# Kakashi vs Hashirama



## joshhookway (Aug 11, 2014)

Location: VOTE
Knowledge: manga
Distance 30 meters


----------



## Destiny Monarch (Aug 11, 2014)

First Hashirama covers the entire battlefield in either Kajukai Korin or Jukai Kotan. Then he creates a Medium sized Mokujin and goes on top of it where he makes a dozen Mokuton clones and has them all search for Kakashi in the forest. Kakashi will use PS, and the two will clash, Mokujin coming out victorious (Until Kakashi's PS gets some feats) and Kakashi falls back down, where he falls prey to the Pollen and gets knocked out cold, the clones find his sleeping body and kill him. 

Base Hashirama should be enough to take down Kakashi until he gets some PS feats. If his PS feats are greater then that of Madara's (Which I highly doubt) then Hashirama can resort to Shinsuusenju (Or he can run around and outlast Kakashi).


----------



## Psp123789 (Aug 11, 2014)

Kakashi copies Hashirama's Buddha and covers it in PS. GG.


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 11, 2014)

Wood Dragon deal with PS, Wood Human as well
World of Tree and Pollen deal with Intang
Wood Clone with Kamui

Or God Gate pin PS down
Thousand Hand deal with Intang


----------



## Destiny Monarch (Aug 11, 2014)

Oh yeah, there also Hashiramas Gates which pinned down the Jubi. That could be another way of Kakashi back down into the Pollen.


----------



## joshhookway (Aug 11, 2014)

Kashi can fly


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 11, 2014)

joshhookway said:


> Kashi can fly



He can't without PS, and PS can be deal easily with Hashirama, flying or not


----------



## Atlantic Storm (Aug 11, 2014)

At thirty metres, in a wide open valley with clear line of sight, Kakashi could probably just zap Hashirama away instantly with his double _Kamui_. 

Take that away and put them somewhere where Kakashi can't immediately see Hashirama and it'd be Hashirama's victory.


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 11, 2014)

Atlantic Storm said:


> At thirty metres, in a wide open valley with clear line of sight, Kakashi could probably just zap Hashirama away instantly with his double _Kamui_.
> 
> Take that away and put them somewhere where Kakashi can't immediately see Hashirama and it'd be Hashirama's victory.



IC Kakashi won't Kamui instantly tho
BL on the other hand


----------



## Destiny Monarch (Aug 11, 2014)

Atlantic Storm said:


> At thirty metres, in a wide open valley with clear line of sight, Kakashi could probably just zap Hashirama away instantly with his double _Kamui_.
> 
> Take that away and put them somewhere where Kakashi can't immediately see Hashirama and it'd be Hashirama's victory.



Hashirama is fast enough to avoid a long range Kamui. He was casually dodging PS slashes and outpacing Bijudamas.

Reactions: Dislike 1


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 11, 2014)

Destiny Monarch said:


> Hashirama is fast enough to avoid a long range Kamui. He was casually dodging PS slashes and outpacing Bijudamas.



Wasn't Double Kamui fast enough that One-Eyed Juudara couldn't react to it?


----------



## Atlantic Storm (Aug 11, 2014)

Destiny Monarch said:


> Hashirama is fast enough to avoid a long range Kamui. He was casually dodging PS slashes and outpacing Bijudamas.



Thirty metres is not long range and a double Kamui outpaced a character far faster than Hashirama.


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 11, 2014)

Atlantic Storm said:


> Thirty metres is not long range and a double Kamui outpaced a character far faster than Hashirama.



It's not IC to begin with Kamui, tho it can come quicker since Kakashi has reputation knowledge


----------



## Atlantic Storm (Aug 11, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> It's not IC to begin with Kamui, tho it can come quicker since Kakashi has reputation knowledge



It's wasn't in character to begin with it because it ate huge chunks of his chakra each time - that has since stopped being a problem. Also, you're correct in that even if it weren't in character, the fact that Kakashi knows his opponent is Hashirama would probably mean he wouldn't prance around trying to _raikiri_ him.


