# Alabasta Luffy vs Mr.1



## Extravlad (Aug 27, 2014)

I made this thread to see how many Zoro haters are gonna deny the fact that Zoro was the only one able to beat Daz Bones at Alabasta.


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## Lawliet (Aug 27, 2014)

Luffy loses. Unless during the fight, he figures a way to beat MR1 just like zoro. Which is possible, but I'm leaning towards luffy loses


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## monkey d ace (Aug 27, 2014)

if anyone has a panel of luffy breaking or atleast denting steel, post them, otherwise the winner is obvious!


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## Dae2 (Aug 27, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> I made this thread to see how many Zoro haters are gonna deny the fact that Zoro was the only one able to beat Daz Bones at Alabasta.




No could damage Mr. 1 during the Straw Hat's adventure at Alabasta except for Zoro once he learned to cut steel, and maybe Nami with her lighting attacks. Only Zoro could beat him. I hope this makes you happy.


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## Haruhifan21 (Aug 27, 2014)

I don't know, man...

I have no idea how in the world Luffy can even beat Mr. 1.

And I understand that many people back then (and likely still now) claim that Luffy would beat Mr. 1... I'm not sure what their logic is, but I am pretty sure it's faulty. It seems it goes along the lines of: "LOLz Zoro beat Mr. 1, so Luffy can too, because he's CAPTAIN and Zoro is First Mate LOLz"

Zoro had to awaken a special power back then just to beat him then, one which was never shown again. Though it is likely to be Haki, it wasn't confirmed, was it? The thing about not cutting the leaf when he swung his sword at it still makes me curious.


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## GreenStache (Aug 27, 2014)

Dae2 said:


> No could damage Mr. 1 during the Straw Hat's adventure at Alabasta except for Zoro once he learned to cut steel, and maybe Nami with her lighting attacks. Only Zoro could beat him.* I hope this makes you happy.*



it wont       .


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## Dae2 (Aug 27, 2014)

rainyrabbit said:


> Zoro had to awaken a special power back then just to beat him then, one which was never shown again. Though it is likely to be Haki, it wasn't confirmed, was it? The thing about not cutting the leaf when he swung his sword at it still makes me curious.




It was probably Haki, but the power Zoro awoke never left him. He could cut steel after the encounter. As for "hearing the breath of the stones" thing, he could probably still do that after Alabasta and prior to training with Mihawk, but like many things attention wasn't called to it.



GreenStache said:


> it wont       .




I know. I feel bad for him/her though.


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## 2Broken (Aug 27, 2014)

Luffy would have lost to Daz Bones and Zoro would have lost to Crocodile.

Even though it is being acknowledged in the OPB less and less how abilities match up in a fight matters.


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## Extravlad (Aug 27, 2014)

> Luffy would have lost to Daz Bones


True.



> Zoro would have lost to Crocodile.


False.


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## Lawliet (Aug 27, 2014)

It's not Haki , it was a technique: nothing more nothing less.


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## GreenStache (Aug 27, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> True.
> 
> 
> False.



^How would Zoro figure to use water or coat his sword in blood to inflict damage? Zoro would not have beaten Croc just as Luffy wouldn't beaten Mr.1


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## Wayne With The Ism (Aug 27, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> True.
> 
> 
> False.




How is Zoro going to beat Croc?


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## Extravlad (Aug 27, 2014)

Zoro would have lost the 1st fight just like Luffy..
But the second one would have been easy, Zoro is smarter than Luffy, so he would have figured out how to counter Croc's DF with water.


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## Suit (Aug 27, 2014)

Luffy > Zoro.

Zoro > Daz Bones.

Luffy > Daz Bones.

Pretty simple logic.


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## Extravlad (Aug 27, 2014)

Well not if you're wrong from the start.
Zoro = Luffy at alabasta this is canon and impossible to deny


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## Suit (Aug 27, 2014)

Zoro can't be as strong as Luffy. Luffy is the captain.


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## Haruhifan21 (Aug 27, 2014)

Roo said:


> Luffy > Zoro.
> 
> Zoro > Daz Bones.
> 
> ...





Extravlad said:


> Well not if you're wrong from the start.
> Zoro = Luffy at alabasta this is canon and impossible to deny



To me it's not exactly the premises that are wrong.

You argue the A>B, B>C, A>C idea and assume that there are no other circumstances that matter, without recognizing that you are claiming statements in a limited perspective.

Example of idea that are faulty:
- "If you keep walking in one direction, there is no way you can return back to the same location. Pretty simple logic." (Simple logic? You think you are being right and call it simple logic. It would be right if you are only talking about a 2D planar geometry. But this idea fails if you are walking on a perfect sphere)

To the actual example of A>B, B>C, A>C. I could argue that this is wrong if you talk about rock, paper, scissors.


