# Godzilla (Any form) vs. SSj3 Goku



## blankshot (Sep 30, 2007)

I'm actually confused here, because several people have assured me that there exists some form of Godzilla that could easily rape Goku in any form. Then they said that Godzilla had an attack that could destroy a planet several times over, and that beats anything Goku could do.

Care to enlighten me? I have no idea what Godzilla's power range is in whatever form is his strongest.


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## Vicious (Sep 30, 2007)

Godzilla from the comics i believe survived a blackhole or something, i think the comic version would rape goku, i mean he has defeated gods..


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## Shoddragon (Sep 30, 2007)

Eiris said:


> Godzilla from the comics i believe survived a blackhole or something, i think the comic version would rape goku, i mean he has defeated gods..



one piece type gods or Samurai Jack type gods?


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## Fang (Sep 30, 2007)

Like actual Celestials such as in Samurai Jack.


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## Shoddragon (Sep 30, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Like actual Celestials such as in Samurai Jack.



then ssj3 goku gets ridiculous buttrapery.


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## Vicious (Sep 30, 2007)

But even the Samurai Jack gods werent that powerful, but they were still gods unlike eneru who was lucky to get the Rumble Rumble fruit.


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## Fang (Sep 30, 2007)

Their a lot more powerful then the Gods of DB.


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## Superrazien (Sep 30, 2007)

I think we all know what Goku can do, so until someone posts proof that godzilla can beat Goku, I will remain unconvinced.


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## FireEel (Sep 30, 2007)

Superrazien said:


> I think we all know what Goku can do, so until someone posts proof that godzilla can beat Goku, I will remain unconvinced.



Godzilla's far more badass than Goku. That's all it takes to beat him


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## Deleted member 45015 (Sep 30, 2007)

I think the only Godzilla that could lose to Goku would be the crappy American Version....


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## Segan (Sep 30, 2007)

Well, the american Godzilla had the coolest design of all version at least.


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## Fang (Sep 30, 2007)

American Zilla is a terrible character. It FW less then a minute to kill it. A tail swipe and Atomic Spiral Ray > American Zilla.


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## Segan (Sep 30, 2007)

It still had the best design...


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## Fang (Sep 30, 2007)

Not really no. Hence the reasons why most decent Godzilla fans wanted it in Final Wars so it got it's ass kicked by the real Godzilla.


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## Protect_The_Butter (Sep 30, 2007)

Here's some information on Godzilla from the comic's.

[Q-R] Mobile Suit Gundam 00 Special (D-MBS DivX5.21 640x480 120fps).avi

Apparently Godzilla played Charles Barkley in a game of basketball. LOL.


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## Segan (Sep 30, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Not really no. Hence the reasons why most decent Godzilla fans wanted it in Final Wars so it got it's ass kicked by the real Godzilla.


I'm talking about the look, not his power.


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## Fang (Sep 30, 2007)

Yeah it's look isn't anything. It was just a tuna-eating monster, basically a gigantic version of what it was mutated from.


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## Segan (Sep 30, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Yeah it's look isn't anything. It was just a tuna-eating monster, basically a gigantic version of what it was mutated from.


Sound like you were quite disappointed with what Hollywood made out of Godzilla.


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## potential (Sep 30, 2007)

That charles barkely shit is hilarious


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## Fang (Sep 30, 2007)

Segan said:


> Sound like you were quite disappointed with what Hollywood made out of Godzilla.



Because as a hardcore Godzilla fan, that movie sucked.


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## Random Nobody (Sep 30, 2007)

Segan said:


> Sound like you were quite disappointed with what Hollywood made out of Godzilla.



Well I'd have to agree with him, Hollywood Godzilla was fail.  I didn't mind it's look but come on he got killed by fucking missiles.  It was the dumbest death I'd seen until Resident Evil Apocalypse came out and Nemesis got killed by a fucking Helicopter.


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## Fang (Sep 30, 2007)

Random Nobody said:


> Well I'd have to agree with him, Hollywood Godzilla was fail.  I didn't mind it's look but come on he got killed by fucking missiles.  It was the dumbest death I'd seen until Resident Evil Apocalypse came out and Nemesis got killed by a fucking Helicopter.



Lol remember Final Wars, the Xilian dude?

" I knew that tuna-eating monster was worthless!"