----------



## richard lewis (Aug 11, 2014)

Kakashi isn't beating hashirama IMO, at least not unless he shows some godly feats in the next few chapters. But hashi creates a few Mokutkon bushins and any possibility of a kamui snipe goes out the window. Hashi's Buddha>PS and hashi has the stamina to simply outlast kakashi and kill him once he's to exhausted to use kamui. No way is kakashi beating him, at least not until he demonstrates feats that suggest otherwise.


----------



## Csdabest (Aug 11, 2014)

Hashirama. He already bitch Slapped Perfect Susano-o armored Kyuubi. And He has the AOE  covering to block Kamui's LOS. Kakashi is gonna get splintered. Splintered Real fuckin hard.


----------



## Lord Aizen (Aug 11, 2014)

I never thought I'd see this but the kakashi wanking is worse than the 8 gates guy wanking back when it was revealed. Hashirama wins PS is nothing to hashirama so it comes down to kamui. Kakashi isn't landing a finger on hashirama so it comes down to long range kamui. Long range kamui is countered same way hashirama counters all sharingan tech which is with wood clones that can't be seen through. Kakashi will warp hashirama clones while hashirama is inside wood and the clones will beat kakashi. I also don't see how kakashi can't do anything since there's a giant forest blasting out pollen that will put him unconscious


----------



## Cognitios (Aug 11, 2014)

The fact that there is a serious debate that Kakashi could beat Hashirama is sad.
Hashi wins high diff. He already put the beat down on PS Kurama. Only Kashi's hax gives him some chance.


----------



## egressmadara (Aug 11, 2014)

Kakashi will Kamui him once he's close enough. And he can use Obito's Kamui to avoid whatever wood attack comes his way to do so.


----------



## Mercurial (Aug 11, 2014)

Kamui GG? Kamui GG.


----------



## richard lewis (Aug 11, 2014)

Raikiri19 said:


> Kamui GG? Kamui GG.



LOL NO! More 1000 hands GG


----------



## Rocky (Aug 11, 2014)

Atlantic Storm said:


> Thirty metres is not long range and a double Kamui outpaced a character far faster than Hashirama.



I don't remember Kamui outpacing Madara himself, only the Truth Seeking Orb, which was slow enough to be interrupted by a thrown Kunai knife _and_ a Hiraishin combination _after_ Madara had already launched them.


----------



## Lurko (Aug 11, 2014)

Destiny Monarch said:


> Oh yeah, there also Hashiramas Gates which pinned down the Jubi. That could be another way of Kakashi back down into the Pollen.



Kakashi isn't the copyninja for no reason.


----------



## ARGUS (Aug 12, 2014)

Hashirama still wins this

--he has the reflexes in SM to evade all the kamui warp attempts and can use mokuuton clones to disrupt kakashis kamui based moveset and attack him the moment he solidifies to attack, 

--his flower tree world can bypass the 5 minute limit of Kakashis kamui and will be used after hashirama uses SS to crush Kakashis PS


----------



## Ryuzaki (Aug 12, 2014)

Kakashi kamui snipes half of Hashirama's body into the other world. 

Job done.


----------



## joshhookway (Aug 12, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> He can't without PS, and PS can be deal easily with Hashirama, flying or not



And how does Hashirama deal with a flying PS?


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 12, 2014)

joshhookway said:


> And how does Hashirama deal with a flying PS?



Wood Dragon, God Gate, Wood Golem or Thousand Hand


----------



## joshhookway (Aug 12, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> Wood Dragon, God Gate, Wood Golem or Thousand Hand



Those things you mentioned can't fly. Didn't Wood Dragon get destroyed by PS Susanoo?


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 12, 2014)

joshhookway said:


> Those things you mentioned can't fly. Didn't Wood Dragon get destroyed by PS Susanoo?



It didn't. It got destroyed by a Bijuudama form Kurama and beside, God Gate appeared form the sky (seeing it pinned the Juubi and Juubito that way) and Thousand Hand is incredibly huge


----------



## SharinganKisame (Aug 12, 2014)

we need more feats from kakashi but for now hashirama is still stronger than him. kakashi can't beat him with a flying PS, but he sure as hell can with his double kamui. lol at people saying SM hashi can dodge double kamui... Kakashi wins low-mid diff with kamui GG

The masters > hokages


----------



## IchLiebe (Aug 12, 2014)

Kakashi with just having 1 Kamui and inexperienced with it was able to use it steadily at long range against Deidara, with 2 Kamui and much more experience in using the 1st Kamui since then I don't see anyone evading it.

