# Strongest/Weakest Akatsuki Member?



## Tsunami (Aug 20, 2013)

Weakest Akatsuki other than Konan...

Basically, who would win out of the 7 Akatsuki, and who is weakest/who would go out first.



Location: Gaara vs Kimimaro Battlefield
Knowledge: Full
Restrictions: No Konan, Pain/Nagato, or Tobi fighting


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## Scarlet Ammo (Aug 20, 2013)

Weakest goes to Zetsu shortly followed by Hidan (admitted it himself).


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## Octavian (Aug 20, 2013)

Not sure how this is debate worthy to be honest since Nagato and Tobi are both restricted. Itachi should be comfortably the strongest one...


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## Kisame (Aug 20, 2013)

*1.* Tobi
*2.* Nagato
*3.* Itachi
*4.* Kisame
*5.* Kakuzu ~ Deidara
*6.* Sasori
*7.* Konan
*8.* Hidan


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## Sadgoob (Aug 20, 2013)

_*When*_ wearing Akatsuki robes 

1. Itachi
2. Tobi 
3. Pain

4. Kisame
5. Sasuke 
6. Deidara
7. Sasori
8. Kakuzu

9. Konan
10. Hidan
11. Jūgo
12. Suigetsu

13. Zetsu
14. Karin


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## Augustus Haugerud (Aug 20, 2013)

Octavian said:


> Not sure how this is debate worthy to be honest since Nagato and Tobi are both restricted. Itachi should be comfortably the strongest one...



Please tell me you're joking, even Strategoob didn't place Itachi number 1 and he/she is a widely recognized Itachi fan. 

Oh wait...


> When wearing Akatsuki robes, imo:
> 
> 1. Itachi
> 2. Pain
> ...



Anyways, this was a list I made a while back, it doesn't have all of the people who've been part of the Akatsuki but I it gets all the loyal members (Except Oro who wasn't loyal obviously)



> 1. Tobi - For sure after implanting one of Nagato's rinnegan. Don't be fooled by his fight with Konan, she had prep
> 2. Nagato/Pain - Even though he didn't completely master rinnegan, he was a beast with it. Massive chakra!
> 3. Itachi - Very powerful dojutsu, high intellect, only problem is lack of stamina and he didn't acquire EMS.
> 4. Sasori - I think he is underrated sometimes because of his match against Sakura and Chiyo. He wasn't going all out, he let himself die.
> ...



I admit Konan and Hidan may be switchable, and I probably should have placed Kisame a bit higher.


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## Sadgoob (Aug 20, 2013)

Augustus Haugerud said:


> Please tell me you're joking, even Strategoob didn't place Itachi number 1 and he/she is a widely recognized Itachi fan.



*fixed

Itachi could be number one if this is pre-Rinnegan Tobi, because when he did get around to stealing Madara's Rinnegan from Nagato, Akatsuki seemed to have dissolved (no indicatory uniforms.)

That's also why I placed MS Sasuke lower. When he was wearing Akatsuki robes, he didn't have access to any form of Susano'o. So he was still powerful, but less so.

Itachi versus Nagato is a closer match, as both have many OHKO abilities, and while Nagato definitely has bulkier abilities overall, Itachi is definitely smarter and more cunning overall.

Tobi's perfect Izanagi with the base Sharingan in his other eye would also allow him to trump Nagato or Pain, but Itachi has Izanami so he's much more of a threat to Tobi's trump card at that time.​


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## Yagura (Aug 20, 2013)

1. Nagato
2. Itachi
3. Obito 

4. Orochimaru
5. Sasori 
6. Kisame / Deidara 

7. Kakuzu
8. Konan
9. Hidan / Zetsu


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## Augustus Haugerud (Aug 20, 2013)

Strategoob said:


> *fixed
> 
> Itachi could be number one if this is pre-Rinnegan Tobi, because when he did get around to stealing Madara's Rinnegan from Nagato, Akatsuki seemed to have dissolved (no indicatory uniforms.)
> 
> ...



Some of that is surprisingly agreeable actually...

Yeah, Itachi is definetely a better tactician. Nagato has some of his own showings but they pretty much pale in comparison to Itachi's, who's probably only been outdone by Naruto's feats for quick battle plans. 
Of course Orochimaru and Kabuto are probably the smartest in nerdy terms 

However, Itachi only has a chance for so long until he runs out of chakra. Nagato is smarter than some give him credit for, I just personally think he could keep Itachi from using a one-shot attack him. Nagato on the other hand has a huge amount of endurance, and in one body has plenty of hax spamming ability when he's not being controlled.

Basically in my mind the only sure-proof attack is Totsuka. Amaterasu can be ST'd, Susanoo will obviously keep him alive but that doesn't mean he can't get sent flying by ST's. So yeah, it's a matter of "Can Itachi use Totsuka blade on him before he runs out of chakra?" 

Interesting observation with izanagi, but I don't think Obito needs it.

I'm not really sure what Obito taking one of the rinnegan has to do with it? 

The reason I still put Pre-Rinne Obito over Nagato and Itachi is because...

Neither really have a means to take him out.

Nagato's powers simply just won't work when Obito can just make them all pass through.

Pretty much the same for Itachi, only chance is genjutsu, Obito is an Uchiha also, and probably can avoid it.


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## Max Thunder (Aug 20, 2013)

Damn I thought I was voting for weakest....


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## MysteriousD (Aug 20, 2013)

Yea... now just how many people would survive Konans sea of explosives?

