# Aha! Proof Uchiha Kagami is Tobidara



## Jericko (Oct 23, 2011)

Take a look at these two pictures. 

Uchiha Kagami here...



Tobi with hair here... (best 3/4ths angle of his hair I could get)



Now let's take the image of Kagami and flip it horizontally so Tobi/Kagami are proportioned correctly. 



  Okay, now that we have both images positioned appropriately, you'll notice that *the angle of their hair lock curls up at almost EXACTLY the same angle* (but yes, tobi's is shorter). We can't be sure 100% because his hair is drawn slightly different in each rendering, however from this it's almost the same hair cut. And nothing has been confirmed.  

  But oh you say, _"MANY characters in the series have spiked hair have similar features depending on the art"_. Yes, but in this picture, his hair couldn't be closer to anyone else's and I'll show you why. 

  Let's do some basic math. Count hair locks with me here... 

  Let's start from Kagami's cow lick moving downward (down and left). 

  Circles point out each lock.



  Kay, now let's do it for Tobidara... (image has been stretched out to match sizes for count). 


*Spoiler*: __ 









  Well holy cow, would you look at that? they have the Same number of strands going from their cow licks outward! And then going forward, other than an extra lick in Kagami's hair, it's 4 going straight outward and lick 5 pointing progressively downward. Go ahead and take a look for yourself, they're almost identical. 

Other could be's

Yamato: 



  Has been speculated, but his hair does not curl upward, and does not have as many locks counting from his sprout. There have been pictures where the number of locks from one side differs, but again, it does not angle upward.

Danzou



  More similar style, but much flatter, and also does not angle up. This is funny, because it was almost confirmed at one point. 

  You can agree or disagree, but Ukagami's hair is the closest in design to Tobidara's we've seen. 

Madara:

And we now know it's not Madara because he's Edo. 

*Other Evidence*

_His Plans: *spoilers for chapter 560*_ 

  When Madara was told of third party besides Nagato, he knew EXACTLY who it was. "His"... Also, we don't know a whole lot about Kagami except that he was part of Team Tobirama (more on that in a minute). 

  Now, considering Tobirama's distrust of the Uchiha, why would he allow an Uchiha to be apart of his personal team? He must have been of someone with great importance, and considered iconic enough to be held within the council of Hiruzen inc. 

  Also, it is speculated that Fugaku could have been the one of whom attacked Minato during Kushina's pregnancy, because she told Sauske's mother about her giving birth. This is unlikely because Fugaku would have been pre-occupied with the coup against konoha and also, has COMPLETELY FLAT HAIR. 

  The person who attacked Minato must have had a PERSONAL interest in reviving the NineTails in order to seek revenge against Konoha for what had been done to the Uchiha Madara. Yet, the reason Fugaku doesn't compute is because his lineage would have been of those that _booted out_ Madara. Also, Fugaku was the head of the current Madaraless Uchiha clan which had been approved by Sarutobi's council. Yes, Fugaku was planning a coup, but that was merely because of the oppression felt from the opposing Senju side, Fugaku had NO INTEREST IN DECIMATING THE ENTIRE CLAN!!! He was IN CHARGE OF IT. There would have been NO MOTIVE.

  Thus, it had to have been someone who more specifically honored the memory of Uchiha Madara *alone*, and hated the Senju/Leaf equally. The hell you say!? This same person, wiped out the entire Uchiha clan with Itachi, so shut up. His plans involve ALL Ninja.   

  It has to be someone with a personal connection to Madara, someone close enough to him and considered important enough to be tied to Danzou, Hiruzen, and etc... and we know little or next to NOTHING about Kagami. 

And before I get to my point, it's very important to not that Kagami is heavily associated with Mirror's which basically culminates the entirety of their Kekki Genaki eye properties. Thus, whoever named him "Kagami" must have wanted him to be remembered as the most powerful Uchiha to have ever lived (much like Minato wanted Naturo to be remembered as a hero).

Who would be arrogant enough to consider their son _that_ great? And why would that person be so intent on embedding the memory of Uchiha Madara into the minds of the Ninja World? 

The *SON* of Uchiha Madara, that's who. An I propose that Kagami is just that, the direct blood lineage child to Uchiha Madara. One who was personally taken in by the Senju clan, raised to be unlike his father, and kept within the circle of importance because of his linage but whilst keeping hum under the closest watch possible. Thus Tobirama must have been so concerned with Kagami to the point of needing to keep him watched at all times, whilst making the best use of him.

 But of course, Kagami must have discovered, or secretly knew, what had happened to his father at VOTE and was collaborating with Madara all along as a spy before his death. Hence, working with him in hopes of eventually attacking the leaf and destroying BOTH the Senju and Uchiha for dad's humiliation. 

And this makes sense too, because most of Nartuo focuses on the NEXT generation outclassing the last. Kagami would be considered the next generation of Evil, of whom which Naruto/Minato has to destroy, much like Hashirama had to prior. Both Naruto and Kagami would be considered the parallels over humanity's existence, and whoever wins sets the balance. 

But also, one more interesting tidbit about Kagami, and the meaning of his name "Mirror". We all know of the three sacred Japanese artifacts (Regalia), and they have been referenced throughout the series (specifically, Itachi now has all three). 

Also, the Sage of 6 paths carried three _iconic items_, notably similar to these things: a sword, a matagama necklace, and a Buddhist staff which could have held the yata no kagami in it's head. 

The interesting thing is that we all know Sauske has been associated with "Swords", and just recently Naruto became associated with the Matagama necklace (as was pain), but not one was associated with the Mirrors, the third artifact... until *Uchiha Kagami.* 

And thus, the Uchiha and Senju will have to reunite into one, once more in order to stop the greatest evil, the Jubii, again. 

Just some food for thought.  

Basically tl;dr, I believe the evidence points towards Uchiha Kagami being the one whom attacked Konoha with the 9 tails in an attempt to avenge the humiliation done to his father, Madara Uchiha. 

Also, and I never said this before, but it's likely that Kagami has been using, and gave Nagato, living Madara's Rinnegan. And, it was probably given to Nagato under _Kagami's watch_ (hence why he's considered a "brat" and allowed to grow) on the condition that he REVIVED UCHIHA MADARA. This would be why "Tobi" got pissed off, because Madara was expecting to be revived and Kagami knew it. Hence, *WHY THINGS WEREN'T GOING ACCORDING TO HIS PLANS.* 

This is supported by Automatic's theory of Madara and Nagato being related, as they probably are. But not as father and son, more like grandfather and grandson, as the generation gap between Madara and Nagato is too large. Thus, Kagami fills that gap. This makes sense, because Tsunade had to have been older than Nagato and yet her Grandfather was roughly *the same age* as Madara. Thus, both Tsunade/Nagato had to have been third generation from Hashirama/Madara's first.

