# Rank the Yonko



## YonkoDrippy (May 7, 2021)

Rank the Yonko from strongest to weakest

Primebeard
Big Mom
Shanks
Blackbeard
Kaido
Old Whitebeard
Luffy (will most likely be an official Yonko after Wano)

Reactions: Funny 2


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## ShadoLord (May 7, 2021)

Primebeard
Blackbeard
Shanks
Old Whitebeard
Kaido
Big Mom
Luffy

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## TheNirou (May 7, 2021)

Primebeard

-------- big gap

Oldbeard
Luffy after Wano
Kaido
Shanks
Blackbeard
MF Oldbeard 

--------  medium gap

Current Luffy
Big Mom

Reactions: Funny 2 | Disagree 4 | Tier Specialist 4


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## Mihawk (May 7, 2021)

Primebeard
-----
Shanks
Kaido
Oldbeard
Current BB
Big Mom
-----
Wano Luffy


I got Blackbeard surpassing all previous or current incarnations of the Yonko in due time.

Reactions: Like 1 | Creative 1 | Tier Specialist 2


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## TheMoffinMan (May 7, 2021)

EoS Blackbeard
Primebeard
Current Blackbeard
Oldbeard/Kaido
Shanks
Big Mom
Luffy
Heartbeard

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## trance (May 7, 2021)

3 fruit teach
primebeard
oldbeard
kaido
shanks
2 fruit teach
snail shit
big meme

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## Van Basten (May 7, 2021)

*Pre-Timeskip (Year of Luffy’s Voyage)*
1. WB
2. Shanks
3. Kaido
4. Big Mom

*During the Timeskip*
1. Shanks
2. Kaido
3. Big Mom
4. Blackbeard

*Post-Timeskip*
1. Blackbeard/Shanks
2. Blackbeard/Shanks
3. Kaido
4. Big Mom

BB’s present strength is just a matter of if he’s at EOS level already or still has another power up to get. EOS BB will probably surpass the prime legends.

Reactions: Like 4 | Agree 2 | Winner 4


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## Gorilla Cook (May 7, 2021)

*Pre-Timeskip*
Primebeard
Kaido
Big Mom
Oldbeard/Shanks
Sickbeard

*Post-Timeskip*
Kaido
Big Mom
Shanks
Blackbeard

This is the only thing that makes sense to me. No way in hell Shanks is the strongest Yonko.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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## Kylo Ren (May 7, 2021)

Primebeard
Kaido/Oldbeard
Shanks
BM
BB/Luffy after Wano
Sickbeard(the one we saw in MF arc)


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## Perrin (May 7, 2021)

Blackbeard
Primebeard
Shanks

Kaido/Luffy
Big Mom
MF Whitebeard

Reactions: Optimistic 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Duhul10 (May 7, 2021)

Primebeard
Kaido
Shanks/BM
BB ( for now )
MF Wb

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Perrin (May 7, 2021)

TheMoffinMan said:


> EoS Blackbeard
> Primebeard
> Current Blackbeard
> Oldbeard/Kaido
> ...


How long till EoS Blackbeard? 2 weeks? 6weeks?


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## charles101 (May 7, 2021)

Perrin said:


> How long till EoS Blackbeard? 2 weeks? 6weeks?



Doesn't matter. Luffy went from questionable extreme diff win over Katakuri to fighting 1 on 1 with Kaido in like 3 weeks or so. Post-TS Blackbeard has no feats other than causing earthquakes subconsciously.

So yeah, he can jump next week even, but placing him at the first spot based only on his MF performance (where he fled from Shanks and Akainu) is too much imo

Reactions: Informative 1


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## The crazy hacker (May 7, 2021)

Primebeard

Old WB
Shanks/Kaido
Blackbeard
Big Mom

Luffy

Reactions: Like 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## convict (May 7, 2021)

1. Primebeard
2. Kaido
3. Oldbeard
4. Shanks
5. Big Mom
6. Teach
7. Luffy

Reactions: Like 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## TheMoffinMan (May 7, 2021)

Perrin said:


> How long till EoS Blackbeard? 2 weeks? 6weeks?


However long it takes for him to beat Shanks


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## Tsukuyomi (May 7, 2021)

Primebeard/Current Blackbeard(Theorized).
Shanks/Old Beard.
Kaido.
Big Mom.
Luffy.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 3


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## TheRealSJ (May 7, 2021)

- Prime Whitebeard

- Current Teach/Old Whitebeard
(very small gap)
- Kaido
(very small gap)
- Current Shanks (for now, he will later on go become stronger)
(small gap)
- MF Whitebeard
(small gap)
- Big Mom
(small-medium gap)
- Current Luffy

Reactions: Like 1 | Tier Specialist 1 | Dislike 1


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## YonkoDrippy (May 7, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> - Prime Whitebeard
> 
> - Current Teach/Old Whitebeard
> (very small gap)
> ...


This

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## VileNotice (May 7, 2021)

Kaido being multiple places above Big Mom in half these lists..

Reactions: Agree 3 | Winner 3


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## TheRealSJ (May 7, 2021)

VileNotice said:


> Kaido being multiple places above Big Mom in half these lists..


I mean base kaido was fighting equally with big mom. 
However her some of her L's are embarrassing and she's been manhandled by people much weaker multiple times.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 2 | Disagree 1 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Magentabeard (May 7, 2021)

Primebeard>BB>=Shanks>BM>=Kaido>Old WB > Luffy

Reactions: Funny 1


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## charles101 (May 7, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> I mean base kaido was fighting equally with big mom.
> However her some of her L's are embarrassing and she's been manhandled by people much weaker multiple times.



He was in base when they clashed. Rest was offpaneled. And Mama didn't have neither Prometheus nor Zeus, that's for sure.

Reactions: Like 1


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## LightningForce (May 7, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> I mean base kaido was fighting equally with big mom.
> However her some of her L's are embarrassing and she's been manhandled by people much weaker multiple times.


Off-paneled, Kaido was actively going for the kill. And BM matched Hybrid Kaido’s strength. And she didn’t have her main homies either.


My list:
1. Primebeard
2. Kaido/BM (equal, neither can kill the other)
3. Shanks
4. Current BB
5. Old WB

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1


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## Ruse (May 7, 2021)

Primebeard
Kaido/Shanks 
Big Mom 
Blackbeard 
Old WB
Luffy

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## Perrin (May 7, 2021)

I assume people who have Blackbeard so far down expect him to get another fruit, I put him above Primebeard as I feel he has to be that high to fight Luffy to demonstrate Luffy surpassing the old generation, I don’t like the third fruit theory, and I don’t see him and Luffy clashing to be very far away and I don’t see him having battles at the same time to level up like Luffy will do. So if he’s doing not a a lot between now and final battle which could be a few weeks away then I reckon he’s already there. He already equalled MF Whitebeards power with Gura Gura in MF.
If he fights Shanks or Marines and levels up or gets a third fruit then I agree that he could be behind Primebeard at present.


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## LightningForce (May 7, 2021)

VileNotice said:


> Kaido being multiple places above Big Mom in half these lists..


I swear Oda basically spoon feeds that Kaido = BM and OLers will still put her as the weakest Emperor.

He could have her shove Napoleon up Kaido’s ass while he is begging for mercy and they will still say she is the weakest.

Meanwhile Shanks the second to youngest Emperor and whose strength the Ace light novels set as the _benchmark_ to become an Emperor, is somehow deemed equal to or stronger than Kaido.

Reactions: Agree 3 | Funny 2 | Winner 3


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## Nikseng (May 7, 2021)

1) Prime Whitebeard
2) Kaido/Old healthy Whitebeard
3) Big Mom
4) Shanks/Current Blackbeard
5) Old sick Whitebeard
6) Luffy

Reactions: Like 2


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## TheRealSJ (May 7, 2021)

LightningForce said:


> Off-paneled, Kaido was actively going for the kill. And BM matched Hybrid Kaido’s strength. And she didn’t have her main homies either.
> 
> 
> My list:
> ...


Old Whitebeard was very much still the WSM. Its been said many times.
MF Whitebeard is the debatable one.


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## TheWiggian (May 7, 2021)

0. Primebeard
1. Oldbeard/Shanks
2. Shanks/Oldbeard
3. Blackbeard
4. Big Mom
5. Kaidou

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 2 | Funny 2 | Winner 1 | Useful 1 | GODA 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Datassassin (May 7, 2021)

-Prime WB/Peak BB
A large gap
-Old WB
-Shanks
-Kaido
-Maybe current BB
-Big Mom
-Current Luffy

Reactions: Agree 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## JustSumGuy (May 7, 2021)

Prime Whitebeard 

Shanks 
Kaido/Big Mom (the longer I think about it, the more I think Oda has set them up as equals

Old Whitebeard 
Current Blackbeard (will eventually be the strongest one on this list) 

Luffy

Reactions: Neutral 1


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## Strobacaxi (May 7, 2021)

YonkoDrippy said:


> Primebeard
> Big Mom
> Shanks
> Blackbeard
> ...


Eos Luffy
EoS BB

Primebeard

Shanks
Old WB (That's right Shanks as strongest Yonko since pre TS)
Current BB
Kaido
BM

MF WB
End of Wano Luffy

Current Luffy

Reactions: Like 1 | Useful 1 | Disagree 1 | Optimistic 1


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## YonkoDrippy (May 7, 2021)

Strobacaxi said:


> Eos Luffy
> EoS BB
> 
> Primebeard
> ...


