# Sanji vs Rooftop Zoro



## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

The 3rd Sanji vs Zoro thread.

This is to see how far the wank really goes.


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## Corax (Dec 3, 2021)

RT Zoro. Hakkai, Tatsumaki, Flying Dragon and Asura feats are more impressive than Ifrite vs Queen and DNA in general.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 2 | Winner 3


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## Kagutsutchi (Dec 3, 2021)

RT Zoro is slightly weaker than current AdCoC Zoro to me. On the Rooftop he could go all out wmas he had his teammates helping him


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 3, 2021)

_We've seen this more or less from Zoro vs King pre power up   _


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

Are we talking about the Zoro that made Kaido bleed, scarred him for life and blocked Hakkai. That same Zoro?

Unlike Qlown, Zoro doesn't lack AP to completely put down DNA Sanji. Zoro had Kaido running away from his attacks. Levels to this.

Reactions: Like 4 | Agree 2 | Winner 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Are we talking about the Zoro that made Kaido bleed, scarred him for life and blocked Hakkai. That same Zoro?
> 
> Unlike Qlown, Zoro doesn't lack AP to completely put down DNA Sanji. Zoro had Kaido running away from his attacks. Levels to this.


We're talking about the same guy who got mid diffed by King, yes.

Reactions: Like 4 | Funny 1 | Winner 1


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## MYJC (Dec 3, 2021)

No matter how these threads get worded, Zoro>Sanji.

Reactions: Funny 5 | Winner 6


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

MYJC said:


> No matter how these threads get worded, Zoro>Sanji.


Ofc a Zoro fan thinks East Blue Zoro beats Sanji. Nothing new here

Reactions: Like 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> We're talking about the same guy who got mid diffed by King, yes.


King > Queen. 
King > Sanji. 

I don't know what point you're trying to make.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 3, 2021)

MYJC said:


> No matter how these threads get worded, Zoro>Sanji.



_I wouldn't doubt that would be the case for some even for a East Blue Zoro vs EoS Sanji thread   _

Reactions: Neutral 1


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## Luffy (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> This is to see how far the wank really goes.


So you had no intention of having a proper discussion when you made this thread. The purpose of this thread was simply for you to cry about the Zoro wank right?

Got it

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 3 | Winner 10


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## Typhon (Dec 3, 2021)

Sanji gives Zoro the King treatment

Reactions: Disagree 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

V said:


> So you had no intention of having a proper discussion when you made this thread. The purpose of this thread was simply for you to cry about the Zoro wank right?
> 
> Got it


Pretty much. I was just going to say this but you covered it.

Dude just wanted to cry about Zoro.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> King > Queen.
> King > Sanji.
> 
> I don't know what point you're trying to make.


Alright let me break this down for you.

King mid diffed this version of Zoro.
Sanji post power up mid diffed Queen.
You think Zoro could beat Sanji.
This means you unironically think King Low diffs Queen.

Zoro fans throw all logic out the window when it comes to him.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Corax (Dec 3, 2021)

RT Zoro isn't much inferior to aCoC Zoro. The only difference is their AP/lethality. And this is the only reason he had to power up vs King,since he was tagging,blocking and dodging him more or less fine,just couldn't bypass his regen+dura.


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

V said:


> So you had no intention of having a proper discussion when you made this thread. The purpose of this thread was simply for you to cry about the Zoro wank right?
> 
> Got it


No I'm actually genuinely curious on how the Zoro fans would spin it in his favor. The answer is obvious yes, but watching them do it is interesting.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Beast (Dec 3, 2021)

Current Zoro is basically Rooftop Zoro except now he knows he got CoC and fully awakened the ability instead of using it by accident. 


Rooftop Zoro did not hold back his haki and was using Enma to its fullest bar his first attack on the roof iirc. 


Zoro first subconsciously unlocked CoC at its advanced form but now, he has fully unlocked CoC and will probably be using it freely rather then subconsciously. 


So, Zoro is still tagging Sanji with an Ashura advance CoC attack and it’s done.  


Extreme diff for roof top Zoro.


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> Alright let me break this down for you.
> 
> King mid diffed this version of Zoro.
> Sanji post power up mid diffed Queen.
> ...



_Kaido was afraid of Zoro on the roof and Zoro scarred him for life

King mid diffed Zoro pre power up

Proper scaling means King low diffs Kaido

However we give Kaido the benefit of portrayal here and say King = Kaido more or less, which is sustainable by Oda's handling of them through out Onigashima





This is how you do it _

Reactions: Funny 6


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## Kagutsutchi (Dec 3, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> RT Zoro is slightly weaker than current AdCoC Zoro to me. On the Rooftop he could go all out wmas he had his teammates helping him


Didn't answer the question. I think Sanji can blitz RT Zoro, and as for durability, Sanji can just attack a weak point like his back or stomach.

And to clarify, while RT Zoro and current Zoro are same tier, that's only in AP since RT Zoro was focused on AP from what I saw


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> Alright let me break this down for you.
> 
> King mid diffed this version of Zoro.
> Sanji post power up mid diffed Queen.
> ...


Alright let me just ask you this. How does Sanji defeat Zoro and by this I mean with what attack bc Iffrite ain't cutting it given Zoro blocked Hakkai. 

Also to clarify something, King didn't defeat anyone yet, he's just pushed Zoro very far which brings me to ask another question: If King with superior AP to Sanji hasn't put down Zoro what attack is Sanji putting down Zoro with. 

Zoro on the other hand can end Sanji with any number of moves in his arsenal. Unlike Queen he's extremely deadly and lethal to Sanji. 

A guy that scarred Kaido, blocked Hakkai, make BM sweat and Kaido noped out of an attack isn't losing to Sanji. I'm sorry it's simply what it is. If you want to accuse anyone of wanking, take that with Oda, he's the one who wrote Zoro accomplishing all those feats.

Reactions: Agree 3 | Winner 3


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Alright let me just ask you this. How does Sanji defeat Zoro and by this I mean with what attack bc Iffrite ain't cutting it given Zoro blocked Hakkai.




_By not kicking him in the swords   _

Reactions: Winner 2


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## bil02 (Dec 3, 2021)

I'm not necessarily a believer of King Mid diffs Queen given the common portrayal they both got all throughout Wano.
But the thing is King has been Dominating a Zoro that already proved himself against Emperors on the rooftop and both King's abilities and aura seem to be on a different level from Queen.

Sanji puts up a good fight with his Vanishing skills against Rooftop Zoro but Zoro was shown to be so impressive in Speed,Ap and reactions on the rooftop that I can't see how he loses this.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 2 | Neutral 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> Didn't answer the question. I think Sanji can blitz RT Zoro, and as for durability, *Sanji can just attack a weak point like his back or stomach.*
> 
> And to clarify, while RT Zoro and current Zoro are same tier, that's only in AP since RT Zoro was focused on AP from what I saw


You guys think everyone is Queen to write stuff like these. 

"Sanji cab just attack his back". You honestly think Sanji can get to Zoro's back.

Zoro and Oda in early One Piece: "*A swordman greatest shame is a scar on his back*". And important theme in Japanese stories about samurais, never letting one's back vulnerable. Yet here you are thinking Sanji could just get to his back.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Alright let me just ask you this. How does Sanji defeat Zoro and by this I mean with what attack bc Iffrite ain't cutting it given Zoro blocked Hakkai.


This is a really bad arguement. You're basically saying you need Hakki lvl attacks to beat Zoro. Which is far from the truth. Since nobody can do that alone. You need Hakkai lvl attacks to disintigrate Zoro, sure. But to beat him you only need YC1 lvl attacks.


maupp said:


> Also to clarify something, King didn't defeat anyone yet, he's just pushed Zoro very far which brings me to ask another question: If King with superior AP to Sanji hasn't put down Zoro what attack is Sanji putting down Zoro with.


Same way he beat Queen. A combo of kicks. Sure it'd take 2 or 3 combos instead if 1, but Zoro's going down. Also, King was clearly close to defeating Zoro without using any of his high end attacks. None of those attacks used on Zoro looked like finishers.


maupp said:


> Zoro on the other hand can end Sanji with any number of moves in his arsenal. Unlike Queen he's extremely deadly and lethal to Sanji.


Only attack putting Sanji down is Ashura. And unless Sanji just stands there and tanks it like Kaido, Zoro would have a hard time landing it. Not saying he can't, but I'd bet on Sanji landing his combos first.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## TrolonoaZoro (Dec 3, 2021)

NGL I think 2 yonkou>>>>>>>>Queen
So Zoro's feat are more impressive than Sanji's attacks being sponged by Queen.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 3, 2021)

_It's funny how when Zoro showed adv CoC last chapter there were threads about how from getting rolled around by King he's now become a Top Tier one of the strongest in the verse, but when discussing RT Zoro in a vs matchup you guys say it's basically the same Zoro and the CoC upgrade just means he can cut stuff better   _

Reactions: Funny 1 | Winner 1


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Sir Curlyhat said:


> _It's funny how when Zoro showed adv CoC last chapter there were threads about how from getting rolled around by King he's now become a Top Tier one of the strongest in the verse, but when discussing RT Zoro in a vs matchup you guys say it's basically the same Zoro and the CoC upgrade just means he can cut stuff better  _

Reactions: Funny 18


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## Beast (Dec 3, 2021)

Zoro is still going to use his new power up subconsciously like he did on the roof top, he just won’t be as injured.


Once daddy Sanji smacks him up and his life on the line, his CoC will show just like in the rooftop.


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> This is a really bad arguement. You're basically saying you need Hakki lvl attacks to beat Zoro. Which is far from the truth. Since nobody can do that alone. You need Hakkai lvl attacks to disintigrate Zoro, sure. But to beat him you only need YC1 lvl attacks.
> 
> Same way he beat Queen. A combo of kicks. Sure it'd take 2 or 3 combos instead if 1, but Zoro's going down. Also, King was clearly close to defeating Zoro without using any of his high end attacks. None of those attacks used on Zoro looked like finishers.
> 
> Only attack putting Sanji down is Ashura. And unless Sanji just stands there and tanks it like Kaido, Zoro would have a hard time landing it. Not saying he can't, but I'd bet on Sanji landing his combos first.


Let me get this straight you think Zoro who just ate POINT BLANK an explosion almost the side of the skull(bigger than anything Queen and Sanji have shown combined) will go down to Sanji's Iffrite Kicks that he'd be likely blocking (Sanji ain't getting shots at Zoro unguarded). 

You also believe that Sanji can only go down to Ashura. So none of the attacks that made Kaido puke blood, cut him, made him scream in agony won't take down Sanji. Not even an attack that completely cleaved the skulls horn that is like the side of several mountains?

Reactions: Funny 2 | Winner 1


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## Beast (Dec 3, 2021)

Queen unaware tanked Kings attack that sent Zoro through walls and the dome.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Let me get this straight you think Zoro who just ate POINT BLANK an explosion almost the side of the skull(bigger than anything Queen and Sanji have shown combined) will go down to Sanji's Iffrite Kicks that he'd be likely blocking (Sanji ain't getting shots at Zoro unguarded).
> 
> You also believe that Sanji can only go down to Ashura. So none of the attacks that made Kaido puke blood, cut him, made him scream in agony won't take down Sanji. Not even an attack that completely cleaved the skulls horn that is like the side of several mountains?




_It was an Ichiji tier explosion




and Queen has Ichiji's abilities   _

Reactions: Funny 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

Or AdCoC simply takes the beast that RT Zoro already was into godhood.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Let me get this straight you think Zoro who just ate POINT BLANK an explosion almost the side of the skull(bigger than anything Queen and Sanji have shown combined) will go down to Sanji's Iffrite Kicks that he'd be likely blocking (Sanji ain't getting shots at Zoro unguarded).


He ate it for 1 second and was near dead afterwards. Zoro is tough but not that tough, King proved that.


maupp said:


> You also believe that Sanji can only go down to Ashura. So none of the attacks that made Kaido puke blood, cut him, made him scream in agony won't take down Sanji. Not even an attack that completely cleaved the skulls horn that is like the side of several mountains?


That one attack would easily miss. If Zoro tried it he would literally lose right there. Don't you remember how using it sucked out all his haki? And how Kaido was able to dodge it after originally planning to tank it.


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## Kagutsutchi (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> You guys think everyone is Queen to write stuff like these.


I don't think everyone is Queen. Queen is absolutely tanking this with little injury for example:





maupp said:


> "Sanji cab just attack his back". You honestly think Sanji can get to Zoro's back.


You honestly think Zoro can prevent Sanji from getting to his back. Zoro hasn't even shown us feats to suggest he is as fast as Queen. Man's still complaining of Lightspeed attacks.



maupp said:


> Zoro and Oda in early One Piece: "*A swordman greatest shame is a scar on his back*". And important theme in Japanese stories about samurais, never letting one's back vulnerable. Yet here you are thinking Sanji could just get to his back.


I didn't just mention his back. I also mentioned his stomach. Besides, the Battledome isn't a story where shit can be twisted to fit whatever theme.


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

@ClannadFan I'm talking about King's explosion which Zoro ate unguarded (but used armement to protect himself). 

That attack is massively far bigger than anything Queen and Sanji have shown combine and Zoro took it point blank.


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

Kagutsutchi said:


> I don't think everyone is Queen. Queen is absolutely tanking this with little injury for example:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ok we're done here.


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## Kagutsutchi (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Ok we're done here.


Good to know


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> @ClannadFan I'm talking about King's explosion which Zoro ate unguarded (but used armement to protect himself).
> 
> That attack is massively far bigger than anything Queen and Sanji have shown combine and Zoro took it point blank.


It's not about the size, but the motion in the Ocean.

But really, it didn't stand out compared to King's other attacks. Seemed like a YC1 lvl attack. Nothing too crazy.


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> It's not about the size, but the motion in the Ocean.
> 
> But really, it didn't stand out compared to King's other attacks. Seemed like a YC1 lvl attack. Nothing too crazy.


You sure you recall that attack correctly. That thing was almost as big as the skull height wise, that's several mountains we're talking about.


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 3, 2021)

_Zoro said the explosion would have killed him if he didn't coat himself in CoA, so if powerful attacks manage to avoid Zoro's guard he will get seriously damaged. _


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> You sure you recall that attack correctly. That thing was almost as big as the skull height wise, that's several mountains we're talking about.


