# Global Rules Discussion



## Reznor (May 1, 2018)

*Background:*
We've gone through various stages of globalization of rules on NF. Giving every section mod sovereignty has historically caused problems. Trying to hybrid solutions of parent forums having consider rules within them was tried and failed. 
These reasons and recent issues have caused globalization to be the direction we plan on going.

The following are tentative plans for new global rules:


> RULES OF CONDUCT
> Welcome to the Naruto Forums Global Rules, your one-stop destination for all the do's and don'ts of NF.
> _Some things to keep in mind_:
> 
> ...


*What is being proposed:*
We've have begun pushing for global modding. The intent is to reduce controversy and establish a consistent protocol in how rules are enforced, regardless of section. This streamlines the process of reacting to reports and complaints and takes a lot of personal proclivities out of the equation. 

*Goals: *
*Exceptions *
Exceptions to these rules should internal justification, not random ad hoc adjustments. 
For example, sexually explicit content isn't allowed in any public area. Bathhouse is an exception by merit of being a private section, rather than being an arbitrary exceptions.
Off-topic controversial issues aren't allowed. Cafe is an exception by merit of controversy conceivable being on topic.

*Consistency over dependence on preferences of current moderator:*
Rules should exist in such a way that global staff needn't feel excess differences in how to handle issues in other sections.
Although some subjectivity is needed, rules should be precise enough that the mod in power doesn't radically alter how rules are enforced in a section.​
The Cafe has received numerous complaints over not cracking down on trolling, followed by allegedly breaking rules with occasional baiting.
A few months ago the Readers Corner received a complaint for not banning/warning a user for insulting them. 
Before this there had been drama in the CB related to staff being too strict, or not strict at all.
These controversies are symptoms, most would agree, of a problem of confusion and inconsistency with respect to how rules are enforced. Users often get mixed messages on what is and isn't okay. 

*Proper modding of baiting/flaming/trolling: *
The Cafe is currently having issues with qualifies as baiting. Some would prefer that any opinion may be expressed, others would prefer action to be taken against users who use "political opinion" as a shield for expressing bigoted opinions. 

A majority of the staff is pushing towards this school of thought:

Off topic racism/sexism/etc will always be disallowed.
Whether or not it's derailing an NA thread about Ameratsu with "Sarada won't get MS since women are inferior" or it's derailing a Cafe thread about mail scams with "they feel for it because women are inferior", it's the same issue.
If it's not germane, it's spam. If it's not germane and it's intentionally inflammatory, it's bait and measures need to be taken against it regardless of how they disguise it.

The only exception that the Cafe should get here is that sexism/racism could potentially be on-topic. _(See "Exceptions")_
In that event, however, the rules need to be made in a such a way that they are clear, not purely subjective and have clear guidelines for the moderators to follow about what shouldn't be allowed.​*This thread:*

This is an open invitation to give feedback and suggest changes to the rules. 
Please not that this thread is not a complaint thread or an opportunity to share individual greivances so much as to provide constructive advice towards fixing those issues.

If you don't like that Mod X does/doesn't enforce flaming enough or that a member Y was banned or that troll Z wasn't, either address that issue in another thread or provide suggestions on rules that would make your desired outcome come about. This is not the place to ask us to remove Mod X, free member Y or ban troll Z, but a broader focus.

If you want to chuckle and make commentary on the happenings of the thread, please do so in your convo thread of choose, rather than here.

I would prefer to not have to read through counter productive posts, so violators will be promptly removed from the thread.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Vegeta (May 1, 2018)

Can you also set out a structure around warnings/bans that is logical and consistent throughout the forum.


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## Reznor (May 1, 2018)

Vegeta said:


> Can you also set out a structure around warnings/bans that is logical and consistent throughout the forum.


Hm, yeah, maybe that should be a goal too


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## Vegeta (May 1, 2018)

I suggest:

Warning, Final Warning, Ban. Two month cool down for reset ie warning -> 2 month later, warning -> 1.5 months -> final warning.

Then after ban is lifted, user gets Final Warning, Ban. Two month cool down applies.

2nd ban, duration increases.

3rd ban, duration increases.

So on and so forth. As a wise person once says, we should never ban because that means we failed as moderators. Except when people are trolls of the highest order of course.


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## Vegeta (May 2, 2018)

Also to add, a standardised warning message which will prevent ambiguity. Some thing simple like:

"In these posts: link link link you have violated global rule: rule number. This is a warning to prevent this behaviour from continuing. It will be in place for two months before it is dropped, however if you reoffend in the next two months it will escalate.

Please reread the rules located here(link) and take note of the warning schedule within the rules."

Reactions: Like 1


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## Lord Tentei (May 8, 2018)

The only thing I disagree with this whole thing is it would kinda interfere with how some of us do mafia and shit we sometimes sling. I mean, if it does just gives me a reason to step away from it. Not that it matters what I say.


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## Island (May 8, 2018)

Reznor said:


> *Off topic *racism/sexism/etc will always be disallowed.


Can you clarify this some more?

I don't understand what constitutes "on-topic racism/sexism." The way this sentence is phrased implies that there _are _threads where "women/minorities are inferior" is appropriate.


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## Mider T (May 8, 2018)

My last ban was indicative if the interpretive nature of pronz.


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## Reznor (May 9, 2018)

Island said:


> Can you clarify this some more?
> 
> I don't understand what constitutes "on-topic racism/sexism." The way this sentence is phrased implies that there _are _threads where "women/minorities are inferior" is appropriate.


Off topic sexism is completely forbidden.
On topic sexism is a short leash.

A diplomatic post that minimizes offense I'd be fine with even if it swerved into sexism alittle bit. Like, if we were talking about women in the military and someone made an argument about women not being as aggressive or physical as men making it a bad idea, I'd believe should be allowed. "Women/minorities are inferior" however I believe would be longer than that lease.

How long do you think that leash should be?


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## Amol (May 9, 2018)

This might be actually a good thing.
As a Cafe regular I am having whiplash of what is okay and what is not okay. We have been too used to cafe being a rough place .
Baiting also needs to be given lot of attention. Few days ago I got banned for flaming a guy. I deserved that ban because I did flame him. But that guy was someone who was advocating tormenting little kids(and had advocated mass murder of children in past) . I thought that was baiting. Mod of section disagreed. Flaming in my part was directly result of my frustration at the fact that no action was taken against such psychopath because he wasn't 'technically' violating any rule. The way I saw that whole mess is that forum rules sucked big time. 
So you can see why I want better forum rules when it comes to baiting. Like you said in your own post ,not all opinions can be forgiven as 'political opinion'. That would only turn forum into a cesspool of depravity where you can talk literally _anything_ as long as you do it 'politely'.


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## Island (May 9, 2018)

Reznor said:


> Off topic sexism is completely forbidden.
> On topic sexism is a short leash.
> 
> A diplomatic post that minimizes offense I'd be fine with even if it swerved into sexism alittle bit. Like, if we were talking about women in the military and someone made an argument about women not being as aggressive or physical as men making it a bad idea, I'd believe should be allowed. "Women/minorities are inferior" however I believe would be longer than that lease.
> ...


My post in that SCR thread sums up my thoughts on the matter:



Island said:


> I don't think people should ever have to defend who they are as human beings. That's not a "debate topic." That's a dignity that every single person deserves. If you were a women, for example, how would you feel about posting in a section where you had to defend your right to participate in politics or that you were just as logical as men?


In general, I think stuff about physicality is fine, but stuff about "women are naturally X mental attribute or prone to Y emotional behavior" is pushing it, especially if it's unsubstantiated.

It's a hard rule to enforce I imagine since there are times when discussing differences is appropriate, but broadly, I don't think anyone should have to defend that their group is mentally, emotionally, or legally equal to others.

So I guess to give you a specific answer, the leash ends when people make unsubstantiated claims about mental/emotional capacities or imply that one group should have less rights than others.

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

Sorry to necro this but recent events have necessitated a discussion on this.



R3ZSN0R3 said:


> Off topic sexism is completely forbidden.
> On topic sexism is a short leash.
> 
> A diplomatic post that minimizes offense I'd be fine with even if it swerved into sexism alittle bit. Like, if we were talking about women in the military and someone made an argument about women not being as aggressive or physical as men making it a bad idea, I'd believe should be allowed. "Women/minorities are inferior" however I believe would be longer than that lease.
> ...



It shouldn't exist at all? The idea that a user can be censored, banned or thrown out because he articulates views that contradict the majority on the staff (which for the Cafe are so far left leaning as to consider open calls for the murder of Trump supporters okay), this an absurdity and in an era where the right to freedom of expression and free speech is becoming the unifying issue for most people online...I don't see this ending well, if you guys start censoring what users can and cannot say no matter how idiotic and racist then you're going to lay the foundations for a response against NF that makes what was done by a certain user in 2010 pale in comparison and honestly? We'd be justifying it, if we put ourselves down that nightmare path.

Your limiting of sexist and racist speech should be the advocating of violence in an incredibly obvious and explicit sense. The idea that users in a forum like the Cafe can't go "Women are able to rape men and the law won't do a damn thing" or "Transgendered people are mentally ill" is..insidious to say the least. Neverminding that attempts to curtail free speech are becoming a human rights crisis and will lead to real world violence sooner or later and that one's interpretation of what is sexist is incredibly subjective you are doing little more than giving one faction of highly volatile, unstable and reactionary posters carte blanch to conduct a purge on this site that's going to result in them wielding the forum rules and the mods like weapons to cull any user they dislike.

This is already happening, the mere fact that Es and myself are banned from certain sections has nothing to do with any valid flaming, its mere political suppression using the flimsiest of excuses. Simply put...users have both the right to attack the character of a poster if that poster shows themselves to be a whackjob...and to express views towards race and religion an unstable majority may find objectionable.

What those users do not have the right to do, is call for the murder of said unstable majority, advocate for violence and specifically use a persons race, orientation or religion as grounds to dismiss their argument.

What you're proposing is Orwellian and monstrous and as the whole global situation on this issue deteriorates further...it invites reprisal here.

This forum isn't going to be saved by insane PC crap and over regulation, the solution to me seems simple.

1, The staff need to be subject to a council of admins with the power to review their actions should a user object(these mods should be hidden from everyone including the staff and should be barred from social interaction with the userbase and the staff), infract them or remove them from power or just laugh at a superfluous report and move on. Right now the staff has zero accountability, zero oversight. While the autonomy of section mods should be a thing that exists here...they also shouldn't be above the law, this creates so much of the mistrust and bitterness you're seeing.

2, global modding ignores section cultures and in the case of the OBD ignores that the OBD is vs forum and not part of NF, its culture and idiosyncrasies are part of a much more expansive internet phenomenon and all vs boards are united by that "culture" with eachother...and do not hold themselves to be part of any forum those sections are part of. You're not modding the OBD, you're modding the internet dadfight community..everywhere...you invited scrutiny on that level. I imagine some other sections like the Dragon Ball section have the same issue...you can't be a DB regular and an NFer or a CBR reg and a DB section poster, you're a DB fan..that happens to post on CBR or NF. you guys gotta be aware of this and tailor your staffs actions towards this...NF is too massive to have one unifying "culture" and one unifying approach to moderation and as long as you approach it like that, the problems we've all seen will continue to repeat themselves.

which brings me to

3, S mods and global mods should be subordinate in "rank" to section mods (and you can create hierarchy here if you want with a senior section mod being "the boss"), they should be here to help these guys out, cater to their needs and implement and enforce the policy these guys design to better keep the peace. Things would go a lot smoother, if someone like Iwandesu called the shots in the OBD and Santi or Panda in the DB section without any ambiguity. While these guys should be held accountable to some higher power for misconduct cases...its these dudes who have a better idea of what's happening in their own backyard and what needs to be done to keep it efficient.

Not that I'm saying each section should have its own rules or no rules...merely that the global rules need to be enforced, not at the cost of the health and stability of this site. Deference should be shown as well, if a section Mod doesn't take issue with a thing, then an S mod from outside has no business infracting that thing unless its beyond the pale bad.

You want to create efficiency that's founded on a common sense approach to modding, not some hyper PC, Tumblr style nightmare that's going to result in what's happening in the Cafe now...a bunch of users weaponizing the staff and the rules to attack users they don't like...or in the OBD where there's little trust..because of a total failure to properly understand the sections culture. That ain't gonna get better if you throw more rules at the forum, its going to get worse and worse until something breaks.

no one wants that...all of us can agree on that.




Island said:


> My post in that SCR thread sums up my thoughts on the matter:
> 
> 
> In general, I think stuff about physicality is fine, but stuff about "women are naturally X mental attribute or prone to Y emotional behavior" is pushing it, especially if it's unsubstantiated.



Because you personally, find them objectionable. Your distaste means little to me and does not trump my right to call into question say a Troon serving in the military (and yes I'm using troon deliberately to fluster you, my entire post here is that censoring mean words and not insanity is  an act of insanity), your issues with people objecting to women should also be moot...unless they're going "kill all the bitches" not in a shitpost but as an actual matter of form.

I'd much rather have hatred out in the open, suppressing it and "deplatforming it" as is so trendy now, only empowers it and makes otherwise good people, turn their head and listen.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Island (Aug 23, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Because you personally, find them objectionable. Your distaste means little to me and does not trump my right


You don't have a right to anything here. This is a privately owned message board.

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

Island said:


> You don't have a right to anything here. This is a privately owned message board.



And this is a brilliant argument to justify insane censorship based on sentimentality and subversive politics.

Oh wait, no its not and im pretty sure soon, it wont even be a spurious defense. Laws change or social media company employees eat led

Either or is going to happen in the next few years


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

You should probably engage in your pedantry and censorship elsewhere Island...because your views on what constitutes acceptable expression are morally comparable to a Soviet political officer signing a suppression warrant on someone

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## Es (Aug 23, 2018)

Island said:


> You don't have a right to anything here. This is a privately owned message board.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

See I find Islands involvement in this thread questionable, as he was part of a group that has for several months now used the forum rules and moderators as a weapon to target us, with you being subject to an unethical ban that was over turned and me still being unjustifiably banned solely because a moderator is bitter because I won't appease him.

This goes back to what I'm talking about, when the staff have zero accountability and the forum rules are set up in a manner that allows for someone like Island or his friends to rail road us purely out of ideological spite. Then it is inevitable that anything you do, will fail.

No one should be forced to obey rules, that are designed to fuck with users, enforced by people who face no sanction for their actions. People inherently resist that and you're all back to square one.

edit



> *Naruto Forums - Error*
> You do not have permission to view this page or perform this action.



As long as this bullshit persists, we're not going to be able to progress.

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## Island (Aug 23, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> And this is a brilliant argument to justify insane censorship based on sentimentality and subversive politics.
> 
> Oh wait, no its not.


It is.

Because it means that the staff can run the forum however they want, regardless of what rights you think you have here.

Morality aside, there are always going to be rules about what you can and cannot say. Minimally, the staff has to get rid of whatever Google and Xenforo say are inappropriate and whatever's illegal in Germany.

From there, it depends on what kind of forum they want to run. If every thread in the Café, for example, degenerated into an attack on Jews, Muslims, black people, or women, why would any of these people want to post here? If they had to justify their identities in every thread, why would they bother?

If I were a woman, I wouldn't to post on a forum where people talk about women being inferior and deserving fewer rights than men.

Whether or not they _should _run the forum this way depends on what kind of community you think this place should be. Once they meet minimum legal requirements and the requirements of Google and Xenforo, it comes down to what kind of place the staff wants to moderate and what the community would enjoy being part of. There are plenty of rules-free communities out there, but I assume the staff want a forum that's reasonably accommodating for as many people as possible, which for better or worse, restricts what you're allowed to say.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> See I find Islands involvement in this thread questionable, as he was part of a group that has for several months now used the forum rules and moderators as a weapon to target us, with you being subject to an unethical ban that was over turned and me still being unjustifiably banned solely because a moderator is bitter because I won't appease him.


I don't know anything about you guys being banned other than that I occasionally report posts that I think break the rules.

As I'm sure you've noticed, I don't exactly get along with the Café staff either.


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## Es (Aug 23, 2018)

Island said:


> From there, it depends on what kind of forum they want to run. If every thread in the Café, for example, degenerated into an attack on Jews, Muslims, black people, or women, why would any of these people want to post here? If they had to justify their identities in every thread, why would they bother?


So the cafe being ok with the genocide of whites in parts of Efricka is cool and doing left wing holocaust denial is A-OK then and bullying people who say its wrong?

FOH island



Island said:


> If I were a woman, I wouldn't to post on a forum where people talk about women being inferior and deserving fewer rights than men.


But you aren't and you would be a pussy if you think making a hugbox is appealing.


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## Island (Aug 23, 2018)

Es said:


> So the cafe being ok with the genocide of whites in parts of Efricka is cool and doing left wing holocaust denial is A-OK then and bullying people who say its wrong?


You're right. That's not okay.



Es said:


> But you aren't and you would be a pussy if you think making a hugbox is appealing.


I didn't say I wanted a hugbox.


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## Unlosing Ranger (Aug 23, 2018)

Island said:


> You don't have a right to anything here. This is a privately owned message board.





> Once they meet minimum legal requirements and the requirements of Google and Xenforo


The forums can come crashing and burning if you don't properly address this as if one had said right despite them not having it. That's the conclusion that can be made from your own words.
Tools used to monitor can be used in malice in far more than the report system of NF.
You don't want that.

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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

Island said:


> It is.



no it really isn't, the fact that there is currently an international scandal over this very issue should tell you how stupid this line of thinking is.


Island said:


> Because it means that the staff can run the forum however they want, regardless of what rights you think you have here.



They're welcome to kill this forum with poor decisions, sure but if they're actually interested in not turning NF into an internet memory then they should recognize this is the wrong tree to be barking up.



Island said:


> Morality aside, there is always going to be rules about what you can and cannot say. Minimally, the staff has to get rid of whatever Google says is inappropriate.



for however long Gweigle has a right to legislate language 



Island said:


> From there, it depends on what kind of forum they want to run. If every thread in the Café, for example, degenerated into an attack on Jews, Muslims, black people, or women, why would any of these people want to post here? If they had to justify their identities in every thread, why would they bother?



considering the 20 or so people who make up the Cafe regs have...at various points done exactly what you're hypothesizing to us...and worse including plotting our murders and no one, but no one bats an eyelash...my response is "They can fucking deal, mock the shit out of the racists and move on"



Island said:


> If I were a woman, I wouldn't to post on a forum where people talk about women being inferior and deserving fewer rights than men.



that's because Island, you're infantilizing women. Meanwhile a Woman who has dealt with that in the real world like say someone in the situation ayaan hirsi ali was in...Wouldn't bat a fucking eyelash at mean words online.



Island said:


> Whether or not they _should _run the forum this way depends on what kind of community you think this place should be. Once they meet minimum legal requirements and the requirements of Google and Xenforo, it comes down to what kind of place the staff wants to moderate and what the community would enjoy being part of. There are plenty of rules-free communities out there, but I assume the staff want a forum that's reasonably accommodating for as many people as possible, which for better or worse, restricts what you're allowed to say about certain groups.



The problem is that "accommodating and inclusive" now mean, infringement on the rights of others, targeted harassment and dispossession.


Island said:


> I don't know anything about you guys being banned other than that I occasionally report posts that I think break the rules.
> 
> As I'm sure you've noticed, I don't exactly get along with the Café staff either.



well considering they organize from your discord bro 



Island said:


> You're right. That's not okay.



I'm glad, the Island I knew is still there and you're a decent human being. Meanwhile @mr_shadow is entirely okay with this...which brings me to my point.

mods face zero repercussions for abuse and this is unacceptable.


Island said:


> I didn't say I wanted a hugbox.



yeah you kinda did,

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## Natty (Aug 23, 2018)

Es said:


> But you aren't and you would be a pussy if you think making a hugbox is appealing.



It might be hard to fathom, but people won't want to join a group that actively dislikes their existence or just straight up calls them inferior. Hug boxing isn't needed to be inclusive.

Also just a need to mention, the forum doesn't have to bend over backwards for "free speech rights", in my experience this place hasn't been orwellian or controlling. You can cry about free speech rights on the streets, a private forum doesn't have to subscribe to that. Nor does it have to subscribe to your idea about platforming an idea.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Es (Aug 23, 2018)

Natty said:


> It might be hard to fathom, but people won't want to join a group that actively dislikes their existence or just straight up calls them inferior. Hug boxing isn't needed to be inclusive.


Being inclusive equates to creating a hugbox and who the hell unironically says women are inferior? This is just more excuses to ban people who say a fact a mod might dislike naw

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

Natty said:


> It might be hard to fathom, but people won't want to join a group that actively dislikes their existence or just straight up calls them inferior. Hug boxing isn't needed to be inclusive.



the problem is most of the people demanding inclusivity are unreasonable, violent, bigoted, twisted and at odds with _97% of the human race.
_
At which point you're not talking about inclusivity, you're talking about forcing yourself on us at gun point and demanding we accept you and put you in a superior position to us or else. And I think I can speak for Es, Ranger and probably Sora when I say "over my rotting corpse"

wait...aren't you dating an Admin? great we're probably going to get perm banned solely for disagreeing with you 



Es said:


> Being inclusive equates to creating a hugbox and who the hell unironically says women are inferior? This is just more excuses to ban people who say a fact a mod might dislike naw



This...it comes down to suppression and deconstruction.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Natty (Aug 23, 2018)

Es said:


> Being inclusive equates to creating a hugbox and who the hell unironically says women are inferior? This is just more excuses to ban people who say a fact a mod might dislike naw



Blanket statement towards not only the woman thing, it can cover the gamet to include religious beliefs, sexuality, gender identity and more.

Sorry, I wasn't clear on my point or position! I'll try and make sure to elaborate next time. I have issues with my own vague statements sometimes, sorry.


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## Natty (Aug 23, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> the problem is most of the people demanding inclusivity are unreasonable, violent, bigoted, twisted and at odds with _97% of the human race.
> _
> At which point you're not talking about inclusivity, you're talking about forcing yourself on us at gun point and demanding we accept you and put you in a superior position above us or else. And I think I can speak for Es, Ranger and probably Sora when I say "over my rotting corpse"
> 
> wait...aren't you dating an Admin? great we're probably going to get perm banned solely for disagreeing with you



I didn't call anyone bigoted, calling for inclusivity is just asking people to chill on hateful comments towards a group.

You're putting lots of words in my mouth

If I'm dating an admin, thats news to me. If you think I'm a dupe, that's kind of showing all you know.

Moderation seems pretty hands off, people calling out bigotism is from the members themselves, isn't that the sort of self policing you want in terms of free speech?


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## Island (Aug 23, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> considering the 20 or so people who make up the Cafe regs have...at various points done exactly what you're hypothesizing to us...and worse including plotting our murders and no one, but no one bats an eyelash...my response is "They can fucking deal, mock the shit out of the racists and move on"


I can't say that I know what you're talking about, but if that's true, then yes, that's wrong. I don't post in a lot of the same threads as you guys.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> well considering they organize from your discord bro


Do they?

You might have notice that when you guys joined my Discord the other day, I didn't even know about it until somebody tagged me. I only moderate the Discord insofar as I do what the majority of regulars there ask me to do. Coincidentally, that seems like the same hands-off approach to moderation that you're asking for.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

Natty said:


> I didn't call anyone bigoted, calling for inclusivity is just asking people to chill on hateful comments towards a group.]



I know you didn't call anyone bigoted, I'm saying a lot of the people calling for inclusivity are bigots, that it usually comes form a position of malice and its usually a prelude to discrimination against normality. What is often called "tolerance" really just means "fuck you and the seven point something billion like you!"


Natty said:


> You're putting lots of words in my mouth



given the kind of posts you make on average...I don't think I am.



Natty said:


> If I'm dating an admin, that news to me. If you think I'm a dupe, that's kind of showing all you know.








Island said:


> I can't say that I know what you're talking about, but if that's true, then yes, that's wrong. I don't post in a lot of the same threads as you guys.



It's happened, while the Cafe staff, the Staff you want to hand the power to ban people for "hateful comments" as interpreted by them...are watching and nothing happens.

I have no desire to see that, that's guaranteeing hatespeech and bigotry of a different sort will become the norm.

interpreted


Island said:


> Do they?
> 
> You might have notice that when you guys joined my Discord the other day, I didn't even know about it until somebody tagged me. I only moderate the Discord insofar as I do what the majority of regulars there ask me to do. Coincidentally, that seems like the same hands-off approach to moderation that you're asking for.



1, yes they do

2, I'm not sure how you can conflate, a call for free speech, diligence and ethics with "Let me do nothing while border line criminal actions happen in a popular section" or "Let me instaban a guy who showed up to shit post after my server was used as ground zero in a stalking and harassment campaign"


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## Island (Aug 23, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> It's happened, while the Cafe staff, the Staff you want to hand the power to ban people for "hateful comments" as interpreted by them...are watching and nothing happens.
> 
> I have no desire to see that, that's guaranteeing hatespeech and bigotry of a different sort will become the norm.


Ideally, the section staff would be people who most regulars see as a fair arbiter of whatever global and section rules exist.

You're right that the section is poorly moderated and that the section staff leave something to be desired.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> 2, I'm not sure how you can conflate, a call for free speech, diligence and ethics with "Let me do nothing while border line criminal actions happen in a popular section" or "Let me instaban a guy who showed up to shit post after my server was used as ground zero in a stalking and harassment campaign"


What criminal actions are happening?

And yes, I think it's a reasonable comparison. I made the Café Discord so that I can keep in touch with the regulars and so that they could have someplace to talk that wasn't the Convo thread. I don't spend a lot of time on it, so moderation extends as far as the regulars asking me to make something happen. That sounds a lot like the moderation style you prefer.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

Island said:


> Ideally, the section staff would be people who most regulars see as a fair arbiter of whatever global and section rules exist.
> 
> You're right that the section is poorly moderated and that the section staff leave something to be desired.



It isn't just the Cafe, accountability is a must.



Island said:


> What criminal actions are happening?



CTK and Co's "hurr we're gonna murder Trump supporters and here's how" nonsense, German law regarding hate speecj probably means the praise of what's happening Soof Efrika is a thot crime..its certainly immoral as fuck.


Island said:


> And yes, I think it's a reasonable comparison. I made the Café Discord so that I can keep in touch with the regulars and so that they could have someplace to talk that wasn't the Convo thread. I don't spend a lot of time on it, so moderation extends as far as the regulars asking me to make something happen. That sounds a lot like the moderation style you prefer.



Then you have a bizarre take on "ethical and diligent modding" namely if I saw OBD'ers doing that on a discord I modded I'd kick them out and call them cunts for being so petty


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## Natty (Aug 23, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I know you didn't call anyone bigoted, I'm saying a lot of the people calling for inclusivity are bigots, that it usually comes form a position of malice and its usually a prelude to discrimination against normality. What is often called "tolerance" really just means "fuck you and the seven point something billion like you!"



