# The Admiral=Yonkou Debate is Officially Over



## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

And just like that, the careers of The Admiral Band Has officially ended. 

@Mawt
@Tsukuyomi 
@convict 
@Sufex 
@Turrin 
@TheOmega

Reactions: Winner 18 | Tier Specialist 5


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## Eustathios (Aug 14, 2022)

Movie events are not canon.

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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> Movie events are not canon.



But more canon than the opinions of NF posters

Reactions: Like 5 | Agree 1 | Funny 4 | Winner 15


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## Grinningfox (Aug 14, 2022)

Should’ve never been a thing to begin with

Reactions: Agree 14 | Winner 1


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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> But more canon than the opinions of NF posters


I've always said this.

Shanks effortlessly defeated Kizaru & actually made "Mr.He's Trolling" sweat. Fujitora was ready to go till Shanks flexed.

By DEFAULT, Yonko scale > Akainu cuz he's not THIS much stronger than Admirals while Shanks is regarded as weakest Yonko before Buggy.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1 | Neutral 1


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## Tenma (Aug 14, 2022)

the audience booing the marines when they showed up in the second clip is too fucking funny

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## jesusus (Aug 14, 2022)

It's fun and games for the red ratatouille until a shadow of the Coast manifests behind him.

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## Bouki (Aug 14, 2022)

Kizaru smiling and doing his trolling as he always does. Fujitora specifies that he doesn’t want to involve the civilians in a war with a yonko crew.
Regardless, movie made to generate money is a great source of material to use for arguments.

Reactions: Funny 4 | Optimistic 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## themightyvoosh (Aug 14, 2022)

Tenma said:


> the audience booing the marines when they showed up in the second clip is too fucking funny

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Chip Skylark (Aug 14, 2022)

It's been over for weeks.

Should've been years, honestly.

The movie was just more icing on the cake.

Reactions: Like 9 | Winner 1 | Optimistic 1


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## Grinningfox (Aug 14, 2022)

Niggas bring Kizaru trolling like he didn’t get knocked to his knees by COC is crazy

Reactions: Like 8 | Funny 2 | Tier Specialist 2


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## arv993 (Aug 14, 2022)

Admiral playbook when they encounter a yonko:

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 18


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## Strobacaxi (Aug 14, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> But more canon than the opinions of NF posters


Nope, they're the same level of canon: Not.

Reactions: Disagree 1


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## Eustathios (Aug 14, 2022)

Grinningfox said:


> Niggas bring Kizaru trolling like he didn’t get knocked to his knees by COC is crazy


Nah it's just that we don't take movies as canon. Otherwise pre TS Luffy should've been close to top tier lvl already since he beat Shiki.

Reactions: Like 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Grinningfox (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> Nah it's just that we don't take movies as canon. Otherwise pre TS Luffy should've been close to top tier lvl already since he beat Shiki.


Friend I mean this in the kindest way possible.

Don’t quote me

Reactions: Funny 8


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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

Strobacaxi said:


> Nope, they're the same level of canon: Not.




IMO it is clear someone like Shanks is stronger than Kizaru.

What does shanks have that Kizaru did not? 

There is no passion!!!!!
There is no aggression!!!!!
What the hell is wrong with these admirals????
Get out of Navy HQ now!!!!
Just need to retire!!!!!!!

Reactions: Funny 5 | Informative 1


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## Ushiromiya Battler (Aug 14, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> IMO it is clear someone like Shanks is stronger than Kizaru.
> 
> What does shanks have that Kizaru did not?
> 
> ...


This is what happens if you don't get paid enough for OT.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 14, 2022)

No wonder they're called the "Admiral Band".
Reminds me of another band which also had 3 glorified idols.



Any of the following moments should have shut down what should never have been a debate:

> A retired old white-haired 1st mate went toe-to-toe with Kizaru who was later held at gun-point by another 1st mate
> A different old white-haired man, injured and way past his prime, rag-dolled probably the strongest admiral and died standing
> A 1-armed man casually blocked probably the strongest admiral's direct punch with the flat end of a blade after holding back Kaido

Never mind all three together. And that's not even mentioning obvious portrayal indicators...



Back in the day, weren't people even debating 2-3 admirals vs an old WB? lol.

Reactions: Funny 10


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## Sherlōck (Aug 14, 2022)

Non canon movie is non canon.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Eustathios (Aug 14, 2022)

Mad Scientist said:


> No wonder they're called the "Admiral Band".
> Reminds me of another band which also had 3 glorified idols.
> 
> 
> ...


Back in the day some people were going with Admirals ~ Marco, due to a misunderstood Databook statement. Good thing the community grew out of that phase though.

Reactions: Informative 1 | Optimistic 1 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Sablés (Aug 14, 2022)

Canon or not, it's clear that the GB vs Shanks confrontation was side-by-side to promote the movie, so it's a valid estimation of how Shanks compares to the admirals. Besides, admirals have never been disgraced like this until now even in non-canon works. Japan isn't as anal about canon as we are. What message does it send in a story that Oda supervised, to the point that he demanded that Luffy and the others be main characters, that Shanks can pressure Kizaru in 18 seconds?

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 11 | Funny 1


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## Mawt (Aug 14, 2022)

Admirals are just like the Sannin. Long forgotten characters who possess a cult fanbase that will do anything to elevate their standing, blissfully unaware of their impending irrelevance compared to actual strong characters like the Yonko.

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## Mawt (Aug 14, 2022)

Admirals need to prove they can beat non weakened YC1 before they can step up to actual top tier opponents

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## Eustathios (Aug 14, 2022)

Mawt said:


> *Admirals need to prove they can beat non weakened YC1 *before they can step up to actual top tier opponents



*Spoiler*: __

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## Strobacaxi (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> *Spoiler*: __


Distracted = weakened

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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> Nah it's just that we don't take movies as canon. Otherwise pre TS Luffy should've been close to top tier lvl already since he beat Shiki.


Nah, that doesn't work. Shiki was extremely old & rusty , crippled, & tortured in Impel Down for decades when Luffy fought him. He could easily just have lost majority of his strength like Chinjao to the point Lao G could fodderize him.

Reactions: Winner 3


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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

For what it's worth, I do think Akainu will get some boost (if he hasn't already) given his role in the story.

But the Admiral Band are fond of wholesale ranking and they have yet to break away from utopia.


Allow me to make a prediction:
Soon the Akainu Fans will be clearly distinguishing themselves from 'Admirals' in general in order to save face.
The time is coming.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 4 | Funny 3 | Informative 1


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## GrizzlyClaws (Aug 14, 2022)

Yes, that ship has sailed.

Most of us saw it coming long ago.

You can be a pansy about it and stick your fingers in the ears to waive away the portrayal Admirals got against a Yonko in the movie like it doesn't matter, eventhough Oda himself worked on the movie too, but you can never, ever, under any circumstance, waive away the same portrayal an Admiral got against the same Yonko in the _manga itself_, while also downright admitting inferiority to another Yonko.

Admirals are not meant to be peers to the Yonkos, they never were, and it's disheartening to see some of you tricked yourselves into still buying this after everything.

Let the ship sail my friends, and let's fill the OL with joy and laughter together, much in the spirit of One Piece and the journey to Laugh Tale, and no ill will towards each other.

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## Mawt (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> *Spoiler*: __


It seems all Admirals resort to is underhanded tactics. Sniping YCs while they’re distracted, bullying weakened and recovering YCs, tricking Yonko underlings into stabbing them and weakening them, and then running away with their tails between their legs when a Yonko challenges them to a fair battle.

It seems Admirals are just losers and frauds playing a role of justice that they can’t back up

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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

Whatever boost Akainu gets it highly doubt it'll be enough to low diff Kizaru like Shanks did

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## Eustathios (Aug 14, 2022)

Are we just gonna ignore Aramaki essentially saying commanders are fodder to an Admiral?

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## Ushiromiya Battler (Aug 14, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> For what it's worth, I do think Akainu will get some boost (if he hasn't already) given his role in the story.
> 
> But the Admiral Band are fond of wholesale ranking and they have yet to break away from utopia.
> 
> ...


It is already happening bro   Greenbull and Fujitora are now "fake admirals" in their eyes with C3 >>> them

Reactions: Funny 3 | Winner 3


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## Strobacaxi (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> Are we just gonna ignore Aramaki essentially saying commanders are fodder to an Admiral?


You gotta read the small print my brother. Aramaki said commanders are fodder as long as they're weakened

Reactions: Funny 5


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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> Are we just gonna ignore Aramaki essentially saying commanders are fodder to an Admiral?


Yes, because they were obviously extremely nerfed. He's not the word of God. King lost a Wing, was in bandages & didn't have his sword that was able to block adcoc slashes from Zoro. Queen lost his weaponry, was in bandages, & didn't use his inventions.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

LMAO someone tag Turrin. Dude argued me up & down that GB was superior to MF Admirals

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## Mawt (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> Are we just gonna ignore Aramaki essentially saying commanders are fodder to an Admiral?


And then bullying weakened and recovering YCs

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> Are we just gonna ignore Aramaki essentially saying commanders are fodder to an Admiral?



This ship has sailed (no pun intended). I, and many others have systematically refuted this propaganda

Admiral Band Assertion 1: Greenbull beat commanders and trash talked them so that mean Admirals>=Yonkou

Refutation: An off panel ambiguous clash should not be used to make such wide reaching claims. What happened? Momo happened. And then Greenbull fled because of Shanks' presence.

There is scarcely a sentient being in the land that thinks Greenbull is in anyway comparable to Shanks. Even The Admiral Band have Christian Baled on this man. 

It's over.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 6 | Winner 2


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## Eustathios (Aug 14, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> This ship has sailed (no pun intended). I, and many others have systematically refuted this propaganda
> 
> Admiral Band Assertion 1: Greenbull beat commanders and trash talked them so that mean *Admirals>=Yonkou*
> 
> ...


Pretty sure most people argue for Admirals ~ Yonkou. Anyway, I would adress your arguments, but I feel that's for another thread and not here.

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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

It's like they refuse to accept it no matter what...

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## Eustathios (Aug 14, 2022)

I will admit that the Admirals' portrayal is at its lowest point right now though.

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## Sablés (Aug 14, 2022)

I can't find the panel now but I'm confident that Robin said Big Mom/Yonko and was the strongest opponent they had ever fought. This being after Robin had participated in battles against two separate admirals. Three if you count Fujitora. If anyone can find the scan, post it.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 4


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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> I will admit that the Admirals' portrayal is at its lowest point right now though.


They literally let Shanks low diff Kizaru then make Fujitora back down only after Shanks gets serious & goes all out with a CoC Haki flex...

It's over they are not equal & no where near it. Shanks literally had Kizaru's head a few seconds into the fight.

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Kroczilla (Aug 14, 2022)

It was never really a debate. Even looking at the way the balance of power was structured as well as the events of Marineford, it was pretty obvious that Yonko were superior. Not that the Admirals can't compete.

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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

I warned everyone 2 years ago but I was shut down 

Finally the time has come

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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

Kroczilla said:


> It was never really a debate. Even looking at the way the balance of power was structured as well as the events of Marineford, it was pretty obvious that Yonko were superior. Not that the Admirals can't compete.


Tbh in a straight up fair 1v1 start to finish. They can't. Shanks straight up low diffed Kizaru. No wonder Luffy was gonna let Yamato, Momo, & Scabbards handle GB. Had Momo not told Yamato to stand down I'm certain GB would've been pushed to extreme.

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## aiyanah (Aug 14, 2022)

shanks is outlier though, it's more correct to think of him as an outsider/other.
he's actually the PK gatekeeper but not quite PK himself.
in terms of autonomy (read: power) and gravitas within op he is just above the gorosei but still beneath imu.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Neutral 1


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## Mawt (Aug 14, 2022)

Kroczilla said:


> It was never really a debate. Even looking at the way the balance of power was structured as well as the events of Marineford, it was pretty obvious that Yonko were superior. Not that the Admirals can't compete.


