# SSJGSSJ Goku runs gauntlet



## ExorcistRain (Sep 27, 2015)

With Goku now being multi-galaxy level+, billions of times MFTL, I want to gauge his new found .strength
:Gauntlet
1. Luke Skywalker
2. Powerpuff Girls
3.  All Keyblade Weilders
4. Worldbreaker Hulk
5. Post-Crisis Wonder Woman
6. Sol Badguy
7. Hyper Kabuto
8.  Dark Shcneider
9. Virgo Shaka
10. God Cloth Seiya
Both sides bloodlusted.
No prep.
Location: Universe

?How far does he go


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## Weather (Sep 27, 2015)

Ho boy, here we go...


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## Imperator100 (Sep 27, 2015)

I think order might be somewhat off but assumed he gets that far he might stop at 5. Wonder Woman is faster and could use the Godwave to win.


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## ExorcistRain (Sep 27, 2015)

Does he have a chance against Sol, Tendou, and the others?


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## Toaa (Sep 27, 2015)

Wait until super gets there rof version loses but the anime one well be multi universal


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Imperator100 said:


> I think order might be somewhat off but assumed he gets that far he might stop at 5. Wonder Woman is faster and could use the Godwave to win.



Shouldn't Worldbreaker Hulk be higher up on the list. I mean powerscaling from how powerful Savage Hulk could get (Cracking and breaking adamantium, crushing mjolnier with his bare hands etc.)


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## Imperator100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Shouldn't Worldbreaker Hulk be higher up on the list. I mean powerscaling from how powerful Savage Hulk could get (Cracking and breaking adamantium, crushing mjolnier with his bare hands etc.)



Don't know WB Hulk's stats. Said order might be off.


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## ExorcistRain (Sep 27, 2015)

Yeah the order may be off guys. Not too familiar with comic book characters. But how does he do against 4 and onwards?


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

*Sigh* Let's just get this over with:

1. Gets curbstomped

2. Gets curbstomped

3. Gets curbstomped

4. Gets curbstomped

5. Curbstomps with Godwave

6. Gets curbstomped

7. Gets curbstomped

8. Hax will be a problem, but ultimately gets curbstomped

9. May actually be a good fight, but ultimately loses

10. May actually be a good fight, but ultimately loses


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## ExorcistRain (Sep 27, 2015)

Doesn't the Godwave need prep to use though?


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## Imperator100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> *Sigh* Let's just get this over with:
> 
> 8. Hax will be a problem, but ultimately gets curbstomped
> 
> ...



What? Dark Schneider and Virgo Shaka can both handily still hax him to death and Seiya has an outright stat advantage


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## Keollyn (Sep 27, 2015)

Can't you just call him God Goku? It's easier and less.... horrible.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

I don't even really get the difference. Going by the words he used SSJGSSJ and SSJG are the same thing only SSJGSSJ is something he has complete control over.


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## ZeroRaiser (Sep 27, 2015)

Isn't current Goku much faster and stronger than Dark Schneider? Like one shot before he could react?  (I dunno much about him mostly second hand info)


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## Imperator100 (Sep 27, 2015)

ZeroRaiser said:


> Isn't current Goku much faster and stronger than Dark Schneider? Like one shot before he could react?  (I dunno much about him mostly second hand info)



That would normally be the case but DS has passive defensive haxes that would keep that from happening, namely Dispel Bounds and Eternal Atoms.


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## NightmareCinema (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> *Sigh* Let's just get this over with:
> 8. Hax will be a problem, but ultimately gets curbstomped
> 
> 9. May actually be a good fight, but ultimately loses
> ...



>Dark Schneider
>Shaka
>God Cloth Seiya
>Losing to Goku

You have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. 

Goku still has no answer for Darsh's Eternal Atoms and Darsh still has some potent hax like soulfuck to kill off Goku.

Shaka can remove Goku's senses to leave him to rot. Not to mention Shaka is a fuckton faster than Goku.

God Cloth Seiya is multi-galaxy level as well and is hilariously faster than Goku too. Goku still gets punched to death here.


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## Keollyn (Sep 27, 2015)

@ Servo: That seemed completely off base with what I posted...


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## Nevermind (Sep 27, 2015)

There's no way in hell Goku is beating Dark Schneider.

And we're going to have to wait and see where the dust settles before I'm comfortable calling Goku "multi galaxy."


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## ZeroRaiser (Sep 27, 2015)

Also isn't the size of the DBU currently being discussed/contested? Goku's speed could be massively upgraded when it's decided.


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## Montanz (Sep 27, 2015)

Not really since the shockwave expansion doesn't scale to their actual speed.


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## MusubiKazesaru (Sep 27, 2015)

I thought we agreed on the name Super Cyan God?


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## Imagine (Sep 27, 2015)

Blueberry Goku or bust


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## Imperator100 (Sep 27, 2015)

MusubiKazesaru said:


> I thought we agreed on the name Super Cyan God?



I thought we agreed on the name Blueberry Goku?
It goes great with his fellow Shonen Jump hero Strawberry-kun


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## Keollyn (Sep 27, 2015)

Blueberry Goku sounds perfectly fine.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Sep 27, 2015)

Sol dumps his ass in the backyard and leaves him there and goes to have a smoke

Gotta love having 0 resistance to hax and being all raw power


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## Warlordgab (Sep 27, 2015)

Blueberry Goku, Strawberry Ichigo... why is this starting to sound like a fruit salad?


