# Hagoromo vs Jigen/Isshiki



## Gibbs (Jul 3, 2020)

In this colossal battle of Titans, Hagoromo, the Sage of the Six Paths, takes on the man who made jokes out of Naruto and Sasuke at the same time, Isshiki/Jigen.



Who wins this one and why?

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## Yumi Zoro (Jul 3, 2020)

Well Naruto and Sasuke together are basically better than Hagoromo himself. So Hagoromo go down the same way.

Hagoromo dont even posess Space Time technique so Jigen could just: 

-drope him in a dimension.

-Stab with his rode and increase the size killing him.

-Seal him in a pot like he did with Naruto.

A better match will be Hamura and Hagoromo vs Jigen/Isshiki. There I Can see Jigen loosing because Hamura and Hagoromo are definitely a stronger duo than Naruto and Sasuke.

Reactions: Like 6 | Lewd 1 | Dislike 1


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## kayz (Jul 3, 2020)

Hagoromo is a lot too featless. His best feat of creating moon is split with his brother. 
This is basically hype-statements-portrayal battle

Isshiki wins based on these.


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## AfroUchiha (Jul 3, 2020)

I feel like Isshiki still has more to show.

Going off portrayal, Isshiki should beat Base Hagoromo. JJ Hagoromo is an entirely different story.

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## Kagutsutchi (Jul 3, 2020)

Hagoromo loses. Adult Naruto and Sasuke are a lot stronger than their war arc selves who were each half of Hagoromo(and then some even then).

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## Draco Bolton (Jul 3, 2020)

Hagoromo seal that in his Hagoromo box, the Amber Purifying Pot.


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## Sufex (Jul 3, 2020)

Hagomoro mid high diffs imo


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## AnbuHokage63 (Jul 3, 2020)

Kamalu said:


> Hagoromo loses. *Adult Naruto and Sasuke are a lot stronger than their war arc selves* who were each half of Hagoromo(and then some even then).

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## Altiora Night (Jul 3, 2020)

Jigen clapped Naruto and Sasuke together.

Hagoromo’s power should be around Naruto and Sasuke’s combined, which Jigen was above.

So yah, Isshiki > Hagoromo.

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## Danyboy (Jul 3, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> Hagoromo’s power should be around Naruto and Sasuke’s combined, which Jigen was above


 Its still debatable if they are on par. And even if they are, they have 50% of non Jin Hagoromo,who is<<<<<<<jin Hagoromo.
Jigenb might beat base Hago, but Jin sage probably beats him.


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## Alita (Jul 3, 2020)

Assuming it's full power isshiki he beats base hagomoro at least. I would still favor hagomoro if he is the juubi jin tho.

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## Koro sensei (Jul 3, 2020)

Isshiki solos hags

Reactions: Winner 1


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## MaruUchiha (Jul 3, 2020)

Sword Of Nunoboko pastes him while he's dealing with Animal Path, or Creation Of Everything turns him into a cheeseburger. Jigen's feats against Naruto and Sasuke don't impress me since they're professional jobbers in the Boruto era

Reactions: Agree 2


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## ARGUS (Jul 3, 2020)

Non jin hagoromo > adult naruto and sasuke together, quite comfortably I might add 

Isshiki May stand a chance against non jin hagoromo Although I struggle to see how he survives CST or mass CT of hagoromos scale 

jin hahoromo however would absolutely should shit on him Based on what’s been shown

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## Wulffel (Jul 4, 2020)

Hagoromo is pretty featless (on top of being a non-fighter) and Isshiki still has plenty to show.

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## Marvel (Jul 4, 2020)

All these aliens are confusing. I be forgetting who did what,when,and what power up they had,like fruit or juubi.


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## blk (Jul 4, 2020)

If this is full power Isshiki with his special eye that can shrink everything he looks at, Hagormo gets demolished. 

That ability alone is insanely haxed, on top of S/T, God Tier Chakra absorption and ridiculously high stats (higher than the Adult Fate Bros Chakra Constructs). 

Literally everything Hagormo will use or throw at Isshiki, will be made microscopic and thus completely ineffective. 

Even if you give him everything that adult Sasuke and Naruto have, i can't see what of their abilities could possibly threat him.

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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

TSBs would also get shrunk or teleported to another dimension; same for CT core orbs.


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## blk (Jul 4, 2020)

Pretty much Hagoromo can only approach this fight via hand-to-hand, since everything is either absorbed, avoided/BFR'd with S/T or shrunk into nothingness.

But Isshiki has insane stats coupled by the shrinking ability which is insanely powerful in hand to hand combat too.

At the very worst it's an high diff win for Isshiki imo. Probably more mid diff tho (assuming Hagoromo gets Naruto and Sasuke's arsenal).


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## Tsukuyomi (Jul 4, 2020)

blk said:


> Pretty much Hagoromo can only approach this fight via hand-to-hand, since everything is either absorbed, avoided/BFR'd with S/T or shrunk into nothingness.
> 
> But Isshiki has insane stats coupled by the shrinking ability which is insanely powerful in hand to hand combat too.
> 
> At the very worst it's an high diff win for Isshiki imo. Probably more mid diff tho (assuming Hagoromo gets Naruto and Sasuke's arsenal).

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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

Depends which hagoromo, jj hagoromo stomps (i believe that version of hags is the strongest naruto character even above kaguya), hagoromo with yin yang seal also beats jigen, hagoromo that fought kaguya with only 1 seal loses.

Hagoromo has;

> tsb
> 6 paths abilities
> 6 paths senjutsu
> Yin yang CT
> Creation of all things
> sword of nunoboku
> can more than likely use sage abikities like lightfang and black lightning.
> raise the dead to help him 


The moment he touches jigen with both hands its the end...


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## kayz (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> Depends which hagoromo, jj hagoromo stomps (i believe that version of hags is *the strongest naruto character *even above kaguya), ...


With what feats?


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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

kayz said:


> With what feats?



Without having the full juubi, he is as strong as juudara, thats base hags.... Hags with full juubi which should be much stronger than war arc juubi should be above kaguya.


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## Artistwannabe (Jul 4, 2020)

Tbh I think Prime Hagoromo is unbeatable, he seems like the most haxxed dude in Naruto

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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

Artistwannabe said:


> Tbh I think Prime Hagoromo is unbeatable, he seems like the most haxxed dude in Naruto



Exactly, he can touch GG anyone in the narutoverse.


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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> Without having the full juubi, he is as strong as juudara, thats base hags.... Hags with full juubi which should be much stronger than war arc juubi should be above kaguya.


Then you don't mind showing panels of Hagoromo and his feats in a battle situation where we actually see him fight perhaps ? No ?


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## blk (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> > tsb
> > Yin yang CT
> > sword of nunoboku
> > can more than likely use sage abikities like lightfang and black lightning



Isshiki can shrink all of them into nothingness just by looking at them. 

On top of that, CT and TSBs can be BFR'd. 

Lighting style and maybe TSBs can be absorbed. 



> > 6 paths abilities



Useless except Deva Path. 

Isshiki can arguably diminish immensely the impact from a strong ST push by becoming microscopic. 



> > 6 paths senjutsu



This is just standard at the God Tier level. 
Naruto has it and it didn't change anything when confronted with Jigen (a much less powerful Isshiki). 



> > Creation of all things



Featless and probably not a combat ability anyway. 



> > raise the dead to help him



Which required a lengthy ritual and perhaps the help of the Hokages if i remember correctly. 
Also can ghosts even fight? 



> The moment he touches jigen with both hands its the end...



Never gonna happen since Isshiki can instantly become microscopic.


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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

Freaking Nunoboko itself is made out of TSBs, and those very TSBs would get shrunk before he even gets a chance to create the sword. 

Isshiki can easily absorb chakra-based attacks, and any attack he cannot absorb, he shrinks them instead.

On the other hand, there's jack shit you can absorb from him as far as his repertoire goes; portals obviously can't be absorbed, Sukunahikona obviously can't be absorbed, and his black rods themselves can absorb chakra and would prevent an opponent with chakra absorption powers from absorbing chakra, just like Madara couldn't use Preta Path when he was bound by Hashirama's _wooden dragons_ due to their chakra absorption ability.

Heck, Isshiki could even implant Hagoromo with microscopic rods, which would slowly but surely drain his chakra. He doesn't even need to restore them to their original size immediately in order to inflict wounds. All he needs to do is wait and restore them back when Hagoromo has been significantly weakened, but until then, he simply needs to keep them in their shrunk state so that they slowly drain Hagoromo's chakra.

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## dergeist (Jul 4, 2020)

Prime Ishiti was scrubbed by sub par Kaguya, Hogaromo's power even as Asspullromo shat on her a second time. It's pretty obvious Hogaromo stands many tiers above the second rate fodder.

Stans and their blind fap, though

Reactions: Funny 1


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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

blk said:


> Isshiki can shrink all of them into nothingness just by looking at them.
> 
> On top of that, CT and TSBs can be BFR'd.
> 
> ...



> Yin yang CT can not be shrieked bruh, ST can also not be shrinked.

> he has to touch tsb to bfr them, hags alters its shape and grabs him with it.

> isshiki can diminish the impact of ST by shrinking?? Wtf??!? Uhh no

> isshiki shrinks and he still can be tracked by hagoromo,the Rinnegan plus rikudou senjutsu heightens hags perception and reaction speed.


