# Kisame Hoshigake and Itachi Uchiha take on an OP Gaunlet



## TheMostReasonableDebater6 (Jun 21, 2014)

How far do they get?


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## Darth Niggatron (Jun 21, 2014)

Admirals.
That is all.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 21, 2014)

You mean: Admiral .


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## Iwandesu (Jun 21, 2014)

finally, finally. 
kisame has city level durability and dc on some of his water attacks. itachi with susanno has city level stats +genjutsu and amaterasu for distractions both might be scalled to mach 117 reaction speedsters. (at least itachi is damn safe)
they get to the top tiers (yonko and admiral) which buutfuck due to better dc, dura and speed (island level+ and mach 350)


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## MusubiKazesaru (Jun 21, 2014)

They stop at the admirals. Depending on the location Kisame could be a pain in the ass for a lot of characters


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 21, 2014)

MusubiKazesaru said:


> They stop at the admirals. Depending on the location Kisame could be a pain in the ass for a lot of characters



Not to any Top Tier .


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## MusubiKazesaru (Jun 21, 2014)

Mr. Black Leg said:


> Not to any Top Tier .



Some people have been calling Sabo "top tier" (I don't agree) and I can't see Kisame losing against him. But he's no match for the obvious top tier characters


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 21, 2014)

I don't agree that Sabo is a Top Tier but I can totally see him killing Kisame . Sabo is MHS, and Casual small City level, he can launch enough attacks to kill Kisame before Kisame brings water enough to kill him .

But that's my opinion, and no Sabo =/= Top Tier .


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## Dr. White (Jun 21, 2014)

I love OP and all(way more than Naruto) but they don't really have any illusion resistance feats IIRC. Tsukuyomi/Koto = GG, along with a psuedo Bjuu at his side? 

We need knowledge, distance, mindset, location, and restrictions of applicable. At 10M with no knowledge, Whitebeards slams his fist and kills them, only to find out he is in a genjutsu and slammed his own chest, Tsukuyomi messes him up, and Ama finishes it off. Waterdome is also a bitch.

But at 100 M WB smashes.


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## blackguyinpinksuit (Jun 21, 2014)

What kind of gauntlet is this? Where are the rounds/waves and the fighters that participate in them? Or is this just fighting everyone in the verse weakest to strongest? Do they heal after every fight they get in? What kind of knowledge do the OP side have and vice versa? What is the distance they start at when the battle commences?


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## Chad (Jun 21, 2014)

With all the hype that BZ has been giving Itachi, I am not sure if the admirals can take on Itachi.


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## B Rabbit (Jun 21, 2014)

Sabo could be top tier, he's def not far below it.

Depends on vs Fujitora.


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## Chad (Jun 21, 2014)

I'm going to guess that the fight is going to be like Ace vs Smoker.

I just realized that Sabo is doing the exact same thing Ace did in Alabasta.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 21, 2014)

blackguyinpinksuit said:


> What kind of gauntlet is this? Where are the rounds/waves and the fighters that participate in them? Or is this just fighting everyone in the verse weakest to strongest? Do they heal after every fight they get in? What kind of knowledge do the OP side have and vice versa? What is the distance they start at when the battle commences?



You never saw a gauntlet with the whole verse ? The only thing it's lacking is the heal part, but we can assume they start fresh every fight, mindset is bloodlust by default, 20 meters by default . 



Dr. White said:


> I love OP and all(way more than Naruto) but they don't really have any illusion resistance feats IIRC. Tsukuyomi/Koto = GG, along with a psuedo Bjuu at his side?
> 
> We need knowledge, distance, mindset, location, and restrictions of applicable. At 10M with no knowledge, Whitebeards slams his fist and kills them, only to find out he is in a genjutsu and slammed his own chest, Tsukuyomi messes him up, and Ama finishes it off. Waterdome is also a bitch.
> 
> But at 100 M WB smashes.




Do you understand that Admirals have speed, dc and durability superior ? Itachi is not even touching them .


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## Chad (Jun 21, 2014)

Yeah Admirals have superior stats, but you have to take into account Itachi's hax. Totsuka bypasses durability. Second, there is also the Itachi's true ocular powers of Itachi's Sharingan. 



Apparently Itachi's power to read people's souls is so hax that Kabuto poses Itachi as a greater threat to him than Edo Madara.



Stats are not always what wins battles.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 21, 2014)

No, but Itachi's durability is shit . He gets a generic magma fist, frozen, a hole through his head, and pined to the ground . 

First move is fundamental in this battle, and Itachi does not have first move .