There would nothing left of Hidan, Kazkuzu, Kisame or his water, Deidara (perhaps... likely), Sasori, Itachi, Zetsu, Sasuke, Juugo, Suigetsu, Karin, orochimaru

Nagato would be just fine though

Konan 2nd strongest with prep hands down


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## Naiad (Aug 20, 2013)

Max Thunder said:


> Damn I thought I was voting for weakest....



yeah im not sure what the OP wants us to vote! i voted for the weakest too!

Zetsu..


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## UchihaX28 (Aug 20, 2013)

MysteriousD said:


> Yea... now just how many people would survive Konans sea of explosives?
> 
> There would nothing left of Hidan, Kazkuzu, Kisame or his water, Deidara (perhaps... likely), Sasori, Itachi, Zetsu, Sasuke, Juugo, Suigetsu, Karin, orochimaru
> 
> ...



 This is what I'm thinking.

 Honestly, Konan nearly killed Tobi if it wasn't for Izanagi. Sorry, but most of the Akatsuki isn't surviving that. Maybe Suigetsu could because he's made of water, but he'd most likely lose a bunch of chakra just trying to survive it.

 As for the weakest, most likely White Zetsu, Hidan, and then Deidara.


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## Turrin (Aug 20, 2013)

1. Obito
2. Nagato
3. Itachi
4. Sasori
5. Kisame
6. Kakuzu 
7. Deidara
8. Zetsu
9. Hidan


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## Tsunami (Aug 20, 2013)

Naiad said:


> yeah im not sure what the OP wants us to vote! i voted for the weakest too!
> 
> Zetsu..



The poll title dood


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## UchihaX28 (Aug 20, 2013)

Shark said:


> *1.* Tobi
> *2.* Nagato
> *3.* Itachi
> *4.* Kisame
> ...



 Deidara admits Sasori is even stronger than he is, so that just doesn't work.


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## Eliyua23 (Aug 21, 2013)

1. Obito
2. Itachi/Nagato
3. Nagato/Itachi
4. Orochimaru
5. Konan
6. Sasori/Kisame 
7. Kisame/Sasori
8. Deidara
9. Kakuzu
10. Zetsu
11. Hidan


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## The Pirate on Wheels (Aug 21, 2013)

Strategoob said:


> *fixed
> 
> Itachi could be number one if this is pre-Rinnegan Tobi, because when he did get around to stealing Madara's Rinnegan from Nagato, Akatsuki seemed to have dissolved (no indicatory uniforms.)
> 
> ...



If Itachi was capable of defeating Tobi the pre-rinneganed, he would have done so.  Cause he's a hero, ya'know?


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## Sadgoob (Aug 21, 2013)

The Pirate on Wheels said:


> If Itachi was capable of defeating Tobi the pre-rinneganed, he would have done so.  Cause he's a hero, ya'know?



Hence why Tobi stayed away from his own organization when Itachi was about―to guard his secrets, or certainly die. Or at least make death a likely enough possibility that the risk wasn't worth it. 

In the movie Kishimoto wrote, he also had Obito warp away from a conflct with Itachi, further indicating that Tobi was the one purposefully avoiding a fight, which his abilities are ideal for.  

On the otherhand, Itachi was ballsy as fuck going into that situation because, unlike Obito, he can't go intangible, meld into the ground, and disappear from any conflict at a whim.​


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## Garcher (Aug 21, 2013)

iitachi 1# soloking :


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## Bansai (Aug 21, 2013)

Strategoob said:


> _*When*_ wearing Akatsuki robes
> 
> 1. Itachi
> 2. Tobi
> ...


We don't know anything about Karin's combat abilities. She might even be stronger than Suigetsu and Jugo considering she can take a lot of damage thanks to her regeneration ability and can predict movements better than anyone. Thanks to these abilities, she might be a great combatant as well. We may not forget that she was a warden after all. Putting her below everyone just because she didn't fight as for her role as a medic and sensor type isn't really fair at this point.


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## Ghost (Aug 21, 2013)

Out of those on the poll:

1. Itachi
2. Kisame
3. Deidara
4. Sasori
5. Kakuzu
6. Hidan
7. Konan
8. Zetsu

Obito and Nagato are more powerful than Itachi though.



Emporio Ivankov said:


> We don't know anything about Karin's combat abilities.* She might even be stronger than Suigetsu and Jugo considering she can take a lot of damage thanks to her regeneration ability and can predict movements better than anyone. Thanks to these abilities, she might be a great combatant as well.* We may not forget that she was a warden after all. Putting her below everyone just because she didn't fight as for her role as a medic and sensor type isn't really fair at this point.



Karin is shit.


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## Ersa (Aug 21, 2013)

Going by the poll.

1. Itachi
2. Kisame
3. Sasori
4. Deidara
5. Kakuzu
6. Hidan
7. Zetsu

A true Akatsuki list.

1. Obito (Juubi)



2. Edo Nagato
3. Edo Itachi

4. Kisame
5. Sasori
6. Konan
7. Deidara
8. Kakuzu

9. Hidan
10. Zetsu


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## Empathy (Aug 21, 2013)

Obito
Pain
Itachi
Sasori
Deidara
Orochimaru
Kisame
Kakuzu
Konan
Hidan
Zetsu
I've always been pretty confident in this list, so if anyone has questions about placements, feel free to ask.


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## Jad (Aug 21, 2013)

Empathy, explain the Sasori and Kisame fight.


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## Bansai (Aug 21, 2013)

saikyou said:


> Out of those on the poll:
> 
> 1. Itachi
> 2. Kisame
> ...


