# Video Game Tier List



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 10, 2009)

Over the years there have been many failed attempts at making "Top 10", "Top 50", and even "Top 100" lists. So, instead, I propose an ongoing tier list for games, which I will closely monitor.

*Placement*:
The placement will work like this: someone nominates a game, I put it in that tier. Then I'll monitor for debating for replacement and average it down to a reasonable level.

**Nominations require the original console it was on to be listed.*

So, the Tier List (suggestions appreciated for tiers):

*Legendary Tier - Revolutionary Games* 
Tetris - Various
Pacman - Various 
Pong - Arcade
Donkey Kong - Arcade
Super Mario Bros. - NES
Street Fighter II - Arcade
Final Fantasy I - NES

*God Tier - the pinnacle of gaming*
Super Mario 3 - NES
Zelda III - SNES
Castlevania: Symphony of the Night - Playstation
Ocarina of Time - Nintendo 64
Chrono Trigger - SNES
Final Fantasy VI - SNES
Megaman II - NES
Super Metroid - SNES
Final Fantasy VII - Playstation
Shadow of the Colossus - PS2
Bioshock - Various
Earthbound - SNES
Starcraft - PC
Grand Theft Auto III - Various
Secret of Mana - SNES
Pokemon Gen 1 - Various

*Top Tier - the (almost) greatest games ever made*
Final Fantasy Tactics - Playstation
Diablo II - PC
The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind - PC
Mario 64 - Nintendo 64
Goldeneye - Nintendo 64
Diablo I - PC
Valkyrie Profile - Playstation
Super Mario World - SNES
Assassin's Creed 2 - PS3
Halo: Combat Evolved - XBOX
Okami - PS2
Final Fantasy IX - Playstation
Sonic the Hedgehog 2 - Genesis
Resident Evil IV - Various
Half-Life 2 - PC
Demon Souls - PS3
Warcraft II - PC
Civilization 4 - PC
Half-Life - PC
Deus Ex - PC 
Golden Sun - GBA
Golden Sun II - GBA
Prince of Persia : The Sands of Time Trilogy - Various
Donkey Kong Country 2: Diddy's Kong Quest - SNES

*High Tier - awesome games*
Valkyrie Profile II - PS2
Bahamut Lagoon - SNES
Sonic the Hedgehog - Genesis
Age of Empires - PC
Warcraft - PC
Super Mario Kart - SNES
Disgaea III - PS3
Mordern Warfare II - XBOX 360
Super Mario Galaxy - Wii
Metal Gear Solid 4 - PS3
The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion - PC/XBOX 360
Fallout 3 - Various
Mass Effect - Various
Batman: Arkham Asylum - Various
Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater - PS2
Mike Tyson's Punchout - NES
Blaster Master - NES
Final Fantasy VIII - Playstation 
God of War II - PS2
Final Fantasy IV - SNES
Resident Evil II - PC
FFX - PS2
Uncharted II - PS3
Dragon Age: Origins - Various
Pokemon Gen 2 - Various
Dynasty Warriors 3 - PS2
The World Ends With You - Nintendo DS

*Mid Tier - great games*
Metroid - NES
Azure Dreams - Playstation
Dungeon Explorer - TurboGrafx 16
Neutopia - TurboGrafx 16
Conkers Bad Fur Day - Nintendo 64
World of Warcraft - PC
Mortal Kombat II - SNES
God of War - PS2
Final Fantasy II - NES
Final Fantasy V - SNES
FFXII - PS2
Donkey Kong 64 - Nintendo 64
Dual Hearts - PS2

*Low Tier - good games*
Tochilight - PC
Twisted Metal 2 - PS2
Final Fantasy III - NES
Final Fantasy XI - Various

*Bottom Tier - bad games*
A Boy and his Blob - NES
Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest - SNES
FFX-2 - PS2
Infinite Undiscovery - XBOX 360

*Shit Tier - worst games in history*
E.T. - Atari
Superman 64 - Nintendo 64
Bujingai: The Forsaken City - PS2 
Final Fantasy Legends - Gameboy 


Note: The games listed are only examples and I will change them as dictated (especially the bottom two tiers ).


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## Hentai (Dec 10, 2009)

CrazyMoronX said:


> *Legendary Tier - the pinnacle of gaming*
> Super Mario 3 - NES
> Super Metroid - SNES
> Zelda III - SNES
> *DOOM - PC*


This is where your list became failure.


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 10, 2009)

Hentai said:


> This is where your list became failure.





			
				CMX said:
			
		

> Note: The games listed are only examples and I will change them as dictated (especially the bottom two tiers ).


This is where your reading comprehension skills became failure.


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## Lucius (Dec 10, 2009)

^yepp. everybody knows it sarted with wolfenstein !


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## Helix (Dec 10, 2009)

CrazyMoronX said:


> *Shit Tier - worst games in history*
> E.T. - Atari
> Superman 64 - Nintendo 64
> *Counterstrike () - PC*



Say what...?


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## Akamatsu (Dec 10, 2009)

One greatest legendary games all time METALGEARSOLID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Fraust (Dec 10, 2009)

I haven't even played Ocarina of Time and I know it should be up there.

Metal Gear Solid, 2, 4? Final Fantasy IV, VI, VII, X? Okami? Devil May Cry? Modern Warfare? Chrono Trigger? 

I believe Tetris and Pacman deserve a "Fucking Godly Game" tier?

Pokemon Silver was actually right after Red in the greatest Pokemon games ever, kthxbai.


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## Hentai (Dec 10, 2009)

CrazyMoronX said:


> This is where your reading comprehension skills became failure.


No. You put up a crap list. Dont try to pull yourself out of the affair. 
Also, even if you really meant them as example, putting Doom on legendary is an insult to the other games in that list.


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 10, 2009)

I put a couple of joke listings in there, you mad? 

Anyway, I am not going to leave my own suggestions on the list. I'm impartial.


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## Hentai (Dec 10, 2009)

I'd ad SotN and Ocarina of Time to Legendary.
Pokemon at least to Middle Tier.
Super Metroid to Top Tier (great but not Legendary)
And Morrowind to Top Tier.


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## Pringer Lagann (Dec 10, 2009)

MGS 4 to shit tier


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## Hentai (Dec 10, 2009)

Pringer Lagann said:


> MGS 4 to shit tier


No U


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## raxor (Dec 10, 2009)

Halo, Half-life (1/2), Portal, Age of Empires, Warcraft, Zelda: TP, Mario Galaxy and 64, Goldeneye, Mario kart, Gta and a load of other games/series that deserves a spot.

The ones listed should all be on top/legendary


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## Gnome (Dec 10, 2009)

Ocarina of Time is missing  it's easily legendary


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 10, 2009)

List updated to my best ability since most of the games mentioned haven't even been ranked by you suckas.


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## Fraust (Dec 10, 2009)

Meh, I disagree with MGS4's placement, but as long as Chrono Trigger is on top I'm fine. :3


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## Gnome (Dec 10, 2009)

CrazyMoronX said:


> List updated *to my best ability* since most of the games mentioned haven't even been ranked by you suckas.



well that's no good.


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 10, 2009)

I concur.


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## Sephiroth (Dec 10, 2009)

Add Metal Gear Solid, Final Fantasy 7, Street Fighter 2 to the legendary, and all is right.


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## Rukia (Dec 10, 2009)

I respected the list when I saw Superman 64 was correctly mentioned as one of the worst games ever.


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## Hentai (Dec 10, 2009)

Remove MGS4 from Crap tier and move it to middle or high, because thats what you would get if you have the average between haters and lovers of the game.


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## Platinum (Dec 10, 2009)

I would move Pokemon up to mid or high tier.

Assassin's Creed 2 is High Tier.


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## Hentai (Dec 10, 2009)

Platinum said:


> I would move Pokemon up to mid or high tier.
> 
> Assassin's Creed 2 is High Tier.


Amen                .


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## Fraust (Dec 10, 2009)

I third the Assassin's Creed II addition. Godly game.


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 10, 2009)

Perhaps I should add games myself.


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## Gnome (Dec 10, 2009)

Modern Warfare 2 is High Tier and Uncharted 2 is either High or Top Tier


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## Shoddragon (Dec 10, 2009)

from the constant reviews I have seen ( especially crazymtf/whity's review of it) uncharted 2 should be top tier.


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## Pringer Lagann (Dec 10, 2009)

Hentai said:


> No U



You mad 

(although it should be bottom tier)

Disgaea 3 High tier
Valkyrie Profile: Lenneth High-Legendary


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## Yagami-Kun (Dec 10, 2009)

Where is Final Fantasy VI? That's legendary tier for sure.


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## Fraust (Dec 10, 2009)

Yagami-Kun said:


> Where is Final Fantasy *VII*? That's legendary tier for sure.



Fix'd.


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## Jon Snow (Dec 10, 2009)

The question is, why am I not seeing Metal Gear Solid in the Legendary tier? Or are my eyes decieving me?


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## Yagami-Kun (Dec 10, 2009)

Fraust said:


> Fix'd.



Meh if you ask me, any FF is legendary tier. Loved all of them.


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## Fraust (Dec 10, 2009)

Jon Snow said:


> The question is, why am I not seeing Metal Gear Solid in the Legendary tier? Or are my eyes decieving me?


Look closer. It's kind of a "Which one of these doesn't belong?" game.



Yagami-Kun said:


> Meh if you ask me, any FF is legendary tier. Loved all of them.



All except for X-2.


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## Yagami-Kun (Dec 10, 2009)

Fraust said:


> Look closer. It's kind of a "Which one of these doesn't belong?" game.
> 
> 
> 
> All except for X-2.



Well when I say FF, I'm talking about the main series only, not spin offs or sequels like X-2.


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## Fraust (Dec 10, 2009)

Yagami-Kun said:


> Well when I say FF, I'm talking about the main series only, not spin offs or sequels like X-2.



Then will you include Versus XIII?


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## Yagami-Kun (Dec 10, 2009)

Fraust said:


> Then will you include Versus XIII?



