# The Daleks vs. The Xeelee vs. The Downstreamers vs. The Time Lords



## DreamySunday (Apr 23, 2014)

All Parties are at their peak and this is the New Dalek Paradigm. Other then that all I have to say about this match up is. Let the shit storms begin. 

Battle ground: The Battle ground is huge. The Battle ground is 12 universes placed in a square that are sectioned off by an impenetrable wall so that no one can enter or leave that multiverse. 6 of the universes are replicas of the Doctor Who universe, 3 of them are replicas of the main Manifold universe and 3 of them are a replica of the main Xeelee sequence universe. The factions are placed in the four corners of the square multiverse and within one of their own universes

Equipment: They have their standard ships and weapons, everything else they will have to build from scratch

Restrictions: Can't think of anything but knowing how ridiculously strong these four factions are, I'm open to suggestions.

Knowledge: Reputation. As for the Daleks and the Time Lords they both have post Time War knowledge on each other

Win conditions: Complete eradication or surrender of opposing factions

State of mind: Completely in character.

Other: .Any universe that is destroyed is immediately replaced with an Identical one. All 12 universes are devoid of any life (with the exception of the combatants). Alliances/tech sharing are allowed.


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## Galo de Lion (Apr 23, 2014)

Downstreamers can turn a single universe into a multiverse.


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## teddy (Apr 23, 2014)

The time lords have pretty much done the same thing with the time vortex, which they created


why are the xeelee even here?


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## DreamySunday (Apr 23, 2014)

They're here because I've seen them put up againts the Time Lords a few times. And because I needed a fourth combatant >#>


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## Galo de Lion (Apr 23, 2014)

? said:


> The time lords have pretty much done the same thing with the time vortex, which they created
> 
> 
> why are the xeelee even here?



When did they create a multiverse?


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## teddy (Apr 23, 2014)

DreamySunday said:


> They're here because I've seen them put up againts the Time Lords a few times.



And anyone who knows anything about them is aware that they're ants compared to time lords, especially at their peak.



> And because I needed a fourth combatant >#>



a fourth combatant that might as well as not be here. xeelee lost a war with the photino birds and spent an uncountable amount of years developing a project to retreat to a parallel universe in order to avoid getting wiped out by changes said photino birds were making to the universe.


the others here could easily turn the physics switch off and render them irrelevant


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## Shiba D. Inu (Apr 23, 2014)

put the Monitors from DC as fourth 


or Marvel Celestials collectively


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## Nighty the Mighty (Apr 23, 2014)

Downstreams rely really heavily on interpretation of feats.


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## Louis Cyphre (Apr 23, 2014)

? said:


> the others here could easily turn the physics switch off and render them irrelevant



It should be noted Xeelee can change physics but the Photino Birds were probably immune to it anyway.


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## teddy (Apr 23, 2014)

TTGL said:


> When did they create a multiverse?



It's noted by the carnival queen that before the time lords were meddling with things there was technically just one universe with infinite possibilities



Louis Cyphre said:


> It should be noted Xeelee can change physics but the Photino Birds were probably immune to it anyway.



true, it's just as a baryonic lifeform they couldn't co-exist in the same universe


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## Galo de Lion (Apr 23, 2014)

What's the quote?


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## Louis Cyphre (Apr 23, 2014)

? said:


> true, it's just as a baryonic lifeform they couldn't co-exist in the same universe





> There was life in dark matter, as well as light.
> 
> Across the universe, dark matter outweighed the baryonic, the “light,” by a factor of six. It gathered in immense reefs hundreds of thousands of light-years across. Unable to shed heat through quirks of its physics, the dark material was resistant to collapse into smaller structures, the scale of stars or planets, as baryonic stuff could.
> 
> ...



Yep, Photino Birds were fucking over all baryonic lifeforms.


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## Bioness (Apr 23, 2014)

? said:


> It's noted by the carnival queen that before the time lords were meddling with things there was technically just one universe with infinite possibilities



Can I get a source for this?

As for this thread, the Xeelee are useless, Daleks are canon inferior to Time Lords (as a whole), and the Downstreamers have very iffy feats (I've mentioned this before, but it didn't go anywhere).

Regardless Time Lords wins for having the more concrete feats, possibly Downstreamers with high levels of wank.

Also OP (DreamySunday), use Google, you would see this fucking match has been done six ways to Sunday, and the outcome remains the same.


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## Galo de Lion (Apr 23, 2014)

It does say that they got rid of everything illogical in the universe, but it doesn't show that they turned it into a multiverse, or do the same on a multiversial level.


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## Bioness (Apr 23, 2014)

Yeah I've read that before, and just reread to make sure.



> – Once upon a time, she said, this was your universe. Long before your time, before any time that you could measure. A place of endless miracles, non? No harsh sciences here, no mundane little laws of physics, no guiding principles. There was just possibility. An infinity of possibility. Now. Look.



This says nothing about there only being a single universe before the Time Lords came and changed it. In fact, because of their rationality you would expect the exact opposite to happen, for universes to slow or stop splitting.



TTGL said:


> It does say that they got rid of everything illogical in the universe, but it doesn't show that they turned it into a multiverse, or do the same on a multiversial level.



In Doctor Who, typically when they say "Creation" they mean the main multiverse. Which also doesn't make sense because there are universes where magic does exist, just not in any that the Time Lords have touched. So either that is a contradiction or the magical universes were just untouched.


