# Shueisha asks to end "unjust copies" on the internet



## Ukoku (Apr 15, 2010)

> Translation credits to cmertb
> 
> To all our readers
> There are now many people unjustly posting copies of manga on the internet. These unjust copies are inconsistent with mangakas' feelings. They are also distorting the authors' intentions of "I want the work to be read this way". The actions of posting these unjust copies on the net, into which the mangakas have poured their hearts, are not only hurting mangakas in real life but are also against the law, even if done in a light-hearted manner. Every time we discover such "unjust copies", we talk to the mangaka and consider every possible countermeasure. But the number of inconsiderate people is great, and at present we cannot deal with all of them. We have a request for all our readers. The unjust internet copies are deeply hurting the manga culture, mangakas' rights, and even mangakas' souls. Please understand once again that all of that is against the law. Also, the mangakas and Shueisha will severely deal with any unjust copies found on the internet. We ask that our readers please continue to support us.
> ...


From MangaHelpers

Also,  has removed all of their scans.


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## Ennoea (Apr 15, 2010)

I don't see what SJ have to whine about, circulation numbers are down because they fill their magazine with junk. The only way international fans get to know about these series is through internet scans. If they really believe it affects sales then they're delusional.


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## hehey (Apr 15, 2010)

Ennoea said:


> I don't see what SJ have to whine about, circulation numbers are down because they fill their magazine with junk. The only way international fans get to know about these series is through internet scans. If they really believe it affects sales then they're delusional.


eh, i dunno, international people could always import wsj.


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## Waveblade (Apr 15, 2010)

International fans are not the only ones that use the raws, some of the Japanese fans do too. Which could relate to dropping sales.

OTOH


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## Blinky (Apr 15, 2010)

I live in Ireland . There isn't exactly a "manga culture " here so it's only really through scans I get to read all of these sreies . 

But I see where they're coming from . It is stealing .


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## Ennoea (Apr 15, 2010)

Sales haven't dropped as much as SJ want you to believe, volume sales numbers still are high.



> But I see where they're coming from . It is stealing .



More like sharing really.


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## Blinky (Apr 15, 2010)

So is there a chance this will have an affect on scans or will it be like musicians asking people not to download music as stated in that thread ?


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## Proxy (Apr 15, 2010)

Raw Paradise gave in first and quickly at that.


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## illmatic (Apr 15, 2010)

Weekly Shounen Jump continues to rise while other magazines sales fall. I don't see why their making a big deal out of online scans.


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## ~Greed~ (Apr 15, 2010)

Well this sucks. Now where are we going to get raws? RP completely getting rid of all their scans can't be a good sign.


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## hehey (Apr 15, 2010)

illmatic said:


> Weekly Shounen Jump continues to rise while other magazines sales fall. I don't see why their making a big deal out of online scans. Its not the same as with the music industry.


well, they never know when the recession will come knocking at their doors... planning ahead.


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## Ennoea (Apr 15, 2010)

Media sales tend to rise in recessions. Films, mangas and books have all enjoyed from the effects of the recession.


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## Waveblade (Apr 15, 2010)

Ennoea said:


> Media sales tend to rise in recessions. Films, mangas and books have all enjoyed from the effects of the recession.



I wonder why that happens?


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## Special Agent Sugar (Apr 15, 2010)

hehey said:


> eh, i dunno, international people could always import wsj.



your right, they could, but not all international people can read & understand japanese.


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## Graham Aker (Apr 15, 2010)

I'd support them if they sell WSJ in my country... and they fucking don't.


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## Nightwish (Apr 15, 2010)

The future ain't looking to bright right now, if places like RP are removing their scans.


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## hehey (Apr 15, 2010)

doom and gloom on the horizon, just imagine, if One Piece chapters stopped coming itn after this rescent chapter, hhehehe, itd be anarchy.


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## TalikX (Apr 15, 2010)

Aren't raw paradise a bunch of ^ (not the meaning of the word "respect".) anyway? Putting watermarks on their raws? Or is that someone else.


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## Blinky (Apr 15, 2010)

I think Raw Paradise use massive watermarks too .


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## Nightwish (Apr 15, 2010)

RP does use "massive" watermarks, sometimes in the middle of the damn pages


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## Special Agent Sugar (Apr 15, 2010)

i'm pretty sure another site/provider will pop up pretty fast since RP wants to fucking assholes & take all of their scans down, so i'm not too worried.


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## Lightysnake (Apr 15, 2010)

Wait, RP is gone? Any chance of this affecting things wide scale?


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## Gnome (Apr 15, 2010)

RP are usually the earliest but the worst quality, no loss imo. But if it leads to more sites closing down


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## Lightysnake (Apr 15, 2010)

I'm confused on something...was RP the only place to get some RAWs?


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## Special Agent Sugar (Apr 15, 2010)

Lightysnake said:


> Wait, RP is gone? Any chance of this affecting things wide scale?



the site its self is not gone, but they have taken down all of their scans.


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## Lightysnake (Apr 15, 2010)

So, pretty much don't worry, things will still come out, hm?


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## illmatic (Apr 15, 2010)

Lightysnake said:


> So, pretty much don't worry, things will still come out, hm?



Eventually.


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## Frostman (Apr 15, 2010)

I was shocked to see nothing on the RP site, this explains it. I checked their site new raws a lot out of habit. can i will need to find my raws some where else.


