# Akainu vs Garp



## Pagn6 (Nov 17, 2020)

Both characters are in their primes.

I often see that many put Akainu above Sengoku (both in their primes). And prime Sengoku has a pretty damn good portrayal (Roger mentioned about bringing Garp or Sengoku, while the marines he had just defeated weren't really worth his time).

Garp portrayal is also obviously amazing and he is often seen as the strongest marine ever.

Both in their primes, who do you think wins? The marine hero, Garp or Sakazuki, the red dog?

Personally, I wouldn't be surprised if Akainu will ultimately be seen as the strongest marine ever, but I know there are a lot of different (even drastically so) opinions on the matter, so I am interested to see what you think.


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## Draco Bolton (Nov 17, 2020)

Garp high-extrem diff

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Bernkastel (Nov 17, 2020)

Garp has portrayal and hype rivaling that of Roger's and WB's...Akainu is strong but he can't beat any of these 3 in their prime.
Garp wins with high diff to very high diff.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Beast (Nov 17, 2020)

With prime Akainu being FV level, I think he can pull off an extreme diff loss.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Lurko (Nov 17, 2020)

Garp.

Reactions: Like 1


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## savior2005 (Nov 17, 2020)

Either way extreme diff. I have these two as the strongest marines. Prime Garp was the past, Akainu is the present, and unfortunately Coby is the future.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3 | Winner 2 | Friendly 1 | GODA 2


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## Vivo Diez (Nov 17, 2020)

Garp. Akainu cleaned up a sickly WB, but prime Garp could probably match prime WB.


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## TheWiggian (Nov 17, 2020)

Garp extreme diffs. Sakazuki probably gets even better feats and portrayal in the final war though.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Corax (Nov 18, 2020)

Depends on definition of prime Akainu. If it is the strongest EOS version he extreme diffs Garp. He should be the strongest even to face EOS Teach/PK Luffy near the end of the manga. If prime is current one he loses very high diff to prime Garp.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Djomla (Nov 18, 2020)

Prime Garp. He is only edged by EoS pirate Jesus and serious Kizaru.


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## CaptainCommander (Nov 18, 2020)

Pagn6 said:


> Both characters are in their primes.


The disrespect Garp gets here . . .  ..

Reactions: Like 2


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## xmysticgohanx (Nov 18, 2020)

Prime Garp wins high diff

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Sherlōck (Nov 20, 2020)

I think Akainu was Prime Sengoku level at MF. But became Prime Garp level after his fight in MF & PH.

So, Current Akainu Vs Prime Garp can go either way extreme difficulty.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## nmwn93 (Nov 21, 2020)

Monkey d Garp. high diff


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## MrPopo (Nov 21, 2020)

Garp


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## Ruse (Nov 21, 2020)

Definitely Garp.


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## Kinjin (Nov 21, 2020)

I personally believe Sakazuki at the time of the final war will be stronger than Prime Garp. Just as Roger and WB will be surpassed by Luffy and Teach a Marine has to surpass the benchmark Garp set.

The only other Marine besides Sakazuki I can see surpassing Garp in his prime is Coby, but that will most likely only happen in the epilogue.

Reactions: Like 6 | Agree 1 | Disagree 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## GucciBandana (Nov 22, 2020)

extreme diffs either way.
Garp is weaker than prime Roger and prime WB, but he's close.
so is current Akainu.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Canute87 (Nov 22, 2020)

Garp is walking away from this with serious injuries.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## TheWiggian (Nov 22, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> extreme diffs either way.
> Garp is weaker than prime Roger and prime WB, but he's close.
> so is current Akainu.



Garp actually got more hype and better portrayal than WB.


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## Strobacaxi (Nov 22, 2020)

Roger, WB, Garp and probably Xebec are the absolute strongest known characters in the story.

Any fight between any of these 4 and any other character is a win for the the big dogs


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## Ruse (Nov 22, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Garp actually got more hype and better portrayal than WB.



You talking about the god valley fight?


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## Ren. (Nov 22, 2020)

Pagn6 said:


> Both characters are in their primes.
> 
> I often see that many put Akainu above Sengoku (both in their primes). And prime Sengoku has a pretty damn good portrayal (Roger mentioned about bringing Garp or Sengoku, while the marines he had just defeated weren't really worth his time).
> 
> ...


Garp high difs.


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## GucciBandana (Nov 23, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Garp actually got more hype and better portrayal than WB.


as long as WB's WSM title stands, Garp can't beat that.


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## Corax (Nov 23, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> as long as WB's WSM title stands, Garp can't beat that.


We still have yet to see full God valley battle. Though I think WB wasn't WSM at that time. But may be Rocks was?Hard to say.


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## Beast (Nov 23, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> as long as WB's WSM title stands, Garp can't beat that.


WB has it while Roger was alive, I dont think it means anything Against Garp.
Unless, you think WB is both stronger and equal to Roger.

Reactions: Like 2


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## TheWiggian (Nov 23, 2020)

Ruse said:


> You talking about the god valley fight?



Not only god valley although the portrayal was clear when Sengoku told us the forces were split in 50%, 1 being Garp and the other Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> as long as WB's WSM title stands, Garp can't beat that.



WB's title means nothing if he wasn't superior to Roger at that time. I take killing Roger multiple times over a single stalemate that was a loot match any day and you should too. If that is no clear indication that Garp is right up there with WB and Roger on top of the other portrayal and hype he received from legendary character's that were all compared to each other, then there is not even a reason to continue the conversation with you, as you clearly are an ignorant reader that shouldn't be taken serious.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Strobacaxi (Nov 23, 2020)

Beast said:


> WB has it while Roger was alive, I dont think it means anything Against Garp.
> Unless, you think WB is both stronger and equal to Roger.


WB was WSM while Roger was alive?


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## TheWiggian (Nov 23, 2020)

Strobacaxi said:


> WB was WSM while Roger was alive?



Yes he established his WSM title before the great pirate age started.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Beast (Nov 23, 2020)

Strobacaxi said:


> WB was WSM while Roger was alive?


It’s kinda Odas pattern to claim someone is the strongest and give them a title but also have an equal/ rival they have never beat or at least not known to (example WB/ Roger, Mihawk/ Shanks and now, Kaidou/ BM), probably gonna have Dragon/ Akainu as well, once he goes from Most wanted to most Dangerous. 

It doesn’t mean much once the person is on their level. Garp is on WBs level and was always, if not above considering GV.

Reactions: Like 3


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## GucciBandana (Nov 24, 2020)

Corax said:


> We still have yet to see full God valley battle. Though I think WB wasn't WSM at that time. But may be Rocks was?Hard to say.



Don't really need to see God Valley Battle, all of Roger, Garp, WB were 40 or younger, way younger than current Akainu/Kaido, they were prob just stepping into top tier territory at the time, doubt they are much stronger than post Wano Luffy and Kidd, so doesn't have much weights on how strong they were after(PK, WSM), Rocks is most likely the strongest individual on that island at the time. WB is the youngest among the 3, he might only be like Yonko VC level or a little higher at the time, I suspect Rocks WB is about as strong we Weevil, since Bukkin met WB then, and Kizaru made a comment about that comparison.



Beast said:


> WB has it while Roger was alive, I dont think it means anything Against Garp.
> Unless, you think WB is both stronger and equal to Roger.



WB never had it while Roger was alive in canon, but WB def had it when Garp is alive. Roger = WB > Garp.



TheWiggian said:


> Not only god valley although the portrayal was clear when Sengoku told us the forces were split in 50%, 1 being Garp and the other Roger.
> 
> 
> 
> WB's title means nothing if he wasn't superior to Roger at that time. I take killing Roger multiple times over a single stalemate that was a loot match any day and you should too. If that is no clear indication that Garp is right up there with WB and Roger on top of the other portrayal and hype he received from legendary character's that were all compared to each other, then there is not even a reason to continue the conversation with you, as you clearly are an ignorant reader that shouldn't be taken serious.



Roger and Garp killing each other statement is very vague, while WB vs Roger being a 3 day stalemate was fully drawn in Oden flashback, not once did Garp fight Roger during Oden flashback, which is right before Roger reached the PK status, but WB vs Roger was there.
Buggy clearly stated WB was the only person to stalemate Roger, combined with Oden flashback, Oda is showing the Roger = WB in a different spotlight than Garp and Roger, we don't know the time frame and circumstance that Roger and Garp tried to kill each other, Roger and Garp can not be taken as equals just like Luffy and Smoker can't be taken as equals, but Roger and WB can.
Then you have WB's title directly sits ontop of Garp, Garp might be 3rd strongest ever, but not any higher, below Roger and WB.


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## TheWiggian (Nov 24, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Roger and Garp killing each other statement is very vague, while WB vs Roger being a 3 day stalemate was fully drawn in Oden flashback, not once did Garp fight Roger during Oden flashback, which is right before Roger reached the PK status, but WB vs Roger was there.



WB vs Roger was an off-paneled loot match. 



GucciBandana said:


> Buggy clearly stated WB was the only person to stalemate Roger,



He also said pirate which doesn't cover the navy.



GucciBandana said:


> combined with Oden flashback, Oda is showing the Roger = WB in a different spotlight than Garp and Roger,



And we have a clear statement in the FB where Roger asks the navy fodder for Garp or Sengoku.



GucciBandana said:


> we don't know the time frame and circumstance that Roger and Garp tried to kill each other,



Except we do, since the moment they met and up till the very end.



GucciBandana said:


> Roger and Garp can not be taken as equals just like Luffy and Smoker can't be taken as equals, but Roger and WB can.



Doesn't make sense. Also WB was the WSM during Roger's time.



GucciBandana said:


> Then you have WB's title directly sits ontop of Garp, Garp might be 3rd strongest ever, but not any higher, below Roger and WB.



Which is wrong. Nearly killing Roger multiple times >>> a single loot match. Enjoy your day.


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## GucciBandana (Nov 24, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> WB vs Roger was an off-paneled loot match.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



WB vs Roger has off panel parts, but still way more on panel than Garp vs Roger.

Buggy never specifically mentioned the only pirate to stalemate Roger, he said something among the "only individual", which covers Garp, and mentioned WB being WSP.

yeah there's that statement, Garp and Sengoku are clearly both very close to Roger and WB, nobody is denying that.

name me one instance of where we know exactly when and how Garp fought Roger.

WB was never mentioned as WSM during Roger's time, but he's both WSM and WSP after Roger.

So Smoker > Kidd I guess?

WB has an era named after him, Garp himself called WB "ruler of the sea".


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## TheWiggian (Nov 24, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> WB vs Roger has off panel parts, but still way more on panel than Garp vs Roger.



They had a single clash on panel and that's it.



GucciBandana said:


> Buggy never specifically mentioned the only pirate to stalemate Roger, he said something among the "only individual", which covers Garp, and mentioned WB being WSP.




*Spoiler*: __ 













All 3 translations cover him as a pirate. 



GucciBandana said:


> yeah there's that statement, Garp and Sengoku are clearly both very close to Roger and WB, nobody is denying that.
> 
> name me one instance of where we know exactly when and how Garp fought Roger.



He fought him throughout the whole career, which covers everything from them meeting to the point of Roger surrendering.



GucciBandana said:


> WB was never mentioned as WSM during Roger's time, but he's both WSM and WSP after Roger.



But he couldn't prove to be > Roger based on the WSM title, why would it cover Garp who nearly killed Roger multiple times? And WSP doesn't include the navy.



GucciBandana said:


> So Smoker > Kidd I guess?



What does Kid have to do with anything here?



GucciBandana said:


> WB has an era named after him, Garp himself called WB "ruler of the sea".



So? Was Garp a pirate to have the pirate era called after him? Did he rule over islands? These 2 statements give WB no leverage over Garp who is a navy VA's, based on the freedom of the title, Garp's view is similiar to Luffy's.


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## Strobacaxi (Nov 24, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Buggy never specifically mentioned the only pirate to stalemate Roger, he said something among the "only individual", which covers Garp, and mentioned WB being WSP.


Buggy was wrong. We know for a fact from Roger's conversation with Garp that they almost killed eachother countless times.



GucciBandana said:


> WB was never mentioned as WSM during Roger's time, but he's both WSM and WSP after Roger.


According to the data book he was WSM during Roger's time. Despite not being WSM

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Beast (Nov 25, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Don't really need to see God Valley Battle, all of Roger, Garp, WB were 40 or younger, way younger than current Akainu/Kaido, they were prob just stepping into top tier territory at the time, doubt they are much stronger than post Wano Luffy and Kidd, so doesn't have much weights on how strong they were after(PK, WSM), Rocks is most likely the strongest individual on that island at the time. WB is the youngest among the 3, he might only be like Yonko VC level or a little higher at the time, I suspect Rocks WB is about as strong we Weevil, since Bukkin met WB then, and Kizaru made a comment about that comparison.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That’s a big big lie, Roger was already a world renown pirate. Rox was the strongest and most dangerous pirate crew but yeah, you go with luffy level.

Yeah, even more lies. Wiggian already posted the VC confirming that WB had it before Roger died but good try.


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## Lord Melkor (Nov 28, 2020)

Betting on Garp, one who was implied to be at similar level as Roger and WB.


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## Datassassin (Nov 28, 2020)

Prime Garp would be in no danger of being heavily injured from fighting Akainu, it'd be that sort of gap. Akainu was weaker than an utter shadow of WB's former self (marginally, since WB was dealt a long-term fatal blow). I don't imagine Prime Garp to be so much weaker than Prime WB/Roger that a character on Akainu's level has any shot here at all. It's unclear exactly where Garp peaked at, since at some point Roger just kept getting better and only had WB regarded as his equal, but the vibe was that Prime Garp was still very much competitive.

Akainu gets all his bones broken.

Reactions: Like 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## GucciBandana (Nov 30, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> They had a single clash on panel and that's it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



still more than what Garp and Roger had, plus the specific narration saying they fought for 3 days.

WB is a pirate... what does him being a pirate have anything to do with the tying Roger statement? Buggy clearly said the only "one" to tie Roger, which describes all. 

I'm pretty sure "covers everything" is your head canon. Even if it covers everything, combined with Buggy's statement, it can be taken as Roger and Garp fought many times, wounding each other severely, but Roger won everytime.

Doesn't WB need to be WSM while Roger was there first, to see if it covers Roger? but it was never stated. WSP include Roger though, but again... not relevant, because WB was never stated as WSM nor WSP during Roger era.

Kid has as much to do with this as Smoker, Kid portrayed as nearly Luffy's equal as a pirate, while Smoker cornered Luffy multiple times, switch Kid to Katakuri pretty sure not much difference at this point of the story, so is Smoker stronger than Katakuri currently?

Where did you get "pirate era" from? no rule saying only pirate can be era names, fact is WB has an era after him, so will Luffy, but not Garp.




Strobacaxi said:


> Buggy was wrong. We know for a fact from Roger's conversation with Garp that they almost killed eachother countless times.
> 
> 
> According to the data book he was WSM during Roger's time. Despite not being WSM



Buggy wasn't wrong, I'm sure his information holds more weight than something coming from the fandom. Buggy's statement was proven right in the Oden flashback. Nearly killing each other doesn't mean a tie, just means a close match, plus we have no idea when those fights took place.

I'm talking about the manga canon, straight from Oda, which is only manga content and SBS.



Beast said:


> That’s a big big lie, Roger was already a world renown pirate. Rox was the strongest and most dangerous pirate crew but yeah, you go with luffy level.
> 
> Yeah, even more lies. Wiggian already posted the VC confirming that WB had it before Roger died but good try.



Luffy is world's renown pirate too... 5th emperor. And Kaido is supposedly WSC, so... isn't that like a perfect match?

no WB was never WSM nor WSP while Roger was alive in canon.


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## Beast (Nov 30, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Luffy is world's renown pirate too... 5th emperor. And Kaido is supposedly WSC, so... isn't that like a perfect match?
> 
> no WB was never WSM nor WSP while Roger was alive in canon.


Which is a fake title, propaganda by no one else other the Big News Morgan, LMAO maybe pay attention to finer detail. Roger had the title of Great Pirate.
That’s a stretch of the two different scenarios.

Hahaha, you don’t have any idea how canon material works. You only make yourself look idiotic, usually when you’re wrong or make a mistake the best thing to do is own it, don’t dig your hole any deeper then it is.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 1, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> still more than what Garp and Roger had, plus the specific narration saying they fought for 3 days.
> 
> WB is a pirate... what does him being a pirate have anything to do with the tying Roger statement? Buggy clearly said the only "one" to tie Roger, which describes all.
> 
> ...



And Roger himself said Garp almost killed him multiple times. You are too biased here and a waste of time.


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## Sherlōck (Dec 1, 2020)

It's almost 2021 and people are still underestimating Garp.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Alakazam (Dec 1, 2020)

Garp, obviously. He is still weaker than WB though.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 1, 2020)

Beast said:


> Which is a fake title, propaganda by no one else other the Big News Morgan, LMAO maybe pay attention to finer detail. Roger had the title of Great Pirate.
> That’s a stretch of the two different scenarios.
> 
> Hahaha, you don’t have any idea how canon material works. You only make yourself look idiotic, usually when you’re wrong or make a mistake the best thing to do is own it, don’t dig your hole any deeper then it is.



you said well renowned, Luffy is a [Blocked Domain] SN and an emperor, that's more than enough to be "well renowned".

Roger was named a Great Pirate in the Oden flashback, which took place way after Rocks fight. And age and experience aside, Luffy has been a Great Pirate, Croc was referred as a Great Pirate.

okay tell me when did the source ever said WB was WSM or WSP during Roger era then, if you can't provide evidence, then the one making himself/herself look idiotic, clearly isn't me.



TheWiggian said:


> And Roger himself said Garp almost killed him multiple times. You are too biased here and a waste of time.



and what exactly does that mean? how does almost kill each other translate to Garp > WB? Did Akainu and Aokiji not nearly kill each other? Did Luffy not nearly die from a poison fish? I can even argue Caesar almost killed Luffy. Biased towards? The 2 confirmed gold medalist that's throne holder level?


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## Beast (Dec 1, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> you said well renowned, Luffy is a [Blocked Domain] SN and an emperor, that's more than enough to be "well renowned".
> 
> Roger was named a Great Pirate in the Oden flashback, when he met WB, which took place way after Rocks fight. And age and experience aside, Luffy has been a Great Pirate, Croc was referred as a Great Pirate.
> 
> ...


Luffy is not an emperor/ 5th yonko. And I corrected myself, but you haven’t done the same.

Roger was shown with the great pirate Title at the start of Odens FB, when he met WB. It was only a few year difference WB had only just started building his crew. Croc not Luffy have been introduced with great pirate title box, only Yonko level guys have WB, BM, Roger etc.

it was given to you literally a page ago, it was in the VC, yet you refused for believe it. Not my problem.

you saying that isn’t the same as Roger the Pk himself saying it. Rather believe Roger then yourself.
Garp has never arrested pirate we know of but people expect him to arrest Roger, his rival lmao. Garp 1HKO’d DCJ and still didn’t arrest him, best Rox and still Everyone but Rox as far as we know left the island.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 1, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> you said well renowned, Luffy is a [Blocked Domain] SN and an emperor, that's more than enough to be "well renowned".
> 
> Roger was named a Great Pirate in the Oden flashback, which took place way after Rocks fight. And age and experience aside, Luffy has been a Great Pirate, Croc was referred as a Great Pirate.
> 
> ...



It doesn't translate to Garp being > WB, it's virtually just better hype and portrayal than a single loot match that ended in a stalemate with Roger.

I got all 3 of them as equal. You should start reading properly.

Reactions: Like 1


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## GucciBandana (Dec 4, 2020)

Beast said:


> Luffy is not an emperor/ 5th yonko. And I corrected myself, but you haven’t done the same.
> 
> Roger was shown with the great pirate Title at the start of Odens FB, when he met WB. It was only a few year difference WB had only just started building his crew. Croc not Luffy have been introduced with great pirate title box, only Yonko level guys have WB, BM, Roger etc.
> 
> ...



except Luffy was published as the 5th emperor on the newspaper.

Roger's title was years after God Valley battle... funny how you doubt Luffy's 5th emperor but uses Roger's title years after the fight as evidence?

Why does it have to be in the title box? Smoker fully called Croc a great pirate, it is pretty clear all Shichibukais are considered Great Pirates, they are shown specifically in the Roger execution scene, and their era is called "the Great Pirate Era", duh.

not in the manga or SBS, so not from the source, why would it matter?

I believe Oda, Oda tells me WB is WSM, then he is. And Oda told me, Garp didn't arrest Roger, Roger turned himself in.



TheWiggian said:


> It doesn't translate to Garp being > WB, it's virtually just better hype and portrayal than a single loot match that ended in a stalemate with Roger.
> 
> I got all 3 of them as equal. You should start reading properly.



except Garp is a man, so how can he be = WSM? it's not better "portrayal" when the other guy's portrayal sits directly above him. Garp is closer to Sengoku than he is to Roger/WB, might as well make the 4 of them equal then.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 4, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> except Garp is a man, so how can he be = WSM? it's not better "portrayal" when the other guy's portrayal sits directly above him. Garp is closer to Sengoku than he is to Roger/WB, might as well make the 4 of them equal then.



Roger is also a man and WB never beat him so it doesn't auto confirm WB is above another equal of the PK. Sengoku never received the hype of Garp, he is the next best thing to Garp just like the Dark King is to Roger though.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 5, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Roger is also a man and WB never beat him so it doesn't auto confirm WB is above another equal of the PK. Sengoku never received the hype of Garp, he is the next best thing to Garp just like the Dark King is to Roger though.



again, in the canon manga, never was WB called WSM during Roger era. It only confirmed WB > other Yonko, Admirals, Garp and Sengoku.

Roger clearly mentioned Garp and Sengoku in the same breath, so did WB, talking about Sengoku and Garp in the same legend statement as Roger. Sengoku does not rank below Garp like Rayleigh to Roger, if anything they are more like Roger and WB, like both Roger and WB were suggesting.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 5, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> again, in the canon manga, never was WB called WSM during Roger era. It only confirmed WB > other Yonko, Admirals, Garp and Sengoku.
> 
> Roger clearly mentioned Garp and Sengoku in the same breath, so did WB, talking about Sengoku and Garp in the same legend statement as Roger. Sengoku does not rank below Garp like Rayleigh to Roger, if anything they are more like Roger and WB, like both Roger and WB were suggesting.



This is absolute denial on your part. Garp was the one who almost murdered him multiple times not Sengoku. You just roll with the statements that you find fitting for your argument to drag down Garp.

Roger = WB as per canon and Buggy's speech (World's Strongest Pirate) = Garp (multiple fights to the death with Roger, Roger had more trust in him than WB or Rayleigh to take care of Ace). Roger = Garp as per god valley incident.

Yea Garp exceeds WB in hype and portrayal, who was by supplementary info WSM since before the great age of pirates.

If you cannot prove WB was not WSM during Roger's time then yeah that's your problem, because there is already an official source that is more accurate than your assumption especially if it doesn't contradict the manga.

Therefore your headcanon is wrong.
Not to mention that Garp aged better than WB.


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## Beast (Dec 5, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> except Luffy was published as the 5th emperor on the newspaper.
> 
> Roger's title was years after God Valley battle... funny how you doubt Luffy's 5th emperor but uses Roger's title years after the fight as evidence?
> 
> ...


Yes by a news paper who Big news Morgan is the head of... a fan boy of Luffys.

luffys title... isn’t a title, is something hard to understand?

Title box is a official, while Smokers words hold no weight and can probably translated to whatever depending on the context of that conversation.


hahaha, VC>>>> your opinions.

Garp also didn’t arrest DCJ... guess DCJ is stronger then him as well.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 5, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> This is absolute denial on your part. Garp was the one who almost murdered him multiple times not Sengoku. You just roll with the statements that you find fitting for your argument to drag down Garp.
> 
> Roger = WB as per canon and Buggy's speech (World's Strongest Pirate) = Garp (multiple fights to the death with Roger, Roger had more trust in him than WB or Rayleigh to take care of Ace). Roger = Garp as per god valley incident.
> 
> ...



How can Sengoku nearly murder Roger multiple times if they didn't fight? that's not saying Aokiji is the one who fought Akainu for 10 days, not Kaido, therefore Kaido is weaker than Aokiji?

How in the world did God Valley translate to Garp = Roger? Where's the logic in that? Just like where's logic of using "trust" to justify Garp is as strong as the strongest man? You can argue that Roger = WB isn't set in stone, since they only fought in 3 days, if they kept fighting who knows what might happen, and Buggy might not know what he's talking about, but you can't argue WSM is not WSM, that's given by Oda... 

Where did you get the "before the great age of pirates" from? nowhere in the canon manga was he ever WSM then.

It is not my assumption, it is called reading the manga, and processing information from the source. WB was not mentioned as WSM during Roger era, therefore he's not by default, common logic, that's like asking me to prove Roger is not pirate king before he became the pirate king??

Not to mention Garp is older than WB, so the law of nature is not in his favor.



Beast said:


> Yes by a news paper who Big news Morgan is the head of... a fan boy of Luffys.
> 
> luffys title... isn’t a title, is something hard to understand?
> 
> ...



Man publishes newspaper, if you think VC >>> my opinion, then Morgans def >>> your opinion.

So please explain to me why Oda links Roger execution pirates like Moriah, Doflamingo, Croc to "Great Pirate Era"?
And lemme take a step back, let's say Croc is not a Great Pirate, so how does that make God Valley Roger stronger than End of Wano Luffy again?

And somebody said Roger is stronger than Garp solely due to the fact Garp didn't arrest him?


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## Sherlōck (Dec 6, 2020)

Shichibukai's *aren't* Great Pirate.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> How can Sengoku nearly murder Roger multiple times if they didn't fight? that's not saying Aokiji is the one who fought Akainu for 10 days, not Kaido, therefore Kaido is weaker than Aokiji?



That was your point. You compared Sengoku to Garp based on Roger's speech but ignored the whole part of Garp being Roger's rival that almost killed him multiple times.



GucciBandana said:


> How in the world did God Valley translate to Garp = Roger? Where's the logic in that?



It's the portrayal they got during the Rocks flashback/Explanation. Wanna deny that too? Roger and Garp been shown in the panel to go up against Rocks crew, obviously split in 50-50.



GucciBandana said:


> Just like where's logic of using "trust" to justify Garp is as strong as the strongest man?



It's simply superior portrayal compared to WB again. Garp was the bigger enemy that they had death battles together and yet he was the one that received the trust for the child instead of WB or even Roger's own partner and VC Rayleigh.



GucciBandana said:


> You can argue that Roger = WB isn't set in stone, since they only fought in 3 days, if they kept fighting who knows what might happen, and Buggy might not know what he's talking about, but you can't argue WSM is not WSM, that's given by Oda...



Buggy already has proven Roger and WB had a stalemate and it was confirmed to be the loot match we saw. And once again we know from another source WB was WSM before the great age of pirates so that gives WB no leverage over Roger or Garp, who is his equal.




GucciBandana said:


> Where did you get the "before the great age of pirates" from? nowhere in the canon manga was he ever WSM then.



It's supplementary info by the Vivre card and unless you prove with the manga he was not WSM back then that Vivre card > You In credibility.



GucciBandana said:


> It is not my assumption, it is called reading the manga, and processing information from the source. WB was not mentioned as WSM during Roger era, therefore he's not by default, common logic, that's like asking me to prove Roger is not pirate king before he became the pirate king??



So you can't prove WB was not WSM back then while we already have a source telling us he was. Case closed.



GucciBandana said:


> Not to mention Garp is older than WB, so the law of nature is not in his favor.



