# Naruto's heart is in Sakura's hands



## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

Do you think this is more symbolism:

Both Naruto's physical and mental heart is in Sakura's hands, as from the first time he saw her he fell in love, and now Sakura is holding it to keep it working.

It is also funny as Hinata 'falls short'  (anybody get it), this task could have been done by any Hyuuga (e.g. Hinata) and yet it is Sakura who ultimately holds his Heart.

I am not even a fan of NaruSaku, and yet that says more to me than any holding hands, mouth-to-mouth, Minato reference etc...

In my opinion it highlights the fact that although Hinata really cares about Naruto, and Naruto sees her as a very good friend who helps him to keep on going and support him, it is Sakura who holds his heart, and this is why Hinata falls short.

It is destiny (Neji ).


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## Overhaul (Feb 5, 2014)

But who will hold Naruto's balls in the end?


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## Golden Circle (Feb 5, 2014)

There's nothing romantic about this at all, unless it has something significant attached with it.

Besides, the girl only wins when the guy reciprocates. Anyone should know this.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

vuke234 said:


> I'm gonna call it, SasuSaku still happens(despite Karin trying her best she lost control and Sasuke is alone again) and NS and NH are both going no where. That's just what is going down at the very end.



After this chapter I want NaruKarin to be honest. Uzumaki4dawin


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## -JT- (Feb 5, 2014)

I don't care much for pairings (other than ShikaIno really), but I was always pro NH during Part 1. However seeing scenes like this has really made me swing over to the NS side, if I had to choose.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

-JT- said:


> I don't care much for pairings (other than ShikaIno really), but I was always pro NH during Part 1. However seeing scenes like this has really made me swing over to the NS side, if I had to choose.



It is still sad as Sakura still sees Naruto as an annoying brother/ best friend imo.


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## Ninja Shadow Warrior (Feb 5, 2014)

Sakura is massaging his love muscle and going mouth to mouth at the same time. Not bad for a first timer. Hell, I was stoked just to hit first base the first time.


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## Kael Hyun (Feb 5, 2014)

Revy said:


> But who will hold Naruto's balls in the end?



Lets not forget who trained with 'The Legendary Sucker'


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## Ninja Shadow Warrior (Feb 5, 2014)

vuke234 said:


> Sasuke is gonna be the one to stick it to her own mouth in the end.



Probably, but there is nothing better to hold over your buddies head than a "I had it first."


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## Mizura (Feb 5, 2014)

Revy said:


> But who will hold Naruto's balls in the end?


Sasuke?


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## Deana (Feb 5, 2014)

Sete said:


> Medics and nurses are such whores...


Yeah, cuz Nurse Sakura and fake Neji had that porn vibe going until she cleaned his clock. XD


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## Sete (Feb 5, 2014)

Deana said:


> Yeah, cuz Nurse Sakura and fake Neji had that porn vibe going until she cleaned his clock. XD



Absolutely man I was all ready for some hentai action there! But well i can fap to a chick making out with a dead guy.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

Rios said:


> Oh come on, your thread is pure baiting, you must be glad you are getting silly responses.



How is it baiting, I don't like NaruSaku or NaruHina to be honest, Sakura does not deserve Naruto, and Naruto does not deserve Hinata imo. After this Chapter I want NaruKarin to continue the Uzumaki legacy.


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## Ninja Shadow Warrior (Feb 5, 2014)

Its night time right?

So would that make Sakura a member of "Midnight Nurses"....? I always did love that flic..


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## Sete (Feb 5, 2014)

Ninja Shadow Warrior said:


> Its night time right?
> 
> So would that make Sakura a member of "Midnight Nurses"....? I always did love that flic..



Hmmm reserch time... for you know...prostate cancer prevention...


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## Deana (Feb 5, 2014)

Sakura: Oops, I did it again. I made my patient believe . . . we're more than just friends.


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## Nic (Feb 5, 2014)

considering there's a 1000 different ways kishi could have gone about it, the symbolism is very real.


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## Ninja Shadow Warrior (Feb 5, 2014)

Sete said:


> Hmmm reserch time... for you know...prostate cancer prevention...



Kakashi calls it 1,000 years of pain. Tobirama calls it a typical Friday night.


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## eluna (Feb 5, 2014)

Well I hope not be the only one to think this "kiss" is just a medic procediment and hold his heart too,c'mon if we take for the romantic side most of the medics will fall in love with patients


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## Ninja Shadow Warrior (Feb 5, 2014)

eluna said:


> Well I hope not be the only one to think this "kiss" is just a medic procediment and hold his heart too,c'mon if we take for the romantic side most of the medics will fall in love with patients



We have no room for logic here. Her mouth was all up on his. What else could it be? hmm?


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## Ninja Shadow Warrior (Feb 5, 2014)

vuke234 said:


> It could have been a dude medic.



Well, your point is solid. It could have been a dude. No good.


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## Sete (Feb 5, 2014)

Ninja Shadow Warrior said:


> Kakashi calls it 1,000 years of pain. Tobirama calls it a typical Friday night.



Prevention is a lot more different than prostate exame. Google it up. And a prostate exame by some people logic must count as anal.


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## hannah (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> Well this thread has degenerated very quickly.



It was degenerate to begin with.

"Any Hyuuga could have done what Sakura did." 

I don't mind the pairing fan symbolism wank. That's what most of them do, all the time anyway. But bashing Sakura's very cool and obviously superior medical skills.
Now that's just...


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## Ninja Shadow Warrior (Feb 5, 2014)

Sete said:


> Prevention is a lot more different than prostate exame. Google it up. And a prostate exame by some people logic must count as anal.



I know the difference, I just couldn't stop from another Tobirama fap moment.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

hannah said:


> It was degenerate to begin with.
> 
> "Any Hyuuga could have done what Sakura did."
> 
> ...



Yes, Concentrate chakra - check (whole jyuken style revolves around this)
pierce chest - check
Manual squeeze the heart - anybody could do it.

In fact it was not just any Hyuuga, but any average joe. If you remember Sakura's Med nin did absolutely nothing at all, hence she resorted to cutting the chest open and squeezing the heart.

Hinata could have easily achieved this even without the Byakugan, so don't sass me.


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## Suzuku (Feb 5, 2014)

vuke234 said:


> I really like to be informed about these 1000 ways plz.


Well one....not having her hold his heart.


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## hannah (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> Yes, Concentrate chakra - check (whole jyuken style revolves around this)
> pierce chest - check
> Manual squeeze the heart - anybody could do it.
> 
> ...



Splitting open a human chest at an appropriate place, grip and massage the heart, yet not injure surrounding tissue, the pericardium, or mess up the capitol blood supply, while maintaining breathing requires medical training. It's not enough to know the surface projection of the location of the hart, to be able to open a chest and just "squeeze". 
"Just any Hyuuga" would have definitely killed Naruto trying to do this.
So don't talk nonsense you ignoramus.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

hannah said:


> Splitting open a human chest at an appropriate place, grip and massage the heart, yet not injure surrounding tissue, the pericardium, or mess up the capitol blood supply, while maintaining breathing requires medical training. It's not enough to know the surface projection of the location of the hart, to be able to open a chest and just "squeeze".
> "Just any Hyuuga" would have definitely killed Naruto trying to do this.
> So don't talk nonsense.



This is a shonen manga:

A) Sakura has no chakra so she should not even be able to do anything chakra related, instead she cuts his body in the right place ---> any academy student should know this, as a ninja such things should be common knowledge, much less a hyuuga who has to know the body for their style to be at full potential, remember not all Hyuugas can see chakra points.

B) Who said Sakura did not injure surrounding tissue, it is simply that the Heart is taking precedence, I mean his ribs must be broken, but once he gets Kyuubi chakra it will heal.

C) constriction of blood to thos points is both natural and with some chakra easy to encourage blockage, remember this is with eyes that can see through skin.

D) Again it is a shonen manga, the same place where putting an eye in the socket magically attatches the optic nerve etc... So yes in Kishi's world any Hyuuga could have done it.


SMH, you do realise that the main target of Hyuuga style is not the chakra points but the inner tissue. Hyuuga plus ninja equals knowledge about the body. Add natural clotting plus Uzumaki body, and it is simple so


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> This is a shonen manga:
> 
> A) Sakura has no chakra so she should not even be able to do anything chakra related, instead she cuts his body in the right place ---> any academy student should know this, as a ninja such things should be common knowledge, much less a hyuuga who has to know the body for their style to be at full potential, remember not all Hyuugas can see chakra points.
> 
> ...



Not to mention that both Madara and Sakura's hands are dirty and yet no infection at all. Kishi does not care about medical practices so much, and I am over doing it as there could be some idiots in the Hyuuga clan that don't know much about Jyuuken and did not do thier physiological studies properly as a ninja, however, there should be enough knowledge and common sense to know what you need to do.


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## Nic (Feb 5, 2014)

anyways one thing is clear.  No one will ever touch Naruto's heart the same way Sakura has.


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## hannah (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> This is a shonen manga:


Does not excuse your lack of understanding of the significance of the medical profession. Fictional or real.



> A) Sakura has no chakra so she should not even be able to do anything chakra related, instead she cuts his body in the right place ---> any academy student should know this, as a ninja such things should be common knowledge, much less a hyuuga who has to know the body for their style to be at full potential, remember not all Hyuugas can see chakra points.


No. If this was common knowledge for every ninja, we would have seen it from some other non medical ninja. It's not.



> B) Who said Sakura did not injure surrounding tissue, it is simply that the Heart is taking precedence, I mean his ribs must be broken, but once he gets Kyuubi chakra it will heal.


If she were to move her fingers in a different position by half a centimeter, she would be stopping his blood flow and piercing the tissue. A human heart can't be held any way you please because it's veins and arteries pump blood trough your body, and back out of it, you could pierce them, block them and the pericardium placed in such a way that you mustn't go near particular areas, since you'd cause a pericardial tamponade and fuck up all your efforts killing Naruto on the spot. Not to mention massaging the heart must include the pressure on the Sino Atrial node. A non medic does not know this.
 She's massaging his heart for him to live. In some non-medics' hands he'd be dead by now. And if nothing here matters like you say and kyuubi chakra fixes all, she would not be doing this.



> C) constriction of blood to thos points is both natural and with some chakra easy to encourage blockage, remember this is with eyes that can see through skin.


This is a bare hand massaging relaxed miyocardium since all chakra flow and all nervous stimulation stopped. If there was chakra running trough Naruto, chakra treatment would help, and Sakura as a medic would know it. Chakra control is not Hyuuga specific.
The only thing Hyuuga do with their chakra is attack as far as I remember. Maybe they'd be good medics, but none of them are.
And no, this is not a "constriction of blood"! 



> D) Again it is a shonen manga, the same place where putting an eye in the socket magically attatches the optic nerve etc... So yes in Kishi's world any Hyuuga could have done it.


"It's a shonen manga" doesn't justify your lack of understanding of the difference between between a medic and a non-medic.
In Kishi's world Hyuuga never have done it, so there is no reason to say they can. If you want to play with magic justifications, you must only use those that already happened. Otherwise you're not only putting Sakura down as a medical ninja, you're pulling Kishi magic out of your ass.



> SMH, you do realise that the main target of Hyuuga style is not the chakra points but the inner tissue. Hyuuga plus ninja equals knowledge about the body. Add natural clotting plus Uzumaki body, and it is simple so


Hyuuga can target all they like. They are still not medics. They don't have the knowledge of the body or its healing. They have knowledge of the body's superficial projection of the inner weak points.

I have a martial arts master who can kick anyone's ass with ease, because he knows where and why to strike. But he doesn't know anything about treatment, or human anatomy half as well as I do.
You equalizing actual medics with fighters who have a superficial knowledge of the human body and no knowledge of medical treatment is irritating.
All for a stupid pairing advocacy.


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## Sete (Feb 5, 2014)

Ninja Shadow Warrior said:


> I know the difference, I just couldn't stop from another Tobirama fap moment.




Seems I missunderstood you my good sir my apologies.
Im a pairing fan and again people are jumping the gun... the last pairing moment was when Madara was impaling my good Tobirama! Dd you feel that sexual tension?Tobirama even said that whatever Madara did do him it would not matter because he was a walking corpse. You have to read between the lines... what a love story gonna start shipping mads tobirama!


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

hannah said:


> Does not excuse your lack of understanding of the significance of the medical profession. Fictional or real.
> 
> 
> No. If this was common knowledge for every ninja, we would have seen it from some other non medical ninja. It's not.
> ...



Dude or dudette I studied Medicine at Imperial, I know what is actually required in real life, however, it is because of that, that I know that Kishi does not follow it as seen in many cases with Jiraiya's arm, Naruto's kyuubi rage mode, Kimmimaro, Sasuke stabbed in the chest near the heart. Obito has many ridiculous feats.

I know that in real life the manouvre is very difficult and requires a lot of skill, the skepticism comes with the fact that this is a universe in which chakra does this for you. The seriousness of a mistake is not accounted for by Kishimoto many times, and he does not consider properly how the body operates.

So yes whilst I was playing devils advocate in saying "any" Hyuuga could do it, you are really over looking this, as Kakashi was pierced by Kakuzu's threads and yet was alright, that would not be the case in real life.

I am actually amazed that you went so overboard into a casual (turned bait) response, I did not need a medical science lecture on it, as quite frankly if all the things were as complicated as they were in real life, so many things would not have happened.

However, I did not want to say that any Hyuuga can do the same technique as Sakura, I meant that just like Sakura they could attempt to restart Naruto's heartbeat, we don't even know whether Sakura's attempt is at all successful or not. It could have been one big fail.

At the end of the day what Naruto needed was a jump start of the Heart, a Hyuuga would use a different method involving chakra around the Heart, here is the speciality of the Hyuuga clan:

*Spoiler*: __ 















A Hyuuga ninja can either activate or deactivate the chakra coils around an organ allowing them to either shut them down or activate (over-activate), this is the same as seen when Neji explained that he could either activate or close chakra points. Thus by using chakra, Hyuugas can do noninvasive surgery, far better than what Sakura is doing with her dirty hands.

Hinata is not just any Hyuuga as she is able to use trigrams 64 palms, and thus can see Chakra points, meaning she would have a good chance to do what is possible for Hyuugas that are good at their craft. Notice how Hinata was looking at his Heart trying to rush over to him in order to help.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

Listen, Sakura is a phenomenal prodigious medical Ninja who is in my books the 3rd best medical ninja in the world, and has the potential to be a kage level ninja if she keeps training.

I was purposely baiting Hannah by saying any average joe could do what in actuality requires insane precision, concentration and knowledge. However, there are two ways to skin a cat, and any Hyuuga could have used a different method that does not involve genius level med ninjutsu (for a 17 year old).


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## Tapion (Feb 5, 2014)

Naruto gettin' that handjob


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## Shattering (Feb 5, 2014)

Hinata was never an option, that girl couldn't be ignored harder, and yes the symbolism is pretty clear IMO, one fell from the race and the other one is holding his heart, if that wasn't enought every single time Naruto speaks about the girl he loves is the pinky one.

Naruhina shippers should give up already, is getting sad


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

I think that people's hate for Sakura is getting to them, it is clear that it is Sakura who is miles ahead. Whilst I would prefer a girl more like Hinata than Sakura, it is clear that Naruto does not share that opinion. Plus Hinata is clearly going to become Heiress after the war, as she would have gotten closer with her father, motivated by Neji, and obtained the wisdom and leadership skills to become clan head, I don't see Naruto being a member of the Hyuga clan (do you?).

It is just to obvious now to deny that Hinata is losing the race and has virtually lost it, unless Sakura still goes for Sasuke, however, she is already really starting to not feel anything for Sasuke hence her fake smile.

It is time to be objective, see past the clouds, if Naruto wanted to be with Hinata he would have been with Hinata already. Naruto really likes Hinata as a friend, and I think they will be very good friends for life, however, Kishimoto has repeatedly had the theme that you don't choose who you love; Jiraiya, Naruto, Hinata, Sakura, Karin, Obito, Ino etc...

If I was in Naruto's shoes I would have respected Sakura's choice and found someone else, it just so happens that Hinata; someone who is kind and fairly strong for her age (Chuunin at 16, and was at one point leading the alliance) actually really likes him, thus most get annoyed with Naruto, and take it out on Sakura.


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## hannah (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> Dude or dudette I studied Medicine at Imperial,


And I'm attending medical school and know you may have studied, but not learned anything since you obviously think heart massage is needed to stop blood clogging here. 



> I know what is actually required in real life, however, it is because of that, that I know that Kishi does not follow it as seen in many cases with Jiraiya's arm, Naruto's kyuubi rage mode, Kimmimaro, Sasuke stabbed in the chest near the heart. Obito has many ridiculous feats.


Irrelevant. Kishi magic is an exception and just because Obito did something you can't decide Hinata can too, by pointing out she's a Hyuuga.



> I know that in real life the manouvre is very difficult and requires a lot of skill, the skepticism comes with the fact that this is a universe in which chakra does this for you.


The chakra is not working. I presume it's because in order to treat with chakra, your patient has to have some of his own up and running. Naruto is basically empty. But I digress, the main point is: Hinata being Hyuuga would not change Naruto loosing chakra. If anything, with her not being a medic, she has less chance of doing anything.



> The seriousness of a mistake is not accounted for by Kishimoto many times, and he does not consider properly how the body operates.


Unless he explicitly pulls chakra magic, you can't claim this. And now that chakra is not working, you really can't claim it.



> So yes whilst I was playing devils advocate in saying "any" Hyuuga could do it, you are really over looking this, as Kakashi was pierced by Kakuzu's threads and yet was alright, that would not be the case in real life.


No mixing of the chakra magic as an indicative of new chakra magic you made up. Only Kishi can do that. Unless Kishi made a Hyuuga heal someone, you can number all other miracle things he made up and it won't matter in proving Hyuuga can heal, because that part was not made up. 

Doing this to put down the significance of Sakura's role as a medic is also annoying.



> I am actually amazed that you went so overboard into a casual (turned bait) response, I did not need a medical science lecture on it, as quite frankly if all the things were as complicated as they were in real life, so many things would not have happened.


I did it to show how you're speculating and I'm proving my point by showing you the difference between a medic and a laymen.



> However, I did not want to say that any Hyuuga can do the same technique as Sakura, I meant that just like Sakura they could attempt to restart Naruto's heartbeat, we don't even know whether Sakura's attempt is at all successful or not. It could have been one big fail.
> At the end of the day what Naruto needed was a jump start of the Heart, a Hyuuga would use a different method involving chakra around the Heart, here is the speciality of the Hyuuga clan:
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...



Accorindg to Kishi magic, he needs a part of kyuubi to live. So we know her "succeeding" is not bringing him back to life, but her keeping him alive until they get there. Since the only way she fails is if Naruto dies, I doubt she'll fail.

Just because medical ninjutsu was not explained in such a way, it does not mean it doesn't involve coil reopening and chakra treatment trough transfer. If anything I'd bet it's something of the sort but much more sophisticated and of course healing orientated. 
All in all, it doesn't matter what Hyuuga were explained of doing and what you presume they could do as medics. Fact remains we don't know what medical ninjustu requires and whether Hyuuga technique can be utilised in such a way. 
Your lack of knowledge on Sakura's justu and little knowledge on Hyuuga doesn't change the fact that Sakura heals and Hyuuga never have. 
Pushing a heart back into pumping is healing, not an attack. So Hyuuga attack can't be observed as something needed.
PS. Naruto is virtually without chakra. I repeat, chakra is not working.



> Hinata is not just any Hyuuga as she is able to use trigrams 64 palms, and thus can see Chakra points, meaning she would have a good chance to do what is possible for Hyuugas that are good at their craft. Notice how Hinata was looking at his Heart trying to rush over to him in order to help.


I don't need byakugan to know exactly where your heart is and to see it in my head by looking at your chest. But I sure as hell wouldn't know how to stick my hand in your chest and fix you, since I'm not a heart surgeon. 
Just because Hinata sees, doesn't mean she can heal and the manga has never given us a reason to think otherwise.
Therefore, you can't use it as proof.



Tahj Sarutobi said:


> Not to mention that both Madara and Sakura's hands are dirty and yet no infection at all.



Crossed my mind right away, but there have been cases wth high risk infection surgeries performed by war sugreouns out of sheer lack of time and space to isolate the blood stream from the outside influence and the patients survived. 
So what Sakura did in terms of infection is fixable in the real world, let alone in the Naruto world, on Naruto himself.


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## Bender (Feb 5, 2014)

Revy said:


> But who will hold Naruto's balls in the end?



This


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## Nic (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> I think that people's hate for Sakura is getting to them, it is clear that it is Sakura who is miles ahead. Whilst I would prefer a girl more like Hinata than Sakura, it is clear that Naruto does not share that opinion. Plus Hinata is clearly going to become Heiress after the war, as she would have gotten closer with her father, motivated by Neji, and obtained the wisdom and leadership skills to become clan head, I don't see Naruto being a member of the Hyuga clan (do you?).
> 
> It is just to obvious now to deny that Hinata is losing the race and has virtually lost it, unless Sakura still goes for Sasuke, however, she is already really starting to not feel anything for Sasuke hence her fake smile.
> 
> ...



ugh i would say Sakura gets far more hate for her feelings towards Sasuke than for any romantic possibilities with Naruto.  If anything Naruto gets most of the hate for liking Sakura.