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## Special Agent Sugar (Apr 15, 2010)

Lightysnake said:


> So, pretty much don't worry, things will still come out, hm?



yeah, but it might take a little bit longer, so that's really the the big thing that sucks about this whole shitty situation.


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## Lightysnake (Apr 15, 2010)

Maybe a bit longer then. Meh, I can live with that. I'm sure the scanners know where things can be found anyways


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## Waveblade (Apr 15, 2010)

But an interesting thing I found is this Japanese chapter scan site used the links from raw-paradise.


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## Lightysnake (Apr 15, 2010)

Hmm...how'll this affect series like Negima or Rosario?


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## evil_kenshin (Apr 15, 2010)

Lightysnake said:


> Hmm...how'll this affect series like Negima or Rosario?



probably delay it about a week or two from normal release.


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## Lightysnake (Apr 15, 2010)

Oh. Hardly that terrible


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## Waveblade (Apr 15, 2010)

Well Negima is published by Kodansha so it's hard to say about that. But I guess it may take longer to get raws if the providers do a pre-emptive shutdown like raw-paradise.

Best case scenario I feel is that we no longer get early scans but receive them after the actual issue is released publicly. Because as it was we were getting raws of a chapter almost a week before it is actually released.


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## Lightysnake (Apr 15, 2010)

That assumes other providers shut down. God knows why RP took this way out


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## evil_kenshin (Apr 15, 2010)

Lightysnake said:


> That assumes other providers shut down. God knows why RP took this way out



RP was always the earliest release (before WSJ even hit the shelves), even if others continue there will be delays because of this (so rather than having raws before WSJ/other is released we will have to wait the actually thing is published then the translation happens from there).


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## Lightysnake (Apr 15, 2010)

Yeah, true. But it's not as if they were actually doing the scanning


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## Lightysnake (Apr 15, 2010)

That'd make more sense. Well, worst case scenario is we have a short delay


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## evil_kenshin (Apr 15, 2010)

Lightysnake said:


> Yeah, true. But it's not as if they were actually doing the scanning



I know, but we require the raw before there can be a translation/scan 

and if the raw has to wait to the publication then that means the translation will be delayed too


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## Lightysnake (Apr 16, 2010)

Eh, perhaps. However, as I said, it's not like RP actually did any scanning, so it seems the scanners can just post it elsewhere, letting us still get 'em


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## Lightysnake (Apr 16, 2010)

Only reason I'm a mite worried is some scans I followed like Rosario to Vampire and Negima tended to credit RP as their RAW provider...and then there's Vagabond and Blade of the Immortal..


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## Judge Fudge (Apr 16, 2010)

They didn't get vanned, receive a takedown or got somehow threatened. The admin just chickened out after seeing the SJ 2010-20 editorial.


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## Mook Mook the Bushman (Apr 16, 2010)

nothing is going to happen. Maybe if I could no longer find tv shows, ppvs, movies, music, and comics online for free I would take this a little more seriously, but well, its still pretty easy to get all that shit. We have heard all of this before

to prove my point here is a modified version of the article in the op



> Translation credits to cmertb
> 
> To all our customers
> There are now many people unjustly posting copies of songs on the internet. These unjust copies are inconsistent with artists' feelings. They are also distorting the artists' intentions of "I want the work to be heard this way". The actions of posting these unjust copies on the net, into which the artists have poured their hearts, are not only hurting artists in real life but are also against the law, even if done in a light-hearted manner. Every time we discover such "unjust copies", we talk to the artist and consider every possible countermeasure. But the number of inconsiderate people is great, and at present we cannot deal with all of them. We have a request for all our customers.The unjust internet copies are deeply hurting the music culture, artists' rights, and even artists' souls. Please understand once again that all of that is against the law. Also, the artists and record label will severely deal with any unjust copies found on the internet. We ask that our readers please continue to support us.
> ...


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## Lightysnake (Apr 16, 2010)

ChocolateBar999 said:


> They didn't get vanned, receive a takedown or got somehow threatened. The admin just chickened out after seeing the SJ 2010-20 editorial.



Aren't they...hosted in France? I mean, that is SERIOUSLY lame


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## Just Blaze (Apr 16, 2010)

> Translation credits to cmertb
> 
> To all our readers
> There are now many people unjustly posting copies of manga on the internet. These unjust copies are inconsistent with mangakas' feelings. They are also distorting the authors' intentions of "I want the work to be read this way". The actions of posting these unjust copies on the net, into which the mangakas have poured their hearts, are not only hurting mangakas in real life but are also against the law, even if done in a light-hearted manner. Every time we discover such "unjust copies", we talk to the mangaka and consider every possible countermeasure. But the number of inconsiderate people is great, and at present we cannot deal with all of them. We have a request for all our readers. The unjust internet copies are deeply hurting the manga culture, mangakas' rights, and even mangakas' *souls*. Please understand once again that all of that is against the law. Also, the mangakas and Shueisha will severely deal with any unjust copies found on the internet. We ask that our readers please continue to support us.
> ...



That's hilarious.


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## Blinky (Apr 16, 2010)

They put THE HEART into their manga


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## Lightysnake (Apr 16, 2010)

You hurt their SOULS


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## iamthewalrus (Apr 16, 2010)

This scared me a tad since there are many jump mangas ive yet to read.

but I think this might be an overreaction.


