# Zoro vs Katakuri



## Tenma (Nov 19, 2021)

just throwing oil into the fire don't mind me

Reactions: Funny 10


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## D4truf (Nov 19, 2021)

LOL some people really petty in this


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## Beast (Nov 19, 2021)

How you gonna throw Kata under the bus?

in terms of feats Kata is still on top despite what anyone says or thinks… ima give it to Kata

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Winner 4


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## MO (Nov 19, 2021)

Katakuri all day, every day.

Reactions: Winner 6


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## Canute87 (Nov 19, 2021)

Katakuri covers himself in block mochi to protect against the dragon twister.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Fel1x (Nov 19, 2021)

any FM>Zoro for now
you should recreate this thread after Zoro will strike back. for now he is just thrown from here to there all the time.
I would say Zoro can be compared to other FMs in the middle of the fight against King or close to an end

Reactions: Like 5


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## o0Shinthi0o (Nov 19, 2021)

Kata all day everyday , twice on friday 
*Spoiler*: __ 



cause thats the weekly holiday in my country


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## Pliskin (Nov 19, 2021)

Katakuri still stomps any SH not named Luffy or Sanji.

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 20


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## Corax (Nov 19, 2021)

Kata dies inside the dragon twister. Unlike King he has no durability to take it. Even Kaido was wounded by it. Zoro can use twister to stun/wound him and follow up with any finisher of his choice.

Reactions: Like 3 | Disagree 1 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Typhon (Nov 19, 2021)

Awakening followed by Mogura to the head.  GG's


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## o0Shinthi0o (Nov 19, 2021)

Corax said:


> Kata dies inside the dragon twister. Unlike King he has no durability to take it. Even Kaido was wounded by it. Zoro can use twister to stun/wound him and follow up with any finisher of his choice.


FS too fast

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Corax (Nov 19, 2021)

o0Shinthi0o said:


> FS too fast


FS isn't teleportation. It doesn't allow to escape AoE. Kata was tagged in room sized black mamba AoE. Let alone dragon sized twister.


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## Fel1x (Nov 19, 2021)

Pliskin said:


> or Sanji.


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## Pliskin (Nov 19, 2021)

Fel1x said:


>


Majin Buu/Perfect Cell level regeneration. Too op.


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 19, 2021)

This chapter just shows how Zoro has been overrated. Dude is a YC2 with CoC coating like Killer

Katakuri can keep a range away from Zoro with his awakening while still attacking from afar with FS+awakening. Or mogura thrust.

He can as well replicate durability with his mochi body to dodge any slashes.

And he can easily restrict zoro's movements

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 4 | Tier Specialist 2 | Dislike 1


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## Beast (Nov 19, 2021)

Pliskin said:


> Katakuri still stomps any SH not named Luffy or Sanji.

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 19, 2021)

The same dragon twister that only made one cut on Kaido. The same AoE that Kaido has a better version of and yet Luffy in base and a bunch of other niggas without FS dodged?


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## Corax (Nov 19, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> The same dragon twister that only made one cut on Kaido. The same AoE that Kaido has a better version of and yet Luffy in base and a bunch of other niggas without FS dodged?


Kaido's AoE was overpowered by twister how it is better?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 19, 2021)

Corax said:


> Kaido's AoE was overpowered by twister how it is better?


I'm talking about Kaido's dragon wind blades that cut Kiku's arms and all the supernova's easily dealt with.

Plus you had nothing to say on Tatsumaki only producing one cut on Kaido despite being AoE


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## Chrollo Lucilfer (Nov 19, 2021)

Whether he threw the fight or not the guy lost to WCI luffy despite only taking 1/10 the hits luffy did
A few hits from Zoro will hurt reaaaaal bad

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## o0Shinthi0o (Nov 19, 2021)

Corax said:


> FS isn't teleportation. It doesn't allow to escape AoE. Kata was tagged in room sized black mamba AoE. Let alone dragon sized twister.


BM speed+unpredictability is way way better than DT . Its not about AoE but the speed vs Kata


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 19, 2021)

Chrollo Lucilfer said:


> Whether he threw the fight or not the guy lost to WCI luffy despite only taking 1/10 the hits luffy did
> A few hits from Zoro will hurt reaaaaal bad


Katakuri threw the fight so we can't use his performance there to say how Zoro's attacks will affect him

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Corax (Nov 19, 2021)

o0Shinthi0o said:


> BM speed+unpredictability is way way better than DT . Its not about AoE but the speed vs Kata


King is a fast aerial fighter and he was caught in AoE. Unless Kata has FS+teleport he won't be able to avoid it. He can't even fly.


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 19, 2021)

Corax said:


> King is a fast aerial fighter and he was caught in AoE.


Yeah because he couldn't see it coming



Corax said:


> Unless Kata has FS+teleport he won't be able to avoid it. He can't even fly.


Katakuri can just use his mochi physiology to avoid the cut. The AoE isn't even AoE.


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## o0Shinthi0o (Nov 19, 2021)

Corax said:


> King is a fast aerial fighter and he was caught in AoE. Unless Kata has FS+teleport he won't be able to avoid it. He can't even fly.


King does not hav FS like Kata ,just like Kata does not have tanky defense like kIng . Kata is best at dodging while King at blocking

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Corax (Nov 19, 2021)

o0Shinthi0o said:


> King does not hav FS like Kata ,just like Kata does not have tanky defense like kIng . Kata is best at dodging while King at blocking


Dodging is only good vs strong singular attacks. Unless it is a teleportation dodge (like Law's room+shambles). Despite Luffy's FS he would've died to Hakkai if not for Law's teleportation help.

Reactions: Winner 1 | GODA 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Yumi Zoro (Nov 19, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> This chapter just shows how Zoro has been overrated. Dude is a YC2 with CoC coating like Killer
> 
> Katakuri can keep a range away from Zoro with his awakening while still attacking from afar with FS+awakening. Or mogura thrust.
> 
> ...



How can You write this then later complain when Zoro fans dont take you serious?

No matter how you doubt Zoro, him scaring Kaido is proof he is not overrated if anything he is underrated.

Reactions: Like 1 | Tier Specialist 1 | Dislike 1


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## Chrollo Lucilfer (Nov 19, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> Katakuri threw the fight so we can't use his performance there to say how Zoro's attacks will affect him


?? We know he could've won if he ended it before luffy developed fs, but lets not act like G4 didnt give him the beats. If you're  gonna argue wci luffy hits harder than current zoro dont even waste your time


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## Yumi Zoro (Nov 19, 2021)

Katakuri will be lucky to even Beat Queen.

Zoro, King Marco are far above him.

Post Udon Luffy is far stronger than his WCI Self and will smoke Katakuri yet rooftop Zoro is stronger than that version of Luffy before As CoC.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Tier Specialist 5


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## Gledania (Nov 19, 2021)

@A Optimistic didn't you say once that Roof top 5 are all above katakuri ?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Corax (Nov 19, 2021)

Gledonux said:


> @A Optimistic didn't you say once that Roof top 5 are all above katakuri ?


If we use pre Udon G4 Luffy to scale them they should be.

Reactions: Funny 2 | Winner 1 | Useful 1


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

Gledonux said:


> @A Optimistic didn't you say once that Roof top 5 are all above katakuri ?



yeah

Reactions: Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Gledania (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> yeah


Do you still believe it ?


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## Incognitos (Nov 19, 2021)

I'd give it to katakuri. Future sight is hard to beat and katakuri counters Zoro pretty well. It's extreme diff tho and I can see Zoro developing future sight in the battle.


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

Gledonux said:


> Do you still believe it ?



every r5 but killer is stronger than Katakuri

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2 | Funny 1 | Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Gledania (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> every r5 but killer is stronger than Katakuri


What about the CP0 agent who are fighting drake ?


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

Gledonux said:


> What about the CP0 agent who are fighting drake ?



not sure yet, need to see how your fodder friend handles them first


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## o0Shinthi0o (Nov 19, 2021)

Corax said:


> Dodging is only good vs strong singular attacks. Unless it is a teleportation dodge (like Law's room+shambles). Despite Luffy's FS he would've died to Hakkai if not for Law's teleportation help.


i would argue about  Law & Luffy vs Hakai dodge part but thats off topic


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## T.D.A (Nov 19, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> This chapter just shows how Zoro has been overrated. Dude is a YC2 with CoC coating like Killer
> 
> Katakuri can keep a range away from Zoro with his awakening while still attacking from afar with FS+awakening. Or mogura thrust.
> 
> ...



Katakuri doesn't have great durability.

Reactions: Winner 2 | Disagree 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## convict (Nov 19, 2021)

Zoro convincingly. This changes nothing it just shows us what a beast King is.

Reactions: Agree 4 | Disagree 1 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Freechoice (Nov 19, 2021)

Corax said:


> Kata dies inside the dragon twister. Unlike King he has no durability to take it. Even Kaido was wounded by it. Zoro can use twister to stun/wound him and follow up with any finisher of his choice.


Man I really hate the Zoro fanbase

I truly due

Itachi fanbase level of idiocy

Just look at this post. They genuinely think Zoro would kill a FM with relative ease

I mean it's a simple two shot fight for Zoro according to them

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 4 | Dislike 1


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## DarkRasengan (Nov 19, 2021)

Katakuri high diff until we see zoros next powerup


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## D4truf (Nov 19, 2021)

Freechoice said:


> Man I really hate the Zoro fanbase
> 
> I truly due
> 
> ...


Itachi Solos whatchu mean?

Reactions: Winner 1


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## DarkRasengan (Nov 19, 2021)

Freechoice said:


> Man I really hate the Zoro fanbase
> 
> I truly due
> 
> ...


Kata sees dragon twister with futuresight snd dodges

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Charlotte D. Kurisu (Nov 19, 2021)

Non FS-Luffy was humiliated against Kata. FS is a real game changer. People are just going by hype. Feats-wise, Kata extreme diffs even Marco.

Reactions: Agree 6 | Funny 1 | Winner 1 | Neutral 1 | Optimistic 1


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

How in the hell does Zoro tag Kata with no FS? Dragon twister might hit Kata but it definitely isn’t KOing him, dragon twister isnt really that powerful, King can block against the attack effortlessly with no damage, Kaido in dragon form received very minor damage, whether it lands or not it won’t be enough against Kata.

Zoro isn’t fast enough here, it took Luffy learning FS and a completely different G4 mode, one focused on speed to land hits on Kata. Zoros going to need to evolve and get FS to win here, and even then he really is just going to need to be much faster than he is, I’m not even sure if FS alone is quite enough. 

Zoros going to be downed on the ground saying he can’t win cause he can’t land hits just like he’s on the ground saying he can’t win unless he figures out Kings lunarian powers, let’s be real.

Reactions: Like 7 | Agree 2


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## Whimsy (Nov 19, 2021)

People underrating FS again is it


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## Yumi Zoro (Nov 19, 2021)

Zoro show Katakuri what a Real G look like.

Zoro mis diff.

FS arent going to change the outcome.


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## Jay. (Nov 19, 2021)

would be interesting to see zoro dealing with future sight


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## Mylesime (Nov 19, 2021)

Where is the poll?


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## truedetectiveseason2intro (Nov 19, 2021)

Katakuri is the first YC1 to go down and has a shit bounty he seems significantly weaker

Reactions: Tier Specialist 3


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## Maruo (Nov 19, 2021)

Zoro low-end high diffs Katakuri. Luffy mid diffs Katakuri. Zoro will high diff King and would upper-end high diff or extreme diff Marco.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Delta Shell (Nov 19, 2021)

FS pretty hax tbh.

Think Zoro would have an issue with that. Would probably gave to develop it mid battle or something.


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## Jay. (Nov 19, 2021)

katakuri is a crazy combatant with coc potential and awakened abilities and his arsenal of attacks is fucked up but whatever not gonna have this discussion in the OL lmao

9 out of 10 times a draw round 10 goes to the more flexible fighter. not gonna tell you who that is.,

Reactions: Like 1


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## Conxc (Nov 19, 2021)

Kata since OL has to keep terrible fan tiers like "YC1" alive. King is distancing himself from Kata with eachg chapter that drops and I'm a fan of Kata. King is just different man. Yes, Zoro beats Katakuri. He isn't taking attacks that injured Kaido well. King is the exception, not the rule.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Mylesime (Nov 19, 2021)

Conxc said:


> King is distancing himself from Kata with each chapter that drops and I'm a fan of Kata. King is just different man.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Jay. (Nov 19, 2021)



Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 3


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

whos the imposter

Reactions: Funny 6


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## Jay. (Nov 19, 2021)

Charlotte King


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Kata since OL has to keep terrible fan tiers like "YC1" alive. King is distancing himself from Kata with eachg chapter that drops and I'm a fan of Kata. King is just different man. Yes, Zoro beats Katakuri. He isn't taking attacks that injured Kaido well. King is the exception, not the rule.


Kata doesnt have to take the attacks if he can dodge them.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

Katakuri isn't dodging Tatsumaki and has underwhelming durability. Nothing has changed. Just makes Katakuri the embarassment among the First mates.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 2 | Dislike 3


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> *Katakuri isn't dodging Tatsumaki* and has underwhelming durability. Nothing has changed. Just makes Katakuri the embarassment among the First mates.


Why do you think he cant?

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Conxc (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Kata doesnt have to take the attacks if he can dodge them.


Zoro tagged Kaido who can move so fast Luffy couldn't fully dodge despite using FS. FS is not the be all end all. Never has been, never will be.


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## Mrdude (Nov 19, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Zoro tagged Kaido who can move so fast Luffy couldn't fully dodge despite using FS. FS is not the be all end all. Never has been, never will be.


Base Luffy tagged Kaido a hundred times. I guess that must mean Luffy is 100x faster then. With that kind of logic you can never go wrong.   

Thunder Bagua has caught everyone including Zoro. Luffy is the only one who has partially dodged it using FS.

Reactions: Winner 4


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## Delta Shell (Nov 19, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Zoro tagged Kaido who can move so fast Luffy couldn't fully dodge despite using FS. FS is not the be all end all. Never has been, never will be.


Wasn't Tatsumaki used on Dragon Kaido, and wasn't it a counter to Kaidos own tornado?


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Zoro tagged Kaido who can move so fast Luffy couldn't fully dodge despite using FS. FS is not the be all end all. Never has been, never will be.


Lol, he tagged Kaido when he was Immobile.

FS can be beaten if you are fast enough but Zoro has not demonstrated the speed necessary for that.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Beast (Nov 19, 2021)

Delta Shell said:


> Wasn't Tatsumaki used on Dragon Kaido, and wasn't it a counter to Kaidos own tornado?

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> Katakuri isn't dodging Tatsumaki


The Tatsumaki that King with bare Bones CoO could react to and cover his body with his wings is what Katakuri with FS cannot react to and dodge?

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1 | Useful 1


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## Mrdude (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Lol, he tagged Kaido when he was Immobile.
> 
> FS can be beaten if you are fast enough but Zoro has not demonstrated the speed necessary for that.


Why? Was Kaido's feet glued to the floor? Was he not attacking Luffy when he used Advanced Conquerors?


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## Conxc (Nov 19, 2021)

Hybrid Kaido kids. I’m not singularly responding to all of you with bad memory/guys who are gonna give every excuse in the book to invalidate the feat. Zoro blitzed Kaido with Ashura, attacking him before he could get his own attack off. As for Luffy tagging Kaido, yes, he’s that fast and like Zoro, has a very fast attacking speed.

Anyway, I said my piece. I know when mr. dude starts quoting it’s time to leave.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 2


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## Mrdude (Nov 19, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Hybrid Kaido kids. I’m not singularly responding to all of you with bad memory/guys who are gonna give every excuse in the book to invalidate the feat. Zoro blitzed Kaido with Ashura, attacking him before he could get his own attack off. As for Luffy tagging Kaido, yes, he’s that fast and like Zoro, has a very fast attacking speed.
> 
> Anyway, I said my piece. I know when mr. dude starts quoting it’s time to leave.




Speed blitz?

Reactions: Funny 2 | Friendly 1


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## Beast (Nov 19, 2021)

Mrdude said:


> Speed blitz?


Blitzed same way he ‘one shot’ King

Reactions: Funny 2


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## icyBankai (Nov 19, 2021)

Hmmm it would probably be a good battle. Once Luffy adjusted to Kata's FS he was able to tag and hurt him with G4.

I view Enma's attacks on the level of G4 so if Zoro could somehow outlast Kata and tag him, he should be able to win.

But if Kata does a mochi trap and removes Zoro's swords then it would be very difficult. Zoro is not at the level that he could simply brush off a YC1/YFM since he's approaching and/or surpassing one currently.

If Oda wrote this battle right now, expect Zoro to come out with the W extreme difficulty.

I could see arguments for both sides if they were to fight this very moment, but post wano I don't think it's a question that Zoro would be superior to Kata.


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## Vagrant Tom (Nov 19, 2021)

Kata does not just dodge attacks, he can see your attack before it happens and prevents you from using it. Luffy got so frustrated because Kata would just knock out his legs or shoulder when Luffy was about to attack. Why would Zoro get to launch all his attacks without trouble? Would Kata wait and dodge dragon twister? Or would he hit Zoro before he's even launched the attack?

That's the real power of future sight. Not dodging but picking the perfect counter. Like how he knew Luffy would use elephant gun and decided to make his own better version.