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## Random Nobody (Sep 30, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Lol remember Final Wars, the Xilian dude?
> 
> " I knew that tuna-eating monster was worthless!"



Yeah that was one of my favorite parts.


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## FireEel (Oct 1, 2007)

Hollywood's version is made of epic fail...because they took the God out and made him into Zilla.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

On a sidenote the only bothering of FW Godzilla was the fact that there were way too many "Bishies" Mutants for Organization M.


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## Life n Discovery (Oct 1, 2007)

Godzilla wins thia through simple atomic breathe and a swipe of his tail.


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## xeldos (Oct 1, 2007)

Im gunna say one thing for this thread.......I feel bad for godzilla. XD


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## FireEel (Oct 1, 2007)

xeldos said:


> Im gunna say one thing for this thread.......I feel bad for *goku*. XD



There, fixed it for ya


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Does Goku have any attacks that can put down Godzilla given his regeneration ability and prone tendency to throw people into space?


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## Segan (Oct 1, 2007)

Dunno. I mean, he was on par with Kid Buu until he ran out of stamina. And the Cell saga showed that it was possible to completely annihilate a being with insane regeneration with a ki-blast, if it was just strong enough.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

He wasn't on "par" with Kid Buu, he was barely at Kid Buu's level who was fucking around the whole time with Vegeta and Goku. And Godzilla's Regeneration is fucking insane.

He has came back from nothing after the Oxygen Destroyer...and that is a much much weaker Showta Godzilla.


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## Blue (Oct 1, 2007)

Goku's physical strength is kinda sad, Tsunade would win in a boxing ring. But Ki blasts are stupidly strong, like end-the-solar-system strong. 
Then you have Buu and this absurdity with ending the universe.

I think beamspam would take it pretty easily.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Blue said:


> Goku's physical strength is kinda sad, Tsunade would win in a boxing ring. But Ki blasts are stupidly strong, like end-the-solar-system strong.
> Then you have Buu and this absurdity with ending the universe.
> 
> I think beamspam would take it pretty easily.



No one Dragonball can bust solar systems. We've seen Zilla shoot people through space. The his Atomic Spiral Ray blasted Ghidorah through space and blew him up.

Goku has nothing on Zilla, he threw King Ghidorah, who weighs couple hundred thousand tons into the atmosphere.

Atomic Spiral Ray > Kamehahama.


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## Blue (Oct 1, 2007)

Nobody HAS blown a solar system, but several people have claimed to be able to - and considering how simple it is to take out a planet in DBZ, it's easy to believe them.

Also, I'm not sure why you're talking about shooting things into space. That's not that impressive.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Blue said:


> Nobody HAS blown a solar system, but several people have claimed to be able to - and considering how simple it is to take out a planet in DBZ, it's easy to believe them.
> 
> Also, I'm not sure why you're talking about shooting things into space. That's not that impressive.



No they don't. Do you know how large a solar system is? Do you understand the difference in power and energy required to bust a planet and that of a solar system?

Goku wouldn't tickle Godzilla with his physical power and his Ki attacks aren't impressive outside of busting planets or moons. What's he going to do, blow up the world then die? Godzilla can survive in space. And his regeneration is better then any of the Buus.

Godzilla has also reacted to beings that move a couple hundred times mach speeds. What does Goku have?


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## Segan (Oct 1, 2007)

Well, the difference is quite vast, that's true. But I can imagine that Goku's strongest ki-blast (which of course wouldn't be directed at Earth) could kill him.

I doubt that the Oxygen Destroyer left no particles of Godzilla. And the final blast against Cell completely annihilated him.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

It liquited Godzilla to nothingness. Which is more then what we can say for Cell. And I see based on strength and durability feats that Goku has nothing on Zilla. All I see is him either physically crushing Goku or blasting him away.


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## Segan (Oct 1, 2007)

Liquited? You mean, Godzilla was turned into liquid?


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

As I mean all of his physical matter was reduced to nothing.


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## Blue (Oct 1, 2007)

Of course it's vast. But do you realize the energy required to blow up a planet is the entire output of the sun for years? 