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## blue berry (Apr 16, 2010)

well, shit just hit the fan. I swear I saw this coming after animation companies startring cracking down on Youtube. 

From what I can see, if they take this to another level, they'll start copyright infringing claims left right and centre. Which, I reckon would at least get all that Naruto chapter crap off Youtube. 

But then Viz and all those eng-lang companies might even follow suit and start requesting to take down translated mangas - and you might be only be able to view them via their offical website.

I hope it doesn't go national - the nearest bookstore with manga is almost 4 hours away and they don't do online ordering  

Oh well. 

There's always 2ch instead of RP now.


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## zuul (Apr 16, 2010)

I don't really feel like a stealing bitch. When I like an online manga, I end up buying it, if it's published where I live of course.

Besides there are a lot of manga published in France so I wouldn't have any excuse.


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## Bleach (Apr 16, 2010)

So no more raws for us ? Is this leading to the end of internet scans as well?

Man thats gay :/.


People are greedy. When they are making enough money as it is, they want to make the max amount they can :/. This is a bad move for them TBH.


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## dream (Apr 16, 2010)

Bleach -_-

No this is not the end of raws and scans.


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## T.D.A (Apr 16, 2010)

oh well, can't blame them.


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## Audible Phonetics (Apr 16, 2010)

IT will slow down how fast we get chapters though.  Places like Raw Paradise provided the most reliable source for scans.  Another will pop up though.  I am just surprised for being as big as they are, they just rolled over.


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## Hachidaime (Apr 16, 2010)

Ennoea said:


> Sales haven't dropped as much as SJ want you to believe, volume sales numbers still are high.
> 
> 
> 
> More like sharing really.



No its stealing, when you're distributing someones art without consent you're damaging the artist


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## dream (Apr 16, 2010)

So Hachidaime...would I be wrong in assuming that you read these scans?


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## T.D.A (Apr 16, 2010)

people also make money out of scans.


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## dream (Apr 16, 2010)

Were you thinking of Tazmo?


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## Audible Phonetics (Apr 16, 2010)

As brought out before, most western civilizations, which most people in this forum reside, are not Manga cultures.  So the only way an "International" audience can even read them is from the scans that are provided over the internet which is a vast media outlet.  I am not sure how this "hurts" the mangaka's soul.  I could understand if people were profiting of of their works.  But the majority of the work being done to scan and translate these things are all done for free.  The monetary donations asked by some, is to just fund the work and service that we get for free.  Either way this will slow everything done dramatically.


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## dream (Apr 16, 2010)

Unrequited Silence said:


> As brought out before, most western civilizations, which most people in this forum reside, are not Manga cultures.  So the only way an "International" audience can even read them is from the scans that are provided over the internet which is a vast media outlet.  I am not sure how this "hurts" the mangaka's soul.  I could understand if people were profiting of of their works.  But the majority of the work being done to scan and translate these things are all done for free.  The monetary donations asked by some, is to just fund the work and service that we get for free.  Either way this will slow everything done dramatically.



THIS.  A thousand times over.


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## Rekar (Apr 16, 2010)

*Stop scanning manga right now! CRIMINAL SCUM!*

there here > MangaHelpers

​


			
				MH said:
			
		

> Translation credits to cmertb
> 
> To all our readers
> There are now many people unjustly posting copies of manga on the internet. These unjust copies are inconsistent with mangakas' feelings. They are also distorting the authors' intentions of "I want the work to be read this way". The actions of posting these unjust copies on the net, into which the mangakas have poured their *hearts*, are not only hurting mangakas in real life but are also against the law, even if done in a light-hearted manner. Every time we discover such "unjust copies", we talk to the mangaka and consider every possible countermeasure. But the number of inconsiderate people is great, and at present we cannot deal with all of them. We have a request for all our readers. The unjust internet copies are deeply hurting the manga culture, mangakas' rights, and even mangakas' souls. Please understand once again that all of that is against the law. Also, the mangakas and Shueisha will severely deal with any unjust copies found on the internet. We ask that our readers please continue to support us.
> ...



inb4kubo

tl;dr shueisha's butthurt.

this won't affect you guys though, so no worries, but i dunno about other less popular manga, worst case scenario the scan will be delayed some days.

you can move this to a more appropriate board if this isn't library material

also raw-paradise is getting closed, no more abominable raws with 500% luminance  and hideous watermarks


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## uchihasurvivor (Apr 16, 2010)

It's more like it hurts the mangaka pockets rather than souls. Damn that terrible news, hope people don't take that seriously and upload anyway


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## Esponer (Apr 16, 2010)

Ch.268

It's good to see some small successes for morality and the law, in the form of Raw Paradise stopping their illegal actions.


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## Clay Man Gumby (Apr 16, 2010)

Criminal scum.


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## Clay Man Gumby (Apr 16, 2010)

All though I do think I remember hearing something about Kubo Tite being pissed about people stealing his work.


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## Vanity (Apr 16, 2010)

I can understand how it would bother them but at the same time it does also actually help them. I ended up buying a lot of manga that I first discovered this way.

I buy the manga when it actually comes out over here....sometimes that isn't for years later and people just want to know the story so we don't get spoiled by other fans who read it before us this way.