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## Imperator100 (Sep 27, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> Sol dumps his ass in the backyard and leaves him there and goes to have a smoke
> 
> Gotta love having 0 resistance to hax and being all raw power



This is the problem with giant sudden upgrades in a series. It leaves you with completely unbalanced stats and a really bad curve as everyone who doesn't get the upgrade becomes fodder.


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## Keollyn (Sep 27, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> Sol dumps his ass in the backyard and leaves him there and goes to have a smoke
> 
> Gotta love having 0 resistance to hax and being all raw power



Someone's gonna mass spam Tori's inbox about this, just you watch.


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## GiveRobert20dollars (Sep 27, 2015)

And then toriyama will forget


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## Imagine (Sep 27, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> Sol dumps his ass in the backyard and leaves him there and goes to have a smoke
> 
> Gotta love having 0 resistance to hax and being all raw power



Sol ''accidentally'' dumps Goku in Blazgreenverse

What happens next?


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## Montanz (Sep 27, 2015)

Also, stops at Wonder Woman since she has tangled with skyfathers and most likely gets scaling from them.

Don't really know about Sol other than the fact he is massively faster as of now and probably has enough hax to ignore the DC difference

DS probably soulfucks Goku as well

Virgo is ridiculously faster and can strip Goku of all his senses.

Seiya just blitzes and punches him into a pulp


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## Keollyn (Sep 27, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> And then toriyama will forget



Par for the course


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## NightmareCinema (Sep 27, 2015)

GiveRobert20dollars said:


> Sol dumps his ass in the backyard and leaves him there and goes to have a smoke
> 
> Gotta love having 0 resistance to hax and being all raw power



Or leaves him as a statue by sacrificing one of the OutRage pieces.

But then again, this is Sol and he's lazy so yeah, he'll probably just dump Goku in the Backyard and leave him there to be turned to dust.


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## King Kakarot (Sep 27, 2015)

Montanz said:


> Not really since the shockwave expansion doesn't scale to their actual speed.



it actually would since they briefly outsped it


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## xenos5 (Sep 27, 2015)

King Kakarot said:


> it actually would since they briefly outsped it



I don't doubt this... though i'd like to see a timestamp for when in the episode it happened.


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## Montanz (Sep 27, 2015)

uh? I rewatched the fight, and I couldn't see an instance where they outran the expansion, every time they clashed the wave was already far beyond the point of origin before they even started moving.


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## King Kakarot (Sep 27, 2015)

[youtube]D7JRPI39Lrs[/youtube]

around 2:29 they _breifly_ outspeed some shockwaves


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## Freddy Mercury (Sep 27, 2015)

Ajimu solos.


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## Montanz (Sep 27, 2015)

That still makes it hard to scale it to them since they were sent flying by the shockwave and didn't make a concious effort to outrun it.


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## Deleted member 45015 (Sep 27, 2015)

ExorcistRain said:


> With Goku now being multi-galaxy level+, billions of times MFTL, I want to gauge his new found .strength



...What...? 

Seriously...what the fuck?


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

CM Pope said:


> ...What...?
> 
> Seriously...what the fuck?


Unfortunately, this actually happened.


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## AgentAAA (Sep 27, 2015)

CM Pope said:


> ...What...?
> 
> Seriously...what the fuck?



yeah, it actually happened at this point.
It's vague, but only in terms of the exact number to put. We've flat-out got universe crumbling as a serious concern from Goku and Beerus's clash.
At the least it's low-galaxy though.
And... it's frompunching


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

AgentAAA said:


> yeah, it actually happened at this point.
> It's vague, but only in terms of the exact number to put. We've flat-out got universe crumbling as a serious concern from Goku and Beerus's clash.
> At the least it's low-galaxy though.
> And... it's frompunching


And now we've got Pseudo-Skyfather level Dragon Ball, and the old mantra of DBZ debates being "stomped or get stomped" only _becomes harder_.


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## Expelsword (Sep 27, 2015)

Keollyn said:


> Can't you just call him God Goku? It's easier and less.... horrible.



Once again, recommending Super Cyan God.


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Sep 27, 2015)

AgentAAA said:


> yeah, it actually happened at this point.
> It's vague, but only in terms of the exact number to put. We've flat-out got universe crumbling as a serious concern from Goku and Beerus's clash.
> At the least it's low-galaxy though.
> And... it's frompunching


Multi-Galaxy DC for DBZ. Damn huh?


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## Blade (Sep 27, 2015)

Goku at best stops and beats Sol.

After that, he just loses badly.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

CM Pope said:


> ...What...?
> 
> Seriously...what the fuck?



He's not.

Small Galaxy level at best and going by statements in the Super episode even that might be too much.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> He's not.
> 
> Small Galaxy level at best and going by statements in the Super episode even that might be too much.



Dafuq are you talking about? Coming from the statements, both Beerus and Goku were multi-galaxy level+, being that they can hollow out the universe in 2 to 3 hits, according to Herms.


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## Imperator100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> He's not.
> 
> Small Galaxy level at best and going by statements in the Super episode even that might be too much.



