# Gilgamesh vs Cloud Strife



## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

Scenario 1: F/Z Gilgamesh vs FF7 Cloud
Scenario 2: F/Z Gilgamesh vs AC Cloud

Distance: 25m facing each other 
Bloodlust on


who wins?


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## shade0180 (May 31, 2013)

I'm pretty sure this has already been done and Cloud rapes.


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

What are Cloud's new stats, anyways?


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> What are Cloud's new stats, anyways?



Mach 100, country level


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## shade0180 (May 31, 2013)

Mach 100. Original FF7 higher at AC, Country to continent level with Materia, Probably mountain level for normal attack since he did cut Bahamut sin. Then you have his omnislash.


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

Where was this done before?

And why do people still believe Gilgamesh beats Sephiroth?


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## shade0180 (May 31, 2013)

Who said Gil beats Sephiroth?  He probably can if Sephy is standing still  and Gil is using Gae Bolg.


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

shade0180 said:


> Who said Gil beats Sephiroth?  He probably can if Sephy is standing still  and Gil is using Gae Bolg.



Wiki does, was before chaos did his calcs.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

> And why do people still believe Gilgamesh beats Sephiroth?


he doesn't


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## Linkofone (May 31, 2013)

Dem Fate threads sure are popular here.


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

shade0180 said:


> Who said Gil beats Sephiroth?  He probably can if Sephy is standing still  and Gil is using Gae Bolg.


There is this guy called ErasorCannon here who still believes Gil beats Sephiroth even with speed unequal


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Because CCC gives Gil MFTL speed


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

shade0180 said:


> Mach 100. Original FF7 higher at AC, Country to continent level with Materia, Probably mountain level for normal attack since he did cut Bahamut sin. Then you have his omnislash.


It's been literally a decade since I played Final Fantasy 7.
How fast can he pull out his various spells?
Cloud appears to have a bit of speed advantage but that only means much if he could pull a high island/country level attack faster than Gilgamesh blasts with Enuma Elish.

BTW, how's Cloud's durability.


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Crimson King said:


> Because CCC gives Gil MFTL speed



Trufax


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## Louis Cyphre (May 31, 2013)

This guy made a rape thread one day after Dangai Ichigo loses to Gil. Try harder.


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

And if you try to argue it's the ship, remember it only moves as fast as Gil's speed of thought.

MFTL speed confirmed


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## shade0180 (May 31, 2013)

Cloud Blitz Sephiroth with omnislash at the end of FF7(it's a movie feat since it will happen regardless if you have learnt it or not), And At the end of AC. I dunno about durability maybe City level+ since he did get hit by Bahamut Sin attack.


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

That attack was city level? Show proof


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Meaning even Gilgamesh casual GoB wave works.
Well, that would certainly take a spin on things.
Unless Cloud can use his spells even when under considerable pressure.
And by that I mean being forced to fend off tons of killing moves at once.
Meanwhile Gilgamesh can charge up Ea for a finishing move.


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## EraserCannon (May 31, 2013)

B-B-B-B

B-B-B-B-Butthurt


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

Crimson King said:


> And if you try to argue it's the ship, remember it only moves as fast as Gil's speed of thought.
> 
> MFTL speed confirmed


Speed of thought so MFTL confirmed? LULZ

Stop wanking.


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## shade0180 (May 31, 2013)

I said I dunno I'm just guesstimating the Sin feat.  CT would probably know better about the calc


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Sensui Seven said:


> Speed of thought so MFTL confirmed? LULZ
> 
> Stop wanking.



I see no counter from you, are you....


frustrated?


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> It's been literally a decade since I played Final Fantasy 7.
> How fast can he pull out his various spells?
> Cloud appears to have a bit of speed advantage but that only means much if he could pull a high island/country level attack faster than Gilgamesh blasts with Enuma Elish.
> 
> BTW, how's Cloud's durability.


Link removed


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Nah, in Fate/Extra CCC Gilgamesh took the protagonist to a distant planet.
Supposedly while riding on Vimana (or not).
Vimana was claimed to move at the speed of thought, at the speed of Gilgamesh' thought.
Hence Crimson King is half-joking about MFTL Gil.