If I only bought the copies and never read anything online I wouldn't really be able to discuss stuff with other fans without getting spoiled in most cases. It's kind of sad sometimes but it's how it is.



Clay Man Gumby said:


> All though I do think I remember hearing something about Kubo Tite being pissed about people stealing his work.



I wonder if that was that guy who's the son of Gene Simmons or whatever.

______

Oh and I hope they realize that most of the people scanning the stuff are actually in Japan.


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## Arya Stark (Apr 16, 2010)

I'm reading it online because Shonen Jump doesn't realise it in my country.


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## Arya Stark (Apr 16, 2010)

I'm reading it online because Shonen Jump doesn't realise it in my country. 

It's really bad news to me


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## Bleach (Apr 16, 2010)

Dai Dreamer said:


> Bleach -_-
> 
> No this is not the end of raws and scans.



Dai -.-

You obviously don't fully understand what this could lead to .


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## dream (Apr 16, 2010)

It leads to scans being better hidden.


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## Danchou (Apr 16, 2010)

I already found it rather stupid for raw-paradise to just put their site and raws out in the open like that. It's a shame if this means we'll be getting manga even later.


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## Vanity (Apr 16, 2010)

How much do these guys make already anyway?

Just curious. I'm assuming that all the big name manga artists are really rich.


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## Achilles (Apr 16, 2010)

Funny, if it wasn't for manga scanners I wouldn't even know about most of the manga I buy.


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## Vanity (Apr 16, 2010)

ulius said:


> Funny, if it wasn't for manga scanners I wouldn't even know about most of the manga I buy.



I honestly wonder how they don't realize this.

It's true that in other cases the scanning of things is very bad....but with this it's really a benefit to them at the same time. It's like their stuff is being promoted and sure they aren't making money off of that part and although some people don't end up buying it a lot of people do end up spending money on something legal related to it eventually.


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## Waveblade (Apr 16, 2010)

Danchou said:


> I already found it rather stupid for raw-paradise to just put their site and raws out in the open like that. It's a shame if this means we'll be getting manga even later.



And the giant watermarks didn't help I guess.


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## Audible Phonetics (Apr 16, 2010)

It def. does mean getting it later. I'd say 75% of the scans we use come from Raw Paradise.


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## Vanity (Apr 16, 2010)

Clay Man Gumby said:


> Nick Simmons just got his revenge against the people who were laughing at him.



How so?

He shouldn't have done what he did though.....he actually copied the Bleach manga and was selling it as his own original work.  Now when you do something like that you should KNOW that it's wrong.


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## Clay Man Gumby (Apr 16, 2010)

Maybe I should hav put  at the end of my post.


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## uchihasurvivor (Apr 16, 2010)

The watermark was a stupid thing to do given it was illegal distribution. Sad day for the the international manga community.


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## Krombacher (Apr 16, 2010)

When they start relasing their goddamn magazine in germany I will start buying it

^ (not the meaning of the word "respect".).


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## Ceria (Apr 16, 2010)

sorry, but the sj that's sold in america blows, and is years behind canon. they have inoue calling ichigo by his first name, something she's never done... 

instant fail. 

I only have interest in naruto bleach (mainly for the lulz) and bakuman, i don't know or care about the rest.


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## Safer Saviour (Apr 16, 2010)

Until the beginning of this year One Piece's official English release was _eight years_ behind the Japanese. Damn right I'm going to read it online. However, even though I don't like Viz's translation half the time ("Zolo" will never stop annoying me), I still buy the English release.

Naruto? Erm... I have no plans to buy Shippuuden xDD;;


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## ~rocka (Apr 16, 2010)

Funny thing is, these whiners at MH probably download alot of stuff like movies and cd's from the internet too. Please dont come here and try to call us on our morale when there's too much shit going on for bullshit like this.

In every industry you have fraud of any kind, its a sad fact but what are you gonna do against it? 

Its a result of the way we live / the way its distributed.


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## MminatoO (Apr 16, 2010)

People that are reading the scans are most of them foreigners. How am I supposed to read popular japanese manga when are only published in Japan? Or I am supposed to wait for like 6 months to get a translated volume? 

If I were japanese I would buy every single Naruto chapter to support Kishi's great work, but unfortunately the only access to Naruto I have atm is the internet scans. 

Half of the world knows Kishi, Naruto, and Shonen jump because of these scans. Do you honestly think guys people in my country (Cyprus) would buy Naruto console games if the manga was not published for free in the internet? They loose in one section but they earn in another. Same for pop singers


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## yummy77777 (Apr 16, 2010)

In the world of NF those who scan manga are called SCUM...but those who don't scan manga are even worse than SCUM...


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## Euraj (Apr 16, 2010)

Verily, I understand where they are coming from. This may or may be something I can really say, but if I was an extremely successful mangaka, I don't believe I would become bent out of shape if there were organizations scanning my work online. The complaints would be more moving if these authors and companies were going into debt because of this, but as far as I know, they are not.

Kyasurin Yakuto brought up my next point. If you don't want someone else taking advantage of a new market, you ought to take control of it first.


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## Shima Tetsuo (Apr 16, 2010)

Just because people are reading it for free doesn't automatically mean that the authors are losing money. A lot of the people who read mangas online would never have actually bought them anyway, so those people aren't contributing to any tangible "loss".

I know I would never pay for something that is intentionally dragged on and on for years _just_ to make more money. Being strung along for free, fine. Paying for it, no.


