# SM Minato vs 7G Gai



## jesusus (Oct 25, 2019)

Standard Rules:

IC
Canon Intel
Located: CE stadium
Start Distance: 20 meters

Reactions: Like 1


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## Android (Oct 25, 2019)

Minato would solos both masters combined.

The fuck you think it's gonna happen when a loner 7G Gai faces Lord 4th ?

Edit: SAGE MODE Minato ? You done fucked up.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Trojan (Oct 25, 2019)

Minato trashes him


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## ZmkSc (Oct 25, 2019)

They start in these respective modes? Unless minato has a tag far enough, Gai jumps up in the air and launches a hirudora down at him. If Minato has tags far enough, then he probably outlasts unless Hirudora removed all marks he has in the battlefield  and thus his escape counted as BFR.


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## t0xeus (Oct 25, 2019)

Minato uses S/T barrier to survive Hirudora, his SM runs out because of that, and then he gets killed by the first incoming attack.. 

His SM timer is so low that one Rasengan depletes it completely, so it's not really something to fight with as he said himself..

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## Trojan (Oct 25, 2019)

t0xeus said:


> Minato uses S/T barrier to survive Hirudora,


gotta admit, I was surprised when I read this sentence at first I was like "hmm? t0xues is not getting asshurt about Minato?!"
and then I finished that line... 

you got me off-guard with that first one. Good job... U_U


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## hbcaptain (Oct 25, 2019)

Minato would win handly, JJ Mads toying with him doesn't mean he can't instanteneously kill 7G Gai faster than the eye can see. Based on all the feats and hype of both all over, the manga base Minato can already beat Gai without much struggle unless this is 8G Gai in which case the latter would stomp.
SM Minato will beat 7G Gai low diff however.


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 25, 2019)

Minato wipes Gai's youth off the map. 

Inb4 "7th gate Gai pressured Judara" arguments lol


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

Guy should win under these conditions.

Minato is screwed, MP blows kunai out of the air before they get anywhere near Guy or outside the battlefield for defensive purposes.

He wiped out a speeding tidal wave 50,000 feet in volume in one panel.

He can’t hang with him in CQC, he can’t slash with a kunai or lunge with a Rasengan faster then someone that can punch at speeds fast enough to light air on fire.

Last resort Gamabunta gets walked around by Guy or knocked the fuck out by MP shots that left Kisame incapacitated in one strike.

Minato can run but once his kunai are all incinerated he’s chased down and beat to death brutally.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 25, 2019)

7G Gai blitzes Minato and ends him with Hirudora

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## Android (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Guy should win under these conditions.
> 
> Minato is screwed, MP blows kunai out of the air before they get anywhere near Guy or outside the battlefield for defensive purposes.
> 
> ...


You saying 6G Gai beats Minato ?

Reactions: Like 1


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Minato wipes Gai's youth off the map.
> 
> Inb4 "7th gate Gai pressured Judara" arguments lol


This dude has the audacity to funny rate me while posting in the thread without an analysis.

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## ShinAkuma (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> This dude has the audacity to funny rate me while posting in the thread without an analysis.



I have more audacity where that came from. 

Didn't think an "analysis" was a requirement.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> I have more audacity where that came from.
> 
> Didn't think an "analysis" was a requirement.


Lmao you did it again.

Don’t bother, you’re not worth a debate.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Symmetry (Oct 25, 2019)

Minato solo’s Gai and kakashi lmao


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> Minato solo’s Gai and kakashi lmao


Interesting analysis.

How is it you came to the conclusion that a teleporter reliant on knife throwing without a single mid range jutsu beats a fireball throwing, Island bombing CQC specialist?

If it’s Minato’s portrayal... ooohh boy... you’re in for a debate.

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## Symmetry (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Interesting analysis.
> 
> How is it you came to the conclusion that a teleporter reliant on knife throwing without a single mid range jutsu beats a fireball throwing, Island bombing CQC specialist?
> 
> If it’s Minato’s portrayal... ooohh boy... you’re in for a debate.




Minato can teleport a jubi blast, he can do it to hirudora. In fact Gai would tore himself out trying to blast Minato with hirudora.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> Minato can teleport a jubi blast, he can do it to hirudora. In fact Gai would tore himself out trying to blast Minato with hirudora.


Ok, where is he teleporting it to?

Why does he need Hirudora?

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## Symmetry (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Ok, where is he teleporting it to?




Doesn’t really matter, could be anywhere he has ever marked, although it would be hella funny if he dropped it atop Gai and Kakashi


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> Doesn’t really matter, could be anywhere he has ever marked, although it would be hella funny if he dropped it atop Gai and Kakashi


No it can’t, he doesn’t have the chakra to teleport an island cyclone across a country.

Why does he need Hirudora?

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## ShinAkuma (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> No it can’t, he doesn’t have the chakra to teleport an island cyclone across a country.



Wait..... 

Are you saying it's more difficult to deal with hirodura than a Bijuu bomb?


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Wait.....
> 
> Are you saying it's more difficult to deal with hirodura than a Bijuu bomb?



Let’s take a look at AT size (while holding back?):



Let’s take a look at Bijuudama Size:



Now let’s consider the fact that Hirudora has island level AoE... while bijuudama only has mountain level AoE...

So Minato has to send it away even further than the bijuudama 

Wait, why does Guy need Hirudora against a knife jumping Rasengan?

Does Minato possess a Daikodan level chakra bullet? How about a 50,000 foot tidal wave?

Er... no. He’s a knife jumping Rasengan. That’s the totality of his offense, which is entirely handled by MP. 

Wait, why am I debating you?

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## Jad (Oct 25, 2019)

In these strict conditions, Gai can catch Minato.

It's like a quick draw, if Minato flicks his Kunai then his met with Hirudora. Motion vs motion. Motion [Flinging Kunai] vs. Motion [Hirudora]. If Minato opens with space barrier as he believes Gai's first move is Hirudora, Gai clips him in Taijutsu or he prematurely detonates Hirudora outside of Minato's barrier. Surely the explosion is bigger then the barrier that can be created. 

So Gai definitely has his chances in starting in 7th Gate with 20 meters.

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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

Jad said:


> In these strict conditions, Gai can catch Minato.
> 
> It's like a quick draw, if Minato flicks his Kunai then his met with Hirudora. Motion vs motion. Motion [Flinging Kunai] vs. Motion [Hirudora]. If Minato opens with space barrier as he believes Gai's first move is Hirudora, Gai clips him in Taijutsu or he prematurely detonates Hirudora outside of Minato's barrier. Surely the explosion is bigger then the barrier that can be created.
> 
> So Gai definitely has his chances in starting in 7th Gate with 20 meters.


Don’t use physics Jad, it’ll hurt their portrayal brains.

Despite the fact that Guy is a walking physics ninja.

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## ShinAkuma (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Let’s take a look at AT size (while holding back?):
> 
> 
> 
> ...



So many problems.....

How did you conclude an island is bigger than a mountain? Pretty sure they aren't static sizes and the range of size between them overlap.

Also do you think hirodura is more powerful than a Bijuu bomb?

Also if Gai's "holding back" hirodura is island size why is his all out one vs Judara so flaccid?



> So Minato has to send it away even further than the bijuudama



You wild homie.



> Wait, why does Guy need Hirudora against a knife jumping Rasengan?



He doesn't or more accurately it wouldn't matter. If Kisame can react to hirodura with his jutsu I'm sure Minato could do one thing or a dozen in the same time frame.



> Wait, why am I debating you?



It's not a debate by simply asking you to clarify your position.


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## Jad (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Don’t use physics Jad, it’ll hurt their portrayal brains.
> 
> Despite the fact that Guy is a walking physics ninja.


I'm well aware of the users who put Gai at dumpster tier level, and have actively made it their duty to call out anyone who debates for Gai by engaging them in insults.

When I debate and believe Gai wins, I'm not trying to piss anyone off, but the idea that I am makes it seem like I'm threatening them, like I'm personally attacking them - which I'm not, I genuinely believe Gai wins.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> So many problems.....
> 
> How did you conclude an island is bigger than a mountain? Pretty sure they aren't static sizes and the range of size between them overlap.
> 
> ...


Power is irrelevant, Minato isn’t warping the power of bijuudama he’s warping the physical space it’s occupying.

You think base Minato can warp 5 Gudodama and a Juubidama based on the power of the techniques? 

It’s actually quite simple. Islands harbor mountains on them, several dozen in some instances. Would you like to dissect the Hirudora panel with the island turtle in it? It’s bad for your argument.

He didn’t react, the jutsu were used simultaneously, and Guy increased the size to match the water shark.

If we’re talking actual speed you lose horribly. Not only did it out speed Daikodan, it crashed against it, had to travel all the way through it despite the high speed water resistance moving in the opposite direction, arrived at Kisame’s face, detonated, and vaporized the entire tidal wave before it even approached Guy’s position.

This is why a walking god (Edo Madara) got his shit pushed in.

Again, Guy doesn’t even need it. Minato poses no threat to him with his knife-reliant teleportation. Every knife gets 10 fireballs, end of Minato’s FTG - end of Minato.

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## ShinAkuma (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Power is irrelevant, Minato isn’t warping the power of bijuudama he’s warping the physical space it’s occupying.



Nice dodge however the question remains - do you believe hirodura to be more powerful than a Bijuu bomb?

Also when we say warp aren't we simply referring to Minato opening a door and letting the technique walk through?



> You think base Minato can warp 5 Gudodama and a Juubidama based on the power of the techniques?



I don't think anything yet I'm simply attempting to get a clear view of your position.



> It’s actually quite simple. Islands harbor mountains on them,



Well some islands do and some are tiny, which is the point. The range of island sizes is immense.




> Would you like to dissect the Hirudora panel with the island turtle in it? It’s bad for your argument.



I haven't made an argument yet?

Also if you want to dissect the size of the island in question and provide a size please go ahead.



> He didn’t react, the jutsu were used simultaneously, and Guy increased the size to match the water shark.



That's possible. I will review the chapter later.



> If we’re talking actual speed you lose horribly.



I didn't realize there was anything to win.

You seem a little triggered.




> Not only did it out speed Daikodan, it crashed against it, had to travel all the way through it despite the high speed water residence, arrived at Kisame’s face, detonated, and vaporized the entire tidal wave before it even approached Guy’s position.



I was never concerned with the travel speed of the technique as it's not relevant to the discussion.

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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Nice dodge however the question remains - do you believe hirodura to be more powerful than a Bijuu bomb?
> 
> Also when we say warp aren't we simply referring to Minato opening a door and letting the technique walk through?
> 
> ...


No, we’re actually not. It’s not a two way portal, it’s a gateway into a dimension that instantly moves the space to the intended marker in the original dimension.

The power isn’t relevant, it’s a space-time technique that moved a Juubidama kilometers upon kilometers away... do you think Base Minato moved the power of this technique, or just the space it’s occupying?


Ok...

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## ShinAkuma (Oct 25, 2019)

Who woulda thunk a yes/no question would be so hard to get an answer for.

I LOVE THE NBD WOOOOOOOOO



DaVizWiz said:


> No, we’re actually not. It’s not a two way portal, it’s a gateway into a dimension that instantly moves the space to the intended marker in the original dimension.



Sure?

Not really any different than what I was getting at.



> The power isn’t relevant, it’s a space-time technique that moved a Juubidama kilometers upon kilometers away.



I never said power was relevant. Not sure why you keep non sequituring your way through this discussion.

Do you think hirodura is more powerful than the Bijuu bomb?

It's a yes/no question. Why are you having such difficulty with this?



> .. do you think Base Minato moved the power of this technique, or just the space it’s occupying?
> 
> 
> Ok...



He simply teleports the physical technique.

Anyway this angle you're attempting to wrangle has nothing to do with my question. Instead of dreaming up wacky strawmans to argue against just answer the question.

Don't be scared.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Who woulda thunk a yes/no question would be so hard to get an answer for.
> 
> I LOVE THE NBD WOOOOOOOOO
> 
> ...


The power of the technique has no relevance to moving it from one spot to another.

What the fuck are you bringing up the power of the technique for?

All Minato has to do is move it from its position to another.

This is exactly what he did with Jubito who is hundreds of times more powerful than a bijuudama.

If and when the power of Hirudora or Bijuudama becomes relevant in this discussion, you will get an answer to your derp question.

I don’t answer irrelevant questions. Be relevant. It’s not difficult.

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## ShinAkuma (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> The power of the technique has no relevance to moving it from one spot to another.



Yeah sure.

Why can't you answer the question?



> What the fuck are you bringing up the power of the technique for?



I'm attempting to gain a clear view of what you think.

So for the 354466 time - Do you consider hirodura to be more powerful than the Bijuu bomb.

It's yes OR no. Pick one.



> All Minato has to do is move it from its position to another.



Non sequitur thy name is DaVizWiz.



> This is exactly what he did with Jubito who is hundreds of times more powerful than a bijuudama.



Literally irrelevant.




> If and when the power of Hirudora or Bijuudama becomes relevant in this discussion you will get an answer to your derp question.