What? Did something drastic happen to change everything?


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## Blade (Sep 27, 2015)

Ignore Servo.

DB is still UNIVERSAL/the minimum AT LEAST multi galaxy+ levels.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Imperator100 said:


> What? Did something drastic happen to change everything?



Nope. Just Tom Servo downplaying.


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## Dudebro (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> He's not.
> 
> Small Galaxy level at best and going by statements in the Super episode even that might be too much.



...How the hell do you come to that conclusion?

Four galaxies or a full sized universe it doesn't matter. Destroying even the former by accident in three punches is flat out multi galaxy level straight up.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Dudebro said:


> ...How the hell do you come to that conclusion?
> 
> Four galaxies or a full sized universe it doesn't matter. Destroying even the former by accident in three punches is flat out multi galaxy level straight up.



The shockwaves are a chain reaction event. The actual punches themselves aren't that powerful. Had you seen the episode you would have known this.



NightmareCinema said:


> It's Tom Servo. He comes up with a lot of retarded conclusions.
> 
> Just like what Bureido said, just ignore him.



How about you actually learn to come up with a decent excuse not to give me an argument?


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## Imperator100 (Sep 27, 2015)

The wars over the new Dragon Ball feat have truly begun.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> The shockwaves are a chain reaction event. The actual punches themselves aren't that powerful. Had you seen the episode you would have known this.



Nope. It was just raw power. Chain reactions are never implied, stated, or shown, and we have zero precedence for such a thing.


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## Dudebro (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> The shockwaves are a chain reaction event. The actual punches themselves aren't that powerful. Had you seen the episode you would have known this.



The shockwaves are the result of an impact of two energy charged fists colliding. And one of the guys who did it had to actively take measures to reduce the spread of raw destructive energy to stop more strikes from destroying every physical object in the universe...Which he started trying to do since the first strike...

Chain reaction my ass. The effects were strange but this isn't no magic spell. Two forces collided and almost everything died. That's how it was portrayed. And that little description you gave means nothing in the end for the same reason Frieza blowing up Namek the way he did didn't


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> Nope. It was just raw power. Chain reactions are never implied, stated, or shown, and we have zero precedence for such a thing.



Rewatch the episode. The shockwaves are growing in power the more they spread out.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Liquid said:


> no no
> 
> this is just servo being the usual retard
> 
> doesn't even count as DB syndrome



You really want me to metaphorically butt fuck you again?



Dudebro said:


> The shockwaves are the result of an impact of two energy charged fists colliding. And one of the guys who did it had to actively take measures to reduce the spread of raw destructive energy to stop more strikes from destroying every physical object in the universe...Which he started trying to do since the first strike...
> 
> Chain reaction my ass. The effects were strange but this isn't no magic spell. Two forces collided and almost everything died. That's how it was portrayed. And that little description you gave means nothing in the end for the same reason Frieza blowing up Namek the way he did didn't




Clearly this is the first time you watch DBZ ofcourse it makes no sense. But if your going to pick a statement to go on from Elder Kai you can't just cherry pick


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Rewatch the episode. The shockwaves are growing in power the more they spread out.



How does that mean some mystical chain reaction did it?


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## NightmareCinema (Sep 27, 2015)

@Tom Servo

No excuse needed. You're just not worth wasting time on.

And your argument is pretty much shot in the face since Goku cancelled out the shockwaves during the 3rd clash and onwards with his physical strength.

The first and second clashes were Goku trying to test out the technique. So yeah, nice job leaving out context as to why nearby shit aren't being destroyed while the faraway ones were.

Then again, that's par for the course with you.


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## Imagine (Sep 27, 2015)

Multiversal here we come. 

Gonna end up on par with Getbackers


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

NightmareCinema said:


> @Tom Servo
> 
> No excuse needed. You're just not worth wasting time on.
> 
> ...



1. concession accepted

2. That literally means nothing and is just a waste of text

3. They were full-powered....this was stated and shown...twice. Go back to MVC


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> I said your chain reaction was "mystical" *because it is near completely undefined in its mechanism, moron.*



SO is Frieza nuking Namek by hollowing out its core.

I think its time you accept Toriyoma doesn't know jack shit about anything regarding physics astronomy or otherwise.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> SO is Frieza nuking Namek by hollowing out its core.
> 
> I think its time you accept Toriyoma doesn't know jack shit about anything regarding physics astronomy or otherwise.


And how does that prove that they didn't use raw power in the universal shockwave feat?


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## Blade (Sep 27, 2015)

Wombat, section ban Servo.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Tom Servo, you're talking out of your ass again. First of all, there aren't four galaxies, there's four quadrants with many different galaxies. Secondly the Kaioshin Realm is in an entirely other plain of existence. You're downplaying.



Why don't you go back to MVC so the big kids can talk this out.

And no its 4 galaxies....

You can't even defend your own fandom you're way out of your league.



Blade said:


> Wombat, section ban Servo.



Still waiting on an argument.


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## Regicide (Sep 27, 2015)

Oh boy

Here we go


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Clearly your stupidity is boundless....I never said it wasn't done through physical strength but we can't scale their direct clashes to them because as Elder Kai said the shockwaves are for whatever reason growing in power the more they spread out.