And, finally, the reason Tobi has hidden his true identity all this time was because many had presumed Kagami dead during the 1st Ninja War as he had been forgotten. Thus, it's a perfect opportunity needed to take vengeance on the Leaf, and eventually use this power to recreate the 10 tails (in Gedo Mazo -hence Shikamaru's shock) and become the next true Sage: the 10 tails Jinchurriki, and rule _everything_ through Infinite Tsukiyomi.      

Anyway, that's what I think. And if my dad had been an icon, and humiliated, I'd probably want revenge too.


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## Vash (Oct 23, 2011)

I agree! Tobi is Yamato.


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## Undead (Oct 23, 2011)

Tobi theory thread #336743.....


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## J★J♥ (Oct 23, 2011)

????????????????????????


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## Jericko (Oct 23, 2011)

_I agree! Tobi is Yamato._


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## crisler (Oct 23, 2011)

wow the hair resemblance is quite right. almost exact..


if kagami is tobi, kishi's gonna need a good plan to persuade the readers.


madara could've brainwashed kagami, or somehow took control of his body/mind, perhaps used something like orochimaru's soul transfer etc...

afterall, tobi's recognition of edotensei and the name itself could be a link to kagami, since he was tobirama's student... but that's all there is.

right now tobi could be anyone so anything's possible


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## Hinata Is Shikaku Nara (Oct 23, 2011)

Very intricate theory. The only real flaw I see in this is that it seems implausible for Kishi to use a seemingly sideline character as a main villain. I like this though. It has thought put into it.


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## Xerces (Oct 23, 2011)

Jericko said:


> _I agree! Tobi is Yamato._



Has anyone noticed that every time Madara appears, Yamato is conveniently missing? It no coincidence.


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## Undead (Oct 23, 2011)

Xerces said:


> Has anyone noticed that every time Madara appears, Yamato is conveniently missing? It no coincidence.


Wrong. Yamato's been shown around Tobi. There was that scene when Kakashi and Yamato confronted Tobi, when he came to talk to Naruto in the Kage Summit arc.


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## Jericko (Oct 23, 2011)

Yamato being tobi doesn't make sense, because, unless tobi is a Yamato clone, Yamato is currently being harnessed for Hashirama juice to power the white Zetsus.

To that, if he was toby, Kabuto (the one who knows everything) would have known Yamato was tobi, and would have simply asked him to contribute his essence. Kabuto wouldn't have wasted his time abducting him (yamato) if he had suspected they were the same person. I repeat: Kabuto knows his fucking identity!!! 

Also, he would have known it was a clone with Naruto. Clones can't utilize Ninjitsu, or *summon Gedo Mazo*, while the real body is incapacitated. No chakra is being supplied for the technique. 

Plus, Yamato's importance is merely in regard to controlling the 9 tails, which is no longer necessary since Naruto can control it alone. Yamato is basically useless now in regard to the plot. 

Him being Tobi would be pointless. 

If he was Tobi, and wanted the 9 tails, well... then he's wasted every opportunity he's had. And he's been in conjunction with Naruto going 9 tails more times than *anyone else so far* 

It's not him. If it is, then that's just bad writing.


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## Xerces (Oct 23, 2011)

Saru Goob said:


> Wrong. Yamato's been shown around Tobi. There was that scene when Kakashi and Yamato confronted Tobi, when he came to talk to Naruto in the Kage Summit arc.



That wasn't Yamato, it was a Zetsu clone.


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## Burke (Oct 23, 2011)

There is no denying tobito.
Is been canon for the every time.


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## GunX2 (Oct 23, 2011)

Tobi is the rock that fell on Obito...duh.


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## Sann (Oct 23, 2011)

Wow 
I have to admit: great theory! First I thought you just would use the "hair" as your only and best argument but all your thoughts afterwards are actually pretty good! I'm impressed 
Would be not bad if Kagami is in fact Tobi, not only when it comes down to the length of the story line. I'd be refreshing for the plot.
Very nice^^


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## DoubleX31 (Oct 23, 2011)

This seems plausible but as I recall, Kagami was anime filler Uchiha.


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## Undead (Oct 23, 2011)

DoubleX31 said:


> This seems plausible but as I recall, Kagami was anime filler Uchiha.


Kagami was not filler. 


Just fodder.


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## Imamember (Oct 23, 2011)

tobi is yammato was more interesting than tobi is kagami 

lets be honest, tobi can be anyone with the fact that there is a thing called clones, (being in 2 places at one aka naruto)


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## Jericko (Oct 23, 2011)

*siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiigh*... I just explained why Yamato couldn't be a clone and Tobi! C'mon guys!


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## Kiss (Oct 23, 2011)

I'm confused.


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## Degauss (Oct 23, 2011)

This is the most idiotic thing i....oh wait. This theory is actually pretty solid and deep

I thought you were just gonna troll with the image, but i see what you did there It pains me to admit, but it even beats my Tobi=Tobirama theory. 

If the parts about the artifacts are true, then i feel Naruto is getting a zelda vibe!!

Well Done. +rep


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## richmass (Oct 23, 2011)

Very plausible


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## G (Oct 23, 2011)

Well done.
I think you might even be right.


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## jacamo (Oct 23, 2011)

agreed ... like i have been saying for a few weeks before the 6th coffin was revealed to be the real Madara... Tobi is Kagami


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## Jirya (Oct 23, 2011)

I had this theory a lot time ago:


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## Zoan Marco (Oct 23, 2011)

Tobigami 

Very nice theory, could be right.


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## Talis (Oct 23, 2011)

Obito makes more sense, he also got the same hairstyle+his body was crushed therefore mixed up with Zetsu parts now.


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## Undead (Oct 23, 2011)

This theory is pretty much based on hairstyle, which is honestly a stupid thing to go on. People can change their hairstyles you know guys... I'm surprised how many of you are buying this.


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## Zoan Marco (Oct 23, 2011)

Saru Goob said:


> This theory is pretty much based on hairstyle, which is honestly a stupid thing to go on. People can change their hairstyles you know guys... I'm surprised how many of you are buying this.



I'm guessing you didn't read OP.


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## Undead (Oct 23, 2011)

Zoan Marco said:


> I'm guessing you didn't read OP.


I read it just fine. It's based mostly on the hairstyle and angles and shit. It's not really something good to go off in my opinion.


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## Degauss (Oct 23, 2011)

Saru Goob said:


> This theory is pretty much based on hairstyle, which is honestly a stupid thing to go on. People can change their hairstyles you know guys... I'm surprised how many of you are buying this.



Read the full op before you speak.


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## Zoan Marco (Oct 23, 2011)

Saru Goob said:


> I read it just fine. It's based mostly on the hairstyle and angles and shit. It's not really something good to go off in my opinion.



