# Touhou-universe VS JJBA



## Red (Feb 14, 2009)

The shrine maidens invade the JJBA universe seeking blood.

Scenario 1. Straight on battle, No reality warpers, speed is equal. Both sides are at their peak.

Scenario 2. How do they stack up against each other?


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## Ham_Sup (Feb 14, 2009)

Touhou characters shoot danmaku at JJBA cast.  Sakuya stops time and chucks knives at Dio.  Dio rips off her head and crushes her with a steamroller.

To be honest, the only Touhou character I can think of that is broken is Yuyuko.  But assuming everyone's in character, she never uses her broken ability anyways.  Plus, all the girls get along and pretty much are friends with Reimu at the end aren't they?


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## Red (Feb 14, 2009)

I'd say the touhou cast is a good match up. The danmaku is just for show, the fluff states that a couple of them are hideously strong and the only reason they play the danmaku is so that they don't wreck shit up.

In character Yuyuko used her power I think once on Moku, but he's immortal so it didn't work. I'll just ban her seeing as that she could just kill everybody with the exception of GER.

It's not fair comparing Sakuya to Dio. She's a human being that can stop time, Dio is a monster who eats other monsters for brunch. But I'm pretty sure that there's someone in the Touhou cast would beat him easily enough. Hell I'm willing to wager the JJBA verse loses to a bunch of little girls.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Feb 14, 2009)

What are they going to do about Cream

Or Notorious BIG

Then there's C Moon with its three kilometer range of gravity manipulating fun


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## skiboydoggy (Feb 14, 2009)

That's that one endboss that controls nuclear reactions or something...


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## Fang (Feb 14, 2009)

Crimson Dragoon said:


> What are they going to do about Cream
> 
> Or Notorious BIG
> 
> Then there's C Moon with its three kilometer range of gravity manipulating fun



White Snake is way cooler than C-Moon.


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## Red (Feb 14, 2009)

Crimson Dragoon said:


> What are they going to do about Cream
> 
> Or Notorious BIG


I don't know about Cream, but Notorious BIG is the guy who's always faster than the opponent right? Komachi can manipulate distance to such an extent that BIG won't get near anyone. Ever. Imagine just taking one step would be like a million miles.



> Then there's C Moon with its three kilometer range of gravity manipulating fun


Udonge Reisen can control waves, all types of waves including gravity. She'd be able to nullify anything C-moon throws at her. She can also mind rape everyone on the JJBA side.



skiboydoggy said:


> That's that one endboss that controls nuclear reactions or something...


She creates a sun as the last spell. I haven't even passed stage 2


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## WaveDasher (Feb 15, 2009)

Does Touhou have an answer to Stairway to Heaven?


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## Red (Feb 15, 2009)

WaveDasher said:


> Does Touhou have an answer to Stairway to Heaven?


Apart from killing it out right, no not at all.


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## Lucifeller (Feb 15, 2009)

What about Gold Experience Requiem? Or Heavy Weather's nasty habit of turning people into animals?


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## Schneider (Feb 15, 2009)

Does the girls show resistance to transmutation? Or can they survive oxygen poisoning? Or are they durable enough to be electrocuted by static charged clouds or being hit by poison frogs?

However, Cream, Heaven's Door, Killer Queen, Whitesnake, The World, King Crimson, GER, SCR, Star Platinum, Cheap Trick and Stairway to Heaven gives JJBA a win, unless Touhou characters tank universe busting attack.



TWF said:


> White Snake is way cooler than C-Moon.



And we can finally agree on something.


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## Fenix (Feb 15, 2009)

Oh crap never thought I see it here

Going to pretend this thread doesn't exist and come back to OBD when it's buried on page 500


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## Red (Feb 15, 2009)

Schneider said:


> Does the girls show resistance to transmutation? Or can they survive oxygen poisoning? Or are they durable enough to be electrocuted by static charged clouds or being hit by poison frogs?
> 
> However, Cream, Heaven's Door, Killer Queen, Whitesnake, The World, King Crimson, *GER*, SCR, Star Platinum, Cheap Trick and *Stairway to Heaven* gives JJBA a win, unless Touhou characters tank universe busting attack.


Bold are banned since they're reality warpers (I put that in the OP). 

Oxygen poisoning? Set everything to flame and use it to make your fire attacks hit harder. Or control the amount of oxygen per square area using your density manipulation?

Poison frogs? Change then to sand or send them back to the owner.

Static electricity? Tank it.

And to almost any stand you name, there's a touhou would contend with it, hence this thread.



Fenix said:


> Oh crap never thought I see it here
> 
> Going to pretend this thread doesn't exist and come back to OBD when it's buried on page 500


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Grateful Dead, Heaven's Door, Rolling Stone, Green Day, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Metallica, Super Fly, Man in the Mirror, ect...