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## Imagine (Aug 27, 2014)

Why are you guys taking this bait?


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## Lawliet (Aug 27, 2014)

> Luffy > Zoro.
> 
> Zoro > Daz Bones.
> 
> ...


No.. Just no.


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## Haruhifan21 (Aug 27, 2014)

Imagine said:


> Why are you guys taking this bait?



Because this is just but one example of the many types of shortcomings in logic that I often see in discussions.


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## Imagine (Aug 27, 2014)

Don't waste your time mang.


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## Suit (Aug 27, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> No.. Just no.



Well? What part is wrong?


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## Suit (Aug 27, 2014)

Getting absolutely serious, why would it be crazy to assume that Luffy couldn't blitz Bones so that the latter wouldn't have time to activate his DF? His body parts aren't blades by nature; he has a human form.


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## Lawliet (Aug 27, 2014)

The Luffy > Daz just because Luffy > Zoro
It's not as simple logic as you make it sound to be. There are things called match ups, and they do matter in battles.

For example. Lucci > Sky island Luffy. 
Sky Island Luffy > Enel
Enel > Lucci

Unless you think Lucci beats Enel, that's another story and a whole different discussion. But for the sake of the argument, if you do think Lucci > Enel, just think of any character that could beat sky island Luffy but would still lose to Enel, Pretty sure there's a bunch of them.



> Getting absolutely serious, why would it be crazy to assume that Luffy couldn't blitz Bones so that the latter wouldn't have time to activate his DF? His body parts aren't blades by nature; he has a human form.


If my memory servers me right. Zoro did blitz Mr 1 couple times, yet it was useless. His entire body was steel the entire fight. What needed to be activated is making blades.


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## Suit (Aug 27, 2014)

Yeah, yeah, I know. I made a serious post. Respond to that one.


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## Lawliet (Aug 27, 2014)

Already did.


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## Suit (Aug 27, 2014)

Nice edit. 

Anyway, I do believe Luffy can hurt steel though. Not easily, but just an arc later, he _did_ flail around a 75,000 lb golden sphere like a paddle-ball.


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## PirateHunter Eddy (Aug 27, 2014)

This is a tough one Luffy might be able to win this.  If Luffy could apply enough force to cause Daz bones steel body some serious damage and if he keeps that up then he should be able to win High or very high Diff but if his Phyisical attacks arent strong enough to dent Daz enough to bring him down the Daz bones should win extreme diff


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## Patrick (Aug 27, 2014)

Just as Extravlad's posts were finally going up in quality, he does this


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## Sayonara (Aug 27, 2014)

Luffys is pretty smart when it comes to fighting but I dont think it would be enough to win this fight though, at least on first encounter anyway.


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## Sanji (Aug 27, 2014)

patrick4life said:


> Just as Extravlad's posts were finally going up in quality



Impossibru


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## Ruse (Aug 27, 2014)

Luffy would've lost to Mr.1 

Zoro would've lost to Croc that is all.


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## Patrick (Aug 27, 2014)

CaveLemon said:


> Impossibru



No really Lemon. He had some very decent posts that didn't wank Zoro or Mihawk. I was just as surprised as you are.


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## Extravlad (Aug 27, 2014)

If Luffy managed to kick Croc's ass Zoro could have done the same because Luffy = Zoro.
MR.1 would beat Luffy because of a DF advantage.


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## Chrollo Lucilfer (Aug 27, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> If Luffy managed to kick Croc's ass Zoro could have done the same because Luffy = Zoro.
> MR.1 would beat Luffy because of a DF advantage.



So... tell me.. would Zoro cut his flesh all the time for him to be able to touch croc?


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## Firo (Aug 27, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> If Luffy managed to kick Croc's ass Zoro could have done the same because Luffy = Zoro.
> MR.1 would beat Luffy because of a DF advantage.



> Doesnt  get that Luffy only won  because of plot
> Ignores the fact that Luffy touching croc with water was done out of pure luck.
Zoro doesnt  have access to water nor does he know how to tag Croc. He gets one shotted.
Nothing to debate here so.. Im out.


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## Chrollo Lucilfer (Aug 27, 2014)

Red Hood said:


> > Doesnt  get that Luffy only won  because of plot
> > Ignores the fact that Luffy touching croc with water was done out of pure luck.
> Zoro doesnt  have access to water nor does he know how to tag Croc. He gets one shotted.



