# Quitting Your Job and Starting a business



## Shanks (Jan 1, 2022)

So my brother owns a few Tobacco shops each netting $80k to $100k per month.

I am thinking of partnering with him to open another shop 50/50 ownership, but I will need do most of the work and get a small salary, while he advise as a shareholder.

The problem is, I have to quit my job and go all in, literally working 6 - 7 days a week, no more holidays. There are a small risk that it might not work out, but if it does I'll get about 3xtimes my current salary after a year.

Took me 15 years to get to where I am with my career and it just a little difficult to let go and currently do not have any financial stress at the moment.

Curious on what would you do in this situation?

Reactions: Like 2


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## Magic (Jan 1, 2022)

Would go for it. 
Godspeed

Reactions: Like 1


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## wibisana (Jan 1, 2022)

Shanks said:


> So my brother owns a few Tobacco shops each netting $80k to $100k per month.
> 
> I am thinking of partnering with him to open another shop 50/50 ownership, but I will need do most of the work and get a small salary, while he advise as a shareholder.
> 
> ...


i was working at my uncle company and posted in project side, due to my disagrement with the manager i decided to quit (i said to my uncle i quit from the project side and considering to quit all together) RN i can go to jakarta/Head office and work there if i want to but im taking my time to get some break, taking care of things...

my wife have this homemade cake thing, that makes quite good amount of money, i was planning to settle there help it grow, but the problem is, RN i dont have house, so im buying one, and at fastest i can get the house in mid/late 2022 if the bank approve our loan. meanwhile i prolly have to go back to work at my uncle's company in jan/feb lol. XD. i do want to be independent

Reactions: Like 1


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## wibisana (Jan 1, 2022)

on your topic why cant you invest and pay someone (preferably relative to run it)... i mean money you got from your career seems to good to be given up

but if you sure you can go back at old work normally of thing didnt work, i dont think it is wrong to try new stuff

Reactions: Like 1


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## Shanks (Jan 1, 2022)

wibisana said:


> on your topic why cant you invest and pay someone (preferably relative to run it)... i mean money you got from your career seems to good to be given up
> 
> but if you sure you can go back at old work normally of thing didnt work, i dont think it is wrong to try new stuff


It is important to be part of your own business, essentially in the beginning. More importantly, I have zero experience and need to learn. 

If I want to just hire someone, then why can't my brother open another shop then? The way he does business is to invest in people that put their heart and souls into the business and he will help make it successful. All his other shops are run by other partners also. 

And no going back on the job if I leave, lol. 



wibisana said:


> i was working at my uncle company and posted in project side, due to my disagrement with the manager i decided to quit (i said to my uncle i quit from the project side and considering to quit all together) RN i can go to jakarta/Head office and work there if i want to but im taking my time to get some break, taking care of things...
> 
> my wife have this homemade cake thing, that makes quite good amount of money, i was planning to settle there help it grow, but the problem is, RN i dont have house, so im buying one, and at fastest i can get the house in mid/late 2022 if the bank approve our loan. meanwhile i prolly have to go back to work at my uncle's company in jan/feb lol. XD. i do want to be independent


Yeah, you should try to get that house first. I already have mine and have equality to take out to invest in the business. 

The homemade cake is great. My niece made heaps more than her job doing catering (from home) and her husband quit his job to help her. Combine, they probably made 3 - 4 people's salary right now.

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


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## wibisana (Jan 1, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Yeah, you should try to get that house first. I already have mine and have equality to take out to invest in the business.
> 
> The homemade cake is great. My niece made heaps more than her job doing catering (from home) and her husband quit his job to help her. Combine, they probably made 3 - 4 people's salary right now.


yeah, RN my wife and me (due to im taking a break) living in inlaws, really not ideal place to live for me personally, while my wife if fine living there and she did the business there, if i am going to all out i need my own place for sure.

i have a place, my parents gave us but my wife doesnt want to sleep there, idk, she said she afraid of ghost and stuff but i think it is more complicated than that.. ideally she would sleep on my place (whether i buy, given or rent) or my parent's if we cant afford those according to our culture, but she insist living in her parents and i dont wanna argue/force her that make her sad... i had a childhood friend who get depressed and died to illness due to forced to live with her inlaws. i dont to make that mistake. 


Shanks said:


> It is important to be part of your own business, essentially in the beginning. More importantly, I have zero experience and need to learn.
> 
> If I want to just hire someone, then why can't my brother open another shop then? The way he does business is to invest in people that put their heart and souls into the business and he will help make it successful. All his other shops are run by other partners also.
> 
> And no going back on the job if I leave, lol.


what i mean is before you let go your safe work, if you invested to make some shops and those investment gave you return money (steadily)

i think it is ok to leave. if me i still prefer to have back up plan (safety net) which is now your current job.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Schneider (Jan 1, 2022)

wibisana said:


> i have a place, my parents gave us but my wife doesnt want to sleep there, idk, she said she afraid of ghost and stuff


i once contemplated buying a suicide/haunted house if it came with full ac, cutting edge fridge and hd widescreen tv    

i mean, just call a priest, pastor, kiai and monk to exorcise the place and we'd still save a lot of money from buying the cursed house


Shanks said:


> There are a small risk that it might not work out, but if it does I'll get about 3xtimes my current salary after a year.


Said it yourself good sir. Plus no financial pressure, i'd take it no brainer. Then again i'm an entrepeneurial at heart, if stability is a big thing for you then professional career path would be the better choice.

