# Super Saiyan Vegetto vs



## Birkin (Feb 13, 2007)

This is a measurement thread, how far does Vegetto go against these characters, in no particular order.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hulk
Juggernaut
The Thing
Wolverine
Storm
Rogue
Xavier
Cyclops
Mystique
Any other x-men chars?
Captain America
Superman
Wonderwoman
Flash
Green Lantern
Hawkgirl

Any other chars?

List the different incarnations as well to the characters that have any.

New setting:

I'm curious about what would happen if we split this into two, both the manga and anime Vegetto.
Let's say we use both the manga and anime to make it more interesting and debate over shown features in both. I'm just curious =)


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## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

Any specific versions?

Because, in the case of Superman, Pre and Post crisis could win, but some of the earlier versions would be horribly raped.


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## Birkin (Feb 13, 2007)

I was about to say prime but would you mind listing the different versions of everyone that has different versions?


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## jackvynmor (Feb 13, 2007)

super saiyan vegeto would lose here because this site is exclusively for american comics only.

if there is wizard magazine official here,this will not become a biased match-up.


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## The Iceman (Feb 13, 2007)

Light said:


> I was about to say prime but would you mind listing the different versions of everyone that has different versions?


Dont use prime that is just to much overkill.


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## jackvynmor (Feb 13, 2007)

sprime,doesn't prove anything

he just crushed the depowerred solaris with his gl power ring,ressurect lois with her dna and restored the planet kypton with the help of hourman3.

just as i said american comics will always win in this site,no matter what

"biased"


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## Biscuits (Feb 13, 2007)

Green Lantern Hal/Kyle would stomp him.No PIS Flash would as well.


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## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

Light said:


> I was about to say prime but would you mind listing the different versions of everyone that has different versions?



I'd love to do that... if I could. I'm not a comic reader. Although, I do know that the original version created in the 40's would have his but whooped... several times, by Vegetto.

He's the version who corresponds to the phrase "faster than a speeding bullet, more powerful than a locomotive, and able to leap tall buildings in a single bound".

He coud lift a car!


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## jackvynmor (Feb 13, 2007)

i don't care who would win besides american comics are always the winner here


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## jackvynmor (Feb 13, 2007)

marvel/dc fans are biased,they even said that the x-men could beat dbzgt verse.


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## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

jackvynmor said:


> marvel/dc fans are biased,they even said that the x-men could beat dbzgt verse.



So do you think that the DBverse could take on Mad Jim Jaspers? He's a mutant from the Marvelverse...

And maybe you didn't realise this, but by saying that DBZ should beat everything, you yourself are being biased... and an idiot.


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## Biscuits (Feb 13, 2007)

Mortalis said:


> So do you think that the DBverse could take on Mad Jim Jaspers? He's a mutant from the Marvelverse...
> 
> And maybe you didn't realise this, but by saying that DBZ should beat everything, you yourself are being biased... and an idiot.


Mad Jim Jaspers .... he's freaking overkill!
He could create his own DBZ universe if he wanted.


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## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

Skeets said:


> Mad Jim Jaspers .... he's freaking overkill!
> He could create his own DBZ universe if he wanted.



I'm well aware. But since ram619 or "jackvynmor" as he's currently going by doesn't believe that comic book characters should be able to defeat DBZ characters...


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## Slips (Feb 13, 2007)

jackvynmor said:


> i don't care who would win besides american comics are always the winner here



Ahh another dbz wtfpwns everything poster

you havent even touched the surface of the OB if you think everyone asumes that marvel/dc beats everyone.

Theres been plenty of anime characters that have wiped the floor with marvel/dc characters

despite the opinions of a few here dbz isnt even the top dog of anime .


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## Biscuits (Feb 13, 2007)

Mortalis said:


> I'm well aware. But since ram619 or "jackvynmor" as he's currently going by doesn't believe that comic book characters should be able to defeat DBZ characters...



Manga characters don't have the 50 plus years of on panel feats and character development that comics have.

I can name 100's of Comic characters that would unload on the DBZ universe.



Hisoka said:


> Ahh another dbz wtfpwns everything poster
> 
> you havent even touched the surface of the OB if you think everyone asumes that marvel/dc beats everyone.
> 
> ...


Agreed the DBZ universe in nowhere near the top of the anime/manga food chain.


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## Kuya (Feb 13, 2007)

Light said:


> This is a measurement thread, how far does Vegetto go against these characters, in no particular order.
> 
> Hulk - *Most versions are much slower then Vegetto. But are much more durable and stronger. *
> Juggernaut - *Can't stop him.*
> ...



there you go.


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## mystictrunks (Feb 13, 2007)

Various supermen

Golden age-Was pretty weak compared to todays standard. High caliber nullets could pierce his skin,and he could only run about 100 or so miles an hour. He was somewhere in the 10 ton range and couldnt fly.

Silver/Pre-crisis- The really retarded version of superman that pulled solar systems with a chain. Had a super power for everything. A huge dick.

Silver/Pre-crisis w/ Sword of Truth - God can beat him. Everyone else,not so much.

Bryne Era- Pretty strongbut had difficulty doing some things. Struggled with safely landing crashing planes if iirc. Around the speed of sound or so as he was equal to the flash at the time.

Superman Reborn- Supes after he came back from the dead. 100+ ton range,can travel near speed of light. Heat beams > heat of sun.

Sun dipped superman- Superman Reborn after taking a bath in the sun,very powerful. Limits unknown,but he's less powerful that Silver age.

Superman Prime- Supes took a 1 million year bath in the sun or something like that. Can be in more than one place at a time,brought lois back to life. Overall a total badass. But he's still not as broken as Silver age supes. Also if some pre-crisis comics still count Supes was destined to be the greatest GL of all time,but krypton blew up before the guardians could entrust him with the ring.


Vegetto could take gold and bryne era,any other one and he gets creamed.


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## Biscuits (Feb 13, 2007)

Loeb's superman is unbeatable.


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## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

jackvynmor said:


> super saiyan vegeto would lose here because this site is exclusively for american comics only.



There are comic characters that are more powerful than the entire DBZverse. In addition, there are characters from DBZ more powerful than comic book characters.



> if there is wizard magazine official here,this will not become a biased match-up.



Actually, Wizard Magazine isn't any better overall.



jackvynmor said:


> sprime,doesn't prove anything
> 
> he just crushed the depowerred solaris with his gl power ring,ressurect lois with her dna and restored the planet kypton with the help of hourman3.
> 
> ...





jackvynmor said:


> i don't care who would win besides american comics are always the winner here



Actually, they don't. You haven't been here long enough.



jackvynmor said:


> marvel/dc fans are biased,they even said that the x-men could beat dbzgt verse.



Actually, some X-Men can defeat a great number of the DBZ warriors, if not all of them. More so, if we consider certain mutants that are not X-Men.


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## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Actually, they don't. You haven't been here long enough.



If he's who I think he is, he's been here more then long enough.


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Mortalis said:


> If he's who I think he is, he's been here more then long enough.


Think? Logic Knew who he was on his first post.


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## mystictrunks (Feb 13, 2007)

Oh now I get it. His name comes from Jackie(Id) Vjn and Mortalis.

Clever.

Vegeto can take on the thing,and the Hulk if he does it fast enough.


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Vegitto should be able to easily take most Hulk incarnations as long as he does it quickly and doesn't hold back.


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## Birkin (Feb 13, 2007)

I've always had the view that the comic guys doesn't blur away and speed hit you like since Namek saga every DBZ char has seem to have done.


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## nameuser (Feb 13, 2007)

mystictrunks said:


> Various supermen
> 
> Golden age-Was pretty weak compared to todays standard. High caliber nullets could pierce his skin,and he could only run about 100 or so miles an hour. He was somewhere in the 10 ton range and couldnt fly.
> 
> ...




first of all i don't care who would win.........

superman prime

feats:
1.)crushed the depowerred solaris with his gl power ring
2.)resurrect lois by her dna,without the dna obtained by kyle rayner inside solaris core-no lois
3.)rebuilt his doomed planet krypton with the help of hourmanIII,without hourman III-no new krypton.

so don't bring-up superman prime in versus thread again.

no proven facts about superman prime when it comes in fighting otherwise this scan should be useful,where ssj3 goku's power was felt across dimension:


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## mystictrunks (Feb 13, 2007)

But Kal-El has an immense amount of willpower. One of the greatest in the Universe,with a GL ring the sky is the limit(figuratively speaking of course)


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## nameuser (Feb 13, 2007)

mystictrunks said:


> But Kal-El has an immense amount of willpower. One of the greatest in the Universe,with a GL ring the sky is the limit(figuratively speaking of course)



prove it,the only thing he did when it comes in fighting was crushed the depowerred solaris that even any gl can do.

no proven facts about superman prime when it comes in fighting otherwise this scan should be useful,where ssj3 goku's power was felt across dimension:


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## Endless Mike (Feb 13, 2007)

Hulk - Depends which version. Most versions lose.
Juggernaut - Depowered version loses, classic would tie or win since there's nothing Vegeto could do to hurt him.
The Thing - You kidding? Loses
Wolverine - Loses
Storm - Loses
Rogue - Loses
Xavier - Depends if Vegeto can get off the first shot or not, otherwise he gets mindraped.
That blind guy that fires lazers prime - I don't know who you're talking about
Mystique - Loses
Any other x-men chars? - Omega level Iceman would win, a Phoenix avatar like Jean Gray or Rachel Summers would win, Nate Gray, etc.
Captain America - Loses
Superman - Depends which version. Silver Age, Bronze Age, later Post - Crisis, Post - IC, Superman 1 Million, All - Star Superman, and Superman Prime win.
Wonderwoman - Depends which version. Strong Post - Crisis would be a good fight.
Flash - Depends which version. Likely to win though.
Green Lantern - Depends which GL and which version. An experienced, powerful GL would win.
That wing girl with the mace - Hawkgirl? Loses.