Ehm... you do know that she used her heal bite already when that happened, right? It's a technique she may only use once a day because it takes away so much power and chakra, yet she used it twice. How was she supposed to do something in that condition? That scan is all but suitable to prove that she's weak if you ask me.


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## Ghost (Aug 21, 2013)

Emporio Ivankov said:


> How was she supposed to do something in that condition?



Not getting defeated with a single kick would be a great start.

Karin is shit.


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## Bansai (Aug 21, 2013)

saikyou said:


> Not getting defeated with a single kick would be a great start.
> 
> Karin is shit.



First of all, she hasn't been defeated. She stood up almost immediately and kept focusing on Danzo's chakra. Secondly not being able to fight in her condition is absolutely nothing that a character should be ashamed about. It would be if she didn't use the heal bite already, but she did use it. She gave up on a huge amount of chakra and power to restore Sasuke's health and chakra completely. Sasuke fought like his fights in the Gokage summit never happened, simply because he took Karin's chakra to be in such a good shape. Blaming Karin because she couldn't do anything with only a small amount of chakra and energy left is almost like blaming Tsunade for not being able to fight properly after using her regeneration ability.


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## Legendary Itachi (Aug 21, 2013)

Why debating for one who is kicked away by old man Danzo easily?
Karin isn't type of fighting, that's clear. Assuming she 'may' have great combat abilities doesn't change the fact that she is the weakest in Akatsuki.

Itachi is the strongest one in here without Nagato/Post-Rinnegan Obito.


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## Trojan (Aug 21, 2013)

if the op mean in a fight between all of them at the same time, them it's Kisame who will win. 
Itachi, may or may not be the strongest between them, but regardless, his chakra won't allowed him
to stay there for too long. So, I think Kisame is the one who will win.


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## Bansai (Aug 21, 2013)

Legendary Itachi said:


> Why debating for one who is kicked away by old man Danzo easily?
> Karin isn't type of fighting, that's clear.



Ehm... yeah. As I said. Kicking away a woman who's almost out of chakra and energy isn't that hard. Come again when she gets kicked easily while not being completely worn out. 

And not a type of fighting? Yeah, because wardens don't fight, right?


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## Kisame (Aug 21, 2013)

NarutoX28 said:


> Deidara admits Sasori is even stronger than he is, so that just doesn't work.


I think Deidara would defeat more opponents.


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## Mayweather (Aug 21, 2013)

Lol. Konan would beat Hidan, Zetsu, and maybe even Deidara under certain conditions.


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## UchihaX28 (Aug 21, 2013)

Emporio Ivankov said:


> Ehm... yeah. As I said. Kicking away a woman who's almost out of chakra and energy isn't that hard. Come again when she gets kicked easily while not being completely worn out.
> 
> And not a type of fighting? Yeah, because wardens don't fight, right?



 Lol, one punch from A would beat the shit out of Karin.

 Ya know what happened to Jugo? He survived a hit and was able to make a point blank shot.

 Suigetsu was also able to at least react to Raikage A when he was so close to Sasuke.

 You're saying Karin can do that when she couldn't react to Old Man Danzo who's fodder without his Izanagi?


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## Tsunami (Aug 21, 2013)

I think Deidara would beat Itachi because his Sharingan Resist thing. Deidara    flies up and AOE's everyone else


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## Ghost (Aug 21, 2013)

Mayweather said:


> Lol. Konan would beat Hidan, Zetsu, and *maybe even Deidara under certain conditions.*





Deidara would have to be heavily gimped.


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## Bansai (Aug 21, 2013)

NarutoX28 said:


> Lol, one punch from A would beat the shit out of Karin.
> 
> Ya know what happened to Jugo? He survived a hit and was able to make a point blank shot.
> 
> ...



lol. Great thing you suck that bad at reading posts properly. Did Jugo or Suigetsu lose such a huge amount of chakra and power? No. Jugo was just fine when this happened. So was Suigetsu. They were all full of chakra and energy. When Danzo kicked Karin, she had almost nothing left to begin with. It was a completely different situation. Sorry, but you're all but the cleverest person I ever met. Comparing two character's actions who have been in a completely different state? A worn out Hashirama would also easily lose to Madara. Does this make him weak? No it doesn't. If Karin didn't use the Heal Bite before, your argument would have been legit, but considering that she was in such a condition, your argument is pretty much worthless.
She wasted almost everything on the Heal Bite. Karin was completely worn out, so what the hell do you expect? It's, as I said, like blaming Tsunade for not being able to do something after deactivating her regeneration ability.  
In addition Karin would survive a hit from A. I don't know how much attention you actually pay to the Manga or whether you actually read it, but if you didn't know already: The Uzumaki Clan has an extremely good regeneration ability. And no, that doesn't go for Suigetsu as well. He may be able to turn into liquid, but he's weak when it comes to lightning, which means that a direct hit would probably kill him.


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## The Gallant Hermit (Aug 21, 2013)

Without the current Orochimaru and Nagato, Itachi is the strongest. With them this how my rate is:
1. Current Orochimaru ( With 4 kages and other Zombies + Sage mode if it is confirmed)
2. Pain
3. Nagato
4. MS Itachi\ Healed arms Orochimaru\ Obito with Sharinngan
5. Kisame\ Sasori
6.Kakuzu \ Konan
7. Deidara
8. Hidan
9. Zetsu


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## wooly Eullerex (Aug 23, 2013)

saikyou said:


> Deidara would have to be heavily gimped.



no, that match-up favors Konan all day


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## Bonly (Aug 23, 2013)

1)Obito
2)Nagato/Pain
3-4)Itachi/Orochi
5-7)Kisame/Konan/Zetsu
8-10)Kakuzu/Deidara/Sasori
11)Hidan

That's how I see it if we don't include the members of Taka.