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## Louis Cyphre (May 31, 2013)

Sensui Seven said:


> Stop wanking.


Spoke the guy that was wanking Dangai Ichigo early 
oh sweet irony


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Who knows, I could be serious


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

OP says F/Z Gil, not CCC. Gil has no MFTL speed feats in F/Z.
His combat speed is only mach 15+


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

And if it wasn't Viamna, he still has to steer the ship to avoid collisions.

Meaning he still is MFTL


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Oh we're spliting up their feats? ok.

Gil still speedblitzes AC cloud seeing as he got hit by a bullet. 

Been took long since I played FF7.


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> Nah, in Fate/Extra CCC Gilgamesh took the protagonist to a distant planet.
> Supposedly while riding on Vimana (or not).
> Vimana was claimed to move at the speed of thought, at the speed of Gilgamesh' thought.
> Hence Crimson King is half-joking about MFTL Gil.



Supposedly it's noted to not be vimana.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Is Fate/Extra CCC canon?


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Kazuakisama said:


> Supposedly it's noted to not be vimana.



Then Gil has to steer it by himself. Same result


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## Louis Cyphre (May 31, 2013)

Crimson King you are breaking him 
I already see tears of frustration


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Sensui Seven said:


> OP says F/Z Gil, not CCC. Gil has no MFTL speed feats in F/Z.
> His combat speed is only mach 15+


All versions of Gilgamesh are the same. Barring little details like FSN Gil being "corrupted" by the Grail.
And his combat speed is Mach 45+ or maybe Mach 90 based on a certain quote.


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> Is Fate/Extra CCC canon?



Nasu wrote it, so it is.


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Louis Cyphre said:


> Crimson King you are breaking him
> I already see tears of frustration


I'm only starting to?
I must be getting rusty


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

concerning durability


> Durability: Country level+ (survived a ga level spell from the combined force of Loz and Yazoo on the Shinra Building roof)




thread needs more CT 

also -


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> All versions of Gilgamesh are the same. Barring little details like FSN Gil being "corrupted" by the Grail.
> And his combat speed is Mach 45+ or maybe Mach 90 based on a certain quote.


Thats just his reaction, doesn't count as combat speed.
Lancer's combat speed is just mach 15+, right?


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Sensui Seven said:


> Thats just his reaction, doesn't count as combat speed.
> Lancer's combat speed is just mach 15+, right?



:gio

He countered a Saber moving at mach 45 by kicking up his spear and stabbing her.


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## Louis Cyphre (May 31, 2013)

Crimson King said:


> I'm only starting to?
> I must be getting rusty


He's perpetually frustrated 
Break him is easily


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

I see.

So is this guy mach 45 or mach 90?


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Sensui Seven said:


> Thats just his reaction, doesn't count as combat speed.
> Lancer's combat speed is just mach 15+, right?


It's Mach 45+.
Mach 90 if the quote which Boom posted is right.
Besides my Mach 15 calc is actually a bit of low end.
It wouldn't be impossible for Lancer and Saber to run around at multitudes of that speed.
And that'd be just for their normal movements.
Their close combat speed is 3 times (or 6 times) faster than that.
Hence the Mach 45 speed (or now Mach 90).


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

wonder if this thread will beat Ichigo vs Gil in page count 


@ Big Boss -


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

You keep saying mach 90, where is the proof of that?

And going by that profile that Chaos seems to have made Cloud kills Gil.


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

Reacting to mach 45 speeds doesn't make one's combat speed mach 45.

For example, I can smack a tennis ball moving at 100 km/h, does it make my combat speed over 100 km/h?

Obviously not. That's just reaction speed.


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## shade0180 (May 31, 2013)

Willy will close it before that happens.


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Ok, it seems that quote from Boom has no relevance to Servant combat speeds.
They're at Mach 45+, then.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

Sensui Seven said:


> I can smack a tennis ball moving at 100 km/h, does it make my combat speed over 100 km/h?
> 
> That's just reaction.


last thread it was a baseball @ 150 km/h


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> Ok, it seems that quote from Boom has no relevance to Servant combat speeds.
> They're at Mach 45+, then.