Sengoku straight up hyping WB as the strongest man in the world, having power capable of destroying the world, and even going as far as to state that the Marines might meet their end there. 

Admirals having individual matchups against YCs rather than, y’know, the Yonko who was present there. And when Akainu does face said Yonko, it’s after he’s already weakened thanks to cheap and underhanded tactics. 

WB beating the absolute fuck out of Akainu after having a damn heart attack and not even being able to use CoC. 

MF would not be a thing if there were like 4 Yonko level motherfuckers on the Marines’ side. Genuinely baffling that people got that impression from the arc. Admirals are clearly portrayed as being stronger than YCs, but weaker than Yonko. This has always been the case.

Oda goes out of his way to give Yonko insane praise. “Strongest man in the world.” “Strongest creature in the world.” “This guy sparred with the world’s strongest swordsman.” “In a 1v1, always bet on Kaido.” These hype statements don’t exist for Admirals. It’s clear who Oda views as being superior.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 5


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## Yumi Zoro (Aug 14, 2022)

Mawt said:


> Admirals are just like the Sannin. Long forgotten characters who possess a cult fanbase that will do anything to elevate their standing, blissfully unaware of their impending irrelevance compared to actual strong characters like the Yonko.



Comparing Chadsanin to Admiral, the direspect.

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Eustathios (Aug 14, 2022)

aiyanah said:


> shanks is outlier though, it's more correct to think of him as an outsider/other.
> *he's actually the PK gatekeeper but not quite PK himself.*
> in terms of autonomy (read: power) and gravitas within op he is just above the gorosei but still beneath imu.


That was WB.

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## Sablés (Aug 14, 2022)

aiyanah said:


> shanks is outlier though, it's more correct to think of him as an outsider/other.
> he's actually the PK gatekeeper but not quite PK himself.
> in terms of autonomy (read: power) and gravitas within op he is just above the gorosei but still beneath imu.


The outliers of the Yonko were Whitebeard and Kaido. BB is liable to surpass them both. If you think Shanks is on that level...well, that would make Big Mom the (negative) outlier, no?

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Ushiromiya Battler (Aug 14, 2022)

Sablés said:


> I can't find the panel now but I'm confident that Robin said Big Mom/Yonko and was the strongest opponent they had ever fought. This being after Robin had participated in battles against two separate admirals. Three if you count Fujitora. If anyone can find the scan, post it.



Here

Reactions: Winner 7 | Informative 2 | GODA 1


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## Ushiromiya Battler (Aug 14, 2022)

aiyanah said:


> shanks is outlier though, it's more correct to think of him as an outsider/other.
> he's actually the PK gatekeeper but not quite PK himself.
> in terms of autonomy (read: power) and gravitas within op he is just above the gorosei but still beneath imu.


Too bad he is a Yonko, not an admiral.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## KBD (Aug 14, 2022)

aiyanah said:


> shanks is outlier though, it's more correct to think of him as an outsider/other.
> he's actually the PK gatekeeper but not quite PK himself.
> in terms of autonomy (read: power) and gravitas within op he is just above the gorosei but still beneath imu.


What  produce some evidence for this, I'd like to hear more.


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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

KBD said:


> What  produce some evidence for this, I'd like to hear more.



Yeah it doesn't stick from a power perspective 

I guess if he argued from personality POV (max charisma) in conjunction with top tier ability, then it'd make sense (the parallel to Roger). 

Shanks can serve as the bridge to PK in that sense 
Roger 
Passes on his legacy to Shanks 
And then Shanks to Luffy who completes the Trident

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Sablés (Aug 14, 2022)

Ushiromiya Battler said:


> Here


How was it even a debate after this?

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## The crazy hacker (Aug 14, 2022)

This should have been over the moment Kaido showed his feats. But people convinced themselves that it's only WB and Kaido that stand above the admirals and Shanks and BM aren't special. Now you have Shanks showing great feats and BM taking  Kidd and Law to beat with them being seen as rivals to yonkou Luffy.

Reactions: Agree 5


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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

Sablés said:


> How was it even a debate after this?



Admiral Band Representative: Nico Robin is not privy to the true abilities of the Admirals as she is a pirate. Her pirate bias clouded her judgement.
Also, another translation confirmed that she was comparing Big Mom to other pirates.

Reactions: Funny 9


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## Ezekjuninor (Aug 14, 2022)

You would think a Shanks fanboy made this movie.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Funny 1


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## Ushiromiya Battler (Aug 14, 2022)

Ezekjuninor said:


> You would think a Shanks fanboy made this movie.


Chapter 1055 and Film Red were written by @Seraphoenix

Reactions: Funny 12


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## KBD (Aug 14, 2022)

Ezekjuninor said:


> You would think a Shanks fanboy made this movie.



He is even wearing the same shorts

Reactions: Funny 11


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## Ezekjuninor (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> Pretty sure most people argue for Admirals ~ Yonkou. Anyway, I would adress your arguments, but I feel that's for another thread and not here.


There was a lot of admiral>yonkou fans before Wano finished. It’s only now that some of them are backing down.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3 | Informative 2


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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

Ezekjuninor said:


> There was a lot of admiral>yonkou fans before Wano finished. It’s only now that some of them are backing down.



Admiral Band right now

Reactions: Funny 8


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## JustSumGuy (Aug 14, 2022)

Admiral gang down bad rn I’m not even gonna lie.

There will be brighter days though.

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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

JustSumGuy said:


> Admiral gang down bad rn I’m not even gonna lie.
> 
> There will be brighter days though.



Coby Coin be strong for One Piece Shippuden

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 2


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## JustSumGuy (Aug 14, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> Coby Coin be strong for One Piece Shippuden


Admiral Koby will be stronger than all the yonko. Book it.

And I’m standing strong with Akainu. One more slip up from the admirals and I’m specifically Akainu gang.

Reactions: Funny 6


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## Ushiromiya Battler (Aug 14, 2022)

JustSumGuy said:


> Admiral Koby will be stronger than all the yonko. Book it.
> 
> And I’m standing strong with Akainu. One more slip up from the admirals and *I’m specifically Akainu gang.*


There are no admiral fans, only Akainu fans

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sablés (Aug 14, 2022)

Ezekjuninor said:


> There was a lot of admiral>yonkou fans before Wano finished. It’s only now that some of them are backing down.


Nah. This was just backlash from Yonko >> Admiral wank for years. Adgang thought the admirals would win by playing the long game and coming after Kaido/BM. Shanks and BB fans thought the same thing for their private agenda and called those two entry-level Yonko.

Yonko >=/~ Admiral was the consensus.

Not anymore though. Couldn't see me advocating that nonsense

Reactions: Funny 1


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## aiyanah (Aug 14, 2022)

Sablés said:


> The outliers of the Yonko were Whitebeard and Kaido. BB is liable to surpass them both. If you think Shanks is on that level...well, that would make Big Mom the (negative) outlier, no?


i don't get it, shanks can walk into the gorosei suite casually and we're still debating whether he exists outside of the presented power hierarchy or not?
imu likewise exists outside of it by breaking the throne rule but that's more psy-op standard than an actual dominance standard, albeit it's a given that he has some notable combat potential.
what explanation is going to be given for luffy and shanks clashing as equals when he's gomu gomu ultra instinct mk4?
shanks took roids?


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## TheOmega (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> Movie events are not canon.


And yet the AdmiraLs consistently continue to get shitted on
 




Grinningfox said:


> Niggas bring Kizaru trolling like he didn’t get knocked to his knees by COC is crazy


He had to bow to the King





arv993 said:


> Admiral playbook when they encounter a yonko:


Admirals be acting like the Yonko are the cops lmaooo





Eustathios said:


> *Spoiler*: __


Imagine tryna show that the Admirals > un nerfed YCs by posting a picture of them sneakshotting YCs 







The crazy hacker said:


> This should have been over the moment Kaido showed his feats. But people convinced themselves that it's only WB and Kaido that stand above the admirals and Shanks and BM aren't special. Now you have Shanks showing great feats and BM taking  Kidd and Law to beat with them being seen as rivals to yonkou Luffy


And the crazy shit is that K&L ain't even really beat BM, she beat herself with the bombs. The Yonko are broken af.






JustSumGuy said:


> Admiral gang down bad rn I’m not even gonna lie.
> 
> There will be brighter days though.


Lmaoo hope is the last thing lost as they say lmao

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Incognitos (Aug 14, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> Back in the day some people were going with Admirals ~ Marco, due to a misunderstood Databook statement. Good thing the community grew out of that phase though.


Cough cough Beckman cough  cough

Reactions: Funny 2


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## TheOmega (Aug 14, 2022)

Sablés said:


> Nah. This was just backlash from Yonko >> Admiral wank for years. Adgang thought the admirals would win by playing the long game and coming after Kaido/BM. Shanks and BB fans thought the same thing for their private agenda and called those two entry-level Yonko.
> 
> Yonko >=/~ Admiral was the consensus.
> 
> Not anymore though. Couldn't see me advocating that nonsense


Yonko >> Admirals has always been the case


Admirals need to apply nerfs on the Yonko for the shit to be semirealistic and even then the Yonko pop up looking better


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## Incognitos (Aug 14, 2022)

One admiral being so afraid of one yonko is why I think kid is admiral level. He's actually taken on a yonko and post big mom should be able to beat an admiral.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Eustathios (Aug 14, 2022)

Incognitos said:


> Cough cough Beckman cough  cough


Beckman is _different_, you don't get it. 

If Admiral coin keeps dropping I might be jumping on that Admiral lvl Beckman/Marco agenda too though

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 2


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## Orca (Aug 14, 2022)

Admiralbros thought Sanji was a threat. At this rate, they gonna be fighting Franky, Brook and Robin whilst the M3 take on Imu and Knights of God.



On a serious note, it was reasonable to say that Admirals can fight with Yonko or even that they are close to Yonko. But this insistence that they are exactly equal to Yonko or even stronger than them was going to get turned on its head eventually. Pirates in every generation have been stronger than the individual marines.

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## Incognitos (Aug 14, 2022)

Orca said:


> Admiralbros thought Sanji was a threat. At this rate, they gonna be fighting Franky, Brook and Robin whilst the M3 take on Imu and Knights of God.
> 
> 
> 
> On a serious note, it was reasonable to say that Admirals can fight with Yonko or even that they are close to Yonko. But this insistence that they are exactly equal to Yonko or even stronger than them was going to get turned on its head eventually. Pirates in every generation have been stronger than the individual marines.


Admiral gang best case is fighting kid and law at this point.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Recca (Aug 14, 2022)

Grinningfox said:


> Niggas bring Kizaru trolling like he didn’t get knocked to his knees by COC is crazy



I love to shit on Kizaru as much as the next guy, but that was Momonga on his knees.

Reactions: Funny 2 | Informative 1


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## TheOmega (Aug 14, 2022)

The way Old Sick Heartstabbed Heart Attack Magma Freebies WB 2 shotted the dog shit outta redbitch always settled the issue for me





Yonko >> Admirals

Reactions: Like 6 | Funny 1


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## BladeofTheMorning (Aug 14, 2022)

Admirals are a force to be reckoned with and they give Yonkou high diff (mid spectrum) at least to any Yonko.

However I don’t understand the hype train for Kizaru too much. I like the guy. But in Marine for he took shots at Marco while the former was cuffed by sea stone, then he was trolling a sick dying WB, woop dee doo.

I mean he took out the SN at Sabondy but they had no Haki feats. I mean he picks and trolls on those who are much much weaker than him and can’t fight back. Just a sadistic bully who plays calm to look cool.

