# NaruHina Thread [Read OP before posting]



## Nidaime Mizukage (Feb 8, 2012)

My Body Is Ready.


*Spoiler*: __ 










_Either discuss the topic or don't post.
No more comments about each other or the thread itself.​--Dragonus Nesha​_​​


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## ceralux (Feb 8, 2012)

We actually agree on something. 

Cheers to the death of NaruSaku  
Burn in hell


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## NarutoIzDaMan (Feb 8, 2012)

Hinata seriously needs to get a life, that's all I'm gonna say about that.


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## Summers (Feb 8, 2012)

NarutoIzDaMan said:


> Hinata seriously needs to get a life, that's all I'm gonna say about that.



She will get A life....
*Spoiler*: __ 



At Naruto's side


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## Dokiz1 (Feb 8, 2012)

In Hinata's dreams, yes it will.


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## Brian (Feb 8, 2012)

Well Hinata is the only decent girl to go for

Sakura is bipolar, Ino is a slut, and Tenten is always invisible


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## Suigetsu (Feb 8, 2012)

Hinata... always hinata.... Clinging to Naruto sigh.


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## Lovely (Feb 8, 2012)

Well, that was some foreshadowing.


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## skins (Feb 8, 2012)

Well its possible... could be foreshadowing or trolling. :3


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## Tony Lou (Feb 8, 2012)

There was nothing subtle in her statement. I hardly believe it was a pointless tease from the author.

I'm not a pairing fan, it's just what seems clear here. 



NarutoIzDaMan said:


> Hinata seriously needs to get a life, that's all I'm gonna say about that.



She never thinks about anything else. Ever.


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## jdbzkh (Feb 8, 2012)

Eh, its a nice NaruHina moment but once again it's simply coming from one side not to mention Hinata is simply stating something Shikamaru once said a couple months back. Only difference she actually wants to....
Hold hands :33

Either way I've lost interest in pairings, NaruHina is far from one of my favorites, however its essentially the healthiest pairing left all this couple really needs now is development coming from Naruto's side.


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## ryz (Feb 8, 2012)

Hinata had 7 panels of romance...Sakura had 5 panels of resolve.... yeah NaruHina seems to have won this chapter as well.


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## Mogami Kyoko (Feb 8, 2012)

I suppose if you say that a one-sided crush's assumption and wish makes a pairing (which needs to be mutual to work, BTW) canon. 

Yes, yes, we know Hinata loves Naruto. Yes, yes, we know she wants to walk with him and rape him. Whoopie-flippin'-doo for her. Naruto still has a say in the matter and so far, we haven't seen a waver in his feelings or anything that might suggest that at a drop of a dime, he decided to switch from Sakura to Hinata.

Move along people. Nothing to see here. Nothing to do here. This chapter did nothing for pairings. kbai


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## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Obvious foreshadowing is obvious.

Then again it's been obvious for quite a while (since 469 to be precise) in my opinion so... *shrug*

Let's just hope Kishi doesn't screw the "Naruto falling for Hinata" part too much.


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## Marsala (Feb 8, 2012)

Goku and Chichi had more development than this.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

So many posts already. 

It was a pretty definitive statement though. I'm beginning to think Kishi might defy the typical tropes and go with it.


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## HashiraMadara (Feb 8, 2012)

Hinata deserves to be with Naruto, Sakura has done nothing but cause him pain, physically (punching him every chance she gets?), mentally (yapping and constantly comparing him to Sasuke in the past, and even going so far as to ask herself who she would treat first!) AND emotionally (With that selfish promise, and taking advantage of his kind hearted nature, regardless of how she always says she'll "try harder next time so she doesn't have to rely on him")
Not to mention the fact Hinata saved Naruto even IF it was by sacrificing herself it's the thought and the feelings behind it that counts, Kishi did good this time around.


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## Mio Akiyama (Feb 8, 2012)

And yet more one sided determination.


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## santanico (Feb 8, 2012)

HashiraMadara said:


> Hinata deserves to be with Naruto, Sakura has done nothing but cause him pain, physically (punching him every chance she gets?), mentally (yapping and constantly comparing him to Sasuke in the past, and even going so far as to ask herself who she would treat first!) AND emotionally (With that selfish promise, and taking advantage of his kind hearted nature, regardless of how she always says she'll "try harder next time so she doesn't have to rely on him")
> Not to mention the fact Hinata saved Naruto even IF it was by sacrificing herself it's the thought and the feelings behind it that counts, Kishi did good this time around.



Pulling the "deserves" card is silly, don't even


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## Tony Lou (Feb 8, 2012)

> Either way I've lost interest in pairings, NaruHina is far from one of my favorites, however its essentially the healthiest pairing left all this couple really needs now is development coming from Naruto's side.



The healthiest? Hinata is friggin' obsessed. What messed up pairings are you comparing it to?


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## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Naruto simply wasn't clear when he gently let Hinata down last time, he'll just have to be more blunt about it next time they meet. That's all. Poor delusionnal Hinata, thinking she might be worth Naruto's interest.


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## Darkhope (Feb 8, 2012)

It was definitely more personal than any other speech. All the other ones blended in together. 

Gotta say, Hinata's feelings sure have been put out there alot this war arc.

Btw, so much for Hinata "stepping down"   

Looks like she's finally actually pursing him.


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## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Darkhope said:


> It was definitely more personal than any other speech. All the other ones blended in together.
> 
> Gotta say, Hinata's feelings sure have been put out there alot this war arc.
> 
> ...



You'd almost think Kishi was building up to something. 

To quote the great McDonald's, I'm lovin' it.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Lovely said:


> Well, that was some foreshadowing.



Foreshadowing.

From Hinata's side.

Again.


I suppose the manga has been foreshadowing this for almost 600 chapters now then?

Sun and Moon and all that


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## Dokiz1 (Feb 8, 2012)

It could also be a ''red herring''. Oh wait, it doesn't apply to naruhina.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Foreshadowing.
> 
> From Hinata's side.
> 
> ...



Certainly more than we're getting from anywhere else, save Naruto-->Sasuke


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## Deshi Basara (Feb 8, 2012)

*Hopefully.. FINALLY!!It will happen this time!*


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Certainly more than we're getting from anywhere else, save Naruto-->Sasuke



Sorry bud, but Hinata wanting/thinking she'll be with Naruto doesn't constitute foreshadowing.

Foreshadowing is something like Kushina's words to Naruto (be it 'find a girl like me' or 'don't fall for the first one that comes your way').


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## Hydro Spiral (Feb 8, 2012)

Mogami Kyoko said:


> Whoopie-flippin'-doo



Whoopie-flippin'-doo that the author decided to give Hinata's bond with Naruto more special little focus time in this arc? Counting her thoughts in 540, and his multi-man rescue ending with her in 558, and their little bonding period in 559?

A blatant declaration of _"I'm gonna be with him when this shyt is over"_...?

I'd say yea  

Whoopie-flippin'-doo for NaruHina and it's fans indeed  Whether it winds up canon or not, it's something to smile about for us, so...

Yep.


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## Kuromaku (Feb 8, 2012)

Brian said:


> Well Hinata is the only decent girl to go for
> 
> Sakura is bipolar, *Ino is a slut*, and Tenten is always invisible



What do you have against sluts? 

Everyone knows virgins are overrated.  It's the experienced ones who are the most fun. 

Then again, Hinata might be the best choice not named Sasuke.  Don't like it?  Suck it..

Sure she is the epitome of a shallow love interest, but considering that the only other option is a bit of a cunt not exactly emotionally healthy or likeable...


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## Summers (Feb 8, 2012)

Foxve said:


> Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 41 (19 members and 22 guests)
> Foxve*, RandomLurker, Luiz, Itaranai, Starr, HashiraMadara, Kek, Iamacloud, ryz, skins, ceralux, kenage, Mogami Kyoko, Armodullahan, iander
> 
> Pairings be some serious biz  Let's just hope S*asuke doesn't kill her*



This may come to a surprise to people but I truly believe there would be a massive mega shitstorm of biblical proportions if Hinata got killed. Worst than if Itachi got his shit stomped, worst than if Minato got wanked to RS levels, worse than if tenten rockets to top-teir, worse than if Tsunade tell the other kage to step back while she pinky solos Madara.

If hinata died her last words would 100% be about Naruto, and that's just......


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2012)

Hinata's dream will always remain just a dream.


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## Lovely (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Foreshadowing.
> 
> From Hinata's side.
> 
> ...



Hinata made a pretty definite statement that basically said she'll be with Naruto after the war is over. When its said like that, everyone can pretty much agree on the author's voice being present as well.


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## ceralux (Feb 8, 2012)

NaruHina? I approve dat


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## santanico (Feb 8, 2012)

So it's agreed then, no Naruto pairing is healthy


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## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> I suppose the manga has been foreshadowing this for almost 600 chapters now then?



Yeah! It's not like Naruto likes, respects and even admires Hinata, how could he fall for someone like that? 

It's not like Naruto's view of Hinata went from "You're just a dark shy weirdo" to "I never knew Hinata could be this amazing" "I really like people like you" "Don't be so hard on yourself, you're strong".

It's not like Hinata played a part in some of Naruto's most important fights that helped him gain the villagers' acknowledgement. His fight with Neji and Pain were greatly focussed on in Kyubi's flashback of Naruto's growth. But it's not like Hinata helped him in both. 

It's not like they have shown to have positive influence on each other. 

There has never been any single hint of possibility for NH to happen, this is so sudden!


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Lovely said:


> Hinata made a pretty definite statement that basically said she'll be with Naruto after the war is over. When its said like that, everyone can pretty much agree on the author's voice being present as well.



Hinata's wanted to be with Naruto for 600 chapters now, how on earth is this different?

Or maybe Naruto told Hinata it's up to her when they were on their secret ramen date and Hinata's only now decided?


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2012)

Everyone knows Kushina only approves of Sakura.


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## Kage (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> So, anyone else staying up to see this shit storm?
> 
> My reaction: She finally aims to pursue him..._took her long enough..._ Should he care at this point?


IF HE DOESN'T HE WOULD BE A HORRIBLE HORRIBLE JERK FACE 

i am disappoint.

she's likely to stick a blade through her gut if she can't hold naruto's hand is what this chapter tells me


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Iamacloud said:


> Yeah! It's not like Naruto likes, respects and even admires Hinata, how could he fall for someone like that?



Yeah! It's not like Sakura likes, respects and even admires Naruto, how could she fall for someone like that?





> It's not like Naruto's view of Hinata went from "You're just a dark shy weirdo" to "I never knew Hinata could be this amazing" "I really like people like you" "Don't be so hard on yourself, you're strong".



It's not like Sakura's view of Naruto went from 'loser who always tries to interfere' to calling out to him during the Pain Arc to trying to relieve his burdens regarding Sasuke.



> It's not like Hinata played a part in some of Naruto's most important fights that helped him gain the villagers' acknowledgement. His fight with Neji and Pain were greatly focussed on in Kyubi's flashback of Naruto's growth. But it's not like Hinata helped him in both.



Oh please, Hinata was tangential to Naruto's growth in both those fights, although her words before Neji's fight were reasonably important, I'll give you that one.

However it's not like she's at all unique in influencing Naruto.


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## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Dokiz1 said:


> It could also be a ''red herring''. Oh wait, it doesn't apply to naruhina.



You don't understand how a red herring works. You don't develop something as a red herring at the END of a story. 

NH could have been a red herring if Kishi inserted such moments much earlier in part 2, but at this point, and a statement so definitive... if you think that's a red herring, you need to have your reading comprehension checked.


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## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Kage said:


> IF HE DOESN'T HE WOULD BE A HORRIBLE HORRIBLE JERK FACE
> 
> i am disappoint.
> 
> she's likely to stick a blade through her gut if she can't hold naruto's hand is what this chapter tells me



*still giggling at your comment*

Or she dies just as the war ends holding Naruto's hand...

How tragikku. 

I loved the chapter for the teamwork theme.


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## 4CloverChan (Feb 8, 2012)

Poor Hinata, she finally became a totally pairing fodder.

Yes, probably Naruto will magically fall in love with her at the end, because if he doesnt, her character will be pointless.

I find that kinda sad. Im pitty Hinata, and Naruto


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2012)

Kishi is really cruel to NaruHina fans.  He's going to get so much hate mail by the end of this manga.


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## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Nic said:


> Everyone knows Kushina only approves of Sakura.



True fact, she would kick Hinata in the nuts if she saw her dating her son.

Get away from that weird alien with big tits, you should find a nice Tsundere with reddish hair. That's what she'd say.

True fact, I can prove it with maths.


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## Hydro Spiral (Feb 8, 2012)

Nic said:
			
		

> Kishi is really cruel to NaruHina fans.


So cruel that he keeps bringing our favorite pairing back into the manga here and there and chooses to do stuff with it even though she's just a support char? 

How so? ..


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2012)

Iamacloud said:


> True fact, she would kick Hinata in the nuts if she saw him dating her son.
> 
> Get away from that weird alien with big tits, you should find a nice Tsundere with reddish hair. That's what she'd say.
> 
> True fact, I can prove it with maths.



well she told her son not to, and Mommy knows best.


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## Dokiz1 (Feb 8, 2012)

Hydro Spiral said:


> So cruel that he keeps bringing our favorite pairing back into the manga and chooses to focus on it here and there even though she's just a support char?
> 
> Wha



Pairing? I think you mean Hinata. That's hardly a pairing moment


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## Michael Lucky (Feb 8, 2012)

sakura looks like a lesbian

but im indifferent to the whole deal


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2012)

Hydro Spiral said:


> So cruel that he keeps bringing our favorite pairing back into the manga and chooses to focus on it here and there even though she's just a support char?
> 
> Wha



oh no that part is great, I'll give you that.  Enjoy.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

4CloverChan said:


> Im pitty Hinata, and Naruto



Don't pity them, pity those who live vicariously through them.


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## Michael Lucky (Feb 8, 2012)

Michael Lucky said:


> sakura looks like a lesbian
> 
> but im indifferent to the whole deal



I mean the pairing, lesbians are awesome


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## 4CloverChan (Feb 8, 2012)

Dokiz1 said:


> Pairing? I think you mean Hinata. That's hardly a pairing moment



Hinata = NaruHina

Everybody Knows that-


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## Michael Lucky (Feb 8, 2012)

Michael Lucky said:


> I mean the pairing, lesbians are awesome



the hot ones anyways


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## Dejablue (Feb 8, 2012)

Nic the puppy in your avatar......i want it.

But anyway. Hinata is being wildly presumptuous wouldn't you all say?  What right does she have to be thinking about being Naruto's lover in the middle of a war where just about anybody could die.  And not really seem to care.  And to top it all off Naruto has not sent any vibes her way that he likes her romantically.  This is something the fans do. Now Hinata is doing it. She's just assuming Naruto will love her back and it makes no sense.


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## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Nic said:


> Everyone knows Kushina only approves of Sakura.



...Really.


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## Michael Lucky (Feb 8, 2012)

Michael Lucky said:


> the hot ones anyways



the one you see in gifs who push their genitalia togther till they reach orgasm, again the hot ones


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## Hydro Spiral (Feb 8, 2012)

Nic said:


> oh no that part is great, I'll give you that.  Enjoy.



Oh, cool beans then


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> ...Really.



yes really. lol


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## Dokiz1 (Feb 8, 2012)

Dejablue said:


> Nic the puppy in your avatar......i want it.
> 
> But anyway. Hinata is being wildly presumptuous wouldn't you all say?  What right does she have to be thinking about being Naruto's lover in the middle of a war where just about anybody could die.  And not really seem to care.  And to top it all off Naruto has not sent any vibes her way that he likes her romantically.  This is something the fans do. Now Hinata is doing it. She's just assuming Naruto will love her back and it makes no sense.



Me think you missed the offscreen development.


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## Brian (Feb 8, 2012)

Michael Lucky said:


> the hot ones anyways



too bad sakura is an ugly dyke


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Dejablue said:


> Nic the puppy in your avatar......i want it.
> 
> But anyway. Hinata is being wildly presumptuous wouldn't you all say?  What right does she have to be thinking about being Naruto's lover in the middle of a war where just about anybody could die.  And not really seem to care.  And to top it all off Naruto has not sent any vibes her way that he likes her romantically.  This is something the fans do. Now Hinata is doing it. She's just assuming Naruto will love her back and it makes no sense.



Do you expect a tiny little annotation at the end of her thoughts going something like "if he also reciprocates my feelings."?


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## Kek (Feb 8, 2012)

Nic said:


> Kishi is really cruel to NaruHina fans.  He's going to get so much hate mail by the end of this manga.



I know right? Making us wait and shit. And all those haters will be blowing up his inbox like nobody's business.  

This doesn't seal the deal for NH, but it sure is nice to see Hinata starting to take the initiative with Naruto instead of simply admiring him from afar.


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2012)

Dejablue said:


> Nic the puppy in your avatar......i want it.
> 
> But anyway. Hinata is being wildly presumptuous wouldn't you all say?  What right does she have to be thinking about being Naruto's lover in the middle of a war where just about anybody could die.  And not really seem to care.  And to top it all off Naruto has not sent any vibes her way that he likes her romantically.  This is something the fans do. Now Hinata is doing it. She's just assuming Naruto will love her back and it makes no sense.



sorry can't do that. 

I just think Kishi had no idea what else to do with her character.  Besides he has to please the pairing lovers with something.


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## 4CloverChan (Feb 8, 2012)

Dejablue said:


> Nic the puppy in your avatar......i want it.
> 
> But anyway. Hinata is being wildly presumptuous wouldn't you all say?  What right does she have to be thinking about being Naruto's lover in the middle of a war where just about anybody could die.  And not really seem to care.  And to top it all off Naruto has not sent any vibes her way that he likes her romantically.  This is something the fans do. Now Hinata is doing it. She's just assuming Naruto will love her back and it makes no sense.



Naruto's feelings?... NaruHina doesn't care about it. He will love her back and thats all


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## ♥Nadia♥ (Feb 8, 2012)

Does Naruto get a say in this?

Obviously not


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## Michael Lucky (Feb 8, 2012)

Brian said:


> too bad sakura is an ugly dyke



and Hinata's a hot dyke?


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## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

I'mma steer clear of the wank, but I have to say...I wonder what Naruto said to her that made her confident enough to make such a promise. Because she's not the type to force herself on another.

All that aside, I am really digging the teamwork and camaraderie of this chapter--I can't wait to see it in action. I was also highly amused by Tobi getting antsy at the beginning--so I guess this means Kabuchimaru is gonna be the final big bad.

I'm also very curious to know what the combined efforts/powers of the jinchuuriki will turn out.


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## son_michael (Feb 8, 2012)

Hey guys...."walking hand in hand" doesn't necessarily mean she's looking to be his woman. Her words are most likely in reference to being by his side as a comrade.



If not then she's going to die, Sasuke will kill her or something.


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## 4CloverChan (Feb 8, 2012)

> This doesn't seal the deal for NH, but it sure is nice to see Hinata starting to take the initiative with Naruto instead of simply admiring him from afar.



Didn't she started to take the initiative when she confessed??


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## Kek (Feb 8, 2012)

♥Nadia♥ said:


> Does Naruto get a say in this?
> 
> Obviously not



Of course he does. Kishi is just being a cocktease when it comes to Naruto developing a relationship with anyone other than Sasuke.


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## Kage (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> *still giggling at your comment*
> 
> Or she dies just as the war ends holding Naruto's hand...
> 
> ...



stop, you'll make me blush

if naruto's not too busy dying with sasuke that is. he does seem to have trouble working her in between that, saving the world and ramen.

i'd like to _see_ the actual teamwork before i throw any kudos. right now it just sounds nice in theory.


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## Dejablue (Feb 8, 2012)

I just think this is an awfully inappropriate place to be thinking about hooking up with a guy.  But this is Hinata so yeah its all she has *to* think about.


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## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Nic said:


> yes really. lol



Care to elaborate where Kushina dropped names in her final words like a freakin Shaman queen who can predict her son's future? Because she fucking can, right? Suddenly, after you've experienced childbirth then shortly died, you fucking earned some supernatural powers that you can reincarnate as a emotional, insecure woman with pink hair and be in chakra form in your son's body at the same time, right? Because that's true love in mommy's form, right?


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## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

What can I say, My argument just got stump....
Hinata stop pursuing Naruto after chapter 450....
But what gives her the right to say that she will hold his hand of the end of this was
for some reason she reminds of a 12 years girl in *Naruto Manga* that claims that Sasuke was already hers, what will happen now?
Naruto don't you dare break Hinata Sama heart or els I will kill you.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> Hey guys...."walking hand in hand" doesn't necessarily mean she's looking to be his woman. Her words are most likely in reference to being by his side as a comrade.



"Hand in hand" is pretty explicitly romantic. If it were just platonic it would've just been "by your side" and nothing more.



> If not then she's going to die, Sasuke will kill her or something.



Hahaha yeah no, all of the Rookies have maximum plot shield.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Kek said:


> Of course he does. Kishi is just being a cocktease when it comes to Naruto developing a relationship with anyone other than Sasuke.



If by 'cocktease' you mean 'Hinata hasn't featured romantically in Naruto's thoughts at all', then I agree .


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## Nic (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Care to elaborate where Kushina dropped names in her final words like a freakin Shaman queen who can predict her son's future? Because she fucking can, right? Suddenly, after you've experienced childbirth then shortly died, you fucking earned some supernatural powers that you can reincarnate as a emotional, insecure woman with pink hair and be in chakra form in your son's body at the same time, right? Because that's true love in mommy's form, right?



don't need to her words to her son, did all the elaborating for me.


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## Hydro Spiral (Feb 8, 2012)

♥Nadia♥ said:


> Does Naruto get a say in this?





Inuyatta said:


> Because *she's not the type to force herself on another*.



Yea, um..I'm with Inuyatta. I think she'd only say something like _that_ with such blatant confidence if she knew that he wouldn't mind either 

We'll see, I guess.


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## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

...all pairing bias aside, I don't see anything wrong with making plans after a war is over--kinda reminds me of the soldiers back in WWII who'd make a bold claim about coming home to marry their sweethearts and the like. 

Basically it's like visualizing a goal to work towards--fight for more than just winning the war.


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## Kek (Feb 8, 2012)

4CloverChan said:


> Didn't she started to take the initiative when she confessed??



I mean take the initiative as in pursuing. When she confessed, she wasn't expecting an answer, and she wasn't going up to him saying "I love you. What do have to say to that?" or something like that. She answered his question of why she was there defending him. Now, at least from what her words suggests, she plans on being active with her love for him.

Hope that makes sense.


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## 4CloverChan (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Care to elaborate where Kushina dropped names in her final words like a freakin Shaman queen who can predict her son's future? Because she fucking can, right? Suddenly, after you've experienced childbirth then shortly died, you fucking earned some supernatural powers that you can reincarnate as a emotional, insecure woman with pink hair and be in chakra form in your son's body at the same time, right? Because that's true love in mommy's form, right?



An obssesed girl who think in holding hands with Naruto in the middle of a war is more accurate to be her daughter-in-law, right?

And Kushina can't predict future.. but Hinata can. Yeah, it make sense at all




Kek said:


> I mean take the initiative as in pursuing. When she confessed, she wasn't expecting an answer, and she wasn't going up to him saying "I love you. What do have to say to that?" or something like that. She answered his question of why she was there defending him. Now, at least from what her words suggests, she plans on being active with her love for him.
> 
> Hope that makes sense.



So she confessed just for fun? Im sorry, That doesnt make sense at all :/


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## Marsala (Feb 8, 2012)

If Sakura had said that about Sasuke, people would be raging, and rightfully so.


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## Kyuubi Naruto (Feb 8, 2012)

I'd be surprised if it's anything else than NaruHina now. That's the end of that. 

At this point I don't care. Hinata's been going on about Naruto for this entire manga, she deserves him. I mean what else is she known for? When you think about Hinata that's what you think about. Naruto doesn't care either, he's going to get a hot girl regardless so whoever floats his boat the best gets the most rows. Plain and simple.


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## Michael Lucky (Feb 8, 2012)

this is the most important thing in shonen history


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## Dejablue (Feb 8, 2012)

Inuyatta said:


> ...all pairing bias aside, I don't see anything wrong with making plans after a war is over--kinda reminds me of the soldiers back in WWII who'd make a bold claim about coming home to marry their sweethearts and the like.
> 
> Basically it's like visualizing a goal to work towards--fight for more than just winning the war. :shrug




The sweet hearts they were already in love with. *And who were in love with them.* You cant make a vow to marry someone who doesn't love you back. Gigantic difference here.


----------



## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Kek said:


> I mean take the initiative as in pursuing. When she confessed, she wasn't expecting an answer, and she wasn't going up to him saying "I love you. What do have to say to that?" or something like that. She answered his question of why she was there defending him. Now, at least from what her words suggests, she plans on being active with her love for him.
> 
> Hope that makes sense.



It does, so it will be ignored by a some. 

And yes I'm enjoying this thread too much. I'll go to sleep now.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Hydro Spiral said:


> Yea, um..I'm with Inuyatta. I think she'd only say something like that with such blatant confidence if she knew that he wouldn't mind either
> 
> We'll see, I guess.



~snip~

Secret ramen dates are a thing of mockery, not a viable theory.

Although if you have some fan art to back it up, I guess this is the time where you throw it in the ring.


----------



## Nic (Feb 8, 2012)

Marsala said:


> If Sakura had said that about Sasuke, people would be raging, and rightfully so.



i'm sure she'll say something rather dumb when Naruto and Sasuke fight. lol


----------



## son_michael (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> "Hand in hand" is pretty explicitly romantic. If it were just platonic it would've just been "by your side" and nothing more.



its really not explicitly romantic at all. It can be interpreted as romantic but nothing is specifically stating it to be so.





> Hahaha yeah no, all of the Rookies have maximum plot shield.



Hinata already came close to death, that could have been foreshadowing. 



Anyway, Naruto loves Sakura and only likes Hinata so...I guess you guys better hope Sasuke has a magical change of heart and falls in love with Sakura after his redemption...that's about the only way your going to get your pairing.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

4CloverChan said:


> An obssesed girl who think in holding hands with Naruto in the middle of a war is more accurate to be her daughter-in-law, right?
> 
> And Kushina can't predict future.. but Hinata can. Yeah, it make sense at all



Since you've replied to me without really knowing what I was posting about... 

I'm trying to wring out how Kushina could have predicted Naruto's love life. Not Hinata; I could care less about her.


----------



## Mogami Kyoko (Feb 8, 2012)

Kyuubi Naruto said:


> I'd be surprised if it's anything else than NaruHina now. That's the end of that.
> 
> At this point I don't care. Hinata's been going on about Naruto for this entire manga, *she deserves him*. I mean what else is she known for? When you think about Hinata that's what you think about. Naruto doesn't care either, he's going to get a hot girl regardless so whoever floats his boat the best gets the most rows. Plain and simple.



Please don't use that argument. It never works and it's been debunked.  If we're going to use the "deserves" argument, then Naruto deserves Sakura more than Hinata deserves Naruto.


----------



## Marsala (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> Anyway, Naruto loves Sakura and only likes Hinata so...I guess you guys better hope Sasuke has a magical change of heart and falls in love with Sakura after his redemption...that's about the only way your going to get your pairing.



At this point, I could see Kishimoto leaving Sasuke and Sakura single, or even letting Sakura be Rock Lee's love interest in the spinoff.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> its really not explicitly romantic at all. It cna be interpreted as romantic but nothing is specifically stating it to be so.



Holding hands is pretty romantic in this context.



> Hinata already came close to death, that could have been foreshadowing.



If anything that's anti-foreshadowing.

She had a brush with death once but survived. Having that happen again would just be a rehash of what happened before.



> Anyway, Naruto loves Sakura and only likes Hinata so...I guess you guys better hope Sasuke has a magical change of heart and falls in love with Sakura after his redemption...that's about the only way your going to get your pairing.



Anyway, Sakura loves Sasuke and only likes Naruto so...I guess you guys better hope Sakura has a magical change of heart and falls in love with Naruto after Sasuke dies...that's about the only way your going to get your pairing.


----------



## son_michael (Feb 8, 2012)

Marsala said:


> At this point, I could see Kishimoto leaving Sasuke and Sakura single, or even letting Sakura be Rock Lee's love interest in the spinoff.



you could see it or you want it?


----------



## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> its really not explicitly romantic at all. It can be interpreted as romantic but nothing is specifically stating it to be so.



The Nile isn't just a river in Egypt.



> Hinata already came close to death, that could have been foreshadowing.



Obviously!



> Anyway, Naruto loves Sakura and only likes Hinata so...I guess you guys better hope Sasuke has a magical change of heart and falls in love with Sakura after his redemption...that's about the only way your going to get your pairing.



Wait... Whut? 

I love this thread.


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

Dejablue said:


> The sweet hearts they were already in love with. *And who were in love with them.* You cant make a vow to marry someone who doesn't love you back. Gigantic difference here.



Sure--but taking into context the characters involved, it's not out of the question to suppose that perhaps Naruto may have intimated he would not mind seeing where things go after the war is over. 

Well, if the flashback in 540 is any indication--had there only been one panel of Naruto smiling or something, I wouldn't think much of it because it could just be an idealized memory. But since there was a flashback panel of him being surprised and noticing something before the second, smiling panel, it makes me think there was a scenario that we aren't being shown yet.

Because Kishi doesn't do chapters without flashbacks. 

Anyhow, nothing canon yet, but enough to make some parts of fandom pretty happy at least.


----------



## Dejablue (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> its really not explicitly romantic at all. It can be interpreted as romantic but nothing is specifically stating it to be so.



Is u serious dude? Teenagers don't hold hands platonically. They just don't unless they are related...and this is Japan so even that is shaky.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

*GONNA POST THIS AGAIN BECAUSE IT'S A QUALITY POST*



> Anyway, Naruto loves Sakura and only likes Hinata so...I guess you guys better hope Sasuke has a magical change of heart and falls in love with Sakura after his redemption...that's about the only way your going to get your pairing.



Anyway, Sakura loves Sasuke and only likes Naruto so...I guess you guys better hope Sakura has a magical change of heart and falls in love with Naruto after Sasuke dies...that's about the only way your going to get your pairing.


----------



## Kyuubi Naruto (Feb 8, 2012)

Mogami Kyoko said:


> Please don't use that argument. It never works and it's been debunked.  If we're going to use the "deserves" argument, then Naruto deserves Sakura more than Hinata deserves Naruto.



This is exactly why I don't post in pairing threads. 

People like you clearly don't get a joke. Relax Skippy, relax.


----------



## Dejablue (Feb 8, 2012)

I don't really buy the idea of there being some off panel side romance going on between Naruto and Hinata.  It could be possible but I just don't think so.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Anyway, Sakura loves Sasuke and only likes Naruto so...I guess you guys better hope Sakura has a magical change of heart and falls in love with Naruto after Sasuke dies...that's about the only way your going to get your pairing.



Well considering the preview just described Sasuke as 'carnage'....
...
...

Tell me, which one do you think is more likely?

Remember, Hinata hasn't featured at all in Naruto's romantic prospects.


----------



## Fay (Feb 8, 2012)

Marsala said:


> At this point, I could see Kishimoto leaving Sasuke and Sakura single, or even letting Sakura be Rock Lee's love interest in the spinoff.



No way Sasuke is going to stay single, no guy that smokin' can stay single for long . After he is redeemed I'm sure he'll be interested in dating some girls, _someone_ out there is sure to live up to his taste .

Sakura might stay single though, I agree with that.


----------



## Kek (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> If by 'cocktease' you mean 'Hinata hasn't featured romantically in Naruto's thoughts at all', then I agree .



Well, Kishi hasn't said one way or another about whether or not Naruto would consider Hinata romantically. Saying 'Hinata hasn't featured romantically in Naruto's thoughts at all' is just as bad as saying "Naruto would definitely consider Hinata romantically." Neither statement is true because Kishi won't give us the goods and tell us what he thinks about Hinata in a romantic context.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Kyuubi Naruto said:


> People like you clearly don't get a joke. Relax Skippy, relax.



NO IF (my preferred pairing) DOESN'T HAPPEN I WILL LITERALLY BE DEPRESSED IRL FOR DAYS

MY CONFIDENCE WILL BE DESTROYED

I WILL LOSE FAITH IN HUMANITY AND HAVE TO SEND HATE-MAIL TO THE AUTHOR


----------



## Hydro Spiral (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Stop being dumb, k?


Um...Ok..? 



> Secret ramen dates are a thing of mockery, not a viable theory.
> 
> Although if you have some fan art to back it up, I guess this is the time where you throw it in the ring.


Who's trying to present a theory or argument in the first place?  I was only stating my opinion on the matter and leaving it there.



> *We'll see, I guess.*


I said this for a reason. I.E - Not seriously trying to start a debate >.>

*shrug*


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Well considering the preview just described Sasuke as 'carnage'....
> ...
> ...
> 
> ...



Given all that Sasuke's done up until now up to and including *murder* and the fact that this has apparently had *no* affect on Sakura's attraction to him, I'd find it *infinitely* more believable if Naruto were to come around to Hinata than Sakura coming around to Naruto.

Sorry, that's just how I see things.


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

Dejablue said:


> I don't really buy the idea of there being some off panel side romance going on between Naruto and Hinata.  It could be possible but I just don't think so.



That's certainly fair enough, we'll wait and see. 

Frankly, I'm just going to enjoy the ride and hope that we actually get to see some awesome teamwork amongst all the rookies. If pairings get resolved in the process, great--if not, I'm still going to be entertained by seeing the rookies whoop some ass.


----------



## SageEnergyMode (Feb 8, 2012)

I always knew ever since his mother told him not to choose someone weird, that he was going to choose Hinata. Naruto once, before his fight against Neji, told Hinata that she was weird, but that he liked people like her.

They both were able to look at the other's eyes and know so much about the other with certainty. They may not show a kiss or some romance, but Hinata is definitely going to Naruto's girl unless she's killed or something.


----------



## son_michael (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Anyway, Sakura loves Sasuke and only likes Naruto so...I guess you guys better hope Sakura has a magical change of heart and falls in love with Naruto after Sasuke dies...that's about the only way your going to get your pairing.



LOL


All NaruSaku needs is for Sakura to fall in love with Naruto,she's not quite there yet, but she's close. 

but no your right, Naruto will fall in love with the girl who has full white eyes, he will be just like Jiraiya and fail in his love life. The fact that kushina was abusive was in no way an indication that his woman would be the same. Despite never giving up, he will give up on his love whom he has sacrificed for time and time again in this manga


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Kyuubi Naruto said:


> This is exactly why I don't post in pairing threads.
> 
> People like you clearly don't get a joke. Relax Skippy, relax.



In his defense, it's hard to tell in pairing threads whether people are joking or truly that stupid.

Sadly, it's most often the latter.



Kek said:


> Well, Kishi hasn't said one way or another about whether or not Naruto would consider Hinata romantically. Saying 'Hinata hasn't featured romantically in Naruto's thoughts at all' is just as bad as saying "Naruto would definitely consider Hinata romantically." Neither statement is true because Kishi won't give us the goods and tell us what he thinks about Hinata in a romantic context.



We've been in Naruto's head for ~100 chapters, where has Hinata shown up? There was that time just before Naruto trained the Kyuubi, but that was not romantic.

All it needs is a hint, but we have had none.


----------



## 4CloverChan (Feb 8, 2012)

> that he was going to choose Hinata



He doesn't choose her, not yet.


----------



## Mogami Kyoko (Feb 8, 2012)

Kyuubi Naruto said:


> This is exactly why I don't post in pairing threads.
> 
> People like you clearly don't get a joke. Relax Skippy, relax.



Sorry. In this kind of thread, it's difficult to tell who is serious and who isn't.


----------



## Geralt of Rivia (Feb 8, 2012)

NaruHina is boring. 

We need more angst with NaruSaku so this forum can rage after he she subtly rejects him and thinks about Sasuke, that's a lot more amusing imo. Or he tries to take her.


----------



## Nic (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> NO IF (my preferred pairing) DOESN'T HAPPEN I WILL LITERALLY BE DEPRESSED IRL FOR DAYS
> 
> MY CONFIDENCE WILL BE DESTROYED
> 
> I WILL LOSE FAITH IN HUMANITY AND HAVE TO SEND HATE-MAIL TO THE AUTHOR



That's what happened to me when NaruBunta seized to a valid pairing.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Given all that Sasuke's done up until now up to and including *murder* and the fact that this has apparently had *no* affect on Sakura's attraction to him, I'd find it *infinitely* more believable if Naruto were to come around to Hinata than Sakura coming around to Naruto.
> 
> Sorry, that's just how I see things.



[sp=540][/sp]

Sure seems like no effect to me .


----------



## Kek (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Holding hands is pretty romantic in this context.



Unless Hinata plans of friend-zoning Naruto into oblivion.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> LOL
> 
> All NaruSaku needs is for Sakura to fall in love with Naruto



LOL

All NaruHina needs is for Naruto to fall in love with Hinata.



> ,she's not quite there yet, but she's close.



Sure she is, that's why she's still fixated on Sasuke.


----------



## Hiro Tooki (Feb 8, 2012)

NaruHina...it's a pairing that brings members and lurkers together.  

This chapter has sold me on this pairing becoming canon.  I mean why wouldn't it?  Hinata only thinking about Naruto and not her comrades like a certain manipulator is what convinced me that she is his future wife.


----------



## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Remember, Hinata hasn't featured at all in Naruto's romantic prospects.



Remember, we haven't seen Naruto's view of his romantic propects since Hinata confessed (Sai's flashback predates Hinata's confession).

Awfully convenient.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> [sp=540][/sp]
> 
> Sure seems like no effect to me .



She still loves him, are you denying this?


----------



## Dejablue (Feb 8, 2012)

I really really really wish Kishimoto would stop dicking around.  It'd be better if pairings were left open. I'm looking at you Digimon 02 Epilogue.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

^
This is where a considerable amount of revenue comes from.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Hydro Spiral said:


> Um...Ok..?
> 
> 
> Who's trying to present a theory or argument in the first place?  I was only stating my opinion on the matter and leaving it there.



Don't be the guy who makes a point then scuttles behind poorly constructed semantic arguments.

Your opinion is simply a theory you were presenting, and stating it in this thread opens it to criticisms.



> I said this for a reason. I.E - Not seriously trying to start a debate >.>



If you're not looking to debate then just don't reply to me?


----------



## 4CloverChan (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> She still loves him, are you denying this?



She is poiting that Sasuke's acts had effects on her.


----------



## Geralt of Rivia (Feb 8, 2012)

Kek said:


> Unless Hinata plans of friend-zoning Naruto into oblivion.



Not hard to accomplish that with a guy who doesn't actually romantically like her.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Iamacloud said:


> Remember, we haven't seen Naruto's view of his romantic propects since Hinata confessed (Sai's flashback predates Hinata's confession).
> 
> Awfully convenient.



Remember how burden of proof works?

If you're looking to change the accepted pattern, namely Naruto loving Sakura, then you need to provide proof, that means panels.



First Tsurugi said:


> She still loves him, are you denying this?



Sure, but it's quite different to how it was, which makes your statement that nothing has changed laughable.


----------



## Kek (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> We've been in Naruto's head for ~100 chapters, where has Hinata shown up? There was that time just before Naruto trained the Kyuubi, but that was not romantic.
> 
> All it needs is a hint, but we have had none.



Has Kishi ever stated Naruto would be interested in a romantic realtionship with Hinata? No.
Has Kishi ever stated Naruto would _not _be interested in a romantic relationship with Hinata? Again, No.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Google that shit.


----------



## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> We've been in Naruto's head for ~100 chapters, where has Hinata shown up? There was that time just before Naruto trained the Kyuubi, but that was not romantic.
> 
> All it needs is a hint, but we have had none.



We've been in Naruto's head for ~100 chapters and there hasn't been anything about his romantic feelings, not for Hinata, but also not for Sakura. 

And since it appears Kishi is heading for NH, it's quite understandable. Naruto showing romantic interest in Hinata is the final step, and Kishi is taking his time (and it will be more realistic that way than if he simply had Naruto turn around right after Hinata confessed). 

But really, you think this chapter is setting up a rejection scene? 

Hinata is going to actively go for Naruto, and he's going to love it.


----------



## WraithX959 (Feb 8, 2012)

Obvious pairing is obvious.


----------



## Geralt of Rivia (Feb 8, 2012)

Kek said:


> Has Kishi ever stated Naruto would be interested in a romantic realtionship with Hinata? No.
> Has Kishi ever stated Naruto would _not _be interested in a romantic relationship with Hinata? Again, No.
> 
> Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Google that shit.



Going off this logic, NarutoxAnyone has as much a chance of happening.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, derp.


----------



## 4CloverChan (Feb 8, 2012)

> Has Kishi ever stated Naruto would not be interested in a romantic relationship with Hinata? Again, No.



He never stated Naruto would not be interested in a romantic relationship with Tenten Neither.. so If Tenten show any interest in Naruto, that mean he will end falling in love with her?


----------



## Kek (Feb 8, 2012)

Geralt of Rivia said:


> Not hard to accomplish that with a guy who doesn't actually romantically like her.



I think you're having trouble with the meaning of friend-zone.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Sure, but it's a far sight different to how it was, which makes your statement that nothing has changed laughable.



If she still loves him, then there's nothing Sasuke can realistically do to stop her from loving him. We know Sasuke will eventually be redeemed, so unless he dies I don't see a situation in which Sakura "moves on" or whatever to Naruto.

Meanwhile Naruto's already shown he'll place Sakura's feeling before his own, that means letting her be with Sasuke even if he'd like to be with her.

Do you see now why I find Naruto's feelings changing more plausible than Sakura's?


----------



## Dejablue (Feb 8, 2012)

my hazard guess is that even though Hinata is determined to be Naruto's girlfriend, it won't actually happen.  The manga will end with Hinata in pursuit.  And then it'll be up to the reader on weather or not she succeeds.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Kek said:


> Has Kishi ever stated Naruto would be interested in a romantic realtionship with Hinata? No.
> Has Kishi ever stated Naruto would _not _be interested in a romantic relationship with Hinata? Again, No.
> 
> Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Google that shit.





Iamacloud said:


> We've been in Naruto's head for ~100 chapters and there hasn't been anything about his romantic feelings, not for Hinata, but also not for Sakura.
> 
> And since it appears Kishi is heading for NH, it's quite understandable. Naruto showing romantic interest in Hinata is the final step, and Kishi is taking his time (and it will be more realistic that way than if he simply had Naruto turn around right after Hinata confessed).
> 
> But really, you think this chapter is setting up a rejection scene?



Again kids, burden of proof.


Although one would think that no answer to Hinata's confession for 110 chapters would indicate a little of Naruto's thoughts on the matter, particularly when he would rather chill at Ichiraku eating than seek her out and reply.

Unless of course, you would like to bring up the secret ramen date .



First Tsurugi said:


> If she still loves him, then there's nothing Sasuke can realistically do to stop her from loving him. We know Sasuke will eventually be redeemed, so unless he dies I don't see a situation in which Sakura "moves on" or whatever to Naruto.
> 
> Meanwhile Naruto's already shown he'll place Sakura's feeling before his own, that means letting her be with Sasuke even if he'd like to be with her.
> 
> Do you see now why I find Naruto's feelings changing more plausible than Sakura's?



Unless of course the process isn't instantaneous and Kishi actually takes time to develop Sakura's feelings as moving away from Sasuke.

There is a difference between Sakura and Karin, namely the amount of panel time allocated to each, although admittedly, Sakura has been a little short recently.


----------



## son_michael (Feb 8, 2012)

Sakura is deeply disturbed by sasuke, she knows she shouldn't love him and that she should pick Naruto. She can conceivably end up with either of them, she has to make her pick.

the fact id like to stress however is there IS romance between Naruto and Sakura, there's teasing,real friendship(not shino friendship) and obvious thoughts of dating between them(Sakura knows Naruto was serious about her, Naruto knows he wants to be with her) and Sakuras has strongly evaluated her feelings about Naruto in that romantic context and has YET to give a answer on how she feels about him.


anyway its time for bed, I wish all you naruhina fans a great night/day.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

Well I guess it is obvious now that NaruHina is the official pairing of the manga.

On a more important note, I sure hope my NaruSaku friends handle this chapter well. Remember guys, it's never too late to jump ship. I'm sure the NH fc will accept you with open arms.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

^
Oh, that will get you loved.  

No, Sakura doesn't _need_ to pick anyone.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Unless of course the process isn't instantaneous and Kishi actually takes time to develop Sakura's feelings as moving away from Sasuke.



He's had literally hundreds of chapters to do this and yet the status quo is the same as always. I cannot emphasize this point enough.

Literally *hundreds* of chapters.

I myself believed it would play out like that at one time, but I was wrong.

If you believe Sakura is going to get any kind of development between now and the end of the manga you are a fool.



> There is a difference between Sakura and Karin, namely the amount of panel time allocated to each, although admittedly, Sakura has been a little short recently.



And it's going to remain that way. She's not important.


----------



## Reddan (Feb 8, 2012)

Don't care about who ends up with, who, but thought from the start Kishimoto was writing the story towards Naruto and Hinata getting together. His words about how hard it was for him to change himself confirmed as much.


----------



## Dejablue (Feb 8, 2012)

I cannot understand the psyche of people who love this pairing so much. It's terribad.


----------



## Geralt of Rivia (Feb 8, 2012)

Kek said:


> I think you're having trouble with the meaning of friend-zone.



Pretty sure I do, my post was crystal clear.

Naruto would not care about Hinata "friend-zoning" him when he doesn't even like her.


----------



## Fourangers (Feb 8, 2012)

Lol. Kishi, you ship tease. 

I think that the icing in the cake would be if he drew all of a sudden Naruto declaring that he still likes Sakura romantically. 

This forum would explode then. 

Sincerely speaking, I thought that the most obvious one was Inoichi X Naruto. The guy nosebleeded, probably got a hard-on thinking about Naruto.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

Dejablue said:


> I cannot understand the psyche of people who love this pairing so much. It's terribad.


They like the idea of a guy ending up with a girl who loves him. Who'd have thought?


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Dejablue said:


> I cannot understand the psyche of people who love this pairing so much. It's terribad.



It's the least offensive of three evils.


----------



## kidgogeta (Feb 8, 2012)

Its pretty much confirmed imo. Sakura and Hinata both had a chance to share their thoughts this chapter.

I'll never understand the people who jump into a thread like this knowing what they are getting into and just being spoiled sports because they are bored or whatever it might be.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Golden Circle said:


> They like the idea of a guy ending up with a girl who loves him. Who'd have thought?



Except that can go with any of Big 3.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> ^
> Oh, that will get you loved.
> 
> No, Sakura doesn't _need_ to pick anyone.



While morally, I would like to agree with you, her character relevance has seemed to boil down between choosing between them.



First Tsurugi said:


> He's had literally hundreds of chapters to do this and yet the status quo is the same as always.



Of course, however Sasuke's worse than he's ever been before, not to mention Sakura actually knows what's going on this time.



> I myself believed it would play out like that at one time, but I was wrong.
> 
> If you believe Sakura is going to get any kind of development between now and the end of the manga you are a fool.



So NS is dead then?

Seems like kind of an amusing thought that Naruto's feelings for Sakura died without so much as a whisper.



> And it's going to remain that way. She's not important.



Actually I see her having more panels, she's a part of Naruto vs Sasuke, admittedly minor. Although Kishi certainly does like to milk all the drama he can out of a situation, personally I think the recent Hinata->Naruto is simply to bring NH back in the picture, again for the drama.

At least compared to the past 50 or so chapters, where she might have been in 5 of them.


----------



## Kyuubi Naruto (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> NO IF (my preferred pairing) DOESN'T HAPPEN I WILL LITERALLY BE DEPRESSED IRL FOR DAYS
> 
> MY CONFIDENCE WILL BE DESTROYED
> 
> I WILL LOSE FAITH IN HUMANITY AND HAVE TO SEND HATE-MAIL TO THE AUTHOR



People take pairings way too seriously. The sad thing is people honestly would think this way. There's people that get upset in reading a spoiler line that can even be linked to a potential pairing they're against and they dread other people in threads commenting on that potential thread in a positive light. 

It's like people think they're reading Fruits Basket or something.


----------



## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Although one would think that no answer to Hinata's confession for 110 chapters would indicate a little of Naruto's thoughts on the matter, particularly when he would rather chill at Ichiraku eating than seek her out and reply.



Psst.. Just one little thing. It's also been 90ish chapters since Sakura's confession, without any positive follow-up, and actually a few negative ones. While NH had positive moments "I can see it in your/his eyes" "Don't be so hard on yourself, you're strong", more Naruto smiling at Hinata, more focussed on damsel in distress moment, Hinata stating clearly she will be more agressive with Naruto.

Not sure your argument is as solid as you think it is...


----------



## 4CloverChan (Feb 8, 2012)

Fourangers said:


> I think that the icing in the cake would be if he drew all of a sudden Naruto declaring that he still likes Sakura romantically.



As far I know, he still.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Fourangers said:


> Lol. Kishi, you ship tease.
> 
> I think that the icing in the cake would be if he drew all of a sudden Naruto declaring that he still likes Sakura romantically.
> 
> ...



Nah Four, most obvious pairing in this chapter was InoCho, skinny Chouji looks almost exactly like Inoichi .


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> While morally, I would like to agree with you, her character relevance has seemed to boil down between choosing between them.



Whoever she chooses, at this point, would be a disgrace.

But that's another thread.

And this chapter showed that she wants to be part of the effort to save the world along with everyone else. Maybe she'll finally focus on other people than herself.

Fuck, I have to talk about Hinata.

Hinata decides to pursue Naruto when she makes it out of the war. God, it's not like NH is canon. There's still Naruto.


----------



## Tyrannos (Feb 8, 2012)

I like to Congratulate NaruHina on another victory point in the pairing war.   

But I have to say, it would be a nice thing if Naruto actually returned Hinata's feelings than us constantly knowing Hinata loves Naruto.  I mean its not like we forgot.  


And call this chapter foreshadowing or what til your heart content, but in the end no matter who wins, the romance is going to stink to high heaven because the winners are going to have sudden development.   Naruto out of the blue saying he loves Hinata,  Sasuke suddenly saying he loves Sakura (after practically killing her a couple of times), and even Sakura requitting Naruto's feelings after all these years. As Marsala said a few pages ago, even Goku had development with Chichi.  

But Kishimoto did say he sucked at Romance.


----------



## Hiro Tooki (Feb 8, 2012)

Now that I think about it, Hinata said something similar like this before in 437 and she got run through by Pein's rod and that almost killed her.  

With Sasuke looming by and his earlier threat to Tobi to let Konoha pay for what the Elders did to his clan...kinda tells me that he plans on killing some Konoha shinobi and that includes the Kohona 11.


----------



## skins (Feb 8, 2012)

Kyuubi Naruto said:


> It's like people think they're reading Fruits Basket or something.



Well it _is_ a manga about _ninja's_... yanno, master's of disguise.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Of course, however Sasuke's worse than he's ever been before, not to mention Sakura actually knows what's going on this time.



It doesn't matter, she's still in love with him despite being fully aware of all of his sins, and knowing that death is all he deserves.



> So NS is just dead then?



In my eyes it is.

Barring Sasuke dying I don't see them getting together.

Though to be fair that's not out of the realm of possibility.



> Seems like kind of an amusing thought that Naruto's feelings for Sakura died without so much as a whisper.



The same would be true for Hinata's feelings if NH didn't happen.

It's redundant.



> Actually I see her having more panels, she's a part of Naruto vs Sasuke, admittedly minor.



She's nothing but a cheerleader at this point.

She said as much herself.



> At least compared to the past 50 or so chapters, where she might have been in 5 of them.



Yeah, maybe 8 instead of 5.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Iamacloud said:


> Psst.. Just one little thing. It's also been 90ish chapters since Sakura's confession, without any positive follow-up, and actually a few negative ones. While NH had positive moments "I can see it in your/his eyes" "Don't be so hard on yourself, you're strong", more Naruto smiling at Hinata, more focussed on damsel in distress moment, Hinata stating clearly she will be more agressive with Naruto.



The eyes comment is a legitimate moment, however every other one you've listed has still been Hinata->Naruto, which by this stage is just assumed.

Note Naruto hasn't had much interaction with Sakura since the confession, however what he has had has been normal for him. So I'm sitting pretty as long as Naruto doesn't start acting abnormal.



> *Not sure your argument is as solid as you think it is... *



I'm not the one claiming my pairing is magically canon .


----------



## Fourangers (Feb 8, 2012)

4CloverChan said:


> As far I know, he still.



Yeah, but it wouldn't hurt to revalidate his feelings. 



Mr Horrible said:


> Nah Four, most obvious pairing in this chapter was InoCho, skinny Chouji looks almost exactly like Inoichi .



And ShikaNaru too, you saw how ferocious he was, thinking: "Just wait for me Naru, I'll be there!"


----------



## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> I'm not the one claiming my pairing is magically canon .



Basic reading comprehension != Magic.


----------



## 4CloverChan (Feb 8, 2012)

Fourangers said:


> Yeah, but it wouldn't hurt to revalidate his feelings.



Why should them change? Just Because Hinata seems so determinated?


----------



## Marsala (Feb 8, 2012)

Alas, the argument "If XXXXX pairing happens, the writing will be really shitty!" is no longer valid, because it applies to all pairings now except NaruSasu.


----------



## Mogami Kyoko (Feb 8, 2012)

Iamacloud said:


> Basic reading comprehension != Magic.



You loooooooove bringing up your reading comprehension in all your arguments, don't you?
Sadly, that has nothing to do with this.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Except that can go with any of Big 3.


To be fair, it's slightly different:

NaruSaku: They like the idea of a girl ending up with a guy who loves him.
NaruHina & SasuSaku: They like the idea of a guy ending up with a girl who loves him.

I can understand the appeal of each pairing.


----------



## Fourangers (Feb 8, 2012)

4CloverChan said:


> Why should them change? Because Hinata seems so determinated?



Nah, because Kishimoto just wants a bigger pairing shitting storm. *shrug*

He who commands this manga, however shitty it is. He can validate anything.

EDIT: I don't doubt that the moment Sasuke appears, he'll be the star of Naruto's thoughts and words.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> It doesn't matter, she's still in love with him despite being fully aware of all of his sins, and knowing that death is all he deserves.



She reacted to Sasuke's change of character, who's to say where that reaction will lead?

Also note it seems like Sasuke has gotten even darker recently (if that's possible), he is the yin to Naruto's yang after all, and Naruto's effectively the saviour of the world now, so what does that make Sasuke?



> In my eyes it is.
> 
> Barring Sasuke dying I don't see them getting together.
> 
> Though to be fair that's not out of the realm of possibility.



I don't really disagree with this, other than the chance of it happening and I cbf arguing that.



> The same would be true for Hinata's feelings if NH didn't happen.
> 
> It's redundant.



a)There was that panel in 450 where Hinata was smiling regarding the Naruto and Sakura hug (although I personally never subscribed to the theory that Hinata stopped chasing Naruto).

b)Hinata is a side character who pops up once every blue moon, whereas I find it laughable that Naruto, the main character who seems to operate purely on emotion sometimes, would change his feelings off panel without even a hint .



> She's nothing but a cheerleader at this point.
> 
> She said as much herself.



Her words in this recent chapter contradict this once again  (although she's said as much ~20 times in this series already and look where it's gotten her).

But even as a cheerleader, she'll have more panel time than she did.



> Yeah, maybe 8 instead of 5.



Eh, it was just an estimation, she's only had a significant role in 2-3(?).


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

Marsala said:


> Alas, the argument "If XXXXX pairing happens, the writing will be really shitty!" is no longer valid, because it applies to all pairings now except NaruSasu.


Minato/Kushina and Asuma/Kurenai disagree with you.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Fourangers said:


> And ShikaNaru too, you saw how ferocious he was, thinking: "Just wait for me Naru, I'll be there!"



No homo 

You told me you only liked SN as well!

You fickle woman! 



Iamacloud said:


> Basic reading comprehension != Magic.



And yet for some it appears to be the same thing .


----------



## Reddan (Feb 8, 2012)

Mogami Kyoko said:


> You loooooooove bringing up your reading comprehension in all your arguments, don't you?
> Sadly, that has nothing to do with this.



No it does. Putting personal feelings aside, Naruto and Hinata was the the pairing Kishimoto hinted at through out the story.


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> Sakura is deeply disturbed by sasuke, she knows she shouldn't love him and that she should pick Naruto. She can conceivably end up with either of them, she has to make her pick.
> 
> the fact id like to stress however is there IS romance between Naruto and Sakura, there's teasing,real friendship(not shino friendship) and obvious thoughts of dating between them(Sakura knows Naruto was serious about her, Naruto knows he wants to be with her) and Sakuras has strongly evaluated her feelings about Naruto in that romantic context and has YET to give a answer on how she feels about him.
> 
> ...




Considering that it is FAR more unlikely for Sasuke to fall in love with Sakura than anything else so Sakura's feelings towards Sasuke are quite irrelevant.

*after Sasuke is redeemed*

Sakura: I love u Sasuke kuuun, I've been waiting for you all this time. We are finally together and...

Sasuke: Shut up. You are annoying.

Sakura:

LOL it is WAY more likely for Naruto to fall in love with Hinata than Asexuality King Sasuke falling for Sakura suddenly.

IMO Kishi will chicken out and leave all pairings ambiguous.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

arednad said:


> No it does. Putting personal feelings aside, Naruto and Hinata was the the pairing Kishimoto hinted at through out the story.



What, four hints?

Good lord, he was basically spelling it out for us!

Get out of here kid.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

arednad said:


> No it does. Putting personal feelings aside, Naruto and Hinata was the the pairing Kishimoto hinted at through out the story.



SasuNaru says hi 

NaruRamen was way more obvious.


----------



## Reddan (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> What, four hints?
> 
> Good lord, he was basically spelling it out for us!
> 
> Get out of here kid.



No there were several hints. Worse still is that there were as many hints that Sakura loved Sasuke. The biggest hint is probably not found in the manga. It's found in Kishimoto's brief account of everything he did to become a mangaka.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> She reacted to Sasuke's change of character, who's to say where that reaction will lead?



It didn't lead anywhere. She already knew how bad he was, that's why she tried to kill him.

But she couldn't do it because deep down she still loved him. That feeling will never disappear.



> Also note it seems like Sasuke has gotten even darker recently (if that's possible), he is the yin to Naruto's yang after all, and Naruto's effectively the saviour of the world now, so what does that make Sasuke?



It doesn't matter how dark Sasuke gets, nothing he does will make her stop loving him. That was the whole point behind her failure to kill him.




> a)There was that panel in 450 where Hinata was smiling regarding the Naruto and Sakura hug (although I personally never subscribed to the theory that Hinata stopped chasing Naruto).



Yeah I didn't buy that explanation either.



> b)Hinata is a side character who pops up once every blue moon, whereas I find it laughable that Naruto, the main character who seems to operate purely on emotion sometimes, would change his feelings off panel without even a hint .



The difference here is that Naruto's feelings for Sakura are a comparatively small part of his character, whereas with Hinata it's a significant part of her character, and arguably the basis of her entire character.

I don't see either of them going undressed but in Naruto's case it can be addressed much more subtly. Hinata's feelings are going to require something a bit more overt.



> Her words in this recent chapter contradict this once again  (although she's said as much ~20 times in this series already and look where it's gotten her).



Pretty much.

I don't expect this will lead anywhere we haven't been before.



> Eh, it was just an estimation, she's only had a significant role in 2-3(?).



I was being hyperbolic. She may get more focus, but it won't be much.


----------



## UberDruid (Feb 8, 2012)




----------



## Fourangers (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> No homo
> 
> You told me you only liked SN as well!
> 
> You fickle woman!



Hey, it's not my fault that Kishi spends more time with bromantic relationships rather than het.  ...........have I ever showed you a second interpretation over the moment when Kakashi saved Naruto few chapters ago? 

I do!  I like screwing your mind, obviously.  plus, NaruHarem sounds like a great idea

Fickle like Autumn Skies, after all, I'm a woman.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

arednad said:


> No there were several hints. Worse still is that there were as many hints that Sakura loved Sasuke. The biggest hint is probably not found in the manga. It's found in Kishimoto's brief account of everything he did to become a mangaka.



"Several" typically means around three .

NH has always had next to no panel time, in the amount of hints it falls greatly behind other pairings. What catches it up is that the others also have negative development sometimes.

Of course you can argue that no interaction is negative development, but that's another story.


----------



## Kurama (Feb 8, 2012)

Amusing thread.


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> SasuNaru says hi



Quoted for truth. I mean, come on...

_Madara: Naruto is merely a pawn to be used to stimulate Sasuke._

This manga. Goddamn.


----------



## Hiro Tooki (Feb 8, 2012)

Golden Circle said:


> Minato/Kushina and Asuma/Kurenai disagree with you.


I agree with Minato/Kushina but Asuma/Kurenai wasn't even developed in the manga much...if at all.  Just seemed like a big wtf? to me when I read that she was pregnant with Asuma's child.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

kyuubi425 said:


> Amusing thread.



I think you could use a few of these:


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

Hiro Tooki said:


> I agree with Minato/Kushina but Asuma/Kurenai wasn't even developed in the manga much...if at all.  Just seemed like a big wtf? to me when I read that she was pregnant with Asuma's child.


Asuma/Kurenai was well done even if they didn't have much panel time imo.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Inuyatta said:


> Quoted for truth. I mean, come on...
> 
> _Madara: Naruto is merely a pawn to be used to stimulate Sasuke._
> 
> This manga. Goddamn.



Exactly. _Stimulate._ Strong verb. To Sasuke. 


*Spoiler*: __ 








*watches the thread rage*


----------



## Gilgamesh (Feb 8, 2012)

Why am i not surprised this thread has more posts than all the other threads in the telegrams?


----------



## Marsala (Feb 8, 2012)

Gilgamesh said:


> Why am i not surprised this thread has more posts than all the other threads in the telegrams?



I would be surprised if anyone is surprised by this.


----------



## Reddan (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> "Several" typically means around three .
> 
> NH has always had next to no panel time, in the amount of hints it falls greatly behind other pairings. What catches it up is that the others also have negative development sometimes.
> 
> Of course you can argue that no interaction is negative development, but that's another story.



I will actually do some effort before I leave this morning and flick through the volumes to find you Kishimoto's thoughts on
1) How hard it is to change yourself and how he feels about the person who helped him change
2) How he feels about someone, who has always been there for him

Besides that Naruto truly opened up to HInata. He was not the brash show off. He told her his deepest insecurities and she did not care. Hinata saw Narut for who he really was. 

Then you could juxtapose her confession with Sakura's.

Hinata being the only person to see watch him leave.

In recent chapters they could read each other eye's. Have you not heard the expression the eyes are the window to the soul?


----------



## Reddan (Feb 8, 2012)

Marsala said:


> I would be surprised if anyone is surprised by this.



Not really much else to talk about this chapter really is there.


----------



## Hydro Spiral (Feb 8, 2012)

Golden Circle said:


> Asuma/Kurenai was well done even if they didn't have much panel time imo.



Now that you mention it..Yahiko/Konan is another pairing like that. It was canon in like, 2, or maybe 3 panels in a montage of flashbacks :L


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Gilgamesh said:


> Why am i not surprised this thread has more posts than all the other threads in the telegrams?



These aren't even all the active posters.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

Gilgamesh said:


> Why am i not surprised this thread has more posts than all the other threads in the telegrams?


At the present rate we will have more posts in here than the discussion thread.

*grabs popcorn*


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> It didn't lead anywhere. She already knew how bad he was, that's why she tried to kill him.
> 
> But she couldn't do it because deep down she still loved him. That feeling will never disappear.



[sp][/sp]

"Is this really Sasuke... He's like a different person..."

Doesn't give much credit to her knowing how bad he was .

Sure, Sakura will never want to actually kill Sasuke, but neither does Naruto, you don't have to romantically love someone in order to not want to kill an ex-comrade.



> It doesn't matter how dark Sasuke gets, nothing he does will make her stop loving him. That was the whole point behind her failure to kill him.



Again, not necessarily love him in that way, not to mention Sakura was also realizing her own weakness then and legitimizing Naruto's words that he was the only one who could deal with Sasuke.



> The difference here is that Naruto's feelings for Sakura are a comparatively small part of his character, whereas with Hinata it's a significant part of her character, and arguably the basis of her entire character.
> 
> I don't see either of them going undressed but in Naruto's case it can be addressed much more subtly. Hinata's feelings are going to require something a bit more overt.



Hinata's feelings don't need to be addressed, Naruto's do, that's the nature of this type of story. Naruto's don't need to be requited, but they do need to be addressed. 



> Pretty much.
> 
> I don't expect this will lead anywhere we haven't been before.
> 
> I was being hyperbolic. She may get more focus, but it won't be much.



It still leads to her getting more panel time.



Fourangers said:


> Hey, it's not my fault that Kishi spends more time with bromantic relationships rather than het.  ...........have I ever showed you a second interpretation over the moment when Kakashi saved Naruto few chapters ago?
> 
> I do!  I like screwing your mind, obviously.  plus, NaruHarem sounds like a great idea
> 
> Fickle like Autumn Skies, after all, I'm a woman.



I hope Sasuke dies in a fire.

Without Naruto. 





Also, Fan-art-sama has appeared .


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

^
Oh look, it's another pairing debate thread in disguise.


This is getting better than I thought.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> If she still loves him, then there's nothing Sasuke can realistically do to stop her from loving him. We know Sasuke will eventually be redeemed, so unless he dies I don't see a situation in which Sakura "moves on" or whatever to Naruto.
> 
> Meanwhile Naruto's already shown he'll place Sakura's feeling before his own, that means letting her be with Sasuke even if he'd like to be with her.
> 
> Do you see now why I find Naruto's feelings changing more plausible than Sakura's?



Well to be honest with you with out Sasuke been redeemed I don't see NaruSaku. Sasuke need to surt out her feeling for the two of them on the good side I really have a strong feeling that she will go for Naruto.
NaruSaku with Sasuke dead will be the worse pairing ever and it will give a bad taste......


----------



## Naruko (Feb 8, 2012)

Stay civil and stay on topic folks. I don't want to see any more personal attacks or negative value judgments about other posters (and I don't want to see spam celebrating or encouraging same). Thanks and carry on (nicely).


----------



## vered (Feb 8, 2012)

this thread is the most discussed thread already.not surprising


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

This chapter doesn't mean NH is officially canon. It just means Hinata plans to pursue Naruto when the war is over.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

Naruko said:


> Stay civil and stay on topic folks. I don't want to see any more personal attacks or negative value judgments about other posters (and I don't want to see spam celebrating or encouraging same). Thanks and carry on (nicely).


You deleted my popcorn gif. 




Sasuko said:


> This chapter doesn't mean NH is officially canon. It just means Hinata plans to pursue Naruto when the war is over.


There is no escaping her.

offscreen.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> [sp][/sp]
> 
> "Is this really Sasuke... He's like a different person..."
> 
> Doesn't give much credit to her knowing how bad he was .



She was planning to kill him at that point. If anything that strengthened her resolve since she saw that he really had become a terrible person.

Yet in spite all of that her resolve failed and she couldn't go through with it. I don't know why that would change now.



> Sure, Sakura will never want to actually kill Sasuke, but neither does Naruto, you don't have to romantically love someone in order to not want to kill an ex-comrade.



The reason Sakura hesitated was because of what she felt for him.

That feeling goes beyond the feeling of camaraderie. What her flashbacks at that moment consisted of prove this.

She loves him, and that hasn't changed, despite everything.



> Hinata's feelings don't need to be addressed, Naruto's do, that's the nature of this type of story. Naruto's don't need to be requited, but they do need to be addressed.



I'm not saying Naruto's feelings won't be addressed, I just don't see any indication they'll be requited.

And I'm positive Hinata's will to, despite her status as a side character.



> It still leads to her getting more panel time.



More panel time doesn't equate to development. I doubt she'll be more than a wall flower representing Team 7.



DONJOSEPH19 said:


> Well to be honest with you with out Sasuke been redeemed I don't see NaruSaku. Sasuke need to surt out her feeling for the two of them on the good side I really have a strong feeling that she will go for Naruto.
> NaruSaku with Sasuke dead will be the worse pairing ever and it will give a bad taste......



I can't fathom anything that would cause Sakura to stop loving Sasuke unless he died, since she would then _have_ to give up her feelings for him.

If he doesn't die, then I don't see Sakura coming around to loving Naruto.

That's just how I see things.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> This chapter doesn't mean NH is officially canon. It just means Hinata plans to pursue Naruto when the war is over.



Which means NH is canon


----------



## Icegaze (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> This chapter doesn't mean NH is officially canon.



It also means NH is officially no longer headcanon. It's somewhere in between but closer to canon.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

inb4 the manga ends precisely when the war is over, and Naruto doesn't end up with anyone.

Calling it now.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Golden Circle said:


> There is no escaping her.
> 
> offscreen.



When I initially read that, I got this yandere vibe. 



Mr Horrible said:


> Which means NH is canon



I didn't say anything.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Icegaze said:


> It also means NH is officially no longer headcanon. It's somewhere in between but closer to canon.



Oh hello. 

Because Naruto cares, right? No, I mean, he likes her romantically?


----------



## Hiro Tooki (Feb 8, 2012)

Whether she will live after the war is what NHers should concern themselves with as well as Naruto reciprocating her feelings.  Though even if this pairing does become canon it would still feel lame, just like the other 2 would in the lame 3. 

Hinata is truly reduced to pairing wank which is evidenced even heavily by this chapter.  Her character that was somewhat interesting back in the genin days has resorted to this.

How sad...for Hinata fans.


----------



## UberDruid (Feb 8, 2012)

Naruto should be a lone wolf like his mentor Jiraiya. Forever alone.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> She was planning to kill him at that point. If anything that strengthened her resolve since she saw that he really had become a terrible person.
> 
> Yet in spite all of that her resolve failed and she couldn't go through with it. I don't know why that would change now.



Stop backpedaling, you said she knew who Sasuke was then when she clearly didn't.

So Sasuke is at his worst ever and Sakura has recently become aware of this, it has also had an impact on her perception of him, what that will lead to is harder to know.



> The reason Sakura hesitated was because of what she felt for him.
> 
> That feeling goes beyond the feeling of camaraderie. What her flashbacks at that moment consisted of prove this.
> 
> She loves him, and that hasn't changed, despite everything.



To say Sakura->Sasuke is the same as it was 200 chapters ago is laughable.



> I'm not saying Naruto's feelings won't be addressed, I just don't see any indication they'll be requited.
> 
> And I'm positive Hinata's will to, despite her status as a side character.



But they haven't been addressed, so therefore NS is hardly dead?



> More panel time doesn't equate to development. I doubt she'll be more than a wall flower representing Team 7.



There's a correlation though, things can't develop if there is no panel time.

So she's more likely to develop now than she was in these recent chapters.



> I can't fathom anything that would cause Sakura to stop loving Sasuke unless he died, since she would then _have_ to give up her feelings for him.
> 
> If he doesn't die, then I don't see Sakura coming around to loving Naruto.
> 
> That's just how I see things.



