# hidan rules the low kage level class. Is he mid kage level?



## Icegaze (Jan 20, 2015)

hidan takes on Mifune, darui and hebi sasuke 

each have no knowledge of each other
distance: 25m 
restrictions: sasuke will not summon manda OC for sasuke to do such against a tiny opponent. 

Can hidan take them out 1 on 1. I believe he can 

is there any low kage level shinobi who hidan cant take out?


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## Kai (Jan 20, 2015)

No knowledge gives Hidan a tremendous advantage against people of the same class. Shikamaru struggled with sweat and tears trying to figure out the mechanics behind Hidan's kinjutsu and still couldn't prevent Asuma's death after the fact.

He kills Mifune and Darui, neither of whom possess problems for his ritual without knowledge. Sasuke puts Hidan down with genjutsu before the ritual gets a chance to shine. No knowledge of the Sharingan's illusions takes precedent before preparation.


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## The Pirate on Wheels (Jan 20, 2015)

Hebi cuts him in half.  His unblockable sword and eiso will prove too much.

Mifune cuts him in half.  Iado that shuts down kage level hand seals is too fast and strong for Akatsuki' slowest attacker, and Hidan's scythe tactics weren't more impressive than Hanzo'd Kusarigama techniques Mifune shut down without even looking at.  

Darui has a rough go of it.  He has the weapon to win, but he's not particularly fast, nor is he more skilled in CQC than Asuma.  Very sadly his range game is entirely ineffective against Hidan.  I question Darui as a kage level fighter during the series. He seemed more like the Elite Jonin we knew in part one, who at best could contribute against other kage, and otherwise hang out for a bit, but not win.  Like a black P1 or early P2 Kakashi.


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## Icegaze (Jan 20, 2015)

The Pirate on Wheels said:


> Hebi cuts him in half.  His unblockable sword and eiso will prove too much.
> 
> Mifune cuts him in half.  Iado that shuts down kage level hand seals is too fast and strong for Akatsuki' slowest attacker, and Hidan's scythe tactics weren't more impressive than Hanzo'd Kusarigama techniques Mifune shut down without even looking at.
> 
> Darui has a rough go of it.  He has the weapon to win, but he's not particularly fast, nor is he more skilled in CQC than Asuma.  Very sadly his range game is entirely ineffective against Hidan.  I question Darui as a kage level fighter during the series. He seemed more like the Elite Jonin we knew in part one, who at best could contribute against other kage, and otherwise hang out for a bit, but not win.  Like a black P1 or early P2 Kakashi.



for his unblockable sword to be a problem he would have to be in cqc wouldnt he. hidan scythe has better range. Sasuke will no doubt close in. But without knowledge he will chidori hidan then get scratched. From there he dies 

mifune isnt goign to cut him in half before getting scratched. loooooooool. hidan has much better feats than hanzo. please stop yourself. 

part 1 kakashi looses to darui quite casually. black lightning>>anything kakashi had or has bar kamui. black lightning is sage enhanced lightning. So no darui is very much low kage level. with ranton which is good for mid range snipping and black lightning, i dont see any jounin level beating him at all. 

As for  his match with hidan. unless he goes for the head shot he laughably dies


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## Ghost (Jan 20, 2015)

HahAHHAHAHAHH

He loses badly in every match


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## The Pirate on Wheels (Jan 20, 2015)

I see no problems with Sasuke keeping track of Hidan's scythe with his sharingan, and using his superior speed to close the distance.  Eiso has a much better range that Hidan's scythe as well, and I'm certain Sasuke can get within ten meters.  Yes, Sasuke will probably stab Hidan in the chest with eiso first, but it won't be a mutual blow, and Hidan doesn't play dead like certain other blonde regenerators.  Assuming he did scratch Sasuke, Sasuke will probably try to chop him apart, much as he did to Orochimaru, and I don't believe Hidan will have time to draw his circle and complete his ritual with Sasuke on top of him.

Um.  Mifune's base sword cuts steel, and he drew with Taka's chidori-gatana.  Hanzo might have been weaker than his Sannin slaying prime, but the handseals of any top ninja, particularly ninjutsu oriented ones as he was implied to be, are going to be amount the fastest movements in the series.  Recall that what was originally the scariest thing about the sharingan, was that it allowed the user to discern the opponents otherwise invisible to the ninja eye hand seals, and that makes sense.  Mifune's quick draw from 10 meters stops them cold at the first seal, because that's all the opening he needs.  I don't see the slowest attacker in Akatsuki keeping up with that kind of rush.  He certainly isn't going to get to draw his circle, that takes longer than any jutsu we've seen since Zabuza's 208 seal water vortex.  By feats, he couldn't even keep up with Shikamaru's tantodori iado.

Darui...I struggle to see Darui defeat any kage.  Hence my reluctance to call him kage class.


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## wooly Eullerex (Jan 20, 2015)

yeah, I personally can't be as forgiving w/ hidans limited character as U can, Icegaze.

I understand the narrative on how intel is suppose to elevate him, but it just doesn't seem plausible when he isn't dominant at something

at best, he only beats darui


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## StarWanderer (Jan 20, 2015)

Hidan is not a kage level at all.


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## The Pirate on Wheels (Jan 20, 2015)

I try to be forgiving, but I really have no idea what he's supposed to be good at or do.  It's really hard for me to imagine him beating fleshed out characters when I can't even guess his powers, and he has so many anti-feats.  Well, I suppose I could say Shikamaru is faster than Asuma, but that doesn't work because he fought Asuma later too.


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## Katou (Jan 20, 2015)

I thought he was just Asuma level. . just slightly higher


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## StarWanderer (Jan 20, 2015)

Wallachia said:


> I thought he was just Asuma level. . just slightly higher



Jonin level.


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## Katou (Jan 20, 2015)

so in other words. . .not a kage level


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## Alex Payne (Jan 20, 2015)

War Arc Darui is not Kage-level. Hidan would shrug off most of his offense and either get the blood or simply mortally wound him after he tires. Darui can only win via chopping Hidan's head off or cutting of his limbs. Raiton-enhancement helps but I don't see him doing so without losing some blood. Hidan is sufficiently skilled in CQC and with his unorthodox style is more than a match for Darui imo. 

Hebi Sasuke shitstomps Hidan with Raiton Kusanagi, Eiso, Genjutsu, snake binding and everything else. He isn't Low-Kage in my eyes. 

Mifune should win with difficulty. He is faster, more skilled, uses enhanced weapon + ranged slashes. He might lose without knowledge but he is overall superior to Hidan.


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## Amol (Jan 20, 2015)

I don't consider Hidan Kage level.
And all three of them has more than good chance of beating him.


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## Dominus (Jan 20, 2015)

Not sure how defeating people who are at best between Kage and jonin-level (Darui, Mifune) is supposed to prove Hidan is on the level of an average Kage.


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## SSMG (Jan 20, 2015)

Darui beats him every time. Storm circus decimates hidan and his limited range.
If he goes in for close range he gets beaten at his own game. Darui makes his sword raiton cuts through hidans scythe and pins him down like he did to suigetsu.


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## Icegaze (Jan 20, 2015)

looooooooooooooooooool @ SSMG you sound like davizwiz. storm circus has ZERO FEATS to suggest it would do anything other than knock hidan back. kakuzu with zukoku, atsugi, gian and domu already said he cannot kill hidan. their fighting style is centered around that. combined they vastly exceed storm circus

sadly hidan has shown better agility and has better range. i dont see how darui is immune to being scratched 


also i seriously dont see how anyone cay mifune isnt low kage level or hebi sasuke. They are above elite jounin. Asuma is the definition of that.


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## StarWanderer (Jan 20, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> looooooooooooooooooool @ SSMG you sound like davizwiz. storm circus has ZERO FEATS to suggest it would do anything other than knock hidan back. kakuzu with zukoku, atsugi, gian and domu already said he cannot kill hidan. their fighting style is centered around that. combined they vastly exceed storm circus
> 
> sadly hidan has shown better agility and has better range. i dont see how darui is immune to being scratched
> 
> ...



Kisame cant kill him, but he can defeat him easily by decapitating him and cutting off his arms and legs. 

Hidan can be defeated easily by allmost any kage level shinobi in Narutoverse. Hidan isnt kage level shinobi. He is a jonin level.


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## The Pirate on Wheels (Jan 20, 2015)

> sadly hidan has shown better agility and has better range.


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## SSMG (Jan 20, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> looooooooooooooooooool @ SSMG you sound like davizwiz. storm circus has ZERO FEATS to suggest it would do anything other than knock hidan back. kakuzu with zukoku, atsugi, gian and domu already said he cannot kill hidan. their fighting style is centered around that. combined they vastly exceed storm circus
> 
> sadly hidan has shown better agility and has better range. i dont see how darui is immune to being scratched
> 
> ...



First off ...you don't need to kill someone to beat them in a fight...
 Bur yeah storm circus woukd push him back and then keep him down with the raiton that's infused in laser circus. I also forgot about black lightning so yeah hidan gets decimated from a distance as I said.

And lemme kno when hidan can blitz someone like gin or kin until then he doesn't have better agility than darui. Also I never once claimed darui is immune to get ting scratched. Just that hidan isn't able to do so.


