# The Naruto Cliche list!(Important for fanfic writers)



## Therahedwig (Jan 16, 2005)

I found this on the internet

Darkness  Over Light, The Other Side of Me

This one is sooo true, why am I posting this here?

Because then people here can use it to become better writers.

(If you still want to be a better writer after this, try the plot/character articles on gamingw.com, they're really good)


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## YamisuiOnna (Jan 16, 2005)

*Writing fanfiction*

_aarikaa is a member of the fanfiction anbu, the site i mentioned in a previous thread where we provide hilarious reviews of bad naruto fanfiction.  for those of you who've found stories online containing the cliches mentioned in aarikaa's masterpiece, please feel free to post links to them here so we at the ff-anbu can piss on...erm...roast...erm, i mean provide constructive criticism for them.  

while we're on the subject of writing tips, i've got a few to add that can PREVENT writers from backsliding into cliches:_

*1)* If you're going to introduce an OC, never describe your OC YOURSELF.  Wait until the OC meets up with the main Naruto characters you're involving in the story and describe the OC through THEIR eyes.  Readers quickly lose interest with long-ass descriptions of your character's eyes and hair and outfit if there's no apparent relevance to the story's plot yet.  Face it, people: nobody likes it when an OC is more important than the actual characters.  Let the NARUTO CHARACTERS decide whether or not the OC is beautiful or strong or crazy-looking.  

As a sidenote, I'd like to add that if the Naruto characters who are giving the visual/behavioral assessment of your OC see only his/her positive traits and no flaws whatsoever, little warning bells should be going off in your brain: THIS IS A MARY SUE.  Which brings me to my next point...

*2)* NATURE ABHORS A MARY SUE.  I'm not going to provide a litmus test here, but here are some tips to keep yourself from writing a Mary Sue: 

Pick personality flaws that are realistic to give your OC.  Having a tragic past or being bitchy and assertive are NOT significant flaws.  Having a scar on the OC's cheek does NOT count as an appearance flaw...unless you're Dilandau... Some examples of more realistic flaws are:

*a)* The OC feels insecure about his/her physical/mental weakness and tends toward jealousy of others.
*b)* The OC cares too much about what others think of him/her and tends to follow the crowd when he/she should speak up.  
*c)* The OC is assertive but tends toward selfishness.  

These are just some examples of realistic personality flaws, which make OC's far more palatable.  Also, because flaws shape us as much as strengths, if you give them to your OC he/she will appear to have more depth and you can avoid the cardboard cutout cliche.  Readers identify more readily with deeper characters.   

*3) * WRITING ACTION/ACTIVITY WITHOUT USING STUPID NO JUTSU'S AND MORE DIALOGUE THAN KICKING/PUNCHING/STABBING.

From reading a lot of peoples' fics and comments, it seems we all struggle with writing good action sequences.  Unfortunately, action sequences are practically a must in a fighting show like Naruto.  Some tips:
* a) * Picture the setting in your head where the fight will take place.  Make a rough sketch if that helps.  Now you know what buildings/trees/objects are near your characters.  Picture where the characters are positioned, and keep track of where they are.  This way you can have them change positions and use the landscape around them to make things more interesting. (e.g. fighting atop tree branches/roofs; running across water).
*  b)* Write your fight scene all in one sitting.  This is hard if you're prone to writers' block, but it helps.  If you can keep your flow of concentration uninterrupted, you'll give your fight scene more continuity because you're more aware of WHERE your character is positioned.  Position awareness is VITAL to a fight scene.  Otherwise we just have two characters standing God knows where and hurling random jutsu's at each other.  
*c)* Keep conversation to a minimum during the fight sequence.  I know Naruto is riddled with flashbacks during fight scenes (many of which make me want to claw my eyes out with their repetitiveness), but for a fanfic the action's most important.  Inserting flashbacks in a fic the way they do in the show just causes confusion for readers and disrupts the flow of the story.  A warning sign that you're writing weak fighting scenes is if the characters are talking more than they're fighting.  If you want dialogue in the scene to explain what's going on, have the characters who are watching do the talking.  Generally intense fighting makes the dueling characters too out-of-breath to be long-winded.   

_Wow...this turned out to be a lot longer than I expected.  And it's not even a rant. At least, not entirely..._


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## salodon (May 11, 2007)

*Thank you.*

Hey, thanks.


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## Saffi (Jun 15, 2007)

I found that really useful Yami..thanks


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## Kool ka lang (Jun 19, 2007)

You should put all the NF cliches in here too.
Like blind itachi, gaible, kwGOD, all the good stuff.


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## Therahedwig (Jun 20, 2007)

Kool ka lang said:


> You should put all the NF cliches in here too.
> Like blind itachi, gaible, kwGOD, all the good stuff.



No Kool, those are running gags, they are good, clich? tend to be bad...


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## Freiza (Jul 15, 2007)

Well it would be nice but it's not there.......
but this im guessing was from there


> aarikaa is a member of the fanfiction anbu, the site i mentioned in a previous thread where we provide hilarious reviews of bad naruto fanfiction. for those of you who've found stories online containing the cliches mentioned in aarikaa's masterpiece, please feel free to post links to them here so we at the ff-anbu can piss on...erm...roast...erm, i mean provide constructive criticism for them.
> 
> while we're on the subject of writing tips, i've got a few to add that can PREVENT writers from backsliding into cliches:
> 
> ...


I like the advice, especially the one about keeping fight convos to a minimum. i hate when people have to much talking....*coughDBZcough* but also those that hve none or very little piss me off*coughBleachcough*


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## NomiNinja90 (Oct 6, 2010)

*Please help! I fear a bad story!!!*

I'm writing a Time-travel Naruto fic where Naruto goes back in time (the only way I could think of was that Kyuubi sent him back) and becomes his fathers best friend. He decides to seal the Kyuubi himself to give his future-self a father. (its alot more complicated but I won't get into details )
Are there any cliches I should ABSOLUTLY avoid?