Manga disagrees. Garp was not the one who couldn't use Haki or shown to be weakened the same way WB was. Therefore despite being older he aged much better and was not bound to medical equipment.


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> How can Sengoku nearly murder Roger multiple times if they didn't fight? that's not saying Aokiji is the one who fought Akainu for 10 days, not Kaido, therefore Kaido is weaker than Aokiji?
> 
> How in the world did God Valley translate to Garp = Roger? Where's the logic in that? Just like where's logic of using "trust" to justify Garp is as strong as the strongest man? You can argue that Roger = WB isn't set in stone, since they only fought in 3 days, if they kept fighting who knows what might happen, and Buggy might not know what he's talking about, but you can't argue WSM is not WSM, that's given by Oda...
> 
> ...


You’re just talking out of your ass tbh.
YOU said WB is stronger then Garp BECAUSE of his title, Wiggian provided evidence that title isn’t a indicator of superiority because Roger, Garps rival and equal, was also equal to WB DESPITE the title, the. You added that Roger is superior to Garp BECAUSE Garp had never arrested him but I corrected you and showed you DCJ who got BEAT by Garp, was not arrested nor anyone we know making your point MUTE. 

You’re in denial of direct evidence, so you do whatever you want with the rest of your time here.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kroczilla (Dec 6, 2020)

Yeah, i am having a hard time seeing how the guy who got bodied by near death, well past his prime WB stands a chance against prime garp.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 6, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> That was your point. You compared Sengoku to Garp based on Roger's speech but ignored the whole part of Garp being Roger's rival that almost killed him multiple times.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That is my whole point, my whole point is, Sengoku and Garp are close, but Sengoku is weaker, just like Garp is close to Roger and WB, but he's weaker, like you ignoring the fact WB is WSM and said the only one fought Roger to a tie.

"Obviously" 50-50 when no detail was shown at all... great logic here, and you are the one saying I have a bias? I'm sure Luffy and Law vs Doflamingo was 50-50 also, since the paper clearly showed them split 50 50?

Yeah sure, bigger enemy, like Shanks was a bigger enemy to Mihawk than Whitebeard, Akainu, or Kaido, what does that have to do with Garp vs WB? WB has a portrayal that sits directly on Garp's head. Plus who's a bigger enemy is completely debatable, since Oda clearly puts more effort and panel time in WB vs Roger than Garp vs Roger, Garp wasn't even shown in Oden flashback, with a more concrete statement from Buggy, but that's beyond the point, irrelevant who's a bigger enemy, like Garp is a marine, wouldn't he be more of an enemy by nature? So strange that when I was talking about Owner of Throne, Name of Era, being marine or not mattered, now all of a sudden it doesn't anymore when determine bigger enemy? Then used as powerscale evidence?

VC is not from Oda, VC has many timeline errors at first, like when Shanks became a Yonko, Inu and Neko's height vs SBS height info, and many many more, because it's not from the source. Both VC and me have 0 credibility in front of the source, Oda. But sure, if you want to go with WB being strongest man during Roger era, and pretend that's Oda's work, then the right conclusion obviously should be WB > Roger and Garp, what is the problem with that?

WB couldn't use Haki at times, not at all times, Sengoku still stated WB has the power to destroy the world, while Garp actually said himself his physical strength seems to be getting weaker. Garp was never seen in a high intensity long lasting battle like WB was, but from how WB and Rayleigh faired against Admirals once the battle drags on, doesn't look good for Garp, consider he was bandaged up multiple places after the war.





Beast said:


> You’re just talking out of your ass tbh.
> YOU said WB is stronger then Garp BECAUSE of his title, Wiggian provided evidence that title isn’t a indicator of superiority because Roger, Garps rival and equal, was also equal to WB DESPITE the title, the. You added that Roger is superior to Garp BECAUSE Garp had never arrested him but I corrected you and showed you DCJ who got BEAT by Garp, was not arrested nor anyone we know making your point MUTE.
> 
> You’re in denial of direct evidence, so you do whatever you want with the rest of your time here.



except VC isn't Oda. Okay let's go with WB was WSM during Roger's era then, that just makes WB stronger than Roger and stronger than Garp, any problems there?

I never said Roger was superior because Garp never arrested him, you were the one bringing up people think Garp arrested Roger as some type of odd evidence in the first place... So I'm not sure what you are talking about. My whole point was WB > Garp, so why would arrest or not even matter to me?

You are the one who used Great Pirate that came years after God Valley as evidence, once proven wrong, made your point MUTE...


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## TheWiggian (Dec 7, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> That is my whole point, my whole point is, Sengoku and Garp are close, but Sengoku is weaker, just like Garp is close to Roger and WB, but he's weaker, like you ignoring the fact WB is WSM and said the only one fought Roger to a tie.



It's simple. WB was not stronger than Roger, if he was he would've beaten him and therefore would've been by default above Garp, since he is Roger's equal too.



GucciBandana said:


> "Obviously" 50-50 when no detail was shown at all... great logic here, and you are the one saying I have a bias? I'm sure Luffy and Law vs Doflamingo was 50-50 also, since the paper clearly showed them split 50 50?



With the difference that we clearly saw Luffy contributing more since we had everything on panel.



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah sure, bigger enemy, like Shanks was a bigger enemy to Mihawk than Whitebeard, Akainu, or Kaido, what does that have to do with Garp vs WB? WB has a portrayal that sits directly on Garp's head. Plus who's a bigger enemy is completely debatable, since Oda clearly puts more effort and panel time in WB vs Roger than Garp vs Roger, Garp wasn't even shown in Oden flashback, with a more concrete statement from Buggy, but that's beyond the point, irrelevant who's a bigger enemy, like Garp is a marine, wouldn't he be more of an enemy by nature? So strange that when I was talking about Owner of Throne, Name of Era, being marine or not mattered, now all of a sudden it doesn't anymore when determine bigger enemy? Then used as powerscale evidence?



Really simple again: Marines = main enemies of pirates > friendly pirate rivalry.



GucciBandana said:


> VC is not from Oda, VC has many timeline errors at first, like when Shanks became a Yonko, Inu and Neko's height vs SBS height info, and many many more, because it's not from the source. Both VC and me have 0 credibility in front of the source, Oda. But sure, if you want to go with WB being strongest man during Roger era, and pretend that's Oda's work, then the right conclusion obviously should be WB > Roger and Garp, what is the problem with that?



VC > your assumption and no WB was not > Roger since he never beat him but only managed to push it to a tie.



GucciBandana said:


> WB couldn't use Haki at times, not at all times, Sengoku still stated WB has the power to destroy the world, while Garp actually said himself his physical strength seems to be getting weaker. Garp was never seen in a high intensity long lasting battle like WB was, but from how WB and Rayleigh faired against Admirals once the battle drags on, doesn't look good for Garp, consider he was bandaged up multiple places after the war.



Garp was healthy and was never shown to have trouble with utilizing Haki unlike WB. Sugarcoat it all you want but Garp aged better.


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## Beast (Dec 7, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> except VC isn't Oda. Okay let's go with WB was WSM during Roger's era then, that just makes WB stronger than Roger and stronger than Garp, any problems there?
> 
> I never said Roger was superior because Garp never arrested him, you were the one bringing up people think Garp arrested Roger as some type of odd evidence in the first place... So I'm not sure what you are talking about. My whole point was WB > Garp, so why would arrest or not even matter to me?
> 
> You are the one who used Great Pirate that came years after God Valley as evidence, once proven wrong, made your point MUTE...


Except it is, so what evidence do you have to say otherwise?
Except that’s wrong because WB is not and never was stronger then Roger. He got the title despite having equals, that is the point.

So, you’re just lying now?
You go and show us on post that says Because ‘Garp arrested Roger, he is stronger then him’ go on, we can all wait, you’re a blatant liar, despite being wrong and just simply just conceding, you just keep making shit up or just ignoring Blatant evidence.

YOU said Roger and the rest were current luffy level AND luffy/ Croc were considered great purates... so show us the evidence. I’ve already mentioned when and where Roger had his BOX title and not Captain Morgan’s news paper.

It’s cool, you’re a lair, you ignore blatant evidence, you make things up. I will remember it and that’s it. Anyone can go back and read the thread about your stupidity, I ain’t got anymore time for this shit.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 7, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> It's simple. WB was not stronger than Roger, if he was he would've beaten him and therefore would've been by default above Garp, since he is Roger's equal too.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



What does WB beating Roger or not, have to do with him being stronger? Did Roger beat Sengoku? Did WB beat Sengoku? Did Garp beat Sengoku? yet you have all of them being stronger than Sengoku I assume?

Yeah and you ASSUMING Garp contributed as much as Roger based off one panel? Be real, in the story so far, which character from the same generation ever contributes as much as the future Pirate King, when teaming up?

Sure, Garp is bigger enemy, but what does that have to do with Garp being stronger than WB? Smoker is a bigger enemy to Luffy than Law, but Smoker got mid diffed by Law.

We are going with VC info now aren't we? If we, please tell me why is it not "Roger managed to push WB to a tie?" Clearly WSM > men.

But Garp fully said he got weaker physically... Sengoku fully called stabbed old WB WSM. I guess Sengoku's opinion > yours?



Beast said:


> Except it is, so what evidence do you have to say otherwise?
> Except that’s wrong because WB is not and never was stronger then Roger. He got the title despite having equals, that is the point.
> 
> So, you’re just lying now?
> ...



Go read how VC was written, Oda contributed, but not the author, read it yourself.
If WB is WSM during Roger's era, then he is indeed stronger than Roger.

What are you talking about? You are the one mentioned arresting between Garp and Roger first between the 2 of us? were you not?

I showed you how Croc was a Great Pirate, fully stated by Smoker, yet you think you know what a Great Pirate is better than Smoker? And I showed you Oda's intention of showing pirates including Shichibukai while mentioning "Great Pirate Era", I guess you know what a Great Pirate better than Oda?

Does Roger's info box have more weight than Smoker's statement? Indeed, but irrelevant in Gods Valley, cuz that's years before, give Luffy this time gap, he'd prob be PK already, not just a "Great Pirate".


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## TheWiggian (Dec 7, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> What does WB beating Roger or not, have to do with him being stronger? Did Roger beat Sengoku? Did WB beat Sengoku? Did Garp beat Sengoku? yet you have all of them being stronger than Sengoku I assume?



WB's best accomplishment against Roger is a tie so he is not stronger than him, there's no point in talking about it. His title doesn't give him any leverage knowing that fact.



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah and you ASSUMING Garp contributed as much as Roger based off one panel? Be real, in the story so far, which character from the same generation ever contributes as much as the future Pirate King, when teaming up?



Iam real enough to give both equal props for destroying Rocks since only they been shown. No need to overcomplicate things.



GucciBandana said:


> Sure, Garp is bigger enemy, but what does that have to do with Garp being stronger than WB? Smoker is a bigger enemy to Luffy than Law, but Smoker got mid diffed by Law.



You seem kinda demented if you can't follow the conversation at this point. 



GucciBandana said:


> We are going with VC info now aren't we? If we, please tell me why is it not "Roger managed to push WB to a tie?" Clearly WSM > men.



Nope it's WB who holds the title that is pretty meaningless in face of the PK and his marine rival.



GucciBandana said:


> But Garp fully said he got weaker physically... Sengoku fully called stabbed old WB WSM. I guess Sengoku's opinion > yours?



He got weaker and so did WB, but WB was in an even worse condition as shown clearly on panel. Try again.


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## Nox (Dec 7, 2020)

Kinjin said:


> The only other Marine besides Sakazuki I can see surpassing Garp in his prime is Coby, but that will most likely only happen in the epilogue.

Reactions: GODA 1


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## GucciBandana (Dec 7, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> WB's best accomplishment against Roger is a tie so he is not stronger than him, there's no point in talking about it. His title doesn't give him any leverage knowing that fact.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



In your exact words, only a loot match, and only for 3 days, top tiers can possibly fight for 10 days and determine a winner, why can't one be stronger than another? Just because you don't agree?
Yes his title does, WSM gives him the leverage over any men, during the time he holds the title.

Great job on having your "conclusion" based off no details at all, we can def see who has a bias here now.

Yeah, I'm demented, says the guy who uses "trust" or "bigger enemy" to justify who's stronger.

If we talking about who's "stronger", I'm pretty sure World's "Strongest" Man holds more weight than something like PK and his marine rival? Unless one of them is not a man?

I mean maybe WB was in a worse condition than Garp, compare to their old selves, like prime WB is 100, now WB is 95, while prime Garp is 98, now Garp is 94, minus 5 is worse than minus 4, that is possible. But saying MF Garp stronger than MF WB, hmmm that's like insulting Sengoku. MF WB gets better hype, portrayal and better feats than MF Garp.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 8, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> In your exact words, only a loot match, and only for 3 days, top tiers can possibly fight for 10 days and determine a winner, why can't one be stronger than another? Just because you don't agree?
> Yes his title does, WSM gives him the leverage over any men, during the time he holds the title.



I can only go off from what was shown or stated and by exactly that WB never won against Roger but only pushed him to a tie once. So no his title gives him nothing.



GucciBandana said:


> Great job on having your "conclusion" based off no details at all, we can def see who has a bias here now.
> 
> Yeah, I'm demented, says the guy who uses "trust" or "bigger enemy" to justify who's stronger.



You can dislike it all year, Garp has superior portrayal as in death battles against Roger and enjoying Roger's ultimate trust.



GucciBandana said:


> If we talking about who's "stronger", I'm pretty sure World's "Strongest" Man holds more weight than something like PK and his marine rival? Unless one of them is not a man?



So the WSM's best accomplishment is a tie?  



GucciBandana said:


> I mean maybe WB was in a worse condition than Garp, compare to their old selves, like prime WB is 100, now WB is 95, while prime Garp is 98, now Garp is 94, minus 5 is worse than minus 4, that is possible. But saying MF Garp stronger than MF WB, hmmm that's like insulting Sengoku. MF WB gets better hype, portrayal and better feats than MF Garp.



Never stated MF Garp is stronger than MF WB, I said he aged better and that's an obvious fact. But as already shown before WB's title gives him no leverage over Garp as seen in the past. Not to mention that the WSM fleet was fleeing from the marines in the past.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 9, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> I can only go off from what was shown or stated and by exactly that WB never won against Roger but only pushed him to a tie once. So no his title gives him nothing.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



"or stated", WB is WSM, stated by Oda.

I mean WB was portrayed as WSM, how can a man who's alive during WB WSM era have a higher portrayal? Yeah I give you that ultimate trust, still don't see how it's related logically though.

We don't know what WSM's best accomplishment is, do you know everything WB did throughout his pirate life? Doubt it, neither do I, but I do know Oda calls him WSM, that's his best accomplishment coming from Oda, and that's all I need to know.

Wait, if you think MF Garp is not stronger than MF WB, and Garp aged better, doesn't that mean you think prime WB is stronger than prime Garp? I guess we are on the same page here?
Except that we don't know if the one fleeing from marines is actually WSM, I mean going by your VC logic there's a chance he was, but still not sure because he could get that title after that moment but before Roger died. WB fully stated why he fled, nothing about Garp was mentioned, so I'm not sure why that has anything to do with Garp.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> "or stated", WB is WSM, stated by Oda.
> 
> I mean WB was portrayed as WSM, how can a man who's alive during WB WSM era have a higher portrayal? Yeah I give you that ultimate trust, still don't see how it's related logically though.We don't know what WSM's best accomplishment is, do you know everything WB did throughout his pirate life? Doubt it, neither do I, but I do know Oda calls him WSM, that's his best accomplishment coming from Oda, and that's all I need to know.



In fact we know WB's best accomplishment from Buggy, which was a tie against Roger, which makes them equal and we even give WB the benefit of a doubt because of that.



GucciBandana said:


> Waiit, if you think MF Garp is not stronger than MF WB, and Garp aged better, doesn't that mean you think prime WB is stronger than prime Garp? I guess we are on the same page here?



Nope you weren't reading as i suspected. I said all 3, Roger, WB, Garp were equal. 



GucciBandana said:


> Except that we don't know if the one fleeing from marines is actually WSM, I mean going by your VC logic there's a chance he was, but still not sure because he could get that title after that moment but before Roger died. WB fully stated why he fled, nothing about Garp was mentioned, so I'm not sure why that has anything to do with Garp.



No, WB was WSM is the only source we have currently, so unless the manga directly contradicts it, it will remain that way.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 9, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> In fact we know WB's best accomplishment from Buggy, which was a tie against Roger, which makes them equal and we even give WB the benefit of a doubt because of that.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



So Buggy knows more than Oda(VC in your case) now? By Buggy's statement, WB = Roger > Garp, by VC, WB > Roger ? Garp, pick one.

If WB, Garp were equal in their prime, how can "aged better" Garp not be stronger than "aged worse" WB? This logic doesn't make any sense.

So you think WB was WSM the day he was born?


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> So Buggy knows more than Oda(VC in your case) now? By Buggy's statement, WB = Roger > Garp, by VC, WB > Roger ? Garp, pick one.



Buggy is a manga statement, it doesn't contradict the VC.



GucciBandana said:


> If WB, Garp were equal in their prime, how can "aged better" Garp not be stronger than "aged worse" WB? This logic doesn't make any sense.



Because his DF powers do not deteriorate unlike stats and willpower.



GucciBandana said:


> So you think WB was WSM the day he was born?



You're desperate


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## GucciBandana (Dec 10, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Buggy is a manga statement, it doesn't contradict the VC.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



WSM is an Oda statement, more weight than manga Buggy statement.

So aged better as in not as an overall fighter? but only selected areas? okay then, if you wanna be that specific about what your definition of "aging" is, then I can too, age and illness should be separate, WB aged better physically, since Garp stated he's getting weaker, just Garp was better at not getting sick?

More like your logic of using WB as WSM while we don't know if he was, is pretty desperate.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 11, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> WSM is an Oda statement, more weight than manga Buggy statement.



Buggy's statement is a manga statement and therefore more canon than secondary sources. Note how he also says pirate but we already had that where I linked you 3 different translations and you're still in denial.



GucciBandana said:


> So aged better as in not as an overall fighter? but only selected areas? okay then, if you wanna be that specific about what your definition of "aging" is, then I can too, age and illness should be separate, WB aged better physically, since Garp stated he's getting weaker, just Garp was better at not getting sick?



He didn't. In MF WB already admitted that he is just a man with one heart.
Pretty obvious he regressed, so you're wrong again.



GucciBandana said:


> More like your logic of using WB as WSM while we don't know if he was, is pretty desperate.



We know from the databook lol. You're hellbent on him not having the title so you can deny him having equals despite being the WSM, but as I said previously: canon sources >>> you.


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## muchentuchen (Dec 11, 2020)

I can't take Garp seriously, he's a hype train like his son and grandson. Akainu on the other hand was the star of Marineford. To this day I don't know why Oda wanked him so much but he clearly stood head and shoulders above everyone else, Aokiji and Kizaru were puppies that day. I mean, stopping WB's 2 handed swinging biscento with a simple foot? Taking off half of WB's face with a punch? The first attack he threw was already noted by everyone on the ground and TV spectators as the apocalypse. 
Akainu's barbeque's the Carp and then eats it, easy peazy.

Reactions: Like 1 | Tier Specialist 1 | Dislike 1


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## GucciBandana (Dec 11, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Buggy's statement is a manga statement and therefore more canon than secondary sources. Note how he also says pirate but we already had that where I linked you 3 different translations and you're still in denial.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Of course Buggy's statement > some secondary sources like VC, but not > Oda himself, who said WB is WSM, if you think Buggy's statement contradicts something here, then your secondary source VC has to go, since Buggy can never contradict Oda.
If you read it proper, like how I showed you, Buggy said WB is the only MAN/only ONE to tie Roger, which includes everybody, pirate or not. Buggy calling WB WSP, which called him something he obviously is: a pirate, is not even in the same text bubble.

yeah of course WB aged/regressed, so did Garp, so where did the Garp aging better come from again? How many heart does Garp have?

Didn't I just make all the recent arguments based off the fact WB was WSM during Roger's era? As I stated, Oda > Buggy >>>> you, so either your idea of Roger = WB must go, or your secondary source must go.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 12, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Of course Buggy's statement > some secondary sources like VC, but not > Oda himself, who said WB is WSM, if you think Buggy's statement contradicts something here, then your secondary source VC has to go, since Buggy can never contradict Oda.



It doesn't. Wb was the only pirate to match Roger and was WSM back in the day as confirmed by the VC, once again giving him no leverage over Garp in both cases.



GucciBandana said:


> If you read it proper, like how I showed you, Buggy said WB is the only MAN/only ONE to tie Roger, which includes everybody, pirate or not. Buggy calling WB WSP, which called him something he obviously is: a pirate, is not even in the same text bubble.



Actually he says WB was the only pirate to match Roger as he was the only of them to match the PK once. And on the other hand the multiple death battles as Roger stated outweight that single standstill by Buggy ^^



GucciBandana said:


> yeah of course WB aged/regressed, so did Garp, so where did the Garp aging better come from again? How many heart does Garp have?



Dude you obviously don't get it? Once WB took off his medicine, it quickly went downhill for him, while Garp had none of those issues.



GucciBandana said:


> Didn't I just make all the recent arguments based off the fact WB was WSM during Roger's era? As I stated, Oda > Buggy >>>> you, so either your idea of Roger = WB must go, or your secondary source must go.



Nothing from the VC is contradicted by the manga. Sry for you.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 12, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> It doesn't. Wb was the only pirate to match Roger and was WSM back in the day as confirmed by the VC, once again giving him no leverage over Garp in both cases.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Read again, "only ONE"/"only MAN", that's leverage over Garp already, I don't know why you stay in denial. Oda, Buggy, VC are 3 difference sources.

Garp had no issue because he was barely fighting, once he started fighting the BB pirates with Sengoku, it didn't go that well for him either. If WB went downhill so fast, was MF WB stronger or weaker than MF Garp then?

Exactly, so you should agree on WB > Roger that? Since that's what VC stated, and never really contradicted.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 12, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Read again, "only ONE"/"only MAN", that's leverage over Garp already, I don't know why you stay in denial. Oda, Buggy, VC are 3 difference sources.



The only one (Pirate as narrated further) who fought Roger to a standstill. Which makes sense since he truly is the only pirate that was equal to Roger.


*Spoiler*: __ 











GucciBandana said:


> Garp had no issue because he was barely fighting, once he started fighting the BB pirates with Sengoku, it didn't go that well for him either.



That's not even the point. Garp didn't need life support equipment despite being a few years younger than Garp.



GucciBandana said:


> If WB went downhill so fast, was MF WB stronger or weaker than MF Garp then?



I already answered that question.



GucciBandana said:


> Exactly, so you should agree on WB > Roger that? Since that's what VC stated, and never really contradicted.



Why would i agree on WB > Roger if he could only tie with Roger once? Proving his title has no leverage over Roger or his marine rival.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 12, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> The only one (Pirate as narrated further) who fought Roger to a standstill. Which makes sense since he truly is the only pirate that was equal to Roger.
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...



What are you talking about? The pirate statement is in a completely different sentence, what does that have to do with the Roger standstill sentence? Why would it be further narrated for no reason(or your personal reason)? "legendary monster", "one", "man" non of them specify "pirate".

If you already answered it, as in MF WB = MF Garp, then they aged the same overall, to you. Why would WB being on life support or not matter? I mean WB was on life support, Lao G wasn't, so...??

 Because your logic is flawed? His title gives him leverage over Roger by default, the fact they fought to a tie once in a loot match is the one that holds less weight in this case. Pretty sure you got the priority mixed up.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 12, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> What are you talking about? The pirate statement is in a completely different sentence, what does that have to do with the Roger standstill sentence? Why would it be further narrated for no reason(or your personal reason)? "legendary monster", "one", "man" non of them specify "pirate".



Monster isn't a man either so? The whole hype moment is revolving around commenting WB as the strongest pirate currently. That's what Buggy's speech is about. The closest pirate to One Piece and the strongest one that tied with Roger once.



GucciBandana said:


> If you already answered it, as in MF WB = MF Garp, then they aged the same overall, to you. Why would WB being on life support or not matter? I mean WB was on life support, Lao G wasn't, so...??



Yes they are equal in my book. All evidence speaks for it.



GucciBandana said:


> Because your logic is flawed? His title gives him leverage over Roger by default, the fact they fought to a tie once in a loot match is the one that holds less weight in this case. Pretty sure you got the priority mixed up.



It doesn't he only managed to tie against Roger as per manga by portrayal and feats. He never beat Roger although being the WSM. So yea the title doesn't say anything when it comes to Roger or his equal marine rival by default.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sherlōck (Dec 12, 2020)

The problem with Buggy's statement is that we saw the clash between Roger and WB. It was a friendly loot match. 

On the other hand, we have statement from PK's own mouth that his fight against Garp was much more intense, they were death match. 

So, they aren't really comparable.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 13, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Monster isn't a man either so? The whole hype moment is revolving around commenting WB as the strongest pirate currently. That's what Buggy's speech is about. The closest pirate to One Piece and the strongest one that tied with Roger once.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



In OP, it is, many men been called monsters, WB is a man, also a monster, so clearly a man can be a monster? Maybe you are trying to say Garp isn't a monster? Like he's too weak to be called one or something?
Maybe in YOUR interpretation, or the one you'd like to see it as, it's revolving around WSP, but how about look at what was stated? Buggy said other things other than WSP? But somebody refuse to look at it? bias?

"All evidence" as in Sengoku calling WB WSM?

Ok Roger never beat Don Chinjao either, never beat Tsuru? why would WB never beat somebody hinder him from being WSM? Roger and WB might just didn't fight long enough to determine a winner, sometimes fights don't end, but Oda straight up tells you who's stronger. WSM comes from Oda, Oda knows more than what you see in the manga, he knows everything, Oda > everybody, Oda > Buggy, VC, you, me, he called WB WSM, then WB is WSM, stronger than any men for the time he holds the title, period. I thought it's simple logic?


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## TheWiggian (Dec 13, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> In OP, it is, many men been called monsters, WB is a man, also a monster, so clearly a man can be a monster? Maybe you are trying to say Garp isn't a monster? Like he's too weak to be called one or something?



No monster by definition just isn't a human.  



GucciBandana said:


> Maybe in YOUR interpretation, or the one you'd like to see it as, it's revolving around WSP, but how about look at what was stated? Buggy said other things other than WSP? But somebody refuse to look at it? bias?



Buggy hyped WB as the strongest pirate in the world and being the closest to the One Piece. There is nothing more to that statement.



GucciBandana said:


> "All evidence" as in Sengoku calling WB WSM?



And that means what if that strongest man cannot beat another?



GucciBandana said:


> Ok Roger never beat Don Chinjao either, never beat Tsuru?



Nothing suggests Roger even fought DCJ or Tsuru. But that's ok since Garp one shot DCJ and therefore WB and Roger would beat him handily by scaling.



GucciBandana said:


> Why would WB never beat somebody hinder him from being WSM? Roger and WB might just didn't fight long enough to determine a winner, sometimes fights don't end, but Oda straight up tells you who's stronger.



Because we know WB's crew fought with Roger's by WB's own words and by Buggy's speech the best WB once achieved was a tie.



GucciBandana said:


> Wsm comes from Oda, Oda knows more than what you see in the manga, he knows everything, Oda > everybody, Oda > Buggy, VC, you, me, he called WB WSM, then WB is WSM, stronger than any men for the time he holds the title, period. I thought it's simple logic?



Again WSM doesn't give him anything if he couldn't come out on top against Roger.