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Endless Mike said:


> Hulk - Depends which version. Most versions lose.
> Juggernaut - Depowered version loses, classic would tie or win since there's nothing Vegeto could do to hurt him.
> The Thing - You kidding? Loses
> Wolverine - Loses
> ...


And he(Ram619) thinks that the Comics always win..


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## Birkin (Feb 13, 2007)

The blind guy is Cyclops, I just forgot his name.
And it's Hawkgirl as well yes


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## Endless Mike (Feb 13, 2007)

Oh, and nameuser: Superman Prime was stated to be more powerful than any version of Pre or Post - Crisis Superman. Furthermore, what does that scan prove? That Goku's power can be detected by the Kaioshins from their dimension? Exactly how is that relevant or quantifiable (especially considering that North Kaio, who is far weaker and has less powers than the Kaioshins, is capable of detecting all different kinds of powers, beings, and such in the universe from his planet)?. So it speaks more for the sensory abilities of the Kaioshins than for Goku's power.


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Quick someone make a Nightcrawler VS Goku thread we haven't had all the DBZ VS Comic threads that need to be made yet..........|


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## Endless Mike (Feb 13, 2007)

Light said:


> The blind guy is Cyclops, I just forgot his name.
> And it's Hawkgirl as well yes



In that case Cyclops loses.

Also he's not blind.


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## Birkin (Feb 13, 2007)

Endless Mike said:


> In that case Cyclops loses.
> 
> Also he's not blind.



Meh, I ment the fact that he can't see without his sunglasses or whatnot, sorry for the misunderstanding.


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## Gunners (Feb 13, 2007)

Hulk I think would loose To Vegito.

Juggernaugh, he couldn't kill but Jugg I don't think could kill Vegito. I guess ITing him to a remote planet and leaving him there.

I think Vegito crushes the thing.

Wolverine I think would get his ass kicked too.
Storm I think gets beat
Rouge I think gets beat.
Xavier I think gets beat.
Scott Looses
Mysique looses
Iceman don't know. As he is I think Iceman would get blown up. If he reforms I think that hurts him at the moment, not really sure too be honest

Gambit I think looses too.

Captain America would get humiliated.

Green lantern I think looses, I think he is week to Yellow anyway.

Wonderwoman, Superman and Flash. Most common versions, personally I think they loose this but I am not getting involved with it.



> Oh, and nameuser: Superman Prime was stated to be more powerful than any version of Pre or Post - Crisis Superman. Furthermore, what does that scan prove? That Goku's power can be detected by the Kaioshins from their dimension? Exactly how is that relevant or quantifiable (especially considering that North Kaio, who is far weaker and has less powers than the Kaioshins, is capable of detecting all different kinds of powers, beings, and such in the universe from his planet)?. So it speaks more for the sensory abilities of the Kaioshins than for Goku's power.



It was there too show how powerful he was, that in outerworld his power could be felt strongly from there. Not down to sensory abilities they were far away and it could be felt from without them even trying too.


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## Hamaru (Feb 13, 2007)

man that is waaay to many people. Couldn't you pick one?


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## Endless Mike (Feb 13, 2007)

Kirin said:


> Iceman don't know. As he is I think Iceman would get blown up. If he reforms I think that hurts him at the moment, not really sure too be honest



Omega - level Iceman can essentially regenerate infinitely and freeze entire planets easily.



> Gambit I think looses too.



Normal Gambit yeah, but New Sun is a different matter.



> Green lantern I think looses, I think he is week to Yellow anyway.



Not after Rebirth.



> Wonderwoman, Superman and Flash. Most common versions, personally I think they loose this but I am not getting involved with it.



That's because all of your arguments have already been debunked in other threads.



> It was there too show how powerful he was, that in outerworld his power could be felt strongly from there. Not down to sensory abilities they were far away and it could be felt from without them even trying too.



And like I said, it's unquantifiable and thus meaningless.


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## Gunners (Feb 13, 2007)

> Omega - level Iceman *can* essentially regenerate infinitely and freeze entire planets easily.



That is a possibility. If my memory serves me correctly, he isn't at that level yet. Far from it, last time I saw him regenerate from steam he needed mouth to mouth.

Full potential Iceman would stomp Vegito imo, he could possibly strip the water molecules that build him but he hasn't tapped that potential.



> Normal Gambit yeah, but New Sun is a different matter.


Yes new sun would stomp.



> Not after Rebirth.


I don't know then. I don't really know what the green lanterns are capable of, and each seperate one. Which one is Parallex and which one is ion.



> That's because all of your arguments have already been debunked in other threads.


Not really, I have coursework and an overdue essay. Debating Vegito vs Flash, and wonderwoman is time consuming Superman is added too the mixture. Simplify things ''Vegito vs Vegito, or Goku vs Superman'' threads.


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Endless Mike said:


> Hulk - Depends which version. Most versions lose.
> Juggernaut - Depowered version loses, classic would tie or win since there's nothing Vegeto could do to hurt him.
> The Thing - You kidding? Loses
> Wolverine - Loses
> ...



Wrong, your list is terrible!! Everyone on that list loses, especially your crappy Supermen. Vegetto is LEVELS above a UNIVERSE destroyer. Vegetto wins this casually.


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

How bout you show a scan where Vegito levels a Universe.


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## Gunners (Feb 13, 2007)

> How bout you show a scan where Vegito levels a Universe.


Buu was going too rip the universe, Vegito took Buu too school and back. He came in like Santa claus and gave him the ass kicking of his life.


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Kirin said:


> Buu was going too rip the universe, Vegito took Buu too school and back. He came in like Santa claus and gave him the ass kicking of his life.


Wheres the proof Buu was going to tear the universe apart, rather than what he was doing which was tearing down the fabric of space time. Which isn't much of a feat considering the paper thin walls between DBU and the other planes attached to it.


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> How bout you show a scan where Vegito levels a Universe.



How about you go on Youtube and watch EPISODE 270: "The Dimension is Shattered! Is Buu Out of Control?!"


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> How about you go on Youtube and watch EPISODE 270: "The Dimension is Shattered! Is Buu Out of Control?!"





Comic Book Guy said:


> Episode 270 is filler.


 So where's the scan?

Oh and before I forget DBU consists of 4 Galaxies and 3 Subverses. (If I forgot one let me know) Its not much of a Universe to destroy to begin with.


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

And? The anime is canon, this is the Manga and ANIME battledome. Super Buu was destroying the universe and Vegetto was Levels above him.


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## Galt (Feb 13, 2007)

Actually this is just the Outskirts Battledome.  Manga and Anime Battledome is _thataway_.  *gestures*


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> And? The anime is canon, this is the Manga and ANIME battledome. Super Buu was destroying the universe and Vegetto was Levels above him.


Hey CBG, Remember what I said about the bus? Now you understand why?

@Phenom, So now we're to believe that Filler is canon. So Chichi can hurt Goku, Goku has difficulty lifting a bus and that Hyperboles are to be taken literally... You know what, the moment you show me where the effect of Buu's powering up was effecting more than just the Earth I'll believe you.

*Points to Galt*





Galt said:


> Actually this is just the Outskirts Battledome.  Manga and Anime Battledome is _thataway_.  *gestures*


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Yeah, this is the Outskirts battledome: "Where your favorite characters from *ANY VENUE *come to do battle!"

Super Buu's power was destroying the universe....


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Those you mentioned is nothing more but for comedy. Yeah this is the Outskirts battledome: "Where your favorite characters from ANY VENUE come to do battle!"


Advocate Filler when it suits you but when it comes back to haunt you dismiss it as comedy. Hmmm... Double Standard much?


Phenomenol said:


> Super Buu's power was destroying the universe....


If it was it'd be real easy to prove you could show me a scan of it tearing apart earth, the moon, the sun, New Namek or the solar system. The event seemed to be localized to Earth Alone. Nor did it seem to be damaging the Earth so much as rupturing the fabric of space around him.


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Chichi hurting Goku is comedy and that can never come back to haunt me. 

Buu was destroying the universe it was stated and shown.^^^


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Chichi hurting Goku is comedy and that can never come back to haunt me.
> 
> Buu was destroying the universe it was stated and shown.^^^


It was stated but not shown actually. All that was shown was the Earth's atmosphere being torn by energy. Nothing else, the statement itself was a hyperbole. Just like Hulk and his 150 Billion Ton feat. Was he lifting all of it? By himself? No, just like was he effecting more than Earth? Did he manage to destroy anything? No.

Granted he showed he had the ability to blow up planets but the filler episode was filler as in *it never happened*.

As for Chichi, well I say that Colossus can beat up Goku because Chichi could hurt Goku.


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## Timur Lane (Feb 13, 2007)

Well, Phenomenol if you are gonna use high end filler showings then i can use low end filler showings as well.

Like Goku having problems lifting a bus or Gohan (i think it was him) crashing into a brick wall and falling over unconcious. 

Thats the problem with using fillers, they are hardly consistent and they contradict themself to often.


