# Aokiji VS Hancock



## Valdie (Sep 5, 2014)

Location: Marineford

Intel: Canon

Mindset: Hancock is bloodlusted, Aokiji is the same as always.

Distance: 100 meters


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## Lycka (Sep 5, 2014)

Aokiji blitzes and one shots.




Marco blitzed past Hancock from a much further than her to hit Aokiji where She was shown to be too slow to even reach let alone react to Aokiji who was attacking Luffy.


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## November (Sep 5, 2014)

Frozen Nipples.


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## Ruse (Sep 5, 2014)

Aokiji lower end of Mid difficulty


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## Rob (Sep 5, 2014)

Does Hancock want some Ice with that rape?


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## convict (Sep 5, 2014)

Aokiji low difficulty.


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## monkey d ace (Sep 5, 2014)

with aokigi's lazy MS, she might push him to mid diff.


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## Lawliet (Sep 5, 2014)

Aokiji high difficulty. Hancock is not as weak as some of you think.


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## Grimsley (Sep 5, 2014)

Could go both ways but I'm leaning towards Hancock because Aokijii was intimidated by ha.



Lycka said:


> Aokiji blitzes and one shots.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



your logic =/= 

Marco is a fast character; not many characters can match his speed. And secondly If plot allowed so she could've striked or at least distracted Aokiji with Slave Arrow which are proven to be faster than cannonballs. Nice try.

Edit: Oh you're banned? Bye bitch.


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## Gohara (Sep 5, 2014)

I could see it going either way.  Both have a high level of physical prowess, have powerful Devil Fruits, and are (probably in Aokiji's case) great Haki users.  Regardless of which one wins, I think they would have high to extremely high difficulty in winning.


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## Orca (Sep 5, 2014)

Kuzan low diff.


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## Grimsley (Sep 5, 2014)

Gohara said:


> I could see it going either way.  Both have a high level of physical prowess, have powerful Devil Fruits, *and are (probably in Aokiji's case) great Haki users.*  Regardless of which one wins, I think they would have high to extremely high difficulty in winning.



probably in Aokiji's case? when Hancock is the one confirmed to have all 3 haki and the leader of a tribe that specializes in haki? ok.


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## LyricalMessiah (Sep 5, 2014)

Aokiji Mid difficulty at best. Redundant to think that she loses with Low difficulty. I am aware that someone below will think so because they're either just too ignorant, but whatever helps them get through the day. A powerful fighter like Hancock isn't going down without giving him moderate difficulty.


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## Luke (Sep 5, 2014)

Aokiji wins with low difficulty.


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## Dellinger (Sep 5, 2014)

Gohara said:


> I could see it going either way.  Both have a high level of physical prowess, have powerful Devil Fruits, and are (probably in Aokiji's case) great Haki users.  Regardless of which one wins, I think they would have high to extremely high difficulty in winning.



Hahahahaha.


No.

Admirals are above Hancock and by a decent margin.


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## Grimsley (Sep 5, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> Hahahahaha.
> 
> 
> No.
> ...



proof? for all we know hancock is on the same level as mihawk

hancock had no fear attacking aokojii, she had no fear ignoring the summon of the fleet admiral. if anything she's probably stronger than an admiral


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## Dellinger (Sep 5, 2014)

jackieshann said:


> proof? for all we know hancock is on the same level as mihawk
> 
> hancock had no fear attacking aokojii, she had no fear ignoring the summon of the fleet admiral. if anything she's probably stronger than an admiral



Luffy had no fear attacking the 3 Admirals either.

Ace had no fear attackign Akainu.

Some Vice Admirals had no fear attacking WB.

And on and on and on.


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## StrawHat4Life (Sep 5, 2014)

I think that Hancock can put up a similar level of resistance against Aokiji as Sabo is currently displaying against Fujitora. She gives him a tough fight.


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## Ruse (Sep 5, 2014)

oOLawlietOo said:


> Aokiji high difficulty. *Hancock is not as weak as some of you think.*



I agree with since I have high expectations for her when she goes all out but I'll go with mid diff for now.


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## Lycka (Sep 5, 2014)

jackieshann said:


> Could go both ways but I'm leaning towards Hancock because Aokijii was intimidated by ha.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



If Marco blitzed a bloodlusted Hancock who REALLY wanted to save Luffy, She's getting blitzed by Aokiji who's of a similar level of speed.


Keyword: If  stop with the hypotheticals and use facts. Andd slave arrows aren't going to touch Aokiji before she's solid ice, cannonballs (which are slower than guns) are considered ridiculously slow. There's a reason she's only used on fodder.


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## Imagine (Sep 5, 2014)

ICE     TIME


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## Suit (Sep 5, 2014)

Assuming Kuzan can keep his Ice Bone under control, he takes it low-diff. I see Hancock and Doflamingo being about the same in strength/stats/etc.


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## Valdie (Sep 5, 2014)

Lycka said:


> If Marco blitzed a bloodlusted Hancock who REALLY wanted to save Luffy, She's getting blitzed by Aokiji who's of a similar level of speed.
> 
> 
> Keyword: If  stop with the hypotheticals and use facts. Andd slave arrows aren't going to touch Aokiji before she's solid ice, cannonballs (which are slower than guns) are considered ridiculously slow. There's a reason she's only used on fodder.


Because Oda doesn't want to spoil the fact that she's the strongest Shichibukai .

But seriously, Aokiji would probably take her on with mid-diff. The further she goes without going all-out, the stronger she's going to turn out to be. That's what I think anyway .


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## X18999 (Sep 5, 2014)

One of the things that annoy me the most is people decided without any evidence that Hancock is relatively weak and that's that.  Sure it's possible she weaker than Doflamingo its also possible that she's as strong as any Admiral.

Honestly I also think people people overate the Admirals far too much.  There is no way in the hell they are Low diffing people on or around Doflamingo level.


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## Gohara (Sep 5, 2014)

jackieshann said:


> probably in Aokiji's case? when Hancock is the one confirmed to have all 3 haki and the leader of a tribe that specializes in haki? ok.



I'm unclear on what you're saying here exactly.  I agree that Hancock is great at using Haki, and would actually probably lean towards her in that regard.

I was saying that Aokiji is probably great at using Haki as well.



White Hawk said:


> Admirals are above Hancock and by a decent margin.



If you can show me proof of that, I'll agree.  



X18999 said:


> Sure it's possible she weaker than Doflamingo its also possible that she's as strong as any Admiral.



Agreed.



X18999 said:


> Honestly I also think people people overate the Admirals far too much.  There is no way in the hell they are Low diffing people on or around Doflamingo level.



I think views on Admirals depend a lot on what level of fighters they're perceived to be.  That may sound obvious, but what I mean is I view them as more along the lines of Yonkou Commanders (like the top 2-4 of Yonkou Commanders) and behind the Fleet Admiral.  On the other hand, there are some who think they are the Yonkou equivalent of the marines or very close to it, stronger than the Fleet Admiral and what not.

