# Mihawk vs Fujitora



## maupp (Aug 9, 2014)

Well I'm surprised I haven't seen this thread yet. Mihawk has the chance to duke it out with a top tier swordman with an overpowered DF. So does this one go?  

No restrictions.


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## Hachibi (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk win High-Difficulty by hype and portayal
They still both lack feat tho


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## Ruse (Aug 9, 2014)

This can only end well  

Mihawk wins since Fuji uses a sword which means he's automatically weaker than Mihawk.


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## Sablés (Aug 9, 2014)

Those meteors are clearly for show


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## Hachibi (Aug 9, 2014)

Heavenly Demon said:


> This can only end well
> 
> Mihawk wins since Fuji uses a sword which means he's automatically weaker than Mihawk.



2 of the C3 (Kizaru and Aokiji) can form a sword with their element, that make them automatically weaker than Mihawk too


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## Raiden34 (Aug 9, 2014)

Fujitora high difficulty.


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## Kaiser (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk has better hype and feats, so he should win at around high difficulty. Though i get the feeling Fujitora is stronger than we think


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## Unclear Justice (Aug 9, 2014)

Fujitora wants to get rid of the Shichibukai but this Shichibukai gets rid of him.


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## maupp (Aug 9, 2014)

Oh so are we going with the "X character is a swordman therefore he is weaker than Mihawk by default" argument?  If so mihawk wins . 

Ok on a serious note, I'm going with Mihawk high to extreme diff.


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## trance (Aug 9, 2014)

Issho uses his gravity to pull Mihawk's sword from his hand and because all of Mihawk's power comes from Yoru, he subsequently gets fodderized with no difficulty. 

Mihawk very high difficulty.


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## Goomoonryong (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk wins high diff.


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## Hachibi (Aug 9, 2014)

maupp said:


> Oh so are we going with the "*X character is a swordman therefore he is weaker than Mihawk by default*" argument?  If so mihawk wins .
> 
> Ok on a serious note, I'm going with Mihawk high to extreme diff.



Flawless Logic


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## Raiden34 (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk can't do this to post-time skip Zoro IMO



He bleeded Zoro with ease...


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## Ruse (Aug 9, 2014)

On a serious note this could go either way I'm nit sure who wins.


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## Sablés (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk wins this high difficulty at most. This is one instance where Mihawk has both the feats and hype to achieve a decisive victory. Furthermore, Fujitora 's destructive capacity relies on meteors which are an impractical way of fighting.


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

Fujitora high-diffs (not extreme). Meteors + swords != swordsmanship and Fujitora is also an Admiral. GG.


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## tanman (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk extreme difficulty.

Whenever Mihawk and feats are used in the same sentence, a small child dies.


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## maupp (Aug 9, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> Flawless Logic


WB had a glaive which if you're not nip picking can say he's a "swordman" therefore Mihawk Solos . 

Speaking of which I think I've seen Roger with a sword in some panels or fanarts, therefore Mihawk solos Rogers too .  

Flawless logic .


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

tanman said:


> Whenever Mihawk and feats are used in the same sentence, a small child dies.



If I ever have a child and it dies, Extravlad will be on the hitlist. 6 stars. Even higher than Usopp.


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## Monster (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk wins.


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## Luke (Aug 9, 2014)

Either way extreme diff.


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## Amol (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk solos with tiny knife. 
[sp] Nah just kidding.
Either way extreme diff.[/sp]


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk wins 10/10.

The blind dude couldn't even beat Zoro let alone his master


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> Mihawk wins 10/10.
> 
> The blind dude couldn't even beat Zoro let alone his master



Fuji wasn't trying. /Post.


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## Raiden34 (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> Mihawk wins 10/10.
> 
> The blind dude couldn't even beat Zoro let alone his master



Same Zoro will defeat / surpass Mihawk soon enough...


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## Shinthia (Aug 9, 2014)

tanman said:


> Whenever Mihawk and feats are used in the same sentence, a small child dies.



this guy


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

Marco1907 said:


> Same Zoro will defeat / surpass Mihawk soon enough...



Soon as in Manga time? Yeah, you might be right. 

Mihawk still wins cuz of his title. Fujitora is a swordsman and he's not called the WSS, Mihawk is.


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## Canute87 (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk breaks fuji's sword in half sucks the blood from it and gains it's DF power.


Mihawk is now unfuckingtouchable.


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## Raiden34 (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> Mihawk still wins cuz of his title.
> 
> Fujitora is a swordsman and he's not called the WSS, Mihawk is.



Fujtora is the strongest battle force of WG (Admiral) while Mihawk is not (Shichibukai) 

Fujitora is using a DF, Mihawk's title is no use here...


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## Hachibi (Aug 9, 2014)

Marco1907 said:


> Fujtora is the strongest battle force of WG (Admiral) while Mihawk is not (Shichibukai)
> 
> Fujitora is using a DF, Mihawk's title is no use here...



So, Dragon is Mid-tier?


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

Marco1907 said:


> Fujtora is the strongest battle force of WG (Admiral) while Mihawk is not (Shichibukai)
> 
> Fujitora is using a DF, Mihawk's title is no use here...



Fujitora's title applies only to those who work as marines. He is superior to those who are below admiral by default because of his rank. Mihawks titles applies to the entire world and its population.

And it has been implied that Fujitora got his DF recently, 2 years ago max. Mihawk was still the WSS 2 years ago and Fujitora wasn't.


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## Rob (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk High diff.


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## Shinthia (Aug 9, 2014)

If Fuji really is weaker than Mihawk its not because of the title. Mihawksfanboy need to stop using that title in every goddamn argument.



oOLawlietOo said:


> And it has been implied that Fujitora got his DF recently, 2 years ago max. Mihawk was still the WSS 2 years ago and Fujitora wasn't.



then its possible that in this 2 years Fuji mastered the DF and surpassed Mihawk


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## Raiden34 (Aug 9, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> So, Dragon is Mid-tier?



Huh ?



oOLawlietOo said:


> Fujitora's title applies only to those who work as marines. He is superior to those who are below admiral by default because of his rank. Mihawks titles applies to the entire world and its population.
> 
> And it has been implied that Fujitora got his DF recently, 2 years ago max. Mihawk was still the WSS 2 years ago and Fujitora wasn't.



Shichibukai organization related with WG, and Admirals defined as ''strongest power of WG'' ... I am not talking about marines here... I am talking about WG's powers...

Recently ? It looks like he become a admiral via DF...  I believe that WG is giving these devil fruits for WG workers, remember Kaku - Kalifa, and probably previous admiral trio's devil fruit etc. 
And we don't know when he become a admiral either, before DF or after ? Until then, its just a baseless suggestion...


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

> then its possible that in this 2 years Fuji mastered the DF and surpassed Mihawk



Whatever makes you happy


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## Ruse (Aug 9, 2014)

Why do people think Fujitora only got his DF recently? Is it because of what he said on Greenbit? I thought he just meant on terms of warming up.