Why are you so afraid to answer the question......


...... Holy shit you think hirodura is more powerful than the Bijuu bomb!?


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## LostSelf (Oct 25, 2019)

When Kakashi is not even in the thread, but still somehow finds his way to the thread. I would not even be surprised if I found him walking on my way to work. 

Anyway, Minato wins. I expected this to be a Taijutsu fight or something when I saw the thread. Unrestricted Minato is not going to lose this.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Yeah sure.
> 
> Why can't you answer the question?
> 
> ...




Nothing relevant here. 

I’ve spent hours debating you in two different threads, and so far you’ve come up with: 

“Gaara was impressed because he never saw it, but we did” 

“Is Hirudora more powerful than Bijuudama?” 

This is what your analysis of feats and matchups boil down to, huh?! 

Fascinating


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## ~Kakashi~ (Oct 25, 2019)

Minato is able to physically react to v2 A quick enough that he can get out of the way, and mentally react to 8G Gai quick enough that he can teleport in and out of the way without getting hit.

Dealing with hirudora and outlasting Gai's 7th gate shouldn't be that big of a deal.

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## ShinAkuma (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Nothing relevant here.
> 
> I’ve spent hours debating you in two different threads, and so far you’ve come up with:
> 
> “Gaara was impressed because he never saw it, but we did”



Still butthurt about that huh?

So you never answer simple questions and you get butthurt easily.

You should invert those traits. You should easily answer simple questions and never get butthurt.



> “Is Hirudora more powerful than Bijuudama?”



Still dodging huh?

I've seen virgins dodge the question "are you still a virgin" less than you've dodged this.

Wild.



> This is what your analysis of feats and matchups boil down to, huh?!



I haven't offered an analysis as we can't get past 1 simple question.

However you have no problem getting butthurt, stawmanning, non sequituring, triggering and dodging your way through this entire discussion.

For an NBD veteran I thought you would be made of sterner stuff.

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## Crimson Flam3s (Oct 25, 2019)

While ignoring the fact that his SM runs out after one attack and he self proclaimed that it sucks.

Minato tries the same shit he tried against Madara and gets his teeth punched down into his throat

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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Still butthurt about that huh?
> 
> So you never answer simple questions and you get butthurt easily.
> 
> ...


There’s nothing wrong with being stern in a debate.

I use to use terms like “butthurt” when I was a teenager.

“Triggered” is definitely a newer one, always thought it was stupid.

If you think I’ve been offended in some way,  you haven’t read much of my material.

Go back to my posts in ‘12 and see what happened when I got offended.

I haven’t been offended by anyone on here for years, sans a recent mod 

I had someone call me the dumbest poster on NF a week ago IIRC... everyone is a warrior behind a keyboard.

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## blk (Oct 25, 2019)

Base Minato can react to, and dodge with FTG, V2 A4, who is by feats much faster than 7G Gai.

SM could augment base Naruto's reflexes to the point he was able to pin point a precise counter attack on A3's elbow.

Imagine what kind of reflexes would have SM Minato? Yeah, 7G Gai isn't anywhere near enough to blitz base Minato, much less SM Minato.

SM Minato can arguably escape from him with his Shunshin. Base Minato too maybe.

Regardless, he dodges everything Gai throws at him (whether with FTG or physical speed) and waits the end of the Gate's effect, then proceeds to murder Gai.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

blk said:


> Base Minato can react to, and dodge with FTG, V2 A4, who is by feats much faster than 7G Gai.
> 
> SM could augment base Naruto's reflexes to the point he was able to pin point a precise counter attack on A3's elbow.
> 
> ...


Thoughts on the tsunami vaporizing MP destroying Minato’s 30 tagged kunai?

Thoughts on Guy outrunning truthseekers that Minato fell on his ass trying to counter with shunshin?


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## ~Kakashi~ (Oct 25, 2019)

Crimson Flam3s said:


> While ignoring the fact that his SM runs out after one attack and he self proclaimed that it sucks.
> 
> Minato tries the same shit he tried against Madara and gets his teeth punched down into his throat



It doesn't really matter how much his SM does or does not suck. If he runs out of it he's in base where he still has the reactions necessary to deal with Gai.

I'm not even sure why this thread starts him in SM tbh, but it gives him a temporary boost I guess.


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## blk (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Thoughts on the tsunami vaporizing MP destroying Minato’s 30 tagged kunai?
> 
> Thoughts on Guy outrunning truthseekers that Minato fell on his ass trying to counter with shunshin?



How does Gai target all the Kunais if they are spread over? 

Several would be in their vicinity too, so what does Gai do? Throw Hirudora at himself?

Minato can put tags anywhere he touches too anyway, so he can supplement by tagging the terrain if needed.

I don't remember 7G Gai outrunning truth seekers, nor Minato failing to counter them. I suppose you might be misinterpreting some feats.

It's not like truth seekers are the pinnacle of speed either.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

blk said:


> How does Gai target all the Kunais if they are spread over?
> 
> Several would be in their vicinity too, so what does Gai do? Throw Hirudora at himself?
> 
> ...


By punching 1,000 Great White sized fireballs when he sees them being thrown?

Ok? Guy obliterated a tsunami in a panel, Minato tagging trees and dirt isn’t really going to help him.

You need to read the manga again then. Guy moved Kakashi away from a speeding truthseeker in his face, Minato fell on his ass when this truthseeker was fired initially.


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## blk (Oct 25, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> By punching 1,000 Great White sized fireballs when he sees them being thrown?
> 
> Ok? Guy obliterated a tsunami in a panel, Minato tagging trees and dirt isn’t really going to help him.
> 
> You need to read the manga again then. Guy moved Kakashi away from a speeding truthseeker in his face, Minato fell on his ass when this truthseeker was fired initially.



Well you have a point with that.

Still Minato simply needs to place tags around, Gai can't keep throwing flame punches forever and can't use Hirudora in his vicinity (or he will get caught by the AoE). And i think Minato should be able to dodge for some time with his Shunshin, while touching the ground, or trees or whatever to put tags around.

Might not be an easy win for Minato perhaps, but the Gates do not last that long.

In the instance you are citing, Minato had no arms and was weakened overall, that's not indicative of what his performance would be as fresh and with all the limbs.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 25, 2019)

blk said:


> Well you have a point with that.
> 
> Still Minato simply needs to place tags around, Gai can't keep throwing flame punches forever and can't use Hirudora in his vicinity (or he will get caught by the AoE). And i think Minato should be able to dodge for some time with his Shunshin, while touching the ground, or trees or whatever to put tags around.
> 
> ...


He can’t outrun Gai and his ability to tag objects isn’t going to circumvent Guy’s MP range or AoE.

Why does he run instead of attempting a CQC exchange?

Prove his shunshin is superior to truthseeker speed and we’ll have a debate.

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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

People Hirudora is a taijutsu move not a physical object you cant teleport it


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## ThirdRidoku (Oct 26, 2019)

These stipulations are biased in favour of the same 7th Gate Gai who  tagged Juubidara twice with a punch and a kick before launching hirudora and outsped Madara's vertical staff strike, while SM Minato got humiliated, bltiz'd like 3  times, and kicked away like fodder.

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## Architect (Oct 26, 2019)

Gai blitzes.


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## J★J♥ (Oct 26, 2019)

Minato gets his head torn off.


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## Trojan (Oct 26, 2019)

Crimson Flam3s said:


> While ignoring the fact that his SM runs out after one attack and he self proclaimed that it sucks.
> 
> Minato tries the same shit he tried against Madara and gets his teeth punched down into his throat


you forgot to add this page

*Link Removed* 


but I got your back


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## Jad (Oct 26, 2019)

Hussain said:


> you forgot to add this page
> 
> *Link Removed*
> 
> ...


Madara can counter Minato's FTG attack and slice his arm off before Minato can teleport (escape), but Madara can't do the same to Gai in 7th or 8th Gate, but Minato is still faster than 8th Gate Gai. So Minato could have always escaped Madara's attack but chose not too?

The logic hurts my head.


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## Trojan (Oct 26, 2019)

Jad said:


> Madara can counter Minato's FTG attack and slice his arm off before Minato can teleport (escape), but Madara can't do the same to Gai in 7th or 8th Gate, but Minato is still faster than 8th Gate Gai. So Minato could have always escaped Madara's attack but chose not too?
> 
> The logic hurts my head.


simply, Minato never tried to teleport and escape in the first place. 

nor did he try to counterattack Gai either.


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## J★J♥ (Oct 26, 2019)

Jad said:


> Madara can counter Minato's FTG attack and slice his arm off before Minato can teleport (escape), but Madara can't do the same to Gai in 7th or 8th Gate, but Minato is still faster than 8th Gate Gai. So Minato could have always escaped Madara's attack but chose not too?
> 
> The logic hurts my head.


This. Minato with support failed to do what Guy did in exactly same situation and on top of that he managed to Razengan Kakashi.
Edit: Guy also fought much older, more experienced and upgraded in every way Obito in base, while Minato struggled with that same character while he was a child.


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## Kai (Oct 26, 2019)

Guy’s Taijutsu is simply better than Minato’s Senjutsu when it comes to fighting Ten Tails Jinchuriki. Minato admittedly sucks at Senjutsu.


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## Hazuki (Oct 26, 2019)

Jad said:


> Madara can counter Minato's FTG attack and slice his arm off before Minato can teleport (escape), but Madara can't do the same to Gai in 7th or 8th Gate, but Minato is still faster than 8th Gate Gai. So Minato could have always escaped Madara's attack but chose not too?
> 
> The logic hurts my head.



it was said in the manga that only senjutsu and taijutsu work on juubi madara
it's not about speed or teleportation or anything , only senjutsu and taijutsu is usefull against a juubi host
that's why gai with gates was abble to give him some trouble , that's why a ramdom frog senjutsu was abble to be useful on juubito
that why a naruto sm was abble to hit juubito ( thanks to tobirama reactivity and space time jutsu team work )

minato can't be usefull because his sennin mod is not good at all
at that specific moment only gai with taijutsu could fight madara
no matter if you are much stronger then gai 7th gate , if you don't have senjutsu or taijutsu , you are useless

also minato is not faster then 8th gate , it s teleportation it's not speed and when he was in front of madara , he focus only on his senjutsu skill but that was terrible as he expected
his teleportation or any ninjutsu are totally useless against madara who is weak only against senjutsu and taijutsu extrem skill
extrem taijutsu skill and senjutsu are bad match for any juubi host

you see ? now it's logic .

*juubi host are vulnerable against taijutsu and senjutsu 
gai is the strongest taijutsu user of all time , of course he is bad match for madara 
it's not because his 7th gates is super strong ( of course it's strong ) but it's more because taijutsu is one of juubi host weak point 
*
everyone who disagree with that logic should just stop reading the manga
it was confirmed IN THE MANGA
( and those who like to dislike my post just for the lol should just stop reading the manga
what is the interest to ignore manga fact that are so obvious ? )

-snip-


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## J★J♥ (Oct 26, 2019)

Hazuki said:


> it was said in the manga that only senjutsu and taijutsu work on juubi madara
> it's not about speed or teleportation or anything , only senjutsu and taijutsu is usefull against a juubi host
> that's why gai with gates was abble to give him some trouble , that's why a ramdom frog senjutsu was abble to be useful on juubito
> that why a naruto sm was abble to hit juubito ( thanks to tobirama reactivity and space time jutsu team work )
> ...


Minatos sage mod while not perfect is above Jirayas because it had less mutation. So yes minato was boosted and still got wrecked.


----------



## Hazuki (Oct 26, 2019)

J★J♥ said:


> Minatos sage mod while not perfect is above Jirayas because it had less mutation. So yes minato was boosted and still got wrecked.



minato when naruto use sennin mod "  naruto , you mastered sennin mod like jiraiya "

minato when he was in front of madara and talk to kakashi " my senjutsu sennin mod is not good at all "

minato sennin mod is not like jiraiya sennin mod
you are the first one in this forum who believe that minato horrible sennin mod is above jiraiya ^^

-snip-


----------



## blk (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> He can’t outrun Gai and his ability to tag objects isn’t going to circumvent Guy’s MP range or AoE.
> 
> Why does he run instead of attempting a CQC exchange?
> 
> Prove his shunshin is superior to truthseeker speed and we’ll have a debate.



Yes he can because Minato's Kunai won't be destroyed instantly, and thus he will have time to zip around and tag places. 
Moreover you just assume that Gai instantly knows where every Kunai has fallen and every tag has been placed, but why would he? And why would he waste his very limited 7G time looking for them? Can he even afford to do so?

Minato runs because he knows the threat, and time limit weakness, of the Gates.

He traveled Konoha with his Shunshin before Kurama charged his TBB. Pretty good feat if you ask me.
The truth seeking balls tho have no notable one.


