# Luffy vs. Darth Vader



## Kuya (Jun 10, 2008)

Current Luffy.
No Jedi/Sith Mind Tricks.


----------



## Kameil (Jun 10, 2008)

You think Vader needs mind tricks to break Luffy where he's standing?


----------



## C. Hook (Jun 10, 2008)

Kuya said:


> Current Luffy.
> No Jedi/Sith Mind Tricks.



What kind of Darth Vader? Pre-cyberstuff, or post-cyberstuff? Either way, Luffy loses. Force crush the wind pipe and it's over, since Luffy won't be able to receive air. Heck, give the guy a heart attack by crushing the arteries leading up to the heart. Luffy might be fast, but he's not fast enough to avoid force choke.


----------



## ?_Camorra_? (Jun 10, 2008)

Using the force is to gay


----------



## Kuya (Jun 10, 2008)

Luffy's not just going to be standing there.


----------



## Kameil (Jun 10, 2008)

Standing or not Luffy isn't going make it out of Vader's force choke.


----------



## Kuya (Jun 10, 2008)

While Vader tries to choke Luffy, Luffy Pistols Vader in the head.


----------



## Kameil (Jun 10, 2008)

Very unlikely the force is far quicker than you think within Vader's thought of choking Luffy is instant Luffy's gone.


----------



## Azure Flame Fright (Jun 10, 2008)

What's Force Choke going to do to Luffy?
I'd say crushing his wind pipe couldn't happen.


----------



## TonyG416 (Jun 10, 2008)

yeah....luffy is rubber...he maybe able to withstand it.....even his bones and blood vessel are rubber. ( If I am not misken......)


----------



## Banhammer (Jun 10, 2008)

Lol, Vader uses the force to stretch luffy's neck and then slices his head off with a lightsaber and watches it fly off to San Diego


----------



## C. Hook (Jun 10, 2008)

Azure Flame Kite said:


> What's Force Choke going to do to Luffy?
> I'd say crushing his wind pipe couldn't happen.



It could. A rubber wind pipe can still be crushed, as seen in the fight with Lucci in Water 7. All Vader has to do is hold Luffy's hands, feet, and head in place with the force while crushing his wind pipe. Easy as pie.


----------



## Kameil (Jun 10, 2008)

Still Vader possesses his lightsaber Luffy is left in pieces.


----------



## Azure Flame Fright (Jun 10, 2008)

It'd be kinda funny to watch Luffy try and punch through a lightsaber


----------



## Fang (Jun 10, 2008)

Vader can Telekentically hold down Luffy, then either simply slice his head off or choke him.

Being a Rubberman means little because Luffy still has to be able to breathe. And lightsaber isn't going to be stopped by Luffy's durability.

Pre-Cog, Telekensis, Force Crush, Telepathy (restricted), ect.

As long as Vader can hold down Luffy and choke him or slice him apart with the Force, Vader can take this. If Luffy can move faster then Vader's speed of thought, then he can easily take this.

Also in LOE, Anakin shot down twelve droid starfighters despite their faster then light processing chips and electronic reflexes in the span of a "heart beat".

Other then that, Vader has very impressive speed and reaction time feats. A 200 meter armorery was going to be destroyed just from his indirect rage because he got angry, due to Obi-Wan's Clairvoyance in the Force.

And in the Clone Wars Vader/Anakin has showcased the ability to internally crush people with the Force.

If he directly targets Luffy's organs like his heart, lungs or brain, Luffy is fucked pretty bad.


----------



## ZenGamr (Jun 10, 2008)

Vadar wins with his ability to use the force, and the fact that the lightsaber can easily cut through Luffy's rubber body.


----------



## Emerald Chaos (Jun 10, 2008)

Do you think Vader could hold that much force with... the force though?


----------



## Frogs557 (Jun 10, 2008)

Emerald Chaos said:


> Do you think Vader could hold that much force with... the force though?



a guy who without much effort TKs star destroyers is gonna have no trouble holding down luffy.


----------



## KazeYama (Jun 10, 2008)

Luffy can't get tk crushed all of his organs and his entire body is rubber. Vader can't simply crush his heart or his brain because nothing would happen they would just return to their original shapes. He could however squeeze Luffy's throat closed since he does still need to breathe and even if his throat is rubber it can be held shut by the force. 