If it turns out to be great then yeah. Really looking forward to that one


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## The810kid (Dec 10, 2009)

Yagami-Kun said:


> Meh if you ask me, any FF is legendary tier. Loved all of them.



I agree with you but then again FFXII and X-2 would fit that category and no way are they legendary.


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 11, 2009)

Jon Snow said:


> The question is, why am I not seeing Metal Gear Solid in the Legendary tier? Or are my eyes decieving me?


 Because this thread is a democracy and nobody voted for it to be up there.

The placement will work like this: someone nominates a game, I put it in that tier. Then I'll monitor for debating for replacement and average it down to a reasonable level.


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## Jon Snow (Dec 11, 2009)

I indirectly nominated the first Metal Gear Solid and it's still not there.

This system is corrupt.


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## Pringer Lagann (Dec 11, 2009)

Someone sticky this


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 11, 2009)

Indirect nominations only count when I want them to. 

Kind of like how I didn't put up Final Fantasy VII though it was indirectly nominated.


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## LoboFTW (Dec 11, 2009)

Can you place Oblivion and Fallout 3 in awesome tier. Also Batman: AA needs a high spot and mass effect needs to be high tier.


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## Fraust (Dec 11, 2009)

Final Fantasy VII. Top Tier. Nao.


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## Reaper of the Mist (Dec 11, 2009)

I nominate Assassin's Creed 2 and FINAL FANTASY VII for the Top tier, and Mortal Kombat 2 for mid.


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## Tenacious Lee (Dec 11, 2009)

Super Mario Galaxy for high tier
Conkers Bad Fur Day for mid tier(this list lacks N64 games)
MGS 4 being only mid tier angers me


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## Gnome (Dec 11, 2009)

MGS 4 should be High tier at the least.

edit: i hate to say it but WoW is the pinnacle of the MMO world, so it would probably Top Tier on this list.


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## Tenacious Lee (Dec 11, 2009)

Gnome on Fire said:


> MGS 4 should be High tier at the least.
> 
> edit: *i hate to say it but WoW is the pinnacle of the MMO world, so it would probably Top Tier on this list*.



popularity =/= quality

Example: twilight


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## Fraust (Dec 11, 2009)

Okami for Legendary tier. Not a top-selling game, but easily one of the greatest games ever created.


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 11, 2009)

Tenacious Lee said:


> Super Mario Galaxy for high tier
> Conkers Bad Fur Day for mid tier(this list lacks N64 games)
> MGS 4 being only mid tier angers me


 It was nominated in at shit tier, then debated up to mid tier. I'll move it up based on these recommendations. 


Gnome on Fire said:


> MGS 4 should be High tier at the least.
> 
> edit: i hate to say it but WoW is the pinnacle of the MMO world, so it would probably Top Tier on this list.


 That brings up an interesting point, I suppose. But I think we should vote on the quality of the game, not the popularity. If you think it should be top tier then vote it in at that tier. Otherwise, it's trash.


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## Gnome (Dec 11, 2009)

Tenacious Lee said:


> popularity =/= quality
> 
> Example: twilight



True, but to say WoW isn't a quality MMO would require you be in complete denial. the game constantly changes and pumps out new content on a steady basis.


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## Tenacious Lee (Dec 11, 2009)

Gnome on Fire said:


> True, but to say WoW isn't a quality MMO would require you be in complete denial. the game constantly changes and pumps out new content on a steady basis.



thats true, i was jsut making sure you understood the point. WoW probably deserves a Mid-tier. I used to play it(i had 2 lvl 70s) and i had some fun times, but overall i feel like my countless hours spent in that game were a waste.


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## Gnome (Dec 11, 2009)

Tenacious Lee said:


> thats true, i was jsut making sure you understood the point. WoW probably deserves a Mid-tier. I used to play it(i had 2 lvl 70s) and i had some fun times, but overall i feel like my countless hours spent in that game were a waste.



i played for three years and yeah, i regret it. it felt like a job at one point...yeah mid tier sounds better. god i hate that game


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## Fraust (Dec 11, 2009)

Bujingai for Bad or Shit tier. Worst. Ending. Ever.


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## Gnome (Dec 11, 2009)

Any Sonic game after the Sonic Adventure games is Bottom Tier


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 11, 2009)

Fraust said:


> Bujingai for Bad or Shit tier. Worst. Ending. Ever.


 What platform is that? I've never even heard of it.


Gnome on Fire said:


> Any Sonic game after the Sonic Adventure games is Bottom Tier


 Which would those be? I don't know everything.


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## Gnome (Dec 11, 2009)

CrazyMoronX said:


> Which would those be? I don't know everything.



All of them, you expect me to remember all that crap?


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## Fraust (Dec 11, 2009)

Bujingai is for the PS2.

Also, Okami for Legendary Tier like I said before. PS2 as well.


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## Gnome (Dec 11, 2009)

I think Legendary tier should only be for games that changed the Gaming world.


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 11, 2009)

Gnome on Fire said:


> All of them, you expect me to remember all that crap?


 Yes. Yes I do. I'm not in the habit of ranking series.  I will rank only singular games. 

Although I did almost consider ranking Megaman as a series, I felt it'd be a cop-out.


Fraust said:


> Bujingai is for the PS2.
> 
> Also, Okami for Legendary Tier like I said before. PS2 as well.


 I looked it up already.


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## Mikaveli (Dec 11, 2009)

Halo: Combat Evolved for Top tier. Hell maybe even higher.


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 11, 2009)

Gnome on Fire said:


> I think Legendary tier should only be for games that changed the Gaming world.


 I'd agree with that, but we would then need one more tier to separate the almost greatest games from the truly greatest.


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## Fraust (Dec 11, 2009)

Assassin's Creed II is on two Tiers. It's just that badass.

No, but it belongs in the higher of the two, honestly.


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## Gnome (Dec 11, 2009)

CrazyMoronX said:


> I'd agree with that, but we would then need one more tier to separate the almost greatest games from the truly greatest.



Make a Godly Tier


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 11, 2009)

I edited it with only 3 games in Legendary tier so far.


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## Fraust (Dec 11, 2009)

Gnome on Fire said:


> Make a Godly Tier



I agree.

There are godly games, legendary games, then heroic games.

Remember: Heroes get remembered, but legends never die.


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## Gabe (Dec 11, 2009)

Superman 64 - Nintendo 64 agree on it being the worst game is history i remember whe i got it as a small kid. 

halo, zelda and mario should be in the legendary section.


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## Sephiroth (Dec 11, 2009)

FFVII and Metal Gear Solid for god tier. 

Kirby Superstar for high tier as well.

Donkey Kong for Legendary Tier.


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## Masurao (Dec 11, 2009)

LoZ: Link to the Past should be on Godly Tier..

Edit: Nvm it's there already, lol.


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## Yagami-Kun (Dec 11, 2009)

Final Fantasy VII should be legendary tier. Love it or hate it, that game changed gaming and made video games culturally significant.

VI is an even better game.

I nominate Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater for High Tier.


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## Proxy (Dec 11, 2009)

Thread lacks MGS rated highly /godtier


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## Bungee Gum (Dec 11, 2009)

final fantasy 7(nvm, make it legendary!) and 10 to god tier, as both are better then 6. diablo 1 to bottom tier, that was shit was horrible.

legend of zelda wind waker and mario sunshine top tier. resident evil 4, either high tier or mid tier.

ff12 high tier or mid tier.

ssbm(super smash bros. melee) god tier.

skies of arcadia, high tier. star ocean 3 high tier.

PSO(Phantasy Star Online) 1 and 2 for GC God tier or Top tier, favorite game of all time right here.


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## NinjaM (Dec 11, 2009)

WHERE THE F' IS SUPER MARIO BROS. 1 IN THE LEGENDARY TIER?

That game brought consoles back from the dead, defined platformers for eternity, and would be the reason half the young developers in the industry (myself included) went into the business.

And WTF is w/ bottom tier!? Boy and his Blob is no bottom tier! And Pokemon? Think what you want about the series but the original games were some of the best RPGs ever made.

</rage>

Okami is great, but it does not quite belong w/ those other games. Move down one tier.

<submissions>
High Tier: Team Fortress 2, Left 4 Dead, Okami, Super Smash Bros. 64/Melee/Brawl, FF8, FF7 (HELL NO NOT GOD)
Mid Tier: League of Legends, Trine, Guild Wars, Braid


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## Bungee Gum (Dec 11, 2009)

look closely it says pokemon gba games, not gb games, ruby and emerald and saphire along with leaf green and firered werent that good.


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## Gnome (Dec 11, 2009)

Pokemon Gold and Silver>all other pokemon games.


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## Rukia (Dec 11, 2009)

I agree with the list pretty much completely.  Obviously there are a lot of additional games I would stack into various tiers, but these are hard to argue with.

Let's go with some NES add's.

High Tier:

Mike Tyson's Punchout
Blaster Master


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## DragonTiger (Dec 11, 2009)

Just because Ruby/Saphire/Emerald seemingly weren't up to par with the rest of the series, they were still great. Definitley not bottom tier material. 

Hell, if were up to me, they'd beat out some of the stuff on the High Tier list. I say at least move them to Mid. 

And since I don't seem to see them on there, I nominate Pokemon Gold/Silver for top tier.


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## NinjaM (Dec 12, 2009)

SuperNovaLogia said:


> look closely it says pokemon gba games, not gb games, ruby and emerald and saphire along with leaf green and firered werent that good.


Ahhh, that makes sense. Although they weren't THAT bad. 

I nominate Red/Blue/Yellow for God Tier.





Rukia said:


> High Tier:
> 
> Mike Tyson's Punchout
> Blaster Master



+1.


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## Fraust (Dec 12, 2009)

I nominate Okami to be unchangeable. Allow me this one joy.


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## Zaelapolopollo (Dec 12, 2009)

I second Super Mario Bros. (NES) for Legendary Tier.