There's no fucking way you could fit that much energy into something the size of a person (or a godzilla, for that matter) and not have a creation-level event on your hands. But they do. So when they say they can pop a solar system, they can. Especially since Buu almost popped the universe.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Blue said:


> Of course it's vast. But do you realize the energy required to blow up a planet is the entire output of the sun for years?
> 
> There's no fucking way you could fit that much energy into something the size of a person (or a godzilla, for that matter) and not have a creation-level event on your hands. But they do. So when they say they can pop a solar system, they can. Especially since Buu almost popped the universe.



No he didn't. All it shows is the light in the galaxy dying. He destroyed no damn universe, much less galaxy or solar system busted. Your making things up now to raise the level of strength for DB characters, which isn't that high to begin with.

Do you understand that a single hit from Zilla will kill Goku? That he fights people faster then Goku? That his ATS is FTL and Ki blasts travel the speed of plot hole?


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## Blue (Oct 1, 2007)

I'm not making anything up, and I don't even really like DBZ.

Do you understand any fight against DBZ characters involves surviving the planet or Solar System going down?

Even if Godzilla can survive in space - which you'll probably claim - he'll be stuck in an asteroid field for the rest of time while Goku goes and chills on Namek or in the other world.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Blue said:


> I'm not making anything up, and I don't even really like DBZ.
> 
> Do you understand any fight against DBZ characters involves surviving the planet or Solar System going down?
> 
> Even if Godzilla can survive in space - which you'll probably claim - he'll be stuck in an asteroid field for the rest of time while Goku goes and chills on Namek or in the other world.



Goku can't breathe in space or survive in the vaccum for one. Two, they can't do anything past planet busting. Secondly, Godzilla has reacted to people who move, for example like Mothra, several hundred times Mach Speeds, which is above if not at Hyper Sonic speeds.

Thirdly, no one hit from Zilla literally kills Goku. If he can throw a King of Kaijuus who weighs a couple hundreds of thousands of tons into space, I'm pretty sure he could toss Goku into a sun or star.

Third, no one has the energy to solar system or galaxy bust in Dragonball. No Buu, not Vegito, no Gohan, not anyone.


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## Blue (Oct 1, 2007)

I'm going to let someone else come correct you, if they care enough to. -_-

By the way, hypersonic = 5 times the speed of sound (Mach). Just for future reference.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Prove that they can solar or galaxy bust with scans from the manga. All we ever see is Super Perfect Cell saying, " This solar system along with the Earth will be destroyed", after the battle was finished with the Turtle Waves, all that was left was a 500/600 meter crater.

Secondly, do you honestly know anything about Godzilla? You know a guy who picks up city blocks for weapons as fun? Do you want Mothra or Raodan's speed listed? DBZ characters are not that fast. They aren't even near the speed of light.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> No they don't. Do you know how large a solar system is? Do you understand the difference in power and energy required to bust a planet and that of a solar system?
> 
> Goku wouldn't tickle Godzilla with his physical power and his Ki attacks aren't impressive outside of busting planets or moons. What's he going to do, blow up the world then die? Godzilla can survive in space. And his regeneration is better then any of the Buus.
> 
> Godzilla has also reacted to beings that move a couple hundred times mach speeds. What does Goku have?



Godzilla couldn't take a planet buster.  Godzilla's regen is no where near Buu's.  And there hasn't been a kanju that moved above mach 5 in an atmosphere.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Wesley said:


> Godzilla couldn't take a planet buster.  Godzilla's regen is no where near Buu's.  And there hasn't been a kanju that moved above mach 5 in an atmosphere.



Leo Mothra can go back and time is only a couple hundred thousand times the speed of light. Mothra herself moves at 200/300 times mach speed according to Toei.

Your wrong as usual, Wesley.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Leo Mothra can go back and time is only a couple hundred thousand times the speed of light. Mothra herself moves at 200/300 times mach speed according to Toei.
> 
> Your wrong as usual, Wesley.



Admittedly most of my information is dated from the sixties through the mid-90s.  Godzilla never fought those versions of Mothra and I'm skeptical that you're being all that accurate since you like to inflate things dramatically when it suits you.

"Supernova punches" ring a bell?


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Wesley said:


> Admittedly most of my information is dated from the sixties through the mid-90s.  Godzilla never fought those versions of Mothra and I'm skeptical that you're being all that accurate since you like to inflate things dramatically when it suits you.
> 
> "Supernova punches" ring a bell?