SMFH, kid.

How does the fact that the shockwaves grow in power the more they spread out prove this magical chain reaction?


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> SMFH, kid.
> 
> How does the fact that the shockwaves grow in power the more they spread out prove this magical chain reaction?



1. Shockwaves don't work like that

2. You're the one claiming their magical...


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Why don't you go back to MVC so the big kids can talk this out.
> 
> And no its 4 galaxies.....


First of all TOm, I've never BEEN to MvC. Secondly, I have far more experience with Dragon Ball than you. Thirdly, its four quadrants. Galaxies with innumerable nebula. Seriously you don't know how the original Japanese is.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> 1. Shockwaves don't work like that
> 
> 2. You're the one claiming their magical...



The burden of proof is on you to show how a magical chain reaction could produce those magical shockwaves.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> First of all TOm, I've never BEEN to MvC. Secondly, I have far more experience with Dragon Ball than you. Thirdly, its four quadrants. Galaxies with innumerable nebula. Seriously you don't know how the original Japanese is.



No it's galaxies. Each Kai to a galaxy was stated explicitly...Ofcourse your no stranger to grasping at straws for any mistranslation you can find.



Tonathan100 said:


> The burden of proof is on you to show how a magical chain reaction could produce those magical shockwaves.



Elder Kai's statement....still waiting on you to explain what makes them magical...


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## Deer Lord (Sep 27, 2015)

The Four galaxies argument always seemed to me like a petty attempt to downplay DB.
From what I can gather all this shit comes from secondary canon that contradicts itself or multiple translations issues.

Most other fictions would just get this silly thing handwaved away as inconsistencies and revert back to universe equlization.
But since this is dragon ball we need to be anal about everything to make it less impressive.


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> No it's galaxies. Each Kai to a galaxy was stated explicitly...Ofcourse your no stranger to grasping at straws for any mistranslation you can find..


Each Kai was given a quadrant. Not a galaxy. You're a dragon ball downplayer so of course you'll chose the most inappropriate translation.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> Each Kai was given a quadrant. Not a galaxy. *You're a dragon ball downplayer* so of course you'll chose the most inappropriate translation.



>Says I downplay DBZ
>Is the reason people accepted kaioken and SSJ multipliers which gives every BOG character a boost in DC and speed

No, its each Kai to a galaxy. Do you even know what a quadrant is?


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> 1. How did you get so much rep, as you are clearly just an idiot?
> 
> *2. The fact that the shockwaves grow in power the more they spread out does not prove a chain reaction.
> *
> Also, I'm feeling some "anti-Raigen effect" from Tom Servo's arguments. I'll call this the "dupe-kun effect" (if it wasn't called that already).



Do you seriously not understand what a chain reaction means?


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> >Says I downplay DBZ
> >Is the reason people accepted kaioken and SSJ multipliers which gives every BOG character a boost in DC and speed
> 
> No, its each Kai to a galaxy. Do you even know what a quadrant is?


No, each Kaio is given a quadrant of the universe with many galaxies within it. You're relying on bad translations and secondary sources that contradict themselves.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> >Says I downplay DBZ
> >Is the reason people accepted kaioken and SSJ multipliers which gives every BOG character a boost in DC and speed
> 
> No, its each Kai to a galaxy. Do you even know what a quadrant is?



The galaxies where said to be "administrative units" given to each Kai, so...it may go either way really. One could argue that each administrative unit = 1 Milky Way sized galaxy, or one could argue for innumerable galaxies. The databooks and various translations contradict themselves so much on this otherwise meaningless trivia.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> No, each Kaio is given a quadrant of the universe with many galaxies within it. You're relying on bad translations and secondary sources that contradict themselves.



Now that's an ironic argument given how much you love to throw around mistranslations.

And no it was stated Each Kaib to a galaxy. The amount of mental gymnastics your doing to get around this is...actually not surprising.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> The galaxies where said to be "administrative units" given to each Kai, so...it may go either way really. One could argue that each administrative unit = 1 Milky Way sized galaxy, or one could argue for innumerable galaxies. The databooks contradict themselves so much on this otherwise meaningless trivia, that, again, it could really go either way.



You're just going by a statement a previous poster had. Going by that would mean that Kai's would only look after one galaxy in a quadrant and ignore all the others which makes no sense.

Quadrant could also be referring to how the universe is split up into four galaxies which still remains consistent with the each kai looking over a galaxy.


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Now that's an ironic argument given how much you love to throw around mistranslations.
> 
> And no it was stated Each Kaib to a galaxy. The amount of mental gymnastics your doing to get around this is...actually not surprising.


How am I doing 'mental gymnastics', I'm going by the original Japanese. Even other people HERE have noted the contradictions that claim the Kaio's rule over four Galaxies or the Universe is only four galaxies.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> *How am I doing 'mental gymnastics', I'm going by the original Japanese. *Even other people HERE have noted the contradictions that claim the Kaio's rule over four Galaxies or the Universe is only four galaxies.



That's hilariously inaccurate.


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## Haro (Sep 27, 2015)

If the shockwaves got more powerful as they went on then Tom is correct.

Also I have yet to see a argument that puts the 4 galaxies one to rest.