Or he could just y'know saber him once and he dies.


----------



## the box (Jun 11, 2008)

the force dont matter 
luffy gets owned in a sec with vaders speed and lightsaber


----------



## Banhammer (Jun 11, 2008)

luffy speed is laughable against a guy trained to reflect blater fire


----------



## Lina Inverse (Jun 11, 2008)

Darth Vader uses the force to levitate Luffy to space.

NOW WHUT?


----------



## Superrazien (Jun 11, 2008)

Luffy > Canon Vader

Luffy< Non Canon Vader


----------



## ?_Camorra_? (Jun 11, 2008)

Superrazien said:


> Luffy > Canon Vader
> 
> Luffy< Non Canon Vader



Vader>>Luffy by a mile,how would Luffy protect himself from the force?This is not Enel's electricity lol


----------



## Ryuk (Jun 11, 2008)

Vader stomps badly.


----------



## strongarm85 (Jun 11, 2008)

Superrazien said:


> Luffy > Canon Vader
> 
> Luffy< Non Canon Vader



Actually Luffy < Canon Vader.

All of the feats for Vader TWF used are canon feats.


----------



## C. Hook (Jun 11, 2008)

Superrazien said:


> Luffy > Canon Vader
> 
> Luffy< Non Canon Vader



No, no, no...

Luffy's weakness is slicing weapons. Ignoring Darth Vader's use of the force, the second Luffy comes in he'll be sliced up like a cow at the butchershop.


----------



## Fang (Jun 11, 2008)

Superrazien said:


> Luffy > Canon Vader
> 
> Luffy< Non Canon Vader



No, wrong again.

Canon Vader > Luffy.

Telekenetically focusing the Force neccessary to easily demolish a 200 meter building into Luffy's head = death.


----------



## Superrazien (Jun 11, 2008)

Mirai Gohan said:


> No, wrong again.
> 
> Canon Vader > Luffy.
> 
> Telekenetically focusing the Force neccessary to easily demolish a 200 meter building into Luffy's head = death.



Movie Vader is Canon, and I don't remember him doing that. Luffy would speed blitz Vader.


----------



## Banhammer (Jun 11, 2008)

Canon vader can reflect blaster fire. Without pre-cog protection luffy would get his hand chopped off before the first blow, and because he throws like, a balant amount of like a million punches without taking consience, his hands would be turned into burnt spaghetty.


----------



## Kamen Rider Godzilla (Jun 11, 2008)

Superrazien said:


> Movie Vader is Canon, and I don't remember him doing that. Luffy would speed blitz Vader.



Extended Universe is also canon.

Even if it wasn't, your point is moot since no version of the character was stated, which means we get to pick whichever version we want.  Meaning that EU Vader would be in even if EU wasn't canon.


----------



## Clearmoon (Jun 11, 2008)

It would be safe to assume Luffy would be somewhat resistant to force crush, since his rubber abilities protected him against the Rokuougan, another technique that attacks the internal organs.....however, Vader is far out of Luffy's league, so it wouldn't matter, this is a stomp sadly.


----------



## Superrazien (Jun 11, 2008)

Snake Plissken said:


> Extended Universe is also canon.
> 
> Even if it wasn't, your point is moot since no version of the character was stated, which means we get to pick whichever version we want.  Meaning that EU Vader would be in even if EU wasn't canon.



Hence why I said 

Luffy> Canon Vader

Luffy < Non Canon Vader.

EU is a bunch of bull, we might as well call Dragonball GT canon.


> Canon vader can reflect blaster fire. Without pre-cog protection luffy would get his hand chopped off before the first blow, and because he throws like, a balant amount of like a million punches without taking consience, his hands would be turned into burnt spaghetty.


Also Vader in his suit has never been shown to delfect blaster fire with a lightsaber in the movies. The best he did was use his robotic hand.


----------



## Shock Therapy (Jun 11, 2008)

He's defeated Jedi's who could react to blasters so that makes him at least as fast as that.