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## blackguyinpinksuit (Jun 21, 2014)

Mr. Black Leg said:


> You never saw a gauntlet with the whole verse ? The only thing it's lacking is the heal part, but we can assume they start fresh every fight, mindset is bloodlust by default, 20 meters by default .



We can assume what the op meant but if the OP was perfect there would be no need. But if the Op deemed it unimportant i guess you can't make him have proper etiquette.


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## Iwandesu (Jun 21, 2014)

Astral said:


> Yeah Admirals have superior stats, but you have to take into account Itachi's hax. Totsuka bypasses durability. Second, there is also the Itachi's true ocular powers of Itachi's Sharingan.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Does totsuka really bypass durability?


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## MusubiKazesaru (Jun 21, 2014)

iwandesu said:


> Does totsuka really bypass durability?



No it doesn't, I believe on here we regard it as being around around the level of Susanoo in DC, thus it can't pierce anything stronger than that


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## B Rabbit (Jun 21, 2014)

Astral said:


> I'm going to guess that the fight is going to be like Ace vs Smoker.
> 
> I just realized that Sabo is doing the exact same thing Ace did in Alabasta.



You must not be that smart then


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## Lurko (Jun 21, 2014)

B Rabbit said:


> You must not be that smart then



Sabo will beat Fuji, calling it Ace will be avenged and shit will get real.


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## B Rabbit (Jun 21, 2014)

Sabo offpanel Fuji. :ignoramus


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## Lurko (Jun 22, 2014)

Hopefully I don't like Fuji.


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## B Rabbit (Jun 22, 2014)

Why?

I do, but Sabo is better imho.


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## Lurko (Jun 22, 2014)

Fuji just seems like a crappy version of Akainu to me, I hope Sabo fists him.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 22, 2014)

I prefer Fujitora a billion times over Sabo .


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## B Rabbit (Jun 22, 2014)

You mad?


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 22, 2014)

Why would I ? I just said I like him more, I like Sabo a lot . When chapter 744 was released I went crazy like a die hard fan girl, I just have the feeling on Sabo a billion times bigger on Fujitora .


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## Dellinger (Jun 22, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Fuji just seems like a crappy version of Akainu to me, I hope Sabo fists him.



They share nothing similar rofl.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 22, 2014)

^ Yeah, Fujitora is the anti-hero type of guy, Sakazuki is the villain type of guy . 

I like Sakazuki more though .


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## Lurko (Jun 22, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> They share nothing similar rofl.



They have the same type of look, same crooked justice fuck Fuji it's all about Akainu.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 22, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> They have the same type of look, *same crooked justice* fuck Fuji it's all about Akainu.



Are you kidding me ? Look at this: 



Now at this:




One thinks that saving/taking care of people is more important than arresting the criminal who did something bad . The other one literally killed inocents in the off chance of having one person who's  a criminal running away .


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## Dellinger (Jun 22, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> They have the same type of look, same crooked justice fuck Fuji it's all about Akainu.



They look completely different (they're based on different actors).

Also wait have you been reading OP?Akainu's justice is completely different to Fujitora's one.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 22, 2014)

Let's say that instead of sending Fujitora, Sakazuki would have gone to Dressrosa himself . He would have gone on rampage through the whole city the moment he set his eyes on Luffy .


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## ClandestineSchemer (Jun 22, 2014)

Astral said:


> I just realized that Sabo is doing the exact same thing Ace did in Alabasta.



I loved that Call Back.


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## Lurko (Jun 22, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> They look completely different (they're based on different actors).
> 
> Also wait have you been reading OP?Akainu's justice is completely different to Fujitora's one.



Yes I read one piece,  Akainu and Fuji look simalir to me and both are crooked while Akainu is worst I wouldn't be surprised if Fuji would be just as bad Akainu>>> Fuji.


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## FrozenFeathers (Jun 23, 2014)

So they fight together?

Assuming they fight together.
Don Krieg
Itachi kunais to the face.

Arlong
Itachi kunais to the face.

Crocodile
Itachi Amaterasus(Part 1 Sasuke's katon could melt rock, melting point 1500'C .Amaterasu is superior to katon, so temperature can be considered to be above 1700'C, melting point of sand)

Smoker/Ace/Magellan
Totsuka gg.

Enel
Itachi Totsukas. El Thor can break Susanoo though, Enel can actually beat Itachi if gets Maxim and starts spamming Raigu. And Kisame can just watch, can Daikodan absorb chakra from the Raigu?

Lucci
Itachi Amaterasus.

