# The stuff that's happening in Iraq thread



## jetwaterluffy1 (Jun 19, 2014)

> Iraq has formally called on the US to launch air strikes against jihadist militants who have seized several key cities over the past week.
> 
> "We have a request from the Iraqi government for air power," confirmed top US military commander Gen Martin Dempsey in front of US senators.
> 
> ...


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-27905849
Because I really have no idea why there is not a thread like this already.


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## Zaru (Jun 19, 2014)

If you had told anyone 11 years ago that Iraq WANTS the US to come in and do airstrikes on Iraqi cities...


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## Linkofone (Jun 19, 2014)

> Iraq has formally called on the US to launch air strikes against jihadist militants who have seized several key cities over the past week.



A formal invitation. :l


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## Hand Banana (Jun 19, 2014)

Hope we decline and let iraq handle their own fucking problem.


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## Jersey Shore Jesus (Jun 19, 2014)

Hand Banana said:


> Hope we decline and let iraq handle their own fucking problem.



For God sake yes...


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## MartyMcFly1 (Jun 19, 2014)

Those ISIS dudes aren't fucking around:


*Spoiler*: __ 



[YOUTUBE]BfdYR9UHVN4[/YOUTUBE]




This literally looks like a post-apocalyptic hell on earth.


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## Mael (Jun 19, 2014)

Here's hoping they'll film an air to ground missile headed their way next time.

Savages...


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## Deleted member 23 (Jun 19, 2014)

WWIII incoming. This one will be in the middle east.


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## Juda (Jun 19, 2014)

Iraq hates us, why should we even help an enemy? dont ask the person whom you consider "Satanic" to help you. This is something that should only be handled by them.


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## Mider T (Jun 19, 2014)

We shouldn't unless Maliki steps down and even if a coalition government is formed,  they STILL attack.


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## makeoutparadise (Jun 20, 2014)

klad said:


> WWIII incoming. This one will be in the middle east.



during the 100th anniversary of WWI awe ISIS you shouldn't have!!!


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## Lurko (Jun 20, 2014)

Hand Banana said:


> Hope we decline and let iraq handle their own fucking problem.



This fuck them, not our problem.


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## dr_shadow (Jun 20, 2014)

klad said:


> WWIII incoming. This one will be in the middle east.



It's not World War III if it doesn't have the U.S, China and/or Russia in it.


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Jun 20, 2014)

^Not our problem...until they took the primary oil refinery in Iraq. Thus sending Gas Prices skyrocketing all over the world.

I'd say just bomb the shit out of ISIS with superior airpower, but leave ground troops out of it.


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## Cardboard Tube Knight (Jun 20, 2014)

mr_shadow said:


> It's not World War III if it doesn't have the U.S, China and/or Russia in it.



Only Germany can call a World War. Official rules.


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## Kagekatsu (Jun 20, 2014)

*ISIS surrounds Beiji refinery, calls for Maliki to resign increasing*



> *Iraq crisis: Fierce battles for Baiji and Tal Afar
> *
> Baiji, Iraq's biggest refinery, is surrounded by the rebels, who say they have seized most of Tal Afar airport.
> 
> ...


http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-27936652


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## Dolohov27 (Jun 20, 2014)

Hopefully we stay out of it.


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## Fiona (Jun 20, 2014)

Airstrikes? Yes. 

Troops? No.


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## Kagekatsu (Jun 21, 2014)

*Sunni insurgents split from ISIS*



> By Our Foreign Staff12:15PM BST 21 Jun 2014
> Sunni militants who fought together to capture swathes of Iraqi territory have turned their weapons on each other during clashes in Kirkuk province that cost 17 lives, according to reports.
> 
> The fighting erupted on Friday evening between Isis and the Army of the Men of the Naqshbandiyah Order
> ...




The wolves are devouring each other now, can't complain.


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## makeoutparadise (Jun 21, 2014)

Gotta love the middle east......


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## Jersey Shore Jesus (Jun 21, 2014)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> ^Not our problem...until they took the primary oil refinery in Iraq. Thus sending Gas Prices skyrocketing all over the world.
> 
> I'd say just bomb the shit out of ISIS with superior airpower, but leave ground troops out of it.



Yet if we stayed out of the nation none of this would of happened. This is something that we have to let happen.

We have enough oil here in the U.S. we just don't take advantage of it.


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## Cardboard Tube Knight (Jun 22, 2014)

Jersey Shore Jesus said:


> Yet if we stayed out of the nation none of this would of happened. This is something that we have to let happen.
> 
> We have enough oil here in the U.S. we just don't take advantage of it.



I love when people say this like staying over there doesn't mean that men and women don't get to see their families and some of them never come home.


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Jun 22, 2014)

Jersey Shore Jesus said:


> Yet if we stayed out of the nation none of this would of happened. This is something that we have to let happen.
> 
> We have enough oil here in the U.S. we just don't take advantage of it.


Of course we should have never gone to Iraq. But I'm saying, just bomb the shit out of ISIS, cripple them, leave them in the stone age and let the current Iraqi government do a dust up operation to keep the stability.


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## Lucaniel (Jun 22, 2014)

what i want to know is, why did ISIS make their name the same as the spy agency in archer


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## Jin-E (Jun 22, 2014)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Of course we should have never gone to Iraq. But I'm saying, just bomb the shit out of ISIS, cripple them, leave them in the stone age and let the current Iraqi government do a dust up operation to keep the stability.



AFAIK, there is a lack of intelligence to accurately identify targets.


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## Mael (Jun 22, 2014)

ISIS is looking for a caliphate and will brutalize anyone to do so.

Once again you apologize for them calling savages noble lions.


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## Jin-E (Jun 22, 2014)

Al Mudaari said:


> Actually, a US puppet and dictator asked for air-strikes, not Iraqi civilians.



Puppet= Someone who has done the diametrically opposite to US interests in Iraq the last few years? Interesting definition.


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## jetwaterluffy1 (Jun 22, 2014)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Shouldn't AL-Mudaari have been banned under the new rules?



Based on what? ISIS being a well-organised military group? That's hardly offensive.


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## Mael (Jun 22, 2014)

*Iran's Ayatollah Khamenei Strongly Opposes U.S. Actions in Iraq*



> DUBAI ? Iran's top leader rejected possible intervention in Iraq by the United States or any other outside power, accusing Washington on Sunday of trying to manipulate Iraqi sectarian differences to retake control of the country it once occupied.
> 
> In remarks published by the official IRNA news agency, Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei added that Iraqis themselves could end violence in their country, where Iran has steadily built up its own influence over the past decade.
> 
> ...


http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ir...nei-strongly-opposes-u-s-actions-iraq-n137841

Where's SoG with another dumbass Israeli macro?

Ayatollah is smokin' mad crack though.


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## Chelydra (Jun 22, 2014)

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ir...nei-strongly-opposes-u-s-actions-iraq-n137841

Iran is telling the US to piss off, claiming we want to take "retake the country we formerly controlled"


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## dr_shadow (Jun 23, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ir...nei-strongly-opposes-u-s-actions-iraq-n137841
> 
> Iran is telling the US to piss off, claiming we want to take "retake the country we formerly controlled"



In the early Middle Ages, Iraq used to be a battleground between Eastern Rome and Persia when they both tried to establish hegemony in the Middle East. Then when they were both tired from fighting, the recently-united Arabs swooped in from the south and kicked both their asses, establishing the first Caliphate.

I guess Iraq has always been a prize since it's located at the crossroads of the Roman, Persian and Arab culture zones.


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## dr_shadow (Jun 28, 2014)

*Iraqi parties pursue talks that could oust Maliki over insurgency*



> *(Reuters) - Iraqi party leaders planned delicate talks that could end Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki's divisive rule after a top Shi'ite cleric called for a new premier to be chosen without delay to tackle Islamist rebels threatening to tear apart the country.*
> 
> Major powers are pushing for a new inclusive government, rather than one pursuing Shi'ite sectarian domination, to be formed fast to counter the insurrection that has spilled across the border with Syria and could menace the wider Middle East.
> 
> ...



http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/06/28/us-iraq-security-idUSKBN0F20S720140628


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## Kagekatsu (Jun 28, 2014)

Even if Maliki steps down, which is looking increasingly likely, what makes you think they'll succeed in creating a "inclusive government"?

Also, Iraqi forces may have recaptured Tikrit


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## dr_shadow (Jun 30, 2014)

*After Iraq gains, Qaeda offshoot claims Islamic "caliphate"*



> *(Reuters) - An offshoot of al Qaeda which has seized territory in Iraq and Syria has declared itself an Islamic "caliphate" and called on factions worldwide to pledge their allegiance, a statement posted on Islamist websites and Twitter said on Sunday.*
> 
> The move poses a direct challenge to the central leadership of al Qaeda, which has disowned it, and to conservative Gulf Arab rulers who already view the group as a security threat.
> 
> ...



http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/06/30/us-syria-crisis-iraq-idUSKBN0F40SL20140630


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## dr_shadow (Jun 30, 2014)

The caliph is the "pope" of Sunni Islam. The job has been vacant for almost 100 years since the last Ottoman caliph was overthrown in the wake of WW1.

To gain widespread legitimacy I think the caliph should control Mecca, so a little premature.

Still, BOLD move.


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## Alwaysmind (Jun 30, 2014)

Some have been dreaming of restoring the Caliph. So for them when Bagdhadi was proclaimed Caliph of the Islamic State, it was good enough for them. 

So right now IS is banking on nostalgia, sort to speak.


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## Mael (Jun 30, 2014)

mr_shadow said:


> http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/06/30/us-syria-crisis-iraq-idUSKBN0F40SL20140630





mr_shadow said:


> The caliph is the "pope" of Sunni Islam. The job has been vacant for almost 100 years since the last Ottoman caliph was overthrown in the wake of WW1.
> 
> To gain widespread legitimacy I think the caliph should control Mecca, so a little premature.
> 
> Still, BOLD move.



These guys must be smoking some serious crack or they're just really good at blustering.

I'd love for another "speech" to be made over the "Caliph" only to hear the sound of an incoming Hellfire immediately afterward.


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## Alwaysmind (Jun 30, 2014)

Mael said:


> These guys must be smoking some serious crack or they're just really good at blustering.
> 
> I'd love for another "speech" to be made over the "Caliph" only to hear the sound of an incoming Hellfire immediately afterward.



Only problem is, those Hellfire missiles would all be captured ones and will be aimed at their creators.


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## Mael (Jun 30, 2014)

Alwaysmind said:


> Only problem is, those Hellfire missiles would all be captured ones and will be aimed at their creators.



Wat.

I'm talking about from a Predator drone.  How would they capture that?


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## Island (Jun 30, 2014)

The caliph is the head of state of a caliphate (obviously), and, like the Pope to Saint Peter, he is the successor to Muhammad.

To give you an idea how crazy these guys are, here are maps of two of the most successful caliphates,  and . The Ottoman Sultan also claimed the title of caliph, though, it preferred to stylize itself as "Empire" instead of "Caliphate", most likely in an attempt to associate themselves with the Romans. In any case, the caliphates, including the Ottoman Empire, ruled over the Middle East for about thirteen hundred years, from the rise of Muhammad to the fall of the Ottoman Empire at the end of the First World War.

Just in case anyone was wondering where this unique brand of crazy comes from.


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## Mael (Jun 30, 2014)

Island said:


> The caliph is the head of state of a caliphate (obviously), and, like the Pope to Saint Peter, he is the successor to Muhammad.
> 
> To give you an idea how crazy these guys are, here are maps of two of the most successful caliphates,  and . The Ottoman Sultan also claimed the title of caliph, though, it preferred to stylize itself as "Empire" instead of "Caliphate", most likely in an attempt to associate themselves with the Romans. In any case, the caliphates, including the Ottoman Empire, ruled over the Middle East for about thirteen hundred years, from the rise of Muhammad to the fall of the Ottoman Empire at the end of the First World War.
> 
> Just in case anyone was wondering where this unique brand of crazy comes from.



And somewhere, Carlos Latuff is fapping to these notions of caliphates.


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## Alwaysmind (Jun 30, 2014)

Mael said:


> Wat.
> 
> I'm talking about from a Predator drone.  How would they capture that?



Well, the U.S. lost about 400 drones, so I guess they just wait till one drops from the sky. A thing like that just laying on the ground can't be that hard to find.


"More than 400 US military drones crashed in past 13 years, report says
Of 418 major drone crashes since 2011 identified by the Washington Post, about half happened in Iraq and Afghanistan"
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/21/400-us-military-drones-crashed-13-years

Plus the then ISIS got plenty of money coming out of Saudi Arabia. So, maybe they will be able to afford one of these some day.


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## Seto Kaiba (Jun 30, 2014)

Alwaysmind said:


> Well, the U.S. lost about 400 drones, so I guess they just wait till one drops from the sky. A thing like that just laying on the ground can't be that hard to find.
> 
> 
> "More than 400 US military drones crashed in past 13 years, report says
> ...






> Of the 418 major drone crashes since September 2001 that the newspaper identified, about half happened in Iraq and Afghanistan and nearly a quarter were in the US. *Almost 200 of the crashes were classed by the military as “class A”, meaning they destroyed the aircraft or caused at least $2m-worth of damage,* though no loss of life was attributed to the accidents.



Missed that part. Of the ones that could be recovered, that is not the same as being able to replicate or reverse-engineer the technology.


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## Mael (Jun 30, 2014)

Alwaysmind said:


> Well, the U.S. lost about 400 drones, so I guess they just wait till one drops from the sky. A thing like that just laying on the ground can't be that hard to find.
> 
> 
> "More than 400 US military drones crashed in past 13 years, report says
> ...



Actually yeah it is pretty hard to find and a Hellfire would more than likely be rendered inoperable.

Are you pulling stuff from your ass for fun?


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## Alwaysmind (Jun 30, 2014)

In any case.



> MILITARY & DEFENSE More: Military Politics International Iraq
> ISIS Is Likely Receiving Funding From People Living In Countries Allied With The US
> 
> ALLAN SMITH
> ...



These guys have a lot of money on their hands. This is going to be a long struggle for Iraq.


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## Mael (Jun 30, 2014)

It's why I might actually advocate letting Iran get in on the fighting.  Both have black market funds and can keep bloodletting themselves for quite some time while Israel can breathe a little easier and the US gets less pressure to get more involved.


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## dr_shadow (Jun 30, 2014)

Take a look at Island's maps and you'll see how pretentious it is to call yourself Caliph when you've only got like 1/20 the territory of previous caliphates and hold neither Mecca, Medina nor Jerusalem.

It's as pathetic as when Byzantium was still the Roman EMPIRE even when they consisted of just Istanbul and its suburbs...


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## Alwaysmind (Jun 30, 2014)

*In the hypothetical* I wonder what would happen if the Islamic State actually becomes a recognized state. Can't really isolate that part of the world just like that.


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## Mael (Jun 30, 2014)

Alwaysmind said:


> *In the hypothetical* I wonder what would happen if the Islamic State actually becomes a recognized state. Can't really isolate that part of the world just like that.



Yes you could.  North Korea is by and large isolated save for news and Chinese black marketing.


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## Alwaysmind (Jun 30, 2014)

mr_shadow said:


> Take a look at Island's maps and you'll see how pretentious it is to call yourself Caliph when you've only got like 1/20 the territory of previous caliphates and hold neither Mecca, Medina nor Jerusalem.
> 
> It's as pathetic as when Byzantium was still the Roman EMPIRE even when they consisted of just Istanbul and its suburbs...



Very true, but you got to start somewhere. Most of it is just for shock and awe. They wanted to form a Caliphate before being blown into smithereens by Turkey and Iran. They probably reasoned "hey, no one has gotten closer to create a Caliphate in (insert number of years), so let's call ourselves a Caliphate before we are destroyed by our neighbors."


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## dr_shadow (Jun 30, 2014)

Mael said:


> Yes you could.  North Korea is by and large isolated save for news and Chinese black marketing.



No oil in NK though.


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## Alwaysmind (Jun 30, 2014)

mr_shadow said:


> No oil in NK though.



Exactly. No oil in North Korea. The Islamic State is sitting comfortably on plenty of barrels of oil. 
Speaking of oil the price of gas will rise again


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## Zaru (Jun 30, 2014)

The USA are now a massive producer of oil and the ban on selling crude oil just got lifted a few days ago. They'd probably LOVE a rising oil price.


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## Mael (Jun 30, 2014)

Alwaysmind said:


> Exactly. No oil in North Korea. The Islamic State is sitting comfortably on plenty of barrels of oil.
> Speaking of oil the price of gas will rise again



http://www.reuters.com/finance/commodity?symbol=CLc1

And gas actually dropped a few cents in my state at least.

But also that swathe of land doesn't include Kirkuk which the Kurds had taken control of, one of Iraq's largest oil fields.  And Saudis control the vast majority anyway.


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## Alwaysmind (Jun 30, 2014)

Mael said:


> http://www.reuters.com/finance/commodity?symbol=CLc1
> 
> And gas actually dropped a few cents in my state at least.
> 
> But also that swathe of land doesn't include Kirkuk which the Kurds had taken control of, one of Iraq's largest oil fields.  And Saudis control the vast majority anyway.



You lucky one, it rose in mine. Maybe its to encourage people from your state to get out while keeping the ones in mine from traveling too far.


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## Hand Banana (Jun 30, 2014)

Dropped in mine. Might be states closer to the coast.


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## Island (Jun 30, 2014)

Alwaysmind said:


> Very true, but you got to start somewhere. Most of it is just for shock and awe. They wanted to form a Caliphate before being blown into smithereens by Turkey and Iran. They probably reasoned "hey, no one has gotten closer to create a Caliphate in (insert number of years), so let's call ourselves a Caliphate before we are destroyed by our neighbors."


Well, no. Can't really justify this kind of crazy.

A caliphate isn't just something you create. You have to be the successor to Muhammad to be the caliph, which all of the caliphs were, at least according to Sunni Islam. The first three out of four empires that claimed the title _were_ founded by people related to or companions to Muhammad. The exception is the Ottomans, but they were way too powerful to be challenged by the time the Ottoman Sultan claimed the title.

It'd almost be like somebody claiming to be the younger brother of Jesus.


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## Zaru (Jun 30, 2014)

Island said:


> The exception is the Ottomans, but they were way too powerful to be challenged by the time the Ottoman Sultan claimed the title.



Might makes right in this case.


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## Juda (Jun 30, 2014)

Island said:


> The caliph is the head of state of a caliphate (obviously), and, like the Pope to Saint Peter, he is the successor to Muhammad.
> 
> To give you an idea how crazy these guys are, here are maps of two of the most successful caliphates,  and . The Ottoman Sultan also claimed the title of caliph, though, it preferred to stylize itself as "Empire" instead of "Caliphate", most likely in an attempt to associate themselves with the Romans. In any case, the caliphates, including the Ottoman Empire, ruled over the Middle East for about thirteen hundred years, from the rise of Muhammad to the fall of the Ottoman Empire at the end of the First World War.
> 
> Just in case anyone was wondering where this unique brand of crazy comes from.



Wow, never new that. 

And using the "Empire" makes sense. Thanks for sharing


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## Alwaysmind (Jun 30, 2014)

Island said:


> Well, no. Can't really justify this kind of crazy.
> 
> A caliphate isn't just something you create. You have to be the successor to Muhammad to be the caliph, which all of the caliphs were, at least according to Sunni Islam. The first three out of four empires that claimed the title _were_ founded by people related to or companions to Muhammad. The exception is the Ottomans, but they were way too powerful to be challenged by the time the Ottoman Sultan claimed the title.
> 
> It'd almost be like somebody claiming to be the younger brother of Jesus.



Again, it's the nostalgia factor. It's really more of an emirate, but calling it that would be counterproductive for The Islamic State's agenda. 

They wanted to restore a Caliph and completely ran over the successor to Mohammad's prerequisite. 
Might makes right indeed. Specially if you have 2 billion dollars worth of might and an army to back it up.
Talk about cutting corners to achieve one's end eh?


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## dr_shadow (Jul 2, 2014)

*Syria-Iraq 'caliph' incites Muslims to holy war*



> *(Reuters) - The leader of the al Qaeda offshoot now calling itself the Islamic State has called on Muslims worldwide to take up arms and flock to the "caliphate" it has declared on captured Syrian and Iraqi soil.*
> 
> Proclaiming a "new era" in which Muslims will ultimately triumph, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi issued the call to jihad - holy war - in an audio message lasting nearly 20 minutes that was posted online on Tuesday.
> 
> ...



http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/07/01/us-iraq-security-baghdadi-idUSKBN0F64QU20140701


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 2, 2014)

The Iraqi Parliament is in serious trouble. I have this feeling that with 5 years Iraq will no longer exist. IS attacked Iraqi cities at the right moment. The army fleeing and the MP's unable to form a government. 300 troops might not be enough to protect the U.S. Embassy and the airport.

What I find annoying is that many of these articles ill explain the current Iraqi political situation (example: the way their government function, why is Maliki being replaced (elections? stepped down? laws saying he can't run anymore?).

Anyway, I hope that the following article will be somewhat useful.



> *Nouri al-Maliki's future in doubt as Iraq parliament fails to elect new leadership*
> _Iraq parliament session to appoint new leadership quickly adjourned without progress amid divisions between Shia, Sunni and Kurdish MPs resulting from Isis advance_
> 
> With a swathe of the country under Jihadist control, Iraq's newly-elected parliament met to elect a new leadership but the session was quickly adjourned as an attempt to name its speaker stalled.
> ...


