# Feat Comparison: Naruto vs Sasuke [Final]



## Kyu (Oct 29, 2014)

*Rikudo Sage Mode Naruto vs Sharinnegan Sasuke*

Everything they've accomplished in every mode/state up til the most recent chapter.


Taijutsu:

_
Skill - 
Physical Strength - 
Speed - 
Reflexes - 
Durability - 
Resilience - 
_

Ninjutsu:

_
Destructive Capacity - 
Defensive - 
Support - 
Casting Speed - 
Efficiency - 
Innovativeness - 
Versatility -
_ 

Genjutsu:

_
Offense - 
Defense - 
_

Chakra: 

_
Chakra Control - 
Chakra Reserves - 
_

Mental: 

_
Tactics - 
Insight - 
Knowledge - 
Willpower -
_

Other distinct skills:
_
Ninja Tools Proficiency - 
Sensing - 
Fūinjutsu - 
Senjutsu -
_

*Overall* -

Who's top dog?


----------



## JuicyG (Oct 29, 2014)

Kyu said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Taijutsu:

_
Skill - Sasuke
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Naruto
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto
_

Ninjutsu:

_
Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Sasuke
Support - Tie
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - Naruto
Innovativeness - Naruto
Versatility - Sasuke
_ 

Genjutsu:

_
Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke
_

Chakra: 

_
Chakra Control - Naruto
Chakra Reserves - Naruto
_

Mental: 

_
Tactics - Naruto
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower -Naruto
_

Other distinct skills:
_
Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Sasuke
Senjutsu - Naruto
_

*Overall* -

Sasuke - 10
Naruto - 14
Tie - 1

Naruto is the winner


----------



## Ghost (Oct 29, 2014)

Taijutsu:


Skill - Sasuke
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Tie
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto


Ninjutsu:


Destructive Capacity - Naruto 
Defensive - Sasuke
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - Tie
Innovativeness - Tie 
Versatility - Sasuke


Genjutsu:


Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke


Chakra: 


Chakra Control - Tie
Chakra Reserves - Naruto


Mental: 


Tactics - Tie
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower - Naruto


Other distinct skills:

Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - 
Senjutsu - Naruto


Overall:

Naruto 10
Sasuke 9
Tie 5


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## Rocky (Oct 29, 2014)

Naruto is at ten if you meant to give physical strength to him. ^


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## Ghost (Oct 29, 2014)

?????????? oh lol

how did I not notice that


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## Trojan (Oct 29, 2014)

[=Kyu;52089325]*[
Everything they've accomplished in every mode/state up til the most recent chapter.
Taijutsu:


Skill - 
Physical Strength - 
Speed - 
Reflexes - 
Durability - 
Resilience - 


Naruto everything. Perhaps except for speed since Sasuke has S/T jutsu. 



Ninjutsu:


Destructive Capacity - 
Defensive - 
Support - 
Casting Speed - 
Efficiency - 
Innovativeness - 
Versatility -


Click to expand...

Naruto




Genjutsu:


Offense - 
Defense - 


Click to expand...

Sasuke



Chakra: 


Chakra Control - 
Chakra Reserves - 


Click to expand...

Naruto




Mental: 


Tactics - 
Insight - 
Knowledge - 
Willpower -


Click to expand...

Naruto. 



Other distinct skills:

Ninja Tools Proficiency - 
Sensing - 
Fūinjutsu - 
Senjutsu -


Click to expand...

Naruto






Overall -
		
Click to expand...


Naruto.

It's Minato & itachi all over again. 
the uchiha are better at Genjutsu, outclassed in everything else.*


----------



## Grimmjowsensei (Oct 29, 2014)

*Taijutsu:*

Skill -  Sasuke
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Sasuke
Durability - Equal
Resilience - Naruto


*Ninjutsu:*

Destructive Capacity - Tie
Defensive - Tie
Support - Sauce
Casting Speed - sauce
Efficiency - Sauce
Innovativeness - tie
Versatility - Sasuke


*Genjutsu:*


Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke


*Chakra: *


Chakra Control - Sasuke
Chakra Reserves - Naruto


*Mental: *


Tactics - Naruto
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower - Naruto


*Other distinct skills:*

Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Naruto
Senjutsu - Naruto


Overall - Tie


----------



## Hachibi (Oct 29, 2014)

^ Actually Grimm, Naruto is more durable than Sasuke, with the body/eyes shit and all.


----------



## Altair21 (Oct 29, 2014)

*Sasuke*

Taijutsu:


 Skill - 5
 Physical Strength - 4.5
 Speed - 5
 Reflexes - 5 
 Durability - 4.5
 Resilience - 5 (these last 2 chapters are all we need to know he gets a 5 in resilience)


Ninjutsu:


 Destructive Capacity - 5
 Defensive - 5
 Support - 5
 Casting Speed - 5
 Efficiency - 5
 Innovativeness - 5 (kirin along with all the chidori variants he made)
 Versatility -5


Genjutsu:


Offense - 5 (putting all 9 bijuu in genjutsu simultaneously easily gives him a 5)
Defense - 5


Chakra: 


Chakra Control - 5
Chakra Reserves - 5 (yes he has a 5 now. him and naruto battled for hours while using extremely taxing jutsu. not to mention he had previously fought kaguya and madara as well) 


Mental: 


Tactics - 5
Insight - 4
Knowledge - 3 
Willpower - 5


Other distinct skills:

Ninja Tools Proficiency - 4.5
Sensing - 1 (not a sensor, though he's got good intuition.)
Fūinjutsu - 2 (he did perform that one sealing jutsu to release Orochimaru from Anko's CM)
Senjutsu - 0 (though if you count his use of Juugo's cure mark and his own then it can go up)


Overall - 110.5

*Naruto*

Taijutsu:


Skill - 5
Physical Strength - 5
Speed - 5
Reflexes - 5
Durability - 5
Resilience - 5


Ninjutsu:


Destructive Capacity - 5
Defensive - 5
Support - 5
Casting Speed - 2 (Naruto never uses hand seals)
Efficiency - 5
Innovativeness - 5 (all the rasengan variants give him a 5 in this)
Versatility - 5 (but this really depends on your meaning of versatility)


Genjutsu:


Offense - 3 (this is if ma and pa's frog song count for him. if not then he gets a 0 in this category)
Defense - 5 (he's got Kurama inside of him)


Chakra: 


Chakra Control - 5
Chakra Reserves - 5 


Mental: 


Tactics - 5 (can't deny that the guy comes up with some really good strategies at times) 
Insight - 4
Knowledge - 3
Willpower - 5


Other distinct skills:

Ninja Tools Proficiency - 3.5 (does naruto even use ninja tools anymore?)
Sensing - 5
Fūinjutsu - 4 (this is based more on hype than anything else as he's an uzumaki)
Senjutsu - 5


Overall - 111


----------



## Grimmjowsensei (Oct 29, 2014)

Hachibi said:


> ^ Actually Grimm, Naruto is more durable than Sasuke, with the body/eyes shit and all.



Based on their taijutsu encounter and last clash, they seem to have all around equal durability.
Naruto is more resilient though.


----------



## Kyu (Oct 29, 2014)

I'll have a go.

Taijutsu:

_
Skill - Sasuke
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Tie
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto
_

Ninjutsu:

_
Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Tie
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - Sasuke
Innovativeness - Naruto
Versatility - Tie
_ 

Genjutsu:

_
Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke
_

Chakra: 

_
Chakra Control - Tie
Chakra Reserves - Naruto
_

Mental: 

_
Tactics - Tie
Insight - Tie
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower - Naruto
_

Other distinct skills:
_
Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Tie (Both have Sealing jutsu)
Senjutsu - Naruto
_

*Overall* - *Naruto: 11*/*Sasuke: 7*/*Tie: 7*

Naruto >= Sasuke

Naruto is a bit stronger but the gap between the two is minuscule. The categories Naruto does have an edge in doesn't place him head and shoulders above Sasuke from a combat standpoint.


----------



## Trojan (Oct 29, 2014)

Sasuke is only equal to Naruto in some specific conditions though. U_U

1- When Sasuke using all the Bijuus - Naruto using only Kurama
2- Sasuke wanting to Kill Naruto - When Naruto holding back
3- When Naruto's chakra is drained from the war.

even with all those, Naruto is still stronger, but the gap is really small that they are equal. Any other condition
Naruto is clearly superior. U_U


----------



## JuicyG (Oct 29, 2014)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> Based on their taijutsu encounter and last clash, they seem to have all around equal durability.
> Naruto is more resilient though.




That is of course if your counting Riduko Sasuke w/ 9-Biju power up vs RSM Naruto. Before Sasuke absorbed those extra chakra it was easily Naruto in the durability category.


----------



## Altair21 (Oct 29, 2014)

JuicyG said:


> That is of course if your counting Riduko Sasuke w/ 9-Biju power up vs RSM Naruto. Before Sasuke absorbed those extra chakra it was easily Naruto in the durability category.



Grim's talking about their base durability (at least I would think so), which was on display these last 2 chapters where they were practically out of chakra and could no longer use their mode/eyes. They were shown to have similar durability as both could pretty much take what the other was dishing out, at least when it came to pure fist fighting. 

When Naruto's in rikudo mode he's easily superior in the durability department though.