Okay, now I know you didn't read it.

kthnxbye.


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## Undead (Oct 23, 2011)

Lmao. Keep thinking that.


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## Zoan Marco (Oct 23, 2011)

Saru Goob said:


> Lmao. Keep thinking that.



You obviously didn't read this if you think all he talked about was hair and angles.


*Spoiler*: __ 





> *Other Evidence*
> 
> _His Plans: *spoilers for chapter 560*_
> 
> ...


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## Ezekial (Oct 23, 2011)

Saru Goob said:


> Kagami was not filler.
> 
> 
> Just fodder.



HAHAHAHA, what an awesome insult, "not filler just fodder" haha


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## Escargon (Oct 23, 2011)

Fk me sides, he got exactly the same hairstyle!


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## jacamo (Oct 23, 2011)

Saru Goob said:


> This theory is pretty much based on hairstyle, which is honestly a stupid thing to go on. People can change their hairstyles you know guys... I'm surprised how many of you are buying this.





Saru Goob said:


> I read it just fine. It's based mostly on the hairstyle and angles *and shit*. It's not really something good to go off in my opinion.



anyone who posts "...and shit..." dont deserve to be taken seriously


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## Doge (Oct 23, 2011)

Link removed


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## Hinata Is Shikaku Nara (Oct 23, 2011)

Saru Goob said:


> This theory is pretty much based on hairstyle, which is honestly a stupid thing to go on. People can change their hairstyles you know guys... I'm surprised how many of you are buying this.





The thing is, plot devices have been based off of stupider ideas than this. This has semi-plausibility. Read my previous post for full details.


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## BrokenBonds (Oct 23, 2011)

Kagami Uchiha, the very definition of a fodder Uchiha is our final villain? A man who was shown in, what, two panels is Tobi?

LOL K.


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## jacamo (Oct 23, 2011)

^if he was fodder he wouldnt have been on Tobirama's team, Tobi isnt FV either

remember how ppl were saying Shisui was fodder?  

its between Kagami and Izuna


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## ShounenSuki (Oct 23, 2011)

This theory reminds me of the Akatsuki Leader = Fourth Hokage theory?

Any way, Kagami's hair is far curlier in the manga.


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## spyware (Oct 23, 2011)

It kind of makes sense but it's basically as good as many theories about him I'm always sceptical when it comes to such theories. It is a possibility however and im looking forward to see tobi's true face.

ps. you should probably delete this hair bullshit because ppl watch pics and then cba to read the rest


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## L. Messi [✔] (Oct 23, 2011)

Tobi is Obito ffs. Kthxbye


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## First Tsurugi (Oct 23, 2011)

We're going back to arguing Tobi's identity based on hair similarity?


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## jacamo (Oct 23, 2011)

L. Messi [✔];40915570 said:
			
		

> Tobi is Obito ffs. Kthxbye



Tobi = Obito is more credible than Tobi = Madara

who would have thought


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## Yuna (Oct 23, 2011)

It seems 99% of Narutoforums posters do not know the definition of the words "evidence" and/or "proof".


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## Jericko (Oct 23, 2011)

> Originally Posted by *FallenAngelII*
> It seems 99% of Narutoforums posters do not know the definition of the words "evidence" and/or "proof".



I'm proposing the hair as supplemental evidence because in those particular images the characters appeared to have the same hair patterns. If you don't agree with the theory, that's fine. However, it doesn't constitute a negative rep because of your strong opinions. Should I neg rep you in return for your actions? Well I won't. I hope you feel bad.  And it's 99% speculation 99% of the time anyway, so relax. 

In that one particular manga panel, yes, his hair looks _nothing like Tobi's._ However, when the anime drew Kagami out it looked suspiciously closer to it. The manga never gave Kagami an accurate close up, and I'm sure that was intentional. Over the years, Naruto's lines in general have become more carefully drawn and more accurate overall. The Manga used to be drawn really messy, and back then a theory based on hair style would not be plausible. 

Just look at the difference between Minato then (Part I) and Now (Part II). He basically used to look like David Bowie in Labyrinth (thank god Kishi changed it). Now Minato's hair is drawn exactly the same in every frame.

Now, to that, few of you are saying it couldn't be Kagami because he's only been in one scene and has little to no plot relevance. Well, if any of you have studied storytelling, you would know an effective way to reveal a true villain is to hide his identity until the Climax, which Naruto is effectively approaching. And, when he is revealed, use a character of whom little is known or never before introduced. It will add weight.  

Full Metal Alchemist did it with "Father" AND "Pride". When Father was revealed, it wasn't who the audience was expecting, and it was a relatively new character as well. When Pride was revealed, *especially* Pride, in chapter 70, they shit themselves for weeks. They couldn't walk. 

Pride was originally a VERY, *EXTREMELY*, out of fucking LEFT FIELD, minor character with little importance to the plot, and had only a handful of previous lines. The idea of him being a major antagonist was laughable to say the least - which turned him into the most effective central villain. It was very effective because it was *not expected.* Go a head and ask anyone today, and they'll tell you pride was the best reveal because it was shocking. People LIKE TO BE SURPRISED AND KISHI KNOWS THIS.  

Star Wars, which this Manga borrows from heavily, didn't reveal Darth Vader's true identity until the END of the 2nd part, which was ALSO unexpected. Yes, it's Luke's father, yet were were told Vader had KILLED HIS FATHER. Thus we introduce a brand new element to an older character and suddenly Darth Vader becomes TWO major characters. In this case, Kishi is avoiding predictable outcomes and has decided to drive more complexity in regards to revealing plot details.   

For example, if you think it's unrealistic that Tobi could be a character vaguely focused on in a flashback of a major character (Ch. 481) , then god forbid Pain's true identity was actually a character who *wasn't even introduced until 30 chapters after we finally saw his "face."* He went from not even existing, to putting Amegakure, Rinnegan, Hanzou, Akatsuki, and the Uzumaki Clan on the map. Lord knows what might be revealed when Tobi is unveiled, and when it is Kagami, as I predict, it will also answer many questions regarding many important (but untouched) events. 

For example...

*Why the Uzumaki Clan was destroyed* during the war, and who lead the destruction. Kagami could have destroyed it while in hiding while attempting to steal the 9 tails before attacking Minato. 

*Why the Uchiha Clan was really annihilated.* Anyone remember Tobi's Lab Room with many Sharringan eyes? Yeah, those had to have come from countless dead Uchiha. Kagami plans to use them, as shown recently, in his Pain bodies. 