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## Mael (Jul 4, 2014)

*Iraq army retakes Saddam's birthplace*



> (Reuters) - The Iraqi army retook Saddam Hussein's home village overnight, a symbolic victory in its struggle to seize back swathes of the country from Sunni insurgents.
> 
> Backed by helicopter gunships and helped by Shi'ite Muslim volunteers, the army recaptured the village of Awja in an hour-long battle on Thursday night, according to state media, police and local inhabitants.
> 
> ...


http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/07/04/us-iraq-security-idUSKBN0F90T520140704


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## Edward Newgate (Jul 4, 2014)

So say Iraq falls apart thanks to IS, what would the consequences be?


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## Mael (Jul 4, 2014)

Edward Newgate said:


> So say Iraq falls apart thanks to IS, what would the consequences be?



Oil prices rising and greater Sunni-Shia conflict.

Not to mention Iran pouring even more efforts into the greater Middle East.

Israel possibly being affected too.


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## dr_shadow (Jul 4, 2014)

Edward Newgate said:


> So say Iraq falls apart thanks to IS, what would the consequences be?



The Islamic State is likely to be very agressive to its neighbours because it does not recognize national borders. Even hooligans like North Korea understand that you can't go into other countries' territories without consequence, but the Islamic State thinks that all Muslims form one nation and they can therefore enter any (Sunni) Muslim country as they please.

Out of self-preservation though they might think twice about picking a fight with Saudi Arabia or Iran.


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## Island (Jul 4, 2014)

Edward Newgate said:


> So say Iraq falls apart thanks to IS, what would the consequences be?


Pretty much what Mael said. This isn't going to be the start of some Islamic super-state or anything like that, not as long as Saudi Arabia, Iran, and Turkey have anything to say about it, never mind Israel and the United States.


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## Megaharrison (Jul 4, 2014)

Edward Newgate said:


> So say Iraq falls apart thanks to IS, what would the consequences be?



The Good:
-Another failed Arab state that is too busy ripping itself apart to bother us (Israel)
-An independent Kurdistan
-Iran gets bogged into another foreign war
-Obama with more egg on his face

The Bad:
-All those US lives squandered over nothing
-Tremendous amounts of dead Iraqi's
-Huge loss to US credibility worldwide
-Rise of a Sharia caliphate terror state in Iraq/Syria

The Ugly:
-Export of terrorism to Western countries similar to Taliban Afghanistan
-Increased Iranian influence over southern Iraq


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## Mael (Jul 6, 2014)

> ​
> The rise of the fundamentalist Sunni terror group ISIS in Iraq over the last couple of weeks has provoked critics of the Iraq war to new heights of smugness. ISIS, of course, is the Taliban-like entity that split from Al-Qaeda in 2013, largely as the result of petty politicking between its leader, self-styled ?caliph? and would-be global overlord Abu al-Baghdadi and Osama Bin Laden?s owlish successor, Ayman al-Zawahiri. According to the , ISIS now controls over a dozen Iraq cities, including Mosul, the country?s second-largest, and we keep being warned their march on the capital is imminent.
> 
> Whether or not ISIS is actually a viable ?government in waiting? remains  ? they have little experience holding territory, let alone running it ? and sensationalistic media analogies framing the group as the North Vietnamese army descending on Saigon display a lazy misunderstanding of both conflicts. Yet either way, the sheer horror of these would-be caliphaties ? the mass-murders of captured soldiers, the , the unapologetically imperial ambitions to rule the entire Middle East within five years  ? has made them a powerful symbol for everything wrong with America?s 2003 intervention in the first place.
> ...


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## Seto Kaiba (Jul 6, 2014)

OK, usually that guy makes a good point but liberals were right in that we should not have gone into Iraq at all.


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## Island (Jul 6, 2014)

According to that comic, it was Pok?mon fans and Swiss nationals that were pushing for the impeachment of Bush.


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## dr_shadow (Jul 6, 2014)

Now there is a video of "Caliph" al-Baghdadi leading Friday prayer, so we can all see what he looks like. Posting stills since I don't have YouTube here in China:


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## dr_shadow (Jul 6, 2014)

Quick analysis is that he seems to for now be adhering to the Salafist ideal of modesty and asceticism.

As far as I know, previous caliphs lived and dressed much like kings, with lots of jewels and complicated, expensive costumes. al-Baghdadi on the other hand wears only a very simply black robe and turban with no decorations whatsoever.

Remember that from the point of view of the Islamic State, this is supposed to be the uniform of the leader of all Muslims in the world.


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## Mael (Jul 6, 2014)

He's still a backwards piece of shit.


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 7, 2014)

*Iraqi Parliament delays meeting until August, general killed near Baghdad*



> BY ISRA'A AL-RUBEI'I AND AHMED RASHEED
> BAGHDAD Mon Jul 7, 2014 1:07pm EDT
> 
> (Reuters) - Iraq's new parliament postponed its next session for five weeks on Monday, extending the country's political paralysis in the face of a Sunni Islamist insurgency which claimed the life of an army general on the northwestern outskirts of Baghdad.
> ...



http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/07/07/us-iraq-security-idUSKBN0FC1Q820140707

At this point, I think we're better off hedging our bets with the Kurds and any Sunni tribesment oppposed to ISIS rather than expecting anything from Baghdad now.


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## Robin (Jul 7, 2014)

Hand Banana said:


> Hope we decline and let iraq handle their own fucking problem.


bad idea. 
it's not a problem, it's a disaster. 


Edward Newgate said:


> So say Iraq falls apart thanks to IS, what would the consequences be?


terrorist government


I'm starting to think that it was all part of the plan from 2003. The US has always been vocal about freedom but has been supporting terrorists and rebels for decades.


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## Megaharrison (Jul 14, 2014)

Iraqi Army has launched a major counterattack led by tanks in Anbar Province, ISIS decimated them and sent the Iraqi's fleeing.







Iraqi military prowess was proven to be rather unflattering against Israel (1948/67/73), Iran, and Murica twice....2014 against ISIS is no different it seems....


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## Sabotage (Jul 14, 2014)

^Didn't Iraq fight to a stalemate with Iran in the 80s?


----------



## Megaharrison (Jul 14, 2014)

Sabotage said:


> ^Didn't Iraq fight to a stalemate with Iran in the 80s?



Iran had just gotten done purging all of its good commanders, their military, while well-equipped, was in chaos and demoralized. As a result Iran primarily relied on poorly trained/equipped Pasdaran who launched mass human wave attacks. Iraq launched a surprise attack and had an overwhelming advantage in tanks/jets/artillery/etc.. They should have curbstomped Iran given the situation after 1979, instead they fought them to a stalemate. And it's not even a total stalemate, Iran was slowly gaining ground and generally having its way on taking the war to Iraqi territory after the first few months of the conflict.


----------



## Mael (Jul 14, 2014)

Shame we didn't give the Kurds this equipment...


----------



## Sabotage (Jul 14, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Iran had just gotten done purging all of its good commanders, their military, while well-equipped, was in chaos and demoralized. As a result Iran primarily relied on poorly trained/equipped Pasdaran who launched mass human wave attacks. Iraq launched a surprise attack and had an overwhelming advantage in tanks/jets/artillery/etc.. They should have curbstomped Iran given the situation after 1979, instead they fought them to a stalemate. And it's not even a total stalemate, Iran was slowly gaining ground and generally having its way on taking the war to Iraqi territory after the first few months of the conflict.



Thanks. That explains the huge loss of life on the both sides (especially the Iranian one).


----------



## Kagekatsu (Jul 14, 2014)

Jeez, no wonder Maliki is begging for U.S. air power.

But again, I'd think the Kurds are more deserving of our support.


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Jul 14, 2014)

They had fucking M1-A1 tanks, how the hell were they curbstomped?


----------



## Megaharrison (Jul 14, 2014)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> They had fucking M1-A1 tanks, how the hell were they curbstomped?



Actually they're "monkey model" M1A1's, downgraded to not have depleted uranium armor. US was very rightfully worried about the Maliki gov giving depleted uranium tech to the Iranians.

Not that it matters much though, even if they had top-of-the-line M1A2's they could still have something like this happen due


----------



## Chelydra (Jul 14, 2014)

OMG the Iraqis are incompetent as fuck  Time to let them rot, this just goes to show that high tech equipment is useless without proper training.

Even if these were dumb'ed down M1s they are still better than what ISIS has.


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Jul 14, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Actually they're "monkey model" M1A1's, downgraded to not have depleted uranium armor.



How does that help? Is uranium a very tough metal then?


----------



## Chelydra (Jul 14, 2014)

jetwaterluffy1 said:


> How does that help? Is uranium a very tough metal then?





Its the currently closest thing to having an invulnerable tank armor out there. Im sure by now the US/England have made something better.


----------



## Megaharrison (Jul 14, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> OMG the Iraqis are incompetent as fuck  Time to let them rot, this just goes to show that high tech equipment is useless without proper training.
> 
> Even if these were dumb'ed down M1s they are still better than what ISIS has.



Pretty much true, though ISIS has a lot of captured tech from Syria they've brought into Iraq














The camo schemes on these tanks are definitely Syrian, they do this to try and help them avoid Israeli airstrikes.

Then of course there's Iraqi tech that has been captured in recent weeks and put into ISIS service....


----------



## Yagura (Jul 14, 2014)

Disregarding a Western intervention, who amongst the local powers is the most liable to topple this group?


----------



## Kagekatsu (Jul 14, 2014)

Yagura said:


> Disregarding a Western intervention, who amongst the local powers is the most liable to topple this group?



At the moment, Iran. Syria also conducted an airstrike a couple weeks ago and the Saudi's are mobilizing troops near the border, though don't expect too much beyond that.


----------



## Megaharrison (Jul 14, 2014)

Iran getting itself into a new war and rallying local Shia forces could stop ISIS moving on Baghdad, but they're dead in the water as soon as they try to advance into Sunni territory.


----------



## IchLiebe (Jul 15, 2014)

ISIS can take Baghdad if they attack with enough people. US intelligence has done confirmed this multiple times. And it will be a hard fight to recapture lands.


----------



## dr_shadow (Jul 15, 2014)

Just split the thing and get it over with. Trying to keep Iraq together is an exercise in futility.

The problem is that the Islamic State does not recognize national borders, so they might not respect the soveregnity of Kurdistan and Shia Iraq in the event of a split. Meaning they wouldn't stop attacking Shias just because they live in separate countries.


----------



## Yagura (Jul 15, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Iran getting itself into a new war and rallying local Shia forces could stop ISIS moving on Baghdad, but they're dead in the water as soon as they try to advance into Sunni territory.



So this group isn't going anywhere essentially?


----------



## dr_shadow (Jul 15, 2014)

Yagura said:


> So this group isn't going anywhere essentially?



Despite what looks like massive human rights abuses, I think the Islamic State could be around for a while if they don't aggro the neighbouring countries. Nobody gave a fuck about North Korea or Afghanistan for years, so what is another psyco dictatorship as long as they stay on their own turf?

They seem more likely to go the Khmer Rouge route though. Pol Pot was stupid enough to pick a fight with fellow Communist state Vietnam and was promptly deposed and replaced by a pro-Vietnamese puppet government.

al-Baghdadi could well get deslusions of grandure and try to conquer Mecca and Medina from Saudi Arabia, the 4th largest military spender in the world. Good luck with that...


----------



## Megu-Nee (Jul 15, 2014)

uhh.. can anyone give me a rough summary of what happened?

haven't been following the news... i just saw so many pictures of babies and children getting bombed..


----------



## Kagekatsu (Jul 16, 2014)

Loki-tama said:


> uhh.. can anyone give me a rough summary of what happened?
> 
> haven't been following the news... i just saw so many pictures of babies and children getting bombed..



Basically:

-ISIS uses its gains in Syria to essentially launch a full scale insurgency in Iraq with the aid of Sunni tribesmen disgruntled over Maliki and a primarily Shia dominated government.

-Most of western and northern Iraq falls because the Iraqi army is fucking useless, wasn't helped by the fact Maliki replaced commanders that may have actually been competent with loyal yes-men. Only the Kurds are really keeping their shit together at this point.

-Shia clerics raise up militias backed by Iranian funds and ammo. 

-Maliki begs for U.S. air power to turn back ISIS. Several problems, Obama won't help unless Maliki becomes more inclusive to the Sunnis and Kurds, which won't happen as long as he's in charge. Also, any air campaign needs to have a force on the ground to consolidate gains. And as explained previously, the Iraqi Army is an absolute joke a of military force. U.S. has sent advisers to ascertain the situation and gather intelligence for possible air operations.

-ISIS declares themselves the Islamic State, basically the restoration of OBL's dream, the Caliphate.

-Iraqi government is currently in chaos as there are factions trying to remove Maliki from power. 

-As of now, Iraq is essentially split in three and unlikely to change anytime soon.


----------



## dr_shadow (Jul 16, 2014)

Also the leader of the Islamic State has declared himself Caliph, i.e "pope of Islam".

The title had been vacant for 90 years, since the last Ottoman Caliph abdicated in I think 1923, in the fallout from WW1.


----------



## Megu-Nee (Jul 16, 2014)

Kagekatsu said:


> Basically:
> 
> -ISIS uses its gains in Syria to essentially launch a full scale insurgency in Iraq with the aid of Sunni tribesmen disgruntled over Maliki and a primarily Shia dominated government.
> 
> ...


oh, thank you very much.

i initially thought some madman specifically targeted to bomb places with children/babies.. there's so many uncensored pictures of the bombings on kids.....


----------



## Mael (Jul 22, 2014)

*ISIS Torches 1800-Year-Old Mosul Church After Expelling Christians*



> Then, matters got worse. From the Daily Beast:
> 
> Friday at noon was the deadline for Christian families to meet ISIS?s demands: Convert to Islam, pay an anachronistic Islamic tax for non-Muslims known as jizya, leave Mosul, or be killed. But the day before the final exodus, Christians were informed jizya was no longer an option. The order came to convert, leave, or die.
> 
> ...




Just to show that the "lions" of Islam are pieces of shit and need the shit droned out of them.  Zero respect for relics.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Jul 22, 2014)

Iraqi's still need to get their shit together for us to do that, and Maliki's going to be scratching and clawing to hold on to his office.

And even if they do somehow manage to form a cohesive government, there's still the fact the Iraqi army is in no condition for an prolonged campaign, and we need a force on the ground for an air assault on ISIS to work since we're not sending in troops. And as competent as the Kurdish Peshmerga are, they can't do it by themselves since they're focused on trying to guard their territories.


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Jul 23, 2014)

Mael said:


> Just to show that the "lions" of Islam are pieces of shit and need the shit droned out of them.  Zero respect for relics.



I thought they were using cathedrals as bases. They must have changed their minds now.

But here's something really major: they are also destroying _sunni_ shrines.
This is the tomb of the girl: 
And this is the shrine of Ahmed al-Rifai: 
As far as I am aware, they are both sunni shrines.

They seem to be opposed to the idea of shrines altogether, but destroying these shrines has probably damaged their support.


----------



## Mael (Jul 23, 2014)

jetwaterluffy1 said:


> I thought they were using cathedrals as bases. They must have changed their minds now.
> 
> But here's something really major: they are also destroying _sunni_ shrines.
> This is the tomb of the girl:
> ...



From the silent majority maybe...ISIS will continue in their unholy crusade as is until the Kurds and Western forces kick their asses.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Jul 23, 2014)

jetwaterluffy1 said:


> I thought they were using cathedrals as bases. They must have changed their minds now.
> 
> But here's something really major: they are also destroying _sunni_ shrines.
> This is the tomb of the girl:
> ...



There's been reports some of the Sunnis are beginning to turn on ISIS recently, similar to how the Awakening councils turned them against Al-Qaeda in 2007 during the surge.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Jul 23, 2014)

*Maliki loses support from prominent Shia cleric*



> World News
> Iraqi Leader Maliki Loses Backing of Shiite Figure and Iran for New Term
> Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani Comes Out in Opposition to Maliki
> 
> ...




Good, the sooner Maliki goes, the better.


----------



## Chelydra (Jul 25, 2014)

ISIS is destroying holy sites





> (CNN) -- If you blink during the video, you might miss the moment Jonah's tomb in Mosul, Iraq, explodes.
> 
> The first few frames show the revered shrine towering over its landscape. There's a sudden burst of dust, fire and smoke.
> 
> ...


----------



## Agent of Chaos (Aug 6, 2014)

*40,000 Yazidi Stranded on Mount Sinjar*

http://www.businessinsider.com/this-yazidi-community-northern-iraq-2014-8



> *As the militant group called Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIS) battles Iraqi government and Kurdish forces for supremacy of Iraq, the relatively tiny Yazidi community has been left stranded in a humanitarian crisis amid talk of "genocide" against them.*
> 
> *As many as 40,000 civilians, many of whom are Yazidi*, are currently trapped on the barren top of Mount Sinjar, humanitarian agencies told The Washington Post on Tuesday. There, the civilians face a grim choice between engaging the ISIS army and starvation or dehydration if they remain.





> *"[The militant policy of] either convert or be killed is a very powerful message,"* Karasik said. "This group is going to be creating more refugee flows as it moves in different directions within the multi-ethnic structure of Iraq."
> 
> But persecution of the Yazidis goes back centuries. As the Christian Science Monitor noted, the Ottoman Empire is said to have slaughtered hundreds of Yazidis. *In the modern era, when the nearby Kurds, Sunnis, and Shiites are engaged in violent conflict after the U.S. largely withdrew its military from Iraq, things have only grown worse for the Yazidis.*
> 
> "Everyone considers us infidels," Samir Babasheikh, whose father is the Yazidis? spiritual leader, told The New York Times. "Sunnis and Shiites are killing each other even though they are both Muslims, so imagine what they will do to us, people from a completely different religion."



This is genocide, and it looks like its going to get worse for them since not many want to give help. 

Info on ISIS for those who don't know them: 

Plea For Help:  (Don't know how to post video's, if someone can do the favor I'd appreciate it).


----------



## Fiona (Aug 6, 2014)

Jesus Christ  

Has there been any talk about protecting them or moving them before it can happen?


----------



## Juda (Aug 6, 2014)

I almost went in tears watching that video . You can feel her pain and grief, sigh. I pray for them to be saved , i dont even care if she worships another God, I couldnt even finish watching that video, it was to much. Is there truly no one on earth whose unwilling to save these people in the middle east? wheres the un?


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 6, 2014)

Juda said:


> I almost went in tears watching that video . You can feel her pain and grief, sigh. I pray for them to be saved , i dont even care if she worships another God, I couldnt even finish watching that video, it was to much. Is there truly no one on earth whose unwilling to save these people in the middle east? *wheres the un*?



Condemning Israel of course, no one will lift a finger here either. Unless the Iraqi government and military miraculously gets its shit together these people are pretty much screwed.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 6, 2014)

Fiona said:


> Jesus Christ
> 
> Has there been any talk about protecting them or moving them before it can happen?



The best I can think of is an airlift of food, water and maybe some weapons to protect themselves. Otherwise, the Iraqi govt is still divided due to Maliki and the Kurds have their hands full guarding their territory.

At this point, I am for unleashing the the drones and raining Hellfire missiles on ISIS but that's probably still a month away from happening


----------



## |)/-\\/\/|\| (Aug 6, 2014)

Fuck them. Many muslims have been killed and been forced out of their homes in Iraq in this secterian violance, many more has been butchered in Syria; no one gave a crap until non-muslims started tasting the suffering.


----------



## N120 (Aug 6, 2014)

The civil war is a messy one in Iraq, the situation is far more complex than people here realise or take time to appreciate.

There was a humanitarian crisis in Iraq even before sadam was overthrown, the invasion of Iraq and the political backlash that followed has escalated the whole region into a deep power struggle both within Iraq and externally as regional powers fight for influence.

This is the back drop to the suffering people face in Iraq today, it's not a sudden disaster but one that's been slowly gathering momentum.

The amalgamation and creation of Isis only complicated the conflict even further, they were not the main factor to the misery people suffer today nor were they major actor in the crisis until recently, they themselves were and in part still are part players alongside other factions that already exist.

And yes, The Yazidis are suffering alongside every other group in Iraq. 

Also, An Israel thread already exists.


----------



## Jin-E (Aug 7, 2014)

Kagekatsu said:


> At this point, I am for unleashing the the drones and raining Hellfire missiles on ISIS but that's probably still a month away from happening



Probably won't happent until Baghdad itself is under direct threat.



> Fuck them. Many muslims have been killed and been forced out of their homes in Iraq in this secterian violance, many more has been butchered in Syria; no one gave a crap until non-muslims started tasting the suffering.



The difference is that the current fight is a existensial threat against this minority.


----------



## Mael (Aug 7, 2014)

|)/-\\/\/|\| said:


> Fuck them. Many muslims have been killed and been forced out of their homes in Iraq in this secterian violance, many more has been butchered in Syria; no one gave a crap until non-muslims started tasting the suffering.



This is why the world isn't a big fan of Islam in any form of policy and looks at the Middle East with mostly disdain.

Non-Muslims have been tasting the suffering for some time, including Coptics and Baha'i but I'm sure you just passed all that by in some misbegotten masturbatory hatefest on Israel amirite?


----------



## Spock (Aug 7, 2014)

I don't know what's worse, the people who are capitalizing on this disaster in favor of Israel or the ones who are doing it for Muslims. You're doing a great disservice .


