# Dante vs Itachi Uchiha



## Roxas233 (Mar 13, 2013)

So here is a battle
Itachi Uchiha 
 Dante 
Some of Dante's weapons 




Dante's Devil Trigger
*Spoiler*: __


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## Donquixote Doflamingo (Mar 13, 2013)

Itachi kills himself saving himself the pain Dante would put him through.


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## Zorofangirl24 (Mar 13, 2013)

Sasuke solos


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

*sigh*

being the massive DMC fanboy I am, it's really hard to say this, but Itachi stomps. Better stats and better hax.


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 13, 2013)

Quicksilver still gives him the win, right guys? Guys?

Make this SMT Dante


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## Roxas233 (Mar 13, 2013)

So two  Dante one Itachi and a Sauske? 
here is my argument dante has the devil trigger the move that heals him over time and he become stronger dante can just not look at itachi considering  how dante has done stuff like that before  itachi attacks him with the susanoo he reflects with royal guard. attacks him back with ultimate release then by then itachi's dead


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## Roxas233 (Mar 13, 2013)

yes it does even though i did not use it that much in dmc 3 (rather of used attack styles than a difirent  dt)


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## CheesyFreak (Mar 13, 2013)

if this is old dante(according to the picture's) he should be able to beat itachi, didnt he solo the verse 1 on 1?


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 13, 2013)

That was a looooooooooooooooong time ago. Now he can't solo for shit.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

CheesyFreak said:


> if this is old dante(according to the picture's) he should be able to beat itachi, didnt he solo the verse 1 on 1?



No. Just no. As things are now, he wouldn't even beat Pain, and I'm talking about shit that happened over 100 chapters ago. Actually, chances are he wouldn't even beat 4 tailed Naruto from early part 2.


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## CheesyFreak (Mar 13, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> That was a looooooooooooooooong time ago. Now he can't solo for shit.



well thanks for the update, are the OBD wiki profile's correct so i can safely take a peek? i know both naruto and dante are hypersonic.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

> well thanks for the update, are the OBD wiki profile's correct so i can safely take a peek? i know both naruto and dante are hypersonic.



There's the new wiki, but since wiki editors are busy uploading old stuff from the old wiki, profiles aren't really up to date, more often than not. Naruto and Dante's profiles aren't up to date.


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## Roxas233 (Mar 13, 2013)

its the old Dante

not donte


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## Velocity (Mar 13, 2013)

I'm sorry, but on what planet did it suddenly get decided that Dante couldn't even beat Four Tailed Naruto? Unless someone went back and rewrote Naruto, Dante should be significantly faster than basically anyone in the Narutoverse bar the very highest tier characters and he should also be immensely stronger - given what the guy was doing in his fight against the Saviour, I find it pretty hard to believe anyone in the Narutoverse could settle for trading blows with Dante.

So, as far as I'm concerned, Dante takes Itachi easily. He's fast enough to avoid most of Itachi's attacks and he has short bursts of Quicksilver to avoid everything else, plus he has Yamato according to the thread creator and that can cut through _anything_ in the Narutoverse.


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## Sablés (Mar 13, 2013)

^FRS happened


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## DarkTorrent (Mar 13, 2013)

How fast is Dante?


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 13, 2013)

Velocity, Yamato ignoring durability is NLF.


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## CheesyFreak (Mar 13, 2013)

DarkTorrent said:


> How fast is Dante?



mach 15 if i am not mistaken.


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## MAPSK (Mar 13, 2013)

Yeah, Nardo high tiers are like what, Mach 20 nowadays? Anyway, Itachi probably takes this.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

Velocity said:


> I'm sorry, but on what planet did it suddenly get decided that Dante couldn't even beat Four Tailed Naruto? Unless someone went back and rewrote Naruto, Dante should be significantly faster than basically anyone in the Narutoverse bar the very highest tier characters and he should also be immensely stronger - given what the guy was doing in his fight against the Saviour, I find it pretty hard to believe anyone in the Narutoverse could settle for trading blows with Dante.
> 
> So, as far as I'm concerned, Dante takes Itachi easily. He's fast enough to avoid most of Itachi's attacks and he has short bursts of Quicksilver to avoid everything else, plus he has Yamato according to the thread creator and that can cut through _anything_ in the Narutoverse.




And you'd be wrong. You know, calcs 'n stuff. Basically, as far as speed goes, Dante currently is on the same level as Pain arc characters (mach 20), with multi city block level firepower, scaling from Abigail and Arius, same for durability and energy based stuff (barriers, E&I bullets, enhanched slashes etc.),  large building level physical strength, which goes up to multi block in devil trigger, shadow clone with the same power as himself, time slow down and that's pretty much it. 

Yamato never displayed the power to cut through anything, or Vergil would've won easily, which he didn't.

Itachi's susano'o is much more durable than anything Dante can dish out, and his Magatama is more powerful than anything Dante can take. That, combined with sharingan pseudo precog, large AoE amaterasu (which is also powerful enough to kill Dante) and katon jutsu, Totsuka sword, illusions, definitely give Itachi the edge in just about everything.

Dante's only chance is using Quicksilver and Doppleganger effectively, but once Susano'o is up, the match is going to be one sided.



> I find it pretty hard to believe anyone in the Narutoverse could settle for trading blows with Dante.



As far as physical strength goes, Dante is vastly outclassed since Pain arc, with characters such as Sennin Naruto and Pain's bodies having much better strength feats than he ever displayed.



> mach 15 if i am not mistaken.



The raindrop feat listed in the old wiki? Debunked. It relied on wrong assumption and it was basically flawed. However, there's a mach 20 calc for someone weaker than Dante.


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## DarkTorrent (Mar 13, 2013)

Edit: ninja'd.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

> Though an ability like Quicksilver could compensate for the speed difference.



There is no speed difference. Dante is mach 20 too.


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## DarkTorrent (Mar 13, 2013)

Yeah, I just didn't see your post before posting mine, HMT.


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## CheesyFreak (Mar 13, 2013)

thanks for updating me, also who was the character that demonstrated the mach 20 feat?


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

CheesyFreak said:


> thanks for updating me, also who was the character that demonstrated the mach 20 feat?




Blitz, the elite foot soldier demon from DMC4.


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## Roxas233 (Mar 13, 2013)

here is something to think about Dante killed The Prince of Darkness, The Dark Emperor,
 The Devil King, Pluto, The Devil Prince, Master Mundu  MUNDUS did any one from naruto kill a go of this caliber


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## CheesyFreak (Mar 13, 2013)

HeavyMetalThunder said:


> Blitz, the elite foot soldier demon from DMC4.



ugh, he was a pain in the ass to deal with.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

CheesyFreak said:


> ugh, he was a pain in the ass to deal with.




Indeed. I thought he was a boss the first time I met him. Like a recurring boss, like Bolverk or Nelo Angelo. He's the most dangerous common demon in the game IMO. When they appear in groups at higher difficoulties it's a fuckin' nightmare.


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## DarkTorrent (Mar 13, 2013)

> here is something to think about Dante killed The Prince of Darkness, The Dark Emperor,
> The Devil King, Pluto, The Devil Prince, Master Mundu MUNDUS did any one from naruto kill a go of this caliber



If they are in city block - MB range like I'm getting from this thread, then yeah, Naruto dealt with more powerful opponents.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

> If they are in city block - MB range like I'm getting from this thread, then yeah, Naruto dealt with more powerful opponents.



"They"? "They" Naruto or "they" DMC characters?


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## DarkTorrent (Mar 13, 2013)

HeavyMetalThunder said:


> "They"? "They" Naruto or "they" DMC characters?



DMC characters.


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## Yagami1211 (Mar 13, 2013)

Bad thread, Dante gets owned. He doesn't deserves that.

Itachi is probablt faster by a fair margin.


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## CheesyFreak (Mar 13, 2013)

HeavyMetalThunder said:


> Indeed. I thought he was a boss the first time I met him. Like a recurring boss, like Bolverk or Nelo Angelo. He's the most dangerous common demon in the game IMO. When they appear in groups at higher difficoulties it's a fuckin' nightmare.



while Nelo Angelo was a great boss figth for me it always me sad, i always wish Dante somehow could recover Vergil from that state, sadly he left only his pendant behind


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## Yagami1211 (Mar 13, 2013)

Good thing for Dante that he isn't fighting current Nardo, though.

I think anyway that Susano'o can give Itachi the boost he needs to win this fight.


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## Expelsword (Mar 13, 2013)

Dante has time and space hax, doesn't he?
:/


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## Velocity (Mar 13, 2013)

HeavyMetalThunder said:


> As far as physical strength goes, Dante is vastly outclassed since Pain arc, with characters such as Sennin Naruto and Pain's bodies having much better strength feats than he ever displayed.



I was with you until here. Seriously, are you reading a different manga or something?


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## Adamant soul (Mar 13, 2013)

Basically been covered. Itachi has the fire power, h4x and move set to end this on top of being as fast or faster than Dante. Quicksilver want help once Susanoo is on.


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## DarkTorrent (Mar 13, 2013)

> Itachi's Susano'o hasn't ever tanked anything impressive except for a ninjutsu that the Yata Mirror adapted itself to, but how can the Yata Mirror adapt to demonic and highly magical metal?



Umm... what?


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

> I was with you until here. Seriously, are you reading a different manga or something?



...sure, dude. 



> Look at the size of Saviour. Did you forget that Nero lifted that damn thing up? He lifted it up. That sort of strength feat blows anything in the Narutoverse clean out of the water and Dante is casually much stronger than Nero.



150 m tall. 343836.734 metric tons of weight. 



> What's the best thing Sage Naruto or the Pain bodies have ever done, compared to that? Throw a rhino?



90 m tall, 157 m long rhino. 410062.5 to 437399.99 metric tons. Not only the rhino is heavier than the saviour, but throwing an object requires much more energy than lifting it. 



> As for your previous comment about Yamato not being able to cut through Itachi's Susano'o... Um...



Gameplay mechanics. If you're referring to Dante slashing the gate, that's low large building level.



> Somehow I don't see that. If Yamato can cut through that with just the shockwave from its slashes, I really don't see how Itachi's Susano'o can tank that. Especially when Itachi's Susano'o hasn't ever tanked anything impressive except for a ninjutsu that the Yata Mirror adapted itself to, but how can the Yata Mirror adapt to demonic and highly magical metal?



Kirin>anything in DMC power wise. So what if he used yata? Yata is standard equipment for him anyway, so he has it by default.


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## Velocity (Mar 13, 2013)

DarkTorrent said:


> Umm... what?



The Yata Mirror adapts itself according to the ninjutsu it is attacked by. It becomes the opposite nature element or something, I don't know. It was never properly explained. Either way, the Yata Mirror is only effective against ninjutsu - nothing ever implied it could get hit by a magical weapon like Yamato and tank the blow.

So I don't see how ezackly Dante doesn't cut straight through it and the Susano'o. We're talking about the guy who can lift anywhere up to 10'000 tonnes (depending upon just how heavy the Saviour is and how much stronger Dante is compared to Nero). That kind of strength, coupled with a sword magically enchanted to cut through basically anything, is not the kind of thing the Narutoverse is equipped to handle. Even if Yamato's crazy cutting power is a no limits fallacy, cutting through Susano'o certainly cannot be considered beyond its capabilities.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 13, 2013)

Would someone provide the link for the mach 20 calc on Blitz.  As far as I remember, the battle with Blitz was the focus of a debate about Dante being a lightning timer back in the day.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> Would someone provide the link for the mach 20 calc on Blitz.  As far as I remember, the battle with Blitz was the focus of a debate about Dante being a lightning timer back in the day.


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## Velocity (Mar 13, 2013)

HeavyMetalThunder said:


> 150 m tall. 343836.734 metric tons of weight.
> 
> 90 m tall, 157 m long rhino. 410062.5 to 437399.99 metric tons. Not only the rhino is heavier than the saviour, but throwing an object requires much more energy than lifting it.



Who made these calculations? Since when was this actually longer ? How does that even begin to make sense?



> Kirin>anything in DMC power wise. So what if he used yata? Yata is standard equipment for him anyway, so he has it by default.



Kirin is ninjutsu and the Yata Mirror protects specifically against ninjutsu. Nothing in the Devil May Cry verse is ninjutsu or could be classified as similar, let alone the Yamato.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

> Who made these calculations? Since when was this actually longer than this is tall? How does that even begin to make sense?