Shanks isn’t stronger than Old WB or Kaido. But otherwise I agree


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## GreenEggsAHam (May 7, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> weaker


yeah like base kaido to hybrid is a massive difference  
Big mom didn't even use prometheus and zeus also

Sengoku says they have a rivarly
they have a equal clash with no upperhand there equals 

Blackbeard>Kaido=Bigmom>Mihawk=Shanks

Reactions: Neutral 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Mihawk (May 7, 2021)

Yall fuckin sleepin on Shanks

Reactions: Agree 4 | Winner 1 | Optimistic 1


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## Klarionan (May 7, 2021)

VileNotice said:


> Kaido being multiple places above Big Mom in half these lists..


Many people on this forum are a good bit below the average intelligence level.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Creative 1 | Tier Specialist 1 | Dislike 1


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## Empathy (May 7, 2021)

Primebeard
EoS Teach
Old WB
Kaidou
Shanks
Big Mom
Current BB
Current Luffy (average admiral-level)​
Given the damage that lesser swordsman and Haki users like Oden, Zoro, and Luffy have all inflicted on Kaidou, it wouldn’t surprise me at all if Shanks ends up stronger than him. Kaidou’s hype just seems better than Shanks’ at the moment, because of his title (though Shanks has more relevance to the MC) and we really don’t know a whole lot about Shanks yet.

If Shanks’ purpose really is to just get killed by BB, then it’s not like he needs to be the strongest Yonkou before Teach ascends to do that. Given what we saw of Burgess on Dressrossa, and the fact that his bounty is still the lowest and he’s the newest Yonkou when others have been there for years and probably decades—I’d expect Teach and his crew’s power to still be ascending, but he’ll probably be the strongest once he reaches his peak. Old WB is unambiguously still called the strongest pirate outright during the Part I generation, and making a distinction between MF Whitebeard and the one that clashed with Shanks seems nit-picky.

Dropping Akainu is still a better feat than anything Kaidou or Big Mom have ever done ten years later. Kaidou is only regarded as the strongest after Whitebeard died. Marco beating up on Kaidou’s two strongest crew-mates by himself seems to reaffirm that the Whitebeard Pirates were the strongest pirate crew in the world all the way until WB died, and the Beast Pirates would’ve been crushed if they had tried to fight the WB Pirates, despite what revisionists will try to tell you.

Reactions: Winner 2 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Dunno (May 8, 2021)

Primebeard
Oldbeard/Shanks/Blackbeard
Kaido
Big Mom
Luffy

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## Eustathios (May 8, 2021)

Prime Whitebeard
Old Whitebeard 
Kaido (?)
Shanks
Big Mom
Blackbeard (?)

Almost certain Blackbeard is at least on par with Shanks now, we just haven't seen him yet. Also Kaido may fall from that spot after Wano.

Reactions: Like 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Duhul10 (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> Old Whitebeard was very much still the WSM. Its been said many times.
> MF Whitebeard is the debatable one.


not debatable at all.


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## Mihawk (May 8, 2021)

Maybe it's just me and I have reading comprehension issues, but I struggle to comprehend how Shanks can be deemed by some to be "the weakest Yonko" or close to it when he's:

-Served as Luffy's benchmark, childhood hero, idol, role model;
-Haoshoku Haki on a different level, and appeared in Chapter 1 while being untouchable since;
-Acted as a rival to both the WSS and the WSM, having clashed with them equally;
-Never showed his powers/abilities and has still been relevant for over 1000 chapters;
-Kept Roger's Straw Hat as his heir/successor of sorts before passing it to Luffy who still won't meet him until at least after Kaido/BM;
-Stopped the entire Marineford War after being the only one sans Whitebeard to stop Akainu, was shown respect by Sengoku, Gorosei etc;

(^see what I did there)? 

Don't forget he also captains the most impregnable/well-rounded crew and is implied to wield one of the strongest Conqueror's Haki of all time. He also climbed to Yonko status just 6 years ago and already exerts the same amount of influence and a similar bounty in spite of not being overtly malicious like the others. Shanks' rise to power from nowhere is still a huge mystery, and he was able to keep Kaido from going after Whitebeard in the War. He also serves as the current narrative and evolutionary link between Luffy and Roger, as well as the closest thing this era has, to an approximation of Rayleigh in his prime. With the exception of Blackbeard, Shanks is pretty much your poster boy pirate for the series too, and has set into motion a great deal of many things relevant to the plot. His importance cannot be overstated.

Is he being dismissed here simply due to a lack of more substantial feats, even though his hype is already legendary? Kaido is set to fall this arc, while Big Mom has had a good chunk of her backstory fleshed out. If there's anyone who is the closest to One Piece since the death of the WSM, it should be him. Until Teach surpasses him (if he does at all) en route to Raftel (but we still have a ways to go until then), it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Shanks was currently the strongest Yonko of them all. In fact, I'm all but certain that he is.

Ya'll definitely sleeping on the King

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 4 | Winner 2


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## Corax (May 8, 2021)

0. Primebeard/Prime Blackbeard
1. Oldbeard/Shanks
2. Shanks/Oldbeard
3. Blackbeard (current)
4. Kaidou
5. Big Mom

Reactions: Funny 1 | Neutral 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Perrin (May 8, 2021)

Corax said:


> 0. Primebeard/Prime Blackbeard
> 1. Oldbeard/Shanks
> 2. Shanks/Oldbeard
> 3. Blackbeard (current)
> ...


Prime Blackbeard only at Prime WB level, despite two OP fruits?

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## TheRealSJ (May 8, 2021)

Prime Blackbeard and Prime Luffy will surpass the old gen god tiers, i thought this was obvious

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 2


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## CaptainCommander (May 8, 2021)

EOS Luffy
EOS BlackBeard
Primebeard
Kaido
Shanks
Big Mom
Old Beard
Current Blackbeard
Current Luffy
MF Whitebeard.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## LightningForce (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> Old Whitebeard was very much still the WSM. Its been said many times.
> MF Whitebeard is the debatable one.


I don’t see a difference. Old WB -> MF WB when he fights. His sickness isn’t something that suddenly appeared in MF, it was already present throughout his later years. In fact it is silly to differentiate between the two.

If Old WB began fresh then he would decline much quicker than the other Emperors in a battle. Battles pitting Emperor to Emperor take at least a few days, and he does not have the same stamina to keep up with the rest of them.



Mihawk said:


> Maybe it's just me and I have reading comprehension issues, but I struggle to comprehend how Shanks can be deemed by some to be "the weakest Yonko" or close to it when he's:
> 
> -Served as Luffy's benchmark, childhood hero, idol, role model;
> -Haoshoku Haki on a different level, and appeared in Chapter 1 while being untouchable since;
> ...



You basically posted 99% speculation and hype. There’s nothing indicating he has one of the strongest HHs ever either, this is baseless. I don’t even know how you quantify that, even WB’s HH isn’t implied to be greater than the other Rocks crew.

Remember when people used to put Kaido way above BM after his WSC moniker and grand introduction and because of “powercreep” lmao. Then he shat his pants when BM came to Wano, couldn’t kill her with intent, turns out he was her “little brother” all along.



Kaido and Shanks both belong in the same generation, Kaido alone was highlighted to have become Emperor through his strength so he has the greater portrayal over Shanks who’s the nakama type. All Emperors have been in deadlock for a long time, for a good reason. I think you are setting yourself up for some real disappointment when Shanks shows how he performs relative to other Emperors.

Also dunno what you’re saying, nobody is claiming Shanks is the weakest. Everybody is saying either that’s BM (debunked by manga) or BB (most likely) or old WB (also plausible).

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## GreenEggsAHam (May 8, 2021)

Mihawk said:


> on


lol you talking about shanks who can only fight equally with the new admirals and clashed equally with whitebeard?
if this just doesn't prove the admirals are on a whole diff level then everyone currently in the opverse then ion know what is

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Blanco (May 8, 2021)

Prime WB
Old WSM WB
Kaido
Teach ~ Shanks
Big Mom
Luffy

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## deltaniner (May 8, 2021)

1. EoS Luffy
2. EoS Blackbeard
3. Primebeard
4. Old Whitebeard
5. Kaido/Shanks
6. Kaido/Shanks
7. MF Whitebeard
8. Big Mom/Current Blackbeard
9. Big Mom/Current Blackbeard
10. Current Luffy

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## TheRealSJ (May 8, 2021)

LightningForce said:


> I don’t see a difference. Old WB -> MF WB when he fights. His sickness isn’t something that suddenly appeared in MF, it was already present throughout his later years. In fact it is silly to differentiate between the two.
> 
> If Old WB began fresh then he would decline much quicker than the other Emperors in a battle. Battles pitting Emperor to Emperor take at least a few days, and he does not have the same stamina to keep up with the rest of them.
> 
> ...


Old whitebeard was the whitebeard that sensed and fodderised ace in his sleep which shows his prominent use of observation haki.



Old whitebeard was the healthy  whitebeard on his meds  who clashed with Shanks and split the sky (possibly using advanced conquerors).




MF WB had constant heart attacks and demonstrated very limited armament haki and lacked observation and conquerors haki. There's quite a big difference.


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## GreenEggsAHam (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> prominent


nice, its the same whitebeard that reacted to kizaru whos faster then any yonko


TheRealSJ said:


> Shanks


WB could use COC but akainu magma in his chest affected his use.


TheRealSJ said:


> demonstrated


idiotic response, Show me where he had constant heart attack I'll wait, show me where he lack armaeant haki I'll wait, show me where he lacked observation I'll wait.

Oda called him stronger then kaido for a reason.