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## Shinthia (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> Whatever makes you happy



its not about me being happy or unhappy. i just wanted to know that its a possibility or not IYO. thats all


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## maupp (Aug 9, 2014)

@Heavenly Demon: People are fecking fickle especially in the OL . It doesn't matter how many times they explain to them that Fuji meant what he said in term of warming up, people always come up with the same nonsenses about Fuji just receiving his fruit. This forum is a strange place sometime .


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## Dellinger (Aug 9, 2014)

While I also think that Mihawk mot likely wins,Fujitora is severely underestimated.He gets no credit at all for hat he's done until now while not being serious at all.


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## Orca (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk extreme diff.

If Mihawk later convinces me that he is nearly equal to shanks, then I can see Mihawk taking this fight high diff.


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## Sablés (Aug 9, 2014)

More like it's the other way around.


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

> its not about me being happy or unhappy. i just wanted to know that its a possibility or not IYO. thats all
> __________________



If Fujitora did surpass Mihawk, the public would consider him the WSS.
The title is not something physical you hold and protect. If he was really the strongest and he had no need to prove himself to Mihawk, the majority would recognize him as the strongest swordsman and not Mihawk.


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## Sablés (Aug 9, 2014)

Fujitora has a DF. WSS title means nothing to him.


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## Extravlad (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk high difficulty.
Also Mihawk isn't "nearly equal as shanks" he's stronger than him.


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## Shinthia (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> If Fujitora did surpass Mihawk, the public would consider him the WSS.
> The title is not something physical you hold and protect. If he was really the strongest and he had no need to prove himself to Mihawk, the majority would recognize him as the strongest swordsman and not Mihawk.



A DF based fighter Fuji cant be the WSS . Its like saying if WB accidentally chose to use a big ass sword instead of his weapon he could have been the WSM. 

Also, how would the people know if Fuji surpassed Mihawk or not in this past 2 years ?


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## The Bloody Nine (Aug 9, 2014)

Yeah IMO Fuji and Mihawk are extremely close in power, both at the top range of high tier/low end of top. But ultimately i expect Fuji to be stronger then Mihawk. because i think Fuji would fare better against people like Sabo and Marco and the other Admirals, then Mihawk would. 

Fuji high to extreme.


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## IchijiNijiSanji (Aug 9, 2014)

Fuji's fruit should be one of the strongest next to Gura Gura.

I don't know exactly how he establishes his gravity (the anime shows he does it with his sword though) or whether haki can guard against it.


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

> A DF based fighter Fuji cant be the WSS


Says who? The WSM had a DF, he didn't have to be a pure-man.



> Its like saying if WB accidentally chose to use a big ass sword instead of his weapon he could have been the WSM.


No it's not the same thing. Swordsmanship is a skill. As far as we know, WB does not posses that kind of skill whether he uses a sword or not. Handing EOS Luffy a sword would not make him the WSS. Because if you hand EOS Luffy a sword, he'd use it the same way he used it against Arlong. Fujitora on the other hand does posses that kind of skill which makes him a swordsman more than a DF user. He'd be a swordsman who possess a DF ability, not a DF user who happened to be a swordsman.





> Also, how would the people know if Fuji surpassed Mihawk or not in this past 2 years ?


Oda knows, and Mihawk still holds that title. And don't tell me that's a stupid argument. It's as valid as much as WB's title, Dragon's and Kaidou's.


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

WSS is a valid title, but it's disgusting to see people argue that someone who touches a sword immediately becomes weaker than Mihawk. That is a poor attempt at reaching just to claim superiority of your favorite character over others. It's a pathetic argument, and it got old a long time ago. Come up with something better please.


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## Arkash (Aug 9, 2014)

Mihawk high diff


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## Extravlad (Aug 9, 2014)

And it's even more pathetic when Shanks's fanboys are using excuses like "Shanks isn't just a swordsman he can do more" or "the title only means he's more skilled with a sword but he would lose a fight" when it's clearly implied that Shanks IS a 100% swordsman AND wouldn't beat Mihawk in a fight.

No one gives a shit about your skill why do you think Kuina said she'll never be able to become WSS? Because she was a woman and didn't have the strength needed, her skills were extremely good better than Zoro's but it still wasn't enough.

WSS = strongest man who carry a sword.

Shanks is Mihawk's rival they're both swordsman, they were equal in the past, Shanks lost an arm he became weaker.

Just accept facts Mihawk > Shanks.


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## Hachibi (Aug 9, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> And it's even more pathetic when Shanks's fanboys are using excuses like "Shanks isn't just a swordsman he can do more" or "the title only means he's more skilled with a sword but he would lose a fight" when it's clearly implied that Shanks IS a 100% swordsman AND wouldn't beat Mihawk in a fight.
> 
> No one gives a shit about your skill why do you think Kuina said she'll never be able to become WSS? Because she was a woman and didn't have the strength needed, her skills were extremely good better than Zoro's but it still wasn't enough.
> 
> ...



Shanks became Yonko after losing his arm but I don't want to turn this thread into a Mihawk vs Shanks thread so..


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## Ruse (Aug 9, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> And it's even more pathetic when Shanks's fanboys are using excuses like "Shanks isn't just a swordsman he can do more" or "the title only means he's more skilled with a sword but he would lose a fight" when it's clearly implied that Shanks IS a 100% swordsman AND wouldn't beat Mihawk in a fight.
> 
> No one gives a shit about your skill why do you think Kuina said she'll never be able to become WSS? Because she was a woman and didn't have the strength needed, her skills were extremely good better than Zoro's but it still wasn't enough.
> 
> ...



Its Mihawk vs Fujitora thread not vs Shanks


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> WSS is a valid title, but it's disgusting to see people argue that someone who touches a sword immediately becomes weaker than Mihawk. That is a poor attempt at reaching just to claim superiority of your favorite character over others. It's a pathetic argument, and it got old a long time ago. Come up with something better please.



Oda hasn't given us much yet to come up with something different. You're asking the impossible for those who argue in Mihawk's favor. And no one is saying he's stronger than anyone who wields a sword. Like I said, EOS Luffy with a sword would NOT be a better swordsman than sky island Zoro.


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> Oda hasn't given us much yet to come up with something different. *You're asking the impossible for those who argue in Mihawk's favor.* And no one is saying he's stronger than anyone who wields a sword. Like I said, *EOS Luffy with a sword would NOT be a better swordsman than sky island Zoro.*



1) Exactly. You have his title to work with and nothing more, so you are forced to use presumptuous arguments.

2) By that logic, Mihawk's title becomes even less relevant, as EOS Luffy would trash the shit out of Skypiea Zoro even if they are both using swords. EOS Luffy's speed and power would be far too much for Zoro to handle way back then.


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

> By that logic, Mihawk's title becomes even less relevant, as EOS Luffy would trash the shit out of Skypiea Zoro even if they are both using swords. EOS Luffy's speed and power would be far too much for Zoro to handle way back then.



No it doesn't. I was explaining the difference between someone wielding a sword and someone who can be called a swordsman. I didn't say this is the case.


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> No it doesn't. I was explaining the difference between someone wielding a sword and someone who can be called a swordsman. I didn't say this is the case.



