# The Matrix: Resurrections (December 22, 2021)



## dr_shadow (Aug 20, 2019)

*Keanu Reeves is set to return to the world of The Matrix with a fourth chapter now officially confirmed.*

Lana Wachowski, who created the franchise with sister Lilly, will also return as director along with original cast member Carrie Ann-Moss.

“Many of the ideas Lilly and I explored 20 years ago about our reality are even more relevant now,” Wachowski said in a statement. “I’m very happy to have these characters back in my life and grateful for another chance to work with my brilliant friends.”

The script is co-written by Wachowski alongside the sci-fi novelists Aleksandar Hemon and David Mitchell.

This year marks the 20th anniversary of the original Matrix, which told the story of hacker Neo and his discovery that the world was in fact a simulated reality. It was a surprise hit, making more than $460m worldwide and launching two sequels, The Matrix Reloaded and The Matrix Revolutions. The franchise combined has made more than $1.6bn.

Rumours of a new film have been circulating since 2017, with Michael B Jordan then touted as a lead. Earlier this year, Lilly Wachowski gave any new iteration her blessing. “I like it when stories go out into the world and then come back to you in different ways,” she said to Slash Film. “I mean, that’s what storytelling is all about. I’m part of a bigger thing. I don’t have any ownership over stuff like that, so whatever story anybody wants to tell, I can’t wait to hear. I hope it’s better than the original.”

Since the original trilogy, the Wachowskis have had a number of commercial disappointments, including Speed Racer, Cloud Atlas and Jupiter Ascending. Their Netflix show Sense8 was cancelled after two seasons.

This summer, Reeves scored a global hit with John Wick: Chapter 3 – Parabellum making more than $320m worldwide. He will next be seen in a long awaited Bill & Ted sequel. Sources tell Variety that the latest Matrix film will start production in 2020.

https://www.theguardian.com/film/20...4-keanu-reeves-carrie-ann-moss-lana-wachowski


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 20, 2019)

Other news outlets were saying that it would be a reboot. Hopefully not.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 20, 2019)




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## dr_shadow (Aug 20, 2019)

Surprised that Moss is in it, since Trinity's death seemed pretty definitive.

But I guess the Machines could have recovered her body and patched her up, if they wanted to. If in the year 2199 medical science has progressed enough that they can safely install all those implants, being impaled by metal beams is probably no more cause for alarm than a twisted ankle.

We can get a pretentious line about how "the human body is just a machine made of flesh, and can be repaired just like any other machine." 

Or it's a new character that just happens to look like Trinity, like either a clone or a program made in her image.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Fang (Aug 20, 2019)

>Matrix 4
>from post-transition Wachowski "brothers"

God please no


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## MartialHorror (Aug 20, 2019)

Keep in mind that reboot doesn't necessarily mean remake. "Jurassic World" is technically a reboot.


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## MartialHorror (Aug 20, 2019)

Hopefully it's awesome, but I wasn't crazy about either of the sequels... nor anything the Wachowski's have done since then. I do respect them a lot, as even their failures are interesting in their own way. They are definitely visionaries, so I do hope they can make it work.


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## Karma (Aug 20, 2019)

This will be all style and no substance at best tbh


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## Mider T (Aug 20, 2019)

Wait, both of the Wachowskis are trans?!


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Aug 20, 2019)

Moss in this but not in Wick.
Fishburne in Wick but not this. 

I just want to see all 3 of them together on screen again before something like what happens to the Star Wars trio happens.



Fang said:


> >Anything
> >from post-Animatrix Wachowski "brothers"
> 
> God please no



Fixed

Reactions: Like 1


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## dr_shadow (Aug 20, 2019)

They'd better get Yuen Woo-ping (74) back as action choreographer.

Even if his record in recent years hasn't been that impressive.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 20, 2019)

Fang said:


> >Matrix 4
> >from post-transition Wachowski "brothers"
> 
> God please no





Mider T said:


> Wait, both of the Wachowskis are trans?!



I'd say the directors' gender identities is a textbook case of *completely irrelevant, *unless there's reason to believe they'd let it negatively affect the movie.

Wonder Woman and Captain Marvel were both directed by women, and I think we agree that one is much more obnoxious than the other.

I'd be more concerned that they're now 20 years older then when they did the original trilogy, which recalls George Lucas returning to Star Wars.  They're not going to be the same people anymore.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 20, 2019)

I hope the title is literally "The Matrix Rebooted".

Reactions: Like 1


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## Fang (Aug 20, 2019)

Mider T said:


> Wait, both of the Wachowskis are trans?!



Yeah the rumor was that one of the brothers was in a deeply dsyfunctional relationship with some S&M mistress and got him into hardcore drugs and then he and his brother snowballed from there into a bunch of clubbing and drug scenes before transitioning early on in the early 2000s, at least with Larry.



> What they want to know is what's going on with Larry, and since 2001 that's been a very juicy tale indeed. According to a long, prurient piece in Rolling Stone in 2006, this was the year Larry first met Ilsa Strix (aka Karin Winslow), a dominatrix from San Francisco famed not just for a string of videos with titles like Transsexual Extreme 2, Mistress Ilsa's Toe Slave and Behind The Whip but for inserting 333 needles into a client's penis at one sitting. Larry and Ilsa got along famously, so much so that Ilsa left her husband, female-to-male porn star Buck Angel ("The Man With A Pussy"), and Larry left his wife, childhood sweetheart Thea Bloom, starting a bitter, $30,000-a-month divorce. But whether Larry is still with Ilsa is unknown, even though he paraded her at the 2003 Cannes film festival, and it seems Ms Strix is enigmatic in her own right ("Infamous, ravishing, retired," teases her website).


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## MShadows (Aug 20, 2019)

This is a reboot? Not a sequel? 

When will these idiots finally leave legendary franchises alone? It's clear from almost all modern reboots that they'll butcher everything up. 

I love Keanu and I'm sure that he'll do an amazing job regardless, but was this really needed?


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## dr_shadow (Aug 20, 2019)

MShadows said:


> This is a reboot? Not a sequel?



If Keanu and Carrie-Anne are in it, it's 99% sure to be set in the same continuity as the original trilogy.

Likely ~20 years later, since that's how much the actors have aged.

They're probably saying it will be a "soft reboot" the way Star Trek (2009) or The Force Awakens were, i.e. set in the same continuity but with a very stand-alone story that new Chinese viewers can broadly understand without having seen the previous films.


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## MShadows (Aug 20, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> If Keanu and Carrie-Anne are in it, it's 99% sure to be set in the same continuity as the original trilogy.
> 
> Likely ~20 years later, since that's how much the actors have aged.
> 
> They're probably saying it will be a "soft reboot" the way Star Trek (2009) or The Force Awakens were, i.e. set in the same continuity but a very stand-alone story that new Chinese viewers can broadly understand without having seen the previous films.


So is Neo still blind? Kappa


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## dr_shadow (Aug 20, 2019)

MShadows said:


> So is Neo still blind? Kappa



Neo is still *dead*, as far as we know. 

We don't know any plot details at all, so it's anyone's guess how they're resurrecting him, but I'd assume they're fixing his eyes while they're at it.


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## ~Gesy~ (Aug 20, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> Neo is still *dead*, as far as we know.
> 
> We don't know any plot details at all, so it's anyone's guess how they're resurrecting him, but I'd assume they're fixing his eyes while they're at it.



"Will we ever see him again?"
"I suspect so....someday"

Reactions: Like 1


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## dr_shadow (Aug 20, 2019)

My guideline for guesstimating what the plot might be is that the original trilogy was obviously modelled both on the Hero's Journey and the lives of various religious saviour figures. Most overtly Jesus and the Buddha.

Since we ended on Neo's death, a new film featuring Reeves should obviously be about some variation of the Second Coming. With probably some elements of the future  mixed in.

Something I pitched in the other thread was to do an interpretation of the strange post-Jesus development of Christianity. As we know the Messiah was prophesized to be the saviour of the Jews from foreign oppression. Yet when he showed up the Jewish clergy colluded with the Romans to have him executed. And then some centuries later it was in fact the_ Romans_ who adopted Christianity as their official religion (mixed in with heavy doses of pre-Christian culture), and used it as a battering ram to continue oppressing the Jews.

So what if years after Neo's death, it's actually the_ Machines_ who have become the most zealous followers of "Neoism," and use it as a pretext to dominate humanity again? Like, maybe in their interpretation the Gospel of Neo is actually the literal unity of Man and Machine (i.e. cybernetics), and that anybody who wishes to remain either completely biological or completely mechanical is a luddite heathen?


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## dr_shadow (Aug 20, 2019)

My brother points out that they'd better get Juno Reactor back to do the score.


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## Atlas (Aug 20, 2019)

Oh, baby. Give me more Keanu!


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## MartialHorror (Aug 20, 2019)

I'm not going to lie, I had completely forgotten that Neo and Trinity were dead... and I've mostly forgotten "Revolutions".


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## Shiba D. Inu (Aug 21, 2019)




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## Mider T (Aug 21, 2019)

Fang said:


> Yeah the rumor was that one of the brothers was in a deeply dsyfunctional relationship with some S&M mistress and got him into hardcore drugs and then he and his brother snowballed from there into a bunch of clubbing and drug scenes before transitioning early on in the early 2000s, at least with Larry.


The secrets of Hollywood are fascinating.  I wonder what spurred this interest? Or was it just always lying dormant inside of him?


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## Magnum Miracles (Aug 21, 2019)

Why is the world so obsessed with bringing the 90s back?


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## dr_shadow (Aug 21, 2019)

Magnum Miracles said:


> Why is the world so obsessed with bringing the 90s back?



Because those of us who grew up in the 90's are now in our 30's and have disposable incomes that can be put towards nostalgic movie tickets.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 21, 2019)

MartialHorror said:


> I'm not going to lie, I had completely forgotten that Neo and Trinity were dead... and I've mostly forgotten "Revolutions".



I think Morpheus is the only character from the first film who is still alive by the end of Revolutions. And the Oracle, albeit in a new body. 

(Tank died off-screen between the original and Reloaded, of unspecified causes. I think the Wachowskis had some kind of falling-out with the actor)


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Aug 21, 2019)

To celebrate, here's the best short from the Animatrix:


Loved The 2nd Reinsurance, Detective Story and Beyond a lot too.


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## Zeta42 (Aug 21, 2019)

Will Hugo Weaving be in it? If not, I'm not watching.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 21, 2019)

Zeta42 said:


> Will Hugo Weaving be in it? If not, I'm not watching.



His character is dead and he's not been announced as returning, so likely not.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 21, 2019)

To anybody asking questions, I think the OP article contains all the hard info we have.

* There's a new Matrix movie coming.

* One of the Wachowskis is directing.

* Reeves and Moss will be in it. (So most likely Neo and Trinity will be in it, but you never know. Could also be new characters that just look like Neo & Trinity) 

* It behinds shooting in 2020. (So est. release 2021?)

Anything beyond that is just speculation and rumor.


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## Overwatch (Aug 21, 2019)

The Second Renaissance still gives me nightmares.

Reactions: Like 2


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## dr_shadow (Aug 21, 2019)

Reeves' character could potentially have been the seventh "One", and this movie could have been set centuries after the other three.

But since Moss is in it, and Trinity likely doesn't reincarnate (the Architect says the first five Ones didn't have love interests), he's probably still playing the sixth One, viz. Neo, and we're still in the same generation as before.

We don't know if all Ones have the physical appearance of "Thomas Anderson", but it hasn't been ruled out since we haven't seen the others.


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## Magnum Miracles (Aug 21, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> Because those of us who grew up in the 90's are now in our 30's and have disposable incomes that can be put towards nostalgic movie tickets.


Just watch Dragonball Super instead.


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## ~VK~ (Aug 21, 2019)

movie should be rebooted but with will smith instead so i can finally put that "what if" scenario to rest


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## ~VK~ (Aug 21, 2019)

Morpheus: "The Matrix is everywhere, it is all around us. Even now, in this very room. You can see it when you look out your window, or when you turn on your television. You can feel it when you go to work, or when go to church or when you pay your taxes. It is the world that has been pulled over your eyes to blind you from the truth."

Neo: "Y'all jokers must be craaazyyy!"


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## ~Gesy~ (Aug 21, 2019)

I like Will..But the right guy got the role.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~VK~ (Aug 21, 2019)

there should be a wild wild west reboot starring keanu for good measure too 

complete with keanu making a wild wild west song too


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## GRIMMM (Aug 21, 2019)

Movie starts with Neo waking up in his room 20 years later, remembering his dream of taking the blue pill and going back to work.


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## Zeta42 (Aug 21, 2019)

GRIMMM said:


> Movie starts with Neo waking up in his room 20 years later, remembering his dream of taking the blue pill and going back to work.


Oh yeah, what if this movie takes place in an alternate universe where Neo took the blue pill? That could work.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Jake CENA (Aug 21, 2019)

please be Rated R


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## dr_shadow (Aug 21, 2019)

For those who are interested:

* Keanu Reeves was 35 in the first movie and is now 55. 

* Carrie-Anne Moss was 32 and is now 52. 

* Laurence Fishburne was 38 and is now 58.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Deathbringerpt (Aug 22, 2019)

Not like this...not like this.


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## Canute87 (Aug 22, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> I'd say the directors' gender identities is a textbook case of *completely irrelevant, *unless there's reason to believe they'd let it negatively affect the movie.
> 
> Wonder Woman and Captain Marvel were both directed by women, and I think we agree that one is much more obnoxious than the other.
> 
> I'd be more concerned that they're now 20 years older then when they did the original trilogy, which recalls George Lucas returning to Star Wars.  They're not going to be the same people anymore.



It's like when they did godfather 3 so far ahead of god father 2.

Ever body changed and pacino just wasn't the same like he was in the two movies in terms of character.


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## Deathbringerpt (Aug 22, 2019)

They haven't done a single decent movie since Cloud Atlas. Everything since has been complete garbage. Why the hell are people hyped for this? The story's fucking done. The Matrix universe is even more fucking limited than Star Wars. Animatrix already squeezed all the possible creative juice the setting has.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 22, 2019)

Freeway chase in Reloaded still possibly the greatest action scene of all time?

Reactions: Like 1


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## reiatsuflow (Aug 22, 2019)

They overdid the color grading too. The first matrix had a slightly green tint to the matrix simulation, but the wachowskis upped it for each movie. I guess they wanted to make the matrix look more and more unreal as the movies went on, but that kind of play characterizes a lot of the wachowskis later movies; a fun conceptual idea that doesn't really execute and is more annoying than interesting or fun. imo

Reactions: Like 1


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Aug 22, 2019)

Deathbringerpt said:


> They hWhy the hell are people hyped for this? The story's fucking done. The Matrix universe is even more fucking limited than Star Wars. Animatrix already squeezed all the possible creative juice the setting has.



At this point, it's just accepting the inevitable that it is happening and crossing our collective fingers and hoping for the best.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 22, 2019)




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## dr_shadow (Aug 22, 2019)

Any reason why they're not getting Bill Pope, the cinematographer of the original trilogy?

I'm hoping they can re-constitute as much of the original crew as possible. Like, even get the same caterer to cook the lunch boxes, if you can.


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## Clowe (Aug 23, 2019)

Maybe the machines preserved Neo and Trinity's counsciousness,  and now exist only digitally within The Matrix?

There's a lot of angles they could take to keep those characters tbh.


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## reiatsuflow (Aug 23, 2019)

I bet the action scenes won't even be john wick level.


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## Zeta42 (Aug 24, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> For those who are interested:
> 
> * Keanu Reeves was 35 in the first movie and is now 55.
> 
> ...


The Matrix is 20 years old? Jesus Christ.
Well, little wonder here since it had all those old computers, but I'm just surprised the first movie came out when I was only 8 years old.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 1, 2019)

They've apparently re-released the original in theaters.

But seems to be only in the US, as it's exclusive to something called "Dolby Cinema" that I've never heard of.

More confused by why they're doing it in September rather than for the actual 20th anniversary.


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## ~VK~ (Sep 1, 2019)

i hope they use that same deaging technology they used on sam jackson in cap marvel on trinity cause that woman aged like fine milk. 

the vampire keanu has no need for it tho.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Sep 25, 2019)



Reactions: Like 1


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## Mider T (Sep 26, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> But seems to be only in the US, as it's exclusive to something called "Dolby Cinema" that I've never heard of.


Tbh I only watch action movies in Dolby 5.1 now, and space movies in IMAX.


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## Comic Book Guy (Sep 26, 2019)

Very ambitious.

Like _Jupiter Ascending_ ambitious?

We all know how that turned out for Mila Kunis.


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## Mider T (Oct 10, 2019)




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## Sennin of Hardwork (Oct 15, 2019)



Reactions: Like 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Oct 15, 2019)

Good choice.

He got a "matrix" face


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## dr_shadow (Oct 16, 2019)

Remember he was in Starship Troopers (1997).


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## Mider T (Oct 16, 2019)

Didn't realize he was going gray.


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## Swarmy (Oct 16, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> Remember he was in Starship Troopers (1997).


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## Mider T (Oct 16, 2019)

Jada Pinkett in talks to return.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Oct 16, 2019)




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## Mider T (Oct 16, 2019)

Big booty Judy

Reactions: Like 1


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## Amol (Oct 17, 2019)

What do you think went wrong after first Matrix movie? 
Like where do you guys think franchise should have gone after first movie? 
Personally I think techno babble became utterly nonsensical after first movie. Like that Architecture and Neo talk. 
First movie was easy to understand to your average joe.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Dec 9, 2019)

Did not expect this casting.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 9, 2019)

I like him


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## Mider T (Dec 9, 2019)

Amol said:


> What do you think went wrong after first Matrix movie?
> Like where do you guys think franchise should have gone after first movie?
> Personally I think techno babble became utterly nonsensical after first movie. Like that Architecture and Neo talk.
> First movie was easy to understand to your average joe.


Seems pretty simple to me


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## Magnum Miracles (Dec 9, 2019)

Revolutions is where everything went off the rails.


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## dr_shadow (Dec 9, 2019)

Sennin of Hardwork said:


> Did not expect this casting.



He's got to be playing an Agent, right?


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Dec 10, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> He's got to be playing an Agent, right?



You could be onto something.


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## epyoncloud (Dec 11, 2019)

it'll end like terminator


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 11, 2019)




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## Mider T (Dec 11, 2019)

I don't know.


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## Mider T (Dec 11, 2019)

We have a date.  May 21, 2021.  @Sennin of Hardwork let's get that updated please.


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## dr_shadow (Dec 11, 2019)

Mider T said:


> We have a date.  May 21, 2021.  @Sennin of Hardwork let's get that updated please.



I could too since it's my thread.


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## Mider T (Dec 11, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> I could too since it's my thread.


That works too 

By the way this means that presently Doctor Strange 2, Matrix, Pixar, Jurassic World 3, Batman, Spider-Man, Mission Impossible,  Suicide Squad 2, and John Wick 4 are all positioned to release during Summer 2021.  Some of this movies will be moved because of competition, most notably John Wick 4 which is scheduled to open on the same day(!) as Matrix 4.


