# 100 Percent Theory Tobi is Obito!



## XxSepher (May 23, 2011)

This is a topic that has been going on and on since we were first introduced to Tobi which was a little bit over than two years ago. This top has had lots of heated debates for years. What if I told you that I found proof that Tobi is with out a shadow of a doubt Obito?

Well here is my proof. I have two theories based on this that will support my proof. My first theory is  Tobi is 100 percent Obito in every single way. He is no Madara at all, not not even his spirt is in Obitos body Tobi is Obito...

Proof 

1) Lets go back during the Hokage sumit when Sasuke was looking for Danzo. In this scene Tobi was poisoned by one of Danzos hench men in which Tobi then cut off his arm as if it was nothing. When he cut off his arm there was no blood at all, to me it looked as though that side of his body was fake. Yet in the Manga he seemed to have a new arm (whenhe came to pick up Sasuke from fighting Kakashi, Naruto, and Sakura the reunion). If I am correct that side of his body in which he cut off his arm was the side where Obitos body was crushed. The samething when he fought Konan his body was damaged, yet now he has new body parts.... The only way I can explain this is that his body is artifical.

2) Lets go back agian to the Hokage Sumit, Tobi talks about his moon eye plan in which he wants to have peace in the ninja world. This seems alot what Obito wanted to do when he told Kakashi "those who dont help their friends are worse then scum, i'll change that aspect of the ninja world" (paraphrasing it along those lines, if you all remember). I find that to Ironic.

3) Tobis sharingan is the thing that tops it all off. Not many people can fit this together or even really payed attention to it. However it made sense in the last chapted of the Naruto manga and it hit me. Lets go back to when Kakashi fought Diadara when they went to save Gara. He used his MS, Kakashi's MS is a portal type technique in which it sends others ot a diffrent dimenson and in his MS he has that circular twirl vortex that sucks people in. I find it strikingly similar to Tobis technique in how he uses his sharingan to vortex people into another dimenson as well as killing them with it. Take a look at Kakashi's and Tobis technique the style is the same, the only difference is Tobi's more complete version of it.  I will send you a link to show you what I mean...

 (this link shows Kakashi using his MS in which he is sucking in Diadara as you can see it spirals around sucking the man in) 

 (this link is Tobi fighting Danzos hench men, go to the last 20 seconds of the clip 5:00 you will Tobi using the same technique as Kakashi was using on Didara the same spiral Technique.) 

The only difference is Tobi's sharingan does not change is the same 3 dots. Kakashi's Sharingan changes. There for I find Tobi's sharingan much stronger than Kakashi, just becuase we have not seen Tobis MS Yet. 

There is one thing I can not explain and thats Tobi's teleportation and making himself like a ghost. As we saw in the Manga when the 4th fought Madara, Madara kept making himself like a ghost in which all the attacks would go through him then harden him self up. The thing that is troubeling me is that Tobi can do the same thing.  The reason why I say Tobi, is that even Zetsu calls him Tobi and not Madara. So therefor the only person who knows Tobi's true identity is Zetsu... So what is my explaintion for Madaras techniques and the same techniques of sharingan used by Kakashi and Tobi..

Simple answer : Obitos grandfather is none other then Madara, why not go and act like it yor Madara. So how do we explain the man who fought the 4th was it Obito no... Is Obito's father... why do I say this? Is simple lets look at some interesting coincidance 

Kakashi's age in the beigning of the Naruto story is 26 years old. Kakashi's age now would be about 31 given the fact that team 7 was together for a year before they broke up, then the 2 1/2 - 3 years of Naruto training with Jiraiya. 12years before Naruto's story, was a young Kakashi at the age of 14. The point is, "Madaras attack" (as Minato said, a "Man in a Mask" attacked therefore there was no indication Madara was that man) came very shortly after Obito died very very shortly. Is that coincidence I think not.  I believe Obito's father attacked the 4th and Konoha as a revenge for not being able to be there for his son. It was never said that Minato killed the man in the mask but it was hinted that he did.  All of a sudden out of no were 12 years later the man in the mask reappears as if nothing ever happened to him.  