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## Jagger (Aug 23, 2013)

How can Karin be stronger in any shape, form or perspective than Juugo or Suigetsu? They demolish her. Have you considered the fact she might not have any fighting abilities?


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## UchihaX28 (Aug 23, 2013)

Emporio Ivankov said:


> lol. Great thing you suck that bad at reading posts properly. Did Jugo or Suigetsu lose such a huge amount of chakra and power? No. Jugo was just fine when this happened. So was Suigetsu. They were all full of chakra and energy. When Danzo kicked Karin, she had almost nothing left to begin with. It was a completely different situation. Sorry, but you're all but the cleverest person I ever met. Comparing two character's actions who have been in a completely different state? A worn out Hashirama would also easily lose to Madara. Does this make him weak? No it doesn't. If Karin didn't use the Heal Bite before, your argument would have been legit, but considering that she was in such a condition, your argument is pretty much worthless.
> She wasted almost everything on the Heal Bite. Karin was completely worn out, so what the hell do you expect? It's, as I said, like blaming Tsunade for not being able to do something after deactivating her regeneration ability.
> In addition Karin would survive a hit from A. I don't know how much attention you actually pay to the Manga or whether you actually read it, but if you didn't know already: The Uzumaki Clan has an extremely good regeneration ability. And no, that doesn't go for Suigetsu as well. He may be able to turn into liquid, but he's weak when it comes to lightning, which means that a direct hit would probably kill him.



 Then why didn't she help against Killer B?

 And ok, Suigetsu has a weakness to lightning. What's your point? Konan also has a weakness to oil so does that make her weak all of a sudden?

 Face it, Karin is weak. What the hell did Karin do against Killer B besides healing Sasuke? 

 That's right, none. At least Jugo was able to dodge V1 Killer Bee's assault and landed a strong hit on him. That's the main reason why he killed off Karin. Apparently her healing ability wasn't enough compared to Jugo and Suigetsu.

 You think Karin can handle Suigetsu's true form that he used that held his own against Hachibi for a couple of seconds? You think she can survive a hit from Raikage A when Suigetsu stated that his arms would've fallen off had he not been made of water? Jugo survived a hit from Raikage A. He obviously took damage, but his berserk attitude clearly ignored it. 

 It's ridiculous to think Karin is stronger than Jugo and Suigetsu. Are you implying she's also stronger than Darui?


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## Laozy (Aug 24, 2013)

*Zetsu* is the strongest Akatsuki member. He'd sink through the floor and let his 100,000 man army take care of the rest.

*Itachi*: lower than average chakra pool. He'd be the worst off (almost) out of everybody.
*Kisame*: relatively large chakra pool, could swamp them with his bubble.. but there's sooo many.
*Hidan*: would die within the hour. Good TaiJutsu skills but his only ability is totally useless..
*Kakuzu*: can spam all of those chakra nature spells. I reckon he could take out a good 3,000 clones before dying.
*Sasori*: he'd take a long time to kill, but eventually he'd end up dead like the rest.
*Deidara*: has the best chance of winning, but wouldn't have enough chakra/clay to take them all out. After destroying about 20,000 clones he'd be flying around until he starved to death, while the Zetsu army tracks him.

There we go. My opinion and my reasoning.


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## Bansai (Aug 24, 2013)

NarutoX28 said:


> Then why didn't she help against Killer B?
> 
> And ok, Suigetsu has a weakness to lightning. What's your point? Konan also has a weakness to oil so does that make her weak all of a sudden?
> 
> ...


LOL. Seriously? Do you even read the Manga? You're absolutely all but the smartest person there is. 

Karin is, as I mentioned twice now, not just a Sensor Type but also a Medic. As Tsunade said, Medics are the LAST ones to die among their group and they may not interfere during a fight. This goes ESPECIALLY for Karin because she needs every single bit of chakra to be able to heal Sasuke any time. Imagine she just wasted her power during a fight while Sasuke gets injured serverly. She wouldn't be able to heal him and he would automatically be fucked. And if you didn't notice (as always) Karin used her Heal Bite during her fight with Killer Bee in the first few minutes. 

As for Suigetsu: You mentioned that every Taka member exept for Karin could survive an attack from A. I told you that Karin could thanks to her regeneration ability while Suigetsu couldn't because Raiton is his weakness and he has nothing that can cure him from such an attack. Can't you even remember your own posts? Really?

Bring real proof that Karin is weak, and then we'll talk. All you got by now are useless arguments which can be neglected easily. You can call her weak when she actually fights an opponent one on one while NOT being completely worn out, but she hasn't done anything like that by now because she is still a medic. 

And seriously? Karin healed Tsunade who was cut in TWO. How was her healing ability not enough? There was NO moment in which her healing ability failed to recover others completely. In addition neither Jugo nor Suigetsu have healing abilities. Jugo's technique only allows him to transfer natural energy to replace parts of the body. 

When did I say that she could handle Suigetsu and Jugo? I said that there is NOTHING that proves that she's below their level, simply because she hasn't shown how strong her combat abilities are. We don't know where she stands, so saying she's weak is simply dumb. Read my posts properly or don't bother reading them at all. You have seriously ridiculous arguments. Bring real proof that she's weak and then we can talk. But if you don't, don't bother replying either.