Reactions: Agree 4 | Winner 4


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## Draffut (Nov 19, 2021)

Zoro gets crushed by the mochi mountain.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## icyBankai (Nov 19, 2021)

Vagrant Tom said:


> Kata does not just dodge attacks, he can see your attack before it happens and prevents you from using it. Luffy got so frustrated because Kata would just knock out his legs or shoulder when Luffy was about to attack. Why would Zoro get to launch all his attacks without trouble? Would Kata wait and dodge dragon twister? Or would he hit Zoro before he's even launched the attack?
> 
> That's the real power of future sight. Not dodging but picking the perfect counter. Like how he knew Luffy would use elephant gun and decided to make his own better version.


You make good points. That's why I think it would be very difficult for Zoro as of now.

Zoro has very lethal AP, we know that. He has good enough defenses to probably tank a lot of power mochis as well.

No-one is questioning Zoro's power. Issue would be tagging him in this scenario.

Yonkous and Admirals might be able to rock Kata's shit regardless, but for a top swordsman like Zoro FS would still be tricky to deal with.

If Zoro finds a way to deal with it then I don't think Kata would outlast Zoro because Zoro is an endurance beast.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Draffut (Nov 19, 2021)

icyBankai said:


> If Zoro finds a way to deal with it then I don't think Kata would outlast Zoro because Zoro is an endurance beast.


Kata had a like 2 day long fight, and then starting using his real moves.  Am I forgetting a zoro fight like that?


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## Fisherman John West (Nov 19, 2021)

Good bye Katakuri


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Mrdude said:


> Why? Was Kaido's feet glued to the floor? Was he not attacking Luffy when he used Advanced Conquerors?


You know full well what I mean by immobile.


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## LaniDani (Nov 19, 2021)

Katakuri is stronger and post Udon Luffy>Kata/Marco/Zoro/King.Current Luffy murder them in 1v1.


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## Kylo Ren (Nov 19, 2021)

Zoro win this extreme diff.


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

Fisherman John West said:


> Good bye Katakuri


That attack isn’t finishing Kata even if it lands, which most likely it won’t, as it probably gets countered well before Zoro gets it off, Kata isn’t getting one shotted, you got to be crazy to think that even if Kata doesn’t have the greatest endurance, he isn’t Cracker.


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Why do you think he cant?





Kagutsutchi said:


> The Tatsumaki that King with bare Bones CoO could react to and cover his body with his wings is what Katakuri with FS cannot react to and dodge?


AoE, dingus.

 King was in the air and even he still caught caught in the middle. Only unlike them, Katakuri's endurance is garbage compared to what it takes to even harm Kaido. But please, continue wanking FS as some inviolable power. Not like Zoro has techniques that completely blew past Kaido's reactions and defenses, where Kaido himself could blitz Post-Udon Luffy.

Reactions: Dislike 1


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## Typhon (Nov 19, 2021)

Zoro supporters conveniently ignore that Katakuri elected to not bother using his whole kit at once when fighting Luffy, but Oda went out of his way to show Kata using it all in a coverpage. This is a battledome thread. Zoro has to deal with FS, Awakening, Spatial Donuts that hit like G4 punches, and diced Mochi/Mogura all at once. 

And the circular logic of Zoro can tag Kaidou so he can tag Katakuri is stupid. Zoro never matched speed with a Thunder Bagua and most of his attacks were on a stationary target. Katakuri outsped Luffy in his fastest form.

Reactions: Agree 7


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## Fisherman John West (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> That attack isn’t finishing Kata even if it lands, which most likely it won’t, as it probably gets countered well before Zoro gets it off, Kata isn’t getting one shotted, you got to be crazy to think that even if Kata doesn’t have the greatest endurance, he isn’t Cracker.


Its lands, and it won't be countered considering it overpowered Kaido twister to land and cut past Kaido scales

Katakuri loses to this alone, he ain't King level of power or durability, lost to WCI who got negged diff by Big Mom


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> AoE, dingus.
> 
> King was in the air and even he still caught caught in the middle. Only unlike them, Katakuri's endurance is garbage compared to what it takes to even harm Kaido. But please, continue wanking FS as some inviolable power. Not like Zoro has techniques that completely blew past Kaido's reactions and defenses, where Kaido himself could blitz Post-Udon Luffy.


AoE isnt the end all be all lol, Kat while severely nerfed and hurt was dodging most of Snakeman's black mamba attacks.

Kaido was only blizting Luffy with TB, Zoro never dodged that.

Zoro blew past Kaido's reactions and defenses while fighting him in a team setting, congratulations I guess?

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Typhon said:


> Zoro supporters conveniently ignore that Katakuri elected to not bother using his whole kit at once when fighting Luffy, but Oda went out of his way to show Kata using it all in a coverpage. This is a battledome thread. Zoro has to deal with FS, Awakening, Spatial Donuts that hit like G4 punches, and diced Mochi/Mogura all at once.
> 
> And the circular logic of Zoro can tag Kaidou so he can tag Katakuri is stupid. Zoro never matched speed with a Thunder Bagua and most of his attacks were on a stationary target. Katakuri outsped Luffy in his fastest form.


Damn you said it better than I did.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> AoE isnt the end all be all lol


Just as FS isn't the end all be all, doesn't stop the rest of you from wanking it to high-heaven, even though it's just precog. If there's nothing the user can physically do, it's useless.


~Flow~ said:


> Snakeman


How's that compared to current Zoro? How's Snakeman's attacks comparable at all to Tatsumaki in range or nature?


~Flow~ said:


> Kaido was only blizting Luffy with TB, Zoro never dodged that.


To hit Luffy with TB demands his reactions are up to par with his movements. Now guess what Zoro had to overcome to slash Kaido with Ashura?



~Flow~ said:


> a team setting


What teamwork took place in the Ashura scene or the Tatsumaki scene?


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> What teamwork took place in the Ashura scene or the Tatsumaki scene?


Kaido was busy with Luffy for the Tatsumaki scene, as for the Asura one Kaido was going after Law then Zoro came attacking Kaido, Kaido turned around and tried to hit Zoro with a nameless strike and Zoro hit him.

Afterwards when Kaido had his attention set on on Zoro he baguaed him back to the 1st floor.



Sablés said:


> To hit Luffy with TB demands his reactions are up to par with his movements. Now guess what Zoro had to overcome to slash Kaido with Ashura?


Thing is you are comparing a named serious attack to a nameless strike.

Reactions: Winner 3


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

Zoro scares Yonko, holds off their combined attack, makes Kaido bleed.

Yet we're defaulting to "katakuri can't be hit", when it's been established for over 100 chapters that top tiers can deal with future sight users (luffy vs kaido)

Reactions: Winner 1


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

Zoro high difficulty. Why would Zoro lose to someone WCI Luffy was able to beat?

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> as for the Asura one Kaido was going after Law then Zoro came attacking Kaido


And Kaido had his full focus on Zoro, even trying to smack him down with attacks that were also blocked by Asura.
There is no sidestepping this.


~Flow~ said:


> Afterwards when Kaido had his attention set on on Zoro he baguaed him back to the 1st floor.


I would hope so, given Zoro had already collapsed from exhaustion at that point.
I can see this is a complete waste of time.


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> I can see this is a complete waste of time.


I agree, you ignored the nameless strike part and seems to think all of Kaido's attacks hold the same speed and power.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> I agree, you ignored the nameless strike part and seems to think all of Kaido's attacks hold the same speed and power.


What "nameless strike"? Kaido's *reactions *don't change and he was completely unable to counter or dodge Asura, when he had already tried to evade weaker attacks from Zoro previously.


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> Katakuri isn't dodging Tatsumaki and has underwhelming durability. Nothing has changed. Just makes Katakuri the embarassment among the First mates.


back to the bleach section

Reactions: Agree 2 | Funny 1 | Winner 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

@Sablés  post in this section more

Reactions: Funny 1 | Friendly 1 | Lewd 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

Future sight is the only real question here.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

Nighty the Mighty said:


> back to the bleach section


Whenever and wherever a sword chad is in need, I am there.

Reactions: Funny 2 | Winner 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> Whenever and wherever a sword chad is in need, I am there.


What would Sanji's Zanpakuto be?


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> What "nameless strike"? Kaido's *reactions *don't change and he was completely unable to counter or dodge Asura, when he had already tried to evade weaker attacks from Zoro previously.


Kaido didnt react to Killer's attack either, I guess Killer trashes Katakuri and can tag Luffy too now.

The nameless strike is the downward swing he was doing here 



Also your argument of dodging is moot as Kaido rarely dodges attacks, he did it once against Hiryu Kaen and that was because BM told him to.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

Can Katakuri even get up from oni giri?


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

Fisherman John West said:


> Its lands, and it won't be countered considering it overpowered Kaido twister to land and cut past Kaido scales
> 
> Katakuri loses to this alone, he ain't King level of power or durability, lost to WCI who got negged diff by Big Mom


Katakuri isn’t getting one shotted, I don’t know what manga you have been reading to think this but it ain’t One Piece.

I shouldn’t even have to explain this, minor superficial damage to Kaido isn’t equivalent to one shotting a YC1 level character. That same attack did Jack shit to King when he blocked it, if you think Odas intentions was for Katakuri to be a complete fodder to King and other YC1 level characters you are sadly sadly mistaken.

Reactions: Winner 3


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> Can Katakuri even get up from oni giri?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> Can Katakuri even get up from oni giri?


It would knock him to the floor like kaido for sure

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Katakuri isn’t getting one shotted, I don’t know what manga you have been reading to think this but it ain’t One Piece.
> 
> I shouldn’t even have to explain this, minor superficial damage to Kaido isn’t equivalent to one shotting a YC1 level character. That same attack did Jack shit to King when he blocked it, if you think Odas intentions was for Katakuri to be a complete fodder to King and other YC1 level characters you are sadly sadly mistaken.


He's reading the same manga that made him believe Zoro mid diffs King.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Funny 1


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> Can Katakuri even get up from oni giri?


How big is Zoro's stomach, can he eat his way through Mochi suffocation ?

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

Nighty the Mighty said:


> What would Sanji's Zanpakuto be?


Overpowered fire sword. Only since it's a female spirit, he'll never allow it to touch men and would never harm a woman.  Kinda useless, huh.

Reactions: Funny 4


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> Zoro high difficulty. Why would Zoro lose to someone WCI Luffy was able to beat?


Because Zoro isn’t as strong as you guys are making him out to be.

Zoro got free hits on a Yonko on the rooftop which ultimately failed miserably in slowing said Yonko down.

You think Katakuri and Marco are going to stand there and try and tank hits without even trying to dodge or block???

Then you have your answer, this shouldn’t even be a discussion to me. Rooftop feats are clearly overrated.

Reactions: Winner 3


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> Overpowered fire sword. Only since it's a female spirit, he'll never allow it to touch men and would never harm a woman.


so he has to fight without it like yoruichi  

i was thinking the same thing


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

Nah but all jokes aside, I think zoro winning high difficulty sounds about right 

we saw how poorly Luffy performed against Kaido in Kuri

zoro should be stronger than the version of Luffy that lost to Kaido at the start of Wano 

zoro will definitely struggle to get past future sight but sooner or lander he will land a blow on Katakuri

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Katakuri isn’t getting one shotted, I don’t know what manga you have been reading to think this but it ain’t One Piece.
> 
> I shouldn’t even have to explain this, minor superficial damage to Kaido isn’t equivalent to one shotting a YC1 level character. That same attack did Jack shit to King when he blocked it, *if you think Odas intentions was for Katakuri to be a complete fodder to King and other YC1 level characters you are sadly sadly mistaken.*


What if that is what I think. Do you have any evidence to back up the contrary belief?

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Because Zoro isn’t as strong as you guys are making him out to be.
> 
> Zoro got free hits on a Yonko on the rooftop which ultimately failed miserably in slowing said Yonko down.
> 
> ...



who’s stronger, current zoro or kuri luffy? The luffy who couldn’t tickle Kaido in case you’re unfamiliar

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

If this fight happened in the actual manga Zoro would obviously win

but so would Sanji


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

Also what do you mean zoro is not as strong as I make him out to be?

I consider zoro to be a yc1, how is he not that strong?


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> Nah but all jokes aside, I think zoro winning high difficulty sounds about right
> 
> we saw how poorly Luffy performed against Kaido in Kuri
> 
> ...


I would say very high, and if Zoro cant find a way to get past FS fast it goes to extreme tbh.

Imo Luffy was only properly YC1 after Udon training.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> He's reading the same manga that made him believe Zoro mid diffs King.


Now look how that is going lollll.

It’s like I have said, Kaido just sat there and let these guys get free hits on him, ain’t no other characters in there right mind is allowing 5 different SN to just land hits.


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> who’s stronger, current zoro or kuri luffy? The luffy who couldn’t tickle Kaido in case you’re unfamiliar


who's stronger, kuri luffy or wci luffy?

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Kaido didnt react to Killer's attack either


What attack? And why would I care if Killer thrashes Katakuri?


~Flow~ said:


> The nameless strike is the downward swing he was doing here


What does this have to do with Kaido's reactions, which scale up to Thunder Bagua?


~Flow~ said:


> Also your argument of dodging is moot as Kaido rarely dodges attacks,


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> Also what do you mean zoro is not as strong as I make him out to be?
> 
> I consider zoro to be a yc1, how is he not that strong?


Zoro is low top tier, you know what just for this comment you must now relinquish your Legion badge

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

that luffy face is still so bad


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Zoro is low top tier, you know what just for this comment you must now relinquish your Legion badge



the only top tiers on onigashima are Kaido, big mom, Luffy, and Yamato


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> What attack? And why would I care if Killer thrashes Katakuri?



Well according to your logic if one tags Kaido they can tag FS users, so do you think Killer beats Kat too?



Sablés said:


> What does this have to do with Kaido's reactions, which scale up to Thunder Bagua?


Imagine cutting my sentence in half to prove your point lmfao.

Shameful stuff.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

More than Zoro, I suppose that I just don't think that highly of Katakuri.

Bloody lightweight

Reactions: Lewd 1


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> the only top tiers on onigashima are Kaido, *big mom*, Luffy, and Yamato

Reactions: Like 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> Yamato


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> I would say very high, and if Zoro cant find a way to get past FS fast it goes to extreme tbh.
> 
> Imo Luffy was only properly YC1 after Udon training.



well I think king is stronger than Katakuri so whatever difficulty zoro needs to defeat king, I think he will need a bit less to beat Katakuri in my opinion

either way, zoro, king and Katakuri are all yc1 and close in strength so it’s whatever

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Tenma (Nov 19, 2021)

honestly the best way to deal with the scaling debacle is to accept Kata is a sham YFM 

as much as it hurts


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> More than Zoro, I suppose that I just don't think that highly of Katakuri.
> 
> Bloody lightweight


You have to remember that he went against MC MCJesus himself in a life or death scenario. Luffy had to win, and he did.

Even though it was complete bullshit, the PIS in that fight was through the roof.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Breadman (Nov 19, 2021)

Can Zolololo even land a HIT on Katakuri? Dude has been pathetically slow and has almost no movement range in post-skip.


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

Tenma said:


> honestly the best way to deal with the scaling debacle is to accept Kata is a sham YFM
> 
> as much as it hurts


As woke as Kuwana.


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> who’s stronger, current zoro or kuri luffy? The luffy who couldn’t tickle Kaido in case you’re unfamiliar


This terrible ass logic, I guess Kiku is also greater than G4 Luffy.

You don’t need me to spoon feed you info me and you both already know and have known for 100s of chapters.

Y’all want to just fanboy, and when Oda hits y’all with the facts y’all want to be in denial lol. The truth hurts I know, we all know Kuri Luffy never had Advanced CoA or a way to bypass the scales, I don’t have to explain this any further for you to get where I’m going with this.

Kuri Luffy could have hit Kaido with KKG at the time and Kaido wouldn’t have felt it, you are fighting a losing battle with me right now.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

Oden was YC2 as we know

kata = YC1>Oden>>>current Zoro


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

Breadman said:


> Can Zolololo even land a HIT on Katakuri? Dude has been pathetically slow and has almost no movement range in post-skip.


AOE


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> You have to remember that he went against MC MCJesus himself in a life or death scenario. Luffy had to win, and he did.
> 
> Even though it was complete bullshit, the PIS in that fight was through the roof.


I think the same about Doflamingo, but y'all shit on him regardless.

Why's Kata getting special treatment?


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## Tenma (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> As woke as Kuwana.



true justice has no biases


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> This terrible ass logic, I guess Kiku is also greater than G4 Luffy.
> 
> You don’t need me to spoon feed you info me and you both already know and have known for 100s of chapters.
> 
> ...


umm

when did kiku visibly hurt kaido?


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> This terrible ass logic, I guess Kiku is also greater than G4 Luffy.
> 
> You don’t need me to spoon feed you info me and you both already know and have known for 100s of chapters.
> 
> ...


 You say I’m fighting a losing battle, while also denying what happened in the manga

brilliant 

current zoro is stronger than kuri Luffy, that’s not up for debate bro sorry.

Luffy fans are so greedy. You’re not content with current Luffy fighting hybrid Kaido in a 1v1 and splitting the sky with him, now you also need Luffy from two power ups ago to also be stronger than current zoro?

so greedy lmao

Reactions: Disagree 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> I think the same about Doflamingo, but y'all shit on him regardless.
> 
> Why's Kata getting special treatment?


Doflamingo got fucking smashed to pieces mate what fight were you reading?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kroczilla (Nov 19, 2021)

It's as I've said before. Katakuri is simply put, an extremely difficult opponent to fight against with either overwhelming strength to a ridiculous degree (i.e. Yonko/Admiral) or a particular set of skills (i.e. Future Sight). And even when Luffy got the latter, he would still have lost without Snakeman which seemed like it was designed to specifically counter a fighter like Katakuri given how it randomly changes direction, continues to build speed indefinitely etc. 


