# Kabuto vs Sasuke Retrieval Team



## Shizune (Jul 18, 2013)

Everyone is Sasuke retrieval arc form. Kabuto is sent to intervene and stop Naruto's team from confronting the sound four.

Kabuto vs Naruto, Neji, Kiba, Choji and Shikamaru

*Location:* This forest.

*Distance:* 20 meters.

*State of mind:* In character.

*Knowledge:* Manga.

The team gets ten minutes of prep before Kabuto arrives and he's already eaten a soldier pill.


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## Chad (Jul 18, 2013)

So you're putting a guy who soloed a Sannin against 5 fodder?


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## trance (Jul 18, 2013)

Naruto beat Kabuto by himself. The others make this overkill.


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## Rocky (Jul 18, 2013)

Preskip Naruto with a broken leg put Kabuto out of commission. He's obviously not that far above them to the point that he's impervious. KN1 can probably give him a decent fight by himself. The others secure the victory.


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## Doge (Jul 18, 2013)

Part 1 Kabuto was not that amazing.  He only "contended" with Tsunade because she was too clutzy to touch him.


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## Pein (Jul 19, 2013)

Shikamaru catches Kabuto in shadow and Naruto rasengans him.


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## Risyth (Jul 19, 2013)

Unless Shikamaru pulls something here (which I doubt, since he couldn't do anything against Sakon), Kabuto will own them all.

Come on, he soloed a squad of ANBU hospital guards, no sweat, was reputed to be on Kakashi's level, and nearly killed Tsunade with a warped control of his body. Sure, he did it cheaply, but these genin would never have gotten that far. He also owned Shizune who would have owned these genin-level kids, too. He was playing around with Naruto and got so arrogant that he let his guard down. A serious Kabuto could've won in <10 seconds.


Kabuto's not going to underestimate this team, at least until there's only one of them left. With the powerscaling being incredibly obvious and enforced in the PTS, he's probably going to near-blitz everyone when he gets to them. The only one who may put up a bit of a fight would be Neji (the only chuunin-level ninja of the group, by power). 

Due to his doujutsu, I'm wouldn't be sure how that would end, but since we can scale Kabuto's speed to Kakashi's and Tsunade's (justified by statements, feats, and off-camera killings of high-level ninja), he would probably finish Neji fast, too.


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## Chad (Jul 19, 2013)

So much PIS/CIS went on in Kabuto vs Naruto lol.


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## Bonly Jr. (Jul 19, 2013)

Team Naruto destroy Kabuto, honestly, he was nothing special in P1.


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## Sadgoob (Jul 19, 2013)

Kabuto's being overestimated, and the Genin are being underestimated. Traditional ranks don't apply, as Wave Arc Sasuke defeated two Chūnin simultaneously with ease.

Butterfly Chōji, KN1, and Neji all have Jōnin qualities and they're all faster and stronger than Kabuto to varying degrees. Kabuto's edge over them is from experience and intellect.

Shikamaru and Kiba are solid support, and all of them together would wreck Kabuto. For instance, if Neji gets in close range of Kabuto, then it's basically over for Orochimaru's lieutenant:

*Neji*

Tai: 4.5
Spe: 4

*Kabuto*

Tai 3.5
Spe: 3.5 

Similarly, the Sound 4 were all Jōnin level, particularly with their curse seals activated. Jōnin like Taiseki or Gaiden Kakashi would be outmatched against any of them.​


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## Rosencrantz (Jul 20, 2013)

Strategoob said:


> Kabuto's being overestimated, and the Genin are being underestimated. Traditional ranks don't apply, as Wave Arc Sasuke defeated two Chūnin simultaneously with ease.
> 
> Butterfly Chōji, KN1, and Neji all have Jōnin qualities and they're all faster and stronger than Kabuto to varying degrees. Kabuto's edge over them is from experience and intellect.
> 
> ...



Kakashi has 4.5 tier taijutsu. speed, and a 3 tomoe sharingan. Yet Kakashi was still said to be Kabuto's equal. So no Neji does not wreck him in CQC.

However, KN1 is low jounin level and with 4 solid chuunin levels backing him up even without pills for Chouji, they should win solidly.


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Jul 20, 2013)

Bluenote said:


> So you're putting a guy who soloed a Sannin against 5 fodder?


You do realize he struggled the ENTIRE fight right, and only won after exploiting Tsunade's fear of blood?


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## Ennoia (Jul 20, 2013)

I believe that this is too much for Kabuto based on what he had shown at the time. Lets say Kiba and Akamaru dive at Kabuto with Gatsuga in order to distract him and Choji smacks him onto a tree, Shikamaru can then pin him down while Neji puts him out. Or switch Neji with Kiba, I believe its simply too much being thrown at Kabuto and Shikamaru only needs to grab him for a second for Neji to end it.