The Yonkou get far bigger reactions.  Admirals haven't really shown anything that leads me to believe they're Yonkou level either, and they've been fought on par with by a handful of below Yonkou level characters.


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## Luke (Sep 5, 2014)

Personally I'd put Hancock as a bit stronger than Magellan, and both of them just under Luffy and Kidd.


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## Suit (Sep 5, 2014)

X18999 said:


> One of the things that annoy me the most is people decided without any evidence that Hancock is relatively weak and that's that.  Sure it's possible she weaker than Doflamingo its also possible that she's as strong as any Admiral.
> 
> Honestly I also think people people overate the Admirals far too much.  There is no way in the hell they are Low diffing people on or around Doflamingo level.









Kuzan is effectively as strong as the man who took all this damage and lived. Doflamingo showed visible damage from Luffy's punch. Be thankful I like Doffy enough not to call him fodder. His guts would have been smeared all over MF had he been in Sakazuki's place.


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## Luke (Sep 5, 2014)

It is kinda funny the first thing people show when people say "Admirals are overrated" is either gifs or pictures of an Admiral getting the worst beating of his life  

I think it'd be more impressive to show a gif of Akainu taking off half of Whitebeard's head rather than showing Akainu getting smashed around like a doll.


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## Gohara (Sep 5, 2014)

Akainu took more damage from those attacks than what Doflamingo took from Luffy's attack.  Also, having superior durability doesn't necessarily make you far stronger than someone.

I wouldn't say any other Admiral is as strong as Akainu, so what he can do doesn't necessarily translate to what the other Admirals can do.


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## Suit (Sep 5, 2014)

Gohara said:


> Akainu took more damage from those attacks than what Doflamingo took from Luffy's attack.  Also, having superior durability doesn't necessarily make you far stronger than someone.
> 
> I wouldn't say any other Admiral is as strong as Akainu, so what he can do doesn't necessarily translate to what the other Admirals can do.



Kuzan fight Sakazuki for ten days straight. From a weakling like Doflamingo's point of view, they are exactly equal. Equal in their ability to utterly decimate him. By the way, Sakazuki also took off half of Whitebeard's face. Doflamingo isn't doing so well against Luffy and Law, despite having Trebol with him. Doflamingo is mostly talk.

Let me put it this way; If Akainu fought Doffy, it would essentially be like Luffy vs Blueno, with Sakazuki taking a win as handily as the former did. Since Kuzan is about equal to Sakazuki, and I (arbitrarily) consider Hancock to be about Doflamingo's level, I call it a low-diff. Same as Luffy vs Blueno.


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## J★J♥ (Sep 5, 2014)

We will know when we see her Limits, but before that i do think that she is stronger.


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## Wayne With The Ism (Sep 5, 2014)

Gohara said:


> I'm unclear on what you're saying here exactly.  I agree that Hancock is great at using Haki, and would actually probably lean towards her in that regard.
> 
> I was saying that Aokiji is probably great at using Haki as well.
> 
> ...



I can use your own logic against you. You say you need evidence for Aokiji being stronger than Hancock but you automatically assume Yonkou>Admirals. The only Yonkou shown to be above the admirals is WB, whom is an outlier. How the hell are the marines going to fight in the final war if their strongest fighters are only equal to the top 2-4 of a Yonkour crew.


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## Suit (Sep 5, 2014)

Luke said:


> It is kinda funny the first thing people show when people say "Admirals are overrated" is either gifs or pictures of an Admiral getting the worst beating of his life
> 
> I think it'd be more impressive to show a gif of Akainu taking off half of Whitebeard's head rather than showing Akainu getting smashed around like a doll.



It wasn't in the anime, so there _isn't_ a gif you nimrod. 

Besides, this is the proper way to argue durability feats.


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## 108CaliberPhoenix (Sep 5, 2014)

Roo said:


> Kuzan fight Sakazuki for ten days straight. From a weakling like Doflamingo's point of view, they are exactly equal. Equal in their ability to utterly decimate him. By the way, Sakazuki also took off half of Whitebeard's face. Doflamingo isn't doing so well against Luffy and Law, despite having Trebol with him. Doflamingo is mostly talk.
> 
> Let me put it this way; If Akainu fought Doffy, it would essentially be like Luffy vs Blueno, with Sakazuki taking a win as handily as the former did. Since Kuzan is about equal to Sakazuki, and I (arbitrarily) consider Hancock to be about Doflamingo's level, I call it a low-diff. Same as Luffy vs Blueno.


I didn't know sitting on ones chair and not even moving whilst handling 2 SN is "not doing so well" against them

Luffy couldn't even hit Mingo on his own he needed Law's help/ hax to land the punch
Trebol hasn't even moved either he hasn't done a thing so why are you bringing him up
And so far Dofla has put about 5% effort into the fight


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## Suit (Sep 5, 2014)

108CaliberPhoenix said:


> I didn't know sitting on ones chair and not even moving whilst handling 2 SN is "not doing so well" against them
> 
> Luffy couldn't even hit Mingo on his own he needed Law's help/ hax to land the punch
> Trebol hasn't even moved either he hasn't done a thing so why are you bringing him up
> And so far Dofla has put about 5% effort into the fight



Sakazuki would have laughed at that Red Hawk. Even if it bypassed his logia intangibility, he would have laughed. Doflamingo wasn't laughing, kid. It clearly hurt him. The difference in the Admirals and Doflamingo (and by extension, Hancock, until proven otherwise) is the difference between Heaven and Earth.


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## Ether (Sep 5, 2014)

Aokiji lower end of mid diff.

He has the feats of an ocean covering Ice Age, freezing Doflamingo without touching him, defeating Jozu, equaling Sakazuki for 10 days, and taking on Whitebeard which solidly puts him above the current feats for Hancock.


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## 108CaliberPhoenix (Sep 5, 2014)

Roo said:


> Sakazuki would have laughed at that Red Hawk. Even if it bypassed his logia intangibility, he would have laughed. Doflamingo wasn't laughing, kid. It clearly hurt him. The difference in the Admirals and Doflamingo (and by extension, Hancock, until proven otherwise) is the difference between Heaven and Earth.


Did I say anything about the red hawk not hurting DD it obviously did damage

Akainu wouldn't laugh he never laughs he doesn't even smile. 

It would do nothing to him but I am not even debating that why don't you tell me how Doflamingo and Trebol are getting owned when they have done next to nothing yet Luffy + Law have been on defensive the whole time

You also act as if Doflamingo has just been killed you know the fight is far from over right?


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## Suit (Sep 5, 2014)

108CaliberPhoenix said:


> Did I say anything about the red hawk not hurting DD it obviously did damage
> 
> Akainu wouldn't laugh he never laughs he doesn't even smile.
> 
> ...



You are acting as if somehow, Doflamingo is comparable to Sakazuki. He's not. I've already been over this. Admirals are leaps and bounds ahead of Doflamingo and Hancock.


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## 108CaliberPhoenix (Sep 5, 2014)

Roo said:


> You are acting as if somehow, Doflamingo is comparable to Sakazuki. He's not. I've already been over this. Admirals are leaps and bounds ahead of Doflamingo and Hancock.


