# gaara can actually beat Ei



## Icegaze (Mar 19, 2015)

@kazekage94 i owe you an apology 
From DB it seems the drop kick gaara blocked was actually enhanced by Ei using gravity to increase the strength of his attack. or so the DB 4 says 

*After covering himself in his Lightning Release Chakra Mode, A jumps into the air above his opponent and performs a downwards kick, using the momentum of the fall to increase the power behind the attack.*

location: kage summit
gaara has just provoked EI. both are bloodlusted. who wins?
knowledge: manga
distance: 25m


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## Ghost (Mar 19, 2015)

Ei rips off Gaara's head in a blitz and shits inside of him.


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## pluuuuffff (Mar 19, 2015)

I don't think so.

Gaara improved a lot since what we saw against Lee. He still has his armor of sand, and he can transform himself in Suna Bunshins if needed, like he did against Lee.

Gaara's more inteligent, skilled and rational than Ei. Ah, and Gaara can just fly in his sand, Ei's jumps aren't enough.

With manga knowledge, the probability of Ei hitting a clone just increased. I see Gaara winning more times than not.


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## Ghost (Mar 19, 2015)

pluuuuffff said:


> Gaara improved a lot since what we saw against Lee.


I did not know that.


> He still has his armor of sand,


Ei's Raiton covered fist that tore through CS lvl 2 Juugo doesn't give a shit.


> and he can transform himself in Suna Bunshins if needed, like he did against Lee.


And what are those bunshins going to do? Waste Gaara's chakra and delay his death for 0.3 seconds?


> Gaara's more inteligent, skilled and rational than Ei.


I am more intelligent, skilled and rational than a freight train moving at top speed but it doesn't mean I can stop it.


> Ah, and Gaara can just fly in his sand, Ei's jumps aren't enough.


In which of Gaara's fights has he gone airborne immediately? 


> With manga knowledge, the probability of Ei hitting a clone just increased.


How exactly? By the time Gaara has created a clone Ei is already planting his fist into Gaara's face. Don't act like Gaara is fast as Itachi at making a clone and switching places with it for an effective feint.


> I see Gaara winning more times than not.


He has literally zero chances of winning.


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## pluuuuffff (Mar 19, 2015)

Saikyou said:


> I did not know that.
> 
> Ei's Raiton covered fist that tore through CS lvl 2 Juugo doesn't give a shit.
> 
> ...



He didn't show any seal on the fight against Lee... And he did it, didn't he?

And by the way, if u didn't see that he evolved a lot since the fight against Lee on the chuunin exam, than yes, that gaara we saw gets destroyed.

But the gaara who fought Nidaime Mizukage, that one, can fuck Ei.

And by the way, Gaara knows about Ei speed, why is he going to stay on the ground? Logic


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## Rocky (Mar 19, 2015)

There is no way that Gaara's Gourd Sand packs the defensive might to stop somebody physically strong enough to smash through Susano'o & dismember Bijuu from trucking right through it and punching a hole right through him.

If need be, A could just fool the sand like Kid Lee did and punch a defenseless Gaara in the face, which would likely crumble his skull.


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## Sadgoob (Mar 19, 2015)

The only situation Gaara wouldn't beat A in is indoors with just his gourd. A is overrated. He rarely uses v2 right away and he is otherwise ≈ Sasuke restricted to lightning kenjutsu.​


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## Rocky (Mar 19, 2015)

Strategoob said:


> The only situation Gaara wouldn't beat A in is indoors with just his gourd. A is overrated.



Gaara wouldn't exactly win outside either unless the battle began in Suna or at 100 meters with Gaara having preparation time and knowledge. 



> and he is otherwise ≈ Sasuke restricted to lightning kenjutsu.



v1 A without using Shunshin vs. Sasuke without using the Mangekyou:


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## DaVizWiz (Mar 19, 2015)

A should blitz him inside and cut through him and his sand armor with Raiton Chop.


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## UchihaX28 (Mar 19, 2015)

Ei eventually overwhelms Gaara. Considering Gaara could react to Madara's V3 Susano'o clones, I wouldn't be surprised if Gaara could react to V2 Ei somewhat, however, V2 Ei easily overwhelms him as eventually, his limited amount of sand that he does have will be unable to compete with Ei.

 Gaara really only has a chance if he's in an environment with a lot of soil/ sand.


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## pluuuuffff (Mar 20, 2015)

My bad.

Didn't see the location. In this case, yes, hard for gaara.

If it was in a normal terrain, like 4th great ninja war, he had chances. In a desert, he would have almost 100%.

But here, hard.


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## Icegaze (Mar 20, 2015)

Rocky said:


> There is no way that Gaara's Gourd Sand packs the defensive might to stop somebody physically strong enough to smash through Susano'o & dismember Bijuu from trucking right through it and punching a hole right through him.
> 
> If need be, A could just fool the sand like Kid Lee did and punch a defenseless Gaara in the face, which would likely crumble his skull.



i see u didnt read the OP 
gaara sand has already stopped Ei attack casually. 
consideirng how DB describes his drop kick its actually enhanced by gravity. and even then gaara with just a little sand stopped it

Ei cant harm gaara if he tried his best


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## Alex Payne (Mar 20, 2015)

Being enhanced by gravity makes a difference? In Naruto-level superhuman fights? Seriously?


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## Sadgoob (Mar 20, 2015)

Rocky said:


> v1 A without using Shunshin vs. Sasuke without using the Mangekyou



A's lucky Sasuke stuck his hand in his massive chest  before that (and coudn't reach his heart,) and not his Chidori blade, eh?​


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## Alex Payne (Mar 20, 2015)

Eiso isn't as "sharp" as Chidori though.


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## ARGUS (Mar 20, 2015)

Ay blitzes him, 
indoors location and a starting distance of 25m just calls for this to happpen, 

gaaras sand blocked gullotine drop where Ay was in free fall, nothing implies that his sand travels or moves as fast as  Ay, or even close to that, especially when Joki boy danced around it just fine,


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## Icegaze (Mar 20, 2015)

Alex Payne said:


> Being enhanced by gravity makes a difference? In Naruto-level superhuman fights? Seriously?



well to the author enough of a difference to mention that it increases the power behind his attack 
so yes it does make a difference

as to A blitzing well he would. but he would not be breaching sand armor if he isnt able to kick through gaara sand despite the power behind *his attack being increased as the author described*


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## Alex Payne (Mar 20, 2015)

So which do you think is stronger - Ei using his maximum speed/acceleration to move at his target with his best punch or this Guillotine Drop with its gravity+leg swing?


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## Ghost (Mar 20, 2015)

free fall kick is fucking weak. Ei using his whole body to strengthen the kick is far stronger.


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## Icegaze (Mar 20, 2015)

Alex Payne said:


> So which do you think is stronger - Ei using his maximum speed/acceleration to move at his target with his best punch or this Guillotine Drop with its gravity+leg swing?



same strength 
since he is a momentum type person

he uses gravity or his speed to enhance his hits

eg a karate chop while he isnt moving is weaker than a V1 speed which is weaker than at V2 speed which is equal to him falling on u with a karate chop after a jump

@saikyou read DB 4. kishi specifically says the power behind his kick is powered up. why argue with the author ?


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## Alex Payne (Mar 20, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> same strength


Right... Good day to you.


