# Apocrypha servants in Fate Zero/Stay Night



## Deer Lord (Jul 24, 2015)

Basically like the achilles thread, just want to test the other servants around.

How would these servants do against the Zero/Stay Night servants:
1. Lancer Karna
2. Saber Siegfried
3. Saber Mordred
4. Lancer Vlad III (Assume they are in romania)
5. Archer Chiron


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## MAPSK (Jul 24, 2015)

Deer Lord said:


> Basically like the achilles thread, just want to test the other servants around.
> 
> How would these servants do against the Zero/Stay Night servants:
> 1. Lancer Karna
> ...



Gilgamesh walks in and is like



That about sums up the thread, really.


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## Brightsteel (Jul 24, 2015)

Karna kills anyone not named Herakles or Gilgamesh. 

Same with Vlad.


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## shade0180 (Jul 24, 2015)

Basically their biggest problem is Gil or Godhand..


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## Deer Lord (Jul 24, 2015)

Would herc even come back if he is struck down by Vasavi Shakti?


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## MAPSK (Jul 24, 2015)

Deer Lord said:


> Would herc even come back if he is struck down by Vasavi Shakti?



Yup. It'd be kind of a waste to use it on him, honestly.


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## Sablés (Jul 24, 2015)

Eh, sounds to me like Vlad would fuck Gil's shit up.

Herc wins all
Lancer can beat most
Saber can beat most
Archer and Kojiro can take some
Gilles with his Eldricht shit _might _beat Chiron but definitely loses to everyone else
Lancelot depending on the scenario could win some
Iskandar should kick Vlad and Chiron's ass. Seig and Mordred depends on how Excalibur-clones interact with IH

Bout it


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

Can Sieg and Mord's anti-army Fakealiblasts and Vlad's infinite spiky things one-shot Gilles' Cthulhu? Wasn't that the biggest issue with the thing?


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

Apocrypha Servants are complete monsters by servant standards

pretty much anyone not named Gil or Herc is completely and utterly screwed here

Saber's totally fucked vs Siegfried since WOG states bitch can't deal with the dragonslayer king

Karna's essentially an unkillable tank that can murder the everloving shit out of everyone and might actually pull off a win vs gil due to his IC being "Kill the shit out of the opponent, no questions asked"

Bloodlusted Karna vs Gil is a quickdraw contest


Vlad does what he does best, and that thing is impale some motherfucking heretics

Chiron snipes pretty much everyone barring Gil and Herc


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## Deer Lord (Jul 24, 2015)

BehemothV2 said:


> Can Sieg and Mord's anti-army Fakealiblasts and Vlad's infinite spiky things one-shot Gilles' Cthulhu? Wasn't that the biggest issue with the thing?


I'd say no.
all of these are anti-army NP
it was specificaly stated that you'd need an anti-fortress NP to take out Cthulhu.


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

_Most_ of the known servants are have something ~extraordinary about them.

I think only Chiron wouldn't get immediately fucked by Cybele, no?


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

When Chiron can literally pull skills out of his ass?

Not likely

Cybele would work if Rider had enough time to pull it out

Considering she'd have to be dealing with thousands of stakes, Fafnir armor flat out going "HAHA NOPE", Mordred's magic resist

Chiron's not the only one with ways around Cybele


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

Don't think Magic Resistance helps much. Archer with Mana rank B and MR rank D still got instantly paralyzed.


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## Deer Lord (Jul 24, 2015)

BehemothV2 said:


> _Most_ of the known servants are have something ~extraordinary about them.
> 
> I think only Chiron wouldn't get immediately fucked by Cybele, no?


Well Vlad has A-rank mana in romania and mordred has B-rank mana+B-rank magic resistance
so they won't be immidietly fucked too.


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

Shit, meant to say Vlad


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## Deer Lord (Jul 24, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> Fafnir armor flat out going "HAHA NOPE"


Riders mystic eyes are A+ rank
they can get through blood armor, though I have no idea what the actual effect would be after substracting the magic blocked by it.

Chiron does have B-rank mana but precog on top of that.
Also, being a fromer pseudo-deity like medusa and hailing from the same lands he'd probably figure her out before she can pull out the mystic eyes.