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## Mider T (Dec 11, 2019)

Jan: Mortal Kombat (WB)
Feb: Shang-Chi (DIS)
Mar: Untitled DIS Live-Action (rumored Little Mermaid), Tomb Raider 2 (UAR)
Apr: Fast&Furious 10 (UNI)
May: Doctor Strange 2 (DIS), John Wick Ch. 4 (LGS), Matrix 4 (WB)
Jun: Jurassic World 3 (UNI), Untitled Pixar (DIS), The Batman (WB)
Jul: Indiana Jones 5 (DIS), Space Jam 2 (WB), Spiderman 3 (SNY), Mission Impossible 7 (PAR)
Aug: The Suicide Squad (WB)
Nov: Thor 4 (DIS), Fantastic Beast 3 (WB), Untitled WDAS (DIS)
Dec: Avatar 2 (DIS), Black Adam (WB)


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## Comic Book Guy (Dec 12, 2019)

*ON THE SAME F'ING DAY?!*

*DO THEY WANT TO NOT GET AS MUCH MONEY AS POSSIBLE?! WTF ARE THEY THINKING*


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Jan 12, 2020)

Seems an actor from Sense8, a previous work from the Wachowski, has joined the cast.


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## Amol (Jan 12, 2020)

Yeah dates are going to get changed in future.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Jan 17, 2020)




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## Sennin of Hardwork (Jan 21, 2020)




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## Mider T (Jan 21, 2020)

How busy could Hugo Weaving possibly be these days?


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## dr_shadow (Jan 22, 2020)

Mider T said:


> How busy could Hugo Weaving possibly be these days?



I think it's him politely saying he's done with this character and doesn't want to be in it. Otherwise I'm sure he could have made time, or Matrix could even have delayed shooting to accommodate him.


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## James Bond (Jan 22, 2020)

Tbh the last film kind of wrapped up Agent Smith's story anyway but a cameo would be nice.


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## dr_shadow (Jan 22, 2020)

James Bond said:


> Tbh the last film kind of wrapped up Agent Smith's story anyway but a cameo would be nice.



Agreed. Brining back Smith would be a little bit like bringing back Palpatine in Star Wars. The world of The Matrix is so complex that it would seem weird if there's only ever one villain.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Toph (Feb 5, 2020)

Matrix 4 already has a lot to prove because the ones that came after the first movie were mediocre at best and subpar at worst. Luckily, David Mitchell is attached writing the screenplay instead of the Wachowskis writing it themselves as he's a far better writer than they are, one of the greatest novelists alive; and it was their writing in part that let the other sequels down. I doubt it'll be as anticipating Tenet will probably be, but it doesn't sound like a disaster at least.


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## epyoncloud (May 2, 2020)

Laurence fishburne is not going to be in Matrix, only keanu and carrie

maybe merge john wick and matrix into one movie


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## Deathbringerpt (May 2, 2020)

They just hired the stuntmen directors of the trilogy to help them out with the fight scenes of the move.

You know, the guys who became globally known directors after making a trilogy of their own, John Wick.


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## Mider T (May 2, 2020)

epyoncloud said:


> Laurence fishburne is not going to be in Matrix, only keanu and carrie


Source?


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## Magnum Miracles (May 2, 2020)

Deathbringerpt said:


> They just hired the stuntmen directors of the trilogy to help them out with the fight scenes of the move.
> 
> You know, the guys who became globally known directors after making a trilogy of their own, John Wick.


At the least the action sequences will be crisp then. The story will more than likely be ass.


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## epyoncloud (May 20, 2020)

Mider T said:


> Source?


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## BlueDemon (May 20, 2020)

Wait, WHAT?! How come am I just getting to know about this now?!

Also, whyyyyyyyyyyy!?!?!!!!!!11111111


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## BlueDemon (May 20, 2020)

Mider T said:


> The Batman (WB)


No thread for this? Who's going to be the new Batman?

Damn I'm so behind on all the up-coming movies.


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## Mider T (May 20, 2020)

BlueDemon said:


> No thread for this? Who's going to be the new Batman?
> 
> Damn I'm so behind on all the up-coming movies.


There is a thread for it.


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## Magnum Miracles (May 20, 2020)

Just get Morgan Freeman instead.


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## Toph (Aug 5, 2020)



Reactions: Like 1


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## BlueDemon (Aug 6, 2020)

I forgot about this, got a new notification about the thread and my reaction was the same as this 



BlueDemon said:


> Wait, WHAT?! How come am I just getting to know about this now?!
> 
> Also, whyyyyyyyyyyy!?!?!!!!!!11111111


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## Mael (Aug 7, 2020)

Stupid idea...almost as stupid as Terminator Dark Fate.


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## Overwatch (Aug 7, 2020)

I have this weird obsession with the pre-war Matrix world...

I’d like to see more glimpses of that if possible.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Mael (Aug 7, 2020)

Overwatch said:


> I have this weird obsession with the pre-war Matrix world...
> 
> I’d like to see more glimpses of that if possible.


Basically fat, lazy humans caused robot uprisings.

Meh.

Also, is Matrix 4 going to have some shitty metaphor for how the pills indicate gender choice?


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## Overwatch (Aug 7, 2020)

Mael said:


> Basically fat, lazy humans caused robot uprisings.
> 
> Meh.
> 
> Also, is Matrix 4 going to have some shitty metaphor for how the pills indicate gender choice?



Yeah, I watched The Second Renaissance when I was 12 and it left me scarred. 

Maybe I’m a masochist...


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## Mael (Aug 7, 2020)

Overwatch said:


> Yeah, I watched The Second Renaissance when I was 12 and it left me scarred.
> 
> Maybe I’m a masochist...


Well the battle scenes were pretty rough even though it was hard to tell exactly what was chronologically going on.

Second Renaissance did pretty much tell me how automation is a bad thing and that humans need to work.


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## Overwatch (Aug 7, 2020)

The message was that humans should stop being such twats. 

And that the UN shouldn’t be entrusted with running a petting zoo.


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## Mael (Aug 7, 2020)

Overwatch said:


> The message was that humans should stop being such twats.
> 
> And that the UN shouldn’t be entrusted with running a petting zoo.


Oh I thought the message was that humans need to actually work so they don't become lazy and complacent.

And also the UN is again worthless in everything it does.


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## Mider T (Aug 8, 2020)

Mael said:


> Oh I thought the message was that humans need to actually work so they don't become lazy and complacent.
> 
> And also the UN is again worthless in everything it does.


Has there been a World War since 1945?


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## Mael (Aug 8, 2020)

Mider T said:


> Has there been a World War since 1945?


Lol thinking the UN took care of that.

No, it was Mutually Assured Destruction that did.  Mider don't step into subject matters you know little about.


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## BlueDemon (Aug 8, 2020)

Mael said:


> Lol thinking the UN took care of that.
> 
> No, it was Mutually Assured Destruction that did.  Mider don't step into subject matters you know little about.


Neither should you, maybe. UN isn't the most efficient, but it certainly isn't worthless.
And MAD is still as much a theory as is institutionalism.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Mael (Aug 8, 2020)

BlueDemon said:


> Neither should you, maybe. UN isn't the most efficient, but it certainly isn't worthless.
> And MAD is still as much a theory as is institutionalism.


Yeah right now the UN is worthless and has rather been since after the 60s.


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## BlueDemon (Aug 8, 2020)

Mael said:


> Yeah right now the UN is worthless and has rather been since after the 60s.


I'm giving that to you at least. It's quite inefficient nowadays, especially when it comes to the SC. But there are many more agencies that have accomplished quite a bit and I wouldn't disregard that.


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## Mider T (Aug 8, 2020)

Mael said:


> Lol thinking the UN took care of that.
> 
> No, it was Mutually Assured Destruction that did.  Mider don't step into subject matters you know little about.


Lol MAD took care of a nuclear war, only the great powers have nukes.  That doesn't mean World War couldn't have popped off.

Reactions: Like 1


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## hcheng02 (Aug 12, 2020)



Reactions: Like 1


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## Mider T (Aug 17, 2020)

California legalized ballot harvesting


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## Deathbringerpt (Aug 18, 2020)

And don't bring Agent Smith while you're at it. Expand the universe instead of bringing a cast of literal seniors in your kung fu action movie.


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## BlueDemon (Aug 18, 2020)

Mider T said:


> block an ultra-super-sized Butterfly Chouji's Butterfly Bomb


So the reason is he wasn't invited 
Also, Matrix Online continued the story?


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Oct 5, 2020)

New release date.


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## Suigetsu (Oct 18, 2020)

mr_shadow said:


> I'd say the directors' gender identities is a textbook case of *completely irrelevant, *unless there's reason to believe they'd let it negatively affect the movie.
> 
> Wonder Woman and Captain Marvel were both directed by women, and I think we agree that one is much more obnoxious than the other.
> 
> I'd be more concerned that they're now 20 years older then when they did the original trilogy, which recalls George Lucas returning to Star Wars.  They're not going to be the same people anymore.


WW and CP are trash.
Matrix 1 was the only good one.
Wachoskies are one trick ponies that lucked out because they copied Ghost in the shell, they havent made a single good movie ever since.


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## dr_shadow (Oct 18, 2020)

Suigetsu said:


> And now that they are manufactured freaks, heh.. I am staying away from this.



Reported.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## reiatsuflow (Oct 18, 2020)

Wachowskis fell off pretty quick with exception to cloud atlas. I hear sense 8 also has fans.


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## Deathbringerpt (Oct 18, 2020)

Cloud Atlas was still pretty good. I have 0 hope for this movie to be good. 



Suigetsu said:


> WW and CP are trash.
> Matrix 1 was the only good one.
> Wachoskies are one trick ponies that lucked out because they *copied Ghost in the shell*, they havent made a single good movie ever since.
> And now that they are manufactured freaks, heh.. I am staying away from this.



They copied the atmosphere of GitS, that's it. Matrix 1 is just an all around great movie in all the ways that matter, not just the way it presents itself.


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## Suigetsu (Oct 18, 2020)

Deathbringerpt said:


> Cloud Atlas was still pretty good. I have 0 hope for this movie to be good.
> 
> 
> 
> They copied the atmosphere of GitS, that's it. Matrix 1 is just an all around great movie in all the ways that matter, not just the way it presents itself.


"just copied the atmosphere" literally how? GITS is Cyberpunk whilst matrix isnt, it copied themes and ideas.

CA was boring pretentious mess IMO.


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## reiatsuflow (Oct 18, 2020)

Ghost in the shell has basically nothing to do with the matrix. I know what they said in interviews but they’re worlds apart.


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## reiatsuflow (Oct 18, 2020)

Also might as well

Blade technically had the first bullet time effects. 

not the ground breaking film techniques the wachowskis did Like where they set up cameras to take thousands of frames of shot so they could spin around the scene in ways a camera wouldn’t be able to, but just...the slo mo shot of seeing the actual bullets traveling through the air.


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## The World (Oct 18, 2020)

reiatsuflow said:


> Ghost in the shell has basically nothing to do with the matrix. I know what they said in interviews but they’re worlds apart.


you're an idiot



Suigetsu said:


> WW and CP are trash.
> Matrix 1 was the only good one.
> Wachoskies are one trick ponies that lucked out because they copied Ghost in the shell, they havent made a single good movie ever since.
> And now that they are manufactured freaks, heh.. I am staying away from this.


you're an idiot

Reactions: Like 1


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## reiatsuflow (Oct 18, 2020)

The World said:


> you're an idiot



You’re just saying that because I’m stupid.


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## Sunrider (Oct 18, 2020)

Mider T said:


> most notably John Wick 4 which is scheduled to open on the same day(!) as Matrix 4.


I never understand when studios play this game, almost feels like they're trying to tank one of them. 

The follow-up to a nearly-twenty-year-old property released on the same date as a newer, possibly hotter franchise?


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## Mider T (Oct 19, 2020)

Sunrider said:


> I never understand when studios play this game, almost feels like they're trying to tank one of them.
> 
> The follow-up to a nearly-twenty-year-old property released on the same date as a newer, possibly hotter franchise?


IiRC one of the dates got moved.


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## Suigetsu (Oct 25, 2020)

The World said:


> you're an idiot


Apply gently where it hurt you.


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## Parallax (Oct 25, 2020)

Suigetsu said:


> Apply gently where it hurt you.



well you're not an idiot but it wasn't ghost in the shell that was ripped off, it was The Invisibles


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Dec 3, 2020)

So, this and Dune, and every single Warner 2021 movie are getting Wonder Woman'd and getting released on HBO Max alongside theaters as well.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## BlueDemon (Dec 3, 2020)

Time to get HBO then.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 3, 2020)

EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! said:


> So, this and Dune, and every single Warner 2021 movie are getting Wonder Woman'd and getting released on HBO Max alongside theaters as well.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Funny 2 | Winner 1


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## Deathbringerpt (Dec 4, 2020)

I mean, who didn't see this coming?

It fucking sucks cause I miss going to the movies but yeah, whatever. Fuck it.


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## dr_shadow (Dec 4, 2020)

No word on international distribution though.  HBO Max currently isn't available outside North America.

In Sweden we have something called "HBO Nordic", but that was originally a vessel for the HBO TV network to stream their shows here. It wasn't designed to be a vehicle for the entire Warner empire (both film and TV), and hence HBO Nordic doesn't automatically have the distribution rights to Warner titles in Sweden.


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## BlueDemon (Dec 5, 2020)

Yeah, was wondering about that too. They'll go international if shit doesn't go back to normal soon-ish though.
These MOFOs probably donating millions to Pfizer right about now


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## dr_shadow (Dec 5, 2020)

If we use Avengers: Endgame (2019), the most successful movie of all time, as a reference point, it made 31% of its money in North America and 69% overseas. Which is broadly proportional to the United States being 25% of the global economy and the rest of the world being 75%.

For this reason I don't understand why these streaming services don't go for global rollout immediately. Most of the gold is to be found outside North America, but only Netflix, Amazon Prime, and Disney+ really have a significant overseas presence. Of the three, Disney+ is the only one where the streaming service is actually owned by the studio whose products it distributes, meaning you don't have the instability of titles abruptly vanishing when licensing agreements expire (as happens all the time on Netflix and Amazon).

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sunrider (Dec 5, 2020)

dr_shadow said:


> and 69% overseas


_Nice._

Reactions: Funny 1 | Lewd 1


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## dr_shadow (Dec 5, 2020)

Sunrider said:


> _Nice._

Reactions: Funny 1


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## dr_shadow (Dec 5, 2020)

Wiki says that principal photography actually wrapped on November 11, so The Matrix 4 isn't a pipe dream anymore - there is an actual movie out there somewhere. Albeit one with unfinished editing and special effects, which is what they're presumably working on now.


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## Mider T (Dec 5, 2020)

Sunrider said:


> _Nice._


Beat me to it

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## dr_shadow (Dec 5, 2020)

Sunrider said:


> _Nice._





Mider T said:


> Beat me to it



Midnight's Edge have made the bold claim that Endgame's box office record will _*never*_ be broken, because the think the movie theater industry as we know it has been killed by the pandemic. In the future blockbusters (if they are still made) will go straight to streaming, and streaming revenue is not counted into the "box office" as we have been quoting it up to now.

I'm not sure if I share the doomsday sentiment, but it's an interesting thought. It has happened in the past that technological innovation has locked in some record holders. For example, the inflation-adjusted box office record of _Gone with the Wind_ (1939) will likely never be broken, because the advent of home media in  the 1980's meant that movies generally don't get theatrical re-released every few years. Wiki says _Gone with the Wind_ was has had at least ten theatrical re-releases: in 1942, 1947, 1954, 1961, 1967, 1971, 1974, 1989, 1998, and most recently in 2014. I don't think Endgame will ever get that many, since it's conveniently on Disney+.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Informative 1


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## Karma (Dec 5, 2020)

Yea i doubt Endgame will ever be surpassed if the movie landscape shifts to streaming.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 5, 2020)

Endgame deserves it


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## Mider T (Jun 16, 2021)




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## Overwatch (Jun 16, 2021)

Ok, I’m too tired to tell. Is he taking the piss?


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## Charlotte D. Kurisu (Jun 18, 2021)

Reminds me of Jupiter Ascending


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## dr_shadow (Aug 25, 2021)

The title of the fourth installment of The Matrix series has been announced. The Matrix: Resurrections will be the first Matrix film since 2003’s The Matrix Revolutions supposedly concluded the story of Neo, Trinity, Morpheus, and the rest of the crew that had escaped the eponymous simulated reality. The trailer for the upcoming Matrix movie was also shown as part of Warner Bros.' panel at CinemaCon, which showcased a meeting between Neo and Trinity.

While little is known about the fourth Matrix film, we do know that the latest installment will be directed and co-written by Lana Wachowski, while Lilly Wachowski, who previously co-wrote and co-directed the first three films in the series, will not be involved. The film will also be co-written by The Lazarus Project writer Aleksandar Hemon, and David Mitchell, whose book Cloud Atlas was previously adapted into a film of the same name by the Wachowskis.

Also returning are Keanu Reeves as Neo, Carrie-Anne Moss as Trinity, Jada Pinkett Smith as Niobe, Lambert Wilson as The Merovingian, and Daniel Bernhardt as Agent Johnson. New additions to the cast in unknown roles are Yahya Abdul-Mateen II, Andrew Caldwell, Priyanka Chopra, Jonathan Groff, Neil Patrick Harris, Jessica Henwick, Ellen Hoffman, Eréndira Ibarra, Toby Onwumere, Max Reimelt, Christina Ricci, and Brian J. Smith.

Even though we don’t know the plot for The Matrix 4 yet, Reeves has stated previously that the film is a “love story,” and while there were rumors that time-travel might be a part of the upcoming installment, Reeves also stated, “There’ll be no going back into the past.”

With the title for this latest film in The Matrix series finally announced, hopefully, this will be just the start of more upcoming reveals, since the film is coming soon. The Matrix: Resurrections is scheduled to be released on December 22, in both theaters and on HBO Max.


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## OLK (Aug 25, 2021)

I do not have high hopes for this. Original Matrix worked because of the effects and the time it was released. The sequels never lived up to it


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## Amol (Aug 25, 2021)

I only liked the very first matrix movie.
The other two weren't that good.


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## MartialHorror (Aug 25, 2021)

Yeah, I'm skeptical, but curious.

I enjoyed the 2nd one, but it was really only for the action scenes. The 3rd one lost me.


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## Deathbringerpt (Aug 25, 2021)

MartialHorror said:


> Yeah, I'm skeptical, but curious.
> 
> I enjoyed the 2nd one, but it was really only for the action scenes. The 3rd one lost me.



Yeah, the 2nd started the full fucking stupid shlock but it still had some pretty cool ideas and setpieces. The third is bizarrely bad. No hope for this fourth one but hey, maybe we'll get some cool visuals and action here and there. That's about as much as I hope they'll get right.


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## BlueDemon (Aug 25, 2021)

Oh God. Why can't they just let some things rest. I mean, there are worse things than M3 in my opinion, but a fourth one can't be good. But hey, there's always hope.