Just looked at it again. And it seems to be on the same lvl as Kings other attacks. Kings face pull thing destoryed a similar lvl of ground, which I'd argue is more impressive than causing a big explosion.


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 3, 2021)

_Large scale destruction isn't end all be all. Marco's best feat is crashing people through couple of walls and it was enough to make King bleed with a basic knee to the face._


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

Well all those other attacks are just adding up to my point which is Zoro is still out there fighting and kicking despite having to fend off against such firepower. So how would Sanji take him down given superior and continuous attacks haven't done so?  @ClannadFan


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Well all those other attacks are just adding up to my point which is Zoro is still out there fighting and kicking despite having to fend off against such firepower. So how would Sanji take him down given superior and continuous attacks haven't done so?  @ClannadFan


_
This attack just grazed Zoro's side though





so it's AP is irrelevant beyond the fact that it was strong enough to pierce Zoro's skin, because it did all it could do in the area it connected, it just landed in a spot where you can aford losing a chunk of meat from  _

Reactions: Agree 4


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 3, 2021)

Sanji win extreme diff, current zoro wins extreme diff. Sanji has better stats all around except attack power which he is no slouch in right now

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1 | Dislike 1


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## Spiegel (Dec 3, 2021)

As always, the Sanji fan club never learns

Reactions: Funny 1 | Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Incognitos (Dec 3, 2021)

Sanji takes this due to matchup advantage. Zoro struggled with flying highly mobile opponents with good defense. His ranged attacks are heavily lacking. Sanji takes this extreme diff imo.


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

Imagine in a fight between Sanji and Zoro, claiming that Zoro is the one with range issues. Can't make this shit up.


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## Spiegel (Dec 3, 2021)

Incognitos said:


> Sanji takes this due to matchup advantage. Zoro struggled with flying highly mobile opponents with good defense. His ranged attacks are heavily lacking. Sanji takes this extreme diff imo.


Sanji doesn't have ranged attacks. He has to come close to Zoro to hit him..

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Incognitos (Dec 3, 2021)

Spiegel said:


> Sanji doesn't have ranged attacks. He has to come close to Zoro to hit him..


Zoro can't see him tho


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Well all those other attacks are just adding up to my point which is Zoro is still out there fighting and kicking despite having to fend off against such firepower. So how would Sanji take him down given superior and continuous attacks haven't done so?  @ClannadFan


Those attacks weren't just beating Zoro, they were mid diffing him. You don't need to be as strong as King to beat Pre AdvCoC Zoro.


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## Spiegel (Dec 3, 2021)

Incognitos said:


> Zoro can't see him tho


Zoro or Queen can't see him?

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Jay. (Dec 3, 2021)

is ashura faster than shishisonson?


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## Typhon (Dec 3, 2021)

The mental gymnastics

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> Those attacks weren't just beating Zoro, they were mid diffing him. You don't need to be as strong as King to beat Pre AdvCoC Zoro.


Beating someone has to be completely defeating them. What King showed was him pressuring Zoro, nothing else. Zoro is still standing fighting which means King's attacks didn't defeat Zoro. 

Had Zoro been defeated, stayed down then you'd have had a point but that's not the case. What those chapters of King pressuring Zoro have shown is that Zoro can take powerful attacks and keep fighting like he currently is. 

If King with the level of firepower he's shown, firepower far above anything Sanji or Queen have shown, couldn't put him down then how does Sanji do so?

You also have to remember one of the main reason the King fight is so one sided in his favor is because Zoro's attacks can't do shit to him. While they are exchanging attacks Zoro is the only one affected while King who has shown durability above Kaido's isn't. Zoro won't have that problem with Sanji. 

Sanji doesn't have King's level of firepower to pressure Zoro as much as King nor does he have the defense or durability of King to no sell his ridiculous AP, AP that is at a level to threaten and wound Kaido. 

Sanji get cooked by Zoro, he simply has too much firepower and his defense is good to handle iffrite jambe.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

As usual Sanji fans are down horrendous. Sanji does not have King’s defensive attributes no matter how hard you want to make it seem like it would be the same fight. The attacks that Zoro landed on King (Tatsumaki that hurt Kaido and Lion Song which is stronger) would wreck Sanji. Zoro doesn’t *need *AdCoC to hurt Sanji. That would just make it much, much easier.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1 | Optimistic 1


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

Like seriously, if you’re truly a fan you wouldn’t keep putting him up against Zoro. Put him against someone he actually stands a chance against.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 3 | Tier Specialist 4


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

Spiegel said:


> Zoro or Queen can't see him?


For some reasons cats are projecting Queen's slow ass to every other characters being pitted against Sanji in these vs threads.


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Beating someone has to be completely defeating them. What King showed was him pressuring Zoro, nothing else. Zoro is still standing fighting which means King's attacks didn't defeat Zoro.
> 
> Had Zoro been defeated, stayed down then you'd have had a point but that's not the case. What those chapters of King pressuring Zoro have shown is that Zoro can take powerful attacks and keep fighting like he currently is.


Are you implying that King wouldn't of won eventually if Zoro never got a power up?


maupp said:


> If King with the level of firepower he's shown, firepower far above anything Sanji or Queen have shown, couldn't put him down then how does Sanji do so?


Wouldn't call it far above. Stronger sure. 


maupp said:


> You also have to remember one of the main reason the King fight is so one sided in his favor is because Zoro's attacks can't do shit to him. While they are exchanging attacks Zoro is the only one affected while King who has shown durability above Kaido's isn't. Zoro won't have that problem with Sanji.


Sanji doesn't have to tank everything. Zoro hasn't shown the ablility to keep up with Sanji's speed. Just look at the speed threads made, most agree that Sanji is the fastest on Wano. Even if you think he isn't, he's still fast enough to blitz Zoro.


maupp said:


> Sanji doesn't have King's level of firepower to pressure Zoro as much as King nor does he have the defense or durability of King to no sell his ridiculous AP, AP that is at a level to threaten and wound Kaido.
> 
> Sanji get cooked by Zoro, he simply has too much firepower and his defense is good to handle iffrite jambe.


Like I said, it's not all about firepower. Sanji's speed and mobility would be too much for Zoro. Without plot King would of just thrown Zoro off Onigashima and he could do nothing about it. This is after he disarmed him for the 2nd time. And even if he had his swords, King/Sanji would still have a huge advantage in the air.


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Like seriously, if you’re truly a fan you wouldn’t keep putting him up against Zoro. Put him against someone he actually stands a chance against.


Exactly. I mean if you really want to enjoy and celebrate a Sanji's week, take advantage of his new feats and pit him against characters he should be able to defeat, that way you get to see Sanji clean out match ups. 

Zoro fans don't go around pitting him against Mihawk just because he get handed new feats. We know our lane and see things in perspective. Just because we see Zoro make Kaido shit his pants from his attack, we don't create threads pitting him against Mihawk and expecting him to win the poll. We know there are levels, this is something some Sanji fans need to understand honestly.  

Beating Queen's ass and adding Iffrite jambe to his arsenal doesn't move the needle for Sanji in regard to Zoro. He simply didn't show enough to spare him from getting cooked by any of RT Zoro's attacks nor is Iffrite jambe powerful enough to be compared to far stronger attacks pre Ad CoC Zoro had taken and defended against well enough.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Exactly. I mean if you really want to enjoy and celebrate a Sanji's week, take advantage of his new feats and pit him against characters he should be able to defeat, that way you get to see Sanji clean out match ups.
> 
> Zoro fans don't go around pitting him against Mihawk just because he get handed new feats. We know our lane and see things in perspective. Just because we see Zoro make Kaido shit his pants from his attack, we don't create threads pitting him against Mihawk and expecting him to win the poll. We know there are levels, this is something some Sanji fans need to understand honestly.
> 
> Beating Queen's ass and adding Iffrite jambe to his arsenal doesn't move the needle for Sanji in regard to Zoro. He simply didn't show enough to spare him from getting cooked by any of RT Zoro's attacks nor is Iffrite jambe powerful enough to be compared to far stronger attacks pre Ad CoC Zoro had taken and defended against well enough.


It’s crazy. They make these threads, get the obvious answers, then calls the whole everyone Zoro wankers lmfao.

Reactions: Funny 3


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> For some reasons cats are projecting Queen's slow ass to every other characters being pitted against Sanji in these vs threads.


1. Queen isn't slow.
2. Even if he was slow, that has nothing to do with his reaction speed.
3. Queen never mentioned Marco being too fast for him, and nobody here should think that Zoro is somehow way faster than Marco. So Sanji has the clear speed advantage.


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

Queen literally has the worst reaction speeds in the manga. Since his debut he has successfully reacted to and blocked 2 attacks.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

@ClannadFan when you bring up speed, for it to matter they have to be ridiculous enough where an opponent get utterly overwhelmed by said speed. Sanji isn't going to run circle around Zoro is that's what you're thinking. Sure he's faster than Zoro but this isn't going to be a Queen situation. 

Zoro has fought against speedsters in the manga and never was he bothered by them. He tangoed with Hybrid Kaido on the rooftop with broken bones and didn't have any issues whatsoever with his speed. Sanji isn't going to Queen his ass speed wise. 

You also have to remember that Sanji is limited in range meaning to land any attack he has to bring it to Zoro, make the fight a close quarter fight which would be suicidal.

Just think of it this way, If that slow ass buffoon Queen could land some attacks on Sanji, so would Zoro and unlike that fat clown, Zoro is lethal and utterly deadly.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Winner 1


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 3, 2021)

_King > Queen high diff
Sanji post PW > Queen mid diff
King > pre power up Zoro mid diff_


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

@maupp youre wasting your time bro. Any debate against most of the Sanji clan is a waste of time. They debate with their blonde dyed single bang covering one eye.


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> 1. *Queen isn't slow.*
> 2. Even if he was slow, that has nothing to do with his reaction speed.
> 3. Queen never mentioned Marco being too fast for him, and nobody here should think that Zoro is somehow way faster than Marco. So Sanji has the clear speed advantage.


Has Queen ever successfully dodged or reacted to an attack on panel? 

Keep in mind this dude has been attacked by the likes of Chopper, BM and the likes, not exactly fast characters or anything.


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> @ClannadFan when you bring up speed, for it to matter they have to be ridiculous enough where an opponent get utterly overwhelmed by said speed. Sanji isn't going to run circle around Zoro is that's what you're thinking. Sure he's faster than Zoro but this isn't going to be a Queen situation.


Can you show a specific situation where Zoro had to deal with top tier speed? Kaido tanking his attacks is not it. Law, who has similar reaction speed to Zoro got blitzed by TB.


maupp said:


> Zoro has fought against speedsters in the manga and never was he bothered by them. He tangoed with Hybrid Kaido on the rooftop with broken bones and didn't have any issues whatsoever with his speed. Sanji isn't going to Queen his ass speed wise.


Nothing in the manga would suggest that Zoro has far superior reaction speed than Queen. The YC2-YC1 tiers have never been shown to have a huge speed gap until Sanji.


maupp said:


> You also have to remember that Sanji is limited in range meaning to land any attack he has to bring it to Zoro, make the fight a close quarter fight which would be suicidal.
> 
> Just think of it this way, If that slow ass buffoon Queen could land some attacks on Sanji, so would Zoro and unlike that fat clown, Zoro is lethal and utterly deadly.


The moment Sanji went high speed mode Queen couldn't tag him anymore.


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Conxc said:


> @maupp youre wasting your time bro. Any debate against most of the Sanji clan is a waste of time. They debate with their blonde dyed single bang covering one eye.


I've consistently said I like Zoro more than Sanji. His fanboys are just way too easy to trigger.


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

Honestly there should more to Sanji's case than "should" as an argument. There is this idea that Sanji "should" be this or that but he isn't backed by feats.

"Sanji should be close to Zoro therefore he beats previous version of Zoro" yet feats wise he doesn't come close.

Reactions: Winner 3


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> I've consistently said I like Zoro more than Sanji. His fanboys are just way too easy to trigger.


So you know that you’re asking stupid questions then? Because the only way this is a fight for Zoro is if Sanji’s durability is comparable to King’s which it isn’t. King no sold attacks that hurt *Kaido. *King is literally different than the rest durability wise as stated by him and proven. He is the exception. Zoro does not *need *AdCoC against Sanji like he does against King. It’s really that simple. AP still favors Zoro. Defensive attributes overall still favor Zoro. Your boy is fast, good for him, but that has never been and never will be enough. Accept that and you’ll be fine.

Reactions: Like 2


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## TrolonoaZoro (Dec 3, 2021)

Queen has the attention span of a headless chicken.  Sanji hadn't disappear for one page before he concentrated entirely on a random girl. It's almost parody, lol.

Reactions: Funny 6


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Conxc said:


> So you know that you’re asking stupid questions then? Because the only way this is a fight for Zoro is if Sanji’s durability is comparable to King’s which it isn’t.


Why would Sanji need King lvl durability? Do you need to no sell every attack now in order to beat someone?


Conxc said:


> King no sold attacks that hurt *Kaido. *King is literally different than the rest durability wise as stated by him and proven. He is the exception. Zoro does not *need *AdCoC against Sanji like he does against King. It’s really that simple. AP still favors Zoro. Defensive attributes overall still favor Zoro. Your boy is fast, good for him, but that has never been and never will be enough. Accept that and you’ll be fine.


For some reason, you guys think someone needs Kings stats to beat RT Zoro. What part about him mid diffing Zoro don't you understand? Maybe if Zoro pushed him to the brink then sure. But Zoro could even scratch him.


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Yamato legitimately did more damage to Kaido than Zoro did to King. Imagine saying you need Kaido+ stats to beat Yamato.


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## Mrdude (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> @ClannadFan when you bring up speed, for it to matter they have to be ridiculous enough where an opponent get utterly overwhelmed by said speed. Sanji isn't going to run circle around Zoro is that's what you're thinking. Sure he's faster than Zoro but this isn't going to be a Queen situation.
> 
> *Zoro has fought against speedsters in the manga and was he bothered by them. He tangoed with Hybrid Kaido on the rooftop with broken bones and didn't have any issues whatsoever with his speed. Sanji isn't going to Queen his ass speed wise.*
> 
> ...


