# Strongest verse Death (Supernatural) can solo?



## Kenpachi TZ (Sep 15, 2013)

[youtube]PghNEN-29CQ[/youtube]

[youtube]kt2mH4PpSkk[/youtube]

[youtube]reOrcfUVz1c[/youtube]

[youtube]YiJ_FIOgd-w[/youtube]

Just a few scenes to refresh the memories of those who need it. I'm really curious.

*Scenario 1:* Death is IC.

*Scenario 2:* Death is bloodlusted.


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## trance (Sep 15, 2013)

Well, Death is _alot_ more powerful than Michael and Lucifer who said to be planet level with ridiculous amounts of hax, so DBZ maybe?


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## Ulti (Sep 15, 2013)

Not sure what the point in restricting the binding spell is, it's like what Kryptonite is to Superman. It's incredibly specific spell with rare ingredients, one of which being a fulgurite, an act of God where lightning strikes sand at an exact angle.

As for the thread Medeka Box


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Definitely solos Negima and To Aru


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## Xiammes (Sep 15, 2013)

How would he fair against full powered Kotarou or Moon Kotarou from Rewrite?


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## Boomy (Sep 15, 2013)

^By putting his sickle in their asses.


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## Xiammes (Sep 15, 2013)

Thats not explaining much, I only have a vague idea of Supernaturals overall power


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## Ulti (Sep 15, 2013)

I don't know who they are I'm afraid.


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## Kenpachi TZ (Sep 15, 2013)

Xiammes said:


> Thats not explaining much, I only have a vague idea of Supernaturals overall power



Oh, I thought the videos would be helpful. 



Hunteri Heroci said:


> Not sure what the point in restricting the binding spell is, it's like what Kryptonite is to Superman. It's incredibly specific spell with rare ingredients, one of which being a fulgurite, an act of God where lightning strikes sand at an exact angle.



I wasn't aware it was so specific. It's been a LONG time. Thanks for the info.

Updating the OP.


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## Boomy (Sep 15, 2013)

Death's sickle can kill anything, be it normal shit like us humans or higher dimensional beings like Angels.

+ he's an abstract of death so from what I know about Kotarou he won't do anything to him.


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Xiammes said:


> How would he fair against full powered Kotarou or Moon Kotarou from Rewrite?



This is Death that we are talking about, an abstract being whose purpose is to reap God.


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## Azzuri (Sep 15, 2013)

Isn't his power on a galactic/universal level? Which is funny, considering he was bound by a spell.


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## teddy (Sep 15, 2013)

Concerning death's own feats...

- cross-dimensional travel 
- moved the moon
- large scale weather manipulation
- soul manipulation _(being death...no fucking duh )_
- telepathy _(cockblocked sam's memories of his time in lucifer's cage with a telepathic wall)_
- abstract who existed before the known universe so there's acausality right there

probably some other stuff i'm forgetting, but you can easily powerscale other shit to him from vastly weaker beings


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## Boomy (Sep 15, 2013)

Galaxy is just another speck of dust on his shoulder.


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## Freddy Mercury (Sep 15, 2013)

Hunteri Heroci said:


> As for the thread Medeka Box



A featless character vs a verse full of NLF characters can only end well


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Just wait until season 9 airs  
who knows he might got some good feats to show


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 15, 2013)

Medaka Box gets stomped for sure


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## Xiammes (Sep 15, 2013)

> I don't know who they are I'm afraid.



through rubber

through rubber



Mahesvara said:


> Death's sickle can kill anything, be it normal shit like us humans or higher dimensional beings like Angels.
> 
> + he's an abstract of death so from what I know about Kotarou he won't do anything to him.



Full Powered Terra-Kotarou probably won't win, but Moon Kotarou is also a abstract, at the very worst I am thinking it would be a stalemate.


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Mahesvara said:


> Galaxy is just another speck of dust on his shoulder.







> "_This is one little planet, in one tiny solar system, in a   galaxy that's barely out of its diapers. I'm old, Dean, very old, so I   invite you to contemplate how insignificant I find you._"


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Xiammes said:


> Full Powered Terra-Kotarou probably won't win, but Moon Kotarou is also a abstract, at the very worst I am thinking it would be a stalemate.



Can he kill Death? 
He got no problem reaping more powerful abstract such as God.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 15, 2013)

> Moon Kotarou is also a abstract


a universal abstract ?


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## teddy (Sep 15, 2013)

To be fair, we really don't know the circumstances behind him reaping god


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

That's why I'm gonna wait until season 9 comes out


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## teddy (Sep 15, 2013)

Freddie Mercury said:


> A featless character vs a verse full of NLF characters can only end well



Um...which featless are you talking about here


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## Xiammes (Sep 15, 2013)

AntiReality said:


> Can he kill Death?
> He got no problem reaping more powerful abstract such as God.



I don't know, the full limits of his rewrite ability are delved upon, the most he did was Rewrite the entire planet, changing its history and culture to boob worshipers got ride of all the violence in the world. Also if Kotarou can get back to his Moon Dimension and can simple chop off all the branches on the theory of life and destroy all the other universes.


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## Freddy Mercury (Sep 15, 2013)

? said:


> Um...which featless are you talking about here



Oh wait, eclipse.


nigh-featless then


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## Xiammes (Sep 15, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> a universal abstract ?