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## Icegaze (Mar 20, 2015)

lol i dont see why u would foolishly argue with kishi the author of the manga
cut your nonesense logic out

he did jump and chop madara rib cage susanoo. once it didnt break he said i need more speed. 

not if i go full speed at him i would have better luck.

why Ei knew that chop was as hard as he could hit madara. 

not only are u arguing with the DB but also the manga. dont be stupid

odd how he cut hachibi horn with his downwards karate chop


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## Nikushimi (Mar 20, 2015)

Lol no he can't.

The Raikage runs circles around Gaara all day and waits for his chakra to run out. Then he chokeslams the Kazekage through a table.


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## Alex Payne (Mar 20, 2015)

I am not arguing with Kishi. I am arguing with you. DB states that by using this move Raikage augments his leg swing with gravity to boost its power. And... that's exactly what this move does. But why did you randomly decide that this move is one of his strongest? Why would this move be stronger than all other known attacks? Why would this +gravity boost mean that Gaara can defend himself from other attacks? There is nothing in that DB article about those things - it simply explains how this move works.

Gaara would need favorable distance + open location to stand a chance. In here he gets murdered.


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## Icegaze (Mar 20, 2015)

Alex Payne said:


> I am not arguing with Kishi. I am arguing with you. DB states that by using this move Raikage augments his leg swing with gravity to boost its power. And... that's exactly what this move does. But why did you randomly decide that this move is one of his strongest? Why would this move be stronger than all other known attacks? Why would this +gravity boost mean that Gaara can defend himself from other attacks? There is nothing in that DB article about those things - it simply explains how this move works.
> 
> Gaara would need favorable distance + open location to stand a chance. In here he gets murdered.



i didnt say strongest. its however V2 Ei who used that move. which means he isnt going to be hitting any harder. his chop or punches wont be harder than that. thats all am saying. doesnt mean thats his strongest move. never said such

gaara defended that attack which is as strong as all his other V2 attacks. thats all i have said 

so if his leg drop which is as strong as all his other full speed V2 attacks cant breach gaara sand. then gaara can play defensive and not get damaged by Ei in the slightest


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## Rocky (Mar 20, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> i see u didnt read the OP
> gaara sand has already stopped Ei attack casually.
> consideirng how DB describes his drop kick its actually enhanced by gravity. and even then gaara with just a little sand stopped it.



A kick enhanced by the speed of gravity isn't going to be anywhere near as powerful as a strike enhanced by the speed of A's Body Flicker.



Strategoob said:


> A's lucky Sasuke stuck his hand in his massive chest  before that (and coudn't reach his heart,) and not his Chidori blade, eh?​



_Lucky?_

The reason Sasuke couldn't reach his heart had nothing to do with luck. The reason Sasuke didn't use his Chidori blade likewise was not Sasuke simply getting "lucky."

Both of those things occurred because of A's inhumane durability; Sasuke had just watched his lightning sword bounce of the Raikage's neck, and he only managed to _cut_ A with his most penetrative attack.

You're reaching. Hard.


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## Icegaze (Mar 20, 2015)

Rocky said:


> A kick enhanced by the speed of gravity isn't going to be anywhere near as powerful as a strike enhanced by the speed of A's Body Flicker.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



kishi disagrees. read how the technique is described. why mention the power behind his attack is increased if it isnt ???
read the DB. its simple, its written in english


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## Rocky (Mar 20, 2015)

When did I say that A's free-falling leg drop was _not_ enhanced by gravitational acceleration? The fact that it is is common sense.

However, even at terminal velocity, A isn't going to reach the hypersonic speeds he normally moves at with Shunshin.


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## Icegaze (Mar 20, 2015)

Rocky said:


> When did I say that A's free-falling leg drop was _not_ enhanced by gravitational acceleration? The fact that it is is common sense.
> 
> However, even at terminal velocity, A isn't going to reach the hypersonic speeds he normally moves at with Shunshin.



the DB says the power of his attack is enhanced and specifically mentions it 

why would u assume that leg drop is less powerful than say his full speed punch 

considering when he did the leg drop he was in V2 and the DB specifically mentions the power behind his attack is increased. 

the faster Ei moves the harder he hits. 

The DB never said his leg drop was less powerful than his full speed hits. again why specifically mention the power behind his attack is increased if thats like the weakest hit he ever pulled off in the manga? 

he jumped and swung his leg down with V2 speed. why would that be slower than his shushin?

*so i take it you all think sakura when she jumped and punched the ground full of juubilings that her punch there was weaker than it would be if she just what stood there and punched the ground? do you all honestly believe that? doesnt tsunade have a move very similar to Ei guillotine drop? why would jumping up in the air and coming down at them be weaker than running at them?*

worse is again the DB very clearly disagrees *using the momentum of the fall to increase the power behind the attack.*

to further prove my point 

DB description of *lightning oppression horizontal drop *

*Covered in the Lightning Release Chakra Mode, A leaps from a high vantage point and performs a simple yet powerful horizontal chop on his opponent from above, seemingly using the momentum gained in the previous fall to increase the force behind his strike. In the event the attack isn't powerful enough to penetrate an opponent's defence, the attack can be used to push an opponent well into the ground to prevent them from escaping from another incoming attack.*

*lightning impression horizontal *

*After covering himself in his Lightning Release Chakra Mode, A performs a simple backhanded horizontal chop against his opponent, which is powerful enough to snap even the bones of Sasuke Uchiha's Susanoo's ribcage.[1]

*

notice the difference in descrption between the 2 moves???


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## Rocky (Mar 20, 2015)

I see the issue.

A being in v2 doesn't mean he's always moving at Amaterasu-dodging speeds. That transformation heightens his reflexes which is what allows him to move at such speeds by utilizing the body flicker technique.

Guillotine Drop is going to be more powerful than a standing blow, but it isn't going to eclipse the power of strikes when A is moving at faster-than-sound speeds. That's just physics.


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## Bonly (Mar 20, 2015)

A likely dodges all of Gaara's attacks and eventually makes his way to Gaara and gives him a few chops to end things.


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## Icegaze (Mar 20, 2015)

Rocky said:


> I see the issue.
> 
> A being in v2 doesn't mean he's always moving at Amaterasu-dodging speeds. That transformation heightens his reflexes which is what allows him to move at such speeds by utilizing the body flicker technique.
> 
> Guillotine Drop is going to be more powerful than a standing blow, but it isn't going to eclipse the power of strikes when A is moving at faster-than-sound speeds. That's just physics.



so what u are saying is Ei wasnt moving at V2 speeds when he tried to drop kick sasuke?
so what he slowed down to give his enemy more time??? why ?

again read the DB descrption between lightning oppressing horizontal and horizontal drop

u would notice again it says the power behind his attack is increased!!! 

why mention it twice in the DB if it isnt a stronger attack than his normal ones? 

again u would have to prove Ei wasnt moving at V2 speeds, considering he had no reason to slow down


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## DaVizWiz (Mar 20, 2015)

Power is irrelevant Icegaze. Gaara, in a desert, could not stop Joki Boy's movements with his sand alone. 

Joki Boy isn't faster than V2 Ei. He will literally never catch him. Assuming he does, Ei already tanked 
1. Light Travel
2. Lariat
3. Enton
and his lightning chakra mode makes him immune to sand attacks outright, he simply streams lightning into sand covering him and it drops inanimate, the same way his father did. 

Raiton Chop goes directly through his sand armor whether he was wielding it or a child is, it negates doton techniques and cuts into the enemy just like Chidori. Ei's physical strength only serves to augment it's capabilities by physically pushing through more durable objects just like his father, this was obvious when he chopped a Mini Buddha Statue hand in half while only in base, add Lightning to that hand and his V2 max velocity torpedoing that hand directly into the target- it's a penetrative sword accompanied by Ei's explosive physical power.