Your idea of normality is different from my own and others. You have a lot of pent up anger regarding this and I understand, but the same could be said for the other side of the spectrum. A marginalized group lashing back because they feel discriminated? Why should they be angry? That being said this is kind of meandering off at this point so that'll be as far as I go with this.

You're adding a lot to just my use of the word inclusivity, I meant throwing out hate towards any group not being inviting to that group and the people who associate with them.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> given the kind of posts you make on average...I don't think I am.



90% of it is shitposting in The Alley or sexually explicit, is that a fair judgment to make?

Hahaaaaaa, like I said, you thinking I'm a dupe really shows how little you know about me. It's hard to believe that some no-lifer coincidentally joined as someone else being banned, which is fair, but keep thinking that. There's a reason why I haven't been banned for being a dupe (well, apparently I'm dating an admin, could that be it?)

Regarding the forum, I find the moderation being nice and hands off. I think the discords and what have you are their own separate entities altogether. Most comments in Cafe line up with mine (cause I lean Left) but any dissenting opinions are usually said and responded to in a respectful manner, you may not like the responses but that's how it'd be done anywhere else from any position. That's just my perspective as a new member seeing things play out in that section of the forum. I can't comment on what's happened in the past unfortunately.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

Natty said:


> Your idea of normality is different from my own and others.



This is an argument as shallow as it is serious  Normal means the average, take nearly eight billion humans and find the Joe Blow...you'll find they aren't rainbow haired alphabet soup activists who want to gut the constitution 

i kinda had to flee from Argentina because Social Justice Advocates destroyed my country, ruined its economy, tried to murder me multiple times and targeted my family so...you know...yeah




Natty said:


> You have a lot of pent up anger regarding this and I understand, but the same could be said for the other side of the spectrum.



I have pent up anger? Nice dig at me, but no. I'm indignant at what I see as an assault on civil liberties by a bigoted group of minorities that are treated almost as a protected class and have more rights than I do, demanding I sacrifice more of my own for their infantile need to feel validated.


Natty said:


> A marginalized group lashing back because they feel discriminated? Why should they be angry? That being said this is kind of meandering off at this point so that'll be as far as I go with this.



Only most of those groups have had superior liberties to regular people for nigh on a decade now.


Natty said:


> You're adding a lot to just my use of the word inclusivity, I meant throwing out hate towards any group not being inviting *to that group and the people who associate with them*.



This is where standing up for yourself and the content of your character and ability to argue eloquently comes in, when you censor racist idiots you empower them, which is bad for all of us and not just the group doing the censoring.


Natty said:


> 90% of it is shitposting in The Alley or sexually explicit, is that a fair judgment to make?



I don't know? if that's literally all I can see, that's all I can go on, given more data that'll probably change though. I'm not a fucking monster, so yeah

Reactions: Like 1


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## Juub (Aug 23, 2018)

@The Immortal WatchDog Did you forget this my friend?

"Final interpretation of the rules is up to the staff. If you see a rule that you think needs to be improved or changed talk to us. We're open to civil discussion."

Which basically means the staff is free to do as they please. We also tried to have a civil discussion. It fell on deaf ears.


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## Natty (Aug 23, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> This is an argument as shallow as it is serious  Normal means the average, take nearly eight billion humans and find the Joe Blow...you'll find they aren't rainbow haired alphabet soup activists who want to gut the constitution
> 
> i kinda had to flee from Argentina because Social Justice Advocates destroyed my country, ruined its economy, tried to murder me multiple times and targeted my family so...you know...yeah



There's something ironic about talking about averages, and then complaining about a people ruining your country, or a small amount of people putting a gun to 7.9b people and trying to get them to subscribe to their beliefs.

I understand you're using the more extreme examples to get your point across but it isn't working for me. 




The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I have pent up anger? Nice dig at me, but no. I'm indignant at what I see as an assault on civil liberties by a bigoted group of minorities that are treated almost as a protected class and have more rights than I do, demanding I sacrifice more of my own for their infantile need to feel validated.
> 
> 
> Only most of those groups have had superior liberties to regular people for nigh on a decade now.



Talking about civil liberties and free speech rights on a thread about discussing rules on a forum.. Yeah..



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> This is where standing up for yourself and the content of your character and ability to argue eloquently comes in, when you censor racist idiots you empower them, which is bad for all of us and not just the group doing the censoring.



You talked about deplatforming an idea previously, that I can understand, but by speaking out against those ideas, is it not doing that same thing? I don't understand what you're getting at here. Like I said in my previous statement, I don't see many posts with dissenting posts being deleted, maybe that's something that's been changed in the past few months but I haven't seen it. Bar maybe one post with a hard r, iirc?

My mind is usually looking like my avatar. Forgive my grammatical errors, I'm not the most eloquent person in the world. I always did better in science classes and math classes back when I went to uni. Not going just to use this as an excuse, since I know my wording can be shit at times, I'm a big enough girl to admit that.

I learn by talking to people like you, so forgive me for using you as the wall in my one person ping pong game.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I don't know? if that's literally all I can see, that's all I can go on, given more data that'll probably change though. I'm not a fucking monster, so yeah



You're a cookie monster, I can get down with that.


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## Yamato (Aug 23, 2018)

Island said:


> You don't have a right to anything here. This is a privately owned message board.



Yes and a lot of boards are privately run, but if the administration is reasonable, then things can change and rules be made more clear. People aren't just gonna sit back and let themselves get kicked off for petty reasons or be harassed without passing judgment on the wrongdoer.



Island said:


> It is.
> 
> Because it means that the staff can run the forum however they want, regardless of what rights you think you have here.
> 
> ...


At the bolded- I wouldn't give a squat if that happened and doubt many other would too. I've survived on quite a few forums without getting triggered when I see stuff like that being said. And I've survived worse too.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> wait...aren't you dating an Admin? great we're probably going to get perm banned solely for disagreeing with you





Natty said:


> If I'm dating an admin, thats news to me. If you think I'm a dupe, that's kind of showing all you know.


Uhhh I don't think he mentioned dupe, you did on your own


Also


Name and pic should be pretty obvious as well.


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## Natty (Aug 23, 2018)

Yamato said:


> Uhhh I don't think he mentioned dupe, you did on your own
> 
> 
> Also
> ...



Most presumptions people have for me is because they think I'm a dupe of either Nataly or because I'm a dupe of someone else.  I may have made a lot of posts but a lot of them are shit posting. I do talk to Trin but I don't know anyother admin, and I can assure you I'm not dating her. Flirting? Yes. E-dating? No

LOL. It'll make sense in the next week, maybe, hopefully. It could be that, I'm fucking with people, but does it matter what I say? Most people will assume what they want anyways.


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## Island (Aug 23, 2018)

Yamato said:


> At the bolded- I wouldn't give a squat if that happened and doubt many other would too. I've survived on quite a few forums without getting triggered when I see stuff like that being said. And I've survived worse too.


Let me put it even broader than that.

A generic person joins a community in their free time. Why would they remain part of that community if said community was questioning their mental capacity and whether they deserve rights? NF is (hopefully) a leisure activity; who in the world would stick around if they constantly had to defend who they are? Surely they have better things to do.

Reactions: Like 2


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

Natty said:


> There's something ironic about talking about averages, and then complaining about a people ruining your country, or a small amount of people putting a gun to 7.9b people and trying to get them to subscribe to their beliefs.
> 
> I understand you're using the more extreme examples to get your point across but it isn't working for me.



In all honesty, this is probably more to the readers and the staff than about convincing you. And they arent exactly exteeme examples any more sadly.





Natty said:


> Talking about civil liberties and free speech rights on a thread about discussing rules on a forum.. Yeah..



This place is a microcosm of what is happening the world over and you and Island seem to be talking about silencing the same speech the larger more "real" culture war is about.




Natty said:


> You talked about deplatforming an idea previously, that I can understand, but by speaking out against those ideas, is it not doing that same thing? I don't understand what you're getting at here


.
Are you really equating the silencing of opposing views by an authority figure vs individuals challenging hate?





Natty said:


> ]ike I said in my previous statement, I don't see many posts with dissenting posts being deleted, maybe that's something that's been changed in the past few months but I haven't seen it. Bar maybe one post with a hard r, iirc?



It happened to Es and myself just now, including fradulant bans and the like.

[



Natty said:


> ]My mind is usually looking like my avatar. Forgive my grammatical errors, I'm not the most eloquent person in the world. I always did better in science classes and math classes back when I went to uni. Not going just to use this as an excuse, since I know my wording can be shit at times, I'm a big enough girl to admit that


.

Lool I spent the first two years on this site so high on all kinds of drugs my grammar, spelling and punctuation constituted a crime against humanity so no worries.
[



Natty said:


> ]
> I learn by talking to people like you, so forgive me for using you as the wall in my one person ping pong game.



Aint that how we all learn? 



Natty said:


> You're a cookie monster, I can get down with that.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Yamato (Aug 23, 2018)

Natty said:


> Most presumptions people have for me is because they think I'm a dupe of either Nataly or because I'm a dupe of someone else.  I may have made a lot of posts but a lot of them are shit posting. I do talk to Trin but I don't know anyother admin, and I can assure you I'm not dating her. Flirting? Yes. E-dating? No
> 
> LOL. It'll make sense in the next week, maybe, hopefully. It could be that, I'm fucking with people, but does it matter what I say? Most people will assume what they want anyways.


It's obvious why they think that. 
A lot points to that you are a dupe of Nataly. Like admitting it on your own profile posts, av, connections with people, etc. 
I've seen and banned a lot of dupes when I was a mod elsewhere and it's gets hilarious when people try to come back. There are tools a mod can use as well then piece together the connections and mannerisms of the members in question.  
Sooo yeah. It ain't hard.



Island said:


> Let me put it even broader than that.
> 
> A generic person joins a community in their free time. Why would they remain part of that community if said community was questioning their mental capacity and whether they deserve rights? NF is (hopefully) a leisure activity; who in the world would stick around if they constantly had to defend who they are? Surely they have better things to do.



Forums are a leisure place for people to relax on and there would be scuffles from time to time. And if they ever feel threatened they could just either ignore or go outside. Funny enough some people like all the drama and stick around for that stuff even if it triggers them. Masochists  
And there are those who like to troll and flame others. 
It's the mixture of craziness and friendliness that attracts many people. They just wanna have fun and poke fun at others. Only requirement is that you aren't a retard and aren't thin skinned.


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## Natty (Aug 23, 2018)

Yamato said:


> It's obvious why they think that.
> A lot points to that you are a dupe of Nataly. Like admitting it on your own profile posts, av, connections with people, etc.
> I've seen and banned a lot of dupes when I was a mod elsewhere and it's gets hilarious when people try to come back. There are tools a mod can use as well then piece together the connections and mannerisms of the members in question.
> Sooo yeah. It ain't hard.



Oh I'm not surprised with the people making the connections. But from the perspective of someone who isn't her, who happened to both be like her and join as she got banned, it's fucking hilarious. I like a little bit of mischief so doing things to point people in the wrong direction is funny to me. The members who want to talk to me think I'm Nataly, so it's natural they want to talk to me (they initiate, not me). The staff that do know me, know I'm not her, so I'm not in any danger or trouble so there's no harm in having some fun with it.

In the server I'm in, I've been talking to Nat and we've been having fun with it. So we're definitely not complaining. Plus I met someone cool and nice because of it so it's a win for me.


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## Yamato (Aug 23, 2018)

Natty said:


> Oh I'm not surprised with the people making the connections. But from the perspective of someone who isn't her, who happened to both be like her and join as she got banned, it's fucking hilarious. I like a little bit of mischief so doing things to point people in the wrong direction is funny to me. The members who want to talk to me think I'm Nataly, so it's natural they want to talk to me (they initiate, not me). The staff that do know me, know I'm not her, so I'm not in any danger or trouble so there's no harm in having some fun with it.
> 
> In the server I'm in, I've been talking to Nat and we've been having fun with it. So we're definitely not complaining. Plus I met someone cool and nice because of it so it's a win for me.


Lot of coincidences and the timing of it all 
Still, who knows .many can fabricate it


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## ~M~ (Aug 23, 2018)

Not one person has posted in this thread I would trust with political theory as far as I could throw them


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## Natty (Aug 23, 2018)

~M~ said:


> Not one person has posted in this thread I would trust with political theory as far as I could throw them



how far can you throw my tiny lil 120lb body? 



Yamato said:


> Lot of coincidences and the timing of it all



FROM MY PERSPECTIVE IT'S SO WEIRD LMAO


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## Island (Aug 23, 2018)

Also, since some people here are (intentionally or otherwise) misinterpreting my stance:



> I don't think people should ever have to defend who they are as human beings. That's not a "debate topic." That's a dignity that every single person deserves.


I think it's a good minimum requirement for any community.


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## ~M~ (Aug 23, 2018)

we have harbored an active culture of distrusting community experience in favor of nepotism and politics. It pisses me off

Reactions: Like 1


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## Natty (Aug 23, 2018)

~M~ said:


> we have harbored an active culture of distrusting community experience in favor of nepotism and politics. It pisses me off



Unfortunate side effect of pitting groups against each other or viewing people as "the right" and "the left", pushes everyone further and further away and so the only people you feel like you can trust are the people within your circle.

I'd like to say I'm not part of that group but everyone is guilty of it in various degrees. Including me 

My time here has been mostly pleasant though, if that means anything to you guys.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

~M~ said:


> Not one person has posted in this thread I would trust with political theory as far as I could throw them



I would be concerned if anyone went to a forum.for that.

Though the argument against censorship here, is more to forum policy. It just happens to reflect reality a bit


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## Es (Aug 23, 2018)

Island said:


> I think it's a good minimum requirement for any community.


Island you don't seem to grasp some cultures are inherently toxic. No this isnt an argument for racism but it is oft misinterpreted for racism because moral cowardice

get it?


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## Island (Aug 23, 2018)

Es said:


> Island you don't seem to grasp some cultures are inherently toxic. No this isnt an argument for racism but it is oft misinterpreted for racism because moral cowardice
> 
> get it?


I didn't say anything about culture.


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## Es (Aug 23, 2018)

Island said:


> I didn't say anything about culture.


Not you
not talking about you


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## Island (Aug 23, 2018)

Es said:


> Not you
> not talking about you


I don't know why you're quoting me then.


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## Es (Aug 23, 2018)

Seraphiel said:


> Can't wait till ^ (use bro)/^ (not the meaning of the word "respect".) and other slurs get censored and these snowflakes get banned trying to bypass the censor.


Also watch you nig nogs try to get trap banned next you bleeding pussies

Reactions: Like 1


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## Seraphiel (Aug 23, 2018)

Es said:


> Also watch you nig nogs try to get trap banned next you bleeding pussies


Nah


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## Unlosing Ranger (Aug 23, 2018)

Juub said:


> "Final interpretation of the rules is up to the staff."


Really, the final interpretation? You believe that lie?


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 23, 2018)

Here's the issue at the end of the day, this site has several serious issues these new rules don't actually address, chief among them is moderator accountability and permitting death threats. 

After that, its not the language its a lack of communication. The solution isn't to add more rules, its for us to come off the siege towers and the mods to come down from their ivory towers, mutually under a banner of truce and fucking talking with each other, not at each other. Part of that starts with you guys conceding something to us, mod accountability or something...then we can reciprocate.

Because right now, demanding we be the only ones who bleed isn't going to work.


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## ~M~ (Aug 24, 2018)

I feel like part of the inherent problem, maybe not the whole one though, is that we have the most biased group of people in power than ever yet they're not rowing in the same direction so we are going no where. 

The Alley is a fucking disgrace because it was executed before a consensus is reached, continues to wander without leadership, and will WITHOUT DOUBT continue its first impression. Who are you jackasses that not only could you not plan out a new section but you maintain it worse than the old ones? 

A lot of corruption in our system has built up. They can't handle the base mechanics of sections let alone the intricacies of interpersonal member relationships... That's why we have staff who freely flame or abuse power while members themselves are censored. 

There's a real authority problem here and the mods either need to grow a pair or be replaced that's that. We need people who are leaders and make threads not your discord friends.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Nighty the Mighty (Aug 24, 2018)

~M~ said:


> I feel like part of the inherent problem, maybe not the whole one though, is that we have the most biased group of people in power than ever yet they're not rowing in the same direction so we are going no where.
> 
> The Alley is a fucking disgrace because it was executed before a consensus is reached, continues to wander without leadership, and will WITHOUT DOUBT continue its first impression. Who are you jackasses that not only could you not plan out a new section but you maintain it worse than the old ones?
> 
> ...



tfw this is actually completely correct but no one will pay attention to it because it's you


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## ~M~ (Aug 25, 2018)

Nighty the Mighty said:


> tfw this is actually completely correct but no one will pay attention to it because it's you


A drug using "p*d*p****" has a stronger ethical code than these people

Reactions: Like 1


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## Deleted member 198194 (Aug 25, 2018)

~M~ said:


> A drug using "p*d*p****" has a stronger ethical code than these people


Yeah, a self admitted sexual predator has a stronger ethical code than non-predators because he complains harder about flaming on an internet forum.

tfw this is actually completely correct but no one will pay attention to it because it's you

Reactions: Like 3


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## ~M~ (Aug 25, 2018)

afgpride said:


> Yeah, a self admitted sexual predator has a stronger ethical code than non-predators because he complains harder about flaming on an internet forum.
> 
> tfw this is actually completely correct but no one will pay attention to it because it's you


I'm not weighing my ethical principles against my complaints, I'm not an idiot whose words are nothing but wind and I'm more ethical than your lot due to my actions.

I don't think it's wrong to sleep with people 5 years within your age when they're living and working as an adult anyways, so I did it.

I don't think it's wrong to call people out on their bullshit, so I do it. I think this forum is garbage but has potential, so I make what I consider good and genuine posts to improve the culture.

See the relationship between my beliefs and action? That's called ethical code. I see none across the staff. You don't have a damn clue what an actually comprehensive list of "harder" complaints would be.


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## Deleted member 198194 (Aug 25, 2018)

~M~ said:


> I'm not weighing my ethical principles against my complaints, I'm not an idiot whose words are nothing but wind and I'm more ethical than your lot due to my actions.
> 
> I don't think it's wrong to sleep with people 5 years within your age when they're living and working as an adult anyways, so I did it.
> 
> ...


That's a nice rationalization for why you, as a self admitted predator, are more ethical than non-predators because you complain about flaming on an anime forum.

tfw this is actually completely correct but no one will pay attention to it because it's you


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## ~M~ (Aug 25, 2018)

Good shitposts, enjoy your like


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## Nighty the Mighty (Aug 25, 2018)

~M~ said:


> A drug using "p*d*p****" has a stronger ethical code than these people



let's not go this far

ur correct that the staff has institutionalised corruption to an obscene level tho


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## JoJo (Aug 25, 2018)

why can't i say p*jeet?


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## Fang (Aug 26, 2018)

JoJo said:


> why can't i say p*jeet?



It offends Lucy


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## Eros (Aug 26, 2018)

Fang said:


> It offends Lucy


It offends a lot of people, because it's an ethnic slur. It's not as bad as the n word, obviously, but it's definitely impolite.


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## BlueDemon (Aug 26, 2018)

If you guys want no censorship and a right-leaning echo chamber, go to the RPGCodex.

Thank me later.

It's also quite funny how the people complaining about censorship are the ones who want to have free reign in disparaging others (going by the example in the first post that started this discussion).

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

afgpride said:


> Yeah, a self admitted sexual predator has a stronger ethical code than non-predators because he complains harder about flaming on an internet forum.
> 
> tfw this is actually completely correct but no one will pay attention to it because it's you



I gotta ask, why this dude wasn't banned given..he admitted to criminal conduct.

Is this the same reason Gibs isn't banned despite the fact that he fucks dogs and children? Because Reznor and Dream feel like people need a second chance...even when they fuck dogs and children?




Eros said:


> It offends a lot of people, because it's an ethnic slur. It's not as bad as the n word, obviously, but it's definitely impolite.



This would have more value if you Marxist trolls didn't hide behind corrupt Cafe mods, lynch people after organizing on discords ...and...call Es and myself race traitors every single time we dared to disagree with the narrative.

Racism is A okay so long as its an irate liberal telling a black poster to get off the porch and calling me a race traitor and a self hating Latino because I happen to think Central Americans who invade the US and don't have any respect for its culture make the rest of us Latinos who actually give a shit about this country look awful.

You're a god damn joke, you guys rail roaded multiple users with your bullshit Cabal and conspire with an abusive mod to silence any kind of dissent on your section. You Jackals are why we're here right now.


If any section should take the highest amounts of bans for racism, its the Cafe and it aint guys like Zenith or Chalyndra who should be on the chopping block


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

nf's new policy is gonna be like how modern video games ban people. instead of actually being productive and targeting the real issue (where in the social sections of this site there aren't many), it's mostly gonna target people who get whined about and make sure carebears don't get their feelings hurt by words

sasuga nf


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

...holy shit I can't believe I'm agreeing with Terry Shiavo...but yeah, that's the risk here.


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> ...holy shit I can't believe I'm agreeing with Terry Shiavo...but yeah, that's the risk here.


it's not the risk but considering how the staff handles shit, it will happen

the reason why slurs have gotten an instant ban (in what i assume is all sections with a 0 tolerance policy) is because it's not productive and doesn't attract new members and if someone is a part of whatever race or group is being slurred against then it just turns them away even more. but in social sections of NF, convo threads, mafia, etc. lax modding and free use of language is an important part because it's 99% banter. And in the history of NF (which im not too savvy in and only speaking afaik) social sections have constituted as almost 0% as to why members actively join NF. For what reason would a person say "yeah I wanna join NF because it looks like the convo thread in the OP section looks great to post in with people I don't know even though I'm a huge naruto fan"

then it begs the question, at what point do they stop or keep going? at what point do they apply the logic they want? Should I not tell people to kill themselves in the off chance they're suicidal? In this scenario, are we really gonna put the onus on someone to not say KYS because there might be a genuinely mentally person with such a fragile state of being that saying 3 letters is gonna make them off themselves? That person is a danger to themselves and others around them and shouldn't be our standard for moderating

also i digress because i started strawmaning  a little and applied what popular video games do to this site and that's not the point

tl;dr is social sections/threads shouldn't be regulated and modded the same as the rest of the forum and requires lax modding as it's generally there because people who know each other come together to meme and bantz

however i do agree there should be lower tolerance policy in normal sections for not just racial slurs but all insultings (because words are equal and only autismos find some more emotionally painful than others)


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

btw, if it's not obvious, nf's problem go waaaaaay further than what's looking to be targeted in this thread


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## NostalgiaFan (Aug 26, 2018)

BlueDemon said:


> If you guys want no censorship and a right-leaning echo chamber


>censorship is the only thing keeping people from being right leaning

I have never seen a more backhanded comment in my life.


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## Aphrodite (Aug 26, 2018)

If you are leaning right or left try some v-8 it might help.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

NostalgiaFan said:


> >censorship is the only thing keeping people from being right leaning
> 
> I have never seen a more backhanded comment in my life.



Beyond that, the comment itself sounds like an admission of defeat when you brass tax it. "Our platform and world views are so weak and frail we need to insta ban anyone right wing"



Aphrodite said:


> If you are leaning right or left try some v-8 it might help.



Oh great, more shitposting.


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## Aphrodite (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Beyond that, the comment itself sounds like an admission of defeat when you brass tax it. "Our platform and world views are so weak and frail we need to insta ban anyone right wing"
> 
> 
> 
> Oh great, more shitposting.



Its what i do best.

Reactions: Like 2


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Aphrodite said:


> Its what i do best.





> can I also point out modding and admining users with chronic mental illness (as some of the newer admins and certain advisers seem to be), or catastrophically poor judgment (ala Natalay) is an act of self destructive lunacy that benefits literally no one...
> 
> Why is it done? Why should we be afflicted with someone who...say lights their VM page up like an early 2000's emo about to make a scene with a razor blade? Because I can think of two ex staffers who fit this bill and it baffles me...they still have access to mod perks





edit - and to the ban happy Staffers, no this isn't a flame its a legitimate question, why do you afflict crazy people on us?


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## Jeroen (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> why do you afflict crazy people on us?



We all crazy here though.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

and we're back to shit posting...because there's no valid counter to the points being raised here.

Totally a coincidence though


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## Ashi (Aug 26, 2018)

Idk why I was summoned but stfu JewJew


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## Reznor (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> and we're back to shit posting...because there's no valid counter to the points being raised here.
> 
> Totally a coincidence though


I opened this thread up months ago, and people only just Thursday bothered to give input.
Calm down.


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## Seraphiel (Aug 26, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> I opened this thread up months ago, and people only just Thursday bothered to give input.
> Calm down.


Just be honest and tell the dude he's gonna be banned soon and that no good arguments were brought forth, literal t_d/pol tier drivel was spewed out.

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> I opened this thread up months ago, and people only just Thursday bothered to give input.
> Calm down.



Dude the forums on fire.



Seraphiel said:


> Just be honest and tell the dude he's gonna be banned soon and that no good arguments were brought forth, literal t_d/pol tier drivel was spewed out.



Ahh one of the architects of this nonsense appears.

Ill be here long after everyone in this thread is gone telling the ashes "told you so"

Reactions: Like 1


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## FLORIDA MAN (Aug 26, 2018)




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## Yin (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Dude the forums on fire.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Too soon..


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## Chloe (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> the problem is most of the people demanding inclusivity are unreasonable, violent, bigoted, twisted and at odds with _97% of the human race._


the calcs


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Yin said:


> Too soon..



Well, I give you points for efficiency in how swiftly y'all blue shit up 



Chloe said:


> the calcs



Most valid studies not done by people or groups with agenda either way support that figure


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## Yin (Aug 26, 2018)

Seraphiel said:


> Just be honest and tell the dude he's gonna be *banned soon* and that no good arguments were brought forth, literal t_d/pol tier drivel was spewed out.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Seraphiel is what happens when you let sjws contribute to society. They end up spreading fascism everywhere


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## Prince Vegeta (Aug 26, 2018)

These new rules are being made due to the fact a super mod went crying like a child and had a mental breakdown in the SCR. Which then promoted A white man to go crying his emo partner and told her to take time off of cutting herself and implement new rules. TLDR: CBers are a bunch of babies


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## Reznor (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Dude the forums on fire.


That's true, but I'm sick this weekend and all the shit happened now.
There's a bunch of things to deal with and I'm not sure the order with which to deal with them. Here's a quickie though:

It would help if contributions in this thread would be solution focused, because it doesn't take any special insight to point out the problem and doesn't really get us any closer to solving this. This thread is about what rules we need to make it work. Literally noone on this forum cares to solve any of these problems until it's on fire, and then the solution needs to happen immediately.