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## Icegaze (Jan 20, 2015)

Raiton isnt infused in laser circus or kinkaku would have pointed it out that it had some numbing properties 

Black lightning will shock hidan and he will keep moving why would that kill him or stop him??

darui did not blitz kin or gin. not once but yh nice try 

I am saying hidan is entirely capable of doing so. why? because darui will soon realize this guy keeps coming safest way to stop that is to take his head off. 

@pirate. you are right, laser circus got ridiculous range i forgot that. thanks for the correction. However it has no fire power at all. what is it supposed to do that kakuzu techniques cant?


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## SSMG (Jan 20, 2015)

Laser circus is a mixture of raiton and suiton... So yes it has raiton in it. Also even if it only knocks hidan down that gives darui time to captialize with black lightning.

I'd keep him paralyzed long enough for darui to stick him with a raiton sword to keep him down for good.

He did blitz one of em when he cut off whichevers arm he cut off.

And if hidan goes in for cqc he gets hus scythe cut down but a raiton sword and then gets said sword stuck in his gullet.


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## Deer Lord (Jan 20, 2015)

> Hidan
> Kage level

lol.

Some people have very wide standarts when it comes to kage lv.
Hidan is elite jounin-tier, yes. And there's no shame in that, there's no need to call him "kage-level" to hype him up.

Darui and mifune should be higher on the same tier, and they'll beat hidan due to better skills.
Sauce should be higher than any of these guys.
But calling any of them mid-kage is exaggerating.


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## The Pirate on Wheels (Jan 20, 2015)

Laser circus seems like a jutsu that's really hard to dodge.  It's multiple guided beam that can bend and curve in any direction.

Apparently it has enough punch to distract the juubi, and it has enough to blow back  in a tailed state.  It's more about precision than raw destruction.  The blasting seems to be blunt force, which I agree won't take down Hidan, but it can be useful for disarming him.


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## Ghost (Jan 20, 2015)

>Hidan unaffected by direct hit from Laser Circus or Black Panther

yeah no. Darui uses that instance to chop Hidan in half.


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## Sword of the Morning (Jan 20, 2015)

Hidan does not rule the low Kage Class. Darui defeats him with low-mid difficulty.

Darui spits out Suitons before MS Sasuke can blitz. He will have no problems repelling him with it then shooting Black Panther into it to fry him. I doubt that will kill Hidan but it at the very least it will paralyze him and allow Darui the opening to cut his head off with Raiton Cleaver.

In CQC he gets beaten by Darui. Raiton Cleaver goes through his weapons and cuts him up. Darui bested Suigetsu, who is a master swordsman so he has the skills to beat someone like Hidan.

Daruis mass Laser Circus will kill Hidan and Hidan can't dodge it.


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## Sadgoob (Jan 20, 2015)

Deer Lord said:


> > Hidan
> > Kage level
> 
> lol.
> ...



Technically, A-rank is upper Jonin level for missions and techniques, and S-rank is therefore Kage level. Akatsuki was said to be all S-rank criminals by Jiraiya in part one.​


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## Deer Lord (Jan 20, 2015)

Strategoob said:


> Technically, A-rank is upper Jonin level for missions and techniques, and S-rank is therefore Kage level. Akatsuki was said to be all S-rank criminals by Jiraiya in part one.​


That argument doesn't really hold tho.
By feats hidan is more in line with elite jonin rather than kage.
Even the weakest kage (Gaara at begining of part 2, or Rasa [depends of who you think is weaker]) can contend with the superior deidara.
HIdan gets murked by anyone on kage-tier, he's basically the weakest akatuski other than zetsu.

This of course applies the other way around. having the title of kage doesn't automatically make you kage-level in power. Old hiruzen is an example of that, he's weak feat-wise regardless of in-manga hype.


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## Kai (Jan 20, 2015)

Deer Lord said:


> Having the title of kage doesn't automatically make you kage-level in power.


This is false by the very definition of the term.

Being a Kage signifies one is Kage level. Even if there's a power discrepancy compared to other Kage, one will just have to broaden their interpretation of the tiers.

It's no secret that the Kage spectrum is the widest out of any other tier category.


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## Sword of the Morning (Jan 20, 2015)

Strategoob said:


> Technically, A-rank is upper Jonin level for missions and techniques, and S-rank is therefore Kage level. Akatsuki was said to be all S-rank criminals by Jiraiya in part one.​



Jiraiya said* most *of them appeared in the Bingo Book, not all of them. Some people like Kakuzu and Hidan were never in the Bingo Book (they slaughtered their people before they left and hell, Kakuzu did his crimes 70+ years ago when a Bingo Book and Ranks weren't even apart of society yet.) and who knows who else wasn't in the book. Also, the criminals are given their rank based on the crimes they've committed, not how powerful they are as shinobi.


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## Icegaze (Jan 20, 2015)

The Pirate on Wheels said:


> Laser circus seems like a jutsu that's really hard to dodge.  It's multiple guided beam that can bend and curve in any direction.
> 
> Apparently it has enough punch to distract the juubi, and it has enough to blow back  in a tailed state.  It's more about precision than raw destruction.  The blasting seems to be blunt force, which I agree won't take down Hidan, but it can be useful for disarming him.



kinkaku was in base. thank you very much. Laser circus is just that a beam of light. big whoop!!!



@SSMG laser circus has no feats to suggest it will knock hidan any further than any of kakuzu jutsu. i can believe he can run through them all the while getting hit and keep moving considering he cant die. laser circus has zero feats to suggest it can numb. the only thing is does is shine really bright which makes it harder to dodge. but hidan wont be dodging them

as for paralysing hidan with raiton its possible. But again considering his combintation techniques with kakuzu i seriously doubt being hit by lightning would paralyse him that long 

 also would not put darui cqc skills far above asuma, however hidan skills certainly are


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## Sword of the Morning (Jan 20, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> kinkaku was in base. thank you very much. Laser circus is just that a beam of light. big whoop!!!
> 
> @SSMG laser circus has no feats to suggest it will knock hidan any further than any of kakuzu jutsu. i can believe he can run through them all the while getting hit and keep moving considering he cant die. laser circus has zero feats to suggest it can numb. the only thing is does is shine really bright which makes it harder to dodge. but hidan wont be dodging them
> 
> ...



Darui only pushed Kinkaku back because he was holding Samui. If he went all out the blasts would have probably killed Samui so he had a reason not using it the way he could.

You believing Hidan can run through them is completely baseless.

You must not read the manga well to claim all they do is shine really bright when each use of it showed they cause explosions.

Raiton doesn't need to paralyze him long, only a brief moment so Darui can shoot Laser Circus right after then chop his head off.

Another baseless claim. You say Hidans CQC skills are better than Darui just because you think it should be that way. Its funny though because Darui has beaten people who are superior to Asuma in CQC.

Are you trolling?


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## Icegaze (Jan 20, 2015)

Sword of the Morning said:


> Darui only pushed Kinkaku back because he was holding Samui. If he went all out the blasts would have probably killed Samui so he had a reason not using it the way he could.
> 
> You believing Hidan can run through them is completely baseless.
> 
> ...



you believing they can kill or stop hidan is even more baseless and laughable. Considering when the bunch of lasers hit kinkaku it didnt even keep him down at all. 
This was after he used it the first time btw

Yes they cause very little explosions hence why the greater the number the more useful. 

Darui will need knowledge to chop his head off. most ninja for some odd kishi reason  hardly go for the head shot. Thats generally zabuza way of fighting

I dont think it should be that way, he showed more skill and agility blame kishi not me 

he also has a weapon that helps said ability. in cqc darui really didnt do much, he slash kinkaku arm while kinkaku foolishly jumped at him. Beyond that he didnt show much more

No but i believe you are trolling considering how you go on about laser circus which so far have done nothing in the manga. They are guided lasers with minimal power. I dont see how someone tanks for a living atsugi and kakuzu other techniques and its laser circus which is somehow going to be a problem for hidan


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## Sword of the Morning (Jan 20, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> you believing they can kill or stop hidan is even more baseless and laughable. Considering when the bunch of lasers hit kinkaku it didnt even keep him down at all.
> This was after he used it the first time btw



You claiming it didn't keep him down at all despite Kinkaku didn't resurface until the end of the chapter along with the fact the Darui managed to used the other Sage Tools on Ginkaku and hold a conversation with him before sealing him is whats laughable.



Icegaze said:


> Yes they cause very little explosions hence why the greater the number the more useful.



Based on what they cause very little explosions? The great number of beams makes them harder to evade and makes it able to hit more targets.



Icegaze said:


> Darui will need knowledge to chop his head off. most ninja for some odd kishi reason  hardly go for the head shot. Thats generally zabuza way of fighting



Dude, it does not matter. If Darui goes for head, torso, or leg attack. The Raiton Cleaver is taking off limbs. What part of that do you not understand?



Icegaze said:


> I dont think it should be that way, he showed more skill and agility blame kishi not me



Yeah, his skills were getting tagged by Hidan for his blood and only managing to get a clean attack on him when Shikamaru locked him down. Darui bested Suigetsu no difficulty with no scars, and was barely serious. Suigetsu is a master swordsman by the way who would beat Hidan and Asuma in a sword fight.