I also recommend Grand Theft Auto III for Legendary. If Mario was the big game for everyone growing up, GTA3 was the big game for everyone when they hit their teens. It made sandbox gaming awesome and brought it to the forefront of the industry, inspiring countless clones. 

Much like how SMB3 inproved upon everything in SMB1, I'd say GTA Vice City for God Tier. It took everythign GTA3 had going for it and made it even better.

Final Fantasy IX for God Tier. It is easily the best Final Fantasy game. As it actually has to do with fantasy, has an epic soundtrack, the best hero and villain in the series, fun gameplay and...shit, what isn't there to praise about this game?


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## Sephiroth (Dec 12, 2009)

The Anti-Existence said:


> Final Fantasy IX for God Tier. It is easily the best Final Fantasy game. As it actually has to do with fantasy, has an epic soundtrack, *the best hero and villain in the series*, fun gameplay and...shit, what isn't there to praise about this game?



Kuja was great, Zidane not so much.


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## Hentai (Dec 12, 2009)

Move God of War to Mid, it's awesome.
God of War 2 is High


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## Dionysus (Dec 12, 2009)

Missing Thief 1 & 2 near the high end of that list.  And there is Fallout 3 but not 2?  Baldur's Gate?  Planescape: Torment?  All bloody amazing.


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## ZE (Dec 12, 2009)

Put these in legendary tier, they deserve it: 
Gran Turimo 
Metal Gear Solid
Mario 64
Super Mario Land
Street Fighter II
Sonic


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## Rayl (Dec 12, 2009)

Where is God Hand? D: Streets of Rage 2? Skies of Arcadia? Granted Skies of Arcadia is a bit bias on my part since i love the game so much but seriously where are the other two? D:


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## Rukia (Dec 12, 2009)

Skies of Arcadia (Dreamcast) was an excellent game.  I don't know that I would put it that high though.

Still not seeing Blaster Master get the respect it deserves.  

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vb8b02474FM[/YOUTUBE]


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## Rayl (Dec 12, 2009)

I would at least put SoA on mid tier. It's better then pretty much every RPG out there tbh.


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## NinjaM (Dec 12, 2009)

The Anti-Existence said:


> Final Fantasy IX for God Tier. It is easily the best Final Fantasy game.



:rofl

Good joke.

Oh wait. 



<Editing out direct ranking, that was stupid of me, replacing with tiers>
Top Tier: FF6
High Tier: FF1, FF4, FF8, FF9
Mid Tier: FF2, FF5, FF7, FF10, FF12
Low Tier: FF3, FF10-2, FF11

Without a doubt, VI is the best in terms of gameplay, and probably in most everything else (IT'S GRAPHICS ARE BETTER THAN SEVEN, FOR SURE).

Everything pre-VII will always be superior to post-VI. 



Rukia said:


> Still not seeing Blaster Master get the respect it deserves.


+2.


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## Rukia (Dec 12, 2009)

Final Fantasy Tactics was great. I have always been disappointed that they didn't come out with another Tactics type game.

Tactics Ogre was much better than Ogre Battle.

I thought Disgaea 3 was the worst Disgaea.  I pretty much only bought it because Etna was supposed to be in it.  I got bored with it in a hurry!


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## NinjaM (Dec 12, 2009)

Rukia said:


> Final Fantasy Tactics was great. I have always been disappointed that they didn't come out with another Tactics type game.



Final Fantasy Tactics 2? 



^ In my DS right now.


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## Zaelapolopollo (Dec 12, 2009)

> FF6 > FF4 > FF1 ~ FF2 ~ FF3 ~ FF5 > FF8 ~ FF9 > FF10 > FF12 > FF7 > FF10-2 > FF11



FF3's a hunk of shit. The plot is horrible and the gameplay is done better in later generations.
FF1 is bland and boring.

Placing either of them above IX and X is a joke. 

And I think IX had a better story and characters than VI or IV. At least IX didn't have a super big reveal of the main villain at the end... You know Golbez don't mea shit right? He was just a pawn.

And Kefka is unoriginal in every way. 



> Everything pre-VII will always be superior to post-VI.



Only Sith deal in absolutes.


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## Fraust (Dec 12, 2009)

The Anti-Existence said:


> And Kefka is unoriginal in every way.





FFIX shouldn't be in God Tier, though. As much as I love the game it didn't do anything for the series like IV, VI, VII, and X did. Mid Tier sounds fine, though .


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## Bungee Gum (Dec 12, 2009)

Nmaster64 said:


> Final Fantasy Tactics 2?
> 
> 
> 
> ^ In my DS right now.



lol, wow, same here ^^


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## Fraust (Dec 12, 2009)

I want Tactics A2. Is it better than Advance?


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## NinjaM (Dec 12, 2009)

The Anti-Existence said:


> FF3's a hunk of shit. The plot is horrible and the gameplay is done better in later generations.


Okay I admit I never played that one much. 


The Anti-Existence said:


> FF1 is bland and boring.


[YOUTUBE]kmi_7udjaSE[/YOUTUBE]



The Anti-Existence said:


> And I think IX had a better story and characters than VI or IV.


Just no. Superior however to VII and X.



The Anti-Existence said:


> And Kefka is unoriginal in every way.


*sees Sephiroth sig*

Total, complete, epic, fail. 



The Anti-Existence said:


> Only Sith deal in absolutes.


So you're calling me a Sith? 

Okay, that's cool. 



Fraust said:


> I want Tactics A2. Is it better than Advance?



I'm leaning towards not quite. But if you love Tactics it's more of the same goodness.


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## Bungee Gum (Dec 12, 2009)

i believe it was better, i like its revamped system, its the same just better imo, and its longer, more fun but not as hardcore? maybe is the word, naah, maybe not as serious, cuz its easier. well, all games made for ds and wii are easier then anything lol.


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## NinjaM (Dec 12, 2009)

It's better in the same way Left 4 Dead 2 is technically better than Left 4 Dead.

There are improvements, but it's just not quite as magical as the first 100+ hours you spent with it's prequel.


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## Fraust (Dec 12, 2009)

I've played Tactics Advance twice 'cause I loved it so much. Didn't play the original Tactics very long, though I'm thinking of playing it soon now since I realized how much I love strategy RPGs.


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## Sephiroth (Dec 12, 2009)

Rukia said:


> Tactics Ogre was much better than Ogre Battle.





> Just no. Superior however to VII and X.


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## Tony Lou (Dec 12, 2009)

I nominate FFX for high tier.


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## Rukia (Dec 12, 2009)

Ogre Battle is alright.  Don't get me wrong.  In fact, I would say that the gameplay and system were fairly innovative for it's time.  I just enjoyed Tactics Ogre a lot more.  And it's a mystery to me why Tactics Ogre is a rare game that no one bought when it was released.

Final Fantasy Tactics on DS?  A DS sequel doesn't count as a sequel.


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## Bungee Gum (Dec 12, 2009)

im going to make some more suggestions if the OP actually edits his posts any time soon.

Legend of Dragoon-high/top
Mortal Kombat: Deadly Alliance-Mid/high
Custom Robo(gc)-high 
Metroid Prime-God/top
Halo 3- Mid
Red, blue, yellow, silver, gold, crystal-Top
THPS 3- mid
SSX Tricky- high
Phantasy Star Universe- mid/high
Phantasy Star Online I+II plus(GC)-high/top
Dragon Ball Z:Budokai 2-bottom/low
DBZ:Tenkaiwhatever 3- Mid
FE, FE: sacred stones-high
Star Fox 64-Top
Star fox adventures-mid/high

i still say diablo 1 should be moved down to bottom/shit, it was horrid.


----------



## NinjaM (Dec 12, 2009)

Rukia said:


> Final Fantasy Tactics on DS?  A DS sequel doesn't count as a sequel.


Tactics Advance > Tactics 

PORTABILITY FTW



SuperNovaLogia said:


> Star fox adventures-mid/high


:/


----------



## Bungee Gum (Dec 12, 2009)

lol, i effin hate how you can only have 2 saved files, my friends get pissed when i erase their junk and let another friend replace, the cycle goes on and on. just for those two though >.>


----------



## NinjaM (Dec 12, 2009)

Sounds like your friends need to get their own damn games.


----------



## Bungee Gum (Dec 12, 2009)

lol yeah, but they havent had jobs yet, lol well, one just did, so he wont need to anymore. and i doubt they like rpg's anymore, they're all into those fps's, mostly junk. and if i dont like them as much as them, its because im not as "good" at them as other games, but maybe thats true, i am good at halo and i love halo, but cod can suck my.... i hate dying by one knife slash, and i cant read the map at all, but once my friend turns on the map so we both see each other, i rape him and ragequits and wonders why he was doing so bad against a noob(hint* they only win because they know the lvl lol)


----------



## Sephiroth (Dec 12, 2009)

Nmaster64 said:


> Tactics Advance > Tactics





Rage, I feel like Goofy Titan.

You can't compare perfection with imperfection.


----------



## Bungee Gum (Dec 12, 2009)

Nmaster64 said:


> Tactics Advance > Tactics
> 
> PORTABILITY FTW
> 
> :/



star fox adventures was epic to me, why dont you think its that good?


----------



## NinjaM (Dec 12, 2009)

Sephiroth said:


> You can't compare perfection with imperfection.


Screw the rules I have money. 

I think the differences between the games are overblown, and the game had the perfect design for going portable. 

There are games I believe just work better on handhelds. WarioWare is a good example.



SuperNovaLogia said:


> star fox adventures was epic to me, why dont you think its that good?



I was really excited about the game but when I played it it just felt average. :/


----------



## Bungee Gum (Dec 12, 2009)

Nmaster64 said:


> I was really excited about the game but when I played it it just felt average. :/



i was excited too, i bought the booklet and everything, ohh, playing those mazes and bosses on sunday mornings in the winter give me great memories.


----------



## Reaper of the Mist (Dec 13, 2009)

I nominate Resident Evil 2, PS1 for High tier. And I nominate Kingdon Hearts 1 and 2, PS2 for Top tier.