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## Beast (Dec 13, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> No monster by definition just isn't a human.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


DCJ has fought Roger and Garp before Garp came back and beat his ultimate weapon.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 13, 2020)

Beast said:


> DCJ has fought Roger and Garp before Garp came back and beat his ultimate weapon.


Did he? I know that Garp broke his will and strongest body part with a single punch. So those fights are questionable. Probably clshes at best.


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## Beast (Dec 13, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Did he? I know that Garp broke his will and strongest body part with a single punch. So those fights are questionable. Probably clshes at best.


Yeah, it was on a VC I think. 
you can see it on his Wiki though under relations.
It’s mostly a Middle finger to those that try to downplay Garp needing to train to beat DCJs ultimate weapon.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 13, 2020)

Beast said:


> Yeah, it was on a VC I think.
> you can see it on his Wiki though under relations.
> It’s mostly a Middle finger to those that try to downplay Garp needing to train to beat DCJs ultimate weapon.



Actually its the opposite, it comfirms Garp still had room for growth after destroying Rocks who is considered above Roger by many here.
It basically confirms DCJ's head being more durable than Rocks and all his subordinates.

Reactions: Like 1


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## GucciBandana (Dec 13, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> No monster by definition just isn't a human.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



By whose definition? Yours or Oda's? Cuz I go by Oda's, not sure about you.

Buggy hyped WB as the only ONE/MAN/MONSTER to stalemate Roger, that's clearly in the statement, yet your own bias dares to say "nothing more".

Still strongest man, stronger than all other men. And what do you mean by "can't beat"? As in like Zoro "can't beat" Carrot?

Yeah, just like nothing suggests WB even fought Garp, but WSM puts WB above Garp by scaling, Oda's scaling. So I don't understand why would "never beat" matter?

In your words, a loot match, only 3 days.

Oh yeah it does, as long as Roger is a man.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 13, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> By whose definition? Yours or Oda's? Cuz I go by Oda's, not sure about you.



By definition of the word that is used in this world, therefore by Oda too cuz he is a human. lmao



GucciBandana said:


> Buggy hyped WB as the only ONE/MAN/MONSTER to stalemate Roger, that's clearly in the statement, yet your own bias dares to say "nothing more".



His hype is about pirates, he doesn't hype him as the WSM.



GucciBandana said:


> Still strongest man, stronger than all other men. And what do you mean by "can't beat"? As in like Zoro "can't beat" Carrot?



Not stronger than Roger and therefore meaningless again.



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah, just like nothing suggests WB even fought Garp, but WSM puts WB above Garp by scaling, Oda's scaling. So I don't understand why would "never beat" matter?



Roger fought both Garp and WB, so there is no need for Garp and WB to face off. Garp chased after Roger not WB, i wonder why if WB was the stronger one.  



GucciBandana said:


> In your words, a loot match, only 3 days.



Yes which is WB's best achievement against Roger. lmao



GucciBandana said:


> Oh yeah it does, as long as Roger is a man.



Yep and Roger is WB's equal also ^^ So that title is still pretty meaningless.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 14, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> By definition of the word that is used in this world, therefore by Oda too cuz he is a human. lmao
> 
> 
> 
> ...



By definition of this world, WB doesn't even exist... Plus didn't you show me 3 translations? How many of them said "monster" specifically, why you so hung up on monster?

His hype is also about only one tying Roger, key word, "one"? never stated pirate or not?

How do you know he's not stronger than Roger? Not head canon > Oda again?

You don't have to wonder, because Oda straight up said it... I actually wonder why you even wonder.

How about more like Roger's best achievement against WSM? At least according your VC source.

You gonna have to pick and choose, either Roger is WB's equal, so your VC source means nothing, or Roger is a man, weaker than WSM, so they aren't equal, having both is contradictory.


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## Myrman9 (Dec 14, 2020)

Pagn6 said:


> Both characters are in their primes.
> 
> I often see that many put Akainu above Sengoku (both in their primes). And prime Sengoku has a pretty damn good portrayal (Roger mentioned about bringing Garp or Sengoku, while the marines he had just defeated weren't really worth his time).
> 
> ...


That would depend; does Garp have a nasty cold? Will half his face be melted off? Does Sakazuki get to pump his chest cavity full of molten rock at any point? Will young Luffy stab him in the gut if Akainu says that Garp stole his meat? Is Dragon being executed simultaneously?

Otherwise, at least Akainu wins in the "Hawaiian Print Shirt" category, and easily at that. No diff, I say.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 14, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> By definition of this world, WB doesn't even exist... Plus didn't you show me 3 translations? How many of them said "monster" specifically, why you so hung up on monster?



Iam not hung up on it I just pointed out that that it's pirate hype and not WSM by Buggy.



GucciBandana said:


> His hype is also about only one tying Roger, key word, "one"? never stated pirate or not?



It did call him WSP, no way around it and a smart move from Oda considering we knew there was a marine equal too.



GucciBandana said:


> How do you know he's not stronger than Roger? Not head canon > Oda again?



Because his best feat is a tie after multiple confrontations and that happened after Roger explicitly stated he doesn't have much time left anymore.



GucciBandana said:


> You don't have to wonder, because Oda straight up said it... I actually wonder why you even wonder.



Because Garp chases after the strongest to test his strenght.



GucciBandana said:


> How about more like Roger's best achievement against WSM? At least according your VC source.



As per manga by Buggy's speech that you hold in such high regard it's WB's.



GucciBandana said:


> You gonna have to pick and choose, either Roger is WB's equal, so your VC source means nothing, or Roger is a man, weaker than WSM, so they aren't equal, having both is contradictory.



WB never beat Roger. Lmao the title is meaningless to Roger.


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## Beast (Dec 14, 2020)

This guy doesn’t follow the OP.

WB is both the strongest man and equal to Roger.

Mihawk is the WSS and has never beaten Shanks.

Kaidou is the WSC and can’t beat BM.

tell to go argue with Oda about inconsistency and what the word strongest means. There wouldn’t be half the debates there is if only one person was the strongest but no, multiple have the strongest title AND at least ONE person equal to them. WB has two, maybe three.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Sherlōck (Dec 14, 2020)

We are supposed to bet on Laidou in 1v1 but he didn't win any fight against a top tier.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 14, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Iam not hung up on it I just pointed out that that it's pirate hype and not WSM by Buggy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It's both... 2 speech bubbles, one for only man tying Roger, one for WSP.

Like I said, only man tying Roger, AND WSP.

Again, your strongest vs Oda's strongest, I'm sure Oda's wins everytime in an OP setting.

Cuz Buggy was clearly talking about WB... not talking about Roger. So did Roger end up tying somebody stronger than WB? Don't think so, can't be stronger than WSM.

Meaningless says who? Is this a rule you made up? Like Mihawk's title is meaningless to Vista?



Beast said:


> This guy doesn’t follow the OP.
> 
> WB is both the strongest man and equal to Roger.
> 
> ...



If you have questions, you can ask me directly.

WB was equal to Roger, then WSM, as in the order Buggy stated.

We don't know if Shanks is classified as a swordsman, and we don't know the result of Mihawk vs Shanks, pointless argument. But Mihawk is superior to any current swordsman for sure, cuz Oda said so, like if Shanks was ever confirmed as a swordsman, then he's indeed weaker than Mihawk, don't see why that would be a problem.

Kaido is not WSC the same way WB and Mihawk's titles work, WB and Mihawk's titles are given by Oda straight up, Kaido's is "people say" "so called".

Not much inconsistency here, just bad readers that don't get it...

Reactions: Disagree 1 | Dislike 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 14, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> It's both... 2 speech bubbles, one for only man tying Roger, one for WSP.



It's just hype for strongest pirate nothing else as no other pirate tied with Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> Like I said, only man tying Roger, AND WSP.
> 
> Again, your strongest vs Oda's strongest, I'm sure Oda's wins everytime in an OP setting.



Cool because Oda's strongest isn't actually the strongest.



GucciBandana said:


> Cuz Buggy was clearly talking about WB... not talking about Roger. So did Roger end up tying somebody stronger than WB? Don't think so, can't be stronger than WSM.



WB has the title to defend not Roger, get that shit back to where it came from.



GucciBandana said:


> Meaningless says who? Is this a rule you made up? Like Mihawk's title is meaningless to Vista?



Mihawk never beat Vista = fact. Same as WB never beat Roger. The difference is Mihawk and Vista postponed while WB only managed a tie.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 14, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> It's just hype for strongest pirate nothing else as no other pirate tied with Roger.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



No other "man" tied with Roger, according to Buggy.

So whose strongest is the strongest then? Yours?

If WB has the title in the first place, then it's def more of Roger accomplishment than Wb's, since clearly he'd be the challenger then. But WB doesn't have to defend anything, WB is created by Oda, he's the strongest as long as Oda calls him the strongest.

WB vs Roger was inconclusive also, as you said, a loot match, and turned into drinking after 3 days. Unless you think WB and Roger have way less stamina than Akainu and Aokiji, else it's pretty obvious 3 days isn't enough to determine anything.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 14, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> No other "man" tied with Roger, according to Buggy.



Yes, Garp rather nearly murders him multiple times than tying once. Still doesn't change that this speech revolves around pirates.



GucciBandana said:


> So whose strongest is the strongest then? Yours?



Dunno but with a tie WB isn't the strongest, simple as that.



GucciBandana said:


> If WB has the title in the first place, then it's def more of Roger accomplishment than Wb's, since clearly he'd be the challenger then. But WB doesn't have to defend anything, WB is created by Oda, he's the strongest as long as Oda calls him the strongest.



Yes and the strongest can only manage a tie. lmao. The strongest wins, simple as that.



GucciBandana said:


> WB vs Roger was inconclusive also, as you said, a loot match, and turned into drinking after 3 days. Unless you think WB and Roger have way less stamina than Akainu and Aokiji, else it's pretty obvious 3 days isn't enough to determine anything.



They fought a few times and WB only once managed a tie when Roger was near his end as he himself stated. So by that WB must've looked inferior in all other confrontations.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 14, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Yes, Garp rather nearly murders him multiple times than tying once. Still doesn't change that this speech revolves around pirates.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You can nearly kill the enemy and lose, like Hody nearly killed Luffy, don't see a problem with that at all.

The strongest wins if the fight lasts till the very end, so why would a 3 day tie take away his title? Your logic don't make any sense, then you prob can't even tell who's the strongest amount Zoro and Carrot? cuz that's a tie, so no strongest.

How about maybe WB won the other matches? Maybe they fought for 7 days and a winner was decided? If you believe WB was WSM at the time, since according to you, strongest wins right? That's if you can confirm WB was WSM at the time.
Well, if Roger is near the end, which makes WB inferior in previous confrontations, then Roger only gets weaker after, WB = Roger at the time of the loot match, WB > Roger after, boom, your VC source WB WSM during Roger era confirmed, no contradiction.



Nox said:


> I never thought I would live to see the day that any Pirate but Blackbeard and Luffy would be considered stronger than Roger. 2020



Oh no, I don't actually think WB is stronger than Roger, I think: according to the manga, Roger = WB > Garp, according to the VC, WB > Roger ? Garp, you gotta pick and choose, it's pretty clear which one I chose.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 14, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> You can nearly kill the enemy and lose, like Hody nearly killed Luffy, don't see a problem with that at all.



Just as you can only tie and still have the WSM title, which isn't making you stronger than another equal either.



GucciBandana said:


> The strongest wins if the fight lasts till the very end, so why would a 3 day tie take away his title? Your logic don't make any sense, then you prob can't even tell who's the strongest amount Zoro and Carrot? cuz that's a tie, so no strongest.



1 clash is = to a 3 days fight in your book, i already know you were delusional before that mighty argument. Thanks.



GucciBandana said:


> How about maybe WB won the other matches? Maybe they fought for 7 days and a winner was decided? If you believe WB was WSM at the time, since according to you, strongest wins right? That's if you can confirm WB was WSM at the time.



No because as per Buggy's specch it was "WB" who managed to tie with Roger not the other way around.



GucciBandana said:


> Well, if Roger is near the end, which makes WB inferior in previous confrontations, then Roger only gets weaker after, WB = Roger at the time of the loot match, WB > Roger after, boom, your VC source WB WSM during Roger era confirmed, no contradiction.



Yes WB only tied to a weakened Roger while Garp nearly killed Roger multiple times throughough the career which again is much better than a single tie.



GucciBandana said:


> Oh no, I don't actually think WB is stronger than Roger, I think: according to the manga, Roger = WB > Garp, according to the VC, WB > Roger ? Garp, you gotta pick and choose, it's pretty clear which one I chose.



Nope as Garps feats and portrayal exceeds WB but you do you.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 14, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Just as you can only tie and still have the WSM title, which isn't making you stronger than another equal either.



Tie as in clash evenly like Zoro vs Carrot? yeah sure, you can, but tie =/= as strong as each other, you can tie in the short run, lose in the long run. WB = WSM, therefore stronger than any other men who isn't WSM at the time, simple and straight forward.



TheWiggian said:


> 1 clash is = to a 3 days fight in your book, i already know you were delusional before that mighty argument. Thanks.



Not exactly equal, but similar concept, if you think fighting evenly for 3 days = as strong as each other, in contrast Akainu and Aokiji tied for 9+ days, but still a difference, then I don't see why 1 clash can't be compare to 3 days.



TheWiggian said:


> No because as per Buggy's specch it was "WB" who managed to tie with Roger not the other way around.



That's because Buggy's speech was about "WB", not Roger... Or, let's go with what makes more sense, which is not WSM yet, cuz if he is, then WB must be the stronger one, since Oda > Buggy.



TheWiggian said:


> Yes WB only tied to a weakened Roger while Garp nearly killed Roger multiple times throughough the career which again is much better than a single tie.



Perfect, so you agree, WB might not be WSM during Roger's prime(before weakened), but of course, must be stronger than Garp after, since as good as Garp can get as a man, can't be better than WSM. I don't think you get it, WB doesn't need to use Roger as a reference to look "good", like Garp, he has Oda calling him WSM...



TheWiggian said:


> Nope as Garps feats and portrayal exceeds WB but you do you.



WSM > everything Garp has to offer, as long as he stays a man.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 14, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Tie as in clash evenly like Zoro vs Carrot? yeah sure, you can, but tie =/= as strong as each other, you can tie in the short run, lose in the long run. WB = WSM, therefore stronger than any other men who isn't WSM at the time, simple and straight forward.



Problem remains that the tie is WB's best feat against Roger after multiple face offs.



GucciBandana said:


> Not exactly equal, but similar concept, if you think fighting evenly for 3 days = as strong as each other, in contrast Akainu and Aokiji tied for 9+ days, but still a difference, then I don't see why 1 clash can't be compare to 3 days.



Oh so you were talking bullshit before. KK accepting the concession.



GucciBandana said:


> That's because Buggy's speech was about "WB", not Roger... Or, let's go with what makes more sense, which is not WSM yet, cuz if he is, then WB must be the stronger one, since Oda > Buggy.



Buggy's speech hypes him as strongest pirate after Roger's death and closest of them to the one piece.



GucciBandana said:


> Perfect, so you agree, WB might not be WSM during Roger's prime(before weakened), but of course, must be stronger than Garp after, since as good as Garp can get as a man, can't be better than WSM. I don't think you get it, WB doesn't need to use Roger as a reference to look "good", like Garp, he has Oda calling him WSM...



Where did I agree on the toad oil Usopp tries to sell? 

WB only matched a weakened Roger while Garp nearly murdered Roger all the way from his start to prime.



GucciBandana said:


> WSM > everything Garp has to offer, as long as he stays a man.



WSM not > Roger and therefore not > Garp. Next try.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 15, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Problem remains that the tie is WB's best feat against Roger after multiple face offs.



Again, why would that matter when Oda calls him WSM?



TheWiggian said:


> Oh so you were talking bullshit before. KK accepting the concession.


What are you talking about? I've been saying one clash can't determine who's stronger, neither can 3 days battle, cuz a fight can last up to 10 days.



TheWiggian said:


> Buggy's speech hypes him as strongest pirate after Roger's death and closest of them to the one piece.



Also hypes him as the only man to tie Roger, which you refuse to look at.



TheWiggian said:


> Where did I agree on the toad oil Usopp tries to sell?



You fully said yourself Roger is on decline, so if you think they are equal during the loot match, then how can Roger not be stronger than WB before it? according to your logic?



TheWiggian said:


> WB only matched a weakened Roger while Garp nearly murdered Roger all the way from his start to prime.



Again, you can nearly kill somebody and still lose the fight due to being weaker, already gave you examples, only means Garp and Roger are close, not equal. The "only" you should be looking at, is who's the "only one" to stalemate Roger according to Buggy.



TheWiggian said:


> WSM not > Roger and therefore not > Garp. Next try.



You just said, WSM > Roger, after the loot match, cuz Roger can only get weaker according to your logic, so your foundation doesn't even stand. Even if WSM not > Roger, why is he not > Garp all of a sudden? Last time I checked Roger and Garp aren't the same person.


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## Red Admiral (Dec 15, 2020)

Prime Garp have better hype than any man alive ... 

Garp beat Akainu high diff if not easier

Reactions: Agree 1 | Disagree 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 15, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Again, why would that matter when Oda calls him WSM?



Because Oda also showed us that WB has an equal, who has another equal. 



GucciBandana said:


> What are you talking about? I've been saying one clash can't determine who's stronger, neither can 3 days battle, cuz a fight can last up to 10 days.



The fight's that last up to 10 days belong to logia users that spam their elements to change the climate of an island. Fight's with weapons involved usually gets settled faster.



GucciBandana said:


> Also hypes him as the only man to tie Roger, which you refuse to look at.



Why would stalemating be any better than bringing someone on the verge of death?



GucciBandana said:


> You fully said yourself Roger is on decline, so if you think they are equal during the loot match, then how can Roger not be stronger than WB before it? according to your logic?



Nothing suggests he wasn't, but that doesn't take away WB's title as we already have seen that WB can't beat Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> Again, you can nearly kill somebody and still lose the fight due to being weaker, already gave you examples, only means Garp and Roger are close, not equal. The "only" you should be looking at, is who's the "only one" to stalemate Roger according to Buggy.



Their portrayal is absolutely equal. "Nearly killing *each other *multiple times throughout all their fights", Garp being Roger's marine rival and god valley incident portrays them as absolute equals as shown clearly in the panel.



GucciBandana said:


> You just said, WSM > Roger, after the loot match, cuz Roger can only get weaker according to your logic, so your foundation doesn't even stand. Even if WSM not > Roger, why is he not > Garp all of a sudden? Last time I checked Roger and Garp aren't the same person.



Never said that. After Roger was sentenced to death, WB was hailed as the ruler of seas and Buggy hypes him as the world's strongest pirates after Roger is gone. Roger is not Garp that's right but their strenght is equal as portrayed the whole time.


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## Beast (Dec 15, 2020)

@TheWiggian you really trying with this guy?

lmao, You know he has no idea what he is talking about right?
This is the same guy says Cracker is only just a little stronger then Vergo and pica fgs.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 15, 2020)

Beast said:


> @TheWiggian you really trying with this guy?
> 
> lmao, You know he has no idea what he is talking about right?
> This is the same guy says Cracker is only just a little stronger then Vergo and pica fgs.



Yeah, this dude doesn't understand that WB can have the WSM title and still have equals like Roger and Garp, same way Mihawk has Shanks. That shit is clear as day because Oda doesn't want to disrespect any of those goat characters by stating 1 is clearly stronger than the other.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Red Admiral (Dec 15, 2020)

Nox said:


> I never thought I would live to see the day that any Pirate but Blackbeard and Luffy would be considered stronger than Roger. 2020






*King of the World Send his regards *​


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## GucciBandana (Dec 16, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Because Oda also showed us that WB has an equal, who has another equal.



Not equal, just close, you don't seem to understand the difference, Aokiji is not Akainu's equal.



TheWiggian said:


> The fight's that last up to 10 days belong to logia users that spam their elements to change the climate of an island. Fight's with weapons involved usually gets settled faster.



Did you make up the rule that only Logia users can fight for 10 days? Jinbei and Jack aren't logia users, still fought 5 days, how can Roger or WB be less than that at minimum?
Did WB and Roger look like Ace and Jinbei at the end of their 3 day "loot" match? Don't think so.



TheWiggian said:


> Why would stalemating be any better than bringing someone on the verge of death?



Because stalemate means an equal match(one can still be a bit stronger, but that specific fight was a tie), nearly killing somebody, not really, just means he's a threat, like Hody vs Luffy as I mentioned.



TheWiggian said:


> Nothing suggests he wasn't, but that doesn't take away WB's title as we already have seen that WB can't beat Roger.



Ok, so Roger on decline, Roger fought WB on panel, no Oda box of WSM for WB, was a tie, they are equal at this point in time; Roger still on decline, a week(or any time period that doesn't go past Roger's death) after the fight, Roger got weaker, WB still the same, so that makes WB stronger than Roger a week after the fight, therefore WB WSM. WB title during Roger era explained, without actually being stronger than prime Roger.



TheWiggian said:


> Their portrayal is absolutely equal. "Nearly killing *each other *multiple times throughout all their fights", Garp being Roger's marine rival and god valley incident portrays them as absolute equals as shown clearly in the panel.


Again, nearly killing DOES NOT mean equal. Again, with your head canon of "equal" when we get no details.



TheWiggian said:


> Never said that. After Roger was sentenced to death, WB was hailed as the ruler of seas and Buggy hypes him as the world's strongest pirates after Roger is gone. Roger is not Garp that's right but their strenght is equal as portrayed the whole time.



Garp is portrayed as being close to Roger, not equal, there's a difference. Regardless Garp = Roger or Garp < Roger, Garp < WB for sure, as long as Garp stays a man.


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## Red Admiral (Dec 16, 2020)

_*1-Sengoku called Whitebeard "the strongest man in the world"*_
*2-Sengoku said "even with all of our men we might still lose to Whitebeard"*
_*3-Garp called Whitebeard "King of seas"*_

4- and novel ...


​
*sorry Garp fanboys .... Prime Beard > Garp is a fact .... it's not even debatable*

*and by default (sick Roger ~ Whitebeard)*

*Roger > Garp  *

p.s

Whitebeard was called "world strongest man" before start of great era


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## TheWiggian (Dec 16, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> _*1-Sengoku called Whitebeard "the strongest man in the world"*_
> *2-Sengoku said "even with all of our men we might still lose to Whitebeard"*
> _*3-Garp called Whitebeard "King of seas"*_
> 
> ...



WB = Roger = Garp. Sry WB fanboys but the title doesn't give him anything if he can't defeat Roger.


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## Beast (Dec 16, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> _*1-Sengoku called Whitebeard "the strongest man in the world"*_
> *2-Sengoku said "even with all of our men we might still lose to Whitebeard"*
> _*3-Garp called Whitebeard "King of seas"*_
> 
> ...


That’s idiotic logic.

WB is stronger then Garp BECAUSE of the WS title but isn’t stronger then Roger?

Riger~ Garp~ WB 
The only thing we know for sure is that Roger and Garp almosted killed each other , WB and Roger has a loot match and draw, Garp AND Roger beat the Rox crew that WB was apart of.
Worlds strongest title doesn’t hold anything about Garp when it doesn’t Roger.

Reactions: Like 1 | Dislike 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 16, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Not equal, just close, you don't seem to understand the difference, Aokiji is not Akainu's equal.



I missed the fact that Garp is Aokiji and Roger Akainu.



GucciBandana said:


> Did you make up the rule that only Logia users can fight for 10 days? Jinbei and Jack aren't logia users, still fought 5 days, how can Roger or WB be less than that at minimum?



It's been shown that only Aokiji and Akainu fought for that time. We know both are logias and changed the climate of that island. Other people get scaled to them but the feat is theirs.

Ace fought Jinbei close to a sea so he could utilize water all the time. So yea it's more or less like 2 logias.

It's been shown and stated that fight's don't last long when weapons are involved especially when it comes to swordsmen.




GucciBandana said:


> Did WB and Roger look like Ace and Jinbei at the end of their 3 day "loot" match? Don't think so.



They both had bandages and were clearly shown to be hurt.



GucciBandana said:


> Because stalemate means an equal match(one can still be a bit stronger, but that specific fight was a tie), nearly killing somebody, not really, just means he's a threat, like Hody vs Luffy as I mentioned.



Nearly killing someone is basically an extreme diff fight. And it didn't happen once but multiple times throughout the years of Roger being a pirate.




GucciBandana said:


> Ok, so Roger on decline, Roger fought WB on panel, no Oda box of WSM for WB, was a tie, they are equal at this point in time; Roger still on decline, a week(or any time period that doesn't go past Roger's death) after the fight, Roger got weaker, WB still the same, so that makes WB stronger than Roger a week after the fight, therefore WB WSM. WB title during Roger era explained, without actually being stronger than prime Roger.



Nice fanfiction man. But no WB was not stronger than Roger as we clearly seen, whatever happened after that fight, doesn't concern me.



GucciBandana said:


> Again, nearly killing DOES NOT mean equal. Again, with your head canon of "equal" when we get no details.



Roger tells us that not one of them nearly killed the other the whole time but both were in a grave condition afterwards, multiple times. Absolutely perfect, equal feats by definition of how their encounters went. God Valley shows Roger and Garp against Rocks once again perfectly portrayed as 2 equals. If you can't follow that, it's not my problem that you're lacking something.



GucciBandana said:


> Garp is portrayed as being close to Roger, not equal, there's a difference. Regardless Garp = Roger or Garp < Roger, Garp < WB for sure, as long as Garp stays a man.



He's been portrayed as perfect equal marine to Roger by Roger's own speech and god valley. WB is portrayed as Roger's only pirate equal by Buggy's speech and the loot match we saw briefly.

You can argue that Roger's words have more weight than Buggy's here and that the god valley was a way more serious event than a loot match, heck therefore i keep saying Garp's hype exceeds WB's. But iam not nitpicky.


All you have against that is WSM which doesn't mean shit to Roger or Garp and some headcanon that WB surpassed Roger after their loot adventure.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 16, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> I missed the fact that Garp is Aokiji and Roger Akainu.


Just like you missed the fact that Garp isn't Roger?



TheWiggian said:


> It's been shown that only Aokiji and Akainu fought for that time. We know both are logias and changed the climate of that island. Other people get scaled to them but the feat is theirs.
> 
> Ace fought Jinbei close to a sea so he could utilize water all the time. So yea it's more or less like 2 logias.
> 
> It's been shown and stated that fight's don't last long when weapons are involved especially when it comes to swordsmen.



So Roger and WB are swordsmen now? If you count Jinbei as a logia, might as well count WB as one too then, his Gura Gura prob has bigger effect on the surrounding than most logias.

Still doesn't explain Jack though.



TheWiggian said:


> They both had bandages and were clearly shown to be hurt.



Yeah of course, but in Jinbei Ace condition? I like that at least you acknowledging the intensity of that match, sounds better than "loot match" now.



TheWiggian said:


> Nearly killing someone is basically an extreme diff fight. And it didn't happen once but multiple times throughout the years of Roger being a pirate.



Again, Aokiji Akainu was prob an extreme-extreme diff fight, still got a winner.
Was Hody vs Luffy an extreme diff fight?



TheWiggian said:


> Nice fanfiction man. But no WB was not stronger than Roger as we clearly seen, whatever happened after that fight, doesn't concern me.



Aren't you the one who brought up your fanfiction of Roger declining in the first place? Now you deny it when somebody else uses it.



TheWiggian said:


> Roger tells us that not one of them nearly killed the other the whole time but both were in a grave condition afterwards, multiple times. Absolutely perfect, equal feats by definition of how their encounters went. God Valley shows Roger and Garp against Rocks once again perfectly portrayed as 2 equals. If you can't follow that, it's not my problem that you're lacking something.