There's a plethora of reasons Sakura will stop loving Sasuke.

There's also the most hints out of any unrequited pairing that NS will be requited.



Sasuko said:


> I didn't say anything.



I should excommunicate you


----------



## C-Moon (Feb 8, 2012)

Fans of her character should be upset(or at least mildly annoyed) she constantly brings Naruto up and nothing else.


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

You're entitled to your opinion, certainly. 

Though I honestly don't see any of the rookies dying (save for _maaaaybe_ Sasuke, and even then...), but as for Naruto reciprocating Hinata's feelings--it's not canon yet, but it looks pretty good in NaruHina's favor, provided it starts off easy. No one would really be satisfied if Naruto just blurted right out 'Ilu2Hinata!' without seeing more of his side of the story. 

The war may be drawing to a close, but the story still has quite a few chapters ahead of it--we might see more of Hinata in regards to her standing with the clan, if Hiashi's words to Hizashi are anything to go by. 

Either way, it's too soon to say what will or won't become of the story or the characters--so there's no reason to be sad just yet. Just try to enjoy the ride.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> She was planning to kill him at that point. If anything that strengthened her resolve since she saw that he really had become a terrible person.
> 
> Yet in spite all of that her resolve failed and she couldn't go through with it. I don't know why that would change now.
> 
> ...




*And that's is the reason why you like a pairing and I like the other pairing because we have different views. At lease I see Naruto been more important than Sasuke and Hinata at the same time.

Now be honest with yourself, what will happen if Naruto say that he still like Sakura but he fail... I guess you never did thing about that. *

There is a reason why the manga names is Naruto but I guess you don't care about that.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

Gamma Akutabi said:


> Fans of her character should be upset(or at least mildly annoyed) she constantly brings Naruto up and nothing else.


Oh look, it's that argument that Hinata is a shallow character and doesn't think of anything else bar Naruto.

I'm sure she got through the chuunin exams thinking of nothing but Naruto, too.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> I should excommunicate you



Do it.  




I don't know how Hinata hiding in a corner/being a coward in Part I is considered a _somewhat_ interesting character.  

Put aside her love for Naruto and you have someone who worked to become strong...[if only I could prove that she's entirely not doing this for Naruto.]


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

I think the databooks back you up there, Sasuko--says Hinata wants to prove herself to Naruto AND to her clan (something about wanting to spar against Neji and her father as well?).


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Stop backpedaling, you said she knew who Sasuke was then when she clearly didn't.



She went there planning to kill him. The fact that he turned out worse than she thought didn't change that, and it didn't change how she felt for him.



> So Sasuke is at his worst ever and Sakura has recently become aware of this, it has also had an impact on her perception of him, what that will lead to is harder to know.



It won't lead anywhere. She saw first hand what he had done. Even him attempting to kill her had no effect on her in the end.



> To say Sakura->Sasuke is the same as it was 200 chapters ago is laughable.



She still loves him, that's all that matters really.

I don't care to debate the specific depth of that love.



> But they haven't been addressed, so therefore NS is hardly dead?



It's dead in the sense that it basically has no chance of happening in my view.

All that's left is for it to be declared dead, by addressing Naruto's feelings.



> There's a correlation though, things can't develop if there is no panel time.
> 
> So she's more likely to develop now than she was in these recent chapters.



She had plenty of panel time before and didn't develop at all. I see no reason why that would change.



> There's a plethora of reasons Sakura will stop loving Sasuke.



Sakura loves Sasuke even now. If Sasuke's only going improve once Naruto converts him, I see no reason why that will change.



> There's also the most hints out of any unrequited pairing that NS will be requited.



I disagree. As I said before, I would find it more believable at this point for Naruto's feelings to swing towards Hinata than Sakura's swinging to Naruto.


----------



## Corvida (Feb 8, 2012)

Gamma Akutabi said:


> Fans of her character should be upset(or at least mildly annoyed) she constantly brings Naruto up and nothing else.



In the context of this particular chapter, where the full bunch of rookies are shown having Inspiring Messiah on their minds and *running to help him*, I dont see why. Oh, I see-it?s the fact than among all the Rookie?s toughts centered in Naruto, hers are the only romantically inspired?


puxa Asturias


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> *And that's is the reason why you like a pairing and I like the other pairing because we have different views. At lease I see Naruto been more important than Sasuke and Hinata at the same time.*



See that's where you're mistaken.

I don't like NH. I don't like any pairing. Heck, I used to like NS, but that ship has long since sailed both literally and metaphorically.

I am only saying what I think will happen, based on how I perceive things. Unlike almost everyone else in this thread, I have no emotional investment for or against any pairing.



> Now be honest with yourself, what will happen if Naruto say that he still like Sakura but he fail... I guess you never did thing about that.



Don't know what you're saying here. I'm sure Naruto will end up with someone so it's really an either or situation.



> There is a reason why the manga names is Naruto but I guess you don't care about that.



Like I said, a while ago I was sure an NS ending was inevitable.

That's not the case anymore.


----------



## Dejablue (Feb 8, 2012)

Golden Circle said:


> Oh look, it's that argument that Hinata is a shallow character and doesn't think of anything else bar Naruto.
> 
> I'm sure she got through the chuunin exams thinking of nothing but Naruto, too.




Actually yeah. She probably did think of nothing but Naruto.


----------



## Renyou (Feb 8, 2012)

Inuyatta said:


> No one would really be satisfied if Naruto just blurted right out 'Ilu2Hinata!' without seeing more of his side of the story.



I disagree, plenty of people would be satisfied with it. Is this thread not proof enough?


----------



## 8 (Feb 8, 2012)

just one post to give my opinion on this topic.



First Tsurugi said:


> Given all that Sasuke's done up until now up to and including *murder* and the fact that this has apparently had *no* affect on Sakura's attraction to him, I'd find it *infinitely* more believable if Naruto were to come around to Hinata than Sakura coming around to Naruto.
> 
> Sorry, that's just how I see things.


this spoke my mind.


naruto and sakura had a lot of interaction. by now sakura knows exactly what naruto is. she knows his good sides, and his flaws. there isn't much more for her to discover about naruto. at this point her opinion on naruto won't change much.

she knows naruto throughout, and still prefer sasuke. the guy who always ignored her, betrayed her and her village, tried to kill her several times.

what if the roles were reversed. sasuke the hero. and naruto as the guy who ignored her, betrayed her and her village, tried to kill her. can you imagine how much she would be in love with sasuke. or how much she would hate naruto.

if she can't pick naruto over sasuke even under these circumstances. or even if she's in doubt. then i don't think she will ever love naruto as much as if it were sasuke in naruto's shoes.


as for naruto > hinata. they didn't interact much. and at this point naruto doesn't know hinata very well. if he get to know her, he may or may not like her. anyway, his opinion on her still can change a lot.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

Dejablue said:


> Actually yeah. She probably did think of nothing but Naruto.



WHOOSH!  <--- THE SARCASM

 o
/|\  <-- YOU
/ \


----------



## UberDruid (Feb 8, 2012)

Why are pairing threads so popular? Is it because of other manga?


----------



## Dejablue (Feb 8, 2012)

You were trying to defend Hinata's shallow character.  What you said before couldn't have been sarcasm.


----------



## Haloman (Feb 8, 2012)

Such a long thread that ignores the obvious:

This is a Japanese manga. Pairings are NEVER resolved. The manga's going to end with Naruto being tired, victorious, and surrounded by all his friends. Sakura's gonna dump converted Sasuke because dumping evil Sasuke for Naruto is an obvious choice. To make her feelings for Naruto seem genuine, Kishi is going to make her choose Naruto over a GOOD Sasuke. Of course, Hinata is going to be making advances on him, as will Ino. TenTen will likely not get into the mix.

Sakura will end up getting Akane-brand angry over Naruto's _obviously_ perverted ways since he has [at least] three women chasing him. Neji will end up misconstruing something in this argument and then tell Naruto that "he had better take responsibility." Naruto will say something about Sasuke being the only one he's ever kissed, causing Sasuke to become chibi volatile as well. Hijinks will ensue with the whole cast (save for Kakashi and Guy) chasing Naruto off into the sunset.

And we'll still be here arguing whether Naruto ends up with Sakura or not.


----------



## Renyou (Feb 8, 2012)

Halo2298 said:


> This is a Japanese manga. Pairings are NEVER resolved.



Maybe you didn't read enough manga, but this couldn't be further from the truth. Or perhaps you're being sarcastic?


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

Renyou said:


> I disagree, plenty of people would be satisfied with it. Is this thread not proof enough?



No, not really. And I hang out with quite a few NH shippers, and I haven't seen more than maybe two people who'd actually want that. 

But if you're not partial to the pairing, I can hardly blame you for not knowing much about what the shippers realistic expectations are, so no foul.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Halo2298 said:


> Such a long thread that ignores the obvious:
> 
> This is a Japanese manga. Pairings are NEVER resolved. The manga's going to end with Naruto being tired, victorious, and surrounded by all his friends. Sakura's gonna dump converted Sasuke because dumping evil Sasuke for Naruto is an obvious choice. To make her feelings for Naruto seem genuine, Kishi is going to make her choose Naruto over a GOOD Sasuke. Of course, Hinata is going to be making advances on him, as will Ino. TenTen will likely not get into the mix.
> 
> ...



That's funny how you've referred to Ranma 1/2 where pairings were resolved. And compared Sakura to Akane, who hails a whole different character. 

Beside the point. Sarcasm, I guess.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

UberDruid said:


> Why are pairing threads so popular? Is it because of other manga?


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

The pairing with the least development makes the most Canon sense??? Lol!! No. That's not how shounen works. Generally the love.interest isn't won over till the very end. Whether you think that makes sense or not doesn't matter. 

The manga is about Naruto and not Hinata. The only one sided love that can foreshadow anything is the main character's..since it is him that the story revolves around. Hinata is just having a fantasy..considering her and Naruto don't even have that kind of relationship. There's no time for romantic development in the war..and after the war the manga is over.  Long story short..there's no place for Naruto to get to know Hinata and fall for her. This is it...what you have now is what you get. Kishi had ample time to develop NH after the confession but he didn't. That should tell you its not happening. You will only rage later if you don't swallow the truth now.

The only pairing Kishi can slap together is NS because its already been developed. It requires no work but for Sakura to discover she really loves Naruto above even Sasuke. Its already set up...Kishi wouldn't need to do anything but a scene.

Other than that you are likely looking at an open ended ending.   NH is out of time for on panel development..and Kishi may not make NS Canon.  Given the timeframe...and the fanservice..probably going to be open ended.  Main point is that this is not foreshadowing..And anyone who thinks so is beyond deluded. Should probably read more.


----------



## Mayaki (Feb 8, 2012)

Well Sakura already stated that she is still in love with Sasuke (more or less)

THEN the rain begins.

If Sasuke should be converted, then this pairing will likely happen and therefore Naruhina will happen. Kishimoto said he didn't want to make a lovestory so that solution would be the most obvious.

If Sasuke shall be killed or he can't be fully converted, then.. it is a mystery. Although I hate the idea that Sakura suddenly changes her mind just because Naruto is the next best.. fuck off, Hinata wanted him all along.

Anyway love ain't fair most of the times. Still I'm hoping for Hinata : D


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Halo2298 said:


> Such a long thread that ignores the obvious:
> 
> This is a Japanese manga. Pairings are NEVER resolved. The manga's going to end with Naruto being tired, victorious, and surrounded by all his friends. Sakura's gonna dump converted Sasuke because dumping evil Sasuke for Naruto is an obvious choice. To make her feelings for Naruto seem genuine, Kishi is going to make her choose Naruto over a GOOD Sasuke. Of course, Hinata is going to be making advances on him, as will Ino. TenTen will likely not get into the mix.
> 
> ...



This just isn't true.

Sure there are some manga that never bother to resolve the pairings, but there are also a ton that do.

To counter your Ranma example, Inuyasha ended with all of the pairings clearly defined.

I don't see Naruto going for ambiguity when it comes to pairings.



AMtrack said:


> The pairing with the least development makes the most Canon sense??? Lol!! No. That's not how shounen works. Generally the love.interest isn't won over till the very end. Whether you think that makes sense or not doesn't matter.
> 
> The manga is about Naruto and not Hinata. The only one sided love that can foreshadow anything is the main character's..since it is him that the story revolves around. Hinata is just having a fantasy..considering her and Naruto don't even have that kind of relationship. There's no time for romantic development in the war..and after the war the manga is over.  Long story short..there's no place for Naruto to get to know Hinata and fall for her. This is it...what you have now is what you get. Kishi had ample time to develop NH after the confession but he didn't. That should tell you its not happening. You will only rage later if you don't swallow the truth now.
> 
> ...



I don't even know what to say to this. You're in for a rude awakening.


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

I disagree that if SS happens, then NH must happen by default.Same in reverse.  

Both of those pairings can stand on their own feet. 

That said, it has been restated over and over that Sakura still loves Sasuke and that Hinata still love Naruto. Sasuke is as crazy as a rabid dog, and Naruto's feelings have been shown to be rather ambiguous for quite some time since part 2 started. 

From a narrative standpoint, it'd make little sense to change the girls' feelings this late in the game when all that needs to be done is to have the boys make a decision. 

Personally, I'm not even 100% that Sasuke will live to the end of the manga, but if he does live...I honestly have no idea if SasuSaku will actually come to fruition or be left open ended. 

I'm partial to NH, and I see potential for it being reciprocated, but as with everything else, it's waiting for the other shoe to drop. Chapters like this and 559-560 do look good in NH's favor though...


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

NH could happen regardless of whether or not SS happens, but if SS happens then NH is basically guaranteed to happen.

And even Sasuke dying doesn't necessarily guarantee NH won't happen IMO.

In my view NH is without a doubt in the most favorable position out of all of the Big 3.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

Mayaki said:


> Well Sakura already stated that she is still in love with Sasuke (more or less)
> 
> THEN the rain begins.
> 
> ...


Contrary to popular belief Sasukes redemption is irrelevant in regards to Sakura falling for Naruto. I love how you totally ignore Sasukes and Narutos feelings in this. Sasuke doesn't love Sakura..ergo that pairing can't happen. Requires too much development.  The same applies to NH. As said Sakuras feelings for Naruto have been shown to be very strong. Doesn't take much for Kishi to say lolthatwaslove and not lolplatonic. Besides open ending that's the only probable outcome period.


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> NH could happen regardless of whether or not SS happens, but if SS happens then NH is basically guaranteed to happen.
> 
> And even Sasuke dying doesn't necessarily guarantee NH won't happen IMO.
> 
> In my view NH is without a doubt in the most favorable position out of all of the Big 3.



Hm...can't really see how SS guarantees NH, since NH developed without Sasuke and Sakura entirely...

But I do agree with the rest of your post. 

well, night all!


----------



## auem (Feb 8, 2012)

i think naru-hina will now surely happen....
that way sasu-saku will be clear and sasuke has be redeemed at some point...no more final villain talk....

only things that stand against this scenario is if hinata dies in this war...which is again unlikely to the extreme...


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

SS is the pairing that's least likely to happen. It's indecent; the friendship/teamwork is gone. If Sasuke is redeemed, SS has to start over. NH can't depend on SS at all.  

NH depends on Naruto.


----------



## Renyou (Feb 8, 2012)

Whether one pairing makes more sense than the other doesn't seem to matter in this manga. Clearly, a coherent romance subplot is too much to ask out of Kishi.


----------



## Mayaki (Feb 8, 2012)

I'm not ignoring it. Actually I can't see Sasuke with any girl right now because he is like Yagami Light if it comes to girls. Still if he is converted, I believe this might change in a way. But I just can't see Naruto to be the "second choice", that would be really retarded as he is the main character.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Inuyatta said:


> Hm...can't really see how SS guarantees NH, since NH developed without Sasuke and Sakura entirely...



I don't see Naruto ending up alone as an option, so if Sakura's taken then he'll end up with Hinata, his only other plausible option.

This has no effect on development, it just dictates that there is only one direction for things to develop in.



> well, night all!



nite o/


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> See that's where you're mistaken.
> 
> I don't like NH. I don't like any pairing. Heck, I used to like NS, but that ship has long since sailed both literally and metaphorically.
> 
> ...




Well I'm really sorry for caling you a NH. but I think you are given a lot more credit to the other character and ignoring Naruto. He say why he cannot be Hokage and he also say why he cannot express is feelings to Sakura...

There was an episode where he say that he will die with Sasuke but after Kushina flash back he say that he will not die before he become Hokage...

After that failfession I thought NS was dead, but then I ask my self why Sakura has not been honest with Naruto and tell him that she cannot love him that way, why she say that only she know how she feels, why Naruto hasnd't not move on from Sakura yet and why we don't see what Naruto think about Hinata yet, maybe we did but we want to see more....
So placing Naruto's feeling behind the girls feeling and thinking Sakura will say no to him if he ask her out is not smart.

540 I don't think Sakura feels she deserves Naruto's love so who els can she think off and even that did not end well.

I'm sure Naruto will tell Sakura that he doesn't care about the past.
Most of the antiNS argument are Sakura has been a terrible person to Naruto and Hinata have been more nice to him, he can forgive other terrible person but for some reason he cannot do the same with Sakura... is this paring logit is clearly not Naruto manga logic.


----------



## Renyou (Feb 8, 2012)

Mayaki said:


> I'm not ignoring it. Actually I can't see Sasuke with any girl right now because he is like Yagami Light if it comes to girls. Still if he is converted, I believe this might change in a way. But I just can't see Naruto to be the "second choice", that would be really retarded as he is the main character.



So, it's okay for Hinata to be a second choice because she's not the main character. Is that what you're trying to say?


----------



## UberDruid (Feb 8, 2012)

This is just a what if but...

What if Sasuke kills Sakura? He has tried to kill her twice already.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Renyou said:


> So, it's okay for Hinata to be a second choice because she's not the main character. Is that what you're trying to say?



Is it any better for Naruto to be Sakura's second choice?



UberDruid said:


> This is just a what if but...
> 
> What if Sasuke kills Sakura?



Then there will be much rejoicing. \0/

And NH happens for sure.


----------



## Renyou (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Is it any better for Naruto to be Sakura's second choice?



I don't remember implying that.


----------



## jacamo (Feb 8, 2012)

i never cared about pairings due to irrelevance issues

but wow, 13 pages.... i guess betting for NaruHina has been suspended


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Renyou said:


> I don't remember implying that.



I should read more carefully. \0/


----------



## Mayaki (Feb 8, 2012)

Renyou said:


> So, it's okay for Hinata to be a second choice because she's not the main character. Is that what you're trying to say?



Well Naruto developed from a drop-out to a f*cking hero. First nobody cared about him, now everbody does really believe in him and in Kakashis eyes he will surpass the 4th (or has already) and is a candidate for the title of the hokage.
Now Naruto is winning ALL the prices. He changes the whole ninjaworld and goes down in history.

Can you believe that Sakura suddenly says "Oh well Sasuke does not seem to be that cool after all, so I take you Naruto"? That would be hypocritical. It's the same shit she already told him in her "Confession" and Naruto was angry about it (although it was merely because she was obviously lying).

Hinata believed in Naruto even before Iruka did.. that's what I'm saying.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

UberDruid said:


> This is just a what if but...
> 
> What if Sasuke kills Sakura? He has tried to kill her twice already.



I'm inclined to think that Team 7 has a thick plot shield that even the 3rd Raikage's finger fuck-cutter-jutsu cannot penetrate.

---


*Spoiler*: _as for ANS view_ 



As for the failfession, is Naruto not allowed to be mad about 1) Sakura lying to him just to 2) give up on their former teammate after years of fucking telling himself that he will do it and kept reassuring her that they can succeed? Yeah, it's a massive blow to NS. He probably forgave her (too busy to even think about it) and she took steps in helping him. Not only that, Naruto revealed his selfish need to save his best friend (not only for Sakura)...just after he lifts the burden his parents left him as the "child of prophecy."

ANS points out how Naruto doesn't understand when Sakura is frustrated, unless it was about Sasuke. Nothing the BS about Hinata deserving Naruto.


----------



## Renyou (Feb 8, 2012)

Mayaki said:


> Hinata believed in Naruto even before Iruka did.. that's what I'm saying.



That's fine and all, but as far as being there for Naruto, she didn't do much. In other words, he wasn't aware of her dedication or even her feelings for him until 437 chapters in.

Had she actually been there for him throughout the entire manga, Naruto developing feelings for her at this point would have been believable. That being said...



Mayaki said:


> Can you believe that Sakura suddenly says "Oh  well Sasuke does not seem to be that cool after all, so I take you  Naruto"? That would be hypocritical. It's the same shit she already told  him in her "Confession" and Naruto was angry about it (although it was  merely because she was obviously lying).



This is about as believable as Naruto falling for Hinata after her confession. Naruto being the main character is irrelevant to how retarded (in your words) it would be or not.


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 8, 2012)

Honestly I dont understand the apeal of NH, The development is totally one sided and Hinata's character overall falls flat of being totally obsessed with Naruto after the Chunin Exams. Now if she and Naruto had gotten some actual Development outside of battle I honestly could see were NHshippers would be coming from but without that development its just a flat pairing. Which is part of the reason I jumped ship about half way through the Itachi retrieval(sp) arc. The other being that Sakura actual fits as Naruto's other half to knock some sense into him when he's going overboard. I honestly can't see Hinata being able to get threw to Naruto as she has a hard time getting threw to him as it is.


----------



## FearTear (Feb 8, 2012)

Hinata is thinking about holding hands with Naruto.

Meanwhile, Naruto is thinking about his kiss with Sasuke.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

They don't have to get married straight off, they can just date and develop the relationship through that.

All you need for that to happen is a willingness to try.

Knowing the other person well already certainly helps, but it's by no means necessary.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

MyNindoForever said:


> Honestly I dont understand the apeal of NH,



Golden Circle I think posted about it a while back.

Basic appeal is guy gets with girl who always liked him.



> The development is totally one sided



This is true for literally all of the Big 3.



> and Hinata's character overall falls flat of being totally obsessed with Naruto after the Chunin Exams.



So does every other Rookie's save Shikamaru.



> Now if she and Naruto had gotten some actual Development outside of battle I honestly could see were NHshippers would be coming from but without that development its just a flat pairing. Which is part of the reason I jumped ship about half way through the Itachi retrieval(sp) arc. The other being that Sakura actual fits as Naruto's other half to knock some sense into him when he's going overboard. I honestly can't see Hinata being able to get threw to Naruto as she has a hard time getting threw to him as it is.



I had this same mindset but fact is Sakura ain't budging, and I don't see that changing. That's why I see NH being more likely now.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

FearTear said:


> Hinata is thinking about holding hands with Naruto.
> 
> Meanwhile, Naruto is thinking about his kiss with Sasuke.



So true. 

That's some powerful recall-gag-reflex Naruto has there.


----------



## Mizura (Feb 8, 2012)

I guess there really are people still caught up in the pairings wars.

Don't you get it though? No matter which couple prevails, all the major fandoms have already lost. Be is SasuSaku or NaruHina or NaruSaku, they're all practically jokes at this point. It's obvious that Naruto is 50% Sasuke, 49% Save The World and 1% everything else, while Sasuke is 90% revenge and uh.... make that 99%.

At this point, Hinata and Sakura are both after-thoughts. Sasuke has barely spared Sakura a glance in the past several hundred chapters, Naruto left Hinata hanging after her confession, Sakura had that fail of a confession. According to the recent Kishimoto interview, this series is reaching its climax, so we likely won't see much character interactions anymore and then the series will end. The missing Naruto -> Hinata or Sasuke -> Sakura parts of the equations will have to be resolved in just a few panels when everything is over. Is that the romance everyone is fighting over? A few panels of one-sided love spread apart by a hundred chapters each? The remaining half of the relationship is an afterthought taken care of in a few chapters?

So, if everything supposedly happens off-screen, and you're left to guess what happened, you might as well read a fanfic. I have my pairing preferences, but I want relationships to be well-written even more. They're not well-written at this point. They're barely written at all.


----------



## Selva (Feb 8, 2012)

omg am I reading some of the same exact arguments that were made when Hinata confessed to Naruto in the Pain arc that _she's going to die or something_ in this thread? 

Anyhoo, I'm having a blast here. Hinata can suck dick for all I care but as long as NaruSaku doesn't happen in the end, then I'm content.
If anything, I really think Sakura will run into Sasuke and hopefully this time he'll kill her without fail and without anybody saving her useless ass this time


----------



## gershwin (Feb 8, 2012)

Thats it. Hinata is going to grab his hand and walk with him together one day. 
Such speeches at this point of the manga can be counted as foreshadowing.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Mizura said:


> I guess there really are people still caught up in the pairings wars.
> 
> Don't you get it though? No matter which couple prevails, all the major fandoms have already lost. Be is SasuSaku or NaruHina or NaruSaku, they're all practically jokes at this point. It's obvious that Naruto is 50% Sasuke, 49% Save The World and 1% everything else, while Sasuke is 90% revenge and uh.... make that 99%.
> 
> ...



I can't believe it. I agree with you.


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> This is true for literally all of the Big 3.


Not for NaruSaku there are tons upon tons of evidence of there budding relationship starting way back in the beginning of the manga. 

NaruHina on the otherhand has ARGUEABLY about 4 MUTIAL relationship sceans together and even then it can be argued even then that its Hinata wanting to live up to Naruto's standards. 

Unless sceans of Naruto and Hinata are hanging out are shown I swere this is going to be like the mess that was Harry/Ginny all over again.



> I had this same mindset but fact is Sakura ain't budging, and I don't see that changing. That's why I see NH being more likely now.



Just because she doesn't seem like shes budging doesn't mean it isn't possible


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

I like to think that no one is seriously expecting any serious romantic developments from here till the end of the manga but I know I'm wrong.


----------



## Harbour (Feb 8, 2012)

She died from the Sasuke's hands, i think. Seriously, who really believe, that Naruto in the end of *this* manga really will be live with someone? Moreover with Lolnata. In addition, she is the opposite of Kushina.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

MyNindoForever said:


> Not for NaruSaku there are tons upon tons of evidence of there budding relationship starting way back in the beginning of the manga.



It's not love, though, it's just deep friendship.

Until there's evidence of it going beyond that it has no chance.



> Just because she doesn't seem like shes budging doesn't mean it isn't possible



What could possibly happen short of Sasuke dying to make her give up her feelings for Sasuke?

Murder, attempted murder, and terrorism apparently isn't enough.


----------



## jacamo (Feb 8, 2012)

FearTear said:


> Hinata is thinking about holding hands with Naruto.
> 
> Meanwhile, Naruto is thinking about his kiss with Sasuke.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Forgive me for not replying to your previous post, but I think it got to the stage where we'd just LAP at each other pointlessly.



First Tsurugi said:


> NH could happen regardless of whether or not SS happens, but if SS happens then NH is basically guaranteed to happen.
> 
> And even Sasuke dying doesn't necessarily guarantee NH won't happen IMO.



I mostly agree, however I'd phase it more like; NH can happen regardless of SS, however for SS to happen, NH needs to happen.



> In my view NH is without a doubt in the most favorable position out of all of the Big 3.



People tend to gravitate towards whoever has had the most recent moment it seems .



First Tsurugi said:


> I don't see Naruto ending up alone as an option, so if Sakura's taken then he'll end up with Hinata, his only other plausible option.
> 
> This has no effect on development, it just dictates that there is only one direction for things to develop in.



I agree, I don't see an open ending being all that likely.




Sasuko said:


> I'm inclined to think that Team 7 has a thick plot shield that even the 3rd Raikage's finger fuck-cutter-jutsu cannot penetrate.
> 
> ---
> 
> ...



As far as that ANS goes; sure, Naruto can be mad at Sakura about her confession, however he hasn't shown that, so I don't see why it's even a talking point anymore. It's not about what Naruto is and isn't allowed to do, it's about what he has and hasn't done.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

*Naruto says Hi;*

Well if you feel Naruto can change everyone's feelings but he can't win Sakura's heart basing on your pairing logit, well it doesn't make any sense to argue with you.

Again Naruto is more important than Sakura, Hinata, and Sasuke combined.
If Hinata say that she like Naruto even when there are no Naruto that make NH close canon. 
this is the biggist lavel of denail I ever seen..
you know when I will beleave in NH when Naruto say that he likes Hinata or He doesn't like Sakura anymore, before that I don't see NaruHina been a cannon pairing.

Hinata tell Naruto that she love Him. He doesnt love her respect her. 
Sakura tell Sasuke that she love him. He hate her. 
Tell me when Naruto tell Sakura how he feels and she tourn him down. Still waiting.....

I think the Format is 
Hinata>>>>>Naruto---------confess already
Sakura>>>>>Sasuke--------confess already
Naruto>>>>>Sakura--------Say he need to save Sasuke 1st


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Hyperbolic, at best, to describe moments in the past when the love interests don't even consider them significant in the same vein. 

No, First, we're expecting asspulls.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

@DONJOSEPH: Naruto's "feelings" toward Sakura don't matter as much because he's demonstrated that he'll step aside so that Sakura can be happy with Sasuke.

NS happening is contingent on Sakura dropping her feelings for Sasuke and developing feelings for Naruto.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> No, First, we're expecting *sudden changes in direction*.


FTFY

[sp=btw]i hate 'asspull'. It's a bad word that makes a humble plot twist look bad. [/sp]


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Forgive me for not replying to your previous post, but I think it got to the stage where we'd just LAP at each other pointlessly.



Yeah, it seems we're virtually in agreement on most issues.



> People tend to gravitate towards whoever has had the most recent moment it seems .



It doesn't help that neither of the remaining two pairings has had a "moment" in forever.

Heck, since the end of the Pain arc they've pretty much only had negative development.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> I like to think that no one is seriously expecting any serious romantic developments from here till the end of the manga but I know I'm wrong.



I guess this doesn't include Naruto switching from Sakura to Hinata?

Seems just a little arbitrary there .


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

I got ninja'd. 



Mr Horrible said:


> As far as that ANS goes; sure, Naruto can be mad at Sakura about her confession, however he hasn't shown that, so I don't see why it's even a talking point anymore. It's not about what Naruto is and isn't allowed to do, it's about what he has and hasn't done.



I was replying to Don. Just correcting some ANS argument he brought up. 



DONJOSEPH19 said:


> *Naruto says Hi;*
> 
> Well if you feel Naruto can change everyone's feelings but he can't win Sakura's heart basing on your pairing logit, well it doesn't make any sense to argue with you.



Wait, you replying to me? 

Based on my pairing logic? You brought up an incorrect ANS argument and I corrected it. It isn't about if Naruto can win her heart, it is Sakura's willingness to genuinely like him, outside the titles and what everyone else thinks of him.  



> Again Naruto is more important than Sakura, Hinata, and Sasuke combined.
> If Hinata say that she like Naruto even when there are not close that make NH canon.
> this is the biggist lavel of denail I ever seen..
> you know when I will beleave in NH when Naruto say that he likes Hinata or He doesn't like Sakura anymore, before that I don't see NaruHina been a cannon pairing.



Yeah, I'm sure as hell you aren't directing this to me because I never said NH is canon in this thread.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> It doesn't help that neither pairing has had a "moment" in forever.
> 
> Heck, since the end of the Pain arc they've pretty much only had negative development.



My problem with many of the anti-canon ANS arguments is that they will be destroyed by even a single NS moment. In my opinion even if Kishi is heading towards an NH ending, there's still going to be a couple NS moments left to build tension. So this doesn't leave some of the classic ANS arguments in a good spot.

Take for instance the recent hypothesis that Naruto has changed his feelings from Sakura, I just don't see that as likely yet, even if we are heading towards NH.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> I guess this doesn't include Naruto switching from Sakura to Hinata?
> 
> Seems just a little arbitrary there .



By "serious romantic developments" I mean stuff like going on dates, being cute together, and whispering sweet nothings into each other's ears. Or "walking side by side, hand in hand" to quote this chapter.

In terms of romantic development we're going to get: somebody finally reciprocating, and them becoming official.

Then we get a timeskip and an epilogue where everybody has kids.

That's about all you can expect as far as "romance" goes in this manga.



Mr Horrible said:


> My problem with many of the anti-canon ANS arguments is that they will be destroyed by even a single NS moment. In my opinion even if Kishi is heading towards an NH ending, there's still going to be a couple NS moments left to build tension. So this doesn't leave some of the classic ANS arguments in a good spot.
> 
> Take for instance the recent hypothesis that Naruto has changed his feelings from Sakura, I just don't see that as likely yet, even if we are heading towards NH.



I suppose that's true, but recent developments have just made any hypothetical NS development so unlikely it's ridiculous.

As I said before, it all depends on Sakura's feelings, but I've seen no evidence that those feelings will change or can even change.


----------



## Blackberry90 (Feb 8, 2012)

Mizura said:


> I guess there really are people still caught up in the pairings wars.
> 
> Don't you get it though? No matter which couple prevails, all the major fandoms have already lost. Be is SasuSaku or NaruHina or NaruSaku, they're all practically jokes at this point. It's obvious that Naruto is 50% Sasuke, 49% Save The World and 1% everything else, while Sasuke is 90% revenge and uh.... make that 99%.
> 
> ...



I agree with you totally.



MyNindoForever said:


> Unless sceans of Naruto and Hinata are hanging out are shown I swere this is going to be like the mess that was Harry/Ginny all over again.



God dont remind me  .

I might have been happy with NH, if only Kishi had managed to make a good development between Naruto and Hinata ( development being more than a few scenes together.)...

At least Im praying to see some good development, if it is gonna be with NH.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> By "serious romantic developments" I mean stuff like going on dates, being cute together, and whispering sweet nothings into each other's ears. Or "walking side by side, hand in hand" to quote this chapter.
> 
> In terms of romantic development we're going to get: somebody finally reciprocating, and them becoming official.
> 
> ...



I reasonably agree, I was always assuming pairings would be canonized with a kiss late in the story and it'd pretty much be left at that.

As far as epilogues go however, it's not too far out of the box to have a chapter on the aftermath of the final arc and then one about a timeskip. In the aftermath chapter it's possible that any canon couples could be seen in Konoha holding hands or something I guess, but I agree it certainly isn't likely.



> I suppose that's true, but recent developments have just made any hypothetical NS development so unlikely it's ridiculous.
> 
> As I said before, it all depends on Sakura's feelings, but I've seen no evidence that those feelings will change or can even change.



Not sure if I agree here, for example all NS needs is confirmation Naruto is still pining after Sakura and we're golden. It becomes about Naruto's feelings vs Hinata's and we should all know who will win that battle 90% of the time.

After all, nearly all of the recent NH moments have been on Hinata's side, which isn't news at all apart from establishing some more empathy I guess.


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> It's not love, though, it's just deep friendship.
> 
> Until there's evidence of it going beyond that it has no chance.



They had a "Deep friendship" by the End of Part 1. If you are seriously going to argue that Sakura doesn't have Romantic feelings for Naruto after: the End/post 4-tails, Feeding Naruto, Her screaming for Naruto during the Pain Invation, the hug, Sai revealing Naruto's fealings for her and her bawling like a baby, and Sakura risking her life to try and trying to save Naruto the Pain of haveing to kill his brother by trying to kill Sasuke herself.

Honestly after all that it's Honestly almost impossible to deny that she has Romantic feelings.



> What could possibly happen short of Sasuke dying to make her give up her feelings for Sasuke?
> 
> Murder, attempted murder, and terrorism apparently isn't enough.



They're all headed for Naruto's Position now how about we wait and watch eh?


----------



## Gortef (Feb 8, 2012)

Damn, I wanted the clones to have something more to do with all this. I guess they just went *poof*.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

MyNindoForever said:


> They had a "Deep friendship" by the End of Part 1. If you are seriously going to argue that Sakura doesn't have Romantic feelings for Naruto after: the End/post 4-tails, Feeding Naruto, Her screaming for Naruto during the Pain Invation, the hug, Sai revealing Naruto's fealings for her and her bawling like a baby, and Sakura risking her life to try and trying to save Naruto the Pain of haveing to kill his brother by trying to kill Sasuke herself.
> 
> Honestly after all that it's Honestly almost impossible to deny that she has Romantic feelings.



It's more than possible to argue that.

If she really felt something for Naruto, that fake confession wouldn't have been so forced.

Plus, you know, she's still in love with Sasuke.

Fact is she doesn't feel anything romantically for him.



> They're all headed for Naruto's Position now how about we wait and watch eh?



In other words you have no rebuttal.


----------



## andrea (Feb 8, 2012)

MyNindoForever said:


> They had a "Deep friendship" by the End of Part 1. If you are seriously going to argue that Sakura doesn't have Romantic feelings for Naruto after: the End/post 4-tails, Feeding Naruto, Her screaming for Naruto during the Pain Invation, the hug, Sai revealing Naruto's fealings for her and her bawling like a baby, and Sakura risking her life to try and trying to save Naruto the Pain of haveing to kill his brother by trying to kill Sasuke herself.
> 
> Honestly after all that it's Honestly almost impossible to deny that she has Romantic feelings.



Except Sakura _did_ deny she has romantic feelings, being in love with Sasuke and all that.

OT: it was a nice Hinata moment, some definite foreshadowing there by Kishi (which is unexpected), but doesn't really change the status of any pairing (which is expected).


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> By "serious romantic developments" I mean stuff like going on dates, being cute together, and whispering sweet nothings into each other's ears. Or "walking side by side, hand in hand" to quote this chapter.


Really?! You want to go there? because IIRC Sakura herself has offered to go on a date with Naruto they have just been so busy. Honestly Tsurugi your just hanging by a thread now.


----------



## gabzilla (Feb 8, 2012)

The poll needs a "this thread needs more yuri discussion"


----------



## Renyou (Feb 8, 2012)

MyNindoForever said:


> Honestly after all that it's Honestly almost impossible to deny that she has Romantic feelings.



Well, Sakura herself has confirmed she is still on the Sasuke boat. So, all that possible NS development was either thrown in the trash or not meant to be taken romantically (personally, I believe Kishimoto was just trolling).


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

MyNindoForever said:


> Really?! You want to go there? because IIRC Sakura herself has offered to go on a date with Naruto they have just been so busy. Honestly Tsurugi your just hanging by a thread now.



I could say the same to you. Where's the panel? 

Is it the one where she wanted a free meal?


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

MyNindoForever said:


> Really?! You want to go there? because IIRC Sakura herself has offered to go on a date with Naruto they have just been so busy. Honestly Tsurugi your just hanging by a thread now.



You seriously believe that we'd ever see that on panel even if it did happen? 

Also protip, *it would never happen*. That's why the offer didn't lead to anything.



gabzilla said:


> The poll needs a "this thread needs more yuri discussion"



Oh gabz, at least I'll always have you and your delicious yuri art. pek



Mr Horrible said:


> Not sure if I agree here, for example all NS needs is confirmation Naruto is still pining after Sakura and we're golden. It becomes about Naruto's feelings vs Hinata's and we should all know who will win that battle 90% of the time.



Naruto's already shown that he'll step aside for Sakura's happiness.

If Naruto gives up on Sakura so she can be happy with Sasuke, then there is only one path I see him taking.


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 8, 2012)

Lysandra said:


> Except Sakura _did_ deny she has romantic feelings, being in love with Sasuke and all that.



She didn't deny anything about not having feelings for Naruto just that she still was barely hanging on to Sasuke. because that's how it looked with how disgusted she looked at herself for still holding a candle for Sasuke



First Tsurugi said:


> You seriously believe that we'd ever see that on panel even if it did happen?
> 
> Also protip, *it would never happen*. That's why the offer didn't lead to anything.


More likely then seeing Naruto on a date with Hinata


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2012)

gabzilla said:


> The poll needs a "this thread needs more yuri discussion"



Kishi is hardly a good enough writer to make yuri canon.

We will most likely have some yaoi bromance though...I wonder with which characters?


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

I hope one of the big four major characers (when it comes to pairings) gets knocked off if only to settle the debate once and for all. (And yes, that is a terrible thing to say. )





gabzilla said:


> The poll needs a "this thread needs more yuri discussion"


Not yet Gabz, this thread is still mildly entertaining.


----------



## gabzilla (Feb 8, 2012)

Mizura said:


> I guess there really are people still caught up in the pairings wars.
> 
> Don't you get it though? No matter which couple prevails, all the major fandoms have already lost. Be is SasuSaku or NaruHina or NaruSaku, they're all practically jokes at this point. It's obvious that Naruto is 50% Sasuke, 49% Save The World and 1% everything else, while Sasuke is 90% revenge and uh.... make that 99%.
> 
> ...



I agree with this.

At this point it doesn't matter what becomes canon, it will be written like crap.



First Tsurugi said:


> Oh gabz, at least I'll always have you and your delicious yuri art. pek







Arles Celes said:


> Kishi is hardly a good enough writer to make yuri canon.
> 
> We will most likely have some yaoi bromance though...I wonder with which characters?



Yuri is too awesome for Kishimoto. 



Golden Circle said:


> Not yet Gabz, this thread is still mildly entertaining.



Can't we have both?


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> @DONJOSEPH: *Naruto's "feelings" toward Sakura don't matter as much because he's demonstrated that he'll step aside so that Sakura can be happy with Sasuke.*
> 
> *NS happening is contingent on Sakura dropping her feelings for Sasuke and developing feelings for Naruto*.



And that is what I'm trying to tell you from my firts post Naruto trying to win her heart the right way without forcing her to look his way she will like to know how he feels about her from him not a third party, that implies that he will have the last word....
To me she will drop her feelings for, the good Sasuke not the bad one at the end, but Sasuke will still be ok with it he never care to start with...


Last bolded part she already has given reason and she has many reason why she can love him.
Something the boys doesn't have on there side.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Can't derail, Naruko is watching. 

Bromo love.


----------



## andrea (Feb 8, 2012)

MyNindoForever said:


> She didn't deny anything about not having feelings for Naruto just that she still was barely hanging on to Sasuke. because that's how it looked with how disgusted she looked at herself for still holding a candle for Sasuke



Oh so now you're going to play the "she's in love with both of them" card? 

If she did have feelings for Naruto, she would have said so in the confession, instead of inventing reasons for liking him ("you're a hero of the village", "I suddenly changed my mind", "women's hearts are fickle").


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

@Gabz:

The cynicism about Kishi being a bad writer is unfounded. Otherwise you wouldn't be reading this manga at all.


----------



## KyuubiFan (Feb 8, 2012)

26 members and 41 guests.

Interesting.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 8, 2012)

KyuubiFan said:


> 26 members and 41 guests.
> 
> Interesting.


It's about as popular as the predictions thread in the middle of the night.

Pairings brings everyone to the table.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

MyNindoForever said:


> More likely then seeing Naruto on a date with Hinata



As I recall we saw them on a date in that Konoha Gakuan OVA didn't we? 



DONJOSEPH19 said:


> And that is what I'm trying to tell you from my firts post Naruto trying to win her heart the right way without forcing her to look his way she will like to know how he feels about her from him not a third party, that implies that he will have the last word....
> To me she will drop her feelings for, the good Sasuke not the bad one at the end, but Sasuke will still be ok with it he never care to start with...
> 
> 
> ...



But she's had all the time in the world to do that and it hasn't happened.

Why would it suddenly happen now?


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Time cannot be argued at this point. If so, it would be the same for asking why Naruto should give two shits now if Hinata likes him. Why should he give up on Sakura now. Same for Sasuke deciding that he likes girls. As it mentioned before, pairings are merely fighting over limited panels/development. Anything can happen and it still wouldn't be enough.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Time cannot be argued at this point. If so, it would be the same for asking why Naruto should give two shits now if Hinata likess him. Why should he give up on Sakura now. Same for Sasuke deciding that he likes girls. As it mentioned before, pairings are merely fighting over limited panels/development. Anything can happen.



It's not the same situation.

Naruto's actually aware of Hinata's feelings now, so the situation between them has changed, significantly.


----------



## gabzilla (Feb 8, 2012)

Golden Circle said:


> @Gabz:
> 
> The cynicism about Kishi being a bad writer is unfounded. Otherwise you wouldn't be reading this manga at all.



I'm a masochist. Don't judge me. 



Sasuko said:


> Anything can happen and it still wouldn't be enough.



Sasunaru endgame.

Now _that _would be funny.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> It's not the same situation.
> 
> Naruto's actually aware of Hinata's feelings now, so the situation between them has changed, significantly.



I can easily apply this to SS. 

So far, Naruto has tiptoed around it. He encourages her. Mentions nothing. How frustrating.


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 8, 2012)

Lysandra said:


> Oh so now you're going to play the "she's in love with both of them" card?
> 
> If she did have feelings for Naruto, she would have said so in the confession, instead of inventing reasons for liking him ("you're a hero of the village", "I suddenly changed my mind", "women's hearts are fickle").


Well would YOU explain seemingly dropping your first love after Figureing out you have feelings for your Best male friend who has been in love with you for lord knows how long and being bitchslaped with them by the emotionaly dead teammate? and Holdng out a bit more of a candle for Sasuke isnt bad its part of her hopeing he gets his head together and I think we can all realize hes way to far gone for that to be viable


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> I can easily apply this to SS.
> 
> So far, Naruto has tiptoed around it. He encourages her. Mentions nothing. How frustrating.



Sakura's aware of Naruto's feelings. She said as much to Sai before she "confessed" to Naruto.

It has no effect on her.


----------



## TheGreen1 (Feb 8, 2012)

You know, nothing is hotter to me than a girl willing to die for me. I mean, if she goes that far, I highly doubt that she's going to lose interest, or want a divorce. Not to mention, the blood dripping from her teth made her look sexy as hell.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Sakura's aware of Naruto's feelings. She said as much to Sai before she "confessed" to Naruto.
> 
> It has no effect on her.



Your point? I'm assuming you're nourishing my point that awareness means nothing/nothing has changed/relationships are nonexistent.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Your point? I'm assuming you're nourishing my point that awareness means nothing/nothing has changed/relationships are nonexistent.



I've forgotten my original point.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Yeah, it happens.


----------



## rac585 (Feb 8, 2012)

All I see here is the author confirming that Hinata and Naruto will be getting some panel time together in the future to settle her pairing war one way or another.

What I do not see here (and have not seen through this entire final arc) is any indication that Sakura is interested in settling anything with Naruto other than both of their issues with Sasuke. What happens after these burdens are lifted remains to be seen. We will see how these teammates' feelings for each other change after getting closure on priority #1 Sasuke.

Anyways it seems Hinata has a fair chance at winning her pairing war whether or not Sasuke is killed or survives his upcoming battle with Naruto, because I believe it will bring Naruto peace of mind either way. Afterwards leaving her to be able to speak with Naruto, and try to cast herself in a more romantic light to him, while he has nothing else on his mind to weigh him down.

On the other hand, Sakura's chances of winning her war against Hinata are solely dependent on her being able to get past Sasuke, which could probably never happen if he dies before he gets any closure on his issues with Konoha and his family. If Sasuke lives, of course, she would still have to reach a second check-point in her development to actually get over Sasuke oh her own terms rather than having that relationship interrupted by an unfortunate obsession with revenge.

So basically all Hinata's group has to hope for is Naruto surviving to the end of series. Sakura's group not only needs Naruto to live, but Sasuke to as well, and even more, confirm whether or not she still has any feelings for Sasuke after actually spending time with his non-evil self.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Naruto's already shown that he'll step aside for Sakura's happiness.
> 
> If Naruto gives up on Sakura so she can be happy with Sasuke, then there is only one path I see him taking.



That's a big 'if' there. Didn't you see Naruto's face in the hospital/PoaL? It seems highly unlikely Kishi will go that route to be honest, whoever Naruto ends up with will be whoever Naruto wants to end up with.

If we're talking about potential love partners smiling while their unrequited crush hugs their unrequited crush, Hinata also takes that much more gracefully .


----------



## Kiss (Feb 8, 2012)

I see it as a foreshadowing. I loved her confidence too.


----------



## sweetmelissa (Feb 8, 2012)

naruto doesn't want her. she can wet herself all she wants


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> That's a big 'if' there. Didn't you see Naruto's face in the hospital/PoaL? It seems highly unlikely Kishi will go that route to be honest, whoever Naruto ends up with will be whoever Naruto wants to end up with.



Didn't Naruto basically do exactly what I said in both those situation; put aside his own feelings for Sakura's happiness?

Seems to me that he'd be quite willing to give up on pursuing Sakura if that's what made her happy, even if it wouldn't be what he wanted.



> If we're talking about potential love partners smiling while their unrequited crush hugs their unrequited crush, Hinata also takes that much more gracefully .



Granted, but because Naruto's feelings toward Sakura are a minor part of his overall character, I think it's much easier for his feelings to be the ones that go unrequited.

Hinata may be a side character, but her feelings for Naruto define her.


----------



## Zabuza (Feb 8, 2012)

Lol at the failed confession.At least Hinata put some emotion and true feelings behind her confession and that is why Naruto doesn't listen to bitches.


----------



## GaaraoftheDesert1 (Feb 8, 2012)

NaruKarin forever.. I hope Sasuke kills both those bitches (sakura/hinata)


----------



## Leuconoe (Feb 8, 2012)

At this point I don't think much of any pairing hints. I feel like Kishi just threw another bone to the fans. It amused me though.


----------



## Kael Hyun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Granted, but because Naruto's feelings toward Sakura are a minor part of his overall character, I think it's much easier for his feelings to be the ones that go unrequited.



Narutos feelings for Sakura are hardly a minor part of his character when it showed up in the second chapter.



> Hinata may be a side character, but her feelings for Naruto define her.


And thats another problem I have with her Shikamaru and Temari have much better characterization then even Hinata the main characters supposed love interest how the fuck does that make any sense?

Like I said before Harry/Ginny All over again


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

MyNindoForever said:


> Narutos feelings for Sakura are hardly a minor part of his character when it showed up in the second chapter.



And how often is it touched upon compared to his rivalry/friendship with Sasuke, or his desire to be Hokage, or more recently his mission to bring peace to the world?



> And thats another problem I have with her Shikamaru and Temari have much better characterization then even Hinata the main characters supposed love interest how the fuck does that make any sense?
> 
> Like I said before Harry/Ginny All over again



Shikamaru is one of Kishi's favs, no surprise he has better characterization.


----------



## Drums (Feb 8, 2012)

As someone said, there was nothing subtle about her statement. It makes NaruHina seem even more likely to happen. And tbh, I think, if Naruto's to end up with a girl, Hinata would be the best option. And I dont even ship NaruHina.


----------



## gershwin (Feb 8, 2012)

Sakura still has no romantic hints for Naruto.
Naruto`s mind is still somewhere else.
Sasuke is still evil.

The only thing has changed  - Hinata is sure in herself. That tells much.
There is no way Kishi will make her desires and hopes be crushed after such development.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Didn't Naruto basically do exactly what I said in both those situation; put aside his own feelings for Sakura's happiness?



And then the manga ended there.

He continued asking Sakura out in part 2 btw, albeit with less vigor than his younger self.



> Seems to me that he'd be quite willing to give up on pursuing Sakura if that's what made her happy, even if it wouldn't be what he wanted.



Sure, but the same goes for all big 3 pairings, it just doesn't seem like a likely scenario.



> Granted, but because Naruto's feelings toward Sakura are a minor part of his overall character, I think it's much easier for his feelings to be the ones that go unrequited.



And yet Naruto's overall character is so much more important than Hinata.

Simply because Naruto has other things going on in his life and other reasons he can't tell Sakura how he feels doesn't mean his feelings aren't important.

Again, this seems to link back to whoever has the last one sided pairing moment, because you can be sure that whenever they occur for Naruto, people don't take them lightly.



> Hinata may be a side character, but her feelings for Naruto define her.



Take a look at Shikamaru, Kishi has shown he has no need to carry through with secondary character romance despite the hints he put there in the first place.

Hinata is just such a minor character at heart, which means that even though she's defined by her feelings for Naruto, they don't have to go anywhere.

Sakura is a better example, as a main character who is really defined by choosing between Naruto and Sasuke. I imagine Kishi wasn't/isn't thinking about Hinata's character when he decides/d who she is going to choose.


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## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> I'm not being hypocritical.
> 
> Naruto's shown that he will put aside his feelings for Sakura to let her be happy with Sasuke.
> 
> ...



So You clearly see her still choosing Sasuke over Naruto boy boy... He is not forcing her she knows he love her and he is not forcing her it will stay up to her and Honestly I don't see her tourning him down, don't you get the message? he wants to see her happy above anything els. wall you think will happen when she knows that...think about it men stop stinking on Hinata think about the 3 characters in play here....

Sakura know yes but trust me she will questiong him about it... It will not end like that the confession need resolution there are desting to be friends is all about team 7


Sarry Naruto but people realy put you down here.


----------



## BraggZero (Feb 8, 2012)

More foreshadowing that Rikudo Sennin's wife might've been a Hyuuga too.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

gershvin said:


> 22 members and 35 guests
> 
> Recycling arguments and denial.
> 
> ...



What an appaling rationalization.

Sakura has shown ambiguous hints regarding Naruto, which still retain a little ambiguity even through 469 and 540. Partly because no other pairing actually has ever had hints regarding canonization (and no, Hinata saying she will hold Naruto's hand doesn't count).

Note that simply describing Sasuke as evil carries the connotation that things will be different when he isn't evil, for which there is no evidence whatsoever.



> The only thing has changed  - Hinata is sure in herself. That tells much.
> There is no way Kishi will make her desires and hopes be crushed after such development.



Sure he can, look at Karin .

Also, he did it for Naruto too .

And Sakura .


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## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> What an appaling rationalization.
> 
> Sakura has shown ambiguous hints regarding Naruto, which still retain a little ambiguity even through 469 and 540. Partly because no other pairing actually has ever had hints regarding canonization (and no, Hinata saying she will hold Naruto's hand doesn't count).
> 
> ...



and also Lee I think his moment was even bigger, but who cares about Lee?
Jiraiya Thunade too...


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> And then the manga ended there.



No but NS pretty much did.

Then the "confession" and the aftermath killed its hopes and dreams.



> He continued asking Sakura out in part 2 btw, albeit with less vigor than his younger self.



It's not treated anywhere as seriously as the aforementioned moments are.



> Sure, but the same goes for all big 3 pairings, it just doesn't seem like a likely scenario.



I think it's _the_ most likely scenario, for reasons I've previously stated.

Naruto's feelings are the ones, I feel, are the most likely to change.



> And yet Naruto's overall character is so much more important than Hinata.



Never denied this.



> Simply because Naruto has other things going on in his life and other reasons he can't tell Sakura how he feels doesn't mean his feelings aren't important.



Sakura knows how he feels about her. She doesn't care.

"The idiot's in love with me."

Remember?



> Again, this seems to link back to whoever has the last one sided pairing moment, because you can be sure that whenever they occur for Naruto, people don't take them lightly.



I don't even know that it's because of that anymore.

NS and SS are frankly in shambles romance-wise.

NH is the only one still semi-together because Naruto's feelings for Hinata aren't well defined. The ambiguity gives it a leg up on the other two.



> Take a look at Shikamaru, Kishi has shown he has no need to carry through with secondary character romance despite the hints he put there in the first place.
> 
> Hinata is just such a minor character at heart, which means that even though she's defined by her feelings for Naruto, they don't have to go anywhere.
> 
> Sakura is a better example, as a main character who is really defined by choosing between Naruto and Sasuke. I imagine Kishi wasn't/isn't thinking about Hinata's character when he decides/d who she is going to choose.



I suppose it's just getting harder and harder for me to believe Hinata's feelings will go unrequited when they're being referenced more and more often.

This isn't the kind of path one takes when they plan to have a character get friendzoned.



DONJOSEPH19 said:


> So You clearly see her still choosing Sasuke over Naruto boy boy... He is not forcing her she knows he love her and he is not forcing her it will stay up to her and Honestly I don't see her tourning him down, don't you get the message? he wants to see her happy above anything els. wall you think will happen when she knows that...think about it men stop stinking on Hinata think about the 3 characters in play here....
> 
> Sakura know yes but trust me she will questiong him about it... It will not end like that the confession need resolution there are desting to be friends is all about team 7
> 
> ...



Like I said, Sakura knows full well what Naruto feels for her and how good of a person he is and still loves Sasuke.

I don't see anything that would change that. Naruto can't really get "nicer" or anything.


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## gershwin (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> What an appaling rationalization.
> 
> Sakura has shown ambiguous hints regarding Naruto, which still retain a little ambiguity even through 469 and 540. Partly because no other pairing actually has ever had hints regarding canonization (and no, Hinata saying she will hold Naruto's hand doesn't count).



Lol no.
469 and 540 vanished all ambiguousness. In love with two never was an option in this manga. Get over it.
Unlike Hinata Naruto never stated anything like this regarding Sakura-chan. 
Hinata woudn`t say about holding hands at this point of the manga if she is gonna be dumped. 
She, like everyone else will meet her happy ending. Thats it.


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## Corvida (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> So You clearly see her still choosing Sasuke over Naruto boy boy... He is not forcing her she knows he love her and he is not forcing her it will stay up to her and Honestly I don't see her tourning him down, don't you get the message? he wants to see her happy above anything els. wall you think will happen when she knows that...



Let me guess...she will be guilt tripped, called worse than a curse seal and will feel obligated  to-let call it so-confess  to make amends?

She-already-knows. And in the worst possible way.

puxa Asturias


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> No but NS pretty much did.
> 
> Then the "confession" and the aftermath killed its hopes and dreams.





NS has always ridden on the back of Naruto, who was confirmed to still love Sakura 10 chapters before her confession.

The only thing that died was a lot of the ambiguity that surrounded Sakura's actions regarding Naruto, and yes, the ambiguity did exist.



> It's not treated anywhere as seriously as the aforementioned moments are.



lolbias.

Maybe not his date attempts, but there are multiple NS moments in part two, more than for any other pairing bar perhaps SN.



> I think it's _the_ most likely scenario, for reasons I've previously stated.
> 
> Naruto's feelings are the ones, I feel, are the most likely to change.



And yet I view Sakura as the most volatile element of the big 3, she is the one constantly bringing everything up after all, not to mention has the best reasons to get over her love and has actually shown something that could suggest she is (as opposed to everyone else which is just supposition based on nothing).



> Sakura knows how he feels about her. She doesn't care.
> 
> "The idiot's in love with me."
> 
> Remember?



That bitch! 

The funniest part is that actually has nothing to do with my point, I meant Naruto's feelings are important overall, in the same sense that you're trying to say Hinata's are.



> I don't even know that it's because of that anymore.
> 
> NS and SS are frankly in shambles romance-wise.
> 
> NH is the only one still semi-together because Naruto's feelings for Hinata aren't well defined. The ambiguity gives it a leg up on the other two.



No. 

NS had/has ambiguity, because Sakura actually performed actions that are ambiguous.

Naruto didn't like Hinata that way and nothing has happened, why on earth is it ambiguous now?



> I suppose it's just getting harder and harder for me to believe Hinata's feelings will go unrequited when they're being reference more and more often.
> 
> This isn't the kind of path one takes when they plan to have a character get friendzoned.



I didn't pick the confession not being addressed for 110 chapters either , but it wasn't, which doesn't bode well for anyone saying Hinata's feelings are important.



gershvin said:


> Lol no.
> 469 and 540 vanished all ambiguousness. In love with two never was an option in this manga. Get over it.



One hell of a double standard here, you guys are fine with saying because Naruto hasn't outright rejected Hinata, his feelings are ambiguous, Sakura hasn't rejected Naruto recently either .

Anyway your argument would be much more compelling if the other pairings actually had ambiguous moments in the first place, as it stands that honour goes to NS despite 469 and 540.



> Unlike Hinata Naruto never stated anything like this regarding Sakura-chan.
> Hinata woudn`t say about holding hands at this point of the manga if she is gonna be dumped.
> She, like everyone else will meet her happy ending. Thats it.



Except Naruto of course, but his feelings don't matter, that silly orange monkey .

And Hinata can wank on about Naruto however she likes, it's still just the same NH shit.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> NS has always ridden on the back of Naruto, who was confirmed to still love Sakura 10 chapters before her confession.
> 
> The only thing that died was a lot of the ambiguity that surrounded Sakura's actions regarding Naruto, and yes, the ambiguity did exist.



Sakura still being in love with Sasuke prevents the pairing from being able to develop beyond a close friendship/one-sided crush.

Like I said, I don't see those feelings changing, so it's basically dead in the water.

I don't deny the ambiguity was there, heck it fooled me for a long time. But it was apparently all going nowhere.



> lolbias.
> 
> Maybe not his date attempts, but there are multiple NS moments in part two, more than for any other pairing bar perhaps SN.



No question, but they were all apparently worthless because Sakura's still in love with Sasuke and not with Naruto.



> And yet I view Sakura as the most volatile element of the big 3, she is the one constantly bringing everything up after all, not to mention has the best reasons to get over her love and has actually shown something that could suggest she is (as opposed to everyone else which is just supposition based on nothing).



I would have agreed, but despite all that Sakura is the same as always: in love with Sasuke and not with Naruto. Despite all the development, the "moments", growing closer, it wasn't enough.

And I don't think Naruto getting over his feelings is "based on nothing", there is some pretty clear indication there.



> That bitch!



You laugh, but it really was a slap in the face.



> NS had/has ambiguity, because Sakura actually performed actions that are ambiguous.



But it doesn't have that anymore since Sakura's feelings have since been clarified.



> Naruto didn't like Hinata that way and nothing has happened, why on earth is it ambiguous now?



Because Hinata confessed and Naruto has yet to definitively respond to that confession.

So there's at least potential for change there.



> I didn't pick the confession not being addressed for 110 chapters either , but it wasn't, which doesn't bode well for anyone saying Hinata's feelings are important.



That's just how Kishi is, bad pacing takes a particularly heavy toll on the unimportant romance.

I have no doubt that it will be revisited in some form eventually. Hinata's statements this chapter should be proof enough of that.


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## skins (Feb 8, 2012)

This pairing has as much credit as Naruto's love with Sakura. At this point, both are one sided. Sakura doesn't love Naruto that way (that we know of, she could be playing the tsundere card) and Naruto hasn't shown that he loves Hinata. 

He may grow to love her, but right now there's no hard evidence to say _he_ loves _her_. ;3


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

There's ambiguity.

NS used to have that but doesn't anymore.

That's why I put NH above NS in terms of likelihood.


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## gershwin (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Anyway your argument would be much more compelling if the other pairings actually had ambiguous moments in the first place, as it stands that honour goes to NS despite 469 and 540.


They had. But if you chose to ignore those hints - i can`t do anything about it.



> Except Naruto of course, but his feelings don't matter, that silly orange monkey .


Naruto`s feeling never were in the spotlight.  Allways being overshadowed
by his other goals.  
Unlike Hinata whose  development depends on Naruto only. So what is more important? Narutos untouched for more than 100 chapters feelings or Hinata, who raise her love to Naruto-kun again and again and  has to be  a completed character in the end? (to achieve something)


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## vagnard (Feb 8, 2012)

Marsala said:


> Goku and Chichi had more development than this.



XDDDD

It's no joke. Kishimoto simply sucks at romance. 

The funny thing is given this is a shounen the only developed pairing (NaruSasu) won't be fullfiled at the end except hidden in the yaoi subtext.


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## splendidlure (Feb 8, 2012)

Like explained before, Hinata's great resolve to hold hands with Naruto implicates that something must have happened for Hinata's to gain such confidence. Before this statement, while it was known that Hinata loves Naruto, she was content on standing by and seeing Naruto happy even if that means without her. Also, Hinata's character flaw is her low-esteem and self doubting nature. For Hinata to be so confident and sure of of herself, speaks volume. Also, Hinata is not the type of girl to force herself on anyone. Her statement is clear foreshadowing. It does not make the couple canon, but the couple is winning the race with this statement. 

Show solid proof that Naruto loves Sakura. At most, it is explicitly known that Naruto had a crush on Sakura. Crush does not equal love. Also, Naruto's feelings hasn't been focused in a while. Instead, Kishimoto continues to cement the facts that Sakura loves Sasuke and Hinata loves Naruto. Those two facts will never change. 

I've seen NS using Sai as proof. -_- Yes. Sai, someone who learns about social conduct from a book, is a great indicator of feelings and knows Naruto's in love with Sakura. 

How does Sakura show any indication of moving on from Sasuke? Yes, she clearly knows Sasuke's too focused on revenge to give her any attention. She also knows that Naruto is a hero and has acknowledged his strengths compared to Sasuke. However, knowing all that, she still loves Sasuke. At this point, nothing more can make Sakura fall out of love with Sasuke. She is aware that being in love with Sasuke is a bad thing, but she is still in love with him.


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## JPongo (Feb 8, 2012)

Hinata all the way.

The byakugan still has a role to play against the rinne/sharin, i hope.


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## Jinchuuriki (Feb 8, 2012)

The sharingan was born from the Buakugan (Hinata) and the 10 tails host (future Naruto RS) they somehow manage to travel back in time 

But really if you've been following the Manga from the start Kishi always said he intended them to be together. here's her first draft (as his wife?):


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## izzyisozaki (Feb 8, 2012)

the credit given to romantic hints in this manga is laughable really. as if kishi was done milking the pairing cow yet. how people get all smug about it is the lulziest thing about this section. can't wait for the next developments.


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## Lovely (Feb 8, 2012)

That's the thing; NaruHina seems to have gotten most of all pairing hints during this war arc. Its become a pattern-- its not like Kishi is switching back and forth between pairings.


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## Ryuzaki (Feb 8, 2012)

ceralux said:


> We actually agree on something.
> 
> Cheers to the death of NaruSaku
> Burn in hell


LAWL....I knew this thread was already gonna be here by the time I woke up 

So much for the whole Sakura and Naruto thing. Kishi just trolled the crap out of all the NaruSaku believers, yet again in the same arc 

I never really thought about it, but ever since the whole Pain vs. Konoha ordeal, I think everyone got the idea that it was going to be NaruHina but that idea was again reaffirmed when Naruto friendzon'd Sakura at the Summit 


Jinchuuriki said:


> The sharingan was born from the Buakugan (Hinata) and the 10 tails host (future Naruto RS) they somehow manage to travel back in time
> 
> But really if you've been following the Manga from the start Kishi always said he intended them to be together. here's her first draft (as his wife?):



Buahahahahaha...are you saying that Sasuke is basically what rolled down the tube after Naruto/Hinata end up smashing in the past ?


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## Renyou (Feb 8, 2012)

Jinchuuriki said:


> But really if you've been following the Manga from the start Kishi always said he intended them to be together.



That's funny, I don't recall him ever saying that.


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## Huey Freeman (Feb 8, 2012)

blue ish and yellow will make a better shade for a jump suit for their child than pink and yellow


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## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

My question again why haven't Kishi show Naruto's view, why we alway see Hinata but whe never see what Naruto think about her in the romance department doesn't that look funny....
Yes whe know Sakura loving Sasuke and Hinata love Naruto, but so far nothing on the boys.
And why is hard to believe that Sakura can have feelings for Naruto but have a bigger crush on Sasuke yes crush we haven't seen the real reason why Sakura loves Sasuke.
We havent seen what Naruto think off Sakura after that confession or what Sakura thinking about it. I think they say that she clearly lied about not caring for Sasuke, but in Summit on chapter 540 we see was a lie, but why nothing on Sakura or Naruto thought after that confession...

Don't you think if he was making NH canon he will make Naruto point of view towards the two girls very clear, and Sakura's thought on Naruto after that confession I really think you are declaring victory ahead of time...


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## Ryuzaki (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> *My question again why haven't Kishi show Naruto's view*, why we alway see Hinata but whe never see what Naruto think about her in the romance department doesn't that look funny....
> Yes whe know Sakura loving Sasuke and Hinata love Naruto, but so far nothing on the boys.
> And why is hard to believe that Sakura can have feelings for Naruto but have a bigger crush on Sasuke yes crush we haven't seen the real reason why Sakura loves Sasuke.
> We havent seen what Naruto think off Sakura after that confession or what Sakura thinking about it. I think they say that she clearly lied about not caring for Sasuke, but in Summit on chapter 540 we see was a lie, but why nothing on Sakura or Naruto thought after that confession...
> ...


Because this manga was made for kids, they don't have the emotional maturity to deal with it outright but then again, Kishimoto sucks at this kind of stuff, he should have read some of Rumiko's work, he would have a better idea of how to involve it into the plot-line.

Also, let's not forget, Kishimoto didn't have the mindset of fan-pairings while writing the manga. He meant to include it subtly, but he's not good at it, so it only makes sense, this is the way it went.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> My question again why haven't Kishi show Naruto's view, why we alway see Hinata but whe never see what Naruto think about her in the romance department doesn't that look funny....
> Yes whe know Sakura loving Sasuke and Hinata love Naruto, but so far nothing on the boys.



Because he's being ambiguous, and until recently the feelings of the guys were obvious.



> And why is hard to believe that Sakura can have feelings for Naruto but have a bigger crush on Sasuke yes crush we haven't seen the real reason why Sakura loves Sasuke.



If she had feelings for Naruto she wouldn't have had to bullshit that confession, she could have simply told him how she feels about him.



> We havent seen what Naruto think off Sakura after that confession or what Sakura thinking about it. I think they say that she clearly lied about not caring for Sasuke, but in Summit on chapter 540 we see was a lie, but why nothing on Sakura or Naruto thought after that confession...



We know exactly what Naruto thought of the confession, he knew it was bullshit and he called Sakura on it.



> Don't you think if he was making NH canon he will make Naruto point of view towards the two girls very clear, and Sakura's thought on Naruto after that confession I really think you are declaring victory ahead of time...



If we knew Naruto's feelings toward Hinata the pairing would either be canon or dead. We won't get clarification until much later for that reason.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Sakura still being in love with Sasuke prevents the pairing from being able to develop beyond a close friendship/one-sided crush.



Naruto still being in love with Sakura prevents the pairing from being able to develop beyond a close friendship/one-sided crush.





> I don't deny the ambiguity was there, heck it fooled me for a long time. But it was apparently all going nowhere.



Instead you choose a pairing with absolutely nothing going for it on Naruto's end.

And is actually trying to spin that as a good thing.



> No question, but they were all apparently worthless because Sakura's still in love with Sasuke and not with Naruto.



And so all of NH's moments were worthless too because it should be assumed that Naruto is still in love with Sakura?

Arguing he isn't is a weak argument. Naruto was in love with Sakura in 458, since then his behaviour hasn't changed. Suddenly, ambiguity!



> I would have agreed, but despite all that Sakura is the same as always: in love with Sasuke and not with Naruto. Despite all the development, the "moments", growing closer, it wasn't enough.



Eh, arguing that Sakura's feelings for Naruto aren't quite strictly platonic is quite a hard argument to counter, it draws from all the moments in part two and isn't countered by the fact that Sasuke springs to mind whenever Sakura is asked who she loves.

Of course if Sakura is feeling something even slightly more than platonic for Naruto, we might as well call game right there.



> And I don't think Naruto getting over his feelings is "based on nothing", there is some pretty clear indication there.



Enlighten me as to where you find these panels .



> You laugh, but it really was a slap in the face.



Next you're going to tell me she's physically abusive too, for srs.



> Because Hinata confessed and Naruto has yet to definitively respond to that confession.
> 
> So there's at least potential for change there.