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## Bonly (Mar 20, 2015)

A is only that fast(as in being able to dodge Ama and what not) when he uses the Shunshin jutsu, he's not constantly using that speed 24/7 when he's in V2. So unless A used the Shunshin jutsu while in free fall bringing down his leg then his leg drop wouldn't be the same speed as if he used his Shunshin to smash someone's face in like when he tried that on Minato and Naruto.


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## Icegaze (Mar 20, 2015)

DaVizWiz said:


> Power is irrelevant Icegaze. Gaara, in a desert, could not stop Joki Boy's movements with his sand alone.
> 
> Joki Boy isn't faster than V2 Ei. He will literally never catch him.
> 
> Raiton Chop goes directly through his sand armor whether he was wielding it or a child is, it negates doton techniques and cuts into the enemy just like Chidori. Ei's physical strength only serves to augment it's capabilities by physically pushing through more durable objects, this was obvious when he chopped a Mini Buddha Statue hand in half while only in base, add Lightning to that hand and his V2 max velocity torpedoing that hand directly into the target- there isn't much he isn't splitting in half.



so why didnt his drop kick negate the doton properties of gaara sand?? 
he chopped budda hand in V1 or V2 
not base. nice try though 

its odd how gaara sand really wasnt negated by his drop kick which had more power in it as the DB described. 

gaara shells up and Ei basically cant harm him in the slightest. he doesnt have to try keep up with Ei speed. he can play on the counter attack. Sand clones, Ei hits it and his hand will already be caught in sand. then Ei gets burried. 

I am not remotely implying gaara sand will catch Ei in any other way.

@Bonly why would A not have been using shunshin? again unless u are trying hard not to read it. it does say his free fall attacks are stronger on 2 separate occassions. 
again A was going for the kill against sasuke its obvious he went at sasuke with full speed there


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## Rocky (Mar 20, 2015)

Guillotine drop is not technique he is able to combine Shunshin with. It's impossible to jump _and fall_ on somebody while moving at flicker speeds. There are other facts that support that he was in free fall, such as:

*1.)* Gaara had time to move sand in between them despite being a slow character.

...and

*2.)* Sasuke had time to physically cover his eye and shape fire into spikes, and guys like C and Karin could react to that. Yet characters like The Yellow Flash barley have time for instantaneous jutsu like Hiraishin before v2 A can successfully blitz.

...but A factually cannot fall at a v2 shunshin pace. He can push off something elevated and propel himself towards the ground, but he just jumped into the air against Sasuke, so he would have been coming down in free-fall, because there was nothing to push off of.


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## DaVizWiz (Mar 20, 2015)

> so why didnt his drop kick negate the doton properties of gaara sand??
> he chopped budda hand in V1 or V2
> not base. nice try though


No, he was in base. Do look back. You are aware Ei has incredible physical strength outside of Lightning Chakra Mode? 



> its odd how gaara sand really wasnt negated by his drop kick which had more power in it as the DB described.


Power is irrelevant, he can't stream lightning into a blade through his fucking leg. He can only do it through his arm canonically. That was literally nothing more than a free fall kick. 

Ei chopped his own arm off by streaming lightning into a blade. 



> gaara shells up and Ei basically cant harm him in the slightest. he doesnt have to try keep up with Ei speed. he can play on the counter attack. Sand clones, Ei hits it and his hand will already be caught in sand. then Ei gets burried.


Buried inside of the Kage summit?

You're fucking comical man. Gaara barely has enough to cover Ei's body with his gourd sand. He's not burying anyone in a stone building. 

Ei instantly streams lightning into the sand and it drops inanimate, then he blitzes Gaara and chops his fucking head off.

Gaara couldn't even avoid a kicked Minato, now he's avoiding V2 Ei by manifesting sand clones from 25m?

No chance whatsoever. None. Zilch. Nada.

No one agrees with you, stop with the rant, you're becoming a fucking eyesore.


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## Icegaze (Mar 20, 2015)

DaVizWiz said:


> No, he was in base. Do look back. You are aware Ei has incredible physical strength outside of Lightning Chakra Mode?
> 
> Power is irrelevant, he can't stream lightning into a blade through his fucking leg. He can only do it through his arm canonically. That was literally nothing more than a free fall kick.
> 
> ...



feats of any streaming raiton into the sand to nullify it or however u put it. 
Ei was covered in lightning, he is stream raiton through out his entire body. if his kick didnt nullify it his punch wont either. 

the way u sounding it means sasuke with chidori should have no problem against gaara then. 

gaara defense it automatic. though. so even if he cant react sand will still protect him. 
considering he always got sand armor on. he should be just fine. 

u would need to prove Ei cant stream lightning through his leg. despite being covered from head to toe in a raiton cloak


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## UchihaX28 (Mar 20, 2015)

- Newton's 2nd Law: F = ma

- V2 Raikage max acceleration > -9.8 m/s^2.

 Mmmkay, how is a guillotine drop even on the same level as the force applied V2 Raikage's Strike that's powered up by his Shunshun? I know you of all people Icegaze values Physics in debates, so this shouldn't come off a surprise to you. You claim momentum is what dictates Raikage's strength, but higher acceleration does mean higher velocity, so a Guillotine drop is considerably weaker and shouldn't even be considered his max strength unless you believe V2 Raikage's Shunshin boosts his speed less than gravity does.


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## Icegaze (Mar 21, 2015)

@NarutoX28 
read the bloody DB 

also i dont get why people fighting this so hard. 

sakura when she jumps and punches down like she did with the juublings isnt that stronger than her just standing there and punching the ground???

The fact is whether Ei is moving at V2 speeds or not the DB clearly states he is using his fall to increase the power behind his attack on 2 separate occassions with 2 separate techniques

When he used the horizontal drop on madara, he said i need more speed and opted for backpack. he didnt make it sound like if he has used his shushin he would have had better luck

so why?

btw i dont value physics when it comes to naruto. it doesnt remotely apply to this manga!!! case in point our current Debate


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## Bonly (Mar 21, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> @Bonly why would A not have been using shunshin?



Shunshin is a putting chakra into the legs for a quick burst of speed to go from point A to point B. If he's in mid air then he can't really use that burst of speed to move from point A to point B since his feet isn't on a surface to push off of to go to point B.



> again unless u are trying hard not to read it. it does say *his free fall attacks are stronger* on 2 separate occassions.



Where does it say that free fall attacks are stronger then an Shunshin attack combo?



> again A was going for the kill against sasuke its obvious he went at sasuke with full speed there



A was going from for the kill since he ran into Sasuke yet did he use his full speed right off the bat? Nope, just because he was going for the kill doesn't mean he was running at top speed 24/7.


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## Kazekage94 (Mar 21, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> @kazekage94 i owe you an apology
> From DB it seems the drop kick gaara blocked was actually enhanced by Ei using gravity to increase the strength of his attack. or so the DB 4 says
> 
> *After covering himself in his Lightning Release Chakra Mode, A jumps into the air above his opponent and performs a downwards kick, using the momentum of the fall to increase the power behind the attack.*
> ...



It's ok man. I just wanted you to know that.


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## Kazekage94 (Mar 21, 2015)

DaVizWiz said:


> Power is irrelevant Icegaze. Gaara, in a desert, could not stop Joki Boy's movements with his sand alone.
> 
> Joki Boy isn't faster than V2 Ei. He will literally never catch him. Assuming he does, Ei already tanked
> 1. Light Travel
> ...