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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> > he has to touch tsb to bfr them, hags alters its shape and grabs him with it.


No, he doesn’t.

Isshiki’s portals fundamentally work differently from Kaguya’s.

His portal ability envelopes objects/targets and suck them into it, kinda like Kamui does. He doesn’t even need to touch them. The TSBs, even if their shape is altered, will be directly sucked into the portal, like Naruto was.


*Spoiler*: __ 










Heck, he doesn’t even need to BFR them. All he needs to do is shrink them and it’s all good.



> > isshiki shrinks and he still can be tracked by hagoromo,the Rinnegan plus rikudou senjutsu heightens hags perception and reaction speed.


Depends on if Hagoromo’s Rinnegan possesses the Sharingan’s kinetic and microscopic vision. We need more evidence than just the panel stating he had the blood and powers of both Senju and Uchiha.

He doesn’t even need to shrink to avoid attacks, as he can just as easily teleport away.


*Spoiler*: __ 









Isshiki’s portals, again, work differently from Kaguya’s, as the portals envelop him, making it easier for him to teleport away in order to avoid getting hit by attacks, and its teleportation speed was impressive as even Sasuke was unable to hit him in time even though he was busy absorbing Naruto’s Rasengan prior and that was V1 Jigen, who is inferior to V2 Jigen, let alone Isshiki himself.


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## blk (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> > Yin yang CT can not be shrieked bruh, ST can also not be shrinked.
> 
> > he has to touch tsb to bfr them, hags alters its shape and grabs him with it.
> 
> ...



- why not? He can shrink the core to microscopic size before it even attracts any meaningful amount of rocks;

- Isshiki's portals are created from his hands but he doesn't need to touch something to BFR it, he just needs to engulf the target with the S/T.
Not that it's important anyway, TSBs are completely useless since he can shrink them;

- he can still be tracked but the point was that Hagoromo will never be able to touch him with both hands at the same time, ti activate Yin Yang CT. Because Isshiki can prevent any and all touch simply by becoming microscoping and flying away/teleporting, if Hag ever manages to corner him.


On the other hand, Hag doesn't really have an effective way to fight someone who has insane stats and can compound that by shrinking himself and his piercing rods at will.
We have seen how Jigen can easily shrink, fly on the side of an enemy leaving microscopic rods on his eyes, and then increase the size of the rods to finish the enemy. 

Also he can make his rods to be Bijuu sized, like the ones that hold his Juubi and the ones he used to hold Kurama Avatar's tails.

Imagine what will happen if a microscopic rod on Hag's face becomes Bijuu sized...

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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

blk said:


> - Isshiki's portals are created from his hands but he doesn't need to touch something to BFR it, he just needs to engulf the target with the S/T.


He can also do it without using his hand. 

For instance after defeating the duo, he manifested a portal behind his body, which then enveloped him and he teleported away.

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## blk (Jul 4, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> He can also do it without using his hand.
> 
> For instance after defeating the duo, he manifested a portal behind his body, which then enveloped him and he teleported away.



I see, that's even better than using the hands


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## Wulffel (Jul 4, 2020)

Also Isshiki can manifest his rods from the ground to incacipate his targets... *Link Removed*

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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> No, he doesn’t.
> 
> Isshiki’s portals fundamentally work differently from Kaguya’s.
> 
> ...



> Bruh tsb's size and shape can be manipulated, so shrinking it doesn't solve anything when tsb users can manipulate its size.

> isshiki still has no answer to ST, hags can pull his ass out before he enters a portal with banshou

> isshiki has no way of hurting hags

> yes the rinnegan can track isshiki, rinnegan, sharingan and byagugan enhances the perception of all wielders of said doujutsu's. (i didn't say precog), and we know the rinnegan could see at mircoscopic levels, madara saw guys innards and his life force diminishing)


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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

Plus hagoromo could use creation of all things to create tsb.


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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> > Bruh tsb's size and shape can be manipulated, so shrinking it doesn't solve anything when tsb users can manipulate its size.


So ? They get instantly shrunk into oblivion before the TSB user gets the chance to do anything with them, and the shrinking can be continuously applied.

Koji’s flames were eternally burning bud; didn’t prevent them from getting shrunk to oblivion.

TSBs get shrunk to oblivion. Nuff said.

Doesn’t matter if you can manipulate their shape or all that blabla when they’re gone.



> > isshiki still has no answer to ST, hags can pull his ass out before he enters a portal with banshou


Nonsense.

Did you even look at the scans ?

His portals wrap around him; he doesn’t even need to enter them.

Try better.



> > isshiki has no way of hurting hags


Multiple rods implanted on Hagoromo’s head and instantly restored to their original size; or heck, imagine if they’re restored/enlarged to the size that they were used against Kurama.

Another option is sealing Hagoromo away, which is entirely feasible since he isn’t known to have any Space-Time Ninjutsu.



> > yes the rinnegan can track isshiki, rinnegan, sharingan and byagugan enhances the perception of all wielders of said doujutsu's. (i didn't say precog), and we know the rinnegan could see at mircoscopic levels, madara saw guys innards and his life force diminishing)


Except it was outright stated that Sasuke could track Isshiki because of the Sharingan’s kinetic vision buddy.

You have to prove Hagoromo’s Rinnegan is capable of kinetic vision.

Oh that’s the problem here; you’re arguing for a character whom we’ve never even seen fight, with only a few panels depicting his battle against Ten-Tails, alongside his brother.


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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> Plus hagoromo could use creation of all things to create tsb.


What in the actual fuck-aroo is that boyo ?

This is fanfic of da highest orda here son.

Try better.

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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> What in the actual fuck-aroo is that boyo ?
> 
> This is fanfic of da highest orda here son.
> 
> Try better.



Lmao, why?? Hypothetically i dont see why he cant, using hags means hypothetical feats inclusive


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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> Lmao, why?? Hypothetically i dont see why he cant, using hags means hypothetical feats inclusive


That’s not how CoAT works though.

Even when Hagoromo created the Tailed Beasts, he created them out of Ten-Tails’ chakra. It’s not like he created them out of simply nothing.

When Naruto similarly created a new eye for Kakashi; he said he took a part of Kakashi and then didn’t finish his statement because he only instinctively understood how what he did works.

Pretty much; what both Hagoromo and Naruto did was create something out of *something*.

They didn’t create stuff out of *nothing*, if you catch my drift.

Hagoromo created the Tailed Beasts out of Ten-Tails’ chakra (something).

Naruto crafted a new eye for Kakashi out of ‘a part of Kakashi’ (something).

There’s clear limitations to that ability.

Of course Hagoromo could create shape out of naught, but his imagination wasn’t the only input.

What you’re referring to is called _mentifery_, which is turning fantasy or imagination into reality.

Gremmy from Bleach can do that.

Hagoromo ? Nope, because he needs another input other than his imagination.

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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

Ironically, if you want something close to _mentifery_ in Naruto, it’s Isshiki’s special ability.

He used his *imagination* to create a new table with food and even lit candles after Delta destroyed the previous dining table in his hideout.


*Spoiler*: __ 










*Spoiler*: __ 










*Spoiler*: __ 










*Spoiler*: __


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## T-Bag (Jul 4, 2020)

dergeist said:


> Prime Ishiti was scrubbed by sub par Kaguya, Hogaromo's power even as Asspullromo shat on her a second time. It's pretty obvious Hogaromo stands many tiers above the second rate fodder.
> 
> Stans and their blind fap, though


no i just think their reading comprehension is substantially below average.
What I read here is shocking. seriously im in shock, literally jaw-dropping . Only a select few here actually know how to read.

jigen beating hagoromo.... what in the actual fuck???? I can tolerate stupidity, but not total lunacy.


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## MYGod000 (Jul 4, 2020)

Hagoromo wins.


 Isshiki was almost killed by Pre-God Ten Tails Kaguya. It doesn't matter if she was weaker...because after she eat the Chakra fruit and became much more powerful. Hagoromo and Hamura defeated her.


Revived Kaguya is more powerful than the Kaguya Hagoromo fought.  Kaguya in the past Wanted Both Hagoromo and Hamura's power back,  while in the war wanted Hagoromo's power.


When Obito died after he absorbed six path Power he still had that Six path Power,  to the point it boosted Kakashi powerful enough to harm Kaguya.

If this is JJ Hagoromo the fact he has Both Seals ends this fight  instantly the moment he touches Jigens body he is completely Sealed.

Jigen beat Naruto and sasuke using *Isshiki power+ Juubi's power*.

Not just Isshiki power like people are trying to allude to.


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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

Aside from the vast amount of BS this guy came up with...



MYGod000 said:


> Jigen beat Naruto and sasuke using *Isshiki power+ Juub's power*.
> 
> Not just Isshiki power like people are trying to allude to.


Precision bud; small amounts of a juvenile Ten-Tails' chakra.

For fuck's sake; borrowing chakra from Ten-Tails isn't the same as being a host for Ten-Tails. That's common sense.

Besides, it's a *juvenile* Ten-Tails, meaning there's still room for a lot of growth and is FAR from maturity.

At the level they're operating at, where Naruto and Sasuke were fighting Ten-Tails' host(s) in the war, absorbing *small amounts of chakra* from a *juvenile Ten-Tails* makes for a small difference bud.

You're literally making it sound like the chakra Jigen took from Ten-Tails made a significant difference; quasi-synonymous to having the beast inside him.