I made both. And they're both accepted. There's an official height chart for DMC4 which puts the saviour's head at 20 m. Human body is roughly 7.5 times as tall as the head. 150 m. If anything, sometimes godlike beings are portrayed as being 8-8.5 heads tall in fiction, and that would, at best, be 170 m. As for the rhino, it's general consensous that he's as tall as gamabunta (90 m). A rhino is longer than its tall. That was it even before I re-calculated its mass, actually.



> Kirin is ninjutsu and the Yata Mirror protects specifically against ninjutsu. Nothing in the Devil May Cry verse is ninjutsu or could be classified as similar, let alone the Yamato.



Yes. It's ninjutsu. So what?


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## DarkTorrent (Mar 13, 2013)

> Kirin is ninjutsu and the Yata Mirror protects specifically against ninjutsu.



Except it blocked kunais and explosions as well.
And Oro's Hydras, but I guess that is classified as ninjutsu even though they are living, breathing snakes.



> Nothing in the Devil May Cry verse is ninjutsu or could be classified as similar, let alone the Yamato.



Except there exists such a thing as Rule of Equivalence.
Not to mention the fact that Kirin is a guided real lightning bolt, not lightning created with chakra.

What matters here is damage, not how it was produced.


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## Roxas233 (Mar 13, 2013)

just wanna say very interesting topic but lets stay on track about Dante vs Itachi


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## ironherc (Mar 13, 2013)

Dammit, and here's another example of undeserving punishment to a quality character who already is suffering from a horrible reboot......itachi wins this one


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 13, 2013)

Thank you very much!


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## Roxas233 (Mar 13, 2013)

ironherc said:


> Dammit, and here's another example of undeserving punishment to a quality character who already is suffering from a horrible reboot......itachi wins this one


yes sadly dante is being forced to suffer but may not the actions of ninja theory be Dante's fault the blame then goes onto don'te not badass dante


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## Velocity (Mar 13, 2013)

Well I can't be bothered with this any more. Dante actually losing to Itachi, of all people? With Yamato, no less? When did Devil May Cry become such a joke, or has everyone just gone crazy? Regardless, I'm out of here before people start saying Mihawk can't cut Susano'o either.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 13, 2013)

> Well I can't be bothered with this any more. Dante actually losing to Itachi, of all people? With Yamato, no less? When did Devil May Cry become such a joke, or has everyone just gone crazy? Regardless, I'm out of here before people start saying Mihawk can't cut Susano'o either.



Mihawk can because his feat surpasses Kirin's power output.


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## DarkTorrent (Mar 13, 2013)

Mihawk is much more powerful than Dante in DC. In megatons, IIRC.
So yeah, he can defeat Itachi.


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## Roxas233 (Mar 13, 2013)

plus when fighting all the Akatsuki with Pandora's box  he could easily trap them all inside of it


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## Roxas233 (Mar 13, 2013)

Velocity said:


> Well I can't be bothered with this any more. Dante actually losing to Itachi, of all people? With Yamato, no less? When did Devil May Cry become such a joke, or has everyone just gone crazy? Regardless, I'm out of here before people start saying Mihawk can't cut Susano'o either.


Hey man no need to leave me and my (stupid) friend have been arguing about this for the bast couple of days him saying Itachi and me saying Dante so i decided to let the Naruto fans at a crack at it but just wanted to say stay a bit on track with the actual battle topic here Itachi vs Dante


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## ironherc (Mar 13, 2013)

Roxas233 said:


> yes sadly dante is being forced to suffer but may not the actions of ninja theory be Dante's fault the blame then goes onto don'te not badass dante



That pic  (still, nero is much cooler than donte)





Velocity said:


> Well I can't be bothered with this any more. Dante actually losing to Itachi, of all people? With Yamato, no less? When did Devil May Cry become such a joke, or has everyone just gone crazy? Regardless, I'm out of here before people start saying Mihawk can't cut Susano'o either.




since crapcom had the bright idea of discontinuing the story, thus ruining potential for an extra power boost to the verse with a disgusting reboot that's even weaker than the original.....hopefully DmC bombing will help that out and bring us what we want. Also Naruto has gotten stronger since the war started, turning the series a little bit better (yet still manages to fuck that up with recent chapters).


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## Roxas233 (Mar 13, 2013)

yea but lets not let that doubt us lets think about the old Dante not don'te k


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## Yagami1211 (Mar 13, 2013)

Velocity said:


> Well I can't be bothered with this any more. Dante actually losing to Itachi, of all people? With Yamato, no less? When did Devil May Cry become such a joke, or has everyone just gone crazy? Regardless, I'm out of here before people start saying Mihawk can't cut Susano'o either.



Madara's perfect Susano'o ?


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## Kyuuzen (Mar 14, 2013)

Dante takes this.  Bangle of Time, Quicksilver, just time manipulation in general pretty much wins it.  Itachi's speed, genjutsu, MS, none of it would matter if he was frozen.  At this point, there isn't anything stopping Dante from wrecking him.  I love Itachi, but he doesn't have an answer to a lot of Dante's abilities.  Especially if this is IC.  It's Out of Character for Itachi to lead with MS, while Dante has been known in his cutscenes to start off with them guns, which will immediately pressure Itachi.  I don't think this will be enough to put him down, but Itachi won't be able to counter attack under fire.

Endless fire.

Non-reloading fire.


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## Imagine (Mar 14, 2013)

I Am Anarchy said:


> Dante takes this.  Bangle of Time, Quicksilver, just time manipulation in general pretty much wins it.  Itachi's speed, genjutsu, MS, none of it would matter if he was frozen.  At this point, there isn't anything stopping Dante from wrecking him.  I love Itachi, but he doesn't have an answer to a lot of Dante's abilities.  Especially if this is IC.  It's Out of Character for Itachi to lead with MS, while Dante has been known in his cutscenes to start off with them guns, which will immediately pressure Itachi.  I don't think this will be enough to put him down, but Itachi won't be able to counter attack under fire.
> 
> Endless fire.
> 
> Non-reloading fire.


..You do know sussano'o would protect him from the gunshots, right?


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## Yagami1211 (Mar 14, 2013)

^Since Itachi is around mach 20, bullets would put him to sleep.
Dante would have to attack himself to get some damage done.
And Quicksilver only works for a very short period of time.
Nothing prevents Dante to be put under Genjutsu one Quicksilver is over.
Is Bangle of time standard equipment for him ?


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## Kyuuzen (Mar 14, 2013)

Imagine said:


> ..You do know sussano'o would protect him from the gunshots, right?



Did you even read the post?  Yes because in every single fight he's been in, Itachi always leads with Susano'o, right?  Yeah, he comes out the gate with it.  Totally.

And how would he even cast Susano'o before the bullets reached him?  Just because he's a bullet timer doesn't mean his techniques are.



Yagami1211 said:


> ^Since Itachi is around mach 20, bullets would put him to sleep.
> Dante would have to attack himself to get some damage done.
> And Quicksilver only works for a very short period of time.
> Nothing prevents Dante to be put under Genjutsu one Quicksilver is over.
> Is Bangle of time standard equipment for him ?



- Just because Itachi can bullet time doesn't mean bullets are just a joke to him.  He knows he would have to keep dodging, and Dante can fire FOREVER.  Itachi doesn't have more stamina than Dante bullets.  And it's not like Dante would miss.  He hit the hilt of a katana while flying through the air at a rapid pace.
- Quicksilver lasts MORE than long enough for him to close the gap and put an immediate end to Itachi.  You really think he's gonna use up all of his Quicksilver time to impale him, shoot him in the head, Dimension Slash with Yamato, etc, etc, etc.  When Quicksilver is over thinking that Dante would just dick around while it was up is nonsensical.
- I dunno, his OBD page just says "Time Stop."  Even if it isn't, Quicksilver.


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## Dariustwinblade (Mar 14, 2013)

Am I reading this right! Dante is loosing to Itachi!!! WTF


All Dante just has to JACKPOT this Uchiha fucker to put him down, Susanoo or NoSusanoo


A sealing technique that is can seal continental level to low dimentional level lifewiper/reality warper Abigail or Island level/ low dimentional reality warper Mundus >>>>>>> anything Susanoo has tanked!

Best part its a sealing technique.


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## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 14, 2013)

Velocity said:


> The Yata Mirror adapts itself according to the ninjutsu it is attacked by. It becomes the opposite nature element or something, I don't know. It was never properly explained. Either way, the Yata Mirror is only effective against ninjutsu - nothing ever implied it could get hit by a magical weapon like Yamato and tank the blow.
> 
> So I don't see how ezackly Dante doesn't cut straight through it and the Susano'o. We're talking about the guy who can lift anywhere up to 10'000 tonnes (depending upon just how heavy the Saviour is and how much stronger Dante is compared to Nero). That kind of strength, coupled with a sword magically enchanted to cut through basically anything, is not the kind of thing the Narutoverse is equipped to handle. Even if Yamato's crazy cutting power is a no limits fallacy, cutting through Susano'o certainly cannot be considered beyond its capabilities.



I don;t remember anything of the sort.

Would like a source for that.

As far as I remember Yata Mirror is stated to block/reflect any blow or something to that effect.


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## Dariustwinblade (Mar 14, 2013)

Imagine said:


> ..You do know sussano'o would protect him from the gunshots, right?



These are bullets that can bring down and destroy bridges while riding on a hypersonic bike.


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## Yagami1211 (Mar 14, 2013)

Bullets destroying bridges aren't really impressive.

Their respective ODB pages aren't really up to date, especially for Itachi.


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## Kyuuzen (Mar 14, 2013)

Yagami1211 said:


> Bullets destroying bridges aren't really impressive.
> 
> Their respective ODB pages aren't really up to date, especially for Itachi.



No, Itachi's is pretty up to date.

Link removed

I see everything there.  It's just none of it will help against Quicksilver.


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## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 14, 2013)

Also reading this thread....

People need to get over Narutoverse's standing.

The verse is shit and your favourite character can't solo it anymore, boo fucking hoo.

Get over yourself.

Find a new character or accept that the fictional debates have nothing to do with respective quality of either character.


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## Dariustwinblade (Mar 14, 2013)

Nightbringer said:


> I don;t remember anything of the sort.
> 
> Would like a source for that.
> 
> As far as I remember Yata Mirror is stated to block/reflect any blow or something to that effect.



The last shot overcharges Dante uses to beat his opponent in nearly every game he is in. 
Jackpot.

The move used by both Dante and Vergil to seal away SpardArkham.
The move used to seal away Abigail in the anime, same abigail was shitting out multi blockbusters and was devouring the continent in a portal.
The move used by Dante to seal away mundus at the end of DMC.


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## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 14, 2013)

I Am Anarchy said:


> No, Itachi's is pretty up to date.
> 
> Link removed
> 
> I see everything there.  It's just none of it will help against Quicksilver.



First of all that's the old wiki so even if the page was up to date what you just linked is not.

Second of all I'm 90% sure none of the pages aside from ones that have been created on the new wiki are accurate.


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## Kyuuzen (Mar 14, 2013)

Dariustwinblade said:


> The last shot overcharges Dante uses to beat his opponent in nearly every game he is in.
> Jackpot.
> 
> The move used by both Dante and Vergil to seal away SpardArkham.
> ...



Well, anime isn't really considered canon, so I don't know about that feat.
As for the other two, the first one he had Vergil's help and the second one he had Trish's powers

@ NightBringer - Even if it's an old wiki, look at the page.  I keep up on the Naruto manga, and I haven't been able to find one thing missing.  Yasaka Magatama, Izanami, Tsumabeni, all there.  What I just linked actually _is_ up to date.


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## Dariustwinblade (Mar 14, 2013)

Nightbringer said:


> Also reading this thread....
> 
> People need to get over Narutoverse's standing.
> 
> ...




Actually Itachi is shit he still is nomatter what Itachitards want.

 I actually like Madara and Hirashima and i know Dante cannot solo the Narutoverse, or bleach or OP. Though if one abuses the laws of relativity.

Dante can:
1. Use Quicksilver
2. Shoot his bullet
3. Speeds up time.
4. Accelerates the bullet to relativistic speed.
5. Bullet hit with megaton level energy level
6. ????
7. Jackpot

But he beat itachi or the lowtiers in the narutoverse yeah he can do that.




I Am Anarchy said:


> Well, anime isn't really considered canon, so I don't know about that feat.



Yes it it, stated multiple times before DMC4 after DMC1.



> As for the other two, the first one he had Vergil's help and the second one he had Trish's powers



post DMC 1/ Anime Dante is stronger than both previousversion, by DMC 4 is stronger than most of the cast lolling throughout the entire game.
DMC2 dante lolstomps nearly all the other version of Dante. So strong that the game became horribly boring to the point no one even want to remember him.