Then what you're saying is that stats don't necessarily matter and that it is completely reliant on "skill" rather than the ability to take down another sword-user?


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> Then what you're saying is that stats don't necessarily matter and that it is completely reliant on "skill" rather than the ability to take down another sword-user?



No, that's not what I'm saying.

A swordsman is not considered a swordsman just because he wields a sword. A swordsman is called a swordsman because he possess the skill swordsmanship. Luffy wielding a sword does not qualify as a swordsman because he lacks that skill.


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> No, that's not what I'm saying.
> 
> A swordsman is not considered a swordsman just because he wields a sword. A swordsman is called a swordsman because he possess the skill swordsmanship. Luffy wielding a sword does not qualify as a swordsman because he lacks that skill.



What if he possesses other skills, such as a DF power, rokushiki, and maybe even Sanji-like or Luffy-like fighting styles? Kicks and punches?


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

he's not a swordsman if does not possess the skill swordsmanship. He's a swordsman if he does, simple as that. I can't make it more simple than this.


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> he's not a swordsman if does not possess the skill swordsmanship. He's a swordsman if he does, simple as that. I can't make it more simple than this.



You are now a confirmed swordsman fanboy. This logic is nothing more than an attempt to portray Mihawk as the strongest person in the series, which is far from the truth.


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> You are now a confirmed swordsman fanboy. This logic is nothing more than an attempt to portray Mihawk as the strongest person in the series, which is far from the truth.



Please tell me what makes me a confirmed swordsman fanboy. Because I bet you 10 bucks right now that you misunderstood everything like always. And I bet you that you jumped into the middle of my debate without even reading the actual debate and the points I've made. 

I would also bet you another 10 bucks that you'll go read my previous posts with Messi and you'll claim that you read them before. But since you can lie about that, I won't make that bet. But please, tell me what makes me a fanboy.



> You are now a confirmed swordsman fanboy. This logic is nothing more than an attempt to portray Mihawk as the strongest person in the series, which is far from the truth.



That's what you think it is because of your closed mind and lack of comprehension. I never even implied such a thing, let a lone try to portray it as such.


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## Hachibi (Aug 9, 2014)

We are going off-topic tho


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> Please tell me what makes me a confirmed swordsman fanboy. Because I bet you 10 bucks right now that you misunderstood everything like always. And I bet you that you jumped into the middle of my debate without even reading the actual debate and the points I've made.
> 
> I would also bet you another 10 bucks that you'll go read my previous posts with Messi and you'll claim that you read them before. But since you can lie about that, I won't make that bet. But please, tell me what makes me a fanboy.
> 
> ...



Wasted some bets there, as I honestly don't care what you posted nor would I have cared if you wouldn't have made that bet. I don't like reading things that don't appeal to me, and I'm sure whatever point you made doesn't appeal to me.

You think that Mihawk, a man who has no combat skills to speak of save for swordsmanship, is stronger than every single person who uses swordsmanship in conjunction with other styles due to his title? Really? So he can defeat an Admiral, who is one of the marines' strongest fighters, just because said Admiral uses a sword as a complimentary fighting style? _That_ is logic from a closed mind.



Hachibi94 said:


> We are going off-topic tho



Not really, as we're discussing how Mihawk's title relates to his relative strength.


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## Hachibi (Aug 9, 2014)

Well, If Issho manage to steal Mihawk's Sword using Gravity it's GG


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

> I don't like reading things that don't appeal to me, and I'm sure whatever point you made doesn't appeal to me



I literally answered the same question you asked on the same page and a bit more, pretty sure that appeals to you in this case. 



> You think that Mihawk, a man who has no combat skills to speak of save for swordsmanship, is stronger than every single person who uses swordsmanship in conjunction with other styles simultaneously due to his title? Really? So he can defeat an Admiral, who is one of the marines' strongest fighters, just because said Admiral uses a sword as a complimentary fighting style? That is logic from a closed mind.



Have you ever met a character in one piece that uses multiple fighting styles? As in, have you seen or heard of a character in one piece that is a swordsman master,  a person who possess the skill swordsmanship and a fishmen karate master, a person who can be considered one of the best in martial arts? No, that character does not exist, and that kind of fighting style does not exist. 

Oda does not do that shit where one character is a master of all or some fighting styles. A brawler like Luffy can't do anything else but brawling. A person who uses his legs like Sanji can't use a different fighting style such as sniping. That's how Oda has been portraying his characters and that's what I'm going with. I won't go with your imaginary characters that don't exist in the Manga and what IF a character like that does exist.  I'm going by the Manga, not your imaginary scenarios and IFs.


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## Hachibi (Aug 9, 2014)

Doesn't Kaku use both swordmanship and rokushiki?


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## Shinthia (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> Says who? The WSM had a DF, he didn't have to be a pure-man.



Common sense.



> No it's not the same thing. Swordsmanship is a skill. As far as we know, WB does not posses that kind of skill whether he uses a sword or not. Handing EOS Luffy a sword would not make him the WSS. Because if you hand EOS Luffy a sword, he'd use it the same way he used it against Arlong. Fujitora on the other hand does posses that kind of skill which makes him a swordsman more than a DF user. He'd be a swordsman who possess a DF ability, not a DF user who happened to be a swordsman.



i will just ask u this.

Say  X & Y  r the 2 most skilled swordsman in a world and Z= has some swordsman skill but is relatively weak compared to X & Y. But, one day Z brought a gun (a DF ) ,practiced his gun skill then challenge X in a fight.Then Z managed to shoot X to death during their fight. Now, who should be the strongest swordsman after X death ? Y or Z ? 


I hopy your ans is not Z.Cause, IMO WSS should be someone who is more skilled with the sword than anyone in this world.


> Oda knows, and Mihawk still holds that title. And don't tell me that's a stupid argument. It's as valid as much as WB's title, Dragon's and Kaidou's.



yes, that is a stupid argument. Oh that guy has a sword on him , lets close our eyes , abandon common sense and call Mihawk stronger.


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> I literally answered the same question you asked on the same page and a bit more, pretty sure that appeals to you in this case.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I don't know if you've made the connection between meteors falling around Fujitora and the fact that they oh-so-coincidentally happen to be aimed at his opponents but never him. This is called a _Devil Fruit_ power and, contrary to popular beliefs, is _not_ a swordsmanship skill.


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> Doesn't Kaku use both swordmanship and rokushiki?



I dont consider Kaku a master in Rokushiki. his rokushiki level and Lucci's were noticeably apart. Sanji also uses rokushiki, Geppo to be specific, but he's not a master. He uses it to add to his main fighting style. Just like how everyone uses Haki to add to their offense/dfs.


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> I don't know if you've made the connection between meteors falling around Fujitora and the fact that they oh-so-coincidentally happen to be aimed at his opponents but never him. This is called a _Devil Fruit_ power and, contrary to popular beliefs, is _not_ a swordsmanship skill.



DFs are abilities and not fighting styles. Sabo is still a martial artists who adds the mera mera to his fighting style, not the other way around.