----------



## Seto Kaiba (Aug 7, 2014)

ISIS is actively creating a warpath across the region, and is actually looking to commit genocide on a number of groups yet you hardly hear anything about it if you watch the news...it's like it is a footnote in the current events there when it's the biggest thing.


----------



## Spock (Aug 7, 2014)

Seto Kaiba said:


> ISIS is actively creating a warpath across the region, and is actually looking to commit genocide on a number of groups yet you hardly hear anything about it if you watch the news...it's like it is a footnote in the current events there when it's the biggest thing.





It's presented in Arabic news. How come they're not in western media?


----------



## Mael (Aug 7, 2014)

Spock said:


> It's presented in Arabic news. How come they're not in western media?



Actually Reuters and BBC keep popping articles about it.  The Yazidi persecution is simply the soup du jour.  The big thing is that ISIS represents a greater threat to stability yet it's only Iraq that seems to be screaming for help and to help.  You're hard-pressed to find even Iran clamoring to combat them from a news representation yet every swinging dick and set of ovaries wants to froth at the mouth at Israel.

It just seems rather headscratching is all.


----------



## |)/-\\/\/|\| (Aug 7, 2014)

Mael said:


> This is why the world isn't a big fan of Islam in any form of policy and looks at the Middle East with mostly disdain.
> 
> Non-Muslims have been tasting the suffering for some time, including Coptics and Baha'i but I'm sure you just passed all that by in some misbegotten masturbatory hatefest on Israel amirite?



Muslims don't give two craps about the fandom of retarded medieval shit fucks. Go give your love to Non-Muslims, it's a disgrace if we have it.


----------



## Mael (Aug 7, 2014)

|)/-\\/\/|\| said:


> Muslims don't give two craps about the fandom of retarded medieval shit fucks. Go give your love to Non-Muslims, it's a disgrace if we have it.



Just what I expected.


----------



## Sherlōck (Aug 7, 2014)

Its a great disaster & this situation needs to be dealt with ASAP. 



Spock said:


> I don't know what's worse, the people who are capitalizing on this disaster in favor of Israel or the ones who are doing it for Muslims. You're doing a great disservice .



Both.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 7, 2014)




----------



## Chelydra (Aug 7, 2014)

Well lets see if its backed up by action, rather than tough words.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 7, 2014)

*U.S. considering airstrikes in Iraq*





> (CNN) -- The United States is considering air strikes in Iraq in response to a militant surge in northern areas that has left minority groups trapped by fighting, a U.S. official told CNN.
> The official said the possibility of such military action "has been something" the Obama administration "has been talking about for some time and the latest news just might meet the threshold for action."
> Iraq's largest Christian town has been overrun by the same militant Islamists who have gained a foothold in parts of eastern Syria and western and northern Iraq.
> Christians targeted in key Iraqi towns UN: Kids dying from poor living situation
> ...



Seems what ISIS is doing to the Christians and Yazidis is forcing our hand.


----------



## Linkofone (Aug 7, 2014)

Just another day for the US i guess.


----------



## Fiona (Aug 7, 2014)

It was just announced that Supply drops are happening right now in Iraq to get food and medical supplies to the stranded and displaced civilians there.


----------



## Fiona (Aug 7, 2014)

It was just announced that Supply drops are happening right now in Iraq to get food and medical supplies to the stranded and displaced civilians there


----------



## Mael (Aug 7, 2014)

I'd also like en masse drone strikes on ISIS targets.


----------



## Fiona (Aug 7, 2014)

Mael said:


> I'd also like en masse drone strikes on ISIS targets.



According to CNN the Pentagon is considering it.


----------



## N120 (Aug 7, 2014)

> The plight of Yazidi refugees in the Sinjar mountains, hemmed in by Islamic State forces and relying on dwindling supplies of food and water, has brought renewed international attention to the war in Iraq. Some have suggested that the United States or United Nations facilitate airdrops to the starving, dehydrated refugees.
> 
> But this is more complicated than it seems.
> 
> ...


----------



## Fiona (Aug 7, 2014)

Except they are already helping them.....

They announced a little while ago that supply drops have already begun....


----------



## Mael (Aug 7, 2014)

The Pentagon better do more than damn consider it.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 7, 2014)

Update: Airstrikes & airdrops authorized


----------



## Joakim3 (Aug 7, 2014)

Mael said:


> The Pentagon better do more than damn consider it.



Wish granted, Obama just authorized them http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-28699832

Time for the drones


----------



## Joakim3 (Aug 7, 2014)

*Obama authorises US air strikes in Iraq*

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-28699832



> About a quarter of Iraq's Christians fled their homes after Qaraqosh was taken
> Continue reading the main story
> Struggle for Iraq
> 
> ...


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 7, 2014)

[YOUTUBE]http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=obMdFFIB0tU[/YOUTUBE]


----------



## Sanity Check (Aug 7, 2014)

*Obama authorises US air strikes in Iraq*



.


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Aug 7, 2014)

About fucking time!


----------



## Taco (Aug 7, 2014)

Ah, the good ol "convert or die"

Obama's being a little unrealistic when he says the only way for there to be peace in Iraq is for all Iraqi communities to work together lol. There's a very clear problem in the area.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 7, 2014)

1mmortal 1tachi said:


> *Obama authorises US air strikes in Iraq*
> 
> 
> 
> .


The cost of the Libyan intervention for the US was estimated to be $1.05 billion.

Which is basically pennies for the US.

I rather doubt this will be much more. Especially if we can get Turkey and the French off their asses and clear out the festering wound that is Syria.


----------



## Sanity Check (Aug 7, 2014)

Sunuvmann said:


> The cost of the Libyan intervention for the US was estimated to be $1.05 billion.
> 
> Which is basically pennies for the US.
> 
> I rather doubt this will be much more. Especially if we can get Turkey and the French off their asses and clear out the festering wound that is Syria.



.

The united states main problem in iraq and afghanistan has been the same over the last 10 years: a severe lack of planning.  There was no exit strategy, no clear goals laid out, no effort made to resolve things that needed resolving.

Air strikes without some type of comprehensive planning and goal oriented strategy won't make a difference.  It doesn't amount to much more than the united states flushing cash down a toilet while Putin applauds from the sidelines.


----------



## Taco (Aug 7, 2014)

1mmortal 1tachi said:


> .
> 
> The united states main problem in iraq and afghanistan has been the same over the last 10 years: a severe lack of planning.  There was no exit strategy, no clear goals laid out, no effort made to resolve things that needed resolving.
> 
> Air strikes without some type of comprehensive planning and goal oriented strategy won't make a difference.  It doesn't amount to much more than the united states flushing cash down a toilet while Putin applauds from the sidelines.



America isn't trying to do ANYTHING long term here... There's literally 40000 people who need help like right now, and if America won't do it nobody else will.


----------



## Blue (Aug 7, 2014)

1mmortal 1tachi said:


> .
> 
> The united states main problem in iraq and afghanistan has been the same over the last 10 years: a severe lack of planning.  There was no exit strategy, no clear goals laid out, no effort made to resolve things that needed resolving.
> 
> Air strikes without some type of comprehensive planning and goal oriented strategy won't make a difference.  It doesn't amount to much more than the united states flushing cash down a toilet while Putin applauds from the sidelines.



Even if that was true what part of "pennies" do you not understand

Anyway fuck Obama, but at least we'll be blowing up some evil.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 7, 2014)

1mmortal 1tachi said:


> .
> 
> The united states main problem in iraq and afghanistan has been the same over the last 10 years: a severe lack of planning.  There was no exit strategy, no clear goals laid out, no effort made to resolve things that needed resolving.
> 
> Air strikes without some type of comprehensive planning and goal oriented strategy won't make a difference.  It doesn't amount to much more than the united states flushing cash down a toilet while Putin applauds from the sidelines.


Sure.

Mostly though, they need to buy time for the Iraqi government to get their shit together. And some airstrikes to prevent further incursion is a pretty cheap way to do just that.

If Iraq can get Maliki the fuck out of the way and put together a national unity government, they should be able to handle ISIS themselves.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 8, 2014)

Im impressed, hopefully this will route ISIS and allow our incompetent Iraqis to retake their shit.


----------



## Pineapples (Aug 8, 2014)

Goof for those people stuck in the mountains. Hopefully the supplies reach them quickly, and that the airstrikes don't hit unintended targets. These strikes won't fully stop their suffering, but hopefully it'll give them time for some pause and rest.


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 8, 2014)

Is lack of news coverage necessarily a bad thing though? Does it really make westen countries vastly more likely to help, and how much does media coverage boost ISIS recuitment?


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 8, 2014)

> Iraq crisis: UK rules out military intervention after US announces possible air strikes against Isis militants
> 
> 
> Fatal error: You have reached the browser stylesheet limit (31)Fatal error: Theme CSS could not loadDavid Cameron has called for international help for trapped Yazidis
> ...


This is unfortunate, IMO. I'm not sure whether intervening in Syria would have been a good idea but IS right now really need stopping, or at least slowing down. But getting public support for this was always going to be hard because this is literally another Iraq.


----------



## Akatora (Aug 8, 2014)

It doesn't have to be all that, destroy their millitary caravans that they openly brag about, and get their opponents some space to work with.


----------



## Seto Kaiba (Aug 8, 2014)

Taco said:


> Ah, the good ol "convert or die"
> 
> Obama's being a little unrealistic when he says the only way for there to be peace in Iraq is for all Iraqi communities to work together lol. There's a very clear problem in the area.



It seems like for some now, it's convert THEN die. Because they are killing those who convert anyway...


----------



## zenieth (Aug 8, 2014)

About time they started doing something.

ISIS really doesn't need any more momentum especially considering everybody else is busy looking over at Gaza


----------



## Hand Banana (Aug 8, 2014)

*U.S. airstrikes begin on ISIS militants in Iraq*



> U.S. airstrikes begin on ISIS militants in Iraq
> By Jim Sciutto, Ben Brumfield and Catherine E. Shoichet, CNN
> updated 9:41 AM EDT, Fri August 8, 2014
> 
> ...


----------



## Mael (Aug 8, 2014)

Thank God.

I was beginning to worry that no one would pull the trigger.  This is hopefully just the start and despite some logical points on why we need to stay the fuck out of the Middle East and let nature run its course, sometimes the inaction of others in the face of evil can be just as bad.

Two other things need to happen here:
1. Intensive drone strikes to hamper any and all ISIS operations to the point they'll be like those in Pakistan continuously hiding because up there are Predators waiting to launch a Hellfire right at them if they so much as rip a loud fart.

2. Arming the Kurds.  We've already seen the follies of arming Sunni and Shia groups and the latter is already getting its goods through Iran.  The Kurds have proven themselves to be competent, stable, and more importantly not a bunch of fucking savages hiding behind religion to excuse mass executions and forced conversions.  It may piss off some Arab states but honestly?  The Kurds actually want to help themselves and are willing to fight for it.  All the more power to them.


----------



## Gunners (Aug 8, 2014)

A spanking was long overdue.


----------



## Hand Banana (Aug 8, 2014)

I didn't like how he spelled _authorize_.


----------



## Wesley (Aug 8, 2014)

Air strikes don't work.


----------



## Mael (Aug 8, 2014)

Wesley said:


> Air strikes don't work.



Care to elaborate further?

If you're going to speak of the necessity of ground operations, please remember that this is a relief effort for ground forces in Iraq that includes the Iraqi Army elements and more importantly the Kurdish peshmerga.  We're not putting boots on the ground for this shit again.


----------



## Hand Banana (Aug 8, 2014)

I'm glad we aren't. Effectively hit their supply lines and move on.


----------



## Axl Low (Aug 8, 2014)

let's hope the bombs and missiles were coated in pigs blood
deny our enemies life on earth
and life in heaven
terrorize the terrorists


----------



## zenieth (Aug 8, 2014)

Mael said:


> Care to elaborate further?
> 
> If you're going to speak of the necessity of ground operations, please remember that this is a relief effort for ground forces in Iraq that includes the Iraqi Army elements and more importantly the Kurdish peshmerga.  We're not putting boots on the ground for this shit again.



They're far too entrenched for drone bombings to be an effective deterrent for the movement and their continued operations.

Considering the fact that they're a force roughly equal to the Iraqi army, Guerrillas, and not in real need of resupplying from outside sources.

Those drones better know where the fuck they're bombing all the time.


----------



## Jin-E (Aug 8, 2014)

To put a real dent on ISIS, you have to strike in Syria as well. Hopefully it won't be a repeat of the whack-a-mole play that has been going on in the Afghanistan-Pakistan border for the last 10 years.


----------



## Mael (Aug 8, 2014)

zenieth said:


> They're far too entrenched for drone bombings to be an effective deterrent for the movement and their continued operations.
> 
> Considering the fact that they're a force roughly equal to the Iraqi army, Guerrillas, and not in real need of resupplying from outside sources.
> 
> Those drones better know where the fuck they're bombing all the time.



Entrenched?  Are you serious?

These fuckers are on the move constantly sweeping into towns and any militia/military enclave they can find.


----------



## zenieth (Aug 8, 2014)

Entrenched as in they're deeply rooted in Iraq now.

I don't mean entrenched as in actually bunkered up. Come on, mael. Really?


----------



## Mael (Aug 8, 2014)

zenieth said:


> Entrenched as in they're deeply rooted in Iraq now.
> 
> I don't mean entrenched as in actually bunkered up. Come on, mael. Really?



Can't really hide behind implied language, dude.

And no they're only really concentrated in one location.  They still haven't really gone deep into Kurd and Shia territory yet.  Right now is the time to strike when they're in offense.


----------



## zenieth (Aug 8, 2014)

Mael said:


> Can't really hide behind implied language, dude.
> 
> And no* they're only really concentrated in one location*.  They still haven't really gone deep into Kurd and Shia territory yet.  Right now is the time to strike when they're in offense.



lolwut



This was back in June


----------



## Mael (Aug 8, 2014)

zenieth said:


> lolwut
> 
> 
> 
> This was back in June



That's still not the majority of the Kurd/Shia areas including the Southern region.

Remember that ISIS is also highly mobile so what you see is very fluid.


----------



## Black Leg Sanji (Aug 8, 2014)

Murika gets it done.



Mael said:


> Thank God.
> 
> I was beginning to worry that no one would pull the trigger.



Wonder why EU didnt do it

Are we really this weak military


----------



## zenieth (Aug 8, 2014)

I know they're highly mobile and have yet to touch Shia and Kurd territory.

I'm contesting them being largely in one location.

I mean sure, if you consider almost half the country one location.


----------



## Chainwave (Aug 8, 2014)

I just hope the Murika will be able to differentiate between the Sunni Muslims, and the IS Sunni Muslims.


----------



## Mael (Aug 8, 2014)

zenieth said:


> I know they're highly mobile and have yet to touch Shia and Kurd territory.
> 
> I'm contesting them being largely in one location.
> 
> I mean sure, if you consider almost half the country one location.



I understand what you're getting at, but my point is that they're smaller in number and have to go between Points A-E to link up and form operations.  The roads between these areas are small yet long and for them to continue operations in their religious zeal makes them prime targets for air strikes.

You wait until the next offensives against the Kurds or their encroachment on Yazidis and watch the fireworks light the savages up.


----------



## Mael (Aug 8, 2014)

Black Leg Sanji said:


> Wonder why EU didnt do it
> 
> Are we really this weak military



To play Devil's Advocate, the EU never really had a hand in it and they also have Russian douchers to worry about more.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 8, 2014)

Black Leg Sanji said:


> Murika gets it done.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Britain, France, Spain and Italy could theoretically do it. Given those four having aircraft carriers.

However probably none of them were in or near position to do so so it'd be rather late coming.

Also a lot of it is political will. For one since the federal state of EU is incredibly weak, they really cant say, hey lets go do this and it will be done (The POTUS has far more military flexibility than the President of the Euripean Parlaiament/Comission/Council. Really, the EU is a fucking mess). It'd probably take months in Brussels being debated.

Any of those four states could do so as well. But again, that would probably require more political will than European states actually have.

Finally, they probably consider it largely America's mess so America should fix it.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 8, 2014)

Black Leg Sanji said:


> Wonder why EU didnt do it
> 
> Are we really this weak military



It's not an issue of ableness as much as it is an issue of willingness actually. 

To answer your question though, any EU member-state in possession of aircraft carriers or air refueling aircrafts should be able to pull off similar missions.


----------



## Goobtachi (Aug 8, 2014)

Good news, these fuckers need to be destroyed...


----------



## Blue (Aug 8, 2014)

Sunuvmann said:


> Britain, France, Spain and Italy could theoretically do it. Given those four having aircraft carriers.



European aircraft carriers aren't really aircraft carriers sunny, they carry helicopters and crap jets and have no real range

The UK is building the first actual supercarriers outside the US, and the first won't be done until next year or something.


----------



## Hand Banana (Aug 8, 2014)

Charles de Gaulle


----------



## Jin-E (Aug 8, 2014)

Of course, a US offensive wouldn't be complete without a nutter going on a hysterical tirade:



Some gems from the article:


> So what should we do to help Iraq stave off an invasion by ISIS, which is now holding some 40,000 Yazidis in the northern part of the country?
> 
> The answer is: _nothing_. Not every problem has a solution. Not every mistake ? in this case the mistake of invading Iraq in the first place ? can be rectified. Our delusions of being a "superpower" have led us to believe we can do anything ? but the very word has led us astray: Uncle Sam isn?t Superman, a mythical being who could fly so fast he could break the time barrier and go back into the past, preventing disasters made inevitable by human folly. We must pay for our folly ? and, unfortunately, so must many others.
> 
> ...






> One might argue we have a moral obligation to get the Yazidis to safety because, after all, didn?t our actions place them in danger to begin with? This argument fails miserably, however, when we ask ourselves who is in the best position to actually do something to aid them. The Turks and Iraq?s other neighbors ? and, yes,* I mean Iran* ? are in a much better position to play the "savior" role than is Washington, for reasons that aren?t just geographical.
> 
> ISIS would like nothing better than to portray themselves as taking on the Americans: it would do wonders for their recruiting around the world. It would also unite Iraqi Sunnis under the banner of ISIS.
> 
> Ever since the "dead-enders" Donald Rumsfeld disdained beat the pants off the Americans and their Iraqi allies, our strategy in the region has been to tilt back toward the Sunnis in their religious war against the rival Shi?ites. From Libya to Egypt to Syria we sought to unite the Sunni jihadists against what we imagined was the main danger: Iran, the epicenter of Shi?ism. This tactic has backfired, and badly, in Iraq ? and it isn?t just the Bush administration that bears the brunt of the blame. This was the strategic conception behind Hillary Clinton?s stewardship of the State Department, as implemented in Libya, Egypt, and Syria: she quit when her scheme to intervene in Syria was aborted.






> It remains to be seen if this "humanitarian disaster" ploy is going to deceive the American people into giving Washington yet another blank check to "save" Iraq. My suspicion is that whatever emotional-laden hysteria the War Party succeeds in whipping up will be short-lived indeed: as soon as the people of this country see the same neocons telling us why we need to re-invade Iraq an awful feeling of deja-vu will overcome them ? and Congress will be deluged with protest, just as they were when Obama decided he wanted to bomb Syria.





> Remember that the Kurds are Israel?s best ? and only ? allies in the region. Israeli trainers have been integrated into the pershmerga, and the first oil extracted from the newly-Kurdified regions of collapsing Iraq went straight to the Jewish state. As related on this episode of the Scott Horton Show, ISIS is at the gates of Irbil, the Kurdish regional government?s capital city. This is why we hear the War Party loudly demanding US military intervention ? not to save the Yazidis, but to save a key Israeli ally.
> 
> As I said at the very outset of America?s misadventures in Iraq, the Iraq war was fought for Israel?s sake: our re-entry will repeat the same scenario. Their long-range plan of destabilizing the region ? giving the Jewish state Lebensraum to expand and fulfill the old Zionist dream of a kingdom spanning the distance between the Nile and the Euphrates ? is now entering phase two. Their amen corner is now demanding the US intervene. Will they succeed. Stay tuned to this space ?.


----------



## Distance (Aug 8, 2014)

The things quoted above aren't completely out there. Of course, the opinion of doing nothing is not going to persuade that many people, I believe.


----------



## Jin-E (Aug 8, 2014)

Distance said:


> The things quoted above aren't completely out there. Of course, the opinion of doing nothing is not going to persuade that many people, I believe.



Banging on about a mythical all reaching "War Party", claiming that ISIS would not slaughter these people because it wouldn't be "very good public relations", suggesting that US is falsely using humanitarism in order to "rescue" a Israeli ally, claiming that Iran is in a better position to intervene and would not be as divisive as the US etc etc. Oh, and not forgetting the thinly disguised anti-semitism seeping through the article.

Yeah, i do believe he is pretty far out there personally.


----------



## x5exotic (Aug 8, 2014)

Yes U.S! Pretend that this isn't your work, and now act as the savior.


Can't believe anyone buys this shit.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 8, 2014)

This would be a good excuse to attack Syrian military hardware, under the grounds of  preventing them from falling into ISIS control 

Hopefully these strikes escalate.



> Yes U.S! Pretend that this isn't your work, and now act as the savior.
> 
> 
> Can't believe anyone buys this shit.



Actually ISIS is the worlds work, since everyone was against attacking Syria where ISIS is getting its military equipment, so thank Russia, China and to a lesser extent the EU since they are pansy ass. And in no small part to Iraq's sheer incompetence.