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## Sete (Feb 5, 2014)

I see a lot of selective reading around... but again I respect everyones opinions. Overall it was a good chapter and sakura was pretty bad ass im my opinion ofc. Ofc I was not reading for the hidden meanings and symbolisms. I leave that to others and thats why I come to nf.


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## Fruits Basket Fan (Feb 5, 2014)

@Nic: No, not really.

NH and SS sadly sideship each other (two pairings are better than one logic) and if Sakura or Naruto do not get on with them "as planned".....they are going to be bashed!

Much like how Naruto is bashed when he revealed that he still loves Sakura to his dad!


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## 민찬영 (Feb 5, 2014)

Nic said:


> anyways one thing is clear.  No one will ever touch Naruto's heart the same way Sakura has.



So much this.


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## Sete (Feb 5, 2014)

Fruits Basket Fan said:


> @Nic: No, not really.
> 
> NH and SS sadly sideship each other (two pairings are better than one logic) and if Sakura or Naruto do not get on with them "as planned".....they are going to be bashed!
> 
> Much like how Naruto is bashed when he revealed that he still loves Sakura to his dad!



Your logic is awfully familiar to some other ships...
And dont forget kids context matters!


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## Nic (Feb 5, 2014)

I just love how Kishi is using Naruto's heart as some type of trophy these last two chapters. 




Fruits Basket Fan said:


> @Nic: No, not really.
> 
> NH and SS sadly sideship each other (two pairings are better than one logic) and if Sakura or Naruto do not get on with them "as planned".....they are going to be bashed!
> 
> Much like how Naruto is bashed when he revealed that he still loves Sakura to his dad!



i know that and your last line is what i mean.  Naruto gets most of the hate for NS, not Sakura.


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## Fruits Basket Fan (Feb 5, 2014)

Sete said:


> Your logic is awfully familiar to some other ships...
> And dont forget kids context matters!



It is fact.

The telegrams reaction to Naruto in chapter 631 was disgusting!

You do not need to be a NS fan to know he gets the short end of the stick here when it comes to his love interest!

Acknowledging his feelings does not mean you support NS !


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## SLB (Feb 5, 2014)

I can't be the only anti-NS that saw the merit of this chapter. It was damn sweet... If anything NS got what it needed all along; a legitimate connection... from Sakura! The pairing became a pairing for me today.

Sakura was brilliant this chapter.


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## Chaelius (Feb 5, 2014)

Sete said:


> Your logic is awfully familiar to some other ships...
> And dont forget kids context matters!



Context didn't really matter when a lot of NH fans were splurging all over themselves while Neji's corpse was still warm on the floor.


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## Selina Kyle (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> Do you think this is more symbolism:
> 
> Both Naruto's physical and mental heart is in Sakura's hands, as from the first time he saw her he fell in love, and now Sakura is holding it to keep it working.
> 
> ...



shit just got real 

i remember naruto talking to yagura about the poor 'kid' not eating the best ramen, getting his first kiss (from a girl) while he was still alive and all that shit. 
nardo, you dead. and now you're getting a kiss of life from the girl you liked for more than half of your life. 

if this shit is fairy tale, the symbolism is crystal clear, i guess. it's an 'awakening of...?' 


it's more or less a fairy tale cuz it's gonna have a happily-ever-after feel to it? would kishi kill naruto after putting him up with shit for about 15 years? probably not. naruto's gonna achieve his dream of becoming the hokage (maybe.) it's an 'epic,' after all. 

but idk what to make of this cuz it's twisted. kishi could've chosen other ways but he decides to go with this gross and sort of heartwarming scene? (no pun intended.)


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

hannah said:


> And I'm attending medical school and know you may have studied, but not learned anything since you obviously think heart massage is needed to stop blood clogging.
> 
> 
> Irrelevant. Kishi magic is an exception and just because Obito did something you can't decide Hinata can too, by pointing out she's a Hyuuga.
> ...



Ignoring the insult on my intellect (as I was not saying that heart massaging is needed to stop clogging SMH), I was stating that there are two ways to skin a cat, Sakura has not healed anything, we see no results, did you see the heart beating? No.

All that we see is Sakura apply a complex technique to manually do what normal med ninjutsu fails to do.

However, Hyuugas are not using medical ninjutsu, rather it objectively sees humans as a machine of wires and points like in electronics.

The fact is I laid out a way which is easy for hyuugas to solve this problem regardless, whereas you are involving speculation about how med ninjutsu works when it is even shown as a different colour, indicating that it's properties have changed. Maybe it does have a mechanism behind it that makes sense.

However, that is irrelevant as I clearly gave you a method in which with little chakra any Hyuuga can do. Notice that Sakura resorted to that method not because Chakra was not working, but rather, she herself had little chakra.

Goodness me, Sakura>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hyuuga at healing, but when it comes to temporary solutions for something like this, it is well within the realm of possibility for the Hyuuga clan so stop being ridiculous.

Stop turning this into something that it is not. Sakura has so many more impressive feats than this, which is impressive in and of itself, note that this is a last resort with the scrap of chakra she has left. Sakura does not have a powerful Byakugan and so can not see individual chakra points required for the Hyuuga method proposed.

We might as well agree to disagree as I feel that I am wasting time on something that was stated offhand by myself noting that a Hyuuga would have been handy in such a situation. Hinata  may have been out of chakra and so might not have been able to do it, but saying that Hyuugas can't do it is stupid, as I already said how a Hyuuga could keep the heart beating with noninvasive surgery.

I bet Sakura could do if she had more chakra. It was not even the focus of the thread, you have succeeded in drawing away from the focus of the thread which is seen in the title.

Do you agree or do you not? Guessing by the images you have I guess you are a NaruHina fan anyway so I should not be surprised. SMH


----------



## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

Moody said:


> I can't be the only anti-NS that saw the merit of this chapter. It was damn sweet... If anything NS got what it needed all along; a legitimate connection... from Sakura! The pairing became a pairing for me today.
> 
> Sakura was brilliant this chapter.



I know, I don't even like NaruSaku, it actually took me a long time to stop disliking Sakura as she was annoying and useless in most cases and I was baffled as to what Naruto sees in her. However, I just accepted that kishi sucks at writing female characters and ended up tolerating Sakura as the genius she is despite her annoying traits.

I see team 7 as a family, I actually at one point wanted NaruHina but quickly saw the end of the road by just trying to imagine how that would turn out (not good). Funny thing is, the series will probably end with either Naruto and nobody, or Naruto and Sakura. However, after this chapter I want Naruto and Karin, A super Uzumaki would be born lol.


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## Naiki (Feb 5, 2014)

Despite the symbolism of where things _might _be heading, I'm glad that Sakura was given the chance to shine once again.

That'll shut those Sakura haters up for a while. She might even shut them up again next chapter when she does something else amazing.


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## Lelouch71 (Feb 5, 2014)

Well Sakura literally having Naruto's heart is bigger than hand holding 

But who knows with Kishi. He likes to tease pairing fans and troll them afterwards. It might be more of the same at least until this manga ends.


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## hannah (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> Ignoring the insult on my intellect (as I was not saying that heart massaging is needed to stop clogging SMH), I was stating that there are two ways to skin a cat, Sakura has not healed anything, we see no results, did you see the heart beating? No.


She has healed plenty of times.
Hinata has never healed.



> However, Hyuugas are not using medical ninjutsu,


Exactly my point.


> The fact is I laid out a way which is easy for hyuugas to solve this problem regardless, whereas you are involving speculation about how med ninjutsu works when it is even shown as a different colour, indicating that it's properties have changed. Maybe it does have a mechanism behind it that makes sense.


My speculation about med ninjutsu is to explain you don't know how it works to point out how you can't say Hyuuga can heal if you don't know how healing works.

I never made any speculation regarding out topic. Sakura healing Naruto.
*You're the one making speculation* on that topic: Hinata maybe could heal Naruto, therefore I'm right. 



> However, that is irrelevant as I clearly gave you a method in which with little chakra any Hyuuga can do.


If you don't know how medical ninjutsu works, you can make up all the methods in the world and that doesn't mean anything. It's not proof. It's you speculating about Kishi magic.



> Notice that Sakura resorted to that method not because Chakra was not working, but rather, she herself had little chakra.


That is possible, but it's also possible chakra is not working. Neither of us can prove otherwise.



> Goodness me, Sakura>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hyuuga at healing, but when it comes to temporary solutions for something like this, it is well within the realm of possibility for the Hyuuga clan so stop being ridiculous.


No it is not, because you have no manga proof to back it up.
You only have your theory, while at the same time no knowledge of what medical ninjutsu is.



> Stop turning this into something that it is not. Sakura has so many more impressive feats than this, which is impressive in and of itself, note that this is a last resort with the scrap of chakra she has left. Sakura does not have a powerful Byakugan and so can not see individual chakra points required for the Hyuuga method proposed.


You made up the Hyuuga method. There is NO Hyuuga method. 



> We might as well agree to disagree as I feel that I am wasting time on something that was stated offhand by myself noting that a Hyuuga would have been handy in such a situation.


Bullshit. 
You clearly used this to make a pairing argument of how Kishi "chose" Sakura while Hinata could have done it. Inadvertently bashing Sakura and all medics in the manga. 



> Hinata  may have been out of chakra and so might not have been able to do it, but saying that Hyuugas can't do it is stupid, as I already said how a Hyuuga could keep the heart beating with noninvasive surgery.


If a Hyuuga ever kept a heart beating  this would be credible. Otherwise you're just fantasizing.



> I bet Sakura could do if she had more chakra. It was not even the focus of the thread, you have succeeded in drawing away from the focus of the thread which is seen in the title.


Focus of the thread is pairing fan symbolism wank. Please, that's what fanclubs are for. I feel no need to show respect to the point of the thread. I find all pairing theorizing ridiculous. I merely addressed what I thought was mean in the OP.



> Do you agree or do you not? Guessing by the images you have I guess you are a NaruHina fan anyway so I should not be surprised. SMH


I don't care about pairing debates. Like I said, I think they are ridiculous.
All I was bothered by was you putting down Sakura while she was fulfilling a role only she can take.


----------



## Naiki (Feb 5, 2014)

Lelouch71 said:


> Well Sakura literally having Naruto's heart is bigger than hand holding
> 
> But who knows with Kishi. He likes to tease pairing fans and troll them afterwards. It might be more of the same at least until this manga ends.




Yeah, he does. He'll give NH something to cheer about, then turn around and give NS something to cheer about. He had the hand-holding incident, needed for chakra transfer and encouragement from Naruto's part. Then, we had this CPR procedure, needed to keep Naruto alive and out of desperation from Sakura.

It's back and forth with him, so . . . I don't know.


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## takL (Feb 5, 2014)

sakura looks so M and karin looks so S in this chap. 
i wouldnt have the indiscretion to say this if i didnt see the sfx　ムクッ（≒rise) in the mouth to mouth breathing panel when kish could have used a more appropriate onomatopoeia for the inflating chest.


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## SLB (Feb 5, 2014)

Naiki said:


> Yeah, he does. He'll give NH something to cheer about, then turn around and give NS something to cheer about. He had the hand-holding incident, needed for chakra transfer and encouragement from Naruto's part. Then, we had this CPR procedure, needed to keep Naruto alive and out of desperation from Sakura.
> 
> It's back and forth with him, so . . . I don't know.



Agreed. At the very least, it's equal trolling now. The weight is the same, and trying to discredit one and boost another as romantic is foolish. 

Both pairings are getting bucked back and forth, and both have clear romantic inclinations. It's a reality folks. Stop deluding yourselves.


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## LazyWaka (Feb 5, 2014)

I'm waiting for official couple status before calling anything.

Lets not forget that Naruhina was practically running victory laps prior to Minato making that "Sakura is like Kushina" statement.


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## Sete (Feb 5, 2014)

Chaelius said:


> Context didn't really matter when a lot of NH fans were splurging all over themselves while Neji's corpse was still warm on the floor.


Not really. I was on the fc that day and in fact it was quite the contrary... At least i don't splur all over myself with fan fiction, parallels and symbolisms...
Enjoyed the chapter, Sakura was badass but i will not come out of the woodwork because CPR...


Fruits Basket Fan said:


> It is fact.
> 
> The telegrams reaction to Naruto in chapter 631 was disgusting!
> 
> ...


 I agree with you it was disgusting and over rated over a comic relief moment. Context!
As far as i can remember the most romantic moment of NS was in the beginning of part 2 with the bells and Kakashi and when Naruto goes 4 tails. After that its downhill. I might be forgetting something tbh. And no Sakuras confession was fake. it does not count...
I cant count this moment as romantic because simply it is not... She is desperately trying to save nardo, there is no symbolism and hidden meanings! You want symbolism go and see neji's bird. Aww man look at me being dragged again to pairing wars. Im done, more than done here. Believe in what you want, the end is at hand soon enough we will see what happens...


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

hannah said:


> She has healed plenty of times.
> Hinata has never healed.
> 
> 
> ...



Please stop trying to look neutral you are not fooling anybody with that foolishness.

1) Why would I wank something that I don't like, it is stupid. Naruto should have been over his academy crush and man up.

2) Shizune and Tsunade could have also been in Sakuras place, I did not attempt to bash Sakura, there is no need to bash Sakura as it is a stupid thing to do in the first place, 17 years old and the 3rd best medic in the world.

3) What you don't seem to get is that what Sakura did was a last resort not due to its complexity, but rather due to her being low on juice, thus it is nowhere near as good as her preffered methods. Now I am saying that it is possible for any Hyuuga to do it with just the skills that have been shown. Does that mean any Hyuuga will do it? No, however, there are many ninja that have not used shunshin, and are not seen with standard equipment like smoke bombs etc... Does that mean they can't do them or have them. The point is that, I told you what the Hyuuga taijutsu is as shown by Kishi, and how you can both activate and close chakra points. Neji used it against Hinata in the negative way and actually damaged the chakra point, thus taking it past what Hyuugas could do to rectivate her Heart.

4) I am not saying that Hyuugas can do everything, as I notice that the damage done to Naruto is not that there is internal bleeding or damage, it is that his body shut down, and so won't respond to techniques designed to accelerate healing or growth. Naruto needs input of chakra plus the managing of that chakra to keep the body running. Specialty of Jyuuken:
- inserting chakra directly into the body
- closing off of chakra points that would allow the control of chakra flow like any circuit.

5) Now do I admit that it is kind of a long shot that Hinata would have the skill to do this effectively? Perhaps, I mean it is something that would need to be practiced but, in life and death situations these things tend to come together in shonen mangas

6) I was really surprised that I was somehow seen as both wanking NaruSaku and bashing Sakura?

7) Sakura is responsible for keeping Shikamaru alive along with Naruto, as well as now keeping Naruto alive manually without the need of much chakra. Sakura healed most of the Shinobi alliance, trumping Tsunade's feat. Sakura baffled Chiyo and Sasori. There is no point or logical reason to bash a character that is already established at a genius of her craft.

8) I understand that Hyuugas are not medical ninjas, and to be honest that was not the point, you don't need to be an electrical engineer to make a make-shift radio out of spare parts, not be a computer technician to fix a computer. Rather a medical Ninja is someone who is prepared for all types of diseases, injuries, surgery procedures etc...

9) Thus me saying that the Hyuuga clan is ideal for one scenario injury, that requires just there base moves used for jyuuken should not be seen as detracting from what Sakura did, as she is not a Hyuuga, she does not have the Byakugan, she does not have much chakra, and she is under tremendous emotional stress. Yet Sakura is perfectly carrying out an insanely difficult operation with one hand, whilst flying in the air very fast.

10) I feel like I have wasted more time than it is worth debating about this, the whole point of this thread was to show how Sakura holding Naruto's heart mirrors the fact that she has held his heart since the beginning of the manga. That is a fact that does not even need to be disputed, I then added in that I notice how Hinata the other love interest fell short (literally collapsed with exhaustion), and that this also mirrors how despite Hinata telling Naruto that she loves him, saving his life, inspiring him and being their to support him, to the degree that he wants Hinata by his side, Naruto still tells his father that Sakura is his girlfriend. Nothing in there was wrong.

11) Kishimoto is famous for using symbolism in Naruto, and whether or not i am reading into it too much is up for debate, but to me it makes perfect sense.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

This thread is not even by a NaruSaku fan, I am just saying what I see. What I see does not equal what I want.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

Also, the fact is that the act itself is a very standard thing, I see Sakura as a sister and good friend to Naruto, and the act of CPR and keeping your family alive is normal, nothing romantic about it. I was just then noticing the irony of how well the current situation matches up to the history of the SakuNaruHina triangle (or line).


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## SLB (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> This thread is not even by a NaruSaku fan, I am just saying what I see. What I see does not equal what I want.



Quite a few people in most fandoms do not understand that. Just because you acknowledge a concept in a story, does not mean you subscribe to that concept or everything it connects to.


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## Danzio (Feb 5, 2014)

takL said:


> sakura looks so *M* and karin looks so *S* in this chap.
> i wouldnt have the indiscretion to say this if i didnt see the sfx　ムクッ（≒rise) in the mouth to mouth breathing panel when kish could have used a more appropriate onomatopoeia for the inflating chest.




What do you mean ? I have no clue, whatsoever. Lol.


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## Sete (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> This thread is not even by a NaruSaku fan, I am just saying what I see. What I see does not equal what I want.



Then your title is quite misleading and can be seen as bait... Just sayin! 
Enjoyed the chapter, the cpr was unexpected but it delivered the drama and sense or urgency needed. Almost as enjoyable as seeing Sasuke getting stabbed.
And my poor Tobirama pinned to the ground.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

Sete said:


> Then your title is quite misleading and can be seen as bait... Just sayin!
> Enjoyed the chapter, the cpr was unexpected but it delivered the drama and sense or urgency needed. Almost as enjoyable as seeing Sasuke getting stabbed.
> And my poor Tobirama pinned to the ground.



Well from what I can see, in the romantic sense this has been true since day 1, in fact, I thought that even NaruHina fans knew this, they would surely argue that Naruto will eventually grow out of his crush on Sakura. The title was just that now Sakura is literally holding his heart, just a play on words.


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## hannah (Feb 5, 2014)

Tahj Sarutobi said:


> Please stop trying to look neutral you are not fooling anybody with that foolishness.


I prefer NaruHina, but I don't debate pairings not now or ever. Pairing debates are stupid to me.



> 1) Why would I wank something that I don't like, it is stupid. Naruto should have been over his academy crush and man up.


What are you on about? 
Who cares? 



> 2) Shizune and Tsunade could have also been in Sakuras place, I did not attempt to bash Sakura, there is no need to bash Sakura as it is a stupid thing to do in the first place, 17 years old and the 3rd best medic in the world.


You belittled the medical method by theorizing some ass pull ideas of how anyone can heal.



> 3) What you don't seem to get is that what Sakura did was a last resort not due to its complexity, but rather due to her being low on juice, thus it is nowhere near as good as her preffered methods.


You can't know or prove this to be true. Stop mentioning it.


> Now I am saying that it is possible for any Hyuuga to do it with just the skills that have been shown.


You can't know or prove this to be true. Stop mentioning it.



> Does that mean any Hyuuga will do it? No, however, there are many ninja that have not used shunshin, and are not seen with standard equipment like smoke bombs etc... Does that mean they can't do them or have them. The point is that, I told you what the Hyuuga taijutsu is as shown by Kishi, and how you can both activate and close chakra points. Neji used it against Hinata in the negative way and actually damaged the chakra point, thus taking it past what Hyuugas could do to rectivate her Heart.


You can't know or prove this to be true. Stop mentioning it.


> 4) I am not saying that Hyuugas can do everything, as I notice that the damage done to Naruto is not that there is internal bleeding or damage, it is that his body shut down, and so won't respond to techniques designed to accelerate healing or growth. Naruto needs input of chakra plus the managing of that chakra to keep the body running. Specialty of Jyuuken:
> - inserting chakra directly into the body
> - closing off of chakra points that would allow the control of chakra flow like any circuit.


Just because you know how Hyuuga technique works doesn't mean it is anything close to enough in place of even a minor treatment of a medic.
You can't know or prove otherwise to be true. Stop mentioning it.



> 5) Now do I admit that it is kind of a long shot that Hinata would have the skill to do this effectively?


Of course it is a long shot. No, longer.



> 6) I was really surprised that I was somehow seen as both wanking NaruSaku and bashing Sakura?


Not intentionally, but yes.



> 7) Sakura is responsible for keeping Shikamaru alive along with Naruto, as well as now keeping Naruto alive manually without the need of much chakra. Sakura healed most of the Shinobi alliance, trumping Tsunade's feat. Sakura baffled Chiyo and Sasori. There is no point or logical reason to bash a character that is already established at a genius of her craft.


You bashed the feat she just did. It looked awesome and you took it away by saying anyone can do it. Just acknowledging her other feats now doesn't change that.



> 8) I understand that Hyuugas are not medical ninjas, and to be honest that was not the point, you don't need to be an electrical engineer to make a make-shift radio out of spare parts, not be a computer technician to fix a computer. Rather a medical Ninja is someone who is prepared for all types of diseases, injuries, surgery procedures etc...