As said, borrowing chakra from Ten-Tails isn't nearly the same as being its host.

Compared to borrowing small amounts of chakra, hosting the beast grants you an even greater power boost alongside abilities like regeneration, nature manipulation (like how Kaguya could control the environment in her dimensions or how Ten-Tails can cause natural disasters), chakra-arms, and stuff like Tailed Beast Bombs and Truth-Seeker Orbs.

Isshiki got none of the above simply because he only took small amounts of chakra from his juvenile Ten-Tails, presumably to keep Jigen's body from breaking down due to the defective nature of Jigen's body. It's doubtable if he even got to use the chakra he took from Ten-Tails in battle.


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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> That’s not how CoAT works though.
> 
> Even when Hagoromo created the Tailed Beasts, he created them out of Ten-Tails’ chakra. It’s not like he created them out of simply nothing.
> 
> ...



I can agree to a certain extent, but we were told COAT is creating things from nothingness, izanagi which was stated to be a watered down COAT was an ability that could alter reality to one's liking and making it real, while yang release uses physical energy to give life or vitality and whatnot. Banbutsu sozo was a combination of both... Altering reality and making life.

If memory serves me right toneri created a cage out of nothing


So yea statement wise hags should be able to create tsb out of nothing since it was stated that was what COAT is...


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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> So ? They get instantly shrunk into oblivion before the TSB user gets the chance to do anything with them, and the shrinking can be continuously applied.
> 
> Koji’s flames were eternally burning bud; didn’t prevent them from getting shrunk to oblivion.
> 
> ...



> isshiki doesn't shrink things into oblivion, they stop at microscopic level which hags can still manipulate and regrow to full size. Stop using the term oblivion because thats not how his shrinking ability work.

> eternally burning means nothing when koji doesn't have the ability to regrow them, he just summoned flames he had no control over like hags does for tsb. So bad example.

> again, isshiki isn't impaling hags when hags could see the rods and ST them.

So basically your argument is the rinnegan could not see microscopic isshiki ?? When i gave you an example of the tinnegan seeing at a microscopic level lmao, the rinnegan sees the shrunk down punk and ST trolls him.

Yea i am arguing for hags cuz he scales above jigen, we know what the rinnegan/tsb/yin yang CT are capable of... They were used by characters either faaar weaker, or faar in experiences than hags. So gets the scaling to everything done by regular rinnegan/tsb and CT


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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

I'm still gonna bring back the fact that naruto and sasuke were jobbing in their fight with jigen which led to their loss....


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## Wulffel (Jul 4, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> When Naruto similarly created a new eye for Kakashi; he said he took a part of Kakashi and then didn’t finish his statement because he only instinctively understood how what he did works


Naruto didn’t use creation of all things though, that’s just some application of Yin-Yang release just like JJs used some unnamed technique basing on yin and yang to nullify all ninjutsu. Hagoromo was said to have created many things with this jutsu along with tailed beasts, and it obviously requires chakra to create stuff, just like chakra is needed to create space distortions with Kamui.

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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

I dont see any reason why hags can't create a portal tbh... Thats purely yin based and he is above the likes of sasuke in yin manipulation.


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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> If memory serves me right toneri created a cage out of nothing


Correction – he created a cage *out of a TSB*.



Wulffel said:


> Naruto didn’t use creation of all things though.


Yes, I’m aware of that. I only included the Naruto example because it is similar in its application.



Wulffel said:


> Hagoromo was said to have created many things with this jutsu along with tailed beasts, and *it obviously requires chakra to create stuff*, just like chakra is needed to create space distortions with Kamui.


Not what I’m alluding to though, but I’ll develop upon this below...



uchihakil said:


> but we were told COAT is creating things from nothingness


Didn’t I just say Hagoromo creates shape from nothing with his ability ?



> Of course Hagoromo could create shape out of naught, but his imagination wasn’t the only input.



Just that his imagination (& chakra) aren’t the only input.

Think of it like this; Hagoromo’s CoAT works like this, and I’ll use the creation of the Tailed Beasts as an example

*Input:* own chakra (obviously) + imagination + Ten-Tails’ chakra

*Output:* Tailed Beasts

However, actual _mentifery_ would be like...

*Input:* your own energy/chakra + imagination

*Output:* Tailed Beasts

In other words, would Hagoromo have been able to create the Tailed Beasts by just imagining them (using his own energy of course) ?

*NOTE:* I’m especially using the Tailed Beasts’ example as they are living proof of Hagoromo’s CoAT. Anything else is incomplete information, as we don’t know precisely what else Hagoromo created if you get what I mean.



> So yea statement wise hags should be able to create tsb out of nothing since it was stated that was what COAT is...


Nope. That’s reaching.



uchihakil said:


> I dont see any reason why hags can't create a portal tbh... Thats purely yin based and he is above the likes of sasuke in yin manipulation.


That’s also reaching.

You’re literally speculating at this point, especially since the full capabilities and limitations of the ability are unknown as it has never been fully explored to begin with.

You can’t just assume stuff like that when we’ve never seen the ability in a combat application to begin with; taking it a bit too far here bud.


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## uchihakil (Jul 4, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> Correction – he created a cage *out of a TSB*.
> 
> 
> Yes, I’m aware of that. I only included the Naruto example because it is similar in its application.
> ...



Thing is i am not assuming, i am basing my arguments based on logic and scaling, go read the databook entry on COAT, it says creating stuff out of nothingness, blackzetsu was likely a by product of COAT. Reaching is me saying hags can use special abilities like amenotojikara/limbo, but opening a portal is something common and is yin affiliated which hags scales to, because he has the chakra and yin manipulation to use said technique.

If we are talking about feats ONLY then hags doesn't have combat feats so this matchup is useless, but via statements and scaling hags got this.


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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> > isshiki doesn't shrink things into oblivion, they stop at microscopic level which hags can still manipulate and regrow to full size. Stop using the term oblivion because thats not how his shrinking ability work.
> > eternally burning means nothing when koji doesn't have the ability to regrow them, he just summoned flames he had no control over like hags does for tsb. So bad example.


Fam. These are natural flames that keep on burning without directly manipulating them with your chakra. Isshiki in Jigen’s body kept on shrinking them, but they kept burning and overwhelmed him when Jigen’s body reached its limits. Even as they were reduced in size, they kept on burning.

Also, it’s like you’re assuming there’s no limit to the change in form and size expansion of the TSB.

It’s not an ETSB lol; there’s an obvious limit to what size a TSB can expand to.

He’ll just keep applying Sukunahikona so that they remain at a non-noticeable size. You’re reaching too much here, as you’ve done multiple times already.


> > again, isshiki isn't impaling hags when hags could see the rods and ST them.


Except when I meant implanting them, he doesn’t need even need to launch the rods; all he needs to do is touch his target and implant the microscopic rods on them.

Mere contact suffices.


*Spoiler*: __ 












> So basically your argument is the rinnegan could not see microscopic isshiki ?? When i gave you an example of the tinnegan seeing at a microscopic level lmao, the rinnegan sees the shrunk down punk and ST trolls him.


Bud. Isn’t that hard to understand ?

I said the Sharingan’s kinetic vision is what allowed Sasuke to track Isshiki.

Prove that Hagoromo has the Sharingan’s kinetic vision.

Plus ST gets avoided by merely teleporting away.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Altiora Night (Jul 4, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> Thing is i am not assuming, i am basing my arguments based on logic and scaling, go read the databook entry on COAT, it says creating stuff out of nothingness, blackzetsu was likely a by product of COAT. Reaching is me saying hags can use special abilities like amenotojikara/limbo, but opening a portal is something common and is yin affiliated which hags scales to, because he has the chakra and yin manipulation to use said technique.
> 
> If we are talking about feats ONLY then hags doesn't have combat feats so this matchup is useless, but via statements and scaling hags got this.


You’re not and haven’t addressed my points; pretty common to hear someone say they’re using logic and scaling, but that’s mainly used by people when they’ve literally ran out of arguments.

You’ve never ever seen Hagoromo fight for fuck’s sake; why do you think some of the earlier posts in this thread said he’s feat-less ? That’s because we’ve never even seen a proper fight of him LMAO.

Thing is, you don’t even know the full extent and limitations of CoAT.

Statements also say Amaterasu’s flames burn as hot as the sun, but if that were the case, its victims would be instantly disintegrated. Statements should be backed up.

Otherwise, you’re literally reaching with CoAT in this thread, and using fanfic arguments, especially in regards to creating TSBs and portals lol.

Reactions: Like 1


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## kayz (Jul 4, 2020)

Urggh, the horrors of arguing for and against a featless character. The wanking and underrating from each sides.


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## kayz (Jul 4, 2020)

I'll be real in this thread. It's obvious the writers of Boruto want to make Isshiki the strongest of all Otsutsuki we've seen till date.


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## Koro sensei (Jul 5, 2020)

MaruUchiha said:


> Sword Of Nunoboko pastes him while he's dealing with Animal Path, or Creation Of Everything turns him into a cheeseburger. Jigen's feats against Naruto and Sasuke don't impress me since they're professional jobbers in the Boruto era


You do know Isshiki can shrink himself and cuck all the animals right??


