# Blackbeard vs. Doflamingo



## IceColdLikeAokiji (Nov 26, 2014)

Before time-skip Darkness Darkness Fruit Marshall D. Teach versus Donquixote Doflamingo

Who wins this fight????


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## TheWiggian (Nov 26, 2014)

Doffy high diff


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## IceColdLikeAokiji (Nov 26, 2014)

TheWiggian said:


> Doffy high diff



Why? You believe Blackbeard was M3 level?


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## Ghost (Nov 26, 2014)

Doffy high diff.


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## ShadowReaper (Nov 26, 2014)

Doflamingo takes this with high difficulty, unless Teach is a master of Haki.


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## monkey d ace (Nov 26, 2014)

high/extreme for doffy


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## Ajin (Nov 26, 2014)

Doffy isn't logia whore like Ace, but complex and physically powerful fighter. He can stand against Teach even without his fruit and give him a tough fight. With Ito Ito this will change into rape, Teach is slow and stupid fatass, Doflamingo would cut him into pieces in the same way as Magellan took BB down with his poison. Pre-skip Luffy blitzed Yami Blackbeard, imagine what Doflamingo can do.


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## ShadowReaper (Nov 26, 2014)

Ajin said:


> Doffy isn't logia whore like Ace, but complex and physically powerful fighter. He can stand against Teach even without his fruit and give him a tough fight. With Ito Ito this will change into rape, Teach is slow and stupid fatass, Doflamingo would cut him into pieces in the same way as Magellan took BB down with his poison. Pre-skip Luffy blitzed Yami Blackbeard, imagine what Doflamingo can do.



And then he defeated Ace. When Teach isn't playing around, he can be a threat to people like Akainu and Whitebeard. He is too durable to die from being cut and yes, Yami-Yami will completely nullify any DF powers(it doesn't matter if you are a logia or a paramecia, your attacks will be useless).


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## IceColdLikeAokiji (Nov 26, 2014)

Teach also fought against Sengoku and Garp with his crew.


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## Extravlad (Nov 26, 2014)

Can go either way.


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## barreltheif (Nov 26, 2014)

ShadowReaper said:


> And then he defeated Ace. When Teach isn't playing around, he can be a threat to people like Akainu and Whitebeard. He is too durable to die from being cut and yes, Yami-Yami will completely nullify any DF powers(it doesn't matter if you are a logia or a paramecia, your attacks will be useless).





IceColdLikeAokiji said:


> Teach also fought against Sengoku and Garp with his crew.




This is yami Teach, not gura Teach. He sure as hell can't take on Sengoku+Garp or Akainu or WB.
Doffy wins, and I doubt it would be close.


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## Luke (Nov 26, 2014)

Doflamingo wins with high difficulty. 

While Yami Teach was undoubtedly very powerful, I don't rank him as highly as a lot of people on here seem to. I also don't think Ace is as strong as a lot make him out to be, which is part of the reason Yami Blackbeard isn't ranked as highly.


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## Freechoice (Nov 26, 2014)

Blackbeard high diff


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## Ajin (Nov 26, 2014)

ShadowReaper said:


> And then he defeated Ace. When Teach isn't playing around, he can be a threat to people like Akainu and Whitebeard. He is too durable to die from being cut and yes, Yami-Yami will completely nullify any DF powers(it doesn't matter if you are a logia or a paramecia, your attacks will be useless).



Ace didn't have nothing aside of his DF, when he lost his power, he was helpless. And fire which he used to fight was easily absorbed by Yami Yami, so Teach didn't took any serious damages. In this case, beating Ace was nothing impressive. 

I noticed that people often overestimate the fact that Teach took a Whitebeard attacks and survived. It's good feat, i don't deny it, but that doesn't mean that character weaker than WB can't beat him. It's like saying that pre-skip Luffy can survive multiple Kizaru's kick, so people like Lucci can do shit to him. We know that it isn't true. Even pre-skip Luffy make Blackbeard bleed, Doflamingo's slashes would make him seriously damages and it shouldn't be even debatable. And Yami Teach wasn't threat to Akainu or Whitebeard, stop joking like that. Even Gura Teach with his whole crew run away when he heard that Akainu is coming for him.

