# Tsunade vs Sasuke



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Battlefield: Valley of the End.

Restrictions-

Tsunade: No katsuya.

Sasuke: Taka Sasuke. No mangekyou sharingan.

Knowledge: Manga knowledge

State of mind: IC

Starting distance: 30 metres.


(waiting for Lady Tsunade so we can duke it out)


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## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

I've arrived. 

Let's. Get. Started! 

Tsunade wins. Sasuke relies too much on his Mangekyo Sharingan, and without it, he only has his speed, Katana, and basic jutsu. Nothing that can stop Tsunade. :ho


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## David (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> I've arrived.
> 
> Let's. Get. Started!
> 
> Tsunade wins. Sasuke relies too much on his Mangekyo Sharingan, and without it, he only has his speed, Katana, and basic jutsu. Nothing that can stop Tsunade. :ho



His katana can slice her head off; Sasuke should be fast enough to manage that.


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## e697 (Sep 27, 2009)

Sasuke wins with easy difficulty. He is much faster than her and has his sharingan prediction to easily avoid her giant punches. One chidori nagashi followed by blossom chidori and its over.


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## Creator (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> *Tsunade: No katsuya.*
> 
> *Sasuke: Taka Sasuke. No mangekyou sharingan.*
> 
> Starting distance: 30 metres.



The restrictions are really fair.  

Based on the sheer biasness of this match, not to mention its only set up to bait Tsunade fans and give Uchiha/Sasuke fans another reason to wank off, i will go with Tsunade.

Sasuke has no knowledge of what his running into, and this is Sasuke, he will alway charge without knowing. Where as Tsunade knows about Sasuke. Plus shes Senju. Manga canon dictates that Sasuke lay down on the floor like the Uchiha dog he is.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

Daviddd said:


> His katana can slice her head off; Sasuke should be fast enough to manage that.



Souzou Saisei negates that. And that's assuming he can land a hit on an evasion expert.



e697 said:


> Sasuke wins with easy difficulty. He is much faster than her and has his sharingan prediction to easily avoid her giant punches. One chidori nagashi followed by blossom chidori and its over.



He may be able to dodge the hits, but he can't dodge the devastation that they land on the terrain.


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## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Current Sasuke is relying on his mangekyou sharingan. Sasuke has good enough skills when it comes to his base sharingan.

His speed is enough to keep away from Tsunade's punches. And Sasuke would know whether or not she's moulding chakra in her hands, as the sharingan can see chakra flow.  Even if he tried to charge her, the sharingan allows the user some room for error as they can avoid creating a "tunnel" like vision, and dodge the initial attacks.

From her fighting style, it would become obvious that she relies a lot on taijutsu. Keeping his distance and using his mid range chidori eisou and trying to catch her with genjutsu would be a good strategy.

Now assuming she gets close enough to try and land a hit, chidori nagashi would completely stop and paralyze the opponents from making any other moves. 

I'll get back to you guys, my food just came out the microwave.


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## Haruhifan21 (Sep 27, 2009)

Itachi vs. Orochimaru, anyone?


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## e697 (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Souzou Saisei negates that. And that's assuming he can land a hit on an evasion expert.
> 
> 
> 
> He may be able to dodge the hits, but he can't dodge the devastation that they land on the terrain.



She cant regenerate her head...

Its called a simple jump/shunshin. And as I said before if she get close to him he can easily use chidori nagashi to paralyze her and cut of her head.


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## Shizune (Sep 27, 2009)

So Sasuke has a boss summon and Tsunade doesn't?


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## hmph (Sep 27, 2009)

Honestly Sasuke loses this. IC Sasuke with manga knowledge would just rush her with his sword and get one shotted. He wouldn't find out about her strength until after she uses it - he'd just see some chakra in her fist. Other than that, dodging at melee range when Sasuke is charging is not exactly easy, since Tsunade can just ignore his first blow.


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## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Creator said:


> Do people really believe that an Uchiha can win against a Senju?
> 
> If Sasuke is proud to be an Uchiha, then he will do what all Uchiha's do. Lay down on the floor and beg the Senju forvgiveness.



So Itachi wouldn't be able to beat Tsunade or Asuma?

Nice logic here.

Tsunade'd probably do what Asuma did. Close his eyes in front of the uchiha.


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## David (Sep 27, 2009)

Shizazzle said:


> So Sasuke has a boss summon and Tsunade doesn't?



Imo that doesn't make it unfair.  Remember- Tsunade can 1HKO summons.  What makes this unfair is Sasuke's skill and his Sharingan.

If you take away his Sharingan, this might become fair 

Actually, since this is VotE, Tsunade won't get blitzed immediately, though I still think she'd lose.


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## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-240/page014.html
Since Sasuke does rush the opponent, he'd be able to see the counters. That's the reason he's so efficient with his shunshin. Because his sharingan allows him the vision to deal with that speed.

If Tsunade tried to counter it'd just end up like this
Link removed

Sasuke rushed in at point blank, and he managed to dodge the fatest characters attack.

And as for Tsunades taijutsu, unless she's faster than people who can leave after images, it'd just end up like this:

Link removed
Link removed
Link removed
Link removed


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## hmph (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> If Tsunade tried to counter it'd just end up like this
> Link removed
> 
> Sasuke rushed in at point blank, and he managed to dodge the fatest characters attack.



Do me a favor and click next page twice.


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## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

hmph said:


> Do me a favor and click next page twice.



Do me a favour and click the page once.

He dodged the attack and his hand got stuck. That won't happen with Tsunade, as her body doesn't protect herself to the extent of a raiton shroud.

So what's your point?


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## Sasukekillsitachi (Sep 27, 2009)

Sasuke wins with ease, just his speed and katana does the job, not to mention Chidori and Kirin, summons, sharingan genjutsu, insight, and his tactical mind etc.

*This thread was made to show how pathetic Tsunade is, right Ace?

Just look at her pathetic situation, she is good as dead in the manga. She couldn't do crap to Pein. Jiraiya or Orochimaru would have at least given Pein a run for his money.*


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## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

People realize that Taka Sasuke cannot summon snakes, right?


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## David (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> People realize that Taka Sasuke cannot summon snakes, right?



Even though he doesn't have Orochimaru anymore, where's the proof that his blood-bound contract with the snakes still doesn't apply?


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## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Current Sasuke is relying on his mangekyou sharingan. Sasuke has good enough skills when it comes to his base sharingan.




But is he good enough to take down a Kage-level shinobi who can't die in battle?



> His speed is enough to keep away from Tsunade's punches. And Sasuke would know whether or not she's moulding chakra in her hands, as the sharingan can see chakra flow.  Even if he tried to charge her, the sharingan allows the user some room for error as they can avoid creating a "tunnel" like vision, and dodge the initial attacks.



Dodge the point-blank attacks, but most likely not the damage that occurs on the playing field and surrounding areas, to which she can use to his advantage. I doubt he can destroy boulders with ease should they be flying all about him as the area's being ripped apart.



> From her fighting style, it would become obvious that she relies a lot on taijutsu. Keeping his distance and using his mid range chidori eisou and trying to catch her with genjutsu would be a good strategy.



Jiraiya specifically taught Naruto how to counter genjutsu simply because he would encounter Itachi again. When teaching Naruto, he said the best way to counter genjutsu is to halt your chakra, or disturb the flow. Seeing as Tsunade's chakra control is as close to perfect as possible, genjutsu won't really be a factor in this match, assuming a war veteran who most likely came upon genjutsu-wielding shinobi during her long life can realize she's in a genjutsu and break out promptly.



> Now assuming she gets close enough to try and land a hit, chidori nagashi would completely stop and paralyze the opponents from making any other moves.



Well, it'd be simple to pull a Kabuto-esque trick then. Medical shinobi of a high calibre know the links to what controls what, and a medic nin of Tsunade's calibre would be able to quickly rework them, perhaps even more so than Kabuto. And Ranshinsho could complete the same effect on Sasuke. I wonder if Ranshinsho would give Tsunade some measure of control over Chidori Nagashi, in terms of breaking it out. 



> I'll get back to you guys, my food just came out the microwave.



Get in that kitchen and make me a sandwich.



e697 said:


> She cant regenerate her head...



I highly doubt Tsunade would over look such an obvious method of dying when claiming she would not die in battle. There's absolutely no evidence to state that she can without a doubt not regrow her head.



> Its called a simple jump/shunshin. And as I said before if she get close to him he can easily use chidori nagashi to paralyze her and cut of her head.



And if he gets close to her, a OHKO is coming his way. She excels in close range combat, as well as evasion. He'd be as hardpressed to get a hit on her because of her evasion as she would because of his speed.



♠Ace♠ said:


> So Itachi wouldn't be able to beat Tsunade or Asuma?




Most likely Asuma, but Tsunade's a shady area.



> Nice logic here.



He's pleased that you approve.



> Tsunade'd probably do what Asuma did. Close his eyes in front of the uchiha.



Or use her analytical skills as a medic and read his movements from his feet, similar to Sakura reading Sasori's movements before they happened due to his fingers.

Think of it as a medic's sharingan. 



Daviddd said:


> Imo that doesn't make it unfair.  Remember- Tsunade can 1HKO summons.  What makes this unfair is Sasuke's skill and his Sharingan.



It's totally unfair that Tsunade has years of experience over him, and a method to ensure she won't die. 



> If you take away all of Tsunade's abilities, this _might_ become fair



I agree. 



> Actually, since this is VotE, Tsunade won't get blitzed immediately, though I still think she'd lose.



Debatable. 



Sasukekillsitachi said:


> Sasuke wins with ease, just his speed and katana does the job, not to mention Chidori and Kirin, summons, sharingan genjutsu, insight, and his tactical mind etc.



All tanked with Souzou Saisei. GG.



> *This thread was made to show how pathetic Tsunade is, right Ace?*


*

More like how to show Sasuke would lose without his uber haxx. 




Just look at her pathetic situation, she is good as dead in the manga. She couldn't do crap to Pein. Jiraiya or Orochimaru would have at least given Pein a run for his money.
		
Click to expand...

*
Except heal an entire village, regenerate that entire village using Souzou Saisei + Katsuyu, and even go so far as to challenge him even without chakra. 

And that's where your logic failed. Tsunade's alive, but comatose. Pain's dead. Who's the real winner here?


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## Mithos (Sep 27, 2009)

Taka Sasuke's whole fighting style revolves around MS spam, and MS is restricted. IC sasuke will charge Tsunade recklessly,like he always does, and be crushed by Tsunade's immense strength. 

Sasuke doesn't have anything he can use besides his chidori variants and katana, which is not enough to defeat Tsunade. Almost all of Sasuke's _effective_ moves are either MS, or close ranged and close range is a bad idea against Tsunade.


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## Sasukekillsitachi (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> People realize that Taka Sasuke cannot summon snakes, right?



Maybe, but the manga still haven't stated it yet. Maybe Sasuke is just conserving his chakra (for MS moves) because who needs snake summons when you have MS?

But he doesn't need summons or curse seal to beat someone as barely Kakashi level like Tsunade 

Just some Katons and Tsunade will show an opening and then her head goes off to space 

I am sure Naruto without Sage Mode would fuck her up just as bad too.

Kage Bunshin plus Fuuton Rasengan, and even Kakuzu got raped.


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## e697 (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> I highly doubt Tsunade would over look such an obvious method of dying when claiming she would not die in battle. There's absolutely no evidence to state that she can without a doubt not regrow her head.



It does not matter what she said. So you are saying she can not die in battle because she can pop a head out of her ass? This is when I totally stop taking your post seriously.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

Sasukekillsitachi said:


> Maybe, but the manga still haven't stated it yet. Maybe Sasuke is just conserving his chakra (for MS moves) because who needs snake summons when you have MS?
> 
> But he doesn't need summons or curse seal to beat someone as barely Kakashi level like Tsunade
> 
> ...



And this, young boys and girls, is a tard. Immune to all logic and reason. 

Well, I've got a cure for that.



> Itachi: "Behold, this is the last Jutsu up my arsenal: LegendaryBeauty!"
> Zetsu: "She uses morals as an unstoppable sword and logic as an unbreakable shield. It's... invincible!" "Fanboys searched for these two legendary items all over the world but still cannot find it!"







e697 said:


> It does not matter what she said. So you are saying she can not die in battle because she can pop a head out of her ass? This is when I totally stop taking your post seriously.



So you know her limitations better than herself? Where've you been, God? Pass judgement down on the bashers!


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## Sasukekillsitachi (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> But is he good enough to take down a Kage-level shinobi who can't die in battle?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



This is manga, nothing can be said as haxx. You answers don't tell shit to what I said. You just got 'speechless' cuz no one thinks Tsunade is strong, or at least Kakashi level 

*Just get off from that whore's legs you perverted Tsunade fanboy/fangirl.*

*Wish my buddy Taz was there, cuz he would have messed you up even more Lady Tsunade *


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## hmph (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Do me a favour and click the page once.
> 
> He dodged the attack and his hand got stuck. That won't happen with Tsunade, as her body doesn't protect herself to the extent of a raiton shroud.
> 
> So what's your point?



What? Since when was it stuck? It certainly came right out easily. And the stuck argument is in contradiction to the armor statement... it'd go right in Tsunade. Its just that Tsunade wouldn't have to care. Furthermore, it'd be a sword, making the point moot from a chidori angle. But all that aside, throwing a great deal of weight and momentum in the direction of your opponent makes it very difficult to dodge a counter attack. The general reason it works is because the target must also dodge or block your attack before they can think about a counter attack. But Tsunade doesn't have to. She can throw 2 hands. a foot, and her weight into tapping Sasuke, and one tap is all it would take. What Sasuke does is suicide really, and it should've been the death of mr. overconfident a long time ago. In the battledome, it is.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

Sasukekillsitachi said:


> This is manga, nothing can be said as haxx. You answers don't tell shit to what I said. You just got 'speechless' cuz no one thinks Tsunade is strong, or at least Kakashi level



Adding onto the perfect definition.


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## David (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> I highly doubt Tsunade would over look such an obvious method of dying when claiming she would not die in battle. There's absolutely no evidence to state that she can without a doubt not regrow her head.





e697 said:


> It does not matter what she said. So you are saying she can not die in battle because she can pop a head out of her ass? This is when I totally stop taking your post seriously.



I gotta sig this. LMAO


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## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Wall of text I see

Ok where do I start....



> But is he good enough to take down a Kage-level shinobi who can't die in battle?



Kage Level is very vague. Sasuke was able to keep Deidara at bay. One of the stronger akatsuki members who arugably is kage level. 

And she can die in battle. Paralyzing her, or dealing fatal wounds to her head/mid sections would make it very difficult for her.

Raition is a bad matchup.



> Dodge the point-blank attacks, but most likely not the damage that occurs on the playing field and surrounding areas, to which she can use to his advantage. I doubt he can destroy boulders with ease should they be flying all about him as the area's being ripped apart.


This is the VOTE. Avoiding large scale destruction should be that hard.



> Jiraiya specifically taught Naruto how to counter genjutsu simply because he would encounter Itachi again. When teaching Naruto, he said the best way to counter genjutsu is to halt your chakra, or disturb the flow. Seeing as Tsunade's chakra control is as close to perfect as possible, genjutsu won't really be a factor in this match, assuming a war veteran who most likely came upon genjutsu-wielding shinobi during her long life can realize she's in a genjutsu and break out promptly.



This is a bit of a speculation. Tsunade really hasn't shown anything that could lead us to the conclusion that she'd be able to disturb her chakra before the genjutsu takes its toll.

First off, sharingan genjutsu is on a whole other level when it comes to its effects. Sasukes sharingan genjutsu was strong enough that Shii wasn't even able to move, let alone try and disturb his chakra flow. It's completley different than what Tsunade would've encountered.



> Well, it'd be simple to pull a Kabuto-esque trick then. Medical shinobi of a high calibre know the links to what controls what, and a medic nin of Tsunade's calibre would be able to quickly rework them, perhaps even more so than Kabuto. And Ranshinsho could complete the same effect on Sasuke. I wonder if Ranshinsho would give Tsunade some measure of control over Chidori Nagashi, in terms of breaking it out


Except Chidori nagashi happens instantly, and has a paralyzing nature.



> Get in that kitchen and make me a sandwich.


Already did.



> I highly doubt Tsunade would over look such an obvious method of dying when claiming she would not die in battle. There's absolutely no evidence to state that she can without a doubt not regrow her head.


She can't regrow her head.



> And if he gets close to her, a OHKO is coming his way. She excels in close range combat, as well as evasion. He'd be as hardpressed to get a hit on her because of her evasion as she would because of his speed.


Again, I'll refer to Raikage vs Sasuke.

Sasuke rushed in against a faster, more taijutsu orientated opponent, and was able to dodge one of the fastest characters to date.

Tsunade won't hit him.



> Or use her analytical skills as a medic and read his movements from his feet, similar to Sakura reading Sasori's movements before they happened due to his fingers.
> 
> Think of it as a medic's sharingan.


That sounds easy but it's near impossible.

Sasuke's shunshin moves incredibly fast, and it'd be hard to catch his movements when his upper body is where most of his techniques come from.

Looking at the upper body and not seeing his eyes would be quite hard.



> It's totally unfair that Tsunade has years of experience over him, and a method to ensure she won't die.


Jiraiya had years over Naruto, and look how that turned out.

And it's kinda unfair that Sasuke has a method of which Tsunade won't be able to hit him

Juanita Tequila
Juanita Tequila

Tsunade isn't as fast as KN0. She isn't touching the sauce.


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## Sasukekillsitachi (Sep 27, 2009)

Daviddd said:


> I gotta sig this. LMAO



Same here, too bad I already got a badass sig


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## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

hmph said:


> What? Since when was it stuck? It certainly came right out easily. And the stuck argument is in contradiction to the armor statement... it'd go right in Tsunade. Its just that Tsunade wouldn't have to care. Furthermore, it'd be a sword, making the point moot from a chidori angle. But all that aside, throwing a great deal of weight and momentum in the direction of your opponent makes it very difficult to dodge a counter attack. The general reason it works is because the target must also dodge or block your attack before they can think about a counter attack. But Tsunade doesn't have to. She can throw 2 hands. a foot, and her weight into tapping Sasuke, and one tap is all it would take. What Sasuke does is suicide really, and it should've been the death of mr. overconfident a long time ago. In the battledome, it is.



This is chidori:

math
Able to break through something as dense as that.

And this is against Raikage, with a stronger chidori:
math

CLEARLY it was stuck. It didn't go past his fingers, while a pre skip Sasuke was able to penetrate Gaaras insanely dense sand.

Tsunade's body won't protect her like Gaaras sand. She'd be half dead with a chidori through the chest.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Wall of text I see
> 
> Ok where do I start....



Wall-o-Text replies are always fun. 



> Kage Level is very vague. Sasuke was able to keep Deidara at bay. One of the stronger akatsuki members who arugably is kage level.
> 
> And she can die in battle. Paralyzing her, or dealing fatal wounds to her head/mid sections would make it very difficult for her.
> 
> Raition is a bad matchup.



Paralyzing her, the kunoichi who knows the body better than anyone? Ranshinsho could possibly counteract the effects, and even if not, should Sasuke be hit by Ranshinsho, it's over.



> This is the VOTE. Avoiding large scale destruction should be that hard.



But make it that much harder.



> This is a bit of a speculation. Tsunade really hasn't shown anything that could lead us to the conclusion that she'd be able to disturb her chakra before the genjutsu takes its toll.
> 
> First off, sharingan genjutsu is on a whole other level when it comes to its effects. Sasukes sharingan genjutsu was strong enough that Shii wasn't even able to move, let alone try and disturb his chakra flow. It's completley different than what Tsunade would've encountered.



Aside from having epic chakra control, as most medics do, which is essential to breaking out of genjutsu.

And I think Jiraiya, the shinobi with the excellent information resources, would know what he was talking about when specifically training Naruto to counteract _Itachi's_ genjutsu.

And should Souzou Saisei be activated, chakra will be flowing constantly to continuously regenerate any damaged parts, and the fluctuating chakra would presumably break her out of genjutsu as quick as she's put in it.



> Except Chidori nagashi happens instantly, and has a paralyzing nature.



As does Ranshinshou, which she can pass off as a poorly-aimed tap.



> Already did.



Good. 



> She can't regrow her head.



Speculation.



> Again, I'll refer to Raikage vs Sasuke.
> 
> Sasuke rushed in against a faster, more taijutsu orientated opponent, and was able to dodge one of the fastest characters to date.
> 
> Tsunade won't hit him.



Even if not him, certainly the area around him. He'd be just as hard-pressed to hit or even catch her, as even when tired out and out of shape, she can dodge attacks inches from her, as shown with Kabuto's doton trick.



> That sounds easy but it's near impossible.




Sasuke's shunshin moves incredibly fast, and it'd be hard to catch his movements when his upper body is where most of his techniques come from.

Looking at the upper body and not seeing his eyes would be quite hard.[/QUOTE]

Up to the shoulders is fine. pimp



> Jiraiya had years over Naruto, and look how that turned out.




Naruto's not the best at learning new types of techniques. After all, he was a dunce, but an analytical genius/experienced shinobi like Tsunade should have no problem.



> And it's kinda unfair that Sasuke has a method of which Tsunade won't be able to hit him
> 
> math
> math
> ...



Just as often as he'll catch her. Close to zero. 

Reply whenever I get near a comp. Off for now. Ciao.


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## e697 (Sep 27, 2009)

Ya except chidori nagashi spreads around his whole body in like a 5 meter radius while rashafnonoern or whatever that gay move is only covers her hands and with sharingan and the obvious chakra on the hand Sasuke has no problems dodging that.


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## hmph (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> This is chidori:
> 
> math
> Able to break through something as dense as that.
> ...



Ah, you're not great at English? "Stuck" implies Sasuke wouldn't be able to remove his hand. The word you're looking for is stopped. Yes, Raikage stopped it, and Tsunade would not. But Tsunade would just regenerate it. Sousou Seisei has overcome holes in her before. And again, Sasuke would characteristically use a sword and swing it in an arc for a nonlethal but debilitating blow. Useless.


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## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

> Wall-o-Text replies are always fun.






> Paralyzing her, the kunoichi who knows the body better than anyone? Ranshinsho could possibly counteract the effects, and even if not, should Sasuke be hit by Ranshinsho, it's over.


Actually, no.

Sasuke has run a chidori through his body before. And has been hit by amped up electricity.

Sasuke can run lightning through his body without any fatal consequences.



> But make it that much harder.


Not really.



> Aside from having epic chakra control, as most medics do, which is essential to breaking out of genjutsu.
> 
> And I think Jiraiya, the shinobi with the excellent information resources, would know what he was talking about when specifically training Naruto to counteract Itachi's genjutsu.
> 
> And should Souzou Saisei be activated, chakra will be flowing constantly to continuously regenerate any damaged parts, and the fluctuating chakra would presumably break her out of genjutsu as quick as she's put in it.



Itachi really didn't know the extent of Itachi's genjutsu. Let alone Tsukiyomi. He didn't even know about amaterasu.

And he wasn't training Naruto to specifically counter Itachi's genjutsu, but genjutsu in general.

Also, it _doesn't_ constantly inject chakra into her system. It does it all at once.


*Spoiler*: __ 



Created by the greatest of medical ninja, Tsunade, this is the ultimate regeneration technique!! By releasing a large amount of chakra at once, the body's cell division is forcibly stimulated, reconstruction all organs and all tissues making up the human body!




AFter that initial injection of chakra, she is still rendered vulnerable to Sasuke's genjutsu.



> As does Ranshinshou, which she can pass off as a poorly-aimed tap.



Chidori nagashi has a longer range.

And as I said before, he can inject electricity into his body without major consequnces.



> Speculation.


Ok, even if by some chance she could, Sasuke see's her growing her head back, and destroys the body.



> Even if not him, certainly the area around him. He'd be just as hard-pressed to hit or even catch her, as even when tired out and out of shape, she can dodge attacks inches from her, as shown with Kabuto's doton trick.



Can she dodge all these?

While avoiding this?




> Naruto's not the best at learning new types of techniques. After all, he was a dunce, but an analytical genius/experienced shinobi like Tsunade should have no problem.


Sasuke's pretty smart himself.

Figuring out how Deidaras explosives worked, and having back up plans just in case the land mines around him went off.

Sasuke is very intelligent.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


>








> Actually, no.
> 
> Sasuke has run a chidori through his body before. And has been hit by amped up electricity.
> 
> Sasuke can run lightning through his body without any fatal consequences.



How about his nervous system? :ho Running it throughout his body and around him is fine, but if his signals are switched, he can't do squat.



> Not really.
> 
> 
> 
> *Itachi really didn't know the extent of Itachi's genjutsu. Let alone Tsukiyomi. He didn't even know about amaterasu.*




Then Itachi must be really dumb if he doen't know his own techniques. 

I assume you meant Jiraiya.



> And he wasn't training Naruto to specifically counter Itachi's genjutsu, but genjutsu in general.



He didn't teach Naruto any genjutsu defence before he had that skirmish with Itachi. It was so he could protect himself from Itachi should the Akatsuki attack him while he wasn't there.



> Also, it _doesn't_ constantly inject chakra into her system. It does it all at once.





> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Releasing it all at once, and it presumably flows throughout her system, ready to stimulate protein and regenerate her as needed during the duration of the jutsu.



> Chidori nagashi has a longer range.
> 
> And as I said before, he can inject electricity into his body without major consequnces.



Body, sure. Nervous system twisted? He doesn't have the medical knowledge to counteract that.




> Ok, even if by some chance she could, Sasuke see's her growing her head back, and destroys the body.



Destroys the body?  That's rich. 



> Can she dodge all these?
> 
> While avoiding this?



But of course. 



> Sasuke's pretty smart himself.
> 
> Figuring out how Deidaras explosives worked, and having back up plans just in case the land mines around him went off.
> 
> Sasuke is very intelligent.



No one's questioning whether he's smart. Just whether he can defeat a kunoichi with temporary immortality and the strength of a giant.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

Creator said:


> Why else did Itachi flee when Asuma found a way around his sharingan? Uchiha Dogs dont stand a chance against Senju gods.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



No, actually. This was supposed to be a little friendly competition between me and Ace, and he even let me set some of the conditions. It's far from an attempt to bash Tsunade, just a place to debate which one is superior.

And he knows deep down who it is.


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


>






> How about his nervous system?  Running it throughout his body and around him is fine, but if his signals are switched, he can't do squat


.

Ironically, that IS how electricity would affect your body anyway. If enough electricity enters the body, it automaticlly would affect the nervous system.

And since Rashinshou works exactly like this, it wouldn't affect him.

Tsunade's move injects electricity into the nervous system. But running a chidori through your body on the microscopic level would have the same affects.

Not to mention that chidori has more electricity in it than a rashinshou.





> Then Itachi must be really dumb if he doen't know his own techniques.
> 
> I assume you meant Jiraiya.






> He didn't teach Naruto any genjutsu defence before he had that skirmish with Itachi. It was so he could protect himself from Itachi should the Akatsuki attack him while he wasn't there.


Yeah, but it was also to teach him against genjutsu generally. 




> Releasing it all at once, and it presumably flows throughout her system, ready to stimulate protein and regenerate her as needed during the duration of the jutsu.


No it goes once, and stimulates the bodies cells. So after that initial injection of chakra, the body does the rest, not the chakra she released.

In other words, she'd be affected by genjutsu.



> Body, sure. Nervous system twisted? He doesn't have the medical knowledge to counteract that.


He did it on a microscopic level. He had to have hit his nervous system.

Also, even if it's not intended, if you inject enough electricity into the body, it would affect the nervous system no matter the intentions.

And since chidori has a considerable amount of electricity, it's obvious that he also hit his nervous system.

It just doesn't affect him.



> But of course


Nope



> No one's questioning whether he's smart. Just whether he can defeat a kunoichi with temporary immortality and the strength of a giant.




And I'm questioning whether or not medical genius would stop her from being paralyzed or grant her the ability to hit someone who is faster and can dodge movements from a kn0 naruto before the time skip.


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Creator said:


> Why else did Itachi flee when Asuma found a way around his sharingan? *Uchiha Dogs dont stand a chance against Senju gods.*
> 
> 
> 
> ...



http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-440/page010.html
Runuganga

And no this thread was not meant to bash Tsunade.


----------



## Creator (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-440/page010.html
> Runuganga
> 
> And no this thread was not meant to bash Tsunade.



Lets see. 

Older brother with the Eye becomes a hater. Ie Uchiha.

Younger brother with the body becomes the leader. Ie Senju.

First Hokage = Senju = Leader.

Madara = Uchiha = Epic fail.

The maths is simple. Tsunade > Uchiha underling who thinks his any good. 



Lady Tsunade said:


> No, actually. This was supposed to be a little friendly competition between me and Ace, and he even let me set some of the conditions. It's far from an attempt to bash Tsunade, just a place to debate which one is superior.
> 
> And he knows deep down who it is.



Oh....then why am i even posting here? :S


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Creator said:


> Lets see.
> 
> Older brother with the Eye becomes a hater. Ie Uchiha.
> 
> ...



Madara = strongest character = above Tsunade.

What's your point here?

If you're trying to say that Senju's have more class than Uchihas, then fine, but to say that they are automatically stronger is pretty stupid.

Especially considering the fact that only 1 Senju is stronger than Madara, and that's Harishama. 



> Oh....then why am i even posting here? :S


That's what I wanna know.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


>



:ho
.



> Ironically, that IS how electricity would affect your body anyway. If enough electricity enters the body, it automaticlly would affect the nervous system.
> 
> And since Rashinshou works exactly like this, it wouldn't affect him.




By switching up the signals? Chidori Nagashi/(Eiso?) doesn't work like that. He's still able to function with that jutsu working. The question is would he be able if his electrical impulses were _flippped._ If Ranshinsho simply just poured chakra into his body, there would be no use to it on Sasuke. But it creates an electrical field that messes with the opponent's nervous system and switches signals. That's the problem.



> Tsunade's move injects electricity into the nervous system. But running a chidori through your body on the microscopic level would have the same affects.



Acting like you're the medical expert. Sorry, that's me.  Chidori defused all of Deidara's bombs, but it didn't hamper/affect his movements because it wasn't directed at his nerves. Simply running it through his body to deactivate them. Tsunade's Ranshinsho actively targets the _nerves themselves._



> Not to mention that chidori has more electricity in it than a rashinshou.



I was about to type 'debatable', but Tsunade did say she converted a small amount of chakra into electricity, where as Chidori seemingly has more.

But what if she used alot more chakra for Ranshinsho? 




>







> Yeah, but it was also to teach him against genjutsu generally.



With the ulterior motive of/while at the same time specifically getting him ready to counter Itachi's genjutsu.



> No it goes once, and stimulates the bodies cells. So after that initial injection of chakra, the body does the rest, not the chakra she released.
> 
> In other words, she'd be affected by genjutsu.



It's years worth of chakra. It's not going to be used up instantly. I assume it'd be at least some time for it to be all out, and stimulate the proteins. During which time genjutsu could potentially be negated.

And even if so, she has the chakra control to negate it. The question is whether Sasuke catches her in one at all, and whether or not she'll realize it in time.




> He did it on a microscopic level. He had to have hit his nervous system.




He ran it through his body to deactivate the bombs. I doubt it was centered on his nervous system. 



> Also, even if it's not intended, if you inject enough electricity into the body, it would affect the nervous system no matter the intentions.



Is that so?



> And since chidori has a considerable amount of electricity, it's obvious that he also hit his nervous system.
> 
> It just doesn't affect him.



Assuming your latter point is right.




> Nope



Quite. 



> And I'm questioning whether or not medical genius would stop her from being paralyzed or grant her the ability to hit someone who is faster and can dodge movements from a kn0 naruto before the time skip.[/COLOR]



Assuming he lasts long enough a kunoichi whose hits can kill in a single blow, can evade most, if not all, of his attacks, and one-shot any summons he brings into battle. 

Granted, we're both doing our fair share of assumptions.



Creator said:


> Oh....then why am i even posting here?



Because he's questioning (no matter whether in friendly sportsmanship or not) Tsunade's abilities to curbstomp an Uchiha, when her family's done so for years. 



♠Ace♠ said:


> Madara = strongest character = above Tsunade.
> 
> What's your point here?
> 
> ...



Madara's an anomaly. He's supposed to have been dead, and hides his face behind a mask and adopts an child-like persona. He's not to be trusted.


----------



## Creator (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Madara = strongest character = above Tsunade.
> 
> What's your point here?
> 
> ...



We dont know the full extent of Tsunade's abilities. Plus shes Senju. She has something up her sleeves. 



> That's what I wanna know.



I was unaware of this debate you had with LT. I thought it was just a normal question asked about Sasuke VS Tsunade. Thus since it involved Tsunade i posted.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

Creator said:


> *I was unaware of this debate you had with LT.* I thought it was just a normal question asked about Sasuke VS Tsunade. Thus since it involved Tsunade i posted.



You should know by now I deal with all things Tsunade. And if you were such a big Tsunade-tard, I would've thought you'd be aware of everything that goes on with Tsunade. :ho

I kid.


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> :ho






> By switching up the signals? Chidori Nagashi/(Eiso?) doesn't work like that. He's still able to function with that jutsu working. The question is would he be able if his electrical impulses were flippped. If Ranshinsho simply just poured chakra into his body, there would be no use to it on Sasuke. But it creates an electrical field that messes with the opponent's nervous system and switches signals. That's the problem.



Forget Chidori Nagashi.

He was able to inject a chidori through his body. Whether or not he was aiming for his nervous system is debatable, but it doesn't matter. 