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## Azrael Finalstar (Jul 24, 2015)

I think realisitically if Gil wants to actually take it seriously there's no reason he should lose


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## Sablés (Jul 24, 2015)

What's stopping Vlad from spear chucking Gil's insides again?


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## manidk (Jul 24, 2015)

Doesn't he have to actually pierce the skin first to attack from the inside?


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

He has to tag you first, then he can execute the conceptual "my np isn't impaling you, it's the concept of impaling itself" effect, yeah.

It's like marking someone for execution, so to speak.

Dunno about piercing the skin first since he tagged karna once or twice then laid him the fuck out using Kazikli despite Kavacha and Kundala


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## MAPSK (Jul 24, 2015)

>implying Gilgamesh would ever let such a filthy mongrel touch him to begin with


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

>Implying Gil wouldn't just stand there hurling weapons like he does in 98% of his fights

Check your gil boner at the door


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## manidk (Jul 24, 2015)

MAPSK said:


> >implying Gilgamesh would ever let such a filthy mongrel touch him to begin with



He'll "let" Vlad just like he "let" Shirou... And Archer... And Saber... And Sakura...


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

>Implying Gil needs to do more than that to win against Vlad

Well, that and deciding to use point blank GoB.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

What is Vlad can spam stakes just as hard for 500 alex


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

Don't his stakes pop out of the ground? While Gil could literally surround his head with swords centimetres away if not for idiocy?


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

they can be summoned out of other stakes and he can use them as a shield as well



> KAZIKLI BEY Description:
> He can easily have himself or his mount walk atop them without difficulty, and used for defense, he can accurately have them sprout in front of him to block projectiles like protective walls.


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## Sablés (Jul 24, 2015)

If Vlad needs to tag, can't he just spam stakes like a centimer's distance from GIl and omni-directionally? Unless Gil's suddenly cautious and fast enough to use Vimana and get out of range, he's fucked. Kazikli Bei is a better counter to GoB than UBW.


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

Liquid said:


> can't he just spam stakes like a centimer's distance from GIl and omni-directionally?



Can't Gil do _literally the same thing_ but better due to GoB being able to come from above and being Noble Phantasms instead of romanian stakes?


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## MAPSK (Jul 24, 2015)

Gil can somehow block Tsubame Gaeshi and his armor no-sells Excalibur except at point-blank range. I think you're underestimating just how much arrogance and the plot tends to hinder him 

Plus, all those times you mentioned were special cases. Shirou was inside UBW, meaning his weapon creation speed was slightly faster than Gil could withdraw weapons (that and Gil was being a dumbass by fighting him in melee instead of using Ea or backing up and firing GoB spam fucking everywhere). And as far as I remember, Archer only ever hit Gil with that arrow to the head at the end of UBW (and it's pretty obvious why that shouldn't count as getting past Gil's defenses given the context). Saber had to use Avalon just to get close to him, and Sakura was full on Dark Sakura at that point and funneling the power of Angry Manjew, which hard-counters Servants. None of those guys would've been able to reach him otherwise (I mean if Herc can't touch Gil, who can?).

Dunno what KB's draw speed might be, but even if it can create stakes right underneath Gil's feat, GoB can do pretty much the same thing but better and stab him through the eye with about fifty divine weapons before Vlad even realizes just who he is fucking with.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

Herc can;t touch gil because his only gimmick is literally I come back from the dead if you kill me

And GOB perfectly counters that ability.

THat's like saying a cripple with only one leg can lose to a world class runner

On the Archer bit, Gil could have still used GOB to defend himself from Archer's shot and didn't, so...yeah.

Kazikli bey can summon around 500 stakes in 3 seconds, that's around 100 odd stakes per second. I'm pretty sure he can keep up in the spam factor just fine with Gil when it comes to the lower ranks of stuff he chucks at people.


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## MAPSK (Jul 24, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> Herc can;t touch gil because his only gimmick is literally I come back from the dead if you kill me
> 
> And GOB perfectly counters that ability.
> 
> THat's like saying a cripple with only one leg can lose to a world class runner



You forgot to append "I am a goddamn terminator who will keep charging at you until you turn me into a literal swordspam pincushion because I have an ability that keeps me from dying unless you kill me _super-dead_, and _then_ I come back from the dead if you kill me"

Seriously, you're making Herc seem a lot less difficult to kill than he _actually_ is.