Blackbeard to nullify opponent's power needs touch him and it isn't easy when you fight against someone who is deadly on long distances like Doflamingo.


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## Beckman (Nov 26, 2014)

Stuff like knowledge and state of mind is really important here. A black knight/parasite combo could make really quick work of Teach before he realises he's in danger.

Would also be nice to find out how, if at all possible, one breaks out of parasite once trapped and how smart you need to be to find it out.


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## ShadowReaper (Nov 26, 2014)

Ajin said:


> Ace didn't have nothing aside of his DF, when he lost his power, he was helpless. And fire which he used to fight was easily absorbed by Yami Yami, so Teach didn't took any serious damages. In this case, beating Ace was nothing impressive.
> 
> I noticed that people often overestimate the fact that Teach took a Whitebeard attacks and survived. It's good feat, i don't deny it, but that doesn't mean that character weaker than WB can't beat him. It's like saying that pre-skip Luffy can survive multiple Kizaru's kick, so people like Lucci can do shit to him. We know that it isn't true. Even pre-skip Luffy make Blackbeard bleed, Doflamingo's slashes would make him seriously damages and it shouldn't be even debatable. And Yami Teach wasn't threat to Akainu or Whitebeard, stop joking like that. Even Gura Teach with his whole crew run away when he heard that Akainu is coming for him.
> 
> Blackbeard to nullify opponent's power needs touch him and it isn't easy when you fight against someone who is deadly on long distances like Doflamingo.



Ace wasn't useless without his DF. Every single commander of a division should at least know Haki and how to use it(not to mention, he could learn it from Whitebeard, Marco and many others) and was very famous in New world even before he met WB. And then he had a stalemate with Jinbei and after 3 years he would only become exponentially stronger(Whitebeard himself believed him to be able to become a Pirate King and he had great potential for growth). Had he not died at MF and he would just become as strong as post TS Sabo or even stronger. 

Yes, Teach would eventually lose to Dofla, but he will not fall so easily. He can still nullify his attacks and he is way too durable to fall on the first attack. He tanked Gura-Gura to the face and was relatively OK, he created a half-island sized black hole(and that isn't even his limits), he has one of the most overpowered logias.


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## Rob (Nov 26, 2014)

Doffy vs. Yami Teach? 

Doffy should take it. 

Though it was off-guard, Doffy had Jozu in check (someone who is above Yami Teach). 

Knowing that Teach is a cocky bastard, Doffy won't even need to catch him off-guard. The dude will walk into the trap himself.


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## Freechoice (Nov 26, 2014)

Blackbeard mid diff


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## Rob (Nov 26, 2014)

lol said:


> Blackbeard mid diff


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## tanman (Nov 26, 2014)

Doflamingo with high difficulty. There's only so much Teach can tank, and his fruit won't really neutralize strings. Then considering Dofla can take a Red Hawk so easily, he can definitely take quite a few hits from Teach.

Either he gets ripped in half or falls victim to Parasite.


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## TheWiggian (Nov 26, 2014)

IceColdLikeAokiji said:


> Why? You believe Blackbeard was M3 level?



I believe that Yami BB is weaker as current Luffy and Zoro, with Sanji it could go either way. And Ace being weaker as all, since he just relies on his DF and is physically rather weak. If Sanji, Zoro and Luffy could force Ace in CqC they most likely guna win.

Y BB vs Post Ts Luffy, Luffy wins with high diff
Y BB vs Post Ts Zoro, Zoro wins with high high - extreme diff
Y BB vs Post Ts Sanji, either way extreme diff or BB high - high high diff


Ofc alot of Teach wankers will disagree because of BB tank feats vs dying WB and clash with Goku, Garp and just ignore his inferiority against any strong opponent like Akainu and Shanks, where BB ran for his life.

Also theres a problem with the Ace wankers, theyll disagree because he was beat by BB.


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## Sanji (Nov 26, 2014)

Doflamingo Extreme Diff


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## MartyMcFly1 (Nov 26, 2014)

This one is hard to call. I'm going to say Teach, only because I just can't see him losing to Doflamingo.

Blackbeard is way more ambitious.