Oda>.TheRealSj headcannon

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Perrin (May 8, 2021)

Assuming the heart is the eighth and final haki gate I think we can assume WB has difficulty moulding Haki during his heart attacks.


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## Mythical Conqueror (May 8, 2021)

Kaido=>Big Mom
Shanks
Blackbeard

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Duhul10 (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> Old whitebeard was the whitebeard that sensed and fodderised ace in his sleep which shows his prominent use of observation haki.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


He had observation haki, but him having advanced haki is still a no, he never showed it. Also his clash with shanks was inferior to Kaido and BM's. Sickbeard is MF wb + some time beforehand.


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## TheRealSJ (May 8, 2021)

GreenEggsAHam said:


> nice, its the same whitebeard that reacted to kizaru whos faster then any yonko
> 
> WB could use COC but akainu magma in his chest affected his use.
> 
> ...


Your statements aren't coherent I don't understand what you're trying to say. You're quoting individual word's I've said and responding to them which doesn't make any sense...

Whitebeard tried to use CoC when ace was about to get executed but his sickness prevented him, as stated on the wiki. A magma fist has nothing to do with it and is YOUR headcanon.



Kizaru's travel speed means nothing when his combat speed shows he can  get tagged by marco and intercepted old Rayleigh.








As for claiming whitebeard didn't have heart attacks, then.....



Just reread marineford.

Reactions: Like 1


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## GreenEggsAHam (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> Whitebeard tried to use CoC when ace was about to get executed but his sickness prevented him, as stated on the wiki. A magma fist has nothing to do with it and is YOUR headcanon.


you're trying to use the wiki as a argument? Whitebeard couldn't use COC because you can literally see him grabbing his chest with a magma fist in it. this is just stupidity.


TheRealSJ said:


> when


Kizaru is up in the air hes not turning into light. nice try to pervert that statement.
chapter 570 bud


TheRealSJ said:


> As for claiming whitebeard didn't have heart attacks, then.....
> 
> 
> 
> Just reread marineford.


Still waiting on them scans where whitebeard had multiple heart attacks all I've seen is one, no wonder you're telling me to re-read the manga because you tried to use headcannon, but guess what go re-read marineford and oda calling WB the strongest pirate every volume


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## TheRealSJ (May 8, 2021)

Duhul10 said:


> He had observation haki, but him having advanced haki is still a no, he never showed it. Also his clash with shanks was inferior to Kaido and BM's. Sickbeard is MF wb + some time beforehand.


He showed advanced haki here.



Old healthy Rayleigh who hadn't touched a sword in years was still able to effortlessly use advanced haki so why claim an Old Healthy whitebeard couldn't? I thought people knew it was his sickness which limited his haki.


Also  what's with the claim that kaido and big mom clash was superior? They look exactly the same to me.


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## Mihawk (May 8, 2021)

LightningForce said:


> Remember when people used to put Kaido way above BM after his WSC moniker and grand introduction and because of “powercreep” lmao. Then he shat his pants when BM came to Wano, couldn’t kill her with intent, turns out he was her “little brother” all along.


Too bad I can't rmb, because I wasn't one of those people. Powercreep was never a part of the reasoning in my post.

I'm not sure what type of argument you're trying to make. I mean, who do you think is the weakest Yonko? For me I'd go with BM or BB.


LightningForce said:


> Kaido and Shanks both belong in the same generation, Kaido alone was highlighted to have become Emperor through his strength so he has the *greater portrayal over Shanks who’s the nakama type. *


So you basically dismiss my post as 99% speculation/hype and baseless, even though everything I literally said was anchored on facts surrounding everything we know about Shanks, and actually supported by the manga and the author...like actual portrayal; and then you go on to rationalise who you think has superior portrayal, based on your own speculation 

I mean, all this stuff about Kaido shitting himself when BM came and him being the "little brother" is selective at best so I'm not even going to bother. I could easily say that Big Mom referred to him as an unbeatable "thing" or that Kaido called her an "invalid" etc. or that Luffy went straight at Kaido and ignored BM, but wtv. Also, the fact that Shanks literally stopped Kaido from trying to go at WB while the latter was preoccupied with MF, and he still managed to arrive and stop the war the next day, gets easily forgotten.

But hey, I guess we're all speculating. You wanna talk about portrayal, that's cool...but I already said my piece.


LightningForce said:


> All Emperors have been in deadlock for a long time, for a good reason. I think you are setting yourself up for some real disappointment when Shanks shows how he performs relative to other Emperors.


Yeah because they're about equal in strength, plus they have crews/territories to manage and can't afford to weaken their position.

I don't I think I'll be disappointed much, if at all. Chances are, Shanks is gonna be exactly where I expect him to be at: around equal in strength to the Yonko, but marginally better due to better portrayal and importance.


LightningForce said:


> Also dunno what you’re saying, nobody is claiming Shanks is the weakest. Everybody is saying either that’s BM (debunked by manga) or BB (most likely) or old WB (also plausible).



Anything is plausible, but I highly doubt it would be Shanks

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## GreenEggsAHam (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> .


Why are you trying to use post timeskip? Haki wasn't fully establish in pre-ts 
And WB used Advanced coA when he deflected akainu magam fist


TheRealSJ said:


> Old healthy Rayleigh who hadn't touched a sword in years was still able to effortlessly use advanced haki so why claim an Old Healthy whitebeard couldn't? I thought people knew it was his sickness which limited his haki


His sickness has nothing to do with his haki it was due to his health.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## GreenEggsAHam (May 8, 2021)

Mihawk said:


> I don't I think I'll be disappointed much, if at all. Chances are, Shanks is gonna be exactly where I expect him to be at: around equal in strength to the Yonko, but marginally better due to better portrayal and importance.


Kid and killer met shanks and still listed kaido as stronger then him,  there is no place where shanks is the strongest, big mom is stronger then him since shes equal to someone stronger then shanks


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## Mihawk (May 8, 2021)

GreenEggsAHam said:


> Kid and killer met shanks and still listed kaido as stronger then him,  there is no place where shanks is the strongest, big mom is stronger then him since shes equal to someone stronger then shanks



The Admirals aren't the strongest, that is all.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Eustathios (May 8, 2021)

I'm pretty sure Luffy and Blackbeard will only surpass Whitebeard and Roger by a slight margin, unless Im is a monster of another calibre entirely. The Admirals are set to still be relevant by EoS powerwise, with Akainu as one of the final villains. So it wouldn't make sense for Luffy to be massively above the legends.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## GreenEggsAHam (May 8, 2021)

Mihawk said:


> The Admirals aren't the strongest, that is all.


yes I know you want shanks to be strongest to wank mihawk but that's not how it works, hes clearly not the strongest but seems like he would be the weakest. Kid and killer call openly admits kaido>shanks
and we know big mom went equal to kaido for 12 hours straight, this should mean kaido=>Big mom or kaido=big mom
meaning Kaido,Mom>Shanks. and we know shanks will lose to BB

Yes the admiras individually clapped someone stronger then shanks and mihawk. they're the final villains along with the gorosei.
Kizaur wanted to solo 2 people stronger then shanks&mihawk.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Mihawk (May 8, 2021)

GreenEggsAHam said:


> yes I know you want shanks to be strongest to wank mihawk


not really, i view them as separate characters unlike you and the admirals.


GreenEggsAHam said:


> but that's not how it works, hes clearly not the strongest but seems like he would be the weakest.


Yeah if you dismissed portrayal and the entire storyline of the series for your own fanon.


GreenEggsAHam said:


> Kid and killer call openly admits kaido>shanks


Where? All I remember is Shanks taking away Kidd's arm while Kaido failed to do so.

Or is this going to devolve into an argument on Kaido's title? 


GreenEggsAHam said:


> and we know big mom went equal to kaido for 12 hours straight, this should mean kaido=>Big mom or kaido=big mom


sure


GreenEggsAHam said:


> meaning Kaido,Mom>Shanks.


nope


GreenEggsAHam said:


> and we know shanks will lose to BB


I agreed that BB would surpass him.



GreenEggsAHam said:


> Yes the admiras individually clapped someone stronger then shanks and mihawk. they're the final villains along with the gorosei.
> Kizaur wanted to solo 2 people stronger then shanks&mihawk.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## TheRealSJ (May 8, 2021)

GreenEggsAHam said:


> you're trying to use the wiki as a argument? Whitebeard couldn't use COC because you can literally see him grabbing his chest with a magma fist in it. this is just stupidity.
> 
> Kizaru is up in the air hes not turning into light. nice try to pervert that statement.
> chapter 570 bud
> ...


So what your trying to say is:
1. You don't have any scans where kizaru has shown to be able to blitz or outspeed a top tier but your still trying to argue with me when you have posted 0 evidence to support your claims.

2. He was able to destroy Blackbeard with 2 holes in his chest but it was the injury limiting him from using haki even though he clearly coughs and clutches his chest.





Above are symptoms of a heart attack. (To make if easy for you).


Since you are adamant that you claim not to have seen whitebeard have heart attacks ill enlighten you.

Heart attack no 1.


Heart attack no 2.



Marco and crocodile even said his health had significantly deteriorated yet you are still in denial.


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## TheRealSJ (May 8, 2021)

GreenEggsAHam said:


> Why are you trying to use post timeskip? Haki wasn't fully establish in pre-ts
> And WB used Advanced coA when he deflected akainu magam fist
> 
> His sickness has nothing to do with his haki it was due to his health.


What are you even saying...
His sickness is the reason for his bad health....
Oda even said old age does not effect fighters too much.