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## Clay Man Gumby (Apr 16, 2010)

I wonder what Kishimoto actually thinks about all this?


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Apr 16, 2010)

Kubo already said he doesn't care I believe. Either way he gets money I think.


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## FitzChivalry (Apr 16, 2010)

Esponer said:


> Ch.268
> 
> It's good to see some small successes for morality and the law, in the form of Raw Paradise stopping their illegal actions.



See link. Trashing.


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## Bleach (Apr 16, 2010)

Dai Dreamer said:


> It leads to scans being better hidden.



Manga becoming underground once more doesn't seem to concern you much. 

Would be annoying if it got to a point where you need a requirement to even look at manga on a website like 100 posts or actually donate and shit. Or invite only


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## Vanity (Apr 16, 2010)

Waveblade said:


> I wonder why that happens?



Because it's cheap entertainment compared to a lot of things.

In recessions people do that for fun instead of doing more expensive stuff for fun.


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## Bleach (Apr 16, 2010)

If anyone noticed, raw paradise's website now leads to:


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## T.D.A (Apr 16, 2010)

either they merged, or raw paradise got raped.


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## Vanity (Apr 16, 2010)

Bleach said:


> If anyone noticed, raw paradise's website now leads to:



I wonder if that means that Shueisha shut them down instead of Raw Paradise taking it down themselves?


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## Blinky (Apr 16, 2010)

I bet RP just pussied out .


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## firefist (Apr 16, 2010)

Does it affect the sales that much?


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## Bleach (Apr 16, 2010)

Kyasurin Yakuto said:


> I wonder if that means that Shueisha shut them down instead of Raw Paradise taking it down themselves?



Most likely Raw Paradise redirected there website and completely took it down. Maybe Shueisha did contact them to tell them to take there raws down or they would take action though. Guess we will never know that :/.

Unless if anyone knows the owner or RP XD?


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## Vanity (Apr 16, 2010)

Bleach said:


> Most likely Raw Paradise redirected there website and completely took it down. Maybe Shueisha did contact them to tell them to take there raws down or they would take action though. Guess we will never know that :/.
> 
> Unless if anyone knows the owner or RP XD?



Well I am really curious as to if Shueisha has gone after anyone like that. They did threaten to do so after all.

EDIT:

Oh and here's another topic about this that was trashed but some people made some good points so I'm linking to it:

Ch.268

I wish it had been merged with this thread instead of trashed. Especially since this whole thing deals a lot with this very site/forum.

The mod who trashed it though doesn't have powers to merge it with this thread since he doesn't have power in this section....but I still hope someone will merge it since a lot of people made good posts about the issue and the issue really does relate a lot to this site.


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## Hellrasinbrasin (Apr 16, 2010)

look what happened in North America during the mid 90s when it was going through a recession Napter cropped up and 1 part of Media Industry said that the reason they lost sales were not because of the slump in the economy but because of "That Napster Site".

Look P2P technologies have all ways been a means of sharing and sampling titles but once you've done so and if like what you see you buy it. Thats all ways been the original line of thought but coming out of the P2P case in the late 90's and later cases have changed that mind set.


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## Audible Phonetics (Apr 16, 2010)

Where do you live.  Multimedia tax thats new.


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## onepostwonder (Apr 16, 2010)

they are dumb idiots (no offence). future media distribution will happen through the internet. the music industry offered online mp3 stores way too late. manga industry messed it up too. 
if they would establish a platform with hq online raws and translated versions they would  definitely make profit. 

look at valves "steam" game-distribution-platform, it is going strong since they started

i dont want to have a whole shelf of books/mangas wasting space in my flat. its the same with cds, dvds or any other information container. the future is digital. 

its 2010 goddamn


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## Blue_Panter_Ninja (Apr 16, 2010)

Shueisha need to fuck up.

4chan is coming to them.:ho


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## Jon Snow (Apr 16, 2010)

hehey said:


> well, they never know when the recession will come knocking at their doors... planning ahead.





			
				Freija @ MSN said:
			
		

> Peter // säger:
> 
> Well, first of all as long as sales are rising the recession won't hit if you didn't really get that considering they could still afford everything if they sell more.
> 
> ...


............


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## Descent of the Lion (Apr 16, 2010)

They forgot to mention "hurts the bottom line." Simple solution, make current manga available to non-Japanese customers. Most people that rip it off are people that can't read Japanese anyway. These businesses are the only inconsiderate ones in that they don't even consider a big vista for profit even if it laid a bird turd on their shoulder. Most of us are willing to pay.


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## Nihongaeri (Apr 16, 2010)

0Fear said:


> Most people that rip it off are people that can't read Japanese anyway.


While I do think that media industries the world over, and Japan especially, need to get with the times in a number of ways and try *seriously* experimenting (as in things that make you think "wow, that's a bold move") with new forms of content distribution... you, sir, are mistaken:




It is not at all surprising that Shueisha sent RP a C&D. In fact, it's somewhat of a wonder that this didn't happen sooner.


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## Red (Apr 16, 2010)

*This is Bullshit Of The Highest Goddamn Order. Raging like a Mother fucker.* 



You know the only reason I buy manga? Its because I read them online, see that they're good enough to buy and buy it. Seriously who'd the fuck would have known about half the things that are licensed now if it wasn't for the scantalators who put time and effort and the raw providers?