False info.

Zoro didn’t speed blitz Kaido with Asura. He repelled Kaido’s strike before he hit him.



Zoro was already in striking distance.


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> Can you show a specific situation where Zoro had to deal with top tier speed? Kaido tanking his attacks is not it. Law, who has similar reaction speed to Zoro got blitzed by TB.
> 
> Nothing in the manga would suggest that Zoro has far superior reaction speed than Queen. The YC2-YC1 tiers have never been shown to have a huge speed gap until Sanji.
> 
> The moment Sanji went high speed mode Queen couldn't tag him anymore.


Ok first of all you just arbitrarily made up that Law has similar reaction speed to Zoro. So I'd like to call you in that. 

Secondly Zoro's reaction speed is ridiculous. On the rooftop he was the only dude who reacted to Hakkai. To drive home this point that was him alongside a FS user (Luffy) yet he reacted to it before him, that alone should illustrate his reaction speed to you. 

Third, Broken bones Zoro tangoed with Hybrid Kaido for a bit, an even blitzed him to land his Ashura. Hybrid Kaido is fast as feck. 

With all the above you think Sanji is running circle around that guy I just described? 

Also comparing Queen's reaction to Zoro is simply tragic. I mean come on now.  

Ever since pre skip Oda has had Zoro casually react to speedster. He had no issue dealing with Kaku CP9 speed. He casually dealt with gepu, etc. Zoro has simply never been bothered by speed.


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

@ClannadFan "*Why would Sanji need King lvl durability?*" So he doesn't get killed by Zoro, why else? 

"*Yamato legitimately did more damage to Kaido than Zoro did to King.*" So what does that tell you about King's durability given Zoro did more damage to Kaido than Yamato yet couldn't do anything to King?

Reactions: Funny 1 | Winner 4


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## Mrdude (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Ok first of all you just arbitrarily made up that Law has similar reaction speed to Zoro. So I'd like to call you in that.
> 
> Secondly Zoro's reaction speed is ridiculous. On the rooftop he was the only dude who reacted to Hakkai. To drive home this point that was him alongside a FS user (Luffy) yet he reacted to it before him, that alone should illustrate his reaction speed to you.
> 
> ...



You do know Luffy was the one who warned them a big attack was coming, right?


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Ok first of all you just arbitrarily made up that Law has similar reaction speed to Zoro. So I'd like to call you in that.
> 
> Secondly Zoro's reaction speed is ridiculous. On the rooftop he was the only dude who reacted to Hakkai. To drive home this point that was him alongside a FS user (Luffy) yet he reacted to it before him, that alone should illustrate his reaction speed to you.


That's just a lie. They ALL saw it coming. Zoro just had the balls to jump infront of it. They literally all reacted to it coming, there's no way that's a speed feat. Also, what sense would it make for Law to jump infront of it? He's the only one who could teleport them all away.


maupp said:


> Third, Broken bones Zoro tangoed with Hybrid Kaido for a bit, an even blitzed him to land his Ashura. Hybrid Kaido is fast as feck.


It wasn't a blitz, as stated by another user.


maupp said:


> With all the above you think Sanji is running circle around that guy I just described?
> 
> Also comparing Queen's reaction to Zoro is simply tragic. I mean come on now.
> 
> Ever since pre skip Oda has had Zoro casually react to speedster. He had no issue dealing with Kaku CP9 speed. He casually dealt with gepu, etc. Zoro has simply never been bothered by speed.


There is no instance where speed was a big factor in battles between YC1 and YC2 until Sanji. Showing that his speed is on another lvl. Zoro's reaction speed has never been something that just happens to be above his peers. He has normal reaction speed for his tier.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> Why would Sanji need King lvl durability? Do you need to no sell every attack now in order to beat someone?


King is relevant because a few of you are saying that this would me a mirror of the King fight, so that’s the point. The biggest reason Zoro struggles with King *is *his durability. You guys saying the fights would mirror are attributing King’s stats to Sanji for your argument which is beyond idiotic.


ClannadFan said:


> For some reason, you guys think someone needs Kings stats to beat RT Zoro. What part about him mid diffing Zoro don't you understand? Maybe if Zoro pushed him to the brink then sure. But Zoro could even scratch him.


Because of his durability which Sanji does not have. Try and keep up. Sanji does not have the attributes that Zoro is struggling with. There is something about King and King only here, that requires AdCoC to defeat *him.*

And about your poorly thought out Yama but, Zoro did more damage to Kaido than he’s done to King so far. Pretty shit take to say the least as you have 0 legs to stand on.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

@ClannadFan is a troll dude. Lmao that’s the only explanation

Reactions: Funny 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> @ClannadFan "*Why would Sanji need King lvl durability?*" So he doesn't get killed by Zoro, why else?


You don't get it. If King had less durability he would of still beaten Zoro. Instead of doing Zero damage Zoro could of did small damage and that would of changed nothing.


maupp said:


> "*Yamato legitimately did more damage to Kaido than Zoro did to King.*" So what does that tell you about King's durability given Zoro did more damage to Kaido than Yamato yet couldn't do anything to King?


All it means is that Zoro only has 1, at best 2 moves on YC1 lvl. And both leave him completely drained afterwards.

Reactions: Disagree 2


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Conxc said:


> King is relevant because a few of you are saying that this would me a mirror of the King fight, so that’s the point. The biggest reason Zoro struggles with King *is *his durability. You guys saying the fights would mirror are attributing King’s stats to Sanji for your argument which is beyond idiotic.


Sanji's speed is too much for Zoro. And his durability is good enough that he can take hits and not get beaten easily. It would mirror King in the way that its a mid diff. Nobody's saying that Sanji would jist walk him down like King did.


Conxc said:


> Because of his durability which Sanji does not have. Try and keep up. Sanji does not have the attributes that Zoro is struggling with. There is something about King and King only here, that requires AdCoC to defeat *him.*


Durability isn't the only stat King has over Zoro. King literally shits on him in every stat.


Conxc said:


> And about your poorly thought out Yama but, Zoro did more damage to Kaido than he’s done to King so far. Pretty shit take to say the least as you have 0 legs to stand on.


You're one of those guys who think King>Kaido huh. 

Outside of Dragon Kaido, Zoro only hurt him with Ashura. You think King wouldn't get hurt more than Kaido did if he used Ashura?

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

@ClannadFan Go reread the RT fight. Zoro had reacted before anyone had time to do anything. Law hadn't even had time to room out. If said Law had similar or faster reaction he'd have room everyone out before Zoro had to block the attack itself. Everyone was in panic mode with no time to react beside Zoro. Go reread the fight.

Ashura Zoro ended up in a blitz. They exchanged clashes for a bit then Zoro quickly Ashura'd Kaido while he was mid swing. Again go revisit those panels.

Speed became a factor in this fight because of Queen's glacial ass(compared to other competent fighters). Dude get clocked by anyone and his ass is always surprised. I mean didn't Zoro casually cut his virus weapon on the live floor from like 100 meters away then his simp ass was surprised? I mean all this stuff are in the manga. Go revisit them.

Queen has pathetic reaction's speed.


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## Kroczilla (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Has Queen ever successfully dodged or reacted to an attack on panel?


Has King?

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Fujitora (Dec 3, 2021)

Corax said:


> RT Zoro. Hakkai, Tatsumaki, Flying Dragon and Asura feats are more impressive than Ifrite vs Queen and DNA in general.


AP isnt everything, we saw it against King. While Zoro is good offensively he’s lacking in other things, like speed.

Sanji would keep blitzing him.

Reactions: Winner 1 | Optimistic 2


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## Fujitora (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> @ClannadFan Go reread the RT fight. Zoro had reacted before anyone had time to do anything.


Luffy reacted first when it came to Hakai.


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> @ClannadFan Go reread the RT fight. Zoro had reacted before anyone had time to do anything. Law hadn't even had time to room out. If said Law had similar or faster reaction he'd have room everyone out before Zoro had to block the attack itself. Everyone was in panic mode with no time to react beside Zoro. Go reread the fight.


You're wrong. Literally everyone reacted. Do you understand what reaction speed is?


maupp said:


> Ashura Zoro ended up in a blitz. They exchanged clashes for a bit then Zoro quickly Ashura'd Kaido while he was mid swing. Again go revisit those panels.


Again, not a speed feat. No blitz was done. All he did was land an attack. Not everytime an attack is landed it's a blitz.


maupp said:


> Speed became a factor in this fight because of Queen's glacial ass(compared to other competent fighters). Dude get clocked by anyone and his ass is always surprised. I mean didn't Zoro casually cut his virus weapon on the live floor from like 100 meters away then his simp ass was surprised? I mean all this stuff are in the manga. Go revisit them.
> 
> Queen has pathetic reaction's speed.


How did Queen keep up with Marco, and even Sanji for the most part? Are they just slow now too?

Also, Zoro fans claiming Zoro has better reaction speed than Luffy. Never change yall.

Reactions: Like 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> You don't get it. If King had less durability he would of still beaten Zoro. Instead of doing Zero damage Zoro could of did small damage and that would of changed nothing.
> 
> All it means is that Zoro only has 1, at best 2 moves on YC1 lvl. And both leave him completely drained afterwards.


If King had less durability, as in durability that doesn't let him completely negate Zoro's attacks then we can't tell how the fight would have turned out. The main reason the fight is one sided is because King is unaffected, without his haxx durability all of Tastumaki and SSSS cause damages and issues to King given the first attack had Kaido vomiting blood and wailing in pain. 

Zor has a whole plethora of moves beyond your so called YC level given he was a nightmare to Kaido on the RT. A mid tier attack of Zoro like tatsumaki overpowered Kaido's own tornados and injured him. Zoro is doing just fine AP wise. King is simply negating him due to his haxx durability.

Reactions: Like 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Thdyingbreed (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> All it means is that Zoro only has 1, at best 2 moves on YC1 lvl. And both leave him completely drained afterwards.


How in the world do you come to this conclusion Kings durability among YC1’s is the exception not the norm you going to try and tell me if Katakuri or Marco takes those attacks there not going to take any damage?

Reactions: Winner 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Luffy reacted first when it came to Hakai.


No he saw it first.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> You're wrong. Literally everyone reacted. Do you understand what reaction speed is?
> 
> Again, not a speed feat. No blitz was done. All he did was land an attack. Not everytime an attack is landed it's a blitz.
> 
> ...


Answer me this: Did Zoro cut Queen's weapon with an air slash from hundreds of meters away and Queen failed to react?


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Thdyingbreed said:


> How in the world do you come to this conclusion Kings durability among YC1’s is the exception not the norm you going to try and tell me if Katakuri or Marco takes those attacks there not going to take any damage?


Zoro pre AdvCoC was a YC2. When he used AdvCoC aka Ashura/Poured all his Haki into Enma he had YC1 lvl attacks. Most people here agree that Luffy still did more damage to Kaido on the rooftop. And that version of Luffy was still just a high end YC1.

Also, you don't need YC1 attacks to hurt a YC1. I'm sure Queen could damage Katakuri and Marco too.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Jay. (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Answer me this: Did Zoro cut Queen's weapon with an air slash from hundreds of meters away and Queen failed to react?


Are you Agenda Piecing again?


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> Answer me this: Did Zoro cut Queen's weapon with an air slash from hundreds of meters away and Queen failed to react?


You mean when Queen was literally aiming his gun at Chopper then got blindsided?


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## Fujitora (Dec 3, 2021)

Did my post really get delete? This website I swear....



maupp said:


> No he saw it first.



Bottom right panel.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 2


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

@ClannadFan No disrespect but I think you're simply wasting everyone's time if you're going to ignore feats and stick to your preconceived idea of how these characters should rank. 

So far all you've done from your end is tell people how X or Y should be this or that but don't bring forth any reasonable feats to back up your claims. You keep saying how X or Y character is YC therefore he has similar X,Y,Z characteristics to another commander, etc. But no feats have been presented from your side. 

The logic you've created allows you to transfer King's feats(durability, AP, etc) to other Yonkou commanders which in your head means they are replicable to Sanji who has just fought/defeated a YC. This is no way to have a discourse. This is simply headcanon.

Reactions: Winner 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

maupp said:


> @ClannadFan No disrespect but I think you're simply wasting everyone's time if you're going to ignore feats and stick to your preconceived idea of how these characters should rank.


The pot calling the kettel black lmao.


maupp said:


> So far all you've done from your end is tell people how X or Y should be this or that but don't bring forth any reasonable feats to back up your claims. You keep saying how X or Y character is YC therefore he has similar X,Y,Z characteristics to another commander, etc. But no feats have been presented from your side.
> 
> The logic you've created allows you to transfer King's feats(durability, AP, etc) to other Yonkou commanders which in your head means they are replicable to Sanji who has just fought/defeated a YC. This is no way to have a discourse. This is simply headcanon.


You've given zero evidience to support how Zoro has better reaction speed than Queen. Every "speed" or "reaction" feat you've given has been debunked.

Your arguement boils down to "Zoro has to have better reaction speed than Queen." And that's literally it.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

~Flow~ said:


> Did my post really get delete? This website I swear....
> 
> 
> 
> Bottom right panel.


My point exactly. He saw it first(probably thanks to FS). 

But Zoro reacted first given he'll be standing in front of everyone blocking Hakai despite standing on the far left pre Hakkai launch.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## maupp (Dec 3, 2021)

Meh, I'm tired. This was fun for a while but I think I've entertained myself enough. 

Aight, you guys be good. Peace.

Reactions: Funny 2 | Friendly 2


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## TheRealSJ (Dec 3, 2021)

levels

Reactions: Funny 6 | Winner 1


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## Thdyingbreed (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> Zoro pre AdvCoC was a YC2. When he used AdvCoC aka Ashura/Poured all his Haki into Enma he had YC1 lvl attacks. Most people here agree that Luffy still did more damage to Kaido on the rooftop. And that version of Luffy was still just a high end YC1.
> 
> Also, you don't need YC1 attacks to hurt a YC1. I'm sure Queen could damage Katakuri and Marco too.


