# Armless Itachi vs Tsunade & Orochimaru



## Ersa (Aug 10, 2013)

*Location*: CE Stadium
*Distance*: 10m
*Mindset*: BL (Itachi knows he's at a disadvantage with no arms).
*Knowledge*: Manga
*Restrictions*: Koto, Izanami, Itachi's arms, Edo Tensei.

- Itachi has lost his arms.
- Itachi has perfect eyesight (will deteriorate with MS use), is healthy.
- This Zetsu Orochimaru.


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## Octavian (Aug 10, 2013)

Not sure why Itachi needs arms in the first place when he has Susano'o  He wins


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## Ersa (Aug 10, 2013)

Because Itachi is Sannin level


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## Dil (Aug 10, 2013)

Itachi already took out Orochimaru without the use of his arms with Genjutsu and Susanoo (Totsuka sword), so he will suffer the same fate as usual. It's just bad putting Orochimaru against Itachi with the treatment Oro has received from him 

And he will just Tsukiyomi Tsunade.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Dil said:


> Itachi already took out Orochimaru without the use of his arms with Genjutsu and Susanoo (Totsuka sword), so he will suffer the same fate as usual. It's just bad putting Orochimaru against Itachi with the treatment Oro has received from him
> 
> And he will just Tsukiyomi Tsunade.


Orochimaru doesn't have the knowledge he has now.  He won't go down easy!

Tsunade can easily heal mental dmg.  He would do more harm to himself, than Tsunade or Orochimaru.


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

There's really nothing stopping Itachi from just running up and making a kebob out of them both with the Totsuka no Tsurugi.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Nikushimi said:


> There's really nothing stopping Itachi from just running up and making a kebob out of them both with the Totsuka no Tsurugi.



Other than the fact they casually side step it?


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Other than the fact they casually side step it?



Orochimaru's already proven that he can't do that, and he's faster than Tsunade.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

He didn't know what it was...  He thought it was a normal sword attack which he could tank NP.
Orochimaru is the wisest shinobi by far in the series. I am sure he won't fall for the same trick twice, and will have numerous counters ready.


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Orochimaru is the wisest shinobi by far in the series. I am sure he won't fall for the same trick twice, and will have numerous counters ready.



Just like the last two times he fought Itachi.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

So he fell into 1 genjutsu, big whoop.


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> So he fell into 1 genjutsu, big whoop.



Technically two. 

EDIT: Three if you count Sasugay.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

He won't fall for that again, and even if he did 2 on 1 + slugs + prep.

EDIT:  Actually itachi doesn't even have arms to cast a genjutsu with.  All he has is his eyes, in which case all they have to do is not look into them.


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## Dil (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> He didn't know what it was...  He thought it was a normal sword attack which he could tank NP.
> Orochimaru is the wisest shinobi by far in the series. I am sure he won't fall for the same trick twice, and will have numerous counters ready.



Oro won't even have the balls to approach Itachi since he had knowledge now from getting beat twice, by the same guy. Itachi owned him and made him run away from Akatsuki.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Dil said:


> Oro won't even have the balls to approach Itachi since he had knowledge now from getting beat twice, by the same guy. Itachi owned him and made him run away from Akatsuki.



He didn't run away.  He was smart enough to not stay and be used, especially when he knew he couldn't get what he wanted.


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> He won't fall for that again, and even if he did 2 on 1 + slugs + prep.



The great thing about the Totsuka no Tsurugi is that it's big enough for both of them at the same time. And there's plenty of room in the bottle.


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

You're not fooling anyone, Vice.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Idk it seems kind of dumb to assume he can land that sword attack easily, especially when they have knowledge to avoid it.


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## Ennoia (Aug 10, 2013)

Either Sanin can solo and I dont hold Tsunade's abilities in high regard. I dont even think Itachi is taking this with his arms to say he can do it without them.


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## Dil (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Idk it seems kind of dumb to assume he can land that sword attack easily.



But he did, twice, against Oro and Nagato. Both ended up in the bottle


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Dil said:


> But he did, twice, against Oro and Nagato. Both ended up in the bottle



Nagato's legs were nearly obliterated in his battle with hanzou.  He basically cant even walk on his own.


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Idk it seems kind of dumb to assume he can land that sword attack easily, especially when they have knowledge to avoid it.



I'm sure Orochimaru thought the same thing before Itachi did it. 



Ennoia said:


> Either Sanin can solo and I dont hold Tsunade's abilities in high regard. I dont even think Itachi is taking this with his arms to say he can do it without them.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

WTF does that basketball player head mean?


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## Dil (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Nagato's legs were nearly obliterated in his battle with hanzou.  He basically cant even walk on his own.



hitting Sasuke with Amaterasu





jesusjuice69 said:


> WTF does that basketball player head mean?


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> WTF does that basketball player head mean?



   
--  
---- 
------


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## Yagura (Aug 10, 2013)

Nikushimi said:


> Technically two.



When was the second time?


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)




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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

Yagura said:


> When was the second time?



Inside the Totsuka gourd.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Dil said:


> hitting Sasuke with Amaterasu



What did that show exactly?  Him standing there?
He couldn't fucking walk dude.  He was using itachi as a crutch to walk.  He told naruto he couldn't move on his own, and then used a summoning animal.


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> What did that show exactly?  Him standing there?
> He couldn't fucking walk dude.  He was using itachi as a crutch to walk.  He told naruto he couldn't move on his own, and then used a summoning animal.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Itachi can't even beat Konohamaru or Tenten!


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)




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## kyla1718 (Aug 10, 2013)

Obviously an itachi wank thread..........     

If itachi has his arms he would win this with high difficulty, and it would take some time. Both orochimaru and tsunade are highly resilient. Also orochimaru and tsunade have worked together for years so they know how to compliment eachother and work together. Itachi stomps one of these sannin alone WITH his arms, but together it is much more difficult for him. Without arms he is done, he could probably be soloed by Tsunade. Susanno is no protection to itachi with tsunade there, he would needs his arms to to perform his jutsu to prevent that train wreck from crumbling him.  Shoot as much Amaterasu at tsunade as you want, it will eventually kill her, but you don't want her running at you with that on her. Good luck getting away with no arms and a flaming ball running at you waiting to catch you on fire as well as punch your head off.  Frankly I think tsunade is more of a threat to itachi than orochimaru is. Itachi is oros weakness.


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## LostSelf (Aug 10, 2013)

Itachi can beat Tsunade with one jutsu.

The thing is if he can beat Orochimaru without arms. Only Totsuka would be effective against him (Or sharingan genjutsu followed by Totsuka), but Oro having knowledge on both and knowing Itachi can't make clones, he might try to be away from him. However, if he does that, Itachi just has to deactivate Susano'o and that's it. It doesn't have to be him rampaging on the offensive.