Don't start this with me when we see what you write when it comes to Star Wars.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Don't start this with me when we see what you write when it comes to Star Wars.



And lots of other things, but that's beside the point.  Right now, in this thread, I'm calling you on counts of exaggeration.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Not really, Mothra's speed did not change in any of the films. Especially when the supernova bit was explained before hand.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Not really, Mothra's speed did not change in any of the films. Especially when the supernova bit was explained before hand.



There have been many versions of Mothra.  None of the ones I'm familiar with would stand a chance against Goku.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Wesley said:


> There have been many versions of Mothra.  None of the ones I'm familiar with would stand a chance against Goku.



Lightspeed Mothra as well as the original Mothra, Dark Leo. Goku isn't that strong, get over it.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Lightspeed Mothra as well as the original Mothra, Dark Leo. Goku isn't that strong, get over it.



The Original?  

You'd better start posting movie screenshots and site some movie quotes after saying that.  There isn't a single Hiesei monster from the 80s that could beat Goku.  Or even really put up much of a fight.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

You realize that Godzilla survived and destroyed a black hole right, Wesley?

As for Godzilla's durability and regen ability.

To date, the only weapons ever shown to be truly effective against Godzilla were Dr. Serizawa's Oxygen Destroyer and Dr. Shiragami's ANEB (Anti-Nuclear Energy Bacteria). The Oxygen Destroyer was a weapon of mass destruction which when discharged, disintegrated Godzilla down to the bone, and then into nothing in a matter of seconds.

And he came back from those.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> You realize that Godzilla survived and destroyed a black hole right, Wesley?



Yeah, I saw that movie.  They called it a blackhole, but it didn't look like one.  It didn't behave like one.  And the idea of using a singularity as an anti-Kanju weapon, I think that'd create more problems than solve if you're using it in the atmosphere.

Remember when they test fired it?  A blackhole simply doesn't disappear because it hits the ground...

As for weapons that have been effective, the Oxygen destroyer did kill Godzilla.  Or one of them.  There was an explanation for that though, something about time machines and 23rd century people.  I'm not familiar with the Ghidorah Hisei movies I'm afraid.


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## FireEel (Oct 1, 2007)

Wesley said:


> The Original?
> 
> You'd better start posting movie screenshots and site some movie quotes after saying that.  There isn't a single Hiesei monster from the 80s that could beat Goku.  Or even really put up much of a fight.



The problem about posting Godzilla ss is that most of the Godzilla movies are so old, and not easily available.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Wesley said:


> Yeah, I saw that movie.  They called it a blackhole, but it didn't look like one.  It didn't behave like one.  And the idea of using a singularity as an anti-Kanju weapon, I think that'd create more problems than solve if you're using it in the atmosphere.
> 
> Remember when they test fired it?  A blackhole simply doesn't disappear because it hits the ground...



No it didn't, it disappated because Godzilla blasted it with his Spiral Ray. Even if was just like a Void Singularity from the Vong, it was going onto the scale of a true black hole, Godzilla stopped it from getting even larger.

And as to Zilla's physical strength, he threw Kumogana into the horizan.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> No it didn't, it disappated because Godzilla blasted it with his Spiral Ray. Even if was just like a Void Singularity from the Vong, it was going onto the scale of a true black hole, Godzilla stopped it from getting even larger.
> 
> And as to Zilla's physical strength, he threw Kumogana into the horizan.



I don't think the Blackhole Weapon feat is a very good one.  There's plenty to doubt about the nature of the weapon.  That Godzilla's breath was able to beat it says only that it was able to beat it.

Think of something else.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

It wasn't his breath, it was him building up energy with his Atomic Spiral Ray which should only make it ever the more clear how powerful his nuclear power is.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> It wasn't his breath, it was him building up energy with his Atomic Spiral Ray which should only make it ever the more clear how powerful his nuclear power is.



Except it isn't clear since it was used on the Blackhole weapon.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

...About the only they haven't tried on Godzilla, any version of Godzilla, is use enough force to destroy him bodily.  They always refuse to use nukes on him, because nukes would do more damage than he's prone to doing on his own.

When they finally decide to use nuclear weapons and he survives a direct hit, then we'll talk about him being able to fight Goku, not before.


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## Sengoku (Oct 1, 2007)

the blackhole blast wasnt a direct hit.