Icegaze said:


> No but i believe you are trolling considering how you go on about laser circus which so far have done nothing in the manga. They are guided lasers with minimal power. I dont see how someone tanks for a living atsugi and kakuzu other techniques and its laser circus which is somehow going to be a problem for hidan



Laser Circus is an explosive attack, not a cutting one, so you can't even compare it to Atsugi. They don't even damage the same way.


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## Nikushimi (Jan 20, 2015)

Hidan is not even Kage-level; he lost to Shikamaru--a Chuunin--with prep. The weakest Kage are Mei and Hiruzen, and they would both destroy Hidan easily.



Icegaze said:


> hidan takes on Mifune, darui and hebi sasuke



Hidan gets babyshaken. Mifune can chakra-coat his blade, while Sasuke and Darui both have Raiton; all three of them can cut through Hidan's scythe and make lunch meat out of him. They're all significantly faster than he is, and Sasuke and Darui have other Ninjutsu (and Genjutsu, in Sasuke's case) to supplement their augmented Kenjutsu. There is nothing Hidan can do.


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## Silver Fang (Jan 20, 2015)

Sword of the Morning said:


> You claiming it didn't keep him down at all despite Kinkaku didn't resurface until the end of the chapter along with the fact the Darui managed to used the other Sage Tools on Ginkaku and hold a conversation with him before sealing him is whats laughable.



Well I notice that too, and wondered where Kinkaku was while his brother was in trouble. However, lets not forget they were standing on water. So the attack may have been strong enough to knock Kinkaku under the water, thus he'd have to swim back up.


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## UchihaX28 (Jan 20, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> Raiton isnt infused in laser circus or kinkaku would have pointed it out that it had some numbing properties
> 
> Black lightning will shock hidan and he will keep moving why would that kill him or stop him??
> 
> ...



 To be fair, Darui's Raiton used against Sasuke never pointed out to have numbed Sasuke in any way even when in combination with Suiton, but it's still clear that it's Raiton. Even Sasuke using Raiton on himself never numbed himself anyways.

 As for black lightning, I'm not sure what it's feats are,  but if it's powerful, then it will knock Hidan back as it's clear he still feels pain, but then again, he could tank Kakuzu's Futon and consistently uses it as a normal combo pointed out by Ino, so who knows. If it really has no fire power, it's not really hurting Hidan. None of Darui's Raiton will affect Hidan if Sasuke tanked his Raiton w/ Suiton combination like it was nothing.


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## JuicyG (Jan 20, 2015)

StarWanderer said:


> Hidan is not a kage level at all.




His passive immortal abilities say otherwise. If someone who didn't know about his immortality were to fight Hidan, he'd be at an instant disadvantage. His strength, speed, and kenjutsu skills alone make him high jounin level as we say him fighting Kakashi while dodging Shikamaru's shadows


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## blackguyinpinksuit (Jan 20, 2015)

If hidan can't even realistically beat people like mei, rasa, hiruzen and tsunade then he is not kage level. 

Immortality is good when your opponent can't lay you all over the floor in pieces or just straight out erase your body. 

Gotta admit his skills were not fleshed out enough he got shafted. He might be able to beat kurotsuchi and that shy guy if they are considered kage level because they are kage lol.


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## The Pirate on Wheels (Jan 20, 2015)

Strategoob said:


> Technically, A-rank is upper Jonin level for missions and techniques, and S-rank is therefore Kage level. Akatsuki was said to be all S-rank criminals by Jiraiya in part one.​



I think originally, only the Hokage was allowed to take on S-rank missions, which were few and far between.  That changed somewhere after early part one, but the idea behind the structure might have filtered through.


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## The Pirate on Wheels (Jan 20, 2015)

Can we stop saying "kill Hidan?". He can't he killed.  But being unable to die doesn't mean he can't get blown up.  I find it hard to believe that tower of lasers packs less punch than the exploding tags Shikamaru maimed Hidan with.


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## The Pirate on Wheels (Jan 20, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> kinkaku was in base. thank you very much. Laser circus is just that a beam of light. big whoop!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Kinkaku hung out in the stomach of the the 100% Kyuubi feeding on his lining.  Kumo theorized that worked because he was a descendant of the Rikkudo Sennin himself.  Orochimaru punched the 4 tails 50% jin, and his arm exploded in violent chakra fire, and Sakure needed medical intervention from Kabuto and herself to prevent imminent death when Sanbi scratched her.  

Big whoop?


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## Sadgoob (Jan 20, 2015)

blackguyinpinksuit said:


> If hidan can't even realistically beat people like mei, rasa, hiruzen and tsunade then he is not kage level.



The problem with this is that the shown Kage in the manga are likely stronger than the unrevealed Kage, for the most part (Kabuto brought back the best.) Also, I'd say Hidan could beat p1 Tsunade. 

More importantly though, he can put down elite Jonin pretty fast, and Asuma said himself that Hidan was out of his league. And Hidan pretty much proved it by taking him down fast.

Therefore, if an elite Jonin says someone is way out of his league, and if Hidan's a stated S-rank (literally Kage class) then it's safe to say that the dude is a Kage level. A low Kage to be sure, but still.​


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## UchihaX28 (Jan 20, 2015)

The Pirate on Wheels said:


> Can we stop saying "kill Hidan?". He can't he killed.  But being unable to die doesn't mean he can't get blown up.  I find it hard to believe that tower of lasers packs less punch than the exploding tags Shikamaru maimed Hidan with.



 Well, his head was partially cut off to begin with.


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## blackguyinpinksuit (Jan 20, 2015)

Strategoob said:


> The problem with this is that the shown Kage in the manga are likely stronger than the unrevealed Kage, for the most part (Kabuto brought back the best.)​



There is truth in what you say 3rd raikage was said to be the greatest raikage, yagura was a know perfect jinchuriki, hokage were unavailable at the time, Muu was said to be the only person beside onoki to have kekkai tota hax(first tsuchikage probably couldn't compare to that) and i guess the 3rd kazekage couldn't be brought back for some reason.



> Also, I'd say Hidan could beat p1 Tsunade.


If it's no knowledge then he could pull it off. Besides her physical stats(like speed) not being up to par. Creation rebirth needing to be consciously sustained would be problematic if he just went crazy on himself. Katsuyu spraying acid every might take too long.



> More importantly though, he can put down elite Jonin pretty fast, and Asuma said himself that Hidan was out of his league. And Hidan pretty much proved it by taking him down fast.


Hidan did need kakuzu help to continue battling tho(after asuma and shikamaru cut his head off) granted if shika wasn't there stalling him he would have been all over asuma. Asuma looked scared shitless but despite his claim it's not like he performed tiers behind asuma or anything.



> Therefore, if an elite Jonin says someone is way out of his league, and if Hidan's a stated S-rank (literally Kage class) then it's safe to say that the dude is a Kage level. A low Kage to be sure, but still.


So hidan for weakest kage level then? Because he can't really win against any of them(that have been shown fighting in part 2). His speed and strength is nothing special, his durability towards cutting attacks(which can disassemble him) is pitiful, no summons, no ranged attacks, bad intelligence, only got his little hax and some good scythe moves.


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## Icegaze (Jan 21, 2015)

The Pirate on Wheels said:


> Kinkaku hung out in the stomach of the the 100% Kyuubi feeding on his lining.  Kumo theorized that worked because he was a descendant of the Rikkudo Sennin himself.  Orochimaru punched the 4 tails 50% jin, and his arm exploded in violent chakra fire, and Sakure needed medical intervention from Kabuto and herself to prevent imminent death when Sanbi scratched her.
> 
> Big whoop?



what does that have anything to do with what am discussing. especially the sanbi bit which sounds like filler. which doesnt exist to me
Yes i know about kinkaku and his bro...still laser circus did nothing to him in base. nothing at all 

i am glad they theorized.  Orochimaru punched the 4 tails and nothing happened to his hand 


it was when he used snake hands that the snake melted.  it did not explode in any violent chakra of anything. wow i love your fanfic. You should write more


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## Bonly (Jan 23, 2015)

Hidan is not Mid Kage level just solid Low Kage level and he'd lose to Darui,Hebi Sasuke, and Mifune more times then not.


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## RedChidori (Jan 23, 2015)

Kai said:


> No knowledge gives Hidan a tremendous advantage against people of the same class. Shikamaru struggled with sweat and tears trying to figure out the mechanics behind Hidan's kinjutsu and still couldn't prevent Asuma's death after the fact.
> 
> He kills Mifune and Darui, neither of whom possess problems for his ritual without knowledge. Sasuke puts Hidan down with genjutsu before the ritual gets a chance to shine. No knowledge of the Sharingan's illusions takes precedent before preparation.



I agree with Kai .


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## StarWanderer (Jan 23, 2015)

Hidan is not a kage level at all. He is an experienced jonin level.


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## SSMG (Jan 23, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> kinkaku was in base. thank you very much. Laser circus is just that a beam of light. big whoop!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Maybe laser circus will numb maybe it won't. It would however knock back hidan long enough for darui to close the distance and stick his raiton infused in hidan pinning him down like he did to suigetsu. Also black lightning would do this as well keeping hidan down longer than laser circus allowing the same follow up strategy.

