# EMS Madara vs EMS Sasuke



## RedChidori (Jul 24, 2014)

The title says it all people .



VS




Location: Uchiha Hideout
State of Mind: IC
Starting Distance: 10 meters away
Knowledge: Both know about each other's EMS.
Restrictions: Rinnegan, Hashirama Cells. 
Additional Info: Madara is an Edo Tensei but he only has EMS. Sasuke has Sealing Tags. Madara has his scythe and gunbai. *Madara will summon Kurama if he is in a desperate situation. The same goes for Perfect Susano'o on both parties.* Both start off with their 3T Sharingans activated and they charge at each other engaging in CQC. 

Oh and Sasuke has this :



Please provide a legitimate reason why either combatant wins, loses, or stalemates.

*READY?! FIGHT   !!!* *-RedChidori*


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## Cognitios (Jul 24, 2014)

flying PS > PS
Sasuke godstomps so hard it's not even funny.
It's like placing Optimus Prime against Sunny from IRobot


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## Hachibi (Jul 24, 2014)

I thought it was a rape thread until I saw Rinnesuke's PS
It still a rape thread but it's not Madara who is doing it


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## Trojan (Jul 24, 2014)

I honestly don't see how current Sasuke's PS is all that powerful compare to Madara's. 
Sasuke's PS is even smaller than Madara's PS, and both of them are able to destroy the Meteors.


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## RedChidori (Jul 24, 2014)

Keep in mind that Madara can summon Kurama guys .


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## Psp123789 (Jul 24, 2014)

Rape thread. Sasuke was casually slicing juudara's meteors in pieces. Madara's PS is getting bent over. Whether it wants to or not.


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## Kyu (Jul 24, 2014)

Flying PS has a speed advantage over Madara's. Plus flight(duh).

Madara's PS appears to be bigger and has better durability feats(tanking Kurama's standard _BD_). *shrugs* Sauce might win since she sliced up multiple mountain sized Meteors.

From ten meters Kurama isn't serving much purpose other than a giant meat shield.


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## Trojan (Jul 24, 2014)

Kyu said:


> Flying PS has a speed advantage over Madara's. Plus flight(duh).
> 
> Madara's PS appears to be bigger and has better durability feats(tanking Kurama's standard _BD_). *shrugs* Sauce might win since she sliced up multiple mountain sized Meteors.
> 
> From ten meters Kurama isn't serving much purpose other than a giant meat shield.



Sasuke destroyed like 2 meteors or so, and there is nothing employ that Madara's PS which is 
even bigger can't do the same thing.


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## IchLiebe (Jul 24, 2014)

Madara's pefect Susanoo was bigger his own meteors, two stacked on top of each other, and he cut through them. And the meteors were bigger than when he did the juubi jin cst meteors (might be wrong). I'm pretty sure Madara stomps Sasuke.


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## Hachibi (Jul 24, 2014)

Are people seriously comparing EMS/Edo Madara PS with Rinnegan Sasuke's PS (which he has in this thread)?
It's like comparing KCM Minato and Rikudo Senjutsu Naruto just because they share something similar (a KCM shroud) ?


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## Cognitios (Jul 24, 2014)

well hachibi, they seem to have similar durability, speed, strength and chakra capabilities.
So yes, ignoring a concept called power-scaling they are exactly identical.


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## Hachibi (Jul 24, 2014)

Cognitios said:


> well hachibi, they seem to have similar durability, speed, strength and chakra capabilities.
> So yes, ignoring a concept called power-scaling they are exactly identical.



Power-scaling is love, Power-scaling is life


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## IchLiebe (Jul 24, 2014)

Did Sasuke ever destroy two meteors, and cut two mountain in half with one swing? I'm pretty sure he also had to get close to them every time while Madara didn't.


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## Cognitios (Jul 24, 2014)

> Power-scaling is love, Power-scaling is life


If you aren't able to power-scale you shouldn't be in a fictional battledome that doesn't heavily rely on stats.
Even then you shouldn't be making stats.