----------



## Crimson Dragoon (Jun 11, 2008)

Superrazien said:


> Hence why I said
> 
> Luffy> Canon Vader
> 
> ...



Not this gay shit again.


----------



## Xirk (Jun 11, 2008)

Banhammer said:
			
		

> luffy speed is laughable against a guy trained to reflect blater fire



Musket/cannon rounds are faster then blaster rounds, waaay slower,  blaster rounds from the movies any way, blaster rounds are hella slow, you can track them with the naked eye.

From what I know of Vader Luffy speed blitz's.


----------



## Crimson Dragoon (Jun 11, 2008)

Xirk said:


> Musket/cannon rounds are faster then blaster rounds, blaster rounds from the movies any way, blaster rounds are hella slow, you can track them with the naked eye.



God fucking dammit.  I hate that stupid, unquantified horse shit of an argument.

Geonosis proves you wrong.









Blaster bolts are capable of traveling vast distances in a short amount of time.  Screw it, I'll just throw in the


----------



## Xirk (Jun 11, 2008)

I wasn't talking about vehicle mounted blasters I was talking about blaster sidearms where the rounds travel fast enough to be tracked with the nakked eye.


----------



## Soul Vibe (Jun 11, 2008)

Aaannnddd we're back on the EU =/= canon argument again...


----------



## Crimson Dragoon (Jun 11, 2008)

Xirk said:


> I wasn't talking about vehicle mounted blasters I was talking about blaster sidearms where the rounds travel fast enough to be tracked with the nakked eye.


----------



## insomniac666 (Jun 11, 2008)

but also if you watch those vids, you see the jedi hacking at the bolts and using pre cog way more than actual reflexes, honestly, jedi use pre cog way more than legitimate speed, thought they are still ridiculously fast.  As for Vader in the suit, he is ridiculously ponderous and slow, so if Luffy could avoid the force somehow, he might be able to smack Vader a new one, but that's the problem, the force will kill him everytime


----------



## Xirk (Jun 11, 2008)

Crimson Dragoon said:
			
		

> Starts about at 4:14



You still see blaster rounds wizing threw the air, their way slower then bullets.


----------



## Crimson Dragoon (Jun 11, 2008)

I'm guessing you ignored the distances they traveled in practically an instant.  And that thread I linked to detailing on blaster speeds.  

That's CBR quality right there.


----------



## Fang (Jun 11, 2008)

Superrazien said:


> Movie Vader is Canon, and I don't remember him doing that. Luffy would speed blitz Vader.



Try harder. 

EU is canon. Hence levels of canon, hence continuity. Hence the statement, " EU + Films " = continuity.

Hence 90% of EU content such as locations, events, characters being referenced in the films ie Coruscant, Wookie homeworld, 1000 generations statement of the Old Republic, Anakin's scar, Master Vos being referenced by Obi-Wan, ect.

The Blue Twiliek Jedi Master killed in RoTS? Not created by Lucas.  Try again.

And lol, I guess since bullets are naked to the naked human sight, they're as fast as light amiright guys?

As for actual blaster bolt speeds.




Blaster bolt traveling about a kilometer and half within less than a second after being fired in two frames.


----------



## C. Hook (Jun 11, 2008)

Mirai Gohan said:


> The Blue Twiliek Jedi Master killed in RoTS? Not created by Lucas.  Try again.



Wait, wasn't she originally a random jedi in the Genosis arena that got expanded upon in the EU? After all, she was in episode 2, which to my knowledge came out before any stories about her.

I've found that the process of how a character becomes famous through the EU often works like this...

Random Backround Guy is shown in the movies->A story is made about RBG->Story becomes popular->People want to see more of RBG->RBG is shown more in the movies

After all, Boba Fett has no movie feats other than standing around, being a plot device to get rid of Solo, and dying a pathetic death before Episode 2 came out.


----------



## Fang (Jun 11, 2008)

C. Hook said:


> Wait, wasn't she originally a random jedi in the Genosis arena that got expanded upon in the EU? After all, she was in episode 2, which to my knowledge came out before any stories about her.



She was created before Episode II by a fan, and later intergrated into the Republic series from Dark Horse Comics.