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## Bonly (Oct 29, 2014)

Taijutsu:

Skill - Sasuke
Physical Strength- Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Tie
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto

Ninjutsu:

Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Naruto
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Tie
Efficiency - Tie
Innovativeness - Naruto
Versatility - Naruto


Genjutsu:

Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Tie

Chakra:

Chakra Control - Naruto
Chakra Reserves - Naruto


Mental:

Tactics - Naruto
Insight - Tie
Knowledge - Tie
Willpower - Naruto


Other distinct skills:

Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Tie 
Senjutsu - Naruto


Overall

Naruto: 15
Sasuke: 3
Tie: 7


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Oct 29, 2014)

Taijutsu:

_
Skill - Naruto. He's had the extensive taijutsu training with the toads after all.
Physical Strength - Naruto, even in base he overpowered Sasuke's strength
Speed - Naruto, fastest shinobi in the world from feats, able to blitz Kaguya unlike Sasuke
Reflexes - Naruto, reacted to attacks Sasuke couldn't.
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto
_

Ninjutsu:

_
Destructive Capacity - Naruto at full power
Defensive - Sasuke
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Tie
Efficiency - Tie
Innovativeness - Naruto
Versatility - Naruto
_ 

Genjutsu:

_
Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Naruto
_

Chakra: 

_
Chakra Control - Naruto, can do attacks that require extensive chakra control with one hand as well as remotely control V1 cloaks
Chakra Reserves - Naruto, it took an entire War for him to be brought down to Sasuke's reserves
_

Mental: 

_
Tactics - Naruto, he has shown the better tactics time and time again
Insight - Sasuke, he's shown the ability to see weaknesses in opponents better than Naruto
Knowledge - Tie
Willpower -Naruto
_

Other distinct skills:
_
Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke, no contest
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Tie
Senjutsu - Naruto
_

*Overall* - Naruto 18, Sasuke 4, Tie 4


----------



## ARGUS (Oct 29, 2014)

Taijutsu:

_
Skill - *Naruto*
Physical Strength - *Naruto* 
Speed - *Naruto*
Reflexes - *Naruto*
Durability - *Naruto*
Resilience - *Naruto*
_

Ninjutsu:

_
Destructive Capacity - *Naruto* 
Defensive - *Sasuke*
Support - *Naruto*
Casting Speed - *Naruto*
Efficiency - *Naruto*
Innovativeness - *Sasuke*
Versatility - *Sasuke*
_ 

Genjutsu:

_
Offense - *Sasuke*
Defense - *Sasuke*
_

Chakra: 

_
Chakra Control - *Naruto*
Chakra Reserves - *Naruto*
_

Mental: 

_
Tactics - *Naruto*
Insight - *Sasuke*
Knowledge - *Sasuke*
Willpower - *Naruto*
_

Other distinct skills:
_
Ninja Tools Proficiency - *Naruto*
Sensing - *Naruto*
Fūinjutsu - *Naruto*
Senjutsu - *Naruto*
_

*Overall* -

Who's top dog?

*Naruto - 18 
Sasuke - 7*


----------



## RedChidori (Oct 29, 2014)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> *Taijutsu:*
> 
> Skill -  Sasuke
> Physical Strength - Naruto
> ...



This cuz I'm too lazy to make my own response .


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## Gibbs (Oct 29, 2014)

Taijutsu:

_
Skill -  Naruto
Physical Strength - Naruto (If you account for the Kurama avatar strength of tossing bijuu around)
Speed -  Naruto
Reflexes - Naruto
Durability - Tie
Resilience - Naruto (Endured way more battles and taxing techniques than Sasuke did)
_
Tally: Naruto 5Sasuke 0
Tie: 1

Ninjutsu:

_
Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - tie
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - tie
Innovativeness - Naruto 
Versatility - Naruto
_
Tally: Naruto 4Sasuke 1
Tie: 2


Genjutsu:

_
Offense - Sasuke
Defense - tie
_
Tally: Naruto 0Sasuke 1
Tie: 1


Chakra: 

_
Chakra Control -  Naruto
Chakra Reserves - Naruto
_
Tally: Naruto 2Sasuke 0
Tie: 0



Mental: 

_
Tactics - Tie
Insight - Tie
Knowledge - Tie 
Willpower -Naruto
_
Tally: Naruto 1Sasuke 0
Tie: 3


Other distinct skills:
_
Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - tie (Naruto has used bijuu sealing techs)
Senjutsu - Naruto
_

Tally: Naruto 2Sasuke 1
Tie: 1


*Overall* -


Naruto 14
Sasuke 3
Tied: 8


----------



## Grimmjowsensei (Oct 30, 2014)

JuicyG said:


> That is of course if your counting Riduko Sasuke w/ 9-Biju power up vs RSM Naruto. Before Sasuke absorbed those extra chakra it was easily Naruto in the durability category.



I am talking about their base.and their ultimate forms. They seemed roughly equal.


----------



## Bkprince33 (Oct 30, 2014)

I pretty much agree with grims list with the expection of i think naruto is slightly more durable

I also think sasuke is faster due to his feat of blitzing 4 kurama avatars but overall there equal if you couldn't  tell by last chapter


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## Grimmjowsensei (Oct 30, 2014)

Bkprince33 said:


> I pretty much agree with grims list with the expection of i think naruto is slightly more durable
> 
> I also think sasuke is faster due to his feat of blitzing 4 kurama avatars but overall there equal if you couldn't  tell by last chapter



Yeah I actually I forgot about that. Sasuke should have better reaction speed, being able to simultaneously defend from 3 Kurama avatars.

As for durability, I haven't seen any feat that'd put one above the other.


----------



## Rocky (Oct 30, 2014)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> Yeah I actually I forgot about that. Sasuke should have better reaction speed, being able to simultaneously defend from 3 Kurama avatars.



Naruto proved better than Sasuke by _dodging_ the same thing Sasuke _failed to dodge. _

Kaguya and Zetsu even commented on his speed & reflexes. 



> As for durability, I haven't seen any feat that'd put one above the other.



Naruto _tanked_ Sasuke's Chidori...


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## Csdabest (Oct 30, 2014)

Taijutsu:


Skill - Sasuke
Physical Strength - Naruto 
Speed - Sasuke
Reflexes - Sasuke
Durability - Naruto 
Resilience - Naruto


Ninjutsu:


Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Sasuke
Support - Tie
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - Sasuke
Innovativeness - Sasuke
Versatility -Sasuke


Genjutsu:


Offense - Sasuke 
Defense - Sasuke


Chakra: 


Chakra Control - Sasuke
Chakra Reserves - Naruto


Mental: 


Tactics - Sasuke
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower - Naruto


Other distinct skills:

Ninja Tools Proficiency - 
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Sasuke
Senjutsu -Naruto


Overall - Sasuke is by far the Superior Shinobi. Naruto has more stamina, Willpower, and destructive capabilities to go with his resilience and durabilty. lol.


----------



## Rocky (Oct 30, 2014)

Csdabest said:


> Overall - Sasuke is by far the Superior Shinobi.



I feel that if that was true, then this:



..wouldn't have happened.


----------



## Grimmjowsensei (Oct 30, 2014)

Rocky said:


> Naruto proved better than Sasuke by _dodging_ the same thing Sasuke _failed to dodge. _
> 
> Kaguya and Zetsu even commented on his speed & reflexes.


Thats because Naruto is a sensor and Sasuke isn't, he can't react to attacks he can't see.

Sasuke was easily reacting to Naruto in their fight. Simultaneously defending from 3 Kyuubi avatars shows he is easily on par and above.



> Naruto _tanked_ Sasuke's Chidori...



with Rikodou Mode. if Power ups do count, then I am pretty sure Sasuke'd counter Chidori with Susano'o.

I am just comparing their base mode and their ultimate forms(Susano'o vs Kyuubi Avatar).


----------



## Rain (Oct 30, 2014)

Taijutsu:


Skill - Sasuke
Physical Strength - Naruto 
Speed - Sasuke
Reflexes - Equal
Durability - Equal
Resilience -  Naruto


Ninjutsu:


Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Sasuke
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Sasuke 
Efficiency - Sasuke
Innovativeness - Equal
Versatility - Sasuke


Genjutsu:


Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke


Chakra: 


Chakra Control - Equal
Chakra Reserves - Naruto


Mental: 


Tactics - Equal
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower - Equal


Other distinct skills:

Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Equal?
Senjutsu - Naruto


Overall - They're equal(ly terrible).


----------



## JuicyG (Oct 30, 2014)

Csdabest said:


> Overall - Sasuke is by far the Superior Shinobi. Naruto has more stamina, Willpower, and destructive capabilities to go with his resilience and durabilty. lol.




Um no,

Naruto has shown over-all greater speed (S/T is not raw speed, and even if it was Naruto matches it)

Naruto has shown innovation in combat

Naruto has better genjutsu defense because of Kurama

Naruto has better chakra control because of Sage

Overall Naruto > Sasuke

SM Naruto > MS Sasuke

BSM Naruto > EMS Sasuke

RSM Naruto > RM Sasuke


----------



## TheGreen1 (Oct 30, 2014)

JuicyG said:


> Um no,
> 
> Naruto has shown over-all greater speed (S/T is not raw speed, and even if it was Naruto matches it)
> 
> ...



I agree with this. Also consider that Sasuke had 9 bijuu, and Naruto only had one in him and pieces of the rest, and Naruto still won.


----------



## Hachibi (Oct 30, 2014)

The actual battle was a draw while Naruto won the ideological war.

It's that simple.


----------



## TheGreen1 (Oct 30, 2014)

Hachibi said:


> The actual battle was a draw while Naruto won the ideological war.
> 
> It's that simple.



Naruto awoke first. Plus, Sasuke admitted he lost. I'm going to be that kind of a dick and say that Naruto won, period.

But in reality, when you look at it objectively, Sasuke had to use the Bijuu to power himself up. If he didn't use the Bijuu to power up his Susano'o, he would have lost, period. (And before you go with your "Naruto has a Bijuu too" argument, I treat it like I treat Sasuke's Sharingan/Rinnegan. He was basically born and raised with it.)


----------



## JuicyG (Oct 30, 2014)

Hachibi said:


> The actual battle was a draw while Naruto won the ideological war.
> 
> It's that simple.




It is not that simple.

It is only a draw if you decide to ignore the entire fight exchanges, the situation and what was actually happening. Anyone who claims this fight was a "draw" is only looking at the end panels.

1- Naruto was not trying to kill Sasuke. If your not fighting to kill the person who is trying to kill you, then you are essentially holding back. There is no way Naruto would have been going 100% if he wasn't trying to kill Sasuke or else he was risking that happening

2- Naruto was in far worse condition than Sasuke (exhuastion wise) at the start of their fight due to the entire war, Sasuke entered the battle far later

3- Sasuke absorbs 9-Biju chakra on top of gaining more mastery of the Rinnegan and fights Naruto with only his Kurama and still can't kill him, even tell Naruto to just fall already out of frustration

4- Sasuke talking about Naruto, being jealous of his immense improvements (Why would Sasuke be jealous of someone weaker than him or even equal ?). 