Also there's nothing to suggest hidan won't be paralyzed by the raiton sword. He's immortal but his body still he gets affected by attacks like a regular shinobi would. He can just tank the damage most of the time. But iirc he's never tanked a paralyzing hit.

And meh I'd beg to differ. Darui was on par with v1 eis speed. Can handle a fight with base gin and kin in cqc so I'd say he's just as good if not better than hidan in that regards. But there's not much to directly compare them to which makes this part a matter of opinion.


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## UchihaX28 (Jan 23, 2015)

But Darui can't even beat a Suigetsu with a broken sword.


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## Trojan (Jan 23, 2015)

NarutoX28 said:


> But Darui can't even beat a Suigetsu with a broken sword.



Except he did. 

the second panel from the bottom. 
Link removed


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## UchihaX28 (Jan 23, 2015)

Hussain said:


> Except he did.
> 
> the second panel from the bottom.
> Link removed



 Sulgetsu was off-guard doe which allowed Darui to get range in the first place. Hidan won't be off-guard and will be too busy trying to chop Darui's head off which means Darui won't have to time to prepare Raiton and use it on Hidan.


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## Trojan (Jan 23, 2015)

How was he off-guard? As far as I am concerned, Darui is the one who was worry about C when he was attacked.

As for his battle with Hidan, I don't really care, I was only talking about that point, and I honestly haven't read anything else in this thread yet. 
(other than your post obviously)


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## UchihaX28 (Jan 23, 2015)

Hussain said:


> How was he off-guard? As far as I am concerned, Darui is the one who was worry about C when he was attacked.
> 
> As for his battle with Hidan, I don't really care, I was only talking about that point, and I honestly haven't read anything else in this thread yet.
> (other than your post obviously)



 No, Suigetsu was concerned about Sasuke's safety and was concerned if they were going to make it out there alive.


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## Gunstarvillain (Jan 23, 2015)

Hidan is only a problem if there is no knowledge, has his zombie brother otherwise I agree he is under mifune, yamato,either one of Ono's kageguard jonin.


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## Icegaze (Jan 24, 2015)

SSMG said:


> Maybe laser circus will numb maybe it won't. It would however knock back hidan long enough for darui to close the distance and stick his raiton infused in hidan pinning him down like he did to suigetsu. Also black lightning would do this as well keeping hidan down longer than laser circus allowing the same follow up strategy.
> 
> Also there's nothing to suggest hidan won't be paralyzed by the raiton sword. He's immortal but his body still he gets affected by attacks like a regular shinobi would. He can just tank the damage most of the time. But iirc he's never tanked a paralyzing hit.
> 
> And meh I'd beg to differ. Darui was on par with v1 eis speed. Can handle a fight with base gin and kin in cqc so I'd say he's just as good if not better than hidan in that regards. But there's not much to directly compare them to which makes this part a matter of opinion.



so you just claimed darui is as fast as V1 EI. so your saying darui could have stalled KCM naruto?
wow i am liking your fanfic darui more and more. 

SO i guess suigetsu is faster than both seeing that he intercepted them while coming much further. i am liking suigetsu even more 

again the entire strategy of hidan and kakuzu fight was for kakuzu to attack hidan and the enemy without discrimination using any element kakuzu pleased. if hidan was going to be paralyzed wont that put a solid dent in their plan 

there is nothing normal about hidan. He stabbed himself in the leg and could still walk while asuma was limping from then on. Cut his neck off. spine and all gone hidan can still talk and make jokes. And you think he can be paralyzed cuz he gets a little shock?

laser circus is entirely usesless i dont even know why you bring it up


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## SSMG (Jan 24, 2015)

Based from the feats in the manga, yes darui is that fast.

Also based on feats yes sug would also be that fast but hes not of concern ITT.

No it wouldn't, seeing as we've never seen kakuzu use his raiton to paralyze someone with it. 

Except for his durability is still normal. He gets cut like anyone else. His tolerance for pain(when the ritual is activated) is higher than normal which may or may not help him deal with raiton paralyzing effects. But if so you haven't proved why this is. On the contary he still got sliced from fuutons cutting effects and  so there's no reason raiton effects wouldn't effect him. 

If he had his ritual up he has a better chance of resisting the effects of paralysis but he needs to get daruis blood for this which he needs to get close to darui for.. And laser circus and black panther put hidan down long before he gets this chance.

I've already explained to you how laser circus can be ultilized. Don't be daft now.


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## Nikushimi (Jan 24, 2015)

You have gotta be kidding me.

Mifune would quarter Hidan and gut him like a trout before he could blink.

Darui blitzes with his Raiton sword, Hidan tries to block...and that's all she wrote.


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## UchihaX28 (Jan 24, 2015)

To be fair, Asuma's Futon chakra couldn't break through Hidan's Scythe and Futon has stronger penetrative forces than Raiton does.


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## Bonly (Jan 24, 2015)

Asuma's Hein never clashed with Hidan's Scythe to have a chance to break(well cut in this case) through it


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## Punished Pathos (Jan 24, 2015)

Hidan special ability makes him low kage?
He needs his handler Kakuzu to make sure things go smoothly.
Shikamaru must be low kage since he was able to disable Hidan.

Sure, Hidan can tank some attacks but once someone figures out his little trick, Hidan is finished.


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## Gunstarvillain (Jan 24, 2015)

Punished Pathos said:


> Hidan special ability makes him low kage?
> He needs his handler Kakuzu to make sure things go smoothly.
> Shikamaru must be low kage since he was able to disable Hidan.
> 
> Sure, Hidan can tank some attacks but once someone figures out his little trick, Hidan is finished.



Exactly. A special class jonin and that's it.


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## Icegaze (Jan 25, 2015)

SSMG said:


> Based from the feats in the manga, yes darui is that fast.
> 
> Also based on feats yes sug would also be that fast but hes not of concern ITT.
> 
> ...



*Please everyone note SSMG just said suigetsu is faster than V1 Ei. please watch out for my suigetsu thread coming up. He will be blizting quite a few people on it. *

kisame gets stabbed by a kunai and his skin is pierced. does that mean his durability is normal? if so then i can just say asuma can survive hirudora as well. which means that type of attack would be laughed at by kakuzu. seeing that kunai cant touch kakuzu 

hidan never got cut by futton slicing effects. are you making stuff up?

you are being daft. laser circus is a waste of both their time. it has no feats to suggest it can even stall someone who normal way of fighting is to tank kakuzu jutsu which in terms of fire power vastly exceed laser circus. laser circus also cannot numb. no feats.


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## SSMG (Jan 25, 2015)

So ur going to make a spite thread because you don't actually read the manga? Gotcha. 

Kisame was barely pierced by killer bees sword stab. And killer bee has some extremely impressive strength feats. I don't know why you jump to kakuzu and asuma taking on a hirudora though as if that means anything to our discussion.. 

Hidan got his head cut off by a fuutons blade.  It wasn't the steel kunai part that cut off his head as the blood is only on the fuutons edge, no where close to the kunai. So since he was effected by one element he should be affected by another.

So you concede that black lightning will put down hidan no problem. Concession accepted. And since darui can put down hidan from a distance hell beat him every time so really this discussion is over.

For the laser circus it was able to put down an Edo tensei host momentarily. Since it could do this to an Edo tensei it could do so it hidan.


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## Patrick (Jan 25, 2015)

I consider Hebi Sasuke and Mifune not to be High Jounin and Darui is probably the absolute bottom of the Kage Tier. 

Out of these three I only see him barely beating Mifune anyway, so to answer your question I consider Hidan not even Low Kage.


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## IchLiebe (Jan 25, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> *Please everyone note SSMG just said suigetsu is faster than V1 Ei. please watch out for my suigetsu thread coming up. He will be blizting quite a few people on it. *



Please do, I hope you get banned. You make 30 spite threads a month and it gets annoying. Quit being butthurt and prove him wrong.


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## Icegaze (Jan 28, 2015)

then you are just as stupid as he is 
how on earth is suigetsu faster than V1 Ei 
wtf is wrong with you trolls 
there is nothing to prove wrong. the author clearly doesnt agree. 1 panel isnt the beginning and end to everything like you fools think
he did this in this panel therefore he can always pull it off. completely disregarding all and every scenario 

i guess and this one is going to be funny, as it will get to you. that haku is faster than war arc kakashi. actually every version of kakashi haku faced. 

you know intercepting kakashi twice and all  

go on prove me wrong! now. i am curious how your fanfic kakashi is going to be faster


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## DavyChan (Jan 28, 2015)

Hidan loses all cases.

Hebi Sasuke mid diffs him
Mifune High diffs him
Darui Extreme diffs him.

Ultimately, hidan sucks and is the worst akatsuki member by far.


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## IchLiebe (Jan 28, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> then you are just as stupid as he is
> how on earth is suigetsu faster than V1 Ei
> wtf is wrong with you trolls
> there is nothing to prove wrong. the author clearly doesnt agree. 1 panel isnt the beginning and end to everything like you fools think
> ...



Go ahead, I got scans and will shut your shit down. If you can't shut someone down when it's so obvious then that's fucking pathetic. But please, make whatever thread you want to or if you want I'll settle it in this thread. Try to argue Haku's as fast or faster than Kakashi and you're going to look fucking dumb.