Its a bit weird, he is the abstract version of himself, he embodies every version of himself throughout his multiverse and has the combined powers and memories of each one. He has had his head choped off, had his guts ripped out of him, had his mind literally melt from the information he learned, and his body was even erased from existence once and he still revived.


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## teddy (Sep 15, 2013)

Xiammes said:


> through rubber
> 
> through rubber
> 
> ...



Change up those colors in kotarou's page whenever you get the chance. the character template page has the standard set on the matter in the 'key' section

through rubber


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Freddie Mercury said:


> Oh wait, eclipse.
> 
> 
> nigh-featless then



^ not entirely I guess, if there's no eclipse then the Winchesters can't open the door to Purgatory. Eclipse is one of the requirement to unlock it.


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## teddy (Sep 15, 2013)

Freddie Mercury said:


> Oh wait, eclipse.
> 
> 
> nigh-featless then



Placing a telepathic wall in sam's mind
weather manipulation
cross-dimensional travel

yeah...

nigh-featless


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## Kenpachi TZ (Sep 15, 2013)

? said:


> To be fair, we really don't know the circumstances behind him reaping god



However, Dean stated he can't be killed because Death is "his bitch." Death may not necessarily be the one to kill God, but he's definitely going to be the one who allows it. Either way you slice it, you're either dead or you're allowed to die, and then you're dead.


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## Boomy (Sep 15, 2013)

Still enough to fuck Ajimu


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## Shiorin (Sep 15, 2013)

I'm gonna put forth Nasuverse. You guys tell me how he fares against Akasha, MEoDP, and the Third Magic.


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

MEoDP against Death himself?  

Paradox inbound


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## Boomy (Sep 15, 2013)

Akasha is featless, Heaven's Feel...it wouldn't do anything to him?

As for MEoDP - it could be quite interesting, but it can only perceive death in the world of Akasha. Even if we lift this restriction this could probably kill(or maybe not...?) Death in the current place, while Death is conceptual existence across universe.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 15, 2013)

? said:


> Placing a telepathic wall in sam's mind
> weather manipulation
> cross-dimensional travel
> 
> ...



Freddy's Medaka-tinted specs are strong


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Assuming the MeoDP is used to kill Death, then the concept of death will vanish. And the ability of MEoDP will be gone, rendering them useless


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 15, 2013)

He will stale-mate alot of verses at any rate

You need atleast a Cube Level-being to put him down for good


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## Ulti (Sep 15, 2013)

Can't remember if Death displayed the ability to stop time or not... But it's safe to assume he can, *all* Reapers can stop time and as many people put it in the series, Death is the "big daddy Reaper" the one who created them as his heralds.


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## Bioness (Sep 15, 2013)

Where is it stated or shown Death is an abstract and not just a representation?


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## Ulti (Sep 15, 2013)

Bioness said:


> Where is it stated or shown Death is an abstract and not just a representation?



From the Season 5 companion guide, which is an official source of information full of interviews with the writers and cast.



> The things the Horseman represent in pestilence, famine and war are like forces of nature and are states that humans experience all the time. So it isn't as though when Lucifer comes on the scene he brings these monsters with him that are unleashed that we haven't been experiencing the effects of throughout history. It's more that he gathers them to him.



Famine, Pestilence and War are representations.

Stated by Sera Gamble, who was one of the head writers at that time. Notice how she doesn't include Death in there, which indicates to me that isn't the case with him as it is his brothers. This is also the same guide which goes out of its way to say that the reason Death is indestructible is because he is a "fundamental, driving force behind the universe"

Though sadly, no trace of scans of these are on the Internet (believe me I tried...)  so I can't blame if you discard this. But the actual series backs up this sentiment in that the other horsemen are defeated by removing their rings (reducing their physical manifestation to a husk, while the concept of War etc: still exists of course)

However, Death is not even hindered by the loss of his ring, in fact he willingly gives it to Dean who iirc still has it.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 15, 2013)

And Bio fails at downplaying yet again


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 15, 2013)

Bioness said:


> Where is it stated or shown Death is an abstract and not just a representation?


he _is_ Death .. _the_ death

that is abstract by definition (I'm talking about being the concept of death in the universe, not Marvel abstract level )


wtf is representation ?


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## Freddy Mercury (Sep 15, 2013)

Black Leg Sanji said:


> And Bio fails at downplaying yet again



Asking a question isn't downplaying.


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## Bioness (Sep 15, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> he _is_ Death .. _the_ death
> 
> that is abstract by definition (I'm talking about being the concept of death in the universe, not Marvel abstract level )
> 
> ...



Representation 



> ˌrepriˌzenˈtāSHən,-zən-/Submit
> noun
> 1.
> the action of speaking or acting on behalf of someone or the state of being so represented.



They are not the actual force, but just take up the actions of it.

And Death from Family Guy has honestly done more to prove that he is an abstract than the Death from Supernatural.



And we know he isn't, so there isn't much evidence besides "assumptions" going on for Supernatural.

And you know how many "Deaths" there are in fiction? That doesn't mean they are death itself. A name means nothing.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 15, 2013)

Freddie Mercury said:


> Asking a question isn't downplaying.