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> It was stated but not shown actually. All that was shown was the Earth's atmosphere being torn by energy. Nothing else, the statement itself was a hyperbole. Granted he showed he had the ability to blow up planets but the filler episode was filler as in *it never happened*.
> 
> As for Chichi, well I say that Colossus can beat up Goku because Chichi could hurt Goku.



No it was stated and shown, he was making holes in the frabric of space. Super Buu has the power to destroy a universe and Vegetto was levels above him.



> Well, Phenomenol if you are gonna use high end filler showings then i can use low end filler showings as well.
> 
> Like Goku having problems lifting a bus or Gohan (i think it was him) crashing into a brick wall and falling over unconcious.
> 
> Thats the problem with using fillers, they are hardly consistent and they contradict themself to often.



Go ahead, Superman and Martian Munhunter had trouble LIFTING a TANKER!!!! Flash got tagged by deathstroke...that is the problem with reading comics, anime or anything else period. Everything has inconsitencies.


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## Countach (Feb 13, 2007)

ahh just like the good old days
forum vs pheomenal


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Go ahead, Superman and Martian Munhunter had trouble LIFTING a TANKER!!!! Flash got tagged by deathstroke...that is the problem with reading comics, anime or anything else period. Everything has inconsitencies.


Except one huge difference. DBU functions on the premise of gaining more and more power thru training. DCU operates under the premise that their powers can fluctuate. They also have several different incarnations.

Not the same thing.


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## Timur Lane (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Go ahead, Superman and Martian Munhunter had trouble LIFTING a TANKER!!!! Flash got tagged by deathstroke...that is the problem with reading comics, anime or anything else period. Everything has inconsitencies.



That dosent stop me from using low end showings as proof against you, you do it all the time anyway.


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> Except one huge difference. DBU functions on the premise of gaining more and more power thru training. DCU operates under the premise that their powers can fluctuate. They also have several different incarnations.
> 
> Not the same thing.



All that you posted is ICONSISTENCY! which is what noxname suggested with the Dragonball Anime. It is the same thing.



			
				noxname said:
			
		

> That dosent stop me from using low end showings as proof against you, you do it all the time anyway



Go ahead, I was just showing that EVERYTHING has inconsisitency, you bias fanboys want to act as if DBZ is the only one with inconsistency.


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## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

Anime filler is anime filler. It's not canon. Unless otherwise specified, characters are to be used in their most accurate portrayal. Thus, the manga takes precedece.

Damn mid-terms prevent me from creating a thread to specify the assumed OB battles. . .


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

The Anime is CANON. Like you said you *ASSUME* the OB battles. This is the Outskirts battledome where anyone from anywhere is to be used. It is in writing.^^^


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## Gunners (Feb 13, 2007)

> ahh just like the good old days
> forum vs pheomenal



A lot of people........... annoy me. I don't know its probably because I see you as bullied ''Ahhh like the good old days Forum vs Phem''. Like you see it as some event or something.

And I don't see why it matters, Buu in the manga was going to rip the universe, Gotenks ripped a whole in the universe. When Buu did it, the universe was going to colapse. 

I don't feel too find an image for this. You yourself have probably seen the image already or know full well the scene I am talking about. Why you want an image I don't know.


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## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

> The Anime is CANON.



The anime is an _adaption_ of the manga. It does not supersede the manga in terms of canonicity.



> Like you said you ASSUME the OB battles. This is the Outskirts battledome where anyone from anywhere is to be used. It is in writing.^^^



Then which character is being argued with by one side? That of the anime adaption or the original manga source?


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Kirin said:


> A lot of people........... annoy me. I don't know its probably because I see you as bullied ''Ahhh like the good old days Forum vs Phem''. Like you see it as some event or something.
> 
> And I don't see why it matters, Buu in the manga was going to rip the universe, Gotenks ripped a whole in the universe. When Buu did it, the universe was going to colapse.
> 
> I don't feel too find an image for this. You yourself have probably seen the image already or know full well the scene I am talking about. Why you want an image I don't know.


Because it was filler, Gotenks never ripped a whole in the universe, Nor did Buu.


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Comic Book Guy said:


> The anime is an _adaption_ of the manga. It does not supersede the manga in terms of canonicity.Then which character is being argued with by one side? That of the anime adaption or the original manga source?



The Anime is STILL canon, you can not just dismiss that fact! I am using the anime Vegetto because they go into DETAIL and deeper of Vegetto and Super Buu's battles. The manga only showcases Vegetto for TWO chapters....Just TWO chapters.


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## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

However, you can not deny that filler is not canon to actual continuity.

Filler/Non-canon may inflate or deflate the abilities, capabilities, and/or powers of the characters, or even suggest and/or present things that may contradict with what is known. This is why Battledomers tend to avoid including filler/non-canon into their arguments.


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

That goes for everything, including comics! The point is the anime is canon and can be used.^^^


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## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

> That goes for everything, including comics!



Comicdom doesn't really have filler though. Just movie adaptions, alternate universes, Elseworlds, and retcons.



> The point is the anime is canon and can be used.^^^



The anime is an adaption of the original source that is the manga, mainly to animate the story. Adaptions can add, subtract, and/or alter anything from the story portrayed by the original source.


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Once again, that even applies to your comics as well.^^^ I am using anime Vegetto. Which means this thread is over.


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## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> Think? Logic Knew who he was on his first post.



True, but CBG wouldn't allow me to make that observation without absolute proof of his identity.

And I can't believe he actually tried it again... "nameuser".. geez. 

@Phenomenol: For the sake of this thread, we are using canonical sources (namely, the manga). You are more then welcome to make your own thread including the non-canonical versions of DBZ characters.


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## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

@ Mortalis, Thats not his most recent dupe.


Phenomenol said:


> Once again, that even applies to your comics as well.^^^


Yes which is what we've been using and what you've been trying to ignore.





> I am using anime Vegetto. Which means this thread is over.


Funny how your not the OP, so your argument is over.


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## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Funny Vynjira, NEIHER are you! So your argument was over pages ago!^^^


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## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> @ Mortalis, Thats not his most recent dupe.



I just noticed "norumots" as well.


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## Birkin (Feb 13, 2007)

It seems I got the power


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## Gunners (Feb 13, 2007)

> Because it was filler, Gotenks never ripped a whole in the universe, Nor did Buu.



Meh I always thought that scene was in the manga. I think they were as well but I am not gonna waste time of my life checkin it up. If you can look it up please.


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Funny Vynjira, NEIHER are you! So your argument was over pages ago!^^^


Actually when something isn't stated like which Vegeto, its left to the Canon version only so stop arguing for the sake of it and either start your own under your own conditions or get on topic. Since you've yet to address the topic, Oh wait you did they all loose right? Which is what you always say, how bout from now on, instead of you posting we just say what you'll say and be done with it. Then continue the topic as it was meant to be.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Nothing but your opinion.^^^


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Nothing but your opinion.^^^


This is the OP; Wanna get back on this Topic?


Light said:


> This is a measurement thread, how far does Vegetto go against these characters, in no particular order.
> 
> Hulk
> Juggernaut
> ...


Keep in mind this isn't speculation quest so only canon sources.. KK Enjoy.


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Nothing but your opinion.^^^



Her opinion... and the general consensus of the OB.


----------



## ~Shin~ (Feb 13, 2007)

Hisoka said:


> Ahh another dbz wtfpwns everything poster
> 
> you havent even touched the surface of the OB if you think everyone asumes that marvel/dc beats everyone.
> 
> ...



This is true. But it seems that most comics fights are usually against DBZ for some reason. I don't know if it's bashing or people thinking that DBZ is the high tier in anime/manga


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

~Shin~ said:


> This is true. But it seems that most comics fights are usually against DBZ for some reason. I don't know if it's bashing or people thinking that DBZ is the high tier in anime/manga



I tend to think a bit of both, but moreso the latter then the former.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> This is the OP; Wanna get back on this Topic?
> Keep in mind this isn't speculation quest so only canon sources.. KK Enjoy.



And I used canon! KK enjoy.


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

You used the anime... which in DBZ's case is rarely canonical.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Wrong, The Anime is canon.^^^


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

All of it?

Including when Goku had trouble lifting a bus?


----------



## Crimson King (Feb 13, 2007)

Hulk-depends on which hulk
Juggernaut-juggs loses
The Thing-Thing loses
Wolverine-Wolverine loses
Storm-Storm loses
Rogue-Power drain FTW
Xavier-Mindrape FTW
That blind guy that fires lazers prime-?
Mystique-assassion!
Any other x-men chars?-Dark Phoenix nukes the Earth
Captain America-Captain loses unless Vegetto slams into the shield
Superman-Superman PRIME FTW!
Wonderwoman-Don't know
Flash-Speedsteal FTW
Green Lantern


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

But Vegetto isn't evil... 

Nice pic though, even if it is a little corny.


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Once again, that even applies to your comics as well.^^^ I am using anime Vegetto. Which means this thread is over.



If anyone can choose what they wish, then I could easily use Classic Ion, Bald Phoenix, and Pre-Crisis Superman with Sword of Truth for character use.

X-Men characters, there's quite a bit; New Sun, Dark Phoenix, White Phoenix of the Crown, Shaman X-Man, "Jesus" Cable, Omega-level Iceman, etc.



Phenomenol said:


> And I used canon! KK enjoy.



You use a character based on the portrayal of the animated adaption.