2nd, goku is able to survive per se. instant transmission(sigh what a stupid name) to planet namek.


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## Segan (Oct 1, 2007)

Except that Goku would need to be in the DBZverse to be able to teleport to Namek (the new Namek, of course). Or we allow IT on a multidimensional scale...


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Segan said:


> Except that Goku would need to be in the DBZverse to be able to teleport to Namek (the new Namek, of course). Or we allow IT on a multidimensional scale...



Goku needs a person Ki whose he's familiar with to do so.


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## Segan (Oct 1, 2007)

I was only referring to the statement that he could teleport to Namek.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

And I was only saying that without a person's ki signature not available to him, he is incapable of doing so. In any case, aside from the fact that Godzilla has fought people faster then Goku, stronger then Goku and has better durability then Goku, how is he going to win?

I'm stilling waiting to hear the reasons aside from "lolz planet busting ki blasts".


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> I'm stilling waiting to hear the reasons aside from "lolz planet busting ki blasts".



What more reason do you need?  Godzilla has never dealt nor taken a planet buster.  Goku has done both.


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## Segan (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> And I was only saying that without a person's ki signature not available to him, he is incapable of doing so. In any case, aside from the fact that Godzilla has fought people faster then Goku, stronger then Goku and has better durability then Goku, how is he going to win?
> 
> I'm stilling waiting to hear the reasons aside from "lolz planet busting ki blasts".


What does it help Godzilla to have better durability than Goku, if Goku wouldn't even survive his own (strongest) blast, if it was directed against him?

At any rate, I doubt that Godzilla has the durability to tank a blast that would annihilate a whole planet and as we have seen, if a ki-blast is strong enough, it will just erase you out of existence.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Wesley said:


> What more reason do you need?  Godzilla has never dealt nor taken a planet buster.  Goku has done both.



Because the average ki blast in DB is a planet busting one?


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Because the average ki blast in DB is a planet busting one?



Or at least contain enough energy to destroy a planet.  Their attacks are "condensed".  Makes them more effective at nailing other fighters without waste.  I mean, sure, the collateral damage doesn't match up with planet busting, but the fact that DBZ characters can take planet busters without flinching.  Anything smaller than that much energy would be kind of pointless don't you think?


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## dwabn (Oct 1, 2007)

asian guy: GODZILLAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111111111111!!!!!!!!!!!11!!1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Segan (Oct 1, 2007)

The DBZ fighters are limiting their amount of ki anyway. SSJ3 Goku fired a Kamehame-Ha, and when it hit the Earth, it destroyed about 1/10 of the surface.

And a much weaker version of SSJ Goku had more power than Frieza, who was capable of busting a planet.

Just by powerscaling alone, SSJ3 Goku has to have enough power worth of destroying several planets at once.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

Segan said:


> The DBZ fighters are limiting their amount of ki anyway. SSJ3 Goku fired a Kamehame-Ha, and when it hit the Earth, it destroyed about 1/10 of the surface.
> 
> And a much weaker version of SSJ Goku had more power than Frieza, who was capable of busting a planet.
> 
> Just by powerscaling alone, SSJ3 Goku has to have enough power worth of destroying several planets at once.



Goku never fired a Kamehameha that destroyed 1/10 of the Earth.  That's out of character.


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## Segan (Oct 1, 2007)

Wesley said:


> Goku never fired a Kamehameha that destroyed 1/10 of the Earth.  That's out of character.


...


*Spoiler*: __ 



It was a rebound. Goku fired a blast and Fat Boo deflected it in another direction, hence that's how it hit the Earth and destroyed a part of the surface.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Wesley said:


> Or at least contain enough energy to destroy a planet.  Their attacks are "condensed".  Makes them more effective at nailing other fighters without waste.  I mean, sure, the collateral damage doesn't match up with planet busting, but the fact that DBZ characters can take planet busters without flinching.  Anything smaller than that much energy would be kind of pointless don't you think?



Except they are not. Roshi had to spend several minutes to charge up his attack to destroy the moon. Vegeta's Final Flash took an absurdly long time for a real fight when he was charging it up against Cell, the same again with Goku's Shokan Idou/Turtle Wave Combo or when Gohan and SPC were firing their blasts.