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 2


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## Djomla (Jan 1, 2022)

Nike.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## wibisana (Jan 1, 2022)

Schneider said:


> i once contemplated buying a suicide/haunted house if it came with full ac, cutting edge fridge and hd widescreen tv
> 
> i mean, just call a priest, pastor, kiai and monk to exorcise the place and we'd still save a lot of money from buying the cursed house


it wasnt really haunted. i mean i slept there for 5years uni study. it is my dad's house, built beside his parent (my grand parent) 

in 5 yrs I only have 2 haunting experiences, 2 night in a row, both12.15 midnight, after watching movie at TV, 

1st night i hear baby crying from attic/eternit/roof. i thought it was my neighbor's baby. i ignore it but turn of tv and sleep.

2nd night i hear women laughing (ih ih ih) you know wewe,kunti and stuff lol
i went panic and pretend didnt hear it, and hide behid by sheet and close my eyes to sleep


my cousin got it worse, she often sees thing there, she saw black huge figure (gendruwo) in one of the room, she saw and walk passed thru wewe/kunti too lol.

my wife hearing those story felt afraid, but personally until now i dont have problem sleeping there if i have to


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## Delta Shell (Jan 1, 2022)

With 15 years experience in your current industry its somewhat of a safety net.

Say the business doesn't work out you might not be able to go back into the exact job you left but that industry experience should make you a valuable hire for other companies regardless.

I have a similar amount of industry experience. Took a break this year to go self employed with a couple of projects and have had some success (not massive though). The industry I left have actually been knocking on my door with offers way above and beyond my salary previously. So I reckon you'd be OK regardless.

Just um I guess have a few months of living costs under your belt in case all the tobacco shops collapse overnight or something crazy. (From what I remember you have rental income from multiple properties too so that would probably offset some of your risk if you don't have kids etc).

Reactions: Like 1


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## Karasu (Jan 1, 2022)

I guess it's all about what you're interested in. If you like the product and want to be in that kind of a business then go for it, But IMO don't do it just because it's another job or it has the possibility of more income. If you wind up hating it then it's just going to suck regardless of the income.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3


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## Delta Shell (Jan 1, 2022)

Karasu said:


> I guess it's all about what you're interested in. If you like the product and want to be in that kind of a business then go for it, But IMO don't do it just because it's another job or it has the possibility of more income. If you wind up hating it then it's just going to suck regardless of the income.


Very good point

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Jim (Jan 1, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Curious on what would you do in this situation?


I wouldn't support a tobacco business unless it was life or death.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Funny 2


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## Shanks (Jan 1, 2022)

Karasu said:


> I guess it's all about what you're interested in. If you like the product and want to be in that kind of a business then go for it, But IMO don't do it just because it's another job or it has the possibility of more income. If you wind up hating it then it's just going to suck regardless of the income.


What interest.. bruh $50k net profit per month!!

Lmao, who actually want to go into the tobacco business that's kills people slowly anyway


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## Mider T (Jan 1, 2022)

@Hand Banana is doing this.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## ЯƎWO⅃ᖷ (Jan 1, 2022)

it depends: how well do you get along with your brother?

if you have a great relationship and are likeminded then it's a no brainer. who knows? you might even get into selling cannabis along with tobacco (if legal).


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## Magic (Jan 1, 2022)

Mider T said:


> @Hand Banana is doing this.


What business is he starting? Or is this a inside joke.


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## Shanks (Jan 1, 2022)

Thanks for the respond guys. I think some of my biggest hesitations are that I only work about 20hrs a week (less sometimes) working from home, have tones of time for the kids, go in NF and want to take a few vacations after COVID is better. 

I also have another project happening. Looking to knock down my other property and rebuild it with 2 duplex and sell.

Will probably do it eventually... Only question is when. I wish my job can make me redundant - 6 months salary bruh


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## Delta Shell (Jan 1, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Thanks for the respond guys. I think some of my biggest hesitations are that I only work about 20hrs a week (less sometimes) working from home, have tones of time for the kids, go in NF and want to take a few vacations after COVID is better.
> 
> I also have another project happening. Looking to knock down my other property and rebuild it with 2 duplex and sell.
> 
> Will probably do it eventually... Only question is when. I wish my job can make me redundant - 6 months salary bruh


I wouldn't give up that quality of life lol

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3


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## savior2005 (Jan 1, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Thanks for the respond guys. I think some of my biggest hesitations are that I only work about 20hrs a week (less sometimes) working from home, have tones of time for the kids, go in NF and want to take a few vacations after COVID is better.
> 
> I also have another project happening. Looking to knock down my other property and rebuild it with 2 duplex and sell.
> 
> Will probably do it eventually... Only question is when. I wish my job can make me redundant - 6 months salary bruh


What do you exactly do now? If you are ok with the money now, maybe you should stick with it. Because it really sounds like you have a great life. You're not working too much and you are spending time with your children. And you have other projects going on.

When you start a business you get a lot more busy, and you lose the most precious commodity, which is free time. I know many business owners who end up not having time for their children, and it really strains the relationship. I'm not saying that will happen to you, I just want to point out that you likely will lose a lot of that free time that you seem to value (it's something we all should value during our limited time on Earth, since each day could very well be our last)

Reactions: Agree 3 | Friendly 1


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## Shanks (Jan 2, 2022)

savior2005 said:


> What do you exactly do now?


Office junkie that WFH due to COVID  


savior2005 said:


> If you are ok with the money now, maybe you should stick with it. Because it really sounds like you have a great life. You're not working too much and you are spending time with your children. And you have other projects going on.