----------



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 14, 2009)

SuperNovaLogia said:


> im going to make some more suggestions if the OP actually edits his posts any time soon.
> 
> i still say diablo 1 should be moved down to bottom/shit, it was horrid.


I'm editing it right now. 


Also, new rule: there are way too many games being named and I don't know some of them. I'm not going to accept new nominations without their consoles also being listed. 

As for Pokemon, since there are so many damn games and they all seem the same to me, I'm ranking them as one entity--I may have two, IE: Pre-Silver/Post-Silver type deal. CAN YOU DEAL WITH THAT?!?


----------



## Zaelapolopollo (Dec 14, 2009)

GTA3 is for PS2, Xbox and PC. And it belongs in Legendary.

David Hayter said it was his favorite game ever. That sounds like a second to me.


----------



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 14, 2009)

I suppose I'd have to accept that it did change gaming. Not for the better though.


----------



## Zaelapolopollo (Dec 14, 2009)

Hey. GTA3 and Vice City are a helluva lot of fun even to this day.

They also brought together the amazing talent of Ray Liota, Burt Reynolds, Gary Busey and Jenna Jameson.
Can you say that about any other game?

I didn't think so.


----------



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 14, 2009)

Kingdom Hearts brought together a lot of actors and shit, too, but you don't see me touting that game as legendary. Legendarily shitty, maybe. 

I'm going to have to convince someone to let me nominate/rank games by proxy. I just need to find a decent cadidate.


----------



## TheoDerek (Dec 14, 2009)

Until Street Fighter II is put in the Legendary tier, and Super Metroid is put in the God tier, this thread is dead to me.

SFII is the very definition of revolutionary.  SFII gave previously unknown life to the arcades and spawned countless clones.  It set the standard for fighting games and its influence can be seen in nearly every fighting game to come out after it.

And as for Super Metroid, it is at the very least on par with Zelda III, and Mario III and was the gameplay inspiration for Symphony of the Night.


----------



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 14, 2009)

What's SM?


----------



## The Nameless Pharaoh (Dec 14, 2009)

I suggest moving God of War a couple of tiers up. That game was superb.

Final Fantasy VII should be moved to Legendary Tier. It put the Playstation on the map and gaming today wouldn't be the same without it (if here at all). It did make gaming culturally huge. And that's without mentioning the influence it had on RPGs (and other genres).


----------



## Proxy (Dec 14, 2009)

Where's my Sonic 2 and/or Sonic & Knuckles? 

Also, where's Marvel vs. Capcom?


----------



## Fraust (Dec 14, 2009)

Lost Odyssey. Xbox 360. High.

WTF is X-2 doing in Low Tier? Move it down.


----------



## typhoon72 (Dec 14, 2009)

Proxy said:


> Where's my Sonic 2 and/or Sonic & Knuckles?
> 
> Also, where's Marvel vs. Capcom?



This. Sonic 2 must be Top tier at least...(genesis)
Donkey Kong 64 (N64) Mid


----------



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 14, 2009)

I'm developing my own personal voting system to keep track of tier placement votes so if you don't see a game move after your suggestion don't worry, it'll get moved up (or down) with additional votes.


----------



## Yagami-Kun (Dec 14, 2009)

Again, FF VII should be moved up to legendary tier.

FF X and XII should be moved up to Top tier. 

BioShock should be moved to Godly.


----------



## Fraust (Dec 14, 2009)

I vote for Yagami-kun's suggestion for VII and X.

Not so for XII.


----------



## Yagami-Kun (Dec 14, 2009)

Fraust said:


> I vote for Yagami-kun's suggestion for VII and X.
> 
> Not so for XII.



Haha 

Never understood the hate for that one though


----------



## Fraust (Dec 14, 2009)

Personally, I like love stories between main characters... I also like main characters. This game had neither. Ending was also shit.

'Twas a fun journey, though. I give it that. Epic on a grand scale in terms of what you have to go through from beginning to end.


----------



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 14, 2009)

FFVII has been moved up one tier.


----------



## Yagami-Kun (Dec 14, 2009)

Which tier is on a higher level though? Godly or Legendary?


----------



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 14, 2009)

Godly is the highest quality tier. Legendary doesn't denote game quality, but it isn't completely exclusive as most of the games on there are top-notch.


----------



## Yagami-Kun (Dec 14, 2009)

Shadow of the Colossus to Godly. And again for Bioshock.


----------



## The Nameless Pharaoh (Dec 14, 2009)

Now that I think about it, Final Fantasy I should be in legendary tier.

Without it, we wouldn't have had the sequels, we wouldn't have had Chrono Trigger and other Square games, and we pretty much wouldn't have had RPG's today. That changed gaming.


----------



## Fawful (Dec 14, 2009)

Needs at least one Fire Emblem game to be in. Also Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing needs to be shit tier.


----------



## Fraust (Dec 14, 2009)

The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> Now that I think about it, Final Fantasy I should be in legendary tier.
> 
> Without it, we wouldn't have had the sequels, we wouldn't have had Chrono Trigger and other Square games, and we pretty much wouldn't have had RPG's today. That changed gaming.




This man speaks truth. It makes sense in theory, but could it work? By gone, I think I'll vote for his suggestion!


----------



## Gnome (Dec 14, 2009)

The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> Now that I think about it, Final Fantasy I should be in legendary tier.
> 
> Without it, we wouldn't have had the sequels, we wouldn't have had Chrono Trigger and other Square games, and we pretty much wouldn't have had RPG's today. That changed gaming.



i second this.


----------



## Shock Therapy (Dec 14, 2009)

imo Super Castlevania 4 is better than Symphony of the Night because it was on SNES making it a classic in its own right, the control is so satisfying allowing you to whip in 8 directions, and I overall had more fun playing it.


----------



## Pringer Lagann (Dec 15, 2009)

Move FFVII to low
Ballz 3D for Bottom
Capcom vs SNK 2 for Top
Lair for Bottom
Valkyria Chronicles for Top or God


----------



## dream (Dec 15, 2009)

Replace Elder Scrolls: Morrowind in top tier with Elder Scrolls: Daggerfall.


----------



## firefist (Dec 15, 2009)

where is Banjo-Kazooie/Banjo-Tooie (N64)?

both should be atleast high tier.


----------



## Zaelapolopollo (Dec 15, 2009)

Banjo-Kazooie was frickin' huge when it came out.


----------



## Han Solo (Dec 15, 2009)

Hmm, I think Mario 64 should be moved up.

It was the first game that ever gave a legitimately good 3D gaming experience.

It was revolutionary.


----------



## Proxy (Dec 15, 2009)

Zombies Ate My Neighbors: /godtier
Rival Schools: /hightier
FFX: /swapwith FFIX
Mortal Kombat II: /hightier


----------



## The Nameless Pharaoh (Dec 15, 2009)

I vote for Shadow of the Colossus (PS2) and Bioshock (360,PS3, and PC) to Godly.
Uncharted 2 (PS3) should be lowered by one tier. 
FF X (PS2) and XII (PS2) should both be in top.


----------



## Zaelapolopollo (Dec 15, 2009)

You better not move FFIX at all unless you're moving it up, CMX. *shakes fist*

Also, if RE2 is on the list, RE4 should be as well.
Resident Evil 4 (various) for Top Tier.


----------



## Shock Therapy (Dec 15, 2009)

Call of Duty 4 should be in pinnacle of gaming.
This game redefines FPS games. Literally.


----------



## Yagami-Kun (Dec 15, 2009)

FF VIII should be in top tier (PS1)
Uncharted 2 should be in high tier (PS3)



> You better not move FFIX at all unless you're moving it up, CMX. *shakes fist*



Seconded.


----------



## Shoddragon (Dec 15, 2009)

oblivion should be moved to top tier. game was fucking amazing, and if you count mods it should be god tier .

Mother ( earthbound?) should be in legendary tier or God Tier.


----------



## dream (Dec 15, 2009)

Shoddragon said:


> oblivion should be moved to top tier. game was fucking amazing, and if you count mods it should be god tier .



Oblivion is fail as an Elder Scrolls game.  Though with FCOM it becomes High Tier.  But in no way can it ever be considered a pinnacle of gaming.  

FFVII needs to be moved down to top tier.  And Half-Life below Halo?    Half-Life needs to be top tier.  ALso where is Half-Life 2 which needs to be top tier as well.  Halo should also be moved down to high tier.


----------



## Shock Therapy (Dec 15, 2009)

half-life definitely beats halo in my books. i mean the first one was awesome but the other two, not so much


----------



## Gnome (Dec 15, 2009)

didn't Halo do for console shooters, what Half-life did for PC shooters?


----------



## Proxy (Dec 15, 2009)

Demon's Souls /toptier


----------



## NinjaM (Dec 16, 2009)

The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> I vote for Shadow of the Colossus (PS2) and Bioshock (360,PS3, and PC) to Godly.


That's a bit much.


The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> Uncharted 2 (PS3) should be lowered by one tier.


Yes.


The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> FF X (PS2) and XII (PS2) should both be in top.


X is overrated.





The Anti-Existence said:


> Also, if RE2 is on the list, RE4 should be as well. Resident Evil 4 (various) for Top Tier.


YES.


Yagami-Kun said:


> FF VIII should be in top tier (PS1)


Fuck Yes. _(it's on PC too)_


Shoddragon said:


> Mother ( earthbound?) should be in legendary tier or God Tier.


Yes.


Dai Dreamer said:


> FFVII needs to be moved down to top tier.


YES. 





Dai Dreamer said:


> And Half-Life below Halo?    Half-Life needs to be top tier.  ALso where is Half-Life 2 which needs to be top tier as well.  Halo should also be moved down to high tier.


FUCK YES.


Gnome on Fire said:


> Didn't Goldeneye 64 do for console shooters, what Half-life did for PC shooters?


Fixed and nominated.


----------



## dream (Dec 16, 2009)

I recommend Team Fortress 2 to High Tier.