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## Koro sensei (Jul 5, 2020)

dergeist said:


> Prime Ishiti was scrubbed by sub par Kaguya, Hogaromo's power even as Asspullromo shat on her a second time. It's pretty obvious Hogaromo stands many tiers above the second rate fodder.
> 
> Stans and their blind fap, though


 You seem to be the fapper here


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## uchihakil (Jul 5, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> Fam. These are natural flames that keep on burning without directly manipulating them with your chakra. Isshiki in Jigen’s body kept on shrinking them, but they kept burning and overwhelmed him when Jigen’s body reached its limits. Even as they were reduced in size, they kept on burning.
> 
> Also, it’s like you’re assuming there’s no limit to the change in form and size expansion of the TSB.
> 
> ...




> you keep saying flames that keep burning like it means anything, koji does not manipulate the size of the flames, so its a moot point because the two techniques are not relatable. Stop comparing tsb with the eternal flame, they are NOT the same, why can't you see that??

> i didn't say there was no limit, but obito could make tsb thousands of times bigger, from a fist sized ball to a ball that dwarves gamakichi.

> he has to be constantly looking at the tsb for that to happen doesn't he?? Which wont be the case in a fight with an otsutsuki as strong as hags.

> you mean enhanced sight?? Something the rinnegan has shown as well xray vision, microscopic vision, seeing chakra etc etc, something common in both doujutsu, i believe hags with his kekkei morra rinnegan can see isshiki just fine.

But seeing as all our arguments are merely speculation and hypothesis regarding hags lets just agree to disagree.

Things i believe;

- Hags can see isshiki and track him just fine with the rinnegan, hell any doujutsu in the series should be capable of that IMO, after all the byakugan has better insight and rinnegan could even see through other planes of existence.

- hags can open a portal using COAT, having mastered the yin release and scaling above sasuke who could do the same, and many other otsutsuki's have shown the ability, momoshiki, urashiki etc, i see no reason hags can't.

- Hags can control the size of tsb and make it bigger if isshiki shrinks'em.

Kudos...


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## dergeist (Jul 5, 2020)

Koro sensei said:


> You seem to be the fapper here



Projecting again are we, lil fap boy


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## Koro sensei (Jul 5, 2020)

dergeist said:


> Projecting again are we, lil fap boy


Don't talk you sound stupid

You are the same person who thinks Itachi can beat bee in a sword fight

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Altiora Night (Jul 5, 2020)

uchihakil said:


> > you keep saying flames that keep burning like it means anything, koji does not manipulate the size of the flames, so its a moot point because the two techniques are not relatable. Stop comparing tsb with the eternal flame, they are NOT the same, why can't you see that??


TSBs are not the same as the immortal flames obviously, but what you’re trying to say in a TSB user expanding the orbs even after they’ve been shrunk is the same as what happened with the eternally burning flames of the Flaming Mountains. This is the fulcrum of the discussion here, and what I’m trying to get you to understand.

Isshiki shrunk them in Jigen’s body, but they kept increasing in size since they’re eternally burning, and they burn by themselves; you don’t even need to waste energy in expanding them.

Even if you shrink them, they’ll just keep on expanding in size *by themselves *because they are eternally burning. Yet, despite being eternally burning, Isshiki shrunk them to the point they were no more.

Come on, that isn’t hard to understand.



> > i didn't say there was no limit, but obito could make tsb thousands of times bigger, from a fist sized ball to a ball that dwarves gamakichi.


Yes, but there’s an ultimately a limit.

I repeat from what I said previously; this is not ETSB, which *continuously* expands.

Isshiki shrunk something that burns eternally, which is similar in principle to the ETSB’s continuous expansion. Meanwhile, a standard TSB has a size limit when it expands.

They are also weapons that can be discarded and control can be lost over them



> > he has to be constantly looking at the tsb for that to happen doesn't he?? Which wont be the case in a fight with an otsutsuki as strong as hags.


Too many options bud; from shrinking them, to teleporting them to another dimension.



uchihakil said:


> But seeing as all our arguments are merely speculation and hypothesis regarding hags lets just agree to disagree.
> 
> Things i believe.


Which is fine, but keep speculation to a minimum.

As I showed you in an earlier post, Isshiki himself is capable of creating stuff out of nothingness, using his imagination.

Yet, I’m not even using this ability in combat application and I’m acting as if it doesn’t even exist in such a battle scenario, meaning I’m not counting it in battles, because little is known about it as its limitations and full capabilities are still unknown.

You should do the same with CoAT.

My last post in this thread. Have a nice day.


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## dergeist (Jul 5, 2020)

Koro sensei said:


> In the Itachi vs bee thread that you were wanking Itachi inck



Link me the post, no doubt Itachi negs KB though, so..


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## MaruUchiha (Jul 5, 2020)

Koro sensei said:


> You do know Isshiki can shrink himself and cuck all the animals right??


That's neat. Still another thousand ways for Juubi Hagoromo to trash Jigen


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## MYGod000 (Jul 6, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> Aside from the vast amount of BS this guy came up with...
> 
> 
> Precision bud; small amounts of a juvenile Ten-Tails' chakra.
> ...




what does that Matter?  My point wasn't to show how much of the Ten Tails power he took. quite frankly, you can't even Tell me exactly how much power from the Ten tails that he took.




the Chapter points out that he has done this *more than once*,  it doesn't matter how small you think it is...the point is the power Jigen used to beat Naruto and sasuke was* Isshiki+Ten tails powers combined.*



Obito after Removing the Full Juubi from his body, and only had the Juubi's Juice  was still stomping BSM Kurama Naruto and EMS Sasuke with minimal Effort. Naruto only beat him because he emotionally got to Obito which gave Them a Window to remove what was left of the Juubi's essences from inside Obito.


The only time Otsutsuki have been a Real Threat is when they had the Juubi with them.  Hagoromo Stomps  Jigen, especially  if this is JJ Hagoromo.


If it was such an insignificant Difference then Jigen wouldn't have made the effort to go their wasting up chakra to grab Chakra to face Naruto and Sasuke. 



You're making claims you can't back up. I'm off the people who agree that Naruto and Sasuke are both  Weaker than when they were in their six path teens. 

Because of a simple logic of Revived Kaguya>>>>Kaguya from the Past VS Hagoromo>>>pre- Fruit Kaguya with Isshiki.


Now we see Adult Naruto and sasuke losing to someone Kaguya already beat before she fused with the Juubi, and Obtained the God Fruit. 


By portrayal of Otsutsuki Isshiki+ Baby Ten tails>>Naruto and Sasuke

Otsutsuki Kaguya+Full Ten tails>>>>>Naruto and Sasuke


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## sabre320 (Sep 21, 2020)

People comparing adult sasuke and naruto to prime Hagoromo as if they are equal are ignoring a few very important things to downplay him.

First :A deathbed age old hagoromos deadass ghost had chakra powerfull enough to make the kids into godtiers with no training, prime hagoromo was obviously superior to his dead ancient ass ghost.

Second: Hagoromo has both chakra halves fused in one body honed over far greater years then naruto or sasuke and was the original owner and true wielder of said power. A fusion of powers has always been shown to be far superior to its parts, as showcased when the juubi even when lacking the nine tails and eight tails fusing was astronomically stronger then the nine bijuu. The duos iso sussano even showcases this when it casually oneshots a golem that was overwhelming adult narutos rsm avatar and their fused iso sussano far outperformed their individual avatars against juubito.

Third ontop of the advantages stated above hagoromo then recieved a freaking juubi jin boost ontop.......the dude who is already a perfect fusion of naruto and sasukes powers has a prime juubi powerup ontop.

Then comes his mastery over the rinnegan and the six paths, the dude was the original sage of the sixpaths the closest thing to a god in the verse dude has the hax and abilities to casually break rules such as death and has control over soul manipulation to the extent manages to manifest himself back from dead casually vessel be damned ,revives naruto and sasuke and passes on power enough to overwhelm juubidara and seals potent enough to seal kaguya in a ancient ghost state  . He posseses both the sun and moon seals in both hands and posseses the rikudo ct the ultimate trump card in the manga. Dude legit has the greatest hax in the manga in creation of all things which is basically described as akin to matter manipulation and is basically the rikudo version of izanagi. He essentially played god and created sentient life with individual unique souls easily splitting the full tentails into the nine intelligent creatures while on his deathbed. 

Onto the matchup we honestly dont know how iishiki would scale to hagoromo. He was defeated by pre fruit kaguya but that may have been a sneakattack. Non Jin hagoromo and hamura defeated prime kaguya but this was before hamura even awakened the tenseigan and hagoromo the juubis power meaning they grew far stronger. Honestly depending on the details that will be revealed regarding iishikis defeat by kaguya hagoromo could be superior if kaguya straight up overwhelmed iishiki in a fight pre fruit, or It could go either way based on feats now. Hagoromo posseses greater power even in base then the duo who were easily beaten,should have a st technique as shown by each and every ootsuki, has a prime juubis vitality and endurance ontop and posseses the oneshot gameender in the rikudo ct and all ootsukis . In my opinion he definitely has the tools to win, but considering the way borutos plot is going I believe IIshiki will be shown to be a threat equal or beyond kaguya considering sasukes remarks of kinhiki and momo.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Animegoin (Sep 21, 2020)

So dunce ass “fans” are really out here believing that the Adult Fate Bros >> Hags, when factually the former aren’t even stronger than their younger selves? The nerve, the audacity of these mfs to type out their bs with a straight face is honestly comical.