I don’t even want to hear the “he was going to wano alone” if he went to wano alone he’s be picking up the scraps of the after math as admirals always do. Didn’t make a move on wano when only Kaido was there but when Kaido and BM made an alliance he had the courage? Non sense.

 If Kizaru went to Wano with the mindset of attacking, BM and Kaido would have busted his ass and we’d be seeing a new pika pika no mi user.

Reactions: Winner 4


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## A Optimistic (Aug 14, 2022)

wow oda really loves shanks

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## Chrono (Aug 14, 2022)

Mawt said:


> Admirals need to prove they can beat non weakened YC1 before they can step up to actual top tier opponents



Blackbeard and his gang were worth far more than a YC1 and they ran faster than the speed of light when Akainu came knocking for them.

--------

This is a non-cannon movie. If we were to use movies as cannon now, Pre Timeskip Luffy wouldve already defeated the eqivalent of Kaido and Big Mom.....that being Shiki. This movie is meaningless.

Only thing cannon as far is Shanks and HIS CREW driving out an Admiral. Which is logical since a Yonko Crew > Admiral

Reactions: Like 1


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## TheOmega (Aug 14, 2022)

BladeofTheMorning said:


> Admirals are a force to be reckoned with and they give Yonkou high diff (mid spectrum) at least to any Yonko.
> 
> *However I don’t understand the hype train for Kizaru* too much. I like the guy. But in Marine for he took shots at Marco while the former was cuffed by sea stone, then he was trolling a sick dying WB, woop dee doo.
> 
> ...


The fruit, man. The Light drip is just *too fuckin clean*. Fast as fuck & he's a fuckin troll lmaoo. Out of all logia abilities thus far, his and Enels are the ones I would want.

Kizaru feels like what an Admiral should feel like. He's fast enough to arrive on the scene and chase enemies, he can fly like some sort of super hero, he can shoot lasers on some law enforcement shit and he even takes his time with shit to make a point. Overall 10/10 character, even if ends up getting punked half the time lol

Reactions: Like 2


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## jesusus (Aug 14, 2022)

Akainu went 1v1 against an enraged Whitebeard

Big Mom slipped on soap and got negged by a waterfall

The debate wasn't baseless thus. Admirals had strong showings for a while until the worlds strongest photosynthesis man jobbed on duty to make Oda's favs, the fodder, look good as usual in post-skip writing 

No one is immune to becoming a gag character in the husk of post-timeskip

You all should jump on board the Krusty the Clown ship as your favs will be twerking and jobbing to Raizou in a few years

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 6


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## trance (Aug 14, 2022)

(fuck OP movies)

but yes, the yonko are better

chapter 1055 was overwhelming proof of that


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## Chip Skylark (Aug 14, 2022)

Ezekjuninor said:


> There was a lot of admiral>yonkou fans before Wano finished. It’s only now that some of them are backing down.


"_Admirals will come later than the Yonko so they're obviously going to be stronger! It's basic story telling, Yonko are entry level!_"

"_The sooner you accept that the Admirals are above and superior to the Yonks, the better your chances of not obtaining a heart attack when the admirals get their screentime!_"



(actual quotes that aged really well)

Reactions: Funny 7 | Winner 1


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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

Chip Skylark said:


> "_Admirals will come later than the Yonko so they're obviously going to be stronger! It's basic story telling, Yonko are entry level!_"
> 
> "_The sooner you accept that the Admirals are above and superior to the Yonks, the better your chances of not obtaining a heart attack when the admirals get their screentime!_"
> 
> ...

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Santoryu (Aug 14, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> wow oda really loves shanks



I told you and this section many years ago but you guys didn't listen

Reactions: Winner 1 | Friendly 1


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## Turrin (Aug 14, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> And just like that, the careers of The Admiral Band Has officially ended.
> 
> @Mawt
> @Tsukuyomi
> ...


As if BM and Buggy would also shit themselves over Shanks.

Shanks >= Akainu >>> Admiral >= BM >= Buggy

Reactions: Funny 3 | Neutral 1 | Lewd 1 | Tier Specialist 3


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## AmitDS (Aug 14, 2022)

Big Mom invaded Kaido's territory, Kaido freed her to fight her fair and square, Shanks and WB clashed, Kaido tried to confront WB and ended up clashing with Shanks. Face it. No emperor was ever going to react to another emperor the way they're having the admirals react to Shanks (and Kaido) recently. You can bring up BM to divert attention from the admirals all you want, *we all know Big Mom, Kaido and WB were not going to react to Shanks like this.*

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 6 | Winner 5


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## macrie69 (Aug 14, 2022)

Shank's Haki literally KO'ed half the people in the movie theatre.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## T-Bag (Aug 14, 2022)

Ushiromiya Battler said:


> Here


BM was luffy's first *top tier* opponent who they were _serious _about taking down.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Sablés (Aug 14, 2022)

Turrin said:


> As if BM and Buggy would also shit themselves over Shanks.


BM > Admirals
Buggy is the exception. He will never see Shanks as anything more than his old annoying cabin buddy despite the overwhelming difference in reputation and influence. That's one of the greatest parts of Buggy's character. He's an emotional guy and not just a walking meme.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Chip Skylark (Aug 14, 2022)

T-Bag said:


> BM was luffy's first top tier opponent who they were serious about taking down.
> 
> Luffy hasn't challenged a serious Admiral yet.


They had fought both Aokiji and Kizaru as a crew by that point. Robin would naturally be considering them as well since they were legitimate opponents.

The admirals may have not been serious, but you'd be kidding yourself if you were to argue that the crew wasn't seriously fighting.

Reactions: Winner 5


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## T-Bag (Aug 14, 2022)

Chip Skylark said:


> They had fought both Aokiji and Kizaru as a crew by that point. Robin would naturally be considering them as well since they were legitimate opponents.
> 
> The admirals may have not been serious, but you'd be kidding yourself if you were to argue that the crew wasn't seriously fighting.


Robin is clearly referring to opponents luffy has taken down.

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## Chip Skylark (Aug 14, 2022)

T-Bag said:


> Robin is clearly referring to opponents luffy has taken down. The admirals don't count, they're waiting at the top.


nah, you definitely just want to believe that for your own reasons. there was no such specification in robin's dialogue.

"*any* of our opponents" is clearly a general statement that encompasses everyone they've fought.

Reactions: Winner 6


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## TheOmega (Aug 14, 2022)

Turrin said:


> As if BM and Buggy would also shit themselves over Shanks.
> 
> Shanks >= Akainu >>> Admiral >= BM >= Buggy


That redpup > yonks shit you was on faded fast huh

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Inferno Jewls (Aug 14, 2022)

That old fat bitch is the weakest

Reactions: Funny 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## TheOmega (Aug 14, 2022)

T-Bag said:


> Robin is clearly referring to opponents luffy has taken down.


Are you fucking kidding me right now?

Robin was the one who fuckin introduced us to the power of the Admirals lmao



She's got PTSD from Aokiji and the crew collectively has PTSD from Kizaru and Luffy from Akainu and you think that Robin & Luffy don't know about the Admirals? Are you reading 3piece or something?

If anyone is qualified to make the statement it's Robin

Reactions: Winner 3 | Tier Specialist 1


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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

Sablés said:


> The outliers of the Yonko were Whitebeard and Kaido. BB is liable to surpass them both. If you think Shanks is on that level...well, that would make Big Mom the (negative) outlier, no?





Ushiromiya Battler said:


> Here


Nice to see people who have proper reading comprehension.

Only reason Kaido couldn't become PK is because his crew was too weak & he hadn't reached his prime during Old Gen Era. Only reason Primemom couldn't become PK is because of her crew being too weak & having the same era as Primebeard & Roger. She was their tier but weaker. People forget before Roger found One Piece he was also just a mere Ruler like Yonko. Finding it didn't magically jump him up a tier. PK & Yonko are essentially the same tier.


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## T-Bag (Aug 14, 2022)

Chip Skylark said:


> nah, you definitely just want to believe that for your own reasons. there was no such specification in robin's dialogue.
> 
> "*any* of our opponents" is clearly a general statement that encompasses everyone they've fought.


It's evidently clear that Big Mom was going to be Strawhat's  first top tier that they were going to gun down as a crew.

Like you don't actually believe Big mom is on a_ completely different level_ than a marine admiral right? Please tell me you dont

Reactions: Tier Specialist 2


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## Ushiromiya Battler (Aug 14, 2022)

T-Bag said:


> BM was luffy's first *top tier* opponent who they were _serious _about taking down.


That's not what Robin said, don't put words in her mouth.

Reactions: Like 1


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## T-Bag (Aug 14, 2022)

Context people, context. The agendas are clouding comprehension.

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## Ushiromiya Battler (Aug 14, 2022)

Agenda people, agenda. Her words are destroying agenda.

Reactions: Funny 3 | Winner 4


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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

LMAO people still cleaving to Akainu like he's somehow massively stronger than his peers all of a sudden when his portrayal implied he's at best a tier above them if even. Love to see the agenda. What happened to Admirals give Akainu low-extreme or very high diff? Keep that same Magma energy.

On another note I'm now starting to believe Primebeard & Roger just might can solo 3 Admirals like those Yonko fans were saying all those yrs ago. I used to think they were slow but now looks like we were. Shanks literally showed he can solo 2 Admirals.


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## T-Bag (Aug 14, 2022)

Ushiromiya Battler said:


> Agenda people, agenda. Her words are destroying agenda.


"Completely different level" is the gap between BM and Crocodile, BM and Gekko Moria, BM and Doflamingo, BM and Katakuri etc. you get it.
*Not* BM and Sakazuki, BM and Aokiji ..

It's not that serious bro

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## Ushiromiya Battler (Aug 14, 2022)

T-Bag said:


> "Completely different level" is the gap between BM and Crocodile, BM and Gekko Moria, BM and Doflamingo, BM and Katakuri etc. you get it.
> *Not* BM and Sakazuki, BM and Aokiji ..
> 
> It's not that serious bro


That's your own selective bias.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## T-Bag (Aug 14, 2022)

Ushiromiya Battler said:


> That's your own selective bias.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Gokou08 (Aug 14, 2022)

Grinningfox said:


> Niggas bring Kizaru trolling like he didn’t get knocked to his knees by COC is crazy


But he didn't???


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## ShWanks (Aug 14, 2022)

T-Bag said:


> "Completely different level" is the gap between BM and Crocodile, BM and Gekko Moria, BM and Doflamingo, BM and Katakuri etc. you get it.
> *Not* BM and Sakazuki, BM and Aokiji ..
> 
> It's not that serious bro


It is scaling BM to Shanks who low diffed Kizaru in seconds who scales to Kuzan & Akainu.


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## Van Basten (Aug 14, 2022)

It was over after Shanks’ ACOC blast at Greenbull, not some filler event from a movie.

Come on now.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## T-Bag (Aug 14, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> It is scaling BM to Shanks who low diffed Kizaru in seconds who scales to Kuzan & Akainu.



now YOU'RE next level. Yonko aint got shit on you fam.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Ushiromiya Battler (Aug 14, 2022)

T-Bag said:


> now YOU'RE next level. Yonko aint got shit on you fam.


Buddy, just join the Yonko bros

Reactions: Funny 1


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## T-Bag (Aug 14, 2022)

Ushiromiya Battler said:


> Buddy, just join the Yonko bros


I will ally temporarily with blackbeard

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Chip Skylark (Aug 14, 2022)

T-Bag said:


> "Completely different level" is the gap between BM and Crocodile, BM and Gekko Moria, BM and Doflamingo, BM and Katakuri etc. you get it.
> *Not* BM and Sakazuki, BM and Aokiji ..
> 
> It's not that serious bro


T-Bag's personal interpretation of "completely different level" isn't exactly "context" that would allow you to reasonably dismiss the implication of Robin's dialogue. 