Everyone here is just pre cumming over this feat.


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## Ultimate Deathsaurer (Sep 27, 2015)

Well it's nice to see this thread going exactly the places we expected. Way to go, guys! How about we lay off the flaming?


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Ryo Asuka said:


> If the shockwaves got more powerful as they went on then Tom is correct.
> 
> Also I have yet to see a argument that puts the 4 galaxies one to rest.
> 
> Everyone here is just pre cumming over this feat.



Ryo Asuka, you are my bro, so please don't do this. Magic shockwaves =/= chain reaction.


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## Vivi Ornitier (Sep 27, 2015)

Wait, how do shockwaves get more powerful the more they drag on? That defies common sense


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## Haro (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> Ryo Asuka, you are my bro, so please don't do this. Magic shockwaves =/= chain reaction.



It just seems like DB logic fuckery.

Not seeing how they would not be considered a chain reaction if they got more power as they went on and the source had nothing to do with it.


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## Imagine (Sep 27, 2015)

Ultimate Deathsaurer said:


> Well it's nice to see this thread going exactly the places we expected. Way to go, guys! How about we lay off the flaming?



Asking too much. UD pls


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## SuperSaiyaMan12 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> It was accepted by you...which means nothing given your horrible track record of pitiful opinions.


It wasn't accepted by just me Tom. It was accepted by God Movement. He has more sway over this than you. Not only that, it was put on the Wiki as the correct DC amount.


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## Haro (Sep 27, 2015)

Vivi Ornitier said:


> Wait, how do shockwaves get more powerful the more they drag on? That defies common sense



Exactly, it doesn't make any sense.

And how people are jumping to multi galaxy is beyond me.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Vivi Ornitier said:


> Wait, how do shockwaves get more powerful the more they drag on? That defies common sense



That's what happened in the feat though.


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## Ultimate Deathsaurer (Sep 27, 2015)

There is literally a pairing section where you can argue with each other and flame to your hearts content. Please, for the love of god, go there instead of doing this in the OBD.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

SuperSaiyaMan12 said:


> It wasn't accepted by just me Tom. It was accepted by God Movement. He has more sway over this than you. Not only that, it was put on the Wiki as the correct DC amount.



He was the one that said it was small galaxy level. 

Also you need to let pairings go. The fact that you negged me here because of Kishi's statements is not my problem and isn't even relevant.



Ultimate Deathsaurer said:


> There is literally a pairing section where you can argue with each other and flame to your hearts content. Please, for the love of god, go there instead of doing this in the OBD.



I'm not interested in arguing pairings otherwise I wouldn't be here...


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## Regicide (Sep 27, 2015)

Vivi Ornitier said:


> Wait, how do shockwaves get more powerful the more they drag on? That defies common sense


Just watch

Sooner or later you'll see someone use that as an example of Goku being able to break logic with sheer ki or some nonsense

Like some ROW ROW FIGHT DA POWAH bullshit


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## Haro (Sep 27, 2015)

Ultimate Deathsaurer said:


> There is literally a pairing section where you can argue with each other and flame to your hearts content. Please, for the love of god, go there instead of doing this in the OBD.



Yes plz


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## Iwandesu (Sep 27, 2015)

Being fair it seemed that they got more powerful because they were further from goku god ki that was nullifying it


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## Imperator100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Regicide said:


> Just watch
> 
> Sooner or later you'll see someone use that as an example of Goku being able to break logic with sheer ki or some nonsense
> 
> Like some ROW ROW FIGHT DA POWAH bullshit



In Japanese versus boards that kind of stuff has already not only started but become so tired already that people are starting to mock the claim.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Imperator100 said:


> In Japanese versus boards that kind of stuff has already not only started but become so tired already that people are starting to mock the claim.



Japanese VS. boards seem much more logical than American VS. boards.


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## Imperator100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> Japanese VS. boards seem much more logical than American VS. boards.



That's because you're not debating on them


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## King Kakarot (Sep 27, 2015)

It's crazy how people don't understand what's going on why earth and the solar system didn't get nuked from the get go.

Thier punches can wreck the entire universe precisely 3 would get the job done.

Earth didn't get destroyed becuase Goku from the very first strike tried to cancel out Beerus attack 



> Minute: 19
> Context: Following the noticeable lack of universal destruction.
> Elder Kaioshin: "[Goku] erased Beerus-sama's attack by slamming his fist against Beerus' at exactly the same speed and angle. *He had planned on perfecting [the technique] on the second blow, but of course with Beerus-sama it wasn't so simple."*
> Beerus (thinking to himself): "Did this guy test out a new techniuqe in the middle of his fight with me?"
> Significance: So Goku "erased" Beerus' attack by countering it with an equivalent attack. An_*d he only got this right on the third attempt, which is why the first two times Goku and Beerus punch each other at the same time it generated shockwaves.*_



Simple also it's hilarious to say thier shockwaves are stronger than their punches


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

King Kakarot said:


> It's crazy how people don't understand what's going on why earth and the solar system didn't get nuked from the get go.
> 
> Thier punches can wreck the entire universe precisely 3 would get the job done.
> 
> ...