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## V i r u s (Jul 24, 2014)

EMS Madara wins 

Madara's susano is Greater  than sasuke's susano


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## Hachibi (Jul 24, 2014)

IchLiebe said:


> Did Sasuke ever destroy two meteors, and cut two mountain in half with one swing? I'm pretty sure he also had to get close to them every time while Madara didn't.



Madara's PS never destroyed the meteor  and Sasuke's PS cut Meteor bigger than mountain as see here 
Link
Also he cut the meteor without the Shockwave/Air Pressure of the sword


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## Hachibi (Jul 24, 2014)

Also lol with the argument about size, as if size matter 
You could make Hashirama(a human) vs Kurama(a Giant Fox) and everyone will say hashirama win


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## Cognitios (Jul 24, 2014)

Those aren't meteors. Those are small moons each about the size of the god tree.
Now I'm going to introduce you to size scaling real quick.
Link
Each meteor is about the size of the god tree correct?
I can provide a red circle if you need it to spot the god tree and the meteors.
Link
Now we can see 10% Katsuya compared to the branches, it's about 1/3rd of the length of one of the roots, and about as wide. 
A single root is about 1/2 to 1/3 the size of the lower part of the trunk, which is what is shown above.
I really shouldn't need to get panels on this part, but i'll do it if you need me too.
We know that boss summons are around the size of bijuu, correct? and we know that bijuu are about the size of Madara's PS correct? Madara's PS cut things about the size of his PS correct?
So lets review.
1 Meteor = more or less = 1 god tree trunk
1 God Tree Trunk = more or less 4 - 9 Katsuya, I'm willing to give benefit of the doubt so I'll say 4
4 10% Katsuya = 8 5% Katsuya = Madara PS
That means that the meteors that Madara cut are 8 times as large as what Madara's PS cut.


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## IchLiebe (Jul 24, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> Madara's PS never destroyed the meteor  and Sasuke's PS cut Meteor bigger than mountain as see here
> Link
> Also he cut the meteor without the Shockwave/Air Pressure of the sword



The meteors were right beside him and when he swung they got destroyed. And those meteors don't look the size of a mountain. And again, Madara didn't even need to be close to them to cut them.


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## Trojan (Jul 24, 2014)

Cognitios said:


> Those aren't meteors. Those are small moons each about the size of the god tree.
> Now I'm going to introduce you to size scaling real quick.
> beside him
> Each meteor is about the size of the god tree correct?
> ...



you really can't scale them like that because Kishi does not draw them correctly. Unless you believe
Yamato's Buddha >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hashirama's Buddha in size. 

the size for those things will seem different from chapter to chapter, they just don't remain the exact same...


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## Cognitios (Jul 24, 2014)

> you really can't scale them like that because Kishi does not draw them correctly. Unless you believe
> Yamato's Buddha >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hashirama's Buddha in size.
> 
> the size for those things will seem different from chapter to chapter, they just don't remain the exact same...


That's exactly how you scale. Even if you scale that way Yamatos buddha is dwarfed by Hashirama's.
Scaling that way only puts Yamato's at around bijuu size.


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## Hachibi (Jul 24, 2014)

IchLiebe said:


> The meteors were right beside him and when he swung they got destroyed. And those meteors don't look the size of a mountain. And again, Madara didn't even need to be close to them to cut them.



The meteor lost alot of their size after they landed on Earth tho so we can't really said that he can cut if they have their full size.

It doesn't matter if Sasuke's PS need to be close or not since it can fly and it's hella fast for it's size

beside him
here he successful dodged Naruto's six BDRS.


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## IchLiebe (Jul 24, 2014)

Here's a better picture of Madara's meteors.  IMO Madara's are bigger and are not pieced together unlike the one's Sasuke did. At best I would give same, and Madara destroyed them while Sasuke cut them.


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## Hachibi (Jul 24, 2014)

Cognitios said:


> Those aren't meteors. Those are small moons each about the size of the god tree.
> Now I'm going to introduce you to size scaling real quick.
> meteors.
> Each meteor is about the size of the god tree correct?
> ...