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## Volt manta (Apr 23, 2014)

How difficult would it be for the Time lords to replicate Davros' reality bomb?. If said Doctor Who "Universes contain the Medusa Cascade, then everything in existence will be destroyed. Even if it doesn't, it's still a universal reset


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## teddy (Apr 23, 2014)

Honestly what she's describing doesn't at all sound like a "universe" by scientific standards which is basically what i'm going with concerning the time lords taking said universe and establishing a structure, with the key component of them regulating the impending multiverse being the time vortex


*Spoiler*: _The Domino Effect_ 





> Sabbath pointed at the child. ‘The Oracle has shown me the future. It foresaw a terrible cataclysm. An infinite number of universes and realities exist, all held in check by the Time Vortex.’





> ‘Time and reality are eroding, splintering,’ Sabbath said. ‘When the Vortex collapses, all time and space will be shattered. Infinite universes will try to replace each other. And what waits beyond the Vortex will invade, feeding on time and space as if they were carrion.’






which, as i noted before, they created


*Spoiler*: _Just War_ 





> ‘I’m not sure about the technicalities. In layman’s terms the TARDIS removes itself from Minkowski space, then integrates itself into a fifth dimension. It travels through something called the Vortex, a transdimensional spiral built by the Doctor’s people which encompasses all points in space and time. Then, the TARDIS just reorientates itself at the other end, and reestablishes a plasmic real-world interface.’






either way i'm not seeing any real advantages the downstreamers hold over the time lords


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## Bioness (Apr 23, 2014)

Volt manta said:


> How difficult would it be for the Time lords to replicate Davros' reality bomb?. If said Doctor Who "Universes contain the Medusa Cascade, then everything in existence will be destroyed. Even if it doesn't, it's still a universal reset



What are you talking about? Have you seen the show or are just commenting on it because you read about it somewhere?

Both Doctors (Tenth and "Ten-Two") were able to figure out what the Reality Bomb was when provided with enough details, meaning the basic idea of it was something known to them or at the very least they knew what would happen before it was explained.

It doesn't destroy everything, only matter, the space still remains, just nothing can exist there. When you say "universal reset" I assume you are talking about the TARDIS exploding. Which the reset only happened because the Doctor set off another explosion, otherwise the universe (or universes?) would have remained gone.

And finally, the Reality Bomb is NOT the most powerful thing shown in Doctor Who, maybe the most powerful on the television series, but not including all of the Doctor Who universe.To put it simply, the Time Lords don't need a Reality Bomb.


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## Volt manta (Apr 23, 2014)

Just pointing out options, Bioness; i'm fully aware of how ridiculously OP the time lords are. The reality bomb is just another option; it's not the most powerful thing the time lords could use even in the TV show.


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## Bioness (Apr 23, 2014)

Depends on ones interpretation of their Final Sanctum, at the very least universal, likely multiversal of an unknown level, and it doesn't touch the higher dimensions like the Six-Fold-Realm.


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## Galo de Lion (Apr 23, 2014)

? said:


> Honestly what she's describing doesn't at all sound like a "universe" by scientific standards which is basically what i'm going with concerning the time lords taking said universe and establishing a structure, with the key component of them regulating the impending multiverse being the time vortex
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: _The Domino Effect_
> ...



They created the Time Vortex, but that doesn't mean they created the Multiverse. The feat was just saying that they made the Universe more rational, and even then there are other universes in the verse where magic still florishes.


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## Bioness (Apr 23, 2014)

? said:


> Honestly what she's describing doesn't at all sound like a "universe" by scientific standards which is basically what i'm going with concerning the time lords taking said universe and establishing a structure, with the key component of them regulating the impending multiverse being the time vortex
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: _The Domino Effect_
> ...



Okay reading that makes a lot more sense. It also reinforces what would happen if the Time Vortex were destroyed.



TTGL said:


> They created the Time Vortex, but that doesn't mean they created the Multiverse. The feat was just saying that they made the Universe more rational, and even then there are other universes in the verse where magic still florishes.



The level of the feats are similar. Not like it changes the outcome of this match.


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## teddy (Apr 24, 2014)

TTGL said:


> They created the Time Vortex, but that doesn't mean they created the Multiverse. The feat was just saying that they made the Universe more rational, and even then there are other universes in the verse where magic still florishes.



Like bioness said, the feats are roughly comparable in scope. they constructed a transdimensional plane that regulates the existence and creation of an infinite amount of universes, and as for the downstreamers _(since this is what it essentially boils down to)_...


*Spoiler*: _Manifold Time_ 






> This isn't some local phenomenon, Malenfant. This is a fundamental change in the structure of the universe. It will never stop. It will sweep on, growing at light speed, a runaway feedback fueled by the collapse of the vacuum itself. The Galaxy will be gone in a hundred thousand years, Andromeda, the nearest large galaxy, in a couple of million years. It will take time, but eventually—
> 
> “The future has gone,” Malenfant said. “My God. That’s what this means, isn’t it? The downstream can’t happen now. All of it is gone. The colonization of the Galaxy; the settlement of the universe; the long, patient fight against entropy…” That immense future had been cut off to die, like a tree chopped through at the root. “Why, Michael? Why have the children done this? Burned the house down, destroyed the future—”
> 
> ...






i'm hard-pressed to believe that the timelords can't outright avert or avoid this, especially when taking into consideration the rate this is all happening.

not to mention it wasn't a straight forward "flip a lever and copy/pasta indefinitely" sort of deal as opposed to them tipping the dominoes down a certain way to eventually induce a favorable result. it's not something they can trigger at a moment's notice


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