That said, I think it could go either way. If Zoro lands a solid shot, Katakuri is done. If he can't, he gets pin cushioned.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 4


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Tenma said:


> honestly the best way to deal with the scaling debacle is to accept Kata is a sham YFM
> 
> as much as it hurts


Don't think so, Kat had to deal with the MC and had to lose. He made himself lose as well.

Heck he was cheering Luffy on to keep fighting, look at this shit:


Katakuri also decided to stop using all of his abilities to his full potential, he turned into a Luffy cheerleader halfway through the fight.

Read this please: You too @Sablés and @A Optimistic and lemme know what you think ^^



> so pre-merienda, it appeared as if the greatest strength of katakuri's powers was his ability to trap opponents in sticky mochi. He did this to Luffy in the tea party and Luffy couldn't do a damn thing against kata, he needed jinbe to save him.
> 
> Then in round 1 of Luffy vs katakuri, kata effortlessly low diffs Luffy by using his awakening to trap Luffy in mochi. However he underestimates Luffy and chooses not to 1 shot him with mogura,
> 
> ...

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1 | Informative 1


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> I think the same about Doflamingo, but y'all shit on him regardless.


I don't ^^, Doffy was done dirty.


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## Sablés (Nov 19, 2021)

Nighty the Mighty said:


> Doflamingo got fucking smashed to pieces mate what fight were you reading?


So did Katakuri! 
Took like 6 punches. Horseshit.


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## Kroczilla (Nov 19, 2021)

Also fyi, I don't think WCI Luffy can beat current Zoro. Unlike Katakuri who can operate at that lvl indefinitely, WCI Luffy with G4 has a time limit which current Zoro can likely wait out (albeit with serious damage)

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> What if that is what I think. Do you have any evidence to back up the contrary belief?


If you have been reading One Piece for 1032 chapters you already know this is bullshit. What’s understood doesn’t really need to be explained.

Y’all make an open book test look hard on this forum.


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Don't think so, Kat had to deal with the MC and had to lose. He made himself lose as well.
> 
> Heck he was cheering Luffy on to keep fighting, look at this shit:
> 
> ...




its been four fucking years

let it go already


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> umm
> 
> when did kiku visibly hurt kaido?


When her sword went directly through his hand like butter and there was blood visible? Like… you telling me you don’t read one piece now?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> When her sword went directly through his hand like butter and there was blood visible? Like… you telling me you don’t read one piece now?


no when like he actually feels pain


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

Nighty the Mighty said:


>



why are you laughing? Yamato is a top tier 

she fought with hybrid Kaido for awhile and casually threw drake’s worthless ass on the ground like he’s a toddler

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 3


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> its been four fucking years
> 
> let it go already


I did, I accepted it. But its still bullshit and we all know it.

And so using it to downplay Kata is unwarranted and needs correcting.


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## o0Shinthi0o (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> Zoro scares Yonko, holds off their combined attack, makes Kaido bleed.
> 
> Yet we're defaulting to "katakuri can't be hit", when it's been established for over 100 chapters that top tiers can deal with future sight users (luffy vs kaido)


Top tiers can , Zoro can not


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

Sablés said:


> So did Katakuri!
> Took like 6 punches.


Katakuri was literally standing over Luffy at the end of that fight after eating tons of attacks for hours. Meanwhile, Doflamingo got absolutely gigafolded and sent unconscious with a single solid Gear Fourth attack.

Gear Fourth was casually dominant over Doflamingo, the whole point of their fight was that Luffy needed to use his brain, now his brawn, in order to work out how to corner Doflamingo to use his powerful new form. Conversely, Katakuri was dominant over Gear Fourth, Luffy had to learn a whole new Haki to beat him. The fights are completely different. Doflamingo is a scrub.

Stay woke.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Kroczilla (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> no when like he actually feels pain


????


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> I did, I accepted it.


riiiiiiiight

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> Zoro scares Yonko, holds off their combined attack, makes Kaido bleed.


Scare is a big word, Kaido never showed fear towards Zoro whatsoever. Curiosity about his sword sure but nothing more.

Big Mom did show concern about Hiryu Kaen but to say it was fear is pushing it.


Shunsuiju said:


> Yet we're defaulting to "katakuri can't be hit", when it's been established for over 100 chapters *that top tiers can deal with future sight users* (luffy vs kaido)


But that's the thing Zoro is not a top tier so I don't know what your point is?


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

Kroczilla said:


> ????


what?


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Don't think so, Kat had to deal with the MC and had to lose. He made himself lose as well.
> 
> Heck he was cheering Luffy on to keep fighting, look at this shit:
> 
> ...



I mean I’m not denying that plot played a major victory in katakuri’s defeat, that’s definitely true 

but this happens in every straw hat fight. We got queen shooting himself with lasers and king deciding to fight zoro in close quarters combat despite knowing that he can win easily by keeping his distance 

every villains IQ drops to a 1 digit number when facing the straw hats, that’s just life unfortunately

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> But that's the thing Zoro is not a top tier so I don't know what your point is?


is luffy?


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> riiiiiiiight


I-I did! Trust me!


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> You say I’m fighting a losing battle, while also denying what happened in the manga
> 
> brilliant
> 
> ...


There’s no greediness Luffys been putting much more work in than Zoro has since Dressrosa, Zoro hasn’t beaten a single damn YC let alone two for Luffy and Mingo who might as well be a Top 3 YC level fighter without the title.

Everything is as it should be, Zoro got free hits in on a Yonko, read that again, Zoro got free hits on a Yonko which ultimately failed to slow said Yonko down tremendously and now we see his true level with him not even being able to beat Kaidos right hand man.

There’s no hate or Zoro downplay here, Luffys a lot stronger than Zoro is because he’s put in more work against stronger competition than Zoro has since Dressrosa, you don’t like it? Blame Oda, but it’s not changing reality.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> I mean I’m not denying that plot played a major victory in katakuri’s defeat, that’s definitely true
> 
> but this happens in every straw hat fight. We got queen shooting himself with lasers and king deciding to fight zoro in close quarters combat despite knowing that he can win easily by keeping his distance
> 
> *every villains IQ drops to a 1 digit number when facing the straw hats, that’s just life unfortunately*


I call it the causality warping shield.

It activates whenever a villain gets within a mile radius of the holy straw hats.


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> no when like he actually feels pain


You can’t be serious right now. You just can’t , you might as well throw in that concession this isn’t even worth the time.

If you are somehow not convinced on Kiku then go look at Kinemon and Raizo and the other scabbards performances, you telling me Kinemon has more power than G4???


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> is luffy?


Luffy had a technique back then that would keep increasing in speed and was very unpredictable and it was used at the very when Kat had a hole in his stomach and was wearing out.


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Luffy had a technique back then that would keep increasing in speed and was very unpredictable and it was used at the very when Kat had a hole in his stomach and was wearing out.


i asked if luffy is top tier or not


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> i asked if luffy is top tier or not


And I answered it?


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> i asked if luffy is top tier or not


Splitting the sky evenly with a Yonko in a clash means you are indeed a Top Tier, yes.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> There’s no greediness Luffys been putting much more work in than Zoro has since Dressrosa, Zoro hasn’t beaten a single damn YC let alone two for Luffy and Mingo who might as well be a Top 3 YC level fighter without the title.
> 
> Everything is as it should be, Zoro got free hits in on a Yonko, read that again, Zoro got free hits on a Yonko which ultimately failed to slow said Yonko down tremendously and now we see his true level with him not even being able to beat Kaidos right hand man.
> 
> There’s no hate or Zoro downplay here, Luffys a lot stronger than Zoro is because he’s put in more work against stronger competition than Zoro has since Dressrosa, you don’t like it? Blame Oda, but it’s not changing reality.



you are being greedy bro

I’ve already admitted current zoro stands no chance against current luffy

but now you got an issue with me saying current zoro is stronger than kuri luffy….a Luffy from two power ups ago

we saw kuri luffy have such a trash performances against Kaido.  But somehow you think he’s stronger than the guy who can scar hybrid Kaido with 30 broken bones

there is no chance kuri luffy can beat current zoro. Just be content with current Luffy’s amazing strength and accept that he was trash at the start of Wano



OG sama said:


> Everything is as it should be, Zoro got free hits in on a Yonko, read that again, Zoro got free hits on a Yonko which ultimately failed to slow said Yonko down tremendously and now we see his true level with him not even being able to beat Kaidos right hand man.



you’re gonna say zoro got free hits on a Yonko while defending kuri luffy….the guy who got an entire chapters worth of free hits on a Yonko and didn’t do any damage

okay bro

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> you’re gonna say zoro got free hits on a Yonko while defending kuri luffy….the guy who got an entire chapters worth of free hits on a Yonko and didn’t do any damage
> 
> okay bro


If Kuri Luffy had Enma Kaido would have been beheaded already

Reactions: Funny 2


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> you are being greedy bro
> 
> I’ve already admitted current zoro stands no chance against current luffy
> 
> ...


Sounds like you just don’t want to accept reality because you are upset that things aren’t the way you want them to be bro and that’s understandable.

But I have already explained this stuff to you, Luffys put in much more work than Zoro has, the only one being greedy is Zoro fans, because they think a guy who went from from fighting freaking Pica can jump up to fighting on par with a Luffy whose beaten not one but two YCs when said guy in question didn’t even have a single clash with a YC level fighter up until just now or recently in the story.

That’s the definition of being greedy, but y’all Zoro fans are so spoiled and entitled y’all can’t see it this way.


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> And I answered it?


yes or no please


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Sounds like you just don’t want to accept reality because you are upset that things aren’t the way you want them to be bro and that’s understandable.



you’re literally pretending that we all didn’t read a chapter of gear 4th Luffy pummeling Kaido and literally doing nothing….and then saying I’m the one not accepting reality?

okay


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

I know for damn sure if Kaido stood there and let current zoro attack him for an entire chapter, Kaido would not walk away with zero damage

that’s for sure

Reactions: Agree 1


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> you’re gonna say zoro got free hits on a Yonko while defending kuri luffy….the guy who got an entire chapters worth of free hits on a Yonko and didn’t do any damage
> 
> okay bro


This argument is going in circles, it’s got to be painful for you to accept reality.  Y’all make a childrens story look so complicated when all you got to do is just read lol.


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## Kroczilla (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> I know for damn sure if Kaido stood there and let current zoro attack him for an entire chapter, Kaido would not walk away with zero damage
> 
> that’s for sure


True. But Katakuri is a completely different type of beast. Literally speaking.


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

Kroczilla said:


> True. But Katakuri is a completely different type of beast. Literally speaking.



yeah Katakuri is a different fighter, already admitted zoro will struggle with his FS for sure and it’s high difficulty

was just strictly talking about current zoro vs kuri luffy

Reactions: Informative 1


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

To put this shit into perspective, Zoro didn’t even have a single clash with a Top 3 YC level guy until literally just recently in the story and Zoro fans are acting like he should in fact be where Luffy is, hell to the nah.

This shit Zoro is doing right now is shit Luffy has been there and done two times in the past arc alone, Zoro is where he should be at with no experience fighting any YCs to date, well below Luffy right now.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Zoro fans are acting like he should in fact be where Luffy is el oh el.



where did anyone in this 6 page thread say current zoro is on current Luffy’s level? You got 6 pages and nearly 200 posts to pick out any quote, lots of options


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> where did anyone in this 6 page thread say current zoro is on current Luffy’s level? You got 6 pages and nearly 200 posts to pick out any quote, lots of options


Nit picking singular sentences in a whole paragraphs worth of info isn’t going to make your argument any better.


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Nit picking singular sentences in a whole paragraphs worth of info isn’t going to make your argument any better.



okay, I’ll quote your whole post if it makes you feel better

now answer my question 


where did anyone in this 6 page thread say current zoro is on current Luffy’s level? You got 6 pages and nearly 200 posts to pick out any quote, lots of options


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> yes or no please





~Flow~ said:


> Luffy had a technique back then that would keep increasing in speed and was very unpredictable and it was used at the very when Kat had a hole in his stomach and was wearing out.


Means no.


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> okay, I’ll quote your whole post if it makes you feel better
> 
> now answer my question
> 
> ...


Where’s your rebuttal for my entire paragraph then? I guess you just don’t have one  

Arguing irrelevant things like this isn’t going to make your argument better, Zoro is well below Luffys level right now, forget him being on par with Current Luffy.


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> is luffy?


Wait are you asking me if Luffy is a top tier rn? If so of course he is. What kind of question is that?


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Where’s your rebuttal for my entire paragraph then? I guess you just don’t have one
> 
> Arguing irrelevant things like this isn’t going to make your argument better, Zoro is well below Luffys level right now, forget him being on par with Current Luffy.



how am I supposed to rebuttal your paragraph…when your entire paragraph is you arguing a claim that nobody said in this thread?



again, can you quote one single post in this thread where anyone said current zoro is on current Luffy’s level?

I feel like I’m talking to a crazy person

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Nighty the Mighty said:


> If Enma fought Kaido in Kuri he would have been beheaded already

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Tenma (Nov 19, 2021)

Kaido>=Luffy>>King>=Zoro>Katakuri=pre-Udon Luffy


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Tenma said:


> Kaido>=Luffy>>King>=Zoro>>Katakuri=pre-Udon Luffy


Nah Fresh Kaido would high diff curent Fresh Luffy so its more like >

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

Tenma said:


> Kaido>=Luffy>>King>=Zoro>Katakuri=pre-Udon Luffy


close but it's more like

Luffy>Kaido>>>Zoro>King=Katakuri

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

You understand that kuri luffy is different from current luffy….right?

Luffy isn’t currently on kuri in case you skipped the last 60 chapters


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Wait are you asking me if Luffy is a top tier rn? If so of course he is. What kind of question is that?


a leading question. if luffy is top tier, so is zoro. yet you say he isn't.


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> again, can you quote one single post in this thread where anyone said current zoro is on current Luffy’s level?





Shunsuiju said:


> a leading question. if luffy is top tier, so is zoro. yet you say he isn't.


ask and you shall receive

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Tenma (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Nah Fresh Kaido would high diff curent Fresh Luffy so its more like >


Luffy isn't fresh either (pointed out by Momo) but we'll see once we go back to the fight


Nighty the Mighty said:


> Luffy>Kaido



we all know this will turn out to be the case by Wano's end

Reactions: Winner 1


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> how am I supposed to rebuttal your paragraph…when your entire paragraph is you arguing a claim that nobody said in this thread?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ok no one is saying that then, you happy?

And they shouldn’t be, cause Zoro isn’t particularly close to Luffy right now as things stand, and the reason makes perfect sense. You don’t go from never even clashing with a Top 3 YC to being as strong as a guy whose beaten two and three, Odas making y’all look bad on here, because there’s nothing hard to understand about this, this is a manga for kids, and y’all still don’t understand some simple logic like this.


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> a leading question. if luffy is top tier, so is zoro. yet you say he isn't.


Not how it works mate, Zoro doesnt get to leech off his captains achievements.

Zoro is currently struggling and getting beaten down by a YC1 so he is not a top tier.

Good day sir ^^


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Tenma said:


> Luffy isn't fresh either (pointed out by Momo) but we'll see once we go back to the fight


Where?


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## A Optimistic (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Ok no one is saying that then, you happy?
> 
> And they shouldn’t be, cause Zoro isn’t particularly close to Luffy right now as things stand, and the reason makes perfect sense. You don’t go from never even clashing with a Top 3 YC  to being as strong as a guy whose beaten two and three, Odas making y’all look bad on here, because there’s nothing hard to understand about this, this is a manga for kids, and y’all still don’t understand some simple logic like this.



you are aware that I don’t think current zoro stands a chance against current luffy, correct? You’ve been typing up essays at someone who agrees with you

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Nighty the Mighty said:


> close but it's more like
> 
> Luffy>Kaido>>>Zoro>King=Katakuri


Luffy isnt gonna be stronger than the current strongest dude, he will be a certified top tier after Wano and thats good enough for him to fight the rest.

This whole him being stronger than Kaido thing went out of the window once Kaido fought half the island non stop while holding and moving said Island( a thing that was proven to require effort and power to do, which means he was nerfed all along prior to all his battles)

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Tenma (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Where?


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> you are aware that I don’t think current zoro stands a chance against current luffy, correct? You’ve been typing up essays at someone who agrees with you


Luffy doesnt read so OG Sama is just roleplaying him, you just don’t understand .

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Oh that is a bad translation. The Viz is completely different.


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## Ren. (Nov 19, 2021)

Tenma said:


> just throwing oil into the fire don't mind me


The same shit as vs King. 

Fs +mochi > current zoro.


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## Tenma (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Oh that is a bad translation. The Viz is completely different.



what the viz say


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Tenma said:


> what the viz say


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## Tenma (Nov 19, 2021)

Ah ok

welp still holding out for luffy> or =kaido by arc's end

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Ren. (Nov 19, 2021)

Freechoice said:


> Man I really hate the Zoro fanbase
> 
> I truly due
> 
> ...


Like it was  for king...


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Tenma said:


> Ah ok
> 
> welp still holding out for luffy> or =kaido by arc's end


Actually in chapter 1026, Kaido says that Luffy has no chance of beating him and Luffy retorts with '' As long as Im alive I have infinite chances!''

Meaning he himself knows he cant beat him at the moment but is still trying lol.


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> you are aware that I don’t think current zoro stands a chance against current luffy, correct? You’ve been typing up essays at someone who agrees with you


So you didn’t say that Current Zoro would high diff Katakuri because you thought it was unfair that Zoro be that far behind Luffy from an arc and three power ups ago?