Naruto > Sauske (Unless your in denial)


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## TheGreen1 (Oct 30, 2014)

JuicyG said:


> It is not that simple.
> 
> It is only a draw if you decide to ignore the entire fight exchanges, the situation and what was actually happening. Anyone who claims this fight was a "draw" is only looking at the end panels.
> 
> ...



Plus, even Sasuke admits that he's following Naruto. That Naruto walks in front of him just like Itachi. To me, that says even Sasuke realizes that Naruto is his superior.


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## Hachibi (Oct 30, 2014)

TheGreen1 said:


> Naruto awoke first. Plus, Sasuke admitted he lost. I'm going to be that kind of a dick and say that Naruto won, period.
> 
> But in reality, when you look at it objectively, Sasuke had to use the Bijuu to power himself up. If he didn't use the Bijuu to power up his Susano'o, he would have lost, period. (And before you go with your "Naruto has a Bijuu too" argument, I treat it like I treat Sasuke's Sharingan/Rinnegan. He was basically born and raised with it.)



Naruto awoking first doesn't matter when he couldn't move, and Sasuke admitted he lost because Naruto won't give up to bring him back.

Also, Naruto needed the world's natural energy to counter Sasuke's Bijuu Perfect Susano.



JuicyG said:


> It is not that simple.
> 
> It is only a draw if you decide to ignore the entire fight exchanges, the situation and what was actually happening. Anyone who claims this fight was a "draw" is only looking at the end panels.
> 
> ...



Does Naruto > Sasuke change the result of the fight or not? You're literally not refuting my points.


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## Kyu (Oct 30, 2014)

> I also think sasuke is faster due to his feat of blitzing 4 kurama avatars but overall there equal if you couldn't tell by last chapter



Naruto blitzed Kaguya.



> with Rikodou Mode. if Power ups do count





> Everything they've accomplished in every mode/state up til the most recent chapter.



They do.


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## Rocky (Oct 30, 2014)

Six-Armed RSM Naruto = Biju-juiced Sasuke > Kaguya-Fight RSM Naruto > Kaguya-Fight Sasuke > Kaguya-Fight Base Naruto.


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## JuicyG (Oct 30, 2014)

Hachibi said:


> Does Naruto > Sasuke change the result of the fight or not? You're literally not refuting my points.



Sure. If you don't want to consider who really is superior (Naruto). The battle itself, _ignoring all other things, including dialog_, was a draw. But I chose not to ignore facts and portrayal.


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Oct 30, 2014)

Rocky said:


> Six-Armed RSM Naruto = Biju-juiced Sasuke


I don't think so. If anything, Asura Mode Rikudo Senjutsu Naruto should be stronger than Biju-Susano'o Sasuke at full power considering he was nearly empty for the battle.


----------



## Hachibi (Oct 30, 2014)

JuicyG said:


> Sure. If you don't want to consider who really is superior (Naruto). The battle itself, _ignoring all other things, including dialog_, was a draw. But I chose not to ignore facts and portrayal.



I don't care if either Naruto or Sasuke is superior (when they both had restriction to boot).


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Oct 30, 2014)

Hachibi said:


> I don't care if either Naruto or Sasuke is superior (when they both had restriction to boot).


How was Sasuke restricted during his battle with Naruto? For the most point he had the advantage because he had killing intent (Naruto lacked it) _and_ his chakra reserves were relatively high compared to Naruto's low ones from fighting the entire war.


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## Hachibi (Oct 30, 2014)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> How was Sasuke restricted during his battle with Naruto? For the most point he had the advantage because he had killing intent (Naruto lacked it) _and_ his chakra reserves were relatively high compared to Naruto's low ones from fighting the entire war.



He didn't fully mastered his Rinnegan. Kurama said it himself


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## JuicyG (Oct 30, 2014)

Hachibi said:


> He didn't fully mastered his Rinnegan. Kurama said it himself




That is not a handicap. That is Sasuke's inferior ability to do so. That is Sasuke's own weakness. That in no way is the same handicap as Naruto having to fight an entire war & then fight Sasuke without bloodlust.


----------



## Hachibi (Oct 30, 2014)

JuicyG said:


> That is not a handicap. That is Sasuke's inferior ability to do so. That is Sasuke's own weakness. That in no way is the same handicap as Naruto having to fight an entire war & then fight Sasuke without bloodlust.



Funny that you ignore the fact that Sasuke didn't have the time to train his Rinnegan. Also, Sasuke forced Naruto to use his nukes and to gain the world's natural energies.


----------



## JuicyG (Oct 30, 2014)

Hachibi said:


> Funny that you ignore the fact that Sasuke didn't have the time to train his Rinnegan.



How is that a handicap just because Sasuke wasn't skilled enough to use his own abilities better ? Like seriously what is this ? That is like saying Naruto lost to pain because he wasn't able to use his KCM yet. 



Hachibi said:


> Also, Sasuke forced Naruto to use his nukes and to gain the world's natural energies.



Sasuke only forced that because he used ALL the biju to power up to Naruto's league. Naruto w/ Kurama (1 Biju) >= 8 Biju - Sasuke


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## Hachibi (Oct 30, 2014)

JuicyG said:


> How is that a handicap just because Sasuke wasn't skilled enough to use his own abilities better ? Like seriously what is this ? That is like saying Naruto lost to pain because he wasn't able to use his KCM yet.



This isn't comparable at all. You're comparing something that someone didn't have at the time to something that the user had but never got time to mastered. Can I also say that this battle was 2 vs 1 as well?



> Sasuke only forced that because he used ALL the biju to power up to Naruto's league. Naruto w/ Kurama (1 Biju) >= 8 Biju - Sasuke



You mean that with all of the bijuus the blitzed a RSM Kurama, fucked up 3 of them and managed to draw against the world's, but sure, he is on the same league as a non-world powered RSM Naruto 

Does I need to bring up that his PS Chidori stalemated RSM Kurama's Bijuudama?


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## Phemt (Oct 30, 2014)

Hachibi said:


> This isn't comparable at all. You're comparing something that someone didn't have at the time to something that the user had but never got time to mastered. *Can I also say that this battle was 2 vs 1 as well?*



Sasuke's opponent wasn't even Naruto, it was Kurama. He was essentially doing most of the fighting against Kurama. 

What is Naruto's league? The real master mind is Kurama.

The roles have been reversed. Today it's Kurama that controls Naruto, not the other way round.


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## Eliyua23 (Oct 31, 2014)

Taijutsu:


Skill - Naruto
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Naruto
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto


Ninjutsu:


Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Sasuke
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Tie
Efficiency - Naruto
Innovativeness - Naruto
Versatility - Naruto


Genjutsu:


Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke


Chakra: 


Chakra Control - Naruto
Chakra Reserves - Naruto


Mental: 


Tactics - Naruto
Insight - Naruto
Knowledge - Tie
Willpower - Naruto


Other distinct skills:

Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Naruto
Senjutsu -  Naruto


Overall - Naruto


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## Bkprince33 (Oct 31, 2014)

Are we seriously arguing one over the other ?   


*Spoiler*: __ 



the author just ended the manga with them side by side and fukin armless


 give it a rest it's clear there equals, sasuke took the biju chakra thanks to his rinnengon abilities

I didn't here one soul bitch when nagato took bee's chakra so give it a rest.

Also naruto may have stated he didn't wanna kill sasuke but sasuke put him in a position where he had to fight with all his power, if you can't see that your delusional as hell

Naruto tried to use rasengon on sasuke when sasuke was out his megazord surley that would of killed sauce or caused sever damage.


----------



## Iwanko (Feb 7, 2015)

Taijutsu:

_
Skill - Naruto
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Sasuke
Reflexes - Naruto
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto
_

Ninjutsu:

_
Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Tie
Support -Naruto
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - Naruto
Innovativeness - Naruto
Versatility - Naruto
_ 

Genjutsu:

_
Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Tie
_

Chakra: 

_
Chakra Control - Naruto
Chakra Reserves - Naruto
_

Mental: 

_
Tactics - Naruto
Insight - Tie
Knowledge - Tie
Willpower -Naruto
_

Other distinct skills:
_
Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Naruto
Senjutsu - Naruto
_

*Overall* -

Sasuke - 4
Naruto - 17
Tie - 4

Naruto is the winner


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 8, 2015)

Depends if Sasuke's feats with bijuus are allowed.

If not then Naruto beats him at all but genjutsu...and maybe chakra manipulation given what Sasuke did with bijuu chakra which was compared to Hagoromo's feat. And I guess Sasuke could be better with weapons but that could appear so only due to Naruto hardly ever fighting with any weapons. Taijutsu a bit hard to tell as they fought to a standstill but maybe Naruto cannot use his Frog Fu at his best without SM.

If bijuus are allowed then Naruto only beats him at physical feats like durability and physical strength given his super mode, are equal in ninjutsu feats, equal at taijutsu and Sasuke is better at genjutsu. Ah, and Naruto is much better at support in any case.


----------



## Raiken (Feb 8, 2015)

Taijutsu:

_
Skill - Sasuke
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Equal
Reflexes - Sasuke
Durability - Equal
Resilience - Equal
_

Ninjutsu:

_
Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Naruto
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Sasuke 
Efficiency - Equal
Innovativeness - Equal
Versatility - Equal
_ 

Genjutsu:

_
Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke
_

Chakra: 

_
Chakra Control - Equal
Chakra Reserves - Naruto
_

Mental: 

_
Tactics - Equal
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower - Naruto
_

Other distinct skills:
_
Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke 
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Equal
Senjutsu - Naruto
_

*Overall* - Naruto


----------



## jorge2060 88 (Feb 8, 2015)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> How was Sasuke restricted during his battle with Naruto? For the most point he had the advantage because he had killing intent (Naruto lacked it) _and_ his chakra reserves were relatively high compared to Naruto's low ones from fighting the entire war.



Sasuke had just unlocked his rinegan and because of that couldn't use it to its fullest potential in his fight against naruto.