Here we go again. 
That wasn't a normal sand desert. 
Gaara wasn't trying to catch him, he was just trying to provoke it. 

Then at the end, he caught it. Let's remember that. 

Gaara in Sauna catches that thing in no time. 
Gaara caught Deidara come on


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## DaVizWiz (Mar 21, 2015)

Kazekage94 said:


> Here we go again.
> That wasn't a normal sand desert.
> Gaara wasn't trying to catch him, he was just trying to provoke it.
> 
> ...


It was clearly a fucking desert to anyone with eyes. Are you fucking kidding me fanboy? Gaara blew a massive sand wave at the Edo Kage to start the bout. 

He clearly was trying to catch it. That is all Gaara does, catch things with his sand. He has no other option. Provoking it meant that he could not stop it from attacking his allies, meaning he was powerless against it. 

He caught it because of a gold dust clone that slowed it down, he couldn't catch it with his own sand. 

Gaara did not catch Deidara, Deidara canonically admitted he sacrificed his arm for the purpose of planting C1 insects into his gourd sand. 

And are you trying to suggest Deidara > Joki Boy in speed?

Gaara failed to catch Mu & Joki Boy, in a fucking desert, both of which are inferior to Ei in speed by feats & hype.

He has a -100% chance of catching Ei inside the Kage Summit castle with only gourd sand. Assuming he does catch him, he can't do anything to him, he tanks sand coffin / anything else Gaara has and his Raiton Armor & Lightning Streaming renders the sand inanimate, he also cannot bury him in a stone castle.


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## Kazekage94 (Mar 21, 2015)

DaVizWiz said:


> It was clearly a fucking desert to anyone with eyes. Are you fucking kidding me fanboy?
> 
> He clearly was trying to catch it. That is all Gaara does, catch things with his sand. He has no other option.
> 
> ...



First and foremost anyone with eyes can clearly fucking see that, that was not Suna. 

No the hell he wasn't. He tested it out then made a plan because his sand couldn't trap it because of the oil but he was able to catch it. 

It slows down once it expands look at the panel dude. Open your eyes. 

Gaara caught him twice. Once inside the ball of sand and the other, the arm. 

I'm suggesting it's harder to be caught in the air than on ground. 

He failed to catch Muu yet he caught the 3rd Raikage. Dude please. Muu would easily get caught

Tsunami easily catches that bitch. Sit down.


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## Icegaze (Mar 22, 2015)

Bonly said:


> Shunshin is a putting chakra into the legs for a quick burst of speed to go from point A to point B. If he's in mid air then he can't really use that burst of speed to move from point A to point B since his feet isn't on a surface to push off of to go to point B.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



why couldnt he have put the shunshin speed into his jump?? considering he was still cloaked and swining his leg downwards. i dont get the confusion. why would DB specifically mention the power of the attack is increased, if the second Ei leaves the ground the power of his attacks get weaker

so does that mean when Ei punched madara in the air, his punch got weaker??

or are we assuming to shunshin point A to B must be on the ground? if so how did bee get to the other side of the mountain. he jumped and landed there(gravity!!!) did it suddenly slow him down

bonly please read the DB, no other attacks are mentioned as havin increased power behind them bar. horizontal drop and guillotine drop

@kazekage it was suna sand and gaara coudlnt catch jouki boy. i am not implying he does here either. but unlike jouki boy explosion which was harder to counter Ei hits can be countered. but gaara isnt going to straight up catch Ei. he certainly cant do that


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## Kazekage94 (Mar 22, 2015)

Why do you people continue yo forget that he wasn't using his gourd sand?

It was not Suna. Gaara grinded the sand he had. When Muu came, Gaara already put some sensing sand down. If you look at the Tsunami thats also a way he got the sand. It was not a sand desert. Gaara grinded that sand.


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## Icegaze (Mar 22, 2015)

gaara was standing on sand though. gaara had alot of sand at his disposal 
granted his gourd sand is faster


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## UchihaX28 (Mar 22, 2015)

Kazekage94 said:


> Why do you people continue yo forget that he wasn't using his gourd sand?
> 
> It was not Suna. Gaara grinded the sand he had. When Muu came, Gaara already put some sensing sand down. If you look at the Tsunami thats also a way he got the sand. It was not a sand desert. Gaara grinded that sand.



 He used his Gourd Sand against Deidara and we all know what happened to Gaara ...


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## RaSenkoChoRinbukoSanshiki (Mar 22, 2015)

Gaara could t even catch Joki boy. A blitzes ten times over.


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## UchihaX28 (Mar 22, 2015)

Bonly said:


> Shunshin is a putting chakra into the legs for a quick burst of speed to go from point A to point B. If he's in mid air then he can't really use that burst of speed to move from point A to point B since his feet isn't on a surface to push off of to go to point B.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



 This.

 V1 Ei never went full speed against KCM Naruto despite going for the kill. V1 Ei also moved just as quickly as Darui did and struck simultaneously in an attempt to strike MS Sasuke (the strike blocked by Jugo and Suigetsu). Ei never goes full speed even in V1 unless he really needs to.


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## Kazekage94 (Mar 22, 2015)

NarutoX28 said:


> He used his Gourd Sand against Deidara and we all know what happened to Gaara ...



Yes, Gaara managed to catch him and crush his arm.

Why don't you get that sand was useless against oil? Catching him would of done nothing. Gaara had to mix the sand with gold dust then used desert sand to catch Joki Boy. Why don't you get that?


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## blackguyinpinksuit (Mar 22, 2015)

Gaara's sand is not in A's speed bracket no matter how you slice it. I mean his auto sand defense was trolled by minato's kicked body flying into him. The speed of his defense when he controls it has better feats but still is not fast enough to save him from A's flicker and this distance. Any little sand gaara might muster up is cut through by a raiton chop.

Gaara is a long range specialist he needs a desert and distance to win. You cannot put him in range of a CQC beast who is far faster and expect him to win.


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## Bonly (Mar 23, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> why couldnt he have put the shunshin speed into his jump??



Never said he couldn't do that.



> considering he was still cloaked and swining his leg downwards. i dont get the confusion.



The confusion is you seem to think that just because he went V2 that means he was moving at Ama dodging speeds 24/7 just because you think it makes sense which doesn't mean he actually was.



> why would DB specifically mention the power of the attack is increased, if the second Ei leaves the ground the power of his attacks get weaker



Because the way the attack work is the same regardless of whether or not it's weaker then an Shunshin smash combo. He uses gravity to increase his attack. Does he magically not get an increase in his strike just because it's not as strong as a Shunshin smash combo? No, the increase is still there hence the DB mentioning it, because that's what happens.



> so does that mean when Ei punched madara in the air, his punch got weaker??



Since A hit Madara more then once while in the air I'm not sure which one you're talking about but chances are it wouldn't be as strong as him using a Shunshin smash combo like he did against Naruto+Minato.



> or are we assuming to shunshin point A to B must be on the ground? if so how did bee get to the other side of the mountain. he jumped and landed there(gravity!!!) did it suddenly slow him down



If Killer B jumped that means his legs was on a surface first. If he's on a surface then he can use that burst of chakra to leave point A(the spot where Jugo was about to hit him) and go to point B(on the other side of the mountain). One can use the Shunshin and jump, but one can't do use it while already in the air like A was when he started to do his leg drop, unless you have a scan of such that is.  