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## WorldsStrongest (Sep 21, 2020)

Isshiki gets sealed pretty easily

Reactions: Like 1


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## Danyx (Dec 2, 2020)

Here we go 

Hagoromo without being TTJ was able to fight a Non nerfed Kaguya and Juubi for months with the help of Hamura of course but he was there only to close the power gap as Hamura admitted himself Hagoromo is stronger, this must mean that Hagaromo was somewhat comparable to his mother, strong enough so that he didn't get blitzed and fodderized.

Now, it is said that Those who awaken Six Paths Senjutsu are able to wield Truth-Seeking Orbs or by becoming the jinchūriki of the Ten-Tails, HOWEVER Hagoromo  was so strong and had so potent chakra, that he could create truth seeking orbs even without being the Juubi jinchuriki.

Before I go further on, Lol to those who say Hagoromo being Madara level, I know Hagoromo himself said Madara is getting close to him, BUT he never said he surpassed him. And that was Base Hagoromo which means Base Hagoromo > Rikudou Madara.

SPSM base Naruto scared the living shit out of Madara with his Lava Style Rasenshuriken and was able to curb Pre God Tree Juubidara like nothing and all that from the ghostly chakra of Hagoromo.

Teen rinnegan Sasuke was already giving troubles to Juubidara, he countered most of his abilities, Infinite Tsukuyomi (countered by his rinnegan), Limbo (Sasuke can see them and is too fast for them because of Ameno and he can damage them as he got six paths chakra), Chibaku Tensei (Sasuke’s PS susanoo slashed through them like butter and Naruto pulverised them with his Bijuu Rasenshurikens), that was Naruto and Sasuke, now TTJ Hagoromo is definitely beyond Six Paths Madara and by a far margin. Hagoromo had many divine powers which Madara didn’t.



Alright now let's see the type of boost the Juubi has given others. The Juubi gave Obito a boost from far below Hashirama to the man saying that Juubito was stronger than him. My god that's a big boost. It also makes it user immune to anything that isn't senjustu,or Taijutsu. Alright so we know that Hagoromo would be massively stronger than he was when he fought Kaguya. He is now immune to anything that isn't senjutsu or Taijutsu based. 

Hagoromo as TTJ was an absolute monster, he was literally able to manipulate reality at this stage, he split Ten Tails, created the moon, had the sword of nunoboko, created 9 bijuu from nothing more than chakra, and people say Madara is like him in terms of power, lol again,now show me Madara doing all that.



Now I know pure stat to stat Juubi Hagoromo is featless, BUT based on what we have in anime and manga so far it isn’t hard to deduce Hagaromo is stronger than Isshiki based on the fact Hagaromo as old as a ghost not close to full power gave Naruto and Sasuke half of his chakra and the seals for Rikudou Chibaku Tensei to seal Kaguya and all by himself and he did not need Hamura to give them the seals, this Chakra made them go from below Sage Madara to cucking one eyed Madara. The boost from his old ass weak chakra was so enormous, that they went to near the top of the verse as adults. 

Hagoromo as a ghostly appearance managed to summon the souls of all other dead kage to summon back team 7 , Madara and all bijuu from Kaguya’s dimension, imagine what he can do if he were alive, and that was his base form.



Now let’s summarize, TTJ Hagoromo is immune to anything which isn’t taijutsu or senjutsu. Isshiki’s taijutsu isn’t putting Hagoromo down, because if it takes simple taijutsu to defeat a legendary sage then this is the biggest bs ever, why the hell does everyone needs chakra then? Also Isshiki does not have any senjutsu powers either, even if he did, that wouldn’t be much of a trouble, yes the attack won’t get nullified but it can be blocked as Obito blocked the oil attack from Naruto’s summoned frog before the frog disappeared with his shield made out of TSO, that was Obito, Hagoromo is clearly beyond that level of defence. 

 Now coming to Isshiki, you may say:



1: Isshiki can travel dimensions, it isn’t hard to deduce so can Hagoromo because you think Kaguya wouldn’t have transported them when he was fighting her with Hamura? How do you think they survived and got out of there? I am not saying of course it was like that since this never happened, but based on what we saw her do to Naruto and Sasuke she could have replicated the same scenario to Hagoromo and Hamura, otherwise why wouldn’t she if she wanted to kill them? Also Hagoromo was the one who gave Sasuke the chakra enabling him to awaken Rinnegan, and we all know what Sasuke’s Rinnegan can do regarding dimensions, so I don’t see why Hagoromo wouldn’t be able to do the same, even on a more advanced level.



2: Isshiki can shrink anything Hagoromo throws at him, true, BUT Hagoromo can counter all Isshiki has in return with his COAT (Creation of All Things Technique) technique, he literally shapes the object with yin release and gives life to it with yang release and transform it to whatever he wants, this is why he can manipulate reality,exactly the way how the bijuu were created, and how Naruto was able to save Guy from death from opening the 8th gate, Guy was a human so he had a form, Naruto had the yang symbol and restored his life back. (A little description of how the technique works)



3: Isshiki can seal Hagoromo just like he did to Naruto in manga, well guess what, COAT technique makes that sealing vessel look like a cake. If that does not satisfy you then I doubt Hagoromo would have troubles from such a low level sealing technique when he by himself (without Hamura) gave Naruto and Sasuke the seals for the strongest sealing technique so far, strong enough to seal Kaguya herself for a second time.



4: Isshiki has the Juubi, sorry again but that Juubi specimen would be split but this time it will be turned into 9 cherries.



5: Isshiki can absorb any technique, well guess what Kaguya was able as well and she lost to the two brothers, but it was a fair fight as that was 2 vs 2 (Kaguya and Juubi) and that was PRIOR to Hagoromo becoming TTJ, also Hagoromo can warp reality, no explanation required to say which is superior.



6:  But Isshiki isn’t full power, and assuming Juubi doesn’t get erased by Hagoromo it is absorbed by Isshiki, so to make it fair in the end, TTJ Isshiki vs TTJ Hagoromo, well even that wouldn’t help Isshiki as being TTJ does not grant you the ability to manipulate reality, this was only manifested again by Hagoromo which shows how powerful he actually was, otherwise Madara and Obito would have had reality manipulation as well, which they didn’t.



What am I even talking about, all Hagoromo needs to do is touch Isshiki and he’s gone, a Six Paths Chibaku Tensei will seal him, it worked on Kaguya and it was never stated Isshiki is immune to it so it will work on him too. (But Hagoromo in the end will still enjoy the cake with 9 cherries at the top   given the above scenario)



Now who do you think who wins, a guy who can manipulate reality or someone which stores glasses of wine in his who knows where place and makes black cubes look like he’s playing minecraft, like dafuq is that.



TTJ Hagoromo at his peak is the strongest being in Naruto/Boruto verse and his powers are unmatched, this is indisputable, he will absolutely obliterate Kaguya, Isshiki and anyone else for that matter.

Again, this is just based on what we saw and have in the anime and manga, he could be even stronger than that, we don’t know what all his feats are, him being weaker wouldn’t make any sense because of everything mentioned above. 
He is called So6P for a reason.


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## Yumi Zoro (Dec 2, 2020)

Isshiki>>>>>>>>>>>>Kaguya>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hagoromo as per Canon.


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## Danyx (Dec 2, 2020)

redboy776 said:


> Isshiki>>>>>>>>>>>>Kaguya>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hagoromo as per Canon.


TTJ Hagoromo surpassed Kaguya, he literally survived her when she had the juubi

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Trojan (Dec 2, 2020)

Danyx said:


> TTJ Hagoromo surpassed Kaguya, he literally survived her when she had the juubi


he fought her as the Juubi, he never fought Kaguya herself.

His feat is below  RT 1-eye Madara.


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## Danyx (Dec 2, 2020)

New Folder said:


> he fought her as the Juubi, he never fought Kaguya herself.
> 
> His feat is below  RT 1-eye Madara.


Lol, that juubi was a combination of Kaguya and God tree,


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## Danyx (Dec 2, 2020)

Danyx said:


> Lol, that juubi was a combination of Kaguya and God tree,


He has the power to turn imagination into reality as TTJ, unless you tell me a Naruto character which has feats beyond that , there ain’t anyone who beats him

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Rinnegan Zetsu (Dec 2, 2020)

All I'm gonna say is this: Izanagi is based off of COAT, and Izanagi lets the user rewrite their death. COAT doesn't leave the user blind, and can be used more than once. Hagoromo used COAT while he was dying, and created the tailed beasts. Imagine what a healthy Hagoromo could do with COAT. It should be extremely difficult to defeat, let alone kill Hagoromo.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Altiora Night (Dec 2, 2020)

Izanagi is a genjutsu that the user casts on themselves and turns whatever misfortune that befell upon them into a mere illusion.

Izanagi is at its root a *genjutsu* and is stated to be the practical application of CoAT.

*Key words:* PRACTICAL APPLICATION.

There is little information, backed with zero combat applications of CoAT to suggest it's capable of doing what people think it does.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Danyx (Dec 2, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> Izanagi is a genjutsu that the user casts on themselves and turns whatever misfortune that befell upon them into a mere illusion.
> 
> Izanagi is at its root a *genjutsu* and is stated to be the practical application of CoAT.
> 
> ...


