# Gilgamesh vs AC Sephiroth (read OP)



## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 6, 2012)

*Fate Zero Gilgamesh, has spirit form, no servant immunities though*


bloodlusted, PIC/CIS off

basic/reputation knowledge


Scenario 1: speed unequal

Scenario 2: speed equal


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## Xelloss (Nov 6, 2012)

Gae bolg... masamamune (I know theres a copy on the vault)


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 6, 2012)

Seph has been moving up in the world recently

it's probably not that easy


Gay Bulge melee also works at close range only IIRC

standart distance 20m


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## Sygurgh (Nov 6, 2012)

Lugh's spear is Gae Bolg without the distance issue. Or was it Odin's? Anyway, Gilgamesh has both.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 6, 2012)

Seph has Mach 50+ reactions and teleport (?)


also a barrier

which Gae Bolg version could bypass walls again ?


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## Atem (Nov 6, 2012)

The close ranged Gae Bulg has the casualty reversal that overwhelms durability. The long ranged version _Soaring Spear that Strikes with Death_, was blocked after it was fired by Archer's Rho Aias IIRC. It didn't appear to have the casualty reversal because otherwise Archer wouldn't have had the time to put up a defense.


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## ikoke (Nov 6, 2012)

Fluttershy said:


> Seph has Mach 50+ reactions and teleport (?)
> 
> 
> also a barrier
> ...



Causality Reversal would probably result in the spear piercing Sephiroth before the barrier is created.And someone posted the other day that WoG states that the thrown version of Gae Bolg(Lance of Death Flight) is semi-intangible and requires a superior conceptual barrier to block-likely on the level of Rho Aius.Though I don't know whether Sephy's barrier counts as a conceptual defense.

Also shouldn't blood lusted Gil go for Ea rather than Gae Bolg?

But Teleport on Sephy's part would be troublesome,since Gil doesn't have Instinct or EotM to act as precog,and Sephy is faster.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 6, 2012)

Gilgamesh would know where Sephiroth teleports the moment he makes the decision. That's his battlefield awareness/mindreading trinket.


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## Ulti (Nov 6, 2012)

Sephiroth is Mach 52 and is packing 80 gigatons of magical power or something.

He's taking the second scenario at least in my opinion.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 6, 2012)

Bloodlusted might make him lose nearly by default though if Fragarach is deployed.


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## ikoke (Nov 6, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> Gilgamesh would know where Sephiroth teleports the moment he makes the decision. That's his battlefield awareness/mindreading trinket.



Yes I forgot about the All Knowing Star. But doesn't Gil have to bring it out of his vault manually before he can use it(like his other NP) or is it always active by default?
Because if it isn't active by default and Gil wastes time summoning it,he's in some trouble....



Sygurgh said:


> Bloodlusted might make him lose nearly by default though if Fragarach is deployed.



If Seph tries to teleport+slash would Fragarach activate?
Fragarach activates in case of opponents using ultimate attack and slash isn't exactly the strongest tool in Sephiroth's arsenal.

But then again,Gil's armor should have similar durability(at least) to Saber's which has a damage soaking ability in megatons,so Seph will have to bring out much stronger tricks to take down Gil,which in turn leaves him open to Fragarach.


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## Ulti (Nov 6, 2012)

Sephiroth's strongest spell is Meteor, it requires prep and is a life wiper.

Shadow Flare, Supernova and Heartless Angel should be more than enough.


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## Expelsword (Nov 6, 2012)

The Penetrator said:


> Sephiroth's strongest spell is Meteor, it requires prep and is a life wiper.
> 
> Shadow Flare, Supernova and Heartless Angel should be more than enough.



Sephiroth needs the Black Materia for that.
Supernova and Heartless Angel are unquantifiable.


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## Ulti (Nov 6, 2012)

Yes, meteor is still his strongest spell however.

Sephiroth can create a barrier that took 80 gigatons, it's common sense to say that he put that power into those spells, which are canonically his strongest.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 6, 2012)

Fragarach doesn't seem to actually work on the "strongest" spell, as in the most energetic attack. It works on the "trump card", or the most useful ability of the enemy. For Berserker, Fragarach would have worked on God Hand, a passive defense.