So here comes my second theory, as I said before Tobi is Obito. When Obito was getting crushed, I believe Zetsu saved him, I believe zetsu is a close friend to Obito's father and Madara, I believe Zetsu helped restore Obitos Body, and before Obito's father attacked Konoha he implanted his eye to his sons. Hense the mask to cover half of the face and keeping one eye. I bet you if anything Zetsu told the whole history of the Uchiha and everything has gone on for all these years  and the corrupted ninja world. What better way then to stick to your ninja moto and change the way the ninja world is by continuing the legacy of the Uchiha. 

This is why Tobi is so much infatuated with Sasuke, becuase Obito to in his own right is an avenger. A man who seeks revenge for his grandfather, his father, for all the Uchihas who have died and above all to create the world he invisoned, the perfect world. 

Tobi is Obito, always has been.  This why when the time does come and the mask is removed, everything will make sense especially to Kakashi.  To many of us Obito is by far one of the most beloved charachters in all of Naruto, and the most shrouded in secreacy and least of all info. It is the same with Tobi, the name is so strikingly familar it makes you wonder since the begining of when the name was mentioned if it really was Obito.  We will soon see the man underneath the mask.. And dont be surprised when I say "I told you so"


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## Mio Akiyama (May 23, 2011)

XxSepher said:


> This is a topic that has been going on and on since we were first introduced to Tobi which was a little bit over than two years ago. This top has had lots of heated debates for years. *What if I told you that I found proof that Tobi is with out a shadow of a doubt Obito?
> 
> Well here is my proof. I have two theories* based on this that will support my proof. My first theory is  Tobi is 100 percent Obito in every single way. He is no Madara at all, not not even his spirt is in Obitos body Tobi is Obito...
> 
> ...



Stopped reading there.
Theories > Proof > BS


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## PikaCheeka (May 23, 2011)

Yea how are theories proof?

But for your sake, I'll go through and read it.

Edit:

1) Both sides of Tobi's body are artificial. When he fought Minato, we saw that his left side is also composed of goo. 

2) Uh....what? What does this have to do with anything? Obito said that those who abandon friends are shit.  Tobi's encouraging Sasuke to kill his old friends and he's getting off on it. And Obito's beliefs here are in complete contradiction to Madara's, so he can hardly be carrying on the legacy. Madara did worse than abandon them. Madara killed his only friend for power. He tried to kill his other potential friend.

3)  Tobirama also had S/T jutsu and we haven't seen how his works. And this could just as easily mean that he's using Obito's body but is still Madara.

Then you get into this little thing where you imply that Minato fought Madara, but the current Tobi isn't Madara....? Then you say that Minato fought Obito's father and not Madara in the next paragraph. This makes very little sense, even if you ignore the contradictions. This is pure speculation with no canon ground whatsoever. A few questions can be raised here:

- How do we know Madara had kids? It's far more unlikely than likely. 
- Who the hell is "Obitos father"? 
- And even though the Kishimoto timeline is bizarre, any grandchild of Madara should be about Tsunade's age, as she was Hashirama's grandchild and Madara was of the same generation and of a similar age as Hashirama.
- Zetsu is a friend of a character you made up? 
- Tobi's mask covers more than half his face.
- I won't even bother with the revenge thing because it is quite contradictory to your earlier statements.


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## SageRafa (May 23, 2011)

At least you guys could read instead of rage negging and such .. We all have the right to have opinions , just because you don't like it , it doesn't mean it's not gonna happen ..

Your first theory it's very old and most of the menbers already know that .. Now your second part of Madara being Obito's Grandfather and the Konoha Attack being made by Obito's Father is new .. Yes Madara could possibly be Obito's Grandpa and that would give him reason to behave like this , but would it would be a little OOC for Obito to go batshit-crazy .. And Kishi won't pull Obito's father out of his ass , except Obito's father is Uchiha Kagami ..

Another thing , how would Obito's Father control the Kyuubi and have the same jutsus as his son ? That would be ridiculous .. The two of them only have two techs , Phasing and Teleporting .. If it was them they could use more Jutsus than Tobi .. Like Katons for example ..

While I believe Obito * could * be Tobi's body , I think it's very hard to be Obito with his personality .. I think that Uchiha Madara is controlling Obito's body in the best option .. But it's more likely to be Uchiha Shisui or Uchiha Kagami


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## wibisana (May 23, 2011)

1. Obito is weak... he cant use sharingan when other Uchiha at his age unlock sharingan.
2. Obito is crushed. in the war who will gonna save him?
and I believe Kakashi and other konoha team come back and get his body as US army always comeback and retrieve dead soldiers.
3. i think that is enough to answer it.