Little information and zero application? He literally split ten tails and created all 9 bijuu with it and the moon to, this is more than enough. He turns imagination into reality with that technique.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Altiora Night (Dec 2, 2020)

Danyx said:


> Little information and zero application? He literally split ten tails and created all 9 bijuu with it and the moon to, this is more than enough. He turns imagination into reality with that technique.


Still little information backed with zero combat applications champ. Read carefully.

He created the Tailed Beasts *out of* the Ten-Tails using CoAT. He didn't create them out of literally nothing with just his imagination as input.

You don't seem to understand how *mentifery* (the ability to turn your imagination into reality) works.

He and his brother created the moon using Six Paths — Chibaku Tensei. That's not CoAT.

Show actual on-panel feats of CoAT in a *combat application*.

Go on. Good luck as well.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Danyx (Dec 2, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> Still little information backed with zero combat applications champ. Read carefully.
> 
> He created the Tailed Beasts *out of* the Ten-Tails using CoAT. He didn't create them out of literally nothing with just his imagination as input.
> 
> ...


Too bad I can’t post pictures
Obito’s words from manga in his battle against Konan: “By administering imagination and the spiritual energy which forms the basis of Yin power, he would create shape and form from NOTHINGNESS,
By administering vitality and the physical energy which forms the basis of Yang power, he would breathe life into that form”
Now, you can’t go against manga, it’s what the author said, the word NOTHINGNESS persists there, if the author said NOTHINGNESS then NOTHINGNESS remains. 
Good luck denying that, ohh wait you can’t do it because going against the author makes all your arguments invalid, but good luck anyway and have a nice day.


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## Danyx (Dec 2, 2020)

redboy776 said:


> Well Naruto and Sasuke together are basically better than Hagoromo himself. So Hagoromo go down the same way.
> 
> Hagoromo dont even posess Space Time technique so Jigen could just:
> 
> ...


Oohh man, All who say Naruto and Sasuke being stronger than Hagoromo are clearly out of their minds, the chakra he gave them from his old ass ghostly projection literally boosted them in Shippuden and they went nearly to the top of the verse in Boruto, he also gave them the symbols to seal Kaguya for the SECOND time, now coming to Isshiki:
You said: 
-he drops Hagoromo into dimension, lol, Hagoromo gave Sasuke his chakra which enabled him to awaken Rinnegan and we all now what Sasuke’s rinnegan can do regarding dimensions, Isshiki mentioned he is annoyed by that rinnegan and wanted to get rid of Sasuke first, now I don’t see why Hagoromo wouldn’t be able to travel dimensions, even on a more advanced level, how can a derivative power be stronger than its original source
- According to what we have in anime and manga a TTJ is immune to anything except taijutsu and senjutsu, now Isshiki’s taijutsu isn’t putting Hagoromo down, because if it takes simple taijutsu to defeat a god tier legendary sage then this is the biggest bs ever, Isshiki does not have any senjutsu power so he could stick his rods in his ass cause they ain’t gonna do any damage
-seal Hagoromo? it’s gonna be exactly the opposite, all Hagoromo needs to do is touch him and he’s gone, a Six Paths Chibaku Tensei will work on him, it worked on Kaguya twice and it was never stated Isshiki is immune to it


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## Altiora Night (Dec 3, 2020)

Danyx said:


> Too bad I can’t post pictures
> Obito’s words from manga in his battle against Konan: “By administering imagination and the spiritual energy which forms the basis of Yin power, he would create shape and form from NOTHINGNESS,
> By administering vitality and the physical energy which forms the basis of Yang power, he would breathe life into that form”
> Now, you can’t go against manga, it’s what the author said, the word NOTHINGNESS persists there, if the author said NOTHINGNESS then NOTHINGNESS remains.
> Good luck denying that, ohh wait you can’t do it because going against the author makes all your arguments invalid, but good luck anyway and have a nice day.


Yeah, too bad you can't post pictures because there are none in terms of *combat applications*.

This is what I've been asking from the start, which you seemingly didn't get.

You're wanking the shit out of an individual and his ability that you've never seen fight for more than two to three panels except in your imagination.

However I'll ask you again.

*Show on-panel feats of Hagoromo using CoAT in a fight.*

Feats that have nothing to do outside of battle like creating the Tailed Beasts.

Also, spare me the BS that creating the moon is a result of using CoAT when it wasn't.


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## Danyx (Dec 3, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> Yeah, too bad you can't post pictures because there are none in terms of *combat applications*.
> 
> This is what I've been asking from the start, which you seemingly didn't get.
> 
> ...


What part of ‘he would create shape and form from nothing and breath life into it don’t you get’ ? I’m not wanking shit, I am going by what the author said, the fact it was stated means he can do it, otherwise I wouldn’t be talking to you, you are actually wanking shit with your practical applications when the answer is directly in front of you. End of discussion.


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## Altiora Night (Dec 3, 2020)

Danyx said:


> What part of ‘he would create shape and form from nothing and breath life into it don’t you get’ ? I’m not wanking shit, I am going by what the author said, the fact it was stated means he can do it, otherwise I wouldn’t be talking to you, you are actually wanking shit with your practical applications when the answer is directly in front of you. End of discussion.


Everyone and their grandma knows what Obito said to Konan son.

I asked for actual on-panel feats of a *combat application* of Hagoromo's use of CoAT in battle, but you seemingly couldn't provide any.

Alright; concession accepted buddy.


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## Sage King (Dec 3, 2020)

Teen godruto was ½ Hagoromo's power.
Guess who Sasuke was compared to when he merged his PS with Bijuu chakra to create the BPS?
Ishikki was being massacred by Baryon mode.

godruto>>>>>>>>>>>Ishikki.

In advance:::::::::::;

thousand bunshins>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>5 bunshins

fighting limbo using sensory abilities alone>>>>>>>>>>>>> being clowned by a shrunken opponent

tanking six path chidori>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pierced by kusanagi, delta's legs.

Fighting Juudara, Kaguya, Sasuke non stop>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>panting after an exchange of rasengans and a couple of blows

Bijuu rasenshurikans, magnet rasengan, gudodama(rasenshurikans, nullifying), Boil release, Chakra arms( stalemating vacuum palms for a bit in clash)>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Rasengans, chakra arms

Kurama avatar clones( taking hits from BPS)>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1 kurama avatar (ravaged by Jigen who couldn't kill koji, Sasuke).

Ashura mode>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Baryon mode.

godruto(teen)>>>>>>>>>>>>>garbageruto(Hokage)

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## Danyx (Dec 3, 2020)

Oh so this is how you wanna play, so be it, first of all ‘son’ you clearly did not get what Obito said to Konan, because you still ask your shit about practical applications, it’s not like I said it, if that were the case it would make sense for you to ask for proof to confirm it, those are the words the author HIMSELF mentioned:  ‘he can do it from nothingness’ it does not matter whether it’s in combat or not, the fact is HE CAN DO IT and there isn’t anyone better who knows about the show other than the author himself, so if you want to deny what he says then you might as well go to that grandma of yours to seek help and ask her to tell you more fairytales at night. Good luck- ‘son’


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## Danyx (Dec 3, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> Everyone and their grandma knows what Obito said to Konan son.
> 
> I asked for actual on-panel feats of a *combat application* of Hagoromo's use of CoAT in battle, but you seemingly couldn't provide any.
> 
> Alright; concession accepted buddy.


Oh so this is how you wanna play, so be it, first of all ‘son’ you clearly did not get what Obito said to Konan, because you still ask your shit about practical applications, it’s not like I said it, if that were the case it would make sense for you to ask for proof to confirm it, those are the words the author HIMSELF mentioned: ‘he can do it from nothingness’ it does not matter whether it’s in combat or not, the fact is HE CAN DO IT and there isn’t anyone better who knows about the show other than the author himself, so if you want to deny what he says then you might as well go to that grandma of yours to seek help and ask her to tell you more fairytales at night. Good luck- ‘son’


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## Altiora Night (Dec 3, 2020)

Danyx said:


> Oh so this is how you wanna play, so be it, first of all ‘son’ you clearly did not get what Obito said to Konan, because you still ask your shit about practical applications, it’s not like I said it, if that were the case it would make sense for you to ask for proof to confirm it, those are the words the author HIMSELF mentioned:  ‘he can do it from nothingness’ it does not matter whether it’s in combat or not, the fact is HE CAN DO IT and there isn’t anyone better who knows about the show other than the author himself, so if you want to deny what he says then you might as well go to that grandma of yours to seek help and ask her to tell you more fairytales at night. Good luck- ‘son’


Ya done goofin' already ?

As I said, everyone and their grandma knows about what Obito said to Konan.

We all know what he said. We all know about the creating shape out of nothing and instilling life into it yada yada.

You're talking of CoAT as an ability much like Gremmy's The Visionary in Bleach where the guy could even imagine his opponent's bones turning into freaking cookies even though you have no on-panel feats of Hagoromo using CoAT *IN BATTLE* to back your shit up.

See where I'm getting at ? Yeah ? No ?

*I asked for on-panel feats of Hagoromo using CoAT in an actual fight.*

What did you do ? Not only did you not provide any scans of Hagoromo using CoAT in a fight as I asked you, but you also regurgitated the BS that Hagoromo created the freaking moon with CoAT when in reality he and his brother created the moon using Six Paths — Chibaku Tensei.



Now do us a favor and do your homework son.

Go back to re-reading the freaking manga.

Try better next time kiddo.