Yeah, that at least one good thing about 2020 and 2021  

Sound good, but they all driving me Batshit crazy  


savior2005 said:


> When you start a business you get a lot more busy, and you lose the most precious commodity, which is free time. I know many business owners who end up not having time for their children, and it really strains the relationship. I'm not saying that will happen to you, I just want to point out that you likely will lose a lot of that free time that you seem to value (it's something we all should value during our limited time on Earth, since each day could very well be our last)


Yeah, that's good advice

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## A Optimistic (Jan 10, 2022)

If I was in your shoes, I would keep your current job. You make good money at your current job, have been there for years so probably have a close relationship and a lot of respect from your coworkers. And you also have plenty of extra time to spend with your family, going on vacations, and pursing your hobbies. While being able to make 3x your current salary does sound tempting, I don't think it's worth losing all the other perks you have at your current job.

So yeah, I'd keep the current job.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Jim (Jan 11, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Lmao, who actually want to go into the tobacco business that's kills people slowly anyway


people who are desperate.


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## Subarashii (Jan 11, 2022)

A tobacco shop? Are you in the US? 
if it were weed, I’d say go for it lol

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Delta Shell (Jan 11, 2022)

Subarashii said:


> A tobacco shop? Are you in the US?
> if it were weed, I’d say go for it lol


He's an Auuuuusssie

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Subarashii (Jan 11, 2022)

Delta Shell said:


> He's an Auuuuusssie


Oh yeah

and tobacco is still big there? Is this place diversified @Shanks


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## Shanks (Jan 11, 2022)

Subarashii said:


> Oh yeah
> 
> and tobacco is still big there? Is this place diversified @Shanks


Huh? You mean multicultural? Yes.


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## Subarashii (Jan 11, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Huh? You mean multicultural? Yes.


No like it's not just cigarettes, you sell vape stuff and accessories like that


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## Shanks (Jan 11, 2022)

Subarashii said:


> No like it's not just cigarettes, you sell vape stuff and accessories like that


Vape yes, but don't think too many other things in a Tobacco shop.


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## Raiden (Jan 11, 2022)

With the amount of time you've put into your job, I think it's a good idea to find a manager to run it.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Canute87 (Jan 11, 2022)

It really all depends on how much time you are giving to the company you work and if you think you can do the same time for a lot more money.

So if a company takes up your time 7 days a week might as well do you own thing. if you only have to work for 7-8 hours a day and not have to work on weekends an you get a decent wage then that's all good.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Canute87 (Jan 11, 2022)

@Shanks 
Also one other thing.  If you make enough money to save investments aren't out of your reach.  

Look on the guys who invested in bitcoin early on and look at them now.


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## Shanks (Jan 11, 2022)

Canute87 said:


> @Shanks
> Also one other thing.  If you make enough money to save investments aren't out of your reach.
> 
> Look on the guys who invested in bitcoin early on and look at them now.


Yeah, my friends have already sent me a tone of investment books to read. Too much effort to learn, lol. I'll get into it someday.

I'm doing property investment right now, which is good enough.


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## Canute87 (Jan 11, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Yeah, my friends have already sent me a tone of investment books to read. Too much effort to learn, lol. I'll get into it someday.
> 
> I'm doing property investment right now, which is good enough.


If you're doing it as something to get rich in the fastest time it does take some effort.

But if you play the long game it usually works out.


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## Shanks (Jan 11, 2022)

Canute87 said:


> If you're doing it as something to get rich in the fastest time it does take some effort.
> 
> But if you play the long game it usually works out.


Yeah, I got a fair bit of retirement fund in there gaining about 6% a year right now.


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## Canute87 (Jan 11, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Yeah, I got a fair bit of retirement fund in there gaining about 6% a year right now.



Nice. . 

Everybody just wants to get rich in the quickest way possible when there is a road map of what works most of the time.

You study hard , educate yourself, live below your means,  save your money, invest, live.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Vagrant Tom (Jan 19, 2022)

Canute87 said:


> Nice. .
> 
> Everybody just wants to get rich in the quickest way possible when there is a road map of what works most of the time.
> 
> You study hard , educate yourself, live below your means,  save your money, invest, live.



Agreed. To be honest, once you get to a certain amount of wealth, I think the benefit of having more decreases. I certainly wouldn't complain about having a larger salary but I'm happy with mine and don't see becoming rich changing my life all that much.

Reactions: Like 1


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## dergeist (Jan 19, 2022)

Shanks said:


> So my brother owns a few Tobacco shops each netting $80k to $100k per month.
> 
> I am thinking of partnering with him to open another shop 50/50 ownership, but I will need do most of the work and get a small salary, while he advise as a shareholder.
> 
> ...



Depends on regulations and how they may hamper your future growth. If they're okay, I would dive right in.

Maybe, have a desk in a backroom where you do your current job and can keep an eye on the shop. That will give you a feeling for things. If that's not possible then a career break to test the water.

Reactions: Like 1


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## wibisana (Jan 23, 2022)

@Shanks
@Schneider

I have this idea/dream that looks pretty promising/but totally unreachable right now, lol
in Indonesia/java traditional attire rental is common, but it is pretty expensive and only for special occasion such as pre-wedding picture, graduations, wedding etc,

i want to make those rental more accessible, by having a place in such tourist trap and renting those costume to be wore and take selfie in.
what i want is accessible, so they dont have to walk far from the object they want to take picture in/with
it have to be easy to wear, RN those attire is hard to wear, you need knowledge/skills to put on right.
have to be cheap enough so people want to rent it

i already know few problem that will i face.
accessible means i need money to rent place near those tourist places. i guess i can start low, by maybe use car, akin to food truck and go  to cheap tourist trap like beach, where i rent the costume using my truck, have modify it so i can have changing room etc. still kinda hard to start lol, also when/if i get a bit of success people will stole my idea right away, and closing my chance to go big later.
there are ways to make those costume easier to wear like putting zipper and other modification.

my mom is traditional wedding make up artist, so she already do this kinda stuff but limited to renting for wedding or prewed or graduation ceremony, this idea to expand to new market,definitely one of my dream

tho prolly there are people/business that already start this but not really  booming/well known  yet

Reactions: Like 1


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## wibisana (Jan 23, 2022)

in the video, i think the rental starts at 200 baht = $6, imo still to expensive for students/uni students
what i am envisioned is something like $3.5 or $3. idk if that is possible since i have to consider the rent/car/salary and the laundry XD

dank starting business isnt easy


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## Schneider (Jan 23, 2022)

wibisana said:


> @Shanks
> @Schneider
> 
> I have this idea/dream that looks pretty promising/but totally unreachable right now, lol
> ...