The range of things to deal with:
- Loose canon mods (being addressed, some of this is visible already)
- Shifting enforcement focus to more egregious matters - we let the wrong people have second chances. (we probably shouldn't stick to perms on flamers, we probably should stick to perms on harassment/pedos/whatever.)
- Toxic environment caused largely by forum gangs

I'm trying to deal with the first two things first, but all of the problems keep tying themselves to other problems and it's big mess.


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## Reznor (Aug 26, 2018)

Prince Vegeta said:


> These new rules are being made due to the fact a super mod went crying like a child and had a mental breakdown in the SCR.


I posted this months ago, and I asked for input

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Prince Vegeta said:


> These new rules are being made due to the fact a super mod went crying like a child and had a mental breakdown in the SCR. Which then promoted A white man to go crying his emo partner and told her to take time off of cutting herself and implement new rules. TLDR: CBers are a bunch of babies



To be fair to Reznor this thread predates Seraphiel and the psyche ward brigade deciding to impose hysterical nonsense on the forum and a bunch of jackals from the cafe and corrupt mods started targeting users they dont like.

So this is less the end result and more the precursor.



R3ZSN0R3 said:


> That's true, but I'm sick this weekend and all the shit happened now.
> There's a bunch of things to deal with and I'm not sure the order with which to deal with them. Here's a quickie though:
> 
> It would help if contributions in this thread would be solution focused, because it doesn't take any special insight to point out the problem and doesn't really get us any closer to solving this. This thread is about what rules we need to make it work. Literally noone on this forum cares to solve any of these problems until it's on fire, and then the solution needs to happen immediately.
> ...



Ill toss you some more constructive posts after I take a nap. Get well well though 

Also stop modding people with psychological problems. A general rule of thumb is if you have spent time in a psychiatric hospital or have panic attacks because of words online

You have no business being a mod.

The second would be, mods need to face punishments and sanctions when they step out of line.

Also I like the idea of focusing on perme for brigaders, pedos and harassers. That would work, most flaming comes from a certain clique of trolls using the victim card and the rules to get users banned.

Reactions: Like 2


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## FLORIDA MAN (Aug 26, 2018)

Reznor, my offer to get admin’d still stands.

I still care. And I still have a vision.

We can make this right.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Nataly (Aug 26, 2018)

Shit always happen during the worst time possible, the law of unluckiness.

It is pretty obvious the forum is experiencing some crazy times right now. To tell the truth, we can all sit around and think about what new rules to make and which ones need to be updated, but the bigger issue here is the _enforcement _of these rules, the actual practicality of putting already existing rules to action.



> Shifting enforcement focus to more egregious matters - we let the wrong people have second chances. (we probably shouldn't stick to perms on flamers, we probably should stick to perms on harassment/pedos/whatever.)


Is this even worth discussing as far as keeping confirmed pedophiles permanently banned? This should not even be questionable.

On another note, every ban and situation is individual, I understand; and second chances are possible for some members (based on the reason for a ban). However, there are cases when the member cannot be allowed back under any circumstances, and you all know who those ones are/might be. Those examples should not be forgotten no matter what.


> Toxic environment caused largely by forum gangs



Those, to whom you refer as 'forum gangs', are not necessarily creating a toxic environment; they are micromanaging the things that need to be addressed (sometimes quicker and more efficient), but in their own ways which sometimes can be harsh and over the line (I'll give you that).

Reactions: Like 2


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## God Movement (Aug 26, 2018)

We definitely need to put an end to these forum gangs. And I am willing to work with you Reznor to put an end to these thugs whoever they are.

Reactions: Like 4


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Permanently banning the users behind the rallying cry for censorship and demodding any mod e-Dating them admin or not.

That might be a good start. This enire fiasco started because khaleesi in a moment of thoughtless anger said something bigoted towards men and a bunch of racist xenophobes like Seraphiel decided to exploit her anguish to push for rules they could then use to purge the site of users they dont like.

I don't think I need to point out how batshit insane it is to appease a bunch of preening psychopathic bigots and how doing so only invites one kind of response.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

God Movement said:


> We definitely need to put an end to these forum gangs. And I am willing to work with you Reznor to put an end to these thugs whoever they are.



The OBD can get behind this, if the DB section and the staff dont mind working together, we can build a better tomorrow United without the draconian measures.
But I will say this, the staff need to pay a butchers bill they have put off for ten years. Certain retired staff need to be stripped of their perks (paralax), certain mods need to be removed from power. Best Gwei in the cafe needs to go, several cafe regulars need to eat bans.

Whoever, member and moderator alike lobied to ban slurs needs to have their accounts erased.

The hellfire they called down on the forum put us all in this position and they didnt do it because they actually care about combating racism but solely to remove people they dislike. What they did last night makes what Zetta did eight years ago pale in comparison and if you guys kept him banned for nearly a decade, then you can remove these people.

Its time to stop asking us for concessions and start offerring yourselves up for it.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Reznor (Aug 26, 2018)

Nataly said:


> Those, to whom you refer as 'forum gangs', are not necessarily creating a toxic environment; they are micromanaging the things that need to be addressed (sometimes quicker and more efficient), but in their own ways which sometimes can be harsh and over the line (I'll give you that).


I'm not really sure. I was vague since I hear conflicting things from different people, and I can't really throw out what I've heard without risk of backpeddling a few minutes later.
I realize what you're saying though - that vigilantism is often a response to failure of the system.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> I'm not really sure. I was vague since I hear conflicting things from different people, and I can't really throw out what I've heard without risk of backpeddling a few minutes later.
> I realize what you're saying though - that vigilantism is often a response to failure of the system.



This is certainly true in some cases, the OBD and its issues tends to come from it reacting to abuses, rather than initiating a crisis. In other situations though, not so much. The Cafe has no such excuse and the ones who pushed this insane policy and the ones who raided Juubs complaint thread, are all acting with malicious intent to attack users they dislike.


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## Chloe (Aug 26, 2018)

Nataly said:


> Is this even worth discussing as far as keeping confirmed pedophiles permanently banned? This should not even be questionable.


again you're too new to comment on this, you don't know the staff/posters of old. this is 100% an issue that has needed to be dealt with since before i joined.


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## Nataly (Aug 26, 2018)

Chloe said:


> again you're too new to comment on this, you don't know the staff/posters of old. this is 100% an issue that has needed to be dealt with since before i joined.


Understandable, and that's why Reznor brought this up so oldies can give their insight and help out with that. 
I stated my opinion based on what I have observed for my time being.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Nataly said:


> I am well aware about Kira and that whole story, it was brought up just recently in DB section and I heard about it prior to that.
> *And you should present these facts and make your case* not to me personally (a regular member) as you are doing right now, but to the staff you are dissatisfied with. But I appreciate a brief outlook at the dark past.
> And it's Nataly.



I thought you read my post? I went into detail about how we did just that and Reznor and co chose to ignore it


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

God Movement said:


> We definitely need to put an end to these forum gangs. And I am willing to work with you Reznor to put an end to these thugs whoever they are.


e-thugs op


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

actually if we're gonna get rid of e-thugs is @jayjay³² gonna be the first to go since he's the most notorious internet gangster?


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## Nataly (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I thought you read my post? I went into detail about how we did just that and Reznor and co chose to ignore it


I did, and I am sure the authority will pay attention to such an important subject, hopefully. It has been brought up several times and cannot be left alone. It's not over yet


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Nataly said:


> I did, and I am sure the authority will pay attention to such an important subject, hopefully. It has been brought up several times and cannot be left alone. It's not over yet



I remain unconvinced because nearly a decade of "lol just let them express themselves, stop being bigoted" is all I've gotten.

Actually in hindsight...I should apologize to Reznor, you weren't behind the decision to let gibs remain..my bad dude


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## God Movement (Aug 26, 2018)

JoJo said:


> e-thugs op



No I will not give you clout.

We need to stay on topic and get to the bottom of who these gangs are.


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## sworder (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I don't think I need to point out how batshit insane it is to appease a bunch of preening psychopathic bigots and how doing so only invites one kind of response.


coming from you this is grade A comedy

Reactions: Like 2


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## Chloe (Aug 26, 2018)

JoJo said:


> e-thugs op




RT me


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

God Movement said:


> No I will not give you clout.
> 
> We need to stay on topic and get to the bottom of who these gangs are.


you're lookin at the leader kiddo 

be happy i didn't reiatsu crush you already


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## God Movement (Aug 26, 2018)

JoJo said:


> you're lookin at the leader kiddo



@R3ZSN0R3 we found our guy.

You know what to do.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Nello (Aug 26, 2018)

Not gonna dignify the staff by taking this thread seriously but


The Immortal WatchDog said:


> The staff need to be subject


this is a complete joke and will never happen. I specifically asked reznor to either unmod a staffer or defend him. There was never a reply and there never will be despite a 50 page complaint thread. And here to prove me wrong I don't present @R3ZSN0R3


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

sworder said:


> coming from you this is grade A comedy



More people, who I don't know...thinking I'm satan 



God Movement said:


> @R3ZSN0R3 we found our guy.
> 
> You know what to do.



Well, that was quick

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~M~ (Aug 26, 2018)

This forum doesn't have a rule problem it has a relationship problem


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## Chloe (Aug 26, 2018)

~M~ said:


> This forum doesn't have a rule problem it has a relationship problem


if i were you i wouldn't be posting tbh


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

~M~ said:


> This forum doesn't have a rule problem it has a relationship problem



Rapists probably shouldn't talk.


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## Blacku (Aug 26, 2018)

People with mental health issues shouldn't be mods. We need leaders not people who have suicide hotline on speed dial.


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

~M~ said:


> This forum doesn't have a rule problem it has a relationship problem


just because we have a problem with ur relationships with minors it doesn't mean it's a bad thing


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Black otaku said:


> People with mental health issues shouldn't be mods. We need leaders not people who have suicide hotline on speed dial.



I can 100% endorse this..

This is wisdom. Sadly it will probably be ignored and the great ethical debater about if we should ban pedophiles or not will rage on.


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## ~M~ (Aug 26, 2018)

What I meant is that people have a problem communicating with one another like human beings like you guys refuse to do with me


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

~M~ said:


> What I meant is that people have a problem communicating with one another like human beings like you guys refuse to do with me



You're a p*d*p****, I can genuinely say without flaming, you should face the death penalty for what you did.

You forfeited your right to breathing much less civil discourse when you decided to fuck a kid.


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## Queen Vag (Aug 26, 2018)

~M~ said:


> What I meant is that people have a problem communicating with one another like human beings like you guys refuse to do with me



you didn't have this grievance when you were calling people "shit posters" and "garbage" for no reason other than to get epats on the back

And now you do after your predatory behavior with minors got exposed

Reactions: Like 3


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

literally just mod me for the alley and i'll fix nf


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## Duke Ysmir01 (Aug 26, 2018)

All this 'cause a super mod had a mental breakdown? Yikes! She should learn this is the internet and not take things so seriously.


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## Deleted member 198194 (Aug 26, 2018)

Khaleesi is de-staffed and level 2 banned, but judging by the omniscient knowledge of grapevine sloths you'd think she was the architect of all of this.  Really jogs the noggin.


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

Ysmir01 said:


> All this cause a super mod had a mental breakdown? Yikes! She should learn this is the internet and not take things so seriously.


>calling someone a retard and telling them to fuck off cause u dont wanna interact with said retard is them being assblasted or having a mental breakdown because some retard can't handle being called retarded

when will this widespread meme that goes beyond nf end
literally the worst internet meme out there

Reactions: Like 1


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## God Movement (Aug 26, 2018)

JoJo said:


> >calling someone a retard and telling them to fuck off cause u dont wanna interact with said retard is them being assblasted or having a mental breakdown because some retard can't handle being called retarded
> 
> when will this widespread meme that goes beyond nf end
> literally the worst internet meme out there



What are you rambling on about? Get a job!


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

God Movement said:


> What are you rambling on about? Get a job!


dude im fuckin tryin but all the goddamn internships for junior year college students are demanding like 5+ years of exp and proficiency in computer languages that aren't apart of my degree of study


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## Blacku (Aug 26, 2018)




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## Juub (Aug 26, 2018)

JoJo said:


> dude im fuckin tryin but all the goddamn internships for junior year college students are demanding like 5+ years of exp and proficiency in computer languages that aren't apart of my degree of study


Start with HTML. Then move on to Javascript, CSS, C, C++, CSharp etc. It's really not hard. Most difficult one is your first. What are you applying for anyway? Plenty of free resources to learn programming languages.


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## Duke Ysmir01 (Aug 26, 2018)

JoJo said:


> >calling someone a retard and telling them to fuck off cause u dont wanna interact with said retard is them being assblasted or having a mental breakdown because some retard can't handle being called retarded
> 
> when will this widespread meme that goes beyond nf end
> literally the worst internet meme out there



Only three things are *infinite*, the duration of a meme, the universe and human stupidity. I can show you the first one as a reward for you showing me an example of one of the others. I think you will like it, it's the one of kids over 20 still asking parents for money end


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

afgpride said:


> Khaleesi is de-staffed and level 2 banned, but judging by the omniscient knowledge of grapevine sloths you'd think she was the architect of all of this.  Really jogs the noggin.


it's almost like when you conform your standards to the lowest common denominator of care bears of who are not only assblasted but also want any level of retribution against what they feel has made them victims unrelated parties (like loz in this case) gets hit in the crossfire. and then even after that the actual people who abuse their power and are shit mods don't any kind of punishment 

it's only almost like this

Reactions: Like 1


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## Atlantic Storm (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> four years ago Reznor allowed Gibs and his forum to have asylum here in NF, several of us who were mods on Viz provided proof Gibs was an animal and kiddy fucker. This proof was deemed "shitposting and just joking" and a heavily photoshopped series of Visitor messages were used by Gibs to claim we were "harassing him' Reznor and Atlantic Storm and Dream all were totally A okay with ignoring our warnings and allowing this sick fuck to post here...He's still here too this day.



don't name drop me for something i wasn't involved in, please - i was just modded around the time gibbs was causing trouble, and have no recollection of being contacted by you or anyone


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## JoJo (Aug 26, 2018)

y'know what nf actually needs instead of more mods or whatever? an internal affairs committee outside of the staff to purge the garbage that's polluting and corrupting the people with power on this site 

:jaeorc


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Atlantic Storm said:


> don't name drop me for something i wasn't involved in, please - i was just modded around the time gibbs was causing trouble, and have no recollection of being contacted by you or anyone



I swear I keep confusing you for other mods and it pisses me off because I like talking to you and feel like ite disrespectful

Yes I absolutely confused you for another mod, I am sorry 



afgpride said:


> Khaleesi is de-staffed and level 2 banned, but judging by the omniscient knowledge of grapevine sloths you'd think she was the architect of all of this.  Really jogs the noggin.



Is anyone really accusing her of running it? Ive said it from the word go that I thought her being demodded and banned was a harsh reaction to whatever she said in public. No idea what was actually said between her and the staff and if that justified that.

She got heated, made a mistake Ive been there and then some. And it wasnt even that bad of a mistake. At least the public one. I do think people used her situation to justify bullshit but she is innocent of that.

At least in my book, if I missed post where she was being called the mastermind behind this my bad

Reactions: Like 1


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## Lucaniel (Aug 26, 2018)

~M~ said:


> This forum doesn't have a rule problem it has a relationship problem


lol youve got a relationships with underage boys problem


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## Reznor (Aug 26, 2018)

> Actually in hindsight...I should apologize to Reznor, you weren't behind the decision to let gibs remain..my bad dude


 We did have a very Lawful Neutral phase in the staff.

There was also a movement "Perms shouldn't be more than 1 year". Some were in support of it, some oppose to it... none were nuanced about it, sadly. The end result was that the members that were personally a headache to mods were deemed too much hassle to let return, and the members that weren't directly a hassle to mods but had extreme moral failings were allowed rehabilitation. 
This wasn't a move to explicitly defend such members by anyone (to my knowledge), but implicitly it certainly gives off that impression.

We're trying to reverse that now, and reevaluating the perms we kept and the perms we undid. There's a lot going on right now, so individual parts are going at a pretty slow pace. We've settled for unbanning people with offense that weren't strong moral failings, and cracking down on highly suggestive loli sets. I suppose that skipping ahead to reopenning cases of pedos is something that deserves priority though.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> We did have a very Lawful Neutral phase in the staff.
> 
> There was also a movement "Perms shouldn't be more than 1 year". Some were in support of it, some oppose to it... none were nuanced about it, sadly. The end result was that the members that were personally a headache to mods were deemed too much hassle to let return, and the members that weren't directly a hassle to mods but had extreme moral failings were allowed rehabilitation.
> This wasn't a move to explicitly defend such members by anyone (to my knowledge), but implicitly it certainly gives off that impression.
> ...



Yeah you've mentioned this to me before and honestly, it sounds like an even bigger clusterfuck of intractable views then it does now. Let me ask you a question, do you have a chain of command? One Admin with the final say who can veto or back a decision and break the stalemate? Because for good or ill, it seems like that would help smooth things over on an internal level a lot?

What about our request for staff oversight/accountability? Because it sounds like there, people with really odd opinions on what constitutes right and wrong were able to hijack Naruko and Toby's  attempt at reform and run it into the ground


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## Unlosing Ranger (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> One Admin with the final say who can veto or back a decision and break the stalemate? Because for good or ill, it seems like that would help smooth things over on an internal level a lot?


Leadership does a lot to smooth things over faster.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Unlosing Ranger said:


> Leadership does a lot to smooth things over faster.



It also does a lot to channel everyone.

I'll also say this...and Ranger can add to this since he's on receiving end of Cafe abuse more than anyone. But y'all are losing mods left and right..good ones.

@R3ZSN0R3  Get Mr_Shadow the fuck out of the cafe and bounce his sorry Wumao ass back to regular member

Reactions: Like 1


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## Unlosing Ranger (Aug 26, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> It also does a lot to channel everyone.
> 
> I'll also say this...and Ranger can add to this since he's on receiving end of Cafe abuse more than anyone. But y'all are losing mods left and right..good ones.
> 
> @R3ZSN0R3  Get Mr_Shadow the fuck out of the cafe and bounce his sorry Wumao ass back to regular member


It's true recently people I'd consider decent mods quit. This is a result of having mostly shit mods.
Also the cafe does have a tendency to abuse my views despite them not being the same of the right members most of the time. They just lump me in with them.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 26, 2018)

Unlosing Ranger said:


> It's true recently people I'd consider decent mods quit. This is a result of having mostly shit mods.
> Also the cafe does have a tendency to abuse my views despite them not being the same of the right members most of the time. They just lump me in with them.




Keep in mind Rez that most of the people doing what US is describing are the people advocating for these hyper censoring crusades yet they act like bigoted trolls and direct a complicit mod to target us. You want to prove there's oversight and fairness now?

Shadow has to go...as does Marcelle


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## Eros (Aug 26, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> - Shifting enforcement focus to more egregious matters - we let the wrong people have second chances. (we probably shouldn't stick to perms on flamers, we probably should stick to perms on harassment/pedos/whatever.)


As far as pedos go, here's a thought. There are a lot of forums that make it against the rules to talk about that particular subject in that particular context in addition to other socially unacceptable paraphilias like zoophilia, necrophilia, and being into snuff films. That way, the related flaming, trolling, and other related problems are kept to a minimum, and those who bring it up are dealt with accordingly and preferably don't talk about such predilitions to begin with.


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## Seraphiel (Aug 27, 2018)

~M~ said:


> What I meant is that people have a problem communicating with one another like human beings like you guys refuse to do with me


Ok I expressly remember you saying you had a 14yo boyfriend and that you were giving him drugs like a few years back. Did that not happen?


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## ~M~ (Aug 27, 2018)

Seraphiel said:


> Ok I expressly remember you saying you had a 14yo boyfriend and that you were giving him drugs like a few years back. Did that not happen?


No he was 16 which is legal in my state


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## Seraphiel (Aug 27, 2018)

~M~ said:


> No he was 16 which is legal in my state


Thanks for the reply.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 27, 2018)

~M~ said:


> No he was 16 which is legal in my state



This is a horrible defense of monstrous life choices...

"it was legal"

so is throwing gays off roofstops in certain parts of the middle east


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## ~M~ (Aug 27, 2018)

I met Devin at 16 and a month later he turned 17. Any other questions?


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 27, 2018)

~M~ said:


> I met Devin at 16 and a month later he turned 17. Any other questions?



Yeah why haven't you been perm banned from the forum

and strung up in real life


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## Fang (Aug 27, 2018)

afgpride said:


> Khaleesi is de-staffed and level 2 banned



Why? I'm not in the loop here, so break it down for the laymen.


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## shieldbounce (Aug 27, 2018)

Fang said:


> Why? I'm not in the loop here, so break it down for the laymen.


Going to request the same thing here. Not sure what happened with Khaleesi (considering she was still super mod a little while ago).

Hmm...


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## Seraphiel (Aug 27, 2018)

She's not banned and she's back.


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## Chloe (Aug 27, 2018)

~M~ said:


> I met Devin at 16 and a month later he turned 17. Any other questions?


what year did this occur, maybe even month if you remember


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## Deleted member 198194 (Aug 27, 2018)

Fang said:


> Why? I'm not in the loop here, so break it down for the laymen.


She's un-lv-2'd now, for the record.  But do you want the entire timeline or the recent one?  Don't know much about the latter.


*Spoiler*: __ 




-Suigetsu insults Val in a member picture thread in the alley, making fun of her nose
-Juub decides to be cheeky and use the opportunity to make a joke at Val's expense ("Agreed. He nose nothing about makeup")
-Khaleesi takes exception to it and says "And you know nothing about women, get a girlfriend before you start commenting on other women’s pictures", doesn't do anything to him aside of that (no warning or ban)
-Juub, offended at an smod talking to him rudely, pretends he never made the joke in the first place and was simply agreeing with them
-Khaleesi doesn't respond
-Juub PMs her continuing to play dumb and telling her she's being un-smod-like
-She calls him an incel
-He makes the Q&C thread and tries to get her de-staffed for being rude to him instead of politely entertaining his dindunuffin schtick
-She leaves for work and writes "I look forward to all the flames and misogyny when I get back"
-Since Juub is only trying to play dumb in order to manipulate the situation in his favor, he takes the opportunity to emphasize that she's being unreasonable and he simply wants a clean dialogue
-A staff member half-assedly brings up his initial joke, to which he replies with the comical excuse that it was just a "typo"
-The staff member buys it (or pretends to buy it), despite it being a half assed defense of an obvious pun made at Val's expense
-While she's at work and unable to respond to the thread, legions of people are hopping on the bandwagon and demanding she is removed for abusing her p-... for being mean to a disingenuous troll on the internet, and for being un-smod-like by not politely dealing with disingenuous trolls on the internet

-Following the thread being locked, people are continuing to complain and make a moral outrage over her insulting Juub
-She has a spat with staff and is fed up with the situation and leaves and asks to be lv-2'd
-Things begin to happen after the fact (such as OBDers getting banned, including Blade who's offending post was directed at her)
-People continue to use her as the scapegoat, transitioning her culpability from the Juub thread to the OBD-pocalypse and turning her into a satanic medusa in the process



Might have gotten some of the latter segment wrong, but the first segment is pretty much pristine.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Blacku (Aug 27, 2018)

Staff finally banned a pedo? 

Is this like when those dirty politician underaged sex rings get found out and they need a fall man

Reactions: Like 3


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## ~M~ (Aug 27, 2018)

Chloe said:


> what year did this occur, maybe even month if you remember


Sep 15 I imagine


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Aug 27, 2018)

afgpride said:


> -People continue to use her as the scapegoat, transitioning her culpability from the Juub thread to the OBD-pocalypse and turning her into a satanic medusa in the process
> 
> Might have gotten some of the latter segment wrong, but the first segment is pretty much pristine.



Uhh no one is blaming her for the Battledomepocalypse, we're blaming scheming vultures her used her situation to justify their own agenda. Khaleesi is blameless in what happened to the OBD


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## Eros (Aug 27, 2018)

Black otaku said:


> Staff finally banned a pedo?
> 
> Is this like when those dirty politician underaged sex rings get found out and they need a fall man


Wait. Which one? There are a lot of them. As I said before, adding a "don't talk about disgusting sexual paraphilias rule" to the rules is a great idea and is really long overdue. Not just for the pedos and dog fuckers, but for all of us. It means, just don't bring up these disgusting topics at all. And there is implied flame baiting anyway. A few years ago, a member was talking in the BH about having a murder fantasy, and it was dealt with. Why should pedophilia and bestiality be any different? It's utterly repulsive. If a member brings it up, then it should be an automatic warning, and an escalation all the way to a ban, because we keep having discussions like this, and tbh, if people are into it, they just need to keep it to themselves, but if they approach minors on this site, then they should be reported to the proper authorities like the FBI or Interpol. It's better for everyone just to make it a complete no-no like having a swastika in your avatar. All it does is piss people off, especially those of us who were sexually abused. I can't reach through the screen and beat the shit out of a pedo, so they should just shut the fuck up about it.


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## Raiden (Aug 27, 2018)

Reading through the thead. Definitely support some restrictions of the content shown in avatars. I think a few sets that I saw go a little too far, though most are good.

Ironically, the only problem I've had with the forum IRL is a story someone wrote about their girlfriend cheating on them. A few years back, my parents read that thread and asked me what the hell I was doing online.




JoJo said:


> dude im fuckin tryin but all the goddamn internships for junior year college students are demanding like 5+ years of exp and proficiency in computer languages that aren't apart of my degree of study



I have a friend who taught himself with Udemy and books. Bootcamp might not be a bad idea.


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## Fang (Aug 27, 2018)

afgpride said:


> She's un-lv-2'd now, for the record.  But do you want the entire timeline or the recent one?  Don't know much about the latter.
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...



I see.


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## Zenith (Aug 28, 2018)

Quickly skimming through the first page and all I'm seeing from Island is "I don't like X topic and Y words so they ought to not be allowed."

If that's not the textbook definition of a snowflake then I don't know what is.


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## Zenith (Aug 28, 2018)

Also stop acting like a paladin to women. I'm sure they can speak for themselves (unless you're a woman yourself, then I'm taking this back)

Reactions: Like 1


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## Zenith (Aug 28, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> the problem is most of the people demanding inclusivity are unreasonable, violent, bigoted, twisted and at odds with _97% of the human race._







The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I gotta ask, why this dude wasn't banned given..he admitted to criminal conduct.
> 
> Is this the same reason Gibs isn't banned despite the fact that he fucks dogs and children? Because Reznor and Dream feel like people need a second chance...even when they fuck dogs and children?







> [This would have more value if you Marxist trolls didn't hide behind corrupt Cafe mods, lynch people after organizing on discords ...and...call Es and myself race traitors every single time we dared to disagree with the narrative.



Absolutely disgusting behaviour to plot members banned behind their back. If you have any issue tell a) the person, b) the mods here



> You're a god damn joke, you guys rail roaded multiple users with your bullshit Cabal and conspire with an abusive mod to silence any kind of dissent on your section. You Jackals are why we're here right now.