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## Louis-954 (Aug 9, 2014)

In a a pure swordfight? Mihawk.

Overall? Fujitora.


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## Suit (Aug 9, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> DFs are abilities and not fighting styles. Sabo is still a martial artists who adds the mera mera to his fighting style, not the other way around.



And if your opponent's swordsmanship skill is only negligibly weaker than your own, the fact that he is able to control gravity and summon meteors isn't going to bridge that gap is it? At least it seems you would think not.


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## Lawliet (Aug 9, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> And if your opponent's swordsmanship skill is only negligibly weaker than your own, the fact that he is able to control gravity and summon meteors isn't going to bridge that gap is it? At least it seems you would think not.



At least seems I would think not? You only think that because you're only attacking and not trying to actually have a decent debate. I never said or thought adding to your fighting style wouldn't close the gap. But who says Fujitora closed the gap between him and Mihawk with his gravity fruit? No one knows, everyone is just giving their opinions and my opinion is no. Mihawk still wins in a fight whether Fuji uses his DF in the fight or not.

Zoro has been winning against DF users too, I don't see why it's impossible for Mihawk to do the same.


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## Coruscation (Aug 9, 2014)

You're not making sense with this "a person can only have one fighting style / skill" thing   Lawliet. Kaku is a perfect example of how that is entirely possible. His Rokushiki abilities weren't any worse than his swordsmanship and he even manipulated his Zoan DF in crazy ways, and all three parts contributed to the difficult fight he gave Zoro. What is Franky? A brawler or a weapons user / ranged fighter? He can be just as powerful with either. And what evidence is there Fujitora is more of a swordsman than a DF user? There is speculation he only recently required his ability, but as far as I know that's not confirmed anywhere. As far as we know he's like Law or Smoker, a guy who has both weapon skill and a DF and is thus a hybrid fighter, not locked into a specific style. If Fujitora fought Mihawk and beat him by making a hundred meteors fall on him, it would be utterly silly to suggest that makes a stronger swordsman.


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## trance (Aug 10, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> DFs are abilities and not fighting styles. Sabo is still a martial artists who adds the mera mera to his fighting style, not the other way around.



Devil Fruits form the foundation for a being's fighting styles. It makes it all the more effective, whether it be with increased speed, strength, hax, destructive capacity, defense, etc. They're directly intertwined and form a mutual relationship.


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## Lawliet (Aug 10, 2014)

Franky is a rare condition and should not be used, Pacifistas included.

Kaku wasn't a master in  rokushiki, He used a bit of this and a bit of that. His swordsmanship doesn't compare to those who can be called masters in  swordsmanship (you know who i mean when i say masters) and his rokushiki doesn't compare to those who can be called rokushiki masters for his speciality is mostly rankyaku,. I'm saying from what I've seen, you only get to master one and maybe use another to add to your MAIN fighting style. Kaku was mainly a swordsman, added  rankyaku to his fighting style (rokushiki in general if you may). Sanji adds Geppo to his fighting style...etc


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## trance (Aug 10, 2014)

Kizaru also has more than one fighting style. While his primary fighting style is being a long range sniper/nuker, he can just as effectively fight at melee-range. He manages to balance out power and speed pretty well.


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## Lawliet (Aug 10, 2014)

Pretty sure all admirals have decent skills in swordsmanships. Akainu was shown to be using a sword in a picture.


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## monkey d ace (Aug 10, 2014)

WSS = best in swordplay/swordsmanship skills/swordsmastery. that's going by the full definition of a swordsman and mihawk's postTS introduction(world's unrivaled swordsmaster).
so since fujitora has other factors in his overall strength other than swordsmanship, mihawk's title doesn't automatically mean mihawk>fujitora.


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## Extravlad (Aug 10, 2014)

> WSS = best in swordplay/swordsmanship skills/swordsmastery.


No that's not what the WSS is in both Zoro and Kuina's eyes.


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## Dunno (Aug 10, 2014)

monkey d ace said:


> WSS = best in swordplay/swordsmanship skills/swordsmastery. that's going by the full definition of a swordsman and mihawk's postTS introduction(world's unrivaled swordsmaster).
> so since fujitora has other factors in his overall strength other than swordsmanship, mihawk's title doesn't automatically mean mihawk>fujitora.



WSM = best in manliness/manly skills/drinking. that's going by the full definition of a man and Whitebeard's preTS introduction(world's strongest man).
so since Akainu has other factors in his overall strength other than manliness, Whitebeard's title doesn't automatically mean Whitebeard>Akainu.

WSC = best in beastmanship/savageness/being wild. that's going by the full definition of a beast and Kaido's postTS introduction(world's strongest beast). 
so since a Sea King has other factors in his overall strength other than beastmanship, Kaido's title doesn't automatically mean Kaido>a Sea King.

See where you logic fails?


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## tanman (Aug 10, 2014)

I see where your counterargument fails.


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## barreltheif (Aug 10, 2014)

I'm looking forward to Zoro's showdown with Shiryu, where Zoro demonstrates his superiority in sword juggling, sword swallowing and other sword skills. I used to suffer from the misapprehension that Zoro would prove that he's the WSS by actually fighting his opponent. But fortunately the wise posters in the OL showed me the error in my views: how could Zoro become WSS through a fight, which could easily involve things like Haki and physical strength, irrelevant to sword skill?


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## Dunno (Aug 10, 2014)

tanman said:


> I see where your counterargument fails.



You mean where I compare Whitebeard's and Mihawk's titles because they are worded the exact same way (in both English and Japanese) and imply the exact same superiority in their respective scopes? Do you believe that Mihawk would not be able to beat every swordsman while Whitebeard would be able to beat every man? If so, then please explain your reasoning.


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## Amol (Aug 10, 2014)

Dunno said:


> WSM = best in manliness/manly skills/drinking. that's going by the full definition of a man and Whitebeard's preTS introduction(world's strongest man).
> so since Akainu has other factors in his overall strength other than manliness, Whitebeard's title doesn't automatically mean Whitebeard>Akainu.
> 
> WSC = best in beastmanship/savageness/being wild. that's going by the full definition of a beast and Kaido's postTS introduction(world's strongest beast).
> ...


But Kiado can't be stronger than sea king. Because then we will have 
Kiado > Sea King > Shanks


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## Hachibi (Aug 10, 2014)

Amol said:


> But Kiado can't be stronger than sea king. Because then we will have
> Kiado > Sea King > Shanks



Currently, Luffy can solo a Sea King so Kaido > Luffy > Sea King > Shanks


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## Amol (Aug 10, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> Currently, Luffy can solo a Sea King so Kaido > Luffy > Sea King > Shanks



Luffy is Yonkou level. confirm .


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## Dunno (Aug 10, 2014)

Amol said:


> But Kiado can't be stronger than sea king. Because then we will have
> Kiado > Sea King > Shanks



Iirc, Shanks actually kinda won against the Sea King, and we also don't know how large the gap between Kaido and the Sea King is. So it's more like: 
Kaido >= Sea King =< Shanks

Totally possible


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## Ghost (Aug 10, 2014)

Mihawk high diff.


