# Does anyone else have um...Super duper extremley horible Social Anxity =) =) ?



## StarlightAshley (Jan 10, 2019)

I have social anxiety bad..like really really bad..and I don't know anyone else who does so it's really hard for me because I have no one to talk to it about is their anyone here who can mabye relate?


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## Jim (Jan 10, 2019)

I'm socially normal


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 10, 2019)

Mider T said:


> Nobody has "extremley" anything.


You wouldn't say that if you knew how bad I have it!!
 my brain tottaly freezes when talking to strangers and I can't think of a single thing to say. My best conversations are "H-hi-hello, um how are you???, ...bye"  and that's just to my family!


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## Nep Nep (Jan 11, 2019)

No I don't.

Maybe you care too much about what others think. Might wanna work on that. Most peoples opinions on you are highly uninformed and thus worth squat.


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## Jim (Jan 11, 2019)

Nep Nep said:


> Might wanna work on that. Most peoples opinions on you are highly uninformed and thus worth squat.


I'll have you know squats are very valuable!
j/k


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## Nep Nep (Jan 11, 2019)

Jim said:


> I'll have you know squats are very valuable!
> j/k



I mean yah, everybody needs a nice, firm, plump ass.


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## The Gr8 Destroyer (Jan 11, 2019)

Nor will you know anyone else who does. You lot tend to not socialize.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 11, 2019)

Nep Nep said:


> No I don't.
> 
> Maybe you care too much about what others think. Might wanna work on that. Most peoples opinions on you are highly uninformed and thus worth squat.



That's not how it works!  I wish it was that easy, I already know that people's opinions don't matter, but I can't just decide that it's irrational and stop feeling afraid.

It's like any other phobia. It would be like telling a germaphobe 'Don't be afraid of eating food someone sneezed in, you wont get sick" or telling an arachnophobic "stop being afraid of spiders crawling all over you, it won't kill you.' 

Reasoning doesn't solve the problem, because the fear isnt a conscious or rational thing, its subconscious, an overwhelmingly negative feeling deeply ingrained in you, that comes out whenever the trigger arises. Sort of like PTSD. 



The Gr8 Destroyer said:


> Nor will you know anyone else who does. You lot tend to not socialize.


  Is that the case? I don't think it's scarce. Social Anxiety is like the most common mental disorder in the US, so I thought it shouldn't be that hard to find people who experience it. For me, as long as it's online, I'm fine with socializing, it doesn't trigger my anxiousness at all. But, maybe some people can't even do this much?? Or mabye the people who do have it don't want to talk about it.


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## Jim (Jan 11, 2019)

It helps to know what the other person is thinking at all times.


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## Magic (Jan 11, 2019)

Can't you go to like a therapy group?


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## Nep Nep (Jan 11, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> That's not how it works!  I wish it was that easy, I already know that people's opinions don't matter, but I can't just decide that it's irrational and stop feeling afraid.
> 
> It's like any other phobia. It would be like telling a germaphobe 'Don't be afraid of eating food someone sneezed in, you wont get sick" or telling an arachnophobic "stop being afraid of spiders crawling all over you, it won't kill you.'
> 
> ...



Then you need therapy or something not a bunch of basement dwellers on a forum


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## Jim (Jan 11, 2019)

Nep Nep said:


> Then you need therapy or something not a bunch of basement dwellers on a forum


yeah, basements can contain radon
j/k


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 11, 2019)

Omg will you shut up about my typos that's so not the point!


RemChu said:


> Can't you go to like a therapy group?





Nep Nep said:


> Then you need therapy or something not a bunch of basement dwellers on a forum


  That's the problem, most people with this issue don't ever get help, and try to just cope with it, because the act of going to a therapist or a group of strangers and talking to them, especially about your personal insecurities, would trigger their social phobia big time.  

That's why I was hoping I could find a few people that've been through this and might have some advice or could tell me how they've handled it, it's really common, more than 1 in 10 people have it apparently, so I'd expected some people on this forum might relate.. 

 At the very least this lets me know that what I feel isn't normal and confirms that most people aren't struggling as much as I am, it makes me feel a little better about myself, because I get a lot of harsh criticism from my family and friends about how bad I can be at socializing.


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## Nep Nep (Jan 11, 2019)

Well, that's life for ya' kiddo. 

You can muscle through the unpleasant bits and seek help from a professional or you can wallow in it forever.

Lots of things in life are scary and many people face some sort of anxiety. Even those without a mental disorder can face crippling/paralyzing anxiety.

But the choice is to sit there and let it fuck you in the ass or force yourself to deal with the unpleasantness to get to the nice bit on the other side. 

There is NO avoiding unpleasantness in life. You can go through it with your head held high or it can come to you and knock you on your fucking ass instead.

But again I doubt that advice is helpful to you. -Shrugs- Everybody says they have anxiety these days so you should be able to find someone who can help you.


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## Jim (Jan 11, 2019)

social gathering are ungodly amounts of boring and you're better off avoiding them when you can anyway


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## Mider T (Jan 11, 2019)

Don't ever listen to Jim's advice on social things.


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## Jim (Jan 11, 2019)

Mider T said:


> Don't ever listen to Jim's advice on social things.


why not? I'm just a normal person.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 11, 2019)

Nep Nep said:


> Well, that's life for ya' kiddo.
> 
> You can muscle through the unpleasant bits and seek help from a professional or you can wallow in it forever.
> 
> ...



It's not that I would rather stay like this for the rest of my life than to face unpleasantness..it's about the degree of unpleasantness that I can handle. 

As far as I know the therapy for getting over phobias works in tiny increments. Like baby steps...if you're afraid of heights, you don't immediately run the roof of a skyscraper and look off the edge. Rather..you would start by looking down from like 2 ft off the ground...then 4 feet..then 6 ft..and slowly and consistently build up your confidence with small amounts of height over long periods of time, until you worked yourself up to being able to do it from multiple stories.

if you just start off by throwing someone with a fear into a situation they aren't able to handle yet, it doesn't help them progress, it only reinforces their fears and will likely traumatize them worse. The ironic thing is if I was conditioned enough to be able to go talk to a therapist about all my problems openly. It means I would have already solved the problem on my own by that point anyways. Its a circular situation, its like having a fear of dogs, but all of the therapists being dogs themselves.  

I want to try to just help myself as much as I can on my own, but what makes me feel scared about my situation is.. I do socialize with strangers, if you live life in society socializing is unavoidable obviously, but despite me forcing myself to get through these daily interactions as best I can. I don't feel like it's helping in any noticeable way. I still feel just as painfully awkward overwhelmed nervous and terrified every time I interact with someone. I've never gotten drunk before, do you think I should try that and see if it helps make my anxiety go away?


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## Mider T (Jan 11, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> It's not that I would rather stay like this for the rest of my life than to face unpleasantness..it's about the degree of unpleasantness that I can handle.
> 
> As far as I know the therapy for getting over phobias works in tiny increments. Like baby steps...if you're afraid of heights, you don't immediately run the roof of a skyscraper and look off the edge. Rather..you would start by looking down from like 2 ft off the ground...then 4 feet..then 6 ft..and slowly and consistently build up your confidence with small amounts of height over long periods of time, until you worked yourself up to being able to do it from multiple stories.
> 
> ...


Seriously though, try masturbating under a table in public without anyone noticing.  Your anxiety will clear up really quickly!


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## Magic (Jan 11, 2019)

You could google the problem sure there are forums/ sub forums dedicated to this particular subject already.


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## Magic (Jan 11, 2019)

and next time you go to your doctor for a check up, speak up and tell them this.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 11, 2019)

Mider T said:


> Seriously though, try masturbating under a table in public without anyone noticing.  Your anxiety will clear up really quickly!


You're disgusting, you Sicko! Pig! 


RemChu said:


> and next time you go to your doctor for a check up, speak up and tell them this.


I don't have a doctor.. 


RemChu said:


> You could google the problem sure there are forums/ sub forums dedicated to this particular subject already.


I don't know how I feel about that..I feel like a community dedicated to something like this would be full of people who identify themselves by their issue..and I don't necessarily think that's a healthy mentality to be around.


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## Mider T (Jan 11, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> You're disgusting, you Sicko! Pig!


I don't suffer from anxiety


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## Magic (Jan 11, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> I don't know how I feel about that..I feel like a community dedicated to something like this would be full of people who identify themselves by their issue..and I don't necessarily think that's a healthy mentality to be around.





StarlightAshley said:


> I have social anxiety bad..like really really bad..and I don't know anyone else who does so it's really hard for me because I have no one to talk to it about is their anyone here who can mabye relate?



Is this a joke thread to you?

A quick google search






Forums to talk:




Literally took me a minute to search this.

How old are you @StarlightAshley ?

how come you have no doctor?


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 11, 2019)

RemChu said:


> Is this a joke thread to you?


 No it's not a joke! I want to talk to other people who can relate to my problem, I just don't like the idea of people being active members of a forum dedicated to it. I suspect those are people who have let the problem consume their lives, and are just there to complain to each other about how much having anxiety sucks, rather than being people who have already/are actively successfully dealing with it. I just don't want to be in such a negative atmosphere...I may have poor confidence but I'm very optimistic..if that makes sense..:S:S


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## Magic (Jan 11, 2019)

Sounds like you are afraid to confront the problem.


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## Magic (Jan 11, 2019)

but uh pretty sure there was a thread with this type of topic in this section already, you can dig that up and talk to those members.

gl


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## Phenomenon (Jan 11, 2019)

Yep had since childhood.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 12, 2019)

AJBeckyBlissRollins said:


> Yep had since childhood.


Yay finally found one! Has yours gotten better since then!?  

I feel like mines been getting worse over time..which is the scary thing. When I was really young I was shy of adults but people my own age I had no problem opening up around. 

But around the time of puberty and entering middle school it was like a light switch and suddenly I was terrified of embarrassing myself in front of all my peers and was afraid to talk to them. It was really hard to make new friends..but I could still be myself around the people I already knew. 

But then in high school I had a falling out with my friends, and have been basically alone ever since, which made me essentially totally mute and reclusive. I feel like going so long in social isolation has made my social skills really really rusty, which makes my confidence in social situations way worse, meaning my social anxiety is even higher than it's ever been..


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## Phenomenon (Jan 12, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Yay finally found one! Has yours gotten better since then!?
> 
> I feel like mines been getting worse over time..which is the scary thing. When I was really young I was shy of adults but people my own age I had no problem opening up around.
> 
> ...


Only way to build more confidence in yourself is going out and getting involved more such as maybe joining a social club or activity, It's a big step initially but that's what I did as hard as it sounds, But it's really the only way to fight the nerves back otherwise it never gets any better the more you isolate yourself.

If your willing to take the risk it will eventually pay off trust me.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Jim (Jan 12, 2019)

AJBeckyBlissRollins said:


>


That looks like he's extending a hand of packman


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 12, 2019)

RemChu said:


> Sounds like you are afraid to confront the problem.