Akainu mid diffs Doflamingo for me. How did anything I say imply DD = Akainu? 

The only thing I refuted you on is your claim about Luffy/Law vs Dofla and you have said nothing in response to that and keep bringing up Akainu >>>>>>> DD and Hancock


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## Gohara (Sep 5, 2014)

Roo said:


> Kuzan fight Sakazuki for ten days straight. From a weakling like Doflamingo's point of view, they are exactly equal.



Akainu was implied to still have the energy to finish off Aokiji, and we were only given basic information from someone who likely didn't even see the fight.  While I have no problem agreeing they aren't far off in strength, I'm not sold on them being 100% equal either.  Plus, that doesn't encompass Fujitora and Kizaru.  That's just Aokiji.

Besides that, I don't think pre time skip Akainu is far stronger than Doflamingo.  I personally don't see any Admiral defeating Doflamingo with low difficulty.



EnyawNehc said:


> I can use your own logic against you. You say you need evidence for Aokiji being stronger than Hancock but you automatically assume Yonkou>Admirals. The only Yonkou shown to be above the admirals is WB, whom is an outlier.



I disagree that Whitebeard is an outlier, and him besting Admirals isn't the only reason I think that.  Shanks also forced Akainu to stand down, and there have been a handful of confrontations between Admirals and characters below Yonkou level that have been even.  There's also my point on Yonkou getting far bigger reactions than Admirals get.



EnyawNehc said:


> How the hell are the marines going to fight in the final war if their strongest fighters are only equal to the top 2-4 of a Yonkour crew.



They'll have two Fleet Admiral level marines at minimum in Kong and current Akainu.  I believe they are likely the Yonkou equivalent of the marines, with the Admirals being like the Yonkou Commanders.

On a personal note, I theorize that Bonney's powers either have been or will be used to turn the Gorosei back into their prime age.  Regardless of who is right about the Admirals' strength, I don't think the marines stand a chance in the final war as they are now.


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## Wayne With The Ism (Sep 5, 2014)

Gohara said:


> Akainu was implied to still have the energy to finish off Aokiji, and we were only given basic information from someone who likely didn't even see the fight.  While I have no problem agreeing they aren't far off in strength, I'm not sold on them being 100% equal either.  Plus, that doesn't encompass Fujitora and Kizaru.  That's just Aokiji.
> 
> Besides that, I don't think pre time skip Akainu is far stronger than Doflamingo.  I personally don't see any Admiral defeating Doflamingo with low difficulty.
> 
> ...



Shanks didn't force shit but surprise Sakazuki when he saved Coby. Sakazuki isn't stupid enough to fight Shanks after the injuries from WB. Lol if you wanna talk about reactions, the mention of Kizaru coming to Saboady made everyone shit themselves.
Kong fighting? Kong isn't going to fight, he's older than Garp/Sengoku and even Garp/Sengoku fighting in the war is questionable.
If you're going to use a personal theory to use as an arguement, you're definitely out of things to say. Anyone can make up some theory to try and justify what they say.


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## Gohara (Sep 5, 2014)

EnyawNehc said:


> Shanks didn't force shit but surprise Sakazuki when he saved Coby. Sakazuki isn't stupid enough to fight Shanks after the injuries from WB.



Akainu was otherwise assertive and willing to fight anyone that was there.  Just not Shanks.



EnyawNehc said:


> if you wanna talk about reactions, the mention of Kizaru coming to Saboady made everyone shit themselves.



As I said in another thread, that wasn't really the case with notable characters.  Bonney is the only one who particularly expressed some level of fear.  Drake, without sweating, just stated he didn't intend to run into Kizaru.  However, that's a rather tamed reaction.  Hawkins was right in front of Kizaru with no fear.  Apoo stated he wanted to go to where Kizaru was.

Pre time skip Luffy stood in front of three Admirals at Marineford, and there wasn't much of a reaction to that.  Post time skip Luffy yelled at Big Mam on the phone, and every notable character around panicked.  Even Jinbe was sweating.

Doflamingo has no issue insulting an Admiral to their face and even attacking them, but he's terrified at the idea of Kaidou being angry at him.  Since you're probably going to say it, I may as well say that Fujitora made it clear that he intended to kill Doflamingo, so it doesn't really matter that the latter is a Celestial Dragon in this case.  Furthermore, he would naturally defend himself if Doflamingo attacked him, so Doflamingo would go in knowing that Fujitora isn't going to refrain from killing him.



EnyawNehc said:


> Kong fighting? Kong isn't going to fight, he's older than Garp/Sengoku and even Garp/Sengoku fighting in the war is questionable.



Kong doesn't appear to have aged as much of them in terms of appearance, likely meaning he keeps himself in shape.  That was similar to Sengoku while he was in the marines.  He didn't age like his comrades who took it easier than he did, but once he retired he aged quickly.  I actually do think Garp and Sengoku are going to get involved in the war.  Plus, there's still the Fleet Admiral.



EnyawNehc said:


> If you're going to use a personal theory to use as an arguement, you're definitely out of things to say. Anyone can make up some theory to try and justify what they say.



My apologies for the confusion, but I think you misunderstood.  I had already responded to your point, and noted the theory as a side note.  Also, this is something I've theorized for years.  As I said in my previous post, I don't think the marines as they are stand a chance in the final war even if the Admirals are significantly more powerful than I believe them to be.  Whether they power up as I mentioned in my theory or another way, they're going to have to add to their fire power.


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## trance (Sep 6, 2014)

jackieshann said:


> hancock had no fear attacking aokojii, she had no fear ignoring the summon of the fleet admiral. if anything she's probably stronger than an admiral



Pre-TS Luffy did not fear and attacked all *three* Admirals at once. Conclusion: Pre-TS Luffy > 3 Admirals.

Pre-TS Luffy did not fear Whitebeard and even got snappy with him. Conclusion: Pre-TS Luffy > Whitebeard. 



Anyway, I see no reason to think Hancock can give an Admiral anything more than a slight struggle. She's strong but we're putting her up against one of the most powerful beings alive and someone that had little trouble tangoing with Whitebeard for a limited amount of time.


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## Magician (Sep 6, 2014)

Kiji, low diff.


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## Extravlad (Sep 6, 2014)

> Aokiji high difficulty. Hancock is not as weak as some of you think.


What make you think Hancock is as strong as people like Marco or Rayleigh? Because high difficulty is exactly why they would give to Kuzan.




Kuzan low difficulty, Hancock is featless and hypeless.


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## Dellinger (Sep 6, 2014)

Gohara said:


> Akainu was implied to still have the energy to finish off Aokiji, and we were only given basic information from someone who likely didn't even see the fight.  While I have no problem agreeing they aren't far off in strength, I'm not sold on them being 100% equal either.  Plus, that doesn't encompass Fujitora and Kizaru.  That's just Aokiji.


Who the fuck are you to say that information given by Jinbe isn't real?