*The Origin of the 10 tails chakra.*.. an Alien Race? True essence of the Bijuu, could be a long lost civilization Kagami is looking to revive? *shrugs* this is simply my imagination speaking.   
*
Minato's last name*... NamiKaze? Where the heck does that fit in? His mother's? Then, does that mean his father was Senju afterall? 

and *Naruto's true Origins*... Is the NamiKaze Blood line extraterrestrial akin to Juubi? No other Ninja besides Naruto/Minato have Blond hair/Blue eyes... except maybe the first Rikudou! Especially since his and Naruto's hair style in Kyuubi mode is painfully similar. I'll bet anything Kagami knows the answers to all of these mysteries, and will be the one who reveals them to Naruto directly after they battle. 

Basically, Kishi is great at foreshadowing characters/events without providing intel until a much later time, and usually implements characters who are relatively unknown as major antagonists. Orochimaru, Sound 4, and Akatsuki were basically enigmas until the plot centered around them. Also, all of them appeared relatively sudden relative to their importance.    

This may not be intentional however, as Kishi notably introduces themes later, and in less organized fashion, as well. For example, we weren't introduced to Chakra elemental properties until the 3rd arc of part II (the Zombie Twins). It has one of those "Oh yeah" effects, as if Kishi never had time to implement it in Part I. Or completely forgot about it, lol.  

Basically, there's still a lot unanswered, and those subjects are just as if not more so shrouded in darkness than Tobi's identity. But, my point is, usually a major element being revealed to have been something formerly minor in importance is an effective way to *surprise* your audience. Basically, and it's a major reason why I think Kagami is Tobi, is because *NO ONE WOULD EXPECT IT, and yet it would be completely logical since WE DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT HIM.*

Yamato is in the Hashirama tree, it couldn't be him. In fact, Kishi purposely had him abducted so you would know it wasn't him!!!! It does not make ANY sense. If anything, he needs to be rescued by Kakashi, like the bitch he is. 

This is how the Manga has been written for the last 400 chapters: First we thought AL was Minato, and then Kakashi, and some even thought it was Jiraiya. Then with Tobi it went Obito, then Yamato, then everyone thought it was Madara because he stated he was, THEN Danzou who Kishi even *TROLLED US WITH* when Shisui's Sharingan was revealed, and then back to Yamato because Kagami was fodder. Much like Nagto to Pain was then. And now it seems as if Nagato may be the direct kin to UM. Huh, well *FUCK.*. 

Enjoy your mind fuck when it does turn out to be Kagami, because Kishi will be laughing. Hard. As will I.


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## Yuna (Oct 23, 2011)

Jericko said:


> I'm proposing the hair as supplemental evidence because in those particular images the characters appeared to have the same hair patterns. If you don't agree with the theory, that's fine. However, it doesn't constitute a negative rep because of your strong opinions. Should I neg rep you in return for your actions? Well I won't. I hope you feel bad.  And it's 99% speculation 99% of the time anyway, so relax.


So you admit you do not have actual proof of any of the things you say?

Not once did I argue that your thread is incorrect. But you're clearly misusing the word "proof".


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## Jericko (Oct 23, 2011)

> Originally posted by *FallenAngelII*
> 
> So you admit you do not have actual proof of any of the things you say?
> 
> Not once did I argue that your thread is incorrect. But you're clearly misusing the word "proof".



No, but I could of course be wrong, yet so far what I have presented here is the strongest evidence pointing towards Kagami being Tobi. That alone should warrant a pat on the back since he's only been seen roughly twice. 

The fact that we have ALMOST NOTHING to use in comparison should constitute the exception of hair measurements. It's simply something that caught my eye, and not because the hair was spiked. But, because of the angle each hair lock bent at. I don't support general hair arguments after Minato = AL fail, but this particular image of Kagami from the anime caught my eye. Then, as I was constructing the hair argument, I wrote everything else as I knew that wouldn't be enough.  

For example, how about when Tobi met Danzou and stated, "long time no see?". It would have been a long time since Kagami and Danzou had seen eachother if Kagami had been presumed dead. And Uchiha Madara wouldn't have spoken to Danzou informally - he would have seen Danzou as a child, like Nagato.  

Basically, the only thing I'll admit to is that you're not providing any valid points as to why my evidence is useless. Simply giving me the finger and the neg repping isn't reason to say I'm providing false evidence. 

If you don't agree with me, explain. Otherwise, take it back .


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## Talis (Oct 23, 2011)

Saru Goob said:


> This theory is pretty much based on hairstyle, which is honestly a stupid thing to go on. People can change their hairstyles you know guys... I'm surprised how many of you are buying this.



So yeah Tobi might be Jiraiya right?
Jiraiya has long white hairs while Tobi has short black, but people changes hairstyles bro. 
No but seriously people believed this because every single character was calling Tobi Madara, but look our friend just got ET. 
Inb4 Tobis long hair in Kisames flashback... it wasnt Tobi it was the real Madara because he was clearly alife in this period since he fought Onoki and knew about Nagato.

And it is even more stupid if you believe that a masked anime characters look will be messed up the whole time.
Do you think Kishi will just show up a masked male character and then show him as a female chacter in his past just to troll us, *NO* so would he mess up with his hairs...?


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## Faux (Oct 23, 2011)

I can just imagine, if it is Kagami, he's going to to say something along the lines of I named myself after my sensei *Tobi*rama, which could be used as another reason it may be him.


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## Jericko (Oct 23, 2011)

^And, I'm not sure if it was you who said that earlier, but that also had me thinking. 

You Faux, or whoever, good find!


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## Nep Nep (Oct 23, 2011)

Nice not only does your theory make sense in the way you intended but it fills in minor things that you didn't even mention quite nicely! 

You have convinced me that Kagami could be as logical as Izuna. 

Also to the Tobi=Madara lovers (Sorry Jericko I need to borrow this >;]) 

*"If you think it's unrealistic that Tobi could be a character vaguely focused on in a flashback of a major character (Ch. 481) , then god forbid Pain's true identity was actually a character who wasn't even introduced until 30 chapters after we finally saw his "face."* 

You have been ownt O;!  

+Reps man!


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## DremolitoX (Oct 23, 2011)

How much did you have to dig around to find a tobi hair pic that resembled kagami's??? I want an answer, seriously, because for every one you find that match I can give you ten that don't.


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## Jericko (Oct 23, 2011)

You probably can because Tobi has been drawn in many different perspectives and many different poses, from many different angles. Kagami hasn't.

As I said before, I'm being particular in this case, and ONLY because there is SO little to go on with Kagami.


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## Jeαnne (Oct 23, 2011)

will this ever end? come on kishi


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## Fatback (Oct 23, 2011)

Tobi may very well be.... Wait for it... wait.... Tobi. I will take my trophy scepter and crown now thank you.. King of fools get it?


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## Fatback (Oct 23, 2011)

jacamo said:


> Tobi = Obito is more credible than Tobi = Madara
> 
> who would have thought



Me.... From the very beginning. Check the first couple of threads I made.