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## Red (Feb 15, 2009)

TWF said:


> Grateful Dead, Heaven's Door, Rolling Stone, Green Day, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Metallica, Super Fly, Man in the Mirror, ect...


What is this shit?


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Those are Stands.

Like Underworld which replays memories to trap its victims and make them kill themselves through their own memories and its range is as great as the city of Orlando. And their stuck replaying that memory as an event until they die.

Or Metallica which is invisible and kills you by iron-deficeny and then cuts your throat. Or a completely intangible Stand which moves in a form of electricty.

And you banned Gold Experience Requiem and Stairway to Heaven/Made in Heaven? That's okay, we still have Bohemian Rhapsody that can swap out their souls with fictional characters. Or Heaven's Door who can break the laws of casauality and its first order is too make others not attack it with soul and mind-manipulation.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Feb 15, 2009)

What about The Sun+Set?


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

I might be confusing Anubis with Set but didn't he make things faster?

Also Bast + Metallica would be a good team too like The Emperor and Hanged Man.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Feb 15, 2009)

Set is the one who can revert people to fetuses if they step on his shadow

Speedwagon destroys them with superior character


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## Crimson Dragoon (Feb 15, 2009)

And Hanged Man was one of the coolest Stands in Part 3 along with Death 13


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Yeah I loved Hanged Man's design and powers. Its really a damn shame that considering how centric he was to Polnareff's story that he didn't play a larger role in Part III.


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## Red (Feb 15, 2009)

TWF said:


> Those are Stands.


And here I thought you where listing your Ipod play list.



> Like Underworld which replays memories to trap its victims and make them kill themselves through their own memories and its range is as great as the city of Orlando. And their stuck replaying that memory as an event until they die.


We have a bunny that can dispel any such mind fuck.


> Or Metallica which is invisible and kills you by iron-deficeny and then cuts your throat.


We have a bunny that can control all electromagnetic spectrum and make the invisible visible.



> Or a completely intangible Stand which moves in a form of electricty.


We have a half ghost who can kill intangibles.



> That's okay, we still have Bohemian Rhapsody that can swap out their souls with fictional characters.


BR is a reality warper 
But you are right, his power is broken.



> Or Heaven's Door who can break the laws of casauality and its first order is too make others not attack it with soul and mind-manipulation.


We have a vampire that controls the laws of causality as well.

On the the other hand, we have a vampire who can destroy anything by crushing it's essence, an Oni that can shatter the heavens, a Raven who can make stars from nuclear fusion/fission. Even not counting the high tiers, mid-tiers like Marisa has a spell card that can pull apart planets.


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

C-Moon's gravity powers are more powerful than the Moon. Also there are many soul manipulators in JJBA from Part III and onwards.

Silver Chariot Requiem, Darby, ect...


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## Crimson Dragoon (Feb 15, 2009)

The confrontation with the Darby brothers were some of the highlights of Part 3 for me

Nothing like gambling with your SOUL


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Wheel of Fortune was awesome. I also liked The Lock in Part IV.


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## Red (Feb 15, 2009)

TWF said:


> C-Moon's gravity powers are more powerful than the Moon. Also there are many soul manipulators in JJBA from Part III and onwards.
> 
> Silver Chariot Requiem, Darby, ect...


Like I said there's a bunny who can fuck with the waves of gravity. 
The only person that can control souls from touhou is the chick I banned, since she'd pretty much kill anybody who isn't immortal right down to the soul.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Feb 15, 2009)

The Lock is when Echoes makes its first appearance, right?


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Crimson Dragoon said:


> The Lock is when Echoes makes its first appearance, right?



Yep. He's the guy who was lying to make Koichi feel guilty and places a chain around your heart till it makes you kill yourself.

Bad Company is a great band and Stand too.



Red said:


> Like I said there's a bunny who can fuck with the waves of gravity.
> The only person that can control souls from touhou is the chick I banned, since she'd pretty much kill anybody who isn't immortal right down to the soul.



Could be but Silver Chariot Requiem is already dead and was accelerating the evolution of life in minutes where it took the Earth billions of years to do the same with everything around it.

And Heaven's Door is a direct type of soul manipulation since he's basically writing over one's soul. Being a Telepath or Psyhic won't protect you from it.


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Rah rah rah rah rah Hanged Man.


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Wasn't J-Giel a rapist who liked taking down little girls?


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## Crimson Dragoon (Feb 15, 2009)

Yeah he was


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Oh man that silly J-Giel.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Feb 15, 2009)

What a wacky guy


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## Tash (Feb 15, 2009)

His stands design fucking owned though.


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Yeah, Death 13 was awesome too.

You get raped in your dreams.


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## Lucifeller (Feb 15, 2009)

Death 13 pretty much solos. While in the dreamworld, he can do whatever he wants with you, and the only way to destroy him is to BRING YOUR OWN STAND in said dreamworld, which is easier said than done.