> Random Backround Guy is shown in the movies->A story is made about RBG->Story becomes popular->People want to see more of RBG->RBG is shown more in the movies



Not really, no. Lucas was directly involved in the NJO series, as well as saying that if he did a continution of Star Wars after Episode VI, it would be Dark Empire, since he loved that comic trilogy.

Also Anakin Skywalker recieving a scar before Episode III from Asajii Ventress, and so on.



> After all, Boba Fett has no movie feats other than standing around, being a plot device to get rid of Solo, and dying a pathetic death before Episode 2 came out.



?


----------



## C. Hook (Jun 11, 2008)

Mirai Gohan said:


> She was created before Episode II by a fan, and later intergrated into the Republic series from Dark Horse Comics.



Ah, I see. Thanks for telling me.



Mirai Gohan said:


> Not really, no. Lucas was directly involved in the NJO series, as well as saying that if he did a continution of Star Wars after Episode VI, it would be Dark Empire, since he loved that comic trilogy.



I was just referring to how I believe many characters became popular or prominent. IG-88, for example, was shown for about 2 seconds in Empire Strikes Back. In the EU, he became the fucking Death Star 2.



Mirai Gohan said:


> Also Anakin Skywalker recieving a scar before Episode III from Asajii Ventress, and so on.



I understand EU is canon, I was just saying that the process in which many characters became famous.




Mirai Gohan said:


> ?



Boba Fett only became such a loved character due to a toy of him becoming popular. He later became God in the EU, despite him being shown as a klutz in the movies.


----------



## Fang (Jun 11, 2008)

He wasn't a clutz. He was hit by the Solo character shield ie facing and nearly killing Luke when Han randomely hit the ignition to his throttle control for his jetpack.


----------



## C. Hook (Jun 11, 2008)

Mirai Gohan said:


> He wasn't a clutz. He was hit by the Solo character shield ie facing and nearly killing Luke when Han randomely hit the ignition to his throttle control for his jetpack.



He then proceeded to not show any control of said jetpack and slam into the wall, all the while screaming like a baby. Yeah, I call that klutz worthy. 

Since when did he nearly kill Luke? All we saw was him aiming at him. Luke was already doing a good job of deflecting fire, and I see no evidence to support that Boba would have made a killing shot. Heck, he showed MUCH less finance than his father. Jango managed a tie with Obi Wan, while Boba couldn't even compare to Luke.


----------



## Fang (Jun 11, 2008)

C. Hook said:


> He then proceeded to not show any control of said jetpack and slam into the wall, all the while screaming like a baby. Yeah, I call that klutz worthy.



Luke was already tagged in the hand by a random Weeqay mercenary on Jabba's barge. And the guy who shot him was directly in front of him.



> Since when did he nearly kill Luke? All we saw was him aiming at him. Luke was already doing a good job of deflecting fire, and I see no evidence to support that Boba would have made a killing shot. Heck, he showed MUCH less finance than his father. Jango managed a tie with Obi Wan, while Boba couldn't even compare to Luke.



See above.


----------



## HumanWine (Jun 11, 2008)

Xirk said:


> You still see blaster rounds wizing threw the air, their way slower then bullets.


Blaster fire is speeding bright light.
Bullets are nearly invisible speeding pebbles.

No shit blaster fire is visible but it doesnt make it slower.


----------



## Fang (Jun 11, 2008)

Actually a blaster bolt is a burst of heat and kinetic force.

More or less its an explosive bolt thats generated from being focused and fired through a chamber at hypersonic speeds.

Thats why its "visible".


----------



## C. Hook (Jun 11, 2008)

Mirai Gohan said:


> Luke was already tagged in the hand by a random Weeqay mercenary on Jabba's barge. And the guy who shot him was directly in front of him.



Boba did not shoot Luke once. Heck, he already had his blaster lifted and was BEHIND Luke, yet he was not able shoot him once. Before he could shoot the damn trigger, Luke cut his blaster in half. That doesn't bode well for his reflexes. 

Also, how does this make him any less of a klutz? He still (almost) died due to his inability to use a jetpack (Seriously, why did he have that thing on his back? It nearly got him killed, and he clearly showed that he was not very skilled with it (Only used it once for a very basic manuever and was not able to control it when it ignited outside of his control.)).