It should be also noted, though it won't change the outcome of the fight as it doesn't have any actual feat, that Fragarach is more powerful than what was actually shown, as it was noted that mastering its ability would have allowed Bazett to jump a tier or two in the Nasuverse rank.


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 6, 2012)

If what you described was the case... wouldn't fragarach have failed against excalibur and only worked on avalon?


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## Sygurgh (Nov 6, 2012)

Shirou had Avalon at the time.
Or Saber might consider Excalibur her trump card over Avalon.
Or the ability might work on trump card*s* (Noble Phantasms).
Most likely the first solution.

Also, there is no "if" about it. It's canon that Fragarach would work on God Hand, a passive defensive ability.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 6, 2012)

Found something interesting:



> Takeuchi: Will Archer be hit by it (Piercing Death Thorn)?
> Nasu: Certainly. Knowing this, Archer will not get too close. If Lancer really plans to unleash Gae Bolg in front of Archer and assumes the stance, Archer will back up for dear life.
> Takeuchi: I see. So how else can Gae Bolg be used in battle? What about being thrown?
> Nasu: Striking Death Flight in essence is pure destructive power.
> ...



So Gilgamesh should have a ranged Gae Bolg. This is the kind of weapon that sounds like an unfair cheat code.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 6, 2012)

Avalon hax are likely too great anyway




it's > Ea and True Magic


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 6, 2012)

anyway, why don't we stick do what Gil actually has used or at least has shown to have .. or has he used Fragarach at some point ?


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## Im The Evil Mastermind (Nov 6, 2012)

Avalon is above true magic? 

Also, Gilgamesh has an air vehicle, couldn't he use that to help him avoid Seph?


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## Ulti (Nov 6, 2012)

I'm okay with people using Fragrach in a fight, as we know what it can do and that Gilgamesh's Gate of Babylon will likely have it.

It's just when people pull random mythological weapons out of their asses that relies on unfounded assumptions that pisses me off.


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## Ulti (Nov 6, 2012)

> Also, Gilgamesh has an air vehicle, couldn't he use that to help him avoid Seph?



Can't Sephiroth fly himself?

Also Sephiroth should be able to "shoot" Vimana down.


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 6, 2012)

Not like we even give those weapons there supposed canon mythical attributes.

Unless we really did take caladbolg (of legend) being able to cleave off 3 hill tops at face value previously (kind of redundant I guess now with some recent calcs and shit?)


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 6, 2012)

> Also, Gilgamesh has an air vehicle, couldn't he use that to help him avoid Seph?


also spirit form

and I believe he can choose where his GoB manifests .. it doesn't *have* to be behind him in linear fashion




> I'm okay with people using Fragrach in a fight, as we know what it can do and that Gilgamesh's Gate of Babylon will likely have it.


ok




> Avalon is above true magic?





> The individual is shielded from all destructive interference in the physical realm, transliners from parallel worlds, and multidimensional communication as far as the sixth dimension. It is on the level of true magic, an actual true magic in itself, that transcends all magecraft, and not even five current magics can overcome the barrier.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 6, 2012)

So, I'd like to know:



> Takeuchi: If it had long range as well as the additional concept of heart-piercing, then...
> Nasu: Then that would become the ability of Lancer's Father. A superior version of Fragarach.



How does Sephiroth not die from this if used at the start of the fight?


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## Ulti (Nov 6, 2012)

> and I believe he can choose where his GoB manifests .. it doesn't have to be behind him in linear fashion



Heard about this, it would be threatening in 1, I was leaning towards Gilgamesh more in 1 anyway, Sephiroth still has the capacity to win.



> also spirit form



Delays the inevitable  at least in 2


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 6, 2012)

Gilgamesh needs to actually think to resorting to it?

He has numerous weapons.

The odds of him picking that one, when he's not aware of all his weapons abilities is slim.


