# Ok you mods better give me a good explanation



## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

why is it that the new rule states that only blenderites get their rep and postcount cut in half @ ban(i heard this from TWF so info might not be 100% accurate) thats fucking unfair, either you make a system that applies to everyone or not. 


and besides that i think this is a bullshit rule, it wont stop any bans, more likely itll increase them since people that get banned often lose both postcount and rep then theyll think "who cares" and do it more often...


i bet you just came up with this to get a reason to remove their reps.


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## Fang (Aug 16, 2007)

Is this true? And does it apply to GBers? We're not that b& prone but sometimes it happens, so does the Blenderite rule work to us as well?


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## pajamas (Aug 16, 2007)

If this is true I need to grab a bag of lol.


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## Kakuzu (Aug 16, 2007)

I got raped by an admin already today.  

This is just too much.


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## ̣ (Aug 16, 2007)

I was linked here.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

no im pretty sure the staff has figured out this "if they lose all their power they wont care and get banned more often" but just doesn't care.


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## B (Aug 16, 2007)

Pretty fucking stupid if you ask me.


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## Purgatory (Aug 16, 2007)

This is fuckin' bullshit. This devil is not amused


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

pretty fucking stupid is putting it mildly


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## Fang (Aug 16, 2007)

Who is Forkshy? Never heard of that staff member.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

he's an advisor, prob some old mod or smod or something who changed nick


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## Pein (Aug 16, 2007)

TheBlindHyuuga said:


> people that obviously don't care about being banned get their rep/post count cut in half and their senior membership removed
> 
> "hurt 'em where it hurts"





Shroomsday said:


> If you did it knowing full well you'd get banned for it (like spamming up a Forum), then yeah you'd get it. As TBH says, it's when the actual punishment of a ban doesn't seem to work as a deterrent.



there you have it 
now


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

take me for example i have 600k if that would be halved i wouldnt really fucking care anymore i'd go crazy since both my postcount and HARD EARNED rep is gone... just one cut in it makes them mad, then they're so mad they get it cut again and again and again, in the end they either leave the forums or are perm banned  remember rep is fucking serious business


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## geG (Aug 16, 2007)

It applies to the whole board.

It's just only done to people who know they'll get banned for doing it and are doing it anyway for the lulz, and more often than not that's going to be a blenderite.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

99% of the people who gets banned are doing it knowingly you just cant go "oh im a noob i didnt know" and get away with it, when a more senior member goes "oh i didn't know" and they get a "lol yeah right" back in their faces, i've been here since the start... and i havent read the rules once.


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

I fucking love that this is coming from you and that many of the people posting here saying how stupid it is, have been previously banned.

We are sick and tired of having to clean up / ban you whenever you guys get your weekly "HEY LETS BE SPECIAL" moment.

It's simple, don't get banned. If you start breaking more rules because you got your rep cut in half or the likes, we'll perm ban you.



> It's just only done to people who know they'll get banned for doing it and are doing it anyway for the lulz, and more often than not that's going to be a blenderite.


123


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## Fang (Aug 16, 2007)

pek the villain said:


> I fucking love that this is coming from you and that many of the people posting here saying how stupid it is, have been previously banned.
> 
> We are sick and tired of having to clean up / ban you whenever you guys get your weekly "HEY LETS BE SPECIAL" moment.
> 
> ...



So is this Blenderite only or what?


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> So is this Blenderite only or what?


no            .


> It's just only done to people who know they'll get banned for doing it and *are doing it anyway for the lulz*, and more often than not that's going to be a blenderite.


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## Fang (Aug 16, 2007)

So everyone that is b& prone or has been b& several times, I take it?


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## Purgatory (Aug 16, 2007)

I sense alot of people becoming b& now.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

pek the villain said:


> I fucking love that this is coming from you


why thank you pekker, thats so nice of you to say 


> and that many of the people posting here saying how stupid it is, have been previously banned.


your point  ?





> We are sick and tired of having to clean up / ban you whenever you guys get your weekly "HEY LETS BE SPECIAL" moment.


saying its weekly is being abit unfair, i've been banned a total of 3 times on this forum, the first one was by random by Kori, second one was thread spamming blender, and third one was... 5/5(and 5/24 combined), and nearly no one gets banned weekly really.... but i get your point, but why not just give longer bans, i mean after my 3 months ban i really dont feel like getting banned again, so everytime they get banned just highten the sentence like 1-2 months instead of a few days....


> It's simple, don't get banned. If you start breaking more rules because you got your rep cut in half or the likes, we'll perm ban you.


which like i said could be caused by the chain reaction of having it cut too many times



forkshy said:


> i don't understand, why not just avoid getting yourself banned?


i dunno, hard rules to follow


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

Freija said:


> your point  ?


My point? That it is extremely amusing seeing members that have been previously banned cry over not being able to "lol" their way out of a ban.



> saying its weekly is being abit unfair, i've been banned a total of 3 times on this forum, the first one was by random by Kori, second one was thread spamming blender, and third one was... 5/5(and 5/24 combined), and nearly no one gets banned weekly really.... but i get your point, but why not just give longer bans, i mean after my 3 months ban i really dont feel like getting banned again, so everytime they get banned just highten the sentence like 1-2 months instead of a few days....


Because we've tried with longer bans and longer bans would lead to lots of dupes and in most cases, perm ban of the original account because he/she was too stupid not to realize that we oculd do an easy ip search to find the dupes which they went to spam with.



> which like i said could be caused by the chain reaction of having it cut too many times


Why get banned in the first place? They didn't HAVE to spam, they did it because they expected a "lol" and to be able to lol their wy out of the ban. Saosin / Devil Akuma kept posting "WHY AM I NOT BANNED" threads/posts in Blender....


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

pek the villain said:


> My point? That it is extremely amusing seeing members that have been previously banned cry over not being able to "lol" their way out of a ban.


they lol their way out of bans  i must master that skill immeadiatly!!!





> Because we've tried with longer bans and longer bans would lead to lots of dupes and in most cases, perm ban of the original account because he/she was too stupid not to realize that we oculd do an easy ip search to find the dupes which they went to spam with.


that does sound kind of annoying, but at the same time, longer bans and no usage of dupes really gets you to stay clear of bannable offenses, i think i've done a good job so far , but you could always ban the ips from the usual proxies which would stop most uses of dupes also....





> Why get banned in the first place? They didn't HAVE to spam, they did it because they expected a "lol" and to be able to lol their wy out of the ban. Saosin / Devil Akuma kept posting "WHY AM I NOT BANNED" threads/posts in Blender....


i never liked saosin or devil akuma, and yeah those thraeds were fucking annoying me 



what i think is most unfair though is that they had no clue about this new rule, and it just applied to them out of the blue, if anything restore their rep and postcount but atleast now they have a warning of what happens next time.


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## Fang (Aug 16, 2007)

So Pek since I've been b& once and it was an accidental ban, so that doesn't count, if I'm banned for flaming let's say, will I lose my stuff as well?


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

Point is. This will only be used in certain cases and it wont be removed anytime soon. Purposely breaking rules just to laugh at it on MSN or Blender is not acceptable and those who's had a bad history with bans/warnings are more into the risk zone and should watch themselves. We wont use this for overstepping the "blender thread limit" etc... we'll only use it when we feel that it is necessary...

and Corrupt Vergil: You should watch it...fucking around to gain some cool points with the blender can get you banned.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

yeah, i don't really agree with the rule at all, but a warning to them at first would've been nice, i mean it's like suddenly stop signs means go  don't stop, and the goverment doesn't care to warn the people, then the people get fines and shit, and then the cops go "well now you know"


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## Ram (Aug 16, 2007)

Ah so the weak spot has been found.

I would recommend not getting banned in the first place but w/e.


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## Mintaka (Aug 16, 2007)

Define necessary.  How do we know that a mod or admin won't abuse this power because maybe we've angered them in the past or gotten on there bad side.  What redundancies are in place to make sure this fair to the one being banned?



Hmmm so I've already been B& once so if I get B& again I lose half my rep points and get senior membership revoked?


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

Only an admin can do it and there are few admins. We have a "Debatable ban" thread where we discuss the bans and what kind of "punishment" will be used.

Corrupt Vergil: Learn to use the edit button, this isn't blender....


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## Circe (Aug 16, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Who is Forkshy? Never heard of that staff member.


He's an advisor. (perhaps you know him as "Bean"?) Uncanny ability to seemingly transport to areas where he is being discussed, and has a ridiculously sarcastic sense of humour.


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## Genesis (Aug 16, 2007)

Pein's quote explains it quite well.

Basically, if you step out line knowing full well what the consequences will be and are doing it for shits and giggles. You get your rep and post cut in half. That's how i interpreted it.

Meaning getting banned for a heated debate (which lead to flames at times) or something like that may not necessarily get you this punishment.


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## Purgatory (Aug 16, 2007)

Alright, seriously, I have no freakin' clue what you're talking about what you said in your earlier post.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Yes but peK honestly, you cant just set up a rule no one knows about and then just use random members as an example (well you can, but its... disgustingly cheap shot) atleast give them back their rep and postcount now, everyone knows the rule know, if it happens again they cant say they haven't been thoroughly warned?


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## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

Thanks Pek...

one question...what is the magic number(how times can you be banned until your rep and post count are cut in half)?


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

No. Someone with a criminal record, and who's been in jail, robs a lady knowing that he'll most likely go to jail and he laughs it off when he is lead to court because he believe he'll only get the normal "2-3 month" jail time...the court however find this behavior extremely disturbing and decides to revoke his driver license and take his car.

They did know that they were breaking the rules, they did intent to break the rules and they were aware that they could get banned but didn't care...their fucking problem now and I'd expect someone who's at least earned their rep to complain not someone who's been giving them out daily to same people and received dialy rep from same people for...nothing.

Edit: This isn't a new "rule". This is a new way for us to stop people from fucking around just so they can laugh and spend their ban time on msn / other forum and return with normal rep / post.

SENTINEL404: How about you take 2 minutes and read the thread.


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## Kagakusha (Aug 16, 2007)

Gah. This isn't a "rule" persay. You'll get the punishment that we think fits your crime. Most of those who had their posts/rep halved were multiples offenders. So, chill out. We won't be doing this to every banned member.

But, like a few have been saying, just ... stay out of trouble. Period. And don't tell us what's fair and unfair, especially if you're repeat offenders. That's just silly and you're only looking out for yourselves by saying it's unfair.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

.......... no one has earned their rep fully without repwhoring... i know you should remember the "rep the user above" thread since i see you joined in sep 04 too.... wether it was allowed back then or not is not the point, it was still repwhoring...


and i still think its really cheap to do it out of the blue like that on them, if they'd been giving a warning first im sure they would've stopped being banned. so be a sport and give it back to them and everyone is aware of the rule and shit, you get your mission accomplished and you don't have to listen to the whining of repwhores such as myself







> But, like a few have been saying, just ... stay out of trouble. Period. And don't tell us what's fair and unfair, especially if you're repeat offenders. That's just silly and you're only looking out for yourselves by saying it's unfair.


am i seen as a repeat offender then ? my ban count is probably amongst the lower ones in the blender... seeing as i've been banned twice (three times if you consider the joke ban by Mary)... and fair and unfair is a matter of oppinion... no ? not to start a fight or anything, but i can express what i feel is fair if i want to or not kaga, amirite?


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

Well IMO this sounds like bullshit. Fine if you want to do it for raiding another forum, thats your perrogative but such routine things as a ban for flooding say the blender, people like kinjo do it just to get a ban for a vacation. Why? Because it gets your attention.

And where pray tell did all this come from? We haven't misbehaved at all recently o_0


And what is this faggotry of being Blender only? We are probably more tame then other such 'clans' on this forum. Lessee, GB, UyB, Battledomers, many other sections do raids, we've behaved ourselves for a while now.

If some are being ^ (not the meaning of the word "respect".), do it to them, upping the punishment (lol Chuck Norris' 10-20-life commercial) for us all is just...lol whut?

Btw, I'm a tad late so haven't read anything, Peter just told me to help


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## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

pek the villain said:


> SENTINEL404: How about you take 2 minutes and read the thread.



                        . ok..makes senses..


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## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

I agree with Freija about this matter. But I want to bring up another point. About the rep part, cutting it in half seems unfair, seeing as how all members have a different amount. If you look at Saosin, who only lost 25k rep points, and Hollow who lost nearly 100k for the same offense it really doesn't make sense, and for example, just say someone like RK gets b& and gets all his stuff halved, he will lose over 600k rep points, which is years worth of getting in this current system, so is that really fair?


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

*Ignores topic*

JULIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE 

Long time no see, when does the preparation for Naruwards this year start?


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## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

Kamina said:


> Btw, I'm a tad late so haven't read anything, Peter just told me to help


Indeed. Read these posts:
Flas Step,I bring you an epic win thread for you.
Flas Step,I bring you an epic win thread for you.
Flas Step,I bring you an epic win thread for you.


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## Kagakusha (Aug 16, 2007)

=__=;

Pantsu - course you have the right to express your opinions. But, you said it yourself, you don't want this being enforced 'cause rep is serius bizness. And that's the point.

Remember, the staff has ALWAYS had the right to do ... what they wish when it comes to punishing members. So, there's no point in arguing with us on making this type of punishment go away. It won't. Because it'll enforce the rules and really make it hurt for a repeat offender. Just ... behave and it'll all be okay. O_o;

It seems to me, that you're more so arguing for those users *specifically* punished. Which is fine. But, honestly, they had it coming. :x


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

well if the rule were annouced before hand i'd just whine alittle and then give up, kaga dear, but i really really feel this was wrong just to start off with it without Dave and Esca knowing and they just lost 100k just like that...


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## Kagakusha (Aug 16, 2007)

Kaga said:
			
		

> It seems to me, that you're more so arguing for those users *specifically* punished. Which is fine. But, honestly, *they had it coming*. :x



>___>


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## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

How about this, you don't do stuff that gets you banned and none if it matters.

This thread makes me SO glad we instituted that rule, because it just proves that people are going to not blow off being banned.


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## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

Freija is right imo. I can understand that if you warned them or set up the rule before they got banned, they would know about it and most likely not try to get banned so easily, since they didn't know its pretty unfair to give them this punishments right now with no warning. I know that you have to make examples and such, but they deserve another chance, now that everyone knows what will happen


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## Sub-Zero (Aug 16, 2007)

Kakuzu said:


> *I got raped by an admin already today.*
> 
> This is just too much.


There are centers for that sort of thing.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

he might've had it coming but this is what he told me happend....







> Dave säger:
> i posted 5 off topic posts in the HoU
> Dave säger:
> then banhammer
> ...


doesnt seem like one of those DIE HARDCORE CASES THAT MUST BE SEVERELY PUNISHED as peK describe earlier...


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

@Pek: >_> Jeez, such serious business. Ever heard of concept of lightening the mood some?

But @ the whole idea of deterrent by increasing the punishment *faceplant*. Boys will be boys. Spammers will be spammers. People do things for the lulz. Are you really sure you want this forum to become such serious business that people have to post things only on topic and its just more continual flaming on Naruto and Sasuke and all that bull? Because thats a slippery slope (i know it a falacy but really don't care) between trying to eradicate such doings and trying to exterminate members who dissagree with you. Nazism I say 

Anyway, it is a fair policy to I dunno, WARN PEOPLE that there is a new law of harsher punishment if you want to deter people before making a few people guinea pigs. If you'd have said HEY GUYS DONT DO THIS OR WE WILL CUT YOUR REP AND POSTS, maybe they wouldn't have done that. And this thread wouldn't be here.

The anouncements aren't there for nothing...

Oh and I think a set amount is more fair. For some who have only say 10k rep, losing 5k is only a few weeks to make it up. For senior members, its an irrecoverable loss.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Kamina said:


> The anouncements aren't there for nothing...



apparently they are...


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## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

Kamina said:
			
		

> Oh and I think a set amount is more fair. For some who have only say 10k rep, losing 5k is only a few weeks to make it up. For senior members, its an irrecoverable loss.


 
I said that


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## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

> But @ the whole idea of deterrent by increasing the punishment *faceplant*. Boys will be boys. Spammers will be spammers. People do things for the lulz. Are you really sure you want this forum to become such serious business that people have to post things only on topic and its just more continual flaming on Naruto and Sasuke and all that bull?


Yes, I really do want a forum where people follow the rules we have worked so hard to construct. 

The problem is a set amount affects people differently too.  To someone with 600k losing 5k is nothing, to someone with 7k it is almost everything.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba thats funny coming from you since you did such a wonderful job at pissing people off at 5/24 even I was impressed


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## Taxman (Aug 16, 2007)

Dave just got off a fucking perm, he should have stayed out of the thread

and using the excuse "I was responding to the thread title" doesn't fucking fly to a spam thread outside of the blender.

FAQ:
1. Is this only for blenderites?

no, it's for the whole board

2. What's the magical number of bans?

it's not the number...it's your fucking attitude.  Treating the court like it's "club fed" or basically not caring if you get banned leads to this punishment because banning you obviously isn't acting as the proper deterrent.

However, being banned multiple times does lead us to believe that you just don't care.

3.  Will this happen if we flood the blender?

no

4.  Will this happen if I flood somewhere other than the blender?

most likely

5.  Have you guys done something like this before?

 yes...see: Gokuden, Cryogenic Blaze, and Yellow as three examples of ban + post count reduction/rep reduction.

6.  How do I avoid this from happening to me?

Stay out of trouble


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

^
how do i know about this rule beforehand if its not announced ?


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## Mintaka (Aug 16, 2007)

Some people don't just do it for the lulz either and when angered won't stay banned for long.  Not to mention stay as only one person or if they do play nice.  What happens when you make the wrong person mad by doing something out of the blue like this?


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## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

Freija said:


> Gooba thats funny coming from you since you did such a wonderful job at pissing people off at 5/24 even I was impressed


And yet I didn't break any rules, and there haven't been any raids since then.


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## Bro Tai Jr. (Aug 16, 2007)

z0mg
Noes my rep!


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> Yes, I really do want a forum where people follow the rules we have worked so hard to construct.


I really need how to learn to do the sound thing.

*insert RO RO FIGHT DA POWAH!*

How boring. But you realize what your existance will be without big things to tackle like raids or other such things, moderating threads in the library or battledome against flaming. Terribly tedious. As a mod you have to make like you are actually doing something. And without things that are more exciting like a raid here and there, you have to do the grunt work that you normally leave for the noobie mods. Admins exist to do the big things. If the forum was tame, your job would be redundant.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> And yet I didn't break any rules.



i really thought it was subtle flamebaiting with your whole "Dear morons of the blender" or something like that 





> z0mg
> Noes my rep!


if that's all you have to say, wow, you suck... now gtfo out of this thread plz


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## Kira Yamato (Aug 16, 2007)

The fact the people care so much about reps and posts shows that this would be the way to punish those who break the rules. The people who are eligible for this type of punishment are people who look at bans as a revolving door system or a slight layover until their next ban. Some people look like they would be *more pissed* at getting their reps and posts halve than an actual *perm ban*. 