----------



## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

blk said:


> Yes he can because Minato's Kunai won't be destroyed instantly, and thus he will have time to zip around and tag places.
> Moreover you just assume that Gai instantly knows where every Kunai has fallen and every tag has been placed, but why would he? And why would he waste his very limited 7G time looking for them? Can he even afford to do so?
> 
> Minato runs because he knows the threat, and time limit weakness, of the Gates.
> ...


Bro he can release a Tsunami fire wave.



Do you see this wave? This was matched by an explosive napalm-like fire wave.



Which vaporized it. There isn’t 1,000 sharks in that caption, the wave in totality is 50,000 feet in volume, it couldn’t fit in the actual panel.

The implication that Minato’s 30 knives can escape MP’s AoE is utter nonsense. It vaporized 1,000 Great White Sharks in one panel.

When he starts throwing knives, Guy punches, the knives are vaporized before they even reach their intended location.


Base Hashirama traversed a mountain range in one panel running from ISO Kurama. 



Do you think Base Hashirama is faster than 7G Guy?


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## Kai (Oct 26, 2019)

J★J♥ said:


> Minatos sage mod while not perfect is above Jirayas because it had less mutation. So yes minato was boosted and still got wrecked.


Only two things work against Ten Tails Jinchuriki and that is Senjutsu and Taijutsu. Guy’s Taijutsu is way better than Minato or Jiraiya’s Senjutsu and that’s all it comes down to. General comparison would be an invalid comparison here considering all but two things are negated.


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## t0xeus (Oct 26, 2019)

Damn @DaVizWiz just ended @ShinAkuma 's career 

The earlier you accept it, the sooner you can recover Shin. I got your back till then


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

t0xeus said:


> Damn @DaVizWiz just ended @ShinAkuma 's career
> 
> The earlier you accept it, the sooner you can recover Shin. I got your back till then



Can't get a yes/no answer


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## J★J♥ (Oct 26, 2019)

Kai said:


> Only two things work against Ten Tails Jinchuriki and that is Senjutsu and Taijutsu. Guy’s Taijutsu is way better than Minato or Jiraiya’s Senjutsu and that’s all it comes down to. General comparison would be an invalid comparison here considering all but two things are negated.


Bullshit. Minatos TFG is not offensive move and Senjutsu boosted Ninjutsu works just fine. that's why minato was attacking with senjutsu boosted *Razengan*. Once he entered sage mod all of his techniques were effective if he somehow managed to land one. The thing is that he was infinitely slower than Madara *OR* Gai. You are being purposely dishonest and are either lying to your own self or just plain trolling.


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## t0xeus (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Can't get a yes/no answer


Your question was not relevant to the discussion though


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

t0xeus said:


> Your question was not relevant to the discussion though



It would be once he submitted his answer.

Why do you think he refused to answer...?


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## Ejenku (Oct 26, 2019)

7gates Gai puts up a good fight if he has knowledge on Hirashin as i see him in similar speed as v4 with better aoe but less stamina. I favor Minato does the samething he did to a4 but Gai is better in cqc. So he could dodge Minatos strike possibly. In a knowledge situation.


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## t0xeus (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> It would be once he submitted his answer.
> 
> Why do you think he refused to answer...?


So what if he said no?


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

t0xeus said:


> So what if he said no?



Yes, what if...?


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## Cichy (Oct 26, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> People Hirudora is a taijutsu move not a physical object you cant teleport it


It's just an air pressure in the shape of a tiger. Don't see a reason why Minato wouldn't be able to teleport air.


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## t0xeus (Oct 26, 2019)

Cichy said:


> It's just an air pressure in the shape of a tiger. Don't see a reason why Minato wouldn't be able to teleport air.


So you think Minato creates vacuum with his S/T barrier? He warps away the air as well?


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## Symmetry (Oct 26, 2019)

Daily reminder that at no point was Gai ever a hokage candidate and he always had the seventh gate

Reactions: Like 1


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## Symmetry (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> No it can’t, he doesn’t have the chakra to teleport an island cyclone across a country.
> 
> Why does he need Hirudora?




Btw the island level thing is the EXPLOSION, the tiger itself is not that big, it gets teleported


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## Cichy (Oct 26, 2019)

t0xeus said:


> So you think Minato creates vacuum with his S/T barrier? He warps away the air as well?


If he wants to, he probably can. Gas is also a form of matter.


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Cichy said:


> It's just an air pressure in the shape of a tiger. Don't see a reason why Minato wouldn't be able to teleport air.


Lol teleporting air pressure


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> Daily reminder that at no point was Gai ever a hokage candidate and he always had the seventh gate


Doesn't have to be a Hokage candidate he was packing heat we all know that. That's like saying Sasuke wasn't a candidate for Hokage, sis, we been knew. This info ain't going to change the fact he stomps

Reactions: Like 2


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## Cichy (Oct 26, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> Lol teleporting air pressure


Brilliant argument. 
You deserve a praise for such outstanding quality of disscussion.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Cichy said:


> Brilliant argument.
> You deserve a praise for such outstanding quality of disscussion.


Thanks. Only real bitches keep up with  me can't waste time on bum bitches


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## J★J♥ (Oct 26, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> Daily reminder that at no point was Gai ever a hokage candidate and he always had the seventh gate


WTF has it to do with anything ?


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

Is Gai now a wanked character?

Reactions: Like 1


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## Symmetry (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> Is Gai now a wanked character?




Yes


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> Is Gai now a wanked character?


Coming from a dude who implied Jiraiya one panels Samehada Fused Kisame in an ocean with Lion’s Mane and a chakra suppression tag - this is comical.

Juicy G dupe, and it isn’t the first one you’ve made.


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> Is Gai now a wanked character?



He's always been wanked to some degree.

He's also universally loved so peeps don't normally bother to contest the wank because who wants to debate against Gai, he's awesome!

For my boy @DaVizWiz 

Yea but, like the whole Naruto roster is wanked soo..!


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> He's always been wanked to some degree.
> 
> He's also universally loved so peeps don't normally bother to contest the wank because who wants to debate against Gai, he's awesome!


Most have him at mid kage tier or below in the 8 years I’ve been here. 

There are some who consider him Jounin level. 

So this is simply wrong.


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> Is Gai now a wanked character?


Are you now a hypocrite?


Orochimaru op said:


> Yes


No


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## Symmetry (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Most have him at mid kage tier or below in the 8 years I’ve been here.
> 
> There are some who consider him Jounin level.
> 
> So this is simply wrong.




There’s no way anyone thinks he isn’t kage level


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> There’s no way anyone thinks he isn’t kage level


The oldest active regular in this section has him at Top Jounin.


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## Symmetry (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> The oldest active regular in this section has him at Top Jounin.




We don’t speak about that


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Most have him at mid kage tier or below in the 8 years I’ve been here.
> 
> There are some who consider him Jounin level.



Downplay always exist even with wanked characters. Also all characters are wanked to some degree however the wank is usually challenged. I've seen Hidan get wanked FFS, Gai is no different.



> So this is simply wrong.



Nope.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> We don’t speak about that


Turrins been here awhile. 

So yes, we’re going to tak about it.


ShinAkuma said:


> Downplay always exist even with wanked characters. Also all characters are wanked to some degree however the wank is usually challenged. I've seen Hidan get wanked FFS, Gai is no different.
> 
> 
> 
> Nope.


We can run a poll.

If Guy is rated higher than mid tier on average I’ll concede he’s overrated.


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> He's always been wanked to some degree.
> 
> He's also universally loved so peeps don't normally bother to contest the wank because who wants to debate against Gai, he's awesome!



I agree

Reactions: Like 1


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## J★J♥ (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Turrins been here awhile.
> 
> So yes, we’re going to tak about it.
> 
> ...


What is mid tier and are we talking about base guy or overall ?


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> We can run a poll.
> 
> If Guy is rated higher than mid tier on average I’ll concede he’s overrated.



Don't matter to me homie I'm just saying what I have seen. I also never said he was *overrated*.

Don't conflate the overall consensus with being wanked or not however. I didn't say the majority wanked him, simply that there are always posters who exist to wank a character.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Don't matter to me homie I'm just saying what I have seen. I also never said he was *overrated*.
> 
> Don't conflate the overall consensus with being wanked or not however. I didn't say the majority wanked him, simply that there are always posters who exist to wank a character.


Wank implies he’s overrated.

Ok so he’s not wanked. He’s favored by a couple posters in a section as are most characters in this section since I’ve started posting here.

Every character has a fandom. Considering your repeated distaste for Guy’s small fandom you would’ve had a stroke reading through Itachi’s horde fandom posts 5 years ago.


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Wank implies he’s overrated.



No, it means wank. Overrated means overrated.

Wank by a large group can mean overrated, however a small group can wank a character and his rating can still be accurate.



> Ok so he’s not wanked. He’s favored by a couple posters in a section as are most characters in this section since I’ve started posting here.



Legit saying he's not wanked except he's wanked by a few posters lol

You do you man.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> No, it means wank. Overrated means overrated.
> 
> Wank by a large group can mean overrated, however a small group can wank a character and his rating can still be accurate.
> 
> ...


Everyone is wanked by your definition.

Off of the top of my head:

Sasori, Jiraiya, Tsunade, Sakura, Kakashi, Orochimaru, Hiruzen, Hanzo, Itachi, Sasuke and Minato are all wanked in this section according to your definition.


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

If Gai wins here. He also beats all of your favs damn near. Implications of God tier feats apply elsewhere as well. So let's remember that

Reactions: Like 1


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Everyone is wanked by your definition.



I know.....I literally said that in a post you quoted....



ShinAkuma said:


> Downplay always exist even with wanked characters. Also all characters are wanked to some degree however the wank is usually challenged. I've seen Hidan get wanked FFS, Gai is no different.



Are you ok?


----------



## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> If Gai wins here. He also beats all of your favs damn near. Implications of God tier feats apply elsewhere as well. So let's remember that


This isn’t a portrayal discussion, it’s a combat simulation.

Minato’s entire offense is contingent upon knife throwing and melee CQC, which doesn’t work against Morning Peacock. 

Portrayal doesn’t circumvent physics or logic, even Edo Madara found that out.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> I know.....I literally said that in a post you quoted....
> 
> 
> 
> Are you ok?


So you’ve come back in here to state the obvious?

Why not add in that there’s air on earth, and the sun is hot?

Good job bud. Have a cookie.

Maybe you can teach us the ABCs next.


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> So you’ve come back in here to state the obvious?



Not my problem the obvious wasn't obvious to you even though you *literally quoted me*.



> Why not add in that there’s air on earth, and the sun is hot?
> 
> Good job bud. Have a cookie.



Wack AF


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Not my problem the obvious wasn't obvious to you even though you *literally quoted me*.
> 
> 
> 
> Wack AF


Thanks for the input. You did a great job. 

Now sit quietly over there with the rest of the children who also have nothing relevant  to add.


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> This isn’t a portrayal discussion, it’s a combat simulation.
> 
> Minato’s entire offense is contingent upon knife throwing and melee CQC, which doesn’t work against Morning Peacock.
> 
> Portrayal doesn’t circumvent physics or logic, even Edo Madara found that out.



You are acting like Gai just simply opens up with this attack. Before getting blitzed killed by an instant transmission attack enhanced by SM amp on reflex which is stupid


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> You are acting like Gai just simply opens up with this attack. Before getting blitzed killed by an instant transmission attack enhanced by SM amp on reflex which is stupid


Guy is in the 7th Gate, you think Minato can blitz him with knife throwing before he can punch?


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Guy is in the 7th Gate, you think Minato can blitz him with knife throwing before he can punch?



Lol why are you downplaying FTG?


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> Lol why are you downplaying FTG?


I’m not.

FTG is reliant on knives that are thrown.

That’s not downplay it’s the actual technique.

I’ve supported Minato’s speed on these forums more than anyone. He can’t win here, Guy punches too fast.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> You are acting like Gai just simply opens up with this attack. Before getting blitzed killed by an instant transmission attack enhanced by SM amp on reflex which is stupid


Considering base Gai kept up with Obito. Go and sit on the potty.


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Thanks for the input. You did a great job.



You quoted me. Not my problem you can't read for shit.



> Now sit quietly over there with the rest of the children who also have nothing relevant  to add.



After you Mr. Irrelevant.


----------



## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> I’m not.
> 
> FTG is reliant on knives that are thrown.
> 
> ...



FTG is broken. And it's been shown to overcome Obito's Kamui without Intel and avoid V2 A4 in conjunction with Killer Bee in BASE let alone Sage Mode. 

Minato stomps and this thread is being played out


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> Considering base Gai kept up with Obito. Go and sit on the potty.



Who are you?


----------



## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> FTG is broken. And it's been shown to overcome Obito's Kamui without Intel and avoid V2 A4 in conjunction with Killer Bee in BASE let alone Sage Mode.
> 
> Minato stomps and this thread is being played out


Ok, so how does FTG tags on 30 iron knives overcome 1,000 Morning Peacock fireballs shot over a 50,000 foot range?

Minato runs for majority of the battle or he attempts a last resort CQC exchange and gets clobbered by MP strikes.


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> Who are you?