There is no reason to believe basic medical technique is comparable to cutting a person's chest open and massaging their heart.
It's not something you "figure out" in real life, and if it is in the manga you can't know or prove this to be true. Stop mentioning it.



> 9) Thus me saying that the Hyuuga clan is ideal for one scenario injury, that requires just there base moves used for jyuuken should not be seen as detracting from what Sakura did, as she is not a Hyuuga, she does not have the Byakugan, she does not have much chakra, and she is under tremendous emotional stress. Yet Sakura is perfectly carrying out an insanely difficult operation with one hand, whilst flying in the air very fast.


You can't prove Hyuuga can heal any injury. Not any scenario of healing. Ever.
It's not about Sakura's feat alone. I already said this. It's about all medics. You're making shit up about the skill requirement for a situation.
Sakura doesn't need a byakugan. She needs knowledge and skill. Hinata has neither of those.



> 10) I feel like I have wasted more time than it is worth debating about this, the whole point of this thread was to show how Sakura holding Naruto's heart mirrors the fact that she has held his heart since the beginning of the manga.


I don't care about that. It's a pretty metaphor. But irrelevant. 



> That is a fact that does not even need to be disputed, I then added in that I notice how Hinata the other love interest fell short (literally collapsed with exhaustion), and that this also mirrors how despite Hinata telling Naruto that she loves him, saving his life, inspiring him and being their to support him, to the degree that he wants Hinata by his side, Naruto still tells his father that Sakura is his girlfriend. Nothing in there was wrong.


Still irrelevant. I don't see the point in mentioning this. I don't care.



> 11) Kishimoto is famous for using symbolism in Naruto, and whether or not i am reading into it too much is up for debate, but to me it makes perfect sense.


And I still don't care.


----------



## Fruits Basket Fan (Feb 5, 2014)

Sete said:


> Not really. I was on the fc that day and in fact it was quite the contrary... At least i don't splur all over myself with fan fiction, parallels and symbolisms...
> Enjoyed the chapter, Sakura was badass but i will not come out of the woodwork because CPR...
> 
> I agree with you it was disgusting and over rated over a comic relief moment. Context!
> ...



Dude, get your black and white pairing mind fixed!

I am not a NS fan nor have I claimed Sakura's confession was real !  The topic was about Naruto's feelings and the nasty expectations on him to reciprocate Hinata's feelings despite having his own!

Sakura's reaction was the comic relief while Naruto was telling the truth since Minato made the comparison after the reaction.  And Naruto show jealousy when Sakura notices Sasuke first next chapter when both saved her.  Never once did I say Sakura loves Naruto, just that Naruto loves Sakura not Hinata.  Fact!

Acknowledging one person's feelings does not equal end game nor reciprocation!


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## Amatérasu’s Son (Feb 5, 2014)

So weird. The only thing that I thought of was that kishi must've been watching the Marvel Agents of Shield episode where Gemma and Coulson kept an Asgardian alive with the heart massage method.

I was just thinking "get it Sakura! Hell Yeah!" I was just seeing badass dirty field surgery. I'm sure Tsunade would've done the same thing. And there in addition to it being her friend and teammate she seemed to be putting her pride as a combat medic on the line with the, "You're not dying on my watch!".


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## Raniero (Feb 5, 2014)

That was suppose to be symbolism...?

Either you're a retard (I'm leaning more towards this to be perfectly honest) or you're seriously overestimating Kishi's abilities as a writer, in which case he's shown to be a rather incompetent writer at this point.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

hannah said:


> I prefer NaruHina, but I don't debate pairings not now or ever. Pairing debates are stupid to me.
> 
> 
> What are you on about?
> ...



Do I know whether or not Iruka can do 10 pushups in a row; no, as it can not be proven, but I know his stamina and strength, and the job that he does allowing deductions. This forum, is a place where people speculate and make theories based on evidence, which I have provided.

The whole part of me saying anybody is an exaggeration, but what I am saying is that this condition of heart failure that is not due to puncture or disease can be done by a Hyuuga, the mechanism can be achieved by a Hyuuga, is Sakura doing it going to give a higher chance of survival, hell yes, but we all know that by plot Naruto is going to survive somehow anyway. Hence the reason why in my earlier posts, despite some baiting in them, I said how this is a shonen manga, Kishi can write anything and by a miracle and some plausibility it would work.

Even Sakura's current method is not good because like I said 'dirty hands', moreover, I referenced how Kishimoto pays little attention to the medical aspect of his manga, thus why in this manga it would not make much of a difference if it was a Hyuuga doing the proposed method.

What I did was:

1) give a method never shown in the manga and we have no proof a Hyuuga would ever do, but it is possible with the skillset of Jyuuken and Byakugan

2) Showed how kishi pays little attention to the medical side and sometimes outright ignores it.

3) Highlighted that there were at least two other amazing medical Ninja who could have done the same thing

4) I showed that even if something is not shown, does not mean that it is impossible, and I do not even need it to be likely, as the standard that Kishi requires for an explanation in the story is not that high.

5) I in no way meant that to detract from the amazing way that Kishi did keep Naruto alive, despite the possible copouts that could have been employed.

6) It is because there were several other ways Kishimoto could have gone about this, that it brought on my observance which is the main point of the thread, which you don't care about.

7) Why post in a thread about a topic you care nothing about, if you don't like metaphors GTFO

8) If you don't want to GTFO, then we can continue to discuss why you feel that I slandered Sakura's awesomeness this chapter by highlighting the fact that Kishimoto could have used several other characters to achieve the same result, even if none where as impressive and well thought out as what Sakura demonstrated today. However, even close chested CPR could have been passed off, and if Naruto survived we would have accepted it. It is only that Sakura resorted to open-chested CPR that the situation magnified, as it is at least twice as effective compared to close-chested CPR.

9) The fact is Sakura is acting like a life support to keep the heart pumping, we won't know whether or not close chested cpr is enough as Sakura (quite rightly so) did not want to take the risk.

10) Because I was able to construct several plausible (within Naruto realm) methods, and ways in which Naruto could have been kept alive by fodder and Hyuuga alike, or even elite medical ninja, I therefore was able to justify my first post in which I stated that any Hyuuga could have done the task. (I did not originally intend it to mean the open chest surgery, but your long post tempted me to troll you)

11) Can a Hyuuga do close chested CPR? Can a Hyuuga activate and close chakra points without cutting the body? If the answer to both of those is yes, I rest my case.


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## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 5, 2014)

Raniero said:


> That was suppose to be symbolism...?
> 
> Either you're a retard (I'm leaning more towards this to be perfectly honest) or you're seriously overestimating Kishi's abilities as a writer, in which case he's shown to be a rather incompetent writer at this point.



Why does it even have to be one of those cases?

1) It is near valentines day
2)Sakura is doing CPR which is commonly joked about in romance due to the closeness of the procedure it is why most men wish that if they have to be saved by CPR that it is by an attractive woman. Of course they will settle with their life being saved.
3) It was a thread by me expressing what came to mind when I saw the chapter, and this is coming from someone that concludes that Sakura views Naruto as a brother (you know the annoying younger brother type, that you also get along with quite well).
4) Whether or not Kishi actively put it as symbolism is the purpose of the thread discussion, and so I would assume that you believe that Kishi definetely did not mean it that way, and so this thread is just based on a coincidence of situation that curretly matches the love interest line:
Hinata---->Naruto----->Sakura----->???Sasuke???


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## Ninja Shadow Warrior (Feb 5, 2014)

You guys take your pairings pretty damn seriously.. It's almost a little disturbing.


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## Scarlet Ammo (Feb 5, 2014)

Dang. I was hoping Kishi wouldn't go for the "hook up main hero with main heroine" trope. But it sure does look like it.

But I doubt all that Hinata teasing was for nothing.

I feel like the only person left who believe's Sakura's best partner is Lee.


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## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 5, 2014)

Raniero said:


> That was suppose to be symbolism...?
> 
> Either you're a retard (I'm leaning more towards this to be perfectly honest) or you're seriously overestimating Kishi's abilities as a writer, in which case he's shown to be a rather incompetent writer at this point.


thats what i was going to say, i didn't get a symbolism vibe. 


Scarlet Ammo said:


> Dang. I was hoping Kishi wouldn't go for the "hook up main hero with main heroine" trope. But it sure does look like it.
> 
> But I doubt all that Hinata teasing was for nothing.
> 
> I feel like the only person left who believe's Sakura's best partner is Lee.


Cry Me A River x Justin Timberlake ft. Hinata 

Hey, I'm a LeeSaku shipper too.


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## B.o.t.i (Feb 5, 2014)

apprently naruto does'nt have lungs  just a heart


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## runsakurarun (Feb 5, 2014)

She energizes him with her chakra flowing throughout his body, 

her hand in his heart, 

her lips in his mouth 

and her breath in his lungs.

That's how heroines do it.


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## FitzChivalry (Feb 5, 2014)

Well there was a certain symbolism to it. Not hard to see it. Then again, if someone chose to actively ignore it and dismiss as Sakura simply doing her job, well, I can understand that to. I really thought the mouth to mouth would get a massive thread though.


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## Kanga (Feb 5, 2014)

Honestly, it's just Kishi being Kishi with his teasing. No one in their right mind should take this seriously. 



Revy said:


> But who will hold Naruto's balls in the end?





Freakin Revy.


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## Hydro Spiral (Feb 5, 2014)

Scarlet Ammo said:


> I feel like the only person left who believe's Sakura's best partner is Lee.



You are not alone


----------



## Abanikochan (Feb 5, 2014)

So if the fastest way to a woman's heart is through Kakashi's hands  
then the fastest way to a man's heart is through Sakura's hands?


----------



## Mizura (Feb 6, 2014)

FitzChivalry said:


> Well there was a certain symbolism to it. Not hard to see it. Then again, if someone chose to actively ignore it and dismiss as Sakura simply doing her job, well, I can understand that to. I really thought the mouth to mouth would get a massive thread though.


In my opinion a pairing is based on both romantic and non-romantic foundations like respect, support, etc. Thus, from a pairing perspective, it is quite possible for NaruSaku supporters to appreciate the moment even while acknowledging it to be completely platonic.

This moment basically shows Sakura supporting Naruto's dreams (good) and entirely dedicated to saving him (good), plus shows some character development (good - nothing to do with relations, but still good). They don't prove anything romantic, but if (only if) they ever do hook up, they'd still count as pluses in a relationship. See?


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 6, 2014)

Mizura said:


> In my opinion a pairing is based on both romantic and non-romantic foundations like respect, support, etc. Thus, from a pairing perspective, it is quite possible for NaruSaku supporters to appreciate the moment even while acknowledging it to be completely platonic.
> 
> This moment basically shows Sakura supporting Naruto's dreams (good) and entirely dedicated to saving him (good), plus shows some character development (good - nothing to do with relations, but still good). They don't prove anything romantic, but if (only if) they ever do hook up, they'd still count as pluses in a relationship. See?



Just a little FYI We've known that Sakura has supported Naruto's Dream sense the Chunin exam, hell she almost disqualified them out of the first part because she didn't want to risk him losing that dream. : already


----------



## Rios (Feb 6, 2014)

Abanikochan said:


> So if the fastest way to a woman's heart is through Kakashi's hands
> then the fastest way to a man's heart is through Sakura's hands?



You mean the fastest way to a man's ass is through Kakashi's hands.


----------



## Mizura (Feb 6, 2014)

ch1p said:


> "just for your information narusaku this" directed at Mizura.


That did made me chuckle. xD To answer the original poster: of course I know. It's just that the occasional follow-up is always nice. 

So anyway, as I was saying, this moment was entirely platonic. Sakura's just performing CPR on a very dear friend. However, this counts as one of the things Sakura has done for Naruto, which would still be a plus -if- they ever hook up (I'm not arguing whether they will or not). If they don't hook up, it'd just count towards the things showing that she's a very good friend to him.


----------



## Rios (Feb 6, 2014)

What if them hooking up ruins their friendship? You know it can happen, its a real world thing.


----------



## Mizura (Feb 6, 2014)

Rios said:


> What if them hooking up ruins their friendship? You know it can happen, its a real world thing.


They haven't hooked up, so it's a rather premature question, no? :S


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 6, 2014)

Rios said:


> You mean the fastest way to a man's ass is through Kakashi's hands.





I'm sorry what? in what way do past events lead you to say that?


----------



## Rios (Feb 6, 2014)

Kael Hyun said:


> I'm sorry what? in what way do past events lead you to say that?



Link removed

Naruto liked it initially, what the hell 



Mizura said:


> They haven't hooked up, so it's a rather premature question, no? :S



Its a valid question because as we know a pairing will only happen in the very end of this manga, when Kishimoto doesnt have the time and energy to troll anymore.


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 6, 2014)

Rios said:


> Link removed
> 
> Naruto liked it initially, what the hell



Ah! Well in that case it was revenge for the first Bell Test and in helping take down Garra he turned it into a valid move. Kunai with exploding tag and all. 



> Its a valid question because as we know a pairing will only happen in the very end of this manga, when Kishimoto doesnt have the time and energy to troll anymore.



No its not really seeing as were probably not going to see much of the relationship. It also doesn't hurt that we've seen there relationship grow on panel so we know they work well together in that they keep each other in check. There basically Jiraiya/Tsunade 2.0 without Naruto being a Huge perv to drive Sakura away from him.


----------



## Mizura (Feb 6, 2014)

Rios said:


> Its a valid question because as we know a pairing will only happen in the very end of this manga, when Kishimoto doesnt have the time and energy to troll anymore.


Perhaps, it's just from my POV, I'm afraid the only answer I can give you is "insufficient information to answer." If they do hook up, I'm just expecting their interactions to remain mostly similar, except the dates are serious. There could be all sorts of complications, but well, you'd be asking me to build scenarios based on very little information, since Kishimoto has been focusing more on other stuff.


----------



## takL (Feb 6, 2014)

Danzio said:


> What do you mean ? I have no clue, whatsoever. Lol.



my bad.  i wanted to say sakuras operation looks  S(sadistic) and karins enduring gurugurus cuttage justsu looks M(maso).
and the 'ムクッ' sfx is in this panel


----------



## Danzio (Feb 6, 2014)

takL said:


> my bad.  i wanted to say sakuras operation looks  S(sadistic) and karins enduring gurugurus cuttage justsu looks M(maso).
> and the 'ムクッ' sfx is in this panel





Thanks, bud. I felt like I wasn't in the know, somehow.


The mood has definitely changed.


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 6, 2014)

takL said:


> my bad.  i wanted to say sakuras operation looks  S(sadistic) and karins enduring gurugurus cuttage justsu looks M(maso).
> and the 'ムクッ' sfx is in this panel



It's actually an apt onomatopoeia for someone doing CPR seeing as the person doing it is looking for the *rise* and fall of the recipients chest. nothing Sadistic or Maso(? Masochistic?) about anything she did.


----------



## takL (Feb 6, 2014)

Kael Hyun said:


> It's actually an apt onomatopoeia for someone doing CPR seeing as the person doing it is looking for the *rise* and fall of the recipients chest. nothing Sadistic or Maso(? Masochistic?) about anything she did.



naa kish could have used a more common  onomatopoeia for the inflation like プゥー, プクッ etc .


----------



## Nic (Feb 6, 2014)

takL said:


> naa kish could have used a more common  onomatopoeia for the inflation like プゥー, プクッ etc .



that's what has you thinking it looks sadistic?  Not the part where she cuts Naruto open takes his heart in her hands and squeezes it? lol


----------



## takL (Feb 6, 2014)

Nic said:


> that's what has you thinking it looks sadistic?  Not the part where she cuts Naruto open takes his heart in her hands and squeezes it? lol



i refrain from being too blunt   but the  'rise' sfx is too naughty in the serious panel .
 i kinda see what kish did there.


----------



## Nic (Feb 6, 2014)

too  naughty? wut?


----------



## Sage (Feb 6, 2014)

Ironic because she was one of the people who has hurt it many times in the past and now being the one to heal and revive it


----------



## Hitt (Feb 6, 2014)

Ah takL throwing gas on the fire.

This just gets better and better 

(and I know that's not your intention takL but ..pairings...)


----------



## takL (Feb 6, 2014)

Nic said:


> too  naughty? wut?



u know what 'Rise' can mean, dont ya?


----------



## takL (Feb 6, 2014)

Nic said:


> takl has a dirty mind.



^ and u too yes,nic? 
I know rescue breathing is far from kissing, not lip to lip,  nothing erotic  and sakura would do the same to sasuke, lee or anyone from konoha....still the sfx  is naughty.


----------



## Nic (Feb 6, 2014)

oh i do, which makes me wonder why i didn't catch up to what you were saying sooner.


----------



## maltyy (Feb 6, 2014)

Proof after all this time that Sakura is still Naruto's 'heart throb'


----------



## Danzio (Feb 6, 2014)

I need to step up my perv game. I didn't even focus on that part. Ha.

Knowing this forum it had exploded if Naruto got an unconscious boner while receiving CPR from a male.


----------



## Sayuri (Feb 6, 2014)

> Naruto's heart is in Sakura's hands



_literally_ 

(this is how you use literally properly guys kthx)


----------



## Alexdhamp (Feb 6, 2014)

takL said:


> naa kish could have used a more common  onomatopoeia for the inflation like プゥー, プクッ etc .



Except when you perform CPR(mouth-to-mouth), you don't look for inflation, you watch for the chest to rise so you know your breath is reaching their lungs.


----------



## takL (Feb 6, 2014)

Danzio said:


> an unconscious boner while receiving CPR from a male.



i  dont want to see kabuto doin that to sasuke tbh.



Alexdhamp said:


> Except when you perform CPR(mouth-to-mouth), you don't look for inflation, you watch for the chest to rise so you know your breath is reaching their lungs.



i havent seen the sfx  ムクツ　being used for a ＣＲＴ scene. have u?


----------



## Sennin of Hardwork (Feb 6, 2014)

Didn't think it looked that symbolic because when I saw it the first thing that I thought was how badass and cool was the method that Sakura was using to keep him alive. Besides isn't symbolism supposed to be subtle and not so literally, like Sayuri said?

This forms part of Sakura's goal, protecting and saving Naruto and Sasuke. One half of it is going underway right now.


----------



## Nic (Feb 6, 2014)

Sennin of Hardwork said:


> Didn't think it looked that symbolic because when I saw it the first thing that I thought was how badass and cool was the method that Sakura was using to keep him alive. Besides isn't symbolism supposed to be subtle and not so literally, like Sayuri said?
> 
> This forms part of Sakura's goal, protecting and saving Naruto and Sasuke. One half of it is going underway right now.



it is still subtle from the fact that the purpose the act has no literal connection to the symbolism.


----------



## Naiki (Feb 6, 2014)

^ Then, there is the symbolism of Hinata falling short and Sakura holding Naruto's heart and giving him mouth-to-mouth. I'd say that's pretty darn literal, but a subtle symbolism as far as the emotional sense of it.


----------



## Sennin of Hardwork (Feb 6, 2014)

One would have to ignore then the symbolism there was when he and Hinata were able to read each other's eyes.



Nic said:


> it is still subtle from the fact that the purpose the act has no literal connection to the symbolism.



Holding his heart was so that she could do the compressions. Not sure where the subtleness is.


----------



## Nic (Feb 6, 2014)

Sennin of Hardwork said:


> One would have to ignore then the symbolism there was when he and Hinata were able to read each other's eyes.
> 
> 
> 
> Holding his heart was so that she could do the compressions. Not sure where the subtleness is.



which is what i said is the literal purpose, not sure what you're getting confused by? 


not exactly hard to see what her holding to his heart means symbolically though.  Even most youtube reviewers who could give a shit about pairings mention that symbolism in their reviews.


----------



## Alexdhamp (Feb 6, 2014)

takL said:


> i  dont want to see kabuto doin that to sasuke tbh.
> 
> 
> 
> *i havent seen the sfx  ムクツ　being used for a ＣＲＴ scene. have u?*



How many CPR scenes have you seen done correctly where the person administering it watches for the patient's chest to *rise* and *fall* as they _should_? My point is simply you don't watch for the lungs to inflate, you watch for the visual movement of the chest rising. Hence something depicting the rise of the chest as the lungs fill up with air is more apt. You're watching the chest* rise*, not the lungs inflate with oxygen/air(yes, that's obviously what's happening, but it's not the visual cue you're looking out for when you perform mouth-to-mouth).


----------



## Sage (Feb 6, 2014)

Sakura is using the hand she wipes her ass with to handle Naruto's heart. 

Gaiz what does this symbolize? is this suppose to mean she is shitting on Naruto's heart?

I don't gets its, someone please explain how symbolism works


----------



## Nic (Feb 6, 2014)

Sage said:


> Sakura is using the hand she wipes her ass with to handle Naruto's heart.
> 
> Gaiz what does this symbolize? is this suppose to mean she is shitting on Naruto's heart?
> 
> I don't gets its, someone please explain how symbolism works



Hinata sees Naruto's heart fading with a nice little close up from kishi. 
Hinata runs towards it and falls flat on her face. 
Sakura runs off with Naruto.
Sakura grabs hold of Naruto's heart. 

the symbolism is quite clear to me.