You still haven't posted a single scan supporting your claims so I'm convinced now you are under a sort of delusion


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## Duhul10 (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> He showed advanced haki here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Old Wb has never showed it. No feats in an entire war + multiple scenes before it. Also aside from that, there are also no signs or feats for CoCoA in his old days, MF being a clear example.

Also, WB vs Shanks made a split a couple of times the size of the ship. BM vs Kaido made one multiple times *an Island.*


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## TheRealSJ (May 8, 2021)

Duhul10 said:


> Old Wb has never showed it. No feats in an entire war + multiple scenes before it. Also aside from that, there are also no signs or feats for CoCoA in his old days, MF being a clear example.
> 
> Also, WB vs Shanks made a split a couple of times the size of the ship. BM vs Kaido made one multiple times *an Island.*


There is still no indication their clash was more powerful than that of the WSM and shanks. Not from the fodders reactions or anything. In fact jozu stated they didnt split the sky but split "the heavens", which implies the feat was something much greater.
It may only appear to be "bigger" because of the the closer angle and the artstyle, which makes sense as the events are 500 chapters apart.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Duhul10 (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> There is still no indication their clash was more powerful than that of the WSM and shanks. Not from the fodders reactions or anything. In fact jozu stated they didnt split the sky but split "the heavens", which implies the feat was something much greater.
> It may only appear to be "bigger" because of the the closer angle and the artstyle, which makes sense as the events are 500 chapters apart.


It's one of those instances when size does matter

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## TheRealSJ (May 8, 2021)

Duhul10 said:


> It's one of those instances when size does matter


if thats true then what you are trying to say is kaido + big mom >>>>>> whitebeard + shanks, which is false and unrealistic.
Think about it.


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## GreenEggsAHam (May 8, 2021)

Mihawk said:


> not really, i view them as separate characters unlike you and the admirals.


you got me 


Mihawk said:


> of


whats? his portrayal is luffy becoming a great pirate and returning his hat nothing strength related. this would only prove Admirals>Shanks since shanks is the last yonko, and admirals are the final villains.


Mihawk said:


> Where? All I remember is Shanks taking away Kidd's arm while Kaido failed to do so.
> 
> Or is this going to devolve into an argument on Kaido's title?


HOW DID YOU KNOW?!?!??!?!?!/!


TheRealSJ said:


> 1. You don't have any scans where kizaru has shown to be able to blitz or outspeed a top tier but your still trying to argue with me when you have posted 0 evidence to support your claims.


Kizaru vivre card says you need great COO for him this is supported by the manga as drake couldn't view him. 


TheRealSJ said:


> 2. He was able to destroy Blackbeard with 2 holes in his chest but it was the injury limiting him from using haki even though he clearly coughs and clutches his chest.


? ok headcannon that his haki was limited. 


TheRealSJ said:


> you


I have no claim but the manga clearly shows us him coughing blood and holding on to the magma chest.


TheRealSJ said:


> you


He has a heart attack once in the fight you can see him on the ground, the second time is he on the ground? this is him trying to use COC but fails due to a magma fist support a scan I'll wait I see him grabbing onto his blasted fist. Heart attacks don't make you cough blood btw thats just the accumulating of damage.


TheRealSJ said:


> What are you even saying...
> His sickness is the reason for his bad health....
> Oda even said old age does not effect fighters too much.
> 
> You still haven't posted a single scan supporting your claims so I'm convinced now you are under a sort of delusion


There isn't no difference oda calls him the strongestpirate
I'll wait for a claim that doesn't involve headcannon,Oda>SJ headcannon like always.


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## TheRealSJ (May 8, 2021)

GreenEggsAHam said:


> you got me
> 
> whats? his portrayal is luffy becoming a great pirate and returning his hat nothing strength related. this would only prove Admirals>Shanks since shanks is the last yonko, and admirals are the final villains.
> 
> ...


Im not going to reply to you anymore as im wasting my time and i have things to do. Your arguements dont even make sense.
"top tiers dont have good observation haki." and "whitebeards haki wasnt limited" even when it was stated by marco in front of your eyes.


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## Duhul10 (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> if thats true then what you are trying to say is *kaido + big mom >>>>>> whitebeard + shanks*, which is false and unrealistic.
> Think about it.


I wouldn't translate it into that, I'd just consider it as more impressive.


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## TheRealSJ (May 8, 2021)

Duhul10 said:


> I wouldn't translate it into that, I'd just consider it as more impressive.


You did say that big mom and kaidos clash was "multiple times the size of the island" and shanks and whitebeards clash was "a couple times the size of the ship", which implies that one is significantly better than the other whilst i wrote it off as art style and angle.
Since it appears you are very passionate about Kaido its gonna take a while if we continue so lets just agree to disagree.


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## Bobybobster (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> You did say that big mom and kaidos clash was "multiple times the size of the island" and shanks and whitebeards clash was "a couple times the size of the ship", which implies that one is significantly better than the other whilst i wrote it off as art style and angle.
> Since it appears you are very passionate about Kaido its gonna take a while if we continue so lets just agree to disagree.


oh he's more than just a little passionate, you can't even make a joke about kaido without him getting triggered

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Duhul10 (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> You did say that big mom and kaidos clash was "multiple times the size of the island" and shanks and whitebeards clash was "a couple times the size of the ship", which implies that one is significantly better than the other whilst i wrote it off as art style and angle.
> Since it appears you are very passionate about Kaido its gonna take a while if we continue so lets just agree to disagree.


Yes, it was more impressive by a good margin. This could mean many things : haki superiority, Shanks and WB being less serious, the difference being an inaccuracy and so on. There are many ways to see a reason for one's superiority over the other, but all in all, one instance looked more impressive than the other and it's got nothing to do with passion, same I could say you are passionate about WB, but it does not really matter to me or the discussion. I'll agree to disagree with you because you seem educated and polite and I like that.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Duhul10 (May 8, 2021)

Bobybobster said:


> oh he's more than just a little passionate, you can't even make a joke about kaido without him getting triggered


LoL, it would be good if those were actually jokes, but you people believe them


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## Bobybobster (May 8, 2021)

Duhul10 said:


> LoL, it would be good if those were actually jokes, but you people believe them


yh, we are always serious. Kaido's honor must be defended.


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## Bobybobster (May 8, 2021)

Primebeard

---

oldbeard (confirmed WSM)
shanks (good potential)
big mom (actually impressive when she's not a meme, stalemated the dude below whilst nerfed)
kaido (rumored strength, runs away vs top tiers, uses hostages to win etc.)
BB
current luffy

Reactions: Funny 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Blanco (May 8, 2021)

wb obv suffers from power creep. outdated haki system. ofc post ts yonkos look more impressive.

but oda gave some of that wb mystique to kaido as well. wsc 1v1 bet on kaido. its not a stretch kaido could be stronger than old wb in odas mind


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## Duhul10 (May 8, 2021)

Bobybobster said:


> Primebeard
> 
> ---
> 
> ...


this is what I've been saying, you guys are funny even though you're serious


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## Bobybobster (May 8, 2021)

Duhul10 said:


> this is what I've been saying, you guys are funny even though you're serious


Something in there triggering you?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Duhul10 (May 8, 2021)

Bobybobster said:


> Something in there triggering you?


no, just making me laugh at you

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## A Optimistic (May 8, 2021)

Primebeard
Kaido
Shanks
Blackbeard
Luffy
Big Mom

Reactions: Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Gotenks92 (May 8, 2021)

Kaido 
Shanks/Big mom 
Current Blackbeard


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## deltaniner (May 8, 2021)

Imo, Shanks is at absolute worse stronger than Big Mom. The only portrayal you can give him that's "Negative" is Mihawk not fighting him anymore and being able to contend with him in the past, and that's more positive portrayal for Mihawk than it is negative portrayal for Shanks.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 3


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## Strobacaxi (May 8, 2021)

GreenEggsAHam said:


> His sickness has nothing to do with his haki it was due to his health.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Jo Ndule (May 8, 2021)

EoS Teach
Kaido ~ WB >= Linlin
Shanks >~ Teach
Sickbeard > Luffy


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## trance (May 8, 2021)

A Optimistic said:


> Luffy
> Big Mom



be careful ava  

this won't sit well with the Linlin Legion

Reactions: Funny 1


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## LightningForce (May 8, 2021)

TheRealSJ said:


> Old whitebeard was the whitebeard that sensed and fodderised ace in his sleep which shows his prominent use of observation haki.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



“Healthy” old WB on meds.



This “healthy” WB who faced Shanks was on fucking *IV drip*. Completey opposite definition of healthy. He was already at death’s door. MF WB is the result of what would happen if that same WB were to exert more effort over some period of time. So this Old WB-MF WB comparison is like comparing a 100% Luffy to 50% Luffy. Same with the WB who smacked Ace like a fly, WB didn’t need any real effort to throw him out.

Completely fallacious distinction you have made, along with OP of this thread (unless he really wanted to compare an old WB who already exerted stamina and effort).

Old WB can’t hang with his Emperor peers who have no such ailments and possess monstrous stamina.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## MYJC (May 8, 2021)

Prime Whitebeard
Kaido
Big Mom
Old/Sick Whitebeard
Shanks
Blackbeard/Luffy

Until Shanks actually does something I refuse to put him any higher.

Reactions: Like 3 | Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## LightningForce (May 8, 2021)

Mihawk said:


> Too bad I can't rmb, because I wasn't one of those people. Powercreep was never a part of the reasoning in my post.
> 
> I'm not sure what type of argument you're trying to make. I mean, who do you think is the weakest Yonko? For me I'd go with BM or BB.
> 
> ...