The only people who haven't were Vegito, Ultimate and Super Buutenks. And of course Kid Buu who still left enough time for Goku and Vegeta to fleeing before his blast was charged to use Shoutan Idou to escape. So I say again, proof of any showings in the manga against this?


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## Rated R Superstar (Oct 1, 2007)

I never knew godzilla, of all characters, was this strong. So theres nothing goku could do to win?


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## master bruce (Oct 1, 2007)

godzilla is cool and all, but dude, you seriously think a solar system busting ftl alien being of insane powerful and fighting skills can loose to a giant radiactive lizard?!!?!?!?!?

WTF??!??!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!!?!?!?!?!?


Goku ssj1 owns godzilla and king kong at the same time.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

master bruce said:


> godzilla is cool and all, but dude, you seriously think a solar system busting ftl alien being of insane powerful and fighting skills can loose to a giant radiactive lizard?!!?!?!?!?
> 
> WTF??!??!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!!?!?!?!?!?
> 
> ...



No character in Dragonball moves close to being near the level of the speed of light, much less faster then it. Nor can anyone in Dragonball bust solar systems.


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## Sengoku (Oct 1, 2007)

what goku could possibly do is fly at the other side of the earth and destroy the planet from there to avoid godzilla first of all.

then hope godzilla would fly through space and lands near a super massive black hole.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Godzilla has destroyed a black hole before after being exposed to it. Not too mention Goku isn't honestly that fast when compared to any of the Mothras.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Except they are not. Roshi had to spend several minutes to charge up his attack to destroy the moon. Vegeta's Final Flash took an absurdly long time for a real fight when he was charging it up against Cell, the same again with Goku's Shokan Idou/Turtle Wave Combo or when Gohan and SPC were firing their blasts.
> 
> The only people who haven't were Vegito, Ultimate and Super Buutenks. And of course Kid Buu who still left enough time for Goku and Vegeta to fleeing before his blast was charged to use Shoutan Idou to escape. So I say again, proof of any showings in the manga against this?



I don't know what your point is.  How does a charge up time have anything to do with anything I just said?


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Wesley, please stop playing dumb with me. You know that DB fighters need a long amount of time to charge up their attacks to do anything equal to busting a planet. While Goku sits and charges, Zilla either swats him out of the sky and crushes him underfoot or blasts him apart with his Atomic Spiral Ray.


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## Sengoku (Oct 1, 2007)

he has never destroyed a super massive black hole.
sorry but no.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Describe the difference between a black hole and  a "super massive one".


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## Sengoku (Oct 1, 2007)

supermassive black hole is a black hole with *a mass of an order of magnitude between 105 and 1010 (hundreds of thousands and tens of billions) of solar masses.* It is currently thought that most, if not all galaxies, including the Milky Way, contain supermassive black holes at their galactic centers.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

So by your logic, Luke Skywalker > Goku and Godzilla since it was stated that when he was rooted in the Force not even the black hole in the center of the Deep Core would budge him from his place?


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## Sengoku (Oct 1, 2007)

no, by my logic.

super massive black holes > godzilla.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Wesley, please stop playing dumb with me. You know that DB fighters need a long amount of time to charge up their attacks to do anything equal to busting a planet. While Goku sits and charges, Zilla either swats him out of the sky and crushes him underfoot or blasts him apart with his Atomic Spiral Ray.



First off all, you wouldn't need a planet destroying attack to kill Godzilla.  His body isn't that big nor is it that tough.

Secondly, they don't need a long time to charge up all of their attacks.  They have low end and high end attacks and as they progress through the series, low end becomes yesterday's high end.  Case in point, Piccolo's special beam cannon.  It took minutes to charge up when he first developed it.  Later on, he could rip it off without a thought.

You also ignored my point.  They've taken planet busters without flinching.  Godzilla has not.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

SengokuGensui said:


> no, by my logic.
> 
> super massive black holes > godzilla.



And Goku never busted a black hole, which takes a shitload more energy then a planet. So that still shows Godzilla > Goku.


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## Sengoku (Oct 1, 2007)

its okay, wes

hes a big fan godzilla fan and i totally understand that.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

SengokuGensui said:


> its okay, wes
> 
> hes a big fan godzilla fan and i totally understand that.



I don't.  He should admit that Godzilla is actually really weak compared to alot of other series.  DBZ among them.