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## homo sapiens narutardis (Oct 12, 2010)

I believe a common cliche in Naruto fics is the angry mob scene so often used in Naruto's childhood flashbacks. You could go through the anime/manga a hundred-bajillion times, and you will never see an angry mob. Angry glares, yes; but I have yet to see an angry mob. If Naruto really was chased by an angry mob in his childhood, I'm pretty sure it would have called to Sarutobi's attention, seeing as he has a crystal ball and sees all. Same goes to those who say that Kid!Naruto gets screwed over by unscrupulous shop-owners. ANBU would be on their asses if that was the case.

Other cliches would involve the crap that is "Me and My Friends Got Sucked into the Narutoverse" and the high-school fics. Some high school fics aren't that bad, but 99.99% of it is utter crap.

And vampires, Oh God, the vampires... I mean, we already have _Twilight_, for crying out loud. Why bother with the vampire fics mucking up the website?

At least the Emo Kid phase is over, thank God.

@ NomiNinja90: If possible, please avoid Good!Kyuubi, or the "They Killed My Kits and My Mate, So I Destroyed the Village"!Kyuubi. It's just a recipe for disaster, not to mention that the manga has explicitly stated that the Kyuubi is a just a mass of chakra and hatred. A viable way for Naruto to go back in time would be would be a long-lost jutsu scroll he discovered, and a backlash while trying to experiment to Hiraishin himself.

If anyone knows what other cliches there are, please let me know.


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## Suhoon (Nov 11, 2010)

Error

This journal has been deleted and purged.

-just a warning for people.


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## Amrun (Nov 13, 2010)

homo sapiens narutardis said:


> I believe a common cliche in Naruto fics is the angry mob scene so often used in Naruto's childhood flashbacks. You could go through the anime/manga a hundred-bajillion times, and you will never see an angry mob. Angry glares, yes; but I have yet to see an angry mob. If Naruto really was chased by an angry mob in his childhood, I'm pretty sure it would have called to Sarutobi's attention, seeing as he has a crystal ball and sees all. Same goes to those who say that Kid!Naruto gets screwed over by unscrupulous shop-owners. ANBU would be on their asses if that was the case.
> 
> Other cliches would involve the crap that is "Me and My Friends Got Sucked into the Narutoverse" and the high-school fics. Some high school fics aren't that bad, but 99.99% of it is utter crap.
> 
> ...



These are true.  I hate those cliches.

However, we do actually see some angry mobs / glaring, but people take it WAY too far and to an unrealistic level and it's a horrible cliche.

Abused!Naruto is not cool.

Another huge cliche is Smart!OP!Naruto.   Naruto is NOOOOOOOOOOOOOT a super smart over powered kid; that defeats the entire purpose of his character and makes him someone else.

Also, harem!Naruto is a cliche that I hate.


Outside of Naruto-centric fics, raped Sakura is a bad cliche, but rape in general is a cliche in fanfiction.

There are particular cliches for every different sort of fic and for each individual pairing especially.


I think number #1 biggest cliche in Naruto fanfiction is timetravel, though.   DON'T DO IT, FOLKS.  It's practically guaranteed to suck.





Dripping Illusions said:


> Error
> 
> This journal has been deleted and purged.
> 
> -just a warning for people.



Full content is posted in-thread.


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## Dejablue (Nov 13, 2010)

Therahedwig said:


> I found this on the internet
> 
> 
> 
> ...




unfortnately that page no longer has the cliche list on it.  What were they specifically if you remember??  Well what YamisuiOnna posted was probably what used to be there.

Sorry i didn't read that above post until just now. yeesh.

I've read tons of stories of Naruto being too outwardly depressed or TOO outwardly energetic and outgoing.  Like the writer can't find the medium between Naruto's sadness and happiness.


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## Amrun (Nov 13, 2010)

Dejablue said:


> I've read tons of stories of Naruto being too outwardly depressed or TOO outwardly energetic and outgoing.  Like the writer can't find the medium between Naruto's sadness and happiness.



Oh, this is a big one.

On the other end of the spectrum, while Naruto-centric stories tend to portray Naruto as way too mature and strong -- which I understand, to a point, but there's a fine line that many people bulldoze -- stories that feature other characters often do the opposite.  They make Naruto completely socially retarded and just plain stupid.

Sadly, it's getting harder to refute that with the newest turns of the manga, but many people take it way too far.

In particular, Sakura-centric stories that have Sakura ignore Naruto almost entirely except token appearances where he does something stupid and she placates him really get on my nerves.


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## Dejablue (Nov 13, 2010)

Oh then lets talk about character specific cliches. Since that's usually where people mess up.  How they write the characters.


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## BellatrixLestrange (Nov 19, 2010)

Being an avid NaruHina fan, a cliche that I hate is Hinata getting sent to the Branch House, or dying of the Curse Seal.  That itself is not totally awful, but people almost never consider the alternative and do stories where Hanabi seems to show all this promise, but when Hinata gets confident, the younger sister gets told that she will be sealed and sent to the Branch House when Hinata's firstborn turns three.

Rape is always an awful cliche, as is a horrid amount of abuse.

The obsession with the seme/uke thing amongst yaoi fangirls is extremely annoying, as are most other forms of badly written "romance".

Overpowered/supersmart/Gary Stu Naruto is very annoying and I can't stand it.

I automatically skip over high school fics.  I watch Naruto because it is a FANTASY.  That means none of that crap.


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## bloodplzkthxlol (Nov 27, 2010)

turning kyuubi into a female. I've had enough of this cliche. and like someone above already stated, people keep using the same bland back story over and over again. "oh my kit got killed, bawww" no. I personally like the idea of good!kyuubi but only if its done RIGHT. but it hasn't been yet.