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## SSMG (Aug 24, 2013)

The strongest? Physically id say kisame. he was causing mini tidal waves off the impact of his attacks...and that was a 30%clone.
but the overal strongest is nagato. i don't know why you didn't list him nor obito on the list though.

weakest hmm physically id probably be sasori or deidera. sasori is a wodden puppet and deidera has always relied in his ninjutsu never his physical strength. 

overall weakest though is zetsu. got fodder by what's his name?


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## UchihaX28 (Aug 24, 2013)

Emporio Ivankov said:


> LOL. Seriously? Do you even read the Manga? You're absolutely all but the smartest person there is.



 So much irony in this comment. It's ridiculous.



> Karin is, as I mentioned twice now, not just a Sensor Type but also a Medic. As Tsunade said, Medics are the LAST ones to die among their group and they may not interfere during a fight. This goes ESPECIALLY for Karin because she needs every single bit of chakra to be able to heal Sasuke any time. Imagine she just wasted her power during a fight while Sasuke gets injured serverly. She wouldn't be able to heal him and he would automatically be fucked. And if you didn't notice (as always) Karin used her Heal Bite during her fight with Killer Bee in the first few minutes.



 She's a medic. Ok, your point? She hasn't shown any feats that point to her towards being as strong as you say she is besides Sakura and Tsunade who have.

 Like I said, you haven't read my comment. Besides healing, what else has she done? Jugo was by far more useful in the fight despite being weakened by a heavy hit by B and Suigetsu managed to stop Hachibi after being hit by his weakness, Raiton attacks. Sasuke only picked her because of her sensory abilities and healing abilities. That's it.



> As for Suigetsu: You mentioned that every Taka member exept for Karin could survive an attack from A. I told you that Karin could thanks to her regeneration ability while Suigetsu couldn't because Raiton is his weakness and he has nothing that can cure him from such an attack. Can't you even remember your own posts? Really?



 Wtf did I just read? You said Karin uses a lot of chakra to heal herself and now you're saying she doesn't to help your argument? Ok, nice job presenting a poor argument. If all she can do is heal herself, she'll get wasted.



> Bring real proof that Karin is weak, and then we'll talk. All you got by now are useless arguments which can be neglected easily. You can call her weak when she actually fights an opponent one on one while NOT being completely worn out, but she hasn't done anything like that by now because she is still a medic.



 You haven't brought any proof honestly besides saying she can heal which you already stated takes too much chakra.



> And seriously? Karin healed Tsunade who was cut in TWO. How was her healing ability not enough? There was NO moment in which her healing ability failed to recover others completely. In addition neither Jugo nor Suigetsu have healing abilities. Jugo's technique only allows him to transfer natural energy to replace parts of the body.



 Problem is, she didn't heal Sasuke completely.

 2

 Here ya go. He admits there are a lot of stronger shinobi and he picked Suigetsu and Jugo clearly because of their strength.



> When did I say that she could handle Suigetsu and Jugo? I said that there is NOTHING that proves that she's below their level, simply because she hasn't shown how strong her combat abilities are. We don't know where she stands, so saying she's weak is simply dumb. Read my posts properly or don't bother reading them at all. You have seriously ridiculous arguments. Bring real proof that she's weak and then we can talk. But if you don't, don't bother replying either.



 You haven't brought proof. You outright stated she can beat Suigetsu and Jugo because of their healing abilities, but Karin didn't do shit. Sasuke sacrificed her because clearly her healing abilities aren't as good as you make them out to be.


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## Bansai (Aug 24, 2013)

NarutoX28 said:


> So much irony in this comment. It's ridiculous.


Nope. It came from the bottom of my heart.


NarutoX28 said:


> She's a medic. Ok, your point? She hasn't shown any feats that point to her towards being as strong as you say she is besides Sakura and Tsunade who have.


Where did I say that she is strong? I said that there is nothing that proves that she is weak. I don't know how often I have to repeat this. 


NarutoX28 said:


> Like I said, you haven't read my comment. Besides healing, what else has she done? Jugo was by far more useful in the fight despite being weakened by a heavy hit by B and Suigetsu managed to stop Hachibi after being hit by his weakness, Raiton attacks. Sasuke only picked her because of her sensory abilities and healing abilities. That's it.


Did I say that she was useful for her combat abilities? No. Dude, seriously. I said that it's her duty to hide during a battle because if she lost a huge amount of chakra or got severely injured herself doing a fight, Sasuke would be fucked. 



NarutoX28 said:


> Wtf did I just read? You said Karin uses a lot of chakra to heal herself and now you're saying she doesn't to help your argument? Ok, nice job presenting a poor argument. If all she can do is heal herself, she'll get wasted.


As I said: Read my posts properly or don't bother replying. Where did I mention ANYTHING about Karin wasting a lot of chakra while healing herself? How much she needs for healing herself is unknown and I never said ANYTHING about the amount of chakra she loses while healing herself. I talked about the heal bite. IT takes away a lot of chakra. Did Karin EVER use the heal bite on herself? No she didn't.



NarutoX28 said:


> You haven't brought any proof honestly besides saying she can heal which you already stated takes too much chakra.


Then you should actually read my posts, buddy. You are the one stating that Karin is weak, so you are the one who has to prove it. You can't exactly prove that a character is not weak, although there is proof that she's indeed a combatant. I would have to prove it if I said she's super strong, but when did I say this? Quote the part where I said that she's strong. I stated reasons why she actually was worn out while she tried to fight Danzo, and I can prove it with the Manga Scan where Jugo stated that this ability worns her out. 



NarutoX28 said:


> Problem is, she didn't heal Sasuke completely.



