# Roronoa Zoro vs. Cloud Strife



## Zaelapolopollo (Jun 5, 2010)

Pretty sure this has been done. But as the search engine sucks and I didn't see it anywhere on Cloud's or Zoro's wiki profiles...I figured why not.

Now  current Zoro is way too much for Cloud from what I've heard. 
But what about East Blue Zoro?

This is Cloud as of the end of Advent Children when he got his Geostigma cured.


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## Sengoku (Jun 5, 2010)

Wait, what? Current Zoro is too much for Cloud? I always thought the FF verse was vastly superior to One Piece. luls.


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## Big Bοss (Jun 5, 2010)

> Now current Zoro is way too much for Cloud from what I've heard.



Why?

10char


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## Raidou Kuzunoha (Jun 5, 2010)

Current Zoro is too much for Cloud? Since when? East Blue Zoro gets the Buster Sword shoved up his ass.


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## Zaelapolopollo (Jun 6, 2010)

Zoro is way too strong. Cloud is far from a Class 100.

From what I can tell, they're only close in speed. Every other stat goes to Zoro.

Cloud's only advantage is his Limit Breaks which may be enough to clinch the win I suppose.



Sengoku said:


> Wait, what? Current Zoro is too much for Cloud? I always thought the FF verse was vastly superior to One Piece. luls.



It depends on the FF in question. 

They don't all operate at the same levels of power ya know.


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## Omnirix (Jun 6, 2010)

Current Zoro should be too much. Cloud gets Asura'ed.


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## Rene (Jun 6, 2010)

Zaelapolopollo said:


> It depends on the FF in question.
> 
> They don't all operate at the same levels of power ya know.



Generally it's the villains that really pump up the strength of all of the Final Fantasies. :<

Ultimecia's time compression, Exdeath and the void, Cloud of Darkness, God Kefka 

Or for the more low end ones: Sin and Vegnagun.


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## Solon Solute (Jun 6, 2010)

I can see Cloud beating EB Zoro with mid difficulty.


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## Shooting burst stream (Jun 11, 2010)

Current Zoro makes Cloud his bitch but East blue Zoro wouldn't stand a chance


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## Rene (Jun 11, 2010)

I'd argue that Cloud could beat Skypiea arc Zoro. After that it becomes too much for him


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## Black Sabbath II (Jun 11, 2010)

EB Zoro gets raped hard. Current Zoro though would wreck Cloud.


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## Psysalis (Jun 11, 2010)

Can Zoro's blades stand up to that buster sword? Its pretty damn powerful


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## Black Sabbath II (Jun 11, 2010)

Psysalis said:


> Can Zoro's blades stand up to that buster sword? Its pretty damn powerful



Well one of his swords is stated to be indestructible. Don't know if that's hyperbole or not. Though Zoro does have a move made specifically to cut through steel, so that might help.

Mind you this is Zoro AFTER east blue. East Blue zoro's swords get shat on by the buster sword.


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## Lord Raizen (Jun 11, 2010)

Current Zoro dwarfs Clounds physical strength and is likely much faster as well. 

Cloud's durability and endurance are also nothing next to Zoro's.

East Blue Zoro had very few feats in comparison though. Bullet timing reactions. Nothin above class 5 strength from what I recall. And no major durability, just alot of endurance. Cloud takes him then with low-mid difficulty.


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## SHM (Jun 11, 2010)

Lord Raizen said:


> Cloud's durability and endurance are also nothing next to Zoro's.



Really? Because Cloud is thrown into buildings and keep fighting like nothing happened. Not to mention his 'fly' through Bahamut Sin's mega Giga Flare(an energy beam the size of a city-block).
And about his endurance... Well, he fought Bahamut Sin and Yazoo and Loz without rest, and after Aerith cured him, fought against Kadaj and Sephiroth without rest too(winning the fight even after what Sephiroth did to him at the end, in the new canonical version of the movie[AC Complete]. It was pretty brutal).


So, are Zoro's durability and endurance greater than that? I'm genuinely curious(my knowledge on Zoro isn't huge, and I know for a fact that people generally forget Cloud's durability and endurance feats).