As hachib said neither one was at the peak of their potential when they fought


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## Bloo (Feb 8, 2015)

*Taijutsu:*
Skill - Sasuke
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Naruto
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto


*Ninjutsu:*
Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Sasuke
Support - Naruto (Datclones are the ultimate support)
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - Naruto
Innovativeness - Naruto
Versatility - Sasuke


*Genjutsu:*
Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke


*Chakra:* 
Chakra Control - Naruto
Chakra Reserves - Naruto


*Mental:* 
Tactics - Sasuke
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower - Naruto


*Other distinct skills:*
Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Sasuke
Senjutsu - Naruto


*Overall - Naruto (14 > 11)*


----------



## Max Thunder (Feb 9, 2015)

JuicyG said:


> That is not a handicap. That is Sasuke's inferior ability to do so. That is Sasuke's own weakness. That in no way is the same handicap as Naruto having to fight an entire war & then fight Sasuke without bloodlust.





So it's not a handicap that Sasuke doesn't have a seperate entity inside him gathering and giving intel during the entire battle for him?


----------



## sabre320 (Feb 9, 2015)

Max Thunder said:


> So it's not a handicap that Sasuke doesn't have a seperate entity inside him gathering and giving intel during the entire battle for him?



Isnt that sasukes weakness in him not being truly able to harness the power of the bijuu willingly? the true power of a jinchuriki is to cooperate with the bijuu sasuke could not truly harness that not to mention whats laughable is the argument that only naruto has external help in his powerups he got itachis eyes did he not and did he not gain a powerup from all the bijuu including the freaking half of the kurama just like naruto? and still could only stalemate naruto


----------



## sabre320 (Feb 9, 2015)

jorge2060 88 said:


> Sasuke had just unlocked his rinegan and because of that couldn't use it to its fullest potential in his fight against naruto.
> 
> As hachib said neither one was at the peak of their potential when they fought



well same could be said of naruto could it not he had not unlocked the full potential of his senjutsu and bijuu abilities as he displayed none of the bijuu abilities against sasuke like steam release that overpowered kaguya..sasuke had the strength of the bijuu to draw on including an identical kurama just like in naruto thats as favourable as its gonna get..


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## Max Thunder (Feb 9, 2015)

sabre320 said:


> Isnt that sasukes weakness in him not being truly able to harness the power of the bijuu willingly? the true power of a jinchuriki is to cooperate with the bijuu sasuke could not truly harness that not to mention whats laughable is the argument that only naruto has external help in his powerups he got itachis eyes did he not and did he not gain a powerup from all the bijuu including the freaking half of the kurama just like naruto? and still could only stalemate naruto



Except it's completely different to get eyes as opposed to an intelligent being giving you chakra and advice so I still don't see your point. There's no comparison.

If Sasuke took the bijuus chakra by force shouldn't he have used their power too? Yet he only used his own elements so, again, what's your point?

The bijuus are none of their powers except Kurama being 'considered' Naruto's they both had access to foreign chakra but only used their own. Except Naruto who still used Kurama to gather more foreign power for him so, again, what's your point?

Come back when you have better arguments.

Naruto being fatigued isn't a handicap.

A handicap is fighting one against 2. And then 1 against 4 or 5 or whatever and still dealing with it (like Sasuke did )


----------



## The Pirate on Wheels (Feb 9, 2015)

Are you the dupe Thunder uses when he pulls out all the stops and unleashes his personality?

OT: They drew so I guess they're even.


----------



## Patrick (Feb 10, 2015)

Taijutsu: Naruto 4 - Sasuke 2


Skill - Sasuke
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Sasuke
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto


Ninjutsu: Naruto 2 - Sasuke 5


Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Sasuke
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - Sasuke
Innovativeness - Sasuke
Versatility - Sasuke


Genjutsu: Naruto 0 - Sasuke 2


Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke


Chakra: Naruto 1 - Sasuke 1


Chakra Control - Sasuke
Chakra Reserves - Naruto


Mental: Naruto 1 - Sasuke 3


Tactics - Sasuke
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower - Naruto


Other distinct skills: Naruto 2 - Sasuke 2

Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Sasuke
Senjutsu - Naruto


Overall: Naruto 10 - Sasuke 15

It seems I'm one of the few to actually get Sasuke as the winner here. Probably because I favor Sasuke more in Mental and Ninjutsu than most. Sasuke was always inventing like crazy. Over the timeskip Naruto made a bigger Rasengan, while Sasuke was creating all sorts of new Jutsu like multiple Chidori variations, a new Katon and of course Kirin. I also see him as more versatile since he can match up to Naruto in Tai and Ninjutsu but is multiple times his superior in Genjutsu and Bukijutsu. 

I also feel that Naruto's tactics and insight are a bit overrated. Look at Sasuke's fights with Deidara, Itachi and Danzo. Especially against Deidara he was a tactical monster. Picking Naruto over Sasuke in knowledge is also an odd choice, since Naruto is as dumb as a brick.


----------



## Bonly (Feb 10, 2015)

Patrick said:


> Sasuke was always inventing like crazy. Over the timeskip Naruto made a bigger Rasengan, while Sasuke was creating all sorts of new Jutsu like multiple Chidori variations, a new Katon and of course Kirin.



Sure but the reverse can be said later on in the series. Mostly everything Sasuke invented was during the timeskip but after his Hebi days what new jutsu did Sasuke get? Ama,Enton,Susanoo and that's about it for the most part, at least that's all I really remember. Naruto on the other hand after the time skip went to use Futon Rasengan,FRS, an even bigger Rasengan(as if he needed another one of those lol),  a huge ass FRS, SM, frog kata, mini FRS, Wakusei Rasengan, Rasenkyūgan, Rasenrangan, Bijuudama, Chō Mini Bijūdama, along with Naruto being able to use the other Bijuu power for jutsu such as a Yoton RS, Jiton Rasengan, ect along with some more jutsu which I'm honestly to lazy to list but you get the point. 

So sure Sasuke was inventing like crazy during the time skip but he slowed down later on while on the other hand Naruto started off slow during the time skip but went crazy afterwords. At the very least they should get a tie here imo.



> I also see him as more versatile since he can match up to Naruto in Tai and Ninjutsu but is multiple times his superior in Genjutsu and Bukijutsu.



Naruto's a bit more versatile with the whole being able to use the other Bijuu powers and clone usage along with constantly getting Kurama from the most part.



> I also feel that Naruto's tactics and insight are a bit overrated. Look at Sasuke's fights with Deidara, Itachi and Danzo. Especially against Deidara he was a tactical monster.



Naruto has been showing good tactics that when add all of them up, they should be around Sasuke's tactics. Naruto's the one who came up with the plan that saved the SA when Obito was gonna nuke everyone to hell, Naruto came up with the tactic to have the Sandaime Raikage hit himself, Naruto came up with the tactic to trick Kaguya with a shitload of clones, he came up with multiple good tactical plans when fighting pain, ect. there's more but I'd be here for an half an hour mentioning all of the tactics he's come up with so meh 



> Picking Naruto over Sasuke in knowledge is also an odd choice, since Naruto is as dumb as a brick.



Naruto has been constantly gaining knowledge on things through the use of his clones through out the war and Naruto is battle smart so people may be going with that


----------



## sabre320 (Feb 10, 2015)

Max Thunder said:


> Except it's completely different to get eyes as opposed to an intelligent being giving you chakra and advice so I still don't see your point. There's no comparison.
> 
> If Sasuke took the bijuus chakra by force shouldn't he have used their power too? Yet he only used his own elements so, again, what's your point?
> 
> ...



this is laughable so still sasuke fans are whining about naruto having kurama....you do realize that sasuke had the chakra of nine biju including an identical kurama so how you can claim that naruto having one kurama is some kind of upset is beyond me..and are you seriously complaining of naruto using shadow clones for multiplae avatars nature energy is his strength senjutsu he learned it kurama never gathered nature energy before interacting with naruto not to mention naruto having to balance the nature energy....worst of all naruto  would have no need to gather that nature energy if he wasnt already exhausted and running low from his fights against kaguya and the war he used far more attacks and was far more involved in the fight and in the war on the otherside sasuke got a boost from 9 bijuu and still ur crying abt narutos advantage


----------



## Max Thunder (Feb 10, 2015)

sabre320 said:


> this is laughable so still sasuke fans are whining about naruto having kurama....you do realize that sasuke had the chakra of nine biju including an identical kurama so how you can claim that naruto having one kurama is some kind of upset is beyond me..and are you seriously complaining of naruto using shadow clones for multiplae avatars nature energy is his strength senjutsu he learned it kurama never gathered nature energy before interacting with naruto not to mention naruto having to balance the nature energy....worst of all naruto  would have no need to gather that nature energy if he wasnt already exhausted and running low from his fights against kaguya and the war he used far more attacks and was far more involved in the fight and in the war on the otherside sasuke got a boost from 9 bijuu and still ur crying abt narutos advantage




Okay first of all, please use punctuation and correct grammar it's quite complicated to read what you're writing. I could call you unintelligent but I really don't want to overestimate you.


Who's complaining? I'm stating facts, whether Naruto has Kurama or not isn't the issue we're talking about being handicapped. You could say Naruto got more exhausted all you want that still doesn't take the away the fact that Sasuke was also exhausted. Not to mention Naruto's chakra reserves are much bigger than Sasuke's and he still has Kurama's chakra on top of that so *how the fuck* could you even know who had more chakra or was more exhausted at the start of the battle when you have no fucking idea?

All you're doing here is speculating you pulling all that shit out of your arse in order to excuse your favourite character which is hilarious actually...

An actual handicap is 1 when 1 brain or one mind is pitted against 2.

Or when 1 body is pitted against 4. 

Guess what? Both of these situations were present in the fight yet Naruto still couldn't get the upper hand.

But you want to talk about the boost? Getting a "boost" from the nine bijuu that didn't even do shit apart from making his PS more powerful not to mention how Naruto already had nine bijuu chakra anyway so it was actually levelling the field. Not only Sasuke's PS got boosted though Naruto's avatar did too, or did you not notice?

Take that away though, they both exchanged blows in base and where was Naruto's superiority? That's what I thought, nowhere.

Again, come back with better arguments.

Also, instead of claiming I'm complaining, spend more time working on that grammar and argument presentation.