His attacks on the rooftop we’re 100% YC1 level pre-advCOC especially the ones that had the flame aura Big mom wouldn’t be telling Kaido to dodge them for no reason.

I was arguing more against your point that Zoro has a couple YC1 attacks which is clearly not the case.


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## God Movement (Dec 3, 2021)

RT Zoro = Low YC1
Current Zoro = High YC1 or above

So RT Zoro wins. But not easily.


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Thdyingbreed said:


> His attacks on the rooftop we’re 100% YC1 level pre-advCOC especially the ones that had the flame aura Big mom wouldn’t be telling Kaido to dodge them for no reason.
> 
> I was arguing more against your point that Zoro has a couple YC1 attacks which is clearly not the case.


Other than the 2 attacks I mentioned, what else did Zoro show that was above YC2 lvl? Damaging Dragon Kaido is easy, ask Killer or any of the Scabbards.


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## Typhon (Dec 3, 2021)

I'm loving the circular logic of wanking King to try and act like Sanji couldn't take Zoro. Not like we didn't see Queen effortlessly tank one of King's attacks that sent Zoro flying and even had Franky offering the man help 

I'm guessing they think King low diffs Queen and Sanji to justify this take

Reactions: Winner 3


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

@ClannadFan personally not wasting anymore time on this guy lmfao. This is next level tier specialist shit dude

Reactions: Funny 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Conxc said:


> @ClannadFan personally not wasting anymore time on this guy lmfao. This is next level tier specialist shit dude


You were the easiest to trigger lmao. It's okay buddy not everyone has the same opinions on childrens cartoons.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> You were the easiest to trigger lmao. It's okay buddy not everyone has the same opinions on childrens cartoons.


Triggered? Lmfao I’m more baffled than anything. You can tell most guys are trolling on here with some of the shit they say, but it’s still pretty surprising just how far y’all will go. Tbh your name is a dead giveaway 

and if you live to “trigger” strangers on the internet about a “children’s cartoon” then maybe you should go outside and touch some grass

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Kroczilla (Dec 3, 2021)

I think Sanji takes this for a few reasons:

- he's just plain faster, to a not insignificant degree. He's twice shown the ability to completely disappear from Queen's perception which tbh I don't see Zoro being able to do much about

- he's attack strength isn't on par with Zoro's. But it doesn't need to be. And given that he's more durable than Queen who certainly isn't getting taken down by that version of Zoro without significant effort, it's fair to say that Sanji is likely to outlast Zoro here especially due to regen. 

- as we've just seem, once Sanji connects a solid attack (which he certainly will), it's all downhill from there for Zoro.

Reactions: Winner 2 | Optimistic 1


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Triggered? Lmfao I’m more baffled than anything. You can tell most guys are trolling on here with some of the shit they say, but it’s still pretty surprising just how far y’all will go. Tbh your name is a dead giveaway
> 
> and if you live to “trigger” strangers on the internet about a “children’s cartoon” then maybe you should go outside and touch some grass


You done crying yet? And triggering kids on the internet isn't my goto for entertainment, but on days I've got nothing to do why not? Also funny you'd say that, since you're wasting just as much time as I am by defending your cartoon character.


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> You done crying yet? And triggering kids on the internet isn't my goto for entertainment, but on days I've got nothing to do why not? Also funny you'd say that, since you're wasting just as much time as I am by defending your cartoon character.


Lol ok “the OG Dango”

Reactions: Funny 1


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Lol ok “the OG Dango”


Keep crying. Like you getting mad defending cartoon characters is any better lmao


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> Keep crying. Like you getting mad defending cartoon characters is any better lmao


“Keep crying. Like you getting mad defending cartoon characters is any better lmao”

Reactions: Funny 4


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Conxc said:


> “Keep crying. Like you getting mad defending cartoon characters is any better lmao”


That's literally you. You know you're mad when you start attacking someone for things outside of the thread subject. Also, I've actually revealed my face here before already. So I'd say there's about a 100% chance that you're more likely to be the triggered fat weeb lmao

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> That's literally you. You know you're mad when you start attacking someone for things outside of the thread subject. Also, I've actually revealed my face here before already. So I'd say there's about a 100% chance that you're more likely to be the triggered fat weeb lmao



You thinking you did something with this

Reactions: Funny 2


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Conxc said:


> You thinking you did something with this


I don't think it's ever been this easy to trigger someone before.


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## Thdyingbreed (Dec 3, 2021)

ClannadFan said:


> Other than the 2 attacks I mentioned, what else did Zoro show that was above YC2 lvl? Damaging Dragon Kaido is easy, ask Killer or any of the Scabbards.


He can do that with literally any of his attacks Dragon twister isn’t a particularly high end move but amped up it becomes on that level.


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## Captain Altintop (Dec 3, 2021)

I don't see much of a difference here between RT Zoro and Current Zoro. 

RT Zoro is gonna win *extreme *(_low_) diff while Current Zoro might win *high *(_high_) diff.


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

“I don’t think it’s ever been this easy to trigger someone before”

> you clearly being the one triggered



Anyway, troll aside, OT, Zoro still wins. Sanji ain’t King.


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## Donquixote Doflamingo (Dec 3, 2021)

Challenging the Legion is a foolish endeavor

Reactions: Funny 2


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Conxc said:


> “I don’t think it’s ever been this easy to trigger someone before”
> 
> > you clearly being the one triggered
> 
> ...


"I'm not mad, I'm just attacking you because I'm baffeled" Cry nerd


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## ClannadFan (Dec 3, 2021)

Captain Altintop said:


> I don't see much of a difference here between RT Zoro and Current Zoro.
> 
> RT Zoro is gonna win *extreme *(_low_) diff while Current Zoro might win *high *(_high_) diff.


Tbh I've never seen AdvCoC as a big upgrade. I think RT Zoro loses extreme (low) diff while Current Zoro wins extreme (low) diff.


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## FitzChivalry (Dec 3, 2021)

I hope we keep progressively downscaling Zoro in these hypotheticals until we finally get to that "RS Sanji with hella advanced Conqueror's coating vs East Blue Little Boy Zoro right after he loses to Kuina" thread.

Reactions: Funny 4 | Winner 1


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

FitzChivalry said:


> I hope we keep progressively downscaling Zoro in these hypotheticals until we finally get to that "RS Sanji with hella advanced Conqueror's coating vs East Blue Little Boy Zoro right after he loses to Kuina" thread.


Next thread: "EoS Sanji vs infant Zoro"


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## Typhon (Dec 3, 2021)

Because Zoro fans didn't flood the forums with Zoro vs previous incarnations of Luffy threads when he made the rooftop?

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Donquixote Doflamingo (Dec 3, 2021)

FitzChivalry said:


> I hope we keep progressively downscaling Zoro in these hypotheticals until we finally get to that "RS Sanji with hella advanced Conqueror's coating vs East Blue Little Boy Zoro right after he loses to Kuina" thread.



Kid Zoro was sqauting a boulder for 500+ reps he low diffs sanji

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Virus (Dec 3, 2021)

Zoro and Sanji fans instead of being totally happy with their respective characters getting power-ups, dwell into pointless debates like this one. Imagine if they were Usopp fans or *any-other-strawhat-fan-except-M3". Maslows pyramid of happiness at work, never settle down but always look for better and superior gratifications. People really are greedy animals in nature and this thread is an excellent example that even manga can elicit the same greediness that has destroyed lands, hopes and lives - just in a different setting and medium.


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## FitzChivalry (Dec 3, 2021)

Typhon said:


> Because Zoro fans didn't flood the forums with Zoro vs previous incarnations of Luffy threads when he made the rooftop?


 Well, those comparisons were more than fair. For one, they were more or less portrayed as equals there, and the hard evidence backs that.

Zoro and Luffy were fighting side by side on the rooftop against the same opponents, had the same teammates, and when you measure everything up between the two, you could make a clear, easy case for Zoro having the better showing of the two: He saved Luffy's ass a bunch of times (comparatively, surprisingly, the reverse isn't that true), was the second person to ever scar Kaido, showed flashes of not just CoC but CoC coating, he had Big Mom coaching Kaido to avoid _his_ attack, and ate the most powerful attack we've ever seen in the series when he took Ocean Sovereignty to save the other four.

He did it while having a newly acquired Enma that, while powerful, we knew wasn't fully cooperating that much with him yet. Luffy was useless twice in that fight: the first time was when he overexerted himself with his armament haki, and the second time when he got knocked the fuck out by Kaido's Ragnarok. Zoro was there both times to bail him out. The one time Zoro should have been useless, when he ate that combined Yonkou attack, he was still a full active participant in cutting up Zeus and helping to knock Big Mom out of the fight for good, and giving Kaido the Asura.

Reactions: Like 3 | Winner 1


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## Mrdude (Dec 3, 2021)

FitzChivalry said:


> Well, those comparisons were more than fair. For one, they were more or less portrayed as equals there, and the hard evidence backs that.
> 
> Zoro and Luffy were fighting side by side on the rooftop against the same opponents, had the same teammates, and when you measure everything up between the two, you could make a clear, easy case for Zoro having the better showing of the two: He saved Luffy's ass a bunch of times (comparatively, surprisingly, the reverse isn't that true), was the second person to ever scar Kaido, showed flashes of not just CoC but CoC coating, he had Big Mom coaching Kaido to avoid _his_ attack, and ate the most powerful attack we've ever seen in the series when he took Ocean Sovereignty to save the other four.
> 
> He did it while having a newly acquired Enma that, while powerful, we knew wasn't fully cooperating that much with him yet. Luffy was useless twice in that fight: the first time was when he overexerted himself with his armament haki, and the second time when he got knocked the fuck out by Kaido's Ragnarok. Zoro was there both times to bail him out. The one time Zoro should have been useless, when he ate that combined Yonkou attack, he was still a full active participant in cutting up Zeus and helping to knock Big Mom out of the fight for good, and giving Kaido the Asura.



Fighting side by side. But who was engaging Kaido on a regular basis?
Who was sitting back for a majority of those fights while Kaido was preoccupied with others? Only ever taking shots at Kaido when he was preoccupied fighting Luffy or when he had back up. (Killer)
The one time Zoro went out of his way to target Kaido on his own was when nobody else was standing and it was him Kaido and Law. We all know how quickly that ended.

In Kaido's eyes only Luffy ever measured up to him which was stated in the recent vivre cards. This proves nobody else was able to push Kaido as far on the rooftop.

Zoro took Hakai merely because he was willing to give up his life and dreams so that others could live. He was bailed out of situations several times himself. When Zoro went up to attack Kaido and missed, who do you think ran up to fight Kaido when Zoro was struck down by lightning? Law also saved his life when he teleported him and everyone else out of Hakai. Do you think Zoro would still be alive had Law not use his teleportation to move everyone out of harms way? Or when Zoro and Law were taken out who got up and told them to go downstairs so he could handle Kaido? This is a team fight where everybody contributes in some way.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 3


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## Navy Scribe (Dec 3, 2021)

Sanji gets babyshaked by any technique with enma , preferably flying dragon blaze ,even other techniques would injure him greatly.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Donquixote Doflamingo (Dec 3, 2021)

Mrdude said:


> Fighting side by side. But who was engaging Kaido on a regular basis?
> Who was sitting back for a majority of those fights while Kaido was preoccupied with others? Only ever taking shots at Kaido when he was preoccupied fighting Luffy or when he had back up. (Killer)
> The one time Zoro went out of his way to target Kaido on his own was when nobody else was standing and it was him Kaido and Law. We all know how quickly that ended.
> 
> ...



What troll ass post is this?

Luffy had to be saved by Zoro 3 fucking times get out of here with this bs

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Mrdude (Dec 3, 2021)

Donquixote Doflamingo said:


> What troll ass post is this?
> 
> Luffy had to be saved by Zoro 3 fucking times get out of here with this bs



Twice yes.
We all know Luffy can take boro breath. Just admit you can't accept the truth for what it is. Zoro's been saved just as much.


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## Donquixote Doflamingo (Dec 3, 2021)

Mrdude said:


> Twice yes.
> We all know Luffy can take boro breath. Just admit you can't accept the truth for what it is. Zoro's been saved just as much.



Hakkai technically double saved with law
Eaten by kaidou
Knocked the fuck out where Zoro 1v1 kaidou


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## Mrdude (Dec 3, 2021)

Donquixote Doflamingo said:


> Hakkai technically double saved with law
> Eaten by kaidou
> Knocked the fuck out where Zoro 1v1 kaidou



What difference would 1 more save make? Especially when Luffy was the one who warned them about Hakkai in the first place?

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## landondonnovan (Dec 3, 2021)

It only takes this to KO Sanji

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## Starrk (Dec 3, 2021)

landondonnovan said:


> It only takes this to KO Sanji


If Sanji did what Zoro did after this, he'd be dead just from the small sample Kuma gives him.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Donquixote Doflamingo (Dec 3, 2021)

Mrdude said:


> What difference would 1 more save make? Especially when Luffy was the one who warned them about Hakkai in the first place?



Do i really need to do basic 1v1 logic for you.

The more times luffy get saved the more your BS luffy was doing all the fighting arguement is stupid 

Luffy was doing all the fighting and taking all the ass beating


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## Mrdude (Dec 3, 2021)

Donquixote Doflamingo said:


> Do i really need to do basic 1v1 logic for you.
> 
> The more times luffy get saved the more your BS luffy was doing all the fighting arguement is stupid
> 
> Luffy was doing all the fighting and taking all the ass beating


Luffy was engaging Kaido regularly on his own. That's a fact. Not BS.
Luffy was getting his ass beat. But so was Zoro.

I'm just pointing out the obvious. I'm sorry you can't handle the truth.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Donquixote Doflamingo (Dec 3, 2021)

Mrdude said:


> Luffy was engaging Kaido regularly on his own. That's a fact. Not BS.
> Luffy was getting his ass beat. But so was Zoro.



Please dont compare luffy getting his head caved in to zoro falling to the ground after having most of his bones broken


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## OG sama (Dec 3, 2021)

How many damn times times do I have to say this shit? Kaido standing there letting guys land hits on him is absolutely not the fucking same as having a fight with someone whose actively trying to dodge or block hits.