This is a good idea and it should be applicable in keraton/candi (old heritage) places. 

It reminds me of the time i visited gyeobokgung palace in seoul. It is a big tourist trap and the local regulation dictates to wear hanbok (trad. korean attire) to get inside. It would be massive help if local govt employ this also. Like if you wanna do it on the beach, local govt could employ a traditional dresscode requirement, but tbh i dont think its a good idea cuz of our climate.

But i do wonder about the make up. Women's wedding/prewed/party preps can take hours, i doubt casual tourist would wanna wait that long. So that's your cue; how to achieve the look in no more than 5 to 10 mins, that's your trade and best to keep secret 

Yes, there are the common issues of doing service trade in here, but do remember
1. Competition doesn't necessarily mean a bad thing. In fact it can help startup the market (5 people wearing the trad. suits? Weirdos. 50 people tho? It's a scene). When the markets big enough thats when you start thinking about brand competitions. 
2. In our climate you're gonna need a cool indoor room for make up and dressing. Its going to be trouble doing make up on a sweaty face, unless you find a workaround somehow (again, your trade secret).
3. My mom in law works in garment/clothing trade. The main things she pay attentions to are feel (comfortability), color, and durabilitt. Juggle these 3 with the cost, and always be the cutting edge when the markets established.

Theres more but thats it for now. Would be nice to talk this over a cup of hot bitter black coffee

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Schneider (Jan 23, 2022)

wibisana said:


> in the video, i think the rental starts at 200 baht = $6, imo still to expensive for students/uni students
> what i am envisioned is something like $3.5 or $3. idk if that is possible since i have to consider the rent/car/salary and the laundry XD
> 
> dank starting business isnt easy


If you want to minimize operational cost employ your family members for free, like me

That leaves your operational costs being logistics and maintenance. Starting up you'd obviously need the attires and the make ups.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Lettuce Eater (Jan 23, 2022)

Don't do business with your family is the best advice I can give you here. If you hate your current job or something than cool. But I personally wouldn't go for it.

Reactions: Disagree 1


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## wibisana (Jan 23, 2022)

Schneider said:


> This is a good idea and it should be applicable in keraton/candi (old heritage) places.
> 
> It reminds me of the time i visited gyeobokgung palace in seoul. It is a big tourist trap and the local regulation dictates to wear hanbok (trad. korean attire) to get inside. It would be massive help if local govt employ this also. Like if you wanna do it on the beach, local govt could employ a traditional dresscode requirement, but tbh i dont think its a good idea cuz of our climate.
> 
> ...





Schneider said:


> If you want to minimize operational cost employ your family members for free, like me
> 
> That leaves your operational costs being logistics and maintenance. Starting up you'd obviously need the attires and the make ups.


starting at Candi/huge place would need huge capital lol which i dont have. but i get what you mean. one day i want to do it

Reactions: Like 1


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## Schneider (Jan 23, 2022)

Lettuce Eater said:


> Don't do business with your family is the best advice I can give you here. If you hate your current job or something than cool. But I personally wouldn't go for it.


As someone with first hand experience (of the shitty side) it is indeed not for the faint of heart

what put you off, if i may ask?


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## Shanks (Feb 4, 2022)

wibisana said:


> @Shanks
> @Schneider
> 
> I have this idea/dream that looks pretty promising/but totally unreachable right now, lol
> ...


That's a pretty cool idea. Why don't you find a tourist place and partner with them and get a small space in that place? Not easy, to hustle, but if you get into a theme park, you're set.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

Hey guys,

Last week I was talking to my manager and there might be a chance that our head company is selling my company soon. If that happens there's probably 50% chance of redundancy. I'll get 6 months pay if that happens.

Also spoken to my brother today about the Tobacco shop and we had a very honest talk. The Tobacco shop is serious investment; likely have to refinance my house to get the fund also:
- 6 days a week work
- no sick leave, annual leave, super, no benifits... Lol. Have to go to work evenil if I'm sick. No worker for the first year.
- expect at least 2 years before we get high profit
- first two years, all profit need to be reinvested into the stock

I'm not really sure tbh... But if I do get redundancy later, there is 80% chance I will start the shop.

Thoughts?


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

yeah if you get fired and get those severage pay anyway it is not wrong to start doing the business. I am pretty doubtful about 2 years wait so you have nice profit. idk. it just seems weird for me. like it doesnt really work like that overhere. but if you made up your mind, it is prolly good opportunity to start.


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

wibisana said:


> yeah if you get fired and get those severage pay anyway it is not wrong to start doing the business. I am pretty doubtful about 2 years wait so you have nice profit. idk. it just seems weird for me. like it doesnt really work like that overhere. but if you made up your mind, it is prolly good opportunity to start.


Need to grow the customers.. while paying my salary, after a year we might get some profit, but the profit need to be reinvested in the business to buy more stock.

It could be faster, but they're been realistic. They have 5 shops already.

Then there are other risks like robbery, COViD, etc.