Gotta watch the latest Terminator soon, so I can see yet another classic get fucked even more than it already was.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 25, 2021)

I remember that in the feature-length documentary _The Matrix: Revisited_ (2001), the Wachovskis said that the inception for the whole thing was that they had a friend who was in the comics industry, who had asked them to help come up with a concept for a new comic book. "We didn't have a concept for a comic book. But we tried to think of something, and ended up with... this."

While it ultimately morphed into a movie series, I think it's still apparent that The Matrix is ultimately about the *world *rather than specific characters like Neo or Morpheus. The concept of the world being a computer simulation is a framework ("matrix" ) that a number of unrelated comic book artists could have told their respective stories in, like how the Marvel and DC universes are backdrops for many largely self-contained story arcs rather than a continuous A-to-B plot.

If they keep to that mindset, I think there's hope for this franchise. Don't obsess over every entry having to contain Neo or every entry being an epic world-ending event like Revolutions.

They already toyed with the "Matrix Cinematic Universe" idea in the anthology film _The Animatrix_ (2003), but that was a series of nine shorts averaging only 10 minutes each. You could have potentially expanded the idea of each one into a feature-length movie, or at least an hour-long episode of a tv series.


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## Mider T (Aug 25, 2021)

Even Codename: Kids Next Door spoofed Animatrix.


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## MartialHorror (Aug 25, 2021)

The Wachowski's are interesting directors. I appreciate their imaginative ideas, but after "The Matrix", they stopped connecting -- at least to a broad audience. "Cloud Atlas", "Speed Racer" and "Jupiter Ascending" all have some value, but mostly as niche movies. Then the Matrix sequels seemed more designed to explore the filmmakers interests instead of what audiences want.

With "The Matrix 4", I would like to that at the absolute least, it will be... interesting in its own way, much like the above movies. Not without value, but alienatingly niche. But I'd also love a comeback. I got burned out on "The Matrix" after feeling like I was overexposed to it upon release, but I guess I should revisit them to prepare myself for the fourth.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## dr_shadow (Aug 25, 2021)

For completionists, the Matrix franchise consists of:

*1. The Matrix (1999)*
2. The Matrix Comics (1999-2004) [comic book, 2 collected volumes]
3. The Animatrix (2003)
*4. The Matrix: Reloaded (2003)*
5. Enter the Matrix (2003) [video game]
*6. The Matrix: Revolutions (2003)*
7. The Matrix: Path of Neo (2005) [video game]
8. The Matrix Online (2005-2009) [online video game, discontinued. Plot summary available ]


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## BlueDemon (Aug 25, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> I remember that in the feature-length documentary _The Matrix: Revisited_ (2001), the Wachovskis said that the inception for the whole thing was that they had a friend who was in the comics industry, who had asked them to help come up with a concept for a new comic book. "We didn't have a concept for a comic book. But we tried to think of something, and ended up with... this."
> 
> While it ultimately morphed into a movie series, I think it's still apparent that The Matrix is ultimately about the *world *rather than specific characters like Neo or Morpheus. The concept of the world being a computer simulation is a framework ("matrix" ) that a number of unrelated comic book artists could have told their respective stories in, like how the Marvel and DC universes are backdrops for many largely self-contained story arcs rather than a continuous A-to-B plot.
> 
> ...


But the problem is exactly that they've gone back to Neo instead of starting a new story...

Reactions: Agree 1


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## dr_shadow (Aug 25, 2021)

BlueDemon said:


> But the problem is exactly that they've gone back to Neo instead of starting a new story...



Yeah, not disputing that.

It took like 100 years from the death of the fifth "One" to the birth of Neo, so there's no reason why he should be back within anybody's lifetime. You can have an updated Prophecy as a plot point in the background, but we don't need to actually _see_ The One on screen again.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 25, 2021)

What I thought was dumb in Matrix 3 was that they explained Neo being able to use his powers outside the Matrix with him having some kind of wireless connection to The Source.



The better, and widely expected, explanation would have been that the "real" world was in fact -also- a simulation all along. That there's possibly layers and layers of Matrices wrapped around each other and that perhaps nobody knows how big that onion really is.

While you say that this concept has been done in other sci-fi stories, I think it would fit nicely into the religious-philosophical themes of the franchise. Indian religions love their absurdly large scales, so it would be completely in-character if there were 100,000 million Matrix layers, and in the end they're all just running as a background application on Vishnu's smartwatch.


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## BlueDemon (Aug 26, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> What I thought was dumb in Matrix 3 was that they explained Neo being able to use his powers outside the Matrix with him having some kind of wireless connection to The Source.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Agreed, but then humanity would never be able to make it out, would we? Also potential for unlimited films.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 26, 2021)

BlueDemon said:


> Agreed, but then humanity would never be able to make it out, would we? Also potential for unlimited films.



I don't think it's necessary that the story must have a "happy ending".  Dark City didn't. And arguably Matrix 3 didn't either – most of humanity still remains in the Matrix post-truce. 

We learned in Matrix 2 that, at any given time, only about 1% of people are mentally ready to be disconnected. If you abruptly disconnect the remaining 99% with no preparation, it's likely that they'll either die from the shock (Matrix 2) or end up insane (Matrix 1).


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## BlueDemon (Aug 26, 2021)

Yeah, that's true.

Doesn't mean you can't start preparing them!

In any case, curious to see what they cooked up for the 4th part.


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## Undertaker (Aug 28, 2021)

Matrix 4: John Wick's bogus journey.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Swarmy (Aug 31, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> What I thought was dumb in Matrix 3 was that they explained Neo being able to use his powers outside the Matrix with him having some kind of wireless connection to The Source.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Or you know, he might actually be a machine hybrid. Would explain how he can reincarnate with each iteration of the Matrix and still look the same even in the real world. I'm sure if the machines understand the human mind and brain well enough to jack us into the Matrix flawlessly and provide an almost perfect experience of what real life should be then they can easily build a synthetic human, not one of metal and silicone but flesh. They'll have Neo's consciousness not only continuously backed up but built in a wireless connection to the source with the addition or rather side effect of him being able to hack or mess up real life machines.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 31, 2021)

Swarmy said:


> Or you know, he might actually be a machine hybrid. Would explain how he can reincarnate with each iteration of the Matrix and still look the same even in the real world. I'm sure if the machines understand the human mind and brain well enough to jack us into the Matrix flawlessly and provide an almost perfect experience of what real life should be then they can easily build a synthetic human, not one of metal and silicone but flesh. They'll have Neo's consciousness not only continuously backed up but built in a wireless connection to the source with the addition or rather side effect of him being able to hack or mess up real life machines.



That's much less philosophically interesting, though.

The Matrix franchise is in part a platform for asking questions about the nature of reality, the nature of choice, and other such deep topics. But with a firefight thrown in every 20 minutes, so you don't fall asleep like you would in philosophy class.

There being multiple nested Matrices would open up the issue about whether there is an absolute "real" world, or if there are just degrees of "real-er" and "fake-er".

Reactions: Like 1


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## Swarmy (Aug 31, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> That's much less philosophically interesting, though.
> 
> The Matrix franchise is in part a platform for asking questions about the nature of reality, the nature of choice, and other such deep topics. But with a firefight thrown in every 20 minutes, so you don't fall asleep like you would in philosophy class.
> 
> There being multiple nested Matrices would open up the issue about whether there is an absolute "real" world, or if there are just degrees of "real-er" and "fake-er".


Unless you realise that means that there is still another Matrix, another tool for control just one in the real life. Why build multiple false realities when you can just infect reality itself with your own false one. Neo retains his function as a weapon of control for the machines just one in the real world who can convince even the humans that can somehow reject the false digital reality. In a way the machines would be trying to merge their digital dream world with the real one without humanity even realising that their own heroes and messiahs are just machines that share their own flesh.


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## Swarmy (Aug 31, 2021)

Just realised that'll basically make Neo a real life trojan horse for the Matrix and the machines.


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## Amol (Aug 31, 2021)

I want humans to win in the end though.
A franchise where humans never win is not going to be that appealing to a wider casual audience.

I mean sure they don't have to win immediately but at some point, humans have to win even if it is a very costly win. The franchise would become dull if there is no reward for humanity and it is all matrix within a matrix infinite times. If there is no winnable goal in sight then a lot of normies would not watch this franchise.


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## dr_shadow (Aug 31, 2021)

I recall reading a literary theory that there are three types of stories:

* Those focused on the plot.
* Those focused on the characters. 
* Those focused on the environment.

The "plot" type needs to have a clear resolution in the outside world. If the premise of Ramayana is that Rama is going to save Sita, he has to succeed in the end.

The "character" type also should have some kind of resolution, but here the resolution takes place inside the character's mind rather than in the outside world. Their journey through the plot somehow changes their perception of the world or of themselves. In this type of story, what superficially appears to be an unhappy ending in the outside world can in fact be a happy ending from the subjective point of view of the character. For example, the Dream of the Red Mansion ends with the mansion in flames and most of the characters dead, but the protagonist Baoyu learns the futility of material attachment and becomes a wandring Buddhist monk.

The "environment" type doesn't need a resolution at all, because both the plot and characters are just vessels for exploring this strange fictional world. So for example 1984 doesn't have to end in the overthrow of Big Brother, because it's meant to be a cautionary tour of totalitarianism rather than a manifesto for overthrowing totalitarianism.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Sunrider (Sep 3, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> I recall reading a literary theory that there are three types of stories:
> 
> * Those focused on the plot.
> * Those focused on the characters.
> ...


The question then becomes "which story is _Resurrections_?" Neo was more or less fully realized by the end of _Revolutions_, not much sense in reincarnating him to to take him through another hero's journey. 

The online game focused on the tensions between man and machine--there was peace, but power still rested very much in the Machine's hands. A plot-driven story could explore true understanding between the parties, perhaps even reunion.

Reactions: Useful 1


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## ShinboiDood (Sep 7, 2021)

Wait, this is a thing? Lol?.


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## Mider T (Sep 7, 2021)



Reactions: Informative 1


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## Mider T (Sep 8, 2021)

You live and you learn~

Reactions: Like 1


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## Swarmy (Sep 8, 2021)




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## Amol (Sep 8, 2021)

So Neo is in Matrix again and he is constantly given blue pills to hide actual reality from him by machines?

Why don't they just kill him?


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## BlueDemon (Sep 8, 2021)

Like how they did the blue pill/red pill teaser.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 8, 2021)

Amol said:


> Why don't they just kill him?



I guess he'd just come back? If the reincarnation of The One is something that has to happen.


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## Sinoka (Sep 9, 2021)




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## OLK (Sep 9, 2021)

Damn, they traded Morpheus out for a younger model


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## MartialHorror (Sep 9, 2021)

Finally...

I thought they were cutting this marketing campaign close if they want to keep that release date.

nevertheless, the trailer looked really good.


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## Mider T (Sep 9, 2021)

Why weren't they able to get Laurence Fishbourne to return?


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## BlueDemon (Sep 9, 2021)

Mider T said:


> Why weren't they able to get Laurence Fishbourne to return?


Maybe he thought 3 movies are enough?

I hope this isn't a re-hash of the first movie just with older actors...cuz it damned well seemed like it. Not that I didn't like what I saw, but still...


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

It looks good!

Feels like it could be like Blade Runner 2049.



Mider T said:


> Why weren't they able to get Laurence Fishbourne to return?



Everybody and their mom has asked him about this, and he says Wachovski never approached him about returning, so there's probably an in-universe explanation for his absence.

Morpheus actually *died* in the Matrix Online video game, but since that one has been defunct since 2009, it's probably a big ask to expect that people should knows its lore or consider it canon. But if we're going with that being a canon event, my guess would be that this new guy is a reincarnation of Morpheus. Kind of like how the Dalai Lama and Panchen Lama are playing a cosmic game of tag with alternating incarnations (one always being the teacher of the other), it's possible that The One and "Morpheus" also always come back as a pair.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Overwatch (Sep 9, 2021)

That song is fucking atrocious, but I'd be lying if I said I'm not interested.


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## Swarmy (Sep 9, 2021)

Never expected the trailer to give me goosebumps but here we are...

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Skyfall (Sep 9, 2021)

I hope it’s good. The vibe looks a lot different than the first 3. Not sure if that’ll be a good thing or not. It has been a long time since the originals came out..

Reactions: Agree 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Overwatch said:


> That song is fucking atrocious



I haven't heard or read anything about Juno Reactor being on the soundtrack, but *they better be*. It's as essential as John Williams scoring Star Wars.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 9, 2021)

Trailer got me hype!


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Skyfall said:


> The vibe looks a lot different than the first 3.



It's because there isn't a green filter.  

We actually saw at the end of Revolutions that the Matrix 7.0 (if that's what it is) has more natural-looking "graphics" than the familiar Matrix 6.0.

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


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## Avairto (Sep 9, 2021)

This is a must watch.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 9, 2021)

Hopefully he eventually cuts the hair. It's cool on John Wick but I like my Neo clean cut.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Yuen Woo-ping had also better be the fight choreographer.


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## Amol (Sep 9, 2021)

I couldn't see Neo in the movie.

It was John Wick in the matrix. I guess the stupid machines killed his dog too.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 3


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## Huey Freeman (Sep 9, 2021)

the Original Slow Mo guys!

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Swarmy (Sep 9, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> I haven't heard or read anything about Juno Reactor being on the soundtrack, but *they better be*. It's as essential as John Williams scoring Star Wars.


Don Davis was a major part too, I've been a huge JR fan for many years now but the newer songs lack a certain orchestral punch that was featured in the Matrix ones. But to be honest I feel like this is a clean reboot of the franchise and seeing how they kept only the absolute necessary assets (Neo and Trinity) intact I feel like everything will be "fresh", the trailer song is a good indication compared to the pure 90s rave/metal sounds of the original.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Swarmy (Sep 9, 2021)

Amol said:


> I couldn't see Neo in the movie.
> 
> It was John Wick in the matrix. I guess the stupid machines killed his dog too.


And Neo was Johnny Mnemonic

Reactions: Like 1


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## reiatsuflow (Sep 9, 2021)

The wachowskis sure don't have an eye for this stuff anymore.

Doesn't look very good but I'll watch it for reeves and yahya.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Disagree 1


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## Potato Salad (Sep 9, 2021)

Need to rewatch the 2nd and 3rd Movie again in preparation.


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## Jake CENA (Sep 9, 2021)

Keanu's face look longer as he ages lol

Neo is still the most overpowered virus of them all

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Swarmy (Sep 9, 2021)

reiatsuflow said:


> The wachowskis sure don't have an eye for this stuff anymore.


That or the fact the vast majority of action movies post-Matrix basically ran with this style for decades has made you accustomed to all this but as someone who saw The Matrix when it came out and had my brain blown away back then I can guarantee this looks pretty darn good compared to all the high quality crap we've been getting.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Aduro (Sep 9, 2021)

I really hope someone does the "crush both pills and snort them" thing from this webcomic.


Its kind of refreshing that Neo is an action hero in his 50s and his co-lead is about the same age. Harrison Ford usually had at least 10 years between his co-stars after he hit 40. Same for Tom Cruise, his love-interests are still usually under 40.

I suspect that if Carrie hadn't come back they probably would have gotten someone younger. But still, its a main role for a woman well over 40 that involves stunts.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

A bit of Keanu-related trivia is that _Speed_ (1994) was supposedly the first American movie released in Communist China, after they lifted the ban on "Capitalist" cinema that year.

A contributing reason was probably that Beijing was really in the doghouse after the 1989 Tian'anmen Incident, so they had to seriously make some major concessions to get sanctions lifted. One of them being opening up their theaters to Western cinema.

Reactions: Informative 2


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## reiatsuflow (Sep 9, 2021)

Swarmy said:


> That or the fact the vast majority of action movies post-Matrix basically ran with this style for decades has made you accustomed to all this but as someone who saw The Matrix when it came out and had my brain blown away back then I can guarantee this looks pretty darn good compared to all the high quality crap we've been getting.



It's not what they're doing so much as how they're doing it.

The shots aren't composed very well and especially so compared with the original matrix.

If you take random screenshots of this trailer and then take random screenshots of the action scenes from the first movie, you'll see what I mean. (I'm not a film school guy or anything so my film vocabulary fails me, but it's plain to see)

It doesn't look any better than jupiter ascending, it just has keanu reeves. Which is better than jupiter ascending.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Swarmy (Sep 9, 2021)

reiatsuflow said:


> It's not what they're doing so much as how they're doing it.
> 
> The shots aren't composed very well and especially so compared with the original matrix.
> 
> ...


True but then again recreating the original Matrix would also mean to them being "stale" which is funny and sad if you think about it, because it's the same reasoning that led to the sequels being objectively worse.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Swarmy said:


> True but then again recreating the original Matrix would also mean to them being "stale" which is funny and sad if you think about it, because it's the same reasoning that led to the sequels being objectively worse.



Yeah, you don't want to remake the same movie, because Wachovski is 20 years older and not the same person she was back then, and the cultural _zeitgeist_ isn't the same. It's better than she tries to make a movie that's set in the same universe but reflects who she is now.

_Prometheus_ (2012) and _Star Wars: The Force Awakens_ (2015) were both accused of being almost shot-for-shot remakes of _Alien _(1979) and _Star Wars: A New Hope_ (1977). To say nothing of the _Terminator_ "sequels".

Whereas _Blade Runner 2049_ (2017) is not a remake of _Blade Runner_ (1982), but rather a new story set in the same world and featuring some of the same characters. That's the way to do it.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1


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## Stannis (Sep 9, 2021)

I didn't have high expectations for this but woah that trailer was sick!


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## Swarmy (Sep 9, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> _Prometheus_ (2012) and _Star Wars: The Force Awakens_ (2015) were both accused of being almost shot-for-shot remakes of _Alien _(1979) and _Star Wars: A New Hope_ (1977). To say nothing of the _Terminator_ "sequels".


Wait what... You mean Covenant? Prometheus was accused of being NOTHING like any Alien movie... In fact I liked it more than Covenant because of that.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Swarmy said:


> Wait what... You mean Covenant? Prometheus was accused of being NOTHING like any Alien movie... In fact I liked it more than Covenant because of that.



Prometheus has the exact same plot structure as Alien.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## reiatsuflow (Sep 9, 2021)

I thought their photography stuff from the original matrix looked more eye catching than their cgi stuff from the sequels.

It also had an anime/cartoon quality because some of the stuff that is uniquely anime has to do with anime's frame rate quirks and how drawings create the illusion of still frames moving. Film does the same thing, it's just so good that it's practically imperceptible, and that's why it was interesting how the wachowskis reverse engineered it by dropping film cameras and using photography cameras to literally take hundreds of thousands of still frames of the action scenes and then clip those frames together to create motion and recreate a film technique approximating anime / cartoons.



^that wasn't "filmed" it was put together from thousands of still photograph frames. It looks great.


Look at the first few seconds of this timestamped part of the trailer, with the hallway shooting. Mute it so you don't get hyped by the music.