----------



## takL (Feb 6, 2014)

Alexdhamp said:


> How many CPR scenes have you seen done correctly where the person administering it watches for the patient's chest to *rise* and *fall* as they _should_? My point is simply you don't watch for the lungs to inflate, you watch for the visual movement of the chest rising. Hence something depicting the rise of the chest as the lungs fill up with air is more apt. You're watching the chest* rise*, not the lungs inflate with oxygen/air(yes, that's obviously what's happening, but it's not the visual cue you're looking out for when you perform mouth-to-mouth).



i have done mouth-to-mouth breathing myself. and  its not like ムクッ. its more like フワッ　or  ブワッ.


----------



## Alexdhamp (Feb 6, 2014)

takL said:


> i have done mouth-to-mouth breathing myself. and  its not like ムクッ. its more like フワッ　or  ブワッ.



Ｔｈａｔ's light movement, right? Or airy and fluffy? Isn't that usually given for the state of something happening(movement) and not something your watching occur? Would you use フワ to show that the movement is being watched or observed?

EDIT: More importantly, it doesn't express something rising, right? As* rise* is the keyword here as that's what's happening with Naruto's chest and what Sakura is observing.


----------



## Seto Kaiba (Feb 6, 2014)

people arguing seriously over a sound effect? 

like what the hell...?


----------



## Selina Kyle (Feb 6, 2014)

Seto Kaiba said:


> people arguing seriously over a sound effect?
> 
> like what the hell...?



it's very important to know so that they can write their thesis in shippingtology


----------



## Kage (Feb 6, 2014)

Seto Kaiba said:


> people arguing seriously over a sound effect?
> 
> like what the hell...?



people were having fun using "rise" as an innuendo and that just. won't. *do.*


----------



## Nic (Feb 6, 2014)

If it had risen for sasuke there would be ten threads about it.


----------



## Selina Kyle (Feb 6, 2014)

Nic said:


> If it had risen for sasuke there would be ten threads about it.



you're grossly underestimating


----------



## takL (Feb 6, 2014)

Alexdhamp said:


> Ｔｈａｔ's light movement, right? Or airy and fluffy? Isn't that usually given for the state of something happening(movement) and not something your watching occur? Would you use フワ to show that the movement is being watched or observed?



yep. while　ムクッ is usually used for something solid or  heavy abruptly moving upward. like when someone suddenly rises (erects) their head,  the  upper part or any stiff part of their body by themself, and Not for something being pumped up  as expected with artificial respiration.



Seto Kaiba said:


> people arguing seriously over a sound effect?



well peeps at 2ch and futaba had fun with this inappropriate sound effect


----------



## Kickflip Uzumaki (Feb 6, 2014)

Hitt said:


> Pairing debates can happen over ink splotches on the page... so yeah.



Naked Snake never had this problem


----------



## Abanikochan (Feb 6, 2014)

takL said:


> yep. while　ムクッ is usually used for something solid or  heavy abruptly moving upward. like when someone suddenly rises (erects) their head,  the  upper part or any stiff part of their body by themself, and Not for something being pumped up  as expected with artificial respiration.
> 
> 
> 
> well peeps at 2ch and futaba had fun with this inappropriate sound effect



At least she's not defibbing him....into her hair.


----------



## Nic (Feb 6, 2014)

See 2ch agree Naruto got a boner out of this.


----------



## Sage (Feb 6, 2014)

Nic said:


> See 2ch agree Naruto got a boner out of this.



Well thats not good. If she keeps applying more pressure to his heart more blood will keep rushing down to his dick. She should switch hands so her left hand can give him a quick tugging and release some of that pressure down there, while still giving him CPR. Take multi-tasking to a whole new level 

Any guy would awaken fully rejuvenated from an experience like that. ... but that could also have a negative effect where he might just go back to sleep after


----------



## Fruits Basket Fan (Feb 6, 2014)

Ewwwww !!!!

Sound effect means Naruto will get a boner ????


----------



## Nic (Feb 6, 2014)

Fruits Basket Fan said:


> Ewwwww !!!!
> 
> Sound effect means Naruto will get a boner ????



You'll have to get the uncut version of the animated episode for this.


----------



## Sage (Feb 7, 2014)

Fruits Basket Fan said:


> Ewwwww !!!!
> 
> Sound effect means Naruto will get a boner ????



Its probably more symbolism.

bone-r... 

as in he is going to bone-her


----------



## Jo-nov (Feb 7, 2014)

Seto Kaiba said:


> people arguing seriously over a sound effect?
> 
> like what the hell...?


The crazy thing is that it could be justified.  



takL said:


> yep. while　ムクッ is usually used for something solid or  heavy abruptly moving upward. like when someone suddenly rises (erects) their head,  the  upper part or any stiff part of their body by themself, and Not for something being pumped up  as expected with artificial respiration.
> 
> 
> 
> well peeps at 2ch and futaba had fun with this inappropriate sound effect



Thanks for the detailed answer on that.  Wow, this scene is going to places I would have never predicted.


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 7, 2014)

this sound effect gonna make NS stans on tumblr more annoying than they already are. 

fuck.


----------



## Fruits Basket Fan (Feb 7, 2014)

Not as bad as NH when it thought it won over the hand holding chakra flowing....

But to be fair, tumblr is a shitty place for shitty tards!


----------



## ichihimelove (Feb 7, 2014)

Japanese blogs make fun for ムクッ (SFX) sound effect 



> キスしたらムクッと勃起した？
> He got boner (erection) after kiss





*Edit:*
I found video in youtube about that sound effect 

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRv4117WmQ4[/YOUTUBE]


----------



## Rosi (Feb 7, 2014)

takL said:


> u know what 'Rise' can mean, dont ya?




oh Kishi.


----------



## PAWS (Feb 7, 2014)

Sakura will always be the girl who touched his heart, Hinata will never be able to fill that void.


----------



## Azula (Feb 7, 2014)

naruto's dead body getting a boner from the 'kiss'

:S


----------



## PAWS (Feb 7, 2014)

-Azula- said:


> naruto's dead body getting a boner from the 'kiss'
> 
> :S



lol its definitely the chest.


----------



## Benzaiten (Feb 7, 2014)

lawl dat kishimoto


----------



## Raiden (Feb 7, 2014)

Well yes, I did also think that there was some symoblism to this.

But I'm not sure if it's what you said. I feel (literally it's intuitive) that the mangaka is almost telling us the OPPOSITE of what's in the OP.


----------



## αshɘs (Feb 7, 2014)

Sennin of Hardwork said:


> Didn't think it looked that symbolic because when I saw it the first thing that I thought was how badass and cool was the method that Sakura was using to keep him alive. Besides isn't symbolism supposed to be subtle and not so literally, like Sayuri said?
> 
> This forms part of Sakura's goal, protecting and saving Naruto and Sasuke. One half of it is going underway right now.



Well, to be frank, it's not like Kishi is being known for subtlety 

but yeah, I wouldn't look too much into it


----------



## Arya Stark (Feb 7, 2014)

Black Banana said:


> Well yes, I did also think that there was some symoblism to this.
> 
> But I'm not sure if it's what you said. I feel (literally it's intuitive) that the mangaka is almost telling us the OPPOSITE of what's in the OP.



Same here.


----------



## Tahj Sarutobi (Feb 7, 2014)

Arya Stark said:


> Same here.



So do you think that it is symbolic that the heart that once beat for her, is no longer going to, and even her attempts at salvaging some sort of makeshift relationship would be doomed to fail???

I just want to hear your interpretation as it seems interesting, I did not know it could be viewed another way, and so I am interested.


----------



## Rios (Feb 7, 2014)

The deep symbolism of creating drama.


----------



## Nic (Feb 7, 2014)

Sage said:


> Its probably more symbolism.
> 
> bone-r...
> 
> as in he is going to bone-her



that's usually what happens when you get together. 



> Finally! This crap is over! GOD, took forever for him to make up his mind. And I'm glad he did. Hopefully we'll never see this shit again, because it was terrible.
> 
> I am talking about the Naruto Romance, of course. After years and years of teasing and trolling, it appears the author has finally decided which girl the main character is going to end up with.
> 
> ...





NH fans all over conceding to NS being the final pairing.


----------



## Danzio (Feb 7, 2014)

↑‎ You're a little too invested in these shipping wars, Nic _TomNamikaze_. Double agent? 


I can't get over how crazy it's that Kishi actually did that in such a serious scene, lol.


----------



## Nic (Feb 7, 2014)

Ever since Pain died and debating that the tobito theories were right, the shipping wars are all that i have left. 


Although no i'd never name my username after Minato.


----------



## Njaa (Feb 7, 2014)

takL said:


> well peeps at 2ch and futaba had fun with this inappropriate sound effect



So basically like us having fun with those _*epic*_ Tajima and Madara rape faces?? The one downside of reading something translated from another language, you miss out on potential gold.


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 7, 2014)

what if naruto ends with a random chick ?


----------



## Danzio (Feb 7, 2014)

Kishi is known for  repeatedly laying the breadcrumbs to reveal absolutely nothing, which is  why when you read posts from shippers claiming victory, you never  read any compelling evidence. Fights over necessary hand-holding and CPR.

Must be frustrating if you only read for that. 



TheDivineOneDannii said:


> what if naruto ends with a random chick ?




or both Hinata and Sakura. Will the fandoms collectively rage or be happy for  him?


----------



## Jagger (Feb 7, 2014)

Or, you know, she's a medic.  They're supposed to save people and even if the ways they do it are very unorthodox (I mean...holding their heart without even cleaning their hand first?).


----------



## Alexdhamp (Feb 7, 2014)

Jagger said:


> Or, you know, she's a medic.  They're supposed to save people and even if the ways they do it are very unorthodox (I mean...holding their heart *without even cleaning their hand first*?).



How's she supposed to do that? Hell, this wasn't even all that odd during wartime when surgeries had to be done right on the battlefield.


----------



## Tom Servo (Feb 7, 2014)

Black Banana said:


> Well yes, I did also think that there was some symoblism to this.
> 
> But I'm not sure if it's what you said. I feel (literally it's intuitive) that the mangaka is almost telling us the OPPOSITE of what's in the OP.



I recall someone here saying something about Kishimoto confirming their relationship. "something something yellow and pink will collide heaven and earth will be come one yadda yadda feelings intensified whatever" 

dunno if true or not, kind of don't feel like looking for an interview.

It still astounds me that in something that's supposed to be an action manga the only thing that really stands out is relationship hinting/trolling.



TheDivineOneDannii said:


> what if naruto ends with a random chick ?



Dexter Morgan syndrome? oh wait he didn't even end up with her she just voluntarily took his kid


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 7, 2014)

godzillafan430 said:


> I recall someone here saying something about Kishimoto confirming their relationship. *"something something yellow and pink will collide heaven and earth will be come one yadda yadda feelings intensified whatever" *
> 
> dunno if true or not, kind of don't feel like looking for an interview.
> 
> ...



he never said that.


----------



## ch1p (Feb 7, 2014)

godzillafan430 said:


> I recall someone here saying something about Kishimoto confirming their relationship. "something something yellow and pink will collide heaven and earth will be come one yadda yadda feelings intensified whatever"
> 
> dunno if true or not, kind of don't feel like looking for an interview.



It's fake. It was made up by an anti NaruSaku fan for baiting purposes I believe.


----------



## Tom Servo (Feb 7, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> he never said that.



Thank you for clearing that up.


----------



## Mizura (Feb 7, 2014)

*sigh*

Once upon a time, Hinata was the failed heir of the powerful but fractured Hyuuga clan, but she did her best to change her destiny and to reach out to her pained cousin, yadda yadda yadda.

I miss back when she was more than about pairing debates.


----------



## Scarlet Ammo (Feb 7, 2014)

And then next week Hinata will give Naruto a kiss of life and more pairing drama shall ensue.


----------



## Tom Servo (Feb 7, 2014)

I'm still surprised this series is still going on didn't feel too long ago back in 09 everyone was saying the climax will be soon, well now its here but it won't leave


----------



## Selina Kyle (Feb 7, 2014)

Mizura said:


> *sigh*
> 
> Once upon a time, Hinata was the failed heir of the powerful but fractured Hyuuga clan, but she did her best to change her destiny and to reach out to her pained cousin, yadda yadda yadda.
> 
> I miss back when she was more than about pairing debates. : (



is it too late wrong to say that narhin ruined hinata's character


----------



## Seto Kaiba (Feb 7, 2014)

Selina Kyle said:


> is it too late wrong to say that narhin ruined hinata's character



Some would say you aren't a 'true fan'.


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 7, 2014)

Selina Kyle said:


> is it too late wrong to say that narhin ruined hinata's character



it is not too late boo. Naruto ruins everything.


----------



## Kage (Feb 7, 2014)

Selina Kyle said:


> is it too late wrong to say that narhin ruined hinata's character



nah, that's been true for years now.


----------



## CyberianGinseng (Feb 7, 2014)

Kind of hilarious people claim these little tid bits that Kishi throws out mean anything at all.

Clearly, he's milking ambiguity for as much as it's worth for as long as he can to keep shippers interested and his pocketbook phat.


----------



## Light Warrior (Feb 7, 2014)

CyberianGinseng said:


> Kind of hilarious people claim these little tid bits that Kishi throws out mean anything at all.
> 
> Clearly, he's milking ambiguity for as much as it's worth for as long as he can to keep shippers interested and his pocketbook phat.



True story.


----------



## Njaa (Feb 7, 2014)

Selina Kyle said:


> is it too late wrong to say that narhin ruined hinata's character



Nah Kishi did that, at one point Hinata and Neji had potential since out of all the non MC rookies they got a lot of background information fleshed out. Sadly i think the whole Hyuuga problems were off-paneled and implied to have been resolved (if memory serves Hiashi and edo-Hizashi had a convo about it when they met) and never resurfaced again.

I had a thought a while back that even though Naruto had been mostly a positive influence on Hinata, his never give up attitude that Hinata emulated almost got her killed against Neji and again against pein. So it's a weird thing, yes she's gotten stronger but she has also almost died as well.

Best way i can explain it is if you ever watched Doctor Who, there's a little (paraphrased) quote Rory tells the Doctor about Amy that sums up Naruto's influence for me.
Rory: "you have no idea idea how dangerous you make people to themselves"


----------



## CyberianGinseng (Feb 7, 2014)

Selina Kyle said:


> is it too late wrong to say that narhin ruined hinata's character


From the beginning her entire character was predicated upon NaruHina. So if it ruined it, the ruining happened before she was even written.


----------



## Tom Servo (Feb 7, 2014)

good kishi Sauce is dead, now if we could just keep him that wa-Kishi what are you doing? Kishi stahp


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 7, 2014)

CyberianGinseng said:


> From the beginning her entire character was predicated upon NaruHina. So if it ruined it, the ruining happened before she was even written.



I saw it as something that ultimately ate up her character, because like most part I characters there was more going for her than that.


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## CandleGuy (Feb 7, 2014)

CyberianGinseng said:


> Kind of hilarious people claim these little tid bits that Kishi throws out mean anything at all.
> 
> Clearly, he's milking ambiguity for as much as it's worth for as long as he can to keep shippers interested and his pocketbook phat.



You were saying the same thing at 615 right?




Light Warrior said:


> True story.



Yeah

Like dat chakra transfer

amiritire?


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## runsakurarun (Feb 7, 2014)

Next week is valentines week, Kishi will end this soon.

Requiescat in pace, NaruHina.


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## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 7, 2014)

Rest In Peace, NaruHina for the 21921983983219021 times.


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## Hydro Spiral (Feb 7, 2014)

Selina Kyle said:


> is it too late wrong to say that narhin ruined hinata's character



No.

Too much of her panel time in part 2 feels like regurgitated dialogue


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## Abz (Feb 7, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> it is not too late boo. Naruto ruins everything.



Naruto as a character ruins everyone else lol


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## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 7, 2014)

Abz said:


> Naruto as a character ruins everyone else lol





true story.


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## Mizura (Feb 7, 2014)

Seto Kaiba said:


> Some would say you aren't a 'true fan'.


Back in the days, I wrote an essay on why I think a romantic focus for her won't do any good for her character. I got labelled a "Bitch ass mother fucker!!!!!!!!" (copy/paste) 

So far all my fears about her character writing came true: instead of having her focus on her rich backstory and finding her own path thanks to being inspired by Naruto (she could have made progress towards becoming the leader and reformer of the Hyuuga clan. No romance needed: Gaara didn't need any to become Kazekage), Kishimoto focused on her crush on Naruto, and frankly as a result she seems to be the character with the least progress among all the rookies. She had trouble defeating One of those juubabies, whereas even ex-loser Kiba was easily mowing through them.

Bleh. Oh well.

I still won't say for sure which pairing will win in the end, but I'm bemused for sure that pairing business ruined what was once one of my favorite characters, one that I thought had among the most potential to become a strong, interesting female character in this series (I'm not saying she's the only one with lost potential by the way, Kishimoto did a number on most of the female characters). And no, being a suicidal fodder is not interesting. Now from most people's POV she's just a 'poor little girl whose life will end if she doesn't hook up with Naruto.'


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## Tom Servo (Feb 7, 2014)

runsakurarun said:


> Next week is valentines week, Kishi will end this soon.
> 
> Requiescat in pace, NaruHina.



Not to start a whole thing with this but haven't people been saying that for the past several years


----------



## Kuromaku (Feb 7, 2014)

Late to the party, but it looks like the OP just couldn't resist making that pun. /slowpoke'd

Eh, Kishi's just fucking with the shippers as he always has. The romance isn't important enough to be well written (although if this is half-assing a subplot, what excuse does he have for the main story? Zing!).

As for Hinata. She's always been shit. Some might argue that she's actually not a shallow love interest, but actually a well developed character. That's because some people are wrong.


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## Kage (Feb 7, 2014)

Seto Kaiba said:


> I saw it as something that ultimately ate up her character



and it didn't have to. she could have been both in love with Naruto and her own person but Kishi felt it necessary to sacrifice one for the other. Even as someone who likes Naruto's character (I mean she could be obsessing over worse, like Sasuke) it's gotten to the point I don't find her feelings for him endearing at all.


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## Light Warrior (Feb 7, 2014)

CandleGuy said:


> You were saying the same thing at 615 right?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Prior to the chakra transfer, there were several panels of Naruto and Hinata simply holding hands. In the following chapter, he high fived chakra to his other allies. However, Naruto and Hinata's hand-hold was significant enough to merit a volume cover.

It doesn't make NaruHina canon, but it's more romantic than CPR. 663 has about as much romance as the lifeguard scene from The Sandlot.


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## LesExit (Feb 7, 2014)

Seto Kaiba said:


> I saw it as something that ultimately ate up her character, because like most part I characters there was more going for her than that.


I'm a NH fan, and I totally get that D: Its not just for her though, it's for all the rookies. They all had so much potential and Kishimoto just ignored and simplified them. This manga is suppose to be all about teamwork and whatnot, but I feel like it's just Naruto...and Sasuke and it just upsets me...


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## runsakurarun (Feb 7, 2014)

She is physically holding his heart, giving her breath to his lungs and her pouring her energy into his body. This has to be the most intimate non-vampire/sexual scene I have seen in any anime or manga. 

Not to mention that she's mentally and emotionally supporting his aspirations the entire time. 

Hand holding and shoulder popping just seems too trivial and anticlimactic at this point.


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## Azula (Feb 7, 2014)

a bit *too* intimate


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## Light Warrior (Feb 7, 2014)

Uhh... that's how CPR works (minus the heart holding, which is completely ridiculous). She's trying desperately to save a comrade and close friend. She'd do the same for Tsunade with just as much passion.

This is why I've avoided the Telegrams up until now, because I knew this scene would be made into something it isn't, but I guess that's what Kishi wanted. 

Sakura still loves Sasuke, by the way. No, I don't support SasuSaku. I hate Sasuke. But Sakura loves him. I'm just Saiyan.


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## Selina Kyle (Feb 7, 2014)

someone on this site showed us that medical chart where internal heart massage actually works.


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## Light Warrior (Feb 7, 2014)

How many ribs have to be cracked to reach the heart? For that matter, how did Sakura bypass Naruto's lung?

Another debate entirely, I know. It's a medical procedure, not romance. It's passionate, and there's no doubt that she has a deep, heartfelt (no pun intended) bond with her teammate and comrade and FRIEND. But it's not romance.


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## Kakugo (Feb 7, 2014)

runsakurarun said:


> She is physically holding his heart, giving her breath to his lungs and her pouring her energy into his body. This has to be the most intimate non-vampire/sexual scene I have seen in any anime or manga.
> 
> Not to mention that she's mentally and emotionally supporting his aspirations the entire time.
> 
> Hand holding and shoulder popping just seems too trivial and anticlimactic at this point.



Yup. With or without any "romantic" connotations either, it was certainly a powerful and touching scene. Sakura is, literally, Naruto's lifeline right now.


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## Light Warrior (Feb 7, 2014)

Kakugo said:


> Yup. With or without any "romantic" connotations either, it was certainly a powerful and touching scene. Sakura is, literally, Naruto's lifeline right now.



I agree. 

No, seriously, I do.


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## LesExit (Feb 8, 2014)

Light Warrior said:


> How many ribs have to be cracked to reach the heart? For that matter, how did Sakura bypass Naruto's lung?
> 
> Another debate entirely, I know. It's a medical procedure, not romance. It's passionate, and there's no doubt that she has a deep, heartfelt (no pun intended) bond with her teammate and comrade and FRIEND. But it's not romance.