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## jaywilson1992 (May 23, 2011)

tobi is madara

tobi summons and controls the nine tailed fox, only madara can do this

also why would the final villain not be the greatest uchiha(madara) but instead be the lamest uchiha(obito).


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## Uzumakinaru (May 23, 2011)

Even so, after all this BS... WHY would Obito act all this insane? Looking for revenge... revenge on what? 

The best plot would look too similar to Pain history...  won't happen


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## makoto_chan (May 23, 2011)

@jaywilson1992: maybe he isn't the final villain.


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## Blackgallon (May 23, 2011)

The Obito theory also holds up weak for me.

Because the few times Tobi and Kakashi have meet, Tobi hasn't really shown signs of 'remembering' Kakashi. I'm certain if it was Obito, he would actually have made some small references to Kakashi about them as team members and Obito giving him his eye.


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## Kazekage Gaara (May 23, 2011)

We can't just say that that Tobi is Obito, Madara, Shisui etc. There is no theory that can find Tobis true identity. Only Kishi knows this and you can't know or guess what he's thinking.. Good thread nonetheless..


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## the eye of the moon (May 23, 2011)

Wtf you guys why can't it be madara in a non-uchiha body maybe the reason why zetzu calls madara tobi is cause madara is using a man named tobi body....and don't say well if he's a non uchiha body how does he have sharingan......MADARA HAVE LIKE A HUNDRED SHARINGANS IN HIS UNDERGROUND BASE


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## jaywilson1992 (May 23, 2011)

the eye of the moon said:


> Wtf you guys why can't it be madara in a non-uchiha body maybe the reason why zetzu calls madara tobi is cause madara is using a man named tobi body....and don't say well if he's a non uchiha body how does he have sharingan......MADARA HAVE LIKE A HUNDRED SHARINGANS IN HIS UNDERGROUND BASE



cause madara can use izanagi and you need uchiha cells to do that


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## Arcuya (May 23, 2011)

Also, whenever we have seen tobi's face which is always his right, it does have wrinkles which matches madaras. Not only that but obito's right half of his body got flattened while it seems madara always shows his right obviously showing that side is not crushed.       The only thing thing I can think that could help this theory is why isn't tobi interested in getting kakashi's sharingan as kamui is obviously very powerful and this could show that he still cares for kakashi. I still think that Tobi is madara and that last point was just a point that came to mind.


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## Yuna (May 23, 2011)

SageRafa said:


> At least you guys could read instead of rage negging and such .. We all have the right to have opinions , just because you don't like it , it doesn't mean it's not gonna happen ..


Opinion =/ Theory =/= "100% proof theory" (by which I assume the OP meant "100% fool-proof, you cannot deny I'm right theory!)


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## Egotism (May 23, 2011)

You would expect Tobi to act some kind of way towards Kakashi if he was tobi but thats not the case. I just don't believe he is Obito, because he has no reason to rage against anyone


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## Seraphiel (May 23, 2011)

Not to mention he called Kakashi and Yammato kids.


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## SonicTron (May 23, 2011)

This theory is so absolutely convoluted (dealing with not only Madara, but Madara, Obito's father who we have never heard of, Obito turning evil, Zetsu relations with Obito's father, Obito somehow knowing the full history of Madara and the secrets of the Rinnegan as well as having been around to give Nagato the Rinnegan, etc).

I'm not sure if its troll bait or genius.  Reps AND FIVE STAR THREAD!


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## SageRafa (May 23, 2011)

FallenAngelII said:


> Opinion =/ Theory =/= "100% proof theory" (by which I assume the OP meant "100% fool-proof, you cannot deny I'm right theory!)



I never said it was right for the OP to put 100 % and all that ,  but it's just a theory , in the OP's head it's 100 % right , so all we need to do is read it and then point out it's flaws or it's good points in order to prove or disprove the theory/opinion ..

So people who simply don't want to read it shouldn't even post in the thread .. I said that because almost every post was just "negged" , "I didn't read" , "+1" etc etc .. 