Perona
Itachi Tsukiomis/Totsukas. Amaterasu might not work.

OZ-Moria
Itachi Amaterasus.
Asgard Moria
Itachi Amaterasus.

Kuma
Let us assume Kuma can repel away Amaterasu flames, next -Totsuka,  Kuma  repelled away Perona who is intangible so I guess he can repel Totsuka too.
Kuma is faster than Luffy and equal to speed with Itachi, so he is not getting blitzed.
That is where Kiasme comes in. Kisame will distract while Itachi will Totsuka from the back.

I guess they stop at admirals who are too fast and too destructive.

It Kisame is alone then he loses to Enel.
If Itachi is alone he loses to Kuma.


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## Krippy (Jun 23, 2014)

Totsuka or Tsukuyomi takes out anyone in the verse


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## Iwandesu (Jun 23, 2014)

FrozenFeathers said:


> So they fight together?
> 
> Assuming they fight together.
> Don Krieg
> ...


Enel is too slow. Itachi and Kisame are 18 times faster
Also, Kisame can kill Kuma


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## Dellinger (Jun 23, 2014)

Kuma bfr both of them.He is a good deal faster.


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## Iwandesu (Jun 23, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> Kuma bfr both of them.He is a good deal faster.


Itachi's speed is mach 117
Kisame is at least mach 70+
I'm pretty sure Kuma can't dodge a city level attack of big AOE like Kisame's while trying to approach him with only a decent advantage like the one he has (I would say 3/10 Kuma)
The 2 of them are overkill.


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## Dellinger (Jun 24, 2014)

iwandesu said:


> Itachi's speed is mach 117
> Kisame is at least mach 70+
> I'm pretty sure Kuma can't dodge a city level attack of big AOE like Kisame's while trying to approach him with only a decent advantage like the one he has (I would say 3/10 Kuma)
> The 2 of them are overkill.



We're talking about a guy who can travel pretty huge distances without a freaking problems.All he needs is a touch and he can do that easily.


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## Iwandesu (Jun 24, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> We're talking about a guy who can travel pretty huge distances without a freaking problems.All he needs is a touch and he can do that easily.


And they can react to attacks which travel pretty Huge distances on casual basis.
The difference is too small for a blitz , Itachi needs to move a finger , Kisame needs to push his hand
Kuma needs to cross the distance between them.


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## Kenpachi TZ (Jun 24, 2014)

If bloodlusted, can't Kuma just push himself towards his enemies *then* BFR them?

Or have I misunderstood his powers?


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## Iwandesu (Jun 24, 2014)

Kenpachi TZ said:


> If bloodlusted, can't Kuma just push himself towards his enemies *then* BFR them?
> 
> Or have I misunderstood his powers?


He has a pseudo teleport thing iirc.
5/10 Kuma (if he start with Kisame he pretty much solos, if not, water colloseum gg)


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## MusubiKazesaru (Jun 24, 2014)

Kenpachi TZ said:


> If bloodlusted, can't Kuma just push himself towards his enemies *then* BFR them?
> 
> Or have I misunderstood his powers?



I'm not sure if his BFR works all that well on character's with better durability


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jun 24, 2014)

Kuma does not have teleportation . He repels himself in a really enormous speed .


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## Kenpachi TZ (Jun 24, 2014)

Anybody calc the push speed? Because I imagine its a pretty effective way to keep up with, or even blitz, people who are otherwise attack/move some degree quicker than Kuma. 

But first, since I don't know OP that well, is there any reason he can't use his ability on himself? 

I'll be the first to admit I'm ignorant as shit about physics, but why should it fail against superior durability? There are numerous instances of characters tanking an attack, but still getting thrown back by its force. Thus, my intuition tells me Kuma's ability bypasses durability so its limiting factor is the weight of the object he's pushing and the target's ability to physically brace themselves.

Of course, I know I could be wrong and I'm open to having someone explain the physics as to why in words I can understand.


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## Kenpachi TZ (Jun 25, 2014)

Bump! Somebody answer meh!


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## Iwandesu (Jun 25, 2014)

Kenpachi TZ said:


> Bump! Somebody answer meh!


He can use the ability at himself to perform a pseudo-teleport (similar to shunshin no jutsu) not an actual teleport
It is pretty useful against slower enemies but anyone with a decent speed gap or prec with a slightly better speed can make up.
He does bypass durability, Kisame is fucked if Kuma choose to teleport near to him.