----------



## Mael (Aug 8, 2014)

x5exotic said:


> Yes U.S! Pretend that this isn't your work, and now act as the savior.
> 
> 
> Can't believe anyone buys this shit.



You're still around?

First off ISIS came from the instability in Syria thanks to Iran and Russia.  Second, don't you have some more shitty Godwin accusations to use?


----------



## x5exotic (Aug 8, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> This would be a good excuse to attack Syrian military hardware, under the grounds of  preventing them from falling into ISIS control
> 
> Hopefully these strikes escalate.
> 
> ...



Yeah, incompetence thanks to America.
That's the thing. America invaded the country, put it in the shit it is now, caused more internal troubles and left it to people they knew wouldn't handle this shit.

This whole thing is the intentional doing of the U.S


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 8, 2014)

no. This whole thing is due to the world refusing to deal with Syria while it had the chance. The lies squarely with Russia, China and to a lesser extent the EU since they lack backbone.

We wanted to stop this but the world said no.


----------



## Mael (Aug 8, 2014)

x5exotic said:


> Yeah, incompetence thanks to America.
> That's the thing. America invaded the country, put it in the shit it is now, caused more internal troubles and left it to people they knew wouldn't handle this shit.
> 
> This whole thing is the intentional doing of the U.S



ISIS (ISIL) formed in Syria.

Syria wasn't touched by the US.

Even if Saddam was still in power, ISIS would still find ways to attack and get through.


----------



## x5exotic (Aug 8, 2014)

@cheldyra Except the part where ISIS isn't independent, For people to be so naive as to think U.S is just being nice.


----------



## Kafuka de Vil (Aug 8, 2014)

America apologists in this thread. 

Obama withdraw all American troops from Iraq in late 2011 despite it clearly being pointed out prior the country was inevitably going to fall into anarchy as soon as the US departed after they started a war that had destabilised the country in the first place.

The US shares the greatest burden of blame, get over it.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 8, 2014)

The U.S. military has begun a second round of airstrikes against ISIS "in area of Irbil," according to U.S. officials. 

Not much info out at this time.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 8, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> The U.S. military has begun a second round of airstrikes against ISIS "in area of Irbil," according to U.S. officials.
> 
> Not much info out at this time.



Kill them all and let Allah sort em out


----------



## Overwatch (Aug 8, 2014)

MbS said:


> America apologists in this thread.
> 
> Obama withdraw all American troops from Iraq in late 2011 despite it clearly being pointed out prior the country was inevitably going to fall into anarchy as soon as the US departed after they started a war that had destabilised the country in the first place.
> 
> The US shares the greatest burden of blame, get over it.



It's either this or letting the ISIS put people's heads on poles for the foreseeable future. And I say this as someone who opposed the invasion of Iraq.


----------



## Wolfgang Grimmer (Aug 8, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> The U.S. military has begun a second round of airstrikes against ISIS "in area of Irbil," according to U.S. officials.
> 
> Not much info out at this time.



they just droned an ISIS convoy


----------



## x5exotic (Aug 8, 2014)

Overwatch said:


> It's either this or letting the ISIS put people's heads on poles for the foreseeable future. And I say this as someone who opposed the invasion of Iraq.




Well naturally. Of course this is a point of no return, and it's ultimately good for the civilians that they are doing this, but this was not supposed to happen in the first place,  they are directly involved in this.
And even after this is over, It'll create another christian vs muslim problem that'll stay with us quite some time.


----------



## The Pink Ninja (Aug 8, 2014)

Should have started this weeks ago when ISIS revealed what a bunch of bastards they were and started to destabilize an entire state.

I don't think they can be defeated by air strikes alone but it will give their many enemies a better to to defeat them. And frankly given their nature I don't think we can have any peace with them.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 8, 2014)

^and had Obama acted in Syria 2 years ago ISIS wouldn't even exist right now.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 8, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> ^and had Obama acted in Syria 2 years ago ISIS wouldn't even exist right now.



Been saying this for awhile now, but a lot of people don't like the fact that the world refusal to intervene has caused this. And also big shout outs to Russia and China.


----------



## Zaru (Aug 8, 2014)

After seeing videos of ISIS doing mass executions, the comparative lack of coverage almost disturbs me as much as the videos themselves.


----------



## sadated_peon (Aug 8, 2014)

MbS said:


> America apologists in this thread.
> 
> Obama withdraw all American troops from Iraq in late 2011 despite it clearly being pointed out prior the country was inevitably going to fall into anarchy as soon as the US departed after they started a war that had destabilised the country in the first place.
> 
> The US shares the greatest burden of blame, get over it.



The Iraq government demanded that US pull out combat troops from Iraq. For Obama to keep troops in would have meant occupying the country. 

If the US had kept troops in you would have attacked them for it. Instead you are attacking them for pulling troops out. 

Your criticism, as always, is just feckless bitching.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 8, 2014)

Blue said:


> European aircraft carriers aren't really aircraft carriers sunny, they carry helicopters and crap jets and have no real range
> 
> The UK is building the first actual supercarriers outside the US, and the first won't be done until next year or something.




That's true actually. Only Charles de Gaulle can be considered as somehow (remotely) close to the league of the US supercarriers. 

The Italians and the Spanish have Harriers on their carriers. A squadron on the Spanish carrier and a squadron on each of the two Italian carriers. 

I'm not very sure if the Harriers can actually travel so deep in Iraq, throw their bombs and come back with fuel left. They should be able to, but they must use drop tanks. I suspect that the F/A-18s here used drop tanks as well. The Harrier can carry much less weight though so having drop tanks would seriously limit the number of bombs it can carry.

To my knowledge the Charles de Gaulle can carry a squadron of Super Etendards and a squadron of Rafales. The Rafale should easily be able to carry on that mission, it would probably not even need drop tanks.

So the French are the only ones able to perform this mission from an aircraft carrier as effectively (if not more, since they can carry more weight and have greater range) than the US has done just now. The Italians and the Spanish should be able to replicate a similar feat but it would be less effective due to the limited capabilities of their aircrafts.


----------



## Savior (Aug 8, 2014)

Mael said:


> You're still around?
> 
> First off ISIS came from the instability in Syria thanks to Iran and Russia.  Second, don't you have some more shitty Godwin accusations to use?




Get real kid. None of this would be happening of the U.S. hadn't invaded Iraq under false pretenses.


----------



## hcheng02 (Aug 9, 2014)

Savior said:


> Get real kid. None of this would be happening of the U.S. hadn't invaded Iraq under false pretenses.



Yes, I'm sure Iraq would be much more peaceful and stabler if Saddam Hussein was around. Its not like that guy brutally oppressed the Shiites and Kurds or killed tens of thousands off people who opposed him. Leaving dictators alone to deal with Arab Spring protests always leads to better and more peaceful results. Just look at Syria.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 9, 2014)

Alright. It looks like the two bombs dropped were GBU-54s (which is basically a smart variant of the Mk 82) dropped from F/A-18 Super Hornets operating from the USS George Bush carrier. The Super Hornets have the ability to fire laser-guided bombs using their own sensors without the need for ground forces to designate the target, although having a ground crew is usually a more reliable way. The attack destroyed a mobile artillery piece (basically an artillery piece carried by a truck) used by IS.

The second strike involved a Predator UAV firing a Hellfire missile at an Islamic State mortar position.

The third strike involved four aicrafts (the same type as before) dropping eight bombs (probably the same type as before) at a seven-vehicle convoy and another IS mortar position.

Yesterday Iraqi goverment forces delivered ammunition to Kurdish forces stationed at Irbil. The Kurdish forces requested further deliveries of ammunition and weapons, including AK-47 and mortars.

Early Saturday, three planes dropped 72 bundles of supplies that included more than 28,000 meals and 1,500 gallons of water in an airdrop mission (this is the second one, the US performed a similar mission yesterday as well) to civilian refugees trapped in the Sinjar mountains. The flight was escorted by two F/A-18 Super Hornets.

sources: washington post


----------



## Jake CENA (Aug 9, 2014)

America already bombed Iraq. Its like America is willing to use their arsenal just to showboat to other countries and basically tell them that they have a larger dick.


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Aug 9, 2014)

TerminaTHOR said:


> America already bombed Iraq. Its like America is willing to use their arsenal just to showboat to other countries and basically tell them that they have a larger dick.


...are you serious? America is bombing ISIS. Aka the Terrorist Organization which is too hardcore for even _Al Qaeda._


----------



## Jake CENA (Aug 9, 2014)

They should just let them kill each other then bombed the surviving terrorists afterwards.


----------



## Taco (Aug 9, 2014)

TerminaTHOR said:


> They should just let them kill each other then bombed the surviving terrorists afterwards.



Except theyre trying to kill 40k Yazidis who didnt want to convert to Islam lol


----------



## Jake CENA (Aug 9, 2014)

Sigh people and their stupid religion.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 9, 2014)

Taco said:


> Except theyre trying to kill 40k Yazidis who didnt want to convert to Islam lol



They would have killed them anyways, just like the Christians they force to convert, then beheaded them. ISIS really is a quality act, a gift from Russia, China, and Syria to the rest of the world.


----------



## Wolfgang Grimmer (Aug 9, 2014)

Hozukimaru said:


> Alright. It looks like the two bombs dropped were GBU-54s (which is basically a smart variant of the Mk 82) dropped from F/A-18 Super Hornets operating from the USS George Bush carrier. The Super Hornets have the ability to fire laser-guided bombs using their own sensors without the need for ground forces to designate the target, although having a ground crew is usually a more reliable way. The attack destroyed a mobile artillery piece (basically an artillery piece carried by a truck) used by IS.
> 
> The second strike involved a Predator UAV firing a Hellfire missile at an Islamic State mortar position.
> 
> ...


good       news


----------



## Mael (Aug 9, 2014)

TerminaTHOR said:


> Sigh people and their stupid religion.



2/10 troll attempt


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 9, 2014)

hcheng02 said:


> Yes, I'm sure Iraq would be much more peaceful and stabler if Saddam Hussein was around.



Until here you actually made sense. 

Saddam Hussein was an evil friend, but he was contained and so was the shiite/sunni hatred. 




> Its not like that guy brutally oppressed the Shiites and Kurds or killed tens of thousands off people who opposed him. Leaving dictators alone to deal with Arab Spring protests always leads to better and more peaceful results. Just look at Syria.



 Srlsy? You call the support of the Rebels, including radical groups (e.g. IS), by Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Turkey and the West "leaving alone"? If Assad hadn't been supported by Iran, the Hezbollah and Russia, the IS would be even stronger today with more land under their control, all thanks to the anti-Assad coalition.

But of course the west could've just singled out one secular rebel leader (some former officer) instead and helped him take Assad's seat. I'm sure it's almost impossible that he would've turned out as a cruel dictator himself, as so many others you supported did.... but hey, if that were to happen you already know the drill: just declare him as evil and invade 

@Mael: Funny how you seem to have forgotten all about you're own "the lesser of two evils" credo when it comes to this matter.


----------



## Sabotage (Aug 9, 2014)

Hozukimaru said:


> Alright. It looks like the two bombs dropped were GBU-54s (which is basically a smart variant of the Mk 82) dropped from F/A-18 Super Hornets operating from the USS George Bush carrier. The Super Hornets have the ability to fire laser-guided bombs using their own sensors without the need for ground forces to designate the target, although having a ground crew is usually a more reliable way. The attack destroyed a mobile artillery piece (basically an artillery piece carried by a truck) used by IS.
> 
> The second strike involved a Predator UAV firing a Hellfire missile at an Islamic aState mortar position.
> 
> ...





Videos of the bombings. Hope there's more to come.


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 9, 2014)

TerminaTHOR said:


> America already bombed Iraq. Its like America is willing to use their arsenal just to showboat to other countries and basically tell them that they have a larger dick.



Read article in the OP. Unless you are counting IS itself as a country, they were invited.


----------



## Cardboard Tube Knight (Aug 9, 2014)

TerminaTHOR said:


> They should just let them kill each other then bombed the surviving terrorists afterwards.



Oh man, so much edge. I hope you've protected yourself from cuts.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 9, 2014)




----------



## Chelydra (Aug 9, 2014)

Oh the horror, months of nearly risk free attacks on an organization that richly deserves it.


----------



## Jin-E (Aug 10, 2014)

> Reuters) - Islamic State militants have killed at least 500 members of Iraq's Yazidi minority in northern Iraq, burying some of their victims alive and kidnapping hundreds of women, a Baghdad government minister said on Sunday.
> 
> The insurgents' advance through northern Iraq has forced tens of thousands to flee, threatened the capital of the Kurdish autonomous region and provoked the first U.S. air strikes in the area since Washington withdrew troops from Iraq in 2011.
> 
> ...



http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/10/us-iraq-security-idUSKBN0G808J20140810

Christ.....


----------



## Ennoea (Aug 10, 2014)

Iraq really turned in to a clusterfuck. For how long will Muslims the word over sympathise with these psychotic nutjobs?? Kill em all I say.


----------



## Saishin (Aug 10, 2014)

*Iraq crisis: live
Islamic State militants 'bury 500 Yazidis, including women and children, in mass grave' - follow latest Iraq updates*


----------



## Saishin (Aug 10, 2014)

*Iraq crisis: live
Islamic State militants 'bury 500 Yazidis, including women and children, in mass grave' - follow latest Iraq updates*


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 10, 2014)

Jin-E said:


> http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/10/us-iraq-security-idUSKBN0G808J20140810
> 
> Christ.....



Where are all the protests across Europe?


----------



## Zaru (Aug 10, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Where are all the protests across Europe?



I sure would love to see some more reactions to the shit going on in Iraq since it's immensely more disturbing than whatever is happening in Gaza, but you won't get many "protests" with a scenario like that.

Israel is a widely accepted democratic state that many have trade relations with, which means that they think it can be affected by "protests" in other countries. Obviously doesn't work much, but they think it's "worth it to try".

ISIS is a glorified group of terrorist nutjobs that don't give a single shit about anything international other than posting threatening twitter pictures from the front of the White House. The West doesn't condone them and the USA are already bombing them - what would protests change? Drive their own countries into an intervention war? I think most of them hate the very idea of that.


----------



## Seto Kaiba (Aug 10, 2014)

I don't think the protests are driven by such a logical basis, at least as it pertains to the common individual. Politically such pressuring my have that rationale. I think Gaza is more or less, the "flavor of the month", and a welcome distraction. I do recall when the Sudan genocide was going on, similar attention was diverted from it in favor of the Israeli-Palestine conflict too.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 10, 2014)

Zaru said:


> I sure would love to see some more reactions to the shit going on in Iraq since it's immensely more disturbing than whatever is happening in Gaza, but you won't get many "protests" with a scenario like that.
> 
> Israel is a widely accepted democratic state that many have trade relations with, which means that they think it can be affected by "protests" in other countries. Obviously doesn't work much, but they think it's "worth it to try".
> 
> ISIS is a glorified group of terrorist nutjobs that don't give a single shit about anything international other than posting threatening twitter pictures from the front of the White House. *The West doesn't condone them and the USA are already bombing them - what would protests change?* Drive their own countries into an intervention war? I think most of them hate the very idea of that.



Pretty much this. Although it's hardly worth wasting so many words explaining this to the Arab/Islam-hating/Israel-wanking crowd. It's not like they actually care to understand their critics.


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 10, 2014)

Son of Goku said:


> Pretty much this. Although it's hardly worth wasting so many words explaining this to the Arab/Islam-hating/Israel-wanking crowd. It's not like they actually care to understand their critics.



I generally think this too- the cafe includes threads about someone stealing a sheep or something that seem to gain a vast amount of comment and condemnation but no-one ever tries to compare that to the situation in iraq.

The exception would be where the person themselves draws the comparison, like here, for example. Obviously the potential genocide of the Yazidis brings the Israel-Gaza conflict to insignificance.


----------



## Cardboard Tube Knight (Aug 10, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Where are all the protests across Europe?



Maybe we can tell people that they're secret Jews so they get angry?


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 10, 2014)

jetwaterluffy1 said:


> I generally think this too- the cafe includes threads about someone stealing a sheep or something that seem to gain a vast amount of comment and condemnation but no-one ever tries to compare that to the situation in iraq.
> 
> The exception would be where the person themselves draws the comparison, like here, for example. Obviously the potential genocide of the Yazidis brings the Israel-Gaza conflict to insignificance.



True. And Yazidis ain't arabs, nor muslims, nor do their interests collide with "ours". Ergo: Good poster-victims worth rescuing and playing hero.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 10, 2014)

Zaru said:


> I sure would love to see some more reactions to the shit going on in Iraq since it's immensely more disturbing than whatever is happening in Gaza, but you won't get many "protests" with a scenario like that.
> 
> Israel is a widely accepted democratic state that many have trade relations with, which means that they think it can be affected by "protests" in other countries. Obviously doesn't work much, but they think it's "worth it to try".
> 
> ISIS is a glorified group of terrorist nutjobs that don't give a single shit about anything international other than posting threatening twitter pictures from the front of the White House. The West doesn't condone them and the USA are already bombing them - what would protests change? Drive their own countries into an intervention war? I think most of them hate the very idea of that.



Meh, there are tons in protests against Israel in places hostile to Israel. That doesn't explain it.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 10, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Meh, there are tons in protests against Israel in places hostile to Israel. That doesn't explain it.



Sure it does. The governments of those places are powerless, their hostility and complaints are meaningless to Israel. Therefore their people still feel the need to protest against Israel AND its powerful western allies, whose favors and good will Israel cannot do without.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 10, 2014)

Son of Goku said:


> Sure it does. The governments of those places are powerless, their hostility and complaints are meaningless to Israel. Therefore their people still feel the need to protest against Israel AND its powerful western allies, whose favors and good will Israel cannot do without.



So you're claiming all these massive vicious (and often racist/violent) protests against Israel are rational and they in fact care about the situation in Iraq just as much? Lol, okay.

You have no ground to stand on to suggest that people worldwide even give 10% the shit about Iraq/Syria as they do with Israel. Dead Muslims only matter if Jews kill them.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 10, 2014)

*sigh*, like I said before: A waste of words.




> Obama is bombing the friends of his Saudi allies – and the enemies of the Assad regime in Syria, by the way – but won’t say so.



@jetwaterluffy1  Thanks, great read!


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 10, 2014)

On a completely off topic subject the comments on the cnn news pages about ISIS are claiming that they are in fact secret Jews that work for America and Israel


----------



## Pineapples (Aug 10, 2014)

I truly feel sorry for the Yazidis and similarly affected groups. I wonder how psychologically warped these individuals (ISIS) mindsets are. Is there fervor for their religion at such heights that they are able to continue waking up in the morning and killing/burring people alive.


----------



## Zaru (Aug 10, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> On a completely off topic subject the comments on the cnn news pages about ISIS are claiming that they are in fact secret Jews that work for America and Israel



Don't you know? Their leader was trained by the CIA and/or Israel. All the fringe right wing websites say so, so it has to be true!


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 10, 2014)

Zaru said:


> Don't you know? Their leader was trained by the CIA and/or Israel. All the fringe right wing websites say so, so it has to be true!



It's funny because all the pro-Assad propagandists are talking about how ISIS is some Mossad/CIA conspiracy when in reality Baghdadi got his support from Assad's regime back when he first started out in terrorism. Syria supported Al Qaeda in Iraq from 2003 to 2009ish because they were killing Americans and Kurds.

Right now ISIS is a Qatari creation though. Saudi support is minimal, they prefer the Nursa Front instead which is actually fighting ISIS in Syria. Qatar has seen to it in recent years however to spread "political Islam" wherever they find it, be it Hamas and Islamic Jihad in Gaza, the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, and now the Islamic State. Qatar has become one of the most damaging countries in the region.


----------



## Wolfgang Grimmer (Aug 10, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> On a completely off topic subject the comments on the cnn news pages about ISIS are claiming that they are in fact secret Jews that work for America and Israel



ISIS = Israeli Secret Intelligence Service

there's a lot of more gems from RT facebook commenters


----------



## Distance (Aug 10, 2014)

Conspiracy theories aside, all these hostile factions in the Middle East are the after effects of the United States and Soviet Union "Cold War", which the U.S government and its Intelligence Agency have taken insignificant steps to dealing with since the disintegration of the Soviet Union.


----------



## Seto Kaiba (Aug 10, 2014)

That is only like, 15% of the story.


----------



## Jin-E (Aug 10, 2014)

Some disturbing reports that Maliki has gone full retard now:



> BAGHDAD: Iraqi police, army and counter-terrorism forces were deployed in unusually high numbers across strategic locations in Baghdad overnight, security sources said Monday.
> 
> "There is a huge security presence, police and army, especially around the Green Zone," the highly-protected district that houses Iraq's key institutions, a high-ranking police officer told AFP.






> BAGHDAD (AP) -- Iraq's Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki says he will file a legal complaint against the country's new president for committing "a clear constitutional violation."
> 
> Al-Maliki made the announcement in a surprise speech late Sunday night, plunging the government into a political crisis at a time it is battling advances by Islamic State militants.
> 
> ...



This could be overblown, but it could also signal some kind of coup.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 10, 2014)

Jin-E said:


> Some disturbing reports that Maliki has gone full retard now:
> 
> 
> This could be overblown, but it could also signal some kind of coup.



He did purge the Iraqi army of most of its more competent officers with loyal yes men, which was part of the reason ISIS' initial campaign was so successful, so I can see that happening if the parliament nominates a replacement. Here's hoping Iraq has an Al-Sisi to counter that from happening.