Lets just say Zoro got lucky as well. Just like Luffy's barrel of water Crocodile would destroy whatever water Zoro uses. So after that will Zoro keep cutting a part of his body to get some liquid on his swords? Cuz i remember Luffy bleeding from his fists


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## Kaiser (Aug 27, 2014)

Why does it even matter? People don't understand the importance of match-up difference? Usopp was the only one capable to defeat Perona in Thriller Bark


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## Firo (Aug 27, 2014)

Chrollo Lucilfer said:


> Lets just say Zoro got lucky as well. Just like Luffy's barrel of water Crocodile would destroy whatever water Zoro uses. So after that will Zoro keep cutting a part of his body to get some liquid on his swords? Cuz i remember Luffy bleeding from his fists



It wouldnt matter. Croc was still capable of beating Luffy with him knowing his weakness as showed.
But oh well, this is off topic and Extrabland is just trying to use a round about manner to claim Zoro is stronger than Luffy.


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## Extravlad (Aug 27, 2014)

> > Doesnt get that Luffy only won because of plot


Bullshit Luffy won because Croc is a joke once you figure out how to hit him.



> > Ignores the fact that Luffy touching croc with water was done out of pure luck.


Zoro in Luffy's shoes would have defeated Crocodile



> Lets just say Zoro got lucky as well. Just like Luffy's barrel of water Crocodile would destroy whatever water Zoro uses. So after that will Zoro keep cutting a part of his body to get some liquid on his swords? Cuz i remember Luffy bleeding from his fists


With wet swords Zoro can beat Croc.


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## Firo (Aug 27, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> Zoro in Luffy's shoes would have defeated Crocodile


> Basically admits that it was due to plot


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## Jet Pistol (Aug 27, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> Bullshit Luffy won because Croc is a joke once you figure out how to hit him.



Explains how Luffy still got stomped once Croc got serious in round 2 and would have died from poison in round 3.



> Zoro in Luffy's shoes would have defeated Crocodile



Nope




> With wet swords Zoro can beat Croc.



The water will fly off Zoro's swords the minute he swings.


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## Sanji (Aug 27, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> Bullshit Luffy won because Croc is a joke once you figure out how to hit him.


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## Suit (Aug 27, 2014)

The thread is about Luffy and Mr. 1. Not about Zoro vs Crocodile. Fuck, Extravlad, can't you do anything right without turning something into a Zoro thread?

Luffy blitzes Daz Bones and uses the strength it takes in casually carrying around a 75,000 lb golden ball to smash the steel body. Game set, match.


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## TheWiggian (Aug 27, 2014)

Luffy isn't winning this without gear3 /thread.


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## Sanji (Aug 27, 2014)

TheWiggian said:


> Luffy isn't winning this without gear3 /thread.



Hehehehhahahahahehahhhahshashasdah dahsdasd h.

No.


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## Suit (Aug 27, 2014)

TheWiggian said:


> Luffy isn't winning this without gear3 /thread.



Luffy goes G3, Daz Bones pops his arm like a balloon. Zehahahahahahahaha


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## DavyChan (Aug 27, 2014)

This is kind of dumb. I like you extralvad and from what people have been saying Luffy probably wouldn't be able to beat Daz Boned. But Zoro definitely wouldn't have beaten Crocodile as 2Broken and EnyawNehc have stated previously. Also on the premises of Zoro being smarter than Luffy, Luffy can at least go one direction and stay in that direction unlike stupid Zoro in Dressrosa (and don't say it was comic relief because he acts dumb all the time). I will give it to you that they are about equally stupid. Just in different ways.


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## Rob (Aug 27, 2014)

Zoro was just a better match-up. 

Doesn't change the obvious fact that Luffy > Zoro

Especially during EL


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## DavyChan (Aug 27, 2014)

Jet Pistol said:


> Explains how Luffy still got stomped once Croc got serious in round 2 and would have died from poison in round 3.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Extravlad said:


> If Luffy managed to kick Croc's ass Zoro could have done the same because Luffy = Zoro.
> MR.1 would beat Luffy because of a DF advantage.



Thank you for saying that. Of course wet swords won't work. That's exactly what I was about to post but I found you beat me to it, thanks.

As for Luffy = Zoro. This is where things get stupid. I know this forum likes to make its own little tier lists  and stuff. Yeah that's cute. But we need to understand simple concepts of a book. Luffy is the captain. He is going to be the strongest and he is the main character. Before anyone says anything I'm aware that that doesn't necessarily mean that he would be the strongest because of other stories, but in this one, Luffy is overplayed and Zoro is downplayed and Luffy fights people a lot stronger and Zoro fights people a lot weaker. Zoro hasn't been shown to be as strong as Luffy plot wise, you all just assume such. I can see guessing at the strength of the non M3 because he doesn't play them up in a certain way, (regardless of the fact that he does occasionally classify a weakling trio), but in the M3, plot shows Luffy to be the strongest and Zoro and Sanji to be very close to each other but not on Luffy's level.(ex. Rob Lucci's doriki compared to Kaku & Jyabora's).