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## Sabco (Nov 26, 2014)

BB mid difficulty


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## tanman (Nov 26, 2014)

Mid difficulty?
Is Yami Teach as strong as an admiral now?


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## Extravlad (Nov 26, 2014)

An admiral would low diff Doffy.

Gura Teach/Marco would mid diff him though.


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## Chrollo Lucilfer (Nov 26, 2014)

Read OP, vlad. Clearly means Yami teach.

Inb4 'Yami teach high diffs Doflamingo''


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## Navy Scribe (Nov 26, 2014)

Cant BB suck in his strings? If it can suck in energy I don't see why it can't suck in strings.


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## tanman (Nov 26, 2014)

Navy Scribe said:


> Cant BB suck in his strings? If it can suck in energy I don't see why it can't suck in strings.



Well, he can. But he'll still end up getting cut by them, probably.


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## Ryuksgelus (Nov 26, 2014)

Teach High diff.


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## Dr. White (Nov 26, 2014)

Doflamingo wins High - Extreme Diff. It's hard to tell with Teach.

anyway doflamingo wins for a couple of reasons:
-Ace was able to get off attacks whilst being pulled in, and Teach is notorious for just tanking and never dodging. That can heed way to Parasite or Overheat which would so some damage, and allow for follow ups. Doflamingo's reactions, and speed should be > Ace.
-Teach has no haki feats nor the indication that he'd have any. Doflamingo's haki is pretty dirty, so it's not like Doflamingo is some scrub with a good DF only.I'm also of the opinion that Haki combined with Strings would overide the Yami Yami's power.
-Doflamingo's fruit is more versatile, and gives him more mobility. 

So all in all I see BB losing more often than not giving Dofla a High - Extreme diff fight.


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## Kaiser (Nov 26, 2014)

I see them on the same level practically, but i give the win to Yami Teach more times than not


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## IceColdLikeAokiji (Nov 26, 2014)

tanman said:


> Well, he can. But he'll still end up getting cut by them, probably.



He can pull Doflamingo in, and beat him up CQC. 
Someone made a argument that Blackbeard doesn't have Haki, really? So does Garp doesn't have Haki because he hasn't shown it? That's a stupid remark to make, because Blackbeard was the one that was saying that Luffy's Haki gotten stronger.


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## Dr. White (Nov 27, 2014)

IceColdLikeAokiji said:


> He can pull Doflamingo in, and beat him up CQC.
> Someone made a argument that Blackbeard doesn't have Haki, really? So does Garp doesn't have Haki because he hasn't shown it? That's a stupid remark to make, because Blackbeard was the one that was saying that Luffy's Haki gotten stronger.



No, just no.
Yami Teach was not on the level of Garp. Furthermore all VA's receive training in Haki. To top it all off, Garp does have haki feats lol. 

So please stop. Even if BB did have Haki how strong is it? what are his limitations?  as far as any objective analysis goes you can't really give him alot there.


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## trance (Nov 27, 2014)

Doffy high difficulty. I'd wager this version of Teach is more or less on equal footing with Doffy but he is just somewhat of a bad matchup for Teach.


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## IceColdLikeAokiji (Nov 27, 2014)

Dr. White said:


> No, just no.
> Yami Teach was not on the level of Garp. Furthermore all VA's receive training in Haki. To top it all off, Garp does have haki feats lol.
> 
> So please stop. Even if BB did have Haki how strong is it? what are his limitations?  as far as any objective analysis goes you can't really give him alot there.



Lacking reading comprehension much? I will refute your points when I come back home.


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## Freechoice (Nov 27, 2014)

Blackbeard High diff


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## Pirao (Nov 27, 2014)

Doflamingo slices his ass high-diff.