Well we knows it's a real procedure...Kishimoto might've not drawn it in that well of a way perhaps? But it's correct for the most part right? I think thats what matters. Regardless the moment between Naruto and Sakura is really powerful and I love it :3


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## ichihimelove (Feb 8, 2014)

-Azula- said:


> naruto's dead body getting a boner from the 'kiss'



even in his death, Naruto will get a boner (erection) if it's kissing from his girlfriend (Sakura-chan) 



Light Warrior said:


> Uhh... that's how CPR works (minus the heart holding, which is completely ridiculous). She's trying desperately to save a comrade and close friend. She'd do the same for Tsunade with just as much passion.
> 
> This is why I've avoided the Telegrams up until now, because I knew this scene would be made into something it isn't, but I guess that's what Kishi wanted.



you know it's first time Kishi draw boy/girl kissing (mouth-to-mouth) panel in his manga 
why he choose to draw this panel for NaruSaku ? not for canon pairing like MinaKushi ,AsuKure, YahiKona .....etc 
Why Kishi choose Sakura to be with Naruto not Hinata ? Kishi can make Gaara goes to Hinata 's place and pick her instead of Sakura ? 
Kishi didn't have to have Sakura (kiss) blow air into him and just help Naruto with pumping his heart but he did. why ? 

It's was Kishi's desire and choice to draw NaruSaku first kiss scene panel in NARUTO manga


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## CandleGuy (Feb 8, 2014)

> The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person simply ignores a person's actual position and substitutes a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position. This sort of "reasoning" has the following pattern:
> 
> Person A has position X.
> Person B presents position Y (which is a distorted version of X).
> ...



DerpANYLifeguardcanperformCPRDERP


Even though this thread has moved beyond the topic and tons of bait has been flying around.

As a person who supports NaruSaku

I want to say this

I am not that thirsty

I did not enjoy "CPR" as a romantic moment in on itself, however I have moderately enjoyed, to the extent one can enjoy that Naruto is pseudo dying (we all know he will live) the entire two chapter sequence so far. The CPR is a part of a sequence which is a part of a continuous process. 

Now its not inherently romantic, no. But certain NH/SS folk ITT have zero leg to stand on in making a blanket statement over this. I guarantee the criteria they use to deem this moment non romantic would effectively wipe the slate of all perceived "romantic" moments in this manga. Especially 615 which if we recall created a massive wank-fest from some of these same people. 

If pressed on this issue the hypocrisy would be so glaring (if not already) to anyone who would even pretend to have ounce of objectivity. 

FWIW: If I saw a life guard perform this kind of CPR at a beach I might just strap up my speedos and  walk right into a church cuz dat friend might just be the Second Coming.


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## ch1p (Feb 8, 2014)

Outside of trolling, because this has gone long enough.

While I didn't expect this particular scenario (but I do find it funny ), I expected _something_ and I expected something as powerful as this. Sakura protecting Naruto was foreshadowed a long time ago, several times in fact. It's part of her character resolution at the end of part 1 and why she became stronger. Indeed, the CPR scene is good for the relationship of Naruto and Sakura, but it's nothing unexpected outside of unreasonable expectations. I've the backlogs to prove these statements, which is more than I can say about 99% of the people that act smug after the fact.

I like that it's '_a small thing_' but that really makes all the difference in whether Naruto lives or dies. She had that dilemma before (and the NaruSaku fandom thought it was over whether she loved him or not, there are not enough eloquent disdain emoticons). However, there aren't any romantic vibes from the CPR scene whatsoever. I didn't see romantic vibes in the bonding in the beginning of part 2 (and I was right), the hug after Pain (and I was right), or the other 12386123 '_ambiguous_' (?) scenes part of the NS fandom lists when backed into a corner either.

So their lips touched. So she's holding his heart. Much ado about nothing when this scene is the exact feeling behind the Chunin exam resolution, though in a more dire situation as its fitting for the end of the series. It's the exact same thing, with Sakura protecting Naruto's dream. Yet, we know Sakura loved Sasuke back at the Chunin exams and not Naruto, and we know that Sakura stated she loves Sasuke and him alone less than one day ago in manga time as well. People go on and on about symbolism, and forget about context. That is important too.

I have told off some anti narusaku fans that they were delusional to think Sakura protecting Naruto would never happen. Pretending this was never going to happen is exactly the same as pretending Sakura would never summon a slug, when this was foreshadowed over and over and over again. I've also have the backlogs to prove these statements, etc etc. I warned those anti narusaku fans and now I warn the same to some of the narusaku fans. Sakura's resolution to protect her teammates also includes Sasuke, and that hasn't happened yet. She has yet to protect him. Instead, I see people convinced she's going to abandon him or chose between the two. Neither were her resolution or what her character aspired for. You are wrong and you'll be proven wrong. If narusaku it's not like this, just like it wasn't over sakura not trusting, because we've already gone through both these scenarios before. Do your homework and come up with better shit.

I have hated NaruHina in the past and trolled the fandom by defending NaruSaku against it for some time for shits and giggles. However, NaruHina has built itself over time and managed to convince someone like me, who really didn't want to be nor needed to be. While I'm an hard arse as me, I'm far from unreasonable, and since there is definetly something there I was convinced. This scene changes nothing.

Have at it.


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## CandleGuy (Feb 8, 2014)

ch1p said:


> Have at it.



You want to uphold that Sasuke loves Sakura but you've continuously called Naruto's own words a "joke" disregarding them when reflected on his feelings top his father. In addition to this Naruto reflected on his feelings to Sai.

Does Naruto still have feelings for Sakura?

There's nothing to the the entire two chapter sequence between naruto and Sakura in context to their entire relationship OK but from your track record 615 is part of what convinced you of "something more there" in the NH sequence. 

> far from unreasonable


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

meh don't know why people are all surprised at Hinata being pairing fodder that's usually how it is with satellite love characters in shounen, kishi is just following the trope.


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## Benzaiten (Feb 8, 2014)

I don't get why it's hard to understand why this moment is important.

For SasuSaku to be canon, Sasuke needs to reciprocate Sakura's feelings.
For NaruHina to be canon, Naruto needs to reciprocate Hinata's feelings.
For NaruSaku to be canon, Sakura needs to reciprocate Naruto's feelings.

That's why for all these pairings, moments with Naruto>Hinata, Sasuke>Sakura, Sakura>Naruto have more weight in determining whether it's going to be canon, cos we already know how the other half feels, it's only the other person who has to change their feelings for the pairing to be canon.

615 was important to NH because unlike so many of its moments, Naruto was the one who initiated the act. It wasn't just Hinata thinking about Naruto (although she did that too) but Naruto doing something for/with Hinata. That's why it mattered.

Now, in 663, Naruto is unconscious. There is nothing from his side in this moment. The one initiating the action, thinking about him _and him alone_, determined to keep him alive and help him fulfill his dream of becoming Hokage, the person doing all of that is Sakura. She is not thinking about his succulent lips and all that shit, she is thinking about keeping him alive and making his dreams come true. In this moment, she doesn't think one second about herself or how she needs Naruto/can't live without Naruto, she is thinking _only about Naruto_ and how to keep him alive. It's called being selfless. Yes, it's a medical procedure and she would do that for anyone but she wouldn't be as frantic or as determined to make the person's dream a reality. Hell, she saw Sasuke, the man she is in love with, announce that he wanted to be Hokage and look at what she's saying in this chapter (Hint: She supports another candidate.). She's having these thoughts because the person in front of her is Naruto. It's not the CPR or the manual heart pumping that's romantic, hell you can even argue none of this is but what she's saying when all of this is happening, what it implies about Sakura's relationship with Naruto, and the fact that she's literally the only one keeping Naruto alive at this point? The fuck you don't want me to celebrate that?

But oh well, I guess it's normal for other people to think of their actions as everyday normal things, that's what happens when your ship interacts regularly and has a really close relationship.


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## ichihimelove (Feb 8, 2014)

ch1p said:


> While I didn't expect this particular scenario (but I do find it funny ), I expected _something_ and I expected something as powerful as this. Sakura protecting Naruto was foreshadowed a long time ago, several times in fact. It's part of her character resolution at the end of part 1 and why she became stronger. Indeed, the CPR scene is good for the relationship of Naruto and Sakura, but it's nothing unexpected outside of unreasonable expectations. I've the backlogs to prove these statements, which is more than I can say about 99% of the people that act smug after the fact.



 I swear if CPR (kiss of life) happened for SS, you will say the opposite what all you said now AAAAAHAAAAAAAAHHHHHHA 




ch1p said:


> So *their lips touched*. So she's holding his heart.



lips touched LOOOOOOOL 

it's a deep kiss you can't deny it because you're SS 

Also Kishi didn't have to have their mouths kissed but he did


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

Benzaiten said:


> For SasuSaku to be canon, Sasuke needs to reciprocate Sakura's feelings.
> For NaruHina to be canon, Naruto needs to reciprocate Hinata's feelings.
> For NaruSaku to be canon, Sakura needs to reciprocate Naruto's feelings.



to break it down, 

Sasuke never even thinks about Sakura unless she's there trying to kill him. 
Naruto only thinks of Hinata when a dramatic event is focused on herself or her sibling. 
Sakura completely obsesses over Naruto every time there's a panel with her thoughts.

what to make of this.


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## ch1p (Feb 8, 2014)

CandleGuy said:


> You want to uphold that Sasuke loves Sakura but you've continuously called Naruto's own words a "joke" disregarding them when reflected on his feelings top his father. In addition to this Naruto reflected on his feelings to Sai.



I have not said that Naruto's feelings are a joke in the way you imply I did. What I've said, plenty of times in the past, I will lay it out for you once again in detail. _Naruto's feelings for Sakura_ have been portrayed under only two different two lights, the comic relief and the serious business.

The comic relief are '_jokes_', whether you like it or not, and that's what I mean when I say [that part of] NS shouldn't be taken seriously. I certainly DO NOT take seriously Sakura asking Sasuke on a date in chapter... 34and I DO NOT take seriously Hinata 'always fainting' because of Naruto comment from Kiba (which I don't remember which chapter it is). Neither all the derivatives like Sakura wanting to see Sasuke pee, nor Hinata being a 'shy weirdo' around Naruto.

The serious business has always been about SasuSaku, again whether you like it or not. Chapter 3 is about Naruto acknowledging that Sakura is that serious about Sasuke. Chapter 172 is about Naruto acknowledging SasuSaku and leaving the room. Chapter 183 is about Naruto acknowledging Sakura is that serious about Sasuke, in a mirror of chapter 3 (it even references it by flashbacks). Chapter whatever the one where Sai remembers Naruto's promise is once more about Sakura's feelings for Sasuke (which is a chapter 183 reference, which in itself is an acknowledgement of Sakura's feelings for Sasuke). Chapter 469-470 and 473 (if I'm not mistaken) is about Naruto rememering all those high times where he acknowledged Sakura loved Sasuke, calling Sakura a liar when she said she was over him.

That's pretty much it for NaruSaku from Naruto's side. Half of the pairing is played for laughs and the other half of the pairing is him conceding to SasuSaku. Fantastic.

Sakura's side, which while thematically different, doesn't really help the NaruSaku pairing either in the ways you'd like it to be. Hers revolves around acknowledging him as a hero much like everyone else, and this acknowledgement has never been likened to acknowledging him romantically.



> Does Naruto still have feelings for Sakura?



Bitch, he might be have. So what of it?

The comic relief 'girlfriend' commentin chapter 631 is a redux of chapter 34 or 35 where he stated the exact same thing, so that part is stale and it's the same as always, so this part is the exact same at 12 and at 17.

The serious business cockblocks the relationship, because it's him acknowledging Sakura is serious about Sasuke and not accepting when she says she's over him. The confession is very clear, highlighting all those SasuSaku moments that _he saw_ (let alone what he didn't see). While you may say that of course Naruto rejects her because she's lying, that doesn't change what's established. Those SasuSaku moments aren't going to erase themselves out of existance. Unless you're the one who'd like to portray Naruto as the clueless guy whose feelings don't matter, then this is absolute: Naruto doesn't accept Sakura can get over Sasuke because of *insert flashbacks here*.

This matters for the positive romantic resolution of NarSak...how?



> There's nothing to the the entire two chapter sequence between naruto and Sakura in context to their entire relationship OK but from your track record 615 is part of what convinced you of "something more there" in the NH sequence.



615 didn't convince me of anything. It was 540, whatever the eye comment and 573. Let me remind you, 540 included SasuSaku and 573 about Sakura stating she'd help Naruto together with _everyone else_.



> > far from unreasonable



I'd say it's more stubborness from the NarSak fandom. It just can't admit it lost, so every time an 'ambiguous' (?) scene such as this happens, here comes the whole trope out of the woodwork. Only to hide away when they're inevitably proven wrong.



Nic said:


> meh don't know why people are all surprised at Hinata being pairing fodder that's usually how it is with satellite love characters in shounen, kishi is just following the trope.



That changes nothing whatsoever.



Benzaiten said:


> I don't get why it's hard to understand why this moment is important.



I never said it wasn't important. In fact, I said it's very important.  It's just not romantic.



> The fuck you don't want me to celebrate that?



Look, even I celebrated. I watched the anti sakura bitches that I dislike over at tumblr seethe in rage because I was right.



> But oh well, I guess it's normal for other people to think of their actions as everyday normal things, that's what happens when your ship interacts regularly and has a really close relationship.



It can have a close relationship all they want. It's just not romantic. 



ichihimelove said:


> it's a deep kiss



With fans like these. 



Nic said:


> Naruto only thinks of Hinata when a dramatic event is focused on herself or her sibling.



So?



> Sakura completely obsesses over Naruto every time there's a panel with her thoughts.



Sure.  In before you change your argument completely.



> what to make of this.



You're reaching ichihimelove levels Nic. This isn't good, if you can't tell.


----------



## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

ch1p said:


> So?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I see nothing noteworthy to change my argument. 

i love ichi, his trolling brings constant lulz.


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 8, 2014)

More correctly, SasuSaku is *melodramatic*. Consistently. All of these pairings have a serious nature to them, and because of each character's own individual natures they are going to have their differences. The ones with Naruto because of his nature, have a light-hearted aspect to them such as with Naruto and Hinata, it pokes fun at her shyness and Naruto's obliviousness or with Naruto and Sakura it pokes fun at Sakura's impatience and again, Naruto's obliviousness....

Sasusaku uh...for all intents in stark contrast has just shown to be simply fucked up. The one thing I feel is a consistent trait with it is how often the flaws of it are highlighted than not.


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## LesExit (Feb 8, 2014)

ichihimelove said:


> lips touched LOOOOOOOL
> 
> it's a deep kiss you can't deny it because you're SS
> 
> Also Kishi didn't have to have their mouths kissed but he did


no...no...no...no o___o no...no dude/mam/...cat :3....NO 

Theres no evidence at all that Sakura mouth was on Naruto's out of romantic love. Look at her expression, she just focused on making sure she's doing a good medical job. She was trying to keep him from dying, not settle down her... lady boner? XD
I can get people thinking, "mmmm symbols!? " but not "omg they're making out! :3"


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

lol ichi is just trolling.


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## ch1p (Feb 8, 2014)

Nic said:


> I see nothing noteworthy to change my argument.



More like there's nothing about your argument that is noteworthy.



> i love ichi, his trolling brings constant lulz.



I find her funny too. I've repped her in the past, for example many times over in the RtN thread.



Seto Kaiba said:


> More correctly, SasuSaku is *melodramatic*.



That matters not for the pairing endgame.



LesExit said:


> no...no...no...no o___o no...no dude/mam/...cat :3....NO
> 
> Theres no evidence at all that Sakura mouth was on Naruto's out of romantic love. Look at her expression, she just focused on making sure she's doing a good medical job. She was trying to keep him from dying, not settle down her... lady boner? XD
> I can get people thinking, "mmmm symbols!? " but not "omg they're making out! :3"



Ew.


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

I love you ch1p.


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 8, 2014)

ch1p said:


> More like there's nothing about your argument that is noteworthy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You are as in the dark on the 'endgame' as anyone else. Yet like any other pairing fan you think the moments for your pairing mean more or something in contrast to those that you don't. It's honestly the stupidest angle a person could go on. What does it even matter in consideration of the flaws in between the two characters? 

Also I saw it in your post, you like many others I've seen in the past seem to be under this impression that the seriousness, or more accurately, the melodramatic nature of a relationship means it is more substantive than one that may have comedic moments here and there. As I stated before, Naruto's relationships all have that aspect to them because of his light-hearted nature. 

That in no way detracts from them in any respect, especially in this genre. They really don't mean anything...What's more is you conflate melodrama with seriousness in general. SasuSaku overall is a melodramatic pairing, SasuSaku overall, has its flaws highlighted and has experienced flaws the other two have even yet to reach. That's what makes it more 'serious', it is not a happy dynamic, nor a healthy one.

For as many times as you go on the mantra that she loves him, it has not done much for the relationship between the two; you still ignore Sasuke's side of the equation, in which if he's not interested, he's doing something that hurts her or could kill her.


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## Benzaiten (Feb 8, 2014)

ch1p said:


> I never said it wasn't important. In fact, I said it's very important.  It's just not romantic.


And I never said I was talking to you lol

It was a general response to those screaming "It's just CPR!" "So what? Naruto held Hinata's hand!" "Why are NaruSaku fans even happy about this?" and the like.



> It can have a close relationship all they want. It's just not romantic.


Eh, if the NH handhold can be seen as romantic or Sasuke's friggin smirk when Sakura showed her power, I don't see anything wrong with people who consider Sakura being Naruto's literal lifeline a romantic moment.

Personally, it doesn't matter whether it's romantic or not due to Sakura not being in love with Naruto. No one can deny it's a NaruSaku moment, and a very intimate and powerful one at that.

And when you're arguing for endgame, all interactions matter, especially those initiated by the half that needs to reciprocate the other's feelings to make it canon.


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 8, 2014)

I just have to ask, is there anything wrong with saying "I don't know?". No one knows how this is all going to end if it ends with a pairing at all that is...so all this bravado and analyses that seem to conveniently wind up with the inescapable conclusion that the favored pairing of the individual(s) is 'endgame' seems to be a lot of speculative bullshit to me. I think if we were to be perfectly honest, Kishi goes back and forth so many times that it's really not a reliable measure on what if any pairing, would happen.


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## ichihimelove (Feb 8, 2014)

I love ch1p's denial for any NS moment 

I can't forget ch1p's reaction for RTN advertising just because AUsasuke flirt sakura pic  (even he's not real sasuke LOOL ), 
ch1p made it like SS becomes CANON AAAAAHHHHHHHAAAAAAA 

This reaction was just for advertising pic movie  , now guys imagine CPR (kiss of life) for SS in manga, ch1p will explode all fanclubs


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## Benzaiten (Feb 8, 2014)

Part of the fun is speculation and debate though. It's the same for discussions regarding the final villain, Naruto and Sasuke's final battle, what's going to happen in the next chapter. The only problem is when people are so invested in their predictions that they lose sight of what's really happening in the manga. Case in point, discounting current events because it doesn't favor the endgame you want. Arguments can be fun but when you can only rely on Part I without any regard for Part II or can't accept the interaction between other characters as it is then that's not an argument anymore, that's just wishful thinking.

We all don't know what's going to happen but what we're saying is given the evidence, _this_ is what is most likely to happen. That's always been my case. It's why I'm not quick to say "canon" or "endgame." Literally the only time I will scream this in all seriousness is if they actually do kiss, get married, or have children.

Don't read this anymore, Seto-chan, it's just me spazzing over this moment. I, too, have been in the pairing business for too long to know how soon a moment can end so yeah, but like I said, there's nothing wrong with enjoying this moment or thinking it's a strong argument for NaruSaku, because 1) Kishimoto could have made that scene differently. Gaara was going for Tsunade but Kishi wrote it so that Sakura is the one who stays with Naruto 2) This is only the second on panel liplock we've seen in this manga, and I think that says a lot cos Kishi is a prude and we've never even seen canon pairings do it (but half of this is my bias speaking) 3) It's a Sakura>Naruto moment and 4) It's setting up a lot for future interaction between Naruto and Sakura. Even if you hate the pairing, there's no doubt Naruto would be happy about the act when he wakes up.


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## ch1p (Feb 8, 2014)

Nic said:


> I love you ch1p.



Thanks, but no thanks.



Seto Kaiba said:


> You are as in the dark on the 'endgame' as anyone else.



Since you've got nothing else to add to the discussion...



Benzaiten said:


> And I never said I was talking to you lol
> 
> It was a general response to those screaming "It's just CPR!" "So what? Naruto held Hinata's hand!" "Why are NaruSaku fans even happy about this?" and the like.



Ah, alright.  Still, my position is clear on the matter.



> Eh, if the NH handhold can be seen as romantic or Sasuke's friggin smirk when Sakura showed her power, I don't see anything wrong with people who consider Sakura being Naruto's literal lifeline a romantic moment.
> 
> Personally, it doesn't matter whether it's romantic or not due to Sakura not being in love with Naruto. No one can deny it's a NaruSaku moment, and a very intimate and powerful one at that.



Oh, the individual might think whatever they may feel like thinking. However, when bringing context into it, things undoubtly change.