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> On the Archer bit, Gil could have still used GOB to defend himself from Archer's shot and didn't, so...yeah.



Wasn't Archer hundreds of meters away, while Gil was having to deal with an ungrateful mongrel refusing to help him?


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## manidk (Jul 24, 2015)

Enkidu was also an extremely hard counter to Herc.

Situational weaknesses go both ways.


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## Sablés (Jul 24, 2015)

BehemothV2 said:


> Can't Gil do _literally the same thing_ but better due to GoB being able to come from above and being Noble Phantasms instead of romanian stakes?



Wouldn't save Gil from getting skewered by hundreds of stakes, at best its a double K.O

Before you bring up the armor tanking Excalibur? Vlad's stake spam was giving Karna a shit-ton of difficulty and stats wise, he's in another world compared to Gilgamesh or Arturia. Doesn't help that it only covers his body leaving his head exposed, even if Gil could block from the front but he's screwed from behind.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

I'm making him sound easy to kill because the fight vs gil was a complete shitstomp

Also gr8 job on missing the overall point

Herc doesn't have a gimmick apart from ressurection and can't even use his Noble Phantasm due to not having the motor skills, hence the reason for the shitstomping.

Meanwhile gil can completely cockblock his main gimmick and killed him circa 40 times, only reason Herc survived being Battle Continuation+ Exerting the entire reserve of willpower he had left to try and attack one last time.

the comparison still stands


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## Qinglong (Jul 24, 2015)

Enkidu hard countered both Alexander and Herc during their last charges (although it's doubtful alexander would have accomplished anything meaningful in that charge)


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

Liquid said:


> Before you bring up the armor tanking Excalibur? Vlad's stake spam was giving Karna a shit-ton of difficulty and stats wise, he's in another world compared to Gilgamesh or Arturia. Doesn't help that it only covers his body leaving his head exposed, even if Gil could block from the front but he's screwed from behind.



Weren't those coming from INSIDE Karna?

Also, can't Gil summon shields n shit? Or is that exclusive to Prillya?


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

No

Karna had to resort to burning his already shit prana supply by popping mana burst to deal with around 2k stakes

and Vlad still managed to tag him three times


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## MusubiKazesaru (Jul 24, 2015)

Qinglong said:


> Enkidu hard countered both Alexander and Herc during their last charges (although it's doubtful alexander would have accomplished anything meaningful in that charge)



I'm sure his superior quality would've done something or other


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## shade0180 (Jul 24, 2015)

> Herc doesn't have a gimmick apart from ressurection and can't even use his Noble Phantasm due to not having the motor skills, hence the reason for the shitstomping.



Herc has a passive regen if you didn't kill him which also gives him immunity to what damaged him.. Which is a part of the effect of godhand..



> It provides three effects of resurrection, attack-nullification, *and the ability of "immunity against an attack he has experienced previously*
> 
> It also grants the effect of automatic regeneration,


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## Crimson Dragoon (Jul 24, 2015)

I'm pretty sure he already knows that


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

Shit got nerfed son

No longer inmunity

Just builds a shitload of resistance to what killed him



> Q: For Berserker's Noble Phantasm "God Hand," it says that he'll gain resistance to any attack he's been dealt, but does it require for him to "die" for this to happen? Would the same attack work multiple times so long as he doesn't die from it?
> 
> Nasu: There's no need for him to die. It's something like...for example, if he is damaged by flames, after his wounds heal he'd gain +100 fire resistance or so.
> Takeuchi: Hey, seems like it's been toned-down. Wouldn't it have rendered flames completely ineffective before?
> Nasu: I said it wouldn't work, not that it would become completely ineffective.


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## Byrd (Jul 24, 2015)

Outside of Gil and Herc, Fate/Stay servants are the weakest out of all the fates I think 

Granted Vlad and Sun boy are literally monsters

and I think someone told me Herc with his senses can stand up to Gil, don't know if thats true or not


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

He'd put up a much better fight with his Noble Phantasm and actually being able to use his other skills

Not sure on being able to stand up to him but if anything he wouldn't get completely and utterly shitstomped like before


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## shade0180 (Jul 24, 2015)

> Just builds a shitload of resistance to what killed him



Resistance is only in effect if the attack didn't kill him. if the attack did kill him he would be immune to it..