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## Thunder (Jan 28, 2015)

Hidan remains a dangerous opponent against fighters of this level and below considering his weird abilities, especially if his opponents lack knowledge. 

But he's low kage at best. Mid kage is pushing it, I think.


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## Icegaze (Jan 29, 2015)

IchLiebe said:


> Go ahead, I got scans and will shut your shit down. If you can't shut someone down when it's so obvious then that's fucking pathetic. But please, make whatever thread you want to or if you want I'll settle it in this thread. Try to argue Haku's as fast or faster than Kakashi and you're going to look fucking dumb.



haku still intercepted twice

you have yet to counter that 
therefore haku>>kakashi in speed. its that simple 
using SSMG fail logic, which sounds similar to yours still kakashi is brought up. then the flip flopping begins


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## SSMG (Jan 29, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> then you are just as stupid as he is
> how on earth is suigetsu faster than V1 Ei
> wtf is wrong with you trolls
> there is nothing to prove wrong. the author clearly doesnt agree. 1 panel isnt the beginning and end to everything like you fools think
> ...



So you concede the orginial arugement that the topic at hand is about and move onto something that has nothing to do with the topic. Typical of someone whose points have not much substance behind them.

As to this post.  Your orginial point to which i agreed to about sugeistu was inherently flawed. Sugeistu may not have movement speed as fast as raikage since we don't know when sug started to move or how far exactly he was from sasuke as opposed to raikages starting posistion. 

We do know however he can react move in and block faster than v1 raikage can throw a punch. He wasnt in the frame at all for when raikage was bringing down his arm which is only a few feet to bring down his arm. Sugiestu had to cross a larger distance in order to get into position to block raikages arm. He did this in a faster time than raikages punch since he wasn't in the previous full shot frame at all. 

But darui did get into roughly the same spot from roughly the same starting spot of v1 raikage in the same time frame so he is in fact the same running speed as v1 raikage.. Unless you can prove otherwise.

As for hakus speed. Kakashi also intercepted zabuza who was equal to speed in haku at that time so its not mutually just haku intercepting kakashis speed.  But even if haku is as fast or faster than kakashi why does it matter? He's a speedster.


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## Icegaze (Jan 29, 2015)

ok SSMG 
hidan wasnt blitz by kakashi 
who is faster kakashi or darui?

the assumption that hidan gets put down by darui despite the ridiculous advantage hidan has is what baffles me. 

darui isnt too fast to be hit by hidan, and all hidan needs is 1 hit. darui must chop his head off to win. 

but yes sure darui with laser circus and all his impressive feats beats hidan, while kakuzu and hidan main method of fighting was for kakuuz to indiscriminately attack hidan suuuure


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## SSMG (Jan 29, 2015)

Hidan gets black lightninged long before he gets close to darui and puts him down once hes paralyzed by the BL.. If he gets close for whatever reason his scythe gets cut in half by a raiton sword or darui chops off his arm like he did to gin/kin(i say both of them since I forget which one this was)

There is no real feats to compare daruis speed to that point of the manga kakashi so I don't k ow why you bring up kakashi...

But if there's is feats for hidan being v1 raikage tier present them. Because daruis feat if attacking sasuke in unison with ei shows darui is faster than hidan.


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## Godaime Tsunade (Jan 29, 2015)

Hidan _rules_ the Low Kage level? Hell no, he doesn't have a place on that tier. 

Danzou, Chiyo, Hanzou, Sasori, Resu, Konan etc. would all wreck him. He's high up on the High/Elite Jounin tier, but he doesn't make it to Kage-level. I don't think Mifune or Darui are Mid Kage level either. I think Mifune is low Kage, and Darui is just below Hidan on the High Jounin tier.

With all that said, who is the strongest person I can see Hidan defeating? Under normal circumstances, the likes of sharinganless Kakashi, Darui or Kimimaro.​​


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## Icegaze (Jan 30, 2015)

Godaime Tsunade said:


> Hidan _rules_ the Low Kage level? Hell no, he doesn't have a place on that tier.
> 
> Danzou, Chiyo, Hanzou, Sasori, Resu, Konan etc. would all wreck him. He's high up on the High/Elite Jounin tier, but he doesn't make it to Kage-level. I don't think Mifune or Darui are Mid Kage level either. I think Mifune is low Kage, and Darui is just below Hidan on the High Jounin tier.
> 
> With all that said, who is the strongest person I can see Hidan defeating? Under normal circumstances, the likes of sharinganless Kakashi, Darui or Kimimaro.​​



hahah godaime you put danzo on low tier????? yet somehow tsunade isnt a chunin?
stop yourself 

danzou is far from low tier. as for chiyo i agree and konan perhaps yes. Hanzo gets lol raped by hidan. what is he going to do??? poison gas him? entirely possible that wont even work. 

Chiyo well..if she can hit hidan with the chakra saw or the paralyzing seals . However note all her other attacks arent an issue for hidan. 
She again isnt immune to getting scratched and isnt too fast for hidan to hit. 


@SSMG. kakashi who has shown more speed than darui failed to blitz hidan. hence why i brought kakashi up. so nope darui most certainly cannot blitz hidan. therefore he is very likely to get caught by hidan. if it was so easy to simply cut through hidan sycthe asuma would have done it

unless you want to start claiming darui>>>asuma. and he can blitz asuma and chop asuma head off before asuma can move. 

because asuma wasnt getting shit blitz by kisame who can react to killer bee. 

darui and hidan would fight each other and speed would not be an issue for either of them. 

unless you want to explain to me how kisame can get hit by asuma yet react to killer bee. despite killer bee having much much much better speed feats than asuma


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## IchLiebe (Jan 30, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> haku still intercepted twice
> 
> you have yet to counter that
> therefore haku>>kakashi in speed. its that simple
> using SSMG fail logic, which sounds similar to yours still kakashi is brought up. then the flip flopping begins



Haku is faster than part 1 Kakashi, yet Kakashi kept pace with Itachi? In part 2 Kakashi didn't have control of his body to he was, what 10-15 feet away from Zabuza and Haku came from offpanel so it was an interception feat. You can hardly use that and no one is going to except you and everyone knows it's wrong. Can Haku get behind Kakuzu and put a hole through him before he even knows what's going on? No. Can Haku come close to having reactions of Minato like Kakashi? No. 



Icegaze said:


> Hanzo gets lol raped by hidan. what is he going to do??? poison gas him? entirely possible that wont even work.



Hanzo is faster and yes, poison would wreck Hidan. His body still plays by normal rules, just not dieing. He still pisses, shits, eats, and bleeds.



> Chiyo well..if she can hit hidan with the chakra saw or the paralyzing seals . However note all her other attacks arent an issue for hidan.
> She again isnt immune to getting scratched and isnt too fast for hidan to hit.



Chiyo kept up with 100 puppets, she would wreck Hidan.



> @SSMG. kakashi who has shown more speed than darui failed to blitz hidan. hence why i brought kakashi up. so nope darui most certainly cannot blitz hidan. therefore he is very likely to get caught by hidan. if it was so easy to simply cut through hidan sycthe asuma would have done it



Kakashi never tried to blitz Hidan. He played defensive because he had knowledge of Hidan, aka can't be killed and a drop of blood is almost a death sentence. Kakashi pulled a kunai and started moving backwards against Hidan and never went on the offensive. Darui kept pace with v1 Ei, so does that mean v1 Ei can't blitz Hidan? 

And Asuma never had the chance to cut through his scythe. It's easy to buy a house, I just don't have the money.



> unless you want to start claiming darui>>>asuma. and he can blitz asuma and chop asuma head off before asuma can move.



Darui is faster but that doesn't mean Asuma doesn't have reflexes to keep up. Speed isn't everything. Reactions matter, skill matters, etc. KCM Naruto is faster than Obito but Obito could react, and I'm not talking Naruto throwing a punch. Obito outright blocked Naruto in fullspeed KCM shunshin.



> because asuma wasnt getting shit blitz by kisame who can react to killer bee.



Yes because Asuma has good reactions. Doesn't make him as fast as killer bee.



> darui and hidan would fight each other and speed would not be an issue for either of them.
> 
> unless you want to explain to me how kisame can get hit by asuma yet react to killer bee. despite killer bee having much much much better speed feats than asuma



Kisame reacted to Asuma, he dodged and everything. Asuma just had fuuton running through his knives and that's what cut Kisame.


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## Icegaze (Jan 30, 2015)

haku intercepted war arc kakashi and part 1 kakashi
so why cant he do all what kakashi did
since you agree with SSMG that suigetsu must be faster than Ei  V1 

feats of hanzo being faster than hidan please

hidan never failed to keep up with 100 puppets. that being the reason why chiyo would beat hidan is bullshit. 

chiyo also did not keep up with 100 puppets. and flat out admitted 1 on 1 sasori would bully her


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## DavyChan (Jan 30, 2015)

Godaime Tsunade said:


> Hidan _rules_ the Low Kage level? Hell no, he doesn't have a place on that tier.
> 
> Danzou, Chiyo, Hanzou, Sasori, Resu, Konan etc. would all wreck him. He's high up on the High/Elite Jounin tier, but he doesn't make it to Kage-level. I don't think Mifune or Darui are Mid Kage level either. I think Mifune is low Kage, and Darui is just below Hidan on the High Jounin tier.
> 
> With all that said, who is the strongest person I can see Hidan defeating? Under normal circumstances, the likes of sharinganless Kakashi, Darui or Kimimaro.​​



^^Why do u always have a good answer to things. Why?