Then like I said Cloud kills Gil.


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Sensui Seven said:


> Reacting to mach 45 speeds doesn't make one's combat speed mach 45.
> 
> For example, I can smack a tennis ball moving at 100 km/h, does it make my combat speed over 100 km/h?
> 
> That's just reaction speed.


Reaction and close combat speed to be precise.
The exact thing everyone has been saying there.
The actual movement speed of Servants is Mach 15+.
But their reactions and combat speed is 3 times of that.


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## Boomy (May 31, 2013)

I see mention about mach 90 Servants or was the soup too salty?


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Was mentioned, was discarded, thread is over, nothing to see.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

So, let me get this:

Servants:

Speed: mach 15+
Reaction speed: mach 45

Cloud speed and reactions mach 100+

Did I got it right?


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> Then like I said Cloud kills Gil.


Being twice as fast means little.
Especially since speed calcs are ambigious as they are.
The question is whether GoB can keep cloud busy enough that Gilgamesh would use an attack that can actually kill him.

But with country-level durability I guess that'd be very difficult (albeit I might argue that part a little, the feat as a whole requires a more through analysis.)
And Cloud really just only needs to cast a random Ga level spell to kill him.

So Cloud is more likely to kill Gilgamesh than in reverse.
Depending on certain things Cloud could even stomp Gilgamesh here.


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> Reaction and close combat speed to be precise.
> The exact thing everyone has been saying there.
> The actual movement speed of Servants is Mach 15+.
> But their reactions and combat speed is 3 times of that.


Oh, fine then.
I meant their actual movement speed is just mach 15+.

Btw Cloud has mach 100+ feats in Base, so he should be able to win this without any difficulty. Since omnislash v6 would be even higher than that


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Cloud can just chop his head off without the need of a spell, cause you know this guy doesn't have a helmet, reason Saber was going for that and Gil was not letting her IIRC.


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## shade0180 (May 31, 2013)

Yea that's about it.


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

Gil's only chance of winning here really is going on ship, create distance, and use Ea. 

Otherwise, yeah, Cloud kills him 99/100 times.


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> Cloud can just chop his head off without the need of a spell, cause you know this guy doesn't have a helmet, reason Saber was going for that and Gil was not letting her IIRC.


He has powerful conceptual shields that can be summoned at demands, even one which protects him from 360 degrees.

And like I said Cloud's speed advantage won't give him even nearly enough to blitz.
Not to mention he'd need to fight an entire army of weapons at once so in a way he'd be in a disadvantage even.

Omnislash or any other Limit Break would work, though.
BTW, can FF7 characters actually use their Limit Breaks in-verse without warming up or meeting the same requirements they do in gameplay?


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

> Cloud can just chop his head off without the need of a spell, cause you know this guy doesn't have a helmet, reason Saber was going for that and Gil was not letting her IIRC.


his armor wouldn't matter seeing as how Seph gets the same country+ durability (scaling from Cloud I think ?) and Cloud can chop him up (i.e. cut through said durability) good (presumably through a combination of his strength and the sharpness of his sword)


for details ask CT


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

Is Ea country level?
I doubt if Ea can kill Cloud, since Cloud has country level durability.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> He has powerful conceptual shields that can be summoned at demands, even one which protects him from 360 degrees.



Proof it can protect him from a slash from Cloud?



> And like I said Cloud's speed advantage won't give him even nearly enough to blitz.
> Not to mention he'd need to fight an entire army of weapons at once so in a way he'd be in a disadvantage even.



Unless those weapons are fast as hell (proof of their speed would be nice) dodgin and repeling them won't be an issue, not to mention his durability.



> Omnislash or any other Limit Break would work, though.
> BTW, can FF7 characters actually use their Limit Breaks in-verse without warming up or meeting the same requirements they do in gameplay?



AC shows he can.


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Well, Cloud's casual striking strength is apaprently isn't as strong as when using Limit Breaks.
Cloud's Limit Breaks, most summons and Ga level spells are at country level+ "trheat" (durability-overcoming capacity).
His regular slashes apparently aren't.


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

A GoB spam could be countered even by Shiro and Saber, why would Cloud have a problem with it?