When did she not heal him completely? She couldn't heal him completely once when she used her technique twice a day on Sasuke, which means that she of course did not have much chakra left to heal him. But was there any other scenario in which she used it ONCE in only ONE day and failed

 2


NarutoX28 said:


> Here ya go. He admits there are a lot of stronger shinobi and he picked Suigetsu and Jugo clearly because of their strength.



He says STRONG not STRONGER. Can't you even read scans properly? And again, where did I state that he picked Karin because of her combat abilities. Nowhere. Also there are two quotes of Kishimoto which mentioned that Karin is among the strongest Kunoichis. 



NarutoX28 said:


> You haven't brought proof. You outright stated she can beat Suigetsu and Jugo because of their healing abilities, but Karin didn't do shit. Sasuke sacrificed her because clearly her healing abilities aren't as good as you make them out to be.


Where did I mention that she beats them? Again, quote it. And Sasuke didn't say a WORD about sacrificing her because she didn't heal him properly. He merely stated that she has no use for her when she's a hostage.


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## Icegaze (Aug 24, 2013)

Nagato strongest. He is stronger than obito. kamui ain't doing shit to preta path . and obito can't use rinnegan or hasn't  shown it 
Zetsu weakest 
Then Hidan


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## UchihaX28 (Aug 24, 2013)

Emporio Ivankov said:


> Nope. It came from the bottom of my heart.



 Then stop speaking with your heart.



> Where did I say that she is strong? I said that there is nothing that proves that she is weak. I don't know how often I have to repeat this.



 Your assumption of her being on Suigetsu and Jugo's level is ridiculous. Sorry, Suigetsu and Jugo aren't that fodder.



> Did I say that she was useful for her combat abilities? No. Dude, seriously. I said that it's her duty to hide during a battle because if she lost a huge amount of chakra or got severely injured herself doing a fight, Sasuke would be fucked.



 So, she's a good support character. I never denied that.

 That doesn't equate to being on Suigetsu and Jugo's level. Stop changing your argument.



> As I said: Read my posts properly or don't bother replying. Where did I mention ANYTHING about Karin wasting a lot of chakra while healing herself? How much she needs for healing herself is unknown and I never said ANYTHING about the amount of chakra she loses while healing herself. I talked about the heal bite. IT takes away a lot of chakra. Did Karin EVER use the heal bite on herself? No she didn't.



 So, can we take Danzo kicking Karin as evidence of Karin being weak because you stated that he used a healing bite prior to that, but if it doesn't use that much chakra, it shouldn't really matter.

 I'm talking about 1v1. If you can't even fight 1v1, you're as weak as hell. White Zetsu isn't that strong, but he's a good support character. Same deal with Karin.




> Then you should actually read my posts, buddy. You are the one stating that Karin is weak, so you are the one who has to prove it. You can't exactly prove that a character is not weak, although there is proof that she's indeed a combatant. I would have to prove it if I said she's super strong, but when did I say this? Quote the part where I said that she's strong. I stated reasons why she actually was worn out while she tried to fight Danzo, and I can prove it with the Manga Scan where Jugo stated that this ability worns her out.


 
 You stated she's on Suigetsu and Jugo's level and you didn't prove it.

 You know what, I'm done. I'm not denying that Healing Bite doesn't wear her out. I agree that it does, but if you can't fight for yourself and get brutally kicked by a character that's not that strong without a jutsu, that's utter bs. Jugo at least managed to make a decent effort at making a point blank shot which would obliterate Darui and esp. Karin, Suigetsu, weakened by Sasuke's Chidori managed to push back the Hachibi. What has Karin done for herself besides being a support character? That's right, nothing. A nearly dead Danzo managed to keep her hostage. That's just sad even if Karin was weakened. Suigetsu or Jugo wouldn't have let up as easily as she did. That's why Sasuke wanted to kill her. Because she's fodder compared to the other 2.




> When did she not heal him completely? She couldn't heal him completely once when she used her technique twice a day on Sasuke, which means that she of course did not have much chakra left to heal him. But was there any other scenario in which she used it ONCE in only ONE day and failed
> 
> 2



 She never used Healing Bite 2x a day if I recall correctly. When she used it on Sasuke during Killer Bee, she didn't heal him completely. He could still move well, but he wasn't full healed.

*here.
* 

 Looks quite tired to me.



> He says STRONG not STRONGER. Can't you even read scans properly? And again, where did I state that he picked Karin because of her combat abilities. Nowhere. Also there are two quotes of Kishimoto which mentioned that Karin is among the strongest Kunoichis.



 If you can't interpret that simple statement, I can't help you. There are plenty of strong shinobi that he could have chosen from (which flat out states they're stronger than her), but she was chosen due to her unique abilities.

 Being one of the strongest Kunoichi isn't something to be proud of. Most of them are downright fodder. That doesn't mean she's as strong as Temari, Tenten or Sakura considering there are a lot of fodder Kunoichi out there.



> Where did I mention that she beats them? Again, quote it. And Sasuke didn't say a WORD about sacrificing her because she didn't heal him properly. He merely stated that she has no use for her when she's a hostage.



 2

 That's not what he says. He says if you can be taken hostage so easily (by a guy who's injured severely), she'll only be a burden.

 I'm done arguing now because your argument is ridiculous.


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## Dr. Leonard Church (Aug 24, 2013)

Hidan would win because he lives forever 

But seriously, it's a tossup between Deidara, Kisame, and Itachi, with Deidara or Kisame coming out on top. Kakuzu, Zetsu, and Konan don't have the firepower to win this (if Konan has her uber-explosives than this is a different story); Itachi has strong defense but is weak offensively, and Deidara and Kisame have their own ways of stomping each other.