Do try too keep up


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 15, 2013)

Bioness said:


> And Death from Family Guy has honestly done more to prove that he is an abstract than the Death from Supernatural.
> 
> 
> 
> And we know he isn't, so there isn't much evidence besides "assumptions" going on for Supernatural.



> Broke his leg
> Hasnt done anything on SN Deaths level

Shitty comparison is shitty


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## Orochibuto (Sep 15, 2013)

He isn't beating Digimon and Medaka Box, that is for sure.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 15, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> He isn't beating Digimon, that is for sure.



He isnt beating anything universal+ or above, period


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## Luftwaffles (Sep 15, 2013)




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## Orochibuto (Sep 15, 2013)

I can see it beating Haruhiverse, though not because he overpowers her, but because everyone there minus Yuki is meh, Haruhi is incredibly easy to steal her power and I assume kill.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 15, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> I can see it beating Haruhiverse, though not because he overpowers her, but because everyone there minus Yuki is meh, Haruhi is incredibly easy to steal her power and I assume kill.



She could easily erase him if she's bloodlusted


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 15, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> He isn't beating Medaka Box, that is for sure.


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## Louis Cyphre (Sep 15, 2013)

Anything above universal+ would destroy him


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## Orochibuto (Sep 15, 2013)

Ajimu survived the Big Bang and blasted a star by pointing her finger, this is leagues above any feat Death feat.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 15, 2013)

sure she did


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## Orochibuto (Sep 15, 2013)

The Big Bang feat might be debatable because we don't know the distance she was when it occured, but the star buster was clear as day, there is no way around it.


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## Eldritch Sukima (Sep 15, 2013)

Please tell me we're not doing this Big Bang thing again.

I thought we already dragged that behind a shed and took a shotgun to it in the Yukari thread.


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## teddy (Sep 15, 2013)

Yeah, it's fairly obvious that he's an abstract. effectively predates the universe along with god, isn't bothered with the loss of his ring, and outright implies that he'll be the last thing living in due time

family guy death got side lined by a broken leg so a bit of a piss poor comparison there

spn's reapers are a better death than family guy's as far as i'm concerned


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## ikoke (Sep 15, 2013)

I wonder how he would do in Bastard!! verse.

They don't have any universe level(or above) feat as yet(unless you consider Satan creating a mini universe in his hands back when he was an angel);but they can completely destroy an enemy's body,spirit & soul,regenerate from different planes of existence,and have resistance to reality warping(and almost every other kind of hax).


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## Orochibuto (Sep 15, 2013)

Eldritch Sukima said:


> Please tell me we're not doing this Big Bang thing again.
> 
> I thought we already dragged that behind a shed and took a shotgun to it in the Yukari thread.



We left the Big Bang aside, what I am saying is that she trivially starbusted and this is beyond any feat Death has performed. Then we have All-Fiction, he isn't surviving that if hit.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 15, 2013)

it's like Orochibuto selectively ignored more then half of this thread


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## Regicide (Sep 15, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> Ajimu survived the Big Bang


Wasn't this debunked?


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## Ulti (Sep 15, 2013)

>my post ignored
>Family Guy Death being compared to Supernatural Death
>Medeka Box


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## Qinglong (Sep 15, 2013)

We're just going through the motions again


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## Orochibuto (Sep 15, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> it's like Orochibuto selectively ignored more then half of this thread



Or you can tell me which feats Death have which put him above casual star busting and haxx like All-Fiction.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 15, 2013)

ikoke said:


> I wonder how he would do in Bastard!! verse.
> 
> They don't have any universe level(or above) feat as yet(unless you consider Satan creating a mini universe in his hands back when he was an angel);but they can completely destroy an enemy's body,spirit & soul,regenerate from different planes of existence,and have resistance to reality warping(and almost every other kind of hax).



Cant do anything to Seraph-class angels

They outclass him in raw power too


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## Bioness (Sep 15, 2013)

Black Leg Sanji said:


> Do try too keep up


 This is irrelevant and a massive strawman.


Black Leg Sanji said:


> > Broke his leg
> > Hasnt done anything on SN Deaths level
> 
> Shitty comparison is shitty


He can effortlessly time travel and when he broke his leg everyone on the planet stopped dying.

That clearly shows his ties to the concept of death. You can also predate the universe and still not be an abstract.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 15, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> it's like Orochibuto selectively ignored more then half of this thread



He's not the only one..

Interesting cherry picking to say the least


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## Shiorin (Sep 15, 2013)

Orochibuto bringing the autism.


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## Ulti (Sep 15, 2013)

> and when he broke his leg everyone on the planet stopped dying.



Stuff like this happens when Reapers in Supernatural go missing, just see _Death Takes a Holiday_ so I'm with Teddy on this:



> spn's reapers are a better death than family guy's as far as i'm concerned


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> Ajimu survived the Big Bang and blasted a star by pointing her finger, this is leagues above any feat Death feat.



wtf is this shit??

Do I need to remind you Death is an abstract concept?? 

And this :






> "_This is one little planet, in one tiny solar system, in a    galaxy that's barely out of its diapers. I'm old, Dean, very old, so I    invite you to contemplate how insignificant I find you._"


And getting defeated by ALL-Fiction?? really?? Death?? the embodiment of end of all things?? then I want you to prove me that All-Fiction could destroy something powerful as conceptual being.

geez, the autism is strong in this thread...