> bonly please read the DB, no other attacks are mentioned as havin increased power behind them bar. horizontal drop and guillotine drop



That doesn't mean that it's stronger then all other attacks, that just means it gets an increase due to gravity as oppose to the other attacks even though if A just jumped and did a chop it'll get an increase due to gravity like the leg drop but meh. 

-Think about it like this, say A's chop does a damage output of 50 points while his leg drop does a damage output of 30 points. 

-Now lets say the increase in gravity gives an extra 10 points. 

-Does that mean that his leg drop is the stronger of the two? 

-No because the total output would only be 40 points compared to the chop's 50 points. 

Now the thing is we don't know which does more damage by itself (since we didn't see the leg drop hit Susanoo and what not) so saying the gravity increase automatically means it's the stronger of the two is faulty.


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## Icegaze (Mar 23, 2015)

@bonly am not saying it 
kishi is
why not mention that his other attacks power are increased by V2 speed

i am implying he was still using his highest speed considering he was fully prepared to kill sasuke and that happened right after he sent sasuke flying with a chop 

why would he randomly slow down ?? that makes no sense at all 

so A could have easily shunshin and been in the air. why assume it was just a regular jump and isnt exactly like what bee did to get to the other side of the mountain?

Ei could have been on the surface, used shushin and come back down to sasuke with his leg swinging down 
hence why kishi the author says the power of his attack is increased. 

this is further emphazied when he fails to break madara rib cage and says i need more speed. *why mention speed in that scenario if failing on madara using gravity was slow? * why resort to back pack right after that??

i am however not saying that those 2 attacks are his strongest since we know thats lariat. but i believe that has more to do with where is being targetted or something


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## Bonly (Mar 23, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> @bonly am not saying it
> kishi is
> why not mention that his other attacks power are increased by V2 speed



Because if you actually pay attention to the DB (old and new) you'd realize that Kishi doesn't mention things of that nature a majority of the time. 

Go look at DB pages for the sound five and Sasuke for an example of this. As we know the CS powers up their jutsu yet if you look at the DB page for every jutsu they used while in CS1 or CS2 you won't see the DB mention the boost of power of the CS in every single DB page. So does that mean they magically don't get the power boost because Kishi didn't mention the CS's power boost? Of course not. 

The DB just tells us how the jutsu works, it doesn't always add in the boost a person gets from being in a powered up form(SM or CS for example) in said DB page. So that means all it does is account for what the leg drop does, it doesn't outright means that the DB is including A being at his top speed.



> i am implying he was still using his highest speed considering he was fully prepared to kill sasuke and that happened right after he sent sasuke flying with a chop
> 
> why would he randomly slow down ?? that makes no sense at all



"just because you think it makes sense which doesn't mean he actually was.". Again just because it wouldn't make sense to you doesn't mean Kishi wouldn't spit in your face and have it done anyway, there are a shitload of things Kishi does with this manga that doesn't make sense so trying to use that to say your implication is right isn't always gonna be true.



> so A could have easily shunshin and been in the air. *why assume it was just a regular jump *and isnt exactly like what bee did to get to the other side of the mountain?



Did I say we should assume he could not have done such? I know you have A.D.D but again pay attention. I said "So unless A used the Shunshin jutsu *while in free fall bringing down his leg* then his leg drop wouldn't be the same speed as if he used his Shunshin to smash someone's face in like when he tried that on Minato and Naruto."

I'm not saying he couldn't have used a Shunshin to jump, I'm saying that unless he used a Shunshin while swinging his leg in free fall(which I'm saying he can't do), that means his leg drop wouldn't have the same momentum as if he stay on the ground and attacked like he did against Minato+Naruto.



> Ei could have been on the surface, used shushin and come back down to sasuke with his leg swinging down
> hence why kishi the author says the power of his attack is increased.



No Kishi says the power increase due to gravity. Would A's leg drop magically not get the increase in gravity if he was to do such without using a Shunshin? No. Why? Because fucking gravity would work either way even if he did use a Shunshin or not.



> this is further emphazied when he fails to break madara rib cage and says i need more speed. *why mention speed in that scenario if failing on madara using gravity was slow? * why resort to back pack right after that??



Why mention speed? I'd assume it's because his speed wasn't good enough to get the job done.



> i am however not saying that those 2 attacks are his strongest since we know thats lariat. but i believe that has more to do with where is being targetted or something



K.


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## Icegaze (Mar 24, 2015)

Bonly said:


> Because if you actually pay attention to the DB (old and new) you'd realize that Kishi doesn't mention things of that nature a majority of the time.
> 
> Go look at DB pages for the sound five and Sasuke for an example of this. As we know the CS powers up their jutsu yet if you look at the DB page for every jutsu they used while in CS1 or CS2 you won't see the DB mention the boost of power of the CS in every single DB page. So does that mean they magically don't get the power boost because Kishi didn't mention the CS's power boost? Of course not.
> 
> ...



 and your an idiot. ADD my ass kmt
Ei used shunshin the same way killer bee did to get to the other mountain side. his method of landing of swining down his leg to murder sasuke 

and your excuse is he in free fall but bee wasnt in free fall.  nice cop out on it. 

either way Db statements from author far trumps ur less than irrelevant opinions

get run over 

so last post. u said his speed wasnt good enough to get the job done. but he landed on madara rib cage with gravity so since its much slower wont his attack be weaker and slower. so why mention he needs more* speed* then resorts to backpack if he could hit faster and harder using shunshin??  

you counter ur own points and dont even know it


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## Ghost (Mar 24, 2015)

Icegaze, just stop.


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## Icegaze (Mar 24, 2015)

saikyou

just in strong denail 

tsunade jumps and impales manda with bunta knife. no mention about her being slower when landing 

sakura does the same with her punch against juubilings no mention of her being slower 

killer bee jumps to the other mountain side. somehow he isnt slower when landing 

tsunade does her own drop kick notihng mentioned about her kick being slower when landing 

but somehow its only EI who was slower when doing a drop kick? lol the denial is strong. 

regardless if with just a bit of sand gaara blocked EI attack. with more sand gaara would have no issues blocking Ei attack. Also sand armour wont be by passed


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## Alex Payne (Mar 24, 2015)

Tsunade used Tanto by throwing and moving it using her _muscles_. Her own top tier strength. 
Sakura used _special technique to release chakra_ from her fists. Her actual strentgh and speed are irrelevant. 
Killer B used _shunshin_ to move mostly horizontally. He was standing on solid ground and propelled himself forward towards the mountain. In a straight line. 

All those instances are completely different from what Raikage does. 

When Raikage jumps like that his own speed is only up to the highest point of that jump - afterwards it is pure gravity and his weight. Unless he used the ceiling to proper himself down that kind of jump ends in a simple free-fall. Which is in another galaxy compared to A's normal speed. For jumping fully aided by his speed he would need to jump forward in a wide arc. Like Hulk jumps around. 



P.S. You are very dense and very rude.