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## Amol (Aug 10, 2014)

Dunno said:


> Iirc, Shanks actually kinda won against the Sea King, and we also don't know how large the gap between Kaido and the Sea King is. So it's more like:
> Kaido >= Sea King =< Shanks
> 
> Totally possible



You are right . Shanks won with high diff. It all depends whether that Sea King became stronger during the skip or not. 
Luffy is still Yonkou level though .


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## Hachibi (Aug 10, 2014)

Amol said:


> You are right . Shanks won with high diff. It all depends whether that Sea King became stronger during the skip or not.
> Luffy is still Yonkou level though .



DD can mid-diff Luffy and Hancock is in the same level as him
DD/Hancock are Pirate king level comfirmed


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## Coruscation (Aug 10, 2014)

> Franky is a rare condition and should not be used



So you think it's viable debate practice to dismiss proof that your stance is wrong because "it's rare"?



> Kaku wasn't a master in rokushiki, He used a bit of this and a bit of that. His swordsmanship doesn't compare to those who can be called masters in swordsmanship (you know who i mean when i say masters) and his rokushiki doesn't compare to those who can be called rokushiki masters for his speciality is mostly rankyaku



So your point is... what? He wasn't as good with Rokushiki as Lucci, and he wasn't as good at swordplay as Zoro. In fact he didn't even have a single named attack with his swords. But he still gave Zoro a heck of a fight, using a combination of his Zoan body, his Rokushiki techniques and, later on, threw his dual swords into the mix. What you should take from that is that despite not being a master of either, his proficiency at several methods of combat came together to make a hybrid style that was much more powerful than any of his single styles by themselves.



> I'm saying from what I've seen, you only get to master one and maybe use another to add to your MAIN fighting style



This is nonsense, there's no "you only get to master one". Why would Oda place such a silly restriction on his universe? Sure, most people have something we could call their main fighting style, but this is no hard rule and puts no restrictions on anyone.


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## Dunno (Aug 10, 2014)

Amol said:


> You are right . Shanks won with high diff. It all depends whether that Sea King became stronger during the skip or not.
> Luffy is still Yonkou level though .



Nono, the Sea King was past his prime when Luffy fought him. Prime Sea King was way stronger, just like Shiki, who also was beaten by Luffy in his old age.


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## Lawliet (Aug 10, 2014)

> So your point is... what? He wasn't as good with Rokushiki as Lucci, and he wasn't as good at swordplay as Zoro. In fact he didn't even have a single named attack with his swords. But he still gave Zoro a heck of a fight, using a combination of his Zoan body, his Rokushiki techniques and, later on, threw his dual swords into the mix. What you should take from that is that despite not being a master of either, his proficiency at several methods of combat came together to make a hybrid style that was much more powerful than any of his single styles by themselves.


I can agree with most of this. He wasn't a master in nothing, like I said before; he used a bit of this and a bit of that, Kaku with his mixed style can't compare to those who are only masters in swordsmanship, they'd literally annihilate him because of the mass difference in levels overall and in swordsmanship specifically, and he wouldn't compare to those who are masters in different fighting styles either.  I am not making a rule and a restriction on you only get to have one main fighting style. But as far as I've seen, that's the case. 

Name me one character in one piece that is a master in at least two different fighting styles. Kaku merely adds rankyaku to his swordsmanship, Sanji adds Geppo to his legs style, a lot of marines have been using Soru, Blueno was using Tekkai. Those are not fighting styles, those are a part of the fighting style rokushiki which they use a bit of it to add to their MAIN fighting styles. 



> So you think it's viable debate practice to dismiss proof that your stance is wrong because "it's rare"?


No, I'm not trying to say that. But you know, as much as I do that Franky is a rare example, all pacifistas are too. Franky would fit mostly into brawling because that's what he does in solo fights, and adds fire arms to his style, but I'll admit that he uses them both as much.. But like I said, Franky is a rare example. Just like Teach is a rare example of using 2 devil fruits doesn't make it possible for everyone else to do the same.

Again, I am not saying being a master in two different fighting styles is impossible in one piece, but if i don't see any of it, I won't make the assumption it exists just because it might help some people's opinions on who's stronger by adding all these styles to their character.


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## Coruscation (Aug 10, 2014)

> Name me one character in one piece that is a master in at least two different fighting styles.



Why do you need to be a master in two different styles to be a hybrid fighter? You don't, you just have to use more than one style. Luffy isn't a _master_ brawler but he's good at it, and he uses his DF to power himself up. Smoker is a competent jutte user, a competent brawler and a competent user of his DF for mobility, disorientation and restraining purposes. Sure I would say that Luffy and Smoker are both brawlers as a baseline but they complement it with other elements. This can be contrasted to someone like Garp who is very nearly a "pure" brawler, just as Zoro is nearly a pure swordsman whereas Kaku had a mixed style. Franky is an even more mixed fighter than Luffy or Smoker. Law is chiefly a DF user but competent at swordsmanship as well.

The overall point is stop trying to put fighting style in restrictive categories. People simply fight and use whatever resources and abilities are available to them. Beyond that we don't need to do more than use basic common sense because I highly, highly doubt Oda puts any more meaning into it. Such as for example how Zoro and Law are both swordsmen, but Zoro is a superior one, which doesn't mean he's stronger overall since Law also has his Devil Fruit. The only reason this is an issue is the everlasting Mihawk debate. Just let common sense rule. If Fujitora wins by dropping meteors on Mihawk's head then that doesn't make him a stronger swordsman. Common sense. If he wins by outdoing Mihawk in swordplay, that would make him a stronger swordsman. Common sense. If Law and Zoro were to duel with swords only it would be proven that Zoro is a stronger swordsman. Common sense.


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## Lawliet (Aug 10, 2014)

> If Fujitora wins by dropping meteors on Mihawk's head then that doesn't make him a stronger swordsman. Common sense. If he wins by outdoing Mihawk in swordplay, that would make him a stronger swordsman. Common sense. If Law and Zoro were to duel with swords only it would be proven that Zoro is a stronger swordsman. Common sense.



I agree with all this, I never tried to say otherwise.



> Why do you need to be a master in two different styles to be a hybrid fighter?



Sanji has been using his Geppo a lot since the time skip, he's still the same Sanji with the same fighting style. Geppo alone doesn't make him a hybrid fighter. Learning all rokushiki techniques and using them with his leg style as much would make him a hybrid fighter.

A sniper who's an inch away from his target might just punch his target instead of shooting him. Does that mean he's a brawler now? No..


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## Typhon (Aug 10, 2014)

I don't really know where this debate went, but I wouldn't call myself the World's greatest swordsman if I won my battles by dropping meteors from the sky and blocking everything with gravity.

I feel it's one thing to use your power (whatever it is) to increase your capability in swordsmanship and it's another to use abilities to supplement your combat efficiency.


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## Furinji Saiga (Aug 10, 2014)

IMO If Fujitora did indeed receive his ability recently, he should be considered a swordsman. This is taking in account on who is based on, Zatoichi the blind swordsman and his age. 