			
				Phenomenol said:
			
		

> Wrong, The Anime is canon.^^^



It's an adaption of the original source, the manga. The manga takes precedence.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

> Comic Book Guy said:
> 
> 
> > If anyone can choose what they wish, then I could easily use Classic Ion, Bald Phoenix, and Pre-Crisis Superman with Sword of Truth for character use.X-Men characters, there's quite a bit; New Sun, Dark Phoenix, White Phoenix of the Crown, Shaman X-Man, "Jesus" Cable, Omega-level Iceman, etc.
> ...


----------



## Zaelapolopollo (Feb 13, 2007)

This is stupid.

Thing can't fly.
Has very limited range attacks (needs the arena for that or a thunderclap)
Is not anywhere near the speed of most DBZ'ers.

Bring Vegetable-Head to the ground and have him go a couple rounds of boxing with Thing and we have a somewhat fair fight.


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Go ahead, the bias on this forum did it anyway...Most of those threads have been made already.
> 
> The anime is canon as well you can't dismiss it.



Yes, the anime does adapt and animate the story that originated from the manga.

However, you can't deny that filler is non-canon.


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> The anime is canon as well you can't dismiss it.



He can dismiss the parts of the anime that disagree with the manga.

Besides, are you really saying that we should include filler? Because that does mean that base Goku would have trouble lifting a bus.


----------



## Kai (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> The anime is canon as well you can't dismiss it.



So Goku's power level when rushing to the scene in the Saiyan saga was over 9,000?


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Wrong, The Anime is canon.^^^


Parts of it are, not the part you selected tho.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Yes, the anime does adapt and animate the story that originated from the manga.
> 
> However, you can't deny that filler is non-canon.



The Dragonball Z anime is canon that means ALL of it!!! You can't just use some of it and then throw away the rest.

Super Buu has the power to destroy a universe and Vegetto was LEVELS above him.


----------



## Gunners (Feb 13, 2007)

This shit is getting ridiculous.

Can you make a rule or something saying when you choose a character state which variation is too be used anime or manga. Essentially people are debating which version too use in which case neither is correct. Really maturity should allow people too deal with this by discussing both scenarios but that isn't the case people argue over which one too use which is pointless.

Anyway can someone tell me if Gotenks ripping a hole in time and space and Buu doing his shit occured in the manga?


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> The Dragonball Z anime is canon that means ALL of it!!! You can't just use some of it and then throw away the rest.
> 
> Super Buu has the power to destroy a universe and Vegetto was LEVELS above him.



Do you ever address arguments, or do you always just blatantly deny them?


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> The Dragonball Z anime is canon that means ALL of it!!! You can't just use some of it and then throw away the rest.



No, not all of the anime adaption is canon. Hence the term filler.

Adaptions can adapt the material they are suppose to adapt. However, they can add, subtract, and/or alter whatever part of the story as allowed.

For example, the Garlic Jr. Saga is non-canon.



> Super Buu has the power to destroy a universe and Vegetto was LEVELS above him.



Which was depicted by the anime adaption.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Comic Book Guy said:


> No, not all of the anime adaption is canon. Hence the term filler.Adaptions can adapt the material they are suppose to adapt. However, they can add, subtract, and/or alter whatever part of the story as allowed.For example, the Garlic Jr. Saga is non-canon.
> 
> Which was depicted by the anime adaption.



I am not talking about garlic Junior which is filler because it is not relevent to the story. I am talking about what is relevant to the story. And Super Buu 3 destroying a universe is canon because Crappy Super Buu and Gotenks can rip a hole in the universe so can the most powerful villain in all of DBZ. And it is CANON!


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

I'll take that as a "No, I don't address arguments".


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> I am not talking about garlic Junior which is filler because it is not relevent to the story. I am talking about what is relevant to the story. And Super Buu 3 destroying a universe is canon because Crappy Super Buu and Gotenks can rip a hole in the universe so can the most powerful villain in all of DBZ. And it is CANON!



Super Buu 1 and SSJ3 Gotenks did rip a hole to their home dimension in the manga.

Super Buu 3 did not in the manga.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Super Buu 1 and SSJ3 Gotenks did rip a hole to their home dimension in the manga.
> 
> Super Buu 3 did not in the manga.



So, the canon anime he did, A more powerful Super buu can rock the universe and that is the truth.


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Super Buu 1 and SSJ3 Gotenks did rip a hole to their home dimension in the manga.


Which can't be considered that they can do it to just anything.. as they were connected.

@Phenom, Can't pick and choose your fillers.


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> So, the canon anime he did, A more powerful Super buu can rock the universe and that is the truth.



However, it did not took place in the manga; the manga supersedes the anime in terms of continuity.


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> A more powerful Super buu can rock the universe and that is the truth.



No, that is an assumption based on a relative power boost. If he could do that, *why didn't he?*


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Comic Book Guy said:
			
		

> However, it did not took place in the manga; the manga supersedes the anime in terms of continuity.



So, Anime is canon and I am using it. Super Buu can rock the universe!!!! and Vegetto was EASILY LEVELS above him.


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> So, Anime is canon and I am using it. Super Buu can rock the universe!!!! and Vegetto was EASILY LEVELS above him.



What the anime adapted from the manga is canon.

What material in encompassed not covered in the manga is not.

Parts of the anime are canon and non-canon.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

No, the anime is considered CANON!!! you just try to ignore it.


----------



## omg laser pew pew! (Feb 13, 2007)

Light said:


> This is a measurement thread, how far does Vegetto go against these characters, in no particular order.
> 
> Hulk - *I think Vegito could match him physically for a long time but woul;dn't work in beating him. He'll need to try and do a huge ki blast or something*
> Juggernaut - *Current Jugs is a joke*
> ...



That's my opinion which is fact because I am Gai and you are not






Dynamic Entry


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

*Spoiler*: _Phenomenol Owning himself_ 





Phenomenol said:


> I am not talking about garlic Junior which is filler





Phenomenol said:


> watch EPISODE 270: "The Dimension is Shattered! Is Buu Out of Control?!"





Comic Book Guy said:


> *Episode 270 is filler.*





Phenomenol said:


> So, Anime is canon and I am using it.






*Spoiler*: _Filler_ 



Filler can also refer to a term regarding some episodes of manga-based anime. Filler episodes are usually used to give the manga storyline time to get ahead of the anime story, as a single anime episode may use several chapters of manga as storyline material.

The fact that the series is based on a manga makes the possibility of plot contradictions all the more probable, since there is often little communication between the two groups. Moreover, in order to avoid such contradictions, the material of such filler episodes are even more limited than normal in that backstory or character development can't occur in order to avoid a clash with future, main-story-arc related material. *Some series may even deviate entirely from the manga as a result.* Also, long periods of filler can eventually lead to the cancellation of a series, which is the case with Rurouni Kenshin. Since manga artists tend to ignore any developments that occur in filler stories, *fillers often further cement the division between the separate anime and manga continuities which may be quite similar without this content, which is most easily noticed in the Dragon Ball series.*


The Anime isn't canon.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> *Spoiler*: _Filler_
> 
> 
> 
> ...



My Guns are Bigger.............Get ready to get owned....... (Go down to the second Rumor)............



Anime is canon.


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> My Guns are Bigger.............Get ready to get owned....... (Go down to the second Rumor)............
> 
> 
> 
> Anime is canon.





> RUMOR: Akira Toriyama had nothing to do with filler.


Sorry to break it to you, but we never said Akira didn't have anything to do with Filler. So again you own yourself by providing more information that doesn't support your cause. Noone here said Akira had nothing to do with it. However it states that Akira wrote some filler. Yea? and? Akira wrote some of GT doesn't all of a sudden make it usable in the arguments.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

It means, The  Anime is CANON!!!! You fail again.^^^


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> It means, The  Anime is CANON!!!! You fail again.^^^


So DBGT, by your logic is canon?


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 13, 2007)

It means that the anime is it's own _seperate_ canon.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> So DBGT, by your logic is canon?



Who said anything about DBGT, I am using Vegetto and he is from DBZ.


----------



## Kai (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Who said anything about DBGT, I am using Vegetto and he is from DBZ.



I thought you were the biggest DBZ fan on this forum, and that even you would know what he would be talking about.

DBGT is an anime only release, therefore its non canon.


----------



## Phenomenol (Feb 13, 2007)

DBZ the anime is CANON!!!! I am not talking about DBGT.....


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 13, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> My Guns are Bigger.............Get ready to get owned....... (Go down to the second Rumor)............
> 
> 
> 
> Anime is canon.



Being involved in an adaption doesn't incorporate it into actual continuity automatically, however. Unless stated by the creator itself, it's non-canon.



Phenomenol said:


> It means, The  Anime is CANON!!!! You fail again.^^^



Again, the anime is an adaption of the original source, the manga. The manga takes precedence.



Phenomenol said:


> Who said anything about DBGT, I am using Vegetto and he is from DBZ.



Indeed. However, you're using feats outside of the original source of the manga. It's like saying we're using Ryu from Street Fighter based on the Street Fighter V Anime series.



Phenomenol said:


> No, the anime is considered CANON!!! you just try to ignore it.



Part of the anime is canon, part of its isn't. Fillers are fillers.

For example, you don't see Naruto fillers being canon, do you?


----------



## Zaelapolopollo (Feb 13, 2007)

Well, sinc Vegetable-Head using all his powers is an absolutely stupid fight, I am thinking he and Thing slug it out. Thing has a great chance of winning.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 14, 2007)

mystictrunks said:


> Various supermen
> 
> Golden age-Was pretty weak compared to todays standard. High caliber nullets could pierce his skin,and he could only run about 100 or so miles an hour. He was somewhere in the 10 ton range and couldnt fly.
> 
> ...