I don't see how Sasuke's smirk is romantic. It's an acknowledgement of her power, which is important in its own way, but it's not romantic until further notice. The handhold is a whole different matter. It has the cover and that 633 chapter to back it up. It's at least a potential romantic scenario, while the CPR (until this moment) is not



> And when you're arguing for endgame, all interactions matter, especially those initiated by the half that needs to reciprocate the other's feelings to make it canon.



Interactions matter but only under context. Sasuke's obesession with his brother, no matter how encompassing it may be, will never make ItaSasu canon. It's not a romantic bond, after all.



Seto Kaiba said:


> I just have to ask, is there anything wrong with saying "I don't know?".



I wonder that myself.



ichihimelove said:


> I love ch1p's denial for any NS moment



I love you bring lies about the past just so you attempt to discredit me while completely avoiding the argument because you just can't answer it. Go home. 



Benzaiten said:


> Part of the fun is speculation and debate though. It's the same for discussions regarding the final villain, Naruto and Sasuke's final battle, what's going to happen in the next chapter. *The only problem is when people are so invested in their predictions that they lose sight of what's really happening in the manga.* Case in point, discounting current events because it doesn't favor the endgame you want. Arguments can be fun but when you can only rely on Part I without any regard for Part II or can't accept the interaction between other characters as it is then that's not an argument anymore, that's just wishful thinking.



That's something which can be said both ways. When 615 showed up, NaruHina is canon was all over the telegrams. Now 664 and it's NaruSaku is canon is all over the telegrams (sort of). In this case, people are so invested in what's happening that they forget that the manga has an architecture for itself. Much like all those people too invested in Naruto / Sasuke "dying" and actually believe this is a threat. 



> We all don't know what's going to happen but what we're saying is given the evidence, _this_ is what is most likely to happen. That's always been my case. It's why I'm not quick to say "canon" or "endgame." I, too, have been in the pairing business for too long to know how soon a moment can end so yeah, but like I said, there's nothing wrong with enjoying this moment or thinking it's a strong argument for NaruSaku, because it is.



Ehr... I'm not saying I have 100% certainity either because this is my _opinion_ after all. Do I have to say 'these are my thoughts and not facts' every time I post about my thoughts on the matter?

On the other hand, if people cannot counter my thoughts properly, I'm not going to half arse it and say I'm wrong just for the sake of neutrality. Nobody should really and I don't see you taking offence with the troll over there saying tongues were touching.


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## ichihimelove (Feb 8, 2014)

ch1p said:


> I love you bring lies about the past just so you attempt to discredit me while completely avoiding the argument because you just can't answer it. Go home.
> .



*" bring lies about the past "*
you also deny yourself not just NS monents


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 8, 2014)

Benzaiten said:


> Part of the fun is speculation and debate though. It's the same for discussions regarding the final villain, Naruto and Sasuke's final battle, what's going to happen in the next chapter.



But the aforementioned are more or less a given or have stronger things going for their occurrence, because of how essential they are to the plot. There has to be a final villain one way or another, that's integral to the story. Naruto and Sasuke's dynamic is the centerpiece of Part II at least; Kishi stating as much his intent and desire to have Naruto and Sasuke fight numerous times...however, largely non-committal on the matter of pairings. So in that respect, wouldn't it just make sense to focus on how the developments insofar shape the nature of these pairings rather than if they mean it will happen? I think the latter is a discussion that should be reserved for retrospect when it comes to this.



> The only problem is when people are so invested in their predictions that they lose sight of what's really happening in the manga. Case in point, discounting current events because it doesn't favor the endgame you want. Arguments can be fun but when you can only rely on Part I without any regard for Part II or can't accept the interaction between other characters as it is then that's not an argument anymore, that's just wishful thinking.



I understand you on that at least...



> We all don't know what's going to happen but what we're saying is given the evidence, _this_ is what is most likely to happen.



I find that term liberally applied. "evidence"? 

That's what I find so unreliable. The story has a back-and-forth with the matter that it's to the point of what can you really consider as reliable 'evidence'? 



> That's always been my case. It's why I'm not quick to say "canon" or "endgame." I, too, have been in the pairing business for too long to know how soon a moment can end so yeah, but like I said, there's nothing wrong with enjoying this moment or thinking it's a strong argument for NaruSaku, because it is.



Hm. I'm not against hoping or in itself thinking your favored pairing will happen, I do find it ridiculous the basis of which I often see such standpoints justified though, and how far it's taken like you stated.


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## ch1p (Feb 8, 2014)

ichihimelove said:


> *" bring lies about the past "*
> you also deny yourself not just NS monents



I'm not denying them. I'm saying they're not romantic, genius.


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 8, 2014)

ch1p said:


> Since you've got nothing else to add to the discussion...



That had everything to do with it, but this is part of my point. I've even asked you before. What does the 'endgame' matter when the path to get there is riddled with fucked up developments? SasuSaku is the poster child of numerous flaws but you seem all right with them oddly enough. Yet at the same time holding the flaws of other relationships against them similar or even less severe in nature. It's like people are so fixated on the pairing they want to be endgame that they are willing to be inconsistent with themselves, and ignore any flaws present between the desired relationship. Again, because they want their pairing to happen that badly.


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## Benzaiten (Feb 8, 2014)

Seto Kaiba said:


> But the aforementioned are more or less a given or have stronger things going for their occurrence, because of how essential they are to the plot. There has to be a final villain one way or another, that's integral to the story. Naruto and Sasuke's dynamic is the centerpiece of Part II at least; Kishi stating as much his intent and desire to have Naruto and Sasuke fight numerous times...however, largely non-committal on the matter of pairings. So in that respect, wouldn't it just make sense to focus on how the developments insofar shape the nature of these pairings rather than if they mean it will happen? I think the latter is a discussion that should be reserved for retrospect when it comes to this.


I'm with you on this. I do think a majority of pairing fans are just hopeful of their pairing becoming canon without really being rabid or extreme about it. It's just that the one's screaming "canon!!!" "endgame!!!" are a little more vocal and out there, so that's what most people see. Most NS fans aren't really screaming canon after this chapter, or if they did it was out of excitement (that's what they said lol). It's just annoying when you're enjoying your moment and you see the ridiculous rebuttals or people who find the need to point out things you already know. That's basically why I'm here, to stop people from putting words into our (NS fans) mouths and addressing the double standards (NH handhold=romantic, etc). It's not to convince them of course, I just want my side to be heard and also because I enjoy talking about NaruSaku.



> I find that term liberally applied. "evidence"?
> 
> That's what I find so unreliable. The story has a back-and-forth with the matter that it's to the point of what can you really consider as reliable 'evidence'?


I can understand where you're coming from. I know you no longer have faith in Kishi. I don't either but I don't really think of him as low as you do. As confusing and ridiculous everything has become, he is still writing it with a clear end in mind and you can still make sense of the events and draw a logical prediction (e.g. who might be standing in front of Sasuke etc) based on them. I just think conceding to him being a bad writer meaning anything could happen despite everything else he's written is no different from SS hoping for Kishi's bad writing to make the pairing canon.



> Hm. I'm not against hoping or in itself thinking your favored pairing will happen, I do find it ridiculous the basis of which I often see such standpoints justified though, and how far it's taken like you stated.


Yeah.


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## Kakugo (Feb 8, 2014)

Benzaiten said:


> Eh, if the NH handhold can be seen as romantic or Sasuke's friggin smirk when Sakura showed her power, I don't see anything wrong with people who consider Sakura being Naruto's literal lifeline a romantic moment.



This. Sakura's internal monologue while giving Naruto CPR and holding his heart is insignificant, but the NH "handhold" and Sasuke's reaction to Sakura's strength are considered significant/romantic? Shit double standard is shit.


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## ch1p (Feb 8, 2014)

Seto Kaiba said:


> That had everything to do with it, but this is part of my point. I've even asked you before. What does the 'endgame' matter when the path to get there is riddled with fucked up developments?




I don't see where NaruHina has fucked up developments.



> SasuSaku is the poster child of numerous flaws but you seem all right with them oddly enough.




"SasuSaku... even after all this time?"
"Always."
Oh, of course, it always comes back to SasuSaku with you.

I've answered that question many times. SasuSaku has it's redeeming qualities in my eyes, I like it for those reasons.

We may talk about it when SS has a moment  however, this isn't the thread to discuss SS. No matter how much you'd enjoy it, since that's all you derail these threads for in the first place.



> Yet at the same time holding the flaws of other relationships against them similar or even less severe in nature. It's like people are so fixated on the pairing they want to be endgame that they are willing to be inconsistent with themselves, and ignore any flaws present between the desired relationship. Again, because they want their pairing to happen that badly.




How am I being inconsistent?

I don't have a problem with NaruSaku pairing. I'm not against best friends hitting it off, albeit I don't feel like it's particularly interesting to read about either (this isn't a fact, but an opinion btw). I just don't see it happening considering context since neither of the two seem interested in it at this point outside of Naruto's joking comments and I don't see how either would be romantically happy with each other either (another opinion).

I do have problems with certain bulshit like the mommy fucking or the endless parallolz which can relate apples and oranges for no good reason, but seriously that's not presented srly into the manga so I can't dislike the _pairing_ for that, only it's arguments.



Kakugo said:


> This. Sakura's internal monologue while giving Naruto CPR and holding his heart is insignificant, but the NH "handhold" and Sasuke's reaction to Sakura's strength are considered significant/romantic? Shit double standard is shit.




It's not a double standard for me.

Sakura's internal monologue is not differently contextually from her monologue in the Chunin exams, where she was in love with Sasuke and not Naruto.

NaruHina's handhold comes in a series of scenes which comprise of 'getting a spine when there was none', 'commenting they can read each other's eyes', 'making endgame claims about standing by the man's side', and 'reaffirming they can stand side by side'. There is a definite buildup. Gauging the precise nature of that buildup and wondering if it's over are worth discussing and imply the potential of the pairing.

Sasuke's reaction to Sakura are significant in guaging that he acknowledges her power, that's not romantic. It also shows he's ready to, as he put it, 'bygone be bygones' which helps air the pairing from his side. Sakura doesn't seem all that bothered by it either. I personally believe there's potential there.

Now what?


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 8, 2014)

ch1p said:


> I don't see where NaruHina has fucked up developments.



Because it doesn't. 



> "SasuSaku... even after all this time?"
> "Always."
> Oh, of course, it always comes back to SasuSaku with you.
> 
> I've answered that question many times. SasuSaku has it's redeeming qualities in my eyes, I like it for those reasons.



Yet it has flaws more evident in itself that you hold against other relationships. The qualities you often cite are from a comparatively small part of the larger story as a whole and also involve ignoring its flaws.



> We may talk about it when SS has a moment  however, this isn't the thread to discuss SS. No matter how much you'd enjoy it, since that's all you derail these threads for in the first place.



Whenever the moment is relevant you don't ever want to. As I recall there was quite a vicious attempt by you all to avoid discussion on the matter. I just find it odd how you, who supports something like SasuSaku, can even attempt to reconcile your criticisms of other relationships. Their flaws hardly compare.



> How am I being inconsistent?
> 
> I don't have a problem with NaruSaku pairing. I'm not against best friends hitting it off, albeit I don't feel like it's particularly interesting to read about either (this isn't a fact, but an opinion btw). I just don't see it happening considering context since neither of the two seem interested in it at this point outside of Naruto's joking comments and I don't see how either would be romantically happy with each other either (another opinion).



The rest ok, the last sentence? Kinda goes back to my point. That in itself ok, I can see what you mean; yet when considering what you DO think would be the contrast to that and considering events in the story that are relevant to that idea...Questions arise. 



> I do have problems with certain bulshit like the mommy fucking or the endless parallolz which can relate apples and oranges for no good reason, but seriously that's not presented srly into the manga so I can't dislike the _pairing_ for that, only it's arguments.



Every pairing has tried the parallel thing. It's like an arms race. They also need their bullshit themes of duality too. Like I said these issues in and of itself, OK that's fine. I have many of those same issues with it too. It's just when taking into account the full scope of the matter regarding what is being favored over all that is why I find the take inconsistent. 



> Sasuke's reaction to Sakura are significant in guaging that he acknowledges her power, that's not romantic. It also shows he's ready to, as he put it, 'bygone be bygones' which helps air the pairing from his side. Sakura doesn't seem all that bothered by it either. I personally believe there's potential there.
> 
> Now what?



How is that any different from what he thinks? The process that leads to your belief is the exact same as his.



Benzaiten said:


> I'm with you on this. I do think a majority of pairing fans are just hopeful of their pairing becoming canon without really being rabid or extreme about it. It's just that the one's screaming "canon!!!" "endgame!!!" are a little more vocal and out there, so that's what most people see. Most NS fans aren't really screaming canon after this chapter, or if they did it was out of excitement (that's what they said lol). It's just annoying when you're enjoying your moment and you see the ridiculous rebuttals or people who find the need to point out things you already know. That's basically why I'm here, to stop people from putting words into our (NS fans) mouths and addressing the double standards (NH handhold=romantic, etc). It's not to convince them of course, I just want my side to be heard and also because I enjoy talking about NaruSaku.



OK, not much I can say on that I guess.



> I can understand where you're coming from. I know you no longer have faith in Kishi. I don't either but I don't really think of him as low as you do. As confusing and ridiculous everything has become, he is still writing it with a clear end in mind and you can still make sense of the events and draw a logical prediction (e.g. who might be standing in front of Sasuke etc) based on them. I just think conceding to him being a bad writer meaning anything could happen despite everything else he's written is no different from SS hoping for Kishi's bad writing to make the pairing canon.



I just always found the claims of 'evidence' bothersome; it is as you said, a prediction. Speculation. I mean I guess one could say it's at best, weak evidence, but not anything truly solid. There ARE events in this manga that are evident, and in retrospect at least, evidence can be found for them but  again those are usually matters integral to the plot; which pairings are not.


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## Kakugo (Feb 8, 2014)

ch1p said:


> It's not a double standard for me.
> 
> Sakura's internal monologue is not differently contextually from her monologue in the Chunin exams, where she was in love with Sasuke and not Naruto.
> 
> ...



You're only proving my point further. Just as you claim to see the supposed significance of Sasuke's reaction to Sakura and NarHin's "handhold" (which really isn't all that significant considering he similarly touched everyone else to pass on his chakra), myself and others see the positive (and contextual) significance of what's transpired between Naruto and Sakura in recent chapters (and many instances before). Why would you, as someone who supports a very unhealthy and dysfunctional pairing (SS), find it plausible to justify your beliefs in their potential, while discrediting the positive potential that Naruto and Sakura continuously demonstrates to have? This is what I mean by double standards. You can't have your cake and eat it too.


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## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2014)

LOL Those pairings....

Sakura still loves Sasuke until told otherwise.

Likewise Naruto still loves Sakura until told otherwise.

Also in NS favor Sakura may love Sasuke BUT also fall in love with Naruto too.

SS may also use this sort of argument in their favor though by saying that even if Sakura shows clear signs of being in love with Naruto she may still love Sasuke too.

After all it is possible to be in love with 2 people no?

There is only one problem: Sasuke

If Sasuke doesn't start reciprocating Sakura's feelings or worse he ends up falling for Karin, then all hope for SS is lost.

The manga is approaching the end and NS gets some tease from Kishi while SS gets none. Now, shipping tease may be just that...tease. However, in order to build SS as a legitimate pairing Kishi should give some "moments" to Sasuke and Sakura and those two hardly got any in part 2. 

NS on the other hand didn't necessarily got romantic development as those moments they had could be still described as character development (Sakura finally acknowledging Naruto as a great shinobi) and a growth of a great friendship between the two. Still, having such a great bond would be a great compliment to love if such eventually arises between the two.

In order for SS to work Sasuke has to acknowledge Sakura and show that he respects her. Then he needs to prove that he can have great dynamics with her. Even if he starts just by proving that he can be a great and trustworthy friend.

I still think that Kishi may not provide clear resolution to this paring bullshit by the end of the manga, though if he does not throw some strong SS hints then most will have to agree that NS most likely became canon eventually off panel. Especially if Sasuke shows some hints of being attracted to Karin or at least shows her greater respect that he had ever shown to Sakura. Or if he leaves Konoha and travels with Taka instead of settling in.


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## Corvida (Feb 8, 2014)

> [
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## izzyisozaki (Feb 8, 2014)

I appreciate this NarSak moment bringing all the pairing debate folk together again.


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## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

What if Kishi pull a JK Rowling.


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## Hitt (Feb 8, 2014)

Regardless of the final outcome, at the very least this chapter restored legitimacy to NaruSaku and proves it's still very much a thing no matter how much the anti-narrative tried to deny it up until this point.

"Kishi no longer is focusing on NS hints.  The pairing is done.  NH is in the clear (and by extension that pile of fecal matter SS)"

But wait, oh no it's not over.  Not by a long shot.  The ticker tape parade has to be postponed, the battle is far from over.

Granted, I knew this long before, but some people just won't learn with this shit.


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## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2014)

Hitt said:


> Regardless of the final outcome, at the very least this chapter restored legitimacy to NaruSaku and proves it's still very much a thing no matter how much the anti-narrative tried to deny it up until this point.
> 
> "Kishi no longer is focusing on NS hints.  The pairing is done.  NH is in the clear (and by extension that pile of fecal matter SS)"
> 
> ...



The pairing bullshit will continue unless something like that happens:

-Naruto outright says that he no longer loves Sakura OR loves Hinata more than he loves Sakura. NH wins, NS is dead, SS is a possibility(though not a given)

- Sasuke says that he loves Sakura and the girl still loves him AND does not love Naruto or at the very least loves Sasuke more. SS wins, NS is dead, NH may happen or not.

- Sakura realizes that she loves Naruto more than she loves Sasuke and Naruto's feelings for her neither change nor does he falls for Hinata. NS wins, SS is dead, NH is dead too.

- Sasuke falls for Karin or Ino.  SK/SI wins, SS is dead, NS may happen or not, NH may happen or not.

OR

Naruto, Sasuke, Sakura, or Hinata die and stay dead. Naruto for example might move on if Sakura died(though Kishi could make him stay faithful to his feelings for her even though they were not a couple thus trolling NH massively) and hook with Hinata.


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## Kickflip Uzumaki (Feb 8, 2014)

Deep kiss = CPR, eh?

So did I get to third base when that doctor touched my balls and made me cough in junior high? Here I thought it was just a physical.. I knew that whore wanted me


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## Alexdhamp (Feb 8, 2014)

Kickflip Uzumaki said:


> Deep kiss = CPR, eh?
> 
> So did I get to third base when that doctor touched my balls and made me cough in junior high? Here I thought it was just a physical.. I knew that whore wanted me


:rofl

.....

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Kickflip Uzumaki again." Dammit!


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## Kael Hyun (Feb 8, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> What if Kishi pull a JK Rowling.



That would be NaruHina were all of the relationship building is left out (or off panel) which is why those kind of hook up's in stories are detested. It works with side characters but with the main character it's just disgusting.


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

Kakugo said:


> This. Sakura's internal monologue while giving Naruto CPR and holding his heart is insignificant, but the NH "handhold" and Sasuke's reaction to Sakura's strength are considered significant/romantic? Shit double standard is shit.



but.... butt... it got a volume cover.


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## PAWS (Feb 8, 2014)

Nic said:


> but.... butt... it got a volume cover.



Exactly its not like Neji was the main focus of the cover but hey to each their own.


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## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

who gives a fuck about neji ? he's dead.


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## CalmPurple (Feb 8, 2014)

None of the pairings are endgame yet so no one should be claming their pairing to be canon.


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## Corvida (Feb 8, 2014)

> []
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

point being volume covers are meant to sell the volume.


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## Corvida (Feb 8, 2014)

> Nic said:
> 
> 
> > point being volume covers are meant to sell the volume.
> ...


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

i'm not referring to Neji, i'm referring to Hinata and Naruto.


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## Corvida (Feb 8, 2014)

> Nic said:
> 
> 
> > i'm not referring to Neji, i'm referring to Hinata and Naruto.
> ...


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## Hitt (Feb 8, 2014)

Pandemics said:


> classic narhin



"Who cares if his corpse is still warm under them..let's CELEBRATE!"

...meanwhile...

"But if NS were to happen cause Sasuke died then that would be terrible writing and you all should be ashamed of yourselves! "


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## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

Pandemics said:


> classic narhin



try again because i no longer gives a fuck about narhin. you tried it. 

idgaf about neji, he had no feats, he was a fodder and i dont get why he has stans. he's overrated.


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

At least Neji wasn't pairing fodder like a certain Hinata.


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## The Faceless Man (Feb 8, 2014)

I love how almost everyone knows that Sakura's character is based around Sasuke and Hinata's character is based around Naruto.

Yet they still debate paring's


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## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

Nic said:


> At least Neji wasn't pairing fodder like a certain Hinata.


so ? he was still a useless fodder.


Ultimate Bijuu said:


> I love how almost everyone knows that Sakura's character is based around Sasuke and Hinata's character is based around Naruto.
> 
> Yet they still debate paring's



Sakura's character is not based around Sasuke because she has connections with other characters. 

Hinata's character is based around Naruto, her main interactions are about him. ''Naruto-kun, Naruto-kun, Naruto-kun''


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## The Faceless Man (Feb 8, 2014)

^ clearly someone missed some interviews and well more then half of manga.