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## Icegaze (Mar 24, 2015)

you are denser and much ruder for being so dense

scans of tsunade throwing the knife and not just jumping with it 

go on ill wait 

bee moved from a smaller mountain to a much higher one. hows that the same line. are ur eyes twisted or something??

so what u are sayign is if sakrua stood there and punched the ground it would have had the same effect??

this wide arc u speak off why does it only apply to EI. 

sakura on landing didnt suddenly get slower in fact her jump kept up with juubiling which she sent flying. 

how is what she did different from Ei. unless of course u are implying sakura standing on the ground and punching it would have the same AoE it had when she jumped and crashed into the juubilings


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## Alex Payne (Mar 24, 2015)

What difference would Tsunade initial Tanto movement make? You can't prove that she did jump with it either. It is easier to throw it above Manda and then jump onto it - guiding the final movements. Than to jump while carrying it. Traveling speed is  irrelevant either way. Manda was blindsided and Tsunade did use her strength to move Tanto right before hitting Manda - check positions before and after. That whole move was about strength. Muscle strength. Completely different move, completely different fighter.


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## Icegaze (Mar 24, 2015)

Alex Payne said:


> What difference would Tsunade initial Tanto movement make? You can't prove that she did jump with it either. It is easier to throw it above Manda and then jump onto it - guiding the final movements. Than to jump while carrying it. Traveling speed is  irrelevant either way. Manda was blindsided and Tsunade did use her strength to move Tanto right before hitting Manda - check positions before and after. That whole move was about strength. Muscle strength. Completely different move, completely different fighter.



fact is both killer bee and sasuek have utterly trolled ur idea of how gravity applies to this manga

bee cloaks up and jumps at sasuke. he punches and misses sasuke. here is where it gets funny

sasuke does a front flip and instead of loosing altitude gains altitude and gets to the other mountain side

bee misses the punch swinging half his body into it. instead of loosing speed or altitutde the guy basically immitates flying and keeps it goign till he crashes the rest of team taka. 

why didnt bee suddenly start dropping due to gravity ??

as for tsunade throwing the tanto i dont see why its easier. wont gravity affect it. thus making it slower  

easier to just shunshin and jump with it. wouldnt u say 

stop applying real world phyiscs to a manga where people can use giant chakra monsters 

especially when the author tells u the power behind his attack is increased. if said attack was much weaker than his shunshin attacks.
1) he wont use it
2 )kishi wont mention it 
3) he wont have asked onoki to boost his speed


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## Arles Celes (Mar 24, 2015)

The sand is clearly extremely durable as it could stop Madara's Susanoo swords as well(it took 5 Susanoo clones to break through).

So it clearly can stop Ei's attacks too.

But Ei himself is extremely durable too and won't be crushed so easily with sand. Nor with his speed will he be easy to grab/hit.

I think it could go either way. Ei is better when it comes to physical stats but is less versatile and is probably less smart. Or at least seemed not so smart when he sought revenge against Sasuke...


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## UchihaX28 (Mar 24, 2015)

Kazekage94 said:


> Yes, Gaara managed to catch him and crush his arm.
> 
> Why don't you get that sand was useless against oil? Catching him would of done nothing. Gaara had to mix the sand with gold dust then used desert sand to catch Joki Boy. Why don't you get that?



 Yeah and that One Armed Deidara raped Gaara, the same Crippled Deidara couldn't even handle KN1 Naruto. KN1 Naruto >> Gaara confirmed.


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## RaSenkoChoRinbukoSanshiki (Mar 24, 2015)

Arles Celes said:


> The sand is clearly extremely durable as it could stop Madara's Susanoo swords as well(it took 5 Susanoo clones to break through).
> 
> So it clearly can stop Ei's attacks too.
> 
> ...



Doesn't matter if the sand is strong enough to stop Eis attacks. It would never keep up with Eis speed.

Same way base Lee and genin sasuke were bypassing the sand with speed alone. Same way the sand couldn't catch Joki boy, same way the sand was too slow to defend against a flying minato. V2 Ei utterly rapes gaara, the sand cannot physically react to Eis full speed.


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## SSMG (Mar 24, 2015)

Off vaara can be at ei.. People actually question this?


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## ATastyMuffin (Mar 24, 2015)

This has to be a joke thread.

OP seriously believes that the force of gravity from jumping 10 feet in the air enhances a physical attack greater than does hypersonic speed.

Nope, not gonna fall for it.



Strategoob said:


> The only situation Gaara wouldn't beat A in is indoors with just his gourd. A is overrated. He rarely uses v2 right away and he is otherwise ≈ Sasuke restricted to lightning kenjutsu.​



And this has to be a joke post.


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## Icegaze (Mar 25, 2015)

@tasty i dont believe
if u could read u would notice it would something i always argued till i saw DB 4 which specfically mentions the power of his attacks are increased by gravity. no other jutsu are mentioned like that. his other taijutsu not one word of the power behind their attacks thats all 

also as a poster mentioned. blocking 5 susanoo swords>>>>>>>>>>>>>>EI strength

gaara doesnt need to be able to react. same way he didnt react to lee. gaara would be able to tank all of Ei hits. till he can trick Ei with a clone. then uses his desert pyramid on EI


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## Lawrence777 (Mar 25, 2015)

Jokey Boy's speed was pushing Gaara to the limits, to the point where it was leap frogging off of Gaara's sand attacks. [1][2]. 

I can't see Gaara having any chance at all of catching Ei to even mount an attack in the first place. The sand could probably be touching Ei's body, and Ei would still move away from it before Gaara could clamp it down on him.

Gaara's ability to defend against 5 Susano'o Clones does not necessarily translate into him defending against Ei.
The most glaring difference between the two attacks is that Ei is so much faster(than 5 Susano'o Clones). There's a good chance Gaara can't erect a sand wall, because Ei wouldn't provide Gaara with as much time as those Susano'o clones did. Gaara will only have a little sand in place by the time Ei is punching him.

Then there's also the fact that his attacks are raiton based and have enhanced cutting/penetrating capabilities in contrast to the susano'o swords that are much more blunt in nature. Honestly, I think the battle would be a rendition of this page[1]. Except, Ei's added penetrative attributes. <- That's a much more protracted fight, I don't think Gaara will last that long against Ei honestly.


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## SSMG (Mar 25, 2015)

^ But Gaara has already reacted to/ intercepted v2 ei going for the kill speed... So jokey boy gets scaled up to at least faster than that.


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## Icegaze (Mar 25, 2015)

@SSMG  
thats really not how it works. *please note folks i have never been foolish enough to claim gaara somehow got magical reactions and would be tracking EI. i need that to be clear*

however based off gaara sand being able to block Ei kick it stands to reason that Ei would have a very hard time hurting gaara which is really all i have been trying to get across. 

but no oh god no  jouki boy in speed<<<<<<<<<<<<Ei speed


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## SSMG (Mar 25, 2015)

Actually that's exactly how scaling works....


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## Icegaze (Mar 25, 2015)

and who invented this dumb scaling? 
u or kishi?
cuz i doubt kishi cares for such 

jouki boy described as nimble at best in DB is somehow faster than a guy who leaves mirror images behind and has his speed comapred to minato's

but its jouki boy that is faster . 

character statements and manga hype is significantly more important than some panel which u then decide to scale up or down. 

jouki boy cannot be faster than EI because the author wills it. the end


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## ATastyMuffin (Mar 25, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> @tasty i dont believe
> if u could read u would notice it would something i always argued till i saw DB 4 which specfically mentions the power of his attacks are increased by gravity.



But that's just fucking *common sense*, of course one's physical attack would be stronger when falling. But Ay's hits are also enhanced from moving at the level of speed he does, and if you seriously think that gravity powers his strikes to a greater extent than his hypersonic speed, I have nothing to say to you.



> no other jutsu are mentioned like that. his other taijutsu not one word of the power behind their attacks thats all



So?



