# Shin Angyo Onshi= overrated medicore tripe. (Discussion of overrated mangas)



## handofjustice (Jun 22, 2009)

I have been reading this manga and have got to chapter 22 and this still hasnt picked up. Bearing in mind its a 70 chapter manga so I think this is a reasonable point to evaluate the quality of the manga and so far I just dont get what all the hype is about. You have an unlikeable main character who seems to suck at combat and relies on a girl to do his fighting and a weird ass world. Honestly I dont see how this can make peoples top ten.

I would like opinions on this matter and to talk about other overrated mangas like this one.


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## The Imp (Jun 22, 2009)

Atleast finish it first.

The pace begins to pick up around chapter 35 and it gets a lot better as you go.


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## Dream Brother (Jun 22, 2009)

> You have an unlikeable main character who seems to suck at combat and relies on a girl to do his fighting and a weird ass world.



_This_ is the full extent of your critique on the series? Seems rather odd when considering your use of 'overrated medicore tripe' in the title. Surely you can elaborate?

Personally I really enjoyed it, aside from one or two qualms. Easily in my top ten.


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## handofjustice (Jun 22, 2009)

kurono76767 said:


> Atleast finish it first.
> 
> The pace begins to pick up around chapter 35 and it gets a lot better as you go.



For a 70 chapter manga I think 35 chapters in is to far gone for it to suddenly switch paces but thats just my opinion, I will certainly continue reading it but so far cant see where the hype comes from.


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## Fran (Jun 22, 2009)

My favourite manga.



> You have an unlikeable main character who seems to suck at combat and relies on a girl to do his fighting and a weird ass world.



As opposed to, lets say, a main male lead with awesome combat abilities with a reliant fodder-girl companion?

This is for me, the best out there. Art, storyline, character and emotion, top notch stuff. I think it deserves more attention.

Actually, now that I think about it, it's strength is in its latter half. The first half is mostly a episodic series of 'arrive at x place, solve x place's problems, defeat y villain' although it all links in later.


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## handofjustice (Jun 22, 2009)

Dream Brother said:


> _This_ is the full extent of your critique on the series? Seems rather odd when considering your use of 'overrated medicore tripe' in the title. *Surely you can elaborate?*
> Personally I really enjoyed it, aside from one or two qualms. Easily in my top ten.



A lot of my distaste of it so far comes from the way its written and also the main character. It seems he is sometimes written to be a complete and utter despicable bastard for the sake of been one. Also the plot seems slow and hasn?t had a build up and for a 70 chapter manga that just isn?t acceptable. Maybe its just me but I was expecting more from this since people on here seem to cum in their pants at the mere mention of Shin Angyo Onshi.


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## Dream Brother (Jun 22, 2009)

Mattaru said:


> Actually, now that I think about it, it's strength is in its latter half. The first half is mostly a episodic series of 'arrive at x place, solve x place's problems, defeat y villain' although it all links in later.



Yep. I found it to be better as it went on -- especially the flashback arc -- and I disagree with the people who whine about the ending. I thought it was a great send-off.


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## handofjustice (Jun 22, 2009)

Mattaru said:


> My favourite manga.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yeah well Munshu (Dont know if I spelt his name right) just seems pointless combat wise and what irks me the most is whenever in battle he always tries to act like this big badass but his shit and gets pwned most of the time. If not for that Sado chick he would have died time ago.


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## The Imp (Jun 22, 2009)

handofjustice said:


> For a 70 chapter manga I think 35 chapters in is to far gone for it to suddenly switch paces but thats just my opinion, I will certainly continue reading it but so far cant see where the hype comes from.



The pace was never really slow to begin with, but it gets much faster and much more important things happen. 


*Spoiler*: __ 



It's also beginning to get closer to the climax. At around chapter 45 we get a really big flashback that begins to put all the pieces to together and we finally understand everything that is going on and all the deeply rooted emotions between the characters.

IMO that 20 chapter flashback is the best part of the entire manga. Then there is about 10 chapters left where a final battle takes place.



When you finish it, you may still think it's overrated but I'm sure you will have atleast enjoyed reading SAO.


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## Dream Brother (Jun 22, 2009)

> A lot of my distaste of it so far comes from the way its written and also the main character. It seems he is sometimes written to be a complete and utter despicable bastard for the sake of been one. Also the plot seems slow and hasn’t had a build up and for a 70 chapter manga that just isn’t acceptable. Maybe its just me but I was expecting more from this since people on here seem to cum in their pants at the mere mention of Shin Angyo Onshi.