Btw it takes too much time for GoB to open and Gil to draw out the weapons (the reason UbW overpowered GoB)


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

> Well, Cloud's casual striking strength is apaprently isn't as strong as when using Limit Breaks.
> Cloud's Limit Breaks, most summons and Ga level spells are at country level+ "trheat" (durability-overcoming capacity).
> His regular slashes apparently aren't.


that might be true, I'm no expert on FF7


although - in AC at least Seph casually stabbed through Clouds shoulder (i.e. overcame durability)

and before that Cloud was matching his blows with his own, wasn't he ?  implying similar strength levels


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Yeah, I have a strong suspicion that the multi city block/town level DC statement was made before FF7 characters became country level.
Might be better to ask Chaos, though.


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Sensui Seven said:


> I doubt if Ea can kill Cloud, since Cloud has country level durability.





Mongrel plz


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

MAPSK said:


> Mongrel plz


Gilgamesh is a mongrel in front of Cloud


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

Sensui Seven said:


> Is Ea country level?
> I doubt if Ea can kill Cloud, since Cloud has country level durability.



To answer your question, Anti-world does actually mean Anti-world.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Oh lets not start with the planet busting shit pls.


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## Sensui Seven (May 31, 2013)

Kazuakisama said:


> To answer your question, Anti-world does actually mean Anti-world.


So what exactly would "world" refer to in this case?
city? island? country? continent? planet? solar system? galaxy? or universe?
If you say planet, what makes you say so?

Just because of the word "world" in it, we can't assume it can destroy the entire earth. I also highly doubt if Gil has enough prana to destroy the entire planet.

Btw we should use only feats and not hype


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> Oh lets not start with the planet busting shit pls.



New stuff from Fate extra CCC

Runes
*Spoiler*: __ 



エヌマ・エリシュ
天地乖離す開闢の星



かいびゃく
開闢
―――すべての始まりを示す、
ギルガメッシュの最終宝具。


メソポタミア神話における神の名を冠した剣、
乖離剣エアによる空間切断。


エア神はまだ地球が原初状態だった頃、
マグマの海とガスとに覆われた地表を回し、砕き、
安定させた星の力を擬神化したものとされる。


多くの神は原初地球が安定し生命が
住まう世界となった後で国造りを始めるが、
エアはその以前、星造りを行った一神とされる。


エアの名を冠したギルガメッシュの剣は、
三層の巨大な力場を回転させることで時空流を起こし、
空間そのものを変動させる。


その真の威力は一個の生命相手に用いるものではなく、
世界を相手に用いるものだ。
サーヴァントたちが持つ数ある宝具の中でも
頂点の一つとされる、"世界を切り裂いた"剣である。




Tl;dr translation by food of beasts lair.

Enuma Elish

-The genesis of a planet is in the domain of gods. Ea's ability to rend the world and revert it to a primordial state makes its power pseudo-divine. (Sounds familiar? This is where Archetype's Regression to the Age of Gods goes back to). 
-It's true power is not meant to be used against one individual, but the World itself. 
-Apparently it does not just produce pseudo-fissures in space time, but it outright influences the flow of space-time and distorts space.


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## Boomy (May 31, 2013)

Planet buster or not Cloud is not gonna survive Ea. And I'm talking about exposure on primordial world here.


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> Oh lets not start with the planet busting shit pls.



Too bad. We're starting it. And technically, the actual blast wave is only city/mountain-level, but the attack itself distorts spacetime, which allows it to destroy entire worlds (including Reality Marbles, as Iskander unfortunately found out). So yeah, it's a planetbuster, just not in the usual sense.

EDIT: Ninja'd.



Sensui Seven said:


> Gilgamesh is a mongrel in front of Cloud





lol no


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Nice, show me the guy planet busting and we are set.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Why so slow? bring the planet busting feats yo.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Finding those planet busting feats shouldn't be hard, since you know they guy is supposse to be one.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

This is how it looks when a planet gets busted btw.


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## lokoxDZz (May 31, 2013)

Cloud rapes,ohwait i'm bit late


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

You said you were starting it, by all means finish it with the feats.