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## Hosemisnuba (Nov 27, 2014)

People here severely underestimate Blackbeard, fittingly so; the guy always seems incompetent on screen. I mean, for Pete's sake, the guy was crushed by Whitebeard, a yonkou and the WSM, with his yami fruit, ran away from Akainu  when he had the gura, and most embarrassingly, was almost killed by Magellan's devil fruit hax. Its no wonder people tend to rank him so lowly. The truth of the matter is, however, he's a lot stronger than we give him credit for, at least off screen. Off screen he crushed Ace, scarred Shanks in a fair battle, defeated the remnants of Whitebeard's crew, and became Yonkou. So what's my verdict regarding a battle between pre-Skip yami Teach and Doffy? Blackbeard wins at medium difficulty. Honestly, no matter what he does, Blackbeard fights against competent individuals will end up being medium or higher difficulty. The way Oda has hyped Blackbeard as this character who arrogantly tanks every attack, but somehow survives it (like Luffy in a way), and seems to be an incompetent buffoon,  buts comes out on top in the end (in the case of Ace), seems to point in this direction.


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## Ryuksgelus (Nov 27, 2014)

I don't see how strings are a bad-match up for Teach. He pulls and  bashes his head repeatedly.

Law could block overheat, Sanji endured 5CS, string bullets are doing jack shit to Teach. I have never seen a convincing reason Doffy can beat Teach.


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## Bohemian Knight (Nov 27, 2014)

Gotta go with Doffy extreme diff. It's not gonna be easy to put down the beast, but Doffy is a tough matchup for Yami Teach and they are on the same level to begin with. Doffy is smarter, faster, and more lethal. He will find a way, extreme diff because Teach is such a tank. His tankiness is going to allow him to land some critical blows. Ultimately, Doffy's got it with his string techs and superior haki


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## Extravlad (Nov 27, 2014)

Parasite wouldn't work on Yami Teach.
I'm pretty sure if Teach uses darkness on his boy it can nullify parasite since it comes from Doffy's DF.
So the hax part is not a problem for Teach.
Doffy is considerably faster with better haki I guess but Teach can probably break Doffy's neck in a few hits.

Teach is also a lot more durable.


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## Sabco (Nov 27, 2014)

tanman said:


> Mid difficulty?




Yes, got a problem with this ?


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## Crocodile Atlas (Nov 27, 2014)

Doflamingo wins with high difficulty. Yami Teach can't counter Doflamingo's strings as well as he could counter Ace's logia fruit, so Blackbeard gets strung up. Gura Teach would win though.


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## IceColdLikeAokiji (Nov 28, 2014)

Dr. White said:


> No, just no.
> Yami Teach was not on the level of Garp. Furthermore all VA's receive training in Haki. To top it all off, Garp does have haki feats lol.
> 
> So please stop. Even if BB did have Haki how strong is it? what are his limitations?  as far as any objective analysis goes you can't really give him alot there.



First of all, where have I stated that Yami Teach is Garp level? Yami Teach is borderline top-tier at best. All VA's recieve Haki training, yet we haven't seen any of the Vice-admirals show CoA/CoO in Preskip? Preskip nobody was shown to coat their body like you see currently. Even then Blackbeard has merits to have Haki, he has been with the Whitebeard Crew for 20years, you believe he didn't pick up Haki with them? Marco had Haki, Jozu had Haki. Blackbeard did too.


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## tanman (Nov 28, 2014)

Well, no.
Garp was I think the first character confirmed to have CoA. It was pre-skip. Remember him punching and grabbing Luffy?

Many many characters were to shown to have CoA before the skip. To name a few: Sentomaru, Marigold, Sandersonia, Hancock, Doflamingo, the admirals, and Whitebeard's top three.

Teach simply wasn't one of them. Let's not retroactively edit his feats.


As far as Teach v Shanks, that was before Shanks even lost his arm. He certainly wasn't a Yonkou. In fact, it was probably during Shanks' first campaign into the Grand Line. Sure Teach is very strong now, but we shouldn't be revisionist about pre-skip BB. His feats don'[t stack up to Dofla's. even if we just take Dofla's pre-skip feats.


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## IceColdLikeAokiji (Nov 28, 2014)

tanman said:


> Well, no.
> Garp was I think the first character confirmed to have CoA. It was pre-skip. Remember him punching and grabbing Luffy?
> 
> Many many characters were to shown to have CoA before the skip. To name a few: Sentomaru, Marigold, Sandersonia, Hancock, Doflamingo, the admirals, and Whitebeard's top three.
> ...