Oh, me?Im your living nightmare


----------



## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Ok, so how does FTG tags on 30 iron knives overcome 1,000 Morning Peacock fireballs shot over a 50,000 foot range?
> 
> Minato runs for majority of the battle or he attempts a last resort CQC exchange and gets clobbered by MP strikes.



First of all LoL 

Go to the databook and check the distance of that attack from Gai. It's considered close to mid range at best

Try again


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> Oh, me?Im your living nightmare



Lol highly doubt it


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## Symmetry (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Ok, so how does FTG tags on 30 iron knives overcome 1,000 Morning Peacock fireballs shot over a 50,000 foot range?
> 
> Minato runs for majority of the battle or he attempts a last resort CQC exchange and gets clobbered by MP strikes.




Minato sends that shit right back at him with FTG barrier


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> You quoted me. Not my problem you can't read for shit.
> 
> 
> 
> After you Mr. Irrelevant.


I told you to sit quietly.




Orochimaru op said:


> Minato sends that shit right back at him with FTG barrier


Minato sets up an FTG barrier to save his knives in mid flight from Morning Peacock punches? 

Interesting take.


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## J★J♥ (Oct 26, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> Minato sends that shit right back at him with FTG barrier


Minato who was blitzed left and right by JJs is now reacting and redirecting 7th gate guy ?


----------



## ThirdRidoku (Oct 26, 2019)

Hussain said:


> nor did he try to counterattack Gai either .



You're being  dishonest Hussain 



Madara *objectively tried to cut Gai in half,* vertically and straight down the middle, but Gai launched hirudora before he could.

And as @Crimson Flam3s  showcased, Minato got shit diff'd by the same attack from essentially the same distance:


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> Minato sends that shit right back at him with FTG barrier


Cookie, I got the tissues. I knew this might be hard for you to handle. But that's not going to happen. 7G Gai is faster


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> I told you to sit quietly.



Unless you are telling me how to dodge a question or read like a partial illiterate I don't think your have any authority otherwise.


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## Symmetry (Oct 26, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> Cookie, I got the tissues. I knew this might be hard for you to handle. But that's not going to happen. 7G Gai is faster




Girl you need to chill, hirudora nor asakujakiu is going to hit Minato, hes teleporting it right back

you do know the raikage was the fastest ninja alive when Gai had the seventh gate, right?


----------



## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Unless you are telling me how to dodge a question or read like a partial illiterate I don't think your have any authority otherwise.


Well people are debating here, most aren’t trying to be keyboard warriors.

You’ve got some gargantuan electronic balls there Shin. Are you satisfied? 

Are you going to continue to be a keyboard warrior or are you actually interested in the thread?

If you’re not interested, please get out. No one here wants to deal with another keyboard warrior on an anime forum.


----------



## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> Girl you need to chill, hirudora nor asakujakiu is going to hit Minato, hes teleporting it right back
> 
> you do know the raikage was the fastest ninja alive when Gai had the seventh gate, right?


Nope. Gai was the fastest. The raikage is fast but was getting bodied by Madara and almost Sasuke. Gai pressed Madara alone and he would've stomped MS Sasuke

Reactions: Like 2


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## Symmetry (Oct 26, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> Nope. Gai was the fastest. The raikage is fast but was getting bodied by Madara and almost Sasuke. Gai pressed Madara alone and he would've stomped MS Sasuke




There’s a reason why the raikage was considered the fastest and not Gai.


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> There’s a reason why the raikage was considered the fastest and not Gai.


Not even going to with you


----------



## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> No you just bark out orders and offer cookies.
> 
> I guess that's so much better.


It is, since you’ve re-entered this thread to throw shade on an entire fandom in this section over a point you consider obvious.

You can’t stand that people disagree with you, so you call it wanking.

Don’t like when someone calls you a child for acting like one? Too bad.

It won’t be the last time you call someone illiterate or mentally ill. That’s what trolls do.


----------



## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> It is, since you’ve re-entered this thread to throw shade on an entire fandom in this section over a point you consider obvious.



Technically I threw shade on all fandoms. That would include myself.

I'm equal opportunity that way.



> You can’t stand that people disagree with you, so you call it wanking.



Irony....?



> Don’t like when someone calls you a child for acting like one? Too bad.



I didn't express any likes or dislikes Professor X.



> It won’t be the last time you call someone illiterate or mentally ill. That’s what trolls do.



Won't be the last time you bark out orders or call people children. That's what trolls do.


----------



## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Peeps bag on me and end this


----------



## Midknight Crow (Oct 26, 2019)

Is this Naruto reddit? You guys are just echoing each other.


----------



## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Technically I threw shade on all fandoms. That would include myself.
> 
> I'm equal opportunity that way.
> 
> ...


No, you came back in with the intention to slight Guy’s fandom.

I don’t see a denial on the horizon.

Ok, yea you don’t dislike Guy’s fandom;



“Most wanked feat?” “Did nothing?” Wow.

This is where the Guy hate reared it’s ugly head for you, troll.

I guess Sakura bumrushing Madara before the transmigrants and being called “faster than Naruto” by several posters here as a result is no longer the most wanked feat.

Thank you keyboard warrior.


----------



## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> No, you came back in with the intention to slight Guy’s fandom.



The thread is about Gai so naturally that would be the focus, however I specifically pointed out this kind of view is not unique to Gai. In fact it happens with (virtually) all popular characters.



> I don’t see a denial on the horizon.
> 
> Ok, yea you don’t dislike Guy’s fandom;
> 
> ...



Is this a reading thing again?


----------



## Symmetry (Oct 26, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> Not even going to with you




I suppose that’s for the best, I enjoy talking about canon, but you do you


----------



## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> The thread is about Gai so naturally that would be the focus, however I specifically pointed out this kind of view is not unique to Gai. In fact it happens with (virtually) all popular characters.
> 
> 
> 
> Is this a reading thing again?


No you didn’t, I probed and you backtracked.

Next time why don’t you add in:

“Yea but, like the whole Naruto roster is wanked soo...” in your original slight post.


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> No you didn’t, I probed and you backtracked.



lol sure



> Next time why don’t you add in
> 
> “Yea but, like the whole Naruto roster is wanked soo...”



If that provision assists in making things more clear for you I will GET IT DONE.

Reactions: Like 1


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> lol sure
> 
> 
> 
> If that provision assists in making things more clear for you I will GET IT DONE.


Good.

Now go into every *Itachi, Kakashi, Jiraiya, Minato, Tsunade, Orochimaru, Sasori, Kisame, Hiruzen, Hanzo and Sasuke* thread on this board and call the characters wanked.

I mean, you agreed right? It’s only fair.

“If that provision assists in making things more clear for you* I will GET IT DONE.*”


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Good.
> 
> Now go into every *Itachi, Kakashi, Jiraiya, Minato, Tsunade, Orochimaru, Sasori, Kisame and Sasuke* thread on this board and call the characters wanked.
> 
> ...



Sorry that wasn't part of the original deal, but I agree that all characters are wanked.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Sorry that wasn't part of the original deal, but I agree that all characters are wanked.


Well no, it was.

I’ve posted in all of them, so I need to be educated on each character being wanked in each thread.

You agreed! Don’t backtrack, trolls don’t backtrack, keyboard warrior.


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Well no, it was.
> 
> I’ve posted in all of them, so I need to be educated on each character being wanked in each thread.
> 
> You agreed!



Ok sure! It might take me a couple of decades to getting around to it.

[HASHTAG]#2040[/HASHTAG]


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Ok sure! It might take me a couple of decades to getting around to it.
> 
> [HASHTAG]#2040[/HASHTAG]


Thanks keyboard warrior. 

You got me this time, I concede.

I’ll look over your progress in the next couple days. Wouldn’t want to be called the backtrack warrior, after all.


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

@jesusus add a poll to end this bullshit

Reactions: Like 1


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Thanks keyboard assassin.
> 
> You got me this time, I concede.
> 
> I’ll look over your progress in the next couple days. Wouldn’t want to be called the backtrack warrior, after all.



Check out the sig homie. Every post comes with the seal of wank approval!

Reactions: Like 1


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Check out the sig homie. Every post comes with the seal of wank approval!


Lol that’s pretty good actually

Reactions: Like 2


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 26, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> you guys this is out of control



Everyday in the NBD is out of control!

It's what you come here for. Don't be shy to admit it!


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> Everyday in the NBD is out of control!
> 
> It's what you come here for. Don't be shy to admit it!


You are right! This is my guilty pleasure


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 26, 2019)

Architect said:


> Gai blitzes.


Wait... He blitzed sage mode minato when base minato did not get blitzed by V2A4?


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> @jesusus add a poll to end this bullshit


Take it easy Juicy, wouldn’t want you creating additional dupes to manipulate the results.

How many have you made? I know it’s more than one.

I vote for a secret PM poll with Juicy being excluded, we don’t know how far his influence reaches.


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Take it easy Juicy, wouldn’t want you creating additional dupes to manipulate the results.
> 
> How many have you made? I know it’s more than one.
> 
> I vote for a secret PM poll with Juicy being excluded, we don’t know how far his influence reaches.


He once implied we missed another one of his dupes. It was on his 10,000 post thread. For all we know everyone could be him.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> He once implied we missed another one of his dupes. It was on his 10,000 post thread. For all we know everyone could be him.


They could be anywhere. Makes me uneasy, like I don’t even want to sit down.


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 26, 2019)

Minato wins mid diff

Reactions: Like 1


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> Minato wins mid diff


Excellent substantiation.

How do you think the final blow goes? Does he kill Guy with a kunai slash or Rasengan before Guy punches him a dozen times in CQC with strikes that occur so fast they combust air?


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

@jesusus Poll please. @DaVizWiz is afraid of the obvious results


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> @jesusus Poll please. @DaVizWiz is afraid of the obvious results


I'm @jesusus is fairy godmother and he's not available rn


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> I'm @jesusus is fairy godmother and he's not available rn



I'll make a poll in a separate thread


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

Come on over to this thread... I added a poll that's aside from the topic but it'll do this thread justice


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Shazam said:


> @jesusus Poll please. @DaVizWiz is afraid of the obvious results


He’s unlikely to appease you.

You have entered this thread and called him a wanker, Juicy Dupe.


Shazam said:


> I'll make a poll in a separate thread


I can tell you the results now:

Juicy G: 0
DaVizWiz: 1

Seeing as you discontinued our debate when your portrayal failed in the matchup. and immediately moved to lean on a sectional opinion.


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## blk (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Bro he can release a Tsunami fire wave.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hmm i admittedly didn't remember the scale of those attacks.

Might have to rethink the result of the match. 

I guess i concede this (for now  !).


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

blk said:


> Hmm i admittedly didn't remember the scale of those attacks.
> 
> Might have to rethink the result of the match.
> 
> I guess i concede this (for now  !).


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## Shazam (Oct 26, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> He’s unlikely to appease you.
> 
> You have entered this thread and called him a wanker, Juicy Dupe.
> 
> ...



Idc to continue with your nonsense time waste lol 

Poll has been made already


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 26, 2019)

Am I the only one that just laughs when I see @Shazam reply to something. He seems so passive aggressive


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## Orochimaruwantsyourbody (Oct 26, 2019)

Gai may have superior physical reactions but even that's doubtful, as Minato was physically reacting to an attack that required double Kamui to barely escape (from at least 40m distance) while in base alone. He literally moved and fell to the ground, then looked up at them before Rikudo Obito even reacted to activate Kamui on himself.

The sequence where he threw a kunai 30m, entered SM, manifested a Rasengan, and teleported to Madara before Kakashi could even open the warphole Kamui on Obito's body is a godly speed feature that BM/BSM Naruto never came close to touching in feats - and Minato did that without a Kurama-based mode.

I can’t see Gai avoiding getting tagged and bagged by Minato. As much as it pains me to admit as a Gai fan, the Yellow Flash is just too much.


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## DaVizWiz (Oct 26, 2019)

Orochimaruwantsyourbody said:


> Gai may have superior physical reactions but even that's doubtful, as Minato was physically reacting to an attack that required double Kamui to barely escape (from at least 40m distance) while in base alone. He literally moved and fell to the ground, then looked up at them before Rikudo Obito even reacted to activate Kamui on himself.
> 
> The sequence where he threw a kunai 30m, entered SM, manifested a Rasengan, and teleported to Madara before Kakashi could even open the warphole Kamui on Obito's body is a godly speed feature that BM/BSM Naruto never came close to touching in feats - and Minato did that without a Kurama-based mode.
> 
> I can’t see Gai avoiding getting tagged and bagged by Minato. As much as it pains me to admit as a Gai fan, the Yellow Flash is just too much.


First feat is extraordinary but he failed. He also had the weight of two arms lifted off his body, making him faster.

Guy within the same feat, against the same truthseeker, picked Kakashi up, a grown man, more than doubling his weight as Kakashi was indeed dead weight, and moved faster than the truthseeker could touch his face from less than a meter. He moved him so much faster than the truthseeker that they even completely escaped the detonation AoE.

He was not in the 7th Gate.