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> Why so slow? bring the planet busting feats yo.



Kazuakisama already said what needs to be said.

Speaking of CCC, why isn't FTL Gilgamesh accepted? I mean, CCC is considered canon by Nasu


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

it destroys space-time, I don't see why planet or whatever even matters





> Ea's ability to rend the world and revert it to a primordial state


well that sounds like planet razing or so to me

if the whole globe was destroyed fully - there'd be nothing to revert .. but rather - the surface is reverted to a primal state (i.e. razed) or something .. though admiteddly I might have trouble understanding whatever it is they mean there 


and - what about this info is new ? didn't we know all this already ? 



also do we know that Gil himself has the juice to bring out this kind of power (to affect the whole world/planet) out of Ea ?


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

I already gave the statement that says that Ea can rend the planet. 



MAPSK said:


> Kazuakisama already said what needs to be said.
> 
> Speaking of CCC, why isn't FTL Gilgamesh accepted? I mean, CCC is considered canon by Nasu



his ship is FTL, not him


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> it destroys space-time, I don't see why planet or whatever even matters
> 
> 
> 
> ...



He did it in hollow ataraxia. Thank god for time loops :amazed


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> it destroys space-time, I don't see why planet or whatever even matters
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Well ok. Yeah, Planetary perhaps. Planetbusting no.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

> He did it in hollow ataraxia


did what ? destroy the world/Gaias reality marble ?


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Kazuakisama said:


> I already gave the statement that says that Ea can rend the planet.
> 
> 
> 
> his ship is FTL, not him



Considering that the ship goes as fast as the speed of his thoughts though (if it is the vimana), wouldn't that make Gil FTL? And even if it isn't the vimana, wouldn't he need to be FTL or close to it to pilot it? I mean, space is empty, but not that empty. Unless he has some sort of autopilot, but considering he was flying into uncharted territory to explore, I doubt that was the case.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> it destroys space-time, I don't see why planet or whatever even matters



It matters, cause busting a planet is a big ass feat, the most thing EA has done is destroy Iskander RM that was city level size or something like that.

People always use quotes of VN and take them by face value when you need to go by FEATS.

If EA can bust planets then why didn't the city blow up when he used it against the shadows in Ataraxia? the whole primordial jizz happened yet the world is intact.

So please stop with the bullshit and bring feats, not quotes than mean jack shit.


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

MAPSK said:


> Considering that the ship goes as fast as the speed of his thoughts though (if it is the vimana), wouldn't that make Gil FTL? And even if it isn't the vimana, wouldn't he need to be FTL or close to it to pilot it? I mean, space is empty, but not that empty.



It's not like we know that he needs to turn it or anything. If we had a more comprehensive statement then maybe. We'd be otherwise be making assumptions.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

did it actually show a ship flying lightyears worth of distance ? perhaps it has a teleport function ? 

or an auto-pilot ?


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> did what ? destroy the world/Gaias reality marble ?



Yes. He used a fully charged (or close to it) Enuma Elish. It vaporized Fuyuki City to the point where it was literally a smooth crater in the ground, and it disrupted Gaia's Reality Marble. The sky itself was literally starting to crack apart like Iskander's RM, if I remember correctly.


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## Boomy (May 31, 2013)

Flutter probably meant why planet busting matters if Cloud is not gonna survive fucking space destroying hax...

Gil exposed primordial world in HA on shadow demons and erased them.


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Kazuakisama said:


> It's not like we know that he needs to turn it or anything. If we had a more comprehensive statement then maybe. We'd be otherwise be making assumptions.





Fluttershy said:


> did it actually show a ship flying lightyears worth of distance ? perhaps it has a teleport function ?
> 
> or an auto-pilot ?



Both good points (although he would need to turn it to maneuver around debris, asteroids, and other small planetoids). Fair enough. That answers my question.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

> It matters, cause busting a planet is a big ass feat, the most thing EA has done is destroy Iskander RM that was city level size or something like that.


planet or even star conventional durability won't save you from a spacetime destroying attack


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> did what ? destroy the world/Gaias reality marble ?