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## Vagrant Tom (Feb 6, 2022)

If the business fails, then what? No savings, no job and stuck with the mortgage. You have two or three kids? With the burden of your family I think the risk is too high. Gamble with your family, work to death for several years and at the end of it, what do you have?

90% of businesses fail in their first year is the commonly quoted stat. Not sure that's still true though. 

Anyway I think it's a bad idea.


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

Vagrant Tom said:


> If the business fails, then what? No savings, no job and stuck with the mortgage. You have two or three kids? With the burden of your family I think the risk is too high. Gamble with your family, work to death for several years and at the end of it, what do you have?
> 
> 90% of businesses fail in their first year is the commonly quoted stat. Not sure that's still true though.
> 
> Anyway I think it's a bad idea.


really depend how much percentage he spend his capital on.

let say he has 100k life saving and most will go to tax, bribe/license, renting warehouse/store etc and only small amount goes to merchandise 
i agree that it is very risky

but if he spend his initial capital mainly on merc(Cigs) even if it is not working out, he can always resell his merc to other with discount price and lose only small percentage of his saving


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

unless he got robbed or the govt consficated his good. that would be problematic.... but still i think it is quite save investment if he know what he is doing

also worth to mention floods that can easily destroy all his stocks.


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

Vagrant Tom said:


> If the business fails, then what? No savings, no job and stuck with the mortgage. You have two or three kids? With the burden of your family I think the risk is too high. Gamble with your family, work to death for several years and at the end of it, what do you have?
> 
> 90% of businesses fail in their first year is the commonly quoted stat. Not sure that's still true though.
> 
> Anyway I think it's a bad idea.





wibisana said:


> really depend how much percentage he spend his capital on.
> 
> let say he has 100k life saving and most will go to tax, bribe/license, renting warehouse/store etc and only small amount goes to merchandise
> i agree that it is very risky
> ...


$700k innitial investment. 95% will be on stock. So 50% of the business will be $350k.

If the business fail, get another job or another business. That's just life right? like @Delta Shell said before 15 years experience is a safety shell. Pretty confident I can get a contracting role within 2 weeks. Full time perfect job with right pay might take abit of time.

2 kids.

As for the extra work... Actually right now due to COViD,.I'm working less. If I have to go back to the office later or find another job, I'll have to work as much or a little less.

For now, just planning a contingency plan if the redundancy is happening. 

Thinking of working at my brother's shop for 2 days a week for now to get the experience and a feel for it, before going all out.


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

wibisana said:


> unless he got robbed or the govt consficated his good. that would be problematic.... but still i think it is quite save investment if he know what he is doing
> 
> also worth to mention floods that can easily destroy all his stocks.


Yeah, big change is hard. Might not work for everyone, but if we want to be more in life, we need to keep moving forward.


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

damn with that amount of money, here
if i were you, i would invest on safer investment like hunting newly built house in gated housing area, it could gave me 20 houses lol. and if i wait 3-4 years mostlikely the price would went up by 50-100% if i select the place wisely, like somewhere close to big road and stuff.

and idk how big is your store will be lol. 700k here could be a capital to start medium-big sized store or building a store-building from scratch and filling it with stuff to sell. i thought you are living in Vietnam bro. i dont know if you need that much money to start business.

@Schneider  prolly can tell you more accuratelly, what can you made overe here with $700k


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

Nervous as fuck though. Getting anxiety just thinking about it. Probably need to do meditation or something to reduce stress.


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## Vagrant Tom (Feb 6, 2022)

Feels like you should have asked about this rather than about traveling in my thread.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

wibisana said:


> damn with that amount of money, here
> if i were you, i would invest on safer investment like hunting newly built house in gated housing area, it could gave me 20 houses lol. and if i wait 3-4 years mostlikely the price would went up by 50-100% if i select the place wisely, like somewhere close to big road and stuff.
> 
> and idk how big is your store will be lol. 700k here could be a capital to start medium-big sized store or building a store-building from scratch and filling it with stuff to sell. i thought you are living in Vietnam bro. i dont know if you need that much money to start business.
> ...


Hehe, the wife just bought a piece of land in Indonesia btw. Only $3.5k though, but if things goes well, it can increase 10 folds in a few years.

As for the business, some of my brothers current shop makes $80k gross profit per month. Big investment, big potentially gain.

Yeah, you're right with the stock though. If it doesn't work out, I can just sell the stock to my bro's shop or else where.


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Hehe, the wife just bought a piece of land in Indonesia btw. Only $3.5k though, but if things goes well, it can increase 10 folds in a few years.
> 
> As for the business, some of my brothers current shop makes $80k gross profit per month. Big investment, big potentially gain.
> 
> Yeah, you're right with the stock though. If it doesn't work out, I can just sell the stock to my bro's shop or else where.


yes land can go up 10folds but it is kinda hard these days... because the market boom already passed.
if she bought it at 2008 and sell it at 2018 i would say she could have got 5-20folds depend on where she got that.

here forward, she is lucky if she can sell it on 50-100% profit in 3yrs
it really depend on development on the area, near business/campus/uni etc

mom bought small patch of land like $8 /m² back 12-15 yrs ago, now it can sell $80-140 /m² (almost 20folds)
because it near big campuses, people need housing for business and students


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

wibisana said:


> yes land can go up 10folds but it is kinda hard these days... because the market boom already passed.
> if she bought it at 2008 and sell it at 2018 i would say she could have got 5-20folds depend on where she got that.
> 
> here forward, she is lucky if she can sell it on 50-100% profit in 3yrs
> ...


Depends where you buy it. I believe it's in a bush land area close to farm land that got rezoned recently. So if they start a community there later, it will grow alot. Lots of untapped opportunities in other islands in Indonesian.

