# Turkish forces thwart coup against Erdogan after crowds rally



## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

(Reuters) - A group within Turkey's military has attempted to overthrow the government and security forces have been called in to "do what is necessary", Prime Minister Binali Yildirim said on Friday.

"Some people illegally undertook an illegal action outside of the chain of command," Yildirim said in comments broadcast by private channel NTV.

"The government elected by the people remains in charge. This government will only go when the people say so."



(Reporting by Ayla Jean Yackley and Nick Tattersall; Writing by David Dolan; Editing by Nick Tattersall)

Reactions: Like 1


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## Arishem (Jul 15, 2016)

Hold onto your butts. There's reports of helicopters firing on government buildings and tanks in the streets, so this coup isn't over until the guns stop firing.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> (Reuters) - A group within Turkey's military has attempted to overthrow the government and security forces have been called in to "do what is necessary", Prime Minister Binali Yildirim said on Friday.
> 
> "Some people illegally undertook an illegal action outside of the chain of command," Yildirim said in comments broadcast by private channel NTV.
> 
> ...



That is kind of an antagonist scenario. Kind of like "I know you bastards are coming, make my day!"

On another note




> "Some people illegally undertook an illegal action outside of the chain of command," Yildirim said in comments broadcast by private channel NTV.



Is there such a thing as people legally undertaking an illegal action or illegally undertaking a legal action?


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## FLORIDA MAN (Jul 15, 2016)

Arishem said:


> Hold onto your butts. There's reports of helicopters firing on government buildings and tanks in the streets, so this coup isn't over until the guns stop firing.



god damn


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

I wonder who is behind this - I mean which interest group, driving what kind of policy. What angred them? The conflict driven foreign policy, the agreement with Israel, what?


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Arishem said:


> Hold onto your butts. There's reports of helicopters firing on government buildings and tanks in the streets, so this coup isn't over until the guns stop firing.



Time to tune it to  Al Jazeera English.

Indeed if you are in Turkey, stay safe.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Also, everyone in Turkey... Stay safe. Avoid crowds, stay indoors.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36809083

Traffic has been stopped from crossing both the Bosphorus and Fatih Sultan Mehmet bridges in Istanbul.

There are reports of gunshots in the capital Ankara.

Tanks are also said to be stationed outside Istanbul airport.


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

Arishem said:


> Hold onto your butts.


Can I hold into Tsuyu's butt instead?


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## Arishem (Jul 15, 2016)

Military just declared that they're in charge of Turkey. 
Jet flying real low.A tank rolling through Istanbul.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Please, no bloodshed...


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## Overwatch (Jul 15, 2016)

Pretty amazing what can happen in a single day.


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## Jin-E (Jul 15, 2016)

I can just imagine how Erdo is throwing a temper tantrum of legends over this.


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## Utopia Realm (Jul 15, 2016)

Goddammit. I just checked my phone 2 min ago. Seems shit just got real and fast...


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## Kusa (Jul 15, 2016)

Jesus what the fuck

After seeing the pictures I am just under shock

My dad is currently in Istanbul..that makes me worry a lot

Reactions: Agree 1 | Friendly 1


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## Arishem (Jul 15, 2016)

Dozens of deaths reported from clashes between police and the military.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Kusa said:


> My dad is currently in Istanbul..that makes me worry a lot



Oh man... Wishing luck to him.

But, we haven't heard of actual fighting going on. It sounds like the military is currently in control of the city.

Edit: Uh.... Not so... 

Hopefully he says safe.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Airports are obviously closed.
Reports that a small branch of the are now in power, citing they are defending civil liberties.


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## Foxve (Jul 15, 2016)

Have they issued any demands? Or is everything still just pure mayhem?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## soulnova (Jul 15, 2016)

Who's leading them? What made them spring into action? ... shit...

Kusa, good luck. Hope you can contact your dad soon and he is well.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> Reports that a small branch of the are now in power, citing they are defending civil liberties.




Don't celebrate yet, they can say whatever they want, but are trying to violently overthrow the elected government most Turks voted for. Not trusting them just like that. 

I wonder if Erdogan made such sudden change in his policies because he got the word there was serious malcontent with him.


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 15, 2016)

Be interesting to see the fallout from this. The AKP does have a lot of popular support, so I can see Erdogan encouraging his supporters to resist the coup at all costs. And then there's the PKK and whether they will try to take advantage of this, or sit quietly and let the AKP and Kemalists bleed each other.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Foxve said:


> Have they issued any demands? Or is everything still just pure mayhem?



Right now its pure confusion.


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

BREAKING: REPORTS COMING IN THAT COUP IS BEING ORCHESTRATED BY "SAMÜEL HAİDE"


Edit: that gimmick only makes your posts harder to read + look like spam / Amanda


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Kagekatsu said:


> Be interesting to see the fallout from this. The AKP does have a lot of popular support, so I can see Erdogan encouraging his supporters to resist the coup at all costs. And then there's the PKK and whether they will try to take advantage of this, or sit quietly and let the AKP and Kemalists bleed each other.



This is what I fear.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Don't celebrate yet, they can say whatever they want, but are trying to violently overthrow the elected government most Turks voted for. Not trusting them just like that.
> 
> I wonder if Erdogan made such sudden change in his policies because he got the word there was serious malcontent with him.



Where was I celebrating?


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 15, 2016)

Honestly not sure how to feel about this


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## Utopia Realm (Jul 15, 2016)

Who's Samuel Haute? Seems this coup was in the works for a long while coming.


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## FLORIDA MAN (Jul 15, 2016)

lol sounds like the coup is fully fucking justified if u ask me

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Arishem (Jul 15, 2016)

A helicopter firing on the city.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> BREAKING: REPORTS COMING IN THAT COUP IS BEING ORCHESTRATED BY "SAMÜEL HAİDE"




So who is he?



Alwaysmind said:


> Where was I celebrating?



You weren't, I just commented on their claim.


No... no no..




wat said:


> lol sounds like the coup is fully fucking justified if u ask me



Depends.

What they actually want and will their actions lead to a civil war?


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Arishem said:


> Dozens of deaths reported from clashes between police and the military.



Hope he is in a safe spot.


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## soulnova (Jul 15, 2016)

Does he want them to get killed? wat


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 15, 2016)

calling innocent people to fight for you while you hide in fear because of the mess you created

Reactions: Like 3


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

soulnova said:


> Does he want them to get killed? wat




He wants them to fight the military.... Just how? They will only get killed.

Unless Erdogan counts on the military not daring to shoot at them.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

> Turkish Prime Minister Binali Yildirim said elements of Turkey’s army have attempted to seize power in the country.
> 
> The effort would not be permitted to succeed, he told NTV television. His comments came as gunshots were heard in the Turkish capital of Ankara on Friday, a Reuters witness said, as military jets and helicopters were seen flying overhead.
> 
> ...


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## Drake (Jul 15, 2016)

I'm no fan of Erdogan, but this has the potential to go very wrong depending on the motives and morals of the coup leaders.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

soulnova said:


> Does he want them to get killed? wat




Probably, a coup is treason. A very serious offense.


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## Son of Goku (Jul 15, 2016)

Holy shit...



Amanda said:


> I wonder who is behind this - I mean which interest group, driving what kind of policy. What angred them? The conflict driven foreign policy, the agreement with Israel, what?



'Probably got tired of Erdogan's neverending shenanigans' would be my immediate response. But it's usually more complicated than that.


Someone posted this on facebook


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## Kusa (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Oh man... Wishing luck to him.
> 
> But, we haven't heard of actual fighting going on. It sounds like the military is currently in control of the city.
> 
> ...


Yeah, he is safe.

Thank you

Reactions: Like 1


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## Pliskin (Jul 15, 2016)

2016 is trying reaaaaall damn hard to advance the doomsday clock.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## FLORIDA MAN (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> So who is he?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Depends on what? Erdogan calling for civilians to take to the streets is enough to know that this kind of guy should never be the head of state.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Jin-E (Jul 15, 2016)

> US Secretary of State John Kerry says he hopes there will be peace, stability and continuity within Turkey, Reuters news agency reports.


So no condemnation of the coup? Notice how "democracy" isn't included in the statement

It's understandable he's preoccupied with stability over all other concerns due to Turkey's vital geopolitical role, but it seems like the US can basically live with the coup(if succesful), just as in Egypt.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Drake said:


> I'm no fan of Erdogan, but this has the potential to go very wrong depending on the motives and morals of the coup leaders.



It could go very wrong nevertheless. 



Alwaysmind said:


> Probably, a coup is treason. A very serious offense.



I think he meant does Erdogan want the AKP supporters to die.


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 15, 2016)

The military needs to resolve this quick, because I guarantee You-Know-Who is already making plans to exploit the chaos for their own benefit with a suicide bombing or two.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Drake said:


> I'm no fan of Erdogan, but this has the potential to go very wrong depending on the motives and morals of the coup leaders.



It is clear that s group in the military wasn't happy about Erdogan and want him gone.


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## FLORIDA MAN (Jul 15, 2016)

Son of Goku said:


> Holy shit...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yup, that's what I'm getting elsewhere.

 "in the name of democratic order, adding that all existing foreign relations will continue and human rights will remain."

if true, then kick erdy's ass to the curb


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

wat said:


> Depends on what? Erdogan calling for civilians to take to the streets is enough to know that this kind of guy should never be the head of state.



That has been obvious for long.

The question is whether this will trigger a civil war in Turkey, something nobody should want, no matter how they hate Erdo. 

I just hope everything goes as smoothly and with as few bodies as possible.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

Sabiha Gokcen airport is not shut down and are flights currently going out. Two of my friends are currently there at the hotel.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Informative 1


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## Xion (Jul 15, 2016)

Long overdue.

Erdogan was steering Turkey on a course to a very dark Islamofascist future.

A dictator in every sense of the word. He stifled free speech. He tried to install himself as president for life. He imprisoned critics. He supported Daesh financially and in spirit. He helped reignite an unwinnable war with the Kurds. He built himself a thousand room palace on a protected park.

Turkey's military has overthrown dictators overstepping constitutional bounds before and hopefully they succeed now. There were doubts after he last gutted the military's top brass, but it seems the pro-secular forces (that support Turkey's founding, Ataturk-derived principles) decided to act now while morale was low for continued Kurdish insurgency and before an August, annual military restructuring.

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


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## soulnova (Jul 15, 2016)

From twitter:


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Turkey has had some experience dealing with coups, so I don't expect they would allow total anarchy.


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## Toby (Jul 15, 2016)

Classic Turkey

Army coups are common in the history of Turkey. It's unfortunate but they haven't really been "punished" for this before, and won't be this time either it seems. I don't like Erdogan and I'd prefer a democratic government, but this is precisely where he gets his supporters from. Forcing a country to develop secular values isn't impossible, but the army chooses to do it the hard way. Bugger all.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Drake (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> It could go very wrong nevertheless.



Yeah, even if Erdogan manages to squash the coup, he'll probably crack down on the population and the military for the attempt.


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## Son of Goku (Jul 15, 2016)




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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Kusa said:


> Yeah, he is safe.
> 
> Thank you



Great to hear!

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Son of Goku (Jul 15, 2016)

Remember this guy?


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## Kusa (Jul 15, 2016)

Erdogan should not tell civilians to go to the streets. The situation is already bad as it is. Don't make it fucking worse by risking innocent human lives.


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## Jin-E (Jul 15, 2016)

Assad must be having a ball right now


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

Xion said:


> Turkey's military has overthrown dictators overstepping constitutional bounds before and hopefully they succeed now. There were doubts after he last gutted the military's top brass, but it seems the pro-secular forces (that support Turkey's founding, Ataturk-derived principles) decided to act now while morale was low for continued Kurdish insurgency and before an August, annual military restructuring.


Kemal hated Kurds more than even Saddam, Why do you think The Kemalists care about Erdo conflict with them


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

Xion said:


> Turkey's military has overthrown dictators overstepping constitutional bounds before and hopefully they succeed now. There were doubts after he last gutted the military's top brass, but it seems the pro-secular forces (that support Turkey's founding, Ataturk-derived principles) decided to act now while morale was low for continued Kurdish insurgency and before an August, annual military restructuring.


Kemal hated Kurds more than even Saddam, Why do you think The Kemalists care about Erdo conflict with them


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## ExoSkel (Jul 15, 2016)

Sounds like Kebabdogan is done for.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Yes, hopefully the Turks understand to not to go to the streets. You can't fight the army, you'd die for nothing.



Jin-E said:


> Assad must be having a ball right now



Hopefully the region becomes more stabile. 



Son of Goku said:


> Remember this guy?



No, who is he?

Remember when we talked of a potential future coup by the army in Turkey earlier this year?


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## Xion (Jul 15, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> Kemal hated Kurds more than even Saddam, Why do you think The Kemalists care about Erdo conflict with them



a.) I don't think this is about Kemalists per se. This is about protecting Turkey's constitution and its delicate democracy.
b.) Kurdish military might have realistic goals in regards to the Kurdish question and foreign policy without turning the whole Southeast into a meat grinder as Erdogan planned.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Toby said:


> Classic Turkey
> 
> Army coups are common in the history of Turkey. It's unfortunate but they haven't really been "punished" for this before, and won't be this time either it seems. I don't like Erdogan and I'd prefer a democratic government, but this is precisely where he gets his supporters from. Forcing a country to develop secular values isn't impossible, but the army chooses to do it the hard way. Bugger all.



Indeed, even going back to the Middle Ages. In the last 50 years there has been 4 coups. They have been through this before and know how not to turn this into a blood feud.


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## Toby (Jul 15, 2016)

Drake said:


> Yeah, even if Erdogan manages to squash the coup, he'll probably crack down on the population and the military for the attempt.



I don't see how he can beat the army. Turkey's army is not some small group of gun enthusiasts. It is a fully fledged army. You need a rival army to beat it, or a separate faction. I don't see that happening. Most likely the Turkish army has been fighting local police or AKP party security personnel who were defending public buildings. The Turkish army won't open fire at the civilians with live ammo, but might use rubber bullets. They'll advise citizens to stay indoors, and they probably will do that.

My guess is they are tired of having to step in between the AKP and demonstrators, and consider Erdogan's leadership to national security AND democracy in Turkey. They'll make a big deal out of this being in the interest of Turkish national security, due to ISIS, Erdogan's relationship with Kurds, Israel, and NATO.


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## Arishem (Jul 15, 2016)

Fucking wow if true.

State tv broadcasted this message from the military.

-New Constitution being prepared

-Last government was undemocratic and violated human rights

-The country is being ruled by a Committee for Peace which will provide public safety and order

- The Committee for Peace will guarantee all human rights regardless of race, religion or native language

- Martial Law is declared


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

Investors seek US Treasuries after Turkey coup attempt 
So this is how the Brexit loss will be evened out for the 10y


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## Suigetsu (Jul 15, 2016)

So, any particular reason of why the coup?


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 15, 2016)




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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 15, 2016)

Arishem said:


> Fucking wow if true.
> 
> State tv broadcasted this message from the military.
> 
> ...



I thought Kerdogan is on vacation rn and not in turkey


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Suigetsu said:


> So, any particular reason of why the coup?



A small faction of the army was tired on Erdogan encroaching on civil liberties.


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

ITT people think the Secularists are the good guys because "muh abusive Religious daddy"
They will end up as corrupt as Erdogan and as corrupt as the Secularist before Erdogan

Turkey is fucked either way

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Son of Goku (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> No, who is he?