Unfortunately, none of the Touhou girls have one, and their powers are worthless since they have to FALL ASLEEP to even meet Death 13. Which, needless to say, gets them pwnzluled.

Note Death 13 doesn't count as a reality warper (he's too limited, being unable to leave the dream world), but as an extradimensional Stand, like Cream. Just very, very broken.


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## Endless Mike (Feb 15, 2009)

Underworld is not a mindfuck, it causes the events to actually replay themselves (it might be counted as a reality warper though)

Does Silver Chariot Requiem count as a reality warper?


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Silver Chariot Requiem doesn't manipulate in reality.

Its a massive AoE soul fucker though and causes evolution to go into rapid fire.


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## Abigail (Feb 15, 2009)

I give this to JJBA for all the reasons stated above. JJBA just has WAY to many really broken stands.


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## Red (Feb 15, 2009)

TWF said:


> Could be but Silver Chariot Requiem is already dead and was accelerating the evolution of life in minutes where it took the Earth billions of years to do the same with everything around it.


 Kaguya Houraisan controls eternity and the power to stop change. She could nullify time acceleration:



			
				 Perfect Memento in a Strict Sense said:
			
		

> 永遠と須臾を操る能力を持つ。
> She possesses the ability to manipulate the eternal and the instantaneous.
> 
> 永遠とは歴史の無い世界の事で、未来永劫変化が訪れない世界である。
> ...






> And Heaven's Door is a direct type of soul manipulation since he's basically writing over one's soul. Being a Telepath or Psyhic won't protect you from it.


Oh 

But you haven't answered my previous queries. Komachi can create an infinite wide gap between the fighters distancing the touhou's from harm. Flandre can one shot all of them being crushing their essence in the palm of her hand. Marisa a normal human can rip apart planets with her spell card. Besides the high tier of JJBA I'm not sure any of them would be able to survive the pure destructive powers of having a sun opened up in front of you.



Endless Mike said:


> Underworld is not a mindfuck, it causes the events to actually replay themselves (it might be counted as a reality warper though)


Oh I assumed it made them relive their memories, not actually replaying them. I would guess it's a reality warper.


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## Endless Mike (Feb 15, 2009)

Red said:


> Kaguya Houraisan controls eternity and the power to stop change. She could nullify time acceleration:



Except that SCR switches everyone's souls and powers with the being nearest them, so she'll likely end up in the body of a chickadee or something while the chickadee is in her body and doesn't know how to use her powers



> But you haven't answered my previous queries. Komachi can create an infinite wide gap between the fighters distancing the touhou's from harm.



Doesn't matter if she gets blitzed before she can do it



> Flandre can one shot all of them being crushing their essence in the palm of her hand.



That's wonderfully quantifiable 



> Marisa a normal human can rip apart planets with her spell card.



And this takes how long?



> Besides the high tier of JJBA I'm not sure any of them would be able to survive the pure destructive powers of having a sun opened up in front of you.



Considering many of them are just spirits, like Cheap Trick, then you're fucked.



> Oh I assumed it made them relive their memories, not actually replaying them. I would guess it's a reality warper.



Replaying the memories connected to anything in the ground. Like if a plane crashed they're suddenly on the plane before it crashed. Maybe reality warping.


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

What does Silver Chariot Requiem's power have to do with time manipulation?


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## Sylar (Feb 15, 2009)

No one's mentioned Another One Bites The Dust yet?


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Or Ultimate Cars.


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## Red (Feb 15, 2009)

Endless Mike said:


> Except that SCR switches everyone's souls and powers with the being nearest them, so she'll likely end up in the body of a chickadee or something while the chickadee is in her body and doesn't know how to use her powers


 Her power "Prevents change" switching someone soul is changing their bodies no?



> Doesn't matter if she gets blitzed before she can do it


Speed equalized, I mentioned that in the OP.



> That's wonderfully quantifiable


To be more specific an example of her using her powers was when she broke apart a meteor in the atmosphere. It's also useful since it's long range.



> And this takes how long?


I don't know but it's not long since it doesn't need any prep.



> Considering many of them are just spirits, like Cheap Trick, then you're fucked.


 I mentioned Youmou can cut spirit. Specifically she can kill ten spirits in one swing.



			
				Game manual said:
			
		

> Konpaku's swords were designed primarily for use against ghosts and spiritual beings, but they still seem to work well against "pre-deads".



If youmu cuts a spirit or a stand they say dead.





TWF said:


> What does Silver Chariot Requiem's power have to do with time manipulation?


You said SCR was accelerating evolution where it would normally take millions of years....


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## Fang (Feb 15, 2009)

Yes, but its not speeding up or accelerating time like King Crimson or Stairway to Heaven. It has no direct temporal powers.

Also SCR's range is across the entire planet.


