# Slurpuff is a huge threat!



## strongarm85 (Dec 11, 2013)

Slurpuff's Hidden Ability is Unburden which gives it 2 stages of Speed whenever it consumes it's hold item. This gives you a couple options for set-up.

Physical: 

Slurpuff egg moves Bellydrum. So potential set-up is to invest a lot EVs into defensive stats, slap on a Sitrus Berry, and use Belly Drum first turn. That will give Slurpuff 6 Stages of Defense and 2 stages of Speed on the first turn, and then it's just ready to sweep the other team. 

Slurpuff also gets Cotton Guard, so if you have a 2nd turn to set-up, you can gain 3 more stages of defense and eliminate the threat of priority moves.

The downside to physical Slurpuff is that it's physical move pool is not never very wide, with Return and Play Rough being about it's only two options, but they are strong options. Thief is also a good option, because you'll be consuming your hold item slot almost immediately, and you could steal something useful.

Special:

In Double Battles you can also pair Slurpuff with a pokemon with a weak 1st turn surf, like Rhyperior, and give Slurpuff absorb bulb, and just have Slurpuff use Cottonguard. Slurpuff gets 3 stages of Defense from Cotton Guard, 2 Stages of Special Attack, and 2 stages of Speed in that set-up. That's 7 Stages in 1 turn!

Turn 2, you can have Slurpuff go for another Cotton Guard for another 3 stages of defense have a Pokemon Psych-up off Slurpuff to gain all 10 of Slurpuff's Stat boosts.

You can also Slurpuff use Calm Mind for more Special Attack/Defense.

Slurpuff's Special Movepool also offers a lot of coverage options with moves like, Psychic, Flamethrower, Thunderbolt, Energy Ball, and Dazzling Gleam.


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 11, 2013)

lol go on to smogon with that

as for me i busy catching/raising the last 60 pokemon of this gen

you know
having fun


----------



## strongarm85 (Dec 11, 2013)

Learning what Pokemon can do and the strategies that can spring up from them is half the fun.


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 11, 2013)

long story short
you're a marth player
im a falcon player


----------



## Swarmy (Dec 12, 2013)

strongarm85 said:


> Learning what Pokemon can do and the strategies that can spring up from them is half the fun.



You should try YGO


----------



## Xiammes (Dec 12, 2013)

Huge threat? Not with all the priority being thrown around, its still way to frail to compete in OU. Its also fails to 1hko steel types, who will be able to retaliate. 

It would be decent if it got a better physical movepool or better bulk.


----------



## Platinum (Dec 12, 2013)

Unburden boosts speed by the way not special defense .


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 12, 2013)

looks like OP is getting
strongarmed in this thread


yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 12, 2013)

substitute + petaya berry :33


still wont help forever uu


----------



## Weather (Dec 12, 2013)

> still wont help forever uu



UU tier was 1000 times more fun last gen anyway.

As long as those fucking Talonflames and Greninjas never stop (and Mega Khan gets banned), OU will repeat itself again.


----------



## strongarm85 (Dec 12, 2013)

Xiammes said:


> Huge threat? Not with all the priority being thrown around, its still way to frail to compete in OU. Its also fails to 1hko steel types, who will be able to retaliate.
> 
> It would be decent if it got a better physical movepool or better bulk.



Priority?

I don't think so. The only priority threat to Slurpuff is Bravebird, and if you set your EVs up right, you don't have to worry about it. I don't care how badass you think Talonflame is, it's not going to one shot a Slurpuff. After the first Cotton Guard is up it'll barely scratch you. If you get a second Cotton Guard up Bravebird will do about 1 hp damage to you.


----------



## Weather (Dec 12, 2013)

> Priority?
> 
> I don't think so. The only priority threat to Slurpuff is Bravebird, and if you set your EVs up right, you don't have to worry about it. I don't care how badass you think Talonflame is, it's not going to one shot a Slurpuff. After the first Cotton Guard is up it'll barely scratch you. If you get a second Cotton Guard up Bravebird will do about 1 hp damage to you.