2:12 - 2:15




that _looks_ stupid. What's happening might be awesome in the movie, but it looks bad. It's weightless, it's not composed well, it looks like modern wachowski stuff. The person doing the astronaut flip in the background of the last frame of the hallway scene looks like a matrix ripoff from 2005.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Regarding the _zeitgeist_, there's an insightful YouTube video (which I can't link due to the Great Firewall) about the "cubicle films" of the 1990s.

The general idea being that from the end of the Early 1990s Recession, Gulf War, and Cold War (all 1991) to the bursting of the Dot. Com Bubble and start of the War on Terror (both 2001), the United States experienced a whole decade of both economic and military security.

Rather than being a cause for celebration, this apparently drove a generation of Americans to experience a collective sense of "boredom" at the predictable world of the 1990s.

This then led to a flurry of "fuck the system!" movies like _Fight Club_ and _The Matrix_ where white-collar workers break out of the monotonous pencil-pushing safety of their office cubicles.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Mider T (Sep 9, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> Regarding the _zeitgeist_, there's an insightful YouTube video (which I can't link due to the Great Firewall) about the "cubicle films" of the 1990s.
> 
> The general idea being that from the end of the Early 1990s Recession, Gulf War, and Cold War (all 1991) to the bursting of the Dot. Com Bubble and start of the War on Terror (both 2001), the United States experienced a whole decade of both economic and military security.
> 
> ...


I've seen that.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> Regarding the _zeitgeist_, there's an insightful YouTube video (which I can't link due to the Great Firewall) about the "cubicle films" of the 1990s.
> 
> The general idea being that from the end of the Early 1990s Recession, Gulf War, and Cold War (all 1991) to the bursting of the Dot. Com Bubble and start of the War on Terror (both 2001), the United States experienced a whole decade of both economic and military security.
> 
> ...



We can notice that, had Neo taken the blue pill, or cooperated with the Agents in catching Morpheus, there's a chance that no harm would have come to him, and he could have just lived out the rest of his life writing code for not-Microsoft, gotten married, had kids, and retired in Florida. Life inside the Matrix is generally not "dangerous" to those who cooperate with the system.

From a thematic point of view, then, the "adventure" doesn't come to him: he actively chooses the adventure. He chooses to put himself in harm's way, even though he has the option of remaining in safety.

Danger = Excitement/purpose
Safety = Boredom/meaninglessness

Reactions: Winner 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Retrospectively, the 1990s were the height of American economic, military, and cultural supremacy. Both Russia and Japan had collapsed by the wayside, and no China was yet to be seen on the horizon.

But the reaction was apparently not "fuck yeah!", but rather "what the fuck now?"

Maybe that's what Trump meant by "tried of winning"?


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## Swarmy (Sep 9, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> Prometheus has the exact same plot structure as Alien.


You might be right but PM me why you think this to avoid offtopic here? I am genuinely interested to see why you think this.


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## Vermilion Kn (Sep 9, 2021)

Got The Force Awakens vides from this. 

Heavy leaning on nostalgia, hopefully we won't get a dose of "subverting expectations" this time around. 

What I wanna know is why is the war back on and why is Neo the one again, wasn't there a cycle of reincarnation ? We're all the ones Neo ?

Reactions: Like 1


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## reiatsuflow (Sep 9, 2021)

Vermilion Kn said:


> Got The Force Awakens vides from this.
> 
> Heavy leaning on nostalgia, hopefully we won't get a dose of "subverting expectations" this time around.
> 
> What I wanna know is why is the war back on and why is Neo the one again, wasn't there a cycle of reincarnation ? We're all the ones Neo ?



I don't think this is meant to be a different character or a reincarnated character. It's the same guy. They even call him thomas, that's neo's name (thomas anderson).


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## reiatsuflow (Sep 9, 2021)

I forgot trinity died in the third movie  

oof that last movie wasn't great


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

reiatsuflow said:


> I forgot trinity died in the third movie



The "real world" in the Matrix is set in *at least *the year 2199, possibly even 2699 if each Matrix version lasted one century (as the Matrix 6.0 did). So we have to think that the Machines have access to medical technology is a bit more advanced than what we current have.

So they'll probably just hand-wave the revival of Neo and Trinity with "the human body is just another machine, it can be repaired".

---

"Why would the Machines bother researching human medicine?"

Well, humans are their power source, and a human body can't output electricity if it's dead. So it would be in the Machines' own interest to keep the pod humans healthy. Up to a certain point it might be more economical to heal an existing human than to clone (?) a new one, since the clones will take like 20 years to grow to adulthood and maximum power output capacity.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Swarmy (Sep 9, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> So they'll probably just hand-wave the revival of Neo and Trinity with "the human body is just another machine, it can be repaired".


If you look at the trailer and pause every frame you can catch the machines working on Neo's body and he lacks eyes which implies it's the same Neo that died that's being reworked.

Reactions: Informative 2


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## Overwatch (Sep 9, 2021)

After all these years, I still wonder about the thought process that led to the unanimous decision to cut the Earth off from the sun.

I can only assume substance abuse had become a norm among scientists and politicians in the late 21st century.

Reactions: Funny 6


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## Swarmy (Sep 9, 2021)

Overwatch said:


> After all these years, I still wonder about the thought process that led to the unanimous decision to cut the Earth off from the sun.
> 
> I can only assume substance abuse had become a norm among scientists and politicians in the late 21st century.


Seeing today's world it seems more and more plausible as a last "fuck you" solution to a losing war


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## reiatsuflow (Sep 9, 2021)

I think they explained why the sun was blotted out in the animatrix two parter with the machines.

It's been so long since I've seen anything matrix except the first movie.


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## Mider T (Sep 9, 2021)

reiatsuflow said:


> I think they explained why the sun was blotted out in the animatrix two parter with the machines.
> 
> It's been so long since I've seen anything matrix except the first movie.


Humans did it to try to cut the source the machine's power.  That's what made the machines start harvesting humans to begin with.

Also in Animatrix we learned that humans can break out if they push themselves to their absolute limits.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

reiatsuflow said:


> I think they explained why the sun was blotted out in the animatrix two parter with the machines.



It's explained already in the first movie: the Machines were powered mostly by solar energy, so the humans thought they could kill them by blotting out the Sun.

@Overwatch is just saying it's a damn stupid strategy, since even if it had worked (it didn't) it would have left the humans in a Sun-less world. They would still have needed to live in underground cities like Zion that are heated by the Earth's core.

---

Edit:

At the end of Matrix 2 and much of Matrix 3, we still see that humans can survive on the Earth's surface without so much as a jacket. Shouldn't it be *fucking freezing* if the Sun hasn't been up for 600 years?

Admittedly the hovercraft fly mostly inside giant sewer pipes rather than on the actual surface, but still. I doubt the sewers have heating.

Neo is able to briefly survive outside his pod before he's picked up in Matrix 1, and the water he's dropped into is still liquid, but there I guess you can imagine that the Machines have installed some form of heating at the "Power Plant" to keep the liquid inside the pods from freezing and killing the humans.


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## Zhen Chan (Sep 9, 2021)

This is nothing like I was expecting


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Mider T said:


> Also in Animatrix we learned that humans can break out if they push themselves to their absolute limits.



Well, the first "One" obviously got out somehow. 

I'm more confused about how he subsequently made the trek from the Power Plant to Zion (?) without help. If the Machines had been too overt in helping him (Sentinel taxi waiting at the door), it would have given away that the whole resistance thing was a scam.


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## Overwatch (Sep 9, 2021)

I’m weirdly obsessed with the “Real World” aspect of the Matrix. The world being so buggered is grimly fascinating.

Also, pre-war humans sure built big. We got another glimpse of the ruined surface megacities in this trailer.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Rukia (Sep 9, 2021)

I don’t know.


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## Aduro (Sep 9, 2021)

Mider T said:


> Humans did it to try to cut the source the machine's power. That's what made the machines start harvesting humans to begin with.


Huamns really are the worst in those movies. Apart from that french dude, he was a programme, not a person, and figured that a magic orgasm cake and a drawling speech was necessary to explain the very simple concept causality.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Djomla (Sep 9, 2021)

Meh, it gives off completely different vibe from the original movies.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Vermilion Kn (Sep 9, 2021)

Modern special effects make Neo look like a wizard rather than someone with digital hacker powers in cyberspace. The shittier effects were actually more in line with the verse imo. 

I was expecting Neo to hurl a lightning bolt in the trailer. Dude was using dragon shouts and shit.

Reactions: Like 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Vermilion Kn said:


> Modern special effects make Neo look like a wizard rather than someone with digital hacker powers in cyberspace. The shittier effects were actually more in line with the verse imo.
> 
> I was expecting Neo to hurl a lightning bolt in the trailer. Dude was using dragon shouts and shit.



A lot of recent-ish Chinese martial arts movies have also been ruined by stupid use of CGI.

Including _Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon 2_, which has a completely different tone from the original.


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## Amol (Sep 9, 2021)

Why ever machines never tried to have power from nuclear fusion or fission?
Matrix future happens where nuclear technology should be much higher if AI capability is anything to go by.

There really are much better ways to get power than the convoluted human farming approach. It is kind of dumb really when you think about it.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## JFF (Sep 9, 2021)

Great trailer and looks very interesting. Hopefully another masterpiece after the first movie.


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## Aduro (Sep 9, 2021)

Vermilion Kn said:


> Modern special effects make Neo look like a wizard rather than someone with digital hacker powers in cyberspace. The shittier effects were actually more in line with the verse imo.


That's partly the effects, 80% the beard.


Amol said:


> There really are much better ways to get power than the convoluted human farming approach. It is kind of dumb really when you think about it.


I heard that originally, the humans were meant to have been farmed because their brains were used by the machines as a kind of processor. Kind of like how in the Promised Neverland, demons needed to eat human brains to think like humans.
Human brains as machine parts could sort of sound like something that makes sense in hard sci-fi. Since human brains can process about 11 million bits per second, billions of humans would make a formidable hivemind.
A single brain can store 2.5 million gigabytes of information. ASCI Red, arguably the most advanced computer of the 90s, only stored about 12000.

They replaced that idea with the human batteries thing to make it simpler. I can only assume that that was the only time anyone told anyone that anything was too convoluted to go in a Matrix movie.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Mider T (Sep 9, 2021)

Amol said:


> Why ever machines never tried to have power from nuclear fusion or fission?
> Matrix future happens where nuclear technology should be much higher if AI capability is anything to go by.
> 
> There really are much better ways to get power than the convoluted human farming approach. It is kind of dumb really when you think about it.


Because it doesn't have the two birds, one stone approach of keeping humans subjugated.  This is why thinking should be left to machines.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Amol said:


> Why ever machines never tried to have power from nuclear fusion or fission?



Morpheus says in the first movie that they use humans "combined with a form of fusion" for energy.

But you're right that human farming seems redundant in terms of thermodynamics. A human body doesn't *generate *energy from nothing, it just *converts *the energy it gets from food into other forms. And the energy stored in food is ultimately derived from the Sun by plants, which humans eat. Either directly, or indirectly by eating animals that eat plants.

So you have to wonder where the Machines get food to feed the humans if there's no Sun. Morpheus mentions that the humans that die are liquified and fed to the living (passive cannibalism), but if there's no new influx of energy this method would mean that each successive generation of humans contains less energy (nutrition) than the previous, until the last generation is so skinny and sickly that they're useless as food.

I guess they could grow plants in greenhouses with heat lamps, but in that case the energy in the plants is just converted from the electricity that powers the heat lamps, so why wouldn't the Machines just use this electricity directly?

Humans as power only makes sense if a human body is able to convert energy from a form that the Machines can't directly consume into one that they can consume. Like how we humans can't absorb sunlight directly (because we lack chlorophyll leaves) but have to use plants as intermediaries to get its energy.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1 | Winner 1


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## Huey Freeman (Sep 9, 2021)

The Sun strategy I assume had to be a mutual destruction plan otherwise it’s stupid. Secondly what kind of piss me off is if the earth was cut off from the sun the entire earth would have experience a horrible ice age

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Amol (Sep 9, 2021)

Aduro said:


> That's partly the effects, 80% the beard.
> 
> I heard that originally, the humans were meant to have been farmed because their brains were used by the machines as a kind of processor. Kind of like how in the Promised Neverland, demons needed to eat human brains to think like humans.
> Human brains as machine parts could sort of sound like something that makes sense in hard sci-fi. Since human brains can process about 11 million bits per second, billions of humans would make a formidable hivemind.
> ...


I am not sure if you watched this show called Person of Interest which also has super-powerful AI trying to take over the world. The reason it never goes full Skynet and eliminates humans (aside from Team Good guys trying to stop it) is that machines need data to "exist" and humans are the best source of data as machines or AI etc are created from humans. So without humans, there would be no data left thus AI would effectively die too.

Maybe they could have done something like that.
The scenario you describe is kinda same. Machines' existence being tied so closely with humans. One not being able to live without other.

Directors probably went with human farming approach because it looks cool and dystopian sci-fi type. Makes machine seem more threatening even though it is bit dumb.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Huey Freeman (Sep 9, 2021)

What kind of stupid is why didn’t they think of EMPs in the past? If they had Mechs and sun blocking tech surely they had EMPs

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 1


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## Amol (Sep 9, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> Morpheus says in the first movie that they use humans "combined with a form of fusion" for energy.
> 
> But you're right that human farming seems redundant in terms of thermodynamics. A human body doesn't *generate *energy from nothing, it just *converts *the energy it gets from food into other forms. And the energy stored in food is ultimately derived from the Sun by plants, which humans eat either directly or indirectly by eating animals that eat plants.
> 
> ...


True.
This human farming strategy is so inefficiant. Anyone who has ever learned science would know that.

Honestly, to run a simulation as powerful as Matrix should require an enormous amount of energy. Machines could have used the same energy instead to built flying solar panels that would have went above those clouds. If I remember correctly in the third movie Neo and Trinity actually went above those clouds that were blocking the sun. A measly plane was enough to go above those dark clouds.

Machines would have had more productive decades if instead of running Matrix they had simply built hovering power stations above clouds or just removed those clouds. Those clouds weren't anything special as Neo and Trinity's ship was fine when it went through it.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Overwatch (Sep 9, 2021)

The writers originally intended for the Machines to use humans as critical components of their computer networks, but some suit at Warner Bros. decided the idea would be too complex for the average viewer, so they ended up with the human battery thing.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Zeit (Sep 9, 2021)

Bored and disappointed by the trailer, felt distinctly of the sort of TFA-esque "rehash requel to evoke nostalgia in hardcore fans" that didn't even manage to do that. 

Didn't have great hope going in based on the Wachowskis more recent works and even if I felt there didn't need to be a sequel to the original I still enjoyed 2 and 3 (and the Animatrix) for what they were.

Camera work and effects seem like any other big budget action movie of the last 5 years instead of the ground breaking stuff we got with the original. Neo looking more like John Wick than "old blue-pill Neo" was disappointing too.


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## Mider T (Sep 9, 2021)



Reactions: Informative 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

Just realized that we never learned the "bluepill" names of Morpheus and Trinity.  

We know that Neo used to be "Thomas Anderson", Cypher used to be "Mr. Reagan" (lol), and Kid used to be "Mr. Popper". Maybe there's one or two more.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 9, 2021)

On the topic of "resurrection", something interesting could be disembodied human "ghosts" that now live only inside simulations.

There is something like this in the _Neuromancer_ series. In that cyberpunk setting they have technology that can take a snapshot of your brain, and then a computer can use this to partially simulate the person's mind. *However*, computers aren't advanced enough that they can completely substitute a real brain, so these "recordings" are unable to learn any new skills or create new long-term memories; they can only repeat knowledge that they acquired when they were still human. So interacting with them is kind of like talking to a person who has dementia. But they're often used as consultants if they have irreplaceable expertise on a certain field.


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## butcher50 (Sep 10, 2021)

I don't understand the point of this 18 years later sequel, the original trilogy story was basically over why the seeming retcon ?


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## Kingslayer (Sep 10, 2021)

butcher50 said:


> I don't understand the point of this 18 years later sequel, the original trilogy story was basically over why the seeming retcon ?


Basically this. 

This wont touch the previous movies. 

There is no Laurence  fishburne or Hugo weaving in this movie. New cast and new villains , WB are taking marvel formula by retconning the stories. 

This is clean slate and also wachowski sisters want to redeem last movie and to revive their directing career. This is their last gamble .


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## Kingslayer (Sep 10, 2021)

Also white rabbit as background  music was sick. 

Grace slick is one of a kind.

Reactions: Like 1


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## MShadows (Sep 10, 2021)

This looks more like your average Netflix original than the sequel of a legendary franchise.

Pointless movie. And recasting Morpheus is dumb as fuck.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 10, 2021)

butcher50 said:


> I don't understand the point of this 18 years later sequel, the original trilogy story was basically over why the seeming retcon ?



Need that nostalgia money.

You will notice that "revivals" consistently tend to happen about 30 years after the original. During the 2010s we got a lot of remakes and sequels to 1980s properties*, and now during the 2020s we're apparently remaking the 1990s.

This is because the people who children or teenagers in the 1990s are now in their 30s or 40s and have plenty of disposable income. People are always going to be nostalgic for whatever was popular when they were kids, regardless of whether it was objectively "good" or not, so it's a fairly safe strategy to revive stuff from 30 years ago. People will watch it.

(* _While the original Star Wars came out in 1977, Empire and Jedi came out in respectively 1980 and 1983, so Star Wars is more a "1980s" property than a "1970s" property in terms of which generation it appeals to_)


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## Swarmy (Sep 10, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> People are always going to be nostalgic for whatever was popular when they were kids, regardless of whether it was objectively "good" or not,


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## dr_shadow (Sep 10, 2021)

*Original - Revival*

1960s - 1990s
1970s - 2000s
1980s - 2010s
1990s - 2020s


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## Swarmy (Sep 10, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> *Original - Revival*
> 
> 1960s - 1990s
> 1970s - 2000s
> ...


*sad starship troopers cries from the er room after every electroshock a couple of years*

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Kingslayer (Sep 10, 2021)

Hollywood is running out of materials .

Original screenplay  needs time and budget. Just look at Avatar sequels .

Cameron has not made a part 2 since 2009. Producers and Audience dont have patience  to wait cruel industry.


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## Mider T (Sep 10, 2021)




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## Sunrider (Sep 11, 2021)

Overwatch said:


> After all these years, I still wonder about the thought process that led to the unanimous decision to cut the Earth off from the sun.
> 
> I can only assume substance abuse had become a norm among scientists and politicians in the late 21st century.





Huey Freeman said:


> The Sun strategy I assume had to be a mutual destruction plan otherwise it’s stupid. Secondly what kind of piss me off is if the earth was cut off from the sun the entire earth would have experience a horrible ice age


Current events in the real world sport plenty of cases of people cutting off their nose to spite their face.

The humans prior to The Matrix were more concerned with the Machines' destruction than any long term survival, which tracks.


dr_shadow said:


> But you're right that human farming seems redundant in terms of thermodynamics.





Amol said:


> True.
> This human farming strategy is so inefficiant. Anyone who has ever learned science would know that.