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## Ennoia (Aug 10, 2013)

Itachi is not Orochimaru's weakness, Orochimaru's weakness is himself.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

kyla1718 said:


> Obviously an itachi wank thread..........
> 
> If itachi has his arms he would win this with high difficulty, and it would take some time. Both orochimaru and tsunade are highly resilient. Also orochimaru and tsunade have worked together for years so they know how to compliment eachother and work together. Itachi stomps one of these sannin alone WITH his arms, but together it is much more difficult for him. Without arms he is done, he could probably be soloed by Tsunade. Susanno is no protection to itachi with tsunade there, he would needs his arms to to perform his jutsu to prevent that train wreck from crumbling him.  Shoot as much Amaterasu at tsunade as you want, it will eventually kill her, but you don't want her running at you with that on her. Good luck getting away with no arms and a flaming ball running at you waiting to catch you on fire as well as punch your head off.  Frankly I think tsunade is more of a threat to itachi than orochimaru is. Itachi is oros weakness.



He wouldn't win even with his arms. 
No chance in hell.

You make a good point though.   
Itachi was Kyptonite to Orochimaru!  People underestimate him greatly because of it.  Simply put he got lucky a couple times!  That's it!  Don't underestimate Orochimaru!


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

Ennoia said:


> Itachi is not Orochimaru's weakness, Orochimaru's weakness is himself.



That is anybody's weakness when they fight Itachi. 



jesusjuice69 said:


> He wouldn't win even with his arms.  No chance in hell.


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## kyla1718 (Aug 10, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> Itachi can beat Tsunade with one jutsu.
> 
> The thing is if he can beat Orochimaru without arms. Only Totsuka would be effective against him (Or sharingan genjutsu followed by Totsuka), but Oro having knowledge on both and knowing Itachi can't make clones, he might try to be away from him. However, if he does that, Itachi just has to deactivate Susano'o and that's it. It doesn't have to be him rampaging on the offensive.



He can beat tsunade with one jutsu? I would love for you to please explain how itachi can one shot the best medic in the manga who survived having her body severed in two by madara uchiha, stabbed dozens of times by orochimaru, and by madara. Tsunade is by no means an ideal fighter, she is prone to be hit, again and again, she slow, and her offensive abilities are lacking, but she makes up with it for having the resilience of a tank. She has endured bodily harm no one in this manga has. You cannot discredit that, and you cannot sit here and tell me itachi one shot the hokage/legendary sannin. Stop with the fanboy ism. We know itachi with his arms solos tsunade, but without arms I would like to see him try.


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> We cant understand what you are saying with all the gurgling noise.
> Take Itachi's dick out of your mouth.


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## LostSelf (Aug 10, 2013)

kyla1718 said:


> He can beat tsunade with one jutsu? I would love for you to please explain how itachi can one shot the best medic in the manga who survived having her body severed in two by madara uchiha, stabbed dozens of times by orochimaru, and by madara. Tsunade is by no means an ideal fighter, she is prone to be hit, again and again, she slow, and her offensive abilities are lacking, but she makes up with it for having the resilience of a tank. She has endured bodily harm no one in this manga has. You cannot discredit that, and you cannot sit here and tell me itachi one shot the hokage/legendary sannin. Stop with the fanboy ism. We know itachi with his arms solos tsunade, but without arms I would like to see him try.



One word: Amaterasu.

Was i called an Itachi fan? To think that i'd see the day where i'm called an Itachi fan .


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

kyla1718 said:


> He can beat tsunade with one jutsu? I would love for you to please explain how itachi can one shot the best medic in the manga who survived having her body severed in two by madara uchiha, stabbed dozens of times by orochimaru, and by madara. Tsunade is by no means an ideal fighter, she is prone to be hit, again and again, she slow, and her offensive abilities are lacking, but she makes up with it for having the resilience of a tank. She has endured bodily harm no one in this manga has. You cannot discredit that, and you cannot sit here and tell me itachi one shot the hokage/legendary sannin. Stop with the fanboy ism. We know itachi with his arms solos tsunade, but without arms I would like to see him try.



Orochimaru has taken similar hits, and came back.   He is very much a tank as well!
Itachi has no chance in hell here.  He doesn't have the chakra to hold them both off, even if he could land some hits.  They would outlast him, that is what they do!


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

Like that time he took a hit from the Totsuka no Tsurugi.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> One word: Amaterasu.



One word.
Block

Put anything in front of you and the fire consumes that instead.
Orochimaru is the strongest ninjutsu character in the series.


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> One word.
> Block
> 
> Put anything in front of you and the fire, and it consumes that instead.
> Orochimaru is the strongest ninjutsu character in the series.



Yeah, we saw how well his strongest Ninjutsu performed against Itachi's strongest Ninjutsu.


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## Ersa (Aug 10, 2013)

Stop trolling my thread.

Dis is serious.



I think it's a decent matchup


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## Nikushimi (Aug 10, 2013)

It's a decent match-up, but Itachi still solos.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Nikushimi said:


> Yeah, we saw how well his strongest Ninjutsu performed against Itachi's strongest Ninjutsu.



That isn't itachi's ninjtusu!  That is just some hacks weapon in the series.


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## LostSelf (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> One word.
> Block
> 
> Put anything in front of you and the fire, and it consumes that instead.
> Orochimaru is the strongest ninjutsu character in the series.



You need to sense Amaterasu coming or be a speedester like Ei to dodge it.

Ei had to go V2 to be safe from Amaterasu. And you think Tsunade is gonna block it with something? She has nothing to counter that jutsu. And she's not outlasting it either.


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## Ersa (Aug 10, 2013)

Totsuka not Itachi's power.


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## Dil (Aug 10, 2013)

This thread 

Itachi doesn't even need his arms, his eyes are more than enough to deal with Tsunade. What's her solution to Tsukiyomi? As soon as the fight starts she'll get caught, Oro will likely run away because he doesn't want to be humiliated again, especially when there's witnesses like Tsunade there.

And Tsunade running towards Itachi while she is engulfed my Amaterasu? Yeah...ok


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> You need to sense Amaterasu coming or be a speedester like Ei to dodge it.
> 
> Ei had to go V2 to be safe from Amaterasu. And you think Tsunade is gonna block it with something? She has nothing to counter that jutsu. And she's not outlasting it either.