BM never called Kaido “unbeatable.” She said specifically _*Luffy*_ would never be able to beat him.

“Invalid?” I have no idea when he said this, if you’re talking about the Rooftop then that was because BM underestimated the SNs, they ganged up on her 4v1, and they specifically took away her ability to fly.

We saw BM when she was fully serious against her opponent. Kaido couldn’t kill her despite going on for days.

This superior “portrayal” you mentioned is not indicative of strength, only plot importance in connection to Luffy. We have no idea how Shanks intercepted Kaido before MF. Perhaps Kaido went alone (very likely considering his solo intro) while Shanks brought his entire crew with him. Who knows.

Ace light novels specifically state that to become an emperor, you need to be as least as strong as Shanks. Meaning he was the benchmark at the time.

Could Shanks be stronger even marginally by the end? Sure. But right now there’s no evidence of that and we need more feats from him, especially against fellow Emperors, to showcase this.

Reactions: Agree 4 | Winner 1


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## deltaniner (May 8, 2021)

LightningForce said:


> Ace light novels specifically state that to become an emperor, you need to be as least as strong as Shanks. Meaning he was the benchmark at the time.


Because he was the newest Emperor, not the weakest.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 1


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## Mythical Conqueror (May 8, 2021)

Yonko>shitbeard>admirals

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1 | Disagree 2 | Dislike 2


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## GreenEggsAHam (May 8, 2021)

Strobacaxi said:


>


his health was deterring due to his age and not being healthy.  It wouldn't matter as Oda called him the strongest pirate


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## Mythical Conqueror (May 8, 2021)

Wb couldn't react and dodge to Squard
Non nerfed hybrid Kaido demolishes Wb with Raimei Hakkei


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## GreenEggsAHam (May 8, 2021)

Mythical Conqueror said:


> Wb couldn't react and dodge to Squard
> Non nerfed hybrid Kaido demolishes Wb with Raimei Hakkei


Wb could react to kizaru whos faster then Laido

Nerfed MF WB is above Kaido easily. admirals>yonkos

Reactions: Funny 3 | Winner 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Mythical Conqueror (May 8, 2021)

GreenEggsAHam said:


> Wb could react to kizaru whos faster then Laido
> 
> Nerfed MF WB is above Kaido easily. admirals>yonkos


Yeah right, he couldn't dodge Squard and the fodders hurt him easily and he suffered a heart attack in the middle of the battle, Kaido destroys Wb


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## Maruo (May 9, 2021)

Primebeard
Sickbeard/Kaido
Big Mom
Shanks
Blackbeard (for now)
<small gap>
Luffy (Admiral level)


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## Canute87 (May 9, 2021)

charles101 said:


> He was in base when they clashed. Rest was offpaneled. And Mama didn't have neither Prometheus nor Zeus, that's for sure.


honestly.

What was promethus and zeus going to do to kaido?


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## charles101 (May 9, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> honestly.
> 
> What was promethus and zeus going to do to kaido?


Well, they give Mama flight, boost some of her sword moves and make for annoyment that Kaido has no way to deal with.


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## CaptainCommander (May 9, 2021)

deltaniner said:


> Because he was the newest Emperor, not the weakest.


Probably both. Shanks became Yonko at 33 giving him 5 years to grow stronger. Big Mom can only get weaker at her age.

Reactions: Neutral 2


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## RossellaFiamingo (May 9, 2021)

I wish I had more tier specialists to hand out.

Linlin~Roger~WB~Kaido>Shanks>Teach

Reactions: Like 3 | Informative 1 | Tier Specialist 3 | Dislike 1


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## Shanks (May 10, 2021)

EOS BB
Primebeard
Shanks
Old beard
Kaido
BB
Big Mom

Reactions: Like 2 | Winner 2 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Mihawk (May 10, 2021)

LightningForce said:


> “Invalid?” I have no idea when he said this, if you’re talking about the Rooftop then that was because BM underestimated the SNs, they ganged up on her 4v1, and they specifically took away her ability to fly.





Then she is a fool for repeatedly underestimating them. And he flat out calls her "pathetic" lol.

The fact is that Kaido "shitting himself over BM" has no more basis to him condescending and looking down on her. Big Mom being repeatedly subjected to buffoonery is humiliation that Oda would never allow in terms of how he handles the portrayal of Shanks or Whitebeard. Pretty much every time they appear, he treats them with a modicum of respect. Big Mom has more feats sure, but that's mainly because she is currently more fleshed out, like Kaido...she also has more head-scratching moments that make you wonder why she would be subjected to this type of treatment in the first place, such as getting sent flying from Onigashima and crying for help from Zeus while Kaido belittles her. It's also in part due to inconsistent writing by Oda and the misfortune of the 2 Yonko being current opponents, but I simply can't imagine the same happening to Whitebeard or Shanks. Hell, it didn't even happen to Kaido. It's highly possible that the current Big Mom is past her prime, and Lin Lin at her peak could've actually been better than the Kaido we see now.



LightningForce said:


> We saw BM when she was fully serious against her opponent. Kaido couldn’t kill her despite going on for days.


Of course, she's a Yonko and they are all in a deadlock against each other. She deserves at least the benefit of a doubt that she could fight another one on equal terms. We know that a fight between top tiers can sometimes last for several days, if not more. The Yonko should be even closer, as they were able to split the skies, in the same way that Whitebeard and Shanks were able to.


LightningForce said:


> This superior “portrayal” you mentioned is not indicative of strength, only plot importance in connection to Luffy. We have no idea how Shanks intercepted Kaido before MF. Perhaps Kaido went alone (very likely considering his solo intro) while Shanks brought his entire crew with him. Who knows.


Then I urge you to read my post again..Shanks has a lot going for him. I am not saying he is the strongest Yonko, than I am merely scoffing at the stupid notion that he's the weakest bc "hurr durr lack of feats". His importance to the plot is an indicator of strength relative to plot placement. Why should his connection to the main character not be relevant in attributing stronger portrayal, unless context is dismissed? I'm not making any predictions for Shanks' role in the future because it is irrelevant to this discussion. What is relevant is what has already been shown by the author, and the prescribed importance to the plot by Oda. There is literally no mandatory requirement for Kaido to be stronger than Shanks. Hell, it's possible that he never was. On the other hand, Shanks' portrayal in the grander scheme of things, is arguably superior to Big Mom's, as it is arguably superior to Kaido's when you scrutinise the details behind the latter's hype. The only Yonko who is an exception to this will probably be Blackbeard, as he is an anomaly and constantly evolving, and perhaps Whitebeard, who was explicitly known as the WSM.


I don't mind if you call this speculation, but Kaido/Big Mom are clearly being shown to be less and less infallible, while Shanks has barely even made a move. Those who can only attribute value based purely on feats, will say that he hasn't done or proven anything. They have more feats, but they also have shown more flaws. A clever reader would think that Shanks actually has more potential, as he is being saved for the long run. Sometimes, the hype and lore of a character is simply greater than face value feats. However, I also understand this being a battledome thread, people don't operate this way. So, we should revisit this in due time; although I am absolutely certain Shanks will justify the hype.

I agree with you on the Kaido interception at MF though. I won't presume anything or jump to any conclusion concerning that incident since we don't have all the facts of the encounter. For all we know, they could've had a cup of sake and reached a compromise somehow. However, remember also that Kaido includes Shanks as one of the few people whom he believes can beat him, along with Roger/WB, Xebec, and Oden. Shanks has also repeatedly been portrayed as the link between Luffy and Roger, so he should be fairly special, even amongst the current Yonko.


LightningForce said:


> Ace light novels specifically state that to become an emperor, you need to be as least as strong as Shanks. Meaning he was the benchmark at the time.


I loved the Ace Light novel but it was written by Shou Hinata and Tatsuya Hamazaki, and not Oda. Still, I'll indulge in this. The fact of the matter is, Shanks became a Yonko 6-12 years ago, so considering he was the youngest and most recent one, the statement would make sense in that regard. It doesn't necessarily mean he was the weakest one, especially when you factor in how he captains the most well-rounded and impregnable of the Emperor crews. Shanks climbed to the top from a mere cabin boy, something even Whitebeard acknowledged. Few other characters have garnered as much respect in-verse than Shanks, in such short a time.



LightningForce said:


> Could Shanks be stronger even marginally by the end? Sure. But right now there’s no evidence of that and we need more feats from him, especially against fellow Emperors, to showcase this.



Fair enough, agreed.

Still, I think his hype makes it pretty clear that Oda considers him to be special. Oda obviously loves Shanks more than the other Yonko lol, as he is the one he admits, that resembles him the most.


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## Mihawk (May 10, 2021)

LightningForce said:


> I get the BM and Kaido trash-talking. Their status as Emperors haven't matched their personalities or some of their feats, BM having her shit stolen and Kaido being an idiot drunk. Oda likes to use them for gags and such. That doesn't invalidate their portrayal as the top tiers. BM was in the same era as Roger and WB and she's far more relevant than Shiki who was also confirmed to be on their level.


Well, they do trash talk each other and are technically still rivals. Oda using them for gags and nerfing them with the plot does create problematic issues in how he handles them. I agree that it doesn't invalidate their portrayal as top tiers. I mean, we know what they're capable of and it would be kinda cheap to just downplay them because of memes. I do think that that the Big Mom who occupied the previous era with Roger, WB, and Shiki, may have been far more aggressive, if not stronger than the current version though. She is on the wrong side of 68 after all.