If they read it then say what's wrong with it and that's absolutely fine , each one has his opinion .. But now dismissing a idea without even knowing what it's ?


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## Talis (May 23, 2011)

I am still lolling that people prefer to believe that hes Madara instead Obito. I know the only thing which doesnt fit is the time line in the Konoha flashback. Alltho i support this theory until Kakashi year is over. Now lets look at the facts which support this theory:

1: Toobi= Obitoobi
2: only 1 sharingan in his left eye
3: Crushed body (Konan fight)
4: Hair (99% will say Madara got a haircut, but in such case characters wont have a haircut believe me)
5: Kakashi/Obito both got a similiar sharingan technique
6: We still dont have a real explatation how Kakashi got his MS (Im sure its related to Obito somehow)
7: Kishi still didnt show how Rin died im sure it will be showed after Tobio revealed himself as Obito
8: Dont forget that panel ''My power, Sharingans true power, Uchiha Madara's power'' 
He might use Madaras namef cuz he uses Madara's power or he just says that cuz Minato thought he was Madara back then. Note that  he useally says that hes Madara but back then he didnt say anything to Minato.
9: Kishi says he moved Kakashi years from 2010 to 2011, Im certain he was up to reveal Obitos identity in 2010 but he delayed it and 1 proof of that is the Konan fight. He showed us half of his face. Now if we look at the current manga state + current time im sure that Tobis identity will be revealed within 7 months or better said in ''Kakashis year''. 
10: Tobi is a pu**y, we never saw him fighting for real, hes only using another characters. And yet in the Konan fight he only used a pipe to kill Konan . Do you know what i believe? It must be a shame too call such a person Madara lol. The real Madara would have killed Konan with just looking at her. And yet people are fantacising about current ''Madara'' being stronger then prime Madara 

Anyways to the ''retarded'' ''Madara'' fanboys try to come with 9 
true Tobi= Madara fact if you can.

Anyways believe whatever you want. I will stop believing in the Tobi=Obito theory after Kakashis year is over without Tobis identity revealed.


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## Aeiou (May 23, 2011)

XxSepher said:


> *Well here is my proof. I have two theories *



You say you have proof then give us 2 theories? Your first mistake 



> Simple answer : *Obitos grandfather is none other then Madara*, why not go and act like it yor Madara.



Madara has no relation whatsoever with Obito. To call him his grandfather is nothing more than an assumption. This makes your so called "proof" far from 100%. If I could say so myself, the only grandfather Madara could be is Sasuke's. There's a lot of relation between the two and it'll give more relevance to the equal rivalry Naruto and Sasuke have

Naruto ----- Minato
Sasuke ----- Madara



> So how do we explain the man who fought the 4th was it Obito no... Is Obito's father... why do I say this? Is simple lets look at some interesting coincidance



How does a random character know how to use S/T, and summon the ninetailed fox? Why does your 100% proven fact have so many farfetched assumptions? 




> Is that coincidence I think not.  I believe Obito's father attacked the 4th and Konoha as a revenge for not being able to be there for his son.



Obito's father was well aware that his son was in the *3rd Great Shinobi War*. He should more or less know that his son could die at any given time, just like any other shinobi. There's no real proof or releveance why he would target not just the 4th, but *the whole village* for casualties in a World War.



> It was never said that Minato killed the man in the mask but it was hinted that he did.  All of a sudden out of no were 12 years later the man in the mask reappears as if nothing ever happened to him.



Itachi was 17 years old in Part 1. I believe the Uchiha Massacre took place when Itachi was 12. This means Sasuke was 7 at that time. 

According to what you're saying, Sasuke was newborn during the attack of Konoha, making Itachi 5. 12 years later would make Sasuke 12... but Tobi helped Itachi kill the Uchiha clan, so that's 2 years he came back. This makes your time period invalid.



> It is the same with Tobi, the name is so strikingly familar it makes you wonder since the begining of when the name was mentioned if it really was Obito.



Yeah, just like *Tobi*rama, or Saru*tobi*, right? . Basing a theory off names is just...



> This is why Tobi is so much infatuated with Sasuke, becuase Obito to in his own right is an avenger. A man who seeks revenge for his grandfather, his father, for all the Uchihas who have died and above all to create the world he invisoned, the perfect world.