After I finished the series I wrote a mini review in the SAO thread here. I'll quote my opening words:

'The beginning had me doubtful, I must say. It seemed a little slow and devoid of meat in the plot, and I was ready to cringe when the customary Scantily Clad Girl Figure was introduced to join the protagonist's party. You can guess how pleased I was, then, when the series actually took the time to give her a distinct personality and actual relevance to the plot. Rather than being the damsel in distress, she ended up actually being ridiculously strong, and saving/upstaging the male characters at various points. Rare. In fact, the series as a whole seems very interested in the power of women and the frailty of men, reversing the traditional route.'

I wish I could quote the rest, as I touch upon a lot of the things that interested me in the series, but it's riddled with spoilers, so I'll leave it out. The point is that you can clearly see how I had a similarly disappointed reaction to you at first -- I honestly think you should give the series a chance and see if it changes your mind, as mine was changed. 

I actually really like Munsu's frailty in combat -- such a refreshing change from manga conventions regarding the male protagonist.


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## Goodfellow (Jun 22, 2009)

I thought it was a great series. Simply brilliant. My only gripe with it was the ending fights, and the whole setup for the ending. I got this sloppy "throw it in" feeling when it was really "Gondor calls for aid". 

But Munsu versus Aji Tae was such an epic last "fight" that it made up for somewhat shoddy build up for the ending climax. If you want an epic ending, that's how you fucking do it

Actually, Munsu as a whole was such a fucking awesome main character. Sure, he starts of as this total ass, but then we start to get glimpse into his inner workings, and we start to realize that the man isn't an ass. He's an absolute hero breathing brimstone and epic!!!

(Sando was also really cool. It's refreshing with strong female leads. To be honest, I often get dreadfully bored with them if they are just pretty faces)


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## Tempproxy (Jun 22, 2009)

handofjustice said:


> A lot of my distaste of it so far comes from the way its written and also the main character. It seems he is sometimes written to be a complete and utter despicable bastard for the sake of been one. Also the plot seems slow and hasn?t had a build up and for a 70 chapter manga that just isn?t acceptable. Maybe its just me but I was expecting more from this *since people on here seem to cum in their pants at the mere mention of Shin Angyo Onshi*.



 You dam right I do.


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## The Imp (Jun 22, 2009)

handofjustice said:


> Yeah well Munshu (Dont know if I spelt his name right) just seems pointless combat wise and what irks me the most is whenever in battle he always tries to act like this big badass but his shit and gets pwned most of the time. If not for that Sado chick he would have died time ago.



He's a lot more badass in the flashback arc. He's more of a cunning main character rather than the character who is stronger than everyone else and can't lose in a fight.


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## Nightfall (Jun 22, 2009)

Goodfellow said:


> I thought it was a great series. Simply brilliant. My only gripe with it was the ending fights, and the whole setup for the ending. I got this sloppy "throw it in" feeling when it was really "*Gondor calls for aid"*.
> 
> But Munsu versus Aji Tae was such an epic last "fight" that it made up for somewhat shoddy build up for the ending climax. If you want an epic ending, that's how you fucking do it




Pretty much, the ending fights were a bit out of nowhere for me as well. Everything happened very fast... should have been a few chapters longer, thats what I think at least...


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## ~Avant~ (Jun 22, 2009)

Come back after you read chapter 48. Any doubts you have will be eliminated with this chapter and thereafter


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## TalikX (Jun 22, 2009)

Thread creator fails, only reading up to chapter 22 of this epic manhwa? Go read Bleach, you will like it


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## Inugami (Jun 22, 2009)

You are sooo wrong 

Shin Angyo Onshi= underrated

dude on seinen you rarely see Ichigo's kicking asses or little kiddos destroying the enemies with their gothic eyes .


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## Fran (Jun 22, 2009)

This thread is heading down the direction where every participant starts:


> to cum in their pants at the mere mention of Shin Angyo Onshi.


Everything becomes very sticky and very, very delicious.  

Seriously, there are some incredible moments later in the manga. I'm glad you're sticking it out though, you'll be rewarded.

 Kye Wol Hyang  Mewww.

Oh yeah another gripe: I can never remember Korean names


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## Wuzzman (Jun 22, 2009)

Shin Angyo Onshi interested me in the beginning, but i think it lost me at some point, so instead of reading 40 something chapters I just read the ending and went "oh that's what happens"....... Anywho this manga is qualifies as a cult classic, meaning it has niche appeal. I don't have any personal dewy eyed memories of reading it even after going back to read the chapters I skipped over.


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## Memos (Jun 22, 2009)

First of all, it's a manhwa. There's a difference so go learn it. Secondly, it's Munsu and Sando, not Munshu and Sado. You seem to be critiquing something which you probably haven't payed enough attention to understand.