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## Ulti (Nov 6, 2012)

Fucker is basically a walking roulette really.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 6, 2012)

> Heard about this, it would be threatening in 1, I was leaning towards Gilgamesh more in 1 anyway, Sephiroth still has the capacity to win.


you're leaning to Gil in speed equal, right ? 

because Scen 1 is speed unequal


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## Ulti (Nov 6, 2012)

Fuck it, I'm getting them mixed up.

Speed equal: Gilgamesh
Unequal: Sephiroth

Capice?


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## Sygurgh (Nov 6, 2012)

Gilgamesh has a tool that keeps him up to date on his treasury. Name, abilities, etc... If he is bloodlusted, why wouldn't he go for the certain kill lance?


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## Dariustwinblade (Nov 7, 2012)

Cause its Gilgamesh need more be said


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## Tir (Nov 7, 2012)

Well it's not like King of Heroes has Gae Bolg as default weapon like Lancer. He still has to pull it out of Gate of Babylon. 

IMO, bloodlusted Gil most likely resorts Ea right away.

Speed equal: Gil. Though he still could lose. 50/50
Unequal: No doubt Sephy


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## Xelloss (Nov 7, 2012)

Mongles, babys, women and drag queens get gate of babylowned


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

So nothing constructive to contribute?

Cool, Gilgatrash eats a shadow flare, see I can do that too


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

Except Gilgamesh has a ranged Gae Bolg which Sephiroth has no counter to.

Bloodlusted ON.
CIS and PIS are OFF.

He dies unless he can kill Gilgamesh before he can open the Gates.


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

Only in speed equal

Gilgamesh dies before he even gets a chance to open it before in the other one. Sephiroth is just as dangerous with bloodlust and CIS off.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

The speed difference isn't large enough to allow a blitz.


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

I never said that, it does however give Sephiroth a headstart


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

So, you're assuming that Sephiroth can kill Gilgamesh before he can open his Vault?


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

...Yes, easily.

Shadow Flare, Supernova, Heartless Angel... Take your pick.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

I'd like you to prove that these spells are faster than opening a Gate, which Gilgamesh can do near-instantaneously and without a gesture.


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## P-X 12 (Nov 7, 2012)

Hmm...
How fast is Gilgamesh's Vault anyways?
As in, how long does it take to activate and pull out a weapon such as Gae Bolg?


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

...Because it relies on Gilgamesh thinking to open it?

It relies in reaction speed in the end dude Sephiroth's is superior, done deal.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

Shadow Flare, Supernova, Heartless Angel are instant and can destroy Gilgamesh's armor in one hit? No build up?


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

It's more than enough, his armor can only tank megatons.

Sephiroth's strongest spells are capable of 80+ gigatons. His spells don't require build up, Supernova and Heartless Angel are instant, Shadow Flare requires a bit of time but Sephiroth's reactions make it doable.


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## Xelloss (Nov 7, 2012)

Sephiroth without speed equal is fairly faster than any showing of Gilgamesh, the only Gilgamesh that may have the reactions to pull a counter in time would be Fate Kaleydo Prism Gil.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

I'd like to see what you use to qualify Supernova and Heartless Angel as instant, because he'll need it to be faster than a weapon that kills the enemy the moment it's deployed. The Gates are a little slower than the speed of thought.


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

Erm the "speed of thought" is based on your reactions dude, it's how you process them. Again, Sephiroth's reactions are superior to Gilgamesh's which gives him the advantage on the quick draw.


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## Vespa (Nov 7, 2012)

I thought no one took Supernova seriously and that Heartless Angel is gameplay mechanics


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

Erm, no they are directly referenced in canon as his strongest spells.

Me and Chaos have been over this multiple times and I'm getting sick of it.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

The Penetrator said:


> Erm the "speed of thought" is based on your reactions dude, it's how you process them. Again, Sephiroth's reactions are superior to Gilgamesh's which gives him the advantage on the quick draw.



It's not a quick draw. He has a weapon that kills the moment it comes into play. No spell casting, no slashing. So please, show me what can kill Gilgamesh before he can deploy Lugh's spear. No game mechanics. Cinematics, Movies or WoG are fine. Just something.