On a higher note,


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 10, 2014)

Maliki is just doing whatever the Iranians tell him to by this point. Though the IRGC troops in Iraq have been unable to stop ISIS thus far.


----------



## Jin-E (Aug 10, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Maliki is just doing whatever the Iranians tell him to by this point. Though the IRGC troops in Iraq have been unable to stop ISIS thus far.



Last i heard, Soleymani(The Iranian Quds general) tried to "convince" Maliki to leave. Without much success obviously.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 10, 2014)

Solemani is treated as the Iranian superman since saving Assad but he's struggling a lot in Iraq I've noticed. Iraqi Army doesn't have the heavy firepower and ability to wantonly massacre its domestic opposition like Assad does, also Hezbollah is too overstretched to open up a 2nd front in Syria (well more like a 3rd front, because they still fight Sunni militias in Lebanon lately).


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 10, 2014)

On a side note, if Maliki goes, who do they nominate to replace him? I've heard some mention Chalabi, who would be just as bad. Allawi's name has also come up a few times.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 10, 2014)

They need a moderate Shia who isn't an Iranian puppet. It's why so many Sunni's are joining ISIS.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 10, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> They need a moderate Shia who isn't an Iranian puppet. It's why so many Sunni's are joining ISIS.


Last I heard Iran was pressuring that very thing.

Its pretty much all just Malaki's ego now.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 10, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> They need a moderate Shia who isn't an Iranian puppet. It's why so many Sunni's are joining ISIS.



Allawi seems to be suitably moderate, though his past history as a Baathist may be unpalatable.



Sunuvmann said:


> Its pretty much all just Malaki's ego now.



That and he pretty much knows if he steps down, he's a dead man.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 10, 2014)

Everyone who is not named "Malaki" wants Malaki to step down. ISIS wants it, Iran wants it and even the West wants it.

The problem is that everyone except from ISIS does not want a theocratic sunni oppresive regime to take over in Maliki's place. So Maliki is most certainly the lesser of two evils.

Fighting against ISIS and replacing Maliki with a moderate should be top priorities.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 10, 2014)

Kagekatsu said:


> That and he pretty much knows if he steps down, he's a dead man.


Can't he do the authoritarian retirement plan and ollie out to Qatar?

Or since shi'a Tehran?


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 10, 2014)

Maliki deploying troops to the Green Zone and put many officials under House Arrest, perhaps to put down a coup attempt by President Masum.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 11, 2014)

ISIS mass-executing 1,500 captured Iraqi teens. The kids are all screaming shit about devotion to Islam and how much they hate Maliki to try and get spared. This is one of the craziest vids I've ever seen.


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Aug 11, 2014)

1,500 in one DAY? And people are bitching about Israel's death toll of one month of fighting?!


----------



## Rabbit and Rose (Aug 11, 2014)

I want world war with japan so we can haz many war babies and then we become one.


----------



## |)/-\\/\/|\| (Aug 11, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> ISIS mass-executing 1,500 captured Iraqi teens. The kids are all screaming shit about devotion to Islam and how much they hate Maliki to try and get spared. This is one of the craziest vids I've ever seen.



And what do you think happens to sunni revolutionists (which can also include "teens" captured by other Iraqi Shia extremists militias? You would just wish it's a bullet to the head. Yet no one gave a fuck.


----------



## Jagger (Aug 11, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> ISIS mass-executing 1,500 captured Iraqi teens. The kids are all screaming shit about devotion to Islam and how much they hate Maliki to try and get spared. This is one of the craziest vids I've ever seen.


That's just fucked up.

I don't have words for this.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 11, 2014)

Time to ramp up the bombing campaign.


----------



## IchLiebe (Aug 11, 2014)

Turn that shit up to 11


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 11, 2014)

> *Iraq President Names Deputy Speaker New PM*
> 
> BAGHDAD, Aug 11 (Reuters) - Iraq's president on Monday asked Haider al-Abadi, the Shi'ite coalition's nominee for prime minister, to form a government, a spokesman for the main Shi'ite coalition said.
> 
> ...




Good news everyone?

Also


> The Godfather and The Matrix are among his favorite movies, according to a Facebook entry.


Well at least he has good taste!


----------



## zenieth (Aug 11, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> ISIS mass-executing 1,500 captured Iraqi teens. The kids are all screaming shit about devotion to Islam and how much they hate Maliki to try and get spared. This is one of the craziest vids I've ever seen.



No offense, but look at the video's origin site.

It's a load of bullshit.


----------



## Mael (Aug 11, 2014)

But do you have the counter to prove that it's complete shit?


----------



## zenieth (Aug 11, 2014)

No blood in the water despite being head shot and immediately thrown in

Zero blood splatter at the lake executions

One handing an AK

Not one close up of any of the headshots.

They're hand tied one moment then they're all not hand tied the next. Like why the fuck would you untie their hands when you're mass executing them?


----------



## zenieth (Aug 11, 2014)

I mean look at that fool pistolling those guys at the lake.

He is pristine as fuck.


----------



## Mael (Aug 11, 2014)

All right I guess that works...I can't view this b/c I'm at work atm.


----------



## Distance (Aug 11, 2014)

So, Iraq is finished?


----------



## Jake CENA (Aug 11, 2014)

The new PM should be an atheist.


----------



## Cardboard Tube Knight (Aug 11, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> ISIS mass-executing 1,500 captured Iraqi teens. The kids are all screaming shit about devotion to Islam and how much they hate Maliki to try and get spared. This is one of the craziest vids I've ever seen.



What the fuck? That doesn't even sound right.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 11, 2014)

Maliki is taking the parliament's decision well



> Iraq's Maliki defiant as new prime minister nominated to succeed him
> 
> Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri Maliki says he will file a legal complaint against the country's new president for committing 'a clear constitutional violation.'
> By PATRICK J. MCDONNELL contact the reporter IraqPoliticsGovernmentElectionsNouri MalikiDemocracyParliament
> ...


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 11, 2014)

>Shia
>Moderate
>PhD in the University of Manchester

Sounds promising.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 12, 2014)

Nothing with Shia sounds promising, since they have been the most troublesome.

Either way the US is stepping up our troop presence on the ground, with advisors.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 12, 2014)

Syrian/Iraqi Kurdish leaders meeting to discuss how to fight ISIS. The one on the right legit is Stalin reincarnated


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 12, 2014)

In looks or policy?


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 12, 2014)

Kurdish Mi-17 helicopter crashed after dropping aid and picking up Yazidi evacuees.

Only the pilot died. Possible causes might have being overloading (like a journalist who was inside the helicopter at the time said) or the pilot's mistake like a Kurdish official said. There was a four-person crew, 20 to 25 Yazidis and two New York Times journalists onboard at the time. Within the safety limit of 30 armed troops + two pilots + one engineer maximum crew that the helicopter can take. Especially thinking the weight difference between your average Yazidi (including women and children) and your average fully armed Russian soldier.

I assume that you have seen this video:

[youtube]HdIEm1s6yhY[/youtube]

This is Vian Dakhil and she was inside the helicopter at the time of the crash as well!


Opinion polls show that the majority of americans support the airstrikes, the democrats possibly slightly even more than the Republicans do. They also show that the general opinion is fully against the involvement of US troops in the fighting but also views negatively the sending of US troops as advisors in the area.

Americans have continued their humanitarian air drops using C-17s and C-130s. The RAF has also used its C-130s for air drops and a few hours ago Tornado jets arrived in Cyprus for surveillance missions to make air drops more accurate. Australia has also offered two of its C-130s to the US for air drop missions.

The US has, in total, conducted 15 airstrikes so far. Reportedly they've also used F-16s and F-15Es for some of them.

I've being trying to find where the hell those came from but apparently they are trying to keep that a secret due to "host-nation sensitivities and operational security," as a CENTCOM official said.

That being said there are quite a few known Air Expeditionary Wings in Qatar, Kuwait, Jordan, Turkey or even Iraq itself that can be used as possible bases of operations.

US forces nearby include B-1 bombers and F-22 fighters that have not being used in the conflict as of yet.

Reportedly some US officers have said that to turn the tide in Iraq would require up to 15,000 US troops.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 12, 2014)

I doubt that, a concerted air campaign should be enough. But we need to step up the pace of these airstrikes, and broaden their scope.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 12, 2014)

And the Iraqi army needs to take a more active role. 

And I forgot to mention that Chinook helicopters have also reportedly arrived in Cyprus in preparation of RAF's aid efforts. They will also carry military equipment gifted from various nations to the Peshmerga.

The US military equipment that was delivered to them was mainly composed of new rifles and bullets. 

ISIS' equipment includes former Iraqi army tanks, humvees, troop carriers and artillery pieces. Peshmerga's equipment is mainly composed of light rifles and light machine guns.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 12, 2014)

However now that airstrikes are underway ISIS will not be able to use those tanks effectively.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 12, 2014)

The thing about ISIS stolen equipment is that while they certainly have a lot of firepower, I doubt they have the parts and know-how to keep those tanks and mobile artillery pieces operational.

Also, looks like Maliki's finally giving up



> 146 COMMENTS
> MIDDLE EAST
> 
> Maliki’s Bid to Keep Power in Iraq Seems to Collapse
> ...


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 12, 2014)

Good now we need to make sure the next leader is not an Iranian lackey, and more competent.


----------



## Thor (Aug 13, 2014)

In a way I'm glad. This makes it more difficult for Muslims and their liberal allies to deny the truth about Islam. This has been Islam from day one. Muhammad himself beheaded those who refuse to convert, such as the Jewish men of Medina. By the way, that's the origin of the trouble between Muslims and Jews, not the creation of Israel.


----------



## Thor (Aug 13, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> By the way the Muslims living in America disprove your statements.



No shit, they don't speak out against the atrocities of the Islamic State. They want IS to succeed. But who cares about their feelings. Not I said the Thor.


----------



## Jagger (Aug 13, 2014)

Thor said:


> In a way I'm glad. This makes it more difficult for Muslims and their liberal allies to deny the truth about Islam. This has been Islam from day one. Muhammad himself beheaded those who refuse to convert, such as the Jewish men of Medina. By the way, that's the origin of the trouble between Muslims and Jews, not the creation of Israel.


It's quite funny how you believe said religions are the most violents ones when you're a christian.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 13, 2014)

A squadron of F-16s block 50 that belong to the USAF moved from Germany to Greece (Crete) for common execises with the Hellenic Air Force. Two squadrons of Greek F-16s block 52+ are stationed there and will take part in the exercise that will last for two weeks. Stationed on the island are also two S-300 batteries and Tor-M1 systems.

I don't think that the american squadron will take part in the airstrikes but if they are really needed they can probably be called.

The French will also send military equipment to help the Kurds. Them and the Italians have asked for an EU meeting that will probably happen this week to discuss about the issue of Iraq.

The meeting will also include the subject of Ukraine and Gaza.


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 13, 2014)

Thor said:


> No shit, they don't speak out against the atrocities of the Islamic State. They want IS to succeed. But who cares about their feelings. Not I said the Thor.



Do you really think Shia in america, at the very minimum, are likely to be supporting ISIS?


----------



## Thor (Aug 13, 2014)

Jagger said:


> It's quite funny how you believe said religions are the most violents ones when you're a christian.



I'm not a Christian. I do not worship White Jesus.



jetwaterluffy1 said:


> Do you really think Shia in america, at the very minimum, are likely to be supporting ISIS?



No


----------



## Jake CENA (Aug 13, 2014)

Muslims living in America are hypocrites. They hate us down to their bones. I actually witnessed their hypocrisy on a daily basis before.

They feel good whenever there's chaos. Its like a drug to them. They celebrate whenever bad things happen to non muslims, especially to Americans.


----------



## Buskuv (Aug 13, 2014)

What the hell is it about people named Thor?


----------



## Mael (Aug 13, 2014)

TerminaTHOR said:


> *Muslims living in America are hypocrites. They hate us down to their bones. I actually witnessed their hypocrisy on a daily basis before.*
> 
> They feel good whenever there's chaos. Its like a drug to them. They celebrate whenever bad things happen to non muslims, especially to Americans.



Where and when?


----------



## Thor (Aug 13, 2014)

TerminaTHOR said:


> Muslims living in America are hypocrites. They hate us down to their bones. I actually witnessed their hypocrisy on a daily basis before.
> 
> They feel good whenever there's chaos. Its like a drug to them. They celebrate whenever bad things happen to non muslims, especially to Americans.



Great post. Unrefutable fact. 

Ever been to Dearborn, Michigan Meal??


----------



## Mael (Aug 13, 2014)

Thor said:


> Great post. Unrefutable fact.
> 
> Ever been to Dearborn, Michigan Meal??



Do you live in MI or are you just spouting bullshit?

Read this, folks:


Seems like people like Thor are actually going in and trolling, so no wonder they're spiteful.


----------



## Thor (Aug 13, 2014)

I live in Detroit.


----------



## Mael (Aug 13, 2014)

Thor said:


> I live in Detroit.



Sweet.

Doesn't address however the fact the Christian evangelicals or whomever seem to be the ones trolling in Dearborn and without evidence of the lack of civility of the Muslim population.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 13, 2014)

Wow more shenanigans. 



> (CNN) -- ISIS fighters abducted more than 100 Yazidi women and children from the northern Iraqi town of Sinjar, a senior commander with the extremist group told CNN by telephone on Wednesday.
> 
> The ISIS commander, who has knowledge of the events that unfolded in the town, said the fighters killed a large number of men when they took over the town more than a week ago.
> 
> "At that time, they took Yazidi women and children, and I can confirm those women and children have entered Mosul," the commander said.





I think we all know these women and children are in for a nasty time.


----------



## Thor (Aug 13, 2014)

Mael said:


> Sweet.
> 
> Doesn't address however the fact the Christian evangelicals or whomever seem to be the ones trolling in Dearborn and without evidence of the lack of civility of the Muslim population.



I don't see why WASPs would waste their time doing that. I've been to Deerborn, it's the HUB of the covert jihad. When the Jihad hit's US shores michigan will be the 1st to fall.


----------



## heavy_rasengan (Aug 13, 2014)

TerminaTHOR said:


> *Muslims living in America are hypocrites. They hate us down to their bones. I actually witnessed their hypocrisy on a daily basis before.*



Oh yeah, lets just go ahead and generalize an entire group of people. The Thors in this forum are truly a special kind of stupid.


----------



## soulnova (Aug 13, 2014)

Thor said:


> I'm not a Christian. I do not worship White Jesus.



 

  щ(゜ロ゜щ)


----------



## Thor (Aug 13, 2014)

soulnova said:


> щ(゜ロ゜щ)



I'm agnostic now.


----------



## Seto Kaiba (Aug 13, 2014)

Dr. Boskov Krevorkian said:


> What the hell is it about people named Thor?



Nordic hate group?


----------



## Mael (Aug 13, 2014)

Thor said:


> I don't see why WASPs would waste their time doing that. I've been to Deerborn, it's the HUB of the covert jihad. When the Jihad hit's US shores michigan will be the 1st to fall.



I see...so you're a liar.

Concession accepted.


----------



## soulnova (Aug 13, 2014)

Thor said:


> I'm agnostic now.





*Spoiler*: __ 











 Anyway guys. I'm getting bombarded on facebook by christian friends posting news about christians being beheaded, cruxified, etc, etc.  Any info on that?


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 13, 2014)

soulnova said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Most of that is actually legit, minus the crucifixion. The media would have a field day if that happened.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 13, 2014)




----------



## IchLiebe (Aug 13, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> Most of that is actually legit, minus the crucifixion. The media would have a field day if that happened.



They wouldn't know what to do.

It would be all out war then.


----------



## Zaru (Aug 14, 2014)

At this rate the Mosul dam will break from lack of maintenance and kill half a million people


----------



## Destroyer of Kittens (Aug 14, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> Most of that is actually legit, minus the crucifixion. The media would have a field day if that happened.



The crucifixion stuff is also legit.  



Watch the entire vice news coverage over ISIS.  its pretty good.

Their coverage of the Battle for Aleppo in Syria is also top notch.  Vice News journalist are actually really impressive.  imbedding themselves into ISIS and Alnursa and the FSA in syria and Iraq.


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 14, 2014)

Weren't they killed then put in the crucifixion position rather than actually being crucified?


----------



## Jagger (Aug 14, 2014)

At this rate, ISIS is going to eventually wipe out the entire Yaizidi ethnic group.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 14, 2014)

Well it seems the ISIS siege has been broken, according to Obama, so are spec ops are leaving, I hope the airstrikes will continue for some time yet.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 14, 2014)

> Baghdad, Iraq (CNN) -- Nuri al-Maliki is stepping down as Iraq's leader, state-run TV reported Thursday, making way for Prime Minister-designate Haider al-Abadi to take the reins of the country.
> 
> The announcement first flashed on state television follows mounting pressure, at home and abroad, for al-Maliki to step aside and make way from someone to bridge the sectarian divide that many accuse him of fomenting.
> 
> ...



Hopefully someone more open to US interests and more competant replaces him.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 14, 2014)




----------



## Jake CENA (Aug 15, 2014)

heavy_rasengan said:


> Oh yeah, lets just go ahead and generalize an entire group of people. The Thors in this forum are truly a special kind of stupid.



Why dont you try and live in Saudi Arabia?? And lets see if you'll learn something new, like the truth perhaps??


----------



## dr_shadow (Aug 15, 2014)

> *(Reuters) - Nuri al-Maliki finally bowed to pressure within Iraq and beyond on Thursday and stepped down as prime minister, paving the way for a new coalition that world and regional powers hope can quash a Sunni Islamist insurgency that threatens Baghdad.*
> 
> Maliki ended eight years of often divisive, sectarian rule and endorsed fellow Shi'ite Haider al-Abadi in a televised speech during which he stood next to his successor and spoke of the grave threat from Sunni Islamic State militants who have taken over large areas of northern Iraq.
> 
> ...



http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/15/us-iraq-security-usa-military-idUSKBN0GD1KS20140815


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 15, 2014)

The RAF confirmed in a surveillance mission, possibly using one of the three Tornado jets that they sent in Cyprus, that the Yazidis currently have enough supplies (the same thing that the US said) and stopped sending air-dropped aid to them. The UK has sent 7 airdrops so far and will send more if needed. The United Nations declared the highest-level state of emergency for Iraq.

The Germany air force is about to send 4 C-160 aircrafts (no, they are not better than the C-130 because the number is larger ) with food (36 tons) and non-military supplies to Erbil so that they can be distributed by the UN there.


The EU foreign ministers are holding a meeting as we speak about all of the EU's foreign issues. These would mainly include the situation in Iraq, Syria, Ukraine, Libya, Gaza and the Ebola issue.

Italy and France seem to be the most eager in sending help to the Kurds while Germany seems reluctant. 

Austria also cited its lack of serious military forces and equipment while Germany cited their lack of Soviet equipment (AK-47 etc) with which the Peshmerga is most used to as excuses for not supporting the initiative of sending military supplies to them.


----------



## Mael (Aug 15, 2014)

TerminaTHOR said:


> Why dont you try and live in Saudi Arabia?? And lets see if you'll learn something new, like the truth perhaps??





You gotta be trolling...you can't be this stupid.


----------



## Thor (Aug 15, 2014)

You go live in Saudi Arabia Meal. You liberals are ignorant to the real world.


----------



## Mael (Aug 15, 2014)

Thor said:


> You go live in Saudi Arabia Meal. You liberals are ignorant to the real world.





Yeah you two are that stupid.  The issue heavy had was your generalization of Muslims in America, not Saudi Arabia.


----------



## Thor (Aug 15, 2014)

Mael said:


> Yeah you two are that stupid.  The issue heavy had was your generalization of Muslims in America, not Saudi Arabia.



Muslims are the same everywhere. Even if they are not screaming Allah Akubar out in the open they scream it in their minds.


----------



## GaaraoftheDesert1 (Aug 15, 2014)

Maybe if your fucking goverment didnt make alliances with some them...like Saudi Arabia... things would be different.


----------



## Thor (Aug 15, 2014)

GaaraoftheDesert1 said:


> Maybe if your fucking goverment didnt make alliances with some them...like Saudi Arabia... things would be different.



I've never said the US is the good guy. The US created it's own troubles in the Infernal Sands.


----------



## Spock (Aug 15, 2014)

in my heart u die thor


----------



## Mael (Aug 15, 2014)

Thor said:


> Muslims are the same everywhere. Even if they are not screaming Allah Akubar out in the open they scream it in their minds.



Yep, gotta be a troll.


----------



## Thor (Aug 15, 2014)

For example so called "Moderate" Muslims love to call out Israel's self defense tactics but are nowhere to be heard when Muslim's slaughter thousands because of their faith. This is a fact.


----------



## Mael (Aug 15, 2014)

Thor said:


> For example so called "Moderate" Muslims love to call out Israel's self defense tactics but are nowhere to be heard when Muslim's slaughter thousands because of their faith. This is a fact.



That's your platform?

Holy shit...that's just retarded.


----------



## Thor (Aug 15, 2014)

Explain why my rational is slow?