You are complaining about a lead character who isn't the be-all-and-end-all Mary Sue of his verse? then you top that off with the "relies on a girl" line which makes you appear nothing but sexist and a little close minded. What's exactly wrong with a character who isn't all that strong? Is a character for you all about strength and fireballs?

As for him being unlikable; there are reasons and there are circumstances. There are layers to this guy and many complexities in his past beyond the 'not everyone liking him and not having a family' certain manga over-use. He has some of the most complex and deep relationship with the other characters than many characters in any manga/manhwa i've ever read.

I don't know what you expected from it but manga/manhwa usually have chapters to build character/situations which pay off later. It's called development. It's called good writing which weaves a complex, fully formed plot. Some of the stand alone chapters are based on Korean legends, myths and so on, but, i'd be surprised if you payed enough attention beyond looking for Munsu to grow wings and go blow up the moon with his inner spirit to realise that.

Sando is strong. She is meant to be strong and there is a damn good reason for her strength. You know, normally I hate spoiling people and especially with this manga, but, i'm finding it hard to care with you so i'll leave it at that. What do you want from the characters? You want them to come on panel and then have their whole story and character, influences and goals to be revealed in crappy and forced exposition?

The side-characters are actually important. Is that a foreign concept for you?

Why don't you just go read _Blade of the Immortal_, _Berserk_, _Pluto_, _Monster_ and come and tell us how much they suck.

This thread is an abortion and should be closed on principle


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## Tempproxy (Jun 22, 2009)

Kusuriuri said:


> First of all, it's a manhwa. There's a difference so go learn it. Secondly, it's Munsu and Sando, not Munshu and Sado. You seem to be critiquing something which you probably haven't payed enough attention to understand.
> 
> You are complaining about a lead character who isn't the be-all-and-end-all Mary Sue of his verse? then you top that off with the "relies on a girl" line which makes you appear nothing but sexist and a little close minded. What's exactly wrong with a character who isn't all that strong? Is a character for you all about strength and fireballs?
> 
> ...



Well said couldnt agree more.


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## Wuzzman (Jun 22, 2009)

you take this manga too seriously.


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## Memos (Jun 22, 2009)

Wuzzman said:


> you take this manga too seriously.



You're right. I should have probably skipped to the end and then gone back to maybe read some chapters again.


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## .access timeco. (Jun 22, 2009)

You didn't explained much, but based on the few you said... I believe you are not used to seinen.

The neverending ammount of cliché in shonen can be addictive and becomes hard to like things that doesn't go along with the formulas it uses for stories/motivations/characters/development/etc.


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## Wuzzman (Jun 22, 2009)

Kusuriuri said:


> You're right. I should have probably skipped to the end and then gone back to maybe read some chapters again.



I enjoyed it for what is was worth, but I don't think its anything to bash someones head over.


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## Memos (Jun 22, 2009)

Wuzzman said:


> I enjoyed it for what is was worth, but I don't think its anything to bash someones head over.



You're pretty strong with your opinions when it comes to Maka and _Soul Eater_ so how about not using such double standards?


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## Cochise (Jun 22, 2009)

I can think of a few overrated series, but Shin Angyo Onshi isn't one of them. I stopped reading in this thread after memos post because it summed up the discussion for me. I would consider series like Bleach, Naruto, and Fairy Tail more as overrated. It's amazing they still have fan bases and are liked by some people considering that they are less than mediocore tripe.


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## KidTony (Jun 22, 2009)

I didn't like SAO either. I didn't finish it, but I read at least 40 chapters. Great artwork and the plot was passable but i got bored. I left it around those chapters in england i think when we start to see some of the backstory. Mainly i thought the fights were crap and the main story line didn't draw you in enough. The only part i really like was that arc about the chick who imagined everything.

I give the manga a 7/10. I'll probably end finishing it when i have time.


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## Wuzzman (Jun 22, 2009)

Kusuriuri said:


> You're pretty strong with your opinions when it comes to Maka and _Soul Eater_ so how about not using such double standards?



Being the only person in the soul eater thread who doesn't bash maka every time he gets vs berating someone over not falling in love with a manga. Maybe if this was berserk we could go to town on the kid, but he didn't even bash manga so...


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## Ennoea (Jun 22, 2009)

> I give the manga a 7/10.



You rating a manga you've never finished.



> you take this manga too seriously.



Claymore, yes this no.


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## Ghost_of_Gashir (Jun 22, 2009)

This story gave us Miss Hwang. Now shut your filthy mouth about Shin Angyo Onshi being overrated.