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## Vespa (Nov 7, 2012)

The Penetrator said:


> Erm, no they are directly referenced in canon as his strongest spells.
> 
> Me and Chaos have been over this multiple times and I'm getting sick of it.



Okay, well can he use them in base?


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

No, he has to open the gate to get it out, he needs to think in order to react to open it, do we understand yet? Sephiroth's reactions would give him a head start.

And for the love of God, they aren't game mechanics, nobody seems to understand what game mechanics actually are, I've been over it in multiple threads and I'm getting sick of it.


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

rararaiden said:


> Okay, well can he use them in base?



Yes, as of Crisis Core, Supernova is referenced as his Limit Break.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

The Penetrator said:


> No, he has to open the gate to get it out, he needs to think in order to react to open it, do we understand yet? Sephiroth's reactions would give him a head start.
> 
> And for the love of God, they aren't game mechanics, nobody seems to understand what game mechanics actually are, I've been over it in multiple threads and I'm getting sick of it.



So your instant death spells don't come from cinematics, movies or WoG?


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> So your instant death spells don't come from cinematics, movies or WoG?



Dude, they are referenced in *canon* as his strongest spells, Sephiroth can generate gigatons of magical power within an instant (with Sephiroth's reactions even a second would be more than enough here) it's common sense to say he can do it with his stronger spells.


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## DarkSlayerZero (Nov 7, 2012)

The Penetrator said:


> Erm, no they are directly referenced in canon as his strongest spells.
> 
> Me and Chaos have been over this multiple times and I'm getting sick of it.



This only mentions Super Nova well the same profiles for cloud skip the rest of his limits.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

I assure you that you don't really want to get into universe/game mechanics when it comes to the Nasuverse. Sephiroth's attacks don't carry any concept and get nullified.


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

...I'm not going into game mechanics

And Dark Slayer, all magic is considered canon in VII, I'll dig that up, gotta look through a few threads or conversations between Chaos and I.


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 7, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> So your instant death spells don't come from cinematics, movies or WoG?



>Can generate enough magical energy to block an 80 gigaton cannon blast for 3 seconds
>Given it is his magical energy causing this, he can easily put this power towards his most powerful offensive spells
>Crisis Core, the original game and dissidia (word of god stating dissidia is canon to their movesets) have all moves mentioned as being crippling/fatal being part of his moveset.



Sygurgh said:


> I assure you that you don't really want to get into universe/game mechanics when it comes to the Nasuverse. Sephiroth's attacks don't carry any concept and get nullified.



I can assure you, having actually read a few routes now, that gilgamesh isn't tanking jack shit.



DarkSlayerZero said:


> This only mentions Super Nova well the same profiles for cloud skip the rest of his limits.



You forgot dissidia chuckles.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

ChaosTheory123 said:


> >Can generate enough magical energy to block an 80 gigaton cannon blast for 3 seconds
> >Given it is his magical energy causing this, he can easily put this power towards his most powerful offensive spells
> >Crisis Core, the original game and dissidia (word of god stating dissidia is canon to their movesets) have all moves mentioned as being crippling/fatal being part of his moveset.



-> Doesn't block Gae Bolg -> Doesn't block Lugh's spear
-> No mention of attack speed
-> No mention of attack speed

-> I know that Gilgamesh isn't tanking any of Sephiroth high-powered attacks, but this wasn't the point of my post. Just like you can't use game mechanics into debates, I can't just arbitrarily decide that Sephiroth's attack are ineffective due to them not carrying a concept.


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## God (Nov 7, 2012)

i remember some years back when ^ (not the meaning of the word "respect".) like red and ck would claim gil could blow up the planet
glad that faggotry's over


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 7, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> -> Doesn't block Gae Bolg -> Doesn't block Lugh's spear
> -> No mention of attack speed
> -> No mention of attack speed



>Doesn't need to block Gae Bolg, he'll never get to use it speed unequal chuckles
>Fast enough to tag assholes faster than giglamesh
>Same as line 2

Giglamesh needs to do a bunch of shit perfectly to take any scenario here dude.