As long as the Muslim population remains around or under 2% in any given country, they will be for the most part be regarded as a peace-loving minority, and not as a threat to other citizens. This is the case in:

United States -- Muslim 0.6%
Australia -- Muslim 1.5%
Canada -- Muslim 1.9%
China -- Muslim 1.8%
Italy -- Muslim 1.5%
Norway -- Muslim 1.8%


At 2% to 5%, they begin to proselytize from other ethnic minorities and disaffected groups, often with major recruiting from the jails and among street gangs. This is happening in:

Denmark -- Muslim 2%
Germany -- Muslim 3.7%
United Kingdom -- Muslim 2.7%
Spain -- Muslim 4%
Thailand -- Muslim 4.6%


From 5% on, they exercise an inordinate influence in proportion to their percentage of the population. For example, they will push for the introduction of halal (clean by Islamic standards) food, thereby securing food preparation jobs for
Muslims. They will increase pressure on supermarket chains to feature halal on their shelves -- along with threats for failure to comply. This is occurring in:

France -- Muslim 8%
Philippines -- 5%
Sweden -- Muslim 5%
Switzerland -- Muslim 4.3%
The Netherlands -- Muslim 5.5%
Trinidad & Tobago -- Muslim 5.8%


At this point, they will work to get the ruling government to allow them to rule themselves (within their ghettos) under Sharia, the Islamic Law. The ultimate goal of Islamists is to establish Sharia law over the entire world.


When Muslims approach 10% of the population, they tend to increase lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions. In Paris , we are already seeing car-burnings. Any non-Muslim action offends Islam, and results in uprisings and threats, such as in Amsterdam , with opposition to Mohammed cartoons and films about Islam. Such tensions are seen daily, particularly in Muslim sections, in:

Guyana – Muslim 10%
India -- Muslim 13.4%
Israel -- Muslim 16%
Kenya -- Muslim 10%
Russia -- Muslim 15%


After reaching 20%, nations can expect hair-trigger rioting, jihad militia formations, sporadic killings, and the burnings of Christian churches and Jewish synagogues, such as in:

Ethiopia -- Muslim 32.8%


At 40%, nations experience widespread massacres, chronic terror attacks, and ongoing militia warfare, such as in:

Bosnia -- Muslim 40%
Nigeria – Muslim 50.4%
Chad – Muslim 50.3%
Lebanon -- Muslim 59.7%


From 60%, nations experience unfettered persecution of non-believers of all other religions (including non-conforming Muslims), sporadic ethnic cleansing (genocide), use of Sharia Law as a weapon, and ***ya, the tax placed on infidels, such as in:

Albania -- Muslim 70%
Malaysia -- Muslim 60.4%
Qatar -- Muslim 77.5%
Sudan -- Muslim 70%


After 80%, expect daily intimidation and violent jihad, some State-run ethnic cleansing, and even some genocide, as these nations drive out the infidels, and move toward 100% Muslim, such as has been experienced and in some ways is on-going in:

Bangladesh -- Muslim 83%
Egypt -- Muslim 90%
Gaza -- Muslim 98.7%
Indonesia -- Muslim 86.1%
Iran -- Muslim 98%
Iraq -- Muslim 97%
Jordan -- Muslim 92%
Morocco -- Muslim 98.7%
Pakistan -- Muslim 97%
Palestine -- Muslim 99%
Syria -- Muslim 90%
Tajikistan -- Muslim 90%
Turkey -- Muslim 99.8%
United Arab Emirates -- Muslim 96%


----------



## Mael (Aug 15, 2014)

^Wow that's pants on head stupid.



Thor said:


> Explain why my rational is slow?



Rationale*

Because you're only taking token examples of what you either think or see and applying it to the wider base of the entire population.  You just previously stated that all of them are hardcore jihadists in their minds when they're not screaming it at the top of their lungs.  You have zero anecdotal or academic evidence into this whereas I have   or condemnation  .

Your move, nutter.


----------



## Mael (Aug 15, 2014)

Thor said:


> Christian Post? Is that supposed to be a reliable source? *I'd like to see some Fox News articles about this*.



Yeah reporting you for trolling...


----------



## Seto Kaiba (Aug 15, 2014)

Why is he back again anyway? I thought he was supposed to be gone for good. I think practically anyone else would have been. I've seen people permed for less. Far less.


----------



## Mael (Aug 15, 2014)

*Is the Islamic State Exterminating the Language of Jesus?*



> Qaraqosh, Tel Kepe, and Karamlesh are just three of the Iraqi towns on the Nineveh plains captured in early August by the Islamic State (IS), but they represent the last major concentration of Aramaic speakers in the world. Pushing northeast of Mosul towards Kurdistan, the jihadist army now occupies the ancient heart of Christian Iraq. According to U.N. officials, roughly 200,000 Christians fled their homes on the Nineveh plains on the night of Aug. 6, justifiably fearful that IS fighters would expel them, kill them, or force them to convert. A local archbishop, Joseph Thomas, described the situation as "catastrophic, a crisis beyond imagination."
> 
> Beyond the urgent humanitarian crisis lies a cultural and linguistic emergency of historic proportions. The extinction of a language in its homeland is rarely a natural process, but almost always reflects the pressures, persecutions, and discriminations endured by its speakers. Linguist Ken Hale famously compared the destruction of a language to "dropping a bomb on the Louvre" -- whole patterns of thought, ways of being, and entire systems of knowledge are among what is lost. If the last Aramaic speaker finally passes away two generations from now, the language will not have died of natural causes.
> Aramaic covers a wide range of Semitic languages and dialects, all related but often mutually incomprehensible, now mostly extinct or endangered. The last available estimates of the number of Aramaic speakers, from the 1990s, put the population as high as 500,000, of whom close to half were thought to be in Iraq. Today the actual number is likely to be much lower; speakers are scattered across the globe, and fewer and fewer children are speaking the language. Nowhere does Aramaic have official status or protection.
> ...




And people thought the anti-Intellectual movement in the States was bad...IS seeks to destroy a complete legacy of historical education.


----------



## Seto Kaiba (Aug 15, 2014)

ISIS was just a natural progression of the radicalism that festers in the region.


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 15, 2014)

So, is there any point in sending the kurds more weaponry they already have, as opposed to an upgrade? Do they have enough guns, bullets, etc.?


Thor said:


> Muslims are the same everywhere. Even if they are not screaming Allah Akubar out in the open they scream it in their minds.


Allahu Akbar means god is the greatest. What is wrong with shouting that?


Mael said:


> That's your platform?
> 
> Holy shit...that's just retarded.


I thought you were saying pretty much the same thing in another thread.


Mael said:


> And people thought the anti-Intellectual movement in the States was bad...IS seeks to destroy a complete legacy of historical education.


While the killing of neo-aramaic communities is obviously a terrible thing, I don't see how this is a huge loss for historical education. You can't prove a word or phrase in modern Aramaic means the same in ancient Aramaic, so you'd have to look it up in ancient documents anyway.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 15, 2014)

> You can't prove a word or phrase in modern Aramaic means the same in ancient Aramaic, so you'd have to look it up in ancient documents anyway.



There must be some similarities nonetheless. And once these guys are gone, nobody can _speak _the language. Which is what matters in these cases. When they speak they are the closest we currently have to Jesus' language. 



Anyway, what matters is that the meeting of the EU foreign ministers is over. The decision is that the EU has agreed to deliver military equipment the Kurds but each member state is free to decide the amounts and range of the military supplies that it will deliver.

The German foreign minister is traveling to Iraq to be informed on what supplies the Kurdish leaders need the most. He said that "I can't rule out that we will have to deliver weapons".

France is already delivering weapons to the Kurdish fighters.

The UK said that if the Kurds make requests for military equipment they will "favourably consider them".

The Czech Republic said that it's working as we speak in the "preparation of military supplies" to the Kurds.

The Netherlands considers deliverying supplies not only to the Kurds but the official Iraqi army as well.

The UN Security Council is expected today to approve a resolution threatening sanctions against any country which finances or supports IS.

Greece's foreign minister said that Greece won't be delivering military supplies but it will deliver humanitarian aid.


----------



## Mael (Aug 15, 2014)

The Kurds have proven themselves to be capable, stable, and not batshit crazy with religious zeal.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 15, 2014)

Mael said:


> The Kurds have proven themselves to be capable, stable, and not batshit crazy with religious zeal.



Mael whats the current status of the PKK? I know they are a terrorist organization, but is that due to them merely pissing off our ally Turkey or do they harbor hatred for the west as a whole?

Furthermore how prevaliant are the extremists elements within the Peshmurga, while to me a Kurdish state would be awesome I am also aware of the US getting its hand bitten for supporting "moderate groups" as well.


----------



## Mael (Aug 15, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> Mael whats the current status of the PKK? I know they are a terrorist organization, but is that due to them merely pissing off our ally Turkey or do they harbor hatred for the west as a whole?
> 
> Furthermore how prevaliant are the extremists elements within the Peshmurga, while to me a Kurdish state would be awesome I am also aware of the US getting its hand bitten for supporting "moderate groups" as well.



The PKK's beef is with Turkey and thank you for mentioning them because I forgot to add them as the one bad factor of the Kurdish movement as a whole.

Extremist elements in the peshmerga?  Unlikely considering how the peshmerga has more or less kept itself within Iraqi-Syrian lines.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 15, 2014)

Mael said:


> The PKK's beef is with Turkey and thank you for mentioning them because I forgot to add them as the one bad factor of the Kurdish movement as a whole.
> 
> Extremist elements in the peshmerga?  Unlikely considering how the peshmerga has more or less kept itself within Iraqi-Syrian lines.



Honestly to me the Kurds seem like a solution that's too good to be true,(Call me cynical, considering movements we supported before blew up in our faces) given this regions history. 

Yet at the same time it does seem like they are really the best bet for ensuring stability in the region, both in short and long term.

Honestly I want to give full backing to the Kurds as well, but I am uneasy in doing so, quite a conundrum this whole region is


----------



## heavy_rasengan (Aug 15, 2014)

Mael said:


> The Kurds have proven themselves to be capable, stable, and not batshit crazy with religious zeal.



This is why they need their own state. An independent Kurdish state would be the only positive result in this shit show.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 15, 2014)

This post by MH shows why the formation of a Kurdish state would be problematic, even though I also like the idea.



Megaharrison said:


> The Good:
> -Another failed Arab state that is too busy ripping itself apart to bother us (Israel)
> -*An independent Kurdistan*
> -Iran gets bogged into another foreign war
> ...



So generally its within western interests to ensure Iraq remains together and somewhat stable.


----------



## Thor (Aug 15, 2014)

Western interests??? You mean the White Supremist system.


----------



## 404error (Aug 15, 2014)

The middle east just loves to party


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 15, 2014)

ISIS massacres eighty Yazidis in village in northern Iraq, 100 women taken captive



Can we just stop with the kid glove shit and start carpet bombing these monsters?


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 15, 2014)

> But the Sunni offer to battle the militants came with strings — possible autonomy and the withdrawal of Iraqi military forces from Sunni areas — that would be difficult for a Shiite-led government to grant, and Shiite politicians in Baghdad showed little enthusiasm. One, Dhiaa al Asadi, a member of Parliament loyal to cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, called the Sunni proposal "very exaggerated and unrealistic."
> 
> U.S. officials have predicted since the Islamic State began its sweep through much of central, western and northern Iraq, often with the collaboration of Sunni tribes, that a more conciliatory government in Baghdad, coupled with harsh rule imposed by the Islamists, would move disaffected Sunnis to rebel. That's one reason the U.S. pushed so hard for Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki to resign in favor of a replacement who would be more disposed to offer concessions to Sunnis and Kurds.
> 
> ...



If this goes through ISIS will be in trouble in Iraq.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 15, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> If this goes through ISIS will be in trouble in Iraq.



Kind of a big if right now, the Shiites are already complaining that the Sunnis demands are too unreasonable. Expect them to haggle and deliberate for a few more months until they settle on a compromise. At least they are trying to negotiate.

In other news, Kurdish forces have launched an offensive to regain control of the Mosul dam


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 16, 2014)

Well if anyone besides the US can deal with these guys its the Kurds, though having the Sunni tribes also fighting would be a huge bonus, it helped quell the insurgency while the US was there.


----------



## WT (Aug 16, 2014)

Kagekatsu said:


> ISIS massacres eighty Yazidis in village in northern Iraq, 100 women taken captive
> 
> 
> 
> Can we just stop with the kid glove shit and start carpet bombing these monsters?



Been reading these series of news and its made me sick. ISIS reminds me of the Khawarij group that was formed early on.

Regardless, these monsters must be dealt with ASAP


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 16, 2014)

Funny how Russia gets sanctions for their "alleged" support of Ukranian seperatists, while Qatar, Saudi Arabia and Turkey got away with arming and sheltering these worse-than-Al-Qaida IS guys.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 16, 2014)

ISIS came from Syria smart one 

We tried to stop that but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Russia and China said no, along with a pansy ass Europe that did not want to intervene either... and now we are stuck trying to contain this mess and hopefully force them back to Syria, where they can fight Assad and all the other groups that the civilized world would love to see crippled.


----------



## Schneider (Aug 16, 2014)

Thor said:


> Explain why my rational is slow?
> 
> As long as the Muslim population remains around or under 2% in any given country, they will be for the most part be regarded as a peace-loving minority, and not as a threat to other citizens. This is the case in:
> 
> ...



lol no. first half of the year had bombings in western parts of china and even in beijing. well china are also being massive dicks to muslims though.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 16, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> ISIS came from Syria smart one



Who cares from which border they entered into Iraq? They still had or still have the support from allies of the US.

Besides: Where do you think IS was before Syria?



> We tried to stop that but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Russia and China said no, along with a pansy ass Europe that did not want to intervene either... and now we are stuck trying to contain this mess and hopefully force them back to Syria, where they can fight Assad and all the other groups that the civilized world would love to see crippled.



You tried to stop "that"? You mean IS?  All "you" wanted was to bomb Assad into submission and turn Syria into a failed state, as you did with Gaddafi's Libya. 
The US played along with Saudi Arabia's and Qatar's funding of IS, because they were fighting Assad. And even now the IS was helpfull to the US by toppling Al-Maliki and bringing Iraq closer to US and further away from Iran.

If the US really was just interested in fighting radical islamists, they would've supported the secular dictator Assad and forced Saudi Arabia and Qatar to stop their funding of IS.


Edit:
A bit outdated, the sign should say Iraq by now, but still accurate enough:


----------



## blk (Aug 16, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> ISIS came from Syria smart one
> 
> We tried to stop that but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Russia and China said no, along with a pansy ass Europe that did not want to intervene either... and now we are stuck trying to contain this mess and hopefully force them back to Syria, where they can fight Assad and all the other groups that the civilized world would love to see crippled.



ISIS (even though it wasn't called like that and changed name several times) did not came out of Syria [].
While it is true that the Syrian civil war had a significant (positive) impact on ISIS, the various past US interventions in the region (most notably in Iraq, considering that the group operated there for the most part of its existence) had an imprescindible effect on the group.
So, i'm not sure how you can blame Russia, China and EU.

There is hardly any country that has and had the same level of impact, in the middle east as whole, as the US (in recent history).


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 16, 2014)

Son of Goku said:


> Funny how Russia gets sanctions for their "alleged" support of Ukranian seperatists, while Qatar, Saudi Arabia and Turkey got away with arming and sheltering these worse-than-Al-Qaida IS guys.



Turkey?
/10char


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 16, 2014)

jetwaterluffy1 said:


> Turkey?
> /10char



Yeah, you know, the country. Not the bird.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 16, 2014)

Turkey is bad at patrolling its borders and its police is bad at arresting terrorists. Definitely does not count as "arming and sheltering" IS fighters if you ask me...


----------



## Jagger (Aug 16, 2014)

I feel pity for the people living in the Middle East. I've barely seen a place where so much fucked up shit happens and it is publicy announced.

No, I'm not saying "Nuke them all!", but it's rather sad how hard it must be for low-class people to live in such violence.


----------



## Taco (Aug 16, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> ISIS came from Syria smart one
> 
> We tried to stop that but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Russia and China said no, along with a pansy ass Europe that did not want to intervene either... and now we are stuck trying to contain this mess and hopefully force them back to Syria, where they can fight Assad and all the other groups that the civilized world would love to see crippled.



So they can slaughter the Christian minorities in Syria as well?


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2014)

blk said:


> ISIS (even though it wasn't called like that and changed name several times) did not came out of Syria [].
> While it is true that the Syrian civil war had a significant (positive) impact on ISIS, the various past US interventions in the region (most notably in Iraq, considering that the group operated there for the most part of its existence) had an imprescindible effect on the group.
> So, i'm not sure how you can blame Russia, China and EU.
> 
> There is hardly any country that has and had the same level of impact, in the middle east as whole, as the US (in recent history).



Yeah, ISIS was originally Al Qaeda in Iraq, the Sunni Al Qaeda franchise US fought from like 2003-2007 before the Sunni Awakening seemed to end them.

But they were just in remission.

They then went over to Syria during their civil war which they used to build up their power and then rapidly expand.

Anyway, the problems with the Middle East basically stem from the fall of the Ottomans.

For the great majority of the past 1400 years, the Middle East was a single political unit. First under the arab caliphate, then the mongols and then under the turks.

Everything since 1918 comes from the disolution of roughly 1300 years of union and trying to sort that out.

Its the same geopolitical clusterfuck that happened in Europe after Rome fell. Or if hypothetically China disolved. But of course with complicating factors of oil and religious zealotry.

For a good portion of the 20th century the descendent states were somewhat stable under various autocrats Europe installed. But lo, as they catch up withthe modern era, all the crap Europe went through since the fall of Rome have been concentrated into roughly a century. So you have the various religious movements bumping up aganst secularism bumping up agaisnt democratic aspirations bumping up against aristocracies and autocracies.

Just watch, by 2050 you'll have a middle east in the heat of an industrial revolution and doing the whole socialism-capitalism thing.

They are rather due on a religious reformation movement. But I guess they just skipped ahead to the puritanism chapter.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 16, 2014)

Taco said:


> So they can slaughter the Christian minorities in Syria as well?



Yup and with impunity too, since Russia and China have their back, as long as they remain in Syria of course.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 17, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> Yup and with impunity too, since Russia and China have their back, as long as they remain in Syria of course.



Russia and China are backing the IS?! 

Just when you think you've seen it all, Chely posts another of his quality posts...


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 17, 2014)

Son of Goku said:


> Russia and China are backing the IS?!
> 
> Just when you think you've seen it all, Chely posts another of his quality posts...



By protecting Assad they allow ISIS to grow in strength. Your lack understanding of politics is showing.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 17, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> By protecting Assad they allow ISIS to grow in strength. Your lack understanding of politics is showing.



And bombing Assad would obviously weaken the IS, why didn't I see that!! 


You're lack of common sense is proven once more. The US allowed IS to grow by allowing Saudi Arabia and Qatar to support them. Without the money and the supplies via Turkey, IS wouldn't be what they are now.

If Assad was gone IS would be figting the other rebel groups over what's left of Syria and probably win.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 17, 2014)

US officials say that there might be up to 400 Islamic State militants in and around the Mosul Dam complex. The Peshmerga is fighting currently and trying to take it back. The U.S. military confirmed a mix of fighter jets and drones carried out nine airstrikes near Mosul and the Kurdish regional capital of Irbil. The strikes targeted armored vehicles used by ISIS fighters, it said.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 17, 2014)

Kurdish forces have recaptured the Mosul Dam


----------



## Jersey Shore Jesus (Aug 17, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> ISIS came from Syria smart one
> 
> We tried to stop that but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Russia and China said no, along with a pansy ass Europe that did not want to intervene either... and now we are stuck trying to contain this mess and hopefully force them back to Syria, where they can fight Assad and all the other groups that the civilized world would love to see crippled.



They actually came from the USA...




Never mind that Son of Goku is right. Regardless where they came from they need to be dealt with now. They are a trained dog that has grown out of control.

And why would you like to see Assad gone? Before this "civil war"(and I call it "civil war" because we paid people to fight him.) Syria was one of the most peaceful nations in the middle east. Christian and Muslim lived next to each other without the threat of beheading so please do tell me why you'd like to see this "dictator" out of power.


----------



## Thor (Aug 17, 2014)

Because he's a 'dictator'. The thing the typical ignorant westerner doesn't realize it that 'democracy' (lol) doesn't work in non-western nations. But their western white supremist mindset blinds them to the fact.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 17, 2014)

Thor said:


> Because he's a 'dictator'. The thing the typical ignorant westerner doesn't realize it that 'democracy' (lol) doesn't work in non-western nations. But their western white supremist mindset blinds them to the fact.


Its working pretty well in India. And Indonesia (world's largest muslim democracy). And Japan. And South Korea. And Bangladesh. And Thailand. And Philippines. And so one and so on.



Non-western states are plenty capable of democracy.

They just need a certain level of economic and political stability for it to be viable.


----------



## Mael (Aug 17, 2014)

*US strikes in Iraq aimed at helping reclaim dam*

Thor's dipshittery aside:


> The White House said President Barack Obama notified Congress Sunday that the widened mission would be limited in duration and scope.
> 
> The administration's letter to Congress said "the mission is consistent with the president's directive that the U.S. military protect U.S. personnel and facilities in Iraq, since the failure of the Mosul Dam could threaten the lives of large numbers of civilians and threaten U.S. personnel and facilities ? including the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad." It also noted that the failure of the dam could "prevent the Iraqi government from providing critical services" to the Iraqi people.
> 
> ...


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 17, 2014)

Mael said:


> Thor's dipshittery aside:



I think everyone knew those were our jets

ISIS getting a taste at what its like when the other side has total air superiority.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 18, 2014)

That's great news. They better defend the Mosul dam well so that they never have to go through this again.