MISS HWANG


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## Ennoea (Jun 22, 2009)

If SAO is mediocre then practically everything I've read is shit on paper.



> Now shut your filthy mouth about Shin Angyo Onshi being overrated.



It should be regarded as blasphemy.


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## p-lou (Jun 22, 2009)

How can something be mediocre tripe?  That doesn't make sense.


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## Memos (Jun 22, 2009)

It's a weird coincidence that this thread came about just as I started re-reading SAO


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## Inugami (Jun 22, 2009)

KidTony said:


> Mainly i thought the fights were crap



Come on the fights maybe not be so exciting but aren't crap. 



KidTony said:


> I give the manga a 7/10. *I'll probably end finishing it when i have time*.



When you do it perhaps you are going to put a 8.9/10 intead of that 7 cuz really its a good read.


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## Goodfellow (Jun 22, 2009)

Wuzzman said:


> Shin Angyo Onshi interested me in the beginning, but i think it lost me at some point, so instead of reading 40 something chapters I just read the ending and went "oh that's what happens"....... Anywho this manga is qualifies as a cult classic, meaning it has niche appeal. I don't have any personal dewy eyed memories of reading it even after going back to read the chapters I skipped over.



I wish I had a ego in the size of this


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## Midus (Jun 22, 2009)

.access timeco. said:


> You didn't explained much, but based on the few you said... I believe you are not used to seinen.
> 
> The neverending ammount of clich? in shonen can be addictive and becomes hard to like things that doesn't go along with the formulas it uses for stories/motivations/characters/development/etc.



I agree with this. You seem pretty taken aback by the fact that the main character isn't a Luffy or Naruto. Munsu isn't a happy go luck "I fight for my friends" kind of character. I don't see the problem with this, but you seem to not like it. 

I suppose that I can respect this on some levels. If the main character isn't appealing, the manga kind of falls apart for you I would guess.


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## .access timeco. (Jun 22, 2009)

Cochise said:


> I would consider series like Bleach, Naruto, and Fairy Tail more as overrated.


Well, I can't see how Naruto can be overrated. Anywhere you find opinions about it (Naruto Forums included) you will see like 90% of people bashing it and Kishimoto's writting.

To be honest, I find Naruto a really good manga for a shonen. In some aspects it really comes closer to Seinen than almost every Shonen I read so far (I know I will be killed for saying it :/).
The story itself no, but I think Kishimoto have developed a lot of characters in a way they keep going more and more away from the clich? formulas he used so damn much at first. The so much hated Sasuke is the best example I can think, characters like him - that shine and looks irresistible due to their mental weaknessess (doing shit over and over again and never being able to stand in face of truth) - are almost nonexistant in shonen. In shonen, those characters are always depicted as loser villains put into the story only to look like fodder... usually are ugly, old, short and are at the right-side of the main villain thinking high of themselves. Sasuke can b

As far as the story is going, define Sasuke by a mere couple of adjectives is becoming impossimble. The more his personality grows, the more human he becomes and the harder is to define him.
That's exactly what we see in seinen. Characters that don't usually fit the clich?s (in a shonen, you can guess with high accuracy a character's personality based on their faces). It makes them more "mundane" though, less fantastic and "out of our world" and that is more than enough for "only shonen" readers to find them not so charismatic.
Damn, even Naruto (the character) now is becoming like that! And at first he was only the "hard working but optimistic main character" (and Sasuke the "cold and rational genius") we saw thousands of times already.

The problem is the story doesn't flow in a way to properly use those character developments. As an example, Naruto's unhealthy obsession towards Sasuke was always depicted as the purest proof of friendship.
If Kishimoto could use Naruto's new found personality properly into the story he would probably say Naruto was blinded by all the "Naruto can change anyone" crap he always heared and became obsessed with the idea of changing Sasuke as well because he couldn't accept the person closest to him would not bend to his irresistible charisma and will.

With Sasuke he is doing a much better job as he is not only developing the character in a more mature and "real" way, but also letting the story absorb and use it. And that shows the series is growing... as the time passes, Naruto becomes less and less a manga supported just by fights and weird powers and more on the development of the main characters personalities (but it will always be a shonen, of course).



Unfortunatelly, maybe due to its huge and fast popularity, maybe to its tons of pre-teenagers fans, Naruto will always be seen by otakus as a stupid manga that dirties the image of animes to the rest of the world (and then someone will throw the shallow and conceited "Elfen Lied" as an example of how adult and anime can be... yeah, boobs, violence and polemic themes being incompetently handled, that's what makes a series be serious)


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## Ennoea (Jun 22, 2009)

> To be honest, I find Naruto a really good manga for a shonen. In some aspects it really comes closer to Seinen than almost every Shonen I read so far



Hell no, HxH.