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## Red (Feb 15, 2009)

TWF said:


> Yes, but its not speeding up or accelerating time like King Crimson or Stairway to Heaven. It has no direct temporal powers.
> 
> Also SCR's range is across the entire planet.


Well that's nifty. Komachi is a death God that controls the river of the dead. The river of the dead is infinitely wide and infinitely deep. She can manipulate that distance (shortening it or making it longer). If she wanted she could make it so SCR's attack would be out of their range even thoug it's planetary in range.

Only real probably is soul fucks. How many stands fall into that category and what are their abilities?

And one thing about Youmu (The girl who can cut spirits) her own range of attack is infinite in range. Here have some game fluff:



			
				Game fluff said:
			
		

> Slash that borrows the power of the Moon. One slash can cover the whole garden of Saigyouji, which is very huge. Power of the Moon calls more power, making its width infinite.


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## Schneider (Feb 16, 2009)

Red said:


> Bold are banned since they're reality warpers (I put that in the OP).
> 
> Oxygen poisoning? Set everything to flame and use it to make your fire attacks hit harder. Or control the amount of oxygen per square area using your density manipulation?
> 
> ...



Oxygen poisoning is about breathing 100% concentrated oxygen, where as humans only take a lot less. It mainly paralyzes anyone who breathes it but I'm sure it's also dangerous to the body as well.

Also, SCR doesn't need range for his soul switch to work. There's a dog nearby and you swap bodies with the dog. What TWF meant was the powers affected the whole planet. Adding space won't do shit, having soul protection does.

And finally, Whitesnake and Weather Report take this.


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## Red (Feb 16, 2009)

Schneider said:


> Oxygen poisoning is about breathing 100% concentrated oxygen, where as humans only take a lot less. It mainly paralyzes anyone who breathes it but I'm sure it's also dangerous to the body as well.


 That's understandable, the thing is the Touhou I brought up controls the amount of anything she wishes. So you make the Air's concentration 100%, she can just disperse it then make your body 1000 times heavier. Her ability is to disperse and gather.



> Also, SCR doesn't need range for his soul switch to work. There's a dog nearby and you swap bodies with the dog. What TWF meant was the powers affected the whole planet. Adding space won't do shit, having soul protection does.


You're going to have to prove hat it's range is infinite.



> And finally, Whitesnake and Weather Report take this.


I disagree.


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## Schneider (Feb 16, 2009)

Red said:


> That's understandable, the thing is the Touhou I brought up controls the amount of anything she wishes. So you make the Air's concentration 100%, she can just disperse it then make your body 1000 times heavier. Her ability is to disperse and gather.



Well, the point is, she doesn't breath it ne? But take note, Weather can only just stand still and it might be too late for the other side 



> You're going to have to prove hat it's range is infinite.



I don't have to. JJBA has The Hand, which teleports any target to point-blank range. There's already Iggy and some rats (and raptors ) here so let's switch anyone's body with the lil' animals here and proceed to finish em' off.



> I disagree.



1. The Hand plays volley with Whitesnake, stealing the "no-change" ability, and lots of other abilities in the process.
2. Weather Report snail rapes everyone else.


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## Red (Feb 17, 2009)

Schneider said:


> Well, the point is, she doesn't breath it ne? But take note, Weather can only just stand still and it might be too late for the other side


 She has the same power of controlling concentration, except it isnt limited to oxygen. I'm pretty sure she could counter it.



> I don't have to. JJBA has The Hand, which teleports any target to point-blank range. There's already Iggy and some rats (and raptors ) here so let's switch anyone's body with the lil' animals here and proceed to finish em' off.


Point still stands I'm going to have to doubt that The Hand can teleport an infinite (constantly expanding) distance. That's a no-limits. Being a no-limits doesn't mean the feat is invalid, it just means I need something to make a claim like that reasonable.



> 1. The Hand plays volley with Whitesnake, stealing the "no-change" ability, and lots of other abilities in the process.


 He won't steal it because Kaguya has another ability that allows her to freeze time as well.



> 2. Weather Report snail rapes everyone else.


Can't argue with that.


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## Cthulhu-versailles (Feb 17, 2009)

I was wondering what the hell Touhou verse was so I googled it. Turns out it's a video game. It both shocked and intrigued me. Though I doubt it is as good as Gradius use to be. Yea, I'm completly off topic, but I don't have anything to add, so yeah.


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## Schneider (Feb 18, 2009)

Red said:


> She has the same power of controlling concentration, except it isnt limited to oxygen. I'm pretty sure she could counter it.



How would she notice that in the first place? Pucci knew that he was intoxicated when he lost the ability to move. 



> Point still stands I'm going to have to doubt that The Hand can teleport an infinite (constantly expanding) distance. That's a no-limits. Being a no-limits doesn't mean the feat is invalid, it just means I need something to make a claim like that reasonable.