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## Byrd (Jun 30, 2014)

> He can use the ability at himself to perform a pseudo-teleport (similar to shunshin no jutsu) not an actual teleport
> It is pretty useful against slower enemies but anyone with a decent speed gap or prec with a slightly better speed can make up.
> He does bypass durability, Kisame is fucked if Kuma choose to teleport near to him.



You clearly don't know what you are talking about... Kuma doesn't teleport... he repels himself at insane speeds... He is able to both repel himself as well as others and even repel intag and even retarded shit like pain..

Its purely speed nothing to do with teleportation... he gets scaled to the highest OP speed calc base off he is able to cross distances (thousands and thousands of KM in seconds apparently)


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## Iwandesu (Jun 30, 2014)

Byrd said:


> You clearly don't know what you are talking about... Kuma doesn't teleport... he repels himself at insane speeds... He is able to both repel himself as well as others and even repel intag and even retarded shit like pain..
> 
> *Its purely speed nothing to do with teleportation... *he gets scaled to the highest OP speed calc base off he is able to cross distances (thousands and thousands of KM in seconds apparently)


So is sunshin no jutsu...
So is any *pseudo*-teleport.


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## Dellinger (Jun 30, 2014)

What is pseudo-teleport anyway?


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## Kenpachi TZ (Jun 30, 2014)

If I had to guess... it's when you move from one place to another virtually instantly minus the space-time fuckery.


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## Vicotex (Jun 30, 2014)

Both tech re different


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## Iwandesu (Jun 30, 2014)

Kenpachi TZ said:


> If I had to guess... it's when you move from one place to another virtually instantly minus the space-time fuckery.





White Hawk said:


> What is pseudo-teleport anyway?


Pseudo=fake
You move in a way that seems you are telporting but you aren't.
I'm honestly not even sure if Kisame can't still just react like he would to any other kind of dash


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## Alita (Jun 30, 2014)

They make it up to top tiers at the least.


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## Byrd (Jun 30, 2014)

iwandesu said:


> So is sunshin no jutsu...
> So is any *pseudo*-teleport.



There is no such thing as pseudo teleportation... Kuma powers allows him to repel at incredible fast speeds... that is all... you sound retarded calling it that


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## Chad (Jun 30, 2014)

I see so many bad posts.


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## Dellinger (Jun 30, 2014)

Alita54 said:


> They make it up to top tiers at the least.



Doflamingo would wreck them.

And I don't see how they get past Law.


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## Lurko (Jun 30, 2014)

Lol Don soloing Kisame and Itachi?  You must be in Itachi's genjustu.


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## Chad (Jun 30, 2014)

This is the part where Flutter would say Itachi solos


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## Iwandesu (Jun 30, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> Doflamingo would wreck them.
> 
> And I don't see how they get past Law.


Don doesn't ignores durability AFAIC
Kisame is city+ at both , has regeneration and can absorb energy to an extent he only lost to guy due to his attacks being physical. (Granted, with his best attack )
Itachi susanoo is city+ too, can soul fuck if he pierce and apply genjutsu which Don can't afford.
Law has chance, but mainly due to his hax added with decent speed advantage


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## Lurko (Jun 30, 2014)

Because that's the truth, Itachi points finger gg don't fuck with Itachi.


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## Byrd (Jun 30, 2014)

They stop at high tiers


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## ZenithXAbyss (Jun 30, 2014)

iwandesu said:


> Don doesn't ignores durability AFAIC
> Kisame is city+ at both , has regeneration and can absorb energy to an extent he only lost to guy due to his attacks being physical. (Granted, with his best attack )


Iirc, it was pegged at triple digit kt's.





> *Itachi susanoo is city+ too*, can soul fuck if he pierce and apply genjutsu which Don can't afford.
> Law has chance, but mainly due to his hax added with decent speed advantage


You must be confusing susano'o to yata mirror.
And no, both are not City+ eitherway.


OT:
Stops at High tier.


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## Dellinger (Jun 30, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Because that's the truth, Itachi points finger gg don't fuck with Itachi.



You mean Doflamingo lifts a finger and Kisame with Itachi become useless.


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## ZenithXAbyss (Jun 30, 2014)

ITT: dofy selling Shark and ^ (not the meaning of the word "respect".) BBQ.


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## Byrd (Jun 30, 2014)

Dof just use his parasite ability on itachi and there goes teamwork... his clone could keep Kisame busy for a while


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## Lurko (Jun 30, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> You mean Doflamingo lifts a finger and Kisame with Itachi become useless.



Lol Itachi wastes that faq like he's a piece of shit, Kisame maybe but Itachi hell no.