More than the fact that he likes Godzilla, I suspect it's because he hates DBZ.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

SengokuGensui said:


> its okay, wes
> 
> hes a big fan godzilla fan and i totally understand that.



This coming from the guy who thinks Trek Ships can take out Star Destroyers.


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## Sengoku (Oct 1, 2007)

changing subjects again arent we?
aww.


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## Segan (Oct 1, 2007)

According to Wikipedia, there are three (of four) realistic sizes (equivalent of energy in that case) for black holes.

One has the size of 1-15 solar masses
One has the size of thousands of solar masses
One has the size of millions to billions of solar masses (10^6 to 10^9)

Problem here is now, that black holes aren't exactly a kind of energy discharge like ki blasts. But withstanding the gravitation of one black hole is quite a feat in itself, and I can imagine that it would require just as much durability as it needs to tank a planet-busting ki-blast...

At any rate, it seems I quite underestimated Godzilla.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

Segan said:


> At any rate, it seems I quite underestimated Godzilla.



You didn't it.  It wasn't a real black hole.


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## Sengoku (Oct 1, 2007)

except the black hole that you saw was a *miniature* black hole. and yes, it wasnt a real "black hole"

realistically speaking, if that black hole was to even come out of that gun in the first place, the ground, the skies, everything will be sucked in automatically.

but... i guess it didnt.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

SengokuGensui said:


> except the black hole that you saw was a *miniature* black hole.
> 
> realistically speaking, if that black hole was to even come out of that gun in the first place, the ground, the skies, everything will be sucked in automatically.
> 
> but... i guess it didnt.



It wasn't a blackhole period.


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## Ippy (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Third, no one has the energy to solar system or galaxy bust in Dragonball. No Buu, not Vegito, no Gohan, not anyone.





Blue said:


> I'm going to let someone else come correct you, if they care enough to. -_-


What? TWF's actually right about this.

Cell's "solar system" buster blew up Kaiou's mini planet, and didn't so much as _touch_ the not-too-far-away yellow clouds and Snake Way.  The pathway was still intact, and the clouds were not dissipated nor dispersed.

And no one in DBZ has shown the capacity to galaxy bust.  Also note that if anyone did, they wouldn't need to take long destroying the entire DBZ universe... since it's only _*four*_ galaxies total. 



Segan said:


> Except that Goku would need to be in the DBZverse to be able to teleport to Namek (the new Namek, of course). Or we allow IT on a multidimensional scale...


Exactly.

Unless the OP is specific, they fight in a neutral universe.



Wesley said:


> Or at least contain enough energy to destroy a planet.  Their attacks are "condensed".  Makes them more effective at nailing other fighters without waste.  I mean, sure, the collateral damage doesn't match up with planet busting, but the fact that DBZ characters can take planet busters without flinching.  Anything smaller than that much energy would be kind of pointless don't you think?


That is completely unsubstantiated.

If I just apply , the simplest and most logical answer is that they don't put the energy necessary to planet bust into all of their attacks.

And when has *anyone* tanked an attack capable of destroying a planet?  

Firstly, they always made a big deal about when they were about to use an attack of that magnitude, and secondly, whoever was going to be on the receiving end(usually Goku) panicked.

You don't panic from getting hit by a pillow.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

> That is completely unsubstantiated.



I admit it's never stated.  It's the only thing that makes sense though, since the collateral damage doesn't increase exponentionally as the characters get more powerful over the course of the series.  You have Nappa making a crater visible from space leaving no trace of the city that was once there.  And he was really weak.

It's like Saint Seiya.  The Collateral =/= the energy in the attack.

I can't prove it though, so just go ahead and say it's bullshit and pretend I never said it.



> If I just apply , the simplest and most logical answer is that they don't put the energy necessary to planet bust into all of their attacks.



Except that...



> And when has *anyone* tanked an attack capable of destroying a planet?



A few times to be sure.  Trunks against Freiza's Deathball for one and that didn't even phase Trunks.



> Firstly, they always made a big deal about when they were about to use an attack of that magnitude, and secondly, whoever was going to be on the receiving end(usually Goku) panicked.
> 
> You don't panic from getting hit by a pillow.



There's a bare minium of energy needed to blow up a planet and then there's overkill.  And they were always up against a stronger oppenent that were about to blow up the planet, except for maybe Cell's self-destruct.  That's just a cheap move though from a cheap villian.