Sanji is probably YC1 after this chapter, he may or may not have AP quite as strong as Zoro before or after ACoC but he is well rounded enough to still win, and unlike Kaido he’s not going to try and tank attacks from Zoro, no damn way.

Sanji beats pre AdvCoC Zoro. Sanji can move so fast that it looks as if he’s invisible, Sanjis got enough versatility to give this version of Zoro the same trouble that King has.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Mrdude (Dec 3, 2021)

Donquixote Doflamingo said:


> Please dont compare luffy getting his head caved in to zoro falling to the ground after having most of his bones broken



Why not? Zoro got a haki bloom in the form of AdvCoC and he dished out his strongest attack with Enma fully powered. The way I see it if Zoro+ wasn't backed into a corner he wouldn't have scarred him anyways. He'd still be throwing attacks right and left with no result.

That is the best version of Zoro up until now.


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## truedetectiveseason2intro (Dec 3, 2021)

Sanji wins high to extreme diff


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## El Hit (Dec 3, 2021)

OG sama said:


> How many damn times times do I have to say this shit? Kaido standing there letting guys land hits on him is absolutely not the fucking same as having a fight with someone whose actively trying to dodge or block hits.
> 
> Sanji is probably YC1 after this chapter, he may or may not have AP quite as strong as Zoro before or after ACoC but he is well rounded enough to still win, and unlike Kaido he’s not going to try and tank attacks from Zoro, no damn way.
> 
> Sanji beats pre AdvCoC Zoro. Sanji can move so fast that it looks as if he’s invisible, Sanjis got enough versatility to give this version of Zoro the same trouble that King has.


He was not standing there, zoro parried club attacks then cut him.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## OG sama (Dec 3, 2021)

El Hit said:


> He was not standing there, zoro parried club attacks then cut him.


No he didn’t parry any club hits ever don’t talk out of your ass if you aren’t going to prove what you claim with scans.

The only people to parry club hits are Luffy, Yamato, and BM, and Luffy didn’t do that until he got AdvCoC.

Kaido stood there allowing everyone from the scabbards to the rooftop 5 to just land clean hits on him, ain’t nobody else in this series is going to sit there and leave there selves open for attack like that.


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## A Optimistic (Dec 3, 2021)

OG sama said:


> No he didn’t parry any club hits ever don’t talk out of your ass if you aren’t going to prove what you claim with scans.
> 
> The only people to parry club hits are Luffy, Yamato, and BM, and Luffy didn’t do that until he got AdvCoC.
> 
> Kaido stood there allowing everyone from the scabbards to the rooftop 5 to just land clean hits on him, ain’t nobody else in this series is going to sit there and leave there selves open for attack like that.



@El Hit is correct. Zoro did block Kaido's attack.

It's the same move he used on Fishman Island. Look at the two images closely. Why do you think Kaido is saying _"Ugh!!"_


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## OG sama (Dec 3, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> @El Hit is correct. Zoro did block Kaido's attack.
> 
> It's the same move he used on Fishman Island. Look at the two images closely. Why do you think Kaido is saying _"Ugh!!"_


That panel is confusing, and even if he did parry club hits he did it with his ultimate attack which is AdvCoC enhanced. He wasn’t doing that at all prior to that. He had to use his highest ceiling attack just to do something that Luffy could casually do in Base with his Sandles with AdvCoC. Ashura is pretty much Zoros ceiling, pre or post AdvCoC he won’t have an attack better than leaving a permanent scar on a Yonko.

So basically he had to use every damn thing he had left to do just that.


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## El Hit (Dec 3, 2021)

OG sama said:


> No he didn’t parry any club hits ever don’t talk out of your ass if you aren’t going to prove what you claim with scans.
> 
> The only people to parry club hits are Luffy, Yamato, and BM, and Luffy didn’t do that until he got AdvCoC.
> 
> Kaido stood there allowing everyone from the scabbards to the rooftop 5 to just land clean hits on him, ain’t nobody else in this series is going to sit there and leave there selves open for attack like that.



CLANG CLANG 
There it is. I do not remember being disrespectful to you so do not be a fucking asshole when you reply.


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## El Hit (Dec 3, 2021)

also sanji does not have hybrid Kaido strength, I think both Zoro's win with high high extreme dif and low end of extreme dif.


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## OG sama (Dec 3, 2021)

El Hit said:


> CLANG CLANG
> There it is. I do not remember being disrespectful to you so do not be a fucking asshole when you reply.


Fair enough I apologize. But that is courtesy of Zoros ultimate move which is AdvCoC enhanced.


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## Conxc (Dec 3, 2021)

El Hit said:


> CLANG CLANG
> There it is. I do not remember being disrespectful to you so do not be a fucking asshole when you reply.


Yo, I never realized that that's what was happening. Zoro really is fucking goated. No wonder they hate him so much

Reactions: Lewd 1


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## FitzChivalry (Dec 3, 2021)

Mrdude said:


> Twice yes.
> We all know Luffy can take boro breath. Just admit you can't accept the truth for what it is. Zoro's been saved just as much.


Twice? How the fuck are you counting these? This just _objectively_ isn't true. So let's see:

- Cut up Big Mom's _Heavenly Fire_ when Luffy had his guard down in chapter 1001
- Cut up Kaido's Blast Breath when Luffy was vulnerable mid-air in chapter 1002
- After Luffy expended his haki and was extra vulnerable, Big Mom took a shot at Luffy's prone form, but Zoro scooped him up and got his ass out of the way in 1003
- Same chapter, Kaido tries to eat Luffy in his dragon form, and Zoro forces him to spit him out with a Santoryuu attack
-  SAME FUCKING CHAPTER: Kaido unleashes _Dragon Twister: Gale of Destruction_. Law, Kid, and Killer are all either able to dodge or deflect safely, except Luffy,  who needs Zoro to carry him to safety
- Kaido and Big Mom combine to use Ocean Sovereignty  to wipe them all out, which Zoro eats, buying Law enough time to warp them all out of the way of the blast
- After being absolutely wrecked by _Ragnarok_, Kaido approaches Luffy's unconscious form to finish him off, and Zoro saves him one last time with Asura in chapter 1010

So by my count, that's *checks notes* _seven_ total times Zoro saves Luffy from damage, injury, or outright death. You act like Luffy wasn't affected in any way by Blast Breath, when Oda drew Luffy visibly being damaged with blood and dirt. He ain't surviving 4 or 5 of those attacks from two Emperors, who are are kidding with that?

Reactions: Winner 7


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## Donquixote Doflamingo (Dec 3, 2021)

FitzChivalry said:


> Twice? How the fuck are you counting these? This just _objectively_ isn't true. So let's see:
> 
> - Cut up Big Mom's _Heavenly Fire_ when Luffy had his guard down in chapter 1001
> - Cut up Kaido's Blast Breath when Luffy was vulnerable mid-air in chapter 1002
> ...



Zoro HARD CARRIED the Roof Top fight

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 2 | Neutral 1 | Optimistic 3


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## convict (Dec 3, 2021)

FitzChivalry said:


> Twice? How the fuck are you counting these? This just _objectively_ isn't true. So let's see:
> 
> - Cut up Big Mom's _Heavenly Fire_ when Luffy had his guard down in chapter 1001
> - Cut up Kaido's Blast Breath when Luffy was vulnerable mid-air in chapter 1002
> ...



And in the prelude to the rooftop: Grabbing Luffy's unconscious ass away and hightailing it from that menace Apoo

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 1


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## Beast (Dec 4, 2021)

Wait… people really think Zoro did more then Luffy on the roof top?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Danyboy (Dec 4, 2021)

Beast said:


> Wait… people really think Zoro did more then Luffy on the roof top?


He sure did more then Kidd

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Beast (Dec 4, 2021)

Danyboy said:


> He sure did more then Kidd


When people ask for your fathers name… you seem like the type to give your mothers maiden name.

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Kylo Ren (Dec 4, 2021)

Zoro extreme or high diff.


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## Heart Over Blade (Dec 4, 2021)

Luffy needing more saving from his teammates isn't really something for Zoro to brag about. It means the other RT5 weren't regarded as highly by the Yonkou.

1. Luffy was considered the main threat to the Yonkou. Kaidou mainly targetted him especially after Luffy smacked him to the floor and everyone's jaw dropped.  BM did too to a lesser extent. Count the number of times Luffy was attacked/targetted vs any other RT5 and you'll find none of them were even targeted half as much as Luffy when he was still in the battle. Even when Kaidou used multi-target attacks like the wind scythes, he launched three at Luffy and one at each of the others. Two for kid because he his metal armor was huge. A missed Flying Dragon Blaze didn't really change that. They only became the focal points after Luffy was incapacitated.
2. Luffy after depleting G4 is a liability. Before that, dragon Kaidou and BM couldn't really do much about Luffy's relentless assault that ended up flooring Kaidou for a few seconds，even when the rest of the team got smacked down by BM's lightning.  Saving incapacitated Luffy is hardly as worthy of bragging rights as saving a Luffy in fighting shape. The fact that Luffy let himself get depleted like that instead of flying away to recharge like the fight against Katakuri means he trusts his nakama and also didn't want to abandon them. Even fodders and Nami have saved incapacitated Luffy. But when Luffy was in fighting shape he didn't actually NEED saving, he'd still be standing after Boro breath or BM's attack. All it did was reduce the damage he took. The one time he did need saving was after Ragnarok, but that ended up being a team effort by Law and Zoro. As for Hakai, the rest of the team would be dead if Luffy didn't warn them first. So Luffy, Zoro, and Law all saved each other.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Danyboy (Dec 4, 2021)

Beast said:


> When people ask for your fathers name… you seem like the type to give your mothers maiden name.


And you look like a person whos favourite going to be weaker then Zoro

Reactions: Funny 9


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## TheWiggian (Dec 4, 2021)

Hilarious thread, haven't laughed like that in a while (RT Killer Vs Sanji prior to DNA PU). Considering we haven't even seen AdCoC Zoro feats yet, so it's basically rooftop Zoro and he takes it with solid high diff or slightly more.
The true difference will be adjusted within the next chapters.


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## maupp (Dec 4, 2021)

Also do people ever think of how bad of a match up Zoro is to Sanji. Let's just forget about their respective levels and whatnot, match up wise, Zoro is the worst type of opponent for Sanji, even going to the Haki they specialize. 

Not only is Sanji limited in range which he would need to stay away from Zoro's swords, his CoA is weaker than Zoro which he'd also need to fight Zoro if the fight is going to be close quarter(only way Sanji can fight Zoro while the latter has means to fight in any range). 

Sanji would always need to make contact with Zoro's swords to land his attacks. This is suicidal given he has weaker CoA than Zoro, so he won't be protected from having his limbs severed or at least hurt. 

Sanji has his fights like with Vergo where they go legs for legs. Imagine instead of Vergo's leg coming to clash with Sanji's leg but it's Enma coming for that sweat tibia.

Reactions: Winner 3 | Optimistic 1


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## Beast (Dec 4, 2021)

maupp said:


> Also do people ever think of how bad of a match up Zoro is to Sanji. Let's just forget about their respective levels and whatnot, match up wise, Zoro is the worst type of opponent for Sanji, even going to the Haki they specialize.
> 
> Not only is Sanji limited in range which he would need to stay away from Zoro's swords, his CoA is weaker than Zoro which he'd also need to fight Zoro if the fight is going to be close quarter(only way Sanji can fight Zoro while the latter has means to fight in any range).
> 
> ...


Thats like the worst take ever. 



Zoro mister Doesn’t have KH is the perfect guy for Sanji to fight with his speed, agility and flight. 


You gotta be a bit stupid to think Zoro is a bad match up for Sanji when you take away power levels and just using basic style against each other. 


Zoros who thing is based on tagging Sanji in once or twice or three or whatever, Sanji isn’t 1 shot (never was but let’s move) and Zoro needs higher end moves… well, you should be able to figure out why someone who is bounded to the ground and has no speed and lacking KH skill… get his dick out your mouth.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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## Kroczilla (Dec 4, 2021)

maupp said:


> Also do people ever think of how bad of a match up Zoro is to Sanji. Let's just forget about their respective levels and whatnot, match up wise, Zoro is the worst type of opponent for Sanji, even going to the Haki they specialize.
> 
> Not only is Sanji limited in range which he would need to stay away from Zoro's swords, his CoA is weaker than Zoro which he'd also need to fight Zoro if the fight is going to be close quarter(only way Sanji can fight Zoro while the latter has means to fight in any range).
> 
> ...


This entire line of reasoning hinges on Sanji fighting like an idiot and not taking advantage of his speed and mobility.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Donquixote Doflamingo (Dec 4, 2021)

Kroczilla said:


> This entire line of reasoning hinges on Sanji fighting like an idiot and not taking advantage of his speed and mobility.



Sanji: Im gonna go super fast and hit zoro from his back or side to get passed his swords.

Zoro:

Reactions: Funny 2 | Winner 1 | Optimistic 1


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 4, 2021)

Donquixote Doflamingo said:


> Zoro HARD CARRIED the Roof Top fight


Luffy hard carried the roof top fight, zoro contributed but not anywhere close to luffy

Reactions: Winner 1 | Disagree 1 | Optimistic 1


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## TrolonoaZoro (Dec 4, 2021)

"sanji is unteachable unless Observation haki and kizaru speed"

"man sanji so fast, man. Never been touch"


@DarkRasengan In a portion of the RT, the squad little takes a panel to give him thanks for not letting the Yonkou wipe the squad out? lol

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 1


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 4, 2021)

TrolonoaZoro said:


> "sanji is unteachable unless Observation haki and kizaru speed"
> 
> "man sanji so fast, man. Never been touch"
> 
> ...


Zoro momentarily slowed 1 attack, luffy was going toe to toe with kaido the entire time, without luffy. Kaido walks around and destroys everyone 1 by 1

Reactions: Tier Specialist 2


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## TrolonoaZoro (Dec 4, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> Zoro momentarily slowed 1 attack, luffy was going toe to toe with kaido the entire time, without luffy. Kaido walks around and destroys everyone 1 by 1

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Beast (Dec 4, 2021)

Odens sword!