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## Dellinger (Jun 30, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Lol Itachi wastes that faq like he's a piece of shit, Kisame maybe but Itachi hell no.



Itachi can't do shit when Doffy has controlled guys who crap on Itachi when it comes to physical strength.


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## B Rabbit (Jun 30, 2014)

Pretty much.


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## Byrd (Jun 30, 2014)

basically Doff can probably control any high-tier in HST with his ability


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## Chad (Jun 30, 2014)

Kisame can still create Oceans even under parasite.


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## Lurko (Jun 30, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> Itachi can't do shit when Doffy has controlled guys who crap on Itachi when it comes to physical strength.



Dosen't Don have to make physical contact with the king in order to do that and if so link?


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## Dellinger (Jun 30, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Dosen't Don have to make physical contact with the king in order to do that and if so link?



What?Doflamingo can parasite others from being kilometers away.


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## Dellinger (Jun 30, 2014)

Astral said:


> Kisame can still create Oceans even under parasite.



Doffy can fly you know


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## Chad (Jun 30, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> Doffy can fly you know



What happens when there aren't any clouds?


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## Dellinger (Jun 30, 2014)

What makes you think there won't be any clouds?


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## Chad (Jun 30, 2014)

I'm just stating a possible scenario.

If there aren't any clouds, even Sakura has chances of beating Dofla.


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## Dellinger (Jun 30, 2014)

Astral said:


> I'm just stating a possible scenario.
> 
> If there aren't any clouds, even Sakura has chances of beating Dofla.



What     ?


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## Chad (Jun 30, 2014)

Without his DF powers, he would have to rely on physical strength. Sakura with Byakgou should get scaled to Kisame's durability, which is City level.


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## LineageCold (Jul 1, 2014)

Itachi & kisame our being heavily underestimated , especially there team work .


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## Source (Jul 1, 2014)

Quad digit Luffy solos.


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## ShadowReaper (Jul 1, 2014)

So what is full Susano's scaling? Is it mountain level like Madara's or just city level?
And is Naruto's high tiers+ still at 143+ mach for speed and reaction?


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## MusubiKazesaru (Jul 1, 2014)

ShadowReaper said:


> So what is full Susano's scaling? Is it mountain level like Madara's or just city level?
> And is Naruto's high tiers+ still at 143+ mach for speed and reaction?



faster high tiers are mach 110+ and top tiers are 143+

There's too big of a gap between top and god tiers, we need a new speed calc


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## Source (Jul 1, 2014)

Mach 143 was debunked, what was Mach 110 for again?


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## MusubiKazesaru (Jul 1, 2014)

Source said:


> Mach 143 was debunked, what was Mach 110 for again?



They aren't even accepting the calc with CFRS calc with 30 seconds now? Why's everyone trying to make Naruto slow? 

I don't remember offhand


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## Source (Jul 1, 2014)

Mach 143 is for prime Kyuubi's BD.


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## Iwandesu (Jul 1, 2014)

Source said:


> Mach 143 is for prime Kyuubi's BD.


juubi v1 beam is the one with mach 140-160 and the one we use
Kyuubi's was mach 114-140
CFRS is up with mach 117 using 1 minute as absolute lower end.


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## MusubiKazesaru (Jul 1, 2014)

iwandesu said:


> juubi v1 beam is the one with mach 140-160 and the one we use
> Kyuubi's was mach 114-140
> CFRS is up with mach 117 using 1 minute as absolute lower end.



I'm not even sure how that could've possibly been as long as one minute, but I guess it's hard to judge the time frame


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## Source (Jul 1, 2014)

iwandesu said:


> juubi v1 beam is the one with mach 140-160 and the one we use
> Kyuubi's was mach 114-140
> CFRS is up with mach 117 using 1 minute as absolute lower end.



Juubi's beam should be a bit higher than that with the larger crater sizes that have been scaled (unless if the first Naruto+Bee crater has been debunked as well, as that is what the beam speed depends on), but it doesn't apply to any top tier anyway.

The Kyuubi's BD has only one result (Mach 143) aside from a low end outlier if I recall correctly but that's been debunked.

Not gonna touch the COFRS.


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## LineageCold (Jul 1, 2014)

Not bringing this up to justify the COFRS (but I kind of am  ) but after looking at the previous old threads & blog comments .