>get out that item that can identify all abilities of a weapon
>draw the right situational weapon out of hundreds/thousands possible
>execute it

Sephiroth doesn't take nearly that much time for his shit to work.



> -> I know that Gilgamesh isn't tanking any of Sephiroth high-powered attacks, but this wasn't the point of my post. Just like you can't use game mechanics into debates, I can't just arbitrarily decide that Sephiroth's attack are ineffective due to them not carrying a concept.



You fuckers completely lack the ability to understand what the fuck gameplay mechanics are.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

Gilgamesh isn't planetary, but he is above 80+ gigatons. Not that it matters. I mean, attacks that reduce HP to 1, or repeatedly destroy the same planet in a cinematic, how do you use things like that? As I said, I'm fine as long as they're seen in an actual cinematic.


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## ThanatoSeraph (Nov 7, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> Gilgamesh isn't planetary, but he is above 80+ gigatons. Not that it matters. I mean, attacks that reduce HP to 1, or repeatedly destroy the same planet in a cinematic, how do you use things like that?



By using common sense and assuming that Sephiroth can put 80+ gigatons of energy into them when he has shown that he can put that amount of energy into his magic?

Obviously the detroying the solar system cutscene is false, but that doesn't mean that the entire attack goes out the window.

You can assume that Heartless Angel works as a spell that cripples the opponent. Just take out the HP values and it works fine.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

Does that mean that all Final Fantasy protagonists can use spells like Full-Cure, Confuse, Haste, Slow, Blind, Reflect, Death, Resurrection... in the battledome?


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## DarkSlayerZero (Nov 7, 2012)

ChaosTheory123 said:


> dissidia (word of god stating dissidia is canon to their movesets)



Provide proof please because I know damn well that Laguna never used a Ragnarok cannon in 8.


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## Im The Evil Mastermind (Nov 7, 2012)

Ragnarok is a reference to the spaceship. ok.

@DSZ


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## Crimson Dragoon (Nov 7, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> Does that mean that all Final Fantasy protagonists can use spells like Full-Cure, Confuse, Haste, Slow, Blind, Reflect, Death, Resurrection... in the battledome?



only if they have the Materia for it, which are actually shown in AC


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

So, if you give Red XIII or Tidus Stop Materia they can pretty much kill anyone, including Madara, Ichigo, Luffy, Thor, Superman etc...?


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## Im The Evil Mastermind (Nov 7, 2012)

You make me mad. Red XIII can use stop magic, but that doesn't mean he has the firepower to kill everyone. And stop isn't stop time forever anyway. And it costs mana.


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

Sephiroth doesn't need materia as of Advent Children as he has full control over the lifestream.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Nov 7, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> So, if you give Red XIII Stop Materia he can pretty much kill anyone much anyone, including Madara, Ichigo, Luffy etc...?



look, all that's known is the spells likely exist, we know jackshit about how effective they actually are 

so quit with the wiseass act


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## Huntring (Nov 7, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> Lugh's spear is *Gae Bolg without the distance issue.* Or was it Odin's? Anyway, Gilgamesh has both.



I don't remember this.

Where is it from?



Some sort of zombie said:


> Avalon is above true magic?



Only defensively.  True magic users can't harm Avalon users.

Overall?  True magic is way to well rounded.  Avalon can only defend people.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Nov 7, 2012)

The Penetrator said:


> Sephiroth doesn't need materia as of Advent Children as he has full control over the lifestream.



you can make reasonable assumptions about his pure brute force spells due to the barrier feat and stuff, but the "hax" stuff like stop, death, or any transmutation crap is, well, probably not all that applicable because fuck knows how effective those actually are 

just putting that out there


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

I was going to say that myself.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Nov 7, 2012)

The Penetrator said:


> I was going to say that myself.



dat OBD hivemind


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

It just that Materia sounds like what is present in any RPG game, from Baldur's Gate, to Tales and Xenogears. If you look at RPG Games you'll find many inconsistencies between what is presented story-wise and what the characters are capable of in actual combat. Melee characters without magical training being able to cast the most difficult of spells without any magical background, and unable to block a simple fireball in cinematics. I think it's best to go by what is shown in the stories and cinematics instead of nitpicking your spells.