> also as a poster mentioned. blocking 5 susanoo swords>>>>>>>>>>>>>>EI strength



Gaara didn't block five Susanoo swords, he blocked one, four other Susanoo attacked and his shield exploded.


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## SSMG (Mar 25, 2015)

@Icey

Scaling is a geometrical technique going back thousands of years icey... 

And I don't care if kishi cares for such or not. He represented as such in the actions of his manga.. Whether he thought about scaling prior to him drawing the feats has zero relevance now.

Actions speak louder than words and thus an extension to this is manga feats>manga statements.  

Since you like statements so much show me a statement of your claim of ei>jokey boy please and thank you.

And the author willed it did he? Then how come he had gaara able to intercept ei yet he couldn't do so against jokey boy?

Try again.


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## Icegaze (Mar 25, 2015)

but gaara blocked one. why cant he block EI hits
you saying EI is that much stronger than susanoo?

i mean EI simply put got zero feats to suggest he can break gaara defense. he also isnt immune to being tricked which wont be that hard for gaara do do as the fight goes on. 

thats basically all i am saying. Ei has nothing to hurt gaara with


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## Rocky (Mar 25, 2015)

SSMG said:


> ^ But Gaara has already reacted to/ intercepted v2 ei going for the kill speed... So jokey boy gets scaled up to at least faster than that.



Free-fall speed.*


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## SSMG (Mar 25, 2015)

Yeah but his downward vertical velocity speed will be greater than his normal running speed.

I am assuming his initial jump and his running speed are more or less the same speed though.


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## Veracity (Mar 25, 2015)

SSMG said:


> Yeah but his downward vertical velocity speed will be greater than his normal running speed.
> 
> I am assuming his initial jump and his running speed are more or less the same speed though.



Downward velocity would be faster than his regular running speed yeah. But ninja in this manga can enhance their speed beyond those mathematical limits via chakra . Especially Ay, who literally specializes in doing. That essentially throws your logic right out the window. Ays shunshin speed is massively faster then both Joki Boy and his free fall speed.


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## SSMG (Mar 25, 2015)

Likes boss said:


> Downward velocity would be faster than his regular running speed yeah. But ninja in this manga can enhance their speed beyond those mathematical limits via chakra . Especially Ay, who literally specializes in doing. That essentially throws your logic right out the window. Ays shunshin speed is massively faster then both Joki Boy and his free fall speed.



But if ei enhances his running speed with chakra there's no reason to think he wouldn't be able to do so as well with his jumping speed as well.  I mean hes using the same chakra enhanced muscles in his legs for both so I don't see why not....
And then the vertical velocity formula would still apply.


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## Veracity (Mar 25, 2015)

SSMG said:


> But if ei enhances his running speed with chakra there's no reason to think he wouldn't be able to do so as well with his jumping speed as well.  I mean hes using the same chakra enhanced muscles in his legs for both so I don't see why not....
> And then the vertical velocity formula would still apply.



I really shouldn't have to explain the logic behind this, and I'm really not gonna waste my time typing a lot.

All I got to say is, ay increasing his jumping speed would only allow him to travel upwards  extremely quick, but traveling down would still be based on gravity seeing as he doesn't have anything to jump off of once he's in the air. His shunshin would still be > to his downward velocity. Ay can't fly lmao


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## SSMG (Mar 25, 2015)

Downward vertical velocity is always faster than the initial upward speed.


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## Veracity (Mar 25, 2015)

SSMG said:


> Downward vertical velocity is always faster than the initial upward speed.



In the real world yes. But can human use chakra to enhance their speed ?


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## SSMG (Mar 25, 2015)

Likes boss said:


> In the real world yes. But can human use chakra to enhance their speed ?



As I said before that doesn't matter. If he can enhance his speed for the jump upwards then the downward velocity will be based off his enhanced upward speed.


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## DaVizWiz (Mar 25, 2015)

SSMG said:


> As I said before that doesn't matter. If he can enhance his speed for the jump upwards then the downward velocity will be based off his enhanced upward speed.


What the fuck are you talking about man?

Ei leaping is clearly faster than Ei in absolute free fall.

His upward speed has nothing to do with it, when you're in free fall you have already stopped ascending completely, that speed no longer exists. Ei was directly above Sasuke and was coming directly down, it was complete free fall, he was not moving horizontally across the landscape while falling down, he literally reached 0 velocity at one point and began falling directly down at Sasuke.


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## SSMG (Mar 25, 2015)

DaVizWiz said:


> What the fuck are you talking about man?
> 
> Ei leaping is clearly faster than Ei in absolute free fall.
> 
> His upward speed has nothing to do with it, when you're in free fall you have already stopped ascending completely, that speed no longer exists. Ei was directly above Sasuke and was coming directly down, it was complete free fall, he was not moving horizontally across the landscape while falling down, he literally reached 0 velocity at one point and began falling directly down at Sasuke.



 I've always thought that when you throw something up it comes down faster. This is based off the vertical velocity formula where downward velocity = initial velocity+ gravityxtime. His initial velocity is the speed he jumps up at is it not? If it is then hed come down faster..Unless the inital velocity is at the apex of the jump where the velocity is 0 in  which case you are correct.

Sorry for the confusion its been a few years since I took a physics class.


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## UchihaX28 (Mar 25, 2015)

DaVizWiz said:


> What the fuck are you talking about man?
> 
> Ei leaping is clearly faster than Ei in absolute free fall.
> 
> * His upward speed has nothing to do with it, when you're in free fall you have already stopped ascending completely, that speed no longer exists. * Ei was directly above Sasuke and was coming directly down, it was complete free fall, he was not moving horizontally across the landscape while falling down, he literally reached 0 velocity at one point and began falling directly down at Sasuke.



 This. 

 You could argue that Ei still had a horizontal component of velocity, but considering he fell directly straight down, there would be no horizontal velocity, so thus, we only focus on his vertical velocity. Since his velocity the instant he reached maximum height was zero, his power within the strike is determined by his maximum height (determining how long he accelerates downwards).

 If you really need to, you can graph a position vs. time graph and you'll see the slope at the maximum height is zero which indicates his velocity was zero.

 @SSMG

 That's the thing. Your initial vertical velocity is zero and thus, your velocity is only affected by the acceleration caused by gravity and time. There would only be a horizontal component of velocity if Ei wasn't accelerating straight towards Ei meaning his horizontal velocity was also zero, so we only focus on the vertical component of velocity.

 In Physics B, you will get accustomed to splitting up his velocity into vertical and horizontal components. The Horizontal Component of Velocity is constant, but that is ignoring friction and Ei's opposing force that allowed him to accelerate straight down towards Sasuke. The Vertical Component of Velocity is affected by Gravity as Gravity is a force that is directed on an object straight down, so it has no relevance to the Horizontal Component of Velocity of a moving object. Since Horizontal Velocity was zero the instant he began to accelerate towards Sasuke, it's only logical we focus on on the Vertical Component of Velocity which is affected by only Gravity (and possibly some air friction.) So really, he's only accelerating at 9.8 m/s^2 starting from rest.

 Ei's speed obviously accelerates him beyond 9.8 m/s^2. An acceleration of 9.8 m/s^2 wouldn't even be enough for V1 Ei to blitz Part 1 Genin (though that's obviously determined by the distance Ei travels).


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## SSMG (Mar 25, 2015)

Oh okay so we do base the initial velocity as the apex of his jump. Thus making it as you said a 0... My mistake then guys I concede my point.