Kakashi 10/10


----------



## Trojan (Aug 12, 2014)

ARGUS said:


> Hashirama still wins this
> 
> --he has the reflexes in SM to evade all the kamui warp attempts and can use mokuuton clones to disrupt kakashis kamui based moveset and attack him the moment he solidifies to attack,
> 
> --his flower tree world can bypass the 5 minute limit of Kakashis kamui and will be used after hashirama uses SS to crush Kakashis PS



- Can you bring Hashirama's SM reflexes that avoid Kamui warp? Because he couldn't even avoid the Black rods. 
- He can fly with his PS.


----------



## Lurko (Aug 13, 2014)

SharinganKisame said:


> we need more feats from kakashi but for now hashirama is still stronger than him. kakashi can't beat him with a flying PS, but he sure as hell can with his double kamui. lol at people saying SM hashi can dodge double kamui... Kakashi wins low-mid diff with kamui GG
> 
> The masters > hokages



Maybe we should add eight gate Guy to make it fun.


----------



## Narutossss (Aug 13, 2014)

cmon now, hashi takes this.


----------



## Lurko (Aug 13, 2014)

Hashi goona take this alright,  Hashi is goona take it up the ass via a thousand years of death yeah kicking it old school.


----------



## ARGUS (Aug 13, 2014)

Hussain said:


> - Can you bring Hashirama's SM reflexes that avoid Kamui warp? Because he couldn't even avoid the Black rods.
> - He can fly with his PS.



Hhis SM sensing enables him to sense the chakra built up for the long range kamui warp therefore he can move prior to the warp and evade it, 
as for  the short range kamui, he can use his mokuton clones which counter the kamui based moveset quite well, as they can attack him the moment he solidifies to attack, 

if his PS is like Madaras (which it most likely is) then all hashirama needs is one chojo kobetsu to bust his PS open, flying is not helping, especially since the attack span for SS is huge


----------



## Nikushimi (Aug 13, 2014)

Hashirama still punches Kakashi to mush with Shinsuusenju.

Mokuton clones can be used to filibuster Kamui-spamming all day.


----------



## Lurko (Aug 13, 2014)

Nikushimi said:


> Hashirama still punches Kakashi to mush with Shinsuusenju.
> 
> Mokuton clones can be used to filibuster Kamui-spamming all day.



Kakashi snipes him before he gets tge chance.


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 13, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Kakashi snipes him before he gets tge chance.


----------



## joshhookway (Aug 13, 2014)

Nikushimi said:


> Hashirama still punches Kakashi to mush with Shinsuusenju.
> 
> Mokuton clones can be used to filibuster Kamui-spamming all day.



Kamui phazes through


----------



## kakashibeast (Aug 13, 2014)

Kakashi high def he has the PS and the double Kamui wich is the ultimate combination


----------



## Lurko (Aug 13, 2014)

Hashi gets sniped,  prove me wrong.


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 13, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Hashi gets sniped,  prove me wrong.



Double Kamui outpaced the Gudodama, who got outpaced by Gated Lee, So you only need Gated Lee speed to dodge it.


----------



## Lurko (Aug 13, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> Double Kamui outpaced the Gudodama, who got outpaced by Gated Lee, So you only need Gated Lee speed to dodge it.



And Kakashi just got to Sakura with Ps before Sasuke could with his s/t, Kakashi takes his head off try again. There's no pis to save Hashi here.


----------



## Trojan (Aug 13, 2014)

ARGUS said:


> Hhis SM sensing enables him to sense the chakra built up for the long range kamui warp therefore he can move prior to the warp and evade it,
> as for  the short range kamui, he can use his mokuton clones which counter the kamui based moveset quite well, as they can attack him the moment he solidifies to attack,
> 
> if his PS is like Madaras (which it most likely is) then all hashirama needs is one chojo kobetsu to bust his PS open, flying is not helping, especially since the attack span for SS is huge



- Which SM Sensing? Can you bring his feats with sensing? 
the wooden clones are fodders though. 