If it was expanding (not instantly infinite), I'm still sure The Hand can still erase the space and pull her to point blank range, unless it's as far as the sun then I'll concede this point. After that it's left for her wish to be soul-raped by Whitesnake or soul-transposed by SCR.



> He won't steal it because Kaguya has another ability that allows her to freeze time as well.



What does freezing time have to do with soul rape? Stopping time will deal with Jotaro Kujo and Dio Brando, simple. Whitesnake can take any part of her ability, or other aspects of her body, or rip her soul completely.


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## Red (Feb 18, 2009)

Schneider said:


> How would she notice that in the first place? Pucci knew that he was intoxicated when he lost the ability to move.


I just reached the final stage. That takes place in space so I'm pretty sure the touhous can survive without oxygen. 



> *If it was expanding (not instantly infinite),* I'm still sure The Hand can still erase the space and pull her to point blank range, unless it's as far as the sun then I'll concede this point. After that it's left for her wish to be soul-raped by Whitesnake or soul-transposed by SCR.


To answer the bold part she can expand and contract space infinitely. Unless WS can erase that much space then I'm not going to buy him teleporting to her face and wrecking her.



> What does freezing time have to do with soul rape? Stopping time will deal with Jotaro Kujo and Dio Brando, simple. Whitesnake can take any part of her ability, or other aspects of her body, or rip her soul completely.


You're not following what I'm saying. Kaguya can preempt the attack with a time freeze. Selectively isolating anybody she wants (Read: white snake, or the entire JJBA cast for that matter) in a time stop while leaving her guys to move around freely. The only ones who'd be immune to said time stop are people who have shown proficiency with time manipulation (i.e only a hand ful of them) and I'm pretty sure white snake isn't among that handful (I could be wrong).

You also haven't answered my quiry, early I stated that one character from the otuhou side can cut anything (save for love) and her attack is infinite in range i.e not dodgeable. How are the JJBA stands going to defend, deal with that.


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## Schneider (Feb 18, 2009)

Red said:


> I just reached the final stage. That takes place in space so I'm pretty sure the touhous can survive without oxygen.



Then I'll give this point. 



> To answer the bold part she can expand and contract space infinitely. Unless WS can erase that much space then I'm not going to buy him teleporting to her face and wrecking her.



First, it's The Hand. And the one being pulled is the girl. How fast does she expand space anyway? 



> You're not following what I'm saying. Kaguya can preempt the attack with a time freeze. Selectively isolating anybody she wants (Read: white snake, or the entire JJBA cast for that matter) in a time stop while leaving her guys to move around freely. The only ones who'd be immune to said time stop are people who have shown proficiency with time manipulation (i.e only a hand ful of them) and I'm pretty sure white snake isn't among that handful (I could be wrong).



The time manipulators are Dio Brando, Jotaro Kujo, Yoshikage Kira, Diavolo, and to an extent, Enrico Pucci. And by handful I really mean that they alone can fend off half other stand users alone. I don't know if you will discard this feat or not, but Pucci already accelerated time before he even got C-Moon.



> You also haven't answered my quiry, early I stated that one character from the otuhou side can cut anything (save for love) and her attack is infinite in range i.e not dodgeable. How are the JJBA stands going to defend, deal with that.



Ignoring how destructive the attack is, I'd say there are 2 stands that'll definitely survive (outside of GER); Cream and Man in the Mirror, provided that their nature is to hide away in a different dimension. Cream is more dangerous of the 2, while Man in the Mirror can pack the characters into his mirror dimension.

Also, depending on the time duration of the attack, if it lasts less then 10 seconds, King Crimson might be able to survive by skipping through it. Or there's the shitty stand Highway to Hell who always try to kill himself. A walking voodoo doll. I think he can be a good use for this situation. And Cheap Trick.


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## Endless Mike (Feb 20, 2009)

Red said:


> Her power "Prevents change" switching someone soul is changing their bodies no?



So she would have to freeze her entire side, which would just cause them to lose by default, since they would be frozen in unchanging movement forever. Also their thoughts would be frozen so they couldn't undo it, since thinking is changing the state of your mind.

Might want to rethink that.



> Speed equalized, I mentioned that in the OP.



How exactly does that work with something like B.I.G. whose speed is dependent on the opponent? Kind of makes his power useless.



> To be more specific an example of her using her powers was when she broke apart a meteor in the atmosphere. It's also useful since it's long range


.

And...? Is there a mechanism for how this works?



> I mentioned Youmou can cut spirit. Specifically she can kill ten spirits in one swing.



Except Cheap Trick acts as its own stand, bonding to the user's own soul. So she'd just be killing herself.



> Well that's nifty. Komachi is a death God that controls the river of the dead. The river of the dead is infinitely wide and infinitely deep. She can manipulate that distance (shortening it or making it longer). If she wanted she could make it so SCR's attack would be out of their range even thoug it's planetary in range.