I honestly think it's Izuna. He was none other than Madara's brother. A character in Naruto that has managed to unlock their Mangekyo Sharingan has to be important. I think he's here to avenge his brother's death. He came from a time period of daily fighting, and wants to see peace in the world. The reason he was so shocked at Kabuto bringing back the 6th coffin was because it was probably his brother, the only Uchiha who was stronger than himself. But this is only my *OPINION*, because if I were to support this blindly, I'd make up farfetched assumptions like you've done here. Just lay off the Obito theory. Although many things may be similar, there are just as many flaws, if not more.


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## Talis (May 23, 2011)

Why did Kishi make Tobi looking as Obito in the beginning. Orange mask 1 eye hole acting like a kid and more like that? Simple cuz Kishi wanted to start the Obito theory. For the same reason he could have show us the old Tobi mask (Grey mask with black flame like thing on it) but then the Obito theory never would have been started. Once the Obito theory started Kishi revealed him as Madara, why? So everyone will be surprised soon after the mask goes down.


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## Neptun (May 23, 2011)

most of your so called proofs are so generic that they could be accounted to almost every dead character


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## Escargon (May 23, 2011)

*Sorry but one year after Obito got WTFPWNT by a stone Madara attacked hokage and said "Do you have any idea how long i waited for this?!" 

It doesnt make sense!*


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## moongem (May 23, 2011)

I'll always, until the series ends and proven otherwise, believe that Tobi= Obito :/ . The unexplained fate of Rin... Kakashi and Tobi's similar techniques... the fact that Kakashi has a MS...

Why would the legendary "Uchiha Madara" who was known as the man who had chakra that, and I quote, "Was more sinister the the Kyuubi's" (Art of paraphrasing) act like a kid for so long? Hm, it just seems out of Madara's assumed character... besides... when someones under a mask... you never know if there is more then on person under there. Especially when paired with drastic attitude adjustments.

Just personal opinion...


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## Yuna (May 24, 2011)

SageRafa said:


> I never said it was right for the OP to put 100 % and all that ,  but it's just a theory , in the OP's head it's 100 % right , so all we need to do is read it and then point out it's flaws or it's good points in order to prove or disprove the theory/opinion ..


Well, then the OP dosen't know the definition of the word "theory", then does he?



SageRafa said:


> So people who simply don't want to read it shouldn't even post in the thread .. I said that because almost every post was just "negged" , "I didn't read" , "+1" etc etc ..


Because maybe some people are sick and tired of "Tobis 100% proven to be Obito!" bullshit threads with zero evidence in them cropping up in the Library, even after chapters that have *nothing* to do with that.

Seriously, nothing in the past, oh, 200 chapters did anything to prove or disprove that theory, yet we keep getting threads like this (less frequenly nowadays, but still). This hit belongs in the House of Uzumaki or whatever that place is called.



SageRafa said:


> If they read it then say what's wrong with it and that's absolutely fine , each one has his opinion .. But now dismissing a idea without even knowing what it's ?


Maybe they did read it and still decided to neg?


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## Fiona (May 24, 2011)

Before i read OP i thought for SURE Madara is just madara!! 

after reading? 

Still do 


BUT 


a good try


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## Eternal Pein (May 24, 2011)

I stopped reading when you said you're 100% proof was 2 theories you have. Theories do not equal proof.


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## PikaCheeka (May 24, 2011)

loool3 said:


> I am still lolling that people prefer to believe that hes Madara instead Obito. I know the only thing which doesnt fit is the time line in the Konoha flashback. Alltho i support this theory until Kakashi year is over. Now lets look at the facts which support this theory:
> 
> 1: Toobi= Obitoobi



If you could spell his name right, this might be slightly more believable. But if you want to play the name game, aren't you forgetting *Tobi*rama, as well?



> 2: only 1 sharingan in his left eye



Prove it. He lost an eye to Konan.



> 3: Crushed body (Konan fight)



How do we know it's crushed? We only know it's goo. And it is on both sides, not one, as Obito's was.



> 4: Hair (99% will say Madara got a haircut, but in such case characters wont have a haircut believe me)



Why wouldn't he get a haircut? Have you seen how many times Madara has had haircuts in flashbacks? He's had even more haircuts and hairstyles than Sasuke in the series, and that's pretty impressive.