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## Max Thunder (Feb 10, 2015)

Patrick said:


> Taijutsu: Naruto 4 - Sasuke 2
> 
> 
> Skill - Sasuke
> ...



It really shouldn't surprise you when Naruto fans are heavily biased towards Naruto. 

90% of the people who posted and voted in this thread are widely known and self-acknowledged Naruto wankers...


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## Mercurial (Feb 10, 2015)

Taijutsu: Naruto 5 - Sasuke 0


Skill - Draw (Sasuke has more finesse, Naruto has mastered Frog Fu as a style)
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Naruto (just compare Sasuke blitzed by Kaguya's S/T with Naruto that reacted and dodged it, even if barely, with Kaguya hyping up his reflexes and speed)
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto


Ninjutsu: Naruto 2 - Sasuke 4


Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Sasuke
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - Sasuke
Innovativeness - Sasuke
Versatility - Draw (remember that Naruto has Gudodama too, while Sasuke doesn't)


Genjutsu: Naruto 0 - Sasuke 2


Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke


Chakra: Naruto 2 - Sasuke 0


Chakra Control - Naruto
Chakra Reserves - Naruto


Mental: Naruto 1 - Sasuke 2


Tactics - Draw
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower - Naruto


Other distinct skills: Naruto 2 - Sasuke 1

Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Draw
Senjutsu - Naruto


Overall: Naruto 12 - Sasuke 9


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## sabre320 (Feb 10, 2015)

Max Thunder said:


> Okay first of all, please use punctuation and correct grammar it's quite complicated to read what you're writing. I could call you unintelligent but I really don't want to overestimate you.
> 
> 
> Who's complaining? I'm stating facts, whether Naruto has Kurama or not isn't the issue we're talking about being handicapped. You could say Naruto got more exhausted all you want that still doesn't take the away the fact that Sasuke was also exhausted. Not to mention Naruto's chakra reserves are much bigger than Sasuke's and he still has Kurama's chakra on top of that so *how the fuck* could you even know who had more chakra or was more exhausted at the start of the battle when you have no fucking idea?
> ...



jesus freaking christ we got a grammar nazi here...

shadow clones are narutos own jutsu why wouldnt he use them? naruto had a small portion of chakra from the nine bijuu which was already running out..

naruto could not use the unique abilities of the bijuu because they were being used by sasuke...

that boost is narutos own goddamn power senjutsu he is a sage who can balance nature energy why wouldnt he use senjutsu to build up his chakra?

without the bijuu sasuke wouldnt really stand a chance ....multiple bm avatars vs one sasuke utilizng bijudama rasenhuriken do the math and lets not even bring ashura avatar into this ..


----------



## Max Thunder (Feb 11, 2015)

sabre320 said:


> jesus freaking christ we got a grammar nazi here...
> 
> shadow clones are narutos own jutsu why wouldnt he use them? naruto had a small portion of chakra from the nine bijuu which was already running out..
> 
> ...




It's his power sure.

But he got someone else to gather it for him.

Who said Naruto can't use shadow clones?

He uses them because that's the way he fights but he obviously needs more of him to have that advantage in battle deal with it.

Sasuke also took the bijuus power and molded it with his own does that make it his own power?

Sasuke didn't even use the unique abilities of the bijuu...

Well taking into consideration that Sasuke countered a bijuddama with a simple chidori...

I'm sure he could counter the others with a mere enton arrow which he can spam.

Not to mention all the other counters he has for that situation like teleporting away.

Also, shadow clones aren't even that effective, the both times Naruto used them against Sasuke they got dealt with, so if Naruto seperates his chakra even more it's a death sentence, plus, it wouldn't be a very wise choice to make against Sasuke seen as that would just give him thousands of possible targets he could switch with.

The only reason they even worked against Kaguya was because he used a gay ass distraction method.

Sexy jutsu isn't going to work on Sasuke...

Ashura avatar isn't even that great of an upgrade in power what fucking difference would it actually make?

4 Ashura avatars got bitch slapped by the PS.


----------



## TheGreen1 (Feb 11, 2015)

JuicyG said:


> Fūinjutsu - Sasuke




Hold up, when did Sasuke ever use any sort of Sealing Techniques outside of the handseals that Hagoromo gave him? Naruto's at least shown a few with his own Shiki Fuuin seal, plus the sealing abilities of having a bit of Shukaku in him.

I wouldn't have an issue conceding the point since both really didn't use Fuuinjutsu. However, from what I've seen, Naruto has a pretty big edge here.


----------



## sabre320 (Feb 11, 2015)

Max Thunder said:


> It's his power sure.
> 
> But he got someone else to gather it for him.
> 
> ...



naruto used shadow clones against bijuu amplified ps and they formed avatarsthey were more then usefull...

ashura avatars were never bitchslapped wtf are u on abt there was only one ashura avatar when naruto merged all the avatars and that avatar matched sasukes amped ps strongest attack how is sasuke supposed to win against something his bijuamped sussano could only stale mate?


----------



## sabre320 (Feb 11, 2015)

TheGreen1 said:


> Hold up, when did Sasuke ever use any sort of Sealing Techniques outside of the handseals that Hagoromo gave him? Naruto's at least shown a few with his own Shiki Fuuin seal, plus the sealing abilities of having a bit of Shukaku in him.
> 
> I wouldn't have an issue conceding the point since both really didn't use Fuuinjutsu. However, from what I've seen, Naruto has a pretty big edge here.



i also find this pretty wierd sasuke has no sealing jutsu while naruto has rikudos seal that he used against kurama and shukakus seal ect..


----------



## Patrick (Feb 11, 2015)

Bonly said:


> Sure but the reverse can be said later on in the series. Mostly everything Sasuke invented was during the timeskip but after his Hebi days what new jutsu did Sasuke get? Ama,Enton,Susanoo and that's about it for the most part, at least that's all I really remember. Naruto on the other hand after the time skip went to use Futon Rasengan,FRS, an even bigger Rasengan(as if he needed another one of those lol),  a huge ass FRS, SM, frog kata, mini FRS, Wakusei Rasengan, Rasenkyūgan, Rasenrangan, Bijuudama, Chō Mini Bijūdama, along with Naruto being able to use the other Bijuu power for jutsu such as a Yoton RS, Jiton Rasengan, ect along with some more jutsu which I'm honestly to lazy to list but you get the point.
> 
> So sure Sasuke was inventing like crazy during the time skip but he slowed down later on while on the other hand Naruto started off slow during the time skip but went crazy afterwords. At the very least they should get a tie here imo.
> 
> ...



I think you might be misinterpreting the terms Versatility and innovativeness a bit. Being versatile means having a lot of options. Naruto pretty much has close range blitz or long range nuke. Sasuke just has a lot more options to attack. You also listed a lot of Naruto's new moves but a lot of those moves already existed. Sasuke actually created new techniques and expanded on already existing ones. Fuuton Rasengan was thought to Naruto, Cho Oodama Rasengan was a product of his Senjutsu, just like his bigger FRS, Sage Mode was thought to him, Frog Kata was thought to him, his mini FRS is only a product of putting less chakra in it, Wakusei Rasengan was a product of KCM, Bijuudama already existed. The only move Naruto really invented on his own was FRS and to a lesser extent Rasenrangan. 

In knowledge and tactics a case could be made for Naruto but I just see Sasuke as superior in those categories.


----------



## TheGreen1 (Feb 11, 2015)

Patrick said:


> I think you might be misinterpreting the terms Versatility and innovativeness a bit. Being versatile means having a lot of options. Naruto pretty much has close range blitz or long range nuke. Sasuke just has a lot more options to attack. You also listed a lot of Naruto's new moves but a lot of those moves already existed. Sasuke actually created new techniques and expanded on already existing ones. Fuuton Rasengan was thought to Naruto, Cho Oodama Rasengan was a product of his Senjutsu, just like his bigger FRS, Sage Mode was thought to him, Frog Kata was thought to him, his mini FRS is only a product of putting less chakra in it, Wakusei Rasengan was a product of KCM, Bijuudama already existed. The only move Naruto really invented on his own was FRS and to a lesser extent Rasenrangan.
> 
> In knowledge and tactics a case could be made for Naruto but I just see Sasuke as superior in those categories.



Those moves, are creations of his. Naruto has created more techniques than Sasuke in my opinion, who has Chidori Nagashi, Kirin, and whatever his Enton moves are. However, that's not saying that Sasuke didn't create new techniques. But let's face it, Outside of his Enton moves, they're all extensions of Chidori. (Though I suppose you could Argue Kirin.)

Basically, Kaguya was the first time I ever saw Sasuke using sealing.


----------



## Bonly (Feb 11, 2015)

Patrick said:


> I think you might be misinterpreting the terms Versatility and innovativeness a bit. Being versatile means having a lot of options. Naruto pretty much has close range blitz or long range nuke. Sasuke just has a lot more options to attack.



What lol? How does Sasuke have more options to attack then Naruto? 



> You also listed a lot of Naruto's new moves but a lot of those moves already existed. Sasuke actually created new techniques and expanded on already existing ones.



And Sasuke is different from Naruto here? All he did was make Kirin and came up with some Chidori variants. What did Naruto make? He made FRS and came up with some Rasengan variants. So what did Sasuke do that makes him better then Naruto here?



> Fuuton Rasengan was thought to Naruto, Cho Oodama Rasengan was a product of his Senjutsu, just like his bigger FRS, Sage Mode was thought to him, Frog Kata was thought to him, his mini FRS is only a product of putting less chakra in it, Wakusei Rasengan was a product of KCM, Bijuudama already existed. The only move Naruto really invented on his own was FRS and to a lesser extent Rasenrangan.



So basically because Naruto made those in another form or had help in getting it you wanna dismiss it and only count FRS yet Sasuke who trained with Orochi and was experimented on doesn't get the same treatment even though there is a good chance he also had help over the two and a half year time skip? 



> In knowledge and tactics a case could be made for Naruto but I just see Sasuke as superior in those categories.



I'll take it.


----------



## TheGreen1 (Feb 11, 2015)

Bonly said:


> I'll take it.



Eh, I'll give it to Sasuke for knowledge. Sasuke is many things, but stupid is not one of them. He just makes stupid decisions when he's fueled by his emotions. 