You are a idiot if you think Blackbeard didn't have Haki pre-skip, he was the one to gauge Luffy's Haki. How is he able to do that if he doesn't have Haki himself, Blackbeard was a exceptional member when he was with the WB Pirates, they are a Yonkou crew to say the stronger members of the crew don't have Haki is ridicilous.


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## Raiden34 (Feb 4, 2015)

Tough one since this is only Yami Teach, Gura + Yami Teach would win though, and I also believe Teach had Haki, Marco and Jozu had, and Ace asked to Teach that he should be the second division commander, and as far as we know from Fishman Island flashbacks, Teach was a main fighter in WB crew along with Marco and Jozu.


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## zoro (Feb 4, 2015)

IC, Teach loses

Bloodlusted, could probably go either way


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## Bernkastel (Feb 4, 2015)

Doffy should win wih high diff.
He has so many ranged attacks and an overheat would seriously damage him if not outright behead him if he tries to tank it.
Even if he tries to pull him in and try to hit him,Doffy's haki and superb stats would place hiim on top of that skirmish.


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## Raiden34 (Feb 6, 2015)

What Doffy tanked Red Hawk ? Guess what, Yami Teach tanked Hiken, Quake Buble into his head, Sengoku's shock wave... Teach is lot more durable, just because he is screaming because of Yami's taking too much pain that doesn't mean Doffy is more durable, Teach can resist more than Doffy...


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## Turrin (Feb 6, 2015)

Well here's the deal, I think this match probably depends on how this arc ends. Ace may have been overshadowed by Vista, Jozu, and Marco, but he was still one of the prominent WB division commanders and demonstrated the ability to at least deflect one of Aokiji's attacks, while in a weakened condition. I'm not sure I see Luffy being that much stronger than his brother so soon into Part II, he could potentially be the same general "level" or at absolute best slightly stronger (though I do not think this is the case). Anyway, if Luffy defeats DD, than it depends how it's done, if Luffy is actually stronger than DD by the end of the arc or if DD is handicapped in some fashion. If Luffy is actually stronger than DD, than I must imagine Ace is at least equivalent with DD, and Yami-BB is stronger, even if it's by a narrow margin. If DD looses due to a moderate handicap there is some wiggle room, but than Ace/Yami-Teach should still be very close, where the match could go anyway. Only way I'd think DD is outright stronger is if he is significantly handicapped or gets completely double teamed.

With that said I still think no matter what DD should push BB to the upper end of High to extreme diff.


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## HisMajestyMihawk (Feb 7, 2015)

Doffy wins, probably on the lower end of high diff

That's if BB plays it smart and doesn't try to tank the first hit like a dumbass


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## Captain Altintop (Feb 7, 2015)

Doflamingo high diffs Yami Teach who would mid-high diff any M3 level opponent like Luffy Law Zoro Sanji Ace etc,.


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## Biased as Fuck (Feb 7, 2015)

Ok so it doesn't matter how durable teach is you try to tank a overheat you're going to die instantly and that goes for anyone in the damn one piece world......I can see tanking a punch but strings that cut like razors no way, you're dead....welcome to death parade episode 6.....


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## tanman (Feb 8, 2015)

This is kind of beyond me. 
Even if we were in a bizarre alternate dimension where Yami BB were stronger, anyone who is forced to tank Doflamingo is going to get ripped up.




IceColdLikeAokiji said:


> You are a idiot if you think Blackbeard didn't have Haki pre-skip, he was the one to gauge Luffy's Haki. How is he able to do that if he doesn't have Haki himself, Blackbeard was a exceptional member when he was with the WB Pirates, they are a Yonkou crew to say the stronger members of the crew don't have Haki is ridicilous.



That's nonsense.
One obviously doesn't need Haki to detect what has been often described as a sort of "pressure." Blackbeard has spent most of his life in the New World. He's obviously incredibly familiar with Haki. It's not impossible for him to have had it, but it would be bizarre for it to have never come up when it would have added so much to his fighting style. 

As I said way back then, don't fucking revise history.


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## Amol (Feb 8, 2015)

DD low diffs IC Yami Teach.
DD very high diffs serious Yami Teach.


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## Raiden34 (Feb 8, 2015)

This is Teach's durability, resisting an attack what destroys a banana rock. Clearly he is using Haki to protect himself...


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