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## Shiorin (Sep 15, 2013)

Death in SPN has the same effect as Death in Family Guy. When Dean started to slack off people stopped dying as well.

[YOUTUBE]mTbFYwoaBs8[/YOUTUBE]
[YOUTUBE]44tcCTzodhw[/YOUTUBE]


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## Bioness (Sep 15, 2013)

AntiReality said:


> wtf is this shit??
> 
> Do I need to remind you Death is an abstract concept??
> 
> ...



Means nothing when no one in Supernatural has feats above planet level. What about this is so hard for you to understand?


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

^ So Death creating an eclipse doesn't count as feats?? 



One the requirement to open the Purgatory's door is an eclipse. If Death didn't create an eclipse, then the door to Purgatory cannot be opened. Is simple as that.


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## Orochibuto (Sep 15, 2013)

AntiReality said:


> ^ So Death creating an eclipse doesn't count as feats??
> 
> 
> 
> One the requirement to open the Purgatory's door is an eclipse. If Death didn't create an eclipse, then the door to Purgatory cannot be opened. Is simple as that.



That is his greatest feat impressive but we don't know how he did it, we don't know how much time it took him or effort. Even if we give him zero effort and casual, it isn't on the tier of saying "bang" with your finger to a distant star and exploding it on sight, not to mention all the reality alternations that would be needed for said effect to be noticed instantly (as you know even if a star disappear it will take time for us to see it has disappeared).


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## Velocity (Sep 15, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> Or you can tell me which feats Death have which put him above casual star busting and haxx like All-Fiction.



He can, and will, reap God and Castiel at his strongest was still a complete pansy compared to him.


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> That is his greatest feat impressive but we don't know how he did it, we don't know how much time it took him or effort. Even if we give him zero effort and casual, it isn't on the tier of saying "bang" with your finger to a distant star and exploding it on sight, not to mention all the reality alternations that would be needed for said effect to be noticed instantly (as you know even if a star disappear it will take time for us to see it has disappeared).



Speaking of star-busting, how is Ajimu's durability? 

Death's Scythe would slice Ajimu more efficiently than Ihiko's rubber.


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Velocity said:


> He can, and will, reap God and Castiel at his strongest was still a complete pansy compared to him.



^ This. God Castiel blows up Archangel Raphael like it was nothing. But he's still below Michael and Lucifer, so we can put him on Gabriel tier.


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## Fujita (Sep 15, 2013)

AntiReality said:


> ^ So Death creating an eclipse doesn't count as feats??
> 
> 
> 
> One the requirement to open the Purgatory's door is an eclipse. If Death didn't create an eclipse, then the door to Purgatory cannot be opened. Is simple as that.





Bioness said:


> Means nothing when no one in Supernatural has feats *above planet level*. What about this is so hard for you to understand?



Not that I agree with what Bioness is saying in this thread, but you might want to read the post you're replying to more closely. 

Anyway

Death was imprisoned for quite a while and people kept dying. That Dean had to physically touch people using the Horseman's Ring was just a way for Death to give him a test, more than anything else. Now, if Reapers slack off, yeah, then people stop dying. 

Death's scythe is rumored to be able to kill even Death as well as being actually shown to finish off his minons, though exactly how reliable that statement is is a bit vague. Never got a chance seeing as it nearly burned Dean's hand off just from being near the guy.


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## Eldritch Sukima (Sep 15, 2013)

AntiReality said:


> But he's still below Michael, so we can put him between Gabriel and Lucifer tier.



When was God Castiel shown or stated to be below Michael?


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## Fujita (Sep 15, 2013)

Eldritch Sukima said:


> When was God Castiel shown or stated to be below Michael?



Well, _just_ going off him being stronger than Raphael, you'd have trouble claiming him to be stronger than Michael. Though... the same would go for claiming Michael to be stronger than him.

As far as implications go, the guy with a soul arsenal who makes a credible claim to be god as far as the hosts of heaven are concerned should be stronger than Michael.


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Eldritch Sukima said:


> When was God Castiel shown or stated to be below Michael?



Based on this one :



> CROWLEY:
> I take it you intend to keep the live share? So, what you're saying is hell's being downsized?
> 
> 
> ...


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Fujita said:


> Death's scythe is rumored to be able to kill even Death as well as being actually shown to finish off his minons, though exactly how reliable that statement is is a bit vague. Never got a chance seeing as it nearly burned Dean's hand off just from being near the guy.



 strangely, the angel's blade able to kill Reapers easily. As shown by Crowley himself.


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## Eldritch Sukima (Sep 15, 2013)

AntiReality said:


> Based on this one :



All that tells us is that he doesn't want to deal with Michael and Lucifer when he can easily keep them trapped instead. That doesn't necessarily mean he's weaker than them.


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## Qinglong (Sep 15, 2013)

What's he mean by "done away with completely"

He was going to nuke hell?


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## Freddy Mercury (Sep 15, 2013)

AntiReality said:


> Speaking of star-busting, how is Ajimu's durability?
> 
> Death's Scythe would slice Ajimu more efficiently than Ihiko's rubber.



Should be much higher than her DC, to say the least.


Also Iihiko's ability is pretty damn broken, even for MB standards.