There has to be some kind of tell, otherwise he couldn't dodge.
I am not so sure he couldn't use some kind of jutsu to block within the same time period.  
In fact, I am positive he could.   
Basically anything will work.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

The Sword of Totsuka, also known as the Sakegari Longsword (酒刈太刀, Sakegari no Tachi; Literally meaning "Sake Cutter Longsword"), is a variant of the Sword of Kusanagi. It is sheathed in a sake jar; the blade is actually the liquid inside the gourd that is released and shaped, rather than a conventional sword. It is an ethereal weapon with an enchanted blade capable of sealing anything it pierces. Those who are stabbed by the sword are drawn into the jar and trapped in a genjutsu-like "world of drunken dreams" for all eternity; by extension, Itachi also managed to remove the Cursed Seal of Heaven from Sasuke by stabbing and removing Orochimaru from Sasuke's body. It can also cut through objects like a normal blade, thereby giving the wielder great versatility in his attacks. *Orochimaru sought the sword for all his life and Zetsu commented that he could never find it.*


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## Dil (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> The Sword of Totsuka, also known as the Sakegari Longsword (酒刈太刀, Sakegari no Tachi; Literally meaning "Sake Cutter Longsword"), is a variant of the Sword of Kusanagi. It is sheathed in a sake jar; the blade is actually the liquid inside the gourd that is released and shaped, rather than a conventional sword. It is an ethereal weapon with an enchanted blade capable of sealing anything it pierces. Those who are stabbed by the sword are drawn into the jar and trapped in a genjutsu-like "world of drunken dreams" for all eternity; by extension, Itachi also managed to remove the Cursed Seal of Heaven from Sasuke by stabbing and removing Orochimaru from Sasuke's body. It can also cut through objects like a normal blade, thereby giving the wielder great versatility in his attacks. *Orochimaru sought the sword for all his life and Zetsu commented that he could never find it.*



He sought for Itachi's powers, can you blame him?


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## Ennoia (Aug 10, 2013)




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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Dil said:


> He sought for Itachi's powers, can you blame him?



_* Zetsu commented that he could never find it.*_

Also see below, supernatural *ITEM*!


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## Ersa (Aug 10, 2013)

Madara says no.


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## LostSelf (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> There has to be some kind of tell, otherwise he couldn't dodge.
> I am not so sure he couldn't use some kind of jutsu to block.   Basically anything will work.



The blood running in Itachi's face should be an indicator. However, Kishi basically showed us that you need sheer speed or sensing to be able to dodge or block said jutsu.

Sasuke was outrunning it for a while, but he was prepared for it. And was caught in the end.


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## kyla1718 (Aug 10, 2013)

Eh, Itachi had his time when the wank threads were a common occurrence. That time is over. I barley consider itachi a level above Orochimaru and Tsunade. To try and create a scenario where Itachi defeats two legendary sannin with no arms seems silly to me. You could have gotten away with this crap 2 years ago, but with current feats, Tsunade has been proven to be more useful then part one portrayed her, and orochimaru had proven to be someone who just will not die. 

We know itachi is awesome, but no longer can you voluntary fodderize Kage level ninja just because it is "itachi." He is old news. Move on.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> The blood running in Itachi's face should be an indicator. However, Kishi basically showed us that you need sheer speed or sensing to be able to dodge or block said jutsu.
> 
> Sasuke was outrunning it for a while, but he was prepared for it. And was caught in the end.



He was trying to set the local area of fire though.  It was part of his strat.

Orochimaru is much faster than sasuke was at that time.


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## Darkmaiar (Aug 10, 2013)

I'm afraid Itachi would lose this one. While his Amaterasu, Susano'o, and Tsukuyomi are very powerful and he could likely beat them 1v1, prior knowledge definitely gives this to the Sannin duo.

Amaterasu is fast and powerful, but both Tsunade and Orochimaru have defenses. Tsunade could pull an Ei and then just heal herself and Oro could puke another body out.

It's been proven that Susano'o is useless against Tsunade and they could both avoid eye contact to avoid Tsukuyomi. Both have 50+ years of experience and also have some extent of teamwork.


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## LostSelf (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> He was trying to set the local area of fire though.  It was part of his strat.



Then i still fail to see how Tsunade can block or dodge before the fire gets her. And since his fire is very big and can shoot two huge fireballs that would cover an entire human body at the same time, nothing stops him from lighting Orochimaru too.


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## Ennoia (Aug 10, 2013)

Ill just go out on a limb here and say that Itachi has no means of putting down Oro and thus he loses. Oro has essentially full knowledge and is not going to attempt to tank Totsuka nor is he going to look Itachi in the eyes which is not necessary given that Itachi will be limited to Susanoo. Totsuka has no feats that says it is capable of tagging Oro; it has only cut off the heads of Orochimaru's Hydra which itself has no speed feats and it stabbed Oro that didnt take Itachi seriously. At the same time Oro was confident enough to engage Totsuka with Kusanagi despite seeing what the sword was capable of which implies that the sword didnt do anything Oro couldnt handle as a swordsman. The only other time it was used was against Nagato which Kabuto outright said he was not mobile and the fact that it was Kabuto controlling him. Amaterasu does nothing, Tsukuyomi isnt happening, and Susanoo gets outlasted.

Even if we were to go out on a limb and say Oro or Tsunade gets stabbed, Totsuka takes some time before the person is sealed which is ample time for Tsunade to snap the sword like she did Madara's or Oro to spit up a new body. Worse comes to worst they outlast him because he cant do shit. Danzo was capable of reacting to Susanoo's arms at point blank and Itachi parried an arm with his back turned, its stupid to say these people lost to Susanoo. What is scary about Itachi is that he uses his abilities wisely in order to set up for the right striking moment, this is not the case here.

Forget about adding in summons that can potentially restrain Susanoo and attack from multiple angles like behind and under him while again Itachi is limited to MS. Katsuya cannot be stabbed and Manda is too fast and can go underground. Im going to need someone to explain to me how this guy handles just Oro to add in Tsunade.


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## kyla1718 (Aug 10, 2013)

Even if Itachi hits Tsunade with Amaterasu, it is not a one hit KO. You seem to be completely ignoring the fact that Tsunade happens to be the one person in this manga who can tank nearly anything. If it kills her it will take time.....also tsunades tolerance for pain is unmatched...... It is not in her character to roll on her side and cry in pain, she works through it......   Itachi armless shooting Amaterasu at a woman who will keep coming at him is incredibly stupid, he would take a chance getting caught in his own jutsu if she makes contact with him, and it would KO him....


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## Ersa (Aug 10, 2013)

Totsuka is a spiritual weapon, you can't snap it. One hit and you're done, you don't think Nagato would've like S/T it if he could break it? 

Orochimaru and Tsunade are not on the same level as Itachi, only Jiraiya is.

Amaterasu outburnt Cerberus regen which I might add has better feats then Byakogou. 

And this Itachi is old news argument is pathetic, the Sannin are even older news. Does that mean anything at all?

I know a full power Itachi unrestricted could beat the Sannin but still...


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## Sans (Aug 10, 2013)

I'm going to say that the Totsuka crossing the Databook's definition of Long in between panels is actually pretty fast.

Orochimaru definitively placed Itachi in a higher strength tier, and he didn't even know about Itachi's final Susano'o weapons. They're beyond him.