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## BrokenBonds (Oct 23, 2011)

jacamo said:


> ^if he was fodder he wouldnt have been on Tobirama's team, Tobi isnt FV either
> 
> remember how ppl were saying Shisui was fodder?
> 
> its between Kagami and Izuna


... Kagami Uchiha was in, what, two panels in this _entire manga._ Kagami affects no one on an emotional level nor is he someone the alliance would even recognize. Seriously, if he were Kagami and took off his mask the alliance would be like _"who the fuck is this flamboyant prick?"_. I wasn't saying fodder as in weak, I meant fodder as in completely irrelevant. At least Shisui was relevant in some sense with Itachi. It's between only Madara himself and Shisui, anyone else would be Kishimoto trollingz.

If the man who directly caused the death of both protagonists death and who's been titled "darkness" and "the harbinger of the end" isn't the final villain then who is? Sasuke?


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## Xerces (Oct 23, 2011)

BrokenBonds said:


> ... Kagami Uchiha was in, what, two panels in this _entire manga._ Kagami affects no one on an emotional level nor is he someone the alliance would even recognize him. Seriously, if he were Kagami and took off his mask the alliance would be like _"who the fuck is this flamboyant prick?"_



Uchiha Kagami: The man who was in the squad of Tobirama, the brother of Hashirama Senju who was Madara's rival. Tobirama - the shinobi that the_ masked man_ derived his alias "Tobi" from.

Uchiha Kagami: The man who was in the same squad as both elders, Danzo, and Hiruzen. Four people all involved in the Uchiha massacre, and 3 of which Tobi brainwashed Sasuke to kill. Keep your friends close, but your enemies closer.

Uchiha Kagami: The man who picked up where his father left off, but was smarter than his father. Instead of destroying the Senju head on, he would infiltrate Konoha, and learn about their ways. _"Patience is the key to success"_ ~ Tobi. 

Uchiha Kagami: The man, the Uchiha, that Kishimoto quietly introduced, yet everyone overlooked.

*Uchiha Kagami: The man behind the mask.*


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## 3rdgenkage (Oct 24, 2011)

This is a very good theory I think it is either him or Izuna. The whole Tobirama thing is also a great point.


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## Jericko (Oct 24, 2011)

So, so far this is what we have to go on: 

His hair is very similar in design from those two images; he's the only one who supposedly died (before the start of the series mind you) from team Tobirama and yet IT'S NEVER MENTIONED WHAT HAPPENED TO HIM - he was never confirmed dead EVER; the name Tobi probably comes from Tobirama, his group leader; and he seems to personally know Danzou in an informal manner, as if *they were friends*. 

To be honest, I have been reading over the Izuna theories, and there is a plausibility there, yet one thing doesn't make sense to be regarding Izuna: *How could he personally know Danzou if he had died long before Danzou was born?* Think about it, Izuna died long before the Leaf ever formed and he basically sacrificed his eyes so Madara could Rival the Senju Clan's Hashirama. This had NOTHING to do with the leaf, and if by some chance Izuna is Tobi, that would be a gaping plot hole, because (evident from Danzou's silence) he must have known Tobi's true identity as well. Needless to say, immediately after Tobi greets him, Daznou *goes into a flashback indirectly pertaining to Kagami himself while presently making eye contact with Tobi.*

How could Danzou be familiar with Tobi today, you say? Well, recall the countless number of Sharingans on his, Danzou's, arm. *This means Danzou had been working with Tobi, and Itachi, while coordinating the Uchiha Massacre, and that BOTH were attempting to become the next Rikudou * Danzou wanted nothing but to obtain the power to create peace in his own way, while Tobi desires the same. Both were looking to obtain the power of Rikudou in order to bring true order, eternally.  

Yet, with Izuna, this COULD mean Kagami (Tobi) is possibly the son of Izuna instead of Madara, hence Tobi clenching his shirt while talking to Sauske (his father lost everything)... but it's a long shot, because if he despised Madara, then why go through the trouble of avenging his memory and becoming him instead? If anything, he should have posed as Izuna! 

But true, Izuna isn't Edo, and probably because his corpse predates any usable DNA Kabuto could find - his remains are older than the current Ninja World. Proof of this is the age range of every Ninja on the battlefield, and not one is *older than Madara in his prime*. However, the same rule doesn't go for Kagami who's easily within range, and SHOULD have been Edo Tensei'd. Since this is the case, and Kagami is truly dead, *why hasn't he been resurrected and yet is the ONLY member of Tobirama unaccounted for!? He should be there, right?* 

*Conclusion:* Because he is there, as the man behind the mask. He is the missing link. He is Kagami Uchiha, the one no one would suspect because he had been erased, forgotten, *and that is exactly what he wanted >*.

And for those of you to lazy to read my post, just skim it or read the updates.


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## Yuna (Oct 24, 2011)

Jericko said:


> No, but I could of course be wrong, yet so far what I have presented here is the strongest evidence pointing towards Kagami being Tobi.


It is meaningless if the proof is weak.



Jericko said:


> That alone should warrant a pat on the back since he's only been seen roughly twice.


That would be like patting someone on the back just for putting effort into drawing a cat, even if that cat resembled a car. It would indulging and patronizing.



Jericko said:


> The fact that we have ALMOST NOTHING to use in comparison should constitute the exception of hair measurements.


My criticism is *not* limited to your usage of the "The hair!" argument. It encompasses your entire OP. You have close to *zero* "proof" in it and the "prof" you *do* present is weak, at best.

So how about not naming thrads "ahHA! [sic] Proof..." when you have next to none to present?


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## Itαchi (Oct 24, 2011)

People... Tobi has to be Izuna, otherwise THIS here:



Is a plothole and Kishi was retconning which I highly doubt, tbh.


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## Agony (Oct 24, 2011)

tobi=yamato.


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## BlazeD (Oct 24, 2011)

Very well done. 



Xerces said:


> Uchiha Kagami: The man who was in the squad of Tobirama, the brother of Hashirama Senju who was Madara's rival. Tobirama - the shinobi that the_ masked man_ derived his alias "Tobi" from.
> 
> Uchiha Kagami: The man who was in the same squad as both elders, Danzo, and Hiruzen. Four people all involved in the Uchiha massacre, and 3 of which Tobi brainwashed Sasuke to kill. Keep your friends close, but your enemies closer.
> 
> ...



Some solid points as well.


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## goldendriger (Oct 24, 2011)

Tobi is Danzou, and he used the soul splitting tech to fake his own death 



Itαchi said:


> People... Tobi has to be Izuna, otherwise THIS here:
> 
> 
> 
> Is a plothole and Kishi was retconning which I highly doubt, tbh.