To do that they would have to go into space. Which would count as a ring - out and they lose by default.



> Only real probably is soul fucks. How many stands fall into that category and what are their abilities?



Death 13 - kills people in their dreams (like Freddy Krueger). Any injuries inflicted in dreams happen in real life. Can warp reality within dreams (but since it's in a dream it doesn't actually count as reality warping). The dreamers will have no powers unless they activate them before going to sleep. If they survive their memories of the dream world will be erased when they wake up.

Anubis - possesses anyone who touches it

Osiris - steals someone's soul if they lose at gambling to the user

Atum - same as Osiris except with video games

Heaven's Door: When opponent is touched (stand user has superhuman speed) they turn into a living book with all information about them, including their history, physical characteristics, thoughts, and memories, written inside. The user can erase or write new information, to change someone's memories, give them commands that they are forced to obey, or even cause physically impossible things to happen to them, like suddenly flying through the air at 50 km/h

Atom Heart Father: Basically a ghost that lives inside a photograph

Boy II Man: Takes others powers if they are beaten in rock-paper-scissors

Cheap Trick: Becomes the victim's own stand. Any damage done to it will occur to the victim as well. When someone sees the victim's back, their soul will be ripped out and Cheap Trick will transfer itself to the person who saw their back. It will talk and attract attention to try to get people to see its victim's back. Lives on after the user is killed.

Black Sabbath: Can only move in darkness. Attacks anyone it sees with a Stand arrow - if their souls have no capacity to develop a stand, they die.

Mr. President: A room inside of a turtle that allows spirits to live within even if their bodies died

Silver Chariot Requiem: Causes all souls to switch with another nearby creature, as well as their abilities. Accelerates evolution across the planet. Any stand (or other power, by equivalence rule) attacking it will turn and attack its owner instead, unless it is attacked from the correct angle with respect to the sun.

Whitesnake: Steals a person's soul by touching them, turning it into a disc. There are two types of discs: memory discs, which contain a person's mind and soul, and ability discs, which contain their powers. The discs can be given to others to give them abilities or memories of previous victims. It also can form a mist that puts people to sleep and digests them like stomach acid.

Burning Down the House: Creates "spirit duplicates" of destroyed objects

Limp Bizkit: Summons the spirits of dead creatures to attack the enemy

Anyway, by banning the stronger stands, equalizing speed, and such it's really just admitting that you lost


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## Red (Feb 21, 2009)

Endless Mike said:


> So she would have to freeze her entire side, which would just cause them to lose by default, since they would be frozen in unchanging movement forever. Also their thoughts would be frozen so they couldn't undo it, since thinking is changing the state of your mind.


 She can selectively freeze areas of the time line. So she can freeze the JJBA side without harming her comrades.



> How exactly does that work with something like B.I.G. whose speed is dependent on the opponent? Kind of makes his power useless.


He's an exception, but every other stand gets speed equalized to avoid the obligatory speed feats fiasco.



> And...? Is there a mechanism for how this works?


Everything has a point of tension, she transfers that point to her palm and crushes it thereby destroying the object. It can work from several thousand kilometers away as well.




> Except Cheap Trick acts as its own stand, bonding to the user's own soul. So she'd just be killing herself.


Well then she valiantly sacrifices herself and her father takes her place as the next person who can kill spirits.


> To do that they would have to go into space. Which would count as a ring - out and they lose by default.


Op says the ring is the entire JJBA universe, so that won't be a problem.


> Death 13 - kills people in their dreams (like Freddy Krueger). Any injuries inflicted in dreams happen in real life. Can warp reality within dreams (but since it's in a dream it doesn't actually count as reality warping). The dreamers will have no powers unless they activate them before going to sleep. If they survive their memories of the dream world will be erased when they wake up.


If he doesn't have the power to put people to sleep then it's useless.



> Osiris - steals someone's soul if they lose at gambling to the user
> 
> Atum - same as Osiris except with video games


 I doubt anybody would play video games or gamble in this battle so it's useless.



> Atom Heart Father: Basically a ghost that lives inside a photograph


This sounds useless in a battle.



> Boy II Man: Takes others powers if they are beaten in rock-paper-scissors


Sounds useless as well.

Cheap Trick: Becomes the victim's own stand. Any damage done to it will occur to the victim as well. When someone sees the victim's back, their soul will be ripped out and Cheap Trick will transfer itself to the person who saw their back. It will talk and attract attention to try to get people to see its victim's back. Lives on after the user is killed.



> Black Sabbath: *Can only move in darkness.* Attacks anyone it sees with a Stand arrow - if their souls have no capacity to develop a stand, they die.


 So he would be useless in the light as well?



> Mr. President: A room inside of a turtle that allows spirits to live within even if their bodies died


Not really useful.