Unless this is Current Orochimaru, which could be different. 

I'll be honest, I haven't even read the OP. Only came here because I saw JesusJuice was in the thread.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> Then i still fail to see how Tsunade can block or dodge before the fire gets her. And since his fire is very big and can shoot two huge fireballs that would cover an entire human body at the same time, nothing stops him from lighting Orochimaru too.



Orochimaru is much faster than Sasuke was at that time. 
Oro would block for tsunade using ninjutsu!  
Heck even tsunade was probably a match for Sasuke's speed at that time.  If she could defend herself for even a few seconds with speed, or a rock, or whatever, then Itachi is a sitting duck!

Bam Itachi just wasted a shitload of chakra and deteriorated his eye!


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## LostSelf (Aug 10, 2013)

kyla1718 said:


> Even if Itachi hits Tsunade with Amaterasu, it is not a one hit KO. You seem to be completely ignoring the fact that Tsunade happens to be the one person in this manga who can tank nearly anything. If it kills her it will take time.....also tsunades tolerance for pain is unmatched...... It is not in her character to roll on her side and cry in pain, she works through it......   Itachi armless shooting Amaterasu at a woman who will keep coming at him is incredibly stupid, he would take a chance getting caught in his own jutsu if she makes contact with him, and it would KO him....



A Tsunade with her entire body on fire won't tag Itachi. Tsunade is not even near Itachi's speed. Let alone having her face burned and suffering a lot of damage.

And actually, damage has made Tsunade collapse. Itachi's Amaterasu would cause much more damage than the Susano'o clones. Thus, Tsunade will be hardly fighting when she's hit by that.

To the poster above: CS2 Sasuke was faster than Tsunade. And Oro is not using ninjutsu before an instantaneous jutsu hits both. They are not that fast.


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## kyla1718 (Aug 10, 2013)

The argument that itachi ARMLESS can take on two sannin working together is pathetic......... I love how you guys keep on ignoring latest feats from tsunade. She could heal herself at the molecular level and you would still choose to ignore it.


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## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Ennoia said:


> Ill just go out on a limb here and say that Itachi has no means of putting down Oro and thus he loses. Oro has essentially full knowledge and is not going to attempt to tank Totsuka nor is he going to look Itachi in the eyes which is not necessary given that Itachi will be limited to Susanoo. Totsuka has no feats that says it is capable of tagging Oro; it has only cut off the heads of Orochimaru's Hydra which itself has no speed feats and it stabbed Oro that didnt take Itachi seriously. At the same time Oro was confident enough to engage Totsuka with Kusanagi despite seeing what the sword was capable of which implies that the sword didnt do anything Oro couldnt handle as a swordsman. The only other time it was used was against Nagato which Kabuto outright said he was not mobile and the fact that it was Kabuto controlling him. Amaterasu does nothing, Tsukuyomi isnt happening, and Susanoo gets outlasted.
> 
> Even if we were to go out on a limb and say Oro or Tsunade gets stabbed, Totsuka takes some time before the person is sealed which is ample time for Tsunade to snap the sword like she did Madara's or Oro to spit up a new body. Worse comes to worst they outlast him because he cant do shit. Danzo was capable of reacting to Susanoo's arms at point blank and Itachi parried an arm with his back turned, its stupid to say these people lost to Susanoo. What is scary about Itachi is that he uses his abilities wisely in order to set up for the right striking moment, this is not the case here.
> 
> Forget about adding in summons that can potentially restrain Susanoo and attack from multiple angles like behind and under him while again Itachi is limited to MS. Katsuya cannot be stabbed and Manda is too fast and can go underground. Im going to need someone to explain to me how this guy handles just Oro to add in Tsunade.


Someone who talks logic finally steps forward.


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## kyla1718 (Aug 10, 2013)

Oh yes, because itachi with no arms is as agile and skilled at diversion with his two arms. That makes a lot of sense........

Your argument is completely valid if this were itachi not handicapped, but the OP chose to make him practically worthless. Without his arms he is left with a few decent Justus that are worthless without the steps it takes to create a scenario where they own, that require the usage of arms. Susanno is no protection, against tsunade. Frankly I am of the opinion tsunade solos armless itachi, with orochimaru there it is just Rolf stomp.


----------



## Dil (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Someone who talks logic finally steps forward.



Says the guy who said Itachi has no swimming feats and will be soloed by a bridge


----------



## kyla1718 (Aug 10, 2013)

Ennoia, has provided a valid argument where orochimaru solos armless itachi, and I have provided one that suggests tsunade solos armless itachi......... Considering orochimaru and tsunade are both in this fight together, things are not looking good for our armless friend who can shoot a few amaterasus out of his eye, which by the way wears on him, and then prop up a Susanno which would not provide adequate protection....... After those options are exhausted, we just have an armless doof running around.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Dil said:


> Says the guy who said Itachi has no swimming feats and will be soloed by a bridge



That thread was a satire of other people saying some ninja don't have basic feats like the ability to break genjutsu.  Assuming high level ninja have basic skills like swimming and genjutsu protection is common sense.


----------



## Ersa (Aug 10, 2013)

kyla1718 said:


> Susanno is no protection, against tsunade. Frankly I am of the opinion tsunade solos armless itachi, with orochimaru there it is just Rolf stomp.


Susanoo doesn't require arms.

Also 



Tsunade's punches will bounce off complete Susanoo before the latter splats her with its shield or seals her away.

Base Itachi could take Tsunade.


----------



## kyla1718 (Aug 10, 2013)

I never said Susanno requires arms, I never implied he could not summon it. Also show me the evidence that states that Susanno can tank a punch from Tsunade. More evidence points to the fact she can in fact break it. Sussano is not all it is made out to be, multiple Kage teir ninjas have shown abilities to break it.......     

Give me proof that suggests tsunade cannot break itachiis Susanno.  You like to scoff, but I want to see panels.


----------



## LostSelf (Aug 10, 2013)

kyla1718 said:


> Oh yes, because itachi with no arms is as agile and skilled at diversion with his two arms. That makes a lot of sense........
> 
> Your argument is completely valid if this were itachi not handicapped, but the OP chose to make him practically worthless. Without his arms he is left with a few decent Justus that are worthless without the steps it takes to create a scenario where they own, that require the usage of arms. Susanno is no protection, against tsunade. Frankly I am of the opinion tsunade solos armless itachi, with orochimaru there it is just Rolf stomp.



Itachi runs with his feets. Not with his arms. If it's me you're talking to... Why are you ignoring my points,  Kyla?


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

You have shown nothing that proves Itachi can win this?  You got two massive tanks, and he ain't got shit to toss at them.


----------



## LostSelf (Aug 10, 2013)

Actually, i did. I gave you a good example of why Itachi can kill Tsunade with Amaterasu. The fact that you choose to ignore it it's different.