This is just an extra line of defense before a perm ban, because frankly some members no longer care about the rules. If people are pissed off about the punishment then something is working.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

well Kira i get why you're having this rule, but i don't think it should apply to esca and HI since they knew nothing of this rule, hell i didn't even know about it until like 2 min before i created this thread, great way to enforce stuff when no one knows about the harsher punishments


a warning beforehand would've prob resulted in him not writing *5* offtopic posts...


and honestly, 5 fucking posts, you'd have to ban and half the whole subforum... hell the whole forum.


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## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

Kamina said:


> I really need how to learn to do the sound thing.
> 
> *insert RO RO FIGHT DA POWAH!*
> 
> How boring. But you realize what your existance will be without big things to tackle like raids or other such things, moderating threads in the library or battledome against flaming. Terribly tedious. As a mod you have to make like you are actually doing something. And without things that are more exciting like a raid here and there, you have to do the grunt work that you normally leave for the noobie mods. Admins exist to do the big things. If the forum was tame, your job would be redundant.


Sounds good to me. Not as much work, meaning I can actually enjoy the forum more, posting at my lesiue.


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## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

Kamina said:


> I really need how to learn to do the sound thing.
> 
> *insert RO RO FIGHT DA POWAH!*
> 
> How boring. But you realize what your existance will be without big things to tackle like raids or other such things, moderating threads in the library or battledome against flaming. Terribly tedious. As a mod you have to make like you are actually doing something. And without things that are more exciting like a raid here and there, you have to do the grunt work that you normally leave for the noobie mods. Admins exist to do the big things. If the forum was tame, your job would be redundant.


I would love nothing more for my job, and all of the mod team's jobs to be redundant.


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

~Kira Yamato~ said:


> The fact the people care so much about reps and posts shows that this would be the way to punish those who break the rules. The people who are eligible for this type of punishment are people who look at bans as a revolving door system or a slight layover until their next ban. Some people look like they would be *more pissed* at getting their reps and posts halve than an actual *perm ban*.
> 
> This is just an extra line of defense before a perm ban, because frankly some members no longer care about the rules. If people are pissed off about the punishment then something is working.


That is a good point of hitting people in the pocket. But really the way it was implemented leaves a lot to be desired.

Now that I'm caught up, it really isn't fair Esca and Hollow to have been used as guinea pigs without knowing the consequences.

And secondly, from a work point stance, it would make more sense to let people argue their case first in the Courthouse then saying I BAN YOU AND CUT YOUR REP! and then find out someone is an innocent bystander and then having to trouble someone as lovely as Julie () to restore their reps and posts.


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## Mintaka (Aug 16, 2007)

Tokoyami said:


> Some people don't just do it for the lulz either and when angered won't stay banned for long.  Not to mention stay as only one person or if they do play nice.  What happens when you make the wrong person mad by doing something out of the blue like this?


Quoted as it's near the bottom of the page and thus may not have been seen.


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## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

you guys seem to avoid the real questions being asked the way I see it


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## Yellow (Aug 16, 2007)

Lol. I got my post count cut in half already. So it's my rep next time huh?


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> I would love nothing more for my job, and all of the mod team's jobs to be redundant.


Suuuuurrreeee...thats what all cops say. They'd all loooove to be able to sit on their ass eating doughnuts and watching the Price is Right. But you all enjoy the thrill of the b&. Even if TBH sometimes gets bored of having to look through all the shit threads you know he deep down inside loves when he can lock threads for great justice.


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## delirium (Aug 16, 2007)

Kamina said:


> Now that I'm caught up, it really isn't fair Esca and Hollow to have been used as guinea pigs without knowing the consequences.



They weren't the first \/\/



Yellow said:


> Lol. I got my post count cut in half already. So it's my rep next time huh?



Also.. Yellow wasn't the first, either. We've done it before.


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## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

TBH loves the lock 

its not a joke, well mostly it is, but he does do a good job with clearing all the shitty threads


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Delirium said:


> They weren't the first \/\/
> 
> 
> 
> Also.. Yellow wasn't the first, either. We've done it before.


 well still stupid that you haven't made any sort of announcation of this


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## Spiral Man (Aug 16, 2007)

i read the first page and based i what i've seen pek is a dick


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

Delirium said:


> They weren't the first \/\/
> 
> 
> 
> Also.. Yellow wasn't the first, either. We've done it before.




First time I've heard about it. Do you guys have a comprehensive rules and consequences thread? That would be good to have so we can know our rights and punishments. 

@Shiron: You really shouldn't be complaining about the workload. No one made you have to be a mod, they offered you the job and you accepted. If you didn't want the workload or to slack off, you never should have accepted the green name.


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## Kagakusha (Aug 16, 2007)

*stabs someone in the face*

*is arrested*

Judge: _You murderer! You are sentenced to life._

Me: _WHAT!? I thought I'd just get lethal injection. I didn't know life was even a possibility. Why wasn't I warned?!?!? I WOULDN'T HAVE STABBED HIM!_

Judge: _*motions palm on forehead picard style*_

See why I'm so torn by the issue? _It makes sense._ :/


----------



## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

Kamina said:


> First time I've heard about it. Do you guys have a comprehensive rules and consequences thread? That would be good to have so we can know our rights and punishments.


No, I don't believe so. Well, actually, I'm pretty sure that we do, but it hasn't been updated recently or anything, so it wouldn't be what I believe that you're looking for.



> @Shiron: You really shouldn't be complaining about the workload. No one made you have to be a mod, they offered you the job and you accepted. If you didn't want the workload or to slack off, you never should have accepted the green name.


Ah, you misunderstand. I accepted it because I don't mind the workload. However, having no work to do and just hanging out in the fanclubs is still better than having to move and lock countless threads. I don't mind doing that at all, but I would still rather hang out in the FCs, so I would perefer having no work.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Kaga said:


> *stabs someone in the face*
> 
> *is arrested*
> 
> ...



no kaga darling... that makes no sense


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## Vandal Savage (Aug 16, 2007)

I honestly see what the mods are doing with this and it is an effective way of prevention. I just feel like it should have been officially announced to the whole forum since it doesn't just apply to the Blenderites.

I can't defend Hollow or Esca's actions outside of the Blender but I do feel like they should have been warned about the new policy before their post count and rep were slashed in half.

They most likely won't pull something like this again now that they know what awaits them on top of a ban.


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## uncanny_sama (Aug 16, 2007)

this is fucking shit rule 

just few weeks ago i got banned for apperantly spoiling people in the tv section without even knowing i was spoiling them

all i said was that i hate uchihas and that they were fucking up the manga

when somebody asked my why i hate them so much

i told them to go read the manga if they wanted to know rather then telling them why

this was read and filed as spoiling by tbh
even though i say he missunderstood my intentions

but still i was banned without knowing i was doing anything wrong losing half my rep over that is bullshit

if these kind of rules are applied than its better to get the old system back

or you could just throw away the whole reputation thing cuz its only being missused

and pussy bitches keep whining about how others have more than they do

this really unfair if you ask me this not reasonable

if you do
 take away rep it should be a set amount

like when you get banned for over a week its like 5k - 10k

less than a week its 2k

stuff like that

also taking away post counts is really unfair
acutall posts take time and effort

posting in blender doesnt take postcounts so punishing on postcount doesnt really make sense


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## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

On the other half...I think blenderite so make the rules and shit..


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

Kaga said:


> *stabs someone in the face*
> 
> *is arrested*
> 
> ...


Actually a better example would be to use that not only is he arrested, he gets his house and monies taken. 

Lol picard. I have that pic. (And its called facepalm btw)


Shiron said:


> No, I don't believe so. At least not one that has been updated lately...
> 
> 
> Ah, you misunderstand. I accepted it because I don't mind the workload. However, having no work to do and just hanging out in the fanclubs is still better than having to move and lock countless threads. I don't mind doing that at all, but I would still rather hang out in the FCs, so I would perefer having no work.


Wouldn't we all love a utopia. But its a reality. There will always be n00bs. There will always be people doing things against the rules.

And that brings me to another point. What if someone in the age of firefox makes a thread in the wrong section because he confused the tab. I've done that like 3 times. And with this, if that person is banned and loses his rep for an accident, that hardly seems fair.

IMO, you should let people at least first argue their case before saying, okay, you been really bad so you lose your rep and posts.


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

Uncanny: Read the thread...

Simon: Fuck off.


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## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

Ok pek..I have an idea....


If this official.....then you should legalize REPWHORING!!!


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

So that the rule wouldn't have any affect? Yeah. How smart of you, not that it matters though. Blenderites rep whore all the time, I'd get down and clean their rep lists and give them rep bans if I only had the time to do so.

Yes, Freija. I remember the over 1 1/2 year old rep the one above you thread, though I don't remember how active it was or how lon git was allowed to stay. You also remember when I started rep banning people, especially Spamasuki / Agony active members?


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## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

uncanny_sama said:


> this is fucking shit rule
> 
> just few weeks ago i got banned for apperantly spoiling people in the tv section without even knowing i was spoiling them
> 
> ...





~Kira Yamato~ said:


> The fact the people care so much about reps and posts shows that this would be the way to punish those who break the rules. The people who are eligible for this type of punishment are people who look at bans as a revolving door system or a slight layover until their next ban. Some people look like they would be *more pissed* at getting their reps and posts halve than an actual *perm ban*.
> 
> This is just an extra line of defense before a perm ban, because frankly some members no longer care about the rules. If people are pissed off about the punishment then something is working.


**


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## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

I mean by not close threads that have rep whoring in them...


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

i still say they should get their reps back and this new rule should be warned in the announciations, that would rather get less people to do bannable offenses


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## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

How about this, don't do bannable stuff.


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## Mintaka (Aug 16, 2007)

There not the only repwhores alot of people do it.  Of course I'm sure you know this by now.  As for my other questions may I ask why you have ignored them?

@gooba:I understand where your coming from but you and I know that will never happen.  Personally I don't like how your acting towards people right now.  A warning makes sense since it will get your point across.  Doing it this way will only serve to anger people.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> How about this, don't do bannable stuff.



i haven't done bannable stuff since 5/24 and i ddin't have my rep slashed in half.


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## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

Freija said:


> i still say they should get their reps back and this new rule should be warned in the announciations, that would rather get less people to do bannable offenses





Makes senses frieja...It stupid how mods are judging the behaves of trolls and tagging it has "THE BLENDER"......


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## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

SENTINEL404 said:


> I mean by not close threads that have rep whoring in them...


And let the repwhoring continue? lol no. Moving such threads to a forum unaccessible by normal members would be the best bet in that case.

Unless you're talking about a FC or something where repwhoring suddenly started up in, in which case we'd warn them to knock it off or risk having the thread killed. If they knocked it off, then everything would be okay. If they continued, then we'd trash it, since they obviously didn't take the warning seriously (some repbans/rep-cuttings could also quite possibly be handled out in such a scenario as well because of how they disregarded the staff member's warning to knock off the repwhoring).


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

@Gooba: Shit happens.

From what I've heard of Dave or Esca or one of them, there is discrimination against Blenderites and as many black people will attest, you could easily be in the wrong place at the wrong time and to just go and take away that because they are a Blenderite or have had done shit in the past (lol Havoc) is just discriminatory.


----------



## Iria (Aug 16, 2007)

Not all blender rep is through rep whoring but I suppose that is a whole other discussion >__>

The problem I have with this "advanced punishment" system is that it seems arbitrary.

Who decides the amount of bannings that a member has been sentenced to before they get rep/post/seniorship revoked, and will that number be the same for all members of the forum?

Is it any wonder why blenderites always feel they are being made "examples of"?


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

Weird that neither of them didn't really plead their cases even though the rep slash came 11-12 hours later.



> Who decides the amount of bannings that a member has been sentenced to before they get rep/post/seniorship revoked, and will that number be the same for all members of the forum?


It is decided in the mod section and it should have all or almost all mods agreeing, to go through. We mods/smods can't do it, only admins can....



> Is it any wonder why blenderites always feel they are being made "examples of"?


"Is it any wonder why we need to make examples of the blenderites when they break rules just for the "fun" of it?"


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## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

Shiron said:


> And let the repwhoring continue? lol no. Moving such threads to a forum unaccessible by normal members would be the best bet in that case.
> 
> Unless you're talking about a FC or something where repwhoring suddenly started up in, in which case we'd warn them to knock it off or risk having the thread killed. If they knocked it off, then everything would be okay. If they continued, then we'd trash it, since they obviously didn't take the warning seriously (some repbans/rep-cuttings could also quite possibly be handled out in such a scenario as well because of how they disregarded the staff member's warning to knock off the repwhoring).



Ok makes senses...

How about the BLENDER community will pick a fellow member to obverse their behave... I know there is mods in blender but this will make people feel more relax in atmosphere...Leading to less mod and blenderite activity like this thread.


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

Sentinel get out and shut up. You aren't helping.

Iria, post more. you are.

Blenderites are convienient examples 



> Weird that neither of them didn't really plead their cases even though the rep slash came 11-12 hours later.


Becuase they didn't know there was an imperative. They probably figured, eh fine, another ban for a little while. Not much point arguing it.


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

pek the villain said:


> Weird that neither of them didn't really plead their cases even though the rep slash came 11-12 hours later.



Coming from one who knows, i didn't plead my case at all at first, because... i had no idea what to write because i suck at those stuff, so i thought it'd be better if i just shut my trap


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## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

Freija said:


> Coming from one who knows, i didn't plead my case at all at first, because... i had no idea what to write because i suck at those stuff, so i thought it'd be better if i just shut my trap



You see my idea will work like in freija's case.


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

Senintentel; Please...leave. Your debating skills is just too much for us mods to handle...you'll probably become a new "LotU" with that ability. Take care and use it wisely in Blender.

OnTopic: They broke the rules. We mods got pissed off seeing how it's the same people who's been released just a short time ago; Discussion starts..."How to prevent them from doing it again" "hit them were it hurts" "In the Blender/internet balls" - "Let's wait 12 hour so most active mods have had a say in this" - THEN SLASH , POST AND REP PILE.


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## Mintaka (Aug 16, 2007)

Picking on one group of people isn't always the best of choices you know.  They may cause trouble but making examples of them won't always incite a positive reaction you know.  From what I'm seeing your pissing them off.  I'm sure there are other examples as you put it to be made.  Why not try them as well and not cause anymore problems between you and the blender?


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## Yellow (Aug 16, 2007)

~Kira Yamato~ said:


> Some people look like they would be *more pissed* at getting their reps and posts halve than an actual *perm ban*.


Lol. That's so fucking me right there. TBH can attest to that.XD

Also if that Esca and Hollow guy get back their reps/post count or whatever I want my posts back too because I didn't know about this rule and probably wouldn't have spammed if I knew about it.

Also this tempts me to get banned again just to see my post count/rep cut in half.


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## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

WE need a voice...and the mod team needs better eyes..


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

pek the villain said:


> Senintentel; Please...leave. Your debating skills is just too much for us mods to handle...you'll probably become a new "LotU" with that ability. Take care and use it wisely in Blender.
> 
> OnTopic: They broke the rules. We mods got pissed off seeing how it's the same people who's been released just a short time ago; Discussion starts..."How to prevent them from doing it again" "hit them were it hurts" "In the Blender/internet balls" - "Let's wait 12 hour so most active mods have had a say in this" - THEN SLASH , POST AND REP PILE.



but pek, make it the standard punishment for the blenderites then, just don't take it out on them without a warning, just give em back their rep to them now if they do it again, they can't possibly say it wasn't fair at all.


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## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

SENTINEL404 said:


> Makes senses frieja...It stupid how mods are judging the behaves of trolls and tagging it has "THE BLENDER"......


We never did...



Iria said:


> Not all blender rep is through rep whoring but I suppose that is a whole other discussion >__>
> 
> The problem I have with this "advanced punishment" system is that it seems arbitrary.
> 
> Who decides the amount of bannings that a member has been sentenced to before they get rep/post/seniorship revoked, and will that number be the same for all members of the forum?


We decide, that is kinda part of the job.  As a collective team we are the judge, jury, and executioners on this forum.  We convicted them as the jury, judged the punishment to actually mean something to them, then I executed it.  What will decide when we use the rep/post cut is when we think banning isn't going to do anything to discourage repeat behavior.



> Is it any wonder why blenderites always feel they are being made "examples of"?


It isn't a wonder.  When blenderites are the only ones behaving like this they will be the only ones punished like this.


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## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

Tokoyami: I don't think you should jump into this seeing how little about the situation you know. You've most likely formed an opinion about us mods and how evil we are in your head and that we are there just to destroy you.

Topic have been answered already, was done by Geg in first page.



Geg said:


> It applies to the whole board.
> 
> It's just only done to people who know they'll get banned for doing it and are *doing it anyway for the lulz*, a*nd more often than not that's going to be a blenderite.*


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## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

Setinel, seriously gtfo. This is kinda a serious buisness thread, don't say anything unless it adds to the argument please >_>


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## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> It isn't a wonder.  When blenderites are the only ones behaving like this they will be the only ones punished like this.


...... gooba you cant honestly mean that..... if you do... just wow... just wow


----------



## uncanny_sama (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> How about this, don't do bannable stuff.



please contribute like the other mods or shut up gooba your only putting oil in the fire with your wisecracks



anyway

what im saying is that this new rule has flaws
its possible to get banned without knowing your were wrong

like i said i was banned for spoiling in the tv section without even knowing that what i did was considered spoiling
even though i personally dont think it was, a mod can asume it is spoiling
is it fair to lose half of your hard work over that

and now you can say stuff like 
"than you shouldnt have posted spoilers"

than i reply
i fucking didnt know i was posting a spoiler as i was trying to be as vague as possible and not saying a thing but it was a mods opinion that said i was spoiling.
if i think im not doing anything wrong but a mods opinons says it is (even though maybe it really isnt) is it fair to lose over half of your rep over it
cus even though you get banned you wont get it back regardless if the mod was wrong

cus you guys will never admit that you were wrong in a banning you always stick up for eachother and always find an excuse to keep the person banned
the only one i ever had an actual usefull discussion with was tbh and pek

this rule is not fair
simply becouse its possible to get banned like i did without even knowing you were ever wrong, losing all your hard work over that is not fair


i say that if you want to punish people using rep you take away SET AMOUNTS of rep

like 1 week = 50k

longer =100k

stuff like that losing half over possibly breaking a rule without knowing it is just not fair

especially when its a known fact that mods use their rep for custom settings
and modfucks and it seems to be that blender is always associated with repwhoring as if its the only place its happening

let me tell you one fact

"BLENDER IS THE ONLY PUBLICLY KNOWN PLACE WHER REPWHORING USED TO BE"

take a look in the fcs. tv section library for real repabuse, pos reps for uchihatards

negs for everyone who dares say that uchiha is shit there is your repabuse





what im saying this rule needs to be worked out better cuz this is just bullshit
its like 
when ur drinking a beer on the public street and then you get arrested and sentenced to jail for 10 years rather than just paying a fine like youre used to do in the first place


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## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

Neji said:


> Setinel, seriously gtfo. This is kinda a serious buisness thread, don't say anything unless it adds to the argument please >_>



says the guy that made the troll dict. 