It's almost hilarious how irrelevant that is...Him nullifying it has nothing to do with anything...he matched him physically and caused the shockwaves that for whatever reason spread out and got more powerful. Goku matching him and cancelling them out changes nothing.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> It's almost hilarious how irrelevant that is...Him nullifying it has nothing to do with anything...he matched him physically and caused the shockwaves that for whatever reason spread out and got more powerful. Goku matching him and cancelling them out changes nothing.



It does change nothing. The fact that the feat was raw power wasn't changed at all.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> It does change nothing. The fact that the feat was raw power wasn't changed at all.



And thus you're explanation for it being magical completely falls apart....why are you still here again?


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## Dudebro (Sep 27, 2015)

Ryo Asuka said:


> Exactly, it doesn't make any sense.
> 
> And how people are jumping to multi galaxy is beyond me.



Its multi galaxy because of the end result of what they were doing.

Its flat out stated that the energy released by some 2-3 uncontrolled brofists by these two uber powerful charcaters would have flat out destroyed all of the physical matter in the universe and then some.

Its explained that Goku did some weird nonsensical move that messed with the attacks AOE.

The whole set up says this be what happens when guys as tough as them start getting a bit serious and start beating each other up. 

Does it make sense?...No...But there are two things that are clear regarding the feat.

The universe was legitimately going to be destroyed and the energy required to do it came entirely from those two fighters.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> And thus you're explanation for it being magical completely falls apart....why are you still here again?





Semantics. I said it was "magical" because the shockwave defies physical laws. I made no argument for it being magical in nature, but thanks for conceding the point that it was raw power.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Dudebro said:


> Its multi galaxy because of the end result of what they were doing.
> 
> Its flat out stated that the energy released by some 2-3 uncontrolled brofists by these two uber powerful charcaters would have flat out destroyed all of the physical matter in the universe and then some.
> 
> ...



No, that makes no sense. WHy would Goku's interference enhance the power of the shockwaves that's pretty much the opposite of what he's going for. 



Tonathan100 said:


> Semantics. I said it was "magical" because the shockwave defies physical laws. I made no argument for it being magical in nature, but thanks for conceding the point that it was raw power.



Why was your argument that they were magical my argument was that it was from their fists but isn't as strong directly as the shockwaves....you really need to work on your debating skills


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## King Kakarot (Sep 27, 2015)

Dudebro said:


> Its multi galaxy because of the end result of what they were doing.
> 
> Its flat out stated that the energy released by some 2-3 uncontrolled brofists by these two uber powerful charcaters would have flat out destroyed all of the physical matter in the universe and then some.
> 
> ...



Nah bro the shockwaves are clearly stronger than Beerus and Goku......

Even though the energy is coming from them


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

King Kakarot said:


> Nah bro the shockwaves are clearly stronger than Beerus and Goku......
> 
> Even though the energy is coming from them



Well that was a waste of a response.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Why was your argument that they were magical my argument was that it was from their fists but isn't as strong directly as the shockwaves....you really need to work on your debating skills


SMFH again.

I never argued the shockwaves to actually be magical. I literally only said that because they defied physical laws.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> SMFH again.
> 
> I never argued the shockwaves to actually be magical. I literally only said that because they defied physical laws.



As does most things Dragonball is responsible for.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> As does most things Dragonball is responsible for.



And this proves a chain reaction how?...


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## Vivi Ornitier (Sep 27, 2015)

Regicide said:


> Just watch
> 
> Sooner or later you'll see someone use that as an example of Goku being able to break logic with sheer ki or some nonsense
> 
> Like some ROW ROW FIGHT DA POWAH bullshit



I already see dumbasses saying he beats STTGL, so


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## Vivi Ornitier (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> Japanese VS. boards seem much more logical than American VS. boards.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> And this proves a chain reaction how?...



A shockwave that gets more powerful as it goes on. If their initial clash wasn't that powerful that's pretty much what it leads to.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> A shockwave that gets more powerful as it goes on. If their initial clash wasn't that powerful that's pretty much what it leads to.



Chain reactions don't create that kind of shockwave. No chain reaction does. Unless you can explain some specific mechanism for this particular chain reaction...


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> Chain reactions don't create that kind of shockwave. No chain reaction does. Unless you can explain some specific mechanism for this particular chain reaction...



Wow so you are unfamiliar with what a chain reaction effect is.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Wow so you are unfamiliar with what a chain reaction effect is.



Chain reactions aren't magic. They cannot accomplish physically impossible effects.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> Chain reactions aren't magic. They cannot accomplish physically impossible effects.



People can't fly and create explosions and death with their hands in real life either...what's your point?


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> People can't fly and create explosions and death with their hands in real life either...what's your point?



I'm saying that a chain reaction doesn't explain the shockwave getting more powerful the farther it goes.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Here's ChaosTheory123's opinion on the feat:



> Finally bothered to watch the episode
> 
> Kind of baffled how King Kai, Kibito Kai, and Elder Kai are alive if the shockwave is somehow getting stronger the further it gets from it's origin seeing as they're about as far away from it as they can get existing outside that weird universe model Toriyama has going
> 
> ...


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> I'm saying that a chain reaction doesn't explain the shockwave getting more powerful the farther it goes.



Actually it does. Setting off and becoming more and more powerful that literally is the only explanation from Elder Kai's statement.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Actually it does. Setting off and becoming more and more powerful that literally is the only explanation from Elder Kai's statement.