Prior to you and Es posting in the Cafe' (based on personal observation of course) this is what the standard routine of the posters looked like:

1. bash Trump
2. his supporters
3. tag baconbits out of the blue to defend Trump's tweets (because supporting Trump is sinful according to the              secular jihadi)
4. pat each other on the back on how cultured and progressive they are
5. vanilla democrats and progressive democrats in-fighting (BernieBros vs Hillashills), all marinated with a pinch      of bitterness, kill whitey  and     Trump bashing for additional seasoning
_6. dulcis in fundo: _throw Nazi, "raycis" and bigot around with the same fervour and zeal a religious fanatic                would yell "heretic" or "infidel" to completely silence the opposition. Hence the expression secular jihadi



> If any section should take the highest amounts of bans for racism, its the Cafe and it aint guys like Zenith or Chalyndra who should be on the chopping block



Can you imagine how upsetting it must be for them to watch me elude the gallows right at the moment of execution?

Secular jihad: "Let the heads roll"

Me: "Not today, I'm afraid, not today "



Juub said:


> Start with HTML. Then move on to Javascript, CSS, C, C++, CSharp etc. It's really not hard. Most difficult one is your first. What are you applying for anyway? Plenty of free resources to learn programming languages.



HTML is not a real language. And no, the process is not linear, as languages are just tools for accomplishing a certain goal. What you should've told him is to think of what he likes/wants to specialise in, and from the moment the choice is made, pick a language that can get him there.

Ignore my condescending tone, via text it's difficult to convey desire to help.



~M~ said:


> I met Devin at 16 and a month later he turned 17. Any other questions?



I used to be very judgemental of those I found morally bankrupt but I've watched this episode from Black Mirror that got me thinking about the fact that even people like you are human beings. So my advice is to seek medical help with no shame or remorse, otherwise you'll end up damaging the life of someone easily exploitable (read: a minor), and destroying another life >>>> your remorse or shame


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## Juub (Aug 28, 2018)

Raiden said:


> HTML is not a real language.


 Yes it is. Just a markup one.



> And no, the process is not linear, as languages are just tools for accomplishing a certain goal. What you should've told him is to think of what he likes/wants to specialise in, and from the moment the choice is made, pick a language that can get him there.


I agree with that but seems he just wants to learn language with no specific goal in mind. From experience, most people new at this with no idea on what they actually wanna accomplish outta start with HTML because it does things they are familiar with and is fairly easy to understand and cover many of the basics. The other ones I mentioned are mostly object oriented and once again, while you are right it is not a linear path I feel it is easier to move onto these than on anything else. From memory Codecadmy, Udemy and TeamTreeHouse all start with HTML to teach languages to beginners. I definitely agree with your general sentiment though.



> Ignore my condescending tone, via text it's difficult to convey desire to help.


No offense taken. Was simply telling him what worked for me and many people I know.


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## Raiden (Aug 28, 2018)

Juub said:


> Yes it is. Just a markup one.
> .



EDIT: Ugh seems to be a misquote here. I didn't say that HTML is not a language .


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## Zenith (Aug 28, 2018)

Juub said:


> Yes it is. Just a markup one.



Well executed comeback, although it's because of my ambiguous wording. Let me rephrase: HTML is not a real programming language. Markup, yes, programming language, no. And no, I'm not being pedantic, pedantry is for intellectuals with no jobs, but a distinction ought to be made. If HTML is a language, then CSS is too and everything and the kitchen sink.

C++ is a programming language because you can use it to build things but HTML is just structure. You can't write a new browser with HTML, but you can with C++ (or other programming languages). What HTML does is give structure to a website. Nothing is been created; constructs like <div> <body> etc. have already been defined/built by a real programming language, and the designer/developer just has to use said constructs within their defined use-case: making web stuff. You can't deploy an HTML-only software on a drone or medical device or any other domain outside of the Web environment.


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## Juub (Aug 28, 2018)

Zenith said:


> Well executed comeback, although it's because of my ambiguous wording. Let me rephrase: HTML is not a real programming language. Markup, yes, programming language, no. And no, I'm not being pedantic, pedantry is for intellectuals with no jobs, but a distinction ought to be made. If HTML is a language, then CSS is too and everything and the kitchen sink.
> 
> C++ is a programming language because you can use it to build things but HTML is just structure. You can't write a new browser with HTML, but you can with C++ (or other programming languages). What HTML does is give structure to a website. Nothing is been created; constructs like <div> <body> etc. have already been defined/built by a real programming language, and the designer/developer just has to use said constructs within their defined use-case: making web stuff. You can't deploy an HTML-only software on a drone or medical device or any other domain outside of the Web environment.


Glad we got it clarified although our posts are kinda useless now. The person who asked is banned.


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## Zenith (Aug 28, 2018)

Juub said:


> Glad we got it clarified although our posts are kinda useless now. The person who asked is banned.



Need to bill Tazmo for loss of time? Opportunity cost and all of that


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## Juub (Aug 28, 2018)

Zenith said:


> Need to bill Tazmo for loss of time? Opportunity cost and all of that




Not talking to someone with a Bruins avatar.


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## Reznor (Sep 2, 2018)

The new rules are up.


Thanks to everyone that gave input.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> The new rules are up.
> 
> 
> Thanks to everyone that gave input.





> *Flaming*:
> Personal attacks and insults aimed at a member or their family or attempts at character assassination is not allowed. Banter between friends and or heated comments towards fictional characters are generally permitted.
> 
> *Baiting*:
> ...



these are so board any SJW on the staff is going to be able to target and abuse anyone they disagree with easily and its already happening.

you've gotta scale back on the hypersensitivity or make a mod banning someone for ideological reasons ground for a permanent demotion and perm banning.

You're asking us to accept rules we know the staff will abuse without offering any kind of checks on the staff. This is unacceptable frankly.

edit - amusingly enough though, the OBD is where the "don't be dismissive or passive aggressive' will do the most good in ensuring users like Cain, Strongarm and Catalyst face perm section bans for their usual conduct...the down side is...that requires mods objective enough to enforce that.


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## Aphrodite (Sep 2, 2018)

Staff is always gonna do what they want no matter how much they change the rules.


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## ~M~ (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> You're asking us to accept rules we know the staff will abuse without offering any kind of checks on the staff.


There was never a serious implication it would be otherwise. Kind of the underlying irony surrounding any discussion regarding democracy on NF; the conclusion is always to remain an oligarchy.


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## Island (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> This is unacceptable frankly.


If it's unacceptable, what's going to happen if they don't do anything?


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## Reznor (Sep 2, 2018)

Does anyone have a clip of the scene in Arrested Development in which George Micheal gets the staircar stuck in a parking garage and then gets out and laughs so that noone would realize he was driving it?


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> Does anyone have a clip of the scene in Arrested Development in which George Micheal gets the staircar stuck in a parking garage and then gets out and laughs so that noone would realize he was driving it?



You do realize, by your own rules you should be banned for this level of passive aggression?


Island said:


> What I'm saying here is that something being unacceptable implies that you won't allow it to happen; what exact will happen if/when NF reaches this "unacceptable" state that you're describing?



Are you trying to bait me into saying something that'd get me banned? How far you've fallen hanging out in that cesspool.

Also, no idea but presumably the same thing that's happened every other time...there's a clusterfuck, users vs staff anti mod rhetoric....its a gigantic clusterfuck as noted before, the staff burn out and we outlast them.

As usual...

or worse? Who the fuck knows...the point is, this is an act of naked insanity, its unacceptable to anyone with a brain and the staff need to have less rules and more honesty and diligence not more.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~M~ (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Then it falls on the userbase to use any means to force the issue whether the staff want to address it or not.


I don't disagree but the staff clique literally rallies in equal force against members. When they, again literally, outnumber the active posters, it's inherent the political climate is more "mum's the word" rather than  something substantial.


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## Island (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Are you trying to bait me into saying something that'd get me banned? How far you've fallen hanging out in that cesspool.


No, I really want to know.

You guys have mentioned before about how stuff is unacceptable and how you won't tolerate whatever problem you have, but I'm not sure where you're going with all of it. There was that copypasta last week too about how NF wouldn't be anything without the OBD, but... what's the point of saying all this stuff if there's zero intent of doing anything? Is it just posturing? Are you trying to play hardball and negotiate an agreeable solution? Are you just venting frustration?

What I'm getting at here is, what's the end goal of stuff like "this is unacceptable to us" and "you guys are nothing without us?"


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## ~M~ (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> What I'm saying here is that something being unacceptable implies that you won't allow it to happen; what exact will happen if/when NF reaches this "unacceptable" state that you're describing?


You're skewing language. To find something unacceptable all he has to do is not accept it. He does not. Acceptance means acquiescence, agreement, compliance, etc. He offers none. 

Why are you splitting hairs in an attempt to paint this picture as acceptable? Well obviously you accept the scenario. That's fine but it doesn't change that finding something disgustingly unacceptable doesn't imply action. If someone won't allow something to happen they say "I won't allow this to happen"


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## Reznor (Sep 2, 2018)

I don't really see why the N word is needed for the OBD, so I'm not going to assume that anyone asked for that is speaking for them.


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## Eros (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> What I'm saying here is that something being unacceptable implies that you won't allow it to happen; what exact will happen if/when NF reaches this "unacceptable" state that you're describing?


If the rules are enforced evenly, then its no longer allowed along with references to a certain The Boondocks character and a book by Harriet Beecher Stowe.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

~M~ said:


> You're skewing language. To find something unacceptable all he has to do is not accept it. He does not. Acceptance means acquiescence, agreement, compliance, etc. He offers none.
> 
> Why are you splitting hairs in an attempt to paint this picture as acceptable? Well obviously you accept the scenario. That's fine but it doesn't change that finding something disgustingly unacceptable doesn't imply action. If someone won't allow something to happen they say "I won't allow this to happen"



Because he's trying to bait me into a perm ban as is reznor because neither of them have an ethical or moral leg to stand on so they're both resorting to this...disgusting farce.



R3ZSN0R3 said:


> I don't really see why the N word is needed for the OBD, so I'm not going to assume that anyone asked for that is speaking for them.



It's not about the word its about the hypocrisy and preexisting moderator abuse under the guise of "preventing racism" of which OBD and Dragonball posters. You again refuse to address the fact that you need to at the very least purge the staff of certain crap moderators.

Are you going to apologize for lying about my post by the way? And attacking my character? Because you just got caught cold doing that.


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## Island (Sep 2, 2018)

~M~ said:


> You're skewing language. To find something unacceptable all he has to do is not accept it. He does not. Acceptance means acquiescence, agreement, compliance, etc. He offers none.
> 
> Why are you splitting hairs in an attempt to paint this picture as acceptable? Well obviously you accept the scenario. That's fine but it doesn't change that finding something disgustingly unacceptable doesn't imply action. If someone won't allow something to happen they say "I won't allow this to happen"


I'm not skewing anything.

If somebody says that something is unacceptable, the natural follow-up to that is "Okay, so what now? What do you plan on doing about it?"

A semantic argument is pointless and so are accusations of dishonesty. I'll just ask @The Immortal WatchDog directly: what _do _you want out of all this and how are these posts helping you get there?


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> I don't really see why the N word is needed for the OBD, so I'm not going to assume that anyone asked for that is speaking for them.



No I was calling the staff who banned Blade and Es stingy, uptight carrion eaters...but sure I'll continue to report racism in the Cafe, which will continue to be ignored, I'll continue to inform you whenever one of your mods abuses these rules and outright lies about a user being racist and I'll continue to call you out for blatantly abusive attacks on my character...

I'm absolutely not going to relent on that,no matter how much you threaten me...as you're doing now.



Island said:


> I'm not skewing anything.
> 
> If somebody says that something is unacceptable, the natural follow-up to that is "Okay, so what now? What do you plan on doing about it?"
> 
> A semantic argument is pointless and so are accusations of dishonesty. I'll just ask @Immortal WatchDog directly: what _do _you want out of all this and how are these posts helping you get there?



I'm not going to answer any more of your questions because its very clear what you're doing...so thank you for making me feel like crap for defending you for years when people on this and other sites told me you were part of the problem



Juub said:


> @The Immortal WatchDog




Still waiting on that apology Rez...one that isn't back handed.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

@R3ZSN0R3 Is there somewhere I can read what lead to the rule changes? Why now? What for? What direction is this place headed to?


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## Hachibi (Sep 2, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> Fair enough. Clearly you were calling out Hachibi's post that you quote.
> I hope I can continue to count on you to help call out people for making posts like the one you quoted.





The post I made was nothing more than an observation, nothing more

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~M~ (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> I'm not skewing anything.
> 
> If somebody says that something is unacceptable, the natural follow-up to that is "Okay, so what now? What do you plan on doing about it?"
> 
> A semantic argument is pointless and so are accusations of dishonesty. I'll just ask @Immortal WatchDog directly: what _do _you want out of all this and how are these posts helping you get there?


I agree to digress but counter that people can tell when something is wrong, unfair, or unacceptable without having a complete solution to the issue. The important thing is identifying the issue in the first place. If we can't trust our judges to distribute justice and rely on ourselves for what's acceptable behavior, what is the point of them? I'm fine with self-reliance, even an anarchistic forum, but the fact is that this isn't one and our justice system serves, it seems, no one.


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## Island (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I'm not going to answer any more of your questions because its very clear what you're doing...so thank you for making me feel like crap for defending you for years when people on this and other sites told me you were part of the problem


I know we have our disagreements, but regardless of how either of us feel about each other, it's a genuine question that needs answering if you (or anyone else) wants to go anywhere with this: what are you trying to get out of all this and how do you plan on getting there?

For example, what good is accusing Reznor of threatening you going to do? Do you expect him to see the error of his ways and suddenly rewrite the rules to your exact specification? Again, where do you expect to go with the posts made here?

I've made a few SCR threads in my day outlining the problem I had, showing evidence, and proposing a solution.

I'm not your enemy. I'm not trying to troll you or get you banned. As you might have noticed, I even like posting in the OBD occasionally, and also, I don't particularly like the staff either.

I really do want to know what you want out of all this and how you plan on getting there. It would be a lot more productive than bickering back and forth.



~M~ said:


> I agree to digress but counter that people can tell when something is wrong, unfair, or unacceptable without having a complete solution to the issue. The important thing is identifying the issue in the first place. If we can't trust our judges to distribute justice and rely on ourselves for what's acceptable behavior, what is the point of them? I'm fine with self-reliance, even an anarchistic forum, but the fact is that this isn't one and our justice system serves, it seems, no one.


Sure, I agree with that.

A person can think something is wrong or unfair without have a solution, but they clearly have a solution in mind. Said solution is sandwiched between a lot of arguing, so that proposed solution is unclear.

Also, my initial question wasn't solution-focused. It was literally "since this is unacceptable, what happens when you don't get your way?" It was a slightly snide remark, but it's also useful for figuring this clusterfuck out: is the intention to keep bickering in rules threads, to accept whatever the outcome is, or something else?


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> I don't really see why the N word is needed for the OBD, so I'm not going to assume that anyone asked for that is speaking for them.


Its a fucking word renzor

no one will spontaneously combust from it


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## Reznor (Sep 2, 2018)

Es said:


> Its a fucking word renzor
> no one will spontaneously combust from it


 Will anyone spontaneously combust from _not _saying it?

Reactions: Like 2


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> Will anyone spontaneously combust from _not _saying it?


You're trying to police speech to protect feels Renzor stop being a spud


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> Will anyone spontaneously combust from _not _saying it?



when you censor language you empower the very attitude you wish to discourage and embolden those who would escalate things to unhealthy degrees...

Why, the fuck..does this need explaining?

Reactions: Like 1


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> when you censor language you empower the very attitude you wish to discourage and embolden those who would escalate things to unhealthy degrees...
> 
> Why, the fuck..does this need explaining?


Because you are talking to a starch


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## Eros (Sep 2, 2018)

Juub said:


> While I understand where you are coming from, he used it in a way the word is intended to be used. You can't say the way he used it is inappropriate. The context might be but if it was his intention all along and he did that to prove a point, what can we really say?


Literally using it right about the n word is used? No. It was still inappropriate.


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> when you censor language you empower the very attitude you wish to discourage and embolden those who would escalate things to unhealthy degrees...
> 
> Why, the fuck..does this need explaining?


no it doesn't

you ban them and that's that, problem solved

which begs the question, why are you not banned yet?


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## Lucaniel (Sep 2, 2018)

the mayocide has begun 

gentlemen, ready your BlackedRaw gifs


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## Island (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> There's no point, you're asking me to appease someone who has lied to my face in this and other threads and keeps shifting the blame away from the staff.
> 
> This forum is beyond saving unless the staff are held to account for their misdeeds and this insane censorship that serves only to give your buddies in the Cafe and other sections grounds to lynch users they don't like and "protection" under the rules the forum is going to gradually alienate everyone until it becomes a half dead hugbox doomed to fading away.
> 
> This forum can't be saved...this is being done entirely for posterity.


My understanding of the problem is that Reznor (and the rest of the staff) want the forum to have a certain image while you guys want to have the OBD modded based on its current culture.

What about making the OBD invisible to everybody who doesn't explicitly request permission to view it like the Chatterbox was for awhile?

Presumably, you guys could have whatever microcosm you wanted if the section was invisible.


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

I used to call skinheads back home in rural Montana snow apes to make them fuck off so the dreaded n-word has its uses


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Eros said:


> Literally using it right about the n word is used? No. It was still inappropriate.



I love this, first it was my avatar...now its my language 



Es said:


> Because you are talking to a starch



that begs the question.

are



and 



also racist?



sworder said:


> no it doesn't
> 
> you ban them and that's that, problem solved
> 
> which begs the question, why are you not banned yet?



Because you guys are louder, more bigoted and aggressive than I ever could be? 



Lucaniel said:


> the mayocide has begun
> 
> gentlemen, ready your BlackedRaw gifs




You whined until the word pajeet was censored....now you're smugly shitposting about basically giving the forum aids?


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

Lucaniel said:


> the mayocide has begun
> 
> gentlemen, ready your BlackedRaw gifs


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> My understanding of the problem is that Reznor (and the rest of the staff) want the forum to have a certain image while you guys want to have the OBD modded based on its current culture.



And my problem is...people the world over are growing sick and tired of that image, recognize it as repressive, hateful and intolerant and are rebelling against it on almost every continent where its values are preached. Reznor wants to basically put the site on the wrong side of a culture war, that has, historically always turned backwards to irreverent defiance and rl shitposting. 

He's committing suicide in short...right when people are saying "We don't accept your morality, we will not permit you to force it on us"


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

Oh for fuck's sake this is painful to watch as it seems nobody gets it.

@The Immortal WatchDog correct me if I'm wrong but this is what I understand from your post and I think this is where you stand. Correct me if I'm wrong.

@R3ZSN0R3 and @Island 

He's saying the rule changes are deliberately targeting a specific group of people, mainly the OBD which he is part of. Why? because those rules are fashioned in a way to suppress certain people while letting others on the other side of the spectrum walk freely. Why did he mentioned left-wings? It wasn't deflection. He used an actual, tangible example of people being guilty of the same sins the new rules are meant to take care of. Except there are no new rules to keep in check those people's behavior(the left wings, SJW, call them however you want). In short, the rules stifle and suppress one side but they do nothing against another side and come across as heavily biased. What about shit like incels, toxic masculinity and the like? You know, shit leftists use against other people but for some reason are seen as more acceptable. So when IWD goes to the Cafe to discuss whatever topic of the day, he'll have to watch his mouth over what he says else he gets the boot whereas his adversaries will keep acting like self-righteous assholes and get no repercussions for it.

In short, the new rules are horsecrap and biased. They target a very obvious group and are made to suppress certain users. They are not there for fairness or whatever.

That's what I got it at least.


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## Eros (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I love this, first it was my avatar...now its my language


I was wrong about the avatar. This is something else entirely. You intentionally chose that word because of the similarity to the other, the difference in meaning notwithstanding. There are plenty of other words that could be used. 



> cheap, mean, miserly, parsimonious, close-fisted, penny-pinching, cheeseparing, grasping, ungenerous, illiberal;
> _informal_stingy, tight, tightfisted


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## Reznor (Sep 2, 2018)

@The Immortal WatchDog I'm not trying to ban you for being racist, I'm trying to tell you to not do this type of thing since we're going to have to start banning for this.
Why are you fighting so hard for this?


The Immortal WatchDog said:


> There's nothing to defend because its an outright fabrication...And you're conflating blade and their like deliberately dropping N bombs to make fun of political correctness and not because they're racists with racism.
> 
> It's dishonest as fuck and it proves their point about you...


This is like, a step below Texas Sharpshooter Fallacy.


The Immortal WatchDog said:


> like I said I deliberately used the word in the hopes that someone like you would come a long and attempt to call me a racist...to prove a point about how dishonest this all is.
> 
> You did exactly what I predicted you'd do...now you should apologize for jumping the gun and insulting me.


I didn't call you racist

You did say that you made a post deliberately to trick people into thinking you were being racist though. I would like you to avoid making posts that makes people think you're racist, whether a trick or by content.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Juub said:


> Oh for fuck's sake this is painful to watch as it seems nobody gets it.
> 
> @The Immortal WatchDog correct me if I'm wrong but this is what I understand from your post and I think this is where you stand. Correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> ...




absolutely this

with a healthy dose of "Political correctness is being opposed by more and more people and more and more popculture and open violence against those who advocate it with a silent majority of support is going to be a reality in the next few years...This isn't going to help the forums long term survival but hurt it"

but mostly the above...and not just the OBD...but the DB section and others as well.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Natty (Sep 2, 2018)

Can't be surprised that the more spiteful people are lashing out about a rule change to make the forum more inviting to newcomers.


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## Reznor (Sep 2, 2018)

Juub said:


> He's saying the rule changes are deliberately targeting a specific group of people, mainly the OBD which he is part of. Why? because those rules are fashioned in a way to suppress certain people while letting others on the other side of the spectrum walk freely. Why did he mentioned left-wings? It wasn't deflection. He used an actual, tangible example of people being guilty of the same sins the new rules are meant to take care of. Except there are no new rules to keep in check those people's behavior(the left wings, SJW, call them however you want). In short, the rules stifle and suppress one side but they do nothing against another side and come across as heavily biased. What about shit like incels, toxic masculinity and the like? You know, shit leftists use against other people but for some reason are seen as more acceptable. So when IWD goes to the Cafe to discuss whatever topic of the day, he'll have to watch his mouth over what he says else he gets the boot whereas his adversaries will keep acting like self-righteous assholes and get no repercussions for it.
> 
> In short, the new rules are horsecrap and biased. They target a very obvious group and are made to suppress certain users. They are not there for fairness or whatever.
> 
> That's what I got it at least.


Is your suggestion "don't listen to their suggestions" or do you have suggestions of your own?


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> You did say that you made a post deliberately to trick people into thinking you were being racist though. I would like you to avoid making posts that makes people think you're racist, whether a trick or by content.


It was to prove a point

you are stupid


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

Natty said:


> Can't be surprised that the more spiteful people are lashing out about a rule change to make the forum more inviting to newcomers.


Yes yes a person who posts about degenerate shit in plain site is talking about being welcoming


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## Natty (Sep 2, 2018)

Es said:


> Yes yes a person who posts about degenerate shit in plain site is talking about being welcoming



A lot more inviting than using slurs and being an ass


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> @The Immortal WatchDog I'm not trying to ban you for being racist, I'm trying to tell you to not do this type of thing since we're going to have to start banning for this.
> Why are you fighting so hard for this?[



For every reason I've tried to hammer into your head and have been vocal about for years...that seems to go into one ear and out the other.

Also you're flat out threatening me in this very thread...don't pretend like you aren't



R3ZSN0R3 said:


> This is like, a step below Texas Sharpshooter Fallacy.



No, it really isn't Rez...you're validating that kind of conduct period.


R3ZSN0R3 said:


> I didn't call you racist
> 
> You did say that you made a post deliberately to trick people into thinking you were being racist though. I would like you to avoid making posts that makes people think you're racist, whether a trick or by content.



in other words "Please, don't expose us for the hypocritical, intolerant, bigots we actually are! Or I'll ban you, for outing us as hypocritical, dishonest, intolerant bigots willing to do anything to justify our atrocious conduct'

Do you truly see, why some users just might take issue with this? While you continue to defend the Cafe and its mods who are blatantly abusive and conspire against users?

Why are you being so obtuse? 



R3ZSN0R3 said:


> Is your suggestion "don't listen to their suggestions" or do you have suggestions of your own?



I would assume his suggestion is "abandon this madness now and actually ban bigoted mods who caused all of this by targeting users they didn't like and uniting two sections against the rest of the forum with their misconduct"
\
probably...



Es said:


> Yes yes a person who posts about degenerate shit in plain site is talking about being welcoming



Who is only dodging being an accomplice to Panda's degeneracy because she Ethirsts on the right people no less.

Reactions: Like 1


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

Juub said:


> Except there are no new rules to keep in check those people's behavior(the left wings, SJW, call them however you want). In short, the rules stifle and suppress one side but they do nothing against another side and come across as heavily biased. What about shit like incels, toxic masculinity and the like?



how the fuck is it biased 

the entire point is to ban racism across the board. just because someone decides to be a racist piece of shit and the other side doesn't doesn't make the rules biased.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> Is your suggestion "don't listen to their suggestions" or do you have suggestions of your own?


I don't have any suggestions. I simply pointed out in layman's terms what he meant. Ask him for suggestions. Now that you know his problem, maybe you two can come to some sort of agreement.


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## Eros (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Who is only dodging being an accomplice to Panda's degeneracy because she Ethirsts on the right people no less.


I'm pretty sure Pandaman is banned.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Natty said:


> A lot more inviting than using slurs and being an ass



you are a smug, passive aggressive, dishonest, sexually aggressive user who contributes nothing but shitposts in one of the most dysfunctional sections of the forum...and you have the gall to call someone an ass?





sworder said:


> how the fuck is it biased
> 
> the entire point is to ban racism across the board. just because someone decides to be a racist piece of shit and the other side doesn't doesn't make the rules biased.



So why are black superman, Muah and Eros not banned for racism? Ej too?

for that matter who the fuck are you and why are you dogging me and having a titty attack about my posts? Did I run you over in the Cafe and forget you existed or something?



Juub said:


> I don't have any suggestions. I simply pointed out in layman's terms what he meant. Ask him for suggestions. Now that you know his problem, maybe you two can come to some sort of agreement.




I've spent six years trying to reach him, he's never listened to anything, he's disrespected me and sheltered degenerates...he'd have to concede an awful lot to get me to want to talk to him again.


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

sworder said:


> how the fuck is it biased
> 
> the entire point is to ban racism across the board. just because someone decides to be a racist piece of shit and the other side doesn't doesn't make the rules biased.


Read my post a second time. You'll realize you're asking the wrong person.