Scizor and Lucario's Technician and Adaptability Super Effective Bullet Punches says hi.


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 12, 2013)

bullet punch
goes a bang bang bang

Vamanos! Vamanos!


----------



## Xiammes (Dec 12, 2013)

strongarm85 said:


> Priority?
> 
> I don't think so. The only priority threat to Slurpuff is Bravebird, and if you set your EVs up right, you don't have to worry about it. I don't care how badass you think Talonflame is, it's not going to one shot a Slurpuff. After the first Cotton Guard is up it'll barely scratch you. If you get a second Cotton Guard up Bravebird will do about 1 hp damage to you.



Fake Out - Megakanga
Brave Bird - Talonflame
*Bullet Punch* - Scizor, Lucario, Metagross, Medicham, various fighting types.
Extreme Speed - Dragonite 
Aqua Jet - Azumaril 
Quick Attack - Mega Pinsir
Ice Shard - Mamoswine

You also assume that people are allowing you to set up, first you need 1 turn to set up the belly drum, then you need another turn to set up cotten guard and another turn after that. 

You waste 3 turns, you are either going to get taunted/paralyzed/toxic'd or what ever nasty thing your opponent does to you. Ferrothorn can put toxic/paralyze/leach seed you and there is nothing you can do except waste your belly drum and switch out.


----------



## strongarm85 (Dec 12, 2013)

Xiammes said:


> Fake Out - Megakanga
> Brave Bird - Talonflame
> *Bullet Punch* - Scizor, Lucario, Metagross, Medicham, various fighting types.
> Extreme Speed - Dragonite
> ...



Bullet Punch still isn't going to do much. Bravebird is stronger, even with STAB, even with Super Effective, than Bullet Punch, mainly because Bravebird also gets STAB and has base 120 power. Its not even close.

Bullet Punch will really not do much once you've got Cotton Guard up.


----------



## Xiammes (Dec 12, 2013)

strongarm85 said:


> Bullet Punch still isn't going to do much. Bravebird is stronger, even with STAB, even with Super Effective, than Bullet Punch, mainly because Bravebird also gets STAB and has base 120 power. Its not even close.
> 
> Bullet Punch will really not do much once you've got Cotton Guard up.



You are assuming you are going to be able to get cotton guard up, if you go for it first, you are going to be slower then your opponent due to unburden not activating.


Scizor the most common pokemon in OU.

252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff: 368-434 (100 - 117.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Technician Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff: 272-324 (73.9 - 88%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Lucario, another dangerous and common OU pokemon thanks to mega stone.

252+ Atk Adaptability Mega Lucario Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff: 356-420 (96.7 - 114.1%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

After Belly Drum, all of these will OHKO, even with sitrus berry.


----------



## strongarm85 (Dec 12, 2013)

Well naturally if you give Slurpuff any Defense EVs you'll end up with the wrong math.

The build calls with for 120 Def. EVs, 180 Sp. Def Evs, and 208 HP EVs. If you put those EVs in, Slurpuff becomes a 2hko or 3hko.

Also your damage calculations are based on the assumption on the assumption Slurpuff doesn't get any kind of set-up at all. With Cotton Guard it's has +3 defense, or 2.5 times defense, which means your bullet punches will be doing closer nearly 2/3rds less damage after the first cotton Guard.

But that's kind of the point of this thread. If you see someone with a Slurpuff, undersand that it can set-up on and murder your team.


----------



## Xiammes (Dec 12, 2013)

strongarm85 said:


> Well naturally if you give Slurpuff any Defense EVs you'll end up with the wrong math.
> 
> The build calls with for 120 Def. EVs, 180 Sp. Def Evs, and 208 HP EVs. If you put those EVs in, Slurpuff becomes a 2hko or 3hko.
> 
> ...



If any pokemon can set up, its going to murder your team, let alone a pokemon with a poor physical movepool and terrible bulk. 

No one is going to let you set up, the most you can ever hope to set up is once unless you are running prankster or incredible bulky, this counts for every pokemon.

Also, no one is going to run a Slurrpuff without max attack, it would be barely stronger then Mega Mawile after BD, but with worse bulk, terrible movepool and worse typing.