What is the mechanism of this chain reaction then?


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> What is the mechanism of this chain reaction then?



Ask whoever wrote Elder Kai's lines.


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## Dudebro (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> *No, that makes no sense*. WHy would Goku's interference enhance the power of the shockwaves that's pretty much the opposite of what he's going for.



...No shit son... 

Your debating purely fictional material.

Material about flying animal gods who blow up celestial bodies with spirit power.

Material made by some guy whose memory is giving me the idea that he might be suffering from Alzheimer's and who has clearly demonstrated that the fucks he gives about it are beneath zero.

There is not a single feat done in this or any fictional series for that matter that makes absolute sense...And if anyone told you otherwise they didn't know or they lied.

There are no facts to work with in this biz. We take fake stuff, use real world logic to measure it and then pass it by when enough people say "Good enough for me"

If violation of logic and even common sense is too much for you to deal with then its time to find a new hobby.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Dudebro said:


> ...No shit son...
> 
> Your debating purely fictional material.



That's simply a terrible excuse. There's basic physical laws it has to afll under ones that atleast make sense. Saying "It makes no sense therefore fuck it" destroys the whole point of calcs.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Ask whoever wrote Elder Kai's lines.



So there is no chain reaction then, as you have to resort to an unknown (the intent of Akira Toriyama) as an excuse to not show a mechanism.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> That's simply a terrible excuse. There's basic physical laws it has to afll under ones that atleast make sense. Saying "It makes no sense therefore fuck it" destroys the whole point of calcs.



We don't judge fiction purely using physics, we judge fiction *liberally* using physics. We don't force fictions to actually conform to physical laws.


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## Nevermind (Sep 27, 2015)

So much disappointment.

This thread shows us who the real OBD'ers are.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Nevermind said:


> So much disappointment.
> 
> This thread shows us who the real OBD'ers are.



Who are they?


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## King Kakarot (Sep 27, 2015)

You don't need calcs for this feat old Kai makes it clear that 3 hits from supressed gods can destroy the universe _and_ thier dimensions 

Meaning thier raw physical strength is what is causing these shockwaves that are going to destroy everything

Is that not what was being portrayed?


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## Sablés (Sep 27, 2015)

This is silly


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## Solar (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> Who are they?



me tbh tbf


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Liquid said:


> This is silly



Very much so.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

King Kakarot said:


> You don't need calcs for this feat old Kai makes it clear that 3 hits from supressed gods can destroy the universe _and_ thier dimensions
> 
> Meaning thier raw physical strength is what is causing these shockwaves that are going to destroy everything
> 
> Is that not what was being portrayed?



Except it didn't and it was clear he was making an assumption. 

And no he also said that the shockwaves got stronger the more it spread it which is the problem here...


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Except it didn't and it was clear he was making an assumption.
> 
> And no he also said that the shockwaves got stronger the more it spread it which is the problem here...



Why is that a problem?


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> Why is that a problem?



Because it doesn't put their strength at Galaxy level which is why you and everyone else are acting butthurt.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Because it doesn't put their strength at Galaxy level which is why you and everyone else are acting butthurt.



Yes, this doesn't put their strength at galaxy level...somehow. Amirite? 

"butthurt"

Oh yeah, I was soooooo butthurt with your ridiculous arguments.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

Tonathan100 said:


> Yes, this doesn't put their strength at galaxy level...somehow. Amirite?
> 
> "butthurt"
> 
> Oh yeah, I was soooooo butthurt with your ridiculous arguments.



Clearly your spamming each page proves this.

Also his statement about the shockwaves growing in power confirms it can't even scale to their strength.


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## Dudebro (Sep 27, 2015)

Liquid said:


> This is silly



Yeah but it gives people something to do. So I can't even be mad.



Tom Servo said:


> *That's simply a terrible excuse*. There's basic physical laws it has to afll under ones that atleast make sense. Saying "It makes no sense therefore fuck it" destroys the whole point of calcs.



Its the truth and it destroys the whole point of this hobby.

But it flies here nonetheless whether people like to admit it or not.

Calcs essentially are useless. The same type of useless any other way to quantify a fictional feat is...Even if your just straight up eyeballing it and going off that.

If you want to get really anal about it, the exact moment a fictional work deviates from how the laws of physics in our universe work(Which is done the moment its spawned) no means we'd typically use to measure it whatsoever are valid.

All of vs debating is simply a matter of "he said/she said" and who can spew their bullshit in a fashion that makes the most sense to the most people around.

This isn't like trying to debate the cause of global warming or some shit. The only fact here for both parties is that there are for all intents and purposes none.


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## King Kakarot (Sep 27, 2015)

How doesn't it put them at that level when they're the ones causing the shockwaves?


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Tom Servo said:


> Clearly your spamming each page proves this.
> 
> Also his statement about the shockwaves growing in power confirms it can't even scale to their strength.


1. How?

2. The shockwave came from the raw power of the collision of their strikes, so it does scale to their striking strength.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 27, 2015)

King Kakarot said:


> How doesn't it put them at that level when they're the ones causing the shockwaves?



Because the shockwaves are getting more powerful as they spread out.