----------



## Bonly (Aug 10, 2013)

Ennoia said:


> Itachi has no means of putting down Oro



This is basically the main problem for Itachi. He can beat Tsunade and he can deal with most of Orochi's arsenal, only problem would be putting Orochi down for go, feat wise that. Unless Itachi stabbed Orochi with the Totsuka blade, Itachi would likely get outlasted and then beat by Orochi eventually.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> Actually, i did. I gave you a good example of why Itachi can kill Tsunade with Amaterasu. The fact that you choose to ignore it it's different.



They can both outrun and defend against Ama.  Orochimaru can do so easily, and even cover for tsunade.
That slow ass sword aint hitting shit.   Keep your distance, GG!
Genjutsu won't work

So what's left?
Losing his arms isn't even that much of a disadvantage.  
We haven't honestly seen any impressive feats with them.  Its always his eyes.


----------



## trance (Aug 10, 2013)

Lol, Tsunade gets a face full of Amaterasu. Orochimaru is eventually hunted down and sealed.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Trance said:


> Lol, Tsunade gets a face full of Amaterasu. Orochimaru is eventually hunted down and sealed.



Tsunade stomps the ground, huge rock flies up to shield her.
She could also outrun it like sasuke did.
Orochimaru can use ninjutsu to block for her.

GG!  Ama aint hitting shit.  He is only wasting his chakra, and eye sight.


After a few minutes of Susano, then he goes blind and loses all his stupidly overpowered powers.
All they have to do is last that long, which is easy as they are uber tanks.


----------



## trance (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Tsunade stomps the ground, huge rock flies up to shield her.
> She could also outrun it like sasuke did.
> Orochimaru can use ninjutsu to block for her.
> 
> ...



>Implying Tsunade has enough time to do so before her face is full of black flames at 10m



Ei had to go V2 to dodge Amaterasu...Tsunade isn't nearly that fast. She's not even as fast as Saucegay. Orochimaru is the only problem.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Trance said:


> >Implying Tsunade has enough time to do so before her face is full of black flames at 10m
> 
> 
> 
> Ei had to go V2 to dodge Amaterasu...Tsunade isn't nearly that fast. She's not even as fast as Saucegay. Orochimaru is the only problem.



She has plenty of time.  Sasuke did it, she can do it!
Maybe he didn't have to go, you are just assuming that.


----------



## trance (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> She has plenty of time.  Sasuke did it, she can do it!
> Maybe he didn't have to go, you are just assuming that.



At 10m, he just has to look at Tsunade which he will be doing in the *very* beginning before she can stomp the ground.

And why do you assume rocks will fly up? That's not guaranteed all the time.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Trance said:


> At 10m, he just has to look at Tsunade which he will be doing in the *very* beginning before she can stomp the ground.
> 
> And why do you assume rocks will fly up? That's not guaranteed all the time.



Its not instant, or others couldn't have dodged.
Kid sasuke dodged it, so Tsunade could dodge as well.  Stomping your foot on the ground is obviously quicker than moving your whole body as well.

Because its an anime, rocks always fly up.

She stomps the ground, ducks, and bam she is safe.  
She can even punch the rocks to launch his fire back into his face.


----------



## trance (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Kid sasuke dodged it, so Tsunade could dodge as well.



Kid Sasuke is Part I Sasuke, so I assume you're talking about Part II Sasuke.

Even Sasuke is faster than Tsunade.



> Because its an anime, rocks always fly up.



Wait, do you *only* watch the anime?


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

Trance said:


> Kid Sasuke is Part I Sasuke, so I assume you're talking about Part II Sasuke.
> 
> Even Sasuke is faster than Tsunade.
> 
> ...



16 is still a kid to me, but yah.
Sasuke at 16 is probably on par with Tsunade as far as speed is concerned.


----------



## eyeknockout (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> WTF does that basketball player head mean?


----------



## LostSelf (Aug 10, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> They can both outrun and defend against Ama.  Orochimaru can do so easily, and even cover for tsunade.
> .



They are going to outrun Amaterasu from 10 meters when Ei had to go V2 to avoid it....

I give up.


----------



## Baroxio (Aug 10, 2013)

Itachi fans are so unreasonable. I mean, CS Sasuke with Sharingan to anticipate Amaterasu, who moved before Amaterasu was fired was able to outrun Amaterasu (nevermind that he still got hit even though Itachi wasn't trying to kill him), so clearly, the much slower Tsunade who Kishimoto says is slower than this version of Sasuke can easily outrun it as well! 

Plus, Tsunade could just punch the ground or something sometime in between Itachi firing Amaterasu, and Amaterasu appearing on her, because we all know how long that time frame is! 

Silly Itachi fans!!!!!!!!!! They need to stop riding Itachi's nuts and admit that even though he still has access to his strongest techniques, they are worthless in the face of ninja who don't suck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

STOP THE WANK AND TROLLING ITACHI FANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

































































Oh god why.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 10, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> They are going to outrun Amaterasu from 10 meters when Ei had to go V2 to avoid it....
> 
> I give up.



Sasuke was about 10m away from Itachi and avoided it.  At least for a little while anyways!  And itachi was standing there like a statue while doing it, completely open to counter attack.

There is nothing suggesting he HAD to go V2 to avoid it!  You are only assuming that!


----------



## LostSelf (Aug 11, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Sasuke was about 10m away from Itachi and avoided it.  At least for a little while anyways!  And itachi was standing there like a statue while doing it, completely open to counter attack.
> 
> There is nothing suggesting he HAD to go V2 to avoid it!  You are only assuming that!



I`m not going to bother arguing why Tsunade and Oro cannot dodge Amaterasu. If Exodia dodges Amaterasu doesn't mean Tsunade and Orochimaru can.

Give me a good reason to believe Ei didn't go V2 to avoid Amaterasu.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 11, 2013)

Two reasons,

He was going on the offensive, and there would be no reason to hold back.
Its only smart to use you max speed to avoid amaterasu.  That doesn't mean it was required though.  That is the point I am making.


You are trying to say the minimum speed to avoid Amaterasu is A Version 2, and I am saying you have no justification to say that. 
All we know is that Sasuke couldn't completely outrun it, and V2 A could.  That means anything in between is fair game for speculation.


----------



## Veracity (Aug 11, 2013)

So Itachi and Sasuke have the same Amaterasu speed? Cause I was under the impression(and obviously based by feats) that's Sasukes was much faster.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 11, 2013)

Likes boss said:


> So Itachi and Sasuke have the same Amaterasu speed? Cause I was under the impression(and obviously based by feats) that's Sasukes was much faster.



What are you talking about, and what does that have to do with this fight?