  Ok maybe i'm being a little bit reserved but I can't help it, i'm sure if you were an alcoholic or something you would drag your feet about going to AA..seeing a bunch of people way farther in life still talking about struggling with this problem is only going to make me feel more scared about my situation.. also I can't find that thread.



AJBeckyBlissRollins said:


> Only way to build more confidence in yourself is going out and getting involved more such as maybe joining a social club or activity, It's a big step initially but that's what I did as hard as it sounds, But it's really the only way to fight the nerves back otherwise it never gets any better the more you isolate yourself.
> If your willing to take the risk it will eventually pay off trust me.


Well, that sounds like good advice, but for an introverted person, spending all of my free time socializing sounds like its going to totally exhaust me and make me hate my life. 

Also I used to be in some clubs in middle school and I just couldn't open up to anyone..it felt like I was wasting my time because I would show up, go through the experiences, but not gain any new friends or improve my social skills, because I wasn't actually talking to the people around me 

The closest thing was that I was in soccer for a while and I was a really good player so the other girls on the team liked me, and warmed up to me, but I didn't actually speak to them, even though it was an easy opportunity to become friends, I was so worried that as soon as I started speaking and they got to know my personality they would stop liking me..I felt like the only way to stay liked, was just to keep not talking to them and being a good teammate.


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## Kairi (Jan 12, 2019)

Don't know if this is a joke, but I have awful anxiety.

I have to take antidepressants every to calm down, with xanax for emergencies. Unfortunately I'm one of those people that get physical symptoms, so if I'm in a crowd of people and I'm already anxious, my stomach starts to hurt, my heart rate shoots up (I actually had to be kept overnight at the hospital because of my this), I start sweating, I've even puked before.

Your best bet would be to talk to your doctor and get a therapist.

Reactions: Like 1


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 12, 2019)

Kairi said:


> Don't know if this is a joke, but I have awful anxiety.
> 
> I have to take antidepressants every to calm down, with xanax for emergencies. Unfortunately I'm one of those people that get physical symptoms, so if I'm in a crowd of people and I'm already anxious, my stomach starts to hurt, my heart rate shoots up (I actually had to be kept overnight at the hospital because of my this), I start sweating, I've even puked before.
> 
> Your best bet would be to talk to your doctor and get a therapist.


No, why do you think it's a joke?  Do my problems amuse you? 

Oh you have panic attacks? I'm sorry, I'm so lucky I don't get those. Or at least I don't think so...my heart starts racing and I feel the need to go hide for a few minutes until I calm down, after a bad social interaction. I don't know if that's what a panic attack is or not. But It seems like you have much more generalized anxiety..because I only feel it when I actually have to interact with someone. 

and I don't have a doctor...but I'm very questionable about both of those things. A doctor I don't think will be able to help at all aside from recommending therapist, because all they can do is give you pills, and as far as I know their isn't a medication as of yet that effectively treats this disorder. As for a therapist...if all they do is listen to you talk to them, and then give you advice. Why is it necessary to go to one..if it makes me so uncomfortable? Can't I gain the same knowledge, without the need for all the money, time and personal interaction a therapist takes? 

Not to mention knowing my family they wouldn't even take me to a therapist anyways, they're not supportive at all, they would act like I am a hassle to them for asking them to take the time out of their days to take me to one and then tell me that I either don't need it or would just shame me and say I should have done it along time ago when the problem first arised and by now its too late.


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## Kairi (Jan 12, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> No, why do you think it's a joke?  Do my problems amuse you?
> 
> Oh you have panic attacks? I'm sorry, I'm so lucky I don't get those. Or at least I don't think so...my heart starts racing and I feel the need to go hide for a few minutes until I calm down, after a bad social interaction. I don't know if that's what a panic attack is or not. But It seems like you have much more generalized anxiety..because I only feel it when I actually have to interact with someone.
> 
> ...


I never said that they amused me, I just simply cannot tell if/when you're trolling.

I have generalized anxiety, but it gets amplified because I have social anxiety as well. And I'm not sure about what you've experienced, but my doctor and my therapist work together. I have appointments every month to see my doctor, and every week to see my therapist, and they both make sure that I am okay. If you do not want one then that's fine, but I don't think its possible to gain the same amount of knowledge as a therapist, who has gone to school for 6-8 years, just by researching yourself. Otherwise everyone would just do that.

There isn't medicine that specifically treat social anxiety, no, but low doses of antidepressants can make a world of difference.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 12, 2019)

Kairi said:


> I never said that they amused me, I just simply cannot tell if/when you're trolling.
> 
> I have generalized anxiety, but it gets amplified because I have social anxiety as well. And I'm not sure about what you've experienced, but my doctor and my therapist work together. I have appointments every month to see my doctor, and every week to see my therapist, and they both make sure that I am okay. If you do not want one then that's fine, but I don't think its possible to gain the same amount of knowledge as a therapist, who has gone to school for 6-8 years, just by researching yourself. Otherwise everyone would just do that.
> 
> There isn't medicine that specifically treat social anxiety, no, but low doses of antidepressants can make a world of difference.


I'm silly sometimes but i'm never trolling, don't believe people who say i'm a dupe. 

It's not practical to gain the same amount of knowledge as a therapist in as broad of a scope of issues true, but when you focus specifically on one small area of therapy, being your specific Anxiety disorder, it's very possible to become an expert about it on your own. :star:star

All the information taught in university exists for free online as well. And it's pretty idealistic to think that just because something can be done, it means everyone will do it. Anyone can be an expert on any subject online through self research, most people find other things they would rather do with their time. 

Phobias are one of the most common disorders in psychology, but also the most consistently treatable. And the best treatments are all internal stuff, that you can only do for yourself. Phobias aren't cured via medications or talking about your problems, all the therapist does is guide you on exercises you need to do to manage your anxiety. 

Phobias are illnesses of our thinking, when we feel the negative physiological symptoms, we start thinking negative thoughts, then run away from the situation, and reinforce the phobia. If we can condition our self to respond differently, and calm ourselves down instead, then we can overcome the fears! 

If your therapist wants you to spend the rest of your life with them because of your anxiety then I feel as though that's suspicious and they may just trying to get your money, rather than being interested in you being fixed.


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## Magic (Jan 12, 2019)

Bah, what is this sophistry. Get professional help, get a support group. You need it. 

This thread is a cry for help is it not?

Like literally very Ddj-esque, to make a thread ask a question, receive valid constructive advice and then talk down to the people giving advice as if you know better and have been doing fine all along.

Sasuga.


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## Magic (Jan 12, 2019)

Do you have an aversion to see a professional due to your past experiences?
Is healthcare where you live that bad?
How old are you ?


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 12, 2019)

RemChu said:


> Do you have an aversion to see a professional due to your past experiences?
> Is healthcare where you live that bad?
> How old are you ?


Yes I do have an aversion, and yes my family's poor as well, we're too poor to afford a dentist let alone a therapist or doctor..and no i'm not like DDJ I haven't been asking for advice for years and made no progress...this is the first time I've ever talked to anyone about having anxiety. 

I'm not trying to talk down to her, i'm just giving my opinion based off what I've read so far. It's not as if I told her cancel her therapist/doctor and stop her meds. 

This article says that they've found treatment for Anxiety is actually most effective without meds.  

I'm just doubtful that those things are absolutely needed for me to resolve this. I know their are people who have once been socially anxious and cured themselves without professional help.

Some illnesses you *can* deal with on your own others you can't. I want to try to fix myself..if its possible, because it would be an extremely more convenient method for me. I was hoping that I could find a support group here that would lead me in the right direction, not just say "Sucks to be you, go get a therapist or a doctor."


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## Phenomenon (Jan 12, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Ok maybe i'm being a little bit reserved but I can't help it, i'm sure if you were an alcoholic or something you would drag your feet about going to AA..seeing a bunch of people way farther in life still talking about struggling with this problem is only going to make me feel more scared about my situation.. also I can't find that thread.
> 
> 
> Well, that sounds like good advice, but for an introverted person, spending all of my free time socializing sounds like its going to totally exhaust me and make me hate my life.
> ...


It's you not opening up to them that may have caused you a setback that's the main issue with socializing is when people decide to welcome you in and then you suddenly worry what they may think of you, I'm willing to bet if they were seriously decent people then perhaps you could trust them enough with expressing your personality.

It's a two way street in the end with either good or bad results, Might aswell take the risk.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 12, 2019)

AJBeckyBlissRollins said:


> It's you not opening up to them that may have caused you a setback that's the main issue with socializing is when people decide to welcome you in and then you suddenly worry what they may think of you, I'm willing to bet if they were seriously decent people then perhaps you could trust them enough with expressing your personality.
> 
> It's a two way street in the end with either good or bad results, Might aswell take the risk.


thanks  I hope you're right.. but to be fully honest, I just feel like such a worthless person. I see all my peers being so much funnier, smarter and more socially adept than me. So when they are friendly or try to get me to open up to them, I feel like i'm only going to let them down, and that they could find better people to hang out with..and I kind of clam up and don't let them in. They only like me because they don't know me, and they don't realize how lame I am, because I keep my personality hidden. 

If i'm not as good as them and can't really bring anything of value to their lives, why should they want to be my friend? I have a long history of mean and abusive friendships and I think it stems from the fact that I was such a dumb and uninteresting person, so the only enjoyment my friends could ever get out of a relationship with me was to constantly pick on me.


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## Jim (Jan 12, 2019)

RemChu said:


> Like literally very Ddj-esque, to make a thread ask a question, receive valid constructive advice and then talk down to the people giving advice as if you know better and have been doing fine all along.


And for some reason, people say _I_ resemble DDJ 


StarlightAshley said:


> If i'm not as good as them and can't really bring anything of value to their lives, why should they want to be my friend? I have a long history of mean and abusive friendships and I think it stems from the fact that I was such a dumb and uninteresting person, so the only enjoyment my friends could ever get out of a relationship with me was to constantly pick on me.


is it a bad thing to be a dumb uninteresting person though? 
Given a short amount of time, you'll probably never see or hear from them again anyway, there's no obligation to be a person "worth" being a friend of. If they're your friend, fine, but realize they'll go away very soon regardless of how much you care for one another.

Whether or not someone is a good, interesting person, means little in the long run tbh

Reactions: Like 1


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 12, 2019)

Jim said:


> And for some reason, people say _I_ resemble DDJ
> 
> is it a bad thing to be a dumb uninteresting person though?
> Given a short amount of time, you'll probably never see or hear from them again anyway, there's no obligation to be a person "worth" being a friend of. If they're your friend, fine, but realize they'll go away very soon regardless of how much you care for one another.
> ...



Well..i'm not interested in having a bunch of shallow surface level 'friends', who don't really care about my well being. 'Friends' like that are only going to end up hurting me, because they won't be there for me. 

If i'm going to have friends, I'd want them to be people who improve my life when they're around, and vice versa. So, If I can't improve their life by being their friend, if I have no wisdom or skills or wit to offer them, then it means i'm not worthy of having good friends.