Except you ignored the fact that based off Buggy's comment, non of those fights were a stalemate... So they hurt each other pretty bad, then maybe fight was interrupted or Roger beat Garp and got away, is that hard to understand? Or maybe Buggy didn't even know about Garp vs Roger, all those fights happened when Roger was still an upcoming pirate? I'd rather go with the former.



TheWiggian said:


> He's been portrayed as perfect equal marine to Roger by Roger's own speech and god valley. WB is portrayed as Roger's only pirate equal by Buggy's speech and the loot match we saw briefly.
> 
> You can argue that Roger's words have more weight than Buggy's here and that the god valley was a way more serious event than a loot match, heck therefore i keep saying Garp's hype exceeds WB's. But iam not nitpicky.
> 
> ...



Doesn't really matter to me Roger's words or Buggy's words have more weight, but I know for sure that Oda's words have more weight than both of them, and Oda calls WB WSM.
Let's say Roger is Oda, Roger's speech still don't indicate specific "strength ranking", just the fact Garp and him are relatively close, but WSM specifically tells you the strongest...


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## TheWiggian (Dec 16, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Just like you missed the fact that Garp isn't Roger?



  you started compare them to admirals, now you're deflecting.



GucciBandana said:


> So Roger and WB are swordsmen now? If you count Jinbei as a logia, might as well count WB as one too then, his Gura Gura prob has bigger effect on the surrounding than most logias.



I said that Jinbei can utilize water, which makes him an equivalent of a logia user who can spam an element.


*Spoiler*: __ 









What do you have again? Oh right assumptions. Don't drift too far off-topic with your deflections.



GucciBandana said:


> Still doesn't explain Jack though.



why would it if you ignore evidence?



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah of course, but in Jinbei Ace condition? I like that at least you acknowledging the intensity of that match, sounds better than "loot match" now.



Ace and Jinbei condition is what Garp and Roger most likely looked like after they were done measuring their dicks. WB doesn't have that privilige to put him in such a condition via feats. Bandages and patches are the best we seen from him. Iam not saying he couldn't since he is Roger's and Garp's equal too but based on that Garp just looks better.



GucciBandana said:


> Again, Aokiji Akainu was prob an extreme-extreme diff fight, still got a winner.
> Was Hody vs Luffy an extreme diff fight?



Why are you deflecting again? Those were fights to the death, iam not ruling out the possiblity of either being slightly superior to the other one with the tides shifting all the time. 



GucciBandana said:


> Aren't you the one who brought up your fanfiction of Roger declining in the first place? Now you deny it when somebody else uses it.




*Spoiler*: __ 









Doesn't look like fanfiction to me. YOu tried to write the story further with WB surpassing Roger after that while Oda wrote Roger off to start the new era.



GucciBandana said:


> Except you ignored the fact that based off Buggy's comment, non of those fights were a stalemate... So they hurt each other pretty bad, then maybe fight was interrupted or Roger beat Garp and got away, is that hard to understand? Or maybe Buggy didn't even know about Garp vs Roger, all those fights happened when Roger was still an upcoming pirate? I'd rather go with the former.



Nothing suggests they weren't stalemates either. It remains better than a single stalemate any day though.



GucciBandana said:


> Doesn't really matter to me Roger's words or Buggy's words have more weight, but I know for sure that Oda's words have more weight than both of them, and Oda calls WB WSM.



And Oda also shows us that WB can't beat Roger in a fight. So that basically cancels itself out.



GucciBandana said:


> Let's say Roger is Oda, Roger's speech still don't indicate specific "strength ranking", just the fact Garp and him are relatively close, but WSM specifically tells you the strongest...



And yet he can't beat Roger, you like to ignore that part as i see.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 16, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> you started compare them to admirals, now you're deflecting.



I did, because that's a much better comparison than something like Pre TS Zoro and Zombie Ryuma, since they are much more comparable strength wise. Just funny that you say WB = Roger so automatically WB = Garp too, then come tell me Garp isn't Aokiji, but he's Roger somehow...



TheWiggian said:


> I said that Jinbei can utilize water, which makes him an equivalent of a logia user who can spam an element.
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...



So WB isn't a logia user, so he can't be compared to Jinbei, Ace, Jack, but somehow he's a swordsman, and can be compared to pre TS Zoro?



TheWiggian said:


> Ace and Jinbei condition is what Garp and Roger most likely looked like after they were done measuring their dicks. WB doesn't have that privilige to put him in such a condition via feats. Bandages and patches are the best we seen from him. Iam not saying he couldn't since he is Roger's and Garp's equal too but based on that Garp just looks better.



The guy refuses to use Ace and Jinbei when comparing WB and Roger, now hops on Jinbei and Ace condition when comparing Garp and Roger lol, then say somebody else has "assumptions"? Except Ace and Jinbei were a stalemate, Garp and Roger couldn't have been a stalemate, since hmmm... here goes your deflection about the Buggy statement.



TheWiggian said:


> Why are you deflecting again? Those were fights to the death, iam not ruling out the possiblity of either being slightly superior to the other one with the tides shifting all the time.



Oh def, based off what Roger and Buggy said, it's definitely possible either one being superior to the other, as long as we follow the Oda rule that Garp must be a little below WB.



TheWiggian said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The illness is canon, but Roger getting weaker is your fanfiction for sure, now if we follow your fanfiction, Roger is weaker than WB after this fight, and you don't seem to be happy with that, ended up calling your own logic fanfiction.



TheWiggian said:


> Nothing suggests they weren't stalemates either. It remains better than a single stalemate any day though.



Buggy suggests it? Like clearly.



TheWiggian said:


> And Oda also shows us that WB can't beat Roger in a fight. So that basically cancels itself out.
> 
> And yet he can't beat Roger, you like to ignore that part as i see.



In a 3 day "loot match", while we don't know if WB had the title then... So how does it cancel out anything?

Sure, maybe he can't beat Roger back then, maybe he can, depends on the moment he got his title in comparison to Roger's condition/death, but he's stronger than Garp, cuz their prime clearly overlap and WB's Oda's WSM... It's like nobody looks like what Oda says and I'm going in circles.


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## Red Admiral (Dec 17, 2020)

Beast said:


> That’s idiotic logic.
> 
> WB is stronger then Garp BECAUSE of the WS title but isn’t stronger then Roger?



the only  idiotic this is that you blinded yourself to OBVIOUS truth

WB is not stronger than Garp cause he have title of world strongest man ...
*WB is stronger than Garp cause Sengoku and Garp himself consider him to be above all living man .... *
when you BFF calls another man "strongest" it means you are not "strongest"


Roger being equal to Whitebeard is a fact ...
Whitebeard being above Garp is a fact ....

tying to kill each other might have nothing to do with personal power as none of them were alone ... and had crew and allies and solders with them ....

*Garp is below Whitebeard ... and gap should be considerable enough unless the world wouldn't see Whitebeard as ABSLOUTE strongest

ffs .... Sengoku said we (3 admirals + Garp + Sengoku) MIGHT LOSE cause our enemy is whitebeard  
that's not EQUALS *


p.s

Roger and Whitebeard fought toe to toe and Roger PROVED he is not weaker than Whitebeard
Garp didn't
so ... yup ... Garp can't even dodge the title

he is below Whitebeard cause of

- lack of feat
- lack of title
- Sengoku and Garp himself consider WB to be strongest therefore above them 

stop playing dumb


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## Beast (Dec 17, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> the only  idiotic this is that you blinded yourself to OBVIOUS truth
> 
> WB is not stronger than Garp cause he have title of world strongest man ...
> *WB is stronger than Garp cause Sengoku and Garp himself consider him to be above all living man .... *
> ...


Worlds strongest man is WBs title.... what do you think they would call him?
WB had that title when Roger was alive, WB is not stronger then Roger, so why is he stronger then Garp?


Roger being equal WB is a fact. 
Roger or WB being stronger Garp is fanfic, nothing to prove it other then a title that holds nothing above Garp or Roger.

Do not try to change the English language to suit your need mate. They weren’t trying to kill each other, Roger Said ‘we almost killed each other’, no it was not a battle of crews and if we do take that into account, Garp had to solo the RPs, go reread any panel of Garp back in the days, he mostly travelled alone or jumped on people’s ship if it was anything to do with Roger. ‘Almost killed each other’s means they both almost killed each other, not that Roger won every fight, not that there is one above the other no, it was a clear example of portrayal and that portrayal and statement shows us clearly.  Don’t not try to change words or rephrase shit to suit your needs.

WBs title holds NOTHING over Garp or Roger. I’m not going to say it again, WBs title was GIVEN to him WHILE Roger was alive, so no WBs title holds no weight over either them because One he was not able to beat Roger and Roger could not completely overcome Garp in their years of battle. So a title is nothing more then it, Mihawk is WSS but isn’t above Shanks... now what?

It’s called hype, are you okay?
WBPs were stomped, Garp said if Ray joined, they couldn’t possibly win but that’s also false hype, they were destroyed and Ray switching to their side was not going to change that. A statement is only a statement espically when we know the RESULTS and the WBPs were raped.

ehhh... that’s not how it works. Wab is the underdog between the three lmao. ROGER DIDNT need to prove anything, he beat up WB along side his captain and crew mates, same with Garp. WB is the one that had to prove himself, Roger was there only For fun and Oden, heck Roger was a great pirate and Garp a hero before WB got any kinda of title be it Great pirate/ yonko or WSM.

lack of feats? 
Roger and Garp hold the great feat in the series lmao. Go try again.
Garp is HERO of the marines lmao.
Go pick up an English dictionary, WB is the WSM title holder and thus that’s what they referred to him as.

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## Red Admiral (Dec 17, 2020)

Beast said:


> Worlds strongest man is WBs title.... what do you think they would call him?
> WB had that title when Roger was alive, WB is not stronger then Roger, so why is he stronger then Garp?
> 
> 
> ...



dude .... you are LGEIT trying to ignore the fact that Sengoku cconisder Whitebeard a man of whole level above Garp?
if you want to say Garp is 4th strongest man I'm fine with it but no one has ever called Garp an equal to Roger or Whitebeard


all you just said is cheap deny ....

Sengoku consider Whitebeard as a man above all of the Marine .... Garp included
Novel called Whitebeard THE ONLY MAN who went toe to toe with Roger

Whitebeard was strongest man among living (before sickness) and everybody admit that's true
Garp and Sengoku admit to that as well

a wanker deny won't change reality


*Whitebeard > Garp is a fact*
*Whitebeard being THE ONLY equal to Roger is a fact
*
*Garp is not being their equal is a fact*

we are not talking about is Garp strong or not
we are talking about if he is equal with Pirate Kings 


for some one who DARE talk about  "English dictionary" you surly have no understand about logic or how to talk or make an argument

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Beast (Dec 17, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> dude .... you are LGEIT trying to ignore the fact that Sengoku cconisder Whitebeard a man of whole level above Garp?
> if you want to say Garp is 4th strongest man I'm fine with it but no one has ever called Garp an equal to Roger or Whitebeard
> 
> 
> ...


Sengoku has never compared WB to Garp.


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## Red Admiral (Dec 17, 2020)

Beast said:


> Sengoku has never compared WB to Garp.



he called Whitebeard the world strongest man 
he said even with all of their man they might lose cause that man is whitebeard 

if Sengoku didn't considered Whitebeard as a man who is "STRONGEST" (Sengoku didn't knew WB is sick as fuck) he wouldn't say this
you want to claim ... no he was just calling his title? and titles have no meaning?

man save yourself some face ....

Sengoku could not be more clear about the fact that Whitebeard is STRONGEST (Sengoku didn't knew WB is sick as fuck)
*therefore he is putting Whitebeard above ALL MEN ... Garp inculded 

the fact that he thinks with 3 admirals and Garp ... they might still lose ... an over kill*

the fact that novel said

Whitebeard is without a doubt strongest ... means Whitebeard > Garp 
Whitebeard is THE ONLY MAN equal to Roger .... means Garp never fought Roger on equal terms 



there is a sea of evidence for Whitebeard being strongest man in the world (without sickness)



Garp might make it to 4th strongest man in the world

but

Roger and Whitebeard WITHOUT A DOUBT stand above him
Xebec MOST LIKELY is above all of them and have best hype in the story 



4th strongest is not a bad place ... don't go over your head and facts to claim Garp is equal to Whitbeard and Roger
there is ZERO claim for that

*Novel legit said no one had ever went toe to toe with Roger .... so Garp never did earn this claim *

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Beast (Dec 17, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> he called Whitebeard the world strongest man
> he said even with all of their man they might lose cause that man is whitebeard
> 
> if Sengoku didn't considered Whitebeard as a man who is "STRONGEST" (Sengoku didn't knew WB is sick as fuck) he wouldn't say this
> ...


Yeah, no... clearly there is some problems with your English and I ain’t about to give you a free lesson. I’ve already addressed everything you’ve said, you’re just repeating yourself.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 17, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> I did, because that's a much better comparison than something like Pre TS Zoro and Zombie Ryuma, since they are much more comparable strength wise. Just funny that you say WB = Roger so automatically WB = Garp too, then come tell me Garp isn't Aokiji, but he's Roger somehow...



Roger, WB and Garp all fought each other and all have more or less the same feats. I don't need to compare them to other characters to justify their standing.




GucciBandana said:


> So WB isn't a logia user, so he can't be compared to Jinbei, Ace, Jack, but somehow he's a swordsman, and can be compared to pre TS Zoro?



Does it matter if it's pre TS? It's just an explanation that weapon wielders with the same level of strenght end their fights faster and it's by far the best option to build a case on since it's an established concept by Oda.




GucciBandana said:


> The guy refuses to use Ace and Jinbei when comparing WB and Roger, now hops on Jinbei and Ace condition when comparing Garp and Roger lol, then say somebody else has "assumptions"? Except Ace and Jinbei were a stalemate, *Garp and Roger couldn't have been a stalemate,* since hmmm... here goes your deflection about the Buggy statement.



You have no evidence on that. Buggy's statement hypes WB as pirate not WSM, so therefore meaningless to a marine.



GucciBandana said:


> Oh def, based off what Roger and Buggy said, it's definitely possible either one being superior to the other, as long as we follow the Oda rule that Garp must be a little below WB.



Oda's rule? He made WB the WSM but not the strongest, so what rule are we talking about. You're fucking desperate with the title.



GucciBandana said:


> The illness is canon, but Roger getting weaker is your fanfiction for sure, now if we follow your fanfiction, Roger is weaker than WB after this fight, and you don't seem to be happy with that, ended up calling your own logic fanfiction.



We know Roger had Crocus, one of the best doctors in the world at that time to lessen the effects of his disease. So yea you're wrong again.




GucciBandana said:


> Buggy suggests it? Like clearly.



Buggy also suggest to call WB the strongest pirate not the strongest man.



GucciBandana said:


> In a 3 day "loot match", while we don't know if WB had the title then... So how does it cancel out anything?



VC says he was. VC > you.



GucciBandana said:


> *Sure, maybe he can't beat Roger* back then, maybe he can, depends on the moment he got his title in comparison to Roger's condition/death, but he's stronger than Garp, cuz their prime clearly overlap and WB's Oda's WSM... It's like nobody looks like what Oda says and I'm going in circles.



Maybe he can't beat Roger already proves his title means nothing. In the end you conceded that WSM = stronger than everyone and therefore doesn't prove he is stronger than Garp. Iam glad the whole back and forth was not for naught.


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## Red Admiral (Dec 17, 2020)

Beast said:


> Yeah, no... clearly there is some problems with your English and I ain’t about to give you a free lesson. I’ve already addressed everything you’ve said, you’re just repeating yourself.



you are the one who claimed  Garp = Whitebeard = Roger

you addressed nothing about my claims .... just cheaply denied them with ignorance ....

there is a sea of advance for Roger = Whitebeard > Garp

feel free to be ignorant ... I ain’t teach you how logic works


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## Beast (Dec 17, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> you are the one who claimed  Garp = Whitebeard = Roger
> 
> you addressed nothing about my claims .... just cheaply denied them with ignorance ....
> 
> ...


It’s fact.
WB~ Roger
Garp ~ Roger
WB and Garp have no encounters other then Rox war and well...

For you to draw any conclusions out of Rogers statement that says/ suggests/ hints anything of Garp being weaker then Roger, post it and I will concede.
WBs title is not a reason as he got it before Roger died, so either you think WBs title is a lie or Garp/ Roger are the exception.

I havent denied anything, other then you saying the same shit again and again.

‘WB is the strongest because Sengoku said’ that’s literally the only thing you’ve said.

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## Red Admiral (Dec 17, 2020)

Beast said:


> It’s fact.
> Garp ~ Roger
> 
> For you to draw any conclusions out of Rogers statement that says/ suggests/ hints anything of Garp being weaker then Roger, post it and I will concede.
> ...



if you want to claim Garp ~ Roger you need proof ....

and there is no proof
Whitebeard is THE ONLY MAN who ever fought Roger on equal terms ....
the fact that he didn't prove to be equal to Roger is enough proof to claim he is weaker than Roger
as he is weaker than Whitebeard ...

it's not so hard for you to understand

*Whitebeard > Garp ... is a fact
Garp never fought or proved to be equal to Roger ... is a fact
so be default ... 
Roger > Garp *

therefore you have ZERO PROOF for claiming Garp is equal to Roger
just because is no a proof
if you dare to put this two on same level it's on you to say why

if you have one ... I be waiting ...
btw ... trying to kill each other is not even in the same realm as being equal on personal level ....


*you can't prove this .... cause WB IS THE ONLY MAN WHO fought Roger on equal terms 
meaning
Garp never fought Roger on equal terms and 



how on god name you can't understand this simple math?! *


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## Beast (Dec 17, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> if you want to claim Garp ~ Roger you need proof ....
> 
> and there is no proof
> Whitebeard is THE ONLY MAN who ever fought Roger on equal terms ....
> ...


Rogers own words are more then enough proof.

WB is not the only person to fight Riger on equal footing, did you forget what Roger said?

I’m still waiting for you to show us this proof of Roger being stronger then Garp...

I don’t want to be rude but bro, English doesn’t seem like your first language so I can understand the misunderstanding, you not once proven anything. Roger saying ‘we’, do you know what it means by ‘we’, he grouped himself and Garp together and ‘almost killed EACH OTHER’, this is a two way street, Roger doesn’t say ‘I almost killed you a bunch of times’, he says ‘we’ meaning that it was going either way at any given time.
So for YOu to claim that Roger is stronger... you’re just gonna have to show us panels or that’s it.

WB is the worlds strongest Man, that is his title, Sengoku and none else would refer to him as otherwise. WB was the Worlds strongest man WHILE Roger is alive, so how can he be the strongest but not above Roger who is a Man?
I know, it’s because Oda does it for hype. He did it with Mihawk/ Shanks and most recently Kaidou/ BM.

WBs TITLE does not put him over Garp, same way it DOESNT with ROGER.

it’s not maths, it’s the English language, which you seem to be having troubles with.

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## Red Admiral (Dec 17, 2020)

Beast said:


> I’m still waiting for you to show us this proof of Roger being stronger then Garp...



proof

1- Sengoku called him "strongest man"
2- Sengoku said with even with all of our army we might lose to him
3- world considered Whitebeard as strongest
4- Garp called him king of the seas
5- Novel said Whitebeard without a doubt is strongest man in the world

and yet you are like "nope don't like this"

Whitebeard > Garp is a fact
Roger = Whitebeard is a fact

Roger > Garp is a fact

I guess you never study logic ... good ... you would fail over and over and over again ....


Beast said:


> I don’t want to be rude but bro, English doesn’t seem like your first language so I can understand the misunderstanding, you not once proven anything. Roger saying ‘we’, do you know what it means by ‘we’, he grouped himself and Garp together and ‘almost killed EACH OTHER’, this is a two way street, Roger doesn’t say ‘I almost killed you a bunch of times’, he says ‘we’ meaning that it was going either way at any given time.
> So for YOu to claim that Roger is stronger... you’re just gonna have to show us panels or that’s it.



no English is not my  first language ... but I got to say .... it's embarrassing that it's your first language and you still don't understand it

1- trying to kill each other don't mean they were alone .... he said we cause they are both also leader of their crew/men .... what you think Roger and Garp fought while rest of the team had a tea?

2- trying to kill each other don't mean they were equal ... Crocodile tried to kill Whitebeard ... lmao
and Roger tried to kill Garp also ... sure .... but he had a crew .... Garp had a Sengoku and fleet


*3- novel said Whitebeard is the ONLY man who fought Roger on equal terms*


so Mr.English .... do you know what "ONLY" means?
I guess I have to educate you .... YOUR OWN language .... that's embarrassing as fuck ....


only mean ....

*and no one or nothing more besides; solely.


therefore Garp could not fought Roger alone and on equal terms
therefore your theory about Roger ~ Garp would go among shits ... where it belong *


p.s 
stop embarrassing  yourself ... it's painful to watch


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## TheWiggian (Dec 17, 2020)

Novel is meaningless if the mangas story portrays Roger and Garp as perfect equals at least twice.


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## Beast (Dec 17, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> proof
> 
> 1- Sengoku called him "strongest man"
> 2- Sengoku said with even with all of our army we might lose to him
> ...


1. That’s WBs title next.
2. that’s called being cautious/ Garp was not apart of the line up nor war till he decided to. WBPs got stomped that is a fact not a statement.
3. WB got his title while Roger was alive, Everyone considers Garp the greatest marine/ Roger the king of pirates and WB as the WSM all three had the title at once.
4. Yonko are the rulers of the sea/ WB is the strongest yonko.
5. Are you talking about the ace novel?
What novel are you speaking of? What is the context? Marines are never grouped together with pirates, Strongest title are for pirates as that makes them look more dangerous to civilians. Garp already has his own title DESPITE being a marine like no other.

don’t lie bruh, don’t do that. You aren’t very good at it, don’t start now.

Garp~ Roger... prove me wrong.
WB being above Garp is your headcanon. The reason you TRY to use for WB being above Garp also works against Roger But you so graciously keep dodging. Why is WB both the WSM and equal to Roger?
his title is the reason you are putting him above Garp as there is nothing else. Accomplish are all on Garps side.

English isn’t my first language but I am English speaker raised and living in England lol. I understand the basics enough mate, YOU however don’t seem to understand the context of ‘we’ and ‘each other’ but since you want act like a bitch, I have no problems insulting your understanding of the English Language which is severely lacking to the point you can barely make coherent sentences.

1. ‘we’ referring to Roger himself and Garp, the man he was talking to. Again just another example that you have no idea how the English language works or at the very least it seems to be a struggle for you. Prove to us that Roger was talking about someone other then himself and Garp... I will wait.

2. another misunderstanding of the English language, Roger didn’t ‘we tried’ he says, ‘they’ve ALMOST killed each other’ so it has happen with deferring results. This is a clear portrayal that they are on equal footing and the results varied, Garp almost killed him a couple times and Roger almost killed Garp a couple of times. Go grab a dictionary and a thesaurus.

3. that is a retcon, Rox war and Rogers statement say otherwise. And that was Buggy’s statement, same buggy that was saying Roger should run from Shiki because he couldn’t hope to win.

yes I know what ‘only’ means but I know that to false, as I’ve read and kept up with the series and am up to date with it, where we found out that Buggy was only referring to a friendly looting match, and Rogers strongest rival was Rox not WB or Garp.

you would be the last person to try educate me in English, id rather learn from the local crack head.

Prove Garp fought Roger with an army, prove that Garp did not fight Roger on equal footing... imagine thinking you can speak English well enough yet can’t understand a simple sentence like ‘*we almost killed each other numerous times’. *

Reactions: Like 1 | Dislike 1


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## Red Admiral (Dec 17, 2020)

Beast said:


> 1. That’s WBs title next.
> 2. that’s called being cautious/ Garp was not apart of the line up nor war till he decided to. WBPs got stomped that is a fact not a statement.
> 3. WB got his title while Roger was alive, Everyone considers Garp the greatest marine/ Roger the king of pirates and WB as the WSM all three had the title at once.
> 4. Yonko are the rulers of the sea/ WB is the strongest yonko.
> ...



lol ... the fact that you say " prove me wrong" means you have no argument ....

1- that him considering WB as strongest
2- not if you have the clear upper hand and Garp be equal to him
3- Roger can prove he is no less than Whitebeard ... Garp can't ...
4- yes ... the fucking ace novel ... fucking read it mr. English

*context is .... you are as wrong as fuck*

​_*ace novel : Whitebeard is Strongest living man without a doubt *_
*ace novel : Whitebeard is ONLY equal to Roger

deny this clear statements to your grave ... see if I give a darn *



1- they fought and tried to kill each other don't mean equal on personal level
2- they fought and tried to kill each other don't mean equal on personal level
3- Rocks war is far too unclear for Garp to get a clear hype out of it ... even when GV ... Sengoku and Garp and world and novel still think WB > Garp


1- that ONLY is come from novel ... not Buggy .... try again
2- of course ... I'm to expensive for you to teach ... go to  local crack head and they will tell you what ONLY means ....

p.s
local crack head might also tell you a 3 days long fight is not a friendly fight .... the war ended in a friendly way ... that's it


p.s


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## TheWiggian (Dec 17, 2020)

Ace novel is just Buggy's speech with more words. It is less canon than Buggy's speech though.
Also novel aligns by hyping WB as the strongest pirate alive after Roger's death:

_"Edward Newgate's very life was that of the strongest *pirate* alive"._

*The bits of information that Skull gathered about Edward "Whitebeard" Newgate came from many sources.*

Dude collected rumours from all over the world. According to Skull, who isn't any different to all the other characters in OP and therefore not different to someone like Roger or Sengoku is held here above everything else in accuracy, which is questionable source at best considering it was written by:


*Spoiler*: __ 




One Piece novel A​
Volume 1 JP
Volume 2 JP
Volume 1 EN
Volume 2 EN

Attribution​Author:​Shou Hinata (Vol. 1)
Tatsuya Hamazaki (Vol. 2)
Cover Artist:​




It's not even written by Oda and only repeats what was written in Oda's story, aka, Buggy's speech bout WB, WB's rules on the ship. What Kaido and Big Mom stand for.

*Buggy hypes WB as the only one to tie with Roger and Strongest pirate, closest to the throne after Roger was gone, later we find out it was a loot match and that it was WB's best achievement from many encounters:*


*Spoiler*: __ 













Roger himself hypes Garp by stating they literally nearly murdered each other multiple times, thus making them equal and same Sengoku that hyped WB as WSM is telling us that Garp was one of 2 men that destroyed Rocks with WB included, portraying Garp as perfect equal with Roger again:


*Spoiler*: __ 











Additional info that the manga doesn't specify has WB as the WSM well before the great age of pirates aka Roger's death:


*Spoiler*: __ 









Unless the manga contradicts it, WB's WSM title doesn't put him above Roger and therefore Garp who is constantly portrayed to be the pirate kings equal.

Don't quote me on that shit no more, i don't need to go on fucking essays and compare them to other characters, *the story established it undoubtedly that those 3 rival each other in feats, hype and portrayal on equal terms. 

A novel that isn't written by Oda and just recycles info that we already know isn't changing anything here.*

Reactions: Like 1


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## MYJC (Dec 17, 2020)

I lean towards Akainu on this one, simply because of the lethality of his fruit and the fact that Garp lacks long range attacks. 

Having to rely on punches is a matchup disadvantage against Sakazuki.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 17, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Roger, WB and Garp all fought each other and all have more or less the same feats. I don't need to compare them to other characters to justify their standing.