The seller have no money and needed funds for their kids uni, therefore have to sell.


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Hehe, the wife just bought a piece of land in Indonesia btw. Only $3.5k though, but if things goes well, it can increase 10 folds in a few years.
> 
> As for the business, some of my brothers current shop makes $80k gross profit per month. Big investment, big potentially gain.
> 
> Yeah, you're right with the stock though. If it doesn't work out, I can just sell the stock to my bro's shop or else where.


if i have to be honest. imo 700k is just too big of investment and without seeing the detail on how your/your bro business model, the claim of 80k profit /mo after 2 yrs is also too good to be true (i mean if it is pure after tax profit, not total sales, like there is never a business can give you 10% profit/mo)..
sounds like a scam.


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

wibisana said:


> if i have to be honest. imo 700k is just too big of investment and without seeing the detail on how your/your bro business model, the claim of 80k profit /mo after 2 yrs is also too good to be true (i mean if it is pure after tax profit, not total sales, like there is never a business can give you 10% profit/mo)..
> sounds like a scam.


I can always work as his business for two days a week first and see, lol.

Na, all good. He lend me a tone of money to buy my properties.. being 10 years and he didn't even ask for it back and did not charge any interest. 

And yes, $80k net. Some people knows how to work it out the right process to move forward in life.


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Depends where you buy it. I believe it's in a bush land area close to farm land that got rezoned recently. So if they start a community there later, it will grow alot. Lots of untapped opportunities in other islands in Indonesian.
> 
> The seller have no money and needed funds for their kids uni, therefore have to sell.


yeah
if she bought it at reasonable price
$8-35 or less /m2 i think it still can grow

but if she bought it overpriced already like $80-150/m2

i dont think that area can reach higher than $150-200/m2 even with rapid development

highest price in indonesia is about $1500/m2 it is at Jakarta very near to city center/and major roadway.

premium land sold at least $500 this land in near mainroad and still area surrounding Jakarta, or other city in middle of city

average city land (aside jakarta) land could go as high as $200-500 /m2 then again it have to be really near city center

outskrits of normal city imo/afaik only grow as much as $150-300/m2. which i assume your wife bought.


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

Shanks said:


> I can always work as his business for two days a week first and see, lol.
> 
> Na, all good. He lend me a tone of money to buy my properties.. being 10 years and he didn't even ask for it back and did not charge any interest.
> 
> And yes, $80k net. Some people knows how to work it out the right process to move forward in life.


not saying your brother is scamming you lol, i know he wont. im just saying if i got business proposal like that with huge capital and profit promise that much, i would be suspicious AF.

then maybe different country offer different business opportunities. it is still possible, it just i dont think it is possible here in Indonesia


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## Schneider (Feb 6, 2022)

wibisana said:


> @Schneider  prolly can tell you more accuratelly, what can you made overe here with $700k


That's 10 billion+ man 

You can buy govt issued bonds or smaller banks with higher interest rates, just half that amount and it'll net you around 20 mil a month doing _nothing._ Which i'm sure, if your not into flexing culture or bite more than you can chew, would be enough for indonesian average living standards (cept _maybe_ jakarta).

My options then for the other:

Low risk/low (long-term) return
1. Indomaret/alfamart (indonesian circle K)
2. More bonds.
3. Do trading
4. Set up a small scale production or other business
5. Buy/flip property, rent it out.
6. Do a joint venture for a bigger business.

High risk/no high return
1. Open shrimp farm
2. Play sunton/forex robots ()
3. Bitcoins ()
4. Peer2peer Lending

Reactions: Agree 1


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

Schneider said:


> Indomaret/alfamart (indonesian circle K


correct me if i am wrong, but to run those sized of store (in video) wont need 5-10% of $700k (35-70k) depend building from scratch or already have the building.
(license, rent, initial cost for decor, salary maybe 6-12 month)

and would give you $1400/month (to spend, not to reinvest) right?

which is reasonable calculation
your investment will pay off in 3-5 yrs

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Vagrant Tom (Feb 6, 2022)

Indonesian gov bonds low risk? Lol, that's very debatable!


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

This is why I am considering one day to sell all my shit, built a house in Indonesia and live. Get 3 house keepers and live in the beach side. Enjoy retirement 

House prices here is fucked. $1M is an average place. In a half decent location we are talking $2.5M average


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## Schneider (Feb 6, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Last week I was talking to my manager and there might be a chance that our head company is selling my company soon. If that happens there's probably 50% chance of redundancy. I'll get 6 months pay if that happens.
> 
> ...


Man (potentially) there goes the safety net down the shitter

Well that is pretty much the name of the game bruv. You aint being employed anymore, you are the business and your bro expects you to pour your heart and soul into it. The numbers for the investment isn't exactly peanuts, moreover you're putting your house to school. REALLY make sure you know every single detail about the business model and be generous with what ifs and worst case scenario questions.

Hope everything works out whatever choice you pick, and i'm sure it will.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

Schneider said:


> Man (potentially) there goes the safety net down the shitter
> 
> Well that is pretty much the name of the game bruv. You aint being employed anymore, you are the business and your bro expects you to pour your heart and soul into it. The numbers for the investment isn't exactly peanuts, moreover you're putting your house to school. REALLY make sure you know every single detail about the business model and be generous with what ifs and worst case scenario questions.
> 
> Hope everything works out whatever choice you pick, and i'm sure it will.


That bro! Appreciate it. 

The potentially redundancy is causing dilemmas.

Option 1 - go with the business after I loose the job. Gotta still put in the work now and maybe work their 2 days a week to learn all they ins and outs for 6 months.