Egypt's Mursi


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## Arishem (Jul 15, 2016)

Erdodong was vacationing at Bodrum in Turkey.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Kusa (Jul 15, 2016)

They took over the channel 'Trt' and are forcing the news reporter to read their 'news'. The poor woman reads the same thing all over again and looks so fucking scared. It's painful to watch.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> A small faction of the army was tired on Erdogan encroaching on civil liberties.



This is an army of conscripts, arresting a president who got about 45pc of the votes. Complicated business man


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Arishem said:


> -The country is being ruled by a Committee for Peace which will provide public safety and order




Ah yes, I meant to look that up. I was wondering what its duties are.


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## Drake (Jul 15, 2016)

Don't think so. I heard he was talking to reporters via FaceTime.


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## Suigetsu (Jul 15, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> A small faction of the army was tired on Erdogan encroaching on civil liberties.


Well they got guts, I can give that to them.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Son of Goku said:


> Egypt's Mursi




Funny, I remembered he looked different... Perhaps I remember al-Sisi instead.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Kusa said:


> They took over the channel 'Trt' and are forcing the news reporter to read their 'news'. The poor woman reads the same thing all over again and looks so fucking scared. It's painful to watch.




Why can't they read their own news... It's not a good first impression on the audiences...


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## Son of Goku (Jul 15, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> A small faction of the army was tired on Erdogan encroaching on civil liberties.



Carefull there, that's what General as-Sisi said to justify his coup against Mursi, just 3 years ago. Now he's worse than even Mubarak.


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## Utopia Realm (Jul 15, 2016)

Wow...Seems this coup was efficient as fuck.


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## Son of Goku (Jul 15, 2016)

live stream


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Stelios said:


> This is an army of conscripts, arresting a president who got about 45pc of the votes. Complicated business man



This is a tricky situation in democracies. How do you overthrow an elected government that restricts your civil liberties. Erodogan was not well likes but he was after all elected. Very sensitive situation.


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 15, 2016)

Kerdogan told the people to rise up while he's hiding in his cozy vacation spot wooooow rise up against what?? This isn't a small group of rebels, it's the entire national military


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

CNN Turk says that Erdogan will speak through skype


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## Kusa (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Why can't they read their own news... It's not a good first impression on the audiences...


I don't know, she looked like she is going to get a heart attack.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

All Jazeera English says Erdogan is traveling back to Istanbul.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Son of Goku said:


> live stream



Thanks.

Erdogan says he's returning to (edit Istanbul and claims it's only a portion of the army that’s rebelling.

It's nerve wrecking..




Alwaysmind said:


> This is a tricky situation in democracies. How do you overthrow an elected government that restricts your civil liberties. Erodogan was not well likes but he was after all elected. Very sensitive situation.



Indeed. Who is to say the AKP voters are happy with this?


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

Erdogan calls for people to go out on the streets and said that the ones responsible for the coup d' etat will pay for this a heavy price


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> All Jazeera English says Erdogan is traveling back to Istanbul.




Are you sure it's Istanbul? I remember they said capital.


Edit: you were right


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## Arishem (Jul 15, 2016)

AHAHAHAHA


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## Sansa (Jul 15, 2016)




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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

Meanwhile NBC just reported that Erdogan is seeking for asylum in Germany.


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

This gonna end badly.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

A spokesman for the Turkish govt just spoke, he was obviously scared.


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Indeed. Who is to say the AKP voters are happy with this?


It will likely cause a Civil war if handled badly


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

S said:


> This gonna end badly.



Fingers and toes crossed it won't.


@Zyrax Pasha

It's scary...

Reactions: Like 1


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Complete chaos of information.


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## Kusa (Jul 15, 2016)

Is this for real


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 15, 2016)

Khaleesi said:


> Kerdogan told the people to rise up while he's hiding in his cozy vacation spot wooooow rise up against what?? This isn't a small group of rebels, it's the entire national military


It's him saying "Go and die for your President my bullet shields loyal citizens of Turkey!" while he tries to find the nearest plane out of the country.


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## Jin-E (Jul 15, 2016)

Wow.....looks like Erdogan is finished.


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## ExoSkel (Jul 15, 2016)

It would be ironic as fuck if he requests asylum in Russia of all places after Germany denied it.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Yeah, Erdo is finished. 

It's a question of how things will work out for Turkey now.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sansa (Jul 15, 2016)

Apparently Great Britain has released it's Warships from Port Cyprus.

Not sure how true that is.


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 15, 2016)

Damn Germany, I was not expecting that if it's true


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> It will likely cause a Civil war if handled badly





Amanda said:


> Fingers and toes crossed it won't.



Lists of coups in the last 50+ years:

1960
1971
1980
1997
2016


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

ExoSkel said:


> It would be ironic as fuck if he requests asylum in Russia of all places.



They wouldn't take him.


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## Sansa (Jul 15, 2016)

ExoSkel said:


> It would be ironic as fuck if he requests asylum in Russia of all places.


He can't.

Vlad would laugh at him.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

@Khaleesi 

Yeah it sounds surprising if true. Are they already calculating how to best bargain with the new regime?


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## Son of Goku (Jul 15, 2016)

Right about now he must feel pretty stupid for getting mad at an offensive German poem.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 2


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## ExoSkel (Jul 15, 2016)



Reactions: Funny 2 | Dislike 1


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## ExoSkel (Jul 15, 2016)

Bang said:


> He can't.
> 
> Vlad would laugh at him.


Putin is already laughing at him as of this moment. Kebabdogan asking for an asylum in Russia would hurt his pride more than anyone else's and Putin knows that.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Erdogan speaking via facetime


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

Greek Navy and Airforce at warring condition. I wouldn't be surprised if British Navy is on the move from Cyprus


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## Arishem (Jul 15, 2016)

what a time to be alive

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> They wouldn't take him.





Bang said:


> He can't.
> 
> Vlad would laugh at him.


>they fell for the defender of teh white race  meme


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Stelios said:


> Greek Navy and Airforce at warring condition. I wouldn't be surprised if British Navy is on the move from Cyprus



Wise, bit unlikely nothing like that comes from this. 

Rather, sounds like Greece might have a bit easier future in that regard.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)




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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Erdogan isn't in a plane right now it seems.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> >they fell for the defender of teh white race  meme




You really need to forget your silly memes. This isn't about the petty fights on the internet. 

Putin wouldn't take Erdogan because Putin wants to secure the re-established relations with Turkey will remain good even with the new regime. 

It has nothing to do with white race and everything with normal politics.


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## Sansa (Jul 15, 2016)

Erdogan is literally trapped in his plane flying over Europe because no one is going to let him become a refugee in their country


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> Erdogan isn't in a plane right now it seems.





Bang said:


> Erdogan is literally trapped in his plane flying over Europe because no one is going to let him become a refugee in their country


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Bang said:


> Erdogan is literally trapped in his plane flying over Europe because no one is going to let him become a refugee in their country


Bullshit, i'm watching the live tv on turkish televison, and erdogan speaking right now but he sure looks like stressed.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sansa (Jul 15, 2016)

Firas Arodaki @Firasias 2m2 minutes ago
Did #France know about this coup? Why did they close their consulate in #Turkey two days ago? #TurkeyCoup

People saying France knew what was going down before hand and quickly protected themselves


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

I wonder if protest will happen in front of the embassy here.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Bang said:


> Firas Arodaki @Firasias 2m2 minutes ago
> Did #France know about this coup? Why did they close their consulate in #Turkey two days ago? #TurkeyCoup
> 
> People saying France knew what was going down before hand and quickly protected themselves




Wouldn't be surprised if quite a few countries knew. USA probably knew. UK. Germany?

The military might have tried to make sure it will be accepted by the other countries before doing this.


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Looks like the coup d'etat failed.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

Turkish media show APK supporters going on the streets and people gathering at airport


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

People honking crazily.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

S said:


> Looks like the coup d'etat failed.



all it's gonna take is a bullet. I hope this bullet won't go off. One bullet and this can turn into chaos in seconds


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

S said:


> Looks like the coup d'etat failed.





Stelios said:


> Turkish media show APK supporters going on the streets and people gathering at airport



The twists and turns!

But how it failed?


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Wouldn't be surprised if quite a few countries knew. USA probably knew. UK. Germany?
> 
> The military might have tried to make sure it will be accepted by the other countries before doing this.



I mean, NATO would want to know if Turkey will stay, so it would have been in their best interest to know if indeed they did.


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Stelios said:


> all it's gonna take is a bullet. I hope this bullet won't go off. One bullet and this can turn into chaos in seconds


Look i dont like erdogan, but this shit is just crazy. I hope the army doesnt do something stupid.


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## the_notorious_Z.É. (Jul 15, 2016)

Man, this came out of nowhere but Erdogan had it coming.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

If the people do indeed take to the streets, then it's up to the army that nobody gets killed.



Alwaysmind said:


> I mean, NATO would want to know if Turkey will stay, so it would have been in their best interest to know if indeed they did.




It's interesting how no Westerner has yet condemned the coup.

Which is of course par for the course for us.


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

My Family went to turkey yesterday with tha car and they are currently in Bulgaria, man i'm in shock. I wanted to fly to turkey next friday but i cant forget that now.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

S said:


> Look i dont like erdogan, but this shit is just crazy. I hope the army doesnt do something stupid.



I don't wish for it  but there's always the foreign factor and payed guns...


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

It looks like the coup failed


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Looks like the army attacked some of the police station in ankara...man i'm trembling, sorry i dont make any sense right now.


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Some of the higher officals in the army taking back the control again.


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

The Best way to settle this is some form of a compromise between the Secularists and Religious like we do in Israel 

Sadly neither side is interested in that


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

I love how there are a bunch of facetime interviews. It is really interesting.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> It looks like the coup failed




Source?


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

holy shit did they shoot towards the protesters at the bridge


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## DonutKid (Jul 15, 2016)

That was fast.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Source?



Probably a biased on.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

S said:


> Looks like the army attacked some of the police station in ankara...man i'm trembling, sorry i dont make any sense right now.




Hurts to think of those policemen and the soldiers dying because of this mess.. 




Zyrax Pasha said:


> The Best way to settle this is some form of a compromise between the Secularists and Religious like we do in Israel
> 
> Sadly neither side is interested in that



Compromise isn't a popular word these days. 

And yes, the both sides should be heard and get to live their life. 



S said:


> Some of the higher officals in the army taking back the control again.




So Erdo was right when he said it was just a part of the army, not the whole army?


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Gunfire in Istanbul.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Stelios said:


> holy shit did they shoot towards the protesters at the bridge



The army at the pro-goverment protesters?

Damn I hope that didn't happen.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

reports that F16s bombed the chief police  building at Çankaya


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## Jin-E (Jul 15, 2016)

Damn....sounds like a civil war is brewing


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Stelios said:


> reports that F16s bombed the chief police  building at Çankaya



This is awful!


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Jin-E said:


> Damn....sounds like a civil war is brewing



Indeed.

helicopter attacked the police headquarters apparently.


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 15, 2016)

All depends on what the Turkish military does in response to the pro AKP supporters demonstrating


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## Seraphiel (Jul 15, 2016)

I legit just left 4 days ago. Clairvoyant.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Khaleesi said:


> All depends on what the Turkish military does in response to the pro AKP supporters demonstrating




That must have been what he was after. He's gambling there that the army won't shoot them, as he himself has nothing to lose otherwise.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

reuters reported that tanks have circled Turkish Grand National Assembly and opened fire


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

I'm in contact with my parents in turkey, and they say is just istanbul and ankara were soldiers tried to take over.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Stelios said:


> reuters reported that tanks have circled Turkish Grand National Assembly and opened fire



What kind of resistance there is that requires tanks?



S said:


> I'm in contact with my parents in turkey, and they say is just istanbul and ankara were soldiers tried to take over.



Where they live?


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

In germany is shool holiday and the mojority of the turks drive to turkey with the car, my 2 brothers went to turkey yesterday and they are currently in Bulgaria...man i dont know what to do right now.


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> What kind of resistance there is that requires tanks?
> 
> 
> 
> Where they live?


No, Corum. Is a town in north in Turkey. 500km from Ankara.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> What kind of resistance there is that requires tanks?



beats me. Turkish Grand National Assembly is obviously current gov's  symbol


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## Neo Arcadia (Jul 15, 2016)

What's this I hear about American nukes in Turkey possibly being in danger?


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## DonutKid (Jul 15, 2016)

ELI5:

-Turkey's military does not answer to its president like many other countries. 

-They serve to maintain the vision of the country's founder.

-The current president of Turkey has been pushing more and more Islamist focused laws (control of the media, things like that). This goes against the secular-focus of the country's founding.

-The military has decided the president needs to be removed, and have staged a coup to accomplish this. This is not unique in Turkey's history, their military has done this a few times in the past for the same reasons. Presumably, the military's goal is to put someone more secular in power of the government.

-The police in Turkey work for the government. So they are fighting against the military currently.

Reactions: Informative 3


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

S said:


> No, Corum. Is a town in north in Turkey. 500km from Ankara.



And they said this event is going on in Istanbul and Ankara only?



Stelios said:


> beats me. Turkish Grand National Assembly is obviously current gov's  symbol



It's very odd and sounds like an overkill.


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## Deer Lord (Jul 15, 2016)

Suigetsu said:


> So, any particular reason of why the coup?


Erdogan a shite


Stelios said:


> Greek Navy and Airforce at warring condition.


"time is of freeing Constantinopoli!"


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

Massive protest in Istanbul, looks like the army controls Istanvul too. Will we call this the Turkish Summer?


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## DonutKid (Jul 15, 2016)

Turkish politics seems interesting.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> Massive protest in Istanbul, looks like the army controls Istanvul too. Will we call this the Turkish Summer?




It better end better than the Arab Spring.


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

Rumors said that Gülen started the Coup 
Can anyone confirm ?


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## ExoSkel (Jul 15, 2016)

DonutKid said:


> ELI5:
> 
> -Turkey's military does not answer to its president like many other countries.
> 
> ...


You dont have to copy and paste from reddit thread.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

What would be a good stream for this?


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## ExoSkel (Jul 15, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> Rumors said that Gülen started the Coup
> *Can anyone confirm* ?


NO ONE CAN CONFIRM AT THIS MOMENT.


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## ExoSkel (Jul 15, 2016)

Reddit has live feed, go there if you want some up to date information.

Reactions: Like 3


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Fuck this shit i'm going out, some protest in Germany right now.


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## Son of Goku (Jul 15, 2016)

Aah, fuck it, I'm going to bed. Turkey better not self-implode until I'm back up...


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

ExoSkel said:


> Reddit has live feed, go there if you want some up to date information.



Thanks!



S said:


> Fuck this shit i'm going out, some protest in Germany right now.



Don't get hurt. 



Son of Goku said:


> Aah, fuck it, I'm going to bed. Turkey better not self-implode until I'm back up...



No way I could sleep through this... But good night!

Reactions: Like 2


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

Turkish Immigrants(and Turkish Kurds) seem to love bringing their politics to Germany
Just last Week I saw a video of Turks and Kurd Nationalists Chimping out in Germany


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Civilian corpses on that bridge indeed...


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## Arishem (Jul 15, 2016)

Live stream of a big stand off with lots of gunshots at the bridge.

Kids swinging carefree while a helicopter fires in the distance.