- I don't think his PS is as powerful as Madara's, and I do believe that Hashirama is stronger than Kakashi (unless he proves otherwise that is), but I was just curious about his non-existing sensing feats and reflexes.


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 13, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> And Kakashi just got to Sakura with Ps before Sasuke could with his s/t, Kakashi takes his head off try again. There's no pis to save Hashi here.



Hashi outruned a Bijuudama while Kakashi need to be close to Hashi to Kamui since his left eye is blind


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Aug 13, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> Hashi outruned a Bijuudama while Kakashi need to be close to Hashi to Kamui since his left eye is blind


Hashirama was already running when the Bijudama was shot so he really didn't react or outspeed anything.


----------



## Gilgamesh (Aug 14, 2014)

Ever since Kakashi got PS he was been overrated as fuck

Hashirama can deal with PS and beat Madara who's on a whole other level compared to Kakashi even when he had full power Kyuubi

Hashirama would beat him in base.


----------



## Trojan (Aug 14, 2014)

Gilgamesh said:


> Ever since Kakashi got PS he was been overrated as fuck
> 
> Hashirama can deal with PS and beat Madara who's on a whole other level compared to Kakashi even when he had full power Kyuubi
> 
> Hashirama would beat him in base.



he is extremely overrated indeed, but mostly because of what people expect of his Kamui.
Some people think he can use one eye to be completely untouchable, while using the other, at the
same time to kill the opponents. 

Some of them that I came across, do believe that kakashi will never have any problem with his chakra
either, and can spam that as much as he likes. 

and not having a chapter this week does not help much either...


----------



## Cognitios (Aug 14, 2014)

I'll post a link latter today but Hashirama once said Tobirama was a better sensor than him, which means he is in fact a sensor.


----------



## Qtekk (Aug 14, 2014)

Hashirama wins easily.


----------



## iJutsu (Aug 14, 2014)

Kamui GG. What the hell is Hashi going to do without a head?


----------



## J★J♥ (Aug 14, 2014)

I seriously doubt sanity of anyone who says Kakashit


----------



## JuicyG (Aug 14, 2014)

Hussain said:


> Some people think he can use one eye to be completely untouchable, while using the other, at the
> same time to kill the opponents. ...




Whose says he can't ?


----------



## Hachibi (Aug 14, 2014)

JuicyG said:


> Whose says he can't ?



Then show a scan where he's both Intangible and Warping

The burden of proof is on you


----------



## Ashi (Aug 14, 2014)

Atlantic Storm said:


> Thirty metres is not long range and a double Kamui outpaced a character far faster than Hashirama.



He can't warp other with right kamui


----------



## Lurko (Aug 15, 2014)

Hachibi94 said:


> Hashi outruned a Bijuudama while Kakashi need to be close to Hashi to Kamui since his left eye is blind



Comparing Hashi's running speed to Sasuke' s s/t speed.... bad example my friend


----------



## joshhookway (Aug 20, 2014)

Kakashi also has nothing to counter Hashirama's Guanyin


----------



## Sorin (Aug 20, 2014)

at some responses here.

If Kakashi doesn't want to get touched he won't get touched. Hashi can make a Buddha the size of the moon with a gazillion hands, Kakashi trolls that easily.

+ last chapter showed that he is faster than Hashirama by being able to contend with the end game villain, a being 3 tiers above Hashirama.

He can also outsmart Hashirama. 

Yeah, med difficulty for Kakashi  at best.


----------



## Jagger (Aug 20, 2014)

In all fairness, Kaguya acted dumb in this chapter. She noticed Sakura was above her head and, yet, she did nothing to actually try to evade or counter attack their ambush.


----------



## kakashibeast (Aug 20, 2014)

after today s chapter its a low def win for Kakashi


----------



## Shinobi no Kami (Aug 20, 2014)

-hashirama uses the buddha.

-kakashi throws his tiny kamui shuriken.

-he warps three hands at the max.

-997 shinsuusenju hands destroy his PS.

-kakashi survives because of intangibility.