Even if he didn't want to hit his nervous system, when you pour that much electricity into your body, it'll hit your nervous system no matter what you intentions.

Seriously. If you stuck your fork in an outlet, the doctor would be telling you about how fucked up your nervous system got.



> Acting like you're the medical expert. Sorry, that's me.  Chidori defused all of Deidara's bombs, but it didn't hamper/affect his movements because it wasn't directed at his nerves. Simply running it through his body to deactivate them. Tsunade's Ranshinsho actively targets the nerves themselves


Like I said before, it doesn't matter whether or not he voluntarily aimed for his nervous system. The sheer amount of electricity would've affected it either way.



> I was about to type 'debatable', but Tsunade did say she converted a small amount of chakra into electricity, where as Chidori seemingly has more.
> 
> *But what if she used alot more chakra for Ranshinsho*?


It'd be the same thing as running a chidori through your body.




> CLICK






> With the ulterior motive of/while at the same time specifically getting him ready to counter Itachi's genjutsu.


Yes, even though that failed miserably.



> It's years worth of chakra. It's not going to be used up instantly. I assume it'd be at least some time for it to be all out, and stimulate the proteins. During which time genjutsu could potentially be negated.
> 
> And even if so, she has the chakra control to negate it. The question is whether Sasuke catches her in one at all, and whether or not she'll realize it in time.



It wouldn't be used up instantly, but it wouldn't last throughout a battle. She'd be vulnerable against a genjutsu sooner or later.

Whetehr or not he catches her in one is the question, but even if she would realize it'd be hard to break out. Shii realized and he couldn't do anything, even though he's a jounin and a genjutsu expert.



> He ran it through his body to deactivate the bombs. I doubt it was centered on his nervous system.


It doesn't matter whether or not it was aimed for his nervous system, if you run that much electricity into your body it won't avoid your nervous system just because you want it too.



> Is that so?


Yes for the 25326246420968246487260 time



> Assuming he lasts long enough a kunoichi whose hits can kill in a single blow, can evade most, if not all, of his attacks, and one-shot any summons he brings into battle.
> 
> Granted, we're both doing our fair share of assumptions.



Sasuke doens't have snake summons, he lost them when he lost Oro.

And I'm not assuming



> Madara's an anomaly. He's supposed to have been dead, and hides his face behind a mask and adopts an child-like persona. He's not to be trusted.


He was called the world's strongest man at one point. Everyone that's heard his name has shit themselves. And he basically has the world at his balls right now.

And last time I checked, those Senju pussies offered up a treaty. And then the only way they could kill the Uchiha, was with another Uchiha.

Madara>every senju except Shodai
And judging by feats the same applies to Itachi


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Creator said:


> We dont know the full extent of Tsunade's abilities. Plus shes Senju. She has something up her sleeves.
> 
> 
> 
> I was unaware of this debate you had with LT. I thought it was just a normal question asked about Sasuke VS Tsunade. Thus since it involved Tsunade i posted.



She doesn't wear sleeves

Oh my bad, but yeah, it wasn't meant to bash Tsunade in any way.


----------



## David (Sep 27, 2009)

After reading so many comments, I believe that no matter what you say or do, Ace, Lady Tsunade (and maybe also Creator) won't be convinced.


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Daviddd said:


> After reading so many comments, I believe that no matter what you say or do, Ace, Lady Tsunade (and maybe also Creator) won't be convinced.



That's what makes it so fun


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


>







> Forget Chidori Nagashi.
> 
> He was able to inject a chidori through his body. Whether or not he was aiming for his nervous system is debatable, but it doesn't matter.
> 
> Even if he didn't want to hit his nervous system, when you pour that much electricity into your body, it'll hit your nervous system no matter what you intentions.




Please provide me with some evidence. I'd like to believe you. Consider it just a formality. 



> Seriously. If you stuck your fork in an outlet, the doctor would be telling you about how fucked up your nervous system got.



But would it re-arrange the way you move afterwards? Hardly.



> Like I said before, it doesn't matter whether or not he voluntarily aimed for his nervous system. The sheer amount of electricity would've affected it either way.







> It'd be the same thing as running a chidori through your body.



I wasn't aware Chidori re-arranged his nervous system patterns and made it hard for him to move.



>







> Yes, even though that failed miserably.



Excellent in theory. It's just that the one who was doing it was Naruto, who doesn't really have a knack for pulling off complicated jutsu unless taught vigorously. Not to mention he doesn't have a natural affinity for genjutsu/genjutsu defence like Sasuke or Sakura do.



> > It wouldn't be used up instantly, but it wouldn't last throughout a battle. She'd be vulnerable against a genjutsu sooner or later.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

Daviddd said:


> After reading so many comments, I believe that no matter what you say or do, Ace, Lady Tsunade (and maybe also Creator) won't be convinced.



I'll be convinced once we see Tsunade's true potential. If it's not matched up to Sasuke's Super disgustingly high hype  status, I'd pull a Sakumo.


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


>







> Please provide me with some evidence. I'd like to believe you. Consider it just a formality.



Wikipedia:


*Spoiler*: __ 



Current can cause interference with nervous control, especially over the heart and lungs. Repeated or severe electric shock which does not lead to death has been shown to cause neuropathy.
When the current path is through the head, it appears that, with sufficient current, loss of consciousness almost always occurs swiftly. (This is borne out by some limited self-experimentation by early designers of the electric chair and by research from the field of animal husbandry, where electric stunning has been extensively studied).[2]







> But would it re-arrange the way you move afterwards? Hardly.


Like wiki said, enough electricity in your body can change your nervous controls. Which is why people who are electrocuted cannot move properly.

It's quite obvious that Sasuke has immunity to electricty up until a point.



> I wasn't aware Chidori re-arranged his nervous system patterns and made it hard for him to move.


Again.....

Running a chidori through your body and not having it affect you, would mean that any sort of shock that doesn't give off the same amounts of voltage as a chidori would be rendered inaffective.



> The chakra is what stimulates her proteins to promote cell division. As long as Souzou Saisei is activated, chakra is available.


But once it enters every cell, she won't be disturbing her chakra anymore.



> Well Shi's not the best medic with such precise chakra control, he could pull off a surgery with only a 51% success rate, is he? Not to mention by his looks/appearance (age), she's got years of experience over him.


She had the odds for her even if it was just 1 percent

And even if, a genjutsu expert should know how to break genjutsu.

He even commented and said, "I can't believe I was beat by genjutsu"
He's pretty confident.




> Debatable by a tard.


Aren't we both?



> And she's called the world's strongest and most beautiful woman. Doesn't mean she's incapable of being defeated (at least while Souzou Saisei's off).


Sorry but I'd rather bang Konan or Kurenai or Mizukage. The z cup isn't doing it for me.



> And which pussy's clan accepted it and told him to "Shut the fuck up, we got dis!", hmm?


Madara>any senju alive



> And his granddaughter. >8D


Her punches go through him



> Green coat with the symbole 'Kake' or 'gamble'/'wager' emblazoned on the back.


Madara has an orange bad ass mask.

Itachi and Sasuke have their akatsuki outfits.


----------



## David (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> I'll be convinced once we see Tsunade's true potential. If it's not matched up to Sasuke's Super disgustingly high hype  status, I'd pull a Sakumo.



I hate Sasuke, and hope he dies.  But I have to admit he's pretty strong, and I don't believe Tsunade's an Aoba-level ninja that can take him down like you imply she is


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Daviddd said:


> I hate Sasuke, and hope he dies.  But I have to admit he's pretty strong, and I don't believe Tsunade's an Aoba-level ninja that can take him down like you imply she is



Aoba>Madara.

Don't even compare


----------



## On and On (Sep 27, 2009)

lol

Shunshin slash = off with Tsunade's head, no regen 4 her

Three tomoe means her slow ass isn't going to hit him.

Chidori Nagashi definitely means she isn't going to hit him.

Close range is a bad idea. What if she tries throwing kunai for range?

lol epic Uchiha projectile rape skills. If he uses a raiton charge on them ala Deidara fight, that's even worse.

Tsunade will lose for every conceivable reason. lol and he still has Kirin

someone lock this


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


>




pek




> Wikipedia:
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...



 Check the spoiler. Fucking love loop holes. 




> Like wiki said, enough electricity in your body can change your nervous controls. Which is why people who are electrocuted cannot move properly.
> 
> It's quite obvious that Sasuke has immunity to electricty up until a point.



Perhaps. Damn, I hate those tards. Never take logic seriously.  Who the hell said Sasuke wasn't immune against electric-based attacks?

Still, I'd maintain, despite your excellent point, that she could fuck up his nervous system. Chidori might inadvertantly affect his nervous system, but Ranshinsho directly targets it. I'd leave it as a grey area, though.



> Again.....
> 
> Running a chidori through your body and not having it affect you, would mean that any sort of shock that doesn't give off the same amounts of voltage as a chidori would be rendered inaffective.



How do you know if it does affect him, but he keeps his emotions to himself? 




> But once it enters every cell, she won't be disturbing her chakra anymore.



She'll be continually fueling her cells with chakra, to promote cell division, so I'd disagree and say it would. Once the chakra's released from the forehead seal, it'll flow through her body and continually regenerate her.



> She had the odds for her even if it was just 1 percent
> 
> And even if, a genjutsu expert should know how to break genjutsu.
> 
> ...



It was 50%, but she had to research and get the chances of the surgery up to by that one percent. And was able to pull it off. So Shi =/= Tsunade. 



> Aren't we both?



I beg your pardon? 



> Sorry but I'd rather bang Konan or Kurenai or Mizukage. The z cup isn't doing it for me.



I'm sure she'd love to bang your head with her fist. 



> Madara>any senju alive



Lies.



> Her punches go through him



And he's unable to do anything during that time he's transparent.



> Madara has an orange bad ass mask.




He can't rock that purple diamond and jugs like she can. 



> Itachi and Sasuke have their akatsuki outfits.



Green > Red + Black.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

The Comedian said:


> lol
> 
> Shunshin slash = off with Tsunade's head, no regen 4 her
> 
> Three tomoe means *he* slow ass isn't going to hit him.



Debatable whether she can regenerate her head, and who you callin' *he*? 



> Chidori Nagashi definitely means she isn't going to attack him.



Please. That ain't got shit on her.  She'd pull a Raikage and stomp through.



> Close range is a bad idea. What if she tries to pick up a kunai?



She doesn't need it when she had a finger... 



> lol epic Uchiha projectile rape skills. If he uses a raiton charge on them ala Deidara fight, that's even worse.



She fingers him then flicks his forehead. 



> Tsunade will lose for every conceivable reason. lol and he still has Kirin



Doesn't he have to heat up the Sky with Amaterasu first?  No MS jutsu. 



> someone lock this



Can't handle the Tsunade ownage?


----------



## On and On (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Doesn't he have to heat up the Sky with Amaterasu first?  No MS jutsu.



No. Just a katon in general works. He just used the heat from Amaterasu to speed up the process.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

The Comedian said:


> No. Just a katon in general works. He just used the heat from Amaterasu to speed up the process.



And I suppose she's too slow to react to him standing there, posing, and using a Katon?

Perfect time to rip the ground from under him.


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> pek







> Check the spoiler. Fucking love loop holes.


CAN as in it CAN affect you if ENOUGH electricity is put through you. Chidori is definately enough electricity.



> Perhaps. Damn, I hate those tards. Never take logic seriously.  Who the hell said Sasuke wasn't immune against electric-based attacks?
> 
> Still, I'd maintain, despite your excellent point, that she could fuck up his nervous system. Chidori might inadvertantly affect his nervous system, but Ranshinsho directly targets it. I'd leave it as a grey area, though.



But this is under the impression that she actually hits him with it. Chidori nagashi has a much wider range, and with the sharingan prediction, she aint hitting him.



> She'll be continually fueling her cells with chakra, to promote cell division, so I'd disagree and say it would. Once the chakra's released from the forehead seal, it'll flow through her body and continually regenerate her


.
From what the databook says, I'd say the chakra enters her system and stays in her cells healing them as they get injured.



> It was 50%, but she had to research and get the chances of the surgery up to by that one percent. And was able to pull it off. So Shi =/= Tsunade.


Shii>Tsunade in genjutsu.

I beg your pardon?




> Lies


Truth



> And he's unable to do anything during that time he's transparent.


I'm sorry....

I really can't take a Tsunadevs Madara argument seriously...

He can't rock that purple diamond and jugs like she can. 
He's the only person in the narutoverse who can rock a swirly orange mask and still be badass.


Oh and red>every other colour.


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> And I suppose she's too slow to react to him standing there, posing, and using a Katon?
> 
> Perfect time to rip the ground from under him.



Katons fire pretty fast. Fastest out of any jutsu next to raiton.

He just needs to make a distance and maintain it for like 3 seconds.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 27, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


>







> CAN as in it CAN affect you if ENOUGH electricity is put through you. Chidori is definately enough electricity.



Or CAN as in possible, but not definite. 



> But this is under the impression that she actually hits him with it. Chidori nagashi has a much wider range, and with the sharingan prediction, she aint hitting him.



Granted. With evasion, he ain't hitting her. 



> From what the databook says, I'd say the chakra enters her system and stays in her cells healing them as they get injured.



It doesn't heal, it creates new cells.



> Shii>Tsunade in genjutsu.



Assuming by one genjutsu shown.



> I beg your pardon?



You can beg all you want, but you ain't getting my pardon. 





> I'm sorry....
> 
> I really can't take a Tsunade vs Madara argument seriously...
> 
> ...



Agree to disagree. 



> Oh and red>every other colour.



I used to have red as my favorite. Til Tsunade rocked green. Although the back of her jacket is red. 



♠Ace♠ said:


> Katons fire pretty fast. Fastest out of any jutsu next to raiton.
> 
> He just needs to make a distance and maintain it for like 3 seconds.



3 seconds = Ample time for Shunshin + OHKO combo.

Off to bed.


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


>






> Or CAN as in possible, but not definite.


Definite with enough electricity.



> Granted. With evasion, he ain't hitting her.


He has a better chance of hitting her, then her hitting him.

Dodging every attack could take it's toll. Especially when dodging shurikens infused with chidori at the same time that he could be using a shadow shuriken



> It doesn't heal, it creates new cells.


That's what I meant.



> Assuming by one genjutsu shown.


And the fact that he's confident in genjutsu.



> You can beg all you want, but you ain't getting my pardon.


I beg your pardon?



> I used to have red as my favorite. Til Tsunade rocked green. Although the back of her jacket is red.


Red>green



> 3 seconds = Ample time for Shunshin + OHKO combo.


He can still react while making the seals.


----------



## αce (Sep 27, 2009)

I gotta go

I can't believe we have 63 posts already....

Anyways, hopefuly someone takes on Lady Tsunades wrath while I'm gone.


----------



## mastergimmy (Sep 27, 2009)

Sasuke seriously wins this due to his speed and chidori variants. Tsunade has only shown her taijutsu feats. sasuke has chidori nagashi to prevent it. She can use her healing but it wont last forever.


----------



## koibito (Sep 28, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Katons fire pretty fast. Fastest out of any jutsu next to raiton.
> 
> He just needs to make a distance and maintain it for like 3 seconds.



Who says? The element doesnt determine the speed with all of the elements sure it does with lighting because well thats what its meant for, but there can be really slow ass large fire ball that can be out sped by a water dragon jutsu so other than lightning you cant really say one is faster than the other. 

As for the vs. Tsunade takes it. She wouldnt charge in she would most likely make distance between them. Sure she could read the foot movements or something to avoid eye contact *OR* toss away any genjutsu he tries with her near perfect (if not perfect) chakra control seeing as he is only able to use regular sharingan in this vs. 

Sasuke can dodge some of her attacks but im thinking the torn up terrain would prevent a quick counter. She would be able to hit him some times i mean shes not slow and from there she could screw up his nervous system like Kabuto and waste him from there. His sword skills may be some trouble if he is able to cause an extremely lethal slice like beheading or heart destruction, because she could easily heal cuts and puncture wounds but thats all if shes hit which i doubt he could hit her with taijutsu or sword techniques.

As for his jutsu his katon will be no problem she could easily dodge and raiton even being much faster she might be able to dodge. Even if not then she could heal seeing as raiton is based on quick puncturing attacks. It would be hard to beat her with his jutsu to say the least. 

So with Sasuke's genjutsu not working, taijutsu and zanjutsu being countered, and ninjutsu hardly being able to hit her or damage her, his best bet is in his ability to dodge which wont get him far before Tsunade makes him literally into sauce.


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## Lunarion (Sep 28, 2009)

This thread is full of fanboyism and presumptions, largely on Lady Tsunade's part. The battledome is about FEATS that we have seen in the Manga. So far, current Sasuke rapes Tsunade with speed, sharingan prediction and chidori variants. I am a fan of all three Sannin but until we see Tsunade go all out she is not much better a Shinobi than Gai battle wise. Sure she is a medic, but all that chakra control and stuff has not been proven to be an instant Genjutsu counter. Even without Genjutsu however, Sasuke kills her.

If we ever see Tsunade perform on a level adequate to her title as a Sannin, i will be the first to defend her in such threads. But right now stating that she can regrow her HEAD seems like stubborn fanboyism and borderline trolling.


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## koibito (Sep 28, 2009)

I agree with Lunarion on the regrow her head thing thats ridiculous for naruto. To heal she would have to focus her chakra to heal and last time i checked you need a head/brain to focus anything.

What i do not agree with is that she couldnt thwart genjutsu easily. No, her chakra control hasnt been shown to be an instant genjutsu stopper but disruption of the chakra has been shown to be an instant genjutsu stopper. Sakura was able to stop the effect of Itachi's genjutsu on Naruto i find it illogical that Tsunade wouldnt be able to do the same. If it were tsukiyomi it obviously wouldnt be easy but Sasuke isnt permitted MS in this vs. so as far as its concerned its regular to high skill genjutsu which Sakura can stop so Tsunade should be able to stop it.


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## Federer (Sep 28, 2009)

Lots of assumptions here,

despite having a great chakra control, Tsunade can't break a sharingan genjutsu. Orochimaru, one of the _Densetsu no Sannin_, like Tsunade, couldn't break the genjutsu, although he has seen it twice. Orochimaru trained his whole life, using several kinjutsu, ninjutsu and the desire to learn all jutsu. Plus, being a genjutsu user himself and having a 5 in that departement. How _big_ is the difference between Tsunade and Orochimaru in that departement?

Tsunade is rusty, she claims it self, she has been the Hokage for a while now, but we still haven't seen any hints that she has become more powerfull since her poor fight against Kabuto. 

Tsunade breaking a sharingan genjutsu, while Orochimaru couldn't do it (he was trying, but he was too slow), is nothing but a fanfiction. Sakura has great control, is she immune to genjutsu?

Tsunade is much slower than Sasuke, featswise, by powerscaling etc. One of the most ridiculous claims is, Tsunade can't die in a battle, really? I mean really? So, she is invincible? Hell no. 

It takes a lot of chakra to use _Sōzō Saisei_, plus Tsunade is shortening her lifespan, not a good idea. Sasuke can try and stab her with a sword, penetrate her with a Chidori and keep her busy with regenerating her body, eventually, she will be out of chakra or she shortened her lifespan too much and dies. 

Nothing hints that Tsunade can actually hit Sasuke or will hit Sasuke, I don't see it.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 28, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


>







> Definite with enough electricity.



 Perhaps.



> He has a better chance of hitting her, then her hitting him.




I doubt it. He does have a good chance of not being hit due to his speed, but evasion is what she excels in.



> Dodging every attack could take it's toll. Especially when dodging shurikens infused with chidori at the same time that he could be using a shadow shuriken



True, but even if she's unable to dodge all of them, Tsunade has shown an incredibly high threshold for pain, and moving regardless of injuries/cut muscles.



> That's what I meant.



Sure it was. 



> And the fact that he's confident in genjutsu.



Confident? If he was so confident, he might have at least been able to attempt to negate Sasuke's jutsu, instead of being taken so thoroughly by it.



> I beg your pardon?



Again, you can beg all you want, but you ain't gettin' my pardon. 



> Red>green



Say it again. Go on, I dare you. :mofo



> He can still react while making the seals.



I doubt he can be focused on dodging her attack, making hand seals, and using a Katon to attempt Kirin. Especially when Shunshin allows Tsunade to move so fast, she's at almost imperceptible levels. Kabuto wasn't even able to notice Tsunade had gotten up, got behind him, and dashed to him him with Ranshinsho until he was actually hit.



Lunarion said:


> This thread is full of fanboyism and presumptions, largely on Lady Tsunade's part. The battledome is about FEATS that we have seen in the Manga. So far, current Sasuke rapes Tsunade with speed, sharingan prediction and chidori variants. I am a fan of all three Sannin but until we see Tsunade go all out she is not much better a Shinobi than Gai battle wise. Sure she is a medic, but all that chakra control and stuff has not been proven to be an instant Genjutsu counter. Even without Genjutsu however, Sasuke kills her.



No. Fan_girl_ism would be me coming in here, saying Tsunade would defeat Sasuke, and provide no reason as to why, perhaps in the following fashion:

"LULZ, TSUNADE PWNS SASGAY, SHE OHKO HIS MASTER, WHAT'S HE GONNA DO?!   "

There's a difference. 

Again, Jiraiya specifically trained Naruto in genjutsu defence to teach him to defend himself against Itachi's illusions. The method he taught was disturbing or halting his chakra flow. Is it really that hard to say Tsunade, one who excels in chakra control, would be unable to perform such a feat?

And this isn't current Sasuke, if you had taken the time to read OP. This is Taka Sasuke, without his Mangekyo Sharingan.



> If we ever see Tsunade perform on a level adequate to her title as a Sannin, i will be the first to defend her in such threads. But right now stating that she can regrow her HEAD seems like stubborn fanboyism and borderline trolling.



In a manga where animals talk, people walk on water, and people come back to life, is it so hard to accept that someone could regrow their head when stating they're invincible in battle as long as their jutsu works, and is a top-notch medic who would hardly fail to calculate the obvious method of decapitation?



Juracule Mihawk said:


> Lots of assumptions here,
> 
> *despite having a great chakra control, Tsunade can't break a sharingan genjutsu. Orochimaru, one of the Densetsu no Sannin, like Tsunade, couldn't break the genjutsu, although he has seen it twice.*



Couldn't? He seemed like he was about to, only to have Itachi (since they were so close together, though Itachi's speed would've made that detail irrelevant anyways ) cut off his arm.



> Orochimaru trained his whole life, using several kinjutsu, ninjutsu and the desire to learn all jutsu. Plus, being a genjutsu user himself and having a 5 in that departement. How _big_ is the difference between Tsunade and Orochimaru in that departement?



You don't have to be good at genjutsu to dispel it. Case and point Jiraiya.



> Tsunade is rusty, she claims it self, she has been the Hokage for a while now, but we still haven't seen any hints that she has become more powerfull since her poor fight against Kabuto.



Aside from training Sakura, which is essentially reviewing her own techniques, remastering them, and demonstrating to Sakura how to do them. She stated she'd go all out. Hardly seems like she's not doing anything during the Time Skip. 



> Tsunade breaking a sharingan genjutsu, while Orochimaru couldn't do it (he was trying, but he was too slow), is nothing but a fanfiction. Sakura has great control, is she immune to genjutsu?



Who said anything about immune? I stated that she could break out of genjutsu. Orochimaru was going to do so, but had his hand chopped off. Using that exact same situation to define every other genjutsu encounter possible isn't really fair, now is it?



> Tsunade is much slower than Sasuke, featswise, by powerscaling etc. One of the most ridiculous claims is, Tsunade can't die in a battle, really? I mean really? So, she is invincible? Hell no.



Manga cannon says you're wrong. She said so herself, and we saw the jutsu in action. Tsunade can't die in battle? Of course she can die. While Souzou Saisei is active? Hell no.



> It takes a lot of chakra to use _Sōzō Saisei_, plus Tsunade is shortening her lifespan, not a good idea. Sasuke can try and stab her with a sword, penetrate her with a Chidori and keep her busy with regenerating her body, eventually, she will be out of chakra or she shortened her lifespan too much and dies.



If all else fails, Tsunade can take a 'fatal' hit from Sasuke, grab him once his cockiness/arrogance takes over thinking he's dealt a final blow, and give him a OHKO.



> Nothing hints that Tsunade can actually hit Sasuke or will hit Sasuke, I don't see it.



Nothing hints she can? I suppose immortality and the strength to kill in a single hit are nothing. And in a battle like this, I find it highly unlikely that Sasuke will get thousands of hits on her while she gets not a _single_ one.


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## Federer (Sep 28, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Couldn't? He seemed like he was about to, only to have Itachi (since they were so close together, though Itachi's speed would've made that detail irrelevant anyways ) cut off his arm.



Yes, couldn't. Since he hasn't, since Itachi cut of his arm. 





> You don't have to be good at genjutsu to dispel it. Case and point Jiraiya.



Have we ever seen Jiraiya dispel something close to a sharingan genjutsu? Not on someone else, no, him being in a genjutsu and dispel it. Naruto couldn't, but he still trained for 2.5 years.




> Aside from training Sakura, which is essentially reviewing her own techniques, remastering them, and demonstrating to Sakura how to do them. She stated she'd go all out. Hardly seems like she's not doing anything during the Time Skip.



Do we have feats? 



> Who said anything about immune? I stated that she could break out of genjutsu. Orochimaru was going to do so, but had his hand chopped off. Using that exact same situation to define every other genjutsu encounter possible isn't really fair, now is it?



What should I do, believe you, because you are a Tsunade fan, and she's the best character, atleast to you? Tsunade hasn't dealt with genjutsu. The Hyuuga have excellent chakra control, which they utilize with their fighting Jyuuken. But the databook flat out states that Neji is poor in genjutsu, he also doesn't have the proper feats. Same goes to Tsunade. Shi is excellent in genjutsu, but even he was defeated by it, Orochimaru was great at it, and even he fell, Deidara same thing, why not Tsunade, because she has excellent chakra control?




> Manga cannon says you're wrong. She said so herself, and we saw the jutsu in action. Tsunade can't die in battle? Of course she can die. While Souzou Saisei is active? Hell no.



Make a thread with Tsunade against the whole verse, and let's see the responses. By claiming every single statement from a manga, you are on a very dangerous territory, so we must also include hyperboles in the battledome?

Rule number 1, if you are out of chakra, you're finished, plain and simple. If you are shortening your lifespan, you are going down. Why do you think that Shizune was worried about Tsunade, when she utilized her jutsu? It's a risky jutsu, in the same category as Chou Shinra Tensei and Susano'o. Even if Sasuke can't chop of her head, or whatever, she will die, because of the effects of the jutsu. Or be in a coma, that's the exact same thing she is doing now. 



> If all else fails, Tsunade can take a 'fatal' hit from Sasuke, grab him once his cockiness/arrogance takes over thinking he's dealt a final blow, and give him a OHKO.



Or Sasuke seeing the punch coming at him, just dodges it point black, like he did against Rari atto B, someone who's so fast, that he could dance around Tsunade, all day long. 



> Nothing hints she can? I suppose immortality and the strength to kill in a single hit are nothing. And in a battle like this, I find it highly unlikely that Sasuke will get thousands of hits on her while she gets not a _single_ one.



Immortal? Nope.

And yes, it is very likely that Sasuke gets thousands of hits and she doesn't get a single, if the battle goes like Sasuke wants it. Sasuke > pre skip Kabuto. 

And you assume that Tsunade will use Souzou Saisei from the very start, why would she do that, she still has her super strength and scalpels and Sasuke is just a "rookie". 

If Tsunade can't hit Kabuto on her first attempt, why would we believe that she can hit and kill Sasuke on her very first attempt? If she misses, she will hit the ground, which will give Sasuke the info to not receive any hits from her.


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## koibito (Sep 28, 2009)

Juracule Mihawk said:


> Tsunade breaking a sharingan genjutsu, while Orochimaru couldn't do it (he was trying, but he was too slow), is nothing but a fanfiction. Sakura has great control, is she immune to genjutsu?



She was able to break Itachi's genjutsu on naruto by simply disrupting the chakra she might not be immune to genjutsu but she can stop itachi's genjutsu.


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## Federer (Sep 28, 2009)

koibito said:


> She was able to break Itachi's genjutsu on naruto by simply disrupting the chakra she might not be immune to genjutsu but she can stop itachi's genjutsu.



That's not the point. 

Can she break a genjutsu, where *she* is in it. That's the question, even Naruto can disrupt someone's chakra and dispel a genjutsu.


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## koibito (Sep 28, 2009)

When did it show Naruto save someone from a genjutsu? He tried stopping it himself but couldnt. If Sakura can use her chakra to disrupt another persons chakra she should be able to disrupt her own.


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## hmph (Sep 28, 2009)

Kurenai could break Itachi's genjutsu with ease, I doubt Tsunade would have much trouble with it, with her level of chakra control. Oro never got his hands together to say Kai, but he was certainly confident he could break it. It never showed him failing like Naruto failed.

Anyways, it doesn't really matter to my point, which is that Sasuke wouldn't live long enough to realize genjutsu might be a good choice.


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## αce (Sep 28, 2009)

^Wait....

When did Kurenai break Itachis genjutsu??


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## hmph (Sep 28, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> ^Wait....
> 
> When did Kurenai break Itachis genjutsu??



Link removed


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## αce (Sep 28, 2009)

He put her in *her own *genjutsu, and she dispelled it by biting her lip(pain) 

It wasn't Itachi's


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## koibito (Sep 28, 2009)

And she didnt break it in the same way we are talking about. Itachi's genjutsu cant simply be broken by pain.


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## αce (Sep 28, 2009)

ACtually, my bad.

It was Itachi's genjutsu. But the databook says that when you use genjutsu reversal, you are using the same genjutsu that was applied onto you. 

So technically, it was kurenais genjutsu through Itachi.

Itachi's genjutsu is on another level.


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## koibito (Sep 28, 2009)

The point still stands it was Itachi using a genjutsu that was on Kurenai's level.


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## αce (Sep 28, 2009)

^Exactly.

Kurenai didn't break out of Itachi level genjutsu. She broke out of Kurenai level genjutsu.

And also adding the fact that he didn't want to kill any of them, would suggest that he didn't use his best genjutsu.


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## koibito (Sep 28, 2009)

Yeah so Kurenai's skill has no point in this, so back to Tsunade. If Sakura can stop Itachi level genjutsu's (not his greatest but still Itachi level) effect on another person she could stop it for herself meaning so could Tsunade.


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## jdbzkh (Sep 28, 2009)

Sasuke wins hands down, CS2 along with a few chidori variations here and there would secure the win.


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## hmph (Sep 28, 2009)

He copied her genjutsu and used it on her. It was still done by him, used through his talent and chakra, it was still his genjutsu.



> Itachi's genjutsu cant simply be broken by pain.



It was. Though, genjutsu has always been odd in how it is dispelled. For example, Sasuke broke Tsukiyomi, and we know he'd have to have done it without pain or a seal. Kurenai may have just used pain as a boost.


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## αce (Sep 28, 2009)

^Dude, it doesn't matter. It was still a kurenai level genjutsu.

If you honestly think that was his strongest genjutsu, something is wrong with you.


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## koibito (Sep 28, 2009)

It was simple pain she didnt form any seals either so it couldnt have been a boost and even if it could have theres no proof it actually was.

Even so this isnt the point the point is that Tsunade can break mid to high level genjutsu.


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## Harry Balzac (Sep 28, 2009)

lol tsunade doesn't stand a chance against sasuke even without his MS. Sasuke was still feared by all even without his MS. Tsunade is weak and is not worthy of being called a "sannin" like jiraiya and Orochimaru. A big disgrace to the senju clan, well what can you expect from a old hag??


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## koibito (Sep 28, 2009)

Harry Balzac said:


> lol tsunade doesn't stand a chance against sasuke even without his MS. Sasuke was still feared by all even without his MS. Tsunade is weak and is not worthy of being called a "sannin" like jiraiya and Orochimaru. A big disgrace to the senju clan, well what can you expect from a old hag??



And whats your basis on this? Tsunade beat Orochimaru. he may not have had the use of his arms but her muscles were all strained and she had multiple wounds and chakra depletion. Tsunade is equal to orochi if not better but none of them are equal to Jiraiya you give no argument other than 'ha ha shes weak'.


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## King Of Gamesxx (Sep 28, 2009)

Taka Sasuke wins. It doesn't matter if he doesn't have MS, he is still very proficient with raiton-based jutsu. Since Taka Sasuke hasn't shownt he ability to summon snakes, I'm going to consider that he can't going off of the manga so far.

Taka Sasuke has also shown EXTREME stamina. In his latest battle he's been spamming the Mangekyo Sharingan so much it's not even funny, and after all of that spamming, he looks like he's ready for more. 

Tsunade has Sozou Saisei, but it takes a good amount out of her and it might end up becoming a stamina battle. I'd like to point out however, that Souzou Sasei may enable her to grow back and heal from injuries instantaneously, but I doubt that if Sasuke cuts off vital parts, like the head, I believe that she won't be able to recover, based on manga of course. 

Taijutsu is another issue, as both combatants prefer taijutsu, however Sasuke has Chidori Nagashi and that electric aura may paralyze Tsunade for him to go in for the kill. 

Speed is another issue, and I'm sure that Tsunade has some good speed feats out there but Sasuke has sharingan prediction and really good speed on his side and I have no doubts that he can outmaneuver Tsunade when required.

However, I would also like to points out that if Sasuke gets too careless it'll turn out to be a situation like with Raikage, except that this time Sasuke won't have Susano'o to save himself and it'll end in Tsunade's favor.