> [
> @ NightBringer - Even if it's an old wiki, look at the page.  I keep up on the Naruto manga, and I haven't been able to find one thing missing.  Yasaka Magatama, Izanami, Tsumabeni, all there.  What I just linked actually _is_ up to date.


Nothing Itachi has will even touch Dante.



> Originally Posted by *Nightbringer*
> As far as I remember Yata Mirror is stated to block/reflect any blow or something to that effect.



You really want to bring up Yata Mirror and say that it can reflect anyblow.

It will take your Yata Mirror and will RAISE you Alestor which contains the spirit of lightning and stated to give Dante litteral lightning speed.

This is not counting Yamato which can cutthough anything including dimention cutting/ spartial manipulation ability.
A swift motion of the blade that cuts through dimensional barriers and unleashes a slicing cyclone with you at its origin.
That alone allows Yamato to ignore conventional durability. Susanoo is useless.

Most people in Narutoverse can't survive decapitation.


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## Imagine (Mar 14, 2013)

I Am Anarchy said:


> Did you even read the post?  Yes because in every single fight he's been in, Itachi always leads with Susano'o, right?  Yeah, he comes out the gate with it.  Totally.
> 
> And how would he even cast Susano'o before the bullets reached him?  Just because he's a bullet timer doesn't mean his techniques are.


What is this shit.

It's one of his primary moves. The op didn't state of their mindset was so they're bloodlusted by default. So yes Itachi is going to bring up susano'o.

Bullet timer but his techs aren't even though they've hit foes who are above bullet timing themselves.

L O FUCKING L. 


Dariustwinblade said:


> These are bullets that can bring down and destroy bridges while riding on a hypersonic bike.


Very impressive.


----------



## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 14, 2013)

Dariustwinblade said:


> Actually Itachi is shit he still is nomatter what Itachitards,
> 
> I actually like Madara and Hirashima and i know Dante cannot solo the Narutoverse, or bleach or OP. Though if one abuses the laws of relativity.
> 
> ...



That's not how quicksilver works at all you jackass.

It slows down time.

Any bullet he shoots will be going in slow motion during Quicksilver.

Once he turns it off it will "accelerate" to normal speed.

Quicksilver does not buff Dante's or anyone's speed.


----------



## Kyuuzen (Mar 14, 2013)

Imagine said:


> What is this shit.
> 
> It's one of his primary moves. The op didn't state of their mindset was so they're bloodlusted by default. So yes Itachi is going to bring up susano'o.
> 
> ...



Since OP didn't state mindset he's automatically Bloodlusted?  Really?  Really?  And he's gonna do it before he can get shot or time stopped?  Really?

Ha.  I feel no further need to reply to anything else _you_ say.


@ NightBringer - No.  Dante can still shoot at normal speed while Quicksilver is active.  It is actually a tactic a lot of people use to rape Heaven and Hell mode.


----------



## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 14, 2013)

I Am Anarchy said:


> Well, anime isn't really considered canon, so I don't know about that feat.
> As for the other two, the first one he had Vergil's help and the second one he had Trish's powers
> 
> @ NightBringer - Even if it's an old wiki, look at the page.  I keep up on the Naruto manga, and I haven't been able to find one thing missing.  Yasaka Magatama, Izanami, Tsumabeni, all there.  What I just linked actually _is_ up to date.



Talking bout the stats and they're are most definitely wrong.

If I could be bothered I might re-read that page to see if everything was wrong or if there were some things that had stood the test of time.

I doubt it.


----------



## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 14, 2013)

I Am Anarchy said:


> Since OP didn't state mindset he's automatically Bloodlusted?  Really?  Really?  And he's gonna do it before he can get shot or time stopped?  Really?
> 
> Ha.  I feel no further need to reply to anything else _you_ say.



Default mindset of a character is bloodlusted if it's not determined by the OP.

Itachi lightning timed (from some kilometers away) his Susanoo activation and then his Yata Mirror and you think bullets are gonna be a problem?


----------



## Imagine (Mar 14, 2013)

^His susano'o still might not be a bullet timer though.


----------



## Dariustwinblade (Mar 14, 2013)

Also what is canon Dante 

Cause all I know is that Crapcom fucked up canon, thus there is no canon Dante like Mario!

There are multiple versions of Dante.

MvC Dante
SMT Dante
DMC Dante
Viewful Joe Dante
DmCevil May Cry Donte

Am I missing any versions?


----------



## Kyuuzen (Mar 14, 2013)

Nightbringer said:


> Talking bout the stats and they're are most definitely wrong.
> 
> If I could be bothered I might re-read that page to see if everything was wrong or if there were some things that had stood the test of time.
> 
> I doubt it.



Apparently, last time it was edited was January 26th by Lord Raizen.  I can't really speak for how reliable the guy is, I don't know him, but that stats look right for the most part.



Nightbringer said:


> Default mindset of a character is bloodlusted if it's not determined by the OP.
> 
> Itachi lightning timed (from some kilometers away) his Susanoo activation and then his Yata Mirror and you think bullets are gonna be a problem?



If he uses Quicksilver, yes bullets will be a problem

From your previous post I'm gonna guess you don't know exactly how Quicksilver works.  Well... no one really does, seeing as the developers never went into it.  Basically, what it looks like from your end is that everyone is moving in super slow motion.  Dante's guns still work, however, so it might be that everything connected to him is affected by Quicksilver.  Seeing as the bullets still fire while it's active it could be that Dante is moving so fast everyone else is moving in slow motion.  And, a surprisingly unknown fact is the exact moment he activates Quicksilver, the attack that was about to hit him is nullified.  I could find a video if you want, but a staple in Quicksilver combos is using that initial intangibility/invincibility/whatever you wanna call it.

So if it's Bloodlusted, that goes up and Dante attacks far faster than Susano'o.  And if Itachi was planning on an initial attack(Amaterasu, Fireball, etc) it doesn't even affect Dante in that first instant he activates Quicksilver.

ALSO, not to ramble on the point, but just as his gunfire is affected by Quicksilver, as are enemy's ranged attacks.  Use Quicksilver on Vergil and watch how slow his Summoned Swords travel.


----------



## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 14, 2013)

I'm almost completely sure Quicksilver gets explained to be time manipulation at some point.

It has nothing to do with speeding Dante up and everything to do with slowing everyone else down.


----------



## Kyuuzen (Mar 14, 2013)

Nightbringer said:


> I'm almost completely sure Quicksilver gets explained to be time manipulation at some point.
> 
> It has nothing to do with speeding Dante up and everything to do with slowing everyone else down.



Actually, both have been stated at some point, so, like I said, we don't completely know.


----------



## Jon Snow (Mar 14, 2013)

Gameplay and cutscene QuickSilvers are different though.

When he first acquired QS, Dante stopped debris that was just about to hit him in mid air, and pushed it back up

Gameplay however it slows down time drastically. Cutscene = canon?


----------



## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 14, 2013)

It depends.

That rock scene one could interpret as some seriously good time slows.


----------



## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 14, 2013)

so much retardation 


is someone seriously using wiki as proof ? no matter if it's outdated ot not (it is)


----------



## Kyuuzen (Mar 14, 2013)

Nightbringer said:


> It depends.
> 
> That rock scene one could interpret as some seriously good time slows.



Yeah, it does



Fluttershy said:


> so much retardation
> 
> 
> is someone seriously using wiki as proof ? no matter if it's outdated ot not (it is)



- Talks about retardation.
- Uses horrible punctuation, grammar, capitalization, and then misspells "or."


And, again, it isn't.  Maybe actually try reading something before you pass judgment.


----------



## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 14, 2013)

I apologise for not being a robot DemonDragonJ


----------



## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 14, 2013)

Quicksilver seems to have a slow down ratio of a few thousands times on average.



> Cutscene = canon?



Yes.


----------



## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 14, 2013)

Anime is canon

To those who argue Yamato can ignore durability, proof please.

Bangle of Time has no cutscene IIRC but should not be disregarded since it is something the game threw in your face to use.


----------



## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 14, 2013)

> Bangle of Time has no cutscene IIRC but should not be disregarded since it is something the game threw in your face to use.



It's something you get in a secret mission, and it has no cutscene. I mean, we don't use dreadnaght form for the same reason, why would we use bangle of times in debates?


----------



## Tranquil Fury (Mar 14, 2013)

Dante is already hypersonic in base  as early as DMC3, can fly with DT, teleport and could take Itachi's head off with his building+ slashes from Yamato in base alone. If he can blitz saviour , he can blitz Susanoo. Plus generic timestop/slow ability will work on glorified fodder like Itachi due to the huge difference.

Sparda Sword would not be needed.

EDIT Who cares about the bangle?Quicksilver is DMC3's version of generic timestop/timeslow and that has an actual cutscene so why is the Bangle going to matter when it won't be any better?


----------



## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 14, 2013)

Because Dreadnaught durability is unquantified and Bangle of Time is easier to quantify since it stops time. If not, there's still the Quicksilver.

Gameplay wise, Dante absorbs every attack with Royal Block and Just Releases it in Itachi's face


----------



## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 14, 2013)

> Dante is already hypersonic in base as early as DMC3, can fly with DT, teleport and could take Itachi's head off with his building+ slashes from Yamato in base alone. If he can blitz saviour , he can blitz Susanoo. Plus generic timestop/slow ability will work on glorified fodder like Itachi due to the huge difference.



He can't blitz susano'o. Both are mach 20, difference being, Itachi can predict his attack and put up his defence before Dante hits. They both need a thought to activate the thing that would allow them to win (susano'o and quicksilver) but Itachi packs more power, and possibly more physical strength too, since he was trading blows with RM Naruto, and more firepower with Amaterasu or Magatama. And hax with totsuka and tsukyiomi.



> Because Dreadnaught durability is unquantified and Bangle of Time is easier to quantify since it stops time. If not, there's still the Quicksilver.



You would still have to quantify stuff such as range and duration.


----------



## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 14, 2013)

he certainly cannot blitz without quicksilver or BoT .. but if he activates those (provided BoT even has the required range .. lacking cutscene feats and all) before Susanoo then he can win, yeah, since Itachis durability is non-existant

otherwise - try to outlast





> Plus generic timestop/slow ability will work on glorified fodder like Itachi due to the huge difference.


there is no huge difference and you can't say it works due to the enemy being "fodder"/not boss level or whatever

it works due to the enemy not having resistance to that type of thing



IMO it's a decent match, depends a lot on what each of them uses first


----------



## Tranquil Fury (Mar 14, 2013)

What about his teleportation?



> you can't say it works due to the enemy being "fodder"/not boss level or whatever



I can because in canon it really does'nt help him against the stronger foes hence why getting off one or two timestops or whatever no don't let him instant win. It's an advantage but hardly much at all when the gaps in stats are closer(Vergil) or far too much for him(Arkham and Mundus though we can mention Greyon losing to Dante despite having the ability first).

But if Itachi is comparable due to newer calcs and feats then this will be a problem for Dante unless he timestops and takes Itachi's head off, assuming Itachi is'nt durable enough to survive Yamato decapitating him. Otherwise he may need the Sparda sword DT afterall.


----------



## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 14, 2013)

He can't teleport, that's just high move speed. Air Trick is gameplay shit though Dante can do that since he's fucking fast.

EDIT:
Never seen Dante get tired in DMC4 (well maybe from all the dodging the Savior, he did get tired a bit). Then we have Itachi who has tuberculosis or some disease.


----------



## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 14, 2013)

In the old series, teleport is gameplay mechanics. AFAIK.


----------



## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 14, 2013)

Teleport is gameplay mechanics.

Although if we get DMC5 showing Vergil legitimately teleporting, well..


----------



## Tranquil Fury (Mar 14, 2013)

Dante mentions teleport in DMC4 to Nero and even does it in that cutscene if I recall.


----------



## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 14, 2013)

Can you give us the cutscene then?


----------



## scerpers (Mar 14, 2013)

Cutscene Dante can win against... almost everyone.


----------



## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 14, 2013)

Tranquil Fury said:


> Dante mentions teleport in DMC4 to Nero and even does it in that cutscene if I recall.



When was that? I remember him moving faster than the eye can see a few times, I don't know if that's just fast movement or teleportation, I always thought he was just going fast.


----------



## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 14, 2013)

don't remember Dante ever legitimately teleporting 

can someone post it ?


----------



## Tranquil Fury (Mar 14, 2013)

Dante vs Nero round 2 I think, let me find it.


----------



## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 14, 2013)

Tranquil Fury said:


> Dante vs Nero round 2 I think, let me find it.



He never teleported during his fights with Nero...and he never mentioned teleportation. The closest thing to teleportation I can think of, would be when he came back from hell in the anime, though that may be due to the massive portal created by Abigail.