T-Bag said:


> It's evidently clear that Big Mom was going to be Strawhat's  first top tier that they were going to gun down as a crew.
> 
> Like you don't actually believe Big mom is on a_ completely different level_ than a marine admiral right? Please tell me you dont


Speaking of context, in that scene the Straw Hats weren't even planning on taking down Big Mom. It was in Zou. Luffy simply wanted to retrieve Sanji, and Robin was warning Luffy to tread carefully on Big Mom's territory.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## T-Bag (Aug 14, 2022)

Chip Skylark said:


> T-Bag's personal interpretation of "completely different level" isn't exactly "context" that would allow you to reasonably dismiss the implication of Robin's dialogue.
> 
> 
> Speaking of context, in that scene the Straw Hats weren't even planning on taking down Big Mom. It was in Zou. Luffy simply wanted to retrieve Sanji, and Robin was warning Luffy to tread carefully on Big Mom's territory.


lol whatever believe what you like. Minds have been made up, I'm only bringing some logic to your awareness.


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## TheOmega (Aug 15, 2022)

TheOmega said:


> The way Old Sick Heartstabbed Heart Attack Magma Freebies WB 2 shotted the dog shit outta redbitch always settled the issue for me
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm still not sure what's worse..

The !!!? Showing how scared and confused akainu was

The helplessness of akainu's frail frame warping from the impact 

The "you lil bitch" look WB is givin him

Or the "somebody please give me some pain killers" look akainu gor on his face lol

Either of these is crazy enough but all 4 together? Sheeeit

Reactions: Funny 2


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## ShWanks (Aug 15, 2022)

TheOmega said:


> I'm still not sure what's worse..
> 
> The !!!? Showing how scared and confused akainu was
> 
> ...


Lol had WB not had that heart attack mid fight WB would've dusted him. WB was laughing him off before it.

Reactions: Like 4


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## TheOmega (Aug 15, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> Lol had WB not had that heart attack mid fight WB would've dusted him. WB was laughing him off before it.


And even with the heart attacks he still came out bullying the fuck outta him. That shit is crazy. Plot had all the nerfs possible and he still 2 pieced old boy lmao. It was like those boss fights in the game where the boss is supposed to win but you end up wrecking them instead.

Actual footage from WB vs Akainu lmaoo

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

Sablés said:


> BM > Admirals
> Buggy is the exception. He will never see Shanks as anything more than his old annoying cabin buddy despite the overwhelming difference in reputation and influence. That's one of the greatest parts of Buggy's character. He's an emotional guy and not just a walking meme.


What has BM shown that puts her over the Admirals? GB performed much better then her against Top Commander Fighters.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Sablés (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> What has BM shown that puts her over the Admirals? GB performed much better then her against Top Commander Fighters.


What have the admirals shown that puts her above Big Mom? Beating up relative/injured fodder that she could trivialize herself?

Story calls her stronger than the admirals the crew faced before. Good enough for me

Reactions: Like 2 | Winner 4


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## Ezekjuninor (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> GB performed much better then her against Top Commander Fighters.


Greenbull defeated an injured King and Queen off-panel while BM without haki or abilities stomped a fresh Queen in 2 hits.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Sablés (Aug 15, 2022)

Ezekjuninor said:


> Greenbull defeated an injured King and Queen off-panel while BM without haki or abilities stomped a fresh Queen in 2 hits.


I mean he's sort of deflecting using a non-sequitur anyway.
His argument depends on BM being weaker than the admirals. I was just explaining that a simple rationale is that BM won't be afraid of Shanks because she's stronger than the admirals. Whether or not that's the case, it's his job to refute that and support his original claim.

Typical Turrin.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Funny 1 | Winner 1


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## trance (Aug 15, 2022)

BM is weaker than akainu

yes i am being irrational in saying this


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## Ezekjuninor (Aug 15, 2022)

trance said:


> BM is weaker than akainu
> 
> yes i am being irrational in saying this


I mean that is possible but it’s pretty obvious that Akainu will be stronger than the other admirals. He also holds the rank of fleet admiral not admiral. Personally I have them on the same level.


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

Sablés said:


> What have the admirals shown that puts her above Big Mom? Beating up relative/injured fodder that she could trivialize herself?
> 
> Story calls her stronger than the admirals the crew faced before. Good enough for me


K/Q/Backup > Marco. She indicated Marco is a tough fight for her. You can say K/Q were injured but Injuries rarely effect someone as strong as K/Q performance in One Piece and they had the elemental advantage over GB. Plus even if I grant them pushing GB to Mid diff when fully healed, that means GB is still beating them with a similar Diff to BM beating Marco, so GB >= BM. 

Kizaru checked Raleigh who is off the same generation and legendary status as BM. Raleigh vs BM I lean towards Raleigh, but even if we give it to BM it’s extreme diff; and it can be argued Kizaru had the edge on Raleigh. So Kizaru >= BM, also fits what the story has shown.

Fujitora took on DR Sabo and had the edge. DR Sabo is also around Top Tier level given that even Pre-Mera Fruit he was able to crush a YC1 (Burgess) and was already second in command of the Revos above Ivankor who is easily Top Commander level herself; so Post Mera he is Top Tier. Fujitora being >= Top Tier puts him also >= BM, who is among the weakest Top Tiers herself.
——
Where does the story ever say that

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## Sablés (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> K/Q/Backup > Marco.


I'm not down for non-sequiturs and A > B > C logic. You need to definitively prove Big Mom's weaker than the admirals, not give me scenarios with a ton of asterisks behind them.

Rayleigh has nothing to do with Big Mom either.



Turrin said:


> Where does the story ever say that






Ushiromiya Battler said:


> Here


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## trance (Aug 15, 2022)

Ezekjuninor said:


> I mean that is possible but it’s pretty obvious that Akainu will be stronger than the other admirals. He also holds the rank of fleet admiral not admiral. Personally I have them on the same level.


lets be honest, its very unlikely to happen lol

i just willingly let my disdain for BM override my sense of logical reasoning

for akainu to be stronger than BM, he'd have to be a good 2 or 3 times stronger than his admirals


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

Ezekjuninor said:


> Greenbull defeated an injured King and Queen off-panel while BM without haki or abilities stomped a fresh Queen in 2 hits.


Queen got back up, she wasn’t defeated. 

K/Q/Backup >>> Queen.

GB Feat is still better.
—
Though if you prefer we can look at how Roof Top 3-4 gave BM extreme amount of trouble,  a group of fighters also much weaker then K/Q.
—-
The point being BM does not have any feats you can point to that are Better then the Admirals and the only characters cleanly above the Admirals are also above BM. So I think it’s pretty fair to place Admiral >=~ BM

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

Sablés said:


> I'm not down for non-sequiturs and A > B > C logic. You need to definitively prove Big Mom's weaker than the admirals, not give me scenarios with a ton of asterisks behind them.
> 
> Rayleigh has nothing to do with Big Mom either.


There is no way you can definitively prove BM is stronger ether; as no definitive statement has ever been made that BM is above the Admirals ether. The only thing we can look at is how they performed in terms of feats and portrayal. 

A/B/C logic works fine unless someone is a type mismatch for someone else. If anything GB was at the type disadvantage against King due to King Fire abilities. So A/B/C logic actually hurts GB here not BM.

Raleigh matters because it speaks to portrayal, Kizaru was clearly portrayed as someone who could take on these old legend from BM’s era. BM is the same type of legendary Pirate as Raleigh. As such Kizaru being able to take her on fits his potrayal.

—-
Robin is saying that because they never took on an Admiral directly before. They have always just run form Admirals or tried to circumvent them. As opposed to declaring war against BM.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Ezekjuninor (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> Queen got back up, she wasn’t defeated.
> 
> K/Q/Backup >>> Queen.
> 
> GB Feat is still better.


BM stomped a fresh Queen while heavily nerfed. We don’t know how long Greenbull fought K/Q for or how much trouble they gave him other than he wasn’t injured.


Turrin said:


> Though if you prefer we can look at how Roof Top 3-4 gave BM extreme amount of trouble, a group of fighters also much weaker then K/Q.


Rooftop 4 are FAR stronger than an injured King/Queen and they didn’t even injure BM at all. She just underestimated them and didn’t realise she had been pushed off of Onigashima. 


Turrin said:


> The point being BM does not have any feats you can point to that are Better then the Admirals and the only characters cleanly above the Admirals are also above BM. So I think it’s pretty fair to place Admiral >=~ BM


BM fought equally with Kaido for 2 to 3 days, BM has split the skies, BM was an emperor of the seas for decades, BM performed better against Marco than Kizaru did despite being at a significant DF disadvantage.

The only feat you’re using to try prove admirals>BM is Greenbull defeating a heavily injured King/Queen, something that BM could replicate based off of her other feats.

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## Strobacaxi (Aug 15, 2022)

Sablés said:


> How was it even a debate after this?


Admiral gang are the masters of cope for  reason


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## JustSumGuy (Aug 15, 2022)

trance said:


> lets be honest, its very unlikely to happen lol
> 
> i just willingly let my disdain for BM override my sense of logical reasoning
> 
> for akainu to be stronger than BM, he'd have to be a good 2 or 3 times stronger than his admirals


I mean, its possible considering one of his admirals is a Akainu meat rider desperate for his approval.


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 15, 2022)

There were so many points in the story where this was obvious. To be frank, Oda had to dumb it down tremendously with GB and Shanks, and Shanks in movie Red for these admiral fans to finally start living in reality. It's unfortunate that Oda had to go to those lengths but when you have people like YellowCosmos writing dissertations of cope, you leave the author no choice.

Reactions: Like 5 | Dislike 1


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## TheWiggian (Aug 15, 2022)

Yonko fans working with filler content once again

Reactions: Funny 3


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## RossellaFiamingo (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> There is no way you can definitively prove BM is stronger ether; as no definitive statement has ever been made that BM is above the Admirals ether. The only thing we can look at is how they performed in terms of feats and portrayal.
> 
> A/B/C logic works fine unless someone is a type mismatch for someone else. If anything GB was at the type disadvantage against King due to King Fire abilities. So A/B/C logic actually hurts GB here not BM.
> 
> ...

Reactions: Funny 9


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## Bouki (Aug 15, 2022)

TheWiggian said:


> Yonko fans working with filler content once again


If they wanna play that game

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## trance (Aug 15, 2022)

JustSumGuy said:


> I mean, its possible considering one of his admirals is a Akainu meat rider desperate for his approval.


didn't you hear? Admiral Ryokugyu is now Lieutenant Commander Aramaki


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## Sablés (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> There is no way you can definitively prove BM is stronger ether;


That's the best part. I don't have to.
You do, because you started this by using BM as a crux for your argument of the admirals vs Shanks.  



Turrin said:


> Robin is saying that because they never took on an Admiral directly before. They have always just run form Admirals or tried to circumvent them. As opposed to declaring war against BM.


This is cope and inference. Robin said she was on a completely different level than their prior opponents. Were the admirals opponents for the SHs? Yes they were, so they're included.

Ballsy of you to say that they were running from the admirals when Luffy specifically chose to confront Fujitora

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

RossellaFiamingo said:


>


Thanks for your opinion dupe account

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## RossellaFiamingo (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> Thanks for your opinion dupe account


 Whose dupe am I? I'm really curious about the person living rent-free in your head to accuse me of being a dupe.


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## Ezekjuninor (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> Kizaru checked Raleigh who is off the same generation and legendary status as BM. Raleigh vs BM I lean towards Raleigh, but even if we give it to BM it’s extreme diff; and it can be argued Kizaru had the edge on Raleigh. So Kizaru >= BM, also fits what the story has shown.