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## Natty (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Who is only dodging being an accomplice to Panda's degeneracy because she Ethirsts on the right people no less.




I flirt with people for fun, panda turned out to be a fraud but it was for fun so it's not much of a loss for me.

I havent dodged it either, i addressed it in the thread of what's your taste. Lel


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

Natty said:


> A lot more inviting than using slurs and being an ass


Being thirsty = Being an ass


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Natty said:


> I flirt with people for fun, panda turned out to be a fraud but it was for fun so it's not much of a loss for me.
> 
> I havent dodged it either, i addressed it in the thread of what's your taste. Lel



case in point

this user is a troll who does nothing but creep on people and make others uncomfortable...and of course Es being called an uncle Tom and being banned for...being called an uncle Tom

which Reznor...still hasn't addressed


Es said:


> Being thirsty = Being an ass



being that pathetically thirsty = Natty gonna prolly pull a Panda and legit thirst on a minor soon enough.

then promptly get modded


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## Eros (Sep 2, 2018)

Natty said:


> Can't be surprised that the more spiteful people are lashing out about a rule change to make the forum more inviting to newcomers.


Because they think that the 1st Amendment right to freedom of speech is absolute and applies to every website on the planet. Make NF 4chan again.


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> So why are black superman, Muah and Eros not banned for racism? Ej too?



i don't know what they've posted but if they were racist then all of you should be banned all the same, yes


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

sworder said:


> i don't know what they've posted but if they were racist then all of you should be banned all the same, yes




the problem is nothing I've said is actually racist, you on the other hand and your broken emotions and bigoted mind take it for being racist and I'm not going to lie down and take a ban to appease mentally ill trolls who can't handle differing world views.



Eros said:


> Because they think that the 1st Amendment right to freedom of speech is absolute and applies to every website on the planet. Make NF 4chan again.



say weren't you the guy who wanted to ban Catholic iconography because it made you feel bad?

Reactions: Like 1


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## Whitebeard (Sep 2, 2018)

Eros said:


> Because they think that the 1st Amendment right to freedom of speech is absolute and applies to every website on the planet. Make NF 4chan again.


Yeah Eros, because Freedom of Speech should only protect _your _point of view. Those damn 4chan incels

Reactions: Like 1


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> the problem is nothing I've said is actually racist, you on the other hand and your broken emotions and bigoted mind take it for being racist and I'm not going to lie down and take a ban to appease mentally ill trolls who can't handle differing world views.





you're racist and dumb then

if you're all gonna be so blatantly dishonest then there's literally no reason for the staff to even humor your points. if you'd admit you said racist shit for X or Y reason then maybe your posts might actually have some value. but you're delusional so

just ban them Rez

Reactions: Like 3


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## ~M~ (Sep 2, 2018)

Juub said:


> So when everyone is done attacking Watch Dog, perhaps we can go back to debating opinions and viewpoints and the rules rather than attempt to slander someone's character? I mean it's cool and fun to tell someone they should STFU based on who you think they are rather than the points they are making but it's also incredibly counter-productive.
> 
> 
> Can you please not bring up my name?


That just brings us full circle though because the new rules do nothing but enable the staff further to justify action based on someone's character


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

@R3ZSN0R3 Maybe you missed it but what lead to the new rules? What lead to the more strict moderation policies? Why now?


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

Eros said:


> Because they think that the 1st Amendment right to freedom of speech is absolute and applies to every website on the planet. Make NF 4chan again.


Eros go hit the gym and stop obsessing with online politics


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

Muah said:
			
		

> I dont know why I wad tagged but black panther calls on his ancestor Killmonger and *decides to solo the white universe.* *He uses his black prowress to beat all normal and peak humans at their own game. His superior genetics( being black not his actual lineage) allows him to easily slay the pale faced morons. *
> 
> *Round 2 he uses his superhuman intelligence he got from hid melanin and devises a way to kill the white actors pretending to be superheroes or in anyway decent human beings. He then turns superman and ben affleck or whatever snowflake played batman into cucks and fucks their fairly decent looking cavebitches making their offspring into beautiful (well half) mulatto warroirs.*
> 
> *Rinse and repeat till OP* [Elric of Melniboné]* and uselessy are dead. Without the pale faced limp dicked colonizers all related universes are turned into a superadvanced utopia.* Once again i dont know why I was singled out here.


Yeah I’m just gonna leave this here


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> Yeah I’m just gonna leave this here




Gotta admit it was pretty funny.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> Yeah I’m just gonna leave this here



I'd sure love to see the guys defending this policy also...respond to the South Africa land grab thread...where racism and denial of genocide was commonfare

but but but...Watch Dog baited me with an old word for stingy! Having my dishonesty and zealotry exposed is a microaggression against a true victim!

déjate de joder con esta mierda Reznor, ya sabes que es una mentira y un pretexto terrible para atacar a nosotros y nada mas. Solamente para esconder los pecados y abusos del moderadores

Reactions: Like 2


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> "This person who I'm stalking and yelling at for no valid reason says shit I disagree with! BAN HIM...BAN THEM ALL!!"



come on now, you were making some progress justifying your racism and now you deleted it


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## Island (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> And my problem is...people the world over are growing sick and tired of that image, recognize it as repressive, hateful and intolerant and are rebelling against it on almost every continent where its values are preached. Reznor wants to basically put the site on the wrong side of a culture war, that has, historically always turned backwards to irreverent defiance and rl shitposting.
> 
> He's committing suicide in short...right when people are saying "We don't accept your morality, we will not permit you to force it on us"





Juub said:


> He's saying the rule changes are deliberately targeting a specific group of people, mainly the OBD which he is part of. Why? because those rules are fashioned in a way to suppress certain people while letting others on the other side of the spectrum walk freely. Why did he mentioned left-wings? It wasn't deflection. He used an actual, tangible example of people being guilty of the same sins the new rules are meant to take care of. Except there are no new rules to keep in check those people's behavior(the left wings, SJW, call them however you want). In short, the rules stifle and suppress one side but they do nothing against another side and come across as heavily biased. What about shit like incels, toxic masculinity and the like? You know, shit leftists use against other people but for some reason are seen as more acceptable. So when IWD goes to the Cafe to discuss whatever topic of the day, he'll have to watch his mouth over what he says else he gets the boot whereas his adversaries will keep acting like self-righteous assholes and get no repercussions for it.


Well.

I'm sure you both know that I don't agree with this "culture war" argument you're making, but for productivity's sake, let's put that disagreement aside.

The way I see it is that either a mutually beneficial solution can be found, or it can't. It would be regrettable if the staff started banning long-time members.

It doesn't seem like the staff is willing to budge on the new rules nor are you guys interested in budging on how you want your section moderated. (I still don't 100% know what your ideal solutions are, so bear with me on that.)

The reasonable compromise, assuming that you guys are willing to stick around with the rule adjustments, is some special accommodation for the OBD, most likely having it be a hidden section.

It seems like it'd satisfy the staff's desire to maintain the "public" side of NF the way they want it and let you guys keep the OBD how you want it. It wouldn't help this broader ideological issue you have, but I don't think that's solvable unless the staff does a 180 on these rules.


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> The reasonable compromise, assuming that you guys are willing to stick around with the rule adjustments, is some special accommodation for the OBD, most likely having it be a hidden section.


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

these new rules are gay

Where the fuck were they when I was a kid here? It never drove me off

you will regret this


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

sworder said:


> come on now, you were making some progress justifying your racism and now you deleted it



That's the exact opposite of what I was doing, liar.

You can go ahead and reveal who the fuck you are and why you're stalking me like a socially retarded teenaged girl though 



Island said:


> Well.
> 
> I'm sure you both know that I don't agree with this "culture war" argument you're making, but for productivity's sake, let's put that disagreement aside.



There's only one thing I want

The mods to admit their misconduct, clean our records, ban the racist lefties in the cafe and apologize to Es for what they did to him.

I mean I'd also want Shadow and Marcelle demodded for abuses and targeting users but that's like asking for water in the desert from Superman 


Also this....the enemy needs to cede ground now...not us.


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## Eros (Sep 2, 2018)

Es said:


> Eros go hit the gym and stop obsessing with online politics


Why don't you lose 100 pounds in a year like I did? Go back to hitting your wife and shut your mouth.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Eros said:


> Why don't you lose 100 pounds in a year like I did? Go back to hitting your wife and shut your mouth.



Thank you for proving an example of the bigotry I have been talking about...beyond the ones I've cited.

Oh and for the record, Es is black, lean like a friend and stays in shape despite crippling back problems

Reactions: Like 2


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> That's the exact opposite of what I was doing, liar.
> 
> You can go ahead and reveal who the fuck you are and why you're stalking me like a socially retarded teenaged girl though





> "go home slave before you end up on a cross"
> Because again..its fun phrasing things in a way that's designed to provoke preprogrammed responses from the social justice crowd, that highlight both their dishonesty and their ignorance.



"its fun being racist" 

why else delete it if not for the fact that you admitted you were in fact racist and removed any credibility you believe you've built up to this point (which is none btw)


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## Eros (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Thank you for proving an example of the bigotry I have been talking about...beyond the ones I've cited.
> 
> Oh and for the record, Es is black, lean like a friend and stays in shape despite crippling back problems


You guys are the obvious homophobes who bully me daily. I would prefer it if you'd simply pretend I don't exist at all.


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## Lucaniel (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> Well.
> 
> I'm sure you both know that I don't agree with this "culture war" argument you're making, but for productivity's sake, let's put that disagreement aside.
> 
> ...


i dont think a secret hidden racism section is a better option than just banning everyone whos decided that an essential component of arguing about which fictional characters can beat each other in a fight is being able to spam the n word and discuss phrenology. since a vs. battles forum serves an actual function in that people in general (as opposed to people who buy prisonplanet's brain pills) are interested in discussing vs battles, it would be pretty dumb to make that forum invisible and only accessible if you sign an agreement saying it wont bother you when the weird mutants that the section caters to (for some reason) wargame how they'd carry out the next holocaust


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

sworder said:


> "its fun being racist"
> 
> why else delete it if not for the fact that you admitted you were in fact racist and removed any credibility you believe you've built up to this point (which is none btw)



more like "It's fun exposing you people as desperate liars who will latch onto anything to prove their point, even when you use a word accurately and make a reference to Spartacus and Jesus in terms of the other sides sad attempt at martyrdom"

As for why I deleted it? I simply didn't like how cluttered it made my post look. It's amusing how ignorant you are, even of racists...Do you really think shaming works on an actual racist? Do you really think they'd feel the need to delete their posts?

You do understand an actual racist would see the world as insane for not seeing things their way and be openly contemptuous of your outrage, refuse to justify themselves at all because in their mind there'd be no need for justification....While continuing to spew their bile without any shame...


you know, exactly like you, Natty and every other racist in the Cafe are doing 


Eros said:


> You guys are the obvious homophobes who bully me daily. I would prefer it if you'd simply pretend I don't exist at all.



I'm such a homophobe Eros, so homophobic I defended @Elric of Melniboné  when one of your fellow lefties called him a homophobic slur while the rest of you stayed silent...and have only attacked LGBT activists for grotesque human rights abuses and called into question the anti science stance on trans people...

bullying you? That's adorable, you literally tried to have me lynched twice...and did succeed in getting Es banned then bragged about it...yes

clearly you're the victim


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

I just like how this whole discussion is centered on one slur and not others like spic

Is NF racist towards Latinos like myself and Watchdog?

Legit question


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> I just like how this whole discussion is centered on one slur and not others like spic
> 
> Is NF racist towards Latinos like myself and Watchdog?
> 
> Legit question



of course, we're spics who don't buy the narrative...and get treated as such


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> of course, we're spics who don't buy the narrative...and get treated as such


Damn

How dare we internalize racism 


The Immortal WatchDog said:


> bullying you? That's adorable, you literally tried to have me lynched twice...and did succeed in getting Es banned then bragged about it...yes
> 
> clearly you're the victim


IIRC according to Hachibi, he’s the jackass that tried to raid my Discord chat just because you and Es showed up in the Cafe discord


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## Island (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> There's only one thing I want
> 
> The mods to admit their misconduct, clean our records, ban the racist lefties in the cafe and apologize to Es for what they did to him.
> 
> I mean I'd also want Shadow and Marcelle demodded for abuses and targeting users but that's like asking for water in the desert from Superman


That's... a lot of stuff.

You'd probably have to give Reznor evidence for why mr_shadow and Marcelle (I don't actually know who this person) should be demodded and go from there.

Same with banning the racist lefties. Without having any idea what you're talking about, I imagine you'd have to compile posts that show them doing things you've been banned for instead of just "ban Flow."



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Also this....the enemy needs to ceded ground now...not us.


From the staff's perspective, I'm not sure why they would.

Like @Lucaniel said below, the easiest thing for them to do would be just... ban you guys. The forum would likely lose a lot of activity, but it's very likely that the staff can stomach that. If you want to get something out of this, I don't think "the staff should cede ground first" is a good place to start.



Lucaniel said:


> i dont think a secret hidden racism section is a better option than just banning everyone whos decided that an essential component of arguing about which fictional characters can beat each other in a fight is being able to spam the n word and discuss phrenology. since a vs. battles forum serves an actual function in that people in general (as opposed to people who buy prisonplanet's brain pills) are interested in discussing vs battles, it would be pretty dumb to make that forum invisible and only accessible if you sign an agreement saying it wont bother you when the weird mutants that the section caters to (for some reason) wargame how they'd carry out the next holocaust


It probably isn't a better option, it'd be an okay starting point for resolving the problem imo.

I don't particularly like the idea either, but it's a step up from just bickering for ten pages.


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> more like "It's fun exposing you people as desperate liars who will latch onto anything to prove their point, even when you use a word accurately and make a reference to Spartacus and Jesus in terms of the other sides sad attempt at martyrdom"
> 
> As for why I deleted it? I simply didn't like how cluttered it made my post look. It's amusing how ignorant you are, even of racists...Do you really think shaming works on an actual racist? Do you really think they'd feel the need to delete their posts?
> 
> ...


this post is comedy gold

it doesn't matter if you've never said anything racist or acted in a discriminatory way, you can STILL be racist if you simply redefine what racism is to something completely irrelevant

it doesn't matter if you say racist shit, being openly racist doesn't mean you're actually racist if you're doing it to "expose" people for getting offended at racism


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## Lucaniel (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> It probably isn't better, but if they're willing to compromise, it'd be an okay starting point for resolving the problem.
> 
> I don't particularly like the idea either, but it's a step up from just bickering for ten pages.


it is however several steps down from just handing out a bunch of level 2 perms and thus winding up with a clean section that has semi-normal people in it, while also getting rid of the peripheral headaches caused by the same group of wingnuts e.g. 10 pages of bickering which amount to coy denials of obviously-intended racism, only separated by impotent rants about the horrible revenge that'll come if the people with all the power in this situation don't randomly acquiesce for no reason


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> That's... a lot of stuff.
> 
> You'd probably have to give Reznor evidence for why mr_shadow and Marcelle (I don't actually know who this person) should be demodded and go from there.
> 
> Same with banning the racist lefties. Without having any idea what you're talking about, I imagine you'd have to compile posts that show them doing things you've been banned for instead of just "ban Flow."



Having done both and having been ignored...you're asking me to do the same thing over again.



sworder said:


>



Stop being racist...that image is a microaggression to some white upper class liberal somewhere...I'm sure


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Thank you for proving an example of the bigotry I have been talking about...beyond the ones I've cited.
> 
> Oh and for the record, Es is black, lean like a friend and stays in shape despite crippling back problems


Its not even crippling it just

leaves me stiff as shit


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

Lucaniel said:


> it is however several steps down from just handing out a bunch of level 2 perms and thus winding up with a clean section that has semi-normal people in it, while also getting rid of the peripheral headaches caused by the same group of wingnuts e.g. 10 pages of bickering which amount to coy denials of obviously-intended racism, only separated by impotent rants about the horrible revenge that'll come if the people with all the power in this situation don't randomly acquiesce for no reason


Hey luc member when you used to be one of those headaches?

Turncoat sack of shit


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Lucaniel said:


> it is however several steps down from just handing out a bunch of level 2 perms and thus winding up with a clean section that has semi-normal people in it, *while also getting rid of the peripheral headaches caused by the same group of wingnuts e.g.* 10 pages of bickering which amount to coy denials of obviously-intended racism, only separated by impotent rants about the horrible revenge that'll come if the people with all the power in this situation don't randomly acquiesce for no reason



And this is what it comes down too...you wanting to ban people for ideological reasons and nothing valid. And this is the entire reason why this is being objected too. Also, you're partly responsible for all this....And you don't have a problem with skulking off to another section and creating a thread just to insult the fuck out of me...over...but hey that's somehow not trolling.

Also, I guess sworder is the crazy stalker that wanted to raid the OBD and IM's discord because he got salty we shitposted in the Cafe's hugbox?



Es said:


> Hey luc member when you used to be one of those headaches?
> 
> Turncoat sack of shit



He decided pandering to the shallow, dishonest class of gibbering parrots was preferable to any kind of personal honesty.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> From the staff's perspective, I'm not sure why they would.
> 
> Like @Lucaniel said below, the easiest thing for them to do would be just... ban you guys. The forum would likely lose a lot of activity, but it's very likely that the staff can stomach that. If you want to get something out of this, I don't think "the staff should cede ground first" is a good place to start


You do realize the hypocrisy of this when Luc was formerly ONE of these headaches right?


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## TYPE-Rey (Sep 2, 2018)

It's also funy how certain special snowflakes scream "RACIST" and "BAN" at Watchdog while they conveniently ignore this.
*
"I dont know why I wad tagged but black panther calls on his ancestor Killmonger and decides to solo the white universe. He uses his black prowress to beat all normal and peak humans at their own game. His superior genetics( being black not his actual lineage) allows him to easily slay the pale faced morons. 

Round 2 he uses his superhuman intelligence he got from hid melanin and devises a way to kill the white actors pretending to be superheroes or in anyway decent human beings. He then turns superman and ben affleck or whatever snowflake played batman into cucks and fucks their fairly decent looking cavebitches making their offspring into beautiful (well half) mulatto warroirs.

Rinse and repeat till OP [Elric of Melniboné] and uselessy are dead. Without the pale faced limp dicked colonizers all related universes are turned into a superadvanced utopia. Once again i dont know why I was singled out here."*

Courtesy of Muah.
Here's some fucking racism..you fucking hipocrytes,



Lucaniel said:


> agreement saying it wont bother you when the weird mutants that the section caters to (for some reason) wargame how they'd carry out the next holocaust


I can't wait for this to pass without so much as a slap on the wrist.


Keep being awesome NF.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Also, I guess sworder is the crazy stalker that wanted to raid the OBD and IM's discord because he got salty we shitposted in the Cafe's hugbox?


That’s some sadboi shit if he’s so booty blasted that he has to drag people that have never spoken to him into his drama just to have some petty revenge on you


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## Island (Sep 2, 2018)

Lucaniel said:


> it is however several steps down from just handing out a bunch of level 2 perms and thus winding up with a clean section that has semi-normal people in it, while also getting rid of the peripheral headaches caused by the same group of wingnuts e.g. 10 pages of bickering which amount to coy denials of obviously-intended racism, only separated by impotent rants about the horrible revenge that'll come if the people with all the power in this situation don't randomly acquiesce for no reason


That's a lot of perms to hand out and most likely the death of the OBD.

Wingnuts or not, I think it'd be a shame if they all just got perma-banned without making a last attempt to compromise with them.

But... 



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Having done both and having been ignored...you're asking me to do the same thing over again.


If you've done that and the staff won't listen to you, then what's the point of posting here? That's the question I initially asked you: what are you trying to get out of all this?


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

While we're on the subject...please Rez enlighten @TYPE-Rey why its acceptable to allow a person who bragged about fucking his underage cousin and admits to posting in the OBD solely to bait posters into a ban...to exist at all in a section he's admitted to troll after a confession like that. Then ban Rey for putting that idiot in his place and using a naughty word solely to highlight your hypocrisy while doing?

Because I'd think fucking your 13 year old cousin...is worse than the hard R.



Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> That’s some sadboi shit if he’s so booty blasted that he has to drag people that never spoken to him into his drama just to have some petty revenge on you



It also validates our point...that these guys are unreasonable trolls who are in league with the mods to target the Dragon Ball and OBD sections..and likely others as well.


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## Island (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Also, I guess sworder is the crazy stalker that wanted to raid the OBD and IM's discord because he got salty we shitposted in the Cafe's hugbox?


I don't think sworder's on the Café Discord, tbf.


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## Lucaniel (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> That's a lot of perms to hand out and most likely the death of the OBD.


doubt it, virtually everyone currently involved here started posting either at the same time or after i did, and there have definitely been new obd posters since then - a lot of them - so given that people are always obsessed with arguing about vs battles, i think new ones will show up just fine


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## TYPE-Rey (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> While we're on the subject...please Rez enlighten @TYPE-Rey why its acceptable to allow a person who bragged about fucking his underage cousin and admits to posting in the OBD solely to bait posters into a ban...to exist at all in a section he's admitted to troll after a confession like that. Then ban Rey for putting that idiot in his place and using a naughty word solely to highlight your hypocrisy while doing?
> 
> Because I'd think fucking your 13 year old cousin...is worse than the hard R


Nah..IWD..it's fine since Mr,Marcelle excells at this type of BS. Why am i saying this you ask ? Well, because he has no qualms about ignoring a user who came from another site into the OBD just for starting trouble (his own admision) but instead he directed his efforts at banning OBD regulars because they used strong language to respond to him.
And at the end of the day they have the gall to ask us  to compromise.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

TYPE-Rey said:


> It's also funy how certain special snowflakes scream "RACIST" and "BAN" at Watchdog while they conveniently ignore this.



The fact that I am being targeted in this very thread by multiple users, including an Admin and this is being ignored is amusing as hell.



TYPE-Rey said:


> Courtesy of Muah.
> Here's some fucking racism..you fucking hipocrytes,
> 
> 
> ...



"he was just joking"




Island said:


> I don't think sworder's on the Café Discord, tbf.



so then he's just a random fucking lunatic slandering me? 



TYPE-Rey said:


> Nah..IWD..it's fine since Mr,Marcelle excells at this type of BS. Why am i saying this you ask ? Well, because he has no qualms about ignoring a user who came from another site into the OBD just for starting trouble (his own admision) but instead he directed his efforts at banning OBD regulars because they used strong language to respond to him.
> And at the end of the day they have the gall to call for compromise.



And yet, no doubt Reznor and the others are presently concocting some narrative where we're the evil monsters who are the sole authors of all this misery...not the actual racists and bigots...not the abusive mods and not Rez himself for habitually making bad decisions that involve Forum policy....Naw

its like 8chan and the Jewish conspiracy.

quick someone find a pic of a dog wringing its paws while slobbering everywhere


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

TYPE-Rey said:


> Courtesy of Muah.
> Here's some fucking racism..you fucking hipocrytes,


there's no hipocrisy

I've had Muah on super ignore for years. I'm 100% sure not a single person that wants people banned for racism would be opposed to Muah getting banned

if it was up to me I would have permabanned him ages ago


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

Island said:


> That's a lot of perms to hand out and most likely the death of the OBD.


You mean the death of NF


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

Lucaniel said:


> doubt it, virtually everyone currently involved here started posting either at the same time or after i did, and there have definitely been new obd posters since then - a lot of them - so given that people are always obsessed with arguing about vs battles, i think new ones will show up just fine


I guess the thirst knocked off your IQ points too when the draw of the OBD was the culture and customs street shitter


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## Es (Sep 2, 2018)

Question Island why the fuck are you listening to someone who is not only a turncoat to the OBD but actively hostile to it?


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Also, I guess sworder is the crazy stalker that wanted to raid the OBD and IM's discord because he got salty we shitposted in the Cafe's hugbox?




dude i had no idea who you even were until you started being an autist about racism in this topic, let it go. you're not that important


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

TYPE-Rey said:


> Nah..IWD..it's fine since Mr,Marcelle excells at this type of BS. Why am i saying this you ask ? Well, because he has no qualms about ignoring a user who came from another site into the OBD just for starting trouble (his own admision) but instead he directed his efforts at banning OBD regulars because they used strong language to respond to him.
> And at the end of the day they have the gall to ask us  to compromise.


Yeah I remember when that guy from SufficientVelocity harassed Gwyn and got nothing for it and that same Marcelle locked a thread and made Iwandesu and Musubi look incompetent even though he should have just threadbanned the troublemaker than punish all of us because of a bait post that strongarm made


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## Eros (Sep 2, 2018)

Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> Damn
> 
> How dare we internalize racism
> 
> IIRC according to Hachibi, he’s the jackass that tried to raid my Discord chat just because you and Es showed up in the Cafe discord


I simply joked about it. I didn't even post the link. See, half of what I say isn't even serious. You literally think everything I say is serious. You literally know nothing about me at all, and yet, you seem convinced that I'm out to destroy you. Thing is, if you put me on SI and left me the hell alone and ES did the same, I'm pretty sure The Cafe would be far better off. Literally, I get that you're an alt-right fanatic, who thinks everyone who's even slightly left of center is the second coming of Vladimir Lenin.


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## TYPE-Rey (Sep 2, 2018)

sworder said:


> there's no hipocrisy
> 
> I've had Muah on super ignore for years. I'm 100% sure not a single person that wants people banned for racism would be opposed to Muah getting banned
> 
> if it was up to me I would have permabanned him ages ago


Yeah right...i don't think you're stupid enough to not observe the difference in treatment. You put one in super ignore and scream banalities at the other one, thirsting for his ban.
No hypocrisy there ...no sir.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Lucaniel said:


> doubt it, virtually everyone currently involved here started posting either at the same time or after i did, and there have definitely been new obd posters since then - a lot of them - so given that people are always obsessed with arguing about vs battles, i think new ones will show up just fine



And guess whose side of this debate they're on?

hint not the side of the person who exploited a rough situation with an S mod to force PC nonsense because he was tired of seeing a word that started with a P and ended with two E's and a T being bandied about...Who whined incessantly about not being hateful yet decided to use the Alley to shit on a user because...reasons.

@Imakarum Mirabilis @Xhominid @Masterblack06 @NostalgiaFan @Claudio Swiss @TYPE-Rey 

Y'all are relative OBD newcomers and like me a member of a minority..care to weigh in on this discussion?


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

TYPE-Rey said:


> Yeah right...i don't think you're stupid enough to not observe the difference in treatment. You put one in super ignore and scream banalities at the other one, thirsting for his ban.
> No hypocrisy there ...no sir.


you're actually retarded

I just told you Muah should get banned and you're still victimizing yourself saying it's hipocrisy

take your L


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

Eros said:


> I simply joked about it. I didn't even post the link. See, half of what I say isn't even serious. You literally think everything I say is serious. You literally know nothing about me at all, and yet, you seem convinced that I'm out to destroy you.