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

Though if you have no resistance to it I guess it could work, not Death though, as it's unknown how it works.

I also wouldn't use stat boosters like haste, we don't have a figure for how much they raise speed. I thought it was x2 but I couldn't find that source.


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## Crimson King (Nov 7, 2012)

IIRC Gil can deploy weapons without opening Gate of Babylon

I don't remember if he had the gate open when he hit Shirou with his hammer.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 7, 2012)

There wasn't a space-distortion when he took out Merodach either.


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## DarkSlayerZero (Nov 7, 2012)

Some sort of zombie said:


> Ragnarok is a reference to the spaceship. ok.
> 
> @DSZ



Yes, a reference not an actual attack that Laguna has.



Sygurgh said:


> Does that mean that all Final Fantasy protagonists can use spells like *Full-Cure,* Confuse, Haste, Slow, Blind, Reflect, Death, *Resurrection*... in the battledome?



They tried it in FFV, FFVIII, and successfully used a healing spell on someone in FFXIII.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Nov 7, 2012)

The Penetrator said:


> Though if you have no resistance to it I guess it could work, not Death though, as it's unknown how it works.



a lot of them could still "miss" though, and there's really no fluff instances of them in action 

only thing is gameplay and that just can't fly


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## Ulti (Nov 7, 2012)

True enough.


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## TheSweetFleshofDeath (Nov 9, 2012)

Why should the defensive power, and offensive power of spells be equal?  They do exist.  However, without any actual showings you can only assume that's it's stronger than weaker shown spells.


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 9, 2012)

TheSweetFleshofDeath said:


> Why should the defensive power, and offensive power of spells be equal?  They do exist.  However, without any actual showings you can only assume that's it's stronger than weaker shown spells.



Wow, is it that difficult to grasp?

If he can generate 80 gigatons of energy in any manner, he can generate it for other offensive spells you ponce.

Its his energy, he can direct it in any manner he desires.


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## Type Fallstar (Nov 9, 2012)

Can't Gilgamesh raise his magic resistance higher than saber


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 9, 2012)

Type Fallstar said:


> Can't Gilgamesh raise his magic resistance higher than saber



Sephy-chan's magical energy production is far above any showing in Nasuverse, barring Zelretch's


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 9, 2012)

ChaosTheory123 said:


> Sephy-chan's magical energy production is far above any showing in Nasuverse, barring Zelretch's


what about Notes feats ?

though idk if that's magical energy ..


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 9, 2012)

Fluttershy said:


> what about Notes feats ?
> 
> though idk if that's magical energy ..



Oh, right, Notes.

Didn't keep that in mind, given I've only read 2 routes of Fate/Stay Night so far.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 9, 2012)

I want Ado Edems excellent adventure animated


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## Sygurgh (Nov 9, 2012)

Saber's magical resistance is due to her dragon blood.
Gilgamesh's magical resistance is due to his items.
Magical energy production isn't mentioned.

On the other hand, Sephiroth doesn't have a counter for this:


> Takeuchi: If it had long range as well as the additional concept of heart-piercing, then...
> Nasu: Then that would become the ability of Lancer's Father. A superior version of Fragarach.


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 9, 2012)

He's not getting that off in a speed unequal scenario.

Nor is Gilgamesh likely to resort to such a tactic without knowledge and acting out of character (which, with bloodlust, can happen).

Gilgamesh's option for victory is narrow and far too situational to get off most of the time.

He'd be better off using Ea and powering it up to fuck with space/time and shit to get passed any defense Sephy-chan can put up.

Given cutting space/time is a hax that bypasses durability without the other character having feats resisting it.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 9, 2012)

Could I know from where Sephiroth gets this speed?
I never questioned it before, but he never seemed that fast in AC.


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 9, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> Could I know from where Sephiroth gets this speed?
> I never questioned it before, but he never seemed that fast in AC.



.