Option 2 - invest in another property and shares. Tones of work and research also.. either way busily as fuck...

No more lazy 5 hrs a day in NF


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## Schneider (Feb 6, 2022)

Vagrant Tom said:


> Indonesian gov bonds low risk? Lol, that's very debatable!


I'd argue they're as safe as state-owned or big public banks, among the best choices here.

What may be not safe though, are state-owned or state-affliated companies (locally referred to as "BUMN"), which may or may not be slick money laundering machines for politicians.


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## Schneider (Feb 6, 2022)

Shanks said:


> This is why I am considering one day to sell all my shit, built a house in Indonesia and live. Get 3 house keepers and live in the beach side. Enjoy retirement
> 
> House prices here is fucked. $1M is an average place. In a half decent location we are talking $2.5M average


Insane prices man. But perhaps thats the first world cuntry for yall.

Yeh its deffo doable, especially if you don't mind rural areas, for me tho i prefer uphills over beachsides for the cool weather. taxes here can be a bitch though.


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

Schneider said:


> Insane prices man. But perhaps thats the first world cuntry for yall.
> 
> Yeh its deffo doable, especially if you don't mind rural areas, for me tho i prefer uphills over beachsides for the cool weather. taxes here can be a bitch though.


Wife's home town and her family are mostly in the region where Maumere is (florist region if I remember correctly). When I was there a couple years ago, they dont even have taxi yet, lol. But food is pretty cheap, very tropical and have nice beaches. 

She said her nieces place (massive place) cost about $140k to buy the land and build the house.


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## Vagrant Tom (Feb 6, 2022)

Schneider said:


> I'd argue they're as safe as state-owned or big public banks, among the best choices here.
> 
> What may be not safe though, are state-owned or state-affliated companies (locally referred to as "BUMN"), which may or may not be slick money laundering machines for politicians.



Indonesia is considered an emerging market country and only have an investment grade BBB credit rating compared to their AA and AAA rated first world country peers. Whilst not the riskiest country out there right now, it's far from a safe one. Plenty of governments default on their debt like Argentina (8 time iirc), most of Africa, Greece etc etc. And we'll see what happens in Turkey! Yields there are through the roof and I'd hate to have held any of their bonds.


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

wibisana said:


> damn with that amount of money, here
> if i were you, i would invest on safer investment like hunting newly built house in gated housing area, it could gave me 20 houses lol. and if i wait 3-4 years mostlikely the price would went up by 50-100% if i select the place wisely, like somewhere close to big road and stuff.
> 
> and idk how big is your store will be lol. 700k here could be a capital to start medium-big sized store or building a store-building from scratch and filling it with stuff to sell. i thought you are living in Vietnam bro. i dont know if you need that much money to start business.
> ...


Btw, which locations are you thinking about it the newly built house investment? Just curious.


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## Schneider (Feb 6, 2022)

Vagrant Tom said:


> Indonesia is considered an emerging market country and only have an investment grade BBB credit rating compared to their AA and AAA rated first world country peers. Whilst not the riskiest country out there right now, it's far from a safe one. Plenty of governments default on their debt like Argentina (8 time iirc), most of Africa, Greece etc etc. And we'll see what happens in Turkey! Yields there are through the roof and I'd hate to have held any of their bonds.


Yeah we are still far from first world country level but that's beside my point.

I'm talking about our options here if we want to spin our money somewhere, so far govt bonds are among the safest here that will give you a decent return. Arguably as safe as our biggest banks but with better rates. We don't have AA or AAA credit ratings, the big banks and the bonds here are our best bet (unregulated chinese p2p lendings being the worst), if they end up defaulting then it might as well be the end of indonesian economy (and perhaps as a country) as we know it.

So yeah as a first world country-er looking in i get your pov, i believe we provide better returns than most developed countries but as common sense dictates, it comes with greater risks. Its always your choice to opt for safer investments, though for the record i doubt the average indos here will even bat an eye at AAA grade sub-1% returns either.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Vagrant Tom (Feb 6, 2022)

Personally, I wouldn't put my money into gov bonds of either country. At least not until I'm nearing retirement. I'd put it into a boring but effective passive world or US stock index tracker.

Anyway, on topic, I agree with others that you need to know the business inside out. And watch out for any regulation given the products you are selling. A few years down the line a gov regulation on tobacco and vape could be a very expensive problem. As I said, I could invoke the supernatural and let you know if this venture will be a success if you but ask.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Schneider (Feb 6, 2022)

Shanks said:


> That bro! Appreciate it.
> 
> The potentially redundancy is causing dilemmas.
> 
> ...


Either way its busting ass time bruv. Yeah gotta have to cut back on the #ddjshow for the much needed cash.

Who knows perhaps by the time you make it our komrade @DemonDragonJ  may finally get his virginity taken for a feel-good double whammy as you return on nf

Reactions: Funny 1


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Btw, which locations are you thinking about it the newly built house investment? Just curious.


in Jakarta's satelite city (bogor, bekasi, tangerang) typically they (big corporation developer) sell new house starts at $40k-70k. 

while in other city it would cost me around $20-30k.
(house with land area of 10x10m2, and building area 6x10m2... or maybe 2 stories one)

the way housing investment work is usually like this. when new developer open a new land, build houses, they will sell at those price i mentioned above. then after few years the price will go up as the demand grow


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## wibisana (Feb 6, 2022)

tho these days realistically you can only hope 30-50% up in 3yrs

i was working for big developer (Adhi Karya) back then.. met many housing marketing person who tell me stuff. 

they said back in early 2010s and late 2000s. house price can doubled in just 2-3 yrs


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## savior2005 (Feb 6, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Last week I was talking to my manager and there might be a chance that our head company is selling my company soon. If that happens there's probably 50% chance of redundancy. I'll get 6 months pay if that happens.
> 
> ...