Tactics however... that's Naruto's game. Granted, Sasuke has used tactics to win fights, but Naruto's have just been shown more. Against Pain, against the 3rd Raikage. Against Juubito. Sage Mode Naruto's brainpower and brains is just simply astounding.


----------



## Patrick (Feb 11, 2015)

TheGreen1 said:


> Those moves, are creations of his. Naruto has created more techniques than Sasuke in my opinion, who has Chidori Nagashi, Kirin, and whatever his Enton moves are. However, that's not saying that Sasuke didn't create new techniques. But let's face it, Outside of his Enton moves, they're all extensions of Chidori. (Though I suppose you could Argue Kirin.)
> 
> Basically, Kaguya was the first time I ever saw Sasuke using sealing.



Indra's arrow might also be his own creation and the Katon he used to set up Kirin was definitely his original move as well. 



Bonly said:


> What lol? How does Sasuke have more options to attack then Naruto?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Sasuke can throw his Katons from afar, a couple of options with his Raiton (blitz, mid range spear, Nagashi bait), Genjutsu of course, mid range tactical offense with his weapons. Just in general Sasuke has more ways to go about attacking than Naruto. 

Look at my response to green for your second point.


----------



## TheGreen1 (Feb 11, 2015)

Patrick said:


> Indra's arrow might also be his own creation and the Katon he used to set up Kirin was definitely his original move as well.



What Katon was it? I was under the assumption it was the firefight, and by firefight I mean literal fight with fire, between Itachi and Sasuke that gave Sasuke the right conditions for Kirin.

Indra's arrow... sure why not. I always thought though that this was an upgrade of the standard Arrow's firing from Susano'o.


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## Bonly (Feb 11, 2015)

Patrick said:


> Sasuke can throw his Katons from afar,



Naruto can throw his FRS or any of the nine Bijuu influenced RS he can throw along with clone. 



> a couple of options with his Raiton (blitz, mid range spear, Nagashi bait),



A clone of Naruto got some chakra from Kurama and could do this. All the clones at the front had a Cho Odama Rasengan in order to stop Madara's Mokuton attacks. Think about how much chakra Kurama gave that Naruto clone(who only had about 13 percent of chakra from the get go) in order to make all those clones, let all the clones at the front use a Cho Odama Rasengan and had a few clones walking ontop of other clones were holding a Cho Odama Rasengan. Just think about all the options that are opened up to him.



> Genjutsu of course,



Naruto has the power of multiple Kekkei Genkai of course



> mid range tactical offense with his weapons.



Naruto has clones which along with all of his jutsu gives him great mid range tactical offense.



> Just in general Sasuke has more ways to go about attacking than Naruto.



So far you haven't really given much to make anyone think that.



> Look at my response to green for your second point.
> 
> Indra's arrow might also be his own creation and the Katon he used to set up Kirin was definitely his original move as well.



Madara used the same fire jutsu(or one that looks alot like it) but on a smaller scale against the Kages IIRC so that seems like it would more so fit in the "expanded on already existing ones" spot. Indra's arrow might be


----------



## Patrick (Feb 11, 2015)

Bonly said:


> Naruto can throw his FRS or any of the nine Bijuu influenced RS he can throw along with clone.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You do understand that I'm talking about who's more versatile and not who's stronger, right? You give examples of Naruto creating clones and then using either Rasengan or FRS. What kind of options other than barrage does that give him? Also having an Elemental Kekkai Genkai (all of which have only been used as upgrades to his Rasengan, which in turn give him absolutely no new means of attacking). 

Goryuka is a Sasuke exclusive move btw. He created it on his own to supplement his Kirin and Madara never showed anything similar.


----------



## Bonly (Feb 11, 2015)

Patrick said:


> You do understand that I'm talking about who's more versatile and not who's stronger, right?



Yup



> You give examples of Naruto creating clones and then using either Rasengan or FRS.



I also gave examples of a clone being the main force behind putting down the Sandaime among a few others. 



> What kind of options other than barrage does that give him?



The clones can do what Naruto can do for the most part. That means they give him the option to feint somebody like he did with Kaguya and many others. That means they give him the option to attack from mid range with their chakra arms while holding jutsu. That means they can use KG abilities along with using Kurama's Avatar which in in itself is a good defense. A clone of Naruto brought Obito back from the dead more or less for Itachi's sake(dear lord lets not think about chakra sharing when it comes to fighting on teams. If you don't see that clones gives him more options of attacking from all ranges as well as provide some good ass defense as well as provide great support by now there it's just a case of you not wanting to give credit to Naruto.



> Also having an Elemental Kekkai Genkai (all of which have only been used as upgrades to his Rasengan, which in turn give him absolutely no new means of attacking).



Naruto using Futton aloud him to overpower Kaguya. So you're wrong in saying that he only used them to upgrade his Rasengans() and he can use Shukaku''s Jiton for a sealing jutsu which gives him a new means of attacking as it'll seal a person.



> Goryuka is a Sasuke exclusive move btw. He created it on his own to supplement his Kirin and Madara never showed anything similar.



Here it is. Look at that jutsu then look at Sasuke's Katon that he used to finish setting up Kirin, the look like the same jutsu with the only difference being that Sasuke's is bigger so yeah Madara showed something similar.


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## Patrick (Feb 11, 2015)

Bonly said:


> Yup
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I still don't see how you think that having clones > Genjutsu, multiple applications of two elemental ninjutsus, well versed with weapons, eye techniques. Then I didn't even begin to talk about the Rinnegan yet. That thing on it's own makes someone more versatile than Naruto. 

It's not that I don't want to give Naruto credit but it has always been the way that Naruto compensates Sasuke's skill with pure power. 

I do have to admit that Naruto is superior in sealing and that Madara indeed had Sasuke's Jutsu as well (though that does not mean Sasuke didn't learn it on his own). I'm not really that knowledgable in the war arc, since I mostly skimmed through that godawful arc.


----------



## Max Thunder (Feb 11, 2015)

sabre320 said:


> naruto used shadow clones against bijuu amplified ps and they formed avatarsthey were more then usefull...
> 
> ashura avatars were never bitchslapped wtf are u on abt there was only one ashura avatar when naruto merged all the avatars and that avatar matched sasukes amped ps strongest attack how is sasuke supposed to win against something his bijuamped sussano could only stale mate?



They were useful? They used bijuu bombs and it didn't do anything 

So much for your original theory...

I meant 4 kurama avatars.

Also considering how Ashura avatar is the equivalent of the PS susanoo. I.e Indra vs Ashura I'm pretty sure it's entirely possible, you're the one that's making it out to be more than it actually is here...

Ashura avatar was literally the clones coming together there was no upgrade in power output whatsoever...

Naruto was amped by the 9 bijuu (still had their chakra left) and then the natural energy that someone else was gathering for him last minute so what's your point?


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## Ashi (Feb 11, 2015)

Max Thunder said:


> They were useful? They used bijuu bombs and it didn't do anything
> 
> So much for your original theory...
> 
> ...



Naruto was down to Kurama's energy which only let him use his basic moves not the ones he used against Kaguya or Madara


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## sabre320 (Feb 12, 2015)

Max Thunder said:


> They were useful? They used bijuu bombs and it didn't do anything
> 
> So much for your original theory...
> 
> ...



okay ur going full sasuke fanboy lol 

one simple bsm avatar was easily matching sasukes simple ps with one tail he blocked sasukes ps sword strike naruto was holding back when sasuke used chidori naruto could have used frs or bdrs he could have made 4 avatars or made the ashura avatar get it...not to mention he was down to kuramas chakra he couldnt use thebiju rasenshuriken like against kaguya..

naruto matched sasuke with all the biju if sasuke does not have all the biju he loses


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## Roman (Feb 12, 2015)

*Taijutsu:*

Skill - Sasuke (barely makes the cut when you consider Naruto's frog kata)
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Tie
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto

Naruto: 4 | Sasuke: 1 | Tie: 1


*Ninjutsu:*

Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Sasuke
Support - Tie
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - Tie
Innovativeness - Naruto
Versatility - Sasuke

Naruto: 2 | Sasuke: 3 | Tie: 2


*Genjutsu:*

Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Tie (Sasuke's Sharingan gives him a good defense but I wager Kyuubi and Sage mode together really help Naruto as well)

Naruto: 0 | Sasuke: 1 | Tie: 1


*Chakra:*

Chakra Control - Naruto (Sage chakra by definition requires top-tier chakra control)
Chakra Reserves - Naruto

Naruto: 2 | Sasuke: 0 | Tie: 0


*Mental:*

Tactics - Naruto (Sasuke might've come out on top in part 1, but Naruto has demonstrated strategic thinking more frequently in part 2 overall)
Insight - Naruto
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower - Naruto

Naruto: 3 | Sasuke: 1 | Tie: 0


*Other distinct skills:*

Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Sasuke
Senjutsu - N/A (I don't want to rate this because it's an unfair advantage in the form of a free point to Naruto given that Sasuke doesn't use Senjutsu, and curse seal doesn't count).

Naruto: 1 | Sasuke: 2 | Tie: 0


*Overall*

Naruto: 12 | Sasuke: 8 | Tie: 4


----------



## Max Thunder (Feb 13, 2015)

sabre320 said:


> okay ur going full sasuke fanboy lol
> 
> one simple bsm avatar was easily matching sasukes simple ps with one tail he blocked sasukes ps sword strike naruto was holding back when sasuke used chidori naruto could have used frs or bdrs he could have made 4 avatars or made the ashura avatar get it...not to mention he was down to kuramas chakra he couldnt use thebiju rasenshuriken like against kaguya..
> 
> naruto matched sasuke with all the biju if sasuke does not have all the biju he loses



One simple PS was matching BSM avatar.
Buffed PS bitchslapped 4 of those BSM avatars though...

You mean the tails that can level mountains?

How is it supposed to be something amazing that tails that can level mountains can block swords that can cut mountains?

You're going full Narutard here boy....

He wasn't down to Kurama's chakra until the end.

"The bijuu chakra inside you is running out" - Sasuke.