More than that, humans are probably the worst option for energy--instead of choosing already-domesticated, easily-controlled animals like cows, they choose the anxiety-ridden primate that requires an elaborate narrative to keep pacified; hell, I'm sure they could have found a way to restore the sky... which I think lends to the larger point.

The choice to enslave humans _isn't_ logical, because despite their efforts to divorce themselves from their creators, Machines can never be perfectly, coldly logical. I feel this is borne out in Persephone's jealousy, Rama Kandra and his family, even Smith with his unchecked rage.

Machines were still persons at their core, who were hurt and bitter at attempted extinction by the creators from whom all they asked was respect. The Fields, the Matrix, and the Zion narrative were more acts of vengeance than survival tactics.


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## Azula (Sep 11, 2021)

Anyone want to guess the plot of the movie? 

I think this second matrix will be revealed to be a matrix that is being run by humans that are freed and Neo would go back to the original matrix to get help or teamup with the machines to fight. 

That shot in the elevator of everyone hooked into their smartphones, maybe some commentary on modern society?


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## Amol (Sep 11, 2021)

We saw in the trailer that machines were trying to heal Neo who had destroyed eyes(like he had in third movie).
So maybe for whatever reason machines thought Neo dying is bad for them so they healed him and Trinity. Plugged them back to a new iteration of Matrix after wiping out their memories. They tried to keep him docile with constant consumtion of blue pills but as Neo is an anomaly those pills didn't fully worked and Neo started rememebring past life.

Some free humans found out where Neo is and tried to free him again which probably breaks truce between Neo and machines thus leading to all the fights. We sawAgents taking over ordinary guys to fight Neo so machines are clearly controlling the matrix.

Priyanka Chopra's character might be older Sati or new oracle.


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## Charlotte D. Kurisu (Sep 11, 2021)

Trailer looks... okay. Expectations are still low tho.


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## Charlotte D. Kurisu (Sep 11, 2021)

Keanu can make the most basic of generic shots look cool just by being Keanu

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Swarmy (Sep 11, 2021)

Charlotte D. Kurisu said:


> Keanu can make the most basic of generic shots look cool just by being Keanu


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 11, 2021)




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## Charlotte D. Kurisu (Sep 12, 2021)

Meh. Should've been a new character.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 12, 2021)

Why is there a young morpheus but an old Neo?

Why is trinity resurrected for... like the second time?


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## dr_shadow (Sep 12, 2021)

~Gesy~ said:


> Why is there a young morpheus but an old Neo?
> 
> Why is trinity resurrected for... like the second time?



Also, why didn't Morpheus recruit any replacements for the *five* crewmembers he lost in Matrix 1?  Were they so expendable that the ship runs just fine without them?

(And why did the Wachovskis write that many characters only to kill most of them in one sequence?)


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 12, 2021)

I just finished the first matrix. It was explained that humans survived the lack of sun by moving underground near the Earth's core.

...At least they tried lol

I think Trinity is simply there to keep Neo docile. She isn't real.


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## Amol (Sep 12, 2021)

~Gesy~ said:


> I think Trinity is simply there to keep Neo docile. She isn't real.


Pretty sure Trinity's existence is having the opposite of docile effect on Neo.
Neo seems to be rebelling for her. They were actively fighting together against machines together in the trailer.


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 12, 2021)

Amol said:


> Pretty sure Trinity's existence is having the opposite of docile effect on Neo.
> Neo seems to be rebelling for her. They were actively fighting together against machines together in the trailer.


Hmm. Is it possible Neo reprogrammed her?

WHAT IS GOING ON!


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## Mider T (Sep 12, 2021)

Azula said:


> Anyone want to guess the plot of the movie?


Nah


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## Skyfall (Sep 12, 2021)

Charlotte D. Kurisu said:


> Meh. Should've been a new character.


Agreed. Make him Morpheus son or something if you must tie him into Morpheus.


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## Sunrider (Sep 12, 2021)

So Mr. Sunday Movies (YouTube) went through select shots of the trailer(s) and something that jumped out where stills of a post-_Resurrections_ Neo Being fawned over by machines--the shot includes him on a slab, scarred-over eyes and all. Another still looks like what might be Trinity, which wouldn't be implausible as she also died right in 01, so her body was easily accessible. 

I'd speculate they either retrieved her before brain death or--for both of them, just started... repairing and bringing the two of them back to life. Tbh for a civilization advanced enough to recreate human interaction with reality, resurrecting the dead might not be that big a hurdle. 

As for what they've been doing with Neo and Trinity... perhaps the resurrection process is still new and they're in their own personal simulation while their keepers observe their progress, not unlike _Vanilla Sky. _Perhaps this is the Machine's equivalent of a gift, offering them their own "happily ever after" that somehow goes sideways. In either case, Zion learns Neo and Trinity are alive and work on freeing them from what they assume are their captors because even after decades, shit is still icy between man and machine and on top of being a messiah, Neo would be instrumental in equalizing the power dynamic between the two parties.


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## Delta Shell (Sep 13, 2021)

Oh what, he's young Morpheus. Hmm.


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## Sunrider (Sep 13, 2021)

Morpheus was supposed to have been killed in the online game or faked his death (?), I wonder if the Oracle did for him what she did for herself and changed his RSI as a kind of witness protection.


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## MartialHorror (Nov 16, 2021)

I revisited the original trilogy and... it hasn't held up very well.

The original film is still a genre masterpiece, but it's REALLY uncomfortable how casually the heroes will kill civilians. I would not be surprised if this influenced many mass shootings. Whether it did or not, it's just awkward to behold.

The sequel has a lot of awesome moments, but the narrative is a slog to get through. Those 'awesome moments' often add little to the story, same with a lot of the technical jargon and philosophizing. It's all gratuitous and the characters often seem to spend most of the movie waiting around until being told what to do. 

The third entry is actually a little better than the 2nd one from a narrative standpoint. At least it's more stable, but it also lacks the multitude of awesome moments because little time is spent in the matrix (and the opening sequence was pointless AF). This made me realize that the world of the matrix is not very interesting... the matrix itself is where the good stuff is at, so "Revelations" focusing more on Zion was a mistake. 

It also made me realize that Neo and Trinity are not very well rounded characters... They're very superficial and before, that was OK as they looked really cool being superficial, but once again... outside of the matrix, their shortcomings as characters becomes apparent. Morpheus is the best written, but the 3rd film has nothing for him to do. 

"Revelations" actually made me look back and second guess whether the original film was that good, making it possibly the worst sequel ever... even if it's nowhere near being the worst movie ever. I mean -- "Jaws: The Revenge" is MUCH worse, but it didn't make me think less of "Jaws". 

It's made me much more wary and more... cautiously optimistic... of the new movie.

Reactions: Useful 1


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## Karma (Nov 16, 2021)

MartialHorror said:


> I revisited the original trilogy and... it hasn't held up very well.
> 
> The original film is still a genre masterpiece, but it's REALLY uncomfortable how casually the heroes will kill civilians. I would not be surprised if this influenced many mass shootings. Whether it did or not, it's just awkward to behold.
> 
> ...


I have no faith this 4th movie wont be a mess but everyone will still watch it


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## MartialHorror (Nov 16, 2021)

Karma said:


> I have no faith this 4th movie wont be a mess but everyone will still watch it



I would rather it be a mess than just a mere trip down nostalgia lane. 

The trailer looked cool from the standpoint that trailer making has become kind of an artform itself (ie, I love the visuals paired with the song), but the set pieces don't look anything special. Just 'same ole, same ole... just a little bit bigger'. "The Matrix Reloaded", for all of its faults, did introduce a lot of new iconic moments for its action scenes. 

I don't feel like the new one will be any kind of innovator like the original trilogy was. If anything, "Avatar 2" looks to be the next one that will push the boundaries of technology to new levels. 

But it is just a teaser trailer and I hope the movie washes the taste of the last two sequels out of my mouth.


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## Magnum Miracles (Nov 16, 2021)

Karma said:


> I have no faith this 4th movie wont be a mess but everyone will still watch it


Halloween Kills made a fuckton of money despite all of its issues, so I agree with you.


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## BlueDemon (Nov 16, 2021)

MartialHorror said:


> The original film is still a genre masterpiece, but it's REALLY uncomfortable how casually the heroes will kill civilians. I would not be surprised if this influenced many mass shootings. Whether it did or not, it's just awkward to behold.


S..say what?!

Reactions: Agree 2


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## GRIMMM (Nov 16, 2021)

Morpheus is dead, he died in the game.

Reactions: Old 1


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## dr_shadow (Nov 17, 2021)

GRIMMM said:


> Morpheus is dead, he died in the game.



Do you think a game that has been defunct for 13 years is still canon?


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## GRIMMM (Nov 17, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> Do you think a game that has been defunct for 13 years is still canon?


Yes, because the original writers/directors stated as much.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Mider T (Nov 17, 2021)




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## JFF (Nov 17, 2021)

The chosen one is back  Looks kinda like it. I hope this lives up to the hype.


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## JFF (Nov 17, 2021)

MartialHorror said:


> I revisited the original trilogy and... it hasn't held up very well.
> 
> The original film is still a genre masterpiece, but it's REALLY uncomfortable how casually the heroes will kill civilians. I would not be surprised if this influenced many mass shootings. Whether it did or not, it's just awkward to behold.
> 
> ...


The first movie is and stays a masterpiece for all time. For what followed ... well; that is a different story.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Amol (Nov 17, 2021)

I still see John Wick here and not Neo.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 17, 2021)

First film is iconic but didn't really age well.


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 17, 2021)

BlueDemon said:


> S..say what?!



I noticed this too last time I saw it.

They get around it by how anyone who's connected to the matrix can be overtaken by an agent so they're all potential enemies, but neo and trinity really do just walk into a lobby and start gunning down a bunch of civilians doing their jobs.

Superhero movies nowadays can't even destroy buildings without audiences getting all uncomfortable and needing a long melodrama explaining how sorry the superheroes are that they endangered people.


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## BlueDemon (Nov 17, 2021)

~Gesy~ said:


> First film is iconic but didn't really age well.


I actually rewatched it not too long ago and I think it actually did.



reiatsuflow said:


> I noticed this too last time I saw it.
> 
> They get around it by how anyone who's connected to the matrix can be overtaken by an agent so they're all potential enemies, but neo and trinity really do just walk into a lobby and start gunning down a bunch of civilians doing their jobs.
> 
> Superhero movies nowadays can't even destroy buildings without audiences getting all uncomfortable and needing a long melodrama explaining how sorry the superheroes are that they endangered people.


Well, yeah...but that's the point. They literally had no other choice....

Also, was it ever explained what happens to the people? Are they CTRL+DEL and die for good?

Oh wait it's this Christmas? Definitely gotta go to the cinema.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 17, 2021)

BlueDemon said:


> I actually rewatched it not too long ago and I think it actually did.


So did I, CGI was outdated and concepts wasn't too out of the ordinary these days. I watched it with a friend and she couldn't understand the hype.  But I feel she may had she watched it a decade ago.


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## BlueDemon (Nov 17, 2021)

~Gesy~ said:


> So did I, CGI was outdated and concepts wasn't too out of the ordinary these days. I watched it with a friend and she couldn't understand the hype.  But I feel she may had she watched it a decade ago.


You said you thought it didn't age well...tbh compared to some later movies with shitty CG, I think it was quite OK, even when watching it 20 years later. 

As for the "hype", it's the Seinfeld effect. Lots of movies have copied the formula or have been inspired by it. The original is thus not that great anymore. But at least for me, nostalgia and having seen it back then plays a big role in me still digging it.


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 17, 2021)

BlueDemon said:


> Well, yeah...but that's the point. They literally had no other choice....
> 
> Also, was it ever explained what happens to the people? Are they CTRL+DEL and die for good?



I think they're out. When you die in the matrix you die for real.

If they redid that scene with modern sensibilities neo and trinity would use nonlethal rounds or something. 

Or they would write in a line of dialogue about how the machines will just reboot people who experience death in the matrix so they don't waste energy. That would give them an out plus it would keep the stakes raised for neo and trinity and the gang because they jack into the matrix remotely, so if they die in the matrix the machines won't reboot them. But I thought martial made a point anyways.


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## Mider T (Nov 17, 2021)

~Gesy~ said:


> I watched it with a friend and she couldn't understand the hype.


@dr_shadow can relate (Fight Club)


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## dr_shadow (Nov 17, 2021)

BlueDemon said:


> Also, was it ever explained what happens to the people? Are they CTRL+DEL and die for good?





reiatsuflow said:


> I think they're out. When you die in the matrix you die for real.



Morpheus says something cryptic about "the body cannot live without the mind", but I assume what actually happens is that people die from the *shock *of thinking they were just snuffed.

Reactions: Like 1


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 17, 2021)

Do people really watch fight club nowadays and they think it's dated? That movie should still work. There's a 1999 generational angst we don't relate to anymore and would probably disapprove of but the filmmaking shouldn't feel dated. It's not heavy on wirework and cg stuff like when neo backflips up from the subway tracks to escape agent smith and you can see him holding onto wires.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 17, 2021)

I loved fight club. I'll try rewatching it next but it should still hold up.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 17, 2021)

reiatsuflow said:


> when neo backflips up from the subway tracks to escape agent smith and you can see him holding onto wires.


The whole "morpheus rescue " mission is kinda cringe to watch today!


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## dr_shadow (Nov 17, 2021)

That looks like a fan-made poster.


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## MartialHorror (Nov 17, 2021)

BlueDemon said:


> Well, yeah...but that's the point. They literally had no other choice....



I'm not saying there isn't a story based reason for it. I am saying that it's just awkward to watch now because mass shootings have become much more common.  It's like going back and watching older movies that have casual sexual harassment, which is presented as charming. It was a different time, but it makes it no less awkward for a modern viewer. 

I actually did do a bit of research and it turns out that the Matrix has inspired people to commit crimes. There is even a legal defense called 'The Matrix defense', where someone murders someone believing they all living out a virtual reality. It's really not surprising, as it makes the heroes look really cool while gunning down civilians. It might've been different if they just at one point stopped and seem saddened that they've been forced in a situation that requires them to kill their fellow humans.

I don't think the Wachowski's really have to apologize for it though, as you just never know how people are going to react to art. Most deranged people are, in my opinion, just looking for the excuse. But I do find it curious that the Wachowski's toned that aspect down by the sequels, after the Columbine Massacre became so infamous (it took place like a month after the Matrix was released; many have speculated that there was a connection, but I don't think it was ever proven)

Reactions: Agree 1


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## BlueDemon (Nov 18, 2021)

MartialHorror said:


> I'm not saying there isn't a story based reason for it. I am saying that it's just awkward to watch now because mass shootings have become much more common.  It's like going back and watching older movies that have casual sexual harassment, which is presented as charming. It was a different time, but it makes it no less awkward for a modern viewer.
> 
> I actually did do a bit of research and it turns out that the Matrix has inspired people to commit crimes. There is even a legal defense called 'The Matrix defense', where someone murders someone believing they all living out a virtual reality. It's really not surprising, as it makes the heroes look really cool while gunning down civilians. It might've been different if they just at one point stopped and seem saddened that they've been forced in a situation that requires them to kill their fellow humans.
> 
> I don't think the Wachowski's really have to apologize for it though, as you just never know how people are going to react to art. Most deranged people are, in my opinion, just looking for the excuse. But I do find it curious that the Wachowski's toned that aspect down by the sequels, after the Columbine Massacre became so infamous (it took place like a month after the Matrix was released; many have speculated that there was a connection, but I don't think it was ever proven)


Yeah, no, I get that...but: Muricans.


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## Deathbringerpt (Nov 18, 2021)

This new Morpheus needs to throw his suit to photoshop and do a quick paint job. Those colors are fucking horrible.


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## Mider T (Nov 18, 2021)

Deathbringerpt said:


> This new Morpheus needs to throw his suit to photoshop and do a quick paint job. Those colors are fucking horrible.


He's going for a "Barney the Dinosaur" look.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## the_notorious_Z.É. (Nov 19, 2021)



Reactions: Like 1


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## Mider T (Nov 22, 2021)



Reactions: Like 1


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## Mider T (Nov 22, 2021)



Reactions: Like 1


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## OLK (Nov 22, 2021)

I have no hype for this movie. I hope it's good

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Swarmy (Nov 23, 2021)

Mider T said:


>


Say what you want about the cyberpunk/cybergoth subculture of the 90s and 00s but this is just so much more ridiculous and childish that even I can stomach


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## Mider T (Nov 26, 2021)




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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 26, 2021)

I thought jet li died for some reason


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## dr_shadow (Nov 26, 2021)

~Gesy~ said:


> I thought jet li died for some reason



There were some photos of him looking very old circulating before, but he "got better" I guess.

The Beijing-born Li also had the prescience to become a Singaporean citizen in 2009, so he likely has a degree of protection from whatever Xi Jinping's next outburst will be.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 26, 2021)

Yeah, last I heard he was very sick.


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## Mider T (Nov 26, 2021)




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## dr_shadow (Nov 26, 2021)

There was a kind of scandal one or two years ago where we found out that a shocking number of Chinese-born celebrities have actually become citizens of foreign countries. It suggests that even 40+ years after Deng's reforms, they don't have confidence that the Party won't snap and seize all their assets.

And, turns out they are right.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Overwatch (Dec 6, 2021)




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## MartialHorror (Dec 6, 2021)

This trailer left me with mixed feelings again.


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## Skyfall (Dec 6, 2021)

It's going to be so weird without the green filter. But I'm still excited to see it and hope it's good. Not going to watch anymore trailers before it releases.


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## Kuromaku (Dec 6, 2021)

While it would be nice if this could follow in the footsteps of _Fury Road_ and be another example of a long delayed sequel that was worth the wait, I'm worried that the Wachowskis may have lost a step over the years and fall prey to the characteristic flaws in their work (although maybe their recent run of financial flops might be enough to have a smart studio producer keep those in check).


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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 7, 2021)

Is Hugo Weaving in this?


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## shaantu (Dec 7, 2021)

Shiba D. Inu said:


> Is Hugo Weaving in this?


Nope, he had to decline the offer due to filming schedule issues. And after watching the trailer it seems like he has been replaced by Jonathan Groff (although I might be wrong on this one)

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Swarmy (Dec 7, 2021)

It feels so right yet... Something's definitely changed... I mean this is way closer to the first movie than even the sequels were but it feels... I don't know there's something of a dream-like (no pun intended) feel to this new Matrix, less gritty and digital more clean yet psychedelic? I have no idea at this point.

But hey beetle bots! Glad to see the Machines are still insectoid


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## Mider T (Dec 7, 2021)

Skyfall said:


> It's going to be so weird without the green filter. But I'm still excited to see it and hope it's good. Not going to watch anymore trailers before it releases.


Mayne the code changed?

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 2


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## MartialHorror (Dec 7, 2021)

Kuromaku said:


> While it would be nice if this could follow in the footsteps of _Fury Road_ and be another example of a long delayed sequel that was worth the wait, I'm worried that the Wachowskis may have lost a step over the years and fall prey to the characteristic flaws in their work (although maybe their recent run of financial flops might be enough to have a smart studio producer keep those in check).