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## Dragonessa (Jan 16, 2011)

Let me think....the major cliches of Naruto fanfiction that I've seen are varied but the biggest one I have seen is SasukexOC, especially when the OC is another "long-lost" Uchiha. At least if your character is paired with Sasuke, give him a reason other than that "You are one of my clan! OHMYGOD I LOVE YOU" . Also, the fanfiction where Sasuke is trying to "rebuild" his clan...those are just nightmares. 

Another nasty fanfiction cliche has to do with our favorite pedo!snake Orochimaru. Now I love me some Orochimaru-fanfic goodness, but when you are writing Orochimaru try not making him a total pedo!bear. He's not _all_ pedo. He's got some depth beneath him that makes him who he is. Explore that and try to make him more than a one-note protagonist or antagonist. 

I could go on for hours about other things too, but I honestly don't want to start spamming the place.


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## Dejablue (Jan 16, 2011)

Oh please spam.  I like this topic.


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## Dragonessa (Jan 17, 2011)

Oh, I've got another one too. 
SASUNARU. Holymotherofjesusandmary....that pairing is so abundant with shit its not even funny. I've seen so many craptastic fics about that pairing. If you are writing a yaoi fanfic, make the characters in-character and give them reasons for loving each other other than Naruto going "I'M BRINGING YOU BACK SASUKE TO THE VILLAGE BECAUSE I LOVE YOU AND WANT YOU IN MY PANTS!"


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## Sunnyfox (Jan 17, 2011)

Kyubi talk in Naruto head (mind)! Or other  jinchuuriki who talk to is demon in is mind!!!

1 word for that: Annoying!!! 

maybe i do exeption with Bee cause HE can...but Naruto or Gaara...forget it!!


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## homo sapiens narutardis (Jan 22, 2011)

Glad to see this forum is getting somewhere.

Here's something I'd like to discuss BTW- Character bashing. Oh Jiminiy Cricket, how I hate that stuff. As much as there are characters we will never like, I don't think they deserve to be treated like crap.

Common victims of these are:

Sakura/Ino/Karin as The Bitch.

The Uchihas as a family of assholes (namely Fugaku Uchiha, although there is nothing in the manga that ever implied that he was a child-abusing, wife-beating basketcase)

Hiashi Hyuuga as a nasty child-abuser. Yes we know that the man hasn't treated his daughter very well before, but later chapters/episodes have shown that he is starting to mellow out. 

And as mentioned earlier, Orochimaru the PedoSnake. 'Nuff said.

Also, there's the character derailment for the less-popular characters:

Psycho!Anko. Okay, this really grinds my gears as Anko may be eccentric, but not to the levels as some fanfics portray her. She's not murderous or extremely sadistic. Just a little wacky.

Kiba/Kankuro as misogynists who only have girls on the brain. Kiba is raised by his mother and sister. I am positive that living with them will teach him a thing or two about treating women right. Same goes for Kankuro as he has Temari for a sister. One more thing about Kankuro- he's a lot smarter than he looks.

Well, that's it for the meantime. Peace out.


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## Kind of a big deal (Jan 22, 2011)

Romance and pairings. That in and of itself is a huge cliché.

The manga does perfectly fine without it, but sometimes it seems like fanfics only exist to satiate the craving that girls have for romance. Let's face it, the majority of fanfic writers are female, and at the risk of sounding chauvinistic, women often have trouble seeing the bigger picture, which is why romance stories become a microcosmos of the two main characters. Or worse, the one main character described in the story. So that's one important point to make about romance.

Another point to make is quick and easy: what you want to see happening to your favorite characters is not a good story. Again, this holds true even more with pairings and romance. Seeing your favorite pairing happening in a story doesn't cut it.

Third point: If it's not the main theme for the story, don't try to artificially add a romance if it doesn't add to the plot. I get it. I understand that you'd probably get more people to read it if you announce a pairing up front. But none of them are worth your time if you're serious about writing something good.

And fourth point, when romance is the most important theme in your story, don't forget that there's a world revolving around the two characters involved. It's actually my first point but elaborated upon. 
So again, most romance stories bog down into the thoughts and motivations of the two or the one character. 
Romeo and Juliet is a good template for how to write a romance. Notice how there's a plethora of characters besides these two, that get real development, notice how there's factions, politics, things and events happening. All kinds of stuff that isn't about the two characters whispering to each other. 
A romance can be interesting and engaging when it's set in a context because unexpected things can happen. In a regular romance fanfic (before I give up reading the whole thing) I keep hoping for something unexpected to happen to mix things up. Never happens. 

Speaking of unexpected things: they don't have to end up together. In fact they could end up hating each other, or loving each other but being bad together, so they split up. Or it's never meant to be. Or something tragic happens. So many possiblities, and so few people take advantage of them. Think about it for a minute, the time they had together when it was great could be all the more special because of how it ends up. Especially if you don't have a lineair timeline.

Then there's the issue of characters being out of character. If two persons are totally incompatible, don't change one of them to the point that it works. Change the world around them to the point that it works. Fabricate something so they have a common ground. They don't have to be in it for the reasons either. 
A jerk character can be into a girl out of lust, boredom or even convenience, or not even like her at all. At some point he will consider her his property, or grow used to her, or even have guilt over the fact that he strings her along. If he grows to love her, it's realistic, has depth and it's complex. It's definately better than the character not understanding his own feelings and why he is attracted to a girl. I'm just saying.

And finally, think long and hard about how old the characters are, and how fast things are moving along. In a real world setting, people don't get married a few weeks after meeting someone. Especially not when they are in their teens by the way. And people don't stay together forever. 
If you think about it, this is just another form of mixing it up and bringing something unexpected, teenagers who go out for a while (nausiating as that may be as a story subject) don't end up together in 99% of all cases. This last point especially reveals the young age of the writer by showing how naive they are. You gotta have some ambition to write something better than that.


The typical fanfic romance story isn't bad because I don't like romance, and it's not bad because the romance isn't lovey dovey enough. The story is bad because it's lacking as a story. Expand on the setting so we better understand _why_ this particular romance is so interesting, rather than just stating it.