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## Black Sabbath II (Jun 11, 2010)

SHM said:


> Really? Because Cloud is thrown into buildings and keep fighting like nothing happened. Not to mention his 'fly' through Bahamut Sin's mega Giga Flare(an energy beam the size of a city-block).
> And about his endurance... Well, he fought Bahamut Sin and Yazoo and Loz without rest, and after Aerith cured him, fought against Kadaj and Sephiroth without rest too(winning the fight even after what Sephiroth did to him at the end, in the new canonical version of the movie[AC Complete]. It was pretty brutal).
> 
> 
> So, are Zoro's durability and endurance greater than that? I'm genuinely curious(my knowledge on Zoro isn't huge, and I know for a fact that people generally forget Cloud's durability and endurance feats).



Yeah, allot of people seem to forget how durable cloud really is.

Well Zoro is known to survive attacks and situations that would otherwise kill any normal person. So far he's tanked lightning (Though allot of the op chars have so that isn't saying much) Receiving various sword slashes directly (Sword slashes strong enough to cut through buildings in the Mr.1 fight) Tanked attacks from a giant (Giant is said to have town level destructive capability in the OBD wiki.) Fell from a height that would normally kill any person (Not very reliable, I know. ) and so far his most impressive showing was taking all the damage Luffy accimulated in the thriller bark arc (Which was a shit load of damage) along with the damage he himself had into himself and was still standing. Didn't even lose consciousness.

Link removed

 So he's pretty durable.


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## Raigen (Jun 11, 2010)

I recall Cloud taking a bullet to the head at point-blank range and it only scratched him. Then there was that massively materia enhanced bullet which punched a hole through his chest, but otherwise didn't really affect him, and that was after fighting Sephiroth. Cloud has a bit of a self-healing ability.

If Cloud has Materia, Zoro is boned. Stops time on Zoro and face-jabs him. Strength isn't so much an issue and Cloud's swords are heretofore indestructible. Cutting steel isn't really a worthy feat when you cut dragons, monsters, and giant sections of buildings in twain just to get to the guy you hate most who plans on killing the whole world and using its corpse as a space ship. And Cloud's current sword is like 5-6 swords in one.

Zoro may have Asura, but Cloud has like several different forms of Omnislash. Wasn't the one he used to kill Sephy form 7 of it?


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## Black Sabbath II (Jun 11, 2010)

Raigen said:


> I recall Cloud taking a bullet to the head at point-blank range and it only scratched him. Then there was that massively materia enhanced bullet which punched a hole through his chest, but otherwise didn't really affect him, and that was after fighting Sephiroth. Cloud has a bit of a self-healing ability.
> 
> If Cloud has Materia, Zoro is boned. Stops time on Zoro and face-jabs him. Strength isn't so much an issue and Cloud's swords are heretofore indestructible. Cutting steel isn't really a worthy feat when you cut dragons, monsters, and giant sections of buildings in twain just to get to the guy you hate most who plans on killing the whole world and using its corpse as a space ship. And Cloud's current sword is like 5-6 swords in one.
> 
> Zoro may have Asura, but Cloud has like several different forms of Omnislash. Wasn't the one he used to kill Sephy form 7 of it?



Well Zoro's also cut through buildings and monsters and whatnot. He could even chuck buildings at people with his hands. So him and cloud are pretty much even in that area.

Though I agree with Omnislash > Asura.


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## Raigen (Jun 11, 2010)

This shows the Omnislash from AC, then the original (which failed), and then the improved omnislash from the extended version of Advent Children.
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7ec6lcDnhQ[/YOUTUBE]


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## SHM (Jun 11, 2010)

KumogakureRaikage said:


> Yeah, allot of people seem to forget how durable cloud really is.
> 
> Well Zoro is known to survive attacks and situations that would otherwise kill any normal person. So far he's tanked lightning (Though allot of the op chars have so that isn't saying much) Receiving various sword slashes directly (Sword slashes strong enough to cut through buildings in the Mr.1 fight) Tanked attacks from a giant (Giant is said to have town level destructive capability in the OBD wiki.) Fell from a height that would normally kill any person (Not very reliable, I know. ) and so far his most impressive showing was taking all the damage Luffy accimulated in the thriller bark arc (Which was a shit load of damage) along with the damage he himself had into himself and was still standing. Didn't even lose consciousness.
> 
> ...