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## koibito (Sep 28, 2009)

Tsunade excel's in evasion she wont let Sasuke hit her with taijutsu or sword techniques and even if he did any punches wont be doing much damage. Any cuts she can heal hed have to cut off her head to kill her because she can heal organs. His katon is no big deal shed be able to dodge and heal any major burns if she got hit and his raiton would cause no problems seeing as its meant for quick kills and piercing attacks which she could heal (his raiton has not been shown to paralyze anyone) and shed never let him pull off a kirin.


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## King Of Gamesxx (Sep 28, 2009)

koibito said:


> Tsunade excel's in evasion she wont let Sasuke hit her with taijutsu or sword techniques and even if he did any punches wont be doing much damage. Any cuts she can heal hed have to cut off her head to kill her because she can heal organs. His katon is no big deal shed be able to dodge and heal any major burns if she got hit and his raiton would cause no problems seeing as its meant for quick kills and piercing attacks which she could heal (his raiton has not been shown to paralyze anyone) and shed never let him pull off a kirin.



Sasuke has speed on his side, plus a vast array of ninjutsu techniques. Sasuke might inititally start off with taijutsu as would Tsunade. Taijutsu however would fail in the long run and make Sasuke switch to raiton based attacks such as chidori senbon. There I think Tsunade would be in trouble.

Tsunade's evasion is questionable. She was able to do fairly well against Orochimaru, but speed wise, Sasuke>Orochimaru. Going off manga of course. 



koibito said:


> Tsunade excel's in evasion she wont let Sasuke hit her with taijutsu or sword techniques and even if he did any punches wont be doing much damage.



This is being a bit biased don't you think? Sasuke's taijutsu skill is quite good, and I don't think Tsunade could just shrug off a direct hit from Sasuke, the damage wouldn't be severe but it would be damage. Tsunade is not Raikage, and I doubt she'd be able to just shrug off a direct attack.

You also mentioned that she can heal any cuts, will that takes time and isn't instantaneous, meaning that Sasuke can use that little bit of time and make Tsunade stop healing. Sasuke sword has also shown the ability to extend itself to a certain range, if Sasuke uses this ability wisely he'd be able to deal some serious damage.



koibito said:


> His katon is no big deal shed be able to dodge and heal any major burns if she got hit and his raiton would cause no problems seeing as its meant for quick kills and piercing attacks which she could heal (*his raiton has not been shown to paralyze anyone)* and shed never let him pull off a kirin.



The bolded is wrong. I believe that his raiton infused sword managed to paralyze Yamato. 
Multiple Ninpou: Kumo Shibari


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## Dman (Sep 28, 2009)

sasuke wins


he beats her in every aspect except brute power


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## koibito (Sep 29, 2009)

First off chidori senbon hasnt been shown to be faster than regular senbon any ninja could most likely evade it if they didnt try to throw something at it first (because it would go through any tools thrown at it giving less time to dodge). Speed wise we dont know that Sasuke is faster than Orochimaru he never fought him fully. When Sasuke busted into his room he was bed ridden and unexpecting and still caught the lightning sword in his wrists preventing a head slice then Sasuke took him over after he attempted on Sasuke first so we cant really say hes faster that Orochi. 

Second of all sorry about that i didnt meant to imply that she could just shrug it off i was distracted when i said that but she does excel in taijutsu it wont be so easy to hit her and if so one or two punches wont do as much as if he hit her a whole bunch of times which she wont let happen, thats all i meant. About healing this is true but it doesnt mean she will just take the time to heal every little cut he gives her it'd have to be pretty serious to have her heal herself. Tsunade's first move might be to create distance seeing as she is not the raikage and wouldnt charge in, in the case of the extending sword bed ridden Orochi was able to react to it accordingly i have no doubt that Tsunade can.

Lastly, im sorry about that i was wrong thank you for correcting me.


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## King Of Gamesxx (Sep 29, 2009)

koibito said:


> First off chidori senbon hasnt been shown to be faster than regular senbon any ninja could most likely evade it if they didnt try to throw something at it first (because it would go through any tools thrown at it giving less time to dodge). Speed wise we dont know that Sasuke is faster than Orochimaru he never fought him fully. When Sasuke busted into his room he was bed ridden and unexpecting and still caught the lightning sword in his wrists preventing a head slice then Sasuke took him over after he attempted on Sasuke first so we cant really say hes faster that Orochi.


I didn't just mean chidori senbon, Sasuke has a vast arsenal of ninjutsu and a lot of chidori variants, chidori senbon being just 1 of those. I have no doubt in my mind that Tsunade can dodge the initial senbons, but can she dodge the blitz afterwards? Baika no Jutsu

Sasuke has shown to be very fast here, and Deidara could only block him by making the bomb explode very close to him and Sasuke. 

I'll give you the speed, but you have to consider that this isn't Hebi Sasuke, but Taka Sasuke. He has much more experience and has shown a decent amount of speed feats backing him up. Taka Sasuke has also shown very good reaction speed.



koibito said:


> Second of all sorry about that i didnt meant to imply that she could just shrug it off i was distracted when i said that but she does excel in taijutsu it wont be so easy to hit her and if so one or two punches wont do as much as if he hit her a whole bunch of times which she wont let happen, thats all i meant. About healing this is true but it doesnt mean she will just take the time to heal every little cut he gives her it'd have to be pretty serious to have her heal herself. Tsunade's first move might be to create distance seeing as she is not the raikage and wouldnt charge in, in the case of the extending sword bed ridden Orochi was able to react to it accordingly i have no doubt that Tsunade can.



Granted that Sasuke's physical strength isn't all that great, and he'll probably find out in the fight that fighting Tsunade head on isn't one of the most intelligent things to do. 

You also mentioned that Tsunade might try to create distance between herself and Sasuke, but Sasuke is very fast and can cover distance very quickly. 
confessing her love
We see quite a distance between Sasuke, and Deidara and Tobi. However
confessing her love We see on this page that he's already managed to cover that distance and blitzes Tobi.


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## koibito (Sep 29, 2009)

I know you didnt mean just chidori senbon it was just the one you mentioned so i replied to that one. lets analyze his techniques though and what they could do against Tsunade.

Chidori senbon - ive already stated how she could evade this.

Chidori nagashi - he uses this as more of a defensive technique against multiple opponents i doubt hed even use this in a one on one battle or at least to attack Tsunade.

Chidori sword - bed ridden Orochimaru was able to react to and avoid lethal damage from this attack. I have no doubt non-weakened Tsunade could do the same if not more if she didnt get out of range in time.

Kirin - he wouldnt get the time to prepare this attack.

Am i forgetting any raiton techniques?

I know that Sasuke has very good reaction speed i dont think it'd be easy to hit him either but just one hit from Tsunade would end it. 

Now in terms of the actual battle. They have current manga knowledge, i believe Sasuke is at a disadvantage here. He may not know about her taijutsu skills other than if Orochimaru told him but are we really allowed to assume that? (im not stating that he wouldnt know im asking if he does and how).


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## Creator (Sep 29, 2009)

koibito said:


> Tsunade excel's in evasion she wont let Sasuke hit her with taijutsu or sword techniques and even if he did any punches wont be doing much damage.



Tried that argument soo many times. All it got me was negs.


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## Dariustwinblade (Sep 29, 2009)

Ignore them without MS Sasuke has no way ot kill Tsunade. She is a master of evasion and can easily make the ground uneven to restrict movement and finish off Sasuke, though It wont be easy. I think she can take Sasuke out.


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## Creator (Sep 29, 2009)

Tsunade can pretty much take out everyone she fights, given she can land atleast ONE hit. Even if it scraped the person, it will completely destroy their insides.

Oro survived because he didnt really care. He felt the pain, but it was about time for him to change his body anyways. So he could care less. Plus he can regenerate his whole body anyways. So it didnt bother him.

But even before that, he said that she was dangerous. If Tsunade can land one hit, ONE HIT on Sasuke. She wins. Even if its the slightest of touch. 

Sadly Sasuke being a disgraceful Uchiha will not lay down and beg the Senju Goddess for forgive, and use his sharingan to evade. His a disgrace.


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## Black Sabbath II (Sep 29, 2009)

Creator said:


> Tsunade can pretty much take out everyone she fights, given she can land atleast ONE hit. Even if it scraped the person, it will completely destroy their insides.
> 
> Oro survived because he didnt really care. He felt the pain, but it was about time for him to change his body anyways. So he could care less. Plus he can regenerate his whole body anyways. So it didnt bother him.
> 
> ...



I agree. And for anyone bringing in the Suusan'o factor keep this in mind. Raikage managed to break through two of Suusano's ribs. Imagine what TSUNADE would do to it.


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## Creator (Sep 29, 2009)

KumogakureRaikage said:


> I agree. And for anyone bringing in the Suusan'o factor keep this in mind. Raikage managed to break through two of Suusano's ribs. Imagine what TSUNADE would do to it.



Sasuke doesnt have MS. So Susano is of no worries.


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## Black Sabbath II (Sep 29, 2009)

Creator said:


> Sasuke doesnt have MS. So Susano is of no worries.



That pretty much guarantees Tsunade's victory. Let's face it, Taka Sasuke couldn't fight his way out of a paper bag. He only beat Orochimaru because he was in a weakened state. A healthy Tsunade, even without Katsuyu, could not only overpower, but outrun Sasuke. The only thing Sasuke has on his side is Genjutsu and I hardly doubt that would work on someone of Tsunade's level.


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## Harry Balzac (Sep 29, 2009)

Sauske wins witha over kill. Tsunade will nvr hit sasuke with taijutsu, he'd just pull out his kusanagi sword and use reiton around it, stab her in her neck and end up paralyzing her. Then just back away quickly and use kirin. Either way tsunade has no chance, she isn't the type for killing. She's a medic


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## Synn (Sep 29, 2009)

We don't know everything Tsunade-hime is capable of, but without the MS, Sasuke wouldn't stand a chance.

However, I have to give it to him, because he's the favorite character of Kishimoto, so he would probably win miraculously.

In a fair fight (without Kishi interferring), Sasuke-bitch-wanna-be would get raped!


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## Atlantic Storm (Sep 29, 2009)

Do you have some actual reasoning? I'm not saying Tsunade is a slouch, but I don't see her landing a hit on Sasuke.


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## Synn (Sep 29, 2009)

Sandaime said:


> Do you have some actual reasoning? I'm not saying Tsunade is a slouch, but I don't see her landing a hit on Sasuke.



She just has to wait for an opening... But according to the last chapters, Sasuke has 
*Spoiler*: __ 



unlimited chakra


, so that is unlikely to happen. Once more, Kishimoto is interferring... 

Does any of you even remember that Tsunade doesn't need Katsuyu to defeat a slut like Sasuke? She can't die in battle! So Sasuke can waste his chakra anytime...


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## Black Sabbath II (Sep 29, 2009)

David1822 said:


> She just has to wait for an hopening... But according to the last chapters, Sasuke has
> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> ...



Don't forget, we're currently talking about Taka Sasuke without Mangekyou. The same Sasuke who pretty much got owned by everyone he fought and only one because of pure luck or his comrades. I THINK Tsunade would get quite a few hits in on him.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 29, 2009)

Juracule Mihawk said:


> Yes, couldn't. Since he hasn't, since Itachi cut of his arm.



Seems like he was, but had his arm lopped off.





> Have we ever seen Jiraiya dispel something close to a sharingan genjutsu? Not on someone else, no, him being in a genjutsu and dispel it. Naruto couldn't, but he still trained for 2.5 years.



Have we seen Jiraiya go up against a Sharingan user? Moot point.
And Naruto couldn't pull off most jutsu, simply because the concept is hard for him to understand, even if it's an easy one. I'm inclined to believe Jiraiya training Naruto to dispel Itachi-like/genjutsu of normal caliber has more relevance than whether or not Jiraiya himself has ever done so. You don't have to be good in casting genjutsu itself in order to break it.



> Do we have feats?



Do we have feats of Itachi's genjutsu defeating Jiraiya? Do we have feats of SM Naruto > HM Jiraiya? You have to go by what's either shown or heavily implied. Are you trying to say that Tsunade sat at a desk and told Sakura how to do it, and Sakura suddenly become excellent in it?



> What should I do, believe you, because you are a Tsunade fan, and *she's the best character,* atleast to you? Tsunade hasn't dealt with genjutsu. The Hyuuga have excellent chakra control, which they utilize with their fighting Jyuuken. But the databook flat out states that Neji is poor in genjutsu, he also doesn't have the proper feats. Same goes to Tsunade. Shi is excellent in genjutsu, but even he was defeated by it, Orochimaru was great at it, and even he fell, Deidara same thing, why not Tsunade, because she has excellent chakra control?



Best character =/= Favorite one. 

Again, you don't have to be good in *casting* genjutsu to be able to be good at *dispelling* genjutsu.




> Make a thread with Tsunade against the whole verse, and let's see the responses. By claiming every single statement from a manga, you are on a very dangerous territory, so we must also include hyperboles in the battledome?



I'm sure NF wouldn't like to see that. 

I don't believe she can solo the entire Narutoverse, much as I'd like her to. 



> Rule number 1, if you are out of chakra, you're finished, plain and simple. If you are shortening your lifespan, you are going down. Why do you think that Shizune was worried about Tsunade, when she utilized her jutsu? It's a risky jutsu, in the same category as Chou Shinra Tensei and Susano'o. Even if Sasuke can't chop of her head, or whatever, she will die, because of the effects of the jutsu. Or be in a coma, that's the exact same thing she is doing now.



The effects of the jutsu is that she shorts her life span. Not enough to die during the duration of the jutsu though. She's only in a coma because she used up all her chakra to use Souzou Saisei on _the entire village_. Chakra which can be used to regenerate her and for jutsus.

And of course she'd lose if the jutsu expires. But that's assume she hasn't defeated Sasuke by then.



> Or Sasuke seeing the punch coming at him, just dodges it point black, like he did against Rari atto B, someone who's so fast, that he could dance around Tsunade, all day long.



Undoubtedly.



> Immortal? Nope.



During the duration of the jutsu, yes.



> And yes, it is very likely that Sasuke gets thousands of hits and she doesn't get a single, if the battle goes like Sasuke wants it. Sasuke > pre skip Kabuto.



And Tsunade with multiple handicaps that fought against Kabuto < Tsunade who's no longer rusty or out of shape. 



> And you assume that Tsunade will use Souzou Saisei from the very start, why would she do that, she still has her super strength and scalpels and Sasuke is just a "rookie".



Perhaps because this is the shinobi that killed off Orochimaru. A formidable opponent, even if it was at his weakest. But seeing as she has no idea (as far as I'm aware) of what condition Orochimaru was in, this is still a tough match. Not to mention that the fact he's been running amok in the Narutoverse with no one stopping him so far might be an inclination as to his power.  



> If Tsunade can't hit Kabuto on her first attempt, why would we believe that she can hit and kill Sasuke on her very first attempt? If she misses, she will hit the ground, which will give Sasuke the info to not receive any hits from her.



Tsunade back then =/= Tsunade now. That's what you're basing it on.


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## koibito (Sep 29, 2009)

Harry Balzac said:


> Sauske wins witha over kill. Tsunade will nvr hit sasuke with taijutsu, he'd just pull out his kusanagi sword and use reiton around it, stab her in her neck and end up paralyzing her. Then just back away quickly and use kirin. Either way tsunade has no chance, she isn't the type for killing. She's a medic



Are you serious? If Sasuke held the kusanagi in long enough to paralyze her shed break it. The only time he paralyzed with that was yamato and he had to hold the sword in him for a little and he still was able to form a seal to push it out with mokuton. If Tsunade had it in her neck shed heal it, and do you know how long kirin takes to prepare? Hell even if she was paralyzed for a little he wouldnt have the time to pull it off. Thats all if she lets him stab her in the neck which she wont.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 29, 2009)

I think tsunade would win this.

Sasuke is faster, has more offensive techniques, and is overall the better combat ninja.

But tsunade can fuck with that speed (chakra scalpel), has insane durabilty (genesis rebirth), and could take him out in one punch.

Worst comes to worst i see tsunade turning on genesis rebirth, letting herself get stabbed/chidori'd (so that she can grab sasuke), then chakra scalpeling his spine or just OHKO punching him.

Sasuke could win this if he planned carefully, kept his distance and used genjutsu liberally...but that's not sasuke's style. He'd probably rush in using sword techniques and raitons, and underestimate tsunade and expect his superior speed/skill to net him the win.

EDIT: In character hurts sasuke a bit in this match.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 29, 2009)

Windwaker said:


> Sasuke could win this if he planned carefully, kept his distance and used genjutsu liberally...but that's not sasuke's style. *He'd probably rush in using sword techniques and raitons, and underestimate tsunade and expect his superior speed/skill to net him the win*.



And when has that worked for him?


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 29, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> And when has that worked for him?



ha well it's a legit tactic since thanks to his sharingan more times than not he avoids getting countered, and it's normally just to gauge his opponent anyway (sorta like how naruto sends in KBs).

But against tsunade, she's skilled enough (and crazy enough lol), that i can totally see her letting sasuke stab her just to get a chance to slow him down/end him.

IMO if sasuke treated tsunade with similar caution as raikage he'd play the distance game and use his superior speed and mid range techniques and score a hit (resulting in genesis rebirth), then with a good strategy get a killing hit on her head....but he won't do that, he'll see tsunade as inferior (cuz she's a medic) and he'll pay for it.

What i mean is. He's got the right cards to win it if he plays it smart ant patient. But since he'll underestimate her he won't be as smart, and since it's sasuke he won't be patient.


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## Harry Balzac (Sep 29, 2009)

wow you guys are really overrating tsunade when she hasn't done crap, hasn't shown nothing specific to kill, BESIDES her brute strength. Brute strength alone is not gona win this battle, Sasuke destroys her in speed, she's really slow. She can never land A hit on sasuke especially due to his sharingan. Sure she can prly protect herself for a while with medical jutsu, but after a while her energy will run very low.. causing her to leave her self wide open for an attack. Tsunade has no chance vs this uchiha genius kid. I'm sorry.

Worst Hokage ever. Notice how as soon as tsunade became hokage, akatsuki started moving and attacking konoha ninjas. Maybe it was concidence but who knows.. Danzo is a much better fit for hokage


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## Black Sabbath II (Sep 29, 2009)

Harry Balzac said:


> wow you guys are really overrating tsunade when she hasn't done crap, hasn't shown nothing specific to kill, BESIDES her brute strength. Brute strength alone is not gona win this battle, Sasuke destroys her in speed, she's really slow. She can never land A hit on sasuke especially due to his sharingan. Sure she can prly protect herself for a while with medical jutsu, but after a while her energy will run very low.. causing her to leave her self wide open for an attack. Tsunade has no chance vs this uchiha genius kid. I'm sorry.
> 
> Worst Hokage ever. Notice how as soon as tsunade became hokage, akatsuki started moving and attacking konoha ninjas. Maybe it was concidence but who knows.. Danzo is a much better fit for hokage



I'd watch out about the whole 'worst hokage ever' comment. We have a hardcore Tsunade fan here and she'll pounce on you like a cheetah.

Staying on topic though, Tsunade can be pretty fast, considering her perfect chakra control. Add some chakra to her feet and she can pretty much match Lee.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 29, 2009)

Harry Balzac said:


> wow you guys are really overrating tsunade when she hasn't done crap, hasn't shown nothing specific to kill, BESIDES her brute strength.


 One punch will kill sasuke. End of story.



> Brute strength alone is not gona win this battle, Sasuke destroys her in speed, she's really slow. She can never land A hit on sasuke especially due to his sharingan.


 She has more than brute strength. She also has the ability to drastically reduce sasuke's speed with one touch. Sasuke doesnt have the medical knowledge kabuto does, so he wont be able to just get used to it.

Also, Tsunade may not be as fast as sasuke but she isn't really slow by any means.



> Sure she can prly protect herself for a while with medical jutsu, but after a while her energy will run very low.. causing her to leave her self wide open for an attack. Tsunade has no chance vs this uchiha genius kid. I'm sorry.



Tsunade has more chakra than sasuke. Sasuke will run out of chakra for ninjutsu before she runs out of chakra for Genesis Rebirth. Also, he can't just do hit and run with sword strikes unless he wants to get chakra scalpeled.

If sasuke played things smart i'd agree with you, tsunade could never hit an evasive sasuke. But sasuke won't be evasive, he'll charge in using close range techniques like he always does. That's where it gets very dangerous for him, since one nice touch with a chakra scalpel will fuck his speed up, and at very close range, the sharingan is less effective (since you can't see all of your opponenet).



> Worst Hokage ever. Notice how as soon as tsunade became hokage, akatsuki started moving and attacking konoha ninjas. Maybe it was concidence but who knows.. Danzo is a much better fit for hokage



They wanted to get the others first. Pain's attack had little to with who the hokage was.

Itachi and kisame showed up because itachi wanted to remind the elders that he was still out there, and that they better keep their word even with sandaime dead.

/not a hardcore tsunade fan. Ha i actually like sasuke considerably more than tsunade.


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## Harry Balzac (Sep 29, 2009)

How is tsunade gona hit sasuke once?


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 29, 2009)

Harry Balzac said:


> How is tsunade gona hit sasuke once?



"But sasuke won't be evasive, he'll charge in using close range techniques like he always does. That's where it gets very dangerous for him, since one nice touch with a chakra scalpel will fuck his speed up, and at very close range, the sharingan is less effective (since you can't see all of your opponent)."

Sasuke is fast, faster than most and definitely faster than tsunade. But that doesn't make him untouchable. 

In close quarters speed doesnt matter as much, and taijutsu skill makes itself relevant. That's why sasuke can't just speedblitz everybody.

And then there's always the fact that sasuke has no clue about genesis rebirth. Tsunade could let sasuke stab her through the stomach, let sasuke think the fight is over for a second, and then punch him to end the fight (or if thats not possible, chakra scapel to fuck his speed up.).


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## Soul (Sep 29, 2009)

Creator said:


> Do people really believe that an Uchiha can win against a Senju?



Post an "Itachi vs. Tsunade" thread and find that out yourself.



Windwaker said:


> One punch will kill sasuke. End of story.



One hit will end Tsunade too, but in a different way.



> She has more than brute strength. She also has the ability to drastically reduce sasuke's speed with one touch. Sasuke doesnt have the medical knowledge kabuto does, so he wont be able to just get used to it.



That is, if she hits him.
Bear in mind that Chidori Nagashi will help Sasuke a lot.



> Sasuke will run out of chakra for ninjutsu before she runs out of chakra for Genesis Rebirth.



False.
Sozo Saisei consumes much more chakra.



> Also, he can't just do hit and run with sword strikes unless he wants to get chakra scalpeled.



Sasuke's Kusanagi no Tsurugi with enhanced Raiton chakra will destroy Tsunade's Scapels, with ease.



> But sasuke won't be evasive, he'll charge in using close range techniques like he always does.



That doesn't means that he will fail.



> /not a hardcore tsunade fan. Ha i actually like sasuke considerably more than tsunade



I don't like Sasuke either, but he has the best chance to win this match up.


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Sep 29, 2009)

KumogakureRaikage said:


> I'd watch out about the whole 'worst hokage ever' comment. We have a hardcore Tsunade fan here and she'll pounce on you like a cheetah.
> 
> Staying on topic though, Tsunade can be pretty fast, considering her perfect chakra control. Add some chakra to her feet and she can pretty much match Lee.



There's no shame in being the worst Hokage seeing as all of the previous Hokages were absolute beasts. It's hard to keep that standard of Hokages going forever, but anyway...

People here are forgetting one crucial piece of information. Tsunade has much more knowledge on Sasuke than Sasuke does of Tsunade. She's heard the account of Team Kakashi's encounter with Sasuke and therefore knows some of the moves in his arsenal.

Also, everyone is using the Kabuto vs. Tsunade fights as an example of Tsunade's feats. In no way is this fair, she was almost 30 years away from battle at that point and she wasn't in good physical or mental condition (hemophobia anyone). She's now in better physical condition and no longer has hemophobia, thus it's safe to assume that her performance in battle will be better. Remember, she was too scared to move for much of the duration of her fight with Kabuto.

People are severely overrating Sasuke in this scenario. Are we all talking about the same Sasuke here? The one who barely survived against Deidara through blocking his explosion with a boss summon at the last second? The one who only survived against Killerbee because the other decided to make a break for it? The one who only defeated Orochimaru because he was in a severely weakened state? Just making sure.

And finally, has it ever occurred to you that Tsunade might have more jutsus, but just hasn't demonstrated them? Putting that aside, she is a medical ninja. Medical ninja are trained in two things: dodging and healing. So to believe that she won't be able to dodge any of Sasuke's moves is utterly ridiculous. You don't get spoon-fed the position of Hokage.


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## David (Sep 29, 2009)

Yondaime X3 said:


> There's no shame in being the worst Hokage seeing as all of the previous Hokages were absolute beasts. It's hard to keep that standard of Hokages going forever, but anyway...
> 
> People here are forgetting one crucial piece of information. Tsunade has much more knowledge on Sasuke than Sasuke does of Tsunade. She's heard the account of Team Kakashi's encounter with Sasuke and therefore knows some of the moves in his arsenal.
> 
> ...



If you're a Sannin you do


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## Harry Balzac (Sep 29, 2009)

We're talking about a 16 yr old kid, who's eliminating kage lvl ninjas, under whatever circumstances. Madara gladly gave him a seat for akatsuki. Sasuke has more potential than you guys think.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 29, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> One hit will end Tsunade too, but in a different way.



Only if sasuke scores a head shot. Anything else is auto healed by genesis rebirth



> That is, if she hits him.
> Bear in mind that Chidori Nagashi will help Sasuke a lot.


 If tsunade has genesis rebirth on what's stopping her from just ignoring chidori nagashi? It'll hurt like a bitch, but its worth it if she gets the hit.



> False.
> Sozo Saisei consumes much more chakra.


 Tsunade was using it during practically the entire pain invasion to heal up everyone in the village. I know katsuyu helped, but mainly as a conduit, not as a chakra battery.



> Sasuke's Kusanagi no Tsurugi with enhanced Raiton chakra will destroy Tsunade's Scapels, with ease.


 Wait what? I'm not saying that she's going to block kusanagi with chakra scalpels lol. I'm saying that if sauske continues to just do hit and run sword strikes he's running the risk of getting chakra scalpel'd and a fucked up nervous system, or a dead limb.



> That doesn't means that he will fail.


 Against someone with insane regen abilities and a OHKO punch i dont see how it will succeed...



> I don't like Sasuke either, but he has the best chance to win this match up.


 How so? He's got speed and ninjutsu, but i can't see sasuke defeating Tsunade without getting hit, and that one hit would be the end of it.


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## King Of Gamesxx (Sep 29, 2009)

I think speed is the main factor here. The only opponents that have actually touched Sasuke are opponents with either high speed or long range attacks. I'm pretty sure Sasuke should win this. I'm sure Tsunade has more to offer, but so far she hasn't shown anything that could win this battle.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 29, 2009)

King Of Gamesxx said:


> I think speed is the main factor here. The only opponents that have actually touched Sasuke are opponents with either high speed or long range attacks. I'm pretty sure Sasuke should win this. I'm sure Tsunade has more to offer, but so far she hasn't shown anything that could win this battle.



Was base killer bee all that fast? He never showed any speed feats outside of rari atto, so i always thought he had average speed in base.

Also, If base bee was already around sasuke speed wise wouldnt rari atto have been too much for him.

In extended close range combat IMO taijutsu skill matters more than speed, and tsunade is much better than sasuke at taijutsu.


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## King Of Gamesxx (Sep 29, 2009)

Windwaker said:


> Was base killer bee all that fast? He never showed any speed feats outside of rari atto, so i always thought he had average speed in base.



Base Killer Bee seemed quite fast, and I believe Sasuke kept up with base Killer Bee without Sharingan for a good amount of time till he pulled out Rari Atto.
half-assed Rasengan We see Sasuke activate his sharingan here after Bee uses Rari Atto.

Taijutsu does indeed matter here, but I do not believe that Tsunade has the speed to back up her taijutsu execution. Also with sharingan prediction, that lowers her chances even more of hitting Sasuke.


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## Sasukekillsitachi (Sep 29, 2009)

Even after Rari Otto Sasuke still holds his ground, half-assed Rasengan.

But he tries to use Tsukuyomi on him without knowing that it won't work on a Jinchuuriki half-assed Rasengan who has complete control over his host, and Killerbee surprises him by being completely immune to the illusion (since he has his Eight-tailed beast as partner to shake off the illusion), and catches him off guard half-assed Rasengan.

Sasuke is million times faster than that hag Tsunade, and he will just Shunshin all his way to Tsunade's neck, head etc.

Even if Tsunade uses Genesis Rebirth, the technique has obvious limits, it uses too much chakra, strength and you even become old! 

So Sasuke just stabs her over and over till she has no energy left.

Sasuke wipes his ass with Tsunade, anytime, anywhere, anyday. Tsunade couldn't even keep up with Kabuto, who is supposed to have crappy Taijutsu. Kabuto is stated to be much weaker than Kakashi, so this explains it.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 29, 2009)

King Of Gamesxx said:


> Base Killer Bee seemed quite fast, and I believe Sasuke kept up with base Killer Bee without Sharingan for a good amount of time till he pulled out Rari Atto.
> half-assed Rasengan We see Sasuke activate his sharingan here after Bee uses Rari Atto.



All he was able to do in base was keep up with sasuke in a taijutsu battle, overwhelm him with good kenjutsu, and then react to his chidori sword. Not anything spectacularly speedy.

And sasuke had his sharingan on when Bee was attacking with his swords in 411. 



> Taijutsu does indeed matter here, but I do not believe that Tsunade has the speed to back up her taijutsu execution. Also with sharingan prediction, that lowers her chances even more of hitting Sasuke.



I don't think that tsunade has a shot of actually attacking sasuke, that i agree with. She's just not fast enough to go on the offensive like that, especially with the sharingan.

However, i think that her speed is adequate that she won't get blitzed and could react to sasuke's moves. This is where her superior taijutsu comes into play. Reacting to and countering sasuke's taijutsu/sword slashes. Enough that she will be able to get at least ONE hit.

Also, Whats stopping tsunade from tricking sasuke using genesis rebirth? As in she gets stabbed, and during that second where he's standing there with his sword buried in her, she grabs him.

So yea i think tsunade wins this 6/10 due to superior taijutsu, sasuke's lack of knowledge (no idea bout genesis rebirth or medical jutsu in general), and sasuke's in characterness (he'll underestimate tsunade, and just charge in without thinking).



Sasukekillsitachi said:


> Sasuke wipes his ass with Tsunade, anytime, anywhere, anyday. Tsunade couldn't even keep up with Kabuto, who is supposed to have crappy Taijutsu. Kabuto is stated to be much weaker than Kakashi, so this explains it.



Yea, because tsunade wasnt suffering from hemophobia, and wasnt years out of practice or anything.

Tsunade would crush kabuto now.


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## Soul (Sep 29, 2009)

Windwaker said:


> Only if sasuke scores a head shot.



Not really.



> Anything else is auto healed by genesis rebirth



Why would she use Sozo Saisei if she is IC?
Why would Sasuke stop attacking if he already is hitting her?

As soon as Sasuke lands the first strike, it will be much easier for Sasuke to keep hitting her, and with his speed, the first blow will be the the end for Tsunade.



> If tsunade has genesis rebirth on what's stopping her from just ignoring chidori nagashi? It'll hurt like a bitch, but its worth it if she gets the hit.



Why are you assuming that Tsunade will use Sozo Saisei immediately IC?
Both characters are IC, not just Sasuke.



> Tsunade was using it during practically the entire pain invasion to heal up everyone in the village. I know katsuyu helped, but mainly as a conduit, not as a chakra battery.



Show me when Tsunade used Sozo Saisei in the Pain Invasion Arc



> I'm saying that if sauske continues to just do hit and run sword strikes he's running the risk of getting chakra scalpel'd and a fucked up nervous system, or a dead limb.



And Tsunade is also running the risk of getting fucked by Sasuke's Kusanagi.
As Sasuke has a better usage of a sword than Tsunade, he has the upper hand.



> Against someone with insane regen abilities and a OHKO punch i dont see how it will succeed...



Chidori Variants, superior speed and Sharingan will help Sasuke a lot.


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## Sasukekillsitachi (Sep 29, 2009)

QUOTE: Windwaker "All he was able to do in base was keep up with sasuke in a taijutsu battle, overwhelm him with good kenjutsu, and then react to his chidori sword". *Not anything spectacularly speedy??*

Oh my god! Are you trying to tell that 4 to 5 tailed Bee is not speedy, not to mention he has full control of the beast!

Just look KN4 Kyuubi beat the hell out of both Orochimaru and Jiraiya who were both obviously much stronger than Tsunade.

You really need to do your research. 

Have you even seen the anime properly? If you can't, then at least reread the previous chapters (Naruto Part-1), before blabbering more foolish posts, with no point at all.


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## King Of Gamesxx (Sep 29, 2009)

Windwaker said:


> All he was able to do in base was keep up with sasuke in a taijutsu battle, overwhelm him with good kenjutsu, and then react to his chidori sword. Not anything spectacularly speedy.
> 
> And sasuke had his sharingan on when Bee was attacking with his swords in 411.


Keeping up with Sasuke in taijutsu is no small feat. He might not be highly skilled in the area of taijutsu, but he has amazing speed, and keeping up with him only shows how skilled Bee was. Bee has good reaction times and is able to counter a lot of the attacks that Sasuke launched at him.

Sasuke's sharingan was active at 411, but he deactivated it immediately afterwards only to activate it again when Rari Atto came about.