Yeh right.

How is superman reborn going to even stand a chance against super Vegetto?

SuperSaiyan increases your power/speed etc by approximately 50 times.



			
				berwyn said:
			
		

> If you are trying to figure out how much Goku's strength multiplies when he went Super Saiyan, I would say use the manga as your guide not the Daizenshuu. If you go by manga you could say the first time Goku went Super Saiyan his strength multiplied atleast 40-50x.
> 
> Goku during the Frieza Saga used Kaioken x20 against a 50% Final Form Frieza who stopped the attack with one hand. Goku would have needed to double that and more to stand a chance against 100% Final Form Frieza and to win.



We know for a fact that Kaioken is a linear increase in power level since during the fight with ginyu Ginyu said goku's base max = 90 000.

Then Ginyu said he knows this isnt goku's true power, so goku does Kaio ken x 2 and it read 180 000.

We also know kaoiken increases everything like speed, power, ki etc. because goku told krillin: "if you get it right, your power and speed and everything just go Zoom...

(i wish there was an online DBZ manga site where i could post links)

If its 50x and Goku can lift 40 tonnes at base level.

This is assuming SSJ2 is 50 and SSJ3 (SSj3 seems stronger than 50 in my opinion).

Now We know fusion is like on another league compared to SSJ3 since Buu + SSj3 Gotenks (which is definately stronger than SSJ3 Goku) + Mystic Gohan (stronger than even SSJ3 Gotenks) + Picoolo all combined were weaker. And SSJ Vegetto would be 50 times more?

40 x 50 x 50 x 50 x 3 x 50 = 750 000 000 tonnes if taking the minimum of an approximate.

Depending on your opinion of base goku's speed the same result in speed is also expected.

You say well all the feats they done never show up to the stated feats?

Well if it would everyone would be dead. Countless times have it been stated by both villains and good guys that they were capable of destroying the earth, yet as STRONGER guys come up the battle feats still look EXACTLY the same, with the same size craters until they intend to destroy the earth like kid buu etc did. Infact from Saiyan saga to Buu saga the fights always show about the same damage to the ground yet we know each new villain is way stronger.

volume 30 chpt 3
18: you wernt serious with that attack.

Vegeta: “of course not, if I were id blow up the planet”. 

volume 32 chpt 12

Trunks says Vegeta purposly makes his blast smaller so it wouldn't destroy the planet.

volume 34 chpt 3

Cell says if goku does that kamehameha it will destroy the earth.

Why do you think that they are so amazed everytime someone intends do to a planet destroying atk? Its because maybe not even the villain ever intended to do planet destorying attacks during their fight.

Freeza: Only did it as a last resort

Cell: Wanted to fight everyone and have a challenge

Buu: Wanted also to fight.

Kid Buu: Didnt want to fight so destroyed the earth right away.

Everyone knows that being serious will destroy the earth so noone fights at planet destroying attacks unless they had to or directly is insane like kid buu.

Nappa did more damage with his two fingers than he did with the entire fight between Goku and himself as well as Vegeta vs Goku.

But it was stated in the manga that Cell would destroy the solar system with that kamehameha if he blew a serious kamehameha.

From Wilkepedia: "Vegetto then began to completely dominate Buu, rendering his attacks useless. His anger at this caused him to start breaking through dimensions, which, if left unchecked, *could have destroyed the universe*. Eventually, Vegetto forced his way through a shield Buu put up, which effectively stopped his rage."

If this was the case that meant that Vegetto could make forcefields that could stop universe detroying effects. Can make magic barriers to prevent absorption from Buu.

Vegetto also states: "Super Buu your too slow because you fight with just sensing your opponent, a good fighter fights by *predicting* the opponent's movement" or something along those lines.

volume 42 cpt 2


----------



## Birkin (Feb 14, 2007)

Hulk
Juggernaut
The Thing
Wolverine
Storm
Rogue
Xavier
Cyclops
Mystique
Any other x-men chars?
Captain America
Superman
Wonderwoman
Flash
Green Lantern
Hawkgirl

Any other chars?

List the different incarnations as well to the characters that have any.

New setting:

I'm curious about what would happen if we split this into two, both the manga and anime Vegetto.
Let's say we use both the manga and anime to make it more interesting and debate over shown features in both. I'm just curious =)


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 14, 2007)

Anime Super Vegito would secure a few more victories, but would still lose against some specific versions of the opposition.


----------



## Birkin (Feb 14, 2007)

Yeah like pre/post crisis Superman if I'm correct? Is there anyone else?


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 14, 2007)

Wonder Woman would probably still beat him to a pulp...

Unless of course you feel like stretching the definition of "Anime" Vegetto to "English Anime" Vegetto...


----------



## Gunners (Feb 14, 2007)

> Wonder Woman would probably still beat him to a pulp...
> 
> Unless of course you feel like stretching the definition of "Anime" Vegetto to "English Anime" Vegetto...



Does it make that much of a diffrence? In the anime it is clear that they can dodge light speed attacks seeing as Radditz did so too Piccollo. An anime variation of Vegito would stomp Wonderwoman the way I see it.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 14, 2007)

can anyone check for me if this was anime only. quote from wilkepedia:

"Vegetto then began to completely dominate Buu, rendering his attacks useless. His anger at this caused him to start breaking through dimensions, which, if left unchecked, could have *destroyed the universe.* Eventually, Vegetto forced his way through a shield Buu put up, which effectively stopped his rage.""

cos if true that would mean Vegetto could make forcefields that could stop universe detroying effects.


----------



## Biscuits (Feb 14, 2007)

No DBZ character is capable of destroying a universe,lets get serious here.The best they can do is a solar system or part of a galaxy.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 14, 2007)

Skeets said:


> No DBZ character is capable of destroying a universe,lets get serious here.The best they can do is a solar system or part of a galaxy.



Its cool that thats your opinion and all, but id rather judge base on the manga, so if they say Buu was capable of this id believe them over you.

So tell me did Wiki get this information:

"Vegetto then began to completely dominate Buu, rendering his attacks useless. His anger at this caused him to start breaking through dimensions, which, if left unchecked, could have destroyed the universe. Eventually, Vegetto forced his way through a shield Buu put up, which effectively stopped his rage."

From the manga or the anime, thats all i need to know.


----------



## Biscuits (Feb 14, 2007)

Wiki...lol the site can be edited by anyone who has an account.Wiki isn't as reliable as might think.Any one with a Bias agenda could have edited the entry to his or her liking.

Buu might destroy the Universe *a Solar system at a time*,Not in one attack like a Big Bang.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 14, 2007)

Skeets said:


> Wiki...lol the site can be edited by anyone who has an account.Wiki isn't as reliable as might think.Any one with a Bias agenda could have edited the entry to his or her liking.
> 
> Buu might destroy the Universe *a Solar system at a time*,Not in one attack like a Big Bang.



lol...dont judge the site judge the information itself. Most of the information is correct for DBZ. Find me information there where you thought was drastically wrong then if you think its so unreliable. Just because you say wiki is sometimes unreliable doesnt really make the information false at all, especially when most of the other information on the same page looks to be correct.

Wiki is good to remind you of the event and then you can look it up yourself for validity.

For eg. wiki might say Goku used kamehameha against cell at this time. So i ask if anyone has the scan  for that time if goku really did use kamehameha to check. Its really useless to say "LOL thats from wiki, wiki is so unreliable, LOL LOL ROFL" implying its false and theres no point checking. 

The only fact that matters is if "Vegetto then began to completely dominate Buu, rendering his attacks useless. His anger at this caused him to start breaking through dimensions, which, if left unchecked, could have destroyed the universe. Eventually, Vegetto forced his way through a shield Buu put up, which effectively stopped his rage."   was stated in the anime or manga only, and thats what i wanted to know.

BTW that was one attack. The source wasnt talking about one solar system at a time or whatever you made up.


----------



## Biscuits (Feb 14, 2007)

Gohan said:


> lol...dont judge the site judge the information itself. Most of the information is correct for DBZ. Find me information there where you thought was drastically wrong then if you think its so unreliable. Just because you say wiki is sometimes unreliable doesnt really make the information false at all, especially when most of the other information on the same page looks to be correct.
> 
> Wiki is good to remind you of the event and then you can look it up yourself for validity.
> 
> ...


The Fact of the matter is that not everything written in Wiki is *FACT*.
So you're saying that Vegetto stopped a Big Bang?Get serious Vegetto punted Buu's best attack.No way in hell does any DBZ character have the power to duplicate a Big Bang.All Buu did when he was screaming was shake other Dimensions nothing was indicated that he could of destroyed the Universe.

I said one Solar system at a time because that's what has been proven on panel that the Characters are capable of.(Example Cell himself stated that he could of destroyed the whole Solar system)

Sure Buu might destroy the Universe but not in one attack like I said earlier.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 14, 2007)

Skeets said:


> The Fact of the matter is that not everything written in Wiki is *FACT*.
> 
> Ok thats good and all, but did that statement there really prove to me that the event wiki described was false? if not then thats not a point to refute what im trying to say at all.
> 
> ...


----------



## Biscuits (Feb 14, 2007)

Gohan said:


> Skeets said:
> 
> 
> > The Fact of the matter is that not everything written in Wiki is *FACT*.
> ...


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 14, 2007)

Gohan said:


> BTW that was one attack. The source wasnt talking about one solar system at a time or whatever you made up.