[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGAw90uuZs0[/YOUTUBE]

Too lazy to search the translated one, he used EA against the shadows in the city, all the primordial and going back to whatever happen in that scene, but no planet razing, no planet busting, you people just like to talk shit and wank every single chance you have.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

And who the fuck is saying Cloud is going to survive? This is about these two guys claiming shit that is false.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

Boom~of~Doom said:


> Gil exposed primordial world in HA on shadow demons and erased them.





MAPSK said:


> Yes. He used a fully charged (or close to it) Enuma Elish. It vaporized Fuyuki City to the point where it was literally a smooth crater in the ground, and it disrupted Gaia's Reality Marble. The sky itself was literally starting to crack apart like Iskander's RM, if I remember correctly.


ok, so he exposed this primordial world over Fuyuki only ? or over the whole Earth ? 

I'd expect you'd need a feat of the latter sort before planet/world level claims


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

MAPSK said:


> Yes. He used a fully charged (or close to it) Enuma Elish. It vaporized Fuyuki City to the point where it was literally a smooth crater in the ground, and it disrupted Gaia's Reality Marble. The sky itself was literally starting to crack apart like Iskander's RM, if I remember correctly.



Oh let me tell you that you don't remember shit and readed a fanfic or something.


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> Oh let me tell you that you don't remember shit and readed a fanfic or something.



One, nice grammar. Two, I already said why the effects were planetary considering the blast in Fuyuki demonstrated similar properties to what happened to Iskander's Reality Marble. Three, if supplemental material backs up what we already suspect, I see no reason to discount it. Four, it's irrelevant anyway, because Cloud still wouldn't survive.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

The video says you are full of shit, thank you for participating.


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> I'd expect you'd need a feat of the latter sort before planet/world level claims



*shrug* Ok. 

That being said, what kind of guidelines do we have as far as statements/WoG are treated?


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

although you probably meant that his exposure feat in F/HA is proof that the entire statement about rending the world is valid

dunno about that, maybe



though there's still the question that even if Ea (the statement is about Ea IIRC) can do it - can Gil power it up enough to reach that level ?


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> The video says you are full of shit, thank you for participating.



The video also isn't translated, so you have no context to base your claims that the city survived. Gil used Enuma Elish, and after some brief expository dialogue about the shit that's going down, we cut to Saber. You assume this means the city survived, but did you not consider that they're simply cutting to an event happening at the same time or shortly before Gil used Ea? It's not translated, so we don't know. Your claims that Fuyuki survived Enuma Elish are entirely baseless. And considering supplementary materials back up Ea being planetary in range as well as its feat of destroying an entire pocket universe in Fate/zero, I'm inclined to believe it has planetary range.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

MAPSK said:


> The video also isn't translated, so you have no context to base your claims that the city survived. Gil used Enuma Elish, and after some brief expository dialogue about the shit that's going down, we cut to Saber. You assume this means the city survived, but did you not consider that they're simply cutting to an event happening at the same time or shortly before Gil used Ea? It's not translated, so we don't know. Your claims that Fuyuki survived Enuma Elish are entirely baseless.



Oh it is translated I am just to lazy to find it, but let me resume this for you:

-Claim EA is a planet buster/razer because of the anti-world thing.
-Anti-world refers to RM, the earth is gaia RM
-Best feat Iskander city size RM
-Used EA in ataraxia against the shadows the whole primordial jizz happens, he destroys them, city is intact, no razing, no busting.
-Saber saves the day with the light of Excalibur.

No busting planets, razing them or whatever shit you people wank this guy to be capable of.

The city survived, that is so clear is painful how you will ignore it just to keep wanking, so like I said, thank you for participating, but you are wrong.


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

From the translated stuff, it seems Gil only took a few seconds to travel 1500 light years on his ship. There was no mention of a teleport function nor an auto pilot.

So he was able to manoeuvre his ship around asteroids and shit while moving at MFTL


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

MFTL Gil wins then.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

2 seconds sounds more like a teleport 

he thought about going to that planet --> poof, ship is there .. speed of thought 

or a hyperspace shortcut 



although MFTL Gil in FSN/FZ is amusing .. it'd make Shirou MFTL


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> Oh it is translated I am just to lazy to find it, but let me resume this for you:
> 
> -Claim EA is a planet buster/razer because of the anti-world thing.
> -Anti-world refers to RM, the earth is gaia RM
> ...