Aokiji and Akainu were almost equal in strength,they fought for 10 days,they caused the same damage on the island and both of the suffered grave injuries.

Deal with it.



> Besides that, I don't think pre time skip Akainu is far stronger than Doflamingo.  I personally don't see any Admiral defeating Doflamingo with low difficulty.


He is far stronger.We're talking about the guy who took half of WB's face,a guy that could fight equally with him for quite some time and a guy that made Teach crap his pants.

Doflamingo has nothing on that.





> I disagree that Whitebeard is an outlier, and him besting Admirals isn't the only reason I think that.  Shanks also forced Akainu to stand down, and there have been a handful of confrontations between Admirals and characters below Yonkou level that have been even.  There's also my point on Yonkou getting far bigger reactions than Admirals get.


He never bested the other Admirals.

Akainu only backed down because Sengoku told him to do so.

The Admirals get the same reactions.

The Admirals have stood above anyone they've fought till now except WB.




> They'll have two Fleet Admiral level marines at minimum in Kong and current Akainu.  I believe they are likely the Yonkou equivalent of the marines, with the Admirals being like the Yonkou Commanders.


You're an idiot.

Garp was stronger than Kong back in their prime and I'm sure as hell that if Garp has gotten weaker due to age,the same can be applied to Kong.



> On a personal note, I theorize that Bonney's powers either have been or will be used to turn the Gorosei back into their prime age.  Regardless of who is right about the Admirals' strength, I don't think the marines stand a chance in the final war as they are now.



That's why the marines dominated in the war against WB.


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## Lawliet (Sep 6, 2014)

> Who the fuck are you to say that information given by Jinbe isn't real?



Holy shit  

Calm down


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## trance (Sep 6, 2014)

Roo said:


> Kuzan fight Sakazuki for ten days straight. From a weakling like Doflamingo's point of view, they are exactly equal. Equal in their ability to utterly decimate him. By the way, Sakazuki also took off half of Whitebeard's face. Doflamingo isn't doing so well against Luffy and Law, despite having Trebol with him. Doflamingo is mostly talk.
> 
> Let me put it this way; If Akainu fought Doffy, it would essentially be like Luffy vs Blueno, with Sakazuki taking a win as handily as the former did. Since Kuzan is about equal to Sakazuki, and I (arbitrarily) consider Hancock to be about Doflamingo's level, I call it a low-diff. Same as Luffy vs Blueno.



I agree with this post.

Doffy is a powerful and capable fighter when need be (demonstrated by his ability to casually dismantle Sanji) but it's pretty clear his foremost talents lie in intelligence and deception, relying more on cunning and psychological warfare to gain an advantage rather than overwhelming brute force. Several of his own abilities even center on controlling others and creating third parties to fight in his place, similar to a "puppet master", lending further credence towards his role as a evil mastermind type villain who works behind the scenes and subtly manipulates everything. That's what makes him such a serious and grave threat, supposedly the greatest threat to even Akainu's Marine HQ.


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## Extravlad (Sep 6, 2014)

> Let me put it this way; If Akainu fought Doffy, it would essentially be like Luffy vs Blueno,


More like Luffy vs Bellamy.


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## Ghost (Sep 6, 2014)

Aokiji high end low diff/lower end mid diff.


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## Nox (Sep 6, 2014)

Aoikiji. Mid Difficulty.


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## LyricalMessiah (Sep 6, 2014)

DxM said:


> Aoikiji. Mid Difficulty.



^This. Agreed.


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## Amol (Sep 6, 2014)

Aokiji wins mid diff.
He will require mid diff for DD also .


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## opofft (Sep 6, 2014)

Aokiji low mid diff
Hancock feats are nothing and her hype is also squat.
And flamingo>hancock

*Spoiler*: __ 



and the anime just made her look fodder, but thats filler. and even in canon, she has nothing remotely close to an admiral


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## Suit (Sep 6, 2014)

Extravlad said:


> More like Luffy vs Bellamy.



I don't quite see Doflamingo getting fodder-stomped like that. He'll put up some slight resistance only to lose without ever bringing out an actual fight from Sakazuki.


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## Gohara (Sep 6, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> Who the fuck are you to say that information given by Jinbe isn't real?



That's not quite what I said.  I just said he didn't see the fight, so it's not like we know the exact details of the fight, and thus that doesn't necessarily mean they are 100% equal.

Oda rarely likes to give us a clear answer on who's stronger and pretty much just says "equal" about every comparison- Luffy/Zoro, Ace/Jinbe, Shanks/Mihawk, and even Kaidou/Moriah.



White Hawk said:


> He is far stronger.We're talking about the guy who took half of WB's face,a guy that could fight equally with him for quite some time and a guy that made Teach crap his pants.



None of this suggests pre time skip Akainu is far stronger than Doflamingo, since we have no relative comparison to make.

I also disagree that he fought equally with Whitebeard.  The only two notable blows he got on him were taking advantage of Whitebeard already being down and a desperation blow.  Despite that and getting a lot of help, Whitebeard still bested him overall.



White Hawk said:


> He never bested the other Admirals.



He bested Aokiji and Akainu.  Kizaru he never really fought, but if he can best the other two I see no reason to believe he couldn't have done the same to the other Admirals.



White Hawk said:


> Akainu only backed down because Sengoku told him to do so.



Akainu had backed down before Sengoku agreed to stop the war.  There was time between when Shanks stopped Akainu's attack with one hand and when Sengoku agreed to end the war.



White Hawk said:


> The Admirals get the same reactions.



*Admirals*

-In Aokiji's first appearance, his presence only really scared Skypiea Robin/Chopper/Nami/Usopp.

-During the Sabaody Arc, Sanji stated "If we cross him, then a marine Admiral will come, huh...?" with no look of worry on his face.  Similarly, when Luffy stated that an Admiral's going to come due to him hitting a Celestial Dragon, the Strawhats' responses were:

Zoro: I wanted to slice him up myself.

Nami: Not like it could be helped - he's Luffy, after all!!

Sanji: Now, then...

Franky: Well, I guess that settles our plan for now, then.

None of them looked worried.

Kid and Law were also smiling.  Kid did state that he wasn't going to stick around to fight an Admiral, but he wasn't at all in a state of panic.  He came off more like "Well, I'd rather not have to fight an Admiral, but I'm not scared of them".

Apoo didn't want to run away from Kizaru, and in fact even wanted to attack him.

Hawkins wasn't worried at all about Kizaru.

Drake said "Damn... I never intended to run into Kizaru.", but he wasn't sweating or anything.  Similar to Kid, it came off more as "I'd rather not have fought him, but I'm not terrified of him".

-When Fujitora arrived on Green Bit, Law didn't even react to the fact that an Admiral was confronting him.

-Doflamingo has confronted two Admirals, and wasn't afraid of either.  In fact, he had no problem insulting one of them and attacking him.

Blackbeard is the only relatively strong character who could be argued as an example, but he's also backed down from a Yonkou and showed fear towards Whitebeard during his fight with him.