----------



## LostSelf (Aug 11, 2013)

Likes boss said:


> So Itachi and Sasuke have the same Amaterasu speed? Cause I was under the impression(and obviously based by feats) that's Sasukes was much faster.



They are both instantaneous. But Itachi's has shown to be way hotter. Sasuke just has better manipulation, though.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 11, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> They are both instantaneous. But Itachi's has shown to be way hotter. Sasuke just has better manipulation, though.



If they were instant, then they would be impossible to dodge.  Yet, it has been dodged way more than once.


----------



## kyla1718 (Aug 11, 2013)

Baroxio,  Love how armless itachi can KO everyone aparently. Lets just take his legs away too, I am sure everyone will have a "viable" defense for his victory as well. 

Hell, I do not wish to steer the thread elsewhere, but lets change the battle to Jesus Christ vs Itachi.     Location gates of heaven.  Conditions; itachi is armless and leg less.

Ill start, naturally itachi will borrow gokus nimbus cloud, and start firing Amaterasu, incinerating Jesus, and then summoning Susanno who then tears down the gates of heaven. Itachi then flies down on his borrowed nimbus and kills tsunade and orochimaru for good measure.  Hell, he ends the ninja war by putting madara in a genjustsu. 

Anyway, I could go on, but I need to get one off to some itachi Yao.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 11, 2013)

Lol yah. 
I can't believe 10 people think Itachi wins this. 
For the 10 ppl who give this to itachi, just how much more of a handicap do we need for the tag team to win?


----------



## kyla1718 (Aug 11, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Lol yah.
> I can't believe 10 people think Itachi wins this.
> For the 10 ppl who give this to itachi, just how much more of a handicap do we need for the tag team to win?




It will probably take a mental handicap for them to start considering that itachi is not god all knowing, but even then, I will not be surprised if a defense is not created.  I am not sure if  I would want a madara vs itachi thread with this crowd. Selling madara as the victor I think would be a tough sale. 

Maybe if itachis head routed 180 and was still armless, then oro and tsunade might stand a chance. But then again, they are not uchiha and tsunade is a woman, so that's two strikes against her. Awww shucks. 

What is sad is that I completely agree that itachi without handicaps stomps tsunade and orochimaru, that is if oro does not have edo tensei.


----------



## Rocky (Aug 11, 2013)

kyla1718 said:


> Give me proof that suggests tsunade cannot break itachiis Susanno.



Tsunade could barley break the Rib-Cage Susano'o, only _cracking_ it with her punch, and shattering it in combination with Ei & Onoki.

Itachi's has a Final Susano'o, which is three stages above the Rib-Cage. In addition to the rib bones that Madara's had, it has skin, and a heavy layer of armor. Tsunade doesn't have the strength feats to crack it, let alone break it.

Furthermore, Itachi's Susano'o has the Yata no Kagami, which generally causes attacks to _bounce back_. Tsunade's fists would get the same treatment as Sasuke's explosives. She is not powerful enough to go through the Mirror and 4 layers of Susano'o.


----------



## Sadgoob (Aug 11, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Lol yah.
> I can't believe 10 people think Itachi wins this.
> For the 10 ppl who give this to itachi, just how much more of a handicap do we need for the tag team to win?



You just said in the other thread that he's barely handicapped here.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 11, 2013)

kyla1718 said:


> It will probably take a mental handicap for them to start considering that itachi is not god all knowing, but even then, I will not be surprised if a defense is not created.  I am not sure if  I would want a madara vs itachi thread with this crowd. Selling madara as the victor I think would be a tough sale.
> 
> Maybe if itachis head routed 180 and was still armless, then oro and tsunade might stand a chance. But then again, they are not uchiha and tsunade is a woman, so that's two strikes against her. Awww shucks.
> 
> What is sad is that I completely agree that itachi without handicaps stomps tsunade and orochimaru, that is if oro does not have edo tensei.



Haha yah, in another thread some idiot was arguing that itachi could read people and predict the future or some bull shit.
Nah, I don't see as giving him arms makes any difference.  The uchiha in the series are one trick ponies, eyes.  

He has no taijutsu feats or speed feats or anything.  
If he isn't behind Susano, then he loses quick and he can only stay behind that for maybe 10 mins before going blind.



Strategoob said:


> You just said in the other thread that he's barely handicapped here.



Feat wise he is.  
I am asking how much more do we need to take away.


----------



## Sadgoob (Aug 11, 2013)

I think Amaterasu basically ends Tsunade. Once her face is on fire she's essentially a non-factor, and she isn't fast enough to avoid it nor is she sensor that can brace against it. 

Orochimaru can go down to Mangekyō technique as well unless you assume that Yamata regenerates (and I do) in which case the Totsuka becomes a bit more essential, though not absolutely so.​


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 11, 2013)

What if itachi was a head?  Would that make any difference?


----------



## Sadgoob (Aug 11, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> What if itachi was a head?  Would that make any difference?



Like Hidan? Hmm, can he have Susano'o hold him? If so, then his eyeballs can still work their magic.​


----------



## LostSelf (Aug 11, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> If they were instant, then they would be impossible to dodge.  Yet, it has been dodged way more than once.



There's a diference. Anticipating Amaterasu and moving before it's used it's diferent than doding it right after it's used.

And the only one who outran Amaterasu was Sasuke, who was fighting an Itachi that wasn't trying to kill him.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 11, 2013)

Its not fucking instant...
That is like some idiot that thinks he can dodge a gun.  You can't fucking dodge a gun!


----------



## Vice (Aug 11, 2013)

The physics you'd have to break to be able to dodge something that's instantaneous is too much even for this manga, which already bends physics over the bed and rapes it mercilessly.


----------



## Sadgoob (Aug 11, 2013)

Amaterasu instantly appears, but it doesn't seem to instantly latch onto enemies. The flames seemed to brush A, but he reacted so quickly that they didn't have time to latch onto him and burn him.

And people can dodge instant attacks if they're prepared for the attack. Think Bee countering Hiraishin. If you know it's coming, then you're essentially preempting it. It's not a 'reaction,' but it works.​


----------



## Cord (Aug 11, 2013)

For what does he need his arms for, if the source of his greatest powers comes from his eyes? 

Bloodusted Itachi who knows that he's at a disadvantage without his arms opens up with Amaterasu and ignites either one of them in the face if he has to. The other unfortunate survivor will now have to face his or her worst nightmare that is Susano'o and a follow up Totsuka seal. Tsunade and Orochimaru have yet to show the speed and reflexes necessary to evade that kind of attack. Otherwise, they'll end up in Itachi's bottle- like one of them already had in canon.

Maybe, if Itachi has a different mindset, the match could go either way.