Well, going by those feats, Cloud went through similar things: He survived slashes strong enough to cut buildings in pieces, fell from a high height(that put Tifa in a coma) with few injuries(and he was just a child at the time), and didn't tank lightning but tanked the super Giga Flare of Sin Bahamut.
The only feat I cannot compare with Cloud's, is Zoro taking all the damage Luffy and himself accumulated through Thriller Bark. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's like taking damage from Oz, Moria, Kuma, and all the other monsters and zombies of that place, right? If it is... Damn, Zoro _really_ is a tough bastard!


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## Black Sabbath II (Jun 11, 2010)

SHM said:


> Well, going by those feats, Cloud went through similar things: He survived slashes strong enough to cut buildings in pieces, fell from a high height(that put Tifa in a coma) with few injuries(and he was just a child at the time), and didn't tank lightning but tanked the super Giga Flare of Sin Bahamut.
> The only feat I cannot compare with Cloud's, is Zoro taking all the damage Luffy and himself accumulated through Thriller Bark. Correct me if I'm wrong but that's like taking damage from Oz, Moria, Kuma, and all the other monsters and zombies of that place, right? If it is... Damn, Zoro _really_ is a tough bastard!



If it had just been the damage from Oz, Moria and the zombies I'd still consider Cloud to have more durability than Zoro. But above all of that Luffy took in over 100 shadows which the pirates said should have torn any normal person's body to shreds and used Gear Second and third in unison shortly afterwards (Which was also stated to have torn Luffy's body to shreds, had it not been for his rubber body)

The fact that Zoro was even standing after taking all of the damage Luffy got from his enemies AND did to himself with the shadows and the gears and whatnot amazes me to this day.


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## Pervy Fox (Jun 11, 2010)

Cloud rapes, did you see what he did to that potato from robot chicken?


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## Axl Low (Jun 12, 2010)

Pervy Fox said:


> Cloud rapes, did you see what he did to that potato from robot chicken?



Overtime with no pay.


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## xlab3000 (Aug 21, 2013)

Cloud curbstomps


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## Red Angel (Aug 21, 2013)

Why the necro?

Cloud solos the HST, so yeah he does indeed curbstomp


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## Wolfgang Grimmer (Aug 21, 2013)

nice       sig necro man


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## Expelsword (Aug 22, 2013)

When this thread was made, Chaos hadn't turned Cloud into the Mach 100-something continent level beast he is now.


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## P-X 12 (Aug 22, 2013)

The only way this doesn't turn into a horrendous stomp is if you limit Cloud to his Buster Sword in base, with no spells/limits/summons and with speed equal.

But yeah, time to call the mods.


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## ironherc (Aug 22, 2013)

don't necro man, this thread was before cloud was turned strong enough to solo the HST


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## Freddy Mercury (Aug 22, 2013)

Imagine i saw you in this thread


Zoro dies deal with it :ignoramus


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## katanalauncher (Aug 22, 2013)

As someone who didn't play FF7, how much stronger sephiroth is compared to cloud?
Because last I heard sephiroth solos HST.
EDIT: damn necro!


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## Xam (Aug 22, 2013)

3 year necro wat


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## lokoxDZz (Aug 22, 2013)

The necro in this one.


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## shade0180 (Aug 22, 2013)

Necro and an Oversize sig and not a senior member. 

Cloud shows Zoro how to use multiple swords.


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## xlab3000 (Aug 23, 2013)

my bad for bumping the thread.


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## Neruc (Aug 23, 2013)

xlab3000 said:


> my bad for bumping the thread.



Just look at the date of the last post before you comment.
Although I question how you found a thread this old.