I think you mean Sasuke's PS


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## Trojan (Jul 24, 2014)

Cognitios said:


> That's exactly how you scale. Even if you scale that way Yamatos buddha is dwarfed by Hashirama's.
> Scaling that way only puts Yamato's at around bijuu size.



No, by that Hashirama's Buddha is dwarfed by Yamato's Buddha, not the other way around. 


Here we can see The Juubi's place, Hashirama's Golem, and Madara's PS.

Here, the Tree's roots >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All companied
meteors. 

Which means
Yamat's Buddha is WAY bigger than Madara's PS, the Juubi, Hashirama's Jutsus
and so are the Bijuus and Katsuyu... 

if we take that to scale those things...


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## Psp123789 (Jul 24, 2014)

Here the pieces of rubble from the meteors were dwarfing entire mountain ranges.


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## ueharakk (Jul 24, 2014)

The meteors that Sasuke was cleaving in half were thousands of times larger than the meteors that madara blew up with his sword swing.

plus sasuke's EMS PS isn't = Sasuke's sharinnegan PS as we know at least his sharinnegan PS had the power to block out infinite tsukuyomi.

Sharinnegan PS wrecks EMS Madara's PS.



Hussain said:


> you really can't scale them like that because Kishi does not draw them correctly. Unless you believe
> Yamato's Buddha >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hashirama's Buddha in size.
> 
> the size for those things will seem different from chapter to chapter, they just don't remain the exact same...



What panel leads you to believe yamato's buddah >>>>>>> shinsuusenjuu in size?

and what you've stated is a terrible argument.  By your logic NOTHING can be concluded about sizes simply because kishi is inconsistent sometimes, you wouldn't even be able to say that a human is smaller than the juubi because 'kishi is inconsistent with sizes'.   So obviously we have to base our conclusions about the sizes of objects on SOMETHING, and obviously if we are shown that the chibaku tenseis are about as big as the combined bijuudama crater, then they are about as big as the combined bijuudama crater.  Saying "sizes change between panels" is not a positive argument for your case as it could just as well mean that the meteors are EVEN BIGGER than what we perceive them as in the manga.


Here's the size relation between the meteors sasuke was cleaving in two and Madara's PS:

Meteors (red) vs combined bijudama crater (yellow):


Combined bijuudama crater (yellow) vs Madara's PS (blue):


The meteor madara slashed didn't even reach his PS's head, you could fit over a thousand of them in the combined bijuudama crater.


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## Trojan (Jul 24, 2014)

^
I already explained that 2 posts above yours, ueharakk. 
Yamato's Buddha is way bigger than Hashirama's Buddha who's at most the Juubi's size
and according to those panels Yamato's Buddha is way bigger than even the Juubi itself. 

I doubt that Kishi want us to view Yamato as stronger than Hashirama and Madara. 

and obviously there are a lot more of examples, I just don't waste my time of looking for them,
in top of my head now is the GM's size.

When Madara was in top of it and talking to the WZ, the GM's head was not much bigger than Madara's size
and when we saw Madara Vs Tobirama, the GM's head was way bigger than them....etc

So, yeah, I don't put so much thought in those things size, as for the humans' cases it's obviously different
as Kishi won't draw them enormously in one panel then shows them tiny. Except when he focus in their faces
for expressions and those sort of things.


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## ueharakk (Jul 24, 2014)

Hussain said:


> ^
> I already explained that 2 posts above yours, ueharakk.
> Yamato's Buddha is way bigger than Hashirama's Buddha who's at most the Juubi's size
> and according to those panels Yamato's Buddha is way bigger than even the Juubi itself.
> ...


You didn't even post a panel of Yamato's buddah vs the tree roots, by what logic are you making that comparison?

Not only that but shinsuusenjuu is far larger than the juubi considering Mokujin is small enough to fit on its head, yet is almost as big as the juubi's own body.



Hussain said:


> and obviously there are a lot more of examples, I just don't waste my time of looking for them,
> in top of my head now is the GM's size.
> 
> When Madara was in top of it and talking to the WZ, the GM's head was not much bigger than Madara's size
> ...