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## Fujita (Sep 15, 2013)

Qinglong said:


> What's he mean by "done away with completely"
> 
> He was going to nuke hell?



Just end the institution and funnel everyone to heaven, I think. 

Wouldn't want to give the demons soul power, after all


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## Əyin (Sep 15, 2013)

Dang, seems I underestimate God Castiel.


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## Poxbox (Sep 15, 2013)

Fujita said:


> Just end the institution and funnel everyone to heaven, I think.
> 
> Wouldn't want to give the demons soul power, after all


Yeah...right...heaven. More like gobble all of them up just like purgatory.


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## Fujita (Sep 15, 2013)

Poxbox said:


> Yeah...right...heaven. More like gobble all of them up just like purgatory.



Well, in heaven, they _are_ part of his arsenal


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## Sherlōck (Sep 15, 2013)

I didn't like Heaven in SN to be honest.


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## Orochibuto (Sep 16, 2013)

Velocity said:


> He can, and will, reap God and



Is there an actual feat for this or this is based on statements and inference?



Velocity said:


> Castiel at his strongest was still a complete pansy compared to him.



Is castiel DC star level?


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## Kenpachi TZ (Sep 16, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> Is there an actual feat for this or this is based on statements and inference?



Just out of curiosity, how does one gain a feat (supportive) of killing God, a being that by definition cannot have a rival, without actually killing God?


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## Orochibuto (Sep 16, 2013)

Kenpachi TZ said:


> Just out of curiosity, how does one gain a feat (supportive) of killing God, a being that by definition cannot have a rival, without actually killing God?



It means that either:

- The feat can't be done.
- God in Supernatural while the most powerful being and universal creator, is not supreme and thus invincible. Which would not suprise me since Death says neither God or him can remember who is older.


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## Bioness (Sep 16, 2013)

As mention before we don't even know how Death would "reap" God. For all we know it might just be when God decides to die and not an actual killing, which to be honest seems the most likely scenario.


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## Kenpachi TZ (Sep 16, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> It means that either:
> 
> - The feat can't be done.



The fact he cannot get a feat indicative of killing God by virtue of its impossibility doesn't equate to an inability to kill Him.



Orochibuto said:


> - God in Supernatural while the most powerful being and universal creator, is not supreme and thus invincible. Which would not suprise me since Death says neither God or him can remember who is older.



I touched on this previously when I brought up how Dean stated he couldn't be killed "even if God pulls the trigger" because "Death is [their] bitch" to infer that mortality, or lack of, is a decision made by Death.

In other words, they're somewhat like two sides of the same coin: God generally makes stuff exist, Death generally makes stuff stop existing. Death doesn't diminish God's position as the Supreme being. It's just that God simply falls under the technicality of existing (as would Death, I suppose) so Death can make him (and himself, I suppose) stop existing.

I don't want to Inception deeper than that as it'd start raising more questions than it does answers.


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## Eldritch Sukima (Sep 16, 2013)

Kenpachi TZ said:


> It's just that God simply falls under the technicality of existing (as would Death, I suppose) so Death can make him (and himself, I suppose) stop existing.



Death mentions that nothing lasts forever except himself, so I doubt he's capable of suicide.


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## Orochibuto (Sep 16, 2013)

Kenpachi TZ said:


> The fact he cannot get a feat indicative of killing God by virtue of its impossibility doesn't equate to an inability to kill Him.




Then if the feat can't happen then it can't be used period, either it is a feat and we use it or it doesn't.


If we use statements as fact, then we can use Ajimu's ablities as well one of them called "Become God". Either Death kills God or it is demonstrated he can, or the feat and its implications can't be used. I am only sticking to feats, as feats stands Death or anyone in Supernatural on that matter has no business with some that can "bang" with her finger a star, though they may still win via speedblitz.



Kenpachi TZ said:


> I touched on this previously when I brought up how Dean stated he couldn't be killed "even if God pulls the trigger" because "Death is [their] bitch" to infer that mortality, or lack of, is a decision made by Death.
> 
> 
> In other words, they're somewhat like two sides of the same coin: God generally makes stuff exist, Death generally makes stuff stop existing. Death doesn't diminish God's position as the Supreme being. It's just that God simply falls under the technicality of existing (as would Death, I suppose) so Death can make him (and himself, I suppose) stop existing.
> ...



Then this means the Supernaturalverse is a duality, thus God in Supernatural is not supreme and would lose to someone who is or have multiversal power (since as far as I remember only omnipotent beings are excused of not having to show higher power than the adversary).

Just like the Sant of Killers God who could be killed by the Saint.


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## Ulti (Sep 16, 2013)

> In other words, they're somewhat like two sides of the same coin: God generally makes stuff exist, Death generally makes stuff stop existing. Death doesn't diminish God's position as the Supreme being. It's just that God simply falls under the technicality of existing (as would Death, I suppose) so Death can make him (and himself, I suppose) stop existing.



Death has always been portrayed as the antithesis to God, so this makes sense.

Also why are just talking about raw power? Hax has always been Supernatural's main advantage and there are beings far lower on the totem pole than Death with the hax to deal with Ajimu.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 16, 2013)

Hunteri Heroci said:


> Death has always been portrayed as the antithesis to God, so this makes sense.
> 
> Also why are just talking about raw power? Hax has always been Supernatural's main advantage and there are beings far lower on the totem pole than Death with the hax to deal with Ajimu.