> I don't think that tsunade has a shot of actually attacking sasuke, that i agree with. She's just not fast enough to go on the offensive like that, especially with the sharingan.


Yes, I too think that for most of the battle Tsunade might be on the defensive, but who's to say that she slips up, or Sasuke overwhelms her with his speed?



> However, i think that her speed is adequate that she won't get blitzed and could react to sasuke's moves. This is where her superior taijutsu comes into play. Reacting to and countering sasuke's taijutsu/sword slashes. Enough that she will be able to get at least ONE hit.


Yes, that's for sure. Tsunade is not going to get blitzed by Sasuke anytime soon. If Tsunade does actually manage to react to an attack and Sasuke sees that he's in danger, who is to say he won't just use Chidori Nagashi to ward off the attack? Sharingan also increases Sasuke's reaction rates and Sasuke has great speed on his side and I think he could easily counter or just evade one of Tsunade's counters.



> Also, Whats stopping tsunade from tricking sasuke using genesis rebirth? As in she gets stabbed, and during that second where he's standing there with his sword buried in her, she grabs him.


Sasuke's Sharingan can see chakra color, I'm sure if he sees something strange he won't hesitate and might either back off or just go in for the kill immdiately.


> So yea i think tsunade wins this 6/10 due to superior taijutsu, sasuke's lack of knowledge (no idea bout genesis rebirth or medical jutsu in general), and sasuke's in characterness (he'll underestimate tsunade, and just charge in without thinking).


Sasuke just charging in there has really gotten on my nerves, I'm not saying that he won't do it, but if he does he's really just setting himself up. However with sharingan prediction and Tsunade's speed, I'm thinking he could dodge the blows Tsunade might deliver. I think Sasuke knows that Tsunade is the hokage and he might take that into mind and not just rush in there


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## hmph (Sep 29, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> Not really.



She repaired a hole in her heart. Yes, really.



> Why would she use Sozo Saisei if she is IC?



She uses it whenever she needs it, using it doesn't harm her unless she needs it to begin with.



> Why would Sasuke stop attacking if he already is hitting her?
> 
> As soon as Sasuke lands the first strike, it will be much easier for Sasuke to keep hitting her, and with his speed, the first blow will be the the end for Tsunade.



This doesn't make sense... his attacks don't harm her in the slightest if she's using Souzou Seisei, and the moment he attacks she ends it with her counter stroke anyway.



> Why are you assuming that Tsunade will use Sozo Saisei immediately IC?
> Both characters are IC, not just Sasuke.



True, but she doesn't need to use it immediatly. She can use it after he's dead, and he would die very quickly. As we've seen Tsunade is not exactly afraid to take lethal damage before using Souzou Seisei, nor did it particularly slow her down.



> Show me when Tsunade used Sozo Saisei in the Pain Invasion Arc



down. We don't know how early she began it but she ran out of chakra after the chou shinra tensei.



> And Tsunade is also running the risk of getting fucked by Sasuke's Kusanagi.
> As Sasuke has a better usage of a sword than Tsunade, he has the upper hand.



His sword doesn't matter if he can't split her skull! 



> Chidori Variants, superior speed and Sharingan will help Sasuke a lot.



Only if he lives long enough to make full use out of them. Which with his strategy of bum rush, is unlikely against Tsunade.

Oh, and chidori nagashi is not exactly instantaneous. See: Sasuke vs Itachi, Sasuke vs Killer Bee, Sasuke vs Raikage... how often has it appeared to save him from attacks?


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 29, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> Not really.


 Fine, forehead and heart. Those are the only two spots that you can hit and kill tsunade. Anywhere else and she'll activate genesis rebirth.



> Why would she use Sozo Saisei if she is IC?
> Why would Sasuke stop attacking if he already is hitting her?
> 
> As soon as Sasuke lands the first strike, it will be much easier for Sasuke to keep hitting her, and with his speed, the first blow will be the the end for Tsunade.



If she feels like she won't be able to get away and heal herself she'll use it.

How would the first blow be the end for tsunade? As long as she's conscious she'll heal herself. And if it's too much for her to heal in time she'll use Genesis  Rebirth. 

Unless you think sasuke will knock her out with the first blow, even though he always starts with his sword.



> Why are you assuming that Tsunade will use Sozo Saisei immediately IC?
> Both characters are IC, not just Sasuke.


 Not immediately, just whenever she needs to. Unless he kills her in a way that is instant (Brain, Heart) she's going to have enough time to form a seal and activate it.



> Show me when Tsunade used Sozo Saisei in the Pain Invasion Arc



It's how she rapid healed everyone during pain's big ass shinra tensei. You see an anbu remarking on it. Ha also tsunade doesn't even have it anymore! Ha but for the purposes of the thread lets say she still has it (if not than sasuke stomps horribly haha).




> And Tsunade is also running the risk of getting fucked by Sasuke's Kusanagi.
> As Sasuke has a better usage of a sword than Tsunade, he has the upper hand.



How? Slashes and stabs mean nothing once she uses genesis rebirth. Unless he cuts off her head, which in character sasuke won't do.

And i'm not saying tsunade and sasuke are going to have a chakra scalpel/kusanagi clash. Just as sasuke is running by slashing tsunade, she taps him on the shoulder as he runs past giving him a dead arm. 



> Chidori Variants, superior speed and Sharingan will help Sasuke a lot.


 Chidori sword will help yea, but like i said, unless he cuts off her head or stabs her in the heart she'll just heal up. And i think unless he catcher her off guard tsunade will be able to dodge that much.

But again, if sasuke knows nothing of Genesis rebirth, what's he going to do when he stabs her in the stomach/shoves a chidori through her? I highly doubt he'll be on the defensive, expecting her to regenerate, he'll most likely drop his guard a little bit like he did against Bee when he dropped. So i don't see how thats not a hit right there.



Sasukekillsitachi said:


> QUOTE: Windwaker "All he was able to do in base was keep up with sasuke in a taijutsu battle, overwhelm him with good kenjutsu, and then react to his chidori sword". *Not anything spectacularly speedy??*
> 
> Oh my god! Are you trying to tell that 4 to 5 tailed Bee is not speedy, not to mention he has full control of the beast!



Oh my god! When did i ever mention 4 to 5 tailed Bee? Where did i mention anything except base bee? And i dont think that his base feats were incredibly fast, the reason he won that exchange was because his sword skill > sasuke's sword skill. 



> Just look KN4 Kyuubi beat the hell out of both Orochimaru and Jiraiya who were both obviously much stronger than Tsunade.
> 
> You really need to do your research.
> 
> Have you even seen the anime properly? If you can't, then at least reread the previous chapters (Naruto Part-1), before blabbering more foolish posts, with no point at all.



So what you're saying is:

KN4 > Jiraiya and orochimaru > tsunade

Okay, What does this have to do with Tsunade vs. Sasuke AT ALL!? 

Unless you're saying KN4 = 4 tail Bee...which isnt true at all.


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## Soul (Sep 30, 2009)

Windwaker said:


> Fine, forehead and heart. Those are the only two spots that you can hit and kill tsunade. Anywhere else and she'll activate genesis rebirth.



No, you aren't listening. {Or reading in this case}
Tsuande won't use Sozo Saisei immediately, and Sasuke won't let her use it once he strats to attack her.



> If she feels like she won't be able to get away and heal herself she'll use it.



Sasuke won't stop attacking; how is she supposed to heal herself?



> How would the first blow be the end for tsunade? As long as she's conscious she'll heal herself.



Again; Sasuke wo't give her ime for that.



> And if it's too much for her to heal in time she'll use Genesis Rebirth.



Tsunade need to concentrate to use Sozo Saisei; Sasuke won't let her.



> Not immediately, just whenever she needs to. Unless he kills her in a way that is instant (Brain, Heart) she's going to have enough time to form a seal and activate it.



Why would she have time?
Sasuke will be constantly attacking with Taijutsu and short ranged Ninjutsu.



> How? Slashes and stabs mean nothing once she uses genesis rebirth. Unless he cuts off her head, which in character sasuke won't do.



Once she used Sozo Saisei is the key; as she won't have time to do it.



> Chidori sword will help yea, but like i said, unless he cuts off her head or stabs her in the heart she'll just heal up. And i think unless he catcher her off guard tsunade will be able to dodge that much.



You are vastly overestimating Tsunade's Sozo Saisei; she needs time to use it.


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## koibito (Sep 30, 2009)

Sasukekillsitachi said:


> both Orochimaru and Jiraiya who were both obviously much stronger than Tsunade.



Jiraiya is no doubt, but what suggests that Orochimaru is stronger than Tsunade? If anything shes equal to him.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 30, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> No, you aren't listening. {Or reading in this case}
> Tsuande won't use Sozo Saisei immediately, and Sasuke won't let her use it once he strats to attack her.



When has sasuke ever continuously attacked in his fights? I highly doubt he would be able to kill tsunade before she could make a single seal.

Also, i think you're underestimating tsunade. She isn't going to get wtfblitzpwned by sasuke without even putting up some kind of defense. In the time it takes him to cross 30 meters she'll do something other than just stand there defenseless. Especially since her taijutsu (which she has a 5 in) is based around evasion.

If sasuke gets a really deep gash on her, or fatally stabs her, he's not going to continue to hack her to bits, he's going to assume she's not going to be able to heal herself while missing organs and bleeding out all over the place and back off and consider the fight done. If he were bloodlusted i'd give this to you, but sasuke just isn't that violent.

Also, sasuke doesn't know the depth of tsunade's medical skill. So whatever in his mind is "best medic nin," that's what he thinks she can do.



> Tsunade need to concentrate to use Sozo Saisei; Sasuke won't let her.



It only takes a brief second for her to do this. Sasuke will give her this much time.



> You are vastly overestimating Tsunade's Sozo Saisei; she needs time to use it.



You're acting like it has a charge time or something, all she has to do is form a seal and say "seal release"

I mean she must be pretty fast with it, considering she used it and gave all of it to katsuyu when pain did his attack.

EDIT: btw, the ONLY reason i say tsunade wins this is because sasuke has no knowledge on sozo saisei or how medic jutsu can work offensively, and is in character.



King Of Gamesxx said:


> Keeping up with Sasuke in taijutsu is no small feat. He might not be highly skilled in the area of taijutsu, but he has amazing speed, and keeping up with him only shows how skilled Bee was. Bee has good reaction times and is able to counter a lot of the attacks that Sasuke launched at him.



Tsunade was reacting to orochimaru's attacks (although it was a bit sluggish since she was bleeding and dying all over the place lol) and he's just about as fast as sasuke.

And if Base Bee is close to sasuke in speed, how comes rari atto didnt blitz sasuke? I find it hard to believe that rari atto is such a small increase, and sasuke dealt with that without much trouble.



> Sasuke's sharingan was active at 411, but he deactivated it immediately afterwards only to activate it again when Rari Atto came about.



True, but the point still stands that Base Bee was able to successfully attack and parry sharingan sauske.



> Yes, I too think that for most of the battle Tsunade might be on the defensive, but who's to say that she slips up, or Sasuke overwhelms her with his speed?



When it comes to slip ups, i gotta give it to the character with the most experience. Although i can't see either of them just slipping up.

As for his speed, once she has Sozo Saisei activated, she won't worry about being hit, so long as she can avoid shots to the head, which sasuke doesn't normally go for anyways.



> Yes, that's for sure. Tsunade is not going to get blitzed by Sasuke anytime soon. If Tsunade does actually manage to react to an attack and Sasuke sees that he's in danger, who is to say he won't just use Chidori Nagashi to ward off the attack? Sharingan also increases Sasuke's reaction rates and Sasuke has great speed on his side and I think he could easily counter or just evade one of Tsunade's counters.


 Ha was that first line sarcasm? I really do find it hard to believe that sasuke is going to blitz someone of average speed with a 5 in taijutsu based around evasion. Especially when she is fully aware that sasuke is fast as fuck.

CHidori nagashi would be troublesome, although i think Sozo would negate it (by reparing the nerve damage).



> Sasuke's Sharingan can see chakra color, I'm sure if he sees something strange he won't hesitate and might either back off or just go in for the kill immdiately.



Depending on their positions tsunade's whole body might not be in his eyes' view. And at that distance i can see tsunade boosting her speed/reaction enough to grab him. 



> Sasuke just charging in there has really gotten on my nerves, I'm not saying that he won't do it, but if he does he's really just setting himself up.


 My entire argument is pretty much based on this. Sasuke could take tsunade no problem if he fought smart or had some idea of her abilities. But he won't and he doesn't. And even THEN i still think he wins like 4 or 5 times out of 10.



> I think Sasuke knows that Tsunade is the hokage and he might take that into mind and not just rush in there



I thought sasuke knew that the raikage was the raikage and that he might take that into mind and not just rush in there....but we both know how that turned out.

EDIT: GOOD GOD I NEED BACK UP! Ha where's lady tsunade when you need her...

BTW, just in case anyone's wondering,  Im not a tsunade fan, and sasuke is tied as my favorite character (with naruto). But its so much more fun to debate in favor of the underdog.


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## David (Sep 30, 2009)

Some of these people supporting Tsunade should try using her in the KC and see how far Genesis Rebirth gets them


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Sep 30, 2009)

Sasukekillsitachi said:


> Even after Rari Otto Sasuke still holds his ground, Link removed.
> 
> But he tries to use Tsukuyomi on him without knowing that it won't work on a Jinchuuriki Link removed who has complete control over his host, and Killerbee surprises him by being completely immune to the illusion (since he has his Eight-tailed beast as partner to shake off the illusion), and catches him off guard Link removed.
> 
> ...



This is a biased argument full of holes. You should read my last post... actually here I'll post excerpts from it.

Also, everyone is using the Kabuto vs. Tsunade fights as an example of Tsunade's feats. In no way is this fair, she was almost 30 years away from battle at that point and she wasn't in good physical or mental condition (hemophobia anyone). She's now in better physical condition and no longer has hemophobia, thus it's safe to assume that her performance in battle will be better. Remember, she was too scared to move for much of the duration of her fight with Kabuto, and yet she still kept up with Kabuto. Ultimately, I would argue that she won the fight.

And we all know that Tsunade will just stand there when Sasuke shunshins up to her, and he will slice her throat without Tsunade moving a muscle. 

I'm not gonna argue the Generation Rebirth doesn't take a lot of chakra cuz that would be just ignorant.



> And if Base Bee is close to sasuke in speed, how comes rari atto didnt blitz sasuke? I find it hard to believe that rari atto is such a small increase, and sasuke dealt with that without much trouble.



You are vastly underrating Killerbee's speed. He has demonstrated that he is more than capable of keeping up with Sasuke who has to be one of the fastest characters in the series. 

As for why Rari Atto only provided an incremental boost to Killerbee's speed is just one of the many plotholes in Kishi's manga.


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## Soul (Sep 30, 2009)

Windwaker said:


> When has sasuke ever continuously attacked in his fights?



He hasn't because:


He hasn't needed it.
His opponents are so fucking fast that he can't.



> I highly doubt he would be able to kill tsunade before she could make a single seal.



After she makes the seal, she needs time to unblock the seal in her forehead. Doesn't she?



> She isn't going to get wtfblitzpwned by sasuke without even putting up some kind of defense.



Then tell me how is she going to defend from Chidori Eisou, or any variant.



> In the time it takes him to cross 30 meters she'll do something other than just stand there defenseless.



Really?


*Spoiler*: _Sasuke's speed even without the Cursed Seal_ 




Link removed
Link removed






> If sasuke gets a really deep gash on her, or fatally stabs her, he's not going to continue to hack her to bits



Why not?
He is going for the kill.



> he's going to assume she's not going to be able to heal herself while missing organs and bleeding out all over the place and back off and consider the fight done. If he were bloodlusted i'd give this to you, but sasuke just isn't that violent.



Because he isn't going for the kill.
I assure you that he would've kill Itachi that way if he could do it.



> It only takes a brief second for her to do this. Sasuke will give her this much time.





> You're acting like it has a charge time or something, all she has to do is form a seal and say "seal release"



Proof.



> I mean she must be pretty fast with it, considering she used it and gave all of it to katsuyu when pain did his attack.



She didn't used Sozo Saisei, did she?


Tsunade won't be able to touch Sasuke, as he is faster + he has Sharingan, which can predict the movements.


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Sep 30, 2009)

> After she makes the seal, she needs time to unblock the seal in her forehead. Doesn't she?



Actually going by how the jutsu was depicted in the anime, I would argue no. It's just that they made it seem dramatic by making it take forever. And unblocking the chakra takes how long? 0.64 seconds?



> Really?



So you're going to argue that arguably the best medical ninja in the series isn't going to perform any evasive maneuver or counter when an enemy just attacks head on? Really?



> Why not?
> He is going for the kill.



True that, but the OP says that he is in character. And the guy who seems to go out of his way to not kill people most likely wouldn't perform a Mortal Kombat fatality on someone with a critical wound.



> Tsunade won't be able to touch Sasuke, as he is faster + he has Sharingan, which can predict the movements.



I dunno, it's not impossible it just takes some strategy or she has to wait for the perfect opening. But remember that her chakra scalpels and OHKO punch don't have to directly hit you... even if you just barely graze the chakra being emitted you're gonna get messed up.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 30, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> He hasn't because:
> 
> 
> He hasn't needed it.
> His opponents are so fucking fast that he can't.



Like deidara? He's not all that fast and sasuke didn't repeatedly attack against him. They had their intial skirmish, then after deidara escaped with the C1 sasuke just stood there and went "!" while he brought out C2. Even if he wasn't going for the kill, there's no reason other than CIS that he didn't continue to attack.



> After she makes the seal, she needs time to unblock the seal in her forehead. Doesn't she?


this

She makes the seal, shizune has a line and a half of dialogue, then tsunade goes HA and its on.

So 2 seconds at most?



> Then tell me how is she going to defend from Chidori Eisou, or any variant.



Eisou is the spear correct? Depending on how far she is i don't see why she couldn't dodge it. The jutsu itself isn't that fast.



> Really?
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: _Sasuke's speed even without the Cursed Seal_
> ...



That mindless beast might not even be that fast, and he isn't a master at a taijutsu style based around reading body language and evasion.



> Why not?
> He is going for the kill.
> 
> Because he isn't going for the kill.
> I assure you that he would've kill Itachi that way if he could do it.



He let itachi (the guy he hated more than anything in the world) recover after he got tsukyomi countered when he could have just dashed in and finished him off. He could have done SOMETHING to prevent amaterasu, but instead he sat their smirking.

pages 14-16 of 388



> She didn't used Sozo Saisei, did she?



this

Yea, she used it to protect the villagers from Pain's massive attack but funneling it through katsuyu into everybody else, and in the process used it up.



> Tsunade won't be able to touch Sasuke, as he is faster + he has Sharingan, which can predict the movements.



Base bee touched him just fine, and he wasn't any faster than sasuke (IMO he was slower, just more skilled, otherwise rari atto would have been too fast for sasuke).

And there will be certain moments that sasuke won't have his eyes on tsunade, and she'll know to capitalize on them.

Although i still say the most probable way that tsunade is going to hit him is when he thinks he's won the fight ha.


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## Soul (Sep 30, 2009)

@Windwaker: Sorry man; I have to get some sleep.
I will respond to your post as soon as I get home tomorrow


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 30, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> @Windwaker: Sorry man; I have to get some sleep.
> I will respond to your post as soon as I get home tomorrow



CONCESSION ACCEPTED! 

Just kidding,  i've just never gotten the chance to act like a narutoforums tough guy before 

/ i need to get to work on homework anyways...I think i unconsciously chose to argue for tsunade since i knew it'd be the most time consuming.


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## koibito (Sep 30, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> Then tell me how is she going to defend from Chidori Eisou, or any variant.



Better than bed ridden unsuspecting Orochimaru who was able to catch it through his wrists.

As for the other variants, senbon she could easily dodge seeing as its most likely the speed of regular senbon. Nagashi which she could punch through burning herself badly and still getting the hit in. And chidori counter it like a taijutsu attack which is how its fired in which she could either take the hit and rip his arm off or at least break it, dont take the hit and block it like a taijutsu attack by maybe blocking at the point that lightning is not covered by such as the wrist, or punch the chidori maybe burning her hand very badly but taking Sasuke's arm in the process. Thats how shed do it.


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## Aegon Targaryen (Sep 30, 2009)

koibito said:


> Jiraiya is no doubt, but what suggests that Orochimaru is stronger than Tsunade? If anything shes equal to him.



Jiraiya is definitely on a different level from Orochimaru. I believe that even in base, Jiraiya has a good deal more power than his old rival and friend, just that Orochimaru unfortunately knows just how to counter his techniques so well and really make him look like the stronger shinobi. But in Hermit Mode, he earned respect from even Pain, who I believe is leagues higher than Orochimaru in terms of power.

After all, A > B > C meaning A > C is not necessarily true at all, but even then, there are instances when it should be so. 

So simply just because Orochimaru had the perfect means to counter Jiraiya's techniques, doesn't mean Orochimaru was better off as a shinobi. 

Interestingly, no Akatsuki bar Zetsu has so far shown apprehension of Orochimaru. And yet Kisame was worried about the prospect of facing Itachi. Plus, he even bought Itachi's false claim that even the two of them together, even if they brought more people, could make it no less than a tie.

While this is untrue that Itachi would lose to a non-augmented Jiraiya, and Kisame himself didn't completely believe it to be true either, he still did buy the part where Itachi said that even if they had at least one more Akatsuki to tag along, like Deidara or Hidan, the battle would still be no more than a tie. And Kisame isn't particularly unintelligent. He was his partner and should have known about his full capabilities outside of Susanoo, which I doubt he even knew about. He isn't as intelligent as say Kakashi or Shikamaru, but still not dumb either, he has a 3.5 in Intelligence after all, which is simply slightly above average.

No, I have a feeling we haven't seen Tsunade's full offensive capabilities yet. If she could use the Yin Seal's chakra to heal an entire village, she could possibly convert it to fantastic offensive use, giving her great bursts of strength and a massive, ongoing stamina to heal herself and hurt the foe, equal to at least 4 Gates of Hachimon Tonkou. This bit is just speculation, but possible. Although if it were, I wouldn't see how she would be weaker than Orochimaru anymore, or even his equal. She'd be beating him down again.


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## mac101 (Sep 30, 2009)

come on!!!
Tsunade=Sanin   
Sasuke =emo bent on revenge

not only does Tsunade have amazing close combat strength but she can also heal all sasuke has is close to mid range attacks and even if Tsunade gets hit i am sure she can heal so i have to say Tsunade wins stop thinking sasuke is god........


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## Aegon Targaryen (Sep 30, 2009)

Tsunade wins.

Without his Mangekyou Sharingan, and access to Tsukuyomi or Amaterasu, Sasuke will not be able to win, simply put. However, even then, I can see him putting up quite an amazing battle against Tsunade, although he would eventually lose in the end.

While Sasuke indeed has a great advantage in speed, and in the ability to read her physical strikes before they are unleashed, dodging the damage caused by Tsunade's attacks to the environment is a different story. He'd most likely get forced into a huge hole in the end, and then be one-shotted by Tsunade's axe kick.

Although catching Sasuke even then, will be a lot harder than it sounds, but even then it will be done in the end.

No Katsuyu, eh? Actually, Katsuyu would fare far worse than Tsunade against Sasuke, ironically, she doesn't have the necessary speed to stop herself from being sliced apart by Sasuke's Chidori Sword.

Anyway, Tsunade wins, with hard to very hard difficulty. Not to mention that the Sharingan is worst off against Taijutsu, and apart from his speed, reflexes and Sharingan perception, Sasuke is only great at Taijutsu, which is nothing compared to Tsunade who is so darn good that Sasuke's physical combat ability without speed, reflexes or perception is off-putting, all right.


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## Creator (Sep 30, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> Show me when Tsunade used Sozo Saisei in the Pain Invasion Arc



Come on Flash. You know exactly when she used her seal to unlock her chakra reserve. 



TheYellowFlash10 said:


> Post an "Itachi vs. Tsunade" thread and find that out yourself.



Both you and i how that will end.

It will end with me getting negged because i provided a different view of the manga to proves that Uchiha tards favourite boytoy is weak compared to a Senju. 

Please, even Itachi understood he was a Senju dog thus followed orders like a good little puppy. 



> One hit will end Tsunade too, but in a different way.



Which hit? :S 

Did you not see that she got impaled in the middle of her chest with a sword which went out the other way? Her tolerance for pain if high enough for her to survive.


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## Federer (Sep 30, 2009)

> *It will end with me getting negged because i provided a different view of the manga* to proves that Uchiha tards favourite boytoy is weak compared to a Senju.
> *
> Please, even Itachi understood he was a Senju dog thus followed orders like a good little puppy.*



Maybe you will understand now, why people neg you? The manga is very clear, in the first world war, the Uchiha and the Senju were equal. 

I don't get how you come up with the conclusion that the Senju were more powerfull? The Senju retained their supremacy because they formed the administration of Konoha, nothing more.

The manga also explicitly said that the Uchiha were the most powerfull clan of Konoha, before they were exterminated. Both Kakashi and Zabuza claimed this. The Senju don't exist anymore, same goes for the Uchiha clan.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 30, 2009)

Wait, does someone actually think that tsunade could take MS Sasuke or MS itachi?


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Sep 30, 2009)

^ Yup someone happens to think Tsunade is a match for MS Itachi. Which is absolutely biased. I mean I understand that people like certain characters more than others, but being blatantly blind due to fandom is something else. Tsunade is not stronger than MS Itachi. And I don't know where you're getting the idea that the Uchiha's were the Senju's bitches. Especially since it's been concluded multiple times that the Uchiha were Konoha's most powerful clan. (I can't believe I'm defending the Uchiha )


----------



## Harry Balzac (Sep 30, 2009)

what is it with this creator guy? Such fucking ignorant and lame posts. Shit, he/she had no idea wtf a senju was till naruto shippuuden.

I can understand why the uchihas aren't around anymore...they got exterminated, but what happened to the senju clan o_O?? Forgot, they nvr existed b4 and were recently introduced as a last minute replacement to make the story line a bit more interesting.


----------



## Whip Whirlwind (Sep 30, 2009)

Yondaime X3 said:


> ^ Yup someone happens to think Tsunade is a match for MS Itachi. Which is absolutely biased. I mean I understand that people like certain characters more than others, but being blatantly blind due to fandom is something else. Tsunade is not stronger than MS Itachi. And I don't know where you're getting the idea that the Uchiha's were the Senju's bitches. Especially since it's been concluded multiple times that the Uchiha were Konoha's most powerful clan. (I can't believe I'm defending the Uchiha )



Well i think the senju as a whole were equal to the uchiha, but once konoha formed the senju ceased to exist and were simply konoha ninja. So it wouldnt surprise me if the non-bloodline clans of konoha could trace their lineage back to the senju.

And yea, Tsunade ain't got shit on the MS.


----------



## Mongolian Chop Squad (Sep 30, 2009)

Windwaker said:


> Well i think the senju as a whole were equal to the uchiha, but once konoha formed the senju ceased to exist and were simply konoha ninja. So it wouldnt surprise me if the non-bloodline clans of konoha could trace their lineage back to the senju.
> 
> And yea, Tsunade ain't got shit on the MS.



Either way, it's not stated anywhere that the Senju > Uchiha. That's just a fallacy Creator is using to aid his argument.


----------



## Koroshi (Sep 30, 2009)

Creator said:


> Both you and i how that will end.
> 
> It will end with me getting negged because i provided a different view of the manga to proves that Uchiha tards favourite boytoy is weak compared to a Senju.
> 
> Please, even Itachi understood he was a Senju dog thus followed orders like a good little puppy.



Itachi followed orders so that he may save Konoha from going into Civil War not because he was a "Senju Dog."



> Which hit? :S
> 
> Did you not see that she got impaled in the middle of her chest with a sword which went out the other way? Her tolerance for pain if high enough for her to survive.



Tsukiyomi can theoretically weaken Tsunade a bit, probably enough for Itachi to finish her off. But this going off-topic



Harry Balzac said:


> what is it with this creator guy? Such fucking ignorant and lame posts. Shit, he/she had no idea wtf a senju was till naruto shippuuden.



I know you don't like Creator's Opinion but there is no need for flaming, you could potentially be repsealed/Banned. At best you'd get a warning.

On-topic:

Tsunade would most likely survive and win this battle,

Her punches are all very powerful and can potentially OHKO Sasuke is hit at the right the place. The problem here is whether she is fast enough to keep up with Sasuke. I'm sure she can use the terrain to try and obtain an opening.

Even if she gets hit probably until almost deat, Sozo Saisei would instantly heal her and aid her very well in the fight.


----------



## Vergil642 (Sep 30, 2009)

Sasuke mortally wounds her a few times with his massive speed advantage (I'm confident he's blitzing her here), pushing her to use Creation Rebirth. He then finds his attacks are worthless and simply waits her out, evading her attacks until she's out of chakra. GG Tsunade.

Speed equalized means this still probably goes to Sasuke thanks to Sharingan and superior combat jutsu.


----------



## Creator (Sep 30, 2009)

Seemeds i offended some Itachi fans.  I job in here is done.


----------



## αce (Sep 30, 2009)

@Creator

Madara>Senju


----------



## Creator (Sep 30, 2009)

@Ace. 

Thats why Madara had to go into excile because he truly is better then Senju. 



Harry Balzac said:


> what is it with this creator guy? Such fucking ignorant and lame posts. Shit, he/she had no idea wtf a senju was till naruto shippuuden.



 A newb flaming me. 

I am sorry if i offended you dear sir. 

If you have done any research into NF history, you will know me as the greatest Tsunade tard ever. So chose your words properly before you try and flame me.


----------



## αce (Sep 30, 2009)

@Creator-

Madara is kind. After embarrasing Minato, he decided to give Senju a break.

:ho


----------



## Harry Balzac (Sep 30, 2009)

Creator said:


> @Ace.
> 
> Thats why Madara had to go into excile because he truly is better then Senju.
> 
> ...




what????????????????


----------



## Harry Balzac (Sep 30, 2009)

@tsunadetard

Shit, I dont know who you are, to me your just a random narutard on the e net lol, like everybody else up in here ;]]]]

In other words no one important


----------



## Creator (Sep 30, 2009)

Anyways, lets get back on topic.

I still put my money on Tsunade. Her slightest of touches will be enough to kill Sasuke completely. Now whether she gets this hit is a different question. 

What people forget is this. Valley of the End. The battle is in the Valley of the End. Which means on opposite heads, unless they are behind in the forest 30 meters away.

If its the heads, Sasuke has to cross it, giving Tsunade enough time to pick something up and fling it at him. Even Sasuke, being the 'Uchiha God' that he is, cant dodge mid air when something huge is flinged at him and at the pace Tsunade can throw at. 

But it all depends on circumstances i guess.



Harry Balzac said:


> what????????????????



Dont worry mate. 

Just try and fit in. Try to avoid flaming members. 

Also, resize your sig, it breaks the sig rules.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 30, 2009)

Harry Balzac said:


> Worst Hokage ever. Notice how as soon as tsunade became hokage, akatsuki started moving and attacking konoha ninjas. Maybe it was concidence but who knows.. Danzo is a much better fit for hokage



And notice while Tsunade was Hokage, most of Akatsuki was wiped out. Consider your argument _obliterated_. 



Sasukekillsitachi said:


> *Have you even seen the anime properly?* If you can't, then at least reread the previous chapters (Naruto Part-1), before blabbering more foolish posts, with no point at all.



Anime =/= Canon (usually). They add so much crap.



TheYellowFlash10 said:


> You are vastly overestimating Tsunade's Sozo Saisei; she needs time to use it.



No, she simply released the seal and uses it. It doesn't take time, and even if so, a few seconds at most.



TheYellowFlash10 said:


> After she makes the seal, she needs time to unblock the seal in her forehead. Doesn't she?



Again, no, she doesn't. See Pain Arc. She used Souzou Saisei on the entire village in a split second to protect them from Chou Shinra Tensei.



> She didn't used Sozo Saisei, did she?



Link removed





Windwaker said:


> And yea, Tsunade ain't got shit on the MS.



Perhaps with what she's been shown. But I highly doubt that's all of her arsenal. You do remember that it was her only and most gimped fight?

Slug mode, on the other hand... 



Harry Balzac said:


> @tsunadetard
> 
> Shit, I dont know who you are, to me your just a random narutard on the e net lol, like everybody else up in here ;]]]]
> 
> *In other words no one important*



Important enough for you to deem worthy of reply.


----------



## AeroNin (Sep 30, 2009)

lol what is slug mode

stop making stuff up


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 30, 2009)

AeroNin said:


> lol what is slug mode
> 
> stop making stuff up



...... You believe what you wish. Slug Mode shall be revealed. 

Making it up? Take that belief up with Pain. He's the one who implied it.


----------



## mac101 (Sep 30, 2009)

lol slug mode


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 30, 2009)

mac101 said:


> lol slug mode



I know right? The sheer power of what it could be makes me giggle too.


----------



## mac101 (Sep 30, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> I know right? The sheer power of what it could be makes me giggle too.



The world will fall too the power of slug mode!!!


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 30, 2009)

mac101 said:


> The world will fall too the power of slug mode!!!



Of course.


----------



## αce (Sep 30, 2009)

Following reasons why Tsunade won't hit Sasuke:

Why won't certain black men date black women?
Sasuke casually dodges kn0 Naruto's punches. The same kn0 Naruto who is part 1's speed demon, and has a nice edge over Tsunade in speed.

Now,..

Why won't certain black men date black women?
Even if Sasuke would rush in, not only does he have the speed to change his momentum, he'll do it if he see's a counter from the opponent.

And he does such as shown here:
Why won't certain black men date black women?