GTA3 needs to be lowered to God Tier at the very least because in my opinion it shouldn't be on the same level as Pong and Donkey Kong.

Bioshock should be lowered to High Tier.  I would add Warcraft 2 (PC) to Top Tier.  Baldur's Gate 2 (PC) should be God Tier.  Assassin's Creed 2 seems to be too high.  Uncharted 2 is also too high.  High or Mid Tier seems right for them.


----------



## NinjaM (Dec 16, 2009)

Dai Dreamer said:


> I recommend Team Fortress 2 to High Tier.
> 
> GTA3 needs to be lowered to God Tier at the very least because in my opinion it shouldn't be on the same level as Pong and Donkey Kong.
> 
> Bioshock should be lowered to High Tier.  I would add Warcraft 2 (PC) to Top Tier.  Baldur's Gate 2 (PC) should be God Tier.  Assassin's Creed 2 seems to be too high.  Uncharted 2 is also too high.  High or Mid Tier seems right for them.



Agree w/ all of this.


----------



## dream (Dec 16, 2009)

I tentatively put forth Civilization 4 (PC) for Top Tier.

I also recommend Ogre Battle 64 (N64) for Mid/Low Tier.


----------



## Zaelapolopollo (Dec 16, 2009)

GTA3 shouldn't be moved. Legendary Tier is specifcally noed to be Revoltuionary Games and that is most certainly what 3 is.


----------



## dream (Dec 16, 2009)

In what ways is GTA3 revolutionary?  I've only played it for five or four hours so my knowledge is incomplete.


----------



## The Nameless Pharaoh (Dec 16, 2009)

I agree that Uncharted 2 is too high.

But FF VII, BioShock, AC II, and GTA III should not be moved, unless they move up


----------



## dream (Dec 16, 2009)

Again I'll ask what has GTA3 done that is revolutionary.  Bioshock is not better than Starcraft.


----------



## The Nameless Pharaoh (Dec 16, 2009)

Bioshock goes beyond video games, that game can be compared with literature. Heavy philosophical stuff in that game.

That's beyond being a pinnacle of gaming.


----------



## dream (Dec 16, 2009)

The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> Bioshock goes beyond video games, that game can be compared with literature. Heavy philosophical stuff in that game.
> 
> That's beyond being a pinnacle of gaming.





Having heavy philosophy in a game doesn't make it amazing or a pinnacle of gaming or beyond it.  Also info on how GTA3 is revolutionary.


----------



## The Nameless Pharaoh (Dec 16, 2009)

Dai Dreamer said:


> Having heavy philosophy in a game doesn't make it amazing or a pinnacle of gaming or beyond it.  Also info on how GTA3 is revolutionary.



Why wouldn't it? It just means that the game goes beyond its medium, and that's a rare feat here.


----------



## LoboFTW (Dec 16, 2009)

Dai Dreamer said:


> In what ways is GTA3 revolutionary?  I've only played it for five or four hours so my knowledge is incomplete.



It started one of the most top scoring genres, besides FPS, the sandbox game. GTA 3 is to sandbox games, what Final Fantasy is to the JRPG. Plus it is freakin awesome.


----------



## The Nameless Pharaoh (Dec 16, 2009)

I suggest FF Tactics be moved to God Tier.

I nominate Dragon Age: Origins (Various) to high tier.

Uncharted 2 has been voted too high I believe. CMX?


----------



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 16, 2009)

It has been moved along with a few other updates.


----------



## dream (Dec 16, 2009)

LoboFTW said:


> It started one of the most top scoring genres, besides FPS, the sandbox game. GTA 3 is to sandbox games, what Final Fantasy is to the JRPG. Plus it is freakin awesome.





Elder Scrolls: Daggerfall came out long before GTA3 and it was a sandbox game, and a better sandbox game. Try again.  

Neverwinter Nights should go to High Tier/Mid Tier.  Either one is fine.


----------



## Zaelapolopollo (Dec 16, 2009)

...Elder Scrolls is an RPG.
And that's like saying other platformers came out before Super Mario. That's true. Did any of them have the effect on gaming that Mario did? No. 

So Daggerfall and those platformers don't mean shit and Mario and GTA3 go in Legendary.


----------



## Fraust (Dec 16, 2009)

I vote to not put GTA3 anywhere near the top. 

San Andreas, ftw.


----------



## Zaelapolopollo (Dec 16, 2009)

Newer fans to series really do suck sometimes. No respect or appreciation for the games that made their favorites a reality.

There'd be no San Andreas without GTA3.


----------



## Yagami-Kun (Dec 16, 2009)

@ Dreamer: Yes, The Anti-Existence is right, his argument makes sense.

I recommend Rome: Total War (PC) to high tier at least, or top tier if people agree.


----------



## Pringer Lagann (Dec 16, 2009)

lol San Andreas blew


----------



## mystictrunks (Dec 16, 2009)

Dai Dreamer said:


> In what ways is GTA3 revolutionary?  I've only played it for five or four hours so my knowledge is incomplete.



Revolutionized the sandbox genre and changed how "adult" gaming was seen in the mainstream.



Pringer Lagann said:


> lol San Andreas blew



It was the best GTA.


----------



## Zaelapolopollo (Dec 16, 2009)

I don't like CJ. That kinda kills SA for me.


----------



## mystictrunks (Dec 16, 2009)

The Anti-Existence said:


> I don't like CJ. That kinda kills SA for me.



You'sa busta


----------



## Fraust (Dec 16, 2009)

The Anti-Existence said:


> Newer fans to series really do suck sometimes. No respect or appreciation for the games that made their favorites a reality.
> 
> There'd be no San Andreas without GTA3.



I've played 3, Vice City, San Andreas, and IV. Don't care for any of them. If anything, Vice City is my favorite because I played it the most. I wouldn't vote any of them on the list, though.

And no shit there'd be no San Andreas without 3. That's like saying there'd be no KH: CoM without KH, it's pretty obvious.


----------



## dream (Dec 16, 2009)

> ...and changed how "adult" gaming was seen in the mainstream.




I'll agree with that.

Moving on, I recommend Deus Ex (PC) for Top Tier.


----------



## NinjaM (Dec 16, 2009)

Dai Dreamer said:


> Bioshock is not better than Starcraft.


This. 

Considering it turned gaming into a NATIONAL SPORT for one country and is TO THIS DAY the greatest RTS of all time, it definitely deserves Legendary.



The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> Bioshock goes beyond video games, that game can be compared with literature. Heavy philosophical stuff in that game.
> 
> That's beyond being a pinnacle of gaming.


:rofl

I'm sorry but that's a bunch of BS.


----------



## Shock Therapy (Dec 16, 2009)

Nmaster64 said:


> This.
> 
> Considering it turned gaming into a NATIONAL SPORT for one country and is TO THIS DAY the greatest RTS of all time, it definitely deserves Legendary.
> 
> ...



people died playing too much starcraft in korea. who's died playing bioshock?


----------



## The Nameless Pharaoh (Dec 16, 2009)

> I'm sorry but that's a bunch of BS.



Hmm? No it isn't.


----------



## Black Wraith (Dec 16, 2009)

Diablo II should be in the highest tier - People play this game even after 10 years.
GTAIII should also be moved to the highest tier.

You should change your top two tier names around too.

Pokemon Gold/Silver/Platinum - GBC - Just as popular and addictive as D2 and GTA3. Even after over a decade and many iterations the formula has hardly changed but still sells record smashing numbers each time. Definitely in the highest tier.


----------



## NinjaM (Dec 17, 2009)

The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> Hmm? No it isn't.



A) Bioshock HARDLY goes beyond video games. It is a video game, one with SOME uniqueness in story-telling and atmosphere. Still very much just a game.

B) I don't see the "heavy" philosophical stuff, definitely nothing that a few if not plenty of other games have shown elements of.

C) By your logic I'm pretty sure _Braid_ is beyond the beyond of the pinnacle of gaming. 

Great, amazing, awesome game. More because it was done _right_ than _different_.


----------



## The Nameless Pharaoh (Dec 17, 2009)

Nmaster64 said:


> A) Bioshock HARDLY goes beyond video games. It is a video game, one with SOME uniqueness in story-telling and atmosphere. Still very much just a game.
> 
> B) I don't see the "heavy" philosophical stuff, definitely nothing that a few if not plenty of other games have shown elements of.
> 
> ...



A) "Some" uniqueness? Hardly. The game world itself, Rapture, is one of the most memorable in any game and the characters are remarkably academic for a video game. Bioshock is a work of art.

B) Well if you can't see the philosophical stuff then that's your problem. Go play it again.

C) Not familiar with Braid.

Perhaps what I said about it being "beyond the pinnacle of gaming" was extreme. But it still goes beyond your average video game in being literate and intelligent.


----------



## DragonTiger (Dec 17, 2009)

I still say the (main) Pokemon series should be moved up a tier. Red and Blue/Gold and Silver single-handedly brought the Game Boy to it's pinnacle, and subsequently, brought every Nintendo handheld to where they are today. 

 Seriously, the poularity of these games moves consoles. Always has, and always will. I'm an example of that. God knows that I wouldn't have a DS if it weren't for Pokemon. I don't know where we'd be handheld-wise without Pokemon. but I'd imagine the market would have to be somewhat different.

Hell, poularity aside, they're just damn good games. I vouch for them to be moved to Top Tier.


----------



## Fraust (Dec 17, 2009)

Pokemon Red is the greatest RPG of all time.


----------



## Tony Lou (Dec 17, 2009)

Shadow of Colossus for top tier


----------



## DideeKawaii (Dec 17, 2009)

The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> Bioshock goes beyond video games, that game can be compared with literature. Heavy philosophical stuff in that game.
> 
> That's beyond being a pinnacle of gaming.



I kind of agree with you on that. Bioshock philosophicaly touches strings videogames rarely touch (Beside MGS4 but, when the game as the content of 3 movies incorporated in it, it goes a little bit everywhere, unlike bioshock.)

As for Ac2, the game is overrated right now. It's not God like. 