Honestly it comes down to Deidara's bombs underwater vs. Kisame underwater.


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## Laozy (Aug 25, 2013)

Zetsu is the weakest.. yeah, ofc, with his 100,000 man army.

Zetsu *RAPES* everyone except Obito and Nagato, who have also been restricted/not included in this listing.


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## Darkmaiar (Aug 25, 2013)

Laozy said:


> Zetsu is the weakest.. yeah, ofc, with his 100,000 man army.
> 
> Zetsu *RAPES* everyone except Obito and Nagato, who have also been restricted/not included in this listing.



*Itachi:* Would be the worst off, because of low stamina. But his abilities could swamp quite a few rather quickly.

*Kisame:* Water Release: Exploding Water Colliding Wave, Water Release: 1,000 Hungry Sharks, a few Water Release: Great Shark Bullets here or there. And the last one could just keep going because all those Zetsus would be feeding it. 

*Kakuzu:* He can spam high level jutsu, but the real threat is the fact that no Zetsu could hurt him. They're already weak as hell and his Doton: Domu would be overkill. Five Hearts = Very, very, very, very long fight. 

*Deidera:* Flying around, dropping bombs. Would last the longest because of mobility, but with all the other members mowing the masses, it wouldn't matter. He'd live while obliterating the Zetsus.

*Hidan:* Same as Kakuzu, but less successful. Zetsus are too weak to incapacitate, save self-destruction. And that's a maybe. He could just slice and dice until he tires out.

*Sasori:* Each of his hundred puppets could easily match a single Zetsu. Hiruko would take a while to get through anyway. Third Kazekage... Iron Sand World... Irond Sand World everywhere...


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## Senjuclan (Aug 25, 2013)

1. Obito
2. Nagato
3. Kisame
4. Sasori
5. Itachi
6. Kakuzu
7. Deidara
8. Zetsu
9. Konan
10. Hidan


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## Bansai (Aug 25, 2013)

NarutoX28 said:


> Then stop speaking with your heart.


Don't worry, my brain is speaking too. You should probably do that too. 




NarutoX28 said:


> Your assumption of her being on Suigetsu and Jugo's level is ridiculous. Sorry, Suigetsu and Jugo aren't that fodder.
> 
> LOL. As I said, I never said she is stronger than them, I said that she might be stronger because we absolutely know nothing about her combat abilities. How often do I have to repeat the same shit?
> 
> ...


LOL. As I said, I never said she is stronger than them, I said that she might be stronger because we absolutely know nothing about her combat abilities. How often do I have to repeat the same shit? If I ever said that she is definitely stronger than them, quote it or just don't reply at all.



NarutoX28 said:


> So, can we take Danzo kicking Karin as evidence of Karin being weak because you stated that he used a healing bite prior to that, but if it doesn't use that much chakra, it shouldn't really matter.


Dude, are you really reading my posts or wait until I reply so you can continue babbling bullsh-
I said that Heal Bite TAKES a lot of chakra, which you can also look up in Narutopedia, but it's an unknown fact how much she wastes while healing HERSELF. Please, dude. Read my posts properly. I can't repeat it often enough.


NarutoX28 said:


> I'm talking about 1v1. If you can't even fight 1v1, you're as weak as hell. White Zetsu isn't that strong, but he's a good support character. Same deal with Karin.


Why would she fight 1v1 if she is a medic of a team who has to act as a support character. In addition Kishimoto stated in an interview that he doesn't wish Team Taka to have 1v1 fights. Just as Tsunade said, medical ninjas have the duty to hide and don't interfere with battles as they are the last ones to die. Karin does that, if you didn't notice.




NarutoX28 said:


> You stated she's on Suigetsu and Jugo's level and you didn't prove it.



I repeat: Quote the part where I said that she's definitely stronger than Suigetsu. You can put as much words into my mouth as you want, but then at least prove it that I said this. None of my posts have been edited as you can see, so quote the part. 



NarutoX28 said:


> You know what, I'm done. I'm not denying that Healing Bite doesn't wear her out. I agree that it does, but if you can't fight for yourself and get brutally kicked by a character that's not that strong without a jutsu, that's utter bs. Jugo at least managed to make a decent effort at making a point blank shot which would obliterate Darui and esp. Karin, Suigetsu, weakened by Sasuke's Chidori managed to push back the Hachibi. What has Karin done for herself besides being a support character? That's right, nothing. A nearly dead Danzo managed to keep her hostage. That's just sad even if Karin was weakened. Suigetsu or Jugo wouldn't have let up as easily as she did. That's why Sasuke wanted to kill her. Because she's fodder compared to the other 2.


 Dude please. Read the manga again and read about medical ninjas. Just because she doesn't fight, it doesn't mean that she is weak. It means that she's doing her job properly and serves as a support character. Jugo is not a medic and Suigetsu isn't one either, so of course they're free to join a battle. Karin isn't. "She didn't fight so she is weak" is the most ridiculous argument I ever heard. Prove it with actual facts or stop replying, you're just wasting your and my time.





NarutoX28 said:


> She never used Healing Bite 2x a day if I recall correctly. When she used it on Sasuke during Killer Bee, she didn't heal him completely. He could still move well, but he wasn't full healed.


1. Prove that he was not fully healed.
2. Oh yes? She didn't? She healed him after the Five Kage Summit and during his fight with Danzo. Don't believe me? See for yourself.