Nothing in Naruto's behaviour has changed, nor has he thought of her even slightly romantically in the 110 chapters he didn't reference the confession.

NH traded the future response to the confession for the eyes comment, it was a good trade in my opinion and it relieves Naruto of the obligation of replying.



> That's just how Kishi is, bad pacing takes a particularly heavy toll on the unimportant romance.
> 
> I have no doubt that it will be revisited in some form eventually. Hinata's statements this chapter should be proof enough of that.



Is this another 'secret ramen date' implication?

Because... 



gershvin said:


> They had. But if you chose to ignore those hints - i can`t do anything about it.



Enlighten me, exactly what is in your hand here?




> Naruto`s feeling never were in the spotlight.  Allways being overshadowed by his other goals.



Very good, Naruto does have other goals, that doesn't make his romantic feelings less important.



> Unlike Hinata whose  development depends on Naruto only.



She doesn't need requittal to develop, nor has Kishi really cared if he has left side characters undeveloped before (see; entirety of part 2).



> So what is more important? Narutos untouched for more than 100 chapters feelings or Hinata, who raise her love to Naruto-kun again and again and  has to be  a completed character in the end? (to achieve something)



Naruto is the main character of the manga, you can't deny that his face to Sai in 458 or at the hospital when Sakura was hugging Sasuke was more compelling than Hinata wanting to be with Naruto for the eighth time.

Also, in terms of untouched feelings and Kishi, remember how long Sakura's were left uncommented in the beginning of part 2 and this was actually with ambiguous acts. He's certainly shown that you shouldn't assume a character has changed just because he hasn't repeated his opinions on a matter every half a chapter.


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## UberDruid (Feb 8, 2012)

NaruHina would be better especially for the powerup of Naruto Jr. 

Uzumaki chakra + Senjuu chakra + bijuu chakra + Byakugan = ? Pwnage

Sakura has no unique power ups. Also, I do not know if Sasuke is capable of becoming pregnant.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Lovely said:


> That's the thing; NaruHina seems to have gotten most of all pairing hints during this war arc. Its become a pattern-- its not like Kishi is switching back and forth between pairings.



Oh please, in at least half of the chapters with NH pairing hints, Sakura's love life has been brought up too, be it her feelings for Naruto or her feelings for Sasuke.

Kishi is clearly trying to play up NH vs NS.

In this very chapter you should notice that while Hinata was the first rookie to say something about helping Naruto, Sakura was the last, mentioning something about 'him not being alone anymore' . Sure it's nowhere near as blatant as NH, but it can't be as Sakura is still designed to choose.


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## Ryuzaki (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Naruto still being in love with Sakura prevents the pairing from being able to develop beyond a close friendship/one-sided crush.



this 
this 
this 

Trouble in paradise? 

Seems more unrequited than anything else to me 


UberDruid said:


> NaruHina would be better especially for the powerup of Naruto Jr.
> 
> *Uzumaki chakra + Senjuu chakra + bijuu chakra + Byakugan = ? Pwnage*


It's called a sharingan user, Naruto = RS, Hinata = RS's wife 


UberDruid said:


> Sakura has no unique power ups. Also, I do not know if Sasuke is capable of becoming pregnant.


We'll find out at the end of the manga that Sakura has a really powerful kekkai genkai that she didn't realize or that Sasuke has a vagina, either of which will be a great twist for the manga


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## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Yes here we go with the Kishi sucks at romance excuse right, but I think I read a comment that say Kishi have this all plan from the Start, so why in the hell you give Naruto and Sakura so much focus if you was always planing to make it NaruHina cannon
Naruto and Hinata are not even close friends isn't that ironic. Come on If he was planing Naruhina Hinata character will not be focus all the time on Naruto so when we see Hinata we have too de desperate about all the one sided moments. it will be on both sides where Hinata knows Naruto love her and she could focus on other things, this is not chapter 100 is chapter 573.

Hinata is all about Naruto and whent she speak she say Naruto that alone doesn't make NH canon .


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## Danzio (Feb 8, 2012)

I never believed in the whole naruhina thing, however it seems like she matured over this last chapter, more importantly, She will actually try to talk to Naruto rather than rape him from behind


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Ryuzaki said:


> this
> this
> this
> 
> ...



Because that's what's going on there.

Naruto not wanting Sakura anymore.

In the face of your overwhelming evidence, I must agree.


----------



## Lovely (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Oh please, in at least half of the chapters with NH pairing hints, Sakura's love life has been brought up too, be it her feelings for Naruto or her feelings for Sasuke.
> 
> Kishi is clearly trying to play up NH vs NS.
> 
> In this very chapter you should notice that while Hinata was the first rookie to say something about helping Naruto, Sakura was the last, mentioning something about 'him not being alone anymore' . Sure it's nowhere near as blatant as NH, but it can't be as Sakura is still designed to choose.


 
NH has been prominent at least since 540. Since then off the top of my head, I can name 558, where Hinata got more focus for her rescue than the rest, and of course 559.

Sakura included herself as part of the group that will fight with Naruto. There was nothing you could take from her comment that hints at romance. If anything, it just becomes more obvious that she thinks of Naruto as a dear friend and nothing more.


----------



## Ryuzaki (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> Yes here we go with the Kishi sucks at romance excuse right, but I think I read a comment that say Kishi have this all plan from the Start, so why in the hell you give Naruto and Sakura so much focus if you was always planing to make it NaruHina cannon
> Naruto and Hinata are not even close friends isn't that ironic. Come on If he was planing Naruhina Hinata character will not be focus all the time on Naruto so when we see Hinata we have too de desperate about all the one sided moments. it will be on both sides where Hinata knows Naruto love her and she could focus on other things, this is not chapter 100 is chapter 573.
> 
> Hinata is all about Naruto and whent she speak she say Naruto that alone doesn't make NH canon .


Personally, I don't mind romance when it's well done, I was a big fan of Rumiko's work, but it's just not Kishi's thing. I wish he would have someone else look over his direction with the romance thing, it would've yielded much better results.

He's not bad as he sometimes he's okay with, but he's not good either. The worst I've seen so far is Kubo, who is either on coke while he's drawing/writing Bleach or he's just a plain idiot to begin with.


----------



## Grimzilla (Feb 8, 2012)

Jinchuuriki said:


> The sharingan was born from the Buakugan (Hinata) and the 10 tails host (future Naruto RS) they somehow manage to travel back in time
> 
> But really if you've been following the Manga from the start Kishi always said he intended them to be together. here's her first draft (as his wife?):



Can't argue with that logic


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Because he's being ambiguous, and until recently the feelings of the guys were obvious.


so why you say NS is dead...




First Tsurugi said:


> If she had feelings for Naruto she wouldn't have had to bullshit that confession, she could have simply told him how she feels about him.



So why it hasn't he make clear that she was lying...


First Tsurugi said:


> We know exactly what Naruto thought of the confession, he knew it was bullshit and he called Sakura on it.


I call her out lying about not cating for Sasuke them we have the team 7 image shattered...



First Tsurugi said:


> If we knew Naruto's feelings toward Hinata the pairing would either be canon or dead. We won't get clarification until much later for that reason.


The same we can say about Naruto's feeling for Sakura since he has alot more wait than Hinata's feeling He is doing alot more for the person he likes dont you think.

Excuses Excuses........


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Lovely said:


> NH has been prominent at least since 540. Since then off the top of my head, I can name 558, where Hinata got more focus for her rescue than the rest, and of course 559.



Remember Sakura got rescued in 558 too .

And it wasn't all that fewer panels than Hinata's rescue either .



> Sakura included herself as part of the group that will fight with Naruto. There was nothing you could take from her comment that hints at romance. If anything, it just becomes more obvious that she thinks of Naruto as a dear friend and nothing more.



Except you know, it's assumed Naruto loves Sakura, so having her being the last to reply (mirroring Hinata being the first to reply) and also getting a couple of extra panels does suggest Kishi is playing NS against NH, which seems exactly like what he's done before (Hinata's confession into 450 hug anyone?)

Just the phrase 'he won't be alone anymore' is suggestive enough to be honest, when it comes in this context. It doesn't matter what it actually means, when the goal is to play NH vs NS for the drama.

But yes, I already said Hinata's was significantly more overt (of course yet again it has nothing from Naruto's side).


----------



## Ryuzaki (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Because that's what's going on there.
> 
> Naruto not wanting Sakura anymore.
> 
> In the face of your overwhelming evidence, I must agree.



Don't worry Sakura will 'find love in a hopeless place'. Sakura is going to bust into tears when Sasuke is brought back by Naruto 


Lovely said:


> NH has been prominent at least since 540. Since then off the top of my head, I can name 558, where Hinata got more focus for her rescue than the rest, and of course 559.
> 
> Sakura included herself as part of the group that will fight with Naruto. There was nothing you could take from her comment that hints at romance. If anything, it just becomes more obvious that she thinks of Naruto as a dear friend and nothing more.


I'd say since Hinata tried to rescue Naruto from Pain, that shit was ballsy. Leave it to Kishi to squash one of the weaker characters by the strongest character in the manga at the time.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Naruto still being in love with Sakura prevents the pairing from being able to develop beyond a close friendship/one-sided crush.



I already explained, multiple times, why I feel Naruto's the one more likely to change.



> Instead you choose a pairing with absolutely nothing going for it on Naruto's end.
> 
> And is actually trying to spin that as a good thing.



See above response.

We're just going in circles now.



> And so all of NH's moments were worthless too because it should be assumed that Naruto is still in love with Sakura?
> 
> Arguing he isn't is a weak argument. Naruto was in love with Sakura in 458, since then his behaviour hasn't changed. Suddenly, ambiguity!



If Naruto were to reconfirm that he only sees Hinata as a friend, then I would see declare NH dead along with all the other pairs.

You need to understand the only reason I see NH is being more likely than the other two is because the other two are both dead.



> Eh, arguing that Sakura's feelings for Naruto aren't quite strictly platonic is quite a hard argument to counter, it draws from all the moments in part two and isn't countered by the fact that Sasuke springs to mind whenever Sakura is asked who she loves.
> 
> Of course if Sakura is feeling something even slightly more than platonic for Naruto, we might as well call game right there.



I see nothing that suggests Sakura thinks of Naruto as anything more than a friend, in spite of the "moments" they've shared. If she truly felt more for him there would have been genuine feeling behind that bullshit confession of hers, but there was none, and Naruto could see that.



> Enlighten me as to where you find these panels .



You gave them yourself, the hospital scene and the PoAL.



> Next you're going to tell me she's physically abusive too, for srs.



There's a big difference between tsun~ slapstick and what went on during the Kage summit arc.

The "confession", Sakura being a cunt to her allies, and her still being in love with Sasuke killed any hope I had for her character. I used to defend her but even I see her as worthless now.



> Nothing in Naruto's behaviour has changed, nor has he thought of her even slightly romantically in the 110 chapters he didn't reference the confession.



I could say the same for him and Sakura. Isn't he supposed to be in love with her? Yet how often is it brought up?



> NH traded the future response to the confession for the eyes comment, it was a good trade in my opinion and it relieves Naruto of the obligation of replying.



And yet you still get what you have this chapter.

It's not over.



> Is this another 'secret ramen date' implication?
> 
> Because...



I'm not familiar with new pairing terminology, I'm just pretty sure Hinata's feelings will be revisited, regardless of how things turn out.



DONJOSEPH19 said:


> so why you say NS is dead...



Because the only thing that might change is Naruto's feelings toward Hinata.



> So why it hasn't make clear that she was lying...



It was made clear she was lying, *by Naruto*.



> The same we can say about Naruto's feeling for Sakura since he has alot more wait than her.
> 
> Excuses Excuses........



We know how Naruto feels toward Sakura and we know how Sakura feels toward Naruto. It's one sided and it's not changing.

NH at least has a prayer of changing, that's why it's more likely than NS.


----------



## Xnr (Feb 8, 2012)

People should not write off NaruHina so quickly. When you've got boobs like Hinata's, nothing is impossible. Also since Naruto's family seems to have strange hair colour, if Naruto gets with Hinata, their child's hair will probably be green (you know, blue + yellow). Not that I care either way.


----------



## Psychic (Feb 8, 2012)

The only way Sakura could redeemed herself now is by reviving Naruto with Chiyoba jutsu after Sasuke kills him. Sakura is still in love with Sasuke, and Hinata is determined to walk along side Naruto...interpret what you will on that. Sasuke will want Hinata too since she has the Byakugan, and who wouldnt want offsprings with strong eye abilities?


----------



## gershwin (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Enlighten me, exactly what is in your hand here?


Take in consideration his latest scene with hinata. He was able to read her worries in her eyes. Empathy? Special attention?


> Very good, Naruto does have other goals, that doesn't make his romantic feelings less important.


What maks you think it is important to his character? Where even love was mentioned in the list of his goals?


> She doesn't need requittal to develop, nor has Kishi really cared if he has left side characters undeveloped before (see; entirety of part 2).


Her development is tied up with _a main character_. Thats what makes her special.  And that was brought up again in this chapter. Why? To be abandoned later? I don` think so.





> Naruto is the main character of the manga, you can't deny that his face to Sai in 458 or at the hospital when Sakura was hugging Sasuke was more compelling than Hinata wanting to be with Naruto for the eighth time.



Yes, that scene 100 chapters ago and Sai`s misunderstanding of the situation that was resolved in  favor of NaruSasu.
Kishi had a lot of time to brought up his feelings again - Dark Naruto, meeting with Kushina etc. But yet there is no any NS signs since kage arc.
Yes, Sakura was like that earlier too. But now the manga is clearly going to its ending. There is no need to touch Hinata and make her believe that some day she will hold his hand if NS is the end game.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> If Naruto were to reconfirm that he only sees Hinata as a friend, then I would see declare NH dead and along with all the other pairs.
> 
> You need to understand the only reason I see NH is being more likely than the other two is because they're both dead.



SS is dead, pretty much no matter what tbh.

NS is merely less likely than it was. Of course it was almost certain for a while there, so that certainly doesn't make it dead, not when it's driven by the main character's feelings and nothing has happened.



> I see nothing that suggests Sakura thinks of Naruto as anything more than a friend, in spite of the "moments" they've shared. If she truly felt more for him there would have been genuine feeling behind that bullshit confession of hers, but there was none, and Naruto could see that.



She did have genuine feeling behind her confession, she wanted to relieve the burden she unintentionally placed on Naruto and have him return safely to Konoha. Of course that didn't quite work out for her .



> You gave them yourself, the hospital scene and the PoAL.



Yes, pain is clearly one character getting over another .

If that's the case, SS is absolutely screwed and NS becomes canon easily then.



> There's a big difference between tsun~ slapstick and what went on during the Kage summit arc.
> 
> The "confession", Sakura being a cunt to her allies, and her still being in love with Sasuke killed any hope I had for her character. I used to defend her but even I see her as worthless now.



It's good you see that.

I'm not as much of a fan of her as I used to be either, I'm hoping she does _something_ in this arc.

Ofc I can't write her off as worthless, not when there was at least good intentions I guess.

This is all tangential to the point ofc.



> I could say the same for him and Sakura. Isn't he supposed to be in love with her? Yet how often is it brought up?



Remember the last time it was brought up (458)? One of the key things discussed there was why it wasn't brought up more often, namely Naruto has issues regarding Sasuke and that's why he's backed off.

Now, for all you kids obsessed with foreshadowing, that is an effective example, it foreshadows Naruto fixing his issues with Sasuke and then telling Sakura his feelings.

And finally, having nothing on Naruto's part is much better for NS than for NH, namely that Naruto loving Sakura is the status quo and therefore should be assumed in the absence of other evidence.



> And yet you still get what you have this chapter.
> 
> It's not over.



There's a difference between NH being dead and Naruto being obligated to respond to Hinata's confession.

I'm saying he is no longer obligated.



> I'm not familiar with new pairing terminology, I'm just pretty sure Hinata's feelings will be revisited, regardless of how things turn out.



Probably, I'm just referring to the implication that Naruto has already made his (positive) feelings known to Hinata and this is the first we're hearing of it .


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

gershvin said:


> Take in consideration his latest scene with hinata. He was able to read her worries in her eyes. Empathy? Special attention?



You mean like Naruto can do with everyone? 

Do I have to bring up the conversation with Inari and Tazuna?



> What maks you think it is important to his character? Where even love was mentioned in the list of his goals?



Naruto loves Sakura and wants her to love him.

Naruto showed pain when he found out she still loved Sasuke (back in part 1 ofc, in part 2 he assumes it's the norm).

How is it not a goal of his to be with Sakura?



> Her development is tied up with _a main character_. Thats what makes her special.  And that was brought up again in this chapter. Why? To be abandoned later? I don` think so.



Shikamaru's pairings were hinted lots of times, why? To be abandoned later .



> Yes, that scene 100 chapters ago and Sai`s misunderstanding of the situation that was resolved in  favor of NaruSasu.



It has nothing to do with Sai, it was Naruto's words that confirmed he still loved Sakura and also explained why he had backed off.



> Kishi had a lot of time to brought up his feelings again - Dark Naruto, meeting with Kushina etc. But yet there is no any NS signs since kage arc.
> Yes, Sakura was like that earlier too. But now the manga is clearly going to its ending.





Again, in the absence of evidence, the status quo takes priority, how on earth are you using no romantic thoughts by Naruto as proof he may have changed to Hinata?

Kishi had all this time to establish Naruto may be changing .



> There is no need to touch Hinata and make her believe that some day she will hold his hand if NS is the end game.



Sure there is, Kishi thrives off drama, it's pretty much the reason he brings pairings up nowadays.


----------



## OGkush (Feb 8, 2012)

eh, I don't get why you're writing off ANY of the pairings to be honest. All of them care about eachother one way or another, and it's more or less one-sided when it comes to love between them. Sakura may have made a bullshit of a confession but in a way he did it cause she cared about him, and Hinata judging from her words this chapter is finally planing to "man-up" (I know, sounds weird) and do something about it (although I guess laying her life on the line and saying I love you is pretty ballsy too). Kishi's clearly going to milk this even longer, it'll be a while till we find out who's gonna be paired up with Naruto.
Although I don't mind NH, my money's on NS a bit more. I'll be glad eitherway it turns out, but for some reason it might seem a bit more plausible that the hero gets the girl he wants, instead of the hero realizes love has been there all along (even though Hinata pretty much spelled it out for him).


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> SS is dead, pretty much no matter what tbh.
> 
> NS is merely less likely than it was. Of course it was almost certain for a while there, so that certainly doesn't make it dead, not when it's driven by the main character's feelings and nothing has happened.



NS was looking like the most likely option for a long time and then it crashed and burned spectacularly when it turned out all of the supposed development it had experienced was worth jack.

Now it's a pile of ashes that flare up on occassion.



> She did have genuine feeling behind her confession, she wanted to relieve the burden she unintentionally placed on Naruto and have him return safely to Konoha. Of course that didn't quite work out for her .



Yeah, but those good feelings are just platonic ones. We've known for a long time how she thinks of Naruto as dear friend.



> Yes, pain is clearly one character getting over another .
> 
> If that's the case, SS is absolutely screwed and NS becomes canon easily then.



Naruto felt bad about what he had to do, but he still did it.

That pretty much spells out how he sees things, and how he sees himself in relation to Sakura.



> It's good you see that.
> 
> I'm not as much of a fan of her as I used to be either, I'm hoping she does _something_ in this arc.



I just can't fathom anything she could possibly do to redeem herself in my eyes.

The end of that arc seemed to be Kishi admitting defeat and giving up on her character.



> Remember the last time it was brought up (458)? One of the key things discussed there was why it wasn't brought up more often, namely Naruto has issues regarding Sasuke and that's why he's backed off.
> 
> Now, for all you kids obsessed with foreshadowing, that is an effective example, it foreshadows Naruto fixing his issues with Sasuke and then telling Sakura his feelings.



But Sakura already knows how he feels about her. Him telling her what she already knows isn't going to change anything.



> And finally, having nothing on Naruto's part is much better for NS than for NH, namely that Naruto loving Sakura is the status quo and therefore should be assumed in the absence of other evidence.



A fair point, but like I said, I see Naruto changing before Sakura does.



> There's a difference between NH being dead and Naruto being obligated to respond to Hinata's confession.
> 
> I'm saying he is no longer obligated.



I don't understand. If you're saying Naruto doesn't have to respond because his feelings have already been conveyed, and they still haven't changed (friendzone) why would Hinata still think she has a chance to be with him?

Either Naruto hasn't communicated his feelings clearly enough or he simply hasn't responded at all.



> Probably, I'm just referring to the implication that Naruto has already made his (positive) feelings known to Hinata and this is the first we're hearing of it .



Yeah, that line of thinking is pretty much unfounded.


----------



## sakalthor (Feb 8, 2012)

Hinata has a blue hair (it is not any less "freaky" than redhair, so there is no problem here with "pick a girl with a hair like mine"), and when you look at Minato-Kushina, you will see that she is crazy person but he is a calm one. With Naruto, this is reversed - he is crazy and Hinata is the calm one. So, it fits just fine.


----------



## gershwin (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> You mean like Naruto can do with everyone?



That was actualy the first time he said something like that to Hinata 


> Naruto loves Sakura and wants her to love him.
> 
> Naruto showed pain when he found out she still loved Sasuke (back in part 1 ofc, in part 2 he assumes it's the norm).
> 
> How is it not a goal of his to be with Sakura?


As for now he doesn't seem to be that much a heartbroken. He never explicity stated that he wants to be with Sakura.
Become a hokage, being acknowledged by Konoha, by Sasuke, bring peace - thats it. Nothing about Sakura, even to himself  - so why whould i think it is important?




> Shikamaru's pairings were hinted lots of times, why? To be abandoned later .


Shikamaru is in love with a main character Naruto?



> It has nothing to do with Sai, it was Naruto's words that confirmed he still loved Sakura and also explained why he had backed off.



The point is that Sai exaggerated his feelings. Made them look more important then they were in reality.


Also regarding hospital scene, this guy brought a good point


			
				Hydro Spiral said:
			
		

> "He's more sensitive than he looks" = He's staring at his his best friend, who just came out of a coma after a long period of uncertainty["Sasuke...You..."], Sakura's already crying her eyes out, and there's a whole lot of love in the room cuz Team 7 just got back together.
> 
> Sensitive in the sense that he doesn't want to get all teary eyed and shyt [hence, the forced smile], so he decides to GTFO and have a bowl at Ichiraku
> I mean c'mon, his best friend wakes up from a coma and he get's sad??? Because the girl that he knows has a crush on said friend [and happens to be a teammate] is showing affection..?


----------



## Farih (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> Anyway, Naruto loves Sakura and only likes Hinata so...I guess you guys better hope Sasuke has a magical change of heart and falls in love with Sakura after his redemption...that's about the only way your going to get your pairing.



You act like this is something new.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

gershvin said:


> That was actualy the first time he said something like that to Hinata



So Hinata is finally on everyone else's level?

That's... good I guess.



> As for now he doesn't seem to be that much a heartbroken. He never explicity stated that he wants to be with Sakura.
> Become a hokage, being acknowledged by Konoha, by Sasuke, bring peace - thats it. Nothing about Sakura, even to himself  - so why whould i think it is important?



He has other things on his mind (although when he was asked about romance 100 chapters ago, he explained what was going on).

An no, this isn't a possible avenue to squeeze 'he might have changed!' into, change requires thought and time, neither of which were given by Naruto.

Again, status quo and all that.



> Shikamaru is in love with a main character Naruto?



Oh, so if being in love with a main character automatically makes your love life important, what is the love like of the main character himself like? 

Again, I refer you to the hospital scene, when Naruto is confronted with SS he is visibly hurt, but tries to put up a nice front, yet Hinata shows no such hurt in 450, it just shows the literary depth of each pairing, namely Hinata's feelings have to be much more simple than Naruto's.



> The point is that Sai exaggerated his feelings. Made them look more important then they were in reality.



To Sakura he did, but that doesn't matter for when we're looking at what Naruto's feelings are exactly. It was Naruto's own words that confirmed he loved Sakura, Sai asked him the question and Naruto answered and it's the answer that's important.



> Also regarding hospital scene, this guy brought a good point



I doubt even the most hardened of SN shippers would imply that Naruto teared up over Sasuke coming out of his coma rather than the display of SS in front of him .

That is, if I'm reading it right.

It was conveniently NarSasian of Hydro Spiral though .


----------



## ~Gesy~ (Feb 8, 2012)

Nic said:


> Kishi is really cruel to NaruHina fans.  He's going to get so much hate mail by the end of this manga.



yeah, When it comes to popularity polls hinata usually way high up there with sakura,sometimes beating her and she doesn't get nearly as much panel time.

I hope naruto and hinata does end up together, but wouldn't that make sakura forever alone?


----------



## Tenyume Kasumi (Feb 8, 2012)

I see a timeskip on the horizon. It's the only way to make any pairings possible at this point.


----------



## Kage (Feb 8, 2012)

my thing is this.

this is the most panel time hinata has been given since the chuunin exams and during this time it has been emphasized how she lives and _breathes_ for naruto. if kishi doesn't intend to go anywhere with this he's done one hell of a job building her character into the most pitiful little creature ever.

so i can understand why any die hard hinata fan would _pray_ this can only bode well because if it doesn't it's a pretty damn big slap in the face.

Still, NH wouldn't be the result of a pairing that's been developed particularly well, not when naruto hasn't been aware of how she feels, did nothing when made aware of how she feels and has been in love with someone else for the majority of the time-skip. Though this will be of little consequence to those who have taken a rather large emotional investment at this point and are convinced it's the tru luv for the ages naturally.


----------



## Renyou (Feb 8, 2012)

~Gesy~ said:


> but wouldn't that make sakura forever alone?



Only if she wants to be. We already know of two guys other than  Naruto who like her, so it's not like Sasuke is her only option or that  she happens to be undesirable (well, at least she's not supposed to be).  She should have moved on as soon as Sasuke rejected her, that would  have done wonders for her character. Or maybe not, who knows with Kishi.


----------



## Hiro Tooki (Feb 8, 2012)

I thought this was a NaruHina thread not a pairing debate one >_>   Poor Sakura, getting dragged into this even though she didn't even mention anything outside of camaraderie when thinking of Naruto. 

It kinda reminds me of that chapter when Naruto got his ass thrown in the water and Hinata shifted her focus and yelled Naruto-kun!  and Sakura told her to focus on the enemy.  And there were arguments about that.  

Wow...some things never change in here


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

None of the Big 3 are well developed or written well tbh, NH gets credit for being perhaps the least offensive of them.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> None of the Big 3 are well developed or written well tbh, NH gets credit for being perhaps the least offensive of them.



Not if it becomes canon like this 

Sorry I didn't reply to your earlier post, but it started to snowball again  and it's too late for me to LAP at anyone who isn't being outright crazy.


----------



## Sygurgh (Feb 8, 2012)

My previsions:
Chances of NS happening: 10%
Chances of NH happening: 65%
Chances of neither: 25%


----------



## Deana (Feb 8, 2012)

In before debate over Sasuke being evil and Sakura being stupid for still loving him takes over the thread!
Well, I wonder if Kishi reads ship debate threads and then acts accordingly. LOL

I feel sorry for Sakura too.  She is dragged into the middle of a debate that she wants no apart of.  Cuz it will take a spell straight from Harry Potter, Merlin, and a voodoo queen, combined, to convince me that she has the ability to have romantic feelings for Naruto. And there is nothing wrong/evil/mean with her because she does not have the ability to fall for Naruto.  He is just not her type.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Not if it becomes canon like this
> 
> Sorry I didn't reply to your earlier post, but it started to snowball again  and it's too late for me to LAP at anyone who isn't being outright crazy.



No worries, totally understandable.


----------



## ~Gesy~ (Feb 8, 2012)

thing is, the end of the world is near, don't think it's the time for naruto to be thinking about girls.

Kishi wrote Hinata determined to express her feelings when the time is right, while Sakura just expressed wanting to be useful. I don't know, it doesn't seem like Sakura's relationship would blossom to anything more than siblings, Naruto would never accept her because of her feelings for Sasuke. maybe the scene of her confession was to show the end of that path. 

the ball seems to be in hinata's court for the time being,but who knows how it'll end or if it will even come to a conclusion.


----------



## Sygurgh (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuke is evil and Sakura is stupid for still being in love with him.

Sakura has some romantic attachments to Naruto, but they are being overshadowed by Sasuke. I think she’d be happy for Naruto if he got together with Hinata (“In a ‘I never deserved him, Hinata has always loved him and can make him happier’ kind of way).


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> NS was looking like the most likely option for a long time and then it crashed and burned spectacularly when it turned out all of the supposed development it had experienced was worth jack.
> 
> Now it's a pile of ashes that flare up on occassion.
> 
> ...



You say that you were a NS fan that was the pairing you supported before...
Ok if you was a NarSak how can you ignore this fact.
Important person in Naruto's life..
NH is only about Hinata but nothing on naruto's side plus a big fact that there are not good friends. Put Hinata and Sakura in a Balance and see wich of the two have more influence on him and more important to him....

Important person in Sakura's life..
SS Sakura onside on Sasuke clearly doesn't care, it implais a lot of hate, plus Sakura doesn't understand him and the reason she love him... we put Naruto and Sasuke on a balance and she choose Naruto, but she really love Sasuke?
does that make any sense.

Narusaku we know that they care about each other, she lied to him and know she is the worse person ever... they are best friends they care about each other, they know each other and they have the the 2 biggest bond in this manga...
Sakura doesn't loved Naruto thats a big lie we know she loves Sasuke a lot more but she hasn't state that she don't love Naruto she stated that she love Sasuke when they ask about the guy she like.

You say that Hinatas will be address, but why will he end with her knowing that doesn't feel the same way, didn't Naruto say that he hate people that lie to themself? I think you need to know the person in a personal level. Again you say that you were a NaruSaku shipper you should know that Sakura has a lot more impact on Naruto....but NH for you is more canon to you does that make any sense?

Sakura, Naruto and Sasuke have a bigger role in the manga the last two have the biggest. What is Hinata's role Love Naruto give me another reason for her character.


----------



## Deana (Feb 8, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> Sasuke is evil and Sakura is stupid for still being in love with him.
> Sakura has some romantic attachments to Naruto, but they are being overshadowed by Sasuke.


Even if the mythical Sasuke never existed, I don't believe Sakura would fall for Naruto.  She does not feel that way about him.  There is just some guys a girl doesn't have feelings in that way for.  It would just be somebody else.


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## Sygurgh (Feb 8, 2012)

I don’t believe she’d fall for Naruto either, but you don’t have to be in love with someone to have romantic attachments for them. I’ve never been in love with any of my girlfriends, sadly.


----------



## Deana (Feb 8, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> I don’t believe she’d fall for Naruto either, but you don’t have to be in love with someone to have romantic attachments for them. I’ve never been in love with any of my girlfriends, sadly.


You are you and Sakura is herself. ^_^  
I personally would not waste time with someone I did not feel an attraction for but that is the type of person I am.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> You say that you were a NS fan that was the pairing you supported before...
> Ok if you was a NarSak how can you ignore this fact.
> Important person in Naruto's life..
> NH is only about Hinata but nothing on naruto's side plus a big fact that there are not good friends. Put Hinata and Sakura in a Balance and see wich of the two have more influence on him and more important to him....



If Sakura doesn't love him the relationship isn't going anywhere. Doesn't matter how close they are as friends if that's all it's ever going to be.



> Important person in Sakura's life..
> SS Sakura onside on Sasuke clearly doesn't care, it implais a lot of hate, plus Sakura doesn't understand him and the reason she love him... we put Naruto and Sasuke on a balance and she choose Naruto, but she really love Sasuke?
> does that make any sense.



No, it doesn't, but it is what it is.

You can't question the word of the author, when he says things are a certain way, even if it doesn't make sense to you, that's how it is.

In this case, Sakura loves Sasuke. Even though he's a shitty person, a murderer, terrorist, and general crazy fuck, she still loves him, and not Naruto.

So we readers have to deal with that and accept that.



> Narusaku we know that they care about each other, she lied to him and know she is the worse person ever... they are best friends they care about each other, they know each other and they have the the 2 biggest bond in this manga...
> Sakura doesn't loved Naruto thats a big lie we know she loves Sasuke a lot more but she hasn't state that she don't love Naruto she stated that she love Sasuke when they ask about the guy she like.



If she loves Sasuke why would she love Naruto?

If you're going to argue something stupid like "SHE LOVES THEM BOTH" you at least have to admit she loves Sasuke more.



> You say that Hinatas will be address, but why will he end with her knowing that doesn't feel the same way, didn't Naruto say that he hate people that lie to themself? I think you need to know the person in a personal level. Again you say that you were a NaruSaku shipper you should know that Sakura has a lot more impact on Naruto....but NH for you is more canon to you does that make any sense?



If Naruto doesn't get with Sakura then he's definitely getting with Hinata.

That's how I see it and that's what looks to be happening.



> Sakura, Naruto and Sasuke have a bigger role in the manga the last two have the biggest. What is Hinata's role Love Naruto give me another reason for her character.



See above. Importance doesn't matter when it comes to this. If Sasuke and Sakura get together, Naruto's out of the loop anyway. Hinata is his only other romantic option.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Uhh... I'm not entirely sure how you're getting this impression Deana, although my gut is screaming that it's a topic hugely open to bias.

Not to mention the obvious 'Naruto would never fall in love with Hinata, she just isn't his type'.


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## Sygurgh (Feb 8, 2012)

Sakura is more in love in Sasuke than she in Naruto but I believe she loves Naruto a lot more than Sasuke. If she had to save one I don’t doubt that she’d choose Naruto in a heartbeat.


----------



## Benzaiten (Feb 8, 2012)

I'm surprised how easy it is for a lot of people to just downright ignore Naruto's feelings.

Oh wait, I'm not surprised.


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## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Deana said:


> Even if the mythical Sasuke never existed, I don't believe Sakura would fall for Naruto.  She does not feel that way about him.  There is just some guys a girl doesn't have feelings in that way for.  It would just be somebody else.



I could say the same about

Sasuke>>>>Sakura
Naruto>>>>Hinata 

at this point but I don't see you making strong stament on the other two. Why is that?

You don't need to be deeply in love with someone to love them after but is a lot diferente when you try to kill them no mistake there.

The only thing you need is haven some romantic feeling for the person and knowing that she will always treat you right.

NaruHina and NaruSaku has that the only problrm with Hinata is that she doesn't care about who Naruto like she doesn't respect his feeling but she will always treat him right. Just Like Naruto>>sakura


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## ♥Red♥ (Feb 8, 2012)

If Hinata doesn't die ,the chance of Naruhina happening would be really high ,of course It's unlikely for Naruto to fall for Hinata ,since Sakura was/is his first love and Sakura and Hinata don't have any similarities at all but on the other side it would be a fuck you to every Hinatas fan ,since Hinata has finally the courage to think about holding Narutos hands and It wouldn't be a nice devolpment (yeah devolment for a girl in this manga means sth. that involves someone with a cock ,but thats how it is)if she talks about it but doesn't make it real.


What pisses me off is that people think Naruhina happening means =Sasusaku


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## ~Gesy~ (Feb 8, 2012)

Naruto said he was going to change hyuuga, who knew he was going to do it from the inside  of hinata:amazed


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## Deana (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Uhh... I'm not entirely sure how you're getting this impression Deana, although my gut is screaming that it's a topic hugely open to bias.
> 
> Not to mention the obvious 'Naruto would never fall in love with Hinata, she just isn't his type'.


Well I submit to you that Kishi has not defined Naruto's feelings for Sakura and/or Hinata for a very long time.  But in the case of Sakura, he has gone beyond the call of duty, as of late, to declare that she is not into Naruto in that way.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Benzaiten said:


> I'm surprised how easy it is for a lot of people to just downright ignore Naruto's feelings.
> 
> Oh wait, I'm not surprised.



You shouldn't be, Sakura herself did just that until recently.


----------



## OGkush (Feb 8, 2012)

Deana said:


> Well I submit to you that Kishi has not defined Naruto's feelings for Sakura and/or Hinata for a very long time.  But in the case of Sakura, he has gone beyond the call of duty, as of late, to declare that she is not into Naruto in that way.



it's really something like a "race" between NS and NH, every couple of chapters one is "in the lead", whereas the other pairing doesn't look that likely. It's constantly changing and that's just so he can keep us interested till the end.


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## Huey Freeman (Feb 8, 2012)

One a serious note, Kishi will fix that plot hole when he said the sharingan came from the byakugan , I bet my last dollar the sage of the 6 path wife was an ancestor of the hyuuga.


----------



## Selva (Feb 8, 2012)

I really hope we get a chapter that confirms Naruto is already over Sakura's fugly ass so we can throw this argument into the garbage cause this is like the most important argument NS has against NH: _because he loves her_


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 8, 2012)

Selva said:


> I really hope we get a chapter that confirms Naruto is already over Sakura's fugly ass so we can throw this argument into the garbage cause this is like the most important argument NS has against NH: _because he loves her_





You realise this entire thread has been 'Because she loves him' v2.0?


----------



## Selva (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> You realise this entire thread has been 'Because she loves him' v2.0?


I know  but at least Hinata doesn't get on my nerves like Sakura so if it boils down to which one of them can haz nardo in the end, I'll pick Hinata any day. Personally, I want either Ino or Karin for him but there's no way kishi is going to make me happy


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## Amatérasu’s Son (Feb 8, 2012)

A shinobi must see beneath the underneath. Therefore, Hidden Option 


As for the argument at hand, clearly Hinata is his best option.

I mean seriously, this is the ninja world. You need a ride or die chick. Hinata is ride or *die*. Without hesitation.

And to the argument that he loves Sakura, we know what that means. He wants her to have what she wants...Sasuke. And he has proven that that's his position on several occasions.


----------



## izzyisozaki (Feb 8, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> I doubt even the most hardened of SN shippers would imply that Naruto teared up over Sasuke coming out of his coma rather than the display of SS in front of him .
> 
> That is, if I'm reading it right.



Indeed  whoever wrote that is smoking the big one.



> It was conveniently NarSasian of Hydro Spiral though .


GOD THIS  (too bad few people will get this jibe)



Kage said:


> my thing is this.
> 
> this is the most panel time hinata has been given since the chuunin exams and during this time it has been emphasized how she lives and _breathes_ for naruto. if kishi doesn't intend to go anywhere with this he's done one hell of a job building her character into the most pitiful little creature ever.
> 
> ...



I don't see how it's different for any other side character with a love interest. Hinata has even less panel time than Lee and Karin, the main reason her truluv is the only shit that matters with her.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> If Sakura doesn't love him the relationship isn't going anywhere. Doesn't matter how close they are as friends if that's all it's ever going to be.


If Sasuke doesn't love her that doesn't implay the same?




First Tsurugi said:


> No, it doesn't, but it is what it is.
> 
> You can't question the word of the author, when he says things are a certain way, even if it doesn't make sense to you, that's how it is.
> 
> ...


You need to understand that he don't love her he try to kill her you forget that.




First Tsurugi said:


> If she loves Sasuke why would she love Naruto?
> 
> If you're going to argue something stupid like "SHE LOVES THEM BOTH" you at least have to admit she loves Sasuke more.


Yes is I acknowlage that a long time ago Sakura feeling for Sasuke over shodow her feeling for Naruto even when there are more genuine
Take away her feeling for sasuke and SS would not be even breathing, thats not got for Kishi he whant to milk the pairing until the end... can you Say the Same about Naruto>>>>Hinata
Sasuke>>>>>Sakura? no. as I say before that confession and Yamato unfinished sentence tells me something else.




First Tsurugi said:


> If Naruto doesn't get with Sakura then he's definitely getting with Hinata.
> 
> That's how I see it and that's what looks to be happening.



But you say Sakura loves Sasuke a lot than what she love Naruto doesn't Naruto loves Sakura thanany living girl? besides his gesture is what matters he clearly care more about her I strongly feel she will choose him at the end if she is gaven that option.... he will put her happiness before his own doesn't that send a message.




First Tsurugi said:


> See above. Importance doesn't matter when it comes to this. If Sasuke and Sakura get together, Naruto's out of the loop anyway. Hinata is his only other romantic option.


I will never put Sakura or Sasuke before Naruto and I stronly believe that Sasuke knows that Naruto likes Sakura...that will be the best way for him to return the favor----- in you view Sakura will be selfish at the end, Sasuke will be selfish at the end, and who the hell care about Nardo right..


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## Dragonus Nesha (Feb 8, 2012)

That's enough!
Either discuss the topic or don't post.
No more comments about each other or the thread itself.​


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## Kage (Feb 8, 2012)

izzyisozaki said:


> I don't see how it's different for any other side character with a love interest. Hinata has even less panel time than Lee and Karin, the main reason her truluv is the only shit that matters with her.



I'm not saying i can't be wrong love, or even to expect NH to be endgame. these are just the vibes it's given me 

the fact that more aren't mourning the loss of any individuality she possessed in favor of is not lost on me.


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## takL (Feb 8, 2012)

i knew it!

"your eyes are telling!"


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## son_michael (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> I see nothing that suggests Sakura thinks of Naruto as anything more than a friend, in spite of the "moments" they've shared. If she truly felt more for him there would have been genuine feeling behind that bullshit confession of hers, but there was none, and Naruto could see that.



that's not true at all. Naruto was angry at her because he knew she was lying about not wanting to save Sasuke, about not loving Sasuke...it had NOTHING to do with the fact that she was lying about her feelings for him. there were no implications she was lying about him, look at the panels, she smiles when she talks about how wonderful he is to her and how great of a man he has become. THERE IS AN ENTIRE MANGA WORTH of development for Naru Saku, the romantic feelings and subtext are there, kishi has made it where Sakura could conceivably realize she's been in love with Naruto all along. 

and lets not forget, the confession was for NARUTO'S SAKE, it was an unselfish move by Sakura to spare him the pain of fighting/killing Sasuke


what a bitch


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> If Sasuke doesn't love her that doesn't implay the same?



No because Sakura will continue to love him regardless. And Naruto will put aside his feelings because of that.



> You need to understand that he don't love her he try to kill her you forget that.



That apparently had no effect on her.



> Yes is I acknowlage that a long time ago Sakura feeling for Sasuke over shodow her feeling for Naruto even when there are more genuine
> Take away her feeling for sasuke and SS would not be even breathing, thats not got for Kishi he whant to milk the pairing until the end... can you Say the Same about Naruto>>>>Hinata
> Sasuke>>>>>Sakura? no. as I say before that confession and Yamato unfinished sentence tells me something else.



You need to stop living in denial, it was not long ago that it was stated, blatantly, that Sakura still loves Sasuke and doesn't love Naruto.



> But you say Sakura loves Sasuke a lot than what she love Naruto doesn't Naruto loves Sakura thanany living girl? besides his gesture is what matters he clearly care more about her I strongly feel she will choose him at the end if she is gaven that option.... he will put her happiness before his own doesn't that send a message.



Naruto's feelings for Sakura are apparently irrelevant to her.

He can either keep chasing her or move on, and there's a lot more indicating he'll go with the latter option than the former.



> I will never put Sakura or Sasuke before Naruto and I stronly believe that Sasuke knows that Naruto likes Sakura...that will be the best way for him to return the favor----- in you view Sakura will be selfish at the end, Sasuke will be selfish at the end, and who the hell care about Nardo right..



Naruto will never accept Sakura if her feelings are not genuine, the fake confession showed that.

The question is if Sakura is even capable of developing romantic feelings for Naruto in the first place, because by all accounts she has not yet.



son_michael said:


> that's not true at all. Naruto was angry at her because he knew she was lying about not wanting to save Sasuke, about not loving Sasuke...it had NOTHING to do with the fact that she was lying about her feelings for him. there were no implications she was lying about him, look at the panels, she smiles when she talks about how wonderful he is to her and how great of a man he has become. THERE IS AN ENTIRE MANGA WORTH of development for Naru Saku, the romantic feelings and subtext are there, kishi has made it where Sakura could conceivably realize she's been in love with Naruto all along.



You're just selectively interpreting things.

"Oh, she was lying about Sasuke, but the parts about Naruto were genuine, really!"

No, the fact that she lied about how she felt towards Sasuke clearly indicates she was lying about everything.



> and lets not forget, the confession was for NARUTO'S SAKE, it was an unselfish move by Sakura to spare him the pain of fighting/killing Sasuke
> 
> what a bitch



She deceived him, her reasons for doing so are irrelevant.


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## izzyisozaki (Feb 8, 2012)

Kage said:


> I'm not saying i can't be wrong love, or even to expect NH to be endgame. these are just the vibes it's given me



I could be wrong, but there is practically nothing that justifies this wank. Hinata's say in things is not the Holy Word. It's the same contrived bullshit of 437 that tries to make it look like an obligation for Naruto to be with her when he could give less of a shit romantically.



> the fact that more aren't mourning the loss of any individuality she possessed in favor of is not lost on me.



the funeral for that was a long time ago for anyone who actually cared.


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## Prince of Pop (Feb 8, 2012)

NaruHina is getting close and I can feel and when it happens. I'll be the 9000x HAPPY!!!


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## son_michael (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> You're just selectively interpreting things.
> 
> "Oh, she was lying about Sasuke, but the parts about Naruto were genuine, really!"
> 
> No, the fact that she lied about how she felt towards Sasuke clearly indicates she was lying about everything.



I could say the same of you, your interpreting that Naruto now dislikes her because she lied about liking him. Naruto never said that, all he said was he dislikes people that lie to themselves. Sure lets let that override everything else that's happened between them and lets interpret it as "I don't like you anymore" instead of you know...actually assuming its about Sasuke who the whole damn conversation was about.





> She deceived him, her reasons for doing so are irrelevant.




they're ninja. Ninja deceive, hell people deceive. Most people will torture themselves about staying with their cheating lovers, that's the shit that's potentially unforgivable. Here Sakura told a lie to protect him, big woop.


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## Gortef (Feb 8, 2012)

Damnit girl, is it ok to such thoughts in the middle of a battlezone. Holding hands is almost equally lewd as having sex in public


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> I could say the same of you, your interpreting that Naruto now dislikes her because she lied about liking him. Naruto never said that, all he said was he dislikes people that lie to themselves. Sure lets that override everything else that's happened between them and lets interpret it as "I don't like you anymore" instead of you know...actually assuming its about Sasuke who the whole damn conversation was about.



I never said Naruto dislikes her, you don't know what you're talking about. 



> they're ninja. Ninja deceive, hell people deceive. Most people will torture themselves about staying with their cheating lovers, that's the shit that's potentially unforgivable. Here Sakura told a lie to protect him, big woop.



They're supposed to be friends.

Practically lovers, according to you.

Aren't they supposed to trust one another? 

Lying shouldn't be necessary if they were truly that close, and if Sakura really cared for and respected him that much.


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## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> that's not true at all. Naruto was angry at her because he knew she was lying about not wanting to save Sasuke, about not loving Sasuke...it had NOTHING to do with the fact that she was lying about her feelings for him. there were no implications she was lying about him, look at the panels, she smiles when she talks about how wonderful he is to her and how great of a man he has become. THERE IS AN ENTIRE MANGA WORTH of development for Naru Saku, the romantic feelings and subtext are there, kishi has made it where Sakura could conceivably realize she's been in love with Naruto all along.
> 
> and lets not forget, the confession was for NARUTO'S SAKE, it was an unselfish move by Sakura to spare him the pain of fighting/killing Sasuke
> 
> ...




Pairing wank logit say that she doesn't love him.....

Sakura>>>>Naruto
Sasuke>>>>Sakura
Naruto>>>>Hinata

are the Same but with of the three care more in a genuine way for the other person.....

Wich one off the 4 character will step back because all he want to see is the other one Happy.

Wich of the 4 trusts the other side deeply.

Kishi can maka any pairing at this time because it's his Manga, but if whe ask with one make more sense I say NaruSaku for obvios reasons. 
Wich one has no focus and both side but positive development NaruHina
SasuSaku can die for I care.

Keep this in mind*** Naruto is over Sakura = NaruHina

Sakura doesn't have any romantic feelings for Naruto even when whe gave a more genuine reoson to like him, than what she use to love Sasuke= all off the pairing are onesided, but NaruHina has the most positive Development. = NH.

They go hand and hand.......


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## Kage (Feb 8, 2012)

izzyisozaki said:


> I could be wrong, but there is practically nothing that justifies this wank. Hinata's say in things is not the Holy Word. It's the same contrived bullshit of 437 that tries to make it look like an obligation for Naruto to be with her when he could give less of a shit romantically.


I agree. Difference is, then i didn't expect she cared whether or not it would be reciprocated. This is not even about trying to be as strong as he is anymore or to get him to acknowledge that as the person she admires/loves (because he already has) the initial reason she was drawn to him in the first place. She's really just pushing for a fucking _date_ and it's just like 'oh lawd' 

I use to think better of hinata. I was wrong. Naruto doesn't owe her shit. I still firmly believe that even if i do think kishi would basically be trolling her character hard if her insistence is for naught.



> the funeral for that was a long time ago for anyone who actually cared.


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## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> *No because Sakura will continue to love him regardless. And Naruto will put aside his feelings because of that.*
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Really I live in denail... I think is all the way aroun the Manga is there I was not the one that make it I only check her character Sakura Naruto vs. Naruto hinata and Sasuke Sakura


Sakura care about Naruto the most between Naruto>>Hinata Sasuke>>Sakura
*Denail*




I really don't know if you are Serious anymore...


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## son_michael (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> I never said Naruto dislikes her, you don't know what you're talking about.



then please clarify how the confession killed Naru Saku when you don't believe it made Naruto stop liking her romantically. Its manga fact that the confession was for Naruto's sake.





> They're supposed to be friends.
> 
> Practically lovers, according to you.
> 
> ...



never did I say they were practically lovers. I said they have had a budding romance since part 1 and all the way through part 2. to the point where she considered going out with him, she hand fed him, she winked at him and posed in a seductive way asking him how she looked etc etc. Too many times to list...point is their romance has yet to blossom and its her fault for still holding on to Sasuke.

People aren't perfect. Even if you know you should have total trust, you wont. There will be a small part of you that is suspicious, a part that wants to deceive, a part that wants to cheat etc, its human nature. I hope you seriously don't believe you will never lie to your spouse or keep something from him/her to protect them. 


people make mistakes, nothing Sakura did was unforgivable which I assume your saying her confession was to Naruto..hence why i said "you think he dislikes Sakura"


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH I seriously don't even know what you're saying anymore, sorry.



son_michael said:


> then pleas eclarify how the confession killed Naru Saku when you don't believe it made Naruto stop liking her romantically. Its manga fact that the confession was for Naruto's sake.



The confession and Sakura's actions afterwards made it clear she is still in love with Sasuke and doesn't love Naruto, so despite all the supposed development NaruSaku had throughout all of Part 2 it didn't make any difference because Sakura's feelings are basically the same as they were at the end of Part 1.



> never did I say they were practically lovers. I said they have had a budding romance since part 1 and all the way through part 2. to the point where she considered going out with him, she hand fed him, she winked at him and posed in a seductive way asking him how she looked etc etc. Too many times to list...point is their romance has yet to blossom and its her fault for still holding on to Sasuke.



And my point is if she's held onto Sasuke for this long, what is going to make her ditch him?

As far as I can see there is nothing that would make her do that.

Sasuke falling to the dark side wasn't enough, growing closer to Naruto wasn't enough.



> People aren't perfect. Even if you know you should have total trust, you wont. There will be a small part of you that is suspicious, a part that wants to deceive, a part that wants to cheat etc, its human nature. I hope you seriously don't believe you will never lie to your spouse or keep something from him/her to protect them
> 
> people make mistakes, nothing Sakura did was unforgivable which I assume your saying her confession was to Naruto..hence why i said "you think he dislikes Sakura"



My issue with her lying is it shows she really hasn't changed at all. She still feels the same about Sasuke (love) she still feels the same about Naruto (friendship).

I used to think she had matured and grown to the point where she'd realize Sasuke was an ass and would logically stop loving him.

But I was wrong.


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## Ryuzaki (Feb 8, 2012)

As a general statement, I don't see where people are contriving the whole Sakura loves Naruto. I thought the moment Naruto told her, he hates people that cannot get their shit together. It was over for her? 

Was there a chapter or pages after the summit that I am missing? 





First Tsurugi said:


> My issue with her lying is it shows she really hasn't changed at all. She still feels the same about Sasuke (love) she still feels the same about Naruto (friendship).
> 
> *I used to think she had matured and grown to the point where she'd realize Sasuke was an ass and would logically stop loving him.*
> 
> But I was wrong.


Women don't do that in real life, you expected something different in the manga?


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Ryuzaki said:


> Women don't do that in real life, you expected something different in the manga?



Yeah I know, silly me.


----------



## OGkush (Feb 8, 2012)

Prince of Pop said:


> NaruHina is getting close and I can feel and when it happens. I'll be the 9000x HAPPY!!!



it's gonna be over 9000?


----------



## Kakugo (Feb 8, 2012)

Benzaiten said:


> I'm surprised how easy it is for a lot of people to just downright ignore Naruto's feelings.
> 
> Oh wait, I'm not surprised.



Nothing new, of course.  Hinata's one-sided banter is the only thing that's ever mattered.


----------



## Talis (Feb 8, 2012)

Sighhhhhhhh...
You guys never read a manga before or wtf?
I am not a NaruHina NaruSasu SasuNaru hater or whatever but could you please stopping taking every statement for real.
That statement actually raises her probablity of death to 70%.


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## son_michael (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> The confession and Sakura's actions afterwards made it clear she is still in love with Sasuke and doesn't love Naruto, so despite all the supposed development NaruSaku had throughout all of Part 2 it didn't make any difference because Sakura's feelings are basically the same as they were at the end of Part 1.



but there's nothing that makes it clear that she doesn't hold similar feelings for Naruto. Instead of throwing away all the Naru saku development, you should use it to back up that she might hold romantic feelings for him. Nothing gets discarded until it is flat out stated that she does not like Naruto more than a friend/brother. She has never stated that to anybody or herself. 





> And my point is if she's held onto Sasuke for this long, what is going to make her ditch him?
> 
> As far as I can see there is nothing that would make her do that.
> 
> Sasuke falling to the dark side wasn't enough, growing closer to Naruto wasn't enough.



maybe seeing Naruto about to die at Sasuke's hands? Maybe seeing him stand atop a mountain while everyone looks up at him is the savior? The moment of romantic realization cna occur at any time, and it would be believable because of all the development Naru Saku went through.





> My issue with her lying is it shows she really hasn't changed at all. She still feels the same about Sasuke (love) she still feels the same about Naruto (friendship).
> 
> I used to think she had matured and grown to the point where she'd realize Sasuke was an ass and would logically stop loving him.
> 
> But I was wrong.



I thought that too, now I think she will simply choose the person she really loves over the other one whom she also loves. Of course, I'm talking about Naruto.

but I argue wholeheartedly that she feels more for him than friendship



and hey while I was reading this chapter again I saw a Naru Saku hint if ever I did see one!

" Naruto, this time we're going be together, *not just me* we're going to all fight together this time!"


----------



## Rinoa (Feb 8, 2012)

I think at least for now, if Kishi is thinking about adding a little romance at the end of the manga, NH is the pairing most likely to happen.
None of the R12 are going to die, neither Hinata nor any other.


----------



## Kek (Feb 8, 2012)

loool3 said:


> Sighhhhhhhh...
> You guys never read a manga before or wtf?
> I am not a NaruHina NaruSasu SasuNaru hater or whatever but could you please stopping taking every statement for real.
> That statement actually raises her probablity of death to 70%.



You're reading the wrong manga if you think anyone from the K12 is going to die.


----------



## ~Gesy~ (Feb 8, 2012)

@ son
Honestly I think both pairings are badly written, first off I don't think sakura feels for naruto as much as hinata does. I think if sasuke somehow goes back to the light she will return to being his number 1 fan. her confession was so terrible,she was forced into saying out of guilt and it wasn't heartfelt at all. All she spoke of is sasuke's and naruto's status as ninjas and how Naruto is the better choice. It felt like she forced her self because she felt how bad it is to still hold on to sasuke.

Hinata have deeper feelings for naruto But that pairing is so ill developed, The last time she really interacted with him was the chuunin exams, which is pretty sad. I understand that naruto is barely stays in the village  for more than a few days nowadays though.


----------



## Hitt (Feb 8, 2012)

Kage said:


> the fact that more aren't mourning the loss of any individuality she possessed in favor of is not lost on me.



This is shocking to me too.

I mean, if you're an actual Hinata fan and not just wanking the pairing, how can this be considered a good thing?

Her character was completely assassinated this chapter.  Forget her family, he friends, her village.  It's all about Naruto and only Naruto, and whether she can get in his pants.

This puts her on a level of fail every bit as bad as Sakura.  Maybe even _worse_.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> DONJOSEPH I seriously don't even know what you're saying anymore, sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





What I say Sasuke doesn't love Sakura there is the prove and there are many more....but you still see SasuSaku because of Sakura love...

Who is more in denail again I see de negative in NaruSaku and the fact that Sakura doesn't love him but she has some feelings for him that are more than friedship can you say that about the other two? NO. What will happen if she drop her feeling for Sasuke and Start lovin Narito for obvios reasons don't you think pairing wank will be over.....her lovin Sasuke doesn't make any sense and she knows on Sasuke hate her gots.


Sakura love him that statement doesn't make any sense if she love him, but she will still choose Naruto life over Sasukes life.




I tell you I read the manga with out bias, how in the hell she love Sasuke but when he is about to kill himself along side Naruto she scream Naruto....
and when the rookies say that they was planing to kill Sasuke she could only thing and how to help Naruto, dont forget that she may still have those feelings for Sasuke but she give up on him many times...... Show me where Sakura say that the doesn't love Naruto since part two show me one panel were she disproves her feeling for him after her confession...


----------



## Raikage (Feb 8, 2012)

Good, Sakura should die old and alone.


----------



## Hitt (Feb 8, 2012)

Muahahahah.

The "church" in the background is a nice touch.


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2012)

Hitt said:


> This is shocking to me too.
> 
> I mean, if you're an actual Hinata fan and not just wanking the pairing, how can this be considered a good thing?
> 
> ...



If NaruHina does not become canon then Hinata's life is forfeit...as is her entire character.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> but there's nothing that makes it clear that she doesn't hold similar feelings for Naruto. Instead of throwing away all the Naru saku development, you should use it to back up that she might hold romantic feelings for him. Nothing gets discarded until it is flat out stated that she does not like Naruto more than a friend/brother. She has never stated that to anybody or herself.



Her confession to Naruto basically spells it out.

When she's "confessing" all Naruto can think about is how much she loves Sasuke. He knows she's lying to him about liking him, and that she really likes Sasuke.



> maybe seeing Naruto about to die at Sasuke's hands? Maybe seeing him stand atop a mountain while everyone looks up at him is the savior? The moment of romantic realization cna occur at any time, and it would be believable because of all the development Naru Saku went through.



Speculation at best.

She's aware that Sasuke's tried to kill him before, and even witnessed it once or twice.

She was there when he saved Konoha from Pain and it didn't change anything.

Face it, if their development hasn't produced results already, it's not going to period.



> I thought that too, now I think she will simply choose the person she really loves over the other one whom she also loves. Of course, I'm talking about Naruto.
> 
> but I argue wholeheartedly that she feels more for him than friendship
> 
> ...



Like I said, what she feels for Sasuke doesn't compare to what she feels for Naruto. Even Naruto is aware of this.



Hitt said:


> This puts her on a level of fail every bit as bad as Sakura.  Maybe even _worse_.



No one is as fail as Sakura, don't even joke about that.


----------



## lain2501 (Feb 8, 2012)

Sakura : "Naruto I love you"
Naruto : "You're kidding right?"

Hinata : "I want to be yours"
Naruto : "I love you, let's make babies"


----------



## Hitt (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> No one is as fail as Sakura, don't even joke about that.



Who said I was joking?

Name one other thing Hinata has thought about the entirety of part II other than Naruto.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Hitt said:


> Who said I was joking?
> 
> Name one other thing Hinata has thought about the entirety of part II other than Naruto.



You're criticizing her for thinking about Naruto in the one chapter where literally everyone is thinking about Naruto?

This is like the one chapter where her thoughts _aren't_ out of place.


----------



## gabzilla (Feb 8, 2012)

loool3 said:


> Sighhhhhhhh...
> You guys never read a manga before or wtf?
> I am not a NaruHina NaruSasu SasuNaru hater or whatever but could you please stopping taking every statement for real.
> *That statement actually raises her probablity of death to 70%*.



I feel deja vu 




Kage said:


> I'm not saying i can't be wrong love, or even to expect NH to be endgame. these are just the vibes it's given me
> 
> the fact that more aren't mourning the loss of any individuality she possessed in favor of is not lost on me.



I already mourned that.

This is one of the few chapters were it's not out of place, though, since all the other rookie were thinking about Naruto.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

denail again Hinata think about Naruto Kun all the time......


----------



## Hitt (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> This is like the one chapter where her thoughts _aren't_ out of place.



And yet, she still has to outdo them by saying she wants his dick, essentially.

Also, you just stated my point for me.  She's a one trick pony that only can think about loving Naruto.  Her character has about as much depth as a line segment.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Hitt said:


> And yet, she still has to outdo them by saying she wants his dick, essentially.



Well yeah, that's why we have this thread.



> Also, you just stated my point for me.  She's a one trick pony that only can think about loving Naruto.  Her character has about as much depth as a line segment.



And yet she's still better than Sakura.

But we're getting off topic. This thread isn't about that.


----------



## Dokiz1 (Feb 8, 2012)

gabzilla said:


> This is one of the few chapters were it's not out of place, though, since all the other rookie were thinking about Naruto.



Not getting in his pants though.


----------



## gabzilla (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> But we're getting off topic. This thread isn't about that.



Silly, all Hinata/Sakura threads are about which one is better than the other one. 



Dokiz1 said:


> Not getting in his pants though.



...and? They are all thinking about Naruto. Would it bother you less if Hinata was still thinking about Naruto - and only about Naruto, not her family, or her friends or her non-Naruto goals - if it was platonic?

Mhh...


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Dokiz1 said:


> Not getting in his pants though.



I know right, holding hands, what the fuck.

Isn't this a children's manga? Kishimoto's a sick fuck.


----------



## MasterSitsu (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> I know right, holding hands, what the fuck.
> 
> Isn't this a children's manga? Kishimoto's a sick fuck.


That Hinata is such gutter slut.


----------



## Kage (Feb 8, 2012)

gabzilla said:


> I already mourned that.
> 
> This is one of the few chapters were it's not out of place, though, since all the other rookie were thinking about Naruto.



yes, it appears i missed the funeral some time ago 

still, even if it were any hinata monologue would remain unchanged i'm sure


----------



## Summers (Feb 8, 2012)

MasterSitsu said:


> That Hinata is such gutter slut.



Why people hating on sluts. I love em. Public service what they do.


----------



## gabzilla (Feb 8, 2012)

Kage said:


> yes, it appears i missed the funeral some time ago
> 
> still, even if it were any hinata monologue would remain unchanged i'm sure



I was a very private affair, ok? 

I'm sure. Is not like Kishimoto cares to develop any of the rookies other than Shikamaru. He probably has a list of default sentences for each one of them.


----------



## Corvida (Feb 8, 2012)

son_michael said:


> and hey while I was reading this chapter again I saw a Naru Saku hint if ever I did see one!
> 
> " Naruto, this time we're going be together, *not just me* we're going to all fight together this time!"



Oh yes,* NOT JUST HER*, just ALL TOGETHER NOW-how awfully romantic and personal- She?s either referencing the Konoha savior... or  maybe planning a Rookie orgy.

" WE  BRING THE BOOZE, NARUTO!!

puxa Asturias


----------



## Louchan (Feb 8, 2012)

Dat love competition.


----------



## Sera (Feb 8, 2012)

I love how Hinata's character development is always revolves around Naruto. She's becoming a very irrelevant character.


----------



## jdbzkh (Feb 8, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> But Sakura already knows how he feels about her. Him telling her what she already knows isn't going to change anything.



Woah this is so wrong Sakura was told by Sai that Naruto loves her. Almost every one knows or at least gets that feeling they care deeply about one another. However this is the biggest thing and a true game changer.

Every one likes to point at the confession and say "Well that's the end of that." However there is some truth in her words. She's happy and feels safe around him. That's something she can't say about Sasuke. She's free to be herself with Naruto, throwout part one Sakura acted as the woman she thought Sasuke wanted. 

Naruto has one thing that no other male has when it comes to Sakura. He loves her cause of who she is. He loves Sakura cause deep down they are very similar and he'd even go as far to step outta the way to make her happy. When the whole Sasuke issue is taken care of Naruto's actions will decide where the pairings go. 

If he walks up to Sakura and tells her how he truly feels she might end up getting that fairy tale romance she's always wanted. Let's not forget that Sakura wants a guy to love her for her. Some one that would say those cheesy lines and kiss that forehead of hers. 

Can we really picture Sasuke being that guy? Nah that's why I will always say this, the pairing wars will be decided by Naruto's feelings. If he loves Sakura he will end up with her. If he's dropped his feelings for her then that will open up all other pairings making NaruHina seem all the more likely. 

However there is this little thing that Kishi loves it's called foreshadowing & we have two chapters showing us where Naruto's life is going 


*Spoiler*: __ 




size of the barrier




Here we have Jiraiya thinking back on his life how he couldn't get the girl or save his friend. Naruto will accomplish all the things Jiraiya couldn't.


*Spoiler*: __ 




size of the barrier




Now this one is one of my favorites cause its obvious that Naruto's character really hit his stride after meeting his mother. Her last words regarding his love life was to find some one like her. It's pretty clear which female is similar to Kushina at the very least closest to her. 

So when we look at these two chapters and reexamine Kishi's style it's not hard to picture NaruSaku happening but once again, the pairing wars will be decided by Naruto's feelings. 

If he still loves Sakura his confession will be the one that stands out over the rest.


----------



## xiaojiang (Feb 8, 2012)

I gotta admit, I haven't though too much of pairings of late but this chapter did make me think NaruHina.


----------



## Lelouch71 (Feb 8, 2012)

New year same kind of thread. Kishi was cock teasing the pairing fans like always. If anything Naruto x harem is becoming more likely.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

jdbzkh said:


> Woah this is so wrong Sakura was told by Sai that Naruto loves her. Almost every one knows or at least gets that feeling they care deeply about one another. However this is the biggest thing and a true game changer.
> 
> Every one likes to point at the confession and say "Well that's the end of that." However there is some truth in her words. She's happy and feels safe around him. That's something she can't say about Sasuke. She's free to be herself with Naruto, throwout part one Sakura acted as the woman she thought Sasuke wanted.
> 
> ...




Well I been trying to Say that for a long time know but who care about Naruto right.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

Still with the Kushina reference....


----------



## Eikichi Onizuka (Feb 8, 2012)

What Jd said is right and no one seems to look at the actual evidence when it comes to predicting pairings. Throughout the whole manga has Naruto shown any feelings of love or even wanting to be in a relationship with Hinata, nope. This pairing is so one sided that if they did end up together i would feel cheated for both characters. Naruto picking Hinata is him settling period because that's not the girl he loves, just the girl that was left and always wanted him. 

The thing is I would have been fine with this pairing if he got over Sakura from part 1 but that doesnt seem like it at all. In fact his feelings are either the same or even greater. The guy keeps on putting himself in harms way and just acting downward foolish just to bring back Sasuke because he thinks that's what will make Sakura happy. That to me is the definition of true love, when you care more about making the other people happy rather then your own happiness. If that means that she is the happiest without being with him then so be it. 

The story of how his parents got together could have been anything but they way it went hints to much like NaruSaku for me. Kushina falls in love with Minato because he liked one of her attributes that people mad fun of. Come one seriously if that's not foreshadowing what is. Honestly kisi is being a tool for making this seem like a love triangle when it simply isnt. Naruto likes Sakura but we don't know how much Sakura really cares about Naruto. She might actually love him like she said but its an unknown in away. Hinata likes Naruto but he hasn't shown any hints of wanting to be anything but friends with her.


----------



## BlazingCobaltX (Feb 8, 2012)

Louchan said:


> Dat love competition.



Does that mean ShikaNaruChouHina is canon? :ho


----------



## Lelouch71 (Feb 8, 2012)

At this point I don't even know why it still matters to you guys. It's like Mizura said. Whether NaruSaku, NaruHina, SasuSaku, Naruto x whoever happens it's going to suck regardless. There is no victory for any pairing fandom.


----------



## Suigetsu (Feb 8, 2012)

Lelouch71 said:


> At this point I don't even know why it still matters to you guys. It's like Mizura said. Whether NaruSaku, NaruHina, SasuSaku, Naruto x whoever happens it's going to suck regardless. There is no victory for any pairing fandom.



N Nauru Ino ?  it would rock no?

However that aint going to happen except in your wildest dreams.


----------



## shepherd (Feb 8, 2012)

The only way naruto doesn't end up with hinata is if A) She dies which would  feel like a retread of the pain invasion arc, B) She simply loses interest, but why would she? this chapter confirms that after about 600 chapters she's still crushing on him and is even more determined to be with him now, or C) Naruto out right rejects her, which would make Naruto look like a complete asshole. So I don't see kishi doing that. 

Sakura has grown to respect Naruto a great deal, but any romantic feelings she may have for him are tepid at best and Naruto seems to have accepted that.  In fact, part of the reason he wants to bring Sasuke back is for Sakura.


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2012)

Lelouch71 said:


> At this point I don't even know why it still matters to you guys. It's like Mizura said. Whether NaruSaku, NaruHina, SasuSaku, Naruto x whoever happens it's going to suck regardless. There is no victory for any pairing fandom.



I though that bromance(SasuNaru) won already at the very beginning of the manga?

Naruto even has nosebleeds when he recalls that most pleasant moment when he kissed Sasuke ^^


----------



## Louchan (Feb 8, 2012)

Blazing CobaltX said:


> Does that mean ShikaNaruChouHina is canon? :ho


There's waiting, there's walking... what more could canon need?! :ho


----------



## Nuuskis (Feb 8, 2012)

Hinata plans to live her life with Naruto, but Naruto hasn't shown any romantic feelings towards Hinata.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Coman Naruto is just been tsundere with Hinata remenber the secrect date thing....

How can he break her heart she is so sweet.
Whe all know that the never giving up  thing is all a bluff.


----------



## Selva (Feb 8, 2012)

Eikichi Onizuka said:


> In fact his feelings are either the same or even greater. *The guy keeps on putting himself in harms way and just acting downward foolish just to bring back Sasuke because he thinks that's what will make Sakura happy.*


Oh no you didn't! You really didn't just imply Naruto is trying to save Sasuke only for Sakura's sake?


----------



## Danzio (Feb 8, 2012)

Now that Choji is skinny and Kishi's personal favourite, I wouldn't be surprised if he stole her right under Naruto's nose. He's the new chick magnet, because he can *expand* on all the right places. 

Dat Choji.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Still with the Kushina reference....



Parallels and foreshadowing are legitimate plot devices.  NH is trying to say this is foreshadowing (lol), yet how dare any other pairing make a "foreshadowing" argument.  Dont you know?  The manga is all about Hinata.