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## ExoSkel (Jul 15, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> Turkish Immigrants(and Turkish Kurds) seem to love bringing their politics to Germany
> Just last Week I saw a video of Turks and Kurd Nationalists Chimping out in Germany


Kebabs aren't very liked people, it seems. Almost everyone surrounding Turkey including EU countries hate them.


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

things have escalated


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

The main Kurdish party HDP rejects the coup. Erdogan must feel like an ass right now...


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## Stelios (Jul 15, 2016)

there's a clash between police and army , erdogans plane on its way to London (Rainews)


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> The main Kurdish party HDP rejects the coup. Erdogan must feel like an ass right now...



They know the nationalistic military wouldn't be any better to them


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## DonutKid (Jul 15, 2016)

DonutKid said:


> ELI5:
> 
> -Turkey's military does not answer to its president like many other countries.
> 
> ...



Another ELI5 3 years ago from reddit I found.

So Turkey is founded as a secular democracy. We're constantly under religious influences because of our geopolitical location, and the military's "unofficial" role as the guardian of these secular principles is frankly the only reason why we haven't descended into Sharia law like most of the Middle Eastern Islamic nations. Due to some archaic law that nobody wants to repeal, politicians in Turkey have legal immunity. This used to be necessary to ensure that politicians are never persecuted for their ideologies, but since then it has devolved into a shelter to hide in for crooks, criminals and Islamists. So whenever there's a government that oversteps its bounds and either infringes upon these secular principles or abuses the legal protection bestowed upon them, the military stages a coup, kicks the government out, holds elections and put in place a new, democratically-elected civilian secularist government before retreating back into its corner. This has happened twice in the past. It's a setback and everyone realizes that it's undemocratic, but us Turks see it as a fair sacrifice in order to ensure that we don't turn into the next Iran.

Anyways, year 2002, these AKP idiots come out of nowhere. They're all proteges of past Islamic governments that the military has ousted. Somehow they manage to win the elections with a ridiculous parliamentary super-majority. Elections were probably not fair and the numbers fudged, but nobody has any real evidence because the opposition party was really stagnant and didn't have the manpower to enforce transparency on the election process. Either way, they come to power and for their first term, their only real sin is that they basically sold off a ton of national assets for outrageously low prices (obvious corruption). There was some outrage but people are apathetic just as they are in the US and more often than not don't care.

Fast forward to year 2007, AKP "wins" their second election. They grow bolder. Out of nowhere, they conjure up this investigation into a clandestine ultra-nationalist secularist organization that allegedly has been plotting a coup against the government. They call it Ergenekon, and then proceed to imprison quite a number of high ranked, decorated veteran military officers with accusations of conspiracy against the government. Journalists start speaking out and publishing contradictory evidence, and then they get thrown in jail alongside the officers with the exact same accusations. AKP appoints sympathizing judges and police chiefs to head the investigation (read: witch hunt). Evidence gets regularly mishandled. Instead of making copies on the spot for both the defendants and persecutors, police confiscates entire computers and then mysteriously comes out with incriminating documents that simply cannot be verified. Courts accept what is obviously questionable/shady evidence. No real convictions are made, but military officers and journalists are kept imprisoned nonetheless. Stripped of its top tier officers, the military is naturally now in disarray. AKP appoints sympathetic replacements. Mission accomplished. The one thing that protected Turkey from Islamist governments in the past has now been rendered ineffective.

Of course, media organizations across the country see this whole mess unfolding in front of their eyes. They want no part of it. When the government can throw basically anybody they want in jail without accountability, without anybody standing up to them, what're you going to do? Turkish media becomes timid, stops criticizing the government and stops giving air-time to the political opposition. In the meantime, AKP continues to infiltrate literally every branch of the public institution. Anyone with any amount of power in any extension of the government is replaced with AKP sympathizers. They have people through every level of this country, all the way from the current heads of the military to the police chiefs ordering and maintaining the disproportionately brutal police response to the latest peaceful protesters.

People have had enough. Even the former supporters are starting to question their party. It's hard not to when police ruthlessly attacks and wounds hundreds of peaceful protesters, the government pretends like nothing has happened, and then proceeds to aggressively censor the media to the point where multi-city, widespread dissent and protest doesn't even make it to the front page of the biggest national newspapers.

The optimistic part of me wants to believe that this is really it. That people will finally do what the military should have done years ago: topple this government and elect a new one. And then there's the cynical side of me who knows just how deep AKP's roots go in this country and thinks that nothing will change, that these idiots will somehow endure, keep the military docile, keep rigging elections and basically have Erdogan become the next Assad in about a decade.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

It might be we were too hasty, this isn't over yet...

The Mosques are calling people to protest on the streets.


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## ExoSkel (Jul 15, 2016)

Khaleesi said:


> They know the nationalistic military wouldn't be any better to them


Because Kebabdogan and HDP already struck a deal, that deal is gone when Kebabdogan is kicked out.


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> The main Kurdish party HDP rejects the coup. Erdogan must feel like an ass right now...


After what the Kemalists did to them in 1980 I don't blame them


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Stelios said:


> there's a clash between police and army , erdogans plane on its way to London (Rainews)



Erdogan and Boris Johnson brought together.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

ExoSkel said:


> Because Kebabdogan and HDP already struck a deal, that deal is gone when Kebabdogan is kicked out.



He was so good at burning bridges, all of which he must now be missing. 

Even more I now suspect his change in tune in regards to several countries was because he anticipated this and wanted to have some friends abroad, or at least not right that bad enemies all around.


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## Kusa (Jul 15, 2016)

ExoSkel said:


> Kebabs aren't very liked people, it seems. Almost everyone surrounding Turkey including EU countries hate them.


They like their kebabs doe

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)




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## Kagekatsu (Jul 15, 2016)




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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

I must say, watching the footage I do admire the Turks for being so brave.



It's over then?

Erdogan won? 

Is this confirmed or another rumor?


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## Arishem (Jul 15, 2016)

God damn this is a clusterfuck.

Heli shooting right next to protesters on the ground.A tank forces its way through the crowd, crushing a car and a light pole


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Obama and Kerry are siding with Erdogan


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## FLORIDA MAN (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Obama and Kerry are siding with Erdogan


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## Jin-E (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Obama and Kerry are siding with Erdogan



Seems like a facesaving move now that the coup looks to have failed. The first reactions from US officials when the coup was announced didn't condemn it, it just advocated "stability"


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## Nemesis (Jul 15, 2016)

They're not siding with Erdo because they like him.  They're siding with Erdo because that's the technical US response to these kind of things "Respect Democratically elected government."


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

STAY SAFE ANZU CHAN


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Arishem said:


> God damn this is a clusterfuck.
> 
> Heli shooting right next to protesters on the ground.A tank forces its way through the crowd, crushing a car and a light pole



Apparently one of the government F-16s shoot down helicopter carrying 'coup plotters' (according to NTV)


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## Arya Stark (Jul 15, 2016)

Coup is most likely over but

a) this is civil war and not the marvel movies kind
b) erdogan will probably stronger than ever

who knows. i just want to go to my muse concert man.

Reactions: Like 2 | Friendly 2


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## Akatora (Jul 15, 2016)

Not a surprise this attempt was made, there's been sever speculation that one was underway for months.
Hopefully this will be able to get Turkey back into sanity instead of living in Erdogans personal wasteland.
There's a risk of things turning into something like Egypt though and hopefully we won't see something like that.

Hopefully Erdogan will lose the power and get kicked to the street, but yeah if he gets through this he'll be back an even worse leader I fear.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Reports about military fire on civilians keeps coming, plus we saw those videos. Not pretty. But it seems like the tide is turning against the coup.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Arya Stark said:


> Coup is most likely over but
> 
> a) this is civil war and not the marvel movies kind
> b) erdogan will probably stronger than ever
> ...






You'll get there luv.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Germany and Qatar join those condemning the coup (according to Sky News).



Watching this I feel a bit idiotic for earlier wishing the people would stay off the streets. Many have been hurt (and perhaps died?), but they are very brave.


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## Deleted member 222538 (Jul 15, 2016)

well one thing is for sure. its gunna get even worse for turkey. Erdogan is gunna come back and be an even worse shithead president.


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## Akatora (Jul 15, 2016)

Erdogan maintain a majority support perhaps, but he isn't a unifying character and Turkey will get bigger and bigger cracks the longer he stays in power.
He may very well outdo this attempt, but hopefully a better leader shows up soon or Turkey will end in Chaos


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## Utopia Realm (Jul 15, 2016)

Normality said:


> well one thing is for sure. its gunna get even worse for turkey. Erdogan is gunna come back and be an even worse shithead president.



Agreed. I suspect even harsher rules and iron fist to come from him.


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## Arya Stark (Jul 15, 2016)

There are already people theorizing this could be some Game of Thrones level shit orchestrated by Erdogan to make sure of Presidency.

I don't know wtf is going on though. We don't even know who the fuck is coup leader.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

In the end it was surprisingly easily crushed. For a moment it looked like Erdogan was finished.


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## Solar (Jul 15, 2016)

I was really pulling for the secular forces too.


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## Akatora (Jul 15, 2016)

Arya Stark said:


> There are already people theorizing this could be some Game of Thrones level shit orchestrated by Erdogan to make sure of Presidency.



Possibly, there's a lot of people and so many opinions and actions, the Media will in general be on "his side" so he has the tools needed to use it for an advantage.


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## Zef (Jul 15, 2016)

The world is going to fucking hell.  


World War 3 imminent


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## Arya Stark (Jul 15, 2016)

Honestly when they gave their "declaration", I knew it was shit. They made the newsreporter read it, without any Turkish flags, National Anthems... In old coups the leader ALWAYS showed their face and made a big deal about it.

This felt like bunch of kids trying to look tough. I mean, you guys know the coup in FMA, right?


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Supporters of Hezbollah, outlawed by the government, are rallying to support Erdogan.

Explosions heard in Istanbul and Ankara.


Gülen was not behind it.


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 15, 2016)

Keep in mind there's a _lot _of misinformation going around right now, fog of war.

Although if the coup fails, hopefully the junta stands down. The Spanish Civil War came about mostly due to a coup gone wrong.


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## Arya Stark (Jul 15, 2016)

tbh i'm most definitely not supporting coup. say what you want to say about erdogan, he's much better than military power. besides this is probably done by Fetullan Gulen's group and they are NO seculars AT ALL.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

It's still a warzone... Explosions, helicopters downed, rockets hitting buildings...


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## Kusa (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Germany and Qatar join those condemning the coup (according to Sky News).
> 
> 
> 
> Watching this I feel a bit idiotic for earlier wishing the people would stay off the streets. Many have been hurt (and perhaps died?), but they are very brave.



Yes, they were indeed very brave which I actually did not expect in this in such dimension.


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

>Hezbollah
Wait what?


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## Arya Stark (Jul 15, 2016)

SHIT, THEY BOMBED THE PARLIEMENT


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Gülen was not behind it.


I knew it, he never was the political type


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> >Hezbollah
> Wait what?



According to this source: 



Arya Stark said:


> SHIT, THEY BOMBED THE PARLIEMENT




It's lunatic!


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

0246 eest fires shot from jets over Kurtuluş Area.



FOX Turkey reports another explosion live. Bigger and louder than the last one.



"3rd bomb hits the Turkish Grand National Assembly building," AKP MP live from the building. ~CNN Turk.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)




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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

FOX Turkey reports that members of the parliament have descended down to the bunker in the TGNA, and that there are people injured.


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## mali (Jul 15, 2016)

...hasimi was literally screaming it wasn't a bomb


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## ~VK~ (Jul 15, 2016)

Man, I have many turkish friends I feel really bad for them thank god their families don't live close to the capital and istanbul


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## Zyrax (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> According to this source:


Oh, According to Wiki there is a Turkish/Kurdish Hezbollah in the region rather than the Lebnanese one


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Apparently Erdogans airplane is circulating over Turkey right now. 




edit:

Erdogans airplane currently descending.


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## Le Mâle-Pensant (Jul 15, 2016)

WTF is going on ? Turkey, that NATO member.


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## Huey Freeman (Jul 15, 2016)

Zef said:


> The world is going to fucking hell.
> 
> 
> World War 3 imminent


Acting like the EU, UK, or The U.S. Gives a shit.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

The Mad King said:


> Acting like the EU, UK, or The U.S. Gives a shit.



About Turkey? Oh they very much do.


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 15, 2016)

State media stations are back on the air, Erdogan's plane is on its way to Ankara.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

First images from TGNA building.




Fox is broadcasting live feed of the area where the chopper is attacking the parliament and military building:



Another live feed:


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

*Erdogan has landed on Istanbul Ataturk Airport.

*
Or then he hasn't yet landed. Uncertain info there. CNN Turkey says he's about to land there.


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## Xion (Jul 15, 2016)

Wow. This is what happens when a large, ignorant majority thinks that staying the course is best.

Democracy works if it's legitimate; Erdogan has shown he will stop at nothing to stack and sack democratic institutions in his pursuit of blind power.

Seems the coup has failed. This bodes very poorly for Turkey's future and for the aptitude and capacity of the Turkish populace. 

Two of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse have been unleashed: Brexit and Turkogan. Both should not have happened in a sane world.

The Third Horseman cometh and his name is Trump.

There will be no Fourth.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

FOX Turkey reports that the TGNA was bombed again. Contrary to past reports, it is reported that there are no injured people. The most recent explosion seems to have damaged a significant portion of the TGNA.


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## Jin-E (Jul 15, 2016)

Sometimes hard to know which fraction is attacking what since both presumably have access to air support.


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## Akatora (Jul 15, 2016)

Xion said:


> Wow. This is what happens when a large, ignorant majority thinks that staying the course is best.
> 
> Democracy works if it's legitimate; Erdogan has shown he will stop at nothing to stack and sack democratic institutions in his pursuit of blind power.
> 
> ...




well said.
Though i don't completely agree
(I support having a EU that look at the big problems and perhaps make regional areas with common rules, so the british islands inc ireland could be one such region, scandinavia another, etc. Should make it quicker to negociate between the parties)


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## Lord Genome (Jul 15, 2016)

God dam


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

CNN Turkey (and Kanal D and some others?) are being taken over by the army.






As for the parliament:


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## DarkTorrent (Jul 15, 2016)




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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 15, 2016)

Erdo has landed. I don't hear Jets, gunfire or explosions anymore. I think the Coup is over.

Reactions: Informative 2


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Latest info on Sky News: Erdogan has landed in Istanbul and is currently surrounded by supporters outside the Atatürk Airport. It's still unconfirmed.

Pics from Reuters:


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## hcheng02 (Jul 15, 2016)

I'm guessing if Erdrogan feels safe enough to land back in his country than the coup ended in his favor.


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## DarkTorrent (Jul 15, 2016)



Reactions: Like 1


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

hcheng02 said:


> I'm guessing if Erdrogan feels safe enough to land back in his country than the coup ended in his favor.


it's not over yet, i'm a not a fan of erdogan but he shouldnt be in turkey right now


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 15, 2016)

I hear a gunshot everyone once in a while but the rest of the noise subsided.

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 2


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

S said:


> it's not over yet, i'm a not a fan of erdogan but he shouldnt be in turkey right now



No, he really needs to be there just now... He can't run and hide, especially when the civilians are confronting the soldiers on the streets.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> No, he really needs to be there just now... He can't run and hide, especially when the civilians are confronting the soldiers on the streets.