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## Hachibi (Aug 27, 2014)

Alabasta Zoro will never beat Crocodile since I doubt the liquid would stay still on the sword when he swing it. Which pretty much let him as unarmed and we all know he's not skilled enough to win.

OT: Alabasta Luffy can't win this. Like people say, Zoro was just a better match-up


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## Wayne With The Ism (Aug 27, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> If Luffy managed to kick Croc's ass Zoro could have done the same because Luffy = Zoro.
> MR.1 would beat Luffy because of a DF advantage.





Wait wait wait wait, so you're saying Zoro can beat Croc because Zoro=Luffy, but Luffy can't beat Mr.1 even tho Zoro beat Mr.1 and Zoro=Luffy. Croc's DF is just as advantageous against Zoro as Mr.1's DF is against Luffy.

I don't think Luffy will have problems dealing with Daz if Baratie Luffy did this. Btw Luffy>Zoro


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## Haruhifan21 (Aug 27, 2014)

EnyawNehc said:


> Wait wait wait wait, so you're saying Zoro can beat Croc because Zoro=Luffy, but Luffy can't beat Mr.1 even tho Zoro beat Mr.1 and Zoro=Luffy. Croc's DF is just as advantageous against Zoro as Mr.1's DF is against Luffy.
> 
> I don't think Luffy will have problems dealing with Daz if Baratie Luffy did this.



It's a bit different for Daz.

If Luffy tried that, his hands/arms would be cut off.


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## Suit (Aug 27, 2014)

rainyrabbit said:


> It's a bit different for Daz.
> 
> If Luffy tried that, his hands/arms would be cut off.



Not if Luffy blitzes him though.


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## November (Aug 27, 2014)

Roo said:


> Nice edit.
> 
> Anyway, I do believe Luffy can hurt steel though. Not easily, but just an arc later, he _did_ flail around a 75,000 lb golden sphere like a paddle-ball.



Pretty sure that the golden ball weighs way more than 75000 lb m8


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## Suit (Aug 27, 2014)

November said:


> Pretty sure that the golden ball weighs way more than 75000 lb m8



I did the calculations, believe me, I know what I'm doing. I assumed a .75 meter radius I think. Take that how you will.


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## TheWiggian (Aug 27, 2014)

CaveLemon said:


> Hehehehhahahahahehahhhahshashasdah dahsdasd h.
> 
> No.



u can laugh as much as u want, it doesnt change anything.


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## HaxHax (Aug 27, 2014)

Love these guys who think that Katanas are in any way shape or form a good weapon of choice against heavy armor.



Zoro may not be able to hurt Daz Bones without a magical 1-off plot attack, but Luffy would have been putting the hurt on him from the get go.

This effect is demonstrated by Sanji, who was able to kick through Jyabura's tekkai with basic kicks, while Zoro struggled to even scratch Kaku.

Kaku, whose strength was measured to be practically identical to Jyabura's. But Jyabura was also said to have the greatest tekkai mastery among the CP9 members.



Don't overexert your wrists, boys.


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## IchijiNijiSanji (Aug 27, 2014)

Blunt force would actually work better against Daz bones than trying to cut it.

Luffy wins, but he does have a disadvantage because extending his limbs would make him more prone to getting cut.. It'd be an interesting fight nonetheless.


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## Tenma (Aug 27, 2014)

In terms of physical acumen, Luffy>Crocodie>>Daz Bones. Daz Bones having an ability advantage won't help him here.


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## Lycka (Aug 27, 2014)

Luffy loses.


And zoro would beat crocodile, that's not debatable.


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## Sanji (Aug 28, 2014)

Another one joins the ranks.

Where did you come from?


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## barreltheif (Aug 28, 2014)

Mr. 1 beats Luffy and Crocodile beats Zoro.


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## Suit (Aug 28, 2014)

barreltheif said:


> Mr. 1 beats Luffy and Crocodile beats Zoro.



The latter statement, while true, is irrelevant and holds no bearing on Luffy vs Mr. 1. Care to explain why you think Luffy loses?


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## November (Aug 28, 2014)

Roo said:


> I did the calculations, believe me, I know what I'm doing. I assumed a .75 meter radius I think. Take that how you will.


Wow
Ar u a wizard


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## Chrollo Lucilfer (Aug 28, 2014)

November said:


> Wow
> Ar u a wizard



His custom title clearly says 'Chief of knowledge'


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## Bansai (Aug 29, 2014)

Daz Bones is a tough opponent for Luffy. Luffy may be immune to hitting, but not cutting, so Daz doesn't need Haki here at all. I also highly doubt that this version of Luffy would be able to really injure Daz. He didn't have Gear Second back then and Daz Bone's body is as solid as steel. Plus trying to block Daz's attacks would be suicide for Luffy. Daz wins for sure.


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