Maybe the wiki?


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## Adamant soul (Aug 23, 2013)

katanalauncher said:


> As someone who didn't play FF7, how much stronger sephiroth is compared to cloud?
> Because last I heard sephiroth solos HST.
> EDIT: damn necro!



If Sephiroth wanted to he could kill Cloud in an instant, the only reason he loses to Cloud is sheer PIS/CIS.


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## Coyote A (Aug 23, 2013)

half the people on AnimeVice seriously think Zoro can beat Cloud lol.

Btw Cloud should be mach 440+ by the end of AC (lightning timing)


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## Adamant soul (Aug 23, 2013)

Coyote A said:


> half the people on AnimeVice seriously think Zoro can beat Cloud lol.
> 
> Btw Cloud should be mach 440+ by the end of AC (lightning timing)



The Bolt spell that Cloud dodged doesn't equal an actual bolt of lightning especially since it neither looked nor acted like a natural bolt of lightning so nope Cloud is just mach 100+ until a calc proves otherwise.


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## Coyote A (Aug 23, 2013)

Adamant soul said:


> The Bolt spell that Cloud dodged doesn't equal an actual bolt of lightning especially since it neither looked nor acted like a natural bolt of lightning so nope Cloud is just mach 100+ until a calc proves otherwise.


Advent Children just stylised it that way to have a more cinematic effect. In the game, the same bolt spell just casts lightning from the sky.

Materia just calls the forces of nature, so the lightning should be elemental


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## ChaosTheory123 (Aug 23, 2013)

Depending on how well received the notion is, Zack Fair can dodge those spikes Bahamut Fury fires at him.

The same spikes that travel a few thousand kilometers to the moon in a few seconds in its summon FMV.

And I have had fuckers advocate the feats shown in those as legitimate, so i might actually get around to that.

And... why are we discussing shit in a necroed thread?


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## Adamant soul (Aug 23, 2013)

Coyote A said:


> Advent Children just stylised it that way to have a more cinematic effect. In the game, the same bolt spell just casts lightning from the sky.
> 
> *Materia just calls the forces of nature,* so the lightning should be elemental



Link to where that is stated please? 



ChaosTheory123 said:


> Depending on how well received the notion is, Zack Fair can dodge those spikes Bahamut Fury fires at him.
> 
> The same spikes that travel a few thousand kilometers to the moon in a few seconds in its summon FMV.
> 
> ...



A necroed rape thread no less, well because Coyote brought up the bolt timing feat as an actual lightning timing feat and I'm not sure it counts as one because that's the only time bolt is used outside of gameplay and it didn't look or act anything like a bolt of lightning.

Go for it, the summon sequences don't tend to be completely out of the ordinary for the verse they're in and that would probably be one hell of speed boost for Zack (well Cloud and Seph as well but mostly Zack ).


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## Expelsword (Aug 23, 2013)

Adamant soul said:


> Link to where that is stated please?



Materia is the planet's life force, as natural as it gets.
Sephiroth basically becomes one with nature and can use all the magic without Materia.


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## DarkSlayerZero (Aug 23, 2013)

Adamant soul said:


> Link to where that is stated please?



They tend to refer to this

_?The knowledge and wisdom of the Ancients is held in the materia. Anyone with this knowledge can freely use the powers of the Land and the Planet. That knowledge interacts between ourselves and the planet calling up magic... or so they say.?_

Also what is the verdict on this?


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## ChaosTheory123 (Aug 23, 2013)

DarkSlayerZero said:


> Also what is the verdict on this?



Well, yeah, she uses natural lightning, that much is made obvious from the fight in the beginning of FFXIII-2.

I'd have to see how many frames the lightning travels on screen for compared to Caius to get a feel for his speed though.

Hard to tell.


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## Fenrir (Aug 23, 2013)

ChaosTheory123 said:


> And... why are we discussing shit in a necroed thread?


Because it's here and not locked. Go with the flow.