Actually read your source;





> "Vegetto then began to completely dominate Buu, rendering his attacks useless. His anger at this caused him to start breaking through dimensions, *which, if left unchecked, could have destroyed the universe.* Eventually, Vegetto forced his way through a shield Buu put up, which effectively stopped his rage.""


It clearly states he could only destroy the universe if left unchecked. Very clearly stating that destroying the universe wasn't a one attack deal. You know for a fact that those chars you've seen are the strongest from their universe. So if one of those bad guys had won their would be noone to stand in their way which means the universe is theirs.





> cos if true that would mean Vegetto could make forcefields that could stop universe detroying effects.


Why? It said Vegito broke Buu's shields which were put up to protect him as he was trying to wipe the earth out.


----------



## Endless Mike (Feb 14, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Wrong, your list is terrible!! Everyone on that list loses, especially your crappy Supermen. Vegetto is LEVELS above a UNIVERSE destroyer. Vegetto wins this casually.



Still harping on filler?

If you want to play it that way, then Hulk is canonically a universe destroyer, Superman canonically beat a guy who is canonically above a being that is the embodiment of the universe.....



Kirin said:


> Buu was going too rip the universe, Vegito took Buu too school and back. He came in like Santa claus and gave him the ass kicking of his life.



Filler. Non - canon.

Besides, all he was doing was screaming and all it took to beat him was punching him. Practically anyone could do that.



Phenomenol said:


> Yeah, this is the Outskirts battledome: "Where your favorite characters from *ANY VENUE *come to do battle!"
> 
> Super Buu's power was destroying the universe....



Don't give me that shit. We only debate the canon of a particular universe. Non - canon doesn't count, or you might as well say that fanfiction counts.



> And I don't see why it matters, Buu in the manga was going to rip the universe,



Wrong.



> Gotenks ripped a whole in the universe.



It was a local hole in a dimension to cross a dimensional barrier that was already weakened from a portal being there for who - knows - how long.



> When Buu did it, the universe was going to colapse.



Filler. Non - canon.



> I don't feel too find an image for this. You yourself have probably seen the image already or know full well the scene I am talking about. Why you want an image I don't know.



Because it's filler and was never in the manga.



Kirin said:


> Does it make that much of a diffrence? In the anime it is clear that they can dodge light speed attacks seeing as Radditz did so too Piccollo. An anime variation of Vegito would stomp Wonderwoman the way I see it.



Except that was only the English dub, not the original anime. Not to mention that the English dub also says that IT is only lightspeed, yet it makes it clear that IT is much faster than their normal movement speed.

Therefore the anime and dub make no sense and are full of contradictions, so any attempt to actually use those versions in a debate is pointless. Stick to the canon.



Gohan said:


> can anyone check for me if this was anime only. quote from wilkepedia:
> 
> "Vegetto then began to completely dominate Buu, rendering his attacks useless. His anger at this caused him to start breaking through dimensions, which, if left unchecked, could have *destroyed the universe.* Eventually, Vegetto forced his way through a shield Buu put up, which effectively stopped his rage.""
> 
> cos if true that would mean Vegetto could make forcefields that could stop universe detroying effects.



No, that was filler. Also he didn't make any forcefields, he simply broke through Buu's shield (which had nothing to do with his scream) and punched him.

Trust me, I've read the manga.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 14, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> Actually read your source;It clearly states he could only destroy the universe if left unchecked. Very clearly stating that destroying the universe wasn't a one attack deal. You know for a fact that those chars you've seen are the strongest from their universe. So if one of those bad guys had won their would be noone to stand in their way which means the universe is theirs.Why? It said Vegito broke Buu's shields which were put up to protect him as he was trying to wipe the earth out.



No, seriously YOU should be rereading the source not me. If you read the whole thing and understood the context you would of realise the passsage meant if the dimensional attack was left unchecked it would of destroyed the universe, meaing IF Vegetto did not stop teh dimensional attack it would grow and destroy the universe. So i dont know how your saying shit like very clearly stating that the universe wasn't a one attack deal because thats EXACTLY what its saying.



> No, that was filler. Also he didn't make any forcefields, he simply broke through Buu's shield (which had nothing to do with his scream) and punched him.
> 
> *Trust me, I've read the manga*.



You got the scans?

Because i don't know man...you were arguing with one thread that you believed Kaio ken wasn't a linear increase in power level when if you read the manga Goku clearly went from 90k to 180k when he used kaioken x 2


----------



## Endless Mike (Feb 14, 2007)

Gohan said:


> You got the scans?
> 
> Because i don't know man...you were arguing with one thread that you believed Kaio ken wasn't a linear increase in power level when if you read the manga Goku clearly went from 90k to 180k when he used kaioken x 2



Which would be a good point if power levels were a linear logical scale and actually meant anything.

As for scans, I would get them if dranet still hosted the manga, but as for now you should realize the burden of proof is on you, since you're making a positive claim that said scene was in the manga, you have to prove it with scans, it's not up to me to prove that said scene *wasn't* in the manga.


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 14, 2007)

Gohan said:


> No, seriously YOU should be rereading the source not me. If you read the whole thing and understood the context you would of realise the passsage meant if the dimensional attack was left unchecked it would of destroyed the universe, meaing IF Vegetto did not stop teh dimensional attack it would grow and destroy the universe. *So i dont know how your saying shit like very clearly stating that the universe wasn't a one attack deal because thats EXACTLY what its saying.*


The rifts were only being caused in Earth's atmosphere so pay attention, to the context.

Quick search on google,


----------



## Kai (Feb 14, 2007)

The handful of you that think Vegetto can take just about everyone on that list, I don't really care you can debate endlessly on that issue.

If you think he even has a slight chance against Flash, we have a problem.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 14, 2007)

Endless Mike said:


> Which would be a good point if power levels were a linear logical scale and actually meant anything.



What are you talking about? I said "you believed Kaio ken wasn't a linear increase in power level when if you read the manga Goku clearly went from 90k to 180k when he used kaioken x 2" meaning you were arguing if kaio ken increases your power level (as in the one stated in the scouter) linearly and that exact example i showed you showed that it did.



> As for scans, I would get them if dranet still hosted the manga, but as for now you should realize the burden of proof is on you, since you're making a positive claim that said scene was in the manga, you have to prove it with scans, it's not up to me to prove that said scene *wasn't* in the manga.



Actually i asked if anyone had the scans to see if this was anime or manga only. Then you said you know its anime only and to trust you. I said i dont know if i can trust you. So how the hell is the burden of proof on me please explain? If i was arguing that the statement was in the manga i guess you would have a valid point, but instead i was asking if had the scans to see if this was anime or manga only, therefore whether i am correct about if it actually happened or not doesnt really matter since im not claiming the statement is true or not. 



			
				Vynjira said:
			
		

> The rifts were only being caused in Earth's atmosphere so pay attention, to the context.
> 
> Quick search on google, DB Manga



Why are you giving me a link to the db manga in responce to my point against you. I said the statement was not talking about buu destroying the planets/solar systems one at a time but the one attack he did could develop and destroy the universe ACCORDING to the statement. But you argued that that same statement that i gave said that Buu was destroying the planet one at a time etc...i was talking about the statement here and what it said.


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 14, 2007)

> Why are you giving me a link to the db manga in responce to my point against you.


Not everything is about you. EM commented on it and you wanted it, it took all of 5 seconds on google.





Gohan said:


> I said the statement was not talking about buu destroying the planets/solar systems one at a time but the one attack he did could develop and destroy the universe ACCORDING to the statement.


I responded to that.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 14, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> Not everything is about you. EM commented on it and you wanted it, it took all of 5 seconds on google.I responded to that.



Well it was kind of confusing considering the fact that you didn't even say @endless mike etc. Btw i think the site is kind of useless since it doen't ocver far enough to where we are talking about.

Ok you responded to me by saying "The rifts were only being caused in Earth's atmosphere so pay attention, to the context". 

statement: "Vegetto then began to completely dominate Buu, rendering his attacks useless. His anger at this caused him to start breaking through dimensions, which, *if left unchecked, could have destroyed the universe*. Eventually, Vegetto forced his way through a shield Buu put up, which effectively stopped his rage.""

The "if" according the context refers to the fact that if the dimensional atk was not stopped it would destroy the universe.

I dont get how your "The rifts were only being caused in Earth's atmosphere" support the fact that the statement meant "Very clearly stating that destroying the universe wasn't a one attack deal. You know for a fact that those chars you've seen are the strongest from their universe. So if one of those bad guys had won their would be noone to stand in their way which means the universe is theirs"

since a) it does not at all imply it wasn't a one attack deal but infact the exact opposite. That one dimensional attack if left unchecked would of develop and destroyed the universe according to the statement.

b) Has nothing to do with "if one of those bad guys had won their would be noone to stand in their way which means the universe is theirs"


----------



## Tsukiyomi (Feb 14, 2007)

Phenomenol said:


> Once again, that even applies to your comics as well.^^^ I am using anime Vegetto. Which means this thread is over.



What do you mean it applies to comics?

No one uses movie/tv forms of people when making arguments about a character because the movie/tv events mean nothing, they aren't part of the real continuity.

Just like going from anime to manga.  The manga is fact, the anime is not.  If the manga states Goku can lift 50 pounds and the anime states he can lift 60, then he can lift 50 pounds, the manga is the real story written by the author, the anime is made by the animators who make changes as they see fit.

I can't use arguments from Superman II where Zod and the other kryptonians could teleport, had telekinesis and shoot lasers out of their  hands as proof of anything, because its not in the comics.