LightningForce said:


> BM's crew arguably looks more impressive than WB's, considering she has the best intel network. Kaido's crew is a meritocracy so strength is guaranteed there.


I gotta disagree with this though. WB's Commanders have performed far better and have noticeably better portrayal. They also don't get relegated to gags either. Shanks' crew is likely similar besides some light comic relief, as they've been hyped by the Marines to be the best current crew of them all. The Beast Pirates have been lackluster imo.


LightningForce said:


> Both have ACoC, so they don't fall behind Shanks in any Haki category so far.



True, but Shanks is the one who prominently demonstrated the usage of CoC that more and more characters are using now. He was the first one who could impose it on inanimate objects and his surroundings, and the first ever user in the series period. I think the hints are there, along with the fact that he was Roger/Rayleigh's apprentice, and both are pretty much confirmed to be Haki gods. Consider also, that Shanks has never showed the use of a devil fruit, unlike Kaido and Big Mom.



LightningForce said:


> And if Shanks resembles anything like Oda later on, then Shanks will be as much of a gag/meme as either BM or Kaido because Oda is literally a meme man. SBS tells you all you need to know about his personality.


Yeah Shanks is lighthearted by nature, but I doubt that's going to translate into narrative ridicule or incompetence in terms of his performance. Oda's used Shanks to set the tone for the manga, and has been keeping him for a very long time now. Every time Luffy makes progress, it's supposedly a big deal for Oda to show his reaction.


LightningForce said:


> Authors of Shonen Jump light novels consult with the mangakas on details and story, double-check on the facts. Light novels on SJ are canon to their respective series. It's the same for Naruto and Bleach as well. Ace novels are canon unless they outright contradict something stated in the manga. At the very least, they are more canon than most speculation on this board.


Sure we can take the light novel as canon. I mean, I like the fact that they confirmed Ace was a CoA user.


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## Fujitora (May 10, 2021)

LightningForce said:


> I swear Oda basically spoon feeds that Kaido = BM and OLers will still put her as the weakest Emperor.
> 
> He could have her shove Napoleon up Kaido’s ass while he is begging for mercy and they will still say she is the weakest.
> 
> Meanwhile Shanks the second to youngest Emperor and whose strength the Ace light novels set as the _benchmark_ to become an Emperor, is somehow deemed equal to or stronger than Kaido.


Its called bias, these forums are full of Kaido and Big mom haters.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Fujitora (May 10, 2021)

Mihawk said:


> Or is this going to devolve into an argument on Kaido's title?


They met with Shank's crew and then went on to call Kaido the strongest pirate.


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## Quipchaque (May 10, 2021)

YonkoDrippy said:


> Rank the Yonko from strongest to weakest
> 
> Primebeard
> Big Mom
> ...



Whitebeard
Shanks
Kaido
Big Mom
Blackbeard
Wano Luffy
WCI Luffy
Old Whitebeard

Reactions: Funny 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Quipchaque (May 10, 2021)

LightningForce said:


> I swear Oda basically spoon feeds that Kaido = BM and OLers will still put her as the weakest Emperor.
> 
> He could have her shove Napoleon up Kaido’s ass while he is begging for mercy and they will still say she is the weakest.
> 
> Meanwhile Shanks the second to youngest Emperor and whose strength the Ace light novels set as the _benchmark_ to become an Emperor, is somehow deemed equal to or stronger than Kaido.



Sorry but no. Shanks>Kaido>Big Mom. 

Shanks being a Benchmark for Yonko candidates does not mean he is the weakest. It means he is a Yonko. Nothing more and nothing less. You don't need to be the weakest of a group to be a valid benchmark and one can easily Interpret such a Statement as a reference to the level Shanks was at when people acknowledged him as Worthy of that title. Kaido fears him but not Big Mom. That should tell you everything you need to know.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 1 | Optimistic 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Fujitora (May 10, 2021)

DiscoZoro20 said:


> Sorry but no. Shanks>Kaido>Big Mom.
> 
> Shanks being a Benchmark for Yonko candidates does not mean he is the weakest. It means he is a Yonko. Nothing more and nothing less. You don't need to be the weakest of a group to be a valid benchmark and one can easily Interpret such a Statement as a reference to the level Shanks was at when people acknowledged him as Worthy of that title. *Kaido fears him but not Big Mom.* That should tell you everything you need to know.


? Making shit up? He respects him but where has he ever shown any fear towards him?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Quipchaque (May 10, 2021)

GreenEggsAHam said:


> hes clearly not the strongest but seems like he would be the weakest.



Yet he lives rent-free in Kaido's head next to all the people that we can safely say Kaido remembers for being Stronger than him. Oh and the guy who Oda chose to use as a King's haki God is totally not going to be more powerful than a random dragon monster and a Balloon who fear Luffy's armament haki...

Reactions: Like 3 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Quipchaque (May 10, 2021)

OniKaido said:


> ? Making shit up? He respects him but where has he ever shown any fear towards him?



Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 2 | Tier Specialist 2


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## Fujitora (May 10, 2021)

DiscoZoro20 said:


> Yet he lives rent-free in Kaido's head next to all the people that we can safely say Kaido remembers for being Stronger than him. Oh and the guy who Oda chose to use as a King's haki God is totally not going to be more powerful than a *random dragon monster* and a *Balloon who fear Luffy's armament haki*...


Safely say huh, i was also right in the Kaido and BM hating department.

Kinda funny you tier specialisted that comment.

Your entire premise is what ifs and speculation, ignoring everything else.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Six (May 10, 2021)

You guys are sleeping on Linlin just because she’s retarded. If her IQ were at least 70, she’d have found the One Piece and dominated the world with the ancient weapons

Reactions: Agree 2 | Funny 3


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## LordVinsmoke (May 10, 2021)

If There Are Still Yonko By Eos

Old WB
Shanks
Kaido
Big Mom

Reactions: Agree 1


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## GreenEggsAHam (May 10, 2021)

DiscoZoro20 said:


> Yet he lives rent-free in Kaido's head next to all the people that we can safely say Kaido remembers for being Stronger than him. Oh and the guy who Oda chose to use as a King's haki God is totally not going to be more powerful than a random dragon monster and a Balloon who fear


Yes the guy whos weaker then mihawk and the admirals.


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## Red Admiral (May 10, 2021)

*1- PrimeTeach* : no debate needed
*2- Prime Beard* : no debate needed
*3- Shanks* : 2 times in manga had hype advantage over Kaido
*4- Kaido* : best claim among living 
*5- Big Mom *: dead equal to Kaido proven over 10 times in manga
*6- Current* *Teach* : on his way 
*7- MF Beard* : much weaker than people really want to believe. he was way too sick guys.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Disagree 1


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## Fujitora (May 10, 2021)

Red Admiral said:


> *3- Shanks* : 2 times in manga had hype advantage over Kaido
> *4- Kaido* : best claim among living


2 times? What?

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 1


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## Quipchaque (May 11, 2021)

GreenEggsAHam said:


> Yes the guy whos weaker then mihawk and the admirals.



Delusional.


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## Red Admiral (May 11, 2021)

OniKaido said:


> 2 times? What?



*first time *: during war of the bests, Shanks got the better hype by stopping Kaido
*2nd time* : when Kaido mentioned Shanks among very small people who can fight (and most likely beat him)

Luffy who barely learned Red Lighting is stopping Hybrid Kaido ...
Shanks as Greatest CoC user who most likely can take CoC to next level? yup ... he will beat Kaido

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 1


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## El Hit (May 11, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> honestly.
> 
> What was promethus and zeus going to do to kaido?


if kinemon and raizo can do something, then Zeus too.


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## Corax (May 11, 2021)

Canute87 said:


> honestly.
> 
> What was promethus and zeus going to do to kaido?


She has aCoC. So Zeus charged punch+aCoC should hurt Kaido a lot,if even Luffy's aCoC punch without fire/electricity can hurt him.


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## Quipchaque (May 11, 2021)

Six said:


> Literally unstoppable.



Exactly. And who among the Yonko resembles that the most? Ding, Ding, Ding! That is right. Shanks. Which is why he is the strongest yonko.


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## Perrin (May 11, 2021)

Six said:


> Literally unstoppable.


Oh I dunno, Luffy is borderline learning difficulties but in combat pulls it out the hat. Ben Beckman has the highest IQ in east blue but doesn’t know how to use a gun (in RD he thinks it’s a club, in MF he couldn’t find the trigger).
Intelligence doesn’t always translate well to combat ability in one piece.


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## Quipchaque (May 11, 2021)

Perrin said:


> (in RD he thinks it’s a club, in MF he couldn’t find the trigger).



What is this ridiculous downplay? Are you ok...?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Perrin (May 11, 2021)

DiscoZoro20 said:


> What is this ridiculous downplay? Are you ok...?


He’s a repressed swordsman/clubman, I’m having a giggle


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## Quipchaque (May 11, 2021)

Perrin said:


> He’s a repressed swordsman/clubman, I’m having a giggle



How is that giggle-worthy..? Sounds lame if anything else tbh.


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## Perrin (May 11, 2021)

DiscoZoro20 said:


> How is that giggle-worthy..? Sounds lame if anything else tbh.