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## Architect (Dec 3, 2020)

Portion of Hago's ghost's power could power up Naruto and Sasuke to Jojodara level. While base Momoshiki was roughly on Darui's level physically and Kinshiki struggled with Kurotsuchi and Chojuro. I don't see why Isshiki should be leagues above other base Otsusuki (outside of his special abilities, but even then...not leagues above probably)
Hago slaps.
P.S. IMO, Hago, born to Kaguya/Juubi, inhereted the power of JJ/Kaguya/Juubi/Six path chakra/whatever upon his birth and as an adult was >>> base pre fruit Kaguya.

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## Danyx (Dec 3, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> Ya done goofin' already ?
> 
> As I said, everyone and their grandma knows about what Obito said to Konan.
> 
> ...


It seems you are the one who isn’t done goofing, I know he created the moon with six paths chibaku tensei, all I said about coat was about the tailed beasts, now what did you do this time? Not only you still requested practical applications but again you seem to not understand what the author said, it’s not that I take coat being an ability as that Gremmy of yours from bleach, it’s literally what the author said about it and if you say you’re so good at homework then you should know that there aren’t any applications of coat in battle BUT that does not mean he can’t do it BECAUSE of the statement made by the author in the manga and this is the entire point I’m making which you seem again to not understand.


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## Altiora Night (Dec 3, 2020)

Danyx said:


> I know he created the moon with six paths chibaku tensei


No you didn't.

Check your own shit.



Danyx said:


> Little information and zero application? *He literally split ten tails and created all 9 bijuu with it and the moon to, this is more than enough.* He turns imagination into reality with that technique.


So what now ? You literally said he created the moon with CoAT.

So again, no on-panel feats of Hagoromo using CoAT in battle ?

Good. I'm done with you. See ya bud.


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## Danyx (Dec 3, 2020)

Altiora Night said:


> No you didn't.
> 
> Check your own shit.
> 
> ...


Okay, the moon being created with coat was my bad satisfied now? Also you did not read what I said
If *you’re so good at homework then you should know*_* that there aren’t any applications of coat in battle BUT *_that does not mean he can’t do it BECAUSE of the statement made by the author in the manga and this is the entire point I’m making which you seem again to not understand.


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## Kai (Dec 3, 2020)

Rinnegan Zetsu said:


> Hagoromo used COAT while he was dying, and created the tailed beasts. Imagine what a healthy Hagoromo could do with COAT. It should be extremely difficult to defeat, let alone kill Hagoromo.


Yin Kurama compared Sasuke merging all Biju chakra into one to Hagoromo using COAT to create the Biju, and he even stated the skill was on Hagoromo's level.

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## Danyx (Dec 3, 2020)

Kai said:


> Yin Kurama compared Sasuke merging all Biju chakra into one to Hagoromo using COAT to create the Biju, and he even stated the skill was on Hagoromo's level.


Sasuke did half of what Hagoromo did with CoAT, nothing living was created, one of Hagoromo’s arms contains more power than Sasuke as a whole so reconsider when you compare Sasuke with Hagoromo, he literally boosted them in shippuden and they went from his old ass ghostly projection chakra to nearly top of the verse as adults, a derivative power can’t be stronger than its original source,


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## Kai (Dec 3, 2020)

Danyx said:


> Sasuke did half of what Hagoromo did with CoAT, nothing living was created, one of Hagoromo’s arms contains more power than Sasuke as a whole so reconsider when you compare Sasuke with Hagoromo, he literally boosted them in shippuden and they went from his old ass ghostly projection chakra to nearly top of the verse as adults, a derivative power can’t be stronger than its original source,


Yin Kurama: "It's like Six Paths geezer's level. Well except he's doing the reverse thing."

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## Danyx (Dec 3, 2020)

Kai said:


> Yin Kurama: "It's like Six Paths geezer's level. Well except he's doing the reverse thing."


That does not make Sasuke stronger than him, it’s simple logic, Hagoromo is regarded a legend in Narutoverse, Sasuke definitely ain’t beating Hagoromo, why? Because he created the tailed beasts, split juubi, created the moon, had the sword of nunoboko which according to Obito , the sage used it to shape the world, all these divine powers, there is no way Sasuke and Naruto are stronger than him, it still amazes me people actually believe that, Sasuke and Naruto are what they are literally because of Hagoromo


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## Arles Celes (Dec 3, 2020)

sabre320 said:


> People comparing adult sasuke and naruto to prime Hagoromo as if they are equal are ignoring a few very important things to downplay him.
> 
> First :A deathbed age old hagoromos deadass ghost had chakra powerfull enough to make the kids into godtiers with no training, prime hagoromo was obviously superior to his dead ancient ass ghost.


I do not think that being an old ghost or a young ghost makes a difference tbh. The guy is a chakra being where the body is basically a discarded shell.

Ghost Obito could empower Kakashi to the point he could be a problem to Kaguya. The same Obito who merely stole some of Juudara's chakra. So if anything becoming a chakra ghost makes one stronger.

We also never know Hago's "prime" as we do not know when he received the Yin seal from his bro. However, we do know that Hamura was an old guy when he died by how we see his ghost appearing to Hinata in the Last.

So its unlikely that a young Juubi Jin Hago with both sun and moon seals ever existed.



sabre320 said:


> Second: Hagoromo has both chakra halves fused in one body honed over far greater years then naruto or sasuke and was the original owner and true wielder of said power. A fusion of powers has always been shown to be far superior to its parts, as showcased when the juubi even when lacking the nine tails and eight tails fusing was astronomically stronger then the nine bijuu. The duos iso sussano even showcases this when it casually oneshots a golem that was overwhelming adult narutos rsm avatar and their fused iso sussano far outperformed their individual avatars against juubito.


Nah, a fusion of powers is not superior. Edo Madara with Hashi's power was not stronger than Hashi. Roughly equal.

Juubi Madara had both the Rinnegan and RSM as he told to the fate bros but when he fought them the ones delivering the asskicking were the fate bros.

Juubi is stronger than the other bijuus in any form since it has Six Path chakra while the other bijuus don't. Its basically a part of Kaguya herself.

Fate bros were so strong together because teamwork/cooperation > no teamwork/cooperation.


sabre320 said:


> sabre320 said:
> 
> 
> > Third ontop of the advantages stated above hagoromo then recieved a freaking juubi jin boost ontop.......the dude who is already a perfect fusion of naruto and sasukes powers has a prime juubi powerup ontop.


Hago already has the powers that one gets by becoming a Juubi Jin (RSM) as was the case with Obito and Madara. All he gets is plenty of chakra at his disposal. A bigger chakra tank so to speak




sabre320 said:


> Then comes his mastery over the rinnegan and the six paths, the dude was the original sage of the sixpaths the closest thing to a god in the verse dude has the hax and abilities to casually break rules such as death and has control over soul manipulation to the extent manages to manifest himself back from dead casually vessel be damned ,revives naruto and sasuke and passes on power enough to overwhelm juubidara and seals potent enough to seal kaguya in a ancient ghost state  . He posseses both the sun and moon seals in both hands and posseses the rikudo ct the ultimate trump card in the manga. Dude legit has the greatest hax in the manga in creation of all things which is basically described as akin to matter manipulation and is basically the rikudo version of izanagi. He essentially played god and created sentient life with individual unique souls easily splitting the full tentails into the nine intelligent creatures while on his deathbed.


In this manga one learns as fast as the plot demands. Naruto likely learned all RSM stuff that Hago knew by the time he fought Kaguya while Sasuke mastered all he needed to by the time he became an adult. Madara knew all about Six Path powers while he was an old man and yet when he returned to life as a Juubi Jin his greater expertise and experience hardly gave him an advantage over fate bros.





Danyx said:


> Here we go
> 
> Hagoromo without being TTJ was able to fight a Non nerfed Kaguya and Juubi for months with the help of Hamura of course but he was there only to close the power gap as Hamura admitted himself Hagoromo is stronger, this must mean that Hagaromo was somewhat comparable to his mother, strong enough so that he didn't get blitzed and fodderized.
> 
> ...


Where is it said that ghost Hago being old affects his power negatively?

Hagos' freat is splitting Juubi's chakra was compared to Sasuke's feat of BPS. Not bad but nothing Jigen level I think.




Danyx said:


> Danyx said:
> 
> 
> > Now let’s summarize, TTJ Hagoromo is immune to anything which isn’t taijutsu or senjutsu. Isshiki’s taijutsu isn’t putting Hagoromo down, because if it takes simple taijutsu to defeat a legendary sage then this is the biggest bs ever, why the hell does everyone needs chakra then?


That sounds like "Hago is so legendary that he should never lose to anthing"

And then we have Jigen kicking the guys who received all of Hago's power with ease.

No one is immune to a taijutsu beating as long as the opponent got higher stats.


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## Danyx (Dec 3, 2020)

Arles Celes said:


> I do not think that being an old ghost or a young ghost makes a difference tbh. The guy is a chakra being where the body is basically a discarded shell.
> 
> Ghost Obito could empower Kakashi to the point he could be a problem to Kaguya. The same Obito who merely stole some of Juudara's chakra. So if anything becoming a chakra ghost makes one stronger.
> 
> ...