You’re comparing an old Rayleigh who hasn’t fought in years to BM. The idea that that version of Rayleigh is as strong as BM is ridiculous.


Turrin said:


> Fujitora took on DR Sabo and had the edge. DR Sabo is also around Top Tier level given that even Pre-Mera Fruit he was able to crush a YC1 (Burgess) and was already second in command of the Revos above Ivankor who is easily Top Commander level herself; so Post Mera he is Top Tier. Fujitora being >= Top Tier puts him also >= BM, who is among the weakest Top Tiers herself.


DR Sabo isn’t close to a top tier. Pre-Mera Sabo didn’t crush Burgess at all, he countered his attack and broke his elbow pad. He didn’t beat Burgess until he obtained the Mera Mera, and he stated himself, that Burgess would leave him incapable of stopping someone as weak as Doflamingo. Claiming Burgess is YC1 is an absolute joke with no evidence. Ivankov is also nowhere close to top commander level based off of his feats. You claim BM is the weakest top tier based on what? You actually think DR Sabo is stronger than Wano Kid/Law? How does that even make sense in your head.


Turrin said:


> K/Q/Backup > Marco. She indicated Marco is a tough fight for her. You can say K/Q were injured but Injuries rarely effect someone as strong as K/Q performance in One Piece and they had the elemental advantage over GB.


An injured King and Queen would likely have a very close fight with a fresh Marco if not outright lose. injuries affect everyone’s performances in One Piece what are you talking about. It was stated that the alliance was hindered by their injuries a hundred times over the past few chapters. Sengoku had squardo stab WB at the start of MF to injure him. Doflamingo was hindered by gamma knife, Kaido was stated to be weakening at the start of his fight with Luffy to the point that he couldn’t even properly hold Onigashima anymore.

You claim King/Queen had an elemental advantage when Marco had a far bigger advantage against BM who had Zeus out of commission and Prometheus was completely useless against Marco. 


Turrin said:


> Plus even if I grant them pushing GB to Mid diff when fully healed, that means GB is still beating them with a similar Diff to BM beating Marco, so GB >= BM.


When did Marco show he could give BM mid diff? He was being held and choked by her within seconds. Marco can give anyone trouble due to his devil fruit. That was shown in marineford when he confronted Akainu and Kizaru.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

Sablés said:


> That's the best part. I don't have to.
> You do, because you started this by using BM as a crux for your argument of the admirals vs Shanks.
> 
> 
> ...


You made a counter claim that BM > Admirals. So yes you do. Otherwise you concede your counter claim. 
—-
The only one coping is you. By trying to completely ignore context. Same reasoning could lead me to argue Enel is > BM. Due to Robin’s hyping his DF as unbeatable 
—-
Luffy tried to confront Fuji but then got yeeted and they ran.


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

RossellaFiamingo said:


> Whose dupe am I? I'm really curious about the person living rent-free in your head to accuse me of being a dupe.


I think the person who needs to respond with their dupe and main account to every post I make has me in their head rent free lol


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

Ezekjuninor said:


> You’re comparing an old Rayleigh who hasn’t fought in years to BM. The idea that that version of Rayleigh is as strong as BM is ridiculous.
> 
> DR Sabo isn’t close to a top tier. Pre-Mera Sabo didn’t crush Burgess at all, he countered his attack and broke his elbow pad. He didn’t beat Burgess until he obtained the Mera Mera, and he stated himself, that Burgess would leave him incapable of stopping someone as weak as Doflamingo. Claiming Burgess is YC1 is an absolute joke with no evidence. Ivankov is also nowhere close to top commander level based off of his feats. You claim BM is the weakest top tier based on what? You actually think DR Sabo is stronger than Wano Kid/Law? How does that even make sense in your head.
> 
> ...


1-  Raleigh was considered a legend of similar status to WB, whose > BM. Do you have any proof BM has fought any kind of serious enemy for Years prior to Wano?

2- Him and Burgess clashed and Burgess is the one who ended up with his weapon crushed. Sabo was clearly beating Burgess. Burgess is literally stated to be Division Commander 1 of the Black Beard Pirates. Meaning he is literally a YC1; and he is noted for his strength even among the other Black Beard Commanders. The only one noted above him is Shiryuu, but Shiryuu is obviously Top Tier and above YC1, given his standings in contrast to Zoro.

3. Luffy and Kaidou at their most injured still unleashed their strongest attacks. Zoro with every bone in his body unleashed his strongest attack on the roof. Law at the most damaged unleashed his strongest attack on BM. And so on… injuries can have an effect but it’s ultimately minimal in One Piece as characters despite injuries can still pull out their peak power.

Plus your missing the point. Even if I grant you all of these excuses and say K/Q/Backup =~ Marco; and at full health they would give GB the same diff that Marco was indicated to give BM; that still just places BM and GB as around the same level. Which is exactly why I said GB >= BM, since at worse he’s around the same level with excuses for K/Q; and at best he is above her without excuses for them.

4. When they clashed equally and he KO’d Napoleon; and then she ran from the fight saying it would take time and cost her homies to beat him.

Landing one Grab doenst mean anything when BM couldn’t even capitalize on it without asking Perspero for help and then after he was no longer able to help her she ran from the fight.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 2


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## TheOmega (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> K/Q/Backup > Marco. She indicated Marco is a tough fight for her. You can say K/Q were injured but Injuries rarely effect someone as strong as K/Q performance in One Piece and they had the elemental advantage over GB. Plus even if I grant them pushing GB to Mid diff when fully healed, that means GB is still beating them with a similar Diff to BM beating Marco, so GB >= BM.
> 
> Kizaru checked Raleigh who is off the same generation and legendary status as BM. Raleigh vs BM I lean towards Raleigh, but even if we give it to BM it’s extreme diff; and it can be argued Kizaru had the edge on Raleigh. So Kizaru >= BM, also fits what the story has shown.
> 
> ...


these takes are so

Reactions: Agree 2


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## trance (Aug 15, 2022)

burgess a YC1?

Reactions: Funny 9


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## TheOmega (Aug 15, 2022)

trance said:


> burgess a YC1?


Turrin be just sayin all type of nonsense lmao

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 4


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## Mawt (Aug 15, 2022)

5 pages worth of Admiral Band cope

Reactions: Funny 8


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

trance said:


> burgess a YC1?


It’s just the facts:

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Sablés (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> You made a counter claim that BM > Admirals. So yes you do. Otherwise you concede your counter claim.


Sure, if you can somehow contradict Robin's claim of BM being stronger than the admirals. But I hope you know that you've just tacitly admitted your own claim doesn't hold weight unless you can prove she's weaker than the admirals. My counter-claim is independent of that.


Turrin said:


> Same reasoning could lead me to argue Enel is > BM. Due to Robin’s hyping his DF as unbeatable


No, it couldn't. What the fuck is this logic?

Robin calling Enel's DF unbeatable just means she's incorrect about Enel, not that it is in the same context as her considering a Yonko (not even BM specifically, just her status as Yonko) above the crew's previous opponents. By the way? Context isn't "whatever I want it to be so I can weasel out of a blatant conclusion".  



Turrin said:


> Luffy tried to confront Fuji but then got yeeted and they ran.


_You mean just like with Big Mom?_

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> It’s just the facts:


Shiryu is second strongest in that crew, as confirmed by Oda in the colour spread. The first ship doesn't mean YC1 btw. Get off the paint thinners.

Reactions: Funny 7 | Winner 1


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## Sherlōck (Aug 15, 2022)

YonkoSet patting each others back based on a non canon movie. 

How hilarious and pathetic.

Reactions: Funny 5 | Optimistic 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

Sablés said:


> Sure, if you can somehow contradict Robin's claim of BM being stronger than the admirals. But I hope you know that you've just tacitly admitted your own claim doesn't hold weight unless you can prove she's weaker than the admirals. My counter-claim is independent of that.
> 
> No, it couldn't. What the fuck is this logic?
> 
> ...


1- I gave evidence, based on Feats and Portrayal. You simply ignored it 

2- Oda wrote Robin’s character. Oda knows characters can beat Enel. So ether A- Oda is intentionally writing Robin as an unreliable source of information, or B- Oda is simply using Robin to hype up the current main antagonist that the Straw Hats are challenging without thinking too much about it.

If the answer is A, then Robin is unreliable and we can’t trust her assessment of BM’s power ether. If it’s B then the statement is being made in the same context as the Enel one; with Oda simply having her hype up the person that the straw hats are directly declaring war with (BM) without thinking about it too much. Ether way we can’t take Robin’s statement here as definitive proof of BM’s strength in relation to the Admirals.

3. Yeah exactly the same as BM.   maybe these characters are suppose to parallel in strength.


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## Turrin (Aug 15, 2022)

Seraphoenix said:


> Shiryu is second strongest in that crew, as confirmed by Oda in the colour spread. The first ship doesn't mean YC1 btw. Get off the paint thinners.


Yeah sometimes the second strongest isn’t YC1? Shiryuu is a Top Tier most likely and above YC1.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Sablés (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> 1- I gave evidence, based on Feats and Portrayal. You simply ignored it


I didn't ignore them. I called them weak, which they are.


Turrin said:


> Oda is intentionally writing Robin as an unreliable source of information,


Sure, in that specific scene. Everyone can be wrong about something, but that doesn't make them wrong in all cases.
What's that have to do with Big Mom and the opponents she has actually seen though? It's almost like the point is that the setting considers Yonko to be stronger than the admirals by default.


Turrin said:


> Oda is simply using Robin to hype up the current main antagonist that the Straw Hats are challenging without thinking too much about it.


Does not help your case, m8.



Turrin said:


> 3. Yeah exactly the same as BM.  maybe these characters are suppose to parallel.


You've lost the point.
We're arguing about the context of Fujitora vs Big Mom.
Both times, Luffy confronted them and ran away, so clearly the context involved Fujitora in the list of opponents Robin considers inferior to a Yonko. Let me remind you again in case you forgot: Robin is fucking terrified of Aokiji, saw Kizaru stomp the group, and knows that Fujitora is in the same class as these two. Robin has comparatively less info to work with on Big Mom and still considers her stronger by virtue of Yonko status.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 15, 2022)

Turrin said:


> Yeah sometimes the second strongest isn’t YC1? Shiryuu is a Top Tier most likely and above YC1.


You quoted the vivre card as if the first ship means YC1 or strongest after Teach. Now you're changing it to Shiryu being above Burgess which means your ship nonsense has no credibility because Shiryiu should be the captain of the first ship based on your ship rank logic.

Reactions: Winner 2


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## trance (Aug 15, 2022)

if burgess is teach's YC1 then teach needs to have 4 fruits to make up his crew being a bunch of squishies

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Sok (Aug 15, 2022)

It was over years ago with only some copium users still going.
It was dead on the ground when shanks Skype diffed GB
One piece  movie red is just the nail on the coffin

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Santoryu (Aug 15, 2022)

Mawt said:


> 5 pages worth of Admiral Band cope



TAB right now

Reactions: Winner 1


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## ShWanks (Aug 15, 2022)

Wtf am I reading here...


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## Duhul10 (Aug 15, 2022)

The debate's been dead for months even for most AW boys


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## JayK (Aug 15, 2022)

and here I was hoping for something canon

Reactions: Funny 3


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## CrownedEagle (Aug 15, 2022)

It was settled long ago when Oda give the title of "strongest" to two of them. After that it obvious to know which group is the more powerful.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Winner 2


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## ShWanks (Aug 15, 2022)

CrownedEagle said:


> It was settled long ago when Oda give the title of "strongest" to two of them. After that it obvious to know which group is the more powerful.