Sakura got development with sasuke , Hinata got with Naruto.

Both with love for their man's


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## Pandemics (Feb 8, 2014)

Hitt said:


> "Who cares if his corpse is still warm under them..let's CELEBRATE!"
> "



The only significance of that scene was clearly the fact that hands were held. dem held hands.



TheDivineOneDannii said:


> try again because i no longer gives a fuck about narhin. you tried it.



oh sry, you're sassak. gave you more credit than deserved.


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## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

Ultimate Bijuu said:


> ^ clearly someone missed some interviews and well more then half of manga.
> 
> Sakura got development with sasuke , Hinata got with Naruto.
> 
> Both with love for their man's



yes, a lot had to do with sauce, but not only him, tsunade too. and you're telling me i didn't read the manga ??? ok boo. 

hinata got development ? welp, yeah i guess. she's no longer a stalker



Pandemics said:


> oh sry, you're sassak. gave you more credit than deserved.



oooo i'm crushed. stay pressed. your fave is maggot food ! nobody gives a damn about his death and he had no MF role when he was alive.


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

Sakura has mentioned Sasuke's name i think 2x in  the last 200 chapters while completely focusing on Naruto just about every time she has panel, Hinata has about 100 Naruto-kun's in that time frame. 

Anyways Hinata is clearly pairing fodder even the way her character is drawn is so stereotypical of shounen. 

She reminds me a lot of character like Honoka in Suzuka, Onodera in Nesekoi, and Shinobu of Love hina.


Maybe Kishi (like the author of Suzuka) will write another manga with a Hinata looking type character that ends up with the main character.  You know just to appease the Hinata fans after Naruto ends up with Sakura.


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## Selina Kyle (Feb 8, 2014)

the hou ships narhin even in their darkest times


----------



## Alexdhamp (Feb 8, 2014)

Pandemics said:


> classic narhin



Nope.  One example does not make the entirety of NaruHina. Most felt horrible at Neji's death, including myself...then again, I'm also a Neji/Hyuuga fan.


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2014)

Nic said:


> At least Neji wasn't pairing fodder like a certain Hinata.



Worse.

He died for NaruHina 

If NaruHina does not become canon and Hinata does not get her man then Neji would have died for nothing.

He will never know peace on the other side 



Nic said:


> Sakura has mentioned Sasuke's name i think 2x in  the last 200 chapters while completely focusing on Naruto just about every time she has panel, Hinata has about 100 Naruto-kun's in that time frame.
> 
> Anyways Hinata is clearly pairing fodder even the way her character is drawn is so stereotypical of shounen.
> 
> ...



That is actually Hinata's only hope.

If the idiot hero always ends up with the tsundere that beats him then maybe Suigetsu will end up with Karin.

Then maybe Hinata would get Sasuke.

After all these shy boobalistic girls have to hook up with someone eventually and who would be left if all hot blooded guys are taken by tsunderes? Obviously the stoic jerk...who may become slightly less jerkish by the end.


----------



## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

Selina Kyle said:


> the hou ships narhin even in their darkest times



The mods of the HoU are lucky that the majority of NS fans have their own forum to post in, or they'd be working 24/7 in that section.


----------



## Hitt (Feb 8, 2014)

Nic said:


> Anyways Hinata is clearly pairing fodder even the way her character is drawn is so stereotypical of shounen.



I guess I should've seen this coming back when we first saw Hinata's Part II design.  Kishi "developed" her in quite interesting ways, and now she fits that dreaded "Yamato nadeshiko" stereotype with the big boobs, body shape, and the same shy personality.

That should've been a red flag for Hinata fans (well, the ones that don't just think of her as a sex symbol) what kind of character they were going to get from now on.


----------



## Kakugo (Feb 8, 2014)

Ultimate Bijuu said:


> I love how almost everyone knows that Sakura's character is based around Sasuke and Hinata's character is based around Naruto.
> 
> Yet they still debate paring's





Ultimate Bijuu said:


> ^ clearly someone missed some interviews and well more then half of manga.
> 
> Sakura got development with sasuke, Hinata got with Naruto.
> 
> Both with love for their man's


----------



## The Faceless Man (Feb 8, 2014)

I feel so soory for this guys/girls...  shonen manga like naruto are typical so many people already know alot of stuff.


----------



## NarutoIzDaMan (Feb 8, 2014)

I haven't posted in a thread like this for ages for good reason but I'll try to appeal to the LOGIC of all pairing fans one last time. Simple question - 

If there is ONE person who is _most likely_ to have their feelings requited in a manga named NARUTO, who would it be.......

A) Hinata
B) Karin 
C) Sakura
D) Sasuke
E) Naruto

P.S. Don't think too long or hard, it's not a trick question


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2014)

NarutoIzDaMan said:


> I haven't posted in a thread like this for ages for good reason but I'll try to appeal to the LOGIC of all pairing fans one last time. Simple question -
> 
> If there is ONE person who is _most likely_ to have their feelings requited in a manga named NARUTO, who would it be.......
> 
> ...



Hinata? 










....in her own spin off manga 

That said apart from Naruto, Sasuke also plays a huge role in the story so whatever girl they want, they will have it. And since Sasuke hadn't shown that his interests conflict with Naruto's in this regard then Kishi won't have a dilemma here. Either Naruto sticks to Sakura and Sasuke chooses another girl or Kishi decides to make Naruto hook with Hinata and pair Sasuke with whatever other girl. The girl's feelings do not matter in the great scheme of things. Poor girls....


----------



## Kage (Feb 8, 2014)

I'm laughing that Naruto is below even Sasuke.


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2014)

Kage said:


> I'm laughing that Naruto is below even Sasuke.



That would be because they are ranked in terms of plot relevance. Hinata and Karin are obviously above the likes of Naruto or Sasuke.


----------



## Alexdhamp (Feb 8, 2014)

Sasuke.


----------



## NarutoIzDaMan (Feb 8, 2014)

Kage said:


> I'm laughing that Naruto is below even Sasuke.





Arles Celes said:


> That would be because they are ranked in terms of plot relevance. Hinata and Karin are obviously above the likes of Naruto or Sasuke.



It's a multiple choice question


----------



## Kage (Feb 8, 2014)

NarutoIzDaMan said:


> It's a multiple choice question



my mistake. my answer is still Hinata 



Arles Celes said:


> That would be because they are ranked in terms of plot relevance. Hinata and Karin are obviously above the likes of Naruto or Sasuke.



Obviously.

This is a tale of Hyuga Hinata and her ninja way.


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

LOL at Karin more relevant than Sakura.


----------



## ichihimelove (Feb 8, 2014)

Ultimate Bijuu said:


> I love how almost everyone knows that Sakura's character is based around Sasuke and Hinata's character is based around Naruto.
> 
> Yet they still debate paring's



I love how almost everyone knows that Karin's character is based around Sasuke and Naruto loving is based around Sakura.

Yet they still debate paring's 



*Spoiler*: __ 



AAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAA 






Kickflip Uzumaki said:


> Deep kiss = CPR, eh?


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

but Naruto is based around Sasuke tho.


----------



## Alexdhamp (Feb 8, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> but Naruto is based around Sasuke tho.



SasuNaru wins. :barf


----------



## ichihimelove (Feb 8, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> but Naruto is based around Sasuke tho.





Alexdhamp said:


> SasuNaru wins. :barf



but Itachi is based around Sasuke and Sasuke is based around Itachi. 

so canon pairings in NARUTO manga are these


----------



## Alexdhamp (Feb 8, 2014)

^No, that makes it ItaSasuNaru...


----------



## Njaa (Feb 8, 2014)

^ True, Sasuke already penetrated Naruto once, and Itachi shoved his "raven" into Naruto's throat. Poor Naruto he got the submissive role in that relationship.


----------



## Kage (Feb 8, 2014)

You're all wrong. Naruto is entrusted with Sasuke's care, Itachi gave him away to Naruto like a father of the bride.


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2014)

Kage said:


> You're all wrong. Naruto is entrusted with Sasuke's care, Itachi gave him away to Naruto like a father of the bride.



Or more like Sasuke is a widow after Itachi's death and Naruto was entrusted by the latter to marry Sasuke and become his 2nd love.


----------



## Kage (Feb 8, 2014)

Arles Celes said:


> Or more like Sasuke is a widow after Itachi's death and Naruto was entrusted by the latter to marry Sasuke and become his 2nd love.



Just because Uchiha familial bonds are creepy doesn't necessarily mean they are incestuous


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2014)

Kage said:


> Just because Uchiha familial bonds are creepy doesn't necessarily mean they are incestuous



No worries, Sasuke's only canonical kiss was with Naruto. 

Unless one sees some sexual innuendo in being poked in the forehead  

But speaking of i*c*st...would you be surprised if it was revealed that Sasuke had crushed on his mom and the rumor of Sasuke liking girls with long hair originates from Mikoto's long hair? ^^


----------



## Kage (Feb 8, 2014)

Arles Celes said:


> No worries, Sasuke's only canonical kiss was with Naruto.
> 
> Unless one sees some sexual innuendo in being poked in the forehead
> 
> But speaking of i*c*st...would you be surprised if it was revealed that Sasuke had crushed on his mom and the rumor of Sasuke liking girls with long hair originates from Mikoto's long hair? ^^



Forever and always 

If it were for the "right" pairing sure why not. It's how shipping around here works. Smirks are considered maximum true love potential after all.

I...would not.  But only because it seems to be a thing in quite a few manga to want to marry someone in your immediate family at some point in your life D:


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

You guys are all wrong about itasasu !


----------



## ch1p (Feb 8, 2014)

ichihimelove said:


> but Itachi is based around Sasuke and Sasuke is based around Itachi.
> 
> so canon pairings in NARUTO manga are these




Sakura's closed eyes. 



Kakugo said:


> You're only proving my point further. Just as you claim to see the supposed significance of Sasuke's reaction to Sakura and NarHin's "handhold" (which really isn't all that significant considering he similarly touched everyone else to pass on his chakra), *myself and others see the positive (and contextual) significance of what's transpired between Naruto and Sakura in recent chapters (and many instances before)*.




I'll say it again, because you didn't read it the first time. I recognise the positive of this moment as well. What I don't recognise is the romantic vibes the NS folk are so keen on seeing. I don't see romantic vibes in Sasuke's smile either, so I don't see why do you keep insisting on saying something I never said.

The handhold is up to discussion for me, and at least has the potential of something more. See, the handhold included an unnecessary smile and hand squeeze. The CPR scene doesn't fit into that ambiguous context. At most, you have 'symbolism'  and valentines being next week. Like I said, ignoring context and story architecture, while getting too hung up on what's happening.



> Why would you, as someone who supports a very unhealthy and dysfunctional pairing (SS), find it plausible to justify your beliefs in their potential, while discrediting the positive potential that Naruto and Sakura continuously demonstrates to have?




Because despite the murder attempts, Sakura still romantically loves Sasuke.

Because despite Naruto becoming what a hero and Sakura acknowledging, she does not love him.

There is a difference here.



> This is what I mean by double standards. You can't have your cake and eat it too.




Of course I can. I can have half and eat the other half. Why would I want to have a cake (what's the point of having it) and not eat it is beyond me though, but that's your simile.



Seto Kaiba said:


> Because it doesn't.




We agree on something?



> Yet it has flaws more evident in itself that you hold against other relationships. The qualities you often cite are from a comparatively small part of the larger story as a whole and also involve ignoring its flaws.




What are these flaws I hold against other relationships that I don't against SS?

Whether the qualities I often cite are comparatively small part of the larger story or not is irrelevant. What matters is that I like them. NaruSaku is also a comparatively small part of the larger story, and there are still fans for it. Is this just you being against pairings altogether? There are fans of Temari, when she's also a comparatively small part of the larger story. Not everyone needs to be a fan of Naruto or Sasuke. 



> Whenever the moment is relevant you don't ever want to. As I recall there was quite a vicious attempt by you all to avoid discussion on the matter. I just find it odd how you, who supports something like SasuSaku, can even attempt to reconcile your criticisms of other relationships. Their flaws hardly compare.




I've never avoided it and I've discussed it with you personally plenty of times. I just don't see the point of discussing it ATM when the manga isn't oriented there. It would be a repetition from last time and I'm not fond of repetition.



> The rest ok, the last sentence? Kinda goes back to my point. That in itself ok, I can see what you mean; yet when considering what you DO think would be the contrast to that and considering events in the story that are relevant to that idea...Questions arise.




It's an AND not a OR.

I find NarSak jokes funny, as much as I find SK jokes funny. However, they don't appeal to me outside of a cheap laugh. The NarSak's other side, Naruto acknowleging SS and bowing out is fine but that doesn't appeal for me to ship them either. Naruto might have been my favourite once upon a time, but I need more than that.

Regarding the last sentence, I also see what you mean. However, I've pointed this out to you more than once as well. Of course Sakura isn't happy with Sasuke frolicking with the arc villain so she can't be happy with him like this. However, Sakura was happy when Sasuke was there with them (and her open smile when she thought he was recently is a throwback to that). Sasuke himself has been an unhappy clusterfuck ever since he left his friends and this is portrayed as his biggest mistake, so going back would be good for him as well. The SS pairing (to me) is about that, not about them smexing inside the Sound Base while being enemies. I don't ship them as bonnie and clyde either (ew).


----------



## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

Arles Celes said:


> Hinata?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Lol I'd laugh so hard if Hinata got her own spinoff many a yo appease the Hinata because she didn't get with Naruto.


----------



## Hitt (Feb 8, 2014)

ch1p said:


> Sakura's closed eyes.
> .



Still less ridiculous of an edit than plugging Hinata in there.  Or Sasuke for the other pairing.  

You know, for a moment with "absolutely no romantic connotations whatsoever".  



Nic said:


> Lol I'd laugh so hard if Hinata got her own spinoff many a yo appease the Hinata because she didn't get with Naruto.


Hinata couldn't carry a manga by herself.

She's a shallow character who has long since been destroyed by her pairing fodder status.


----------



## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

No just reinvent the character and draw her the same.  That's exactly how kimi no iru machi was created.


----------



## Gunstarvillain (Feb 8, 2014)

So I'm thinking orochimaru is the person at sasukes body. He will choose to give him a second chance and take the power kabuto had and give it to sasuke then sasuke is dragon sage uchiha
Kakashi and obito leave naruto a new pair of eyes not like he needs them but it would be dope.


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2014)

Nic said:


> Lol I'd laugh so hard if Hinata got her own spinoff many a yo appease the Hinata because she didn't get with Naruto.



Hinata may snap in said spin off and become Obito v2.

These "fragile flower" types of girls also have a tendency to snap and go yandere.

Hinata kinda reminds me of Kotonoha from School Days.

If Naruto ignores her confession for way to long she may develop...delusions.


----------



## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

Never understood the popularity of Hinata's character, yet often that's the case with the one dimensional satelitte  shy love character that has a crush on the main character.  I wonder if that's because fan girls just relate to the character.


----------



## Seto Kaiba (Feb 8, 2014)

Nic said:


> Never understood the popularity of Hinata's character, yet often that's the case with the one dimensional satelitte  shy love character that has a crush on the main character.  I wonder if that's because fan girls just relate to the character.



Relation and Woobification.


----------



## brainguyobserver (Feb 8, 2014)

Is it true that in the first databook it says "she also looks Naruto's way despite loving Sasuke at that moment,but it is also mentioned that she might happen to love Naruto in the future."

I'd say that's another big clue of them getting together


----------



## Benzaiten (Feb 8, 2014)

Meh, aren't editors the ones in charge of the databook? I wouldn't rely on them so much. Of course, it's nice when it gives hints for your pairings but it's not really a good source of "evidence" or whatever. I just treat it as a filler or movie. Ultimately, it's the manga that tells you what you need to know.


----------



## Rios (Feb 8, 2014)

Nic said:


> Never understood the popularity of Hinata's character, yet often that's the case with the one dimensional satelitte  shy love character that has a crush on the main character.  I wonder if that's because fan girls just relate to the character.



God forbid the author actually makes a unique character look that appeals to males and females alike. How can such a character ever gain popularity.


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

brainguyobserver said:


> Is it true that in the first databook it says "she also looks Naruto's way despite loving Sasuke at that moment,but it is also mentioned that she might happen to love Naruto in the future."
> 
> I'd say that's another big clue of them getting together



no kishi never said that.



Benzaiten said:


> Meh, aren't editors the ones in charge of the databook? I wouldn't rely on them so much. Of course, it's nice when it gives hints for your pairings but it's not really a good source of "evidence" or whatever. I just treat it as a filler or movie. Ultimately, it's the manga that tells you what you need to know.



don't start. databooks are written by kishimoto


----------



## Nic (Feb 8, 2014)

Rios said:


> God forbid the author actually makes a unique character look that appeals to males and females alike. How can such a character ever gain popularity.



There's nothing unique in a type of character that is employed more often than even the tsundere type or dumb main character.


----------



## Benzaiten (Feb 8, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> don't start. databooks are written by kishimoto


They aren't. It's like those big ass texts you see at the end of a chapter. They're written by the staff/editors. I'd love to believe the databooks as much as the next guy but it's really not a good basis for what'll happen in the manga, not after Kishi admitted he's making up shit along the way.


----------



## brainguyobserver (Feb 8, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> no kishi never said that.



I'm not saying Kishi did but the first databook did.


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

brainguyobserver said:


> I'm not saying Kishi did but the first databook did.



gimme the links please


----------



## brainguyobserver (Feb 8, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> gimme the links please



I saw the translation here

"Sakura herself doesn't really know how she feels about Naruto. Her great love is Sasuke, but it should be noticed she also looks Naruto's way... We can't talk about love for the moment, but who knows?! It might happen."


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 8, 2014)

brainguyobserver said:


> I saw the translation here
> 
> "Sakura herself doesn't really know how she feels about Naruto. Her great love is Sasuke, but it should be noticed she also looks Naruto's way... We can't talk about love for the moment, but who knows?! It might happen."


was it the first databook ? cuz
currently, sakura knows how she feels about nardo and sasuke. see the fake confession. she listed the reasons why she should love nardo but doesnt and she's in love with the bae, Sasskeh.


----------



## runsakurarun (Feb 9, 2014)

NarutoIzDaMan said:


> I haven't posted in a thread like this for ages for good reason but I'll try to appeal to the LOGIC of all pairing fans one last time. Simple question -
> 
> If there is ONE person who is _most likely_ to have their feelings requited in a manga named NARUTO, who would it be.......
> 
> ...



The answer is E or D care of C


----------



## ch1p (Feb 9, 2014)

brainguyobserver said:


> I saw the translation here
> 
> "Sakura herself doesn't really know how she feels about Naruto. Her great love is Sasuke, but it should be noticed she also looks Naruto's way... We can't talk about love for the moment, but who knows?! It might happen."




Oh, DB1... "*She's been harboring an unrequited love for Sasuke since early childhood.* At the same time, she handles the rigorous, daily life of missions and practice, and she loves with every fiber of her being. She probably exemplifies what an ideal young woman would be like. Even here on this picture, *there's no refraining from cheering for her*!!"

Well, fuck.  

The databooks are supplemental material anyway. They've been retconned a few times too.


----------



## Kickflip Uzumaki (Feb 9, 2014)

Does nobody remember the Jump Fiesta 2010 interview when Kishimoto-sensei was like "Naruto is close to her, but Sakura loves Sasuke. We should all remember the speech he gave her"?

I remember because that was right before saying he doesn't want to write Shikamaru in any romances and something about it being Kakashi's year.


----------



## brainguyobserver (Feb 9, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> was it the first databook ? cuz
> currently, sakura knows how she feels about nardo and sasuke. see the fake confession. she listed the reasons why she should love nardo but doesnt and she's in love with the bae, Sasskeh.



Correct me if I'm wrong but that was before he tried to kill her right? Not to mention there was also that panel where Sai pointed out that even though Sauce became a good guy again she still doesn't trust him nor appears to harbor feelings for him. When he showed up she showed that she was surprised and when she teamed up with nardo and sauce there was that "humurous" moment where she forgot Nardo was there but thats about it

then there's that shonen cliche where the protagonist's pa (jokingly or otherwise) asks if <insert female lead here> is his gf. This cliche is a form of foreshadowing that they'll be together as demonstrated in multiple other titles as well (Rave, Dragonball, Psyren etc.)

Don't get me wrong I see your point though.



Kickflip Uzumaki said:


> Does nobody remember the Jump Fiesta 2010 interview when Kishimoto-sensei was like "Naruto is close to her, but Sakura loves Sasuke. We should all remember the speech he gave her"?
> 
> I remember because that was right before saying he doesn't want to write Shikamaru in any romances and something about it being Kakashi's year.



What speech is he talking about?