The real news, besides that dam, is that the US most likely used B-1 bombers from the Al Udeid air base in Qatar for the first time to support the Kurds in their attack, Washington Post reports.

13/8/2014:



Hozukimaru said:


> That being said there are quite a few known Air Expeditionary Wings in Qatar, Kuwait, Jordan, Turkey or even Iraq itself that can be used as possible bases of operations.
> 
> US forces nearby include B-1 bombers and F-22 fighters that have not being used in the conflict as of yet.


----------



## Mider T (Aug 18, 2014)

Jersey Shore Jesus said:


> They actually came from the USA...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Don't you ever get tired of being wrong?


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Aug 18, 2014)

He's JSJ, he thrives on being wrong.


----------



## Zaru (Aug 18, 2014)

Sunuvmann said:


> Its working pretty well in India. And Indonesia (world's largest muslim democracy). And Japan. And South Korea. And Bangladesh. And Thailand. And Philippines. And so one and so on.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



"Pretty well"? India is more complicated than you're making it out to be because it's essentially split into ideologically indistinguishable dynastic parties for personal gain and parties that center around local areas, from what I've read.

The rest is (South-)East asians. The problem is mainly the Middle East. (And probably Africa, but most of that continent is not economically developed enough to judge what could work politically)

They are extremely "close community"-centered. Extended families, clans, tribes. I've also seen the term "favor-based society" in that context. Democracy requires a certain universal trust for the other people in your country (at least a significant amount of them). The West has continuously failed to understand this when trying to "free the shit out of" the Middle East. Many of them were and are simply held together by military might of non-democratic or hardly democratic rulers. Alternatively, they're appeased with copious amounts of oil money. Remove those, and you get e.g. Iraq and Egypt.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 18, 2014)

Middle East and Democracy:

God knows where the middle east would be now if our oil wasn't under their sand. 
Iran, e.g., could still be a democracy today, hadn't the US put a stop to it in 1953.


----------



## Jersey Shore Jesus (Aug 18, 2014)

Mider T said:


> Don't you ever get tired of being wrong?





http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/03/10/us-syria-crisis-rebels-usa-idUSBRE9290FI20130310

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/mar/08/west-training-syrian-rebels-jordan



SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> He's JSJ, he thrives on being wrong.



You thrive on flame baiting.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 18, 2014)

You do realise that the Free Syrian Army is actually fighting against ISIS, right?



This is the current situation in Syria. Green are the Free Syrian Army and rebels connected to them, red are Assad's forces, black are IS forces and yellow are the Kurds.


----------



## Mael (Aug 18, 2014)

Go Team Kurdistan.

TerminaTHOR is super salty.


----------



## Prince Vegeta (Aug 18, 2014)

Zor supas Peshmaga <3


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 19, 2014)

Hozukimaru said:


> You do realise that the Free Syrian Army is actually fighting against ISIS, right?
> 
> 
> 
> This is the current situation in Syria. Green are the Free Syrian Army and rebels connected to them, red are Assad's forces, black are IS forces and yellow are the Kurds.



So the kurds are fighting the FSA, too?


----------



## Nordstrom (Aug 19, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> ISIS came from Syria smart one
> 
> We tried to stop that but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Russia and China said no, along with a pansy ass Europe that did not want to intervene either... and now we are stuck trying to contain this mess and hopefully force them back to Syria, where they can fight Assad and all the other groups that the civilized world would love to see crippled.



Something tells me this will backfire if Assad puts them down. Plus, intervention isn't always answer N?1.

At any rate, this is either a victory for Assad or the IS, so either way, West loses.

I love my life...

[sp]Not like I'm enjoying this mind you. The reaction is what will be amusing.[/sp]


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 19, 2014)

One idea would be to attack IS in the areas where they border the FSA and Kurd-owned territory. That way assad doesn't gain anything, IS loses, while russia and china won't veto it because it does them not harm. But of course the potential knock-on effects are what is crucial.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 19, 2014)

jetwaterluffy1 said:


> So the kurds are fighting the FSA, too?



They're not exactly best buddies. But unless the FSA enters Kurdish territory (which happens from time to time), they don't fight. 

It's basically a free-for-all situation, but the Kurds stick out because they make no territorial claims outside of Kurdistan while the other main forces (FSA, Assad and IS) that take part in the fighting want the whole country so fighting is more intense between them.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 19, 2014)

Iraqis are making another go at retaking Tikirt.


----------



## the_notorious_Z.É. (Aug 19, 2014)

And now they want to conquer the Iberian peninsula too, and they plan top accomplish this plan in just 5 years.


----------



## Mael (Aug 19, 2014)

I think Russia would nuke them into oblivion than let Islamic radicals gain one inch of ground of their former territories.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 19, 2014)

That Iraqi army's attack on Tikrit failed. 

ISIS has placed a large number of landmines and snipers on the west of the city making it largerly inaccessible while the Iraqi units that attacked from the south came under heavy machinegun and mortar fire which didn't allow them to push into the city.



Mael said:


> I think Russia would nuke them into oblivion than let Islamic radicals gain one inch of ground of their former territories.



Chechen rebels would probably welcome ISIS.


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 19, 2014)

the_notorious_Z.?. said:


> And now they want to conquer the Iberian peninsula too, and they plan top accomplish this plan in just 5 years.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Pretty sure that map is fake.

But they have said they want to invade Italy and they want every (sunni?) muslim nation to join to make a united state under the "caliph", so that's quite a lot of land they're after.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 19, 2014)

Hozukimaru said:


> That Iraqi army's attack on Tikrit failed.
> 
> ISIS has placed a large number of landmines and snipers on the west of the city making it largerly inaccessible while the Iraqi units that attacked from the south came under heavy machinegun and mortar fire which didn't allow them to push into the city.



As I've implied, this wasn't the first time either.

Our advisers on the ground actually warned the Iraqis that trying to retake Tikrit right now would be a bad idea, but Maliki wanted a big PR victory.

Baghdad's probably going to be even more impatient that we expand our air campaign into their front.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 19, 2014)

ISIS killed a US journalist, that was abducted two years ago.


----------



## Taco (Aug 19, 2014)

Yep that's gonna make the US go away for sure!!!

The sooner these shits are exterminated the better for the entire world, idiot monkeys.


----------



## Nordstrom (Aug 20, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> By protecting Assad they allow ISIS to grow in strength. Your lack understanding of politics is showing.



Assad is the same guy air striking them.



Zaru said:


> "Pretty well"? India is more complicated than you're making it out to be because it's essentially split into ideologically indistinguishable dynastic parties for personal gain and parties that center around local areas, from what I've read.
> 
> The rest is (South-)East asians. The problem is mainly the Middle East. (And probably Africa, but most of that continent is not economically developed enough to judge what could work politically)
> 
> They are extremely "close community"-centered. Extended families, clans, tribes. I've also seen the term "favor-based society" in that context. Democracy requires a certain universal trust for the other people in your country (at least a significant amount of them). The West has continuously failed to understand this when trying to "free the shit out of" the Middle East. Many of them were and are simply held together by military might of non-democratic or hardly democratic rulers. Alternatively, they're appeased with copious amounts of oil money. Remove those, and you get e.g. Iraq and Egypt.



You could start by accepting democracy isn't a universally agreed upon rule. Western culture developed that way, and by forcing it upon others we're denying them the stability they deserve.



jetwaterluffy1 said:


> One idea would be to attack IS in the areas where they border the FSA and Kurd-owned territory. That way assad doesn't gain anything, IS loses, while russia and china won't veto it because it does them not harm. But of course the potential knock-on effects are what is crucial.



Then Assad's Syria walks away with impunity and having sacrificed very little.


----------



## Prince Vegeta (Aug 20, 2014)

Sleipnyr said:


> Assad is the same guy air striking them.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Assad was also doing oil business with ISIS. when ISIS captured some oil refineries in Iraq.


----------



## Saishin (Aug 20, 2014)

> *Italy parliament OKs arms to Kurds as Renzi meets with Iraqi leaders*
> 
> *'Europe will not turn its back on Iraq' says Renzi*
> 
> ...


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 20, 2014)

So I was thinking, with all that shit going on all around the world and especially the middle east, oil prices must've gone off the charts. I was surprised to find that the opposite was actually true. Oil prices have being falling as of lately. I looked up the reasons and it seems that the US has had its oil industry working really well lately and thus be less dependant on imports while the EU has had anemic to no growth recently and thus demand for oil is relatively low.


----------



## Vermin (Aug 20, 2014)

^

besides alaska i didn't think that the us produced a significant amount of oil 

you learn something new every day


----------



## zenieth (Aug 20, 2014)

Alaska, Texas and North Dakota


----------



## Jersey Shore Jesus (Aug 20, 2014)

*Islamic State message to America: 'we will drown all of you in blood'
*


> BAGHDAD (Reuters) - The Islamic State militant group that has seized large parts of Iraq and drawn the first American air strikes since the end of the occupation in 2011 has warned the United States it will attack Americans "in any place" if the raids hit its militants.
> 
> The video, which shows a photograph of an American who was beheaded during the U.S. occupation of Iraq and victims of snipers, featured a statement which said in English "we will drown all of you in blood".
> 
> ...



http://news.yahoo.com/islamic-state-message-america-drown-blood-004418744.html

Don't know if this has been posted yet.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 20, 2014)

zyken said:


> ^
> 
> besides alaska i didn't think that the us produced a significant amount of oil
> 
> you learn something new every day



Well Texas and Alaska produce quite some oil actually. The rest of the oil mainly comes from Canada, Saudi Arabia and Mexico.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 20, 2014)

Prince Vegeta said:


> Assad was also doing oil business with ISIS. when ISIS captured some oil refineries in Iraq.



More specifically . People like to claim that since Assad fights certain Jihadi groups he doesn't support any Jihadi groups, but like ME politics in general the reality is more complicated.

ISIS is a two headed beast born from Syrian activities in Iraq 2003-2011 and Western abandonment of anti-Assad opponents in Syria.


----------



## Sanity Check (Aug 21, 2014)

Hozukimaru said:


> So I was thinking, with all that shit going on all around the world and especially the middle east, oil prices must've gone off the charts. I was surprised to find that the opposite was actually true. Oil prices have being falling as of lately. I looked up the reasons and it seems that the US has had its oil industry working really well lately and thus be less dependant on imports while the EU has had anemic to no growth recently and thus demand for oil is relatively low.



Some have said Shale is a fraud.



.


----------



## Nordstrom (Aug 21, 2014)

Prince Vegeta said:


> Assad was also doing oil business with ISIS. when ISIS captured some oil refineries in Iraq.



That would make little sense. Why would Assad attempt to destroy something he assisted...


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 21, 2014)

1mmortal 1tachi said:


> Some have said Shale is a fraud.
> 
> 
> 
> .



Truth is that fracking tends to be more harsh on the environment than conventional ways of extracting gas and oil. That's largerly because of the possible risk of contaminating nearby drinking water resources, although the companies deny that the chemicals involved actually reach the drinking water. They also refuse to make public the composition of the chemicals used because it will "hurt their business".

I'm not saying that those are absolutely true, I don't have much experience on the matter, but the goverment should at least perform some extended tests in drinking water in these areas.

Regarding the use of oil in general that the site and video adresses, it's estimated that about 8 million barrels of oil are produced in the US every single day. That's about 3 billion barrels of oil every year. Wonder about the proven oil reserves? They're about 33 billion barrels of oil. So that's 11 more years minimum. Concerning natural gas production, 681 billion m^3 of natural gas is produced in the US every year. Considering the 9.5 trillion m^3 of natural gas that is proven to exist in the US, that leaves for at least 14 more years of production.

More reserves will be found, but they likely won't last for more than a few decades.




In other news, the Greek defence minister traveled today in the US to meet the US defence secretary Chuck Hagel. The possible involvement of the Greek armed forces in the middle east will be one of the main talking points. The free supply of surplus US defense material to Greece will also be discussed as will its retrofitting and upgrade through the Greek defence industry.


----------



## jetwaterluffy1 (Aug 21, 2014)

Sleipnyr said:


> Then Assad's Syria walks away with impunity and having sacrificed very little.


Sorry, I don't get what you are trying to say here.


Hozukimaru said:


> Truth is that fracking tends to be more harsh on the environment than conventional ways of extracting gas and oil. That's largerly because of the possible risk of contaminating nearby drinking water resources, although the companies deny that the chemicals involved actually reach the drinking water. They also refuse to make public the composition of the chemicals used because it will "hurt their business".



No it doesn't. Or at least, it doesn't if you regulate it properly. Unless by conventional methods you mean "buy it from another country", and even then, the pollution caused by burning the stuff if orders of magnitude above mining it anyway.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 21, 2014)

jetwaterluffy1 said:


> No it doesn't. Or at least,* it doesn't if you regulate it properly*. Unless by conventional methods you mean "buy it from another country", and even then, the pollution caused by burning the stuff if orders of magnitude above mining it anyway.



That's the whole point though. Proper regulation. The risks of fracking may not be inherent to it, safety breaches and bad practises being the main cause of enviromental issues doesn't mean that we can be rest assured that the regulations will always be followed.


----------



## Overwatch (Aug 22, 2014)

> *Iran To US: We'll Help Fight ISIS If You Lift Nuclear Sanctions*
> 
> Iran is ready to join international action against jihadists in Iraq provided the West lifts crippling sanctions, Foreign Minister Mohammad Javad Zarif said on Thursday.
> 
> ...



http://www.businessinsider.com/iran-offers-help-with-isis-if-us-lifts-nuclear-sanctions-2014-8

I'm sure this won't backfire.


----------



## Chelydra (Aug 22, 2014)

Iran would likely pull a pakistan and help them instead


----------



## Overwatch (Aug 22, 2014)

> *Iraqi forces make gains against ISIS, official says*
> 
> (CNN) -- Kurdish and Iraqi armed forces made gains against ISIS fighters in northeastern Iraq on Friday, taking back several villages as they surrounded the large ISIS-held town of Jalawla, a spokesman for Kurdish forces said.
> 
> ...


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 22, 2014)

Chelydra said:


> Iran would likely pull a pakistan and help them instead



Iran is Shia. The last thing they probably want is an extremist Sunni state inching close to their borders.

Though its not surprising they're taking advantage of the chaos to pursue their own self-interests.


So it looks our air campaign is having an effect in Kurdistan at least. Though I wonder how long Baghdad is going to chafe over the fact their still not getting CAS on their front.

As for strikes on Syria, on one hand that will mean we're inadvertently helping Assad, but the FSA is fighting a two-front war and may not survive for long.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 22, 2014)

Kagekatsu said:


> Iran is Shia. The last thing they probably want is an extremist Sunni state inching close to their borders.
> 
> Though its not surprising they're taking advantage of the chaos to pursue their own self-interests.



Iran will support ideological enemies in the face of other interests. They allied with Israel against Saddam 1980-1988 and supported the Taliban 2003-2010ish. Iran has supported many Sunni Jihadist groups such as Islamic Jihad, Hamas, Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade, and so on. They'd support ISIS if it wasn't a threat to their puppet regimes in Damascus/Baghdad, especially since Iran likes to keep the Kurds down.


----------



## hcheng02 (Aug 22, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Iran will support ideological enemies in the face of other interests. They allied with Israel against Saddam 1980-1988 and supported the Taliban 2003-2010ish. Iran has supported many Sunni Jihadist groups such as Islamic Jihad, Hamas, Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade, and so on. They'd support ISIS if it wasn't a threat to their puppet regimes in Damascus/Baghdad, especially since Iran likes to keep the Kurds down.



The point still stands that Iran can hardly ally itself with ISIS as it is now considering how ISIS has publicly blown up Shiite shrines and lopped off Shiite heads for heresy.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 22, 2014)

hcheng02 said:


> The point still stands that Iran can hardly ally itself with ISIS as it is now considering how ISIS has publicly blown up Shiite shrines and lopped off Shiite heads for heresy.



Taliban killed Iranian Revolutionary Guards and hung their mutilated bodies in public squares in the 90's/early 2000's, didn't stop Iran from supporting them later.


----------



## Prince Vegeta (Aug 22, 2014)

Kagekatsu said:


> Iran is Shia. The last thing they probably want is an extremist Sunni state inching close to their borders.
> 
> Though its not surprising they're taking advantage of the chaos to pursue their own self-interests.
> 
> ...



I hope US will support Independent Kurdistan at least for northern part of Iraq. The Kurds are the best allies that US has in Iraq.


----------



## baconbits (Aug 22, 2014)

So the point is that Iran is very pragmatic when it comes to pursuing power.  With that in mind we ought not do any negotiations with them on this regard since...

1. We don't need their help.
2. Its already in their interest to eliminate ISIS.


----------



## Prince Vegeta (Aug 22, 2014)

baconbits said:


> So the point is that Iran is very pragmatic when it comes to pursuing power.  With that in mind we ought not do any negotiations with them on this regard since...
> 
> 1. We don't need their help.
> 2. Its already in their interest to eliminate ISIS.



exactly so US should ignore them. I believe Iran has indirectly supported ISIS.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 22, 2014)

Prince Vegeta said:


> exactly so US should ignore them. *I believe Iran has indirectly supported ISIS.*



Yeah right, who hasn't?! :rofl


----------



## hcheng02 (Aug 22, 2014)

Prince Vegeta said:


> exactly so US should ignore them. I believe Iran has indirectly supported ISIS.



Kinda doubt that considering how Iran is openly supporting Assad and ISIS is currently attacking him. 

The US response so far has only been to shore up Kurdistan since they are really the only viable ally left in Iraq.


----------



## Prince Vegeta (Aug 22, 2014)

hcheng02 said:


> Kinda doubt that considering how Iran is openly supporting Assad and ISIS is currently attacking him.
> 
> The US response so far has only been to shore up Kurdistan since they are really the only viable ally left in Iraq.



Hence US should have supported the Kurds earlier before the Yezidi's, Christians and other religious minorities got into this mess. There is no such thing as unity of Iraq the Obama administration should realize that the Sunni's and the Shia's can't live with each other peacefully.  

btw Iran along with Russia were also against US attacking Assad regime.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 22, 2014)

Son of Goku said:


> Yeah right, who hasn't?! :rofl



Iran's imperial adventure and meddling in Syria is what caused ISIS to gain momentum in the first place.


----------



## Distance (Aug 22, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Iran's imperial adventure and meddling in Syria is what caused ISIS to gain momentum in the first place.



Pointing fingers at just Iran as the cause of a group this big and effective is ridiculous unless you have the evidence to back it up.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 22, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Iran's imperial adventure and meddling in Syria is what caused ISIS to gain momentum in the first place.



Yeah sure, the Saudi and Qatarian (and Turkish) support right under the nose of allied Uncle Sam, in persuit of weakening Iran/the Shia in the region had nothing to do with it.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 22, 2014)

Distance said:


> Pointing fingers at just Iran as the cause of a group this big and effective is ridiculous unless you have the evidence to back it up.


It's more an inadvertent case. Iran has kept Assad, a fellow Shia, propped up with manpower and resources, which together with Russia and China, is keeping the war prolonged indefinitely. Which in turn is causing many Sunnis to snub the moderate Free Syrian Army in favor of ISIS, Al-Nusra and other Jihadist groups. And its because the war has been so chaotic due to the interference of those three countries that ISIS was able to build its powerbase to launch its invasion of Iraq.


----------



## Megaharrison (Aug 22, 2014)

Son of Goku said:


> Yeah sure, the Saudi and Qatarian (and Turkish) support right under the nose of allied Uncle Sam, in persuit of weakening Iran/the Shia in the region had nothing to do with it.



ISIS formed out of a vacuum for international abandonment of Syria and no other viable alternative to battle Assad, who himself was only saved by Iran and their foreign fighter Islamist army Hezbollah. Iran turning the Assad regime into a Shia puppet alienated the non-alawite and Sunni community and gave ISIS recruitment tools. Had Assad stepped down or been defeated early this would not have occurred. 

The Syrian opposition, initially secular and calling for an end to Syria's de facto monarchy, was radicalized when the world did nothing in the face of Assad's butchery. Non-intervention can have just as much (often worse) blowback as intervention.


----------



## Distance (Aug 22, 2014)

Kagekatsu said:


> It's more an inadvertent case. Iran has kept Assad, a fellow Shia, propped up with manpower and resources, which together with Russia and China, is keeping the war prolonged indefinitely. Which in turn is causing many Sunnis to snub the moderate Free Syrian Army in favor of ISIS, Al-Nusra and other Jihadist groups. And its because the war has been so chaotic due to the interference of those three countries that ISIS was able to build its powerbase to launch its invasion of Iraq.



But the U.S is also backing the Gulf States, which ISIS, Al-Nusra and other Jihadi groups are using to persuade civilians to join their organisations too.

I've noticed that there has been an unchecked look at if the Free Syrian army or other rebel groups actually have a positive or negative view of U.S intervention. 

On one documentary I watched on ISIS, one of their members showed a video to young male civilians who wanted to join the group and he had a bad reaction to it; it showed a news presenter saying that the U.S was backing one of the rebel groups in the war against Assad and the civilian had a bad reaction to that, feeling applaud that the U.S was on his side against Assad. Later he and his friends presumably joined ISIS.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 22, 2014)

Distance said:


> But the U.S is also backing the Gulf States, which ISIS, Al-Nusra and other Jihadi groups are using to persuade civilians to join their organisations too.
> 
> I've noticed that there has been an unchecked look at if the Free Syrian army or other rebel groups actually have a positive or negative view of U.S intervention.
> 
> On one documentary I watched on ISIS, one of their members showed a video to young male civilians who wanted to join the group and he had a bad reaction to it; it showed a news presenter saying that the U.S was backing one of the rebel groups in the war against Assad and the civilian had a bad reaction to that, feeling applaud that the U.S was on his side against Assad. Later he and his friends presumably joined ISIS.