FF3 is terribly low. And where the fuck is Secret of mana at. That game's near god level.


----------



## Sephiroth (Dec 17, 2009)

mystictrunks said:


> Revolutionized the sandbox genre and changed how "adult" gaming was seen in the mainstream.



Yeah in a bad light. 

I vote Starcraft to god tier, as it's the best of the best of the genre.


----------



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 17, 2009)

A little movement today. I may seed in a few games in the future.


----------



## NinjaM (Dec 17, 2009)

The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> A) "Some" uniqueness? Hardly. The game world itself, Rapture, is one of the most memorable in any game and the characters are remarkably academic for a video game. Bioshock is a work of art.
> 
> B) Well if you can't see the philosophical stuff then that's your problem. Go play it again.
> 
> ...



First off, go buy and beat Braid (XBLA or Steam). Now.

Second, yes, it's definitely very "above average" in a lot of respects. Artistically and atmospherically it's beautiful, but that's not "beyond" video games or anything, it's exactly what a good game should be doing.

I don't like this concept that if a video game does something artistically or "philosophically" or whatever that somehow the game graduates from being a game. That's BS. It's just a damn good game that does something right. Period.

Like I said before, Bioshock is great because it did things _right _more than _different_. I think you're just over-amplifying things a bit and making it out to be some kind of high-brow literature instead of just a seeing it as the really well-done game it is.

"Top Tier - the (almost) greatest games ever made"
That's where Bioshock belongs. It's amazing, but not perfect. I don't put it up there with things like Mario 3, but I put it close behind...


----------



## firefist (Dec 17, 2009)

DragonTiger said:


> I still say the (main) Pokemon series should be moved up a tier. Red and Blue/Gold and Silver single-handedly brought the Game Boy to it's pinnacle, and subsequently, brought every Nintendo handheld to where they are today.
> 
> Seriously, the poularity of these games moves consoles. Always has, and always will. I'm an example of that. God knows that I wouldn't have a DS if it weren't for Pokemon. I don't know where we'd be handheld-wise without Pokemon. but I'd imagine the market would have to be somewhat different.
> 
> Hell, poularity aside, they're just damn good games. I vouch for them to be moved to Top Tier.



R/B & G/S (and if you want add yellow and crystal too) should be atleast go up to top tier or maybe even higher. They had such a huge impact and most of the gamers spent hours/days/months/years playing them. Many kids told their parents they would go out meeting up with friends, but instead of playing soccer they just played pokemon.
R/B may have many bugs but they're still great.

And why isn't any DMC game on that list?


----------



## NinjaM (Dec 17, 2009)

I believe the proper way to discuss Pokemon is in terms of "generations".


----------



## CrazyMoronX (Dec 17, 2009)

Firefist said:


> R/B & G/S (and if you want add yellow and crystal too) should be atleast go up to top tier or maybe even higher. They had such a huge impact and most of the gamers spent hours/days/months/years playing them. Many kids told their parents they would go out meeting up with friends, but instead of playing soccer they just played pokemon.
> R/B may have many bugs but they're still great.
> 
> And why isn't any DMC game on that list?


 Because nobody nominated any of them.


Nmaster64 said:


> I believe the proper way to discuss Pokemon is in terms of "generations".


 Okay, sounds fair. Where should they go?


----------



## The Nameless Pharaoh (Dec 17, 2009)

Nmaster64 said:


> First off, go buy and beat Braid (XBLA or Steam). Now.
> 
> Second, yes, it's definitely very "above average" in a lot of respects. Artistically and atmospherically it's beautiful, but that's not "beyond" video games or anything, it's exactly what a good game should be doing.
> 
> ...



Man you misunderstood me.

What I meant was that if someone were to compare the video game medium to other mediums like literature, film, and graphic novels, then Bioshock is one of the games I would use in the comparison.

I didn't mean it wasn't a video-game.

As for the last part, well that's just your opinion.


----------



## firefist (Dec 17, 2009)

Nmaster64 said:


> I believe the proper way to discuss Pokemon is in terms of "generations".


then let's just say gen. I and maybe gen. II need to move up to top tier or maybe even god tier.


CrazyMoronX said:


> Because nobody nominated any of them.
> 
> Okay, sounds fair. Where should they go?



I didn't read the whole thread, but wasn't DMC mentioned on the first page already?
Well nvm, I say DMC3 should be high tier.


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## NinjaM (Dec 17, 2009)

The Nameless Pharaoh said:


> What I meant was that if someone were to compare the video game medium to other mediums like literature, film, and graphic novels, then Bioshock is one of the games I would use in the comparison.



I am not a fan of such comparisons.


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## mystictrunks (Dec 17, 2009)

Pokemon Gen 1 for God or legendary tier.


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## DragonTiger (Dec 17, 2009)

Pokemon Gen 1 & 2 both belong in Top Tier, at the very least. Probably even God Tier for generation 1.


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## Shock Therapy (Dec 17, 2009)

i believe everyone's played pokemon gen 1. if not,


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## Sephiroth (Dec 17, 2009)

Just pokemon gen 1 for god tier.


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## Fraust (Dec 17, 2009)

Assassin's Creed II is still in two different tiers.


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## dream (Dec 17, 2009)

rawrawraw said:


> i believe everyone's played pokemon gen 1. if not,



I've never played it.


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## DragonTiger (Dec 17, 2009)

Dai Dreamer said:


> I've never played it.



I...I'm sorry to hear of your loss


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## bobomb (Dec 17, 2009)

Super Mario 64 and Wii Sports belongs in the Legendary Tier. 

Wii Sports deserves it for innovation alone.


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## The_Black_Rose (Dec 17, 2009)

I know this may sound childish, but the pokemon games should be in the next tier up from where they are. Pokemon battle revolution was the FIRST wii game to bring online gaming, and that was revolutionary


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 18, 2009)

I got them pokemans games updated and removed the redundant ACII listing.


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## Yagami-Kun (Dec 19, 2009)

I would like to recommend:

Prince of Persia : The Sands of Time Trilogy for Top tier at least. (PS2, XBox, PC)

The 3 games are: Sands of Time, Warrior Within, and The Two Thrones.

I would suggest listing it as "Prince of Persia : Sands of Time Trilogy" because, while each game is a masterpiece, the storylines of the three games continue and combine into a single masterwork by the end of the 3rd game.


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## Fraust (Dec 19, 2009)

Dual Hearts. PS2. Mid Tier.
Final Fantasy Legends. GB. Shit Tier.
Infinite Undiscovery. 360. Bottom Tier.

Dynasty Warriors 3 for High Tier. Although it started a terrible trend of repetitive games, it was amazing.


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## NinjaM (Dec 19, 2009)

The World Ends With You - High Tier


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## firefist (Dec 19, 2009)

Donkey Kong Country 2: Diddy's Kong Quest (SNES) should be high tier/top tier.


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## Shock Therapy (Dec 19, 2009)

why is call of duty 4 still not on there. should probably be in pinnacle of gaming since it is the best FPS game of the decade. if not it at least deserves to be in the best games.


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## dream (Dec 19, 2009)

rawrawraw said:


> why is call of duty 4 still not on there. should probably be in pinnacle of gaming since it is the best FPS game of the decade. if not it at least deserves to be in the best games.



Call of Duty 4 is not the best FPS game of the decade.


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## Lord Yu (Dec 19, 2009)

Call of Duty more like Camp of Duty AMIRITE!


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## Jon Snow (Dec 20, 2009)

Firefist said:


> Donkey Kong Country 2: Diddy's Kong Quest (SNES) should be high tier/top tier.



More like the highest tier avaliable.


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## Proxy (Dec 20, 2009)

Guess what I didn't notice there?

Vectorman /hightier


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## Gnome (Dec 20, 2009)

Diddy kong racing - Top Tier. i loved that game, although i was only 6 it was great


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## firefist (Dec 20, 2009)

Jon Snow said:


> More like the highest tier avaliable.


dunno if it was legendary, but atleast it should be god tier


Gnome on Fire said:


> Diddy kong racing - Top Tier. i loved that game, although i was only 6 it was great



I would put that in high tier.


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## NinjaM (Dec 20, 2009)

Firefist said:


> dunno if it was legendary, but atleast it should be god tier
> 
> I would put that in high tier.



This......


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## Fraust (Dec 20, 2009)

I add a vote for Diddy Kong Racing...

Shit, the non-race levels were the most fun multiplayer things I've ever played.


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## CrazyMoronX (Dec 21, 2009)

Diddy Kong what now? For which console?


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## Scholzee (Dec 21, 2009)

Diddy kong Racing was for the N64.


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## Zaelapolopollo (Jan 30, 2010)

Metal Gear Solid (PS1) to Legendary.
Same for GTA3. It is not the pinnacle of gaming. It is a revoltuionary game.


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## Rated R Superstar (Jan 30, 2010)

Mario 64 to legendary tier...for setting the platform for all 3d games.


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## Reaper of the Mist (Feb 3, 2010)

I would like to nominate PS3's Little Big Planet for high or top tier, I just got this game and it is so cool.


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## CrazyMoronX (Feb 4, 2010)

I forgot this thing even existed.

Maybe I'll put together a wiki with a voting system. That way the votes can be managed by something that's not me.


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## NinjaM (Feb 4, 2010)

You're such a crazy moron...


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## Newton (Feb 4, 2010)

No-one liked chips?


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## C. Hook (Feb 5, 2010)

Metroid Prime doesn't seem to be on the list, and it's often considered as good as Super Metroid; the graphics were amazing for the cube and for the time, the game provided a decent challenge while being easy enough for newcomers with the hint system, and sequence breaking with Metroid Prime is almost as easy as it was with Super Metroid.

Halo: Combat Evolved being above either Half Life game is bullshit. Simply that. Bullshit. Both of the Half Life games revolutionized single player FPS gameplay and immersion. Speaking of which, where's Team Fortress 2, one of the best PC shooters of all time? 

Ah well, not as if my opinion's gonna change anything.

EDIT: Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing for God tier. You can drive backwards at several times the speed of light!