They won't accept it because BM is the 2nd strongest Yonko & that would ruin their headcanon of Shanks & BB currently being the two strongest. Oda literally had to write Kaido & BM out with handicap battles cuz there was no one in the verse currently who could 1v1 those two & win. Now Luffy, Teach, Shanks, & Mihawk are the top Dogs

Reactions: Like 1


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 15, 2022)



Reactions: Funny 9


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## TheOmega (Aug 15, 2022)

Sherlōck said:


> YonkoSet patting each others back based on a non canon movie.
> 
> How hilarious and pathetic.


Beats sAdmiraL gang's month of mourning lmaoo


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## Phantom Thief (Aug 15, 2022)

Admirals deserve more respect than this. Yes, on average, the Yonko are stronger, but some of y'all acting like the Admirals get mid-diffed by Big Meme.

Shanks' actions near Wano really made some waves in the community. Not sure why peeps are using Film Red though for discussion.


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## ShWanks (Aug 15, 2022)

Phantom Thief said:


> Admirals deserve more respect than this. Yes, on average, the Yonko are stronger, but some of y'all acting like the Admirals get mid-diffed by Big Meme.
> 
> Shanks' actions near Wano really made some waves in the community. Not sure why peeps are using Film Red though for discussion.


Scaling from Shanks low diffing Kizaru in seconds in Film Red says she does just that.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Phantom Thief (Aug 15, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> Scaling from Shanks low diffing Kizaru in seconds in Film Red says she does just that.



Again, why use Film Red


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## ShWanks (Aug 15, 2022)

Phantom Thief said:


> Again, why use Film Red


Oda stated he agrees with the content used in projects he's involved in. He literally said he doesn't allow what he doesn't agree with in anime etc. He gives the approval on important things before they go with it. I highly doubt Oda would let them falsely portray Shanks >>> Kizaru.


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## Phantom Thief (Aug 15, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> Oda stated he agrees with the content used in projects he's involved in. He literally said he doesn't allow what he doesn't agree with in anime etc. He gives the approval on important things before they go with it. I highly doubt Oda would let them falsely portray Shanks >>> Kizaru.



Yes, but as a mangaka, I imagine Oda is far less concerned with power levels than he is the consistency of the actual story of what's presented. This is also considered a non-canon creation, so I'm concerned with the legitimacy of any power dynamics shown in the film.

That aside, as far as I'm aware, Shanks held Kizaru up at swordpoint in the same fashion Beckman did back in Marineford and nobody argues Beckman had Kizaru on the ropes then.

There are too many interactions that have happened in the manga between Yonko and Admirals for me to turn a blind eye to and assert Yonko > Admirals to such a large degree. Aramaki putting his hands up when Shanks appeared put more of a dent in the perception of the Admiral's strength than it should have in my opinion.


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## Sablés (Aug 15, 2022)

Phantom Thief said:


> That aside, as far as I'm aware, Shanks held Kizaru up at swordpoint in the same fashion Beckman did back in Marineford and nobody argues Beckman had Kizaru on the ropes then.


Not the same. Beckman showed up out of nowhere and held Kiz at gunpoint.
Shanks responded to Kizaru's signature move, slapped it away, then chased him to the ground, where Kizaru was forced to put his hands up. You can't really deny that Kizaru was outmatched.


Phantom Thief said:


> There are too many interactions that have happened in the manga between Yonko and Admirals for me to turn a blind eye to and assert Yonko > Admirals to such a large degree. Aramaki putting his hands up when Shanks appeared put more of a dent in the perception of the Admiral's strength than it should have in my opinion.


There actually have not been.

We've never seen an admiral interact with a Yonko except an injured WB, who was clearly considered their betters in MF.
All the world strongest titles belong to the Yonko
We have Robin considering the Yonko as superior
The very strongest characters in the setting are great pirates, with comparatively little marines
Shanks vs Greenbull
Now a movie Oda supervised heavily makes a star admiral look worse than he has ever been, even in previous non-canon works where his dignity was kept.

If anything, the navy has way too little backing them at this point to give them the benefit of the doubt anymore.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1


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## Fel1x (Aug 15, 2022)

to people that keep telling movie Shanks feats are not canon:
he literally did the same in manga.

his feat against Kizaru is literally the same as against GB
manga even made it more dirty for admiral fans. Shanks CuCkolded GB from a very far distance.

so drop this "not canon" shit already and face the truth.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1


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## Phantom Thief (Aug 15, 2022)

Sablés said:


> Not the same. Beckman showed up out of nowhere and held Kiz at gunpoint.
> Shanks responded to Kizaru's signature move, slapped it away, then chased him to the ground, where Kizaru was forced to put his hands up. You can't really deny that Kizaru was outmatched.


Forced to or did so as a trolling behavior? If Kizaru couldn't find a way to avoid a fatal blow at that range, then Whitebeard should have had Kuzan dead to rights at Marineford. I don't believe that interaction would have been the fight terminus.



Sablés said:


> There actually have not been.
> 
> We've never seen an admiral interact with a Yonko except an injured WB, who was clearly considered their betters in MF.
> All the world strongest titles belong to the Yonko
> ...



I'm not just referring to physical altercations between Yonko and Admirals but dialogue and actions made when either party was subject to a potential meeting.

We saw each of the three Admirals tango with MF Whitebeard, Akainu actually showing relative parity and the others being no worse for wear after their encounters with him.

After Blackbeard obtained the Gura Gura no Mi, we saw Old Sengoku, a character many argue is weaker than the C3, take on him and his whole crew and this Blackbeard shouldn't be that far removed from his current self in power.

Blackbeard later during the timeskip, ran from Akainu with his entire crew. We saw Borsalino offer to engage Kaido and Big Mom in Wano and later saw Aramaki choose to invade Wano, confident that he could capture Luffy, somebody who had just beat the WSC. Weakened yes, but Luffy still had the massive support of all his allies.

Some may argue this is just bad hubris, but Aramaki showed the power to back it up, easily dispatching of King and Queen and going on to contend with the Scabbards relatively easily.

Yes, he fled when Shanks arrived, but he even said that he just didn't want to deal with him then and why would he when he already has to contend with a group that is likely stronger than one Yonko crew already.

I find it curious that Shanks has been able to stop everybody from fighting as well, and wonder if this is due to an incredible power or his ties with the Gorosei. Even Akainu, the same man who went toe to toe with MF Whitebeard and who's like a pitbull biting down on the chains of justice chose to back off.

I'm not going to assert Yonko >>> Admirals when there always seems to be a little bit of subtext for why the Admirals choose to disengage.

Yes, Yonko on average can high-diff the Admirals, but saying any less feels disingenuous.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## JustSumGuy (Aug 15, 2022)

I haven’t seen the movie but if the feats are canon and Uta is also canon……does this make Uta strongest in the verse canonically ?


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## Sablés (Aug 15, 2022)

Phantom Thief said:


> Forced to or did so as a trolling behavior?  If Kizaru couldn't find a way to avoid a fatal blow at that range, then Whitebeard should have had Kuzan dead to rights at Marineford. I don't believe that interaction would have been the fight terminus.


Man. When your most notable attack gets swatted like a fly and you are caught at swordpoint despite attempting to escape, you took a loss. Kizaru being a troll doesn't immunize him to this simple logic. He was made to look inferior and later sweats just from the pressure of Shanks' CoC. I never said anything about Kizaru being dead. I said he was outmatched.



Phantom Thief said:


> We saw each of the three Admirals tango with MF Whitebeard, Akainu actually showing relative parity and the others being no worse for wear after their encounters with him.


A weakened Whitebeard. And Akainu lost their duel.


Phantom Thief said:


> After Blackbeard obtained the Gura Gura no Mi, we saw Old Sengoku, a character many argue is weaker than the C3, take on him and his whole crew and *this Blackbeard shouldn't be that far removed from his current self in power.*


This is entirely speculation. Blackbeard could be tiers stronger for all we know.


Phantom Thief said:


> We saw Borsalino offer to engage Kaido and Big Mom in Wano


We never actually saw this. Kizaru can think what he wants of his own capabilities, but the fact is that he was warned against it due to an unknown army that Akainu KNOWS that Kaido subjugated.


Phantom Thief said:


> Aramaki


Aramaki literally said he wouldn't even had dared set foot in Wano if Kaido was there.  Either he's an idiot or he simply underestimated Luffy and the others to the point that he might as well be an idiot.


Phantom Thief said:


> Even Akainu, the same man who went toe to toe with MF Whitebeard and who's like a pitbull biting down on the chains of justice chose to back off.


Well, I don't think this specific case has to do with power.
Shanks is a Yonko. The Marines' current campaign was against WB. He lays a hand on Shanks pre-emptively and he starts a new war. As far as I know? Only Sengoku could give word on that. Akainu was being pragmatic by not acting hastily.


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## A Optimistic (Aug 15, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> LMAO someone tag Turrin. Dude argued me up & down that GB was superior to MF Admirals



greenbull is superior to the MF admirals

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Phantom Thief (Aug 16, 2022)

Sablés said:


> Man. When your most notable attack gets swatted like a fly and you are caught at swordpoint despite attempting to escape, you took a loss. Kizaru being a troll doesn't immunize him to this simple logic. He was made to look inferior and later sweats just from the pressure of Shanks' CoC. I never said anything about Kizaru being dead. I said he was outmatched.


My assertion is that this does not imply a low-diff fight. Yes, I agree he was outmatched, but such a short scuffle hardly dictates what the flow of an extended fight would be, especially in a non-canon medium.


Sablés said:


> A weakened Whitebeard. And Akainu lost their duel.


Akainu also blew multiple chunks out of him. Their first encounter was roughly equal until WB got incapacitated by a heart attack and their second encounter ended with an enraged Whitebeard blindsiding Akainu and the latter still got a very solid hit in. Don't think these encounters really showcase solid superiority of one over the other. Old WB > Akainu though, generally speaking.



Sablés said:


> This is entirely speculation. Blackbeard could be tiers stronger for all we know.


Sure, but I don't think Oda would have him jump tiers after he already gave the Whitebeard Remnants a crushing defeat while still seeming wary of his fellow Yonko. I do not believe there is enough of a gap between these two ends to constitute multiple tiers.



Sablés said:


> We never actually saw this. Kizaru can think what he wants of his own capabilities, but the fact is that he was warned against it due to an unknown army that Akainu KNOWS that Kaido subjugated.


In addition to Kaido himself. I don't think this had to do with Kaido's army itself.


Sablés said:


> Aramaki literally said he wouldn't even had dared set foot in Wano if Kaido was there.  Either he's an idiot or he simply underestimated Luffy and the others to the point that he might as well be an idiot.


I think, yes, he is partially an idiot, but as an Admiral I find it unlikely his combat intelligence is so low that he would be unable to ascertain that a weakened Yonko (Luffy) is far too much for him when he seemingly has firsthand knowledge of Kaido's capabilities after he acknowledged Momo as a poor man's Kaido.


Sablés said:


> Well, I don't think this specific case has to do with power.
> Shanks is a Yonko. The Marines' current campaign was against WB. He lays a hand on Shanks pre-emptively and he starts a new war. As far as I know? Only Sengoku could give word on that. Akainu was being pragmatic by not acting hastily.


Yeah, fair. I wasn't sure if people use that as an argument so I just slid it in.

Again, I'd like to reiterate I am firmly in the camp that Yonko are generally above Admirals but I think recency bias has clouded people's judgement of the debate especially when part of their argument is a non-canon film made to hype up one of the Yonko. I mean, do you honestly believe Akainu or Aokiji are getting low-diffed by Big Mom or Blackbeard right now?


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## ShWanks (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> greenbull is superior to the MF admirals


Nah, they don't tremble at the presence of Yonko.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> greenbull is superior to the MF admirals


nah


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## Phantom Thief (Aug 16, 2022)

Never thought I'd be the Admiral loyalist after so many years arguing against them lol

Reactions: Funny 2


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> Nah, they don't tremble at the presence of Yonko.