I get that but some of the jets are still bombing part of istanbul, if they can get the chance, they sure would kill Erdogan. To prevent a bigger chaos he needs to be save.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Not sure if true:


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

He giving a speech!


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Not sure if true:


i hope hope hope this true


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

*Erdoğan currently live on many TV channels. Preparing for a press announcement.

*
Edit: ninjae'd_

_
What does he say?_







_


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## D4nc3Style (Jul 15, 2016)

I haven't really read up on this but people are saying Russia might get involved.?


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

D4nc3Style said:


> I haven't really read up on this but people are saying Russia might get involved.?



You mean people are coming up with ideas of their own and posting them on the internet with no evidence? Yeah seen a few of those.

However, Russia has no reason to arrange a coup against Erdogan _after_ Erdogan has made peace with them and has started to show signs of wanting to co-operate about the Syrian situation.






Apparently Erdogan is blaming Gülan for this.


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## Arya Stark (Jul 15, 2016)

No Russia. This is Turkey's internal problem since it's foundation. Erdogan speaking means coup is mostly over but who knows really.

To think that even a little fraction of military is causing big problems......


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

My english is limited so take my translation with grain of salt, Erdogan was in "marmaris" the whole time and according to him he army tried to eliminate him while


Arya Stark said:


> No Russia. This is Turkey's internal problem since it's foundation. Erdogan speaking means coup is mostly over but who knows really.
> 
> *To think that even a little fraction of military is causing big problems*......


Well, they are professinals and good organized.


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## Amanda (Jul 15, 2016)

Ankara Numune hospital requesting blood donations, overwhelmed by wounded people


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## God (Jul 15, 2016)

This coup solved nothing.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Amanda said:


> *Erdoğan currently live on many TV channels. Preparing for a press announcement.
> 
> *
> Edit: ninjae'd
> ...


Quick summary, small part of the army(i dont know how accurate this is) tried to eliminate him in Marmaris but they failed. The timing was close though.


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 15, 2016)

S said:


> He giving a speech!



The guy speaking right now has Erdo's balls deep in his mouth.


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## makeoutparadise (Jul 15, 2016)

Sobis there anymore fighting?


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## FLORIDA MAN (Jul 15, 2016)




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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 15, 2016)

Yes, gunfire started again. Also every fucking Imam in the city is singing call to prayer from every mosque it seems.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> The guy speaking right now has Erdo's balls deep in his mouth.


Look, this shit isnt about Erdogan, the army tried to coup d'etat brutaly against the will of the turkish people.I dont give a darn who is in the current goverment but if you go so far to bomb your own city you lost all sympathy. Fuck those guys.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 15, 2016)

Windows and doors shook with an explosion, could be a sonic boom too. Not sure.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 15, 2016)

S said:


> Look, this shit isnt about Erdogan,




Stopped reading here as its apparent you don't know shit.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 15, 2016)

The coup is pretty much finished, but I don't expect the units that took part are going to stand down so easily. Given Erdogan just flat out stated he's going to purge the military, they're dead men the minute they lay down their arms.

Might as well go down swinging and maybe convince the rest of the military on what is going to happen to them next if they let the Sultan have his way.


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## Megaharrison (Jul 15, 2016)

This was Turkey's last chance to be a secular/modern country. Oh well.

Anyway here's a fun clip of Kemalist helicopters attacking a crowd of Islamists


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 15, 2016)

The purge seems to already be in progress. 
Any infonon who that faction from the military was?


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## Megaharrison (Jul 15, 2016)

Secularist soldiers being led away for lynching by Islamist mobs.


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 15, 2016)

Megaharrison said:


> This was Turkey's last chance to be a secular/modern country. Oh well.


The coup might be quelled, but the situation is far from settled. The holdouts know they'll be hanged from the streets if they surrender and will go down fighting, and with Erdogan's threat of a purge, whatever elements in the military that stayed neutral are going to have to pick a side sooner or later.


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## Megaharrison (Jul 15, 2016)

Islamists get run over by tank


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## Megaharrison (Jul 15, 2016)

Kagekatsu said:


> The coup might be quelled, but the situation is far from settled. The holdouts know they'll be hanged from the streets if they surrender and will go down fighting, and with Erdogan's threat of a purge, whatever elements in the military that stayed neutral are going to have to pick a side sooner or later.



They're being moped up but I don't expect much else to happen. This coup was small. In ~2010 Erdogan imprisoned the army chief of staff and major kemalist/secularist Ilker Basbug and this led to a general purge of the armed forces. The high-level command was mostly loyal Islamists, in this case the conspirators seem to have been a few army brigades around the major cities backed by a squadron of F-16's from an air force sympathizer. The navy, intelligence, and police weren't in on it and they couldn't secure locations fast enough before Erdogan was able to escape. Had this started with an assassination of him and the PM it might have created a domino effect but who knows. Now Turkey gets to look like Muslim Brotherhood Egypt some more.


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 15, 2016)

Megaharrison said:


> They're being moped up but I don't expect much else to happen. This coup was small. In ~2010 Erdogan imprisoned the army chief of staff and major kemalist/secularist Ilker Basbug and this led to a general purge of the armed forces. The high-level command was mostly loyal Islamists, in this case the conspirators seem to have been a few army brigades around the major cities backed by a squadron of F-16's from an air force sympathizer. The navy, intelligence, and police weren't in on it and they couldn't secure locations fast enough before Erdogan was able to escape. Had this started with an assassination of him and the PM it might have created a domino effect but who knows. Now Turkey gets to look like Muslim Brotherhood Egypt some more.


We'll see. I have a strong suspicion there will be another coup by the Kemalists before the end of the year, one far more organized and successful.


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## Mider T (Jul 15, 2016)

This coupon attempt is a direct response to Erdogan doing a 180 in regards to the Syrian Civil War a few days ago.  Obviously the military wasn't having it.


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## Megaharrison (Jul 15, 2016)

Kagekatsu said:


> We'll see. I have a strong suspicion there will be another coup by the Kemalists before the end of the year, one far more organized and successful.



Not after this. Erdo is going to go full 1930's Stalin on the army. It will make them a less capable force at least. Syria and Russia should be happy.

This was their legit one chance for many years.

The best-case scenario now seems to be that the secularists still have some control in Akara while Istanbul is in Islamist hands. I wonder if this will become a Libya Tripoli vs Benghazi civil war, though I sincerely doubt it.


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## Megaharrison (Jul 15, 2016)

It seems at the onset of this Erdogan was vacationing at his palace in Marmaris. Meanwhile the coup kicked off by bombing parliament and blocking bridges in Istanbul. When Erdo, completely unmolested, heard of this he hoped on a plane and organized an Islamist counterattack.

Christ these people were stupid. Even the 1991 Soviet coup was professional compared to this.


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 15, 2016)

So the coup failed and Kerdogan is going to have even more power now which is exactly what he wanted, lovely


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## Huey Freeman (Jul 15, 2016)

Just how many fucking posters on this forum is from the Turkey/Middle East?

Reactions: Dislike 2


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## S (Jul 15, 2016)

Thanks god its over. I donk know what will happen next but nothing is gonna be the same anymore in Turkey.


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 15, 2016)

S said:


> Thanks god its over. I donk know what will happen next but nothing is gonna be the same anymore in Turkey.


It's going to be about 10000x worse, this has basically granted Kerdogan as much power as he wants, if he had made Turkey an Islamist dictatorship before, it's going to be even worse now with people thinking they're being "protected"


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## S (Jul 16, 2016)

Khaleesi said:


> It's going to be about 10000x worse, this has basically granted Kerdogan as much power as he wants, if he had made Turkey an Islamist dictatorship before, it's going to be even worse now with people thinking they're being "protected"


Do you live in turkey? how can you say that? i know Erdogan gets a lot of hate (rightfully so) but if you think Erdogan is gonna go full dictator then you are a fool. 

They will change the military, thats for sure...i cant belive they bomb the parlement.


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 16, 2016)

S said:


> Do you live in turkey? how can you say that? i know Erdogan gets a lot of hate (rightfully so) but if you think Erdogan is gonna go full dictator then you are a fool.
> 
> They will change the military, thats for sure...i cant belive they bomb the parlement.



Lmao no you're the fool if you don't see that happening, given that he's already practically a dictator, this literally gave him the perfect opening to grab more power. And no, I don't live in Turkey, I'm Kurdish and have been there though


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## ExoSkel (Jul 16, 2016)

LOL, some people still trying to make an argument that Kerdogan isn't trying to be a dictator when all signs points towards him trying to be one?

Time to wake up and smell the ashes, sunshine.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 16, 2016)

ExoSkel said:


> LOL, some people still trying to make an argument that Kerdogan isn't trying to be a dictator when all signs pointed towards him trying to be one many months ago?
> 
> Time to wake up and smell the ashes, sunshine.



I've noticed a trend when they like to admit that Kerogan is bad but not as bad as the media likes to portray him


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## SupremeKage (Jul 16, 2016)

Not gonna lie, but this year has been interesting


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## Deleted member 222538 (Jul 16, 2016)

lol the turkish people cheering because Erdogan is back in control...... lol just you wait.  Its about to get a whole lot worse. just wait on it.


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## Kusa (Jul 16, 2016)

60 people died for absolutely nothing

And some people defend this coup, oh did bring so much right. If you think Erdogan was a dictator than just wait and see 

This will make more powerful than he ever was


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## DarkTorrent (Jul 16, 2016)

there are more than 1.5 thousand of military personnel arrested already according to Reuters


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## DonutKid (Jul 16, 2016)

ExoSkel said:


> You dont have to copy and paste from reddit thread.



Why can't I?

It wasn't from reddit btw.


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## S (Jul 16, 2016)



Reactions: Funny 1


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## DarkTorrent (Jul 16, 2016)

is that the parliament building?


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## Akatora (Jul 16, 2016)

S said:


> Look, this shit isnt about Erdogan, the army tried to coup d'etat brutaly against the will of the turkish people.I dont give a darn who is in the current goverment but if you go so far to bomb your own city you lost all sympathy. Fuck those guys.



It should probably be viewed as a desperate last effort before their country change for the worse and completely submits to Erdogans will.
I agree though bombing your own people is stupid, but for the millitary to be shooting at civilians that attempt to disarm them and beat them up etc. makes sense that some would shoot at the civilians under such chaotic circumstances(that a large mob shows up on the street supporting Erdogan shouldn't necessary mean he entire population does)

Anyway I hope Erdogan become more secular after this, there should be a limit at how many fronts he can create in his own country

----------------

Regarding the millitary really is sad if they become another religious cult, let them stay secular


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## S (Jul 16, 2016)

Akatora said:


> It should probably be viewed as a desperate last effort before their country change for the worse and completely submits to Erdogans will.
> I agree though bombing your own people is stupid, but for the millitary to be shooting at civilians that attempt to disarm them and beat them up etc. makes sense that some would shoot at the civilians under such chaotic circumstances(that a large mob shows up on the street supporting Erdogan shouldn't necessary mean he entire population does)
> 
> Anyway I hope Erdogan become more secular after this, there should be a limit at how many fronts he can create in his own country
> ...


Turkey is sacular and it should stay this way but the fear mongering is getting out of control. If Erdogan ever tried to get rid of sacular state, he would be long gone, the turkish people would not tolerate this at all. You dont need the army for this.

The reason why the coup failed today is, the army coulndt get behind the turkish people.


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## Zyrax (Jul 16, 2016)

Erdogan has yet to go full Saudi/Iran, He knows his limits Unless you think lifting the Ban on Religious clothing in schools is comparable to hanging gay people or straight up making being a Christian a Crime


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## Le Mâle-Pensant (Jul 16, 2016)

90 deads for a failed coup.  My god,  it's just crazy what happened there.


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## Zyrax (Jul 16, 2016)

What did Gülen do to make Erdogan hate him so much to the point of blaming him for the Coup? 
From what I read hes only some preacher


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## scerpers (Jul 16, 2016)

fucking awesome tho


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## Kaaant (Jul 16, 2016)

What? The coup failed?


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

Some 2,839 soldiers, including high-ranking officers, have been arrested.

161 people have been killed and 1,440 wounded.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36813924


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 16, 2016)

Megaharrison said:


> This was Turkey's last chance to be a secular/modern country. Oh well.
> 
> Anyway here's a fun clip of Kemalist helicopters attacking a crowd of Islamists





Alwaysmind said:


> The purge seems to already be in progress.
> Any infonon who that faction from the military was?



Actually some sources say this wasn't done by the secular part of the military. It was executed by the loyalists(congregation) of Fethullah Gülen(hardcore Islamist).

It is very likely that this was a hoax. Executed with a deeper agenda behind it. Some things will change in Turkey, thats for sure. For the worse, thats also for sure.
To kicks things off with, bringing death penalty back is in the talks.



Zyrax Pasha said:


> Erdogan has yet to go full Saudi/Iran, He knows his limits Unless you think lifting the Ban on Religious clothing in schools is comparable to hanging gay people or straight up making being a Christian a Crime



Erdoğan expressed on many occasions that he supports Sharia Law and hates Atatürk, before he came to power 14 years ago. People just seem to forget.


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> It is very likely that this was a hoax. Executed with a deeper agenda behind it.




That has crossed the minds of many. 

If it was a genuine attempt, it was pretty badly pulled off. 



Grimmjowsensei said:


> Some things will change in Turkey, thats for sure. For the worse, thats also for sure.
> To kicks things off with, bringing death penalty back is in the talks.




Oh great.


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 16, 2016)

Amanda said:


> If it was a genuine attempt, it was pretty badly pulled off.



It seems too sloppy to be considered a genuine attempt.

Or it maybe that they didn't have a chance to plan it for long because they were on a clock. Maybe they recieved intel that the goverment would start an investigation in the military ranks or something similar and they knew they would be exposed and they tried to do as much damage as they could before they went down.

But for now I think it is the former, there is a different agenda here.


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## Zyrax (Jul 16, 2016)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> Fethullah Gülen(hardcore Islamist).


Isn't he the same guy who preaches tolerance and is one of the biggest critics of Salafism ?


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> It seems too sloppy to be considered a genuine attempt.




They were very keen on punishing the Parliament building while Erdo flew around and the media largely sent pro-government message.








> "Five generals and 29 colonels are relieved of their duty, according to Turkey’s Interior Ministry, and several high court judges are also being questioned."







Judges?