You saying you didn’t say that?

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

Tenma said:


> Ah ok
> 
> welp still holding out for luffy> or *=kaido* by arc's end


Also this would make his fights against admirals and other top tiers lose all tension. Luffy is always meant to be the underdog.

I think him leaving Wano as a solid top tier( above Old Rayleigh for example) is good enough tbh.


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## OG sama (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Luffy doesnt read so OG Sama is just roleplaying him, you just don’t understand .


Nah I’m not crazy lol, I know how this argument started, Zoro fans want to throw around the “it’s unfair” argument when they don’t like what the story is really telling them.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Fujitora (Nov 19, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Nah I’m not crazy lol, I know how this argument started, Zoro fans want to throw around the “it’s unfair” argument when they don’t like what the story is really telling them.


Im just pulling your leg lol.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Luffy isnt gonna be stronger than the current strongest dude, he will be a certified top tier after Wano and thats good enough for him to fight the rest.
> 
> This whole him being stronger than Kaido thing went out of the window once Kaido fought half the island non stop while holding and moving said Island( a thing that was proven to require effort and power to do, which means he was nerfed all along prior to all his battles)


Kaido was never the strongest dude. He's a phony, it's why Oda only ever had him as rumoured, whereas for others he just says they are.


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## Tenma (Nov 19, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Also this would make his fights against admirals and other top tiers lose all tension. Luffy is always meant to be the underdog.
> 
> I think him leaving Wano as a solid top tier( above Old Rayleigh for example) is good enough tbh.



Oda loves escalation,he's gonna find a way to make the next big challenge an even bigger threat than Kaido. Teach is obviously going to be beyond the Yonko.

If Akainu fights Luffy without any X-factor I can see it being a cathartic squash match before Teach/Imu lol


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> So you didn’t say that Current Zoro would high diff Katakuri because you thought it was unfair that Zoro be that far behind Luffy from an arc and three power ups ago?
> 
> You saying you didn’t say that?



yes, I did say that current zoro is stronger than kuri luffy

I’m curious to know how many more posts it’s going to take you until you realize that current luffy and kuri luffy are two different fighters

I’m wagering another 20 more posts

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Fujitora (Nov 20, 2021)

Tenma said:


> Oda loves escalation,he's gonna find a way to make the next big challenge an even bigger threat than Kaido. Teach is obviously going to be beyond the Yonko.
> 
> If Akainu fights Luffy without any X-factor I can see it being a cathartic squash match before Teach/Imu lol


Agreed on BB, I see EOS teach high diffing the current top of top tiers(Akainu/Kaido,etc)

Rest I dont, which why If you think Luffy will have more opponents before EOS BB and then Imu then I dont see Luffy ending up equal to Kaido or Stronger EOW.

I see it like this;

He ends up stronger than old Rayleigh

He fights a top tier ( BM? or Admiral) in an actual 1vs1 battle without outside help and wins.

Fights BB EOS as the current cream of the top tiers and beats him.

Declares war on the WG and beats them.

Series Ends.


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> You say I’m fighting a losing battle, while also denying what happened in the manga
> 
> brilliant
> 
> ...


Mate you guys said he will low diff king.

You were saying.


So zip it.


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

Ren. said:


> Mate you guys said he will low diff king.
> 
> You were saying.
> 
> ...



okay so i'll ask you the same question i asked OG Sama

quote a single post in _this thread_ where that was stated by anyone

you and OG Sama like to do this thing where you literally imagine an argument out of thin air and then make 20+ posts arguing against the imaginary thought you had

it's without a doubt the weirdest debating style i've seen.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## FakeTaxi1738 (Nov 20, 2021)

Katakuri destroys zoro, zoro legit got no speed feats that can counter Katakuris FS, and remember even against Snakemans speed Katakuri was still able to dodge some of luffys attacks. Unstoppable mochi +FS mid-high diff zoro honestly.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> okay so i'll ask you the same question i asked OG Sama
> 
> quote a single post in _this thread_ where that was stated by anyone
> 
> ...


Mate...  Your fan club said that.

You said we are greedy.

GTO.


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

Ren. said:


> You said we are greedy.



so me saying that luffy fans are greedy...somehow translates to me saying in this thread that zoro will low diff king?

it's interesting how the translator in your brain works


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> so me saying that luffy fans are greedy...somehow translates to me saying zoro will low diff king?
> 
> it's interesting how the translator in your brain works


no mate this what the fifth time you say something never happened.

Before this you said, your Z boys never said Enma is a nerf.


Then I showed you 3 people in that thread and 1 in the spoilers for 1032.

So yeah go and attack your fan base first.


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> Luffy fans are so greedy. Y
> 
> so greedy lmao



....

You were saying.


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

Ren. said:


> no mate this what the fifth time you say something never happened.
> 
> Before this you said, your Z boys never said Enma is a nerf.
> 
> ...



so if i'm understanding you correctly...you're arguing with _me_ in _this thread_ about stuff that _other people _said in a _different thread_? did i interpret this post correctly?

well I think this pic sums up you and OG Sama quite well

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> so if i'm understanding you correctly...you're arguing with me in _this thread_ about stuff that _other people _said in a _different thread_? did i interpret this post correctly?
> 
> well I think this pic sums up you and OG Sama quite well


so you hate zoro now?

Reactions: Funny 2


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

Ren. said:


> ....
> You were saying.





...what does a random tweet have to do with anything i said in this thread?


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> so if i'm understanding you correctly...you're arguing with _me_ in _this thread_ about stuff that _other people _said in a _different thread_? did i interpret this post correctly?
> 
> well I think this pic sums up you and OG Sama quite well


Mate talk about Katakuri for once.


Zoro is not stronger than kata because Luffy defeated him in WCI because Luffy has FS, Zoro doesn't, Luffy has Snake-man, Zoro doesn't.


That is not an argument.


And stop shitting on Luffy's base ... check your base first.


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

Ren. said:


> Mate talk about Katakuri for once.



you're the one who literally quoted me talking about zoro vs king

and now you're saying "talk about katakuri for once"

are you insane? serious question


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> ...what does a random tweet have to do with anything i said in this thread?


I don't know what does Kaka vs Zoro has to do with Luffy's fans.

You said it not me.

Also what relatioship does Luffy defeating Kata in WCI with Snakeman and FS has to do with Zoro that is getting bodied by another Kata level figther.

And please don't say King is that much stronger, based on what?



A Optimistic said:


> you're the one who literally quoted me talking about zoro vs king
> 
> and now you're saying "talk about katakuri for once"
> 
> are you insane? serious question


No I quoted you because muh Luffy fanbase.


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

goodnight ren

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 20, 2021)

this thread confirms sanji fanbase>luffy fanbase>zoro fanbase

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

Mate


A Optimistic said:


> goodnight ren


Bye.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

Nighty the Mighty said:


> so you hate zoro now?


Neah he attacks the fanbase that disagrees with him

Then forgets what fanbase he is talking for.

I have no problem with his takes.

I mean, our last debate he forgot to read that I said if this happens Marco mid diffs King.

Took it as Marco mid diffs King. I was like what.

So Mate sorry, you can troll but I can quote you ... and I have a better memory than you.


And mate if Luffy defeated Kata doesn't mean that Zoro defeats Kata, Luffy has the speed and precog to damage kata, Zoro didn't show that as of yet.

I mean most of Z boys powerscaled Zoro to mid diff King ... this is what you guys are doing now again, Kata has a special skill set like King that Zoro can no easily overcome.

Kata wins extreme diff, after Zoro defets King he also defeats Kata with same diff.


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## Fisherman John West (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Katakuri isn’t getting one shotted, I don’t know what manga you have been reading to think this but it ain’t One Piece.
> 
> I shouldn’t even have to explain this, minor superficial damage to Kaido isn’t equivalent to one shotting a YC1 level character. That same attack did Jack shit to King when he blocked it, if you think Odas intentions was for Katakuri to be a complete fodder to King and other YC1 level characters you are sadly sadly mistaken.


Yet Oda had Katakuri lose to WCI Luffy who got negged diff twice by yonkos

While King is overpowering Zoro who scared Yonkos, and King wings are showing to be more durable then even Kaido scales

Being Yc1 doesn't = to being all the same level when feats show otherwise

Katakuri is literal fodder to yonkos, while King has a better defense than Kaido and stronger than Enma Zoro that scared them itself.

So no, Zoro destroys katakuri


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## Fisherman John West (Nov 20, 2021)

Ren. said:


> Neah he attacks the fanbase that disagrees with him
> 
> Then forgets what fanbase he is talking for.
> 
> ...


Someone ignored how Zoro faired against yonkos on the roof in comparison to how Luffy faired against Big Mom and Kaido pre Udon.

Go reread one piece


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## Seraphoenix (Nov 20, 2021)

Zoro gets folded. Too much Kata disrespect here. He beats King too


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## Fisherman John West (Nov 20, 2021)

Luffy WCI vs Big Mom


Luffy Pre Udon Vs Kaido BAse


While Zoro vs Yonkos


Zoro >>> Pre Udon Luffy > Katakuri

Go be dumb somewhere else

King > Zoro >>> Udon Luffy > Katakuri

Reactions: Funny 1 | Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 1 | Dislike 1


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## Oda Report (Nov 20, 2021)

Zoro is fighting king who walks all over kata.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Fisherman John West (Nov 20, 2021)

Seraphoenix said:


> Zoro gets folded. Too much Kata disrespect here. He beats King too


Amazing how he lost to someone who got negged by Yonkos while King is overpowering Zoro who did this

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Seraphoenix (Nov 20, 2021)

Fisherman John West said:


> Amazing how he lost to someone who got negged by Yonkos while King is overpowering Zoro who did this


Is this from Zoro's 1v1 with Kaido?

The whole point of this 1v1 with King is to bring you Zoro boys back to reality. A team battle is not a 1v1. BM got rolled out in a team battle with Jinbe and Robin. She folds either one 1v1.


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## Seraphoenix (Nov 20, 2021)

Some of you keep bringing up WCI Luffy beating Kata. Let's ignore all the plot and how Kata could have killed him earlier. What makes you think Zoro survives 1v1 against WCI Luffy with future sight? Once Kong Gatling comes out it's ggwp.


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 20, 2021)

Sablés said:


> AoE, dingus.


The AoE that only produces one cut on Kaido? Katakuri will be fine dodging that

And even if it produces dozens of cuts, Katakuri will just dodge it like he did Luffy's Gatling easily.



Sablés said:


> King was in the air and even he still caught caught in the middle.


King is slow as shit compared to Katakuri. After all I never saw King (or anybody else for that matter) blitz Gear 4 Luffy or even keep up with FS Snakeman which only Katakuri has done so far.




Sablés said:


> Only unlike them, Katakuri's endurance is garbage compared to what it takes to even harm Kaido.


And Katakuri can just separate his body where the cut will appear.

And lol at him having Garbage endurance. We all know King is gonna get slashed on his chest and get knocked out like all of Zoro's opponents. Meanwhile Katakuri could still fight for hours with a hole in his stomach.



Sablés said:


> please, continue wanking FS as some inviolable power.


I'm not wanking FS, I can simply use my brain to think of how it can be used based on what we've canonically seen unlike some idiots who only understand boom slash, aoe



Sablés said:


> Not like Zoro has techniques that completely blew past Kaido's reactions and defenses, where Kaido himself could blitz Post-Udon Luffy.


Kaido didn't blitz FS Luffy you dumbass, Luffy himself confirms this. Base Luffy with FS is faster than G4 Luffy because of FS, as he himself says. But because you've decided to be stupid where FS is concerned, you'll obviously choose not to see that.



And Zoro didn't even blitz Kaido. This same Kaido has been eating everyone's attacks without dodging and the only people he complimented on speed were base Luffy and Law


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## Fisherman John West (Nov 20, 2021)

Seraphoenix said:


> Is this from Zoro's 1v1 with Kaido?
> 
> The whole point of this 1v1 with King is to bring you Zoro boys back to reality. A team battle is not a 1v1. BM got rolled out in a team battle with Jinbe and Robin. She folds either one 1v1.


"Is it a 1 v 1"

Let refresh your memory

Flying Dragon Blaze is Zoro attack by himself
Tatsumaki was saving Luffy from Kaido, Zoro own attack again, no help
Hakai was Zoro holding it on his own
Ashura vs Kaido was a 1 v 1

"BuT It Was A 5 V 2" yeah and? got nothing to do with these feats

Zoro smacks Katakuri


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## OG sama (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> yes, I did say that current zoro is stronger than kuri luffy
> 
> I’m curious to know how many more posts it’s going to take you until you realize that current luffy and kuri luffy are two different fighters
> 
> I’m wagering another 20 more posts


Current Zoro isn’t stronger than Kuri Luffy, how has that not been obvious reading my entire argument on this subject??

The only person clinging to Current Luffy is you, if Zoro is far away from the Current Luffy it’s because he isn’t even stronger than Kuri Luffy.

The only reason Kuri Luffy couldn’t hurt Kaido to begin with is because Kuri Luffy had no way to bypass Kaidos scales, it had absolutely nothing to do with his attacks simply not being strong enough.

Like damn… how is that so hard for people here to understand??? Y’all mfers make an open notes test look hard I swear.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Current Zoro isn’t stronger than Kuri Luffy, how has that not been obvious reading my entire argument on this subject??
> 
> The only person clinging to Current Luffy is you, if Zoro is far away from the Current Luffy it’s because he isn’t even stronger than Kuri Luffy.



are you saying kuri luffy is close in strength to current luffy? the luffy who got one shotted by kaido is close in strength to the luffy who is currently 1v1ing kaido and splitting the sky?

did i read that right?

what difficulty can kuri luffy give current luffy in a fight, if you don't mind me asking?

 




OG sama said:


> The only reason Kuri Luffy couldn’t hurt Kaido to begin with is because Kuri Luffy had no way to bypass Kaidos scales, it had absolutely nothing to do with his attacks simply not being strong enough.



"the reason kuri luffy's attacks couldn't hurt kaido has nothing to do with the attacks not being strong enough"

i hope i never fall inlove so strongly with a character that i make up lies like this

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Seraphoenix (Nov 20, 2021)

Fisherman John West said:


> "Is it a 1 v 1"
> 
> Let refresh your memory
> 
> ...


So nothing in a 1v1? Also all attacks where Kaido didn't bother to dodge or use CoA?  
Thanks for proving my point 

Time to get back to reality fanboy.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Current Zoro isn’t stronger than Kuri Luffy, how has that not been obvious reading my entire argument on this subject??
> 
> The only person clinging to Current Luffy is you, if Zoro is far away from the Current Luffy it’s because he isn’t even stronger than Kuri Luffy.
> 
> ...


Because he is restricting his reach to make it plausible.

You are taking the bait.

Say this, as for king you need a se of skills.

Just because you can scar Kaido, it doesn't mean you can hit or damage a highly dynamic and durable enemy like King.

The same for Katakuri, his as dynamic as Snake-man and better at evading than FS Luffy.

This is what you have to say ... and if he trolls you back ,repeat it again until he stops.


Now see his reply to you and see my feedback ... he does this often.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## OG sama (Nov 20, 2021)

Fisherman John West said:


> Yet Oda had Katakuri lose to WCI Luffy who got negged diff twice by yonkos
> 
> While King is overpowering Zoro who scared Yonkos, and King wings are showing to be more durable then even Kaido scales
> 
> ...


Luffy wasn’t calm and Oda obviously had him get beat in the way he did for tension purposes mainly.

We even see FS being such a useful ability that Luffy was the only rooftop fighter who could dodge and react to a point blank Thunder Bagua albeit barely.

What you don’t even realize is, thats a feat that’s easily transferable to Katakuri. That’s how OP FS is, and it’s an ability that Kata has had way more practice with than Luffy. Imagine Katakuri dodging a Thunder Bagua that no one else on the rooftop could even react to.

The above doesn’t sound like a fodder to me at all. You got to come to me when you have a better comprehension of this manga bro, all this is right there in the manga for you to understand.

Katakuri isn’t a fodder and never has been a fodder, nothing from WCI, everything it took for Luffy to beat this dude, should have you believing this way.

Reactions: Winner 5


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> are you saying kuri luffy is close in strength to current luffy? the luffy who got one shotted by kaido is close in strength to the luffy who is currently 1v1ing kaido and splitting the sky?
> 
> did i read that right?
> 
> ...


It has nothing to do with power level ... this is the Zoro will easily defeat King after scaring Kaido all over again.


OG sama said:


> Luffy wasn’t calm and Oda obviously had him get beat in the way he did for tension purposes mainly.
> 
> We even see FS being such a useful ability that Luffy was the only rooftop fighter who could dodge and react to a point blank Thunder Bagua albeit barely.
> 
> ...


For this one juts ignore him.

I sill don't know why this gent is still here .... WG is that way.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Funny 1


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

Ren. said:


> It has nothing to do with power level so stop it.



"feats that i dont like have nothing to do with powerlevels"




or maybe, luffy just got a lot stronger after his training in udon and learning how to split the sky, have you ever considered that possibility?

Reactions: Funny 1 | Winner 1


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## Dellinger (Nov 20, 2021)

Ahhh these retarded arguments 

Zoro never fought a Yonko one v one. He had other guys around him and got saved from getting turned into dust thanks to Law.

Kaido would obliterate Zoro in a one vs one as he did with a stronger Luffy 3 times

Reactions: Agree 5


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Current Zoro isn’t stronger than Kuri Luffy, how has that not been obvious reading my entire argument on this subject??
> 
> The only person clinging to Current Luffy is you, if Zoro is far away from the Current Luffy it’s because he isn’t even stronger than Kuri Luffy.
> 
> ...