----------



## Urahara-X (Jun 12, 2008)

Well considering darth vader can choke kinda kills the fight even though. luffy is made of rubber and if being choked it dosent disable the rest of your body. also being made of rubber. not something you could really choke anways.
luffy goes 3rd gear and rapes darth vader were he stands.


----------



## Fang (Jun 12, 2008)

Urahara-X said:


> Well considering darth vader can choke kinda kills the fight even though. luffy is made of rubber and if being choked it dosent disable the rest of your body. also being made of rubber. not something you could really choke anways.
> luffy goes 3rd gear and rapes darth vader were he stands.



He needs to breathe.

He already proved this when he was getting drowned in the Arlong Arc.

And Vader can still Telekentically hold him down and slash him apart.


----------



## Superrazien (Jun 12, 2008)

Mirai Gohan said:


> Try harder.
> 
> EU is canon. Hence levels of canon, hence continuity. Hence the statement, " EU + Films " = continuity.
> 
> ...



Well thats pretty gay, anything George Lucas has not worked on but he says its canon then says its not later on, or it just has little shit like Anakin scar it is to be considered Canon. So why cant we consider DBGT canon, Akira let them continue DB, hell he even helped them with character designs, Toriyama was more involved in GT that Lucas is in some of his EU crap.


> He needs to breathe.
> 
> He already proved this when he was getting drowned in the Arlong Arc.
> 
> And Vader can still Telekentically hold him down and slash him apart.



Incase you forgot Sea Water drains Luffy of all his strength he couldnt do shit. Do you honustly think Luffy wont attack Vader while he is choking him? Being choked doesn't count you out of the game. Also show proof where Vader has held someone down to the ground and attacked them.


----------



## Fang (Jun 12, 2008)

Superrazien said:


> Well thats pretty gay, anything George Lucas has not worked on but he says its canon then says its not later on, or it just has little shit like Anakin scar it is to be considered Canon. So why cant we consider DBGT canon, Akira let them continue DB, hell he even helped them with character designs, Toriyama was more involved in GT that Lucas is in some of his EU crap.



Try again, your a broken record spouting the same irrevelant argument every single time, ad nauesm, even though you've been proven wrong. EU + Films = Continuity according to Leland Chee, who is the designator of canon for Lucas himself.

Your obviously getting pissed off that Lucas firmly shows that EU and Films go hand in hand. 

Look at the end of the Clone Wars animated series, the films take place during that same time frame, so does LoE with RoTS, so too does Lucas acknowledge that the events that transpired with Anakin recieving his scars are in the continuity of the universe of EU and the films.

Hence levels of canon, hence your wrong again. Now stop beating the dead horse.

And no Toriyama didn't. Only thing Toriyama did was draw the design for the Super Saiyan 4 Goku in GT and design Brolli in the films.



> Incase you forgot Sea Water drains Luffy of all his strength he couldnt do shit. Do you honustly think Luffy wont attack Vader while he is choking him? Being choked doesn't count you out of the game. Also show proof where Vader has held someone down to the ground and attacked them.



He telekentically tossed and choked Jace Dallian at the same time. And once more, Vader can telepathically read Luffy's mind, has Pre-Cognition and Clairvoyant psyhic powers.

He also forcibly read Boba Fett's mind so he could stay a step ahead of him without resorting to his Pre-Cog. And Fett was again later chocked by a Vader and was incapable of moving.

Luffy isn't blitzing a guy who can easily bullet-time. Now once more, since when has Luffy proven immune to be suffocated? Scans now.


----------



## Traveler (Jun 13, 2008)

Darth Vader wins. A light saber would have to much heat for Luffy to handle not melting.


----------



## Lina Inverse (Jun 13, 2008)

Testrun said:


> Darth Vader uses the force to levitate Luffy to space.
> 
> NOW WHUT?


Can anyone tell me how will Luffy survive this one again?