The first COFRS time frame of 9-10 secs were comfortable accepted by a good majority of the cancerdome members (after reading through some blog's comments & Vs threads) but a week later, somebody suggested a 12- 15 sec timeframe, then a month later after that a few aruged a 20 second timeframe for a safer low end, and then a little while after that it shot up to 25-30 secs, but now I'm seeing people using a "whole minute" timeframe (not that there's a problem with it being a minute timeframe) 


But the main point I'm bringing up is , i "really" don't see no problem with using 15- 20 secs (probably 20 secs for a low end) rather than the absurd out of the park "absolute Low end" . because originally a few members comfortably accepted a "10 second" timeframe without much problems .(although some agured about the angles iirc)

Also i absolutely doubt it would of took that long simply just by looking at the panels (or the conversation if necessary) & the events that were taken place. Its kind of ridiculous for it to tooken a "whole minute" , I agree with low ends but not ridiculous ones.


*Off-Topic*

*Spoiler*: __ 



Damn, I hardly post here anymore , This Wii u taken up my time after work.

Also, anybody here got a Wii u , if so hit me up


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## Dellinger (Jul 1, 2014)

Oh yeah,I forgot that Luffy is quad digits now.

He murders them


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jul 1, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> Oh yeah,I forgot that Luffy is quad digits now.
> 
> He murders them



Is this legit ? 4 digit mach OP ? 

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK LOVE YOU FUJITORA !


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## ZenithXAbyss (Jul 1, 2014)

LineageCold said:


> Not bringing this up to justify the COFRS (but I kind of am  ) but after looking at the previous old threads & blog comments .
> 
> 
> The first COFRS time frame of 9-10 secs were comfortable accepted by a good majority of the cancerdome members (after reading through some blog's comments & Vs threads) but a week later, somebody suggested a 12- 15 sec timeframe, then a month later after that a few aruged a 20 second timeframe for a safer low end, and then a little while after that it shot up to 25-30 secs, but now I'm seeing people using a "whole minute" timeframe (not that there's a problem with it being a minute timeframe)
> ...



"cancerdome members"
Should have stopped there.

Also, lolsakura being scaled to anything relevant.


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## Lurko (Jul 1, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> What?Doflamingo can parasite others from being kilometers away.



Scans?  That's all I need.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jul 1, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Scans?  That's all I need.








He's controling people all across Dressrosa . Dressrosa is kilometers long .

He's using Birdcage but why he wouldn't be able to use in this situation .



Astral said:


> I'm just stating a possible scenario.
> 
> If there aren't any clouds, even Sakura has chances of beating Dofla.



He does not need clouds to kill Sakura . To kill Sakura he needs Parasite and maybe Marionette  .


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## ZenithXAbyss (Jul 1, 2014)

To kill sakura, dofla needs to flick his wrist.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jul 1, 2014)

ZenithXAbyss said:


> To kill sakura, dofla needs to move his fingers.



Fixed for accuracy .


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## Lurko (Jul 1, 2014)

Mr. Black Leg said:


> He's controling people all across Dressrosa . Dressrosa is kilometers long .
> 
> He's using Birdcage but why he wouldn't be able to use in this situation .
> 
> ...



Didn't that require prep?


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## 1Person (Jul 1, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Didn't that require prep?



He had his string clone disperse and form bird cage.


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## ZenithXAbyss (Jul 1, 2014)

Just Why does doflamingo need to use birdcage to sodomize these two?
He has two hands.


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## Lurko (Jul 1, 2014)

1Person said:


> He had his string clone disperse and form bird cage.



That didn't take a lot of time?


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## Dellinger (Jul 1, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Scans?  That's all I need.


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## Byrd (Jul 1, 2014)

Astral said:


> I'm just stating a possible scenario.
> 
> If there aren't any clouds, even Sakura has chances of beating Dofla.



This is literally the dumbest comment in this thread


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## LazyWaka (Jul 1, 2014)

Don't really feel like reading the last few pages. So what's this nonsense I'm hearing about Sakura somehow competing with dofla?


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## Dellinger (Jul 1, 2014)

LazyWaka said:


> Don't really feel like reading the last few pages. So what's this nonsense I'm hearing about Sakura somehow competing with dofla?



It is just Astral hating on Doffy again


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## Chad (Jul 1, 2014)

She has superior durability.


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## Lurko (Jul 1, 2014)

Sakura can't do shit to Don.


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## Dellinger (Jul 1, 2014)

Astral said:


> She has superior durability.



Since when?


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## ZenithXAbyss (Jul 1, 2014)

it's sad when even FOL knows what's up, astral.


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## Chad (Jul 2, 2014)

Zenath don't insult Lurker, he's a good poster. 



White Hawk said:


> Since when?



Sakura should be at least as durable as a weakened Kisame, who tanked Hirudora. The most recent chapters even show that Hirudora can extend to about ~60 km.