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## Nagato Sennin (Feb 5, 2010)

No Modern Warfare

what is this i don't even


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## NinjaM (Feb 5, 2010)

C. Hook said:


> Halo: Combat Evolved being above either Half Life game is bullshit. Simply that. Bullshit. Both of the Half Life games revolutionized single player FPS gameplay and immersion. Speaking of which, where's Team Fortress 2, one of the best PC shooters of all time?


+1



Endurance 117 said:


> No Modern Warfare
> 
> what is this i don't even



Mid-tier.


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## crazymtf (Feb 5, 2010)

C. Hook said:


> Metroid Prime doesn't seem to be on the list, and it's often considered as good as Super Metroid; the graphics were amazing for the cube and for the time, the game provided a decent challenge while being easy enough for newcomers with the hint system, and sequence breaking with Metroid Prime is almost as easy as it was with Super Metroid.
> 
> Halo: Combat Evolved being above either Half Life game is bullshit. Simply that. Bullshit. Both of the Half Life games revolutionized single player FPS gameplay and immersion. Speaking of which, where's Team Fortress 2, one of the best PC shooters of all time?
> 
> ...



Except Halo did change alot. Halo's soundtrack, story, pacing, guns, vehicles, all were huge for it's time. Don't even get me started on how Halo 2 Multiplayer made what online gaming console is today. 

And as much as I think Half Life is oh so fucking overrated I won't just ignore what it did for the genre. So dismissing halo for what it did for console shooters, especially multiplayer wise is kinda dumb.


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## Reaper of the Mist (Feb 5, 2010)

Halo 1 and 2 are some of the best games ever made, I would also like to nominate PS2's Guitar Hero for mid or high tier. I just li playing all of the games, my consoles are, 
PS2 
PS3 
PSP  
N64 
DS 
right now at this time.


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## NinjaM (Feb 5, 2010)

I think Halo and Half-Life should be placed equally, neither should be under-rated. Halo was a defining title for shooters on the consoles just as Half-life was for PCs.


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## C. Hook (Feb 5, 2010)

crazymtf said:


> Except Halo did change alot. Halo's soundtrack, story, pacing, guns, vehicles, all were huge for it's time.



Soundtrack? Plenty of games had good sound tracks way before Halo. Pacing? Since when have games done well when badly paced? Guns? Which ones, the generic machine gun, rocket launcher, pistol (That was more like the standard "revolver" in other FPS games, I guess), and alien weapons that were typically useless? Vechicles you have more of a point with, though. Not that vehicles were invented by Halo, but they were definitely popularized by it.



crazymtf said:


> Don't even get me started on how Halo 2 Multiplayer made what online gaming console is today.



Halo 2 is not Halo: Combat Evolved. 



crazymtf said:


> And as much as I think Half Life is oh so fucking overrated



Because Half Life is totally more well-known than Halo.



crazymtf said:


> I won't just ignore what it did for the genre. So dismissing halo for what it did for console shooters, especially multiplayer wise is kinda dumb.



Half Life did plenty for games in general. In-gameplay triggered story scenes? Half Life practically invented that to create immersion.

Half Life 2 brought in one of the most used physics engines of our time.

Most of what Halo "innovated", it just ported from the PC to a console.


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## Super Naruto (Feb 5, 2010)

Ocarina of time needs to be Legendary, or your whole list is worthless.


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## crazymtf (Feb 5, 2010)

C. Hook said:


> Soundtrack? Plenty of games had good sound tracks way before Halo. Pacing? Since when have games done well when badly paced? Guns? Which ones, the generic machine gun, rocket launcher, pistol (That was more like the standard "revolver" in other FPS games, I guess), and alien weapons that were typically useless? Vechicles you have more of a point with, though. Not that vehicles were invented by Halo, but they were definitely popularized by it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Just cause other games had good soundtrack doesn't mean Halo's amazing soundtrack and gun sounds should go unnoticed. Halo 2's story is so badly paced, terrible mid missions and anti-climatic ending missions. Plenty of Final Fantasy games have bad pacing and to much filler shit to throw people off thinking there getting there money's worth. There's more but two huge examples. Plus Half life 2 episode 1....oh yeah...talk about badly pacing and boring ass filler story. 

Pistol in halo is amazing. No one talks about pistols in games like golden eye or perfect dark, but sure as hell people mention how great the pistol felt. As for the vehicles they weren't invented but like you said made them popular. Funny still haven't found a shooter with good driving controls like halo. 

I'm not saying Half life is as well known but doesn't make it any less overrated in terms of critics reviews. Glad you liked em though. 

And your right half life did create that terrible fucking stand there while they talk cutscenes. Terrible idea, can't even skip the cutscenes on your second run. Who thought that idea would be great? Immersion? Yes cause standing there while a guy talks is amazing 

As for physics, your right half life 2 did alot. Again I'm not saying half life didn't help the genre but halo did plenty aswell.


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## C. Hook (Feb 5, 2010)

crazymtf said:


> Just cause other games had good soundtrack doesn't mean Halo's amazing soundtrack and gun sounds should go unnoticed.



It has a great soundtrack, I agree. Although Halo 2 and 3 had fucking bland remixes.

Gunsounds... Eh, don't see how this counts, but I always did like the Sniper rifle sound.



crazymtf said:


> Halo 2's story is so badly paced, terrible mid missions and anti-climatic ending missions.



I mentioned Halo 2 because you cited online multiplayer. That came with Halo 2 (Or rather, Halo PC, but that was a bit outdated at the time).

And oddly enough, I liked some parts of Halo 2 better than Halo CE (Say, any part of Metropolis vs. any part of Two Betrayals). 



crazymtf said:


> Plenty of Final Fantasy games have bad pacing and to much filler shit to throw people off thinking there getting there money's worth. There's more but two huge examples.



Never played Final Fantasy, so I can't say whether I agree or disagree.

Might as well say it: RPGs are a different can of fish.



crazymtf said:


> Might as well say: Halo 1 had horrible pacing on some of the parts, namely Two Betrayals (LOL let's go through the longest level AGAIN) and the Library. That didn't stop the other parts from being kickass.
> 
> Plus Half life 2 episode 1....oh yeah...talk about badly pacing and boring ass filler story.



Half Life 2 Episode 1 is Half Life 2?

But yeah, Episode 1 was underwhelming, especially compared to Episode 2. And with Episode 3's vapor ware status, I can't really get too excited for it.



crazymtf said:


> Pistol in halo is amazing. No one talks about pistols in games like golden eye or perfect dark, but sure as hell people mention how great the pistol felt.



Pistol was also near borken, although its impact was overrated. But yeah, the pistol was powerful.

Citing a single weapon doesn't give me all of them. The Plasma Pistol was near useless, the Plasma Rifle was useless, the Needler was meh, the Assault Rifle was boring (Run forward and shoot!), Shotgun was awesome, and the Sniper was a bit "eh" due to the controls making sniping too easy.

Rocket Launcher doesn't really merit description as anything other than a crutch that WASN'T as awesome as the shotgun.



crazymtf said:


> As for the vehicles they weren't invented but like you said made them popular. Funny still haven't found a shooter with good driving controls like halo.



Most shooters don't have vehicles.



crazymtf said:


> I'm not saying Half life is as well known but doesn't make it any less overrated in terms of critics reviews. Glad you liked em though.



Using that argument, Halo is overrated because of fraternities.



crazymtf said:


> And your right half life did create that terrible fucking stand there while they talk cutscenes. Terrible idea, can't even skip the cutscenes on your second run. Who thought that idea would be great? Immersion? Yes cause standing there while a guy talks is amazing



Yes, it allowed for that.

It also allowed for moments such as rushing into a room to see a scientist get eaten by a prehistoric reptile while you still have full control. Pretty much any scene where a plot point of any kind happens in real time while you are in control fits. 

It allowed for moments such as in Bioshock where the actual REMOVAL of control is a plot point.

Sure, sometimes that idea was abused (I.E. Obnoxious Half Life 2 beginning/Black Mesa West), but sometimes it was used in a very well done way (I.E. Talks with father Grigori while shooting out zombies). Like all mechanics, it could be done well or poorly.



crazymtf said:


> As for physics, your right half life 2 did alot. Again I'm not saying half life didn't help the genre but halo did plenty aswell.



Halo helped the genre on consoles, because other than a few standouts like Goldeneye and Perfect Dark, shooters on consoles were nothing to write home about.

I guess I must admit, Halo DID do a lot by making console shooters popular. It was a great game (Minus a few awful levels), and its sequels both managed to blunder compared to it in single player (Halo 2 was horribly paced, Halo 3 was good until a certain level that involved flood, flood, flood, and more flood).

I just prefer Half Life 2 and 1, and I doubt that's going to change.


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## NinjaM (Feb 6, 2010)

lol got banned. 

Too much arguing. Both games were important and awesome.


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## crazymtf (Feb 6, 2010)

^That. To bad he got banned cause thought this response was awesome.


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## Twizted (Feb 6, 2010)

I'd like to throw up Metal Gear Solid (PS) for God Tier, and Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic (Various) for Top Tier.

Also, IMO FFIX is too high up there. It was a good FF, but truthfully what it had on the first two discs it lost hard on the third disc. An Elizabethan era analog that suddenly turns sci-fi out of the blue. Felt a little bit like Indy 4 to me. xD 

Some of the primary villains are introduced (way) too late in the game, and it lacked the enjoyable side-quests/minigames that made some of the previous FFs enjoyable. The card game was tedious and pointless, and the Chocobo side-quest was painful. Good game on the whole, but it should not be above FFVIII and FFX IMO. IX either needs to be demoted, or VIII and X need to promoted.


I also agree that Ocarina and FFVII need to be Legendary.


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## Kokaku (Feb 6, 2010)

> God Tier - the pinnacle of gaming
> Bioshock - Various


>this thread

so many facepalms


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## Super Naruto (Feb 6, 2010)

Kokaku said:


> >this thread
> 
> so many facepalms



Have you ever played Bioshock?