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## IchLiebe (Jan 30, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> haku intercepted war arc kakashi and part 1 kakashi
> so why cant he do all what kakashi did
> since you agree with SSMG that suigetsu must be faster than Ei  V1



Ask any poster on here. Interception feats mean shit. Or what about Kakashi intercepting Pain, Sasuke, Obito, etc. And when did I ever say anything about suigetsu. Quit with the dumb shit and grow up. Can you do a post without bait?



> feats of hanzo being faster than hidan please



Blocking Mifune. Fighting all three sannin at once. Feats of Hidan's speed? 



> hidan never failed to keep up with 100 puppets. that being the reason why chiyo would beat hidan is bullshit.



Hidan got hit by Shikamaru, nuff said.



> chiyo also did not keep up with 100 puppets. and flat out admitted 1 on 1 sasori would bully her



She destroyed all 100 puppets with 10.


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## Icegaze (Jan 30, 2015)

IchLiebe said:


> Ask any poster on here. Interception feats mean shit. Or what about Kakashi intercepting Pain, Sasuke, Obito, etc. And when did I ever say anything about suigetsu. Quit with the dumb shit and grow up. Can you do a post without bait?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



i completely agree with you. interception means shit. hOwever you were dumb enough to agree with SSMG about suigetsu being fast or even anywhere near Ei V1 speed. Now that i bring up kakashi. you flip flop. why is that? if suigetsu is faster than Ei because he intercepted him as SSMG suggests then haku is faster than kakashi. Why agree to the former and not the latter. unless you didnt even read his post and just jumped at the chance to argue with me

Clearly i do not believe haku is faster than kakashi. but messing with you, to show you how flip floppy you are is certainly fun 

fighting young featless sanin. pointless to bring that up 

blocking mifune...good for hanzo. mind showing me mifune blitzing hidan...ill wait. Hidan isnt blitzing hanzo..hanzo isnt blitzing hidan. unless poison works. with what hanzo has shown he is going to get killed. 

she did not destroy all 100 puppets. jesus u make things up. sakura destroyed puppets. not all 100 were even defeated. they just got to sasori. 

not only do u flip flop u make shit up. wow..you are just the worst there is


----------



## IchLiebe (Jan 30, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> i completely agree with you. interception means shit. hOwever you were dumb enough to agree with SSMG about suigetsu being fast. Now that i bring up kakashi. you flip flop. why is that?



Fucking quote me then. You're so full of shit it's ridiculous. I said prove him wrong and quit acting like a little butthurt bitch. I never said anything about who was faster nor about whatever the fuck y'all were debating. 



> Clearly i do not believe haku is faster than kakashi. but messing with you, to show you how flip floppy you are is certainly fun



Never flip flopped shit. Maybe if you had some reading comprehension you would know. But you got that shit in reverse. 

Person A- Suigetsu is faster than v1 Ei.
You- "shit, more shit, I'm going to make a thread, a pile of shit"
Me- "Hope you get banned for spite threads since you make 30 a year. Quit being butthurt and prove him wrong."
You- "MOUNTAIN OF SHIT, you agreed with him so I'm going to take a stance I know is wrong to prove you wrong"

You see who look fucking retarded there? Hint: Not me and not person A. And no, that doesn't mean I agree with person A because I don't find what he said stupid.



> fighting young featless sanin. pointless to bring that up



Featless? Tsunade was an amazing medic ninja who countered every poison made, Jiraiya trained at frog mountain, and Orochimaru was a genius in line for Hokage. That alone says everything.



> blocking mifune...good for hanzo. mind showing me mifune blitzing hidan...ill wait



Mind showing me v1 Ei blitzing Suigetsu...I'll wait.



> she did not destroy all 100 puppets. jesus u make things up. sakura destroyed puppets. not all 100 were even defeated. they just got to sasori.



Beating Sasori means stopping the puppets. Doing that with 10 means destroying.


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## SSMG (Jan 30, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> @SSMG. kakashi who has shown more speed than darui failed to blitz hidan. hence why i brought kakashi up. so nope darui most certainly cannot blitz hidan. therefore he is very likely to get caught by hidan. if it was so easy to simply cut through hidan sycthe asuma would have done it
> 
> unless you want to start claiming darui>>>asuma. and he can blitz asuma and chop asuma head off before asuma can move.
> 
> ...



What feats are comparable for darui and kakashi to lead you to make the claim kakashi is faster?

Asuma did cut through a weapon hidan was using when they clashed.
Well you can't train your inner body. It can be a critical hit even for the toughest guy
If hidan wasn't wielding that jonnins sword and was using his scythe, i don't see why it wouldn't cut through the scythe.

What? You don't need to be able to decapitate asuma to be faster than hidan.. Since asuma decapiated hidan that logic doesn't work. Darui could be in asumas speed tier and be able to put raiton into hidan.. 

So? Darui wasnt getting blitzd by gin and kin who raikage thought he needed to handle directly.  Also kisame was facing a tailed beast for killer bee and he stated himself the stronger his opponent the stronger he gets. He also previously fought and beat the four tailed beast which would have boosted his chakra levels as well. And also the fact that kisame was toying with asuma. And he could have also gotten stronger during the three year time skip. And also theres the power creep as well. That's five different explanations for ya.

You know what would be an issue for hidan? Daruis ranged attack such as Black lightning.. which you keep convenintly ignoring. Why is this? Is it because it shuts down your whole argument? If you fail to address this again I'm not even waste my time responding to you.


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## SSMG (Jan 30, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> i completely agree with you. interception means shit. hOwever you were dumb enough to agree with SSMG about suigetsu being fast or even anywhere near Ei V1 speed. Now that i bring up kakashi. you flip flop. why is that? if suigetsu is faster than Ei because he intercepted him as SSMG suggests then haku is faster than kakashi. Why agree to the former and not the latter. unless you didnt even read his post and just jumped at the chance to argue with me
> 
> Clearly i do not believe haku is faster than kakashi. but messing with you, to show you how flip floppy you are is certainly fun
> 
> ...


 I just want to point out that you suggested suigestus speed placement in this topic, no one mentioned suigestu until you brought him up. I merely agreed with your suggestion...But I did recant that agreement with you so don't try and put that on me here.


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## Icegaze (Jan 30, 2015)

IchLiebe said:


> Fucking quote me then. You're so full of shit it's ridiculous. I said prove him wrong and quit acting like a little butthurt bitch. I never said anything about who was faster nor about whatever the fuck y'all were debating.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Well you one brilliant poster are you 
Stopping Sasori isn't the same as destroying 100 puppets 
The same way beating itachi because he dies from susanoo usage isn't the same as breaching his susanoo 
But you are too smart to get that 

If u dumb fuck didn't agree with SSMG why ask me to prove him wrong ??

Young Sannin are featless . Same way the hanzo that fought them is featless. They could all have been weaker than shikamaru at the time . No way to knw their level . Unless you then want to imply they were so strong back then therefore mifune beating hanzo means he can compete with either of the current Sannin

Suigetsu isn't faster than Ei that SSMG who thinks that not me 

So I take it you have no way to prove hanzo is faster 

I get you then. Why make the claim. I never claimed hidan was faster 

It's not relevant . Neither have shown or implied any speed to suggest speed would be a dominat factor in their battle 

Speed is only relevant in a battle when one is an actual speedster being simply faster early isn't enough . Or kisame who could keep up with bee would have shit blitz asuma but failed to do so


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## SSMG (Jan 30, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> Suigetsu isn't faster than Ei that SSMG who thinks that not me



No ice. I think darui is as fast as v1 ei to which you basically conceded this point and replied by bringing up sugeitsu.. I agreed with your notion as long as if that's what the feat suggests. But then once I reread the chapter and realized that isnt wjat the feat suggest I told you how your analogy of bringing up sugietsu was wrong.


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## IchLiebe (Jan 30, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> Well you one brilliant poster are you
> Stopping Sasori isn't the same as destroying 100 puppets
> The same way beating itachi because he dies from susanoo usage isn't the same as breaching his susanoo
> But you are too smart to get that



If you beat Itachi while susanoo is up, you got past susanoo...No? If you damage the 3rd raikage when his raiton shroud is up, then you got past his defense. Etc, etc, you're wrong.



> If u dumb fuck didn't agree with SSMG why ask me to prove him wrong ??



Because you were threatening to make another spite thread and, even though I do it sometimes, you do it 5 times a week and make it sound like a whiny bitch who wants someone to agree with him. If it was as simple as you said it was then you should be able to prove it.



> Young Sannin are featless . Same way the hanzo that fought them is featless. They could all have been weaker than shikamaru at the time . No way to knw their level . Unless you then want to imply they were so strong back then therefore mifune beating hanzo means he can compete with either of the current Sannin



Shikamaru =/> the Sannin.