Pek.. I have read your early posts... I see your point.


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## geG (Aug 16, 2007)

While I'm not arguing against the rule, I do think using it on esca/dave/sao/akuma/blaze is a little much. They made, what, one or two threads that each of them probably only had 3 or 4 posts in each, right? That's usually not much to warrant any kind of ban. Unless there were more threads than just the one I saw in the landfill.


----------



## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

You guys seem to be putting so much effort in trying to punish the Blender. Why don't you guys handle the real shithole, like the Library. Constant rep abuse, spam threads, flaming and more go on in the library and nothing gets done. I've stopped posting at the library completely because of this. So why don't you guys stop worrying about a section that is MADE FOR SPAM, and handle a section that is suppose to be about discussion of serious topics like its suppose to. imo I see more mods in the Blender, than in the actual serious posting sections of NF



> says the guy that made the troll dict.


 
wtf does that have to do with anything?


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

pek the villain said:


> *Senintentel; Please...leave. Your debating skills is just too much for us mods to handle...you'll probably become a new "LotU" with that ability. Take care and use it wisely in Blender.*


qft. But we don't want em.


> OnTopic: They broke the rules. We mods got pissed off seeing how it's the same people who's been released just a short time ago; Discussion starts..."How to prevent them from doing it again" "hit them were it hurts" "In the Blender/internet balls" - "Let's wait 12 hour so most active mods have had a say in this" - THEN SLASH , POST AND REP PILE.


But really, I understand you people desire your privacy and shit like that but you'd think you would have the decency to tell us about it if it effects us before silently experimenting on a few.


forkshy said:


> why do you think rep is an immutable and inalienable right?


REP IS OUR MONIES! AND GOVERNMENT HAS NO RIGHTS TO TOUCH OUR MONIES UNLESS YOU USE IT TO GIVE POOR PEOPLE REP HEALTH INSURANCE BUT TO TOSS IT DOWN THE TOILETS IS


----------



## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

Geg said:


> While I'm not arguing against the rule, I do think using it on esca/dave/sao/akuma/blaze is a little much. They made, what, one or two threads that each of them probably only had 3 or 4 posts in each, right? That's usually not much to warrant any kind of ban. Unless there were more threads than just the one I saw in the landfill.


It was more of their prior ban history there and how they didn't care about their bans that inspired the much more harsh punishment than normal. It wasn't their first time bieng banned or anything, and it shouldn't be treated as such, like you're proposing here. Offenses accumulate and stack up; they don't go away and aren't forgotten.

@uncanny_sama: Bad move. Won't work. The amount of rep deducted off of them should be based on each person's own rep amount and how much of a rephworse/how much they care about their rep. A set amount of rep deducted from any one person for any one offense will affect different people differently (it could take a huge chunk off of one person's rep, but barely leave a dent in the rep of another). Thus, it's something that should be decided on a case by case basis and not being decided by set amounts.


----------



## Crowe (Aug 16, 2007)

forkshy said:


> i feel like there's a basic misunderstanding of the concept of 'reputation.'
> rep is graphic representation of your social status.
> getting banned should have a negative effect on your social status.
> 
> ...



end of thread.


----------



## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

... the rep has never been used like that... ever.


----------



## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

> .


 
Can you seriously gtfo, i'm trying to be serious on this matter, yeah sure i'm a Blenderite, but I know the difference between the Blender and other sections >_>


----------



## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

> Dave säger:
> im getting more of a punishment from 5 posts then raiding NF full force
> Dave säger:
> oh jesus
> Peter // säger:




i really have to say... thats frikkin true


----------



## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

Freija said:


> i really have to say... thats frikkin true


Yet again... it was because of his ban history and how it became apparent that he didn't even care about bans. The only reason it seems more severe to him is because the rest of the time we were using ineffective punishments on him. Now, he actually got a punishment that is actually doing it's job for once, and he's actually feeling the hurt.

All that really shows is that it worked; nothing more.


----------



## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

he didn't care about being banned, yet cared so much about coming back from a perm?


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## uncanny_sama (Aug 16, 2007)

Neji said:


> You guys seem to be putting so much effort in trying to punish the Blender. Why don't you guys handle the real shithole, like the Library. Constant rep abuse, spam threads, flaming and more go on in the library and nothing gets done. I've stopped posting at the library completely because of this. So why don't you guys stop worrying about a section that is MADE FOR SPAM, and handle a section that is suppose to be about discussion of serious topics like its suppose to. imo I see more mods in the Blender, than in the actual serious posting sections of NF



quoted for fucking truth

i feel like mods are only vistiting blender for the joy of maybe banning somebody today

but places like library i dont see any mod action ever

people get negged to shit out there for simply saying that sasuke isnt their favorite character
or that they dont believe that itachi could kill the entire clan

i swear in the library ive only gotten annonymous neg rep
NEVER do i get repped  in library with a name

im also sick of all blenderites being punished for shit only maybe 3 or 4 member  are actually doing

and then you punish us all saying we encouraged them
but thats so not true
ever since the raids and 5/24 and the deletion of blender
we have been cool and abiding by the rules


we havent done anything out of the ordinary

and if people got banned they did that on their own

we did good ever since blender got deleted
and dont act like we didnt cuz we did

also i think you guys need to consider your modfucks and shit 
cus this shit isnt as funny as you think

and if you guys do everything together like you say you do than i do think you need to listen to members when they say somebody is abusing powers
like vash did


----------



## Genesis (Aug 16, 2007)

So far it's like this - 

Mods - Repeated offence and their attitude is not towards our liking since it is apparent to us that they don't take banning seriously. Hence, rep and post cut and we think it is a suitable deterrent by the way everyone is reacting. In HI's case, he came back from a perm so that would be one of the reasons for the punishment.

Defenders - It is unfair to make an example out of them because they weren't warned previously and had no idea of such a thing. If they knew then they wouldn't have attempted such a thing. Also, how do you realisitically assess something like this since i might get banned for something without my intentions being on that particular path.

In light of that, i think the point would remain in the fact why they were doing it in the first place regardless of what they perceived the punishment to be. It turned out to be something that matters which is why it's now a problem.

I personally do think the rep/post cut is harsh because their rep is really that high but when it comes down to it, on priniciple; you can't do shit against it if you see where the mods are coming from on this.


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

forkshy said:


> i feel like there's a basic misunderstanding of the concept of 'reputation.'
> rep is graphic representation of your social status.
> getting banned should have a negative effect on your social status.
> 
> ...


I think I should quote Zaru's old sig. You are not your rep, you are not your post count. You are not your avy. You are not your sig.

Rep is not your social status. If it was, then you wouldn't have adjusted the rep power because thats putting a permanent impediment on those who are new.

Rep is money. It is not social status. Rep buys you favors (sexual ). Rep says I hate you in a way that is private. It has nothing to do with soical status. People don't respect others for their rep as people don't respect people because of their money. Its just a tangible way of saying thanks and saying you suck.


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## Mintaka (Aug 16, 2007)

WHAT!?  Hahah...No no no you have me all wrong.  The mods and admins have there jobs to do whether I like it or not.  The admins tend to be mor rational and fair while the mods are usually somewhat corrupt save for a few who actaully do there jobs reasonably well.  I'm pretty sure I know the gist about this situation as being a part of LUE2 I've seen these things happen over and over on many a site (some we invaded) and seen whats happened in the blender before quite a few times.  They cause problems  break the rules ect you ban them.  They come back and do it again. You ban them again.  They raid the site for lulz.  You ban them.  They think there better than you are because ur teh ebil staffz.  They come back and keep doing the same shit over and over.  You ban them over and over finally perming them.  Occasionally the perm doesn't work and one may come back again. ECT ECT.  Then they complain about it to each other over Im's causing even more trouble and a thread like this is made.  Alot might get banned at one time like that 5/24 thing and it will be used as a meme/attack date.

Am I wrong?

What I'm saying is this.  Announcing what will happen has much more of an affect as they can't complain about it and know its coming.  Just doing it won't get them to stop it'll just piss them off/cause you more trouble.


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## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

Freija said:


> ...... gooba you cant honestly mean that..... if you do... just wow... just wow


The only people who do things like this that they know are bannable because they don't care at all about being banned since they just see it as lulz have been blenderites.  We didn't ban them like this as blenderites, we banned them as regular users who just happen to go use the Blender.  If someone from the OB does this they will recieve the exact same punishment.



uncanny_sama said:


> please contribute like the other mods or shut up gooba your only putting oil in the fire with your wisecracks


It isn't a wisecrack, it is my serious opinion.  Arguing to reduce the punishment for bannable behavior is only really motivated because you/your friends plan on doing bannable stuff on purpose in the future.  These things won't happen to regular bans where it is a slip up, these happen when you do something specifically to get banned.  So it is very much a conscious choice to get banned, and I am telling you not to make that choice.



> what im saying is that this new rule has flaws
> its possible to get banned without knowing your were wrong


Not for this punishment.



> like i said i was banned for spoiling in the tv section without even knowing that what i did was considered spoiling
> even though i personally dont think it was, a mod can asume it is spoiling
> is it fair to lose half of your hard work over that
> 
> ...


You wouldn't get rep/post cut for accidents like that.


> if i think im not doing anything wrong but a mods opinons says it is (even though maybe it really isnt) is it fair to lose over half of your rep over it
> cus even though you get banned you wont get it back regardless if the mod was wrong
> 
> cus you guys will never admit that you were wrong in a banning you always stick up for eachother and always find an excuse to keep the person banned
> the only one i ever had an actual usefull discussion with was tbh and pek


That isn't true at all, and just shows how ignorant you are to what has happened with the hundreds of bans we have done since this place started.



> this rule is not fair
> simply becouse its possible to get banned like i did without even knowing you were ever wrong, losing all your hard work over that is not fair


All punishments have a chance to happen to innocent people, does that mean we should never put anyone in jail, or ever ban anyone just because it might be a mistake?


> what im saying this rule needs to be worked out better cuz this is just bullshit
> its like
> when ur drinking a beer on the public street and then you get arrested and sentenced to jail for 10 years rather than just paying a fine like youre used to do in the first place


That is nothing like this.



Neji said:


> You guys seem to be putting so much effort in trying to punish the Blender. Why don't you guys handle the real shithole, like the Library. Constant rep abuse, spam threads, flaming and more go on in the library and nothing gets done. I've stopped posting at the library completely because of this. So why don't you guys stop worrying about a section that is MADE FOR SPAM, and handle a section that is suppose to be about discussion of serious topics like its suppose to. imo I see more mods in the Blender, than in the actual serious posting sections of NF


Um, this isn't about the Blender.  We banned 5 people from the Blender who spammed in the HoU.



Freija said:


> i really have to say... thats frikkin true


That is what happens when you have previous offenses, you get harsher treatment in the future.  Also, this isn't harsher than the initial punihsment since that was a perm ban.


----------



## Yellow (Aug 16, 2007)

forkshy said:


> i feel like there's a basic misunderstanding of the concept of 'reputation.'
> rep is graphic representation of your social status.
> getting banned should have a negative effect on your social status.
> 
> ...


So you agree with this then forkshy? Well I respect you more than the other Mods,{Except Del of course O=) so if you agree with this punishment then I'm gonna have to say I agree as well.

But it seems like your saying post count is not a graphical representation of your social status and therefore it shouldn't be cut right?;D

But seriously though some of the Mods do seem to single out the blender a lot. I noticed a lot of banable  offenses slipping by in the house and library such as flaming and spamming and all they ever do is delete the threads. No one is ever punished. I've seen the same people warned over and over in the house and library and yet they've never gotten a severe punishment yet it seems the Mods ban blenderites/certain members for the least little things.:/


----------



## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> The only people who do things like this that they know are bannable because they don't care at all about being banned since they just see it as lulz have been blenderites.  We didn't ban them like this as blenderites, we banned them as regular users who just happen to go use the Blender.  If someone from the OB does this they will recieve the exact same punishment.


OH YEAH WHEN OB SPAM ATTACKED THE BLENDER I DIDNT SEE ANYTHING HAPPEND THEY EVEN HAD A THREAD WHERE THEY REPPED EACHOTHER IF THEY RECEIVED NEGREPS FROM BLENDERITES FOR FLAMING US, AND IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY YOUR RESPONSES WERE TO LOOK AWAY! so don't come with your fair crap, cause that was the most fuckin biased shit i've seen on my entire time on the forum.





> That is what happens when you have previous offenses, you get harsher treatment in the future.  Also, this isn't harsher than the initial punihsment since that was a perm ban.



still think they should've been warned prehandedly


----------



## geG (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> It isn't a wisecrack, it is my serious opinion.  Arguing to reduce the punishment for bannable behavior is only really motivated because you/your friends plan on doing bannable stuff on purpose in the future.  These things won't happen to regular bans where it is a slip up, these happen when you do something specifically to get banned.  So it is very much a conscious choice to get banned, and I am telling you not to make that choice.



I doubt esca and the others expected to get banned though. Like I said making 1 off-topic thread generally isn't enough to warrant a ban.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

But really, you wonder why we care about that stuff and do believe you have no right to touch is it is it is the one thing on this forum we can control. Because about 1% of the forum population (probably less, I don't feel like doing the math) has all the power, what do us have in terms of power? Only thing we can do, rep. We can't delete posts, lock threads, or ban those we don't like, we can't promote those who do, we can only give rep. And lets be honest, the idea that you guys who apparently have it out for the Blender (why? Because we care, because we are organized, not like the masses that just randomly go here and there) will try and take what little power we have if we slip up just once, it disturbs us greatly. Thats why we give a shit when you abuse one of us.


----------



## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

Freija said:


> OH YEAH WHEN OB SPAM ATTACKED THE BLENDER I DIDNT SEE ANYTHING HAPPEND THEY EVEN HAD A THREAD WHERE THEY REPPED EACHOTHER IF THEY RECEIVED NEGREPS FROM BLENDERITES FOR FLAMING US, AND IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY YOUR RESPONSES WERE TO LOOK AWAY! so don't come with your fair crap, cause that was the most fuckin biased shit i've seen on my entire time on the forum.
> 
> still think they should've been warned prehandedly


 

oh god, that was pure pwnage


----------



## Mintaka (Aug 16, 2007)

Apparently there pretty damn serious this time.  Still not telling anyone about it and just doing it really isn't right.  If they had known this was going to happen to there rep and posts which they value I highly doubt they wouldn't think twice before doing whatever the hell they did.


@freija take screenshots when this happens next time then you'll have evidence against him if you see him being biased again.


----------



## uncanny_sama (Aug 16, 2007)

still making up a new rule after you punish people is pretty lame

they shouldve been notified beforehand

when you get sentenced to jail its common sense to notify the person in question about what is going to happen to them

they didnt know shit

also i dont really see the reason for the rep and post cuts

i thougth punishment was dertement on the time you spend in bannishment


----------



## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

> OH YEAH WHEN OB SPAM ATTACKED THE BLENDER I DIDNT SEE ANYTHING HAPPEND THEY EVEN HAD A THREAD WHERE THEY REPPED EACHOTHER IF THEY RECEIVED NEGREPS FROM BLENDERITES FOR FLAMING US, AND IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY YOUR RESPONSES WERE TO LOOK AWAY! so don't come with your fair crap, cause that was the most fuckin biased shit i've seen on my entire time on the forum.


They didn't actually break any rules.  They spammed the spam section.  Also, we said if they ever did it again they would be getting long bans.


----------



## Havoc (Aug 16, 2007)

So will I get halved for anything I get banned for?


----------



## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> They didn't actually break any rules.  They spammed the spam section.  Also, we said if they ever did it again they would be getting long bans.



ok the rules they broke


repwhoring
flooding
flamebaiting
flaming
going over the thread limit



so stop fucking lying.



and when B made one or 2 threads back she got a week ban, WTF? and you staff were like viewing the whole situation


----------



## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

uncanny_sama said:


> still making up a new rule after you punish people is pretty lame
> 
> they shouldve been notified beforehand
> 
> ...


It's not anything new:
Great Teacher Onizuka FC


----------



## uncanny_sama (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> They didn't actually break any rules.  They spammed the spam section.  Also, we said if they ever did it again they would be getting long bans.



we spam our own spam section,we get banned
they do it and they get warned 

what the shit??


----------



## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

They didn't get warned.





Gooba said:


> They didn't actually break any rules.  They spammed the spam section.  Also, we said if they ever did it again they would be getting long bans.



ok the rules they broke


repwhoring
flooding
flamebaiting
flaming
going over the thread limit



so stop fucking lying.



and when B made one or 2 threads back she got a week ban, WTF? and you staff were like viewing the whole situation


----------



## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

Havoc said:


> So will I get halved for anything I get banned for?


Depends on what you do.


----------



## uncanny_sama (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> Depends on what you do.



translation:

anything that will get you banned


----------



## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

uncanny_sama said:


> translation:
> 
> anything that will get you banned


Translation correction:
No. It's just as Gooba said.


----------



## Havoc (Aug 16, 2007)

Shiron said:


> Translation correction:
> No. It's just as Gooba said.



Translation:

Havoc, I want you.


----------



## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

translation: anything a known blenderite gets banned for


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

Havoc gets banned for being black. If you do that to him, you more then racist, you wanna keep him down


----------



## Pein (Aug 16, 2007)

Freija said:


> They didn't get warned.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


wow they didn't even respond


----------



## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

Freija said:


> translation: anything a known blenderite gets banned for


Correction: It depends on what that known blenderite did, as Gooba said.


----------



## Havoc (Aug 16, 2007)

Kamina said:


> Havoc gets banned for being black. If you do that to him, you more then racist, you wanna keep him down



Also the reason I have yet to be modded.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

uncanny_sama said:


> translation:
> 
> anything that will get you banned


Yes, exactly, all I do all day is sit around thinking up ways to ban people in the Blender.


----------



## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Pein said:


> wow they didn't even respond



they can't considering the entire subforum saw it, including the OBers when they bragged about it in blender with a huge thread explaining how they planned it and executed it


----------



## Kira Yamato (Aug 16, 2007)

Kamina said:


> Havoc gets banned for being black. If you do that to him, you more then racist, you wanna keep him down



I was the last person to ban Havoc so I guess it would be Black on Black crime  

And while I never recommended posts and rep being halved in the past I have agreed with a few of them (especially one particular member for being a known spammer and rep whore) and no it wasn't a blenderite


----------



## Shiron (Aug 16, 2007)

Pein said:


> wow they didn't even respond


Or one of us could be busy typing out a response for that, or got distracted and forgot to respond to it, or had something else we had to do before we could respond to it. Because that certainly isn't possible...