----------



## Vice (Aug 11, 2013)

Strategoob said:


> Amaterasu instantly appears, but it doesn't seem to instantly latch onto enemies. The flames seemed to brush A, but he reacted so quickly that they didn't have time to latch onto him and burn him.
> 
> And people can dodge instant attacks if they're prepared for the attack. Think Bee countering Hiraishin. If you know it's coming, then you're essentially preempting it. It's not a 'reaction,' but it works.​



You're full of more shit than any Itachi fan I've ever seen. Fuck, half your argument is based on some bizarro-world fanfiction inside your head.


----------



## Vice (Aug 11, 2013)

Cordelia said:


> The other unfortunate survivor will now have to face his or her worst nightmare that is Susano'o and a follow up Totsuka seal. Tsunade and Orochimaru have yet to show the speed and reflexes necessary to evade that kind of attack.



Apparently Orochimaru and Tsunade have yet to show speed faster than NOT MOVING AT ALL because that's the only condition in which Totsuka has actually been successful.


----------



## Sadgoob (Aug 11, 2013)

Vice said:


> You're full of more shit than any Itachi fan I've ever seen. Fuck, half your argument is based on some bizarro-world fanfiction inside your head.



You hurt my feelings.


----------



## Cord (Aug 11, 2013)

Vice said:


> Apparently Orochimaru and Tsunade have yet to show speed faster than NOT MOVING AT ALL because that's the only condition in which Totsuka has actually been successful.



Because that's only one of the two instances where we've seen Totsuka being used. Yes? Then what other instances did we see Totsuka assault  *not* being successful? Do we base a jutsu's efficiency on how it has been a success or how it hasn't been?

I think it should already be established that Susano'o attacks are launched in a similar level of speed, granted that there could be a disparity, it shouldn't be that significant enough to conclude that they can be reacted to and evaded by characters who haven't shown the speed to do do so.  Itachi's Yasaka Magatama, Totsuka no Tsurugi. . . Sasuke's Susano'o arrows. 

If Kakashi who has Sharingan reflexes had to resort to Kamui to avoid himself from getting instantenously killed, then I wouldn't bet on either Orochimaru or Tsunade to achieve a better feat with evasion. They don't have to be stationary for Itachi's gargantuan summon to maim them with the Totsuka.


----------



## jesusjuice69 (Aug 11, 2013)

Cordelia said:


> Because that's only one of the two instances where we've seen Totsuka being used. Yes? Then what other instances did we see Totsuka assault  *not* being successful? Do we base a jutsu's efficiency on how it has been a success or how it hasn't been?
> 
> I think it should already be established that Susano'o attacks are launched in a similar level of speed, granted that there could be a disparity, it shouldn't be that significant enough to conclude that they can be reacted to and evaded by characters who haven't shown the speed to do do so.  Itachi's Yasaka Magatama, Totsuka no Tsurugi. . . Sasuke's Susano'o arrows.
> 
> If Kakashi who has Sharingan reflexes had to resort to Kamui to avoid himself from getting instantenously killed, then I wouldn't bet on either Orochimaru or Tsunade to achieve a better feat with evasion. They don't have to be stationary for Itachi's gargantuan summon to maim them with the Totsuka.



So what are you saying? It worked twice so it always works?

No that isn't established at all.  

They have knowledge, so they won't get that close.   Orochimaru also has walls to guard with.


----------



## Veracity (Aug 11, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> They are both instantaneous. But Itachi's has shown to be way hotter. Sasuke just has better manipulation, though.



If they are both instantaneous then how can they be dodged? Furthermore, how could Hebi Sasuke manage to outpace Itachis Amaterasu for awhile?(don't give me shit on Itachi holding back, cause he eventually got hit by it.)

While Sasukes took a v2 Ay shunshin to dodge? Doesn't even add up. It's obvious that Sasuke has the faster Amaterasu while Itachis is hotter.


----------



## LostSelf (Aug 11, 2013)

Likes boss said:


> If they are both instantaneous then how can they be dodged? Furthermore, how could Hebi Sasuke manage to outpace Itachis Amaterasu for awhile?(don't give me shit on Itachi holding back, cause he eventually got hit by it.)
> 
> While Sasukes took a v2 Ay shunshin to dodge? Doesn't even add up. It's obvious that Sasuke has the faster Amaterasu while Itachis is hotter.



It appears on what the caster is looking at. Sasuke _tried_ to leave Itachi's field of vision, and Itachi was just following him. And yeah, Itachi wasn't trying to kill Sasuke, he aimed for a safe part of his body, like his wing.

Ei was closer to Sasuke. And unlike Sasuke, he couldn't anticipate it until Sasuke activated MS and was about to shoot Amaterasu. When Sasuke fought Itachi, he knew what was coming before hand.


----------



## FairyTailisBack (Aug 11, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> It appears on what the caster is looking at. Sasuke _tried_ to leave Itachi's field of vision, and Itachi was just following him. And yeah, Itachi wasn't trying to kill Sasuke, he aimed for a safe part of his body, like his wing.
> 
> Ei was closer to Sasuke. And unlike Sasuke, he couldn't anticipate it until Sasuke activated MS and was about to shoot Amaterasu. When Sasuke fought Itachi, he knew what was coming before hand.



Ohh bull shit!
SHIT is spewing forth from your keyboard faster than a dairy farm.

Just complete and utter baseless BS!


----------



## The Pirate on Wheels (Aug 11, 2013)

Totsuga crossed Kishi's idea of long distance instantly.  That's pretty impressive.

However, Orochimaru didn't look worried, or care about being hit, so it's possible he could have evaded.  Well, for that matter, he could have just not revealed himself from inside the summon at all, and not given Itachi a real target to stab.  

The second showing is similarly dubious.  Nagato's eyes change back right before Totsuga is unleashed, which means that even if he saw it, and could have evaded, he might have gotten free from Kabuto's control and took the hit, or responded in a non-optimal way.  Not to mention his weakness was mobility.  

There is also a decent disparity in attack speeds.  The arrow seems to be much faster and more powerful than the Magatama, in the way an arrow should be faster than shuriken, their non-spiritual counterparts.  So while the Totsuga might be of similar speed, or surely an impressive speed, I don't know if it can't be evaded given Orochimaru's prior knowledge of the jutsu.

10 meters is also an incredibly short distance for either set of ninjas to cross to think Itachi gets more than one move before being attacked, and MS does slow reflexes and movement right after use.


----------



## The Pirate on Wheels (Aug 11, 2013)

MS isn't instantanious.  The user has to build up chakra in their eye first.  This has happened several times already, once by Nagato, and the other in just the other chapter by I think Tobirama.

The formation of Susano isn't either, thought it's PDQ, and not the poster.


----------



## The Pirate on Wheels (Aug 11, 2013)

jesusjuice69 said:


> Its not fucking instant...
> That is like some idiot that thinks he can dodge a gun.  You can't fucking dodge a gun!



Guns are easy.  It's the bullet that gets ya.