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 12, 2013)

lol get taunted or hazed or roared


----------



## strongarm85 (Dec 12, 2013)

Xiammes said:


> If any pokemon can set up, its going to murder your team, let alone a pokemon with a poor physical movepool and terrible bulk.
> 
> No one is going to let you set up, the most you can ever hope to set up is once unless you are running prankster or incredible bulky, this counts for every pokemon.
> 
> Also, no one is going to run a Slurrpuff without max attack, it would be barely stronger then Mega Mawile after BD, but with worse bulk, terrible movepool and worse typing.



Wow, someone can't do math.

At minimum, with 0 IVs or Evs in Attack, Slurpuff has 196 attack with 31 IVs and No EVs invested. At +6 that equals 588 attack. It also equals 408 Speed.

With physical attack stats like those, you can pretty much OHKO any threat. Metagross will go  down to a Super Effective Theif + lose his item. Mega-Sizor doesn't have the bulk to survive a Play Rough or Return, even though it resists it. Same is true for Mega-Lucario.

In Double Battles Slurpuff's going to probably have Prankster Klefky support, so Priority Reflect pretty much  ruins your day, and the battle will  likely be over before Reflect wears off, especially in doubles.

None of the tactics you've suggested alone are enough to prevent Slurpuff from setting up and doing lots of damage, and Slurpuff's bulk will keep it alive a lot longer than Mawile, while presenting a faster threat that hits still manages to hit 588 after the first turn.



Axl Low said:


> lol get taunted or hazed or roared



Slurpuff after Belly Drum will kill any pokemon capable of using those moves before they can attack because nothing will be able to survive it's +6 attack with +2 Speed.

Also, the special move version is even stronger because Slurpuff gets awesome coverage moves like Flamethrower (Good-bye Steal), and Psychic (Good-bye Poison), Surf (Good-bye Fire), Dazzling Gleam, Thunderbolt, Energy Ball.


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 12, 2013)

haze :I and slur aint fast lol 72
taunt bait

lol taunt skarm and taunt lass say hi


----------



## strongarm85 (Dec 12, 2013)

Actually it is that fast.

With +2 Speed Slurpuff will have 582 Speed. And that's with 31 Speed IVs, and no Evs.

Not Speed Form Deoxys with max speed investment can match that speed without being Choice Scarfed (which is a terrible item for Speed Deoxys).


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 12, 2013)

clear smog for damage and debuff
walled by weezing


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 12, 2013)

prankster / tricking a scarf on you 
what would your item even be


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 12, 2013)

belly drum + citrus berry
or petaya berry


----------



## strongarm85 (Dec 12, 2013)

Axl Low said:


> clear smog for damage and debuff
> walled by weezing



Weezing would get OHKOed by a Return after Belly Drum if you go physical, or OHKOed by a Psychic if you go special. Take your pick.



Axl Low said:


> prankster / tricking a scarf on you
> what would your item even be



First turn item would be a berry or an absorb bulb, take your pick.

After that, it wouldn't have an item anymore, chances are whatever move you use to trick a choice item on the Slurpuff wouldn't stop you from getting killed by it, even if you resisted the move, because the attack and special attack of the move would be so high.

Besides, this isn't much of a Marth Strategy. This is a Roy Strategy.


----------



## Xiammes (Dec 12, 2013)

strongarm85 said:


> Wow, someone can't do math.
> 
> At minimum, with 0 IVs or Evs in Attack, Slurpuff has 196 attack with 31 IVs and No EVs invested. At +6 that equals 588 attack. It also equals 408 Speed.



Yeah, thats actually weaker then Mega Mawile, who has better bulk, typing and a physical movepool. 



> With physical attack stats like those, you can pretty much OHKO any threat. Metagross will go  down to a Super Effective Theif + lose his item. Mega-Sizor doesn't have the bulk to survive a Play Rough or Return, even though it resists it. Same is true for Mega-Lucario.



Running thief means you lose your cotten guard.