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## Memos (Jun 22, 2009)

_Fullmetal Alchemist_ comes closer to seinen than _Naruto_ has ever dared.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Jun 22, 2009)

You read my mind memos

I was about to throw FMA in

Hokuto no Ken although finished a loooooooooong time ago would be a candidate aswell


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## Midus (Jun 22, 2009)

Death Note?


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## Memos (Jun 22, 2009)

Black Leg Sanji said:


> You read my mind memos
> 
> I was about to throw FMA in
> 
> Hokuto no Ken although finished a loooooooooong time ago would be a candidate aswell



_Hakuto no Ken_ is one of the best examples.


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## Nightfall (Jun 22, 2009)

Ah Hokuto no Ken... 
I wont say anything about it, since I never finished it. But the anime was hilarious...


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## Inugami (Jun 22, 2009)

GTO is kinda seinen too .


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## Black Leg Sanji (Jun 22, 2009)

Kusuriuri said:


> _Hakuto no Ken_ is one of the best examples.



Definetly is art and fighting-wise


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## Muk (Jun 22, 2009)

memos you got it wrong

SaO is a manga. it came out published in japan first, thus considered a manga 

edit:

on topic. I actually enjoyed the manga because the main was a dislike able character. also i loved it that his sexslave Sando was actually the strong character.

Sando was bodyguard to begin with, if his bodyguard couldn't protect his master, then it would be rather a useless bodyguard don't you think?


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## Graham Aker (Jun 22, 2009)

SAO had an average story imo, but the art was just mind blowing.


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## Higawa (Jun 22, 2009)

SAO was a really good Manga!

the ending was so emotional!

No shounen Manga can give you that tense!

also you cant day its an 70chapter Manga, I rate it after 22!

You have to read till 40 and the real fun begins!


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## Graham Aker (Jun 22, 2009)

Ehh, the ending arc was rushed. And I felt I got trolled in the ending ending.


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## Hapayahapaya (Jun 22, 2009)

I agree that some of the fights were bland, and that the ending arc was a bit rushed. However, the art, the plot, and the character interactions were nothing less than superb. 

Munsu is the absolute definition of badassery. His cunning and mindgames are some of the best I've seen in any story. I'd take him as a protagonist anytime over the generic crap being spouted out in (most) manga nowadays.


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## yo586 (Jun 22, 2009)

I read this a while back before it seemed to grow huge round these parts.  I like Munsu, I think he was a well portrayed main character.  I thought the flashback arc, while I was confused throughout most of it, was interesting as well (once I figured out what the hell was going on).  Also liked the girl Munsu was in love with although I admit I forgot her name.  The love triangle between the three childhood friends was cliched but somewhat enjoyable.  

Overall the manga (manwa, whatever) was ok.  Still the story never got hold of me like some others such as Berserk, Vagabond, and Vinland Saga.  It doesn't even come close.  Very little moral ambiguity, way too heavy on the fantasy for my tastes, and seemingly irrelevant side characters with so little back story I didn't care at all about them.
Being a huge fan of training arcs and efforts of hard work, the flashy fireworks after little training here annoyed me.
Additionally, as a fan of quasi realistic battle strategy (independent of fantastical fighting styles) the final battle our main character strategized was so mind boggingly dumbfounding that it was better placed in a manga like Yu-gi-oh.  Have to admit though, the final send off was positively badass.

Overall I'd recommend that the original poster not waste his time reading it and choose to skim the next chapters for the good art.  Although I must say, I disagree with anyone who calls it the best art whole heartedly.  I can think of much better examples out there.


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## The Doctor (Jun 22, 2009)

Seinen > Shonen

Seinen is an evolution of shounen. Always.


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## Sen (Jun 22, 2009)

SAO is actually one of my favorites 

Although honestly, I don't think you should say anything is overrated if you have only read the beginning.  The beginning of anything really hardly can represent the entire series and often you need to read further to get into it.


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## Ennoea (Jun 22, 2009)

> Still the story never got hold of me like some others such as *Berserk, Vagabond, and Vinland Saga*. It doesn't even come close. *Very little moral ambiguity, way too heavy on the fantasy for my tastes, and seemingly irrelevant side characters with so little back story *I didn't care at all about them.



Those three mangas suffer from the same problems...



> Overall I'd recommend that the original poster not waste his time reading it and choose to skim the next chapters for the good art. Although I must say, I disagree with anyone who calls it the best art whole heartedly. I can think of much better examples out there.