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## guidewriter211 (Jan 23, 2011)

I think a lot of you have a majority covered, however, one cliche plot that has been getting on my nerves is the 'i'm-an-oc-girl-who-got-captured-by-the-akatsuki-and-now-they-love-me-and-i'm-one-of-them' fics. I have never seen a fic like this where any of the characters are actually IN character...or where the OC isn't a mary sue.
I shall save you time.
Tobi tries to be her bestest-best-buddy because he's a 'sweetie' at heart.
Pain either tries to kill her or rape her.
Deidara tries to seduce her, though not rape her because he's a nice guy.
Itachi is rather sweet and the 'big brother' she has been missing.
Kisame wants fish sticks and is often an idiot, following Itachi around like a lost puppy.
Sasori is trying to suck Deidaras face off...or other random appendages.
Konan is kissing the ground Pain walks on and is UBER jealous of the OC because she's so darn perfect and beautiful in every single way.
Zetsu is rarely included.
Hidan does his laugh, and is either a protective big brother, or a total perv and tries to get in her pants.
Kakuzu wants to cut off her head and sell it because she's worth about a billion dollars (or whatever their currency is).
I think that about covers what you will be missing when you skip over one of these stories.


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## Kankurette (Jan 24, 2011)

^ I HATE bastardisation of Kisame. I don't know what's worse, him being turned into a moron, or him being shoved out of the fic because he's not pretty enough.

I've written this elsewhere, but:-
 - Gaara having friends as a kid. No no NO. He did NOT have friends. The kids in Suna hated and feared him.
 - Sakura being turned into a huge raging bitch who beats Naruto senseless, and is either humiliated or given what for by Hinata / Naruto / Ino / a Sue.
 - Shikamaru saying 'troublesome' all the time.
 - Lee and Gai saying 'youth' all the time.
 - Sasuke saying 'dobe' all the time.
 - Naruto as a weeping uke.
 - Hinata being raped and abused by Hiashi / Neji.
 - Chouji not doing anything besides eating, and not having a personality outside liking food a lot.
 - Paedo!Kakashi.
 - Akatsuki not acting like the motley crew of terrorists, religious fundamentalists, Norman Bateses, wannabe gods, megalomanics, plant men, serial killers and angsty bishounen that we know and love. EG when a fangirl finds their base and they don't kill her. Or they all sit around doing their nail polish and talking about their feelings.
 - Deidara saying 'un' at the end of every sentence. He says it when he's finished speaking. There's a difference.
 - Kyuubi calling Naruto 'kit'.
 - Badly written lemons.
 - Ino being a brainless bimbo.
 - Naruto goes back in time to meet his dad. Didn't one of the movies do this?
 - Hinata being turned into a Sue.
 - Naruto getting a kekkei genkai.
- High school fics, especially where Kakashi or Jiraiya teaches sex ed.


homo sapiens narutardis said:


> One more thing about Kankuro- he's a lot smarter than he looks.


Yeah, Idiot!Kankuro annoys me too. Impulsive and hot-headed does not = stupid. Recent chapters show that Kankuro is actually intelligent. 

As for Kiba being a misogynist, wtf? Tsume and Hana aside, he's never treated Hinata like crap. In fact, he likes her a lot. And he's never disrespected Kurenai for being a woman.


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## HolyDemon (Jan 24, 2011)

Kind of a big deal said:


> Romance and pairings. That in and of itself is a huge clich?.
> 
> The manga does perfectly fine without it, but sometimes it seems like fanfics only exist to satiate the craving that girls have for romance. Let's face it, the majority of fanfic writers are female, and at the risk of sounding chauvinistic, women often have trouble seeing the bigger picture, which is why romance stories become a microcosmos of the two main characters. Or worse, the one main character described in the story. So that's one important point to make about romance.
> 
> ...



Extensive psyche description is what would turn a linear story into a masterpiece. We could have just 2 whispering to each other, or sometimes just one person whispering to him/herself and still get the bigger picture. The dialogue, the feelings, the doubt and many trivial humane thoughts will slowly add up into the atmosphere. There may be little development, sometimes not at all, but readers can feel the humanistic behaviors, the authentic demographic and political context. It's even more realistic when such notions are formed not through an omniconscious point of view that knows all, see dialogue but from a puny mind who knows naught.

After all, you don't need to see everything to get the picture.


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## homo sapiens narutardis (Jan 24, 2011)

Kankurette said:


> Yeah, Idiot!Kankuro annoys me too. Impulsive and hot-headed does not = stupid. Recent chapters show that Kankuro is actually intelligent.



Glad to know someone agrees.

Btw, did I already mention Bitch!Karin and Pervert!Sai? Since their appearance back in '07 these two have received a whole of hatred because of their involvement/resemblance to a certain Uchiha.

Karin does not hate Sakura or any other female for that matter. In fact, one of her lines to Sakura was, "Don't cry." Does that sound like something a bitch would say?

Sai is not a pervert. Yes, he's a little creepy, but that's because he's emotionally stunted. And seriously, in this day and age, green jokes and swearwords are just about as common as fish in the sea.


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## bloodplzkthxlol (Feb 14, 2011)

Kankurette said:


> - Sakura being turned into a huge raging bitch who beats Naruto senseless, and is either humiliated or given what for by Hinata / Naruto / Ino / a Sue.
> - Lee and Gai saying 'youth' all the time.
> - Naruto as a weeping uke.
> - Hinata being raped and abused by Hiashi / Neji.
> ...



yesyesyesyes and again yes. at first I thought kyuubi calling naruto his kit was cute but later it turned into a running gag again and again. it drives me crazy and its lost its taste. I guess I keep going on fanfiction because I actually hold hope that some people actually give 2 h00ts about the series they're writing about. turning every character ooc ISN'T FUNNY, if you take a step back and realize what you do to these characters you begin to wonder why you loved them in the first place. 