Hows this even helping? We're the secondary market, the primary market is in Japan with the market in American representing a fraction of the selection and profit that these guys make. If sales are slumping then an aggressive marketing program over there in Japan should do more good than removing the few free publicity you get.

Fuck you Shuiesha. The only reason I'm not cursing you and everything you stand for right now is because some of my favorite artists and mangaka are tied to you. I hope they all move to Kodansha and you lose all your business and become hobos. Fucking shit.


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## Suzuku (Apr 16, 2010)

How about they provide an alternative legitimate way for us westerners to get our hands on translated copies of the mangas? Maybe piracy wouldn't be so rabid then. It's not like the vast majorities of manga are readily available for us to read.

Is it so hard to set up a new business model where they post Japanese RAWs and translated versions of their mangas on the web and use advertisement as a source of revenue? Even if they didn't want to rely on only advertisements, they could still have subscription services. If a couple of random people can set up groups on the internet and translate manga in a timely fashion and distribute it on the web for the masses I'm sure that a multi-million dollar corporation can do the same thing, and should be able to do it even more efficiently.


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## Descent of the Lion (Apr 17, 2010)

Nihongaeri said:


> While I do think that media industries the world over, and Japan especially, need to get with the times in a number of ways and try *seriously* experimenting (as in things that make you think "wow, that's a bold move") with new forms of content distribution... you, sir, are mistaken:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You must remember that the raw is in Japanese. These numbers may be underrepresenting non Japanese manga consumers, since many westerners skip the raw and read the cleaned and translated version of the manga. That said, point taken. It seems that Japanese consumption is still the overwhelming majority. 

 It wouldn't hurt their bottom line to provide digital magazines  to japan either I suspect.  If people only want to read One Piece, they really shouldn't have to get everything else. A digital model wouldn't just remove the thorn of illiterate westerners, it would probably increase local profit as well.

I say the best answer is a model that allows manga chapters to be sent to devices through a controlled viewing software.


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## Bleach (Apr 17, 2010)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Kubo already said he doesn't care I believe. Either way he gets money I think.



Kubo doesn't give a shit about anything. Even his own work 

If anyone can translate French really well, give us a hint of what heija says here cause google translate is weird:


Also, Shuiesha makes way too much fucking money to give a shit about this. Fucking greed >_>.. $759 million dollars in 2009 and 6% of market share >_>


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## firefist (Apr 17, 2010)

> Edit: I don't know if this sped up things for Shueisha, but for some time now, some (stupid?) people have been going to Kubo's (mangaka of Bleach) Twitter to comment on chapters before Jump is even released in Japan.



wow, if that's true, people really lack common sense.


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## Punpun (Apr 17, 2010)

And that's true 

People really are stupid ...


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## Mizura (Apr 17, 2010)

That's... indeed very stupid...


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## Bleach (Apr 17, 2010)

Thanks Kirjava. ANd yea, Google translate was saying that he got arrested or something weird so IDk if that was true but thanks. 

But people are big idiots if they are twittering about that


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## Lord Snow (Apr 17, 2010)

Waveblade said:


> I wonder why that happens?



During hard times people want an escape from life's troubles books and movies provide that escape.


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## Vanity (Apr 17, 2010)

Firefist said:


> wow, if that's true, people really lack common sense.



Yeah....it sounds like people just get too excited about the new chapter and don't think about what they are doing.

I wouldn't even try to talk to any manga authors about anything that isn't even out in my country officially yet, let alone it being out in Japan.


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## Lightysnake (Apr 17, 2010)

Seriously, let's not panic. As people have pointed out, there's also the P2P networks that can't be regulated, independent scanners, etc. Scans might be delayed, but seriously, can people stop panicking over all this? Remember when the movie, television or music industries 'cracked down?'


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## Superstars (Apr 17, 2010)

Well if this is the case and Shueisha succeeds in stopping online scanning totally then you people better become ANIME fans real quick.


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## Ennoea (Apr 17, 2010)

Kubo is the one with the hurt soul? I should tweet about the low quality of his manga.


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## The Imp (Apr 17, 2010)

Superstars said:


> Well if this is the case and Shueisha succeeds in stopping online scanning totally then you people better become ANIME fans real quick.



Adaptations aren't as good as the source material 99% of the time.


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## Superstars (Apr 17, 2010)

Lυ Bυ said:


> Adaptations aren't as good as the source material 99% of the time.


This is wrong just like 99% of the posts on NF.


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## Mider T (Apr 17, 2010)

Mangahelpers is shit anyway.


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## firefist (Apr 17, 2010)

Superstars said:


> This is wrong just like 99% of the posts on NF.



name 10 good adaptations.
I can only think of Gintama and maybe Death Note and Dragonball Kai.


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## Blinky (Apr 17, 2010)

Superstars said:


> This is wrong just like 99% of the posts on NF.



Actually it's very true .


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## firefist (Apr 17, 2010)

what about the prices? I heared mangas aren't that cheap in the U.S.


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## Ennoea (Apr 17, 2010)

Its exposure, theres next to none of it anymore, especially here in the UK. If it wasn't for online scans I would never have even read most mangas, or even ever bought one.

Biggest issue for me is the price, I don't see why I have to pay more than double for a manga volume than Japan.