With their logic, fucking Kiku is stronger than Kuri Luffy

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> "feats that i dont like have nothing to do with powerlevels"
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Mate just because you can damage someone cough Kaido that is way stronger.

Doesn't mean you can not get defeated or are weaker than someone vastly weaker than Kaido aka King.


KKG AP wise is way stronger than any move from Kata and before FS Kata low diffed bound man.

So what ever imaginary feats you have to defeat FS and Snake-man mobility be my guest.


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## Sablés (Nov 20, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> The AoE that only produces one cut?


Literally not how the move works and was shown to repeatedly strike at King. I can pretty much tell how the rest is going from this nonsense.



Kagutsutchi said:


> King is slow as shit


Proof?



Kagutsutchi said:


> And Katakuri can just separate his body where the cut will appear


^^


Kagutsutchi said:


> Please continue to not use your brain to see how FS can be used


Non response.


Kagutsutchi said:


> Kaido didn't blitz FS Luffy


Even post-udon Luffy using FS still got tagged by TB.


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> With their logic, fucking Kiku is stronger than Kuri Luffy


O and I posted that Kiku stab vs Kaido's 10km free fall.

And ask what has more AP.

Crickets.


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## OG sama (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> are you saying kuri luffy is close in strength to current luffy? the luffy who got one shotted by kaido is close in strength to the luffy who is currently 1v1ing kaido and splitting the sky?
> 
> did i read that right?
> 
> ...


I’m saying that Zoro is far below Luffys level and Current Luffy is far above his Kuri self. That totally makes ton of sense, Luffys got three Advanced forms of Haki, he had 1 during Kuri and he wasn’t even calm enough to use it then, Zoro has one advanced CoC attack and it’s his strongest last ditch effort attack. Kuri Luffy still has KKG and other attacks that don’t work on Kaido but should work perfectly fine on Zoro. Like, the fact that I even have to explain this shit is just baffling, but you aren’t alone in this, most of y’all are pretty delusional and don’t know something as simple as this.

That’s true… unless you are telling me Kinemon has better attack power than G4. You might as well hold this L instead of acting like you know anything at all of what you are saying, you are arguing nothing at this point, you got no real rebuttals.


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## Sablés (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> That’s true… unless you are telling me Kinemon has better attack power than G4


What's the problem here exactly?


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 20, 2021)

Hey @Sablés why don't you quote the post again and see what I wrote


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## Freechoice (Nov 20, 2021)

You ok mate

You act like mocking of Zoro is like someone is mocking your family

You realise he's a fictional character, right?

Reactions: Agree 3 | Optimistic 1


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 20, 2021)

Sablés said:


> Even post-udon Luffy using FS still got tagged by TB.


Base Luffy partially tagged by Kaido's fastest attack which Zoro in no way scales to. Okay


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 20, 2021)

the only defensible position for katakuri standing a chance is by backing yourself into this fantastical world where luffy is strides ahead of zoro

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Sablés (Nov 20, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> Hey @Sablés why don't you quote the post again and see what I wrote


I'm pretty sure you need to be older than 12 to post here.


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 20, 2021)

Sablés said:


> I'm pretty sure you need to be older than 12 to post here.


Non response.


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## Sablés (Nov 20, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> Base Luffy partially tagged by Kaido's fastest attack which Zoro in no way scales to. Okay


Post-Udon Base Luffy > Pre-Udon G4 Luffy

Cope as hard as you can, m8, but the feats speak for themselves.



Kagutsutchi said:


> Non response


As was literally 2/3rds of what you made me reply to.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> I’m saying that Zoro is far below Luffys level and Current Luffy is far above his Kuri self. That totally makes ton of sense, Luffys got three Advanced forms of Haki, he had 1 during Kuri and he wasn’t even calm enough to use it then, Zoro has one advanced CoC attack and it’s his strongest last ditch effort attack. Kuri Luffy still has KKG and other attacks that don’t work on Kaido but should work perfectly fine on Zoro. Like, the fact that I even have to explain this shit is just baffling, but you aren’t alone in this, most of y’all are pretty delusional and don’t know something as simple as this.
> 
> That’s true… unless you are telling me Kinemon has better attack power than G4. You might as well hold this L instead of acting like you know anything at all of what you are saying, you are arguing nothing at this point, you got no real rebuttals.



You avoided my question. If current Luffy and kuri Luffy fought, who wins and what's the difficulty? 


As for Kinemon, he was using Oden's haki when he stabbed Kaido. Perhaps if kuri Luffy prays hard enough, he will get access to Oden's haki as well.


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## OG sama (Nov 20, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


>


It’s not even a debate at this point, Kaido let those guys get free hits on them, it’s literally in the manga for you and me to see.

Ain’t nobody else going to just sit there like Kaido has and tank hits, you seeing exactly why that shit is overrated right now against King bruh. It’s not rocket science, this manga is very easy to understand, y’all just throw all thought out the window when it doesn’t sit your headcanon.


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 20, 2021)

Sablés said:


> Post-Udon Base Luffy > Pre-Udon G4 Luffy
> 
> Cope as hard as you can, m8, but the feats speak for themselves.


Yeah as long as he uses FS which Pre-Udon G4 didn't use as he himself stated.

It appears you're only intelligent on the bleach section 



Sablés said:


> As was literally 2/3rds of what you made me reply to.


I edited my post, now are you gonna stop being a bitch and quote me properly?


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 20, 2021)

Sablés said:


> Post-Udon Base Luffy > Pre-Udon G4 Luffy

Reactions: Funny 2


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> this manga is very easy to understand, y’all just throw all thought out the window when it doesn’t sit your headcanon.





OG sama said:


> Luffy wasn’t calm and Oda obviously had him get beat in the way he did for tension purposes mainly.



How can you type these two contradictory statements in a short window span?


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## Sablés (Nov 20, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> Yeah as long as he uses FS which Pre-Udon G4 didn't use as he himself stated.


You stupid or something?

Post-Udon Luffy is ridiculously more powerful than his weaker versions just from the opening shot he landed, by feats and portrayal. He used FS on Kaido in their fight and still got tagged.


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## MrPopo (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> Luffy fans are so greedy. You’re not content with current Luffy fighting hybrid Kaido in a 1v1 and splitting the sky with him, now you also need Luffy from two power ups ago to also be stronger than current zoro?
> 
> so greedy lmao





A Optimistic said:


> The Zoro fandom is very greedy. And that's a good thing.


I thought greed was a good thing

Reactions: Funny 13 | Winner 1


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## OG sama (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> You avoided my question. If current Luffy and kuri Luffy fought, who wins and what's the difficulty?
> 
> 
> As for Kinemon, he was using Oden's haki when he stabbed Kaido. Perhaps if kuri Luffy prays hard enough, he will get access to Oden's haki as well.


The difficulty is irrelevant to the real argument at hand. Zoro isn’t stronger than even Kuri Luffy, he has only looked better in the same manner that others have looked better despite not being stronger like the Scabbards, they all had ways of bypassing Kaidos scales that Kuri Luffy simply didn’t have access to, hurting Kaido has nothing to do with just pure strength alone.

I don’t know how many times I need to say this but I won’t be saying it no more. Just go and reread this post again and again until you get your comprehension skills right.


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## Sablés (Nov 20, 2021)

MrPopo said:


> I thought greed was a good thing


@A Optimistic You _need _to stop making posts that are so easy to call out

Reactions: Funny 8


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

wtf popo

Reactions: Funny 11


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## MrPopo (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> wtf popo


Revenge for doubting my Law fandom

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 20, 2021)

how about a kid/law vs katakuri thread next

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> How can you type these two contradictory statements in a short window span?


hes right my guy

not even zoro can stand up to pre-udon luffy

matter of fact, he should just give up on mihawk. it's a pipe dream.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Sablés (Nov 20, 2021)

Nighty the Mighty said:


> how about a kid/law vs katakuri thread next


Seeing as they're beating his mum, it's only right

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 20, 2021)

Sablés said:


> You stupid or something?


No. Are you retarded?



Sablés said:


> Post-Udon Luffy is ridiculously more powerful than his weaker versions just from the opening shot he landed at the start,


No the fuck he isn't. Him learning a new skill that improves his AP doesn't mean he improved his speed you smooth brain.

And going by this logic, Kiku must be stronger than Pre-Udon Gear 4 Luffy since she could harm Kaido whereas Luffy back then couldn't huh?




Sablés said:


> by feats and portrayal. He used FS on Kaido in their fight and still got tagged.


He didn't use FS back in his first fight against Kaido so he couldn't dodge the Thunder Bagua at all, whereas base Luffy only got partially tagged.

Reactions: Winner 3


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## Nighty the Mighty (Nov 20, 2021)

Sablés said:


> Seeing as they're beating his mum, it's only right


BMEW (big mom escapes wano)


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## OG sama (Nov 20, 2021)

MrPopo said:


> I thought greed was a good thing


How can he type these two contradictory statements in such a short window span?

Reactions: Funny 6


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## MrPopo (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> How can he type these two contradictory statements in such a short window span?


To be fair those posts are months apart

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Sablés (Nov 20, 2021)

Nighty the Mighty said:


> BMEW (big mom escapes wano)

Reactions: Funny 2


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

alright i concede, you win mr. popo

Reactions: Funny 1 | Friendly 2


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## MrPopo (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> alright i concede, you win mr. popo


Bookmarked for future use

Reactions: Funny 5


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## Fisherman John West (Nov 20, 2021)

Seraphoenix said:


> So nothing in a 1v1? Also all attacks where Kaido didn't bother to dodge or use CoA?
> Thanks for proving my point
> 
> Time to get back to reality fanboy.



It was all Zoro by himself

unless you want to show me Zoro getting assistance in the attacks or moments when doing those attacks besides Law teleporting Zoro 

Until then, keep coping


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## OG sama (Nov 20, 2021)

MrPopo said:


> To be fair those posts are months apart


I’m just pulling some legs.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Fisherman John West (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Luffy wasn’t calm and Oda obviously had him get beat in the way he did for tension purposes mainly.
> 
> We even see FS being such a useful ability that Luffy was the only rooftop fighter who could dodge and react to a point blank Thunder Bagua albeit barely.



Being calm doesn't enhance durability nor does it help for Luffy, nor does it help Katakuri cause he lost his cool many times against someone who got negged diff


OG sama said:


> What you don’t even realize is, thats a feat that’s easily transferable to Katakuri. That’s how OP FS is, and it’s an ability that Kata has had way more practice with than Luffy. Imagine Katakuri dodging a Thunder Bagua that no one else on the rooftop could even react to.



He can't dodge it, he will do no different than Luffy against Base Kaido, see the future + unable to react in time.


OG sama said:


> The above doesn’t sound like a fodder to me at all. You got to come to me when you have a better comprehension of this manga bro, all this is right there in the manga for you to understand.
> 
> Katakuri isn’t a fodder and never has been a fodder, nothing from WCI, everything it took for Luffy to beat this dude, should have you believing this way.


It sounds like head canon actually causes you think Katakuri will dodge Kaido when another FS user could barely do it. And that FS user is more durable then Katakuri


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## OG sama (Nov 20, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> hes right my guy
> 
> not even zoro can stand up to pre-udon luffy
> 
> matter of fact, he should just give up on mihawk. it's a pipe dream.


Nah he just has to get stronger and this battle will make him stronger.

You want Zoro to be near Luffys level with no experience fighting any YCs but I’m the one being greedy and I’m the one wanking Luffy when Zoro hasn’t proved Jack shit, he beat Pica and y’all Zoro fans thought he was somebody.


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

this has been @Tenma watching this thread closely for the last hour

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 6


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## Tenma (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> this has been @Tenma watching this thread closely for the last hour

Reactions: Funny 1 | Winner 3


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## Nardoguey (Nov 20, 2021)

Dellinger said:


> Ahhh these retarded arguments
> 
> Zoro never fought a Yonko one v one. He had other guys around him and got saved from getting turned into dust thanks to Law.
> 
> Kaido would obliterate Zoro in a one vs one as he did with a stronger Luffy 3 times


Zorotards will take anything to overwank the object of their desires
Every chapter, they have to make it about Zoro being the strongest, they are the worst fanbase by far 

They even made me dislike Zoro now, that's how bad it's gotten

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Shanks (Nov 20, 2021)

Bruh... Where's ma neg  

Guess the super ignore function is a good backup


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 20, 2021)

OG sama said:


> Nah he just has to get stronger and this battle will make him stronger.
> 
> You want Zoro to be near Luffys level with no experience fighting any YCs but I’m the one being greedy and I’m the one wanking Luffy when Zoro hasn’t proved Jack shit, he beat Pica and y’all Zoro fans thought he was somebody.


at the end of this arc, how close will zoro be to luffy. give it a difficulty.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

MrPopo said:


> I thought greed was a good thing


Only for Zoro fans.

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

Sablés said:


> @A Optimistic You _need _to stop making posts that are so easy to call out


You mean he needs to stop posting about Zoro.

I told him, he contradicts himself easily.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

Ren. said:


> You mean he needs to stop posting about Zoro.
> 
> I told him, he contradicts himself easily.



if I stopped posting about zoro, then who would you quote and tag 10 times everyday?

you need me

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> if I stopped posting about zoro, then who would you quote and tag 10 times everyday?
> 
> you need me


Fair enough

Reactions: Funny 3


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## blueframe01 (Nov 20, 2021)

It's funny how Katakuri gets called out for his "lack of durability" despite having to battle G4 Luffy with a self inflicted stab in his body. Yet the same people conveniently forget that Zoro performed so much worse than Katakuri under the same condition. 

Remember Zoro vs Kamazo? Zoro was stabbed through his body similar to Katakuri and all he could muster is ONE finishing move before being knocked out cold. This is Zoro, the durability king in OL, fainting shortly after getting stabbed through. What happened to his durability then? 

Now compare that with Katakuri: That moment when he stabbed himself was the transition period from where we went from looking down on Luffy to respecting him as an equal. You could consider that moment to be where the fight got serious, and both took many hits, big moves, etc. 

By that comparison alone tells us that Katakuri durability is so underrated here in OL.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 6


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## Seraphoenix (Nov 20, 2021)

blueframe01 said:


> It's funny how Katakuri gets called out for his "lack of durability" despite having to battle G4 Luffy with a self inflicted stab in his body. Yet the same people conveniently forget that Zoro performed so much worse than Katakuri under the same condition.
> 
> Remember Zoro vs Kamazo? Zoro was stabbed through his body similar to Katakuri and all he could muster is ONE finishing move before being knocked out cold. This is Zoro, the durability king in OL, fainting shortly after getting stabbed through. What happened to his durability then?
> 
> ...


According to the Zoro fans, Zoro fainted because he was hungry

Reactions: Funny 12


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## Lawliet (Nov 20, 2021)

o0Shinthi0o said:


> Kata all day everyday , twice on friday
> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> ...


Where are you from


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## Mylesime (Nov 20, 2021)

Luffy was not at the level of a YFM after WCI, just like he won't be at the level of the Yonkos after Wano despite his incoming victory against Kaido.
Ignoring plot and taking the feats out of context won't change that....
The only time Luffy was comparable to Katakuri was after gaining FS and when using that advanced form of haki with his Gear 4 Snakeman.
So It was only momentarly.....
Rather than punching, kicking and hitting the MC with his knees, had Mogura been used it should have been game over.

Kaido could have sliced Luffy's throat several times on the Rooftop and spared him every single time, just like with the scabbards, plot is the only reason those heroes are alive.
We're getting close to the end game, the protagonists had to grow, never before have we witnessed so many big power ups mid fights. This is Ennies loby  x 10.
The heroes power ups mid fight are insane.....
If someone had told me that Sanji would be able to heal a broken spine in mere seconds a few weeks ago I would have laughed at him. This is crazy.
Oda did not handle the protagonists growth very well.
I mean when I look at a character like Law, compared to what he did on Dressrosa?


It's time to accept that Katakuri let Luffy win, and that at Kuri Oda took away Future Sight, which meant that Luffy wasn't anywhere near "YFM" level when Kaido OS him.
It's frankly laughable to claim that Killer could destroy Katakuri, something that was told at the peak of the Rooftop wank... 


I mean come on, Perospero is portrayed as not totally outclassed by Jack, Big Mom is on par with Kaido, but somehow her right hand and strongest child would be the only one outclassed by his competition in the rival crew.
So what, Katakuri is supposed to be comparable to Jack, weaker than Queen when Smoothie, Snack and Cracker are between the two siblings in the rankings of the Charlotte family ?
It's obvious that it doesn't make any sense.... Specially since we know how much stronger Katakuri is compared to Cracker. It wasn't even close.

On topic: Zoro extreme diff.
He's getting there, and unlike Luffy his victory will be legit. King will not become a cheerleader mid fight.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1 | Lewd 1


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## Jay. (Nov 20, 2021)

king is already a zoro cheerleader and offered him some close range sparring. king could just wait in long distance and attack zoro as much as he wants and zoro would get more and more tired til the mink medicine finishes him off. strawhats have charisma. they always win their opponents over. look at the mr.1 fight and killer and zoro also seem like lowkey bros now

Reactions: Winner 1


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## o0Shinthi0o (Nov 20, 2021)

Lawliet said:


> Where are you from


Bangladesh

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


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## Mylesime (Nov 20, 2021)

Jay. said:


> king is already a zoro cheerleader and offered him some close range sparring. king could just wait in long distance and attack zoro as much as he wants and zoro would get more and more tired til the mink medicine finishes him off. strawhats have charisma. they always win their opponents over. look at the mr.1 fight and killer and zoro also seem like lowkey bros now



There is level to this shit tough.
Katakuri took a lunch break against Luffy, stabbed himself, and between the two events Luffy fell on Brûlée who was the key in order to get out of the mirror world when he ran out of haki after bound man......
King is just doing the mandatory villain dumb/arrogant move in comparison.
Luffy VS Katakuri was atrocious in terms of plotshield and PIS.