This is clearly all Enma feats.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Venom (Dec 4, 2021)

Someone please make an East Blue Zoro vs DNA+ RS Sanji thread. Sanji fans be fuming

Reactions: Funny 3


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## FitzChivalry (Dec 4, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> Luffy hard carried the roof top fight, zoro contributed but not anywhere close to luffy


I wonder if we read the same manga. Luffy had some really cool moments, but he fought super recklessly, to the point he needed constant saving. If not for Zoro and Law intervening, he'd have been in a world of shit.

Reactions: Like 1


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 4, 2021)

FitzChivalry said:


> I wonder if we read the same manga. Luffy had some really cool moments, but he fought super recklessly, to the point he needed constant saving. If not for Zoro and Law intervening, he'd have been in a world of shit.


We're not, luffy was the only one going toe to toe with kaido while the rest were supporting him and taking pot shots.


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 4, 2021)

So zoro replicated a feat that literally all of the scabbards had done. Also, zoro didn't have to worry about kaido attacking him because kaido was dealing with luffy, which is my point

Reactions: Funny 1


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## o0Shinthi0o (Dec 4, 2021)

Venom said:


> Someone please make an East Blue Zoro vs DNA+ RS Sanji thread. Sanji fans be fuming


And people will still vote Zoro mid diff


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## Conxc (Dec 4, 2021)

Venom said:


> Someone please make an East Blue Zoro vs DNA+ RS Sanji thread. Sanji fans be fuming


“East Blue Zoro right after fighting Mihawk vs DNA + RS + AdCoC Sanji”  

if “down bad” was a fanbase

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Marik Swift (Dec 4, 2021)

If I had a bunch of people to save my ass every time shit goes south in a fight against Mike Tyson, don't you think I would be more willing to throw hands with him as well? 

I mean, we all know Luffy, he would fight Kaido even if the RT4 weren't there, but let's not act like him choosing to go over Kaido was cause he was the only one who could.

Him and Kaido have a personal feud, that's the only reason they were focusing on each other more than anybody else.


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 4, 2021)

Marik Swift said:


> If I had a bunch of people to save my ass every time shit goes south in a fight against Mike Tyson, don't you think I would be more willing to throw hands with him as well?
> 
> I mean, we all know Luffy, he would fight Kaido even if the RT4 weren't there, but let's not act like him choosing to go over Kaido was cause he was the only one who could.
> 
> Him and Kaido have a personal feud, that's the only reason they were focusing on each other more than anybody else.


The reason kaido was focusing on luffy because he is the biggest threat and the only person would could even fight him 1 on 1


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## Marik Swift (Dec 4, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> The reason kaido was focusing on luffy because he is the biggest threat and the only person would could even fight him 1 on 1


Based on?  

Cause last I remember right after when he got Luffy 1v1 he solo'd him no problem.

He was focused on Luffy cause he was interested in him, not cause Luffy was a threat.

While his character has been contradictory a lot throughout this arc, we have been told multiple times Kaido likes to fight and wants to die. He could care less whether Luffy is a threat or not. He just likes the potential challenge. Having fought Luffy before he saw something in Luffy that he had yet to see in the others.

What they have is personal, very little to do with threat. Fans just went with that completely ignoring the fact that Kaido wants to die.

Reactions: Disagree 2


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 4, 2021)

Marik Swift said:


> Based on?
> 
> Cause last I remember right after when he got Luffy 1v1 he solo'd him no problem.
> 
> ...


Based on the fact that no one had feats anywhere close to luffys and luffy had better haki all around and better physical stats than every one of the rooftop 5 by a long shot. He was the only one anywhere close to the strength to go toe to toe with kaido

Luffy is the only one that had the speed/strength/haki that wouldn't immediately get demolished


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## Marik Swift (Dec 4, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> Based on the fact that no one had feats anywhere close to luffys and luffy had better haki all around and better physical stats than every one of the rooftop 5 by a long shot. He was the only one anywhere close to the strength to go toe to toe with kaido
> 
> Luffy is the only one that had the speed/strength/haki that wouldn't immediately get demolished


Exactly. You're saying exactly what I'm saying.

"Kaido fought Luffy before so he took an interest in him".

Nowhere in there does it imply however that he saw Luffy as a threat so he singled him out. He simply wanted to fight him, and didn't care about the others. It's the same as if you have a craving for a particular food, you don't care about any other food. Doesn't mean the other stuff doesn't taste good, just means that you want that food and that food only.

If it was about threat, and Kaido was worried about that, he would have killed Luffy instead of sending him to Udon.

Reactions: Disagree 1


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## Sir Curlyhat (Dec 4, 2021)

_King flings Zoro around => King is strong outlier only top tier YC1
Queen combos his abilities well enough to connect with a faster than ever Sanji => Queen sucks and Sanji is slow

_

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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## TrolonoaZoro (Dec 4, 2021)

Queen level comboing to hit a Sanji? So movement speed is irrelevant. Logging this comment.

But who else do we have for reference when it comes to Queens combat abilities? Because overcoming Zoro physically is a feat because he's been established as an outlier in terms of strength.



King tags Marco. Queen doesn't.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Heart Over Blade (Dec 5, 2021)

Of course Kaidou knew the threat Luffy posed. He saw him grow from an insignificant insect he could one shot, to one that could tango with him for a while, to one that's now going toe to toe with him in base, in a very short period of time in verse. How many other RT5 sent Kaidou into a monologue about whether they're going to surpass Kaidou's top 5 list of strongest people? Among the RT5, Luffy was the one with the highest bounty  by far, which is still used as a general measure of threat level in verse.
Kaidou's also well aware of the alliance putting their faith in Luffy to defeat him. He realizes if Luffy goes down it will cripple everyone's morale.



He said he regretted not killing Luffy earlier , and proceeds to throw an unconscious Luffy into the ocean to drown.  If it weren't for plot Luffy would be dead.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 5, 2021)

I wonder if Queen ever tagged someone?


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## Beast (Dec 5, 2021)

Marik Swift said:


> Nowhere in there does it imply however that he saw Luffy as a threat so he singled him out. He simply wanted to fight him, and didn't care about the others. It's the same as if you have a craving for a particular food, you don't care about any other food.


You clearly only read bits of the spoiler thread and not the manga because what the fuck are you talking about?



Luffys been singled out since the start. Not because he is just any other food, fuck is you talking about?
Did you read DR?
Have you been keeping up with the plot since PH? 
Because that’s where the plot for Kaidou starts. 



Fuck this guy mean… about Nothing implies Luffy was a threat?

People shouldn’t do join these discussions if they aren’t reading the manga if I’m honest.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Beast (Dec 5, 2021)

TrolonoaZoro said:


> Queen level comboing to hit a Sanji? So movement speed is irrelevant. Logging this comment.
> 
> But who else do we have for reference when it comes to Queens combat abilities? Because overcoming Zoro physically is a feat because he's been established as an outlier in terms of strength.
> 
> ...





TheWiggian said:


> I wonder if Queen ever tagged someone?


Did you guys stop reading the manga at act2?


You guys just going with the flow right about now.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 5, 2021)

Beast said:


> Did you guys stop reading the manga at act2?
> 
> 
> You guys just going with the flow right about now.



So who did he tag? An absent minded Sanji? Or Sanji with King's help?

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Beast (Dec 5, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> So who did he tag? An absent minded Sanji? Or Sanji with King's help?


ooh… you want me to read for you?

Nah buddy…. You go pick up from chapter 1025 and go from there.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 5, 2021)

Beast said:


> ooh… you want me to read for you?
> 
> Nah buddy…. You go pick up from chapter 1025 and go from there.



So you can't mention a single character he tagged without the person being being ganged by someone else and him or when his opponent is somewhere else with his mind?

Good to know. Might as well have said you have nothing.

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Beast (Dec 5, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> So you can't mention a single character he tagged without the person being being ganged by someone else and him or when his opponent is somewhere else with his mind?
> 
> Good to know. Might as well have said you have nothing.


marco and Sanji… you know the guys he actually fought. 

Slapped away base Luffy in prison. 



It’s nothing short of extreme bias and stupidity to say Queen hasn’t tagged anyone… sp you clearly haven’t been reading act 3 given your silly responses thread after thread. Or maybe you’re still talking about Two piece, where Denjiro stopped/ blocked/ countered and overpowered Kaidou

Reactions: Winner 1


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## stealthblack (Dec 5, 2021)

More like sanji vs enma


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## Mariko (Dec 5, 2021)

Isn't Sanji mid diffing Queen? 

If yes it would place him around King's level no? 

You have my answer brothers.

Reactions: Winner 1 | Disagree 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 5, 2021)

Beast said:


> marco and Sanji… you know the guys he actually fought.



Did he tag those on his own? Maybe King helped him with both and later Sanji was absent minded? 

 



Beast said:


> Slapped away base Luffy in prison.



 



Beast said:


> It’s nothing short of extreme bias and stupidity to say Queen hasn’t tagged anyone… sp you clearly haven’t been reading act 3 given your silly responses thread after thread. Or maybe you’re still talking about Two piece, where Denjiro stopped/ blocked/ countered and overpowered Kaidou



So who did he tag without support from others or special circumstances like Luffy being limited to a small area with plot devices on his hands or a Sanji who was busy thinking about his emotions and DNA?

Teach us Beast-kun.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## ice demon slayer (Dec 5, 2021)

RT Zoro is too much for Sanji to handle

Reactions: Agree 3


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## TheWiggian (Dec 5, 2021)

ice demon slayer said:


> RT Zoro is too much for Sanji to handle



Doesn't mean it won't be a good fight.


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## ice demon slayer (Dec 5, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Doesn't mean it won't be a good fight.


A two shot probably

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Marik Swift (Dec 5, 2021)

Beast said:


> You clearly only read bits of the spoiler thread and not the manga because what the fuck are you talking about?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Your entire argument falls apart when Kaido sent Luffy to Udon instead of killing him.

And "PIS" isn't a defense, since we are discussing character motivations, not Oda's intentions.

Want to try again?

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Beast (Dec 5, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Did he tag those on his own? Maybe King helped him with both and later Sanji was absent minded?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Loool, far from it. He’s been fighting Sanji by himself and all you gotta do is read the latest chapter and see for yourself about this absent minded Sanji  
He tagged Marco the same as king, not sure what the difference is if the attacks phase through Marco. 


Bro… just read the latest chapter for god sake. He tagged Sanji 4 times just this chapter.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Disagree 1


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## AmitDS (Dec 5, 2021)

Well Current Sanji is dominating Queen while Rooftop Zoro was clearly struggling with King as he came down from the rooftop so I'd say Sanji hence Zoro and Sanji both powering up simultaneously to beat King and Queen.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 5, 2021)

Beast said:


> Loool, far from it. He’s been fighting Sanji by himself and all you gotta do is read the latest chapter and see for yourself about this absent minded Sanji
> He tagged Marco the same as king, not sure what the difference is if the attacks phase through Marco.
> 
> 
> Bro… just read the latest chapter for god sake. He tagged Sanji 4 times just this chapter.



Just tell me who Queen tagged on his own without outside factors like another combatant aiding him or CIS like Sanji daydreaming. Shouldn't be that hard.


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## Beast (Dec 5, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Just tell me who Queen tagged on his own without outside factors like another combatant aiding him or CIS like Sanji daydreaming. Shouldn't be that hard.





Beast said:


> all you gotta do is read the latest chapter and see for yourself about this absent minded Sanji


So, when are you going to start reading posts first before replying?


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> So, when are you going to start reading posts first before replying?



So Queen tagged no one on his own?

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> So Queen tagged no one on his own?


Wow, not only can you not read… you’ve turned blind. Damn. 


Who do you think was tossing Sanji around this very chapter? 


Ooh wait, you still haven’t read it

Reactions: Winner 1


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## maupp (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Doesn't mean it won't be a good fight.


Would it? Sanji's ultimate technique is some fire based move, meanwhile RT Zoro no sell fire based attacks.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## Mylesime (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> Wow, not only can you not read… you’ve turned blind. Damn.
> 
> 
> Who do you think was tossing Sanji around this very chapter?
> ...



What do you expect?
Several readers have no shame, admitting to have not even read hundreds of chapters, fact that doesn't prevent them from spewing some of the wildest nonsense out there.
Queen and King ganged up on Marco?
Logical flawless conclusion:
1)King is stronger than Marco.
2)Queen can not tag anyone.....

You can't make this shit up. The fuck are you supposed to tell confronted with so much bullshit?



You laugh that's what you do.

















Moral of the story.
These guys have no shame.

Reactions: Winner 4 | Optimistic 1


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 6, 2021)

maupp said:


> Would it? Sanji's ultimate technique is some fire based move, meanwhile RT Zoro no sell fire based attacks.


Zoro cant no sell fire based attacks, where do you get that from? If your talking about firefox fire cutting
1. Good luck tagging sanjis leg before it hits you
2. If you do focus on cutting the fire from sanjis leg, your leaving yourself open to still getting kicked hard


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Mylesime said:


> What do you expect?
> Several readers have no shame, admitting to have not even read hundreds of chapters, fact that doesn't prevent them to spew some of the wildest nonsense.
> Queen and King ganged up on Marco?
> Logical flawless conclusion:
> ...



Great you showed 2 panels of Queen tagging Sanji that was mesmerized by his families abilites.

Then you admitted Queen had Kings help. 

Conclusion you didn't help Beast-kun here but added more weight to the fact that Queen couldn't Tag anyone on his own without support or the person daydreaming.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Kroczilla (Dec 6, 2021)

Has King tagged anyone unaided ?

Reactions: Funny 1 | Winner 1


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## Mylesime (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Great you showed 2 panels of Queen tagging Sanji that was mesmerized by his families abilites.



Excuses.
This shit can be applied to downplay any feat.
An example?
The only reason King tagged Zoro was because Zoro was mesmerized by the Pteranodon's abilities, his swords tricks, and Enma acting up.
We all know it's bullshit tough.
So collectively we do the sensible thing, we praise King. Which is quite clearly not what is happening with Queen. Every single one of his feats are downplayed, same with his portrayal and hype.
They are getting tagged , period.

*You also conveniently did not touch the instance where Queen stopped Zoro and Luffy from reaching the Rooftop....... did not want any of that smoke......*
Your bias is stronk i'll give you that.
Keep ridiculously painting the calamity as a glass cannon, a slow fat ass unable to tag anyone...... except for all the instances you're choosing to ignore. It only shows your fairness.......