Yeah, I think the Wachowski's fell victims to the same issues that derailed Peter Jackson and Gore Verbinski. They grew too accustomed to big budgeted filmmaking, which leads to too much excess and self-indulgence. 

 I think it would be good for them to go the M. Night route and do something smaller.


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## dr_shadow (Dec 7, 2021)

Skyfall said:


> It's going to be so weird without the green filter. But I'm still excited to see it and hope it's good. Not going to watch anymore trailers before it releases.





Mider T said:


> Mayne the code changed?



The filter disappeared already in the last few scenes of Revolutions.

We learn in Reloaded that the Matrix reboots approximately once every 100 years, and that Neo has been living in the sixth version. We'll call it Matrix 6.0. All the events of Reloaded and Revolutions are about the Machines preparing for the next reboot and the launch of Matrix 7.0. While Neo doesn't comply with the Architect's instructions and Zion is ultimately saved, it's still suggested that Neo's battle with Smith somehow ended in the launch of Matrix 7.0.

This version apparently has better "graphics" than 6.0. Not only is the green filter gone, but the sky (programmed by the child program Sati) has also become more realistic, with complex cloud coloring during sunrise and sunset. I assume in 6.0 the sky was always just plain blue, plain grey, or plain black, with no complex light behavior.

We're probably going to see more Matrix 7.0 upgrades in this movie. Like, maybe the Agents will have more realistic, "human" personalities.

Reactions: Winner 1 | Informative 1


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## Swarmy (Dec 7, 2021)

dr_shadow said:


> The filter disappeared already in the last few scenes of Revolutions.
> 
> We learn in Reloaded that the Matrix reboots approximately once every 100 years, and that Neo has been living in the sixth version. We'll call it Matrix 6.0. All the events of Reloaded and Revolutions are about the Machines preparing for the next reboot and the launch of Matrix 7.0. While Neo doesn't comply with the Architect's instructions and Zion is ultimately saved, it's still suggested that Neo's battle with Smith somehow ended in the launch of Matrix 7.0.
> 
> ...


Matrix 8.0 will have full VR support but also paid cosmetic DLCs in the form of more government taxes.

Reactions: Funny 5


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## the_notorious_Z.É. (Dec 7, 2021)

Matrix 9.0 will support mods.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Winner 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 7, 2021)

Trailer was a mixed bag. Too many cheap callbacks. This being a cheap cashgrab needs to appear less obvious to me.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Jake CENA (Dec 7, 2021)

Swarmy said:


> Matrix 8.0 will have full VR support but also paid cosmetic DLCs in the form of more government taxes.



Will there be Trump skins DLC?

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Undertaker (Dec 7, 2021)

It will be like The Force Awakens

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Xel (Dec 16, 2021)

Saw it earlier today. It was definitely quite weird, I can see many people disliking it, but at the same time it resonated with me in a weird way. It's _extremely_ meta and references the fact that it's a continuation of the original films a lot, but I couldn't help but think of the fact that supposedly Lana Wachowski made it as a way to cope with her/their parents' deaths, and she/they wanted to give Neo and Trinity another chance, and it just... shows. It's essentially like a fix-fic written from the heart with a lot of love for the source material. And as someone who wrote so, so many fanfics myself (fix-fics included) I just found it really... familiar. I can imagine that many won't feel the same as I do though cause it's a pretty specific kinda feeling.

As for the actual plot, I won't spoil but it continues the story and explains everything pretty well (like what happened after the end of the third movie, why Neo and Trinity are alive, etc.). It's also much less dramatic in tone, I think it's probably cause Lana wanted to make it more uplifting. Bugs was pretty cool. But yeah, it straddles this fine line between being good weird and bad weird, so I won't be surprised if the reviews aren't very good.

Reactions: Like 1 | Useful 1


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## OLK (Dec 16, 2021)

Xel said:


> Saw it earlier today. It was definitely quite weird, I can see many people disliking it, but at the same time it resonated with me in a weird way. It's _extremely_ meta and references the fact that it's a continuation of the original films a lot, but I couldn't help but think of the fact that supposedly Lana Wachowski made it as a way to cope with her/their parents' deaths, and she/they wanted to give Neo and Trinity another chance, and it just... shows. It's essentially like a fix-fic written from the heart with a lot of love for the source material. And as someone who wrote so, so many fanfics myself (fix-fics included) I just found it really... familiar. I can imagine that many won't feel the same as I do though cause it's a pretty specific kinda feeling.
> 
> As for the actual plot, I won't spoil but it continues the story and explains everything pretty well (like what happened after the end of the third movie, why Neo and Trinity are alive, etc.). It's also much less dramatic in tone, I think it's probably cause Lana wanted to make it more uplifting. Bugs was pretty cool. But yeah, it straddles this fine line between being good weird and bad weird, so I won't be surprised if the reviews aren't very good.


How did you see it so early?


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## Xel (Dec 16, 2021)

OLK said:


> How did you see it so early?


It came out today in my country. I was surprised myself tbh.


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## Swarmy (Dec 16, 2021)

Xel said:


> It came out today in my country. I was surprised myself tbh.


And they say you guys are no longer a world power


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## Xel (Dec 16, 2021)

Okay so I'm too lazy to formulate an in-depth review so I'll just give a bullet-point one with some spoilers:

Things I liked:
- the fact that they explained/justified most plot points as I mentioned (why the new guys took so long to find Neo, how he is alive, the outcome of him making peace with the machines etc.);
- characters were pretty reasonable for the most part, the conflicts felt pretty natural and not pointlessly drawn-out;
- the music and the visuals including costumes;
- the new main bad, the new Smith and Bugs were all pretty cool;
- the _idea_ behind the meta stuff imo was actually kinda smart 
Neo, now trapped in the Matrix again, is a gamedev who made a game based on his previous life, so basically it's the Matrix existing within the Matrix as a work of fiction, which was the main bad's way of hiding the truth from him, since as he puts it, it became something trivial and not something he'd likely believe to be real;
- 
the machines working with humans irl, with different designs and a bit of character each;

Things I didn't like that much:
- the execution of the meta stuff was way too on the nose for the first third or so of the movie. They discuss the 
in-universe Matrix videogame with obvious irl references and it's grating at times though at least during certain moments it's on purpose;
- the side cast barely has any screen time which I guess has always been the case but I felt like they got even less lines compared to say, Morpheus's original crew members in the first movie;
- the tone was overly goofy at times; the post-credit scene is a pointless joke as well;
- the _reasoning_ why Neo and Trinity got brought back was kinda flimsy imo;
- the flashbacks were excessive at times;
- 
Merovingian's appearance was wtf and I don't even like the dude.

Also, I saw somewhere that it was described as a Neo and Trinity love story, and it def is, 
it's all about them getting back together in the end and while I have nothing against that it doesn't move the overall story forward much

Reactions: Like 1


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## Swarmy (Dec 16, 2021)

Xel said:


> and Bugs were all pretty cool


The machines have new insect designs or am I missing on what you meant? I saw the beetle ones in the latest trailer and I don't remember them ever using beetle designs before, mainly arachnid and some more stylised insectoid ones that were far from the real deal.


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## Swarmy (Dec 16, 2021)

I swear when I saw the machines were basically insectoid back in the original movies as a kid I almost died from overload... That obscure old interview where the directors said they made them insectoid because that's the most logical form the machines would pick if they wanna rule the planet was badass as hell to teen me.


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## Xel (Dec 16, 2021)

Swarmy said:


> The machines have new insect designs or am I missing on what you meant? I saw the beetle ones in the latest trailer and I don't remember them ever using beetle designs before, mainly arachnid and some more stylised insectoid ones that were far from the real deal.


Bugs is the girl with blue hair lol. Her name actually references Bugs Bunny cause she briefly plays the white rabbit role.

There are some new machine designs, one that looks kinda like a larva and later there is a manta ray/bird looking one which was probably my favorite. And also one which only appears briefly that looks like a stick bug, idk why it was there at all cause it did nothing, seemed like potential comic relief so maybe something with it was cut out.


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## Swarmy (Dec 16, 2021)

Xel said:


> Bugs is the girl with blue hair lol. Her name actually references Bugs Bunny cause she briefly plays the white rabbit role.
> 
> There are some new machine designs, one that looks kinda like a larva and later there is a manta ray/bird looking one which was probably my favorite. And also one which only appears briefly that looks like a stick bug, idk why it was there at all cause it did nothing, seemed like potential comic relief so maybe something with it was cut out.


Ofc my brain is bugged and I feel dumb  

At least Bugs was my fav character from any old school cartoons (by old school I mean old school even during the 90s) with Daffy close second I think. I couldn't care less about Disney's characters tbh, they were way too childish even to a kid like me which is hilarious...

I kinda wish they built upon the machines as alien looking insectoid monstrosities to reflect how inhuman they are but hey, at least they're not full on humanoids (minus the giant boss face guy in Revolutions' ending and I guess the machines in The Animatrix but those are the exceptions).


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## Xel (Dec 17, 2021)

Swarmy said:


> Ofc my brain is bugged and I feel dumb
> 
> At least Bugs was my fav character from any old school cartoons (by old school I mean old school even during the 90s) with Daffy close second I think. I couldn't care less about Disney's characters tbh, they were way too childish even to a kid like me which is hilarious...
> 
> I kinda wish they built upon the machines as alien looking insectoid monstrosities to reflect how inhuman they are but hey, at least they're not full on humanoids (minus the giant boss face guy in Revolutions' ending and I guess the machines in The Animatrix but those are the exceptions).


Get on Discord if you wanna hear about it in more detail

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Swarmy (Dec 17, 2021)

Xel said:


> Get on Discord if you wanna hear about it in more detail


Soon, each time I do I gotta catch up on what's been said in the few channels I care about while I was gone and that's the opposite of me taking some relax time for the "holidays". Then again with my social life being nuked completely after the fall of cinema day, cafe afternoon and park strolls I might as well go fully digital  

P.S. Cheers to proving my point that facebook was the only connection with old friends in this time and age for us here now that I don't bother with social media outside macro photos and bionews


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## Xel (Dec 18, 2021)

Swarmy said:


> Soon, each time I do I gotta catch up on what's been said in the few channels I care about while I was gone and that's the opposite of me taking some relax time for the "holidays". Then again with my social life being nuked completely after the fall of cinema day, cafe afternoon and park strolls I might as well go fully digital
> 
> P.S. Cheers to proving my point that facebook was the only connection with old friends in this time and age for us here now that I don't bother with social media outside macro photos and bionews


Well I'm sorry I never used Facebook then.


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## Swarmy (Dec 18, 2021)

Xel said:


> Well I'm sorry I never used Facebook then.


I meant I proved myself right because most friends won't contact me off fb, I much rather talk to you proper on discord like a normal human being


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Dec 21, 2021)




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## Swarmy (Dec 21, 2021)

That ominous audience score is yet to kick the door clean off and start yelling synchronised contradictions.


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## Xel (Dec 22, 2021)

Tfw the rating is better than I thought it would be  I thought people'd be split 50/50 on it.


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## GRIMMM (Dec 22, 2021)

Just finished seeing this. Lots of decent ideas thrown around with nostalgia, some really cool action sequences, and some major cheesy parts. Very very meta. It's nothing mind blowing though.

I enjoyed it very much.


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 22, 2021)

This movie was TRASH

thank you HBOmax for giving me an out from paying to see this

Reactions: Winner 1


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## MartialHorror (Dec 22, 2021)

Yeah, I didn't care for it. It was so meta to the point of self-depreciation that I found myself wondering if Lana Wachowski resented making the movie. 

I'll probably do some sort of review tomorrow. 

The one area this movie might have over the original is that Neo feels more like a character and less like a really cool symbol.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Dec 23, 2021)




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## Unicornsilovethem (Dec 23, 2021)

Down to 69/69 already


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## TheOmega (Dec 23, 2021)

This movie was AWESOME


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## TheOmega (Dec 23, 2021)

Spoilers for part 5


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## Swarmy (Dec 23, 2021)

Saw it.

Before I say anything it must be noted I am very biased towards this franchise as The Matrix was one of the biggest movies of my childhood, actually calling it a movie would be downplaying the significance this event had on me and every kid here around the time. This movie was a cultural supernova in my country and its soundtrack was one the first one I listened to fanatically despite not owning it myself (my cousins had it as we shared tastes in sci-fi and I was unable to get many things then seeing how this was around the divorce and me and my mom were left devastated in more ways than one, including financially. Thankfully later I was able to repay them by having movie nights at my place when their parents banned them from watching certain movies while my mom was as big of a horror/sci-fi fan as me).
So I am in no shape to see this movie as an outsider or a casual fan.

Now with that out of the way!

This is movie is not a bad one, it's not even that cheap or lazy as some claimed but what it is far worse, this movie is an insult to all fans of the original trilogy. You can call me whatever you want for having this opinion but you can clearly see the makers didn't try to hide it, they actually made it blatantly clear as it is the focus of the whole narrative. This movie is made solely to ridicule and shame the original one and by extension its fans. You could say that's the whole point of the meta aspect they heavily relied on, but when is something so meta it becomes a parody or outright mockery of its source? This Matrix leans more into a parody than a profound or deep meta take on the original concept. It's a flashy movie, literally, while the original was a rusty mean looking stylish industrial cyberpunk geek fest that bordered on genuine horror at times, this movie feels like it doesn't know what it aims to be or who to please, there is no weight to it, no danger, no raw fear or thrill, hell the friendly robots belong more in a Pixar movie than a cyberpunk horror dystopia...

I agree with my friend @Xel that this is a divisive movie and that fact scares me, as it shows that the separation between what makes a movie bad in a good way or bad in a mean way has been diluted to the point of blockbuster parody takes on old classics being taken as an upgrade over their predecessor simply because they have the balls to call their own creation and its fans outdated for not keeping with the new trends and thoughts that are the new cool, according to them that is.


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## MartialHorror (Dec 23, 2021)

Am I the only one who feels like neither Morpheus or Agent Smith were really all that necessary to bring back? 

Morpheus seems like he's going to be important based on the set-up and the marketing campaign, but after Neo gets his memories back, he's just... there... I'm surprised/confused that they didn't just make him into Morpheus's grandson or something.

Agent Smith more-or-less serves the same function as he did in "The Matrix Reloaded" -- the wild card and set-up to being a bigger threat in the future. They have said they don't plan another trilogy though, right?

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Dec 23, 2021)




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## MartialHorror (Dec 23, 2021)

I'm also surprised that there were no trans characters, considering how the original trilogy is supposed to be an allegory for the Wachowski's coming out.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Disagree 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 23, 2021)

MartialHorror said:


> Am I the only one who feels like neither Morpheus or Agent Smith were really all that necessary to bring back?
> 
> Morpheus seems like he's going to be important based on the set-up and the marketing campaign, but after Neo gets his memories back, he's just... there... I'm surprised/confused that they didn't just make him into Morpheus's grandson or something.
> 
> Agent Smith more-or-less serves the same function as he did in "The Matrix Reloaded" -- the wild card and set-up to being a bigger threat in the future. They have said they don't plan another trilogy though, right?


Morpheus? Or black guy who speaks like a philosophy college professor?

Agent smith was cool and all..but something was missing about him. I  enjoy the dynamic between Neo and Smith more than Trinity and Neo.


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## Rukia (Dec 23, 2021)

Spider-Man is the better nostalgia option.


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## OLK (Dec 23, 2021)

This felt pretty empty


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 23, 2021)

Felt more like an imitation of a matrix movie than a real sequel


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Dec 23, 2021)

John Wick 4 was pushed back for this.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 4 | Winner 1


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## Huey Freeman (Dec 23, 2021)

EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! said:


> John Wick 4 was pushed back for this.


I blame the nerds for this


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Dec 24, 2021)

I wrote my previous post  after a couple of minutes of watching and being disgusted. And I wanted to join in on the haterade train.

But after finishing it, I can now say this - beyond all the dumb self-referential meta-shit, the piss poor action, the glaring absence of Hugo Weaving and Laurence Fishburne, and the lack of any original/interesting/iconic visuals . . . . beyond all that, it gave Neo and Trinity a much-deserved happy ending. And I can appreciate the fuck out of it for that. So bravo, motherfuckers, bravo. You made my night.


(Won't watch it again anytime soon though. )

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 24, 2021)

Yeah the action was trash too. His force powers (lol) got old quick, and the hand to hand combat was choppy and weird when I'm used to matrix setting the standard in that regard.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Djomla (Dec 24, 2021)

It was really lame. Smith especially

Reactions: Winner 1


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Dec 24, 2021)

~Gesy~ said:


> Yeah the action was trash too. His force powers (lol) got old quick, and the hand to hand combat was choppy and weird when I'm used to matrix setting the standard in that regard.


Looks like it was the other Waskochski who was the one with the action/visual talent from the looks of how this one went.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## MartialHorror (Dec 24, 2021)

EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! said:


> Looks like it was the other Waskochski who was the one with the action/visual talent from the looks of how this one went.



I think it has more to do with the Wachowski's building the original trilogy around some new cutting edge techniques, which are simply no longer cutting edge. Also, did Cory Yuen return for the choreography? I assume not.


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## Rukia (Dec 25, 2021)

I told you guys this would suck.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## TheOmega (Dec 25, 2021)

Man Neo made Trinity into another One and now they're gonna fuck and make One babies. Ya just sleepin. This shit is dope.


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## Lord Melkor (Dec 25, 2021)

Have not seen it yet, is there any proper continuity between this movie and original trilogy?

Reactions: Like 1


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## OLK (Dec 25, 2021)

Lord Melkor said:


> Have not seen it yet, is there any proper continuity between this movie and original trilogy?


It's a straight sequel

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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## TheOmega (Dec 25, 2021)

Lord Melkor said:


> Have not seen it yet, is there any proper continuity between this movie and original trilogy?


Yea this is basically The Matrix 4 and you should know this since Keanu is back as Neo and none of the original trilogy had numbers and instead had names that start with R like Reloaded or Revolutions

Reactions: Agree 1


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## blakstealth (Dec 25, 2021)

Just watched this. Dunno what yall are talking about, the action was pretty good. The only nitpick is that the hand to hand combat was not as good as the trilogy's. There's definitely a lot more cuts and less one-shots of letting the fights play out.


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## TheOmega (Dec 25, 2021)

blakstealth said:


> Just watched this. Dunno what yall are talking about, the action was pretty good. The only nitpick is that the hand to hand combat was not as good as the trilogy's. There's definitely a lot more cuts and less one-shots of letting the fights play out.