I'd also like to add that part 1 Sasuke was as fast as kn0.
Why won't certain black men date black women?
By this logic, Sasuke was only able to keep up with kn0 because he was as fast.

Tsunade is outclassed in speed, and with her current speed feats, she won't land a hit on Sasuke.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 30, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Following reasons why Tsunade won't hit Sasuke:
> 
> Gabrielle Union
> Sasuke casually dodges kn0 Naruto's punches. The same kn0 Naruto who is part 1's speed demon, and has a nice edge over Tsunade in speed.
> ...



Assuming she doesn't rip apart the ground, having him tossed off balance, and speedblitz him with a Shunshin + Ranshinsho combo while he's occupied with the missing ground.

_Reason_ why Sasuke won't land a hit on Tsunade (Not that it matters if he does when Souzou Saisei is on ):

Gabrielle Union

Keep in mind that's out of practice, tired out, and snuck upon. 

Medic's evasion > all.


----------



## αce (Sep 30, 2009)

So that's more impressive then dodging Raikage at point blank?

Also, sharingan+body speed evasion>all. Including medics.

Sharingan gives natural evasion tactics, and if you add on your own, its hax.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 30, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> So that's more impressive then dodging Raikage at point blank?
> 
> Also, sharingan+body speed evasion>all. Including medics.
> 
> Sharingan gives natural evasion tactics, and if you add on your own, its hax.



Let's put it like this.

Sasuke's incredibly fast. Dodging an attack from an incredibly fast person isn't really that impressive. However, he did dodge an attack from a fast Kage. He's good. 

But: Coming back to the battle field after decades and keeping up with a Jounin while he had to tire you out before even engaging with you is even more impressive. Not to mention she _still_ dodged.  I can't stress enough that it's incredibly impressive for someone to just hop onto the battlefield after years of inactivity, keep on par with someone much younger/advantaged then she is, and only losing because of a phobia. Not to mention her performance and prowess made his question whether that was the power of a living legend. And that's when she's gimped as hell. 

He may evade because of his sharingan, but it's second nature to medics like Tsunade, especially experienced ones. So he'll be just as hardpressed to land a hit on her as she will on him.


----------



## Harry Balzac (Sep 30, 2009)

Tsunade hokage... complete joke


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 30, 2009)

Harry Balzac said:


> I reply to anybody I like/dislike. Doesn't make her or You important to me, like I said, he/she is just like everybody else here



Au contraire. If you reply to them, you deem them worthy of your time and as such, they have some importance, no matter how trivial or negative.  If you didn't really think they were important, you'd ignore them.


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## Andre (Sep 30, 2009)

Tsunade wins.


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## αce (Sep 30, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Let's put it like this.
> 
> Sasuke's incredibly fast. Dodging an attack from an incredibly fast person isn't really that impressive. However, he did dodge an attack from a fast Kage. He's good.
> 
> ...



Raikage>eveyone else in speed.

Kn0 Naruto>Tsunade in speed.

Sasuke has a better chance of hitting her. Especially with his built in chidori blade that gives him an extra five metres.


----------



## Neji-Hyuuga (Sep 30, 2009)

> You are vastly overestimating Tsunade's Sozo Saisei; she needs time to use it.
> 
> No, she simply released the seal and uses it. It doesn't take time, and even if so, a few seconds at most.


I think hes talking about the time needed to store chakara.
- Katon: Gouryuuka no Jutsu
She has stated that she has been gathering chakara in her seal for quite some time ( it has probably been a long time, as she has not been in any fights for awhile.)


> Not that it matters if he does when Souzou Saisei is on


So the justu is not something that can just be kept on giving immortality, nor is it a move she can spam.

But Imo, tsunade's not gonna make it past the part where sasuke runs with a choidori in his hand toward her. Because of his sharigan, he will be able to see when she is building up chakara in her hand, then avoiding the ground smash thing will be as easy as jumping, and will not throw him off balance. If she decides to try to punch him when sasuke is charging at her, she going to end up losing a hand if he decides to extend the range of the chidori with Chidori Eisō, if shes tries to dodge, he can just keep charging at her, which will result in him catching her because he's faster


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## αce (Sep 30, 2009)

Where's this notion that she can't die with souzou saisei come from?


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## Harry Balzac (Sep 30, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Au contraire. If you reply to them, you deem them worthy of your time and as such, they have some importance, no matter how trivial or negative.  If you didn't really think they were important, you'd ignore them.




How are they important when I don't even know who they are? lolol


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 30, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Raikage>eveyone else in speed.
> 
> Kn0 Naruto>Tsunade in speed.
> 
> Sasuke has a better chance of hitting her. *Especially with his built in chidori blade that gives him an extra five metres*.



Super-high Tsunade jump negates that. But you'll find a counter argument in my reply to Neji-Hyuuga. Or epic dodging skills to the sides, which won't be negated with my next statement. 



Neji-Hyuuga said:


> I think hes talking about the time needed to store chakara.
> - Katon: Gouryuuka no Jutsu
> She has stated that she has been gathering chakara in her seal for quite some time ( it has probably been a long time, as she has not been in any fights for awhile.)



He said use, as in the actual usage of the jutsu, not the prerequisite of storing up chakra for it.



> So the justu is not something that can just be kept on giving immortality, nor is it a move she can spam.



She's immortal for a long as she has chakra. And we know she's a chakra beast. See healing village while Pain attacked (when healing one takes up lots of chakra), then using a regenerative technique, Souzou Saisei, on them all. 



> But Imo, tsunade's not gonna make it past the part where sasuke runs with a choidori in his hand toward her.* Because of his sharigan, he will be able to see when she is building up chakara in her hand, then avoiding the ground smash thing will be as easy as jumping, and will not throw him off balance.* If she decides to try to punch him when sasuke is charging at her, she going to end up losing a hand if he decides to extend the range of the chidori with Chidori Eisō, if shes tries to dodge, he can just keep charging at her, which will result in him catching her because he's faster



Unfortunately, to debate your point, I am essentially giving Ace a way to counter my argument to him.

If Sasuke jumps in the air, he'll be an easier target. You can't manuever in mid-air.



Harry Balzac said:


> How are they important when I don't even know who they are? lolol



You don't have to know someone for them to be important. Most religions showcase this by believing in God (as I myself do), but they don't know God personally. 



♠Ace♠ said:


> Where's this notion that she can't die with souzou saisei come from?



When she specifically stated "I can't die during battle" when revealing Souzou Saisei. 

I'm off. Til next time.


----------



## αce (Sep 30, 2009)

^Lot's of characters have said stuff that is bullshit. They are hyping themselves. And even when other characters say stuff. Like Nejis absolute defense, or Gaaras absolute defense.

Going by those, not even Tsunade could break them, right?

And Sasuke maneuvers and titlted his body like 180 degrees in mid air.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 30, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> ^Lot's of characters have said stuff that is bullshit. They are hyping themselves. And even when other characters say stuff. Like Nejis absolute defense, or Gaaras absolute defense.
> 
> Going by those, not even Tsunade could break them, right?
> 
> And Sasuke maneuvers and titlted his body like 180 degrees in mid air.



However, Tsunade actually proved it. She stated she's invincible because any damage will be instantly regenerated and she can continue the battle. All the wounds Kabuto and Orochimaru inflicted on her were regenerated. Notice how she one-shotted Manda then Orochimaru soon after.


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## Harry Balzac (Sep 30, 2009)

Off topic:

Alright well, Lady Tsunade..since this person is important and isn't anyone I know off, give me the name so i can type it on wikipedia see if his/her name shows up. I wana see what she accomplished so much, so that I can respect him//her like you.


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## αce (Sep 30, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> However, Tsunade actually proved it. She stated she's invincible because any damage will be instantly regenerated and she can continue the battle. All the wounds Kabuto and Orochimaru inflicted on her were regenerated. Notice how she one-shotted Manda then Orochimaru soon after.



She only has a certain amount of cells she can create.

And if enough damage is done to her body, it won't matter if she can regenerate cells or not because her body will fail.

For example, if Sasuke stabbed her through the heart with a chidori infused blade and caused damage to her lungs, she would die. Simply because her cells won't regenerate fast enough before her body gives out and it'd be even worse if the lightning messes up her nervous systems.

Also, she one shotted Oro without his arms. And Sasuke can one shot manda by blinking.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Sep 30, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> She only has a certain amount of cells she can create.
> 
> And if enough damage is done to her body, it won't matter if she can regenerate cells or not because her body will fail.
> 
> ...



She's only in her 50's. She's got countless (not countless, but damn near it) years-worth of cells to use up. Using Souzou Saisei won't really kill her, especially soon enough in battle.

She still one-shotted them. :ho


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## αce (Sep 30, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> She's only in her 50's. She's got countless (not countless, but damn near it) years-worth of cells to use up. Using Souzou Saisei won't really kill her, especially soon enough in battle.
> 
> She still one-shotted them. :ho



True, but she's still not invincible.


----------



## Harry Balzac (Sep 30, 2009)

Dude ace, no matter what you say to her.. you will fail to convince. Look at her Avatar and name man. She's bound to protect tsunade at all costs.


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## Innerhype (Sep 30, 2009)

Even if someone is declared dead, their cells continue working for a finite amount of time (hours maybe?), If thats truly the case wouldn't Tsunade just come back to life over and over again if she did happen to be killed somehow?


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## αce (Sep 30, 2009)

Harry Balzac said:


> Dude ace, no matter what you say to her.. you will fail to convince. Look at her Avatar and name man. She's bound to protect tsunade at all costs.


That's what makes it so fun.


----------



## Romanticide (Sep 30, 2009)

I'm saying it would be a tie, since i like both characters, Ace/Taka Sasuke and Lady Tsunade/Legendary Beauty. Plus we couldn't really gauge their reactions.


----------



## koibito (Sep 30, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Let's put it like this.
> 
> Sasuke's incredibly fast. Dodging an attack from an incredibly fast person isn't really that impressive. However, he did dodge an attack from a fast Kage. He's good.
> 
> ...



You also forget that after she had her arms screwed over by Kabuto's chakra scalpel and hardly able to breath she was able to get behind him without him noticing and get him in the back of the neck, and screw up his nervous system with one strike.
here.
Regulator


----------



## On and On (Sep 30, 2009)

How in the hell is this thread still going?

Oh snap, LB/LT 

Sasuke wins in under a minute. Seriously.


----------



## Mongolian Chop Squad (Sep 30, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> ^Lot's of characters have said stuff that is bullshit. They are hyping themselves. And even when other characters say stuff. Like Nejis absolute defense, or Gaaras absolute defense.
> 
> Going by those, not even Tsunade could break them, right?
> 
> And Sasuke maneuvers and titlted his body like 180 degrees in mid air.



She could be hyping herself, but Gaara and Neji never claimed to have absolute defenses. Those statements came from other characters, i.e. Temari and Tenten respectively.



> Off topic:
> 
> Alright well, Lady Tsunade..since this person is important and isn't anyone I know off, give me the name so i can type it on wikipedia see if his/her name shows up. I wana see what she accomplished so much, so that I can respect him//her like you.



Dude, you just need to drop it and go on with your life.



> She only has a certain amount of cells she can create.
> 
> And if enough damage is done to her body, it won't matter if she can regenerate cells or not because her body will fail.
> 
> ...



Actually, Tsunade had one of her lungs punctured during the Sannin fight. Just thought I should point that out. And Sasuke doing enough damage to her to make her use up all of the cells available to her throughout the rest of her life is just not gonna happen.


----------



## King Of Gamesxx (Sep 30, 2009)

With Souzou Saisei Tsunade can essentially grow back limbs too right? Since internal organs are no problem?


----------



## Soul (Oct 1, 2009)

Windwaker said:


> He's not all that fast and sasuke didn't repeatedly attack against him.



Deidara wasn't that fasts; his bombs were + Deidara is fast; a 4.5 speed stat in the Databook supports it.

They had their intial skirmish, then after deidara escaped with the C1 sasuke just stood there and went "!" while he brought out C2. Even if he wasn't going for the kill, there's no reason other than CIS that he didn't continue to attack.



> Eisou is the spear correct? Depending on how far she is i don't see why she couldn't dodge it. The jutsu itself isn't that fast.



What about this one? {Middle Panel}



> That mindless beast might not even be that fast, and he isn't a master at a taijutsu style based around reading body language and evasion.



Killer Bee showed:


Excellent Taijutsu.
Excellent control of the sword.
A lot of power
Great Speed



> He let itachi (the guy he hated more than anything in the world) recover after he got tsukyomi countered when he could have just dashed in and finished him off. He could have done SOMETHING to prevent amaterasu, but instead he sat their smirking.



Sasuke was damaged too; re read the fight.



> this one
> 
> Yea, she used it to protect the villagers from Pain's massive attack but funneling it through katsuyu into everybody else, and in the process used it up.



My bad.



> Base bee touched him just fine, and he wasn't any faster than sasuke (IMO he was slower, just more skilled, otherwise rari atto would have been too fast for sasuke).



Rari Atto's attack was evaded because:


It was a linear attack.
_*Sasuke had Sharingan*_ which can read movements.



> And there will be certain moments that sasuke won't have his eyes on tsunade, and she'll know to capitalize on them.



Like when?



> Although i still say the most probable way that tsunade is going to hit him is when he thinks he's won the fight ha.



That could be true, but it is unlikely.



koibito said:


> Better than bed ridden unsuspecting Orochimaru who was able to catch it through his wrists.



True.



> Nagashi which she could punch through burning herself badly and still getting the hit in.



Are you serious?
Re read the fight; Nagashi covered a very wide area {+4 m}.

Tsunade won't be able to throw a punch within the range of a Raiton Ninjutsu before she is damaged.


----------



## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 1, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> Deidara wasn't that fasts; his bombs were + Deidara is fast; a 4.5 speed stat in the Databook supports it.



Im pretty sure he has a 4. Also, whats his taijutsu stat? My reasoning that tsunade will be decent at evading is because even though she's a point behind in speed, she's got a 5 in a taijutsu style based solely around evasion. 

And while we've never seen HER use it, we've seen sakura use it (who's slower and worse off at it) and she had some pretty nice moves.




> What about this one? {Middle Panel}



Fast, but itachi was in mid air, which gave him no reason to dodge. Also, from 30 meters away it's less likely to hit. Finally, unless he stabs her in the forehead (which he won't cuz it's not his style) she'll activate SS.




> Killer Bee showed:
> 
> 
> Excellent Taijutsu.
> ...


The panel i was responding to didnt have killer bee in it, it had random CS fodder.

And imo base bee did not show great speed. 



> Sasuke was damaged too; re read the fight.



Barely. He goes down initially, but then he gets up smirking, Then he just stands there for a few pages while zetsu talks, itachi gets up, and then makes the seal for amaterasu.



> Rari Atto's attack was evaded because:
> 
> 
> It was a linear attack.
> _*Sasuke had Sharingan*_ which can read movements.



But it was still speed that he could keep up with with little difficulty. If base bee was sasuke's match in speed, then with the addition of 4 tails wouldnt he be too fast for even sasukes sharingan?

My main point with the Bee thing is that in base form, his primary asset was technique, not speed. Normally taijutsu skill is vastly underrated compared to speed.



> Like when?


So sasuke is going to keep his eyes on all of tsunade at all times? In a close range encounter this would be difficult, especially to someone skilled in taijutsu.



> That could be true, but it is unlikely.



Why is it unlikely? When he fatally stabs her he isnt going to keep his guard up. If he disintegrates her lung with chidori he's not going to think "Hmm she might be able to regenerate organs."

When Killer Bee fell down after tsukyomi he didn't turn around to make sure he was down. He let him lay there for a few seconds and then got clotheslined.

It was rational to assume that he wouldnt have a counter to tsukyomi, just as it'd be rational to assume that a fatally wounded tsunade wouldn't have regeneration on par (surpassing?) even a jinchuriki.

Sasuke underestimates his opponents, and its come back to haunt him before.


----------



## koibito (Oct 1, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> Are you serious?
> Re read the fight; Nagashi covered a very wide area {+4 m}.
> 
> Tsunade won't be able to throw a punch within the range of a Raiton Ninjutsu before she is damaged.



I will re read it then although i forget the chapter number, what was it?


----------



## Soul (Oct 1, 2009)

koibito said:


> I will re read it then although i forget the chapter number, what was it?



Let me link you:

Chidori Nagashi


----------



## Creator (Oct 1, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Where's this notion that she can't die with souzou saisei come from?



The constant healing that is taking place in her body maybe? Its like Kabuto's jutsu but much better since its Tsunade. 



♠Ace♠ said:


> Lot's of characters have said stuff that is bullshit. They are hyping themselves. And even when other characters say stuff. Like Nejis absolute defense, or Gaaras absolute defense.




I would like to know some of these characters.

Apart from Oro and Tsunade, no character is effectively immortal. Only these two are. Well only Oro is, Tsunade's immortal for a period of time. The period in which she has the extra chakra in her body.


Again i like to point out. One hit. ONE HIT, is enough to end Sasuke. Be it a scratch, or a full fisted punch. Yes Sasuke can dodge it, but even then his chakra is limited, where as her chakra reserves are immense. 

Furthermore, his not the only one who can use Shushin. She can use Shushin aswell, so speed wise she can keep up to an extent. She also has an immense threshold for pain, as we saw, so a few hits wont really be the end of her, and she can alway survive. 

Another thing. It seems no one is taking into account the location. Sasuke has to jump from one side to the other which leaves him open for attack.


----------



## Koroshi (Oct 1, 2009)

Creator said:


> I would like to know some of these characters.
> 
> Apart from Oro and Tsunade, no character is effectively immortal. Only these two are. Well only Oro is, Tsunade's immortal for a period of time. The period in which she has the extra chakra in her body.



Sasori disagrees.




> Again i like to point out. One hit. ONE HIT, is enough to end Sasuke. Be it a scratch, or a full fisted punch. Yes Sasuke can dodge it, but even then his chakra is limited, where as her chakra reserves are immense.



Well I wouldn't say scratch but yeah one hit should be able to kill Sasuke, albeit it needs to be at a vital area. Lungs, Throat, Head, Balls. Anywher vital.


----------



## Creator (Oct 1, 2009)

Koroshi said:


> Sasori disagrees.



He was meh. His a difficult one to judge to be honest.



> Well I wouldn't say scratch but yeah one hit should be able to kill Sasuke, albeit it needs to be at a vital area. Lungs, Throat, Head, Balls. Anywher vital.



Even a touch to Sasuke's leg = Broken Leg = Sasuke's main weapon gone. 

One touch to Sasuke's hand = No jutsus. 

Like i said, the slightest touches = Death for Sasuke.


----------



## knives907 (Oct 1, 2009)

Creator said:


> He was meh. His a difficult one to judge to be honest.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



And who has Tsunade hit with this godly taijutsu?


----------



## Creator (Oct 1, 2009)

knives907 said:


> And who has Tsunade hit with this godly taijutsu?



Oro. Kabuto. 

But i already stated, it depends on whether she can hit him. Its just the moment she does, Sasuke's finished.


----------



## koibito (Oct 1, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> Let me link you:
> 
> Chidori Nagashi



You were right, my bad, although Sasuke wont run up to somebody and nagashi them. He would use it in response to an attack as a defensive technique so even though it would be a problem its only a problem for her attacking not something that anyone can argue he'd win with.


@Creator: Not to mention it doesnt have to be a super strength attack one hit can screw over his entire nerve system.


----------



## knives907 (Oct 1, 2009)

Creator said:


> Oro. Kabuto.



Kabuto is a low level medic nin not suited for taijutsu. Good luck hitting someone with actual skill and a taijutsu/strength/speed enhancer(CS2)
Orochimaru was just caught off guard, as they weren't really fighting. Also, notice how neither of them died/were crippled. 

Tsunade has to rely on genin Naruto to protect her not ONCE but TWICE. Sorry granny, stick to healing.



> But i already stated, it depends on whether she can hit him. Its just the moment she does, Sasuke's finished.



Just like she finished Kabuto and Orochimaru... Oh wait...


----------



## Creator (Oct 1, 2009)

koibito said:


> Not to mention it doesnt have to be a super strength attack one hit can screw over his entire nerve system.



Exactly



knives907 said:


> Kabuto is a low level medic nin not suited for taijutsu. Good luck hitting someone with actual skill and a taijutsu/strength/speed enhancer(CS2)
> Orochimaru was just caught off guard, as they weren't really fighting. Also, notice how neither of them died/were crippled.
> 
> Tsunade has to rely on genin Naruto to protect her not ONCE but TWICE. Sorry granny, stick to healing.



Alright. Fair point. Tsunade struggles against Oro and Kabuto shortly after fighting of her fear of blood is not an achieve.

But wait, when has Sasuke ever won a battle without Plot Shield? 

Hmm.....Cant remember one. 

Dont bring plot into this battle. Sasuke has had the biggest plot shield i have ever seen. Not even Naruto has a plot shield that big. 



> Just like she finished Kabuto and Orochimaru... Oh wait...



She did almost kill Kabuto. 

Oro is the only one who can tank her punch and survive. Why? Oral Rebirth, plus his body isnt even his own. Its someone elses. He doesnt care about his body's well being. He only cared for living.


----------



## koibito (Oct 1, 2009)

knives907 said:


> Kabuto is a low level medic nin not suited for taijutsu. Good luck hitting someone with actual skill and a taijutsu/strength/speed enhancer(CS2)
> Orochimaru was just caught off guard, as they weren't really fighting. Also, notice how neither of them died/were crippled.
> 
> Tsunade has to rely on genin Naruto to protect her not ONCE but TWICE. Sorry granny, stick to healing.
> ...




Umm Kabuto is by no means 'low level' seriously the skill it took to figure out his own body after Tsunade screwed it over is nothing small. Look at what Orochimaru is saying to Kabuto.

uses a KB, as well

Plus she didnt finish off Kabuto because he pulled a dirty trick, that says nothing against Tsunade's skill.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 1, 2009)

What's happened to you, knives? I always thought of you as a kind soul.... 



knives907 said:


> Kabuto is a low level medic nin not suited for taijutsu. Good luck hitting someone with actual skill and a taijutsu/strength/speed enhancer(CS2)
> Orochimaru was just caught off guard, as they weren't really fighting. Also, notice how neither of them died/were crippled.



No. Orochimaru was not caught off guard. He attacked her in the first place, attempting to strangle her. Did he expect she wouldn't react?

Kabuto wasn't killed because he negated her strength, after getting her into a position where she couldn't dodge (in mid air), and that's when he landed his first hit.

Orochimaru was not killed because of two possible reasons: 1.) His modified body or 2.) Souzou Saisei used up all her chakra, and as such, she could not enhance her great raw strength to inhumane levels, sparing him death. 



> Tsunade has to rely on genin Naruto to protect her not ONCE but TWICE. Sorry granny, stick to healing.



And her relied on her three times. And do remember the conditions under which she fought. Not to mention the phobia, which would render anyone immobile. That's hardly a factor here. Irrelevant.



> Just like she finished Kabuto and Orochimaru... Oh wait...



She started the Sannin fight and ended it. 



koibito said:


> You also forget that after she had her arms screwed over by Kabuto's chakra scalpel and hardly able to breath she was able to get behind him without him noticing and get him in the back of the neck, and screw up his nervous system with one strike.
> epigenetics
> NamiKazeKage



Forget? I never forget.  I mentioned that in the beginning posts.



The Comedian said:


> How in the hell is this thread still going?
> 
> Oh snap, LB/LT
> 
> Tsunade wins in under a minute. Seriously.



I agree.


----------



## Mongolian Chop Squad (Oct 1, 2009)

knives907 said:


> And who has Tsunade hit with this godly taijutsu?



And how many times have we seen Tsunade in an actual fight? Oh, that's right just once... and she happened to hit both Orochimaru and Kabuto.


----------



## koibito (Oct 1, 2009)

"Forget? I never forget.  I mentioned that in the beginning posts."

Ah then maybe i missed that, but its still true. My apologies.


----------



## KamuiEyes (Oct 1, 2009)

e697 said:


> Sasuke wins with easy difficulty. He is much *faster* than her and has his *sharingan prediction* to easily avoid her giant punches. One chidori nagashi followed by blossom chidori and its over.



Those two things alone mean that anything Tsunade has shown is useless against Sasuke. Especially without Katsuya. Speed+Sharingan>Brute strength.


----------



## Lord Raizen (Oct 3, 2009)

KamuiEyes said:


> Those two things alone mean that anything Tsunade has shown is useless against Sasuke. Especially without Katsuya. Speed+Sharingan>Brute strength.



Whats your basis for assuming that Sasuke is that much faster than her, if at all? She is comparable to Orochimaru and Jiraiya in speed, and sasuke has shown anything that puts him higher than Tsunade in speed. And his sharingan prediction has failed him all too many times for me to believe that he can simply see every hit coming. Kakashi spent much of his time evading Sakura in their training excercise, as he commented himself that one hit would finish him. However, he has a great speed advantage over Sakura. A signifcant speed adavatage over Tsunade, is what Sasuke lacks. Much of his effort would be spent avoiding, not only her fatal punches, but the slightest grazes that could mess up his nervous system or cause any internal damage.

If hes smart enough he'll deduce that his best options are long ranged attacks, of which he can onyl produce so much off, before fatigue sets in. Combined with the fact that he'll be avoiding powerful strikes and thier after effects much of the time, his endurance will only go down that much faster. Tsunade on the other hand has a great deal more chakra, can take a great deal more damage. Tsunade has knowledge and battle expeience of which Sasuke lacks the ability to deal with. Simply because he has a powerful jutsu and sharingan doenst mean it willl bring him victory agaisnt Kage level ninja, as later chapters show. Tsunade's experience=40+ years. Sasuke's= about 6 months. 

I dont believe he can go the entire battle and achieve victory without getting touched once by Tsunade, and one touch is all that it would take for her to win. All things point to Tsunade's victory. And Id say it would be mid difficulty at best.


----------



## Vergil642 (Oct 3, 2009)

Lord Raizen said:


> Whats your basis for assuming that Sasuke is that much faster than her, if at all? She is comparable to Orochimaru and Jiraiya in speed, and sasuke has shown anything that puts him higher than Tsunade in speed. And his sharingan prediction has failed him all too many times for me to believe that he can simply see every hit coming. Kakashi spent much of his time evading Sakura in their training excercise, as he commented himself that one hit would finish him. However, he has a great speed advantage over Sakura. A signifcant speed adavatage over Tsunade, is what Sasuke lacks. Much of his effort would be spent avoiding, not only her fatal punches, but the slightest grazes that could mess up his nervous system or cause any internal damage.



Tsunade's Tier 3.5 in speed and only hit Oro with a surprise attack/when he couldn't dodge it anyway (she had his tongue in her hands after all). Sasuke nearly blitzed someone in his own speed tier. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out he's going to blitz her ass really hard. His Sharingan prediction has only failed him once, if you're going to argue him being hit you'd be better off citing his hugely inferior Taijutsu skills and Tsunade managing to grab him when he leaves himself open or something, sorta like how Bee stabbed him up.

Course, Bee being really, really fast is one of the reasons he could do that. If he didn't have that speed he'd not have landed the blows as Sasuke would have time to try and dodge. Unfortunately for Tsunade, she's in such a scenario; Sasuke without his Sharingan could dodge most of her attacks pretty easily just by running away faster than she can keep up. Also, Chidori Nagashi would throw her away if she ever came close to landing a blow.



> If hes smart enough he'll deduce that his best options are long ranged attacks, of which he can onyl produce so much off, before fatigue sets in. Combined with the fact that he'll be avoiding powerful strikes and thier after effects much of the time, his endurance will only go down that much faster. Tsunade on the other hand has a great deal more chakra, can take a great deal more damage. Tsunade has knowledge and battle expeience of which Sasuke lacks the ability to deal with. Simply because he has a powerful jutsu and sharingan doenst mean it willl bring him victory agaisnt Kage level ninja, as later chapters show. Tsunade's experience=40+ years. Sasuke's= about 6 months.



So you're telling me that Tsunade's going to basically outlast/outsmart Sasuke? I can see the second thing happening, but outlasting isn't really an issue here. Without a cunning tactic to get her hands on him, Tsunade isn't going to be hitting Sasuke. What's more, Sasuke's ranged jutsu means he'll be hitting her, forcing her to heal herself and use Sozo Saisei when he stabs her with Chidori Eisou then causes it to spike out while inside her.



> I dont believe he can go the entire battle and achieve victory without getting touched once by Tsunade, and one touch is all that it would take for her to win. All things point to Tsunade's victory. And Id say it would be mid difficulty at best.



Why not? Sasuke's speed advantage here is amazing, his reactions are enhanced by the Sharingan and he can see Tsunade's every move before she makes it. And Tsunade lacks any ranged attacks, meaning just having Chidori Eisou out would allow Sasuke to force her to use Sozo Saisei, which in turn would lead to her running out of chakra long before he does.

Tsunade's only hope is Sasuke slips up at some point or something. She can do very nearly nothing against him from what she's shown.


----------



## ? (Oct 3, 2009)

the OP is obviously trying to put things in sasukes favor. he's haxed as it is, and he restricts something very important to tsunade.

anyway i still say tsunade wins. sasuke charges in as usual and tsunade punches the ground. he trips up and fall she then proceeds to one shot him with one of her chakra enhanced strong punches.

wow, that senario could really work lol. even here sasuke looses.


----------



## David (Oct 3, 2009)

Inu-Sennin said:


> the OP is obviously trying to put things in sasukes favor. he's haxed as it is, and he restricts something very important to tsunade.
> 
> anyway i still say tsunade wins. sasuke charges in as usual and tsunade punches the ground. he trips up and fall she then proceeds to one shot him with one of her chakra enhanced strong punches.
> 
> wow, that senario could really work lol. even here sasuke looses.



You're saying Katsuya > CS "base boost," CS1, CS2, snake jutsus & Oro jutsus?

I say Sasuke is restricted just as much - if not more - than Tsunade.

And your scenario seems like a joke to me.  Sasuke's 3-Tomoe Sharingan would predict all of Tsunade's attacks, + Sasuke has the speed to dodge those attacks.


----------



## ? (Oct 3, 2009)

Daviddd said:


> You're saying Katsuya > CS "base boost," CS1, CS2, snake jutsus & Oro jutsus?
> 
> I say Sasuke is restricted just as much - if not more - than Tsunade.
> 
> And your scenario seems like a joke to me.  Sasuke's 3-Tomoe Sharingan would predict all of Tsunade's attacks, + Sasuke has the speed to dodge those attacks.


but if he wanted to make this fair he should have gimped him more. in this situation is obvious sauce-cake would win. it seems like this thread was made strictly to go in sasukes favor.


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## Seductress (Oct 4, 2009)

sasuke ddddddddahhhh


----------



## αce (Oct 4, 2009)

Inu-Sennin said:


> but if he wanted to make this fair he should have gimped him more. in this situation is obvious sauce-cake would win. it seems like this thread was made strictly to go in sasukes favor.



Believe it or not, I gave Lady Tsunade the choice in the restrictions. Except battlefield.


----------



## Creator (Oct 4, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Believe it or not, I gave Lady Tsunade the choice in the restrictions. Except battlefield.



Tsunade: No katsuya.

Sasuke: Taka Sasuke. No mangekyou sharingan.

Knowledge: Manga knowledge


She had the choice and she chose that?  

WTF is this shit? No Katsuyu. 

But your clever. You chose the battlefield that aids Sasuke. 

But this is well messed. She could have chosen anything and she chose to NOT give Tsunade one of her main offences.


----------



## Munboy Dracule O'Brian (Oct 4, 2009)

Sasuke. His Chidori variants can help him out here, eventually he'd end with Kirin.


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## αce (Oct 4, 2009)

Creator said:


> Tsunade: No katsuya.
> 
> Sasuke: Taka Sasuke. No mangekyou sharingan.
> 
> ...



How is this not fair?

And since when was Katsuya an offensive summon?


----------



## Creator (Oct 4, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> How is this not fair?
> 
> And since when was Katsuya an offensive summon?



You tell me that when a ton worth of acidic slug is falling on you.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 4, 2009)

Creator said:


> Tsunade: No katsuya.
> 
> Sasuke: Taka Sasuke. No mangekyou sharingan.
> 
> ...




I'd like the notion that Tsunade can win battles without Katsuyu's help every single time.  Your post makes me think she relies on Katsuyu way too much.

I question your Tsunade-tardism. 



♠Ace♠ said:


> How is this not fair?
> 
> And since when was Katsuya an offensive summon?



Since Part I when she fought, and not healed.


----------



## Harry Balzac (Oct 4, 2009)

Creator said:


> You tell me that when a ton worth of acidic slug is falling on you.



It aint go do nothing to sasuke. He'll easy dodge ALL of them, teleport right to tsunades back and stab her with the sword of kusanagi along with a chidori. 
Tsunade has nothing to attack with, except her taijutsu, and you and i both know she'll nvr hit sasuke with her speed.


----------



## Creator (Oct 4, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> I'd like the notion that Tsunade can win battles without Katsuyu's help every single time.  Your post makes me think she relies on Katsuyu way too much.
> 
> I question your Tsunade-tardism.



A Summon is a Shinobi tool. In her case, Katsuyu happens to be her radio, and her helper with acid. 

Its one of her only form of offence which doesnt rely on smashy smashy.

If i could chose restricts i would chose, 'Sasuke realizes his a Senju dog and as a result will never attack a senju'  



Harry Balzac said:


> It aint go do nothing to sasuke. He'll easy dodge ALL of them, teleport right to tsunades back and stab her with the sword of kusanagi along with a chidori.
> Tsunade has nothing to attack with, except her taijutsu, and you and i both know she'll nvr hit sasuke with her speed.