Anyway, I personally was inactive durring the time when that happened, I believe, so I can't really respond to that personallly (which is another thing: not alll mods can respond to all questons; you have to wait until a staff member who is actually capable of answering that question and who has the time to do so comes along; not any staff member will do).


----------



## Havoc (Aug 16, 2007)

Why can't we repwhore if we do it in a funny, clever way?



Kira you uncle tom


----------



## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

> They didn't get warned.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, they did get warned, and they have mentioned raids a few times since then and they got re-warned.  The repwhoring wasn't quite repwhoring, and they didnt really flood, just a lot of people made a lot of threads which is ok.  A couple might have gone over the limit but that happens all the time and not every case gets a ban.



> and when B made one or 2 threads back she got a week ban, WTF? and you staff were like viewing the whole situation


She did more, and spammed a whole bunch of other threads.  Spamming at all in those is bannable.


----------



## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

They can't respond since they're wrong though.



> Why can't we repwhore if we do it in a funny, clever way?
> 
> 
> 
> Kira you uncle tom


 
Havoc, stop. They'll probably ban you and h4x your rep for that post


----------



## Havoc (Aug 16, 2007)

Weren't the main ppl who raided the blender, blenderites?


And by main ppl, I mean me.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> Yes, exactly, all I do all day is sit around thinking up ways to ban people in the Blender.


Well, that and other things.

Gooba's schedule (official)

8AM - 10AM : Read the newest Wolverine and every other related X-men comic that came out in the past month (for 5th time)
10-12 AM: Read classic X-men
12-12:05 PM: Drink Mountain Dew
12:05-6PM: Plot the demise of the blenderites.
6-7PM: Share plans for demise of the blenderites with the rest of the staff who heartilly agree with shotting their cum into the air. No wait thats just Kaga and Hef 
7-7:05 PM: Drink another Dew
7:05-9PM: Put plan into action
9-12PM: Argue with blenderites over nefarious deeds.
12-8 AM: Have wet dreams of Jean Grey


----------



## geG (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> She did more, and spammed a whole bunch of other threads.  Spamming at all in those is bannable.



In the Blender?


----------



## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Gooba said:


> Yes, they did get warned, and they have mentioned raids a few times since then and they got re-warned.


fine i was wrong there, but had it been a blenderite he'd been insta banned T





> he repwhoring wasn't quite repwhoring,


really? id's thread was pretty much "if you need rep come here" and that's repwhoring as far as i've gotten banned for it... 





> and they didnt really flood, just a lot of people made a lot of threads which is ok.  A couple might have gone over the limit but that happens all the time and not every case gets a ban.


each person who attacked made approx 6 threads so don't say some of them...


> She did more, and spammed a whole bunch of other threads.  Spamming at all in those is bannable.



yeah but obviously it's ok to raid the blender


----------



## Gooba (Aug 16, 2007)

In the Bdome.


----------



## SENTINEL (Aug 16, 2007)

Kamina said:


> Well, that and other things.
> 
> Gooba's schedule (official)
> 
> ...



Your neg just turned  pos...


----------



## Freija (Aug 16, 2007)

Hey guys lets raid the blender we'll only get a warning for those offenses i mentioned above!!!!!!!!!!! and later on we get a rewarning


----------



## Neji (Aug 16, 2007)

warned for mentioning raids when the Blender was told next time they plan a raid they get a minimal 1 month ban?


----------



## Kira Yamato (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> Hey guys lets raid the blender we'll only get a warning for those offenses i mentioned above!!!!!!!!!!! and later on we get a rewarning



Hopefully all you're all first time offenders  


Plus, you forgot one key factor...the rules while there are open to our discretion. 

We're not running a cookie cutter factory so people can guess how much of punishment they will get for committing "x" crime. 
Show me a person who was banned and received halved reps, posts, ect...on their very first attempt. Most of the people on the chopping block should be in line for perms...once you reach that status, rep and posts bans shouldn't be something you should warned in advance.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

wanna join us kira, we'll spam and flame, and we'll repwhore, and we'll just get a warning 



oh and Kira, the winner is... DEVIL AKUMA it was his first ban


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Kira has bathhouse material ava 


hentai


----------



## Yellow (Aug 17, 2007)

~Kira Yamato~ said:


> I was the last person to ban Havoc so I guess it would be Black on Black crime
> 
> And while I never recommended posts and rep being halved in the past I have agreed with a few of them (especially one particular member for being a known spammer and rep whore) and no it wasn't a blenderite



Lol. Your black Kira? Which other staff members are black or is it just you?


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

lol... i don't really care about that since i won't be getting myself banned again(atleast on purpose), but i think its fucking unfair to esca and hollow...


----------



## Neji (Aug 17, 2007)

lol gokuden seriously deserved that. He was the worse, post/repwhore ever


Kisame was a master. Others too but i'm not mentioning because they'll get b& lol


----------



## Iria (Aug 17, 2007)

Kamina said:


> But really, you wonder why we care about that stuff and do believe you have no right to touch is it is it is the one thing on this forum we can control. Because about 1% of the forum population (probably less, I don't feel like doing the math) has all the power, what do us have in terms of power? Only thing we can do, rep. We can't delete posts, lock threads, or ban those we don't like, we can't promote those who do, we can only give rep. And lets be honest, the idea that you guys who apparently have it out for the Blender (why? Because we care, because we are organized, not like the masses that just randomly go here and there) will try and take what little power we have if we slip up just once, it disturbs us greatly. Thats why we give a shit when you abuse one of us.



Sunny speaks the truth.

People wonder why reputation is such a big deal...but it is really the only completely autonomous means a forum goer has to demonstrate their approval for another. It is not given to us by mods as an entity (though you may be repped individually by one), but it is our peers that give us that gift. What makes it ok for that which was given to us by our peers to be taken away by someone else?

Likewise post count is a reflection of activity and participation on the forum. Each member spends time and thought and energy with each post, only for it to be potentially taken away as a punishment.

If the intent was to make the members fearful of restricted rights, and the loss of that which was gained on their own accord, then congratulations, it worked.


----------



## Yellow (Aug 17, 2007)

forkshy said:


> seriously, freija, don't worry about it, if you get yourself banned and your rep gets cut in half i'll fix things so you end up with twice as much at the end of the day. ^_^



Bastard. I want twice my rep at the end of today. I hate you now Forsky and Kira answer my question.



Iria said:


> Likewise post count is a reflection of activity and participation on the forum. Each member spends time and thought and energy with each post, only for it to be potentially taken away as a punishment.


I tried telling TBH that but he wouldn't listen.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

yes, im a real knight


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Would you double my rep if I got banned forkshy?


----------



## Neji (Aug 17, 2007)

lol I should've made this thread back when I was thinking about it. All I did was debate to pek about it in the Blender though. Seriously though, only a small handful of Blenderites are supporting us, I expected there to be more but w/e 


lol guy's its a trap, whoever asks for rep from forkshy is gonna be b& and rep h4xed, don't do it


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Blenderites are cowards


----------



## Yellow (Aug 17, 2007)

Neji said:


> lol I should've made this thread back when I was thinking about it. All I did was debate to pek about it in the Blender though. Seriously though, only a small handful of Blenderites are supporting us, I expected there to be more but w/e
> 
> 
> lol guy's its a trap, whoever asks for rep from forkshy is gonna be b& and rep h4xed, don't do it



All your blenderites seem to be scared.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

no they're just a bunch of ^ (not the meaning of the word "respect".)


----------



## Neji (Aug 17, 2007)

I'm not scared, i'm a true Blender soldier. I've been through the first and 2nd 5/24. Taken part in raides before they were illegal, adept in the art of spam. I can't say that about anyone else who is not in this thread or b& right now. Maybe a few


@forkshy- stop lying you just want to see our rep removed


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

bah, let's not get offtopic, get escas and HI's rep and postcount back ffs, its so fucking unfair to do that to them


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

I'm most well behaved blenderite, I've only been banned once and it was just a misunderstanding.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 17, 2007)

forkshy said:


> you're going through all this for someone els?, how noble. ^_^


I hope you'd do the same if you were in our shoes 


Anyway, this thread seems to be coming to a close and I'm sure by me saying it I'm accelerating it a bit but anyway, in b4 loq


----------



## Yellow (Aug 17, 2007)

forkshy said:


> i will double the rep of anyone who gets themselves banned, yes.


I'll get myself banned for you forkshy. 


Freija said:


> bah, let's not get offtopic, get escas and HI's rep and postcount back ffs, its so fucking unfair to do that to them


Yeah I think they should get back their rep and post count because that rule wasn't made clear before.



			
				forkshy said:
			
		

> no, i just want to see gullible idiots get what they deserve.


That hurt bad man. That one hit deep.


----------



## Iria (Aug 17, 2007)

Has the issue been resolved 


Or is it: mod judgment stands, thanks for playing, have this lovely consolation prize of...stfu


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

im not giving in they need their fucking rep and postcount back, this is so fucking fucked up its not true


----------



## delirium (Aug 17, 2007)

Iria said:


> Has the issue been resolved
> 
> 
> Or is it: mod judgment stands, thanks for playing, have this lovely consolation prize of...stfu



Iria.. I love you, hun.


----------



## DragonHeart52 (Aug 17, 2007)

Kamina said:


> Well, that and other things.
> 
> Gooba's schedule (official)
> 
> ...


----------



## Yellow (Aug 17, 2007)

Delirium said:


> Iria.. I love you, hun.



Fuck you Del. You don't love me do you? Now I"ve lost both you and forkshy. My two favorite staff members. Whyyyyyyyy??


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

if you don't care about the reps as all you staff say, then why won't you give it back to them?


----------



## Kagakusha (Aug 17, 2007)

DH is here. Everyone get the fuck out. :>


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

im honestly more scared of you kaga, you permed me 



anyway give them their rep back, seriously've 10 pages now, just give in staff


----------



## Shiron (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> if you don't care about the reps as all you staff say, then why won't you give it back to them?


Because they apparently do, which makes it a great punishment for them. We're going in circles here...


----------



## SENTINEL (Aug 17, 2007)

Delirium said:


> Iria.. I love you, hun.



SHE HATES MODS   !!


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Shiron said:


> Because they apparently do, which makes it a great punishment for them.



Cheh, then why not make it a known rule instead ?


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 17, 2007)

forkshy said:


> again, freija, i just don't see how rep levels and post counts are inalienable or immutable rights.


Ummmm...because we work for em....

I mean sure if there's excessive rep whoring and post whoring, then yeah thats an excuse to do something about em.

But rep and posts are signs that we have actually existed on the forum, that we were there, that we did shit.

Same goes for senior membership. That was also a sign that we have participated.

To make that a punishment is to try and erase a person's presence, work, and accomplishments from the forum.


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

I hate my rep 

Next time you guys ban me double it, that'll really teach me


----------



## Shiron (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> Cheh, then why not make it a known rule instead ?


It's quite known now, so it doesn't really matter at this point.

EDIT: 





Kamina said:


> Ummmm...because we work for em....
> 
> I mean sure if there's excessive rep whoring and post whoring, then yeah thats an excuse to do something about em.
> 
> ...


All are also privleges (especially senior membership), or alllow members access to certain privleges, and as such can be revoked as necessary. They're privleges; not rights.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Shiron said:


> It's quite known now, so it doesn't really matter at this point.



Yeah now after i made it a big deal, it was kinda stupid to have it unknown if it was ment to stop peopple from being banned, no?


----------



## Shiron (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> Yeah now after i made it a big deal, it was kinda stupid to have it unknown if it was ment to stop peopple from being banned, no?


The original purpouse here was as a deterrant to the repeat offenders who plain old bans weren't working on. It really wasn't meant to prevent bans in general, but now because of all this drama surrounding it, it's doing that as well, which is a nice plus.


----------



## SENTINEL (Aug 17, 2007)

Forkshy..double rep my dupe 

accountelirium............I am activity.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Neji said:


> warned for mentioning raids when the Blender was told next time they plan a raid they get a minimal 1 month ban?


The OB did it before the Blender raided the entire forum.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> The OB did it before the Blender raided the entire forum.



still doesn't change the fact you looked away when they broke tons of rules and now you come here and say "If the obers would do it i'd ban them too"


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 17, 2007)

But I think the big point about this is its okay if you take away something YOU gave us. Not to take away something we earned.

I take back my point on senior membership.

I think as a punishment you should be able to take away group membership because* you gave us that, we didn't earn it.* That is that status thing fork was talking about. But it is not your right to take away something *we earned on our own*.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> If the intent was to make the members fearful of restricted rights, and the loss of that which was gained on their own accord, then congratulations, it worked.


Yea, it was.  Real courts take money from people as punishment for crimes, which is stuff they gained on their own accord.

Bottom line: Punishments are supposed to be unpleasant.  You guys have demonstrated that we finally figured out a way to make them unpleasant for those who don't care about a week off.



> But it is not your right to take away something we earned on our own.


Why not?  I really don't understand why that isn't exactly within our rights as the mods/admins of this forum trying to make people obey the rules.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

@Fork
then that should work the other way too, you should get reps everyday when you're not banned since you're a good boy?


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Except courts have set rules they follow, the don't make them up on the fly...unless you're a minority, ZING!


----------



## Neji (Aug 17, 2007)

People get banned for Legendary things, which is rep deserving, contradictory? 


while we're on this topic, enable smilies in the courts


----------



## Iria (Aug 17, 2007)

That is something I will agree with you on, Gooba. This is certainly an unpleasant but effective deterrent for bannable behavior.

Which, as Freija has so vehemently pointed out, may have served to deter Dave and escamoh and Saosin had they known beforehand.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> People get banned for Legendary things, which is rep deserving, contradictory?


Yes it is contradictory, since if they got banned for something it doesn't deserve pos rep.  The problem is that the same rep system is used for the criminals and the regular users.  Cop killers get increased rep with other criminals, but decreased with normal people.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

lol cop killers XD it always bring a smile to my face when you compare rule breakers to stuff like that


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> Which, as Freija has so vehemently pointed out, may have served to deter Dave and escamoh and Saosin had they known beforehand.


They did something which is worthy of punishment.  If we give them back their rep, seeing as they don't care about bans, we will have effectively not punished them.


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 17, 2007)

forkshy said:


> See, this is the problem I am having with your arguments.
> 
> You work for your rep, your rep is part of your legacy at the forum. Your rep is a symbol of your interpersonal relationships with other forums members and the genreal quality of your posts.
> 
> ...


But you see that is pointless. It won't effect how your friends think of you. They'll say, hey! You're back!

More on a personal level its insulting like say in Hollows case, congratulations, for spamming in another section, all the art you have done, all the times you have made people laugh, all the times you have made someone feel good, CONGRATUMAFUCKINGLATIONS, half of them no longer insist. Its a personal insult. As an alternative to permaban, thats a great option, but as just a bullshit thing to do for repeat offenders which is entirely a judgement call which can easily biased, it is hardly a fair circumstance.

All I'm saying is make the punishment fit the crime. Perhaps this be a plea deal alternative to a permaban (as you all seem to imply), instead of being gone 
for ever, you give half your legacy.

But for a simple misdemeanor like this, its an irrational alternative.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> lol cop killers XD it always bring a smile to my face when you compare rule breakers to stuff like that


I am not comparing them, I am showing an example of a situation where "rep" could be earned with one group and lost with another.  I never said the amount of rep lost/gained were even in the same ballpark.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

it would on the other hand serve as a warning to any others who might think to do what they did?


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> All I'm saying is make the punishment fit the crime.


We did.  On those users a ban isn't a punishment.  And 0 punishment didn't fit the crime.


----------



## Pein (Aug 17, 2007)

well since mods are in here trash this its just a thread filled with fail jokes
 here


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

It's not that you made a new kind of punish for repeat offenders, it's that you implemented it without any kind of advanced notice.

It'd be like increasing the punishment for loitering to 10 years in prison w/o informing anyone.


----------



## Vandal Savage (Aug 17, 2007)

This would be different if they knew before hand which they didn't. You say that this applies to all members of the forums but I doubt over 50% of the posters on NF even know that they will lose half of their post count and rep for something like this. 

I take it the staff isn't going to budge on Hollow, Esca, and Sao?


----------



## Sunuvmann (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> We did.  On those users a ban isn't a punishment.  And 0 punishment didn't fit the crime.


Yeah. Thats what happens when you ban people a day here and another day here and a week there over small things, it looses its effect.

When you are a noob you are like OMFG I DONT WANT TO BE BANNED! But since you are so liberal in your use of the ban hammer, it doesn't have the same effect it used to have.

And as such you are resorting to the absurd.

Anyways, I'm going now. Still have a bit more packing to finish in the morning before I leave.

KEEP RO RO FIGHTIN THE POWAH MY BROTHERS!


----------



## Mintaka (Aug 17, 2007)

I love how this solved nothing even though IT SHOULD AT LEAST BE IN THE ANNOUNCMENTS BY NOW!!!!!!!

And yet it isn't....how sad.


----------



## Vandal Savage (Aug 17, 2007)

I have checked all over the forums and I seriously haven't seen any updates. I think what they did was wrong but the rest of the forum should know of this policy since you say it doesn't only apply to Blenderites.


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

I heard Shiron is pushing to make it blender applicable only.


----------



## Shiron (Aug 17, 2007)

Is this so...?


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Yea, Tazmo told me.


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## Fang (Aug 17, 2007)

Shiron is the strangest mod ever.


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## Pein (Aug 17, 2007)

shiron which section do you mod


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Uh oh, this threads gonna get locked!


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## Vandal Savage (Aug 17, 2007)

When will the rest of the forum know of said policy?


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Jetstorm said:


> When will the rest of the forum know of said policy?



When they get banned and half their rep and posts are taken away.


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## Bro Tai Jr. (Aug 17, 2007)

How about you don't get banned.
Problem solved.


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Bro Tai Jr. said:


> How about you don't get banned.
> Problem solved.



You're missing the point.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Actually, I think he is the only one getting it.

We didn't warn Nybarius and ItO when we took away 100% of their rep, and they had way more than the people today given rep inflation.  We give out punishments which we see fit for various offenses.  We don't need to make it perfectly defined because the only reason to do that is so that when you are actively deciding whether or not to break the rules you know all the information.  You should never be weighing punishment vs fun you get from doing it.  You should always be saying "no I won't do it because it is against the rules" the punishment itself doesn't matter.


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Can I donate my rep to those ppl who got theirs cut in half?

I think that would create a feeling of joy and unite the forums.

Then we could all work to love, honor, and respect each other.


----------



## Yellow (Aug 17, 2007)

^Hey can I donate my posts count to someone then? Don't want it anymore.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

If we let you do that then they would effectively not be punished, which is an outcome we don't want.