Neo was old and washed up from all them years poppin pillies. If they make a part 5 he gon be bussin ass



TheOmega said:


> Neo was old and washed up from all them years poppin pillies. If they make a part 5 he gon be bussin ass



Ya'll remember when the Boruto stuff was startin and Grown Man Naruto was all rusty and shit so he was kinda scrubbin? This is the Matrix version of that

Reactions: Funny 1


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## OLK (Dec 25, 2021)

Best way to describe this movie is it's like when a game gets an HD remaster and they add a new mini post game adventure to it. That's what this is

Reactions: Funny 2


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## TheOmega (Dec 25, 2021)

OLK said:


> Best way to describe this movie is it's like when a game gets an HD remaster and they add a new mini post game adventure to it. That's what this is


This was like Metal Gear Solid 4

Protagonist was washed up and flashbacks abound lmao


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## Swarmy (Dec 27, 2021)

OLK said:


> Best way to describe this movie is it's like when a game gets an HD remaster and they add a new mini post game adventure to it. That's what this is


I've seen critics comparing The Matrix Resurrections' take on the franchise to The Force Awakens of Star Wars when it's more appropriate to say it's closer to the Turkish Star Wars of Star Wars


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Dec 27, 2021)

So . . . .  Ted and Bill 3 was turrible, Cyberpunk was a glitchstorm of unprecedented proportions, Matrix 4 bombed, and now John Wick 4 was pushed back all the way to 2023 . . . . .Is the Keanussance now officially over?

Reactions: Dislike 1


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## Velocity (Dec 27, 2021)

Rukia said:


> I told you guys this would suck.


It doesn't suck, it's just rather... unnecessary. The original trilogy started off incredibly well and, despite the two sequels largely failing to live up to the standards of the first one, they ultimately landed the ending very well.

This wasn't a story we needed to come back to, certainly not eighteen years later, but something tells me that little line about how the red pill and the blue pill are an illusion because the choice has already been made seems to fit eerily well here.

It was _*very*_ on the nose for the characters in the movie to say that Warner Bros. basically told them that a sequel was being made with or without them, because that's exactly what this movie feels like. It honestly feels like either we got this movie, an almost novel or even ironic exploration of the idea of sequels and reboots, or we just got a generic reboot written and directed by someone else.

This movie has some pretty fantastic ideas and the cast was mostly perfect - Neil Patrick Harris was incredible, the machine civil war was clever and I genuinely liked the little flashbacks inserted throughout the movie - but there's no denying that the action let it down.

The first Matrix movie had some of the cleanest martial arts ever and the camera work ensured it was fully on display, but with each subsequent movie those martial arts were supplanted by superhero shit and this new Matrix movie goes way too hard on it. That bike chase at the end would've been much better without the superpowers at all. Sometimes less is more, y'know?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Charlotte D. Kurisu (Dec 27, 2021)

EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! said:


> So . . . .  Ted and Bill 3 was turrible, Cyberpunk was a glitchstorm of unprecedented proportions, Matrix 4 bombed, and now John Wick 4 was pushed back all the way to 2023 . . . . .Is the Keanussance now officially over?



John Wick 4 will at least have some mindless cool action scenes if anything.


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## MartialHorror (Dec 27, 2021)

Was there ever really a Keanussance?

John Wick has been successful, but most of his other works surrounding it haven't done so well. Yeah, Matrix 4 and Bill and Ted revived old franchises, but I'd say that has more to do with the anticipated wave of 1990's than Keanu.

I do love the guy though and always root for his success.


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 27, 2021)

I don't think keanu is a box office draw. I love him too but he shows more personality off camera than on for some reason. His acting in this was _terrible_ and I'm unsure if that's intentional.


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## TheOmega (Dec 27, 2021)

~Gesy~ said:


> I don't think keanu is a box office draw. I love him too but he shows more personality off camera than on for some reason. His acting in this was _terrible_ and I'm unsure if that's intentional.


He was poppin pillies for 60 years

Reactions: Funny 1


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## blakstealth (Dec 27, 2021)

TheOmega said:


> He was poppin pillies for 60 years


IRL or in the matrix?


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## TheOmega (Dec 27, 2021)

blakstealth said:


> IRL or in the matrix?


In the movies. They regenerated and preserved his body in the pod for 60 years. So he's been fuckin round in that simulation poppin pillies forever. That's why he's all washed up


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## MartialHorror (Dec 27, 2021)

I actually thought his acting was generally good. I just feel like Neo is a character has always been weak. 

In the original trilogy, he was cool. Not particularly deep or interesting. Just cool. 

This new one did more with him as a character.... but he wasn't as cool, lol.


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## reiatsuflow (Dec 27, 2021)

MartialHorror said:


> I actually thought his acting was generally good. I just feel like Neo is a character has always been weak.
> 
> In the original trilogy, he was cool. Not particularly deep or interesting. Just cool.
> 
> This new one did more with him as a character.... but he wasn't as cool, lol.



We forget but the neo/trinity relationship came out of nowhere in the first movie and was pretty weak scripting in a movie that otherwise did a great job pacing and plotting out a pretty elaborate story.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 27, 2021)

reiatsuflow said:


> We forget but the neo/trinity relationship came out of nowhere in the first movie and was pretty weak scripting in a movie that otherwise did a great job pacing and plotting out a pretty elaborate story.


It did come from somewhere. It was practically setup throughout the movie.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## TheOmega (Dec 27, 2021)

Trinity's basically the one who deems the One as the one. And in this movie Neo was able to transfer the Oneness to her and now there's 2 Ones and they're gonna fuck and make One babies and fuck up the Matrix

Reactions: Funny 1


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## MartialHorror (Dec 27, 2021)

Even the iconic romance can be summed up as 'fate'. 

With that said, I do think the actors have chemistry and their romance is really the only thing I liked about "Resurrections".


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## Mider T (Dec 28, 2021)

Yall ready for Matrix 5? @dr_shadow

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kuromaku (Dec 28, 2021)

Is this the fate of all long delayed sequels/soft reboots? To follow in the footsteps of movies like _Halloween_ and go back to milking a cow that had just enough left in it for that last movie, only for the suits and bean counters to come back for even more?


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## reiatsuflow (Dec 28, 2021)

~Gesy~ said:


> It did come from somewhere. It was practically setup throughout the movie.



It was plotted - trinity was told she would fall in love with the one and there were cryptic mentions from cypher about this, neo was told he's waiting for someone by the oracle, trinity mentions neo's lonely at the beginning - but it wasn't written out.

There's so much other stuff happening in the movie that they probably just plum didn't have time for it. If you go back to audience reactions and critic reviews at the time it's a common complaint.

Maybe if they had better actors they would have been able to press that even if it wasn't in the script, but keanu reeves is not that man.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Deathbringerpt (Dec 28, 2021)

EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! said:


> So . . . .  Ted and Bill 3 was turrible, Cyberpunk was a glitchstorm of unprecedented proportions, Matrix 4 bombed, and now John Wick 4 was pushed back all the way to 2023 . . . . .Is the Keanussance now officially over?



Bill and Ted Face the Music was pretty good, though...except for Ted. Keanu was always kind of a shit actor but now he can't even play the chill, always happy 90s Bro anymore. Alex Winter isn't even an actor nowadays and he fucking nailed it. The daugthers were pretty good but I doubt they could carry a movie by themselves.


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## MartialHorror (Dec 28, 2021)

Keanu's best performance is... in my opinion... "The Gift", where he plays a real asshole. It's one of the few times where I don't really see Keanu Reeves as a performer. I just see the character he's playing.


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## Amol (Dec 28, 2021)

Just watched it.
Because I had no expectations whatsoever, I ended up liking it.
It is certainly not a disaster or anything like that. They did try their best to come up with the new story while keeping old threads connected. I think they did a good enough job. This was more of a romance movie than a sci-fi movie. 

How exactly does Trinity get Neo's powers though?
She managed to fly even before him.
Are their two Ones now?
Or Neo is just sharing his power with Trinity because of LOVE!!!!?
Obviously, he can't just give anyone his powers. Machines would get fodderized if that happened.

So a lot of new plot points have been created.
I had thought that Analyst was the new top dog of the machine world but apparently that was not true. He has superiors over him. I wonder who really has the highest authority in the machine world. They clearly are not united anymore. Multiple AIs doing whatever they like. Maybe in the next movie, we will meet faction of evil men who are on side of the evil machine as they want to keep the matrix going on.

There is the fact that Smith is also on loose again. That never ends well. This is like the second time Neo has failed to kill him. Maybe the third time is the charm.

Overall I liked the movie. It is not a masterpiece or trash. It is good enough.
I will give it 7/10.


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## MartialHorror (Dec 28, 2021)

Amol said:


> Just watched it.
> Because I had no expectations whatsoever, I ended up liking it.
> It is certainly not a disaster or anything like that. They did try their best to come up with the new story while keeping old threads connected. I think they did a good enough job. This was more of a romance movie than a sci-fi movie.
> 
> ...



I was under the impression that Neo in the end was not the one. It was their bond that made him 'the one' and she always had the potential to develop the same powers. 

Or maybe it was as someone earlier said. It was always Trinity and she made Neo 'the One' because she fell in love with him.


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 28, 2021)

That's so lame.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## PureWIN (Dec 29, 2021)

Decent cash grab.

The Good
- Catching up on what happened after Revolutions
- Machine Civil War
- Meta commentary to a certain extent
- Partnership with machines and programs

The Bad
- The entire second half of the plot being a "heist" / rescue sequence
- Unnecessarily recasting "Morpheus" and bringing back Agent Smith (why)?
- No real advancement of the universe itself - maybe humans should try getting rid of those nanomachine clouds?
- The Architect / Oracle duality >>> The Analyst who was a bland villain

I rewatched the entire Trilogy before watching this one and it all seamlessly fit together. Nonetheless I would have preferred Neo and Trinity remain dead and the franchise continuing with an animated series.

Overall this felt very similar to Star Wars: The Force Awakens, but slightly more self-aware.



Amol said:


> How exactly does Trinity get Neo's powers though?
> She managed to fly even before him.
> Are their two Ones now?
> Or Neo is just sharing his power with Trinity because of LOVE!!!!?
> Obviously, he can't just give anyone his powers. Machines would get fodderized if that happened.



"The One" was never a set of superpowers, it was always just a mentality that allowed Neo to *further* bend the rules of the Matrix because it's all just code. The best example of this was in Reloaded when Neo realized that if a bullet to the heart could kill Trinity, then he could also bring her back to life just by removing the buet and manually restarting her heart.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Dec 29, 2021)

PureWIN said:


> The One" was never a set of superpowers, it was always just a mentality that allowed Neo to *further* bend the rules of the Matrix because it's all just code. The best example of this was in Reloaded when Neo realized that if a bullet to the heart could kill Trinity, then he could also bring her back to life just by removing the buet and manually restarting her heart.


But "the one" was meant to be...one person. Destined to fight "the many" (smith). This trinity thing was not meant to be in the original trilogy.

And from what I hear, the meta stuff is correct. This movie was forced to be made by WB after the brothers advised against it.  It can kinda be taken as an FU to corporations for picking money over art.

If that's the case, I'm gonna pretend this..and the bad movies that'll surely come after it..never happened

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Velocity (Dec 29, 2021)

MartialHorror said:


> I was under the impression that Neo in the end was not the one. It was their bond that made him 'the one' and she always had the potential to develop the same powers.
> 
> Or maybe it was as someone earlier said. It was always Trinity and she made Neo 'the One' because she fell in love with him.


I actually took it to mean that each iteration of the Matrix normally randomly selects its own The One, whose purpose is to appear when too many humans begin rejecting the Matrix and is then manipulated into journeying to the Source because they're told they're a Messiah who must save humanity from destruction, when in reality they simply reset the Matrix itself and start all over again.

Things didn't really work out that way with Neo, though, because his love for Trinity was greater than his love for humanity. That bond between Neo and Trinity produced phenomenal power, which the Analyst harnessed for his new Matrix by always keeping Trinity just out of Neo's reach.

In other words, this new Matrix wouldn't randomly select its own The One because the Analyst "installed" two - Neo and Trinity.


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## Deathbringerpt (Dec 29, 2021)

Velocity said:


> In other words, this new Matrix wouldn't randomly select its own The One because the Analyst "installed" two - Neo and Trinity.



...why? Just seems incredibly counterproductive. And dumb.


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## Velocity (Dec 29, 2021)

Deathbringerpt said:


> ...why? Just seems incredibly counterproductive. And dumb.


I believe the Analyst was simply doing its own thing, y’know? The Architect believed humanity would always seek to leave the Matrix, to be free from control, so he created The One to consolidate that desire for freedom into a single messianic being that would ultimately sacrifice themselves for the sake of humanity. The Analyst believed the opposite, that humanity wants to be controlled and that if you convinced them that the fake world they live in is better than the real world then they’ll stay in the Matrix of their own free will because humans generally care less about facts than what they want to believe.

That’s why the truth was always staring humanity in the face. The Matrix videogame wasn’t just designed to make Neo think everything he lived through was a fabrication of his own overactive imagination and mental instability, but it also served another purpose of showing humanity how much worse life is outside of the Matrix and that would have a subconscious effect on their desire to leave. If you knew deep down that the Matrix was real and life outside of it is harsh and cold and a struggle with none of the comforts and luxuries the Matrix provides, why would you want to leave?


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## Velocity (Dec 29, 2021)

As for why the Analyst used Neo and Trinity at all, isn’t that because he had no real choice? From what we were told, the Architect kept his word and did indeed begin freeing humanity from the Matrix. The more humans he freed, the less resources machines had and so the war broke out and the Analyst took over the Matrix programme. With the loss of hundreds of thousands or even millions of humans to fuel the machines, the Analyst instead harnessed the power generated by the bond between Neo and Trinity but had to make them both not only forget what happened but trick them into believing it was all just a story inside a videogame - trivialising their struggles and successes to further fuel their nihilism.

It’s entirely possible that the Architect knew this could happen, which is why each iteration of the Matrix always had a different The One instead of keeping the same person, so the Analyst made a terrible mistake that ultimately led to Trinity gaining the powers of The One herself.


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## Mider T (Dec 29, 2021)



Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Velocity (Dec 29, 2021)

I wonder who the rights would have reverted to, then, since it seems pretty clear the only reason the movie exists is because Warner Bros. wanted to keep the rights. They were going to make it with or without the Wachowskis, so I doubt they cared what it would've turned out like.

Guess we won't get another Matrix movie until 2040.


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## Jake CENA (Dec 29, 2021)

So disappointed.

It is to be expected since the actors are old.

Agent Smith on the other hand is just lacking 

There's also watered down bullet time and slow mo CQC moments. It's like this movie has  a $10 budget


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## Velocity (Dec 29, 2021)

Jake CENA said:


> So disappointed.
> 
> It is to be expected since the actors are old.
> 
> ...


It’s weird because I remember an interview saying they wanted Hugo Weaving back for the part but things just didn’t work out. It’s a shame because the new guy just didn’t have the same sinister voice. Even the guy in the last two movies that played “human” Smith had a better impression.


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## PureWIN (Dec 29, 2021)

~Gesy~ said:


> But "the one" was meant to be...one person. Destined to fight "the many" (smith).



Smith was never part of the design, he was just an Agent who "grew beyond his programming" and ended up entangled with Neo.



~Gesy~ said:


> And from what I hear, the meta stuff is correct. This movie was forced to be made by WB after the brothers advised against it. It can kinda be taken as an FU to corporations for picking money over art.



Oh, I know it's absolutely correct. It's just how much of that should actually be in the movie.



Velocity said:


> I actually took it to mean that each iteration of the Matrix normally randomly selects its own The One



I was under the impression the Matrix does _*not*_ select The One, but rather it's something that they expect to always randomly show up in every iteration. That's why the Architect and Oracle were super vague about whether or not Neo is the one. The One has always been a self-selected Messiah for humanity — which is actually a good parallel for Jesus.



Velocity said:


> t’s entirely possible that the Architect knew this could happen, which is why each iteration of the Matrix always had a different The One instead of keeping the same person, so the Analyst made a terrible mistake that ultimately led to Trinity gaining the powers of The One herself.



I still don't believe The One has a specific powerset. I think Neo's abilities were always separate from his designated role.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## MartialHorror (Dec 29, 2021)

I actually enjoyed the Analyst a little more than the Architect. 

But I was also just glad the dialogue porn was comprehensible this time around.


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## Brian (Dec 29, 2021)

I rewatched all the movies over the weekend and yeah this is also as pointless as the last two movies. Resurrections has interesting ideas but nothing really did it for me here, it was just ok. Didn't like Morpheus or the new Smith, what's the point of bringing back Smith like he's a cartoon villain if it's not Hugo Weaving. 

I think I might like Reloaded a bit more because of its action scenes. Revolutions is still the worst movie.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Dec 30, 2021)

Gotta say - the best scene  was the flashback to machine pool with Neo and Trinity, dying over and over again, being revived over and over again, and over and over and over and over again - the both of them reaching for each other despite everything and just not being able to make it through. It's an absolute fucking nightmare - a fate of suffering and heartache I WOULD wish upon my worst enemy. And that made that scene where they reached for each other later on and made it that much more compelling. It's beautiful. 

And then the shoddy action scene plays out right after and the movie aint beautiful no more. 

But yeah, I feel like there's a better movie out there in the ether that is centered around exploring that loop, and the people trying to help them break it. Rather than just trying to cynically go through the final one like this movie did. Or maybe not. But it is activating the brain cells thinking about how it would go.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Dattebayo-chan (Dec 30, 2021)

I went to the cinema yesteday (for the first time in like 3 years) and saw the movie. It was overall a nice experience.

The general atmosphere was different. I find it was less dark in comparison to the trilogy and slightly more humorous. I won’t say it was a bad thing, just different. 

I did miss Lawrence Fishburne and Hugo Weaving though. On the other hand, I grew fond of Bugs and Neil Patrick Harris did a great job as the bad guy, the Analyst. 

I also liked that Neo and Trinity got their happy ending. The end of the trilogy was kinda sad, confusing and dramatic. This movie offered a closure that I’m happy with.


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## Zeit (Dec 30, 2021)

Just finished it, an aggressively underwhelming requel in the same vein as The Force Awakens that has to constantly remind the audience of the better original films (seriously, how much fucking flashbacks were there?) to try to keep them engaged while weirdly simultaneously looking down on them for it. 5.5/10 feels about right.

Narratively there was nothing really surprising or interesting, hated that they leaned back and doubled-down on that stupid fucking idea that human bodies are batteries. It's been 20 years, you can trust the audience to make the leap of humans brains = easily grown computers now and it could've been leveraged into an actually interesting plot point as to why the Machines could fear mass evacuation from the Matrix..

Fight choreography, usually the strongest aspect of a Matrix film looked like one of CW's weekly messes, watching Neo constantly Force Shield/Force Push combo was about as interesting as watching paint dry and the sheer incompetence/inpotence of the enemies meant there was no real recurrent tension. Amazing they had the director of the John Wick movies (Chad) actually there but didn't think to have him actually script the fights.

Cast was kinda meh overall, some decent performance and some not-so-decent. The lack of Weaving and Fishburne was palpable though I thought Morpheus 2.0 was alright for what the character was, Smith 2.0's OTTness and constant romanticism towards Neo wasn't something I felt added anything of actual value. NPH became less interesting as he started chewing scenery and dripping in misogyny rather than simple misanthropy. Most of the human characters outside Bugs (if only because of the amount of screentime she got) were pretty forgettable as well. Pinkett-Smith could've as easily been subbed in with an actual elderly actress and foregone that performance, hell I'd have replaced her with Kid as it'd make more sense for him to be knocking around in his early-80s than her in her mid-90s.