----------



## Tranquil Fury (Mar 14, 2013)

Looking back at the scene no mention of teleport, he just moves super fast to dodge Nero's slash and land stylishly on the pillar. My bad, remembered the scene wrong.

No mention of teleport either just "a tip from your elders".

Continue on then, I'll just watch since I appear out of the loop with Itachi's power ups/calcs.


----------



## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 14, 2013)

Standard distance right? If it is so, Quicksilver will reach Itachi, the whole arena was affected with it IIRC.

If I'm right, Dante rams Rebellion into Itachi's face with a DT powered Stinger while shouting "CUUURAYZEEE!"


----------



## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 14, 2013)

It really depends on who does what first, if Itachi puts up susano'o that's pretty much it, as Dante can't scratch it.


----------



## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 14, 2013)

Since this isn't Edo, how long can Itachi keep his Susanoo up?


----------



## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 14, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> Since this isn't Edo, how long can Itachi keep his Susanoo up?


not too long

his non-sick self is rather unquantifiable


----------



## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 14, 2013)

Dante outlasts him then while occasionally shooting bullets to stall.


----------



## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 14, 2013)

he needs to watch out for getting hit with anything

though with quicksilver that shouldn't be an issue

how long does quicksilver last anyway ?


----------



## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 14, 2013)

It doesn't state clearly  though if we take gameplay into consideration, it burns DT gauge.


----------



## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 14, 2013)

QS lasts at least 16 seconds


----------



## Adamant soul (Mar 14, 2013)

On the subject of teleporting Dante, as much as I don't like to bring it up, in the reboot Vorgil outright teleports in a cutscene and his abilities are based on DMC3 Vergil's. Not to mention in every boss fight with Vergil he uses his telportation like it's going out of style. Air trick is basically Dante's version of Vergil's trick up. 

With 20m standard distance he just might be able to take this before Itachi can use Susanoo with a quicksilver, air trick, helm breaker combo. Though even if Itachi uses Susanoo, quicksilver and doppleganger may allow him to avoid the attaciks long enough to tire Itachi out though one hit from Itachi and he's screwed so yeah, I still give Itachi good odds of winning though if Dante gets quicksilver up before Susanoo he should win.


----------



## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 14, 2013)

> On the subject of teleporting Dante, as much as I don't like to bring it up, in the reboot Vorgil outright teleports in a cutscene and his abilities are based on DMC3 Vergil's.



Which means absolutely nothing since the reboot isn't in the same continuity as the old series. But in the old series Vergil can indeed teleport, as Nelo Angelo.


----------



## Adamant soul (Mar 14, 2013)

HeavyMetalThunder said:


> Which means absolutely nothing since the reboot isn't in the same continuity as the old series. But in the old series Vergil can indeed teleport, as Nelo Angelo.



Indeed, I just thought i should bring that up since Donte and Vorgil's abilities were supposed to be based on their predecessors. Yeah Nelo Angelo could teleport which only makes the possibility Dante can do it as well that much higher.


----------



## Dariustwinblade (Mar 14, 2013)

HeavyMetalThunder said:


> He never teleported during his fights with Nero...and he never mentioned teleportation. The closest thing to teleportation I can think of, would be when he came back from hell in the anime, though that may be due to the massive portal created by Abigail.



Actually

Eg:1
Episode 5 
A guy tries to escape dante goes to the outskirts of town. Dante is teleported infront of him.
Link removed
start from 5:00

Eg:2
With Dante impaled and crucified and SEALED in the demon dimension that imprisoned Abigail. He still teleported from that dimention and saved Patty.The protal Abigail created had nothing to do with the one Dante was sealed in that dimention was specifically created and designed by patty''s father to seal Abigail. SId sealed Dante and locked him away. .

Eg:3
The description of air trick
Air Trick : Instantaneously *teleport* to a spot directly near the enemy.

Eg 4 and 5

During the battle with the Saviour Dante trash talks a Bianca Angelo(Santus) and teleports behind him.

During the same battle the saviour catches Dante in his hands but immediately a few seconds later he materialized on the tip of its finger. Despite being shown caught.


Also ingame description of yamato's cutting ability.


> Slash Dimension F 	 	 A swift motion of the blade that cuts through* dimensional barriers* and unleashes a vortex of destruction.
> Slash Dimension C 		 A swift motion of the blade that cuts through* dimensional barriers *and unleashes a slicing cyclone with you at its origin.


----------



## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 14, 2013)

None of the feats you posted is teleport. Just fast movement. Crossing a city before a car does it is no big deal when you can move 20 times faster than sound. As for ingame descriptions, unless there's some feats to back them up, usually they aren't accepted.


----------



## Dariustwinblade (Mar 14, 2013)

WTF, what make Flying Thunder God and Instant Transmition teleportaion.......it can just be normal speed blitz or going really fast.

Answer: Description!! FTG and IT is described as teleport. Just as Air Tick is stated to be teleport.

Again
Eg:2
 With Dante impaled and crucified and SEALED in the demon dimension that imprisoned Abigail. He still teleported from that dimention and saved Patty.The protal Abigail created had nothing to do with the one Dante was sealed in that dimention was specifically created and designed by patty''s father to seal Abigail. SId sealed Dante and locked him away. .

 Eg:3
 The description of air trick
 Air Trick : Instantaneously teleport to a spot directly near the enemy.

While on the subject on speed 

calc this.
Link removed


 From the first 36 seconds of the video.


 0:00 The distance from Lady to the Tower Abigail is on

 0:08 Trish jumps off.

 0:16 Lady locks on. Fires

 0:21 Trish run jumps from a wall 

 0:23 Trish land on the rocket

 0:29 she is just a couple of meters from abigails face

 0:32 demonicaly over charged rocket explodes.

 0:33 Trish lands beside lady. Instantly moments after the rocked exploded.

The distance is shown from Lady to Abigail at the top of the tower. The timeframe for Trish to come down is the duration of the explosion.

My guess is it to be much faster than Hiea's gas explosion dodge feat.


----------



## ikoke (Mar 14, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> Since this isn't Edo, how long can Itachi keep his Susanoo up?



A half blind,chakra starved and sick(nearly dead) Itachi managed to use Susanoo twice.
 First time fast enough to block Kirin,and the second time he maintained it for some minutes,long enough to fight and one shot Orochimaru,and totter up to Sauce like a drunk 90 year old man while using it to shield himself from Sauce's attack.
And this was after he had used Tsukuyomi,a continuous barrage of Amaterasu,shadow clones and other assorted ninjutsu. And even after that he had enough juice left over to seal another shot of Amaterasu into Sauce's eyes.

Healthy Itachi can maintain Susanoo for an unquantifiably longer time period.

Anyway,does Dante have any defense against powerful illusions?


----------



## Kyuuzen (Mar 14, 2013)

Dariustwinblade said:


> WTF, what make Flying Thunder God and Instant Transmition teleportaion.......it can just be normal speed blitz or going really fast.
> 
> Answer: Description!! FTG and IT is described as teleport. Just as Air Tick is stated to be teleport.
> 
> ...



What they're saying is there isn't any proof, dude.

The in-game description may say one thing but Devil May Cry has a habit of not explaining powers to well, leaving us to figure it out.  What they want is for you to post undeniable proof that on his own, without portals, Dante can move through space and time itself to reach another location.



ikoke said:


> A half blind,chakra starved and sick(nearly dead) Itachi managed to use Susanoo twice.
> First time fast enough to block Kirin,and the second time he maintained it for some minutes,long enough to fight and one shot Orochimaru,and totter up to Sauce like a drunk 90 year old man while using it to shield himself from Sauce's attack.
> And this was after he had used Tsukuyomi,a continuous barrage of Amaterasu,shadow clones and other assorted ninjutsu. And even after that he had enough juice left over to seal another shot of Amaterasu into Sauce's eyes.
> 
> ...



I personally think he could break them, just because his force of will is massive and at one point he was forced to relive the death of his mother(I guess that's kind of a Genjutsu?) and managed to escape, but if you're asking for a kai or ability made for defeating illusions, then no.


----------



## ikoke (Mar 14, 2013)

I Am Anarchy said:


> I personally think he could break them, just because his force of will is massive and at one point he was forced to relive the death of his mother(I guess that's kind of a Genjutsu?) and managed to escape, but if you're asking for a kai or ability made for defeating illusions, then no.



Thank you.

Massive willpower would probably help a little against genjutsus. But the problem is,some sharingan illusions can cause paralysis and/or real physical pain(e.g Tsukuyomi,Magen:Kasegui) and willpower won't help against these nasty side effects. What's even more troubling for Dante is the fact that Itachi can use simple genjutsus to set him up for the bigger guns.  

And as the fighters are going to be clashing at hypersonic+ speeds,even if Dante is frozen for a split second it's game over for him. And unfortunately for him,standard OBD regulations mean that he has no warning about not looking at Itachi's eyes/fingers or at the eyes/fingers of the crow clones Itachi can create fast enough to fool Sennin mode precognition.

With all these factors at play,I think there's a pretty good chance that genjutsu+Totsuka/Amaterasu can finish the match.


----------



## Dariustwinblade (Mar 14, 2013)

I Am Anarchy said:


> What they're saying is there isn't any proof, dude.


I gave you five example, and an ingame description!.


> The in-game description may say one thing but Devil May Cry has a habit of not explaining powers to well, leaving us to figure it out.



Again,
Air Trick : Instantaneously teleport to a spot directly near the enemy.
Seems pretty clear cut to me! The word teleport and instantaniously is there. Just like Time Lag,Time Stop, Doppelganger does what it says in the can.

Many of the ingame description is exactly what it says.



> What they want is for you to post undeniable proof that on his own, without portals, Dante can move through space and time itself to reach another location.



I just did there weren't any portals Dante was SEALED inside Abigail's dimention.

Link removed

The portal carving under the floor. Was not activated, there is a red aura around Dante, similar to trickster's Air Trick.
Teleportation is pretty conclusive. It is even stated as such.





ikoke said:


> Thank you.
> 
> Massive willpower would probably help a little against genjutsus. But the problem is,some sharingan illusions can cause paralysis and/or real physical pain(e.g Tsukuyomi,Magen:Kasegui)



Said to the guy that lols as getting stabbed on a regular basis.
I also remember Nevan had some and soul sucking hypnotic ability. Dante can resist that.



> and willpower won't help against these nasty side effects.



Dude Dante can survive holding an object that devours your lifeforce, Willpower is the only way to endure torture. Dante has plenty. Not to mention Devil Trigger can probally snap him out of genjutsu instantly.


> What's even more troubling for Dante is the fact that Itachi can use simple genjutsus to set him up for the bigger guns.


Itachi has no knowledge will most likely go for a kunai to the throat like normal. Which is a bad move.



> And as the fighters are going to be clashing at hypersonic+ speeds,even if Dante is frozen for a split second it's game over for him. And unfortunately for him,standard OBD regulations mean that he has no warning about not looking at Itachi's eyes/fingers or at the eyes/fingers of the crow clones Itachi can create fast enough to fool Sennin mode precognition.



Again he can break them using Devil Trigger.



> With all these factors at play,I think there's a pretty good chance that genjutsu+Totsuka/Amaterasu can finish the match.



Which can be stopped via timestop and timelag.

Doppleganger is another bitch, cause it is a perfect clone of Dante not a crow clone.


----------



## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 14, 2013)

> A half blind,chakra starved and sick(nearly dead) Itachi managed to use Susanoo twice.
> First time fast enough to block Kirin,and the second time he maintained it for some minutes,long enough to fight and one shot Orochimaru,and totter up to Sauce like a drunk 90 year old man while using it to shield himself from Sauce's attack.
> And this was after he had used Tsukuyomi,a continuous barrage of Amaterasu,shadow clones and other assorted ninjutsu. And even after that he had enough juice left over to seal another shot of Amaterasu into Sauce's eyes.


to be fair, all of that + the injuries in the battle pretty much killed him (or at least accelerated the sickness enough to kill him)


----------



## Dariustwinblade (Mar 14, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> to be fair, all of that + the injuries in the battle pretty much killed him (or at least accelerated the sickness enough to kill him)



Bullshit I have Sasuke vs Itachi nearly memorised

Consists of 

1 Sharingan genjutsu
1 Tsukiyomi
1 Katon
1 Amaterasu
1 Susanoo

Death.


Even healthy Itachi from pt1


Could do 
1 genjutsu reversal
1 explodin clone
2 Tsukiyomi
1 Amaterasu
1 Minor Suition.


It was never stated sickness effect ones chakra supply. Kimimaro despite sickness had 5 in stamina. Itachi always had crap stamina.