> Every time he is harmed by an attack, regardless if it leads to death or not, he will gain resistance after he heals. In the case of being damaged by flames, he would gain around "+100 fire resistance" after healing. Rather than rendering them "completely ineffective", it makes subsequent attacks almost useless against him.[18][8] No matter the power of the Noble Phantasm used to kill him, it will be nullified after he resurrects, so even the greatest attack will not be effective on him twice and will require different methods to take each subsequent life.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

shade0180 said:


> Resistance is only in effect if the attack didn't kill him. if the attack did kill him he would be immune to it..





> Nasu: There's no need for him to die. It's something like...for example, if he is damaged by flames, after his wounds heal he'd gain +100 fire resistance or so.



>There's no need for him to die
>+100 Fire resistance



> Takeuchi: Hey, seems like it's been toned-down. Wouldn't it have rendered flames completely ineffective before?
> Nasu: I said it wouldn't work, not that it would become completely ineffective.


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## Sablés (Jul 24, 2015)

Byrd said:


> Outside of Gil and Herc, Fate/Stay servants are the weakest out of all the fates I think



>Cu Arturia Medusa

Nope


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## BreakFlame (Jul 24, 2015)

Liquid said:


> >Cu Arturia Medusa
> 
> Nope



Cu is Lancer and therefore screwed.

The other two get nerfed to hell because plot.


Honestly, we need another spinoff with the Fate servants shown at their full potential.


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## Byrd (Jul 24, 2015)

Forgot about Rider not being gimped

Still tho thats only three 

and Saber with Avalon too

They sho aint beating Fate/Extra CCC or Extra

not when you have orignal Gil or Tamamo


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

No one cares about CCC tho


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## shade0180 (Jul 24, 2015)

^that


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

Medea can make amulets that amp commoners into servant strength, and has Age of Gods beam that would be good if not for the grail being a dick to Casters and giving Magic Resistance to 4 of the classes

Kojiro can imitate second magic with nothing but pure skill.

Really only Hassan and Avenger are shitty servants.


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## manidk (Jul 24, 2015)

Byrd said:


> They sho aint beating Fate/Extra CCC or Extra



Think about what an absolute monster Nero could be without headaches and if used to her full potential.

I'm talking like Revelations shit.


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## Byrd (Jul 24, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> No one cares about CCC tho



That is true


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## Byrd (Jul 24, 2015)

manidk said:


> Think about what an absolute monster Nero could be without headaches and if used to her full potential.
> 
> I'm talking like Revelations shit.



Naw she would be reality warping


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## Sablés (Jul 24, 2015)

Stay/night suffers because other series have a lot more than just 7 servants.

The quality is roughly equal with Apocrypha leading the pack


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## manidk (Jul 24, 2015)

Byrd said:


> Naw she would be reality warping



Completely disregarding the fact that she can pretty much give herself Divinity, among other things.

Her(well, the real Nero's) ties to the Beast of Revelations would be some dope shit to explore.  I'm honestly surprised that hasn't been covered yet, what with all of Fate's other weird bullshit.


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## Byrd (Jul 24, 2015)

its been confirmed that not even Arcueid can beat Tamamo in her origin form so take that as you will


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 24, 2015)

Nero being summonable as Rider, under the identity of the Whore of Babylon


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

That's not tamamo tho

That's Amaterasu in the flesh

Tamamo's a knockoff of a Knockoff and literally a "You're better off commiting suicide than going into the war with this dumb bitch" servant

On top of that, Amaterasu's shit is due to the power of the internet or some dumb shit like that so it's not the norm


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## Sablés (Jul 24, 2015)

I thought True Ancestors > Divine Spirits

Or was that just a generalization?


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## Qinglong (Jul 24, 2015)

Liquid said:


> I thought True Ancestors > Divine Spirits
> 
> Or was that just a generalization?



I have no clue where you're going with this but yes, True Ancestors are generally > Divine Spirits


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## MAPSK (Jul 24, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> That's not tamamo tho
> 
> That's Amaterasu in the flesh
> 
> ...