*Spoiler*: __ 







And number two:




NarutoX28 said:


> Link removed
> 
> Looks quite tired to me.


LOOOL!!! Where is he tired in this picture!? You're trying to prove that he was not healed properly by showing me his facial expression during a fight?     


NarutoX28 said:


> If you can't interpret that simple statement, I can't help you. There are plenty of strong shinobi that he could have chosen from (which flat out states they're stronger than her), but she was chosen due to her unique abilities.


He would have said "stronger" is he meant that others are stronger. Dude, learn reading. Seriously. It merely means that there are other STRONG Shinobis he could have picked. He never said "stronger" and if it meant "stronger" he would have said "stronger" instead of strong. How about actual proof?


NarutoX28 said:


> Being one of the strongest Kunoichi isn't something to be proud of. Most of them are downright fodder. That doesn't mean she's as strong as Temari, Tenten or Sakura considering there are a lot of fodder Kunoichi out there.


And there's a small amount of Kunoichis. There are almost no Kunoichis which are weaker then Tenten. If she was below Tenten, she would be among the WEAKEST Kunoichis, not the strongest. 


NarutoX28 said:


> 2
> 
> That's not what he says. He says if you can be taken hostage so easily (by a guy who's injured severely), she'll only be a burden.
> 
> I'm done arguing now because your argument is ridiculous.


Again, where does he say easily? Don't make up things. And Karin's condition was probably even worse than Danzo's. She was already close do death, as using this ability twice is life threatenning, which means she was close to death. 

Sorry man, but I really never met anyone with such a ridiculous way to debate.


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## UchihaX28 (Aug 25, 2013)

Emporio Ivankov said:


> We don't know anything about Karin's combat abilities. * She might even be stronger than Suigetsu and Jugo * considering * she can take a lot of damage thanks to her regeneration ability and can predict movements better than anyone. * Thanks to these abilities, she might be a great combatant as well. We may not forget that she was a warden after all. Putting her below everyone just because she didn't fight as for her role as a medic and sensor type isn't really fair at this point.



 Yeah, ok. There's so much bs in that comment.

 You basically implied she can repeatedly heal herself which isn't true at all. She doesn't have the Uzumaki clan's stamina if she gets worn out by one Healing Bite which is implied.


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## Jagger (Aug 25, 2013)

Karin can heal herself, that's good. But she doesn't have any offensive capacity nor anything that might defend her from Juugo attacks. Juugo can easily break her neck and I doubt there's any form of healing that might heal her from that. Suigetsu can slice her into pieces without any problems.


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## Bansai (Aug 27, 2013)

NarutoX28 said:


> Yeah, ok. There's so much bs in that comment.
> 
> You basically implied she can repeatedly heal herself which isn't true at all. She doesn't have the Uzumaki clan's stamina if she gets worn out by one Healing Bite which is implied.



As I mentioned in my previous comment, I said that she COULD be stronger and never said that she is definitely stronger. I told you to quote the part where I said that she is without a doubt stronger. 

Oh, and she has no regeneration ability to heal herself?


*Spoiler*: __ 












Jagger said:


> Karin can heal herself, that's good. But she doesn't have any offensive capacity nor anything that might defend her from Juugo attacks. Juugo can easily break her neck and I doubt there's any form of healing that might heal her from that. Suigetsu can slice her into pieces without any problems.



The thing is, nothing confirms that she doesn't have any offensive capacity. We don't know that. I mean she was a warden, and as a warden you should be able to fight when you actually wish to stop the prisoner. 

I mean this page shows Karin defeating a prisoner (or another warden, which is more likely because he wears the same uniform as Karin and all the other wardens and also because the prisoners have different outfits) by herself. She has combat abilities, but we can't put them on a specific level, simply because we've never seen any of them. Considering that she seemed to have used Taijutsu here and tried to use Taijutsu on Danzo, it could be that the only thing she got is Taijutsu when it comes to combat. But whether her combat abilities are bad or not is something no one can know. She might be physically strong enough to defend herself, and she might not be. As of yet, we had no chance to see anything from her. Except for her attack on Danzo, which she performed in a bad condition, as Jugo confirmed that her heal bite rapidly depletes her chakra. And we also don't know whether she can use her Sensor abilities to fight. She can predict movements perfectly. After all, Sasuke asked her to work as his eyes and predict Bee's movements although he was using the Sharingan. I'm neither saying she's strong, nor am I saying that she's weak. I'm saying that this is something simply no one can know and no one can tell. There ARE legit reasons why she didn't join the battles. As Tsunade said, Medics have to constantly hide from their opponents since they're the last ones to die. That should go especially for Karin as she needs a lot of chakra to perform the heal bite. If she got injured during a fight and had to regenerate her own body, she'd lose a big amount of chakra she'd actually need for healing Sasuke. How strong she is is something we simply don't know, so telling she's the weakest of all is all but fair. She really might be a good combatant considering that she can regenerate and predict movements. And she might as well be a bad one. Even if Kishimoto himself mentioned twice that she's among the strongest Kunoichis, I wouldn't even try to convince anyone that she's truly strong, because I'm not Kishimoto. I don't know that. But it's a fact that there's pretty much nothing that proves that she's weak. We have no choice but to wait for her to actually fight in this (which is very unlikely as she already used her heal bite) or wait for the last data book to come out so we can check her physical skills. But until then, whether she's strong or weak remains something no one can know and no one can confirm.


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## sanninme rikudo (Aug 28, 2013)

nagato should be 1


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## sakurakunoichi (Sep 22, 2013)

Itachi wins
Karin dies


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