Rather than reading overrated nonesense like HSD and Soul Eater I'd say it's better to "waste" your time reading this.


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## .access timeco. (Jun 23, 2009)

Ennoea said:


> Hell no, HxH.



I said "*almost* every Shonen I read so far".

And as I said, it is more when it comes to character development, not the story itself :/


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## Dream Brother (Jun 23, 2009)

yo586 said:


> Overall the manga (manwa, whatever) was ok.  Still the story never got hold of me like some others such as Berserk, Vagabond, and Vinland Saga.  It doesn't even come close.  Very little moral ambiguity, way too heavy on the fantasy for my tastes, and seemingly irrelevant side characters with so little back story I didn't care at all about them.



Have you read _Blade of the Immortal_? I haven't read _Vinland Saga_, but I personally like BotI even more than _Berserk, Vagabond_ and SAO, all series' that I enjoyed to varying degrees.


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## Tempproxy (Jun 23, 2009)

Dream Brother said:


> Have you read _Blade of the Immortal_? I haven't read _Vinland Saga_, but I personally like BotI even more than _Berserk, Vagabond_ and SAO, all series' that I enjoyed to varying degrees.



Do you read vagabond?


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## yo586 (Jun 23, 2009)

Ennoea said:


> Those three mangas suffer from the same problems...



You think so?  I don't know, Vagabond has a character despised by most as the "hero" who goes around killing for his dream and all the while questioning his goal.  Plus it attempts to see good in a coward such as his former best friend. Vikings in Vinland Saga are far from archetypically good guys, but yet we are ushered to grow attached to them.  And Berserk was alot more morally ambiguous during flashback arc, now I agree its a little straightforward (but still awesome).

SAO, on the other hand, establishes good and evil fairly early in the story and does nothing to even question it.  It never attempts to explore the inherent morality of the story, but trumpets it as fact throughout.  None of the character, IMO, have the same depth as in these other 3.



Dream Brother said:


> Have you read _Blade of the Immortal_? I haven't read _Vinland Saga_, but I personally like BotI even more than _Berserk, Vagabond_ and SAO, all series' that I enjoyed to varying degrees.



Never got into it, read the first few chapters and was turned off by the whole immortal premise if my memory serves me.  Also I found the way he fights with 500 weapons to be meh.  Does it get more interesting as it goes on?  I wouldn't mind picking it up again.  You seem to have similar tastes to me.


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## Dream Brother (Jun 23, 2009)

> Never got into it, read the first few chapters and was turned off by the whole immortal premise if my memory serves me.  Also I found the way he fights with 500 weapons to be meh.  Does it get more interesting as it goes on?  I wouldn't mind picking it up again.  You seem to have similar tastes to me.



Definitely worth picking up again. I did a spoiler free write-up on my general thoughts here, if you're interested: Moderator Petition

Interesting to see how I was similarly turned off by the premise at first...if you want moral complexity, you're in for some fun. 



> Do you read vagabond?



Yep, and I dig it. I still think Inoue's best work is _REAL_, though.


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## Memos (Jun 23, 2009)

yo586 said:


> Never got into it, read the first few chapters and was turned off by the whole immortal premise if my memory serves me.  Also I found the way he fights with 500 weapons to be meh.  Does it get more interesting as it goes on?  I wouldn't mind picking it up again.  You seem to have similar tastes to me.


The immortality thing really isn't that bad. It seems like it could be ridicilous on the surface, but, if anything, it has led to Manji to be weaker than he would have been if he didn't rely on it so much in his fighting style. It does lead to some of the most visceral battles I have seen in any manga. Tiny spoiler, but, have you ever seen someone cut off their own arm and use it as bait/a distraction in battle? The fights are not only greatly choreographed but are also drawn with such loving detail by the mangaka. It has that second-to-second, step-by-step kind of fighting which most manga skip on.

The weapons are pretty cool. He does have a few weapons but it never gets ridicilous when you see the reason he has them and how he uses them.

It certainly does get a lot more interesting and the pacing is just one of the best of any manga i've read. The mangaka makes great decisions when it comes to his characters and their development. And when it comes to moral ambiguity, _Blade of the Immortal_ >>> _Berserk_ any day. The characters are so well thought out and nothing is really as simple as they may appear. A lot of people come to like characters who you would think are the worst people at first.

The art is beautiful and original.

Along with _SAO_ and _Berserk_, _Blade of the Immortal_ is at the top of my favourites.

---

edit: what Dream said


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## Goodfellow (Jun 23, 2009)

I'm really going to ahve to read that blade of the immortal huh?

Oh well, as soon as I finish Eden, It's an endless world!