We don't know the size of Iskander's RM. Reality Marbles are technically entire worlds in and of themselves. And you just admitted that Earth is Gaia's Reality Marble, and that Enuma Elish is meant to destroy Reality Marbles. Therefore, Gilgamesh can destroy Earth. Concession accepted. Besides, even you admitted this argument is pointless. Cloud doesn't survive.

Also, dat MFTL Gil


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## TehChron (May 31, 2013)

Wait.

Wait wait wait.

If inference is out, then why would Cloud have continental durability? Isnt that inferred from him fighting the weapons?


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

-There is a calc of the size of the RM
-I explain what anti-world means in FS
-I say that the best feat Gil has is destroying Iskander RM
-Used EA in earth aka gaia RM and it was intact

Yeah not only you are wrong, but fail at reading comprehension.

Terrible user.


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## Sablés (May 31, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> although MFTL Gil in FSN/FZ is amusing.. it'd make Shirou MFTL


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> 2 seconds sounds more like a teleport
> 
> he thought about going to that planet --> poof, ship is there .. speed of thought
> 
> ...



None of that was mentioned. If you claim it has those you're going to have to prove it 

Also

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eJM-ppLPTs[/YOUTUBE]
2:30
Cutscene!Gil is a triple galaxy buster


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> -There is a calc of the size of the RM
> -I explain what anti-world means in FS
> -I say that the best feat Gil has is destroying Iskander RM
> -Used EA in earth aka gaia RM and it was intact
> ...



Show it to me then. Show me the calc of it's size. I'd like to see this.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

UBW Shirou who fought him and sliced his arm faster then he drew Ea ? what's the problem ? 

it's not like Gil is even the fastest in FSN or anything, most Servants could be scaled from him 




> If inference is out, then why would Cloud have continental durability? Isnt that inferred from him fighting the weapons?


this


> Durability: Country level+ (*survived a ga level spell from the combined force of Loz and Yazoo on the Shinra Building roof*)


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

Crimson King said:


> None of that was mentioned. If you claim it has those you're going to have to prove it
> 
> Also
> 
> ...


post the whole feat/translation then .. so I know what *was* mentioned


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## TehChron (May 31, 2013)

Fair enough


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Strange, when I watched that movie the explosion was nowhere near country sized


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Not going to show you shit, go look for it yourself, I been doing this since I joined, there have been a bunch of other users like you that make the same retarded claim without any basis and the funny thing is that you are the so called fans of the series and yet know nothing about it.


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Crimson King said:


> Strange, when I watched that movie the explosion was nowhere near country sized



I would agree with this. Not gonna dispute the calcs if we have previous evidence that the spells used were country level, but that explosion did not look like it was anywhere near potent enough to fit the durability level described here.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

Crimson King said:


> Strange, when I watched that movie the explosion was nowhere near country sized


ask Chaos 

AoE is nothing, J/cc is everything


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

MAPSK said:


> Show it to me then. Show me the calc of it's size. I'd like to see this.



The calc was made with visual only, if a person stood still on a flat surface.

Horizon extends for around 2 km before it "merges" wit the ground. Lowest cloud level is 2km.

Then I basically did a calc for the volume of a cylinder. 

it's a very low end calc


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> ask Chaos
> 
> AoE is nothing, J/cc is everything



It's very possible the spell has different yields depending on the user.


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> Not going to show you shit, go look for it yourself, I been doing this since I joined, there have been a bunch of other users like you that make the same retarded claim without any basis and the funny thing is that you are the so called fans of the series and yet know nothing about it.



Sorry, couldn't find nothing. Show it to me or I'm calling bullshit. If you wanna prove I'm wrong, get off your lazy ass and do it, or ask someone else to find it. Either way, I want to see it.

EDIT: Ninja'd. And thank you, Crimson King.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Hahahahaha this guy trying to give me orders hahahahahahahahaha, full retard mode activated yo.