I want a good akatsuki fanfiction with the actual crime genre, thats NOT CENTERED AROUND DEIDARA FOR PETES SAKE! no highschool fliks those have been done countless times and you expect someone to read that trash? this was a comic book about ninja's wasn't it? not some highschool soap opra with preteens talking about sexual intercourse and marriage?

yeah I know its says "unleash your imagination" but I wasn't expected so many people to have the same freaking idea! THINK before you post instead of clogging the tubes with this garbage. if you don't then it'll just be left forgotten under the piles of the exact same story (if you want to call it that), no one's gonna remember you and it'll just show the minutes you've wasted on your keyboard when you could've used your brain and actually try to gain an audience. 

but no, people eat that shit up, and they get a lot of reviews saying make more, what? alright but hey, word of advice: you're missing out on good literature.  *end ramble*


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## Kakashifan727 (Feb 14, 2011)

It's kinda sad really. How many more HS/ Akatsuki fics do we need to see?


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## Desert Butterfly (Feb 15, 2011)

The thing that's been bothering me the most, lately, is: depiction of characters as one-dimensional people.
Tenten as a weapon-maniac tomboy; Chouji as a binge eater with no life; Sakura as someone whose only purpose in the plot is fangirling over Sasuke/Naruto/whoever it is; Shikamaru constantly saying "Troublesome" and acting lazily; and so on and so forth.
Seriously, ever heard of in-depth characterisation? There's more to the characters than their main hobby/love interest/general attitude.


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## Kakashifan727 (Feb 18, 2011)

i dunno if it's a cliche but something I personally find odd. In most of the OC-takes in Naruto/Sasuke and tries to care for them fics, they do everything almost perfectly and Naruto turns up the way he should in canon, albiet with a few changes. However, if they're not ninja who obviously have a damn good payroll, just working at Ichiraku's isn't going to cut it. It has to be at least minimum wage and those apartments don't look that cheap. They'd need at least two jobs, though that depends if they get the magical loan from the Sandaime plot device that usually happens. After working for those long hours, how the heck would they be able to train the kid, feed, bathe etc? 

They'd pass out eventually or just be exhausted/cranky for most of the day. Especially with the teenage kids who are about college age, though most IRL are usually independent, some aren't. How could they take care of themselves, much less a 6-8 year old kid for five(?) years while working two jobs that are probably 6 hours long? It'd be impossible and we all know that the kid would suffer some small negligence as to the parent not being home due to the job, etc. 

I dunno really...just my two cents on that.


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## Divi (Feb 18, 2011)

Oh god, this thread. So much truth. Must post my two cents WHICH IS LONG SO BEWARE.

Y'see, I do fall in the fanfiction writer category who writes both canonxcanon and canonxoc, but I really, really make it a number 1 point to avoid clich?s. I've read a lot of fanfiction before I started out, so I knew what bullshit to avoid. I'm not the best, not by any chance, but I like the characters and I specialize mainly in the Akatsuki because I researched them before I wrote them. This is to keep everything nice and in-character. I am in fact so hellbent on improvement that I occasionally message a random user on FF.net to critique me to the best of their ability, and I make sure they don't know me so they can give me constructive crit without being biased.

Now, here's my list of clich?s which I dread:

Itachi = Either still your old school sadistic Itachi before the manga happened, or you've got your overly nice Itachi who is so openly nice even Deidara would frown. 
Pein = Usually the rapist. Mostly the rapist. He's just always so out-of-character I want to bang my head on my keyboard. They always make them out to be the ultimate bad guy in fanfiction, kicking the OC's love life in the crotch at every turn because it gets him off. He is so butchered in fanfiction.
Madara = Well, this one is tricky. Tobi indeed always befriends the OC, whereas Madara is usually obsessed with the OC for some unknown reason. Also rapist. Pre-Konoha Madara is also included, which just gets worse. 
Deidara = Gentle. Always gentle and nice. This is my main pet peeve, because he is not. He blows shit up, he's slightly maniacal in his way of blowing shit up, and he's rude and arrogant. Fuck the nice guy syndrome just because he _looks_ like a nice guy.
Sasori = Butchered. Giving him emotions, giving him fully functional genitals for the sweet sweet lemons, making him give a crap about people when he was fully prepared to murder the woman who raised him since he was a child...
Kisame = Another pet peeve. Just because he's not pretty people don't have to kick him to the curb. I love his character and his sharky-ness, and especially his partnership with Itachi. 
Kakuzu = Well, he's not hard to interpret. He's somewhat similar to Sasori if you just replace the puppet thing with money and give him more attitude. But even that is screwed up in fanfiction.
Hidan = Rapist, always tries to fuck with the OC, swears a lot more than he actually does. (I've seen the fanfiction, and they really get ridiculous sometimes.) 
Konan = A nice lady. See, another annoyance. Just because she's a woman, she's portrayed as the one who helps people. I see her more as the type who keeps to herself, since she's only there for Nagato. 

Then there's those writers who have a certain dislike for characters and they make it blatantly obvious in their stories. Kisame is very hated, as is Sakura. Most OC writers use those two as opportunities to make their OC sound like a badass by insulting or degrading either of them, completely disregarding the fact that:
1: Kisame is not the guy you want on your bad side. Ever.
2: Sakura is hot-tempered and developing Tsunade's strength.

But to narrow it down, if the characters are not in-character, it kills a story. 
If the OC has a major influence on every main character but has no basis for this influence other than her "breath-taking beauty and amazing ninja skills", it kills a story.
If I see a 60-chaptered canonxOC story and there's already sex in the second chapter, and a marriage in the tenth, it kills a story and throws a steaming pile of shit on it.
Unwarranted self-importance in OCs or authors kills a story. (Example: "You say my OC is a mary-sue? I'm going to flame each and every story you have because you're a bitch and your stories probably suck anyway!") This is also the reason I've stopped giving out constructive criticism to authors. 