Gab pulls out WWH


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## Shiorin (Sep 16, 2013)

Even regular angels are "" and incorporeal. Every time Oro mentions DC and starbusting a kitten dies.


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## OtherGalaxy (Sep 16, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> If we use statements as fact, then we can use Ajimu's ablities as well one of them called "Become God". Either Death kills God or it is demonstrated he can, or the feat and its implications can't be used. I am only sticking to feats, as feats stands Death or anyone in Supernatural on that matter has no business with some that can "bang" with her finger a star, though they may still win via speedblitz.



Just wanted to comment on this, but you're getting two things mixed up here.

Statements are not automatically invalid, they have to be checked out case by case. The thing with Ajimu "becoming God" (and many of her other skills) isn't a matter of the statements being reliable, it's pure NLF and lack of feats. What does "become God" tell us about her DC or any other skills? Nothing, it's just a title.

Whereas a statement of Death eventually reaping SPN's God at least gives us something to work with: Death should be roughly equal to SPN's God who already has feats.


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## Freddy Mercury (Sep 16, 2013)

OtherGalaxy said:


> Statements are not automatically invalid, they have to be checked out case by case. The thing with Ajimu "becoming God" (and many of her other skills) isn't a matter of the statements being reliable, it's pure NLF and lack of feats. What does "become God" tell us about her DC or any other skills? Nothing, it's just a title.



Ajimu actually has a ton of specific skills named, it's just that the OBD decided to label them all as hyperbole and NLF's, even the ones she should be more than capable of doing with the feats she's already shown on panel.


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## Kenpachi TZ (Sep 16, 2013)

Eldritch Sukima said:


> Death mentions that nothing lasts  forever except himself, so I doubt he's capable of suicide.



He could take his own Scythe to his own throat or such. It was mentioned as the only thing capable of killing him. In fact, I suspect he forged it for that very reason considering he's so old that he hardly cares about anything.



Orochibuto said:


> Then if the feat can't happen then it can't be used period, either it is a feat and we use it or it doesn't.
> 
> Either Death kills God or it is demonstrated he can, or the feat and its  implications can't be used. I am only sticking to feats, as feats  stands Death or anyone in Supernatural on that matter has no business  with some that can "bang" with her finger a star, though they may still  win via speedblitz.



Lack of a feat =/= unable to perform feat. Are they correlated? Yes. Is the correlation always true? Nope.



Orochibuto said:


> If we use statements as fact, then we can use Ajimu's ablities as well one of them called "Become God".



No, you can't. Not when SN doesn't lend itself anywhere close to NLF and hyperbole that most, dare I say nearly all, manga find themselves guilty of.

Even assuming this isn't hyperbole, how would this help against a guy who says he can and will kill God?



Orochibuto said:


> Then this means the Supernaturalverse is a duality, thus God in Supernatural is not supreme and would lose to someone who is or have multiversal power (since as far as I remember only omnipotent beings are excused of not having to show higher power than the adversary).
> 
> Just like the Sant of Killers God who could be killed by the Saint.



If God isn't supreme because Death can kill him, that would make Death the supreme being in the SNverse. As such, he would count as an omnipotent thus excused of not having to show higher power than... anything that's ever died.

Wouldn't that make your demand for feats is pointless?
**


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## OtherGalaxy (Sep 16, 2013)

Freddie Mercury said:


> Ajimu actually has a ton of specific skills named, it's just that the OBD decided to label them all as hyperbole and NLF's, *even the ones she should be more than capable of doing with the feats she's already shown on panel.*



Well that makes...no sense at all

I was trying to aim specifically at Orochibuto's...interesting interpretation of using statements though. "Becoming God" skill having even less basis than what he was trying to counter and all.


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## Ulti (Sep 16, 2013)

God has created the various realms of the afterlife, including Heaven which is hundreds of billions of dimensions huddled together.

So while he may not have many feats, they are the most impressive, enough to justify his name at least.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 16, 2013)

Death :

> is on a similar level to God who's universal
> refers to Milky Way galaxy as something small and insignificant (not 100% proof, but would be fitting for a universal)
> is older then the universe and possibly God
> will reap God, possibly meaning that his scythe DC > God 
> is (the concept of) Death _for_ the _entire_ universe 


has Medaka Box wank truly gotten so bad that someone thinks Death doesn't solo it easily ?


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 16, 2013)

Oh god no

Saitomaru lurking, more "LOLNOPE" incoming



Fluttershy said:


> Death :
> 
> > is on a similar level to God who's universal
> > refers to Milky Way galaxy as something small and insignificant (not 100% proof, but would be fitting for a universal)
> ...



Freddy and Bio gonna tear you apart now

Be very afraid


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 16, 2013)

I can already see a Bioneg in my CP


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 16, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> I can already see a Bioneg in my CP



It wasnt just me then


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## Əyin (Sep 16, 2013)

Fluttershy said:


> I can already see a Bioneg in my CP



I got one too.
Fuck it, it was worth it to call them out.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 16, 2013)

no, I didn't get one yet, but at this rate I will soon


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 16, 2013)

Really tempted to make a Big G thread now..