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## Fang (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba is sexy and rite, Asuma fans are always rite.


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## Vandal Savage (Aug 17, 2007)

Alright Gooba.


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## Yellow (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba. Read my PM please. I don't want to donate to one of the banned members.


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## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

We've decided to stop all the rep and post donations, banned or not.  It just got too out of hand, and given everything that has been said in this thread you can see why.  Huge donations in either changes what identity they have earned and all that.


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## Yellow (Aug 17, 2007)

Oh ok. Fine, too bad. Wait so even if I want to donate to you Gooba you can't accept?;D

Well then I'll have to rep that member more often to show my appreciation for him/her. Hope you Mods don't see that as repwhoring.


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Damn, I was gonna donate my rep and posts to you Gooba.


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## delirium (Aug 17, 2007)

There's a hidden clause. You can donate to this guy.


----------



## Yellow (Aug 17, 2007)

Lol. No. That guy can't hab mah post count.

Del did I rep you recently or something? I just tried to rep you but it said I need to spread some reputation around.

EDIT: I see you TBH.O=


EDIT: Oh you left TBH.

EDIT: I saw you too Del.D:

I'm go spam post in your naruto sections now. uh oh. Hope I don't do anything to get banned and my post count/rep cut in half.


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## delirium (Aug 17, 2007)

You're not on my most current rep page. Then again.. I got repped like a monster today. You could have been pushed off.

Alright.. enough off topic from me.

Bye bye thread.


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## Yellow (Aug 17, 2007)

I see Delirium. Your doing well. Well I guess it will take longer than I thought to neg you below Ascendant.

See you Del. I'm off to increase my post count and rep power so I can neg you below Ascendant faster.


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

I want my rep reversed and donated to Del


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## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

[lookatme]  

I haven't been banned or repsealed _ever_.[/lookatme]

edit Havoc@ur location: I wanna join in

btw the donations thing was fucked up, Goober, and with superb timing to boot, it was decided on when I just held a signature contest and the winners couldn't receive their price because donations were suddenly off-limits.  While the same thing (donations for winning contests of some sort) happened just weeks before that incident. Identity my Windian ass.[/off topic]


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

susano i don't like that ypour invisible becuz i cant stalk you


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## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

A superstar of my level needs this, lest he gets engulfed by massive amounts of fans every time he browses the forums. If it makes it easier: when I lurk, I mostly only lurk in blender, predictions thread, or this section.


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

I'll remember that 

ok gnite

i cant rep you


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## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

doesn't matter, my dear Bearer of Nobleness and Self-directed Love, Master of Masturbation and Generally Nice Person.


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## Crowe (Aug 17, 2007)

UH NOEZ, IC AN'T "SPAM, GET BANNED, LOL ON MSN" ANYMORE. IT IS SOOO UNFAIR....FUCKT HE MODS..OMG THEY HATE US SOO MUCH...OH, GOD WHAT TO DO...FUCK YOU MODS...WHY U HAVE TO HATE ON US?...U CAN'T EVEN ANSWER ON DIZ QUESTION OMG....WE'VE DONE NOTHING BAD *MAJOR COUGHING*...PLZ, REMOVE THIS SO WE CAN BREAK THE RULES AS WE SEE FIT WITHOUT HAVING TO BE AFRAID OF LOSING OUR "HARD WHORED REP"...
PLEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASEEEEEEE?


----------



## Crowe (Aug 17, 2007)

OGM MATURE? HOW UNFAIR..?! WHY DO YOU TARGET US MODS ALL THE TIME, WHY DO WE HAVE TO ACT SO MATURE?[/DRAMA]


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

you know, I bet my left testicle when I saw peK in the 'viewing this thread' thing that he would respond in CAPS lock in such a manner   

I won fair and square now rep praise me, Daisy!

edit: hey peK darling, I suppose you can't change my name to "Susano-o" for me? I requested it to several staff members recently, but they seem to be busy.


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Shut up pek, you're always crying about something, well you know what...I'm sick of it.


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## Zaru (Aug 17, 2007)

Alright, I'll be sure to look like a victim who didn't see it coming and never intended any lulz next time I get myself banned


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## delirium (Aug 17, 2007)

Deputy Masterball said:


> I've only read through this page and the first, so I ask forgiveness if this has already been asked;
> 
> It has been said that senior membership will be taken away if one gets b& for the "lulz". Will these members be able to get it back early due to good behaviour, or should they wait a full half year or something after their ban to request senior membership again?



While I don't want to explicitly say yes or no.. it's hard not to ignore Iria's case. She was let off early from her time off for the raid. And since then.. she hasn't gotten into any trouble (minus getting sealed for a while). But she's always been a sweet girl. So I'd say it's a case by case. Depending on past bans.. current attitude.. things like that.

Then again.. she has tits. =/



Zaru said:


> Alright, I'll be sure to look like a victim who didn't see it coming and never intended any lulz next time I get myself banned



I'd love to see the day.


----------



## ssj3boruto (Aug 17, 2007)

You _son of a bitch_. But really Reznor cares enough for all of us, and several times over, so carry on with total peace of mind Ssj3.

Also the topic of this thread has been addressed already for coming up to fifteen pages, so I won't add anything else.


----------



## Ssj3_Goku (Aug 17, 2007)

* Must be the my grumpy  morning  today"




Gooba said:


> Shit like that makes me wonder why I have spent hours and hours a day for the last 2 years dealing with ridiculous amount of drama and headaches to make this place better overall for people who probably don't even know who I am or what I did.
> 
> Oh yea, I remember, so I could be sparkley.



I said most, not all or specific names, because I wanted to leave those out..  No gooba you where not one of the mods I was talking about, nor renzor, nor shroom either. If anything when I say "mod" I mean moderator or Smod, not Administrator. I know who you are  and what you done for NF and I have to say it was alot.


----------



## Harlita (Aug 17, 2007)

Nothing is being done to just 1 group. 
Nothing is being done that hasn't been done before.
Nothing is going to stop being done, simply because people are complaining.



We have been complaining about CONSISTENT rule breaking for quite some time.

80% of the time, I make statistics up based on experience and rough estimates.

90% of the time, temporarily banning a member will get their attention to at least TRY to pay attention to the rules.

However, for the other 10% of the time, banning becomes a joke and is basically ignorable by the forum member.

After all, people can just chat on IRC, MSN or other forum, right?  So by banning a person who isn't really being affected by it, we need to look at taking other steps.


If someone is consistently spamming, you'll see we've cut post counts. This isn't new. 

If someone is repwhoring, or being repped for spamming, you'll find we'll cut rep counts. This has happened plenty of times in the past.

If someone is trolling an area, you'll find that we've section banned them from that area. Yes, even if it's release night, even if it's the only area they go to.

If a Senior Member consistently break rules, has infractions numerous, warnings given and ignored, you'll see them lose their senior membership. 

NONE of this is new.


This thread exists only because this time, it happened to several people at once.


----------



## Aruarian (Aug 17, 2007)

You're pretty much the only one bothering with Infractions, Harlita. XD


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

blah, you guys are totally being unfair about this, sure have this new "law" if you wish, but don't make examples out of esca and HI, besides what they did is nothing, in any thread in the library there are more than 20 offtopic replies... you'd have to ban the entire subforum.


----------



## Harlita (Aug 17, 2007)

Lucifer the Light-bearer said:


> You're pretty much the only one bothering with Infractions, Harlita. XD


heh, that you know of ^_^

I know Shrooms infracts a lot as well. A lot of mods still send PM's as warnings though.




Freija said:


> blah, you guys are totally being unfair about this, sure have this new "law" if you wish, but don't make examples out of esca and HI, besides what they did is nothing, in any thread in the library there are more than 20 offtopic replies... you'd have to ban the entire subforum.



Would you say that it is fair to have to constantly readdress an issue with someone over and over again?


Only to find out that, it would have been avoided if they knew we'd be more strict about the rules beforehand?

How is that fair?  We're supposed to forwarn rule breakers that keep breaking rules that we're going to do something other than ban sometimes? 


Are we going to be forwarned when spamming is going to be done outside the blender? Or when porn is going to be posted randomly around by someone who does it "cause they were bored" for the 3rd time?


I think it's fair that we've given multiple chances to people. We're not going out on extremes here. 

Not one person you've mentioned was a first time offender. 


When you look at this specific thread they spammed, it is not that horrible of a thread. But let them discuss with you how many times they have been Warned, Infracted, Banned leading up to this and then we can revisit this idea.

Remember, it's "Don't break the damn rules."  Not- "Break the rules as long as the punishment is something that you don't mind."


And please don't think that I'm somehow being unfair in this, or abusing power or whatnot.

Dave is my friend. And this FUCKING SUCKS to not be able to have him here right now.  

SO you say, "but don't make examples out of esca and HI, besides what they did is nothing" -  well then with who should we start?


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

actually harlita i've mentioned a first time offender... Devil Akuma if you read the few other pages. and if you banned esca and HI for what they did, you'd have to ban the entire library to be fair. and yes its always nice to know the rules before hand. i mean someone  changes the rules, red lights means go in trafic, then they get a fine for stopping the traffic, and they go "but i didn't know" and cops go "well now you do"... does that sound fair and square?


start by using the "announciations" since it was created for this type of new rules


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> Remember, it's "Don't break the damn rules." Not- "Break the rules as long as the punishment is something that you don't mind."


I think this is the most important thing to remember.  The attitude of cherry picking rules to follow based on their penalty has got to fucking stop.  We shouldn't need to have any penalty at all if you guys were all good forum goers.



> i mean someone changes the rules, red lights means go in trafic


That isn't what happened.  What they did was always against the rules, the only thing that changed is the penalty.  Any in my opinion the penalty that is stated doesn't matter at all since if you actually think about the penalty beforehand you deserve far worse.



> i mean someone changes the rules, red lights means go in trafic


It really wasn't, since all the warning would say is "Don't break the rules if you don't want to be punished."  Which I kinda assumed was known.


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## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

Harlita said:


> [...]
> If someone is repwhoring, or *being repped for spamming*, you'll find we'll cut rep counts. This has happened plenty of times in the past.[...]



This was new to me. Did this happen to me? Cuz then obviously I need punishment for being repped for every thing I do.


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## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

^
Gooba, they didn't even do anything out of the ordinary in the library, its full of offtopic shit everywhere, liked i've said like 3 times now, if HI got banned for 5 offtopic posts, the entire fucking subforum must be banned.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

If they didn't think it was bannable why did they say stuff like "If I knew my rep and post would be cut I wouldn't have done it" and make threads like "WHY AM I NOT BANNED YET"  They knew they were doing bannable stuff, they just didn't care about being banned.  You should follow rules because they are the rules and no other reason.

Just so you know, every time I hear "they wouldn't have if they knew their rep/posts would be cut in half" makes me want to cut it again just because I think the fact that they had that attitude shows they don't belong on this forum.


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## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

That was Saosin and Devil akuma, not HI and Esca(the why am i not banned yet)

and you can't take something they said afterwards into account, even if they knew or not, when you're banned you tend to say "i won't do it again" or stuff amongst those lines


HI explained like 5 times he wrote in escas thread, and stayed on-topic in it, but it kept changing titles, so it got lots of offtopics.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> That was Saosin and Devil akuma, not HI and Esca(the why am i not banned yet)


Yes, but it was 





			
				Dave said:
			
		

> Well you should have made an announcement before handing out this punishment
> if i knew before hand, i wouldn't be here


 Plus it has been said several times in here that it isn't fair they didn't know the punishment beforehand, and that if they did they might not have done it.  Knowing the punishment beforehand should have NO bearing on whether or not you do something here.  100% of the decision should be "is that against the rules?"


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

which is more of a reason to call that new banning method bad, since it would stop lots of bans if you just took a second to ANNOUNCE IT!


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

I agree with the announcing thing, it could have also prevented my complaints about the donation issue and the 'out of fucking nowhere its hasselhoff'-no jutsu concerning new rules .


----------



## Harlita (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> actually harlita i've mentioned a first time offender... Devil Akuma if you read the few other pages. and if you banned esca and HI for what they did, you'd have to ban the entire library to be fair. and yes its always nice to know the rules before hand. i mean someone  changes the rules, red lights means go in trafic, then they get a fine for stopping the traffic, and they go "but i didn't know" and cops go "well now you do"... does that sound fair and square?
> 
> 
> start by using the "announciations" since it was created for this type of new rules



Freija- what I will tell you now is the last thing I can say before I need to turn in for the night. 

If you believe that Devil Akuma was a "first time offender" and that we _normally _take action, like this against first time offenders- then you are wrong.

I am not going to go into great detail on what DA has had issues with in the past, but what I can tell you is this.


These warnings, infractions, pm's and attempts to working with people that many would like to say we DONT do - aren't visible to regular members. They are between the member and the staff.


DA was given the punishment he was given based on two things: His part in the event PLUS his history on the forums.

DA was NOT a first time offender. You just aren't privy to what issues he has had in the past.


How is that even fair, when people can't even keep spam threads in the Blender, which we've created specifically FOR those threads? 


This situation is so simple, and so easy it's not even funny. It's not up for debate and it's really quite irritating.


If you break the rules, there are consequences. Those consequences are up to the discretion of the staff - who, for the most part are becoming tired of banning the same people for a week or so, here and there. Warning them, once or twice a week. Section banning them every other month.


If it caught you off guard, I am sorry. But you'll also notice a ton of other members who are not having these problems.


All because - they just HAD to spam outside the blender, that everyone rioted about getting back when it got trashed. 

So what do we do? 

Get rid of the blender?  Let people spam all over the place? Just keep banning them? Because- you know- that worked, right?

It's very easy to judge the decisions of other people - but it sucks to hear someone say they wouldn't have broken the rule if they knew they were going to get a different punishment.

How about NOT breaking the rule?


----------



## Zaru (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> ^
> Gooba, they didn't even do anything out of the ordinary in the library, its full of offtopic shit everywhere, liked i've said like 3 times now, if HI got banned for 5 offtopic posts, the entire fucking subforum must be banned.



As a fun side fact, the only times I got infractioned or warned in the library, it was for being on-topic


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> which is more of a reason to call that new banning method bad, since it would stop lots of bans if you just took a second to ANNOUNCE IT!


I shouldn't have to say the new punishments for rules that should already be followed just because they are rules.  The people who only stay in line because of the size of the banhammer are people I want to ban because they are horrible forumites.

All my other comments about "How about you just don't break the rules" shouldn't be considered wisecracks.  The fact that they were really pisses me off.  An admin asking you to just obey the fucking rules shouldn't be "lol, like we could do that."  Yes.  You can.  Punishments shouldn't matter, nor should they be something we need to talk about.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

now im going back to this, but when the obers were breaking those rules it was alright...


was it because they only raided the blender, which you already hate and despise? or was it cause its your "pals" ?


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

It was because it was only borderline rulebreaking (they spammed the spam section), and because none of them had been warned previously.  They do any of it again and they get a month off, and possibly rep/postcount reductions if we think it is justified.  The members we did this stuff to were warned many times before and even PERM BANNED in one case.

Also, it doesn't have anything to do with this thread.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Yeh, borederline, they broke ever rule in the blender, and i've seen blenderites getting banned for "breaking the thread limit" with 1 thread...


the blenderites have learned that there is no borderline, even though its a spam section, the rules still apply, which they've and myself included learned the hard way


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

I didn't learn it, Freija. I'm slow. But I didn't break it either.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Not helping susanoo


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> Not helping susanoo


Helping with what?  I don't see where this line of reasoning is going in terms of this thread.  If you want to make a different thread to try and prove the mods made a huge mistake 4 months ago go ahead, but it isn't going to get these people their rep/posts back.


----------



## Aruarian (Aug 17, 2007)

Harlita said:


> heh, that you know of ^_^
> 
> I know Shrooms infracts a lot as well. A lot of mods still send PM's as warnings though.


Sean isn't a mod anymore, is he?


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

1.no it isn't
2.mod made a mistake my ass, you did it on purpose because you really didn't care
3.i've said like 50 times already why it was unfair i don't see why i should say it again when you already know it.


----------



## Einstein (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> It was because it was only borderline rulebreaking (they spammed the spam section), and because none of them had been warned previously.  They do any of it again and they get a month off, and possibly rep/postcount reductions if we think it is justified.  The members we did this stuff to were warned many times before and even PERM BANNED in one case.
> 
> Also, it doesn't have anything to do with this thread.



But.. isn't a raid a raid? [I take it] they knew they were raiding. Even if it is the spam section, I've seen people get banned inside the blender for doing blender things. Or, are you saying that to lose half of your rep/postcount, you must have a history of doing these types of things. If so, I don't feel that's right, imo, because someone could do something "for the lulz" and have never been banned before.

I simply think the rule should be all or none, no matter why you got banned.


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

As for helping, my on topic posts seem to get ignored, it happens when I do that in the Q&C section. So does everyone agree that it might be a good idea to announce new rules in a sticky in the relevant section(s)?


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## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

^
as long as you aren't a blenderite there's no need for harsh punishment 


@ susanoo, no then they can't make examples of blenderites and we can't have that.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> But.. isn't a raid a raid? [I take it] they knew they were raiding. Even if it is the spam section, I've seen people get banned inside the blender for doing blender things. Or, are you saying that to lose half of your rep/postcount, you must have a history of doing these types of things. If so, I don't feel that's right, imo, because someone could do something "for the lulz" and have never been banned before.
> 
> I simply think the rule should be all or none, no matter why you got banned.


That was a long time ago, and has nothing to do with this.  I'm not going to go back and give new punishments for stuff people did years/months ago.

We don't have it out for the Blender specifically, it just happens that having it out for rulebreakers makes us seem like we do since so many Blenderites can't follow the rules.

We do announce new rules in the relevant sections, but there are no new rules.  Making an announcement "We are punishing people who break rules in ways they won't enjoy," is stupid.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba you're not fooling anyone, you've been out for the blender for along time


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

I never heard about the donations thing (or the rep cut/post count cut thing) until after it was enforced. Was it that I didn't check the relevant sections for stickies?

Well, it can be argued that the cut in rep/posts isn't an actual rule (rather a punishment, but that is a gray area), but the donations thing is.

Also, I was once told that it is forbidden to speak my mind about spammers, i.e. give my opinion (doing so without breaking rules, at least no 'out of fucking nowhere its david hasselhoff'-rules). I'm still waiting for that sticky containing allowed opinions.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija, I don't care if you think I do.  I didn't become admin because I wanted everyone to think I was a cool guy.  I did it because I wanted to make this place better for the majority of people who use this forum, and if you look at the users online list and the "users viewing" by all the the forums, that majority is people who want to discuss Naruto without wading through Blenderite spam in their sections.  I would "have it out" for the OB too if they started posting tons of Batman vs threads in the Library, but they don't.  The Blender is where there is a concentration of people who like breaking our rules, and most of them happen to be the "popular" members who think they own NF because their postcounts are OVER 9000!