You said it yourself, "more or less", Smoker, Ace, Aokiji all fought each other and all have more or less the same feats, I guess we don't need to bring in other characters to justify their standing? 



TheWiggian said:


> Does it matter if it's pre TS? It's just an explanation that weapon wielders with the same level of strenght end their fights faster and it's by far the best option to build a case on since it's an established concept by Oda.



Weapon wielders = swordsman now, might as well consider Jack a swordsman too then, I guess Jack isn't created by Oda.



TheWiggian said:


> You have no evidence on that. Buggy's statement hypes WB as pirate not WSM, so therefore meaningless to a marine.



Buggy's statement hypes WB as only Roger equal/stalemate, regardless of pirate or not, so of course it's meaningful to a marine, cp, revolutionary, bandits or whatever.



TheWiggian said:


> Oda's rule? He made WB the WSM but not the strongest, so what rule are we talking about. You're fucking desperate with the title.



How can Oda make WB the World's "Strongest" Man but not the strongest... doesn't make any sense. More like Oda made WB the strongest, just you didn't, maybe you can go write your own OP spinoff.



TheWiggian said:


> We know Roger had Crocus, one of the best doctors in the world at that time to lessen the effects of his disease. So yea you're wrong again.



So Crocus can stop Roger from declining but not before, according to your head canon, , well, in your words, "lessen", so still declined I guess?



TheWiggian said:


> Buggy also suggest to call WB the strongest pirate not the strongest man.



I never said Buggy called WB WSM... I said only Roger stalemate. However, Sengoku did, so did Oda box.



TheWiggian said:


> VC says he was. VC > you.



VC says Roger era, means can be any point of time before Roger's death, maybe before execution, after their loot match?



TheWiggian said:


> Maybe he can't beat Roger already proves his title means nothing. In the end you conceded that WSM = stronger than everyone and therefore doesn't prove he is stronger than Garp. Iam glad the whole back and forth was not for naught.



For his title to mean nothing, you have to prove WB had the title the moment he "can't beat" Roger, if not, your "meaning nothing" means nothing.

However, Oda calling him strongest clearly means anything you can throw out.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 17, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> You said it yourself, "more or less", Smoker, Ace, Aokiji all fought each other and all have more or less the same feats, I guess we don't need to bring in other characters to justify their standing?



Yes I don't need to bring in Smoker, Ace or Aokiji.



GucciBandana said:


> Weapon wielders = swordsman now, might as well consider Jack a swordsman too then, I guess Jack isn't created by Oda.



For the sake of your strawman, Jack fought a swordsman with his blades. More evidence than not.



GucciBandana said:


> Buggy's statement hypes WB as only Roger equal/stalemate, regardless of pirate or not, so of course it's meaningful to a marine, cp, revolutionary, bandits or whatever.



It isn't, lastly it's to establish WB as the WSP, not WSM.




GucciBandana said:


> How can Oda make WB the World's "Strongest" Man but not the strongest... doesn't make any sense. More like Oda made WB the strongest, just you didn't, maybe you can go write your own OP spinoff.



Ask Oda.



GucciBandana said:


> So Crocus can stop Roger from declining but not before, according to your head canon, , well, in your words, "lessen", so still declined I guess?



Not before what? Talk clear or don't respond.



GucciBandana said:


> I never said Buggy called WB WSM... I said only Roger stalemate. However, Sengoku did, so did Oda box.



Meaningless, Roger thinks of Garp as his equal. So once again, WSM means nothing to these 2.



GucciBandana said:


> VC says Roger era, means can be any point of time before Roger's death, maybe before execution, after their loot match?



It says way before the great age of pirates which just started after Roger died.




GucciBandana said:


> For his title to mean nothing, you have to prove WB had the title the moment he "can't beat" Roger, if not, your "meaning nothing" means nothing.



His title means something against all others, just not Roger who he never proved to be above and by defaul Garp who is seen by Roger and portrayed as equal.



GucciBandana said:


> However, Oda calling him strongest clearly means anything you can throw out.



WB never beat Roger so WB = Roger best case scenario

Roger = Garp by Roger's own words.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 18, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Yes I don't need to bring in Smoker, Ace or Aokiji.



But you do when comparing those 3, double standard?



TheWiggian said:


> For the sake of your strawman, Jack fought a swordsman with his blades. More evidence than not.



Yeah and Jack fights for 5 days, even better...


TheWiggian said:


> It isn't, lastly it's to establish WB as the WSP, not WSM.



What about the statement before "lastly"? Didn't exist? WB is WSP and WSM(Oda Box), he's both.



TheWiggian said:


> Ask Oda.



Don't need to, he already said strongest, I wonder if it's hard to pick if I should go with his strongest or yours, hmmm.



TheWiggian said:


> Not before what? Talk clear or don't respond.



Before WB vs Roger "loot match", duh, since the after implies to "after the loot match" also.



TheWiggian said:


> Meaningless, Roger thinks of Garp as his equal. So once again, WSM means nothing to these 2.



Not equal, just close, Roger has never ever said they were equal, Roger's only equal/stalemate, said in the manga, is by Buggy, and it wasn't Garp. You keep getting them mixed up.



TheWiggian said:


> It says way before the great age of pirates which just started after Roger died.



Still doesn't say before or after the loot match, need your fanfic here.



TheWiggian said:


> His title means something against all others, just not Roger who he never proved to be above and by defaul Garp who is seen by Roger and portrayed as equal.



Such double standard... so his title works sometimes, doesn't work some other time, and you get to pick when, hmmm I really wonder who's the biased one here.



TheWiggian said:


> WB never beat Roger so WB = Roger best case scenario
> 
> Roger = Garp by Roger's own words.



Best case scenario is WB > Roger cuz WB is WSM, worst scenario is Roger > WB because WB got WSM either after Roger's death or after Roger's prime.

Garp, no illness, didn't die, his best case is a little below WB, like why is Roger, who is not named Garp last time I checked, and can be either stronger, weaker, or equal to WB, even relevant here?


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## TheWiggian (Dec 18, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> But you do when comparing those 3, double standard?



You brought them up not me.



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah and Jack fights for 5 days, even better...



Now you bring up Jack.



GucciBandana said:


> What about the statement before "lastly"? Didn't exist? WB is WSP and WSM(Oda Box), he's both.



Yep WSP gives him nothing over a marine and Roger views Garp as his equal, who WB never beat.



GucciBandana said:


> Don't need to, he already said strongest, I wonder if it's hard to pick if I should go with his strongest or yours, hmmm.



You should ask Oda why he gave WB the title if he shows us that WB cannot defeat Roger ^^



GucciBandana said:


> Before WB vs Roger "loot match", duh, since the after implies to "after the loot match" also.



And?



GucciBandana said:


> Not equal, just close, Roger has never ever said they were equal, Roger's only equal/stalemate, said in the manga, is by Buggy, and it wasn't Garp. You keep getting them mixed up.



Roger portrays it perfectly as "nearly killing EACH OTHER" Rocks were brought down by "GARP and ROGER". Heck perfectly equal 50-50.



GucciBandana said:


> Still doesn't say before or after the loot match, need your fanfic here.



Roger was alive when WB was stated to be the WSM and he never beat Roger, i don't need more than that to render the title useless against Roger and Garp.



GucciBandana said:


> Such double standard... so his title works sometimes, doesn't work some other time, and you get to pick when, hmmm I really wonder who's the biased one here.



Not a single double standart, no one except WB and Garp fought and was portrayed as Roger's equal therefore WB > all others except Roger and Garp.



GucciBandana said:


> Best case scenario is WB > Roger cuz WB is WSM, worst scenario is Roger > WB because WB got WSM either after Roger's death or after Roger's prime.



No it's not he never beat Roger despite having the title and multiple fights against him.



GucciBandana said:


> Garp, no illness, didn't die, his best case is a little below WB, like why is Roger, who is not named Garp last time I checked, and can be either stronger, weaker, or equal to WB, even relevant here?



Roger = Garp as per the PK's words and god valley portrayal. WB = Roger as per their match and Buggy speech. Dunno what you guys don't get here. Playing dumb definitely isn't helping you here.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 19, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> You brought them up not me.



Yeah, cuz they destroy your funny logic, which is why you dodge them.



TheWiggian said:


> Now you bring up Jack.



Yeah, same reason as above.



TheWiggian said:


> Yep WSP gives him nothing over a marine and Roger views Garp as his equal, who WB never beat.



But "ONLY MAN" stalemate Roger and WSM does...



TheWiggian said:


> You should ask Oda why he gave WB the title if he shows us that WB cannot defeat Roger ^^



But we aren't even comparing WB Roger here... Even we are, I might go ask him, but still not necessary, since Oda himself never said WB's WSM title overlapped with the Roger he "couldn't beat".



TheWiggian said:


> And?



And it makes your logic of Crocus can make Roger stay as strong after the "loot match", but not before the "loot match" kinda ridiculous. But you already contradicted that actually, you used to word "lessen", which still matches my point: Roger is weaker than WB after by your decline logic.



TheWiggian said:


> Roger portrays it perfectly as "nearly killing EACH OTHER" Rocks were brought down by "GARP and ROGER". Heck perfectly equal 50-50.



Nearly killing each other isn't perfect 50-50... as I mentioned multiple times, however, that's closer to a 50-50 than a no detail brief description silhouette though.



TheWiggian said:


> Roger was alive when WB was stated to be the WSM and he never beat Roger, i don't need more than that to render the title useless against Roger and Garp.



hmmm, WB never beat Boa Hancock, Boa Hancock was alive when WB was stated to be the WSM, and your point?



TheWiggian said:


> Not a single double standart, no one except WB and Garp fought and was portrayed as Roger's equal therefore WB > all others except Roger and Garp.



Again, no one except WB was portrayed as Roger's equal, Garp is portrayed as close to be Roger's equal, so was Sengoku, but Garp is closer, still not equal. You'd prob have better luck trying to justify Sengoku is Garp's equal, than Garp is Roger's equal.



TheWiggian said:


> No it's not he never beat Roger despite having the title and multiple fights against him.
> 
> Roger = Garp as per the PK's words and god valley portrayal. WB = Roger as per their match and Buggy speech. Dunno what you guys don't get here. Playing dumb definitely isn't helping you here.



What you don't get here, is you don't have to beat someone to be stronger than him... there are all these other things information in the manga that can tell you who's stronger, if you actually go look?

Again and again, Garp is CLOSE to Roger, not equal, big difference, he can't be equal to Roger(only stalemate being WB), and can't be equal to WB(WSM). Dunno what's so confusing for you?


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## TheWiggian (Dec 19, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Yeah, cuz they destroy your funny logic, which is why you dodge them.



How do they destroy them if they have nothing to do with the PK in the first place?



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah, same reason as above.



What has Jack to do with Roger dude?



GucciBandana said:


> But "ONLY MAN" stalemate Roger and WSM does...



Why can he only stalemate Roger if he is the WSM? Can't he beat him so your title argument can become solid?



GucciBandana said:


> But we aren't even comparing WB Roger here... Even we are, I might go ask him, but still not necessary, since Oda himself never said WB's WSM title overlapped with the Roger he "couldn't beat".



He showed that WB never beat Roger so idc.



GucciBandana said:


> And it makes your logic of Crocus can make Roger stay as strong after the "loot match", but not before the "loot match" kinda ridiculous. But you already contradicted that actually, you used to word "lessen", which still matches my point: Roger is weaker than WB after by your decline logic.



_We know Roger had Crocus, one of the best doctors in the world at that time to lessen the effects of his disease. So yea you're wrong again_.


No idea where I said before or after. As you can see I only said Crocus stabilized Roger so you're attacking a strawman again.





GucciBandana said:


> Nearly killing each other isn't perfect 50-50... as I mentioned multiple times, however, that's closer to a 50-50 than a no detail brief description silhouette though.



No you took other characters into account that have nothing to do with Roger and Garp, Roger never mentioned that either had the edge over the other.

Garp and Roger are the only shown in that panel so yeah it's a perfectly split portrayal of 2 equals.



GucciBandana said:


> hmmm, WB never beat Boa Hancock, Boa Hancock was alive when WB was stated to be the WSM, and your point?



Boa is a woman in the first place 

You are extremely desperate at this point.



GucciBandana said:


> Again, no one except WB was portrayed as Roger's equal, Garp is portrayed as close to be Roger's equal, so was Sengoku, but Garp is closer, still not equal. You'd prob have better luck trying to justify Sengoku is Garp's equal, than Garp is Roger's equal.



Roger's words mean more to me than yours.




GucciBandana said:


> What you don't get here, is you don't have to beat someone to be stronger than him... there are all these other things information in the manga that can tell you who's stronger, if you actually go look?



So Garp can beat WB? Since they're equal with Roger, yea that's a possibility I don't rule out.




GucciBandana said:


> Again and again, Garp is CLOSE to Roger, not equal, big difference, he can't be equal to Roger(only stalemate being WB), and can't be equal to WB(WSM). Dunno what's so confusing for you?



WB = Roger via the stalemate
Garp = Roger via GV and Roger's own words.

Sadly you have nothing to disprove that.


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## Beast (Dec 19, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> lol ... the fact that you say " prove me wrong" means you have no argument ....
> 
> 1- that him considering WB as strongest
> 2- not if you have the clear upper hand and Garp be equal to him
> ...


Repeating the same shit doesn’t change anything.
Do not try to act as you have a good enough grasp of the English language to teach it. You can barely put a sentence together.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Dislike 1


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## Red Admiral (Dec 19, 2020)

Beast said:


> Repeating the same shit doesn’t change anything.
> Do not try to act as you have a good enough grasp of the English language to teach it. You can barely put a sentence together.



lol ... the fact that you are so hopeless to make an argument that you attack my 4th language is funny as fuck

Repeating facts change nothing .... cause they are facts .... ignoring them also make no difference .... no ... in fairness ... it prove you are not qualified for having a civil argument about ANY THING ... let alone one piece

Everyone on One Piece World : Whitebeard is strongest
Oda official title : Whitebeard is strongest man
Garp and Sengoku : Whitebeard is the strongest and king of seas
Novel : Whitebeard is strongest without a doubt

Your brain :





don't reply .... you humiliated yourself enough ...
getting beaten , humiliated and left hopeless by a dude who can't put sentence together must hurt as fuck
take sometime off so you can heal form it


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## TheWiggian (Dec 19, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> lol ... the fact that you are so hopeless to make an argument that you attack my 4th language is funny as fuck
> 
> Repeating facts change nothing .... cause they are facts .... ignoring them also make no difference .... no ... in fairness ... it prove you are not qualified for having a civil argument about ANY THING ... let alone one piece
> 
> ...



Your whole argument is broken by WB failing to prove he is stronger than Roger on multiple occasions. Therefore it's non-existent.


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## Beast (Dec 19, 2020)

Red Admiral said:


> lol ... the fact that you are so hopeless to make an argument that you attack my 4th language is funny as fuck
> 
> Repeating facts change nothing .... cause they are facts .... ignoring them also make no difference .... no ... in fairness ... it prove you are not qualified for having a civil argument about ANY THING ... let alone one piece
> 
> ...


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## Red Admiral (Dec 19, 2020)

it's really good that you are self-aware about your condition ...

but I fear it's too late

when a man look at a fact and attack another for showing it to him ... it's means you "don't want to know the truth" that's too deep in darkness



any way

as feats , Oda , title , Novel , Sengoku , Garp and millions other in one piece world and real world know and said

*Whitebeard > Garp*

deal with it
stop crying about it


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## GucciBandana (Dec 19, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> How do they destroy them if they have nothing to do with the PK in the first place?



They have a lot to do with your logic regarding PK though.



TheWiggian said:


> What has Jack to do with Roger dude?



Again, has to do with your flawed logic.


TheWiggian said:


> Why can he only stalemate Roger if he is the WSM? Can't he beat him so your title argument can become solid?



Because WB can either be WSM after the fight, or that if the fight kept going, he couldn't won, either way fits his title, I mean his title has to fit, Oda gave it... It's concrete as Newton's first law.



TheWiggian said:


> He showed that WB never beat Roger so idc.



but he showed WB is WSM, do you care?



TheWiggian said:


> _We know Roger had Crocus, one of the best doctors in the world at that time to lessen the effects of his disease. So yea you're wrong again_.
> 
> 
> No idea where I said before or after. As you can see I only said Crocus stabilized Roger so you're attacking a strawman again.



so did Roger get weaker after the loot match or nah? stop beating around the bushes.



TheWiggian said:


> No you took other characters into account that have nothing to do with Roger and Garp, Roger never mentioned that either had the edge over the other.



Because they have something to do with your WB Roger Garp logic?



TheWiggian said:


> Garp and Roger are the only shown in that panel so yeah it's a perfectly split portrayal of 2 equals.



Oh yeah? If you call that "equals", then tell me how many perfect split Garp has with Sengoku, more than he has with Roger I bet.



TheWiggian said:


> Boa is a woman in the first place
> 
> You are extremely desperate at this point.



Boa is a pirate though, but does it matter than WB never beat her?



TheWiggian said:


> Roger's words mean more to me than yours.



More than yours also, but less than Oda's obviously.



TheWiggian said:


> So Garp can beat WB? Since they're equal with Roger, yea that's a possibility I don't rule out.



"Can beat" and "did beat" completely different concepts, I don't think you get it, just like "equal" and "close" completely different. Can Garp beat WB? As long as Garp isn't a perfect counter to WB, then no, no way, WB is WSM. Did Garp beat WB? No, he didn't even beat Tsuru... Only guy Garp ever beat on panel, was Chinjao.



TheWiggian said:


> WB = Roger via the stalemate
> Garp = Roger via GV and Roger's own words.
> 
> Sadly you have nothing to disprove that.



Stalemate means fought equally, but what Roger said and GV have nothing to do with "equal", it's like saying Garp = Sengoku via Shiki fight. In fact, Roger and Garp can't even reach stalemate(still not necessarily equal, but very close), Buggy ruled it out. You can nearly kill somebody but still be weaker than that somebody, but you as a man, can't be as strong as WSM. In fact, the word in Japanese Roger used to describe what happened between him and Garp is "殺し合", go look it up what is means yourself.
All these equal signs made up by your fanfic rules, when Oda clearly stated WB(WSM) > Garp(a man), Oda's rule >>>> yours.

Sadly you have nothing to disprove WB is WSM...


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 19, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> They have a lot to do with your logic regarding PK though.



They have nothing in common. Strawman.



GucciBandana said:


> Again, has to do with your flawed logic.



Again, nothing in common. Strawman 2.



GucciBandana said:


> Because WB can either be WSM after the fight, or that if the fight kept going, he couldn't won, either way fits his title, I mean his title has to fit, Oda gave it... It's concrete as Newton's first law.



Nope they were portrayed with a tie, nothing more and nothing less and it was WB's best achievement.



GucciBandana said:


> but he showed WB is WSM, do you care?



Yes i also care for what else he has shown: "that WB cannot beat Roger."



GucciBandana said:


> so did Roger get weaker after the loot match or nah? stop beating around the bushes.



Never said he did, i said his last adventure he was with Crocus, who stabilized him.



GucciBandana said:


> Because they have something to do with your WB Roger Garp logic?



Strawman 3. Roger sees Garp as his equal.  



GucciBandana said:


> Oh yeah? If you call that "equals", then tell me how many perfect split Garp has with Sengoku, more than he has with Roger I bet.



The stronger Sengoku is portrayed the better marines look, Garp included. 



GucciBandana said:


> Boa is a pirate though, but does it matter than WB never beat her?



Why would i care? I argue Garp = WB = Roger not if WB ever beat Boa. So strawman number 4.



GucciBandana said:


> More than yours also, but less than Oda's obviously.



And yet Oda shows WB never beating Roger  



GucciBandana said:


> "Can beat" and "did beat" completely different concepts, I don't think you get it, just like "equal" and "close" completely different. Can Garp beat WB? As long as Garp isn't a perfect counter to WB, then no, no way, WB is WSM. Did Garp beat WB? No, he didn't even beat Tsuru... Only guy Garp ever beat on panel, was Chinjao.



Hmm Roger views Garp as his equal and WB never beat Roger, so yeah nothing guarantees WB can win against Garp either if he cannot beat Roger after multiple tries.



GucciBandana said:


> Stalemate means fought equally, but what Roger said and GV have nothing to do with "equal", it's like saying Garp = Sengoku via Shiki fight. In fact, Roger and Garp can't even reach stalemate(still not necessarily equal, but very close), Buggy ruled it out.



Roger didn't rule it out though.  



GucciBandana said:


> You can nearly kill somebody but still be weaker than that somebody, but you as a man, can't be as strong as WSM. In fact, the word in Japanese Roger used to describe what happened between him and Garp is "殺し合", go look it up what is means yourself.



Why would i look up something if i know what the official translation says?



GucciBandana said:


> All these equal signs made up by your fanfic rules, when Oda clearly stated WB(WSM) > Garp(a man), Oda's rule >>>> yours.
> 
> Sadly you have nothing to disprove WB is WSM...



WSM that isn't WSM because he never beat Roger. Mighty argument ^^


----------



## GucciBandana (Dec 19, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> They have nothing in common. Strawman.



Made somebody dodge the question though.



TheWiggian said:


> Again, nothing in common. Strawman 2.



Dodge No.2



TheWiggian said:


> Nope they were portrayed with a tie, nothing more and nothing less and it was WB's best achievement.



Did WB and Roger only exist during their "loot match"? Nothing before nothing after?



TheWiggian said:


> Yes i also care for what else he has shown: "that WB cannot beat Roger."



No, that's fanfic, Oda never stated WB can or cannot beat Roger, he only stated they fought 3 days as a stalemate, and WB is WSM. Can or Can Not completely goes into your fanfic.



TheWiggian said:


> Never said he did, i said his last adventure he was with Crocus, who stabilized him.



Ok, so stabilized means Roger's in good health condition? AKA Prime?



TheWiggian said:


> Strawman 3. Roger sees Garp as his equal.



Fanfic 3, Roger never said that.



TheWiggian said:


> The stronger Sengoku is portrayed the better marines look, Garp included.



Yeah, Sengoku is portrayed as Garp's "equal", just like Garp is Roger's "equal". Why would how the rest of the marine looks even matter? Marines are strong AF, you have guys like Akainu Kizaru showing that to everybody, but we talk about Garp Roger here.



TheWiggian said:


> Why would i care? I argue Garp = WB = Roger not if WB ever beat Boa. So strawman number 4.



Question dodged No.4, cuz destroys your flawed logic.



TheWiggian said:


> And yet Oda shows WB never beating Roger



And yet Oda shows WB never beating Boa?



TheWiggian said:


> Hmm Roger views Garp as his equal and WB never beat Roger, so yeah nothing guarantees WB can win against Garp either if he cannot beat Roger after multiple tries.



Not equal, but close, you just can't get your fanfic out of your head. WSM guarantees WB can win, against any man, during the time he holds the title, if fought till a winner is determined.



TheWiggian said:


> Roger didn't rule it out though.



Cuz he didn't imply much...



TheWiggian said:


> Why would i look up something if i know what the official translation says?



Because Japanese is the original?



TheWiggian said:


> WSM that isn't WSM because he never beat Roger. Mighty argument ^^



But WSM must be WSM, cuz Oda said so... Oda >>>> you, so def a mighty argument.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 20, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Made somebody dodge the question though.



If it's meaningless, it doesn't matter. They have their own feats.


GucciBandana said:


> Dodge No.2



Once you make a coherent connection what Jack has to do with Roger, Garp and WB I might take you serious.



GucciBandana said:


> Did WB and Roger only exist during their "loot match"? Nothing before nothing after?



I don't get what you're trying to say. WB and Roger were portrayed with a tie. There is nothing more to it. wB could not beat Roger to justify his title.



GucciBandana said:


> No, that's fanfic, Oda never stated WB can or cannot beat Roger, he only stated they fought 3 days as a stalemate, and WB is WSM. Can or Can Not completely goes into your fanfic.



They had multiple fights and the best was a tie. He did more than enough to show that WB was not superior to Roger. The rest is deflection on your end.



GucciBandana said:


> Ok, so stabilized means Roger's in good health condition? AKA Prime?



It was enough to finish the adventure.



GucciBandana said:


> Fanfic 3, Roger never said that.



"We" "nearly" "killed" "each" "other" "multiple/countless" "times".

He didn't portray one above the other. Equal ^^



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah, Sengoku is portrayed as Garp's "equal", just like Garp is Roger's "equal". Why would how the rest of the marine looks even matter? Marines are strong AF, you have guys like Akainu Kizaru showing that to everybody, but we talk about Garp Roger here.



That's what Iam saying marines look strong as fuck, Garp is equal to Roger and his partner and next best thing is most likely equal to Roger's partner Rayleigh.



GucciBandana said:


> Question dodged No.4, cuz destroys your flawed logic.



No idea what you're talking about but it seems to be another deflection since you lack arguments that WB > Garp.



GucciBandana said:


> And yet Oda shows WB never beating Boa?



Wow you really are desperate. WB tied against Roger and never beat him after multiple encounters. Your mentally challenged Boa argument isn't changing that.



GucciBandana said:


> Not equal, but close, you just can't get your fanfic out of your head. WSM guarantees WB can win, against any man, during the time he holds the title, if fought till a winner is determined.



Same way WSM guaranteed WB to win against Roger and in the end you're disappointed with a draw  



GucciBandana said:


> Cuz he didn't imply much...



He doesn't need to imply, he clearly said that he views Garp as his equal with them almost murdering each other multiple times, hype the WSM didn't receive.



GucciBandana said:


> Because Japanese is the original?



Good you can read Japanese and I'll read the translated version. Happy?



GucciBandana said:


> But WSM must be WSM, cuz Oda said so... Oda >>>> you, so def a mighty argument.



But WSM should be above Roger and yet the best thing that happenend was a standstill. WSM could not even bring a non WSM to the verge of death after multiple tries.


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## GucciBandana (Dec 20, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> If it's meaningless, it doesn't matter. They have their own feats.



Garp has his own feats too, so does Roger and WB?



TheWiggian said:


> Once you make a coherent connection what Jack has to do with Roger, Garp and WB I might take you serious.



hmmm... 5 day battle? While Roger WB only 3 days?



TheWiggian said:


> I don't get what you're trying to say. WB and Roger were portrayed with a tie. There is nothing more to it. wB could not beat Roger to justify his title.



But WB lived for like 25 more yeas after that... And his entire life is determined by one "loot match"?



TheWiggian said:


> They had multiple fights and the best was a tie. He did more than enough to show that WB was not superior to Roger. The rest is deflection on your end.



The biggest deflection here is you deflection Oda calling WB WSM. Maybe WB was not superior to Roger at that point, but he can be after.



TheWiggian said:


> It was enough to finish the adventure.



Again, dodging the question, so did he get weaker or not?



TheWiggian said:


> "We" "nearly" "killed" "each" "other" "multiple/countless" "times".
> 
> He didn't portray one above the other. Equal ^^



How many times do I have to say this simple logic, nearly kill each other does NOT imply equal. Sounds just like Oda didn't portray Sengoku to be above Garp, "equal"?



TheWiggian said:


> That's what Iam saying marines look strong as fuck, Garp is equal to Roger and his partner and next best thing is most likely equal to Roger's partner Rayleigh.



Rayleigh is under Roger, Roger is Rayleigh's captain... While Sengoku has higher rank than Garp, like when was Sengoku ever mentioned in the same statement as Rayleigh? If Garp is equal to WB, then Sengoku would be equal to WB, all 4 are equal.



TheWiggian said:


> No idea what you're talking about but it seems to be another deflection since you lack arguments that WB > Garp.