That's just showing that GM like any other construct in the manga isn't consistently drawn to scale vs a human.  However, does that mean that NOTHING can be concluded about how big GM is?  Kishi is not going to draw two objects in the same panel of equal size when in reality one of the objects is many times larger than the other.

Is Shukaku as big as bunta?
Is Chouji about as big as his father?
are all the bijuus about the same size?
Is PS as big as mokujin?  
Obviously the answer is yes to these questions as we've been shown the full objects in the same panel.

And then again you are left with the problem that the meteor could be EVEN LARGER than what kishi draws it.  

So no, you don't get to say 'because kishi isn't 100% consistent with sizes all the time, I can make up whatever sizes I want things to be', Kishi explicitly shows us the Chibaku tenseis are of comparable size to the combined bijuudama crater via multiple panels and has given us literally zero reason to believe that it's much smaller, therefore it's of comparable size.


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## Arles Celes (Jul 25, 2014)

Really, Kishi left it ambiguous how strong is Sasuke's PS. We know that he had it but we do not know how it compare's to Madara's as it was left featless.

Size alone doesn't mean much IMO as Naruto's BM is most likely as strong as Madara's PS despite being smaller and probably stronger than 100% Kurama despite being smaller too. Current Sasuke's PS doesn't seem as big as Madara's PS either...

Well...we could argue that Naruto and Sasuke defeating with their Kyuusano a guy whose weaker version was supposedly above Hashi(who was at least a match for Madara's own Kyuusano) might mean that Naruto and Hashi surpassed at this point their legendary benchmarks.

We could also take this approach if we consider what BZ said that only transmigrants with a great enough power can meet RS and as we have seen Hashi never meet him and I doubt Madara did either.

Other than that it is pure speculation without any solid foundations I guess...


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## The Saiyan Prince Vegeta (Jul 25, 2014)

Hussain said:


> you really can't scale them like that because Kishi does not draw them correctly. Unless you believe
> Yamato's Buddha >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hashirama's Buddha in size.
> 
> the size for those things will seem different from chapter to chapter, they just don't remain the exact same...



So you want to complain about size when it pertains to a feat for Sasuke (saying Kishi's inconsistent with size) and then sit here and say Sasuke's PS isn't as big as Madara's despite him being far stronger than EMS Madara (yet magically the Kishi's inconsistent with size point you made previously isn't anywhere to be found here)? 

The double standards are quite amusing.  And why am I not surprised that it's only Naruto fans bitching about this? 

Back on topic - Sasuke stomps the ever living shit out of him. His susanoo has flight and has far better feats (cutting through multiple meteors in which the rubble of said meteors dwarfed mountains).


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## Trojan (Jul 25, 2014)

@ueharakk

Yamato's Buddha (while setting) was at the same Height as the Tree's roots, which is way bigger than the Juubi itself.



The Saiyan Prince Vegeta said:


> So you want to complain about size when it pertains to a feat for Sasuke (saying Kishi's inconsistent with size) and then sit here and say Sasuke's PS isn't as big as Madara's despite him being far stronger than EMS Madara (yet magically the Kishi's inconsistent with size point you made previously isn't anywhere to be found here)?
> 
> The double standards are quite amusing.  And why am I not surprised that it's only Naruto fans bitching about this?
> 
> Back on topic - Sasuke stomps the ever living shit out of him. His susanoo has flight and has far better feats (cutting through multiple meteors in which the rubble of said meteors dwarfed mountains).



what the heck are you talking about? You are bumbling on about Sasuke's feat and all he has done is cutting the CT which there is absolutely nothing indicates that Madara's PS cannot do. 

and I don't what the heck does Sasuke being stronger than EMS has anything to do with everything he has. Kaguya can shit on Sasuke, does that mean her hair jutsu is stronger than his PS? 