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## Sablés (Jul 2, 2014)

Based on  ?


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## Dr. White (Jul 2, 2014)

Astral said:


> Zenath don't insult Lurker, he's a good poster.
> 
> 
> 
> Sakura should be at least as durable as a weakened Kisame, who tanked Hirudora. The most recent chapters even show that Hirudora can extend to about ~60 km.



Kisame "tanked" a non killing intent AT that clashed through Great Water Shark Bullet which matched it in size.


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## Iwandesu (Jul 2, 2014)

Dr. White said:


> Kisame "tanked" a* non killing intent AT* that clashed through *Great Water Shark Bullet* which matched it in size.


Bs cuz the one he tanked was the one calculated to city+
>Which is purely chakra without mass and within the solely proposity of negating/absorbing chakra based attacks


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## Lurko (Jul 2, 2014)

ZenithXAbyss said:


> it's sad when even FOL knows what's up, astral.



Same thing for you but worse.


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## ZenithXAbyss (Jul 2, 2014)

^hahaha, no.

@astral
Orly?


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## Sherlōck (Jul 2, 2014)

Astral said:


> Zenath don't insult *Lurker, he's a good poster. *
> 
> *Sakura should be at least as durable as a weakened Kisame*, who tanked Hirudora. The most recent chapters even show that Hirudora can extend to about ~60 km.



And Barak Obama is white.Hillary Clinton is black.


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## Darth Niggatron (Jul 2, 2014)

And Jennifer Lopez is my bitch.


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## LazyWaka (Jul 2, 2014)

Astral said:


> Sakura should be at least as durable as a weakened Kisame, who tanked Hirudora. The most recent chapters even show that Hirudora can extend to about ~60 km.



First off, Hirudora is 15-20km at most.

Second, How was Kisame weakened when he took that? Was it because he didn't have Samahada?

Third, how the fuck does Sakura get scaled to Kisame?


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jul 2, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Didn't that require prep?



Seconds level of prep . Clone > Birdcage > Control .

It happens really fast . Not a kind of prep that he cannot do while fighting . Au contraire he makes the clone, Oda knows how, and while he's fighting the clone does the birdcage .


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## Lurko (Jul 2, 2014)

Hmm is that new calc legit?


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## LazyWaka (Jul 2, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Hmm is that new calc legit?



Which one?


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## Lurko (Jul 2, 2014)

The Fuji one.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jul 2, 2014)

Which one ? Speed or DC ?


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## Lurko (Jul 2, 2014)

Speed one.


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## xlab3000 (Jul 2, 2014)

Don't they get blitzed by a Mach 441+ G2 Luffy?


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## Dr. White (Jul 2, 2014)

iwandesu said:


> Bs cuz the one he tanked was the one calculated to city+
> >Which is purely chakra without mass and within the solely proposity of negating/absorbing chakra based attacks



Ok? Gai specifically wasn't trying to kill him, to think he used weaker versions in the war is ridiculous. His AT vs Madara (Juubi Jin) was huge enough to partially damage a tree root so it could as well be a high end instance.

Anywho, no now you are wrong. Daikodan is also a physical move, the whole point of it is to absorb the opponents ace and strengthen Daikodan. Regardless it's still a mass of chakra, which no doubt is going to buffer the hit Kisame took. It's essentially the same situation as if Mei got one of her huge Water Dragons to meet AT smack dab in the middle of the two.

Daikodan couldn't absorb AT because it wasn't chakra but it was still a huge mass of water taking force, impact, heat, etc from AT which in its absence would have gotten to Kisame for more damage.


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## Iwandesu (Jul 2, 2014)

xlab3000 said:


> *Don't they get blitzed by a Mach 441+ G2 Luffy?*


Nope for 2 reasons
>GT luffy is no more mach 441+ by a while (got downgraded to 1xx+) but is still 350+ from dofla string.
You need mach 1400 to speedblitz Kisame right from the beginning. And 2340 to do the same with Itachi.


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## Iwandesu (Jul 2, 2014)

Dr. White said:


> Ok? Gai specifically wasn't trying to kill him, to think he used weaker versions in the war is ridiculous. His AT vs Madara (Juubi Jin) was huge enough to partially damage a tree root so it could as well be a high end instance.
> 
> Anywho, no now you are wrong. Daikodan is also a physical move, the whole point of it is to absorb the opponents ace and strengthen Daikodan. Regardless it's still a mass of chakra, which no doubt is going to buffer the hit Kisame took. It's essentially the same situation as if Mei got one of her huge Water Dragons to meet AT smack dab in the middle of the two.