> Anubis - possesses anyone who touches it
> 
> Heaven's Door: When opponent is touched (stand user has superhuman speed) they turn into a living book with all information about them, including their history, physical characteristics, thoughts, and memories, written inside. The user can erase or write new information, to change someone's memories, give them commands that they are forced to obey, or even cause physically impossible things to happen to them, like suddenly flying through the air at 50 km/h
> 
> ...


These would be the biggest problems facing the touhou side, so it all depends on who attacks first and who they attack.



> Burning Down the House: Creates "spirit duplicates" of destroyed objects


Well them being "spirits" is disadvantaging them since they're specific characters on the touhou side which kills them off with ease.



> Limp Bizkit: Summons the spirits of dead creatures to attack the enemy


Same as above.



> Anyway, by banning the stronger stands, equalizing speed, and such it's really just admitting that you lost


I also banned people from my side, but if it's really a bother then all characters are allowed, even GER. Though speed stays the same with the exception of BIG.


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## Fang (Feb 21, 2009)

Actually Atom Heart Father is pretty dangerous. If he drags or holds an object in his photograph, the victim is powerless to stop his actions in his own world.

Ie slits you across a throat with a knife in his picture or whatever. Also if GER was in this match up, speed equalization wouldn't help against it at all.


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## Red (Feb 21, 2009)

TWF said:


> Actually Atom Heart Father is pretty dangerous. If he drags or holds an object in his photograph, the victim is powerless to stop his actions in his own world.
> 
> Ie slits you across a throat with a knife in his picture or whatever.


The problem with Atom heart is that he has to have his victim in the photograph. I doubt anybody is going to just waltz into his picture.


> Also if GER was in this match up, speed equalization wouldn't help against it at all.


I know GER, would you honestly think I'd allow him and his HAX if I didn't think there was a good chance he'd lose?

If you can't deal with GER because he's too hax, then you simply wipe him out of existence *before *he became GER. Keine can eat anybody's history.


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## Fang (Feb 21, 2009)

You know that GER can nullify and action during or after it occured and works on universal level with its powers.

I severely doubt GER would allow that action to occur unobstructed.

Also, Atom Heart Father from Yoshiro doesn't need its victims in the photograph to harm them.


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## Red (Feb 21, 2009)

TWF said:


> You know that GER can nullify and action during or after it occured and works on universal level with its powers.
> 
> I severely doubt GER would allow that action to occur unobstructed.


Unless GER's powers are able to effect past time lines that have already happened (say thousands of years ago) then this would effect him.



> Also, Atom Heart Father from Yoshiro doesn't need its victims in the photograph to harm them.


Can you explain his power in depth.


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## Fang (Feb 21, 2009)

Red said:


> Unless GER's powers are able to effect past time lines that have already happened (say thousands of years ago) then this would effect him.



How would that translate her powers into specifically the JJBAverse's own time line and universes? GER operated where time and space didn't exist, has infinite range and put values on the concept of death. And create its own infinite loops of reality to target its victims.

Taking action against GER is basically impossible unless your a high level reality warper or have a defense like LHWs or Dispell Bound. Or some sort of being that has universal+ powers that can ignore the law of casuality.



> Can you explain his power in depth.



And Atom Heart Father is a tough one to describe. Basically Kira Yoshiro (Kira Yoshikage's father) was already dead when Part IV in JJBA started. His ghost inhabits a photograph thanks to his Stand power activating after his death to protect his son.

Dance of the Camellia 
Dance of the Camellia 
Dance of the Camellia 
Dance of the Camellia 
Dance of the Camellia 

Crazy Diamond rips apart the photograph of Atom Heart Father, since Josuke and Jotaro are reflected in the picture, the action rips apart Jotaro and Josuke.

Dance of the Camellia 
Dance of the Camellia 
Dance of the Camellia 
Dance of the Camellia 

Basically if you die or are harmed in the picture of Atom Heart Father from Kira Yoshiro, it affects you in the real world.

Dance of the Camellia 
Dance of the Camellia 
Dance of the Camellia 

Even The Hand, a Stand that cuts space and teleports anything to Okuyasu, couldn't affect Atom Heart Father or pull Yoshiro out of his Stand in the photograph.

Dance of the Camellia 
Dance of the Camellia 

And the borders of the picture obstacles and impossible to bypass since they mirror the world the picture of Yoshiro's that is reflected.

Link removed

Yoshiro explains it in depth.

Link removed


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## Red (Feb 22, 2009)

TWF said:


> How would that translate her powers into specifically the JJBAverse's own time line and universes? GER operated where time and space didn't exist, has infinite range and put values on the concept of death. And create its own infinite loops of reality to target its victims.
> 
> Taking action against GER is basically impossible unless your a high level reality warper or have a defense like LHWs or Dispell Bound. Or some sort of being that has universal+ powers that can ignore the law of casuality.