----------



## Urahara-X (Jun 13, 2008)

Mirai Gohan said:


> He needs to breathe.
> 
> He already proved this when he was getting drowned in the Arlong Arc.
> 
> And Vader can still Telekentically hold him down and slash him apart.



what are you on about?
luffy couldnt breathe becuase he was under water. reacting with the devil fruit he becomes powerless.
ep 73 of one piece. luffy is trapped under whats practically a mountain for at least an hour. his body would be flattened yet he can still breathe.


----------



## Superrazien (Jun 13, 2008)

Mirai Gohan said:


> Try again, your a broken record spouting the same irrevelant argument every single time, ad nauesm, even though you've been proven wrong. EU + Films = Continuity according to Leland Chee, who is the designator of canon for Lucas himself.
> 
> Your obviously getting pissed off that Lucas firmly shows that EU and Films go hand in hand.
> 
> ...



Lucas says one thing then says another, he has been caught saying that there exsists his universe which is the movies, then the EU. But something Like the Clone Wars series can be considered Canon, I wasn't talking about that Lucas had alot of involvment in it, and more so in the new Clone Wars, same thing for the new game coming up. I'm talking about shit Lucas hasn't been involved in, probably wouldn't even know what your talking about if you brought it up to him. 

You missed my point about Toriyama, him doing character designs for the series and Supervising the development is more involvment than some of Lucas has been apart of for his EU. So why is it GT and Broly isn't canon?



> He telekentically tossed and choked Jace Dallian at the same time. And once more, Vader can telepathically read Luffy's mind, has Pre-Cognition and Clairvoyant psyhic powers.



Thats not proof.


> He also forcibly read Boba Fett's mind so he could stay a step ahead of him without resorting to his Pre-Cog. And Fett was again later chocked by a Vader and was incapable of moving.



Again thats not proof.


> Luffy isn't blitzing a guy who can easily bullet-time. Now once more, since when has Luffy proven immune to be suffocated? Scans now.



Luffy doesn't have to be immune to suffocating, as long as he is not under water he will still be able to move. Being choked doesn't mean your dead. Its not like he can't fight without being choked. If Zoro can still fight after loseing 90% of his blood, I'm sure Luffy fighting while being choked isn't going to be that hard.


----------



## Fang (Jun 13, 2008)

Superrazien said:


> Lucas says one thing then says another, he has been caught saying that there exsists his universe which is the movies, then the EU. But something Like the Clone Wars series can be considered Canon, I wasn't talking about that Lucas had alot of involvment in it, and more so in the new Clone Wars, same thing for the new game coming up. I'm talking about shit Lucas hasn't been involved in, probably wouldn't even know what your talking about if you brought it up to him.



Which is why he reads Republic, Dark Empire, Heir to the Empire, and was offically apart of the Force Unleashed project and NJO, amiright? Which is why he incorparates EU into his films right?

Because its non-canon? Try harder. And Lucas was the one who had Leland Chee make levels of canon, because EU is offical to him and Lucasfilms.



> You missed my point about Toriyama, him doing character designs for the series and Supervising the development is more involvment than some of Lucas has been apart of for his EU. So why is it GT and Broly isn't canon?



Except Toriyama never said anything about the canonicty of GT or the films. Lucas did, multiple times.  Except that Toriyama doesn't care and has never said a word about continuity of the anime version of Dragonball, the films or the extended series.





> Thats not proof.



Try again.




> Again thats not proof.



Yes it is. Was Motti moving around when Vader was choking him? Or Needa, or Ozzel?

Nope.




> Luffy doesn't have to be immune to suffocating, as long as he is not under water he will still be able to move. Being choked doesn't mean your dead. Its not like he can't fight without being choked. If Zoro can still fight after loseing 90% of his blood, I'm sure Luffy fighting while being choked isn't going to be that hard.



Assocation fallacy.

Burden of proof is on you. Show me where Luffy can survive without oxygen circulating in his body. Now. All Vader has to did is pinch off his oxygen and he suffocates to death.

Not too mention he can simply pinch off nerves in Luffy's brain or wrench his heart apart to kill hiim.