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## A Optimistic (Nov 20, 2021)

Seraphoenix said:


> According to the Zoro fans, Zoro fainted because he was hungry


Zoro was celebrating Ramadan at the time and needed to break his fast

Reactions: Funny 6 | Lewd 1


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 20, 2021)

The most important thing is the actual logistics of the fight. If you jump to Zoro's superior attack power and endurance
you forget that Zoro has no way of hitting Kat at all with his poor observation haki and average speed. Kat would mid diff 
zoro

Reactions: Agree 1 | Informative 1


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 20, 2021)

Shunsuiju said:


> the only defensible position for katakuri standing a chance is by backing yourself into this fantastical world where luffy is strides ahead of zoro



The argument you are making is not logistical. You've said top tiers can handle future sight but what abilities 
does Zoro have to handle it actually. Does he have Kaido's speed or snakeman's speed or ancient zoan endurance.
You are using the abilities of top tiers who have totally different skill sets to Zoro. Which is not making an argument
based on stats but on some broad assumption that there are binary levels where strengths and weaknesses aren't important. 
Boundman luffy is stronger, has better defense and is faster than Kat yet essentially could do nothing to him.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Geralt-Singh (Nov 20, 2021)

Looks like people are forgetting Zoro's feats on the rooftop 
Like reacting to Hakai/BM's attacks faster than the others SN could 
Or scarring and blitzing Kaido 
Zoro stomps Katakuri mid diff

Reactions: Winner 2 | Tier Specialist 3


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## Beast (Nov 20, 2021)

Zoro blitz Kaidou.

Zoro was the only able to react to Hakai.

Zoro just needs to land a blow.

Oda won’t believe that.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Dellinger (Nov 20, 2021)

Seraphoenix said:


> According to the Zoro fans, Zoro fainted because he was hungry


I had forgotten that lmao


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## Jay. (Nov 20, 2021)

kaido couldn't stop underrestimating zoro and the scar he already had reopened upon touching enma's cold steel again. 
zoro didnt stop hakai he bought law and the others some time to get them all out of instant death. he broke all his bones in the process. stop two piecing. that's why you guys are so surprised about the king fight. 


zoro's move was brave but law prolly had it under control with room

Reactions: Agree 3 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Typhon (Nov 20, 2021)

My Kata coin at an all time high

So basically the only defense I'm seeing for Zoro winning is faulty power scalling

Reactions: Funny 2


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## TheWiggian (Nov 20, 2021)

Enma low diffs, Zoro watches and wins by default.

Reactions: Funny 2 | Optimistic 1


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Enma low diffs, Zoro watches and wins by default.


Well enma can neg Zoro so...


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## TheWiggian (Nov 20, 2021)

Ren. said:


> Well enma can neg Zoro so...



It can. It also stalemated prime WB.


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> It can. It also stalemated prime WB.


Fake news, as after that the sword Ace  no diffed Enma and fough WB' bisento for 3 days.


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## TheWiggian (Nov 20, 2021)

Ren. said:


> Fake news, as after that Roger no diffed Enma and fough WB for 3 days.



Oda drew this not me:



Keep hating mate. And WB had support from Murakumogiri on top of that.

Reactions: Funny 10 | Winner 1


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Oda drew this not me:
> 
> 
> 
> Keep hating mate. And WB had support from Murakumogiri on top of that.


Still fake news by omissions.


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## Firo (Nov 20, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Oda drew this not me:
> 
> 
> 
> Keep hating mate. And WB had support from Murakumogiri on top of that.


Bruh.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Friendly 1


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## bil02 (Nov 20, 2021)

Just funny how the one piece fandom change their views every week.

We went from :
>Zoro is a top tier and much stronger than kuri Luffy as a consensus
     To
>King making Zoro struggle will only elevate him
     To
>Zoro is barely Yc1 level and weaker than Kuri Luffy.

I bet next chapter,we will be back to >Zoro was always much stronger than Kuri Luffy,it was obvious.

Like having a consistent take is so difficult?

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Ren. (Nov 20, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> bil02 said:
> 
> 
> > Just funny how the one piece change their views every week.
> ...


Neah I am stiil on track with above YC1 for Zoro after King.

And Luffy just below the weakest Admiral after Kaido.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Typhon (Nov 20, 2021)

Nah Kuri Luffy doesn't matter. Katakuri bloodlusted folds him too. Idk why he was even brought up.


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## Oda Report (Nov 20, 2021)

kata loses......seriously luffy fan boys need to chill.

Reactions: Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 3


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 20, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> kata loses......seriously luffy fan boys need to chill.



How? what does Zoro do to hurt him?


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## truedetectiveseason2intro (Nov 20, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> goodnight ren


Literally just don’t respond to him


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## Oda Report (Nov 20, 2021)

Commanderbilli said:


> How? what does Zoro do to hurt him?



Zoro is damaging a greater threat in Kaidou. 

Please.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## ho11ow (Nov 20, 2021)

Putting Zoro vs Katakuri aside, who can beat Katakuri if you don't have FS or a top tier?

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Yumi Zoro (Nov 20, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Oda drew this not me:
> 
> 
> 
> Keep hating mate. And WB had support from Murakumogiri on top of that.



Please Make one with Luffy's Homu Gomu fruit clashing with fish fish fruit Kaido.

And splitting Sky.


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## Oda Report (Nov 20, 2021)

ho11ow said:


> Putting Zoro vs Katakuri aside, who can beat Katakuri if you don't have FS or a top tier?



FS doesn't make you unbeatable everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 2 | Tier Specialist 1 | Dislike 1


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 20, 2021)

ho11ow said:


> Putting Zoro vs Katakuri aside, who can beat Katakuri if you don't have FS or a top tier?


Those who have more stamina than him

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Yumi Zoro (Nov 20, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> Those who have more stamina than him



King, Zoro have more stamina than Katakuri.

Its funny that you juste contradict yourself with this one.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 20, 2021)

Sweet Tomato said:


> King, Zoro have more stamina than Katakuri.
> 
> Its funny that you juste contradict yourself with this one.


Zoro fainted after getting stabbed by Kamazo in the shoulder

Katakuri was still able to fight for hours after putting a hole in his abdomen.

King is gonna go down to less

Shut up and read the manga


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## Great Potato (Nov 20, 2021)

Zoro wins

He's also going to take King while on a strict time limit from the magic medicine. Maybe if he's also on the drug in this fight then Katakuri can use FS to try burning the clock, but in normal circumstances Zoro is going to get him eventually.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 2


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## Jay. (Nov 20, 2021)

Great Potato said:


> Zoro wins
> 
> He's also going to take King while on a strict time limit from the magic medicine. Maybe if he's also on the drug in this fight then Katakuri can use FS to try burning the clock, but in normal circumstances Zoro is going to get him eventually.


wild take bro but i see where you coming from

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Yumi Zoro (Nov 20, 2021)

Great Potato said:


> Zoro wins
> 
> He's also going to take King while on a strict time limit from the magic medicine. Maybe if he's also on the drug in this fight then Katakuri can use FS to try burning the clock, but in normal circumstances Zoro is going to get him eventually.



One of the best OL poster, hand down.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Friendly 1


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 20, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> Zoro is damaging a greater threat in Kaidou.
> 
> Please.



This isn't Dragon Ball Z. Zoro is losing to a YC1 right now how does he beat one that he can't even hit
Kaido let's people hit him.


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 20, 2021)

Remember when King blitz into Zoro after hitting him, it was so quick that Zoro couldn't react. Faster people than King have tried doing that to Katakuri and he dodged them. The airheadness of this thread is unconscionable


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## Oda Report (Nov 20, 2021)

Commanderbilli said:


> This isn't Dragon Ball Z. Zoro is losing to a YC1 right now how does he beat one that he can't even hit
> Kaido let's people hit him.



This isn't DBZ yet you are the one running around using fanmade terms like YC1 trying to place king into a box rather then let his personal power speak for itself. Espically when King hasn't gone full tilt. 

The right hands aren't all built the same. As you are seeing with King destroying Zoro, whom Kaidou takes on suicide missions vs another yonkou crew, who happens to have better durability then kaidous dragon scales. .


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## Sablés (Nov 20, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> No. Are you retarded?


Coming from the guy who said Tatsumaki only cuts once when then premise is a whirlwind of blades and we see King withstand a series of cuts in the very chapter this thread was made for.   


Kagutsutchi said:


> No the fuck he isn't. Him learning a new skill that improves his AP doesn't mean he improved his speed you smooth brain.


Luffy's abilities increased wholesale. This is why he doesn't even need G4 to outspeed and punch Kaido out, and before that was taking hits that would have floored his former incarnations. Big example is taking Ragnarok in base, unguarded, only to get up by the next chapter and go harder than before. Thunder Bagua K.O'd G4, with no comeback. 



Kagutsutchi said:


> And going by this logic, Kiku must be stronger than Pre-Udon Gear 4 Luffy since she could harm Kaido whereas Luffy back then couldn't huh?


Yeah sure, why not? Zoro and Killer couldn't scratch Base Kaido at the start. Anyone who could achieve that - if they did so on their own merits - is very impressive.


Kagutsutchi said:


> He didn't use FS back in his first fight against Kaido


Never said that he did, and I already told you that. You have a habit of making people repeat themselves?


Kagutsutchi said:


> so he couldn't dodge the Thunder Bagua at all, whereas base Luffy only got partially tagged.


Base Luffy is stronger here.
Not that I understand the issue. WCI-Base Luffy could tag Katakuri on occasion.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## DarkRasengan (Nov 20, 2021)

Katakuri is a bad matchup for zoro, he wins as if now since zoro doesnt have the speed to tag him.


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## Nathan Copeland (Nov 20, 2021)

Kats my use bro but he’s not getting up from farce of the dead!


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 20, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> This isn't DBZ yet you are the one running around using fanmade terms like YC1 trying to place king into a box rather then let his personal power speak for itself. Espically when King hasn't gone full tilt.
> 
> The right hands aren't all built the same. As you are seeing with King destroying Zoro, whom Kaidou takes on suicide missions vs another yonkou crew, who happens to have better durability then kaidous dragon scales. .



King blocked the attack with his wings and Kaido did not block. King being stronger than Katakuri has no basis because Zoro's
strength is unknown and undefined he fought in a group match while there are clear ways to compare Katakuri to boundman, snakeman, doffy and Cracker. What we know from Zoro is that in a one on one fight with King a person who occupies a similar
position to Katakuri he can't do anything. Katakuri possesses the ability to dodge all of Zoro's attacks


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## Oda Report (Nov 20, 2021)

Commanderbilli said:


> King blocked the attack with his wings and Kaido did not block.



Wow King blocked once. . .in full Zoan mode.

Zoro had Kaidou do more then just block the koi fish was instructed to dodge, while big mom was shook. 
Zoro throw away attacks can cut past Kaidous scales. 
Zoro hasn't damaged King and King hasn't even broken a sweat overpowering Zoro who has enough ap to damage kaidou easily even with broken bones. 



Commanderbilli said:


> King being stronger than Katakuri has no basis because Zoro's
> strength is unknown and undefined he fought in a group match while there are clear ways to compare Katakuri to boundman, snakeman, doffy and Cracker. What we know from Zoro is that in a one on one fight with King a person who occupies a similar
> position to Katakuri he can't do anything. Katakuri possesses the ability to dodge all of Zoro's attacks



King is above WCI Kata, Kata can't damage King and loses to King, has no answer for King Fire attacks etc etc.

Zoro at this point is tagging Kaidou with broken bones. . . yet you claim Zoro can't tag Kata, no.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 20, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> Wow King blocked once. . .in full Zoan mode.
> 
> Zoro had Kaidou do more then just block the koi fish was instructed to dodge, while big mom was shook.
> Zoro throw away attacks can cut past Kaidous scales.
> ...



Katakuri can damage King. First it has already been established that Zoro can damage King because
the slashed grazed his face. 2nd King has gone out of his way to both dodge and block attacks from Zoro
in order to avoid being damaged. 3rd Katakuri is capable of hitting King unguarded whenever he wants to.

What's more important here is that FS lets Katakuri hit King without King being able to guard against it.
We know this to be a 'fact' because Katakuri could hit Boundman and even Snakeman without either
of them being able to guard in time because Kat can dodge their attacks and hit them unguarded.
Again to reiterate King was grazed when he couldn't get out of the way and blocks/dodges attacks
so when faced with someone who will have no problem with his speed and he can't block/dodge against
he will be open.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 20, 2021)

- SNIP -



Sablés said:


> when then premise is a whirlwind of blades and we see King withstand a series of cuts in the very chapter this thread was made for.


Cool story kid, that "whirlwind of blades" only produces ONE  cut on Kaido. Actual manga evidence to support my claim:


And even still with the latest chapter, I also acknowledged that Katakuri can dodge the many wind blades of Zoro's tornado, he no diffed a Kong Organ:


So whether it produces one or a bunch of cuts, Katakuri can easily dodge them.

And before you go about claiming that Katakuri can't separate his body completely, know that he can do that like other logias.



Sablés said:


> Luffy's abilities increased wholesale.


Fucking prove this boy. Don't just talk. You had an entire day to come up with an argument.






Sablés said:


> This is why he doesn't even need G4 to outspeed and punch Kaido out, and before that was taking hits that would have floored his former incarnations.


He punched Kaido out thanks to him learning a new skill(AdCoA) and Kaido not expecting any damage from him.

And he never fucking outsped Kaido in his base form, even when he used his Future Sight, he could only partially dodge Kaido's fastest Attack:





Sablés said:


> Big example is taking Ragnarok in base, unguarded, only to get up by the next chapter and go harder than before. Thunder Bagua K.O'd G4, with no comeback.


That's just Kaido and Oda's own fucking inconsistency. Freaking Kinemon tanked Kaido's CoC attacks plus a stab wound from the man, and even you aren't genuinely that stupid to claim he's stronger than Pre-Udon G4 Luffy, or are you?



Sablés said:


> Yeah sure, why not? Zoro and Killer couldn't scratch Base Kaido at the start. Anyone who could achieve that - if they did


Well that answers that fucking question. Now I know not to take you serious anymore.




Sablés said:


> Never said that he did, and I already told you that. You have a habit of making people repeat themselves?


- SNIP - You don't say it, but you might as well act like you're saying it since your argument implies that there is no difference between him using it or not.

- SNIP -



Sablés said:


> WCI-Base Luffy could tag Katakuri on occasion.


And on other occasions couldn't tag Katakuri even in his fastest form with the ability to see the future.

Base Luffy can match Kaido blow for blow now, yet G4 Snakeman isn't sending Kaido flying.

Knowing how your logic works, I'm sure you don't see the inconsistencies and outliers within this and the Kinemon comparison.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Oda Report (Nov 20, 2021)

Commanderbilli said:


> Katakuri can damage King.



Kata can't damage kaidou, Kata can't damage King, much like how Zoro can damage kaidou but cant hurt King, even when King is in base. Kata hasn't displayed AP any where near Zoros. 



Commanderbilli said:


> First it has already been established that Zoro can damage King because
> the slashed grazed his face.



That's his mask, Not king ripping King shirt doesn't mean Zoro can damage King. Zoro already stated nothing has worked. 



Commanderbilli said:


> 3rd Katakuri is capable of hitting King unguarded whenever he wants to.



It won't do anything to hurt King, that's the problem. 



Commanderbilli said:


> What's more important here is that FS lets Katakuri hit King without King being able to guard against it.
> We know this to be a 'fact' because Katakuri could hit Boundman and even Snakeman without either
> of them being able to guard in time because Kat can dodge their attacks and hit them unguarded.
> Again to reiterate King was grazed when he couldn't get out of the way and blocks/dodges attacks
> ...



Luffy in WCI is no wear near King. 

WCI Luffy can't damage King either, and thats what Kata took a L from.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Dislike 1


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 20, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> Kata can't damage kaidou, Kata can't damage King, much like how Zoro can damage kaidou but cant hurt King, even when King is in base. Kata hasn't displayed AP any where near Zoros.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



This comparison between King and Kaido ends at King dodging and blocking attacks. Zoro did not say he was hitting King directly 'he said after all those attacks' and what have the panels shown us dodging at supersonic speeds to avoid attacks, blocking. There is one character in THIS ARC who can't be hurt and he doesn't block or dodge. I'm willing to bet you $500 dollars
that a character who dodges with supersonic speed and blocks attacks can be damaged if tagged (when not blocking). I won't even take your money you can just receive if you are right. Hit me in direct message during the Zoro fight. The time when he mask got cut is the only time you've seen Zoro tag king the rest of the time he is dodging or blocking and yet you believe he cant be hurt if tagged.


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## Sablés (Nov 20, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> Oh yeah you are retarded if you took the entire day to come up with this as a comeback.


Not all of us have free time for stupidity.


Kagutsutchi said:


> Cool story kid, that "whirlwind of blades" only produces ONE cut on Kaido. Actual manga evidence to support my claim:


Indeed. Which is a testament to Kaido's durability that only a single part on his body was cut, NOT that the nature of Zoro's attack is to only slash once, you oaf.



Sadly for Katakuri, he's nowhere near as durable as King or Kaido.