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## Agmaster (Jun 23, 2009)

I would've liked SAO alot more if they flashback arc wasn't so long.  I seriously got about 2/3rds thru that and just skipped it.  The point of it was drawn out and decompressed like a circa 2008 Bendis comic.


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## .access timeco. (Jun 23, 2009)

Blade of the Immortal is nearly perfect. And, fuck, I love the "medical experiments arc" so damn much!

Berserk was made to be my favorite manga ever... but then Shierke appeared and the story changed completely after it. And changed to a despicable parody of what it was once, it's really hard to believe it is still the same person writting it. Then I dropped it and I really doubt I will ever pick it up again :/ a shame, I probably never enjoyed a manga as much as I was enjoying Berserk up to that point.


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## Fran (Jun 23, 2009)

Blade of the Immortal?
That one I've never tried. If you guys say it is as good as SAO and Berserk, then I will give this a dabble. I've been wanting something on the same sort of epic scale as the former two anyways.


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## Memos (Jun 23, 2009)

.access timeco. said:


> Blade of the Immortal is nearly perfect. And, fuck, I love the "medical experiments arc" so damn much!




That arc got so gruesome at some points  Poor Manji.


> Berserk was made to be my favorite manga ever... but then Shierke appeared and the story changed completely after it. And changed to a despicable parody of what it was once, it's really hard to believe it is still the same person writting it. Then I dropped it and I really doubt I will ever pick it up again :/ a shame, I probably never enjoyed a manga as much as I was enjoying Berserk up to that point.


It has certainly gone through a few changes, especially in pace. The story is just so large and has so many elements to it that it can't be helped, I guess.

I just wish Miura would stop including so much nudity.

---

Mattaru, go for it. _Blade of the Immortal_ is fantastic.


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## Spy_Smasher (Jun 23, 2009)

memos, you actually expect me to read this whole thread?


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## Memos (Jun 23, 2009)

Spy_Smasher said:


> memos, you actually expect me to read this whole thread?



No. Just mention your love for the series so more people can see. I probably should have made that more clear.


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## p-lou (Jun 23, 2009)

Spy_Smasher said:


> memos, you actually expect me to read this whole thread?



you can read? :amazed


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## Memos (Jun 23, 2009)

p-lou said:


> you can read? :amazed



I feel I should have said that  I'm slipping.


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## @lk3mizt (Jun 23, 2009)

wow dude, your taste in manga must really fail then 

SAO easily the greatest manga out there!


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## Spy_Smasher (Jun 23, 2009)

Gotcha. 

Blade of the Immortal is outstanding. On the surface, the plot may seem well-trod, but the _characterization_ is so well-rounded, so authentic, that the story seems wholly original. Add to that a breathtakingly original art style (no inking, just pencils), that manages to be both graceful and raw at the same time, and it is impossible to overstate the quality of this manga. If you don't read it, you're missing out on a unique manga experience.



p-lou said:


> you can read? :amazed


Not unless there's pictures. Duh. That's why I asked.


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## Shintiko (Jun 23, 2009)

Agmaster said:


> I would've liked SAO alot more if they flashback arc wasn't so long.  I seriously got about 2/3rds thru that and just skipped it.  The point of it was drawn out and decompressed like a circa 2008 Bendis comic.



Wait wait wait! ..You skipped the best arc of the entire series?


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## Memos (Jun 23, 2009)

Beautifully said, Spy.


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## p-lou (Jun 23, 2009)

Spy_Smasher said:


> Not unless there's pictures. Duh. That's why I asked.



well i just thought that you, kinda just _knew_ stuff


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## Midus (Jun 23, 2009)

Goodfellow said:


> I'm really going to ahve to read that blade of the immortal huh?
> 
> Oh well, as soon as I finish Eden, It's an endless world!



So you started? What do you think so far?


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## Agmaster (Jun 23, 2009)

Shintiko said:


> Wait wait wait! ..You skipped the best arc of the entire series?


Yeah....let's call it that?  Sure.  Why not?


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## Ennoea (Jun 24, 2009)

> Yeah....let's call it that? Sure. Why not?



Its one of the most outstanding arc's in manga.


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## mystictrunks (Jun 24, 2009)

SMH @ The Thread starters review. He read 22 chapters of a 75 chapter book and decided it was mediocre.