----------



## ikoke (Mar 14, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> to be fair, all of that + the injuries in the battle pretty much killed him (or at least accelerated the sickness enough to kill him)



Well,Itachi in killer mode(instead of dying by Sauce mode) can probably finish the battle with these many moves,so even if he's a little short on gas afterwards it doesn't really matter.

And a perfectly healthy Itachi's stamina is at least a little above this anyway.
And remember just before he fought Sauce,he sent a KB to meet Nardo and to entrust the KotoAmatsukami crow to it. And KB's supposedly halve the chakra reserve.

So it's possible that Itachi did all those things when nearly dieing *and* running on a tank only half full(though it may seem a bit of a stretch!).


----------



## ikoke (Mar 14, 2013)

Dariustwinblade said:


> Bullshit I have Sasuke vs Itachi nearly memorised
> 
> Consists of
> 
> ...



Get your memory checked. Itachi fired 2 shots of Amaterasu(1 hit the forest,1 hit Sauce's wing).Susanoo twice and then sealed a 3rd Amterasu into Sauce's eye(which was triggered by Tobi's appearance)+the KB he sent to visit Nardo.

And Part 1 Itachi is not healthy Itachi. Itachi obtained MS at around 13 years of age. In Part 1 he is somewhere around 17. So he had been using MS for at least 4 years. And MS,as we all know degrades the eyesight rapidly.Sauce's eyes started degrading after just 2 battles.

And clearly Kimimaroo and Itachi were suffering from the same disease.right?
It's not as if different diseases do not tend to have different symptoms.

Itachi is no Killer Bee in terms of stamina,but he's not the wimp a few people make him out to be.


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## Roxas233 (Mar 14, 2013)

Granted that Qs could win alone no one is eally showing any of his weapons so here they are
Dmc4
Dmc3
dmc1
Dmc2 was not posted could not find a video so here is a neo Page


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 15, 2013)

Doppelganger confusing Itachi?


----------



## ikoke (Mar 15, 2013)

Dariustwinblade said:


> Said to the guy that lols as getting stabbed on a regular basis.
> I also remember Nevan had some and soul sucking hypnotic ability. Dante can resist that.



Has he ever lold after getting stabbed non stop for 72 hours,while crucified?



Dariustwinblade said:


> Dude Dante can survive holding an object that devours your lifeforce, Willpower is the only way to endure torture. Dante has plenty. Not to mention Devil Trigger can probally snap him out of genjutsu instantly.



Lifeforce drain and mental attack are not the same thing,so I don't know why that's relevant. And yes,willpower is useful for resisting torture,but once again,does Dante have any feats of withstanding mental *and* physical torture for 72 hours non stop? 

Not to mention the fact that even if he can withstand Tsukuyomi's pain inducing effect without getting KO'd like Kakashi,he will still be locked inside the genjutsu for 3 whole seconds and that's much more than what Itachi needs to bag him.

And then there's the fact that Tsukuyomi can be used to simply mind control the target into obeying the caster's wishes(refer SM kabuto vs Uchiha brothers),so there's more than one way to skin the cat.



Dariustwinblade said:


> Itachi has no knowledge will most likely go for a kunai to the throat like normal. Which is a bad move.



No. Standard OBD mindset is Bloodlusted. that means Itachi will pull out the biggest guns in his arsenal immediately.



Dariustwinblade said:


> Again he can break them using Devil Trigger.



Has Dante ever broken out of illusions cast by a master illusionist using DT? Otherwise you can't simply assume he can.




Dariustwinblade said:


> Which can be stopped via timestop and timelag.



And how is he going to pull off the said time stop when he is trying to break out of a paralyzing genjutsu and fighting off extreme physical and mental pain at the same time?



Dariustwinblade said:


> Doppleganger is another bitch, cause it is a perfect clone of Dante not a crow clone.



I am assuming that killing/mind controlling/KO'ing the original takes care of the clones. Plus Itachi can spam the chakra efficient crow clones who can tie the Dopplegangers down with their own genjutsus+katon+suiton techniques.

Not to mention the fact that as these clones can't pierce through Susanoo any more than the original can,they are not really a threat.

And once again,it's probable that they never come into play,since the match ends as soon as Dante looks at Itachi's eyes or fingers which probably happens pretty soon,as Dante gets no knowledge.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 15, 2013)

> Has he ever lold after getting stabbed non stop for 72 hours,while crucified?



His brother regenerated from being sliced in half. And he was much weaker than EoS Dante. Another character weaker than him regenerated from having all of his organs and bones crushed. There was only blood, and he recreated his own body from that. Being stabbed isn't a problem.


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## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 15, 2013)

It's not the damage, it's the mental trauma.


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 15, 2013)

Nightbringer said:


> It's not the damage, it's the mental trauma.



He had to face his subconscious mental traumas over and over again in Nightmare's pocket dimension.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 15, 2013)

it's the recovery time from Tsukuyomi (even a small one .. HS+ characters, remember) that sets the enemy up for getting hit with another attack, especially Totsuka seal


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

That particular mindfuck only works based on the premise that your physical body can't take 72 hours worth of physical trauma and Dante not having the willpower to break it.  Itachi would just get frustrated in his jutsu when attempting to torture Dante because it takes a series of concentrated, mystically powerful attacks to wear the Son of Sparda down enough to actually do lasting damage.  Hell, in Devil May Cry 4, Dante outright states that he is more powerful that any demon (including his father) because of his will power (due to his human side).  IMO, the technique fails either due to frustration or just Dante lulz.

Link removed

Impaling Dante or pounding on him for 72 hours with regular attacks won't bother him and when he comes out of the jutsu (whether early or at the predetermined time) Dante is probably activating Quicksilver before Itachi can pull off another jutsu.  The activation of Quicksilver is just thought-based and it negates all damage that would be done to Dante the moment the attack would connect.  

Link removed

Order of events:

1.)  Tsukuyomi goes off.
2.)  Dante comes out and immediately activates Quicksilver before Itachi can land an attack.
3.)  Dante wins.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> Order of events:
> 
> 1.)  Tsukuyomi goes off.
> 2.)  Dante comes out and immediately activates Quicksilver before Itachi can land an attack.
> 3.)  Dante wins.



Not arguing for either side but their 'clone' techniques would kinda throw a wrench in your order of events. One Itachi is using fancy eye attacks while the other preps some other attack. I'm pretty sure he has some sort of clone ability (not 100% sure since I stopped paying attention a while back in the series due to boredom).


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## willyvereb (Mar 15, 2013)

And when would exactly Itachi get the time to use clones?
This is a direct battle without any prep and Tsukuyomi not only just demanding on Itachi but also only lasts for a second in real time.
To use the clone trick, Itachi needs to have the spare time to create a clone and then run into hiding.
He won't have the time here.
Neither the energy to spare.
Like I said before, Tsukuyomi is rather draining on Itachi so I can't imagine him using that while preparing another technique.


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## ikoke (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> That particular mindfuck only works based on the premise that your physical body can't take 72 hours worth of physical trauma and Dante not having the willpower to break it.  Itachi would just get frustrated in his jutsu when attempting to torture Dante because it takes a series of concentrated, mystically powerful attacks to wear the Son of Sparda down enough to actually do lasting damage.  Hell, in Devil May Cry 4, Dante outright states that he is more powerful that any demon (including his father) because of his will power (due to his human side).  IMO, the technique fails either due to frustration or just Dante lulz.
> 
> Link removed
> 
> ...



All of is useless if Susanoo is up,and with a bloodlusted mentality Susanoo is coming up as soon as the battle begins. And once Quicksilver ends,the advantage shifts to Itachi once again.

Not to mention,Itachi can simply mind control Dante,rather than try to torture him if he feels it to be necessary.(He forced Kabuto to undo Edo Tensei with Tsukuyomi).

And then he can always place a subtle genjutsu that Dante won't even notice(and hence won't fight against) like the one Sauce used on Danzo and use the resulting slip up to his advantage.



willyvereb said:


> And when would exactly Itachi get the time to use clones?
> This is a direct battle without any prep and Tsukuyomi not only just demanding on Itachi but also only lasts for a second in real time.
> To use the clone trick, Itachi needs to have the spare time to create a clone and then run into hiding.
> He won't have the time here.
> ...



Well Itachi somehow managed to replace himself with a clone during his battle against Kabuto without the latter managing to spot the deception.And SM Kabuto is one of the most skilled sensors in the entire verse.

And his crow clones are very chakra efficient.

Also,doesn't Tsukuyomi last for 3 seconds?


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## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 15, 2013)

crow clones use actual living crows as base for the clone, they're much cheaper chakra-wise then regular shadow clones


I actually did not know that Itachi could use those for a long time


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

ikoke said:


> All of is useless if Susanoo is up,and with a bloodlusted mentality Susanoo is coming up as soon as the battle begins. And once Quicksilver ends,the advantage shifts to Itachi once again.
> 
> Not to mention,Itachi can simply mind control Dante,rather than try to torture him if he feels it to be necessary.(He forced Kabuto to undo Edo Tensei with Tsukuyomi).
> 
> ...



You are acting like Susanoo can go off before Quicksilver.  It still takes chakra molding to get it up and with speed equal between the two, Dante would get Quicksilver (which requires only that Dante will it into effect and instantly happens).  I'm not sure even the mind-fuck would go off before the activation of time distortion either.  This is bloodlusted Dante additionally.  He's going for the timestop first.

Which means, Susanoo might start to come up.  However, I don't think it will be completely formed or even close to that.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 15, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> And when would exactly Itachi get the time to use clones?
> This is a direct battle without any prep and Tsukuyomi not only just demanding on Itachi but also only lasts for a second in real time.
> To use the clone trick, Itachi needs to have the spare time to create a clone and then run into hiding.
> He won't have the time here.
> ...



I think you're overestimating the 'effort' that goes into making clones. Others have already gone into detail so I'll just leave it at that. And instead of wasting time using Tsukuyomi he could just use Susano'o (or a longer lasting Genjutsu). 

But as I said before, I'm not really on either side since I don't know much about Dante and I don't care for Itachi. I just felt like throwing some stuff out there.


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## ikoke (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> You are acting like Susanoo can go off before Quicksilver.  It still takes chakra molding to get it up and with speed equal between the two, Dante would get Quicksilver (which requires only that Dante will it into effect and instantly happens).  I'm not sure even the mind-fuck would go off before the activation of time distortion either.  This is bloodlusted Dante additionally.  He's going for the timestop first.
> 
> Which means, Susanoo might start to come up.  However, I don't think it will be completely formed or even close to that.



And you are acting as if Susanoo takes a lot of time to activate. Itachi needs just a thought to activate it as well-meaning it activates at mach 20+(the same speed as Itachi's reactions).

Not to mention that several people in this thread(more knowledgeable than me about DMC) seem to have doubts about QS's actual ability.

And even Sauce's 1st usage of incomplete Susanoo managed to block some of Raikage's MCB level strikes,and Itachi's version is far above that. So even if he doesn't have time to bring out Yata,it's not a problem.

And from what I gathered QS doesn't last too long either. Once it's over,Dante dies.


----------



## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

Also, Dante could just telekinetically pull Itachi out of Susanoo.  He has displayed telekinesis a couple of times.



Link removed

Link removed

Or in the anime where he pulled Rebellion through a window to him.


----------



## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

ikoke said:


> And you are acting as if Susanoo takes a lot of time to activate. Itachi needs just a thought to activate it as well-meaning it activates at mach 20+(the same speed as Itachi's reactions).
> 
> Not to mention that several people in this thread(more knowledgeable than me about DMC) seem to have doubts about QS's actual ability.
> 
> ...



If it isn't fulled formed and he is frozen in time, then Dante gets to him and stabs him though the head.  Itachi dies.  Quicksilver is apparent in its functionality.  Dante activates it and it goes into effect instantly.  You want to make this battle less about speculation?  Have the OP remove Quicksilver from the original post.  Otherwise, it's abilities goes strictly off of its showings in-game.  I.E. It triggers instantaneously with Dante's will.  Susanoo still forms from chakra molding.  It's thought, energy summoning, and then form.

Even with a complete Susanoo, which he won't achieve.  Dante could still just pull Itachi out of it and kill him at Mach 20+.  Or Quicksilver + Yamato for instantaneous death with an incomplete Susanoo.


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## ikoke (Mar 15, 2013)

Anime feats are probably non canon. And doubtful,Dante can pull Itachi out of Susanoo with Tk,since:-

1. Susanoo usually moves along with it's user,unless it is forcibly tied down.
2. Dante would have to generate enough force telekinetically to break through the Susanoo's body(since Itachi's body won't simply phase through the defense surrounding him).