>insulting for reals the best Servant ever as well as the Nasuverse's literal god-tier waifu


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## Qinglong (Jul 24, 2015)

Except she is literally shit


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

>Tamamo
>Best servant
>Literally a 6 on a scale of 100

I could summon a Lancer and have more chances of winning a fucking Grail war than with that useless sack of shit

I could fucking summon the vagrant living under the bridge near my apartment and he'd have a better shot at winning

Ur waifu is shit


SHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIT


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## shade0180 (Jul 24, 2015)

lolmapsk.. seriously what's good about Tamamo? 

She's literally a fanservice for people with furry fetish.. which is 90% prominent in japan or some shit...


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## Byrd (Jul 24, 2015)

Not to mention how broken Caster from Extra was...


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## manidk (Jul 24, 2015)

MAPSK said:


> >insulting for reals the best Servant ever as well as the Nasuverse's literal god-tier waifu



It's like you've thrown away the veil and are now shitposting like you've always truly wanted to.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Jul 24, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> I could fucking summon the vagrant living under the bridge near my apartment and he'd have a better shot at winning



Plat's servant 



shade0180 said:


> lolmapsk.. seriously what's good about Tamamo?
> 
> She's literally a fanservice for people with furry fetish.. which is 90% prominent in japan or some shit...



MAPSK likes MGQ so...


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## MAPSK (Jul 24, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> >Tamamo
> >Best servant
> >Literally a 6 on a scale of 100
> 
> ...



Clearly the result of having a shitty Master instead of her being a shitty Servant. The power of love is stronger than Gilgamesh, it's WoG confirmed


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## Qinglong (Jul 24, 2015)

>Wog is the one who confirmed she's 9% of an A rank servant
>you literally have better chances of winning with a lancer Servant than that


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

>Xavier
>Shit
>Gilgamesh acknowledges him/her as "Master"

Shitpost and defend your shitty furry waifu harder

It's WOG confirmed that she's the shittiest servant so


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## Crimson Dragoon (Jul 24, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> Shitpost and defend your shitty furry waifu harder



by this, he means stop posting


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## MAPSK (Jul 24, 2015)

manidk said:


> It's like you've thrown away the veil and are now shitposting like you've always truly wanted to.



It's not shitposting when these heathens deserve it 

Clearly though, I've spent too much time in this thread already. The outcome is already more or less decided (a.k.a Gilgamesh wins like he always does because WoG says he would literally destroy any other Servant if he fought remotely seriously), so now all that's left is to shit-talk about each other's tastes in waifus.

All we need now is Freddy and Kurou


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 24, 2015)

Except

you know

that's not the outcome of this thread at all

^ (use bro) are just blinded by Gil's powerlevel to even remotely consider the fact that he can ever lose ever.


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## Sablés (Jul 25, 2015)

> because WoG says he would literally destroy any other Servant if he fought remotely seriously



90% sure this only applies to regular servants


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 25, 2015)

Against Gil, wouldn't Karna and Achilles get fucked by Enkidu, the Sabers get fucked because they're shit?

Mordred only has Clarent, Sieg is a watered down Herc.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 25, 2015)

you mean the enkidu gil won't bust out until he's in danger of getting facepunched?

When Karna's first move against Jeanne was to almost throw a Nuclear Spear at her face?

>Apocrypha Sabers
>Shit
>One is a combination of Lancelot's Stat hiding and berserker fighting style with Arturia's Mana Burst on top of having an excalibur

>The other is a watered down Herc with an AOE Excalibur that has his defense boosted when fighting true heroes and can go toe to toe with Karna in a melee duel

Totes shit


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## Byrd (Jul 25, 2015)

> a.k.a Gilgamesh wins like he always does because WoG says he would literally destroy any other Servant if he fought remotely seriously



If only Nastu actually believes this 

Aye Rob, How would Caster with all her BS fair against F/S?