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## Jim (Jan 12, 2019)

I didn't say they would be shallow though, it's just the way life is. Friends can do _very_ little in someone else's life.


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## Island (Jan 12, 2019)

If your social anxiety is so bad that it's negatively impacting your life, go to a therapist. Unless you literally don't have health insurance, it shouldn't cost a lot to talk to one the first couple times, and if you're having trouble finding one, I'm sure your college/university has a counseling office.

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## Kathutet (Jan 12, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> It's not that I would rather stay like this for the rest of my life than to face unpleasantness..it's about the degree of unpleasantness that I can handle.
> 
> As far as I know the therapy for getting over phobias works in tiny increments. Like baby steps...if you're afraid of heights, you don't immediately run the roof of a skyscraper and look off the edge. Rather..you would start by looking down from like 2 ft off the ground...then 4 feet..then 6 ft..and slowly and consistently build up your confidence with small amounts of height over long periods of time, until you worked yourself up to being able to do it from multiple stories.
> 
> ...


Two things, really quick:

* You said that it happens in baby steps. It works the same way for social anxiety. Don't force it. You have to want it. And you do. So take the smallest steps you can think of. It's also fine to be shy. So work towards just being shy, not being a social butterfly.

* Alcohol is not a valid type of medication, help, or permanent solution. It's going to make you rely on alcohol all the time because you'll start treating it like medicine.

And also, self help is just self help. If your case is especially bad, at the very least consult a professional like a therapist. It's okay to recognize an issue, to want to rectify that issue perceived or otherwise, but it doesn't always work out just by rolling up your sleeves and saying "well then". These people are educated on the problem, they have all the information and information networks with which to help you.

You don't have to visit them for the rest of your life, but their knowledge is an important and strong foundation to rebuild yourself on. It's very important. So hear them out and ask for ideas.

Reactions: Like 1


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 12, 2019)

Jim said:


> I didn't say they would be shallow though, it's just the way life is. Friends can do _very_ little in someone else's life.


You don't think humans having bonds with other human beings is necessary for their mental health? like aside from all the ways friends are necessary and valuable to help you get ahead in life.. 

Just from an emotional aspect, having people you love and that love you back in your life is important or else you'll end up feeling alone and depressed. As someone with anxiety, whose lost all their friends and has a mean family I keep my distance from. I don't really have any meaningful relationships at this point and its starting to get to me. 

You don't know how important friends are until you don't have them. It makes you feel socially rejected, I don't even know if it's possible to have high self esteem when no one likes you. We get our validation from other people accepting us.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 13, 2019)

Island said:


> If your social anxiety is so bad that it's negatively impacting your life, go to a therapist. Unless you literally don't have health insurance, it shouldn't cost a lot to talk to one the first couple times, and if you're having trouble finding one, I'm sure your college/university has a counseling office.


Are you saying the school Councillor is qualified as a therapist? I don't want to go around telling everyone everywhere about my personal insecurities, it's really hard and painful for me to open up to people in person 


Kenneth said:


> Two things, really quick:
> 
> * You said that it happens in baby steps. It works the same way for social anxiety. Don't force it. You have to want it. And you do. So take the smallest steps you can think of. It's also fine to be shy. So work towards just being shy, not being a social butterfly.
> 
> ...


Well what's the difference between anxiety and shyness in your opinion? As far as I know, the diagnosis of social anxiety is once your fear is at the point where it holds you back from doing things you'd otherwise do.

I can conceivably believe that Ill be able to get myself to the point where I can force myself to do things that I get overwhelming anxiety from. But..if that's all it means to 'cure' anxiety..it's not a very bright thing to look forward too. 
If i'm still always going to be "shy" and extremely nervous and embarrassed when around people i'm not close with, I don't understand how I'll form genuine relationships with anyone..When you say it's fine to be shy are you just trying to be nice? I like shy people, but I can relate to them. I find it hard to believe normal people perter the company of shy people.

Also I know and that's why I'v never been drunk i'm afraid of who i'll become if I get drunk, maybe I'll lose all my inhibitions, and then i'll finally be able to socialize normally..and then for the rest of my life i'll realize if theirs an situation where I need to socialize I need to drink first or else I won't be able to get through it..

And maybe if going to therapy was just a one time thing I could work up the courage to do it but...if going to therapy once means its going to inevitably become a repeat thing that they try to rope me into for the rest of my life or even just for the long term..I can't cope with that much stress. Having to sit alone in a chair and have an hour and a half conversation with someone i'm not comfortable with once is a trial, but on a regular basis, it would just be torture for me.


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## Jim (Jan 13, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> You don't think humans having bonds with other human beings is necessary for their mental health? like aside from all the ways friends are necessary and valuable to help you get ahead in life..


i didn't say that, i was just saying that you shouldn't have a friendship where you're obligated to improve someone's life or expect it from someone else. If it happens, it happens, but it's not something you should expect. Especially since friends are so transient. Life just happens, and when it does, it's a mutual and sometimes unsaid understanding.

If you don't fish for deep friendships or make huge efforts to create deep friendships, you'll probably make more and deeper friendships. 



StarlightAshley said:


> You don't know how important friends are until you don't have them. It makes you feel socially rejected, I don't even know if it's possible to have high self esteem when no one likes you. We get our validation from other people accepting us.


I've already lost all of my friends IRL and i'm completely normal

Reactions: Like 1


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## Island (Jan 13, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Are you saying the school Councillor is qualified as a therapist? I don't want to go around telling everyone everywhere about my personal insecurities, it's really hard and painful for me to open up to people in person


If they're not, they can direct you to one.

Nobody at a counseling center is going to pretend to be a counselor when they're not. They'll be upfront with what they're trained and allowed to do.

Reactions: Like 1


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 13, 2019)

Jim said:


> i didn't say that, i was just saying that you shouldn't have a friendship where you're obligated to improve someone's life or expect it from someone else. If it happens, it happens, but it's not something you should expect. Especially since friends are so transient. Life just happens, and when it does, it's a mutual and sometimes unsaid understanding.


I can't help it..i'm super 'try hard', it's a habit I developed by necessity, I don't feel like i'm very good at things, so I have to try as hard as I can and then some to have any chance of successfully getting things everyone else gets effortlessly. 



Jim said:


> I've already lost all of my friends IRL and i'm completely normal


OH GOD NOOOOO!!! 



Island said:


> If they're not, they can direct you to one.
> Nobody at a counseling center is going to pretend to be a counselor when they're not. They'll be upfront with what they're trained and allowed to do.


I'm afraid of talking to strangers, it triggers an extremely negative response in me. I can't just talk about my problems like this to someone I don't know that's why I have to resort to asking for therapy advice online, so then mabye i'll be able to improve myself first to the point where I can be able to talk to a therapist and not have an anxious breakdown.


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## Jim (Jan 13, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> I can't help it..i'm super 'try hard', it's a habit I developed by necessity, I don't feel like i'm very good at things, so I have to try as hard as I can and then some to have any chance of successfully getting things everyone else gets effortlessly.


Well then, give up on trying to be a good person. You'll probably end up happier 

It may sound mean and think you'll turn into a mean unhappy person, but give it a try 


StarlightAshley said:


> OH GOD NOOOOO!!!


Yes, really, lol.
Probably been more than a decade now since I've had a friend.


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## Island (Jan 13, 2019)

Don't listen to Jim.


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## Kathutet (Jan 13, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Well what's the difference between anxiety and shyness in your opinion? As far as I know, the diagnosis of social anxiety is once your fear is at the point where it holds you back from doing things you'd otherwise do.
> 
> I can conceivably believe that Ill be able to get myself to the point where I can force myself to do things that I get overwhelming anxiety from. But..if that's all it means to 'cure' anxiety..it's not a very bright thing to look forward too.
> If i'm still always going to be "shy" and extremely nervous and embarrassed when around people i'm not close with, I don't understand how I'll form genuine relationships with anyone..When you say it's fine to be shy are you just trying to be nice? I like shy people, but I can relate to them. I find it hard to believe normal people perter the company of shy people.
> ...


There is some difference in anxiety and shyness because we're talking of a matter of degree. Anxiety is just shyness on steroids and it kicks your ass because it's angry at how the steroids made its dick smaller.

Shyness is okay because shyness is not crippling. It's comparatively speaking the bottom step of a very tall ladder, and you want to climb down from the anxiety mountain. Shyness is a goal to work to. It's about, using your words again, taking small steps. Take strides and you'll fall. But you being on the ground doesn't mean it's all over. You'll just be put on the mountain again, except now after that fall you'll be afraid of trying, and a little more every time you fall, until you stop taking risks to get to where you want to be.

You've already intellectualized that there is an issue, that there is a solution, that there is a pathway to what you want to work towards and end up at. That in itself was an important, first step.

It's now up to you to decide: do you want to take steps based on information you receive from people who know both the mountain AND the ladder you will use? Or do you take strikes and risk falling because you didn't call for help?

I understand that this is a problem you have that is a tight loop of events, as your anxiety prevents you from calling out for help, but you want less anxiety, but the best and safest way is to call for help...

So I propose to you this: on your best day, your happiest day where you feel like you've taken a little step closer, of any distance, on any step of the ladder, consider using that new-found confidence to reach out. You can give it a spin yourself first. But the help should always be on your mind. And on your worst day, remember that there is help.

It won't be easy, it will suck, you will be afraid the first few times, you will dread having to talk to someone. But it takes time you will have to invest to see results. You've said all this yourself earlier. Time, effort, and so on. You know that deep in your heart. You understand that. It's going to suck for a while until it doesn't, but when it stops sucking (as bad) you will feel like you have a grasp on yourself, like you've begun to conquer your mountain. And that's when you're going to be able to start thinking about taking strides. Let your confidence, which you will gain if you take baby steps, do the heavy lifting.

And again, none of us are professionals here. What we say might be the best thing in the world or the worst. That's why you should reach out to a therapist. I don't have social anxiety, I don't believe a lot of people here have it, but I'm damn sure that it's draining and crippling and severely limiting to have it. So step on, and good luck.


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## Jim (Jan 13, 2019)

Kenneth said:


> Anxiety is just shyness on steroids and it kicks your ass because it's angry at how the steroids made its dick smaller.


Interesting metaphor?


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## The Gr8 Destroyer (Jan 13, 2019)

Kenneth said:


> * Alcohol is not a valid type of medication, help, or permanent solution. It's going to make you rely on alcohol all the time because you'll start treating it like medicine.



Fuck you Kenny I don't tell you how to form a Rasengan without shadow clones so don't you tell me how to go about with the doctoring and pharmaceuticalizing.