As for the second feat, I love that feat, yet Guy already reacted to Kamui in base by moving his upper body aside for a BM clone to land Rasengan on Obito as the warp on his miniature soshuga was occurring, a much faster Kamui then trying to warp a full bodied man.

It should be noted that Gaara also constructed a sand wall by touching the ground before Kakashi’s Kamui opened on Obito. So he shares roughly the same speed feature as Minato in that sequence, which doesn’t help your case for it being a tremendous accomplishment. 

Guy in the 7th Gate, which is a faster version of the one that performed these two features, will be beating Minato to death with his bare hands at some point in this match, screams, blood and all.

He is not faster than Guy outside of level 2 FTG at *anything*. Level 2 doesn’t work, his knives are vaporized by MP in transit. He loses, end of story.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Architect (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> Wait... He blitzed sage mode minato when base minato did not get blitzed by V2A4?


yes


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## Trojan (Oct 27, 2019)

ThirdRidoku said:


> You're being dishonest Hussain
> 
> 
> 
> Madara *objectively tried to cut Gai in half,* vertically and straight down the middle, but Gai launched hirudora before he could.



no he didn't. He cut his attack in half. 

which shouldn't comes to no surprise, as if you have any basic understanding of how the manga works you would understand that Kishi can't simply afford to get Gai handicapped at that point. Where Minato is just a dead ET. 
that's why Kishi has more freedom to do whatever he wants to ET, unlike living characters whom their wounds will be permanent.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 27, 2019)

DaVizWiz said:


> Excellent substantiation.
> 
> How do you think the final blow goes? Does he kill Guy with a kunai slash or Rasengan before Guy punches him a dozen times in CQC with strikes that occur so fast they combust air?


Let me ask you this, who's faster 7-gate gai or V2A4?


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## J★J♥ (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> Let me ask you this, who's faster 7-gate gai or V2A4?


Guy is stronger and faster in 6th. Imo


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 27, 2019)

J★J♥ said:


> Guy is stronger and faster in 6th. Imo


"There is no faster shinobi than me" - A4


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## Jad (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> "There is no faster shinobi than me" - A4


*Link Removed*


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## J★J♥ (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> "There is no faster shinobi than me" - A4


Meaningless statment A shit his bed way too much.


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 27, 2019)

Jad said:


> *Link Removed*


Ohhh... Tell me the junior ninja better in taijutsu than lee with gates in question


J★J♥ said:


> Meaningless statment A shit his bed way too much.


Lol...
Yeah.. Sure, gai is faster than what a dojutsu can perceive.


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## Jad (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> Ohhh... Tell me the junior ninja better in taijutsu than lee with gates in question
> 
> Lol...
> Yeah.. Sure, gai is faster than what a dojutsu can perceive.


Little confused.

Do you understand why I posted that scene?


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 27, 2019)

Jad said:


> Little confused.
> 
> Do you understand why I posted that scene?


You are trying to debunk the raikage's "no shinobi is faster than me" statement by posting that scan. No?


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## Jad (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> You are trying to debunk the raikage's "no shinobi is faster than me" statement by posting that scan. No?


Did it work?


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## Ziggy Stardust (Oct 27, 2019)

Lee was the greatest Junior fighter from Konoha at that time, tbh.


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## J★J♥ (Oct 27, 2019)

Ziggy Stardust said:


> Lee was the greatest Junior fighter from Konoha at that time, tbh.


Neji


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## Ziggy Stardust (Oct 27, 2019)

J★J♥ said:


> Neji's reaction to Lee's gates


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## J★J♥ (Oct 27, 2019)

Ziggy Stardust said:


>


And Lee would die to Kaiten the second he tries that bondage bullshit.


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 27, 2019)

Jad said:


> Did it work?


No it didn't... Lee was the best junior taijutsu user just slightly above neji. 
Based on feats, the raikage is the fastest shinobi. Only 8-gate gai is faster.


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## J★J♥ (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> No it didn't... Lee was the best junior taijutsu user just slightly above neji.
> Based on feats, the raikage is the fastest shinobi. Only 8-gate gai is faster.


So Raikage can punch Kisame 1000 times before kisame moves a finger ? Can he punch out hirudoras too


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## J★J♥ (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> No it didn't... Lee was the best junior taijutsu user just slightly above neji.
> Based on feats, the raikage is the fastest shinobi. Only 8-gate gai is faster.


So Raikage can punch Kisame 1000 times before kisame moves a finger ? Can he punch out hirudoras too


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## JiraiyaFlash (Oct 27, 2019)

Omg NBD aint surprise me at all anymore. people creating debate matches like PA Kakashi and WA Tsunade (cuz appereantly WA Kakashi makes it one sided lol) . And now people talking about SM Minato Vs 7G Gai w/o any restriction for 9 all pages.

Minato has superior hax, track record, portrayal, feats, reputation, impact, influence, technicality, versatiliy. 

Only thing that 7G Gai has above Minato is strength and taijutsu. 

Its a sad day. 

Minato w/o an effort. Even Jonin Minato who confronted with A&B combo is more than enough for Gai.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 27, 2019)

J★J♥ said:


> So Raikage can punch Kisame 1000 times before kisame moves a finger ? Can he punch out hirudoras too


There is  a huge difference between ''I can punch fast" and "I can run fast".


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## J★J♥ (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> There is  a huge difference between ''I can punch fast" and "I can run fast".


There is a big difference between speed and movement speed as well.


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## Leaf Hurricane (Oct 27, 2019)

Gai Is top jounin at best.


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 27, 2019)

J★J♥ said:


> There is a big difference between speed and movement speed as well.


What's the difference?


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## J★J♥ (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> What's the difference?


Ms and as are completely different stats then there is skill which determines how you can utilize those stats. It is not exclusive to naruto, but kakashit gaiden is a good example.


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 27, 2019)

J★J♥ said:


> Ms and as are completely different stats then there is skill which determines how you can utilize those stats. It is not exclusive to naruto, but kakashit gaiden is a good example.


Minato movement speed is faster than gai's( FTG) 
Minato's reaction is better ( he could react to V2A4 while in base) 
Sage mode buff minato already insane reaction to a whole different and abnormal level. 

Let me ask you this, while using the gates, does gai have any significant reaction feat?


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## jesusus (Oct 27, 2019)

Gai can only use gates for two milliseconds before dying of exhaustion as per NBD canon


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## J★J♥ (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> Minato movement speed is faster than gai's( FTG)
> Minato's reaction is better ( he could react to V2A4 while in base)
> Sage mode buff minato already insane reaction to a whole different and abnormal level.
> 
> Let me ask you this, while using the gates, does gai have any significant reaction feat?


What ? Guy and minato were put in literally same situation anf one did better than another and it was not minato.


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 27, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> "There is no faster shinobi than me" - A4


Yes, there is Gai


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 27, 2019)

J★J♥ said:


> What ? Guy and minato were put in literally same situation anf one did better than another and it was not minato.


But gai does not have the reactionary abilities of a juubi jin


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 27, 2019)

HawaywayHuncho said:


> Yes, there is Gai


Only with the eight gate.


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## narut0ninjafan (Oct 27, 2019)

Minato obviously wins, he FTGs his way out of all of Gai's attacks until he exhausts himself and reverts back to base, then finishes him off

How has this gone on for 10 pages?

Reactions: Like 2


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## Mad Scientist (Oct 28, 2019)

Orochimaru op said:


> We don’t speak about that


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## Crimson Flam3s (Oct 28, 2019)

J★J♥ said:


> What ? Guy and minato were put in literally same situation anf one did better than another and it was not minato.



Madara was obviously going soooo serious against Minato who was a threat but Gai is so below him, let decided not to kill him right off the bat


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## Mad Scientist (Oct 28, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> Only with the eight gate.


But that's part of Gai, is it not? Just like how RCM max speed is part of A's speed, and KCM with Body Flicker is part of Naruto's speed. The issue with the moniker is that it simply doesn't take into account everyone.

In an Olympic race, someone may be claimed the fastest man, perhaps they've won 10 years in a row. That doesn't automatically qualify him as actually being the fastest in the world. Somewhere out there, a real "ninja" may exist, who trained his entire life, honed his body on this one thing, who, when put to the test, would exceed the speed of that world-renowned man.

We also have evidence of Gai moving much more impressively than A. Recall a much, much weaker and slower Madara physically reacting to RCM A, whereas 7G Gai surprised the much, much stronger and faster Madara and pushed him back without being tagged even once.


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## J★J♥ (Oct 28, 2019)

Crimson Flam3s said:


> Madara was obviously going soooo serious against Minato who was a threat but Gai is so below him, let decided not to kill him right off the bat


I see


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 28, 2019)

Mad Scientist said:


> We also have evidence of Gai moving much more impressively than A. Recall a much, much weaker and slower Madara physically reacting to RCM A, whereas 7G Gai surprised the much, much stronger and faster Madara and pushed him back without being tagged even once.


Could you post scans... Madara reacting to a4 and Gai.


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## Mad Scientist (Oct 28, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> Could you post scans... Madara reacting to a4 and Gai.


10 Tails Alive 1-Rinnegan Madara's reaction to Gai
 - Look closely at the last panel, and
 - Match with the first panel.

Here, Mads could do nothing but dodge. When he does find an opportunity, he goes straight to attempting to cut Gai in half, which ends up unsuccessful. 

Base Edo 2-Rinnegan Madara's reaction to RCM A
 - Look closely at the last panel, and
 - Match with the first panel.

Here, Mads reacts to RCM A at point-blank and actually "blocks" the attack.

In summary, a much slower Madara reacted to A, and a much faster Madara could do nothing but dodge Gai, and even when he tried to attack him, it failed. This may not be the most clear parallel, but what is clear is the fact Gai's performance far outshines A's.


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## J★J♥ (Oct 28, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> But gai does not have the reactionary abilities of a juubi jin


He clearly does tho.

Reactions: Like 2


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## jesusus (Oct 28, 2019)

Did we all read the same manga? I guess Juudara would play fight with part 1 Konohamaru too since he's also not a threat


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## Ziggy Stardust (Oct 28, 2019)

Let's break down this fight :

Base Minato : movements perfectly perceived by teen Obito until FTG blind side.  The latter is suggested to be rushing the fight.

Kmc Naruto : Dodges V2 Ay. compared to the Yellow Flash by onlookers.  They're regarding his _Hiraishin_, not Shunshin

Adult Obito : tools the prodical child, yet faces staunch resistance from a worthy foe, Base Gai and his nunchaku

So already there are some grounds to claim the two have parity when comparing Gai in his rawest form to Minato using Hiriashin.  And he wouldn't be the first to counter the vaunted technique: Killer B


Next comparison :


SM Minato: instant transmissions in front of Judara, gets sliced, diced and discarded before he can poof out.  Onlookers are disapointed

7g Gai : puts the Six paths incarnate on his heels with speed greater than the latter can produce himself.  Onlookers are astonished.


The comparison isn't fair.  Guy takes Minato out.  He does so in from any Gate above #5

Portrayal counter #1

Reactions: Like 4


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## sabre320 (Oct 28, 2019)

People are seriously arguing 7th gate gai beats sm minato......dude who is war arc kakashis rival is going to beat the dude who stalemated ei and bee only now amped with sm......this forum what happened


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## Mad Scientist (Oct 28, 2019)

sabre320 said:


> People are seriously arguing 7th gate gai beats sm minato......dude who is war arc kakashis rival is going to beat the gai who stalemated ei and bee now amped with sm......this forum what happened


I legitimately don't understand what your objection is, Sabre? I'm sure most of your objections have been handled. Like, why not actually refute the arguments made in the thread instead of saying you don't believe this and that just because? I understand how you feel, because I feel the same way in that posters actually believe base Minato beats Kisamehada in the Pacific Ocean. But I didn't just rant - I actually provided justifications for my viewpoint.


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 28, 2019)

Mad Scientist said:


> 10 Tails Alive 1-Rinnegan Madara's reaction to Gai
> - Look closely at the last panel, and
> - Match with the first panel.
> 
> ...


Oh.. I see
Don't you think it was the constant and recurring pressure that denied madara (vs gai) the opportunity  to counter?
Madara could replicate his reaction vs A4 with gai if only gai did not constantly attack madara


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## Mad Scientist (Oct 28, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> Oh.. I see
> Don't you think it was the constant and recurring pressure that denied madara (vs gai) the opportunity  to counter?


I think so. It was clear from Madara's initial reaction to 7G Gai's first step that he had underestimated it. He knows taijutsu can hurt him, and he wouldn't want to get hit for no reason. The speed and pressure with which Gai attacked wouldn't have granted Madara an opportunity to attack, at least for those brief few moments. When Madara did get that one opportunity to react back instead of dodging, however, he failed.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Ziggy Stardust (Oct 28, 2019)

sabre320 said:


> People are seriously arguing 7th gate gai beats sm minato......dude who is war arc kakashis rival is going to beat the dude who stalemated ei and bee only now amped with sm......this forum what happened



Paradigms change, as do opinions.