He wasn't holding himself Hirudora is his best 7th Gate attack he was using that to stop Kisame.
Daikodan absorb chakra to gain power it might had a physical form but Hirudora passed through it like butter.mizukage dragon water wouldn't refrain the damage at all btw.
What you are arguing for is some unquantifiable bs that doesn't flow at all.


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## Dellinger (Jul 2, 2014)

iwandesu said:


> Nope for 2 reasons
> >GT luffy is no more mach 441+ by a while (got downgraded to 1xx+) but is still 350+ from dofla string.
> You need mach 1400 to speedblitz Kisame right from the beginning. And 2340 to do the same with Itachi.



Luffy is Mach 2000 now though


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## Iwandesu (Jul 2, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> Luffy is Mach 2000 now though



Calc and shitstorm link please.


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## Mr. Black Leg (Jul 2, 2014)

Still being debated though .


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## LazyWaka (Jul 2, 2014)

Mr. Black Leg said:


> Still being debated though .



I think most people are fine with the speed. The only thing being debated is what it does to Fuji's meteor DC calc.


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## xlab3000 (Jul 3, 2014)

Luffy mach 2000? That's too fast. He blitzes them anyway.


iwandesu said:


> Nope for 2 reasons
> >GT luffy is no more mach 441+ by a while (got downgraded to 1xx+) but is still 350+ from dofla string.
> You need mach 1400 to speedblitz Kisame right from the beginning. And 2340 to do the same with Itachi.



Mach 1400 and Mach 2340 to speedblitz Itachi and Kisame? lolwut? He is already way faster than them. I don't see why he can't blitz them from the start. Their reactions and speed are below his speed.


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## Iwandesu (Jul 3, 2014)

xlab3000 said:


> Luffy mach 2000? That's too fast. He blitzes them anyway.
> 
> 
> Mach 1400 and Mach 2340 to speedblitz Itachi and Kisame? lolwut? He is already way faster than them. I don't see why he can't blitz them from the start. Their reactions and speed are below his speed.


i honestly doesn't have the time for a full explanation.
you need to be 20 times faster to speedblitz from the starting distance of 20 meters right off the bait.
i will better explain when i wake up tomorrow


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## Vicotex (Jul 3, 2014)

No flutter, no nardo calc. Mssbd sucks these days w/o flutter tho.


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## Lurko (Jul 3, 2014)

Tell me about it!


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## Dellinger (Jul 3, 2014)

You mean no Flutter,no bullshit calcs.


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## ZenithXAbyss (Jul 3, 2014)

iwandesu said:


> i honestly doesn't have the time for a full explanation.
> you need to be 20 times faster to speedblitz from the starting distance of 20 meters right off the bait.
> i will better explain when i wake up tomorrow



That would only be the case if they both perceive the start of the match at the same time.
In short, no.


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## Piecesis (Jul 3, 2014)

Vicotex said:


> No flutter, no nardo calc. Mssbd sucks these days w/o flutter tho.



The thirst is real. lol


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## Lurko (Jul 3, 2014)

Piecesis said:


> The thirst is real. lol



The bs is real here.


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## Piecesis (Jul 3, 2014)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> The bs is real here.



Right, because it's bullshit your almighty god flutter isn't here to sate your calc thirst.


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## Iwandesu (Jul 3, 2014)

ZenithXAbyss said:


> That would only be the case if they both perceive the start of the match at the same time.
> In short, no.


Both are BL.
They want to kill the enemy.
The enemy is 20 meters ahead.
In short yes


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## Lurko (Jul 3, 2014)

Piecesis said:


> Right, because it's bullshit your almighty god flutter isn't here to sate your calc thirst.



Don't get Fluttered now.


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## Vicotex (Jul 3, 2014)

Dnt worry, he will soon be back


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## KaiserWombat (Jul 3, 2014)

Oh man

When the primary discussion in a vs thread is regarding the welfare and location of _*Fluttershy*_, I think that's the proverbial line of tolerance being thoroughly crossed and dashing straight into the horizon of oblivion

I mean, this wasn't exactly groundbreaking territory in terms of creativity or intrigue from the onset of its creation, but talk about your steep dives directly into oncoming traffic with this riveting discourse upon the merits of a single MIA poster...

(I do actually like Flutter, but this convo in regards to his opinion on matchups is absolute drivel)

Plus, 8 pages long and all that fun stuff. So, hey, giving this thread a bit of closure, as it were!


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