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## Kenpachi TZ (Sep 16, 2013)

Ouch, doesn't Bioness neg for like... a bazillion points?


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 16, 2013)

his bark is worse then his bite


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## Tranquil Fury (Sep 16, 2013)

> Whereas a statement of Death eventually reaping SPN's God at least gives us something to work with: Death should be roughly equal to SPN's God who already has feats



It gives us nothing to work with, we do not know how he'll do this, he's been sealed up before and I'm sure God can do it again or recreate the binding spell, guessing he taught the angels how to do it and by extension Lucifer.

I agree that Death has been potrayed and hyped as being the closest thing to god in SPN based on feats, statements and his own potrayal but every thread with Death turns into the "will reap god" thing and it leads to nothing useful.

He's the abstract of death, implied to be of the universe considering he considers Earth quite young(neither he nor God remember who came first due to how old they are). Killing a concept like that is not easy, then add his H4X like time travel, time stop, time loop, reality warping, death touch etc and the fact his raw power is planetary level atleast. He'd be above HST, FMA, SDK, YYH and various other verses.

Speed is'nt a problem, they can't kill a concept/fundamental force so he does'nt have to worry about much.



> refers to Milky Way galaxy as something small and insignificant (not 100% proof, but would be fitting for a universal)



You misunderstood his convo with Dean. His "I'm older than you can imagine" dialogue was part of that. He considers the Milky Way Galaxy insignificant because it's one Galaxy vs countless other Galaxies in the universe. He also states that Milky Way Galaxy= young "a galaxy barely out of it's diapers".

That statement is not the type of proof you are looking for, it does not mean what you think it does , it's to establish his age and how small one planet or even one Galaxy is in scale to the rest of the universe. I'm not saying Death can't be universal, it's implied he's a universal force of death but let's not take every little statement and blow it out of proportion.

_"To a thing like me, a thing like you...well think about how you'd feel if a bacterium sat at your table and started to get snarky. This is one tiny planet, one tiny little solar system in a galaxy that's barely out of its diapers. I'm old, Dean, very old. So I invite you to contemplate how insignificant I find you."_

It was an age thing, it established that he considers humans like bacteria due to how far beneath him they are and how old he is compared to the Milkyway.

Great scene, great acting and great dialogue there BTW.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 16, 2013)

Does he get reality warping and time manipulation cause of powerscaling from angels?


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## Ulti (Sep 16, 2013)

Time manipulation because every Reaper is capable of it and he's the "big daddy" as they put it.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 16, 2013)

Oh right

Been a few years since i watched those eps


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## Tranquil Fury (Sep 16, 2013)

Black Leg Sanji said:


> Does he get reality warping and time manipulation cause of powerscaling from angels?



Reapers do time manipulation on a lesser scale but it's obvious that Death is WAY beyond Michael and Lucifer in the cosmic scale of SPN when he can enter The Cage without them being able to stop him from taking Sam's soul and even God Castiel did'nt want to fight Death despite how powerful he was compared to Archangel Raphael to a point he could kill him with a finger snap or take away his ability to teleport away(to be fair he did'nt want Michael out of the cage either but Death can waltz in and out on a whim). Dean and Sam called Death the most powerful thing they ever hunted.

Death is vastly above most SPN not God, older than just about anything and clearly more knowledgeable on the universe than most not God, he's been around since before the universe possibly. 

Don't see why he does'nt get powerscaling from beings who are lesser than him in every way.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 16, 2013)

Tranquil Fury said:


> Reapers do time manipulation on a lesser scale but it's obvious that Death is WAY beyond Michael and Lucifer in the cosmic scale of SPN when he can enter The Cage without them being able to stop him from taking Sam's soul and even God Castiel did'nt want to fight Death despite how powerful he was compared to Archangel Raphael. Dean and Sam called Death the most powerful thing they ever hunted.
> 
> Death is vastly above most SPN not God, older than just about anything and clearly more knowledgeable on the universe than most not God, he's been around since before the universe possibly.
> 
> Don't see why he does'nt get powerscaling from beings who are lesser than him in every way.



I agree with you, he should

Just had to ask since i forgot some details


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## Velocity (Sep 16, 2013)

Orochibuto said:


> Is there an actual feat for this or this is based on statements and inference?



It's a reliable character statement. Death isn't the kind of guy to joke around or lie or exaggerate. He's very straightforward and serious. He's significantly more powerful than even the Archangels, each of whom is a confirmed planetary threat, and everything points to God and Death being equals. We don't need to see him reap God to know that when he says he will, he will.


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## Tranquil Fury (Sep 16, 2013)

> each of whom is a confirmed planetary threat



Only Michael and Lucifer, Lucy actually has the feats to back it up and Michael has already beaten him with good odds by Castiel and Zachariah on him beating Lucifer again. 

Raphael blacked out the eastern seaboard, impressive but not sure how that feat is used. Is it a feat of electrokinesis?Is it implicating he can destroy the Eastern Seaboard?I mean he's able shit over lesser angels and very H4X but nothing planetary. Michael is vastly above Raphael as per Castiel's statement to Dean.

Gabriel was more about reality warping than raw power, Lucifer taught him everything he knew and Michael in turn taught Lucifer everything he knew. Lucifer was vastly above Gabriel to a point he tried to avoid direct combat and restored to a trick,Lucy saw through it and overpowered Gabriel in CQC.