Plus pulling Itachi closer only makes it easier for the missing nin to land a point blank Amaterasu(which can kill/subdue a beast that no sells 700 KT FRS) or genjutsu. Also Itachi can simply reform Susanoo around himself(if at all he can be dragged out of it in the first place) and land a point blank shot of Totsuka/Magatama.


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## ikoke (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> If it isn't fulled formed and he is frozen in time, then Dante gets to him and stabs him though the head.  Itachi dies.  Quicksilver is apparent in its functionality.  Dante activates it and it goes into effect instantly.  You want to make this battle less about speculation?  Have the OP remove Quicksilver from the original post.  Otherwise, it's abilities goes strictly off of its showings in-game.  I.E. It triggers instantaneously with Dante's will.  Susanoo still forms from chakra molding.  It's thought, energy summoning, and then form.
> 
> Even with a complete Susanoo, which he won't achieve.  Dante could still just pull Itachi out of it and kill him at Mach 20+.  Or Quicksilver + Yamato for instantaneous death with an incomplete Susanoo.



Once again,Susanoo formation speed is as fast as Itachi's reactions which are mach 20+,same as Dante's. SO Dante is *not* getting to him before it's up. And activating QS after Susanoo is up is only delaying the inevitable.

And Yamato does not ignore durability(from what I have been able to gather about it's usage by reading HMT's posts). So it definitely isn't getting past Susanoo,whether incomplete or complete.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

ikoke said:


> Anime feats are probably non canon. And doubtful,Dante can pull Itachi out of Susanoo with Tk,since:-
> 
> 1. Susanoo usually moves along with it's user,unless it is forcibly tied down.
> 2. Dante would have to generate enough force telekinetically to break through the Susanoo's body(since Itachi's body won't simply phase through the defense surrounding him).
> ...



First of all, he's frozen in time.  He doesn't get to actively do anything.  You are not getting that at all.  Secondly, Gaara pulled Madara out of Susanoo using sand.  So, don't give that you can't get the user out of the technique with a little bit of effort.  That sand tendril is small.



Itachi dies within the first Quicksilver because he doesn't have the Susanoo formed or he gets pulled out of it.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

ikoke said:


> Once again,Susanoo formation speed is as fast as Itachi's reactions which are mach 20+,same as Dante's. SO Dante is *not* getting to him before it's up. And activating QS after Susanoo is up is only delaying the inevitable.
> 
> And Yamato does not ignore durability(from what I have been able to gather about it's usage by reading HMT's posts). So it definitely isn't getting past Susanoo,whether incomplete or complete.




DUDE QS freezes time in the area around Dante.  The starting distance isn't out of the effective range of the move.  I.E. Dante QS's at the first of the fight.  Susanoo isn't up.  Dante uses Yamato for ranged decapitation or closes the distance and stabs him in the face.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

Order of events (by your fucked up logic)

1.)  Fight starts and Dante attempts to close on Itachi.
2.)  Susanoo activates.
3.)  Dante uses QS.

Order of events (by actual logic)

1.)  Dante opens with QS.
2.)  Itachi dies.


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## Tsubori (Mar 15, 2013)

Yeah, reading through this, there's no reason Dante wouldn't just quicksilver the shit out of itachi right off the bat.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> First of all, he's frozen in time.  He doesn't get to actively do anything.  You are not getting that at all.  Secondly, Gaara pulled Madara out of Susanoo using sand.  So, don't give that you can't get the user out of the technique with a little bit of effort.  That sand tendril is small.
> 
> 
> 
> Itachi dies within the first Quicksilver because he doesn't have the Susanoo formed or he gets pulled out of it.



To be fair, Susano'o was tied down which doesn't disprove what ikoke was saying earlier.



Punchsplosion said:


> DUDE QS freezes time in the area around Dante.  The starting distance isn't out of the effective range of the move.  I.E. Dante QS's at the first of the fight.  Susanoo isn't up.  Dante uses Yamato for ranged decapitation or closes the distance and stabs him in the face.



If they have comparable reactions and Susano'o is activated via thought (just like QS) why would Susano'o not be up (at least in its incomplete form)? Are you assuming that Itachi wouldn't use Susano'o or are you assuming that Dante's reactions are faster?



Punchsplosion said:


> Order of events (by your fucked up logic)
> 
> 1.)  Fight starts and Dante attempts to close on Itachi.
> 2.)  Susanoo activates.
> 3.)  Dante uses QS.



Nah, I think the idea was:

1. Fight starts both combatants activate their respective thought-based techs.
2. Dante attacks Itachi's incomplete Susano'o causing unknown amounts of damage.
3. If Itachi is still alive X happens.




> Order of events (by actual logic)
> 
> 1.)  Dante opens with QS.
> 2.)  Itachi dies.



This is assuming Itachi doesn't have incomplete susano'o up.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

Time distortion mechanics are broken.  If speed is pretty much equalized, the person with an instantaneous activation of a temporal freeze is going to win.  Itachi still has to form Susanoo.  Dante doesn't have to use energy to do anything.  He just thinks and everything stops.


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## ikoke (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> First of all, he's frozen in time.  He doesn't get to actively do anything.  You are not getting that at all.  Secondly, Gaara pulled Madara out of Susanoo using sand.  So, don't give that you can't get the user out of the technique with a little bit of effort.  That sand tendril is small.
> 
> 
> 
> Itachi dies within the first Quicksilver because he doesn't have the Susanoo formed or he gets pulled out of it.



Watch that scan and the previous page closely. They are fighting on sandy ground,which is Gaara's dominion. Gaara bound down Susanoo with sand,raised it up above the ground and dragged Madara out from the open bottom.

Unless Dante can perform similar terraforming with Tk,he isn't getting anywhere. 

And once again,since Itachi's reactions are just as fast as Dante's,QS's effect doesn't activate before Susanoo does.



Punchsplosion said:


> DUDE QS freezes time in the area around Dante.  The starting distance isn't out of the effective range of the move.  I.E. *Dante QS's at the first of the fight.  Susanoo isn't up*.  Dante uses Yamato for ranged decapitation or closes the distance and stabs him in the face.



No. Both are equal in speed and reactions. That means as soon as battle begins Itachi activates Susanoo,Dante uses QS which does whatever the hell it is supposed to do. But Dante can't get through any version of Susanoo,so it's back to the square one. 

You see,it doesn't matter whether QS stops time or slows time or whatever else. It's activation depends on Dante's reactions which are *not* faster than Itachi's. So his time stop/slow doesn't stop Itachi from bringing up Susanoo.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

Saitomaru said:


> To be fair, Susano'o was tied down which doesn't disprove what ikoke was saying earlier.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




It would only work that way if Susanoo didn't require actual chakra formation.  The order of events are actually.

1.)  Dante activates QS/Itachi starts Susanoo.
2.)  Susanoo isn't incomplete.  It isn't formed at all.  Dante needs only thought to pop QS.  Itachi needs throught and THEN chakra summoning to form the technique.
3.)  So, Dante casually kills the unprotected Itachi.  

It's more about the steps that it takes to perform the action since speed is equal between the two.  Dante just stops time through thinking it.  Itachi actually has to go further than that with the way the technique works.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> Time distortion mechanics are broken.  If speed is pretty much equalized, the person with an instantaneous activation of a temporal freeze is going to win.  Itachi still has to form Susanoo.  Dante doesn't have to use energy to do anything.  He just thinks and everything stops.



Susano'o's full formation takes some (unknown and inconsistent) amount of time, its activated via thought so some form of susano'o would be up. If two instantaneous things are activated at the same time, one does not magically outspeed the other.

Edit:



> It would only work that way if Susanoo didn't require actual chakra formation. The order of events are actually.
> 
> 1.) Dante activates QS/Itachi starts Susanoo.
> 2.) Susanoo isn't incomplete. It isn't formed at all. Dante needs only thought to pop QS. Itachi needs throught and THEN chakra summoning to form the technique.
> ...



If Susano'o requires thought _and_ chakra formation then that would mean that Sasgay and Itachi's reactions are slightly faster than what people give them credit for since (as stated before) Sasgay managed to activate Susano'o to block the Raikage's attacks. Meaning he had enough time to think to use Susano'o AND do the necessary chakra formation needed to activate it.


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## ikoke (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> Order of events (by your fucked up logic)
> 
> 1.)  Fight starts and Dante attempts to close on Itachi.
> 2.)  Susanoo activates.
> ...



Actually,by my logic(and unbiased logic):-

1.) Fight starts. itachi uses Susanoo and dante uses QS.
2.) While time is stopped/slowed around Itachi,Dante repeatedly tries to break through Susanoo,but fails.
3.) QS's effect ends. Dante dies.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

Fair enough about Madara being bound by sand.  Still don't believe Susanoo becomes even incomplete before he can't do anything.


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## ikoke (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> It would only work that way if Susanoo didn't require actual chakra formation.  The order of events are actually.
> 
> 1.)  Dante activates QS/Itachi starts Susanoo.
> 2.)  Susanoo isn't incomplete.  It isn't formed at all.  Dante needs only thought to pop QS.  Itachi needs throught and THEN chakra summoning to form the technique.
> ...



This is probably the 10th time I'm saying this,Susanoo isn't a technique that needs any explicit hand seals to mold chakra. Read Sauce vs Itachi or kabuto vs Uchiha brothers. The technique forms as soon as Itachi wills it. It's formation speed=Itachi's reactions.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

ikoke said:


> Actually,by my logic(and unbiased logic):-
> 
> 1.) Fight starts. itachi uses Susanoo and dante uses QS.
> 2.) While time is stopped/slowed around Itachi,Dante repeatedly tries to break through Susanoo,but fails.
> 3.) QS's effect ends. Dante dies.




Or Dante just grabs Susanoo bare-handed while it is frozen and telekinetically pulls Itachi out.  And kills him.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> Or Dante just grabs Susanoo bare-handed while it is frozen and telekinetically pulls Itachi out.  And kills him.



I don't see why that wouldn't work.


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## willyvereb (Mar 15, 2013)

Because Susano has propagation time, it isn't instant by a long-shot.
Seriously, can people finally use their brain instead of sputing this "instant" shit for abilities that aren't like that by their very nature?
Susanoo forms an energy aura which surrounds Itachi.
It might form faster than your generic Naruto ninja can close the distance but it isn't by any way instant.


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## ikoke (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> Or Dante just *grabs Susanoo bare-handed while it is frozen* and telekinetically pulls Itachi out.  And kills him.



You need to prove he can generate enough force telekinetically to overwhelm Susanoo's defense,or that he can make Itachi's body phase out through the defense.


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## ikoke (Mar 15, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> Because Susano has propagation time, it isn't instant by a long-shot.
> Seriously, can people finally use their brain instead of sputing this "instant" shit for abilities that aren't like that by their very nature?
> Susanoo forms an energy aura which surrounds Itachi.
> It might form faster than your generic Naruto ninja can close the distance but it isn't by any way instant.



Susanoo isn't instant,but it's activation speed=Itachi's reaction speed.


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## willyvereb (Mar 15, 2013)

I could say the same.
You have yet to show any evidence that Susanoo is an instant technique.
Which I very much doubt but at least I would like to see you try.



ikoke said:


> Susanoo isn't instant,but it's activation speed=Itachi's reaction speed.


Well, that'd be reasonable.
On the other hand that also means that Susanoo won't be covering Itachi by the time Dante activates Quicksilver.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> Because Susano has propagation time, it isn't instant by a long-shot.
> Seriously, can people finally use their brain instead of sputing this "instant" shit for abilities that aren't like that by their very nature?
> Susanoo forms an energy aura which surrounds Itachi.
> It might form faster than your generic Naruto ninja can close the distance but it isn't by any way instant.



Exactly what I was trying to say.  Thanks.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> I could say the same.
> You have yet to show any evidence that Susanoo is an instant technique.
> Which I very much doubt but at least I would like to see you try.
> 
> ...



Which is what I was saying the whole time, Susanoo might start up.  But the protective aura won't be completely covering Itachi at all.  He will still be vulnerable.


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## Roxas233 (Mar 15, 2013)

a question could itachi reaction time keep up with someone or something thats as fast as lightning?


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## P-X 12 (Mar 15, 2013)

^Short answer, no.

Don't mind me, btw, just walkin' through here.