I dunno. I think stalking a convo and grabbing a link is a lot of effort in just “joking around.” I think you did try to raid my chat but since I revoked it, you couldn’t get in and your sad little attempt failed. I’ve also never talked to you beforehand and didn’t know much about you until you attempted to start shit with me. But please, make yourself out to be the victim when it was you that nearly caused a raid in my chat 


Eros said:


> Literally, I get that you're an alt-right fanatic, who thinks everyone who's even slightly left of center is the second coming of Vladimir Lenin.


Do you even know my politics dude? Because I’ll have you know, I used to beat up Neo-Nazis and skinheads back home in rural Montana while sadbois like you were crying on election night


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## Atlantic Storm (Sep 2, 2018)

I don't want to lock the thread because keeping people from discussing or having dialogue about the new rules is in bad spirit, but let's stop the personal attacks—on both sides. This isn't the place for that.


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## Masterblack06 (Sep 2, 2018)

What even is happening?


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

Masterblack06 said:


> What even is happening?


Ragnarok is upon us my dear friend.


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## Claudio Swiss (Sep 2, 2018)

Masterblack06 said:


> What even is happening?


Idk 


The Immortal WatchDog said:


> And guess whose side of this debate they're on?
> 
> hint not the side of the person who exploited a rough situation with an S mod to force PC nonsense because he was tired of seeing a word that started with a P and ended with two E's and a T being bandied about...Who whined incessantly about not being hateful yet decided to use the Alley to shit on a user because...reasons.
> 
> ...


Need a rundown cause it seems things are heated here


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Claudio Swiss said:


> Idk
> 
> Need a rundown cause it seems things are heated here



Remember how you got banned for Goblino memes?

like that...but across the entire forum. Also Luca is contending you new OBD'ers hate my guts, think I'm a nazi and reject the idea that words only have power if you are a thin skinned whacko. So perm banning me will instantly make the OBD tumblr.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

Eros said:


> I only saw the link and joked about posting it when people started tagging me in the ODB (a section in which I don't even post), for the purpose of harassing me. Again, I didn't post the link.


Given you didn’t answer me when I tagged you to explain yourself about that fiasco, it makes me think you’re lying 


Eros said:


> Also, the alt-right does not just cover people covered in swastika tattoos. Most these days are far more subtle about it, and it's more about militant hatred of Mestizos and Muslims than Jews. In fact, there is literally Ben Shapiro and a gay British dude of Greek descent who are both famously alt-right. Nice try though.


So me being battered up by Neo-Nazis and skinheads who people like Richard Spencer throw their lot in with means I’m still alt-right despite you knowing nothing about my politics. Awfully convenient


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## Lucaniel (Sep 2, 2018)

ive just been informed by someone who was losing their shit on disc that im being called a "turncoat to the OBD" in here cuz im saying all the weirdo cryptofascists should be banned, and i would like to address these extremely hurtful accusations

- im still down with flaming people for being shit posters, pedos, generally weird and/or socially retarded, just plain retarded, etc. to me that's def not the same as being a diet nazi, and while i would never support perming people for generalised flaming i.e. calling people retards and cunts etc, i have no problem supporting the staff perming this whole lot of alt-right weirdos

- back when i was in it, the obd was about arguing vs battles, loling at dumb nf dipshits, and discussing stuff we watched or read, as opposed to arguing about the right to spam the n word and discussing how (((SJeW cultural marxism))) is killing america. so i dont have a problem with nuking this current incarnation. this disconnect between what i remember and whats there now is also shared by zetta, who came back recently and asked why the obd had become /pol/. that about sums it up

- homie its an anime forum subsection lol. nobody owes it any loyalty. none of you are real. log off if youre getting that invested


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## Atlantic Storm (Sep 2, 2018)

I'm going to do a clean-up of the flamebaiting posts made after my initial warning earlier. I won't retroactively give any bans, but anyone who continues to use this thread purely as a platform to attack or insult other users will be given a thread ban.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Claudio Swiss (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Remember how you got banned for Goblino memes?
> 
> like that...but across the entire forum. Also Luca is contending you new OBD'ers hate my guts, think I'm a nazi and reject the idea that words only have power if you are a thin skinned whacko. So perm banning me will instantly make the OBD tumblr.


You a cool guy
Also s Othere trying to castrate the entire forum correct?


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## Masterblack06 (Sep 2, 2018)

Well i dont know how anyone else feels but I like Watchdog. He and I may have different opinions on stuff, though I have never brought it up cause there isnt a point, but I respect his opinion on how he feels and im not gonna shit on him for it. The same goes for everyone here. I respect your opinions on stuff even if I dont like them. The only issue i have is when people start treating their opinions as fact and telling other people bullshit like what Muah is telling me in my own thread about how I support the slave industry because I dont want to murder people. That shit is unacceptable

Reactions: Like 3


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> He;'s a mestizo too


I’m a Mestizo who admits his ancestry is made up of mostly psychopaths that wouldn’t be out of place in Conan the Barbarian 

It took getting their asses kicked and Catholicism forced on them to straighten their shit out and telling Santa Anna to piss off


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> inb4 the Cafe flails about internalized racism


Please, I don’t hate all my ancestors

The Tejanos were some badass mofos for helping in the defense of Texas from Santa Anna’s tyranny


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## sworder (Sep 2, 2018)

Masterblack06 said:


> The only issue i have is when people start treating their opinions as fact and telling other people bullshit like what Muah is telling me in my own thread about how I support the slave industry because I dont want to murder people. That shit is unacceptable


Well then there's the first person that should get banned with the new rules


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## Masterblack06 (Sep 2, 2018)

sworder said:


> Well then there's the first person that should get banned with the new rules


There isn't even any thing to take out of context either. "If you don't support killing slave owners then you support the slave industry period" were his exact words. Now I don't know how many of you don't care for murdering people but according to Muah, you support the slave industry


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## Eros (Sep 2, 2018)

sworder said:


> Well then there's the first person that should get banned with the new rules


He's also expressed misogynistic and openly homophobic stuff as well. He started a thread in The BH a couple years ago that I'm surprised didn't get a certain ninetail's blood boiling. I thought it was repulsive tbh.


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## Claudio Swiss (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Thank you...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Pretty much 
You're a spic and I'm a Haitian American 
While i don't fully agree with u on everything though I do most of the time 
However ur a cool guy and opinions are worth hearing


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

Claudio Swiss said:


> Pretty much
> You're a spic and I'm a Haitian American
> While i don't fully agree with u on everything though I do most of the time
> However ur a cool guy and opinions are worth hearing


Holy shit you’re Haitian? No wonder I like you. I’m Haitian Canadian though.


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## Claudio Swiss (Sep 2, 2018)

Juub said:


> Holy shit you’re Haitian? No wonder I like you. I’m Haitian Canadian though.


Yep family immigrated down in Florida


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

Claudio Swiss said:


> Yep family immigrated down in Florida


Kinda figured that. Haitians go to Florida, Jersey or NY.


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

Though I have no idea how a Latino ends up in rural Montana @Imakarum Mirabilis


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

Juub said:


> Though I have no idea how a Latino ends up in rural Montana @Imakarum Mirabilis


There is a sizable Latino community in Montana believe it or not. We get shit on but that’s to be expected.

I’m also not fully Latino, I’m mostly Norwegian much to the chagrin of Neo-Nazis I’m whiter than


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## Juub (Sep 2, 2018)

Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> There is a sizable Latino community in Montana believe it or not. We get shit on but that’s to be expected.
> 
> I’m also not fully Latino, I’m mostly Norwegian much to the chagrin of Neo-Nazis I’m whiter than


Probably glad you didn't end up like him.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

I love how this has now turned into a thread where the supposed racists are shooting the shit about their immigrant stories and where they come from 



Claudio Swiss said:


> Yep family immigrated down in Florida



Haitians in South Florida work hard man..turned Homestead from a meth addict, giant wild boar infested shithole into one of the fastest growing areas in the country. Developed as fuck too

too bad you guys still gotta deal with murderous wild boars and gators though 

edit- assuming your peeps live in Homestead or MDC any way

Reactions: Like 1


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## Claudio Swiss (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I love how this has now turned into a thread where the supposed racists are shooting the shit about their immigrant stories and where they come from
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Live down in west palm heat be annoying at times


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## Xhominid (Sep 2, 2018)

Masterblack06 said:


> Well i dont know how anyone else feels but I like Watchdog. He and I may have different opinions on stuff, though I have never brought it up cause there isnt a point, but I respect his opinion on how he feels and im not gonna shit on him for it. The same goes for everyone here. I respect your opinions on stuff even if I dont like them. The only issue i have is when people start treating their opinions as fact and telling other people bullshit like what Muah is telling me in my own thread about how I support the slave industry because I dont want to murder people. That shit is unacceptable



This is pretty much how I see this as well. I have no problem debating with people as long as they come with some level of respect and actually willing to debate, not just throw nonsense at your face.

Even when I had a small heated debate with DeathbringerPT on DOA6's direction, I never really felt like he was devauling my opinion. But on the Cafe though... hoo boy, if you don't agree with them, you support Trump and hate your own race(Despite the fact I hate Trump as President and that has never changed)


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## NostalgiaFan (Sep 2, 2018)

These new forum rules are, in the most respectful way I can state, the most retarded, short sighted, idiotic, confounded, mindbogglingly stupid actions I have seen in my entire history of first coming to the OBD as a young kid looking for laughs.

You guys are just asking for a disaster if you are serious with continuing with this dumbass motion that is sure to not only cause trouble for the old members here but even the new ones who are going to have to deal with the dumbfucks who come along once in a while to fuck around when you have their hands tied behind their backs.

The old rules were never the problem here, the way the staff did fucking nothing when they needed to were the problem. All you are doing here is tightening the leash and it's just going to make shit worse, not better.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 2, 2018)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Nice to see this place burning down slowly.


Surtr is coming for this site, his Flaming Sword in hand to bring his wrath down upon all of us

Reactions: Like 3


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## Lurko (Sep 2, 2018)

Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> Surtr is coming for this site, his Flaming Sword in hand to bring his wrath down upon all of us


It sure seems that way, now more people just need to know about Nf's past.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

NostalgiaFan said:


> The old rules were never the problem here, the way the staff did fucking nothing when they needed to were the problem. All you are doing here is tightening the leash and it's just going to make shit worse, not better.



This is exactly the problem, Moderator apathy and refusal to hold themselves accountable for their inaction and then, when moved to action lose their shit and abuse users they dislike.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> Beware the Watchdog
> 
> Nevermind the Maddog


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## Chloe (Sep 2, 2018)

my sources are my sources


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## Six (Sep 2, 2018)

Wtf is going on in this thread?


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## Lurko (Sep 2, 2018)

Snake said:


> Wtf is going on in this thread?


The staff.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

I mean its fair we all got nasty, it just looked selective


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## Lurko (Sep 2, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I mean its fair we all got nasty, it just looked selective


It was.


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## God Movement (Sep 2, 2018)




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## Claudio Swiss (Sep 2, 2018)

Some of the post wasn't even delete worthy nor baiting


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 2, 2018)

God Movement said:


>



ah, excellent I was wondering when a representative of the DB section could be free to air their grievances.


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## Lurko (Sep 2, 2018)

So Reznor what are you goona do about some of the staff?


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## Fang (Sep 3, 2018)

On one hand, I don't think global rules as they are formatted now are a great or good fit for the OBD in particular:

- Xiammes, Iwandesu, and a few others have that open table discussion in the OBD's meta-dome section about what we can do for specific rules for the OBD
- I was on board with putting a special case of regulating the OBD with at least looser rules because like the Blender, things tend to get a lot more heated in the vs section; people are more easily heated up, angry, posting with reaction images, macros, or towing the line just outside of flaming and baiting
- It would've been nice to see that at least things that were also said in the OBD convo threads that things would not be taken out of context for laughs; picking fun at political-correctness, poking fun at race, gender, locker-room sort of talks more or less
- I don't know how much else there is for me to talk about; in a sense the OBD has been as much a niche for the regulars there as it was for the Blender

On the other hand, playing devil's advocate here, as someone whose been in the crosshairs of certain staff years ago because like some others I would get extremely pissed off in vs debate on a mongolian finger-painting forum designed around whose power level dick is bigger, you could say I get the current staff's position. I think outside of the Cafe, which is probably the biggest piece of festering pus-laden crap of nonsense and deserves to be nuked off NF for good outside of when Mega was modding it, the OBD and Naruto section have the most issues which gets in the staff's hair.

Still its kind of silly that certain people like a black poster would get banned for saying the "n word" regardless of circumstances or context.

I don't know.

Really though you guys, regardless, are going to do what you want in the belief that what you are doing is the best for the entire board's health. So I wish you the best in that regards.

Good luck.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Atlantic Storm (Sep 3, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I mean its fair we all got nasty, it just looked selective



All posts from both sides were deleted. I'm not sure how it was selective.

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Atlantic Storm said:


> All posts from both sides were deleted. I'm not sure how it was selective.



Yeah like I said it was optics not necessarily reality

Reactions: Like 1


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## Reznor (Sep 3, 2018)

Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> I just like how this whole discussion is centered on one slur and not others like spic
> 
> Is NF racist towards Latinos like myself and Watchdog?
> 
> Legit question


 
What are you even talking about? That's not on me. I just said no racism.

You guys are the one fighting me on using a specific slur.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Es (Sep 3, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> What are you even talking about? That's not on me. I just said no racism.
> 
> You guys are the one fighting me on using a specific slur.


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## Es (Sep 3, 2018)

> "Nazi Propaganda: As Narutoforums is hosted in Germany, we have a zero tolerance policy with advocating genocide, nazi propaganda and white supremacy."/QUOTE]



Ban the idiots in the cafe like rain saying taking the land from the minority groups in South Africa then and then I won't think your entire policy isnt full of dogshit renzor

Reactions: Like 1


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## Reznor (Sep 3, 2018)

Nazi shit is explicitly not allowed via the terms of service on a German server.


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## Es (Sep 3, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> Nazi shit is explicitly not allowed via the terms of service on a German server.


Reread my post you spud 

You specified saying genocide

Guess what they are making mental gymnastics for in the cafe?


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## White Wolf (Sep 3, 2018)

The thing is; the rules aren't being enforced *retroactively*. Else that's a decades worth of shit to dig through, and nobody wants that. Going forward though, propagating murder and the likes? No thank you. 

It's why Muah was banned since his posts happened today, not a week ago, not a month ago, etc. 
Though rule change or not them being overlooked wouldn't have been realistic. 

If there's cases of the things you're saying from after the new rules released, report it, and it'll be taken care of. 
Things like the "uncle tom" posts shouldn't have been left alone, but that's why your own ban was nulled previously, and going forward there'll be more *uniform *coverage in cases like that so shouldn't be a mistake that's repeated.


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## Eros (Sep 3, 2018)

I'm guessing "bundle of sticks" is also not a good word to use.


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## TYPE-Rey (Sep 3, 2018)

Rules not being inforced retroactively is pure BS since you're once again enabling a large part of the staff and certain members to get away scot free from whatever shady things they've done in the past.
If someone finds and presents evidence of a any form of miscounduct that anyone has commited,that should be taken into consideration and dealt with cause lord knows there's a lot on this forum...and things far worse than saying "^ (use bro)".
Not to mention that this is done subjectively since when i got banned for using the apparent single crystalization of racism on this forum , the word "^ (use bro)" and asked why was i not given a warning, Marcelle a.k.a the "best god damn Smod" on this forum told me that i've gotten a couple of warning months ago so... once again..it's BS and extremely easy to abuse or ignore especially when incompetent or corrupt mods like the aformentioned  are involved.

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> What are you even talking about? That's not on me. I just said no racism.
> 
> You guys are the one fighting me on using a specific slur.



Yes, Reznor that's totally what it is and not just us vociferously objecting to an absurdity that caters to an unreasonable batch of ultra violent hysterics that puts this forum on the losing side of the culture war and all but guarantees it will become a battleground therein..to the detriment of all of us. 



Eros said:


> I'm guessing "bundle of sticks" is also not a good word to use.



inb4 Eros goes for my avatar again 

also wanting to ban a word that has evolved beyond being a homophobic slur because..muh mental state is...the epitome of why we're attacking these rules.

people as whiny, petulant and dishonest as you never should be catered too..



TYPE-Rey said:


> Rules not being inforced retroactively is pure BS since you're once again enabling a large part of the staff and certain members to get away scot free from whatever shady things they've done in the past.
> If someone finds and presents evidence of a any form of miscounduct that anyone has commited,that should be taken into consideration and dealt with cause lord knows there's a lot on this forum...and things far worse than saying "^ (use bro)".
> Not to mention that this is done subjectively since when i got banned for using the apparent single crystalization of racism on this forum , the word "^ (use bro)" and asked why was i not given a warning, Marcelle a.k.a the "best god damn Smod" on this forum told me that i've gotten a couple of warning months ago so... once again..it's BS and extremely easy to abuse or ignore especially when incompetent or corrupt mods like the aformentioned  are involved.




Gotten a couple warnings months ago is also how that gibbering fraud justified hitting me with a twenty four hour ban "You were given multiple warnings..IWD...the stepdad joke hurt me in my feels because it accurately describes my personal life and the relationship with the child I brag about drugging with Xanax in my sigs..."

"Marc...you do realize...I was last here..literally two fucking years ago?!"

I DOESN'T MATTER....BAWW

so again @R3ZSN0R3 Demod Marcelle, permanently ban Stephanie for the goblino shit and Demod Shadow from the Cafe and maybe we'll believe you...even though you habitually try in the lamest way possible to misrepresent us and lie about our point...maybe


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

@Atlantic Storm @Naruto @R3ZSN0R3 @MusubiKazesaru @Santi @baconbits @White Wolf I have a question...since white supremacy is specifically banned...is Turkish supremacy allowed? I've got a feeling a certain restored to power S mod would take exception to that...what about Japanese supremacists? Should we start banning posters affiliated with the Nihon Kaigi movement? What about MR_Shadow who is a Sinophile and a Sino-supremacists?

What about @Yamato she hates the China and rightly so..she probably thinks the Republic of China is the only legal Chinese Government (which it is, Long live Taipei and Down with Beijing the city of lies and all that) and the PRC are nothing but a bunch of low class usurping dogs who should be cleansed from Terra Mater in nuclear hellfire...

How's about Black supremacists? Like Ej, Cardboard Tube Knight (who has talked about murdering Trump supporters) and their like? How about Eros who is an LGBT zealot who acts like gay people are morally and personally superior to straight people?

Cis Het is a slur..its designed to remove the tangible and stigmatize the word "normal" which is the only accurate way to describe 97% of the human race....can I report Natty and Eros and anyone else who uses that term...which I find to be bigoted and fucking disgraceful and I could probably get a decent amount of users to cosign a petition for its ban on those grounds...

How's about @Juub? Paralax and Khaleesi called him incels which is a misandrist slur...do you recognize misandry as a form of prejudice? Can he now request her demotion? Can he request Paralax be banned?

Lucaniel threw a bunch of derogatory slurs at us...he targeted us for politics and is advocating treatment that the UN outrageous and immoral as the organization is...considers a form of political dispossession and in dramatic cases slumps it in with genocide...should he banned?

You can see..the absurdity in the examples...but the point remains, how far are you people going to justify this nonsense and how far are you going to take it?

@TYPE-Rey made a good point...Luca should have been banned for the comments he made but because he lied and called us alt righters it made his commentary acceptable..you endorsed selective modding based on issues you disagree with...and did not mod objectively...as these rules were set in place and as they were implemented.  How long are you going to maintain this hypocrisy?

Rey makes an excellent point too...you guys are resetting everything not because you want to give us a chance but because you're looking for an out to dodge the abuses of yesterday while setting up a CYA policy to justify the abuses of tomorrow...That you are proceeding towards this fucking waterfall naked and dragging the entire forum with you...and you are _*still refusing to hold the moderation staff accountable *_is what we're saying is unacceptable...these rules are nullified and void because you are using them to shield yourselves from scrutiny in  a way only people as out of touch as the Denizens of HR can be...would.

they're not worth obeying...Because you've made it very clear in this very thread...you won't enforce them properly beyond banning Muah to make yourselves look like you aren't total frauds...which failed hilariously.


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## Reznor (Sep 3, 2018)

You believing me isn't required. These are the rules, follow them.

If you have legitimate questions about what that entails ask, but I can't keep entertaining this all day so I'm done now

Reactions: Like 4


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

R3ZSN0R3 said:


> You believing me isn't required. These are the rules, follow them.
> 
> If you have legitimate questions about what that entails ask, but I can't keep entertaining this all day so I'm done now



So basically..."We're going to abuse you, target the userbase and selectively enforce this nonsense and then flip our lids when Entire sections start attacking us in public, spamming memes at us and burn us out and force us to walk back these rules...Because we're all lying simpletons who can't mod a forum to save its life"

Christ...the staff at CBR may have just committed about a dozen felonies..and they're still better than you people 

edit- No one is going to follow these rules, this is going to cause you guys endless headaches..you're wasting everyone's time.

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Running from this thread in the face of multiple users telling you how stupid this is, won't change the reality of the situation Reznor...if you think this is loud now wait until you invariably cull someone they like and they get really nasty....you've never dealt with batshit Dragon Ball fans for example.

in the OBD we have..and then you've managed to piss them off too and turned the cinema section into an unsafe place unless you're a yes men to metal horror and Catalyst...how many more sections you want calling for blood?

Reactions: Like 2


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## Majin Lu (Sep 3, 2018)

I have a question: how does the staff act if members give rates such as "_like_", "_agree_" or even "_funny_" to a racist post, for example?

Reactions: Like 2


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## Lew (Sep 3, 2018)

Majin Lu said:


> I have a question: how does the staff act if members give rates such as "_like_", "_agree_" or even "_funny_" to a racist post, for example?



Of course the poster gets a punishment, the post is also deleted.

As for the ratings on the post, just having the post deleted is enough. It would be way too strict to go after people rating a comment which is against the rules when they're not the ones who wrote it.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Lewd said:


> Of course the poster gets a punishment, the post is also deleted.
> 
> As for the ratings on the post, just having the post deleted is enough. It would be way too strict to go after people rating a comment which is against the rules when they're not the ones who wrote it.



You expect us to believe that.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Lew (Sep 3, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> You expect us to believe that.



Yes, I think what I said was pretty reasonable.

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Lewd said:


> Yes, I think what I said was pretty reasonable.



Yeah...but the track record of every mod in the Cafe and other places says otherwise...Marcelles raids on the obd...and the like.

ironically the only S mod I trust to hold herself to any standards is Khaleesi and I still expect her to target me since she seems to think I framed her for all this when I was defended her

Reactions: Like 1


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## White Wolf (Sep 3, 2018)

If someone posts "all mexicans should die!" that's clear cut.
Someone rating it funny, or lewd, or whatever else... is not. Accusing someone of something over a rating lacks the same intent that a post does. 


The Immortal WatchDog said:


> ironically the only S mod I trust to hold herself to any standards is Khaleesi


 these wounds they will not heal


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## Lew (Sep 3, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Yeah...but the track record of every mod in the Cafe and other places says otherwise...Marcelles raids on the obd...and the like.
> 
> ironically the only S mod I trust to hold herself to any standards is Khaleesi and I still expect her to target me since she seems to think I framed her for all this when I was defended her



To my knowledge, we only ever crack down on ratings when someone is rating abusing someone.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

White Wolf said:


> these wounds they will not heal



okkayy finne you and Bacon too.

which is hilarious because you and Bacon have both banned me more than any other staffers and if the narrative about me were true I'd want you both demodded but naw...Bacons ban was solid and you were enforcing Shadows bullshit but were fair about it and diligent as hell about other stuff too.



Lewd said:


> To my knowledge, we only ever crack down on ratings when someone is rating abusing someone.



the phrasing of these policies and the conduct of certain mods suggest this would be a very easy and justifiable leap to make,.


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## White Wolf (Sep 3, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> the phrasing of these policies and the conduct of certain mods suggest this would be a very easy and justifiable leap to make,.


Tbh, there's a pretty big looseness when it comes to ratings because the system is just not manageable as well as one would hope, compared to vB/several add-ons. We've tried more than once to do hard policing on it, which was effective in vB days (I'm sure many people remember the countless repslashes that were handed out), but after a lot of discussion unless it's very blatant abuse of the system, not much will be done about it. 

Telling someone to die in a fire through rep = bad 
Repping someone 10 times in a week = whatever
Rating a bad post funny or something = whatever
etc
You get the idea.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Eros (Sep 3, 2018)

Whitebeard said:


> You're a piece of work, even videos of other people suffering somehow turns you into a victim.


No, it was a huge mistake I made when I was younger. Kids shouldn't watch scary movies. Seeing real violence is horrifying. I brought it upon myself. I made a collasal error in judgment. That's on me. It wasn't forced upon me. I sought and found, and I paid the price for it. I blame myself.


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## Zenith (Sep 3, 2018)

I was linked to this thread because free hugs were promised


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Zenith said:


> I was linked to this thread because free hugs were promised



only if you swear by the bible of the holy prophet Marx and his messiah Ernesto "haha dead babies are funny yay China" Guevara. or are, a calamitous, cancerous, cavalcade of madness...


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## Santí (Sep 3, 2018)

Really guys? _Misandry?

_


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Santi said:


> Really guys? _Misandry?
> 
> _



Are you saying misandry doesn't exist? Because i can show you suicide figures and research and..you know..current events that say otherwise. Or that Khaleesi wasn't being an absolute bigot there?

This is the bed you made...lie in it and actually enforce the rules or give the entire forum cause to disobey them enmasse.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Unlosing Ranger (Sep 3, 2018)

Santi said:


> Really guys? _Misandry?
> 
> _


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

> mis·an·dry
> miˈsandrē/
> _noun_
> 
> ...



It's a very real thing and its resulted in an innocent college student nearly being sent up the river for rape, the destruction of lives due to spurious allegations not being vetted and caused plenty of suicides.

This is something your rules are against..Yes? Or are you saying its okay to be bigoted, prejudiced and malicious against certain groups you dislike or disagree with but not ones you've chosen to identify with?

Reactions: Like 2


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## Juub (Sep 3, 2018)

White Wolf said:


> If someone posts "all mexicans should die!" that's clear cut.


What if the person meant it as a joke?


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## White Wolf (Sep 3, 2018)

Juub said:


> What if the person meant it as a joke?


Give me an example where the context would imply it as a joke. I can't really imagine a scenario where saying "all mexicans should die", "all blacks should die", "all asians should die", "all men should die", "all women should die", etc... is a joke. Mocking someone else's views in the news with an indirect statement?

If your post is simply "all ____ should die", no added context after the fact is going to really help. If there's context before that, that defends it it might get a post deletion and nothing more. 