All I can say is I've yet to see an NH argument that isnt full of double-standards.  It would be nice if someone would just be honest and say they want it to happen because its their OTP, not because it has to happen, or will happen.  At least then you're admitting that there's no real argument for it in the story, but regardless you like it anyway and hope it works out.  Instead anyone who likes NH has to erroneously believe that there's overwhelming proof of it in the manga and that it will become canon.  Naturally, this is a very poor argument..with little backing..and only betrays double-standard after double-standard. Just be honest..seriously.


The only feelings that matter are Naruto's.  He will get what he wants, or he will get nothing.  If he wants Sakura, which he does, that is what he'll get.  If he doesn't get Sakura, then itll be left open.  That is really just the bottom line.  Before you give me the same retarded arguments I'll refute them.

1) Sakura isnt changing her mind, so NH is more possible

Counter:  Naruto isn't changing his mind, therefore NH is the least likely.  Naruto does not want Hinata, has never wanted Hinata, and since he's the main character his feelings are what matter.  The girls' feelings can be changed at will by the author with no explanation simply because they are side characters.

2)  If Sakura changes her mind, Naruto will just be second choice

Counter:  If Naruto changes his mind, Hinata will just be a 2nd choice.  See how easy this is?  I dont care if you think Hinata is a better choice anyway, its still the same logic.  If "second choice" is bad, then "second choice" in NH is also bad.

3)  Hinata has always liked him, so Naruto should get her

Counter:  So what?  Hate to break it to you, but Sakura has done way more for Naruto than Hinata ever has.  Since Sakura has actually been there for Naruto, through *everything*, even when she didnt like him, Naruto should get her.  Especially since Naruto has done the same thing for her in turn.  Hinata and Naruto have hardly done anything for each other, that is a fact.  Almost everything Hinata got from Naruto came by stalking him.


With those facts settled, I'm waiting for an NH fan to come out and represent the fandom properly, without resorting to double-standard arguments fuled with personal bias.  Really, just say you want it to happen cuz you like it, or you think it will happen cuz thats just how you feel.  Giving any arguments like the above is just pitiful, if not outright desperate.


----------



## Ice Sage (Feb 8, 2012)

jdbzkh said:


> Now this one is one of my favorites cause its obvious that Naruto's character really hit his stride after meeting his mother. *Her last words regarding his love life was to find some one like her*. It's pretty clear which female is similar to Kushina at the very least closest to her.


Just saying, he failed allot of her advice.
Why should that last part be an exception that he actually follows.
The trend would be the opposite.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

Ice Sage said:


> Just saying, he failed allot of her advice.
> Why should that last part be an exception that he actually follows.
> The trend would be the opposite.



Umm but he didnt fail her advice, last I checked he loves Sakura, who happens to be like Kushina.  So..there goes that argument.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Give me an example I was looking at that charter an he call out all the reason and say that he will start eating more than just ramen...
and the love Part 
Now a smart thinker will say that if he already has a date with Hinata fron Hinata flassk back in 540 and he sure that she love him why didn't he mention her simple.... love part was left out because he still working on it and you only work on someone you want to win over the right way not Forcing the issue or for selfish reeson.....


----------



## shepherd (Feb 8, 2012)

I should say, i'm no expert on pairings, that's not why I read this manga.  So I don't have a dog in the fight, But I don't see any way for Kishi To avoid making   naruto look like a Jerk if he ends up rejecting Hinata.  Which He would have to if he's not supposed to end up with her.

  As far as "second choices" or "settling" is concerned, it seems to me that the Idea of being with hinata as opposed to being with sakura has grown much more on Naruto, than the idea of being with Naruto as opposed to being with sasuke has grown on sakura.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

shepherd said:


> As far as "second choices" or "settling" is concerned, it seems to me that the Idea of being with hinata as opposed to being with sakura has grown much more on Naruto, than the idea of being with Naruto as opposed to being with sasuke has grown on sakura.



I'd love to see you prove that...cuz Naruto hardly gives Hinata a thought at all lol!  I also find it funny that ppl claim not to be *fans* yet they see things through pairing goggles that only fans could see.  An unbiased third party could not make the statement you just made because its nowhere in the manga.


Just be honest 

And Naruto would not look like a jerk for rejecting Hinata.  Thats moar bias talking.  Contrary to popular belief Hinata is not the center of the universe.  Yes, the little angel can be rejected and no, that doesn't make the guy a jerk.  Owait, Hinata should get everything Hinata wants because, after all, she's the center of the manga.


----------



## Whirlpool (Feb 8, 2012)

Thethiala said:


> More foreshadowing that Rikudo Sennin's wife might've been a Hyuuga too.



I see....

NaruHina is i*c*st....

Just like HashiMito


----------



## Eikichi Onizuka (Feb 8, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> 3)  Hinata has always liked him, so Naruto should get her
> 
> Counter:  So what?  Hate to break it to you, but Sakura has done way more for Naruto than Hinata ever has.  Since Sakura has actually been there for Naruto, through *everything*, even when she didnt like him, Naruto should get her.  Especially since Naruto has done the same thing for her in turn.  Hinata and Naruto have hardly done anything for each other, that is a fact.  Almost everything Hinata got from Naruto came by stalking him.
> 
> ...



Ding ding we have another winner people seem to forget that love is a two way street and I dont know or see any reason at the moment for Naruto be just go out and choose to be with Hinata when she doesn't know him. She knows as much as Ino knows about him so why not Ino people. 

If we put this is real life terms here's what i see. 
Girl A- Shes a girl in your class that has a crush on you. You notice her and are on friendly terms with her but you never really hang out with her or even sat down and had a lengthy conservations with her. All you really know about her is what other people have told you about her and what you see from time to time. She likes you because of what she sees the best part of you that you show the world, but she doesn't know the parts you don't show.

Girl B- Is your friend that you always have had a crush on and she knows this for a fact. She hangs out with you and your other friend who she really likes. You three are around each other for most of the time and she starts to get to know you and realizes she might be wrong about you, but she still likes your bro. Your friend then goes off to do sketch things and you promise her that you will make him walk back on the straight and narrow just so she can be with him so she is happy. Thing is your friend has gotten himself way to deep into whatever hes into. She realizes that maybe there really isnt hope for said friend. While all this is happening you too are dealing with your friends betrayal. She learns things about you that most people don't and she starts to care about you. 

What timeline or even reality do you choose girl A. Girl A likes you but does she really know you no. Not saying girl B knows everything about you but she has more of a feeling or a sense of who the real you is. She was their for you when you needed her and you where there for her. You both have been through something together that most people cant imagine and that has formed a bond that will last forever. 

My point being why does he choose hinata period. Your not an asshole for telling a girl you dont like her but you are when you tell a girl you love her and you really have feelings for someone else.


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Parallels and foreshadowing are legitimate plot devices.  NH is trying to say this is foreshadowing (lol), yet how dare any other pairing make a "foreshadowing" argument.  Dont you know?  The manga is all about Hinata.
> 
> All I can say is I've yet to see an NH argument that isnt full of double-standards.  It would be nice if someone would just be honest and say they want it to happen because its their OTP, not because it has to happen, or will happen.  At least then you're admitting that there's no real argument for it in the story, but regardless you like it anyway and hope it works out.  Instead anyone who likes NH has to erroneously believe that there's overwhelming proof of it in the manga and that it will become canon.  Naturally, this is a very poor argument..with little backing..and only betrays double-standard after double-standard. Just be honest..seriously.
> 
> ...



It wouldn't surprise me if every single character decided to stick to his/her crush.

Naruto wont get over Sakura, while Sakura wont get over Sasuke, Hinata wont get over Naruto, and Sasuke wont magically fall in love with anyone.

Kishi seems to be too much of a chicken when it comes to making his mind regarding pairings and only throws minor cockteases to keep fandoms believing that they have some hope. All love may remain as unrequited as ever at the end of the manga OR it will remain ambiguous. For example: Sakura blushes at Naruto but also at Sasuke, while Sasuke is sorta nice to Sakura, and Naruto blushes in both Hinata's and Sakura's presence.

Kishi loves his ambiguity after all.

If Sasuke kicks the bucket then it will become way easier to settle as Sakura's major obstacle to start her love aspirations anew will be gone. Kishi then may(or not) throw SS fans some "cute" farewell bone by making her say that he(Sasuke) will always be dear to her heart but she can't look in the past forwewar and must go forward towards the future*looks passionately at Naruto*...or some shit like that.

Maybe Kishi will truly make Sasuke and Naruto die together at the end(Kishi's brother killed his MC after all) if SasuNaru fangirls bother him enough with their letters though...LOL


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Come on be easy on Hinata Sama she will get her Naruto kun he is force to love her bank now her last declaration say so....
But frankly her little thought was so selfish. Everyone is concerned with Naruto, Kakashi, and Guy, oh but not Hinata. No she's thinking about what's important to *"HER"* It was reassuring to see that she will never change. I just hope she focous on the fight and acutally helps Naruto instead of concerning herself with his safety during the battle, we dont need anymore pain moments.


----------



## Deana (Feb 8, 2012)

shepherd said:


> I should say, i'm no expert on pairings, that's not why I read this manga.  So I don't have a dog in the fight, But I don't see any way for Kishi To avoid making   naruto look like a Jerk if he ends up rejecting Hinata.  Which He would have to if he's not supposed to end up with her.
> 
> As far as "second choices" or "settling" is concerned, it seems to me that the Idea of being with hinata as opposed to being with sakura has grown much more on Naruto, than the idea of being with Naruto as opposed to being with sasuke has grown on sakura.


Naruto would not look like a jerk for rejecting Hinata just like Sakura does not look like a jerk for rejecting Naruto.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Parallels and foreshadowing are legitimate plot devices.  NH is trying to say this is foreshadowing (lol), yet how dare any other pairing make a "foreshadowing" argument.  Dont you know?  The manga is all about Hinata.



Oh how cute, you replied to me assuming that I support NH in this chapter as foreshadowing or that I accept parallels to support "my" pairings. 

If anything, the parallel bonds readers should be paying attention to: HashiMada/OroJira (even that's a joke)/NagaYahi/any other guy-rivalry that echoes soundly (to some degree) with SasuNaru. Not MinaKushi who made Naruto as he is...as similar to NH & NS


----------



## 8 (Feb 8, 2012)

gabzilla said:


> Silly, all Hinata/Sakura threads are about which one is better than the other one.


funny thing is that ino is supposed to be her rival. yet no one seems to give a shit about that rivalry.


----------



## Deana (Feb 8, 2012)

Parallels are, and will always be, a hilarious trap of fail.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Deana said:


> Naruto would not look like a jerk for rejecting Hinata just like Sakura does not look like a jerk for rejecting Naruto.



And Sasuke will not look like a jerk for rejecting Sakura.... Oh sh*t he already did that.:amazed


----------



## BlueSnow94 (Feb 8, 2012)

Halo2298 said:


> Such a long thread that ignores the obvious:
> 
> This is a Japanese manga. Pairings are NEVER resolved. The manga's going to end with Naruto being tired, victorious, and surrounded by all his friends. Sakura's gonna dump converted Sasuke because dumping evil Sasuke for Naruto is an obvious choice. To make her feelings for Naruto seem genuine, Kishi is going to make her choose Naruto over a GOOD Sasuke. Of course, Hinata is going to be making advances on him, as will Ino. TenTen will likely not get into the mix.
> 
> ...



There are a lot of Shonen mangas out there where pairings are resolved.


----------



## Deana (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> And Sasuke will not look like a jerk for rejecting Sakura.... Oh sh*t he already did that.:amazed


Sasuke gone wild dvds are hot.


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

That's a lot of words being placed in other people's mouths. 

Last I checked, the only possible hint that Naruto actually still looks at Sakura romantically was 457, which was in a flashback that took place quite some time ago (before Pain, possibly soon after Sai was actually included in the team)--and even then, one could interpret that he had given up some time ago, said as much, and has since moved on. Sure, he could also still be pining, but looking at Naruto and everything that has happened since then, it doesn't seem likely that he's pining for anyone other than Sasuke.

I agree in that Naruto would not necessarily look like a jerk for rejecting Hinata--no one owes anyone their love because that is not how love works. But from a narrative standpoint, it doesn't make a lot of sense to hype up Hinata's love for Naruto, keep his romantic feelings ambiguous while hinting at the subject occasionally throughout the story, and re-confirm Sakura's love for Sasuke over and over. Add in that Naruto has been shown with special focus towards Hinata in small bouts here and there (and in a positive manner) just adds to the case.

I mean, this IS a shounen series--romance is going to be kept short, sweet and to the point without all the twists and turns necessary like in a shojo plot twist. It's not unfair to say that in terms with the big three, there would be far less work to do to make NH canon IF and only if Kishi intends to make at least one pairing confirmed by series' end as he mentioned in an earlier interview. 

And you really don't have to be a shipper to see that. So how about a little less unnecessary questioning of motives and just letting people have their say? 

Because you know, this being Kishi's manga, he could troll us all and have it end with NO pairings. Then we'd be all in the same boat, and make all of the squabbling look really silly. XD


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Deana said:


> Sasuke gone wild dvds are hot.




*You know that I'm a boy right?*


----------



## Deana (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> *You know that I'm a boy right?*


Um, well . . . Kushina Gone Wild videos are hott too.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

Arles Celes said:


> It wouldn't surprise me if every single character decided to stick to his/her crush.
> 
> Naruto wont get over Sakura, while Sakura wont get over Sasuke, Hinata wont get over Naruto, and Sasuke wont magically fall in love with anyone.



Won't surprise me either actually lol, I see it as very likely.  Its the easiest outcome for him to write, and given that he's rushing the manga to its climax I can't see him feeling obligated to complete the pairing storyline.  Notice that pairing jargon has been removed from all characters but Hinata (obvious fanservice is obvious).  Naruto isn't concerned Sakura, Sakura isn't concerned with Sasuke, its all moving in a rather pairing neutral direction.

EDIT:  Given the super big cheesiness Kishi has been using lately, it wouldn't surprise me if NS happened either.  But as of now I lean towards open ending.


----------



## Fay (Feb 8, 2012)

The manga is reaching it's climax, Kishimoto has said this in his interview last month. I feel that ever since the Pain arc ended, this was clear by the way Kishimoto handled things. It's no more questions, time for answers. 

Kage summit arc killed off 3 pairings: SasuKarin, NaruSaku and SasuSaku. Two pairings remain: NaruHina and SasuNaru. This year will tell us what Kishimoto plans on doing with them.
With the manga bringing up NarutoxSasuke last week and this week HinataxNaruto it seems that the first steps of the last round towards a conclusion have been set. It can still go any way, as a good author keeps his readers guessing, but I expect us to have an answer by the end of this year.


----------



## Deana (Feb 8, 2012)

^^I don't know, I think Naruto/Sasuke got assassinated 272.  I mean, you can't recover from that making Naruto vomit thing.  well you can but it won't be pretty. lol


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> *You know that I'm a boy right?*



KushiMiko shall fix you right up.


----------



## Louchan (Feb 8, 2012)

Inuyatta said:


> having it end with NO pairings. Then we'd be all in the same boat, and make all of the squabbling look really silly. XD


You're not familiar with pairing wars within fandoms such as Final Fantasy VII, are you?


----------



## Skywalker (Feb 8, 2012)

What a one sided obsession.


----------



## BlueSnow94 (Feb 8, 2012)

Mayaki said:


> I'm not ignoring it. Actually I can't see Sasuke with any girl right now because he is like Yagami Light if it comes to girls. Still if he is converted, I believe this might change in a way. But I just can't see Naruto to be the "second choice", that would be really retarded as he is the main character.



What?

Light Yagami and Sasuke have nothing in common when it comes to girls. Light took advantage of girls by tricking them so he could fulfil his desires. Not to mention Light actually had a few girlfriends. 

Sasuke on the other hand never had a girlfriend and wasn't smart enough to take advantage of the girls who were infatuated with him.


----------



## Fay (Feb 8, 2012)

Deana said:


> ^^I don't know, I think Naruto/Sasuke got assassinated 272.  I mean, you can't recover from that making Naruto vomit thing.



I don't think so, Naruto has yet to meet Sasuke again.


----------



## Penance (Feb 8, 2012)

Hinata wants the dick...:ho


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

Louchan said:


> You're not familiar with pairing wars within fandoms such as Final Fantasy VII, are you?



...Dammit girl, don't remind me of that. 

*C/A fist bump*


----------



## Eikichi Onizuka (Feb 8, 2012)

Fay said:


> The manga is reaching it's climax, Kishimoto has said this in his interview last month. I feel that ever since the Pain arc ended, this was clear by the way Kishimoto handled things. It's no more questions, time for answers.
> 
> Kage summit arc killed off 3 pairings: SasuKarin, NaruSaku and SasuSaku. Two pairings remain: NaruHina and SasuNaru. This year will tell us what Kishimoto plans on doing with them.
> With the manga bringing up NarutoxSasuke last week and this week HinataxNaruto it seems that the first steps of the last round towards a conclusion have been set. It can still go any way, as a good author keeps his readers guessing, but I expect us to have an answer by the end of this year.



Kishi saying that doesnt mean much since i think he also said there is one more Arc left and with mangas the final Arc could very well take 4-5 years easy. What makes you say NaruSaku is dead, I don't see it at all. Just because naruto didn't magically fall for the confession means nothing.

There is no Sasuke anyone pairing in the future i would think since the character has to die. Hes committed to many betrayals and war crimes to be able to go about and live a life. The only way he can atone for his actions is by dying in some heroic way. Everyone hates Sasuke and even if he where to turn good he has to much to answer for. He burned off a kages arm, that cant be overlooked.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> KushiMiko shall fix you right up.



But I don't need that, real life girl is much much better....
don't you think.....


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 8, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> But I don't need that, real life girl is much much better....
> don't you think.....



Real girls are so much better. 

KH...


----------



## Hydro Spiral (Feb 8, 2012)

Deana said:


> ^^I don't know, I think Naruto/Sasuke got assassinated 272.  I mean, you can't recover from that making Naruto vomit thing.  well you can but it won't be pretty. lol



At least we know that SN brotherhood will live on forever


----------



## Fay (Feb 8, 2012)

Eikichi Onizuka said:


> Kishi saying that doesnt mean much since i think he also said there is one more Arc left and with mangas the final Arc could very well take 4-5 years easy. What makes you say NaruSaku is dead, I don't see it at all. Just because naruto didn't magically fall for the confession means nothing.
> 
> There is no Sasuke anyone pairing in the future i would think since the character has to die. Hes committed to many betrayals and war crimes to be able to go about and live a life. The only way he can atone for his actions is by dying in some heroic way. Everyone hates Sasuke and even if he where to turn good he has to much to answer for. He burned off a kages arm, that cant be overlooked.



We read the same manga, so if you're wondering what makes me say NaruSaku is dead then kindly reread the kage summit arc. You're of course free to disagree with me.


----------



## Louchan (Feb 8, 2012)

Inuyatta said:


> ...Dammit girl, don't remind me of that.
> 
> *C/A fist bump*


An ending without any pairings would only lead to one thing: ENDLESS PAIRING WARS. 

omg I forgot. <3<3


----------



## Deana (Feb 8, 2012)

Eikichi Onizuka said:


> Kishi saying that doesnt mean much since i think he also said there is one more Arc left and with mangas the final Arc could very well take 4-5 years easy. What makes you say NaruSaku is dead, I don't see it at all. Just because naruto didn't magically fall for the confession means nothing.
> 
> There is no Sasuke anyone pairing in the future i would think since the character has to die. Hes committed to many betrayals and war crimes to be able to go about and live a life. The only way he can atone for his actions is by dying in some heroic way. Everyone hates Sasuke and even if he where to turn good he has to much to answer for. He burned off a kages arm, that cant be overlooked.


And he could use those next four years to be even more consistent with Sakura's lack of lust for Naruto.
And what is with this Sasuke has to die to be redeemed stuff?  Sasuke could become the new Wizard of Oz instead of dying.  That would be a much better use of his time and he could redeem himself many more ways in such a setting. And being that close to Munchkin Land would be torture for someone such as him.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

Fay said:


> The manga is reaching it's climax, Kishimoto has said this in his interview last month. I feel that ever since the Pain arc ended, this was clear by the way Kishimoto handled things. It's no more questions, time for answers.
> 
> Kage summit arc killed off 3 pairings: SasuKarin, NaruSaku and SasuSaku.



LOL!  No.  Though your confidence amuses me a lot.  Naruto still loves Sakura, ergo, it is not dead.  Sakura still loves Sasuke, ergo, it is not dead.  Hinata still loves Naruto, ergo, it is not dead.  The only thing that kills a pairing is outright rejection, or implied rejection (course this is opinion so outright is better).  

Sakura has confessed to Sasuke, but he left her.  One could argue implied rejection.  He also tried to kill her a few times, so that is the more blatant "outright rejection".  However one could argue that Sasuke isnt in his right mind, therefore its not a true rejection.  Long story short, its still alive, though highly unlikely given Sasuke's past actions.

Naruto has not confessed to Sakura, ergo, he has not been rejected, ergo, the pairing is still alive.  Moving on.  Sai confessing on Naruto's behalf is not the same.  It has to come from Naruto's mouth, to Sakura's face.  If you insist on using Sai's confession, you can argue implied rejection because Sakura still loves Sasuke.  This would, of course, mean you would have to argue implied rejection for all pairings since they are all one-sided.  In the interest of not killing off *every* pairing at once, we'll just say there is no rejection in one-sided love, unless said love is confessed by the lover and rejected by the one loved (implied or blatant).

Hinata has confessed to Naruto, but he has yet to accept said confession.  One could argue implied rejection due to his non-answer.  One could also argue that Naruto has not been given ample opportunity to accept (though i'd strongly disagree), or one could argue (as I do) that Naruto forgot it entirely due to the Kyuubi transformation.  If that is the case, it has not bee rejected at all, ergo, the pairing is still alive.  But, the author making a character forget a confession is not a good sign for the pairing.  Just saying.  It has the same (well probably more) likelihood as SS.

All in all that was a pretty laughable argument.  Claiming the Kage Summit arc killed any pairings is hilarious.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Real girls are so much better.
> 
> KH...



So you don't have a B that's what you are implaying..... You joking right.

I already tired of NF on all the pairing wank, sadly I'm one of them shipping this screw up Big 3 or 4 real life is alot better..... don't you think.





Deana said:


> And he could use those next four years to be even more consistent with Sakura's lack of lust for Naruto.
> And what is with this Sasuke has to die to be redeemed stuff?  Sasuke could become the new Wizard of Oz instead of dying.  That would be a much better use of his time and he could redeem himself many more ways in such a setting. And being that close to Munchkin Land would be torture for someone such as him.



I doubt she will spend 4 years with him not liking if, know this is too much Sasuke Dvds thinking there, they are cartoon, Anime.....

But I hate the Sasuke need to Die, that will make Naruto and Sakura Emo.... 
I whant her to dump a good Sasuke and then *punch Him* that will be Nice.....

*Sorry I was dey dreaming with that part..*


----------



## Eikichi Onizuka (Feb 8, 2012)

Fay said:


> We read the same manga, so if you're wondering what makes me say NaruSaku is dead then kindly reread the kage summit arc. You're of course free to disagree with me.



I disagree with you sorry. I could also say that Naruto and Hinata never had a chance reading the entire manga since its so one sided that there would have to be a miracle for it to happen. To much points to either NaruSaku, Naruto dying, or Naruto no one.


----------



## Louchan (Feb 8, 2012)

People like throwing around "this pairing is dead" a lot.  Always have. And It's usually done whenever a pairing is shown to be one-sided, which is especially funny because... ... all of the Big 3 are one-sided.  And the same can be said about people throwing around "yay, this pairing is becoming canon!" as soon as one-sided affection is shown. Naruto pairings are clearly messing up everyone's respective on romance, that's for sure.


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Won't surprise me either actually lol, I see it as very likely.  Its the easiest outcome for him to write, and given that he's rushing the manga to its climax I can't see him feeling obligated to complete the pairing storyline.  Notice that pairing jargon has been removed from all characters but Hinata (obvious fanservice is obvious).  Naruto isn't concerned Sakura, Sakura isn't concerned with Sasuke, its all moving in a rather pairing neutral direction.
> 
> EDIT:  Given the super big cheesiness Kishi has been using lately, it wouldn't surprise me if NS happened either.  But as of now I lean towards open ending.



Showing as much NH as possible(especially just Hinata's fixation on Naruto) is the easiest and cheapest way to keep the status of the pairings as ambiguous as possible and the fans as pleased as possible.

If he shows Naruto showing an interest in Sakura then all NH fans can stop clinging to their hopes that Naruto "maybe" will have a change of heart now that he knows that Hinata is in love with him and what GREAT a girl she is. It would make it too obvious that he will never give up on his love for her(Sakura). Ironically since said confession there were basically no NS moments at all to keep NH fans hopes somehow. NH fans would be obviously very angry about Naruto still being intersted romantically in Sakura and Kishi fears their wrath as he fears the wrath of all pairing fans.

If he shows Naruto showing a clear ROMANTIC interest in Hinata then it is settled: NH is canon and then we have either SasuSaku or SasuDeath NaruSaku fans would be obviously not pleased with this.

If he shows Sakura being still way too interested in Sasuke then that kills NS and makes NS fans angry while at the same time not making it clear if NH becames canon(Sakura still loving Sasuke wont necessarily make Naruto fall in love with Hinata). And obviously SS fans may not be THAT happy as long as Sasuke is completely uninterested in Sakura.

If he shows Sasuke being interested in Sakura then....LOL OOC Sauce?
I would kinda love to see the pairing mayhem(and not only) that a lovey dovey Sasuke could cause...the ultimate asspull

If he shows Hinata being interested in Naruto though then that is just keeping the pairing from being completely dead. As long as Naruto does not fall for her the pairing is living on Hinata's feelings alone. If she stops loving him its all over folks. That is why as long as Naruto is not responding to her feelings, showing Hinata madly in love is good as it has no effect on the other pairings and thus is harmless.

As a not so great pairing fan I would prefer MUCH more if Sakura and (especially) Hinata stopped being treated as pairing fodders by Kishi and stood on their feet as girls whose whole life does not revolve just around love issues. With Hinata it is particularly terrible as EVERY single appearance of her in part 2 is focused on her interest in Naruto. There is no longer any stuff with her bond with her clan or any plans for the future. It is all about "Naruto Kun"

Sheesh...


----------



## AoshiKun (Feb 8, 2012)

At this point if will happen a pairing, it'll be NaruHina.
I can't see all those hints of Hinata and Naruto walking together for in the end he ends with Sakura...

I don't like pairings anyway.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 8, 2012)

Arles Celes said:


> Showing as much NH as possible(especially just Hinata's fixation on Naruto) is the easiest and cheapest way to keep the status of the pairings as ambiguous as possible and the fans as pleased as possible.
> 
> If he shows Naruto showing an interest in Sakura then all NH fans can stop clinging to their hopes that Naruto "maybe" will have a change of heart now that he knows that Hinata is in love with him and what GREAT a girl she is. It would make it too obvious that he will never give up on his love for her(Sakura). Ironically since said confession there were basically no NS moments at all to keep NH fans hopes somehow. NH fans would be obviously very angry about Naruto still being intersted romantically in Sakura and Kishi fears their wrath as he fears the wrath of all pairing fans.
> 
> ...




You Make a grat post but the last comment clearly did not get your message..


----------



## lain2501 (Feb 8, 2012)

" He also tried to kill her a few times, so that is the more blatant "outright rejection".

I like this one


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

lain2501 said:


> " He also tried to kill her a few times, so that is the more blatant "outright rejection".
> 
> I like this one



Lol  nothing says "no" better than a chidori to the face >_>


----------



## LivingHitokiri (Feb 8, 2012)

Louchan said:


> You're not familiar with pairing wars within fandoms such as Final Fantasy VII, are you?


There wasn't any war to begin with,since CloudTifa was confirmed pretty much right after Aeris died, should i even the story from Crisis Core, AC movie ?



Eikichi Onizuka said:


> I disagree with you sorry. I could also say that Naruto and Hinata never had a chance reading the entire manga since its so one sided that there would have to be a miracle for it to happen. To much points to either NaruSaku, Naruto dying, or Naruto no one.


It must be really hard for you to live in denial.
Seriously, how in the hell anyone can ignore the messages that mangaka throws around. Everyone talked about team spirit while Hinata talks about her future with Naruto, i mean hell you must be blind thinking that Kishi wants to corfirm that Hinata is still obsessed with naruto since it was already confirmed since chapter one.
get it over fanbgirls/boys, the war is over, you lost, NaruHina won.


----------



## izzyisozaki (Feb 8, 2012)

Arles Celes said:


> Naruto even has nosebleeds when he recalls that most pleasant moment when he kissed Sasuke ^^



He wasn't nosebleeding 



Deana said:


> ^^I don't know, I think Naruto/Sasuke got assassinated 272.  I mean, you can't recover from that making Naruto vomit thing.  well you can but it won't be pretty. lol



omfg Naruto gagged at implied homosexuality with Sasuke !!!!!!!!! SasNar is DEAD DEADER DEADEST even if we already knew it was a platonic pairing ROUND OF APPLAUSE let's just ignore it still has more emotional implications than all your otpees combined  cos that's convenient and SasNar is dead cos afterall it was alive jk I'm not srs it's homo this is shounen.


----------



## Angevelinka (Feb 8, 2012)

Oh my gosh, a pairing thread... cool:3 But you all guys take it once again very seriously, so I'm gonna lighten the atmosphere a bit. We all know that ultimate stalkerism and constant thinking about the person to the point it becomes the essence of your personality is love, right? NARUHINA, yay! We all know that whatever out parents say and do and foreshadow and approve of has to be true, right? NARUSAKU, yay! 

And when we all mash up both of the two above reasoning we get...




*ran away*

P.S. But to be serious... how about that Naruto dies before the war is over and we get no final pairing? Now that would be (un)satisfying ending (for the author).


----------



## Marsala (Feb 8, 2012)

Well however it ends, it can't be worse than School Rumble.


----------



## Sirius B (Feb 8, 2012)

Marsala said:


> Well however it ends, it can't be worse than School Rumble.



May I ask how was School Rumble's ending bad?


----------



## LivingHitokiri (Feb 8, 2012)

Marsala said:


> Well however it ends, it can't be worse than School Rumble.


Now why you have to make it worse eh ?



Sirius B said:


> May I ask how was School Rumble's ending bad?


No just don't, let it rest in a deep slumber.


----------



## FrayedThread (Feb 8, 2012)

There is no reason to be jumping the gun for this one statement.
No pairing is canon until both people feel the same way - Naruto will not suddenly start loving Hinata: but of course that doesn't mean nothing can happen.
Best not to base it on speculation however.

I don't really care for NH, there's nothing negative about the pairing- atleast not on the levels of the others.
It's just that the lack of development and the fact that Hinata's sole purpose revolves around her being in love with Naruto that turns me away.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> There wasn't any war to begin with,since CloudTifa was confirmed pretty much right after Aeris died, should i even the story from Crisis Core, AC movie ?
> 
> 
> It must be really hard for you to live in denial.
> ...




Thats right gaiz..you must be blind that Kishi wanted to confirm Naruto's love for Sakura with Sai's confession because it was already confirmed since chapter one.  That means  NS is canon!!

Owait.  You must be blind that Kishi wanted to confirm Sakura's love for Sasuke in her recent flashback cuz it was already confirmed since chapter 1!  That means  SS is canon!!


I'm so tired of repeating myself.  Hinata. Is. Not. The. Main. Character.  Just because she fantasizes about Naruto doesn't make the pairing canon.  Does Naruto love Hinata?  No.  Has he thought about loving Hinata?  No.  So how is Hinata going to be holding hands with Naruto when he doesn't even love her hmmm?  Come now really, its hard to argue for a pairing that is missing the affections of the MAIN CHARACTER.

Jus sayin, you might wanna evaluate the fact that you are missing the Naruto in the NH.


----------



## Eikichi Onizuka (Feb 8, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> There wasn't any war to begin with,since CloudTifa was confirmed pretty much right after Aeris died, should i even the story from Crisis Core, AC movie ?
> 
> 
> It must be really hard for you to live in denial.
> ...




No my dear friend logic lost. Im only a fan of logic for the most part and reason. My arguments against NaruHina have clearly stated and you bringing up the fact that she is thinking about Naruto proves how delusional the character sounds. This is THEEE war and shes thinking about a guy that hasnt shown any feelings toward her while people are dying. I lost respect for the character I think when she was fighting earlier and still thinking about Naruto. Thats another kind of obsessive.


----------



## Descent of the Lion (Feb 8, 2012)

I approve. Hinata looks like a hime. That's appropriate because Naruto is Rikudou and all.


----------



## LivingHitokiri (Feb 8, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Thats right gaiz..you must be blind that Kishi wanted to confirm Naruto's love for Sakura with Sai's confession because it was already confirmed since chapter one.  That means  NS is canon!!
> 
> Owait.  You must be blind that Kishi wanted to confirm Sakura's love for Sasuke in her recent flashback cuz it was already confirmed since chapter 1!  That means  SS is canon!!
> 
> ...


The fact that keep arguing over something that only the mangaka can know its amazing. kishi could pretty much shit on romance in this manga since this is a freaking SHOUNEN, he already messed enough with romance so far.
Not to offend you but your way of analyzing the manga is no more different from a 5 years girl trying to judge objectively. How many clues you need, Kishi expects his audience to be more than 10 years old in order to understand his story.
Do you honestly need details that Hinata and Naruto had freaking sex in order to get the feeling that they are getting along  ?
Also, welcome to internets.


----------



## izzyisozaki (Feb 8, 2012)

Louchan said:


> _*wipes foam from Izzy's mouth*_



I'm as cool as cucumber  but no really saying SasuNaru is dead because Naruto gagged is the worst reason I've read yet, right after that 'Kushina's dying wish is for Naruto to get a _garu_furendo'. 'Attempted murder' is the only valid reason SasuNaru is remotely jeopardized, and even in that sense it can handle itself better than its stepsister SasSak let alone maintain a more emotional dynamic than NaruHin.



Angevelinka said:


> Oh my gosh, a pairing thread... cool:3 But you all guys take it once again very seriously, so I'm gonna lighten the atmosphere a bit. We all know that ultimate stalkerism and constant thinking about the person to the point it becomes the essence of your personality is love, right? NARUHINA, yay! We all know that whatever out parents say and do and foreshadow and approve of has to be true, right? NARUSAKU, yay!
> 
> And when we all mash up both of the two above reasoning we get...
> 
> ...



would have worked better if Gaara's hair wasn't actually set as brown in the manga, it was the anime that changed it, just saying


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

@LivingHitokiri: Actually, no pairing has been confirmed with FFVII either because they keep churning out crap with tidbits for both parties. The only ones who got closest with Cloud in that way was Mukki and about 10 other dudes in a hot-tub. So Lou's right, it's a never ending cycle of wank and trolling.

Also...I agree with you on some points concerning NH, but you might wanna tone down the personal jabs before it escalates into something ban-worthy, as is prone to happening in a pairing thread.


----------



## Leuconoe (Feb 8, 2012)

I don't care too much for NaruHina, well any pairing for that matter, but after hearing her speech it'd be kind of sad if they didn't do _something._ Naruto is Hinata's Charlie the Unicorn door. All that once was and all that will be.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> The fact that keep arguing over something that only the mangaka can know its amazing. kishi could pretty much shit on romance in this manga since this is a freaking SHOUNEN, he already messed enough with romance so far.
> Not to offend you but your way of analyzing the manga is no more different from a 5 years girl trying to judge objectively. How many clues you need, Kishi expects his audience to be more than 10 years old in order to understand his story.
> Do you honestly need details that Hinata and Naruto had freaking sex in order to get the feeling that they are getting along  ?
> Also, welcome to internets.



How is one-sided love by a side character a clue?  You have yet to answer that question.  If you wanna talk about clues, lets do this:

1) Naruto loves Sakura (big clue lol)

2) In over 400 chapters, Naruto has not even considered loving Hinata (big clue)

3)  Hinata confessed to Naruto, but was ignored (biiiiig clue)

4)  Naruto told Sai he can't confess to Sakura until he's brought Sasuke back (biiiiiiiiiigger clue)

5) Naruto still hasn't confessed to Sakura (big clue)

6) The manga is almost over, and Hinata is no closer to Naruto than she was before (big clue)

7) NH has the least development out of all the pairings (big clue)

8) Hinata hardly ever shares panels with Naruto (big clue)

9) Naruto loves Sakura (owait I said that)


Lol and you want to talk about clues?  I find it funny that you try to compare my logic to a 5 year old, when you have yet to refute my argument.  I also find this 





LivingHitokiri said:


> The fact that keep arguing over something that only the mangaka can know its amazing


hilarious when you just said this..

*Spoiler*: __ 





> It must be really hard for you to live in denial.
> Seriously, how in the hell anyone can ignore the messages that mangaka throws around. Everyone talked about team spirit while Hinata talks about her future with Naruto, i mean hell you must be blind thinking that Kishi wants to corfirm that Hinata is still obsessed with naruto since it was already confirmed since chapter one.
> get it over fanbgirls/boys, the war is over, you lost, NaruHina won.


----------



## Kakugo (Feb 8, 2012)

Inuyatta said:


> Last I checked, the only possible hint that Naruto actually still looks at Sakura romantically was 457, which was in a flashback that took place quite some time ago (before Pain, possibly soon after Sai was actually included in the team)--and even then, one could interpret that he had given up some time ago, said as much, and has since moved on. Sure, he could also still be pining, but looking at Naruto and everything that has happened since then, it doesn't seem likely that he's pining for anyone other than Sasuke[/s




Is it necessary to get into the nitty-gritty of when the flashback took place? If it were irrelevant to Naruto's current feelings, then Kishi wouldn't have used it as a medium to address it in present tense. Naruto re-emphasizing his love for Sakura and explaining why he hasn't expressed his feelings to her yet (felt inadequate for not fulfilling his promise) =/= giving up on her, so I really don't get how something this straight forward could be misinterpreted (especially considering that even since there's been nothing to suggest that Naruto's feelings have changed). Arguments claim he "gave up" his feelings for her way back in the hospital scene with Sasuke, though as the flashback (among other instances) reminded us, that clearly hasn't been the case.



AMtrack said:


> Thats right gaiz..you must be blind that Kishi wanted to confirm Naruto's love for Sakura with Sai's confession because it was already confirmed since chapter one.  That means  NS is canon!!
> 
> Owait.  You must be blind that Kishi wanted to confirm Sakura's love for Sasuke in her recent flashback cuz it was already confirmed since chapter 1!  That means  SS is canon!!
> 
> ...



Hasn't the blatant disregard to Naruto's end of the spectrum always been the case?


----------



## Iamacloud (Feb 8, 2012)

I'm curious to hear how the people who are saying this chapter does not strongly hint NH think Naruto rejecting Hinata will happen... and mostly, why it has not happened yet? 

A lot of you (not all, but you will know who you are (if you aren't lying to yourselves )) used to claim that:


Naruto/Kishi would never follow up on Hinata's confession.
Thought it was only admiration and that she didn't really intend to pursue him romantically. 
Thought that Kishi had given Hinata closure with 450 or the rescue scene.
Thought Sakura meant Naruto was the someone else she told the love fodder about.
Thought Sakura had been getting over Sasuke/was falling for Naruto.

In fact, some of you still claim some of those even if all are now confirmed as wrong by manga canon. 

But seriously, those of you who realize your past mistakes, take the hint gracefully, keep hating NH all you please, but denying the obvious foreshadowing in this chapter is only setting yourself up for the next point that will be confirmed.


Thought 573 didn't foreshadow NH's canon status.

We're getting to the end of the story, there isn't that much time left, and ever since Hinata confessed, we've seen negative NS development and positive NH one. And this chapter confirms that after or at the end of this arc, Hinata intend to make a serious move on Naruto. 

Naruto is a good guy, he wouldn't let Hinata pine on him needlessly if he had no interest in her at all. If he wasn't interested, he would have told her much sooner, as Naruto is very empathic and knows how an unrequited love feels. The very fact that he didn't give her closure right away hints that the answer wasn't that obvious.

But instead of giving Hinata closure, Kishi keeps bringing up her determination, to the point where it's not "I want to walk with you" anymore, but "I WILL walk with you". 

Either Hinata is incredibly delusional, or she picked up signs from Naruto that she does have some chances. My interpretation, and I believe it is correct, is that the second option is the right one. And it's not hard to point 2 moments where Hinata might have picked some subtle hints. Hinata is very perceptive when it comes to Naruto, heck she can tell him from a Zetsu clone when no one else can from just a look in his eyes.

Well we've seen Hinata remembering Naruto smiling at her earlier in the war, which some deluded fans have twisted into a ramen date or something, which I highly doubt happened. But you can tell a lot through a simple smile, and it's quite possible Hinata felt that Naruto was now smiling at her more warmly than before.

But mostly, the recent damsel in distress moment. The panel is clear, Naruto and Hinata both know he is talking about her actions against Pain when he tells her, "Don't be so hard on yourself, you're strong". Clearly Hinata took that as "I like what you're doing, keep going", and she plans to act on it.

As to why Kishi hasn't been more obvious on the Naruto -> Hinata side... well that's pretty simple. Naruto warming up to Hinata isn't a hint, it is the canonization of NH, that's the last thing that will come. And now we have an idea when. When the war ends.

Kishi hasn't touched Naruto's romantic feelings ever since Hinata confessed to him, so, as a writer, he left himself the liberty to use flashback to show us the evolution of Naruto's feelings during that time. Those things don't happen by mistake in storytelling, Kishi is going for NH, it's blatantly obvious now.

The earlier you realize that, the easier the actual moment will be to swallow. Heck, you might even find yourself saying "NH isn't so bad after all" if Kishi does a decent job at it.


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

Kakugo said:


> Is it necessary to get into the nitty-gritty of when the flashback took place? If it were irrelevant to Naruto's current feelings, then Kishi wouldn't have used it as a medium to address it in present tense. Naruto re-emphasizing his love for Sakura and explaining why he hasn't expressed his feelings to her yet (felt inadequate for not fulfilling his promise) =/= giving up on her, so I really don't get how something this straight forward could be misinterpreted (especially considering that even since there's been nothing to suggest that Naruto's feelings have changed). Arguments claim he "gave up" his feelings for her way back in the hospital scene with Sasuke, though as the flashback (among other instances) reminded us, that clearly hasn't been the case.
> 
> 
> 
> Hasn't the blatant disregard to Naruto's end of the spectrum always been the case?



Yes, it actually is somewhat important to know just when that flashback took place because A LOT has happened since then, and opportunities have been more than ripe for Naruto to have some subtle hinting to build on towards still being in love with Sakura--instead, we have plenty of indicators that he does not, and has not thought about Sakura romantically for some time--what we got was a memory from a secondary viewpoint that didn't really confirm nor deny Naruto's feelings. Additionally, the hint dropping towards Naruto/Hinata has been decreasingly subtle.

You may not see the relevance of dating that flashback, but in light of everything that has happened in part two, a lot of us aren't going to feel the same (and not just in my own camp if this thread is any indication). 

As for your latter quip--blanket statements like that don't help.  It's not exactly bad for Naruto to end up with someone who loves him for who he is, and whom he respects and thinks highly of. No one is saying he is in love with her right now, but the potential is there--that's all. Which is what other commenters were getting at. Sakura and Hinata's feelings are pretty set in stone at this point--Naruto's feelings have been ambiguous enough to be called into question as of right now.

Of course, you may disagree, no doubt. But I hope you can understand that for the rest of us, it is not so cut and dry.


----------



## Leuconoe (Feb 8, 2012)

Welp to be fair, this development of Hinata feeling's for Naruto was still as one-sided as this always has been. I'd just wait and see what happens. But I totally agree that this is a great foreshadow of the resolve to Hinata's story and Naruto's true revelation of how she feels for her. <3 Good luck, Hina!


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

^Agreed. Though I'm still wondering what Naruto said to her that made her feel confident to make such a statement. She's not the forceful type, but I will wait and enjoy the story.


----------



## ownageprince (Feb 8, 2012)

NarutoIzDaMan said:


> Hinata seriously needs to get a life, that's all I'm gonna say about that.



She will get a life when Naruto puts it in her.


----------



## izzyisozaki (Feb 8, 2012)

Inuyatta said:


> ^Agreed. Though I'm still wondering what Naruto said to her that made her feel confident to make such a statement. She's not the forceful type, but I will wait and enjoy the story.



He didn't say anything. She made the decision out of mere determination, hence the sombre look on her face. She's tired of sitting and watching I suppose, gonna go get her man _no matter what -_ hence everything that made Part 1 NH redeemable compared to Part 1 SS is coming! /not srs but really there is no indication he said anything.


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> How is one-sided love by a side character a clue?  You have yet to answer that question.  If you wanna talk about clues, lets do this:
> 
> 1) Naruto loves Sakura (big clue lol)
> 
> ...



To be fair I'm not sure if Naruto confessing would be a good thing for NS considering that every time we had a confession things didn't go well for said pairing(ex. Sakura's confession to Sasuke, Hinata's cinfession to Naruto, Sakura's confession to Naruto).

Sakura already knows how Naruto feels about her so Naruto confessing his feelings to her would be hardly an "enlightment like" moment for her. Either she realizes that she feels something for him that goes beyond friendship on her own or she never does IMO.

And Naruto confessing just after he "saved" Sasuke would be kinda weird

Naruto: Hey Sakura here is Sasuke

Sasuke: You are still annoying

Sakura: (What a meanie...how could I love him?)

Naruto: Now I have to confess...that I love you!!

Sakura: Naruto...I...I...*blush*

Though with Kishi confessions are usually even more fail than the one provided in my example LOL

Besides Naruto probably will fail to bring Sasuke alive to Konoha as the latter seems to be on a route to "Redemption Equals Death" or something similar.

So how could Naruto confess after he basically fails that particular requirement that he placed upon himself?(confess after saving Sasuke).

Seriously...at this point the ultimate pairing win would be Saku/Ino

Pure win


----------



## Skywalker (Feb 8, 2012)




----------



## Naruko (Feb 8, 2012)

Try to stay on topic (NH, yes you think it'll happen more now, or won't happen) - be civil, try to steer away from other pairing talk ok?

Some of you are in high spirits (not bad) but it's getting a WEE off topic in various clumps of posts so if you want to talk other pairings, head to the appropriate FC or HoU....thank you <3


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## Inuyatta (Feb 8, 2012)

izzyisozaki said:


> He didn't say anything. She made the decision out of mere determination, hence the sombre look on her face. She's tired of sitting and watching I suppose, gonna go get her man _no matter what -_ hence everything that made Part 1 NH redeemable compared to Part 1 SS is coming! /not srs but really there is no indication he said anything.



I thought the same at first myself, but then I remembered something in an earlier chapter and now I'm not so sure... Meh. Time will tell.


----------



## Lee-Sensei (Feb 8, 2012)

Luiz said:


> The healthiest? Hinata is friggin' obsessed. What messed up pairings are you comparing it to?



The one where he's paired up with the whacked out chick who's well on her way to becoming a domestic abuser.


----------



## Yuna (Feb 8, 2012)

Luiz said:


> The healthiest? Hinata is friggin' obsessed. What messed up pairings are you comparing it to?


In this case, it means "least unhealthy".


----------



## Skeith (Feb 8, 2012)

Skywalker said:


>



As a NH fan, that is funny. 


But I think I'm going to stay out of this place for now.


----------



## Drunkenwhale (Feb 8, 2012)

Ehhhh... I've had thoughts as to do I want to comment in this thread or not. Part of the reason I want to is to give out my two cents.

The only reasons I don't want to is because of the general sense of stupidity that reeks from this thread with "lol our pairing wins! You guys all suck, we hope you die!" and the inevitable string of replies leading to debates whenever someone has a different opinion than the general consensus. Not to mention the stench of smugness whenever someone replies to an opposite opinion as if they are right because they have the backing of the majority.

But yunno what, I'll bite. I know someone is going to come in, debate my points, and pull this smug persona thinking they've won when I don't reply to them, further cementing that pairings are serious business and that there is a reason I don't like NaruHina.


...


The general concensus of this thread is "NaruHina is canon" but I gotta be brutally honest, I don't see it.

She's reaffirming something we already know: She loves him.

How exactly does this make it canon? Because Kishi wrote it in a romantic way? Because we're reminded she still loves him?

Okay... But this is Hinata's character. Go ahead, tell me I'm wrong, but Hinata's entire character revolves around Naruto.

The thing is though, I don't consider a pairing canon until both sides have confessed anything. Reaffirming something we already know, just written a different way, does not make a pairing canon.

I need something from Naruto.

You can toss that meeting between Naruto's clone and Hinata a few chapters back as evidence, but that doesn't do it for me. Get me the two having some kind of interaction that tells me that they've become a canon couple.

And for god's sake, don't give me some bull like "off-panel"

I don't consider NaruHina canon at this point, because all this chapter did was reaffirm something we already know, but obviously all of you guys seem to believe this makes the couple canon...

So... Woo?

I will admit one thing, the couple looks cute and she's devoted to him. I'm sure a relationship between the two if seen would be a happy one.

But then again, so would any other pairing with either character, regardless of what you believe.


So that's my two cents on the matter, feel free to tl;dr it or pick it apart, I'm not going to argue with ya today.

See ya, I'm going to go draw some stuff now while listening to old cartoon theme songs.





tl;dr Version: NaruHina isn't canon until *Naruto* does something romantic, which he has yet to do, not matter what you might assume.


----------



## Mael (Feb 8, 2012)

This is hilarious...and although I am indeed a NaruHina fan I gotta say this is some classic work Kishimoto the Overrated has done here.  Fueling the "Hinata is one-dimensional argument" as she joins the circlejerk choir around our teenage false God-Emperor of Man while making a thinly veiled attempt to shut the door on a pairing debate but leaving that little wiggle room open before our eventual climax because he has clearly stopped caring as much as he did beforehand while the profits come in.

Genius...like Stephanie Meyer genius.



ownageprince said:


> She will get a life when Naruto puts it in her.



So far the smartest thing I've read the whole thread.


----------



## Mider T (Feb 8, 2012)

My body has been ready for years, make it happen already!


----------



## Mael (Feb 8, 2012)

Mider T said:


> My body has been ready for years, make it happen already!



Bananas aren't ripe for very long...stop lying.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 8, 2012)

Drunkenwhale said:


> Words



No one is saying NH is canon, and if they are that's not what they mean.

What they mean is they see it as inevitable.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

Iamacloud said:


> I'm curious to hear how the people who are saying this chapter does not strongly hint NH think Naruto rejecting Hinata will happen... and mostly, why it has not happened yet?
> 
> A lot of you (not all, but you will know who you are (if you aren't lying to yourselves )) used to claim that:
> 
> ...



I really worry what will happen to ppl like you if NH doesn't become canon.  You are so far deluded I really think you might snap.  I will ask again, since no one answered my question:

How is it an NH hint if it is one-sided?  Its not.

Also Kishi followed up on Hinata's confession and Naruto did not return her feelings.  Manga is almost over, Naruto isnt going to randomly change his mind mid-war.

Romance is not the point of the manga, so Naruto has no business thinking about it in the middle of a war.  Btw, he has NEVER thought about Hinata in a romantic light EVER.  How does that make NH canon again?  He does think of Sakura in a romantic light btw, it was reconfirmed in the kage summit arc, and hasn't be denied since then.

Do I really need to make a checklist of all the things NH thought was going to happen, but didnt happen?  You are opening yourself up to a huuuuge counter argument.

[] ZOMG Hyuuga arc (didnt happen)
[] Naruto will flashback Hinata's confession (didnt happen)
[] Hinata will become important to the plot!! (didnt happen)
[] Naruto will spend more time with Hinata and fall for her (didnt happen)
[] Hinata will help Naruto save Sasuke!! (didnt happen either)

I really don't get where you are getting all this canon stuff from.  Its still as one-sided as its ever been, and Naruto/Hinata haven't developed into anything more than friends.  Again, and I repeat, Naruto has NEVER thought of Hinata romantically EVER even AFTER that confession.  It is what it is man, hard to have NaruHina when Naruto is not on board and the manga is almost over.

Kishi has made Naruto's affections abundantly clear.  If you can't accept them, you are what most would call delusional.  



Kakugo said:


> Hasn't the blatant disregard to Naruto's end of the spectrum always been the case?



 always.  It amazes me, but from other shipping experiences can't say I'm surprised coughharryhermionecough, coughzutaracough


----------



## rac585 (Feb 8, 2012)

Iamacloud said:


> We're getting to the end of the story, there isn't that much time left, and ever since Hinata confessed, we've seen negative NS development and positive NH one. And this chapter confirms that after or at the end of this arc, Hinata intend to make a serious move on Naruto.
> 
> Naruto is a good guy, he wouldn't let Hinata pine on him needlessly if he had no interest in her at all. If he wasn't interested, he would have told her much sooner, as Naruto is very empathic and knows how an unrequited love feels. The very fact that he didn't give her closure right away hints that the answer wasn't that obvious.
> 
> But instead of giving Hinata closure, Kishi keeps bringing up her determination, to the point where it's not "I want to walk with you" anymore, but "I WILL walk with you".



I think you're right that after this War Arc we will see Hinata go to make her move on Naruto. How could the author write a scene like this into the manga without having Naruto finally weigh his feelings for both love interests? If I were to take my NS goggles off for a moment, the comparison (as it stands now) would boil down to someone who still has feelings for someone else, versus someone who's had feelings for him all along. A pretty easy choice to make when you look at it like that.

While even though all is not said and done, and while there might be an opportunity to have Sakura to move on from Sasuke post-redemption, what would happen if both love interests were still in love with the main character at the very end? It would leave one of them with an ending that doesn't sit well with the audience. Which leads me to believe that that won't happen.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 8, 2012)

Rac said:


> I think you're right that after this War Arc we will see Hinata go to make her move on Naruto. How could the author write a scene like this into the manga without having Naruto finally weigh his feelings for both love interests? If I were to take my NS goggles off for a moment, the comparison (as it stands now) would boil down to someone who still has feelings for someone else, versus someone who's had feelings for him all along. A pretty easy choice to make when you look at it like that.
> 
> While even though all is not said and done, and while there might be an opportunity to have Sakura to move on from Sasuke post-redemption, what would happen if both love interests were still in love with the main character at the very end? It would leave one of them with an ending that doesn't sit well with the audience. Which leads me to believe that that won't happen.



Authors dont care how shippers like their ending.  I dont know why everyone assumes that just because a fandom will be butthurt, the author wont do something.  Its the end of the manga..youve bought their volumes already..who cares what you think at the end.  Authors dont give a shit.

Example:

Kishi did this:

[2]

And then he did this:

[2]

And then he had that flashback with Sai, only to have Sakura's bad confession, only to have Sasuke try to kill her again, only to have Sakura still love Sasuke...and so the cycle continues.  He's throws a bone one way, then throws the bone the other direction..and every time we get silly threads like these that are like "zomg canon" only to get pwned a few chapters later.

Its actually about time for Kishi to throw a bone towards NS again here in the future.  Cant imagine the shitstorm thatll start.


----------



## Kezone (Feb 8, 2012)

Me? I'm just waiting for NarutoKurama. I mean, Kurama is a Tsundere (Most Shounen heroes end up with Tsunderes), one of the strongest characters in the manga, extremely plot relevant, and would probably have red hair in human form. See? What's not to love? 

(Make it happen Kishi)

BTW, Oi, do we have a NaruKura fanclub? Caus I think we need one.


----------



## Centeolt (Feb 8, 2012)

All I'm going to say is.. as a fan of the pairing, it was nice to see something related to it again. I thought it was officially over since the Pain Arc, so it kind of brought back the light to the candle for futur  possibilities.


----------



## rac585 (Feb 8, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Authors dont care how shippers like their ending.  I dont know why everyone assumes that just because a fandom will be butthurt, the author wont do something.  Its the end of the manga..youve bought their volumes already..who cares what you think at the end.  Authors dont give a shit.



I'm not talking about just shippers and specific fandoms, I meant like for example seeing the manga ending with Hinata still pining for Naruto while he ends up with Sakura. Hinata getting a raw deal instead of the author at least having her move on and get over him isn't something anybody would want to see... I don't even like Hinata that much.

I think authors do care about all of their characters endings somewhat.


----------



## Eikichi Onizuka (Feb 9, 2012)

Rac said:


> I'm not talking about just shippers and specific fandoms, I meant like for example seeing the manga ending with Hinata still pining for Naruto while he ends up with Sakura. Hinata getting a raw deal instead of the author at least having her move on and get over him isn't something anybody would want to see... I don't even like Hinata that much.
> 
> I think authors do care about all of their characters endings somewhat.



You know whats even more of a rare deal marrying someone and loving them as much as Hinata supposedly does but knowing deep down he doesn't love you as much as he does Sakura. I honestly will say that I didn't care about pairings until the madness made me care.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 9, 2012)

Eikichi Onizuka said:


> You know whats even more of a rare deal marrying someone and loving them as much as Hinata supposedly does but knowing deep down he doesn't love you as much as he does Sakura. I honestly will say that I didn't care about pairings until the madness made me care.



You could say exactly the same for Naruto and Sakura, that's an empty argument.


----------



## Battoumaru (Feb 9, 2012)

That glimpse of Naruto and Hinata getting close to each other in one of the Anime-esque scenes from Generations made me think something was going to be revealed, at least partially, about them and their status in relation to one-another. Especially since the anime filler and current manga tend to share similar themes as of late. 

Kakashi and Guy showed up in the manga to fight the Bijuu alongside a Gai and Kakashi themed episode in the anime. Kyuubi's important role in the Manga coincided with his taming/resealing arc in the Anime. I'm thinking that Studio Pierrot knows some stuff about the plot before the chapters are even released, which would explain this correlation between filler and canon manga. 

It would also explain things like the Bikochu Arc, the whole "Secret Lovers" title fiasco in Storm 2, and now, their close proximity compared to everyone else in the Ichiraku Ramen scene in Generation. (For a bit of perspective, all of the rookies are there, but Hinata and Naruto are looking at each other, and are extremely close. It almost seems as if Hinata is sitting in his lap or something.)

Stubborn people are stubborn. NaruHina has been foreshadowed for the longest time. From the pilot chapter, even! "Naruto moves toward the Sun" with a spiral in the sun behind an image of Hinata? Before she was even intended to be a shinobi? If she wasn't meant to be a shinobi, then what relevance would her character have served, were she not his love interest? 

I'm not saying that Kishimoto is above trolling, like he did with Sasuke's "Don't speak of Itachi" Genjutsu, but I also know a thing or two about characterization. Hinata has been characterized as Naruto's ideal love interest from the beginning. Of course, Naruto's not going to think much of her at first. He didn't know her very well at all. All he knew was that she was quiet, and a bit dark. As he's progressed, he's learned more about her. Over time, his opinion has become more favorable. I don't necessarily favor any pairing over another, but signs point to NaruHina being the intended pairing.

NaruSaku was what it was. A puppy love sort of thing. Sakura loves Sasuke. Naruto understands this more than anyone now. One could argue that he gets this element of her and Sasuke's relationship even more than they do, which is why he refused her love confession. It's not to say that he didn't harbor feelings for her, it's simply that her heart wasn't really in it. Understand? I'd be perfectly cool with NaruSaku. I used to think that could possibly be the ideal pairing, back before her whole "Heart as fickle as the Autumn sky" incident, and her failed attempt to kill Sasuke. 

Now, though, if anything, the seven panels of Hinata's introspection about walking next to Naruto, versus Sakura's... what? five panels? of her resolve not to let Naruto fight alone anymore only cements my belief that NaruHina is what Kishimoto is going for.

No disrespect to the other pairing followers. Provide evidence of your pairing's legitimacy, and I will hear it, as I have explained my own reasoning, and it would be both unfair and extremely arrogant not to hear anyone else's.


----------



## Random Nobody (Feb 9, 2012)

Clearly NaruHina will happen.  Then Hinata will disappear because Kishi will forget she exists again.

But seriously how the hell do any of you mangae to care at this point?  Don't get me wrong I'm not just picking on the NH people, and I'm not asking why you care about the pairing itself or crticizing you for enjoying it.  But why do you care about the resolution to a romance subplot by and author that's so bad at romance I honesly wonder if artifical insemination exists in Naruto since I'm not conviced any of these characters know enough about romance to fuck much less have plausible relationships.


----------



## ceralux (Feb 9, 2012)

Naruto is a Shounen manga that emphasizes on Action and Adventure and NOT romance. So why is this the most discussed thread in the telegrams? Do you people really have this fucking much to talk about in a manga that barely touches on the romantic feelings of it's characters? 

*People writing paragraphs about supporting their favorite shipping, more than half of you will lose in the end and you can't even be mad, make excuses or blame Kishi because this isn't a fucking ROMANCE manga. *


----------



## Random Nobody (Feb 9, 2012)

ceralux said:


> Naruto is a Shounen manga that emphasizes on Action and Adventure and NOT romance. So why is this the most discussed thread in the telegrams? Do you people really have this fucking much to talk about in a manga that barely touches on the romantic feelings of it's characters?
> 
> *People writing paragraphs about supporting their favorite shipping, more than half of you will lose in the end and you can't even be mad, make excuses or blame Kishi because this isn't a fucking ROMANCE manga. *



Because aside from that this chapter consisted of:

*Naruto:* I know a bunch of names!

*Madara:* Oh shit!

*Everybody Else:* *Circlejerk Naruto*

*Sasuke:* I'M STANDING OMNIOUSLY!


----------



## Battoumaru (Feb 9, 2012)

ceralux said:


> Naruto is a Shounen manga that emphasizes on Action and Adventure and NOT romance. So why is this the most discussed thread in the telegrams? Do you people really have this fucking much to talk about in a manga that barely touches on the romantic feelings of it's characters?
> 
> *People writing paragraphs about supporting their favorite shipping, more than half of you will lose in the end and you can't even be mad, make excuses or blame Kishi because this isn't a fucking ROMANCE manga. *



For some, it isn't as much an issue of shipping, per se. More like characterization and foreshadowing.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 9, 2012)

Random Nobody said:


> Clearly NaruHina will happen.  Then Hinata will disappear because Kishi will forget she exists again.
> 
> But seriously how the hell do any of you mangae to care at this point?  Don't get me wrong I'm not just picking on the NH people, and I'm not asking why you care about the pairing itself or crticizing you for enjoying it.  But why do you care about the resolution to a romance subplot by and author that's so bad at romance I honesly wonder if artifical insemination exists in Naruto since I'm not conviced any of these characters know enough about romance to fuck much less have plausible relationships.





ceralux said:


> Naruto is a Shounen manga that emphasizes on Action and Adventure and NOT romance. So why is this the most discussed thread in the telegrams? Do you people really have this fucking much to talk about in a manga that barely touches on the romantic feelings of it's characters?
> 
> *People writing paragraphs about supporting their favorite shipping, more than half of you will lose in the end and you can't even be mad, make excuses or blame Kishi because this isn't a fucking ROMANCE manga. *



As someone who's posted a lot in this thread and gives no fucks about any pairing, I do it because I'm having fun. That's all really.

The reps from people that agree with me are a nice incentive to keep going, too.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

Random Nobody said:


> Clearly NaruHina will happen.  Then Hinata will disappear because Kishi will forget she exists again.
> 
> But seriously how the hell do any of you mangae to care at this point?  Don't get me wrong I'm not just picking on the NH people, and I'm not asking why you care about the pairing itself or crticizing you for enjoying it.  But why do you care about the resolution to a romance subplot by and author that's so bad at romance I honesly wonder if artifical insemination exists in Naruto since I'm not conviced any of these characters know enough about romance to fuck much less have plausible relationships.



Its not so much the pairings but the retarded arguments that come with them which bug me.  Honestly if everyone was all like, "I love NS!" or "I love NH!" or "SN ftw!" I wouldn't bother arguing because I could care less.  

Ridiculous arguments are just a pet peeve of mine, and it just so happens they are most prevalent in pairing threads (and battledome topics..jesus).

I have to side with J.K. Rowling on the subject when she says that militant fandoms are freakin crazy.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Rac said:


> I'm not talking about just shippers and specific fandoms, I meant like for example seeing the manga ending with Hinata still pining for Naruto while he ends up with Sakura. Hinata getting a raw deal instead of the author at least having her move on and get over him isn't something anybody would want to see... I don't even like Hinata that much.
> 
> I think authors do care about all of their characters endings somewhat.



And it's still much, much more likely than Naruto getting that raw deal.

If he moves on to Hinata he actually has to show that, hell even the Kyuubi got 20-30 chapters for his turnabout, Naruto has not even begun the process yet.


----------



## UltimateDeadpool (Feb 9, 2012)

Naruto and Hinata will reunite the bloodlines and their babies will be true Rikudous.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

Rac said:


> I think authors do care about all of their characters endings somewhat.



If Kishi can make NH canon in time for the manga to end, despite its utter lack of development, he could have Hinata move on from her crush and accept Naruto loving someone else in the same timespan.  It doesn't even have to be a raw deal, other than the fact that Hinata didnt get what she wanted.  Can't satisfy everyone..shes just a side character.



Eikichi Onizuka said:


> You know whats even more of a rare deal marrying someone and loving them as much as Hinata supposedly does but knowing deep down he doesn't love you as much as he does Sakura. I honestly will say that I didn't care about pairings until the madness made me care.



Exactly...



First Tsurugi said:


> You could say exactly the same for Naruto and Sakura, that's an empty argument.


 
Congrats, you see all sides of the argument!  But if anyone should get a raw deal who should it be:  Main character, side character, or other side character?  My vote goes to side character..jus sayin.  The manga is about Naruto, as such he shouldnt (and wont) be the one to get a raw deal.

Contrary to popular belief not everyone has to be paired up for the characters to be happy.  Only fandoms care about that shit.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 9, 2012)

Restraining myself...



AMtrack said:


> If Kishi can make NH canon in time for the manga to end, despite its utter lack of development, he could have Hinata move on from her crush and accept Naruto loving someone else in the same timespan.  It doesn't even have to be a raw deal, other than the fact that Hinata didnt get what she wanted.  Can't satisfy everyone..*shes just a side character.*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


>Implying that Naruto never gets raw deals 
So I see we're back to the old "she's a side character, they don't count" argument. Side characters get development too you know. Fan fact: Derpy was in a lot of episodes as a simple background character before Hasbro from gave Derpy a voice and a real personality. Don't discount it as impossible.



> Contrary to popular belief not everyone has to be paired up for the characters to be happy.  Only fandoms care about that shit.


I'm sure if the characters had a voice they would say otherwise.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Golden Circle said:


> Restraining myself...
> 
> *>Implying that Naruto never gets raw deals *
> So I see we're back to the old "she's a side character, they don't count" argument. Side characters get development too you know. Fan fact: Derpy was in a lot of episodes as a simple background character before Hasbro from gave Derpy a voice and a real personality. Don't discount it as impossible.
> ...



Actually he really doesn't.

This entire story has been about Naruto working his way up from nothing.

Other than Jiraiya's death, nearly everything has gone his way in the end.


----------



## Marsala (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Actually he really doesn't.
> 
> This entire story has been about Naruto working his way up from nothing.
> 
> Other than Jiraiya's death, nearly everything has gone his way in the end.



With Kishimoto's attitude towards Sakura these days, he may consider having Naruto wind up with her to be a raw deal.

At any rate, I think that NaruSaku was definitely intended around the start of part 2 but may have been abandoned due to either editorial pressure or Kishimoto deciding that he didn't like Sakura.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Actually he really doesn't.
> 
> This entire story has been about Naruto working his way up from nothing.
> 
> Other than Jiraiya's death, nearly everything has gone his way in the end.


Don't forget not being able to bring Sasuke back, not once, or twice, but three times.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Congrats, you see all sides of the argument!  But if anyone should get a raw deal who should it be:  Main character, side character, or other side character?  My vote goes to side character..jus sayin.  The manga is about Naruto, as such he shouldnt (and wont) be the one to get a raw deal.
> 
> Contrary to popular belief not everyone has to be paired up for the characters to be happy.  Only fandoms care about that shit.



This is just a rehash of the "X deserves Y because..." argument.

As I've said, I see Naruto's feelings changing before Sakura's do.

Plus Naruto's pretty much guaranteed to end up with someone, so a "raw deal" isn't really possible. He'll find happiness either way.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Marsala said:


> With Kishimoto's attitude towards Sakura these days, he may consider having Naruto wind up with her to be a raw deal.
> 
> At any rate, I think that NaruSaku was definitely intended around the start of part 2 but may have been abandoned due to either editorial pressure or Kishimoto deciding that he didn't like Sakura.



Eh, Naruto wants Sakura, so that's what I'm going off.



Golden Circle said:


> Don't forget not being able to bring Sasuke back, not once, or twice, but three times.



Anyone who thinks Sasuke isn't going to get redeemed must be joking.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Anyone who thinks Sasuke isn't going to get redeemed must be joking.


Well yes, but that's not my point. He got a raw deal on those three occasions. By extension, Naruto isn't immune from getting a raw deal in anything. Such as this battle for example; Tobi can easily pull something out of his sleeve and win. So when you said that Naruto isn't prone to getting raw deals, you were wrong.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Golden Circle said:


> Well yes, but that's not my point. He got a raw deal on those three occasions. By extension, Naruto isn't immune from getting a raw deal in anything. Such as this battle for example; Tobi can easily pull something out of his sleeve and win. So when you said that Naruto isn't prone to getting raw deals, you were wrong.





			
				Me said:
			
		

> nearly everything has gone his way *in the end.*



I'm certainly aware Naruto can temporarily get raw deals, but my point was about when things are finished, Naruto generally comes out very well.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> I'm certainly aware Naruto can temporarily get raw deals, but my point was about when things are finished, Naruto generally comes out very well.


Yes okay, he is the main character after all. HOWEVER, as you said, that doesn't stop him from falling short... so he isn't totally immune as you assert.

Now, what do you have to say about side characters getting no development, seeing as Hinata didn't appear in this chapter.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Golden Circle said:


> Yes okay, he is the main character after all. HOWEVER, as you said, that doesn't stop him from falling short... so he isn't totally immune as you assert.



Yes he can fall short, however that very rarely sticks. If the story ends then everything is wrapping up, so there's no way Naruto will be able to fix it later.

I.e. if he loses to Tobi here it's highly, highly like he will beat Tobi later. Or with Sasuke, he's failed several times already, but everyone accepts that Naruto is going to prevail in the end.

My point is that every time Naruto finishes a story arc/line, he comes out of it well, Gaara was the closest he's come to outright failing and yet Kishi revived him anyway.



> Now, what do you have to say about side characters getting no development, seeing as Hinata didn't appear in this chapter.



I don't understand.


----------



## Nic (Feb 9, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> This is just a rehash of the "X deserves Y because..." argument.
> 
> *As I've said, I see Naruto's feelings changing before Sakura's do.
> *
> Plus Naruto's pretty much guaranteed to end up with someone, so a "raw deal" isn't really possible. He'll find happiness either way.



considering there has been a much bigger emphasis surrounding Sakura's feelings towards Naruto than Naruto towards Hinata, I somehow doubt that.