Other than Blackbeard, the strongest character who has shown fear in particular is pre time skip Bonney.  Even then, she wasn't panicking.

*Yonkou*

-Jinbe was sweating at the idea of Big Mam being angry.  Jinbe wasn't afraid of Akainu.

-Doflamingo was terrified at the idea of Kaidou being angry at him.  Doflamingo has confronted multiple Admirals face to face and shown no fear of them.

-Pre time skip Luffy stood in front of three Admirals and basically dared them to stop him, and there wasn't much of a reaction.  Post time skip Luffy yelled at Big Mam on the phone, and everyone around (including notable characters) panicked.  The members of Big Mam's crew that were there freaked out, including the otherwise calm Tamago.  Jinbe got scared and started sweating.  Neptune was scared to the point that he looked like he had seen a ghost.  Post time skip Usopp, post time skip Chopper, post time skip Franky, and post time skip Brook were scared.  Aside from the major difference in reaction- there are also the huge differences of standing in front of an Admiral while basically daring them to attack you and yelling at a Yonkou over the phone, standing in front of three Admirals while just yelling at one Yonkou over the phone, a significant difference in strength between those who freaked out, and a huge difference in strength between pre time skip Luffy and post time skip Luffy.

-The World Government was freaking out at the idea of two Yonkou even coming within close proximity of one another.

-Marco and Jozu remarked at how "amazing" Shanks' aura was even though Shanks implied he wasn't even trying all that much.  They gave no such compliment towards any of the Admirals.



White Hawk said:


> The Admirals have stood above anyone they've fought till now except WB.



Against opponents that are below Yonkou level:

*Aokiji*

-Ace clashed equally with him.  Ace couldn't even touch Whitebeard while the latter was sleeping.

-Doflamingo had an equal confrontation with him.  He froze Doflamingo from behind, but Doflamingo easily broke out of the ice.  Doflamingo is terrified at the idea of Kaidou being angry at him.

*Kizaru*

-Old Rayleigh fought on par with him.  Kizaru even expressed frustration that he couldn't get past Rayleigh.  Old Rayleigh is only at the level of a Yonkou Division Commander.  So, I don't see any Yonkou being unable to get past him.

-Marco fought on par with him.  Marco is only a Yonkou Division Commander, so I don't see him fighting on par with any Yonkou.

-He surrendered to Beckman.  Kizaru was desperate to capture Luffy at Sabaody, expressing anger when Kuma allowed him to escape.  This was before he even found out about Luffy's heritage.  So, I know the easy reaction is "Kizaru was joking", but I highly doubt that he was given that he legitimately wanted to capture Luffy.  It would be out of character for him to risk letting Luffy escape just for the sake of being sarcastic.  Plus, if he were joking, then he would have immediately attacked Luffy while Beckman was still there.  He waited until Beckman left the area to attack him.  I don't see any Yonkou surrendering to Beckman.

*Fujitora*

-Zoro briefly clashed with him, and wasn't overwhelmed at all.  Neither got the significant upper hand over the other.  I can't see Zoro doing that against any Yonkou.

-Doflamingo's confronted him multiple times.  The first time he destroyed Fujitora's meteors without much of a problem.  The second time he attacked Fujitora with just his foot, causing Fujitora to block it with his sword.  In a non-direct confrontation, Doflamingo's Bird Cage broke up some of Fujitora's meteors.  I can't see Doflamingo even daring to attack Kaidou in a similar situation, let alone casually blocking/destroying his attacks.

-Sabo has, so far, fought equally with Fujitora.  However, we've barely seen any of the fight, so there could be more to it than what we've seen.  Still, I don't see Sabo doing that against any Yonkou.

Akainu's really the only Admiral who's particularly had the upper hand against characters that are below Yonkou level, although the strongest one he's really fought is Ace, who again couldn't even touch Whitebeard while Whitebeard was sleeping.

Replacing Admirals with Yonkou in every scene they've been in seems unrealistic.  I don't see the Yonkou only fighting on par with subordinates of other pirate crews, nor do I see pre time skip Supernovas (maybe other than Luffy) casually going face to face with a Yonkou with no fear.  Not to mention three Yonkou standing anywhere in Marineford at the same time would probably give the World Government a heart attack- let alone if they stood side by side by side in front of Luffy.  On the other hand, I can't see the Admirals replacing the Yonkou with the same reaction.  I don't see Law telling Doflamingo that an Admiral is going to be angry at him, with Doflamingo being terrified (he's directly confronted, insulted, and attacked Admirals multiple times).  I don't see Jinbe being scared at the idea of Luffy yelling at an Admiral over the phone.



White Hawk said:


> Garp was stronger than Kong back in their prime and I'm sure as hell that if Garp has gotten weaker due to age,the same can be applied to Kong.



As I said, Kong seems to be in great shape.  As we saw when he talked to Sengoku and Garp, he's still huge and looks younger than they do.  I think this just represents the difference between more active and less active marines.  Sengoku is around the same age as Garp, but looked significantly younger than him pre time skip while he was still more active.  Yet post time skip, we've seen that Sengoku- who has been relaxing more- has aged and now looks around the same age as Garp.

Garp was a Vice Admiral, so while he might have still been active, he didn't seem as active as Kong and Sengoku are (was in Sengoku's case).



White Hawk said:


> That's why the marines dominated in the war against WB.



I wouldn't say they dominated.  When the prospect of fighting a second Yonkou crew came along, the marines were pretty scared.  Not to mention Garp implied that the marines couldn't take on both Whitebeard and old Rayleigh at the same time.

In the final war- if we include the Revolutionaries, the marines will potentially be facing around 3-4 Yonkou level groups at once.  Not to mention they'll likely be doing this without the Shichibukai and Sengoku/Garp.  If they fight as they are now, I don't see how the marines would stand a chance regardless of who's right about how strong the Admirals are.


----------



## Canute87 (Sep 6, 2014)

And here i thought this was a sex battle and not an actual one


----------



## trance (Sep 7, 2014)

Fucking TL;DRs.


----------



## Daisuke Jigen (Sep 8, 2014)

Aokiji pops her head off...low diff.


Roƅ said:


> Does Hancock want some Ice with that rape?


 


monkey d ace said:


> with aokigi's lazy MS, she might push him to mid diff.




*Spoiler*: __ 



Nope.


----------



## Dellinger (Sep 8, 2014)

Gohara said:


> That's not quite what I said.  I just said he didn't see the fight, so it's not like we know the exact details of the fight, and thus that doesn't necessarily mean they are 100% equal.
> 
> Oda rarely likes to give us a clear answer on who's stronger and pretty much just says "equal" about every comparison- Luffy/Zoro, Ace/Jinbe, Shanks/Mihawk, and even Kaidou/Moriah.


We don't need to know the exact details of the fight to tell that they were dead equal when the fight took place.

Kaido and Moriah were rivals at some point and Kaido destroyed him then so it doesn't matter.

Ace got stronger than Jinbe.