Like if you post "all mods should die" after this post here, it'll get deleted but not gonna ban you for it cos it'll be understandably tossing the shit and being smart about it, not genuinely malicious in nature. (least it better not be  )


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 3, 2018)

White Wolf said:


> Give me an example where the context would imply it as a joke. I can't really imagine a scenario where saying "all mexicans should die", "all blacks should die", "all asians should die", "all men should die", "all women should die", etc... is a joke. Mocking someone else's views in the news with an indirect statement?
> 
> If your post is simply "all ____ should die", no added context after the fact is going to really help. If there's context before that, that defends it it might get a post deletion and nothing more.
> 
> Like if you post "all mods should die" after this post here, it'll get deleted but not gonna ban you for it cos it'll be understandably tossing the shit and being smart about it, not genuinely malicious in nature. (least it better not be  )


I once made a post in jest about nuking Asia after having watched the shitshow that was Kashimashi because I was mad at Crimson Dragoon

I could see someone doing similar


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

White Wolf said:


> Give me an example where the context would imply it as a joke. I can't really imagine a scenario where saying "all mexicans should die", "all blacks should die", "all asians should die", "*all men should die", "all women should die", etc... is a joke.* Mocking someone else's views in the news with an indirect statement?



kay 

So for the record...Then



Khaleesi said:


> C) end all posts with “men are trash/kill all men”



This post should get Khaleesi temp banned? Because it sounds like, that's your official position.

Reactions: Like 5


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## Juub (Sep 3, 2018)

White Wolf said:


> Give me an example where the context would imply it as a joke. I can't really imagine a scenario where saying "all mexicans should die", "all blacks should die", "all asians should die", "all men should die", "all women should die", etc... is a joke. Mocking someone else's views in the news with an indirect statement?
> 
> If your post is simply "all ____ should die", no added context after the fact is going to really help. If there's context before that, that defends it it might get a post deletion and nothing more.
> 
> Like if you post "all mods should die" after this post here, it'll get deleted but not gonna ban you for it cos it'll be understandably tossing the shit and being smart about it, not genuinely malicious in nature. (least it better not be  )

Reactions: Like 2


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Notice how the Admin behind these insane policies is liking that post

@R3ZSN0R3  endorsing bigotry now are we?

Do you perhaps see yet...the absolute absurdity of these rules? Or do we really have to try and force the issue?


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## Juub (Sep 3, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> kay
> 
> So for the record...Then
> 
> ...


Holy shit lol. It shows we've known each other for over a decade.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Juub said:


> Holy shit lol. It shows we've known each other for over a decade.



Remember the days of facing down the Phenom brigade?

our foes grow weaker while our fangs and power levels keep rising


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## Juub (Sep 3, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Remember the days of facing down the Phenom brigade?
> 
> our foes grow weaker while our fangs and power levels keep rising


That was you and EM. I joined a bit later from memory. I did hear about them though. There was also Tyrant and his cronies too. Don't know where they went but word is the OBD ran em out of town. Not sure what happened exactly.


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## White Wolf (Sep 3, 2018)

This is why context matters; the whole "kill all men/men are trash" thing is a meme mocking some feminist whose show got cancelled over a tweet. (well the latter just being chicks taking the piss out of trashy boyfriends which is valid enough more often than not). 

I'd put it in a similar category as a conversation about lolicons or something and someone posting "nuke Japan", which is a meme. Bad taste? Yes, post deletion? Warranted. Not really *extremely *punishable within those boundaries though. 

It does look bad though since inside jokes go over one's head very fast, and optics do matter since it's hard to have anyone's trust with a poor image. Don't think @Khaleesi has any genuine malice towards men as a whole though.


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## Juub (Sep 3, 2018)

White Wolf said:


> This is why context matters; the whole "kill all men/men are trash" thing is a meme mocking some feminist whose show got cancelled over a tweet. (well the latter just being chicks taking the piss out of trashy boyfriends which is valid enough more often than not).
> 
> I'd put it in a similar category as a conversation about lolicons or something and someone posting "nuke Japan", which is a meme. Bad taste? Yes, post deletion? Warranted. Not really *extremely *punishable within those boundaries though.
> 
> It does look bad though since inside jokes go over one's head very fast, and optics do matter since it's hard to have anyone's trust with a poor image. Don't think @Khaleesi has any genuine malice towards men as a whole though.


Which is why I asked. So in the context of a joke, it is OK? Obviously if I say "all black people should die" with the intent of provoking someone, that's unacceptable. If however I say it in a very obvious tongue-in-cheek manner that is meant to humor rather than offend, it is OK. Correct?


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Juub said:


> That was you and EM. I joined a bit later from memory. I did hear about them though. There was also Tyrant and his cronies too. Don't know where they went but word is the OBD ran em out of town. Not sure what happened exactly.



Naw i was thinking MFG, but I lump Tyrant and his morons into the Phenom brigade mostly because they were like...the retarded car bombing terrorists guys like Bin Laden sent before the real forces of the Jihad.

And that's kinda what it was, Phenom was pretty much leading a crusade against the internet at that point.



White Wolf said:


> This is why context matters; the whole "kill all men/men are trash" thing is a meme mocking some feminist whose show got cancelled over a tweet. (well the latter just being chicks taking the piss out of trashy boyfriends which is valid enough more often than not).
> 
> I'd put it in a similar category as a conversation about lolicons or something and someone posting "nuke Japan", which is a meme. Bad taste? Yes, post deletion? Warranted. Not really *extremely *punishable within those boundaries though.
> 
> It does look bad though since inside jokes go over one's head very fast, and optics do matter since it's hard to have anyone's trust with a poor image. Don't think @Khaleesi has any genuine malice towards men as a whole though.



.....I certainly don't think she should be banned. She probably is a misandrist though, I've no doubt of that but that's fine too, I think prejudice should be naked and out in the open because its self defeating and the louder you are the easier it is to point and laugh. However, when you censor it and attack it and silence it...you suddenly make it a sympathetic beast and people who ordinarily would scoff and walk off from say...the arguments of President Abe and his Nihon Kaigi suddenly start looking at it with interest. Because when you react with censorship you fucking surrender power to a thing.

Which is my entire god damn point about these rules....they don't actually suppress bigotry, because the Cafe is still around...Shadow is still a mod and Reznor is still a mod despite his blatant trolling and lies and false accusations and prejudice here. It directs and canonizes bigotry and racism of a sort deemed socially acceptable while pushing to the fringe ideas and values you guys dislike.

You're not keeping this forum a safe space...you're guaranteeing people are going to find memeing /pol tier bullshit at you as a form of resistance and worse...you're creating the dragons you wanna beat and simply put...you ain't gonna survive it.



Juub said:


> Which is why I asked. So in the context of a joke, it is OK? Obviously if I say "all black people should die" with the intent of provoking someone, that's unacceptable. If however I say it in a very obvious tongue-in-cheek manner that is meant to humor rather than offend, it is OK. Correct?



Suddenly all the screen caps Rez tried to use against me look...even less legitimate.


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## Deleted member 235437 (Sep 3, 2018)

I apologize if my post offended anyone. I don’t want to kill all men lmao and I don’t think men are trash. It’s honestly just a meme that I use to mock feminazis that do believe that stuff.

I thought it would’ve been a fun little post because of the topic of the thread which was about how to bring more women to NF. So yeah I apologize for that.

Also if anything I would nuke all of humanity, not just men


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Khaleesi said:


> I apologize if my post offended anyone. I don’t want to kill all men lmao and I don’t think men are trash. It’s honestly just a meme that I use to mock feminazis that do believe thist stuff.
> 
> I thought it would’ve been a fun little post because of the topic of the thread which was about how to bring more women to NF. So yeah I apologize for that.
> 
> Also if anything I would nuke all of humanity, not just men



You don't need to apologize, even if you meant it 

it was more to prove a point though which was proven...not that anyone will listen.


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## Lew (Sep 3, 2018)

Juub said:


> Which is why I asked. So in the context of a joke, it is OK? Obviously if I say "all black people should die" with the intent of provoking someone, that's unacceptable. If however I say it in a very obvious tongue-in-cheek manner that is meant to humor rather than offend, it is OK. Correct?



It would be a ballsy joke to make, but if context allows it and it's interpreted as a joke by basically everyone then sure.

Honestly having a hard time even thinking how you could use that in a joke.


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## Santí (Sep 3, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I have a question...since white supremacy is specifically banned...is Turkish supremacy allowed? I've got a feeling a certain restored to power S mod would take exception to that...what about Japanese supremacists? Should we start banning posters affiliated with the Nihon Kaigi movement? What about MR_Shadow who is a Sinophile and a Sino-supremacists?
> 
> What about @Yamato she hates the China and rightly so..she probably thinks the Republic of China is the only legal Chinese Government (which it is, Long live Taipei and Down with Beijing the city of lies and all that) and the PRC are nothing but a bunch of low class usurping dogs who should be cleansed from Terra Mater in nuclear hellfire...
> 
> How's about Black supremacists? Like Ej, Cardboard Tube Knight (who has talked about murdering Trump supporters) and their like? How about Eros who is an LGBT zealot who acts like gay people are morally and personally superior to straight people?



I think racial/ethnic supremacy of all forms should be banned if there's clear advocating of dominance over other racial or ethnic groups, and this definitely shouldn't be conflated with something such as black/latino pride and the likes which are political beliefs of empowerment for the disenfranchised.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Cis Het is a slur..its designed to remove the tangible and stigmatize the word "normal" which is the only accurate way to describe 97% of the human race....can I report Natty and Eros and anyone else who uses that term...which I find to be bigoted and fucking disgraceful and I could probably get a decent amount of users to cosign a petition for its ban on those grounds...



Cis comments are ad-homs at most. Slurs are targeted derogatory statements used for _specific groups_ of people, not 97.99% of the planet minus trans. They'll be dealt with under the rules of flaming if applicable.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> How's about @Juub? Paralax and Khaleesi called him incels which is a misandrist slur...do you recognize misandry as a form of prejudice? Can he now request her demotion? Can he request Paralax be banned?



Incels are a *self-identified* subculture. If used as an insult towards another member, it'll be treated as an ad-hom and thus be enforced by the rules of flaming.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Lucaniel threw a bunch of derogatory slurs at us...he targeted us for politics and is advocating treatment that the UN outrageous and immoral as the organization is...considers a form of political dispossession and in dramatic cases slumps it in with genocide...should he banned?



I'm not sure if I understand this scenario, but to be clear: we're not retroactively banning anyone for things which were said prior to the new global rules.


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## Nataly (Sep 3, 2018)

I am amazed how you guys are going hard on the staff and literally not letting them get away with anything, 
That's the way to go!


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## Island (Sep 3, 2018)

Juub said:


> It was at around that time yourself, Malus Darkblade and another use join(name escapes me but he was a troll). I remember you were by far the most knowledgeable of the group when it came to comics. Unfortunately, Tyrant was kind of the main MFG member on NF at the time and ruined our reputation. He was also a mod of the Battledome section and I remember he'd lock your threads or suppress you when you'd destroy him. He was free to do that on MFG but on NF he was just an average joe so he earned quite a bad reputation. After that I created an account but the damage had been done. Since I was from MFG people associated me with Tyrant despite the fact he was a guy I used to routinely own back in my days as a mod. Tyrant singlehandedly destroyed MFGers' reputation. Cableguy, Final Giku Tenshu, Nikushimi hell even Island got lumped with him. I think only Wombat escaped but that's because he was a frequent visitor of both NF and MFG.


This brings back memories, mostly bad memories but memories nonetheless, gg.


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## Es (Sep 3, 2018)

Santi said:


> I think racial/ethnic supremacy of all forms should be banned if there's clear advocating of dominance over other racial or ethnic groups, and this definitely shouldn't be conflated with something such as black/latino pride and the likes which are political beliefs of empowerment for the disenfranchised.


Except its not empowerment in its current state its an ideology of "Mom said its my turn to play xbox."

Everyone pushing this shit want their time in the limelight fucking their targgeted groups over.



Santi said:


> Incels are a *self-identified* subculture.


Which has become a term for anyone who criticizes feminism or really anyone who doesn't bother with thots


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## Santí (Sep 3, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Are you saying misandry doesn't exist? Because i can show you suicide figures and research and..you know..current events that say otherwise. Or that Khaleesi wasn't being an absolute bigot there?
> 
> This is the bed you made...lie in it and actually enforce the rules or give the entire forum cause to disobey them enmasse.





The Immortal WatchDog said:


> It's a very real thing and its resulted in an innocent college student nearly being sent up the river for rape, the destruction of lives due to spurious allegations not being vetted and caused plenty of suicides.
> 
> This is something your rules are against..Yes? Or are you saying its okay to be bigoted, prejudiced and malicious against certain groups you dislike or disagree with but not ones you've chosen to identify with?



I think it takes an outstanding level of intellectual dishonesty to constitute Khaleesi's post as misandry, quite frankly. Obviously this exists, but you're intentionally ignoring the context of the thread, the spam/shitpost purpose of the section, and the irony which is clearly present in the post and has been interpreted as a joke by just about anyone viewing the thread except... You and the ones most actively arguing against the global rules coincidentally?

It's of my opinion that you guys are trying to prove a point of a potentially slippery slope which can be used to target and crack your skulls open because of an institutionalized (and sometimes valid) distrust of staff decisions and history; which I get, really I truly do; but let's analyze the verbatim of the rules regarding flaming/slurs and why they were worded the way they were.



> Berating users specifically or making vague discriminatory comments *to bait a reaction out of users* will likewise not be tolerated, *any and all off-topic discriminatory remarks will be dealt with accordingly* also





> Personal attacks and insults aimed at a member or their family or attempts at character assassination is not allowed. *Banter between friends and or heated comments towards fictional characters are generally permitted.*



Intent plays a huge factor in it, and we get that friends will shoot the shit and say mean things to each other for laughs, I nor anyone else have the intent to stop or crack anyone's skulls open over that and I wouldn't dream of staying silent if I see a member of the staff use these rules to target you or anyone else.

There is a difference in severity/historical context between slurs and insults, hence why nibbers, fabbots, etc. are going to be less excepted/overlooked due to: the actual prevalence of these forms of bigotry as a sheer aggregate and the (lack of) social acceptance of them among users and modern society both ironically and unironically.

If something in particular is causing a problem or unrest in its community and its within reason, then I do believe the staff have an obligation to respond to it in a way that isn't exactly equitable. The staff of a forum are around to ensure that problems don't arise, if there was nothing that would cause problems then there'd be no need for there to be staff in the first place.



Es said:


> xcept its not empowerment in its current state its an ideology of "Mom said its my turn to play xbox."
> 
> Everyone pushing this shit want their time in the limelight fucking their targgeted groups over.



Then this will be viewed on a case by case scenario and dealt with accordingly. Again, intent has to be examined and if it's clear that the intent isn't empowerment of your group but the "it's my turn to play Xbox" ideology as you said, then those posts will be subject to moderation accordingly as well.



Es said:


> Which has become a term for anyone who criticizes feminism or really anyone who doesn't bother with thots



Moderated under Ad-Homs/flaming if used with that intent.


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## Ashi (Sep 3, 2018)

Santi said:


> I think it takes an outstanding level of intellectual dishonesty to constitute Khaleesi's post as misandry, quite frankly. Obviously this exists, but you're intentionally ignoring the context of the thread, the spam/shitpost purpose of the section, and the irony which is clearly present in the post and has been interpreted as a joke by just about anyone viewing the thread except... You and the ones most actively arguing against the global rules coincidentally?
> 
> It's of my opinion that you guys are trying to prove a point of a potentially slippery slope which can be used to target and crack your skulls open because of an institutionalized (and sometimes valid) distrust of staff decisions and history; which I get, really I truly do; but let's analyze the verbatim of the rules regarding flaming/slurs and why they were worded the way they were.
> 
> ...



None of this is correct


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## Santí (Sep 3, 2018)

Shut up, Tensa.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Ashi (Sep 3, 2018)

Okay


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## Nataly (Sep 3, 2018)

Did he tl;dr you


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## Unlosing Ranger (Sep 3, 2018)

Lewd said:


> It would be a ballsy joke to make, but if context allows it and it's interpreted as a joke by basically everyone then sure.
> 
> Honestly having a hard time even thinking how you could use that in a joke.


Ironic, isn't it?

Reactions: Like 1


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## Juub (Sep 3, 2018)

@Santi I clearly said it was a joke and hope you didn’t include me there. I wanted to know if in the context of a joke, racism/sexism etc were tolerated which they seemingly are.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Santi said:


> I think it takes an outstanding level of intellectual dishonesty to constitute Khaleesi's post as misandry, quite frankly.



Why? Because you like her? Because she's female? Because she's part of the protected class of Socjus that infest the forum like a fucking plague?

I'm being facetious about most of that, but you do realize Khaleesi has dehumanized huge chunks of the forum when she blows her top?



Santi said:


> I
> 
> Obviously this exists, but you're intentionally ignoring the context of the thread, the spam/shitpost purpose of the section, and the irony which is clearly present in the post and has been interpreted as a joke by just about anyone viewing the thread except... You and the ones most actively arguing against the global rules coincidentally?



So we're gonna ignore the fact that Lucaniel and nighty used the section to flame me...while Nighty was crusading for this insanity no less...then lied about it indignantly like she was innocent. Or we're gonna ignore the fact that Natty and Natalay make pedoesque commentary towards people there....that shit posting like that directly contradicts the Sesame Street tier nonsense you guys want to enforce.


Santi said:


> I
> It's of my opinion that you guys are trying to prove a point of a potentially slippery slope which can be used to target and crack your skulls open because of an institutionalized (and sometimes valid) distrust of staff decisions and history; which I get, really I truly do; but let's analyze the verbatim of the rules regarding flaming/slurs and why they were worded the way they were.



No, you guys are proving the point for us, while continuing to attack us...this thread basically degenerated into a "Lynch the OBD" "Ban IWD" hysteria thread for about five pages while Reznor lied out of his ass to try and slander me and...you guys directed users in here to fuck with us.





Santi said:


> I
> 
> Intent plays a huge factor in it, and we get that friends will shoot the shit and say mean things to each other for laughs, I nor anyone else* have the intent to stop or crack anyone's skulls open over that and I wouldn't dream of staying silent if I see a member of the staff use these rules to target you or anyone else. *



Really? Because we have been abused by your fellow mods virtually nonstop since about June and all I hear are fucking crickets from you Santi

and then you unbanned Gibs for the stupidest of fucking reasons...repeating history with the same god damn degenerate admin no less.


Santi said:


> I
> There is a difference in severity/historical context between slurs and insults, hence why nibbers, fabbots, etc. are going to be less excepted/overlooked due to: the actual prevalence of these forms of bigotry as a sheer aggregate and the (lack of) social acceptance of them among users and modern society both ironically and unironically.



Who determines what the criteria is for "historical context" then because you just dismissed a bunch of racism, bigotry and prejudice as flaming...so you'll forgive me if I'm a little skeptical here.


Santi said:


> I
> If something in particular is causing a problem or unrest in its community and its within reason, then I do believe the staff have an obligation to respond to it in a way that isn't exactly equitable. The staff of a forum are around to ensure that problems don't arise, if there was nothing that would cause problems then there'd be no need for there to be staff in the first place.



The staff are proving themselves to be no better than the guys who allowed Yokai to pimp child porn on the site and let a dog fucking p*d*p**** back onto it again.


Santi said:


> I
> 
> Then this will be viewed on a case by case scenario and dealt with accordingly. Again, intent has to be examined and if it's clear that the intent isn't empowerment of your group but the "it's my turn to play Xbox" ideology as you said, then those posts will be subject to moderation accordingly as well.



where's the oversight? Who makes sure the S mods and mods responding and enforcing these rules aren't biased as fuck?

Who punishes the mods when its clear they virtue signaled and lynched a user they didn't like?



Santi said:


> I think racial/ethnic supremacy of all forms should be banned if there's clear advocating of dominance over other racial or ethnic groups, and this definitely shouldn't be conflated with something such as black/latino pride and the likes which are political beliefs of empowerment for the disenfranchised.]



What about white pride vs white supremacy? Or are you going to argue that whites aren't the subject of institutionalized racism? They have been for about 50 years now.

further more I'm a Latino...specifically Argentine, La Raza and such groups don't speak for me...Sin Fronteras not only doesn't speak for me but I'm with Bandera Vecinal who want to declare them a terrorist organization.

Do I get to object every time some Centro Americano who's whored himself out to the DNC decides to speak on my behalf and body Americans and whine about Azteca pride?




Santi said:


> Cis comments are ad-homs at most. Slurs are targeted derogatory statements used for _specific groups_ of people, not 97.99% of the planet minus trans. They'll be dealt with under the rules of flaming if applicable.



No, Cis is a _bigoted _term directed at billions of people by a vocal minority, its prejudicial regardless of the numbers.





Santi said:


> Incels are a *self-identified* subculture. If used as an insult towards another member, it'll be treated as an ad-hom and thus be enforced by the rules of flaming.



Again users like Khaleesi directly use it as a slur against men.




Santi said:


> I'm not sure if I understand this scenario, but to be clear: we're not retroactively banning anyone for things which were said prior to the new global rules.



try again Santi and with a little less Mod wall of silence...Luca said this shit while the rules were in place.



Nataly said:


> I am amazed how you guys are going hard on the staff and literally not letting them get away with anything,
> That's the way to go!



Don't you have another NEET to cuckold?

Reactions: Like 1


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## Lurko (Sep 3, 2018)

Lewd and Santi are the only good mods Imo.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 3, 2018)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> Lewd and Santi are the only good mods Imo.



don't know Lewd, Santi has always seemingly been good people though.

which is why him endorsing this shit is confusing me.


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## A Optimistic (Sep 3, 2018)

So multiple people have sent me PMs, and contacted me on Discord asking me why I haven't been commenting in this thread.

And the reason is simple: I've been occupied dominating the Alley Mafia game.

Now I will catch up and share my thoughts. Thank you to all the kind souls who brought this thread to my attention.


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## A Optimistic (Sep 3, 2018)

Good lord, 14 pages?

No fucking thank you, I'm going to bed.


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## Lurko (Sep 3, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> don't know Lewd, Santi has always seemingly been good people though.
> 
> which is why him endorsing this shit is confusing me.


He's a mod, he kinda has to probaly.


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## Nataly (Sep 3, 2018)

Ava's opinion on such a serious issue 
No thank you I'm going to bed


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## A Optimistic (Sep 3, 2018)

Love how all the people I've been running circles around in the Alley Mafia game are the ones rating me optimistic.

Can you losers get any more bitter?


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## A Optimistic (Sep 3, 2018)

Ashi said:


> None of this is correct



You should have the courage to say why, speak your mind brother.

Reactions: Like 1


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## A Optimistic (Sep 3, 2018)

Alright, I actually read the opening post. 

I'm fine with the opening post and all the rules...if you guys are actually consistent with these new rules with _everybody, members and staff alike.
_
Knowing you guys though...


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## Santí (Sep 3, 2018)

Avalon said:


> Love how all the people I've been running circles around in the Alley Mafia game are the ones rating me optimistic.
> 
> Can you losers get any more bitter?



I am the 2-time reigning champ. Come at me


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## A Optimistic (Sep 3, 2018)

@Santi

See you next DP. 



White Wolf said:


> The thing is; the rules aren't being enforced *retroactively*.



I like this a lot tbh. I don't want to get in trouble for any wild shit I said before the new rules are up.

Fresh start for everyone.


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## White Wolf (Sep 4, 2018)

Please stick to your scheduled rule shitting, not people shitting. Thanks!

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 4, 2018)

White Wolf said:


> Please stick to your scheduled rule shitting, not people shitting. Thanks!



What about Street shitting? :


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 4, 2018)

NostalgiaFan said:


> They deleted another batch of comments again.


Nah I don’t care this time. Stephanie starting shit with us is worth deleting.

Gonna miss my System Shock 2 post tho


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## White Wolf (Sep 4, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> What about Street shitting? :


Man's gotta do what a man's gotta do, I live in shitsville where they turn water off if there's no electricity, do you know how hard it is to not shit a fountain in the comfort of the outdoors with a gentle breeze slipping through the cracks? 


but yeah, no personal pls


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 4, 2018)

White Wolf said:


> Man's gotta do what a man's gotta do, I live in shitsville where they turn water off if there's no electricity, do you know how hard it is to not shit a fountain in the comfort of the outdoors with a gentle breeze slipping through the cracks?
> 
> 
> but yeah, no personal pls


But why’d you have to delete my System Shock 2 post tho

That was actually a good one


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## NostalgiaFan (Sep 4, 2018)

They have gone full on MIB on this shit, can't even have me saying they got rid of it


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## Blakk Jakk (Sep 4, 2018)

Former Obd Lurker. said:


> What's MIB?


Men in Black


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## Lurko (Sep 4, 2018)

Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> Men in Black


Oh that's savage.


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## Kathutet (Sep 4, 2018)

Imakarum Mirabilis said:


> But why’d you have to delete my System Shock 2 post tho
> 
> That was actually a good one


I was rewatching it, too. Lead me to a treasure trove of old video games videos on Youtube.

God damn it all to shit. Those were good times. When your GPU wasn't a brick made out of spacedust that could heat your entire house in the winter if you turned off the fan. It was just a brick. Probably. It ran like one, anyway. Best use for them was to show off your wireframe windows 98 screensaver.

Read this before it's deleted. I'm probably doing a bad right here by not being on topic. I'm only slightly sorry. This is how I lived my forumlife for almost a decade.

Oh god it's almost a decade. Kill me.


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## Kinjin (Sep 4, 2018)

Kenneth said:


> I was rewatching it, too. Lead me to a treasure trove of old video games videos on Youtube.
> 
> God damn it all to shit. Those were good times. When your GPU wasn't a brick made out of spacedust that could heat your entire house in the winter if you turned off the fan. It was just a brick. Probably. It ran like one, anyway. Best use for them was to show off your wireframe windows 98 screensaver.
> 
> ...


Drive-by, pointless comments are not welcome. Doubling-down with an antagonistic attitude when this is pointed out to you is, obviously, also not welcome. An account strike has been issued to Kenneth for this behavior. Account strikes add up to temporary/permanent bans, which revoke access to the entirety of the Narutoforums website. Please review the community guidelines, which you agreed to (twice) prior to registration. While reviewing these rules, you may also wish to re-evaluate what it is you are looking to get out of your time here.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Santí (Sep 4, 2018)

Juub said:


> @Santi I clearly said it was a joke and hope you didn’t include me there. I wanted to know if in the context of a joke, racism/sexism etc were tolerated which they seemingly are.



Wasn’t even aware of your posts when I made mine, so no you weren’t in mind.


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## Santí (Sep 4, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Why? Because you like her? Because she's female? Because she's part of the protected class of Socjus that infest the forum like a fucking plague?



Because I read the thread and came to an informed decision based off of context clues.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> So we're gonna ignore the fact that Lucaniel and nighty used the section to flame me...while Nighty was crusading for this insanity no less...then lied about it indignantly like she was innocent. Or we're gonna ignore the fact that Natty and Natalay make pedoesque commentary towards people there....that shit posting like that directly contradicts the Sesame Street tier nonsense you guys want to enforce.