-he rushes towards hashirama with raikiri.

-he gets feinted by a wood clone and is stabbed in the chest.


----------



## Sorin (Aug 20, 2014)

Jagger said:


> In all fairness, Kaguya acted dumb in this chapter. She noticed Sakura was above her head and, yet, she did nothing to actually try to evade or counter attack their ambush.



Is that a counter to my argument that Kakashi can outsmart Hashirama?

^Only that the stabbed Kakashi is a Raiton clone which stuns Hashirama.


----------



## ShinobisWill (Aug 20, 2014)

Kakashi can Kamui the budda long range. Doesn't need the be the whole thing either to effectively ruin it, either.

People often forget that long-range Kamui rarely needs to warp something entirely. That's a waste of chakra unless you want the target to live or simply seal it within the dimension. As long as you warp the part that can kill or cripple the user without it, that's enough.


----------



## Sorin (Aug 20, 2014)

Kamuing Buddha is out of the question. It's probably just a bit tinier than Kaguya's black ball this chapter. And i don't think Kamuing its head will do something to it, unless it catches Hashirama too.

But Kakashi has other means to deal with Buddha, by simply porting around it or porting directly in Hashi's mug.


----------



## ShinobisWill (Aug 20, 2014)

Sorin said:


> Kamuing Buddha is out of the question. It's probably just a bit tinier than Kaguya's black ball this chapter. And i don't think Kamuing its head will do something to it, unless it catches Hashirama too.
> 
> But Kakashi has other means to deal with Buddha, by simply porting around it or porting directly in Hashi's mug.




He said he couldn't warp it away, but how much could he warp away if he actually tried?

Besides, it was still growing. I think it's going to end up a lot larger than the Buddah, which is also probably why Kakashi didn't want to bother warping something that was continuing to expand.


----------



## Sorin (Aug 20, 2014)

ShinobisWill said:


> He said he couldn't warp it away, but how much could he warp away if he actually tried?



Good question. 

He does have a tiny portion of Rikodou chakra in him. 

Half of it? Maybe...


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Aug 20, 2014)

Sorin said:


> Kamuing Buddha is out of the question. It's probably just a bit tinier than Kaguya's black ball this chapter. And i don't think Kamuing its head will do something to it, unless it catches Hashirama too.
> 
> But Kakashi has other means to deal with Buddha, by simply porting around it or porting directly in Hashi's mug.


Uh, the mega Gudodama was FAAAAAAAARRRR larger than Shinsusenju.

Gudodama dwarfs everything.
Shinsusenju isn't even close in size.


----------



## Sorin (Aug 20, 2014)

I stand corrected. 

Guess Hashirama is not that lucky after all.


----------



## ShinobisWill (Aug 20, 2014)

Not only that, but Kamui Raikiri blitzed an empowered Kaguya..


----------



## Sorin (Aug 20, 2014)

Yeah, Kakashi not only received eyeball boosts but also speed and physical boost.

If that Kamui raikiri is actually a Kamui shaped like Raikiri which actually cuts trough the dimension then he wins this on baddasness alone.


----------



## joshhookway (Aug 21, 2014)

Sorin said:


> Yeah, Kakashi not only received eyeball boosts but also speed and physical boost.
> 
> If that Kamui raikiri is actually a Kamui shaped like Raikiri which actually cuts trough the dimension then he wins this on baddasness alone.



Remember Hashirama's healing feats from Madara. Hashirama will laugh at Raikiri and easily regenerate the damage.


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Aug 21, 2014)

joshhookway said:


> Remember Hashirama's healing feats from Madara. Hashirama will laugh at Raikiri and easily regenerate the damage.


Madara, with Hashirama's healing power, never regenerated a near lost limb until gaining the power of the Juubi.


----------



## Csdabest (Aug 21, 2014)

Hashirama wins with Mid difficulty. Kamui is not a good answer for 1,000 wooden hand bitch slapped. And Hashiramas Budda was already shown to fucked up 100% Armored Kyuubi. 

Their is no Way kakashi is winning this. Kamui is going to get its LOS dependcy hax shut down by AOE Mokuton.