> I never heard about the donations thing (or the rep cut/post count cut) thing until after it was enforced. Was it that I didn't check the relevant sections for stickies?


Donations isn't really something we need to warn people about.  It isn't like you could donate by yourself and then have us punish you for it.  We'd let the people who try know that they can't when they ask.  This post cutting thing is new too, but that is just part of "rules _aren't_ meant to be broken" which everyone should know already.


----------



## Einstein (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> That was a long time ago, and has nothing to do with this.  I'm not going to go back and give new punishments for stuff people did years/months ago.
> 
> We don't have it out for the Blender specifically, it just happens that having it out for rulebreakers makes us seem like we do since so many Blenderites can't follow the rules.



I understand that, I wouldn't want you to go and give people new punishments for how they screwed up long ago. 

And as for the term "rulebreakers", unless you mean everyone that gets banned from now on, including non-blenderites, I still don't see that as fair. Because, unless the guilty person makes it obvious that they are breaking rules on purpose, how will you know? They may have never read the rules, or just didn't know, which isn't as hard to believe as you think. How can you tell if they did it on accident or on purpose, espcially since you can't rely on anyone to tell the truth about such a thing. The best thing would be to give everyone the same punishment, regardless of past history, the crime, or whether they knew what they were doing or not.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

then delete the blender if you don't want it ?


and i don't think we have anyone OVER  9000!!!!!!!!!!!!


and i rarely see blenderites in the library that are spamming.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> unless the guilty person makes it obvious that they are breaking rules on purpose, how will you know?


It is pretty obvious in these cases that they did.  We have a big advantage over cops in that everything everyone has ever said on the forums, and everything they have done is on record here.  We know what they know and what they don't.  Any time you do something, then ask "WHY HAVEN'T I BEEN BANNED YET" I think it is a good hint that you know you were breaking a rule and didn't care about being banned.  Any time you have been banned 3 times for the same thing, then do it again and say "I wouldn't have if I knew I'd care about the punishment" it is pretty clear you knew what you were doing.

Us mods are a lot smarter than you give us credit for, we can tell when we should use this and when we shouldn't.



> and i don't think we have anyone OVER 9000!!!!!!!!!!!!


I just meant a lot, 3k works too and I know you have some over that.


> and i rarely see blenderites in the library that are spamming.


I just saw 5, and now they got punished so hopefully I won't see any more.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Stop applying Devil Akuma and Sasosins threads to HI and Esca


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Stop ignoring the rest of that sentence.  We've known HI and esca for a long time, we know they know what they did was wrong.  Stop pretending they didn't.



> then delete the blender if you don't want it ?


I'd rather let those who enjoy it enjoy it, as long as that enjoyment doesn't infringe on the enjoyment of people outside of it.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> I just saw 5, and now they got punished so hopefully I won't see any more.



but what you wrote alittle higher makes it seem like we attack the library daily, hell we probably have 2-4 guys who visit there regularly and they don't spam.


If posting 5 offtopic posts is wrong then the ENTIRE SUBFORUM SHOULD BE BANNED


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> *A*Donations isn't really something we need to warn people about.  It isn't like you could donate by yourself and then have us punish you for it.  We'd let the people who try know that they can't when they ask.
> 
> *B*This post cutting thing is new too, but that is just part of "rules _aren't_ meant to be broken" which everyone should know already.



*A:*I beg to differ. There was this contest to make me a signature and I was supposed to deal out/donate rep to the first 3 entries; the effort of them is wasted. 

In any case, when you have a common practice, and want to change it, it isn't up to the ones not knowing about the change to ask questions, but it's up to the 'changers' to notify the community. Its not like members wake up every day, wonder if there will be a new rule allowing/forbidding something and then asking a mod about it, i.e. me waking up tomorrow and asking if sparkles in names will be forbidden any time soon. Its not the way members barrelroll.

*B:*I somewhat agree here (see previous edited post), but still, you can't deny that notifying/announcing stuff like this would have cleared at least some confusion. It would even be handy from the POV of you staff members, as a kind of 'justification', i.e. 'we told you we would do this, check sticky, made on date xx/xx/xxxx, so now you have less reason to bullshit, puny spammer' desuuuu.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

You make it out like we attack the Blender all the time too, we only do it when they go and spam outside of the section.  Both are pretty rare occurances, yet you act like I spend all day plotting and acting against you.


----------



## Einstein (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> It is pretty obvious in these cases that they did.  We have a big advantage over cops in that everything everyone has ever said on the forums, and everything they have done is on record here.  We know what they know and what they don't.  Any time you do something, then ask "WHY HAVEN'T I BEEN BANNED YET" I think it is a good hint that you know you were breaking a rule and didn't care about being banned.  Any time you have been banned 3 times for the same thing, then do it again and say "I wouldn't have if I knew I'd care about the punishment" it is pretty clear you knew what you were doing.


And if it isn't obvious, what are you going to do? Assume?



> Us mods are a lot smarter than you give us credit for, we can tell when we should use this and when we shouldn't.


No, you don't. You should use it all the time, or not at all. 

If you let people off the hook once and say "Next time, it'll be worse," you can't expect them to believe you. At the same time, you can't leave people in the dark and take off half their postcount just because you think they got banned on purpose. I've been banned once, by Kira, for not watching HXH. Now that I have a record, is a fire lit under my ass?


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

it seems like that when the first thing you wrote on  5/24 was flamebaiting blenderites then you go ahead and delete the blender cause of the flame there, and when you let your pals in OB raid the fuck out of us etc.


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## Goodfellow (Aug 17, 2007)

Supporting the cause!


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> No, you don't. You should use it all the time, or not at all.
> 
> If you let people off the hook once and say "Next time, it'll be worse," you can't expect them to believe you. At the same time, you can't leave people in the dark and take off half their postcount just because you think they got banned on purpose. I've been banned once, by Kira, for not watching HXH. Now that I have a record, is a fire lit under my ass?


Us mods are a lot smarter than you give us credit for.  We can use discretion on punishments, just like every other punitive system in existence.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Really ? and letting all the OB'ers off what a blenderite would've been permed for was smart?


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

"A blenderite" wouldn't have been permed for it.


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## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

i edited in "ite"


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## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

So did  I.


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## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

well we would, last time i checked, i got permed for spamming the blender...


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## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> well we would, last time i checked, i got permed for spamming the blender...


Funny, you don't seem permed to me, and the ban wasn't for spamming the Blender.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

because i was pretty unbanned, permbans don't seem to last too long


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

lol what about my 'point A'



in any case, I'm off for now kbai


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Tazmo'money said:


> lol what about my 'point A'
> 
> 
> 
> in any case, I'm off for now kbai



susanoo legit points are ignored <3, bye


----------



## Einstein (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> Us mods are a lot smarter than you give us credit for.  We can use discretion on punishments, just like every other punitive system in existence.


lol, NFPD. I give mods tons of credit. I think you are smart, which is why I bother arguing with you, Gooba. But you make it sound like mods are gods, who know exactly how everybody thinks and has a 100% foolproof way of knowing who is doing something on purpose and who is not.

And every other punitive system in existence is irrelevent to the internet. I just don't see why everyone can't get the same punsihment, no matter what.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

You were given a shorter ban when we learned the porn posting dupe's weren't yours.

Here is the majority of the reasoning behind why I didn't ban OBers:

They started planning it in the OB convo thread.  I personally thought that them going in and spamming would be fun because that is what the spam section was for.  There had been some OB vs Blender jabs going back and forth beforehand and it seemed to all be in good fun.  The Blender even was saying stuff about how trying to beat the Spam section with spam was only going to make them stronger, and that it wouldn't even phase them.  I said the raid was ok before it happened because it just seemed like something both sides would enjoy and laugh about after.  When they did go in they didn't do anything too far over the line like post porn or spoilers (like the Blender raid on 5/24 did).  When it became clear that it wasn't fun for everyone we warned them to stop with the threat of bans, and they did.  I couldn't go an ban them because I made the wrong call of the Blender thinking it was spam fun (despite a number of them basically stating they would).



> I just don't see why everyone can't get the same punsihment, no matter what.


Because every situation isn't the same, and thus not deserving of the same treatment.

I am not saying they are gods, but really, we get SO much information in every instance it isn't even a challenge.



> A:I beg to differ. There was this contest to make me a signature and I was supposed to deal out/donate rep to the first 3 entries; the effort of them is wasted.
> 
> In any case, when you have a common practice, and want to change it, it isn't up to the ones not knowing about the change to ask questions, but it's up to the 'changers' to notify the community. Its not like members wake up every day, wonder if there will be a new rule allowing/forbidding something and then asking a mod about it, i.e. me waking up tomorrow and asking if sparkles in names will be forbidden any time soon. Its not the way members barrelroll.


Making an announcement that only effects 20-30 people really isn't that vital, when the information will still make its way out without disturbing the thousands of other people who go on the forum.  It wasn't a common practice.  It was common among one clique of people but you have to realize 99% of the users on this forum don't deal with rep donations at all.  It really was a very uncommon practice, so getting the information out by PM worked fine in every case but yours.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Yeah you got so much information about me that i got blamed not only for 5/24 but for the raids after that too 

and i clearly said like 30 times i didn't post any porn.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Freija said:


> Yeah you got so much information about me that i got blamed not only for 5/24 but for the raids after that too


Sorry about that perm ban, let me go lift it... OH WAIT, we figured out what actually happened MONTHS ago and rectified the situation.


> and i clearly said like 30 times i didn't post any porn.


Yea, because in the Court people never lie.  Ever been to jail, apparently _everyone _in there is innocent.


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Months ago... it was last month, after i was banned for 3 months on false grounds.... which i clearly said many times wasn't me, then i got blamed for tons of raids afterwards and everytime i tried to plead my case in the court my threads were pretty much ignored or responded to with "we think you're a big idiot"


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## Einstein (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba:
I didn't mean that as in ban time. I meant that as in the taking off half of the postcount and such. It's nothing but an additional punishment to a ban, so I feel that everyone should get it. If they've got what it takes to get banned, they should be able to stomach the additional punsihment as well, period. Of course, vacation bans shouldn't have to apply this rule, since the person banned didn't really do anything wrong.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> Gooba:
> I didn't mean that as in ban time. I meant that as in the taking off half of the postcount and such. It's nothing but an additional punishment to a ban, so I feel that everyone should get it. If they've got what it takes to get banned, they should be able to stomach the additional punsihment as well, period. Of course, vacation bans shouldn't have to apply this rule, since the person banned didn't really do anything wrong.


Punishments should fit the crime, not every ban needs additional punishment because there are varying degrees of how bad the action was.  Posting an extra 1 thread in the Blender isn't nearly as bad as posting pictures of tubgirl, and they shouldn't be treated the same.  Do I really need to defend the idea of differing punishments based on offense?  Every legal system ever has done it, and while you may not think it is relevant it just shows that thousands of people smarter than any of us have thought about it for years and all come to the conclusion that different crimes should get different punishments.


----------



## Einstein (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> Punishments should fit the crime, not every ban needs additional punishment because there are varying degrees of how bad the action was.  Posting an extra 1 thread in the Blender isn't nearly as bad as posting pictures of tubgirl, and they shouldn't be treated the same.


Then make bans longer, and don't bother with the half-off stuff at all. If the half-off stuff is for people who knew what they were doing, why can't someone posting too may threads (and they knew they were doing it) get half-off, just like the person posting the tubgirl pics. Bu tthen again, you don't know whether or not the person with the extra thread was doing it on purpose or not, so you can't give them the proper punishment.

So, if half-off is for people doing stuff on purpose, and you don't know, what do you do? And what if, like in Freija's case, they were found to not be guilty, and you took half off, does the person get those back?


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## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> Then make bans longer, and don't bother with the half-off stuff at all.


But for some people that doesn't matter, which is why we do the half off stuff.





> So, if half-off is for people doing stuff on purpose, and you don't know, what do you do? And what if, like in Freija's case, they were found to not be guilty, and you took half off, does the person get those back?


Yes.


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## Einstein (Aug 17, 2007)

And if the half-off stuff doesn't matter, what do you do?

Oh, shit, nevermind. I know the answer. You permban. Which doesn't mean people can't make new accounts.

I suppose I can rest my case, so long as I know the rule isn't subject only to a certain group of people (blenerites).


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## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

no, blenderites are there to be made examples of


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## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> And if the half-off stuff doesn't matter, what do you do?
> 
> Oh, shit, nevermind. I know the answer. You permban. Which doesn't mean people can't make new accounts.


What are you saying, we might as well not do anything because we don't have absolute power over every user here?



> no, blenderites are there to be made examples of


Yea, if you look in the Court you would see that there are nothing but Blenderites in there.


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## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

so you're saying there are no other banned people except blenderites


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## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Yes. **


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## Einstein (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> What are you saying, we might as well not do anything because we don't have absolute power over every user here?


No. I'm not trying to say anything. My question was directed at you, then I realized that the answer was obvious so I answered it myself. And the fact that people can make new accounts is obvious, too. Maybe getting permbanned will get them to make a new account and act like a new, improved member, provided they don't get banned for having a new account, which is dumb, imo, especially if they made a new account to do good instead of bad. Maybe it'll make them worse. 

The problem will never be solved, no matter what you do. You won't be able to scare people into not getting banned, and sitting around doing nothing doesn't make it any better, hence April Fool's. Well, you'll scare a few, but not everyone will turn into honerable members of internet society, and blenderites aren't the only ones that cause trouble.


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## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba, your lies are funny


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## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> The problem will never be solved, no matter what you do. You won't be able to scare people into not getting banned, and sitting around doing nothing doesn't make it any better, hence April Fool's. Well, you'll scare a few, but not everyone will turn into honerable members of internet society, and blenderites aren't the only ones that cause trouble.


It will never be 100% solved, but we can try as close as possible, and using this halving system will get us a few %s towards 100.


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## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> It will never be 100% solved, but we can try as close as possible, and using this halving system will get us a few %s towards 100.



IF people knew about it...


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## Ram (Aug 17, 2007)

It does look like argument is moving around in ever increasing circles. And I thought the question was decently answered in the first page.


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## Einstein (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> It will never be 100% solved, but we can try as close as possible, and using this halving system will get us a few %s towards 100.


If you say so, as long as you know 100% will never happen.


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## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

Ram said:


> It does look like argument is moving around in ever increasing circles. And I thought the question was decently answered in the first page.


So did I, apparently not.


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## GrimaH (Aug 17, 2007)

This rule is a conspiracy by the republicans to control the Internet Hate Machine.


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## kidloco (Aug 17, 2007)

ok im here!!! (not internet in my couising home )

i think they ban and rep cut and ect was unfair for teh reson my felow blednerite have said
and rep is a gift, and like in spanish said

lo que se regala no se quita o de regalo no se regresa o se quita

that is whit the rep

about the postcount: much of the post outside of the bledner is count and much have be good thread or posts and not only spam like much mod think it is, that why we have the bledner and is only to blenderite

about the spam in the bledner, is right otehrs raid spam and make a caos there and the bledneritewho do that get a ban??

that is unfair

the new pushiment have have told

is like in real life, you not have see they never get arrest somebodywitout warning them?

that why are the announce part to everything new like new rules or ect


soo that mean if  i get ban againg for whatever i iwll getmy rep and count cut??

and you modare full of lie, you said you see everyone teh same is shit because the only really get ban fron the blenderiteand otehrs not and they do spam and flame and worst whine to you to get ban while in the rules we dont do nothing wrong (example U y B i have tlak to harlita and she is wiht me in that because i never flame and do what they do and i get flame and amenazas and banfor post there, i think i had to time ban for that and is injust but i not said nothing becuase i know you will said teh mod always have ther eason (experienci fron another forum i went) or think that was right but when i read teh rules like 5 times, here never said i was not permit to post in a fc if not i am a member but she  tell me somehow that is noather theme not goin to said becuase i kno what she mean and everythgn was right but somehow feel injust gett hat ban

soo you not goin to said that you was wrong ban me for that? (and i have some warning of that and really i dint did nothign wrong)

soo you some of teh mod abusing the power (not everyone for luck but who some know who can be)

example gooba have lfa teh blednerite sometime and nothgin have did
otehr is let oters spam and raid but we cant do it because we get ban while otehrs get a warning

what is teh fuck is that??


sometime


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## Sunuvmann (Aug 17, 2007)

-__________________________-

...this is still going on...?

I'll say one last thing on this. Next time you make a drastic new policy that affects many many people, I dunno...tell us?

Shrooms/Suzy made a sticky thread in the Blender when we had new rules. If its forum wide, make an announcement to liek everyone...is it really that hard?

Must you be so secretive? I mean wouldn't it be easier to say 'We have decided so and so' and let us argue it out beforehand. I mean hell that'd be better for you guys, you'd have the moral advantage and we wouldn't have martyrs to fight for.

Anyway, Gooba, Pek, with all due respect, stop being such dicks and for once have some empathy for those you govern over. 2 years or so ago, you were once one of us teeming masses. Try and remember what it was like.

Hopefully in the coming months there will be a change in the ethics of this place and you guys can learn to be a tad bit more tolerant and open oh high and mighty forum gods.


Au revoir shit heads, Screw you guys, I'm going to school.


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## Gunners (Aug 17, 2007)

I think it's good, to many people have a smug attitude to getting banned.


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## Crowe (Aug 17, 2007)

Kamina said:


> -__________________________-
> 
> ...this is still going on...?
> 
> ...


We weren't secretive. This isn't something entirely new neither is it a "rule", we've always "punished" people as we see fit. We've cut rep in half before, we've cut post count in half before, we've removed Senior Membership before...but most often then not, we've only banned people but this time we decided that this shouldn't be the case as they were purposely breaking the rules over and over again. I bet you don't care as you probably where "lol'ng" with them...It just happened to "popular" people now.

Consider this thread as an announcement if you really need one.


> Anyway, Gooba, Pek, with all due respect, stop being such dicks and for once have some empathy for those you govern over. 2 years or so ago, you were once one of us teeming masses. Try and remember what it was like.


I remember what it was like...I was like, NOT TRYING TO PURPOSELY BREAK RULES SEVERAL TIMES. I kept to my sections, GFX section and Library 2 and didn't have any problems with the mod. I'm being a dick? Are we reading the same thread? I'm just getting annoyed at the same arguments coming up over and over again and when things don't go "your way" incidents that happened over a half year ago is brought up "why didn't you do so here, why didn't you do so there". 



> Hopefully in the coming months there will be a change in the ethics of this place and you guys can learn to be a tad bit more tolerant and open oh high and mighty forum gods.


...says the one who started flaming Suzuhiko for something she wasn't even responsible of...