There's no such thing as lack of arguments when it comes to WB > Garp, Oda fully said WSM, and WSM > man.



TheWiggian said:


> Wow you really are desperate. WB tied against Roger and never beat him after multiple encounters. Your mentally challenged Boa argument isn't changing that.



Sure changes WB's title credibility over Boa, as your mentally challenged logic suggests.



TheWiggian said:


> Same way WSM guaranteed WB to win against Roger and in the end you're disappointed with a draw



Except the fight wasn't finished, since both can still keep going, and you have to prove WB was WSM then, which was not found anywhere in the manga.



TheWiggian said:


> He doesn't need to imply, he clearly said that he views Garp as his equal with them almost murdering each other multiple times, hype the WSM didn't receive.



But WSM received WSM... above anything Garp ever is.



TheWiggian said:


> Good you can read Japanese and I'll read the translated version. Happy?



I'm telling you the original context, but somebody is in denial because of his/her bias?



TheWiggian said:


> But WSM should be above Roger and yet the best thing that happenend was a standstill. WSM could not even bring a non WSM to the verge of death after multiple tries.



WSM should be above Roger, if he was WSM. And WSM can be above Roger, after the match, if Roger got weaker or WB got stronger. NOTHING contradict WSM is the strongest, contradicts your flawed logic big time though.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 20, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Garp has his own feats too, so does Roger and WB?



Ofc. What a stupid question.



GucciBandana said:


> hmmm... 5 day battle? While Roger WB only 3 days?



Surely in the realm of possibility. Also the blade argument I dropped before.



GucciBandana said:


> But WB lived for like 25 more yeas after that... And his entire life is determined by one "loot match"?



Dude I have no idea. Roger died and during his lifetime WB never defeated him. Can't say anything afterwards because there is nothing to compare it to.



GucciBandana said:


> The biggest deflection here is you deflection Oda calling WB WSM. Maybe WB was not superior to Roger at that point, but he can be after.



Yea that's meaningless to the argument since Roger is dead.



GucciBandana said:


> Again, dodging the question, so did he get weaker or not?



It was hinted at Roger being in pain and Crocus stabilized him so he could continue the journey. It was also said that Crocus was capable of slowing down the process of the disease. Most diseases weaken a person so...



GucciBandana said:


> How many times do I have to say this simple logic, nearly kill each other does NOT imply equal. Sounds just like Oda didn't portray Sengoku to be above Garp, "equal"?



What does it matter what you say? Roger said they were equal in terms of nearly killing each other, it happened to both of them during their encounters. Roger didn't mention any side to be superior over the other so that's perfect, equal portrayal and you didn't disprove it any way so far.



GucciBandana said:


> Rayleigh is under Roger, Roger is Rayleigh's captain... While Sengoku has higher rank than Garp, like when was Sengoku ever mentioned in the same statement as Rayleigh? If Garp is equal to WB, then Sengoku would be equal to WB, all 4 are equal.



They're all called legends and Garp declined the admiral title multiple times. We know that Garp was Roger's rival not Sengoku. Sengokus main rival was Shiki who he chased after while Garp was chasing mainly after Roger. Ray is Roger's partner and Garp and Sengoku share a similiar relationship.



GucciBandana said:


> There's no such thing as lack of arguments when it comes to WB > Garp, Oda fully said WSM, and WSM > man.



Roger is a man, is WB also > Roger?
How come he never beat him then?



GucciBandana said:


> Sure changes WB's title credibility over Boa, as your mentally challenged logic suggests.



Keep attacking the strawman 



GucciBandana said:


> Except the fight wasn't finished, since both can still keep going, and you have to prove WB was WSM then, which was not found anywhere in the manga.



But verified by an additional source.



GucciBandana said:


> But WSM received WSM... above anything Garp ever is.



And yet manga shows us he is not really the WSM because he never beat Roger. Man titles are so useless in this manga.






GucciBandana said:


> I'm telling you the original context, but somebody is in denial because of his/her bias?



Ok what is the original context?



GucciBandana said:


> WSM should be above Roger, if he was WSM.



And yet he isn't 



GucciBandana said:


> And WSM can be above Roger, after the match, if Roger got weaker or WB got stronger. NOTHING contradict WSM is the strongest, contradicts your flawed logic big time though.



Nothing except Roger who WB never beat and that Roger has another equal in Garp.

Keep thinking about it when you sleep tonight

Reactions: Like 1


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## Beast (Dec 20, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Ofc. What a stupid question.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You really think these guys will get the point?  im amazed people are misinterpreting such a simple line.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 20, 2020)

Beast said:


> You really think these guys will get the point?  im amazed people are misinterpreting such a simple line.



B-b-but t-t-the title... WB is t-t-the Wo-o-orld's S-s-stronkest M-m-man... H-h-he m-m-must be s-s-stronk-k-ker than Roger...


He never beat Roger and Roger has another rival that shares perfect, equal portrayal with him.

B-b-but W... S... M!!!

Meaningless, his best achievement was a tie.

B-b-but Oda gi-i-ive him t-t-title...

He also showed us that WB never beat Roger after multiple tries.

B-b-but WSM... He m-m-must be stronger... 

Then why isn't he?

B-b-but he is W... S... M....

Reactions: Funny 1


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## GucciBandana (Dec 20, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Ofc. What a stupid question.



But somebody somehow believes just looking at the 3 of them can determine their powerlevel? But not Smoker, Ace, Aokiji?



TheWiggian said:


> Surely in the realm of possibility. Also the blade argument I dropped before.



The blade one fully contradicted yourself.



TheWiggian said:


> Dude I have no idea. Roger died and during his lifetime WB never defeated him. Can't say anything afterwards because there is nothing to compare it to.



If you have no idea, why you so sure WB can't be stronger than Roger when Roger's alive? Hypocritical? 



TheWiggian said:


> Yea that's meaningless to the argument since Roger is dead.



Not right after the "loot match". Plus, Garp is still alive anyways.



TheWiggian said:


> It was hinted at Roger being in pain and Crocus stabilized him so he could continue the journey. It was also said that Crocus was capable of slowing down the process of the disease. Most diseases weaken a person so...



So... you still dodged the question.



TheWiggian said:


> What does it matter what you say? Roger said they were equal in terms of nearly killing each other, it happened to both of them during their encounters. Roger didn't mention any side to be superior over the other so that's perfect, equal portrayal and you didn't disprove it any way so far.



It doesn't matter what I say, just like guess how much it matters for you to think them being equal just because they nearly killed each other(tried to kill each other in fact)? Not one bit.
You do realize there are other content in the manga outside of a mere Roger comment right? Like only one stalemate Roger?



TheWiggian said:


> They're all called legends and Garp declined the admiral title multiple times. We know that Garp was Roger's rival not Sengoku. Sengokus main rival was Shiki who he chased after while Garp was chasing mainly after Roger. Ray is Roger's partner and Garp and Sengoku share a similiar relationship.



Yeah similar relationship, except you got it backwards, Roger higher rank than Rayleigh, Sengoku higher rank than Garp, facts.
Based off your logic of GV, Sengoku = Garp because of their fight vs Shiki, therefore Roger = WB = Garp = Sengoku = Rayleigh, as they all legends I guess    



TheWiggian said:


> Roger is a man, is WB also > Roger?
> How come he never beat him then?



I don't think you read or listen, WB > Roger, if Roger was alive during the time WB holds WSM title, indeed. WB never beat Roger maybe because he wasn't WSM? or maybe he can beat him, just never fought till there was a winner? Think out side of your linear straight line a bit, answer is simple.



TheWiggian said:


> Keep attacking the strawman



Keeping deflecting.



TheWiggian said:


> But verified by an additional source.



Nope, not when WB fought Roger, WB was WSM at that time verified by your fanfic.



TheWiggian said:


> And yet manga shows us he is not really the WSM because he never beat Roger. Man titles are so useless in this manga.



More useful than anything you can come up with.



TheWiggian said:


> Ok what is the original context?



"Tried to kill each other dozens of times" it the original Japanese context.



TheWiggian said:


> And yet he isn't



Exactly, if he wasn't WSM at the time, how can he be above Roger?



TheWiggian said:


> Nothing except Roger who WB never beat and that Roger has another equal in Garp.



Nothing suggests Roger and Garp were true equals. But suggest WB > Garp, Roger isn't even relevant here.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 21, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> But somebody somehow believes just looking at the 3 of them can determine their powerlevel? But not Smoker, Ace, Aokiji?



I don't get your point here. What are those 3 supposed to prove when it comes to Garp and Roger?



GucciBandana said:


> The blade one fully contradicted yourself.



Nah, it actually fits since the fights end faster.



GucciBandana said:


> If you have no idea, why you so sure WB can't be stronger than Roger when Roger's alive? Hypocritical?



I have no idea if WB surpassed Roger after the later died. If you do enlighten me pls with what kind of mental gymnastics you determine that?



GucciBandana said:


> Not right after the "loot match". Plus, Garp is still alive anyways.



Alright prove WB surpassed Roger after the loot match, I'll be waiting here.



GucciBandana said:


> So... you still dodged the question.



What question dude? What has a woman to do with a "man's" title in the first place? Especially when she was a little girl and enslaved by celestial dragons at that time?



GucciBandana said:


> It doesn't matter what I say, just like guess how much it matters for you to think them being equal just because they nearly killed each other(tried to kill each other in fact)? Not one bit.



You only need to convince Roger now to change his speech. 

 



GucciBandana said:


> You do realize there are other content in the manga outside of a mere Roger comment right? Like only one stalemate Roger?



Yea the WSM that can't beat another man. Why would I try to ignore the words of the PK that fought said man countless times and views him as his equal?



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah similar relationship, except you got it backwards, Roger higher rank than Rayleigh, Sengoku higher rank than Garp, facts.



Garp never wanted a higher rank, you should start to read the story. Therefore Sengokus title means nothing to Garp just like WB's WSM title.  



GucciBandana said:


> Based off your logic of GV, Sengoku = Garp because of their fight vs Shiki, therefore Roger = WB = Garp = Sengoku = Rayleigh, as they all legends I guess



Except I never said that they're all equal but you do like attacking strawmen after all.

Sadly it changes nothing in the Garp = Roger = WB part. As many deflections as you try to throw into the conversation. 






GucciBandana said:


> I don't think you read or listen, WB > Roger, if Roger was alive during the time WB holds WSM title, indeed. WB never beat Roger maybe because he wasn't WSM? or maybe he can beat him, just never fought till there was a winner? Think out side of your linear straight line a bit, answer is simple.



Or he never beat him as the manga has shown and a secondary source, that's still > you already said he was WSM at that time.



GucciBandana said:


> Keeping deflecting.



Bring in more characters, Aokiji, Sakazuki, ace, smoker, boa seem to be not enough to prove how PK level characters duke it out.



GucciBandana said:


> Nope, not when WB fought Roger, WB was WSM at that time verified by your fanfic.



Didn't know that Oda's Vivre cards were fanfic.



GucciBandana said:


> More useful than anything you can come up with.



Once the WSM can beat another man we will walk over this bridge.  




GucciBandana said:


> "Tried to kill each other dozens of times" it the original Japanese context.




*Spoiler*: _Svg_ 




Roger: Garp!! I'm gonna have a kid!!

But unfortunately, I'm not gonna live long enough to see'im.

Garp: Why are you telling me this, Roger!? I'm a marine!!

You should know every woman associated with you will get capital punishment!!

Roger: That's why I'm telling you.

The government will surely trace my footsteps back a year.

They'll find her and she'll be killed!! But my unborn child has no sins!! Garp!!

*We've fought to the death tons of times!!*

I trust you like I trust a friend!!

You protect him!! [[Added missing bubbles here]]

SFX at Roger: Smile

Garp: You can't tell me what to do!!

Roger: Nah... I know you'll do it... !!!

Make sure to take good care of my kid!!





*Spoiler*: _cnet_ 




Flashback!Roger: Garp!! I'm going to be having a kid...! // But I'm afraid by the time my kid arrives in the world, I'll already be gone...
Flashback!Garp: And why do you feel the need to tell this to a Marine like me, Roger?!! / Any woman with connections to you will be put straight to death, you should know that!!
Flashback!Roger: That's _why_ I'm telling this to you. / The Government are sure to trace all of my activities in this last year... // They'll find her, and they'll kill her!! / ...But a child who is yet to be born bears no sin, Garp!! // *The two of us have nearly killed each other so many times...* we're like old pals now, aren't we?!! / I trust you as much as I'd trust my own crewmates!! // Protect my child!!
Flashback!Garp: Absolutely preposterous!!!
Flashback!Roger: No... you'll do it, I know you will......!! // I leave my child in your hands!!





*Spoiler*: __ 






Roger: They'll find and kill her! However, a child who is yet to be born bears no sin, Garp! You and I have nearly killed each other tens of times now... you could say we're buddies, right? If it's you we're talking about, then I can trust you like my own crew! Protect my kid!!
Garp: Nonsense!
Roger: Nah... I'm sure you will. I leave my kid in your hands!




Credits to @MShadows for the third pic and translation. Easiest choice of my life, all 3 say the same which is not "tried to kill each other" but "nearly killed each other".



GucciBandana said:


> Exactly, if he wasn't WSM at the time, how can he be above Roger?




*Spoiler*: __ 









Official sources really got you on the ropes eh. 

 



GucciBandana said:


> Nothing suggests Roger and Garp were true equals. But suggest WB > Garp, Roger isn't even relevant here.



Except Roger's speech and WB failing to beat Roger after multiple tries.


----------



## Kingdom Come (Dec 21, 2020)

Roger=Whitebeard=Garp > Oden/Mihawk/Rayleigh/Yonkos > Admirals/Sengoku/Kong

Oldbeard bullied the shit out of Akainu

Now imagine this matchup


----------



## GucciBandana (Dec 21, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> I don't get your point here. What are those 3 supposed to prove when it comes to Garp and Roger?



Proves that only looking at the exchanges within the 3, but nothing outside, is ridiculous logic.



TheWiggian said:


> Nah, it actually fits since the fights end faster.



Jack fight on Zou ended faster?




TheWiggian said:


> I have no idea if WB surpassed Roger after the later died. If you do enlighten me pls with what kind of mental gymnastics you determine that?



When he got WSM? While(if) Roger was alive. Oda already told you the answer.



TheWiggian said:


> Alright prove WB surpassed Roger after the loot match, I'll be waiting here.



WSM? WSM? WSM?



TheWiggian said:


> What question dude? What has a woman to do with a "man's" title in the first place? Especially when she was a little girl and enslaved by celestial dragons at that time?



Shows you that you don't have to "beat" someone to be stronger than that someone, tons of other info you can go with.



TheWiggian said:


> You only need to convince Roger now to change his speech.



I just need to read the Japanese version and understand it.



TheWiggian said:


> Yea the WSM that can't beat another man. Why would I try to ignore the words of the PK that fought said man countless times and views him as his equal?



"can't"? says you?
Gimme one instance Roger described Garp as "equal", Garp fully called this man a devil, same thing DCJ called Garp.



TheWiggian said:


> Garp never wanted a higher rank, you should start to read the story. Therefore Sengokus title means nothing to Garp just like WB's WSM title.



Garp never wanted a higher rank... proves Garp outranks Sengoku like Roger outranks Rayleigh? Great logic as usual. Of course Sengoku's rank means nothing to Garp, they are "nearly equal" like Roger and Garp, but Garp is the higher one here.




TheWiggian said:


> Except I never said that they're all equal but you do like attacking strawmen after all.



Only using your logic? You did claim Roger and Garp being equal due to some ambiguous split panel.



TheWiggian said:


> Sadly it changes nothing in the Garp = Roger = WB part. As many deflections as you try to throw into the conversation.



Like you change nothing about WB = WSM? With all your deflection?



TheWiggian said:


> Or he never beat him as the manga has shown and a secondary source, that's still > you already said he was WSM at that time.



WSM at the time? Says you I'm sure.



TheWiggian said:


> Bring in more characters, Aokiji, Sakazuki, ace, smoker, boa seem to be not enough to prove how PK level characters duke it out.



I bring in the entire manga, because unlike somebody, I actually read parts outside of Roger WB Garp. Also, if you consider Garp PK level, Akainu might be PK level also.



TheWiggian said:


> Didn't know that Oda's Vivre cards were fanfic.



1. Not from Oda
2. Never contradicted what I said.



TheWiggian said:


> Once the WSM can beat another man we will walk over this bridge.



Once you convince Oda to take WSM away from him, we can consider judging him based off "beating".



TheWiggian said:


> *Spoiler*: _Svg_
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Fought to death is the right translation, I gave you the word itself, look it up:
殺し合



TheWiggian said:


> Credits to @MShadows for the third pic and translation. Easiest choice of my life, all 3 say the same which is not "tried to kill each other" but "nearly killed each other".
> 
> 
> 
> ...



How? I fully said, WB can gain WSM title during Roger era, after the loot match, if Roger got weaker after, and WB got stronger, Roger is sick and WB is younger afterall.



TheWiggian said:


> Except Roger's speech and WB failing to beat Roger after multiple tries.



Contradicts nothing, and Oda's words is OP powerscale first law, WSM > any men during the time he holds the title, without a doubt.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 21, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Proves that only looking at the exchanges within the 3, but nothing outside, is ridiculous logic.



Why should I include feats from other characters if those have their own?
No one does that shit unless there a lack of info.



GucciBandana said:


> Jack fight on Zou ended faster?



Why would I give a shit how long jack's fight took?



GucciBandana said:


> When he got WSM? While(if) Roger was alive. Oda already told you the answer.



Yes WSM WB never beat Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> WSM? WSM? WSM?



Never beat Roger. Never beat Roger. Never beat Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> Shows you that you don't have to "beat" someone to be stronger than that someone, tons of other info you can go with.



You use a woman to justify WB's title. You're beyond help.



GucciBandana said:


> I just need to read the Japanese version and understand it.



You've already been exposed as a liar when it comes to translations. 





GucciBandana said:


> "can't"? says you?
> Gimme one instance Roger described Garp as "equal", Garp fully called this man a devil, same thing DCJ called Garp.



Show me WB beating Roger and I'll concede.





GucciBandana said:


> Garp never wanted a higher rank... proves Garp outranks Sengoku like Roger outranks Rayleigh? Great logic as usual. Of course Sengoku's rank means nothing to Garp, they are "nearly equal" like Roger and Garp, but Garp is the higher one here.



Nothing to do with outranking. Garp could've easily been admiral if not more if he didn't keep declining the titles.

So Garp who could've easily been the same rank as Sengoku doesn't mean Sengoku has any leverage over him.



GucciBandana said:


> Only using your logic? You did claim Roger and Garp being equal due to some ambiguous split panel.



1 is calling all of them legends while the other is a clear powerlevel statement. Try again.



GucciBandana said:


> Like you change nothing about WB = WSM? With all your deflection?



WSM WB = Roger = Garp, that is correct.



GucciBandana said:


> WSM at the time? Says you I'm sure.





Man this VC really destroys your headcanon doesn't it? 



GucciBandana said:


> I bring in the entire manga, because unlike somebody, I actually read parts outside of Roger WB Garp. Also, if you consider Garp PK level, Akainu might be PK level also.



Nice so you are starting to believe Garp = WB and Roger. we are making progress. I don't see why Akainu wouldn't be up there, man got the best hype, portrayal and feats currently.




GucciBandana said:


> 1. Not from Oda
> 2. Never contradicted what I said.




*Spoiler*: __ 




Vivre Card - One Piece Visual Dictionary​ATTRIBUTION​AUTHOR:​




I still just view them as secondary canon if the manga should say otherwise but that's not the case with the WSM WB since the manga never clarified when he got the title. It's > you any day though.





GucciBandana said:


> Once you convince Oda to take WSM away from him, we can consider judging him based off "beating".



I don't need to, Oda already shown us everything we need, that the WSM never beat Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> Fought to death is the right translation, I gave you the word itself, look it up:
> 殺し合



Nah I trust I native Japanese speaking translators like @MShadows more than your Google translation.




GucciBandana said:


> How? I fully said, WB can gain WSM title during Roger era, after the loot match, if Roger got weaker after, and WB got stronger, Roger is sick and WB is younger afterall.



 WSM WB by the only source we have on that = Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> Contradicts nothing, and Oda's words is OP powerscale first law, WSM > any men during the time he holds the title, without a doubt.



WSM that can't beat a man. Yeah I heard that already.


----------



## Beast (Dec 21, 2020)

So this guys argument is... WB and Roger aren’t equal because WB was WSM?


----------



## GucciBandana (Dec 22, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Why should I include feats from other characters if those have their own?
> No one does that shit unless there a lack of info.



Yeah, lack of info, clearly the case here, man's using a silhouetted panel as evidence lmfao.



TheWiggian said:


> Why would I give a shit how long jack's fight took?



Cuz it's longer than Roger WB fight?



TheWiggian said:


> Yes WSM WB never beat Roger.



And? Boa? Ring Ring.



TheWiggian said:


> Never beat Roger. Never beat Roger. Never beat Roger.



Never beat Boa, blah blah blah.



TheWiggian said:


> You use a woman to justify WB's title. You're beyond help.
> 
> 
> 
> You've already been exposed as a liar when it comes to translations.



Nope, did not lie, 殺し合 means "to kill each other", not nearly killed, the latter is "殺されかけた", which is what Ace said to Jinbei(without the each other part). Nothing indications Roger and Garp nearly killed each other(as in it happened), just they fought in matches with intention to kill each other.



TheWiggian said:


> Show me WB beating Roger and I'll concede.



Don't need to, because... Boa?



TheWiggian said:


> Nothing to do with outranking. Garp could've easily been admiral if not more if he didn't keep declining the titles.



And Sengoku is not?



TheWiggian said:


> So Garp who could've easily been the same rank as Sengoku doesn't mean Sengoku has any leverage over him.



No leverage, but Garp no leverage over Sengoku either, can Rayleigh say that about Roger?



TheWiggian said:


> 1 is calling all of them legends while the other is a clear powerlevel statement. Try again.



powerscaling according to?



TheWiggian said:


> WSM WB = Roger = Garp, that is correct.



Garp can't be as strong as WSM, sorry.



TheWiggian said:


> Man this VC really destroys your headcanon doesn't it?



What part destroyed anything I said? Maybe your head cannon destroyed it?



TheWiggian said:


> Nice so you are starting to believe Garp = WB and Roger. we are making progress. I don't see why Akainu wouldn't be up there, man got the best hype, portrayal and feats currently.



I never said Garp = WB, of course Roger is a whole diff case.
So WB = Roger = Garp = Akainu?



TheWiggian said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I never said VC is BS did I? Not straight from Oda, less weigh than Manga and SBS that's what I said, also, Oda didn't actually write it, only contributed...



TheWiggian said:


> I don't need to, Oda already shown us everything we need, that the WSM never beat Roger.
> 
> 
> 
> Nah I trust I native Japanese speaking translators like @MShadows more than your Google translation.



I'm showing you how we can learn together right? With all the online resource, but you refuse due to your bias.



TheWiggian said:


> WSM WB by the only source we have on that = Roger.
> 
> 
> 
> WSM that can't beat a man. Yeah I heard that already.



Boa, Boa, Boa.
WB = Boa too?
Too bad non of your deflections work when Oda himself calls WB WSM. He should've designed Garp as a woman.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 22, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Yeah, lack of info, clearly the case here, man's using a silhouetted panel as evidence lmfao.



Got more than that? Present it to us, else we need to go by Garp = Roger > Rocks



GucciBandana said:


> Cuz it's longer than Roger WB fight?



Jack fought in mammoth form. The moment he drew a weapon like CC's gas it was over, looks like the weapon argument isn't baseless after all eh?



GucciBandana said:


> And? Boa? Ring Ring.



What is with Boa? She is not in that league unlike Roger and Garp, your argument falls apart.



GucciBandana said:


> Never beat Boa, blah blah blah.



Heythe title argument is your trump card, the more characters you bring up the worse he looks 



GucciBandana said:


> Nope, did not lie, 殺し合 means "to kill each other", not nearly killed, the latter is "殺されかけた", which is what Ace said to Jinbei(without the each other part). Nothing indications Roger and Garp nearly killed each other(as in it happened), just they fought in matches with intention to kill each other.



All translators say otherwise. Unless you're somehow better than all of them i take their word over yours ^^



GucciBandana said:


> Don't need to, because... Boa?



Again, idc if you can't prove that WB was indeed stronger based on the title, it's not my argument but yours.



GucciBandana said:


> And Sengoku is not?



So you agree after all. What's your point bringing Sengoku's title up then?



GucciBandana said:


> No leverage, but Garp no leverage over Sengoku either, can Rayleigh say that about Roger?



Garp is Rogers rival, Sengoku is Shikis. Last time i checked Roger > Shiki.



GucciBandana said:


> powerscaling according to?



They're all legends but even you argue about Roger > Rayleigh so this argument of yours got no legs to stand on, you defeated it yourself with that:

_can Rayleigh say that about Roger?_

You should drop powerlevel debates man 



GucciBandana said:


> Garp can't be as strong as WSM, sorry.



Well he is as strong as Roger who is equal to the WSM, so yea he can.



GucciBandana said:


> What part destroyed anything I said? Maybe your head cannon destroyed it?



Whitebeards vivre card is owning you hard here.



GucciBandana said:


> I never said Garp = WB, of course Roger is a whole diff case.
> So WB = Roger = Garp = Akainu?



WB = Roger = Garp >= Sakazuki for now, who still will be relevant later on and most likely reach that level too.



GucciBandana said:


> I never said VC is BS did I? Not straight from Oda, less weigh than Manga and SBS that's what I said, also, Oda didn't actually write it, only contributed...



Yea, but it's still a better source than you so WB was WSM when he couldn't defeat Roger. Finally you grasped it.




GucciBandana said:


> I'm showing you how we can learn together right? With all the online resource, but you refuse due to your bias.



Learn what together? Roger and Garp was already established pre TS and further reinforced post TS during the God Valley flashback. Whitebeard's vivre card covers the lack of info regarding his title. There is nothing left to learn unless we get new info.



GucciBandana said:


> Boa, Boa, Boa.
> WB = Boa too?
> Too bad non of your deflections work when Oda himself calls WB WSM. He should've designed Garp as a woman.



Just give me a reason to assume Boa could compete with either of the trio. She is scaled to Doflamingo at best. Your argument is just trash. WB = Roger = Garp from all we know.


----------



## GucciBandana (Dec 22, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Got more than that? Present it to us, else we need to go by Garp = Roger > Rocks



What presented to us is clearly Garp + Roger > Rocks. Or else we need to go by Garp = Sengoku > Shiki?



TheWiggian said:


> Jack fought in mammoth form. The moment he drew a weapon like CC's gas it was over, looks like the weapon argument isn't baseless after all eh?



Oh so Jack didn't have scythe in his human form I guess?



TheWiggian said:


> What is with Boa? She is not in that league unlike Roger and Garp, your argument falls apart.



hmm, Roger, Garp, WB never beat her though...



TheWiggian said:


> Heythe title argument is your trump card, the more characters you bring up the worse he looks



Of course it's trump card, cuz Oda said it, can't get a better trump card than that. More characters to destroy your logic, the more you deflect the worse Garp looks.



TheWiggian said:


> All translators say otherwise. Unless you're somehow better than all of them i take their word over yours ^^



Says you I guess? I guess you are somebody who listens to "translators" you find, but don't listen to Oda.



TheWiggian said:


> Again, idc if you can't prove that WB was indeed stronger based on the title, it's not my argument but yours.



WB is indeed stronger, by the title... It's an universal law, you know like thing you use to prove other things?