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## Nep Nep (Jan 13, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> thanks  I hope you're right.. but to be fully honest, I just feel like such a worthless person. I see all my peers being so much funnier, smarter and more socially adept than me. So when they are friendly or try to get me to open up to them, I feel like i'm only going to let them down, and that they could find better people to hang out with..and I kind of clam up and don't let them in. They only like me because they don't know me, and they don't realize how lame I am, because I keep my personality hidden.
> 
> If i'm not as good as them and can't really bring anything of value to their lives, why should they want to be my friend? I have a long history of mean and abusive friendships and I think it stems from the fact that I was such a dumb and uninteresting person, so the only enjoyment my friends could ever get out of a relationship with me was to constantly pick on me.



Oh my god dude. You are overthinking EVERYTHING.

Look most people only care that you have one or two similar interests and that you won't stab them in the back.

If you can do that tell your dumbass brain to stfu with the worthless bs.

We're all worthless meatbags in the end anyways. The only thing that matters is how many other worthless meatbags lives you made better just by being their company.

Those people you think are smarter, funnier blah blah aren't they're just not crippled with fear like you.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kathutet (Jan 13, 2019)

Jim said:


> Interesting metaphor?


Jim, you have no idea. I've got plenty of them, Jim. In fact, I've got too many.

Please take some off my hands. The weight is crushing me.



The Gr8 Destroyer said:


> Fuck you Kenny I don't tell you how to form a Rasengan without shadow clones so don't you tell me how to go about with the doctoring and pharmaceuticalizing.


Alcohol is two things

Temporary meds that later on will make you very dependent on them
A liquid blanket



So there's no malpractice or fingerpointing here doctor, it's just not what this patient needs


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 13, 2019)

Nep Nep said:


> Oh my god dude. You are overthinking EVERYTHING.
> 
> Look most people only care that you have one or two similar interests and that you won't stab them in the back.
> 
> ...



I really want what you say to be true, if I was just nice enough people would like me and be just as nice to me back. But that's not how it's ever worked out for me. I've always been kind to my friends.

But because I had nothing of value to offer to them, my "friends" didn't treat me like their "friend", they treated me like someone they kept around to make fun of. They were always laughing at me, not with me.

I can shift the blame and just say "well the people I make friends with are all just bad people" or instead, I could look at myself and ask what I'm doing wrong to always end up with bullies for friends. Maybe my friends treated me badly because I don't have enough value for them to respect me.


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## Nep Nep (Jan 13, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> I really want what you say to be true, if I was just nice enough people would like me and be just as nice to me back. But that's not how it's ever worked out for me. I've always been kind to my friends.
> 
> But because I had nothing of value to offer to them, my "friends" didn't treat me like their "friend", they treated me like someone they kept around to make fun of. They were always laughing at me, not with me.
> 
> I can shift the blame and just say "well the people I make friends with are all just bad people" or instead, I could look at myself and ask what I'm doing wrong to always end up with bullies for friends. Maybe my friends treated me badly because I don't have enough value for them to respect me.



Well my ex did always say Canadians were fucking pricks.

Either way you're 16? Give it time. The dumbass kids will have to grow up soon and they'll realize the value of just having someone nice to talk to.


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## Karma (Jan 13, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> I really want what you say to be true, if I was just nice enough people would like me and be just as nice to me back. But that's not how it's ever worked out for me. I've always been kind to my friends.
> 
> But because I had nothing of value to offer to them, my "friends" didn't treat me like their "friend", they treated me like someone they kept around to make fun of. They were always laughing at me, not with me.
> 
> I can shift the blame and just say "well the people I make friends with are all just bad people" or instead, I could look at myself and ask what I'm doing wrong to always end up with bullies for friends. Maybe my friends treated me badly because I don't have enough value for them to respect me.


I'd need specifics to be sure, but from my experience with anxiety I'm willing to bet a lot of this is in ur head.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 13, 2019)

Luck said:


> I'd need specifics to be sure, but from my experience with anxiety I'm willing to bet a lot of this is in ur head.


Well okay if you're willing to listen to me recount the sad story of me losing all my friends, at the start of highschool...

I had a group of 5 friends, I know that it's apparently normal for friends to be mean to each other playfully, although that's not something I've ever done, I thought the fact that they would pick on me all the time, was just normal. 

The thing about it however, was it was always me, it's not that they would tease and pick on each other as well, they all would just take turns making mean jokes at my expense or doing annoying or cruel things to me. I used to walk with my friends to resturants for lunch for example, and they would like pick berries off the trees chew them up then spit them on me from behind as we walked.  

Or They would reach into my bag while I was walking, pull out my stuff and throw it onto the road, then all laugh together about it. They would act like typical bullies to me, but they were my "friends". I'm usually a really agreeable and passive person so I would never get mad at them or anything like that. I would just ignore it and pretend it wasn't a problem.

So one day during the winter while we were walking to the store at lunch, they all started throwing snowballs at me, the entire time until we finally got to the restaurant, and I was soaking wet and freezing cold covered in snow. Once we got our food and left, a girl threw another snowball at me..and I'm really embarrassed about this but.. I lost it 

I got outwardly angry for the first time and just splashed my drink all over her and then she screamed and fell into the snow. My first reaction was excitement , I felt like I was finally joining in on the "teasing" thing friends do to each other, I smiled but as soon as I turned to look at my other friends, expecting to see them laughing about it the same way they did at me, I realized none of them were happy, their expression were all..disgust and annoyance. They didn't like what I did at all they were all like "Not cool Ashley...not cool."

And I just walked away. And never hung out with them again.  I spent the rest of high school with no friends. It's not that they didn't want to hang out with me anymore, they kept looking for me trying to make me hang out with them again, but I started hiding at lunch time in bathroom stalls or change rooms, eating lunch by myself in there to avoid them, until they eventually found me. But I still refused to go hang out with them..so they tried to blackmail me and said they would tell everyone rumors about me if I didn't start hanging out with them again.

But I didn't care, I had already decided I wouldn't let them hurt me anymore..so they stopped bothering with me, and started spreading rumors about me around school to spite me, they said stupid things like I had STDS or they caught me touching myself in the bathroom. And people believed them!!! .

Anyways after that that I was all alone, I pretty much became a total mute because I had no one I was comfortable enough to talk to at school anymore, and even the people who were nice to me and tried to offer me to hang out with them, I brushed off. I was so traumatized by my realization that all my friends since middle school didn't really like me and were just bullies, that I stopped trusting people completely. 

I believe that anyone I make friends with is only gong to be nice at first, before they get to know me, to trick me into opening up to them..and then they're going to be mean to me and treat me badly to amuse themselves because that's the only value I have!!!


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## Jim (Jan 13, 2019)

I'd say just forget who you label friend and socialize as necessary. It will feel less like an obligation if you never sign the friend contract . Also, people who aren't your friends are probably going to treat you better because generally people are polite to strangers. (don't sign the friend contract!  )


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## Karma (Jan 13, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Well okay if you're willing to listen to me recount the sad story of me losing all my friends, at the start of highschool...
> 
> I had a group of 5 friends, I know that it's apparently normal for friends to be mean to each other playfully, although that's not something I've ever done, I thought the fact that they would pick on me all the time, was just normal.
> 
> ...


Yeah this definitely sounds more like bullying rather than teasing, especially with the spreading rumors part.

How long were u friends with these girls prior to when they started bullying u? Did all of them start bullying u at once or was it one after the other?


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 14, 2019)

Jim said:


> I'd say just forget who you label friend and socialize as necessary. It will feel less like an obligation if you never sign the friend contract . Also, people who aren't your friends are probably going to treat you better because generally people are polite to strangers. (don't sign the friend contract!  )


That's exactly what my mentality became after I had that horrible experience with my friends. I decided that people are nicer to strangers than they are to their close friends. And so the only way to keep people treating me with respect, is if I never get closer to them than someone they say Hi to when they walk by. 



Luck said:


> Yeah this definitely sounds more like bullying rather than teasing, especially with the spreading rumors part.
> How long were u friends with these girls prior to when they started bullying u? Did all of them start bullying u at once or was it one after the other?


Well from what I've heard, in any group it's normal for a hierarchy to arise, as in, for someone to be on the bottom that everyone picks on, and someone to be on top that sets a precedent for the others. I guess my situation is a kind of novel, because I didn't come into it as the bottom person, I actually started off as the leader of my social group, all of them were my friends separately first, and then I brought them all together. I had the best grades, was the most superficially pretty, and had the most social clout, so they treated me like I was special and looked up to me, and we had a lot of fun back in middle school 

But around the beginning of high school, they eventually started being really mean to me when they were together as a group. I don't know if it's some kind of mob mentality thing, but they were definitely a lot worse to me when they were all together than they would ever be if it were just us one one one. It's as if when its just two of us, they're trying to appease me and treat me like their friend. But as soon as it was all of us as a group, then they were only trying to appease each other, by having fun together bullying me.

And I just realized something! As soon as we got to high school, I wasn't in any of the same classes as my friends, but they all ended up in the same classes together. So even though we would still hang out together at lunch in high school, they were getting a lot closer with each other, without me. I suppose because of that, they stopped looking at me as the centerpiece to their social circle, and started to demote me as more of an outsider of their clique. That would explain why they started bullying me shortly after high school started!!


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## Jim (Jan 14, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> That's exactly what my mentality became after I had that horrible experience with my friends. I decided that people are nicer to strangers than they are to their close friends. And so the only way to keep people treating me with respect, is if I never get closer to them than someone they say Hi to when they walk by.


Sounds like you're pretty golden then.


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## Karma (Jan 14, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Well from what I've heard, in any group it's normal for a hierarchy to arise, as in, for someone to be on the bottom that everyone picks on, and someone to be on top that sets a precedent for the others. I guess my situation is a kind of novel, because I didn't come into it as the bottom person, I actually started off as the leader of my social group, all of them were my friends separately first, and then I brought them all together. I had the best grades, was the most superficially pretty, and had the most social clout, so they treated me like I was special and looked up to me, and we had a lot of fun back in middle school
> 
> But around the beginning of high school, they eventually started being really mean to me when they were together as a group. I don't know if it's some kind of mob mentality thing, but they were definitely a lot worse to me when they were all together than they would ever be if it were just us one one one. It's as if when its just two of us, they're trying to appease me and treat me like their friend. But as soon as it was all of us as a group, then they were only trying to appease each other, by having fun together bullying me.
> 
> And I just realized something! As soon as we got to high school, I wasn't in any of the same classes as my friends, but they all ended up in the same classes together. So even though we would still hang out together at lunch in high school, they were getting a lot closer with each other, without me. I suppose because of that, they stopped looking at me as the centerpiece to their social circle, and started to demote me as more of an outsider of their clique. That would explain why they started bullying me shortly after high school started!!


Kids can be horrible, if a circlejerk goes unchecked it's only likely to get worse.

I'm not sure many years it's been but I'm sure if u tried to hang out with some of these girls now they'd probably apologize or at very least act much kinder to u. It's ok if u dont to see them any more too, I can understand that.

Since I'm guessing ur in college I'd reccomend making some friends there to hang out and talk with, its unlikely they'll treat u like those girls did since most people get their shit together by the time they leave high school. Friends can help u get out of ur comfort zone.