One of Naruto's best attacks got blocked by a Chidori and that's a *fact*.
"But... but... Naruto could used this and that instead'
And instead of Chidori Sasuke could have used a number of other jutsu so what's your point?

Bijuudama don't do shit to Sasuke, it's in the fucking manga 

If Naruto uses Rasenshuriken Sasuke can block it in midflight with an arrow...

Madara had to be taken out of his Susanoo to be hit with a Rasenshuriken so what the fuck is it gonna do to Sasuke's PS?

You dream too much 

All those attacks you stated wouldn't do shit and if Sasuke for some reason didn't have PS's defense he'd just absorb RS with his Rinnegan...

What's your point again?

Honestly, you're about a chromosome short of being normal...


----------



## Arles Celes (Feb 13, 2015)

sabre320 said:


> okay ur going full sasuke fanboy lol
> 
> one simple bsm avatar was easily matching sasukes simple ps with one tail he blocked sasukes ps sword strike naruto was holding back when sasuke used chidori naruto could have used frs or bdrs he could have made 4 avatars or made the ashura avatar get it...not to mention he was down to kuramas chakra he couldnt use thebiju rasenshuriken like against kaguya..
> 
> naruto matched sasuke with all the biju if sasuke does not have all the biju he loses



If Naruto used bijuu FRS then Sasuke would either teleport out of the way or fly to not get hit. I doubt he would try for a contest of sheer power in such scenario just like Minato wouldn't try to stop bijuudamas with a rasengan.

As for the avatars we already heard from Obito that a RSM clone is weaker than the real one. Kaguya casually "killed" 100s if not 1000s of said clones but got some trouble against the real one. Since the Kurama avatars after "splitting" only got a part of Naruto's power they are weaker than his original Kurama avatar. After the explosion caused by Sasuke's chidori sembon those Kurama avatars lost arms and tails which did make them crippled. Which is why Naruto decided to make them merge to make up for their weakness. Both Naruto's Avatar and Sasuke PS did not regenerate after their first clash which implies that chakra avatars take long to "heal" or even need to be constructed anew.

And even if Naruto lost the ability to use other bijuus during the fight(which makes no sense as their chakra was still there so the only reason could be due to them being in Sasuke's genjutsu) his Kurama bijuu FRS looks still more powerful than the other FRS variants that the other bijuus offer. Madara could even sorta "tank" one.


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## TheGreen1 (Feb 13, 2015)

Freedan said:


> *Other distinct skills:*
> 
> Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
> Sensing - Naruto
> ...



Again, what are you basing your fuuinjutsu on with Sasuke? Sasuke has never shown any ability or skill with Fuuinjutsu. I don't mind being proven wrong with manga showings, but I don't know why everyone has this stupid fucking idea that Sasuke has any ability in Fuuinjutsu.  Having part of Shukaku with his cursed seal body alone gives Naruto the edge here.


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## Iwanko (Feb 15, 2015)

> I also feel that Naruto's tactics and insight are a bit overrated. Look at Sasuke's fights with Deidara, Itachi and Danzo. Especially against Deidara he was a tactical monster.


Were it Sharinnegan Sasuke fights? No.  





> Picking Naruto over Sasuke in knowledge is also an odd choice, since Naruto is as dumb as a brick.


 RSM Naruto has universal comprehension of all things


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## heartsutra (Feb 15, 2015)

Freedan said:


> *Mental:*
> 
> Tactics - Naruto (Sasuke might've come out on top in part 1, but Naruto has demonstrated strategic thinking more frequently in part 2 overall)
> Insight - Naruto
> ...




I feel like it should be at least a tie concerning tactics.
Every time Sasuke fights someone that is not Naruto, he deliberately spends time to analyze (Sasuke vs. Deidara, for example Sasuke vs. Danzo).
Well. The Madara fight where he got himself stabbed & kinda dies () is the only exception I am aware of, tho & I am not counting fillers. 
Naruto on the other hand is easier to trigger, more impulsive & goes by trial and error & if he fails, he resorts to some kind of strategy. 

& Maybe another tie regarding defensive Genjutsu.


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## Panther (Feb 15, 2015)

Taijutsu:

_
Skill - Naruto ( he actually learned a fighting style with frog kata )
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto ( Blitzed Kaguya while Sasuke got casually countered )
Reflexes - Naruto ( Reacted to Kaguya's and Sasuke's ST )
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto
_

Ninjutsu:

_
Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Tie ( only because of Sasuke's bijuu powered PS is it a tie )
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Tie
Efficiency - Tie 
Innovativeness - Tie
Versatility - Naruto
_ 

Genjutsu:

_
Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Tie ( Naruto has all the chakra of all nine Bijuu's and casually saw trough Sasuke's genjutsu when he used it on Sakura, not to mention Sasuke didn't bother to use it in their last fight implying that it would be a waste of time)
_

Chakra: 

_
Chakra Control - Naruto
Chakra Reserves - Naruto
_

Mental: 

_
Tactics - Tie ( Zabuza, Kakuzu, Pain. These fights put naruto on the same lvl as Sauce )
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Naruto
Willpower - Naruto
_

Other distinct skills:
_
Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Naruto ( Has used Rikudou's seal to seal Kurama during their fight and can now use Shukaku's sealing jutsu too which is superior than anything Sasuke has shown which Kakashi's Copier sealing jutsu against CS from part one and his summoning seals for his shuriken which isn't remotely impressive )
Senjutsu - Naruto
_

*Overall* 

Naruto - 16

Sasuke - 3

Tie - 6


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## Alex Payne (Feb 15, 2015)

Taijutsu:

_
*Skill* - Naruto(Frog Kata)
*Physical Strength* - Naruto
*Speed* - Sasuke(S/T)
*Reflexes* - Naruto
*Durability* - Naruto
*Resilience* - Naruto
_

Ninjutsu:

_
*Destructive Capacity* - Tie(Both have a massive amount of different nukes)
*Defensive* - Sasuke(Susano + S/T)
*Support* - Naruto(Chakra Sharing)
*Casting Speed* - Sasuke(Dojutsu abilities are mostly seal-less)
*Efficiency* - Sasuke(Naruto is more about clone spam and powerful AoE offense while Sauce was able to make MS jutsu Kagutsuchi more efficient after getting EMS)
*Innovativeness* - Naruto(He does a lot of creative things with his limited arsenal)
*Versatility* - Sasuke(genjutsu, moves which covers all ranges, S/T, two sets of summons)
_ 

Genjutsu:

_
*Offense* - Sasuke
*Defense* - Sasuke
_

Chakra: 

_
*Chakra Control* - Tie(Sauce was below before showing Hagoromo-level biju channeling)
*Chakra Reserves* - Naruto
_

Mental: 

_
*Tactics* - Tie(both had their moments)
*Insight* - Sasuke(Sasuke showed good insight more often while Naruto went retarded in the middle of the fights(Edo Nagato, Obito))
*Knowledge* - Sasuke(Spending time with Orochimaru gave him more practical knowledge than Naruto traveling with Jiraiya(which didn't really have any noticeable effect, Naruto was still clueless in most subjects). Naruto then got a fair amount of knowledge from training with Toads and facing Nagato but Sasuke got history lessons from Obito and Hokages.)
*Willpower* - Naruto
_

Other distinct skills:
_
*Ninja Tools Proficiency* - Sasuke(Fuma Shuriken, Ninja Wire)
*Sensing* - Naruto
*Fūinjutsu* - Sasuke(Orochimaru unsealing was a very creative application of fuinjutsu. Sasuke remembered Kakashi's seal and was able to perform the reverse variant. Considering that he saw that seal years ago without Sharingan and came up with unsealing on the spot it was very impressive. Plus he's got more experience and knowledge from facing different seals from Itachi, Danzo and Oro. Plus shuriken seals, yeah.)
*Senjutsu* - Naruto
_

*Overall* - Naruto 11, Sauce 11, 3 Ties


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## Jad (Feb 15, 2015)

Title should be changed. 

Should be Hogorama (/w some Naruto) vs. Hogorama (w/ some Sasuke)


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Feb 16, 2015)

Alex Payne said:


> Taijutsu:
> 
> _
> *Skill* - Naruto(Frog Kata)
> ...


How is Sasuke's speed superior to Naruto's when Naruto could blitz Kaguya and Sasuke couldn't?


> Ninjutsu:
> 
> _
> *Destructive Capacity* - Tie(Both have a massive amount of different nukes)
> ...


Naruto has multiple elements and bloodlines now that he has the Biju inside him, Gudodama, and everything else. And Naruto's DC is superior to Sasuke's. How is Sasuke more efficient than Naruto, it looks like you're just making up stuff to make Sasuke better.


> Genjutsu:
> 
> _
> *Offense* - Sasuke
> ...


Perfect Jinchuriki are immune to genjutsu.


> Chakra:
> 
> _
> *Chakra Control* - Tie(Sauce was below before showing Hagoromo-level biju channeling)
> ...


Naruto was manipulating all the Biju Chakra and controlling it far before Sasuke and in a far better way, so Sasuke isn't tied with him.


> Mental:
> 
> _
> *Tactics* - Tie(both had their moments)
> ...


Naruto's tactics have shown to be better than Sasuke's. Naruto's insight has been better too (given he was the only one who recognized what Obito planned). Sasuke doesn't have more knowledge than Naruto either.
Other distinct skills:
_



*Ninja Tools Proficiency* - Sasuke(Fuma Shuriken, Ninja Wire)
*Sensing* - Naruto
*Fūinjutsu* - Sasuke(Orochimaru unsealing was a very creative application of fuinjutsu. Sasuke remembered Kakashi's seal and was able to perform the reverse variant. Considering that he saw that seal years ago without Sharingan and came up with unsealing on the spot it was very impressive. Plus he's got more experience and knowledge from facing different seals from Itachi, Danzo and Oro. Plus shuriken seals, yeah.)
*Senjutsu* - Naruto
		
Click to expand...

_


> *Overall* - Naruto 11, Sauce 11, 3 Ties


So much Naruto downplaying in your analysis.


----------



## Alex Payne (Feb 16, 2015)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> How is Sasuke's speed superior to Naruto's when Naruto could blitz Kaguya and Sasuke couldn't?