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## UchihaX28 (Mar 25, 2015)

SSMG said:


> Oh okay so we do base the initial velocity as the apex of his jump. Thus making it as you said a 0... My mistake then guys I concede my point.



 No, it's okay.

 It's an easy misconception to make.


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## Icegaze (Mar 26, 2015)

i dunno why physics got into this
all i was implying is Ei doesnt have anything to suggest he can breach gaara defense making this an upscale battle for him 

gaara gourd sand is certainly more sturdy than madara arm, which Ei couldnt break so it really isnt a stretch to say EI is fighting an uphill battle here


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## Bonly (Mar 26, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> and your an idiot. ADD my ass kmt



Ah cry some more please, your tears are yummy 



> Ei used shunshin the same way killer bee did to get to the other mountain side. his method of landing of swining down his leg to murder sasuke
> 
> and your excuse is he in free fall but bee wasnt in free fall.  nice cop out on it.



Did Killer B use a Shunshin to *only* jump vertically in the air like A with a slight arc? No? So then Killer B+A did not Shunshin the exact same way when it came to their jumps so you failed with that point.



> either way Db statements from author far trumps ur less than irrelevant opinions
> 
> get run over



I haven't said that A doesn't get an increase in power upon which that's what the DB says. This is where your A.D.D kicks in since you don't even realize that, actually pay attention and focus and you'll realize what is being said.



> so last post. u said his speed wasnt good enough to get the job done but he landed on madara rib cage with gravity so since its much slower wont his attack be weaker and slower. so why mention he needs more* speed* then resorts to backpack if he could hit faster and harder using shunshin??
> 
> you counter ur own points and dont even know it



This is what A said.

"You're able to guard yourself against even my speed? I've got to up the speed... to get enough power to crush his guard...!!"

So why would he mention more speed yet go to use the backpack combo when he can use a Shunshin? It's simple, as A himself mentioned, he needed more speed to get even more power(which he gets from his momentum) but if you read the manga you'll see that Onoki says "Mizukage!! Raikage!! I've got a plan" and they listened. That means A did what he was told to do rather then what he wanted to do by himself and as we know Onoki has the ability to make things lighter(aka faster+weaker) or heavier(slower+stronger) with a single touch upon which said jutsu's are the reason why A was able to send Susanoo flying after a single hit so yet again your point fails so no I didn't counter my own point.


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## UchihaX28 (Mar 26, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> fact is both killer bee and sasuek have utterly trolled ur idea of how gravity applies to this manga



 No, he hasn't.



> bee cloaks up and jumps at sasuke. he punches and misses sasuke. here is where it gets funny



 I better be laughing at how ridiculous your argument is or I'll be very disappointed. 



> sasuke does a front flip and instead of loosing altitude gains altitude and gets to the other mountain side



 That doesn't mean he'll lose altitude. He's already moving at a very high velocity due to Jugo's Rocket Fist giving him a boost, so he has high kinetic energy. Him flipping does mean he loses some speed, but that doesn't necessarily mean he won't keep accelerating upward. After all, some of that translational kinetic energy was transferred towards rotational kinetic energy in the instant that he continued flipping. That in no way implies Sasuke lost all his kinetic energy or he wouldn't have continued accelerating upward.





> bee misses the punch swinging half his body into it. instead of loosing speed or altitutde the guy basically immitates flying and keeps it goign till he crashes the rest of team taka.
> 
> why didnt bee suddenly start dropping due to gravity ??



 Bee Shunshin'd off the Mountain meaning he's already moving at a very high velocity. This means gravity has a minimal effect considering the time Bee will be in the air for a shorter time as his vertical component of velocity will be very high. Bee also didn't start dropping because his horizontal velocity and vertical velocity was very high and since his time in the air was very low, it appeared he didn't drop due to gravity when logically he did..




> stop applying real world phyiscs to a manga where people can use giant chakra monsters



 Kishi's not going to ignore the basic common sense just because he's writing a manga.

 Just letting you know, I didn't laugh, so your argument is understandable.


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## Icegaze (Mar 27, 2015)

really kishi wont ignore basic common sense 
how about what he did with kabuto u know
have ur own summon troll you.  
instead of just dispellign him yh kishi and common sense dont go hand in hand


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## Ashi (Mar 27, 2015)

Gaara loses to Toph according to Death Battle 

How could he ever hope to defeat the Raikage if he can't defeat a puny girl


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## Icegaze (Mar 28, 2015)

Bonly said:


> Ah cry some more please, your tears are yummy
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ei referred to madara as being able to guard against his speed yet 
The first punch he jumped at madara 
Second he landed on him . If the second attack was much weaker due to free fall don't you think EI would have mentioned that as being the only reason susanoo didn't crack ?

Then he mentions his speed and power being insufficient directly after a horizontal drop which kishi himself states as having his power increased 

Then the proud hot headed fellow resorts to back pack. Again if his attack get much weaker due to gravity he would have mentioned it rihjt there . vs making a comment about his speed and power 
Considering madara was sent flying on the first punch 
The guard he was referring to must have been susanoo . Not like madara won't laigjably die against Ei without it 

Therefore the attack Ei was referring 2 as being able to defend himself would have more to down with his horizontal drop being tanked . 

Considering his best destructive feats have to do with gravity 

Horizontal drop on Hachibi horn 
Laiga bomb bringing someone down using his force +gravity 

I find it odd that u would argue .


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## Kazekage94 (Mar 28, 2015)

TensaXZangetsu said:


> Gaara loses to Toph according to Death Battle
> 
> How could he ever hope to defeat the Raikage if he can't defeat a puny girl



Umm...no. 
Toph is blind. She uses her feat to hear the vibrations in the ground to spot people. The only problem is that Gaara can levitate. So she will be oblivious. He can grind sand some distance away and drop a defensive wall on her. GG.


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## genii96 (Apr 1, 2015)

Gaara flies...raikage dies.


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## BurningVegeta (Apr 3, 2015)

Is this where the Gravity Kick stuff comes from?


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## Icegaze (Apr 4, 2015)

@Burning vegeta yes. saikyou got 

i dont get why the salt all i was saying is if gaara can casually block an attack which the DB stats as having a power increase then Ei wont be breaching gaara defense even if gaara cant outright catch him 

but nope i got


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## Grimmjowsensei (Apr 4, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> @kazekage94 i owe you an apology
> From DB it seems the drop kick gaara blocked was actually enhanced by Ei using gravity to increase the strength of his attack. or so the DB 4 says
> 
> *After covering himself in his Lightning Release Chakra Mode, A jumps into the air above his opponent and performs a downwards kick, using the momentum of the fall to increase the power behind the attack.*
> ...



Yeah but what about the speed ?
Gravity is pretty slow compared to how A can actually move on his feet.

A blitzes and rips Gaara in half with a casual lariat.


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## Icegaze (Apr 4, 2015)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> Yeah but what about the speed ?
> Gravity is pretty slow compared to how A can actually move on his feet.
> 
> A blitzes and rips Gaara in half with a casual lariat.



i refer you again to the translation of the technique. when mention a power increase if in reality everything he can do while using shunshin would be much stronger. i mean wont it be pointless in itself for Ei to ever use gravity to attack if in essence its his weakest attack. like people seem to be implying while contradicting the manga in itself. 


Ei best feat is cutting hachibi horn. did so with gravity. horizontal drop against madara susanoo cracked it. 

Just my opinion but if people want to go against the DB then by all means. again no need to mention a power increase if using gravity substaintially weakens his attack like you are implying since its slower than his shunshihn


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