Luffy is always stronger than Zoro.

etc





> None of this suggests pre time skip Akainu is far stronger than Doflamingo, since we have no relative comparison to make.
> 
> I also disagree that he fought equally with Whitebeard.  The only two notable blows he got on him were taking advantage of Whitebeard already being down and a desperation blow.  Despite that and getting a lot of help, Whitebeard still bested him overall.


Unless I see Doflamingo making someone on the same level with Teach crap his pants,it does matter.

He fought equally with him.WB at no point got the upper hand in all of their clashes.






> He bested Aokiji and Akainu.  Kizaru he never really fought, but if he can best the other two I see no reason to believe he couldn't have done the same to the other Admirals.


He never bested Aokiji.Aokiji was actually ready to connect an attack if it wasn't for Jozu.

Kizaru blasted a laser through him while WB did nothing.





> Akainu had backed down before Sengoku agreed to stop the war.  There was time between when Shanks stopped Akainu's attack with one hand and when Sengoku agreed to end the war.



All I saw was Akainu getting pissed at Luffy escaping.



*Admirals*



> -In Aokiji's first appearance, his presence only really scared Skypiea Robin/Chopper/Nami/Usopp.


They were the only people around there 



> snip


The Straw Hats of course wouldn't give a shit,Luffy was challenging WB directly.


> -When Fujitora arrived on Green Bit, Law didn't even react to the fact that an Admiral was confronting him.


Law actually wanted an Admiral to be there in order for the Admiral to deal with Doflamingo.

And he crapped his pants when the meteor came.



> -Doflamingo has confronted two Admirals, and wasn't afraid of either.  In fact, he had no problem insulting one of them and attacking him.


He ran away from the first one and the second one has been fighting casually the whole arc without even getting close to being serious strength wise.



> Blackbeard is the only relatively strong character who could be argued as an example, but he's also backed down from a Yonkou and showed fear towards Whitebeard during his fight with him.


Teach came to kill WB not to run away from him.




> -Jinbe was sweating at the idea of Big Mam being angry.  Jinbe wasn't afraid of Akainu.


Jinbe was afraid because Big Mom wuld obliterate Fishman Island.

Jinbe run away from Akainu.



> -Doflamingo was terrified at the idea of Kaidou being angry at him.  Doflamingo has confronted multiple Admirals face to face and shown no fear of them.


Of course because his status doesn't protect him from a Yonko.



> -The World Government was freaking out at the idea of two Yonkou even coming within close proximity of one another.


They're the strongest pirates,of course they would freak out.



> -Marco and Jozu remarked at how "amazing" Shanks' aura was even though Shanks implied he wasn't even trying all that much.  They gave no such compliment towards any of the Admirals.


The Admirals didn't give a darn about WB's strength,does that mean WB is weak?





> -Ace clashed equally with him.  Ace couldn't even touch Whitebeard while the latter was sleeping.


Ace only cancelled an attack.And that doesn't matter because Aokiji is equal to a man that treated Ace like shit.Imagine if Aokiji was serious about it.

You mean a rookie Ace couldn't touch WB at his sleep.



> -Doflamingo had an equal confrontation with him.  He froze Doflamingo from behind, but Doflamingo easily broke out of the ice.  Doflamingo is terrified at the idea of Kaidou being angry at him.


>Aokiji had his hands in his pockets.

>Doflamingo was panting like ass.

>Buffalo commented that Doflamingo was lucky to not get his heart frozen.

Equal my ass.




> Old Rayleigh fought on par with him.  Kizaru even expressed frustration that he couldn't get past Rayleigh.  Old Rayleigh is only at the level of a Yonkou Division Commander.  So, I don't see any Yonkou being unable to get past him.


Actually Kizaru was impressed that Rayleigh could still do that much.Not to mention that Kizaru fought with a sword which is not his main fighting style.



> Marco fought on par with him.  Marco is only a Yonkou Division Commander, so I don't see him fighting on par with any Yonkou.


Marco would easily fight on par for some time with a Yonko.The guy has immense hype.



> He surrendered to Beckman.  Kizaru was desperate to capture Luffy at Sabaody, expressing anger when Kuma allowed him to escape.  This was before he even found out about Luffy's heritage.  So, I know the easy reaction is "Kizaru was joking", but I highly doubt that he was given that he legitimately wanted to capture Luffy.  It would be out of character for him to risk letting Luffy escape just for the sake of being sarcastic.  Plus, if he were joking, then he would have immediately attacked Luffy while Beckman was still there.  He waited until Beckman left the area to attack him.  I don't see any Yonkou surrendering to Beckman.


Kizaru didn't give a damn,he attacked the next moment.And yeah Kizaru was joking.He always does that.

*Fujitora*



> Zoro briefly clashed with him, and wasn't overwhelmed at all.  Neither got the significant upper hand over the other.  I can't see Zoro doing that against any Yonkou.


>Zoro is bleeding and sweating bullocks

>Zoro is in a hole

>Wasn't overwhelmed



> -Doflamingo's confronted him multiple times.  The first time he destroyed Fujitora's meteors without much of a problem.  The second time he attacked Fujitora with just his foot, causing Fujitora to block it with his sword.  In a non-direct confrontation, Doflamingo's Bird Cage broke up some of Fujitora's meteors.  I can't see Doflamingo even daring to attack Kaidou in a similar situation, let alone casually blocking/destroying his attacks.


Fujitora hasn't used his full strength and Doflamingo crapped his pants when he saw the meteor which doesn't even come close to the other ones in size.

You have seen what a kick attack from Doflamingo can do yet Fujitora easily stopped that attack.




> -Sabo has, so far, fought equally with Fujitora.  However, we've barely seen any of the fight, so there could be more to it than what we've seen.  Still, I don't see Sabo doing that against any Yonkou.


Sabo himself stated that Fujitora hasn't gotten any serious and he was panting.Not to mention that Sabo has been attacking all time and yet Fujitora is completely fine.



> Akainu's really the only Admiral who's particularly had the upper hand against characters that are below Yonkou level, although the strongest one he's really fought is Ace, who again couldn't even touch Whitebeard while Whitebeard was sleeping.


Teach who is stronger than Ace crapped his pants with his entire crew being at his side.

Marco and Vista couldn't even touch him.

He basically killed WB with that last attack.



> snip


You clearly can't even tell the difference between the Admirals and the Yonko.




> As I said, Kong seems to be in great shape.  As we saw when he talked to Sengoku and Garp, he's still huge and looks younger than they do.  I think this just represents the difference between more active and less active marines.  Sengoku is around the same age as Garp, but looked significantly younger than him pre time skip while he was still more active.  Yet post time skip, we've seen that Sengoku- who has been relaxing more- has aged and now looks around the same age as Garp.


What kind of logic is this?

WB was still huge,does that mean he was as strong as his prime?And in no way Kong is stronger than Garp,the strongest marine of all time.




> I wouldn't say they dominated.  When the prospect of fighting a second Yonkou crew came along, the marines were pretty scared.  Not to mention Garp implied that the marines couldn't take on both Whitebeard and old Rayleigh at the same time.