You can either adapt, try to use your own persuasion ability to defeat these new arguments.

Or you can whine, clutch your pearls, and most likely, your cock, while the meta shifts and leaves you behind.


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## Cognitios (Oct 28, 2019)

Is this SM Minato, a Minato with Sage mode as Minato has it in the manga or is this Sage Mode Minato as in a hypothetical Minato that will remain and start in Sage Mode for the entirety of the match?


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## Mad Scientist (Oct 28, 2019)

Cognitios said:


> Is this SM Minato, a Minato with Sage mode as Minato has it in the manga or is this Sage Mode Minato as in a hypothetical Minato that will remain and start in Sage Mode for the entirety of the match?


I think it's Minato who has entered Sage Mode, like Jiraiya entered Sage Mode.

This may be useful

*Spoiler*: __


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## Cognitios (Oct 28, 2019)

Mad Scientist said:


> I think it's Minato who has entered Sage Mode, like Jiraiya entered Sage Mode.
> 
> This may be useful
> 
> *Spoiler*: __


I believe Minato only has one rasengan charge in SM so if I'm wrong please correct me. If Minato can end Gai in that time frame I think he can win. Gai is a very slightly slower Minato with longer range attacks and more offensive power. I think with only 20 meters of distance Gai has an advantage. With prep Minato would win I think but I don't see Minato being able to deal with MP or AT (his hirodora thing, please forgive me I haven't touched Naruto in a while), they would destroy his tags easily as Gai would have knowledge of FTG. Minato would have to get close in order to land a rasengan and unfortunately for him Gai is one of the very few people who can actually keep up to his speed in CQC

Reactions: Like 1


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 28, 2019)

Mad Scientist said:


> I think so. It was clear from Madara's initial reaction to 7G Gai's first step that he had underestimated it. He knows taijutsu can hurt him, and he wouldn't want to get hit for no reason. The speed and pressure with which Gai attacked wouldn't have granted Madara an opportunity to attack, at least for those brief few moments. When Madara did get that one opportunity to react back instead of dodging, however, he failed.


Do you think madara could have reacted and blocked Gai's attack assuming it was just one punch attempt like the raikage's


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 28, 2019)

@ShinAkuma whats your opinion of this?


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## ShinAkuma (Oct 28, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> @ShinAkuma whats your opinion of this?



It's difficult to say. 

Portrayal wise I would favor Minato. Logically Minato could just warp away. 

However 7th gate is nothing to fuck with. The Masters can give most a fight. I think Gai pushes Minato hard but FTG is broke and 7th gate runs out. 

I give Minato the edge.


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## Mad Scientist (Oct 28, 2019)

Hina uzumaki said:


> Do you think madara could have reacted and blocked Gai's attack assuming it was just one punch attempt like the raikage's


If he was fast enough to dodge it, then yes he could have raised his arm and "blocked" it much in the same way he did against A. But he would have gotten punched and he wouldn't want to risk getting hit, especially shortly after realising he had underestimated the 7G, which is why A) He dodged the attacks and B) Tried to kill Gai when he got the opportunity, eliminating the risk of damage.


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## Crimson Flam3s (Oct 28, 2019)

sabre320 said:


> People are seriously arguing 7th gate gai beats sm minato......*dude who is war arc kakashis rival is going to beat the dude who stalemated ei and bee only now amped with sm*......this forum what happened





Mad Scientist said:


> I legitimately don't understand what your objection is, Sabre? I'm sure most of your objections have been handled. Like, why not actually refute the arguments made in the thread instead of saying you don't believe this and that just because? I understand how you feel, because I feel the same way in that posters actually believe base Minato beats Kisamehada in the Pacific Ocean. But I didn't just rant - I actually provided justifications for my viewpoint.



This is exactly the problem I see most often around here. 

People get mad that someone beats a character they consider to be far superior to their rival in portrayal, and don't even take into account how their ninjutsu qould matchup against each other.

This ain't DBZ and inferior tier Ninja can beat superior ones under the right conditions or if they simply counter their arsenal. 

Gai in this case, not only has much better Taijutsu and CQC showings, but can destroy Minato's tags or scatter them with Hirudora and if Minato tries to go rip up to his face, he gets his teeth punched down his throat.


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## Hina uzumaki (Oct 29, 2019)

Crimson Flam3s said:


> This is exactly the problem I see most often around here.
> 
> People get mad that someone beats a character they consider to be far superior to their rival in portrayal, and don't even take into account how their ninjutsu qould matchup against each other.
> 
> ...


Minato is not that reliant on tags. He can make new tags by touching any objects in the area or use clones as mobile tags.


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## The_Conqueror (Oct 29, 2019)

Minato wins. Gai can't touch minato and even if he can destroy all kunai it comes down to minato vs Ay with Gai having kunai on his back and Minato teleporting there or the same Minato throwing kunai around and Gai wasting chakra. Summons would also aid Minato but doubt its neeed.

Reactions: Like 2


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## JiraiyaFlash (Oct 29, 2019)

Omg there are people that still believe Juudara heavily pressured by 7G Gai. Why everybody forgets Madara's personality and his childish desire to new experiences.

This dude didnt manifest Perfect Susano right out the bat against Gokage but he choose to build up to it. He waited the exact time that Kage think that they're victories. This dude didnt said anything about his Hashirama cells but instead chose to show'em in fashionnette way. He took a jinton on purpose.

This dude is ready to take on thousands of shinoi just with cqc abilities and taijutsu until Ônoki and Gaara interfere and even then he just released his ribcage susano. And he released that cuz of ônoki + naruto's combo. And he only showed his rinnegan after he pulled out of his v1 susano.

This is one of the main characteristic treatment of Madara. He loves to play. Even when he fought 8G .. He didnt cast any of his ninjutsu. He didnt go fly away, he didnt try to stall Gai and eventualy let him die via 8th gate exhaustion. No he try to fight with Gai on his on term.

And when he ssaw Gai's 7G he said "You're embrassing me, you cant do much with blue steam. Show me the red one." ().
And even after Gai's 7th Gate attempts. He was done in a sec().  And he needed to rescue by someone else. Thats the drawback of the inner gates ().

And even after 8th gate come out to play. Madara encountered with 8th Gate in a childish joy of curiosity ()() .As Madara described it;  it was a "game" to him. And to turn this game to real deal for Madara, even in 8th Gate Gai needed huge support and backup () .


So its funny even 8th Gate Gai's biggest hit happened cuz of Minato's keen strategy and fast reactions. But somehow Healthier and more powerful Minato is gonna bite the dust of 7th Gate due to some nbd bois   


-----

Gai had his emotional, very early promised burst moment against madara it started with 7G and turned into 8G. and it was both emotional and  powerful. But in the end Minato is a superior character by portrayal, reputation, track record, accomplishments, career acheivements, impact, influence etc,etc.

Gai is not versatile enough to defeat him w/o Gates and Gates has time and endurance issues. And even with gates w/o 8th Gate he is not gonna surprass a top notch speedster and space-time specialist who is more versatile and intelligent than Gai. 

Its simple as it is.


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## J★J♥ (Oct 29, 2019)

JiraiyaFlash said:


> Omg there are people that still believe Juudara heavily pressured by 7G Gai. Why everybody forgets Madara's personality and his childish desire to new experiences.
> 
> This dude didnt manifest Perfect Susano right out the bat against Gokage but he choose to build up to it. He waited the exact time that Kage think that they're victories. This dude didnt said anything about his Hashirama cells but instead chose to show'em in fashionnette way. He took a jinton on purpose.
> 
> ...


This whole post is big pile of steaming bullshit. You can see body language and facial reactions in both fights and there is clear difference in performance and reaction as well. Read it again.


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## Jad (Oct 29, 2019)

JiraiyaFlash said:


> Omg there are people that still believe Juudara heavily pressured by 7G Gai. Why everybody forgets Madara's personality and his childish desire to new experiences.
> 
> This dude didnt manifest Perfect Susano right out the bat against Gokage but he choose to build up to it. He waited the exact time that Kage think that they're victories. This dude didnt said anything about his Hashirama cells but instead chose to show'em in fashionnette way. He took a jinton on purpose.
> 
> ...


Gees.

Madara already 'experinced 7th Gate' Gai in the war.

There is LITERALLY no reason for Madara not to have taken Gai out like he did to Minato a second ago. Madara didn't all of a sudden have a crisis of the mind because some green spandex looking guy charged at him. The man was insulted, how does someone like Madara who was insulted not try to immediately humiliated Gai?

The feat is Gai did better than Minato.

That's it. There is no need for you to make up theories or make up dialog for Madara to justify the scene. Kishimoto didn't tell us this is how Madara was thinking, so you certainly don't need to.

It's mind boggling simple. Minato attaks, gets instantly cut down, Gai attacks seconds later, gets further ahead then Minato - that is the feat. The icing on the cake is Gaara even commented on how beastly Gai was. Kishimoto MEANT for the scene to be impressive, since he had Gaara and Minato looking in awe. I mean he had Madara looking in awe several times, what more do you want? Seriously, Kishimoto didn't sit on his tiny desk and draw Madara with those facial expressions just to tease us.

Don't you think Kishimoto would have drawn the scene wildly different if it wasn't meant to be a good look for Gai in those few moments? Think about that.

If Kishimoto himself came out and said this scene needs to be taken for verbatim, you guys still wouldn't believe it. Hell you guys don't believe half the stuff said about the Gates and Gai in the DB (even when you guys love using it for your own characters).


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## t0xeus (Oct 29, 2019)

JiraiyaFlash said:


> Omg there are people that still believe Juudara heavily pressured by 7G Gai. Why everybody forgets Madara's personality and his childish desire to new experiences.
> 
> This dude didnt manifest Perfect Susano right out the bat against Gokage but he choose to build up to it. He waited the exact time that Kage think that they're victories. This dude didnt said anything about his Hashirama cells but instead chose to show'em in fashionnette way. He took a jinton on purpose.
> 
> ...


Agree with all except bold

It was mainly Lee's perfect prediction timing that made Gai's last attack possible. Even Minato himself says this.


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## t0xeus (Oct 29, 2019)

Jad said:


> Gees.
> 
> Madara already 'experinced 7th Gate' Gai in the war.
> 
> ...


Actually it's the opposite

He was insulted that Gai went only with 7G against him, so he just tanked/dodged everything he could so he'd force Gai into going 8G, as he himself says

If he kills him right there then he ruins his own enjoyment


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## Jad (Oct 29, 2019)

t0xeus said:


> Actually it's the opposite
> 
> He was insulted that Gai went only with 7G against him, so he just tanked/dodged everything he could so he'd force Gai into going 8G, as he himself says
> 
> If he kills him right there then he ruins his own enjoyment


But he tried attacking killing him twice when given the opportunity.

Once when Hirudora was launched, trying to slice Gai with his staff. Second time with the black orbs when Gai was downed by the pre-explosion.

When you insult someone like Madara, you're not going to get on his generous side.


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## t0xeus (Oct 29, 2019)

Jad said:


> But he tried attacking killing him twice when given the opportunity.
> 
> Once with Hirudora, trying to slice Gai with his staff. Second time with the black orbs when Gai was downed.


He was attacking, alright, but it was not Madara seriously trying to kill him

Unless you think a serious Madara kills by throwing a Gudodama at you


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## Jad (Oct 29, 2019)

t0xeus said:


> He was attacking, alright, but it was not Madara seriously trying to kill him
> 
> Unless you think a serious Madara kills by throwing a Gudodama at you


Goudama are pretty fast, and he flinged two of them, not just one. So he was definitely trying for a quick death. I mean he used them on Obito and Kakashi and the latter fucked him out of Kurama. You can't block those suckers as well with ninjutsu.


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## t0xeus (Oct 29, 2019)

Jad said:


> Goudama are pretty fast, and he flinged two of them, not just one. So he was definitely trying for a quick death.


1) They're not, they're kunai toss speed at best which is not really that fast for ninjas
2) You can see Madara going all-out when he fights Sasuke and Naruto. He actually uses ninjutsu when he is trying to get rid of the opponent


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## Jad (Oct 29, 2019)

​


t0xeus said:


> 1) They're not, they're kunai toss speed at best which is not really that fast for ninjas
> 2) You can see Madara going all-out when he fights Sasuke and Naruto. He actually uses ninjutsu when he is trying to get rid of the opponent


I said two Goudama, but it was one.

Like I said, he used two to get rid of Obito and Kakashi, and the latter stole Kurama from him (or some form of it), which he wanted back.

So I think that's a pretty big response to get Goudama thrown at you. Mind you, Goudama is above all ninujutsu, since it's all chakra natures and types, and can be shape manipulated, and by pass all obstacles.

In fact, funnily enough it's the same way he was going to kill Gai a second time around when the 8th Gate was used up.


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## t0xeus (Oct 29, 2019)

Jad said:


> ​
> I said two Goudama, but it was one.
> 
> Like I said, he used two to get rid of Obito and Kakashi, and the latter stole Kurama from him (or some form of it), which he wanted back.
> ...