Worst part in all of this, highlighting how shameless and agenda driven some of us are?
The same posters have been highlighting for years the instances where the cook was in a bad spot against other characters (Vergo, Doffy,etc) ignoring all context those times.
The double standard is quite impressive:






TheWiggian said:


> *Then you admitted Queen had Kings help.*
> 
> Conclusion you didn't help Beast-kun here but added more weight to the fact that Queen couldn't Tag anyone on his own without support or the person daydreaming.



Bolded i'm sure you'll be able to figure out eventually that if Queen had King's help (which wasn't the case in the instance i posted), this shit worked both ways...... Hang in there, you should be able to reach the sensible conclusion one day.

I have rarely witnessed so much collective denial and bad faith.
Why simply not accept that just like Zoro is not some scrub compared to Luffy, Sanji ain't one either compared to Zoro.
The minute you guys will apply the same dynamic , everything will make sense, rather than shamelessly denying actual facts or acting like this type of threads are not the exact same thing that all the Zoro VS Luffy threads all over this section.....


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Mylesime said:


> Excuses.
> This shit can be applied to downplay any feat.
> An example?
> The only reason King tagged Zoro was because Zoro was mesmerized by the Pteranodon's abilities, his swords tricks, and Enma acting up.
> ...



Lol you sound very desperate. You cannot even defend your stance without bringing up Zoro and King. I wouldn't care anyway since I never made an argument of King tagging someone like Zoro. So you're pretty much attacking a strawman like most of the time.

**



Mylesime said:


> Worst part in all of this, highlighting how shameless and agenda driven some of us are?
> The same posters have been highlighting for years the instances where the cook was in a bad spot against other characters (Vergo, Doffy,etc) ignoring all context.
> The double double standard is quite impressive:



The only agenda here is that you try to make Queen more than what he is. He's someone your buddy and you failed to provide evidence, multiple times for tagging someone without outside factors



Mylesime said:


> Bolded i'm sure you'll be able to figure out eventually that if Queen had King's help (which wasn't the case in the instance i posted), this shit worked both ways...... Hang in there, you should be able to reach the sensible conclusion one day.
> I have rarely witnessed so much collective denial and bad faith.
> Why simply not accept that just like Zoro is not some scrub compared to Luffy, Sanji ain't one either compared to Zoro.
> The minute you guys will apply the same dynamic , everything will make sense, rather than shamelessly denying actual facts or acting like this type of threads are not the exact same thing than all the Zoro VS Luffy threads all over the section.....



Once again, that would mean something to me if I ever made an argument that King tagged someone on his own.

So again attacking a strawman and trying to deflect from the fact that Queen can't Tag shit on his own.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Mylesime (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> *So again attacking a strawman and trying to deflect from the fact that Queen can't Tag shit on his own.*



I know it's so crazy to bring Zoro's name in a thread titled: "Sanji VS RT Zoro".


I won't waste my time. You're clearly full of it, which is not surprising to be fair.....
This shit will go nowhere as we're both aware of.
I have as much respect for your takes as you have for mine.


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## maupp (Dec 6, 2021)

Are people honestly trying to make a case for Queen when it comes to anything related to speed(reaction time, movement, tagging, etc).  

The fat bastard couldn't react to a casual air slash from Zoro hundreds of meters away. Instead of Queen the plague he should be known as Queen the snail.

Reactions: Funny 7


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Mylesime said:


> I won't waste my time. You're clearly full of it, which is not surprising to be fair.....



So when the Sanji thing gets dismantled the only hope left is a gag scene with Luffy and Zoro and Marco in a mode that was never shown to dodge any sort of attack throughout the whole story?



Doesn't look like you can muster any sort of content to support your deluded notion of Queen being capable of tagging someone noteworthy.

Keep posting the GIFs, they reflect the strength of your argument.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Mylesime (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> *strength of your argument.*








TheWiggian said:


> the only hope left is a *gag scene* with Luffy and Zoro and Marco in a mode that was never shown to dodge any sort of attack throughout the whole story?


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Glad the gag arguments (Sanji fans speciality) are exhausted.

Reactions: Winner 1 | Optimistic 1


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

Mylesime said:


> Excuses.
> This shit can be applied to downplay any feat.
> An example?
> The only reason King tagged Zoro was because Zoro was mesmerized by the Pteranodon's abilities, his swords tricks, and Enma acting up.
> ...


You know it’s funny when the first attack from the brothers queen used, Sanji effortlessly dodged but… according to @TheWiggian 

Sanji was mesmerised. 


And the @maupp guy is a joke tbh, literally went into hiding being put in his place numerous times… I think he blocked me now.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> You know it’s funny when the first attack from the brothers queen used, Sanji effortlessly dodged but… according to @TheWiggian
> 
> Sanji was mesmerised.
> 
> ...



The most hilarious thing is when you believe you made an argument by attacking another person. Iam still waiting for Queen the tagger, tagging characters without outside factors.


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> The most hilarious thing is when you believe you made an argument by attacking another person. Iam still waiting for Queen the tagger, tagging characters without outside factors.


You’re still replying back to me?

Bro… you gone keep making yourself look stupid?


The pictures have already been posted Mr ‘Sanji was mesmerised’  

Attacking someone? I know the truth can be scary but it is the truth.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> You’re still replying back to me?
> 
> Bro… you gone keep making yourself look stupid?
> 
> ...



So you still got absolutely nothing?

 

Queen tagged base Luffy in Udon right bro? Ain't that a strong argument?


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> So you still got absolutely nothing?
> 
> 
> 
> Queen tagged base Luffy in Udon right bro? Ain't that a strong argument?


Looool, nothing… 

> all while skipping Queen tagging Sanji… 


Yeah absolutely nothing mr ‘Sanji was mesmerised’.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

Excuses…

1. Distractions
2. Help from king 
3. ‘Sanji mesmerised’ 
4. Gag 


 

Not even after being caught cheating on my girl, could I come up this many excuses. Props to @TheWiggian  it’s not easy hating.

Reactions: Funny 4


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> Excuses…
> 
> 1. Distractions
> 2. Help from king
> ...



And yet you cannot add anything to counter those 4 points and instead continue with ad hominems?


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> And yet you cannot add anything to counter those 4 points and instead continue with ad hominems?


You know I can’t preform miracles right?


Can’t make a blind man see.I can only guide you, now hold on to my shoulder Wigs.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> You know I can’t preform miracles right?
> 
> 
> Can’t make a blind man see.I can only guide you, now hold on to my shoulder Wigs.



No one here asks for miracles 

Is it really so hard for you to find evidence when Sanji is not distracted?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Strobacaxi (Dec 6, 2021)

Current Sanji should be able to extreme diff RT Zoro. Sanji can avoid Zoro's strongest attacks, he will only be hit by large scale air slashes like Tatsumaki or 1080P which are not enough to defeat him. But Zoro also tanks most of his attacks.

A long fight but Sanji ends up winning with extreme extreme diff. Assuming Zoro is unable to use CoC of course, if he can use CoC in a random attack he wins

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3 | Disagree 1


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## Conxc (Dec 6, 2021)

Strobacaxi said:


> Current Sanji should be able to extreme diff RT Zoro. Sanji can avoid Zoro's strongest attacks, he will only be hit by large scale air slashes like Tatsumaki or 1080P which are not enough to defeat him. But Zoro also tanks most of his attacks.
> 
> A long fight but Sanji ends up winning with extreme extreme diff. Assuming Zoro is unable to use CoC of course, if he can use CoC in a random attack he wins


Idk if Sanji can avoid attacks like Lion’s Song or Ashura. He can definitely avoid Zoro’s more telegraphed moves but his finishers have extremely fast attacking speed. I doubt Sanji can avoid attacks that Kaido could not. Sanji’s reaction speed remains a big weakness of his.

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 1 | Optimistic 1


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

That Kaidou ‘could not’ as we watch Kaidou tank attack after attack.


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## Strobacaxi (Dec 6, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Idk if Sanji can avoid attacks like Lion’s Song or Ashura. He can definitely avoid Zoro’s more telegraphed moves but his finishers have extremely fast attacking speed. I doubt Sanji can avoid attacks that Kaido could not. Sanji’s reaction speed remains a big weakness of his.


Did Kaido try tho?
It looks to me that Kaido was trying to block/Attack Zoro and getting blocked/Overpowered, but I didn't see any hint that Kaido tried to dodge or avoid his attack

Reactions: Like 2


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## Conxc (Dec 6, 2021)

Strobacaxi said:


> Did Kaido try tho?
> It looks to me that Kaido was trying to block/Attack Zoro and getting blocked/Overpowered, but I didn't see any hint that Kaido tried to dodge or avoid his attack


That’s true. He didn’t try and dodge it, but he did try and attack Zoro first. He couldn’t react in time and Kaido has really good reactions. Sanji doesn’t. King’s no slouch either and Zoro casually blitzed him with Lion’s Song.

Reactions: Like 2 | Optimistic 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Kaido 'could not' and Kid 'could never even hope to' after seeing how his scrap golem was shredded by iNvIsIbLe AiR sLaShEs

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Kroczilla (Dec 6, 2021)

I see @Conxc delusions are as strong as ever


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Kaido 'could not' and Kid 'could never even hope to' after seeing how his scrap golem was shredded by iNvIsIbLe AiR sLaShEs


Only because he was ‘mesmerised’

Reactions: Funny 5


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## Conxc (Dec 6, 2021)

Forgot about the invisible slashes lol. So let’s see:

Rooftop Zoro:
-completely reacted to the invisible slashes to counter Sanji’s “invisibility”
-can cut fire and Sanji’s strongest attacks are fire based
-can tag guys like Kaido several times
-Can hurt guys with Kaido’s durability several times
-can still operate after momentarily blocking an attack like Hakai, which even taking the brunt force temporarily is still more AP than Sanji can put out

Of course Zoro will be tagged here and there, but Hakai proves that he can take *a lot *of punishment before he reaches his limit. Zoro needs to land a lot less to put Sanji down than the reverse.

Sanji runs faster tho.


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

Conxc said:


> He didn’t try and dodge it.
> He couldn’t react in time
> Kaido has really good reactions.



What if I told you… this is all just one post. 

Like how could you contradict yourself back to back to back. Damn… Z boys setting some great record this week.


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## Kroczilla (Dec 6, 2021)

Can someone help with those Kaido reaction feats? 

I seem to recall him basically soaking up attacks left, right and center.


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

Kroczilla said:


> Can someone help with those Kaido reaction feats?
> 
> I seem to recall him basically soaking up attacks left, right and center.




Kaidou didn’t even try to dodge but he still couldn’t react in time. He definitely has good reaction though.


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## Kroczilla (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> Kaidou didn’t even try to dodge but he still couldn’t react in time. He definitely has good reaction though.


No doubt he has good reactions. But apparently Sanji has bad reactions compared to Kaido. Just need some info on that.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> Only because he was ‘mesmerised’



About what exactly? How Killer performed better than him?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> About what exactly? How Killer performed better than him?


‘Mesmerised’ at the freshness of the air in onigashima.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> ‘Mesmerised’ at the freshness of the air in onigashima.



So he was so impressed by Killer's superior performance he said: "fuck the scrap, I'll make killer the king?'


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> So he was so impressed by Killer's superior performance he said: "fuck the scrap, I'll make killer the king?'


Sounds like something a subordinate would say. Kidd is a Captain. It gets confusing I know, that’s why Oda added ‘Captain’ to his name, it doesn’t get confusing like with Zoro or killer or Law.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> Sounds like something a subordinate would say. Kidd is a Captain. It gets confusing I know, that’s why Oda added ‘Captain’ to his name, it doesn’t get confusing like with Zoro or killer or Law.



Kid just now managed to hurt a Yonko, nearly 3 dozens of chapters after Killer. He's playing catch-up right now and needs the awakening of his fruit to stand his ground. Kinda sad.


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## Kroczilla (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Kid just now managed to hurt a Yonko, nearly 3 dozens of chapters after Killer. He's playing catch-up right now and needs the awakening of his fruit to stand his ground. Kinda sad.


Could have sworn Kid hurt dragon Kaido on the roof


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## Mylesime (Dec 6, 2021)

Kroczilla said:


> Could have sworn Kid hurt dragon Kaido on the roof



Nope he did not, just like Queen did not tag anyone!


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Kid just now managed to hurt a Yonko, nearly 3 dozens of chapters after Killer. He's playing catch-up right now and needs the awakening of his fruit to stand his ground. Kinda sad.


Two piece sounds great but this is a OP discussion.


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## convict (Dec 6, 2021)

I'm not gonna lie I thought Sanji would have won the poll one would think after an Adv CoC powerup that makes one canonically multiple leagues stronger a post-Sanji power-up would get more love than a pre-powerup Zoro.

That just goes to show how disappointing Queen was in comparison to the feats Zoro accomplished in the rooftop. It really is a feat vs portrayal situation.

Reactions: Like 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Lmao (Dec 6, 2021)

9 pages going strong

Reactions: Like 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> Two piece sounds great *but this is a OP discussion*.



Then why are you participating with no evidence of Queen tagging Sanji without outside factors?


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Then why are you participating with no evidence of Queen tagging Sanji without outside factors?


Loool, you’re the only here that thinks Queen hasn’t tagged anyone


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> Loool, you’re the only here that thinks Queen hasn’t tagged anyone



OL disagrees, we would like to see who Queen tagged without outside factors beast-kun. Gonna bring up Udon and Luffy up again?

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> OL disagrees, we would like to see who Queen tagged without outside factors beast-kun. Gonna bring up Udon and Luffy up again?


Who is OP? 
You mean the Z boys?
I mean anything related to Zoro and Sanji has never your strong suit in discussions, sp not sure what you mean. 


I’m not the person who is ignoring On panel feats. Mr ‘mesmerised’.  


It’s not even a discussion just laughing at your embarrassing claim that is literally against what happens this very latest chapter.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> *Who is OP?*
> You mean the Z boys?
> I mean anything related to Zoro and Sanji has never your strong suit in discussions, sp not sure what you mean.
> 
> ...



Wtf are you talking about?   