TheWiggian said:


> So you agree after all. What's your point bringing Sengoku's title up then?



Do I agree Garp could reach same rank as Sengoku? Yeah. Do I have agree Garp is as strong as WSM? no.



TheWiggian said:


> Garp is Rogers rival, Sengoku is Shikis. Last time i checked Roger > Shiki.



I guess it's just like last time I checked Roger > Garp? Or even better one, I checked Roger often matched WB, Garp matches Sengoku, last time I checked, WB > Sengoku.



TheWiggian said:


> They're all legends but even you argue about Roger > Rayleigh so this argument of yours got no legs to stand on, you defeated it yourself with that:
> 
> _can Rayleigh say that about Roger?_
> 
> You should drop powerlevel debates man



What? Is it common sense Roger > Rayleigh? I mean, so is WB > Garp, but that's common sense to a less degree compare to Roger Rayleigh. Clearly the one who should drop pwerlevel debates is the one who refuses to use Oda's powerlevel statements.




TheWiggian said:


> Well he is as strong as Roger who is equal to the WSM, so yea he can.



He is almost as strong as Roger, who is prob equal to WSM, but then there's a direct comparison between Garp and WB due to Oda statement, why you going refuse to take a direct route but goes around with shaky logic? 



TheWiggian said:


> Whitebeards vivre card is owning you hard here.



Which part? Another self claimed fanfic "owning"?



TheWiggian said:


> WB = Roger = Garp >= Sakazuki for now, who still will be relevant later on and most likely reach that level too.



No way, Sengoku = Garp, cuz Garp gets a split panel with him, Sakazuki = Sengoku, cuz they both fleet admirals, actually Sakazuki prob a little stronger, cuz Luffy's obstacles will be a little greater than Rogers, therefore Sakakuzi >= WB = Roger = Garp = Sengoku, according to your logic.



TheWiggian said:


> Yea, but it's still a better source than you so WB was WSM when he couldn't defeat Roger. Finally you grasped it.



Oda is a better source than VC, who's a better source than you, therefore WSM > anything you can come up with, ever.



TheWiggian said:


> Learn what together? Roger and Garp was already established pre TS and further reinforced post TS during the God Valley flashback. Whitebeard's vivre card covers the lack of info regarding his title. There is nothing left to learn unless we get new info.



Japanese context of course. Garp and Sengoku were already established pre TS also, and further reinforced post TS during Oden flashback.
Yet, for some reason Sengoku doesn't equal Roger or WB... hmmm.



TheWiggian said:


> Just give me a reason to assume Boa could compete with either of the trio. She is scaled to Doflamingo at best. Your argument is just trash. WB = Roger = Garp from all we know.



Boa doesn't, but Roger or WB never beat her, so they must not be stronger I guess, according to your logic.
Why would it matter what Boa is scaled to? Just like Garp as a man, is scaled below WSM, but that doesn't matter here, right?


----------



## Nox (Dec 22, 2020)

On 50 posts a page and this Thread is 6 pages deep. All this debating over Akainu and Garp, like Koby won't surpass them, so it doesn't matter.


----------



## Beast (Dec 23, 2020)

Nox said:


> On 50 posts a page and this Thread is 6 pages deep. All this debating over Akainu and Garp, like Koby won't surpass them, so it doesn't matter.


The last few pages are about...

WSM title/ WB/ Roger/ Garp.

apparently Gucci here doesn’t understand that WB is both equal to Roger and Was still WSM, he doesn’t understand how WB is the strongest and has an equal lol, it’s hurting his brain too much.

Reactions: Funny 1


----------



## Bobybobster (Dec 23, 2020)

tbh WB could've been stronger than roger, but may have made up for it in other areas (prob some OP haki shit).


----------



## Beast (Dec 23, 2020)

Bobybobster said:


> tbh WB could've been stronger than roger, but may have made up for it in other areas (prob some OP haki shit).


We know WB was never stronger then Roger.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 23, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> What presented to us is clearly Garp + Roger > Rocks. Or else we need to go by Garp = Sengoku > Shiki?



Yep Sengoku is up there at the top, he doesn't have superior portrayal to Garp though, it's the other way around. And yes Shiki was stomped hard that day, Sengoku alone as his main rival would've been capable of defeating him, Garp secured a quick win with a single battleship dropped on MF.



GucciBandana said:


> Oh so Jack didn't have scythe in his human form I guess?



Don't forget Neko and Inu switched every 12 hours to recover. It's not like each of them fought 5 days straight against him.



GucciBandana said:


> hmm, Roger, Garp, WB never beat her though...



I doubt there is a need for a serious response on a troll argument like Boa. Once Boa plays in the pirate king league you can come back for more "L's".



GucciBandana said:


> Of course it's trump card, cuz Oda said it, can't get a better trump card than that. More characters to destroy your logic, the more you deflect the worse Garp looks.



The World's Strongest Man that cannot beat another man. Do i need to say more? 



GucciBandana said:


> Says you I guess? I guess you are somebody who listens to "translators" you find, but don't listen to Oda.



Translators that translate Oda's words since i obviously don't speak japanese iam relying on them and all of them say the same: "nearly killing each other countless times".





GucciBandana said:


> WB is indeed stronger, by the title... It's an universal law, you know like thing you use to prove other things?



It's not, Oda was kind enough to show us that WB never beat Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> Do I agree Garp could reach same rank as Sengoku? Yeah. Do I have agree Garp is as strong as WSM? no.



You should rather question yourself if WB was indeed the WSM since you know he didn't beat a man.



GucciBandana said:


> I guess it's just like last time I checked Roger > Garp? Or even better one, I checked Roger often matched WB, Garp matches Sengoku, last time I checked, WB > Sengoku.



WB = Roger = Garp > Sengoku, you are correct with that. I like your double standarts, you take Roger's words for granted that he rather fights Sengoku and Garp while completely ignoring his speech that Garp is his equal who nearly killed him multiple times and vice versa while Sengoku never received that praise and neither did WB.



GucciBandana said:


> What? Is it common sense Roger > Rayleigh? I mean, so is WB > Garp, but that's common sense to a less degree compare to Roger Rayleigh. Clearly the one who should drop pwerlevel debates is the one who refuses to use Oda's powerlevel statements.



Nope. Rayleigh albeit being Roger's partner and having a king epithet is still Rogers nakama. Same can't be said for Garp who almost killed his captain multiple times in his career. Did WB have the same hype despite being stronger by your words? Why couldn't he if thats the case?



GucciBandana said:


> He is almost as strong as Roger, who is prob equal to WSM, but then there's a direct comparison between Garp and WB due to Oda statement, why you going refuse to take a direct route but goes around with shaky logic?



Nah WSM is equal to Roger by his best accomplishment from many, which is a tie. Garps best accomplishments are almost killing Roger and defeating the strongest rival crew (which included WB) of Roger together with the PK.



GucciBandana said:


> Which part? Another self claimed fanfic "owning"?



VC remains > you. 



GucciBandana said:


> No way, Sengoku = Garp, cuz Garp gets a split panel with him, Sakazuki = Sengoku, cuz they both fleet admirals, actually Sakazuki prob a little stronger, cuz Luffy's obstacles will be a little greater than Rogers, therefore Sakakuzi >= WB = Roger = Garp = Sengoku, according to your logic.



Yes Sengoku receives praise in the same way Garp does from Roger, also said Roger praises Garp way more with death battles, outshining even the WSM. Also the same Sengoku praises Garp on the same level as Roger when we saw the god valley incident FB. Garp exceeds Sengoku by portrayal very clearly.



GucciBandana said:


> Oda is a better source than VC, who's a better source than you, therefore WSM > anything you can come up with, ever.



Yea but Oda didn't cover us with information since when WB was considered WSm, which he did with the VC.



GucciBandana said:


> Japanese context of course. Garp and Sengoku were already established pre TS also, and further reinforced post TS during Oden flashback.
> Yet, for some reason Sengoku doesn't equal Roger or WB... hmmm.



Roger's rival
Nearly killing the PK multiple times
God Valley equal force

>

Taking shiki into ID
PK wanting to fight Sengoku or Garp



GucciBandana said:


> Boa doesn't, but Roger or WB never beat her, so they must not be stronger I guess, according to your logic.
> Why would it matter what Boa is scaled to? Just like Garp as a man, is scaled below WSM, but that doesn't matter here, right?



Look Boa is first of all not even a man, i have don't know if you secretly expect her to be a trans and no idea if you swing that way, it's none of my concern.
Second Boa will never be in the league of a PK unlike Roger, WB and Garp.
3rd the WSM couldn't beat another man, so thats out of the window too.

That's why WSM means nothing to Garp.


----------



## GucciBandana (Dec 23, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Yep Sengoku is up there at the top, he doesn't have superior portrayal to Garp though, it's the other way around. And yes Shiki was stomped hard that day, Sengoku alone as his main rival would've been capable of defeating him, Garp secured a quick win with a single battleship dropped on MF.



"The battle went on to destroy half of MF" - then called a quick win.
I guess Sengoku called Rocks "Roger's first and most formidable foe", meaning Roger would've been capable of defeating Rocks alone as well? Garp was just a tag along?
A lot of fanfic here, as logic that don't make sense at all(result aside, like what does Sengoku being rival have anything to do with defeating him?), as usual.



TheWiggian said:


> Don't forget Neko and Inu switched every 12 hours to recover. It's not like each of them fought 5 days straight against him.



Did Jack take a break too?



TheWiggian said:


> I doubt there is a need for a serious response on a troll argument like Boa. Once Boa plays in the pirate king league you can come back for more "L's".



The biggest L is denying WSM.
By your logic, Boa can easily play in the PK league, since Boa easily overpowers Smoker, Smoker clashes equally with Ace, Ace clashes equally with Aokiji, Aokiji 10 days Akainu barely lost, by your linear logic, without looking outside, that makes Boa stronger than Aokiji, possibly stronger than Akainu as well, PK league indeed.




TheWiggian said:


> The World's Strongest Man that cannot beat another man. Do i need to say more?



WSP can't defeat Boa.



TheWiggian said:


> Translators that translate Oda's words since i obviously don't speak japanese iam relying on them and all of them say the same: "nearly killing each other countless times".



I just fully showed you the kanji and taught you how it is used through online resource. Refuse to look at it = big denial = big L.



TheWiggian said:


> It's not, Oda was kind enough to show us that WB never beat Roger.



never beat Boa either.



TheWiggian said:


> You should rather question yourself if WB was indeed the WSM since you know he didn't beat a man.



WSP didn't beat many pirates, one of them is Boa.



TheWiggian said:


> WB = Roger = Garp > Sengoku, you are correct with that. I like your double standarts, you take Roger's words for granted that he rather fights Sengoku and Garp while completely ignoring his speech that Garp is his equal who nearly killed him multiple times and vice versa while Sengoku never received that praise and neither did WB.



The only double standard here is placing Garp above Sengoku, but not WB above Garp. I mean, taking Roger's words might be pretty bad, but nowhere as bad as taking Oda's words for granted.
Funny logic here: Oda's strongest doesn't mean strongest, but Roger's vague statement means "equal".

  



TheWiggian said:


> Nope. Rayleigh albeit being Roger's partner and having a king epithet is still Rogers nakama. Same can't be said for Garp who almost killed his captain multiple times in his career. Did WB have the same hype despite being stronger by your words? Why couldn't he if thats the case?



Rayleigh ranks below Roger in the crew... Are you trying to say Roger = WB = Garp = Rayleigh now?
Why would WB need anything else, he's WSM... That's like the most hype thing you can get.



TheWiggian said:


> Nah WSM is equal to Roger by his best accomplishment from many, which is a tie. Garps best accomplishments are almost killing Roger and defeating the strongest rival crew (which included WB) of Roger together with the PK.



But why would accomplishment matter here when Oda fully stated WB is WSM and Garp is a man? Like what's Dragon's biggest accomplishment? Stopping Smoker? Well I guess at least these characters WB Roger couldn't beat have something in common now, Boa isn't alone anymore.



TheWiggian said:


> VC remains > you.



Sure, still > you though, who tries to deny Oda.



TheWiggian said:


> Yes Sengoku receives praise in the same way Garp does from Roger, also said Roger praises Garp way more with death battles, outshining even the WSM. Also the same Sengoku praises Garp on the same level as Roger when we saw the god valley incident FB. Garp exceeds Sengoku by portrayal very clearly.



Just like WB exceeds Garp by portrayal, by definition, which is very clear, but somebody can't see it?



TheWiggian said:


> Yea but Oda didn't cover us with information since when WB was considered WSm, which he did with the VC.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yeah sure, just like:
WSM > man(Garp) > man(Sengoku)



TheWiggian said:


> Look Boa is first of all not even a man, i have don't know if you secretly expect her to be a trans and no idea if you swing that way, it's none of my concern.
> Second Boa will never be in the league of a PK unlike Roger, WB and Garp.
> 3rd the WSM couldn't beat another man, so thats out of the window too.
> 
> That's why WSM means nothing to Garp.



Boa is a pirate though, WB can't beat her, therefore WSP out of the window too.
Plus like I said, Boa has ways to scale to PK level, just like how Garp creeps onto WSM somehow, with bias. Boa > Smoker = Ace = Aokiji <= Akainu, therefore Boa is in PK realm now, you are the one who likes to look at WB Roger Garp like that too right? Linear tunnel vision comparison.
Garp, PK, WB have nothing on Boa.

Does Boa actually scales to PK level? Hell nah, but if Garp can "equal" WSM, Boa might as well be PK level.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 23, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> "The battle went on to destroy half of MF" - then called a quick win.
> I guess Sengoku called Rocks "Roger's first and most formidable foe", meaning Roger would've been capable of defeating Rocks alone as well? Garp was just a tag along?
> A lot of fanfic here, as logic that don't make sense at all(result aside, like what does Sengoku being rival have anything to do with defeating him?), as usual.




*Spoiler*: __ 









I just see one battleship dropped on MF which roughly covers half the buildings, well not even half of it.

Shiki's powers allow him to leviate anything he touches. Dude was stomped hard if he only made it to one battleship. Not sure what you expected 1 top tier ain't doing shit to 2 of them.



GucciBandana said:


> Did Jack take a break too?



No he didn't. Them taking a break every 12 hours for half a day though suggests they would've went down way faster.



GucciBandana said:


> The biggest L is denying WSM.
> By your logic, Boa can easily play in the PK league, since Boa easily overpowers Smoker, Smoker clashes equally with Ace, Ace clashes equally with Aokiji, Aokiji 10 days Akainu barely lost, by your linear logic, without looking outside, that makes Boa stronger than Aokiji, possibly stronger than Akainu as well, PK league indeed.



Nope. WB was the WSM yet he couldn't beat a man. It's denial to believe he is the strongest despite failing to prove it.



GucciBandana said:


> WSP can't defeat Boa.



 

Why would I care? Iam not using WSP and WSM to prove WB is above Garp here.



GucciBandana said:


> I just fully showed you the kanji and taught you how it is used through online resource. Refuse to look at it = big denial = big L.



Dude idc what you show me when official sources and native Japanese translator's already translated it multiple times. 



GucciBandana said:


> never beat Boa either.



Your trump argument not mine.  



GucciBandana said:


> WSP didn't beat many pirates, one of them is Boa.



Why would I care Garp is not a pirate. 
 



GucciBandana said:


> The only double standard here is placing Garp above Sengoku, but not WB above Garp. I mean, taking Roger's words might be pretty bad, but nowhere as bad as taking Oda's words for granted.
> Funny logic here: Oda's strongest doesn't mean strongest, but Roger's vague statement means "equal".



Oda showed us that WB can't beat Roger, you kite some nonsense with other character's while failing to prove WB was indeed the WSM. 



GucciBandana said:


> Rayleigh ranks below Roger in the crew... Are you trying to say Roger = WB = Garp = Rayleigh now?
> Why would WB need anything else, he's WSM... That's like the most hype thing you can get.



No you're trying to say that. 

Roger = Garp = WB > Ray and Sengoku.

Yea WSM remains meaningless unless he finally beats Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> But why would accomplishment matter here when Oda fully stated WB is WSM and Garp is a man? Like what's Dragon's biggest accomplishment? Stopping Smoker? Well I guess at least these characters WB Roger couldn't beat have something in common now, Boa isn't alone anymore.



Because WSM WB never beat Roger and neither nearly killed him unlike Garp who had Roger on the verge of death mutliple times. WB never managed to pull that off.  



GucciBandana said:


> Sure, still > you though, who tries to deny Oda.



Oda says WB is WSM, he also shows WB can't beat Roger. Oda via VC: WB was WSM way before the great age of pirates.

Conclusion: WB is WSM but never beat Roger, therefore his title is meaningless to someone like Roger or Garp who is literally Roger's equal.




GucciBandana said:


> Just like WB exceeds Garp by portrayal, by definition, which is very clear, but somebody can't see it?



WB exceeds Garp by his title only which we already been shown by Oda that he can still hold despite not being capable of beating other men.



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah sure, just like:
> WSM > man(Garp) > man(Sengoku)



WSM can't beat a man (Roger) who has another equal like Garp.
WSM gives him nothing over those 2.



GucciBandana said:


> Boa is a pirate though, WB can't beat her, therefore WSP out of the window too.
> Plus like I said, Boa has ways to scale to PK level, just like how Garp creeps onto WSM somehow, with bias. Boa > Smoker = Ace = Aokiji <= Akainu, therefore Boa is in PK realm now, you are the one who likes to look at WB Roger Garp like that too right? Linear tunnel vision comparison.
> Garp, PK, WB have nothing on Boa.



Idc if WB never beat her, it's not my argument. Iam not arguing that WSM WB is > all other men and apparently women too.



GucciBandana said:


> Does Boa actually scales to PK level? Hell nah, but if Garp can "equal" WSM, Boa might as well be PK level.



 

Garp scales to Roger (someone WB cannot beat), that's more than enough. Call me when Boa does that.


----------



## Nox (Dec 23, 2020)

Beast said:


> The last few pages are about...
> 
> WSM title/ WB/ Roger/ Garp.
> 
> apparently Gucci here doesn’t understand that WB is both equal to Roger and Was still WSM, he doesn’t understand how WB is the strongest and has an equal lol, it’s hurting his brain too much.



If he can't handle that, Shanks vs Mihawk vs Rayleigh will tear him apart 



























































Lisa

Reactions: Funny 1


----------



## GucciBandana (Dec 24, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Again, somebody who doesn't read what Oda tells you? If you don't think that's half of it, go argue with Oda, he wrote it.



TheWiggian said:


> Shiki's powers allow him to leviate anything he touches. Dude was stomped hard if he only made it to one battleship. Not sure what you expected 1 top tier ain't doing shit to 2 of them.



hmmm, destroying half of MF? Like Oda said? You do know that people don't only fight with DF power right?



TheWiggian said:


> No he didn't. Them taking a break every 12 hours for half a day though suggests they would've went down way faster.



But Jack fought for 5 days straight... longer than Roger and WB.



TheWiggian said:


> Nope. WB was the WSM yet he couldn't beat a man. It's denial to believe he is the strongest despite failing to prove it.



Still don't understand why you have to "beat" a man... When Oda fully said he's the Strongest man.
I mean, he didn't beat Boa.



TheWiggian said:


> Why would I care? Iam not using WSP and WSM to prove WB is above Garp here.



Because it destroys your flawed logic?



TheWiggian said:


> Dude idc what you show me when official sources and native Japanese translator's already translated it multiple times.



"idc cuz I'm a hypocrite in denial".



TheWiggian said:


> Your trump argument not mine.
> 
> 
> 
> Why would I care Garp is not a pirate.



Again, cuz destroys your sad logic.



TheWiggian said:


> Oda showed us that WB can't beat Roger, you kite some nonsense with other character's while failing to prove WB was indeed the WSM.



I don't need to prove WB is WSM... Oda said it, it's the first law. You need to prove WB is NOT WSM, but failed to do so with your nonsense.



TheWiggian said:


> No you're trying to say that.
> 
> Roger = Garp = WB > Ray and Sengoku.
> 
> Yea WSM remains meaningless unless he finally beats Roger.



No I'm only making fun of your logic.

If Garp = Roger, then Sengoku def = Garp. 

LMFAO meaningless says who?



TheWiggian said:


> Because WSM WB never beat Roger and neither nearly killed him unlike Garp who had Roger on the verge of death mutliple times. WB never managed to pull that off.



hmmm why does WB need to pull it off again?



TheWiggian said:


> Oda says WB is WSM, he also shows WB can't beat Roger. Oda via VC: WB was WSM way before the great age of pirates.



You do know that time exist after the fight, before great age of pirates, right?



TheWiggian said:


> Conclusion: WB is WSM but never beat Roger, therefore his title is meaningless to someone like Roger or Garp who is literally Roger's equal.



Meaningless says who again?
I'm sorry, WSM can't be meaningless, to any man.




TheWiggian said:


> WB exceeds Garp by his title only which we already been shown by Oda that he can still hold despite not being capable of beating other men.



Oh at least you acknowledge WB's title exceeds Garp, great!
Too bad that "other men" isn't Garp, so why would it matter anyways?



TheWiggian said:


> WSM can't beat a man (Roger) who has another equal like Garp.
> WSM gives him nothing over those 2.



Aokiji can't beat a pirate(Ace) who has another equal like Smoker? Interesting logic.
Aokiji has nothing over Smoker, being an Admiral is meaningless now.



TheWiggian said:


> Idc if WB never beat her, it's not my argument. Iam not arguing that WSM WB is > all other men and apparently women too.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Boa scales to Roger too, I just fully showed you how, with a logic that's as flawed as yours, demonstrates your flaw perfectly.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 24, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Again, somebody who doesn't read what Oda tells you? If you don't think that's half of it, go argue with Oda, he wrote it.



Oda also provided the panel for it the same way he provided panels of WSM WB never beating Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> hmmm, destroying half of MF? Like Oda said? You do know that people don't only fight with DF power right?



I don't see any destruction other than the battleship which was thrown by Shiki. He didn't manage more.



GucciBandana said:


> But Jack fought for 5 days straight... longer than Roger and WB.



And? Neko and Inu kept recovering. He would've finished them earlier.



GucciBandana said:


> Still don't understand why you have to "beat" a man... When Oda fully said he's the Strongest man.
> I mean, he didn't beat Boa.



He doesn't but fate is on my side because there is evidence they fought multiple times and WB never beat Roger which makes his title useless. And you seem to agree since you keep arguing WB isn't even above Boa.



GucciBandana said:


> Because it destroys your flawed logic?



How is that my logic? I argue for Garp not WB.
 



GucciBandana said:


> "idc cuz I'm a hypocrite in denial".



No those translators are > you and already exposed you as a liar.



GucciBandana said:


> Again, cuz destroys your sad logic.



Not my argument, you're just exposing yourself here.



GucciBandana said:


> I don't need to prove WB is WSM... Oda said it, it's the first law. You need to prove WB is NOT WSM, but failed to do so with your nonsense.



Been there, seen it. WB only tied with Roger, never beat him.  
Your title would make sens did he were undisputed which he isn't.



GucciBandana said:


> No I'm only making fun of your logic.



The only thing you're doing is wasting both our time because you can't accept that WB never beat Roger.


GucciBandana said:


> If Garp = Roger, then Sengoku def = Garp.



Yes if Sengoku would've nearly killed Roger multiple times would've considered that but he didn't. Sry.



GucciBandana said:


> LMFAO meaningless says who?



Oda who made him a WSM without the capabilities of beating other men.



GucciBandana said:


> hmmm why does WB need to pull it off again?



Because that is what you expect from someone with a WSM title no?



GucciBandana said:


> You do know that time exist after the fight, before great age of pirates, right?



And you do know that WB was WSM during Roger's time and still couldn't beat him?



GucciBandana said:


> Meaningless says who again?
> I'm sorry, WSM can't be meaningless, to any man.



Yea as I already said hundreds of times it's meaningless to Roger (and Garp who is Roger's equal) because WB never managed to take a "W" in their confrontations.



GucciBandana said:


> Oh at least you acknowledge WB's title exceeds Garp, great!
> Too bad that "other men" isn't Garp, so why would it matter anyways?



Yea I acknowledge WSM yet not if WB can't beat Garp's equal called Roger. Which makes his title meaningless for those 2. 



GucciBandana said:


> Aokiji can't beat a pirate(Ace) who has another equal like Smoker? Interesting logic.



Those characters never had a full out fight, but nice try.



GucciBandana said:


> Aokiji has nothing over Smoker, being an Admiral is meaningless now.



Why would I care? Iam not arguing about admirals here. Just another deflection on your part. Stay on topic or fuck off.



GucciBandana said:


> Boa scales to Roger too, I just fully showed you how, with a logic that's as flawed as yours, demonstrates your flaw perfectly.



Jesus I didn't thought it were so bad about your health.


----------



## Sherlōck (Dec 24, 2020)

Three top tier fought in that small ass island.

The fact that only half of it was destroyed is a miracle in itself.


----------



## Captain Altintop (Dec 24, 2020)

100 Roger / Primebeard
99.0 Prime Garp
97.5 Current Akainu
96.5 MF C3 / MF Garp
95.5 Current Garp

Reactions: Like 1 | Neutral 1


----------



## GucciBandana (Dec 24, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Oda also provided the panel for it the same way he provided panels of WSM WB never beating Roger.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't see any destruction other than the battleship which was thrown by Shiki. He didn't manage more.



You know that Garp and Sengoku aren't MF right? Like they are actually people? Not buildings?



TheWiggian said:


> And? Neko and Inu kept recovering. He would've finished them earlier.



But he has stamina to fighting 5 days, without having logia DF while much weaker than WB Roger. It's not about how fast he can finish the fight, I've seen him finish fights in seconds, like against fodder minks, but why is it relevant here?




TheWiggian said:


> He doesn't but fate is on my side because there is evidence they fought multiple times and WB never beat Roger which makes his title useless. And you seem to agree since you keep arguing WB isn't even above Boa.



Oh fate is far from your side the moment you deny WB's WSM given by Oda.
I mean yeah, I agree that WB isn't even above Boa, only if WB isn't above Garp, product your logic.




TheWiggian said:


> How is that my logic? I argue for Garp not WB.



Your logic to justify Garp... I don't think you even understand what logic means, logic has nothing to do with who you argue for...



TheWiggian said:


> No those translators are > you and already exposed you as a liar.



hmmm not really, those translators = me, who know how to translate Japanese, and both >>> you, who not only don't know anything about translating, but refuse to even look at it.



TheWiggian said:


> Not my argument, you're just exposing yourself here.



Your petty logic though.



TheWiggian said:


> Been there, seen it. WB only tied with Roger, never beat him.
> Your title would make sens did he were undisputed which he isn't.



Irrelevant WB never beat Roger, non of them beat Boa.



TheWiggian said:


> The only thing you're doing is wasting both our time because you can't accept that WB never beat Roger.



I fully accept WB never beat Roger, like I fully accept the fact WB never beat Boa, but what does that have to do with WSM being stronger than Garp?



TheWiggian said:


> Yes if Sengoku would've nearly killed Roger multiple times would've considered that but he didn't. Sry.



Yes if Garp was called World's Also Strongest Man, would've considered that, but he wasn't, sorry.



TheWiggian said:


> Oda who made him a WSM without the capabilities of beating other men.
> 
> 
> Because that is what you expect from someone with a WSM title no?



Hmmm, no... Maybe if he's fighting somebody like John Giant, sure, but not what I expect when WSM fights PK? or WSM fights Marine HQ's highest military asset? However, you can "expect" with your fanfic expectations, I just listen to Oda and actually, hmmm think?
Man's using his expectation as arguments, lmfao.