> Suigetsu isn't faster than Ei that SSMG who thinks that not me



Apparently you're twisting his words like you did mine, not surprising.  Whining tends to have that affect.



> So I take it you have no way to prove hanzo is faster



I forgot who we were talking about. But most like faster and better reactions.



> I get you then. Why make the claim. I never claimed hidan was faster



I don't know what you're talking about because your post is a jumbled mess. Do multi-quotes in your post. [.quote] to start it and [./quote] to end it, without the periods btw.



> It's not relevant . Neither have shown or implied any speed to suggest speed would be a dominat factor in their battle



Again, no idea what you're talking about.



> Speed is only relevant in a battle when one is an actual speedster being simply faster early isn't enough . Or kisame who could keep up with bee would have shit blitz asuma but failed to do so



I agree. You've been giving the opposite impression though.


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## Icegaze (Jan 31, 2015)

Ichi
You claimed chiyo destroyed the 100 puppets 
That means you are claiming Sakura destroyed none 
And all 100 were defeated 
Neither are true. So why use that as a basis to say chiyo can beat hidan 
When it's not like hidan ever fought Sasori 

Young Sannin have no feats therefore pointless to bring them up. Their level is irrelevant . They were far weaker than they were now . We have no idea what jutsu they had or how fast they were . Hanzo beating them means nothing . Unless you want to agree to the fact that mifune could do the same . Since you obviously won't agree to that stfu

Like I have said which you are too slow to understand neither hanzo or hidan can blitz each other

Prove I post 5 times a week 
I'll wait


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## IchLiebe (Jan 31, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> Ichi
> You claimed chiyo destroyed the 100 puppets
> That means you are claiming Sakura destroyed none
> And all 100 were defeated



Beating Sasori is defeating the puppets as he had them out at the time. And you clearly don't know what exaggeration is.



> Neither are true. So why use that as a basis to say chiyo can beat hidan
> When it's not like hidan ever fought Sasori



Chiyo against the 100 puppets showed more than enough to beat Hidan. Madara never fought Konohamaru but using logic and feats I can tell you Madara fucking destroys him.



> Young Sannin have no feats therefore pointless to bring them up. Their level is irrelevant . They were far weaker than they were now . We have no idea what jutsu they had or how fast they were . Hanzo beating them means nothing . Unless you want to agree to the fact that mifune could do the same . Since you obviously won't agree to that stfu



We have Hanzo's hype. We have the Sannin's hype. Put it together. Mifune said the only reason he could beat Hanzo was because he grew "dull".



> Like I have said which you are too slow to understand neither hanzo or hidan can blitz each other



Did I ever say such? No, you just keep throwing words in my mouth trying to start shit. I said Hanzo was faster, NEVER did I even imply Hanzo would blitz. This is what I mean by acting like a butthurt bitch. I say Hanzo is faster and 10 posts over you've turned it into me saying Hanzo blitz's. I said prove Ei was faster than Suigetsu instead of being butthurt and you turn it into me saying Suigetsu was faster than v1 Ei. It's fucking annoying, actually read the post and grow up.



> Prove I post 5 times a week
> I'll wait





Need more? That's 5 times in 5 days right there.


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## Icegaze (Jan 31, 2015)

IchLiebe said:


> Beating Sasori is defeating the puppets as he had them out at the time. And you clearly don't know what exaggeration is.



So you admit you were exaggerating then? good just wanted to point that out. simple fact she did not destroy the 100 puppets. we have sakura destroying 1 on panel. Even if chiyo did, how is that any basis to say she is above hidan?



> Chiyo against the 100 puppets showed more than enough to beat Hidan. Madara never fought Konohamaru but using logic and feats I can tell you Madara fucking destroys him.



How did she show more than enough. what cant hidan deal with. hidan against asuma and shikamaru showed more than enough to be able to scratch chiyo which is all he needs to win



> We have Hanzo's hype. We have the Sannin's hype. Put it together. Mifune said the only reason he could beat Hanzo was because he grew "dull".



all we know is dull hanzo. why bring anyting else up. its dull hanzo we are talking about here. since, the proper hanzo was never shown. so using that to say he will be much stronger than hidan is baseless. and typical of your BS. 



> Did I ever say such? No, you just keep throwing words in my mouth trying to start shit. I said Hanzo was faster, NEVER did I even imply Hanzo would blitz. This is what I mean by acting like a butthurt bitch. I say Hanzo is faster and 10 posts over you've turned it into me saying Hanzo blitz's. I said prove Ei was faster than Suigetsu instead of being butthurt and you turn it into me saying Suigetsu was faster than v1 Ei. It's fucking annoying, actually read the post and grow up.



hidan can talk with his head chop off. why are we assuming he is anything normal. sasori doesnt breathe. kakuzu has 5 hearts. why should poison work against someone who essentially can remain alive and well with no body attached to his head





> Need more? That's 5 times in 5 days right there.




i said prove it. i did not deny it 

you make it sound like you post less. want to try claim that?? please go on.


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## IchLiebe (Jan 31, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> So you admit you were exaggerating then? good just wanted to point that out. simple fact she did not destroy the 100 puppets. we have sakura destroying 1 on panel. Even if chiyo did, how is that any basis to say she is above hidan?



She beat Sasori, with help but still more than enough to beat Hidan.



> How did she show more than enough. what cant hidan deal with. hidan against asuma and shikamaru showed more than enough to be able to scratch chiyo which is all he needs to win



How does Hidan get past her puppets? How does he avoid her puppets who showed way better speed? How does he have "more than enough" to get a scratch when Sasori couldn't til the end of the fight. You do know Shikamaru beat him in CQC (by tricking him into thinking that he landed a hit when Shika dodged and put blood on the sword).



> all we know is dull hanzo. why bring anyting else up. its dull hanzo we are talking about here. since, the proper hanzo was never shown. so using that to say he will be much stronger than hidan is baseless. and typical of your BS.



I never said he was much stronger than Hidan, your typical bullshit. I said faster and that poison would wreck him. Never did I say Hanzo was much stronger. His poison would wreck 99% of the verse.



> hidan can talk with his head chop off. why are we assuming he is anything normal. sasori doesnt breathe. kakuzu has 5 hearts. why should poison work against someone who essentially can remain alive and well with no body attached to his head



Hidan still feels pain, he still bleeds, why wouldn't poison work? And I'm not saying it kills him. I'm saying he won't be able to move as Sasori's poison instantly paralyzes the opponent.



> i said prove it. i did not deny it
> 
> you make it sound like you post less. want to try claim that?? please go on.



How did I make it sound like I post less? I'm not even talking about posts, I'm talking about you making spite threads. But you just twist shit to make it whatever you want.


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## Icegaze (Jan 31, 2015)

IchLiebe said:


> She beat Sasori, with help but still more than enough to beat Hidan.



chiyo and sakura beat. sasori. chiyo did not beat sasori. i dont see how thats more than enough. why cant hidan and sakura beat sasori. especially with antidote and sasori going easy on them and being careless. 




> How does Hidan get past her puppets? How does he avoid her puppets who showed way better speed? How does he have "more than enough" to get a scratch when Sasori couldn't til the end of the fight. You do know Shikamaru beat him in CQC (by tricking him into thinking that he landed a hit when Shika dodged and put blood on the sword)


.

why must he get past to attack. his sycthe is mid range. he can swing it. who is that careful as to be terrified of a scratch. also stabbing hidan means nothing he will keep running at her. 
attempting to chop his head off can be blocked he will see it coming 



> I never said he was much stronger than Hidan, your typical bullshit. I said faster and that poison would wreck him. Never did I say Hanzo was much stronger. His poison would wreck 99% of the verse.



you brought up the young sannin BS. isnt that what you are implying? why bring up baseless hype if thats not the point you trying to make 



> Hidan still feels pain, he still bleeds, why wouldn't poison work? And I'm not saying it kills him. I'm saying he won't be able to move as Sasori's poison instantly paralyzes the opponent.



hidan can talk with his spine severed. go figure . why assume it would paralyze him. you know what paralyses a normal person. a severed spine!!! putting his head back together. and guess what he is all good. the damage to the spine. healed, but someone its poison gas that would be stopping him. 


> How did I make it sound like I post less? I'm not even talking about posts, I'm talking about you making spite threads. But you just twist shit to make it whatever you want.




why bring up how many times i post if it isnt to imply that. mind showing me my spite threads. you obviously got time. go ahead


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## IchLiebe (Jan 31, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> chiyo and sakura beat. sasori. chiyo did not beat sasori. i dont see how thats more than enough. why cant hidan and sakura beat sasori. especially with antidote and sasori going easy on them and being careless.



They wouldn't get past Magnetic sand. Not to mention Sasori doesn't bleed so there goes Hidan's arsenal.



> why must he get past to attack. his sycthe is mid range. he can swing it. who is that careful as to be terrified of a scratch. also stabbing hidan means nothing he will keep running at her.
> attempting to chop his head off can be blocked he will see it coming



Sasori with 100 puppets couldn't yet Hidan's sycthe does. You do know Asuma dodged his scythe when his body was burnt up and had a hole through his leg. Not to mention Shikamaru almost landed a hit on Hidan in taijutsu.