It’s a funny observation, from what we’ve seen Lucky Roo is a better marksman than Beckmann


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## Quipchaque (May 11, 2021)

Perrin said:


> It’s a funny observation, from what we’ve seen Lucky Roo is a better marksman than Beckmann



I guess lol.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Fujitora (May 11, 2021)

Red Admiral said:


> *first time *: during war of the bests, Shanks got the upper end of the better hype by stopping Kaido
> *2nd time* : when Kaido mentioned Shanks among very small people who can fight (and most likely beat him)
> 
> Luffy who barely learned Red Lighting is stopping Hybrid Kaido ...
> Shanks as Greatest CoC user who most likely can take CoC to next level? yup ... he will beat Kaido


Kaido is > Shanks and go read the spoilers.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Draco Bolton (May 11, 2021)

IMO

Prime WB
Healthy Old WB
Kaido
BM
Shanks
Sick Old WB with heart attacks
Current Teach
Current Luffy

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2 | Lewd 1


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## TheWiggian (May 11, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> 0. Primebeard
> 1. Oldbeard/Shanks
> 2. Shanks/Oldbeard
> 3. Blackbeard
> ...



Damn this guy got it right. Going with this

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Red Admiral (May 11, 2021)

OniKaido said:


> Kaido is > Shanks and go read the spoilers.



I did ... Kaido have best claim so far but CoC God still wins

Reactions: Winner 2


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## Fujitora (May 11, 2021)

Red Admiral said:


> I did ... Kaido have best claim so far but CoC God still wins


Lol no.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Gotenks92 (May 17, 2021)

Kaido haters lmao took your L
"our enemy is the strongest pirate" Kaido > Linlin = Shanks > current Teach

Reactions: Agree 1 | Optimistic 1


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## Tsukuyomi (May 17, 2021)

Gotenks92 said:


> Kaido haters lmao took your L
> "our enemy is the strongest pirate" Kaido > Linlin = Shanks > current Teach


When was this stated


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## TheWiggian (May 17, 2021)

Code said:


> When was this stated



Killer said it. Zoro said he is the so called toughest guy in the world. 

Kid agreed by bringing all the metal he found against Kaido but for some reason he has more metal prepared for Big Mom now.




Anyway nothing changes that it remains a rumour which even Oda agrees on in the latest SBS.


_
D: IF LUFFY'S GEAR FOUR IS A THING, THEN WILL GEAR FIVE BE A THING TOO?! – P.N. Y・Sousei-kun

O: Very well. Seeing the passion in your handwriting, I feel obligated to include this question as I received it. Will "Five" be a thing…? Right now, the enemy we have to defeat is the man said to essentially be the world's strongest. Because of that, the world is in the age of transitioning from "4G" to "5G"."G" means "gear", right?_

Note how he talks about Kaido when Oda is asked about G5 rumours?

Oda never confirms Kaido as the undoubtedly strongest, evading it. It's similar to how Luffy - Zoro - Sanji stand to each other. We all know the foodchain without any statements.

Reactions: Winner 1 | Useful 1


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## Quipchaque (May 17, 2021)

Gotenks92 said:


> Kaido haters lmao took your L
> "our enemy is the strongest pirate" Kaido > Linlin = Shanks > current Teach



Actually if anything that is a L for Kaido's Fans. The fact that Zoro says that Despite never even meeting him Shows us how credible his title really is.

Reactions: Funny 2 | Optimistic 1


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## Mihawk (May 17, 2021)

TheWiggian said:


> _O: Very well. Seeing the passion in your handwriting, I feel obligated to include this question as I received it. Will "Five" be a thing…? Right now, the enemy we have to defeat is the man said to essentially be the world's strongest. *Because of that, the world is in the age of transitioning from "4G" to "5G"."G" means "gear", right?*_
> 
> Note how he talks about Kaido when Oda is asked about G5 rumours?
> 
> Oda never confirms Kaido as the undoubtedly strongest, evading it. It's similar to how Luffy - Zoro - Sanji stand to each other. We all know the foodchain without any statements.



Interesting what he says about Kaido's defeat being the catalyst to the world transitioning from an age of 4G to 5G. Seems to almost imply there will be others who may qualify as the top dog

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Gotenks92 (May 17, 2021)

Code said:


> When was this stated


Killer said it and Kid said "good answer"

Reactions: Useful 1


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## Ushiromiya Battler (May 17, 2021)

Likely

Prime WB
EoS BB
Kaido
Shanks/Big Mom
Foxy

Reactions: Like 1


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## YonkoDrippy (May 17, 2021)

I think it’s 

Primebeard
Old Whitebeard/Kaido
Big Mom
Shanks
Blackbeard (Current)
Luffy (Current)


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## Turrin (May 18, 2021)

1) Primebeard / Teach (Post Wano)
2) Shanks
——
3) Kaidou / Peak Old WB / Luffy
4) BM
5) Old WB at his weakest in MF

It’s indicated that Primebeard and Shanks are PK level; and last time Kaidou fought a PK Level (Oden) he got blitz’d Stomp’d, and I have yet to see any evidence he got so much stronger as to make a significant difference here.

Teach needs to be able to beat Shanks and he should be at that level Post-Wano
—-
Kaidou is greatly out performing BM in this arc, so I have to put him above her and I can’t see WB at his weakest where he couldn’t even use CoC, really being able to beat Kaidou ether. But Old WB in better condition still seems implied to be a real threat to Kaidou if not above him.

Luffy should end the arc nebulously around Kaidou’s level due to beating him 1v1 in their final round.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 2


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## MO (May 20, 2021)

LightningForce said:


> You basically posted 99% speculation and hype.


this is what annoys me when it comes to shanks fans.  It really is just speculation and baseless hype. Stuff like Roger's "protege", or Luffy's Idol, and "Man closest to One piece" which isn't even true. That doesn't add anything to his standing with the other emperors. There is nothing concrete that put shanks above another emperor.

Kaido is viewed as superior to everybody including Shanks in the one-piece World
Big Mom hasn't been scarred in her life, let alone lost her arm to a fish
Whitebeard was the WSM period.
Blackbeard as two uber-powerful Devil fruit and is still growing.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1 | Disagree 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Shunsuiju (May 20, 2021)

MO said:


> this is what annoys me when it comes to shanks fans.  It really is just speculation and baseless hype. Stuff like Roger's "protege", or Luffy's Idol, and "Man closest to One piece" which isn't even true. That doesn't add anything to his standing with the other emperors. There is nothing concrete that put shanks above another emperor.
> 
> Kaido is viewed as superior to everybody including Shanks in the one-piece World
> Big Mom hasn't been scarred in her life, let alone lost her arm to a fish
> ...


Putting Big Mom over Shanks because of the fish incident is pretty disingenuous. Kaido is all hype as well, his title is basically there to be taken from him, it's nothing like Whitebeard's, as you said he was the strongest when Kaido was alive. You can make a good argument for Shanks over Kaido as you can for Kaido over Shanks. I think putting them all as equals for now is the most reasonable position and the one least infected by bias.


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## Mihawk (May 21, 2021)

MO said:


> this is what annoys me when it comes to shanks fans.  It really is just speculation and baseless hype. Stuff like Roger's "protege", or Luffy's Idol, and "Man closest to One piece" which isn't even true. That doesn't add anything to his standing with the other emperors. There is nothing concrete that put shanks above another emperor.


Huh? Shanks being Roger's protege and Luffy's idol is "speculation, "baseless hype", and isn't true? I thought it was 100% manga fact at this point, or have people forgotten the story. Why wouldn't Shanks be the man closest to One Piece at this moment? Kaido and BM are set to fall and are busy handling the Supernova Alliance, while Whitebeard is dead, and Teach has his hands full with the marines, revos, etc. Meanwhile, Shanks and Teach are the only ones left standing while the former has inherited Roger's will.

Kaido/Big Mom fans just can't accept the fact that Shanks has greater relevance in the grander scheme.



MO said:


> Kaido is viewed as superior to everybody including Shanks in the one-piece World


Really? I thought he was simply viewed as superior to all non-human creatures.



MO said:


> Big Mom hasn't been scarred in her life, let alone lost her arm to a fish


  Kidd disagrees.



MO said:


> Whitebeard was the WSM period.


Yes, and he is dead.


MO said:


> Blackbeard as two uber-powerful Devil fruit and is still growing.


Sure.

Reactions: Like 2


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## MO (May 21, 2021)

Mihawk said:


> Huh? Shanks being Roger's protege and Luffy's idol is "speculation, "baseless hype", and isn't true? I thought it was 100% manga fact at this point, or have people forgotten the story. Why wouldn't Shanks be the man closest to One Piece at this moment? Kaido and BM are set to fall and are busy handling the Supernova Alliance, while Whitebeard is dead, and Teach has his hands full with the marines, revos, etc. Meanwhile, Shanks and Teach are the only ones left standing while the former has inherited Roger's will.
> 
> Kaido/Big Mom fans just can't accept the fact that Shanks has greater relevance in the grander scheme.


What makes him the closest? He doesn't have any Red poneglyph from what we know. So how is he closer to one piece than BM and Kaido? Unless some Past roger crewmate told him where ralftel is, there is nothing that says he is the closest man to one piece. Him being more relevant than Kaido or BM does not mean he is closer to one piece nor does it mean he is stronger.



Mihawk said:


> Really? I thought he was simply viewed as superior to all non-human creatures.


Human are creatures. His title includes every being.



Mihawk said:


> Kidd disagrees.


Kidd hasn't scarred BM so IDK what you are trying to do here.



Mihawk said:


> Yes, and he is dead.


was and is still stronger.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Mihawk (May 21, 2021)

MO said:


> What makes him the closest? He doesn't have any Red poneglyph from what we know. So how is he closer to one piece than BM and Kaido? Unless some Past roger crewmate told him where ralftel is, there is nothing that says he is the closest man to one piece. Him being more relevant than Kaido or BM does not mean he is closer to one piece nor does it mean he is stronger.