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## Muk (Jun 24, 2009)

btw is there any place to read more of blade of the immortal online? i haven't read passed the medical arc in the longest of time

probably because at that time nothing was online


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## omg laser pew pew! (Jun 24, 2009)

Spy_Smasher said:


> Gotcha.
> 
> Blade of the Immortal is outstanding. On the surface, the plot may seem well-trod, but the _characterization_ is so well-rounded, so authentic, that the story seems wholly original. Add to that a breathtakingly original art style (no inking, just pencils), that manages to be both graceful and raw at the same time, and it is impossible to overstate the quality of this manga. If you don't read it, you're missing out on a unique manga experience.
> 
> Not unless there's pictures. Duh. That's why I asked.



I completely agree though I do feel that it has fallen into some slight shounen roads ever since it was being published by Dark Horse

Still a small speck of dust doesn't detract from the fact that the whole thing is simply incredibly


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## shadowlords (Jun 24, 2009)

Mm if you think Shin Angyo Onshi is overrated "medicore" tripe because the main character is not that strong and the girl is stronger than him I suggest you read something like Snow White and the Seven Dwarves, Cinderella, or Rapunzel.


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## Aokiji (Jun 24, 2009)

OMG, Munsu can't warp reality with his eyes, he MUST suck. 

He is more awesome than the entire Naruto manga combined. Easily one of my favourite maga protagonists.


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## handofjustice (Jun 24, 2009)

I just finished the manga today guys, and I Owe SAO fans a huge apology. This manga is fantastic that it had me choked up and shedding tears at the end. I guess my review was to early because this simply blew all expectations out of the yard. Does anyone know a series similar to this?


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## Nightfall (Jun 24, 2009)

I wouldn't call it similar, but its another one of his works called Island. Seinen and horror, I liked it, even if it wasn't as good as Shin Angyo Onshi. Well in fact its not nearly as good, but meh...

I'm reading currently 12 shounens mangas


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## Memos (Jun 24, 2009)

handofjustice said:


> I just finished the manga today guys, and I Owe SAO fans a huge apology. This manga is fantastic that it had me choked up and shedding tears at the end. I guess my review was to early because this simply blew all expectations out of the yard. Does anyone know a series similar to this?



 Okay. Glad you liked it at least and I hope you'll give other manga you read more of a chance next time.

Go read _Blade of the Immortal_. Not necessarily similar but just as good.


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## Tempproxy (Jun 24, 2009)

handofjustice said:


> I just finished the manga today guys, and I Owe SAO fans a huge apology. This manga is fantastic that it had me choked up and shedding tears at the end. I guess my review was to early because this simply blew all expectations out of the yard. Does anyone know a series similar to this?



I wouldn?t say its similar but I recommend Dangu its another jizz inducing Manhwa and glad to see you stuck it out and realised how great SAO is.


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## Ennoea (Jun 24, 2009)

King of hell is pretty fucking good, nothing like SAO tho but a great manwha.


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## Agmaster (Jun 24, 2009)

Ennoea said:


> Its one of the most outstanding arc's in manga.


False.  It's pretty, it tells me more about Munsu and Ajis past.  But guess what?  By then, I cared exponentially more about the present.  Oh sure, brilliant plan during the run to get you people to read it, but I understood their motivations.  The flashback should have occurred during a quieter arc.  I got why they fought.  It didn't need to take that long. And I didn't skip...I condensed.


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## Memos (Jun 24, 2009)

The beauty of the flashback arc was that it wasn't actually a flashback arc. Sure it told of what happened in the past but the things happening in there also changed the next arc considerably. It was necessary to move the plot on.


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## Fran (Jun 24, 2009)

handofjustice said:


> I just finished the manga today guys, and I Owe SAO fans a huge apology. This manga is fantastic that it had me choked up and shedding tears at the end. I guess my review was to early because this simply blew all expectations out of the yard. Does anyone know a series similar to this?



pek Booyah!


I've just started Blade of the Immortal now. The art is beautiful, especially the cutting techniques, and it's drawing me in. Excellent story so far, excellent characters - kinda reminds me of Vagabond, but with an emphasis on character rather than action.

The Itto-ryo just killed some girl's family, and the Nun turned up at the grave. Freaking epic, thanks for the recommendation



edit: wooo, first volume complete. best manga i've picked up this year.


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## omg laser pew pew! (Jun 24, 2009)

As far as SAO goes, I have yet to find another manga/manhwa that has a better first chapter.

Then again, I haven't read many but it still rocked my socks


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## Memos (Jun 24, 2009)

Mattaru said:


> pek Booyah!
> 
> 
> I've just started Blade of the Immortal now. The art is beautiful, especially the cutting techniques, and it's drawing me in. Excellent story so far, excellent characters - kinda reminds me of Vagabond, but with an emphasis on character rather than action.
> ...



Yeah, those certain spreads are just amazing. There are some great examples later on too.

The story gets better.


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