If he had this ability for a long time, then no doubt he should be considered a gravity man first and foremost with really good swordsmanship secondary.

tbh he has not really shown us the full scale and usage of either his DF or swordsmanship, so its too early to make any definitive statements on what his style is.

As for the fight, I think Mihawk takes it high difficulty.


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## Extravlad (Aug 10, 2014)

Who care anyway? We all know that most people who try to say the WSS is only the more skilled are on Shanks's side.
But it's actually wrong since both Kuina and Zoro clearly implied that the WSS need to be able to defeat every swordsman.
Kuina was more skilled than Zoro, but she still couldn't become WSS.
Haki,physical strength and durability are as important as skill.

Zoro want to defeat Mihawk not to say "yea look i'm better than u with a sword but you're using haki u cheater".

Mihawk > Shanks is a fact.


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## Suit (Aug 10, 2014)

It's pretty clear that he is well-versed enough in his DF power to make up for not being the WSS.


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## Hachibi (Aug 10, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> Who care anyway? We all know that most people who try to say the WSS is only the more skilled are on Shanks's side.
> But it's actually wrong since both Kuina and Zoro clearly implied that the WSS need to be able to defeat every swordsman.
> Kuina was more skilled than Zoro, but she still couldn't become WSS.
> Haki,physical strength and durability are as important as skill.
> ...



Why did you bring Shanks again?


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## Extravlad (Aug 10, 2014)

He still loses.
Fujitora is a sworsman in the first place.
His DF has been useless against every worthy opponent he faced so far.

Mihawk would just cut his meteor and beat him with the sword.



> Why did you bring Shanks again?


Cause this thread is obviously Mihawk vs Shanks in disguise.


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## Suit (Aug 10, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> He still loses.
> Fujitora is a sworsman in the first place.
> His DF has been useless against every worthy opponent he faced so far.
> 
> ...



Not really. There is no point to go into Shanks vs Mihawk here. It is obvious Fujitora hasn't gone all out yet, and he even stated that he is keeping civilians in mind when attacking.


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## barreltheif (Aug 10, 2014)

Fujitora isn't a pure swordsman like Mihawk, Ryuma, Zoro, Rayleigh, Shanks, etc.
Thus the fact that Mihawk is the WSS doesn't automatically put him above Fujitora.
Mihawk is still obviously stronger than Fujitora though.


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## Raiden34 (Aug 10, 2014)

barreltheif said:


> Fujitora isn't a pure swordsman like Mihawk, Ryuma, Zoro, Rayleigh, Shanks, etc.
> Thus the fact that Mihawk is the WSS doesn't automatically put him above Fujitora.
> Mihawk is still obviously stronger than Fujitora though.



Agree except Shanks & Rayleigh, their power more like haki mastery rather than swordmanship. (And probably Gold Roger as well) Not saying that they don't have any skill though...

And no, Fujitora must be stronger than him.


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## Suit (Aug 10, 2014)

barreltheif said:


> Fujitora *isn't a pure swordsman like* Mihawk, Ryuma, Zoro, *Rayleigh, Shanks*, etc.
> Thus the fact that Mihawk is the WSS doesn't automatically put him above Fujitora.
> *Mihawk is still obviously stronger than Fujitora though.*



Bold statements are very baseless.


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## Dunno (Aug 10, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> Bold statements are very baseless.



The opinion that Shanks is purely a swordsman isn't baseless at all. Only the fact that he has only used a sword every time we've seen him fight/clash is enough of a base for the opinion to be valid. It's also almost certain that he doesn't have a DF, which decreases the probability of him being a hybrid fighter. He also has swords on his jolly roger, something that one might expect a swordsman to have. Last but not least, he used to duel Mihawk in his youth. And since duels are almost exclusively between people using the same weapon/fighting style, it increases the probability of Shanks being a swordsman.


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## Shanks (Aug 10, 2014)

I actually read over this entire debate, lol. Now people are going into Shanks vs. Mihawk territory huh?

Anyway Mihawk wins with hype and portrayal high dif. Even if we take feats, there's nothing that Fujitora have shown so far that Mihawk can't overcome with the slightest difficulties. And yes, I said feats and Mihawk in the same sentence. Lol.


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## Lawliet (Aug 10, 2014)

Adding to Dunno..

They're not baseless just because you choose not to believe it. Rayleigh was shown to swim, 100% he doesn't have a DF. He was only shown to fight using a sword, and he stated that he didn't use his weapon (sword) in 20 years. All things suggest he's a swordsman more than anything else. You can imagine both him and Shanks using their sword, throw it in the air then punch you, kick you then grab the sword and slice you, but like I said, you can imagine.


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## Suit (Aug 10, 2014)

Dunno said:


> The opinion that Shanks is purely a swordsman isn't baseless at all. Only the fact that he has only used a sword every time we've seen him fight/clash is enough of a base for the opinion to be valid. It's also almost certain that he doesn't have a DF, which decreases the probability of him being a hybrid fighter. He also has swords on his jolly roger, something that one might expect a swordsman to have. Last but not least, he used to duel Mihawk in his youth. And since duels are almost exclusively between people using the same weapon/fighting style, it increases the probability of Shanks being a swordsman.





oOLawlietOo said:


> They're not baseless just because you choose not to believe it. Rayleigh was shown to swim, 100% he doesn't have a DF. He was only shown to fight using a sword, and he stated that he didn't use his weapon (sword) in 20 years. All things suggest he's a swordsman more than anything else. You can imagine both him and Shanks using their sword, throw it in the air then punch you, kick you then grab the sword and slice you, but like I said, you can imagine.



Nothing will ever convince me that this is more than agenda-driven propaganda, sorry.


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## Sablés (Aug 10, 2014)

Shame nobody's trying to convince you.

They're stating facts to support a conclusion. What you take from it is your problem.


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## Suit (Aug 10, 2014)

Sabl?s said:


> Shame nobody's trying to convince you.
> 
> They're stating facts to support a conclusion. What you take from it is your problem.



That's cute, someone who agrees with them making an attempt at sounding condescending. Shanks being a pure swordsman isn't a fact yet, and those who say otherwise have an agenda. Mihawk has shown pathetic feats not worthy of placing him on Admiral or Yonkou level, and his presence also doesn't have the same pressure to it as an Admiral or Yonkou.

I'll go ahead and state it again, Fuji, high-diff. An Admiral isn't losing to someone who gave up his hopes of being comparable to Whitebeard when his attack got blocked by Jozu.


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## Lawliet (Aug 10, 2014)

> An Admiral isn't losing to someone who gave up his hopes of being comparable to Whitebeard when his attack got blocked by Jozu.


No offense, but I can't take you seriously after this.


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## Sablés (Aug 10, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> That's cute, someone who agrees with them making an attempt at sounding condescending.



....I applaud your attempt at irony. Really, given  all I see you do in threads is ride off other's posts while failing contribute anything of value.