We've been tolerant, that is why Hollow Ichigo and esca isn't perm banned. If you did this last year, I would vow that they'd be sitting dupe accounts trying to outsmart us mods now because their main accounts got perm banned.

See this from a mod PoV please and stop trying to be a hero...everyone knows heroes have capes and big muscles, and you obviously neither.


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

kidloco said:


> ok im here!!! (not internet in my couising home )
> 
> i think they ban and rep cut and ect was unfair for teh reson my felow blednerite have said
> and rep is a gift, and like in spanish said
> ...



qflmao            .


----------



## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

Actually sunny like 1-2 years ago peK threatned me with a reply only ban, i don't think he's changed D:



back to studying for the drivers lisence


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## Undercovermc (Aug 17, 2007)

Jio said:


> I think it's good, to many people have a smug attitude to getting banned.


I  agree .


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Yea, pek didn't start breaking rules until he was modded.


----------



## Mori` (Aug 17, 2007)

Gah what a lot of repetitive crap to read through.

Lets start with the point about an announcement; yes from the perspective of using it as a deterrant it would probably have been more effective to make one clear, but regarding punishment it doesn't really change much. If you break the rules you are going to get punished, this option for punishment has always been available if we wanted to use it and it looks like its going to be applied more often in future to try and get a point across.

I would imagine for the vast majority of forum members they'll barely notice these changes to the rules because the vast majority of our members do obey the rules and if they break them it tends to be on accident or a one time offence. Its only a select few who seem to find it funny to get banned and they are going to be the ones this new rule applies to. Get banned for an accident and you aren't going to be in trouble, its deliberate and repetitive rule breaking that will (should) get you in trouble with this type of punishment.

There was a comment earlier about perm bans not seeming to be perm? Thats because contrary to popular belief the staff aren't monsters, all they are doing is trying to take care of the forums so that everyone can enjoy them. If someone behaves well and we think they will actually make an attempt to be a responsible and good forum member again then there's always a possibility they'll be let back in.

For those who the rep and post count halving was applied I wouldn't expect them to get them back, they shouldn't have knowingly broken the rules in the first place.


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Well I accidentally break the rules all the time


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## k1nj3 (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba stop talking like if you were god plz lol


----------



## DragonHeart52 (Aug 17, 2007)

monny's bitch said:


> Gooba stop talking like if you were god plz lol



That comment won't mean anything to him.  Goober's an atheist.


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

DragonHeart52 said:


> That comment really won't mean anything to him.  Goober's an atheist.



Gooba doesn't believe in me?


----------



## Fang (Aug 17, 2007)

I don't believe in you, Aaron. I know in you. So peK, if I get banned for flaming, will my rep get cut in half or will I be safe since it's like the first time I'll be banned?


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

God damn you Gooba, let me join the pimps group.


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## Crowe (Aug 17, 2007)

Depends on how severe it is to be honest, and I wouldn't expect you to have to "worry" about this since you haven't as bad history as some other members here have and as long as you don't fuck up really bad...Devil Akuma style, you'll only be banned.

It's like russian roulette. Those who have previous bans, have already used a few "shots" and are in far greater chance to shoot themselves.


----------



## Fang (Aug 17, 2007)

pek the villain said:


> Depends on how severe it is to be honest, and I wouldn't expect you to have to "worry" about this since you haven't as bad history as some other members here have and as long as you don't fuck up really bad...Devil Akuma style, you'll only be banned.
> 
> It's like russian roulette. Those who have previous bans, have already used a few "shots" and are in far greater chance to shoot themselves.



So first time bans mean you have immunity more or less given the case in general but other wise chronic b& posters are fucked? Right?


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

What if I shoot you


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## Freija (Aug 17, 2007)

so for example if i get banned for lets say flaming after being flamebaited(just mild flaming) would i get a cut?


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## Crowe (Aug 17, 2007)

You have far lesser chance to get this done to you if you are a first time offender but as said, a real fuck up like blenderite raid may lead to this even if you are a first time offender.




Freija said:


> so for example if i get banned for lets say flaming after being flamebaited(just mild flaming) would i get a cut?


Most likely not, but as said...russian roulette. We take things as they come, we can't tell you "you wont get this applied to if you break the rules this way or that" since that would lower the effect we want this to have.


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## Neji (Aug 17, 2007)

pek do you count me and someone who get b& alot??


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## Fang (Aug 17, 2007)

Okay, I just needed that clarification.


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Would you count me as someone who gets banned a lot?

I mean, I've turned a new leaf pek, I'm all about peace and harmony.


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## Crowe (Aug 17, 2007)

LET ME TELL YOU A SECRET, HOW NOT TO HAVE THIS HAPPEN TO YOU: Don't break the rules. :<


Neji said:


> pek do you count me and someone who get b& alot??


You got 6 bans noted in your usernotes...most very short but still...


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## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

I don't break the rules on purpose.


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## GrimaH (Aug 17, 2007)

> It's just only done to people who know they'll get banned for doing it and are doing it anyway *for the lulz*



I SAY IT IS A CONSPARACY AGAINST ANON, DO NOBODAY HEAR MEH!!!!!!!!!!


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## Kagakusha (Aug 17, 2007)

You guys still masturbating over this issue? lol


----------



## DragonHeart52 (Aug 17, 2007)

Kaga said:


> You guys still masturbating over this issue? lol



  Okay!!  Everybody out but Kaga!  No masturbating allowed outside the BH!!


----------



## Gooba (Aug 17, 2007)

> Anyway, Gooba, Pek, with all due respect, stop being such dicks and for once have some empathy for those you govern over. 2 years or so ago, you were once one of us teeming masses. Try and remember what it was like.


I do have empathy for those I govern over, mainly the 90% of the users who use the Naruto Ave and just want to talk about Naruto without having to wade through spam from the minority of members who use the Blender.  You guys might have the biggest e-peens and feel like you are the gods of the forum, but you aren't, you are a small minority and when you try and make this place worse for the real "teeming masses" in the NA I'm going to punish you in a way you won't laugh off.


----------



## Red (Aug 17, 2007)

This IS not FAIR.

I want my rep and post count to be reduced to NOTHING. Ive been BANNED in the past so why am I left OUT? I'm not important? Am I a NOBODY? oh god I feel UNLOVED.


----------



## Havoc (Aug 17, 2007)

Gooba said:


> I do have empathy for those I govern over, mainly the 90% of the users who use the Naruto Ave and just want to talk about Naruto without having to wade through spam from the minority of members who use the Blender.  You guys might have the biggest e-peens and feel like you are the gods of the forum, but you aren't, you are a small minority and when you try and make this place worse for the real "teeming masses" in the NA I'm going to punish you in a way you won't laugh off.



Every time I've been banned I never hurt anyone, I just tried to put a smile on the faces of all the little boys and girls.  Is that so wrong Gooba, is that so wrong?


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 17, 2007)

lol Gooba is generalizing

Havoc has an important job here. Talk about ungrateful, huh?


----------



## LivingHitokiri (Aug 18, 2007)

Thats means if i get 1 ban (any kind) im screwed because of my history right???


----------



## Mori` (Aug 18, 2007)

no LH, read the thread.

Its the context of your banning thats going to determine the punishment.


----------



## Uzumaki (Aug 18, 2007)

If your having rep rep? Delete or add? Or deletes If they have give me red rep and Add if they dont?


----------



## Vegitto-kun (Aug 18, 2007)

Setoshi said:


> Man everyone just needs to shut the fuck up.
> 
> You fucking members have been spoiled enough. You know how many chances people have been given here? And the amounts of favortism other members get here? I'm already tired of "oh what about GB and U.YB and Battledome they do things that we can't do" stop pointing fingers and worry about yourself, becauses that's all you need to worry for in a forum.
> 
> ...




You speak the truth. Sometimes the staff just wont perm ban somebody who deserves it because they are "popular"


----------



## Freija (Aug 18, 2007)

Seto we're really most pissed about the no announcation


----------



## Vegitto-kun (Aug 18, 2007)

Freija said:


> Seto we're really most pissed about the no announcation



That is something I agree with, though you guys shouldn't be doing anything banable anyway.


----------



## Freija (Aug 18, 2007)

Perhaps, but the annouciations are there for stuff like new rules etc


----------



## Vegitto-kun (Aug 18, 2007)

Freija said:


> Perhaps, but the annouciations are there for stuff like new rules etc



The mods might of wanted to fuck you guys in the ass with the not announcing part


----------



## Freija (Aug 18, 2007)

like we've said a couple of times


----------



## Vegitto-kun (Aug 18, 2007)

I am glad that im not a blenderite


----------



## Gooba (Aug 18, 2007)

I'm not making an announcement "Punishments aren't fun."


----------



## Vegitto-kun (Aug 18, 2007)

Gooba said:


> I'm not making an announcement "Punishments aren't fun."



Too lazy? Or is it fun when people go wtf after their ban period is over?


----------



## Freija (Aug 18, 2007)

he likes to torture blenderiteswe're cop killers


----------



## Vegitto-kun (Aug 18, 2007)

Freija said:


> he likes to torture blenderiteswe're cop killers



funny thing is I know somebody who got banned over 3 times for harrasing and flamebaiting members, that person got unbanned after 2 days even when one of the bans was supposed to be 2 month, why? Probably because the member is popular.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 18, 2007)

Vegitto-kun said:


> Too lazy? Or is it fun when people go wtf after their ban period is over?


Not worth wasting the announcement space on something that will only affect maybe 5-10 people ever.


----------



## Vegitto-kun (Aug 18, 2007)

Gooba said:


> Not worth wasting the announcement space on something that will only affect maybe 5-10 people ever.



People not knowing might cause the group to grow :amazed


----------



## Last of the Arrancar (Aug 18, 2007)

So who's considered a Blenderite and who is not? Is there a black list?


----------



## DragonHeart52 (Aug 18, 2007)

Vegitto-kun said:


> People not knowing might cause the group to grow :amazed



I think the word is pretty much out there for the habitual offenders.  This will become like an urban legend on NF.  There are IM discussions about this particular punishment going on that don't even appear in this thread.  The unanticipated reaction on the admins' part to deliberate repeat offenses by forum members has served its point.  And the admins are within bounds to apply it.

"Don't do the crime if you can't do the time" is an old expression that points out considering the consequences of actions.  In the case of these few, ban time wasn't adequate, but "time" expressed as earned post count and rep points did get the message across.  Great call on the part of the staff!!  I'd rep you all for it, but this darned system won't let me.  



Last of the Arrancar said:


> So who's considered a Blenderite and who is not? Is there a black list?



The situation being discussed isn't about Blenderites, it's about habitual deliberate breakers of NF rules.  Just because someone makes an accusation in the first post doesn't make that accusation true.  If you haven't had time yet, read the thread for the admin members' responses.


----------



## Zaru (Aug 18, 2007)

Last of the Arrancar said:


> So who's considered a Blenderite and who is not? Is there a black list?



They said it's not only blenderites -_-


----------



## Last of the Arrancar (Aug 18, 2007)

> They said it's not only blenderites -_-



Damn 

So if some dumb bitch complains about a neg again then I'm screwed?


----------



## Gooba (Aug 18, 2007)

The black list of people who get this is just anyone I personally dislike.


----------



## SENTINEL (Aug 18, 2007)

I am surprised this thread is not closed..Interesting.. aka..mod vs mod..lol


----------



## Gooba (Aug 18, 2007)

I don't like closing threads, sometimes real discussion is still left in them.


----------



## SENTINEL (Aug 18, 2007)

I would say something smart about that..but I was distracted by your sparkly name...


----------



## Vegitto-kun (Aug 18, 2007)

I do have a question to gooba, why is somebody who harrased, insulted and flamebaited and got banned over 3 times not perm banned? While these people get punished so badly


----------



## Last of the Arrancar (Aug 18, 2007)

> I would say something smart about that..but I was distracted by your sparkly name...



Suckup ....


----------



## SENTINEL (Aug 18, 2007)

Setoshi for mod...it's that simple..no arguing about it or debating....


I wasn't here on the raid days..but
I feel on the drama..in the blender..this days..TOO MUCH...yet I'm always somehow in the midst of it.


----------



## Freija (Aug 18, 2007)

Setoshi said:


> Who cares?
> 
> You said yourself you don't like Saosin and Devil Akuma, why waste your time defending them? The staff won't change there opinion. Worry about yourself, you're probably next on the list to get your repped halfed.
> 
> ...


Esca and HI suffered the same concequenses which is why im defending ESCA AND HI


----------



## kidloco (Aug 18, 2007)

i think every new punished to need be announce (dont come like robotech.com, they really is worst :scary)

and one thing, i have see worst poeple in others part of the forums (im a vagaabundo walking in the street of NF lol) and i have much of the thread go offtopic very fast nad spam, in that place of tlak about naruto and ect, when one said sasuke is suck for that reason because is wat that person think, is get very fast flame and whine and worst much neg wihtout name and one tried to defent that person get the ban or ect while who begin the flame for no reason got away and much are very constant about it, while one who can said is know is getting ban very fast while other not popular but know about the flaming go away

how that?

ok the thing is, not everyone get that, undestand that

only repeating breakrules

but, is only who you know an dont like or everyone break rules who have more bans get the same?

because what i know in every forum of NF have they black sheep

but hwat i see is only in the bledner get that

yeah i know is not only blenderite, but why not do that to the rest?

eh?

only asking


----------



## SENTINEL (Aug 18, 2007)

Kidloco...I am glad you supporting the cause..in your special way..

Gooba...stop drinking mountain dew...


----------



## Gooba (Aug 18, 2007)

Vegitto-kun said:


> I do have a question to gooba, why is somebody who harrased, insulted and flamebaited and got banned over 3 times not perm banned? While these people get punished so badly


Because we don't like permming people.



Setoshi said:


> When a cop arrests a criminal they don't randomly shoot someone in the face, there are steps the cops need to follow and not create new rules just as the person gets arrested.


If they arrest someone they punish them.  They can do either fines, community service, or jail depending on which fits the situation better.  In this instance, fines to the rep/pc are in order.



> I'm 99% percent sure if the members knew about this new rule before "spamming" the library, they wouldn't have "spammed".


The fact that this is probably true makes me want to cut their rep/postcounts just because they are horrible members if that is indeed the case.

Punishments should not be important, rules should be obeyed because they are the rules.


----------



## DragonHeart52 (Aug 18, 2007)

Setoshi said:


> Who cares?
> 
> *DragonHeart52:* You haven't been seen on NF for months a you're randomly gonna pop up and start praising? You have no idea what the members gone through nor you know the entire situation. You only know the staff's side of the story.
> 
> ...



Just because I'm not posting doesn't mean I'm not around or that I don't know what's going on.  One of the reasons I'm not as active posting as in the past is 
(1)  same old stuff gets re-hashed and re-hashed over and over in discussions.  That becomes boring.  I don't express opinions on matters when I don't have a background in the area, such as the BD.

(2)  What you've been through?  On a forum?  Boo-hoo.  When you have some real life tragedy and loss to talk about, contact me then.  Chances are you'll get a sympathetic ear.  In the meantime, how about some perspective?  People deliberately broke the rules and they got a punishment that finally sunk in.  Punishments are deterrants.  You can have fun here and enjoy the people you meet without acting like self-centered attention-mongering assholes, which is the type of behavior that has caused this situation to begin with.  Better to learn that lesson here than in real life with real consequences.  Also, who are you to judge the worthiness of my opinions?  Most of my posts are in FCs, where they don't count.  "Chattiness" doesn't necessarily equate with deep thought or consideration of a situation from all sides.

A rich e-life is great.  It's given me the opportunity to meet some great people I would have never known otherwise.  To limit oneself to that and that alone is not a wise choice.  Step back and take a deep breath and consider the big picture of your entire life.  Outside of the people you met that you like here, occurrences in this little fantasy island aren't really that big a deal.


----------



## Last of the Arrancar (Aug 18, 2007)

Kidloco I´ve become you´re devoted fan!! Hilarious!


----------



## SENTINEL (Aug 18, 2007)

Gooba....How do you punish mods...!?


----------



## Crowe (Aug 18, 2007)

Random admin creates a dupe and spams, said mods section section and telling him/her then to keep their section clean or get demodded.


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## SENTINEL (Aug 18, 2007)

Thanks pek.


----------



## Yellow (Aug 18, 2007)

Hey DragonHeart52, what about when those punishments don't matter anymore?

Like me. I got my post count cut which was the only thing I had going for me on the forum so I don't care if they want to cut it again or cut my rep. Not like my rep is anything significant anyways. It just doesn't matter to me anymore because I really have nothing to lose.

How do you punish someone like me?


----------



## Gooba (Aug 18, 2007)

Yellow said:


> Hey DragonHeart52, what about when those punishments don't matter anymore?
> 
> Like me. I got my post count cut which was the only thing I had going for me on the forum so I don't care if they want to cut it again or cut my rep. Not like my rep is anything significant anyways. It just doesn't matter to me anymore because I really have nothing to lose.
> 
> How do you punish someone like me?


I don't see how that shows our system is bad.  If banning itself doesn't bother you, then nothing we could do before post/rep cuts would matter either.  At least this way we get 1 effective punishment in.


----------



## Vegitto-kun (Aug 18, 2007)

Gooba said:


> Because we don't like permming people.
> 
> If they arrest someone they punish them.  They can do either fines, community service, or jail depending on which fits the situation better.  In this instance, fines to the rep/pc are in order.
> 
> ...



Talk about weak punishments, so people can harrass other members as long as they are popular doesn't matter they will be unbanned after a day or two.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 18, 2007)

The popularity doesn't factor into it.  Pretty much the only perms are ad accounts, dupes, people who have posted porn (and sometimes they get off), and a few uber-trolls like LotU and Jiraiya_Sama aka Yakushi~Kabuto.

And yes, a lot of our bans are soft, this thread is an example of what happens when we are more heavy handed.


----------



## Yellow (Aug 18, 2007)

Gooba said:


> I don't see how that shows our system is bad.  If banning itself doesn't bother you, then nothing we could do before post/rep cuts would matter either.  At least this way we get 1 effective punishment in.



I wasn't saying it's bad. I was just asking what punishment he/she would suggest for someone who doesn't have anything to lose anymore.

Ok. I see your point about the 1 effective punishment.

Also infractions are the dumbest form of punishment I've ever seen. I mean seriously how does an infraction convince me not to break the rule again?

I loled the when Suzuhiko gave me my infraction. I was scared at first because I didn't know what in infraction would do but then I was like "lol WTF it didn't do anything to me at all." 

So yeah what's the point of infractions?


----------



## Gooba (Aug 18, 2007)

> I mean seriously how does an infraction convince me not to break the rule again?


It is supposed to inform you that the actions you have done are against the rules, and then that is supposed to make you not want to break them.