They dominated.

WB and Ace got killed,the majority of the WB alliance got wrecked and the Admirals were just fine without even going all out.


----------



## Dellinger (Sep 8, 2014)

Long story short,I won't reply again to you because you post long textes and half of them aren't even worthy of arguing about.


----------



## RF (Sep 8, 2014)

Aokiji crushes her.


----------



## Peppoko (Sep 8, 2014)

While most people disagree, I'd still go for Aokiji high-diff.

Hancock is a wild card so far, given that she never fought an opponent even near admiral level. But she basically has everything a strong fighter in One Piece needs.

- strong portrayal (hasn't been hit once so far)
- hax devil fruit
- all three types of haki
- strong physical power


----------



## trance (Sep 8, 2014)

White Hawk soloing this thread.


----------



## LyricalMessiah (Sep 8, 2014)

Peppoko said:


> While most people disagree, I'd still go for Aokiji high-diff.
> 
> Hancock is a wild card so far, given that she never fought an opponent even near admiral level. But she basically has everything a strong fighter in One Piece needs.
> 
> ...



I agree with this, except for the "high difficulty" thing. I think he beats her with with medium end of medium difficulty.


I just find it ridiculous when I see people see that he beats her low difficulty as if she were a fodder.


----------



## Extravlad (Sep 8, 2014)

Hancock is weak, fillers may not be canon but you're never gonna see Toei using toptiers characters as fodders to hype a shitty villain like Burndy World.


----------



## Gohara (Sep 8, 2014)

White Hawk said:


> We don't need to know the exact details of the fight to tell that they were dead equal when the fight took place.



I disagree.  Without the exact details, it could range anywhere from Akainu having a hard time to Akainu almost being dead and not even being able to move (although what Jinbe said implied that he was still able to move okay).



White Hawk said:


> Kaido and Moriah were rivals at some point and Kaido destroyed him then so it doesn't matter.



They were stated to be on par with one another, even though I think we can both agree that Moriah wasn't even close to Kaidou's league.



White Hawk said:


> Ace got stronger than Jinbe.



Maybe, but it still stands as an example of my point.



White Hawk said:


> Luffy is always stronger than Zoro.



I agree that he has been for most of the series, but Oda never answers which of the two is stronger.  He usually either gives vague answers or says they're equal.



White Hawk said:


> Unless I see Doflamingo making someone on the same level with Teach crap his pants,it does matter.



If there are no relative comparisons to make, it doesn't tell us that pre time skip Akainu is far stronger than him.



White Hawk said:


> He fought equally with him.WB at no point got the upper hand in all of their clashes.



Whitebeard overwhelmed him upon going all out and in the fight that was between them specifically, Whitebeard was the last man standing.  Akainu was knocked to the ground and through a hole, and didn't reemerge until Whitebeard was already killed by the Blackbeard Pirates.  Akainu also had a lot of help against old/sick Whitebeard.



White Hawk said:


> He never bested Aokiji.Aokiji was actually ready to connect an attack if it wasn't for Jozu.



In their first encounter, Whitebeard smashed Aokiji into the ground.  Aokiji didn't do anything to Whitebeard in return.  In their second encounter, Whitebeard easily  broke out of Aokiji's ice and then stabbed him.  Their encounter ended after that.



White Hawk said:


> Kizaru blasted a laser through him while WB did nothing.



They never really fought.  Whitebeard reached out just to prevent Kizaru from going to where Luffy was, which gave Kizaru an advantageous position and then shot him with his laser.



White Hawk said:


> All I saw was Akainu getting pissed at Luffy escaping.



He didn't do anything between when Shanks blocked his blow with one hand and when Sengoku stopped the war.

If we're going to compare Akainu to Shanks, I would also mention that the latter was able to split the sky when clashing with Whitebeard.  Akainu wasn't able to do the same.



White Hawk said:


> They were the only people around there



Except for the rest of the crew.  



White Hawk said:


> The Straw Hats of course wouldn't give a shit,Luffy was challenging WB directly.



That's Luffy.  Not the rest of the Strawhats.



White Hawk said:


> Law actually wanted an Admiral to be there in order for the Admiral to deal with Doflamingo



Law lacked a reaction when it was made clear that Fujitora was going after him instead.



White Hawk said:


> And he crapped his pants when the meteor came.



Then he destroyed it.



White Hawk said:


> He ran away from the first one and the second one has been fighting casually the whole arc without even getting close to being serious strength wise.



As I said, even if he's stronger than Aokiji, it wouldn't make sense for him to fight him at that point in time.  Doing so would defeat the purpose of him going there in the first place, and would also allow the Strawhats and Law to get a huge jump on him.  Even if he's stronger than Aokiji, it would be completely detrimental to Doflamingo to fight him.  Hence, that doesn't prove he was afraid of Aokiji.  On the contrary, he ignored Aokiji's request and easily broke out of his ice, while laughing the whole time.  He didn't even show slight fear, much less the level of fear he showed just at the idea of Kaidou being angry at him.

As for Fujitora, how much of his own power he's used so far in this Arc doesn't have much to do with Doflamingo's confrontations with him.  In their first confrontation as well as their indirect one, Doflamingo wasn't stated or implied to have been using any more of his own power than Fujitora was his.  In their second confrontation, Doflamingo would know that Fujitora would be capable of using his full power.



White Hawk said:


> Teach came to kill WB not to run away from him.



I was talking about him backing down from Shanks, but as I said he did show fear towards Whitebeard as well.



White Hawk said:


> Jinbe was afraid because Big Mom wuld obliterate Fishman Island.



This isn't much different than just being afraid of a Yonkou being mad at him, since he would be faced with the idea of fighting a Yonkou either way.



White Hawk said:


> Jinbe run away from Akainu.



He was holding Luffy in his arms and trying to protect him from taking more damage.  He didn't really show any fear towards Akainu.



White Hawk said:


> Of course because his status doesn't protect him from a Yonko.



As I said, Fujitora had made it clear to Doflamingo that he intended to kill him.  Furthermore, Fujitora would naturally go all out to defend himself if he had to.  So, Doflamingo's status isn't really relevant here.

Aokiji is no longer a marine, so Doflamingo's status isn't really relevant here either.



White Hawk said:


> They're the strongest pirates,of course they would freak out.



No Admiral has gotten that level of reaction.



White Hawk said:


> The Admirals didn't give a darn about WB's strength,does that mean WB is weak?



This doesn't serve as a relative comparison, since you're not comparing it to how they reacted towards another character.  I brought up two comparisons that are relative to one another- how Marco and Jozu reacted to Shanks' level of power and how they reacted to the Admirals' level of power.


----------



## Gohara (Sep 8, 2014)

My apologies for the double post, but it wouldn't fit in one post.  



White Hawk said:


> Ace only cancelled an attack.And that doesn't matter because Aokiji is equal to a man that treated Ace like shit.Imagine if Aokiji was serious about it.



There's nothing suggesting Aokiji was any less serious about it than Ace was.  As for Aokiji being 100% equal to Akainu, read the top of my post.