> Shanks being a pure swordsman isn't a fact yet, and those who say otherwise have an agenda



Who the hell said he was? I'm damn sure Dunno was arguing against the notion that Shanks being a swordsman was "baseless". Don't extrapolate statements to support your own extreme opinion.



> Mihawk has shown pathetic feats not worthy of placing him on Admiral or Yonkou level, and his presence also doesn't have the same pressure to it as an Admiral or Yonkou.







> I'll go ahead and state it again, Fuji, high-diff. An Admiral isn't losing to someone who gave up his hopes of being comparable to Whitebeard when his attack got blocked by Jozu.



Having their casual unnamed swing blocked by Jozu, who is likely the most durable of Whitebeard's commanders is sure to decimate one's resolve; helluva a point you got there. Guess that makes Kizaru inferior to marco for being placed in the same boat.

What a joke.


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## Suit (Aug 10, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> No offense, but I can't take you seriously after this.



It's good reasoning that is much better than what you use to claim Shanks is a pure swordsman. But reasoning is conveniently subjective when viewed with bias.


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## Ruse (Aug 10, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> That's cute, someone who agrees with them making an attempt at sounding condescending. Shanks being a pure swordsman isn't a fact yet, and those who say otherwise have an agenda. *Mihawk has shown pathetic feats* not worthy of placing him on Admiral or Yonkou level, and his presence also doesn't have the same pressure to it as an Admiral or Yonkou.
> 
> I'll go ahead and state it again, Fuji, high-diff. An Admiral isn't losing to someone who gave up his hopes of being comparable to Whitebeard when his attack got blocked by Jozu.





That's impressive no matter how you slice it saying otherwise is just downplaying.


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## Lycka (Aug 10, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> And it's even more pathetic when Shanks's fanboys are using excuses like "Shanks isn't just a swordsman he can do more" or "the title only means he's more skilled with a sword but he would lose a fight" when it's clearly implied that Shanks IS a 100% swordsman AND wouldn't beat Mihawk in a fight.
> 
> No one gives a shit about your skill why do you think Kuina said she'll never be able to become WSS? Because she was a woman and didn't have the strength needed, her skills were extremely good better than Zoro's but it still wasn't enough.
> 
> ...



Let the neckbeard weaboos be, they live vicariously through one piece characters let them just be happy.


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## Lawliet (Aug 10, 2014)

> It's good reasoning that is much better than what you use to claim Shanks is a pure swordsman. But reasoning is conveniently subjective when viewed with bias.


No one claimed shanks is a pure swordsman. Maybe if you open your eyes more and actually read you'll comprehend what's going on.


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## Gilgamesh (Aug 10, 2014)

death to all mihawk fans


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## blueframe01 (Aug 10, 2014)

It's funny how people claim  Mihawk > Shanks as facts when the only fact that was revealed about them both is that all their duals have ended in a draw, and Mihawk has declined to fight right after Shanks lost his arm. So he got the WSS title without beating Shanks so it's impossible to simply claim the Mihawk >Shanks IMO

on topic, Fujitora 's showing has been pretty underwhelming for an Admiral IMO. And he doesn't seem to have anything that Mihawk can't overcome .  I'll give it to Mihawk


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## Suit (Aug 10, 2014)

Sabl?s said:


> ....I applaud your attempt at irony. Really, given  all I see you do in threads is ride off other's posts while failing contribute anything of value.



I second others' posts a lot because I agree with what they're saying and I would like to back up their answer. This lets me contribute my standpoint to the consensus without restating what someone says and looking like a pseudo-plagiarist.



Sabl?s said:


> Who the hell said he was? I'm damn sure Dunno was arguing against the notion that Shanks being a swordsman was "baseless". Don't extrapolate statements to support your own extreme opinion.



1) That's pretty much what most of you are saying. 

2) My opinion isn't the extreme one. The extreme opinion is that he is definitely a pure swordsman.




Sabl?s said:


> Having their casual unnamed swing blocked by Jozu, who is likely the most durable of Whitebeard's commanders is sure to decimate one's resolve; helluva a point you got there. Guess that makes Kizaru inferior to marco for being placed in the same boat.
> 
> What a joke.



It did decimate his resolve. That's why he stopped. Kizaru didn't stop for the rest of the war though; he continued to pursue Whitebeard, just not directly. So that is a terrible example. What a joke.


----------



## Dunno (Aug 10, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> That's cute, someone who agrees with them making an attempt at sounding condescending. Shanks being a pure swordsman isn't a fact yet, and those who say otherwise have an agenda. Mihawk has shown pathetic feats not worthy of placing him on Admiral or Yonkou level, and his presence also doesn't have the same pressure to it as an Admiral or Yonkou.
> 
> I'll go ahead and state it again, Fuji, high-diff. An Admiral isn't losing to someone who gave up his hopes of being comparable to Whitebeard when his attack got blocked by Jozu.



When have I ever stated that Shanks being a swordsman is a fact? It certainly isn't a fact, it's just very likely due to the facts I previously listed. Mihawk's ice-berg lifting feat is the strongest* physical** feat in the manga, and atop of that, he performed it casually. In my book, that's pretty impressive. You can't expect an air-slash performed without any visible effort from kilometres away to be able to one-shot a character intercepting it who could survive against Aokiji in melee for some time, it's very likely even Roger couldn't do that. 

*The physical feat requiring the most energy to perform. 

**An attack made without the help of a DF or any external source of power.


----------



## Sablés (Aug 10, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> I second others' posts a lot because I agree with what they're saying and I would like to back up their answer. This lets me contribute my standpoint to the consensus without restating what someone says and looking like a pseudo-plagiarist.



And you have a problem with my doing the same _because_?



> 1) That's pretty much what most of you are saying.
> 
> 2) My opinion isn't the extreme one. The extreme opinion is that he is definitely a pure swordsman.



That is a product of your misinterpretation. Where is it stated that Shanks is factually 100% a pure Swordsman?



Dunno said:


> The opinion that *Shanks is purely a swordsman isn't baseless at all.* Only the fact that he has only used a sword every time we've seen him fight/clash is enough of a base for the opinion to be valid. It's also almost certain that he doesn't have a DF, which *decreases the probability of him being a hybrid fighter*. He also has swords on his jolly roger, *something that one might expect a swordsman to have*. Last but not least, he used to duel Mihawk in his youth. And since duels are almost exclusively between people using the same weapon/fighting style, it increases the *probability of Shanks being a swordsman.*





oOLawlietOo said:


> Adding to Dunno..
> 
> They're not baseless just because you choose not to believe it. Rayleigh was shown to swim, 100% he doesn't have a DF. He was only shown to fight using a sword, and he stated that he didn't use his weapon (sword) in 20 years.* All things suggest he's a swordsman more than anything else*. You can imagine both him and Shanks using their sword, throw it in the air then punch you, kick you then grab the sword and slice you, but like I said, you can imagine.



Key words being: Probability, might and suggest

Indicating nothing definitive



> It did decimate his resolve. That's why he stopped. Kizaru didn't stop for the rest of the war though; he continued to pursue Whitebeard, just not directly. So that is a terrible example. What a joke.