Reactions: Like 1


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## YellowCosmos (Jan 14, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> I feel like mines been getting worse over time..which is the scary thing



It's not gonna get better by itself.
The longer you wait and the more you let social anxiety dictate what you feel and do, the more debilitating it will become, because you'll be only reinforcing that behaviour.

If you suffer from severe social anxiety, going to a therapist is a good idea.
First, actually going to a therapist is the opposite of reinforcing socially anxious behaviour.
Second, it's gonna be easier to talk to that therapist than anybody else, because that's the therapist's professional function.
Third, therapy can actually help if you stick to it.

I know that actually going to a therapist can seem daunting, but do it anyway.
You have to routinely challenge those feelings and thoughts if you want to get over social anxiety. There's no other way.

Reactions: Like 1


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 14, 2019)

Jim said:


> Sounds like you're pretty golden then.


But then what do I do about my lonliness? 


Luck said:


> Kids can be horrible, if a circlejerk goes unchecked it's only likely to get worse.
> 
> I'm not sure many years it's been but I'm sure if u tried to hang out with some of these girls now they'd probably apologize or at very least act much kinder to u. It's ok if u dont to see them any more too, I can understand that.
> 
> Since I'm guessing ur in college I'd reccomend making some friends there to hang out and talk with, its unlikely they'll treat u like those girls did since most people get their shit together by the time they leave high school. Friends can help u get out of ur comfort zone.


Yes it's been time since then, and yes I'd seen them after, and sure they tried to be kinder to me, but no they didn't apologize. But, I wasn't going to let them in again. If I did then wouldn't it mean that I learned nothing from the last time? The moral of what happend before, is that as soon as I get comfortable with people, they'll start abusing me. It's not only them, my family mistreats me as well! 


YellowCosmos said:


> It's not gonna get better by itself.
> The longer you wait and the more you let social anxiety dictate what you feel and do, the more debilitating it will become, because you'll be only reinforcing that behaviour.
> 
> If you suffer from severe social anxiety, going to a therapist is a good idea.
> ...


 Well I'm confused, because i'm getting mixed messages on this because the people I've asked on discord told me that I don't need therapy I just need practice talking to people, but the people here seem to be saying therapy is the only solution..


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## Karma (Jan 14, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> The moral of what happend before, is that as soon as I get comfortable with people, they'll start abusing me. It's not only them, my family mistreats me as well!


How does ur family mistreat u?


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## YellowCosmos (Jan 14, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> but the people here seem to be saying therapy is the only solution..



It's really the same solution. A therapist (based on my experience) will encourage you to get that practice and even suggest ways you can practice it that you can't think of on your own.

When I said that social anxiety won't get better on its own, I meant it won't get better if you don't take serious steps to challenge it. If you're not doing anything about it (example, not trying to make friends or starting conversations with strangers and whatever else is difficult for you), and if you find yourself unable to take those steps, therapy can help you do that.

Basically, the difference is between winging it on your own or trying to have some structure and professional advice.


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## Jim (Jan 14, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> But then what do I do about my lonliness?


just play some games, watch anime, and have fun 
People on discord are better than IRL friends probably.


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## Magic (Jan 14, 2019)

You should have talked to an adult about this while in high school. Were there literally no other people you could have hung out with ?
You could have told the guidance counselor what is going on, you have a mouth talk. Simply letting people walk all over you and treat you like trash is not being passive or shy. Have some self worth, self esteem. Speak up for yourself. 

Hiding in bathroom stalls to eat lunch that's dehumanizing and the way they treated you is wrong, but uh by never say anything or telling them to stop you permit this abuse. Like not all people are like this which should be obvious, a real friend watches out for you. A real friend gives you mutual trust and love. A friend will pick you up when you are down.

You clearly have a ton of mental and emotional baggage. How do you think you can tackle this by yourself when you could not solve this problem on your own before, clearly it seems your family is not  a supporting group for you. So maybe join a church or local community group. Do some volunteer stuff or something. Like uh practice talking and interacting with people in those "safe" environments.

People are good for the most part. You don't have to live like this. 


but uhhhh pretty clear you come from a shit home environment, and then this shit treatment at school results in the damaged person we have today.


So please do seek out some sort of support irl. Talking with randoms on the internet doesn't really solve anything.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 14, 2019)

Luck said:


> How does ur family mistreat u?


They are just not a typical "unconditional loving and supportive" family like I would expect. They treat me very coldly and are very hard on me. They're very unempathetic, controlling and aggressive people in my life. And they don't see me struggling socially and feel bad for me, they get mad at me for it and say things like "Stop acting like you're stupid smarten up and act like a normal person you're not retarded" or "I never wanted a child that doesn't talk to people you're so rude no wonder you don't have any friends ".  After I left my friends, when I realized I felt better being alone at school, than having friends who pick on me everyday, I realized I needed to do the same for my family, but I can't!! I'm stuck with them for now!!! 


YellowCosmos said:


> It's really the same solution. A therapist (based on my experience) will encourage you to get that practice and even suggest ways you can practice it that you can't think of on your own.
> 
> When I said that social anxiety won't get better on its own, I meant it won't get better if you don't take serious steps to challenge it. If you're not doing anything about it (example, not trying to make friends or starting conversations with strangers and whatever else is difficult for you), and if you find yourself unable to take those steps, therapy can help you do that.
> 
> Basically, the difference is between winging it on your own or trying to have some structure and professional advice.


Well...I have a kind of job, meaning my dad needs someone to run his store so I have to do it for him, and don't get payed..even though it's all the work and time of a normal job..but anyways, doing that I have to answer his phones and help the customers who come in and it forces me to talk to them even though i'm extremely awkward nervous and overwhelmed when I do so.

I've been doing it for a long time now though, and my anxiety hasn't 'magically disappear' by pushing myself like this. I still feel so horrible. Every time a customer walks through the door or the phone rings, I feel a sudden giant spike in stress and it feels so jarring literally like I just got slapped in the face. I have to try my hardest to hold myself together and try to calm my self down, not shake, or trip over my words, while I try to have a normal interaction to serve them, despite feeling immense anxiety. I have made tiny progress..I used to have immense phone anxiety and would never answer it, and now that I have been forced, I can answer it, but i'm still just as nervous and embarrassed the whole time on the phone. 

Its made me uncertain if theirs hope because..I care about helping others, more than I care about myself so I push myself into being social with the customers for the sake of doing the job and assisting them, but I don't actually notice any difference in how badly Im feeling anxiety before, during, and after the interactions. I'm not sure If I am improving from doing this.

It may have something to do with the fact that I don't consider most of the interactions I have with cusomters "successful" and it might be only worsening my fear of having them. My goal in the interactions, aside from helping the customers, is to make sure they walk away from the conversation, with a positive impression of me, or at least feeling happy they talked to me. If they walk away not caring about me that's fine, I don't mind them having no opinion of me at all. But Whenever a customer walks away and I get the impression that they think I was socially awkward, or dumb or rude..I get really really embarrassed and have a short panic attack as soon as the customer leaves. Most of my interactions are ending up that way...I need to learn how to consistently make the other person leave with a good impression.

 But my problem is when I get all anxious around strangers and my brain goes into fight or flight mode, I can't think, I can't even do simple math, It's like the creative part of my brain turns off. And I can't come up with anything to say that I don't know off the top of my head. So I can say "Hi, How can I help you?" "Bye, Have a Nice Day" but beyond that, I have absolutely NOTHING to say most of the time. If I have to be silent for like a few minutes while I get their bill ready, they feel awkward because i'm not talking to them, and I feel sooo horrible because I know they feel awkward because of me, but I have neither the knowledge of what else to say, or the courage to say something off the top of my head without filtering it.



RemChu said:


> You should have talked to an adult about this while in high school. Were there literally no other people you could have hung out with ?
> You could have told the guidance counselor what is going on, you have a mouth talk. Simply letting people walk all over you and treat you like trash is not being passive or shy. Have some self worth, self esteem. Speak up for yourself.
> 
> Hiding in bathroom stalls to eat lunch that's dehumanizing and the way they treated you is wrong, but uh by never say anything or telling them to stop you permit this abuse. Like not all people are like this which should be obvious, a real friend watches out for you. A real friend gives you mutual trust and love. A friend will pick you up when you are down.
> ...



The principle did call me into their office and try to force me to go to the guidance Councillor. I guess they realized I had no friends and was frequently skipping classes everyday. But I didn't ever go to the guidance Councillor. I wouldn't have been comfortable talking to them and the whole situation just made me feel even more embarrassed!! 

And yes I do have low self esteem but, I don't get it from apropos of nothing, I think it's justified. I honestly believe that i'm not as competent as the majority of people. Friends and family members would all almost certainly all use 'incompetent' to describe me and would have trouble coming up with a lot of good traits, that is like the number one quality people don't want in a person. If no one in your life treats you like you're their equal except for people who don't know you, it probably means you're not a very valuable person.

I don't think you understand my perspective, I don't blame the people who have been bad to me for being bad people. Both my family and friends at certain points of my life, had treated me nice. My family was nice to me when I was very young, and my friends were nice to me before they got close, realized how useless I am, and got tired of me. I think they are 'good people', to normal people, but not to me. I think it would be extremely hard for me to find friends who were good enough people to be supportive and caring for me, that also didn't mind the fact that I have little value to offer their lives.

I do -think- I've found the reason and solution for the poor treatment the people in my life always give me, I just don't know how to reach the solution. I think the reason people are always bad to me, is because I suck. If I can become more valuable aka smarter, friendlier, funnier, richer, then friends and family would probably like me a lot more and finally start being nice to me.


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## Karma (Jan 14, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Wellc certain family members have done things I probably shouldn't share on here...but aside from that crazy stuff I won't mention. They are just not a typical "unconditional loving and supportive" family like I would expect. They treat me very coldly and are very hard on me. They're very unempathetic, controlling and aggressive people in my life. And they don't see me struggling socially and feel bad for me, they get mad at me for it and say things like "Stop acting like you're stupid smarten up and act like a normal person you're not retarded" or "I never wanted a child that doesn't talk to people you're so rude no wonder you don't have any friends ".  After I left my friends, when I realized I felt better being alone at school, than having friends who pick on me everyday, I realized I needed to do the same for my family, but I can't!! I'm stuck with them for now!!!


They seem emotionally unavailable.

Like I said, make some friends, maybe even boyfriend or find a school counselor/teacher to talk to. Itll help u in the long run.


StarlightAshley said:


> Well...I have a kind of job, meaning my dad needs someone to run his store so I have to do it for him, and don't get payed..even though it's all the work and time of a normal job..but anyways, doing that I have to answer his phones and help the customers who come in and it forces me to talk to them even though i'm extremely awkward nervous and overwhelmed when I do so.
> 
> I've been doing it for a long time now though, and my anxiety hasn't 'magically disappear' by pushing myself like this. I still feel so horrible. Every time a customer walks through the door or the phone rings, I feel a sudden giant spike in stress and it feels so jarring literally like I just got slapped in the face. I have to try my hardest to hold myself together and try to calm my self down, not shake, or trip over my words, while I try to have a normal interaction to serve them, despite feeling immense anxiety. I have made tiny progress..I used to have immense phone anxiety and would never answer it, and now that I have been forced, I can answer it, but i'm still just as nervous and embarrassed the whole time on the phone.
> 
> ...