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## Roxas233 (Mar 15, 2013)

Phx12 said:


> ^Short answer, no.
> 
> Don't mind me, btw, just walkin' through here.



if that is the case then Dante has better reaction time than itachi considering how Dante could of almost hit of a blitz (lightning demon) before the blitz teleported at the last second 

Blitz


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

Roxas233 said:


> if that is the case then Dante has better reaction time than itachi considering how Dante could of almost hit of a blitz (lightning demon) before the blitz teleported at the last second
> 
> Blitz



That is where the Mach 20+ calc is coming from Roxas.


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## Roxas233 (Mar 15, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> That is where the Mach 20+ calc is coming from Roxas.



i under stand that but wouldnt that mean dante is faster and has more reaction tome than itachi since ittachi cant keep up with a blitz


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## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 15, 2013)

No, because Itachi could keep up with Blitz.

He's not real Lightning therefore he doesn;t get true Lightning speed.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 15, 2013)

Never-the-less, QS + face stab ftw.


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## Sablés (Mar 15, 2013)

What does it take to be real lightning fast again?


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## Roxas233 (Mar 15, 2013)

Sabl?s said:


> What does it take to be real lightning fast again?



apperently anything but being a spawn of lightning


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## Saitomaru (Mar 15, 2013)

Sabl?s said:


> What does it take to be real lightning fast again?



Being Kirin


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## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 15, 2013)

Sabl?s said:


> What does it take to be real lightning fast again?



Being from cloud to ground usually, unless there is some seriously good proof for lightning speed.


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## Tsubori (Mar 16, 2013)

SO is this debate settled then? Itachi has no counter to an instant quicksilver/instant death, so I'd assume so. Also, I love that little algorithm of how long the fight is compared to how awesome the fighters are. At the start when both fighters are crappy, the fight is kinda short, just whoever does something stabby first. Then you get to stronger characters drawing out badass long fights. Then... this. Welcome to Hax level, where the match time is about 4 seconds because whoever lets loose their hax first wins.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 16, 2013)

Tsubori said:


> Also, I love that little algorithm of how long the fight is compared to how awesome the fighters are. At the start when both fighters are crappy, the fight is kinda short, just whoever does something stabby first. Then you get to stronger characters drawing out badass long fights. Then... this. Welcome to Hax level, where the match time is about 4 seconds because whoever lets loose their hax first wins.



What are you talking about? If you think this is 'hax' you need to lurk more.


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## Tsubori (Mar 16, 2013)

Okay, fair enough. But quicksilver is like.... extremely low end hax at least. He's no God Emperor of Mankind, but it's at least a little hax-y.


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## Nighty the Mighty (Mar 16, 2013)

Quick silver is pretty hax.

Based on that one cutscene it slows time for Dante's enemies down by thousands at least.


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## P-X 12 (Mar 16, 2013)

Is there even a calc for Quicksilver?


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## HeavyMetalThunder (Mar 16, 2013)

I calculated it to slow down time by 3000+ times once, as a low end, or something. Can't remember the actual number right now.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 16, 2013)

Tsubori said:


> Okay, fair enough. But quicksilver is like.... extremely low end hax at least. He's no God Emperor of Mankind, but it's at least a little hax-y.



I know was just busting your chops.


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## Tsubori (Mar 16, 2013)

Gah -3- I'm an autistic kid. I can't sense sarcasm. I thought I really fucked up.


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## ikoke (Mar 16, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> Well, that'd be reasonable.
> On the other hand that also means that Susanoo won't be covering Itachi by the time Dante activates Quicksilver.



But what I don't understand is this:- both QS and Susanoo activation depends on the user's reaction speed. Both the fighters have the same reaction speed(mach 20+). Then why exactly will QS's effect come into play before even incomplete Susanoo is up?

Kage summit arc Sauce is inferior to Itachi,and yet he had no problem bringing up Susanoo in time to save himself from the 4th Raikage's attack(who is easily mach 20+ in both movement and reaction speed),and yet here we can clearly see that he had not even activated Susanoo by the time  Raikage's attack was well underway and he still managed to pull it off before the attack ended. Hell,the  Raikage didn't even realize that Sauce had used Susanoo until after the attack was over   
,and he has mach 20+ reactions.

And Itachi's reactions are>> Kage arc Sasuke's.


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## Tsubori (Mar 16, 2013)

Because mach 20 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Instant.


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## ikoke (Mar 16, 2013)

^ Doesn't matter whether or not QS's effect is instant,because Dante has to initiate the technique first and his reactions are mach 20.


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## Tsubori (Mar 16, 2013)

Yes, but if they react at the same time, Instant is still faster than Dr Seussanoo forming. If there's even a bit of Itachi that hasn't been covered by then, game over.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 16, 2013)

The problem is that chakra still has to pour out of Itachi's body.  It's a process.  The Sharingan's precognitive ability helps give Uchiha bloodline the edge against people that are equal speed or a little bit faster because it anticipates what they are going to do and affords the user the ability to react before/same time their opponent performs an action.

This won't matter for Dante because....

1.)  They are dead-starting, with no prep.
2.)  Dante's ability is based on a magical artifact not chakra..

Therefore, precognition doesn't come into play.  Therefore, Dante's time-stop prevents Itachi from fully producing his Susanoo.


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## ikoke (Mar 16, 2013)

Tsubori said:


> Yes, but if they react at the same time, Instant is still faster than Dr Seussanoo forming. If there's even a bit of Itachi that hasn't been covered by then, game over.



True,but Itachi can directly use this version of Susanoo. So no part of him will be left uncovered.


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## Tsubori (Mar 16, 2013)

.......So you`re just ignoring the fact that we've established that Dante quicksilvers before Susanoo even forms at all? Ooookay then.

Does that mean our side can ignore susanoo's existence and call it a win?


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## Saitomaru (Mar 16, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> The problem is that chakra still has to pour out of Itachi's body.



You know, I hadn't even thought about the fact that Susano'o 'pours' out of their body. Why are we assuming that there would be a part of him left uncovered when it basically oozes out of his skin. Worst case scenario he has a thin layer surrounding his body (I don't see why people are assuming it gets created at different rates around his body. Every time I see it used it just sort of appears. The only thing that takes longer is the more advanced (complete) forms. Its the anime that makes it seem like it takes a while. The manga (usually) has it appear next panel. By the same token, that also makes it hard to prove what its formation 'speed' is. Making it happen next panel could mean instant to some extent, or it could mean it takes scant seconds. The second option would make it useless here.



> .......So you`re just ignoring the fact that we've established that Dante quicksilvers before Susanoo even forms at all? Ooookay then.
> 
> Does that mean our side can ignore susanoo's existence and call it a win?



I think its just as I said above, it's difficult to figure out how fast their incomplete susano'o formation is since it tends to happen next-panel and block some attack last minute.


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## ikoke (Mar 16, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> The problem is that chakra still has to pour out of Itachi's body.  It's a process.  The Sharingan's precognitive ability helps give Uchiha bloodline the edge against people that are equal speed or a little bit faster because it anticipates what they are going to do and affords the user the ability to react before/same time their opponent performs an action.
> 
> This won't matter for Dante because....
> 
> ...



No offense,but I would rather get willy's reply on this matter. You see,we have been arguing over this point for several hours now,and neither of us has quite succeeded in convincing the other.

As for your post, the rate of formation of Susanoo has nothing to do with sharingan precog.

you have been saying that Susanoo has a little "charge time" before it comes into play after the user thinks of it. But there is no real indication of anything like this in the manga. No Susanoo->Susanoo appears. No Susanoo->susanoo appears. Same thing in that scan of Raikage vs Sauce fight. Precognition has nothing to do with it. Sauce managed to intitae the technique after his opponent launched his attack and yet managed to finish it before the attack landed,and his opponent(who has great speed+reactions) didn't even notice it.

The only thing Susanoo users can't do is,activate the Final form of the technique at once,but Itachi has feats of activating 2nd stage Susanoo right off the bat.


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 16, 2013)

So you're saying 2nd stage Susanoo is instantaneous?


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## ikoke (Mar 16, 2013)

Tsubori said:


> .......So you`re just ignoring the fact that we've established that Dante quicksilvers before Susanoo even forms at all? Ooookay then.
> 
> Does that mean our side can ignore susanoo's existence and call it a win?



In case you haven't noticed,I'm not understanding how exactly QS effect comes into existence before even incomplete Susanoo comes up. Hence the whole debate.

And when did *you* prove anything? Punchsplosion has been trying to prove it,but you are pretty much a spectator.

@Hyperion101-No I am not saying something like that,since it's rather hard to say anything of that sort from the manga panels. But what I am saying is,Susanoo's 1st and 2nd stages seem to materialize around the user as soon as they will it.It's as Saitomaru said,in the anime the process is a bit lengthened,but in the manga it just seems to pop out of no where.


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## Tsubori (Mar 16, 2013)

manga scans are usually pretty bad for the timing being explained, so honestly, it'd be much more accurate to look at the anime for that.


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## Tsubori (Mar 16, 2013)

ikoke said:


> In case you haven't noticed,I'm not understanding how exactly QS effect comes into existence before even incomplete Susanoo comes up. Hence the whole debate.
> 
> And when did *you* prove anything? Punchsplosion has been trying to prove it,but you are pretty much a spectator.



Oh no, I'm not saying I've proven anything. I for the most part AM a spectator. Mostly because Punchsplosion got to any point I had already.


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 16, 2013)

Lol, no Tsubori.

In any case, both techniques activate by thought but QS comes faster as chakra needs to mold in order to form Susanoo.

Last time I checked, Susanoo is not instantaneous in any given form.


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## ikoke (Mar 16, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> Lol, no Tsubori.
> 
> In any case, both techniques activate by thought but QS comes faster as chakra needs to mold in order to form Susanoo.
> 
> Last time I checked, Susanoo is not instantaneous in any given form.



Did you check the scans I posted. The time for chakra molding seems to be factored into Itachi's reaction time,because in none of the scans there is any indication of any chakra build up prior to Susanoo's activation.

For that matter,Amaterasu,another prominent MS technique *does* have a well known charge time. Zetsu noted this during Itachi vs sasuske fight,and Sasuke himself tried to take advantage of it. But no one has ever commented on chakra buildup for Susanoo. Zetsu didn't even realize Susanoo had been used,even though he was watching and he seems to have some sort of chakra detection skill.

@Tsubori-You can't look to the anime,since it's non canon.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 16, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> So you're saying 2nd stage Susanoo is instantaneous?



I doubt it, but as he said Susano'o (in the manga) always forms next panel. So we really have no way of telling whether it just pops out (in its incomplete form) instantly or whether it takes a few off panel seconds.



Tsubori said:


> manga scans are usually pretty bad for the timing being explained, so honestly, it'd be much more accurate to look at the anime for that.



I don't trust the anime for anything, to much fuck ups in manga-based anime. I still remember those 'radditz is ftl' fucktards.



Hyperion1O1 said:


> Lol, no Tsubori.
> 
> In any case, both techniques activate by thought but QS comes faster as chakra needs to mold in order to form Susanoo.
> 
> Last time I checked, Susanoo is not instantaneous in any given form.



As has been stated there is not proof for or against the idea that Incomplete Susano'o forms instantly. It always just appears next panel at the last second, just in time to block some attack (Kishi abuses this). 

Do you have any proof that Susano'o requires chakra molding prior to formation? As I said before, if it does require chakra molding prior to use all that means is that Itachi (and Sasgay) have faster reactions than what is being given them in this. 

So if they currently have equal reactions, assuming it takes prior chakra molding would just mean Itachi has higher reactions because it would mean that every time they blocked an attack with Susano'o they had already long since perceived the attack. The increased amount would be rather unquantifiable but it would exist.


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 16, 2013)

It would still require to have a very small build up time.

How's the durability from that 2nd stage?


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## ikoke (Mar 16, 2013)

@Hyperion- Sasuke' ribcage Susanoo stopped one(or two) attacks from a bloodlusted raikage. Those are in the MCB+ range.

Itachi's Susanoo is unquantifiably better than that,so without Yata somewhere in the high MCB range is my guess. With Yata,it is around 10 MT. And even 2nd stage Susanoo can use Yata.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 16, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> It would still require to have a very small build up time.



Any proof for that? 



> How's the durability from that 2nd stage?



The wiki says large building level but its outdated so... I don't know. I guess I could go look for feats, but I don't like Itachi enough to bother. I'm only arguing because I have the free time and I don't like to see one side get completely dismissed when there is still some room to build upon.


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 16, 2013)

Saitomaru said:


> Any proof for that?



Because its debatable even if its instantaneous?

Susanoo still requires chakra, am I right? So unless it doesn't, we assume chakra is still needed to form that thing.

EDIT: God, this is giving me a headache.