----------



## rac585 (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Contrary to popular belief not everyone has to be paired up for the characters to be *happy*. Only fandoms care about that shit.



I completely agree, and it seems you also agree with me that everyone (on the good side) should at least end happy? That's all I'm saying. The Hinata bit was just an example of someone ending the series with everyone feeling sorry for them. 

Nobody should be getting the raw deal, and to assume that NH automatically equals raw deal for Naruto then I don't think you're taking into account Naruto's huge heart that could probably love anybody who loves him back.

You're right though, Kishi could have Hinata move on from Naruto, but after this chapter do you really think he's setting her up to move on? She's just gone from shy girl who watches Naruto's back from the shadows (out of combat), to finally ready act on her feelings. What would the logic be behind the writing here?

I'm fully aware of all the development NS has gotten, but we're getting near the end and soon Sakura will be making her choice between Sasuke or Naruto. Kishi could go either way here, and... well... considering the direction he's taking with Hinata.. you do the math. 

(Threesome, right? )


----------



## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> How is one-sided love by a side character a clue?  You have yet to answer that question.  If you wanna talk about clues, lets do this:


I will say it again, Kishi is the one that writes the manga,he can easily say that naruto and Hinata had of screen moments,and, if you ask him why he didn't brought this up he can easily say because this is a SHOUNEN manga, not romance.
Did this answer your question ?




> 1) Naruto loves Sakura (big clue lol)


How can you even be sure about it, heck after the troll confession to him i bet he barely takes w/e  she says about love generally as serious,Naruto got a crush on her,got crushed big time when Sakura confessed to him while giving him clear messages that she still loves Sasuke and this confession is pretty much a farce in order to make him stop.





> 2) In over 400 chapters, Naruto has not even considered loving Hinata (big clue)


Read what i have said in first quote of yours.




> 3)  Hinata confessed to Naruto, but was ignored (biiiiig clue)


Because it didn't show in the manga it go ignore, holy moly, so then,lets ignore the half manga that is based on theories and assumptions, good way.




> 4)  Naruto told Sai he can't confess to Sakura until he's brought Sasuke back (biiiiiiiiiigger clue)


Until she came up and messed up the whole romance with her stupid confession, heck, it gave Naruto even more clue that even confessing after he brought Sasuke back wouldn't change anything,hell he even knew that probably but he wanted to let his feelings out anyway.




> 5) Naruto still hasn't confessed to Sakura (big clue)


The whole reason Sakura confessed to Naruto is because she knew about Naruto having crush on her,hence she used herself in order to stop him, again,its not that hard to figure it out.



> 6) The manga is almost over, and Hinata is no closer to Naruto than she was before (big clue)


Lol manga being over, Kishi could pretty much say " Hey guys, PART 2 is over, wait for part 3" Nothing is over until its over.
Again,like i quoted in the beginning, Kishimoto alreayd gave us more than enough romance in a shounen manga,he can use however other characters in order to pass through these messages.




> 7) NH has the least development out of all the pairings (big clue)


According to whom, i just hope you dont delete/ignore all pages from the manga that include Hinata and Naruto.



> 8) Hinata hardly ever shares panels with Naruto (big clue)


1 good panel ( like her confession) can easily "outshine" multiple shitty panels( Sakura's confession), there you got it.




> 9) Naruto loves Sakura (owait I said that)


 slash clap, you're so funny,  congrats!



> Lol and you want to talk about clues?  I find it funny that you try to compare my logic to a 5 year old, when you have yet to refute my argument.  I also find this
> hilarious when you just said this..


There is no need to refute your argument when its already refuted by the mangaka itself, only Kishimoto can do that.
Also my last reference was obvious trolling, hence the " welcome to the Iternets"


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 9, 2012)

Nic said:


> considering there has been a much bigger emphasis surrounding Sakura's feelings towards Naruto than Naruto towards Hinata, I somehow doubt that.



There's been a greater focus on Sakura but her feelings still haven't changed.

I don't see anything changing them at this point, not even Sasuke going full retard was enough to make her stop loving him.


----------



## SeventhPath (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Thats right gaiz..you must be blind that Kishi wanted to confirm Naruto's love for Sakura with Sai's confession because it was already confirmed since chapter one.  That means  NS is canon!!
> 
> Owait.  You must be blind that Kishi wanted to confirm Sakura's love for Sasuke in her recent flashback cuz it was already confirmed since chapter 1!  That means  SS is canon!!
> 
> ...



AMtrack - first rule with Kishi - his character development and plot are filled with inconsitencies, plot-holes, etc.

Part 2 - until the kage summit arc (Sakura's confession to Naruto, to be exact) - Kishi intended for Naruto&Sakura to be a pair (he developed NaruSaku; NaruHina - and the Hinata character, in general - were non-entities). Then he abruptly changed his mind - he said in an interview Sakura loves Sasuke, all relevant characters said Sakura loves Sasuke, her actions showed it, etc.

Since then, he was consistent with NaruHina and SasuSaku - Hinata (this non-character) actually got panels - far more panels with Naruto than Sakura; EXPLICITLY ROMANTIC PANELS, at that. Sakura got to reaffirm her love to Sasuke.

And we are in the final phase (the final arcs of the manga). This means Kishi's done with 'throwing bones'; it's the endgame (and Kishi said he already decided on the end of the manga).

Is the NaruHina relation lacking any relevant development whatsoever? Yes.
Is the SasuSaku relation atrociously 'developed'? Yes.
And?
AMtrack - second rule with Kishi - he has no problem writing atrocious character 'development' or garbage/ass-pull plot development; he has done it already in this manga, many times - Kishi decides on a development and then messes up the characters/plot as needed in order to get there.



PS - AMtrack, you obviously are emotionally invested in the NaruSaku pairing. 
As an advice - try to detach youself from it, emotionally. Or you will be hurt.


----------



## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

*And the truth shall set you free!*

The truth is...

Naruto x Hinata = Canon

Naruto x Sakura = not Canon

Here is why:

1) When Yondaime saved Kushina Uzumaki, did any of them tell eachother that they loved eachother? No. What did Kushina and Yondaime have in the beginning? Just friendship.


2) The whole idea of Naruto being a dumb ass raising his thumbs up and telling Sakura "I will save Sasuke" is just pointless if Naruto later goes and bangs Sakura.

3) Sakura loves Sasuke . Why would Naruto get in Sakura's way? Sakura has not shown ANY interest in Naruto as her partner. All she has shown is looking at Naruto as a strong hero.  When it's Sasuke  - Sakura is very obsessed, when it's Naruto Sakura is very calm. So calm that she tried to lie through stopping Naruto from chasing Sasuke.


And the most important:
4) Hinata and Naruto care for eachother. They have such bond that they can understand eachother's feelings. 





Naruto and Hinata being together is their destiny. Hinata despite BEING very, very shy girl gave Naruto a medicine kit. She dared to do that to be friends with Naruto.



I seriously don't get how much proof you people need...

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kehk_0CtBx4&feature=related[/YOUTUBE]
4:10 Naruto's rage makes Kyuubi take him over because of Hinata being stabbed to "death".


----------



## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

Target said:


> Dont think anyone smart disagrees after reading both there comments yesterday. Why do you care so much weirdo?



Their friendship development has been nice  From beginning til now every since Hinata reached out to Naruto, Naruto has done same for Hinata.

And i find that Kishimoto is doing a good job with Naruto and Hinata relationship whether that be friends or romantic lovers.


----------



## Target (Feb 9, 2012)

kishi cant write girls/romance he said so himself the best your gonna get is one panel at the end saying hinata and naruto lived happily ever after


----------



## Benzaiten (Feb 9, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> No one is saying NH is canon, and if they are that's not what they mean.
> 
> What they mean is they see it as inevitable.



Uh, I'm not sure you understand what inevitable means..


----------



## Louchan (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> he can easily say that naruto and Hinata had of screen moments,and, if you ask him why he didn't brought this up he can easily say because this is a SHOUNEN manga, not romance.


Ah, the "off-screen development" argument and "shonen manga" excuse both in one go.  Classic. 



LivingHitokiri said:


> Naruto got a crush on her,got crushed big time when Sakura confessed to him while giving him clear messages that she still loves Sasuke


Except Naruto has been fully aware of the extent of Sakura's feelings for Sasuke since chapter 183 and yet that has never stopped him from continuing to love her over the years that have gone by in the manga timeline.



LivingHitokiri said:


> i just hope you dont delete/ignore all pages from the manga that include Hinata and Naruto.


Come on, let's face it. If we took every single page that had Naruto and Hinata communicating with each other in any way it'd probably only amount to two or three chapters in size.


----------



## Yozora (Feb 9, 2012)

Hinata like Naruto
Naruto like Sakura
Sakura like Sasuke
Sasuke like Itachi
Itachi like Sasuke

Itachi X Sasuke is canon. Others than this are just you're imagination.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 9, 2012)

Benzaiten said:


> Uh, I'm not sure you understand what inevitable means..



People are saying it is definitely going to happen.

What is your definition of inevitable?


----------



## Louchan (Feb 9, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> People are saying it is definitely going to happen.
> 
> What is your definition of inevitable?


I'm pretty sure what Benzai is saying is that first saying NaruHina isn't canon but then saying it's inevitable is rather contradictive, since what you're saying is that there's apparently no way it won't become canon, hence why you might as well say it's canon already.


----------



## Leuconoe (Feb 9, 2012)

I think the main thing that runs into trouble here with NaruHina pairing wars is that everytime Hinata gets _personal_ development, people translate it as _NaruHina_ development. And even though I totally understand because Hinata's determination is intertwined with her feelings for Naruto, this is having no effect on _Naruto's_ personal love life right now.


----------



## Benzaiten (Feb 9, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> People are saying it is definitely going to happen.
> 
> What is your definition of inevitable?





			
				from an online dictionary said:
			
		

> inevitable (adjective)
> certain, unavoidable, assured, binding, compulsory, decided, decreed, destined, determined, doomed, fated, fateful, fixed, foreordained, imminent, impending, in the bag, ineluctable, ineludible, inescapable, inexorable, inflexible, irresistible, irrevocable, necessary, no ifs ands or buts, obligatory, ordained, pat, prescribed, settled, sure, unalterable, undeniable, unpreventable, without recourse



My definition of the word is the same as what's written in the dictionary and according to it, that's what inevitable means. Saying NaruHina is inevitable is as good as saying it's canon because 'inevitable' means there is no other way except 'that one'.

EDIT:



Louchan said:


> I'm pretty sure what Benzai is saying is that first saying NaruHina isn't canon but then saying it's inevitable is rather contradictive, since what you're saying is that there's apparently no way it won't become canon, hence why you might as well say it's canon already.



Wow you beat me to it


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 9, 2012)

Louchan said:


> I'm pretty sure what Benzai is saying is that first saying NaruHina isn't canon but then saying it's inevitable is rather contradictive, since what you're saying is that there's apparently no way it won't become canon, hence why you might as well say it's canon already.



You can't say something _has_ happened until it's actually happened, even if you know it _will_ happen.



Benzaiten said:


> That's what inevitable means. Saying NaruHina is inevitable is as good as saying it's canon because 'inevitable' means there is no other way except 'that one'.



A relationship doesn't become canon just because it's the only possible outcome. It has to actually happen before it is truly canon.


----------



## Leuconoe (Feb 9, 2012)

I think a better word choice here for a fan would be "imminent." Just as...well, not that true but  it sounds better than inevitable.


----------



## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Louchan said:


> Ah, the "off-screen development" argument and "shonen manga" excuse both in one go.  Classic.


Undeniable fact ?
Foreshadowing gets more focus in a Shounen manga mainly because Shounen manga is not about romance, this story is about Team 7 tragic adventures not Naruto's love problems. Kishimoto himself stated that he sucks at writing love stories hence giving even more weight to the foreshadowing that he does.


> Except Naruto has been fully aware of the extent of Sakura's feelings for Sasuke since chapter 183 and yet that has never stopped him from continuing to love her over the years that have gone by in the manga timeline.


You didnt understand what i posted, i said that he knew , heck even if he knew that Sakura wouldn't accept his feelings because she likes Sasuke  he would still say it to let out his feelings,but, after what she did with that stupid confession i doubt he even takes Sakura serious in a romantic way anymore, she literally used his feelings and trashed all over.




> Come on, let's face it. If we took every single page that had Naruto and Hinata communicating with each other in any way it'd probably only amount to two or three chapters in size.


The whole Hinata's life resolves around Narutos way of living,mangaka doesn't need to focus a whole arc just for love in the Naruto universe,he left many implementations  on how the Romance goes in the series,he never wanted to focus on it but hell because many people where asking for this he used a mix of fights and love  in order to satisfy both parties.

When someone says " We will be together forever" (random reference ) you can easily assume how it goes and what will happen in general,you don't need the full detail on their personal life just to convince yourself about them living together.

Fans many times try to complicate the manga more than it is, Naruto is more simplistic than you think,and,rather generic at some extend.
Check other Shounen mangas  ( Dragonball for example) and check how bad the romance is developed just because the mangakas of Shounen usually cannot write LOVE stories.


----------



## Leuconoe (Feb 9, 2012)

WhiteWolf said:


> The truth is...
> 
> Naruto x Hinata = Canon
> 
> ...


No I do not agree that NaruHina is cannon yet. That monolouge was _personally Hinata's_ development and had no effect on Naruto's love life. How could it? He's in the middle of fighting Tobi, not reading Hinata's mind.  

Do I think this is a hint that we're getting close to Hinata's story resolve and that soon she'll finally express the true feelings she wants to _convey_ to Naruto? Yes. And good luck to her. 

How in the world does a one-sided monolouge with Naruto not even there make you think this is cannon now? It's the same information we've been getting since day one. Hinata is getting stronger and wants to be with Naruto.

And no, I don't think NaruSaku is cannon right now either.


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## Joshu (Feb 9, 2012)

WhiteWolf said:


> The truth is...
> 
> Naruto x Hinata = Canon
> 
> ...


I think your theory is fine.

I hope Naruto Fan Forum however, hasn't ruined you vocabulary.

You promised us canon and only provided conjecture.


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## Bane (Feb 9, 2012)

I thought this became apparent like 30 chapters ago when Sakura rejected that love note fodders letter and said there was someone which left everyone thinking she was talking about Naruto, only to find out next chapter that she's still a stupid bitch.


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## Taijukage (Feb 9, 2012)

> only to find out next chapter that she's still a stupid bitch.


yes because loving someone other than yourself makes you a bitch. right.


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## Ryuzaki (Feb 9, 2012)

Holy shit, 600 posts? Fan pairings are serious business.

I'm still not sure as to how or why anyone thinks this wouldn't be canon. If you take into factor how poorly written the romance aspect was this chapter (Hinata) and the fact that this is the best Kishi can do, why would Sakura be relevant at all?

Most fans that support Sakura are just deluding themselves at this point. I mean, Hinata was about 30 chapters early about the whole "I love you" confession, sure it was poorly written, but when Sakura went to the summit to cock-block Hinata, Naruto was all like "bitch why you lying?"

[2]
[2]
[2]

I don't think you can ignore those pages, when it's pretty much manga canon now that Naruto hates Sakura


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 9, 2012)

Taijukage said:


> yes because loving someone other than yourself makes you a bitch. right.



Loving Sasuke makes her a stupid bitch.



Ryuzaki said:


> I don't think you can ignore those pages, when it's pretty much manga canon now that Naruto hates Sakura



Naruto doesn't hate Sakura, that's ridiculous (and unfortunate).


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## TJFuZioN (Feb 9, 2012)

For the record, it goes:

Jiraiya
Minato
Naruto

Therefore the corresponding females are:

Tsunade
Kushina
(NOT HINATA)


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## Nic (Feb 9, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> There's been a greater focus on Sakura but her feelings still haven't changed.
> 
> I don't see anything changing them at this point, not even Sasuke going full retard was enough to make her stop loving him.



naturally since everything is supposed to be settled with their fight. lol


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## Nagiza (Feb 9, 2012)

@Scarlet  R-Truth



Ryuzaki said:


> Holy shit, 600 posts? Fan pairings are serious business.
> 
> I'm still not sure as to how or why anyone thinks this wouldn't be canon. If you take into factor how poorly written the romance aspect was this chapter (Hinata) and the fact that this is the best Kishi can do, why would Sakura be relevant at all?
> 
> ...



Okay, let me ask you a question. All of these panels show Naruto saving Sakura AFTER her confession.

[2]
[2]
[2]

So, if he hated her because of that, why would he save her both times, let alone still call her chan? Because he's just not an asshole? No, because he still cares for her.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

The confession wasn't enough for Naruto to hate Sakura, if she wanted really to be hated by him she would go rapestomp like Pain and destroy Konoha,which will never happen.


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## Kurama (Feb 9, 2012)

Naruto doesn't hate Sakura, but him saving her and calling her -chan isn't exactly proof of everlasting love either.


NaruHina: one-sided with intent to pursue [Hinata] + ambiguously positive [Naruto]
NaruSaku: ambiguously one sided without intent to pursue [Naruto] + concretely negative [Sakura]
SasuSaku: one-sided without intent to pursue [Sakura] + negative due to current insanity [Sasuke]


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## Whirlpool (Feb 9, 2012)

kyuubi425 said:


> Naruto doesn't hate Sakura, but him saving her and calling her -chan isn't exactly proof of everlasting love either.



I know, but he still loves her anyways


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## Whirlpool (Feb 9, 2012)

WhiteWolf said:


> The truth is...
> 
> Naruto x Hinata = Canon
> 
> ...



 Wow...just wow...

I'm sure they've grew such a string bond and became BFFs with all8 interactions they've had 

I aint denying that NaruHina can't become canon, but you talk as if they are with each other regularly. Naruto knows nothing about Hinata, what she likes, dislikes, how her childhood went etc.... 

Does he even know she has a sister


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## ch1p (Feb 9, 2012)

Now that this thread has calmed down, I have some things to say about this week's developments.

Hinata is pairing fodder to the max and this chapter only cemented it further. There's nothing about her whatsoever that cannot be related to Naruto. All she says or does is about Naruto somehow. Not once has she expressed some interest in anything else. She might have think of other things, but she has never shown in the manga to have them. This is beyond _pathetic_. Only Karin managed to be this one track minded and at least she was amusing while she was at it. If Hinata doesn't get Naruto at the end of this manga, her character will have accomplished _nothing_. Not that Naruto is a prize for her to have (far from it), but honestly, what's her character in this manga even there for if she doesn't get him? To show that if you're passive and you don't fight for what you want, you won't be achieving anything, because things don't fall into your lap if you really don't work for it or it might be too late when you finally decide to move your arse? _IF ONLY_.

That said, this arc's relentless pandering to NarHin, makes an ending with it more likely. I don't even know why this is being denied. The focus the pairing has had in this arc is overwhelming and it was _two sided_ (never thought I'd see the day). From a story construction POV, what's this focus even doing here if it's all for nothing? What's this buildup for _at the final stretch of the manga_ if not for a positive resolution? Troll people?

Some say it's for pairing wars and keeping the reader interested. Honestly, after Sakura's feelings being clear in 540, this war being a two day affair thing, Sakura's speech this chapter focused on focused on friendship and teamwork... Unless NarSak gets something huge soon and I don't even know how that's going to be believable (is there a point in defending it doesn't need to be believable?), then all NarSak has for it is Sakura changing her mind after the war is over. So there are no pairing tension here.

That said, this chapter brings nothing new. *Hinata wants to jump Naruto, tell me something everyone doesn't know.* The true core of this is Naruto himself and it has always been. He might love Sakura still and even if he has fallen out of love for her (is there even a hint of this?), that doesn't mean he'll automatically fall for Hinata. One sided confessions from background characters sometimes _really_ don't matter (Lee, oh Lee , you confessed too soon, if it only was towards the end of the manga). I'm not saying anything new either, suck it captain obvious.

So who knows, maybe Kishi truly sucks at romance like he's been saying all along and this arc buildup really is for nothing. Or he's a best story teller / troll than I ever thought. One of these, whatever it is I _wish_ was the case. All I know is that I don't want to see NarHin. Troll NarHin, Kishimoto. My body is ready for another 35 pages of LOL and facepalming. Even my OTP getting trolled is worth... no, wait, I'm not finishing that sentence. No way that's true. 



Skywalker said:


>







Battoumaru said:


> Stubborn people are stubborn. NaruHina has been foreshadowed for the longest time. From the pilot chapter, even! "Naruto moves toward the Sun" with a spiral in the sun behind an image of Hinata? Before she was even intended to be a shinobi? If she wasn't meant to be a shinobi, then what relevance would her character have served, were she not his love interest?



Dat image. 

You can come up with a million foreshadowings if you look at the Naruto spreads or complementing material. That's not an argument.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Calling one of the main romance character of the series makes your argument even more dull.
Like saying that Naruto thinking during whole manga about becoming Hokage is fodder.
How can someone's thoughts about other person can be considered as negative argument for a pairing, you gotta be kidding me.


----------



## Nagiza (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> Calling one of the main romance character of the series makes your argument even more dull.
> Like saying that Naruto thinking during whole manga about becoming Hokage is fodder.
> How can someone's thoughts about other person can be considered as negative argument for a pairing, you gotta be kidding me.



He was probably just saying that because it's pretty much been confirmed, unfortunately. Most of the panels, if not all of them, are her focusing on Naruto. Not her clan or anything else. Only being with Naruto. If she thought of her friends, family, clan more often then she wouldn't be called pairing fodder as often.


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## Don-kun (Feb 9, 2012)

I'm very sure that is rude to call a person to call any person chan..... If I'm not wrong he never use that term with any of his age girl in the Manga.

In the Japanese culture most people are refered to with a suffix by others as either a way of being *polite or intimate.* *Teme and chan are basically an extra word to show affection towards the person and are considered more close* "feminine" to say. Kun is a more proper term more commonly used on males for politeness or friendliness...

Chan (ちゃん?) is a diminutive suffix; it expresses that the speaker *finds a person endearing*. In general, chan is used for babies, young children, grandparents and teenage girls. It may also be used towards cute animals, *lovers, close friends*, or any youthful woman.... Naruto loves Sakura and he still do, just because he is not spelling it like Hinata does not mean that he doesn't......

When you feel betray by someone you like the suffix is 1st thing you will drop.... That will give them a message we are friends but things will no be the same. He still love her but her feelings come first....that's selflessness he has on that't true way to show someone that you truly love them....




Hinata love is big, but Naruto love is selfless. I choose Naruto


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 9, 2012)

Nagiza said:


> He was probably just saying that because it's pretty much been confirmed, unfortunately. Most of the panels, if not all of them, are her focusing on Naruto. Not her clan or anything else. Only being with Naruto. If she thought of her friends, family, clan more often then she wouldn't be called pairing fodder as often.



Why would she think about the Hyuuga and Rookies when they haven't been relevant since the end of Part 1?


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## Nagiza (Feb 9, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Why would she think about the Hyuuga and Rookies when they haven't been relevant since the end of Part 1?



To show that she still cares about them too? There was the panel where she saved Neji from the zetsu clone, so that's something. I just wish that her entire character wouldn't completely revolve around Naruto. I used to be neutral about her, but I'm sorta being disappointed right now with her.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Nagiza said:


> He was probably just saying that because it's pretty much been confirmed, unfortunately. Most of the panels, if not all of them, are her focusing on Naruto. Not her clan or anything else. Only being with Naruto. If she thought of her friends, family, clan more often then she wouldn't be called pairing fodder as often.


The manga is called Naruto,the person she likes is naruto,her whole character development comes from Naruto's way of living. Why should i care if she things about her thinking about her family ( she probably does but its just pointless to add manga panels for that) .We already had a good look in her family life at Chunnin exam arc.
This chapter wants to show how strong are the bonds of Naruto and his Nakama,some romantic,some due to rivalry,some due to friendship and Hinata's definitely a bond of romance.
It would impossible to cover every characters in this manga exact thoughts, since it would require 300 pages .
Seriously,who else you saw in this manga thinking about their famillies at this extend . Sakura thinks about Sasuke since chapter 2 of the manga,should we criticize her for this, no.
Only thoughts about families/friends etc in detail that we care to learn are Naruto's since he is the main Joker of the series.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 9, 2012)

Nagiza said:


> To show that she still cares about them too? There was the panel where she saved Neji from the zetsu clone, so that's something. I just wish that her entire character wouldn't completely revolve around Naruto. I used to be neutral about her, but I'm sorta being disappointed right now with her.



All of the side characters have shit characterization though, that's hardly something you can hold exclusively against Hinata.

And despite her terrible characterization she's still pretty inoffensive, something Sakura could only dream of being.


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## Sasuko (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> Calling one of the main romance character of the series makes your argument even more dull.
> Like saying that Naruto thinking during whole manga about becoming Hokage is fodder.
> How can someone's thoughts about other person can be considered as negative argument for a pairing, you gotta be kidding me.



Because Hinata isn't inspired by anyone other than Naruto. She exists for Naruto. That is pathetic in some cases.  

Blame the settings, manga-ka panel limits and her side-character role but at least recognize that that's what Hinata _is_ summarized into: someone who loves for Naruto and is related to the arrogant prick (that picked on Naruto), Neji.

By the way, the parallels with Jira-Tsu and Mina-Kushi are left field. Here's why: Jiraiya and Tsunade were teammates who had Orochimaru. Minato and Kushina were not on the same genin squad (hence the nonexistent third member), they were each other's first love/best friend from childhood. One was never canon and the other will always be. Just because Naruto has surpassed his own father and mentor doesn't mean he either does or doesn't get a girl () as a complement. Tsunade and Kushina are distant relatives, does that mean Sakura is a Senju relative? 

See the hilarious fail of parallels?


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## Lovely (Feb 9, 2012)

Hinata was doing the same as everyone else, but the nature of her words happen to not be as platonic so she gets crap as a consequence. 

Her statement fits with how she feels about Naruto, just the same as the rest of the rookies. Sakura's always felt guilty for not being able to fight alongside him, so she thinks to herself that she'll be able to this time. Kiba has always been competitive with Naruto, so he thinks of him as a rival. Hinata has always loved Naruto... so she thinks of finally having a relationship.

I do admit to being a little taken aback though, for her words are very bold. I don't think Kishi would have let her say that if it wasn't going to happen.


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## Nagiza (Feb 9, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> All of the side characters have shit characterization though, that's hardly something you can hold exclusively against Hinata.
> 
> And despite her terrible characterization she's still pretty inoffensive, something Sakura could only dream of being.



Yet I actually like some of the other side characters like Lee and Ino.

As for inoffensive, Sakura will speak her mind impulsively most of the time. And that either just warns the enemy she's facing or just stupid. But you're wrong if you think that she's always like that. Sakura can't be when she's at work, healing. And when the love letter nin confessed to her, she could've been like: "Hell no. Get away from me." like she was to Lee in Part 1, but she didn't. She turned him down nicely.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> By the way, the parallels with Jira-Tsu and Mina-Kushi are left field. Here's why: Jiraiya and Tsunade were teammates who had Orochimaru. Minato and Kushina were not on the same genin squad (hence the nonexistent third member), they were each other's first love/best friend from childhood. One was never canon and the other will always be. Just because Naruto has surpassed his own father and mentor doesn't mean he either does or doesn't get a girl () as a complement. Tsunade and Kushina are distant relatives, does that mean Sakura is a Senju relative?
> 
> See the hilarious fail of parallels?



To be honest I view the differences as mattering very little when their personalities are so similar. Anyone denying that the parallels are there seems to be kidding themselves nowadays, of course they may not lead to anything, but they are there.

It's really another example of pairing foreshadowing to have Naruto succeed where Jiraiya failed or to find a girl like his mother.

I mean damn, I know you ANS like to try and belittle that Sakura/Kushina page full of panels, but your argument basically boils down to the law of large numbers and everything being a coincidence from that. I can't say that I agree considering how few panels Kushina gets and some of the very real similarities for Sakura that have only been brought up once or twice.


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## Kage (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Because Hinata isn't inspired by anyone other than Naruto. She exists for Naruto. That is pathetic in some cases.



it's just made the "creepy" mark for me.

being inspired by him isn't a bad thing in itself but...it's the only thing she thinks about. *ever.*


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## Benzaiten (Feb 9, 2012)

You guys, why are you even arguing about this? 

Nothing changed.

Sure, NaruHina (or should I say Hinata) has been getting a lot of panel time as of late but it hasn't done anything to change the pairing dynamics (Naruto still loves Sakura, Sakura still loves Sasuke, and Hinata still loves Naruto). I mean yes, it puts NH on the radar but when has it ever been not on the radar? Whether or not a Hinata or NH moment appeared, this pairing's always been talked about (where's Hinata, where is the Hyuuga arc, when will Hinata help Naruto control the kyuubi with her jyuuken, Hinata will be the brightest spot in KCM Naruto's vision, etc.).

The pairings are still one-sided as ever. The only thing that ever really changed in this chapter is that we now know Hinata wants to pursue a romantic relationship with Naruto (unlike in her confession where she confessed only for the sake of confessing due to the whole thing being her personal suicide mission). However, for a one-sided pairing to become canon, the nonreciprocating side should return the other person's feelings. Being hammered with panels of how much Hinata loves Naruto isn't going to make that happen. And please don't bring up the 'NarSak failfession' because whether or not "Naruto hates her now", he's not going to immediately fall for another girl just because he 'is disgusted' by the pink bitchslutwhore.


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## ch1p (Feb 9, 2012)

> In the Japanese culture most people are refered to with a suffix by others as either a way of being *polite or intimate.* *Teme and chan are basically an extra word to show affection towards the person and are considered more close* "feminine" to say.


Teme is not a suffix. Teme is an informal and extremely rude way of saying "you". It's rampant in fanfics, Naruto calling Sasuke, Sasuke-teme, but it's incorrect. Or at least, that's what I was lectured about once.



LivingHitokiri said:


> Calling one of the main romance character of the series makes your argument even more dull.
> Like saying that Naruto thinking during whole manga about becoming Hokage is fodder.
> How can someone's thoughts about other person can be considered as negative argument for a pairing, you gotta be kidding me.



Hinata isn't shown thinking of anything else but Naruto. I aknowledge it's not the character's fault, it's Kishinomoto's, and that this chapter is actually a good excuse for her to think about Naruto. However and I'm sorry if it hurts your feelings, but I'm going to mention the truth if I see fit.


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## Sasuko (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> To be honest I view the differences as mattering very little when their personalities are so similar. Anyone denying that the parallels are there seems to be kidding themselves nowadays, of course they may not lead to anything, but they are there.
> 
> It's really another example of pairing foreshadowing to have Naruto succeed where Jiraiya failed or to find a girl like his mother.
> 
> I mean damn, I know you ANS like to try and belittle that Sakura/Kushina page full of panels, but your argument basically boils down to the law of large numbers and everything being a coincidence from that. I can't say that I agree considering how few panels Kushina gets and some of the very real similarities for Sakura that have only been brought up once or twice.



Kidding myself since I don't believe in "parallels" in NS/SS/NH?  

Very real similarities? Tell me. Like going from 0-60 in a matter of seconds with[out] a fist, which is a recurring reaction of mothers and girls in the manga (even Mikoto)? Naruto comments on how mothers are scary then recalls Shikamaru's (not in that order but whatever). I don't believe that's deliberate foreshadowing to Sakura. Kushina's last words were ambiguous: "like me." As in yeah, a tomboy who loves him intensely or, someone who would love Naruto as much as she did. *shrug* Again, how does that boil down to Sakura, only? Tsunade and Jiraiya had commented before how Kushina was a tomboy and "motor-mouth", like Naruto. It's one thing to say that Sakura is like Kushina and another to stick by it like it's destiny: an actual argument. 

With Tsunade, I take it that she is very much like Sakura. Often, Sakura's parallel to her is ignored for pairing benefit. Tsunade failed to keep those she loved alive and the Sannin trio deteriorated-- and it's fair to say that Sakura would be different. Abilities-wise, Sakura would surpass her. To bring up Tsu's love life is a mess isn't it? Who's Dan? Nawaki? 

(LOL, heard that they were both Naruto since they wanted to be Hokage. ) 

Those loved ones were outside of the triad. Is that part of Tsunade's parallel to Sakura or are we cherry picking? (Like Mikoto to Sakura.  When really, Sasuke would be more like his mom...or like Hinata, if she existed outside of Narutoland.  SasuHina!) 

Oh, and before I get bombarded with Kushina/Hinata bias, I think that is utter bull shit as well. MK to NH is ridunkulous.  

For pairing/bond/character parallels to work, there needs to be explicit references. Kishi needs to go, "Hey guys, they're like this parallel bond. Aren't they epic? " or "Sakura is becoming the second Tsunade."


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Because Hinata isn't inspired by anyone other than Naruto. She exists for Naruto. That is pathetic in some cases.
> 
> Blame the settings, manga-ka panel limits and her side-character role but at least recognize that that's what Hinata _is_ summarized into: someone who loves for Naruto and is related to the arrogant prick (that picked on Naruto), Neji.


Being inspired by the Main character of the series is all i want ( or the main reason i need) and is more than enough. The rest is irrelevant since Hinata is a romance interest in the series. yes i agree she could have had  a better development but from the standpoint of view and Kishimoto focuses the story around is everything about Team 7 and MAINLY Naruto, the rest can be considered  fodder,lacking development/characterization since there are plenty of holes/questions left around that probably never will be explained.
Kishimoto ( like i've said in my previous posts ) doesnt want to give anyone more focus than Naruto as individual. You can summarize all this story on how Naruto became from  the most hated person into a Hokage in short.

Her being inspire by Naruto is more than enough for me to understand her way of living,developing and her character as general. her fight with Pain was the first result about her growth,now her resolve is another one and im sure im missing tons of hidden content lying behind the words.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 9, 2012)

Benzaiten said:


> Words



Nothing really changed, but the fact that Hinata's feelings continue to be emphasized is leading more people to believe something will actually come of it, rather than just her being friend zoned.


----------



## gershwin (Feb 9, 2012)

Damn those Kushina parallels are completely far-fetched 
When Kishi wants the reader to see paralells - he makes them much more obvious. Here it was stated that Kushina is a lot like Naruto, and thats the only truth.
Even if someone wants to believe in Sakura - Kushina`s clone, it still fails as foreshadowing.
Kushina tells Naruto to find someone like his mother. A good, loving woman - thats what she meant. Telling her son on her death bed to marry a girl with her personality or hair color makes Kushina completely retarded.


----------



## Mael (Feb 9, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> My body is ready for fan-tears.



Considering I still ship NarHin, this seems like an acceptable answer but only in some contexts.



First Tsurugi said:


> Nothing really changed, but the fact that Hinata's feelings continue to be emphasized is leading more people to believe something will actually come of it, rather than just her being friend zoned.



Indeed.  All that's required is Naruto's action and we have ourself the result.  That is of course if Sasuke in drag doesn't entice him first.



gershvin said:


> Damn those Kushina parallels are completely far-fetched
> When Kishi wants the reader to see paralells - he makes them much more obvious. Here it was stated that Kushina is a lot like Naruto, and thats the only truth.
> Even if someone wants to believe in Sakura - Kushina`s clone, it still fails as foreshadowing.
> Kushina tells Naruto to find someone like his mother. A good, loving woman - thats what she meant. Telling her son on her death bed to marry a girl with her personality or hair color makes Kushina completely retarded.



I wish you'd all stop with any form of parallel argument, ALL OF YOU.

It's one of the lamest excuses used to justify anything next to *using fanarts*.  If I were a writer and fans did this to my work, I'd laugh my ass off as to how most of them know nothing of my work a la _Annie Hall_.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Ch1p said:


> Hinata isn't shown thinking of anything else but Naruto. I aknowledge it's not the character's fault, it's Kishinomoto's, and that this chapter is actually a good excuse for her to think about Naruto. However and I'm sorry if it hurts your feelings, but I'm going to mention the truth if I see fit.



There isn't Truth in fiction thats is written by a person, especially not  before it even finished.
There are however some facts,messages that the mangaka give us in order help us progress with these questions or even make new ones to be born.
This chapter alone shows a great deal on how Hinata sees, or wanna see her future and how she grows and finally decides to go for it , you do not consider this a development  then what ?
It may look no big deal for you but for Hinata  it is considered a huge step forward her feelings and determination.
Im gonna say this again, blame Kishimoto for sucking at writing love in his series and using 80% of the times foreshadowing and make us talk days and night on what each of them meant or try to mean.


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## Mael (Feb 9, 2012)

> Im gonna say this again, blame Kishimoto for sucking at writing love in his series and using 80% of the times foreshadowing and make us talk days and night on what each of them meant or try to mean.



Oh I blame him for a lot of things...terrible writing from what it once was should be compressed altogether.


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## Sasuko (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> Being inspired by the Main character of the series is all i want ( or the main reason i need) and is more than enough. The rest is irrelevant since Hinata is a romance interest in the series. yes i agree she could have had  a better development but from the standpoint of view and Kishimoto focuses the story around is everything about Team 7 and MAINLY Naruto, the rest can be considered  fodder,lacking development/characterization since there are plenty of holes/questions left around that probably never will be explained.
> Kishimoto ( like i've said in my previous posts ) doesnt want to give anyone more focus than Naruto as individual. You can summarize all this story on how Naruto became from  the most hated person into a Hokage in short.
> 
> Her being inspire by Naruto is more than enough for me to understand her way of living,developing and her character as general. her fight with Pain was the first result about her growth,now her resolve is another one and im sure im missing tons of hidden content lying behind the words.



Then keep on liking her. Kishi has given few panels/back stories of other secondary characters that lacked of Naruto's existence. But yeah, keep liking her.


----------



## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Then keep on liking her. Kishi has given few panels/back stories of other secondary characters that lacked of Naruto's existence. But yeah, keep liking her.


All of them either had great importance in Naruto development as character or they where fillers, i would like you to point me these panels you're so fond of.
I do not particularly dislike any characters, i may dislike how kishi writes many times  but all characters are at least tolerable in my list.


----------



## Renyou (Feb 9, 2012)

Centeolt said:


> Naruto will realise that Hinata was always there for him.



Being "always there for him" implies they interacted all the time. We all know that's not the case.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Kidding myself since I don't believe in "parallels" in NS/SS/NH?



I never said anything about SS/NH, NS has always been the pairing that has had popular parallels.



> Very real similarities? Tell me. Like going from 0-60 in a matter of seconds with[out] a fist, which is a recurring reaction of mothers and girls in the manga (even Mikoto)? Naruto comments on how mothers are scary then recalls Shikamaru's (not in that order but whatever). I don't believe that's deliberate foreshadowing to Sakura. Kushina's last words were ambiguous: "like me." As in yeah, a tomboy who loves him intensely or, someone who would love Naruto as much as she did. *shrug* Again, how does that boil down to Sakura, only? Tsunade and Jiraiya had commented before how Kushina was a tomboy and "motor-mouth", like Naruto. It's one thing to say that Sakura is like Kushina and another to stick by it like it's destiny: an actual argument.



I didn't say it was like destiny, I said Sakura is like Kushina.

"Like me" isn't terribly ambiguous though, it means someone like Kushina. Do I really need to find that picture with the panels? However to me, one of the most telling parallels between Kushina and Sakura is the red hair/forehead (and no, that doesn't mean I think the chapter 3 scene will be revisited, I guess it's possible though). Then there is the hitting, which we have never seen from another mother (I always got the impression Shikamaru's mother was scary from a nagging/overprotective standpoint rather than physically).



> With Tsunade, I take it that she is very much like Sakura. Often, Sakura's parallel to her is ignored for pairing benefit. Tsunade failed to keep those she loved alive and the Sannin trio deteriorated-- and it's fair to say that Sakura would be different. Abilities-wise, Sakura would surpass her. To bring up Tsu's love life is a mess isn't it? Who's Dan? Nawaki?



Naruto actually parallels to every male in Tsunade's life , however the key one is definitely JiraTsu and how that tragically never quite worked out. Again, if Naruto is meant to succeed where Jiraiya failed, that could quite possibly include actually getting the girl.

NS parallels to JiraTsu simply because of how alike Naruto is to Jiraiya and Sakura is to Tsunade, while sure, it's not the exact same, otherwise it'd be boring.

A key point to note here is that anyone who likens Dan to Sasuke is talking out their ass.



> (LOL, heard that they were both Naruto since they wanted to be Hokage. )



Well Naruto does remind Tsunade of both of them. 

But that isn't the issue, parallels are never 100%.

What they do parallel to is special people who Sakura wants to protect, whereas Tsunade ultimately couldn't (it seems the Sannin were quite the failures in the end ).



> Those loved ones were outside of the triad. Is that part of Tsunade's parallel to Sakura or are we cherry picking? (Like Mikoto to Sakura.  When really, Sasuke would be more like his mom...or like Hinata, if she existed outside of Narutoland.  SasuHina!)



Eh, I couldn't care less about Mikoto to be honest.

But to expect all parallels to match completely (including personal history) just seems ridiculous, each character has to be different despite the parallels. To say that Naruto is exactly like any of the people he's been explicitly and in-canon told he resembles is foolish.



> For pairing/bond/character parallels to work, there needs to be explicit references. Kishi needs to go, "Hey guys, they're like this parallel bond. Aren't they epic? " or "Sakura is becoming the second Tsunade."



Why? Of course Jiraiya did say Sakura had become like a second Tsunade. I just don't really see the need for explicit parallels when they are really so similar, JiraTsu is a no-brainer given the team 7 = Sannin parallel (which no, still isn't completely dealt with, Naruto is still a lot like Jiraiya and Sakura doesn't have shit going on other than being in team 7 and Tsunade's apprentice). MinaKushi scrapes in because of that page of parallels between Sakura and Kushina, while yes Kushina is the most like Naruto, she also explicitly told Naruto to find a girl like her, which naturally brings up the thought of parallels.


----------



## gabzilla (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> There isn't Truth in fiction thats is written by a person, especially not  before it even finished.
> There are however some facts,messages that the mangaka give us in order help us progress with these questions or even make new ones to be born.
> This chapter alone shows a great deal on how Hinata sees, or wanna see her future and how she grows and finally decides to go for it , you do not consider this a development  then what ?
> It may look no big deal for you but for Hinata  it is considered a huge step forward her feelings and determination.
> Im gonna say this again, blame Kishimoto for sucking at writing love in his series and using 80% of the times foreshadowing and make us talk days and night on what each of them meant or try to mean.



So her future begins and ends with Naruto? That's pretty sad. I love the character, but come on.


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## Sasuko (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> All of them either had great importance in Naruto development as character or they where fillers, i would like you to point me these panels you're so fond of.
> I do not particularly dislike any characters, i may dislike how kishi writes many times  but all characters are at least tolerable in my list.



The panels I'm so fond of (wth, I did not claim this fondness)? I'd be OT-ing this because it's outside of Hime. Just on top of my head: Lee's surgery. How was Naruto attached to that? Kimimaro. Kakashi. Shikamaru and Chouji's bond. Ino thanked her father and had a moment with their dead sensei; she's connected to Naruto but doesn't put him in the centre of her focus. Tenten? What about her...*head scratch*


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## ch1p (Feb 9, 2012)

It's very good to use Kushina as a parallel to whom Naruto will end up with. There's nothing better than to have the desire to fuck a shadow of your mother. That is true love right there. 



LivingHitokiri said:


> This chapter alone shows a great deal on how Hinata sees, or wanna see her future and how she grows and finally decides to go for it , you do not consider this a development  then what ?



I just wish it her character wasn't summed thoroughly as one word and a suffix: Naruto-kun.

What development? It's still all about Naruto-kun. Then only different thing is that she decided to do something different with her Naruto-kun. How snazzy and novel. *sigh*



> Im gonna say this again, blame Kishimoto for sucking at writing love in his series


I do. However, that only goes so far. He has made characters that aren't this one tracked minded after all.

edit: this is getting serious bizz again.  I'm off to bathe the cat.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Renyou said:


> Being "always there for him" implies they interacted all the time. We all know that's not the case.


The one you call " you know" could be literally destroyed by a mere flashback if the mangaka decides.
We do not know that the exact interaction between Hinata and Naruto, Naruto actions towards her could imply multiple things from many standpoints.
Hell at this point i think its risky to say that nobody from the Rookie team is nto interacting with Naruto most of times.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Ch1p said:


> It's very good to use Kushina as a parallel to whom Naruto will end up with. There's nothing better than to have the desire to fuck a shadow of your mother. That is true love right there.


I lold.




> I just wish it her character wasn't summed thoroughly as one word and a suffix: Naruto-kun.
> 
> What development? It's still all about Naruto-kun. Then only different thing is that she decided to do something different with her Naruto-kun. How snazzy and novel. *sigh*
> 
> ...


Whats important is not her words but her thoughts.
Development as in same way Sakura developed her resolve and grown after she decided to take on Sasuke, the main difference?
Sakura gets whole chapters about it while Hinata few panels. 
Do you really forget how many times we had this Sasuke kun by Sakura side? Hinata looks more repetitive only because she gets less screentime that Sakura, if you did flip the roles around it would be EXACT the same thing.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

gershvin said:


> Damn those Kushina parallels are completely far-fetched



Kushina was in what, like 6 chapters?

How is is that there's so many similarities between her and Sakura then?

This isn't a case of the law of large numbers, many of the similarities aren't generic poses.



> When Kishi wants the reader to see paralells - he makes them much more obvious. Here it was stated that Kushina is a lot like Naruto, and thats the only truth.



I'm not aware he's ever said this.

And the parallels were obvious to be honest, how can someone read Kushina's line about her hair and not realize the parallel to Sakura's forehead?



> Even if someone wants to believe in Sakura - Kushina`s clone, it still fails as foreshadowing.



Not a clone, just similar in ways.



> Kushina tells Naruto to find someone like his mother. A good, loving woman - thats what she meant. Telling her son on her death bed to marry a girl with her personality or hair color makes Kushina completely retarded.



, Kushina is kind of rash, telling Naruto to find someone with a personality like hers is in no way out of the question. 

Again, nothing has to come of this, but the parallel is there. Kushina telling Naruto to find someone like her deliberately raises the point of parallels, which actually loops back into your point about Kishi being more obvious generally.


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## Sasuko (Feb 9, 2012)

BAHH I wrote a wall text before this. 



Mr Horrible said:


> I never said anything about SS/NH, NS has always been the pairing that has had popular parallels.



Beg to differ. Hence why I even pulled other examples to ridicule parallels. 



> I didn't say it was like destiny, I said Sakura is like Kushina.



Throughout this thread, I was addressing the tendency to hold onto it like it's fact leading to "validity" for a pairing. The parallel is suddenly 100% reliable to fall back on. 



> "Like me" isn't terribly ambiguous though, it means someone like Kushina. Do I really need to find that picture with the panels? However to me, one of the most telling parallels between Kushina and Sakura is the red hair/forehead (and no, that doesn't mean I think the chapter 3 scene will be revisited, I guess it's possible though). Then there is the hitting, which we have never seen from another mother (I always got the impression Shikamaru's mother was scary from a nagging/overprotective standpoint rather than physically).



Sigh. It is ambiguous. Like her? When personal history isn't 100%, then what makes appearance as enough of a connection? The hitting? Kushina tends to hit people who make false accusations about her, yeah? What I'm getting here is superficial trivia, which makes it flexible to stick on any girl.  



> Naruto actually parallels to every male in Tsunade's life , however the key one is definitely JiraTsu and how that tragically never quite worked out. Again, if Naruto is meant to succeed where Jiraiya failed, that could quite possibly include actually getting the girl.



Every male in Tsunade's life? It's only because they wanted to be Hokage. One was a medic nin. The other one barely made it to chuunin, I think. Tsu liked Dan because he wanted to protect the village (and maybe he was hot?) and loved her lilbro because he had his own dream of protecting the village like their past relatives. 



> NS parallels to JiraTsu simply because of how alike Naruto is to Jiraiya and Sakura is to Tsunade, while sure, it's not the exact same, otherwise it'd be boring.



It only scratches the surface of their friendship. 



> A key point to note here is that anyone who likens Dan to Sasuke is talking out their ass.



Pretty much.



> Well Naruto does remind Tsunade of both of them.But that isn't the issue, parallels are never 100%.
> 
> What they do parallel to is special people who Sakura wants to protect, whereas Tsunade ultimately couldn't (it seems the Sannin were quite the failures in the end ).



They all were. 



> Eh, I couldn't care less about Mikoto to be honest.


Grr...Well, it was an example of parallels. *savestheMikotospaz* 



> But to expect all parallels to match completely (including personal history) just seems ridiculous, each character has to be different despite the parallels. To say that Naruto is exactly like any of the people he's been explicitly and in-canon told he resembles is foolish.



Yet Kishi hasn't failed drawing out obvious similarities that trumps out most ambiguity. Minato and Naruto. Hashirama and Madara to Naruto and Sasuke.  Here, if Kishi states Kushina is like Sakura then I'd be convinced that it isn't grasping.  

InoSaku is terribly ignored as a bond, sigh.



> Why? Of course Jiraiya did say Sakura had become like a second Tsunade. I just don't really see the need for explicit parallels when they are really so similar, JiraTsu is a no-brainer given the team 7 = Sannin parallel (which no, still isn't completely dealt with, Naruto is still a lot like Jiraiya and Sakura doesn't have shit going on other than being in team 7 and Tsunade's apprentice). MinaKushi scrapes in because of that page of parallels between Sakura and Kushina, while yes Kushina is the most like Naruto, she also explicitly told Naruto to find a girl like her, which naturally brings up the thought of parallels.



Fair enough.


----------



## Renyou (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> The one you call " you know" could be literally destroyed by a mere flashback if the mangaka decides.
> We do not know that the exact interaction between Hinata and Naruto, Naruto actions towards her could imply multiple things from many standpoints.



I don't get your post. Are you trying to say you're waiting for a retcon from Kishi to show us that Hinata and Naruto have always been close, when the entire manga shows otherwise?


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Renyou said:


> I don't get your post. Are you trying to say you're waiting for a retcon from Kishi to show us that Hinata and Naruto have always been close, when the entire manga shows otherwise?


Lol no, i would be way too blind to even consider this.
My point is that we actually never saw Naruto's  view about Hinata in a long long time,and, by the way her acts towards he it definitely looks that something changed and i think we will see at what extend it did maybe after/during this war arc.
There is a reason for Kishi showing this huge step forward from Hinata and her confidence could imply that things will happen or did happen already but we havent seen them yet.
I would disagree about Hinata and Naruto not being close on daily basis,just because the manga doesn't show it.


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## Kage (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> I would disagree about Hinata and Naruto not being close on daily basis,just because the manga doesn't show it.


...

um...

that's _kind of_ important.

when the manga shows you things.

"just because the manga doesn't show it" shouldn't be so damn convenient.


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## Sasuko (Feb 9, 2012)

Off-screen development FTL...

Sounds like SK.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Kage said:


> ...
> 
> um...
> 
> ...


Convenient indeed but you cannot exclude it as well.
This kind of scenario happen couple of times already in the manga,with, the most recent one the gather of all bijuu, i doubt many could even imagine that bijuu had relationship between them as individuals besides being powers of destruction during whole manga.
Like i've said, we shouldn't take it as give that Kishi focuses on the romance of the series more than couple minutes on each chapter


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> BAHH I wrote a wall text before this.







> Beg to differ. Hence why I even pulled other examples to ridicule parallels.



Well I'm under no obligation to defend whatever parallels NH or SS find for themselves.



> Throughout this thread, I was addressing the tendency to hold onto it like it's fact leading to "validity" for a pairing. The parallel is suddenly 100% reliable to fall back on.



Eh, if we take one lesson from Kishi it's that nothing in pairings is 100% reliable.

That being said, I do think parallels are something to consider.



> Sigh. It is ambiguous. Like her? When personal history isn't 100%, then what makes appearance as enough of a connection? The hitting? Kushina tends to hit people who make false accusations about her, yeah? What I'm getting here is superficial trivia, which makes it utterly flexible to apply to any girl.



I don't believe I've ever said that appearance is a factor in parallels.

I assumed she hit Naruto because he was being stupid, which doesn't sound so different from a certain pink haired girl we know . 

I also would have thought Kishi would remember how he had Naruto save Sakura at the summit, those panels seem uncannily similar to Minato saving Kushina imo. In regards to this kind of point, while individual panels can (and probably are) coincidences, when they start to stack up you need to take a step back and ask the question.



> Every male in Tsunade's life? It's only because they wanted to be Hokage. One was a medic nin. The other one barely made it to chuunin, I think. Tsu liked Dan because he wanted to protect the village (and maybe he was hot?) and loved her lilbro because he had his own dream of protecting the village like their past relatives.



When Tsunade was introduced she was reminded of both Dan and Nawaki upon meeting Naruto, that's what I base my earlier statement on.

But still, tangential point really, JiraTsu is the one commonly focused on.



> It only scratches the surface of their friendship.



Or it's merely a part of their friendship.

But to say there are more reasons for NS to get together than simply being reminiscent of JiraTsu can only be good for NS .



> Grr...Well, it was an example of parallels. *savestheMikotospaz*



Well she isn't involved in any of my parallels, nor was she really a mother bear like Kushina or Shikamaru's mother.



> Yet Kishi hasn't failed drawing out obvious similarities that trumps out most ambiguity. Minato and Naruto. Hashirama and Madara to Naruto and Sasuke.  Here, if Kishi states Kushina is like Sakura then I'd be convinced that it isn't grasping.



Kishi has always been about as subtle as a brick when it comes to Naruto vs Sasuke, or Naruto's parents.

I don't think all parallels need to be that overt, particularly concerning a topic like pairings, where it seems Kishi will do everything in his power to not be overt.



> InoSaku is terribly ignored as a bond, sigh.



It seems SS taints most of the platonic bonds in Sakura's life .

Although I do like InoSaku.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> Off-screen development FTL...
> 
> Sounds like SK.


Ohh really,may  i remind you what connects Part 1 Ending with part 2 beginning of this very same series?


----------



## Kage (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> Convenient indeed but you cannot exclude it as well.
> This kind of scenario happen couple of times already in the manga,with, the most recent one the gather of all bijuu, i doubt many could even imagine that bijuu had relationship between them as individuals besides being powers of destruction during whole manga.
> Like i've said, we shouldn't take it as give that Kishi focuses on the romance of the series more than couple minutes on each chapter



how can i exclude what technically doesn't exist?

you shouldn't get to decide "what that manga doesn't show" is okay for.

apparently that's not okay for naruto who's not shown thinking about his true luv for sakura 24/7 and therefore means he doesn't feel that way anymore (or at all for speshual cases)

you can speculate sure but not use that as definitive proof for anything.


----------



## gershwin (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> I'm not aware he's ever said this.


Tsunade said that.


> Kushina was in what, like 6 chapters?
> 
> How is is that there's so many similarities between her and Sakura then?
> 
> This isn't a case of the law of large numbers, many of the similarities aren't generic poses.



What exactly are these similarities? 
Hair colour? Temper? 
/insert Karui/Karin/etc



> And the parallels were obvious to be honest, how can someone read Kushina's line about her hair and not realize the parallel to Sakura's forehead?


Ino was her Minato 



> Again, nothing has to come of this, but the parallel is there. Kushina telling Naruto to find someone like her deliberately raises the point of parallels, which actually loops back into your point about Kishi being more obvious generally.


If  paralell was there - than it would have been outright stated, who paralells who and what purpose it serves. Instead of far fetched similarities, Naruto`s ignorance and Hinatas foreshadowing inner monologue.


Sasuko said:


> InoSaku is terribly ignored as a bond, sigh.


Realy...


----------



## Ryuzaki (Feb 9, 2012)

Nagiza said:


> Okay, let me ask you a question. All of these panels show Naruto saving Sakura AFTER her confession.
> 
> himself
> himself
> ...


Oh wow, Naruto may not love her but that doesn't mean he hates her guts to the point where he'd just sit there and let her die. Kakashi tried to save her too, guess there might be some connection there too.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

gershvin said:


> Tsunade said that.



You misunderstood.

I'm not aware of Kishi ever making a statement like "When Kishi wants the reader to see paralells - he makes them much more obvious."



> What exactly are these similarities?
> Hair colour? Temper?
> /insert Karui/Karin/etc



Off the top of my head I believe the strongest examples are;

Forehead - Red hair similarities.
Hitting Naruto when he's being dumb.
General similar panels (and no, I don't mean poses), Naruto/Minato saving Sakura/Kushina are very good examples of this.

Again, it's the number of similarities that combined together give the impression that it's either unlikely it happened by chance.

Of course if it did happen by chance, then it's really not good for ANS either .



> Ino was her Minato



I assume you're not trying to devalue that point and are simply joking.



> If  paralell was there - than it would have been outright stated, who paralells who and what purpose it serves. Instead of far fetched similarities, Naruto`s ignorance and Hinatas foreshadowing inner monologue.



Now your bias is showing 

There are plenty of foreshadowings regarding pairings, it's at the point where they don't mean shit other than what they explicitly say. This means Hinata wants to hold Naruto's hand, which I'm sure must be news to everyone.

If no parallel was potentially here, why would Kishi have Kushina tell Naruto to find a girl like her? That deliberately raises the question of parallels.

Again, to expect him to be as blatantly obvious regarding pairings as he is with the outcome of Naruto's attempts to redeem Sasuke is silly.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Kage said:


> how can i exclude what technically doesn't exist?
> 
> you shouldn't get to decide "what that manga doesn't show" is okay for.
> 
> ...


I think we can safely assume that Naruto is not a  battle maniac that fights 24/7 and only talks with his Nakama during/middle of a battlefield.
I am not deciding anything, i am merely  pointing up something that people usually tent to ignore.
I never argued about Naruto feelings for Sakura,all i said was that he got hurt by Sakura's confession and its hardly  unavoidable to think that his way for her didn't change after this.
Off screen development is used very much by the mangakas,especially on the long written ones. it's their trump card to explain lots of plot holes that occur in their stories.So saying that off screen development is not to be taken into a serious accord of a story being majorly affected by it could be pretty inaccurate.


----------



## Benzaiten (Feb 9, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Nothing really changed, but the fact that Hinata's feelings continue to be emphasized is leading more people to believe something will actually come of it, rather than just her being friend zoned.



But that doesn't guarantee NH becoming canon which is what I was talking about and I'm not saying you're one of the people who claim that either so please don't bring that up. hehe



LivingHitokiri said:


> Lol no, i would be way too blind to even consider this.
> My point is that we actually never saw Naruto's  view about Hinata in a long long time,and, by the way her acts towards he it definitely looks that something changed and i think we will see at what extend it did maybe after/during this war arc.
> There is a reason for Kishi showing this huge step forward from Hinata and her confidence could imply that things will happen or did happen already but we havent seen them yet.
> I would disagree about Hinata and Naruto not being close on daily basis,just because the manga doesn't show it.



But that's just speculation on your part. We're all free to assume what we think Naruto is feeling right now but you need more evidence than just 'there's a reason Hinata's become more confident' or 'he hates Sakura now so he must have taken a liking to Hinata'. One, there's no proof Naruto no longer loves Sakura. No matter how much people like to think someone has finally moved on, the truth will always come to bite you in the ass (I learned that the hard way with Sakura in 540). Two, off-screen development is an argument that can be used by every pairing. If you say Kishi will make Hinata and Naruto have secret ramen dates, I could just as easily say that Kishimoto will show a flashback of Sakura and Naruto going on dates and making out yadda yadda. I don't even know what you're arguing for. I thought the arguments in this thread were for debating whether this chapter makes NH canon or not (which it obviously doesn't because we're yet to see Naruto's POV).


----------



## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Benzaiten said:


> But that's just speculation on your part. We're all free to assume what we think Naruto is feeling right now but you need more evidence than just 'there's a reason Hinata's become more confident' or 'he hates Sakura now so he must have taken a liking to Hinata'. One, there's no proof Naruto no longer loves Sakura. No matter how much people like to think someone has finally moved on, the truth will always come to bite you in the ass (I learned that the hard way with Sakura in 540). Two, off-screen development is an argument that can be used by every pairing. If you say Kishi will make Hinata and Naruto have secret ramen dates, I could just as easily say that Kishimoto will show a flashback of Sakura and Naruto going on dates and making out yadda yadda. I don't even know what you're arguing for. I thought the arguments in this thread were for debating whether this chapter makes NH canon or not (which it obviously doesn't because we're yet to see Naruto's POV).


Speculation at some point indeed,but you also must not exclude the messages that the mangaka give us, it would make no sense otherwise would it,do not forget that the one writing about Sakura,Naruto,Hinata are all coming from 1 man. It would totally be out of place for Kishi  to change the way Hinata acts just to bring her in the same boat that she was sailing for Naruto so far.

I never ever stated that He hates Sakura, all is said is that  hardly Naruto's  view for Sakura could not be affected after the confession.
I didn't used the off screen to defend the pairing, i used mainly to point for people to not discard it or call dull/irrelevant to the series.
Arguments are build through possibilities hence the discussion is born between people that share different point of view.If anyone knew already whats canon  or not we wouldn't even discuss at moment.

All we can do is take in accord the writer's style,some similar events and assume at best on what will happen and what will not, nobody argues about things that already happen ( ex that Pain is dead).
I think we shall soon or later drop this narrow view point about everything being either black or white.


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## Sasuko (Feb 9, 2012)

@Mr H: Still, if this is shounen and pairings are obvious, then I don't need foreshadowing that doesn't even "mostly" work with the pairing/pairing partner. Parallels are nice to look at, from a non-serious point of view.  



LivingHitokiri said:


> Ohh really,may  i remind you what connects Part 1 Ending with part 2 beginning of this very same series?



I don't get it. You want me to say that NH does? Because I was referring to off-screen development you are hinting that Kishi may possibly add on in the near future. It reminded me of SK when it had this entire theory of _what_ Karin did to Sasuke.  Considering how SK isn't long-written, Kishi gave a few panels on how they met...by Manga time, yes, Karin knew and liked Sasuke since Part I.

Oh _god_ 

_I thought I'd never see the day that I'm discussing SK._


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> @Mr H: Still, if this is shounen and pairings are obvious, then I don't need foreshadowing that doesn't even "mostly" work with the pairing/pairing partner. Parallels are nice to look at, from a non-serious point of view.



If this is shounen and pairings are obvious, NS was canon at chapter 3 .


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Sure thing bud.
> 
> Anyone who uses off panel development as an argument deserves to be laughed at.


Clearly the opposite, i do not know how you came to this conclusion if you did read my posts as a whole and not half.
Good thing my posts had some influence then, laughter is good addition to have.


Sasuko said:


> I don't get it. You want me to say that NH does? Because I was referring to off-screen development you are hinting that Kishi may possibly add on. Reminded me of SK when they had this entire theory of _what_ Karin did to Sasuke.  Considering how it isn't long-written, Kishi gave a few panels on how they met...by Manga time, then yes, Karin knew and liked Sasuke since Part I.
> 
> Oh _god_


Again ,i pretty much tried to point you that there is no way to not include the off screen development in the series as you made it look like its a minor part of  it when its not. I do not understand why you exclude foreshadowing as valid way to for any love in these series to develop as starting point.
Since people tend to forget or never read what i posted before, this is Shounen manga,mangaka is not fond of his writing romance so his method of doing it as ridiculous it may look for some people it could be actually what he does.


----------



## gershwin (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Off the top of my head I believe the strongest examples are;
> 
> Forehead - Red hair similarities.




Forehead - red hair.
The problem with this is that "red hair" was a part of MinaKushi love story, the trademark. Red thread of fate - it was the begininning of them.
Sakura resolved her forehead problems (lack of self confidence) long before Naruto appeared in her life. With the help of Ino.
Red hair ties Kushina with Minato. What about Sakura?
"Forehead" was forgotten and burried long time ago.
Red hair is a big part of Kushina`s character.


> [*]Hitting Naruto when he's being dumb.


Okey, thats valid. But  rather shows how Kishi portrays all  hot tempered women. Once again, Karin. Karui. They are all alike.



> [*]General similar panels (and no, I don't mean poses), Naruto/Minato saving Sakura/Kushina are very good examples of this.



Thats not Kushina/Sakura paralells but NaruSaku/MinaKushi.
Which fails. Couples are not alike at all. Different stories, different fates.
Also here you do mean poses. Since situations are completely different.


> Now your bias is showing
> 
> There are plenty of foreshadowings regarding pairings, it's at the point where they don't mean shit other than what they explicitly say. This means Hinata wants to hold Naruto's hand, which I'm sure must be news to everyone.


This foreshadowing was the latest. So why shouldn`t I believe in this?
Its not just another moment where Hinata is drooling over Naruto - here she made a decision at last. 
The lack of rivalry from Sakura there and no indications of any NS for more than 100 chapters already lead to the thought that she will achieve it.

As i said - "like her" means caring, loving etc.
It was just one of motherly advises. Teachers/friends/food/girls. Everything included.


----------



## Nidaime Mizukage (Feb 9, 2012)

Michael Lucky said:


> this is the most important thing in shonen history



I agree.

Their kids will be godlike.


----------



## Sasuko (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> If this is shounen and pairings are obvious, NS was canon at chapter 3 .



...Dude, no.  

Canon should've been "yo, we had sex/kissed/groped". 

Also, by "foreshadowing" I was talking about parallels=foreshadowing consideration. 

@LivingHitokiri



LivingHitokiri said:


> Again ,i pretty much tried to point you that there is no way to not include the off screen development in the series as you made it look like its a minor part of  it when its not. I do not understand why you exclude foreshadowing as valid way to for any love in these series to develop as starting point.
> 
> Since people tend to forget or never read what i posted before, this is Shounen manga,mangaka is not fond of his writing romance so his method of doing it as ridiculous it may look for some people it could be actually what he does.




Well, you brought up that panel/time skip works in NH's favour since Hinata kept reminding everyone she likes Naruto. Then you suggested that off-panel development is very possible. By that logic, all pairings work. Like, who knows if Sasuke dragged Sakura to the bench or carried her? SasuKarin got a flashback () and look where that led to. SK was minor. Do you want development off-screen because it's so important and hypothetically hogging panel space...? 

I get that it's Kishi is writing it; it's fucking law. 

Foreshadowing via Hinata for the nth time doesn't make NH canon. It's character development, updated since Naruto's contribution.   

Now, foreshadowing via Naruto would definitely stir things. He doesn't revolve around Hinata.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> @LivingHitokiri
> 
> Well, you brought up that panel/time skip works in NH's favoure since Hinata kept reminding everyone she likes Naruto. Then you suggested that off-panel development is very possible. By that logic, all pairings work. Like, who knows if Sasuke dragged Sakura to bench or carried her? SasuKarin got a flashback () and look where that led to


. 
The only reason i brought it a possible is to include it,as it could used in order to explain some of the points, but, what really surprised me the change that Kishimoto brought to Hinata's feelings, i would consider it dull if this hyped change was just Kishimoto threw in last moment because he had nothing else to put in. As this chapter to a special meaning to bonding and understanding between Rookies and Naruto i found this point of change  as a surprise rather a coincidence.
Also,i doubt Naruto didn't got affected by what Hinata did for him vs Pain and how she supported him ( even verbally) all this time, it would rather harsh by Kishimoto's standpoint.



> Foreshadowing via Hinata for the nth time doesn't make NH canon. It's character development.


I would totally agree if it was the same but this time its different one,or so it feels.This sudden change is what makes me think that something big is coming to conclude this, still foreshadowing but with more important timing this time in my opinion.



> Now, foreshadowing via Naruto would definitely stir things. He doesn't revolve around Hinata.


This is what pretty much would end up all the pairings debate unless the message wasnt clear enough to do so.


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## Sasuko (Feb 9, 2012)

"Something big" 

Help save the world OR Asking for a date/holding hands with Naruto...huh, tough choice, Kishi.


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## BossofBosses (Feb 9, 2012)

I hate pairing threads but like I have been saying from the start if Naruto and Hinata don't end up together I will stop reading the manga. She loved that dude when he was an awkward weakling loser. Not Naruto the hero of Konoha. Naruto the class clown. Now that's genuine love so she deserves to be his wife when that time comes.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> "Something big"
> 
> Help save the world OR Asking for a date/holding hands with Naruto...huh, tough choice, Kishi.



Unfortunately or not Kishi have to include both as important parts for the story's conclusion,unless he takes a different approach for the ending ( which i wont try to discuss here since il get jumped on by naruto fans for killing him >.> )
In the romance department i mean,its " big" since it makes so many people talk/argue about it, also it could clarify many things  IF is this what gonna happen.
Also her reference of holding hands could be easily implied as " I want to be together with you "


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

I don't like getting involved with pairing discussions, but I really don't think much has changed regarding the pairings when in regard to the feelings of either Sakura or Hinata. Both of them had important character development regarding their intentions regarding Naruto this chapter, but their feelings themselves haven't changed. 

Sakura's feelings towards Naruto are still platonic in nature and Hinata's feelings toward Naruto are still romantic in nature. What changed is their resolve. Hinata has resolved to act on her feelings toward Naruto and Sakura has resolved to finally be helpful to her friend and team member.

Both are important character development for these two characters, but only Hinata's development really points to the possibility of some resolution to a pairing sub plot. Unlike what some may be arguing this certainly doesn't make NarutoxHinata more canon than other pairings, but realistically we may have a resolution for that pairing sometime relatively soon between now and sometime after the war. NarutoxSakura is sort of a dormant plot thread in comparison.


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## ch1p (Feb 9, 2012)

ElementalShinobi said:


> I hate pairing threads but like I have been saying from the start if Naruto and Hinata don't end up together I will stop reading the manga.


Pretty sure most agree this pairing extremism isn't the mindset one should have when reading _Naruto_, so nothing of value would be lost.


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## HolyHands (Feb 9, 2012)

As far as off-screen development goes, there's obviously no way to know for sure if Naruto and Hinata ever interacted off-panel, but as LivingHitokiri pointed out, it'd be incredibly easy for Kishi to just retcon in some flashbacks of them bonding together.

In fact Kishi does this all the time, and ironically it's with the most important bond in the series: Naruto and Sasuke. Most of part 1 had Naruto and Sasuke generally show hostility towards each other with small bits of friendship here and there. It wasn't until the Valley of the End that we suddenly started getting never-before-seen flashbacks of them bonding together as little kids. And even now we still get the occasional flashback of "new" material never seen before by the readers. If Kishi can do this technique with Naruto and Sasuke, he can do the same with everyone else.

It's a pretty annoying way to write a story to be honest, but I definitely wouldn't put it past Kishi to keep on using it.


----------



## TJFuZioN (Feb 9, 2012)

I honestly never realised folks were this passionate about the pairings. It sort of makes me wonder if a series like Code Geass, which is far more overt with its pairings (even in the midst of a full-scale Superpower Coup de Tat), had fans this... fanatic!

On the topic of the Sakura~Kushina parallel:

I think anyone arguing that Kushina is anything more than a Sakura expy is dellusional, given that just about everything we know about her character(as little as it may be) is ripped off from Sakura.

Sure, Karin and Karui have some vague similarities with her, but no where near on the same level as Sakura. Also neither of the former have any direct connection with Naruto!


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

TJFuZioN said:


> I honestly never realised folks were this passionate about the pairings. It sort of makes me wonder if a series like Code Geass, which is far more overt with its pairings (even in the midst of a full-scale Superpower Coup de Tat), had fans this... fanatic!
> 
> On the topic of the Sakura~Kushina parallel:
> 
> ...