Kagutsutchi said:


> Fucking prove this boy.


The rest of my post does it fine. You can read, hopefully.


Kagutsutchi said:


> He punched Kaido out thanks to him learning a new skill(AdCoA) and Kaido not expecting any damage from him.


Why would Kaido not expect any damage when Luffy already _proved _he could damage him, and Kaido was actively avoiding his punches? - SNIP -






Kagutsutchi said:


> he never fucking outsped Kaido in his base form



'

Both cases, a charging Kaido failed to land his attack before Luffy did.


Kagutsutchi said:


> That's just Kaido and Oda's own fucking inconsistency.




- SNIP - Second shit doesn't work in your favor, it doesn't count. 

Prove this is an inconsistency in Luffy's showings. "Muh scabbard" isn't an argument, because that would, at most, be an outlier for THEM not Luffy.


Kagutsutchi said:


> Well that answers that fucking question. Now I know not to take you serious anymore.


Of course it does, as whenever a point against you arises, you have nothing but strawmen to offer.


Kagutsutchi said:


> And on other occasions couldn't tag Katakuri even in his fastest form with the ability to see the future.


My entire point is that FS on Katakuri is not some perfect ability that means he will never be hit. An inferior Base Luffy _did _tag him. Whether he can do so consistently, is irrelevant.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Oda Report (Nov 20, 2021)

Commanderbilli said:


> This comparison between King and Kaido ends at King dodging and blocking attacks.



Kaidou blocks attacks and dodged Zoro's dragon blaze.....Checkmate.  



Commanderbilli said:


> Zoro did not say he was hitting King directly 'he said after all those attacks' and what have the panels shown us dodging at supersonic speeds to avoid attacks, blocking. There is one character in THIS ARC who can't be hurt and he doesn't block or dodge. I'm willing to bet you $500 dollars
> that a character who dodges with supersonic speed and blocks attacks can be damaged if tagged (when not blocking). I won't even take your money you can just receive if you are right. Hit me in direct message during the Zoro fight. The time when he mask got cut is the only time you've seen Zoro tag king the rest of the time he is dodging or blocking and yet you believe he cant be hurt if tagged.



King durability was compared to kaidous and Kings won out. Kings full Zoan tanked Zoro's twister, kaidous full zoan didn't. You can not say Kings words about being on a different level from his peers is hyperbole when it was also displayed for us.


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## Ayy lmao (Nov 20, 2021)

Do some people here think Katakuri can harm Kaido?


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## DarkRasengan (Nov 20, 2021)

Ayy lmao said:


> Do some people here think Katakuri can harm Kaido?


Nope, good thing that has nothing to do with this matchup
Zoro doesnt have kaidos durability and zoro doesnt have the speed to even hit katakuri

Reactions: Like 1 | Tier Specialist 1 | Dislike 2


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## Shunsuiju (Nov 20, 2021)

I applaud those who still have the stamina to go back and forth on this. If I post that panel a few more times, I'm sure they'll listen.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Oda Report (Nov 20, 2021)

Ayy lmao said:


> Do some people here think Katakuri can harm Kaido?



They think Kata can dodge kaidou to death.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 1 | Disagree 1


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## DarkRasengan (Nov 20, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> They think Kata can dodge kaidou to death.


Who thinks that? Is this thread called kaidou vs katakuri?

Reactions: Dislike 1


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## Grinningfox (Nov 20, 2021)

Zoro bros are out of control


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 21, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> Kaidou blocks attacks and dodged Zoro's dragon blaze.....Checkmate.
> 
> 
> 
> King durability was compared to kaidous and Kings won out. Kings full Zoan tanked Zoro's twister, kaidous full zoan didn't. You can not say Kings words about being on a different level from his peers is hyperbole when it was also displayed for us.



Accept the bet. Let's making it $800 dollars. 

As I've reiterated King's blocking durability is being compared to Kaido nonblocking durability and in one
piece there are other factors like armament haki to be considered let alone blocking itself. 
If king doesn't block Katakuri can hurt him and in fact King can't block against Katakuri


----------



## Oda Report (Nov 21, 2021)

Commanderbilli said:


> Accept the bet. Let's making it $800 dollars.



Whats the bet?  



Commanderbilli said:


> As I've reiterated King's blocking durability is being compared to Kaido nonblocking durability and in one
> piece there are other factors like armament haki to be considered let alone blocking itself.



If King used COA and that's how he became more durable then kaidou, it doesn't change anything. really since haki is a personal power of X individual.

Keep yo money, give me the respect and hold ya L like a man.  



Commanderbilli said:


> If king doesn't block Katakuri can hurt him and in fact King can't block against Katakuri



Does kata hit as hard as lets say Marco or Zoro?

Can kata hurt Kaidou because we just learn that King is that durable.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Oda Report (Nov 21, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> Who thinks that? Is this thread called kaidou vs katakuri?



If kata can hurt kaidou he has a chance of beating King because king is more durable then kaidou.  



Grinningfox said:


> Zoro bros are out of control



The Zoro bros caught the biggest L this week.

I warned them as well, hold ya L also fox, Im not bias everyone gets shot.

Reactions: Winner 1 | Disagree 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 21, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> Whats the bet?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



If he used COA there's a time limit on him using this haki but more importantly if you can hit him without
him getting the opportunity to block you can hurt him. The use of COA, blocking and supersonic dodging
are to protect him from being hurt because his actual body isn't as durable as Kaido. In a fight with Katakuri
his speed is nerfed, his blocking is nerfed and the only possibility is COA body parts like apoo used in
this chapter but that is significantly less effective than the outright blocking and running he has been doing.
In fact we've never seen King just COA a specific part of his body instead of blocking and running because
obviously he doesnt want to

It doesn't matter if he doesn't hit as hard things like block mochi/diced mochi are comparable to G4 attacks
and King will rarely be able to make contact with Kat


----------



## Kagutsutchi (Nov 21, 2021)

Sablés said:


> Not all of us have free time for stupidity.


Yeah but you're not a part of that group of busy people bozo  




Sablés said:


> Indeed. Which is a testament to Kaido's durability that only a single part on his body was cut, NOT that the nature of Zoro's attack is to only slash once, you oaf.


"Only a single part of Kaido was cut" that means not all the blades are created equal then. So Katakuri can dodge the most dangerous one. Not to say he can't dodge all of them anyway.

And good for you to ignore this panel:

You're intelligent enough to recognize when your claims no longer prove anything




Sablés said:


> The rest of my post does it fine. You can read, hopefully.


It proves nothing except how stupid your reasoning is.




Sablés said:


> Why would Kaido not expect any damage when Luffy already _proved _he could damage him, and Kaido was actively avoiding his punches? Are you fucking stupid?


Are _you_ fucking stupid? I was talking about the start of their fight before Kaido saw the silhouettes of his hall of fame you retard.




Sablés said:


> '
> 
> Both cases, a charging Kaido failed to land his attack before Luffy did.


The struggle to look like you're intelligent is real:


Kagutsutchi said:


> he could only partially dodge Kaido's fastest Attack


Why didn't you quote the rest my post to provide full context? Are you so insecure of your own arguments? So pathetic on your part.

Do you think base Luffy with FS outspeeding a Kaido using a nameless attack means he can blitz Kaido's TB? Of course you do, you think Kiku is stronger than Luffy.



Sablés said:


> Fuck right off. Second shit doesn't work in your favor, it doesn't count.


You're the bozo arguing that commonly accepted outliers are legit ways of scaling. Create a goddamn thread in any one piece fan site promoting and defending this take of yours and get laughed out of the community, clown.



Sablés said:


> Prove this is an inconsistency in Luffy's showings. "Muh scabbard" isn't an argument, because that would, at most, be an outlier for THEM not Luffy.


Same Luffy with a powerup that boosted his defense and offense was later K.O.ed and thrown off onigashima by Kaido and was in such a bad shape he had to eat a week or month's worth of food to be able to fight Kaido. If he had such an amazing recovery, he wouldn't need to do this especially after getting stronger.

Same Luffy who was able to split the sky and match blows with Kaido in his base form, did barely any damage to a non guarding Kaido in his G4 snakeman form with all his powerups on top of Yamato's assistance after coming back to the flying Island. 

And I already mentioned the latter, but you're a blind cherry picking dullard.

Luffy's stats and feats against Kaido are not completely consistent. He's quickly recovering from attacks to a weaker form that K.O.ed and severely weakened stronger forms in the same fight.

His base form is performing on par with or better than his stronger forms against just minutes apart with nothing to show he grew stronger.

But hey, I expect you to ignore this and cherry pick a statement you can easily debunk, then you accuse me of strawmanning.




Sablés said:


> Of course it does, as whenever a point against you arises, you have nothing but strawmen to offer.


You just admitted to Kiku being stronger than G4 Luffy, and you accuse me of using strawmen, how the fuck are you still alive being this stupid?




Sablés said:


> My entire point is that FS on Katakuri is not some perfect ability that means he will never be hit. An inferior Base Luffy _did _tag him. Whether he can do so consistently, is irrelevant.


Base Luffy only tagged him after awakening his own FS, other times he did so was when Katakuri was not calm enough to use FS.

And the fact that you ignore consistency is not my problem, that's your own flaw for not seeing when stupid shit is stupid shit.

And don't bother expecting a reply if you continue to cherry pick my statements like a coward.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Sablés (Nov 21, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> "Only a single part of Kaido was cut" that means not all the blades are created equal then


Some of those swings will be caused by Enma, which has a higher DC than Zoro's other blades.
Another possibility could be artistic liberty by Oda, considering Ashura has 9 blades yet Kaido only suffered one deep gash.


Kagutsutchi said:


> You're intelligent enough to recognize when your claims no longer prove anything


What's this meant to prove exactly? Luffy's frontal barrage of punches come in intervals. Tatsumaki is a whirlwind that surrounds the target. If Katakuri's in the middle of it, his entire body is susceptible to damage.

Nice false equivalence.


Kagutsutchi said:


> I was talking about the start of their fight.


I was referring to the entire of the battle, including the very scans posted where Luffy reacts and fights on Kaido's level. Not my fault if you can't keep up with the train of conversation 


Kagutsutchi said:


> The struggle to look like you're intelligent is real:


Non-response. As expected.



Kagutsutchi said:


> Do you think base Luffy with FS outspeeding a Kaido using a nameless attack means he can blitz Kaido's TB?


What does TB have to do with Kaido's reactions, you ape? 


Kagutsutchi said:


> You're the bozo arguing that commonly accepted outliers


Cool buzzword for "I have no argument so I'll pretend it doesn't count".


Kagutsutchi said:


> Same Luffy with a powerup that boosted his defense and offense was later K.O.ed and thrown off onigashima by Kaido


Which is later explained on account of Luffy having no experience with his newfound powers. Fuck does that matter in the case of the panels linked to you where Luffy demonstrably outperforms his prior G4 self?


Kagutsutchi said:


> But hey, I expect you to ignore this and cherry pick a statement you can easily debunk, then you accuse me of strawmanning.


Sure I will, because the bulk of your post is filled with juvenile insults _and _cherrypicking, you utter hypocrite. Feats that don't match your agenda are ignored and you bring up some nonsense with the scabbards to attempt to justify an outlier for LUFFY, a completely unrelated character. When this entire battle is about his ascension into Yonko territory. Impressively stupid.



Kagutsutchi said:


> You just admitted


Don't remember saying any such thing. I actually sidestepped a definitive answer as it is irrelevant to Luffy, Katakuri, or Zoro.  Maybe when you stop frothing from the mouth because of some weird anger at someone not sucking Katakuri's mochi-flavored cock, you'll be able to see the nuance.


Kagutsutchi said:


> and you accuse me of using strawmen


Don't pretend you know the meaning of the word to feel offended by it.


Kagutsutchi said:


> Base Luffy only tagged him after awakening his own FS


All I needed to see. To nip this tedious "debate" in the bud. FS is not perfect. Luffy through sheer will and perseverance got the drop on Katakuri without requiring gears. Zoro is going to get him eventually, and a single slash from Enma is going to hurt.

Any further debate with you is a waste of time, as far as I'm concerned.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Ayy lmao (Nov 21, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> Nope, good thing that has nothing to do with this matchup
> Zoro doesnt have kaidos durability and zoro doesnt have the speed to even hit katakuri


Yes, attack power and durability has nothing to do with this matchup. You sure got that right.


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 21, 2021)

Sablés said:


> Some of those swings will be caused by Enma, which has a higher DC than Zoro's other blades.
> Another possibility could be artistic liberty by Oda, considering Ashura has 9 blades yet Kaido only suffered one deep gash.


Whatever. One cut is still one cut




Sablés said:


> What's this meant to prove exactly? Luffy's frontal barrage of punches come in intervals. Tatsumaki is a whirlwind that surrounds the target. If Katakuri's in the middle of it, his entire body is susceptible to damage.
> 
> Nice false equivalence.


Intervals or not, Katakuri can still dodge it. It's even better that it all comes at once as he only needs to dodge once

It doesn't even matter that he's in the middle of it, when we've seen him separate his entire body into different pieces.




Sablés said:


> I was referring to the entire of the battle, including the very scans posted where Luffy reacts and fights on Kaido's level. Not my fault if you can't keep up with the train of conversation


How am I supposed to know how the conversation is flowing if you can't exactly explain what you're talking about.



Sablés said:


> Non-response. As expected.


Concession accepted.




Sablés said:


> What does TB have to do with Kaido's reactions, you ape?


- SNIP -

My entire argument was that base Luffy never outsped Kaido's fastest attack and Pre-Udon Luffy was never outsped by Kaido's casual attacks either on top of the fact that he wasn't using FS, which immensely boosts your speed. So you have no point in claiming base Luffy grew faster than Gear 4 Luffy.

But at this point, I'm definitely done entertaining a fucking chimpanzee.




Sablés said:


> Cool buzzword for "I have no argument so I'll pretend it doesn't count".


Again concession accepted - SNIP -

And I do have an argument, let's see if you ignore it too.





Sablés said:


> Which is later explained on account of Luffy having no experience with his newfound powers.


Inexperience with a power that boosted your defense and offense led to Luffy performing worse than when he didn't have his powerup, - SNIP -




Sablés said:


> Fuck does that matter in the case of the panels linked to you where Luffy demonstrably outperforms his prior G4 self?


Again it's not my fault you can't see an outlier because you're too stupid.




Sablés said:


> Sure I will, because the bulk of your post is filled with juvenile insults


You're the one who started with the insults, don't cry about me returning the favor you asshole.

It's hilarious how people like you will start flinging shit at someone, yet when they decide to act like you, you cry foul.

- SNIP -




Sablés said:


> Zoro is going to get him eventually,


Maybe when he also awakens FS too. But I won't count on that.




Sablés said:


> Any further debate with you is a waste of time, as far as I'm concerned.



- SNIP -

Reactions: Agree 1 | Optimistic 1


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## Amol (Nov 21, 2021)

It could go either way extreme diff.
I would be on Zoro by the end of Wano though.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## DarkRasengan (Nov 21, 2021)

Ayy lmao said:


> Yes, attack power and durability has nothing to do with this matchup. You sure got that right.


It doesnt because zoro isnt anywhere close to kaidos durability and hes not gonna tag katakuri, so yes, im right

Reactions: Agree 1


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## DarkRasengan (Nov 21, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> If kata can hurt kaidou he has a chance of beating King because king is more durable then kaidou.


What does kings durability have to do with a zoro vs katakuri thread?

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Ayy lmao (Nov 21, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> It doesnt because zoro isnt anywhere close to kaidos durability and hes not gonna tag katakuri, so yes, im right


he doesn't need to be as durable as kaido to be stronger and more durable than Katakuri, you do realize that, right? you're also acting as if zoro will be unable to defend or dodge any of katakuri's attacks, despite luffy and sanji doing exactly that without FS. you're also acting as if he can use FS indefinitely. if he cant put wci luffy down despite beating him for hours and wci luffy being much weaker than current zoro, what makes you think he can put zoro down before he runs out of CoO?

Reactions: Disagree 3


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## DarkRasengan (Nov 21, 2021)

Ayy lmao said:


> he doesn't need to be as durable as kaido to be stronger and more durable than Katakuri, you do realize that, right? you're also acting as if zoro will be unable to defend or dodge any of katakuri's attacks, despite luffy and sanji doing exactly that without FS. you're also acting as if he can use FS indefinitely. if he cant put wci luffy down despite beating him for hours and wci luffy being much weaker than current zoro, what makes you think he can put zoro down before he runs out of CoO?


Being more durable than katakuri doesnt mean he automatically wind you do realize that right? Wci luffy isnt much weaker than current zoro. I think he can put zoro down by drowning him in mochi, peerless donuts, or his trident, zoro hasnt shown the durability feats to be able to tank g4 level attacks or to not suffocate in mochi, he also doesnt have the speed feats to tag katakuri.

Zoros not hitting kata so katas durability doesnt matter much.
If a nerfes killers scythe can go through zoros shoulder and eventually make him pass out, katakuri isnt going to have a problem in that department


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## Ayy lmao (Nov 21, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> Being more durable than katakuri doesnt mean he automatically wind you do realize that right?


Never said that lol.


DarkRasengan said:


> Wci luffy isnt much weaker than current zoro. I think he can put zoro down by drowning him in mochi, peerless donuts, or his trident, zoro hasnt shown the durability feats to be able to tank g4 level attacks or to not suffocate in mochi, he also doesnt have the speed feats to tag katakuri.