----------



## Wesley (Feb 14, 2007)

But Superman's been around for decades and has had many different writers and continuties.  Are they call canon because they're in comic book form?


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 14, 2007)

Gohan said:


> *Snip*


It never stated it would happen with one attack, it was saying if Buu continued unchecked he could destroy the universe. If you can't understand that A) Stop using wiki sites and B) look at back feats to see what the most logical reasoning for the statement. Also its sidetracked you onto a topic about filler.


----------



## Gunners (Feb 14, 2007)

> What do you mean it applies to comics?
> 
> No one uses movie/tv forms of people when making arguments about a character because the movie/tv events mean nothing, they aren't part of the real continuity.
> 
> ...



Which is why I think the anime and manga should be treated as their own seperate business and people get in the habbit of saying Anime????? or Manga?????.

If someone argues that anime Goku can beat a character and it is true, but the manga couldn't. Then too the other person Goku is not going to win and to the other he would win. It moves no where.


----------



## Wesley (Feb 14, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> It never stated it would happen with one attack, it was saying if Buu continued unchecked he could destroy the universe. If you can't understand that A) Stop using wiki sites and B) look at back feats to see what the most logical reasoning for the statement. Also its sidetracked you onto a topic about filler.



The situation gave a sense of urgency.  It wasn't like, "Oh no!  He's going to blow up and take the Solar Sytem with him!  And then he'll do that forever and ever until there's nothing left."  I percieved it as Buu setting himself up to flush the Universe down the toilet.  So to speak.


----------



## Tsukiyomi (Feb 14, 2007)

Wesley said:


> But Superman's been around for decades and has had many different writers and continuties.  Are they call canon because they're in comic book form?



No they aren't all considered in continutity anymore.  DC has things like the crisis of infinite earths to explain away all the events that don't fit into what they want to be canon.

Thats why they release things like the DC encyclopedia for their writers, that encyclopedia is canon, anything else is not and is explained away.


----------



## Wesley (Feb 14, 2007)

Tsukiyomi said:


> No they aren't all considered in continutity anymore.  DC has things like the crisis of infinite earths to explain away all the events that don't fit into what they want to be canon.
> 
> Thats why they release things like the DC encyclopedia for their writers, that encyclopedia is canon, anything else is not and is explained away.



So if a decade from now, the rights to Goku and company are sold to say...the Catholic Church, and they decide that everything that ever happened in Dragonball, never happened, would that be canon?


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 14, 2007)

That'd be a retcon. Perhaps a remake.



			
				Wesley said:
			
		

> But Superman's been around for decades and has had many different writers and continuties. Are they call canon because they're in comic book form?



The thing is, some of the Superman stories are of Elseworlds -- basically What If?'s. Stories for the sake of stories. And, like Marvel, they are of an alternate universe.

And every few years or so, DC Comics orchestrates a "Crisis" event where certain stories, events, and character histories of the DC continuity are literally removed, edited, and added as they see fit. So not all the stories DC Comics produces will forever remain, nor at least always contribute and be incorporated into DC continuity.


----------



## Tsukiyomi (Feb 14, 2007)

Wesley said:


> So if a decade from now, the rights to Goku and company are sold to say...the Catholic Church, and they decide that everything that ever happened in Dragonball, never happened, would that be canon?



If Akira Toriyama gave them the rights then yes, he would have given them control over his universe.

When Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster created Superman they did it for DC, so they have always had control of the universe Superman was in, he lives in the DC universe afterall.

So its not quite the same.


----------



## Endless Mike (Feb 14, 2007)

Gohan said:


> What are you talking about? I said "you believed Kaio ken wasn't a linear increase in power level when if you read the manga Goku clearly went from 90k to 180k when he used kaioken x 2" meaning you were arguing if kaio ken increases your power level (as in the one stated in the scouter) linearly and that exact example i showed you showed that it did.



You misunderstand. I never stated it wasn't a linear increase in power level (as in the number), but in actual power and ability.



> Actually i asked if anyone had the scans to see if this was anime or manga only. Then you said you know its anime only and to trust you. I said i dont know if i can trust you. So how the hell is the burden of proof on me please explain? If i was arguing that the statement was in the manga i guess you would have a valid point, but instead i was asking if had the scans to see if this was anime or manga only, therefore whether i am correct about if it actually happened or not doesnt really matter since im not claiming the statement is true or not.



So you're not claiming it's true? So then why are you even talking about it?

If you won't trust me, ask anyone else who's read the manga.

Vyrnjira provided a link to the online manga, but it appears that that site only has it up to the point where Majin Buu is first released.


----------



## Crimson King (Feb 14, 2007)

This thread is getting ridiculous.

Maybe you could put a temporary ban on DBZ topic to let off the heat.


----------



## Wesley (Feb 14, 2007)

Crimson King said:


> This thread is getting ridiculous.
> 
> Maybe you could put a temporary ban on DBZ topic to let off the heat.



Or better yet, a ban on match ups that crosses national boundaries, genres, and medias.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 15, 2007)

Vynjira said:


> It never stated it would happen with one attack, it was saying if Buu continued unchecked he could destroy the universe. If you can't understand that A) Stop using wiki sites and B) look at back feats to see what the most logical reasoning for the statement. Also its sidetracked you onto a topic about filler.



And the context is that his rage was blowing dimensions apart, meaning his getting angry and the dimensions are tearing apart and would eventually destroy the universe. So basically the thing was going bigger and bigger ripping through dimensions not like destroying a dimension at a solar system then going to the next to destroy the dimensions there...


Im not trusting you to say its filler, so ill keep talking about it until someone shows the scan.



			
				Endless_Mike said:
			
		

> So you're not claiming it's true? So then why are you even talking about it?
> 
> If you won't trust me, ask anyone else who's read the manga.
> 
> Vyrnjira provided a link to the online manga, but it appears that that site only has it up to the point where Majin Buu is first released.



Errr i never claimed its not true, i said i dont know if its in the anime or manga could someone post scans to show that its either in it or not...


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 15, 2007)

Gohan said:


> Im not trusting you to say its filler, so ill keep talking about it until someone shows the scan.



Ummm... Gohan, you're asking for negative proof. 

That would require them to show a scan proving it doesn't exist... which in itself is impossible. The only way to verify it isn't there would be to read through the DB manga and NOT find it.

Which would therefore mean it is actually up to you to prove it is in the manga. 

Sorry, that's just how it is.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 15, 2007)

Mortalis said:


> Ummm... Gohan, you're asking for negative proof.
> 
> That would require them to show a scan proving it doesn't exist... which in itself is impossible. The only way to verify it isn't there would be to read through the DB manga and NOT find it.
> 
> ...



Nah im not asking for negative proof because i never claimed it was true. Im just saying if anyone know the actual words that were described by wiki was also in the manga, meaing all you would have to do is show the scan where he does his dimension attack.

I asked if someone could post a scan for this particular instance, i never claimed it to be true. Mike comes along and says trust him its filler, so im like do you have a scan or something, and then his like "no no, burden of proof on you" and im like "wtf ok...not claiming it to be true...";, but im gonna keep asking for a scan for it until someone shows a scan, im not gonna sbe satisfied with him saying it.


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 15, 2007)

Gohan said:


> I asked if someone could post a scan for this particular instance, i never claimed it to be true. Mike comes along and says trust him its filler, so im like do you have a scan or something, and then his like "no no, burden of proof on you" and im like "wtf ok...not claiming it to be true...";, but im gonna keep asking for a scan for it until someone shows a scan, im not gonna sbe satisfied with him saying it.



But, if you're not claiming the point is true, then they have no reason to argue against it, or to prove that it is false.

And if it is filler, then by definition it shouldn't exist in the manga and therefore can't be found to prove otherwise. There's a chance that that scene itself is filler, not just the line. In which case, the scene cannot be brought up to prove anything because there's nothing there to use.

And I'd strongly suggest steering away from Wikipedia, what with it's ability to be edited by anybody.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 15, 2007)

Mortalis said:


> But, if you're not claiming the point is true, then they have no reason to argue against it, or to prove that it is false.
> 
> And if it is filler, then by definition it shouldn't exist in the manga and therefore can't be found to prove otherwise. There's a chance that that scene itself is filler, not just the line. In which case, the scene cannot be brought up to prove anything because there's nothing there to use.
> 
> And I'd strongly suggest steering away from Wikipedia, what with it's ability to be edited by anybody.



I never told them to argue against it nor did i provoke them to.

Im not talking about the scene, im talking about words that it would if left unchecked, destroy the universe.

If the scene is filler then its very easy to check. All one would have to look up is after the scene the 2 kais talk about who's stronger to the pnt where he gets turned into candy.


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 15, 2007)

Gohan said:


> I never told them to argue against it nor did i provoke them to.



Except that you did just say:



Gohan said:


> Im not trusting you to say its filler, so ill keep talking about it until someone shows the scan.



And by refusing to take their word on the subject, you leave them no choice but to prove it's wrong... that, or ignore you. Ignoring you however wouldn't be in their interests though seeing as they are debating with you.  




Gohan said:


> Im not talking about the scene, im talking about words that it would if left unchecked, destroy the universe.



Precisely my point. If the quote doesn't exist, then their's nothing they can post to prove it doesn't.



Gohan said:


> If the scene is filler then its very easy to check. All one would have to look up is after the scene the 2 kais talk about who's stronger to the pnt where he gets turned into candy.



True, except that's not something that can be proven by them. That is something you would need to do on your own.