Lets do some calcs without any attack investment

*Spoiler*: __ 




+6 0 Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 161-189 (57.2 - 67.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+6 0 Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Scizor: 120-141 (42.7 - 50.1%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO

+6 0 Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Ferrothorn: 127-150 (36 - 42.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

+6 0 Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Skarmory: 120-141 (35.9 - 42.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

+6 0 Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Multiscale Dragonite: 336-396 (87 - 102.5%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

+6 0 Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Gliscor: 265-313 (74.8 - 88.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO




Oh look, with no bulk investment Scizor only gets 2hko'd, Mega Scizor has a 1% chance to get 2hko'd, Mega Scizor is going to likely have bulk investment and can easily set up a swords dance on Slurpuff

Ferrothorn only gets 3kho'd, meaning it can paralyze/toxic/leech seed you to death. Skarmory is in a similar situation, except it can whirlwind you out.

Slurpuff only has a 18% chance to 1hko Dragonite, something it has a super effective stab against at +6.



> None of the tactics you've suggested alone are enough to prevent Slurpuff from setting up and doing lots of damage, and Slurpuff's bulk will keep it alive a lot longer than Mawile, while presenting a faster threat that hits still manages to hit 588 after the first turn.



Slurpuffs bulk is terrible, even neutral hits are going hurt it. You also assume this makes Slurpuff some unstoppable force of nature, but with no attack investment, you will be missing out on important 2hko's and 3hko's.



> Slurpuff after Belly Drum will kill any pokemon capable of using those moves before they can attack because nothing will be able to survive it's +6 attack with +2 Speed.



I've already proved you wrong, even at +6, no attack investment means you will be missing out on alot of 1hko's.


----------



## strongarm85 (Dec 13, 2013)

Xiammes said:


> Yeah, thats actually weaker then Mega Mawile, who has better bulk, typing and a physical movepool.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



And not a single thing you suggested there is valid against a Special Attacking Slurrpuff because it gets super effective coverage moves against every threat you just listed, accept Dragonite.

You've only debated Bellydrum so far, and Sizor is not going to OHKO through a Reflect even after a swords dance.

The point of the thread, as you've illustrated brilliantly, is that it requires very specific counters to stop Slurpuff once it gets started. It only needs 1 turn to set-up to cause a lot of damage. If you don't kill Slurpuff before then, you'll get swept a unless you use very specific counters.

Thank you for proving my point.

By the way, Mega Mawile may have better defenses, but it's irrelevant because it has terrible HP.


----------



## Xiammes (Dec 13, 2013)

strongarm85 said:


> And not a single thing you suggested there is valid against a Special Attacking Slurrpuff because it gets super effective coverage moves against every threat you just listed, accept Dragonite.
> 
> You've only debated Bellydrum so far, and Sizor is not going to OHKO through a Reflect even after a swords dance.
> 
> ...



I don't play doubles, so why would I bother to put up a argument?

Where is the reflect coming from? You are putting a lot of support for one Bellydrum set when Azumarril pulls off the set much better.

Since when is Scizor a specific counter? He is the most common pokemon in OU and he has only gotten better this generation. 

Black and White 2 July 2013(can't find a more recent one).

Mega Gengar was not banned because it was an all powerful threat that couldn't be answered

1) Scizor
2) Ferrothorn
5) Heatran - 4x resists play rough
18) Forretress 
19) Skarmory
20) Gliscore