Noted regarding the Poneglyphs. Chances are though, since Mom & Kaido are set up to fall, Shanks and Teach will take precedence. He was protege to both Roger and Rayleigh. We know that Shanks met Rayleigh afterwards and spoke to him. He has more insight on Roger than almost anyone else, even if he didn't go to Raftel himself. So yes, he was closer to the Pirate King by virtue of being a former member of the Roger Pirates and the inheritor of the captain's memento.

So him being more relevant means that he is weaker? Even though Oda has highlighted his importance and saved him for over a thousand chapters? What is the point of concealing his power and importance only for him to be inferior then?



MO said:


> Human are creatures. His title includes every being.


Actually, in the most recent chapter Kaido refers to humans in third person. Kaido's nature has been called into question before, with Nami wondering if he isn't human back in Punk Hazard, and even Big Mom herself refers to him as "that thing". Clearly, he is being separated from humans by the narrative.



MO said:


> Kidd hasn't scarred BM so IDK what you are trying to do here.


And you're citing a circumstance of plot that occured back from Chapter 1 which is pretty much a meme. Oda even said Shanks never got weaker. On the other hand, BM wasn't wounded by Kidd simply due to plot.


MO said:


> was and is still stronger.


Sure.

Doflamingo and Big Mom's words imply that no one has surpassed Whitebeard even after his death.


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## MO (May 21, 2021)

Mihawk said:


> Noted regarding the Poneglyphs. Chances are though, since Mom & Kaido are set up to fall, Shanks and Teach will take precedence. He was protege to both Roger and Rayleigh. We know that Shanks met Rayleigh afterwards and spoke to him. He has more insight on Roger than almost anyone else, even if he didn't go to Raftel himself. So yes, he was closer to the Pirate King by virtue of being a former member of the Roger Pirates and the inheritor of the captain's memento.
> 
> So him being more relevant means that he is weaker? Even though Oda has highlighted his importance and saved him for over a thousand chapters? What is the point of concealing his power and importance only for him to be inferior then?


I don't really understand what your trying to explain in your first paragraph.

Yes, He is confirmed weaker than Kaido for one. And Shanks relevance is highly overrated. He's most likely going to be used as a hype tool for Blackbeard. 


Mihawk said:


> Actually, in the most recent chapter Kaido refers to humans in third person. Kaido's nature has been called into question before, with Nami wondering if he isn't human back in Punk Hazard, and even Big Mom herself refers to him as "that thing". Clearly, he is being separated from humans by the narrative.


Even if he isn't a human his title includes human. He is the world strongest living being. and has been stated quite a few times already to be the strongest in the world.



Mihawk said:


> And you're citing a circumstance of plot that occured back from Chapter 1 which is pretty much a meme. Oda even said Shanks never got weaker. On the other hand, *BM wasn't wounded by Kidd simply due to plot.*


even if he hasn't gotten weaker He still got his arm ripped off by a fish and scarred by pre-time skip no fruit Blackbeard. 

and the bolded line is laughable. BM hasn't been wounded in her life and she has fought people way stronger than Kidd. It's not due to the plot.


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## Mihawk (May 21, 2021)

MO said:


> I don't really understand what your trying to explain in your first paragraph.


His relevance.


MO said:


> And Shanks relevance is highly overrated.


We disagree.


MO said:


> He's most likely going to be used as a hype tool for Blackbeard.


Perhaps. But Blackbeard is likely going to be the strongest man in the world. They both have greater relevance to the story than the Rocks duo.


MO said:


> Even if he isn't a human his title includes human. He is the world strongest living being. *and has been stated quite a few times already to be the strongest in the world.*


By whom? And I already provided you with instances where his status was separated from the humans.


MO said:


> even if he hasn't gotten weaker He still got his arm ripped off by a fish and scarred by pre-time skip no fruit Blackbeard.


Yeah and Kaido took 7 Ls, got captured 18 times, had to resort to hostages to beat Oden even though he's supposedly unbeatable 1 on 1, and acknowledged 5 others as his potential equals. Meanwhile, Big Mom got no sold by Jinbe and Chopper, while getting rolled around by Robin. We can both go on with the downplay, but it's silly don't you think?


MO said:


> and the bolded line is laughable. *BM hasn't been wounded in her life*



Source please? I can't remember this part. All I remember was it being stated that no weapon had pierced her, similar to Kaido.


MO said:


> and she has fought people way stronger than Kidd. *It's not due to the plot.*


Yes I said it's *not* due to the plot lol.

And she has fought people way stronger than Kidd, yet Kidd was able to wound her


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## MO (May 21, 2021)

Mihawk said:


> Perhaps. But Blackbeard is likely going to be the strongest man in the world. They both have greater relevance to the story than the Rocks duo.


only blackbeard.


Mihawk said:


> By whom? And I already provided you with instances where his status was separated from the humans.


law, killer, Zoro, kaido himself. Like I said his title includes humans even if he is not human. Human are creatures. His title isn't the Strongest non-human creature. It's the World strongest creature.


Mihawk said:


> Yeah and Kaido took 7 Ls, got captured 18 times, had to resort to hostages to beat Oden even though he's supposedly unbeatable 1 on 1, and acknowledged 5 others as his potential equals. Meanwhile, Big Mom got no sold by Jinbe and Chopper, while getting rolled around by Robin. We can both go on with the downplay, but it's silly don't you think?


Kaido "Ls" are actually meant to hype him. Even tho he was capture that many time and defeated that many times he was never killed.
Big Mom's portrayal is abysmal, yes, but still even through all those gag moments. She is never injured or wounded.


Mihawk said:


> Source please? I can't remember this part. All I remember was it being stated that no weapon had pierced her, similar to Kaido.


Capone I think stated when he was explaining the assassination plot to the Strawhats.


Mihawk said:


> And she has fought people way stronger than Kidd, yet Kidd was able to wound her


except he didn't. he did as much damage as frankly motorcycle did to Big Mom.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Informative 1 | Tier Specialist 1


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## Turrin (May 23, 2021)

MO said:


> this is what annoys me when it comes to shanks fans.  It really is just speculation and baseless hype. Stuff like Roger's "protege", or Luffy's Idol, and "Man closest to One piece" which isn't even true. That doesn't add anything to his standing with the other emperors. There is nothing concrete that put shanks above another emperor.
> 
> Kaido is viewed as superior to everybody including Shanks in the one-piece World
> Big Mom hasn't been scarred in her life, let alone lost her arm to a fish
> ...


Kaidou himself placed Shanks among characters that we know are almost certainly stronger then him and above BM, who he clear doesnt think has chance against him. Kaidou could be wrong of course but this is certainly tangible hype that would place Shanks >= Kaidou and above BM.

Reactions: Tier Specialist 3


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## Maruo (May 23, 2021)

Turrin said:


> Kaidou himself placed Shanks *among characters that we know are almost certainly stronger then him and above BM*



This is headcanon. I see no basis for concluding this based on the panel I believe you're referring to.


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## Perrin (May 23, 2021)

Maruo said:


> This is headcanon. I see no basis for concluding this based on the panel I believe you're referring to.


None whatsoever? Interesting.
Do you not think Xebec Roger and Whitebeard were stronger than him?

Reactions: Like 1


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## Maruo (May 23, 2021)

Perrin said:


> None whatsoever? Interesting.
> Do you not think Xebec Roger and Whitebeard were stronger than him?



Well yes (at the very least their prime versions), but that's not what that panel was about. The panel was about people who Kaido considered to be legends and how Kaido saw the same potential in Luffy. Big Mom wasn't in the panel because she was there in person. The panel does not say anything about how Kaido sees himself in relation to these characters in terms of power level.

As an addendum, if Kaido does indeed turn out to be the weakest or one of the two weakest Yonkos, I think this could be used as circumstantial evidence in hindsight (although I would still consider this poor writing). Just by itself, however, the panel doesn't necessarily imply that Kaido is weaker than all the individuals he imagines.


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## Perrin (May 23, 2021)

Maruo said:


> Well yes (at the very least their prime versions), but that's not what that panel was about. The panel was about people who Kaido considered to be at the top of the world and how Kaido saw the same potential in Luffy. Big Mom wasn't in the panel because she was there in person. The panel does not say anything about how Kaido saw himself in relation to these characters in terms of power level.


Oden was at the top of the world?


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## Maruo (May 23, 2021)

Perrin said:


> Oden was at the top of the world?



That was probably a bad phrase to use here. It was moreso characters who Kaido appreciates the strength of.

Again, the main point of that scene was to show Kaido's view of Luffy. In my opinion, drawing any other conclusions using this panel as the main piece of evidence isn't justified.


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## Perrin (May 23, 2021)

Ah okay, more like a generic ‘hes strong’


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## Turrin (May 23, 2021)

Maruo said:


> This is headcanon. I see no basis for concluding this based on the panel I believe you're referring to.


So you think Kaidou >= Roger / Xebec / Primebeard / Oden

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Maruo (May 23, 2021)

Turrin said:


> So you think Kaidou >= Roger / Xebec / Primebeard / Oden



Again, that's not what I meant. My point was that that panel was not about their power levels in relation to Kaido, but Kaido viewing Luffy as having the potential to reach those same heights.


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## Yonko RedHair Shanks (May 26, 2021)

Kaido the mr top 1 this is indisputable and has the feats to back it up. 
Later:
Big mom
Blackbeard 
Shanks

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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