----------



## Yagami1211 (Jun 13, 2008)

I would like to see how Luffy can handle Vador, I mean The Vador of all people.
Being a Dark Jedi, Vador can see things happens before it actually happens, as saw in ep 1.
Seeing how Anakin beat the shit out of Dooku in ep 3 ( Which Vador is it again ? ). Maybe later on Vador in physically weaker but he a monster when it comes to Force using.
Jedis can survive falls of 200m+, Push and shock things with light saber.

I say Vador chockes Luffy and lightsaber his ass.


----------



## Superrazien (Jun 14, 2008)

Mirai Gohan said:


> Which is why he reads Republic, Dark Empire, Heir to the Empire, and was offically apart of the Force Unleashed project and NJO, amiright? Which is why he incorparates EU into his films right?
> 
> Because its non-canon? Try harder. And Lucas was the one who had Leland Chee make levels of canon, because EU is offical to him and Lucasfilms.



Yeah cause you know for a fact he reads those books. I never said Force Unleashed isn't canon, Lucas himself said that which means its canon. Lucas incorparates EU into his films? Example please, and dont use that scar crap about Anakin thats weak. Levels on canon just proves how not high he holds other peoples canon, if EU was canon there wouldn't be levels of canon. Also Lucas has said before that there exsists his verse which is the movie verse.





> Except Toriyama never said anything about the canonicty of GT or the films. Lucas did, multiple times.  Except that Toriyama doesn't care and has never said a word about continuity of the anime version of Dragonball, the films or the extended series.



Lucas also contradicted himself a few times, and Toriyama worked on these projects he had involvment in them and you can't count that as canon, but you count GL reading books canon?




> Try again.



If you dont have proof thats fine, just stop arguing.






> Yes it is. Was Motti moving around when Vader was choking him? Or Needa, or Ozzel?
> 
> Nope.



I dont think you under stand the meaning of proof, post proof, and offical source not just what you say.





> Assocation fallacy.
> 
> Burden of proof is on you. Show me where Luffy can survive without oxygen circulating in his body. Now. All Vader has to did is pinch off his oxygen and he suffocates to death.
> 
> Not too mention he can simply pinch off nerves in Luffy's brain or wrench his heart apart to kill hiim.



Omg, I can't believe I have to explain this. If someone chokes you does that mean you die right away? Does that mean you are totally unable to move? No.  Have you seen OP? Do you think someone like Luffy would just stanf there by being choked. Again post proof of this pinching nerves crap.


----------



## C. Hook (Jun 14, 2008)

Vader could just immobilize Luffy's entire body. There, done? Or, when Luffy tries to punch, Vader cuts up his hand. When Luffy tries again, Vader cuts off his other hand. Movie Vader has pre-cog and force choke/immobilization. Seriously, just by going with movie feats Vader wins. No need to bring in the Stated-as-canon-EU.


----------



## Kamen Rider Godzilla (Jun 14, 2008)

Superrazien said:


> Yeah cause you know for a fact he reads those books. I never said Force Unleashed isn't canon, Lucas himself said that which means its canon. Lucas incorparates EU into his films? Example please, and dont use that scar crap about Anakin thats weak. Levels on canon just proves how not high he holds other peoples canon, if EU was canon there wouldn't be levels of canon. Also Lucas has said before that there exsists his verse which is the movie verse.




George Lucas stated in the interviews on the dvd of Family Guy: Blue Harvest that when he is doing a Star Wars related project he always looks things up to see if what he is thinking has already been made so that he doesn't make repeats or make something new when what he wants to do already exists.  So yeah, he has read at least some of the EU.





> Lucas also contradicted himself a few times, and Toriyama worked on these projects he had involvment in them and you can't count that as canon, but you count GL reading books canon?



Toriyama stated in an interview that he would have done things differently had he been allowed control of DBGT.  That's why it's noncanon, because the creator said it's not what he would have done.  George Lucas has said that he would do things the way they are done in EU, in fact he incorporates elements originally from EU into his works.  So that's not really a good comparison you are trying to make.


----------



## -18 (Jun 15, 2008)

Vader stomps


----------



## ShadowRaze (Jun 18, 2008)

Banhammer said:


> Lol, Vader uses the force to stretch luffy's neck and then slices his head off with a lightsaber and watches it fly off to San Diego



San Diego? why not the sun?


----------