I can relate to this from the time I worked in a lab. Despite being Brazilian, portuguese technically isn't my first language so I'd often times say something wrong or say something odd. Being afraid to say something weird made people think I was shy, which isn't the case.

U have to stop overthinking it, be yourself. As long as u do ur job well they wont mind if u come off as weird.


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## Magic (Jan 14, 2019)

> . If I can become more valuable aka smarter, friendlier, funnier, richer, then friends and family would probably like me a lot more and finally start being nice to me.


No no no this is not true. Unhealthy way to think. It's good to work on yourself and to self actualize but this is never the prerequisite to making friends or forming meaningful bonds.

You have value as a human being no matter what. Do not belittle yourself. It's really that simple.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 14, 2019)

RemChu said:


> You have value as a human being no matter what. Do not belittle yourself. It's really that simple.





Luck said:


> They seem emotionally unavailable.
> 
> Like I said, make some friends, maybe even boyfriend


But why would anyone want to be friends with a boring anti social person with severe social anxiety? People don't love me just for existing as a human on this planet. Or at least that's not the experience I've had in my life up until now. Not everyone is lucky enough to make good friends that care about you unconditionally.



Luck said:


> I can relate to this from the time I worked in a lab. Despite being Brazilian, portuguese technically isn't my first language so I'd often times say something wrong or say something odd. Being afraid to say something weird made people think I was shy, which isn't the case.
> 
> U have to stop overthinking it, be yourself. As long as u do ur job well they wont mind if u come off as weird.



But i'm not doing the job well! My dad's store isn't very organized a lot of the time only he will be able to help them, and he's barley there. So many of them i'm not actually capable of helping by myself. When a customer comes in, and I can successfully sell them what they want, then it kind of balances out the fact that I came off super shy awkward and uncomfortable. But when I waste their time by telling them I can't help them AND I'm being very awkward, that's when its nightmare levels of anxiety provoking. I'm a very agreeable people pleasing person, so its very difficult for me to let people down or say things that will make people unhappy. Some customers get angry at me when I have to tell them this and they walk out or don't come back, or they think that i'm just being lazy and don't want to help them.


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## Magic (Jan 14, 2019)

You should recite some affirmations,
Building up your sense of self.
Envision who you want to be and work towards that day by day.



> But why would anyone want to be friends with a boring anti social person with severe social anxiety?


If people here are encouraging you to get help or improve, you are again doing what I was saying asking for advice yet ignoring because you apparently know better. People are taking the time to try and point you in the right direction because they care. Again for the most part people are good and will help each other when they can. 

Like I've had friendships with people from all walks of life, young and old. It doesn't take much to build a friendship on it's just mutual respect, caring. Don't be so hard on yourself.


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## Karma (Jan 14, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> But why would anyone want to be friends with a boring anti social person with severe social anxiety?


Yes they do, u just have to make an effort on ur part to find them.


StarlightAshley said:


> But when I waste their time by telling them I can't help them AND I'm being very awkward, that's when its nightmare levels of anxiety provoking.


Wen this happens is it because u legitimately dont have wut they want, or is it because u simply dont know if u have it or not?


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 15, 2019)

RemChu said:


> You should recite some affirmations,
> Building up your sense of self.
> Envision who you want to be and work towards that day by day.
> 
> ...


It's easy for you to just say "Everyone is nice and wants the best for you" when that's all you've experienced with your friends. But with my "friends", every single time, they are meaner to me than I am to them. It's not mutual respect and caring, it's one sided. How can you explain that if "everyone is nice to one each other?" It's ignoring what i've experienced completely. I know that their are people here being kind to me and trying to help, and I appreciate that, but that's the difference, you people are not my friends. You're at most acquaintances, and from my experience. People are nice to strangers, they are nice to me before we get close, before I star opening up to them, but once we do get closer, once we are "friends" and they know me, and I know them, and they don't have to worry about putting up a front of politeness anymore to make a good impression. They get meaner.



Luck said:


> Yes they do, u just have to make an effort on ur part to find them.
> Wen this happens is it because u legitimately dont have wut they want, or is it because u simply dont know if u have it or not?



An effort at what expense? I've went through my entire life having toxic friendships. How many bad people do you want me to go through, until I get 'lucky' and stumble onto a genuinely good person? If all my friends are mean to me, couldn't it mean that i'm the problem? Isn't their something I need to change about myself, to stop this cycle? 

When I can't help the customers, what they want is in the store usually, but my dad is a hoarder, so I'm not capable of finding it in all of his garbage and junk. It's not organized, it's all messy. Only he knows exactly where he puts his things. Sometimes he will tell me things like 'this is here in case anyone wants to buy this and i'm putting these under here and I need you to do this and ect ect ect" he'll overload me with like 10 things at once and I can't remember it all.

Then a customer comes later, and asks me for something, and I have no idea where to find it so I say "My dad will have to look for it when he gets back sorry I probably won't be able to find it for you" and then the customer will sometimes question me or get angry at me or say things like "Well you shouldn't be here if you can't help people, what are you being paid for?" Even though i'm NOT being paid, then my dad will walk in, and say 'What's going on? Oh they want that? It's right here -lifts up a pile of junk next to me- and then he will throw me under the bus in front of the customer by saying something like 'I TOLD you that it was there before didn't I? Don't you listen? Is their something wrong with your brain?' And obviously this makes my anxiety go through the roof and lowers my self esteem even more. This sounds like an detailed and obscure scenario I know, but it happens almost every single day.


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## Mider T (Jan 15, 2019)

*Yawn* you bore me now.


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## Jim (Jan 15, 2019)

I'm pretty sure nobody here attempted to treat you nicely, considering it's the internet, lol


StarlightAshley said:


> This sounds like an detailed and obscure scenario I know, but it happens almost every single day.


No, sounds pretty typical imo. You're just caring too much. If you just let go it will be so much easier. You don't owe anyone your best efforts and you'll be yelled at and belittled regardless of what you do, so there's no real point in trying so hard to please others. Lol


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 15, 2019)

Mider T said:


> *Yawn* you bore me now.





Jim said:


> No, sounds pretty typical imo. You're just caring too much. If you just let go it will be so much easier. You don't owe anyone your best efforts and you'll be yelled at and belittled regardless of what you do, so there's no real point in trying so hard to please others. Lol


Are you trying to tell me that everyone is treated with contempt by the people in their lives? I know that's not the case, because I don't do the mean things to others, that I don't like being done to me. Assuming most people have the same moral values, I don't understand why so many people are so rude judgmental and unemphatic towards me. I can only assume it really is a problem that's my fault.


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## Jim (Jan 15, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Are you trying to tell me that everyone is treated with contempt by the people in their lives? I know that's not the case, because I don't do the mean things to others, that I don't like being done to me. Assuming most people have the same moral values, I don't understand why so many people are so rude judgmental and unemphatic towards me. I can only assume it really is a problem that's my fault.


Pretty much yeah. Just because you don't treat others like that does mean the rest of the world doesn't 
By treating others with contempt, they are fulfilling their righteous holy duty to punish those that don't agree with them.


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## MarF (Jan 15, 2019)

First of all I'm not a therapist or a doctor or anything like that. The following is based solely on my life experiences and nothing more. Maybe it can help you maybe not.

When I was a teenager I was fat, very shy and due to unknown medical reasons lost all my upper teeth over a span of 6 months. I was so socially awkward and shy if I saw a group of girls I legit couldn't walk past them. I had to go back and loop around them. In other words my life was shit. 

My familiy tried to help me in various ways like trying to motivate me to do sports or go out to the local discothek with my brothers or even just plain talking. And you know what? Nothing helped. It didn't help because I myself wasn't ready to change. Instead of bettering myself I looked for excuses and justifications.

One day when I was around 17 years old I realised that I actually genuinly hate myself and my life and that I'd rather kill myself than live another year like that. In other words I hit rock bottom.

So what did I do? I forced myself to ignore my fears and selfdoubts and went lookin for a job. After trying out various things I finally ended up in a supermarket. I liked the work, the pay was decent enough and most importantly the people working there were awesome. I still work there happily nearly 6 years later.

It wasn't easy at first, when somebody made a joke I usually just grinned and nodded without really answering and when a costumer asked me something I often answered so quietly they couldn't hear me. Now almost 6 years later I lost ~25kg of weight, got myself tooth implantants and often find myself teasing my coworkers or cracking jokes that I know that particular person will like.

So my advice to you is this:
If you really want to change, focus on nothing but your goal and how to get there. 
Throw away the excuses and justifications they will only hold you back.
Forget what your family wants from you or what "so called" friends say.

Tl:dr
The only thing that matters is what YOU want from YOUR LIFE and what YOU have to do, to get there. If somebody tries to get in the way of your goal or put you down, look them straight into the eyes and tell them to fuck off. Remember it's YOUR LIFE, not your familys or anyone elses. YOURS.

Reactions: Like 1


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 15, 2019)

MarF said:


> First of all I'm not a therapist or a doctor or anything like that. The following is based solely on my life experiences and nothing more. Maybe it can help you maybe not.
> 
> When I was a teenager I was fat, very shy and due to unknown medical reasons lost all my upper teeth over a span of 6 months. I was so socially awkward and shy if I saw a group of girls I legit couldn't walk past them. I had to go back and loop around them. In other words my life was shit.
> 
> ...


 Thank you for the advice! It makes me feel bad, because you actually had concrete reasons for feeling so insecure, I just feel shy and insecure for no good reason. It's not that i'm worried about how I look or sound, but rather my personality itself, I feel like my social skills are so bad and i'm so weird and inept, that people being mean to me is their natural reaction to my behavior. You said I should just focus on my goal and forget about what anyone else thinks or wants but, wouldn't that make me kind of selfish?


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## Jim (Jan 15, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> You said I should just focus on my goal and forget about what anyone else thinks or wants but, wouldn't that make me kind of selfish?


learn to be selfish


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## A Optimistic (Jan 15, 2019)

oh my god I totally can relate to having super duper scary anxiety   like whenever people talk to me I get so nervous and faint  

talking to people is scary   and I don't know how to make it stop  

does anyone have some advice for me?


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## Jim (Jan 15, 2019)

this mention of "super duper" keeps reminding me of trigger happy havoc


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## Magic (Jan 15, 2019)

A Optimistic said:


> oh my god I totally can relate to having super duper scary anxiety   like whenever people talk to me I get so nervous and faint
> 
> talking to people is scary   and I don't know how to make it stop
> 
> does anyone have some advice for me?