Sorry to double post but WTF dude? He clenched his arm and you buy that Tobi is Izuna? Or Madara or whatever?

Please...Madara is the biggest liar ive ever seen in a manga (Aizen included) he's never told the truth about anything ever. He cleched his arm, coolio.

He also said "Im Madara" and "I had NOTHING to do with the Kyuubi attack" and "Im a credable villain" Okay...maybe that last one was me, but you get my point.


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## Jericko (Oct 25, 2011)

I seriously doubt Tobi gripping his arm means anything, and he could have even done that to create an emotional emphasis towards what he was explaining to Sauske. And let's be honest here people, Tobi has been lying his ASS off the entire time. 

I don't trust ANYTHING he told Sauske.    

If anything, the evidence points solely towards Kagami since that's all you have to go on for Izuna. Izuna is dead, let's end this.

Edit 10/24: Also, one more bit of evidence and this in akin to prove without a shadow of a doubt that TOBI is NOT Izuna:

Chapter 404 pg. 16/17

Page 16: 

Tobi: _"Konoha is no longer off limits... *Itachi is dead, NOTHING stands in my way*."_

Page 17:

Tobi: _The most important thing was to *make Sauske Mine*_

It couldn't be Izuna, because his relevancy to Sauske doesn't exist; Izuna never lived long enough ever know of Itachi/Sauske's existence. However, someone closer to Danzou's Age WOULD be, like Kagami.

Especially since, according to Zetsu, it had been a _"long time since" they've been to THE HIDDEN LEAF_. What does this mean? It means *Izuna COULDN'T BE TOBI, because Izuna was NEVER apart of the hidden leaf as it didn't exist during his lifetime!* Kagami DAMN sure was, and it would have been a long time if many had thought he died long before during the 1st Ninja WW. Again, he is the ONLY Ninja unaccounted for among former team Tobirama. The ONLY ONE. Where did he go guys!? He's been there all along, waiting for his chance to strike. Of course, he tried when Minato was Hokage but underestimated him... I'm curious if that had been his first attempt to take the Kyuubi. 

As for what the hell Zetsu is, I have no idea why he had anything to do with Konoha. Zetsu I don't get, at all. Although there is obviously some Yin Yang symbolism in his black/white persona.

Anyway, there is probably more evidence, and if I find any, I will add it to this topic. Can't add anything to the OP because of 10,000 character limit.


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## Yuna (Oct 25, 2011)

Jericko said:


> <Snip>


You do realize, though, that if Tobi is Izuna, Izuna's death was faked, right? So who cares if he supposedly died before any of that happened?

Also, you seem to forget that Tobi probably was the one to help Itachi slaughter the Uchiha clan 16 years ago, so regardlesss of who he is, he's been to Konoha.


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## Tomcat171 (Oct 25, 2011)

Tonton = Tobi

They both have 't' and 'o' in their names, just like Yamato and Obito, so don't leave the pork out of the argument


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## Yuna (Oct 25, 2011)

Tomcat171 said:


> Tonton = Tobi
> 
> They both have 't' and 'o' in their names, just like Yamato and Obito, so don't leave the pork out of the argument


Piglets don't have hands!


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## gehad (Oct 25, 2011)

Good effort actually but seriously i think that alot of people have been thinking too much about Tobi's identity . Actually Kagami is a good thing but why would they involve Kagami , Kagami's name wasn't mentioned when he appeared in this flashback i guess moreover its more logical that he's Izuna tho i don't go with that theory , But Izuna sounds more logical . Also the clinching thing is really logical imo .


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## Stelios (Oct 25, 2011)

ok OP here's a question.How would you feel if this unimportant fodder char is actually the man behind the mask?I  personally not going to be impressed unless it has some amazing plot level behind it.But as far as I m concerned plot wise Kishi was always full of empty spaces...


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## Tomcat171 (Oct 25, 2011)

FallenAngelII said:


> Piglets don't have hands!


Zetsu gave her hands!


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## Jericko (Oct 25, 2011)

> Originally posted by *Mstelios*
> 
> ok OP here's a question.How would you feel if this unimportant fodder char is actually the man behind the mask?I personally not going to be impressed unless it has some amazing plot level behind it.But as far as I m concerned plot wise Kishi was always full of empty spaces...



First of all, he's no more fodder than Danzou or Hiruzen, otherwise why would Kishi bother to put him in Team 2nd ho-freaking-kage in the first place. To that, as others have pointed out, team *Tobi*rama. Hm? 

2nd of all, as you stated, the plot hole is FULLY of empty space, and so is Tobi. So let's think logically here: Would it make more sense for Tobi to be a character we've seen and know everything about, or someone we don't know ANYTHING about? Because until 559, it was Uchiha Madara. Now it's up in the air. 

Kishi has been leading us on since Tobi's introduction, and we still don't know a DAMN THING ABOUT HIM. To me, this points towards the character behind the mask being someone we don't know... and that someone will *fill those empty spaces.*

If it's self satisfying to hold on to the idea that in some way he's Izuna because you're still holding onto Tobi = Madara, then fine. Be my guest. But from the evidence presented here, it CLEARLY isn't him. 

But if it does turn out to be Izuna, then as I stated, it will be bad writing. Why? The fued of PART II has to do with the leaf, and Izuna has nothing to do with the leaf. If by some chance Kagami is Izuna's son, then fine! The arm clench makes sense in that context.



FallenAngelII said:


> You do realize, though, that if Tobi is Izuna, Izuna's death was faked, right? So who cares if he supposedly died before any of that happened?
> 
> Also, you seem to forget that Tobi probably was the one to help Itachi slaughter the Uchiha clan 16 years ago, so regardlesss of who he is, he's been to Konoha.



Sure, Izuna's death could have been faked, and Hiruzen's fight with Oro was all planned and they're really sippn' on tea over at Jiraiya's house,  and the moon Rikudo created is made completely * out of Mozzarella cheese*. Yum. 

Just because something could be, doesn't mean it will be for the sake of fiction and your dashed hopes. However, you obviously don't support this theory, so why should I attempt to refute your opinion. Believe what you'ed like. 

And no, I didn't forget about the Uchiha massacre. In fact, I touched up on that a few posts prior if you'ed bother to read them all. As I said, Kagami and Danzou were both in on the Massacre to score a shitload of Sharingans for themselves. 

They're both the same age, from the same group, and both sadistically power hungry. One for control, and one for revenge.

And here's another piece of evidence for the day that proves it is Kagami and not Izuna. 

Let's take a look at this picture, from the Manga of Uchiha Kagami: 



Now let's take a look at Tobi's face WHEN HE FIRST showed his eye, in the next chapter it's drawn a bit differently (probably on purpose).

[sp=Over-sized Image][/sp]

Kay, now let's take a look at Izuna. 