Kushina from what has been given is more of a female Naruto that shares some threads that Kishimoto reuses with regards to a specific attitude with female characters. This includes Sakura of course. There isn't however a one to one parallelism between these two characters though.


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

Why NaruSaku don't seem likely:

Argument #1:
Ino-Sakura rivalry started over Sasuke.

Argument #2:
Naruto smiled and raised thumbs up for Sakura and promised he would bring back Sasuke. That the promise is for life. And reason for this is because he knows Sakura likes Sasuke

Argument #3:
Kakashi: Ok, introduce yourself and tell me your goals:
Sakura: My goal is..., my ambition is....i want....  >>>>>>>> SASUKE.

Argument #4:
Sakura has deep feelings for Sasuke. Naruto seems like a second place for her. 
If Sasuke dies then NaruSaku could happen. But Obviously Sasuke will survive because...whole manga is about saving Sasuke. 



I rest my case


----------



## ch1p (Feb 9, 2012)

WhiteWolf said:


> Why NaruSaku don't seem likely:
> 
> Argument #1:
> Ino-Sakura rivalry started over Sasuke.



Sakura and Ino's rivalry did not start with Sasuke. This is shown when the two of them are both infatuated with Sasuke, both knowing about it and still be friends (on two occasions no less, it's not a coincidence). The rivalry started when Sakura wanted to step out of Ino's shadow and be her own person, the flower metaphor and the giving back of the ribbon. Sasuke was one of the many things Sakura and Ino competed at, but he was not the main one, nor was it the reason of them "ending" (or "restarting") their friendship.


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## TJFuZioN (Feb 9, 2012)

Jikayaki said:


> Kushina from what has been given is more of a female Naruto that shares some threads that Kishimoto reuses with regards to a specific attitude with female characters. This includes Sakura of course. There isn't however a one to one parallelism between these two characters though.



Well, not one-to-one, but I immediately got some heavy Sakura vibes more than anything when we peeked into Kushina's past.

I think I'll reread the Kushina chapters with "female Naruto" in mind and see if it fits better(hey, I've already invested hours reading half this thread...) because if there's one thing thing we should take away from this ridiculous thread, it's that we're all to some extent guilty of confirmation bias once we've decided on a pairing.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

Not to meddle with your parallel discussion but i wanted to ask this.
Wouldn't you think it would be unfair for Sakura as character to be chosen by Naruto just because she got the same... erm " forehead,hair color" as his mother?
How would you try to justify this if you where the mangaka ?


----------



## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

TJFuZioN said:


> Well, not one-to-one, but I immediately got some heavy Sakura vibes more than anything when we peeked into Kushina's past.
> 
> I think I'll reread the Kushina chapters with "female Naruto" in mind and see if it fits better(hey, I've already invested hours reading half this thread...) because if there's one thing thing we should take away from this ridiculous thread, it's that we're all to some extent guilty of confirmation bias once we've decided on a pairing.



I completely understand where some individuals get the similarities between Kushina and Sakura, but in my opinion its a weak argument that they are honestly parallel characters.

We already know that Kushina's personality was similar to Naruto's own. That certainly doesn't match with Sakura's. Kushina's introduction and flashback during Naruto's training with Bee merely backed that up. The similarities showcased by fans regarding Sakura merely come from Kushina being a rather violent head strong woman.


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

Ch1p said:


> Sakura and Ino's rivalry did not start with Sasuke. This is shown when the two of them are both infatuated with Sasuke, both knowing about it and still be friends (on two occasions no less, it's not a coincidence). The rivalry started when Sakura wanted to step out of Ino's shadow and be her own person, the flower metaphor and the giving back of the ribbon. Sasuke was one of the many things Sakura and Ino competed at, but he was not the main one, nor was it the reason of them "ending" (or "restarting") their friendship.


That's true, but didn't Sasuke trigger their rivalry?


----------



## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

_Kimimaro_ said:


> _It's so ridiculous that anyone can dispute the idea that Hinata and Naruto will wind up together facing the future as a couple. The mangaka just shoved the intention of Hinata directly confronting  her target of worship with a confession of love once the main plot is fini. This has been foreshadowed since the damn beginning of the manga, wow, grow NaruSakura tards. Your pipe dream is just not going to happen and I suggest you all find a new pairing to fight over once Naruto hitches up with Hinata permanently. Kishi is feeding the hints to the NaruSakura tards ever so slowly so the ending won't be as painful..I really feel for all your fragile wishes of ever so ugly Sakura not getting any intimate affection from Naruto..ever. Cheer up however, I am sure she will make a great Nurse on call for either Neji or Rock Lee when they are done training.
> 
> Hinata x Naruto..count on it kids because it will be in your face pretty soon__._



This is why many individuals don't take pairing threads seriously or as an extension pairing fans themselves. Nothing about Hinata's development this chapter magically makes the pairing more canon than another. Its still merely Hinata's intentions and feelings. However this development certainly put NaruHina into the forefront of the romantic sub plots. It foreshadows the possibility that this sub plot will be resolved sometime relatively soon.


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## _Kimimaro_ (Feb 9, 2012)

Jikayaki said:


> This is why many individuals don't take pairing threads seriously or as an extension pairing fans themselves. Nothing about Hinata's development this chapter magically makes the pairing more canon than another. Its still merely Hinata's intentions and feelings. However this development certainly put NaruHina into the forefront of the romantic sub plots. It foreshadows the possibility that this sub plot will be resolved sometime relatively soon.



Just face it, the deed is as good as done already. Considering the kind of manga this is the chances of Naruto telling Hinata to shove off when she advances on him is a fat 0% not going to happen chance. If only the NaruxSakura ~snip~ can get a grip ~snip~.


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## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> Not to meddle with your parallel discussion but i wanted to ask this.
> Wouldn't you think it would be unfair for Sakura as character to be chosen by Naruto just because she got the same... erm " forehead,hair color" as his mother?
> How would you try to justify this if you where the mangaka ?



He wouldnt have to justify it, Naruto liked Sakura since chapter 1.  He even explains why he likes her so much while he impersonates as Sasuke.  No explanation necessary, idk why you thought Naruto liked Sakura cuz of the Kushina parallel anyway.  He liked her way before we knew Kushina existed.



_Kimimaro_ said:


> _It's so ridiculous that anyone can dispute the idea that Hinata and Naruto will wind up together facing the future as a couple. Hinata x Naruto..count on it kids because it will be in your face pretty soon__._



LOL I can dispute it because Naruto doesn't love her.  I mean...that wasnt very hard now was it?



Jikayaki said:


> I completely understand where some individuals get the similarities between Kushina and Sakura, but in my opinion its a weak argument that they are honestly parallel characters.



Lol wait..weak that they are parallel or weak that it matters?  Cuz it is surely not weak that they are parallel characters.  Kushina thought Minato was a loser.  Sakura thought Naruto was a loser.  Kushina has a brash personality.  Sakura has a brash personality.  Kushina was self conscious due to a physical feature that Minato ended up complimenting her on.  Sakura is self conscious of a physical feature (her forehead) that Naruto ended up complimenting her on.  Kushina came to respect Minato as he saved her and became one hell of a shinobi, even future kage.  Sakura came to respect Naruto as he saved her over and over, and became one hell of a shinobi, even future kage.  Its almost a blatant copy/paste, i dont see how you can call it a weak argument.

Dont get me started on the Jiraiya Tsunade parallel



> We already know that Kushina's personality was similar to Naruto's own. That certainly doesn't match with Sakura's. Kushina's introduction and flashback during Naruto's training with Bee merely backed that up. The similarities showcased by fans regarding Sakura merely come from Kushina being a rather violent head strong woman.



If you go back to part 1 you can see how Naruto and Sakura are very similar.  Both of them are brash and headstrong, and both of them love pranks.  Their similarities in personalities was made pretty clear early on.    I find it odd that you dont find Naruto and Sakura similar at all.  Really odd lol.  I'm pretty sure even Sasuke commented on it but i'd have to dig through all the part 1 panels.


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

This episode below is such amazing episode because it shows how strong feelings Hinata has for Naruto, and how Naruto cares for Hinata as well.



13:09 - Naruto defending Hinata from bullies.
16:49 - Naruto shouting and telling Neji that Hinata can change herself for the better.


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## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

_Kimimaro_ said:


> Just face it, the deed is as good as done already. Considering the kind of manga this is the chances of Naruto telling Hinata to shove off when she advances on him is a fat 0% not going to happen chance. If only the NaruxSakura tards can get a grip on reality and stop being so buthurt and in denial...so sad.



Ummm...Hinata already confessed, in case you forgot.  And as I recall..nothing came of it


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## Dokiz1 (Feb 9, 2012)

WhiteWolf said:


> This episode below is such amazing episode because it shows how strong feelings Hinata has for Naruto, and how Naruto cares for Hinata as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 13:09 - Naruto defending Hinata from bullies.



That's some amazing evidence. +rep


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

Dokiz1 said:


> That's some amazing evidence. +rep



Fillers are not evidence >_>

example:  Anime filler, Naruto gets kissed by a girl

manga:  Kyuubi tells Naruto he's never kissed a girl


And here we have a contradiction...which is why anime doesnt matter since the author doesn't make it.


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Ummm...Hinata already confessed, in case you forgot.  And as I recall..nothing came of it



What's wrong with you guys. The manga is not about romance. It's not a love story. 

Nothing came of Hinata's confession?

Yeah Naruto reading Hinata's thoughts through her eyes is nothing.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

WhiteWolf said:


> What's wrong with you guys. The manga is not about romance. It's not a love story.
> 
> Nothing came of Hinata's confession?
> 
> Yeah Naruto reading Hinata's thoughts through her eyes is nothing.


No nothing came through Hinata's confession.  Big woop Naruto understands her, I dont see the big romance in that sorry.  Hinata and Naruto have always been friends.  I dont see why ppl can't accept that.  I also dont see why ppl can't accept the fact that Naruto just doesnt love the girl, and given his personality, will not change his mind.  He's stubborn about *everything*  look at Sasuke...he *still* will not give up on the guy.  What makes you think Sakura is any different.  Naruto gives up on no one.  

Now once Naruto actually gives up on Sakura, we can have this conversation.  Its just annoying ppl completely ignore a main character and start pasting their fanfictions all over this thread.  Ppl need to chill and talk sense.


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## TJFuZioN (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> Not to meddle with your parallel discussion but i wanted to ask this.
> Wouldn't you think it would be unfair for Sakura as character to be chosen by Naruto just because she got the same... erm " forehead,hair color" as his mother?
> How would you try to justify this if you where the mangaka ?



I can't really speak for everyone, but I for one don't think Naruto is going to "pick" Sakura simply because she bares a slight resemblance to his mother. He's been in love with her way before he knew anything about his mother, remember? I just think the parallel is simply literary reinforcement from Kishimoto. He's shown us NaruSaku-prototypes through previous generations (Jiraiya and Tsunade, Minato and Kushina, Obito and Rin... Hell, I'll even throw in Yahiko and Konan) as sort of a hint as to who Naruto will end up with. Kind of like how Lilly Potter had red hair like Ginny Weasly. Of course, it's always possible that these parallels all exist because Kishi is just sh%t at creating female characters .


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

Because Sakura is main character she will be the wife of Naruto.
Because Sakura punches people (because she's a bitch) unlike Kushina who punches bullies - she will be his wife?

Great arguments. Bravo....


O.o

Not using this as a argument but you can't help wonder why Shion looks like Hinata.
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_zrIRCM7Jc[/YOUTUBE]


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## Sygurgh (Feb 9, 2012)

Who the hell cares that that Naruto hasn’t yet answered her confession. What matters most are the intentions of the author, and this chapter basically shoved NH in our face. Like others said, it’s as good as a done deal.


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I suppose really what I'm meaning is two fold. I find the parallelism argument a weak excuse to ship NarutoxSakura. Then I don't think there is much of a parallelism between Sakura and Kushina to begin with. There are similarities some use as parallelism between the two characters, but much of them I take as coincidences.

Jiraiya/Tsunade parallelism is a noticeable stronger argument in my opinion, but that isn't what I was talking about.



AMtrack said:


> If you go back to part 1 you can see how Naruto and Sakura are very similar.  Both of them are brash and headstrong, and both of them love pranks.  Their similarities in personalities was made pretty clear early on.    I find it odd that you dont find Naruto and Sakura similar at all.  Really odd lol.  I'm pretty sure even Sasuke commented on it but i'd have to dig through all the part 1 panels.



I don't see much of similarity between Naruto's personality and Sakura's. If you find anything pointing to a similarity I'll certainly look at it, but in my opinion they are very distinct. Sakura is more withdrawn for instance its why in part one inner Sakura existed. They both are at times headstrong, but that hardly counts as much in common and I certainly don't remember Sakura liking pranks.


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

Sygurgh said:


> Who the hell cares that that Naruto hasn’t yet answered her confession. What matters most are the intentions of the author, and this chapter basically shoved NH in our face. Like others said, it’s as good as a done deal.



The pairing isn't a given. Hinata's development this chapter merely put it in the forefront of the romantic sub plots. Of the romantic sub plots it is the most likely now to have a conclusion relatively soon. In retrospect for instance the other popular pairing NarutoxSakura is on the back burner and rather dormant right now.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

Jikayaki said:


> I suppose really what I'm meaning is two fold. I find the parallelism argument a weak excuse to ship NarutoxSakura. Then I don't think there is much of a parallelism between Sakura and Kushina to begin with. There are similarities some use as parallelism between the two characters, but much of them I take as coincidences.
> 
> Jiraiya/Tsunade parallelism is a noticeable stronger argument in my opinion, but that isn't what I was talking about.



So you find all those similarities I listed just coincidences?  Hardly.  That many dont happen by accident, it was obviously done with forethought.  Especially when Kushina said "find someone like me," that was a giant clue that whatever similarities a reader might have found were no accident.  Otherwise that statement wouldnt be there.

Considering Jiraiya/Tsunade is very similar to Minato/Kushina ..i find it weird you find one noticeably stronger (then again Jir/Tsu was forced down our throats).  When it comes to literary devices like parallels, you can't take them as accidents.  Things like that dont happen without forethought.

Course whether they are significant or not is up for debate, but I dont think their existence is.  Kushina's statement guarantees that there was supposed to be a similarity there.





> I don't see much of similarity between Naruto's personality and Sakura's. If you find anything pointing to a similarity I'll certainly look at it, but in my opinion they are very distinct. Sakura is more withdrawn for instance its why in part one inner Sakura existed. They both are at times headstrong, but that hardly counts as much in common and I certainly don't remember Sakura liking pranks.



Similar doesn't mean exactly the same.  Of course Naruto and Sakura have differences but they also have something in common.  In part 1 when Naruto put the eraser on the door, inner Sakura was getting a kick out of it.  In part 2 during the 2nd bell test, Sakura played along with Naruto's prank on Kakashi.  In part 1 when Naruto was impersonating as Sasuke, he found that Sakura had that same desire for acknowledgement that he did, which is why he said "I understand why I like her".

Like Naruto, Sakura was alone until Ino recognized her.  Naruto was alone until Sasuke recognized him.  They really are quite similar, with small differences between them.  Also inner Sakura doesnt exist in part 2, which makes Sakura's personality a lot more "out there"..like Naruto's.


----------



## ch1p (Feb 9, 2012)

WhiteWolf said:


> That's true, but didn't Sasuke trigger their rivalry?



Sasuke didn't trigger their rivalry. Sakura and Ino were friends even after both knew who each other liked. Here, Sakura tells her group of friends who she likes. Ino hears it, yet they remain friends. This is further emphasised when Sakura tells Ino that Sasuke likes girls with long hair. This sharing of the boy they both like wouldn't happen if Sasuke was the basis of their rivalry. This is revisited a third time (really beating a dead horse), as both girls are cheering for Sasuke to win his match against Naruto yet they're still obviously best friends.

Furthermore, notice both Sakura and Ino cut their hair short, even though Sasuke supposedly likes girls with long hair. Sasuke as a romantic partner is irrelevant to both Sakura's drive to beat Ino and vice-versa (it's also irrelevant to Sakura's desire of being stronger at the Chunin exams, but that's another cookie for another time and has no point in this conversation) _Sasuke_ is just another thing they compete in, the equivalent of who throws their shuriken better or a notch in the bedpost (poor Sasuke ).

Sakura and Ino's rivalry is Sakura's desire to be aknowledged as her own person and as an equal to Ino. This is first seen here and here, culminating here and here.

Their rivalry begins as Sakura returns the ribbon Ino gave her and demands to be aknowledged as an equal and a rival from then on. It's after the Genin teams are sorted and each starts their own path away from each other. Way after Sakura and Ino learn of each other's feelings for Sasuke.

Saying Sasuke triggered anything is a gross misinderstanding of their rivalry. Their rivalry parallels Naruto and Sasuke's actually, in a girly kind of way (which can be quite vicious too, though not as murderous). 

Sakura and Ino's rivalry is what it is. Furthermore, and not quite related to this, Sakura's own feelings for Sasuke as he left were not a part of the rivalry with Ino.

I hope I made myself clear. Though with that signature, I'm not so sure you'll accept anything I just written.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Sasuko said:


> ...Dude, no.
> 
> Canon should've been "yo, we had sex/kissed/groped".



I feel like I'm missing something here.



> Also, by "foreshadowing" I was talking about parallels=foreshadowing consideration.



Eh, I'd argue it's there by virtue of Naruto succeeding where Jiraiya failed, or actually finding a girl like his mother.

But again, I've said I don't put too much faith in foreshadowings like this (although I really don't put much faith in the argument Hinata saying she wants to get with Naruto means she will ).



gershvin said:


> Forehead - red hair.
> The problem with this is that "red hair" was a part of MinaKushi love story, the trademark. Red thread of fate - it was the begininning of them.
> Sakura resolved her forehead problems (lack of self confidence) long before Naruto appeared in her life. With the help of Ino.
> Red hair ties Kushina with Minato. What about Sakura?
> ...



Sakura's forehead was still giving her gripes in chapter 3 .

Also note that Kushina's character is a lot more compact than Sakura's is, I'd say roughly the same amount of panels are given to Kushina's hair as have been given to Sakura's forehead.



> Okey, thats valid. But  rather shows how Kishi portrays all  hot tempered women. Once again, Karin. Karui. They are all alike.



Except it's only Sakura and Kushina that hit _Naruto_.

Karui hitting Naruto was a different case entirely.



> Thats not Kushina/Sakura paralells but NaruSaku/MinaKushi.
> Which fails. Couples are not alike at all. Different stories, different fates.
> Also here you do mean poses. Since situations are completely different.



What on earth do you think we're talking about? Kushina/Sakura parallels are used for NS/MK, as are NS/MK parallels.



> This foreshadowing was the latest. So why shouldn`t I believe in this?
> Its not just another moment where Hinata is drooling over Naruto - here she made a decision at last.



 this is a perfect example of people gravitating to the pairing with the latest moment, even if it's completely one-sided. I shouldn't need to explain why this is a poor thing to do.

She made a decision, to be his girlfriend.

Good development there Hinata, we didn't know you wanted to actually date Naruto .



> The lack of rivalry from Sakura there and no indications of any NS for more than 100 chapters already lead to the thought that she will achieve it.



If Sakura is has an overt rivalry with Hinata because of Naruto, NS can be considered canon .

So the lack of it is certainly not surprising.

And hey, Naruto has had other shit to do, there's no point in assuming he's magically changed his feelings.



> As i said - "like her" means caring, loving etc.
> It was just one of motherly advises. Teachers/friends/food/girls. Everything included.



Or you know, it actually means "like her", assuming Kushina thinks she's a good person, it seems like pretty normal advice from someone like Kushina to give to her son if she doesn't have much time. 

Tbh your interpretation doesn't make much sense, why wouldn't she just say 'find someone who loves you'? At least with with mine, it is self-explanatory, she didn't have time to lay out the specifics and made a global statement as to the girls Naruto should look for.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> He wouldnt have to justify it, Naruto liked Sakura since chapter 1.  He even explains why he likes her so much while he impersonates as Sasuke.  No explanation necessary, idk why you thought Naruto liked Sakura cuz of the Kushina parallel anyway.  He liked her way before we knew Kushina existed.


The way Naruto liked her as kid i think its totally different from now, he grew up and his feelings matured along with it,his feeling since part 2 could be taken far more serious than the part 1 which was more of a typical young crush.
Anyway, the reason i asked is because someone discussed about it the previous posts.
Also, have you ever considered the parallels between Jiraya,Ororchimaru and Tsunade being different from the Naruto,Sasuke and Sakura ?
Don't you think Naruto tried to deny what Jiraya said at the hospital about giving up Sasuke just because the same thing happen to Jiraya but instead he refused showing us that he ( and probably team 7) are following a different path than what the sanins did .Also if we take them as individuals separated then only Sakura in my opinion actually comes to Tsunade as similar form the trio, with naruto being a mix of  both Yondaime,Jiraya and Sasuke taking overall different path that what Orochimaru did.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Jikayaki said:


> The pairing isn't a given. Hinata's development this chapter merely put it in the forefront of the romantic sub plots. Of the romantic sub plots it is the most likely now to have a conclusion *relatively soon*. In retrospect for instance the other popular pairing NarutoxSakura is on the back burner and rather dormant right now.



I disagree, Kishi is going to string this shit along like he always has.

Not to mention keeping the subplot open adds another aspect to Naruto vs Sasuke in who will Sakura ultimately choose (which has become the purpose of her character it seems).


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

@AMtrack

"Find a girl like me".

What did Kushina mean? Physical appearance? Habits? What?
We don't know SPESIFICALLY what Kushina means with this. She could have thought of a certain human quality when she said what she said, or she could have thought of a exact copy of herself?

Assuming that Kushina meant that Naruto should find a girl that's a copy of his mother does not sound like the right interpretation. 

So what did Kushina mean? I think she meant certain human qualities, and i will assume what they are:

kindnesss, protective and brave

These qualities Hinata have. Hinata is like Kushina in that she sacrifices herself for Naruto just like how Yondaime and Kushina did!
Hinata is kind just like Kushina.

Kushina is violent like Sakura, but then again so is Ino and all the other "Sasuke" fan groups. And Sakura hits Naruto because she finds him being silly, where as Kushina hit people from what we saw of her because they were bullying her.


Hinata has a weak willpower. She is not exactly like Kushina. When abducted Kushina left hair on ground for someone to find her. She was that clever and didn't give up.
But Hinata is brave for Naruto.

Speaking of parallels...Yondaime saves Kushina from the "outsider hell". And Naruto saves Hinata from her insecurity.


And Sasuke was not the only one to recognize Naruto. You forgot Hinata.


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> So you find all those similarities I listed just coincidences?  Hardly.  That many dont happen by accident, it was obviously done with forethought.  Especially when Kushina said "find someone like me," that was a giant clue that whatever similarities a reader might have found were no accident.  Otherwise that statement wouldnt be there.
> 
> Considering Jiraiya/Tsunade is very similar to Minato/Kushina ..i find it weird you find one noticeably stronger (then again Jir/Tsu was forced down our throats).  When it comes to literary devices like parallels, you can't take them as accidents.  Things like that dont happen without forethought.
> 
> Course whether they are significant or not is up for debate, but I dont think their existence is.  Kushina's statement guarantees that there was supposed to be a similarity there.



I do find most similarities fans list when trying to create a parallelism between Kushina and Sakura as mere coincidences. They come from in my opinion individuals looking for similarities between the two and Kishimoto being Kishimoto. They certainly aren't a one to one parallelism at the very least most of the similarities I can see come merely from Kushina's violent head strong behavior, but for the most part Kushina is a female version of her son. I think you over simplify aspects making them fit better than otherwise as Naruto/Sakura and Minato/Kushina are very different relationships at least in my opinion. 

Jiraiya unlike Minato has more similarities with Naruto and perhaps I see Tsunade being more like Sakura or at least she was in a similar situation as a set up. This is why I see it as a stronger argument.




AMtrack said:


> Similar doesn't mean exactly the same.  Of course Naruto and Sakura have differences but they also have something in common.  In part 1 when Naruto put the eraser on the door, inner Sakura was getting a kick out of it.  In part 2 during the 2nd bell test, Sakura played along with Naruto's prank on Kakashi.  In part 1 when Naruto was impersonating as Sasuke, he found that Sakura had that same desire for acknowledgement that he did, which is why he said "I understand why I like her".
> 
> Like Naruto, Sakura was alone until Ino recognized her.  Naruto was alone until Sasuke recognized him.  They really are quite similar, with small differences between them.  Also inner Sakura doesnt exist in part 2, which makes Sakura's personality a lot more "out there"..like Naruto's.



Your argument for similarity between their personalities merely shows character development as Naruto realized Sakura is a distinct individual. I don't see any reason to reconsider my view on Sakura's personality as I pointed out she's more withdrawn often doesn't speak her mind this was showcased in part one through inner Sakura. Sakura is a very different character to Naruto regardless of the fact she can be head strong at times.

There are perhaps similarities, but I don't think their personalities over all are that similar, nor have I ever looked at them being overly similar to begin with. Naruto's personality is more than merely being head strong. Kushina's behavior and personality far better matches up with her son than any other character Kishimoto even give her a silly catch phrase at the end of her sentences.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> No nothing came through Hinata's confession.  Big woop Naruto understands her, I dont see the big romance in that sorry.  Hinata and Naruto have always been friends.  I dont see why ppl can't accept that.  I also dont see why ppl can't accept the fact that Naruto just doesnt love the girl, and given his personality, will not change his mind.  He's stubborn about *everything*  look at Sasuke...he *still* will not give up on the guy.  What makes you think Sakura is any different.  Naruto gives up on no one.
> 
> .


Apparently in this manga we never had a  development between two people that got concluded  much later one in the series, biggest reference was the bond between Sasuke in Naruto, you never actually saw them having it until later on in the manga.

Please, stop with your " fact " attitude since what you said are your opinion on how you view this manga , not ours and apparently not Kishimoto's.
Im gonna use your type logic, how exactly you know that Naruto and Hinata are friends and nothing more, you saw them ? No, you just make assumptions which you magically convert them in facts just to try to prove your point.Only fact about Naruto feelings for anyone will be at the end of the series, and, not when you say so.

Naruto grew up a lot during Part 2, he had a lots of different emotional moments which played a major role on his growth and development.



> Now once Naruto actually gives up on Sakura, we can have this  conversation.  Its just annoying ppl completely ignore a main character  and start pasting their fanfictions all over this thread.  Ppl need to  chill and talk sense


It is also annoying when people try to pass their facts on others with a relative null argument just because they do not agree with your viewpoint, you're not Kishimoto and there is no way that you know better than others on how any character feels better than others.

Please do refrain reading my previous posts in this thread to verify why your so profound facts are nothing more opinions that could change in mere panels if mangaka wished to.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

WhiteWolf said:


> @AMtrack
> 
> "Find a girl like me".
> 
> ...



It means what it says, the obvious.  Sakura is like Kushina..its not supposed to be something you have to think really hard about.  Kishi made it obvious in the way he drew Kushina, her facial expressions, and her actions that it was like a grown up Sakura.

All of the rookies are kind and brave.


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> It means what it says, the obvious.  Sakura is like Kushina..its not supposed to be something you have to think really hard about.  Kishi made it obvious in the way he drew Kushina, her facial expressions, and her actions that it was like a grown up Sakura.
> 
> All of the rookies are kind and brave.


Your assuming you know what Kushina means with "A girl like me". Yet you talk about it as if you  K N O  W . You don't know. I don't either.
And that's why your delusional.


We're discussing which pairing has highest posibility of happening.

When Naruto was restrained by Pain's rods - did Sakura run to save him? 
Did she? No.

Who did? 

Hinata.

Action say more than words.

Did Sakura kill Sasuke? No, and she cried she couldn't do it.
Did rookies have to notify Sakura about taking out Sasuke? Yes.

Why? She has feelings for him.

All this "I will save Sasuke for you Sakura"
"Sakura we're gonna kill Sasuke"

Sakura "No i will do it myself" (Oh i can't do it - it's to hard!).


All of these things happen - and guess what? It turns out Sakura only views Sasuke as a friend and she actually loves Naruto.
Seriously?

Naruto and Sasuke have higher possibility as pairing than Naruto and Sakura.


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## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> Apparently in this manga we never had a  development between two people that got concluded  much later one in the series, biggest reference was the bond between Sasuke in Naruto, you never actually saw them having it until later on in the manga.



That bond was established early in part 1.  The first clue was before they even fought Zabuza.  What are you talking about?

Please, stop with your " fact " attitude since what you said are your opinion on how you view this manga , not ours and apparently not Kishimoto's.
Im gonna use your type logic, how exactly you know that Naruto and Hinata are friends and nothing more, you saw them ?[/quote]

Because they have been nothing but friends in the manga.  And Naruto has established he likes Sakura.  I'm sorry you dont' like my fact attitude but those are FACTS, written in canon, by KISHIMOTO.  You just need to get over it.  Until those facts are proven wrong they are still facts.  Sorry to ruin your fanfiction party.  The *fact* that she confessed to him and he has not accepted it *proves* they are friends.  Just like how Naruto and Sakura are friends.  Get over it.



> It is also annoying when people try to pass their facts on others with a relative null argument just because they do not agree with your viewpoint, you're not Kishimoto and there is no way that you know better than others on how any character feels better than others.



Whats annoying is when ppl ignore the manga and pretend that things have happened despite the fact that they are not on panel.  I did not say anything which is not in the manga.  If you dont like it write hate mail to Kishi.



> Please do refrain reading my previous posts in this thread to verify why your so profound facts are nothing more opinions that could change in mere panels if mangaka wished to.



Sure they could change, but as of now facts are facts.  In the next panel Hinata could die, Sasuke could turn gay and rape Naruto, or pigs could fall out of the sky?  Whats your point?  Facts now are facts, and as long as they stay facts you have no business complaining to me about what i'm saying.  I'm not the one who wrote the manga.


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> I disagree, Kishi is going to string this shit along like he always has.
> 
> Not to mention keeping the subplot open adds another aspect to Naruto vs Sasuke in who will Sakura ultimately choose (which has become the purpose of her character it seems).



I'm being very open in regards to what I mean by relatively soon regarding a conclusion of the NarutoxHinata romantic sub plot. Hinata's character development this chapter points to some future development between now and some time after the war.  

It's the only romantic sub plot currently anywhere near the front burner, thus the only romantic sub plot with a chance of resolution anytime soon, but that could be numerous chapters from now. Not I didn't state Hinata would necessarily end up with Naruto merely that there could be a conclusion to this sub plot in the foreseeable future.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Jikayaki said:


> I'm being very open in regards to what I mean by relatively soon regarding a conclusion of the NarutoxHinata romantic sub plot. Hinata's character development this chapter points to some future development between now and some time after the war.
> 
> It's the only romantic sub plot currently anywhere near the front burner, thus the only romantic sub plot with a chance of resolution anytime soon, but that could be numerous chapters from now. Not I didn't state Hinata would necessarily end up with Naruto merely that there could be a conclusion to this sub plot in the foreseeable future.



If the NH subplot ends soon then it's going to be rejection, you should hope it's kept strung along.


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## mayumi (Feb 9, 2012)

if naruhina happens it is not going to be because she deserves him but because naruto chose her over anyone else.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> It means what it says, the obvious.  Sakura is like Kushina..its not supposed to be something you have to think really hard about.  Kishi made it obvious in the way he drew Kushina, her facial expressions, and her actions that it was like a grown up Sakura.
> 
> All of the rookies are kind and brave.


So Kishimoto's drawing style turned into intended similarity argument ?, wow just wow.
And hell, since freaking well parallels where a solid basis in a manga for someone to hold up with ?
Stop being ridiculous,remove those glasses that you are wearing and try to do a proper discussion.


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Facts now are facts, and as long as they stay facts you have no business complaining to me about what i'm saying.  I'm not the one who wrote the manga.


Facts are:
Sakura's amibition...goal....desire has been and always will be: Sasuke.

Fact is Naruto gave a lifetime promise to save Sasuke for Sakura. 
Fact is Sai told Sakura this promise is burdening Naruto.

Fact is Sakura is someone important when your gonna discuss the assassination of Sasuke.

Fact is Hinata said "I love you Naruto"
Fact is Hinata recognized the Naruto we see now from the beginning.
Fact is Hinata attacked Pain and got hurt despite knowing she's weaker.

Fact is Sakura didn't nudge and go jump into battle to try to rescue Naruto when he was restrained by chakra rods. Not saying she's cold, but goes to show you she isn't overprotective of Naruto.

Fact is : Ramen and Hokage was the goals of Naruto when Team 7 first met.

Fact is Sakura wanted Sasuke to kiss him
Fact is Sakura's rivalry with Ino was triggered by Sasuke


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## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

WhiteWolf said:


> Your assuming you know what Kushina means with "A girl like me". Yet you talk about it as if you  K N O  W . You don't know. I don't either.
> And that's why your delusional.



A girl like me means "a girl like me".  She didnt say "a girl thats kind" or "a girl thats brave"...she said "a girl like me."  Who is similar to Kushina?  Sakura.  Its incredibly blatant.  Hinata is not like Kushina.  Their personalities couldnt be more opposite.




> We're discussing which pairing has highest posibility of happening.
> 
> When Naruto was restrained by Pain's rods - did Sakura run to save him?
> Did she? No.



Sakura had no way of knowing Naruto needed saving.  Only Hinata and her Byakugan could see that.  Btw, Sakura has tried to protect Naruto more times than Hinata ever has.

1) Chuunin exams

2) When Naruto turned KN4 during the rescue sasuke arc.

3) Oh yeah, she also tried to sacrifice the only guy she loved just so Naruto would be safe.

4) Oh she tried to protect Naruto and Sasuke during the hospital fight.

There's your actions..probably more but I can't be bothered to find them all.



> Did Sakura kill Sasuke? No, and she cried she couldn't do it.
> Did rookies have to notify Sakura about taking out Sasuke? Yes.



Did Hinata beat pain? No, she got one-paneled.  Did she even try to free Naruto?  No, she confessed and went to play hero.  Did she try to save Naruto? Yes.  Sakura tried..thats all that matters.




> All of these things happen - and guess what? It turns out Sakura only views Sasuke as a friend and she actually loves Naruto.
> Seriously?



After Hinata's confession, Naruto still likes Sakura and cant confess her until he brings Sasuke back?? 

Btw no one said she loves Naruto, what are you smoking.



> Naruto and Sasuke have higher possibility as pairing than Naruto and Sakura.



Naruto and Sasuke have a higher possibility than any pairing.  And given that Sakura loves Sasuke, Naruto loves Sakura, and Hinata loves Naruto...one is hardly more likely than the other.

The one with the most development and paneltime is Naruto and Sakura though.  Take that for what it is.


EDIT:  Fact is Naruto loves Sakura.  Fact is Hinata confessed, and Naruto did not return her feelings.  Get over it.


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> If the NH subplot ends soon then it's going to be rejection, you should hope it's kept strung along.



Not a particular shipper of any pairing. All I'm stating is there could be a conclusion to this specific sub plot sometime relatively soon. Whether Hinata fans will like that conclusion I can't say. Still I don't see how NarutoxHinata is honestly any less likely than any other pairing.



AMtrack said:


> It means what it says, the obvious.  Sakura is like Kushina..its not supposed to be something you have to think really hard about.  Kishi made it obvious in the way he drew Kushina, her facial expressions, and her actions that it was like a grown up Sakura.
> 
> All of the rookies are kind and brave.



An again I disagree Kushina really isn't all that similar to Sakura especially if as stated Kushina's personality truly takes after her son. They are very different individuals on many levels the only similarities I can honestly see come from Kushina's violent behavior, but that hardly makes Kushina more similar to Sakura than any number of female characters with similar behaviors.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> That bond was established early in part 1.  The first clue was before they even fought Zabuza.  What are you talking about?


Again, you know what the word, CONCLUDED means ?
The peak of Narutos bond with Sasuke where confirmed  after  the battle at the valley of end,before all we had where fragments,confusion and character development from both sides.





> Because they have been nothing but friends in the manga.  And Naruto has established he likes Sakura.  I'm sorry you dont' like my fact attitude but those are FACTS, written in canon, by KISHIMOTO.  You just need to get over it.  Until those facts are proven wrong they are still facts.  Sorry to ruin your fanfiction party.  The *fact* that she confessed to him and he has not accepted it *proves* they are friends.  Just like how Naruto and Sakura are friends.  Get over it.


Holy shit, because what he said 200 chapters ago are technically not allowing Naruto to develop further,especially when he had TONS of emotional situations. hell nobody would imagine Naruto saying to Sasuke about the conclusion of their next battle ( which is one of them to die) yet he did.
Do you even know what character development means?




> Whats annoying is when ppl ignore the manga and pretend that things have happened despite the fact that they are not on panel.  I did not say anything which is not in the manga.  If you dont like it write hate mail to Kishi.


Despite the fact that he used the same way of explanation for couple of times ( flashbacks,foreshadowing,long term development) because thats Kishimoto's style ?
Wow, i bet your fact about Hinatas death vs Pain lasted for 1 week maximum untill you changed your " fact".





> Sure they could change, but as of now facts are facts.  In the next panel Hinata could die, Sasuke could turn gay and rape Naruto, or pigs could fall out of the sky?  Whats your point?  Facts now are facts, and as long as they stay facts you have no business complaining to me about what i'm saying.  I'm not the one who wrote the manga.


The point is that we examine on how Kishimoto written this cursed manga,his messages that he gives,so we can make assumption/theories around it, the whole freaking point is only Kishimoto can establish facts.The romance in the series is far from over even by kishimotos standards yet you magically consider this a fact since chapter 1, holy shit, im speechless.


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> A girl like me means "a girl like me".  She didnt say "a girl thats kind" or "a girl thats brave"...she said "a girl like me."  Who is similar to Kushina?  Sakura.  Its incredibly blatant.  Hinata is not like Kushina.  Their personalities couldnt be more opposite.
> *The quote "a girl like me" can be misinterpreted. Your not Kushina, and your certainly not Kishimoto. Yet you seem to think you know better than everyone else on these forums about what Kushina/Kishimoto means by "a girl like me".*
> 
> 
> ...


seriously.

Ok, i want to say i am a Hinata fan. 

The thought of Naruto and Hinata as a couple is very heart warming. Because they both warm eachother's heart. Hinata cheered for Naruto (Neji vs Naruto), and Naruto the same.

But i am so darn fed up of NaruSaku pairing.

So i hope Hinata is killed so that the "pairing war" ends. 

Besides Hinata is far to divine to be live on earth. Her place is in heaven.


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## OGkush (Feb 9, 2012)

once naruto compliments sakura's forehead specifically, her panties are as good as dropped. you heard it here first


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Jikayaki said:


> Not a particular shipper of any pairing. All I'm stating is there could be a conclusion to this specific sub plot sometime relatively soon. Whether Hinata fans will like that conclusion I can't say. Still I don't see how NarutoxHinata is honestly any less likely than any other pairing.



Still, if the conclusion is soon, it's going to be negative.

Kishi is going to string this romance plot out to the end, he can do that without NH (although I highly doubt he will). Unless by 'conclusion', you would count Naruto reaffirming his feelings for Sakura (unlikely to be around Hinata at the time though), I could see that happening as it'd keep the pairings open.




You mentioned before you don't know why anyone would ship NS because of the parallels, fyi I don't know anyone who does. It's more like people ship NS and then notice the parallels.


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## Lovely (Feb 9, 2012)

Hinata's statement was definitely more concrete than the usual pairing teases, though. The most we normally get is a reaffirmation of one-sided feelings, but here Hinata is thinking that she'll have a mutual relationship with Naruto after the war. She's apparently done 'chasing' him (having her feelings remain unrequited) and has now decided that she'll get Naruto to like her back. Its not even a case of trying either, as she clearly says that she _will _be with him after the war.

The whole thing was very blunt.


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Still, if the conclusion is soon, it's going to be negative.
> 
> Kishi is going to string this romance plot out to the end, he can do that without NH (although I highly doubt he will). Unless by 'conclusion', you would count Naruto reaffirming his feelings for Sakura (unlikely to be around Hinata at the time though), I could see that happening as it'd keep the pairings open.



Still by relatively soon I mean anytime from now to the next arc after the war. By conclusion I mean NarutoxHinata getting a conclusion through Hinata confronting Naruto. Whether that will end with NarutoxHinata becoming the canon pairing or not I can't say.

I see no reason why the first potential romantic sub plot to potentially resolved would mean that the result would necessarily be negative. Sakura's intentions aren't changing, and NarutoxSakura is so far off the front burner now in comparison outside being Naruto's original crush I don't see how any pairing is honestly more likely to have a positive or negative ending. No reason Naruto's love interest can't be resolved before the end.



Mr Horrible said:


> You mentioned before you don't know why anyone would ship NS because of the parallels, fyi I don't know anyone who does. It's more like people ship NS and then notice the parallels.



I meant that I find any believed parallels between Naruto/Sakura and any related pairing a poor reason to support the pairing and a poor excuse to dismiss other pairings.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 9, 2012)

Jikayaki said:


> Still by relatively soon I mean anytime from now to the next arc after the war. By conclusion I mean NarutoxHinata getting a conclusion through Hinata confronting Naruto. Whether that will end with NarutoxHinata becoming the canon pairing or not I can't say.



Doubt it, Hinata only recently told Naruto her feelings and he is very busy at the moment, her words explicitly state 'after the war' too.

This war is very likely going to continue for quite a while, I'd wager almost the end of the manga.



> I see no reason why the first potential romantic sub plot to potentially resolved would mean that the result would necessarily be negative. Sakura's intentions aren't changing, and NarutoxSakura is so far off the front burner now in comparison outside being Naruto's original crush I don't see how any pairing is honestly more likely to have a positive or negative ending. No reason Naruto's love interest can't be resolved before the end.



Just because Naruto's feelings haven't been brought up recently doesn't make them less important. Pairings will always be an ebb and flow and unless you want to be changing your opinion every 20 chapters, you should know this.

Again, when/if it comes down to what Naruto wants vs what Hinata wants, Naruto takes that.



> I meant that I find any believed parallels between Naruto/Sakura and any related pairing a poor reason to support the pairing and a poor excuse to dismiss other pairings.



Again, to deny the parallels exist is a poor argument.

You can argue they mean nothing however.


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Doubt it, Hinata only recently told Naruto her feelings and he is very busy at the moment, her words explicitly state 'after the war' too.
> 
> This war is very likely going to continue for quite a while, I'd wager almost the end of the manga.



Like I stated I'm being rather open by what I mean by relatively soon. I expect the most likely time for the sub plot to end is after the war. I don't think that is going to take long though. Its not going to end in the first few chapters, but we're most of the way through.



Mr Horrible said:


> Just because Naruto's feelings haven't been brought up recently doesn't make them less important. Pairings will always be an ebb and flow and unless you want to be changing your opinion every 20 chapters, you should know this.
> 
> Again, when/if it comes down to what Naruto wants vs what Hinata wants, Naruto takes that.



Pairing stuff tends to be delayed in this manga. We don't yet know how Naruto reacted to Hinata's confession, or really how Sakura's fake confession has effected his feelings toward her.

As stated this won't come to conclusion tell Hinata actually openly talks to Naruto about this stuff some time later in the series. We have to have Naruto's reaction otherwise its not resolved. 

That doesn't change the fact Sakura's intentions and feelings hasn't changed. Her feelings toward Naruto are purely platonic.



Mr Horrible said:


> Again, to deny the parallels exist is a poor argument.
> 
> You can argue they mean nothing however.



The parallels with Kushina/Minato are extremely thin and in my opinion are at best coincidences or at worst fans trying to legitimize their pairing. Jiraiya/Tsunade parallels make more sense if only because there are more similarities.


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## Tyrannos (Feb 9, 2012)

Why do NaruSaku's exist?   Because we like the possibility of a NaruSaku pairing?   

Nothing wrong with people liking a pairing, even if it never happens.    Just look at all the other types of pairings in this forum alone, they like it for the fun of it.


The fandoms shouldn't brag about being the winner when the winner hasn't been officially declared.  I for one am going to wait until that final moment where there is either a requitting of feelings, a kiss, or even a time jump where they are suddenly together.  And lets not forget, Kishimoto loves to play with the NS, SS, and NH fandoms with that love Triangle.   So bragging that you won is awfully premature.

Never know, next chapter things can easily turn around.  It's happened before.   Remember that Hinata Confession moment only to have Naruto greeted with a hug by Sakura.  (We can argue if that was platonic or not til our eyes bleed).


And we can argue about the Sannin Parallels, the Kushina Parallels, or whatever parallels til our hearts content.    But to use anime filler is just wrong on so many levels, and we all know why.  


But here is my quick take of the Big Three:

With Hinata we seen her nothing but crush on Naruto for years and it caused her to break out of her shell and train to be stronger.   Okay thats good and all but what has she done to get Naruto to start feeling for her?    Where is that moment that says, "You know, I love Hinata!"    Thats where the NH fandom hinges on.

Sure, during this final fight something can happen that sparks it off.   Honestly, I don't think it's another "I love you" moment or her risking her life again, because that plot has been overused.   But like I said, anything can change.   She could very well confront Sasuke and reveal her feelings and Naruto gets it through his thick skull.


With SasuSaku, never know when Naruto brings Sasuke back to the light, it could respark that love and in a time jump, they are together as a couple.


But with NaruSaku, even if you disagree, I for one am not still not giving up.   While Hinata has risked her life, confessed, and shown her determination to be with Naruto; with Naruto and Sakura, he saved her life twice, went out to make her happy by pledging to bring back Sasuke (even if he knew it would mean SS happening).   And we had in turn Sakura growing to believe in Naruto and outright have faith in him where others think he wasn't going to succeed.

So you never know what may happen in that final confrontation between Naruto and Sasuke.   Sakura could very well blurt out her feelings are still strong for Sasuke, or she could very well turn it around and requit Naruto's feelings.   You just never know.

So until that defining moment, the war is not over.




BTW, remember Karma is at work too.


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## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> So Kishimoto's drawing style turned into intended similarity argument ?, wow just wow.
> And hell, since freaking well parallels where a solid basis in a manga for someone to hold up with ?
> Stop being ridiculous,remove those glasses that you are wearing and try to do a proper discussion.



I really wonder why you're so angry...it is nearly impossible to have a logcial argument with you because you lolrage and miscontrue everything I say.  My advice to you is take a break from the computer, have some meaningful relationships, and come back.  You are way too absorbed in this whole pairing thing.  Calm the hell down.  Seriously.

Nowhere did I say a parallel was a solid basis for anything.  Like I said, stop miscontruing what I say and freakin breathe.  All I said was the parallel existed.  And it does.  You can argue with me all you want, but the author's intention, by Kushina's words "Find someone like me", made it clear we were supposed to compare Kushina to someone.  

If you dont think the parallel is important just say it.  Sitting here and arguing that it doesnt exist, and im crazy for thinking it exists (despite evidence to the contrary) is nothing short of being nuts.  Breathe dude..really.

I find it rather funny that any NH argument becomes full of rage.  Its really going to be a sad day is the NH ship sinks..cuz I imagine the whole forum will just explode with bash threads, anger, hatred, and bans.  Its the only shipping fandom in Naruto that is so ridiculously militant that any objection to it results in personal attacks.  Even so-called "neutrals" go batshit crazy if you continue to object to Naruhina, with reasonable manga evidence mind you (Naruto not loving her being a rather huge one).

In any case, ppl will read a manga how they want to.  All i can do is guess an author's intention based on obvious things, and try not to get into subtle things (cuz bias generally clouds judgement).  The *obvious* thing to me is the similarity of Kushina to Sakura.  Some ppl, like the person i was debating with, will just not see it at all..but as I said Kushina was meant to be similar to someone (or else she wouldnt say "find someone like me").

The biggest candidate, as in the closest, is Sakura for all the reasons I listed (and they were *quite* a few).  Call it coincidence if you want ( i find that hard to buy), but its there.


And since it needs to be said, Hinata's panel was given no more significance than any other rookie panel.  As a result, it is unlikely its a pivotal scene at all..because if it was, the author would surely draw more attention to it.  The fact that he did not says to me that its just Hinata expressing her wish.  Hinata isnt a fortune teller, its just yet another reaffirmation of her feelings.  Big whoop..we knew she loved the guy already.

Give me a panel of Naruto considering Hinata romantically, and then you can get excited.  Until then nothing has changed..as usual.  You're about to walk right into another 437 to 450 again.  NH had a party after 437 and then 450 smacked them in the face.  How many times have I heard:

"its over we won" only for it not to be over lol.  When will you ever learn?


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## Jeαnne (Feb 9, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


the problem is that narusaku is closer to a crack pairing than even sasunaru, yet narusaku fans try to rivalize with naruhina that is a way more solid possibility at this point .

im not pro naruhina or anything, i am fan of the two yaoi crack pairings that have the most cannon evidence(sasunaru and itasasu )...but personally, from a point of view of someone who doesnt give a flying fuck about who naruto will have his babies with (since he cant with sasuke ), i think that naruhina makes so much more sense than narusaku storywise that its not even funny.


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## Eikichi Onizuka (Feb 9, 2012)

This madness will never end and it was my mistake i guest for not trying to reach out of nowhere to make my arguments. I don't mind NaruHina i really don't period but what I do mind is when people pull arguments out of nowhere and use FILTER anime episodes to back up their point and that's whats been happening. 

Tyrannos is right whoever he ends up with its not like picking between between being in cage with a hungry lion or a hungry bear. Their both good options to have. My problem with people who are pushing NaruHina has always been the fact some of you have said it would be harsh or in bad taste if he doesnt get with her because she loves him so much. But yet you forget the part that he has a say on whether he likes her or not. Just because you love someone doesnt mean they love you back, god how well do i know this.  

Everyone waiting for Naruto's reactions over Hinata's confession you should hold your breath even if it does happen soon because LOGICALLY speaking it shouldnt end with him saying "you know what i love you too." This is a girl he hasn't had any real interactions with outside of the Pain thing and what the exams. If a girl your just somewhat friends with comes up to you and just starts talking about how much shes in love with you, I don't think your going to just say what the hell why not. 

The only way this couple works is if he honestly is COMPLETELY over Sakura and spends a significant amount of time with Hinata and realizes that this is the one for him. Everyone forgets the scenario when you've dated someone for like a few months or even years and you realize that this isnt what you want, that could very well happen. Same goes with Sakura so hey I could very well be wrong. In the end Naruto could very well end up with freaking Tenten who the hell knows because things happen. 

My arguments for NaruSaku have always been its the most logical step for both characters in way. For Sakura it would show that she was over a dumb childhood crush. Since her relationship with Sasuke somewhat mirriors the Naruto and Hinatas. Except she did spend some valuable time with the guy but yet I don't think she really knew him or really understood why she cared so much about him. The only person that actually knew Sasuke enough to say they loved him was Naruto period. For Naruto when it comes to being with Sakura I think it would just help his ego knowing that he wasn't being picked over Sasuke like he felt a lot during earlier part 2.  But like I said they could have a go at it and realize that their better at just being friends. 

I don't own Naruto but if I did I would fire the hell out of Kisi for starting what seems like a holy war. Everyone here needs to watch 500 days of summer so they see how real relationships can be. There more bitter sweet then happy every after.


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## AMtrack (Feb 9, 2012)

Jeαnne said:


> the problem is that narusaku is closer to a crack pairing than even sasunaru, yet narusaku fans try to rivalize with naruhina that is a way more solid possibility at this point .



o.O Naruto loves Sakura..I dont see how that makes it crack.


So far the only evidence I see that NH isn't crack is cuz Hinata is determined to get him.  But Hinata isnt the main character, so i fail to see how that matters.  Sakura was determined to be with Sasuke and look where that got her.

Like I said, I dont wanna hear crying when/if Naruto rejects the poor girl.  Even if she pursues him, who says he'll accept.  All I hear is "Naruto will love her cuz she loves him".  What are we in 3rd grade?


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## son_michael (Feb 9, 2012)

Naru Saku fans exist because we actually appreciate a budding romance that's been developed since the earliest chapters, we exist because we want Naruto to get what he wants and he wants Sakura. We exist because of the many many hints of attraction Sakura has for Naruto, of her evolution in how she first handled and felt about him to how she is with him now. We see the seeds have been sown and now we wait for the romance to blossom, we have far more evidence than any pairing starting from the earliest chapters to the current ones. 

Sakura's love for Sasuke is the problem, but we believe she will realize her true love for Naruto before the manga ends.


For Naruto to fail in getting the girl he loves is borderline ridiculous, he must succeed where Jiraiya failed, he must get what he deserves.


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## shurei (Feb 9, 2012)

For HinaNaru to be a sure win, there sure is a lot of rage. 
Perhaps it's not such a victory as proclaimed. We still have to hear from Naruto. That guy, the other half of HinaNaru


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## Jeαnne (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> o.O Naruto loves Sakura..I dont see how that makes it crack.
> 
> 
> So far the only evidence I see that NH isn't crack is cuz Hinata is determined to get him.  But Hinata isnt the main character, so i fail to see how that matters.  Sakura was determined to be with Sasuke and look where that got her.
> ...


naruto loved sakura just like sakura loved sasuke, if he loves her still its not so apparent, what i see nowadays between naruto and sakura is a friend that is trying to pay his promise and make his friend happy, just this.

sakura still shows clear signs of love towards sasuke, her conflict towards him is so obvious, like, really.

what is the point of kishi making hinata throw herself at naruto's legs? only to make him kick her ass for a girl that loved his rival in the first place?

do you guys realise how naruto will hurt hinata if he turns his back to her? and how out of place it will feel if naruto and sakura end up together after sakura loving sasuke all this time?

if sakura accept naruto one day, it will just be because she couldnt have sasuke, how bad is this for naruto, really? he would be her second choice.

if i were a naruto fan, i would pray for naruto to end up with hinata, she is beautiful, has a good personality, and doesnt play with his heart, she has also loved him from day one.

as a true sasuke fan, i prefer to see him die than end up with sakura, and this is how bad i think that sakura's character is.


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## Eikichi Onizuka (Feb 9, 2012)

Jeαnne said:


> naruto loved sakura just like sakura loved sasuke, if he loves her still its not so apparent, what i see nowadays between naruto and sakura is a friend that is trying to pay his promise and make his friend happy, just this.
> 
> sakura still shows clear signs of love towards sasuke, her conflict towards him is so obvious, like, really.
> 
> ...




95% of those arguments are so false its not even fair.
1. Naruto does not love Sakura like Sakura loved Sasuke. Sakura first liked Sasuke because everyone else did and she just wanted to fit it. Read the manga or watch the nonfilter anime. Then she learned there was a little more to him. That still doesnt come close to complexity of Naruto and Sakura relationship. 
2. Sakura honestly has feelings for Naruto she sees how much he has suffered and wants to be there for him thats why she didnt want to continue searching for sasuke. 
3. Sakura might not even love Sasuke like she did because well she did try to kill him failed and you know what he didnt flinch at trying to kill her.
4. You know whats more cruel being in a relationship with someone and knowing they wont ever love you like they do someone else.


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> o.O Naruto loves Sakura..I dont see how that makes it crack.
> 
> 
> So far the only evidence I see that NH isn't crack is cuz Hinata is determined to get him.  But Hinata isnt the main character, so i fail to see how that matters.  Sakura was determined to be with Sasuke and look where that got her.
> ...



Don't agree with his statement, both popular pairings in this thread for instance still sit on equal ground for the most part, but one thing against NarutoxSakura is Sakura's feelings.

As you keep bring up Sakura was Naruto's first crush. However Sakura's feelings have been clear and aren't changing. Sakura's feelings for Naruto are purely platonic.

If a romantic sub plot is going to be resolved anytime soon NaruHina is the current most likely pairing to get some sort of resolution. The resolution may not be what the fans want of course, but Hinata's development this chapter puts the pairing onto the front burner.


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## Kakugo (Feb 9, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...





AMtrack said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...





son_michael said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> Naru Saku fans exist because we actually appreciate a budding romance that's been developed since the earliest chapters, we exist because we want Naruto to get what he wants and he wants Sakura. We exist because of the many many hints of attraction Sakura has for Naruto, of her evolution in how she first handled and felt about him to how she is with him now. We see the seeds have been sown and now we wait for the romance to blossom, we have far more evidence than any pairing starting from the earliest chapters to the current ones.







shurei said:


> For HinaNaru to be a sure win, there sure is a lot of rage.
> Perhaps it's not such a victory as proclaimed. We still have to hear from Naruto. That guy, the other half of HinaNaru



Oh yea, *that* guy. Guess we forgot about him again, didn't we.


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## Vort (Feb 9, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> A girl like me means "a girl like me".  She didnt say "a girl thats kind" or "a girl thats brave"...she said "a girl like me."  Who is similar to Kushina?  Sakura.  Its incredibly blatant.  Hinata is not like Kushina.  Their personalities couldnt be more opposite.



It was last minute motherly advice, it doesn't really support any pairing.  There is _one_ person that's like Kushina though and that is Naruto.  So I guess that statement must support Naruto/Naruko.



> Sakura had no way of knowing Naruto needed saving.  Only Hinata and her Byakugan could see that.  Btw, Sakura has tried to protect Naruto more times than Hinata ever has.
> 
> 1) Chuunin exams
> 
> ...



Sakura is also on Naruto's team.  Of course she's had more chances to protect her teammate.  Just like any of the other "good" characters, she protects her friends.

It's true that Sakura didn't know that Naruto needed saving.  The point is that it was Hinata that went, fully knowing that she could end up dying.  She ended up confessing because Naruto pressed her on why she came to help.  As for not trying to free Naruto, the anime adaption while filler gave a good view on why it would have been meaningless to try to remove the rods first anyways.  Defeating that Pain body was the only choice.



> After Hinata's confession, Naruto still likes Sakura and cant confess her until he brings Sasuke back??



You really think Naruto will confess after he brings Sasuke back?  He knows and respects that Sakura is in love with Sasuke.  Even if he is in love with Sakura, Naruto would not burden Sakura with that kind of guilt.



> Naruto and Sasuke have a higher possibility than any pairing.  And given that Sakura loves Sasuke, Naruto loves Sakura, and Hinata loves Naruto...one is hardly more likely than the other.
> 
> The one with the most development and paneltime is Naruto and Sakura though.  Take that for what it is.
> 
> EDIT:  Fact is Naruto loves Sakura.  Fact is Hinata confessed, and Naruto did not return her feelings.  Get over it.



What development?  Certainly not romantic development.  They've developed pretty well as friends even if they can't confide in each other about anything other than Sasuke.  "Mutual Development" was thrown out the window in chapter 469.

Fact is Naruto's feelings are ambiguous at best.  He may love Sakura, but beyond a flashback from Sai's perspective that could have been from before the wind element training, there's nothing to suggest that he is _in_ love with Sakura.  

Fact is there is a hell of a lot going on for Naruto to be focusing on his love life.  



Tyrannos said:


> Why do NaruSaku's exist?   Because we like the possibility of a NaruSaku pairing?
> 
> *Nothing wrong with people liking a pairing, even if it never happens.    Just look at all the other types of pairings in this forum alone, they like it for the fun of it.*



The bolded for truth.



> Never know, next chapter things can easily turn around.  It's happened before.   Remember that Hinata Confession moment only to have Naruto greeted with a hug by Sakura.  (We can argue if that was platonic or not til our eyes bleed).



It was platonic *eyes start bleeding*



> And we can argue about the Sannin Parallels, the Kushina Parallels, or whatever parallels til our hearts content.    But to use anime filler is just wrong on so many levels, and we all know why.



Eh...arguing the Sannin and Kushina parallels is just as bad as using anime filler in my opinion.


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## son_michael (Feb 9, 2012)

Jeαnne said:


> naruto loved sakura just like sakura loved sasuke, if he loves her still its not so apparent, what i see nowadays between naruto and sakura is a friend that is trying to pay his promise and make his friend happy, just this.



not so apparent because he was mad at her for lying about wanting to save Sasuke and also her decision to kill sasuke?

are you seriously arguing he no longer loves her because of that?





> sakura still shows clear signs of love towards sasuke, her conflict towards him is so obvious, like, really.



she has to sort her feelings out for the both of them. makes no sense to me but that's the way it is...

One could make an argument that Sakura has abandoned all hope of being with Sasuke and simply seeks to save him now but that would be an interpretation with no real evidence.





> what is the point of kishi making hinata throw herself at naruto's legs? only to make him kick her ass for a girl that loved his rival in the first place?



Off the top of my head

1. Kill her off

2. use her to emphasize how much Naruto loves Sakura instead

3. somehow use this to give her character development(lol yea right)









> you guys do realise how naruto will hurt hinata if he turns his back to her? and how out of place it will feel if naruto and sakura end up together after sakura loving sasuke all this time?



She will get over it, in fact she will probably see them off with a smile. She's good like that. this isn't a seinin, everything will end fine and happy regardless of which pairing comes out on top.

You do realize how hurt Naruto would be if he saw Sasuke somehow magically fall in love with Sakura and the two of them got together...don't you?


it all comes down to this, what Naruto wants, he gets.



Naru Hina wins once Naruto decides to romantically like Hinata over Sakura.


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## ninjaneko (Feb 9, 2012)

*I used to post in the Library - then I took a pairing thread in the knee--I mean eye.*

_Excuse me as I shoe-horn my thoughts into this thread:_

I have to say, the NaruHina was strong this chapter...well, the Hina anyway. 

I agree with ; this chap strongly reinforces Hinata's commitment to the Naruto Train as I call it, and even shows some detectable "progress" on Hinata's end with her determination to move things forward. 

Of course, it's really not unexpected or significantly beyond similar previous thoughts from her, and it doesn't actually move it toward something mutual. Naruto is still hopelessly pining for Sakura. It just adds some wood to the fire of hope (Kishi: Just as planned ).

And one could argue that with Hinata firmly on the Naruto Train, and Naruto accepting of Sakura being on the Sasuke Train, he may eventually switch "trains" himself.  Of course, that's what NH fans have been arguing for years. But for some reason this is the first time I've begun to see it as more of a real possibility (Hinata's confession was more about her character development than any pairing development for me). 


But...you know Kishi.  The man is brilliant at giving the mere illusion of pairing development...without actually changing anything. So it's unwise to assign much significance for the future to this stuff. I made that mistake once. 'Twas unpleasant. You've been warned.

But I don't see why her words can't or shouldn't happen (unless Kishi wants to seriously disappoint the girl >(). If it works out romantically for them, this will be in hindsight a nice if small post in the road. If not, her words could still be played out in a non-romantic fashion the same way Sasuke ultimately acknowledged Sakura sans the romantic way she wanted. Her words aren't _just_ about dating him - or shouldn't be.

Speaking of which, what happened to Hinata's growth/story in the ninja/general human realm? Her feelings for Naruto have always been part of it, but it feels like it's starting to be the only avenue for it...

And on _that_ note: 

The more openly entrenched the characters get in their one-sided romances, the more...annoying I find it, as I fear it pushes closer toward an inevitably Dissatisfying Resolution (if there is one). Weird as it sounds, I actually... like the love quadrangle better when it's more fluid/ambiguous.


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## Nightjumper (Feb 9, 2012)

There was pairing development this chapter? What? If anything, the only pairing receiving that would've been Naruto X everyone.


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## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

Eikichi Onizuka said:


> 95% of those arguments are so false its not even fair.
> 1. Naruto does not love Sakura like Sakura loved Sasuke. Sakura first liked Sasuke because everyone else did and she just wanted to fit it. Read the manga or watch the nonfilter anime. Then she learned there was a little more to him. That still doesnt come close to complexity of Naruto and Sakura relationship.
> 2. Sakura honestly has feelings for Naruto she sees how much he has suffered and wants to be there for him thats why she didnt want to continue searching for sasuke.
> 3. Sakura might not even love Sasuke like she did because well she did try to kill him failed and you know what he didnt flinch at trying to kill her.
> 4. You know whats more cruel being in a relationship with someone and knowing they wont ever love you like they do someone else.



1. Naruto's initial crush in regards to Sakura wasn't any deeper than Sakura's initial crush on Sasuke. His feelings developed for Sakura in much the same way that Sakura's feelings developed for Sasuke over the extent of part one.

2. Sakura has feelings for Naruto, but they are purely platonic. They developed gradually much like her feelings for Sasuke, but they aren't romantic feelings. Its merely the feelings one might have for a brother or a close friend.

3. Sakura's attempt of Sasuke's life hasn't changed anything. Her feelings for Naruto are still platonic and her feelings for Sasuke are still romantic.

4. It wouldn't be too much a stretch should pairing stuff be focused on again for Naruto's feelings for Sakura to shift into a platonic relationship. It may already be leaning in that direction. You don't often hook up with your first crush.


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## Eikichi Onizuka (Feb 9, 2012)

ninjaneko said:


> _Excuse me as I shoe-horn my thoughts into this thread:_
> 
> Speaking of which, what happened to Hinata's growth/story in the ninja/general human realm? Her feelings for Naruto have always been part of it, but it feels like it's starting to be the only avenue for it...
> 
> ...



*Spoiler*: __ 




He wasn't even that mad when Sasuke tried to kill Sakura.



Ding Ding she has no life it seems outside the guy. The war isnt to fucking protect Naruto only Hinata. If you lose or mess up EVERYTHING goes to hell. People continually shit on Sakura for lack of development or for being flooder but where is it when it comes to Hinata. I might be bias because you know what i don't like her character. Her way of ninja is soft as hell. She needs to learn from Shino. Do things because its what has to be done.


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## Jeαnne (Feb 9, 2012)

im not here to defend any pairing, im just giving a completly non-partial and cold opinion about this stuff:

i can say with all words, until the day that sasuke was gone, naruto's love towards sakura was exacly like sakura's love toward sasuke.

sasuke ignored sakura as much as sakura ignored naruto, the difference is that sasuke has gone and no place was given for sakura to try to develop something with him. What was left was naruto, that she started to accept and recognize since sasuke was not there.

but you can see how kishi gives us the hints of where sakura's true interest is: why do you think that sakura believed that she was the one that should kill sasuke? you think that its because of that fucking promise? 

sakura just went after sasuke because she knows that there is something that she feels towards him that will never die, see that she tried to take naruto out of the way, its between both of them.

she went there to kill him, but she also knew that meeting him could end up in her own death, but thats her own choice, she prefers an end where she kills the one she loves, or is killed by him, because this would link them forever. Now tell me, where is sakura's consideration for naruto's love in this story, when it comes to sasuke? ITS NOWHERE TO BE SEEN, prove me wrong. *She even played with naruto's heart lying to him for the sake of getting him out of the way!*

people say "sakura is retarded for going after sasuke", and dont comprehend her true intentions behind this, its a true sign of love, that can only be truly displayed when sasuke is there. All possible development that narusaku can get happens exacly for the fact that sasuke is not there, when sasuke gets into the picture, sakura passes over anything that naruto could feel for her, she doesnt care, because her mind is all focused in sasuke.


do you really want this? do you really want people to say that sakura just chose naruto because she couldnt have sasuke?

really, it can sound harsh, but im just being realistic. In my mind, if narusaku happens it will be one of the biggest asspulls in this manga, but i rest my case...im still hoping for sakura's death though .

edit: gotta save my post before the mods delete it


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## auem (Feb 9, 2012)

son_michael said:


> not so apparent because he was mad at her for lying about wanting to save Sasuke and also her decision to kill sasuke?
> 
> are you seriously arguing he no longer loves her because of that?
> 
> ...



1.she never shown conflicting feeling with naruto and sasuke....*sakura never shown any romantic interest on naruto*(even her confession was spotted as fake by naruto) and *sakura never ceased to love sasuke,even after his genuine attempt to kill her*(vide the war arc where a shinobi gives her a love letter)...
she cares about naruto strongly,but it is just as much sisterly feelings as anythings else....whatever people around sakura(sai,yamoto) thinks..


2.you are right that hinata will accept a happy naruto with sakura with a smile...her love is genuine..
but how do you come to the conclusion that it would be different in case of naruto...?..he loves sakura and his commitment towards saving sasuke goes well beyond reasoning....why won't be he truly happy if two people he cares most finding happiness with each other?


i don't think that pairing in this manga will have a straight end..there will be twist....but naru-saku is clearly at odd at this point....


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## son_michael (Feb 9, 2012)

Jikayaki said:


> 1. Naruto's initial crush in regards to Sakura wasn't any deeper than Sakura's initial crush on Sasuke. His feelings developed for Sakura in much the same way that Sakura's feelings developed for Sasuke over the extent of part one.
> 
> 2. Sakura has feelings for Naruto, but they are purely platonic. They developed gradually much like her feelings for Sasuke, but they aren't romantic feelings. Its merely the feelings one might have for a brother or a close friend.
> 
> ...





I would love to know where you Naru hina fans get that sakura doesn't like Naruto in any romantic context whatsoever. The confession was done for Naruto's sake and all the development in part 1 and 2 don't just magically disappear. 

All the romantic hints don't just go away because Sakura still loves Sasuke and like I said above, even then it can be argued that she has given up all hope of being with him as she did try to kill him


----------



## Tyrannos (Feb 9, 2012)

Jeαnne said:


> the problem is that narusaku is closer to a crack pairing than even sasunaru, yet narusaku fans try to rivalize with naruhina that is a way more solid possibility at this point .
> 
> im not pro naruhina or anything, i am fan of the two yaoi crack pairings that have the most cannon evidence(sasunaru and itasasu )...but personally, from a point of view of someone who doesnt give a flying fuck about who naruto will have his babies with (since he cant with sasuke ), i think that naruhina makes so much more sense than narusaku storywise that its not even funny.



For a pairing people think is "crack", "almost crack", and " isn't going to win", there is sure plenty of rage against it.   And tons of energy trying to defend "the winner".   

Makes me think certain people could be threatened by the possibly of NaruSaku actually winning.


----------



## Jeαnne (Feb 9, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> For a pairing people think is "crack", "almost crack", and " isn't going to win", there is sure plenty of rage against it.   And tons of energy trying to defend "the winner".
> 
> Makes me think certain people are threatened by the possibly of NaruSaku actually winning.


well if we get 500 neji fans coming here and saying that he could win a fight against sasuke or naruto, there would be just as much rage , it doesnt mean that neji could in fact win them.


----------



## Kakugo (Feb 9, 2012)

Vort said:


> As for not trying to free Naruto, the anime adaption while filler gave a good view on why it would have been meaningless to try to remove the rods first anyways.  Defeating that Pain body was the only choice.



You realize it's filler, yet still use it as a reference? 



Vort said:


> You really think Naruto will confess after he brings Sasuke back?  He knows and respects that Sakura is in love with Sasuke.  Even if he is in love with Sakura, Naruto would not burden Sakura with that kind of guilt.



You really think Hinata will confess (again) after the war is over? She knows and respects that Naruto is in love with Sakura. Even if she is in love with Naruto, Hinata would not burden Naruto with that kind of guilt.

Easy how that can be adjusted.



Vort said:


> What development?  Certainly not romantic development.  They've developed pretty well as friends even if they can't confide in each other about anything other than Sasuke.  "Mutual Development" was thrown out the window in chapter 469.