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 9, 2014)

Kickflip Uzumaki said:


> Does nobody remember the Jump Fiesta 2010 interview when Kishimoto-sensei was like "Naruto is close to her, but Sakura loves Sasuke. We should all remember the speech he gave her"?
> 
> I remember because that was right before saying he doesn't want to write Shikamaru in any romances and something about it being Kakashi's year.


yep, you are correct but too lazy to search for the interview, but i do remember he said these exact same words. 



brainguyobserver said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong but that was before he tried to kill her right? Not to mention there was also that panel where Sai pointed out that even though Sauce became a good guy again she still doesn't trust him nor appears to harbor feelings for him. When he showed up she showed that she was surprised and when she teamed up with nardo and sauce there was that "humurous" moment where she forgot Nardo was there but thats about it
> 
> then there's that shonen cliche where the protagonist's pa (jokingly or otherwise) asks if <insert female lead here> is his gf. This cliche is a form of foreshadowing that they'll be together as demonstrated in multiple other titles as well (Rave, Dragonball, Psyren etc.)
> 
> ...


i believe that was before he tried to kill her.
i'm not surprised, it seems like on shounen, they don't care about the female's feelings, the hero gotta win his prize.  
i know she's still in love with him because she blushed when sasuke saved her from the juubi, plus sai said her words were sincere but her smile was fake. she's worried about his intentions which is reasonable because the last time they've seen each other sasuke told her he wanted to destroy konoha and now he wanna be hokage, of course she'd be suspicious, and as we know already, sakura can read sasuke very well. Also, *chapter 540*, confirms us she's still in love with sasuke.

about the speech...i can't remember exactly


----------



## brainguyobserver (Feb 9, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> yep, you are correct but too lazy to search for the interview, but i do remember he said these exact same words..



So. we're gonna be stuck with SasuSaku? 

That sounds...terrible not just because I hope for narusaku to happen but also because the relationship wouldn't be a good one. I hate to think of a relationship where a girl spends the rest of her life with someone who tried to killer multiple times without a second thought for the sole purpose that she and she alone still loves him.....isn't that how some real life abusive relationships are? (obviously most of the time is without the killing part)


----------



## Kage (Feb 9, 2014)

There is an awful lot of need to assert how much Sakura loves Sasuke despite Sakura supposedly not being an obstacle to NH regardless.
and despite how miserable it makes her and how obsolete she continues to be to Sasuke's story.

Whether she loves him or not shouldn't matter if one is confident in Naruto's feelings for Hinata. _pssst_ this means being absolutely certain he would choose Hinata even if Sakura became available to him
Evidently many are not as confident as they seem that such would be the case.


----------



## brainguyobserver (Feb 9, 2014)

I don't really like the NH pairing either (I used to back in part 1 but the "being too shy to talk and all the stalking" is getting annoying as hell after 15 years)


----------



## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 9, 2014)

brainguyobserver said:


> So. we're gonna be stuck with SasuSaku?
> 
> That sounds...terrible not just because I hope for narusaku to happen but also because the relationship wouldn't be a good one. I hate to think of a relationship where a girl spends the rest of her life with someone who tried to killer multiple times without a second thought for the sole purpose that she and she alone still loves him.....isn't that how some real life abusive relationships are? (obviously most of the time is without the killing part)



and ? 

i hope for sasusaku to happen and *ahem* you can't separate reality from fiction ?


----------



## ch1p (Feb 9, 2014)

Kage said:


> There is an awful lot of need to assert how much Sakura loves Sasuke despite Sakura supposedly not being an obstacle to NH regardless.




That's because this was a Sakura -> Naruto moment. It's her actions we're discussing.


----------



## brainguyobserver (Feb 9, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> and ?
> 
> i hope for sasusaku to happen and *ahem* you can't separate reality from fiction ?



Its not a matter of reality or fiction its just an unhealthy relationship.


----------



## Kage (Feb 9, 2014)

brainguyobserver said:


> I don't really like the NH pairing either (I used to back in part 1 but the "being too shy to talk and all the stalking" is getting annoying as hell after 15 years)



I used to like it too but then a whole lot of nothing happened and even with the attention it's been getting it still just feels like _a whole lot of nothing._

Anyway, you shouldn't worry about carefully selected databook entries and old interviews used to conveniently "prove" (and man do I use this word loosely) whatever pairing. Let the rest of the manga show you rather than just "tell"


----------



## Renyou (Feb 9, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> i'm not surprised, it seems like on shounen, they don't care about the female's feelings, the hero gotta win his prize.


Well, somebody has to move on for the whole thing to be resolved, right? That implies one character's desires have to be favored over another's (in a manner of speaking, as "moving on" implies both characters would be desiring the same thing). Usually, the main character takes priority, especially when he has established feelings for another character (which wasn't the case with Goku and Bulma, for example) and in this case it makes sense too since the plot was written with that in mind (as far as I can tell, at least). Besides, they wouldn't really be a 'prize', that sounds like something that just happened out of the blue for the heck of it, which isn't the case at all. If there was no foreshadowing or development whatsoever, you would have a point (it seems what's considered "development" varies depending on who you ask though).

Kishimoto could just make everyone end up with someone random, but many would consider that to be bad writing or a cop-out as the "moments" between the characters would be for nothing (see: Digimon 02).


----------



## brainguyobserver (Feb 9, 2014)

Kage said:


> I used to like it too but then a whole lot of nothing happened and even with the attention it's been getting it still just feels like _a whole lot of nothing._
> 
> Anyway, you shouldn't worry about carefully selected databook entries and old interviews used to conveniently "prove" (and man do I use this word loosely) whatever pairing. Let the rest of the manga show you rather than just "tell"



I wasn't so much using it to back up my argument so much as I was asking to make sure it was true and not some more false rumors.

There's quite alot of evidence in the manga backing up the narusaku relationship one of which I mentioned is that there are atleast 3 different characters who point it out (konohamaru, Gamakichi and Minato) The only thing that's really keeping this at bay is Sakura's persistent love for sauce.


----------



## Alexdhamp (Feb 9, 2014)

^So says one that's worse than Matrix for the NS side...well, _one_ of them.


brainguyobserver said:


> So. we're gonna be stuck with SasuSaku?
> 
> That sounds...terrible not just because I hope for narusaku to happen but also because the relationship wouldn't be a good one. I hate to think of a relationship where a girl spends the rest of her life with someone who tried to killer multiple times without a second thought for the sole purpose that she and she alone still loves him....*.isn't that how some real life abusive relationships are?* (obviously most of the time is without the killing part)



How many of those real life relationships are where each member was on some kind of violently opposing faction? This actually isn't all that odd in fiction where two enemies eventually become lovers. Also, Sasuke wouldn't be an abusive guy once hes _actually_ with someone.


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 9, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> and ?
> 
> i hope for sasusaku to happen and *ahem* you can't separate reality from fiction ?



That's such a stupid attempt to dodge the negatives of it. If you look at interactions between two characters you are going to judge the nature of them based on how familiar you are with them as they exist. You hope for SasuSaku to happen, you want it to be romantic presumably; As the nature of any relationship in fiction can ultimately only be identified based on understanding of such nature as it exists IRL, bringing up any flaws or faults that like *murder attempts* is more than a little valid in consideration of how you and others may perceive the particular relationship of Sasuke and Sakura and where you want it to go.



Alexdhamp said:


> How many of those real life relationships are where each member was on some kind of violently opposing faction? This actually isn't all that odd in fiction where two enemies eventually become lovers. Also, Sasuke wouldn't be an abusive guy once hes _actually_ with someone.



This is an even worse argument. Sasuke didn't start out as the bad guy, he started out as their friend; and he allowed himself to be driven to the point that he would kill them without hesitation. It's pretty ridiculous the way you try to excuse it, as does the story sadly enough. Furthermore, you seem to be under the mistaken idea that because the characters act like it's ok, we should too. 

Another warped rationale you have is your last sentence. I shouldn't even have to explain that one. So he'll stop being homicidal once he gets some lovin'? Oh, if only we found a woman for Ted Bundy!


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## Nic (Feb 9, 2014)

Kishi must think so much of SS considering he can't even be bothered to focus on it.


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## Nic (Feb 9, 2014)

Kishi - " how can I make these two into a canon pairing? Oh that's right how about I try and have them kill each other? "


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## Kage (Feb 9, 2014)

brainguyobserver said:


> I wasn't so much using it to back up my argument so much as I was asking to make sure it was true and not some more false rumors.
> 
> There's quite alot of evidence in the manga backing up the narusaku relationship one of which I mentioned is that there are atleast 3 different characters who point it out (konohamaru, Gamakichi and Minato) The only thing that's really keeping this at bay is Sakura's persistent love for sauce.



Okay, that already makes your case better than most.

Yeah, I can't really tell you if she's going to grow up and get over her infatuation because I honestly don't know and Kishi doesn't seem particularly committed to making Sakura likeable...


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## ichihimelove (Feb 9, 2014)

Alexdhamp said:


> ^So says one that's worse than Matrix for the NS side...well, _one_ of them.



Who? 


*Spoiler*: __ 










Nic said:


> Kishi - " how can I make these two into a canon pairing? Oh that's right how about I try and have them kill each other? "



*kill each other = love each othe*r in SS world


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 9, 2014)

I just wanna put it out there, SasuSaku at this point isn't really anything more than some warped wish fulfillment ala Twilight/50 Shades of Grey. I think you all know how that trope goes...

I just can't imagine trying to constantly defend something that fucked up, it'd take an amazing degree of selective interpretation, moreso than average for a pairing; just to avoid the flaws for its qualities. Even moreso, in contrast to the other two, seems to be stuck in time, so to speak. It's like apparently it has a "pause" button where none of their interactions in Part II we are supposed to count against it. Probably because most of them involved Sasuke trying to kill Sakura.


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## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 9, 2014)

Kage said:


> Okay, that already makes your case better than most.
> 
> Yeah, I can't really tell you if she's going to grow up and get over her infatuation because I honestly don't know and Kishi doesn't seem particularly committed to making Sakura likeable...


how is sakura falling in love with nardo will make her likeable or grow ??? 
she doesn't have to fall for him to prove something.


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## C-Moon (Feb 9, 2014)

> how is sakura falling in love with nardo will make her likeable or grow ???
> she doesn't have to fall for him to prove something.



You seem to have this idea that everyone who wants her to stop pursuing Sasuke do so because they want her going after Naruto instead. That's shortsighted. She doesn't have to fall for him. In fact, no one in this story is obligated to love someone because that someone expressed their feelings, but she needs to show some dignity around Sasuke if nothing else.


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## Deleted member 206107 (Feb 9, 2014)

Seto Kaiba said:


> Straight from the fangirl handbook, when you can't properly address an argument try to claim the critic is obsessed/hater/bitter in lieu of any actual substance or relevance to the argument presented.
> 
> 
> 
> It is abusive.



you ain't criticizing, you're saying a lot of BS. like always. 

no it is not. 
this is what being abusive is.


> Relationship abuse is a pattern of abusive and coercive behaviors used to maintain power and control over a former or current intimate partner. Abuse can be emotional, financial, sexual or physical and can include threats, isolation, and intimidation. Abuse tends to escalate over time. When someone uses abuse and violence against a partner, it is always part of a larger pattern of control.



i don't remember sasuke harming sakura for his own benefit or trying to control her. 
since you brought the MF murder attempts....sasuke was unstable at the time, he knew sakura was there to assassinate him and he had this hatred against konoha not sakura personally.
btw saying its abusive is disrespectful to people who have gone thru REAL abusive relationships.


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## Renyou (Feb 9, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> since you brought the MF murder attempts....sasuke was unstable at the time, he knew sakura was there to assassinate him and he had this hatred against konoha not sakura personally.


Be as it may, he chose that path himself. So it's his own fault he was unstable and lashing out to begin with.

Did he even apologize to Sakura? Or do you think he doesn't have to?


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## ch1p (Feb 9, 2014)

I like how nobody adressed my posts, which had arguments, and instead this has devolved into petty insulting. I cannot wait for the inevitable post elsehwere full of butthurt because I got away with it for the umptieth of time.



Seto Kaiba said:


> I just wanna put it out there.




Here and anywhere you can think of, because that's your litany at this point.


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 9, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> you ain't criticizing, you're saying a lot of BS. like always.



No, I'm saying things you don't like but can't argue against and that infuriates you. 



> no it is not.
> this is what being abusive is
> 
> i don't remember sasuke harming sakura for his own benefit or trying to control her.



That's one form of it. What you cited is a case in an actual relationship, that is, once it has started. It comes in many forms since you don't seem to know, and I would think repeatedly trying to kill someone would fall under that, but it doesn't now. Or rather you don't want it to as far as Sasuke and Sakura are concerned.



> since you brought the MF murder attempts....sasuke was unstable at the time, he knew sakura was there to assassinate him and he had this hatred against konoha not sakura personally.



1. Sasuke was lucid. He knew everything he was doing.

2. Sakura going after him is like an Academy Student going after a Jonin.

3. He has incapacitated a greater number of enemies through non-lethal means. He tried to kill simply because he wanted to.

4. The non-personal nature of his attempt only hurts your attempted portrayal of the relationship. It illustrates just exactly how little influence she has over him.



> btw saying its abusive is disrespectful to people who have gone thru REAL abusive relationships.



No it isn't. It is what it is, regardless of personal feelings. Sakura experience significant emotional turmoil due to his actions, and even at times, threats to her well-being and very life. Yet you and others try to advertise it as this meaningful relationship that deserves to progress into a romantic one, no less.


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## Kakugo (Feb 9, 2014)

ch1p said:


> I'll say it again, because you didn't read it the first time. I recognise the positive of this moment as well. What I don't recognise is the romantic vibes the NS folk are so keen on seeing. I don't see romantic vibes in Sasuke's smile either, so I don't see why do you keep insisting on saying something I never said.



I read what you said, though perhaps you missed my point. You’re abiding by the same double standards that I’ve pointed out to you in my previous post. As an SS supporter, you make the bias distinction in that Sasuke’s reaction to Sakura is considered “significant”, while the context of Sakura’s actions/internal monologue while giving Naruto CPR isn't. I’m not even talking romantic connotations here (and I never said you considered Sasuke’s reaction to be romantic), I’m talking about the significance of said actions that could potentially be built upon and become something greater. You claim to see potential stemming from Sasuke’s side, but shun those who see the potential for Sakura to radiate anything towards Naruto that could very well lead to mutual reciprocation. 



> Sakura's internal monologue is not differently contextually from her monologue in the Chunin exams, where she was in love with Sasuke and not Naruto.
> 
> Sasuke's reaction to Sakura are significant in guaging that he acknowledges her power, that's not romantic. It also shows he's ready to, as he put it, 'bygone be bygones' which helps air the pairing from his side. Sakura doesn't seem all that bothered by it either. I personally believe there's potential there.



^ Those were your words. You may not consider that to be a double standard, but I do. Others might agree with me.



ch1p said:


> The handhold is up to discussion for me, and at least has the potential of something more. See, the handhold included an unnecessary smile and hand squeeze. The CPR scene doesn't fit into that ambiguous context. At most, you have 'symbolism'  and valentines being next week. Like I said, ignoring context and story architecture, while getting too hung up on what's happening.



You’re doing it again. 



ch1p said:


> Because despite the murder attempts, Sakura still romantically loves Sasuke.
> 
> Because despite Naruto becoming what a hero and Sakura acknowledging, she does not love him.
> 
> There is a difference here.



I find it rather difficult to understand how anyone with a moral compass could find your statement to be a reasonable justification as to why SasuSaku is plausible while NaruSaku is not.

Unlike Naruto, Sasuke, OR Hinata, Sakura has been the one character to demonstrate emotional confliction and the potential to switch sides. Naruto has never demonstrated to have any romantic interest in Hinata, Sasuke has never demonstrated to have any romantic interest in Sakura, Hinata is one-dimensional and doesn’t see the world outside of Naruto, and Sakura has numerously behaved in ways towards Naruto that could easily be perceived as romantic (hence why her feelings are often subject to debate).

If you want to hold onto your beliefs in that SasuSaku is a contender in this supposed “pairing race”, you must acknowledge that NaruSaku is a contender as well.



ch1p said:


> Of course I can. I can have half and eat the other half. Why would I want to have a cake (what's the point of having it) and not eat it is beyond me though, but that's your simile.



The double standard is your cake. You can’t crap out the BS that you see SasuSaku’s potential despite their minimal foundation but shit on those who justifiably see NaruSaku’s potential in the long haul, especially considering their comparatively healthier (and far more stable) cushioning.


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## CandleGuy (Feb 9, 2014)

I do enjoy when SS waxes philosophic on the nature of love. It bring such stimulating and poignant content to the mind.

For example SS has a very defined and concrete criteria for love when judging Naruto, Karin, and Sakura. For Sasuke however the rules are more fluid and abstract for very good reasons.

Very, very, good reasons. Some of which are too complicated and well hard to grasp by the facile mind.

Indeed every other pairing has unhealthy attributes to it if you look hard enough yet when it comes to SS one has to be able to separate fact from fiction.

It seems SS like love itself has many variables and _um _layers to it. Its such a rich tapestry of complexity that perhaps once again like love one must be in it, to truly appreciate the majesty of it.


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## ch1p (Feb 9, 2014)

@candleguy: 



Kakugo said:


> I read what you said, though perhaps you missed my point. You?re abiding by the same double standards that I?ve pointed out to you in my previous post. As an SS supporter, you make the bias distinction in that Sasuke?s reaction to Sakura is considered ?significant?, while the context of Sakura?s actions/internal monologue while giving Naruto CPR isn't.
> 
> I?m not even talking romantic connotations here (and I never said you considered Sasuke?s reaction to be romantic), I?m talking about the significance of said actions that could potentially be built upon and become something greater. You claim to see potential stemming from Sasuke?s side, but shun those who see the potential for Sakura to radiate anything towards Naruto that could very well lead to mutual reciprocation.



I don't make any bias distinction. I have acknowledged, many times over that Sakura's CPR moment was cool for the relationship. I just don't acknowledged it as romantic, because there's no indication it is romantic.

I make the dinstinction between Sakura's feelings for Sasuke, because while it was stated indirectly, it was stated in 540 that she loves Sasuke. She didn't do that in 663, she "recycled" an old platonic moment before, which makes it non romantic by default unless retconned later.



> ^ Those were your words. You may not consider that to be a double standard, but I do. Others might agree with me.



And others agree with me. This isn't a novel concept.



> You?re doing it again.



Oops. NOT.



> I find it rather difficult to understand how anyone with a moral compass could find your statement to be a reasonable justification as to why SasuSaku is plausible while NaruSaku is not.



Because it's not about right or wrong, but about reading the manga's context. You thinking it's wrong is not going to change the endgame. Kishi certainly never portrayed it as a problem he couldn't overcome.



> Unlike Naruto, Sasuke, OR Hinata, Sakura has been the one character to demonstrate emotional confliction and the potential to switch sides. Naruto has never demonstrated to have any romantic interest in Hinata, Sasuke has never demonstrated to have any romantic interest in Sakura, Hinata is one-dimensional and doesn?t see the world outside of Naruto, and Sakura has numerously behaved in ways towards Naruto that could easily be perceived as romantic (hence why her feelings are often subject to debate).



Sakura stated her dream to be acknowledged by Sasuke in chapter 3, which Naruto acnowledged as worth noting because it's the same as his. Furthermore, Sakura stated in chapter 4 that Sasuke was her dream while Naruto said he wanted to be Hokage and Sasuke wanted to kill Itachi. You'd have a point if Kishimoto hadn't setup Sakura's romantic feelings for Sakura to be that important. As important as the other two's dreams.



> If you want to hold onto your beliefs in that SasuSaku is a contender in this supposed ?pairing race?, you must acknowledge that NaruSaku is a contender as well.



I do acknowledge it, I just acknowledge it's a very good contender or much of a contender to begin with.



> The double standard is your cake. You can?t crap out the BS that you see SasuSaku?s potential despite their minimal foundation but shit on those who justifiably see NaruSaku?s potential in the long haul, especially considering their comparatively healthier (and far more stable) cushioning.



LOL Sakura's cushioning. She's flat chested!


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 9, 2014)

TheDivineOneDannii said:


> oh the irony.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You clearly don't know the meaning of either of those words...



> that's completely false. show me the manga panels because i really don't know what are you talking about. maybe you read a fanfiction.



He knew it was Sakura, he knew the likely reason she was there. As a matter of fact, it was pretty clear he planned on killing her once he saw her, considering he made the first move while she was still struggling in thought:


*Spoiler*: __ 



[/IMG]






> first of fucking all, most of the times when sasuke criticized sakura, she reflected on it and takes it to better herself.
> 
> for example, in chapter 3 when she made the comment about naruto having no parent and he called her annoying, sakura reflected on it and she told herself she'll behave nicer with naruto, which she actually did.



He wasn't "Hey Sakura, maybe you can be a little nicer to Naruto!"

He was contemptuous. She felt guilt over it, because she was hell-bent on getting good with Sasuke and it was clear she had pissed him off. You guys pretend in this little fantasy like he was just giving some friendly advice. He wasn't. He doesn't. He's blunt and criticizes others in that fashion.



> on the chuunin exams, sasuke told her to work on her skills and that she was lower than naruto, sakura reflected on it and hell to the yeah she worked on it.
> and he did that plenty of times and yet he's EVUUUUUUUUUHHHLLLL, HE'S A DICK, SASGAY IS SOOO GAY.



Just the same. It wasn't applied as constructive criticism, he seriously thought she was a weak burden on the team. He had contempt for that weakness.


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## Cord (Feb 9, 2014)

Alright that's enough. Wait a few more hours and you can continue this discussion in the Fanclubs or HoU section.

Hope you guys had enough fun tho.


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