> *Turkish frigate seized in Golcuk naval base: Greek army source*
> 
> A Turkish group opposed to the government has taken over a frigate at Turkey's Golcuk naval base and the head of the Turkish fleet is being held hostage, a senior Greek military source told Reuters on Saturday.



http://www.reuters.com/article/us-turkey-security-frigate-idUSKCN0ZW0LS?il=0



> *In Greece, our correspondent Helena Smith is being told that the eight Turkish military personnel who sought asylum in the northern Greek town of Alexandoupolis have removed all insignia from their uniforms, making it impossible to know their ranks. She reports:*
> 
> _“We are in the process of sending interpreters in order to be debriefed,” one insider said. “We are also in touch with the Turkish embassy. It is vital that we know what is going on.”
> 
> ...




https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2016/jul/15/turkey-coup-attempt-military-gunfire-ankara





> *Turkish PM: Any country that stands by cleric Gulen will be at war with Turkey*
> 
> 
> Any country that stands by the Muslim cleric Fethullah Gulen will not be a friend of Turkey and will be considered at war with the NATO member, Turkish Prime Minister Binali Yildirim said on Saturday.
> ...




http://www.reuters.com/article/us-turkey-security-primeminister-gulen-idUSKCN0ZW0K5?il=0




> Turkish authorities have issued an alarm to border gates and airports upon being informed that prominent members of the Gulen Movement, including journalists, might flee the country following the overnight attempted military coup, according to state-run press agency Anadolu.
> 
> The report says authorities discovered the plans after lists were found detailing the commanders and their deputies to be put in charge during the period of martial law if the coup had succeeded.
> 
> Turkey’s acting chief of the general staff, Gen. Umit Dundar, said Saturday that the military is determined to purge members of the movement of Fethullah Gulen, a Muslim cleric living in exile in Pennsylvania, from the ranks.



https://www.theguardian.com/world/l...b073c22786c8ee#block-578a019be4b073c22786c8ee



> *Death penalty an option - Turkish PM*
> Asked if reintroducing the death penalty was an option for dealing with coup plotters, Yildirim said the death penalty was not in the constitution but legal changes would be considered.



https://www.theguardian.com/world/l...b073c22786c8ee#block-578a019be4b073c22786c8ee


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## Le Mâle-Pensant (Jul 16, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Some 2,839 soldiers, including high-ranking officers, have been arrested.
> 
> 161 people have been killed and 1,440 wounded.
> 
> http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36813924


God,  the army is losing the support of the population.  It's a shame when you know their position in the country.


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## Arya Stark (Jul 16, 2016)

Everything is terrible and it's going to get worse. And the worst is that Turkey won't be the only one to suffer, the entire world is tumbling down to a chaos. Turkey is one of the key players of ISIS vs. the world ordeal and any step from here will have larger effects. 

Coup is officially done for. And if you know anything about military's power in Turkey, you also know that something isn't right.

Coup HAS NEVER done good to this country. never. I don't understand why people in this thread genuinely wanted coup to win. This wasn't done by Kemalists!! It was done by the men of Fetullah Gulen!   


Zyrax Pasha said:


> What did Gülen do to make Erdogan hate him so much to the point of blaming him for the Coup?
> From what I read hes only some preacher


He's the reason Erdogan exists. Gulen was his mentor but then they had bad blood because Erdogan wanted absolute power. He pulled an Obito on Gulen's Madara, if you catch my drift. And now Gulen is fighting back but their men are already as divided as it was. Gulen is more of a ~pacifist~ and he's directing his organization from a distant place (Pennsylvania) so Erdogan has more control over his men.


Literally the main reason why this coup failed was because Kemalists didn't support it. So the group didn't have enough back up ammo wise. *High rankers were no where to be seen and that was the deal breaker. *They couldn't even read their own declaration themselves. They attacked national television first instead of holding Parliament. No politicians were taken in,  Erdogan's capture was a failure and so on...And it was all because IMHO army had their own conflicts amongst themselves. They took the Chief of General Staff as hostage instead of having him join them. Or you know, outright killing him and so on.

This whole thing is too dumb. There is clearly some agenda going on here. It doesn't have to be Erdogan plotting this. I have hard time believing it because Erdogan already has enough power in state already......Something is fishy....

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

2745 judges have been fired for being connected with Gulan.

The pilot who shot down the Russian plane was among the coup plotters, says the government sources. 

"Turkish media are widely reporting two men as having orchestrated the attempted coup. 

One of these is General Akin Ozturk, the former commander of the Turkish Air Force, who retired from the military in August 2015, but who continued to serve as a member of the Supreme Military Council. 

The second indvidual is Lieutenant-General Metin Iyidil, the Combat and Support Training commander of the Land Forces Training and Doctrine Command."

Kerry says USA has not received any official request to hand over Gulan, say USA is helping Turkey to solve what happened and asks for any evidence Turkey has on Gulan's participation. 

All from BBC.


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 16, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> Isn't he the same guy who preaches tolerance and is one of the biggest critics of Salafism ?


Islam is Islam bro. 
It tells you that you can "pretend" till you get what you want. You can also lie, cheat, kill in the name of Jihad. Religion of Peace and Tolerance.

Reactions: Disagree 1


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## Pliskin (Jul 16, 2016)

Kerdogan calling the coup allah's blessing already. 

Brace yourslelves, stalinist style Turkey is upon you.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

Yeah if this wasn't organized to get rid of everyone unfavored, then it will be used as an excuse to do so.


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 16, 2016)

Arya Stark said:


> This whole thing is too dumb. There is clearly some agenda going on here. It doesn't have to be Erdogan plotting this. I have hard time believing it because Erdogan already has enough power in state already......Something is fishy....



He has absolute power, but now he has full support of the public in any outrageous thing he does. He asked people to swarm the streets, and people stood against the military. Coup is prevented. Zealous mobs killed soldiers who surrendered, in brutal fashion too. Now they are promoting the idea of "People's justice." 
They created the base for a more authoritarian goverment, maybe the base for a less liberal islamic state.


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## Son of Goku (Jul 16, 2016)

Wow... last time I checked in here everyone was like "Erdogan is done for"! Now, not so much. 
Classic case of _'don't count your chickens before they're hatched'_.


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## SLB (Jul 16, 2016)

Settle down, Arya Stark. Pretty sure this was just a regular Tuesday during the Cold War.


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## Arya Stark (Jul 16, 2016)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> He has absolute power, but now he has full support of the public in any outrageous thing he does. He asked people to swarm the streets, and people stood against the military. Coup is prevented. Zealous mobs killed soldiers who surrendered, in brutal fashion too. Now they are promoting the idea of "People's justice."
> They created the base for a more authoritarian goverment, maybe the base for a less liberal islamic state.



It's still 50/50 as it was before. Those who rallied streets are the same ones who supported him through the worst. I really don't see a point.



Moody said:


> Settle down, Arya Stark. Pretty sure this was just a regular Tuesday during the Cold War.



This is Middle East, Cold War rarely stays "cold" here.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 16, 2016)

Amanda said:


> That has crossed the minds of many.
> 
> If it was a genuine attempt, it was pretty badly pulled off.
> 
> ...



I read online that some soldiers thought it was a military exercise. Some realized it was a coup when people climbed on the tanks.


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## Zyrax (Jul 16, 2016)

@Arya Stark @Grimmjowsensei
Does any politician in Turkey Has a solution to the "Baig" culture 
Or do Turkish Dramas exagerate it?


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## Arya Stark (Jul 16, 2016)

That's what happened. Low-rank soldiers had no idea what was going on, once they realized most of them surrendered immediately. This also helped coup to fail quickly.


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## Arya Stark (Jul 16, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> @Arya Stark @Grimmjowsensei
> Does any politician in Turkey Has a solution to the "Baig" culture
> Or do Turkish Dramas exagerate it?



what is "baig" ?


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 16, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> @Arya Stark @Grimmjowsensei
> Does any politician in Turkey Has a solution to the "Baig" culture
> Or do Turkish Dramas exagerate it?



I have no idea what Baig is.


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## Zyrax (Jul 16, 2016)

Arya Stark said:


> what is "baig" ?





Grimmjowsensei said:


> I have no idea what Baig is.



Beks
In Turkish Dramas there is always this powerful family who act like jackasses to everyone else in their Neighbourhoods with the head of the house being called Bek like Mehmet Bek or someshit
Is this Mafia like common in Turkey or is it only in Turkish Drama


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 16, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> Beks
> In Turkish Dramas there is always this powerful family who act like jackasses to everyone else in their Neighbourhoods with the head of the house being called Bek like Mehmet Bek or someshit
> Is this Mafia like common in Turkey or is it only in Turkish Drama



I still have no idea what you are talking about. Never heard a turkish word "bek."
Maybe you mean "bey" ? But its something like "Mr." Like Mehmet Bey = Mr. Mehmet

I never watch Turkish TV, let alone Turkish shows/drama.
Mafia is common in Turkey. Current Goverment is the best example.


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

*Reports: Scores of arrest warrants issued against Supreme Court*
Posted at16:53


We told you earlier that 2,745 judges have been fired in Turkey on Saturday for alleged links to Fetullah Gulen - now both the Hurriyet newspaper and Anadolu Agency are reporting that 140 arrest warrants have been issued against members of the Supreme Court.

By BBC



Son of Goku said:


> Wow... last time I checked in here everyone was like "Erdogan is done for"! Now, not so much.
> Classic case of _'don't count your chickens before they're hatched'_.




Yeah, we were too hasty. First it looked like the coup is succeeding. But after Erdogan returned things started turning around quite quickly - the momentum died.



Alwaysmind said:


> I read online that some soldiers thought it was a military exercise. Some realized it was a coup when people climbed on the tanks.





Arya Stark said:


> That's what happened. Low-rank soldiers had no idea what was going on, once they realized most of them surrendered immediately. This also helped coup to fail quickly.




Poor guys, I hope they won't face any punishment. 

Though it's odd. How can you attempt to take over if some other your soldiers don't even know what's going on and that it’s for real?


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 16, 2016)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> Or it maybe that they didn't have a chance to plan it for long because they were on a clock. Maybe they recieved intel that the goverment would start an investigation in the military ranks or something similar and they knew they would be exposed and they tried to do as much damage as they could before they went down.



Some sources confirmed this. Although I can't vouch for the validity of the sources yet.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 16, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Though it's odd. How can you attempt to take over if some other your soldiers don't even know what's going on and that it’s for real?



18 Brumaire maybe?


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## Orochibuto (Jul 16, 2016)

This is really bad.

A failed coup means Erdogan now can be president for life, likely get full control of the military and become a full fledged dictator like Saddam was.

This just destroyed any chance of Erdogan stepping down when his term is up.


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## Punished Pathos (Jul 16, 2016)

Orochibuto said:


> This is really bad.
> 
> A failed coup means Erdogan now can be president for life, likely get full control of the military and become a full fledged dictator like Saddam was.
> 
> This just destroyed any chance of Erdogan stepping down when his term is up.



Comparing Erdogan to Saddam?


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## Arya Stark (Jul 16, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> Beks
> In Turkish Dramas there is always this powerful family who act like jackasses to everyone else in their Neighbourhoods with the head of the house being called Bek like Mehmet Bek or someshit
> Is this Mafia like common in Turkey or is it only in Turkish Drama


Oh I think I get it. Do you mean Aşiret families? They are like clans in Eastern Turkey. The leader is called "Reis"  which means "leader, chief".

They are not exactly like mafias, though there are some overlappings with classic mob family type. They are influencial, that's true.


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

*Update on Incirlik air base*
Posted at19:44

The US embassy in Ankara earlier confirmed that power was off at the Incirlik air base in Turkey, from where it launches its raids on the Islamic State group, also known as ISIL.

Here's the latest update from Pentagon Press Secretary Peter Cook:

"The Turkish government has closed its airspace to military aircraft, and as a result air operations at Incirlik Air Base have been halted at this time. US officials are working with the Turks to resume air operations there as soon as possible. In the meantime, US Central Command is adjusting flight operations in the counter-ISIL campaign to minimize any effects on the campaign. US facilities at Incirlik are operating on internal power sources and a loss of commercial power to the base has not affected base operations."



*Greek asylum request: The plot thickens*
Posted at19:27


Further to our post 25 minutes ago: it appears there's a very different view in Greece as to whether the eight Turks who arrived in a helicopter, claiming asylum, will be deported.

A Greek journalist with Der Spiegel writes:


GR Gov source denies claimed agreement btw Greece and #Turkey to extradite 8 officers. Asylum claims to be processed swiftly but lawfully


No-one tell Turkey's foreign minister - he was insistent they would be deported.


By BBC 



Alwaysmind said:


> 18 Brumaire maybe?



Is that how it happened? But this is surely a very different situation...


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## Deer Lord (Jul 16, 2016)

so... this is pretty much the Greyjoy Rebellion isn't it?


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

*Death toll rises to 265 - president's office*
Posted at19:16


The office of the Turkish president has given an update on the number of people killed in the attempted coup.

It says 161 civilians died, of whom 20 were "plotters".

Another 104 "plotters" - presumably referring to soldiers - died, making a total of 265.


*High-ranking member of Constitutional Court 'arrested'*
Posted at19:22


Various Turkish media outlets, including the Anadolu Agency, are now reporting that a high-ranking member of the Constitutional Court has now been arrested.

Alparslan Altan is the vice-president of the court, the most authoritative in the country.



*Obama urges Turkey to 'act within rule of law'*
Posted at19:49


A statement just released by the White House says President Obama has reiterated the United States' "unwavering support for the democratically-elected, civilian government of Turkey".

It adds:

"While we have no indications as of yet that Americans were killed or injured in the violence, the president and his team lamented the loss of life and registered the vital need for all parties in Turkey to act within the rule of law and to avoid actions that would lead to further violence or instability."

"The president also underscored the shared challenges that will require continued Turkish cooperation, including our joint efforts against terrorism."




Forgot to post the previous part of the Incirlik story:

*More on Incirlik base being cut off*
Posted at17:39


We told you about half an hour ago ago that the Incirlik air base, used by US jets to launch their raids on the Islamic State group, had been cut off.

We now have the statement by the US embassy in Ankara - .

"Be advised that local authorities are denying movements on to and off of Incirlik Air Base. The power there has also been cut. Please avoid the air base until normal operations have been restored."



BBC again.


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## Rukia (Jul 16, 2016)

I haven't been following that closely.  I do wonder why so many military men were captured.  It seems like they should have had the ability and the desire to fight to the last man.


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

Rukia said:


> I haven't been following that closely.  I do wonder why so many military men were captured.  It seems like they should have had the ability and the desire to fight to the last man.




From the previous page:



Alwaysmind said:


> I read online that some soldiers thought it was a military exercise. Some realized it was a coup when people climbed on the tanks.





Arya Stark said:


> That's what happened. Low-rank soldiers had no idea what was going on, once they realized most of them surrendered immediately. This also helped coup to fail quickly.


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## Zyrax (Jul 16, 2016)

Arya Stark said:


> Oh I think I get it. Do you mean Aşiret families? They are like clans in Eastern Turkey. The leader is called "Reis"  which means "leader, chief".
> 
> They are not exactly like mafias, though there are some overlappings with classic mob family type. They are influencial, that's true.


Well yeah those, are they seen as a Problem in Turkey? Like are there some clashes between families over some feuds like the way Turkish Drama potray it? 

Also what are your thoughts on 
Yaprak Dökümü
Gümüş and Kıvanç Tatlıtu


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## S (Jul 16, 2016)

Rukia said:


> I haven't been following that closely.  I do wonder why so many military men were captured.  It seems like they should have had the ability and the desire to fight to the last man.


The low level officals didnt wanted to shoot his own people, if they wanted they could easily stomp the whole civilian movement, at least they had some decency to stop the madness.

The high level officals on the other...


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## ExoSkel (Jul 16, 2016)

> : "US have to give us  if we are to cooperate together." In  meantime, 1,500 Americans at  can't go in, out or fly.


Fuck that country and fuck the rest of turks who supported Kerdogan. I no longer consider them as an ally of the US.


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

Updated the title.



> *Gülen rejects coup accusations*
> Amana Fontanella-Khan
> 
> _In a rare interview with a small group of journalists at his residence in Saylorsburg, Pennsylvania, the reclusive Fethullah _Gülen_ has told my colleague *Amana Fontanella-Khan* that he rejects all accusations that he was behind Friday’s coup attempt._
> ...