I did not say he is immune to taijutsu, it’s just that what we have so far from Isshiki’s taijutsu it is very unlikely that will put Hagoromo down, Naruto in Baryon mode kept with Isshiki in taijutsu and 95% of Naruto’s power comes from Hagoromo, Kurama was created by Hagoromo, his boost from shippuden comes from Hagoromo, same applies for Sasuke’s rinnegan and all else he has gained, now I am talking about TTJ Hagoromo, base Hagoromo was already god tier, add TT on top of that and it’s overkill, Kurama himself said he wouldn’t stand a chance against TT, what makes you think a TTJ wouldn’t have a baryon or a fkin supernova mode which will obliterate anyone in sight


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## Arles Celes (Dec 3, 2020)

Danyx said:


> I did not say he is immune to taijutsu, it’s just that what we have so far from Isshiki’s taijutsu it is very unlikely that will put Hagoromo down, Naruto in Baryon mode kept with Isshiki in taijutsu and 95% of Naruto’s power comes from Hagoromo, Kurama was created by Hagoromo, his boost from shippuden comes from Hagoromo, same applies for Sasuke’s rinnegan and all else he has gained, now I am talking about TTJ Hagoromo, base Hagoromo was already god tier, add TT on top of that and it’s overkill, Kurama himself said he wouldn’t stand a chance against TT, what makes you think a TTJ wouldn’t have a baryon or a fkin supernova mode which will obliterate anyone in sight


Teen RSM Naruto tired from the War was strong enough in taijutsu to stand up alone against kaguya for a long while. Even after Kaguya decided to kill him. He never looked as if he was absolutely hopeless against her with a suicide jutsu to save his ass. And Kaguya is Hago's superior against whom he needed his bros help.

Adult RSM Naruto got the remaining half of Kurama and wasn't tired when facing jigen. Still lost despite having an Adult Sasuke with greater dojutsu experience that the one who fought Kaguya.

Isshiki is above Jigen as stated in the manga.

As for Baryon it is Kurama's version of the 8th Gate by giving him power waaaaay above his normal tier.

And Kurama was not exactly "created" by Hago. He was just shaped into his form from Juubi's chakra. Hago did not create Kurama out of nowhere with his own power. Same as to how Sasuke does not create BPS sans bijuu chakra. No chakra power source means no tool for Creation of All Things stuff.

All we know about Hago is that him giving his full power empowered teen Naruto and Sasuke a lot. But even their adult versions with said power still lost handily to Jigen who is below Isshiki. So how Hago wins now unless we give him fanfic powers that he never displayed?

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## Danyx (Dec 3, 2020)

Arles Celes said:


> Teen RSM Naruto tired from the War was strong enough in taijutsu to stand up alone against kaguya for a long while. Even after Kaguya decided to kill him. He never looked as if he was absolutely hopeless against her with a suicide jutsu to save his ass. And Kaguya is Hago's superior against whom he needed his bros help.
> 
> Adult RSM Naruto got the remaining half of Kurama and wasn't tired when facing jigen. Still lost despite having an Adult Sasuke with greater dojutsu experience that the one who fought Kaguya.
> 
> ...


‘As for Baryon it is Kurama's version of the 8th Gate by giving him power waaaaay above his normal tier.’ Now Kurama is literally part of TT just like the other tailed beasts, what makes you think a TT wouldn’t have the so called 8th gate version to power up his Jinchuuriki to give him a boost in order to annihilate everything, if Kurama’s boost which is part of TT was able to reduce Isshiki’s lifespan from hours to minutes just by getting some hits on him, then a baryon mode of TT would reduce Isshiki’s life from minutes to nanoseconds, because TT> Kurama


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## Arles Celes (Dec 3, 2020)

Danyx said:


> ‘As for Baryon it is Kurama's version of the 8th Gate by giving him power waaaaay above his normal tier.’ Now Kurama is literally part of TT just like the other tailed beasts, what makes you think a TT wouldn’t have the so called 8th gate version to power up his Jinchuuriki to give him a boost in order to annihilate everything, if Kurama’s boost which is part of TT was able to reduce Isshiki’s lifespan from hours to minutes just by getting some hits on him, then a baryon mode of TT would reduce Isshiki’s life from minutes to nanoseconds, because TT> Kurama


Juubi is just a mindless beast man.

A weaker and uglier Kaguya without the ability to speak.

You might as well argue that it can use Indra Arrow since BPS made from the chakra of all bijuus can do so. Or you could argue that it can use Shinra Tensei or Preta since it got a Rinnegan of sort.

Kurama is far smarter and lived long enough to learn some new stuff that Juubi never could. Its as simple as that.

A mere jounin like Guy with the 8th Gate was pressuring A Juubi Jin who even sans Juubi was Hokage level. Juubi is no longer so godlike especially when compared to other "gods".

Just a chakra fruit fertilizer nowadays.

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## Danyx (Dec 3, 2020)

Arles Celes said:


> Juubi is just a mindless beast man.
> 
> A weaker and uglier Kaguya without the ability to speak.
> 
> ...


Ooh man, Hagoromo himself stated that if Juubi were to be revived it would mean the end of the world, Kurama himself stated again he’d stand no chance against him, now you have right there two statements which can’t be denied. In the 4th great ninja war Juubi with just portions of Gyuki and Kurama’s chakra was overwhelming and deflecting their bijuudamas with a flick of his fingers, it does not matter for how long Kurama lived or how many things he knows, one simple thing is clear, a TT jinchuriki is stronger than a 9 tails jinchuuriki, why is it so hard to understand that? Literally 10>9 it’s not advanced maths here

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## My Honor (Dec 5, 2020)

Hagoromo annihilates this fodder.

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## MYGod000 (Dec 5, 2020)

Hagoromo destroys Isshiki and Jigen.  The only thing you could argue is Physical Strength for Isshiki side, While Hagoromo is far More powerful.

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## Sage King (Dec 5, 2020)

MYGod000 said:


> Hagoromo destroys Isshiki and Jigen.  The only thing you could argue is Physical Strength for Isshiki side, While Hagoromo is far More powerful.



What strength? lol.
Hagoromo= godruto+ teen Sasuke.
He has the body of godruto except he has Juubi as his pet.
Ishikki hits tickles him at best.

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## MYGod000 (Dec 6, 2020)

Sage King said:


> What strength? lol.
> Hagoromo= godruto+ teen Sasuke.
> He has the body of godruto except he has Juubi as his pet.
> Ishikki hits tickles him at best.



Jigen body couldn't handle Isshiki powers, it was stated during the Naruto+sasuke fight.

Jigen/Isshiki is also weaken and not as powerful as he was when Kaguya Off guarded him and nearly killed him.

This was why he was trying to get Kawaki as his new vessel, someone who can fully handle the full power of Isshiki.

Isshiki in his prime is stated to have immense powers. 

I agree with what was said in here about derivative powers not being as powerful as the original.  the 9 tails powers comes from the 10 tails, like all the lesser Tailed beast powers originate from. 

Isshiki loses to Kaguya, Madara and Hagoromo. They are just too powerful, have too much chakra.  Isshiki chakra is immense while in his prime and fully healthy...But the Juubi in the war is stated to have immeasurable chakra.

Immeasurable Chakra>Immense Chakra.


Hagoromo wins this pretty easily.

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## stormrider321 (Feb 18, 2021)

Naruto and sasuke were finding out how isshiki fights. Now that they know how he fights they can easily defeat him. Plus naruto got so weak after the war because he wasn’t keeping his skills sharp. I’m not even sure if naruto and sasuke can defeat kaguya anymore. Meaning kaguya probably is stronger than isshiki 
but maybe they are tied. But hagoromo gets the ten tails. In a fight hagoromo godstomps isshiki end of story.


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## Grinningfox (Feb 18, 2021)

Hag is hard to place but one thing I know for sure is that he’s not > Naruto and Sasuke definitively

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## Animegoin (Feb 18, 2021)

Hagoromo calls the soul of Kaguya forward just to intimidate Jigen; that alone solos that bitch

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## stormrider321 (Mar 1, 2021)

People say hagoromo dosent have space time techniques so jigen could trap him. Hagoromo has ten tails. Ten tails has rinnesharingan so he can get out of space time

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## stormrider321 (Mar 1, 2021)

Also isshikis eye got stopped by a regular sharingan lol

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## stormrider321 (Mar 1, 2021)

hagoromo defeated kaguya with Hamura. Then he got ten tails making him way stronger than kaguya. Plus naruto and sasuke cant beat kaguya together. To defeat her the entire Team 7 had to combine their efforts, and even then, they only had a small opportunity to seal her away. It goes without saying that Naruto and Sasuke alone wouldn't have been able to defeat her Because without distractions they wouldn’t have had the time the time to seal her. Kakashis Susanoo and sakura helped get kaguya into a position where she could be sealed.


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## T-Bag (Mar 1, 2021)

stormrider321 said:


> People say hagoromo dosent have space time techniques so jigen could trap him. Hagoromo has ten tails. Ten tails has rinnesharingan so he can get out of space time


You know it’s actually silly they say hagaromo doesnt have s-t jutsus to escape when he used one of the most ridicilous s-t jutsus to bring team 7 back from kaguya's dimension. Even kakashi saying “this is something only the you can do” or something along those lines.

it’s really dumb to assume you cant use spacetime ninjutsus when you have the rinnegan and the juubi at your command. These are 2 tools that were responsible for the fabric of ninjutsu. Anything is possible with them.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Architect (Mar 1, 2021)

Hagoromo spanks


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