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## ikoke (Mar 16, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> Because its debatable even if its instantaneous?
> 
> Susanoo still requires chakra, am I right? So unless it doesn't, we assume chakra is still needed to form that thing.
> 
> EDIT: *God, this is giving me a headache.*



Chakra is needed,but whatever molding it needs is pretty damn fast....no charge time or anything of the sort.

Agree with the bolded part. Time to log out.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 16, 2013)

ikoke said:


> Chakra is needed,but whatever molding it needs is pretty damn fast....no charge time or anything of the sort.
> 
> Agree with the bolded part. Time to log out.



It is still a process.  The precog enables his body to react to things that he sees at a high speed.  Getting powerbombed and activating incomplete Susanoo before he hits the ground is not the same as an instant time stop.  Sasuke had from the time he was lifted up till he hit the ground to think and mold the chakra.  He doesn't get that time.  Bot think at the same time and Susanoo doesn't instantly come out.  Therefore, it is would be a minuscule layer that wouldn't even qualify as incomplete.  Just a chakra aura at best.

If they can react at the same time and one effect is instant while the other is not, then the other technique process becomes moot because time essentially stops.

I don't understand why you fail to understand this truth.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 16, 2013)

You misunderstand me saying chakra molding and think I mean charge time.  I don't.  The process of Susanoo forming stops.


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 16, 2013)

Going to correct you just in case you might use time stop in the future, QS is a time slow.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 16, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> Because its debatable even if its instantaneous?
> 
> Susanoo still requires chakra, am I right? So unless it doesn't, we assume chakra is still needed to form that thing.
> 
> EDIT: God, this is giving me a headache.



The debatability of it being instantaneous is not proof that it requires chakra molding. chakra being needed to form it does not mean it requires some sort of prior chakra molding to use. The fact is if it DOES require prior molding that means their reactions are faster than the Mach 20+ attacks they're reacting to by however long it takes to mold said chakra. Meaning they have faster reaction times than Dante (by some unknown factor) making the chakra molding time moot since things still play out as if Susano'o was instantaneous to some extent. This is going off the idea that Dante is equal to the mach 20+ characters that they use Susano'o to block at the last minute. 



Punchsplosion said:


> You misunderstand me saying chakra molding and think I mean charge time.  I don't.  The process of Susanoo forming stops.



That the problem, Susano'o always forms (to its incomplete stage at the very least) over the on the next panel. One panel they're unprotected, the next Susano'o is up to some extent. This makes proving/disproving its 'formation speed' relatively impossible. Especially since they also have a habit (well Sasgay does) of only forming what is needed (i.e- ribs).



Hyperion1O1 said:


> Going to correct you just in case you might use time stop in the future, QS is a time slow.



Didn't someone say that it slows time down by like 3000 times or something crazy like that?


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## willyvereb (Mar 16, 2013)

Well, that's still far from instant.
Forming fast enough that it can block a guy's attack who charges at full speed at him only makes the formation of Susanoo about as fast as its opponents.

Seriously, are people this dense?
Basically we're repeating the same argument for pages now and some people still doesn't seem to get it.
Even if Dante and Itachi use their abilities in the same time, if the former activates Quicksilver then Susanoo is going to put on halt long before it could fully form around him.
Quicksilver being time stop or time slowing, it doesn't matter here.
Like others said, Quicksilver effectively makes Dante at least 1000 times faster so both Itachi and his Susanoo technique would be looking standing still.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 16, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> Well, that's still far from instant.
> Forming fast enough that it can block a guy's attack who charges at full speed at him only makes the formation of Susanoo about as fast as its opponents.
> 
> Seriously, are people this dense?
> ...



And as was already stated whether or not its incomplete formation is instant is debateable since it always just forms next panel. It doesn't form as they approach, it forms last second yet off panel so we hardly ever see its partial formation unless that was the user's intention. The anime makes the formation seem longer but last time I checked the anime is either non canon or trumped by the manga.

Edit: A lack of proof for instant partial formation is not proof that it doesn't have instant partial formation.


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## willyvereb (Mar 16, 2013)

Saitomaru said:


> And as was already stated whether or not its incomplete formation is instant is debateable since it always just forms next panel. It doesn't form as they approach, it forms last second yet off panel so we hardly ever see its partial formation unless that was the user's intention. The anime makes the formation seem longer but last time I checked the anime is either non canon or trumped by the manga.
> 
> Edit: A lack of proof for instant partial formation is not proof that it doesn't have instant partial formation.


Burden of Proof Fallacy.
You have to prove Susanoo is instant.
Not the other way around.

So I guess anyone who can speedblitz is moving instantly, no?
Itachi vs the Flash


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## P-X 12 (Mar 16, 2013)

Wait, you guys are arguing whether or not Susanoo activation is instant?

How in the hell can it be considered that? Does it have any evidence of instant activation?


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## Saitomaru (Mar 16, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> Burden of Proof Fallacy.
> You have to prove Susanoo is instant.
> Not the other way around.
> 
> ...



Ah see, that works both ways. As I already said, my lack of proof is not proof to the contrary. I have no proof its instant (other than the fact that if forms off panel/next panel), do you have any proof that it takes time to form? Otherwise it fall under the same thing that certain banned topics fall under.

As it stands, the only "proof" I have is those feats random guy who I forgot the name of posted a while back showing the 'one panel its not there, panel it is' thing I was talking about.


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 17, 2013)

Saitomaru said:


> Ah see, that works both ways. As I already said, my lack of proof is not proof to the contrary. I have no proof its instant (other than the fact that if forms off panel/next panel), do you have any proof that it takes time to form? Otherwise it fall under the same thing that certain banned topics fall under.
> 
> As it stands, the only "proof" I have is those feats random guy who I forgot the name of posted a while back showing the 'one panel its not there, panel it is' thing I was talking about.



That would work if we didn't know that every other Naruto technique takes chakra molding AND we haven't already seen examples of the Susanoo actually taking time to activate.  It's not an instant ability as chakra HAS to leave the body and form the designated shape.

Additionally, I called it a time stop earlier because it slows the combatants down by 3000 times.  So, essentially it is a time stop effect for this scenario.

Regardless, Dante's temporal distortion ability IS instantaneous and precedents have already been established in the Naruto series that designate how jutsus operate.  Thought, chakra molding (optional hand seals), and completion.  Dante's doesn't have a middle step.  It's thought and completion.  Because Itachi has that other step, he loses based on the fact that....as Willyvereb has already stated...the technique isn't allowed to propagate.


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## Hullo (Mar 17, 2013)

I've only gone through 6 pages. Has anyone made a multiversal pizza joke yet?


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## Saitomaru (Mar 17, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> AND we haven't already seen examples of the Susanoo actually taking time to activate.



When was this, that's the kind of stuff I was hoping someone would find. Gimme


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## Punchsplosion (Mar 17, 2013)

Saitomaru said:


> When was this, that's the kind of stuff I was hoping someone would find. Gimme



I might have been thinking of the anime, but I will go through some scans and post them when I find them tomorrow.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 17, 2013)

Punchsplosion said:


> I might have been thinking of the anime, but I will go through some scans and post them when I find them tomorrow.



Please do, I REALLY did not like arguing _for_ Itachi.


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## ikoke (Mar 17, 2013)

Saitomaru said:


> Please do, I REALLY did not like arguing _for_ Itachi.



Well,the closest I managed to find was this,the flesh forming on Susanoo's bones. But check the previous page,and the last pages of the previous chapter,and you will see that the skeletal framework materializes all around him at once,not in steps.





Punchsplosion said:


> That would work if we didn't know that every other Naruto technique takes chakra molding AND we haven't already seen examples of the Susanoo actually taking time to activate.  It's not an instant ability as chakra HAS to leave the body and form the designated shape.
> 
> Additionally, I called it a time stop earlier because it slows the combatants down by 3000 times.  So, essentially it is a time stop effect for this scenario.
> 
> Regardless, Dante's temporal distortion ability IS instantaneous and precedents have already been established in the Naruto series that designate how jutsus operate.  Thought, chakra molding (optional hand seals), and completion.  Dante's doesn't have a middle step.  It's thought and completion.  Because Itachi has that other step, he loses based on the fact that....as Willyvereb has already stated...the technique isn't allowed to propagate.



Chakra is definitely needed. But why are you assuming that the process goes in this order:-
Itachi thinks of Susanoo->Itachi molds chakra for Susanoo->Susanoo appears.?
The process seems to be:-
Itachi thinks of Susanoo and molds chakra->Susanoo appears. Basically,the thinking of activation and chakra molding for activation steps are not sequential,by all indications they are simultaneous.

Hence Susanoo activation is just 2 steps as well. And Itachi can directly bring out Stage 2 Susanoo,so even if time slow halts further development of Susanoo,Itachi will still be protected.



willyvereb said:


> Well, that's still far from instant.
> Forming fast enough that it can block a guy's attack who charges at full speed at him only makes the formation of Susanoo about as fast as its opponents.
> 
> Seriously, are people this dense?
> ...



Once QS activates Susanoo's further formation is going to be put on hold,that's true. But that doesn't really matter since even non final form Susanoo's completely covers Itachi,and I have posted several scans to show that he can directly bring 2nd stage.


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 17, 2013)

Well, imo, the reason we see it simply forming bones and shit around Itachi is the fact that this was Susanoo's first introduction so Kishi may have wanted to show off a bit and now that Susanoo is more and more used, there's no reason to show it forming step by step since we know exactly how it appears.

Apparently, thats the only logical assumption I could make without resorting to calling it instantaneous.


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## ikoke (Mar 17, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> Well, imo, the reason we see it simply forming bones and shit around Itachi is the fact that this was Susanoo's first introduction so Kishi may have wanted to show off a bit and now that Susanoo is more and more used, there's no reason to show it forming step by step since we know exactly how it appears.
> 
> Apparently, thats the only logical assumption I could make without resorting to calling it instantaneous.



Even the 1st time it was used,the skeletal form appears directly,the flesh and armor forms gradually. It's nearly the same for every appearance of the technique.

Also,the FRS first appears in the Kakuzu Arc,but even in the War Arc we are shown it's formation process(top right panel).


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 17, 2013)

1st time it was used- formation was shown
2nd time (around Danzo, I think)- formation shown but maybe just because it was Sasuke's, not Itachi's

When's the 3rd time and 4th time it was used?


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## ikoke (Mar 17, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> 1st time it was used- formation was shown
> 2nd time (around Danzo, I think)- formation shown but maybe just because it was Sasuke's, not Itachi's
> 
> When's the 3rd time and 4th time it was used?



Probably when Itachi and Sauce skirmished and when they faced Kabuto.


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 17, 2013)

So its the instantaneous one?

Are we counting Madara's Perfect Susanoo in this?


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## ikoke (Mar 17, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> So its the instantaneous one?
> 
> Are we counting Madara's Perfect Susanoo in this?



I am sorry,but I don't quite get what you are trying to say here.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 17, 2013)

12 pages smh


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 17, 2013)

I'm asking how Madara  forms his Susanoo. It could be used to properly scale the "instantaneous one"


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## ikoke (Mar 17, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> I'm asking how Madara  forms his Susanoo. It could be used to properly scale the "instantaneous one"



As far as I remember,it's the same as others. Skeletal part appears out of nowhere,then flesh and armor gets added layer by layer.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Mar 17, 2013)

like this :

formation process
formation process


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## Saitomaru (Mar 17, 2013)

Hyperion1O1 said:


> I'm asking how Madara  forms his Susanoo. It could be used to properly scale the "instantaneous one"





Fluttershy said:


> like this :
> 
> got up again
> Link removed



Yep, yet another next-panel pop in.


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## Unlucky13 (Mar 17, 2013)

So....has this discussion gotten anywhere beyond the point of the quick silver blitz and susanoo argument? We have one side arguing that Dante could finish Itachi off before Susanoo forms while we have another side arguing that Susanoo forms too fast for speed blitz. Just wondering mind you because this has gone on for several pages but what the heck it's OBD.


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## Saitomaru (Mar 17, 2013)

Unlucky13 said:


> So....has this discussion gotten anywhere beyond the point of the quick silver blitz and susanoo argument? We have one side arguing that Dante could finish Itachi off before Susanoo forms while we have another side arguing that Susanoo forms too fast for speed blitz. Just wondering mind you because this has gone on for several pages but what the heck it's OBD.



That's what happens when artists get lazy and start to cut corners. If it was just me arguing I'd have dropped it and conceded long ago.


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## Hyperion1O1 (Mar 17, 2013)

Kishi probably wanted to save pages to have us eating out of his hands..


It won't happen, Kishi. Better give up now.


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## Jurassic park (Mar 18, 2013)

An interesting match. This could go either way, IMO.


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