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 25, 2015)

Shit compared to Gil

He turned Herc into a pincushion, can do the same to Sieg
What does Lancelot stat hiding help with? And watered down Excaliburs won't be doing any good considering the real thing didn't get through him.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 25, 2015)

The real thing didn't get through him

Except when you know

It bifurcated the shit out of him


From a Saber with Stats weaker than most Apocrypha Servants

And a reflected Gram/Merodach melted his armor and wounded him

Balmung= Gram

If sieg hits him he's going to fucking feel that shit


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## Raidou Kuzunoha (Jul 25, 2015)

BehemothV2 said:


> Shit compared to Gil
> 
> *He turned Herc into a pincushion, can do the same to Sieg*
> What does Lancelot stat hiding help with? And watered down Excaliburs won't be doing any good considering the real thing didn't get through him.





I've seen some stupid shit before, but holy god man, you aren't even trying


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 25, 2015)

What exactly would prevent him from turning Sieg into a pincushion? The damage reduction? Yeah, that's great and all. Not that good against Noble Phantasms raining from every side.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 25, 2015)

Lancelot with Mad Enhancements was grabbing and deflecting his weapons from the GOB

Sieg shits on him in terms of swordsmanship

He can literally go toe to toe with Karna in a melee duel

He could most likely deflect GOB fire using just his greatsword


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 25, 2015)

Where exactly is it ever indicated that Sieg > Lancelot in terms of swordsmanship? Lancelot has Eternal Arms Mastership meaning ME does jack shit to his skill, and Knight of Honor only exists because he managed to beat an armed knight while using a stick as his weapon.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 25, 2015)

The fact that Sieg's swordsmanship is specifically noted to have transcended the realm of humans?

And the fact that he can have a melee duel with Karna who is also >>>>>>Lancelot in Skill?


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## BehemothV2 (Jul 25, 2015)

Didn't Siegfriend at one point in Apocrypha have an ~even duel with Mordred? Who is <<<<<<<<Lancelot?
Sieg also has less Agility than Lancelot, and Gil could go for omnidirectional point blank GoB, which is what he SHOULD'VE done in SN/Zero but that'd cut the plot too short.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 25, 2015)

That was fake sieg

and he was dominating her till Kairi reinforced her with a command seal


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## Sablés (Jul 25, 2015)

Lancelot would have been overwhelmed by 30 or more portals.  Tokiomi saved his ass
Sieg's CQC is more or less equal to Saber's.
Karna was decisively pushing Sieg's shit in and would have been full of holes if not for AoF and Gordes regenerating


Sieg is a beast but he's not taking Gate of Babylon any better than Saber or Herc would.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 25, 2015)

Pushing his shit in would have meant that Karna wouldn't have taken wounds like he did during their duel.

He's superior to Sieg in combat skill, but not by such a huge amount that it winds up making a huge difference

Also Sieg was taking damage on purpose to get closer to karna since he knew AoF would mitigate the damage, otherwise I'm 90% sure he would have fought a lot more carefully

on GOB: 

He would hold up a bit better than Saber/Herc due to the fact that any damage he'd take would have a pretty big reduction thanks to armor of fafnir's boost to B+ rank damage nullification/reduction when fighting true heroes.


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## Kurou (Jul 25, 2015)

Sieg and Karna go drinking

And by go drinking I mean they slaughter the shit out of errone while Jeanne cheers from the sidelines


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## OneSimpleAnime (Jul 25, 2015)

Do we apply any limit on how many portals Gil can summon at one time? like literally covering every inch of his opponents body with GoB from an inch away and skewering them 100 times. of course thats bloodlusted and CIS PIS off but yea he would stomp


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## Sablés (Jul 25, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> Pushing his shit in would have meant that Karna wouldn't have taken wounds like he did during their duel.
> 
> He's superior to Sieg in combat skill, but not by such a huge amount that it winds up making a huge difference
> 
> ...



Legit

But defending from GOB still wouldn't be that easy. Issue of skill and stats aside, Sieg's got a massive weak-point on his back. Omni-directional sword spam's kind of a big fuck off here.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Jul 25, 2015)

That I can recognize and accept without a care in the world

Though IIRC he does his best to keep it covered with Balmung's sheath and the cape attatched to it.

It's not much but it's something.


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## Kurou (Jul 25, 2015)

Jeanne's got his back and that's all that matters


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## Crimson Dragoon (Jul 25, 2015)

not according to the OP


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## Kurou (Jul 25, 2015)

The OP can eat a dick


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