Freiza's planet busting Deathball would likely be very managable for endgame DBZ characters.

Point is it was usually a stronger enemy that would be able to generate an attack they couldn't tank, regardless of the fact it'd destroy the planet.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Trunks caught his Death Ball, he wasn't hit by it, and when it exploded, it clearly showed it lacked the power to bust the planet afterward with it's explosion.


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## Banhammer (Oct 1, 2007)

For those who don't know, Godzilla is what happens when you add 40% GAR, 20% Batman with prep, 20% pure win, 10% pimpaliciousness, 9% raping genes, 0.9% Sqirrel Girl, and and 0.1% Rosie O'Donnel (that's the part that gives him those looks)


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

TheFourthNin said:


> For those who don't know, Godzilla is what happens when you add 40% GAR, 20% Batman with prep, 20% pure win, 10% pimpaliciousness, 9% raping genes, 0.9% Sqirrel Girl, and and 0.1% Rosie O'Donnel (that's the part that gives him those looks)



Only the versions from the sixties.


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## Banhammer (Oct 1, 2007)

That's what ya'll teenagers call it these days?


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

TheFourthNin said:


> That's what ya'll teenagers call it these days?



I'm twenty-four.  I'm a Heisei Godzilla fan through and through.


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> Trunks caught his Death Ball, he wasn't hit by it, and when it exploded, it clearly showed it lacked the power to bust the planet afterward with it's explosion.



So basically you're just going to ignore everything I said about collateral damage in DBZ?


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## FireEel (Oct 1, 2007)

master bruce said:


> godzilla is cool and all, but dude, you seriously think a solar system busting ftl alien being of insane powerful and fighting skills can loose to a giant radiactive lizard?!!?!?!?!?
> 
> WTF??!??!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!!?!?!?!?!?
> 
> ...



First off, Godzilla isn't a giant "radiactive" lizard. He's a Godzillanosaurus that has survived for over 65 million years and got exposed to nuclear energy due to some bomb tests near his island.

Second, yes we do think Goku can lose to Godzilla.

Third, King Kong is merely 10 tonnes, Godzilla is 60,000 tonnes. In a fight, Godzilla is liable to just step on kong and not realise it. King Kong is a King. Godzilla is GOD.


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## Fang (Oct 1, 2007)

Wesley said:


> So basically you're just going to ignore everything I said about collateral damage in DBZ?



So that....is collateral damage when it exploded and did nothing?


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## Wesley (Oct 1, 2007)

The White Fang said:


> So that....is collateral damage when it exploded and did nothing?



Kinda.  I guess.

Whatever.


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## Green Lantern (Oct 2, 2007)

I close thread now or Joke BD?


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## Orion (Oct 2, 2007)

Segan said:


> The DBZ fighters are limiting their amount of ki anyway. SSJ3 Goku fired a Kamehame-Ha, and when it hit the Earth, it destroyed about 1/10 of the surface.
> 
> And a much weaker version of SSJ Goku had more power than Frieza, who was capable of busting a planet.
> 
> Just by powerscaling alone, SSJ3 Goku has to have enough power worth of destroying several planets at once.



Frieza could only do it by coring it,kid buu was the only real planet buster and ssj3 wasnt that much stronger then him,and the difference  in energy between busting one planet and 2 at a time is much much larger then you think,and in case it comes up  no dbz character is a casual throw 100 planet busters crap they have always made a big deal about planet destroyers and usually always try to avoid them.


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## Segan (Oct 2, 2007)

You got a point, feitan. I would like to say that he was only at half his power, but...well, it doesn't actually change anything.

@radishbak: Why JB? The way I see, the opinions are quite split. It's not the average ant vs elephant thread.


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## Banhammer (Oct 2, 2007)

In my day, we knew why did the lizard called himself *God*zilla


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## FireEel (Oct 2, 2007)

Green Lantern said:


> I close thread now or Joke BD?



I dun see the point...

There is not so much a power gap between these two as you might think.


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## Wesley (Oct 2, 2007)

Green Lantern said:


> I close thread now or Joke BD?



Yeah, please close it.  Some people just can't tolerate the fact that DBZ can actually win some match-ups handiedly.


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## Fang (Oct 2, 2007)

Green Lantern said:


> I close thread now or Joke BD?



Neither of them.


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