> *Erdoğan calls on Obama to arrest Gülen*
> President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan is speaking from Istanbul, where he calls on Barack Obama to arrest cleric Fethullah Gülen or deport him to Turkey to face charges related to the coup.
> 
> He says that if the US and Turkey are truly strategic allies, then the American president will help Erdoğan with regard to the exiled imam, who lives in central Pennsylvania.
> ...



https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2016/jul/15/turkey-coup-attempt-military-gunfire-ankara


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## Rukia (Jul 16, 2016)

Amanda said:


> From the previous page:


Okay.  Even if that isn't true, it sounds like a good excuse to make when it becomes clear that the coup will fail.


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## Orochibuto (Jul 16, 2016)

Punished Pathos said:


> Comparing Erdogan to Saddam?



Only in regards to dictatorial power, not their way of governing.

Erdogan was either becoming a dictator or a de facto dictator, he still had some restrictions.

For example, it would really be unlikely unless he dramatically changed the law, that he could just refuse to step down when his term is up.

Now with this shit? He has everything he needs to toss aside the constitution and just not step down when his time is up or simply create a superior office with unlimited term and powers.

In short, he now can go from an authoritarian president with a lot of power to a legit dictator like Saddam, Stalin or the Kims in North Korea.

Coups are the kind of shit that can create full fledged dictatorships even in stable solid democracies. Here? I cant see how they will ever get rid of Erdogan now.


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

It's reported Turkey's Minister of Labour has accused USA of being behind the coup (for the Gulan connection) while live on television, can anyone confirm to have seen this happen?


I also read Gulan is one of the supporters of the Clintons, is this true?


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## Rukia (Jul 16, 2016)

I don't know this leader very well.  But what I have read makes it seem like it would have been in our best interest for the coup to have been successful.


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)




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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 16, 2016)

ExoSkel said:


> Fuck that country and fuck the rest of turks who supported Kerdogan. I no longer consider them as an ally of the US.



I sincerely hope Obama laughs in this pricks face, lmao threatening the the US, just like he keeps threatening every other country, they might be an ally in the Middle East but they need us more than we need them


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## Zyrax (Jul 16, 2016)

I still doubt Gülen being behind the Coup


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## Mider T (Jul 16, 2016)

What are the Young Turks saying?


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

Khaleesi said:


> just like he keeps threatening every other country



He succeeded with EU. And he blackmailed US in the near past as well - don't remember how that all transpired.



Zyrax Pasha said:


> I still doubt Gülen being behind the Coup



Me too.

Perhaps Erdogan doesn't even want him. He's more useful alive and free.


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## SupremeKage (Jul 16, 2016)

Rukia said:


> I don't know this leader very well.  But what I have read makes it seem like it would have been in our best interest for the coup to have been successful.


The fact that civilians were fighting the military coup, it seems like people love him. He probably has done some good things


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## Jin-E (Jul 16, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Perhaps Erdogan doesn't even want him. He's more useful alive and free.



He seems to serve as Erdogan's Trotsky, a puppetmaster boogeyman he can blame everything on and use him as a pretext for cracking down on dissent.


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## God (Jul 16, 2016)

For all the moral superiority these religious "politicians" (re: dictators) claim to have, they sure do love to take up the role of their beloved allah for themselves. Do they just lack self-awareness or...?


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## Zyrax (Jul 16, 2016)

>Its another "Trotsky wasn't more of a Cunt than Stalin" Episode


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## Kagekatsu (Jul 16, 2016)




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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

As of now I subscribe to this theory:

"@chinahand TRE knew about the plot, made sure it would fail w/ help of loyal officers pretending to be part of it, & let it go ahead."

Would explain why it seemed so badly planned. The crucial people vanished when the time came and didn't do their agreed jobs.


So it's true then.

It was said already during the night that the jet(s) refueled at Incirlik. It sounded like gossip but apparently wasn't.

Is it true then also that the commanding officer at Incirlik has been arrested? Probably so, but I don’t know whether he is Turkish or American.


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## divid (Jul 16, 2016)

*Suspected Turkey Coup Leader Served as Military Attaché to Israel *

probably just a coincidence
because israel is, we all know that, a haven of democracy


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

divid said:


> probably just a coincidence
> because israel is, we all know that, a haven of democracy



Not because of that, but because Turkey and Israel have recently been re-establishing their friendly relations and trade. Erdogan is now pro-Israel again.

Ditto for Russia. And Syria.

Those don't benefit from Erdogan being removed _now_.

If anything, some of the people calling Erdogan the betrayer of the Palestinians might. The Saudis haven't liked it either.

But I doubt that's the motive.


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## Zyrax (Jul 16, 2016)

Except that Israel condemned the Coup


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

Yes, and they expressed their eagerness to get to continue the normalization process of their relations.

Stay focused, folks.


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## divid (Jul 16, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> Except that Israel condemned the Coup


they rally *after *the failure ? lol
and of course they aren't going to make this public, this is more than enough to start a total war

@Amanda, erdogan's problem is he was trying to straddle the fence, you can't do that for years and not end slipping
try to not piss people who are enemies and one or the other will eventually come at you
the friend of my enemy is my enemy


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

You're trying too hard... One small secondary piece of connection to Israel doesn't outdo the fact that this would have been a coup against a renewed Israel ally - who has been making enemies everywhere but has recently removed Israel from the enemy list.

Ask "who benefits", not "how can I try to connect a country I dislike with this?"

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kusa (Jul 16, 2016)

Fucking 265 people died over a failed coup that gave the man who already had power more power...wow

Reactions: Agree 1


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## S (Jul 16, 2016)

Kusa said:


> Fucking 265 people died over a failed coup that gave the man who already had power more power...wow


Again those fuckers bomb the fucking parliament with F16 jets and helicopters, what do you think the goverment should do now? like i said before, i'm not a fan of the current goverment but some of the high officials cross the line. They will get hard punishment, lifetime sentence should be good.


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## Orochibuto (Jul 16, 2016)

S said:


> what do you think the goverment should do now? like i said before, i'm not a fan of the current goverment but some of the high officials cross the line. They will get hard punishment, lifetime sentence should be good.



Ensure the democratic process and make sure the man will step down when his term is up and will not do some fuckery like rule by proxy or move to a higher office.

Btw wiki says in Turkey the president is a ceremonial role and the Prime Minister is the ruler.

How true is that?


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## Kusa (Jul 16, 2016)

S said:


> Again those fuckers bomb the fucking parliament with F16 jets and helicopters, what do you think the goverment should do now? like i said before, i'm not a fan of the current goverment but some of the high officials cross the line. They will get hard punishment, lifetime sentence should be good.



I was actually blaming the ones who are responsible for the coup. They did achieve nothing but the opposite of what they intended and the loss of so many lives.


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## Grimmjowsensei (Jul 16, 2016)

It is more or less confirmed that Feto's men were behind the coup and they executed it because they were about to get exposed and they wanted to do as much damage as possible before they were apprehended.



Orochibuto said:


> Ensure the democratic process and make sure the man will step down when his term is up and will not do some fuckery like rule by proxy or move to a higher office.
> 
> Btw wiki says in Turkey the president is a ceremonial role and the Prime Minister is the ruler.
> 
> How true is that?



Used to be true. But Erdo controls everything now, current and the previous PM's were just puppets. Once he brings the presidential system his absolute rulership will be legitimized.


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## Amanda (Jul 16, 2016)

I wonder what is the exact plan with demanding the extradation of Gülen and saying Incirlik returns to normal once the post-coup operation is finished.

Does Erdogan really intent to play that game out, or is he just mouthing off? And if he's willing to stick to those guns, has he considered the full gravity of the ensuing situation, and prepared for it with some alternative plan for Turkey's future?

Also... ISIS gets to sleep a bit better for at least a while now.



Orochibuto said:


> Btw wiki says in Turkey the president is a ceremonial role and the Prime Minister is the ruler.
> 
> How true is that?




It has been true, but Erdogan is seeking to change the laws to transfer the power to the president.


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## Zyrax (Jul 16, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Also... ISIS gets to sleep a bit better for at least a while now.


http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-crisis-iraq-mosul-idUSKCN0ZS2E6
Maybe in Syria but the Moment they lose Mosul(Which likely in 3 Month or so) they become Irrelevant In Iraq


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## Rukia (Jul 16, 2016)

Is Turkey part of the EU?


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 16, 2016)

Rukia said:


> Is Turkey part of the EU?



No, it wanted to be but there has been resistance.


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## Rukia (Jul 16, 2016)

I heard that there were at least discussions.  Probably not a good idea.  It seems like if the government doesn't like you in Turkey, you are guilty until proven innocent and an automatic co-conspirator.  Makes me think the president really was behind the coup.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 16, 2016)

Rukia said:


> I heard that there were at least discussions.  Probably not a good idea.  It seems like if the government doesn't like you in Turkey, you are guilty until proven innocent and an automatic co-conspirator.  Makes me think the president really was behind the coup.



Some counties were in favour, others were not and the discussions pretty much stalled last I recall.


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

*Turkey coup attempt: US warns Turkey against 'insinuations' of involvement*

The US has warned Turkey against "public insinuations" of American involvement in a failed military coup, saying such claims are "utterly false and harmful" to their relations.

US Secretary of State John Kerry was speaking after Turkey's labour minister suggested the US was behind the coup.

Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has called on the US to extradite US-based Turkish cleric Fethullah Gulen.

Mr Erdogan has accused him of being behind the plot, which Mr Gulen denies.

Mr Gulen told reporters from his home in Pennsylvania that he had been away from Turkey for more than 15 years and "I don't even know who my followers [in the country] are".

The attempted coup began on Friday night when a faction of the military took over key bridges in Istanbul and attacked parliament buildings in Ankara.

The government says 161 civilians and 104 "plotters" were killed in ensuing clashes, and more than 1,440 injured.

Nearly 3,000 soldiers have been detained and some 2,700 judges were sacked on Saturday as the government sought to re-assert its power.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36818401


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

So there has been arrests in Incirlik. An airforce general and some other officers. (Turkish.)

Have any other bases been cut off like Incirlik, or is this the only case?

What surprises me is that people knew at such an early stage where the coupist jet was refueling. At the same time we were uncertain about whether Istanbul was being bombed or if it was just the sonic booms people heard. Is this something you can see by following the sites that report airplane traffic? They detect military planes as well?


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## Le Mâle-Pensant (Jul 17, 2016)

Anti Americanism will rise in Turkey after these claims.


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

I suppose he has to demand for the extradition of Gülen. And America has told decline.

Hopefully they leave it at that and by time forget about it. Not sure how realistic that wish is, though.

Hmmm...

How will this affect the proposal of co-operation USA has been offering to Russia? USA can still act in Syria I guess, but it's harder for them until they get to use Incirlik again.


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## Arya Stark (Jul 17, 2016)

Surprisingly Turkish media isn't covering the potential US influence yet. This would have shut down those who think coup was staged.



Rukia said:


> I heard that there were at least discussions.  Probably not a good idea.  It seems like if the government doesn't like you in Turkey, you are guilty until proven innocent and an automatic co-conspirator.  Makes me think the president really was behind the coup.



Erdogan rose to power because people were fed up with EU's stalling. General public don't care abou EU anymore, neither does Erdogan really.
Even considering the return of death penalty shows you how much they care.


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

Apparently Incirlik has returned back to normal! They arrested some Turkish officers and a military police, now it's operating as before.

Good, one drama less.



Arya Stark said:


> Erdogan rose to power because people were fed up with EU's stalling. General public don't care abou EU anymore, neither does Erdogan really.
> Even considering the return of death penalty shows you how much they care.



It was so pathetic when during the height of the immigration crisis European politicians and the Eurocrats asked themselves "how can we bargain with Turkey?" "Oh right, let's say we reopen the EU membership negotiations!"

Everyone and their dog knows EU will never let Turkey in. It would be more fair to just say it out right - but such honesty and directness is unheard of in Brussels.


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## S (Jul 17, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Apparently Incirlik has returned back to normal! They arrested some Turkish officers and a military police, now it's operating as before.
> 
> Good, one drama less.
> 
> ...


To be fair Erdogan did some questionable decisions out of frustation which is of course not acceptble but nonetheless what happend last few days doesnt justify this treason. More and more details coming out and it looks almost out of Hollywood movie.

The media released a video how Erdogan escaped the execution, 4 helicopters opened fire the hotel where Erdogan was making his vacation but luckily he left the house 15 minute's before the attack. To make it sure he is dead, 40 bordo bereliler(special forces) stormed the hotel. Now they are on the run, some of them escape to Greece to apply for asylum...lol what

edit. the guy on the middle is the mastermind of the whole coup.


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## Orochibuto (Jul 17, 2016)

S said:


> To be fair Erdogan did some questionable decisions out of frustation which is of course not acceptble but nonetheless what happend last few days doesnt justify this treason.



In my book when you restrict free speech whatever people do to stop you is fair game.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 17, 2016)

S said:


> edit. the guy on the middle is the mastermind of the whole coup.


Sadly, this is might be their last pictures too.

But the guy in the middle still has a look of defiance, kinda like he is saying "come and make my day".


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 17, 2016)

S said:


> To be fair Erdogan did some questionable decisions out of frustation which is of course not acceptble but nonetheless what happend last few days doesnt justify this treason. More and more details coming out and it looks almost out of Hollywood movie.
> 
> The media released a video how Erdogan escaped the execution, 4 helicopters opened fire the hotel where Erdogan was making his vacation but luckily he left the house 15 minute's before the attack. To make it sure he is dead, 40 bordo bereliler(special forces) stormed the hotel. Now they are on the run, some of them escape to Greece to apply for asylum...lol what
> 
> edit. the guy on the middle is the mastermind of the whole coup.



"Luckily" nah him not being killed was unlucky


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

Sun Jul 17, 2016 | 12:53 PM EDT
*At height of Turkish coup bid, rebel jets had Erdogan's plane in their sights*



Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan prays during a funeral service for victims of the thwarted coup in Istanbul at Fatih Mosque in Istanbul, Turkey, July 17, 2016.
REUTERS/ALKIS KONSTANTINIDIS




Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan waves to the crowd following a funeral service for a victim of the thwarted coup in Istanbul, Turkey, July 17, 2016.

By Humeyra Pamuk and Orhan Coskun | ANKARA/ISTANBUL
(Reuters) - At the height of the attempt to overthrow Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan, the rebel pilots of two F-16 fighter jets had Erdogan's plane in their sights. And yet he was able to fly on.

The Turkish leader was returning to Istanbul from a holiday near the coastal resort of Marmaris after a faction in the military launched the coup attempt on Friday night, sealing off a bridge across the Bosphorus, trying to capture Istanbul's main airport and sending tanks to parliament in Ankara.

"At least two F-16s harassed Erdogan's plane while it was in the air and en route to Istanbul. They locked their radars on his plane and on two other F-16s protecting him," a former military officer with knowledge of the events told Reuters.

"Why they didn't fire is a mystery," he said.

A successful overthrow of Erdogan, who has ruled the country of about 80 million people since 2003, could have sent Turkey spiraling into conflict and marked another seismic shift in the Middle East, five years after the Arab uprisings erupted and plunged its southern neighbor Syria into civil war.

A senior Turkish official confirmed to Reuters that Erdogan's business jet had been harassed while flying from the airport that serves Marmaris by two F-16s commandeered by the coup plotters but that he had managed to reach Istanbul safely.

A second senior official also said the presidential jet had been "in trouble in the air" but gave no details.