Michael and Lucifer are way above their younger siblings.

But yes Death shits over Michael and Lucifer.


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## Kenpachi TZ (Sep 16, 2013)

Does anybody know of blatantly exaggerated claims in SN? 

I don't need to read a chapter of any of the presented mangas to know that they're probably full of them.


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## Tranquil Fury (Sep 16, 2013)

Then you'd be wrong or just hating on a work of fiction. Plenty of fiction have such claims, does'nt mean all should be ignored as wrong. Especially when some of those have been reinforced repeatedly by different characters and some of them have actually happened albeit off screen like Death's eclipse but that's budget reasons.


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## Kenpachi TZ (Sep 16, 2013)

Either I haven't spoken clearly or you don't understand where I was going with that question.

Every manga I've read has its fair share of hyperbole. I don't see anywhere near the same amount of exaggeration in series, especially SN where they like to demonstrate that Sam & Dean are players in something _*a lot*_ bigger than they are rather than just say it. I understand the budget concerns and appreciate how they work around it _*so*_ well that it doesn't even matter.

I was asking whether I made an oversight seeing as it's been a while since I watched SN as to whether they also have a lot of exaggeration.


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## Nevermind (Sep 16, 2013)

ikoke said:


> I wonder how he would do in Bastard!! verse.
> 
> They don't have any universe level(or above) feat as yet(unless you consider Satan creating a mini universe in his hands back when he was an angel);but they can completely destroy an enemy's body,spirit & soul,regenerate from different planes of existence,and have resistance to reality warping(and almost every other kind of hax).



There is still God, who's universal, and Satan should in all honesty be up there as well. Aside from creating the mini universe there is the size of his Augoeides implying he is at the very least, far, far, far above galaxy level, if not universal.



Black Leg Sanji said:


> Cant do anything to Seraph-class angels
> 
> They outclass him in raw power too



I don't really see how they're capable of killing an abstract TBH. Meanwhile if Death is on par with God he should be able to take them. Stalemate at best IMO.


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## Black Leg Sanji (Sep 16, 2013)

Nevermind said:


> I don't really see how they're capable of killing an abstract TBH. Meanwhile if Death is on par with God he should be able to take them. Stalemate at best IMO.



Should have said he stalemates at best cause their durability is far above anything he's done and they cant do anything to him in turn

Also not sure how time manipulation and reality warping at SN's level would affect Eternal Atoms (Havent read that far yet)


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## Tranquil Fury (Sep 16, 2013)

> I don't really see how they're capable of killing an abstract TBH. Meanwhile if Death is on par with God he should be able to take them. Stalemate at best IMO



He can't take them. They are too fast and while I did say Death being a concept can negate speed advantage, he has no feat or powerscaling that let's him hurt beings who can touch star level let alone some of the stronger Luminous bodies which can rival Quasars. Fallen Uriel is a Galaxy buster, Satan does it by virtue of sheer size alone which is going to be a problem as Death is not a Galaxy buster(yet). He can't hurt them even if they allowed it, he can't bypass their dispel bounds due to lacking the raw power and speed either. I'm not sure if his death touch will work on them or not, they're vastly above anything in SPN he's tried to claim or claimed.

It's really just a stalemate due to his abstract nature making it hard for them to kill him and them just being WAY above him overall in feats making it impossible for him to kill them. His range is not sufficient to tag MFTL characters.


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## ikoke (Sep 16, 2013)

Nevermind said:


> There is still God, who's universal, and Satan should in all honesty be up there as well. Aside from creating the mini universe there is the size of his Augoeides implying he is at the very least, far, far, far above galaxy level, if not universal.



I left out God because he's been a background character up till now,but yeah, he should be at least universal.

Besides him,wasn't there another dark god that Satan prayed to?

Also,is it just my memory malfunctioning or was Metatron mentioned as being the one who split the Judas Pain into pieces?


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## Orochibuto (Sep 16, 2013)

We don't know how Death will "reap" God, it might have to do with killing him, or not. This is something that can't be used, reasonable powerscaling Im all for it, but this particular statment is something that simply can't be used to meassure Death.


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## Orochibuto (Sep 16, 2013)

Kenpachi TZ said:


> If God isn't supreme because Death can kill him, that would make Death the supreme being in the SNverse. As such, he would count as an omnipotent thus excused of not having to show higher power than... anything that's ever died.
> 
> Wouldn't that make your demand for feats is pointless?
> **



No, because that would make Death the most powerful being in his verse, not omnipotent. Being the most powerful being in a verse does not automatically make you omnipotent, though it is certaintly a good way to get there omnipotence have to be vadilated by claims, confirmed by feats and never contradicted.

Death has already a contradiction to that, he CAN'T remember who is older, apparently he could not undo the seal himself, thus Death even if stronger than God would not make him omnipotent just the most powerful guy in his verse. Though of course if this statement is true (too bad it can't be used for the reasons I posted) that would make Death strong enough to solo a lot of verses, including Haruhi, Medaka Box and while not solo high rank in Saint Seiya.

Do note that by "solo" I mean fighting all characters at the same time bloodlusted, if it is "solo" as in Story Mode, then I agree Death by himself should solo a lot of verses.


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