Sasuke's PS was shat on by Kaguya who did not even use any goddame jutsu, and Naruto after his sexy jutsu punched her and she was effected
do you also believe that Naruto's hand is stronger than Sasuke's PS because its feat is better than Sasuke's PS? 

So I suppose Sasuke's PS is superior in power, but in term of durability it's trash? 

anyway, never-mind believe in whatever you want, I don't care.


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## The Saiyan Prince Vegeta (Jul 25, 2014)

Hussain said:


> @ueharakk
> 
> Yamato's Buddha (while setting) was at the same Height as the Tree's roots, which is way bigger than the Juubi itself.
> 
> ...



A dense naruto fan who can't comprehend a thing. Why am I not surprised. 

Please continue spewing nonsense on how the mountains Madara cut were in anyway comparable to the meteors Sasuke cut (in which the rubble of said meteors dwarfed mountains). So let's take this in baby steps. 

>Madara cuts two mountains
>Sasuke cuts two meteors
>Rubble from said meteors dwarf mountains
>Yet somehow Sasuke's feat isn't superior 

Got to give it to Naruto fans and that logic. 

When Madara's PS displays that it can do this then there can be a discussion, but it hasn't has it? He doesn't get Sasuke's feats, especially since this was a Sasuke whom was enhanced by Hagoromo's chakra. Get that through your head.  

And why don't you actually try reading? You tried to bring up how the meteors sizes were inconsistent because Kishi is inconsistent with size at times yet you never brought that up when comparing Madara and Sasuke's PS size. Why? The obvious double standards you have, but I shouldn't have expected anything less from a Naruto fan. Objectivity isn't all that high on their priority list save a few like ueharakk, SSM12 at times (those are really the only 2 lol)


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## ueharakk (Jul 27, 2014)

Hussain said:


> @ueharakk
> 
> Yamato's Buddha (while setting) was at the same Height as the Tree's roots, which is way bigger than the Juubi itself.



Unless you are talking about some other tree roots, *these ones are far in the back ground,* thus obviously they'd appear to be as tall as something way closer to the PoV.

It's impossible for the buddah to be anywhere close to the tree root since it looks just as close to the tree trunk, yet we know that if it was close to the trunk, the scene would take place in the combined bijuudama crater.  Therefore the surroundings would look like *this.*

Finally, how does one extremely ambiguous instance where you are comparing a portion of one object to another negate every other size comparison in the manga?  Like I said before, is gamabunta not as big as shukaku?  Is Chouji not as big as his father?  Is Kurama not bigger than a house?  Is a mountain not bigger than a human?  

And again, sizes being inconsistent means nothing as it could very well be the case that the meteor is even larger than what it seems to be in the scans.


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## Sans (Jul 27, 2014)

I was going to say that everyone in this thread is incorrect. But then I read Ueherak's post.

Everyone bar one in this thread, is incorrect.


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## Sans (Jul 27, 2014)

Sasuke's Susano'o was granted to him by the Rikudou Sennin, and activated with a Sharinnegan that is two evolutions greater than Madara's Eternal Mangekyou.

Madara's Susano'o was shown next to Meteors that were large in a conventional sense. Sasuke's Susano'o was destroying Meteors that were shown against the curvature of the Earth, and were created by a Madara exponentially more powerful than when he used the originals.  Sasuke's Susano'o also ascended into space, and blocked Infinite Tsukiyomi.

By portrayal and the Narutoverse's logic, Sasuke's Susano'o is obviously superior. By feats, it is also obviously superior.

Can we stop being terrible please?


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## Hachibi (Jul 27, 2014)

Komnenos said:


> Sasuke's Susano'o was granted to him by the Rikudou Sennin, and activated with a Sharinnegan that is two evolutions greater than Madara's Eternal Mangekyou.
> 
> Madara's Susano'o was shown next to Meteors that were large in a conventional sense. Sasuke's Susano'o was destroying Meteors that were shown against the curvature of the Earth, and were created by a Madara exponentially more powerful than when he used the originals.  Sasuke's Susano'o also ascended into space, and blocked Infinite Tsukiyomi.
> 
> ...



This, basically


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