# Tobirama vs MS Madara



## babaGAReeb (Dec 8, 2013)

Madara is real angry that Tobirama killed his brother, after he cried himself to sleep he decided he was gonna kill Tobirama and forgot all about stealing his eyes, the dumb ^ (use bro)!!(Madara doesnt have a EMS cause he forgot to steal his bros eyes dont forget)

Scenario 1:Tobirama and Madara fight on some plains 

Scenario 2:Tobirama knows Madaras is coming so just to be a dick he edo summons Izuna and makes him fight Madara

Scenario 3: Madara took a wrong turn at Albuquerque and ends up in cloud village


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## Grimmjowsensei (Dec 8, 2013)

"Brotherly love" 


Anyways back in the day Cloud Village wasn't formed. Village system started with Konoha so what your suggesting in 3rd scenario can't happen 

Also noone would be interested in seeing Madara get prison raped by a bunch of black men.


Scenario 1 goes to Madara.
Scenario 2 can go eitherway, depends on how much of an effect Edo Izuna can have on Madara emotionally.


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## Atlantic Storm (Dec 8, 2013)

Based on portrayal and feats, I don't think Tobirama can defeat Madara.


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## babaGAReeb (Dec 8, 2013)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> "Brotherly love"
> 
> 
> Anyways back in the day Cloud Village wasn't formed. Village system started with Konoha so what your suggesting in 3rd scenario can't happen
> ...


i dont think madara can beat the 2nd, izuna was said to be equal to madara and tobirama pwned that bitch

*Anyways back in the day Cloud Village wasn't formed. Village system started with Konoha so what your suggesting in 3rd scenario can't happen* 
he got lost so hard he ended up in the future

*Also noone would be interested in seeing Madara get prison raped by a bunch of black men.*
hehehe i would and so would Orochimaru


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## babaGAReeb (Dec 8, 2013)

Atlantic Storm said:


> Based on portrayal and feats, I don't think Tobirama can defeat Madara.


maybe madara needs a handicap, he forgot to remove that dildo from his ass and thus has his mobilty crippled cause he walks like a duck


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## Dominus (Dec 8, 2013)

MS Madara doesn't really have any feats, he most likely had Susanoo, but we don't know for how long he could maintain it, which version of it is the strongest nor his other MS techniques. Tobirama could win this by avoiding Madara's attacks with Hiraishin, extinguishing Madara's Katon techniques and the moment he can't use his Susanoo anymore, he uses Hiraishingiri or Gojou Kibaku Fuda.


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## crisler (Dec 8, 2013)

We don't know the extent of MS Madaras' powers.

He could be roughly the same as MS Sasuke or Itachi...or even weaker, or stronger...

All we know is that he and Izuna were considered almost equal when both of them were alive, and Madara became the leader because he was the elder one. Frankly, I think the powers balance between them are still controversial...

The funny part is, both MS Madara and EMS Madara fought almost equal to Hashirama despite having huge difference between them...so we don't know for sure.

Sticking to the fact that MS Madara and Izuna were almost equal, and Tobirama killed Izuna...I'd say MS Madara and Tobirama ain't too far away


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## Bonly (Dec 8, 2013)

We haven't seen much of MS Madara but I'd favor him more times then not.


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## richard lewis (Dec 8, 2013)

scenario 1: assuming madara can only use suanoo "apparently he has no other MS jutsu" tobirama should win very high diff. His suitons should counter madara's katons and with FTG he can dance around madara's weaker susanoo all day long. he should be able to simply outlast madara here.

scenario 2: tobirama rapes *HARD*. since he knows madara is coming he'll have ample time to cover the battlefield with dozens of FTG tags. throw on top of that a kage lvl edo and madara stands no chance.


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## eyeknockout (Dec 8, 2013)

if MS madara is as powerful as MS itachi, then madara wins


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## babaGAReeb (Dec 8, 2013)

eyeknockout said:


> if MS madara is as powerful as MS itachi, then tobirama pwns


Yes
lolololol


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## Jagger (Dec 8, 2013)

There's really no way to gauge MS Madara's power. For all we know, he could have weaker, equal or stronger than Tobirama.

Just because EMS Madara is shown to have insane power doesn't mean the MS version is capable of doing the same. This is pretty much a pointless and one-sided debate.