But will you agree that one hit will end Sasuke.


----------



## Munboy Dracule O'Brian (Oct 4, 2009)

Can someone tell me how its possible to avoid Kirin? Sasuke can predict where the victim goes with the Sharingan and plan the strike accordingly.

This fight would be smoother for him has he been able to use his Mangekyou.


----------



## αce (Oct 4, 2009)

Creator said:


> You tell me that when a ton worth of acidic slug is falling on you.



Katsuya was restriced.

As was Sasukes _*strongest abilities.*_

This is completely fair.

Unless you want to add Tsunade a _slug_ and Sasuke _flames_ that force bijuus and kages to mutilate their limbs? Or how about moves that tank mountain busters?

Sasuke is more nerfed than Tsunade here.


----------



## Sadgoob (Oct 4, 2009)

Tsunade loses with or without restrictions.


----------



## Creator (Oct 4, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Sasuke is more nerfed than Tsunade here.



Right. You tell yourself that, eventually someone will believe you.


----------



## αce (Oct 4, 2009)

Creator said:


> Right. You tell yourself that, eventually someone will believe you.



Ok, so let me get this straight.

Sasuke-
.Loses Susano-o. A move that can tank mountain busting level moves. Attacks from 3 jounins and a kage are reduced to nothing. And cuts through cement like butter

.Loses Amaterasu. A move that has only been avoided by Raikage. The fastest ninja in the manga. A move that forced Hachibi, a bijuu, to mutilate one of it's limbs. A move that forced a kage to mutilate one of his arms. And a move that was hailed by Zetsu as the strongest ninjutsu. A move that broke through Jiraiyas frog stomach. A frog that breathes fire.

.Loses Enton: Kagatsuchi. A move that allows Sasuke to manipulate those exact same raping black flames.

.Loses Tsukiyomi. Rape on massive levels.



Tsunade-
. Loses Katsuya. A summon that allows for healing, even though she already has souzo sasei. And spits acid. It can also multiply and talk to Tsunade. But has no threatening offensive presence.




Sorry, but Susano-o or amaterasu alone>Katsuya.

And this isn't even the susano-o+amaterasu combo.



Tsunade isn't losing much of an offensive force here. Sasuke is losing some of the strongest jutsus to date.

It doesn't take a child to see this.


----------



## HUNTER EMS (Oct 4, 2009)

Sasuke + Kirin + Tsunade = Tsunade dead. 
Sasuke is much more skilled in taijutsu,genjutsu,nature release(ninjutsu),his much more faster and has the sharingan to his advantage. Tsunade is overrated,she wouldnt be able to touch him. All Sasuke needs is one hit with chidori. Sasuke managed to defeat Deidera without MS,i dont see why he shouldnt be able to defeat granma.


----------



## Sadgoob (Oct 4, 2009)

Creator said:


> Right. You tell yourself that, eventually someone will believe you.



The only people who believe that Slugs are more valuable than Tsukiyomi, Amatarasu, and Susanoo or that Slugs are more valuable than Oral Rebirth, CS2, and the White Snake are people with Tsunade in their avatars. Sasuke wins with basic Genjutsu used in the Raikage fight. If not, then he wins with Chidori variations. If not, he wins with Kirin. He's faster than Tsunade, he has Sharingan prediction, he has Ninjutsu that paralyzes people in Taijutsu range, and she has no chance in hell. If you gave him the Mangyekou Sharingan and Tsunade her slugs then he wins with even more ease.


----------



## KamuiEyes (Oct 4, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Katsuya was restriced.
> 
> As was Sasukes _*strongest abilities.*_
> 
> ...



Uhh yeah, a summon as opposed to Sasuke's main fucking attack, really people? How much more could you nerf Sasuke? "No eye's" 

You only want him more restricted because people still think he can win... What does that say about Tsunade


----------



## Harry Balzac (Oct 4, 2009)

Creator said:


> A Summon is a Shinobi tool. In her case, Katsuyu happens to be her radio, and her helper with acid.
> 
> Its one of her only form of offence which doesnt rely on smashy smashy.
> 
> ...



A single punch killing sasuke? Highly unlikely, I don't agree, no


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 4, 2009)

Illusory said:


> Tsunade loses with or without restrictions.



You again. We had a talk about this, Illusory. 



KamuiEyes said:


> Uhh yeah, a summon as opposed to Sasuke's main fucking attack, really people? How much more could you nerf Sasuke? "No eye's"
> 
> *You only want him more restricted because people still think he can win... What does that say about Tsunade*



That even with handicaps similar to the likes of what she had against Kabuto, she can still kick ass. 

To think we were getting along for a bit. 



Harry Balzac said:


> A single punch killing sasuke? Highly unlikely, I don't agree, no



So Sasuke's immune to manga canon of one of Tsunade's chakra punches being fatal?


----------



## αce (Oct 4, 2009)

Read the latest arc and see how much torment hes taken.

And he got hit by part of Deidaras c0 blast.

He isn't dying from one hit.


----------



## hmph (Oct 4, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Read the latest arc and see how much torment Susanoo has taken.



Fixed that for you.


----------



## Cjones (Oct 4, 2009)

HUNTER EMS said:


> Sasuke + Kirin + Tsunade = Tsunade dead.
> *Sasuke is much more skilled in taijutsu* ,genjutsu,nature release(ninjutsu),his much more faster and has the sharingan to his advantage. Tsunade is overrated,she wouldnt be able to touch him. All Sasuke needs is one hit with chidori. Sasuke managed to defeat Deidera without MS,i dont see why he shouldnt be able to defeat granma.





Harry Balzac said:


> *A single punch killing sasuke? Highly unlikely*, I don't agree, no





♠Ace♠ said:


> Read the latest arc and see how much torment hes taken.
> 
> And he got hit by part of Deidaras c0 blast.
> 
> *He isn't dying from one hit*.



,,,,,,,


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 4, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Read the latest arc and see how much torment hes taken.
> 
> And he got hit by part of Deidaras c0 blast.
> 
> He isn't dying from one hit.



One clear hit, and yes, he's dying from it. No Susanoo to block it for him, thanks to no MS. 

She'd one-shot any of his summons, just like she did with Manda.


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## Ra (Oct 4, 2009)

Sasuke win, the sharingan prediction will allow him to predict tsunade taijutsu. Also sasuke genjutsu + chidori will be effective in killing her.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 4, 2009)

GrandKitaro777 said:


> Sasuke win, the sharingan prediction will allow him to predict tsunade taijutsu. Also sasuke genjutsu + chidori will be effective in killing her.



Predict her movements, but it doesn't help him from the effects of a collapsing arena, flying boulders from all sides, etc.

Genjutsu is negated by chakra control, which Tsunade happens to excel in.

And Souzou Saisei tanks Chidori. Assuming he hits her in the first place, since she excels in evasion. And if he should, nothing's stopping her from ripping his face in half when his arm is buried in her chest.


----------



## Ra (Oct 4, 2009)

> Predict her movements, but it doesn't help him from the effects of a collapsing arena, flying boulders from all sides, etc.



He could evade.



> Genjutsu is negated by chakra control, which Tsunade happens to excel in.



She doesn't break out instantly, it takes time and sasuke can exploit that time with a chidori.



> And Souzou Saisei tanks Chidori. Assuming he hits her in the first place, since she excels in evasion. And if he should, nothing's stopping her from ripping his face in half when his arm is buried in her chest.



If he hits her heart she's dead and if tsunade survive somehow and goes for a strike chidori nagashi is effective in handling the situation.


----------



## the box (Oct 4, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> I've arrived.
> 
> Let's. Get. Started!
> 
> Tsunade wins. Sasuke relies too much on his Mangekyo Sharingan, and without it, he only has his speed, Katana, and basic jutsu. Nothing that can stop Tsunade. :ho



tsuande gets killed befor she even knows shes dead. sasuke is way to fast for her to react to


----------



## KamuiEyes (Oct 5, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> That even with handicaps similar to the likes of what she had against Kabuto, she can still kick ass.
> 
> To think we were getting along for a bit.



Umm.. What? Restricting a summon is nothing like a phobia of blood. And it seems a lot of people disagree Tsunade wins this fight. That shows nothing like her kicking ass... It shows that when Sasuke is stripped of his 3 best and main jutsus, he can still beat Tsunade. 

If you really think Katsuya is as useful to Tsunade as MS is to Sasuke... Wow.


----------



## Mithos (Oct 5, 2009)

> He could evade


.

It's unlikely he won't get hit once. And I can argue the same, with her skills in evasion Tsunade could evade Sasuke



> She doesn't break out instantly, it takes time and sasuke can exploit that time with a chidori


.

Possibly, but if she has Souzou Saisei on she will tank the damage and regenerate. If not she might be able to survive long enough to active it,seeing as she did after being slashed and pierced with the kusanagi.

With her chakra control and experience she should be able to break out of genjutsu pretty quickly. She might even be able to prevent herself from falling for it in the first place. 



> If he hits her heart she's dead and if tsunade survive somehow and goes for a strike chidori nagashi is effective in handling the situation.



Actually with Souzou Saisei active she could take a hit to the heart and live. It regenerates "all organs and parts". If he goes for a second strike Tsunade could tank it and regenerate again, and then counter attack and crush Sasuke


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 5, 2009)

the box said:


> tsuande gets killed befor she even knows shes dead. sasuke is way to fast for her to react to



Assuming he lands a hit on her. 



KamuiEyes said:


> Umm.. What? Restricting a summon is nothing like a phobia of blood. And it seems a lot of people disagree Tsunade wins this fight. That shows nothing like her kicking ass... It shows that when Sasuke is stripped of his 3 best and main jutsus, he can still beat Tsunade.
> 
> *If you really think Katsuya is as useful to Tsunade *as MS is to Sasuke... Wow.



Yes, because a 300+ ton slug that spits acid, breaks into bunshin, can share intelligence and vantage points (similar to rinnegan) and can be used as a medium for healing is absolutely useless to have in your arsenal.


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## Harry Balzac (Oct 5, 2009)

Can't believe this is still going on lol.

Lady Tsunade, deep down inside of you, you know sasuke is victorious. He always wins, regardless


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 5, 2009)

Harry Balzac said:


> Can't believe this is still going on lol.
> 
> Lady Tsunade, deep down inside of you, you know sasuke is victorious. *He always wins, regardless*



So no matter what the circumstances, he'll win?  No. His Mangekyo Sharingan is taken away, and as such, a vast majority of his jutsu. Katsuyu's taken away for Tsunade. This is Tsunade's win.


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## Creator (Oct 5, 2009)

Harry Balzac said:


> Can't believe this is still going on lol.
> 
> Lady Tsunade, deep down inside of you, you know sasuke is victorious. He always wins, regardless



An Uchiha dog only wins by running away when facing a Senju. Ask Madara. He will let you know.


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## αce (Oct 5, 2009)

Is creator still going on about Senju>Uchiha? This is just an attempt to place Tsunade above Sasuke by her genes.

Itachi is stronger than Tsunade.
And Madara is the strongest ninja alive at the moment.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 5, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Is creator still going on about Senju>Uchiha? This is just an attempt to place Tsunade above Sasuke by her genes.
> 
> Itachi is stronger than Tsunade.
> And Madara is the strongest ninja alive at the moment.



Agreed.

Although without MS or knowledge on tsunade's jutsu, and some CIS, i still think tsunade takes this.


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## Harry Balzac (Oct 5, 2009)

Creator said:


> An Uchiha dog only wins by running away when facing a Senju. Ask Madara. He will let you know.



No, last time i checked madara hunted hashiramas ass down. Sure he lost, we don't know exactly what happened in that fight but all we know is that he lost, and at the same time fooled the great hashirama, pretending to be dead. Now look the senju leader.. dead while the uchiha leader is about to take over the world. Madara always gets the last laugh :]. 

PS: What happened to the senju clan? I don't remember them being assasinated, like the uchiha


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## KamuiEyes (Oct 5, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Yes, because a 300+ ton slug that spits acid, breaks into bunshin, can share intelligence and vantage points (similar to rinnegan) and can be used as a medium for healing is absolutely useless to have in your arsenal.



Not as much as the most powerful genjutsu in Naruto so far, an incredibly powerful long range attack jutsu that can also be used defensively, AND the best defensive justsu shown in Naruto so far... No not nearly as useful. Amaterasu>Summons I.E. Sasuke VS. Killer Bee. The bigger they are the easier the target.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 5, 2009)

KamuiEyes said:


> Not as much as the most powerful genjutsu in Naruto so far, an incredibly powerful long range attack jutsu that can also be used defensively, AND the best defensive justsu shown in Naruto so far... No not nearly as useful. Amaterasu>Summons I.E. Sasuke VS. Killer Bee. The bigger they are the easier the target.



So simply because he has one of his haxx taken away, he's gimped more than Tsunade, who has some feats, but not as much as the nearly Manga-centric Sasuke?

Katsuyu could avoid Amaterasu by breaking up into small bunshin, as opposed to being set on fire as one giant slug.


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## eHav (Oct 5, 2009)

well sasuke doesnt seem to aim his chidori's into the head, but into the chest. so tsunade tanks one chidori and grabs his arm, then rips sasuke in half. then plucks sasukes arm from her chest, regenerates and voila she's ready for another fight


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 5, 2009)

eHav said:


> well sasuke doesnt seem to aim his chidori's into the head, but into the chest. so tsunade tanks one chidori and grabs his arm, then rips sasuke in half. then plucks sasukes arm from her chest, regenerates and voila she's ready for another fight



Yea this is like 40% of why i think tsunade takes this.


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## KamuiEyes (Oct 5, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> So simply because he has one of his haxx taken away, he's gimped more than Tsunade, who has some feats, but not as much as the nearly Manga-centric Sasuke?
> 
> Katsuyu could avoid Amaterasu by breaking up into small bunshin, as opposed to being set on fire as one giant slug.


3 of his so called "hax" actually. It's completely biased to call his MS "hax" and act as though Tsunade's abilities are simply feats. Manga-centric or not, he still wins against Tsunade... Since when did panel time have anything to do with abilities or mean anything he can do is unfair because Tsunade doesn't get as much panel time.

And in breaking up she becomes useless offensively against Sasuke. They haven't shown any ability other than healing when broken down. Oh and fire spreads and Amaterasu doesn't go out. I doubt it wont do serious damage to Katsuya before it's too late.


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## Innerhype (Oct 5, 2009)

eHav said:


> well sasuke doesnt seem to aim his chidori's into the head, but into the chest. so tsunade tanks one chidori and grabs his arm, then rips sasuke in half. then plucks sasukes arm from her chest, regenerates and voila she's ready for another fight



I agree.

Sasuke isn't dumb in the slightest but his recklessness is going to eventually cost him a finger flick to the head that'll end this fight immediately.


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## eHav (Oct 5, 2009)

well ye, for sasuke to beat tsunade he has to get in close and hit her somehow, and without knowledge of her regeneration, tsunade tanking his blow will for sure caught him off guard. thats all she needs to get a grab on him and get a clean hit.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 5, 2009)

eHav said:


> well ye, for sasuke to beat tsunade he has to get in close and hit her somehow, and without knowledge of her regeneration, tsunade tanking his blow will for sure caught him off guard. thats all she needs to get a grab on him and get a clean hit.



Exactly.

I brought this angle up a few days ago and people either ignored it or wrote it off as something sharingan would predict thus making it UNPOSSIBLE.


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## eHav (Oct 5, 2009)

i bet they had uchiha signatures and avatars


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## Black Sabbath II (Oct 5, 2009)

Tsunade takes chidori in the chest and counters with a punch to the face when Sasuke least expects it.

Then she uses souzou saisei.

The end.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 5, 2009)

eHav said:


> i bet they had uchiha signatures and avatars



Most of them yes...how ever did you guess?


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## machiavelli2009 (Oct 6, 2009)

is it me or has everyone forgotten that chidori actually numbs its target. not only would he pierce her chest but she would have no way of returning the favor.


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## eHav (Oct 6, 2009)

machiavelli2009 said:


> is it me or has everyone forgotten that chidori actually numbs its target. not only would he pierce her chest but she would have no way of returning the favor.



yeah because gaara, naruto and kakuzu clearly were hopeless after getting hit right?


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## machiavelli2009 (Oct 6, 2009)

well lets see, gaara bailed out. naruto, plot shield+ kyubi charka. kakuzu 5 hearts, so unlike tsuande who would get killed  if her heart gets crushed kakuzu wnt have such problems.


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## mastergimmy (Oct 6, 2009)

machiavelli2009 said:


> well lets see, gaara bailed out. naruto, plot shield+ kyubi charka. kakuzu 5 hearts, so unlike tsuande who would get killed  if her heart gets crushed kakuzu wnt have such problems.



Kakuzu did prove it doesnt numb the target. Although he had another heart, if chidori did numb his body then he woodnt be able to stand up


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## eHav (Oct 6, 2009)

machiavelli2009 said:


> well lets see, gaara bailed out. naruto, plot shield+ kyubi charka. kakuzu 5 hearts, so unlike tsuande who would get killed  if her heart gets crushed kakuzu wnt have such problems.



so basicaly chidori never made anyone numb?

nice argument there


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 6, 2009)

Also, heart getting crushed would have no effect on whether or not he gets numbed.

The lack of a generic human body would defend him from that.

Also, depending on how chidori numbs the body SS could heal it very quickly (nerve damage?)


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## Koroshi (Oct 6, 2009)

Creator said:


> An Uchiha dog only wins by running away when facing a Senju. Ask Madara. He will let you know.



At least debate properly Creator instead of stating Senju > Uchiha, Which is true anyway.



machiavelli2009 said:


> is it me or has everyone forgotten that chidori actually numbs its target. not only would he pierce her chest but she would have no way of returning the favor.



An actual manga scan of Chidori numbing a person, even the DB doesn't state so. Even then Sozo Saisei can theoretically heal Tsunade from said numbing of the body if it existed.


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## machiavelli2009 (Oct 6, 2009)

wait in leaf ninja.com when i search chidori and its variants it is stated that they all numb. 
so yh thats where i got that from.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 6, 2009)

KamuiEyes said:


> 3 of his so called "hax" actually. It's completely biased to call his MS "hax" and act as though Tsunade's abilities are simply feats. Manga-centric or not, he still wins against Tsunade... Since when did panel time have anything to do with abilities or mean anything he can do is unfair because Tsunade doesn't get as much panel time.
> 
> And in breaking up she becomes useless offensively against Sasuke. They haven't shown any ability other than healing when broken down. Oh and fire spreads and Amaterasu doesn't go out. I doubt it wont do serious damage to Katsuya before it's too late.




1.) MS is haxxed. Sharingan gives him an advantage over any opponent already, as well as proficiency in genjutsu, but then he has to have a more powerful form that allows him to use Amaterasu, Susanoo, and Tsukuyomi (if that's in his arsenal) ? As opposed to Tsunade's Souzou Saisei, her only haxx jutsu we've seen. Yes, Sasuke has it _much_ harder. 

Sasuke still has snake summons whereas Tsunade doesn't, but it's irrelevant since she can one-shot them anyways. If Sasuke was fully-powered without any restrictions, than from what we've seen of Tsunade, yes, he'd most likely defeat her. However, that's not the case here. Speed and Chidori is not going to be enough for someone who tanks it so easily and can end this in one hit. Close quarters is her forte, and Sasuke will have to be close to get an accurate hit on her, since her training as a medic emphasizes on evasion. Once he's there, OHKO here we go.  Another method is to activate Souzou Saisei, let him think he's got a fatal blow, then rip him to shreds.


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## Mithos (Oct 6, 2009)

machiavelli2009 said:


> wait in leaf ninja.com when i search chidori and its variants it is stated that they all numb.
> so yh thats where i got that from.



Even if it does numb, they don't _paralyze_ the target so Tsunade could still crush him when his arm is in her. If she has Souzou Saisei active she regenerates instantly, if not she crushes Sasuke then activates it.


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## Sadgoob (Oct 6, 2009)

eHav said:


> yeah because gaara, naruto and kakuzu clearly were hopeless after getting hit right?



None of those individuals have regular bodies. You fail. I'm confused though. When people acknowledge that Sasuke is faster, has Sharingan prediction, and has ranged attacks we still have individuals saying she'd trick him. He wouldn't get in close, Tsunade's strength is legendary, and he would cut her in half or stab her and blossom the chidori from a distance. Sasuke has every advantage in this fight and only haters or hardcore Tsunade fans think Tsunade would have the advantage (by trikz, evidently.)


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 6, 2009)

Illusory said:


> *None of those individuals have regular bodies. You fail.* I'm confused though. When people acknowledge that Sasuke is faster, has Sharingan prediction, and has ranged attacks we still have individuals saying she'd trick him. *He wouldn't get in close,* Tsunade's strength is legendary, and *he would cut her in half or stab her and blossom the chidori from a distance.* Sasuke has every advantage in this fight and only haters or hardcore Tsunade fans think Tsunade would have the advantage (by trikz, evidently.)



And Tsunade does? 

I suppose the ability to take great damage, tank most attacks, and regrow organs/limbs, essentially making you immortal for as long as the jutsu's active, constitutes as a normal body.

Yes, a large swing of a sword. The most linear kind of attack possible. Here we have an evasion specialist. I suppose you think she wouldn't be able to dodge?


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## Sadgoob (Oct 6, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> And Tsunade does?



Is she composed of black fibers or has demonic appendages growing from her?



Lady Tsunade said:


> I suppose the ability to take great damage, tank most attacks, and regrow organs/limbs, essentially making you immortal for as long as the jutsu's active, constitutes as a normal body.



It is still a normal body and the power originates from the seal on her forehead. Now tell me, Lady Tsunade, why Sasuke would be unable to analyze this. Does he not have the time? Is he not faster than her? Can he not predict her attacks? Does his Sharingan miss the chakra flow? Is she for whatever reason immune to his powerful Genjutsu for even a few seconds? Is she going to tank all of his Chidori variants that he throws out like candy? Tell me how she would counter all of this and win in the majority of scenarios.  



Lady Tsunade said:


> Yes, a large swing of a sword. The most linear kind of attack possible. Here we have an evasion specialist. I suppose you think she wouldn't be able to dodge?



Oh, and needles, and shock waves through the ground, and an opponent far faster than herself who can put you under Genjutsu for even a moment before landing the hit. She may be an evasion specialist, and I'm not saying it would be easy, but the deck is so obviously stacked against her in this match.


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## machiavelli2009 (Oct 6, 2009)

omg!! thank you illusory for some actual reasoning. the only people that say sasuke gets killed are the sauce haters. and those that say it would be easy are the sauce-tards. and in between there is me and  illusory, so trust me when i say that sasuke wnt loose this.
he takes it with mid-difficulty
AND PLEASE TAKA SAUCE DOESNT HAVE SUMMONS!! im not shouting it is just that people keep writing  that, thinking they are making sense.


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## eHav (Oct 6, 2009)

Illusory said:


> Is she composed of black fibers or has demonic appendages growing from her?
> 
> 
> 
> ...




yeah becaue sasuke just uses all that and tsunade stands there taking it 

 sasuke hasnt got any particular knowledge on her (Knowledge: Manga knowledge) and tsunade does know a lot about sasuke.

 sasuke will not be hurting tsunade without getting close, and landing an attack that he expects to be fatal just to see that it isnt will leave him open to get hit. and thats all tsunade needs to win.

 you act like sasuke is so fast that he blitzes everyone and never gets hit. well as we can see in all his fights he always goes in melee and he always gets hit, sharingan or not. 
just assuming that he will just go in there sunshin and cut her in half isnt much of an argument.

an evasion specialist will not be taking deadly hits from a distance, and sasuke will not land a deadly hit in melee. and any hit he gets in melee leaves him open to get hit back wich he cannot afford to against tsunade.

and why do ppl assume sasuke is so much faster than tsunade?


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## Sadgoob (Oct 6, 2009)

eHav said:


> yeah becaue sasuke just uses all that and tsunade stands there taking it



Because she's going to catch the faster opponent with Sharingan prediction, right? In your mind that's how it works?



eHav said:


> sasuke hasnt got any particular knowledge on her (Knowledge: Manga knowledge) and tsunade does know a lot about sasuke.



She's a legendary Sanin who is a renowned healer and is known to have super strength. Additionally, she was Orochimaru's partner. He can also see her chakra flow.



eHav said:


> sasuke will not be hurting tsunade without getting close, and landing an attack that he expects to be fatal just to see that it isnt will leave him open to get hit. and thats all tsunade needs to win.



This is why you're wrong. Needles, chidori variants, Genjutsu. He does not need to be close. He won't want to be close. Her strength is legendary.



eHav said:


> you act like sasuke is so fast that he blitzes everyone and never gets hit. well as we can see in all his fights he always goes in melee and he always gets hit, sharingan or not.



I'm acting as if he's been up against opponents a great deal faster than Tsunade that he had no knowledge of and still did reasonably well. Your argument stems from him getting up close. Why would he do that when he's said himself that he functions best at mid range and excels at Genjutsu?



eHav said:


> just assuming that he will just go in there sunshin and cut her in half isnt much of an argument.



That wasn't my argument. He has an extending chidori blade. 



eHav said:


> an evasion specialist will not be taking deadly hits from a distance



Even if under a Genjutsu?


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## machiavelli2009 (Oct 6, 2009)

erm cuz tsuande has shown no speed feats. kabuto was faster than her. now on the other hand sauce has shown nothin but speed feats.yamato,deidara,madara and sakura all talked about how fast he moves. so yh, that is why people know that tsuande is slower.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 6, 2009)

eHav covered it, but I'll take my go at it. 



Illusory said:


> Is she composed of black fibers or has demonic appendages growing from her?



So that's the only definition of an irregular body?



> It is still a normal body and the power originates from the seal on her forehead. Now tell me, Lady Tsunade, why Sasuke would be unable to analyze this. Does he not have the time? Is he not faster than her? Can he not predict her attacks? Does his Sharingan miss the chakra flow? Is she for whatever reason immune to his powerful Genjutsu for even a few seconds? Is she going to tank all of his Chidori variants that he throws out like candy? Tell me how she would counter all of this and win in the majority of scenarios.



1.) Knowledge is nothing if you don't have the power to act on it.
2.) Predicting her attacks is not the same as predicting the catastrophic results, and it doesn't necessarily guarantee his escape. Predicting and reacting are two different things.
3.) With sublime chakra control, the very thing Jiraiya taught Naruto (while having Itachi/Akatsuki in mind) would be beneficial to breaking out of genjutsu, yes, she'd break out of his regular Sharingan jutsu (seeing as MS is restricted) with ease.

4.) Souzou Saisei tanks those all, assuming he even hits her in the first place.



> Oh, and needles, and shock waves through the ground, and an opponent far faster than herself who can put you under Genjutsu for even a moment before landing the hit. She may be an evasion specialist, and I'm not saying it would be easy, but the deck is so obviously stacked against her in this match.



No, it's actually in his favor. Speed, summons, genjutsu, etc, as opposed to her strength and medical ninjutsu. He isn't much of a threat without MS.



machiavelli2009 said:


> erm cuz tsuande has shown no speed feats. kabuto was faster than her. now on the other hand sauce has shown nothin but speed feats.yamato,deidara,madara and sakura all talked about how fast he moves. so yh, that is why people know that tsuande is slower.



Kabuto against a Tsunade who hasn't fought in years and had to tire her out was equal in speed to Tsunade, and she was giving him a run for his money. She does have a few speed feats.


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## machiavelli2009 (Oct 6, 2009)

well u make it seem lyk since then she went to go get herself fit. anywayz people this is redudant the only way sauce looses is if he runs in point blank and uses chidori. of course tsuande wnt be killed, and from there sauce dies. so its based on circumstance really. genjutsu would be a life saver here.


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## Sadgoob (Oct 6, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> So that's the only definition of an irregular body?



This isn't complicated. She has a regular body, regular chakra, but a unique seal. This is different from being five hearts that are held together by black strings, white snakes, having a Bijuu overtake half of your body, or been having the Kyubi's chakra fuse with your own over the years.



Lady Tsunade said:


> 1.) Knowledge is nothing if you don't have the power to act on it.



As I've said and as you've ignored, Sasuke has every _possible_ advantage to act on it.



Lady Tsunade said:


> 2.) Predicting her attacks is not the same as predicting the catastrophic results, and it doesn't necessarily guarantee his escape. Predicting and reacting are two different things.



Predicting and reacting are two different things when your opponent is far above you in speed. Tsunade is not. To the contrary, all evidence shows that she's significantly below him in speed. As for the catastrophic results, Tsunade's strength is legendary. She was Orochimaru's partner for decades. Sasuke not knowing about her strength and chakra control is incredibly unlikely. 



Lady Tsunade said:


> 3.) With sublime chakra control, the very thing Jiraiya taught Naruto (while having Itachi/Akatsuki in mind) would be beneficial to breaking out of genjutsu, yes, she'd break out of his regular Sharingan jutsu (seeing as MS is restricted) with ease.



But in time? Sasuke saw right through Shi's Genjutsu, instantaneously, and yet he still needed Juugo and Sugietsu to block the Raikage's hit. Tsunade doesn't have the Sharingan. It will take he a few moments, like it took Naruto, to even realize she's in a Genjutsu before a taking a few more moments to break it. That's more than enough time for an attack. 



Lady Tsunade said:


> No, it's actually in his favor. Speed, summons, genjutsu, etc, as opposed to her strength and medical ninjutsu. He isn't much of a threat without MS.



No, it's not. She can stand there and take it. But not for long.



Lady Tsunade said:


> Kabuto against a Tsunade who hasn't fought in years and had to tire her out was equal in speed to Tsunade, and she was giving him a run for his money. She does have a few speed feats.



Kabuto is not a speed feat, sweetie.


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## Canute87 (Oct 6, 2009)

If deidara can dodge Sasuke's speed and he isn't even a close combat fighter why can't tsunade?


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## Sadgoob (Oct 6, 2009)

No, she can. But for how long? Do you think Deidara could have kept that up indefinitely?


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 6, 2009)

Illusory said:


> None of those individuals have regular bodies. You fail. I'm confused though. When people acknowledge that Sasuke is faster, has Sharingan prediction, and has ranged attacks we still have individuals saying she'd trick him. He wouldn't get in close, Tsunade's strength is legendary, and he would cut her in half or stab her and blossom the chidori from a distance. Sasuke has every advantage in this fight and only haters or hardcore Tsunade fans think Tsunade would have the advantage (by trikz, evidently.)



None of his ranged attacks are extremely fast, so with tsunade's decent speed and evasive abilities im confident she could dodge them.

Tsunade can anticipate where an attack is heading by watching the subtle movements a person makes before or just as the attack is beginning.

Also, while tsunade's strength is legendary, sasuke saw raikage's insane strength first hand, strength that would end him in one hit....did that stop him from rushing in like he always does? 

And sasuke has a few disadvantages that are a big deal. Lack of knowledge and in characterization hurt sasuke a lot. Sadly sasuke hasn't fought smart since itachi. 

I don't see why sasuke wouldn't charge in with a chidori, then tsunade would take the hit, and grab sasuke while he is arm deep in her stomach.

EDIT: Btw im more of a sasuke fan than a tsunade fan, and yet in this scenario i still think tsunade would win.


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## Cjones (Oct 6, 2009)

Windwaker said:


> None of his ranged attacks are extremely fast, so with tsunade's decent speed and evasive abilities im confident she could dodge them.
> 
> Tsunade can anticipate where an attack is heading by watching the subtle movements a person makes before or just as the attack is beginning.
> 
> ...



That's what I was going to comment on. IC Sasuke always charges in head first and he's done it about 3 times now. He did it against Deidara, Killer Bee and recently Raikage.

This thread reminds me so much of the Asuma vs Sasuke thread.


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## Vergil642 (Oct 6, 2009)

Canute87 said:


> If deidara can dodge Sasuke's speed and he isn't even a close combat fighter why can't tsunade?



Because Deidara's reactions are much, much faster than Tsunade's.

And even then he barely escaped, partly by hitting himself with his own exlosion (inexplicably avoiding damage in the process).

Also, good luck grabbing Sasuke when he pops a Chidori Nagashi and throws your ass back with it. Besides, all he has to do is get his Chidori to spike out and send one spike through her brain, killing her instantly. Or flow the Chidori through her (while his hand is still inside her abdomen), numbing her and paralysing her, undermining her ability to use her super strength or even move.

The only reason Raikage pulled this off was because he didn't get stabbed that much and happened to be immune to Raiton attacks. Tsunade lacks both of these attributes, and high speed reactions. Sasuke could probably Shunshin out of there if he's lucky before she grabbed him anyway.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 6, 2009)

Vergil642 said:


> Because Deidara's reactions are much, much faster than Tsunade's.



Thats a bit of an overstatement. Deidara has faster reactions, but its not by a huge margin as you're implying. Also, tsunade can anticipate movements, which should help with the lack of speed. Also, Tsunade is a much better close range fighter than deidara.



> Also, good luck grabbing Sasuke when he pops a Chidori Nagashi and throws your ass back with it. Besides, all he has to do is get his Chidori to spike out and send one spike through her brain, killing her instantly. Or flow the Chidori through her (while his hand is still inside her abdomen), numbing her and paralysing her, undermining her ability to use her super strength or even move.



This all requires him to be aware that tsunade has regen abilities. If sasuke runs in head first (as we've seen many a time), he'll stab tsunade through the stomach/lungs. At this point i think that tsunade could knock him out (since he isnt going to expect her to be completely unfazed) before he has the chance to do nagashi.