Erdogan said as the coup unfolded that the plotters had tried to attack him in the resort town of Marmaris and had bombed places he had been at shortly after he left. He "evaded death by minutes", the second official said.

Around 25 soldiers in helicopters descended on a hotel in Marmaris on ropes, shooting, just after Erdogan had left in an apparent attempt to seize him, broadcaster CNN Turk said.

Prime Minister Binali Yildirim had also been directly targeted in Istanbul during the coup bid and had narrowly escaped, the official said, without giving details.

Flight tracker websites showed a Gulfstream IV aircraft, a type of business jet owned by the Turkish government, take off from Dalaman airport, which is about an hour and a quarter's drive from Marmaris, at about 2240 GMT on Friday.

It later circled in what appeared to be a holding pattern just south of Istanbul, around the time when a Reuters witness in the airport was still hearing bursts of gunfire, before finally coming in to land.

Gunfire and explosions rocked both Istanbul and Ankara through Friday night, as the armed faction which tried to seize power strafed the headquarters of Turkish intelligence and parliament in the capital. At one point it ordered state television to read out a statement declaring a nationwide curfew.

But the attempt crumbled as forces loyal to Erdogan pushed the rebels back and as the Turkish leader, at one point appearing on broadcaster CNN Turk in a video call from a mobile phone, urged people to take to the streets to support him.

More than 290 people were killed in the violence, 104 of them coup supporters, the rest largely civilians and police officers.

The aerial aspect of the plot appears to have centered on the Akinci air base around 50 km (30 miles) northwest of Ankara, with at least 15 pilots involved under the orders of a rebel commander, according to the former military officer.

The head of the armed forces, Hulusi Akar, was held hostage at the base during the coup attempt but was eventually rescued. Jets from Akinci piloted by the rebels roared low over Istanbul and Ankara repeatedly during the chaos of Friday night, shattering windows and terrifying civilians with sonic booms.

Fighter jets taking off from another air base at Eskisehir, west of Ankara, were scrambled to bomb Akinci and try to stop the rebels. However, the rogue aircraft were able to keep flying through the night by refueling mid-air after a tanker plane was commandeered, the first senior official said.

The tanker aircraft was taken from the Incirlik air base in southern Turkey, which is used by the U.S.-led coalition to bomb Islamic State in Syria and Iraq. The commander of Incirlik was detained on Sunday for complicity, the official said.



MASTERMINDS

Three senior officials in Ankara said Akin Ozturk, head of the air force until 2015 and a member of High Military Council (YAS), the top body overseeing the armed forces, was one of the masterminds of the plot. He was among thousands of soldiers detained, pictured on Sunday in handcuffs wearing a striped polo shirt at Ankara police headquarters.

Ozturk was due to be retired this August at a meeting of the YAS, which convenes twice a year. According to his biography, still on the military's website, he was born in 1952.

The second mastermind was thought to be Muharrem Kose, a former legal adviser to the chief of military staff, the same three Ankara officials said. They described Kose as a follower of Fethullah Gulen, a U.S.-based cleric whose network Erdogan has blamed for carrying out the coup attempt.

Kose was removed from his post in March for misconduct but had not been discharged from the armed forces, one of the officials said. His whereabouts are currently unknown.

"There were serious preparations ongoing for a very long time. The two people in question seem to have been the brains behind the coup attempt," the official said, declining to be identified because the investigation is still continuing.

Erdogan and the government have long accused Gulen's followers of trying to create a "parallel structure" within the courts, police, armed forces and media with the aim of seizing power, a charge the cleric has repeatedly denied.



"NOT FULLY PREPARED"

Erdogan, his roots in Islamist politics, has always had a difficult relationship with the military, which long saw itself as the guardian of secularism in Turkey, carrying out three coups and forcing a fourth, Islamist-led government from power in the second half of the 20th century.

Coup plot trials saw hundreds of officers jailed while Erdogan was prime minister, as the government used the courts to clip the wings of the armed forces. The allegations were later discredited and convictions overturned, but the actions damaged morale and fueled resentment.

Yet the coup plotters appear to have overestimated the support they would find within the military ranks.

"It was outside the chain of command which was the biggest handicap for the coup plotters," said Sinan Ulgen, a visiting scholar at Carnegie Europe and a former Turkish diplomat.

"They had an insufficient portfolio of resources. They were grossly under-equipped to achieve their strategic objectives ... There was definitely quite a degree of incompetence compared to how coups were done here in the past."

At one point they tried to silence CNN Turk, forcing the evacuation of the studio. When it came back on air, anchorwoman Nevsin Mengu described the soldiers as young and with "only fear in their eyes and no sign of devotion or determination".

The former military officer said the coup plotters appeared to have launched their attempt prematurely because they realized they were under surveillance, something corroborated by other officials in Ankara.

"They weren't fully prepared. The plans were leaked, they found out they were being monitored and it all apparently forced them to move faster than planned," the ex-officer said.

They also underestimated Erdogan's ability to rally the crowds, his appeal for supporters to take to the streets bringing people out in Istanbul, Ankara and elsewhere even as tanks took to the streets and jets screamed overhead.

Sertac Koc, press adviser to the mayor of Kazan district where the Akinci base is located, said local residents started noticing the high number of jets taking off as events unfolded.

"When they saw jets hitting parliament in Ankara and people in Istanbul, they got organized among themselves and marched to the base to try and stop them," he told Reuters by phone.

"They tried to block traffic to the base by parking their vehicles, burning hay to block the jets' vision, and in the end they attempted to cut the power to the base," he said.

Seven people were killed when the rebel soldiers opened fire, Koc said, among the dozens of civilians killed across the country in one of Turkey's worst nights of bloodshed.



(Additional reporting by Tom Miles in Geneva, Paul Taylor in Brussels; Writing by Nick Tattersall; editing by David Stamp)

Reactions: Like 1


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 17, 2016)

Tinfoil idea here but has there been talks that this failed coup was just a diversion?


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> Tinfoil idea here but has there been talks that this failed coup was just a diversion?



Don't be afraid of the tinfoil. Think freely and think a lot of thoughts. Throw the bad ones away, keep the good ones.

That said, it's a very popular theory right now. It's possible.

Personally I believe it was a genuine attempt, but one Erdogan had been preparing for beforehand. It's not like this was a surprise. And their intelligence services (or those of some friendly country) might have found out in time.

Our president met Erdogan earlier this week and said he looked very worried about something.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 17, 2016)

I meant, that the army let the attack fail on purpose so that it would try again later. 


Is it just me or did others think of how the coup in Valkyrie was shot? As I followed the news and seeing contradictory reports combined with the faction of the military establishing a new government, Onkept picturing Tom Cruise at the head pushing this through.


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> I meant, that the army let the attack fail on purpose so that it would try again later.



Ah, I don't quite follow you there. Why would it do that? It's going to be much harder in the future, after the current purge.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 17, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Ah, I don't quite follow you there. Why would it do that? It's going to be much harder in the future, after the current purge.



I did say if that tinfoil theory was being thrown around. Don't say I didn't give warning.

Basically, since the coup failed epically, would the army have a decoy purge so that the attention will be turned elsewhere instead of a bigger rebellious faction within the army.

I'm just asking what ideas have been thrown around.


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> I did say if that tinfoil theory was being thrown around. Don't say I didn't give warning.



And I said it's not a bad thing to have wild theories.  I just didn't catch what you were after. 



Alwaysmind said:


> Basically, since the coup failed epically, would the army have a decoy purge so that the attention will be turned elsewhere instead of a bigger rebellious faction within the army.
> 
> I'm just asking what ideas have been thrown around.



Gotcha. 

Haven't seen that proposed.


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## hcheng02 (Jul 17, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Don't be afraid of the tinfoil. Think freely and think a lot of thoughts. Throw the bad ones away, keep the good ones.
> 
> That said, it's a very popular theory right now. It's possible.
> 
> ...



Are you saying Obama looked worried or Erdrogan?


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

hcheng02 said:


> Are you saying Obama looked worried or Erdrogan?



Obama? What... 

Oh you think I'm Americana. 

No, our president Niinistö said Erdogan looked worried about something when they met about a week ago.

Of course, he could have been worried about anything. Perhaps he had weak stomach.


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## hcheng02 (Jul 17, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Obama? What...
> 
> Oh you think I'm Americana.
> 
> ...



Well Erdrogan should be worried. He's still facing a war in Syria and a Kurdish insurrection at home. Purging the army might make it more loyal to him, but its bound to cause some disruption. Stalin's purges of the Soviet army left it so weak that it couldn't even win against Finland for a while.


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## Orochibuto (Jul 17, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> No, it wanted to be but there has been resistance.



If they had allowed it likely Turkey would not be an authoritarian state.

On Erdogan's first term he went on the complete opposite of now..... then went authoritarian.


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

hcheng02 said:


> Well Erdrogan should be worried. He's still facing a war in Syria and a Kurdish insurrection at home



Actually just a few days ago their PM said Turkey is looking to normalize its relations with Syria the way it has normalized its relations with Israel and Russia.

Cue to some displeased noises from Riadh.

Kurds are still a thing. I wonder if they are having a detente with their external enemies to get to concentrate on the Kurds in peace, or if this new peaceful approach will be extended to them too.



hcheng02 said:


> Purging the army might make it more loyal to him, but its bound to cause some disruption. Stalin's purges of the Soviet army left it so weak that it couldn't even win against Finland for a while.



Yeah their army was in bad bad shape thanks to Stalin's paranoia.

However, immediately after Winter War they did what they could to learn from it and kick the Red Army back into shape before the main confrontation, the one with the Germans.

Their later ultimate victory against us though was because of the simple question of critical mass - lots and lots of it.


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## hcheng02 (Jul 17, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Actually just a few days ago their PM said Turkey is looking to normalize its relations with Syria the way it has normalized its relations with Israel and Russia.
> 
> Cue to some displeased noises from Riadh.
> 
> Kurds are still a thing. I wonder if they are having a detente with their external enemies to get to concentrate on the Kurds in peace, or if this new peaceful approach will be extended to them too.



They might normalize with Assad, but what about ISIS? And I think that this peace is more to concentrate on the Kurds to set his house in order before trying again in Syria. Fact is that Turkey is still getting flooded with refugees as long as Syria is at war. 



> Yeah their army was in bad bad shape thanks to Stalin's paranoia.
> 
> However, immediately after Winter War they did what they could to learn from it and kick the Red Army back into shape before the main confrontation, the one with the Germans.
> 
> Their later ultimate victory against us though was because of the simple question of critical mass - lots and lots of it.



Yeah, and I don't think Turkey's military has the kind of critical mass factor at play in Syria.


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

hcheng02 said:


> They might normalize with Assad, but what about ISIS?



Erdogan never had his heart in fighting ISIS - he seems to have thought of them as the enemy of his enemy. But the escalation of terrorism by ISIS in Turkey might have made him see it differently.

That still doesn't say anything about what he might do about it.

But just preventing them from crossing the Turkey-Syria border would help a lot.



hcheng02 said:


> And I think that this peace is more to concentrate on the Kurds to set his house in order before trying again in Syria. Fact is that Turkey is still getting flooded with refugees as long as Syria is at war.



Kurds are the long term problem. They are about to outbreed the Turks, to say it bluntly.

Syria is about the stupid Saudis vs Iran / Sunnis vs Shiites conflict. Objectively it's not as crucial to Turkey's own domestic future, it's more of a geopolitical game the locals play (with outsider interference.)

Also, Turkey is trying to prevent the Kurds in the neighboring countries from getting freedom/power, and that's just what might happen in a decentralized Syria.

I don't know what kind of Syrian peace policy they have in mind though.



hcheng02 said:


> Yeah, and I don't think Turkey's military has the kind of critical mass factor at play in Syria.



The Turkish army is rather impressive though, certainly stronger than Assad's.

However, wars aren't just about beating someone else, they're also about gaining and keeping power. And that they couldn't do.

Turkey's original plan for Syria was to oust Assad and replace him with some pro-Riadh Muslim Brotherhood Sunni Islamist.

The plan B might just be to make Assad reasonably pro-Ankara instead.

Or then they still wish to partition Syria.


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## Zyrax (Jul 17, 2016)

>MB
>Pro Saudi
Wut


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## Amanda (Jul 17, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> >MB
> >Pro Saudi
> Wut



You know, for once in your NF life, when you notice someone making an error, you might actually offer some insight and provide better info, instead of just trying to stroke your ego with a "wut" or "what" or an image macro. Tell us about the skism between the Muslim Brotherhood and the House of Saud and the history behind, along with the current day implications. Contribute to the thread.

Fine, you got me. But you still know what I mean. The idea was to replace Assad with Sunni leadership and shift Syria from the Shia Crescent to the Sunni Crescent.

Oil pipelines were involved as well.

Let's see what becomes of those now... If Syria is ever rebuilt.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Nello (Jul 17, 2016)

Keep being you, Amanda


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## Orochibuto (Jul 18, 2016)

Alwaysmind said:


> I did say if that tinfoil theory was being thrown around. Don't say I didn't give warning.
> 
> Basically, since the coup failed epically, would the army have a decoy purge so that the attention will be turned elsewhere instead of a bigger rebellious faction within the army.
> 
> I'm just asking what ideas have been thrown around.



Well..... the "they had Erdogan's plane in shooting range, but just didnt shoot." sounds very suspicious to me.

I cant find any logical reason why they didnt do the 1 thing that would had guaranteed success.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Arya Stark (Jul 18, 2016)

I'm more and more leaning towards coup being "half" staged. He probably learned about the plan some time ago so he cut the high rankers out of picture and manipulated the guys into thinking they were going to be backed only to leave them all alone once they came out. Erdogan is a pretty smart guy.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="tr"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">ANNOUNCE: Get ready for a fight as we release 100k+ docs on <a href="">#Turkey</a>&#39;s political power structure. <a href="">#TurkeyCoup</a> <a href="">#Soon</a> <a href="">pic.twitter.com/dhJuWza4Es</a></p>&mdash; WikiLeaks (@wikileaks) <a href="">18 Temmuz 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


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## epyoncloud (Jul 18, 2016)

Putin must be behind this.


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## DonutKid (Jul 18, 2016)

Amanda said:


> You know, for once in your NF life, when you notice someone making an error, you might actually offer some insight and provide better info, instead of just trying to stroke your ego with a "wut" or "what" or an image macro. Tell us about the skism between the Muslim Brotherhood and the House of Saud and the history behind, along with the current day implications. Contribute to the thread.



You forgot his infamous and overused...

>Muh


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## John Wick (Jul 18, 2016)

Just heard on the news that they've evacuated the parliament

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-security-threat-ankara-erdogan-a7142546.html

Edit although this could because of a fist fight getting out of hand and not the coup....


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## Arya Stark (Jul 18, 2016)

it's not coup. coup leaders are being investigated now.


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## Shinobu (Jul 18, 2016)

Everytime I hear news from Turkey it gets worse and worse.

It's like you could count the days 'till full dictatorship...


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## John Wick (Jul 18, 2016)

well considering members of parliament are exempt from prosecution is there anything in place to stop one of them murdering every other politician and taking over?


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## Xion (Jul 18, 2016)

Shinobu said:


> Everytime I hear news from Turkey it gets worse and worse.
> 
> It's like you could count the days 'till full dictatorship...



The saddest part of all is that mainstream Turks *rallied *behind this dictator.