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## ARGUS (Dec 8, 2013)

well manga states that MS Madara = MS Izuna 
since Tobirama defeated MS Izuna, i'd say he wins 

but EMS Madara >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tobirama


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## ARGUS (Dec 8, 2013)

OT - Tobirama wins both scenarios


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## babaGAReeb (Dec 8, 2013)

xxHKCDxx said:


> OT - Tobirama wins both scenarios


but who wins 3rd scenario?


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## J★J♥ (Dec 8, 2013)

Tobirama already one shotted his bro who was at the same level as MS madara, but considering how Tobirama dislikes Madara instead of throat he puts his sword through Madaras anus.


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## Sadgoob (Dec 8, 2013)

xxHKCDxx said:


> well manga states that MS Madara = MS Izuna



Manga doesn't say that. That statement is prior to them awakening MS.

Also, it was in Itachi's story, which was a confirmed lie.

The actual flashback shows Madara being a prodigy above Izuna.


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## αce (Dec 8, 2013)

Izuna was_ never_ equal to Madara. The skill between the two was probably never even close. In the flashback, when Madara confirmed that Hashirama was stronger than him, Izuna was amazed that someone was stronger than his older brother, indicating he was always the inferior. 

Regardless, we don't know Madara's two mangekyou abilities. Based on manga portrayal though, the only person who was ever truly above Madara at any given point in his progression as a shinobi was Hashirama and Hashirama alone. Although given recent developments, Madara is faster than sage mode Naruto by a significant margin and we already know how deadly his katons are considering they almost wiped out half the entire alliance before Naruto helped.

And before anyone even suggests that Madara's speed was only due to Hashirama's cells, I'd like to point out that Hashirama commented on the fact that Madara had regained his _old powers_ when he launched that katon after casually blitzing past Naruto.



> Tobirama already one shotted his bro who  was at the same level as MS madara, but considering how Tobirama  dislikes Madara instead of throat he puts his sword through Madaras  anus.


It wasn't a one shot. We only saw the panel of Izuna's death and thus we only saw one move being made. If Tobirama was capable of doing that to Izuna he would've done it years earlier, not when they were both fully grown.


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## Jagger (Dec 8, 2013)

In other words, the thread should be closed as there's no evidence that MS Madara can beat Tobirama or viceversa.


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## αce (Dec 8, 2013)

No evidence bar manga portrayal. Although I'd argue that with his gunbai and his base feats he's clearly stronger if we factor in a generic sharingan upgrade.


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## Coppur (Dec 8, 2013)

There is a serious lack of feats regarding MS Madara, so I don't believe an accurate call can be made. However, by portrayal I believe Madara takes it.


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## Miyamoto Musashi (Dec 9, 2013)

Who do you think I think wins?


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## Hazuki (Dec 9, 2013)

αce said:


> Izuna was_ never_ equal to Madara. The skill between the two was probably never even close. In the flashback, when Madara confirmed that Hashirama was stronger than him, Izuna was amazed that someone was stronger than his older brother, indicating he was always the inferior.
> n.



it's not because izuna at the age of 8 said that his brother was stronger than him , that he wasn't as strong as him when he was 20 years old 

your argue is illogic 

a kid can be stronger than his younger brother 

but when they are adult they can be as strong each other especially if they gain ms both of them

manga confirmed that izuna ms = madara ms when they were already adult  ( not a litlle kid who just awake his low sharingan)


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## Jagger (Dec 9, 2013)

Can you really trust Itachi, though? Most of his story was either a lie or he didn't know the real version.

According to Itachi, Madara removed his brother's eyes through force. According to Hashirama (according from what he heard about Madara) his brother gave up his eyes to him in order to protect the Uchiha Clan and defeat the Senju.

I'd rather believe the guy who fought all his life with Uchiha Madara than some Uchiha that never knew Madara was already dead.


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## babaGAReeb (Dec 9, 2013)

Giving how many fangurls worship itachi, call him king and want to have butt babies with him i would trust Itachis word

and Tobirama losing isnt an option here, the only way Madara avoids losing is if he gets lost some how, ends up in cloud country, gets thrown in jail with horny black men and then drops the soap


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## Dominus (Dec 9, 2013)




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## babaGAReeb (Dec 9, 2013)

^ lol i forgot what izuna looked like, he has a permanent duck face

man he sucks, hes duck and he got killed by a water jutsu master
this duck sucks


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## Kickflip Uzumaki (Dec 9, 2013)

αce said:


> Izuna was_ never_ equal to Madara. The skill between the two was probably never even close. In the flashback, when Madara confirmed that Hashirama was stronger than him, Izuna was amazed that someone was stronger than his older brother, indicating he was always the inferior.
> 
> Regardless, we don't know Madara's two mangekyou abilities. Based on manga portrayal though, the only person who was ever truly above Madara at any given point in his progression as a shinobi was Hashirama and Hashirama alone. Although given recent developments, Madara is faster than sage mode Naruto by a significant margin and we already know how deadly his katons are considering they almost wiped out half the entire alliance before Naruto helped.
> 
> ...