At that point he hasnt shown skill on the level of Kakashi despite word of mouth, I would even question Kakashi's ability to survive in this situation.


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## Kai (Jul 20, 2013)

Rocky said:


> Preskip Naruto with a broken leg put Kabuto out of commission.


He pretty much got over it and proceeded to summon Manda afterwards.


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## Bonly Jr. (Jul 20, 2013)

Kai said:


> He pretty much got over it and proceeded to summon Manda afterwards.



And then went out of commission again,


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## Zonmari Leroux (Jul 20, 2013)

Neji or Naruto could solo the four of them against him is overkill. 

Heck I think Gatsuga could put him down.


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## Sadgoob (Jul 20, 2013)

Rosencrantz said:


> Kakashi has 4.5 tier taijutsu. speed, and a 3 tomoe sharingan. Yet Kakashi was still said to be Kabuto's equal. So no Neji does not wreck him in CQC.



Both Neji and Kakashi would babyshake Kabuto in taijutsu then. Kabuto's just more sly than Neji, which is why he'd prevail. That might even be true for him taking on part two Neji.

If Kabuto prevailed over Kakashi, then it would be because he stalled out Kakashi's very low tolerance for using the Sharingan, but I'm of the opinion that Kakashi would take Kabuto down in that time.​


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## Reznor (Jul 20, 2013)

Kabuto outplanned Tsunade, not overpowered. He played defensive to exhaust them both, dealt with his own exhaustion with a soldier pill and then was finally able to attack via counter-attack. (Even then, he took an unpowered punch to land it.) Tsunade still had the ability to fight even after that, so Kabuto had to use her phobia. 
It is impressive that Kabuto could do all that, but he wasn't Sannin level.



> Naruto beat Kabuto by himself. The others make this overkill.


Kabuto got up and summoned Manda a minute or two later.
Naruto was going to die if not for Tsunade's intervention.

How is that a win for Naruto? It's only impressive because it was Kabuto. Who, by the way, was trying to get Naruto to leave the fight and was going for non-lethal damage until Naruto made it clear that he wasn't going to leave.


> So much PIS/CIS went on in Kabuto vs Naruto lol.





> He pretty much got over it and proceeded to summon Manda afterwards.






> Wave Arc Sasuke defeated two Chūnin simultaneously with ease.





> Similarly, the Sound 4 were all Jōnin level, particularly with their curse seals activated.


Part I Children << Part I Adults

Sasuke KICKED the Demon Bros after they killed the log they thought was Kakashi. But then he needed an adult.

The Sound 4 were not Jounin level. The sound 4 need CS2 to beat 2 Special Jounin.


Verdict: Kabuto and Shikamaru I'm going to place in the same tier of intelligence. Shikamaru has more resources than Kabuto has, which is a definite advantage. 
Kabuto has full knowledge on them, sans anything real recent, and they know anything Naruto can tell them about the Sannin Battlefield fight.

In addition to intelligence, KN1 presents a lot on the raw power front. I believe that KN1 can deal with KN1, but not easily and he'd have to focus him.

Here's what decides this match:


> *State of mind:* In character.
> *Knowledge:* Manga.



In character, the Retrieval Team lacks full knowledge _on themselves_. KN1 is not going to be something that Shikamaru can plan around. If he could, then he would have KN1 keeping Kabuto on the run, and the others would find ways to back him up to prevent Kabuto from outmaneuvering him or employing any kind of strategy. They would wear him down and give him too much to deal with at the same time.

But, since they lack this knowledge, KN1 and teamwork/strategy are completely independent plans. Kabuto will fight the team. He plan around the others abilities well, as he has seen them all fight. Shikamaru is a good planner, but Kabuto has seen him in action but Shikamaru only has Naruto's account to go off of. Kabuto has tricks to foil Neji and Kiba's detection (which they lack knowledge of) KN1 will come up if Kabuto chooses to take out Naruto last - he may go for him earlier in the plan. Strangely, the biggest factor in this battle is Chouji - but at a small size he'll be outmaneuvered and at a large size, Kabuto can hide easily and Chouji has a difficult time being a part of any plan. This scenario goes to Kabuto.


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## Sadgoob (Jul 20, 2013)

In my opinion, Tsunade wasn't "Sannin level" at the time. Her databook relevant stats in part two, after getting back in shape, was 3.5 speed and a very impressive 5 in taijutsu. 