Like it or not, fact remains that NS is still the most developed and the least one-sided (SN aside). Naruto and Sakura have dealt quality bonding/interaction time together both with and without the relevance of Sasuke. The extent of Hinata's interaction time with Naruto can be counted on one's hand, and have virtually nothing to do with the two of them getting to know one another on any personal level. 

But I don't know... I guess being asked out on dates and blushing when someone wants to feed you ramen seems completely in character for just a couple of "friends". 



Vort said:


> *Fact is Naruto's feelings are ambiguous at best*.  He may love Sakura, but beyond a flashback from Sai's perspective that could have been from before the wind element training, there's nothing to suggest that he is _in_ love with Sakura.



This argument again?  He reaffirmed it himself with Sai, and since then hasn't done anything to demonstrate that his feelings have changed. He *is* in love with Sakura, like it or not.



Vort said:


> Fact is there is a hell of a lot going on for Naruto to be focusing on his love life.



True.



Vort said:


> Eh...arguing the Sannin and Kushina parallels is just as bad as using anime filler in my opinion.



...which you did.


----------



## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

son_michael said:


> I would love to know where you Naru hina fans get that sakura doesn't like Naruto in any romantic context whatsoever. The confession was done for Naruto's sake and all the development in part 1 and 2 don't just magically disappear.
> 
> All the romantic hints don't just go away because Sakura still loves Sasuke and like I said above, even then it can be argued that she has given up all hope of being with him as she did try to kill him



Not really a NarutoxHinata fan so that statement really doesn't apply to me. I don't see how anyone would mistake Sakura's feelings for Naruto as anything other than a platonic relationship.

When Sakura's feelings for Naruto or her intentions regarding Naruto are brought up they are always platonic in nature. Sakura's fake confession was to try and remove Naruto from the burden of the promise he'd made for her back in part one. It was indeed made for him so he could focus on his own life and his goals, but this wasn't motivated by romantic love. Her romantic feelings where still focused on Sasuke and her feelings to Naruto where purely platonic.

There aren't any romantic hints between Sakura and Naruto her feelings have always been platonic and shown this chapter they haven't changed any.


----------



## Eikichi Onizuka (Feb 9, 2012)

I've realized why this is been happening and I've come up with a solution. Win-Win-Win. Sakura CAN'T be with Sasuke anymore people. What story is everyone reading or did I forget the fact this guy is a TERRORIST. People act like at the end of story Sasuke is coming back and all will be normal so Sakura can be with him. She isn't stupid people she knows that shipped has sailed. I don't think she forget when you he tried to KILL her. Promised to DESTROY the village that she loves. 

Sasuke isn't a viable option for anyone pointing it as one. If Kisi does make it one I guest we all got mindfucked. If he pulls an Itachi here with Sasuke then this story loses alot of points. Back to my rant. Everyone pro NaruHina uses her confession as either toying with his heart or just Naruto not wanting it. The confession was illtimed and Naruto isnt that stupid. It holds some merit. She did it because she saw how things would end up if she kept letting Naruto case Sasuke. Afterall her childish promise you know looked so selfish because he kept on putting himself in more DANGER when he didnt need to. You know added danger that seemed dumb since their was a multinational group of TERRORIST trying to kill him.

Well heres my win-win-win scenario. Sakura and Naruto give it a go figure their just better as friends and Sakura ends up with someone not Sasuke since hes dead. Hinata grows up and stops revolving her life around Naruto and learns to have some backbone from Shino. Naruto ends up with Ino.


----------



## Tyrannos (Feb 9, 2012)

Jeαnne said:


> well if we get 500 neji fans coming here and saying that he could win a fight against sasuke or naruto, there would be just as much rage , it doesnt mean that neji could in fact win them.



And if they had moments in the manga they feel could back that fact, they would be justified to.


----------



## son_michael (Feb 9, 2012)

auem said:


> 1.she never shown conflicting feeling with naruto and sasuke....*sakura never shown any romantic interest on naruto*(even her confession was spotted as fake by naruto) and *sakura never ceased to love sasuke,even after his genuine attempt to kill her*(vide the war arc where a shinobi gives her a love letter)...
> she cares about naruto strongly,but it is just as much sisterly feelings as anythings else....whatever people around sakura(sai,yamoto) thinks..



As I said, there's a whole manga's worth of romance between them. You need to read it from the beginning.


2.





> you are right that hinata will accept a happy naruto with sakura with a smile...her love is genuine..
> but how do you come to the conclusion that it would be different in case of naruto...?..he loves sakura and his commitment towards saving sasuke goes well beyond reasoning....why won't be he truly happy if two people he cares most finding happiness with each other?



He would be just as upset as Hinata would be, the thing is..he's the main character and he loves Sakura. Who's to say he could get over her and be with Hinata?He's loved Sakura from the first chapter up to the current, he thinks of Hinata as a friend or as someone he likes.

besides Sasuke Loving Sakura would really make no sense, even if he did somehow magically like her, he would have to feel guilty as shit for trying to kill her more than 3 times lol




> i don't think that pairing in this manga will have a straight end..there will be twist....but naru-saku is clearly at odd at this point....




Naru Saku is the most likely by a long shot and that wont change until Naruto decides to be with Hinata or Sakura decides to be with Sasuke.

Why is it the most likely? because its the most developed, it has the most hints and parallels and more importantly, a real relationship as its foundation. WHere as...when the hell does Naruto ever talk to Hinata? and when did Sasuke and Sakura ever spend time together without Naruto? 

Sakura knows Naruto, she's comforted by him, she arguably likes him more than a friend based on many many manga panels and she IS the main heroine, lets not forget that.


----------



## ninjaneko (Feb 9, 2012)

Nightjumper said:
			
		

> There was pairing development this chapter? What? If anything, the only pairing receiving that would've been Naruto X everyone.


Any time anything can be interpreted romantically in any way, it's declared "pairing development" or a "pairing moment." In this case, it seems a legitimate reminder of Hinata's feelings and goals, though not much else.

The entire Alliance ships themselves with Naruto now  That's why they're running to meet him  It's a race to see who gets him. They forget there's enough Naruto via bunshin to go around 



Eikichi Onizuka said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I guess I forgot that scene, though it's only showing her determination, ie. how far she's come, not really working on it further. Then again, I guess maybe she doesn't need to have any more struggles/developments really. She could, but she doesn't need to. 

I like Hinata  Her story is about changing herself and becoming stronger. 
But I also think Shino is win in a jacket.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 9, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> For a pairing people think is "crack", "almost crack", and " isn't going to win", there is sure plenty of rage against it.   And tons of energy trying to defend "the winner".
> 
> Makes me think certain people could be threatened by the possibly of NaruSaku actually winning.


To be fair, there's just as much "defending" coming from all sides, so the point is moot actually. In any case, I'm waiting for this to descend into mindless character bashing, and then I'll step in. Doesn't matter which character is getting it.


----------



## Tyrannos (Feb 9, 2012)

Golden Circle said:


> To be fair, there's just as much "defending" coming from all sides, so the point is moot actually. In any case, I'm waiting for this to descend into mindless character bashing, and then I'll step in. Doesn't matter which character is getting it.



Afraid this thread already did that pages ago.   Still plenty of Sakura hate.


----------



## Vort (Feb 9, 2012)

@Tyrannos: It's always one of the girls that ends up getting mindlessly hated on in these threads.  Though poor Sakura does seem to get it more.



Kakugo said:


> You realize it's filler, yet still use it as a reference?



Using filler to prove a pairing is pointless.  Even if 437 was animated exactly as the manga portrayed it doesn't change that attacking the rods would have been just a useless as attacking Pain head on turned out to be.  




> You really think Hinata will confess (again) after the war is over? She knows and respects that Naruto is in love with Sakura. Even if she is in love with Naruto, Hinata would not burden Naruto with that kind of guilt.
> 
> Easy how that can be adjusted.



Who said Hinata needs to confess again?  Naruto remembers Hinata jumping in to save him and her being hurt by Pain.  It stands to reason that he remembers the confession, so she doesn't need to confess again.

That adjustment only works when you work with facts.  Of the big three only the girl's feelings are set in stone. 



> Like it or not, fact remains that NS is still the most developed and the least one-sided (SN aside). Naruto and Sakura have dealt quality bonding/interaction time together both with and without the relevance of Sasuke. The extent of Hinata's interaction time with Naruto can be counted on one's hand, and have virtually nothing to do with the two of them getting to know one another on any personal level.
> 
> But I don't know... I guess being asked out on dates and blushing when someone wants to feed you ramen seems completely in character for just a couple of "friends".



Really? Naruto and Sakura's friendship is rather centered around Sasuke.  They are never shown confiding in each other unless it deals with Sasuke.  Sure they have bonding beyond that, but it is a bond of friendship.

The date requests end up being used as comic relief and for Naruto to distract Sakura from his angsting over Sasuke.  Can't a friend help another friend if they can't feed themselves?  



> This argument again?  He reaffirmed it himself with Sai, and since then hasn't done anything to demonstrate that his feelings have changed. He *is* in love with Sakura, like it or not.



The argument stands.  Sakura walking off into the background can be interpreted as letting go as well.  If Naruto really was _in_ love with Sakura, you'd think he'd show it a bit during 469/470.  Instead he focused on Sakura giving up on Sasuke.



> ...which you did.



To showcase a point that isn't pairing related.


----------



## WraithX959 (Feb 9, 2012)

Anyone who understands the Hero's Journey and Joseph Campbell's work should realize that Hinata will end up with Naruto.


----------



## Jikayaki (Feb 9, 2012)

son_michael said:


> As I said, there's a whole manga's worth of romance between them. You need to read it from the beginning.



There is no romance between Naruto and Sakura. Like every other popular pairing the pairing is completely one sided. Sakura was Naruto's first crush, but Sakura's feelings have never leaned toward romantic love. Her feelings toward him is purely platonic.



son_michael said:


> 2. He would be just as upset as Hinata would be, the thing is..he's the main character and he loves Sakura. Who's to say he could get over her and be with Hinata?He's loved Sakura from the first chapter up to the current, he thinks of Hinata as a friend or as someone he likes.
> 
> besides Sasuke Loving Sakura would really make no sense, even if he did somehow magically like her, he would have to feel guilty as shit for trying to kill her more than 3 times lol



One can argue for a potential shift of his feelings for Sakura shifting toward a platonic relationship instead of his current romantic crush. He'd certainly not try and get in the way if SasukexSakura was ever again a real possibility, not that SasukexSakura has much chance of occurring currently. Lastly we haven't seen Naruto's current feelings regarding any one of the two girls or his reactions to the pairing related stuff that was placed on back burner as the plot moved forward. Pairings hasn't been a focus.



son_michael said:


> Naru Saku is the most likely by a long shot and that wont change until Naruto decides to be with Hinata or Sakura decides to be with Sasuke.
> 
> Why is it the most likely? because its the most developed, it has the most hints and parallels and more importantly, a real relationship as its foundation. WHere as...when the hell does Naruto ever talk to Hinata? and when did Sasuke and Sakura ever spend time together without Naruto?
> 
> Sakura knows Naruto, she's comforted by him, she arguably likes him more than a friend based on many many manga panels and she IS the main heroine, lets not forget that.



It's only as developed as NarutoxHinata in all reality. The only difference Naruto is the focus and unlike Hinata has a more straight forward confident personality. The relationship is still only ever been one sided. Sakura's feelings have developed toward platonic love and hasn't changed since.


----------



## Lovely (Feb 9, 2012)

> You really think Hinata will confess (again) after the war is over? She knows and respects that Naruto is in love with Sakura. Even if she is in love with Naruto, Hinata would not burden Naruto with that kind of guilt.




Did you not read the chapter? 

And even so Hinata is not planning to just express her feelings again ('chasing', as she put it), but she's aiming on having an actual relationship.


----------



## auem (Feb 9, 2012)

son_michael said:


> *As I said, there's a whole manga's worth of romance between them. You need to read it from the beginning.*
> 
> 
> 2.
> ...



yes,one sided......
i think you are the type of guys who  read manga less than watching anime...
hence this illusion....or don't understand that there can be hell lot of caring without romantic feelings;from a person to a person...

there were many opportunities for author to make them grow intimate,but he tried to skim the pairing as long as possible and now reached a point where all type of pairings(naru-hina,naru-saku or sasu-saku),if any of it happens,will carry contradictions....


----------



## Lelouch71 (Feb 10, 2012)

I'm feeling humorous so I just repeat what I said in the past. Naruto likes/loves Sakura. Sakura "loves" Sasuke. Hinata "loves" Naruto. Sasuke "loves" revenge. 

Someone will have to change their mind in order for the pairing to work. Naruto has to look at Hinata as a possible lover for NaruHina to work. Sakura has to see Naruto as a potential lover (if she doesn't already) in order for NaruSaku to work. Sasuke has to stop having a love affair with vengeance and start liking girls to even consider Sakura as a potential lover. NaruHina and SasuSaku are very one-sided. The dudes aren't interested. NaruSaku and NaruSasu are probably the only pairing that receive any sort of development at all whether it's platonic or romantic. 

The whole Sakura choosing Naruto makes him a rebound is rather stupid. The same could be said for Naruto choosing Hinata. If either changes their mind then that's their choice. I rather see NaruKarin happen to be honest, but as far as development goes Kishi would suck less with romance if he goes with the option of NaruSaku or even NaruSasu despite how often we joke about it. NaruHina could happen but it's beyond horrible at this point. I also can't stand the fact that Hinata is so pathetic and have no life outside of wanting to screw Naruto. By the same token Sakura doesn't either. It's a damn shame both are nothing more than shallow pairing fodders at this point.


----------



## Golden Circle (Feb 10, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> Afraid this thread already did that pages ago.   Still plenty of Sakura hate.


I've got your back bro.





Lelouch71 said:


> I'm feeling humorous so I just repeat what I said in the past. Naruto likes/loves Sakura. Sakura "loves" Sasuke. Hinata "loves" Naruto. Sasuke "loves" revenge.


Yes, it feels like one giant circle. I wonder how long it will take before someone draws a diagram.



> The whole Sakura choosing Naruto makes him a rebound is rather stupid. The same could be said for Naruto choosing Hinata. If either changes their mind then that's their choice. I rather see NaruKarin happen to be honest, but as far as development goes Kishi would suck less with romance if he goes with the option of NaruSaku or even NaruSasu despite how often we joke about it. NaruHina could happen but it's beyond horrible at this point. I also can't stand the fact that Hinata is so pathetic and have no life outside of wanting to screw Naruto. By the same token Sakura doesn't either. It's a damn shame *both are nothing more than shallow pairing fodders at this point.*


That's harsh. Sakura trained with Tsunade for three years to learn healing jutsu and how to punch rocks, while Hinata taught herself a whole new gentle fist technique. You are tearing down characters and saying that they are dirt, which is not the point of this thread; if we are going to argue pairings, the first point would obviously start with the assumption that the characters involved are worthwhile and debate about how they feel from there.


----------



## Kakugo (Feb 10, 2012)

Vort said:


> Using filler to prove a pairing is pointless.  Even if 437 was animated exactly as the manga portrayed it doesn't change that attacking the rods would have been just a useless as attacking Pain head on turned out to be.



Yea, but you still used it as reference in an argument.



Vort said:


> Who said Hinata needs to confess again?  Naruto remembers Hinata jumping in to save him and her being hurt by Pain.  It stands to reason that he remembers the confession, so she doesn't need to confess again.
> 
> That adjustment only works when you work with facts.  Of the big three only the girl's feelings are set in stone.



The adjustment was made to show the double standards in your post. If you can proclaim that Naruto would feel bad for supposedly imposing his feelings onto Sakura when hes concerned about her feelings for Sasuke, why can't the same be said for Hinata when shes likely aware that Naruto is in love with Sakura?



Vort said:


> Really? Naruto and Sakura's friendship is rather centered around Sasuke.  They are never shown confiding in each other unless it deals with Sasuke.  Sure they have bonding beyond that, but it is a bond of friendship.
> 
> The date requests end up being used as comic relief and for Naruto to distract Sakura from his angsting over Sasuke.  Can't a friend help another friend if they can't feed themselves?



Romantic elements to emphasize on a friendship we already knew existed? Makes total sense.


*Spoiler*: __ 













 

What's this, no Sasuke conversation going on? How unheard of. Let's also ignore Naruto straight-forwardly admitting he wants to be alone with Sakura on a "date-like" walk. Not like his advances have ever been labeled as a joke or completely disregarded altogether though, amirite?

Oh wait. 



Vort said:


> The argument stands.  Sakura walking off into the background can be interpreted as letting go as well.  If Naruto really was _in_ love with Sakura, you'd think he'd show it a bit during 469/470.  Instead he focused on Sakura giving up on Sasuke.







Pretty straight forward. The guy feels like shit for not being able to keep his promise, thus feels inadequate and undeserving to confess to her directly. Him watching her walk into the distance longingly =/= letting go of her, cause if that were the case then he could/would of done so during the hospital scene with Sasuke, yet his feelings have always remained the same. 

You honestly think he wouldn't be better equipped mentally to tell her how he feels once the circumstances become better (aka fulfills his promise)? I have no reason to believe that he wouldn't.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 10, 2012)

Lovely said:


> Did you not read the chapter?
> 
> And even so Hinata is not planning to just express her feelings again ('chasing', as she put it), but she's aiming on having an actual relationship.





What a pathetic turn of events.

When Naruto said he'll confess to Sai after he's redeemed Sasuke it's 'why would he confess? Sakura already knows he loves her', yet now that it's Hinata-hime, of course she'll confess again .

Be at least a little subtle about your bias, I mean come on.


----------



## Hydro Spiral (Feb 10, 2012)

Kakugo said:


> Let's also ignore Naruto straight-forwardly admitting he wants to be alone with Sakura on a "date-like" walk. Not like his advances have ever been labeled as a joke or completely disregarded altogether though, amirite?
> 
> Oh wait.


OK, keep in mind though, that one was still a cover up for his Sasuke wangst :33

He was indeed thinking about Duckbutt and the failed reunion, literally _right_ before she showed up. Not planning a date


----------



## Kurama (Feb 10, 2012)

Hinata's never been shown to give a damn about Naruto's crush on Sakura. I'll get to the rest later.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 10, 2012)

Hydro Spiral said:


> OK, keep in mind though, that one was still a cover up for his Sasuke wangst :33
> 
> He was indeed thinking about Duckbutt and the failed reunion, literally _right_ before she showed up. Not planning a date



Little tip; if you give SN an inch, they will beat you with it for a mile.

Namely never, ever do it.

Just don't.


----------



## santanico (Feb 10, 2012)

> As I said, there's a whole manga's worth of romance between them. You need to read it from the beginning.



lol what?


----------



## Lovely (Feb 10, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> What a pathetic turn of events.
> 
> When Naruto said he'll confess to Sai after he's redeemed Sasuke it's 'why would he confess? Sakura already knows he loves her', yet now that it's Hinata-hime, of course she'll confess again .
> 
> Be at least a little subtle about your bias, I mean come on.



Right now I'm just stating what Hinata said in the chapter. I'm not making assumptions or anything like that-- this is exactly what she meant by her monolog.  

What I'm arguing is that such a statement wouldn't be said if the author didn't intend to go through with it. I don't think this is just some typical pairing tease; her statement is much too straight forward, and hints at obvious reciprocation, which is certainly new for Kishi.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 10, 2012)

Lovely said:


> Right now I'm just stating what Hinata said in the chapter. I'm not making assumptions or anything like that-- this is exactly what she meant by her monolog.
> 
> What I'm arguing is that such a statement wouldn't be said if the author didn't intend to go through with it. I don't think this is just some typical pairing tease; her statement is much too straight forward, and hints at obvious reciprocation, which is certainly new for Kishi.



Except Naruto actually said why he hadn't already confessed.

The most you can say is that she may have implied she will confess with the intention of Naruto giving her an answer.


Yet again I'd like to take a moment to call out your bias here.


----------



## Tyrannos (Feb 10, 2012)

kyuubi425 said:


> Hinata's never been shown to give a damn about Naruto's crush on Sakura. I'll get to the rest later.



And yet Naruto loved Sakura enough to give her room to pursue her love for Sasuke.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 10, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> And yet Naruto loved Sakura enough to give her room to pursue her love for Sasuke.



Which is why if anyone's feelings are going to change, it'll probably be Naruto's.


----------



## Lovely (Feb 10, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Except Naruto actually said why he hadn't already confessed.
> 
> The most you can say is that she may have implied she will confess with the intention of Naruto giving her an answer.
> 
> ...



Her words didn't _imply_ anything, it was all too obvious at what she meant. 

Hinata is tired of 'chasing' Naruto, which means that she is tired of attempting to get his attention romantically/having her feelings remain unrequited. She's going to stop chasing him once and for all after the war is over (her feelings will stop being one-sided), and instead she _will _hold his hand (she'll be in a relationship with him.) 

This reasoning is exactly why I believe Hinata's inner thoughts were more than just wishful thinking on her part, but actual foreshadowing by the author himself.

If you want to compare the POAL with this, Naruto admitted to Sai  that he couldn't express his feelings for Sakura if he did not succeed in bringing Sasuke back. It was all about his feelings, and it did not in any way hint at Sakura eventually reciprocating, as this chapter did for NaruHina.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 10, 2012)

Lovely said:


> Her words didn't _imply_ anything, it was all too obvious at what she meant.



Not in regards to confessing.

She said absolutely nothing about it, all you're running with are implications.



> Hinata is tired of 'chasing' Naruto, which means that she is tired of attempting to get his attention romantically/having her feelings remain unrequited. She's going to stop chasing him once and for all after the war is over (her feelings will stop being one-sided), and instead she _will _hold his hand (she'll be in a relationship with him.)





I don't think that's up to Hinata to decide.



> This reasoning is exactly why I believe Hinata's inner thoughts were more than just wishful thinking on her part, but actual foreshadowing by the author himself.



Seems like pretty poor foreshadowing to be honest.

At its heart it's just Hinata wanting to get into Naruto's pants again.



> If you want to compare the POAL with this, Naruto admitted to Sai was that he couldn't express his feelings for Sakura if he did not succeed in bringing Sasuke back. It was all about his feelings, and it did not in any way hint at Sakura eventually reciprocating, as this chapter did for NaruHina.



So you think Naruto has already had a positive conversation with Hinata and now is the first time it's being brought up? As you people are so lovely to remind me, there are several NH moments in this arc, yet nothing was mentioned of some previous conversation but now?

However you're also strawmanning me, we're talking about confessions, not possible requital. 

The fact is, Naruto was talking much more about actually confessing his feelings to Sakura and why he couldn't do it yet, compare it to Hinata who doesn't actually say anything regarding a confession, only that she's done chasing after him.


----------



## Zarzamora-no-kimi (Feb 10, 2012)

I think all this discussion I haven't even read can come to a very simple conclusion. 

We all have come to the agreement that Kishi does seem more aware of his readers than other authors do, and he has resorted to write the story not just as it could be, but carefully written to address itself to the readers.

With that said, there is no way he could have made Hinata say the things she said if there wasn't a future plan in it. Whatever future it is, we can at least expect some sort of....something. Whether it is Hinata just straight out tell him "I wanna have your babies" or "Decide boy" (I'm just making a point). Hell it could be her telling him just for him to reject her. 

Kishi hasn't let loose ends, and the one we have know are because they are still developing, taking panel time.We sure as hell will see something in the future. That Kishi chose to address this side of the story AT THIS MOMENT means something pro-NaruHina will happen, whatever that might be.

Many thought the Naruto/Hinata closed after her confession because Kishi didn't address it until this chapter, now we know it wasn't. Many will think this Naruto/Hinata will be closed after this, and then something else will come up.


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## Lovely (Feb 10, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Not in regards to confessing.
> 
> She said absolutely nothing about it, all you're running with are implications.
> 
> ...



Yet, that's the thing.... Hinata said nothing about confessing again,  but her words mean that she's actively decided to have a relationship with Naruto. Which is a step  further than just releasing pent up feelings, or confessing, in other words. 

And I'm not sure about any past conversations Naruto and Hinata may or may not have had. It could be that he already gave her an answer, which is something I doubt. As I said before, I think her thoughts were foreshadowing eventual reciprocation, and that it highlights less of what she wants personally, but more that the mangaka is using her as a mouth piece to tell his audience which way he's heading on the pairing front. If one takes Hinata's comment as wishful thinking, then her statement would seem highly presumptuous. I don't think that's Kishi's intention.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 10, 2012)

So you're branching off completely from your statement that Hinata is likely to confess to Naruto again?

That's really all I wanted to point out, the terrible inconsistencies you had compared to your stance on Naruto confessing to Sakura in the future.


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## Lovely (Feb 10, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> So you're branching off completely from your statement that Hinata is likely to confess to Naruto again?
> 
> That's really all I wanted to point out, the terrible inconsistencies you had compared to your stance on Naruto confessing to Sakura in the future.





> And even so Hinata is not planning to just express her feelings again ('chasing', as she put it), but she's aiming on having an actual relationship.



I specifically said that she _wouldn't_ confess again. Where are you getting that from?


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## jacamo (Feb 10, 2012)

OMG imagine if the Konoha 11 characters that got inner monologues in this chapter were ALL killed by Sasuke's hand..... including Hinata and Sakura 

insta respect Kishi


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 10, 2012)

"Just" modifies the sentence, meaning "as well as" in regards to pursuing a relationship with Naruto.


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## Lovely (Feb 10, 2012)

Yet in my other posts I've stated several times about what I think she'll do. She won't just confess like Naruto would have done with the POAL, does that make my meaning clear to you? The nitpicking really doesn't make my point any less true. The main thing is that Hinata will not make a confession #2, but her motivation is to make the feelings she's already expressed, mutual.


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## Tyrannos (Feb 10, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Which is why if anyone's feelings are going to change, it'll probably be Naruto's.



Perhaps, but then everyone can change their mind.   Sakura could opt to go for Naruto, Hinata could decide to give up her dream and have Sakura be with Naruto.  Ino could go after Chouji.    Sakura could go after Lee.     You never know til the fat lady sings.


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## AMtrack (Feb 10, 2012)

Zarzamora-no-kimi said:


> I think all this discussion I haven't even read can come to a very simple conclusion.
> 
> With that said, there is no way he could have made Hinata say the things she said if there wasn't a future plan in it. Whatever future it is, we can at least expect some sort of....something. Whether it is Hinata just straight out tell him "I wanna have your babies" or "Decide boy" (I'm just making a point). Hell it could be her telling him just for him to reject her.
> 
> Kishi hasn't let loose ends, and the one we have know are because they are still developing, taking panel time.We sure as hell will see something in the future. That Kishi chose to address this side of the story AT THIS MOMENT means something pro-NaruHina will happen, whatever that might be.



Well here's the thing...I can't disagree with you because you make a good point; however, since she's already confessed, there is little else she can do to push the issue without it making her character seem..well pushy.  Hinata is *not* a pushy character, so Kishi is really writing himself into a whole, if what you say is true.

Realistically what can Hinata do?  Force him to answer her?  She never asked a question, she just confessed her feelings.  Pushing him to accept them would be very out of character.  I really don't get what ppl are expecting...especially when the two dont share panels together very often.  Its partially why I feel ppl are reading into it way too much.  At most Hinata might confront Naruto directly and ask how he feels about her, but even that doesnt seem like something Kishi would write.  Only for what?  Naruto to say "you're a great friend but I like someone else?"

Hinata knows he likes Sakura..the whole freakin village knows.  I doubt Kishi would put Hinata in that sort of position lol.  Course part of her character may be learning how to accept the fact that the one she loves loves someone else.  Maybe.  Or maybe they'll ride off into the sunset together, though I dont find that likely.

I think since the panel wasnt given any significance, you read it as is..Hinata wants to get into Naruto's pants.  Everyone knows its not her decision to make.  Sakura also said she's going to fight with Naruto whatever he says, but we know shes just gonna stand on the sidelines and be a cheerleader.  Unless you sincerely believe that the Rookies are gonna team up with Naruto against Tobi/Sasuke just cuz Sakura said it all determined.  Of course not.  I dont see what makes Hinata's statement any different.  They were all just spouting stuff to pump themselves up.


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## Inuyatta (Feb 10, 2012)

@MrHorrible: I don't think she's been inconsistent insomuch as you've come off as somewhat willfully obtuse in regards to her points.  I'm not sure what it is, but you and a couple of others seem pretty hellbent on picking a fight with mostly anyone who chimes in with another nod to NaruHina--which is what the debate threads are for. 

Then again, this is a pairing thread outside of the FC's, so it was probably bound to happen. 

I am not here to engage in a fight as I'm far too happy to be in the right mindset for it, please excuse me. But I would like to ask a question that Holyhands pointed out some pages ago that I feel is worth discussion, if you'll indulge me.

Kishimoto has had a penchant for inserting background information via flashbacks at various points during the action-heavy sequences, this much we can agree on, yea?

So with just what we've seen in the manga thus far, without any projection, speculation, guesswork, etc--would it be completely shocking if it was revealed that Naruto and Hinata DID speak to each other offpanel, perhaps before leaving for the island?

The reason I ask is because this page in particular has struck my notice:
Sunagakure priest

Had it been a single image of Naruto smiling, I wouldn't have thought much of it and just assumed it was an ideal memory (since she says his smile saved her, it would make sense), like what Sakura has here in this page: 

Sunagakure priest

But as you can see, there's more to the panels in the first page I gave you. Not only is there that flash of Naruto's surprise, there's a follow up with his smile. Furthermore, there's a section of rebuilt Konoha behind him in both images, so this is most definitely a memory. Seemingly a memory that Hinata is privy to, while the rest of us are not.


I don't think it's stretching too much to make notice of this, as the page is set up to place emphasis on it without being too direct (though this is according to animation students, I have no idea what their grades are in the subject).

I don't think anything so preposterous as a returned confession took place off screen, but what if it was just a simple 'why don't we see where it goes after this war is over?' 

I mean, if Naruto is willing to let Sakura go, it wouldn't be unreasonable for him to see what happens with a girl that loves him. It'd be pretty unrealistic to expect him to remain celibate and forever alone because his first crush didn't work out, right? 

I just wanted to bring this up and see what everyone thought, be it from the fans, haters or neutrals.


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## AMtrack (Feb 10, 2012)

Inuyatta said:


> words



Because something as important as "pairings" will never be hinted or resolved through flashback.  Ever.  That is just the epitome of very bad writing.  Everything happens in realtime, except to confirm what the reader already knows (Sai flashback, Sakura flashback of Sasuke).  Any *new* information is always presented in realtime (at least in Naruto).  Basically what you see now is what you get.

That would have been impossible anyway given a few reasons..

1) After Hinata's confession, it was reconfirmed that Naruto wasnt going to confess to Sakura until the end of the manga.  Basically, that conversation would not have taken place, because the pink haired girl was still on Naruto's mind.

2)  A confession doesn't change how you feel about someone.  Most ppl wish it did, but thats now how it works.  A confession might allow you to look at them differently, but all that takes time.  Naruto and Hinata have not shared that time together, therefore, that conversation could not have taken place.


What NH lacks is time and development.  Bottom line is, if this manga went on another 300 chapters after the war, I could say NH had a real shot.  But after the war it can be assumed the manga will be pretty much over.  There's no time left for Naruto to spend time with Hinata and get to see her differently.  There's no time left for Naruto to switch his feelings just like that for someone he's hardly spent time with.  There's just no time for that development to take place.

The only way NH can take place is in an epilogue, where all that can be skipped.  I'd hardly consider that a good ending to any pairing though, but if it makes ppl happy its an option.  

The only pairing with sufficient on-panel development is NS, and that would not require epiloguing.  Both SS and NH would need epiloguing in order to happen; cuz quite frankly it can't happen on-panel due to the fact the manga is about over...and neither pair is really getting developed.  Just getting reconfirmations of one-sided feelings we already knew.


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## Inuyatta (Feb 10, 2012)

Hm...well, if that's what you really feel, thank you for your thoughts. I can't say I agree, but I appreciate that you answered.


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## AMtrack (Feb 10, 2012)

For those who were wondering about the NS/MinaKushin parallel, someone from my FC put together a nice comparison.  You'll notice the edit text is from this thread rofl.



nasa123 said:


> :ho:ho
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> ...




This is what I meant by a copy/paste lol..kinda why I find hard to deny that the parallel exists.  Not saying it means anything, but it doesnt get much more blatant than that.  Course it could all be the result of Kishi being so uncreative he ripped MinaKushi from NS


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## Marsala (Feb 10, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Because something as important as "pairings" will never be hinted or resolved through flashback.  Ever.  That is just the epitome of very bad writing.  Everything happens in realtime, except to confirm what the reader already knows (Sai flashback, Sakura flashback of Sasuke).  Any *new* information is always presented in realtime (at least in Naruto).  Basically what you see now is what you get.



This is logical, but it also seems likely that Naruto and Hinata had some sort of interaction off panel, one in which Hinata became very optimistic.

Buuuuut... it's strange that it's being brought up now of all times. It's not a straightforward way to do a romance. More likely it will come out in full in a dramatic moment.

Hinata making that vow is really testing fate, especially now that Sasuke is on the scene. There haven't been any deaths in the war, but it's hard to believe that there won't be even *one*, and logically Kishimoto would save the death for a dramatic moment near the end and give it to a villain who isn't a plant clone or zombie. Tobi doesn't need to establish his evil cred (also, he snapped Torune's neck), Kabuto is a schmuck, but Sasuke...


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## AMtrack (Feb 10, 2012)

Marsala said:


> This is logical, but it also seems likely that Naruto and Hinata had some sort of interaction off panel, one in which Hinata became very optimistic.



I honestly just think she's crazy, or Naruto's thing about her eyes got her feeling pumped up.  If anything did it, it would be that imo.



> Buuuuut... it's strange that it's being brought up now of all times. It's not a straightforward way to do a romance. More likely it will come out in full in a dramatic moment.
> 
> Hinata making that vow is really testing fate, especially now that Sasuke is on the scene. There haven't been any deaths in the war, but it's hard to believe that there won't be even *one*, and logically Kishimoto would save the death for a dramatic moment near the end and give it to a villain who isn't a plant clone or zombie. Tobi doesn't need to establish his evil cred (also, he snapped Torune's neck), Kabuto is a schmuck, but Sasuke...



LOL Kishi couldnt dare kill Hinata..she's just too good.  Then again I suppose that would make it all the more dramatic.  Its the end of the manga so i suppose he'll kill who he wants.  More than anything I think he didnt know what else to have Hinata say.  Hinata only talks in relation to her love for Naruto, it would be odd if she said anything but that now that i think of it.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 10, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> Perhaps, but then everyone can change their mind.   Sakura could opt to go for Naruto, Hinata could decide to give up her dream and have Sakura be with Naruto.  Ino could go after Chouji.    Sakura could go after Lee.     You never know til the fat lady sings.



When someone's feelings have to change in order for things to progress, you have to look for the weakest link.

Sakura is still in love with Sasuke, despite everything.

Hinata is still in love with Naruto, and is indeed pursuing an actual relationship with him, as opposed to a distant admiration.

Naruto is still in love with Sakura, but he's shown a willingness to step aside if that's what makes her happy.

Fact is Naruto is the weak link in the chain of one-sided feelings.

As you say, nothing's guaranteed, but if I were betting on who's going to be the one to change, my money would be on Naruto.


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## Don-kun (Feb 10, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Which is why if anyone's feelings are going to change, it'll probably be Naruto's.



I think the way you look at this Manga is very wrong... Just like out the fillers doesn't count, the fan logic doest not count either.

NaruHina can still Happen but it will no be because Naruto will give up because he can't win Sakura's heart believe me He will get some romantic feeling from her, but he can say no to them.... they can have a chat and say that they don't want to sacrifice the frienship they have or Naruto can say that he wants to get to know Hinata more.....

There is no Sakura feeling set in stone here, the story is about Naruto.
getting with hard work and sacrifice everything he ever wish for.

If you can accept that he will save the worl, save is best friend, become Hokage how can you ignore that he may win Sakura's heart.....


Again NH can still happen but not because he give up is because he doesn't want to be with Sakura... not the way around...


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## gershwin (Feb 10, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> For those who were wondering about the NS/MinaKushin parallel, someone from my FC put together a nice comparison.  You'll notice the edit text is from this thread rofl.
> 
> 
> nasa123 said:
> ...



Kishi is well-known for sin of copy pasting poses and expressions  
It`s nothing but his inability to try the new angles/views.
If an average reader was meant to see paralells in those scenes - "saving Sakura bridal style" should have happen after MinaKushi flashbacks, not before and shouldn`t been overshadowed by following Naruto`s dialogue with Sasuke.
Target audience that reads Shounen Jump once a week in no way will be searhing throughout the whole manga for similar drawn scenes. Its only what pairing tards like most of us in this thread are capable of. 
If paralell doesn`t lie on the surface  - it doesn`t exist.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 10, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> I really wonder why you're so angry...it is nearly impossible to have a logcial argument with you because you lolrage and miscontrue everything I say.  My advice to you is take a break from the computer, have some meaningful relationships, and come back.  You are way too absorbed in this whole pairing thing.  Calm the hell down.  Seriously.


I was having logical argument for 4 pages until you popped up with provocative tone and ruined everything.You started to post nonsense just trying to support your point blindly ignoring tons  of aspects.
I thank you for the advice but i have already a "meaningful" relationship with a wife and 2 kids, thanks for carrying tho.
The only one absorbed is you,if you bothered to read properly and not trying to twist my sayings then everything would be fine. I even tried to open a discussion with you properly and your reply pretty much showed who is absorbed and who is not. Refer checking couple of posts back.



> Nowhere did I say a parallel was a solid basis for anything.  Like I said, stop miscontruing what I say and freakin breathe.  All I said was the parallel existed.  And it does.  You can argue with me all you want, but the author's intention, by Kushina's words "Find someone like me", made it clear we were supposed to compare Kushina to someone.


No, you made it sound like ( and from the tons of discussion around it) that parallel  can be used as solid argument for Naruto choosing Sakura, which is ridiculous to say at least.Like i have  said in  my previous posts ,parallels are mainly authors writing style that sometimes can collide in the series, especially in the long ones. if you took the meaning of Kushina words " Find someone like me" as " find someone that got same character like me, same hair,same forehead etc" and not " Find someone as carrying as me that would love you and willing to do same sacrifices as i did "  or something close  to it then i think we shouldn't even bother discussion further eachother, its pointless.Convening mothers last moments towards her son as  nothing more than some joke she spouted ,then wow.


> If you dont think the parallel is important just say it.  Sitting here and arguing that it doesnt exist, and im crazy for thinking it exists (despite evidence to the contrary) is nothing short of being nuts.  Breathe dude..really.


Nobody said parallel doesn't exist all i said it is ridiculous for any manga to use  parallel as a valid point in order to support your arguments around it, or some of them.




> I find it rather funny that any NH argument becomes full of rage.  Its really going to be a sad day is the NH ship sinks..cuz I imagine the whole forum will just explode with bash threads, anger, hatred, and bans.  Its the only shipping fandom in Naruto that is so ridiculously militant that any objection to it results in personal attacks.  Even so-called "neutrals" go batshit crazy if you continue to object to Naruhina, with reasonable manga evidence mind you (Naruto not loving her being a rather huge one).


Hilarious, i didn't even rage as you would like it to sound, i merely got annoyed by your provocative tone while posting ridiculous argumentative "facts" .You didn't even bother to read the previous posts and try to follow the discussion you just popped in and started the "fact show"



> In any case, ppl will read a manga how they want to.  All i can do is guess an author's intention based on obvious things, and try not to get into subtle things (cuz bias generally clouds judgement).  The *obvious* thing to me is the similarity of Kushina to Sakura.  Some ppl, like the person i was debating with, will just not see it at all..but as I said Kushina was meant to be similar to someone (or else she wouldnt say "find someone like me").


Yes people should read the manga and make form their own opinion based around them,but, there is a difference from someone that tries to state the romance fact while referring to chapter 1 of the series.
And no, i would disagree about Kushina, we don't know that much about her personally to make be sure, yes there are facial and some character similarities but these are from far what we could use as intended by the mangaka in order to give it importance, hell,we don't even know that Sakura would/could ever do such sacrifice like Kushina did. We can assume yes,but thats all.





> The biggest candidate, as in the closest, is Sakura for all the reasons I listed (and they were *quite* a few).  Call it coincidence if you want ( i find that hard to buy), but its there.


And i have already told you, something based 200 chapters ago doesn't stops a character to be developed further, especially in a series where character developing is what the writer tends to focus on. We do not know Naruto's feelings for Sakura after the confession,until we actually see it and having them both talk it remains an open book,do not also forget that there is a reason why this fake confession existed to begin with, if not it only strengthen Sakura's love to Sasuke  further.Sasuke and Sakura romance is another open book that i wont refer to discuss as anything can change drastically in couple of chapters.



> And since it needs to be said, Hinata's panel was given no more significance than any other rookie panel.  As a result, it is unlikely its a pivotal scene at all..because if it was, the author would surely draw more attention to it.  The fact that he did not says to me that its just Hinata expressing her wish.  Hinata isnt a fortune teller, its just yet another reaffirmation of her feelings.  Big whoop..we knew she loved the guy already.


Hinata's panel was the only one that busted the change is her feelings in major extend,we all knew that she likes Naruto and she gets developed around him but what we did learn this time was that her determination has changed, she is more resolved than anything ( same like happen with Pain fight) which shows a MAJOR change in her persona. 
Yes Hinata is not a fortune teller,but Kishimoto that writes Hinatas words sure is, don't you think ?



> Give me a panel of Naruto considering Hinata romantically, and then you can get excited.  Until then nothing has changed..as usual.  You're about to walk right into another 437 to 450 again.  NH had a party after 437 and then 450 smacked them in the face.  How many times have I heard:


For the last time, try to read my posts before quoting me, i already explained TONS of times on how romance works in this Shounen series and Kishimoto tries to approach it many times via foreshadowing,flashbacks and late development.
But il play along and use your kind of " fact" 
Naruto said in part 1 said even tho Hinata looks dark as person he still likes her.
You may say it was nothing more than friendly approach  ( which i consider this as starting point for Hinata development as character into what she becomes later on).
As you can see its not hard to twist the readings into my liking,but, i dont like to have that kind of approach.




"





> its over we won" only for it not to be over lol.  When will you ever learn?


Hahaha, its interesting quote that fans use against eachother in order to cause a provocation , nothing is over and noone has won until the end of the series.


EDIT


> Because something as important as "pairings" will never be hinted or  resolved through flashback.  Ever.  That is just the epitome of very bad  writing


Already happen in this exact series.Welcome to naruto manga.


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## auem (Feb 10, 2012)

*@AMtruck,*

*i think those images proves that sakura is a sisterly replacement for a mother naruto never had.*..if  kushina had a girl,sakura would have been that kind....like naruto's aura matching minato's...

*@marsala,*

if sasuke kills any rookies and particularly hinata,it is ensured that he will die as a villain or redeem himself in death...i bet...


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## Icegaze (Feb 10, 2012)

Just adding my 2 cents to this... "hot topic". 

When I see the term "logical" used in any argument in regards to romance it makes me cringe, whether it is fictional or IRL. There's no logical explanation to anyone's romantic feelings for another human being. Emotional stimulations (or stimuli) transcend Cartesian logic if not there won't be all these "tragedies" in relationships.

Anyway, each and every pairing has it's pros and cons.














































But NaruHina is the best!


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 10, 2012)

Icegaze said:


> Just adding my 2 cents to this... "hot topic".
> 
> When I see the term "logical" used in any argument in regards to romance it makes me cringe, whether it is fictional or IRL. There's no logical explanation to anyone's romantic feelings for another human being. Emotional stimulations (or stimuli) transcend Cartesian logic if not there won't be all these "tragedies" in relationships.


Logical as in the discussion about the style this manga goes and to extend of possibilities that Kishimoto  give/gave us so far.
As more to put ourselves into mangakas place and think on how he could continue based on what he did so far.
I was talking more in general on how the views on this manga are discussed ,possibilities and such,rather focusing to use logic to explain the romance.


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## Kuromaku (Feb 10, 2012)

Icegaze said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That's like saying a rotten egg is better than shit.  You're better off, but still left highly unsatisfied and even a little sickened.

Anyway, there's always some logical explanation of a person's feelings, however, it's the nature of said feelings that can become illogical.  Lust is illogical.  Love however, involves quite a bit of logic, believe it or not.


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## Icegaze (Feb 10, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> I was talking more in general on how the views on this manga are discussed ,possibilities and such,rather focusing to use logic to explain the romance.



I totally understand that. And I wasn't necessarily refering to your posts. In fact, I'd say I agree with most of you have said so far. 

I just wanted to make a general point.


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## First Tsurugi (Feb 10, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> Words



I don't know why you assume Sakura will develop romantic feelings for Naruto, there isn't very much at this point that suggests that will happen.


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## Jikayaki (Feb 10, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Because something as important as "pairings" will never be hinted or resolved through flashback.  Ever.  That is just the epitome of very bad writing.  Everything happens in realtime, except to confirm what the reader already knows (Sai flashback, Sakura flashback of Sasuke).  Any *new* information is always presented in realtime (at least in Naruto).  Basically what you see now is what you get.
> 
> That would have been impossible anyway given a few reasons..
> 
> ...



There have been important developments that happened off panel to be introduced after the fact. Sure off the top of my head they are far and few between, but it isn't impossible for what some suggest to occur and is something Kishimoto could potentially do.

Pairings aren't really important their sub plots. It doesn't matter that some fans are fanatic regarding their preferred pairing it doesn't change that. A flashback to set up a resolution to one of these romantic sub plots is completely in the realm of possibility. It would likely be needed as all pairings are still one sided.

Pairing related sub plots are on the back burner obviously more important events are occurring right now, but at least Hinata's statement may be taken to foreshadowing of a conclusion to one of these sub plots after the war. That of course doesn't mean NaruHina is going to happen she could just be rejected.

NaruHina has relatively the same amount of development as any pairing. The characters involved in NaruHina and NaruSaku have gone through the same general development. All NaruSaku benefits from is that Sakura was Naruto's original crush and Sakura tends to be in forefront more because of being a member of team seven. 

Both pairings are equally one sided some development would be needed to make them official. Naruto's feelings for Sakura and Hinata have to be readdressed and change for NaruHina to happen. Sakura's feelings regarding Sasuke have to be addressed and her feelings for Naruto changed from platonic to romantic for NaruSaku to happen.


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## Mr Horrible (Feb 10, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> I don't know why you assume Sakura will develop romantic feelings for Naruto, there isn't very much at this point that suggests that will happen.



More than what suggests Naruto will develop feelings for Hinata at this point, which is nothing.

I mean at least we have a panel of Sakura looking depressed after the summit, even if it confirms she still loves him, her opinion of him is lower than ever before. Then we have acts on Sakura's behalf towards Naruto that were certainly suggestive, NH has absolutely nothing like that, which is one of the reasons I'm troubled when people claim it's the most likely.


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## Iamacloud (Feb 10, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Well here's the thing...I can't disagree with you because you make a good point; however, since she's already confessed, there is little else she can do to push the issue without it making her character seem..well pushy.  Hinata is *not* a pushy character, so Kishi is really writing himself into a whole, if what you say is true.



That's the point, Hinata is not pushy, she wouldn't be this confident if she did not have reasons to. Kishi wrote her that way because she has reasons to be confident.



> Realistically what can Hinata do?  Force him to answer her?  She never asked a question, she just confessed her feelings.  Pushing him to accept them would be very out of character.  I really don't get what ppl are expecting...especially when the two dont share panels together very often.  Its partially why I feel ppl are reading into it way too much.  At most Hinata might confront Naruto directly and ask how he feels about her, but even that doesnt seem like something Kishi would write.  Only for what?  Naruto to say "you're a great friend but I like someone else?"



If Kishi was to have Naruto answer "you're a great friend but I like someone else", he certainly wouldn't go about it the way he did in this chapter as that would be setting her up for a massive dissapointment. There was ample time for Naruto to gently turn her down, but instead, we see that she is more determined and confident than she ever was. Naruto is not a jerk, if the answer was a simple "thanks but I'm not interested", he would have told Hinata long ago instead of letting her keep her hopes up.



> Hinata knows he likes Sakura..the whole freakin village knows.  I doubt Kishi would put Hinata in that sort of position lol.  Course part of her character may be learning how to accept the fact that the one she loves loves someone else.  Maybe.  Or maybe they'll ride off into the sunset together, though I dont find that likely.



You see the point "I doubt Kishi would put Hinata in that sort of position", but refuse to admit the obvious conclusion. She won't be put in that sort of position, because Naruto's answer will be positive.



> I think since the panel wasnt given any significance, you read it as is..



But it was... she spoke first and she got the most panel time (in fact ever since she confessed, NH is the only pairing that got positive panel time). Isn't part of your NS argument that NS has more panel time together? Well ever since 437, the pattern has reversed. NS got panel time alright, negative panel time, and NH kept getting more and more positive panels.



> Hinata wants to get into Naruto's pants.  Everyone knows its not her decision to make.  Sakura also said she's going to fight with Naruto whatever he says, but we know shes just gonna stand on the sidelines and be a cheerleader.  Unless you sincerely believe that the Rookies are gonna team up with Naruto against Tobi/Sasuke just cuz Sakura said it all determined.  Of course not.  I dont see what makes Hinata's statement any different.  They were all just spouting stuff to pump themselves up.



Well the rookies are indeed going to help Naruto, if only by standing by his side. Thing is Sakura clearly said she would stand by his side as one of his friends. Hinata clearly said she would stand by his side as more than a friend.



AMtrack said:


> Because something as important as "pairings" will never be hinted or resolved through flashback.  Ever.  That is just the epitome of very bad writing.  Everything happens in realtime, except to confirm what the reader already knows (Sai flashback, Sakura flashback of Sasuke).  Any *new* information is always presented in realtime (at least in Naruto).  Basically what you see now is what you get.



Karin/Sasuke FoD meeting says hi!

I do think the reveal of Naruto's growing feelings for Hinata will happen in real time, but I also think this will be helped by flashbacks revealing how his view of her changed after seeing her growth.



> That would have been impossible anyway given a few reasons..
> 
> 1) After Hinata's confession, it was reconfirmed that Naruto wasnt going to confess to Sakura until the end of the manga.  Basically, that conversation would not have taken place, because the pink haired girl was still on Naruto's mind.



You don't stop loving someone just like that. All that Sai's flashback did was remind us that when Hinata confessed, Naruto still had feelings for someone else (since the flashback took place BEFORE Hinata confessed). But don't you find it awfully convenient that Kishi has not touched Naruto's feelings for either of them since? We've had plenty of Hinata -> Naruto and Sakura -> Sasuke moments. But no Naruto -> Sakura one. If Naruto is still sooooo in love with Sakura, why isn't it showing? Up to Hinata's confession we always had sporadic reminders of Naruto's feelings for Sakura. But not since then...

It's Kishi himself that is emphasing Hinata and Sakura's romantic feelings while neglecting Naruto, the fans are just taking what he is giving them.

If Naruto's feelings for Sakura are still as strong as ever, why isn't it showing while we had plenty of demonstrations from Sakura and Hinata? 



> 2)  A confession doesn't change how you feel about someone.  Most ppl wish it did, but thats now how it works.  A confession might allow you to look at them differently, but all that takes time.  Naruto and Hinata have not shared that time together, therefore, that conversation could not have taken place.



1) I don't believe they had a conversation yet. I think we'll see that in real time, not through a flashback, just like you.

2) Naruto HAS had time to reflect on his feelings for both Sakura and Hinata.

3) It's not the confession itself that could change Naruto's hearth, but rather the growth revealed by her actions. And we know Naruto DID notice that growth "Don't be so hard on yourself, you're strong!". 



> What NH lacks is time and development.  Bottom line is, if this manga went on another 300 chapters after the war, I could say NH had a real shot.  But after the war it can be assumed the manga will be pretty much over.  There's no time left for Naruto to spend time with Hinata and get to see her differently.  There's no time left for Naruto to switch his feelings just like that for someone he's hardly spent time with.  There's just no time for that development to take place.



There has been plenty of Naruto -> Hinata development. 

Naruto's initial view of Hinata: Dark shy weirdo.

Naruto's reaction to seeing Hinata fight Neji: I never knew Hinata could be this amazing.

Naruto's reaction after the proud failure speech: I really like people like you.

Naruto's reaction to Hinata's confession: You're strong! 

Slowly but surely, Hinata has been changing the way Naruto sees her.



> The only way NH can take place is in an epilogue, where all that can be skipped.  I'd hardly consider that a good ending to any pairing though, but if it makes ppl happy its an option.



No it is not the only way lol. In fact Kishi just told us how and when NH could take place. Hinata plans on making a move on Naruto after the war. The last time Hinata was shown in that manner, it lead to 437.



> The only pairing with sufficient on-panel development is NS, and that would not require epiloguing.  Both SS and NH would need epiloguing in order to happen; cuz quite frankly it can't happen on-panel due to the fact the manga is about over...and neither pair is really getting developed.  Just getting reconfirmations of one-sided feelings we already knew.



So much emphasis has been put on Sakura's feelings for Sasuke lately, and so little nothing on Naruto's feelings for Sakura, that I believe you are mistaken in your analysis. For NS to happen, a LOT of development would be needed to repair the damage caused to it in the kage meeting arc.

Seriously, Sakura has acknowledged the hero and good man Naruto has become, so Kishi burned one of his major tool for turning Sakura around with that. 

He also ruined the "Sakura finding out Naruto loves her" by having a 3rd party confess for him.

He also ruined MANY old NS moments with the Kage meeting arc. You can't say anymore that Yamato implied romantic love with his comment, not after his reaction to Sakura's confession. You also can't say "Sakura has been slowly falling in love with Naruto" <insert feeding/blushing/etc scene here> because Sakura herself revealed that she never looked at Naruto in a romantic way.

So all the "romantic development" between NS actually never happen, it was wishful thinking. 

On the other hand, Kishi has revealed NOTHING of Naruto's romantic feelings ever since Hinata confessed. The door is still open there, while he would have to pretty much start over with Sakura -> Naruto.

Hinata has always been extremely insightful when it comes to Naruto. She wouldn't be this confident without reasons. She obviously took his "don't be so hard on yourself, you're strong" comment as an insentive to keep going, and I think she was right to.


----------



## auem (Feb 10, 2012)

i often wonder whether sakura's most precious moment with sasuke is the time when naruto bounded sasuke by rope and used henge no jutsu to get close to sakura...

seriously,only twice sakura felt a positive response from sasuke regarding romance...once that scene and other was when sasuke thanked her before knocking her into sleep...

i wonder if sakura will ever know...


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## ch1p (Feb 10, 2012)

Eikichi Onizuka said:


> 95% of those arguments are so false its not even fair.
> 1. Naruto does not love Sakura like Sakura loved Sasuke. Sakura first liked Sasuke because everyone else did and she just wanted to fit it. Read the manga or watch the nonfilter anime. Then she learned there was a little more to him. That still doesnt come close to complexity of Naruto and Sakura relationship.



Yeah, read the manga. That's good advice, for you too. 

Look at it. Sakura liked Sasuke and she didn't know others did too. She didn't like Sasuke so she'd fit in. Furthermore, after knowing her best friend did like the same boy, if her desire to fit in was this big, she would have dropped her crush. Ino doesn't look happy that Sakura likes Sasuke after all. What you say, Sakura liking Sasuke to fit in, makes no sense.

I'm sick and tired of the misinterpretation of Ino and Sakura's friendship. Honestly people, I know Sakura is not an easy character to like, but at least _try_ to have accurate information about what you hate.


----------



## bearzerger (Feb 10, 2012)

three hundred chapters ago when there was still hope for romantic development shipping still had any reason to exist. Nowadays however, there's just no point. NaruHina starved to death as the stereotypical otaku-pairing and NaruSaku died because Kishi fed it poison.


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## AMtrack (Feb 10, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> Fact is Naruto is the weak link in the chain of one-sided feelings.



Umm incorrect..i really wonder if we are reading the same manga.  Sakura is the weakest link, by far, because she is nowhere near as strong as Naruto or Hinata emotionally.  For example:

1) Of the 3, Sakura is the only one to have questioned her feelings.

2) Of the 3, Sakura is the only one who tried to kill her crush

3) Of the 3, Sakura is the only one who has had to have her hopes renewed due to doubt.

4) Of the 3, Sakura's feelings are the only ones that have actually been in constant flux and development.

5) Naruto and Hinata are alike in the fact that they refuse to give up.  Just like Hinata won't drop her love for Naruto, Naruto will not drop his for Sakura.

6)  Naruto has the strongest feelings in the manga.  Sasuke, despite all his crimes, is still loved by Naruto.  Sakura is no different..any bond Naruto has is no different.  He gives up on no one, and gives up on nothing.  Kyuubi just said it, once he gets his mind set on something he just wont back down.  Thats Naruto.

7)  If it wasn't for Naruto, Sakura would've given up on Sasuke already.  Naruto has always been the one to renew her faith, to do all the heavy lifting, which is why Sai called her a leech (pretty much)>


Sakura's feelings have always been the weakest..the most ambiguous..the most shaky.  To say Naruto's one-sided love is the weakest among the 3 is a bit of a joke, you'd have to ignore the entire manga to come to that kind of conclusion.  NH can't happen based on Naruto giving up, it has to happen based on Naruto genuinely changing his mind.  He wont give up, thats just not Naruto.



Icegaze said:


> Just adding my 2 cents to this... "hot topic".
> 
> When I see the term "logical" used in any argument in regards to romance it makes me cringe, whether it is fictional or IRL. There's no logical explanation to anyone's romantic feelings for another human being. Emotional stimulations (or stimuli) transcend Cartesian logic if not there won't be all these "tragedies" in relationships.
> 
> ...



At least you're honest, reading through BS gets really old lol.  You represent the fandom well


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## Tyrannos (Feb 10, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> When someone's feelings have to change in order for things to progress, you have to look for the weakest link.
> 
> Sakura is still in love with Sasuke, despite everything.
> 
> ...



Actually both Naruto and Sakura are the "weak links" because of that "decision" they have to make.

Naruto its either Sakura or Hinata.
Sakura its either Naruto or Sasuke.



First Tsurugi said:


> As you say, nothing's guaranteed, but if I were betting on who's going to be the one to change, my money would be on Naruto.



To me that bet would be on Sakura.   Because Hinata is not relevant to the overall plot of the story, unlike Sakura is.   Hinata's plot is revolving solely around Naruto and her breaking out of her shell.

I honestly don't see Kishimoto having Hinata jump in harms way or have her confess again (since those plots have already been used), not to mention having Naruto make that romantic decision in the middle of fighting Madara and Sasuke.  Just doesn't mesh well, IMHO.

With Sakura, since she's connected to Sasuke, there is a greater chance of something happening like we have in the past with the Forest of Death, the Fight on the Hospital, and Sasuke leaving Konoha.  

So that's why I think Sakura is that "weak link" in the love Quadrangle.



First Tsurugi said:


> I don't know why you assume Sakura will develop romantic feelings for Naruto, there isn't very much at this point that suggests that will happen.



What's to say she hasn't?   Everyone is fixated on her thinking about Sasuke, but is it really romantic?   We honestly don't know.

To NSers, the relationship between Naruto and Sakura has been building for years.   And not something that happened overnight.

And to say there isn't very much is being ignorant to the manga moments:


Naruto saving Sakura from Gaara
The Promise of a Lifetime
Sakura running to save an Injured Naruto.
Sakura offering to feed Naruto while he was injured.
Sakura crying out for Naruto (and him appearing)
Sakura hugging Naruto after defeating Pain
Naruto princess-carrying Sakura in saving her from being killed by Sasuke

I can easily imagine if Sakura was Hinata or Naruto as Sasuke, you NS haters would regard this as romantic too. in a heartbeat.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 10, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> To me that bet would be on Sakura.   *Because Hinata is not relevant to the overall plot of the story, unlike Sakura is*.   Hinata's plot is revolving solely around Naruto and her breaking out of her shell.


I highly disagree with this statement and i will be explaining the  why.
Is it true that Hinata's development mainly revolves around Naruto, not solely.Her training and growth wasn't only for Naruto's sake but for herself as well .As head of Hyuuga clan in the early days she felt weak and powerless but she knew that she couldn't let herself to be protected for the whole time so she became stronger,also as part of her nindo which exactly the same as Narutos.
She already played major part of the overall plot of the story during Chuunin and Pain arc and i can easily explain it if you do not see it how.
Everyone in the rookie team plays major role and are relevant to the plot, best example is nothing more than the latest chapter.


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## Hydro Spiral (Feb 10, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> Actually both Naruto and Sakura are the "weak links" because of that "decision" they have to make.
> 
> Naruto its either Sakura or Hinata.
> Sakura its either Naruto or Sasuke.



Kishi already took care of Sakura's end though. 539 was the big _*"Who is it!?"*_ chapter for Sakura after all developments had taken place, and 540 was the answer.



> Naruto saving Sakura from Gaara
> The Promise of a Lifetime
> Sakura running to save an Injured Naruto.
> Sakura offering to feed Naruto while he was injured.
> ...



That's all fair and good and I get what you're saying, but in addition to her growth towards Naruto, you also have to remember.._She was *still* shown to reject Naruto and express blatant disinterest in his pursuits_ :/

In a rather lulzy fashion that he brushed off pretty easily


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## Don-kun (Feb 10, 2012)

First Tsurugi said:


> I don't know why you assume Sakura will develop romantic feelings for Naruto, there isn't very much at this point that suggests that will happen.




I don't know why you assume Sasuke magicaly will develop romantic feelings for Sakura, after he try three time to kill her and treat her like garbage, there isn't very much at this point that suggests that will happen.


I don't know why you assume Naruto will develop romantic feelings for Hinata, when there re no even close with each other, there isn't very much at this point that suggests that will happen.

*Lol see what I did there.....*


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## ch1p (Feb 10, 2012)

auem said:


> i often wonder whether sakura's most precious moment with sasuke is the time when naruto bounded sasuke by rope and used henge no jutsu to get close to sakura...
> 
> seriously,only twice sakura felt a positive response from sasuke regarding romance...once that scene and other was when sasuke thanked her before knocking her into sleep...
> 
> i wonder if sakura will ever know...



The forehead compliment is not a powerful memory Sakura has of Sasuke (she never thought of it again), and even if it was, it's not in the same level of the thank you scene. If that was true, it would have appeared along with it when she rejected killing him. However, it didn't.

Furthermore, Sasuke not answering Sakura's heartfelt confession, leaving her for power, and explicitly telling her they have their own individual paths to take from that moment on, is not a positive response in the slightest, let alone a _romantic_ positive response.


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## Madai (Feb 10, 2012)

Hinata: You're impossibly fast and strong, your skin is gold with flames coming off of it, your eyes change color, and sometimes you speak like... you're a complete retard but it's still inspirational.  You never eat or drink anything but ramen, how old are you?
Naruto: 16
Hinata: How long have you been 16?
Naruto: uh... what?
Hinata: I know what this pairing is...
Naruto: SAY IT... OUT LOUD!
Hinata: Fuck, we're just like Twilight!
Naruto: Are you afraid?
Hinata: No, that bitch Sakura doesn't stand a chance.

100% PROOOVED


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## Jeαnne (Feb 10, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> I don't know why you assume Sasuke magicaly will develop romantic feelings for Sakura, after he try three time to kill her and treat her like garbage, there isn't very much at this point that suggests that will happen.
> 
> 
> I don't know why you assume Naruto will develop romantic feelings for Hinata, when there re no even close with each other, there isn't very much at this point that suggests that will happen.
> ...


sasuke is a white canvas when it comes to het love, he could be gay for all i care, kishi can pull sasuke falling in love for any girl for the sole fact that he loves no one at all.

btw if you guys dont want hinata, would be cool if sasuke got her, she is so much better than sakura its not even funny .


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## Arles Celes (Feb 10, 2012)

Jeαnne said:


> sasuke is a white canvas when it comes to het love, he could be gay for all i care, kishi can pull sasuke falling in love for any girl for the sole fact that he loves no one at all.
> 
> btw if you guys dont want hinata, would be cool if sasuke got her, she is so much better than sakura its not even funny .



Actually SasuHina is mega win:

1) Sasuke loves being the "boss" so he gets the most submissive girl in the manga that will always allow him to have his way

2) At least 3 pairings are trolled as a result and the pairing war that would ensue would be hilarious to watch LOL.

3) Sasuke is an dojutsu lover so with Hinata he would get a "dojutsu girl". Just perfect.

4) He never tried to kill her or abused abused her in any way.

Make it happen Kishi-Sama


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## Tyrannos (Feb 10, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> I highly disagree with this statement and i will be explaining the  why.
> Is it true that Hinata's development mainly revolves around Naruto, not solely.Her training and growth wasn't only for Naruto's sake but for herself as well .As head of Hyuuga clan in the early days she felt weak and powerless but she knew that she couldn't let herself to be protected for the whole time so she became stronger,also as part of her nindo which exactly the same as Narutos.



How is that relevant to the main plot with Naruto saving the Ninja world?   With the Akatsuki?   With the Bijuu?   With Sasuke?



LivingHitokiri said:


> She already played major part of the overall plot of the story during Chuunin and Pain arc and i can easily explain it if you do not see it how.
> Everyone in the rookie team plays major role and are relevant to the plot, best example is nothing more than the latest chapter.



I would appricate it if you did, because I really don't see Hinata's plot being relevant outside her offering Naruto Cheat on the test and the plot around Neji.  The only plots that I regard being "major" was Naruto's determination to pass and the plot around Orochimaru's infiltration.

With the Pain Arc, only thing Hinata did that was relevant was jump in to rescue Naruto and nearly got herself killed.   She didn't even lay a hand on Pain, and her getting stabbed caused the Kyuubi transformation that could've risked the lives of the village.



Hydro Spiral said:


> Kishi already took care of Sakura's end though. 539 was the big _*"Who is it!?"*_ chapter for Sakura, and 540 was the answer.



No, you think Kishi took care of that.  Unless you're Kishimoto, you're just assuming.



Hydro Spiral said:


> That's all fair and good and I get what you're saying, but in addition to her growth towards Naruto, you also have to remember.._She was *still* shown to reject Naruto and express blatant disinterest in his pursuits_ :/
> 
> In a rather lulzy fashion.



Last I checked, comedical rejection moments in Shonen tends to be a good thing.   

Now if you want serious romantic moments, I suggest you go read Shoujo manga.


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## Hydro Spiral (Feb 10, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> No, you think Kishi took care of that.  Unless you're Kishimoto, you're just assuming.


Well..

540 was post-developments, and dealt with current feelings. She had a whole arc where she questioned and dealt with her feelings for both teamamtes. That little scene was the result.

But okay, I guess.. :'U



> Now if you want serious romantic moments, I suggest you go read Shoujo manga.


That wasn't my point, bro 

My point was that even if she grew towards him [and she did], she was still blatantly disinterested in _that_ sense.


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## ch1p (Feb 10, 2012)

Arles Celes said:


> Actually SasuHina is mega win:
> 
> 1) Sasuke loves being the "boss" so he gets the most submissive girl in the manga that will always allow him to have his way
> 
> ...



1. Sasuke needs someone that will support him and someone who can call him out on his bullshit. Sasuke does so many stupid things already, because he has no support / guidance. Marrying a doormat wouldn't really help him be a better person.

3. Kishimoto has come out and say if a Uchiha and a Hyuga have a kid, it would had a Sharingan and a Byakugan eye. Why would Sasuke destroy his clan's legacy, if that legacy was the reason he'd marry another doujutsu user? Also, Hinata is (or should be, I don't even know anymore, she doesn't have the branch seal yet) the Hyuga's heir. Why would she marry someone who'd destroy her clan's legacy?

I agree 2. would make pairing wars more entertaining though. Then again, most everything will at this point.


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## Don-kun (Feb 10, 2012)

You My problem is those donb argument that state that Sakura feeling are set in stone thats *BS.*

Sakura find liking in naruto she warm up to him a lot, she try to kill Sasuke to stop is madnest and spare Naruto, she forget about him when the rookies make there statement only to spare her friend, in the last confrontation *Rasengan vs. Chidori she scream Naruto's name not Sasuke or even the two*, Your heart will only responde to the person you care for the most in life and death situations. she lose hope many times, she place Naruto over Sasuke in everything minus the romantic part, and know she look up to Naruto....

Hinata look up to Naruto because everyone turn him down, and Hinata Family turn her down she borrow Naruto strent to over come her own weakness...He imspared her, Remove Hinata past and give her Hanabi's success and ask your self if she will still be imspired by Naruto.....

Now in curent Manga Hinata's feelings are set in stone, But Naruto and Sakura feelings are still open. Naruto's love are selfless and Sakura's love is weak.....


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## Jeαnne (Feb 10, 2012)

its because sasuke is going for the kill, not naruto


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## Arles Celes (Feb 10, 2012)

Ch1p said:


> 1. Sasuke needs someone that will support him and someone who can call him out on his bullshit. Sasuke does so many stupid things already, because he has no support / guidance. Marrying a doormat wouldn't really help him be a better person.
> 
> 3. Kishimoto has come out and say if a Uchiha and a Hyuga have a kid, it would had a Sharingan and a Byakugan eye. Why would Sasuke destroy his clan's legacy, if that legacy was the reason he'd marry another doujutsu user? Also, Hinata is (or should be, I don't even know anymore, she doesn't have the branch seal yet) the Hyuga's heir. Why would she marry someone who'd destroy her clan's legacy?
> 
> I agree 2. would make pairing wars more entertaining though. Then again, most everything will at this point.



1. The problem is that even with tsundere-like girls(Karin and Sakura) Sasuke was always the guy with the last word. If the girl resisted his way of thinking he would just call her "annoying" and do what he intended anyway. He hardly gives a damn about what others tell him so a "strong" girl would have no effect on him anyway.

2. Considering that SasuSaku, NaruHina, and NaruSasu are the pairings with the biggest fanbase SasuHina happening would have the most mind blowing effect possible on the pairing war. And if NAruto and Sakura do NOT end up together then it would be even more hilarious. All those pairing fans arguing their "theories" for years and here LOL an asspull pairing. And a Sasuke in love? It would be even more mindblowing than the Juubi reveal

3. There is always possible that a mix of both dojutsus could result in an even more haxxed dojutsu so all good for the Sauce. Besides if he marries a regular girl then due to said girl having no Uchiha blood the sharingan may even die. Better a half sharingan than none.

And Sasuke would overtake the Hyuuga clan anyway. They have such a big house and Sasuke loves big houses


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## Don-kun (Feb 10, 2012)

@Jeαnne

Sasuke was goin for the kill the first time, Kakashi even make a come about it and what we get later a Heart confession from Sakura....BS again. She try to give up on the guy many times, is because of Naruto she still belive. In some way it does Make sense, how can they be a Happy team 7 if she and Kakashi loose hope...
Her feeling are the weakist accept it.

And Yes SasuIno and SasuHina are cool. No abuse or murther attempt But Zero development..