White Hawk said:


> Aokiji had his hands in his pockets.



I'm unsure of what your point is here.  Aokiji can create ice either way.



White Hawk said:


> Doflamingo was panting like ass.



Ice is freezing cold, so that would be common for almost any character.  Besides, he was only frozen because Aokiji attacked him from behind.  Doflamingo easily broke out of the ice and was smiling.



White Hawk said:


> Buffalo commented that Doflamingo was lucky to not get his heart frozen.



I'm not sure this means what you think it means.  It doesn't speak of a distinction between Aokiji's attacks, and Buffalo would likely have no way of knowing if Doflamingo's heart was frozen or not.  Besides, even if I agreed with you here, Buffalo said it wasn't frozen "yet"- it wasn't frozen "yet" because Doflamingo broke out of the ice quickly and with ease.



White Hawk said:


> Equal my ass.



Neither damaged the other.  Aokiji froze him from behind, and Doflamingo broke out easily.



White Hawk said:


> Actually Kizaru was impressed that Rayleigh could still do that much.



Maybe, but he still basically admitted that he couldn't get past old Rayleigh.



White Hawk said:


> Not to mention that Kizaru fought with a sword which is not his main fighting style.



He uses light based abilities.  A light based sword is still using his special abilities.



White Hawk said:


> Marco would easily fight on par for some time with a Yonko.The guy has immense hype.



How do you figure that?  Especially the "easily" part?



White Hawk said:


> Kizaru didn't give a damn,he attacked the next moment.



He didn't attack immediately afterwards.  He gave Luffy extra time to escape, and then attacked after Beckman had left the area.  I don't see why Kizaru would do that when he's desperate to capture Luffy, if he wasn't legitimately worried about Beckman.



White Hawk said:


> >Zoro is bleeding and sweating bullocks
> 
> >Zoro is in a hole
> 
> >Wasn't overwhelmed



Fujitora surprise attacked him, which Zoro was able to parry or at least hold him off.  Fujitora then used his gravity powers, which is when he started to get the upper hand (not the significant upper hand though).  Zoro then sent a flying slash at him, which Fujitora said was brutal.



White Hawk said:


> Fujitora hasn't used his full strength



Neither has Doflamingo.



White Hawk said:


> Doflamingo crapped his pants when he saw the meteor



Not really.  He was just angry that Fujitora was sending a meteor down to an island right next to Dressrosa.  He destroyed the meteor without much of a problem.  His Bird Cage technique has also broken up some of Fujitora's other meteors.



White Hawk said:


> You have seen what a kick attack from Doflamingo can do yet Fujitora easily stopped that attack.



Fujitora used his sword, holding back his Devil Fruit powers.  Doflamingo only used his foot, holding back his Devil Fruit powers.  Doflamingo only used one small part of his body- Fujitora used his weapon.  Even if Doflamingo's kicks are really powerful, there's still a difference there.



White Hawk said:


> Sabo himself stated that Fujitora hasn't gotten any serious and he was panting.Not to mention that Sabo has been attacking all time and yet Fujitora is completely fine.



How serious Fujitora was getting when we last saw him is what Sabo said he needs him to be.  Fujitora hadn't gone all out prior to what we saw on panel, but it's very possible- if not likely- that Sabo hadn't either.

We don't know that Fujitora has gone the whole fight free of panting, nor do we know that Sabo has been the only one attacking the whole fight.



White Hawk said:


> Teach who is stronger than Ace crapped his pants with his entire crew being at his side.
> 
> Marco and Vista couldn't even touch him.



He didn't really fight any of them.



White Hawk said:


> He basically killed WB with that last attack.



Not really.  Whitebeard still took quite a bit of damage after that and still hadn't died yet.



White Hawk said:


> You clearly can't even tell the difference between the Admirals and the Yonko.



You didn't really respond to any of my points here.  Other than that, this is just you basically saying you disagree with me, which doesn't tell me much.



White Hawk said:


> WB was still huge,does that mean he was as strong as his prime?And in no way Kong is stronger than Garp,the strongest marine of all time.



Kong isn't sick from what we've seen.

Garp likely lost strength due to the aging his body has undergone.



White Hawk said:


> They dominated.
> 
> WB and Ace got killed,the majority of the WB alliance got wrecked and the Admirals were just fine without even going all out.



Marco and Jozu were only down and out (only temporarily in Marco's case) due to surprise attacks.  Other than that they were okay, and the rest of the significant characters in the Whitebeard Pirates and their alliance were relatively okay as well.

Akainu also used trickery to lure Ace into doing what he did anyways.  Had Ace just kept going, the Whitebeard Pirates technically win that war.  The marines didn't kill Whitebeard by themselves, and it took a huge combination of marines and trickery to deal as much damage to him as they did in the first place.  The Blackbeard Pirates are the ones that killed Whitebeard.

Garp implied that they wouldn't want to take on both the Whitebeard Pirates and old Rayleigh at the same time.  If they were really that dominant over the Whitebeard Pirates, I don't see how one Yonkou subordinate level character would be enough to make that much of a difference.  Not to mention they didn't want to fight two Yonkou crews consecutively.  If they aren't confident that they can defeat two Yonkou crews consecutively (let alone at the same time), then there's no way they can take on 3-4 Yonkou crews at once as they are now.


----------



## Dellinger (Sep 8, 2014)

> Long story short,I won't reply again to you because you post long textes and half of them aren't even worthy of arguing about.



                 .


----------



## Gohara (Sep 8, 2014)

Ah, I see.  Well, fair enough then.  I respect your views either way.


----------



## trance (Sep 8, 2014)

> If we're going to compare Akainu to Shanks, I would also mention that the latter was able to split the sky when clashing with Whitebeard.  Akainu wasn't able to do the same.



Seemingly, it was an effect of their Haoshoku Haki clashing. Their wills were equal but not _necessarily_ their strength. Luffy and Chinjao's Haoshoku Haki clash had a similar effect (albeit, on a smaller scale) yet Luffy ended up beating Chinjao without being pushed to his limit. 

Not to mention that Newgate didn't even use his DF.


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## Gohara (Sep 8, 2014)

Well, I'm not saying that means Luffy was equal to Chinjao.  Just that Shanks did something Akainu didn't.


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## Luke (Sep 8, 2014)

Issho D Tea said:


> Why has this advice not been heeded?



Dude you're a good poster but telling another poster to leave just because you tend to disagree with them is extremely childish.


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## Gohara (Sep 8, 2014)

Thanks Luke, but it's all jiggy.  Debates can get heated.  I still respect everyone's views on the matter.


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## Lyren (Oct 28, 2019)

This is a tough match and it could go either way. The characters of Hancock, doffy, weevil can't be one shotted by someone unless it is a yonko.
If Hancock showed no fear going against Aokiji, she is not fodder to him. Either winner of them push the other to high difficulty.
Being a shichibukai doesnt mean you are weaker than an Admiral, the shichibukai are on par with Yonko commanders no context, who themselves are on par with Admirals.


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