 There are a number of ways that can be overcome. Like I said, Keine can wipe GER from existence before GER was pierced with a stand arrow. Inu has a sword that counters everything and anything. That's it's power to use the exact opposite of your power to counter you. If GER's power is reducing everything to zero by nullifying it, then the sword would react by increasing everything to inifinity. If these two ever meet then it's going to be like an unstoppable force meeting an unmoviable sheild.



> And Atom Heart Father is a tough one to describe. Basically Kira Yoshiro (Kira Yoshikage's father) was already dead when Part IV in JJBA started. His ghost inhabits a photograph thanks to his Stand power activating after his death to protect his son.
> 
> here
> here
> ...


So, how do you get into the picture?


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## Fang (Feb 22, 2009)

GER transcend time space and reality. It would just stop and nullify the action during or after she attempts it and then places her in an infinite death loop for eternity.

And again, Atom Heart Father doesn't bring the victims into the photograph. Your reflected in his Stand automatically, and any action that happens in the picture reflects on the victim.


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## Schneider (Feb 23, 2009)

Red said:


> There are a number of ways that can be overcome. Like I said, Keine can wipe GER from existence before GER was pierced with a stand arrow. Inu has a sword that counters everything and anything. That's it's power to use the exact opposite of your power to counter you. If GER's power is reducing everything to zero by nullifying it, then the sword would react by increasing everything to inifinity. If these two ever meet then it's going to be like an unstoppable force meeting an unmoviable sheild.



GER managed to work in a period where he _didn't even exist_. Also, if that sword counters what GER does (infinite murder loop) by doing the exact opposite, what will that sword do? Infinite sex loop?

Well, GER gives endless torture, so the sword must give endless pleasure no?


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## Rashou (Feb 23, 2009)

Schneider said:


> GER managed to work in a period where he _didn't even exist_. Also, if that sword counters what GER does (infinite murder loop) by doing the exact opposite, what will that sword do? Infinite sex loop?
> 
> Well, GER gives endless torture, so the sword must give endless pleasure no?



Presumably it'd make the death loop GER creates a life loop and give it a value of infinite... Whatever that means (maybe it'll make the user immortal?).


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## Endless Mike (Feb 23, 2009)

Red said:


> She can selectively freeze areas of the time line. So she can freeze the JJBA side without harming her comrades.



Your original plan was to freeze their own souls to stop SCR



> He's an exception, but every other stand gets speed equalized to avoid the obligatory speed feats fiasco.



Which is just a tacit admission that you've lost.



> Everything has a point of tension, she transfers that point to her palm and crushes it thereby destroying the object. It can work from several thousand kilometers away as well.



This only works on physical objects, right?



> Well then she valiantly sacrifices herself and her father takes her place as the next person who can kill spirits.



Cheap Trick survives its users death and just transfers to him



> Op says the ring is the entire JJBA universe, so that won't be a problem.



I missed that



> If he doesn't have the power to put people to sleep then it's useless.



Other stands, like Whitesnake, do



> I doubt anybody would play video games or gamble in this battle so it's useless.



There are stands that can alter the emotions, personalities, and memories of characters that could cause them to do so



> Sounds useless as well.



See the note on Atum and Osiris



> So he would be useless in the light as well?



Yes



> These would be the biggest problems facing the touhou side, so it all depends on who attacks first and who they attack.



Ok



> Well them being "spirits" is disadvantaging them since they're specific characters on the touhou side which kills them off with ease.



They can be called into existence as long as the original object once existed in the same area



> Same as above.



I'd like to see proof that they can kill an unlimited amount of spirits effortlessly



> I also banned people from my side, but if it's really a bother then all characters are allowed, even GER. Though speed stays the same with the exception of BIG.



Bohemian Rhapsody summons Squirrel Girl 



> There are a number of ways that can be overcome. Like I said, Keine can wipe GER from existence before GER was pierced with a stand arrow. Inu has a sword that counters everything and anything. That's it's power to use the exact opposite of your power to counter you. If GER's power is reducing everything to zero by nullifying it, then the sword would react by increasing everything to inifinity. If these two ever meet then it's going to be like an unstoppable force meeting an unmoviable sheild.



Wouldn't work - King Crimson was described as the exact opposite of GER, while King Crimson nullifies causes, GER nullifies effects.

GER beat King Crimson.


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## Schneider (Feb 23, 2009)

Rashou said:


> Presumably it'd make the death loop GER creates a life loop and give it a value of infinite... Whatever that means (maybe it'll make the user immortal?).



You're technically immortal inside GER death loop since you can't really die in the first place. Getting infinite pleasure (sex loop ) seemed more fitting since all that there is in the death loop is endless methods of death.


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## Rashou (Feb 23, 2009)

Schneider said:


> You're technically immortal inside GER death loop since you can't really die in the first place. Getting infinite pleasure (sex loop ) seemed more fitting since all that there is in the death loop is endless methods of death.



You and your sex loop!


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