Its beyond Godly.


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## Kokaku (Feb 6, 2010)

Super Naruto said:


> Have you ever played Bioshock?
> 
> Its beyond Godly.


Yes I have, why else would I comment? O.O 

And no, it is not.


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## Pintsize (Feb 6, 2010)

Forgive them, they live in a world where games like Halo and InFamous are considered to be original, groundbreaking titles. :ho


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## Furious George (Feb 6, 2010)

Pintsize said:


> Forgive them, they live in a world where games like Halo and InFamous are considered to be original, groundbreaking titles. :ho



Bioshock *is* godly and I don't live in a world where Halo and InFamous are original, groundbreaking titles. 

And OoT not being in the Legendary tier is confusing and frightening.

---------------------------

Wait a minute... he mentioned Metroid Prime and he called everyone on the idiocy of putting Halo before Half-Life 2...*C.Hook* is a brilliant man! Why was he banned?!?! 

And *Crazy*, I finally think I understand you. It should have come to me sooner... You saying Resistance 2>Killzone 2, not liking Bioshock and now Halo>Half-Life 2? 

You don't have bad taste in games. You have awful taste in FPS. I mean awful.


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## Zaelapolopollo (Feb 6, 2010)

> Forgive them, they live in a world where games like Halo and InFamous are considered to be original, groundbreaking titles.



Don't lump InFamous together with Halo.


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## NinjaM (Feb 6, 2010)

Super Naruto said:


> Have you ever played Bioshock?
> 
> Its beyond Godly.


... 



Kokaku said:


> no, it is not.


This.


Great game. LOVE the game. Amazing atmosphere, solid mechanics, amazing atmosphere, interesting story, amazing atmosphere...

But godly? Please. The game's not perfect by any means. I finished that game over the course of many, many moons because it just never quite kept me totally hooked. 

Unlike Batman, which I just finished over the past couple days. Now that is a nearly perfect Action Adventure game. _(Edit: that was an aside, not a comparison)_


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## Yagami-Kun (Feb 6, 2010)

^ Well that is your opinion.

Bioshock's storytelling alone puts it in godly. Perfect or not.

And besides, there is a difference between an actual flaw and something you just don't like/other reasons such as "never quite kept me totally hooked"


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## Pintsize (Feb 6, 2010)

Oh, please. I could name a dozen games with better storytelling than Bioshock. 

The Secret of Monkey Island
Grim Fandango
Psychonauts
Half Life 2
Half Life 2: Episode 2
Portal
Zelda: OoT
Zelda: TWP
Ico
Shadow of the Colossus 
Conker's Bad Fur Day
Vampire: The Masquerade: Bloodlines

There, and that's not even trying hard. Note: world building alone does not a good story make.


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## NinjaM (Feb 7, 2010)

Yagami-Kun said:


> ^ Well that is your opinion.
> 
> Bioshock's storytelling alone puts it in godly. Perfect or not.


^ Well that is _your_ opinion. 

It's top tier for sure, but I don't see anything special enough to put it among the gods...

Pintsize nailed it, well 'cept for those last two wildcards...


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## Pintsize (Feb 7, 2010)

Hmpf. Just because you haven't played them doesn't mean you shouldn't trust my judgement. :ho


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## NinjaM (Feb 7, 2010)

Pintsize said:


> Just because you haven't played



HALT. _Incorrect._

I sir love me some White Wolf.


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## crazymtf (Feb 7, 2010)

Cyckness said:


> Bioshock *is* godly and I don't live in a world where Halo and InFamous are original, groundbreaking titles.
> 
> And OoT not being in the Legendary tier is confusing and frightening.
> 
> ...



Most FPS > Killzone 2. I'd rather play Bioshock then Killzone 2. Least then I'm not bored. 

Bioshock as you can see isn't loved by all. I just don't have a problem telling the internet that. 

Halo > Half life 2. 

Half life 2 > Halo 2-3's single player. 

That's how I view half life 2. I enjoyed half life 2 despite it getting those crazy 10/10's. I liked it a hell of a lot more then half life 1 anyway. 

And shooters for me are just become dull now days. I haven't played a multiplayer in shooters since halo 3 that I liked. Battlefield, killzone, call of duty, gears, uncharted, they all have good online but none did it for me. So multiplayer wise I'll always enjoy halo more then those so I'll enjoy halo series more so then the others. Not my fault, no multiplayer is ever as fun as halo for me.


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## Pintsize (Feb 7, 2010)

Nmaster64 said:


> HALT. _Incorrect._
> 
> I sir love me some White Wolf.



I think you need to play it again, then. The most well written characters matching a setting, excellent, non 'save the world' storyline with multiple branches I've ever seen in a game. 

If you disagree, you're obviously just plain wrong.


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## Furious George (Feb 7, 2010)

Pintsize said:


> Oh, please. I could name a dozen games with better storytelling than Bioshock.
> 
> The Secret of Monkey Island
> Grim Fandango
> ...



Yeah anyone can list a bunch of games that have good stories... but the point is that they have to have better story-*telling* then Bioshock and I'd say only about 3 games from that list even come close.

Ya see the "world building" aspect, and all the wonder and strong sense of discovery that came with it, was only one of the things that made Bioshock great. Pretending that all the things that were going on in the plot (The beginning and the destruction of a society, morality, manipulation) aren't enough to put it on the godly level, the real beauty of Bioshock was the way the plot was conveyed. Instead of things happening to the character they seemed to be happening around him... you can get good deal of insight into the plot by just following a splicer from the distance and listening to him ramble. The audio diaries not only provided unforgettable dialogue from awesome characters but they aren't forced on you. The life and death of Rapture unfolds around you fluidly because its all at your own pace. Its a thing of beauty.

Bottom line: My opinion is stronger then yours.


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## Yagami-Kun (Feb 7, 2010)

I wrote a post to respond to the comments above some time ago but it seems that my internet wasn't working properly, and it wasn't posted. Ah well, can't be bothered to write it all over again...



> Oh, please. I could name a dozen games with better storytelling than Bioshock.



Your point being? We weren't comparing Bioschock to any other games, just stating that it had superb storytelling.



> The Secret of Monkey Island
> Grim Fandango
> Psychonauts
> Half Life 2
> ...



You're not giving Bioshock enough credit at all. And anyway, there is far more to its storytelling than just the amazing world building.

If you are saying that these stories are better subjectively then I won't argue, since your entitled to your own opinion. However, if you're saying that they are actually *superior*, then you'll have to come up with some pretty convincing reasons why and not just a list. And there is also little point for that in this case because I was not comparing Bioshock to other games in that post.

I agree with SotC and Ico, they are around Bioshock. But I highly disagree with Zelda.

Haven't played Half-life series but I heard it had superb storytelling.



Cyckness said:


> Yeah anyone can list a bunch of games that have good stories... but the point is that they have to have better story-*telling* then Bioshock and I'd say only about 3 games from that list even come close.
> 
> Ya see the "world building" aspect, and all the wonder and strong sense of discovery that came with it, was only one of the things that made Bioshock great. Pretending that all the things that were going on in the plot (The beginning and the destruction of a society, morality, manipulation) aren't enough to put it on the godly level, the real beauty of Bioshock was the way the plot was conveyed. Instead of things happening to the character they seemed to be happening around him... you can get good deal of insight into the plot by just following a splicer from the distance and listening to him ramble. The audio diaries not only provided unforgettable dialogue from awesome characters but they aren't forced on you. The life and death of Rapture unfolds around you fluidly because its all at your own pace. Its a thing of beauty.



This, and +reps. The game's setting spoke volumes about the city and gave the game an identity of it's own.

Not just this, but I also loved that just when you thought your protagonist was a generic FPS hero, they threw that _twist_ at you.


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## Pintsize (Feb 7, 2010)

> Bottom line: My opinion is stronger then yours.



Please, I'm a TA for writing classes at college. 

But I don't really feel like getting into a page spanning debate.


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## Big Boss (Feb 7, 2010)

Killzone 2 is a great shooter. I honestly don't know how someone could despise it.


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## Suzuku (Feb 8, 2010)

I have to clear my eyes; why don't I see Metal Gear on the Legendary tier?


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## Zaelapolopollo (Feb 8, 2010)

That's one of the reasons I bumped this.


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## Shock Therapy (Feb 8, 2010)

scoot bioshock over, bioshock 2 is coming to town!


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## Helix (Feb 9, 2010)

^Having beaten Bioshock for the first time last week, I doubt the sequel can top it.


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## Reaper of the Mist (Feb 10, 2010)

The first time I played BioShock was on my PS3 as a Demo, even as a Demo it was just so cool in both look and story. I now have it on my 360, I just got to get my XBOX working again, but now I what 2.


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## eHav (Feb 12, 2010)

man metal gear is so low -.-

metal gear should be on the second best tier. it has gameplay, story and at least mgs4 and mgs3 were sweet on the eye for the console they were made on


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## Bluth (Feb 13, 2010)

I have to say I can't believe that there isn't anything from this current generation that isn't God tier.  To say that only games from 6 or more years are worthy is ridiculous.  There have been a ton of games that will be looked upon as being some of the pinnacles of gaming.  Perhaps for some people they need more time to realize how good some of these games are, but there are many games today that should be considered, games that have changed how games will be made in the future.


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## NinjaM (Feb 13, 2010)

I think it does take time to properly evaluate a games place in everything.

And it's really easy to get caught up in a game while it's fresh. It may seem like the greatest thing ever but in a year your old opinions don't hold so strongly.


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## Big Boss (Feb 13, 2010)

You have the right to express your opinions but your opinions are retarded.


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## Zaelapolopollo (Feb 13, 2010)

Nmaster64 said:


> I think it does take time to properly evaluate a games place in everything.
> 
> And it's really easy to get caught up in a game while it's fresh. It may seem like the greatest thing ever but in a year your old opinions don't hold so strongly.



This is very true.

Anyway, I think CMX has forgotten about this thread again.


----------