> The only reason Raikage pulled this off was because he didn't get stabbed that much and happened to be immune to Raiton attacks. Tsunade lacks both of these attributes, and high speed reactions. Sasuke could probably Shunshin out of there if he's lucky before she grabbed him anyway.



Tsunade is however almost completely immune to pain, or at least, she talked/acted perfectly fine (before SS started up) after orochimaru had just gone to town on her with kusanagi.

I agree that sasuke might be able to get away through use of CN and shunshin, but i think more times than not he'll be KO'd before he gets away.

So 6/10 in tsunade's favor imo.


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## machiavelli2009 (Oct 6, 2009)

u all seem to 4get that when tsuande is healin herself sauce can tell thanks to haxxgan. 
tsuande isnt oro who cn tank high level injures without having ta heal himself and attack after wards. if tsuande gets hit in the chest, she is gonna have to heal herself then attack sauce. by the tym she is done healin herself sauce would see through her straight line attack. common people, we are talking about kishi pet here.


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 6, 2009)

machiavelli2009 said:


> u all seem to 4get that when tsuande is healin herself sauce can tell thanks to haxxgan.
> tsuande isnt oro who cn tank high level injures without having ta heal himself and attack after wards. if tsuande gets hit in the chest, she is gonna have to heal herself then attack sauce. by the tym she is done healin herself sauce would see through her straight line attack. common people, we are talking about kishi pet here.



Stabs in the chest don't stop tsunade, as seen when orochimaru was going to town on her and she got up just fine (this would be BEFORE ss activated.)

Sasuke will see the chakra, maybe even know its regenerative chakra, but it won't be enough for him to know that stabs in the chest dont stop tsunade at all until its too late.


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## Sadgoob (Oct 6, 2009)

Windwaker said:


> Also, while tsunade's strength is legendary, sasuke saw raikage's insane strength first hand, strength that would end him in one hit....did that stop him from rushing in like he always does?



Good point. Although you're ignoring Genjutsu


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 6, 2009)

Illusory said:


> Good point. Although you're ignoring Genjutsu



What does that have to do with what you quoted? 

Anyways, With tsunade's chakra control it won't be much of an issue. And sasuke has rarely (if ever?) used his genjutsu in conjunction with a close range attack, which would be the only way it'd be effective.

Also, sasuke rarely opens with genjutsu unless there are other people besides his target and he doesnt want them interfering (Examples: Raikage fight, against Team 7)


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 6, 2009)

Illusory said:


> This isn't complicated. She has a regular body, regular chakra, but a unique seal. This is different from being five hearts that are held together by black strings, white snakes, having a Bijuu overtake half of your body, or been having the Kyubi's chakra fuse with your own over the years.



About as different as having the ability to regenerate lost body parts. Which she has.



> As I've said and as you've ignored, Sasuke has every _possible_ advantage to act on it.



He has advantages, but they can be negated. Genjutsu negated by Chakra Control. Damage negated by Souzou Saisei. Summons negated by Strength, which can potentially negate Sasuke's speed since he'd be hard pressed to attack while having boulders/cracked ground as obstacles.



> Predicting and reacting are two different things when your opponent is far above you in speed. Tsunade is not. To the contrary, all evidence shows that she's significantly below him in speed. As for the catastrophic results, Tsunade's strength is legendary. She was Orochimaru's partner for decades. Sasuke not knowing about her strength and chakra control is incredibly unlikely.



I said predicting and reacting is two different things. Whether or not he's faster than her doesn't change that. I'd doubt Orochimaru would've had an opening to tell Sasuke about Tsunade's monstrous strength, as it'd be entirely irrelevant to whatever they'd be doing. I have a hard time imagining Orochimaru proclaiming his defeat to his student and detailing how it occured. Not to mention that Sasuke left after the Sannin fight had ended, during which he was comatose. Even more unlikely that Sasuke would know about it.

However, as the Hokage and him being a member of the infamous Uchiha Clan, I'd be inclined to say that one of Tsunade's few advantages is superior knowledge.



> But in time? Sasuke saw right through Shi's Genjutsu, instantaneously, and yet he still needed Juugo and Sugietsu to block the Raikage's hit. Tsunade doesn't have the Sharingan. It will take he a few moments, like it took Naruto, to even realize she's in a Genjutsu before a taking a few more moments to break it. That's more than enough time for an attack.



So simply because he has the Sharingan and it took him a second to break out of genjutsu and was still threatened by Raikage, whom Sasuke couldn't keep up with, it's automatically saying that since Sasuke couldn't keep up with Raikage, Tsunade can't keep up with Sasuke? 



> No, it's not. She can stand there and take it. But not for long.



Yes, a legendary kunoichi can't hold her own against a gimped shinobi simply because he's manga-centric. Despite not needing it with these conditions, Souzou Saisei can be used and rape him. Walk in, ignorant of death and damage, become more reckless just to ensure a hit, then it's done.



> Kabuto is not a speed feat, sweetie.



When you're up against a much younger, agile 100% elite shinobi who's pumped up on ninja roids (Soldier Pill) and you've been out of shape and tired out and can still keep on par with that said shinobi (a Jounin, no less), even managing to get in a surprise attack against him and quickly getting Gamabunta's dagger up in the air with no one noticing, I'd say you're pretty fast. Simply because she's not as fast as others doesn't mean she's slow.


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## Sadgoob (Oct 6, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> About as different as having the ability to regenerate lost body parts. Which she has.



They're still normal body parts. So it's different. He would also be able to see where the healing energy is coming from and aim his attacks accordingly.



Lady Tsunade said:


> He has advantages, but they can be negated. Genjutsu negated by Chakra Control.



If being under Genjutsu for two to ten seconds intervals whenever Sasuke catches her eye isn't a crushing advantage than I don't know what is.



Lady Tsunade said:


> Damage negated by Souzou Saisei.



If he lops off her head upon putting 2 and 2 together with his chakra sight would her entire body regenerate from that seal? If so, how many times?



Lady Tsunade said:


> Summons negated by Strength



I don't think Taka Sasuke has summons.



Lady Tsunade said:


> which can potentially negate Sasuke's speed since he'd be hard pressed to attack while having boulders/cracked ground as obstacles.



Idk, he danced around the White Snake pretty nicely.



Lady Tsunade said:


> I said predicting and reacting is two different things. Whether or not he's faster than her doesn't change that.



Yes, it does. The only times predicting has lost out is to much, much, much faster opponents. Even KN0 was a good deal faster and was still completely owned by prediction. You have to be the mothereffing Raikage to want to get a Taijutsu hit in against someone as fast as Sasuke with Sharingan prediction.



Lady Tsunade said:


> I'd doubt Orochimaru would've had an opening to tell Sasuke about Tsunade's monstrous strength, as it'd be entirely irrelevant to whatever they'd be doing.



Three years of 1 on 1 training and never mentioning Tsunade? 



Lady Tsunade said:


> I have a hard time imagining Orochimaru proclaiming his defeat to his student and detailing how it occured.



When teaching him about medical ninja he wouldn't mention it?



Lady Tsunade said:


> However, as the Hokage and him being a member of the infamous Uchiha Clan, I'd be inclined to say that one of Tsunade's few advantages is superior knowledge.



If Orochimaru didn't know about his variants then she wouldn't.



Lady Tsunade said:


> So simply because he has the Sharingan and it took him a second to break out of genjutsu and was still threatened by Raikage, whom Sasuke couldn't keep up with, it's automatically saying that since Sasuke couldn't keep up with Raikage, Tsunade can't keep up with Sasuke?



Considering she doesn't have a Sharingan and it would take her longer, yes.



Lady Tsunade said:


> When you're up against a much younger, agile 100% elite shinobi who's pumped up on ninja roids (Soldier Pill)



But is still significantly slower than Yamato.



Lady Tsunade said:


> and you've been out of shape and tired out and can still keep on par with that said shinobi (a Jounin, no less)



Kabuto was a Genin. Not all Jounins are fast. Gaara was a Kage < Genin Lee.



Lady Tsunade said:


> even managing to get in a surprise attack against him and quickly getting Gamabunta's dagger up in the air with no one noticing, I'd say you're pretty fast. Simply because she's not as fast as others doesn't mean she's slow.



But in comparison to Sasuke, relevant to this battle, she's slow.


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## ? (Oct 6, 2009)

theres no way a female can win in this manga.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 6, 2009)

Illusory said:


> They're still normal body parts. So it's different. He would also be able to see where the healing energy is coming from and aim his attacks accordingly.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Stopped right there. Saying Kabuto is a genin is what ruined your post.


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## Sadgoob (Oct 6, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Stopped right there. Saying Kabuto is a genin is what ruined your post.



He was taking the Chuunin exam 

If you had continued, you'd notece that ranks don't mean squat.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 6, 2009)

Illusory said:


> He was taking the Chuunin exam
> 
> If you had continued, you'd notece that ranks don't mean squat.



He's a Jounin. He was taking the Chunin exams to spy on Konoha/gather info and report to Orochimaru.

Well, when you kill your post like that, I'm too busy being bemused to continue.


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## Sadgoob (Oct 6, 2009)

Link me where it says he's a Jounin. It's no concern of mine if you'd rather snigger at rhetoric rather than respond to the argument.


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Oct 6, 2009)

Even if his rank isn't Jounin he was compared to pre-timeskip Kakashi. So, that pretty much makes him an Elite Jounin. That's like saying that Sasuke and Naruto suck because they are Genin even though they are Kage level.


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## Jermaine (Oct 8, 2009)

eHav said:


> so basicaly chidori never made anyone numb?
> 
> nice argument there




Yamato went numb  and barely was able to counter after getting stabbed with chidori flowing through sasuke's sword.


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## machiavelli2009 (Oct 8, 2009)

thank you, ur a genius i 4got that!! so people who think chidori dnt numb, wat do u have to say about that.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 8, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> Yamato went numb  and barely was able to counter after getting stabbed with chidori flowing through sasuke's sword.



Barely able =/= not able to do it at all. It's still manageable.


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## Jermaine (Oct 8, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Barely able =/= not able to do it at all. It's still manageable.



Very true.


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## Jermaine (Oct 10, 2009)

Yamato barely able to counter it using his wood jutsu to force the sword out, not to mention sasuke didnt even have his blade in very deep.

So if sasuke plunged his blade deeper he would win especially without tsunade not being able to force it out with wood jutsu.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 10, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> Yamato barely able to counter it using his wood jutsu to force the sword out, not to mention sasuke didnt even have his blade in very deep.
> 
> So if sasuke plunged his blade deeper he would win especially without tsunade not being able to force it out with wood jutsu.



She can easily break the sword with her strength. Even if not, she can do what Sakura did against Sasori, heal herself with the sword in her even with the paralyzing/numbing affects of Sasuke's chidori (like Sasori's poison was doing to Sakura).


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## Csdabest (Oct 10, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> She can easily break the sword with her strength. Even if not, she can do what Sakura did against Sasori, heal herself with the sword in her even with the paralyzing/numbing affects of Sasuke's chidori (like Sasori's poison was doing to Sakura).



Are you really trying to say her fist>>>The Chidori gatana blade of a sword. Why doent he just use Projectile Chakra blades and cut her up from a distance. Sasuke clowns her all over. Her super strength account for shit cuz she will never touch Sasuke. She is slower than Sasuke. And Sasuke can easily counter her punches. Whats to stop him from using Kasegui genjutsu or using that long range genjutsu he hit shit with to paralise her. 

Tsunade gets shitted o horribely. And whats to stop sasuke from further slicing upward or downward to cut her in half. Either way she will be paralysed. Sasuke could simply chidori eisou her into her face.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 10, 2009)

Csdabest said:


> Are you really trying to say her fist>>>The Chidori gatana blade of a sword.



Super strength > metal. Even if electrified.



> Why doent he just use Projectile Chakra blades and cut her up from a distance.



Attacks from distance = time until they hit. Time which could only benefit one who excels in evasion. Long distance attacks most likely won't work.



> Sasuke clowns her all over.



Not gimped like this.



> Her super strength account for shit cuz she will never touch Sasuke.



Similarly, one could say his skills count for shit because he will never touch her (due to her evasion).



> She is slower than Sasuke.



I guess that means he'll kill her because of his speed. Tsunade's stronger then him. Does that mean she'll win because it's one of her characteristics? Not automatically. Even if he gets up close, she can one-shot him.



> And Sasuke can easily counter her punches.



One punch = death. Define 'counter'.



> Whats to stop him from using Kasegui genjutsu or using that long range genjutsu he hit shit with to paralise her.



Kasegui genjutsu? He only used that when he was about to be absorbed and was restricted in movement. We haven't seen it since. 

And as it's regular sharingan genjutsu, Tsunade could use chakra control to break out of it quite quickly. Jiraiya and Chiyo both stated that stopping/halting/disturbing the flow of chakra would end the genjutsu.



> Tsunade gets shitted o horribely. And whats to stop sasuke from further slicing upward or downward to cut her in half.



What's stopping him is that he's going up against an opponent with superior experience, evasion, strength, and can OHKO him in a number of ways. Souzou Saisei's stopping the 'cutting in half' bit, assuming he even catches her with it. A sword swing is only about the most linear kind of attack, and a medic should be able to dodge it.



> Either way she will be paralysed. Sasuke could simply chidori eisou her into her face.



Tenzou was paralyzed. Yet he was able to counter Sasuke's jutsu. And as Sakura displayed, should he cut into her and attempt to paralyze him, she could simply heal the wound around it, counteract the paralyzing affect like Sakura did with Sasori's poison through healing, and grab the sword to one-shot him. He's not going to win this fight, with the condition's OP gave.


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## Hidden Nin (Oct 10, 2009)

About your whole evasion bit, Tsunade had difficulty evading Kabuto's blows, and yes she was rusty, but she was still outmaneuvered quickly.  Kabuto was the same speed as her, give or take.  But Sasuke is much faster.  She won't hit him.  Because he's faster.  She can continue to try and dodge, but he's got the speed advantage and will get a hit in eventually.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 10, 2009)

Hidden Nin said:


> About your whole evasion bit, *Tsunade had difficulty evading Kabuto's blows*, and yes she was rusty, but she was still outmaneuvered quickly.  Kabuto was the same speed as her, give or take.  But Sasuke is much faster.  She won't hit him.  Because he's faster.  She can continue to try and dodge, but he's got the speed advantage and will get a hit in eventually.



He had to tire her out despite inactivity for years, which is why he stood a shot. Only managed to hit her first when she was in a position she couldn't dodge (mid-air). Even then, she was on-par with him, and dodged his doton trick at point-blank range (his hands were inches from her ankles, and despite not knowing when he'd appear or where, she still dodged). None of those handicaps apply to this match.


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## Hidden Nin (Oct 10, 2009)

She hasn't exactly been training for years.  And thats exactly what I said.  He outmaneuvered her, and had the chance to cop a feel.  And he appeared instantly, you can hear someone digging upwards.  Sasuke is faster, and has Sharingan to enhance his prediction of her movements.  Plus the reach of a katana.

Katana + Sharingan + Speed > Two years tops of training Sakura, which you think means she was training diligently + no phobia + "not being tired"


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 10, 2009)

Hidden Nin said:


> She hasn't exactly been training for years.



Training Sakura during Time Skip would've changed that.



> And thats exactly what I said.  He outmaneuvered her, and had the chance to cop a feel.



And ended up spasming on the ground 5 seconds later for daring to do so. 



> *And he appeared instantly, you can hear someone digging upwards.*



Contradict yourself. If he appeared instantly, she wouldn't have had the time to hear the digging, which takes time.



> Sasuke is faster, and has Sharingan to enhance his prediction of her movements.  Plus the reach of a katana.



Sharingan gives him the potential to avoid her hits, not the automatic dodging of it. And should those hits miss, they destroy the area around them which only hinders Sasuke since Tsunade can just obliterate anything in her way. Katana is a linear attack, easy to dodge.



> Katana + Sharingan + Speed > Two years tops of training Sakura, which you think means she was training diligently + no phobia + "not being tired"



Experience + Strength + Evasion + Medical Ninjutsu + A variety of OHKO's > Katana (which can be dodged easily) + Sharingan (which gives him the ability to see her movements, not the automatic dodging of them and their affects on the area) + Speed (which can get him close to her, but close quarters are deadly).


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## Hidden Nin (Oct 10, 2009)

Nice adding everything she has.  He also has Kirin, a shitload of fire, chidori, nagashi, which would be super effective, and what?  A variety of OHKOs?  She has one.  And that is punching a hole through your chest.  But Sasuke's chest is too fast for her.  And its harder to dodge a katana than it is a fist.

Sharingan grants a intuitive knowledge of how a ninja, or perhaps something else, moves.  Her dodging is movement.  He can catch on, and impale her through the heart.

And didn't Kabuto ironically figure out how to escape that jutsu in 5 seconds?


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## machiavelli2009 (Oct 10, 2009)

please lady tsuande except our uber ninja such as killer bee. who do u know has suffered sharingan genjutsu and broken out of it by themselves even bee didnt do that. my ass lyk tsuande will break out of it. shii a gen specialist crumbled by one sharigan genjutsu attack( he was taken out of the fight in one hit.)
please this match is hands down in his favor. he doesnt kill her but he mind rapes  her and her boobies


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 10, 2009)

Hidden Nin said:


> Nice adding everything she has.  He also has Kirin, a shitload of fire, chidori, nagashi, which would be super effective, and what?  A variety of OHKOs?  She has one.  And that is punching a hole through your chest.  But Sasuke's chest is too fast for her.  And its harder to dodge a katana than it is a fist.



I left out Katsuyu. 

Variety of KO's = Ranshinsho (debatable whether it would work), Strength, Chakra scalpel, etc.



> Sharingan grants a intuitive knowledge of how a ninja, or perhaps something else, moves.  Her dodging is movement.  He can catch on, and impale her through the heart.



Is that so? Let's, for a moment, concede that it was true. Impale her through the heart? Even so, Souzou Saisei tanks it. Assuming she doesn't break his sword in half.



> And didn't Kabuto ironically figure out how to escape that jutsu in 5 seconds?



As a highly intelligent medic, yes he did. Sasuke isn't one.


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## Hidden Nin (Oct 10, 2009)

I forgot all about that.  And he also has Manda, CS, and Genjustu, like mackiflveli said.  And yes, I spelled that wrong.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 10, 2009)

Hidden Nin said:


> I forgot all about that.  And he also has Manda, CS, and Genjustu, like mackiflveli said.  And yes, I spelled that wrong.



Manda = one-shotted.

I'd like to see what he dares try in CS. 

Genjutsu negated by chakra control.


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## Hidden Nin (Oct 10, 2009)

So she just breaks out of it that easily?  Because of chakra control?  And while she fights Manda, Sasuke could go in for the kill.  Plus with Curse mark, he's even faster.


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## Mithos (Oct 10, 2009)

Hidden Nin said:


> So she just breaks out of it that easily?  Because of chakra control?  And while she fights Manda, Sasuke could go in for the kill.  Plus with Curse mark, he's even faster.



Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think _Taka_ Sasuke has the ability to summon Manda, he doesn't have Oro's powers anymore. So if I'm right Manda won't be a factor at all in this fight. If Sasuke can summon him, like LT said he can be one shotted. 

Once again this is _Taka_ Sasuke, so he doesn't have the Curse Mark and, like Manda, isn't a factor in this fight.


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Oct 11, 2009)

Matto-sama said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think _Taka_ Sasuke has the ability to summon Manda, he doesn't have Oro's powers anymore. So if I'm right Manda won't be a factor at all in this fight. If Sasuke can summon him, like LT said he can be one shotted.
> 
> Once again this is _Taka_ Sasuke, so he doesn't have the Curse Mark and, like Manda, isn't a factor in this fight.



Not to mention the fact that Manda is dead.


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## Soul (Oct 11, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> She can easily break the sword with her strength. Even if not, she can do what Sakura did against Sasori, heal herself with the sword in her even with the paralyzing/numbing affects of Sasuke's chidori (like Sasori's poison was doing to Sakura).



This is wrong.
She would just injure herself + Sasuke can use a Raiton Current 
Also, Sasuke would just cut her in pieces; he won't be affected by PIS like Sasori was.


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## Mithos (Oct 11, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> This is wrong.
> She would just injure herself + Sasuke can use a Raiton Current
> Also, Sasuke would just cut her in pieces; he won't be affected by PIS like Sasori was.



That is if he lands a hit with his kusanagi before Tsunade OHKO's him
And Tsunade can tank being cut with Sozo Saisei and counter attack when Sasuke is off guard(thinking he's defeated her) and demolish him with her brute strength.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 11, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> This is wrong.
> She would just injure herself + Sasuke can use a Raiton Current
> Also, Sasuke would just cut her in pieces; *he won't be affected by PIS like Sasori was*.



I agree. ^ This is wrong.  Matto took it, but I'd like to point out something.

So Sakura has one of those rare feats of hers, and it's PIS?


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## Koroshi (Oct 11, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> So Sakura has one of those rare feats of hers, and it's PIS?



Yes it was PIS, Chiyo confirmed it when she clearly stated Sasori could've killed them then but he didn't.


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## Soul (Oct 11, 2009)

Matto-sama said:


> That is if he lands a hit with his kusanagi before Tsunade OHKO's him



I just pointed out that tsunade can't break the sword with sheer power.


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## Soul (Oct 11, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> So Sakura has one of those rare feats of hers, and it's PIS?



That was considered a feat? 
She was useless, except for the antidotes and punching the Satetsu blocks.

If Sasori wanted, he would just have to keep attacking with the attack that forced Chiyo to use her Chakra Shield, and kill them both; it is as easy as that.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 11, 2009)

Koroshi said:


> Yes it was PIS, Chiyo confirmed it when she clearly stated Sasori could've killed them then but he didn't.



Chiyo stated he could've killed them at the end; everything right up to that was fair and square. He had the chance to kill them when he was aiming for Chiyo after that. Sakura's feat before hand is not negated simply because he let them kill him after she had already done it.



Here's Sakura healing.

Here's Sasori going for the kill.

5 pages later. So are you telling me he was planning to let them kill him before she was even healing, and thus its significance was negated?



TheYellowFlash10 said:


> that was considered a feat?
> She was useless, except for the antidotes and punching the block.
> 
> If Sasori wanted, he would just have to keep attacking with the attack that forced Chiyo to use her Chakra Shield, and kill them both; it is as easy as that.



Sasori was marvelling at how she was skilled enough to heal herself with the blade inside her. Seems like a feat.


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## Koroshi (Oct 11, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Chiyo stated he could've killed them at the end; everything right up to that was fair and square. He had the chance to kill them when he was aiming for Chiyo after that. Sakura's feat before hand is not negated simply because he let them kill him after she had already done it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Oh you were talking about Sakura's feat of healing when the sword was inside her, my bad.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 11, 2009)

Koroshi said:


> Oh you were talking about Sakura's feat of healing when the sword was inside her, my bad.



Exactly.


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## Shizune (Oct 11, 2009)

This is in character Sasuke. He'll rush Tsunade, she'll dodge and try to get a hit in... she'll probably play keep away for awhile but he will overwhelm her and stab her. At that point Tsunade will win because the moment she realizes what's about to happen she'll punch his head off. And whatever sword wound he gives her will be easily healed.


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## αce (Oct 11, 2009)

So we can all agree that Sasuke rapes, right?


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 11, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> So we can all agree that Sasuke rapes, right?



Hardly.


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## αce (Oct 11, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Hardly.



Fine

But seriously though. In taijutsu, it really doesn't matter how superior Tsunade is. With his speed and sharingan, she isn't touching him. Unless she uses some sort of strategy. This is just like Kn0 vs Sasuke. kn0 was superior in speed, superior in taijutsu and wayyyy more superior in power. But because each of those factors actually requires you to hit the opponent, it doesn't matter, because sharingan prediction negates it all. Not to mention the fact that Sasuke is faster.

Rashinsho is useless, as I pointed out before. She runs electric natured chakra through her opponents nervous system, but Sasuke has already ran a chidori through his body with hardly any effects.

He can keep his distance with chidori sebons, chidori eisou and guard himself with chidori nagashi.

He can see chakra, so he'll know when she's focusing chakra in her hands and feet.



Sorry but this is rape. And if you want extra sizzled Tsunade and Katsuya on a rotary, I'll add mangekyou sharingan.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 11, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Fine
> 
> But seriously though. In taijutsu, it really doesn't matter how superior Tsunade is. With his speed and sharingan, she isn't touching him. Unless she uses some sort of strategy. This is just like Kn0 vs Sasuke. kn0 was superior in speed, superior in taijutsu and wayyyy more superior in power. But because each of those factors actually requires you to hit the opponent, it doesn't matter, because sharingan prediction negates it all. Not to mention the fact that Sasuke is faster.




Her evasion > his.

Her strength > his.

His speed > hers.



I dun wanna go into details 



> Rashinsho is useless, as I pointed out before. She runs electric natured chakra through her opponents nervous system, but Sasuke has already ran a chidori through his body with hardly any effects.



That's an assumption. We're not sure if it's actually useless, or how Sasuke's abilities will be.



> He can keep his distance with chidori sebons, chidori eisou and guard himself with chidori nagashi.



All of which have little chance of hitting her should he attack from a distance.



> He can see chakra, so he'll know when she's focusing chakra in her hands and feet.



Seeing it doesn't aid him in blocking it.



> Sorry but this is rape. And if you want extra sizzled Tsunade and Katsuya on a rotary, I'll add mangekyou sharingan.



I agree. Tsunade slaps on a strap-on and rapes thoroughly.


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## Creator (Oct 11, 2009)

I do wonder something. A bit offtopic, but do people think that Take Sasuke can take Sasori out? 

Furthermore, how much chakra does people think Sasuke have? From what i remember, Sasuke has very little chakra and in terms of chakra and healing, Tsunade can outlast him.



Lady Tsunade said:


> I agree. Tsunade slaps on a strap-on and rapes thoroughly.



This graphical statement will forever scar me.


----------



## αce (Oct 11, 2009)

> Lady Tsunade said:
> 
> 
> > Her evasion > his.
> ...


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 11, 2009)

Creator said:


> This graphical statement will forever scar me.



Suu said something along the same lines.  I'll think of it as my catchphrase, something to counter 'cockslash at 300 miles/hour' etc.


----------



## Luxiano (Oct 11, 2009)

TBH Tsunade lacks feats to compete with  Sasuke , maybe she'll have a fight in the next chapters... who knows ... imo Sasuke takes this with high diff.


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Oct 11, 2009)

> Rashinsho is useless, as I pointed out before. She runs electric natured chakra through her opponents nervous system, but Sasuke has already ran a chidori through his body with hardly any effects.



The nervous system works by sending electrical signals between nerves. If you forcefully add more electric signals in the system it screws it up and you get temporary paralysis and your nerves go haywire. But you're saying this doesn't work on Sasuke because he electrocuted himself with a Chidori variant. That doesn't make any sense. People that get electrocuted don't get paralyzed that's completely different.


----------



## αce (Oct 11, 2009)

Creator said:


> I do wonder something. A bit offtopic, but do people think that Take Sasuke can take Sasori out?
> 
> Furthermore, how much chakra does people think Sasuke have? From what i remember, Sasuke has very little chakra and in terms of chakra and healing, Tsunade can outlast him.
> 
> ...



With MS, Sasuke can take Sasori. But without it, it's questionable.

And please don't bring up Sakura That was plot bias at it's finest.


Also, he displayed a lot of chakra recently. He used his MS multiple times, while using a top rate genjutsu and chidoris. It was arguably so much, that people in the library were screaming pnj at Sasuke's resevoir of chakra.

That being said, he isn;t using MS in this match. Which means he has even more chakra to be used, because MS drains a shitload.

Tsunade has more chakra, but more chakra =/= stronger. If that was true Itachi and Kakashi would be genin level.


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## αce (Oct 11, 2009)

Yondaime X3 said:


> The nervous system works by sending electrical signals between nerves. If you forcefully add more electric signals in the system it screws it up and you get temporary paralysis and your nerves go haywire. But you're saying this doesn't work on Sasuke because he electrocuted himself with a Chidori variant. That doesn't make any sense. People that get electrocuted don't get paralyzed that's completely different.



Wiki's a gay source but watev.

Electric shock-

*Spoiler*: __ 





> Repeated or severe electric shock which does not lead to death has been shown to cause neuropathy.






Neuropathy-

*Spoiler*: __ 





> Neuropathy is a medical term referring to disorders of the nerves of the peripheral nervous system (specifically excluding encephalopathy and myelopathy, which pertain to the central nervous system.)






People with minor electric shocks don't get paralyzed. But if you suffer severe electric shock, which a chidori would do(yamato was paralyzed), and you don't die then you'll suffer from paralyzing effects.


----------



## Creator (Oct 11, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> With MS, Sasuke can take Sasori. But without it, it's questionable.
> 
> And please don't bring up Sakura That was plot bias at it's finest.




Questionable. Hmmm....

Most of Sasuke's fights were plot. So both cases matter.



> Also, he displayed a lot of chakra recently. He used his MS multiple times, while using a top rate genjutsu and chidoris. It was arguably so much, that people in the library were screaming pnj at Sasuke's resevoir of chakra.



Uchiha bodies and genitially built to use sharingan and MS for huge periods of time without much chakra waste. Thats what made Itachi alot better then Kakashi. Kakashi didnt have an Uchiha body thus burned chakra faster. Where as Itachi and Sasuke wouldnt burn any chakra for Sharingan. 

People in the Library are all Uchiha tards, anti Uchiha, Pein tards, etc. 



> That being said, he isn;t using MS in this match. Which means he has even more chakra to be used, because MS drains a shitload.



I wasnt talking about that. I was talking about exactly how much chakra people think he has. 



> Tsunade has more chakra, but more chakra =/= stronger. If that was true Itachi and Kakashi would be genin level.



I didnt say that chakra = strenght. 

Even normal fighting is costly on chakra. If Tsunade can effectively dodge Sasuke's hits untilhe tires, she takes it. Add on healing, Sasuke has trouble.

However, this is based on assumption and hype from the manga. Mainly so from Tsunade's past deeds. Like fighting Chiyo and stuff. I would say fighting a puppeteer is just as had as fighting a Sharingan since both are extremely unpredictable. 

So if Tsunade can win againt a puppeteer, a world recognised one at that, i would say she has enough ability to dodge Sasuke. But i do point out again, this is based on assumptions. 

Whereas Part 2 has been mainly about Sasuke getting power up after power up.


----------



## αce (Oct 11, 2009)

> Questionable. Hmmm....
> 
> Most of Sasuke's fights were plot. So both cases matter.


Yea, but unlike the Sakura fight where she just dodged and punched, Sasuke has some feats to work with.



> Uchiha bodies and genitially built to use sharingan and MS for huge periods of time without much chakra waste. Thats what made Itachi alot better then Kakashi. Kakashi didnt have an Uchiha body thus burned chakra faster. *Where as Itachi and Sasuke wouldnt burn any chakra for Sharingan.*
> 
> People in the Library are all Uchiha tards, anti Uchiha, Pein tards, etc.



Bolded: ????

It's been stated many times that Itachi couldn't use the MS for long periods of time. Also, when Itachi fought Sasuke and ran out of chakra, he could no longer use his sharingan. The sharingan requires chakra. And Mangekyou sharingan techniques require a lot of chakra.



> I didnt say that chakra = strenght.
> 
> Even normal fighting is costly on chakra. If Tsunade can effectively dodge Sasuke's hits untilhe tires, she takes it. Add on healing, Sasuke has trouble.
> 
> ...



Sasuke won't tire easily. He took on a brutal match with Itachi, and a brutal match with Raikage and Mizukage. He went on to say that his body was exhaustd, yet he was still fighting.

And Sasuke get's powerups just like every other character that isn't Naruto. Why?

Because Sasuke training arcs are pointless.


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Oct 11, 2009)

> People with minor electric shocks don't get paralyzed. But if you suffer severe electric shock, which a chidori would do(yamato was paralyzed), and you don't die then you'll suffer from paralyzing effects.



Lol, I like how we're incorporating real life science to argue about a manga. 

And I'm pre-med so I found that interesting, and good to know. Thanks for sharing the knowledge.


----------



## αce (Oct 11, 2009)

Yondaime X3 said:


> Lol, I like how we're incorporating real life science to argue about a manga.
> 
> And I'm pre-med so I found that interesting, and good to know. Thanks for sharing the knowledge.



Knowledge is power


----------



## Creator (Oct 11, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Yea, but unlike the Sakura fight where she just dodged and punched, Sasuke has some feats to work with.



Feats that can keep up with one touch one poison kill. But this is offtopic. I just wanted to know your opinion so i knew what i was working with.



> Bolded: ????
> 
> It's been stated many times that Itachi couldn't use the MS for long periods of time. Also, when Itachi fought Sasuke and ran out of chakra, he could no longer use his sharingan. The sharingan requires chakra. And Mangekyou sharingan techniques require a lot of chakra.



Needless to say. For an uchiha body, the sharingan takes very little chakra. Thus Itachi almost alway has his sharingan on. 

He said it himself when he met Kakashi outside Konoha. 



> Sasuke won't tire easily. He took on a brutal match with Itachi, and a brutal match with Raikage and Mizukage. He went on to say that his body was exhaustd, yet he was still fighting.
> 
> And Sasuke get's powerups just like every other character that isn't Naruto. Why?
> 
> Because Sasuke training arcs are pointless.



A brutal match? He spend the whole time getting his ass kicked. But thats not the point.

Tsunade chakra is insane after the Pein arc. 

Anyways, i stand by my point. As long as Tsunade avoids Sasuke, one hit will kill Sasuke. Thus he was rushed into using Susano against Raikage. Because if he hadnt, he would have had his head cut off.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 11, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Knowledge is power



Tell that to the tards. Don't you just hate them?