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## Nevermind (Sep 27, 2015)

What this thread shows, DEFINITIVELY.

We need more than one mod.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Nevermind said:


> What this thread shows, DEFINITIVELY.
> 
> We need more than one mod.



Why is that?


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## Ultimate Deathsaurer (Sep 27, 2015)

Ideally this incident should cause people to reevaluate what they consider to be the truth in this hobby. Fiction doesn't have to follow any of the rules we have. Doesn't actually have to make any sense at all. Dudebro is right thus I find this bickering to be pointless.


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## Ultimate Deathsaurer (Sep 27, 2015)

Nevermind said:


> What this thread shows, DEFINITIVELY.
> 
> We need more than one mod.



I could just go on an epic crackdown but I doubt anyone would be happy with that.


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## Tonathan100 (Sep 27, 2015)

Ultimate Deathsaurer said:


> I could just go on an epic crackdown but I doubt anyone would be happy with that.



And you would be right.


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## Warlordgab (Sep 27, 2015)

This makes me wonder, was Marvel's Odin fight against Seth as contested as this "universal" shockwave?


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## Montanz (Sep 27, 2015)

It comes from author narration so It's taken at face value.


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## Keollyn (Sep 27, 2015)

Make me mod again.








































God no, don't even joke like that Keo.


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## Matta Clatta (Sep 27, 2015)

Montanz said:


> It comes from author narration so It's taken at face value.



That's contested anyway for other reasons.


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## The Saiyan Prince Vegeta (Sep 28, 2015)

An already awful thread that just got worse with more posts.  I skimmed through all 8 pages and it's filled with nothing but Servo and Tonathan bitching at each other.


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## Toaa (Sep 28, 2015)

Like seriously why cant you see the feat ? They punched each other and the shockwave had enoigh power to destroy the universe.as in actually shown.Now bitching about physics magical and what not is idiotic.The feat would have beem the same even if unicorns were born from it its fiction.


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## Nighty the Mighty (Sep 28, 2015)

> 1. Luke Skywalker
> 2. Powerpuff Girls
> 3. All Keyblade Weilders
> 4. Worldbreaker Hulk
> ...



ayy lmao this order


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## Nighty the Mighty (Sep 28, 2015)

also top lel at needing more mods

the obd is dead as a doornail atm, it's not that it needs more mods its that UD doesn't think cracking down on this thread is a particularly useful action

which is correct because DB threads for DBtards to show off their new feats is the latest autism craze and the only thing spurring activity right now

it'll die when super does or when dbtards realise all this new feat does is bump them into an all new tier of comics where they get demolished by anyone who breathes.


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## Ultimate Deathsaurer (Sep 28, 2015)

Well no, something clearly needs to be worked out. Something that hopefully strikes a balance between allowing everyones excitement and curbing the nonsense. But that's not something that can be done knee-jerk style.


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## Nighty the Mighty (Sep 28, 2015)

I guarantee it won't last long enough for thinking about striking a balance to become a plausible use of time

unless you wanna institute something dumb like a page limit, which for the record never made sense and only lead to cancer multiplication


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## Haro (Sep 28, 2015)

Its a pissing contest at this point.


Im on tom's team tho


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## Abigail (Sep 28, 2015)

What I personally don't get is why you're all going on and on and SSG Goku's feats when this thread is about SSGSSJ Goku, who, IIRC, is quite a bit weaker then SSG Goku.

As for the thread itself, he at most get's by Sol (and that's iffy), but he most certainly stops at Schneider.


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## Blade (Sep 28, 2015)

Blueberry Goku is a better version of Redberry Goku.

Goku knows the abilities of this form better and he doesn't have stamina limits.

See RoF.


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## Warlordgab (Sep 28, 2015)

Blade said:


> Blueberry Goku is a better version of Redberry Goku.



Is that true? Because from what I recall from the movie, Beerus is still above Blueberry Goku


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## Blade (Sep 28, 2015)

Beerus is still much stronger than Golden Frieza, Blueberry Goku and Blueberry Vegeta despite their somewhat decent upgrades at their stats.


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## Crimson Dragoon (Sep 28, 2015)

Blueberry Goku and Blueberry Vegeta were said by Whis to be a match for Beerus if they worked together 

Very Cherry Goku is a Six to Beerus's Ten, and I don't see two Sixes beating a Ten


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## Imagine (Sep 28, 2015)

Blueberry Goku 

Blueberry Vegeta

Tell ya friends


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## Gilgamesh (Sep 28, 2015)

80% SSG Goku was equal to 70% Beerus.

Blueper Saiyan Goku should be his equal or even a little bit stronger. Fucking Toriyama.


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## Blade (Sep 28, 2015)

At best, Blueberry Goku and Blueberry Vegeta are a 7 now with Golden Frieza being 7,5 which means nothing compared to Beerus.


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## Blade (Sep 28, 2015)

Lol Imagine, we were saying the Blueberry and Redberry names before you posted your shitty opinion on that vs thread.


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## Imagine (Sep 28, 2015)

I know this Burado.

My opinions the GOAT


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## Blade (Sep 28, 2015)

As GOAT as Tsuna's manliness.


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## Ultimate Deathsaurer (Sep 28, 2015)

Let's not take this thread off topic too


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