It depends on what you value. 

On one hand, you seem like a great employee who can find another job with relative ease. You could probably get a nice pay bump. You'll have all those benefits that you don't really get running the Tobacco shop.

On the other hand, you *could *make a lot more money running the business. But you will be putting in a lot of time. Don't be surprised if you actually end up working 7 days a week. Even if the store is closed one day a week, there is work that needs to be done related to store maintenance/inventory/orders. This is stuff you may not get to when the store is busy.

It's basically a scenario of stability vs highrisk highreward.  If you were single I would have told you to go after the high risk high reward scenario but you have a family and children, so it's tougher to endorse that path.

But From reading your other posts, worst case scenario you can always sell your share to your brother's shop etc. 

Me personally, if I have children I want to be there for them and spend time with them. That's something I would never be able to get back. I think most children would rather have a more attentive father than a father who's always busy. Similar to you I'm also at a crossroads because I'm not sure if I should continue up the corporate ladder, which means a lot more work but also more money, or if I should stay where I am at and make decent money and have good worklife balance. I'm leaning towards moving up the ladder since I don't have children right now.

Reactions: Like 1 | Friendly 1


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

Thanks for all your feedback guys. There's a few things I need to be honest with myself and others and then start moving forward.

1) I talk about my kids alot, be it here or else where in the forum. The truth is, while I want to priortise them, I still have alot of time for other hobbies like going on NF and couple years ago, I played mobile games about 3 - 5hrs a day. I need to reduce these and prioritise my time on more important things.

2) Whether work or business, honestly, I think it will be all the same eventually. Whether for myself or most of us who choose to climb the corporate ladder. When COVID finishes, I don't think most of us will have the luxury of working from home have more spare time anymore. Difference is, at least work have annual leave, so we can still travel.

That said, I'm going to see how things are going with the work first, but  going to start shaping up regardless, starting with spending more time at work, learning how to invest in shares, keep an eye out of other investment properties. And in a few months, maybe find time to work in my bro's shop for a couple days to learn the feels.

Reactions: Like 1


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## savior2005 (Feb 6, 2022)

Shanks said:


> Thanks for all your feedback guys. There's a few things I need to be honest with myself and others and then start moving forward.
> 
> 1) I talk about my kids alot, be it here or else where in the forum. The truth is, while I want to priortise them, I still have alot of time for other hobbies like going on NF and couple years ago, I played mobile games about 3 - 5hrs a day. I need to reduce these and prioritise my time on more important things.
> 
> ...


You know what you can do? If possible you can have your children with you at the store. Especially if there's a room for them to stay in (I'm assuming they are young, like younger than 11). That way you can spend time with them if it's slow, and they can still see your face and know that you're there most of the time. The only issue would be security, but imo security is something no business should cheapen out on.

Or if the store is very close to your house, you can probably work from home and come and go as you please. You can probably assign someone to watch over the store when you're not there.

You're right that most of us will not have the luxury of WFH once Covid is over, but I'm starting to see employers who are offering 100% remote position. I myself just did a first round interview for one last week.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Shanks (Feb 6, 2022)

savior2005 said:


> You're right that most of us will not have the luxury of WFH once Covid is over, but I'm starting to see employers who are offering 100% remote position. I myself just did a first round interview for one last week.


Depends where you are in your career and what you want to accomplished. If you want massive career advancement, higher pay, etc ya got to put in the extra mile. During the peek of COVID executive managers and up in my company still head into the office despite having options to WFH.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Yami Munesanzun (Feb 7, 2022)

Schneider said:


> i once contemplated buying a suicide/haunted house if it came with full ac, cutting edge fridge and hd widescreen tv
> 
> i mean, just call a priest, pastor, kiai and monk to exorcise the place and we'd still save a lot of money from buying the cursed house


Have you considered sexing the ghost?


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## Schneider (Feb 7, 2022)

supposedly, time is supposed to be the biggest advertised perk that comes with running your own business as you are your own boss. turns out its not always the case. truthfully speaking, the work is always there, just that no one is there telling you stuff and no 9 to 5s, while at first appearing as hours your obligated to in this world it actually becomes the boundary for when work and duties can reach out to you. So yea, i answer customer calls and texts at 11 pm, provided i have the required infos.


savior2005 said:


> but I'm starting to see employers who are offering 100% remote position


without question. i feel that remote effeciencies could be an aspect that'll radically change industries post covid.


Yami Munesanzun said:


> Have you considered sexing the ghost?


naturally, as a normal man (@Jim ) "is the ghost hot?" is the very first question that comes up on haunting sites. imagine this ghost for instance

ooh drag me to afterlife baby

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Shanks (Mar 7, 2022)

Just want to give you guys a little update,

Formal confirmation of redundancy and dates happened today, though I already knew about it 2 weeks ago. It doesn't make it any less depressing to have to tell the news to everyone in my team... 

I have already started interviewing for other roles and will apply more jobs tomorrow.

My wife and I have decided that we want to have a third child, therefore, I will continue to work in corporate for the next year or so. This will give us some time to take a holiday later and then support my family more closer to the birth of my 3rd child.

After that, I will go all guns blazing with the business. You do not get paid THAT MUCH working and I believe that I'm already close to a glass ceiling, giving any additional income will incur about 50% more tax.

I want to make sure I have $5M by retirement and ensure that I can help paid off my kids uni fees in full and help them with a deposit for a house as soon they started working.

Thanks for all of your responses earlier.

Cheers,

Shanks

Reactions: Like 2 | Friendly 2


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