I hope you’re not talking about the thread where they literally just copy/pasta’d posts? Because if we’re talking about Sesame Street tier nonsense then constituting that as flaming is 3glasshouse5me.

If you’re referring to something else, must have missed it.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> No, you guys are proving the point for us, while continuing to attack us...this thread basically degenerated into a "Lynch the OBD" "Ban IWD" hysteria thread for about five pages while Reznor lied out of his ass to try and slander me and...*you guys directed users in here to fuck with us.*



Lots of accusations. No one’s directing anyone here to fuck with you and I’m not sure how you came to that conclusion.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Really? Because we have been abused by your fellow mods virtually nonstop since about June and all I hear are fucking crickets from you Santi
> 
> and then you unbanned Gibs for the stupidest of fucking reasons...repeating history with the same god damn degenerate admin no less.



Abused how?

If you’re expecting us to take action on what has been purely hearsay, I emplore that you consider what kind of precedent that is and how that could be used to abuse you and your pals even further, no?

I don’t understand how you can argue against what I see as a fairly rational set of rules for potential mod abuse but in the same breath argue that mods should extra judicially punish on unverified word of mouth which has greater potential for abuse.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Who determines what the criteria is for "historical context" then because you just dismissed a bunch of racism, bigotry and prejudice as flaming...so you'll forgive me if I'm a little skeptical here.



I went based off the etymology and their origin, their current definition, and the context of their usage as shown in the examples provided. Sounded more like flaming to me.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> The staff are proving themselves to be no better than the guys who allowed Yokai to pimp child porn on the site and let a dog fucking p*d*p**** back onto it again.



Based on...?



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> where's the oversight? Who makes sure the S mods and mods responding and enforcing these rules aren't biased as fuck?
> 
> Who punishes the mods when its clear they virtue signaled and lynched a user they didn't like?



I’m not sure what you’re asking for here, a 3rd party tribunal?

We acknowledge that we haven’t held each other accountable as much as we should have, and many of us are determined to change that.

Obviously this won’t convince you due to your distrust but... I can’t think of any alternative?



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> What about white pride vs white supremacy? Or are you going to argue that whites aren't the subject of institutionalized racism? They have been for about 50 years now.



Same applies. I don’t see why it’d be excluded, but I rarely if never do I see that type of “White Pride”



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> No, Cis is a _bigoted _term directed at billions of people by a vocal minority, its prejudicial regardless of the numbers.



I disagree.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Again users like Khaleesi directly use it as a slur against men.



Ad-homs/Flaming.



The Immortal WatchDog said:


> try again Santi and with a little less Mod wall of silence...Luca said this shit while the rules were in place.



I’ll ask about this and come back to you. Can’t give you an answer about something I haven’t seen or heard about until now.


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## Deleted member 235437 (Sep 4, 2018)

As a result of continuous shit flinging and posting in a way that harms the point of this thread and it’s discussion, thread bans were given out. You guys were given a warning period, anymore shit flinging and more will be given out.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 4, 2018)

Santi said:


> Because I read the thread and came to an informed decision based off of context clues.



disregarding entirely, her propensity to dehumanize people who don't think like her and then play the victim card..of course.




Santi said:


> I hope you’re not talking about the thread where they literally just copy/pasta’d posts? Because if we’re talking about Sesame Street tier nonsense then constituting that as flaming is 3glasshouse5me.
> 
> If you’re referring to something else, must have missed it.



The hypocrisy of it, certainly bothers more than language...



Santi said:


> Lots of accusations. No one’s directing anyone here to fuck with you and I’m not sure how you came to that conclusion.



Bullshit, it's been done before over on Island's discord and the timing of all this is adorably suspect.




Santi said:


> Abused how?



ooohh lets see here, banning Nightmare Cinema 24 hours after he'd stopped responding to Gunstarvillains who was trolling (Stephanie, big fucking surprise here) Marcelle taking a fucking stepfather joke so personally the doofus goes and hits me with a twenty four hour ban when the dude it was directed at thought it was hilarious as fuck and didn't bat an eyelash. Allowing Id to basically target and go after Nightmare Cinema resulting in a situation where he ate a three or four month long ban...based off ban scaling from the prior year (which isn't supposed to happen) and Marcelle's feelings being hurt because the Pinoy lost his shit after being abused by two S mods and lobbed a few grenades off that neither could handle...only after...said S mods raided the OBD issued the above bad faith bans..Id got his powers back over the OBD when no one wanted it and it resulted in half the sections active regulars flaming all of you in disgust...and then deciding to moderate his fucking posts (which is an absurdity in and of itself) which then allowed them to justify their horseshit ban.

What else? Oh yeah...allowing Catalyst to flame me for months then hitting me with a horseshit 24 hour ban based purely on political appeasement because I called that little sociopath a fucking hypocrite for ignoring how many, many school shooters are, like him untreated Aspies ...based entirely on political appeasement? What else? Oh yeah Banning Es after Ej and Skaddix called him an uncle Tom after about a solid month of Mr_Shadow not only permitting flaming and hostility towards him but knowing full well the Cafe regulars use their discord to target Ranger, Es and myself...make up nonsense excuses to get us banned and he basically not only endorses it but codifies it by entering threads to warn _us off _and not his band of mental degenerates. What else? ooohhh yeeaahh...after directing another lynch mob on the both of us...an unjust banning for me which White Wolf reset to a section ban and none of you assholes had the fucking integrity to reverse even after Shadow flamed us in the OBD convo and bragged in my court thread about how he was setting an example...Lets see,...what else

Marcelle shitting on the sections he mods originally...Marcelle being a petty fuck and demanding Es ban run the clock up DESPITE CLEAR EVIDENCE OF ABUSE AND MODERATORS OBJECTING TO THE BAN.....Blade being banned for the use of the N word (which I find hilarious because again Luca slandering the fuck out of us here with slurs) and what else...Reznor lying his ass off and trying to slander me as a racist and being a lazy fuck about it....what else...hmmm...Lets see

oh yeah....Strongarms perm section ban from the OBD being reversed because he fed you some lame ass narrative about how I;'m the architect of all the mod vs user resentment and the OBD's hatred of him despite me being in active FOR FIVE FUCKING YEARS. Marcelle reversing Cains ban because Marcelle is apparently the biggest idiot you have on the staff and his hatred for the OBD and blatant disrespect for the OBD staff is apparent to anyone with eyes.

Do I need to go on? Or does a mod fucking directing lynchings and coordinating attacks on users so he has a pretext to request their ban...the blatant disrespect and insulting towards OBD mods by a god damn invalid and Reznor being...the biggest sleezebag the staff has ever had short of Kira Yamato (Since as far as I know..Reznor doesn't share his proclivities) and everything else listed count as "sufficient cause for a grievance"


Santi said:


> If you’re expecting us to take action on what has been purely hearsay, I emplore that you consider what kind of precedent that is and how that could be used to abuse you and your pals even further, no?



This is such a lame defense for why you guys again reversed a ban on that piece of shit that it's not even worth addressing beyond this point.



Santi said:


> I don’t understand how you can argue against what I see as a fairly rational set of rules for potential mod abuse but in the same breath argue that mods should extra judicially punish on unverified word of mouth which has greater potential for abuse.



Because you're a draft horse with blinders on charging into a siege.

wow that's probably the most bad ass diss I've ever tossed out to someone 



Santi said:


> I went based off the etymology and their origin, their current definition, and the context of their usage as shown in the examples provided. Sounded more like flaming to me.



mhmm...They're slurs....you can't defend treating them as anything else.



Santi said:


> Based on...?







> ooohh lets see here, banning Nightmare Cinema 24 hours after he'd stopped responding to Gunstarvillains who was trolling (Stephanie, big fucking surprise here) Marcelle taking a fucking stepfather joke so personally the doofus goes and hits me with a twenty four hour ban when the dude it was directed at thought it was hilarious as fuck and didn't bat an eyelash. Allowing Id to basically target and go after Nightmare Cinema resulting in a situation where he ate a three or four month long ban...based off ban scaling from the prior year (which isn't supposed to happen) and Marcelle's feelings being hurt because the Pinoy lost his shit after being abused by two S mods and lobbed a few grenades off that neither could handle...only after...said S mods raided the OBD issued the above bad faith bans..Id got his powers back over the OBD when no one wanted it and it resulted in half the sections active regulars flaming all of you in disgust...and then deciding to moderate his fucking posts (which is an absurdity in and of itself) which then allowed them to justify their horseshit ban.
> 
> What else? Oh yeah...allowing Catalyst to flame me for months then hitting me with a horseshit 24 hour ban based purely on political appeasement because I called that little sociopath a fucking hypocrite for ignoring how many, many school shooters are, like him untreated Aspies ...based entirely on political appeasement? What else? Oh yeah Banning Es after Ej and Skaddix called him an uncle Tom after about a solid month of Mr_Shadow not only permitting flaming and hostility towards him but knowing full well the Cafe regulars use their discord to target Ranger, Es and myself...make up nonsense excuses to get us banned and he basically not only endorses it but codifies it by entering threads to warn _us off _and not his band of mental degenerates. What else? ooohhh yeeaahh...after directing another lynch mob on the both of us...an unjust banning for me which White Wolf reset to a section ban and none of you assholes had the fucking integrity to reverse even after Shadow flamed us in the OBD convo and bragged in my court thread about how he was setting an example...Lets see,...what else
> 
> ...





Santi said:


> I’m not sure what you’re asking for here, a 3rd party tribunal?



Yes, made up of veteran users with no ties to sections like the Cafe who are little more than tools for the mods. Or outside staffers who have no sense of solidarity with any of us.

You guys should be judged by us...held accountable by us and face punishment by us.



Santi said:


> We acknowledge that we haven’t held each other accountable as much as we should have, and many of us are determined to change that.
> 
> Obviously this won’t convince you due to your distrust but... I can’t think of any alternative?



give us Marcelle's head...Maybe Mr_Shadows too..

that'd be a start.

Then maybe reverse the policy that gives S mods superior authority to you guys, they should be your janitors not your bosses.



Santi said:


> Same applies. I don’t see why it’d be excluded, but I rarely if never do I see that type of “White Pride”



Really? Because I'm a fucking spic and I'm big on Western civilization and pride for it...




Santi said:


> I disagree.



Based on what?




Santi said:


> Ad-homs/Flaming.



No slurs...


Santi said:


> I’ll ask about this and come back to you. Can’t give you an answer about something I haven’t seen or heard about until now.



Thank you, Santi.

edit- Khaleesi really shouldn't be modding this thread... I question her judgement and partiality.

Reactions: Like 1


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## A Optimistic (Sep 4, 2018)

Testing to see if thread banned 

Edit: FUCK YEAH LET'S GOOOO I SURVIVED THE THREAD BAN PURGE!!!!!!!


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## Island (Sep 4, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> Bullshit, it's been done before over on Island's discord and the timing of all this is adorably suspect.


To my knowledge, this is untrue.

I haven't seen anybody (especially not the staff, none of which are especially active on the Discord) coordinate anything against you or your friends.

GOS and Khaleesi are probably the only staffers who post there at least semi-regularly.

While it's true that the OBD gets shit talked sometimes on the Discord, I haven't seen any efforts to get you guys banned or anything, especially not from the staff.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 4, 2018)

Island said:


> To my knowledge, this is untrue.
> 
> I haven't seen anybody (especially not the staff, none of which are especially active on the Discord) coordinate anything against you or your friends.
> .



Yeah no...not only is it true but we were warned about it multiple times and Caps existed at one point 

also it helps when the thugs in that section brag about it out in the open

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 8, 2018)

And once again, like clockwork the staff prove our point about these rules being little more than a "cover your ass" policy. You have Cafe users bragging openly about planning lynchings and doing whatever they please..rep circles being ignored by the admins annnnnnddd

@NightmareCinema  is unbanned but you guys are still...moderating...his posts


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## Masterblack06 (Sep 8, 2018)




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## Atlantic Storm (Sep 8, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> And once again, like clockwork the staff prove our point about these rules being little more than a "cover your ass" policy. You have Cafe users bragging openly about planning lynchings and doing whatever they please..rep circles being ignored by the admins annnnnnddd
> 
> @NightmareCinema  is unbanned but you guys are still...moderating...his posts



I'm pretty sure I addressed all these points in our private conversation, dude. You didn't complain then, so why do it now?


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 8, 2018)

Atlantic Storm said:


> I'm pretty sure I addressed all these points in our private conversation, dude. You didn't complain then, so why do it now?



I don't know how you could mistake "hmmm"

and "thirst is a powerful drug"

as my endorsing your determination...both suggest something else.


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## Atlantic Storm (Sep 8, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I don't know how you could mistake "hmmm"
> 
> and "thirst is a powerful drug"
> 
> as my endorsing your determination...both suggest something else.


Never said you endorsed it, only that you didn't complain when I made my responses. Either way, you accepted my answer regarding Mega's supposed "lynching" in the Café, and Natty's "rep circle" being ignored by admins is completely untrue. I investigated it, and it just doesn't exist.


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 8, 2018)

Atlantic Storm said:


> Never said you endorsed it, only that you didn't complain when I made my responses. Either way, you accepted my answer regarding Mega's supposed "lynching" in the Café, and Natty's "rep circle" being ignored by admins is completely untrue. I investigated it, and it just doesn't exist.



I didn't accept either answer...I simply chose to remain silent because I don't know if I can trust any of you to actually do something in the interest of the users as opposed to a clique of malignant shitheel Marxists who should all be mass banned...and their section mod thrown out.

edit- its painfully obvious section regs in the Cafe and the Alley are acting like cliques, the way you guys always accuse the OBD of acting..you guys rep slash Blade and Hachibi and accuse them of running a circle...yet the obvious cliquing shit is ignored


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## Atlantic Storm (Sep 8, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> I didn't accept either answer...I simply chose to remain silent because I don't know if I can trust any of you to actually do something in the interest of the users as opposed to a clique of malignant shitheel Marxists who should all be mass banned...and their section mod thrown out.



Do I have permission to quote a sentence from one of your responses in our convo for the purpose of this discussion?


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## The Immortal WatchDog (Sep 8, 2018)

Atlantic Storm said:


> Do I have permission to quote a sentence from one of your responses in our convo for the purpose of this discussion?



would it be this one?



> Oh I know, I just thought it was hilarious to read that from them given the chief complaint against us was that we supposedly rail roaded your mods.
> 
> Are you going to return autonomy to section mods yet?



and my commentary there...is the blatant hypocrisy. If I shitpost in a discord after abuse was directed towards me there and Island ran into damage mode at light speed...it gets taken seriously. When we make noise, its an organized conspiracy against S mods...

yet...anyone else "its all funn'n'

Reactions: Like 1


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## Fang (Sep 8, 2018)

Why was IWD banned?

Reactions: Like 1


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## Es (Sep 8, 2018)

Fang said:


> Why was IWD banned?


Kahlesshi got triggered again it seems



> Khaleesi and Reznor directed some Cafe regulars to lurk the OBD and waited until we got angry that NC was still having his posts modded after he got banned, people got angry and when I noticed the staffs usual puppets lurking I made a shitpost that wasn't serious but would be taken as serious by the emotionally unstable and they reported it to Khaleesi who basically has a vendetta against me and blames me for her meltdown when I did nothing but defend her. I shit posted, to expose the mods as morally compromised and unwilling to actually listen to our grievances and were willing to do anything to silence us including directing users to harass us, stalk us and flame us. Lucaniel, Gunners, CTK, Ej, Ashi all of them prove it and the attitude and conduct in the Cafe discord prove it. I basically wanted to see if they'd be willing to not jump at a chance to attack us and ban a user they have an issue with and to see if they'd be willing to deal with their own bad moderators and revise these insane rules to the benefit of the forum.
> Instead, Khaleesi banned me and is lying to justify her ban and the rest of the staff are hyperventilating and trying to cover up the fact that they basically lynched a user because they can't be bothered to hold themselves to any actual standards.
> Tell; them that
> and also tell them while its supposed to only be a week long ban
> ...


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## Lurko (Sep 9, 2018)

Damn Watchdog banned?


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## sworder (Sep 9, 2018)

cool story bro, didn't realize I was in the fanfiction forum


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## Lurko (Sep 9, 2018)




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## Yamato (Sep 9, 2018)

The Immortal WatchDog said:


> edit- its painfully obvious section regs in the Cafe and the Alley are acting like cliques, the way you guys always accuse the OBD of acting..you guys rep slash Blade and Hachibi and accuse them of running a circle...yet the obvious cliquing shit is ignored






Atlantic Storm said:


> Never said you endorsed it, only that you didn't complain when I made my responses. Either way, you accepted my answer regarding Mega's supposed "lynching" in the Café, and *Natty's "rep circle" being ignored by admins is completely untrue. I investigated it, and it just doesn't exist.*



Is this what you are supposed to be looking for



These a couple blatant “rep circle” threads going on in the Alley

Reactions: Like 1


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## Natty (Sep 9, 2018)

Yamato said:


> Is this what you are supposed to be looking for
> 
> 
> 
> These a couple blatant “rep circle” threads going on in the Alley



Is this for real? lmao


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## ~M~ (Sep 9, 2018)

Yamato said:


> Is this what you are supposed to be looking for
> 
> 
> 
> These a couple blatant “rep circle” threads going on in the Alley


But why would Atlantic Storm say something that isn't true?


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## Natty (Sep 9, 2018)

I hope you guys are kidding, cause that thread was made in reaction to the accusation. LOL


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## Unlosing Ranger (Sep 9, 2018)

I remember when users used to be banned for rep circles, guess it has changed.


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## Santí (Sep 9, 2018)

Unlosing Ranger said:


> I remember when users used to be banned for rep circles, guess it has changed.



What? They were sealed and slashed at most, no one was ever banned for a rep circle


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## White Wolf (Sep 9, 2018)

I literally mentioned this last Monday to the same people and why it's still brought up in an attempt to make some point is beyond me.



White Wolf said:


> Tbh, there's a pretty big looseness when it comes to ratings because the system is just not manageable as well as one would hope, compared to vB/several add-ons. We've tried more than once to do hard policing on it, which was effective in vB days (I'm sure many people remember the countless repslashes that were handed out), *but after a lot of discussion unless it's very blatant abuse of the system, not much will be done about it. *
> 
> Telling someone to die in a fire through rep = bad
> Repping someone 10 times in a week = whatever
> ...



Getting repped by a few people every few days is a waste of everyone's time, the only recent "repcircle" to be punished was a dozen some people in the span of several months repping systematically. Not some meager circlejerking that most sections have. 

Hope that clarifies things.


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## Unlosing Ranger (Sep 9, 2018)

Santi said:


> What? They were sealed and slashed at most, no one was ever banned for a rep circle


I recall a user called Owl something or another who was running around with a rep circle thread directly in public and the mods letting it run for who knows how long. I don't recall that user ever posting again after that. 
But then I guess you should laugh at how incompetent mods are as you are one now.


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## Santí (Sep 9, 2018)

Unlosing Ranger said:


> I recall a user called Owl something or another who was running around with a rep circle thread directly in public and the mods letting it run for who knows how long. I don't recall that user ever posting again after that.
> But then I guess you should laugh at how incompetent mods are as you are one now.



Owl wasn’t banned for the rep circle because I was in that thread jerking rep out of those saps too because it was funny how invisible they thought they were in the hidden section 

He was banned for trolling, raiding, and conspiracy against users etc.


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## Unlosing Ranger (Sep 9, 2018)

Santi said:


> Owl wasn’t banned for the rep circle because I was in that thread jerking rep out of those saps too because it was funny how invisible they thought they were in the hidden section


At least you know what I'm talking about. I'm amazed you remembered.


> He was banned for trolling, raiding, and conspiracy against users etc.


But then that begs the question about the latter point you just made considering the subject we are on.


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## Fang (Sep 9, 2018)

Santi said:


> What? They were sealed and slashed at most, no one was ever banned for a rep circle



They were in the past actually. That's how early rep system with flaming, rep abuse, and rep whoring worked. First you got a warning, second time you got a more severe warning, third time you got rep-banned for a week; you could rep others but not receive rep, then you would rep-sealed so no incoming or outgoing rep, and finally either the duration of the rep-ban is increased or you are just banned. That usually also got coupled with rep slashes.


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## Fang (Sep 9, 2018)

I mean the rep system rules have been changed and altered so many times now that no one really cares including the Staff unless its really fucking blatant rep-whoring or rep-abuse to the extreme. And that was done back in 2014, "you can neg rep each other to your hearts content and we (staff) won't care anymore as long as you aren't breaking site rules with content in the rep messages."


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## Yamato (Sep 9, 2018)

~M~ said:


> But why would Atlantic Storm say something that isn't true?


I wouldn’t doubt him either, but it’s hard to tell sometimes if staff are honest or lying to cover up something. That goes for anyone.



Natty said:


> I hope you guys are kidding, cause that thread was made in reaction to the accusation. LOL


It’s what I thought too, but the way you say it, it makes it sound like the rep circle has been going around for some time already. Also, that because a member was banned, you didn’t really bat an eye and it was someone who you’ve interacted with. Some clashes lately.
“Not gonna complain though” can be determined as, “Good riddance”

Sooo that’s my take on it.



White Wolf said:


> I literally mentioned this last Monday to the same people and why it's still brought up in an attempt to make some point is beyond me.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




It does clarify things. But what if the rep circle going on in the Alley or wherever goes on for more than weeks? Would mods really wait months before something turns big and becomes more difficult to handle?

I would assume this rep issue was brought up again becaus there are some users who haven’t really caught up with that or that these groups are mass repping each other to give each other higher points to gang neg someone they don’t like. They’re deliberately doing something passive aggressively to terrorize members and mess with them.
I know there are those who don’t really care about rep and those who do.
It’s just that it is silly and pitiful for people to silently gang neg others because they are cowards who can’t face the other person directly.


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## sworder (Sep 9, 2018)




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## White Wolf (Sep 9, 2018)

Yamato said:


> But what if the rep circle going on in the Alley or wherever goes on for more than weeks? Would mods really wait months before something turns big and becomes more difficult to handle?


It wouldn't be more difficult since the longer it lasts the more compromised you are. 
If one person reps you 10 times in a month, that's nothing.
If ten people rep you 60 times each in a month, that's blatant. 


Yamato said:


> I would assume this rep issue was brought up again becaus there are some users who haven’t really caught up with that or that these groups are mass repping each other to give each other higher points to gang neg someone they don’t like. They’re deliberately doing something passive aggressively to terrorize members and mess with them.
> I know there are those who don’t really care about rep and those who do.
> It’s just that it is silly and pitiful for people to silently gang neg others because they are cowards who can’t face the other person directly.


Except there's no evidence of these claims only people thinking that it's happening.


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## Natty (Sep 9, 2018)

Yamato said:


> It’s what I thought too, but the way you say it, it makes it sound like the rep circle has been going around for some time already. Also, that because a member was banned, you didn’t really bat an eye and it was someone who you’ve interacted with. Some clashes lately.
> “Not gonna complain though” can be determined as, “Good riddance”
> 
> Sooo that’s my take on it.



There's no rep circle, it's just people in the Alley repping my posts cause they find it funny or they send me a message through the rep system. I mostly post in the alley, so people who frequent the Alley will regularly rep me if I consistently post funny posts. It's not a conspiracy, there's nothing going behind the scenes. I just joined last month and I really don't care about rep.

I blame my high rep on Rez, since he gave me a shit ton of rep for saying that I didn't know him LOL

Not gonna complain because the dude has a penchant to attracting drama nearly everywhere he goes, and his posts are often chock full of off the hinge rants about perceived threats. He has the capabilities to be nice.. But if you were to ask me if he breaks any rules though, he constantly breaks the baiting rule. As he's always poking at staff, name calling users, dismissing people to incite a reaction and more. I partially mentioned this in our last discussion, if you can call it that. That's just my opinion and ultimately it doesn't mean anything as I'm not in a position of power.

It's also just a temp ban, it's not like the dude died.


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## Yamato (Sep 9, 2018)

White Wolf said:


> It wouldn't be more difficult since the longer it lasts the more compromised you are.
> If one person reps you 10 times in a month, that's nothing.
> If ten people rep you 60 times each in a month, that's blatant.
> 
> Except there's no evidence of these claims only people thinking that it's happening.


Claims gotta be based off of something right 
What they see, what they hear, gut feelings, etc. But yeah.



Natty said:


> There's no rep circle, it's just people in the Alley repping my posts cause they find it funny or they send me a message through the rep system. I mostly post in the alley, so people who frequent the Alley will regularly rep me if I consistently post funny posts. It's not a conspiracy, there's nothing going behind the scenes. I just joined last month and I really don't care about rep.
> 
> I blame my high rep on Rez, since he gave me a shit ton of rep for saying that I didn't know him LOL
> 
> ...



That's what it makes it seem like a rep circle. Bunch of close knit users spreading rep to each other often.


It's funny because I only frequent here ever so often and came back from a hiatus, all I remember and info that I collected mostly to relates to Reznor and him being whatever everyone calls him to be. There always is going to be drama going on around regarding staff.


He's a tough dog. I'm sure he will be fine too. 
Some make it out to be though

Reactions: Like 1


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## Fang (Sep 9, 2018)

Repstorm 2018 when?


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## TheCupOfBrew (Sep 9, 2018)

I honestly forget that rep is a thing.


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## A Optimistic (Sep 9, 2018)

I doubt someone who went out of their way to disable their rep bar forgot that rep is a thing.


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## TheCupOfBrew (Sep 9, 2018)

Avalon said:


> I doubt someone who went out of their way to disable their rep bar forgot that rep is a thing.




I disabled it because of aesthetic though.


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## Juub (Sep 9, 2018)

Would just like to say this thread has been and still is completely useless.


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## Juub (Sep 9, 2018)

@R3ZSN0R3 Also have you thought about restructuring your staff? Too many cooks in that damn kitchen. I see people with "Advisor" and "Retired" staff running around acting like they are admins. Maybe your staff needs new global rules and not this place. Easier to adapt to the masses than have the masses adapt to you.


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## Xhominid (Sep 9, 2018)

How about we have a system that if people believe that the admin is being abusive with their power, that there can be a system in place that people can vote them out?

And for it to not be abusive for the people, have it equally be reviewed by people outside of that board(So for example if people try and force a mod out on purpose in say NF Cafe, people in the different boards can equally review if they are abusive with their power and also agree with it from the outside as well).


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## Juub (Sep 9, 2018)

Xhominid said:


> How about we have a system that if people believe that the admin is being abusive with their power, that there can be a system in place that people can vote them out?


Because they know the whole damn staff would be taken out in a matter of minutes.


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## Unlosing Ranger (Sep 10, 2018)

Juub said:


> Because they know the whole damn staff would be taken out in a matter of minutes.


That and it'd just be yes men.


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