Will you finally give us the panels where Queen tags Sanji without King's help or the cook being distracted by his family or not?


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Wtf are you talking about?
> 
> Will you finally give us the panels where Queen tags Sanji without King's help or the cook being distracted by his family or not?


Someone did and you went with ‘it’s a gag’ 
And ‘Sanji was mesmerised’. 

I’m done giving you lessons. You must find out on your own Mr ‘mesmerised’


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## Lmao (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> *Will you finally give us the panels where Queen tags Sanji* without King's help or the cook being distracted by his family or not?


 

This literally happened in the latest chapter.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> Someone did and you went with ‘it’s a gag’
> And ‘Sanji was mesmerised’.
> 
> I’m done giving you lessons. You must find out on your own Mr ‘mesmerised’



So you still have nothing? 



Lmao said:


> This literally happened in the latest chapter.



Meh can't read past the part he wants to see.


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

Mylesime said:


> Moral of the story.
> These guys have no shame.





TheWiggian said:


> Great you showed 2 panels of Queen tagging Sanji that was mesmerized by his families abilites.



Okay Mr ‘mesmerised’


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## Lmao (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Meh can't read past the part he wants to see.


King is not present and Queen tags Sanji more than once, you denying it happened or what?


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

Sanji dodged the first attack from the brothers powers, got tagged, dodged again and got tagged again… but yeah ‘mesmerised’.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> Okay Mr ‘mesmerised’




*Spoiler*: __ 









Garp too gets tagged by preskip Luffy. Because yea since according to Beast-kun, context doesn't matter. Oh well poor Garp too weak or slow to dodge or block despite being a confirmed CoO user.





Lmao said:


> King is not present and Queen tags Sanji more than once, you denying it happened or what?



Getting tagged while constantly getting suprised and remembering his traumatizing brothers throughough the whole exchange. It went all the way from Sanji discovering his newly found powers, where he was hit multiple times while being absent minded without even bothering to defend in some cases.


*Spoiler*: __ 













You even have an idiot like Zoro pointing out why Sanji is spacing out.  

@Beast : "Nah Sanji is fine... Queen tagged him fair and squre with no other factors involved".  

Show goes on with Sanji getting confronted by his traumatizing memories but ofc they don't mean anything and Sanji's just fine, Oda just drew his brothers, their abilities and their blood relation with Judge which visibly affects Sanji's (a CoO specialists) temper/emotions (which disrupt the observation): 
We already know their abilites but let's delay this arc even further with meaningless panels and speech bubbles related to them. 

@Beast : "Sanji fine".  


*Spoiler*: __ 













Same old story. Queen couldn't land a single hit on Sanji without confronting him with his bloodline or something related to it, which kept reminding Sanji of them and he kept having flashbacks and was thinking back in time or wondering what was happening to his body.



Feel free and try to debunk that.

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 2


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## maupp (Dec 6, 2021)

convict said:


> I'm not gonna lie I thought Sanji would have won the poll one would think after an Adv CoC powerup that makes one canonically multiple leagues stronger a post-Sanji power-up would get more love than a pre-powerup Zoro.
> 
> That just goes to show how disappointing Queen was in comparison to the feats Zoro accomplished in the rooftop. It really is a feat vs portrayal situation.


The only way Sanji is winning this is if we go with the "should" logic from people instead of actual feats. 

Sanji arguments, especially against Zoro have always hinged on this notion they "should" be close(why is that I don't know but apparently it's something we have to accept just because). 

Zoro would bust feats after feats post Skip while Oda would use Sanji as a hype tool yet people will always say the fight is hard/extreme diff. 

So now that Zoro powers up from his RT version, people instantly equates Zoro's previous version as lesser than Sanji's current one because like I mentioned, that's what the "should" logic demands. But feats wise RT Zoro absolutely bodies the latest version of Sanji. 

Not only is Zoro an awful match up against Sanji, he also negates his most powerful attacks which are fire based(RT Zoro no sell fire attacks).

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looool, not sure what all these words are for when there are clear pictures… Queen tagging Sanji without any distraction. 
‘Mesmerised’


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## Lmao (Dec 6, 2021)

According to Wiggian's logic, Kaido has been distracted this entire time by Oden's trauma and Enma's weird aura

Rooftop 5 fought a distracted Kaido

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Conxc (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> What if I told you… this is all just one post.
> 
> Like how could you contradict yourself back to back to back. Damn… Z boys setting some great record this week.


Sorry beast, I didn’t realize that getting tagged by a character that is known to have a fast attacking speed meant your had bad reactions.

I wonder what that means for guys that get tagged by X Drake and Queen…casually might I add. Just my Z boy jargon again though I guess.

Reactions: Creative 1


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## Kroczilla (Dec 6, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Sorry beast, I didn’t realize that getting tagged by a character that is known to have a fast attacking speed meant your had bad reactions.


How exactly do you rate characters as having good reaction if they don't consistently react to attacks


Conxc said:


> I wonder what that means for guys that get tagged by X Drake and Queen…casually might I add


Your "X-drake and Queen is slow" propaganda has gotten a bit boring. Got anything else?


Conxc said:


> Just my Z boy jargon again though I guess.


Agreed.


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## Conxc (Dec 6, 2021)

known speedsters X Drake and Queen must have godly attacking speeds. Unfortunate. Especially Queen. Top 5 speeds across the board in the verse. I guess running fast does mitigate all other advantage.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 6, 2021)

Lmao said:


> According to Wiggian's logic, Kaido has been distracted this entire time by Oden's trauma and Enma's weird aura
> 
> Rooftop 5 fought a distracted Kaido



Did you just discover that Kaido has PTSD from Oden?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Beast (Dec 6, 2021)

Conxc said:


> Sorry beast, I didn’t realize that getting tagged by a character that is known to have a fast attacking speed meant your had bad reactions.
> 
> I wonder what that means for guys that get tagged by X Drake and Queen…casually might I add. Just my Z boy jargon again though I guess.


it was the framing of your post, you admit that he didn’t try to dodge but also claimed he could not, it’s just funny logic.

Not sure what you mean, I don’t doubt they could tag anyone but maybe Kizaru moving light speed similar to Sanji this week but I doubt Kizaru would be as effected by fatigue of using his natural DF power rather then Sanji who is running with his legs. Drake could perform attacks at similar speeds to G4, he got away from Queen, WWs and Hawkins when he got ambushed. Tagging someone I don’t think is that hard a task as people try to act like. People stronger and faster then queen or drake wouldn’t need to dodge every attack, that’s something Sanji does, most would counter, parry or fully block the attack depending what the right move is.


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## Conxc (Dec 6, 2021)

Beast said:


> it was the framing of your post, you admit that he didn’t try to dodge but also claimed he could not, it’s just funny logic.


I said that he could not *react*. Reacting is not only dodging. Reacting includes dodging, parrying, blocking, countering.


Beast said:


> Not sure what you mean, I don’t doubt they could tag anyone but maybe Kizaru moving light speed similar to Sanji this week but I doubt Kizaru would be as effected by fatigue of using his natural DF power rather then Sanji who is running with his legs. Drake could perform attacks at similar speeds to G4, he got away from Queen, WWs and Hawkins when he got ambushed. Tagging someone I don’t think is that hard a task as people try to act like. People stronger and faster then queen or drake wouldn’t need to dodge every attack, that’s something Sanji does, most would counter, parry or fully block the attack depending what the right move is.


The point is those are fears that speak to Sanji’s reaction speeds. Just as him dodging Katakuri’s jellybean was and is a positive feat towards that, guys that aren’t particularly known for their attacking speed tagging him contribute to the negative. It’s fair game. This wouldn’t be the first time that we’ve seen a super fast character having a weakness of slow reactions. Enel with one of the best CoO showings in the manga had piss poor reaction speeds for example. You didn’t bring this up here, but I’ve seen it a lot, but Sanji’s newfound *movement *speed and specialization in CoO doesn’t make him exempt from being tagged and it doesn’t wash away his poor reaction feats.


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## FitzChivalry (Dec 7, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> So zoro replicated a feat that literally all of the scabbards had done. Also, zoro didn't have to worry about kaido attacking him because kaido was dealing with luffy, which is my point


Christ, scabbards ain't scaring or scarring Kaido. They, in the end, really didn't accomplish shit. He ate all of their attacks and told them their cuts weren't deep enough towards the end of proceedings, and told them none of them were Oden. Grievous insult to devastating physical injury. All heart, no results.

"Also Zoro didn't have to worry about--" No, cut that out. This was a battle with _two_ Yonkou. So correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't this the same battle where Zoro (and Killer, separately) was also cheap shot from behind by Big Mom with an electric based attack, right after she was coaching Kaido to dodge his attack? A Kaido who, up to that point, was taking every attack to test his durability against these guys? 

Luffy was on offense for like 95% of that fight. Zoro did what he did while taking on a decidedly more supportive role for the majority of it. Luffy had the luxury to be reckless, because his #2 was right there.

So if you don't think it's not actually wildly impressive that Zoro managed to do everything he did while covering Luffy's ass for most of the fight, while also having to worry about Big Mom at his back, I don't know what to tell you.

Reactions: Like 6 | Winner 1


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 7, 2021)

FitzChivalry said:


> Christ, scabbards ain't scaring or scarring Kaido. They, in the end, really didn't accomplish shit. He ate all of their attacks and told them their cuts weren't deep enough towards the end of proceedings, and told them none of them were Oden. Grievous insult to devastating physical injury. All heart, no results.
> 
> "Also Zoro didn't have to worry about--" No, cut that out. This was a battle with _two_ Yonkou. So correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't this the same battle where Zoro (and Killer, separately) was also cheap shot from behind by Big Mom with an electric based attack, right after she was coaching Kaido to dodge his attack? A Kaido who, up to that point, was taking every attack to test his durability against these guys?
> 
> ...


Christ in that panel he didnt scar kaido

Reactions: Dislike 1


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## TheNirou (Dec 7, 2021)

Zoro's feats clears off Sanji's feats and it's not even a debate.

Reactions: Like 2 | Winner 3


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## Beast (Dec 7, 2021)

Conxc said:


> I said that he could not *react*. Reacting is not only dodging. Reacting includes dodging, parrying, blocking, countering.
> 
> The point is those are fears that speak to Sanji’s reaction speeds. Just as him dodging Katakuri’s jellybean was and is a positive feat towards that, guys that aren’t particularly known for their attacking speed tagging him contribute to the negative. It’s fair game. This wouldn’t be the first time that we’ve seen a super fast character having a weakness of slow reactions. Enel with one of the best CoO showings in the manga had piss poor reaction speeds for example. You didn’t bring this up here, but I’ve seen it a lot, but Sanji’s newfound *movement *speed and specialization in CoO doesn’t make him exempt from being tagged and it doesn’t wash away his poor reaction feats.


Nah, not being able to react means the character was blitz, which never once happened to Kaidou, people have hit with varying techniques and attacks and he just eats every single one of them. 
The only attack that seemed like he couldn’t react to is Odens and given, Zoros last words I don’t doubt Oden is still even stronger then Luffy never mind Zoro or anyone else. Being tagged, Countered or having your attacks parried is not and will not ever be classed as ‘not being able to react’. Do you think everyone thing is a 1 HKO type of fight? Dodge, dodge and dodge to land one hit? Is that you think is the only way to class a fight because it doesn’t make sense any other way. 


Umm… not sure what you mean, I was telling you what I think nothing more or less. Enel is an outlier and has always been, Oda said he would have had 500m but to beat him, Enels weakness was much basic reactions and stats (understandable as he lived as a god on skypia and no one could touch his real body). 
Sanji has never been the slow speed or slow reaction type, you’re just being biased is all. From Vergo in PH, to travelling half way across DR to catch up to DD, to dodging katas Fs, to literally blitzing Oven and everyone in WCI, Sanjis never been shown to be slow in speed nor reaction and on top of that… Oda gave him KH as a speciality but you go run off with Sanji got shit reactions or that’s his weakness when it’s clearly been his strongest suits from when he came into the series.

Reactions: Like 1


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## DarkRasengan (Dec 7, 2021)

TheNirou said:


> Zoro's feats clears off Sanji's feats and it's not even a debate.


Sanji defeated a commander


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## Strobacaxi (Dec 7, 2021)

DarkRasengan said:


> Sanji defeated a commander


So did a literal dog

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Lmao (Dec 7, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> Did you just discover that Kaido has PTSD from Oden?


So you're admitting the rooftop 5 fought a distracted Kaido then

Looking forward to seeing you participate in talks regarding rooftop feats

Reactions: Like 1


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## Conxc (Dec 7, 2021)

Beast said:


> Nah, not being able to react means the character was blitz, which never once happened to Kaidou, people have hit with varying techniques and attacks and he just eats every single one of them.
> The only attack that seemed like he couldn’t react to is Odens and given, Zoros last words I don’t doubt Oden is still even stronger then Luffy never mind Zoro or anyone else. Being tagged, Countered or having your attacks parried is not and will not ever be classed as ‘not being able to react’. Do you think everyone thing is a 1 HKO type of fight? Dodge, dodge and dodge to land one hit? Is that you think is the only way to class a fight because it doesn’t make sense any other way.
> 
> 
> ...


I disagree to an extent, but I’m curious to know what you would say happened in the exchange where Zoro used Ashura on Kaido? Because Kaido was prepairing an attack to counter. That much is undebatable. He wasn’t just standing there waiting to be tagged. So what do you think happened there?

The bold is my point. Enel is literal lightning. He should be second only to Kizaru (or first, don’t remember is lightning or light is faster). On top of that he’s got such powerful CoO. He would literally be invincible if he didn’t have piss poor reactions, hence why that is one of his most glaring weaknesses. Regarding Sanji, there have been many examples of him not being able to react to much slower (relative to himself) characters. Full Zoan Drake and Queen are just the Wano examples. There are more.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 7, 2021)

Lmao said:


> So you're admitting the rooftop 5 fought a distracted Kaido then
> 
> Looking forward to seeing you participate in talks regarding rooftop feats



He had his moments, even prior to Rooftop. You didn't know this either?

I have no idea what there is with you being excited about if you had no idea about Kaido's PTSD in the first place.

Reactions: Like 1


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