[sp=Over-sized Image][/sp]


From these images, it's pretty clear that Kagami's Eyes and Tobi's are very similar. The folds of the eye lids are almost identical, with the angled point to the right of each eye, except Tobi's is a bit more aged and uneven, as it should be. Izuna's eye folds CONNECT to his eyes, so that's a gaping issue right there. 

Also, he looks almost exactly like Sauske, hence the symbolism between Madara/Izuna and Itachi/Sauske. However, this doesn't have anything to really do with my evidence, it's just something I noticed. Kishi, yet again, givn' Suaske a backrub.  

Difference in art or not, *every time we've seen TOBI's eyes, the folds of his top eye-lids never touch the eye-line. Ever.* (in a normal expression). 

The evidence is piling up guys.


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## Stelios (Oct 26, 2011)

> If it's self satisfying to hold on to the idea that in some way he's Izuna because you're still holding onto Tobi = Madara, then fine. Be my guest. But from the evidence presented here, it CLEARLY isn't him.
> 
> But if it does turn out to be Izuna, then as I stated, it will be bad writing. Why? The fued of PART II has to do with the leaf, and Izuna has nothing to do with the leaf. If by some chance Kagami is Izuna's son, then fine! The arm clench makes sense in that context.



 If Tobi was indeed Kagami don't you think he would say something very private to Danzo the moment of his death?They were on the same team after all.Given the current data kagami is someone that JUST existed.If he was Izuna's son indeed don't you think he would be someone distinguished in the ranks of Uchiha-ha?

 Even Tobi taking over Madara's identity and using his revenge story does not add up unless Tobi is related to Madara.Edo Madara talking about Nagato well that certainly has given more food for thought.New chapter will be out soon anyway hold that thought.


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## Talis (Oct 26, 2011)

Jericko said:


> [sp]First of all, he's no more fodder than Danzou or Hiruzen, otherwise why would Kishi bother to put him in Team 2nd ho-freaking-kage in the first place. To that, as others have pointed out, team *Tobi*rama. Hm?
> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> ...


Last panel disagrees: [sp=Over-sized Image][/sp]
He clearly looks as Obito whether your an Obito believer or not.


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## Stelios (Oct 26, 2011)

loool3 said:


> Last panel disagrees: [sp=Over-sized Image][/sp]
> He clearly looks as Obito whether your an Obito believer or not.



You know I always believed that the guy who started the tobi=obito theory was some teenager that couldn't handle weed's paranoid side effects.Why would Obito know so much about madara and uchiha-ha lineage and not to mention that he is one man vs the world and all that because.... a rock crashed his half side gave to kakashi the good sharingan and then was left for dead?
 So he somehow tricked death and instead of going to kick Kakashi's ass he will pwn the whole world alone just because this is who Obito was.... oh no ... wait that shit does not even makes sense!


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## Talis (Oct 26, 2011)

mstelios said:


> You know I always believed that the guy who started the tobi=obito theory was some teenager that couldn't handle weed's paranoid side effects.Why would Obito know so much about madara and uchiha-ha lineage and not to mention that he is one man vs the world and all that because.... a rock crashed his half side gave to kakashi the good sharingan and then was left for dead?
> So he somehow tricked death and instead of going to kick Kakashi's ass he will pwn the whole world alone just because this is who Obito was.... oh no ... wait that shit does not even makes sense!



And what great theory do you support?
Tobi is Madara clone number 10000000? lol.
Anyways then tell me:

For gods sake why did he wear an orange 1 eye holed mask?
Why does his name TobiTobi/Toobi resambles badly to Obi*TO*? 
Why does he have the same S/T as Kakashis MS?
Why didnt Kishi reveal Rins death yet?
Why is his body made out of Zetsu goo?
Why is this ''Kakashis year'' keeps getting delayed as Tobis revealing moment does?
You call all of these facts coincedence?

Inb4 a pathetic reply ??he had 2 eyes??, he had a whole Sharingan lab...


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## Talis (Oct 26, 2011)

mstelios said:


> You know I always believed that the guy who started the tobi=obito theory was some teenager that couldn't handle weed's paranoid side effects.Why would Obito know so much about madara and uchiha-ha lineage and not to mention that he is one man vs the world and all that because.... a rock crashed his half side gave to kakashi the good sharingan and then was left for dead?
> So he somehow tricked death and instead of going to kick Kakashi's ass he will pwn the whole world alone just because this is who Obito was.... oh no ... wait that shit does not even makes sense!



More coincedence?

[sp=Over-sized Image][/sp]

That faceside was clean unlike the other faceside was completely messed up cuz of that giant rock. Also this face couldnt have ??scars-bags?? because as you see this face side is clearly being ??protected?? by the rocks next to it as you can see in this pic.
Now tell me why is this face side not shown, [sp=Over-sized Image][/sp]

Oh right that face side isnt full of scars-bags.
Instead of bashing other peoples theories use your head.


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## Stelios (Oct 26, 2011)

loool3 said:


> And what great theory do you support?
> Tobi is Madara clone number 10000000? lol.
> Anyways then tell me:
> 
> ...



I believe that Tobi is related somehow to madara after the latest chapter.How where and why I have no clue and we will soon find out.

But according to you a half dead, half body crushed, blind kid was able to:

1) Cling back to life
2) Screw  with Minato and Kushina the day they were giving birth to Naruto,
3) School Itachi how to kill the whole Uchiha-ha Clan
4) Control the Fourth Mizukage
5) Declare war in the whole world.

Seriously this list could go on and on....and all this by Obito that was the son of .... Aizen with the Will Of D?Just as planned? 



loool3 said:


> More coincedence?
> 
> [sp=Over-sized Image][/sp]
> 
> ...


 
 Your theory is flawed i m not bashing it I disagree with it and I present arguments to you.Feeling touchy?

 Right right his face here is not shown because it was half crushed by the rocks...So a half brained , half faced , half body crushed  blind kid is the manga's ultimate vilain


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## Talis (Oct 26, 2011)

mstelios said:


> I believe that Tobi is related somehow to madara after the latest chapter.How where and why I have no clue and we will soon find out.
> 
> But according to you a half dead, half body crushed, blind kid was able to:
> 
> ...



1: Obitos emotions were pretty messed up when he ''knew'' that he was up to die he was desperate and wished to stay longer with his friends around which means he ''lost his friends'' and awakend the MS.
2: This one is so suspicious. Why did Minato sarifice himself? Why didnt Tobi kill him? Now try to think as Kishi: How would fans have react if Tobi gets revealed as Obito which had killed Minato? Pretty mad and probably feeled pretty trolled thats why Minato died in this way.
3: I believe that was the real Madara which have been brought back early before to life for a short moment.
4: same as 3.
5: Why not once a FV always a FV.