Reactions: Dislike 1


----------



## StickaStick (Aug 21, 2014)

Ridukuo-amped Kamui warps Hashirama and his budda out of existence.


----------



## Kyu (Aug 21, 2014)

Battle starts.

Hashirama looks down & realizes he no longer has a torso.


----------



## blackguyinpinksuit (Aug 21, 2014)

Hashirama can't hit kakashi so he cannot damage kakashi.

Hashirama ain't fast enough to defend from kamui so his head gets ripped off.


----------



## Semiotic Sacrilege (Aug 21, 2014)

Shinobi no Kami said:


> -hashirama uses the buddha.
> 
> -kakashi throws his tiny kamui shuriken.
> 
> ...



Yeah. Kakashi will suddenly lose all his sense of strategy and caution. 

Hashirama stabs him in the chest and he bursts into a raiton clone. As Hashirama is stunned he gets his head sniped off by the real Kakashi hiding in some rubble 100 feet away. 

Seriously... it's like you've never seen a Kakashi fight before.

And what makes you think that hitting a wood clone is gonna make Kakashi forget to go intangible when the real Hashirama attacks in your little scenario?


----------



## Lurko (Aug 21, 2014)

Some of you guys make me sad at the fact that still think Hashi can beat Kakashi, after what he did to Kaguya this chapter you would think people would realize the obvious but they don't.  Kinda sad.


----------



## ShinobisWill (Aug 21, 2014)

It's pathetic that anyone thinks Hashirama even holds a candle to Kaguya, whom Kakashi blitzed and phased like it was childs-play. The only reason he couldn't Kamui GG her is because she'll just warp herself out of the dimension anyway, thus making it pointless.

Kaguya would fodderize Hashirama, and Kakashi made her his bitch. Sad to put it that way, but that's what happened.


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Aug 21, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Some of you guys make me sad at the fact that still think Hashi can beat Kakashi, after what he did to Kaguya this chapter you would think people would realize the obvious but they don't.  Kinda sad.


Its _Shinobi no Kami_. He believes Hashirama can defeat one-Rinnegan Madara (regardless if he had the Juubi or not), Juubito, or current Naruto and Sasuke with mid difficulty at best.


----------



## Ryuzaki (Aug 22, 2014)

ShinobisWill said:


> It's pathetic that anyone thinks Hashirama even holds a candle to Kaguya, whom Kakashi blitzed and phased like it was childs-play. The only reason he couldn't Kamui GG her is because she'll just warp herself out of the dimension anyway, thus making it pointless.
> 
> Kaguya would fodderize Hashirama, and Kakashi made her his bitch. Sad to put it that way, but that's what happened.



Hashirama probably could hold his own against Kaguya (don't know for how long, but he has the tools to fight her better than most of the Narutoverse) but I don't think he'd be able to beat the current Kakashi. He's basically Naruto without the sage power-up. And he's probably the best counter to any Jinchuriki...


----------



## Lurko (Aug 22, 2014)

Ryuzaki said:


> Hashirama probably could hold his own against Kaguya (don't know for how long, but he has the tools to fight her better than most of the Narutoverse) but I don't think he'd be able to beat the current Kakashi. He's basically Naruto without the sage power-up. And he's probably the best counter to any Jinchuriki...



No Hashi's butt will get bone fucked by Kaguya.


----------



## Ryuzaki (Aug 22, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> No Hashi's butt will get bone fucked by Kaguya.


lol...I doubt it but if you say so, then it must be true


----------



## Ashi (Aug 22, 2014)

Kamui Lightning Blade GG

Kamui Shuriken GG


----------



## Atlantic Storm (Aug 22, 2014)

Hashirama might avoid a basic frontal assault from it, but by powerscaling, I don't think he could do the same thing if she tried to do it with dimension warping trickery.


----------



## Grimmjowsensei (Aug 22, 2014)

I dunno. I think Kakashi might lose this since he lacks the power to fight against Buddha. But If he can find a way to directly deal with Hashirama, he might have a shot.


----------



## Lurko (Aug 22, 2014)

Ryuzaki said:


> lol...I doubt it but if you say so, then it must be true



Kaguya is on another level bro, Hashi was getting raped by Jubbito.


----------