Greenbull’s performance against the scabbards and king/queen is better than aokiji’s performance agansit Jozu or kizaru’s performance against Marco and there’s no denying that 

and what do you mean they don’t tremble at the presence of yonko? Did you miss akainu going on a rampage before shanks showed up and then stopped going on a rampage after shanks showed up?

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> Nah, they don't tremble at the presence of Yonko.


MF WB never flexed an immense level of CoC like shanks did, hell he couldn't even pull off a basic CoC blast without putting himself at risk for a heart attack

MF WB is barely admiral level let alone yonko level

as a huge WB stan, i can safely say WB at marineford was a complete and utter disgrace

thanks to the gura fruit, he still had monstrous offense and legendary endurance for a man that was essentially on his deathbed from the beginning of the war but that's pretty much all he had going for him

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 16, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> Nah, they don't tremble at the presence of Yonko.


They weren't hit with the WiFi haki though. Hell Akainu was sweating from a relatively small burst of CotC.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1


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## Phantom Thief (Aug 16, 2022)

Seraphoenix said:


> They weren't hit with the WiFi haki though. Hell Akainu was sweating from a relatively small burst of CotC.


When was this? Can't recall

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

Seraphoenix said:


> They weren't hit with the WiFi haki though. Hell Akainu was sweating from a relatively small burst of CotC.


it wasn't even a CoC blast

just seeing shanks sent shivers down akainu's spine

Reactions: Funny 3 | Winner 1


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## ShWanks (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> Greenbull’s performance against the scabbards and king/queen is better than aokiji’s performance agansit Jozu or kizaru’s performance against Marco and there’s no denying that
> 
> and what do you mean they don’t tremble at the presence of yonko? Did you miss akainu going on a rampage before shanks showed up and then stopped going on a rampage after shanks showed up?


Eh, GB wasn't in a war ground which requires much more awareness. Also, MF Admirals couldn't go all-out because they didn't wanna destroy MF or slaughter all their allies. GB had no such worries.

GB fought the equivalent of a YC1 lvl character with fodder as backup seeing how nerfed King & Queen were. MF Admirals had good showings against Oldbeard.


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 16, 2022)

Phantom Thief said:


> When was this? Can't recall


When Shanks blocked Akainu's punch. Coby was knocked out similarly to others who were knocked out by CotC (Foaming at the mouth). Sakazuki was then seen sweating similarly to GB and didn't make any attempt to continue fighting.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> it wasn't even a CoC blast
> 
> just seeing shanks sent shivers down akainu's spine


That sounds even better

Reactions: Funny 1


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## ShWanks (Aug 16, 2022)

Additionally, Kuzan has Island lvl AOE for example. Had his fight with Jozu took place on a remote island with no allies. Kuzan would oneshot Jozu with his Ice freeze like he showcased he can. Jozu has no counter to it as he can't fly nor outrun it nor break it. I doubt GB oneshot injured King or Queen.


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> Eh, GB wasn't in a war ground which requires much more awareness. Also, MF Admirals couldn't go all-out because they didn't wanna destroy MF or slaughter all their allies. GB had no such worries.
> 
> GB fought the equivalent of a YC1 lvl character with fodder as backup seeing how nerfed King & Queen were. MF Admirals had good showings against Oldbeard.



I see you didn’t address the shanks and akainu part

its okay, we’ll pretend shanks isn’t a yonko

Reactions: Funny 1


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> Additionally, Kuzan has Island lvl AOE for example. Had his fight with Jozu took place on a remote island with no allies. Kuzan would oneshot Jozu with his Ice freeze like he showcased he can. Jozu has no counter to it as he can't fly nor outrun it nor break it. I doubt GB oneshot injured King or Queen.



headcanon. Aokiji can’t even touch Jozu without a distraction

Reactions: Like 2


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

greenbull > aokiji/kizaru

shanks > greenbull

and therefore…..


*Spoiler*: __ 





Mihawk > shanks > greenbull > aokiji/kizaru

I’m playing chess for my agenda while y’all are playing checkers

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

admirals needing lots of room to go all out with their fruits just proves how inadequate their actual combat proficiency is compared to the yonko

don't get me wrong, they're far from unskilled fighters but they've shown precisely nothing in regards to possessing legitimate top level haki

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 16, 2022)

ShWanks said:


> Additionally, Kuzan has Island lvl AOE for example. Had he a fight with Rayleigh on a remote island with no allies. Kuzan would oneshot Rayleigh with his Ice freeze like he showcased he can. Rayleigh has no counter to it as he can't fly nor outrun it nor break it. I doubt GB oneshot injured King or Queen.


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 16, 2022)

Ace with island-sized Entei>Roger

Reactions: Funny 3


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

Seraphoenix said:


> Ace with island-sized Entei>Roger


pokemon elemental AoE is king after all

Reactions: Funny 2


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

One day people will realize haki >>> fruits

Kaido, Roger, garp and shanks spelled it out in clear English and people still always talking about magical AoE fruit attacks in the battledome like it’s relevant

Reactions: Like 2 | Winner 1


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> One day people will realize haki >>> fruits
> 
> Kaido, Roger, garp and shanks spelled it out in clear English and people still always talking about magical AoE fruit attacks in the battledome like it’s relevant


Why did Enel go to the moon? Didn’t he know he was admiral level with his fruit?

Reactions: Funny 3


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

Seraphoenix said:


> Why did Enel go to the moon? Didn’t he know he was admiral level with his fruit?



lmaoo I’m dead

one would think that a logia being humbled by a one armed man with no devil fruit would make it clear to everyone that haki >>>>>> logia but I guess not lol

Reactions: Funny 2 | Winner 1


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

if WB had access to adv. CoC at MF, he wouldn't have needed a blindside to beat akainu

Reactions: Like 1


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

Phantom Thief said:


> Never thought I'd be the Admiral loyalist after so many years arguing against them lol


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> Greenbull’s performance against the scabbards and king/queen is better than aokiji’s performance agansit Jozu or kizaru’s performance against Marco and there’s no denying that
> 
> and what do you mean they don’t tremble at the presence of yonko? Did you miss akainu going on a rampage before shanks showed up and then stopped going on a rampage after shanks showed up?




Serious post

This is an off panel ambiguous clash and was partly discredited chapters later where Greenbull becomes the first Admiral in One Piece history to struggle majorly against Momo and subsequently flee at the mere presence of Shanks.

Using this off panel clash to elavate Greenbull above characters such as even Mareinford Admirals is fanciful. Furthermore, we have explicit confirmation that characters such as Crocodile have essentially been retconned. 

It is the same logic employed by people that have elavated Sabo (wrongly) to elysian heights. I guarantee you that Sabo will be weaker than Zoro.


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## Eustathios (Aug 16, 2022)

This thread will have aged like milk when the final war comes around

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 1 | Creative 1 | Optimistic 4 | Lewd 1


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

Eustathios said:


> This thread will have aged like milk when the final war comes around



Have you read the latest chapters?

Fujitora and Greenbull are considered embarrassments by Akainu himself.
And old and diabetic Rayleigh was relative to Kizaru Sempai

The true GOATS like Mihawk solos

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Chip Skylark (Aug 16, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> Serious post
> 
> This is an off panel ambiguous clash and was partly discredited chapters later where Greenbull becomes the first Admiral in One Piece history to struggle majorly against Momo and subsequently flee at the mere presence of Shanks.
> 
> ...


You say that as if the other admirals were put in the same position at some point. Can't really say it was discredited without confirmation that the other admirals wouldn't have struggled similarly. 

Even if you don't agree that Greenbull is superior to his peers it can't really be argued that he's below them.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Winner 2


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## Sok (Aug 16, 2022)

Seraphoenix said:


> When Shanks blocked Akainu's punch. Coby was knocked out similarly to others who were knocked out by CotC (Foaming at the mouth). Sakazuki was then seen sweating similarly to GB and didn't make any attempt to continue fighting.


Do you think shanks coc is the reason akainu doesnt leave his desk anymore?

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Corax (Aug 16, 2022)

Movies are filler. They have characters like Clown who are stronger than Shanks+G5 combined. I guess next movie villain will be Final villain+ lvl. Also in Z he took on Kizaru+Aokiji combined and they barely took him down.Yet he had the same admiral rank. Movie villains are just crazy strong.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

Chip Skylark said:


> You say that as if the other admirals were put in the same position at some point. Can't really say it was discredited without confirmation that the other admirals wouldn't have struggled similarly.
> 
> Even if you don't agree that Greenbull is superior to his peers it can't really be argued that he's below them.



I put more weight on Akainu's feats against Whitebeard (even though sick and barttered) than an off panel ambiguous clash and subsequent disappointment and retreat.

But it's not impossible that he's on their level.


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## TheOmega (Aug 16, 2022)

Yonko >> Admirals.

Anything else is headcanon/fanfic

Reactions: Agree 4


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## Gianfi (Aug 16, 2022)

Grinningfox said:


> Should’ve never been a thing to begin with


This. Mods should have been stricter against Yonko=Admirals threads

Reactions: Funny 2


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## TheOmega (Aug 16, 2022)

Gianfi said:


> This. Mods should have been stricter against Yonko=Admirals threads


The mods were the cokeheads making them lmao

Reactions: Funny 5 | Winner 1


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 16, 2022)

TheOmega said:


> The mods were the cokeheads making them lmao


Unfortunately, to be a mod you have to pretend to believe in Yonko=Admirals, or Soca will veto your appointment

Reactions: Funny 2


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

Seraphoenix said:


> Unfortunately, to be a mod you have to pretend to believe in Yonko=Admirals, or Soca will veto your appointment


so what about @A Optimistic then?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## TheOmega (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> so what about @A Optimistic then?


Gurl power femininism affirmative aktion

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> so what about @A Optimistic then?


He came in through the backdoor by first being a mod in another section.

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Gitagon (Aug 16, 2022)

JustSumGuy said:


> I haven’t seen the movie but if the feats are canon and Uta is also canon……does this make Uta strongest in the verse canonically ?


Uta is canon but the film events aren't exactly canon so in the manga she might not be as powerful as the movie version.


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

Seraphoenix said:


> He came in through the backdoor by first being a mod in another section.


ava infiltrating the mod ranks to push back the yonko ~ admirals agenda

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> so what about @A Optimistic then?



In the old days he underrated yonkou such as shanks and Whitebeard while elevating MF Admirals (Akainu in particular).

But I think he has changed his ways somewhat (but the sabo wank and by extension admiral hype is lewd AF).
We all have our flaws though. For example I know sugar is bad for me but I put it in my coffee from time to time.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> In the old days he underrated yonkou such as shanks while elevating MF Admirals (Akainu in particular).
> 
> But I think he has changed his ways somewhat (but the sabo wank and by extension admiral hype is lewd AF).
> We all have our flaws though. For example I know sugar is bad for me but I put it in my coffee from time to time.


as someone who has known ava for many eons, i can safely say he has always had yonko > admirals


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> as someone who has known ava for many eons, i can safely say he has always had yonko > admirals



That might be true but the points I made still stand


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> as someone who has known ava for many eons, i can safely say he has always had yonko > admirals





A Optimistic said:


> Whitebeard > Akainu = Shanks > Aokiji > Kaidou = Kizaru >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Big Mom



This is from 2018

If I go back further it gets worse

Reactions: Funny 1


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> This is from 2018
> 
> If I go back further it gets worse


nice try fbi


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> nice try fbi



Careers

Reactions: Funny 1 | Informative 1


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

At the very least, I will give him props for fairly rating Mihawk


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## TheOmega (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> ava infiltrating the mod ranks to push back the yonko ~ admirals agenda


Shanks/Buggy/Blackbeard style


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## TheOmega (Aug 16, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> This is from 2018
> 
> If I go back further it gets worse


Yeaa the optimistically bad takes were outta hand at one point lmao

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Turrin (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> Greenbull’s performance against the scabbards and king/queen is better than aokiji’s performance agansit Jozu or kizaru’s performance against Marco and there’s no denying that
> 
> and what do you mean they don’t tremble at the presence of yonko? Did you miss akainu going on a rampage before shanks showed up and then stopped going on a rampage after shanks showed up?