Hey man psst, try dis!



*GEWD SHIT*


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## A Optimistic (Jan 15, 2019)

RemChu said:


> Hey man psst, try dis!
> 
> 
> 
> *GEWD SHIT*




Thanks man, it worked! I feel all better now!


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 15, 2019)

A Optimistic said:


> oh my god I totally can relate to having super duper scary anxiety   like whenever people talk to me I get so nervous and faint
> 
> talking to people is scary   and I don't know how to make it stop
> 
> does anyone have some advice for me?


What does the A stand for? Asshole? 



RemChu said:


> Hey man psst, try dis!
> 
> 
> 
> *GEWD SHIT*


Well marijuana did just become legal in Canada, but Owl recommended that I shouldn't try it. He said it would only make my conditions worse.


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## A Optimistic (Jan 15, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> What does the A stand for? Asshole?




Why are you calling me an asshole? That is very mean.  



StarlightAshley said:


> Well marijuana did just become legal in Canada, but Owl recommended that I shouldn't try it. He said it would only make my conditions worse.



Yes it did become legal in our country. I'm gonna puff puff smoke until I pass out.


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## Magic (Jan 15, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> What does the A stand for? Asshole?
> 
> 
> Well marijuana did just become legal in Canada*, but Owl recommended that I shouldn't try it*. He said it would only make my conditions worse.



He isn't a doctor.

Uh my good friend Pablo has a bad anxiety problem he deals with it with weed. Just try it.
You seem high strung/ stressed, no offense.


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## Louis-954 (Jan 15, 2019)

RemChu said:


> He isn't a doctor.
> 
> Uh my good friend Pablo has a bad anxiety problem he deals with it with weed. Just try it.
> You seem high strung/ stressed, no offense.


One of the side effects of marijuana for some people is anxiety/nervousness, so for *some* people it does exacerbate their issues.


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## Magic (Jan 15, 2019)

Louis-954 said:


> One of the side effects of marijuana for some people is anxiety/nervousness, so for *some* people it does exacerbate their issues.



Medical Marijuana is a thing, prescribed by doctors!  And what does Ash have to lose? They are rock bottom socially.

Anyways just joking with Ava. I'm outta here. Idc. None of this advice does anything. Just feeding a sick person attention.


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## MarF (Jan 16, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Thank you for the advice! It makes me feel bad, because you actually had concrete reasons for feeling so insecure, I just feel shy and insecure for no good reason. It's not that i'm worried about how I look or sound, but rather my personality itself, I feel like my social skills are so bad and i'm so weird and inept, that people being mean to me is their natural reaction to my behavior. You said I should just focus on my goal and forget about what anyone else thinks or wants but, wouldn't that make me kind of selfish?



Don't feel bad. Saying things like I'm like this because this or that happened to me is just an excuse. I've had problems and I fixed them until I was satisfied thats all there is to it.


About people being mean to you, I know the feeling. It was the same for me in school. The way I see it you have two choices.
You can either try and fit in with them or you can say fuck em and try to find nicer people somewhere else.

If you want to fit in with them, look at how they behave, what they talk about, stuff like that and try to get yourself interested in that. If they say something mean to you try to joke it off. If you see one of them struggling with something try to help.

Personally I'd reccomend getting a part or full time job depending on how much time you have. Try to find a place that has nice coworkers.
You could also do something else that can be done in a group, like a sport, gymnastics or maybe a some other form of hobby.


If you have to be a little selfish to make your life better, than so be it. It's your life after all.
I mean if your parents ask you to buy groceries or take out the trash or something like that, then thats fine. I was talking more about things that make you feel bad or could hold you back. You said you sometimes work at your fathers shop(i think). If you don't like it there, then don't work there. If your father really needs help he should hire somebody.

If you like working there, try to make it easier for yourself. Look at the stuff he's selling, what are the parts called, what are they used for, stuff like that. Google can be a great help for things like that, if your father isn't. If you struggle with remembering all the information, then take some paper and write it down.
If there is a problem with a customer that you can't solve on your own and your father isn't there. Call him, most issues can be solved over phone. Talking with the boss/owner also makes customers feel important, which can de-escalate situations.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 16, 2019)

RemChu said:


> He isn't a doctor.
> 
> Uh my good friend Pablo has a bad anxiety problem he deals with it with weed. Just try it.
> You seem high strung/ stressed, no offense.


I do worry a lot and get extremely stressed about social situations, that's anxiety. But even if weed did temporarily solve the problem, wouldn't that be the same as using alcohol to medicate it? Wouldn't it just make me reliant on using weed as a crutch that I would abuse to ignore my problems, rather than addressing the issues causing them and possibly curing myself? 



MarF said:


> Don't feel bad. Saying things like I'm like this because this or that happened to me is just an excuse. I've had problems and I fixed them until I was satisfied thats all there is to it.
> 
> About people being mean to you, I know the feeling. It was the same for me in school. The way I see it you have two choices.
> You can either try and fit in with them or you can say fuck em and try to find nicer people somewhere else.
> ...



At least the things driving you to be insecure were things you were in control of. You didn't like certain things about yourself and you changed them, but for me, my insecurity is based upon having no validation from other people, my lack of social confidence comes from having a lack of positive feedback from the people I interact with. I don't know how to make people like me more, it's very hard for me to change how other people typically react towards me socially.

As for a job or a sport. I'm afraid of trying a real job, I really hate the way my dad treats me and I can't stand working for him, it's not that I do it because I want to, I don't want to help him because he doesn't treat me well. Everyone in my family is pressuring me to and expects me to help him.I would literally rather work anywhere else. 

But i'm told i'm too incompetent to work at a real job. Every time I make a mistake my dad is so harsh to me and says I wouldn't be able to make it out in the world and Id be fired anywhere else. Being scorned by my dad is bad enough but by a boss who's a stranger, I would feel so overwhelmed by anxiety and want to cry. I know in theory other co workers would be a good way to have a social circle and make friends, but knowing me I doubt I would talk to any of them at all. Because I was so shy my parents used to sign me up for things since I was like 5 until I was like 14, swimming, girl scouts, soccer, summer camp but I wouldn't say a word to anyone and wan't able to make any friends or enjoy myself. 

And I do call my dad immediately whenever their is a problem, but he often keeps his phone off because he doesn't want to be bothered with customers problems. He is very different than I am, I have way too much empathy and panic if a customer is angry or unhappy and can't just tell them to leave when they're unsatisfied. He's very stressed running his business, and he takes out his stress on whoever works for him, my mom used to work for him but she left because he was too bad to her, and now i'm forced to be in this situation instead.


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## MarF (Jan 16, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> At least the things driving you to be insecure were things you were in control of. You didn't like certain things about yourself and you changed them, but for me, my insecurity is based upon having no validation from other people, my lack of social confidence comes from having a lack of positive feedback from the people I interact with. I don't know how to make people like me more, it's very hard for me to change how other people typically react towards me socially.


I know you heard this before but I'll say it again. You care too much about what other people think about you. Do something that's hard on you and give yourself positive feedback for it. Force yourself to do something that makes you uncomfortable until it becomes normal to you.

I used to go to a type of training group that helps you with getting a job. I had to do things like always looking somebody in the eyes when talking to them. Stand in front of a group and give a presentation or walk around the street and ask random people questions.

If things like these make you uncomfortable, force yourself to do them until you get used to it.



StarlightAshley said:


> As for a job or a sport. I'm afraid of trying a real job, I really hate the way my dad treats me and I can't stand working for him, it's not that I do it because I want to, I don't want to help him because he doesn't treat me well. Everyone in my family is pressuring me to and expects me to help him.I would literally rather work anywhere else.
> 
> But i'm told i'm too incompetent to work at a real job. Every time I make a mistake my dad is so harsh to me and says I wouldn't be able to make it out in the world and Id be fired anywhere else. Being scorned by my dad is bad enough but by a boss who's a stranger, I would feel so overwhelmed by anxiety and want to cry. I know in theory other co workers would be a good way to have a social circle and make friends, but knowing me I doubt I would talk to any of them at all. Because I was so shy my parents used to sign me up for things since I was like 5 until I was like 14, swimming, girl scouts, soccer, summer camp but I wouldn't say a word to anyone and wan't able to make any friends or enjoy myself.



There isn't really anything to be afraid of, worst that can happen is you getting fired for messing something up. If that happens just take the experiences you gained there with you and find a new job until you got one that fits you.



StarlightAshley said:


> And I do call my dad immediately whenever their is a problem, but he often keeps his phone off because he doesn't want to be bothered with customers problems. He is very different than I am, I have way too much empathy and panic if a customer is angry or unhappy and can't just tell them to leave when they're unsatisfied. He's very stressed running his business, and he takes out his stress on whoever works for him, my mom used to work for him but she left because he was too bad to her, and now i'm forced to be in this situation instead.



Don't take this personal but your father sounds like a piece of shit. I should know seeing as mine is one.
If your dad doesn't want to deal with customers and can't handle stress he shouldn't be running a business.
Are your parents together or divorced? Have you tried talking to her about this and maybe get her support?
If she walked away from the job than she should understand if you do the same.

Are you old enough to legally live on your own? If yes I'd recommend getting a job and turning your back on anyone that tries to put you down.


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## Jim (Jan 16, 2019)

are you actually going to get a job in the future? Because if so, you're going to have to deal with them whether you're ready or not


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 16, 2019)

MarF said:


> I know you heard this before but I'll say it again. You care too much about what other people think about you. Do something that's hard on you and give yourself positive feedback for it. Force yourself to do something that makes you uncomfortable until it becomes normal to you.
> 
> I used to go to a type of training group that helps you with getting a job. I had to do things like always looking somebody in the eyes when talking to them. Stand in front of a group and give a presentation or walk around the street and ask random people questions.
> 
> ...





MarF said:


> I know you heard this before but I'll say it again. You care too much about what other people think about you. Do something that's hard on you and give yourself positive feedback for it. Force yourself to do something that makes you uncomfortable until it becomes normal to you.
> 
> I used to go to a type of training group that helps you with getting a job. I had to do things like always looking somebody in the eyes when talking to them. Stand in front of a group and give a presentation or walk around the street and ask random people questions.
> 
> ...



They are still together but she walked away from working for him after enduring it for over a decade, my dad took it very badly and yelled at her everyday when she refused to go back, he begged and pleaded and shamed and screamed at her everyday to come back to work for him. My mom didn't like him blaming her for his business falling apart without her, so she insisted he should get me to work for him instead. So no, she clearly isn't supportive of me leaving, because then he would pressure her to work for him again. She is more interested in protecting herself. When I've talked to her about how much I hate working there, shes said "Well I had to put up with it for over 15 years, now its your turn" 

And yes I am old enough, but since I've been working for my dad for free I haven't been making any income so i'm trapped in this situation. He would want me to keep working for him forever, or at least until he dies and then just "inherit his wealth" but obviously I hate my life as it is now, and that would be me throwing my life away for him. 