----------



## Unlosing Ranger (Dec 13, 2013)

scizor op plz nerf


----------



## BiNexus (Dec 13, 2013)

X and Y OU Usage for October


*Spoiler*: __ 



| 1 | Aegislash | 38.33802%
| 2 | Greninja | 28.54731%
| 3 | Talonflame | 25.44047%
| 4 | Gengar | 20.89680%
| 5 | Ferrothorn | 14.84655%
| 6 | Tyranitar | 14.71539%
| 7 | Scizor | 14.63622%
| 8 | Klefki | 13.76588%
| 9 | Garchomp | 13.65784%
| 10 | Goodra | 12.69665%
| 11 | Azumarill | 12.50290%
| 12 | Rotom-Wash | 11.93938%
| 13 | Excadrill | 10.99819%
| 14 | Noivern | 10.81764%
| 15 | Alakazam | 9.98199%
| 16 | Dragonite | 9.91683%
| 17 | Gliscor | 9.67184%
| 18 | Lucario | 9.40824%
| 19 | Kangaskhan | 9.33202%
| 20 | Charizard | 9.03738%
| 21 | Trevenant | 8.55612%
| 22 | Malamar | 8.41735%
| 23 | Smeargle | 8.27984%
| 24 | Sylveon | 8.18109%
| 25 | Gyarados | 7.81704%
| 26 | Galvantula | 7.28694%
| 27 | Skarmory | 7.20031%
| 28 | Togekiss | 7.02792%
| 29 | Volcarona | 7.02354%
| 30 | Florges | 6.64256%
| 31 | Forretress | 6.06235%
| 32 | Starmie | 5.93586%
| 33 | Espeon | 5.83902%
| 34 | Mawile | 5.77589%
| 35 | Breloom | 5.62116%
| 36 | Tyrantrum | 5.59876%
| 37 | Cloyster | 5.50015%
| 38 | Mamoswine | 5.22060%
| 39 | Venusaur | 5.05563%
| 40 | Zygarde | 4.84289%
| 41 | Tentacruel | 4.67151%
| 42 | Heliolisk | 4.63548%
| 43 | Jolteon | 4.45997%
| 44 | Clawitzer | 4.26007%
| 45 | Diggersby | 4.06548%
| 46 | Delphox | 3.99960%
| 47 | Blissey | 3.86275%
| 48 | Barbaracle | 3.71251%
| 49 | Gardevoir | 3.51909%


----------



## Weather (Dec 13, 2013)

Aegislash and Greninja should drop. Srsly.

Especially Greninja.


----------



## strongarm85 (Dec 13, 2013)

Xiammes said:


> I don't play doubles, so why would I bother to put up a argument?
> 
> Where is the reflect coming from? You are putting a lot of support for one Bellydrum set when Azumarril pulls off the set much better.
> 
> ...



You know Steal desn't resist dark anymore right?

Thief pretty much covers those threats pretty well.


----------



## Bioness (Dec 13, 2013)

OP you've been watching Verlisify's videos too much.

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0QgId5CJtM[/YOUTUBE]

These gimmicky tactics will catch some people off guard but not anyone with knowledge worth a damn.


----------



## BiNexus (Dec 13, 2013)

Weather said:


> Aegislash and Greninja should drop. Srsly.
> 
> Especially Greninja.



Note that these are pre-pok?bank stats, so there is more representation by Gen VI 'mons. I remember I glanced at post-pok?bank and it was generally the same, with Scizor and Rotom-W claiming the top spots. I believe Greninja and Aegislash were still in the top 5. 

Through the entirety of Gen VI OU I doubt Aegislash or Greninja drop down below 25th place.

Edit @ above. That commentator is really humble


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 14, 2013)

so whirlwinnd and roar screw that over
k

also that guys doesnt know what he is talking about mat block is only if used on the turn greninja is sent out


3/10 would roar again


----------



## Xiammes (Dec 14, 2013)

strongarm85 said:


> You know Steal desn't resist dark anymore right?
> 
> Thief pretty much covers those threats pretty well.



A non stabbed thief, even a resisted play rough will do more damage then thief unless its supereffective. Only time you would want to use theif is on Heatran or grab a item.

Also scizor and forretress resist dark moves due to bug typing.


----------



## Scizor (Dec 14, 2013)

Axl Low said:


> long story short
> you're a marth player
> im a falcon player



Holy **** that's an awesome image 

And its meaning is somewhat relevant to the thread.


----------



## Axl Low (Dec 14, 2013)

Scizor said:


> Holy **** that's an awesome image
> 
> And its meaning is somewhat relevant to the thread.



You know me Scizor
when it comes to video games i always find good stuff 

its cute and all that you get like 7 special stat boosts in one turn
aka marth

but all i have to do is whirlwind/roar
aka the brute forcing of falcon punch


----------