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## Kazu (May 31, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> ask Chaos
> 
> AoE is nothing, J/cc is everything



I remember that Chaos did a calc based around the huge materia rocket. It came out as petatons and the huge materia are stated to have 330x the power of regular materia. so regular materia have like 50~ teratons


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

Crimson King said:


> It's very possible the spell has different yields depending on the user.


as far as I know the scaling was from the highest yield of average (not huge) materia in FF7 which was calced to country level (through the 330 times multiplier between average and huge materias .. and huge was calced to continent+ levels .. continent level divided by 330 = country level)

since it was a Ga spell it'd be as strong as that


don't know about the user, wouldn't it just depend on materia itself ?

though Loz and Yazoo were no slouches


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## Sablés (May 31, 2013)

Hmmm.

MFTL Shirou would mean MFTL Kirei which also means MFTL Kiritsugu.


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## MAPSK (May 31, 2013)

Big Bοss said:


> Hahahahaha this guy trying to give me orders hahahahahahahahaha, full retard mode activated yo.



It's the way things work. Show me the facts, or I'm not buying it. Now that Crimson King has informed me of the calc you referred to, I'm satisfied. Besides, as he said, it's a very low end calc, so we technically still don't have a good idea of how big it is. And as we've all concluded already, Cloud isn't surviving it anyway


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

MFTL Kirei?

MFTL trolling.


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Well, if it's based only on that feat then we might call that an outlier for regular Materia.
Albeit I did hear FF7 has other country-level stuff going on.

It's also possible that while the materia has the potential to unleash country-level power, not everyone is capable of channeling that much energy.
Or maybe not.
Honestly, I barely remember anything from FF7.

It'd be nice to talk the details out with Chaos.
And that was the only reason I kept this debate open.

But oh well...
Thread closes in 10 minutes.


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

MAPSK said:


> *It's the way things work in the OBD. Show me the facts, or I'm not buying it.* Now that Crimson King has informed me of the calc you referred to, I'm satisfied. Besides, as he said, it's a very low end calc, so we technically still don't have a good idea of how big it is. And as we've all concluded already, Cloud isn't surviving it anyway



The irony in this is so great irony itself can't believe it.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (May 31, 2013)

MFTL Bajiquan Facepunches combined with MFTL Trolling.

manly tears were shed


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Inconclusive?

or lol MFTL Gae Bolg to the face?


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)

Eyes of MFTL Death Perception.
@Big Boss: Just wait until you see him arguing for Father or Schr?edinger.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> Just wait until you see him arguing for Father or Schr?edinger.


who do you mean here ? 


edit: ah, you mean MAPSK then


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

I will stay away from those then.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (May 31, 2013)

Kirei trolling Lancer at MFTL speeds

MFTL tears of suffering.


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

willyvereb said:


> Eyes of MFTL Death Perception.
> @Big Boss: Just wait until you see him arguing for Father or Schr?edinger.



MFTL mollusks 

wait a minute...


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## Fenrir (May 31, 2013)

How has this lasted for so long?


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## Huntring (May 31, 2013)

Sensui Seven said:


> A GoB spam could be countered even by Shiro and Saber, why would Cloud have a problem with it?



Shriou and Saber countering it is PIS and CIS.

Shirou's UBW is a perfect counter to GoB and Gil refuses to go all out against a mongrel even when driven to the corner.

Saber wouldn't make a good waifu if she's turned into pincushion now would she?

The fact that Berserker was getting killed trying to get close to Gil and he's much much stronger then Shirou and Saber (a least Saber under Shirou) proves that if Gil wanted to he could've killed both Shirou and saber a couple dozen times



> Btw it takes too much time for GoB to open and Gil to draw out the weapons (the reason UbW overpowered GoB)



Cloud has to cross 20 meters before Gil can open GoB for that to happen.  So that isn't happening

UBW was overpowering GoB because the weapons were already there as opposed to being summoned.

As for the match itself, I don't care.


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## Crimson King (May 31, 2013)

Because this thread moves at MFTL


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## Big Bοss (May 31, 2013)

Nasu thread, always happens.


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## Louis Cyphre (May 31, 2013)

Amazing thread 
@Alpha, don't know


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## willyvereb (May 31, 2013)




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