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 18, 2007)

Still same issue? Just another 2 cents about this: 

lol Gooba, why, with your imagination, you only look at this issue from the POV of the staff, although you ask for us to look at it also from the POV of the other side? Take your own advice. Its not realistic to think that forum members follow the rules because of the rules. Nor is it realistic to think (all) humans follow the rules because those are the rules. 

Fear of punishment is an awesome and efficient deterrent, it is even better for the staff, and it would be for the best for both staff and members if the rules and the punishments were clear; the rules for obvious reasons (we wanna know what's forbidden, what's allowed etc. just like the staff want to make it clear what can and can't be done), and punishments, because the fear of severe penalties can stop 'spammers' dead in their tracks and the staff has little need to deal with (at least) this type of BS after execution of the penalties.

I know mods (or maybe its just you, Gooba) like to think every member follows the rules because they are the rules, and you come up with wonderful statistics saying that 90% or so are saints. Although I don't have such wonderful numbers to back my claim, I doubt yours are right, and I bet my one precious testicle that the fear of punishment is also a major part for members to behave (lol look at what happened at the April Fool's joke ). Humans aren't saints. And the amount of crap you need to endure depend in large part on your own actions, i.e. this complaining because the lack of announcements. This is the way of the world; if you wanna work with rules, regulations and punishments, then it is obviously handy to make the community you rule over acquainted with these rules, regulations, punishments etc. And another real life lesson for you: to know what the punishments are, IS important in any kind of 'legal system' (for reasons stated above; deterring future crimes and avoiding BS after the execution). To not announce these things gives nothing but trouble.

if kidloqo was a catgirl I would rape him... her... >.>


----------



## Yellow (Aug 18, 2007)

Gooba said:


> It is supposed to inform you that the actions you have done are against the rules, and then that is supposed to make you not want to break them.



 

*Spoiler*: __ 




Oh God, stop making me laugh so hard.




Infractions are the most ineffective form of punishment there is. A 1 day ban would be more intimidating than an infraction. And if the infraction informs me I've done something wrong then why did Suzuhiko Pm me after giving me my infraction to tell me I did something wrong? I mean if the infraction is supposed to let me know I did something wrong then she had no need to PM telling me the same thing again now did she?


And I agree with Susano-o that you should make that rule more well know. Even though according to you this rule will only ever apply to about 5-10 people I think these 5-10 people deserve to know of this rule.

Also were you the one that cut my post count?



SENTINEL404 said:


> susano is made of WIN..



Ok. That's true but GTFO if your not gonna contribute anything constructive to the thread.


----------



## Gooba (Aug 18, 2007)

The problem is that we do things on a case by case basis, and thus have a lot of flexibility in every area of punishment, and even what is bannable/what is not.  It isn't even like we made up some new punishment, rep/postcount cuts have happened for at least 2 years now.  We just chose to use them in this one situation.  Making announcements about every punishment for every case would require a ton of them daily.  The government doesn't put out public service announcements on every channel every time a judge gives someone a fine, and we shouldn't either.


----------



## SENTINEL (Aug 18, 2007)

Listen to susano...truth was spoken.


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 18, 2007)

It's not about stating announcements for every case. That would indeed be ridiculous. I actually meant general guidelines, as you CAN find in lawbooks/government guidelines w/e (or in the current announcements about the other, known, rules, for that matter). 

Of course, lawbooks, just like announcements, can't cover all aspects and all cases, and that is where your judgment comes in, which we have to respect (or which we can argue with in complaints threads) since you are part of the staff. But it is possible to explicitly name the possible punishments and implicitly 'explain' where such punishments are fit. For instance, a 'list' or a paragraph about what could lead to a ban as a kind of rigid part of the rules, and a notice/disclaimer that in certain cases, where the staff deems a ban is not enough (like this case), other instruments like rep cuts or post count reductions will be used (just like how you explained in your previous posts, Gooba; liek, copy the content of one of your explanatory posts and modify it a little, and add it to the rules thread, and there would not have been a problem, and possibly, no offenses to punish). 

In the current issue rep cuts have been unknown to the offenders, and they were in no position to find out about these penalties; to continue with the real life analogy, they couldn't read it in a law book and although there may have been cases where you used this 'new' instrument before, this 'jurisprudence' or information about these previous cases isn't (easily) accessible to members (I assume), so really, for them, rep cuts and the like fell like thunder out of the clear blue sky.


----------



## GrimaH (Aug 18, 2007)

Normally I side with the blenderites, but I do think that now that things have been explained pretty clearly there's no need to sweat out and go bonkers over all the small stuff. Really, to me it seems fair, and as long as there isn't any case where a smod/admin abuses this rule, I'm fine with it, and I really don't see the need to continue to feel so mean against the staff for it.


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 18, 2007)

I'm not really angry or anything (seeing as how this issue really does not concern me that much, aside from the donation thing, but that is already dealt with), lol to be honest, for me this just started as a practice/exercise argument (since I can't use the library or cafe for these kinds of things with fanatics out there , so this is the only sane place to verbally have some 'fun' arguing). I also don't really see these actions as abuse, and if the victims of this case can't be pardoned, so be it; I just honestly think announcing stuff gives less trouble for all.


----------



## DragonHeart52 (Aug 18, 2007)

Tazmo'money said:


> It's not about stating announcements for every case. That would indeed be ridiculous. I actually meant general guidelines, as you CAN find in lawbooks/government guidelines w/e (or in the current announcements about the other, known, rules, for that matter).
> 
> Of course, lawbooks, just like announcements, can't cover all aspects and all cases, and that is where your judgment comes in, which we have to respect (or which we can argue with in complaints threads) since you are part of the staff. But it is possible to explicitly name the possible punishments and implicitly 'explain' where such punishments are fit. For instance, a 'list' or a paragraph about what could lead to a ban as a kind of rigid part of the rules, and a notice/disclaimer that in certain cases, where the staff deems a ban is not enough (like this case), other instruments like rep cuts or post count reductions will be used (just like how you explained in your previous posts, Gooba; liek, copy the content of one of your explanatory posts and modify it a little, and add it to the rules thread, and there would not have been a problem, and possibly, no offenses to punish).
> 
> In the current issue rep cuts have been unknown to the offenders, and they were in no position to find out about these penalties; to continue with the real life analogy, they couldn't read it in a law book and although there may have been cases where you used this 'new' instrument before, this 'jurisprudence' or information about these previous cases isn't (easily) accessible to members (I assume), so really, for them, rep cuts and the like fell like thunder out of the clear blue sky.




Why is it forum members think this place is a democracy and has to follow the rules of whatever US. European, or other government system they live under in their day to day lives?  It's a freaking database with a cute little GUI that exists for a particular purpose.  Nothing we have here is a right - only assigned privileges.  By their very natures, FORUMS ARE DICTATORSHIPS!!  Fortunately for NF, our dictators (admins) are darned benevolent.  They aren't under any obligation to post special warnings (how many of us read the rules daily??  Even if it says "new rules", most of us are too interested in checking to see if our friends are around or if anything new has been posted in our individual areas of special interest).  Just think about it in terms of read, write, edit, create, delete...got the picture??  

Ladies and gentlemen: welcome to the Matrix.  

There is no legal obligation with three branches of government with specific powers blah blah blah.  Posting the rules, giving guidelines for banning, etc. are courtesies to let people know the expected behaviors.  We should be glad they are willing to look at problem posters on a case by case basis and to discuss reasons for their actions.  The admins have been a lot more tolerant here than they are at other forums.  





> Hey DragonHeart52, what about when those punishments don't matter anymore?
> 
> Like me. I got my post count cut which was the only thing I had going for me on the forum so I don't care if they want to cut it again or cut my rep. Not like my rep is anything significant anyways. It just doesn't matter to me anymore because I really have nothing to lose.
> 
> How do you punish someone like me?



Uh... I don't, fella.    I haven't been assigned those privileges to your particular entry in the overall database.  If I had them, with your luck ,you'd hit me on a bad day and I'd hit the big bad DELETE button.  That's why I would never agree to be something like a forum mod/smod/admin.  Too much fire in my inherent makeup.  

However, since you _are_ looking for suggestions, here is a newsflash:  YOU decide your behavior and YOU decide your reactions to whatever others might do in response to your behavior.  Seriously, if your rep and post count on a forum is all you have going for you, I pity you.  Get out while you still can!!


----------



## Susano-o (Aug 18, 2007)

I'm not saying this should be a democracy. You don't see me voting for mods (except in the Blender lol). I'm saying that as long as you want to keep up (at least the appearances of) being a rule based system, it would be handy to let these rules be publicly known, lest you work against your own ideal scenario. Now listen well: My intention is not to bash the staff, I am merely offering suggestions. I'm well aware that they can ignore my advice and I won't lose any sleep if they choose to. Also, these forums aren't dictatorships, especially not when you have a group of more or less equals ruling over a place. And I am well aware that we're not in the worst forum on the Internet.

About the part of expected behaviors: that is exactly my point. It is in the staff's interest to have clear guidelines, so the community behaves in predictable fashion (not including possible offenders). If there is any inclination to work with guidelines etc., then what I'm doing is merely giving advice to do it better. 

FYI even the Matrix has rules . EVERY system has, its about the accessibility of these rules we're talking about. But really, I'm off now (I believe I said that a few posts back, too ).


----------



## Masaki (Aug 18, 2007)

I love how the person who started this thread got out of a perm ban.


----------



## DragonHeart52 (Aug 18, 2007)

Masaki said:


> I love how the person who started this thread got out of a perm ban.



Yeah.  I think the reason for that was given in a response by Gooba somewhere in this thread.



> FYI even the Matrix has rules  . EVERY system has, its about the accessibility of these rules we're talking about. But really, I'm off now (I believe I said that a few posts back, too ).



The Matrix has _perceived_ rules for those that dwell there, but those aren't really all the rules of the Matrix, are they??  Break them and Smith dupes come after you and I don't know kung fu.  

Admins have the ability to use their judgement when it comes to deterring repeat offenders without necessarily giving advance notice.  If just knowing _that_ stops people from stepping outside the rules, then so be it.  It's like old-fashioned child-rearing.  The kid knows the boundaries and the punishments.  If that doesn't deter the behavior, the parents can and will pull out something that does matter, with no advance notice required.  The undesired behavior on the kid's part ceases.  End of story.  The parent's have added a new potential punishment to the list for future infractions and they can continue to add new ones as needed and apply the ones that are most effective.  That is behavior modification, not the legal system, and it is behavior modification that is being attempted here.


----------



## ssj3boruto (Aug 18, 2007)

This is certainly some great work making an issue seem a lot more complicated and long winded than it is.


----------



## Havoc (Aug 18, 2007)

Will my rep be cut in half the next time I get banned?


----------



## DragonHeart52 (Aug 18, 2007)

Havoc said:


> Will my rep be cut in half the next time I get banned?



  With your luck, they'll probably go for body parts...very sensitive body parts.  They need some trophies for the HR game room wall.

@Shrooms:  I'm just feeling a bit chatty, that's all.  Blame Goober.  He dropped out of an IM early and there is still blood flow to my hands.


----------



## Havoc (Aug 19, 2007)

Will you keep defending me?


----------



## Merciless (Aug 19, 2007)

What in the hell is a blenderite?


----------



## Shiron (Aug 19, 2007)

SSJ4 said:


> What in the hell is a blenderite?


A person who regularly posts in the Konoha Blender section of the forum.


----------



## Merciless (Aug 19, 2007)

Shiron said:


> A person who regularly posts in the Konoha Blender section of the forum.



Good god...

What a steamy pile of horse ****


----------



## Iria (Aug 19, 2007)

Hey now...

People like to judge the blender having never spent an appreciable amount of time there.

Its less about the "geography" and more about the sense of community.

That is why when one of us is affected by an issue, our sense of loyalty comes out and we all like to express our opinions


----------



## Vegitto-kun (Aug 19, 2007)

SSJ4 said:


> What in the hell is a blenderite?



People who get targeted by the staff constantly


----------



## Shiron (Aug 19, 2007)

Only when they give us reason to though, which seems to happen frequently.

And we don't ban people and such because their blenderites or anything; we ban them because they were people who broke the rules who happened to be Blenderites. The fact that they are Blenderites had nothing to do with them getting punished; the fact that they broke the rules did.


----------



## Spanish Hoffkage (Aug 19, 2007)

lol, what kind of things i miss


----------



## Fang (Aug 19, 2007)

Suiton Hasselhoff said:


> lol, what kind of things i miss



If you get b& for the sake of "lawlz b&" you lose half your rep and post count for doing that shit. Esca and Dave both are b& and lost half their rep and post count.


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## Gooba (Aug 19, 2007)

> People who get targeted by the staff constantly


Want us to stop targeting the blender?  Stop making it _so easy_ for us to find excuses to ban you.

I'm not saying that we actually are targeting you, _we aren't_, but you know that not breaking the rules would make it very hard for us to do anything even if we wanted to.


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## Vegitto-kun (Aug 19, 2007)

Gooba said:


> Want us to stop targeting the blender?  Stop making it _so easy_ for us to find excuses to ban you.
> 
> I'm not saying that we actually are targeting you, _we aren't_, but you know that not breaking the rules would make it very hard for us to do anything even if we wanted to.



oy oy oy

I am not a blenderite


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## Gooba (Aug 19, 2007)

I was using the plural you for all the blenderites in the thread.


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## cupnoodles (Aug 19, 2007)

wait..when does one get labeled as a blenderite? :S


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## Crowe (Aug 19, 2007)

When your tits start to hang below your waist.

True story.

Ontopic: A good explanation would be - We liked to fuck make you cry. Nothing makes me more happier then to see a glass of boiling hot tears standing on my table when i wake up.


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## Iria (Aug 19, 2007)

its a subtle transition from being a normal functioning member of society and being a blenderite

mostly you just have to post there alot

the neurological/dermatological changes come later


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## Vegitto-kun (Aug 19, 2007)

Iria said:


> its a subtle transition from being a normal functioning member of society and being a blenderite
> 
> mostly you just have to post there alot
> 
> the neurological/dermatological changes come later



and then the modfucks come


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## Crowe (Aug 19, 2007)

... and how often does blender get mod fucked nowadays...? *sigh* noob


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## Vegitto-kun (Aug 19, 2007)

pek the villain said:


> ... and how often does blender get mod fucked nowadays...? *sigh* noob



How can I know I don't go to the blender anymore


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## Iria (Aug 19, 2007)

Its true...there hasn't been a good mod fucking in awhile.

In fact the only time the mods really talk to us is when something like this happens, and they reprimand us T___T

Which is probably why these threads last so long


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## Susano-o (Aug 19, 2007)

I've got hanging mantits. Milk me.


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## Crowe (Aug 19, 2007)

I tend to walk by Blender when I've rep sealed / banned / closed a thread which a blenderite was active in, just to laugh. True story


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## Iria (Aug 19, 2007)

ladies and gentlemen of the jury exhibit A ^


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## Masaki (Aug 19, 2007)

Iria said:


> ladies and gentlemen of the jury exhibit A ^



I told you already you should switch to law school, didn't I?


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## Vegitto-kun (Aug 19, 2007)

mmm hot law person


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## Buskuv (Aug 19, 2007)

Imagine that, anything that has the Blender in the topic of conversation inevitably becomes that which it tries to avoid.  Irony makes me lol.

My man tits are not saggy, unfortunately.


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## Ippy (Aug 20, 2007)

Just to start out, let me say that I don't care either way about this decision nor how it was conducted.  It doesn't affect me, in any way, shape, or form.

What I just wanted to touch on is many people's complaint that there was no prior warning, and I believe Gooba replied with something along the lines of "With all of the staff decisions that get made, it wouldn't be reasonable to announce them all," but what I have to say is... why not?

Would it be _that_ difficult to just post a thread somewhere in this section that lists all of the recent staff decisions and rules not important enough to be added to the FAQ?  

You could just keep it locked 24/7, so whenever a new rule comes up, an smod+ could post a new rule in it, and people looking to see what's up won't have to wade through dozens upon dozens of people bitching about the new rule(which could be done in separate threads... like it is now).

*edit:* This way, *no one* has an excuse.

I just say this because a lot of times we never find out about rules until we're actually breaking them, or through hearsay.  

Just to once again reiterate, I don't care at all about this decision nor how it was conducted.


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## Gooba (Aug 20, 2007)

> What I just wanted to touch on is many people's complaint that there was no prior warning, and I believe Gooba replied with something along the lines of "With all of the staff decisions that get made, it wouldn't be reasonable to announce them all," but what I have to say is... why not?


The thing is, what would we have announced here prior?  We didn't know we were going to ban them with this punishment prior, so we couldn't really announce it any more than we can announce what we will decide tomorrow.  As soon as we did do it to them we did announce it, apparently me and Pek both did.  And I am not sure what we would have posted in that thread beforehand, "punishments we have used for 2 years can still be used."


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## Ippy (Aug 20, 2007)

*shrugs*

I just think it would make _everyone's_ e-lives easier if you did something like that, staff and normal members.

Note that I'm only talking about _future_ rules that you might think of.  I haven't been paying attention to the full details of this issue, nor do I really care.

I've just been lurking in here to read the e-drama, when I thought of a quick idea after reading some of the complaints, is all.


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## Gooba (Aug 20, 2007)

We are going to update the rules to include stuff like this, but I'm just warning you that almost all of our policy decision are reactive, so prior warning is really difficult since we usually see a problem, and make a solution right then.  Like in this case, they did that spam and we ran in to the problem of a ban not being punishment.  I have a feeling no matter how hard we try to warn you ahead of time there will always be one instance of a new rule before we could announce.

Then again, this whole thing doesn't come up very often.  This is one of very few punishments that isn't a regular ban.


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## Sasori (Aug 20, 2007)

What happens if a person with 1 post and 1 reppoint does it?


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## Gooba (Aug 20, 2007)

Perm         ban.


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## Sasori (Aug 20, 2007)

lol then in a way, that person beat the system 

Gooba, give me a good site for Proxys so I can play this plan out


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## Gooba (Aug 20, 2007)

www.knowthatIknowyourplanproxieswon'thelp.com


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## Sasori (Aug 20, 2007)

Rick Roll'd?


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## GrimaH (Aug 20, 2007)

Thread over.
And Veggito-kun, update your sig for God's sake.


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## Havoc (Aug 20, 2007)

What if the person has full red bars, would you take off half?


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## Iria (Aug 20, 2007)

Maybe if the person has full red, it would move in the positive direction since to take away negative reputation is to pos


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## Gooba (Aug 20, 2007)

Probably not.


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## Havoc (Aug 20, 2007)

What happens if they have zero posts because they only post in sections where posts don't count?


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## Crowe (Aug 20, 2007)

Thread reached enough faggotry level. I'll close this with a message from the bottom of my ass heart.

DIE BLENDERITE DIE. DIE DIE DIE...PLZ DIE. OMG BLENDER SHOULD BURRRRRN... I'LL MAKE YOUR TIME HERE A LVIING HELL, FUCK BLENDER.


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