WCI Luffy couldn't scratch base Kaido even with his strongest attacks, current Zoro harmed him in Hybrid form. So yes, physically speaking, wci luffy is much weaker. Zoro is currently taking hits from a guy who overpowered the same attacks he used to harm Kaido, so yes he can tank WCI G4 level attacks. Unless you think WCI G4 Luffy can harm Kaido, and if so, proof?
And he can just cut the mochi with an air slash before it reaches him or just dodge.  
if zoro is able to react to BM and Kaido, I very much doubt katakuri's speed would poses a problem. 
Again, base Sanji and base Luffy pre FS was able to react to Katakuri just fine, Katakuri is not speed blitzing zoro no matter how much keep implying otherwise.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Creative 1


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## Oda Report (Nov 21, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> What does kings durability have to do with a zoro vs katakuri thread?



Read the posts.

Zoro beats kata, Zoro tags faster foes in Kaidou.


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## Typhon (Nov 21, 2021)

Typhon said:


> And the circular logic of Zoro can tag Kaidou so he can tag Katakuri is stupid. Zoro never matched speed with a Thunder Bagua and most of his attacks were on a stationary target. Katakuri outsped Luffy in his fastest form.


And to top this off. Zoro is currently having a hard time landing clean hits on King. So much so that King even decided to give him a handicap and fight in close quarters lol


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## DarkRasengan (Nov 21, 2021)

Ayy lmao said:


> Never said that lol.
> 
> WCI Luffy couldn't scratch base Kaido even with his strongest attacks, current Zoro harmed him in Hybrid form. So yes, physically speaking, wci luffy is much weaker. Zoro is currently taking hits from a guy who overpowered the same attacks he used to harm Kaido, so yes he can tank WCI G4 level attacks. Unless you think WCI G4 Luffy can harm Kaido, and if so, proof?
> And he can just cut the mochi with an air slash before it reaches him or just dodge.
> ...


Wci luffy had superior speed, endurance and CoO than current zoro, so he wasnt weaker

Reactions: Agree 1


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## convict (Nov 21, 2021)

Keep the flaming out of it people really close to just locking the thread. Currently reviewing for individual punishment.


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## Mercurial (Nov 21, 2021)

Long story short.

Katakuri troubles Zoro a lot.
Then Zoro goes Ashura and Katakuri dies.
Zoro wins high/extreme diff.


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## Commanderbilli (Nov 21, 2021)

Ayy lmao said:


> he doesn't need to be as durable as kaido to be stronger and more durable than Katakuri, you do realize that, right? you're also acting as if zoro will be unable to defend or dodge any of katakuri's attacks, despite luffy and sanji doing exactly that without FS. you're also acting as if he can use FS indefinitely. if he cant put wci luffy down despite beating him for hours and wci luffy being much weaker than current zoro, what makes you think he can put zoro down before he runs out of CoO?



These are very fair points actually especially the one about sanji and luffy dodging attacks. Although of course
we know that Kat can still hit people as fast as snakeman. 

In terms of the endurance point I'm unconvinced g2/g3 luffy is an endurance monster just because Zoro 
has far stronger attacks doesn't mean he can take g4 level attacks from Katakuri continuously especially
if Kat isn't being hit.


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## Jay. (Nov 27, 2021)

so what is the idea itt
what does zori do against future sight? or does he learn it by instinct like sanji and luffy


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## Jay. (Nov 28, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> Read the posts.
> 
> Zoro beats kata, Zoro tags faster foes in Kaidou.


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## Oda Report (Nov 28, 2021)

Toei Goodness.  

That version of Luffy was KO by Kaidou in base......

Zoro tags stronger version of Kaidou  with the same combat speed he entered part 2 with because Enma doesn't increase ya speed

Kata loses still, Zoro being too slow has always been a myth when it comes to combat speed.

Reactions: Like 4 | Tier Specialist 3


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## Jay. (Nov 29, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> Toei Goodness.
> 
> That version of Luffy was KO by Kaidou in base......
> 
> ...


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## Corax (Nov 29, 2021)

Not sure why it is still discussed. Kata isn't as durable as King and has no regen/healing factor. King was absolutely blitzed by Lion's song and hand to rely on regen, also he was casually tagged by huge AOE twister and had to rely on his wing's durability. Kata has neither. FS allows only to see attack in the future,actual physical stats aren't changed by FS.

Reactions: Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Kagutsutchi (Nov 29, 2021)

Who needs durability or Regen when attacks never even hit

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 1


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## Mrdude (Nov 29, 2021)

Oda Report said:


> Toei Goodness.
> 
> That version of Luffy was KO by Kaidou in base......
> 
> ...



Luffy was KOed by Thunder Bagua. Kaido's signature move and likely his most powerful attack. You tellin me Zoro has tanked that shit and managed to stay conscious?


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## ClannadFan (Nov 29, 2021)

I'm pretty late on this thread. At the time of the thread being created Katakuri would of won. Currently Zoro takes it.

I once believed the RT5(Minus Killer) were all above Katakuri, due to how the Rooftop feats made a lot of people overrate the RT5. King really woke us up. The only reason people believe that there's a big gap between Katakuri and the other YC1s is because of Luffy being one shot by Kaido. When you realize that was an outlier then you also realize that Katakuri really isnt that much weaker than the other YC1s. Also Luffy himself wasn't really YC1 lvl until he got AdvCoA. Katakuri is still the weakest YC1, but he should give the other YC1s extreme diff fights. And King proved that Zoro Pre AdvCoC, wasn't YC1 lvl yet. Calling what he did to Zoro a mid diff is putting it lightly. And on top of that he's just a bad match up for Pre AdvCoC Zoro. Zoro's strongest moves would of been an easy dodge.

I'll add that I'm not saying what Zoro did on the roof is any less impressive just because King kicked his ass. It's just that it turns out that you didn't need to be a YC1 to do what Zoro did. Think of it as hype for YC2s.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Ayy lmao (Dec 19, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> Wci luffy had superior *speed*, *endurance *and CoO than current zoro, so he* wasnt weaker*





DarkRasengan said:


> Zoro doesnt have kaidos durability and zoro doesnt have the speed to even hit katakuri


You still sure Zoro can't hit this wannabe half-fish?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 19, 2021)

Ayy lmao said:


> You still sure Zoro can't hit this wannabe half-fish?


Yes i am

Reactions: Funny 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## BenMazino01 (Dec 25, 2021)

Again stop putting this people against Katakuri.. He's the most complete YC1 so far.. Insane Haki + Awakened DF + Insanely Fast & Agile and Strong..

It's a bad matchup for Zorro to be honest..

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## truedetectiveseason2intro (Dec 25, 2021)

BenMazino01 said:


> Again stop putting this people against Katakuri.. He's the most complete YC1 so far.. Insane Haki + Awakened DF + Insanely Fast & Agile and Strong..
> 
> It's a bad matchup for Zorro to be honest..


Fresh Zoro beats the breaks off kata

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Eustathios (Dec 25, 2021)

Zoro high diff

Reactions: Like 2


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## trance (Dec 25, 2021)

zoro high diffs

Reactions: Like 1


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## Danyboy (Dec 25, 2021)

Zoro midd dif. Going to be Pica like fight, Kuri can avoid due to Future sight, but once Zoro lands 2-3 hits its over.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Yumi Zoro (Dec 25, 2021)

Zoro lower end of mid diff.


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## bil02 (Dec 25, 2021)

Zoro has some extremely fast speed attacks like Lion Song or even his new attack that seemed too fast for King to change to his speed mode.

Zoro is having trouble hitting Kata at the beggining but we know he eventually will when he uses his upper tier techniques.

If someone as weak as Wci Luffy could win against Kata,Zoro definitely does better.
High diff.


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## xmysticgohanx (Dec 25, 2021)

Katakuri got power crept. Zoro annihilates him

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Chip Skylark (Dec 25, 2021)

There’s more to a fight than how hard you can hit. Katakuri wins this one.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Canute87 (Dec 25, 2021)

Chip Skylark said:


> There’s more to a fight than how hard you can hit. Katakuri wins this one.


Zoro has pretty damn good reactions.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Chip Skylark (Dec 25, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> Zoro has pretty damn good reactions.


Katakuri doesn't? On top of FS


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## Canute87 (Dec 25, 2021)

Chip Skylark said:


> Katakuri doesn't? On top of FS



I know But Zoro can react to fast movement and actions.  Not only did he counter king at his fastest movement he was able to completely protect himself against a point blank explosion.

Just like how Katakuri had future sight  and  still couldn't hit luffy with the trident, his future sight isn't going to be  unstoppable for Zoro.

All katakuri will be seeing with his future sight is zoro blocking most if not all of his attacks.  

Zoro actually  has a much better defensive game than Luffy.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Traveling Swordsman (Dec 25, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> I know But Zoro can react to fast movement and actions.  Not only did he counter king at his fastest movement he was able to completely protect himself against a point blank explosion.
> 
> Just like how Katakuri had future sight  and  still couldn't hit luffy with the trident, his future sight isn't going to be  unstoppable for Zoro.
> 
> ...


Or King is slow af.


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## Canute87 (Dec 25, 2021)

Traveling Swordsman said:


> Or King is slow af.


You know that isn't true.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Traveling Swordsman (Dec 25, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> You know that isn't true.


It's true. G2>>>Zoro in speed and Katakuri blitzed G2. King is slow af can't hit Zoro.


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## Canute87 (Dec 25, 2021)

Traveling Swordsman said:


> It's true. G2>>>Zoro in speed and Katakuri blitzed G2. King is slow af can't hit Zoro.


 Zoro can react to G2 as well.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Traveling Swordsman (Dec 25, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> Zoro can react to G2 as well.


He never reacted to opponent as fast as G2. Bird Dance of Zoro got reacted by Hody while steroid Hody can't react to G2. G2>>>Zoro in speed.


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## Canute87 (Dec 25, 2021)

Traveling Swordsman said:


> He never reacted to opponent as fast as G2. Bird Dance of Zoro got reacted by Hody while steroid Hody can't react to G2. G2>>>Zoro in speed.



This Fishman Island business again.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Traveling Swordsman (Dec 25, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> This Fishman Island business again.


And G2 is much faster than Bird Dance proven by Hody.


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## Sherlōck (Dec 25, 2021)

Zolo ain't fast enough to tag Katakuri. 

That still remains true. Zoro fans are clinging on to Tatsumaki and screaming one shot cause they know that's the only attack that can potentially hit Kata. 

Aside from FS people forget that Katakuri's CoA was still stronger than WCI Luffy's and he had CoC as well. Not to mention awakening and the ability to hit from long distance without engaging in CQC.

All in all, I am giving the fight to Katakuri.

Reactions: Like 1 | Tier Specialist 4


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## xmysticgohanx (Dec 26, 2021)

Traveling Swordsman said:


> He never reacted to opponent as fast as G2. Bird Dance of Zoro got reacted by Hody while steroid Hody can't react to G2. G2>>>Zoro in speed.





Traveling Swordsman said:


> And G2 is much faster than Bird Dance proven by Hody.


hyouzou before steroids reacted to g2 jet pistol


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## Traveling Swordsman (Dec 26, 2021)

xmysticgohanx said:


> hyouzou before steroids reacted to g2 jet pistol


That notion was debunked when later G2 blitzed much stronger opponent steroid Hody while much weaker Hody, base Hody reacted to Zoro's attack Bird Dance.


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## xmysticgohanx (Dec 26, 2021)

Traveling Swordsman said:


> That notion was debunked when later G2 blitzed much stronger opponent steroid Hody while much weaker Hody, base Hody reacted to Zoro's attack Bird Dance.


nope , hyouzou is faster confirmed


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## Traveling Swordsman (Dec 26, 2021)

xmysticgohanx said:


> nope , hyouzou is faster confirmed


Nope Hody is faster he reacted to Bird Dance.


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## truedetectiveseason2intro (Dec 26, 2021)

Traveling Swordsman said:


> Nope Hody is faster he reacted to Bird Dance.


No hyouzou is faster

Reactions: Like 1


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## Traveling Swordsman (Dec 26, 2021)

truedetectiveseason2intro said:


> No hyouzou is faster


No steroid Hody is much faster than base Hody who is faster than base Hyouzo and base Hody reacted to Bird Dance.


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## Chip Skylark (Dec 26, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> I know But Zoro can react to fast movement and actions.  Not only did he counter king at his fastest movement he was able to completely protect himself against a point blank explosion.
> 
> Just like how Katakuri had future sight  and  still couldn't hit luffy with the trident, his future sight isn't going to be  unstoppable for Zoro.
> 
> ...


It's not like Katakuri couldn't hit Luffy at all. Even if he couldn't land a blow with his trident he was still damaging Luffy with most of his other attacks. Luffy was a punching bag for most of the fight until he developed FS himself, and even after that Kat was still competing with snake man. It's a huge stretch to assume that Katakuri wouldn't be able to land most or any of his attacks with his speed, awakening, and  FS. 

Also not sure where you're getting that Zoro has a much better defensive game than Luffy. If it's based on him defending against the point blank explosion, Luffy has been doing stuff like that since at least Punk Hazard.


*Spoiler*: __ 








Besides, it's one thing to play defense. It's another to land attacks of his own.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Canute87 (Dec 26, 2021)

Chip Skylark said:


> It's not like Katakuri couldn't hit Luffy at all. Even if he couldn't land a blow with his trident he was still damaging Luffy with most of his other attacks. Luffy was a punching bag for most of the fight until he developed FS himself, and even after that Kat was still competing with snake man. It's a huge stretch to assume that Katakuri wouldn't be able to land most or any of his attacks with his speed, awakening, and  FS.


He'll land a few on zoro but Luffy can't put up a hand a block attacks without it hurting him  Zoro's swords will completely protect him from pain. So The attacks are essentially going to be more forgiving to Zoro than Luffy.



Chip Skylark said:


> Also not sure where you're getting that Zoro has a much better defensive game than Luffy. If it's based on him defending against the point blank explosion, Luffy has been doing stuff like that since at least Punk Hazard.



It's based on how zoro fights.  anytime luffy uses the gomu his outstretched arm leaves him open.  Zoro doesn't have to leave himself open when he does attacks because all of his mid range and long range attacks leave his body. Zoro can launch a powerful attack and immediately switch to a defensive stance. His twister attacks can literally stop the pace if Katakuri tries to go in for the strike,   Katakuri not wheeling through that. 


Chip Skylark said:


> Besides, it's one thing to play defense. It's another to land attacks of his own.



Against Katakuri this is basically a chess battle.   The problem is while luffy was inferior to Katakuri in every single stat,  Zoro has a much higher attack power than Katakuri.  Katakuri cannot block any of zoro's more focused attacks and Zoro  is capable of blocking everyone of his because he managed to hold back a hakai which is leaps and bounds more powerful than anything katakuri  has in his arsenal , Zoro has  higher mobility than Boundman so there's no real opportunity  for Katakuri to outmaneuver zoro as easily as he did luffy and he doesn't have to expel anywhere near the amount of haki to do it.

I honestly thought that the awakening was going to fuck with his footing but in the latest chapter zoro owned a friend in air and he can't even fly.

Zoro will end up doing to Katakuri what Katakuri had to do to himself for luffy to win. Luffy's only hope against Katakuri was no sort of counter or strategy, luffy's method was to just keep pressure on him.
Zoro without a doubt is more equipped for a battle of chess against katakuri and eventually there will be an opening for zoro to exploit. Zoro also is a tactical fighter, he did it against pica and he did it against King, He's going to do it against Katakuri.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Chip Skylark (Dec 26, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> He'll land a few on zoro but Luffy can't put up a hand a block attacks without it hurting him  Zoro's swords will completely protect him from pain. So The attacks are essentially going to be more forgiving to Zoro than Luffy.
> 
> 
> 
> It's based on how zoro fights.  anytime luffy uses the gomu his outstretched arm leaves him open.  Zoro doesn't have to leave himself open when he does attacks because all of his mid range and long range attacks leave his body. Zoro can launch a powerful attack and immediately switch to a defensive stance. His twister attacks can literally stop the pace if Katakuri tries to go in for the strike,   Katakuri not wheeling through that.


Fair points. Though feel you're still neglecting the awakening a lot. Kat can turn any of Zoro's surroundings into mochi. He doesn't have to charge straight on to attack.


Canute87 said:


> Against Katakuri this is basically a chess battle.   The problem is while luffy was inferior to Katakuri in every single stat,  Zoro has a much higher attack power than Katakuri.  Katakuri cannot block any of zoro's more focused attacks and Zoro  is capable of blocking everyone of his because he managed to hold back a hakai which is leaps and bounds more powerful than anything katakuri  has in his arsenal , Zoro has  higher mobility than Boundman so there's no real opportunity  for Katakuri to outmaneuver zoro as easily as he did luffy and he doesn't have to expel anywhere near the amount of haki to do it.
> 
> I honestly thought that the awakening was going to fuck with his footing but in the latest chapter zoro owned a friend in air and he can't even fly.
> 
> ...


Zoro only managed to block hakai for an instant. While that is a great feat it doesn't translate well to other fights in the way that you're trying to because it was for just a moment. Which is why Zoro couldn't block a lot of King's attacks at first despite having accomplished what he did against hakai. In the same way, the hakai feat doesn't guarantee that Zoro can just block anything from Katakuri.

It's... not like Zoro outmaneuvered King in the air. They just traded attacks in the air, and Zoro's won. Don't see how that is somehow meant to be a feat for Zoro's mobility.

Katakuri maintained his FS for half a day against Luffy. Expecting him to slip up so Zoro could exploit an opening just seems hopeful rather than something that's actually likely. Besides, it's not like Zoro has time for eventualities. Enma won't allow him to prolong a fight.

Reactions: Agree 1


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