The issue with your logic is generalizing Shanks with the other Yonko, when in reality only Kaidou has been indicated close to Shanks and that was likely P1 Shanks.


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## Sufex (Aug 16, 2022)

Literally me rn

Reactions: Funny 2


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## t0xeus (Aug 16, 2022)

I am literally on chapter 24 of One Piece and even I know this, ffs.

Are you telling me there are seriously people in denial about this?

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

t0xeus said:


> I am literally on chapter 24 of One Piece and even I know this, ffs.
> 
> Are you telling me there are seriously people in denial about this?



I'm afraid so 

The corruption was so bad that my thread got instantly closed by a mod when I opposed the heinous propaganda

Reactions: Winner 1 | Friendly 1


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## Vengeance (Aug 16, 2022)

I have always viewed the Yonkou as legendary beasts whereas the Admirals are generally "just" very strong fighters, exception(s) possible though. Wasted too much time with this shit back then, but it seems it is finally settled now.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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## Chip Skylark (Aug 16, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> In the old days he underrated yonkou such as shanks and Whitebeard while elevating MF Admirals (Akainu in particular).


@A Optimistic deserves a reward for being one of the few that can change his mind.

The kind of character development I hope to see in the rest of the AW community.

Reactions: Funny 2 | Winner 1 | Friendly 1 | Useful 1


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

Chip Skylark said:


> @A Optimistic deserves a reward for being one of the few that can change his mind.
> 
> The kind of character development I hope to see in the rest of the AW community.



Indeed. Under normal circumstances you're completely right 
See it's about balance

 but sadly he's recently been propagating the obscene 'Sabo Storm'

Once this has been abated we can discuss coffee and tea


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## TheOmega (Aug 16, 2022)

Vengeance said:


> I have always viewed the Yonkou as legendary beasts whereas the Admirals are generally "just" very strong fighters, exception(s) possible though. Wasted too much time with this shit back then, but it seems it is finally settled now.


This. The Admirals are strong ass law enforcement officers that serve as the Freddy Krueger to pirates but the Yonko themselves are forces of nature that completely surpass logic and are even beyond the Admirals themselves. The Kings who have sovereignty and freedom from the shackles of WG society and law

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Winner 1 | GODA 1


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> as someone who has known ava for many eons, i can safely say he has always had yonko > admirals



this isn’t true at all. I thought admirals > yonko until I saw Kaido one shot luffy at the start of wano and Fujitora covered in bandages after fighting the revos

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Phantom Thief (Aug 16, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> Indeed. Under normal circumstances you're completely right
> See it's about balance
> 
> but sadly he's recently been propagating the obscene 'Sabo Storm'
> ...


The "Sabo Storm"?

Do explain


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

Phantom Thief said:


> The "Sabo Storm"?
> 
> Do explain



he’s big mad that I said sabo > Zoro

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Phantom Thief (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> he’s big mad that I said sabo > Zoro


Is this not the general consensus?

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sablés (Aug 16, 2022)

Phantom Thief said:


> general consensus?


@Mider T


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## Sablés (Aug 16, 2022)

If you're not on the Sabo train already, you've missed out.
It's clear that he's one of the two new gen who have a shot at being Luffy-level in EoS as the frontman of the revs and the primary carrier of Ace's will

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1 | Disagree 1


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## Phantom Thief (Aug 16, 2022)

Yeaaah, not sure why Zoro would be above Sabo at this point. Dude recently received the flame emperor epithet, is arguably more infamous than Dragon, presumably did well against the Admirals in the Holy Land, has the Mera Mera no Mi and ACoA, and is supposedly an inheritor of Ace's will, along with Luffy. It's clear he's probably on par with the Old Legends right now, if not already Admiral level.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

Phantom Thief said:


> Is this not the general consensus?




It's not just the opinion in and of itself. It's the asserted significant gap based on another ambiguous off panel clash.
General consensus can be wrong. And has consistently been wrong in recent times 


I guarantee you all that Zoro will be stronger than Sabo


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## Aegon Targaryen (Aug 16, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> Have you read the latest chapters?
> 
> Fujitora and Greenbull are considered embarrassments by Akainu himself.
> And old and diabetic Rayleigh was relative to Kizaru Sempai
> ...



To be fair, it's not impossible that the Admirals could have gotten amped by that point (or even earlier) to the point they surpass Yonko.


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

Sablés said:


> If you're not on the Sabo train already, you've missed out.
> It's clear that he's one of the two new gen who have a shot at being Luffy-level in EoS as the frontman of the revs and the primary carrier of Ace's will



Dragon was front man of the Rev and was weaker than several characters, including Mihawk (another prediction that will be right).

This 'Ace potential' thing is in no way greater than WSS

Every major prediction regarding OP characters I've made have been right.

The one I was massively wrong about was Smoker. But he's not a major player ,


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## Sablés (Aug 16, 2022)

Santoryu said:


> Dragon was front man of the Rev and was weaker than several characters, including Mihawk (another prediction that will be right).
> 
> This 'Ace potential' thing is in no way greater than WSS
> 
> ...


I don't understand what this has to do with my post. The other new gen is Zoro, btw.


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

Chip Skylark said:


> @A Optimistic deserves a reward for being one of the few that can change his mind.
> 
> The kind of character development I hope to see in the rest of the AW community.



My tier list will continue to change as long as the manga is on-going. I’ll never understand people who’s tier list never changes for years.

but yeah I was on the admiral > yonko wave until Kaido gave luffy the boink at the start of wano


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> this isn’t true at all. I thought admirals > yonko until I saw Kaido one shot luffy at the start of wano and Fujitora covered in bandages after fighting the revos


shhh

just go along with it

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Santoryu (Aug 16, 2022)

Sablés said:


> I don't understand what this has to do with my post. The other new gen is Zoro, btw.



Basically many in that thread claimed that Sabo is

A: Significantly stronger than Zoro
B: Has greater hype and potential than Zoro

The emphasis on significant.
Even if by some chance Sabo turns out to be stronger, there won't be much of a difference. Though I contend Zoro will be stronger

But I guess this isn't applicable to you since you've clarified your position.

Still. People have already decided Sabo's place in the hierarchy because of the cited incident.

It is Blackbeard obviously that will be closer to Luffy than Sabo

I also guarantee that


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## Chip Skylark (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> My tier list will continue to change as long as the manga is on-going. I’ll never understand people who’s tier list never changes for years.
> 
> but yeah I was on the admiral > yonko wave until Kaido gave luffy the boink at the start of wano


Facts.

That should've been the changing point for everyone, to be honest. We all knew an admiral couldn't replicate that feat.

Yet here we are, with many people who still haven't changed their mind even after GB's embarrassing performance in chapter 1055

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> I thought admirals > yonko


wait

i just seen the ">"

when ava was the greeneggs before greeneggs was greeneggs

Reactions: Funny 4


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> wait
> 
> i just seen the ">"
> 
> when ava was the greeneggs before greeneggs was greeneggs



I used to argue with sera back in the day. Told him his boy shanks couldn’t even defeat a fish

Reactions: Funny 1 | Informative 1


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## Seraphoenix (Aug 16, 2022)

Deathbed Yonko, deathbed commanders, distracted commanders etc. anytime an admiral looks good there is likely an asterisk attached.

On the flip side, Yonko tend to be nerfed for others to be able to compete.

Reactions: Like 3 | Useful 1


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## Sablés (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> I used to argue with sera back in the day. Told him his boy shanks couldn’t even defeat a fish


I remember when Sera came out with Mihawk > Shanks.

a deeper twist than anything oda came up with in wano.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> I used to argue with sera back in the day. Told him his boy shanks couldn’t even defeat a fish


i definitely remember your legendary duels with sera but your previous admirals > yonko stance is definitely drawing some blanks

i guess since 99.9% of admiralgang only ever argued for parity rather than superiority, i just by default assumed it was the former

Reactions: Funny 1


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

Sablés said:


> I remember when Sera came out with Mihawk > Shanks.
> 
> a deeper twist than anything oda came up with in wano.



you won’t ever hear him say that again after shanks latest feats

Reactions: Funny 2


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

trance said:


> i definitely remember your legendary duels with sera but your previous admirals > yonko stance is definitely drawing some blanks
> 
> i guess since 99.9% of admiralgang only ever argued for parity rather than superiority, i just by default assumed it was the former



I shared a lot of Greeneggs currents stances 4-5 years ago 

when I debate with him I feel like i’m talking to myself in the past

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Sablés (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> you won’t ever hear him say that again after shanks latest feats


no problem

tier lists always changing

Reactions: Funny 1


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## A Optimistic (Aug 16, 2022)

Not my fault WCI had big mom looking atrocious 

 

I was supposed to be defending yonko during that painful arc? No thank you


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## trance (Aug 16, 2022)

A Optimistic said:


> I shared a lot of Greeneggs currents stances 4-5 years ago
> 
> when I debate with him I feel like i’m talking to myself in the past


greeneggs is a alot more stubborn than you are tho

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Sok (Aug 16, 2022)

Leech eyes bros i see what you doing


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## Gianfi (Aug 16, 2022)

Turrin said:


> The issue with your logic is generalizing Shanks with the other Yonko, when in reality only Kaidou has been indicated close to Shanks and that was likely P1 Shanks.


BM has been sttated to be equal to Kaido's several times but I see you have selective reading comprehension only when it fits your agenda


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## Turrin (Aug 16, 2022)

Gianfi said:


> BM has been sttated to be equal to Kaido's several times but I see you have selective reading comprehension only when it fits your agenda


That’s fanfiction BM has only ever been stated inferior to Kaidou, so please don’t accuse me of agendas when your making shit up

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Heart Over Blade (Aug 17, 2022)

Sablés said:


> What message does it send in a story that *Oda supervised*


An inconvenient truth that the Admiral Gang don't want ot acknowledge when it came to One Piece: Red

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Aegon Targaryen (Aug 17, 2022)

Sablés said:


> Canon or not, it's clear that the GB vs Shanks confrontation was side-by-side to promote the movie, so it's a valid estimation of how Shanks compares to the admirals. Besides, admirals have never been disgraced like this until now even in non-canon works. Japan isn't as anal about canon as we are. What message does it send in a story that Oda supervised, to the point that he demanded that Luffy and the others be main characters, that Shanks can pressure Kizaru in 18 seconds?



I don't agree with the Japanese having a different idea of canon, but agree on the rest, and whether or not the movie is canon doesn't change the fact Oda himself was involved in writing the script and all, so the movie is essentially canon.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## TheOmega (Aug 17, 2022)

Sablés said:


> If you're not on the Sabo train already, you've missed out.
> It's clear that he's one of the two new gen who have a shot at being Luffy-level in EoS as the frontman of the revs and the primary carrier of Ace's will


EoS Luff Sabz & Coby are the leaders of the free world


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## Inferno Jewls (Aug 17, 2022)

big meme weak as shit

unfortunately Kaido *might* be able to beat the following admirals - _Kizaru/Fujitora_
while he can beat greenbull

but with Akainu and Aokiji only 2 things will happen

- Kaido ends up smoked out like current Kaido but instead of being in the volcano he ends up on sakazuki's ashtray,
- Kaido gets frozen like the cooler he stores his liqs in *(used to store) *

Meme loses to everyone her ass can't win a fight for shit

Reactions: Disagree 1


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