So you think Madara was serious against 7G Gai but he then says to much stronger 8G Gai that he will play with him for a bit longer?

Is Madara supposed to be just standing straight and not do anything at all for you to think he is not serious?

Or is using his possibly weakest attack besides spitting too much already?


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## JiraiyaFlash (Oct 29, 2019)

t0xeus said:


> It was mainly Lee's perfect prediction timing that made Gai's last attack possible. Even Minato himself says this.


All plan come from Minato's plan thats the part of intelligence. And he picked exact time to activate Hiraishin to take those godou damas away w/o pierced by'em. Yes Lee aided him but it wasnt solely based on Lee's physical attiributes.


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## Crimson Flam3s (Oct 29, 2019)

@t0xeus

Are you seriously arguing that Madara shot those Goudodamas knowing that Gai would either block or dodge them?(Neither of which he was capable)?



Do I have to remind you what they do?



How was Gai going to do anything when he had to be saved?


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## sabre320 (Oct 29, 2019)

Jesus christ the madara fight was the same as boruto seemingly pressuring hokage kakashi at the chunnin test....we literally saw that juubidara reacted and blocked a evening elephant from 8th gate gai who is on another stratosphere to 7thgate gai . It makes absolutely zero sense for him to even be remotely pressured by 7th gate gai when he freaking put up a block with his guodama staff against freaking yagai.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ThirdRidoku (Nov 2, 2019)

Hussain said:


> no he didn't. He cut his attack in half.
> 
> which shouldn't comes to no surprise, as if you have any basic understanding of how the manga works you would understand that Kishi can't simply afford to get Gai handicapped at that point. Where Minato is just a dead ET.
> that's why Kishi has more freedom to do whatever he wants to ET, unlike living characters whom their wounds will be permanent.



That still means he counter attacked though...* He felt the need to parry an attack he already survived in the weaker form*. We literally see him reacting to Hirudora's hand sign in the previous panel, and then he literally steps forward swinging his staff down in the exact same manner he did to counter SM Minato's rasengan. The fact that we see movement lines on Madara himself, not just the staff, means he tried to blitz Gai and cut him in half before the tiger could be released but he failed to do so in time.  The point being, 7th Gai wasn't shit diff'd while SM Minato was.... just pointing out that fact.


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## LostSelf (Nov 2, 2019)

sabre320 said:


> Jesus christ the madara fight was the same as boruto seemingly pressuring hokage kakashi at the chunnin test....we literally saw that juubidara reacted and blocked a evening elephant from 8th gate gai who is on another stratosphere to 7thgate gai . It makes absolutely zero sense for him to even be remotely pressured by 7th gate gai when he freaking put up a block with his guodama staff against freaking yagai.



Why people say it's impossible for the 7th gate to have pressured Juudara because he reacted to the 8th gate? 

Watching both performances, the 8th gate did far better against the 7th, because the 7th gate didn't touch Madara, the 8th gate pushed him through the floor.

Therefore using that as an argument to dismiss the 7th gate's display doesn't match unless the 7th gate's display were better.


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## hbcaptain (Nov 2, 2019)

LostSelf said:


> Therefore using that as an argument to dismiss the 7th gate's display doesn't work.


However red Gai was noted to be tens of times stronger than the Gokage. So, if 7G Gai could still fight an oponent who took him seriously and at the same time managed to handle red Gai for a while, it only means that 7G Gai is still a few times stronger than the Gokage for the very least which doesn't make a lot of sens.


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## LostSelf (Nov 2, 2019)

hbcaptain said:


> However red Gai was noted to be tens of times stronger than the Gokage. So, if 7G Gai could still fight an oponent who took him seriously and at the same time managed to handle red Gai for a while, it only means that 7G Gai is still a few times stronger than the Gokage for the very least which doesn't make a lot of sens.



It would not mean that. However, I am not calculating how much seriously Madara took Gai. I am saying the 8th Gate did far better than the 7th, so I do not know from where the argument that the 7th Gate did better, otherwise he should've been toying around" comes from.

I'd say Juudara was taking Gai as serious as he was taking the group. However you want to look at it.


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## hbcaptain (Nov 2, 2019)

LostSelf said:


> I'd say Juudara was taking Gai as serious as he was taking the group. However you want to look at it.


The group was composed of SM Minato, War Kakashi (who is equal to Gai up to the 7th gate) and War Gaara, JJ Mads busted them like nothing while 7G Gai was pressuring him, in other words that would means 7G Gai >> SM Minato&Kakashi&Gaara which doesn't make a lot of sens either.


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## LostSelf (Nov 2, 2019)

hbcaptain said:


> The group was composed of SM Minato, War Kakashi (who is equal to Gai up to the 7th gate) and War Gaara, JJ Mads busted them like nothing while 7G Gai was pressuring him, in other words that would means 7G Gai >> SM Minato&Kakashi&Gaara which doesn't make a lot of sens either.



7Th Gated Gai doing better than Minato in CqC makes a lot of sense.


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## hbcaptain (Nov 2, 2019)

LostSelf said:


> 7Th Gated Gai doing better than Minato in CqC makes a lot of sense.


JJ Mads neg diffed SM Minato, War Kakashi and War Gaara at the same time. They attacked him with the best strategy they could think about and they were slaughtered.
So, it only means that 7G Gai >> SM Minato&Gaara&Kakashi which doesn't make a lot of sens.
Minato attacked him in CQC because speed and thus CQC is his main and strongest asset offensively, Kakashi used Kamui his ultimate Jutsu and Gaara used his ultimate defense, all of them were outdone just like this.


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## LostSelf (Nov 2, 2019)

hbcaptain said:


> JJ Mads neg diffed SM Minato, War Kakashi and War Gaara at the same time. They attacked him with the best strategy they could think about and they were slaughtered.
> So, it only means that 7G Gai >> SM Minato&Gaara&Kakashi which doesn't make a lot of sens.
> Minato attacked him in CQC because speed and thus CQC is his main and strongest asset offensively, Kakashi used Kamui his ultimate Jutsu and Gaara used his ultimate defense, all of them were outdone just like this.



That just proves Madara is too fast, not that they are better than Gai in CqC. Neither means Gai would beat them in a fight. It has no correlation. Madara is above them all, him doing this doesn't mean Gai can just because he did better than Minato in CqC.

Hiraishin is Minato's fort, not Taijutsu skills which is what the battle was about.


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## hbcaptain (Nov 2, 2019)

LostSelf said:


> That just proves Madara is too fast, not that they are better than Gai in CqC. Neither means Gai would beat them in a fight. It has no correlation. Madara is above them all, him doing this doesn't mean Gai can just because he did better than Minato in CqC.
> 
> Hiraishin is Minato's fort, not Taijutsu skills which is what the battle was about.


As I said earlier, SM Minato and Kakashi and Gaara used the best of what they could do, Minato attacking in CQC only means the best he can do is CQC, which makes sens since speed specialist => CQC specialist as speed only allows the caster to attack in CQC. Kakashi's strongest point is Kamui, a long range technique while Gaara's strongest point is defense which he used.
Gai had to be dramatically faster than SM Minato to be able to pressure Madara this way.
Now, even if you suppose both Minato and Madara are talentless Taijutsu fodders (which doesn't make a lot of sens). The speed gap isn't something just unorthodox movements can overcome.


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## ThirdRidoku (Nov 2, 2019)

hbcaptain said:


> As I said earlier, SM Minato and Kakashi and Gaara used the best of what they could do, Minato attacking in CQC only means the best he can do is CQC, which makes sens since speed specialist => CQC specialist as speed only allows the caster to attack in CQC. Kakashi's strongest point is Kamui, a long range technique while Gaara's strongest point is defense which he used.
> Gai had to be dramatically faster than SM Minato to be able to pressure Madara this way.
> Now, even if you suppose both Minato and Madara are talentless Taijutsu fodders (which doesn't make a lot of sens). The speed gap isn't something just unorthodox movements can overcome.



Nothing was established about 7th gates
Gai combat speed prior to his skirmish with juubidara. All we had to go on before was two very short 7th gate long range performances against kisame and Edo madara with hirudora.... the juubidara fight was used to establish gai combat speed. Therefore we default to what the manga showed us...


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## LostSelf (Nov 2, 2019)

hbcaptain said:


> Gai had to be dramatically faster than SM Minato to be able to pressure Madara this way.



What's the problem with Gai being faster than Minato without Hiraishin? Not to mention that Madara was expecting Gai to be slower, so there's a surprise factor there.

The speed gap might not, but Taijutsu skill is. And in CqC Gai has exceeded Minato in base when Minato was two panneled by Obito twice and forced to teleport away and Gai lasted far longer than him in close combat. In pure taijutsu skill (where speed difference and strength didn't matter much), Gai also outdid KCM Naruto

We have not one, but two interactions against the same enemy where Gai did way better than Minato in CqC. There is a taijutsu gap between the two, a notable one proven by two instances that makes the latter one more believable, not only one.

This does not mean Gai would be able to beat Minato, Gaara and Kakashi at the same time. You are equalizing Gai to Madara here while I am not. There's always middle ground.


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## Grinningfox (Nov 2, 2019)

LostSelf said:


> What's the problem with Gai being faster than Minato without Hiraishin? Not to mention that Madara was expecting Gai to be slower, so there's a surprise factor there.
> 
> The speed gap might not, but Taijutsu skill is. And in CqC Gai has exceeded Minato in base when Minato was two panneled by Obito twice and forced to teleport away and Gai lasted far longer than him in close combat. In pure taijutsu skill (where speed difference and strength didn't matter much), Gai also outdid KCM Naruto
> 
> ...



Gai had the benefit of knowledge against Obito while Minato had none at all it’s not a 1-1 comparison like at all


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## LostSelf (Nov 2, 2019)

Grinningfox said:


> Gai had the benefit of knowledge against Obito while Minato had none at all it’s not a 1-1 comparison like at all



Minato clashed twice against Obito in CqC. Second time he was chained with minimal effort and once again had to use Hiraishin.


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## Grinningfox (Nov 2, 2019)

LostSelf said:


> Minato clashed twice against Obito in CqC. Second time he was chained with minimal effort and once again had to use Hiraishin.


 Again with zero knowledge put base Gai with no knowledge there and he dies and it certainly wasn’t twice 

At this time


Obito used Kyuubi launching a Bijudama to take Minato off guard so hardly fair circumstances 



And here is Minato still trying to figure it out but getting tricked 

 You’re leaving out context man

now I don’t disagree with your assertion in the slightest bar what I responded to


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## LostSelf (Nov 3, 2019)

Grinningfox said:


> Again with zero knowledge put base Gai with no knowledge there and he dies and it certainly wasn’t twice
> 
> At this time
> 
> ...



Can't see links right now because they are blocked at work, but as I remember things, the first encounter was a surprise attack from Obito, whom Minato responded, was phased, grabbed and defeated until he used Hiraishin.

After that, the other encounter they had, they both clashed, Minato phased him again (after getting a bit of knowledge on his abilities - meaning he knew Obito could phase and suck people, as well as teleporting) and was chained, once again forced to use Hiraishin. 

While Gai in mid air prevented Obito's Kamui attempts and sneak attacks.

Will check them out at home to see if I missed anything, after work. But feel free to respond to that meanwhile.


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## Grinningfox (Nov 3, 2019)

LostSelf said:


> Can't see links right now because they are blocked at work, but as I remember things, the first encounter was a surprise attack from Obito, whom Minato responded, was phased, grabbed and defeated until he used Hiraishin.
> 
> After that, the other encounter they had, they both clashed, Minato phased him again (after getting a bit of knowledge on his abilities) and was chained.
> 
> While Gai in mid air prevented Obito's Kamui attempts and sneak attacks.


That surprise attack was initiated by Obito making Kurama launch a Bijudama at him and then coming  at him from behind

[Ch 607 pg 8 and 10]

That’s something Gai just isn’t dealing with outside of 8G

the next attempt is Minato still with next to no knowledge trying to overcome him with pure physicals and failing

A Gai with knowledge and the opportunity to initiate the offense


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## hbcaptain (Nov 3, 2019)

LostSelf said:


> What's the problem with Gai being faster than Minato without Hiraishin? Not to mention that Madara was expecting Gai to be slower, so there's a surprise factor there.
> 
> The speed gap might not, but Taijutsu skill is. And in CqC Gai has exceeded Minato in base when Minato was two panneled by Obito twice and forced to teleport away and Gai lasted far longer than him in close combat. In pure taijutsu skill (where speed difference and strength didn't matter much), Gai also outdid KCM Naruto
> 
> ...


Minato used Hiraishin to attack JJ Mads and he was in SM, so Gai being so dramatically faster than Minato w Hiraishin even in the 7th gate poses a huge anomaly in terms of consistency.