As for the whole mach 440+ Cloud, you don't have to be moving at the same speed as lightning to dodge it. You only need to be moving at a fraction of the speed to dodge it - the only exceptions being if you dodge it from a meter or less or you  move a significant distance while dodging it. And while Bolt is natural electricity in the works, it isn't cloud-produced lightning. If, say, Kadaj's hand turned into a fucking cloud before he shot it than I wouldn't argue.


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## ChaosTheory123 (Aug 23, 2013)

Its not going to particularly matter either way given dodging the shit fired by Bahamut Fury is well above mach 440.

And that new FFXIII feat could be good, but figuring out how to prove Caius moved at speeds close to that of lightning looks to be a massive headache.


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## KaiserWombat (Aug 23, 2013)

Necromancy of past threads is not tolerated.

And with the relatively recent overhaul of the Final Fantasy series in terms of calculations, this has now become an absolute and total mismatch, so a newly created thread of the same nature will be locked also, just for those curious.


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## Coyote A (Aug 23, 2013)

Alpha~13 said:


> As for the whole mach 440+ Cloud, you don't have to be moving at the same speed as lightning to dodge it. You only need to be moving at a fraction of the speed to dodge it - the only exceptions being if you dodge it from a meter or less or you  move a significant distance while dodging it. And while Bolt is natural electricity in the works, it isn't cloud-produced lightning. If, say, Kadaj's hand turned into a fucking cloud before he shot it than I wouldn't argue.


Cloud not only dodged, but even outran the bolt. 

he is behind it before it even hits the ground.



Adamant soul said:


> Link to where that is stated please?


this

At around 5:08 into this video you get Sephiroth's explanation on how materia works. He explains that "When you condense mako energy, materia is produced." This point alone gives a lot of credit to materia producing magic from nature itself. As Mako energy is a condensed form of Lifestream and Lifestream is literately what creates everything on the planet. It is nature. So in essence, controlling materia is controlling nature. But continuing on with what Sephiroth explains...

"The Knowledge and wisdom of the Ancients is held in the materia. Anyone with this knowledge can freely powers of the land and the planet. The knowledge interacts between ourselves and the planet calling up magic... Or so they say" (6:08)

This is only further enforced by the ideology of the Cetra (Ancients) themselves. They were extremely in tune with the planet. Even so to the point where they could hear the planet speaking to them. Even though it's irrelevant, this video proves that at 5:35. Their bond with the planet was so close that they were able to call up magic from the planet even before materia was manufactured. Meaning they had to connect to the planet itself and call forth natural elements to summon up the magic. 

Once again, supporting this being natural lightning, is the appearance it takes in the game. Advent Children had this wrong, it showed all magic as weird strings of energy that practically exploded upon impact, no matter what element it was. But Final Fantasy VII showed it right. 

this video proves that at 5:35
(Last spell used)

As you can see, the lightning bolts rain down from the sky instead of shooting from the user's hand. This means it falls in line with the general physics of lightning that Tyreaus/Tyrane pointed out earlier. And it follows another important guideline, it doesn't make any contact with the caster because doing so would likely kill the caster as well, being hotter than the surface of the sun an all. You'll also notice that unlike Quake and Ice, you don't see the element actually forming at all. It simply appears, flashing on the screen and then disappearing. This proves the speed aspect of it as well. It actually behaves just like real lightning does. And despite the appearance of it in Advent Children, it is the same materia that's in the game. 

Finally this is confirmed by The 10th Anniversary: Ultimania Omega Strategy Guide & Plot Analysis for Final Fantasy VII. 

The following is an excerpt from the translation of the guide. 

_**Materia and postwar society**
When Mako Energy condenses, it becomes materia. In places where the energy is abundant, materia  has formed naturally, but these are rare instances and it's more practical for Shin-Ra to manufacture it by way of artificial production.

It is said that the knowledge of the Ancients is within materia. By bringing out this knowledge [through contact with the materia], one can interact with the Planet and even an ordinary person can gain the powers of the Ancients, as it is the condensed [spiritual energy which contains their] knowledge that is implemented as a link [to the Planet]......This allows for the presentation of abilities [associated with the materia]._


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