And more Tobi has a crushed body and is made out of Zetsu goo now lets give it a look in the mirror way.
Why did Obito ''die'' in this way, i mean which freaking character gets such a death lol, being crushed under a boulder.
There might be some holes which i can think of in this theory but Kishi can come up with something like always.
I cant call all of these facts coincedence.



mstelios said:


> Your theory is flawed i m not bashing it I disagree with it and I present arguments to you.Feeling touchy?
> 
> Right right his face here is not shown because it was half crushed by the rocks...So a half brained , half faced , half body crushed  blind kid is the manga's ultimate vilain



That face side isnt crushed. 
Look at the pic that face side is clearly being protected by the rocks below it.
Anyways if you can give me a stronger fact of your own theory then feel free to post it.


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## Stelios (Oct 26, 2011)

loool3 said:


> 1: Obitos emotions were pretty messed up when he ''knew'' that he was up to die he was desperate and wished to stay longer with his friends around which means he ''lost his friends'' and awakend the MS.
> 2: This one is so suspicious. Why did Minato sarifice himself? Why didnt Tobi kill him? Now try to think as Kishi: How would fans have react if Tobi gets revealed as Obito which had killed Minato? Pretty mad and probably feeled pretty trolled thats why Minato died in this way.
> 3: I believe that was the real Madara which have been brought back early before to life for a short moment.
> 4: same as 3.
> ...



Obito's appearance in the manga had to do with Kakashi's self growth and that only.Not to mention that the time frame of Minato's death and Obito's were not that far.It does not add up. Did obito that just had awakened sharingan somehow found the capacity to troll the 4th and control the kuybi?

 These feats Tobi has on his back are too much to credit them to Obito.

As for the kishi can make up something comment well that's just wishful thinking to back this theory is it not?


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## Talis (Oct 26, 2011)

mstelios said:


> Obito's appearance in the manga had to do with Kakashi's self growth and that only.Not to mention that the time frame of Minato's death and Obito's were not that far.It does not add up. Did obito that just had awakened sharingan somehow found the capacity to troll the 4th and control the kuybi?
> 
> These feats Tobi has on his back are too much to credit them to Obito.
> 
> As for the kishi can make up something comment well that's just wishful thinking to back this theory is it not?



Of course i have to count on Kishi at some points, how should i know Obito's reasons for all these doings i am just supporting this theory with these many facts, like i said there are some holes like why Obito changed his personality but thats something for Kishi to reveal.

And i think the Kakashi gaiden wasnt actually to show us how Kakashi gained the Sharingan but more the introduce of Tobi/Obito lol.


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## Jericko (Oct 26, 2011)

Um as far as the left side of his face not being shown, I believe there is a page were his left side IS shown and it appears completely normal. He's sucking up Zetsu goop, or whatever, but we see his full back side and left cheek side.

Looks completely normal.

As for the right side of his face, those are called *wrinkles.*

[sp=Over-sized Image][/sp]

There ya go, left side of his face. Looks fine. And with that, I gotta get some sleep.


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## Stelios (Oct 26, 2011)

loool3 said:


> Of course i have to count on Kishi at some points, how should i know Obito's reasons for all these doings i am just supporting this theory with these many facts, like i said there are some holes like why Obito changed his personality but thats something for Kishi to reveal.
> 
> *And i think the Kakashi gaiden wasnt actually to show us how Kakashi gained the Sharingan but more the introduce of Tobi/Obito lol*.



It's not facts they are theories coming from some stoned kid's ass.
Fact is :minato died.Fact also: Obito died.
I want you to go to google and look what Gaiden means.Let's not forget that Kakashi Gaiden was published because of the massive interest that was generated around Kakashi's character.So someone jumping from Kakashi's-Gaiden to the main story and taking over a lead role in the manga's progression is not plausible.

*Think again*


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## Jericko (Oct 26, 2011)

One more thing caught my eye, in this image....

[sp=Over-sized Image][/sp]

It's not so much the image itself, but the Tagline... _the "magician's" assistant._

Sounds like a lot of smoke and _*mirrors*_... if you ask me.


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## Battoumaru (Oct 26, 2011)

Kagami could just be a code name like Yamato.

Uchiha Kagami = Uchiha "?" as Yamato = Tenzo

His real name could have been anything. That is, if the databook hasn't said otherwise.


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## chauronity (Oct 26, 2011)

Did you just base a whole thread to his haircut? What if someone uses these?



What'cha gonna do now, ha!


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## Escargon (Oct 26, 2011)

chauronity said:


> Did you just base a whole thread to his haircut? What if someone uses these?
> 
> 
> 
> What'cha gonna do now, ha!



Lol the hair could even be fake. It might be a monk from that ruined temple. =D


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## Jericko (Oct 26, 2011)

chauronity said:


> Did you just base a whole thread to his haircut? What if someone uses these?
> 
> 
> 
> What'cha gonna do now, ha!



At first I did, but then I added a bunch of stuff. Also, I'm not sure if it's laziness, but Kishi doesn't seem to give any characters haircuts off-screen. Sakura being the only one, and because she had to. 

With Kishi, kind of like Toriyama, the hair cuts for the important characters are apart of their character. 

Sure, he could be wearing the scalp of Kagami, and turn out to be Kubo Tite, and this whole time we've been in a genjutsu while reading Bleach. "My true plan is to troll all of your eyes!"  :amazed


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## Kakashi343 (Oct 27, 2011)

Good theory, I kinda hope it's true, but speaking reasonably I don't think Kishi would use someone as unmentioned for his ultimate villan


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## Stelios (Oct 27, 2011)

Jericko said:


> At first I did, but then I added a bunch of stuff. Also, I'm not sure if it's laziness, but Kishi doesn't seem to give any characters haircuts off-screen. Sakura being the only one, and because she had to.
> 
> With Kishi, kind of like Toriyama, the hair cuts for the important characters are apart of their character.
> 
> Sure, he could be wearing the scalp of Kagami, and turn out to be Kubo Tite, and this whole time we've been in a genjutsu while reading Bleach. "My true plan is to troll all of your eyes!"  :amazed



That would be so Genesis Evangelion mode.


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## icemanlonewolf (Oct 27, 2011)

loool3 said:


> like i said there are some holes like why Obito changed his personality but thats something for Kishi to reveal.


Some other holes are why would Obito, who wishes to remain unknown, call himself Tobi and not change his hairstyle? In order to maximize his disguise shouldn't he choose a name that doesn't cause one to think of his original, as you have? Also, again in order to maximize your disguise in a very simple way wouldn't it make sense to change your hairstyle? Oh what am I saying. He removed his goggles. That alone would prevent ppl from recognizing him. I'm not sure why he would choose to remove his goggles over some of these other things, but whatever. Silly me.


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