----------



## Veracity (Aug 11, 2013)

LostSelf said:


> It appears on what the caster is looking at. Sasuke _tried_ to leave Itachi's field of vision, and Itachi was just following him. And yeah, Itachi wasn't trying to kill Sasuke, he aimed for a safe part of his body, like his wing.
> 
> Ei was closer to Sasuke. And unlike Sasuke, he couldn't anticipate it until Sasuke activated MS and was about to shoot Amaterasu. When Sasuke fought Itachi, he knew what was coming before hand.



Doesn't change the fact that Itachi only had to move his head around to hit Sasuke, which he should have been able to do easily considering the difference between turning your head and outpacing said speed.

Aimed for a safe spot? So I guess hitting Sasuke dead in his mid-section is safe I assume?

And shouldn't the distance between Sasuke and Ay not make a difference cosidering you said the technique was instantaneous?


----------



## LostSelf (Aug 11, 2013)

Likes boss said:


> Doesn't change the fact that Itachi only had to move his head around to hit Sasuke, which he should have been able to do easily considering the difference between turning your head and outpacing said speed.



No, it wasn't. Itachi was near blind, fatigated and sick. It's not like you turn your head against someone that's running out of your sight while Tsukuyomi and the first Amaterasu you used began to show some side effects. Clearly enough for Sasuke to notice.

 And Sasuke began to move before Itachi even activated Amaterasu.

Comparing almost dead, blind and fatigated Itachi's Amaterasu to an almost full power Sasuke's is an awful comparison.



> Aimed for a safe spot? So I guess hitting Sasuke dead in his mid-section is safe I assume?



Don't know if you noticed, Itachi hit Sasuke in his wing, not in his mid-section. The fire spread over his mid section, but Sasuke had time to use his oral rebirth effectively and before it burned his mid-section.



> And shouldn't the distance between Sasuke and Ay not make a difference cosidering you said the technique was instantaneous?


Indeed. Yet Ei moved _after_ Sasuke activated MS and prepared to use Amaterasu, wich missed and clashed with a Samurai because Ei was so fast to leave his field of vision. Sasuke moved before an almost, dead, blind Itachi who was feeling the side effects of Tsukuyomi and Amaterasu shot the black flames.

And i don't know the point of this debate. Tsunade cannot hope to dodge/block/outrun Amaterasu. So Itachi only needs one jutsu to kill her. That's my stance in this fight like i said in my first post.


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## mysticjbyrd (Aug 11, 2013)

Itachi won't be able to beat both of them before going blind.
Their tank feats are too great, and they compliment each other far too well.

Tsunade's standing toe to toe with Madara.  
Itachi aint got shit on Madara.


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## Mithos (Aug 11, 2013)

Itachi can't fight 2 Sannin at once. 

Tsunade and Orochimaru win.


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## Rocky (Aug 11, 2013)

Matto-sama said:


> Itachi can't fight 2 Sannin at once.
> 
> Tsunade and Orochimaru win.



So do tell, how do they get through Susano'o?


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## ImSerious (Aug 11, 2013)

take away his legs and they might stand a chance.


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## Mithos (Aug 11, 2013)

Rocky said:


> So do tell, how do they get through Susano'o?



They don't have to. Susano'o drains Itachi's stamina like crazy; they can just outlast it. He can't defend himself against both of them for long without it (not at all without his arms) so he will be forced to use it. As long as they make sure they don't get hit by Totsuka they'll be fine. 

Oro can block it with Rashoumon, they can use Kage Bunshins, Oro can meld into the ground; as long as they focus on keeping their distance they can evade. A giant wall of thousands of snakes or thousands of Katsuyu clones can obscure vision to mess up Itachi's aim. 

Hell - Oro could probably survive being impaled now that he nows it can seal him. One small white snake made it away so why can't he quickly Oral Rebirth before it takes effect? 

Tsunade may be able to break it like she did to the other Susano'o swords. If she does that, it won't seal her since it won't be connected to Susano'o anymore. I don't know if she can do this or not for sure, but it's possible. 

They have plenty of methods to avoid it if they focus on defense.


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## joshhookway (Aug 11, 2013)

Oro gets totsuka blitzed canon. Tsunade gets Totsuka'ed


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## Grimmjowsensei (Aug 11, 2013)

Itachi soloes 


He can still use his strongest jutsus without an arm. SUsano'o, Amaterasu Tsukiyomi... and this is bloodlusted. From 10 meter distance one of the sannin will die in a heartbeat. Remaining one, whoever he/she is, have no chance to put up a fight alone.


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## FlamingRain (Aug 11, 2013)

Rocky said:


> So do tell, how do they get through Susano'o?



They go around*, not through.

Tsunade going she-hulk draws Itachi's attention by kicking the ground and flipping _Susano'o_ like a pancake or just plain being destructive. Orochimaru slips underground during the distraction and the following MS refractory period before the Kusanagi extends and impales Itachi from behind from underground on the inside of _Susano'o_.

At least one member of team SanNinin is left so they win.


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## Frawstbite (Aug 11, 2013)

kyla1718 said:


> Even if Itachi hits Tsunade with Amaterasu, it is not a one hit KO. You seem to be completely ignoring the fact that Tsunade happens to be the one person in this manga who can tank nearly anything. If it kills her it will take time.....also tsunades tolerance for pain is unmatched...... It is not in her character to roll on her side and cry in pain, she works through it......   Itachi armless shooting Amaterasu at a woman who will keep coming at him is incredibly stupid, he would take a chance getting caught in his own jutsu if she makes contact with him, and it would KO him....



The black flames obscuring her entire body and eyes, as all flames do, would make her a totally useless ally. Unless she can remove them entirely, they spread from head to toe, covering her face and eyes. She can't see through fire, she'll be inhaling smoke, mostly hearing the flames...it'll just be a complete and total disaster until she can go no further.

I have seen this a few times, and am I missing something? Or is there a reason why people think that the flames will stop at her neck?


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## Magicbullet (Aug 11, 2013)

Arms are pretty much superfluous where Itachi's strongest jutsu are concerned. Even with knowledge Orochimaru and Tsunade will be hard pressed to avoid totsuka instakills, a veritable field's worth of Ametaratsu flames and, should they lock eyes with Itachi, a weeks long torture session followed by impalement once they regain consciousness. 

This matchup is basically the same as Itachi vs Orochimaru and Tsunade. All of Itachi's most destructive skills don't require his arms anyway. The sannin will probably have to outlast him and their chances don't look very good.

Without ET, Orochimaru can't overwhelm either.


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## ? (Aug 11, 2013)




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## iJutsu (Aug 11, 2013)

Itachi amaterasus Tsunade and tsukiyomi's Oro. While she's busy ripping her skins off, he totsukas Oro. He then does the same to Tsunade.


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