The military's all like "You know how we have defended the secular constitution all those times you had crazy Islamists starting to get their tendrils all up in everything..." and the populace was just not having it.

They *like* being subjugated. 

It's especially sad when the subjugator is a Gollum-esque, emasculated, overly sensitive ninnypoopkins who probably couldn't run a mile to save his life.

Putin. That's a subjugator. Strong. Stalwart. Ruthless. Grapples with crocodiles and armwrestles Chechen warlords.

But...but...

That call to prayer. All that chattel. That state-controlled media. Those jobs producing damask rugs and local fruit!

He's done so much to reinvigorate the Turkish economy! To raise the standard of living of the average Turk who can now pray to Allah wherever he wants, beat his wife whenever he feels like, and lash out at foreign powers and "dirty" Kurds whenever a good olde scapegoat is needed.

Turkey, now, is the Land of Oz.

It really is.

Once a rising secular star amongst a sea of theocratic hellholes -- on its way to join Europe and contribute to human understanding as it had in its storied and glorious past, it is now on the path to replacing Syria (sometime in the 2020s) as the number one war-ravaged country in the world! Come for the kebabs, stay because Europe isn't accepting anymore refugees!

Erdogan is a dictator without the image of Putin, without the shrewdness of Gaddafi and without the cunning of Assad.

Turkey had so much promise before this man and it pains me like nothing else to see Turks, by and large, cowed by a state propaganda machine and echo chamber of their own creation. There is no free media left. The judiciary has been purged and controlled. The military has been emasculated. The constitution is being changed. The economy is in shambles and token gestures of reciprocation to Russia and Syria are just gesticulations. Kurds are second-class citizens and the war between them and the state is just beginning. Terrorist attacks are increasing dramatically.

Back when Libya was fresh and popping, I thought Syria was next. Five years later and it's still raging despite the intervention of almost every major world power.

Turkey's only chance was to rid itself of Erdogan. Now, ironically, this self-styled neo-Ottoman emperor will be the greatest catastrophe Anatolia has ever experienced. The Sack of Constantinople will be a mere footnote by the time he is through.


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## hcheng02 (Jul 18, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Erdogan never had his heart in fighting ISIS - he seems to have thought of them as the enemy of his enemy. But the escalation of terrorism by ISIS in Turkey might have made him see it differently.
> 
> That still doesn't say anything about what he might do about it.
> 
> But just preventing them from crossing the Turkey-Syria border would help a lot.



Erdrogan has to deal with ISIS if they are launching attacks on Turkish citizens. I can't see how he can cast a blind eye if ISIS keeps bragging about killing Turks. Hopefully he does do something about border controls though.



> Kurds are the long term problem. They are about to outbreed the Turks, to say it bluntly.
> 
> Syria is about the stupid Saudis vs Iran / Sunnis vs Shiites conflict. Objectively it's not as crucial to Turkey's own domestic future, it's more of a geopolitical game the locals play (with outsider interference.)
> 
> ...



I would imagine being flooded by millions of refugees would be crucial to Turkey's domestic future at least for the short term. 



> The Turkish army is rather impressive though, certainly stronger than Assad's.
> 
> However, wars aren't just about beating someone else, they're also about gaining and keeping power. And that they couldn't do.
> 
> ...



The thing is that the Kurds are currently the most effective anti-ISIS group and has at least lukewarm support from the USA. Partitioning Syria would mean that Kurdish enclaves become a proto-Kurdish state which would be a bigger problem for Turkey.


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## Alwaysmind (Jul 18, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Obama? What...
> 
> Oh you think I'm Americana.
> 
> ...






With a smile like that, I'd look worried too.


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## Shinobu (Jul 19, 2016)

Xion said:


> The saddest part of all is that mainstream Turks *rallied *behind this dictator.
> 
> The military's all like "You know how we have defended the secular constitution all those times you had crazy Islamists starting to get their tendrils all up in everything..." and the populace was just not having it.
> 
> They *like* being subjugated.




ikr

Whoever is going to criticize Erdogan or his party now or in the future will be marked as one of the coup and gets nothing less than the death penalty with the people's legitimation.


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## epyoncloud (Jul 20, 2016)

yet the US still backs this guy.


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## Zyrax (Jul 20, 2016)

Xion said:


> Putin. That's a subjugator. Strong. Stalwart. Ruthless. Grapples with crocodiles and armwrestles Chechen warlords.


>people still think Putin isn't a massive wimp

Go back to your bodybuilding forums or some shit.


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## Punished Pathos (Jul 20, 2016)

epyoncloud said:


> yet the US still backs this guy.



Duh, The US backs Dictators but then they kill them when they won't play ball.


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## John Wick (Jul 20, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> >people still think Putin isn't a massive wimp
> 
> Go back to your bodybuilding forums or some shit.



He might be but the image he portrays in the media is one of that of a BAMF. I'd rather meet Obama down a dark alley than Putin. 

The man tranqs tigers (Allegedly) like a fearless mofo and goes swimming in freezing serbian rivers and flys fighter jets. Then there was the fact he was in the KGB so can probably give you a polonium cocktail for free.


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## S (Jul 20, 2016)

Punished Pathos said:


> Duh, The US backs Dictators but then they kill them when they won't play ball.


I highly doubt it, Turkey doesnt have oil so Turkey is safe from american freedom.


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## John Wick (Jul 20, 2016)

S said:


> I highly doubt it, Turkey doesnt have oil so Turkey is safe from american freedom.



That and you're earning a pretty penny from military sales f-35's aren't cheap.

Nor are sidewinders amraams jdams and everything else that they buy! pretty sure Turkey is one of the biggest buyers of US military equipment.


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## Son of Goku (Jul 20, 2016)

Amanda said:


> You know, for once in your NF life, when you notice someone making an error, you might actually offer some insight and provide better info, instead of just trying to stroke your ego with a "wut" or "what" or an image macro. Tell us about the skism between the Muslim Brotherhood and the House of Saud and the history behind, along with the current day implications. Contribute to the thread.
> 
> Fine, you got me. But you still know what I mean. The idea was to replace Assad with Sunni leadership and shift Syria from the Shia Crescent to the Sunni Crescent.


+rep 



> Oil pipelines were involved as well.
> 
> Let's see what becomes of those now... If Syria is ever rebuilt.



Gas pipelines actually (Iran vs. Qatar).


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## Son of Goku (Jul 20, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> >people still think Putin isn't a massive wimp


Yup, most people think that. Any reasons they shouldn't?


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## John Wick (Jul 20, 2016)

Son of Goku said:


> Yup, most people think that. Any reasons they shouldn't?


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## Son of Goku (Jul 20, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> >MB
> >Pro Saudi
> Wut



More pro-Saudi than Assad will ever be.

Also:


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## Deleted member 198194 (Jul 20, 2016)

Amanda said:


> Obama? What...
> 
> Oh you think I'm Americana.
> 
> ...


Erdogan is always worried, and for good reason.  The world is a scary place.  Civil tensions across the world.  Nuclear weaponry abound.  Anti-Erdogan poems and stand up comedy acts continue to terrorize his good name in so-called progressive countries.  Kurds remain disgruntled despite being treated far better than they deserve.  Kurdish villages outside of Turkey's borders that don't like Turkey continue to be unsacked and their civilians continue to be unslaughtered.  The Jewish western media continues to lie to the world that ISIS is a bigger threat than the PKK.  Did you know that, chances are, someone is criticizing Erdogan right now and getting away with it? Like, they probably won't even be SWATed and jailed let alone hanged for heresy. 

Erdogan knows all this, he's woke, and a sweat drop of distinguished wisdom constantly remains perched on the left side of his forehead to reflect this.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 2


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## Xion (Jul 20, 2016)

Shinobu said:


> ikr
> 
> Whoever is going to criticize Erdogan or his party now or in the future will be marked as one of the coup and gets nothing less than the death penalty with the people's legitimation.



What's kind of funny is that this is like the fifth day of massive pro-Erdogan, anti-coup protests in the streets of major Turkish cities, but the minute there's the slightest anti-Erdogan/anti-AKP or pro-LGBT gathering, they're immediately met by riot police and mass arrests. Sometimes pro-AKP groups come and beat the shit out of the other groups. It's almost always not punished, but it's tough to know with ZERO free or critical media left in Turkey.

I used to read Hurriyet (before it was all shilly) and Zaman (before it was purged) and now all the news out of Turkey is quite literally propaganda.



Zyrax Pasha said:


> >people still think Putin isn't a massive wimp
> 
> Go back to your bodybuilding forums or some shit.



I'm reflecting a meme about Putin's image which he most likely enjoys seeing reinforced.

Could be true and I know he has degrees in judo or something, but Erdogan is like the pencil pusher who got way too much power for almost incomprehensible reasons.

I'd be curious as to your opinion on the Sultan. Be careful though, if he doesn't like what you say you might find yourself before a magistrate.


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## Amanda (Jul 21, 2016)

Son of Goku said:


> Gas pipelines actually (Iran vs. Qatar).




Details. (Don't mind the devil.)



Son of Goku said:


> Yup, most people think that. Any reasons they shouldn't?



He didn't declare war on Turkey when they downed one of his jet?

He didn't attack the American soldiers operating on Syrian soil without Syria's permission?

He isn't giving the ultra-nationalist loonies in East Ukraine everything they want?

He doesn't kill bitches and shoot missiles at everyone who dishonors him?

Idk what a wimp is these days.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Son of Goku (Jul 21, 2016)

You can stop eating, the projector is broken.


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## Amanda (Jul 21, 2016)

On topic*: 

Deutsche Welle says Turks are closing down their social media accounts because they're afraid of consequences for their posts. In what kind of scale is this happening?

*I probably should rename this the big Turkey thread or something, the follow-up event seems to go on for quite a while.


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## Deleted member 235437 (Jul 21, 2016)

Amanda said:


> On topic*:
> 
> Deutsche Welle says Turks are closing down their social media accounts because they're afraid of consequences for their posts. In what kind of scale is this happening?
> 
> *I probably should rename this the big Turkey thread or something, the follow-up event seems to go on for quite a while.



Is this the "democracy" that Turks supposedly took back


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## Amanda (Jul 21, 2016)

Khaleesi said:


> Is this the "democracy" that Turks supposedly took back



Well if I recall it right and if I understood him correctly, Erodogan is chiefly concerned with protecting the majority from the minority.

In this sense, if the majority wants to use their power to silence the minority, then their version of democracy has happened...

Of course, Erdogan's majority isn't that absolute. The people who probably would want to speak out against him but are afraid of the purge are numerous too.

Btw, what is the latest number? I last heard 50 000 have been fired, dismissed, had their license revoked or have been arrested.


Oh and Turkey is suspending the European Convention of Human Rights as part of the state of emergency.


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## Zyrax (Jul 22, 2016)

Son of Goku said:


> Yup, most people think that. Any reasons they shouldn't?


The Donbass, He chickened out of sending troops to it when it was winnable, Igor Stelkov called him out on it


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## Amanda (Jul 22, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> The Donbass, He chickened out of sending troops to it when it was winnable, Igor Stelkov called him out on it



Everyone makes mistakes. Especially in a time like that when things are changing rapidly and every move you make could have tremendous unexpected and unwanted consequences. Putin has whole lot more to worry about than just the borders of Donbass.

It's easy to criticize the people in responsibility afterwards, of course.

Personally, I'm pretty pleased with his cautious take on things. We have enough hot heads and self-righteous idealists around.

Similarly, people also criticized him for not taking stronger action against Turkey after they "insulted" Russia by shooting down the jet. And now they're mocking Erdogan for apologizing for it.

But the reality is that both won by not thinking of their hurt egos and by instead thinking of the objective good of their countries and their region. It would be advantageous for both peoples to have peace in the Black Sea and Caucasus region, and to co-operate about ISIS.

That is what matters, not being macho.


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## Son of Goku (Jul 22, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> The Donbass, He chickened out of sending troops to it when it was winnable, Igor Stelkov called him out on it


 
k 

That's not "massively wimpy" though, but smart. He only really cared for Crimea and Sevastopol and so did the Russians.


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## Zyrax (Jul 23, 2016)

So now tne Purge has begun


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## Son of Goku (Jul 23, 2016)

Zyrax Pasha said:


> So now tne Purge has begun


Begun? Don't you mean almost over?


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## Xion (Jul 24, 2016)

Orochibuto said:


> Well..... the "they had Erdogan's plane in shooting range, but just didnt shoot." sounds very suspicious to me.
> 
> I cant find any logical reason why they didnt do the 1 thing that would had guaranteed success.



This. I read that they had him in their sights as well.

Remember the question about if you could go back in time to kill baby Hitler would you do it?

This is the Turkish version of that.

And yes, while I did just Godwin the thread, .


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## Orochibuto (Jul 24, 2016)

Xion said:


> This. I read that they had him in their sights as well.
> 
> Remember the question about if you could go back in time to kill baby Hitler would you do it?
> 
> ...



Maybe the pilots or the particular military commanders in charge of those pilots, got bribed or offered a very sweet deal in exchange for not firing.

Assuming Erodgan had communications equipment in his plane, he or a representative might had contacted the pilots and/or commander (s) to talk them out of doing it.

Kinda like how in inglorious bastards the german commander outright disobeyed his orders in exchange of full amnesty and a wealthy life.


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## Xion (Jul 26, 2016)

Orochibuto said:


> Maybe the pilots or the particular military commanders in charge of those pilots, got bribed or offered a very sweet deal in exchange for not firing.
> 
> Assuming Erodgan had communications equipment in his plane, he or a representative might had contacted the pilots and/or commander (s) to talk them out of doing it.
> 
> Kinda like how in inglorious bastards the german commander outright disobeyed his orders in exchange of full amnesty and a wealthy life.



My initial guess is that it was simply too much to ask of the coup forces.

Shooting down the plane makes it real. That requires courage.

Erdogan's Turkey is rich in many things, but courage and backbone are in short supply.

That or it was a conspiracy and Erdogan was never in any real danger.

I don't think there were secret offers. Real life, especially in a second-world nation, is fairly banal and the technology and lines of communication needed to ensure the right fighter pilots are contacted through the chain of command quickly via presidential-supported forces is likely not well established. It's a lot to ask even of advanced Western nations, let alone the Land of Oz.


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## Orochibuto (Jul 26, 2016)

Xion said:


> My initial guess is that it was simply too much to ask of the coup forces.
> 
> Shooting down the plane makes it real. That requires courage.
> 
> ...



Erdogan is an incipient dictator. I dont think lack of courage was a thing.

With a guy like him, even attempting the coup is life imprisonment and possibly horrible torture and death.

Is not like Erdogan will say "well they didnt killed me so I guess I will go easy on them."

Once you initiate the coup you either win or you are fucked unless you can flee the country.

So I dont think guts was a thing, you got that if you already went that far.


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## Xion (Jul 26, 2016)

Orochibuto said:


> Erdogan is an incipient dictator. I dont think lack of courage was a thing.
> 
> With a guy like him, even attempting the coup is life imprisonment and possibly horrible torture and death.
> 
> ...



If I were flying the jet with weapons locked on his plane, that would be my thinking too.

So either something is fishy regarding that story or they were following the chain of command and did not get a clear order to fire. I suspect it is a combination of the two. Soldiers are usually pretty obedient, especially in a fairly notable military like the Turkish Air Force.

Although Coup 101 tells us the first thing to ALWAYS do is to secure the current leadership ASAP as holding them pretty much determines if the coup will be successful.


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