Manga says otherwise brah.




Tobirama >MS Izuna. MS Izuna = MS Madara. Tobirama > MS Madara.


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## babaGAReeb (Dec 9, 2013)

hmmmmmmmm there seem to be two different translations, so which is it? madara=izuna or  just fought each other a lot? course tobirama>MS madara and MS duckface but really i want to know which translation is correct


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## Kickflip Uzumaki (Dec 9, 2013)

babaGAReeb said:


> hmmmmmmmm there seem to be two different translations, so which is it? madara=izuna or  just fought each other a lot? course tobirama>MS madara and MS duckface but really i want to know which translation is correct



Both mean the same thing in essence. How can you hone your skills and test yourself someone who isn't your equal or close in skill?

Rhetorical question. You can't.

Tobirama > Uchiha. These are Manga facts from Kishi's own work.


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## Munboy Dracule O'Brian (Dec 9, 2013)

I reckon Madara would win, not easily though. Bear in mind I'm assuming his MS jutsu are Tsukuyomi and Amaterasu (the standard MS jutsu), along with Kagutsuchi (Amaterasu enhanced) and Susanoo. Susanoo with half a body, of course.


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## babaGAReeb (Dec 9, 2013)

Munboy Dracule O'Brian said:


> I reckon Madara would win, not easily though. Bear in mind I'm assuming his MS jutsu are Tsukuyomi and Amaterasu (the standard MS jutsu), along with Kagutsuchi (Amaterasu enhanced) and Susanoo. Susanoo with half a body, of course.


ahem madara wining is not allowed cause its impossibru, choose cloud prison option if you dont want him to lose


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## Munboy Dracule O'Brian (Dec 9, 2013)

babaGAReeb said:


> ahem madara wining is not allowed cause its impossibru, choose cloud prison option if you dont want him to lose



All I know about Tobirama is he has a lesser Hiraishin relative to Minato, sensing (as does Madara), Edo Tensei and Suiton... not really enough to take Madara with the jutsu I presume Madara has. 

Sure it would be a pretty intense fight, but I don't see Tobirama winning. Scenario 2, is interesting, and Tobirama _might_ win that one.


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## Complete_Ownage (Dec 9, 2013)

I see it some what like this....

1)Izuna was never stated to be Madaras equal however it's probably a safe bet to say he was the second strongest.
2)In the end we get one panel showing Tobirama > Izuna
3)We do not exactly have a perfect way to guage MS Madara's powers or his abilities

In my opinion by the time of Tobiramas death he would have surpassed MS Madara.. This would be due to such things as gaining more experience, creating new jutsus, and etc

The thing that gets me is....
Tobirama knows damn well that Madara has EMS and is still confident to take him on without hesitation. Either we do not fully understand Tobiramas true power or he's simply an Orochimaru type character that is over confident in his abilties. As of righ tnow EMS Madara would destroy tobirama


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## babaGAReeb (Dec 9, 2013)

Complete_Ownage said:


> I see it some what like this....
> 
> 1)Izuna was never stated to be Madaras equal however it's probably a safe bet to say he was the second strongest.
> 2)In the end we get one panel showing Tobirama > Izuna
> ...


or maybe he is just fearless, and if he got get a sword swipe on madara with FTG while he is not paying attention he could shove his sword up his ass and kill him with one hit

in fact with madara blind right now he has all the time in the world to violate his butthole with a foreign object but for plot convenience is kept away from madara, nobody wants to see madara die so humiliatingly and anticlimactically


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## Overhaul (Dec 10, 2013)

Tobirama beats the shit out of MS Madara up until this happens.


Hashirama wins...yet again.


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## babaGAReeb (Dec 10, 2013)

^ lol tobirama wont touch madaras long greasy hair, and judging from his shirtless scene he probably shaves his ass hair so when tobirama sword goes through his anus no hair will be harmed and then hashirama can do whatever he wants with madaras hair.

i think his hair needs a wash anyway , nothing like a L'Oreal  no jutsu


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## DeK3iDE (Dec 10, 2013)

pssh, even MS Madara is more than Tobirama could handle.


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