It's not surprising considering the Saudis are in a cold war with Iran. Point Mega is saying is we should have been arming the FSA much earlier to counter the Iranians. Obama didn't want to do that during an election year, something Hillary pointed out.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 22, 2014)

> Dozens Killed at Sunni Mosque in Iraq After Attack on Shiite Leader
> By BEN HUBBARD AUG. 22, 2014
> 
> BAGHDAD — Dozens of Sunni worshipers were killed during a militant raid on a rural mosque in central Iraq on Friday, an attack that security officials said had followed the attempted assassination of a local Shiite leader.
> ...



Oh yeah, because this is _certainly_ not going to piss off the Sunnis even more when you're trying to form a coalition government and cause them to join ISIS.


----------



## Prince Vegeta (Aug 22, 2014)

That article just proved my point. Shia and sunni can never co-exist peacefully.

Iraq should be seperated into three parts. 

Kurds 

Sunni

And shia.


----------



## Nordstrom (Aug 22, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> Taliban killed Iranian Revolutionary Guards and hung their mutilated bodies in public squares in the 90's/early 2000's, didn't stop Iran from supporting them later.



Reagan financed the Mujahideen, yet nobody seems to remember this shite...



Prince Vegeta said:


> I hope US will support Independent Kurdistan at least for northern part of Iraq. The Kurds are the best allies that US has in Iraq.



I approve of this. Independent Kurdistan is definitely a thing that has been on my mind for some time now.

Just, update their gear.



baconbits said:


> So the point is that Iran is very pragmatic when it comes to pursuing power.  With that in mind we ought not do any negotiations with them on this regard since...
> 
> 1. We may need their help.
> 2. Its already in their interest to eliminate ISIS.



Fixed. Right with the second one though. Iran is probably telling them they'll barge in earlier if they let them go Israel, whereas if they don't, they will only move when they get to close.



Prince Vegeta said:


> Hence US should have supported the Kurds earlier before the Yezidi's, Christians and other religious minorities got into this mess. There is no such thing as unity of Iraq the Obama administration should realize that the Sunni's and the Shia's can't live with each other peacefully.
> 
> btw Iran along with Russia were also against US attacking Assad regime.



This could do.

Also, what's the problem with backing up the guy who was attempting to get rid of these nutcases to begin with?

Yeah, I get the Stalin esque purges. But if the US saw it as important, they could've just barged in regardless. The US and NATO don't have to agree and the UN won't tie them down for that.



Megaharrison said:


> Iran's imperial adventure and meddling in Syria is what caused ISIS to gain momentum in the first place.



Oh no sir, IS would've been born regardless. All Iran did was accelerate it.



Kagekatsu said:


> It's more an inadvertent case. Iran has kept Assad, a fellow Shia, propped up with manpower and resources, which together with Russia and China, is keeping the war prolonged indefinitely. Which in turn is causing many Sunnis to snub the moderate Free Syrian Army in favor of ISIS, Al-Nusra and other Jihadist groups. And its because the war has been so chaotic due to the interference of those three countries that ISIS was able to build its powerbase to launch its invasion of Iraq.



So basically, it's a case of two soul buddies supporting each other.



Megaharrison said:


> ISIS formed out of a vacuum for international abandonment of Syria and no other viable alternative to battle Assad, who himself was only saved by Iran and their foreign fighter Islamist army Hezbollah. Iran turning the Assad regime into a Shia puppet alienated the non-alawite and Sunni community and gave ISIS recruitment tools. Had Assad stepped down or been defeated early this would not have occurred.
> 
> The Syrian opposition, initially secular and calling for an end to Syria's de facto monarchy, was radicalized when the world did nothing in the face of Assad's butchery. Non-intervention can have just as much (often worse) blowback as intervention.



So we should blame Assad for not being a Sunni and disliking Sunni Islamists?

Intervention would've only worsened the Civil War. I get what Assad did just kicked things into motion, but to put the sole blame in him is pointless. If people wanted him out from power, they would've joined the ranks of the FSA rather than IS. The reason for this war lies in the Sunni-Shiite bullshit.

I don't deny arming the FSA would've helped though. I believe giving people the tools to decide for themselves what to do is better than just invading.



Kagekatsu said:


> It's not surprising considering the Saudis are in a cold war with Iran. Point Mega is saying is we should have been arming the FSA much earlier to counter the Iranians. Obama didn't want to do that during an election year, something Hillary pointed out.



I agree, but it's not like Obama could risk doing that without his ratings plummeting.


----------



## Prince Vegeta (Aug 23, 2014)

The Iraqi Government hasn't provided KRG budget for over 6-7 months and forbid KRG to sell their own oil directly, Nuri Al-Maliki is a dick the new PM isn't any better he too is against the kurds. it's funny how the Arabs that fled from Mosul and other areas still hate kurds despite being protected by the kurds against Isis.


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 23, 2014)

UN calls for action to prevent massacre at town besieged by ISIS militants



> 23 August 2014 Last updated at 13:06 ET
> 
> Iraq conflict: UN warns of possible Amerli 'massacre'
> 
> ...


----------



## Krory (Aug 23, 2014)

Wait, what's going on in Iraq?


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 23, 2014)

Megaharrison said:


> ISIS formed out of a vacuum for international abandonment of Syria and no other viable alternative to battle Assad, who himself was only saved by Iran and their foreign fighter Islamist army Hezbollah. Iran turning the Assad regime into a Shia puppet alienated the non-alawite and Sunni community and gave ISIS recruitment tools. Had Assad stepped down or been defeated early this would not have occurred.
> 
> The Syrian opposition, initially secular and calling for an end to Syria's de facto monarchy, was radicalized when the world did nothing in the face of Assad's butchery. Non-intervention can have just as much (often worse) blowback as intervention.



I doubt that Assad had needed Iran's help if all he had to deal with were only Syrians, without outside help. The Oppostion, including Jihadists groups, had the support from adversaries of Iran pretty much from the getgo. That's when Iran stepped in and I can't blame them.

It's foreign intereference that turned the Syrian uprising into a lengthy and bloody civil war. Unlike other Arab rulers, Assad had too much support from within Syria to be toppled, and would have won the struggle for power with a fraction of the casualites we have now, if foreign powers had stayed out of it. By now millions of Syrians could be living a relative peaceful life again and under their own intact roofs, instead of being scattered all over in refugee camps.


----------



## x5exotic (Aug 23, 2014)

Prince Vegeta said:


> That article just proved my point. Shia and sunni can never co-exist peacefully.
> 
> Iraq should be seperated into three parts.
> 
> ...





Any country lacking a good form of government will have these types of petty conflicts.
Especially when there is a third party trying to turn them against each other.


It's not like any and every single sunni is trying to kill any shiite or vice versa. Many don't really give a darn.


----------



## Edward Newgate (Aug 24, 2014)

A journalist claims to identify the ISIS training camp by looking at the photos ISIS themselves uploaded.



For further read, with more photos:


Impressive. Time to send a drone.


----------



## Prince Vegeta (Aug 24, 2014)

x5exotic said:


> Any country lacking a good form of government will have these types of petty conflicts.
> Especially when there is a third party trying to turn them against each other.
> 
> 
> It's not like any and every single sunni is trying to kill any shiite or vice versa. Many don't really give a darn.



True it's not like every single Sunni is trying to kill Shiite or vice versa but the hate is present, not too long ago the Shia created an organization that would kill people with the name Omar they killed a handful people with that name. The Sunni and Shiite hate each other in general and both of them Hate the Kurds even more, hence the Kurds don't even want to stay as part of Iraq history shows how they've treated the Kurds.


----------



## Hozukimaru (Aug 25, 2014)

> *Iraq forces defeat militant push to take oil refinery​*
> *Iraqi government forces say they have defeated a militant attack on the country's largest oil refinery, killing several insurgents.*
> 
> The Baiji refinery in northern Iraq has been the site of several battles between government forces and militants over the past few months.
> ...



http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-28917609

And ofc the usual map with all the locations mentioned in the article:


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 25, 2014)

Syria offers assistance to combat ISIS



> 25 August 2014 Last updated at 10:50 ET
> 
> Syria's foreign minister has offered to help the US fight the Islamic State (IS) militant group, which has seized swathes of land in Iraq and Syria.
> 
> ...



Terrorism really makes strange bedfellows


----------



## Kagekatsu (Aug 25, 2014)

*Obama approves surveillance flights over Syria*



> MIDDLE EAST
> 
> Obama Approves Air Surveillance of ISIS in Syria
> By MARK LANDLER and HELENE COOPERAUG. 25, 2014
> ...


----------



## dr_shadow (Aug 26, 2014)

Someone is thinking the same as me:



> *The arrival of the Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham (ISIS) onto the global stage with its recent invasion of northern Iraq has induced panic not only in the region but throughout the world.*
> 
> This panic has been particularly felt in Western capitals among political elites whose disastrous policies in the region have created the chaos, instability, and despair out of which these religious fanatics have emerged.
> 
> ...


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 26, 2014)

> *Iran supplied weapons to Iraqi Kurdish forces -Kurdistan President
> *
> Aug 26 (Reuters) - Iran supplied weapons and ammunition to Iraqi Kurdish forces, Kurdistan President Massoud Barzani said Tuesday at a joint press conference with Iranian foreign minister Mohammad Javad Zarif in Arbil, capital of Iraq's autonomous Kurdish region.
> 
> ...





:rofl


----------



## Mael (Aug 26, 2014)

Wow super cool story.


----------



## Distance (Aug 26, 2014)

It's so wonderful that one terrorist organisation has caused so many states that are adversaries to the U.S to suddenly become a helpful ally. Maybe terrorist organisation aren't a completely negative thing afterall.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 26, 2014)

Don't be so bitter, Maeli. I'm sure the US media will manage to downplay or even ignore Iran's effort and involvement in the fight against IS, which will allow you to do the same and keep your well-sustained grudge against Iran. Just as they managed to downplay or even ignore the support for the IS and other Jihadist groups that came flowing from Saudi Arabia and your other allied Gulf States, therefore allowing you to do the same and not force you to question your alliance with them. Thank god for that!


----------



## Mael (Aug 26, 2014)

Or maybe I just already know Iran's dipping its hand in to stop such a horrid Sunni expansion.  It's common knowledge since Maliki's Shia government was shit despite Iran's help.

It's ME Geopolitics 101.

I just know you also like to worship the ground the Ayatollah walks on is all.


----------



## Son of Goku (Aug 26, 2014)

Mael said:


> I just know you also like to worship the ground the Ayatollah walks on is all.



Yet another flamebait, wrapped in more unfounded bullshit? Oh that's just soo you!


----------



## Cardboard Tube Knight (Aug 26, 2014)

SoG is here to teach us more about the evil West.


----------



## Mael (Aug 26, 2014)

Cardboard Tube Knight said:


> SoG is here to teach us more about the evil West.



DURRR FLAEMBATE!


----------



## Island (Aug 26, 2014)

mr_shadow said:


> Article


This is the same old sensationalist, anti-American rhetoric that I'd expect from RT.



> In 1973 the US dropped more bombs on Cambodia in just a few weeks than it dropped on Japan in the Second World War. This small country across the Republic of Vietnam’s western border, with in 1973 a population of between 7-8 million people, found itself on the receiving end of the equivalent of five Hiroshimas.


Of course more bombs were dropped on Cambodia than on Japan. That's the changing nature of war, not some maniacal ambition to exterminate Cambodians everywhere.

Mostly because rocketry didn't exist until 1944-1945 but also because asymmetrical warfare, you're going to be more likely to bomb targets that don't have a chance of shooting your planes or missiles down in the process.

Also, five "Hiroshimas" isn't a whole lot. The atomic bombs that destroyed Hiroshima and Nagasaki were hilariously small compared to nuclear weapons of today, and the article is obviously playing at its readers' ignorance to that fact.

This is the equivalent to saying "There have been more drone strikes in the last decade than the entirety of both World Wars." Well, no shit. That's the changing nature of warfare.



> The Khmer Rouge at the time was a marginal Maoist cult in Cambodia. Led by Pol Pot, a former Buddhist monk, they had no base of support and its influence was nonexistent. The mass bombing of the country, the destruction and chaos it wrought changed that. By 1975 the Khmer Rouge had managed to take over the country, whereupon they immediately embarked upon one of the most brutal and barbaric campaigns of genocidal violence the world has seen. With the objective of taking the country back to Year Zero, an agrarian pure communist society, they forcibly depopulated Cambodian cities and towns, sending people into the country to work on the land in communes. Thousands died from disease and starvation, others were worked to death, while thousands more were tortured and executed. Teachers, doctors, lawyers, people who’d been educated, Buddhist monks, non Cambodians, all were slaughtered in the Khmer Rouge’s campaign to purify the country of anything which did not conform to their twisted worldview, setting up a network of slave labor camps and torture centers throughout the country in which brutality knew no bounds. By the end of their reign a third of Cambodia’s population had perished. It was, in the famous words of Hannah Arendt vis-?-vis the Holocaust, the banality of evil.


Because the US is totally responsible for this, right?

Also, I'm pretty sure a Holocaust reference is Godwin's law.



> The brutal rule of Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge lasted until 1979, when after defeating the might of the US military forces and their collaborators, the armed forces of the Republic of Vietnam entered the country to liberate its people. The response of the West to the liberation of Cambodia was to impose economic sanctions on the country. This was an act of nauseating cruelty against a beleaguered people whose only crime was that they had been liberated by a country, Vietnam, that had refused to accept its colonial status and thrown off the yoke of Western domination.


More "evil Westerners" bullshit.

It's for this reason that RT is banned. This article isn't even relevant to ISIS. It's just some writer's cheap jabs at Cold War foreign policy and trying to make Pol Pot seem like the US's best friend.

I mean, the association between the two isn't _that_ far off, a power vacuum that some crazy takes advantage of, but after the first paragraph, the whole article turns to crap.


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## Jersey Shore Jesus (Aug 26, 2014)

Mael said:


> DURRR FLAEMBATE!



Well it is a flame bait...


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## Cardboard Tube Knight (Aug 26, 2014)

I am just happy that this story means we get to see more Marie Harf.


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## Jersey Shore Jesus (Aug 26, 2014)

Distance said:


> It's so wonderful that one terrorist organisation has caused so many states that are adversaries to the U.S to suddenly become a helpful ally. Maybe terrorist organisation aren't a completely negative thing afterall.



Thats the very definition of terrorism my friend.

"the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, *especially for political purposes*."





Mael said:


> Or maybe *I just already know Iran's dipping its hand in to stop such a horrid Sunni expansion*.  It's common knowledge since Maliki's Shia government was shit despite Iran's help.



How do you know this?


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## Prince Vegeta (Aug 26, 2014)

I dont trust Iran they are against Independent kurdistan in northern Iraq.

And education in Kurdish language is still forbidden in kurdish areas of Iran.


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## Hozukimaru (Aug 26, 2014)

The US defence minister said that besides the US and the Iraqi gov, seven other nations will provide equipment to the Kurds. These are: Albania, Canada, Croatia, Denmark, Italy, France, and the United Kingdom. 



More specifically I read somewhere that the Albanian delivery (which was a surprise to me, thus I searched for specifics) is composed of: 22 million cartridges for Kalashnikov rifles, 15,000 grenades, 20,000 anti-tank rounds and 32,000 rocket-propelled grenades and mortar missiles of various types.

These will be delivered to Iraq by Italy, presumably by the Italian air force, since the Albanian air force lacks fixed-wing aircrafts of all kinds.


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## Mael (Aug 26, 2014)

Jersey Shore Jesus said:


> How do you know this?



Are you REALLY this ignorant?

Iran has placed its hand in Syria to stop Sunni uprisings and Sunni extremist factions much like it did supporting Muqtada al-Sadr and the Mahdi Army in Iraq.  Iran is the predominate Shiite nation in the Middle East whereas the vast majority of the Middle East is Sunni.

Do the fucking math, kid.


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## Jersey Shore Jesus (Aug 27, 2014)

Mael said:


> Are you REALLY this ignorant?
> 
> Iran has placed its hand in Syria to stop Sunni uprisings and Sunni extremist factions much like it did supporting Muqtada al-Sadr and the Mahdi Army in Iraq.  Iran is the predominate Shiite nation in the Middle East whereas the vast majority of the Middle East is Sunni.
> 
> Do the fucking math, kid.



Just asking I'm still not 100% clear on the Shiite vs Sunni thing. Its weird.


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 27, 2014)

Jersey Shore Jesus said:


> Just asking I'm still not 100% clear on the Shiite vs Sunni thing. Its weird.



tl;dr of Shia vs Sunni

Main theological difference is who was the heir to Mohammad after he died.

Sunni thought the caliph should have been elected, Shia thought it should be someone in Mohammad's family. That's about it.


> The division between Shia and Sunni dates back to the death of the Prophet Muhammad, and the question of who was to take over the leadership of the Muslim nation. Sunni Muslims agree with the position taken by many of the Prophet's companions, that the new leader should be elected from among those capable of the job. This is what was done, and the Prophet Muhammad's close friend and advisor, Abu Bakr, became the first Caliph of the Islamic nation. The word "Sunni" in Arabic comes from a word meaning "one who follows the traditions of the Prophet."
> 
> On the other hand, some Muslims share the belief that leadership should have stayed within the Prophet's own family, among those specifically appointed by him, or among Imams appointed by God Himself.
> 
> The Shia Muslims believe that following the Prophet Muhammad's death, leadership should have passed directly to his cousin/son-in-law, Ali bin Abu Talib. Throughout history, Shia Muslims have not recognized the authority of elected Muslim leaders, choosing instead to follow a line of Imams which they believe have been appointed by the Prophet Muhammad or God Himself.



Its about as bullshit as religious schisms come.

As a geopolitical matter, Iran is the primary center of power of Shi'a islam whereas Saudi Arabia is the center of power for Sunni.

As far as populations go, Sunni make up the vast majority of muslims. Shi'a however are the overwhelming majority in Iran, a significant majority in Iraq and a minority (but the ones in power with the Assad regime) in Syria.

As a related sidenote: Saddam Hussein's government while secular, favored the sunni minority in Iraq and suppressed the shi'a majority. Thus when the US sought to completely remove the Iraqi state and rebuild it from scratch, they gave pmuch everything to the Shi'a majority. And like majorities who had been repressed generally do, they exact retribution. Which is why the sunni community in Iraq has been fertile ground for (formerly Al-Qaeda in Iraq) ISIS to use as a base of support.


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## Kagekatsu (Aug 27, 2014)

*U.S. preparing relief mission for Shia Turkmen in besieged city*




> Sources: US Considering New Relief Mission in Iraq
> 
> WASHINGTON ? Aug 27, 2014, 3:18 PM ET
> By ROBERT BURNS AP National Security Writer
> ...



Let's hope we get there before the city gets overrun.


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## Kagekatsu (Aug 30, 2014)




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## Hozukimaru (Aug 31, 2014)

The Iraqi army broke the siege and freed Amirli just now.



> *Government forces mainly composed of Kurdish peshmerga fighters and armed volunteers have broken through the Islamic State group siege on the town of Amerli located between Baghdad, and the northern city of Kirkuk, sources have told Al Jazeera.*
> 
> Iraqi forces and the armed volunteers entered the city on Sunday, where at leat 12,000 people have been trapped for over two months with dwindling food and water.
> 
> ...


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## Son of Goku (Sep 1, 2014)

> *U.S. and Iran Unlikely Allies in Iraq Battle*
> 
> _By TIM ARANGO and AZAM AHMEDAUG. 31, 2014
> _
> ...


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## Saishin (Sep 3, 2014)

> *Italy to start delivering arms to Kurds*
> 
> 'By Sep 10,' says Pinotti
> 
> ...


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## Kagekatsu (Sep 7, 2014)

U.S. launches airstrikes at ISIS forces surrounding the Haditha Dam

I think we can say this is no longer a "limited operation" now.


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## LyricalMessiah (Sep 7, 2014)

Juda said:


> Iraq hates us, why should we even help an enemy? dont ask the person whom you consider "Satanic" to help you. This is something that should only be handled by them.



Sometimes a brotha's gotta help a brotha out. Put our differences aside and help one another regardless of the false dogmas surrounding us.


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## Son of Goku (Sep 8, 2014)

> *In place of 'boots on the ground,' US seeks contractors for Iraq*
> 
> _By Seth Robson
> Stars and Stripes
> ...







[YOUTUBE]xm6hC2oW5P8[/YOUTUBE]

One possible answer to "Why do they hate us? "


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## Jin-E (Sep 8, 2014)

Kagekatsu said:


> U.S. launches airstrikes at ISIS forces surrounding the Haditha Dam
> 
> I think we can say this is no longer a "limited operation" now.



The administration has flat out stated that ISIS destruction is the goal now. Seems for now they are checking any advances by the terrorists until they can get the Sunni's onboard.


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## Kagekatsu (Sep 9, 2014)

Iraqi parliament swears in new unity government.

Glad they got this out of the way without too much trouble, having Kurdish and Sunni deputy PM's should help at least keep the coalition together until ISIS is defeated.


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