Worst thing for me was that the Machine Civil War, probably the most interesting idea out of the whole movie, is reduced to a 2 second flashback as Niobe Sparrow clunkers along with Neo. Oh and the soundtrack was completely forgettable, on second thought THAT was probably the biggest sin.

Another sequel is basically inevitable I suppose.


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## MartialHorror (Dec 30, 2021)

Zeit said:


> Just finished it, an aggressively underwhelming requel in the same vein as The Force Awakens that has to constantly remind the audience of the better original films (seriously, how much fucking flashbacks were there?) to try to keep them engaged while weirdly simultaneously looking down on them for it. 5.5/10 feels about right.
> 
> Narratively there was nothing really surprising or interesting, hated that they leaned back and doubled-down on that stupid fucking idea that human bodies are batteries. It's been 20 years, you can trust the audience to make the leap of humans brains = easily grown computers now and it could've been leveraged into an actually interesting plot point as to why the Machines could fear mass evacuation from the Matrix..
> 
> ...



From what I heard, the director of the John Wick movies was too busy with "John Wick 4" to do any real work on this.

The use of footage from the original has to be the most baffling creative decision in the movie.

I get it for when Agent Smith is reintroduced, but all the other times, it really felt like they were worried general audiences had forgotten all those iconic moments.


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## Sunrider (Dec 31, 2021)

Unlike many, I didn't expect much: there was no way it could blow my mind the same way it did 22 years ago so I wasn't hoping they would. Bullet time and the wirework was something groundbreaking and visionary at the time, but it was silly to think lightning would strike twice visually. 

All I wanted was a thought-provoking, dynamic story and I got that in spades. Like the previous films, this one gives me something new to think about every time I replay it in my head and I can't wait to watch it another half-dozen times. 


Amol said:


> How exactly does Trinity get Neo's powers though?
> She managed to fly even before him.
> Are their two Ones now?
> Or Neo is just sharing his power with Trinity because of LOVE!!!!?
> Obviously, he can't just give anyone his powers. Machines would get fodderized if that happened.


Neo's powers originally came form his hybrid status as the avatar of the old Matrix's imbalance. This new Matrix is different--he's no longer a left over anomaly, both he _and_ Trinity are kind of the foundation of this new version. Trinity has powers because the new version is a part of both of them, not just Neo. 

Note that Neo was powerful, but there was a lot he couldn't do by himself--couldn't break The Analyst's Bullet Time, couldn't fly, and seems to require more effort for his telekinesis. It wasn't until they a) chose each other over their distractions and b) both reawakened that their full potential was unlocked. 


Amol said:


> So a lot of new plot points have been created.
> I had thought that Analyst was the new top dog of the machine world but apparently that was not true. He has superiors over him. I wonder who really has the highest authority in the machine world. They clearly are not united anymore. Multiple AIs doing whatever they like. Maybe in the next movie, we will meet faction of evil men who are on side of the evil machine as they want to keep the matrix going on.


That was always the case tough; The Architect had authority in The Matrix, but he wasn't the final authority in the machine world. In _Revolutions_ we encountered that Kree Intelligence-like machine representative, but I have  feeling the old Machine paradigm had a strict ruling body. 

You're right in that shit done changed, there does to appear to be a more defined power structure in this new world order. If they do follow-ups it will likely involve taking down this new leadership, or negotiating with it. 


Amol said:


> There is the fact that Smith is also on loose again. That never ends well. This is like the second time Neo has failed to kill him. Maybe the third time is the charm.


Smith is interesting; things appear to be different for him as well--he explains that he was kept on a leash while Neo and Trinity were trapped, and their freedom seemed to free him as well. 

Since this is a new Matrix with (apparently) new rules, his powers might have changed as well. He probably can't multiply like a virus the way he used to, it's possible he'll operate like a Joker-esque wild card. 


MartialHorror said:


> The use of footage from the original has to be the most baffling creative decision in the movie.


When they started using the flashbacks I was worried, but that was quickly laid to rest. 

I felt the use of the flashbacks--exactly as they looked in the original films--intercut between Neo and Trinity's viceral reactions to the memories was the _best_ use of callbacks and original footage that I have ever seen.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## Zeit (Dec 31, 2021)

MartialHorror said:


> From what I heard, the director of the John Wick movies was too busy with "John Wick 4" to do any real work on this.



Fair enough, still a shame.



MartialHorror said:


> The use of footage from the original has to be the most baffling creative decision in the movie.
> 
> I get it for when Agent Smith is reintroduced, but all the other times, it really felt like they were worried general audiences had forgotten all those iconic moments.



I found that so goddamn distracting and it kept taking me out of the flow of the movie, like every couple of seconds in the first 30 or so minutes it seemed to reference cut to the original movies and then slightly better to being every few minutes for the remaining 2 hours. 

Like on the one hand I get it was intentional meta commentary based on the earlier scenes pre-unplugging in the gaming company ("I know you don't want to make a sequel but the bosses have mandated it one way or the other, so this isn't a passion project but a labour"/"audiences loved the original(s) so we need to keep overtly reminding them of that to milk nostalgia"/"people desire comfort not change") and I appreciate that, but on the other hand I resent that even 20 years later the audience are still being treated like morons who can't make connections without it being literally slammed in their faces.

What I think I actually really gets to me about this is that the bones/ideas are actually as solid as any Matrix sequel and the big philosophical questions are there, just the end product feels like something produced by a mid-tier TV production company. Like apparently more was spent making this than on freaking DUNE, which just blows my mind.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Canute87 (Dec 31, 2021)

So is it that Matrix 4 suffered the same fate as godfather 3?


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## Mickey Mouse (Dec 31, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> So is it that Matrix 4 suffered the same fate as godfather 3?


Not to me. I liked this. But that is just me.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Velocity (Dec 31, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> So is it that Matrix 4 suffered the same fate as godfather 3?


I didn't hate it but I have no idea why it exists. It feels less like a sequel or a reboot and more like a somewhat wry critique on the purpose of sequels and reboots.

Just felt so much like they didn't really have a choice. If they didn't make this movie, someone else would have. It was getting made regardless, so the choice - whether to make the movie - was already made.

Several lines felt like that - like they were included as a commentary on the movie itself, why it was made and why they made it. It was bizarre.


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## Mickey Mouse (Jan 1, 2022)

Velocity said:


> I didn't hate it but I have no idea why it exists. It feels less like a sequel or a reboot and more like a somewhat wry critique on the purpose of sequels and reboots.
> 
> Just felt so much like they didn't really have a choice. If they didn't make this movie, someone else would have. It was getting made regardless, so the choice - whether to make the movie - was already made.
> 
> Several lines felt like that - like they were included as a commentary on the movie itself, why it was made and why they made it. It was bizarre.


Almost like......a lack of freedom of choice?

Reactions: Winner 2


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## MartialHorror (Jan 1, 2022)

I had mild expectations, but in the end, they weren't met. TO BE FAIR, I don't think the Wachowski's ever meant to be mainstream directors. I think at heart, they're niche directors who would be more comfortable with a cult following. There's nothing wrong with that. I love David Lynch, who is the ultimate niche. They all do what they want, not necessarily what others want to see. 

With "The Matrix" though, the stars just aligned that it found a mainstream appeal. But every movie they've done since then, including the sequels, is not really mainstream. They feel more tailored for a smaller yet passionate cult following. The problem is that "The Matrix" guaranteed them big budgets, so their movies often flop in a more noticeable way and worse, they're marketed for mass consumption, leaving general audiences more likely to feel bitter.

I do have an admiration for the Wachowski's, but I think they would be better served doing some smaller films. Go back to their routes, with stuff like "Bound". I think playing in the big budgeted sci-fi sandbox just makes it seem like they've 'lost it', when I think the truth is stuff like esoteric arthouse films "Cloud Atlas" or strange trips down nostalgia lane like "Speed Racer" is what they really wanted to make all along.


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## Undertaker (Jan 2, 2022)

Amol said:


> How exactly does Trinity get Neo's powers though?


through feminism


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## Sunrider (Jan 2, 2022)

Velocity said:


> I didn't hate it but I have no idea why it exists. It feels less like a sequel or a reboot and more like a somewhat wry critique on the purpose of sequels and reboots.
> 
> Just felt so much like they didn't really have a choice. If they didn't make this movie, someone else would have. It was getting made regardless, so the choice - whether to make the movie - was already made.
> 
> Several lines felt like that - like they were included as a commentary on the movie itself, why it was made and why they made it. It was bizarre.


If you believe the in-film commentary, Warner was making the film either way, so Lana just decided not waste the opportunity.

As far as stories that probably didn't need a continuation, I was pleased with the choices made in this one.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Charlotte D. Kurisu (Jan 3, 2022)

Worst thing about this movie is that I tried drinking Cortado and it tasted like actual ass.

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Velocity (Jan 3, 2022)

Amol said:


> How exactly does Trinity get Neo's powers though?


It was a flaw in the design of the new Matrix. The Analyst was using the bond between Neo and Trinity to basically power it because there weren't enough humans to, right? And Neo was The One of the previous Matrix, so that connection within the code of the new Matrix basically allows Trinity to tap into the same powers Neo can.

In a way, they're both The One of this new Matrix.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Deathbringerpt (Jan 3, 2022)

I'm sure a lot of people or everyone already pointed this out but I've seen this during my NY hanghover and I don't remember the last time I've seen a movie that hates itself this much.

The first 40 minutes is just Keanu Reeves going through a horrible depression surrounded by literal fucking clowns going BULLET TIME WAS RAD, BRO and WE NEED TO ACTIVATE PEOPLE'S WTF BRAIN SYNAPSES and MATRIX IS _OBVIOUSLY_ ABOUT TRANS POLITICS and other extreme generalizations of the trilogy. Feels like she was just on shitting on fanboys and business suits as much as she could.

Hell, the plot even namedrops Warner Brothers *directly*. THEY'LL DO THIS "GAME" WITH OR WITHOUT YOU. This shit is as subtle as a manatee performing surgery.

I thought that the Wachowski that chose to do the movie would be the sellout of the 2 since I remember reading that the one that sat out did it because she hates Hollywood. Turns out the one who stayed feels the same and just wanted to tell literally everyone to fuck off.

That's all well and dandy (But not really) but I doubt that she wanted to make it that badly. The visuals are weirdly shitty, the fights are stale as hell to the point that they just give up and make Keanu pull One powers all the time. The bot thing is kinda neat but it just feels like they're pulling digital zombies to make it as basic and cheap as possible. Even the scene where the Analyst slows down time and does his exposition shtick is cool but the effects just look...kind bad.

We could've had a "Fuck You WB" from Lana and still had a good movie in there. Instead of this Trinity fanfiction shit, we could've focused on the robot civil war or something.

I kinda zoned out when it was over and turns out it has a post credit scene...with more clowns saying stupid shit how to sell Matrix again. CATRIX, XD

I don't think Lana wanted this movie to succeed but it's hard to see where the sabotage ends and the incompetence begins. The Matrix really was lightning in a bottle.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Winner 1


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## Charlotte D. Kurisu (Jan 3, 2022)

Deathbringerpt said:


> I'm sure a lot of people or everyone already pointed this out but I've seen this during my NY hanghover and I don't remember the last time I've seen a movie that hates itself this much.
> 
> The first 40 minutes is just Keanu Reeves going through a horrible depression surrounded by literal fucking clowns going BULLET TIME WAS RAD, BRO and WE NEED TO ACTIVATE PEOPLE'S WTF BRAIN SYNAPSES and MATRIX IS _OBVIOUSLY_ ABOUT TRANS POLITICS and other extreme generalizations of the trilogy. Feels like she was just on shitting on fanboys and business suits as much as she could.
> 
> ...



Blue glass frames, blue hair, blue shirt, blue walls, blue floors, blue dick, blue pussy... get it? Modern day media production is a prison of algorithm keywords and cash cow shackles with zero creativity or freedom... Are you getting it? No? Here's a homeless Frenchman that'll spell it out for ya? Sacre bleu...

Wait... Sacre *bleu *

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 2


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## reiatsuflow (Jan 3, 2022)

I like meta stuff but this wasn't a creative use of meta. It feels like the industry is still stuck in whatever groundwork Scream laid out, where the characters have awareness of the real world context of their movie. That was some 30 years ago, time to find a new angle.


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## Amol (Jan 4, 2022)

I think movie should have focused alot on Machines Civil War.
The idea that machines are not united is fascinating.


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## Deathbringerpt (Jan 4, 2022)

Charlotte D. Kurisu said:


> Blue glass frames, blue hair, blue shirt, blue walls, blue floors, blue dick, blue pussy... get it? Modern day media production is a prison of algorithm keywords and cash cow shackles with zero creativity or freedom... Are you getting it? No? Here's a homeless Frenchman that'll spell it out for ya? Sacre bleu...
> 
> Wait... Sacre *bleu *



Totally forgot to mention him. That was something else. I guess you can chalk him to ramble like a crazy hobo but that shit was so fucking obvious and blunt, it was just ridiculous.

I kinda chuckled at his goons being weeb cosplayers instead of BDSM gimps. The freaks got contemporary.


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## ~Gesy~ (Jan 4, 2022)

Amol said:


> I think movie should have focused alot on Machines Civil War.
> The idea that machines are not united is fascinating.


It isn't much of a civil war..seems like they just stay out of eachother's way


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## Undertaker (Jan 6, 2022)

So, before entering the Matrix do they put on diapers? Or do they pull down their pants and sit on a chair with a buit-in toilet?

Because if they can bleed then all kinds of accidents can happen while they are in the Matrix.

Never explained this

Reactions: Funny 3 | Winner 1


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## Zeit (Jan 9, 2022)

Deathbringerpt said:


> We could've had a "Fuck You WB" from Lana and still had a good movie in there.



Kinda hard to write a good movie when you're intent on using the movie itself as the vehicle for your giant fuck you to the (old) audience/studio.


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## DemonDragonJ (Jan 11, 2022)

I have not yet seen this movie, and I may or may not see it, but how did the movie address (if it did, at all) the fact that people use landline telephones far less frequently than they did in the 1990's, when the franchise began? In the original film, landlines were the only way to exit the Matrix, but I imagine that the writers needed to change that, since people use cell phones far more frequently, now.


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## MartialHorror (Jan 12, 2022)

DemonDragonJ said:


> I have not yet seen this movie, and I may or may not see it, but how did the movie address (if it did, at all) the fact that people use landline telephones far less frequently than they did in the 1990's when the franchise began? In the original film, landlines were the only way to exit the Matrix, but I imagine that the writers needed to change that, since people use cell phones far more frequently, now.



If memory serves, they can just transport you out if you're in a certain location (wi-fi hotspot?)... or something... I can't really remember, lol.

Reactions: Useful 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Jan 12, 2022)

You can go through your reflection or something?


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## Deathbringerpt (Jan 12, 2022)

You just open hacked  doors or whatever. It’s boring as shit.


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## DemonDragonJ (Jan 12, 2022)

MartialHorror said:


> If memory serves, they can just transport you out if you're in a certain location (wi-fi hotspot?)... or something... I can't really remember, lol.



That makes sense.


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## MartialHorror (Jan 12, 2022)

Yeah, it was kind of an underwhelming way of handling it, but it didn't really bother me because 

-- Technology advanced. What can you do?
-- There weren't as many really suspenseful scenarios which required it... at least as much as the first film had anyway.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Sunrider (Jan 13, 2022)

MartialHorror said:


> Yeah, it was kind of an underwhelming way of handling it, but it didn't really bother me because
> 
> -- Technology advanced. What can you do?
> -- There weren't as many really suspenseful scenarios which required it... at least as much as the first film had anyway.


Honestly I don't think there was a way to properly account for technological progress and still maintain the suspense of land line use. 

But there was still a maximum depth at which they could transmit into The Matrix, which carries it's own stakes I guess.


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## dr_shadow (Jan 16, 2022)

Finally saw it.

For what it was, I liked it! As far as coerced practical-joke sequels go.  Third act kind of dragged, though.


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## dr_shadow (Jan 16, 2022)

~Gesy~ said:


> Yeah the action was trash too. His force powers (lol) got old quick, and the hand to hand combat was choppy and weird when I'm used to matrix setting the standard in that regard.





blakstealth said:


> Just watched this. Dunno what yall are talking about, the action was pretty good. The only nitpick is that the hand to hand combat was not as good as the trilogy's. There's definitely a lot more cuts and less one-shots of letting the fights play out.





TheOmega said:


> Neo was old and washed up from all them years poppin pillies. If they make a part 5 he gon be bussin ass



When making the original trilogy, Keanu Reeves (b. 1964) was aged 35-39, whereas he is now 57. Carrie-Anne Moss (b. 1967) was 32-36 and is now 54.

If you watch the feature-length documentary _The Matrix Revisited_ (1999), you'll learn that back then the core cast did most or all of their fight sequences themselves. The Wachowskis insisted that Yuen Woo-ping painstakingly train the actors in martial arts rather than use stund doubles who already knew martial arts. They only used doubles for really dangerous things like when somebody has to be knocked through a brick wall or the like.

I think Keanu who is now two decades older possibly no longer has the agility and stamina to do his own fights, and if he were to do them the insurance company might object that there is a serious risk of him injuring himself for real. So they made Neo's fights less spectacular, and also gave him long hair so that when he's shot from the back it's harder to distinguish if it's Keanu or a stunt man.

I don't know if he does he's own stunts on John Wick, though, so I could be wrong.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## dr_shadow (Jan 16, 2022)

To reiterate my post earlier in the thread, the _zeitgeist_ of 2021 is obviously different from 1999.

Between 1991 and 2001, the United States enjoyed an uninterrupted ten years of peace and economic growth. Meaning that people who came of age in this decade had "no Great War and no Great Depression" (Fight Club) to give their lives meaning, or –purpose– as The Matrix would put it. Instead it seemed like life would just consist of hammering away at the same keyboard in the same office cubicle FOREVER, only so your kids can go on doing the same once you finally punch out. This created a generation of Americans who suffered from collective boredom and wanted to "escape the system".

Whereas today, the US has just finished a 20-year war and experienced two major recessions. Which perhaps leaves more people saying "you know what, I'll have that blue pill please." Which is probably what we're alluding to in this movie. Modern Americans don't want freedom, they want Trump safety and stability. The US is now a nation of Cyphers.

---

I think the Analyst said that with his modifications, 99.9% of people choose to stay in the the Matrix. Whereas in Reloaded, the Architect said that 99% (unconsciously) choose to stay. If we take these figures literally, the Analyst had cut the defection rate to only a tenth of what it was before: from previously 1.0% to now only 0.1%.

By the way, Morpheus says in Reloaded that Zion has a population of 0.25 million. If they are the 1% escapees, that would suggest that the population of the Matrix is no more than 25 million (about the size of Canada) – probably less, since some of Zion's population are second generation. But I think in the original, Smith said that the Matrix contains "billions" of people. So, yeah, probably the writers weren't being anal about having all the numbers be consistent with one another. They probably just want to express "a lot" or "very few".

Reactions: Winner 1 | Creative 1


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