Minato was still analyzing Obito's movements when he was grabed by the chain meanwhile Gai had full knowledge (thus he acted accordingly) and Obito was fighting four Kage level at once, thus his focus was strongly divided between all the oponents he was up against.
 Furhteremore, Gai's feat is contradicted by two facts :
-he was subdued by Shouten Kisame earlier in P2.
-he needs to activate the 6th gate to fight on 3T Kakashi's level Taijutuswise against three V2 Jins in which the three V2 Jins had the upper hand against 3T Kakashi and 6G Gai.
And let's not forget that based on his overall standing which was built all over the manga, he simply can't support someone like KCM Naruto (fast enough to speedblitz Kisame, moves faster than Bee, Tsunade, A4 can see, etc) with just his base Taijutsu. (well, unless you consider Soshuga > 6G in CQC, but even so he was still overwhelmed by Shouten Kisame).

It means that Madara overwhelmed SM Minato, Kakashi and Gaara simultaneously like fodders with just "Taijutsu" and Gai showed an even better Taijutsu skill than JJ Mads. So that obivously means 7G Gai can fodderize all three of them at once had Madara fought both with the same of seriousness.


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## JiraiyaFlash (Nov 4, 2019)

LostSelf said:


> when Minato was two panneled by Obito twice and forced to teleport away and Gai lasted far longer than him in close combat.


Minato never two paneled by Obito and Gai never fought against Obito all by himself and he had knowledge about him. You guys neglecting the facts and overlook the main details ..



LostSelf said:


> We have not one, but two interactions against the same enemy where Gai did way better than Minato in CqC.


Well actually not.



LostSelf said:


> Minato clashed twice against Obito in CqC. Second time he was chained with minimal effort and once again had to use Hiraishin.


He chained cuz Obito was intangible. And Minato's fighting style is about being able to take risks cuz of Hirashin (like Tobirama). İf wouldnt've have that he probably aproach in other way. Thats nothing about "panelled by someone". Mİnato also concerning about his kid, dying wife and rampaging 9 Tails.

If you want panelling. Jiraiya one panelled Kisame and %30 of Kisame forced Gai to 6G . So 7G is not enough to close to gap since we know Minato >> Base J-Man >>Kisame > 6G Gai > %30 Kisame

So 7G not gonna put Gai over the top of this chain and made him superior than Minato. Also difference in reputation, track record, acheivements and portrayal supports this too.


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## LostSelf (Nov 5, 2019)

Grinningfox said:


> Again with zero knowledge put base Gai with no knowledge there and he dies and it certainly wasn’t twice
> 
> At this time
> 
> ...



Minato knew by the time of their second encounter that Obito could phase through attacks. You can say the chain took him by surprise and that'd be fair, but the phasing is something he already knew about.



hbcaptain said:


> Minato used Hiraishin to attack JJ Mads and he was in SM, so Gai being so dramatically faster than Minato w Hiraishin even in the 7th gate poses a huge anomaly in terms of consistency.
> 
> Minato was still analyzing Obito's movements when he was grabed by the chain meanwhile Gai had full knowledge (thus he acted accordingly) and Obito was fighting four Kage level at once, thus his focus was strongly divided between all the oponents he was up against.
> Furhteremore, Gai's feat is contradicted by two facts :
> ...



Minato was analyzing his teleporting jutsu as he thought was something different, but he knew Obito could phase.

The next part I feel are going into a different place. Activating the 6th gate to fight alongside Kakashi doesn't mean he needs it to fight in pure Taijutsu against Kakashi. Put Kakashi in pure taijutsu against Gai and see how it goes.

That is irrelevant because 7th Gated Gai is a different person. And Gai already had Shoten Kisame disarmed. What kept Kisame in the fight was his living sword returning to him, otherwise Gai was going to kill him. Therefore, Gai showed greater Taijutsu feats than Kisame.

The Jins were having the upper hand against KCM Naruto and Bee as well in lesser forms. Killer Bee had to go full Hachibi to fight these guys. Minato is not above a combination of KCM Naruto and Hachibi to invalidate this.

Gai in the 6th gate would've had a better display in that encounter against Obito than in base, for obvious reasons. He's faster, has way faster punching strikes. Even if he was not going to end up touching him.

Again, Madara besting these guys when he proved to be faster than 7th Gated Gai doesn't invalidate Gai being better than Minato in Taijutsu. This has nothing to do with Gai vs Minato -In Taijutsu-. Minato used Hiraishin to get in front of Madara, but after that, it was his own moving speed that Madara reacted to, just like he reacted to Gai's. Just that 7th Gated Gai moved faster than Minato's body speed and went further. 

Another character not named Madara would've died against Minato there, because Hiraishin was going to end up putting them in a position they would've not been able to counter Minato. However, Madara, who can react, inevitable forced this into a Taijutsu fight.



JiraiyaFlash said:


> Minato never two paneled by Obito and Gai never fought against Obito all by himself and he had knowledge about him. You guys neglecting the facts and overlook the main details ..



Yes, he did. Twice. I am talking about Minato in CqC, without the use of Hiraishin. Read Gai's panel vs Obito and tell me where is Naruto or Bee. Gai was all by himself when he fought Obito in that particular scenario. No help, no assistance. And lasted longer than even KCM Naruto using clones, who was also being ragdolled by Kamui in two panels.



JiraiyaFlash said:


> Well actually not.



Argue context in the first fight, but I can bring panels of Gai getting further than Minato in Taijutsu.



JiraiyaFlash said:


> He chained cuz Obito was intangible. And Minato's fighting style is about being able to take risks cuz of Hirashin (like Tobirama). İf wouldnt've have that he probably aproach in other way. Thats nothing about "panelled by someone". Mİnato also concerning about his kid, dying wife and rampaging 9 Tails.
> 
> If you want panelling. Jiraiya one panelled Kisame and %30 of Kisame forced Gai to 6G . So 7G is not enough to close to gap since we know Minato >> Base J-Man >>Kisame > 6G Gai > %30 Kisame
> 
> So 7G not gonna put Gai over the top of this chain and made him superior than Minato. Also difference in reputation, track record, acheivements and portrayal supports this too.



I am pretty sure 7th gated Gai would destroy Minato, Jiraiya or Kisame in a Taijutsu fight. Which is what Gai used against Madara and is the entire subject of the debate. He doesn't need to close a gap, because it's Jiraiya, Minato or Kisame who needs to close it when it comes to Taijutsu.

Nobody is saying Gai is overall superior to Minato. We're talking about Taijutsu. When Madara is so powerful that Hiraishin is useless and MInato is cornered to Taijutsu the moment he teleports, who do you think would do better? Minato's Taijutsu or 7th Gated Gai's Taijutsu?


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## Crimson Flam3s (Nov 5, 2019)

Lol people still mad that Gai, a Taijutsu expert further boosted by the 7G, is much better than Minato a blindside expert, in Taijutsu. 

SM boost means nothing when Minato himself says it's trash.

This is the problem people have with Gai's feat vs Madara. Their expectations of Minato's performance didn't match the reality, but the answer as to why, is obvious.


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## JiraiyaFlash (Nov 5, 2019)

LostSelf said:


> in Taijutsu.





LostSelf said:


> comes to Taijutsu.





LostSelf said:


> We're talking about Taijutsu.



I'm quoting the op.


jesusus said:


> Standard Rules:
> 
> IC
> Canon Intel
> ...


This match not base on only Taijutsu.



LostSelf said:


> Nobody is saying Gai is overall superior to Minato.


Some of'em implied.

And ı never compared Minato and Gai in taijutsu and thats stupid. 

But general superiority =/= being superior at some departments and cqc =/= taijutsu. Taijutsu a part of cqc but not all of it.

So all argue over taijutsu kinda moot. The topic is not about that and ı wasnt talking about that either.


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## Serene Grace (Nov 5, 2019)

Minato would win. Hirudora and Asa serve no purpose here other then being redirected back to Guy, while some make the argument that he can destroy Minato’s kunais, Guy can’t destroy Minato’s FTG tags meaning Minato’s maneuverability won’t be hindered in the slightest

Minato physically reacted to V2 A4 at almost point blank range, the argument that 7 gated guy can blitz him, especially while he’s in SM is a joke. His feats against Madara hardly tell anything given Madara was in fact holding back, tho even if we choose to be bias and ignore all the context of a situation we have Minato physically reacting to the faster 8 gated guy

At worst guy gets outlasted, this stuff was cute before, but now it’s just getting ridiculous

Off topc; I said I was leaving but I’m bored lol, no point in just dropping a hobby that I’ve been doing for years so why not

Reactions: Like 2


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## Crimson Flam3s (Nov 5, 2019)

Cherry said:


> His feats against Madara hardly tell anything given Madara was in fact holding back



What suggest Madara was holding back on Gai anymore than he was holding back against SM Minato which he decimated in an instant?

But that doesn't tell us anything... 

Right.


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## Serene Grace (Nov 5, 2019)

Crimson Flam3s said:


> What suggest Madara was holding back on Gai anymore than he was holding back against SM Minato which he decimated in an instant?
> 
> But that doesn't tell us anything...
> 
> Right.


Guy out performed Minato simply due to being superior to him in Taijutsu

We know Madara was holding back given he didn’t even use Limbo against guy, not to mention before Guy attacked him Madara felt insulted that Guy didn’t use the red aura

We also know 7 gated guys speed wasn’t the suprise for him given he reacted to 8 gated guy right after

While I agree Minato got outperformed in that scenario, it wouldn’t really translate to his fight here with Minato

Reactions: Like 1


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## WorldsStrongest (Nov 5, 2019)

The fuck is this thread doing still open?

BASE MINATO can solo BOTH MASTERS 

SM Minato vs just Gai?

Joke thread

Should be locked by now


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## Crimson Flam3s (Nov 5, 2019)

Cherry said:


> Guy out performed Minato simply due to being superior to him in Taijutsu



Which is the whole point, Minato has to close in on CQC to deliver the final blow against someone who can fire off a Hirudora in base, at the last sec while drained by the GoD tree. 



> We know Madara was holding back given he didn’t even use Limbo against guy, not to mention before Guy attacked him Madara felt insulted that Guy didn’t use the red aura



Madara not using one of his strongest techniques doesn't mean much, Shinobi rarely do so off the bat, and Madara certainly showed that tendency during the WA, however my question is geared towards what suggests he took Gai less serious than Minato, why did he just not kill him ouright or cut his arms off if it was that easy? 



> We also know 7 gated guys speed wasn’t the suprise for him given he reacted to 8 gated guy right after



Not really, he was on the defensive and getting overwhelmed against 8G Taijutsu, while 7G put Gai on a level where he was able to briefly stand up to Madara in Taijutsu. 

[/QUOTE] While I agree Minato got outperformed in that scenario, it wouldn’t really translate to his fight here with Minato[/QUOTE]

I believe I explained why above, Minato's tendency  to enter CQC for the final blow can cost him.

However you don't seem to be arguing that Madara went easier on Gai than he did vs Minato which was my main point lol

Many believe otherwise but I just don't see what's so unbelievable about a Taijutsu expert looking better than someone who specializes in blindsides and who's SM is self admittedly trash.


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## ShinAkuma (Nov 5, 2019)

WorldsStrongest said:


> The fuck is this thread doing still open?
> 
> BASE MINATO can solo BOTH MASTERS
> 
> ...



It's painful....

....and mindblowing.....

....and expected....

Can you expect something and be mindblown simultaneously?


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## Grinningfox (Nov 5, 2019)

ShinAkuma said:


> It's painful....
> 
> ....and mindblowing.....
> 
> ...


I’m starting to think you might have a point about the masters fans


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## ShinAkuma (Nov 5, 2019)

Grinningfox said:


> I’m starting to think you might have a point about the masters fans



I would never steer you wrong.

Trust in the ShinAkuma.


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## Trojan (Nov 6, 2019)

Crimson Flam3s said:


> is much better than Minato a blindside expert, in Taijutsu.


it was not a blindside attack tho, Minato attacked him from the front.  


Crimson Flam3s said:


> This is the problem people have with Gai's feat vs Madara. Their expectations of Minato's performance didn't match the reality, but the answer as to why, is obvious.


it wouldn't matter anyway. Gai's attacks are not that strong... 
judging from his feats...


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## Crimson Flam3s (Nov 6, 2019)

Hussain said:


> it was not a blindside attack tho, Minato attacked him from the front.



Which is why he got slaughtered. 

Even a blindside wouldn't have much of a difference as Tobirama showed. 




> it wouldn't matter anyway. Gai's attacks are not that strong...
> judging from his feats...



Strong relative to God tiers? Sure.


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## Username (Nov 6, 2019)

Even though he sucks at using sage mode probably still Minato because he outplayed A who's imo on a higher physical level than 7 gate guy


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## Trojan (Nov 6, 2019)

Crimson Flam3s said:


> Strong relative to God tiers? Sure.


his strongest punch is weaker than Zetsu's naked arm by feats, no? 

his first punch only managed to break Asspulldara's horn. 
Sakura's punch destroyed Kaguya's horn (which is bigger than Asspulldara's )
Boruto's Rasengan destroyed Urashiki's horn.

So, it's not something out of the ordinary...  

Of course, that's based on feats that we have seen... U_U


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