> 5: Kakashi/Obito both got a similiar sharingan technique



We don't know if his s/t justu has to do with his Sharingan yet, and even if it does, this could just as easily mean that he's using Obito's body and is still Madara.



> 6: We still dont have a real explatation how Kakashi got his MS (Im sure its related to Obito somehow)



And...? What does this have to do with Tobi...? I'm pretty sure he's not dead.



> 7: Kishi still didnt show how Rin died im sure it will be showed after Tobio revealed himself as Obito



Man people really are hooked on her, aren't they?  She and Obito were only mentioned in a gaiden hundreds of chapters ago and haven't been mentioned since. You think some girl with a Sakura complex who was in 20 pages is going to be important now when Sakura herself isn't?



> 8: Dont forget that panel ''My power, Sharingans true power, Uchiha Madara's power''
> He might use Madaras namef cuz he uses Madara's power or he just says that cuz Minato thought he was Madara back then. Note that  he useally says that hes Madara but back then he didnt say anything to Minato.



Speech patterns vary significantly between English and Japanese. Go ask a Japanese expert to translate that panel for you. The words he used imply royalty and follow a pattern where you commonly speak of yourself in the third person.



> 9: Kishi says he moved Kakashi years from 2010 to 2011, Im certain he was up to reveal Obitos identity in 2010 but he delayed it and 1 proof of that is the Konan fight. He showed us half of his face. Now if we look at the current manga state + current time im sure that Tobis identity will be revealed within 7 months or better said in ''Kakashis year''.



Why can't people accept the fact that this is very likely Kishi just screwing with people by now? Sakura's supposed to have been doing something important for a long time now as well. His clues, if they are genuine at all, are extremely cryptic. For all we know Kakashi's Year = Year of the Off-Panel Rampage. Considering how he's been treated in part 2 it isn't difficult to imagine what his 'year' could consist of. And again, far too much importance is being placed on Kakashi. The final villain (or near-final, if you believe him to be) is going to be the hero's long-since-useless teacher's best friend? What? When have we ever seen this before? We never have. It's ridiculously bad writing. Kakashi hasn't been important since Part 1, and even then he only was for 150 chapters or so. Hate to break it to his fanbase but he has very little impact on the story, and even if he did, it's just silly to have someone as important as Tobi be his best friend. 



> 10: Tobi is a pu**y, we never saw him fighting for real, hes only using another characters. And yet in the Konan fight he only used a pipe to kill Konan . Do you know what i believe? It must be a shame too call such a person Madara lol. The real Madara would have killed Konan with just looking at her. And yet people are fantacising about current ''Madara'' being stronger then prime Madara



What part of "shell of my former self" do you not understand?

And current Madara has the Rinnegan. He didn't prior to his fight with Konan, so your last sentence is null and void.



> Anyways to the ''retarded'' ''Madara'' fanboys try to come with 9
> true Tobi= Madara fact if you can.
> 
> Anyways believe whatever you want. I will stop believing in the Tobi=Obito theory after Kakashis year is over without Tobis identity revealed.



I'll humor you.


*Spoiler*: __ 



1) Tobi = kite, a small bird of prey. Madara's favorite hobby is falconry (Databook). Along those lines, Madara is manipulating and using Sasuke (a hawk) as a falconer does a bird of prey. Interesting symbolism, no?

2) He goes to VotE to brood, which would be unusual even for someone 'getting revenge' for him.
3) He is obsessed with Hashirama. Now anyone who was getting revenge or carrying on the family tradition would despise him for what he did. The only villain-esque figure who could logically continue to revere him is the one defeated by him. 
4) He said that Naruto reminded him of Hashirama. You would think anyone else would say Minato.
2-4 (note) = If you can give me a _valid_, psychological explanation for the idea of anyone else behaving as such, let me know. I've heard the 'carrying on the revenge through generations' excuse innumerable times, but it always falters here. Generally if you're trying to avenge the death of your father/grandfather/other, you're not completely and utterly infatuated with the guy who killed him. You also don't compare people to him as if you personally knew him.

5) He takes off his mask to prove who he is to both Kisame and Sasuke. He has a habit of confirming his identity to people he trusts by removing the mask after he says he is Madara.