Cloud has saved barret from getting smashed by one, and kept pace with a lightning spell from kadaj (which should be faster than one of barret's limits, which is as fast as one of Bahamut's flares)

Not to mention you have fuckers like Weiss (someone below genesis and sephiroth if the DoC ending is to be believed) being able to react to chaos vincent's beam shots from close range in DoC, which should be comparable to the diamond weapon's attacks in speed (), given how much vincent in that form outstripes the diamond weapon.

I can really go there you know


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## Ulti (Nov 9, 2012)

That sister ray speed is actually insane


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## Sygurgh (Nov 9, 2012)

You powerscaled everything from the pixelscaling of the flare?


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 9, 2012)

Yep 

Your point ponce?

Are you that asshurt that you're trying to bitch about pixel scaling?


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## Huntring (Nov 9, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> *Lugh's spear is Gae Bolg without the distance issue.* Or was it Odin's? Anyway, Gilgamesh has both.



Still don't know where you get this from.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 9, 2012)

ChaosTheory123 said:


> Yep
> 
> Your point ponce?
> 
> Are you that asshurt that you're trying to bitch about pixel scaling?



Are you obligated to use derogatory words, fuckwit?
I have simply never liked this kind of pixelscaling stretched to the extreme. Nothing to do with a particular character, simple matter of personal preference.
I'll accept the calculation per the rules of the forum, of course.


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 9, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> Are you obligated to use derogatory words, fuckwit?
> I have simply never liked this kind of pixelscaling stretched to the extreme. Nothing to do with a particular character.



Yep, if I didn't, I'd sound like an even bigger asshole when I talk down to you 

To the extreme my ass.  I got a distance, I used free fall, I got a speed.

This is basic math shit.


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## Sygurgh (Nov 9, 2012)

I'm just thinking that by using this kind of jump as reference to calculate the speed of a projective, we'll find many mac+10 bullets in Black Lagoon as the first example that comes to mind, ignoring that it's a originally a manga.


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 9, 2012)

and what happens in another fiction clearly effects all other fictions 

don't bother bringing up exceptions to the rule.

especially when you probably have a poor grasp of how to gauge shit in the first place.

which is rather universal for the human species without showing your work.  We all suck at guessimating size and speed most of the time.


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## Dark Slayer (Nov 9, 2012)

Round 1: Gil

Round 2: Seph


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## Sygurgh (Nov 9, 2012)

Calculations affect all fictions the same, and projectiles have the tendency to appear near-instantly from one position to another in many animes and animation movies. You react badly to anyone having a different opinion than you, maybe you should consult about this superiotity complex. I already said that I accepted this calculation.

It's time to sleep for me, when I have the time I might want do some calculations for fun.


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## Im The Evil Mastermind (Nov 9, 2012)

That'll be a sight to behold.


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## ChaosTheory123 (Nov 9, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> Calculations affect all fictions the same, and projectiles have the tendency to appear near-instantly from one position to another in many animes and animation movies.



Uh huh.



> You react badly to anyone having a different opinion than you



I'm fairly accepting of all differing opinions chuckles.

Thing is?  I'm tired of ad nauseum arguments about the validity of calcs and when other can't be bothered to offer up a counter argument.

Unless you're referring to the excessive cursing.  In which case... you're fucking high if you think that's indicative of anything 



> maybe you should consult about this superiotity complex.



Don't go throwing around terms you don't understand kiddo 



> I already said that I accepted this calculation.



You did say that, and yet you offered up a counter argument to a calc despite that.

I addressed your post.

Don't want me to debate?

Don't post the extraneous shit.



> It's time to sleep for me, when I have the time I might want do some calculations for fun.



Go for it.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 9, 2012)

> superio*tity*


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## jetwaterluffy1 (Nov 10, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> I'm just thinking that by using this kind of jump as reference to calculate the speed of a projective, we'll find many mac+10 bullets in Black Lagoon as the first example that comes to mind, ignoring that it's a originally a manga.



Show the feat. If it's mach 10, it's mach 10. It may or may not be an outlier, though, depends if there are other feats at that level.


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