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## Superstars (Apr 17, 2010)

Firefist said:


> name 10 good adaptations.
> I can only think of Gintama and maybe Death Note and Dragonball Kai.



Dragonball Kai? lol, Please the original DBZ anime will always be the best along with Dragonball anime.
Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood
Rurouni Kenshin [Despite it not being finished]
Guyver OVA's
Naruto 
Bleach
YYH
Gundam series
Case Closed
Yugioh
Akira
The list goes on..


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## Amatsu (Apr 17, 2010)

I think it goes either way. There are good adaptations, and then there are the not so good ones. It depends on how you look at it I guess.


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## Blinky (Apr 17, 2010)

> Dragonball Kai? lol, Please the original DBZ anime will always be the best along with Dragonball anime.



Dragonball Kai is Z without the filler . It's miles better . 



> Akira



Good but not nearly as good as the manga .


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## Mist Puppet (Apr 17, 2010)

Ennoea said:


> Its exposure, theres next to none of it anymore, especially here in the UK. If it wasn't for online scans I would never have even read most mangas, or even ever bought one.



Maybe lack of anime adaptations? I watched Naruto, Bleach, OP, Death Note, and Dragonball before I read the manga.


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## Superstars (Apr 17, 2010)

BlinkyEC said:


> Dragonball Kai is Z without the filler . It's miles better .



Not even close, music sucks and the battles aren't as dramatic or epic as the original anime.


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## Amatsu (Apr 17, 2010)

and in cases like Detective Conan and One Piece the filler is actually good. It may sound ridiculous but a good adaptation doesn't necessarily mean a series that has little to no filler in it. It just depends on how good the filler material is and how it fits into the adapted storyline.


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## Blinky (Apr 17, 2010)

Superstars said:


> Not even close, music sucks and the battles aren't as dramatic or epic as the original anime.



It has an orchetral score like how the Jap version of Z was . Much better than that techno crap . And how does stalling for time make the battles better . 

In Z Goku vs Freeza was 80 % dialouge . Dragonball was much better anyway so I don't really care . 



> and in cases like Detective Conan and One Piece the filler is actually good. It may sound ridiculous but a good adaptation doesn't necessarily mean a series that has little to no filler in it. It just depends on how good the filler material is and how it fits into the adapted storyline.



The filler in Z consisted of stalling for time and not much else . Remember when in the Goku versus Freeza fight they cut to Bulma for a few episodes ? annoying .


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## Amatsu (Apr 17, 2010)

BlinkyEC said:


> It has an orchetral score like how the Jap version of Z was . Much better than that techno crap . And how does stalling for time make the battles better .
> 
> In Z Goku vs Freeza was 80 % dialouge . Dragonball was much better anyway so I don't really care .
> 
> ...



I'm not defending the original Z. I only think there was one good filler in that. Dragonball Kai is obviously superior in that regard.


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## Blinky (Apr 17, 2010)

Amatsu said:


> I'm not defending the original Z. I only think there was one good filler in that. Dragonball Kai is obviously superior in that regard.



I know you weren't talking about Z I was giving an example of how terrible filler can be . 

I never saw Detective Conan so I don't know about that . Might watch it some day..


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## Superstars (Apr 17, 2010)

BlinkyEC said:


> It has an orchetral score like how the Jap version of Z was . Much better than that techno crap . And how does stalling for time make the battles better .
> 
> In Z Goku vs Freeza was 80 % dialouge . Dragonball was much better anyway so I don't really care .  .


No, the filler extended the battles and even made them more epic. The filler completed the series. Goku vs Majin v
egeta, Cell series, Vegetto vs Buu Freeza ect. The original anime didn't use techno..That's dub and kai.


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## Amatsu (Apr 17, 2010)

BlinkyEC said:


> I know you weren't talking about Z I was giving an example of how terrible filler can be .
> 
> I never saw Detective Conan so I don't know about that . Might watch it some day..



well considering Detective Conan is near or around 600 episodes where over 90% of it is filler episodes. I'd say it's a faithful adaptation considering the filler mysteries are fun to watch.


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## Blinky (Apr 17, 2010)

> No, the filler extended the battles and even made them more epic. The filler completed the series. Goku vs Majin v
> egeta, Cell series, Vegetto vs Buu Freeza ect. The original anime didn't use techno..That's dub and kai.



I think you'r suffering from nostalgia blindness . Anyway this is way too off topic . 

So were RP threatened or what ?


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## Superstars (Apr 17, 2010)

nah I got the anime video originals!

But yeah, this is off topic.


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## Ennoea (Apr 17, 2010)

> Maybe lack of anime adaptations? I watched Naruto, Bleach, OP, Death Note, and Dragonball before I read the manga.



I watched Naruto and Bleach before I read the mangas too but if it wasn't for online manga I probably would have stopped there.

Also filler should be included in adaptations. Anyway OP isn't a good adaptation, the pace of the anime is so slow that I want to bang my head in to the screen.


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## Amatsu (Apr 17, 2010)

Ennoea said:


> I watched Naruto and Bleach before I read the mangas too but if it wasn't for online manga I probably would have stopped there.
> 
> Also filler should be included in adaptations. Anyway OP isn't a good adaptation, the pace of the anime is so slow that I want to bang my head in to the screen.