No he didn't. Kizaru continued because *Whitebeard came to him.* So your opinion is that Mihawk's casual swing aimed at someone kilometers away where said attack would weaken with distance/time being blocked by the toughest member of the WB commanders is somehow relevant to Mihawk being weaker than the Admirals?  When Jozu himself could go against Aokiji without a scratch in melee range?

Yeah I'm done.


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## Firo (Aug 10, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> 1) That's pretty much what most of you are saying.
> 
> 2) My opinion isn't the extreme one. The extreme opinion is that he is definitely a pure swordsman.


Except what they are saying is more plausible despite* nothing being cut and dry*. Mihawk is the WSS  regardless. Shanks has only been showing so far as a swordsman. Im not saying he's limited to that, but  there claims can be backed much more than yours.
Especially when you judge  Mihawk based on a brief confrontation that he started and ended of his own accord.
I'm pretty sure it wasnt stated that Shanks is a confirmed swordsman here btw.
Its like you see what the fuck you want to see.



> It did decimate his resolve. That's why he stopped. Kizaru didn't stop for the rest of the war though; he continued to pursue Whitebeard, just not directly. So that is a terrible example. What a joke.



Not really. Shichibukai didnt really want anything to do with the war in the first place. They joined in and fell back based on how they felt. Mihawk's slash that Jozu intercepted was casual. He then nonchalantly sheathed his sword and faded back into the background afterwards.


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## Suit (Aug 10, 2014)

Red Hood said:


> I'm pretty sure it wasnt stated that Shanks is a confirmed swordsman here btw.
> Its like you see what the fuck you want to see.



1) How convenient an excuse "Its like you see what the fuck you want to see."
2) This is ridiculously off-topic.

I've already stated my stance on the matter: Fuji, high-diff. And an Admiral won't lose to Mihawk. Very mature of you to keep drawing me back into the (off-topic) discussion just so you and your friends can gang-neg me. 

You should stay in the convo thread where you belong. Trash opinions aren't welcome.

Oh yeah, and learn some grammar, as well as the correct form of "their, they're, and there", because reading that was a nightmare in more than one way. Not that I should expect you to be too intelligent in the first place though.


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## Dunno (Aug 10, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> 1) How convenient an excuse "Its like you see what the fuck you want to see."
> 2) This is ridiculously off-topic.
> 
> I've already stated my stance on the matter: Fuji, high-diff. And an Admiral won't lose to Mihawk. Very mature of you to keep drawing me back into the discussion just so you and your friends can gang-neg me.
> ...



Cheer up!  We're just having a discussion on an internet forum, there's no reason to get all fired up... Unless you get fired up about something positive, which is another and much awesomer thing


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## Firo (Aug 10, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> 1) How convenient an excuse "Its like you see what the fuck you want to see."
> 2) This is ridiculously off-topic.


This is your own fault for not comprehending what was said. No one here said  Shanks was confirmed a swordsman. You took what you wanted out of what was being said. Therefore, I told you about yourself.



> I've already stated my stance on the matter: Fuji, high-diff. And an Admiral won't lose to Mihawk.


Which isnt proven either way and some people will disagree with you 


> Very mature of you to keep drawing me back into the (off-topic) discussion just so you and your friends can gang-neg me.


You deleted most of my post and only responded to the off topic part.
Lol at gang negging you. Such a masochist.



> You should stay in the convo thread where you belong. Trash opinions aren't welcome.


:heston


> Oh yeah, and learn some grammar, as well as the correct form of "their, they're, and there", because reading that was a nightmare in more than one way. Not that I should expect you to be too intelligent in the first place though.



I'm not sober and I still didnt misinterpret anything said here.


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## Lawliet (Aug 10, 2014)

> Oh yeah, and learn some grammar, as well as the correct form of "their, they're, and there", because reading that was a nightmare in more than one way. Not that I should expect you to be too intelligent in the first place though


Not everyone is "blessed" by having English as their first language. You might want to think about it before you start attacking people like that.


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## Lurko (Aug 10, 2014)

Yeah I'm going with Mihawk.


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## trance (Aug 10, 2014)

blueframe01 said:


> It's funny how people claim  Mihawk > Shanks as facts when the only fact that was revealed about them both is that all their duals have ended in a draw, *and Mihawk has declined to fight right after Shanks lost his arm*. So he got the WSS title without beating Shanks so it's impossible to simply claim the Mihawk >Shanks IMO



Perhaps because even Mihawk himself doesn't see Shanks as a swordsman anymore, making the whole "Shanks is a weaker swordsman but stronger overall" theory possible?


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## Krippy (Aug 10, 2014)

Issho is underrated as fuck. I can't see him being weaker than the C3 besides Akainu. He should win with extreme diff imo.


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## Sablés (Aug 10, 2014)

Krippy said:


> Issho is underrated as fuck. I can't see him being weaker than the C3 besides Akainu. He should win with extreme diff imo.



Don't give me that.

Prove it with feetz, crusty


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## Krippy (Aug 10, 2014)

Ielsuppers

Issho weighs his ass down and rearranges his face


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## Lycka (Aug 10, 2014)

The Rooman had a meltdown.



Well Krippy be next?


Stay tuned.


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## Sablés (Aug 10, 2014)

Fujitora commits seppuku due to having an inferior stache.

Komatme, Krispykreme


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## trance (Aug 10, 2014)

TheRooMan said:


> You should stay in the convo thread where you belong. Trash opinions aren't welcome.
> 
> Oh yeah, and learn some grammar, as well as the correct form of "their, they're, and there", because reading that was a nightmare in more than one way. Not that I should expect you to be too intelligent in the first place though.



And I here I thought you were above flaming.


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## Krippy (Aug 10, 2014)

OPtiers said:


> The Rooman had a meltdown.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



*Will


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## Amol (Aug 11, 2014)

Golden Rule of staying sane in internet forum.
-Never argue in Mihawk thread. Just state your opinion and move along.


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## Suit (Aug 11, 2014)

Sabl?s said:


> Fujitora commits seppuku due to having an inferior stache.
> 
> Komatme, Krispykreme



Just stopped by to say that Fuji wouldn't know what that stache looks like. He's blind.


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## Sherlōck (Aug 11, 2014)

Either of them can win. Its going to be an extremely difficult fight whoever wins..


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## Vengeance (Aug 11, 2014)

Mihawk with high - very high difficulty imo.


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## X18999 (Aug 11, 2014)

It is a goddamn fact that Shanks is a swordsman!  Even if he was a master of Rokushiki, Fishman Karate, five other styles, and had 3 devil fruit abilities he'd still be a swordsman in addition to that.


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## The Bloody Nine (Aug 11, 2014)

Amol said:


> Golden Rule of staying sane in internet forum.
> -Never argue in Mihawk thread. Just state your opinion and move along.



Glad to see you have learnt this already. If you keep arguing against the swordwankers you eventually go off the deep end like Spiro did, god rest his soul.


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## Sanji (Aug 11, 2014)

Mihawk high diffs yo.


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## Lycka (Aug 11, 2014)

Krippy said:


> *Will



Well...........


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