6) Tobi clearly despises the Will of Fire more than anyone else. It destroyed Madara's life. Obito and maybe half of the other characters who were/are suspected of being Tobi died for it. Anyone see the discrepancy? 

7) What would Obito have against the Uchiha clan? Madara and Itachi are the only two known Uchiha who utterly despise their clan enough to want to massacre them all.

8) What 'lost abilities' does Tobi speak of if he's Obito? If he is a 'shell of his former self', then that implies at one point he was extremely powerful. This fits Madara far more than...Obito. This fits Madara better than any other Uchiha, and we now know that the likelihood of him being an Uchiha exceeds that of anything else (the only other person that makes sense in this instance is Shisui, but given the fact that Tobi seems perfectly capable of manipulating and controlling people even without a jutsu specifically designated for it, I'm not sure why he would be considering that such a significant loss. Yes, he wants the eye, but is it enough for him to say that he's only a shell of his former self over it?)

9) As someone else pointed out, why would he say "You don't know how long I've waited" if the second Kyuubi attack was only a year or so after his 'death' via rock. You only say this when you're very old. 

10) How was he able to fool Itachi, who was able to find most all other inconsistencies in Tobi's story? Response must be detailed, please.

11) The personality change. This is one of the biggest conundrums with the Obito theory. Tobi as he is now is very much like Madara, nearly identical barring the wisdom that comes with age.

Keep in mind the thread dates, but there are many more 'facts' and questions , , , and . I tried to avoid overlaps but I know a few are inevitable. Some are strictly Tobi = Madara, while others are more of a process-of-elimination commentary.






loool3 said:


> Why did Kishi make Tobi looking as Obito in the beginning. Orange mask 1 eye hole acting like a kid and more like that? Simple cuz Kishi wanted to start the Obito theory.



Acting like a kid? Disguise, perhaps? The Villain-Playing-the-Fool motif is extremely common in all genre. 



> For the same reason he could have show us the old Tobi mask (Grey mask with black flame like thing on it) but then the Obito theory never would have been started.



Someone came up with a very interesting theory that his masks display the symbols of the clans he recently gained the powers of. Kishimoto also fully admitted to liking Madara's mask because it was easy to draw. His old one certainly wasn't.



> Once the Obito theory started Kishi revealed him as Madara, why? So everyone will be surprised soon after the mask goes down.



Erm...the Obito theory was going for years before he revealed himself to be Madara.


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## silenceofthelambs (May 24, 2011)

It's almost as if people _don't_ want Tobi to be Madara. 

I have nothing to say in regards to this thread, I've shot down "Tobi = Obito" so many times I'm not going to bother anymore. It just isn't worth anyone's time.


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## Fiona (May 24, 2011)

TOBIrama

saruTOBI 

Obito 

 


im being dead serious. 

GIVE ME 3 VALID, EVIDENCE SUPPORTED REASONS THAT MADARA CANNOT BE MADARA


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## Yami_no_Princess (May 24, 2011)

Wow, to think people actually want this manga to have worse writing than it already does. It baffles the mind. Something like this happening would prompt people to be screaming "retcon!" or "PNJ!" or something. Regardless, these "theory" threads serve no purpose other than to piss people off.

I mean we should certainly know by now not to click anything that has "100% proven" anywhere in the title. The title for a *THEORY*. 

Once a "theory" is "100% proven" it is no longer a "theory" it is then considered a "fact". 

I wanted to read this for the lulz, but my eyes started burning when you mentioned Kakashi's MS jutsu being similar to Madara's. Of course they're similar, they're both space/time jutsus. You can argue that Minato's technique is similar to Madara's. It doesn't mean Minato suddenly has a sharingan. If you had argued that Tobi's MS pattern was similar to Kakashi's MS pattern I would have been intrigued, but we haven't seen Tobi's MS pattern yet. Not to mention Obito's only working Sharingan was given to Kakashi, the other one got crushed. Meaning it's useless, meaning Tobi having a sharingan discredits the Tobi = Obito *theory*.


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## Naruto (May 24, 2011)

FallenAngelII said:


> Because maybe some people are sick and tired of "Tobis 100% proven to be Obito!" bullshit threads with zero evidence in them cropping up in the Library, even after chapters that have *nothing* to do with that.



That sounds like a good reason to let it die, not derail it into spam.


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