Well it has to be. One Piece is way too close to the manga right now. If they don't slow down they'd have to do like Bleach and pull a filler arc right in the middle of a major arc.


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## Bleach (Apr 18, 2010)

I rather the anime actually take a break than filler.


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## Waveblade (Apr 18, 2010)

chapter translation. 

Check out the traffic rankings under the audience tab, over 40% is from Japan. Wow. I heard it was even more for raw-paradise. So I wonder if it's similar for similar websites?


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## Jugger (Apr 18, 2010)

Bleach said:


> I rather the anime actually take a break than filler.



Like Gintama did


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## San Juan Wolf (Apr 18, 2010)

About decline in sales , does anybody not think it might have something to do with a little thing called "the recession" ?


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## T.D.A (Apr 18, 2010)

Shueisha were talking to the japanese audience btw.


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## Vanity (Apr 18, 2010)

T.D.A said:


> Shueisha were talking to the japanese audience btw.



Yeah most likely....I mean it's mostly them that scan it too for us to be able to get it so early. It's obviously people in Japan that are scanning most of the stuff up.


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## Sasori (Apr 18, 2010)

No online sharing of manga would be detrimental to manga culture itself.


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## Jinibea (Apr 18, 2010)

Bleach said:


> I rather the anime actually take a break than filler.



With the amount of ratings it gets I highly doubt they would do that.

What they could do is prolong the fights that only got a couple of panels.


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## Fullmetalthis (Apr 18, 2010)

I didn't bother reading the whole thread but has anyone suggested that perhaps the best bet for SJ is to release translated work online along with the weekly sales? Along the lines of how the anime is now with subbed releases from licensed providers that have it out almost immediately after the original episode airs?

Its something to think about and if it was affordable I'd consider subscribing as I read half of Weekly Shounen Jump now anyway.


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## Gunners (Apr 18, 2010)

San Juan Wolf said:


> About decline in sales , does anybody not think it might have something to do with a little thing called "the recession" ?



No I don't think it's due to the recession, they cost what the equivalent of $5 on a weekly basis.


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## Deathbringerpt (Apr 19, 2010)

Waveblade said:


> HERE
> 
> Check out the traffic rankings under the audience tab, over 40% is from Japan. Wow. I heard it was even more for raw-paradise. So I wonder if it's similar for similar websites?



Breaking news, Japanese people read manga online!

Raw Paradise visitor influx was 90% Japanese, i shit you not. Now connect the dots.


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## cha-uzu (Apr 19, 2010)

Maybe they should make english versions of SJ available simultanious with the japanese versian and ship em at the same time? 

If they take away scans thier sales will plummit because the long wait for chapters would result in people loosing interest.


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## Bleach (Apr 19, 2010)

I'm wondering if this is the reason for some manga scans not being released yet because Kimi no iru machi and GE are taking wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy too long to come out >_>


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## Spica (Apr 19, 2010)

HugeGuy said:


> Wow, that's really cool. It's really a good way to gauge which country is a profitable market and which are not.
> 
> EDIT: Actually OM and Mangafox did have this series but Viz asked them to take it down.



Peculiar, right? Viz asked them to take a specific series down. Not a C&D.


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## Parallax (Apr 19, 2010)

Viz knows they would lose too much money if they did that.


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## Amatsu (Apr 19, 2010)

Tyrannos said:


> You can get a year's subscription to Shonen Jump for $26.95, which is quite reasonable.



and as far as graphic novels they run at least 10 dollars a book. Pretty expensive if you're only buying graphic novels.


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## Bleach (Apr 19, 2010)

Yea but what Rumiko is doing with Rin-ne is actually really good and coolio and wish everyone did that.


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## Amatsu (Apr 19, 2010)

Tyrannos said:


> Well you're paying for the Takoubons, but this the montly.  Which is mbasically $2 per month.  Which is cheap!



Well even so. For those who only collect the Takoubons it's still expensive. Think of it. You're buying six series a month that come out at the same time. You're spending at least 60 dollars just for 6 takoubons. That's far too pricy here in the US.

It's why I pretty much stopped collecting them. There are more important things that money needs to be used on, and honestly it's not very convenient either to have to pay so much just to keep up with Viz related series just so you can support the creator.


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## Tyrannos (Apr 19, 2010)

Amatsu said:


> Well even so. For those who only collect the Takoubons it's still expensive. Think of it. You're buying six series a month that come out at the same time. You're spending at least 60 dollars just for 6 takoubons. That's far too pricy here in the US.
> 
> It's why I pretty much stopped collecting them. There are more important things that money needs to be used on, and honestly it's not very convenient either to have to pay so much just to keep up with Viz related series just so you can support the creator.



I agree, it is expensive if you buy them all at once, but every 3 months it's not bad.

Or buy at places like Barnes and Noble for $5 per Volume.



Bleach said:


> I just don't get how it benefits her though. Is it just good advertising?



Remember, mangakas depend on their Takubon sales for the majority of their income.   And people still going to buy them for their collections.


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## Amatsu (Apr 20, 2010)

Tyrannos said:


> I agree, it is expensive if you buy them all at once, but every 3 months it's not bad.
> 
> Or buy at places like Barnes and Noble for $5 per Volume.
> 
> ...



Most of the ones I was buying released a volume either every month, every other month, or every three months. So I would be buying 4 or 5 manga volumes a month just to keep up with the releases.


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