TheWiggian said:


> And you do know that WB was WSM during Roger's time and still couldn't beat him?



Not necessarily when they fought each other...




TheWiggian said:


> Yea as I already said hundreds of times it's meaningless to Roger (and Garp who is Roger's equal) because WB never managed to take a "W" in their confrontations.



WB's WSM is meaningful to every man, during the time he holds the title... including Roger, if he held it that is, and def including Garp the Roger tag along.
Good chance WB was not WSM before his loot match with Roger, so nothing "meaningless" here other than your "expectation" and "fanfic".



TheWiggian said:


> Yea I acknowledge WSM yet not if WB can't beat Garp's equal called Roger. Which makes his title meaningless for those 2.



He can still beat Garp... You do know that Garp and Roger are 2 diff people right?



TheWiggian said:


> Those characters never had a full out fight, but nice try.



While Roger and Garp didn't even have a clash on panel, no time stamp, no details, even fully rejected the chance of a stalemate by Buggy, yet they are "equals", so nice try also...



TheWiggian said:


> Why would I care? Iam not arguing about admirals here. Just another deflection on your part. Stay on topic or fuck off.



Your logic, admit the flaw or fuck off?



TheWiggian said:


> Jesus I didn't thought it were so bad about your health.



Through your logic, not mine, if anything it speaks of your health.
For somebody who had to start making comments about "health" the sentence after asking to "stay on topic", it's pretty sad how much you losing your mind lol.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 25, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> You know that Garp and Sengoku aren't MF right? Like they are actually people? Not buildings?



No idea what you're trying to say, but i know how Shiki's devilfruit works. MF wouldn't exist if he had enough time to go all out.



GucciBandana said:


> But he has stamina to fighting 5 days, without having logia DF while much weaker than WB Roger. It's not about how fast he can finish the fight, I've seen him finish fights in seconds, like against fodder minks, but why is it relevant here?



No idea why it's relevant, you're the one who brought Jack up and before Jack, Aokiji, Ace and Smoker.  



GucciBandana said:


> Oh fate is far from your side the moment you deny WB's WSM given by Oda.



Yea again a WSM that can't beat another man.



GucciBandana said:


> I mean yeah, I agree that WB isn't even above Boa, only if WB isn't above Garp, product your logic.



No, idc what kind of characters you bring up, because from all sources the reader has, WB never has proven superiority over Roger and his marine equal.



GucciBandana said:


> Your logic to justify Garp... I don't think you even understand what logic means, logic has nothing to do with who you argue for...



Oda wrote the portrayal, hype and feats for Garp not me.



GucciBandana said:


> hmmm not really, those translators = me, who know how to translate Japanese, and both >>> you, who not only don't know anything about translating, but refuse to even look at it.



You are a shitty liar and troll. I already posted the translations.



GucciBandana said:


> Your petty logic though.



It was your argument. Idc if you destroy it yourself.



GucciBandana said:


> Irrelevant WB never beat Roger, non of them beat Boa.



 



GucciBandana said:


> I fully accept WB never beat Roger, like I fully accept the fact WB never beat Boa, but what does that have to do with WSM being stronger than Garp?



Garp is Roger's equal.



GucciBandana said:


> Yes if Garp was called World's Also Strongest Man, would've considered that, but he wasn't, sorry.



Give me a single title that has 2 holders simultaneously.



GucciBandana said:


> Hmmm, no... Maybe if he's fighting somebody like John Giant, sure, but not what I expect when WSM fights PK? or WSM fights Marine HQ's highest military asset? However, you can "expect" with your fanfic expectations, I just listen to Oda and actually, hmmm think?
> Man's using his expectation as arguments, lmfao.



Then think for yourself why can't the WSM bring Roger to the verge of death if by your understanding an inferior character in strenght like Garp can?



GucciBandana said:


> Not necessarily when they fought each other...



VC covers that timespan.



GucciBandana said:


> WB's WSM is meaningful to every man, during the time he holds the title... including Roger, if he held it that is, and def including Garp the Roger tag along.
> Good chance WB was not WSM before his loot match with Roger, so nothing "meaningless" here other than your "expectation" and "fanfic".



Well doesn't looke like it was meaningful to Roger who he never beat, it doesn't have any credibility when it comes to him and his marine equal.



GucciBandana said:


> He can still beat Garp... You do know that Garp and Roger are 2 diff people right?



Yes and do you know that Garp and Roger are portrayed as equals and have equal feats like destroying Rocks and nearly killing each other the whole time?



GucciBandana said:


> While Roger and Garp didn't even have a clash on panel, no time stamp, no details, even fully rejected the chance of a stalemate by Buggy, yet they are "equals", so nice try also...



Yes because thats how portrayal works. They don't need to have on panel feats, we haven't seen WB tieing with Roger either, the fight was off-panel and even the conclusion was narrated rather than shown. Equal portrayal was not rejected by Roger and Sengoku.



GucciBandana said:


> Your logic, admit the flaw or fuck off?



No, stay on topic without attacking strawmen or fuck off.



GucciBandana said:


> Through your logic, not mine, if anything it speaks of your health.
> For somebody who had to start making comments about "health" the sentence after asking to "stay on topic", it's pretty sad how much you losing your mind lol.



Bring in actual facts of WB, Roger or Garp instead of other characters or just don't respond then else i'll keep mocking you for your off-topic arguments.


----------



## GucciBandana (Dec 25, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> No idea what you're trying to say, but i know how Shiki's devilfruit works. MF wouldn't exist if he had enough time to go all out.



Do you know how haki and swordsmanship works? WB and Roger's island still existed... I guess they didn't go all out?
Somebody who loves bringing up logias, forgets they aren't logia users all of a sudden?



TheWiggian said:


> No idea why it's relevant, you're the one who brought Jack up and before Jack, Aokiji, Ace and Smoker.



to show you a non logia can fight 5 days...



TheWiggian said:


> Yea again a WSM that can't beat another man.



Don't need to, just listen to Oda.



TheWiggian said:


> No, idc what kind of characters you bring up, because from all sources the reader has, WB never has proven superiority over Roger and his marine equal.



"equal" says you. Doesn't matter what character I bring up, WB is superior to Garp by default.



TheWiggian said:


> Oda wrote the portrayal, hype and feats for Garp not me.



Oda wrote WSM too.



TheWiggian said:


> You are a shitty liar and troll. I already posted the translations.



I posted the damn Japanese Kanji, most authentic thing you can get.



TheWiggian said:


> It was your argument. Idc if you destroy it yourself.



Only destroyed your Garp = WB logic, like all the characters I bring up.



TheWiggian said:


> Garp is Roger's equal.



They only "equal" in fanfic(yours), the same way Sengoku equals Garp(somebody else's).



TheWiggian said:


> Give me a single title that has 2 holders simultaneously.



Marine HQ's highest military force?



TheWiggian said:


> Then think for yourself why can't the WSM bring Roger to the verge of death if by your understanding an inferior character in strenght like Garp can?



If Hody can bring Luffy near death, why can't Garp do that to Roger?



TheWiggian said:


> VC covers that timespan.



Nope, only before Great Pirate Era, which is years after the fight.



TheWiggian said:


> Well doesn't looke like it was meaningful to Roger who he never beat, it doesn't have any credibility when it comes to him and his marine equal.



not meaningful cuz he might not have the title... if he had, indeed meaningful.



TheWiggian said:


> Yes and do you know that Garp and Roger are portrayed as equals and have equal feats like destroying Rocks and nearly killing each other the whole time?



Not according to Buggy... Not according to Sengoku either, he called Rocks "Roger's first and most formidable enemy", not Garp's.
So many details points to Roger is the superior one, Garp is a Roger tag along.



TheWiggian said:


> Yes because thats how portrayal works. They don't need to have on panel feats, we haven't seen WB tieing with Roger either, the fight was off-panel and even the conclusion was narrated rather than shown. Equal portrayal was not rejected by Roger and Sengoku.



But do you realize another way of how portrayal works is by being called WSM by the author?



TheWiggian said:


> No, stay on topic without attacking strawmen or fuck off.



Deflection?



TheWiggian said:


> Bring in actual facts of WB, Roger or Garp instead of other characters or just don't respond then else i'll keep mocking you for your off-topic arguments.



Cuz other characters destroy your logic.
I mean the actual facts of WB and Garp is simple... WB WSM.


----------



## TheWiggian (Dec 25, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> Do you know how haki and swordsmanship works? WB and Roger's island still existed... I guess they didn't go all out?
> Somebody who loves bringing up logias, forgets they aren't logia users all of a sudden?



Do you have a timeframe from Sengoku and Garp Vs Shiki? Go ahead and Google what Shiki's abilities are.



GucciBandana said:


> to show you a non logia can fight 5 days...



Cool it's still just 50% of the Aokiji and Sakazuki fight. 



GucciBandana said:


> Don't need to, just listen to Oda.



Yea he established WSM WB = Roger = Garp. I do.



GucciBandana said:


> "equal" says you. Doesn't matter what character I bring up, WB is superior to Garp by default.



If he can beat Roger yes, sadly he didn't, so no he isn't.



GucciBandana said:


> Oda wrote WSM too.



And that the WSM can't win a fight against another man. 



GucciBandana said:


> I posted the damn Japanese Kanji, most authentic thing you can get.



Don't care. Better, approved translators already translated this part. I don't need your shitty lies.



GucciBandana said:


> Only destroyed your Garp = WB logic, like all the characters I bring up.



Character's you bring up = off-topic because they don't have anything to do with Garp, Roger and WB.



GucciBandana said:


> They only "equal" in fanfic(yours), the same way Sengoku equals Garp(somebody else's).



Yea and by Roger's word and Sengoku who educated his marines on that.



GucciBandana said:


> Marine HQ's highest military force?



We are talking about world's strongest titles 

Is WB a marine to share a title with Garp?



Perhaps Garp is a pirate just like WB in your world.



GucciBandana said:


> If Hody can bring Luffy near death, why can't Garp do that to Roger?



Oh he can, but sadly WSM WB cannot. 



GucciBandana said:


> Nope, only before Great Pirate Era, which is years after the fight.



Years? That's 2 years at max lol



GucciBandana said:


> not meaningful cuz he might not have the title... if he had, indeed meaningful.



The WSM never beat Roger, this is a fact. His title is useless here.



GucciBandana said:


> Not according to Buggy... Not according to Sengoku either, he called Rocks "Roger's first and most formidable enemy", not Garp's.



Neither did Sengoku call WB, Roger's greatest enemy or rival. So what's your point? Roger himself said Garp was his equal, against Rocks it was just another portrayal of equality.



GucciBandana said:


> So many details points to Roger is the superior one, Garp is a Roger tag along.



Not a single detail points at Roger being superior, in fact the only 2 instances they're compared together, portray them absolutely equal: Rocks destruction and nearly killing each other multiple times.


GucciBandana said:


> But do you realize another way of how portrayal works is by being called WSM by the author?



Yea I also see how that portrayal is contradicted when WB failed to prove that title while fighting Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> Deflection?



Stay on topic.



GucciBandana said:


> Cuz other characters destroy your logic.
> I mean the actual facts of WB and Garp is simple... WB WSM.



WB WSM that isn't WSM which I heard like a hundred times by you at this point? Why can't the WSM defeat another man then?


----------



## GucciBandana (Dec 26, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Do you have a timeframe from Sengoku and Garp Vs Shiki? Go ahead and Google what Shiki's abilities are.



No we don't, did I say we have one? Go ahead and google me a top tier that can only use DF abilities.



TheWiggian said:


> Cool it's still just 50% of the Aokiji and Sakazuki fight.



Yeah, but longer than Roger vs WB.



TheWiggian said:


> Yea he established WSM WB = Roger = Garp. I do.



I established WSM > men.



TheWiggian said:


> If he can beat Roger yes, sadly he didn't, so no he isn't.



Roger isn't relevant, Aokiji can't gain upper hand agaist Ace, but he's stronger than Smoker.



TheWiggian said:


> And that the WSM can't win a fight against another man.



Still WSM, Oda said so, can't win against Boa either though.



TheWiggian said:


> Don't care. Better, approved translators already translated this part. I don't need your shitty lies.



Oh the Kanji I provided was a lie?



TheWiggian said:


> Character's you bring up = off-topic because they don't have anything to do with Garp, Roger and WB.



Of course they do, they are from the same manga? Ace is Roger's son? WB's crew underling? Garp's adopted grandson? If that's off topic, then Roger is off topic too, Roger is not Garp nor WB if I remember right.



TheWiggian said:


> Yea and by Roger's word and Sengoku who educated his marines on that.



But Sengoku's words didn't educate marines on Rocks being ROGER's first and most formidable enemy?



TheWiggian said:


> We are talking about world's strongest titles


Why has to be world's strongest? says who?



TheWiggian said:


> Is WB a marine to share a title with Garp?



No, WB isn't a marine, why would he share marine title with Garp? Garp is a man though.



TheWiggian said:


> Perhaps Garp is a pirate just like WB in your world.



Garp is a man, not a pirate.



TheWiggian said:


> Oh he can, but sadly WSM WB cannot.



hmmm Hody can, Kidd can't?



TheWiggian said:


> Years? That's 2 years at max lol



2 years = years.



TheWiggian said:


> The WSM never beat Roger, this is a fact. His title is useless here.



WSM never beat many many people, including Boa. But is title is always useful for the time period he holds it, cuz Oda said so. Oda > you, or anybody else on their forum combined.



TheWiggian said:


> Neither did Sengoku call WB, Roger's greatest enemy or rival. So what's your point? Roger himself said Garp was his equal, against Rocks it was just another portrayal of equality.



Sengoku called WB WSM though... Why is Roger's greatest enemy necessary? They don't even seem to be real enemies.
Roger never said Garp was his equal... just close.



TheWiggian said:


> Not a single detail points at Roger being superior, in fact the only 2 instances they're compared together, portray them absolutely equal: Rocks destruction and nearly killing each other multiple times.



hmmm, "Roger Era"? Whose name did WB mention to Shanks before Garp, and whose name came after Garp?



TheWiggian said:


> Yea I also see how that portrayal is contradicted when WB failed to prove that title while fighting Roger.



WB doesn't need to "prove" his title... It's given by Oda... Who does he need to prove it to? you?



TheWiggian said:


> Stay on topic.



Fully on topic, about OP powerscale logic, just like you can't justify why Boa isn't PK level through the Smoker Ace Aokiji direct comparison, had to deflect.



TheWiggian said:


> WB WSM that isn't WSM which I heard like a hundred times by you at this point? Why can't the WSM defeat another man then?



Oda's WSM isn't WSM, says you. How ridiculous does it sound? How can I take this seriously?


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## TheWiggian (Dec 27, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> No we don't, did I say we have one? Go ahead and google me a top tier that can only use DF abilities.



Nah there is a single battleship that was thrown with his powers. Don't care about the rest, dude was destroyed by those 2.



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah, but longer than Roger vs WB.



And?



GucciBandana said:


> I established WSM > men.



Who cares Oda established the WSM can't beat said men.



GucciBandana said:


> Roger isn't relevant, Aokiji can't gain upper hand agaist Ace, but he's stronger than Smoker.



We talk about Garp and Roger, not Aokiji. Drop the desperation.



GucciBandana said:


> Still WSM, Oda said so, can't win against Boa either though.



Boa is a woman 



GucciBandana said:


> Oh the Kanji I provided was a lie?



Posted the translations already.



GucciBandana said:


> Of course they do, they are from the same manga? Ace is Roger's son? WB's crew underling? Garp's adopted grandson? If that's off topic, then Roger is off topic too, Roger is not Garp nor WB if I remember right.



Ace got nothing to do with WB, Roger and Garp being equals.



GucciBandana said:


> But Sengoku's words didn't educate marines on Rocks being ROGER's first and most formidable enemy?



Yep he did and guess who defeated him alongside Roger? 



GucciBandana said:


> Why has to be world's strongest? says who?



We are talking about WB's title, which remains useless until you prove he can beat Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> No, WB isn't a marine, why would he share marine title with Garp? Garp is a man though.



And? Can WB beat every man? Because we have canon evidence he can't.



GucciBandana said:


> Garp is a man, not a pirate.



Yep and the equal of a man WSM WB cannot beat. 



GucciBandana said:


> hmmm Hody can, Kidd can't?



Dunno, don't care. Iam fully focussed on WB who couldn't but Garp could.



GucciBandana said:


> 2 years = years.



Way before > 2 years at max. 



GucciBandana said:


> WSM never beat many many people, including Boa. But is title is always useful for the time period he holds it, cuz Oda said so. Oda > you, or anybody else on their forum combined.



Yep the WSM that cannot even prove the titles worth ^^



GucciBandana said:


> Sengoku called WB WSM though... Why is Roger's greatest enemy necessary? They don't even seem to be real enemies.
> Roger never said Garp was his equal... just close.



Roger and Sengoku both portrayed Garp as Roger's equal, try again.



GucciBandana said:


> hmmm, "Roger Era"? Whose name did WB mention to Shanks before Garp, and whose name came after Garp?



Why just count this one instance and not all of them? Roger's words about Garp, Roger and Garp destroying Rocks? What are you afraid off? The better Sengoku looks the better Garp looks by default because Garp has superior hype to Sengoku as the PK's equal.



GucciBandana said:


> WB doesn't need to "prove" his title... It's given by Oda... Who does he need to prove it to? you?



The readers, because said WSM couldn't actually back up the title as shown by Oda.



GucciBandana said:


> Fully on topic, about OP powerscale logic, just like you can't justify why Boa isn't PK level through the Smoker Ace Aokiji direct comparison, had to deflect.



Nah man you keept bringing up characters that have nothing in common with characters that are equal to the pirate king. Therefore it's off-topic.



GucciBandana said:


> Oda's WSM isn't WSM, says you. How ridiculous does it sound? How can I take this seriously?



It doesn't, the WSM would've defeated Roger as he is a man and included in the title, yet he didn't. So either the title doesn't mean anything or you're just horrible at debating and proving WB indeed can beat Roger.


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## xmysticgohanx (Dec 27, 2020)

Both have fought Marco. Garp had better feats.

However, BB fought Garp and Sengoku without fright, yet he ran from Akainu

Reactions: Like 1


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## GucciBandana (Dec 27, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Nah there is a single battleship that was thrown with his powers. Don't care about the rest, dude was destroyed by those 2.



You don't care about things like physical stats haki swordsmanship? So tell me did Roger and WB fight evolve WB's DF power or nah? according to the surrounding.



TheWiggian said:


> And?



And Roger and WB in very good condition after the fight, clearly can go for much longer...


TheWiggian said:


> Who cares Oda established the WSM can't beat said men.


Oh, so who cares what Oda says? then what do you care about? your fanfic?



TheWiggian said:


> We talk about Garp and Roger, not Aokiji. Drop the desperation.



How about we talk about Garp and WB? not Roger? Drop the desperation?



TheWiggian said:


> Boa is a woman



A pirate though, a pirate Roger WB Garp never beat.



TheWiggian said:


> Posted the translations already.



Posted the original kanji.



TheWiggian said:


> Ace got nothing to do with WB, Roger and Garp being equals.



But he has something to do with Smoker, Ace, Aokiji being equals? And all weaker than Boa? Sounds familiar here? yeah figured, since it's your logic.



TheWiggian said:


> Yep he did and guess who defeated him alongside Roger?



AKA Roger tag along?



TheWiggian said:


> We are talking about WB's title, which remains useless until you prove he can beat Roger.



More like unless you can prove he can't beat Roger if they kept fighting, or unless you can prove he's WSM at the time and can't beat Roger.



TheWiggian said:


> And? Can WB beat every man? Because we have canon evidence he can't.



We don't need any evidence, Oda said it... Oda is the god of OP verse.



TheWiggian said:


> Yep and the equal of a man WSM WB cannot beat.



"Equal" according to your fanfic again, disagreed by Buggy though.



TheWiggian said:


> Dunno, don't care. Iam fully focussed on WB who couldn't but Garp could.



Yeah, tunnel vision can only read from point to point, unaware of the manga has more powerscale related shit going on outside of Roger Garp WB?



TheWiggian said:


> Way before > 2 years at max.



According too?



TheWiggian said:


> Yep the WSM that cannot even prove the titles worth ^^



Don't need to prove anything to you, a mere reader.



TheWiggian said:


> Roger and Sengoku both portrayed Garp as Roger's equal, try again.



Just like WB and Roger both portrayed Sengoku as Garp's equal?



TheWiggian said:


> Why just count this one instance and not all of them? Roger's words about Garp, Roger and Garp destroying Rocks? What are you afraid off? The better Sengoku looks the better Garp looks by default because Garp has superior hype to Sengoku as the PK's equal.



one of them is among all of them... So if Garp gets 6, Roger gets 8, and we count all of them, who's ahead?
Yeah, just like the better Garp looks the better WB looks by default, because hmmm... WSM?



TheWiggian said:


> The readers, because said WSM couldn't actually back up the title as shown by Oda.



The readers read WB is WSM already... Which is shown by Oda. Unless you missed that part.



TheWiggian said:


> Nah man you keept bringing up characters that have nothing in common with characters that are equal to the pirate king. Therefore it's off-topic.



Somebody made the rule of only PK equals allowed here? I mean Garp somehow got in here cuz he's a Roger tag along, then why can't Boa who kicked the shit out of the supposedly "new gen Garp", be in the convo too? Garp is PK equal according to you, why can't Boa be PK equal according to me? In fact neither of them is true equal of the PK. Just look out side of the box a little, it's not hard to see that WB is a bit superior...



TheWiggian said:


> It doesn't, the WSM would've defeated Roger as he is a man and included in the title, yet he didn't. So either the title doesn't mean anything or you're just horrible at debating and proving WB indeed can beat Roger.



If WSM finished his damn fight... maybe.
Either you know more than Oda, or you just horrible at debating trying to prove Oda wrong in a verse Oda created lmaooo.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 28, 2020)

GucciBandana said:


> You don't care about things like physical stats haki swordsmanship? So tell me did Roger and WB fight evolve WB's DF power or nah? according to the surrounding.



Dude got destroyed, a single top tier got boned by 2 of them unless you think he put up a great fight with 1 ship dropped on MF.



GucciBandana said:


> And Roger and WB in very good condition after the fight, clearly can go for much longer...



Both were in bandages and patched.



GucciBandana said:


> Oh, so who cares what Oda says? then what do you care about? your fanfic?



Yes Oda narrated him to be WSm and he also narrated that said WSM cannot beat another man. So who should i believe? Oda or Oda?
Guess the title is contradicted then.



GucciBandana said:


> How about we talk about Garp and WB? not Roger? Drop the desperation?



Okay, WB ran from the marines. He did not ran from Roger.



GucciBandana said:


> A pirate though, a pirate Roger WB Garp never beat.



And? is it my problem that the WSM didn't beat her?



GucciBandana said:


> Posted the original kanji.



Yep still is translated by everyone into "nearly killing each other multiple times".



GucciBandana said:


> But he has something to do with Smoker, Ace, Aokiji being equals? And all weaker than Boa? Sounds familiar here? yeah figured, since it's your logic.



Why would i care about the others? Iam discussing Garp and Roger = WB and not in single clashes.



GucciBandana said:


> AKA Roger tag along?



Nice so after all you agree Garp is portrayed as Roger's equal at the latters peak 



GucciBandana said:


> More like unless you can prove he can't beat Roger if they kept fighting, or unless you can prove he's WSM at the time and can't beat Roger.



Oda portrayed it that way, iam not to blame for that  
Good luck proving otherwise.



GucciBandana said:


> We don't need any evidence, Oda said it... Oda is the god of OP verse.



Good because Oda showed us the WSM can't beat another man.  



GucciBandana said:


> "Equal" according to your fanfic again, disagreed by Buggy though.



Agreed by Roger and Sengoku though.



GucciBandana said:


> Yeah, tunnel vision can only read from point to point, unaware of the manga has more powerscale related shit going on outside of Roger Garp WB?



I don't want to hear that from someone who believes Vergo and Pica are about as powerful as Cracker.  



GucciBandana said:


> According too?



Oda via Vivre Card  



GucciBandana said:


> Don't need to prove anything to you, a mere reader.



Doesn't need to either bcause Oda already have shown he can't.



GucciBandana said:


> Just like WB and Roger both portrayed Sengoku as Garp's equal?



Yep, already said Sengoku in his prime is up there with them, just slightly below because he lacks the hype of being equal to the pirate king unlike Garp.



GucciBandana said:


> one of them is among all of them... So if Garp gets 6, Roger gets 8, and we count all of them, who's ahead?
> Yeah, just like the better Garp looks the better WB looks by default, because hmmm... WSM?



No Garp received praise to nearly killing Roger multiple times, Sengoku did not. Garp is also the one who was portrayed as Roger's equal when levelling god valley and destroying Rocks while Sengoku was not. And all of them are legends as said by multiple people around the world: "Roger, WB, Garp, Sengoku, Rayleigh, Shiki..." list goes on. If that legend status hypes them on equal terms to Roger and therefore WB, the latters WSM title only looks worse by every new name thrown in there.  



GucciBandana said:


> The readers read WB is WSM already... Which is shown by Oda. Unless you missed that part.



They also read that this WSM cannot beat another man. 



GucciBandana said:


> Somebody made the rule of only PK equals allowed here? I mean Garp somehow got in here cuz he's a Roger tag along, then why can't Boa who kicked the shit out of the supposedly "new gen Garp", be in the convo too? Garp is PK equal according to you, why can't Boa be PK equal according to me? In fact neither of them is true equal of the PK. Just look out side of the box a little, it's not hard to see that WB is a bit superior...



Not only because of Roger tag along, but also that he almost killed the pirate king multiple times or his legend status as you like to say, to throw in Sengoku and Ray in there . HasBoa every reiced praise on that level?Desperate argument remains desperate.



GucciBandana said:


> If WSM finished his damn fight... maybe.
> Either you know more than Oda, or you just horrible at debating trying to prove Oda wrong in a verse Oda created lmaooo.



No i don't know more than Oda, i just know that Oda wrote the WSM can't beat another man and i go with it unlike you.


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## Sherlōck (Dec 28, 2020)

You guys @TheWiggian @GucciBandana do know that you are repeating same shit over and over again, right?

Maybe it's finally time to give it a rest.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## GucciBandana (Dec 29, 2020)

TheWiggian said:


> Dude got destroyed, a single top tier got boned by 2 of them unless you think he put up a great fight with 1 ship dropped on MF.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Somebody requested a stop, so I'm stopping here, WB > Garp in the next related thread if you are ready.


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## Beast (Dec 29, 2020)

Denial will get you far as people can see with this thread.
@TheWiggian 
You probably shouldn’t bother wasting your time with him ever.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 29, 2020)

Beast said:


> Denial will get you far as people can see with this thread.
> @TheWiggian
> You probably shouldn’t bother wasting your time with him ever.



I won't. Put that person on ignore. Vergo as strong as Cracker and Boa compareable to Roger and Primebeard.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## hbcaptain (Jan 2, 2021)

Garp is stronger probably, Roger and WB deemed him as a very powerful foe, they clashed many time with no winner.


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## Shadowlord123 (Jan 2, 2021)

As of now, Prime Garp has better portrayal. He and Roger came close to killing each other multiple times by Roger's own admission. While I suspect Akainu to have grown stronger after his battle against Aokiji (Haki seems to bloom in an extreme fight and Aokiji vs Akainu is arguably the most extreme match we've heard of thus far), I wouldn't give him the benefit of the doubt over Garp. Not until he shows it. 

Prime Garp wins with around High Difficulty. May be higher (or lower even though I doubt it) depending on Akainu's future showings.


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