And finally, my last most hated ass-pulls: Brutal rape one night, and the next day the canon character apologizes and says he didn't mean to and he really regrets it and love love love. Now, see here, this indulges in every author's secret desire to be wanted so much their love interest would want to rape them. They project this unto their OC, bastardize the canon character in order to do so, and there you have it, the perfect "love story"! And the OC probably ends up pregnant and they get married and he rapes and knocks her around a bunch more but it's awwwwwright because that's what love is all about, kids! And spawned many dual-haired and two-coloured-eyed OC babies which is genetically impossible but FUCK BIOLOGY.

^And there you have my gigantic rant, created and based from the many fanfictions I have read in my day which have made me both smug with my own writing ability and disappointed with the bullshit people will write just for the sake of their own wish-fulfillment.


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## Bolmung LK (Mar 17, 2011)

Heh, I've written a couple fanfics with these clich?s in them. Clich?s are USUALLY bad in fanfics, but ONLY because they're badly written. If you're a good written, which surprisingly a lot of FF writers are good, you can pull off any clich? and turn it into gold.

I actually got a commission to turn a most clich?d plotline into a decent fanfic about three weeks ago or so. I've only started it, but when it's done I can post it for you.

My list of clich?s:

1. Repeating the SAME adjective/phrase over and over and over and OVER again!! Like saying Tenten's eyes are a "chocolate brown" more than twice in the same chapter would drive me through a roof. Dear god, other things are the color brown, not just chocolate!! Try "Earthly brown" or even "coffee brown". Give it some creativity!

Also, "her eyes slid sideways" as the action for her eyes is a rather descriptive way of putting it. Just don't use it EVERY TIME you're going to make them look sideways. Yes, there's a LOT of looking sideways, it's repetitive, now make it less repetitive by saying "she looked sideways again" then "again she was forced to look to her right at him" and then "She looked to the right for what felt like the hundredth time that day."

2. I understand a running joke, they can be hilarious is thrown in at the occasional moment. What I can't stand is when it's placed horribly and too often. It's like saying "your mom" at the end of everything someone says. Funny as hell when done at the right time, even if it's often. Yet it's not funny if it's done after everything someone says. Chose the few, and right, times to use your running joke. Don't just throw it in at random times. What makes a joke funnier is when it's heard less often.

3. If you're creating a Mary Sue, or even bending a premade char to your specifications, DO NOT make them perfect. I will admit in my early years of writing that I made Sakura absolutely perfect in one of my fanfics. Years later I came back and read it and wanted to cry. It was bad..... When putting my OCs into a fanfic I make SURE that I have all of their info ready. I don't just throw Xellos around like a rag doll into any fanfic he seems convenient.

4. When making an OC with a VERY clich? background, try to make it as reasonable as possible. Let's take Jane Doe the ninja vampire in Naruto for example. She's smokin' hot, got a tragic past in which her whole family died and everyone hates her. If that's what you're going with make SURE she's got a great personality. Because at that point that's the only interesting thing you've got going.

Say Jane is running from killers and ends up in Konoha where she meets Naruto and Sakura. Don't have Naruto find her instantly attractive. No matter how hot the girl, Naruto is blind to her image if she's being attacked. Don't make Sakura her instant enemy/best friend either. Sakura has a great sense of judging people's personalities. (Except for Sasuke's apparently, lol)

What makes clich?s really stick out, especially OC clich?s, is bad writing. If you can get good detail in, but ONLY when it's relevant to the situation, you can make a clich? seem totally new and fresh. Like having vampire fangs is a clich?, but can be worked into making it sound like a better idea.

"Suddenly, Naruto and Sakura saw a girl with vampire fangs, a long red and black kimono, long black hair and red eyes run passed them in a flash. Naruto and Sakura didn't have time to react before three thug men pushed by them and knocked them to the ground yelling "Get over here Jane!"

Naruto and Sakura jumped to their feet and ran like the wind after them and caught up quickly. They beat up the thugs and rescued the vampire.

"Are you okay?" asked Sakura. The girl nodded and thanked them.
"You've got fangs, you must be a vampire!" Naruto said eagerly.

DO NOT DO THAT!
Do this.

"Naruto and Sakura were walking around a small village South of Konoha while taking a break after their mission. Naruto heard a noise from behind and turned quickly. In a sudden flash of black and red something swept passed him.

"What was that?!" Naruto asked as he saw the retreating form run away.
"I think it was a girl." Sakura said with a lifted pink brow. "I wonder why she's running so fast---?

Before Sakura could finish her sentence, three figures brushed passed them and headed in the direction of the girl.

"We should help, maybe she's being attacked!" Sakura exclaimed and took off running after them. Naruto followed behind Sakura until they reached a narrow alley way in between two buildings where the three men were huddling over the small girl's figure. Sakura tapped on one of the men's shoulder and he turned to look at her in surprise. As soon as the unruly man looked at her she focused a minor amount of chakra into her gloved fist and launched a decent punch right to his nose. This sent the man toppling to the ground in pain.

"Hey, who's the broad?!" one of the other two men shouted.
"I don't know, but she must be a kunoichi! I'm getting out of here!" said the other man as he dropped his sharp weapon and fled.

"You'd better run too or you'll end up like your friend here!" Naruto smirked as he pointed to the writhing man on the ground. The last man standing took one look at his bloodied friend before he took off running as well."

Okay, not my best, but it's defiantly better. For one, when Jan Doe ran by Naruto and Sakura, they will only catch a glimpse of her. Even if it's from the front, they are HIGHLY unlikely to notice that she has fangs. They're also unlikely to notice her red eyes either.

Example 1 (the bad example) had lots of detail, but not where it should of been.
Example 2 (the better one) had lots of detail, but in the right places.
Be careful where you put the details. Placement is 50% of the problems OCs have. Don't let every detail about your OC become apparent the instant we meet them. In fact, if I were actually going to finish this as a real fanfic, I wouldn't add the fact that she's a vampire or even has fangs until way later.