However, it's highly probable that, given Kabuto's performance, each category was a tier or so lower 3 years prior. She had given up being a ninja for decades to gamble and drink after all...​


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## Reznor (Jul 20, 2013)

Lol databook.
But being below 5 taijutsu isn't shabby.

And his speed is *comparable to **Tsunade's who is leagues faster than Naruto who is comparable to the others. (*probably faster **out of shape Part I, yeah.)

In Part I, Jounin with a 3.5 speed were in practice, faster than Genin  with 3.5 speed. Kabuto could keep up with Kakashi and Baki, whom none of  the kids could hope to face.


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## Sadgoob (Jul 20, 2013)

Reznor said:


> Lol databook.



Yep, lol @ the author giving us a universal scale to compare ninja's individual skills instead of gut feelings.​


Reznor said:


> But being below 5 taijutsu isn't shabby.



No doubt, but she likely improved over a tier during timeskip, because she didn't appear particularly skillful against Kabuto. If anything, as someone said earlier, she seemed clutzy and brutish.​


Reznor said:


> In Part I, Jounin with a 3.5 speed were in practice, faster than Genin  with 3.5 speed. Kabuto could keep up with Kakashi and Baki, whom none of  the kids could hope to face.



I think this is based off of flashy entrances that have little bearing on an actual match between two individuals. Ex: Tsunade and Kabuto could never hope to face part one Nardo.​


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## wooly Eullerex (Jul 20, 2013)

Team SRA Shika>>>>Anbu hospital guards.

unless Kabuto summons manda?...he loses


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## Reznor (Jul 20, 2013)

> No doubt, but she likely improved over a tier during timeskip, because  she didn't appear particularly skillful against Kabuto. If anything, as  someone said earlier, she seemed clutzy and brutish.


 This is circular logic.


> Yep, lol @ the author giving us a universal scale to compare ninja's individual skills instead of gut feelings.


 No, I'm refute its application with what we've been shown and told in the manga.


> I think this is based off of flashy entrances that have little bearing on an actual match between two individuals.


 No, I'm saying that all the jounin are faster than all of the genin. (At the very least in terms of effective combat speed.) Do you doubt that Kakashi is leagues faster than any member of the SRA team?


> Team SRA Shika>>>>Anbu hospital guards.


 I disagree. ANBU are Chuunin+.


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## Shizune (Jul 21, 2013)

Strategoob said:


> In my opinion, Tsunade wasn't "Sannin level" at the time. Her databook relevant stats in part two, after getting back in shape, was 3.5 speed and a very impressive 5 in taijutsu.
> 
> However, it's highly probable that, given Kabuto's performance, each category was a tier or so lower 3 years prior. She had given up being a ninja for decades to gamble and drink after all...​



This argument made a lot more sense when we didn't take Kabuto very seriously, but considering this is the same man who later became one of the strongest antagonists in the series, him pressuring a sannin makes a lot more sense. He didn't seemed particularly afraid of Jiraiya, either.

People also exaggerate exactly how successful he was against Tsunade. He exhausted her to level the playing field and had a clearly developed strategy of using his chakra scalpels to to cripple her. While it succeeded in saving his life when she landed hits on him, it was unsuccessful in terms of incapacitating her. When she'd healed herself and he realized his jutsu wasn't going to stop her, he prepared to abuse her phobia of blood, implying he was outmatched. I don't see how that's unbelievable or suggests we should downplay Tsunade's feats. They landed an equal amount of hits on each other and Tsunade was the only one who actually succeeded in putting her opponent down and recovering from the damage; Kakashi should have been capable of similar pressure against a sannin.


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## The Pirate on Wheels (Jul 21, 2013)

Kabuto can put everyone but Shikamaru to sleep with Nihao Shoujo Manga Feather genjutsu and then chop them up with scalpels.  He's way above them, and has been killing Jonin since he was their age.  

Now if Naruto would actually summon Gamabunta, then things would go differently.


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## Bonly (Jul 21, 2013)

Risyth said:


> Unless Shikamaru pulls something here (which I doubt, since he couldn't do anything against Sakon), Kabuto will own them all.
> 
> Come on, he soloed a squad of ANBU hospital guards, no sweat, was reputed to be on Kakashi's level, and nearly killed Tsunade with a warped control of his body. Sure, he did it cheaply, but these genin would never have gotten that far. He also owned Shizune who would have owned these genin-level kids, too. He was playing around with Naruto and got so arrogant that he let his guard down. A serious Kabuto could've won in <10 seconds.
> 
> ...



Basically this over all. Kabuto had the portrayal of being Kakashi's equal and the Jounin's were portrayed as being a step above the Genin. Unless Shika managed to catch Kabuto in his Kagemane then I don't see the SRA team winning more times then not.