I'm in college part time and I have my own aspirations, i'm good at programming, I could conceivably earn money from that somehow, without having to socialize with people..In fact for a long time i've thought, "Ill just program some games, sell them on steam, and then move out and live out on my own as neet!" I would be happier..if I lived on my own and earned my own income, and I wouldn't have to worry about my family being mean to me or controlling me or judging me anymore. My anxiety wouldn't get triggered much if I lived by myself..and only made trips to buy groceries and things for myself..that's stressful..but not too much for me to handle. Should I be aiming for that goal first, and then try to fix my anxiety once i'm there?


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## Jim (Jan 16, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> He would want me to keep working for him forever, or at least until he dies and then just "inherit his wealth" but obviously I hate my life as it is now, and that would be me throwing my life away for him.


wait a second, did he actually _say_ he was going to give you any inheritance?


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## MarF (Jan 17, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> They are still together but she walked away from working for him after enduring it for over a decade, my dad took it very badly and yelled at her everyday when she refused to go back, he begged and pleaded and shamed and screamed at her everyday to come back to work for him. My mom didn't like him blaming her for his business falling apart without her, so she insisted he should get me to work for him instead. So no, she clearly isn't supportive of me leaving, because then he would pressure her to work for him again. She is more interested in protecting herself. When I've talked to her about how much I hate working there, shes said "Well I had to put up with it for over 15 years, now its your turn"



So to summarize your father is a crappy business man that can't handle his shop and your mother threw you under the bus to get away from it.
Earlier you asked me if ignoring your family would be selfish, the way I see it the people in your family already act selfish themselves.
If they treat you badly why should you treat them nicely in return?



StarlightAshley said:


> And yes I am old enough, but since I've been working for my dad for free I haven't been making any income so i'm trapped in this situation. He would want me to keep working for him forever, or at least until he dies and then just "inherit his wealth" but obviously I hate my life as it is now, and that would be me throwing my life away for him.


I don't know your father but from the way you describe him I doubt he has any real wealth you can inheritate.



StarlightAshley said:


> I'm in college part time and I have my own aspirations, i'm good at programming, I could conceivably earn money from that somehow, without having to socialize with people..In fact for a long time i've thought, "Ill just program some games, sell them on steam, and then move out and live out on my own as neet!" I would be happier..if I lived on my own and earned my own income, and I wouldn't have to worry about my family being mean to me or controlling me or judging me anymore. My anxiety wouldn't get triggered much if I lived by myself..and only made trips to buy groceries and things for myself..that's stressful..but not too much for me to handle. Should I be aiming for that goal first, and then try to fix my anxiety once i'm there?



If possible I would definitely recommend moving out. Changing your current environment to one that doesn't make your anxiety problems worse would obviously be a good thing. But don't do it rashly. Plan everything through. How much money would you need per month for rent, food and transportation? Get a steady income from a job, doesn't matter what kind of work it is as long as it pays your bills.

Reactions: Like 1


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## La Moral Support XXV (Jan 17, 2019)

I hate the feeling when you know you’re coming off as socially awkward and the person thinks you’re weird.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 17, 2019)

Imopink1 said:


> I hate the feeling when you know you’re coming off as socially awkward and the person thinks you’re weird.


That's exactly where I lose it and the very situation that I'm trying to avoid. 
It's not the fact that they judge me even that bothers me the most, it's the fact that I don't know how they're judging me. If I could read minds I probably wouldn't have this fear, because even if they were thinking bad things about me, just removing the ambiguity of what they could be thinking and why would be a lot less worrisome.


Jim said:


> wait a second, did he actually _say_ he was going to give you any inheritance?


Yes, or so he says, but only if I work for him. And no he's not exactly rich. But he owns a big building that I could sell I guess.. 


MarF said:


> So to summarize your father is a crappy business man that can't handle his shop and your mother threw you under the bus to get away from it.
> Earlier you asked me if ignoring your family would be selfish, the way I see it the people in your family already act selfish themselves.
> If they treat you badly why should you treat them nicely in return?
> 
> If possible I would definitely recommend moving out. Changing your current environment to one that doesn't make your anxiety problems worse would obviously be a good thing. But don't do it rashly. Plan everything through. How much money would you need per month for rent, food and transportation? Get a steady income from a job, doesn't matter what kind of work it is as long as it pays your bills.


I don't like my family, and I wouldn't miss them if I moved out. But my family would take it very badly if I just left them and cut off contact like I want to. Also if I cut off my family, and I have no friends. I would be throwing myself into complete isolation for a while. Are you of the opinion that it's better to be alone, than to have bad company?


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## MarF (Jan 17, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> I don't like my family, and I wouldn't miss them if I moved out. But my family would take it very badly if I just left them and cut off contact like I want to. Also if I cut off my family, and I have no friends. I would be throwing myself into complete isolation for a while. Are you of the opinion that it's better to be alone, than to have bad company?



Personally I'd rather be alone than in bad company. But I'm also a slight Introvert who spends 40 to 50 hours a week working in retail talking with colleagues and dealing with customers.

Whether or not you can deal with being alone for what might be an extended period of time, is something you'll have to figure out for yourself.

The choice between those two options is also something you can confront your parents with. The prospect of you moving away might make them rethink the whole situation.


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## Jim (Jan 17, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Are you of the opinion that it's better to be alone, than to have bad company?


Yes


StarlightAshley said:


> If I could read minds I probably wouldn't have this fear, because even if they were thinking bad things about me, just removing the ambiguity of what they could be thinking and why would be a lot less worrisome.


It's easy enough to figure out. People aren't generally this enigma of complications, they're usually not thinking of you or how awkward you are. They're usually thinking of exactly what they're saying.


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 17, 2019)

MarF said:


> It's easy enough to figure out. People aren't generally this enigma of complications, they're usually not thinking of you or how awkward you are. They're usually thinking of exactly what they're saying.


That's to say people aren't often fake, and don't try to mask their emotions for the sake of politeness. Are people always happy when they smile at you, or interested in your life when they say how are you? As someone who tries my best to hide my negative feelings when I interact with people, I can only assume everyone else is doing the same, only are much more skilled at it than I am. And in the absence of being stuck in their heads judging themselves, they're judging other people instead.



MarF said:


> Personally I'd rather be alone than in bad company. But I'm also a slight Introvert who spends 40 to 50 hours a week working in retail talking with colleagues and dealing with customers.
> 
> Whether or not you can deal with being alone for what might be an extended period of time, is something you'll have to figure out for yourself.
> 
> The choice between those two options is also something you can confront your parents with. The prospect of you moving away might make them rethink the whole situation.


Oh trust me i'm not just a slight introvert i'm a super introvert, i'm probably as far down the introvert spectrum as I can get. Not only can I deal with being alone, but i'm only ever happy and relaxed if I'm alone. Which is also likely heavily contributing to my problem, because I imagine someone who's a little extroverted would get mixed feelings from social interactions. On one hand they'd enjoy them, but on the other they'd hate the way they acted. But for me..it's both that I hate the way I handle social interactions, and I don't even get enjoyment from them, I just feel drained. It's not that I think I can't survive without talking to people, I definitely can. I just fear that if I don't address my problem and just try to isolate myself, it'll get to the point where I blur the line between "I don't t socialize because I prefer not to" and "I don't socialize because I can't."


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## Jim (Jan 17, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> That's to say people aren't often fake, and don't try to mask their emotions for the sake of politeness. Are people always happy when they smile at you, or interested in your life when they say how are you? As someone who tries my best to hide my negative feelings when I interact with people, I can only assume everyone else is doing the same, only are much more skilled at it than I am. And in the absence of being stuck in their heads judging themselves, they're judging other people instead.


They're probably not interested in your life when they ask how are you in a general tone. They just need something to say.  If they do ask in a very concerning tone, then they may be genuinely concerned about something, but the chances of that happening in one's life is low. People you see may or may not have these extreme problems going on with their life when interacting with you, but it doesn't involve you, nor can you actually help. It would also be rude of you to pry into their lives anyway and they don't expect some random stranger to get involved.


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## Lurko (Jan 18, 2019)

RemChu said:


> Hey man psst, try dis!
> 
> 
> 
> *GEWD SHIT*


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## StarlightAshley (Jan 21, 2019)

Um Ok I thought of a really convoluted Pokemon analogy to try to explain what its like...

Imagine having a conversation with someone is fighting a charmander. 

It's a fairly weak fire pokemon. Most Pokemon are capable of beating it pretty easily. And so everyone else beats charmander's regularly and thinks "This is super simple to do."

However, you are a grass type. One fire attack devestates you. An easy challenge that's no big deal to anyone else, a little charmander, is like an insurmountable wall for you.


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## Asriel (Jan 21, 2019)

Magpie said:


> I hate the feeling when you know you’re coming off as socially awkward and the person thinks you’re weird.


When that happens to me, I try to roll with it like I'm intentionally being silly. Getting them to smile or smirk or even laugh helps break the pressure from the awkwardness imo. 

I used to be severely awkward when I was in my early-mid teens. Between having moved several times in a short span of years and having been diagnosed with high functioning autism, I often isolated myself from my peers (usually schoolmates) and I seldom did anything social.

It's hard to pinpoint when all of that changed; I still have moments of social anxiety, but they're nothing like they used to be. I know I got fed up with how I always felt like I was in a corner. And I got fed up with feeling so lonely and misunderstood. Self-dissatisfaction very likely opened the door for me to start trying to be more direct and social with others... and after a while it just felt natural? Or at least, as natural as possible when my enthusiasm still shoots all over the place.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Hozukimaru (Jan 21, 2019)

I think I also suffer from social anxiety. But I consider myself lucky because people appear in my life from time to time that disregard my shortcomings and insist on putting effort and caring about me. Even when I seemingly offer little back, they just keep giving.

And that would be my family, my diverse bunch of friends, my ex girlfriend and other people I've met along the way.

There have been times that I come across people similar to me, who close themselves up or wait for others to do all the action. I really don't stick well with these.

We're probably both afraid of rejection/failure so we don't initiate conversation or propose activities. We maybe assume the other person is too stuck up or not at all interested in us. When in reality they're just an lonely and simply have been battling the same issues.

Example: I have two flatmates and we've only hanged out once in the past 5 months. And we barely converse, most days we only say "hey" or "good morning" and nothing else for the whole day. And I'm not exaggerating. 

I've been abroad for the past 5 months. And I only managed to make 2 friends. We hanged out some times. But they're always so busy. I don't enjoy staying at home for ~15 days straight (only going to university and the grocery store) without anyone to hang out with, not even grabbing a cup of coffee.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Mider T (Jan 21, 2019)

StarlightAshley said:


> Um Ok I thought of a really convoluted Pokemon analogy to try to explain what its like...
> 
> Imagine having a conversation with someone is fighting a charmander.
> 
> ...


Uh what?  Vulpix is a weak fire pokemon.  Torkoal is a weak fire pokemon.  Charmander is a badass.


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