The BEST way to present an OC is actually to make them a minor/cameo character once or twice until their role pops up. Unless your OC is one whacky person, don?t have them bulldoze down the front door exclaiming who they are. Sadly this happened so much in Bleach I couldn?t stand watching it anymore! DX
I?ve actually got a page about how to make a bad OC seem decent in my website. If you want the website it?s in my profile.


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## siyrean (Mar 31, 2011)

Kind of a big deal said:


> Romance and pairings. That in and of itself is a huge clich?.
> 
> The manga does perfectly fine without it, but sometimes it seems like fanfics only exist to satiate the craving that girls have for romance. Let's face it, the majority of fanfic writers are female, and at the risk of sounding chauvinistic, women often have trouble seeing the bigger picture, which is why romance stories become a microcosmos of the two main characters. Or worse, the one main character described in the story. So that's one important point to make about romance.
> 
> ...



I agree so much with this, and i'm a romantic comedy writer! but guh, it kills me that people don't understand character development. You need to have a story, not just a pattern of events that get two characters in bed. If character A is the exact same person they were at the beginning of the story by the end of it, with the exception of getting it on with character B, than what really have you accomplished? Please people, make your characters dynamic! 

Characters do not exist in a bubble, and all side characters are not one dimensional pylons for your pairing to bounce off of when you need an excuse for an obstacle. A characters team mates should never be pushed to the side or ignored. Their opinion should matter. 

Marriage being the goal and that plus a baby = happily ever after.  seriously, I am this >--< close to writing a Tenten gets an abortion fic just because of how ticked this cliche gets me. Why does no one write about a relationship in which love doesn't conquer all? In which all those reasons people give for the two to not get together, actually come true? where the tragedy comes from love not changing a character, or it's too little too late? 

and babies... oh how i hate get together for the sake of the babies and fall in love. Babies arn't romantic! they're a massive pain in the ass, a huge time commitment, and a giant set back in the career of a kunoichi. Don't get me wrong, i have read some excellent baby on the way fics, silvershrine immediately comes to mind, but i've also read so so many fluffy, overly sappy, complete horseshit on the subject.

off the romance topic, something that really bugs me in particular, i think because i'm a huge stickler when it comes to logic, but characters that make huge leaps in their reasoning to get to the right conclusion when it doesn't follow the logic of the situation. I know what it is, it's just lazy writing. Authors don't want to put the effort in to showing the character go through the logical steps given their universe and situation. 

I'm going to use one of my own fics as an example. I have an Obito Hinata fic where she starts to see his ghost, it's not a completely uncommon premiss. However a lot of the time, when i read things similar, they will immediately or almost immediately accept the fact that they are seeing a ghost. _That_ doesn't make sense - at all. Genjutsu, strange ninjustsu, enemy spy, some sort of test! all these are more likely then you suddenly coming across a ghost! and I hate the fact that I have to spend thousands of words going through eliminating these options, but i know that's what i've got to do.

The same falls for an outsider joining the village and being privvy to or joining the shinobi. Like bloody hell that's going to happen without a short novel explaining why they'd ever allow it. This is why I loved that filler episode "Kakashi's song", because Kakashi intended to kill her and she knew her only option was suicide. I admit i did a little happy dance when no one offered her amnesty. 

ok, i need to stop ranting.


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## BellatrixLestrange (Mar 31, 2011)

homo sapiens narutardis said:


> Glad to see this forum is getting somewhere.
> 
> Here's something I'd like to discuss BTW- Character bashing. Oh Jiminiy Cricket, how I hate that stuff. As much as there are characters we will never like, I don't think they deserve to be treated like crap.
> 
> ...



Let me explain Hiashi's character.  He's kinda like your typical non-abusive but perfectionistic Asian parent.  He already lost at least his twin.  Maybe he's pushing Hinata really hard as a way of teaching her how not to get kidnapped a second time, or worse, killed?

Ok, he looked mean when he sent Hinata off with Kurenai, but I think the latest chapters gave a lot of insights into his character.  In addition to a ninja registration number, he has a headband and a chunin vest.  Maybe, as mean as he could be on the outside, he was sent to Ninja Academy and later, missions, in the same manner as Hinata and is therefore treating her the same way he was treated by his parents.

I can just imagine the following:

the twins' father:  need to give Hizashi less reasons to hate the Main House, so we gotta treat them both the same.  Ok, off to Ninja Academy with the two of you.  Yup, that means you as well, Hiashi.  Oh, and you'll both have to go out on dangerous ninja missions when you graduate.

Hiashi:  *gets treated normally at school and gets used to the rest of the Main House making fun of him*

I think that Fugaku is a bit more of a gray character, too.  Perhaps he just wanted what's best for the Uchiha clan and he seemed to have his own way of showing love.
The last point will turn me off from a lot of fanfics, too.


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## C-No (Apr 4, 2011)

Wow I see a lot of long posts that I didn't care to read through them all, but I have one I really get tired of hearing.

Naruto was abused and mistreated by the villagers so he leaves to Iwa,Suna, or Kiri and hooks up with an OC or a character from that village then returns to Konoha years later.

For crossovers: It's either the same as above or Naruto dies in the middle of the chunin exams and gets a second chance at life in another world.


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## Barioth (Apr 28, 2011)

What I see a lot that I don't like about Fan Fic is people make is......
FFOC= Fan Fic Original Character is my definition.

1. FFOC > Naruto Canon
2. FFOC kill Naruto Canon
3. FFOC is the Hero/Heroine of the Story
4. FFOC description = 1/3 of the story (exclude fan fiction report/timeline/documentary/database and etc. It has to fit Naruto Fannon/Cannon timeline?)