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 10, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> How is that relevant to the main plot with Naruto saving the Ninja world?   With the Akatsuki?   With the Bijuu?   With Sasuke?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Overall plot is not only how Naruto saves the world, its about all his life and how he developed from a hated child into what he is today.
Ok let me explain.
Chunnin arc:
The role she played was mainly in the developing of Naruto's character. She pretty much began all this heat between Neji and Naruto.
Hinata was cheered by Naruto making her stand against Neji,on the other part Neji's way of thinking was, the whole thought of the weak(dropout) to stand against the strong nothing more than  a wishful thinking. Neji crushed what Naruto's ( and later Hinata's) nindo represents, so Naruto vowed to protect this by fighting and winning against Neji, all concluded into Major character development for naruto and him getting more acknowledged by others.

Pain arc:
In the Pain arc it was more visible, Hinata played a strong part on what Pain's ideology stood all along ,Hinata's (fake) death made Naruto realize the pain of loss,which later one contributed  for Naruto to understand what Pain was talking all along and to come with an answer.

Both these parts played major role in Narutos development as a character.
Same can be said for the other rookies in their own relevant way.
All are one chain which made Naruto into current Konoha Hero.


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## gabzilla (Feb 10, 2012)

Arles Celes said:


> Actually SakuHina is mega win



Fixed it for you


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## Arles Celes (Feb 10, 2012)

gabzilla said:


> Fixed it for you



But what about SakuIno then?

I demand a threesome: SakuInoHina

ULTRA WIN

The boys in this manga do not even care about the girls so let them have their "bromances".


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## ch1p (Feb 10, 2012)

Arles Celes said:


> 1. The problem is that even with tsundere-like girls(Karin and Sakura) Sasuke was always the guy with the last word. If the girl resisted his way of thinking he would just call her "annoying" and do what he intended anyway. He hardly gives a damn about what others tell him so a "strong" girl would have no effect on him anyway.



Because he married Karin and Sakura for you to say this with certainity. Teammate and marriage dynamics are not the same. You wouldn't hear me complaining about this if you had said SasuTen.



> 2. Considering that SasuSaku, NaruHina, and NaruSasu are the pairings with the biggest fanbase SasuHina happening would have the most mind blowing effect possible on the pairing war. And if NAruto and Sakura do NOT end up together then it would be even more hilarious. All those pairing fans arguing their "theories" for years and here LOL an asspull pairing. And a Sasuke in love? It would be even more mindblowing than the Juubi reveal



Didn't I say I agreed with it?



> 3. There is always possible that a mix of both dojutsus could result in an even more haxxed dojutsu so all good for the Sauce. Besides if he marries a regular girl then due to said girl having no Uchiha blood the sharingan may even die. Better a half sharingan than none.



Kishimoto does not agree with your scenario.



> And Sasuke would overtake the Hyuuga clan anyway. They have such a big house and Sasuke loves big houses



Sasuke overtaking the Hyuga clan? The guys that brand the big majority of their people so they won't have them clamouring for power? Your scenario sure seems very likely. 

Sasuke will be in the bottom of social hierarchy if he ever goes back to the Leaf. As if a big, respected and important clan like the Hyuga would soil their name or want to deal with a super powered traitor.


----------



## Corvida (Feb 10, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Umm incorrect..i Sakura's feelings have always been the weakest..the most ambiguous..the most shaky.



You wish. If Sakura?s feeling werent the weakest. shakiest and most ambigous, Naruto woudnt have made the POAL or reacted to her confuzzlion-and her autums skies- the way he did..Even Kishimoto called them ?"stubborn" .Sakura?s tragedy was precisely that she-coudnt cast-them off. as she would have liked in order  to carry what she felt it was her duty. to both her teammates.
The ambiguity card got rancid after the guilt trip.







puxa Asturias


----------



## Kakugo (Feb 10, 2012)

AMtrack said:


> Umm incorrect..i really wonder if we are reading the same manga.  Sakura is the weakest link, by far, because she is nowhere near as strong as Naruto or Hinata emotionally.  For example:
> 
> 1) Of the 3, Sakura is the only one to have questioned her feelings.
> 
> ...





Tyrannos said:


> Actually both Naruto and Sakura are the "weak links" because of that "decision" they have to make.
> 
> Naruto its either Sakura or Hinata.
> Sakura its either Naruto or Sasuke.
> ...



Pretty much this.


----------



## gershwin (Feb 10, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> Now in curent Manga Hinata's feelings are set in stone, But Naruto and Sakura feelings are still open. Naruto's love are selfless and Sakura's love is weak.....


Sakura`s love was destined to meet the greatest number of obstacles than any other pairing and outlive them. How in the hell it can be said with the straight face that her feelings are weaker than Naruto`s?


----------



## Iamacloud (Feb 10, 2012)

@MrHorrible, AMtrack, DonJoseph, and others reacting against the view that this chapter foreshadows NH, please answer me this.

Why does Kishi write Hinata so confident and determined at this point in the game? 

After 450, it seemed like Naruto could have walked to Hinata and told her "Thanks but I'm not interested", and she would have been fine with it. 

But she does not WANT to walk with him anymore, she thinks she WILL walk with him (holding hands to clarify that she doesn't mean "as a friend"). While she seemed not to expect anything when she confessed, things have dramatically changed now. A rejection when she's so sure of herself would be much harder then when she did not appear to expect anything.

It also implies that she clearly didn't get the vibe that Naruto wasn't interested, and Hinata has always been extremely insightful when it comes to Naruto. 

So again I ask: Why does Kishi write Hinata so confident and determined at this point in the game, if he does not intend to make NaruHina canon?


----------



## BlazingCobaltX (Feb 10, 2012)

Iamacloud said:


> @MrHorrible, AMtrack, DonJoseph, and others reacting against the view that this chapter foreshadows NH, please answer me this.
> 
> Why does Kishi write Hinata so confident and determined at this point in the game?
> 
> ...



Is Hinata a character on her own or does she breath for the sake of this pairing? Kishi could've written her like that to show how much she has changed from what she used to be, not to indicate a pairing closer to its canonshap. 

This is what I always see; Hinata lives for the solemn reason to make this pairing canon, but tell me; is Hinata an individual or not?


----------



## Inuyatta (Feb 10, 2012)

She is an individual, but that does not mean that she's now the type to shoot her mouth off without any reasonable justification. I'd hardly call that development.


----------



## kubik (Feb 10, 2012)

@Iamacloud You enjoy this don't you? 



			
				Blazing CobaltX said:
			
		

> Is Hinata a character on her own or does she breath for the sake of this pairing?


Are Hyuugas important?


----------



## Iamacloud (Feb 10, 2012)

Blazing CobaltX said:


> Is Hinata a character on her own or does she breath for the sake of this pairing?



She has been doing just fine I think, even if her character isn't focussed on. 

Her own story has progressed, her father used to view her as useless, and now he thinks that Neji and Hinata represent the future of the Hyuuga clan. She introduced a new tech (twin lion fists) that reveals some serious chakra shape manipulation skills and did quite well fighting on the front lines of this war, so clearly as a shinobi she also progressed leaps and bounds.

I still expect to hear a bit more about the Hyuuga clan, as I believe the main and branch houses system will come to an end with the current generation and that Hinata and Neji will bring that about, but it shouldn't be a main part of the story.

She's in love with the main character of the story, so obviously we hear a lot about that side, but like I said, after 450, she didn't appear to expect anything from Naruto. This chapter shows a different Hinata. 



> Kishi could've written her like that to show how much she has changed from what she used to be, not to indicate a pairing closer to its canonshap.



I disagree, showing her more confident is one thing. Having her state "Next time, I WILL be next to you, holding your hand... walking WITH you!" is taking it to the extreme.

I can't see Kishi making her this confident only to crush her confidence with a rejection by Naruto. Kishi is a corny, cliche writer, and I can't believe he would do that to Hinata. (while I would have been fine with Naruto rejecting Hinata if it happened shortly after her confession or shortly after 450) 



> This is what I always see; Hinata lives for the solemn reason to make this pairing canon, but tell me; is Hinata an individual or not?



Actually for a long time Hinata herself didn't believe she could make NH happen. I'd say all the way up to Naruto's "Don't be so hard on yourself, you're strong" in direct reference to her actions against Pain. So making NH canon wasn't her solemn reason.

*All the work she's put has been mostly for herself*. She did not like herself when she was always giving up, that was not her, and she recognized herself in Naruto and found the path to a Hinata that SHE liked better. And we've seen that she earned the respect of both Neji and her father, and how she became much stronger as a shinobi, so obviously she's been doing great on the other parts of her life, even if it was off-panel.

I'm fine with Hinata being a side character, I don't need to see Hinata training arcs or Hyuuga arcs, I can see through what little is revealed that she is doing just fine in other aspects of her life.

Although I think it's safe to say that we should see more of her in the future.



kubik said:


> @Iamacloud You enjoy this don't you?



Of course not...



















Gah I need to stop lying to myself, of course I am.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 10, 2012)

That's Not a got excuse Come on You can do better....


----------



## LivingHitokiri (Feb 10, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> That's Not a got excuse Come on You can do better....


And exactly how you contribute to this discussion,not ask how exactly are you arguing against what she/he said ?


----------



## scerpers (Feb 10, 2012)

Christ.

You ^ (not the meaning of the word "respect".) and your pairings.


----------



## BlazingCobaltX (Feb 10, 2012)

Icloud, I'll respond tomorrow.



Scorp A Derp said:


> Christ.
> 
> You ^ (not the meaning of the word "respect".) and your pairings.



Stay away, pairings are srs bzniz here.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 10, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> And exactly how you contribute to this discussion,not ask how exactly are you arguing against what she/he said ?



Sory Ima was too fast..



kubik said:


> @Iamacloud You enjoy this don't you?
> 
> 
> *Are Hyuugas important?*



I try to replay this statement....


Ok now let me ask you a question, we all love our pairing but with out any BS.
You know We still need....




Naruto>>>>>Hinata 

Sasuke>>>>>Sakura

Sakura>>>>>Naruto


But of the three selection with out any BS wichone will make a statement like this or close to this.....



*I can't tell what it's but with you I feel warm I feel Peace inside me, with you I feel save or Happy....
*


----------



## scerpers (Feb 10, 2012)

Blazing CobaltX said:


> Icloud, I'll respond tomorrow.
> 
> 
> 
> Stay away, pairings are srs bzniz here.



I just don't understand


----------



## Hydro Spiral (Feb 10, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> You know We still need....
> 
> Naruto>>>>>Hinata
> 
> ...


We just recently[finally] got that started with Naruto looking into Hina's eyes, telling her that she's strong, and thinking of the day where she confessed with a smile.

Sasuke's..Sasuke  He's on haterage mode atm, and is incapable of loving anyone who isn't name Itachi Uchiha {  }

And we know now that Sakura's loves Naru dearly after all that they've been through together, just not _that_ way.

So..Um..Meh..*shrug*


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 10, 2012)

Hydro Spiral said:


> We just recently got Naruto looking into Hina's eyes, telling her that she's strong, and thinking of the day where she confessed with a smile.
> 
> Sasuke's..Sasuke
> 
> ...




There is facts and there is speculations, there is theories and then there is fabrications. This is a fabrication.



To me It was very clear who will say something like this....

Call it fake because I call it fake too is obvios that She still love Sasuke, why? I don't know ???,  but he hurt her a lot.....

But back to my post Sakura was the only one that say that she feel Save, and the only one to express that she feel comfortable around...  Her unrequited love.


----------



## Hydro Spiral (Feb 10, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:
			
		

> But back to my post Sakura was the only one that say that she feel Save, and the only one to express that she feel comfortable around... Her unrequited love


But, y'see..She also said..

- _"Beloved by everyone in the village. * I'm just one of them*"_


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 10, 2012)

You earn My respect you are very good at selective reading.....
There is a reason why I post that page..... you wonder why people still think SS has a lot of chance? The Murder attemp and the abuse never happen. If you could do this with proof anyone can do it as well....



*Time for some NBA....*


----------



## Tyrannos (Feb 10, 2012)

Hydro Spiral said:


> Well..
> 
> 540 was post-developments, and dealt with current feelings. She had a whole arc where she questioned and dealt with her feelings for both teamamtes. That little scene was the result.
> 
> But okay, I guess.. :'U



See you guys are focusing on the, "hey the guy said asked if she liked someone and Sakura then thought about Sasuke", yet you ignore the fact that Sakura is obviously thinking that Sasuke is lost to the Darkness.   Which resulted from their last encounter, where she tried to kill him and seen how far he's fallen.

So how can you call that love?   To me, she's lost heart. 



Hydro Spiral said:


> That wasn't my point, bro
> 
> My point was that even if she grew towards him [and she did], she was still blatantly disinterested in _that_ sense.



Then lets see them.   



LivingHitokiri said:


> Overall plot is not only how Naruto saves the world, its about all his life and how he developed from a hated child into what he is today.
> Ok let me explain.
> Chunnin arc:
> The role she played was mainly in the developing of Naruto's character. She pretty much began all this heat between Neji and Naruto.
> Hinata was cheered by Naruto making her stand against Neji,on the other part Neji's way of thinking was, the whole thought of the weak(dropout) to stand against the strong nothing more than  a wishful thinking. Neji crushed what Naruto's ( and later Hinata's) nindo represents, so Naruto vowed to protect this by fighting and winning against Neji, all concluded into Major character development for naruto and him getting more acknowledged by others.



First of all it was Iruka that saved him from the Darkness, not Hinata.   And it was Team 7 that helped Naruto on his path.  Only thing Hinata did during the Chuunin Exam was to encourage Naruto in the final battle. 

And again, the fight with Neji, he wasn't fighting solely for Hinata but for all the people Neji looked down on (which included Lee).   Thats what encouraged Naruto's nindo - to never give up.    To keep fighting to send that message to Neji.



LivingHitokiri said:


> Pain arc:
> In the Pain arc it was more visible, Hinata played a strong part on what Pain's ideology stood all along ,Hinata's (fake) death made Naruto realize the pain of loss,which later one contributed  for Naruto to understand what Pain was talking all along and to come with an answer.
> 
> Both these parts played major role in Narutos development as a character.
> ...



Last I recall he thanked Nagato for helping him understand Pain, not Hinata.  If anything, Hinata was the catalyst.  And I bet if anyone of the other Rookies replaced Hinata, the outcome would've been the same.


----------



## Hydro Spiral (Feb 10, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:
			
		

> There is a reason why I post that page..... you wonder why people still think SS has a lot of chance? The Murder attemp and the abuse never happen. If you could do this with proof anyone can do it as well....


I must've misunderstood the point of your post then. Sorry 

And since I can't really speak for SS at all, I'll let someone else come in and do it 



> *Time for some NBA....*


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 10, 2012)

Iamacloud said:


> @MrHorrible, AMtrack, DonJoseph, and others reacting against the view that this chapter foreshadows NH, please answer me this.
> 
> Why does Kishi write Hinata so confident and determined at this point in the game?



Well, what possibilities are there? Personally, these spring to mind;

Naruto already gave a positive answer to Hinata.
Hinata is going to start being more forceful in her pursuit of Naruto, despite the fact he hasn't given her a positive answer.



> After 450, it seemed like Naruto could have walked to Hinata and told her "Thanks but I'm not interested", and she would have been fine with it.



Very good, now go back to the NH fc where that argument won't get laughed at.



> But she does not WANT to walk with him anymore, she thinks she WILL walk with him (holding hands to clarify that she doesn't mean "as a friend"). While she seemed not to expect anything when she confessed, things have dramatically changed now. A rejection when she's so sure of herself would be much harder then when she did not appear to expect anything.



Just like Sakura said she _will_ catch up to Naruto and Sasuke? Just like Jiraiya said he _will_ return safely to the village? Just like Sasuke said he _will_ destroy Konoha? 

Face it, unless it's Naruto, any character making a definitive statement simply can't be trusted. Now if Naruto makes a statement like that, it's a different matter, as I said before, Naruto hasn't really failed in the end ever, things generally go pretty well for him.



> It also implies that she clearly didn't get the vibe that Naruto wasn't interested, and Hinata has always been extremely insightful when it comes to Naruto.



If Hinata understands Naruto so well, why the hell didn't she help him when he was so lonely as a kid?

Hinata has shown insight into Naruto once and yet many times she's had to be corrected in her view (sometimes by Sakura of all people ).



> So again I ask: Why does Kishi write Hinata so confident and determined at this point in the game, if he does not intend to make NaruHina canon?



So, going back to my first point, the first possibility seems highly unlikely for a number of reasons;

As you people have pointed out in here, NH has had a number of moments in this arc, nearly all of them from Hinata's end. Yet this is the first we're even seeing a positive answer from Naruto being implied? For Hinata, who seems to breath for Naruto now, why on earth wouldn't this be touched on before? Not to mention, why wouldn't Hinata have featured even possibly romantically in Naruto's thoughts? Even the Kyuubi got 20-30 chapters of warming up to Naruto, do you expect me to Kishi won't give at least that to any pairing change of heart?
Then there's the reason for Naruto not confessing to Sakura; namely him being unable to fulfill his promises and the general lack of self esteem Sasuke is causing him at the moment. Remember this spills over into his dream of becoming Hokage, so it isn't just related to the PoaL and Sakura. So if we have Naruto, who doesn't think himself worthy of romance at the moment, why would he answer Hinata positively?
Finally the thought that the romance subplot will be wrapped up in a flashback with no real drama build up seems ridiculous to me, considering what Kishi has done before. On a note of what Kishi has done before, I'd advise you not to be too explicit with your crowing, remember 437->450?


----------



## Semplice (Feb 10, 2012)

The newest chapter was really sweet.    Hinata's feelings for Naruto are so pure~  :33


----------



## Bellville (Feb 10, 2012)

gershvin said:


> Sakura`s love was destined to meet the greatest number of obstacles than any other pairing and outlive them. How in the hell it can be said with the straight face that her feelings are weaker than Naruto`s?



lol are you going to imply, with a straight face, that her feelings are at least equal to Naruto's? 

after all the fucking wavering that happened in the Kage Summit arc?

she gave up. she picked everything else over Sasuke. Naruto couldn't even choose, instead he took his "should-be-impossible" third option route.

even now these feelings appear to be something she has accepted but they burden her while Naruto is STILL being strengthened by his own.

i just

i can't

i don't even

*Negged for the greater good.*


----------



## auem (Feb 10, 2012)

Ch1p said:


> The forehead compliment is not a powerful memory Sakura has of Sasuke (she never thought of it again), and even if it was, it's not in the same level of the thank you scene. If that was true, it would have appeared along with it when she rejected killing him. However, it didn't.
> 
> Furthermore, Sasuke not answering Sakura's heartfelt confession, leaving her for power, and explicitly telling her they have their own individual paths to take from that moment on, is not a positive response in the slightest, let alone a _romantic_ positive response.



i give you first para...

but 'positive' is very relative words...sasuke's last words there showed that he understand sakura's feelings,though unable to complement it because his great burden....
that's the closest possible 'positive' response sakura ever managed to get from sasuke,because at that point sasuke didn't hold up any of his inner turmoils...he was truthful to his objective...


----------



## ch1p (Feb 10, 2012)

auem said:


> i give you first para...
> 
> but 'positive' is very relative words...sasuke's last words there showed that he understand sakura's feelings,though unable to complement it because his great burden....
> that's the closest possible 'positive' response sakura ever managed to get from sasuke,because at that point sasuke didn't hold up any of his inner turmoils...he was truthful to his objective...



Yes, he understands her feelings and it's certainly positive for _them_ because he aknowledges he's grateful. However, how is that one of the two positive response regarding romance? Sasuke is cutting his ties. There is no romance in his thank you, even if we assume he loved her then (not saying he did, before anyone comes here and try slice my throat, I'm just saying that even in the best scenario this isn't about romantic love). He's not leaving any hope behind (we will both have our own paths from now on, there will be no happiness for you or me). He's saying _goodbye_ and Sakura knows this (again, individual paths, there will be no happiness). It's a powerful scene, his acceptance that how much she meant to him, but there is nothing romantic here. They were never together romantically. His thank you is not for the jolly make out time they had.

You even equate it to the half arsed forehead comment, when the emotional connotations can't even compare. This argument of yours baffles me. I have no clue what you're trying to say here.


----------



## Kurama (Feb 10, 2012)

Soooo Sakura thinking of Sasuke in 540 is brought up to counter the assumptions that she somehow harbors romantic feelings for Naruto due to her confession [despite it being an outright lie and throwing out all previous "ambiguous" moments beforehand that drew NS fans to the conclusion that something was brewing since she evidently was NOT thinking of Naruto romantically as of Sai's Guilt Trip], and the response to that is that she's ashamed because Sasuke's in darkness?

How does this disprove her having a total lack of romantic thoughts towards Naruto even when provoked?

And another thing, Naruto gets a Big Damn Heroes moment coming to the rescue of both Hinata and Sakura [though there are distinct differences between both that makes things even more interesting: his save of Sakura is his entrance to the medic tent, and was absolutely necessary as Sakura was paralyzed in shock at falling for Zetsu's kung fu treachery, meanwhile he's dashing across the battlefield shouting orders left and right heading straight for Hinata who's isolated finishing off a group of Zetsu and turning to engage the ambush before Naruto intercepts, long story short saving Sakura because he had to, and protecting Hinata because he wanted to], and as follow up he's shown having a heartfelt interaction with Hinata where they can communicate through eye contact and he references her sacrifice and acknowledges her strength, and this leads to her now having complete confidence enough to vow both herself and Naruto will survive the war and she'll be at his side, holding his hand, no longer trying to reach him but having succeeded. Sakura is once again speaking as one of a group, with no reference towards a desire for a romantic attachment to Naruto whatsoever.

If Kishi is supposed to be still dicking around with the pairing fandoms, just what is NaruSaku supposed to receive to "even the odds"?


----------



## gabzilla (Feb 10, 2012)

Arles Celes said:


> But what about SakuIno then?
> 
> I demand a threesome: SakuInoHina
> 
> ...



It would be better than any of the big three, that's for sure


----------



## Aleeight (Feb 11, 2012)

Mr Horrible said:


> Just like Sakura said she _will_ catch up to Naruto and Sasuke? Just like Jiraiya said he _will_ return safely to the village? Just like Sasuke said he _will_ destroy Konoha?
> 
> Face it, unless it's Naruto, any character making a definitive statement simply can't be trusted. Now if Naruto makes a statement like that, it's a different matter, as I said before, Naruto hasn't really failed in the end ever, things generally go pretty well for him.


Remember, Hinata adopted Naruto's nindou of "I won't go back on my words" way back during the chuunin exams. So her promising something is a significant thing for her character.


----------



## Target (Feb 11, 2012)

41 pages? Dont think ive ever seen a longer thread in a shorter time. I just dont get the craze for pairings in naruto kishi is not a romance writer and there has been very little development between boys n girls. Obviously hinata would father his chidren and she might be narutos second choice.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 11, 2012)

Aleeight said:


> Remember, Hinata adopted Naruto's nindou of "I won't go back on my words" way back during the chuunin exams. So her promising something is a significant thing for her character.



Jiraiya never went back on his words either .

Suffice it to say that sharing a nindo with Naruto doesn't propel Hinata into the prophetic realm of the main character.

Especially considering she's only really ever had one goal (Naruto) and we don't know how that'll turn out.


----------



## Kira U. Masaki (Feb 11, 2012)

Marsala said:


> Goku and Chichi had more development than this.



Not really as Goku is primarily portrayed as more asexual, Naruto has at least been shown to be interested in girls; Chichi was just like goku im gonna marry you and hes like whateves man


----------



## Marsala (Feb 11, 2012)

Welp, looks like NaruHina is a done deal. Kishimoto would have to be horrible at writing romance and women in general to turn back on it now.


----------



## First Tsurugi (Feb 11, 2012)

Marsala said:


> Welp, looks like NaruHina is a done deal. Kishimoto would have to be horrible at writing romance and women in general to turn back on it now.



Dohohohoho.


----------



## auem (Feb 11, 2012)

what if hinata dies in the war,saving sakura this time.....and then asking sakura to take care of naruto in dying breath....the melodramatic solution..


----------



## Kurama (Feb 11, 2012)

Jiraiya's connection with Naruto is "the guts to never give up/strength to get back up", the trait he praised Naruto for in his dying breath and also what Hinata stated was his true strength way back in chapter 98.


----------



## Mr Horrible (Feb 11, 2012)

kyuubi425 said:


> Jiraiya's connection with Naruto is "the guts to never give up/strength to get back up", the trait he praised Naruto for in his dying breath and also what Hinata stated was his true strength way back in chapter 98.



Not entirely sure what you call this then;


			
				Jiraiya said:
			
		

> "Never go back on your word ... and never give up. That's your ninja way ... and as your mentor ... I have no business whining! Because ... the student's ninja way should be the master's too! Isn't that so, Naruto?!"



It seems Hinata wasn't the only one that borrowed Naruto's nindou .


----------



## Louchan (Feb 11, 2012)

kyuubi425 said:


> Jiraiya's connection with Naruto is "the guts to never give up/strength to get back up", the trait he praised Naruto for in his dying breath and also what Hinata stated was his true strength way back in chapter 98.


Yes, Kyuubi.  You've told everyone at least a dozen times. Chapter 98 truly was the key that opened the door leading down the path of canon for NaruHina, wasn't it? I'm glad for your sake, you've got it all figured out.


----------



## AMtrack (Feb 11, 2012)

Kira U. Masaki said:


> Not really as Goku is primarily portrayed as more asexual, Naruto has at least been shown to be interested in girls; Chichi was just like goku im gonna marry you and hes like whateves man



Naruto has been nothing but asexual towards Hinata.  If it wasn't for Sakura, most would think Naruto was gay...jus sayin.


----------



## LivingHitokiri (Feb 11, 2012)

Tyrannos said:


> First of all it was Iruka that saved him from the Darkness, not Hinata.   And it was Team 7 that helped Naruto on his path.  Only thing Hinata did during the Chuunin Exam was to encourage Naruto in the final battle.
> 
> And again, the fight with Neji, he wasn't fighting solely for Hinata but for all the people Neji looked down on (which included Lee).   Thats what encouraged Naruto's nindo - to never give up.    To keep fighting to send that message to Neji.


I never said anything Hinata saving Naruto from any Darkness, i made my self clear with the points  about the Chuunin arc, i don't see how you can even argue about them when, all i see you hardly trying to deny the points from the manga, the outcome is clear and that Hinata played major role in narutos character development is undeniable, if still keeping neglecting that then i will say that i respect your opinion and point of view.


> Last I recall he thanked Nagato for helping him understand Pain, not Hinata.  If anything, Hinata was the catalyst.  And I bet if anyone of the other Rookies replaced Hinata, the outcome would've been the same.


Again you miss the point.
After Nagato " killed " Hinata first thing he said was, now you understand PAIN, do you hate me now ?
Naruto's response was the rage that transformed him instantly into 6 tailed beast, which is a clear answer to if he understand PAIN and if  he hates Nagato.Nagato wanted him to experience the same he did with his parents
I do not know if the same would happen with any other rookies ( probably it would) but thats far from the point. Having Hinata "dying" right after her confession was a major blow to Naruto's feelings.

All those above clearly played major role in the overall plot  and i could go as far and call them facts on their meaning.
Please refer to  mix your personal dislike for a character to ruin his/her importance in the series .


@Louchan:
May i ask why every time you cannot answer properly you refer to sarcasm, it doesn't make your point more valid or others more invalid you know ?


----------



## lain2501 (Feb 11, 2012)

Sakura will fuck Sasuke when this one turns good again. It will be open door for Hinata.


----------



## ♥Red♥ (Feb 11, 2012)

lain2501 said:


> Sakura will fuck Sasuke when this one turns good again. It will be open door for Hinata.




Sasuke would beat the shit of Sakura if she tried to fuck him.


----------



## Don-kun (Feb 11, 2012)

Bellville said:


> lol are you going to imply, with a straight face, that her feelings are at least equal to Naruto's?
> 
> after all the fucking wavering that happened in the Kage Summit arc?
> 
> ...




Not even to mention that she is proud of those feelings, she is  ashamed, sad, hurt and feel destroyed by those feelings... last time we see her thinking about them we have the same resolte, a total stranger make she have to feel bad about her feeling again, how many times we see this with her character and the strong love many claim she has for Sasuke...

Her love is weak her resolve is weak and if they met before Naruto met Sasuke what the hell will she do...

Sakura will not run back to Sasuke in a romantic way, if he doesn't give her a good reason, why he ignore her, why he treat her like trash, why he never consider any of her advice when she worries about him, especially why he try  to kill her so many times... it can happen with a friend you asking to forgive you that will be up to him to later start from zero, but it can't happen with someone that you supposed to marry later. How can marry someone you hurted so much you will live in guilt the whole time, when you look at her, when you hug, her when you kiss her. 

Sasuke doesn't have any excuse for that behavior, it just doesn't make any sense...

I know Sakura make many error but for her to go running back to him, thats a low, low on her character and pride...

When we look at all the aspect we see or wrong this pairing really is....

NH maybe one sided to no hell. 
NS a little less one sided (just a little) and also it may have a lot off faults, it really have a lot.

But they are far, far, far better than SS if you really focus and all aspect...


It's better to say that you like SS bacause you just like it, but to make up excuse for it doesn't many any sense because it doesn't have any excuse.


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## ch1p (Feb 11, 2012)

Kira U. Masaki said:


> Not really as Goku is primarily portrayed as more asexual, Naruto has at least been shown to be interested in girls; Chichi was just like goku im gonna marry you and hes like whateves man



More like, cake yay, otherwise I agree.




Marsala said:


> Welp, looks like NaruHina is a done deal. Kishimoto would have to be horrible at writing romance and women in general to turn back on it now.







AMtrack said:


> Naruto has been nothing but asexual towards Hinata.  If it wasn't for Sakura, most would think Naruto was gay...jus sayin.


This bothers me. No _sexual_ interest in anything doesn't mean gay, you know?



♥Red♥ said:


> Sasuke would beat the shit of Sakura if she tried to fuck him.



Yes, and then, he'd ram his cock up Naruto's arse as she convulses in pain, screaming 'REALISE I WAS GAY ALL ALONG, BITCH' at the top of his lungs. Brownie points if he pisses all over her frothing mouth.

What an upstanding young man Sasuke is. 



DONJOSEPH19 said:


> why he ignore her, why he treat her like trash, why he never consider any of her advice when she worries about him, especially why he try  to kill her so many times...


I'll never understand why people demonise other people's pairings so theirs look better or more legit. Not ever, with a straight face, will I ever say Naruto hates Sakura after the confession. Still, look at this: 'SASUKE IS A SAKURA HATOR!' shtick. I dunno what manga people were reading. Sasuke didn't hate Sakura and you know what? That doesn't make NS any less likely either. Isn't development what really matters, not what happened at the beginning of the manga? Then why demonise it? This insistence just makes you look more childish. *shrugs*


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## shurei (Feb 11, 2012)

I don't oppose of a  Sakura + Sasuke preference, but looking at its development, I do believe Sasuke never hesitated in killing her, not once.


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 11, 2012)

I've seen this kinda reaction happen like six or seven times since Part II started...



			
				Ch1p said:
			
		

> 'SASUKE IS A SAKURA HATOR!' shtick. I dunno what manga people were reading. Sasuke didn't hate Sakura and you know what?That doesn't make NS any less likely either. Isn't development what really matters, not what happened at the beginning of the manga? Then why demonise it? This insistence just makes you look more childish. *shrugs*



He tried killing her, attempts at which you tried to deny were genuine. Even if he doesn't hate her, he certainly doesn't care for her...don't see why you'd even want the two together. Also, it's hard to 'demonize' SasuSaku as it's already been done so in the story itself.


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## shurei (Feb 11, 2012)

Ch1p said:


> 'SASUKE IS A SAKURA HATOR!' shtick. Sasuke didn't hate Sakura and you know what? That doesn't make NS any less likely either. Isn't development what really matters, not what happened at the beginning of the manga? Then why demonise it? This insistence just makes you look more childish. *shrugs*


It was *Sasuke* at their 1st reunion that attempted to welcome her with a chidori.
It was* Sasuke * that attempted to chidori her through the skull.
It was *Sakura* that went for round two in her resolve in killing Sasuke, round two, in the same chapter, after she was specifically told to by Kakashi to stay out of it.
It was *Sasuke* that was choking her and removed the kunai from her hand to then proceed in stabbing her. 
Clearly I don't need to stoop to level of 'Sasuke is a Sakura Hator' but I can at this point of the story say WELL SHIT, HE REALLY IS NOT INTO SAKURA!


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## ~lyrica~ (Feb 11, 2012)

There's no need to demonise SS as Kishi is doing fine on his own. Though I do agree that Sasuke doesn't hate Sakura, it's more like he couldn't care less about Sakura, if she get on Sasuke's way he'll kill her simple as that just like swatting fly. Epic lol at SS and development.

On topic:
Hinata seriously need a life outside of her Naruto obsession, she's getting creepier as the series progress. I personally wouldn't say its canon unless we get something from Naruto's side, I only see it as Hinata deciding to pursue Naruto. After 500+ chapter nothing's change Hinata-->Naruto-->Sakura-->Sasuke-->Revenge.


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## ch1p (Feb 11, 2012)

Seto Kaiba said:


> I've seen this kinda reaction happen like six or seven times since Part II started...
> 
> 
> 
> He tried killing her, attempts at which you tried to deny were genuine. Even if he doesn't hate her, he certainly doesn't care for her...don't see why you'd even want the two together. Also, it's hard to 'demonize' SasuSaku as it's already been done so in the story itself.



I was mentioning part I. I thought past tense and the word 'beginning' was pretty explicit as to what I was talking about. You won't hear me defending he cares about her _now_, lol.

What I was against was demonising something that clearly existed, for the sake of a pairing, when what happened in the past has no relevance to what's happening in the present and that might or might not influence the future. NarSak should stay on its own two feet, regardless of Sasuke.

On other news, your anti-SasSak senses and the ability to hunt it at any given time / place are scary.



shurei said:


> It was *Sasuke* at their 1st reunion that attempted to welcome her with a chidori.
> It was* Sasuke * that attempted to chidori her through the skull.
> It was *Sakura* that went for round two in her resolve in killing Sasuke, round two, in the same chapter, after she was specifically told to by Kakashi to stay out of it.
> It was *Sasuke* that was choking her and removed the kunai from her hand to then proceed in stabbing her.
> Clearly I don't need to stoop to level of 'Sasuke is a Sakura Hator' but I can at this point of the story say WELL SHIT, HE REALLY IS NOT INTO SAKURA!



See above. *Part I*.



~lyrica~ said:


> There's no need to demonise SS as Kishi is doing fine on his own. Though I do agree that Sasuke doesn't hate Sakura, it's more like he couldn't care less about Sakura, if she get on Sasuke's way he'll kill her simple as that just like swatting fly. Epic lol at SS and development.



*Part I*


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 11, 2012)

Ch1p said:


> I was mentioning part I. I thought past tense and the word 'beginning' was pretty explicit as to what I was talking about. You won't hear me saying he cares about her now, lol.
> 
> On other news, your anti-SasSak senses and the ability to hunt it at any given time / place are scary.
> 
> ...



See Part II.


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## ~lyrica~ (Feb 11, 2012)

Seto Kaiba said:


> See Part II.



This.

Are we not allowed to talk about part II in regards to SS?
Well the one that your talking to mentioned about Sasuke Killing Sakura and I don't recall the killing attempt on part I and you said the beginning was not important but the development yada yada so


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 11, 2012)

So, let me get this and see if i understood it correctly.
We totally scrap the feelings and the thoughts of both parties,then,we judge their actions while totally ignoring their intentions and words,while coming to this conclusion.
Because both Naruto and Sasuke (technically ) tried to kill each other it magically transforms into they do not care for each other.
Can we please stop separating all this again with black and white  ?
Try for once to take in accord both sides and them make a conclusion.
1. Why does Sakura  still keep insisting on Sasuke even after all this  that happen between them, does Kishimoto wants Sakura romance to be a dramatic one , does he want to point something specifically about Sakura's character overall ?

2. Why Sasuke keeps insisting on this dark path of slaughter,vengeance , maybe Kishimoto doesn't want to bring romance in his thoughts right just because it will ruins his dark image that was build so far ,maybe he actually doesn't care about any romance, maybe he does but its totally irrelevant at this point of story ?

One thing is for sure to me,Sasuke's desire to kill anyone is pretty much a mirror to his dark path,which could clash against his personal feelings . For sure Sasuke wasn't always some maniac that enjoys to destroy everything for the sake of amusement , part 1 of the series proved us many times that he easily could live a peaceful life with others within different conditions.


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## ch1p (Feb 11, 2012)

Seto Kaiba said:


> See Part II.


I've seen it. Relevance to the argument = 0.



~lyrica~ said:


> This.
> 
> Are we not allowed to talk about part II in regards to SS?


Yes, you can talk about it. However, what has part II to do with what was being discussed in the first place? The other poster was ratting at Sasuke hating Sakura in _part I_, which I disagreed with (and how that was essential for NarSak, which I also disagree with, but that's another can of worms). Either disagree with the point that was being made, or let go of the deflecting bone.


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## ♥Red♥ (Feb 11, 2012)

Ch1p said:


> More like, cake yay, otherwise I agree.
> 
> Yes, and then, he'd ram his cock up Naruto's arse as she convulses in pain, screaming 'REALISE I WAS GAY ALL ALONG, BITCH' at the top of his lungs. Brownie points if he pisses all over her frothing mouth.What an upstanding young man Sasuke is.




I never said that Sasuke is interested in fucking Naruto  in fact I think he isn't ,just as he isn't interested in fucking Sakura.accept this or don't,I don't give a darn


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 11, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> So, let me get this and see if i understood it correctly.
> We totally scrap the feelings and the thoughts of both parties,then,we judge their actions while totally ignoring their intentions and words,while coming to this conclusion.



Not at all, and if that is the conclusion you came to you must have a hard time paying attention.



> Because both Naruto and Sasuke (technically ) tried to kill each other it magically transforms into they do not care for each other.
> Can we please stop separating all this again with black and white  ?



We know of the effect they have on each other because of the reactions they have towards each other, so again, you haven't been paying attention. It is taken into context their actions along with their intentions and attitudes at the moment they carried them out. We still know of the effect Naruto has on Sasuke because of the latter's reaction to his words and presence. The same can't be said for the others. 



> Try for once to take in accord both sides and them make a conclusion.
> 1. Why does Sakura  still keep insisting on Sasuke even after all this  that happen between them, does Kishimoto wants Sakura romance to be a dramatic one , does he want to point something specifically about Sakura's character overall ?



Apparently that she's unlikeable and detestable to his own words. She already has displayed an astounding lack of self-respect, which is in part why no one respects her. 



> 2. Why Sasuke keeps insisting on this dark path of slaughter,vengeance , maybe Kishimoto doesn't want to bring romance in his thoughts right just because it will ruins his dark image that was build so far ,maybe he actually doesn't care about any romance, maybe he does but its totally irrelevant at this point of story ?



Sasuke believes he's right, that's why, and needs to affirm that completely with killing Naruto. He felt good killing Danzo, even at the potential cost of Karin's life, I think it can be stated he doesn't care about anything else. He never showed any interest in that particular aspect at all to begin with.



> One thing is for sure to me,Sasuke's desire to kill anyone is pretty much a mirror to his dark path,which could clash against his personal feelings . For sure Sasuke wasn't always some maniac that enjoys to destroy everything for the sake of amusement , part 1 of the series proved us many times that he easily could live a peaceful life with others within different conditions.



Wrong. His dark path is a result of his personal feelings, and the actions he  taken since then are driven by them. He wishes to kill those he felt are responsible for the deaths of his brother and the clan in general, and that is Konoha and maybe even the entirety of the ninja system. Sakura and Karin would have merely been casualties in his rampage, Naruto on the other hand like Kakashi, was a goal to kill.

Sasuke wasn't always like this, but he is now. Pretty pointless to mention that. 



Ch1p said:


> I've seen it. Relevance to the argument = 0.



Completely relevant.


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## Don-kun (Feb 11, 2012)

Ch1p

I like Narusaku a little and like NaruHina a lot more when I start watching the Anime...
after Zabuza fight I have zero problem with SS I was neutral to liking it, but after Gaara's fight and the Promise of a Lifetime, I start liking NaruSaku more and NaruHina less mostly because of Naruto been so selfless....

When I stop been neutral with SS, was at the Apple scene there is where I start looking at SS the wrong way and start hating Sasuke for trying to kill Naruto, but after the battle of the end my feelings towards Sasuke was gone.

When Part II started, there was no going back, Sasuke become an annoyance for my liking, but I only start hating that pairing after reading some SS and sideshipping comments back in april of 2011, ignoring what the Manga as shown us and killing NS at the same time....

Plus Sakura's love for Sasuke is something I find very insulting to all female gender, girls don't behave like that and worse for someone that try to kill them. Kishi say that Sakura is a realistic girl I find that very ofensive and I'm a man....


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## gershwin (Feb 11, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19, the problem is that from your own negative perception of Sakura`s development you are trying to decrease and deform her canonicaly manifested feelings 
Sakura tried to get rid of him - and failed. Because common sence was supressed by the strength of lingering  affection to the Sasuke she fell in love with. So here comes the simple conclusion - the love is stronger than duty.
So why are u calling it weak?

Naruto is attached to THAT Sasuke too. Sasuke, who used to put the morality higher than hatred, who was influencing him and whom he wanted to be acknowledged by. THAT Sasuke he wants to save from hatred. 
Sasuke is a completely different person now, not himself. Of course Sakura would be sad. Naruto was saddened as well at some point  -  and? Was he ashamed?
 Yes, it hurts, but its there. The big strong tree is the big strong tree - whether the leaves are green or dry. When the spring comes after the winter - it is capable of blooming agan, cause its still alive.


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 11, 2012)

Sasuke *is* himself, it's just that he changed.



> DONJOSEPH19, the problem is that from your own negative perception of Sakura`s development you are trying to decrease and deform her canonicaly manifested feelings
> Sakura tried to get rid of him - and failed. Because common sence was supressed by the strength of lingering affection to the Sasuke she fell in love with. So here comes the simple conclusion - the love is stronger than duty.
> So why are u calling it weak?



She fell in love with an ideal of Sasuke that wasn't quite like the real Sasuke; She's a slave to her emotions, and her whims and decisions are affected negatively due to that.



> The big strong tree is the big strong tree - whether the leaves are green or dry. When the spring comes after the winter - it is capable of blooming agan, cause its still alive



Not if it has blight.


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## Don-kun (Feb 11, 2012)

*Sorry Chip. *I never say Sasuke hate Sakura in Part I. I'm not crazy or blind, I say he never listen to her advice and hurt her feeling and disrespect her many time... Sasuke start hating Sakura and everyone since the Summit....



gershvin said:


> DONJOSEPH19, the problem is that from your own negative perception of Sakura`s development you are trying to decrease and deform her canonicaly manifested feelings
> Sakura tried to get rid of him - and failed. Because common sence was supressed by the strength of lingering  affection to the Sasuke she fell in love with. So here comes the simple conclusion - the love is stronger than duty.
> So why are u calling it weak?
> 
> ...




Hey I want to see a Happy team 7 I want to see them in a future as the sannin of konoha...

What I don't agree with is the love part is st*pid for a girl to still have feeling for a goy that never care about her love, if Naruto did those things to Sakura I will hate NaruSaku too....

You really thing that I care if Sasuke live or die... No i don't give a Sh*t I don't have a soft heart for someone that betray is friend after hearing a speech like Obito's speech....
But Kishi wants that plus I will hate the idea of seen a EMO Naruto....

Do I feel Sasuke chould care about her like a friend and earn her trust? Yes, do I feel Sakura chould still love him? No thats stu*id...

And Finaly Naruto is trying to save his friend they have a bond, Naruto is the only one that can change Sasuke it was already stated and he doesn't want to make Sasuke his future man...... Sakura has no efect on him he never return her feeling and break her heart many times, but she still want to make hin her future man thats pathetic.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 11, 2012)

Seto Kaiba said:


> Not at all, and if that is the conclusion you came to you must have a hard time paying attention.


The conclusion was example to point out how the discussion generally goes in this thread,with both parties ignoring many manga references,meanings,characters as a whole. It wasn't personal pointed at you just to make it clear.



> We know of the effect they have on each other because of the reactions they have towards each other, so again, you haven't been paying attention. It is taken into context their *actions along with their intentions and attitudes* at the moment they carried them out. We still know of the effect Naruto has on Sasuke because of the latter's reaction to his words and presence.


I totally agree with you ,especially with the bold parts,i was paying attention hence i was asking why the same bold parts that i quote is getting ignored almost all the time in pairing discussion  or it ends up with people twisting these bold parts to their liking.



> The same can't be said for the others.


May i ask why this cannot be said especially for Sakura in part II considering her actions,intentions and attitude towards Sasuke ?





> Apparently that she's unlikeable and detestable to his own words. She already has displayed an astounding lack of self-respect, which is in part why no one respects her.


At this point Sasuke doesn't seem to respect anything besides his vengeance and Naruto as his rival . i don't think his attitude towards her is on personal level,Sakura knows that hence there can be the possibility of her justifying his attitude towards her.





> Sasuke believes he's right, that's why, and needs to affirm that completely with killing Naruto. He felt good killing Danzo, even at the potential cost of Karin's life, I think it can be stated he doesn't care about anything else. He never showed any interest in that particular aspect at all to begin with.


There is no right or wrong in vengeance,its a monotonous path that all what matters its to achieve  it.
If he could  distinguish  the right and wrong he wouldn't have go after orochimaru, he wouldn't have join Tobi and try to destroy whole village of irrelevant people . He blindly see Konoha as whole reason that must be destroying without distinguish  the difference. 



> Wrong. His dark path is a result of his personal feelings, and the actions he  taken since then are driven by them. He wishes to kill those he felt are responsible for the deaths of his brother and the clan in general, and that is Konoha and maybe even the entirety of the ninja system. Sakura and Karin would have merely been casualties in his rampage, Naruto on the other hand like Kakashi, was a goal to kill.


How this is wrong,Sasuke did seek vengeance way before he started to hate Konoha and its peoples. 
He did clash with his personal feelings when he left for Orochimaru, and even more when he fought Naruto.
The way his dark self developed during manga, the truth he learned ,the decisions he made and how he turned into his current state are mirroring his path of vengeance.
Sasuke never had personal problems with them as individuals, he have problem with Konoha as a symbol, that obliterated his clan.


> Sasuke wasn't always like this, but he is now. Pretty pointless to mention that.


Considering how the manga strives towards Sasuke's redemption and a good ending  how exactly is this pointless to mention when it got the probability of it to happen is not unreal, taken into consideration Kishimoto and what he want to point in this manga with Team 7 relationship taken into accord.


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## Naruko (Feb 11, 2012)

Stop the personal commentary (i.e. you're biased because, of course you like/dislike xyz. etc). Take the personal grudges out of here. Some of you are getting too heated. Either you find the recent manga happenings to give or not give evidence to NH (or some other pairing) or you don't. Explain which and why and then drop it. You aren't going to change someones mind by trying to further attack their p,o.v. ok? Life's too short to keep going back and forth over this.


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## Don-kun (Feb 11, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> How this is wrong,Sasuke did seek vengeance way before he started to hate Konoha and its peoples.
> He did clash with his personal feelings when he left for Orochimaru, and even more when he fought Naruto.
> The way his dark self developed during manga, the truth he learned ,the decisions he made and how he turned into his current state are mirroring his path of vengeance.
> Sasuke never had personal problems with them as individuals, he have problem with Konoha as a symbol, that obliterated his clan.
> Considering how the manga strives towards Sasuke's redemption and a good ending  how exactly is this pointless to mention when it got the probability of it to happen is not unreal, taken into consideration Kishimoto and what he want to point in this manga with Team 7 relationship taken into accord.



I agree with the team 7 end is not that bad I hate the idae that Kishi thinks a slap in Sasuke waist is ok but what can I do, the romance between SS is what i see wrong....

You can hate a country but you will never hate the person you form a bond with, the first time they see each other, a very fine Sasuke was planing to kill Naruto, then he got so annoy with there attitude that he was planing to use the same technique he use agains Itashi if Oro did not stop him....

That's is sometime that's ignore, is better to say thanks to Naruto and Kakashi we can still argue about NS and SS, if not for them Sakura will be dead already.....

So how the hell can I still look at SS with good eye.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 11, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> I agree with the team 7 end is not that bad I hate the idae that Kishi thinks a slap in Sasuke waist is *ok but what can I do, the romance between SS is what i see wrong....
> *
> You can hate a country but you will never hate the person you form a bond with, the first time they see each other, a very fine Sasuke was planing to kill Naruto, then he got so annoy with there attitude that he was planing to use the same technique he use agains Itashi if Oro did not stop him....
> 
> ...


 I totally respect your opinion about a pairing ,my problem is on how people try  to enforce their opinion with ridiculous points ESPECIALLY  when they talk about a pairing  they do not like.
I think Sasuke got a lot mixed up feelings which will be made more clear in the future.


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 11, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> The conclusion was example to point out how the discussion generally goes in this thread,with both parties ignoring many manga references,meanings,characters as a whole. It wasn't personal pointed at you just to make it clear.



OK.



> I totally agree with you ,especially with the bold parts,i was paying attention hence i was asking why the same bold parts that i quote is getting ignored almost all the time in pairing discussion  or it ends up with people twisting these bold parts to their liking.
> 
> May i ask why this cannot be said especially for Sakura in part II considering her actions,intentions and attitude towards Sasuke ?



Sasuke exhibited no response to her. It's all in Naruto's hands, and pretty much has always been. 

I'm saying the same can't be said for Sasuke's actions towards Sakura, as they were murderous yet very coldly impersonal. He was not trying to kill her as an individual, or for any special reason, he did it because he felt like it. 



> At this point Sasuke doesn't seem to respect anything besides his vengeance and Naruto as his rival . i don't think his attitude towards her is on personal level,Sakura knows that hence there can be the possibility of her justifying his attitude towards her.



Everything he has done is due to his own personal issues. His murderous nature is due to allowing his darker emotions to bring him to that point. 

If Sakura tried that reasoning she really would be the most pathetic heroine in WSJ. You are right in that it did not come off as being done on a personal level, and that is probably far worse. He was simply going to make her a casualty, he had a complete disregard for her, just as he did Karin.



> There is no right or wrong in vengeance,its a monotonous path that all what matters its to achieve  it.
> If he could  distinguish  the right and wrong he wouldn't have go after orochimaru, he wouldn't have join Tobi and try to destroy whole village of irrelevant people . He blindly see Konoha as whole reason that must be destroying without distinguish  the difference.



There is a right and wrong in matters of vengeance, that's the whole point with Sasuke to begin with. What Sasuke has been doing has been all kinds of wrong. He knows the difference between right and wrong very clearly, he knew the evils Orochimaru had done and still sought him out, and was aware of the nature and consequences of the actions he had carried out on his journey. The thing is, he doesn't care, he is aware of his sense of reason, but only cares about satiating his hatred and desire for vengeance, and that is what makes him evil. 



> How this is wrong,Sasuke did seek vengeance way before he started to hate Konoha and its peoples.



They, even then, were driven by dark feelings that eventually began to consume his entire mindset. Even before his turn, he was told to abandon revenge or else what is happening to him now would occur, plus the likelihood of him living emptily and dying the same way. 



> He did clash with his personal feelings when he left for Orochimaru, and even more when he fought Naruto.
> The way his dark self developed during manga, the truth he learned ,the decisions he made and how he turned into his current state are mirroring his path of vengeance.
> Sasuke never had personal problems with them as individuals, he have problem with Konoha as a symbol, that obliterated his clan.



He clashed with conflicting emotions against Naruto as will likely do so in the future. The desire for revenge is driven by his intense personal feelings on the matter, and not exclusively a sense of duty, if that at all anymore. The feelings for wanting revenge were stronger than his desire to stay with his friends. 

Sasuke does have a personal issue with Naruto, as he not only can forcefully stray him from his path, he can through words if he listens as well. It isn't just that Naruto is now the symbol of Konoha's, and by extension, the Senju's idealism. It's Naruto as the person that he feels he relates to most, and felt closest to that threatens Sasuke. 



> Considering how the manga strives towards Sasuke's redemption and a good ending  how exactly is this pointless to mention when it got the probability of it to happen is not unreal, taken into consideration Kishimoto and what he want to point in this manga with Team 7 relationship taken into accord.



He'll be redeemed, but he has done many things and many things have changed since Part I, his attitudes included as well as others' attitudes towards him.


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## Don-kun (Feb 11, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> I totally respect your opinion about a pairing ,my problem is on how people try  to enforce their opinion with ridiculous points ESPECIALLY  when they talk about a pairing  they do not like.
> I think Sasuke got a lot mixed up feelings which will be made more clear in the future.



I don't have a problem with Sakura been paired with any character that is not Naruto or single, My desire for NaruSaku is because sometimes I feel sorry for Naruto and his big heart and how much it hurt him after doing so many things he has done for her....

May problem is with SS and the excuses for that pairing. I feel no men should ever treat a woman the way he treat her for unintentionally loving him.... You don't like her tell her nicely it doesn't hurt to be nice... And Sakura I wish she could learn to choose the men she love better again it doesn't have to be Naruto but not Sasuke thats all.


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## LivingHitokiri (Feb 11, 2012)

Seto Kaiba said:


> Sasuke exhibited no response to her. It's all in Naruto's hands, and pretty much has always been.


True,but, lets also agree that doesn't turn Sasuke into hates her as well.



> I'm saying the same can't be said for Sasuke's actions towards Sakura, as they were murderous yet very coldly impersonal. He was not trying to kill her as an individual, or for any special reason, he did it because he felt like it.


Here allow me to disagree.Sakura is an important member of team 7 ,also, he probably knows that Sakura is in love with him.
As we know, Sasuke wanted to break his bonds with team 7 because he thinks it as a burden towards his path.Sakura is a part of these bonds and by knowing that she drives special feelings for him ( or used to ) he wanted to rip em apart like he tried with Naruto.
I doubt Sasuke just went for Sakura because he felt like it. 



> Everything he has done is due to his own personal issues. His murderous  nature is due to allowing his darker emotions to bring him to that  point.


One of his personal issue is also the bonds he have/had with team 7 and Sakura obviously is a part of those.
Sasuke hasn't showed us that he enjoys going randomly  slaughtering people, he tries to kill those that played part to what he become today.
There is a difference between a Murderer and  an Avenger, they may draw from same source but their motivation is totally different. 
Sasuke had plenty of time and room to kill both Sakura and Naruto,yet he didn't because he isn't a murderer, he probably still value them.




> If Sakura tried that reasoning she really would be the most pathetic heroine in WSJ. You are right in that it did not come off as being done on a personal level, and that is probably far worse. He was simply going to make her a casualty, he had a complete disregard for her, just as he did Karin.


In my opinion Sakura is on different level than Karin, i think Sakura has more importance to him while Karin was nothing more than a tool he used,while Sakura was there along with Naruto and Kakashi long before.
There is a reason why Sasuke didn't brought Sakura along when she asked,one of the reason was probably he didn't to get in the same situation that he got with Karin, because he knew that he probably wouldn't stop no matter so he tried cut ties and avoid to bring team 7 into his meddling.




> There is a right and wrong in matters of vengeance, that's the whole point with Sasuke to begin with. What Sasuke has been doing has been all kinds of wrong. He knows the difference between right and wrong very clearly, he knew the evils Orochimaru had done and still sought him out, and was aware of the nature and consequences of the actions he had carried out on his journey. The thing is, he doesn't care, he is aware of his sense of reason, but only cares about satiating his hatred and desire for vengeance, and that is what makes him evil.


The point is , he justifies everything as right because he got blinded by vengeance.
At his current state Sasuke could probably believe anything if it somehow makes sense and crosses path to Uchiha.




> They, even then, were driven by dark feelings that eventually began to consume his entire mindset. Even before his turn, he was told to abandon revenge or else what is happening to him now would occur, plus the likelihood of him living emptily and dying the same way.


Sasuke is used in this series as total opposite force than Naruto.
His path that he choose was most likely the inevitable one.Sasuke is driven by vengeance while Naruto by acknowledgement of many.




> He clashed with conflicting emotions against Naruto as will likely do so in the future. The desire for revenge is driven by his intense personal feelings on the matter, and not exclusively a sense of duty, if that at all anymore. The feelings for wanting revenge were stronger than his desire to stay with his friends.


Same as he clashed with Sakura,did  and probably will do it again in the future.
I don't think he was driven by sense of justice to begin with, i think its was more like that, he didn't wanted to mix his vengeance with his friends.
Think of the scenario  if Sasuke killed Itachi and never learned the truth from Tobi, you think he would refuse return after he achieved that ?
In my opinion i doubt he would but the problem comes when he finally killed Itachi , Tobi showed up to screw up this possibility , just because needed to use Sasuke against Konoha.So here comes the exploitation of Sasukes feelings by Madara rather Sasuke's choice.




> Sasuke does have a personal issue with Naruto, as he not only can forcefully stray him from his path, he can through words if he listens as well. It isn't just that Naruto is now the symbol of Konoha's, and by extension, the Senju's idealism. It's Naruto as the person that he feels he relates to most, and felt closest to that threatens Sasuke.


Bingo, recall how he reacted to Naruto's words last time they met ?
He got surprised by what he said because probably he never expected or didn't wanted  their relationship to reach at this point.




> He'll be redeemed, but he has done many things and many things have changed since Part I, his attitudes included as well as others' attitudes towards him.


He will be probably be despised by many for years but it still doesn't change the fact that Sasuke will remain himself with different kind of emotions flowing through him at the time. it wont be the one of hatred anymore but more likely something that will make him realize what he did was wrong.
But thats my point of view on this matter.





DONJOSEPH19 said:


> I don't have a problem with Sakura been  paired with any character that is not Naruto or single, My desire for  NaruSaku is because sometimes I feel sorry for Naruto and his big heart  and how much it hurt him after doing so many things he has done for  her....
> 
> May problem is with SS and the excuses for that pairing. *I feel no men  should ever treat a woman the way he treat her for unintentionally  loving him*.... You don't like her tell her nicely it doesn't hurt to be  nice... And Sakura I wish she could learn to choose the men she love  better again it doesn't have to be Naruto but not Sasuke thats  all.


I would totally agree with you if this wasn't a part of story .
Our view from Kishimoto are different,especially when it comes to romance ,but, what can do if for example he likes to dramatize it ?
Sometimes is hard for us to take in accord that all words,character options/sayings in this series are coming from 1 man so our logic easily could clash with his hence bringing up this confusion ,discussion and debate.


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## Don-kun (Feb 11, 2012)

Hey, Hey, Hey I'm not a girl....


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## Fay (Feb 11, 2012)

Jeαnne said:


> *the problem is that narusaku is closer to a crack pairing than even sasunaru, yet narusaku fans try to rivalize with naruhina that is a way more solid possibility at this point .*
> 
> im not pro naruhina or anything, i am fan of the two yaoi crack pairings that have the most cannon evidence(sasunaru and itasasu )...but personally, from a point of view of someone who doesnt give a flying fuck about who naruto will have his babies with (since he cant with sasuke ), i think that naruhina makes so much more sense than narusaku storywise that its not even funny.


Agreed . My way of saying my statement is by explaining I view the pairing as dead (NaruSaku) and the other two you mentioned as still alive/not killed of yet (SasuNaru and NaruHina).




Jeαnne said:


> sasuke is a white canvas when it comes to het love, he could be gay for all i care, kishi can pull sasuke falling in love for any girl for the sole fact that he loves no one at all.
> 
> btw if you guys dont want hinata, would be cool if sasuke got her, she is so much better than sakura its not even funny .



Actually It would be funny if Sasuke married Hanabi and Naruto married Hinata, then they would officially be brothers .


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## Kakugo (Feb 11, 2012)

Naruto's love for Sakura is canon, so it's a pretty moot point to try to despute it when he himself confirmed it. Also considering the consistent development NS has received throughout the course of the manga, I fail to see how this makes it crack. 



AMtrack said:


> o.O Naruto loves Sakura..I dont see how that makes it crack.
> 
> 
> So far the only evidence I see that NH isn't crack is cuz Hinata is determined to get him.  But Hinata isnt the main character, so i fail to see how that matters.  Sakura was determined to be with Sasuke and look where that got her.
> ...





son_michael said:


> Naru Saku fans exist because we actually appreciate a budding romance that's been developed since the earliest chapters, we exist because we want Naruto to get what he wants and he wants Sakura. We exist because of the many many hints of attraction Sakura has for Naruto, of her evolution in how she first handled and felt about him to how she is with him now. We see the seeds have been sown and now we wait for the romance to blossom, we have far more evidence than any pairing starting from the earliest chapters to the current ones.
> 
> Sakura's love for Sasuke is the problem, but we believe she will realize her true love for Naruto before the manga ends.
> 
> ...


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 11, 2012)

Using the fact that Sakura is a main character as a argument for pairing discussion is just stupidity. 

Who matters most among the three?

Naruto, then Sasuke and then Sakura.


So if i use the argument "Well Sasuke is more of a main character than Sakura, so he will end up with Naruto" - it would be stupidity.


Go back to Zabuza vs Sakura Sasuke & Naruto:
Sakura just stood there being pretty holding a kunai while the great tag team Sasuke and Naruto beat Zabuza with their strategy.


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 11, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> I agree with the team 7 end is not that bad I hate the idae that Kishi thinks a slap in Sasuke waist is ok but what can I do, the romance between SS is what i see wrong....
> 
> You can hate a country but you will never hate the person you form a bond with, the first time they see each other, a very fine Sasuke was planing to kill Naruto, then he got so annoy with there attitude that he was planing to use the same technique he use agains Itashi if Oro did not stop him....
> 
> ...


SS pairing is not dead.

Sasuke fights everyone (Kakashi, Yamato , Naruto , Sakura). It doesn't matter to him who he's fighting at the moment.


So i don't think he really wanted to kill Sakura. He told Kakashi and Naruto he would love to kill them too.


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## Seto Kaiba (Feb 11, 2012)

LivingHitokiri said:


> True,but, lets also agree that doesn't turn Sasuke into hates her as well.



He hates her as a Konoha ninja, as an individual she is nothing special.

Here allow me to disagree.Sakura is an important member of team 7 ,also, he probably knows that Sakura is in love with him.
As we know, Sasuke wanted to break his bonds with team 7 because he thinks it as a burden towards his path.Sakura is a part of these bonds and by knowing that she drives special feelings for him ( or used to ) he wanted to rip em apart like he tried with Naruto.
I doubt Sasuke just went for Sakura because he felt like it. 



> One of his personal issue is also the bonds he have/had with team 7 and Sakura obviously is a part of those.
> Sasuke hasn't showed us that he enjoys going randomly  slaughtering people, he tries to kill those that played part to what he become today.



Wrong. He killed the samurai based on his own whims, and sacrificed Karin to satiate his revenge. He's long past breaking his old bonds, save for the one he has with Naruto. That is why Naruto can only reach him, because they still have that connection.



> There is a difference between a Murderer and  an Avenger, they may draw from same source but their motivation is totally different.
> 
> Sasuke had plenty of time and room to kill both Sakura and Naruto,yet he didn't because he isn't a murderer, he probably still value them.



This is denial. When he has met them he has tried to kill them, especially if they insisted on getting in his way. Again, he is far past that point anyways except in the case of Naruto. It's simple murder on a whim now. 



> In my opinion Sakura is on different level than Karin, i think Sakura has more importance to him while Karin was nothing more than a tool he used,while Sakura was there along with Naruto and Kakashi long before.



Your opinion is on faulty reasoning then. He came to value Taka just as he did Team 7, and cared for its members just the same. It is his voluntary turn to evil that he began to abandon that, and that again, the issue of his desire to break bonds became moot since he'd achieved that already with everyone but Naruto.



> There is a reason why Sasuke didn't brought Sakura along when she asked,one of the reason was probably he didn't to get in the same situation that he got with Karin, because he knew that he probably wouldn't stop no matter so he tried cut ties and avoid to bring team 7 into his meddling.



There was a three-year gap between that and the time he formed Taka. He brought Karin along initially for her ability to heal and sense chakra. Since it'd be a journey to find Itachi, he knew that he'd need people with suitable abilities and formed the team. I don't know where you guys get this "THEY WERE JUST TOOLS" bullshit when he showed even then he was still capable of caring for them just as he did his old teammates. It's the unfortunate circumstance that Karin was around during his transformation into an evil person that was the difference. 

Sakura had nothing that she could offer to assist him in his revenge, and Naruto's purpose was to be his death which would trigger MS. Now, it's only that Naruto's death will serve to embolden Sasuke's cause for vengeance and genocide.



> The point is , he justifies everything as right because he got blinded by vengeance.
> At his current state Sasuke could probably believe anything if it somehow makes sense and crosses path to Uchiha.



That's incorrect too. He has already acknowledge the nature and consequences of his actions, once again, he just doesn't care. This is what makes him an evil person.



> Sasuke is used in this series as total opposite force than Naruto.
> His path that he choose was most likely the inevitable one.Sasuke is driven by vengeance while Naruto by acknowledgement of many.



True enough.



> Same as he clashed with Sakura,did  and probably will do it again in the future.



He clashed with being with his team, and Naruto as his individual friend. 



> I don't think he was driven by sense of justice to begin with, i think its was more like that, he didn't wanted to mix his vengeance with his friends.
> Think of the scenario  if Sasuke killed Itachi and never learned the truth from Tobi, you think he would refuse return after he achieved that ?



Yes, because he made it clear he had no plans to return and even die with Itachi if it came to it. 



> In my opinion i doubt he would but the problem comes when he finally killed Itachi , Tobi showed up to screw up this possibility , just because needed to use Sasuke against Konoha.So here comes the exploitation of Sasukes feelings by Madara rather Sasuke's choice.



He wasn't going to return. He may no longer have been evil, but coming back to the village a hero just wasn't going to happen. Itachi did not anticipate that Sasuke would go to Orochimaru, which put a dent in his plans for him.



> Bingo, recall how he reacted to Naruto's words last time they met ?
> He got surprised by what he said because probably he never expected or didn't wanted  their relationship to reach at this point.



It happened, and it is still the one bond that he can't let go of.



> He will be probably be despised by many for years but it still doesn't change the fact that Sasuke will remain himself with different kind of emotions flowing through him at the time. it wont be the one of hatred anymore but more likely something that will make him realize what he did was wrong.
> But thats my point of view on this matter.



But he knows what he is doing is wrong. The matter is getting him to care about that matter, and get him to stop.



WhiteWolf said:


> SS pairing is not dead.
> 
> Sasuke fights everyone (Kakashi, Yamato , Naruto , Sakura). It doesn't matter to him who he's fighting at the moment.
> 
> ...



He was going to kill them. Period. God, that level of denial is ridiculous. Sakura wouldn't have a head if it weren't for Kakashi, nor a trachea if it weren't for Naruto.


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## ch1p (Feb 11, 2012)

DONJOSEPH19 said:


> I don't have a problem with Sakura been paired with any character that is not Naruto or single, My desire for NaruSaku is because sometimes I feel sorry for Naruto and his big heart and how much it hurt him after doing so many things he has done for her....



That's not a reasonable reason for two characters to be paired together. He did things for her? So what of it? He did the things he did because he likes and cherishes her, not because she's a prize to be won due to selfish persistance and hard work. She's not am object. I hope for your sake that you don't apply this logic to real life. _Ugh_.


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## alchemy1234 (Feb 11, 2012)

well kishimoto couldn't have made it any more obvious.


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## Don-kun (Feb 12, 2012)

Ch1p said:


> That's not a reasonable reason for two characters to be paired together. He did things for her? So what of it? He did the things he did because he likes and cherishes her, not because she's a prize to be won due to selfish persistance and hard work. She's not am object. I hope for your sake that you don't apply this logic to real life. _Ugh_.


*This is not NaruSaku FC. but since you ask.*


*Reason why I support Naruto:*
Naruto is the one guy who has been denied just about anything that he's ever wanted. It would just be... Nice.. For him to finally get one thing he's had his heart set on since the start almost everything has been achieved only 3 wishes are still missing....
1- Saving his best friend 
2- Becoming Hokage
3- If Sakura could truly love him one day.
Plus the fact that when Sakura is hurt he is deeply hurt too, I don't see that in the OTP....


*Reason for the pairing:*
When I sat back and thought about everything, I realised that Naruto and Sakura had this spark, this chemistry, between them. While Sakura did publicly chase Sasuke, it was clear he never thought of her as a romantic interest and she was trying to be someone she wasn't.

Why I'm supporting NaruSaku? Its a good developing relationship between two people who will do ANYTHING for one another. 

Its a relationship that's been steadily working its way to the forefront since start of the series! It's like watching a real relationship in all honesty. Sakura doesn't immediately like Naruto, she has to grow into it- Like MOST people do. 

She goes from Saying she hates Naruto, to admiring him- To be willing to Sacrifice her chances in the Chuunin Exams, to further his. She goes from Admiring him and using him as a support pillar to wanting to become a source of support, shelter, and protection for HIM.

A real relationship is about Give and take, sacrifice and compromise. I see that in Naruto and Sakura and it brings them to life. They don't always get along, they don't always agree with the others methods ( Post Confession...) But they ALWAYS have the others back. 

Thats love. Having a row one minute, and being over it in the next. 


She was willing to kill the person she supposedly loved for HIS Sake, and if that's not love I don't know what is. 

You can deeply care for two people, but at the end of the day you will always choose one over the other and I think Sakura has made it perfectly clear who she's gonna choose if it gets down to the wire- No question. 

I  also love how Naruto and Sakura are shown to have deepening feelings for each other, based on solid reasons.  They have so much in common, and compliment each other nicely. Sakura is also the only girl who will pull Naruto back when he gets out of line! Naruto's courage and determination also inspires Sakura. It just feels so natural between them.

It's definitely certain that, without Naruto, Sakura would not have become a medic-nin. She wouldn't have started to realise her potential. Hell, she was ready to just give up until Naruto told her he wouldn't drop his promise.

I have no idea how long it will be until Naruto and Sakura get together - if they do get together, touch wood! But I like the gradual growth of their relationship.  I will never forget that day Chapter 245 was published. XD It's far better than the rushed romance you regularly see in films, other manga, and books.

It's so powerful when a friendship deepens into love. I honestly think that is the best form of love (in my opinion), and I don't think the "princess is swept off her feet by a knight in shining armour" romance holds any water for me.

I think the best part about these two, is that they could not only be lovers- but best friends and that's the ideal type of romantic relationship. Not only where your lovers but friends too.


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## WhiteWolf (Feb 12, 2012)

Seto Kaiba said:


> He was going to kill them. Period. God, that level of denial is ridiculous. Sakura wouldn't have a head if it weren't for Kakashi, nor a trachea if it weren't for Naruto.


Denial? The only one denying anything is probably you.
Because Sasuke would have killed Kakashi, Naruto, Sakura and whoever else got on his nerves.

That's the whole point of him being in the darkness. He told Gaara "I closed my eyes long time ago".


And my point with bringing this up is that SasukexSakura pairing is not over because Sasuke would have killed anyone. So him trying to kill Sakura isn't something personal.


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