> you brought up the young sannin BS. isnt that what you are implying? why bring up baseless hype if thats not the point you trying to make



You said for me to list his speed feats, I said blocking Mifune and fighting the Sannin at once (fighting three ninja of that caliber obviously takes speed. Could someone fight Kakashi, Gai, and Asuma and be slow, hell no). I never said anything about strength. YOU DID.



> hidan can talk with his spine severed. go figure . why assume it would paralyze him. you know what paralyses a normal person. a severed spine!!! putting his head back together. and guess what he is all good. the damage to the spine. healed, but someone its poison gas that would be stopping him.



And? His body couldn't move til his head was reconnected so his body still follows logic to an extent.



> why bring up how many times i post if it isnt to imply that. mind showing me my spite threads. you obviously got time. go ahead



, , and  are three quick ones.


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## Alex Payne (Jan 31, 2015)

I'd love to see Hidan trying to beat Sasori. When both his Scythe and metal rods are controlled by 3rd Kazekage Magnetic Release.


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## Amol (Jan 31, 2015)

Hidan is one trick pony.
If that worked then he can beat anyone if not then he gets stomped.
Too much wanking of him in this thread.Atleast most of the people are sensible here .
Sasori ,Chiyo,Hanzo, Mifune, Darui or any Akatsuki and Kage can beat Hidan.
The guy didn't have Elemental Ninjutsu nor any variety of Taijutsu.
He is atmost High Jounin.
Shikamaru of all people tricked him in CQC (He not only dodged the scythe but also put blood on it without Hidan noticing it).
And it is not that hard to disturb his ritual when he starts drawing it on ground.


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## Icegaze (Feb 1, 2015)

IchLiebe said:


> They wouldn't get past Magnetic sand. Not to mention Sasori doesn't bleed so there goes Hidan's arsenal.



Your right. pointless hidan hype i was doing. chiyo kicks his teeth in. 



> Sasori with 100 puppets couldn't yet Hidan's sycthe does. You do know Asuma dodged his scythe when his body was burnt up and had a hole through his leg. Not to mention Shikamaru almost landed a hit on Hidan in taijutsu.



sasori did end up scratching chiyo though. just saying its not impossible for hidan. and just like a puppter thats all he needs to win



> You said for me to list his speed feats, I said blocking Mifune and fighting the Sannin at once (fighting three ninja of that caliber obviously takes speed. Could someone fight Kakashi, Gai, and Asuma and be slow, hell no). I never said anything about strength. YOU DID.



sannin are featless. they could have been slow as hell and weak as hell. having a title doesnt mean shit. ask asuma. despite his title by mid part 2. he could get 1 panelled by a vast number of ninja



> And? His body couldn't move til his head was reconnected so his body still follows logic to an extent.



to an extent. it isnt solid proof. the guy heals a spine injury instantly once his head is connected. 
same way i dont see tsunade being put down by poison while healing automatically 




> , , and  are three quick ones.


[/QUOTE]

those arent spite threads. or mods would have called it out. dont try do their job for them. 
not like you would be good at it anywayz

lol i dont have the time to find your spite threads. but you started the kakashi vs itachi spite thread. trying to claim that because kakashi put 2 fodders to sleep that he was on the same level or better than itachi. so exposing your BS is hardly spite. even kishi dont agree with you. go bitch somewhere else. hypocrite


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## IchLiebe (Feb 1, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> sasori did end up scratching chiyo though. just saying its not impossible for hidan. and just like a puppter thats all he needs to win



It took Iron sand, his real puppet body, and then 100 puppets to do it. He went through hell for that one scratch.



> to an extent. it isnt solid proof. the guy heals a spine injury instantly once his head is connected.
> same way i dont see tsunade being put down by poison while healing automatically



He bleeds, that means his blood pumps through his body, that means poison will spread through his body and affect him. It won't kill him but it will paralyze him.



> those arent spite threads. or mods would have called it out. dont try do their job for them.
> not like you would be good at it anywayz
> 
> lol i dont have the time to find your spite threads. but you started the kakashi vs itachi spite thread. trying to claim that because kakashi put 2 fodders to sleep that he was on the same level or better than itachi. so exposing your BS is hardly spite. even kishi dont agree with you. go bitch somewhere else. hypocrite



Spite
spīt/
noun
noun: spite

    1.
    a desire to hurt, annoy, or offend someone.

That was the reason you made those threads. I made the Kakashi vs Itachi genjutsu thread to show people Kakashi's genjutsu feats which are better than people give credit.


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## Icegaze (Feb 1, 2015)

> IchLiebe said:
> 
> 
> > It took Iron sand, his real puppet body, and then 100 puppets to do it. He went through hell for that one scratch.
> ...


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## IchLiebe (Feb 1, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> it would be harder for him, seeing that they fight the exact same way. and know each others strategies. hidan would simply be running at her. and with Ma and Pa puppet she is hugely at risk of getting scratched.



How? Hidan would have to get past both puppets and Chiyo who's part puppet herself and get blood. He's too slow, and she had too good of reactions.



> he can breathe with no head attached to his body as well. keep trying



AND? What does that have to do with stopping poison? Absolutely nothing. It's raining outside, I can do a suiton jutsu. You're not giving any evidence that poison won't effect him, you just saying dumb shit.



> so your saying i hurt your little feelings then?
> tell me more



Nope, that was you intent, to hurt, annoy, or offend me. Read the OP in those threads.



> you made the thread to get reactions from posters. well you got it. and then whined cuz you know u never had a point to begin with. kishi clearly doesnt think kakashi is better at genjutsu. deal with it



I never whined, no one could prove me wrong and acted like butthurt bitches and made spite threads. Literally 7 spite threads from my one thread. And it wasn't a spite thread, like I said it was to add to Kakashi's feats. I wasn't trying to annoy, offend, or hurt anyone, I was trying to improve people's outlook on Kakashi.


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## Icegaze (Feb 1, 2015)

[]QUOTE=IchLiebe;52803288]How? Hidan would have to get past both puppets and Chiyo who's part puppet herself and get blood. He's too slow, and she had too good of reactions[/QUOTE].

Again hidan doesnt necessarily have to get past her puppets. that the whole idea of a mid ranged weapon.also note Ma and Pa puppets really cant do anything to hidan to begin with



> AND? What does that have to do with stopping poison? Absolutely nothing. It's raining outside, I can do a suiton jutsu. You're not giving any evidence that poison won't effect him, you just saying dumb shit.



am glad you believe you can do suiton jutsu. speaks alot as to why you argue like shit. you actually believe you are kakashi dont you. 



> Nope, that was you intent, to hurt, annoy, or offend me. Read the OP in those threads.



obviously i succeeded and am glad. your pain is my joy. 
if i did not succeed you wont bother bringing it up. you are like those women who say i dont care about this or that, yet thats all they care to talk about. 



> I never whined, no one could prove me wrong and acted like butthurt bitches and made spite threads. Literally 7 spite threads from my one thread. And it wasn't a spite thread, like I said it was to add to Kakashi's feats. I wasn't trying to annoy, offend, or hurt anyone, I was trying to improve people's outlook on Kakashi.



utter BS. if you were just trying to improve people view on kakashi. the DIRECT!! comparison with itachi wont have been necessary. as the title of your thread indicated. so come off it and dont sound like some female. you made a spite thread. and when you get one in return you bitch!!!...thats not a good look


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## IchLiebe (Feb 1, 2015)

Ma/Pa puppets cut Hidan in half.

I told you to prove v1 Ei was faster than Suigetsu instead of being a bitch and making a spite thread. You're still crying about it.

Itachi's the greatest genjutsu user in people's mind and Kakashi has a better genjutsu feat. That's why it was Itachi vs Kakashi. Still butthurt, and still being a bitch. You can't prove one claim you make and make spite threads like brownies. Grow up, a 15 yo can make better arguments than you.


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## Icegaze (Feb 1, 2015)

> IchLiebe said:
> 
> 
> > Ma/Pa puppets cut Hidan in half.
> ...


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## IchLiebe (Feb 1, 2015)

Icegaze said:


> with what? the fanfic ablity you gave them. yes sure. because wire strings cant be cut by a sycthe. suuure



So the scythe is blocking and and hitting chiyo at the same time? Get real, the puppets are faster than Hidan and have a better range, Hidan gets destroyed.



> only a fucking fool would ask me to prove such. kishi obviously made it clear. the fact that you even bring that up. shows how much of a fail you are



Only a fucking fool couldn't provide scans to prove such.



> kakashi has a better genjutsu. feat ONLY AND SOLEY in your mind. putting someone to sleep is much easier than having them almost kill themselves.



LOL Itachi tries to knock someone out and fails and yet it's a better feat than Kakashi instantly knocking two people out. 



> lol at least a 15 year old can. a toodler has more context and reason than you do in life entirely



Says the guy who's literally been wrong about 5+ things I've said in this thread alone. The guy who has yet to prove one thing he's claimed despite it being common sense and Kishi making it obvious (only way to make it such is putting it in the manga so obviously scans of such). You twist words and attack people because you can't prove a god damn thing you say. You start spite threads because you don't agree with someone and since YOU can't prove them wrong you hope someone comes in the thread and does. Fucking pathetic.


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