----------



## αce (Oct 11, 2009)

> Feats that can keep up with one touch one poison kill. But this is offtopic. I just wanted to know your opinion so i knew what i was working with.


And taking down cloud jounins by blinking



> Needless to say. For an uchiha body, the sharingan takes very little chakra. Thus Itachi almost alway has his sharingan on.
> 
> He said it himself when he met Kakashi outside Konoha.


He said Kakashi tires easily because he doesn't have an Uchiha body. Right after kakashi used a sharingan tech. Keeping the sharingan on doesn't require much chakra, but using it's abilities does. Mangekyou sharingan doesn't require much to keep it on, but using it's abilities cause your eyes to bleed and use chakra.



> A brutal match? He spend the whole time getting his ass kicked.


Exactly my point....



> Tsunade chakra is insane after the Pein arc.


Same with Sasuke's in this arc.



> Anyways, i stand by my point. As long as Tsunade avoids Sasuke, one hit will kill Sasuke. Thus he was rushed into using Susano against Raikage. Because if he hadnt, he would have had his head cut off.


He used Susano-o because Raikage has Minato level speed.

He doesn't have to worry about that with Tsunade.


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## αce (Oct 11, 2009)

Ok, Ill be back later

I wonder if you guys would still be arguing if I added MS here?


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## Creator (Oct 11, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> And taking down cloud jounins by blinking



There are some who cant hack a genjutsu. 



> He said Kakashi tires easily because he doesn't have an Uchiha body. Right after kakashi used a sharingan tech. Keeping the sharingan on doesn't require much chakra, but using it's abilities does. Mangekyou sharingan doesn't require much to keep it on, but using it's abilities cause your eyes to bleed and use chakra.



Kakashi didnt use any sharingan technique. He just looked at Kisame's jutsus. 

If its on, it uses Chakra. 



> Same with Sasuke's in this arc.



Sasuke was out for the msot part.



> He used Susano-o because Raikage has Minato level speed.
> 
> He doesn't have to worry about that with Tsunade.



Tsunade has Shushin aswell.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 11, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Ok, Ill be back later
> 
> I wonder if you guys would still be arguing if I added MS here?



Quite feverently.


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## Suu (Oct 11, 2009)

From what it looks like, you guys are just slinging back arguments that are barely relevant to the actual fight. 
(eg. "Tsunade has a shit-tonne of chakra"; "So does Sasuke")

Also, why is the MS being discussed when it is clearly banned in this fight?


Lady Tsunade said:


> Quite *fever*ently.


Hehe, I know we're not meant to pick on spelling mistakes here, but this one made me laugh.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 11, 2009)

Suu said:


> From what it looks like, you guys are just slinging back arguments that are barely relevant to the actual fight.
> (eg. "Tsunade has a shit-tonne of chakra"; "So does Sasuke")
> 
> Also, why is the MS being discussed when it is clearly banned in this fight?



Care to grace us with your input, Suu? 



> Hehe, I know we're not meant to pick on spelling mistakes here, but this one made me laugh.



I usually don't make spelling mistakes (as I do enjoy writing and am quite talented with words, conceit aside). I was debating whether it was feverently or fervently, but I went with the former. I suppose the second one could be used as a pun on my temper determination and frequent rare hot-headedness.


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## Suu (Oct 11, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Care to grace us with your input, Suu?


I am sorry but I must decline, madam. It is against my morals to enter a debate that involves Uchihas. 

I will say, however, that restricting Katsuyu puts Tsunade at more of a disadvantage than restricting MS for Sasuke. That is all.



> (as I do enjoy writing and am quite talented with words, conceit aside).


You know after reading this, I'm going to grammar/spelling Nazi all your posts. :ho
(not really, I don't care enough)



> I was debating whether it was feverently or fervently, but I went with the former. I suppose the second one could be used as a pun on my temper determination and frequent rare hot-headedness.


Haha, well the first thing that came to _my_ mind was "she's going to argue until she gets...a fever". :amazed


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 11, 2009)

Suu said:


> I am sorry but I must decline, madam. It is against my morals to enter a debate that involves Uchihas.



I can understand why.  



> I will say, however, that restricting Katsuyu puts Tsunade at more of a disadvantage than restricting MS for Sasuke. That is all.



True.



> You know after reading this, I'm going to grammar/spelling Nazi all your posts. :ho
> (not really, I don't care enough)



I'd have liked to see you try. You'd be hardpressed to find a grammar/spelling error, for as soon as I spot one (should I accidentally post before fixing it), I edit and fix it.  




> Haha, well the first thing that came to _my_ mind was "she's going to argue until she gets...a fever". :amazed



 How very true.


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## Creator (Oct 12, 2009)

Suu said:


> I am sorry but I must decline, madam. It is against my morals to enter a debate that involves Uchihas.
> 
> I will say, however, that restricting Katsuyu puts Tsunade at more of a disadvantage than restricting MS for Sasuke. That is all.



I should follow that. Debating Uchiha alway gets me negged. 

Also, i agree with what you said. Tsunade has a fair bit of disadvantage without Katsuyu.


PS. LT. What episode is your sig avy from?


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## Grimmjowsensei (Oct 12, 2009)

Without PIS(which is automatically off in battledome matches anyways), Sasuke makes a short work of Tsunade, like, with no effort at all.


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Oct 12, 2009)

Creator said:


> I should follow that. Debating Uchiha alway gets me negged.
> 
> Also, i agree with what you said. Tsunade has a fair bit of disadvantage without Katsuyu.
> 
> ...



That's from the Jiraiya Chronicles, eps 129-130.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 12, 2009)

Grimmjowsensei said:


> Without PIS(which is automatically off in battledome matches anyways), Sasuke makes a short work of Tsunade, like, with no effort at all.



You act as if he has all the hax of MS.


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## Soul (Oct 12, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Sasori was marvelling at how she was skilled enough to heal herself with the blade inside her. Seems like a feat.



If Sasori really wanted to kill her, he would just slice her quickly.
She is a good medical ninja with power; nothing else.

Sasori was killed by his PIS.



Creator said:


> I do wonder something. A bit offtopic, but do people think that Take Sasuke can take Sasori out?



Without Susano'o and without knowledge? Hell no. He will get raped.


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## Superior (Oct 12, 2009)

Why do people say that Sasuke will just wipe the floor with Tsunade, no sweat?

Tsunade would give him a run for him money, or beat him, one punch from her, and it's lights out for the Sauce.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 13, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> If Sasori really wanted to kill her, he would just slice her quickly.
> She is a good medical ninja with power; nothing else.
> 
> Sasori was killed by his PIS.



Easy to claim. It happens all the time. Tsunade could've one-shot Orochimaru and Kabuto from the start. PIS. Itachi could've raped Sasuke from the start. PIS. Alot of times it happens, but we can't change it so we go with what we've got. No one makes a case for all the other ones.


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## αce (Oct 13, 2009)

Sasori was pnj'd to the max.

He didn't even use all of his scrolls.


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## DnK (Oct 13, 2009)

Tsunade is a good fighter, one there is really skilled but again, if she have to win so do she have to be in close combat, and Sasuke can attack from long distance with Goukakyuu no Jutsu or Kirin, so Sasuke will win


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 13, 2009)

DnK said:


> Tsunade is a good fighter, one there is really skilled but again, if she have to win so do she have to be in close combat, and Sasuke can attack from long distance with Goukakyuu no Jutsu or Kirin, so Sasuke will win



Ranged combat has a high likelihood of being dodged.


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## DnK (Oct 13, 2009)

Yeah that is true ^^ hehe, but still, if she can't come up to her, then she will lose, it will be a really close battle so yeah, it come to how it turns out, well i am new here but i have read and watched anime since it started ^^ haha, but well nice to meet you, i'm Dan, but you can call me what you want


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 13, 2009)

DnK said:


> Yeah that is true ^^ hehe, but still, if she can't come up to her, then she will lose, it will be a really close battle so yeah, it come to how it turns out, well i am new here but i have read and watched anime since it started ^^ haha, but well nice to meet you, i'm Dan, but you can call me what you want



Welcome to the forums, Dan. 

But I must say I disagree. Ranged combat = higher likelihood of dodging. And as such, he'll have to resort to close combat. Which is deadly against Tsunade.


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## DnK (Oct 13, 2009)

Well thank you Tsunade-chan ^^ hehe (yeah i call all my friends something)

Ahhhh finaly i find someone there actually know what Naruto is ^^ haha, yeah you are right in that, and yes it is true, but not if he makes a clone and he can attack her from behind or something, so yeah, but oh well, it all depends on if something happens like Tsunade will all the time come up to Sasuke or if she will stay a little away, so yeah, but anyways, Tsunade will win if she will be close to Sasuke


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## αce (Oct 13, 2009)

Yeah, except Tsunade wouldn't touch Sasuke in close combat if he dodged Raikage and kn0 Naruto.

Both tiers above Tsunade in speed.


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## DnK (Oct 13, 2009)

yeah and all know that speed defeat power, if you have the power but your speed is way to low, then you will be defeated fast


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 13, 2009)

♠Ace♠ said:


> Yeah, except Tsunade wouldn't touch Sasuke in close combat if he dodged Raikage and kn0 Naruto.
> 
> Both tiers above Tsunade in speed.



Neither would he, since she escaped attacks at point blank range while handicapped.


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## DnK (Oct 13, 2009)

yeah but still, Tsunade isen't that fast, she can't hit Sasuke if he is way to fast for her, but if he does something wrong then he will be defeated, i think they are both good fighter's but only one will win, i would say Sasuke, but Lady Tsunade is right too, hmmm hard choice


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## Mithos (Oct 13, 2009)

DnK said:


> yeah but still, Tsunade isen't that fast, she can't hit Sasuke if he is way to fast for her, but if he does something wrong then he will be defeated, i think they are both good fighter's but only one will win, i would say Sasuke, but Lady Tsunade is right too, hmmm hard choice



Speed isn't that big of a factor when you're actually fighting in taijutsu. It matters if one can completely blitz an opponent, but Sasuke doesn't have that large of an advantage in speed over her. Tsunade is quite a bit more skilled than Taijutsu than Sasuke, and if they fight up close for an extended period of time it's byebye Sasuke with a OHKO by Tsunade.


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## DnK (Oct 13, 2009)

Matto-sama said:


> Speed isn't that big of a factor when you're actually fighting in taijutsu. It matters if one can completely blitz an opponent, but Sasuke doesn't have that large of an advantage in speed over her. Tsunade is quite a bit more skilled than Taijutsu than Sasuke, and if they fight up close for an extended period of time it's byebye Sasuke with a OHKO by Tsunade.



true, but if Sasuke attack her and then he get's away and does like that, then he can maybe win, also if he can use Chidori at her, so can it be byebye to Tsunade, all depends on what happens in the fight


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 13, 2009)

Sasuke's speed advantage would serve him well if he fought defensively/evasively, since if tsunade can't catch up to him she can't hit him (obviously).

But sasuke won't do that, he'll rush in and fight her up close because thats his M.O.



DnK said:


> true, but if Sasuke attack her and then he get's away and does like that, then he can maybe win, also if he can use Chidori at her, so can it be byebye to Tsunade, all depends on what happens in the fight



Chidori only works if he gets a heart shot or brain shot. But in character means he'll go for the lungs/stomach.


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## DnK (Oct 13, 2009)

true and that's what i was meaning, goes through lungs then she will die, he just need to hit her, that's all


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 13, 2009)

DnK said:


> true and that's what i was meaning, goes through lungs then she will die, he just need to hit her, that's all



She won't die from anything but a heart or brain shot.

Unless he instantly kills her she's going to use genesis rebirth before he realizes whats going on.


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## DnK (Oct 13, 2009)

haha ^^ your so true in that, i'm glad i finaly finds some there knows what Naruto is, but anyways, you are right in that, but depends on the fight, if he are fast enough to could stop her doing that or just make sure she won't be hit, then she will begin to lose her powers, becuase of that side-effect there is using rebirth


----------



## koibito (Oct 13, 2009)

Even with the heart she could heal it itd have to be a brain shot.



DnK said:


> Tsunade is a good fighter, one there is really skilled but again, if she have to win so do she have to be in close combat, and Sasuke can attack from long distance with Goukakyuu no Jutsu or Kirin, so Sasuke will win



There is no way hes going to pull off kirin. He had to cause a rising air current that was only enough with a field of amaterasu and a couple of fire jutsu's plus Itachi letting him get high enough to conduct it then he needed to do a chidori to conduct the kirin and then move it. There is no way he can pull that off he doesnt have the chakra for a field of amaterasu, fire jutsu, chidori, and the remaining chakra to move the kirin. There is also no way Tsunade would just let that all happen once Sasuke tried amaterasu hed be low enough and shed take him out from there. 




Lady Tsunade said:


> But I must say I disagree. Ranged combat = higher likelihood of dodging. And as such, he'll have to resort to close combat. Which is deadly against Tsunade.



This is also true.


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## DnK (Oct 13, 2009)

Yeah okay, that is true, hmmmm well i guess i have no more to defend with, that was the finaly blow and the winner is.....Tsunade


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## Soul (Oct 13, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Easy to claim. It happens all the time. Tsunade could've one-shot Orochimaru and Kabuto from the start. PIS. Itachi could've raped Sasuke from the start. PIS. Alot of times it happens, but we can't change it so we go with what we've got. No one makes a case for all the other ones.



Please re read the fight if you think that Sasori wasn't badly nerfed by PIS/PnJ.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 13, 2009)

TheYellowFlash10 said:


> Please re read the fight if you think that Sasori wasn't badly nerfed by PIS/PnJ.



My memory is sufficient enough to recall what happened in that match with good detail.


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Oct 13, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> My memory is sufficient enough to recall what happened in that match with good detail.



Sasori *LET* Chiyo kill him. That's definitely PIS.


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## Soul (Oct 14, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> My memory is sufficient enough to recall what happened in that match with good detail.



What happened is that Sasori had plenty of ways of killing both of them quickly, and he didn't took them, while he has a Top Stat in intelligence in the Databook.


----------



## Creator (Oct 14, 2009)

This thread went from MS Sasuke pwns, to Sasori PIS, to just PIS.

Wow. 


Since i brought up Sasori, i will end this. Its offtopic, i just wanted 1/2 responses on that. Ace answered my question so i know what i am dealing with in this topic. 

So instead of going completely offtopic with PIS, and Sasori talks. Please stay on topic.


----------



## kingcombo (Oct 22, 2009)

ill give it to sasuke. tsunade hasn't showed any great speed as of yet. kabuto was easily able to keep up with her. 

i guess it depends on the summoning. if she summons as soon as the match  begins then she has a chance. if not then she'll loose. i wouldn't be surprised if this happened


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 22, 2009)

Yondaime X3 said:


> Sasori *LET* Chiyo kill him. That's definitely PIS.



Simply because he let them kill him at the end doesn't mean that their abilities and strategies thus far were negated. 



TheYellowFlash10 said:


> What happened is that Sasori had plenty of ways of killing both of them quickly, and he didn't took them, while he has a Top Stat in intelligence in the Databook.



Do show me the times when he could've killed them but didn't. I only recall the final one.


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## Panos (Oct 22, 2009)

Sasuke kills Tsuande very easily.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 22, 2009)

peaceful said:


> Sasuke kills Tsuande very easily.



I love your sense of humour.


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## Panos (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> I love your sense of humour.



Me and many other people too but i fail to see my talent in that particular post you quoted .


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 22, 2009)

peaceful said:


> Me and many other people too but i fail to see my talent in that particular post you quoted .



One day, young grasshopper, you will.  

When you learn to read OP. :ho


----------



## Panos (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> One day, young grasshopper, you will.
> 
> When you learn to read OP. :ho



I read the op. Do you imply something? Because even when i read the op i didnt find whats funny with my post.


----------



## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 22, 2009)

peaceful said:


> I read the op. Do you imply something? Because even when i read the op i didnt find whats funny with my post.



All in due time, peaceful. All in due time.


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## Panos (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> All in due time, peaceful. All in due time.



Tsunade is about to die off panel. Time is restricted for you...


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 22, 2009)

peaceful said:


> Tsunade is about to die off panel. Time is restricted for you...



So sad to see someone who isn't enlightened in the topic of Tsunade.


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## Panos (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> So sad to see someone who isn't enlightened in the topic of Tsunade.



Wait the last time i saw her she was like 80 years old... Isnt she dead yet?


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 22, 2009)

peaceful said:


> Wait the last time i saw her she was like 80 years old... Isnt she dead yet?



She's 50.


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## Panos (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> She's 50.



I thought that the jutsu she uses limits her life


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 22, 2009)

peaceful said:


> I thought that the jutsu she uses limits her life



No. It simply shortens her lifespan. Doesn't mean that it'll do it harsh enough to end her life.


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## Panos (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> No. It simply shortens her lifespan. Doesn't mean that it'll do it harsh enough to end her life.



If her lifespan is totally 70 years and she is right now 53 and she has used that jutsu 5-6 times how many more years does she have?


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 22, 2009)

peaceful said:


> If her lifespan is totally 70 years and she is right now 53 and she has used that jutsu 5-6 times how many more years does she have?



1.) We have no idea how long she will live.

2.) We have no idea if she's used the jutsu 5-6 times, perhaps a max of 3 since A.) Shizune recognized it and its side effects before she used it during the Sannin fight, which implies that she's used it at least once before, B.) She used it during the Sannin fight, and C.) She used it on the villagers.


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## Panos (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> 1.) We have no idea how long she will live.
> 
> 2.) We have no idea if she's used the jutsu 5-6 times, perhaps a max of 3 since A.) Shizune recognized it and its side effects before she used it during the Sannin fight, which implies that she's used it at least once before, B.) She used it during the Sannin fight, and C.) She used it on the villagers.



Average lifespan is 70. Even in a manga Kishi cannot ignore that. Lets say maximum 80. How much does the jutsu reduce the lifespan?


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 22, 2009)

peaceful said:


> Average lifespan is 70. Even in a manga Kishi cannot ignore that. Lets say maximum 80. How much does the jutsu reduce the lifespan?



Well, this isn't real life now is it? 

We have no idea how much it reduces her lifespan each time she uses it. I made a  about it once, and the majority believed it was a direct relation in order to the severity of her wounds.


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## Panos (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Well, this isn't real life now is it?
> 
> We have no idea how much it reduces her lifespan each time she uses it. I made a  about it once, *and the majority believed it was a direct relation in order to the severity of her wounds*.




We havent seen anyone who is above 80-90 untill now.

Isnt it?


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## Whip Whirlwind (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Well, this isn't real life now is it?
> 
> We have no idea how much it reduces her lifespan each time she uses it. I made a  about it once, and the majority believed it was a direct relation in order to the severity of her wounds.



Actually, isn't the age thing kind of irrelevant?

She used it to such an extent that it disappeared, and fell into a coma.

No single fight would ever make her use it as much as she did when countering chibaku tensei, so it's kind of a moot point, is it not?


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## Jermaine (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Well, this isn't real life now is it?
> 
> We have no idea how much it reduces her lifespan each time she uses it. I made a  about it once, and the majority believed it was a direct relation in order to the severity of her wounds.



Its not completely alien to real life either .


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 22, 2009)

peaceful said:


> *We havent seen anyone who is above 80-90 *untill now.
> 
> Isnt it?



Kakuzu. Madara. 



Windwaker said:


> Actually, isn't the age thing kind of irrelevant?
> 
> She used it to such an extent that it disappeared, and fell into a coma.
> 
> No single fight would ever make her use it as much as she did when countering chibaku tensei, so it's kind of a moot point, is it not?



Pretty much. It's not as though this one fight will cause her to die due to use of Souzou Saisei.



Jermaine said:


> Its not completely alien to real life either .



Uses some real life components, but basing it all entirely on real life, especially when the manga deals with people walking on water, animals talking, and people coming back from the dead, is ridiculous.


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## Jermaine (Oct 22, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Kakuzu. Madara.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It uses alot of real life components actually, and kakuzu and madara dont really count to be honest.

No ninja could live as long as them without using forbidden technique's or doing some stealing peoples body/forbidden crap.

Sasuke wins btw.


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## kogiyahshi (Oct 22, 2009)

Sasuke wins because women are shit in this manga, and he's faster. Please, Chidori would kill her.


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## Mist Puppet (Oct 22, 2009)

kogiyahshi said:


> Sasuke wins because women are shit in this manga, and he's faster. Please, Chidori would kill her.



I'm trying to figure out how this is even possible... 

Tsunade wins mid difficulty. IC Sasuke will rush in, guns ablazing, not knowing what he's getting himself into. Tsunade then proceeds to shushin behind him, and use Rashinshou, leaving him open for a major ground pound.

Chidori can be tanked thanks to Souzou Saisei.


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## On and On (Oct 22, 2009)

Mistukuni said:


> I'm trying to figure out how this is even possible...
> 
> Tsunade wins mid difficulty. IC Sasuke will rush in, guns ablazing, not knowing what he's getting himself into. Tsunade then proceeds to shushin behind him, and use Rashinshou, leaving him open for a major ground pound.
> 
> Chidori can be tanked thanks to Souzou Saisei.



Chidori Nagashi paralyzes her, she hasn't shown shunshin, Sasuke has. She gets genjutsu raped and her head lopped off.


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## Shizune (Oct 23, 2009)

The Comedian said:


> Chidori Nagashi paralyzes her, she hasn't shown shunshin, Sasuke has. She gets genjutsu raped and her head lopped off.





That is shunshin.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Mistukuni said:


> I'm trying to figure out how this is even possible...
> 
> Tsunade wins mid difficulty. IC Sasuke will rush in, guns ablazing, not knowing what he's getting himself into. Tsunade then proceeds to shushin behind him, and use Rashinshou, leaving him open for a major ground pound.
> 
> Chidori can be tanked thanks to Souzou Saisei.



He can read her movements with sharingan and evade them with his speed.

If sasuke plays smart he can easily win.


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## Creator (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> If sasuke plays smart he can easily win.



This is Sasuke. He doesnt play smart. He rushes in and gets himself killed. 

Refer to Kage Arc for reference.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Creator said:


> This is Sasuke. He doesnt play smart. He rushes in and gets himself killed.
> 
> Refer to Kage Arc for reference.



True, but its not like he cant play smart.


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## Mithos (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> True, but its not like he cant play smart.



He could play smart, but he won't. _IC_ Sasuke will charge in, like an idiot, as he always does and get beaten.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Matto-sama said:


> He could play smart, but he won't. _IC_ Sasuke will charge in, like an idiot, as he always does and get beaten.



If Sasuke charges in i doubt he would die right then, he would most likely survive , learn from it and then play smart.


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## Mithos (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> If Sasuke charges in i doubt he would die right then, he would most likely survive , learn from it and then play smart.



Even if he survives the initial fighting, he will still not play smart. Sasuke didn't play smart against KillerBee, and he should have after he learned how deadly KB really was. He also didn't against Raikage, and he certainly didn't play smart when he decided to fight 3 kages with very low energy. Now matter how bad you want Sasuke to fight intelligently, it's not going to happen.


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## Creator (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> If Sasuke charges in i doubt he would die right then, he would most likely survive , learn from it and then play smart.



Yes, he clearly played it smart when he got owned by Raikage and then dived straight into the council where there was even more Kage level shinobis. He was clearly playing it smart. 

He doesnt play it smart. He alway runs into the battle.

As i have said on several occations in this thread. One hit will kill Sasuke.

As i read in a Tsunade VS Itachi thread. Tsunade can do a similar thing to what Naruto did against Kabuto. Let Sasuke come in, and get hit but grab hold of him, use Genesis Rebirth and punch his skull down his throat.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Creator said:


> Yes, he clearly played it smart when he got owned by Raikage and then dived straight into the council where there was even more Kage level shinobis. He was clearly playing it smart.
> 
> He doesnt play it smart. He alway runs into the battle.
> 
> ...


 I agree about the Raikage ownage but hes quite a bit faster than sasuke ,Tsunade is slower than sasuke.

Although Tsunade can kill in 1 hit, sasuke has a much better variety of jutsu to kill here,all she really has is her fists and summon to kill.

Oh and if she grabs him .... Chidori nagashi will paralyze her.


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## Mongolian Chop Squad (Oct 23, 2009)

> I agree about the Raikage ownage but hes quite a bit faster than sasuke ,Tsunade is slower than sasuke.
> 
> Although Tsunade can kill in 1 hit, sasuke has a much better variety of jutsu to kill here,all she really has is her fists and summon to kill.
> 
> Oh and if she grabs him .... Chidori nagashi will paralyze her.



That stuff doesn't matter if he's obliterated in the first five seconds because he runs at her like a dumbass.


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## Creator (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> I agree about the Raikage ownage but hes quite a bit faster than sasuke ,Tsunade is slower than sasuke.
> 
> Although Tsunade can kill in 1 hit, sasuke has a much better variety of jutsu to kill here,all she really has is her fists and summon to kill.
> 
> Oh and if she grabs him .... Chidori nagashi will paralyze her.



Tsunade also has a jutsu that causes paralysis. 

Also, once caught, it doesnt take much time to punch his head in. Literally 2 seconds. Variety of Jutsu doesnt really matter here. What will he do? Waste chakra? Go for it. She will survive alot longer then he can and then just walk upto him and stomp his head in.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Yondaime X3 said:


> That stuff doesn't matter if he's obliterated in the first five seconds because he runs at her like a dumbass.



He will dodge her attack with his sharingan and speed.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> He will dodge her attack with his sharingan and speed.



Doesn't mean he'll dodge forever. That's like saying Tsunade's a medic, so with her epic dodging skills, Sasuke will never hit her despite his speed. He's obviously going to get in some hits, but she will as well. Whereas his don't kill, hers does.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Doesn't mean he'll dodge forever. That's like saying Tsunade's a medic, so with her epic dodging skills, Sasuke will never hit her despite his speed. He's obviously going to get in some hits, but she will as well. Whereas his don't kill, hers does.



His hits wont   kill ,but his jutsu  or sword will.


He has a wider variety of things to kill her with, all she has is her fists and some nerve attacks.

Genesis rebirth will be hard to beat though.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> His hits wont   kill ,but his jutsu  or sword will.
> 
> 
> He has a wider variety of things to kill her with, all she has is her fists and some nerve attacks.
> ...



Let's break this down.

He will rush in.

She will take a hit.

She will grab him.

She will one-shot him.

Done.


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## Mist Puppet (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> His hits wont   kill ,but his jutsu  or sword will.
> 
> 
> He has a wider variety of things to kill her with, all she has is her fists and some nerve attacks.
> ...



Chidori Nagashi from afar could allow Sasuke to get up close. However, getting up close with Tsunade is almost asking for suicide. Most of his Chidori attacks she can tank with Souzou Saisei. Rashinshou + Punch seals the deal.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Creator said:


> Tsunade also has a jutsu that causes paralysis.
> 
> Also, once caught, it doesnt take much time to punch his head in. Literally 2 seconds. Variety of Jutsu doesnt really matter here. What will he do? Waste chakra? Go for it. She will survive alot longer then he can and then just walk upto him and stomp his head in.



He has a wide variety of things he can choose to do.. Tsunade is limted in attacks.

 Taka Sasuke is fucked-Sharingan,Katon/Chidori variants,Kirin,CS,snake techniques.

vs
 limited range-Immense strength + Genesis rebirth

Also cant cant sasuke fly with CS2? if he can then Tsunade wont be able to do anything.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Let's break this down.
> 
> He will rush in.
> 
> ...



So he will rush in and punch her?? 
If he rushes in with his sword though and gets a hit with that i dont see her grabbing him after taking that.

He could actually run in with his speed and cut her head off..


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Mistukuni said:


> Chidori Nagashi from afar could allow Sasuke to get up close. However, getting up close with Tsunade is almost asking for suicide. Most of his Chidori attacks she can tank with Souzou Saisei. Rashinshou + Punch seals the deal.



She cant use  activate Souzou saisei if she's paralyzed.


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## Mist Puppet (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> Taka Sasuke is fucked-Sharingan,Katon/Chidori variants,Kirin,CS,snake techniques.



This is Taka Sasuke. Which means he no longer has Curse Mark. We don't know if he still has the contracts with snakes, but he may not be able to use snakes either. Kirin takes alot of prep. Which means he has Sharingan and Katon, along with Chidori variants.



> limited range-Immense strength + Genesis rebirth



Tsunade's strength isn't limited to just Sasuke. Terrain can also be used by her.



> Also cant cant sasuke fly with CS2? if he can then Tsunade wont be able to do anything.



If I'm not mistaken, the curse mark was sealed along Oro because of Itachi.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> So he will rush in and punch her??
> If he rushes in with his sword though and gets a hit with that i dont see her grabbing him after taking that.
> 
> He could actually run in with his speed and cut her head off..



She grabs his sword, punches his face. End of story.

Damage tanked by Souzou Saisei.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

no CS then


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> She grabs his sword, punches his face. End of story.
> 
> Damage tanked by Souzou Saisei.



Too fast for her to react, if she manages to grab it she will be holding chidori through the sword..not strong enough to paralyze her since she has souzou saisei on , but it will most likely make her fling her hands back in reflex then sasuke might follow up with taking her head off or maybe retreat.

But i doubt she would use Souzou early on , sasuke takes this by cuttung her head off straight away.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Mistukuni said:


> This is Taka Sasuke. Which means he no longer has Curse Mark. We don't know if he still has the contracts with snakes, but he may not be able to use snakes either. Kirin takes alot of prep. Which means he has Sharingan and Katon, along with Chidori variants.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



My bad ,got mixed up with Hebi and Taka.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 23, 2009)

Jermaine said:


> Too fast for her to react, if she manages to grab it she will be holding chidori through the sword..*not strong enough to paralyze her just from that , but it will most likely make her fling her hands back in reflex from chidori attack her nerves.*



...... No. If it's not strong enough to paralyze her, it's not strong enough to make her fling her hands back and scream in pain. She'll one-shot him then and there.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> ...... No. If it's not strong enough to paralyze her, it's not strong enough to make her fling her hands back and scream in pain. She'll one-shot him then and there.



Paralyzing doesnt make you scream in pain though lol, the lower level chidori would make her step back in shock/reflex.

I doubt she would be fast enough to grab it anyway, and if sasuke saw she wanted to grab it he would adjust to that.

Katon/chidori variants,sharingan,speed,Kirin,his sword,shurikens and wires>>>> her strength and rebirth.

 mid-long range attacks>> close range.


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## LegendaryBeauty (Oct 23, 2009)

Mid-long range attacks can be dodged, especially by one who excels at it.

He'd need to do close-range attacks to ensure he hits her, and even that's negligible. Close quarters = suicide, so he's done for.


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## Jermaine (Oct 23, 2009)

Lady Tsunade said:


> Mid-long range attacks can be dodged, especially by one who excels at it.
> 
> He'd need to do close-range attacks to ensure he hits her, and even that's negligible. Close quarters = suicide, so he's done for.



Close ranges attacks can be dodged,especially by someone who can read your movements and has great speed.

Sasuke can kill at all ranges,that gives him an adbantage already.


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## Aggressor (Oct 24, 2009)

Tsunade would own, 10 fold rofl! We haven't even seen everything she has got, if the her ying seal has been released then no doubt.


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## Panos (Oct 24, 2009)

Creator said:


> Yes, he clearly played it smart when he got owned by Raikage and then dived straight into the council where there was even more Kage level shinobis. He was clearly playing it smart.
> 
> He doesnt play it smart. He alway runs into the battle.
> 
> ...



What are you saying? He didnt get owned by Raikage. If losing one arm and going on to almost lose and a leg while your opponent is still alive equates to "owing" then you are clearly biased.

His plan from the start was to kill Danzo and that explains why he went in the Kage room.

Furthermore, Tsuande has nothing to defend against Kirin. If she gets hit she is dead. There will be no time for counter or  Genesis Rebirth here. We shall not forget that Sasuke can use Genjutsu im a sublime manner. Tsuande doesnt have any feats that may convince me she can defend against that. Finally, Sasuke is faster than Tsunade when in CS and can blitz her.


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## Mist Puppet (Oct 24, 2009)

peaceful said:


> What are you saying? He didnt get owned by Raikage. If losing one arm and going on to almost lose and a leg while your opponent is still alive equates to "owing" then you are clearly biased.



He's only alive because he used Susanoo to stop his neck from snapping.



> His plan from the start was to kill Danzo and that explains why he went in the Kage room.



Relevance?



> Furthermore, Tsuande has nothing to defend against Kirin. If she gets hit she is dead. There will be no time for counter or  Genesis Rebirth here. We shall not forget that Sasuke can use Genjutsu im a sublime manner. Tsuande doesnt have any feats that may convince me she can defend against that. Finally, Sasuke is faster than Tsunade when in CS and can blitz her.



Why do people think Sasuke can just use Kirin whenever he wants? Kirin needs prep time. Time in which Sasuke can't afford to waste. And Genjutsu could work, except for the fact that Tsunade is a master of chakra control. And Sasuke can't use CS because this is TAKA Sasuke.

If Sasuke tries to prep for Kirin, he gets his butt kicked by a Shunshin Tsunade punch.


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## Jermaine (Oct 24, 2009)

Faraoh1 said:


> Tsunade would own, 10 fold rofl! We haven't even seen everything she has got, if the her ying seal has been released then no doubt.



Dont be silly.


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## Jermaine (Oct 24, 2009)

Mistukuni said:


> He's only alive because he used Susanoo to stop his neck from snapping.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Sasuke doesnt even need kirin for this, he can just paralyze her then cut her head off.

or just roll in at the start evading her obvious ounches with his speed+ sharingan then slicing her head off.


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