Because even if that scene doesn't exist, posting the scene that comes afterwards won't prove anything. Filler doesn't outright replace scenes (usually), it merely provides a filling inbetween them. 

Which would mean that scene should be inbetween "the scene the 2 kais talk about who's stronger" and whatever the heck it is that comes next, not instead of what should come next.

Comprende?


----------



## Rice Ball (Feb 15, 2007)

There are a few people on this forum who gather around anyone who like Dragonball and throw rocks at them with the other 'Big Kids'. I do feel abit sorry for some genuine Dragonball fans who get misstreated on this forum.

But then again the idiots like Ram/jplaya/Phemon don't help.


----------



## Lucero del Alba (Feb 15, 2007)

> There are a few people on this forum who gather around anyone who like Dragonball and throw rocks at them with the other 'Big Kids'. I do feel abit sorry for some genuine Dragonball fans who get misstreated on this forum.
> 
> But then again the idiots like Ram/jplaya/Phemon don't help.


 
Hell, Vegeta is one of my favorite characters of all time, right up there with lex and just behind lucifer. That doesn't make me an idiot though, so I don't feel mistreated because everyone wants to stomp on the morons who insist beyond all rationality that krillin > wally west. So it's not really a matter of alienating fans, just the people that don't know that their fandom should be left out of objectivity, or maybe don't even know _how_ to leave it out. It's the difference between argument and stupidity.

Point: Don't feel bad for them, the ones worth feeling bad about aren't offended by you stomping on the dolts who prevent serious or decent conversation on the subject.

Also, someone should end the dbz > comic tardness with a handy Vegito Vs. Lucifer Morningstar thread. It would be amusing, at worst. Blow up all the universes you want to, it won't help =D

The ultimate power of will incarnate, stronger than the personification of the demiurgos power, even, coupled with the only intellect in the comic medium shown to be on a higher level than the thanos vs. ? should end some arguments about whether or not there are comic characters > dbz. It wouldn't, of course, but it should.




Since I'm here and it's been mentioned, does anyone have scans of the high end iceman/new sun gambit stuff? I know, or think I do, at least, that the omega level iceman stuff has only been spoken, and not feated, but I'd like to check it out anyways. I'd ask for it in the comic request thread, but I've got no clue what runs or issues they're in. Might anyways >_>


----------



## Gunners (Feb 15, 2007)

> There are a few people on this forum who gather around anyone who like Dragonball and throw rocks at them with the other 'Big Kids'. I do feel abit sorry for some genuine Dragonball fans who get misstreated on this forum.
> 
> But then again the idiots like Ram/jplaya/Phemon don't help.



There wasn't really need too call those people idiots. That is what annoys me about in here. It seems the new rules are done on a selective basis. A lot of accepted flaming is allowed in this end so long as it comes from a particular end.



> It never stated it would happen with one attack, it was saying if Buu continued unchecked he could destroy the universe. If you can't understand that A) Stop using wiki sites and B) look at back feats to see what the most logical reasoning for the statement. Also its sidetracked you onto a topic about filler.



I guess the scene didn't happen in the manga, though it doesn't really matter he was still able too create rips in dimensions and Vegito far surpassed him.


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 15, 2007)

Kirin said:


> There wasn't really need too call those people idiots. That is what annoys me about in here. It seems the new rules are done on a selective basis. A lot of accepted flaming is allowed in this end so long as it comes from a particular end.


With regards to 3 members that have been banned on several occasions its hard for any mod to stand up for the members that violate more rules than anyone else. Like if Hitler got mugged by Mike Tyson. You may wanna ignore what Hitler's done in the past but can you?


----------



## Rice Ball (Feb 16, 2007)

Kirin said:


> There wasn't really need too call those people idiots. That is what annoys me about in here. It seems the new rules are done on a selective basis. A lot of accepted flaming is allowed in this end so long as it comes from a particular end.



You must be new here.
Welcome to the OBD.

Have you ever been in a debate where someone betlieves his favorite Z fighter can take out people like LoN/Living Tribunal by flying up to them and 'punching' them.

Believe me there is a 'Need' sometimes.


----------



## omg laser pew pew! (Feb 16, 2007)

Mad Titan said:


> You must be new here.
> Welcome to the OBD.
> 
> Have you ever been in a debate where someone betlieves his favorite Z fighter can take out people like LoN/Living Tribunal by flying up to them and 'punching' them.
> ...



That's gunners


----------



## Rice Ball (Feb 16, 2007)

Gai said:


> That's gunners



He should know them well then.


----------



## Gohan (Feb 16, 2007)

> Mortalis said:
> 
> 
> > Except that you did just say:
> ...


----------



## Endless Mike (Feb 16, 2007)

> Errr i never claimed its not true, i said i dont know if its in the anime or manga could someone post scans to show that its either in it or not...



I've read the manga, and I can assure you it's not.

Furthermore, since the burden of proof is always on the positive, and no one has ever posted scans showing it is there, then we assume it is not there unless someone proves otherwise.


----------



## Violent Man (Feb 16, 2007)

Mike is right, that scene never happened in the manga. It was filler. I would post scans but I don't know what I'm supposed to post since I can't post filler?


----------



## Gohan (Feb 16, 2007)

berwyn said:


> Mike is right, that scene never happened in the manga. It was filler. I would post scans but I don't know what I'm supposed to post since I can't post filler?



Well since you said it then i will leave it at that. 

Thnx for the confirmation  (i mean both of you)


----------



## Gunners (Feb 16, 2007)

> I wasn't terribly happy at trying to prove for over a page why it was his responsibility... yet here we are.



People aim for the kill too much here. He wasn't claiming it too be truth saying ''Unless you prove me wrong it is true''. He was asking a general question.


----------



## Endless Mike (Feb 16, 2007)

Kirin said:


> People aim for the kill too much here. He wasn't claiming it too be truth saying ''Unless you prove me wrong it is true''. He was asking a general question.



And I answered the question. Can we get over this now?


----------



## Gunners (Feb 16, 2007)

> And I answered the question. Can we get over this now?


You know, I wasn't really speaking too you. People are heating up over answering a questioning and making a meal out of it, I don't really think it says much for the whole OB too be honest.


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 16, 2007)

At this rate, I may close the topic, should it get out of hand.


----------



## Vynjira (Feb 16, 2007)

Comic Book Guy said:


> At this rate, I may close the topic, should it get out of hand.


I would, just the topic of DBZ seems to have grown way out of control because of Ramspam619.


----------



## Gunners (Feb 16, 2007)

How is the topic going out of hand?


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 16, 2007)

Well, subtle undercurrents suggest the possibility from what I'm reading here. However, that doesn't mean I'm going to go ahead and immediately close the topic.

I rather be safe than sorry, if anything.

That said. . . where are we now?


----------



## Ram (Feb 16, 2007)

Mad Titan said:


> But then again the idiots like Ram/jplaya/Phemon don't help.



Care to explain yourself?


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 16, 2007)

No, Mad Titan was referring to ram619. Look around page 5.


----------



## Gunners (Feb 16, 2007)

> Vegeto would blow up the world if needed but as apparently in these parts of the forum = OP > everything and comics > everything I don't even bother replying


Vegeto can't breath in space it would eventually kill him unless he moved too a planet with o2. Many people on the list would survive the explosion of the planet and win by default.

So blowing up the planet isn't a good ideal.



			
				CBG said:
			
		

> Well, subtle undercurrents suggest the possibility from what I'm reading here. However, that doesn't mean I'm going to go ahead and immediately close the topic.
> 
> I rather be safe than sorry, if anything.
> 
> That said. . . where are we now?



Understood.


----------



## Birkin (Feb 16, 2007)

Scenario:

Vegetto blows up the planet, instant transmissions to the new Namek
Vegetto wins


----------



## Comic Book Guy (Feb 16, 2007)

Certain X-Men characters would definitely live, however, and would probably do the same if they wanted to.


----------



## Birkin (Feb 16, 2007)

According to earlier pages most x-men can't win against Vegetto so even if they somehow found the new Namek I doubt they could take him.


----------



## Gunners (Feb 16, 2007)

> Scenario:
> 
> Vegetto blows up the planet, instant transmissions to the new Namek
> Vegetto wins



If they fight in a neutral verse new namek wouldn't exist. New Namek is far anyway he wouldn't be able too sense it out. People like Superman ( even though I think he would loose) would survive the planets explosion and the fight would continue regardless actually it wouldn't continue, Vegito would either flee and loose the match or he would sufficate. 

For Vegito his best option is fighting it out without damaging the planet. He isn't Kidd buu though he is strong poofin the planet isn't too his advantage.


----------



## ~Shin~ (Feb 16, 2007)

Vegitto-kun said:


> Vegeto would blow up the world if needed but as apparently in these parts of the forum =  OP > everything and comics > everything I don't even bother replying



That's a very stereotypical statement. Not everyone in the OBD's like this


----------



## Thanatos (Feb 16, 2007)

Ram said:


> Care to explain yourself?



He didn't mean you. He meant another user called Ram619 who was banned for creating multiple dupe accounts.

@CBG: You probably should close this thread. Every point that can be made pretty much has been.


----------



## Reznor (Feb 16, 2007)

Kirin said:


> People aim for the kill too much here. He wasn't claiming it too be truth saying ''Unless you prove me wrong it is true''. He was asking a general question.





Kirin said:


> You know, I wasn't really speaking too you. People are heating up over answering a questioning and making a meal out of it, I don't really think it says much for the whole OB too be honest.


I agree. That's why these DBZ threads don't interest me as much any more. People start out hostile and partisan.


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