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## Sadgoob (Jul 21, 2013)

Reznor said:


> This is circular logic.



More of an opinion, really.​


Reznor said:


> No, I'm refute its application with what we've been shown and told in the manga.



Numbers are more reliable in this case, just like statistics tends to be more reliable than interpretations of literature.​


Reznor said:


> No, I'm saying that all the jounin are faster than all of the genin. (At the very least in terms of effective combat speed.) Do you doubt that Kakashi is leagues faster than any member of the SRA team?



Fans coined the term "elite Jōnin" for him. Kakashi was famous throughout the world. With a 4.5 speed and Sharingan boost, yeah, he's faster. But he'd smoke most Jōnin easily as well.

In contrast, Taiseki was a Jōnin that was fodderized by a Chūnin. A Chūnin  that was teased for being untalented among the Uchiha at that, who had weak skills and only a fraction of his dōjutsu's power.​


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## Veracity (Jul 21, 2013)

Strategoob said:


> In my opinion, Tsunade wasn't "Sannin level" at the time. Her databook relevant stats in part two, after getting back in shape, was 3.5 speed and a very impressive 5 in taijutsu.
> 
> However, it's highly probable that, given Kabuto's performance, each category was a tier or so lower 3 years prior. She had given up being a ninja for decades to gamble and drink after all...​


Why do you use Databooks for everything. They don't even make sense.  Tsunade with a 3.5 in speed blitzed Shizune. She also managed to beat the shit out of Oro and kept him from running. And Oro has a 4.5 in speed. So explain this...


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## Sadgoob (Jul 21, 2013)

Likes boss said:


> Why do you use Databooks for everything.



I don't use it for everything... I use it for what it was designed for: supplementary information. Without the databook, it would be impossible to gauge skills in all but the vaguest senses.​


Likes boss said:


> They don't even make sense.  Tsunade with a 3.5 in speed blitzed Shizune.



Base Naruto punched Minato, remember? When you're not anticipating an attack, you get hit. Besides, Shizune has only a very slight reflex advantage over Tsunade anyway.​


Likes boss said:


> She also managed to beat the shit out of Oro and kept him from running. And Oro has a 4.5 in speed. So explain this...



Orochimaru didn't have arms... and even if he did, he has a 3.5 in taijutsu, so he'd be liable to get hit anyway if he engaged in taijutsu. However, IIRC, Tsunade landed a solid hit by grabbing his tongue.​


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## Veracity (Jul 21, 2013)

Strategoob said:


> I don't use it for everything... I use it for what it was designed for: supplementary information. Without the databook, it would be impossible to gauge skills in all but the vaguest senses.​
> 
> 
> Base Naruto punched Minato, remember? When you're not anticipating an attack, you get hit. Besides, Shizune has only a very slight reflex advantage over Tsunade anyway.​
> ...



You still didn't explain.  And when did Naruto do this?

Also your damn point is? That doesn't stop him from using his legs to move the fuck out of the way. He just couldn't, because Tsunade was keeping pace with him. Which makes the Databooks irrelevant.  And if we're using databooks, then it even says Tsunade managed to trump Shizune in speed and blitz her. So...

Then again, I'm not surprised coming from you. The same person who thinks Haku trumps Hiruzen based on shitty databooks, and what Zabuza says.


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## Sadgoob (Jul 21, 2013)

Likes boss said:


> Then again, I'm not surprised coming from you. The same person who thinks Haku trumps Hiruzen based on shitty databooks, and what Zabuza says.






*Spoiler*: __ 



jk ily


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## Shizune (Jul 21, 2013)

Strategoob said:


> Besides, Shizune has only a very slight reflex advantage over Tsunade anyway.


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## FlamingRain (Jul 21, 2013)

I can see all but Shikamaru going nighty-night with _Nehan Shoja no Jutsu_, and when Shika goes to wake them up he gets immobilized and cut up with _Chakra no Mesu_ from underground (in case Kabuto needs to avoid any shadows) before he can wake them. After that, everyone else dies in their sleep.

Kabuto on steroids wins.





Strategoob said:


> Orochimaru didn't have arms....​



Don't ninjas run with their arms flying behind them like Sonic the Hedgehog anyway?



> However, IIRC, Tsunade landed a solid hit by grabbing his tongue.​



You would be remembering the _second_ time _(1)_. The _first_ time she jumped over Naruto from a rather inconvenient starting position _(2)_, _(3)_ to hit him. The hit was still solid, it only had less of an effect that time because she hit him before repairing her severed muscles and stuff here _(4)_, thus without her monster strength.


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