For me I don't mind FFOC is the antagonist but when make it flawless it ruins it. Plus I don't like when the FFOC beat up Sasuke, Akatsuki and etc. And if you make your FFOC overpower may as well make him/her/it lose to Naruto Canon Character to balance it out.


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## Kakashifan727 (May 6, 2011)

I don't get what you mean with 1 and 2. Do they kill Naruto or fuck up the canon? I usually use OC's as a ay to diversify the canon a little, then later kill them off or keep them but only provide brief mentioning every now and again by other chars if they're not too relevant.


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## Kankurette (Aug 18, 2011)

Desert Butterfly said:


> The thing that's been bothering me the most, lately, is: depiction of characters as one-dimensional people.
> Tenten as a weapon-maniac tomboy; Chouji as a binge eater with no life; Sakura as someone whose only purpose in the plot is fangirling over Sasuke/Naruto/whoever it is; Shikamaru constantly saying "Troublesome" and acting lazily; and so on and so forth.
> Seriously, ever heard of in-depth characterisation? There's more to the characters than their main hobby/love interest/general attitude.


Yep. Tenten thinks about things other than weapons, and she's also very practical and clearly does care about her team mates. And she does have a kind side, remember when she was telling Kiba to lay off Ino? Sakura has interests and goals outside of Sasuke, although YMMV, but at least she's not as bad as she used to be, and she sees Sasuke and Naruto as people now. Chouji is kind and brave and although he isn't academic or a strategist, he is wise and a good people reader. Shikamaru hasn't been lazy for some time, not since Asuma died. It's called plot progression, people. 

And I never got the 'Deidara is a nice guy' thing. What, so a guy who had a horrible temper, tried to blow up a village, killed countless people and _used Gaara's corpse as a sofa_ is nice now?


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## Samehada (Aug 28, 2011)

Divi said:


> Oh god, this thread. So much truth. Must post my two cents WHICH IS LONG SO BEWARE.
> 
> Y'see, I do fall in the fanfiction writer category who writes both canonxcanon and canonxoc, but I really, really make it a number 1 point to avoid clich?s. I've read a lot of fanfiction before I started out, so I knew what bullshit to avoid. I'm not the best, not by any chance, but I like the characters and I specialize mainly in the Akatsuki because I researched them before I wrote them. This is to keep everything nice and in-character. I am in fact so hellbent on improvement that I occasionally message a random user on FF.net to critique me to the best of their ability, and I make sure they don't know me so they can give me constructive crit without being biased.
> 
> ...



 Your my hero!


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## Kankurette (Sep 24, 2011)

Re the Akatsuki rape thing - I honestly can't imagine Pein raping anyone. He's too honourable, in his own twisted way, to do that, IMO. Same with Itachi, unless you're talking mind rape. Kisame would rather fight, and Kakuzu and Sasori (who is possibly the most sexless character in Naruto - ffs, he's made of wood) don't piss around and are more likely to kill their enemy in seconds. Dunno about the others. YMMV.

I know rape is about power rather than sex, I just agree it's very cliched to make all the bad guys rapists. Especially when it seems OOC for most of them. 

Just out of interest, does Tayuya get bastardised as much as Hidan when it comes to swearing? Anyone know?


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## Kakashifan727 (Oct 3, 2011)

I haven't read many fics with either of them in it, so I have no idea, but guessing the amountsof overused cliches on here, I'd say yes.


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## Pseudo (Oct 3, 2011)

I love those cheesy NaruSaku fics where Naruto comes back to Konoha with SOTSP power levels.


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## Kakashifan727 (Oct 3, 2011)

Where? Point me to some.

I remmber one, the Golden Fox, where Naruto was all Godly and trolling =everyone, and they all hated him and he was such a jackass. Ppl thought it was the best fic ever, but it sucked balls to me.


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## Von Kreuz (Apr 12, 2013)

I know that I perform Thread necromancy but I think that this thread should get a push with the current flood of fan fictions that are posted in hour intervals. 

I have to admit that, if used on a right way, even cliches might have the strength to be good. But it seems that authors are not really able to use the things they want to use. 


I have seen a lot Cheating and Infidelity fictions in the time I started to read active and all, okay mostly all, follow the same setting: 


The Character is mostly Sakura and Naruto.  Sakura cheats with Sasuke (okay, no further questions) and breaks Naruto with that. Okay...I also have seen different mix ups. 

I also have to admit what people say about the characters. Many Authors have the tendency to break havoc with the original characters and turn them into something strange. Best Example Hinata and stuttering. I know that there are people who act like the ff hinata, but even those manage to finish one or two words in one flow. 

I think it is not rally easy to list all of the cliches. The problem is there are to many of them. And sometimes I have the feeling that Kishi has an eye on the ff and start to use the cliches as well. But that could also be my paranoid thought. 


What really didn't work in my eyes is the banned from the city stuff and we accept Sasuke without penalties for him. 

Okay. Naruto get banished or exiled. Yep, a realistic scenario for the current weapon of the Village. Why is banning someone like Naruto even a idea. If he is not a perfect weapon he can be made to a perfect defender. He is more then loyal to do that. But well, it seems to be a thrill to pull a Banish Story out of the air. Followed by ten stories with the same idea. 

And like many others. I can't see Sasuke be returning to Konoha as an member of the village. Okay, if he has "business" then he will step a feet into it. But not when people are around or were he can be caught. But Authors seems to work it the other way. The Village welcomes him with open arms, sacrifice him some virgins, kiss his ass and do many other things. Yep, also a realistic view. Normally he would be thrown into prison and maybe executed later. 


A different question. Is Sakura shallow? I mean in the genin stage she was more or less shallow... but later on.... is she that shallow how authors want her to be seen? Okay, she is a medic but like someone said she is more or less the normal part of the whole ninja population. if you cut out the inner voice that was only there in her childhood and the slight obsession. 


Okay, I hope that I don't get gutted cause I brought this thread back up... but cliches and to set them up for others to see is in my eyes important to avoid said mistakes.


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