Naruto's blitz was closer to Sai blitzing Deidara/Sasori than to proper speed difference. Was Naruto able to replicate that performance after that? Sasuke can actually teleport which trumps physical speed.



SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Naruto has multiple elements and bloodlines now that he has the Biju inside him, Gudodama, and everything else. And Naruto's DC is superior to Sasuke's. How is Sasuke more efficient than Naruto, it looks like you're just making up stuff to make Sasuke better.


 Sasuke made the same bijus his pets. And could channel their power at the same level as Hagoromo. You really think that he couldn't use their abilities if he wanted? I explained why Sasuke is more efficient - his moveset is more efficient by itself. He turned Amaterasu into very efficient Kagutsuchi slashes. And you should stop attacking people because they have different opinion. I give zero fucks about both Naruto and Sasuke, they both went to shit in Part 2. 



SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Perfect Jinchuriki are immune to genjutsu.


 Just like Killer B was "immune" right? Needing time to realize that B is under genjutsu and breaking it. Having a partner inside doesn't help when dealing with AoE genjutsu sych as Bringer of Darkness and Gengetsu's Clam. And the real kicker is Sasuke's immunity to Mugen Tsukuyomi.



SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Naruto was manipulating all the Biju Chakra and controlling it far before Sasuke and in a far better way, so Sasuke isn't tied with him.


 If Naruto was "far better" Kyubi wouldn't freak out after seeing Sasuke's moves. Naruto used bits of bijus chakra that they gave him. Sasuke channeled their full forms into Perfect Susano. Difference is clear. Sasuke can also use beastly genjutsu to trap all bijus. Naruto gets props for Senjutsu manipulation and chakra-sharing. They both excel at different aspects. 



SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Naruto's tactics have shown to be better than Sasuke's. Naruto's insight has been better too (given he was the only one who recognized what Obito planned). Sasuke doesn't have more knowledge than Naruto either.


 Hebi Sasuke still stands at the top of on-panel tactics. Naruto "insight" was him having specific knowledge and being able to sense bijus chakra. I've explained why I think that Sasuke is more knowledgeable - he was always above in terms of practical knowledge due to actually giving a shit about Academy and studying + being exposed to Uchiha's hidden knowledge. Afterwards he went to study under someone whose goal is to basically to hoard knowledge and jutsu. Naruto was supposed to attain knowledge about different people and places when traveling with Jiraiya, giving him broader perspective on the world. Yet he returned as clueless as ever. Afterwards Naruto closed the gap due to dealing with high level stuff like Rinnegan and Senjutsu but Sasuke's new knowledge of history combined with learning about more Uchiha stuff and Sage Mode allowed him to stay ahead. 



SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> So much Naruto downplaying in your analysis.


So much of not being able to stand people having different opinions. We are discussing heavily inconsistent manga full of subjective bullshit. You can't have one "right" opinion about it. You should deal with it.


----------



## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Feb 16, 2015)

Alex Payne said:


> Naruto's blitz was closer to Sai blitzing Deidara/Sasori than to proper speed difference. Was Naruto able to replicate that performance after that? Sasuke can actually teleport which trumps physical speed.


Naruto consistently could get the drop on Kaguya and even avoid her Yomotsu Hirasaka, something Sasuke couldn't do. 


> Sasuke made the same bijus his pets. And could channel their power at the same level as Hagoromo. You really think that he couldn't use their abilities if he wanted? I explained why Sasuke is more efficient - his moveset is more efficient by itself. He turned Amaterasu into very efficient Kagutsuchi slashes. And you should stop attacking people because they have different opinion. I give zero fucks about both Naruto and Sasuke, they both went to shit in Part 2.


And Naruto has the friendship of all the Biju's and can bring out their full power and use their other abilities, something Sasuke nor Hagoromo could do. Sasuke isn't more efficent, Naruto's shown better stuff in that department.


> Just like Killer B was "immune" right? Needing time to realize that B is under genjutsu and breaking it. Having a partner inside doesn't help when dealing with AoE genjutsu sych as Bringer of Darkness and Gengetsu's Clam. And the real kicker is Sasuke's immunity to Mugen Tsukuyomi.


Manga-Perfect Jinchuriki are immune to genjutsu. Makes it quite clear.


> If Naruto was "far better" Kyubi wouldn't freak out after seeing Sasuke's moves. Naruto used bits of bijus chakra that they gave him. Sasuke channeled their full forms into Perfect Susano. Difference is clear. Sasuke can also use beastly genjutsu to trap all bijus. Naruto gets props for Senjutsu manipulation and chakra-sharing. They both excel at different aspects.


Kurama freaked out due to the simple fact that Naruto was running on empty for most of the fight. He was physically exhausted even at the start while Sasuke was relatively fresh. And even then he could deal with Sasuke's best, all without killing intent, which Sasuke commented upon. 


> Hebi Sasuke still stands at the top of on-panel tactics. Naruto "insight" was him having specific knowledge and being able to sense bijus chakra. I've explained why I think that Sasuke is more knowledgeable - he was always above in terms of practical knowledge due to actually giving a shit about Academy and studying + being exposed to Uchiha's hidden knowledge. Afterwards he went to study under someone whose goal is to basically to hoard knowledge and jutsu. Naruto was supposed to attain knowledge about different people and places when traveling with Jiraiya, giving him broader perspective on the world. Yet he returned as clueless as ever. Afterwards Naruto closed the gap due to dealing with high level stuff like Rinnegan and Senjutsu but Sasuke's new knowledge of history combined with learning about more Uchiha stuff and Sage Mode allowed him to stay ahead.


Did you forget all of Naruto's tactics against Pain? Against Kakuzu? Against Neji and Gaara or way back against Zabuza or in the Forest of Death. Even his tactics against Kaguya, Obito, and Madara were better than Sasuke to the point where Sasuke was following his lead.


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## mykel23 (Feb 16, 2015)

Taijutsu:


Skill - Sasuke
Physical Strength - Naruto
Speed - Naruto
Reflexes - Tie 
Durability - Naruto
Resilience - Naruto


Ninjutsu:


Destructive Capacity - Naruto
Defensive - Naruto
Support - Naruto
Casting Speed - Sasuke
Efficiency - Naruto
Innovativeness - Naruto
Versatility - Sasuke


Genjutsu:


Offense - Sasuke
Defense - Sasuke


Chakra: 


Chakra Control - Naruto
Chakra Reserves - Naruto


Mental: 


Tactics - Sasuke
Insight - Sasuke
Knowledge - Sasuke
Willpower -Naruto


Other distinct skills:

Ninja Tools Proficiency - Sasuke
Sensing - Naruto
Fūinjutsu - Tie
Senjutsu -Naruto


Overall - Naruto : 16
Sasuke : 11


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## Bonly (Feb 16, 2015)

Patrick said:


> I still don't see how you think that having clones > Genjutsu, multiple applications of two elemental ninjutsus, well versed with weapons, eye techniques.



I don't think having clones alone > all that stuff. I think having clones which can do damn near everything Naruto can do what puts them > all that stuff.

You say Genjutsu? I say sealing jutsu.

You say Sasuke having multiple jutsu in two elements? I say Naruto having access to at least four of the basic jutsu, multiple KG and Bijuu who can help coach him.

You say well versed with weapons? I say Naruto's versed in clone usage.

You say eye jutsu? I say Bijuu Power.

All of those things are things the clones can use to help match up to Sasuke's options to attack(let alone the rest the clones can use) but if you don't think that at the least give him the same options to attack then we'll just agree to disagree.  



> Then I didn't even begin to talk about the Rinnegan yet. That thing on it's own makes someone more versatile than Naruto.



If this was Nagato or Madara or Obito then you'd have a point here but sadly Sasuke couldn't use all of it's powers to the fullest, even Kurama points out how Sasuke can't cast jutsu and absorb at the same time because he's new with his Rinnegan so yeah.



> It's not that I don't want to give Naruto credit but*it has always been the way* that Naruto compensates Sasuke's skill with pure power.



So in other words that don't go against the status quo.



SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Perfect Jinchuriki are immune to genjutsu.





SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Manga-Perfect Jinchuriki are immune to genjutsu. Makes it quite clear.



Manga shows Perfect Jin Killer B being effected by both Sasuke's and Itachi's genjutsu. Manga shows Perfect Jin Yagura being under Obito's genjutsu. Manga makes it quite clear that Perfect Jins aren't immune to genjutsu, just because they can break out of a genjutsu via partner method doesn't mean they are immune and unaffected by genjutsu.


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## Iwanko (Feb 16, 2015)

> Hebi Sasuke still stands at the top of on-panel tactics. Naruto "insight" was him having specific knowledge and being able to sense bijus chakra.


 Which knowledge he had against Zabuza, against Kakuzu and against Neji ? 


> I've explained why I think that Sasuke is more knowledgeable - he was always above in terms of practical knowledge due to actually giving a shit about Academy and studying + being exposed to Uchiha's hidden knowledge.


 Please explain why Sasuke couldn't answer even one question at Chuunin exam if he had  more practical knowledge than Naruto. 



> Afterwards Naruto closed the gap due to dealing with high level stuff like Rinnegan and Senjutsu but Sasuke's new knowledge of history combined with learning about more Uchiha stuff and Sage Mode allowed him to stay ahead.


Also Naruto learned from Tobi about Indra/Ashura feud

He got knowledge about MS jutsu from Itachi

He got tones of experience from his clones.


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## TheGreen1 (Feb 17, 2015)

Again, this still baffels me with Sasuke having a Fuuinjutsu edge when he's never really been shown with seals. Naruto has altered and messed with his own seal, and also has Shukaku's cursed seal body. That alone shits on whatever Sasuke can do. 

God, it's like people don't really read.


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Feb 17, 2015)

TheGreen1 said:


> Again, this still baffels me with Sasuke having a Fuuinjutsu edge when he's never really been shown with seals. Naruto has altered and messed with his own seal, and also has Shukaku's cursed seal body. That alone shits on whatever Sasuke can do.
> 
> God, it's like people don't really read.


Its because of a bias that wants Sasuke to either be stronger than Naruto or equal to him despite the manga showing the opposite.


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