# Was Prime Garp PK-tier (Roger/Primebeard) in power ?



## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 9, 2019)

vote


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## trance (Dec 9, 2019)

yes

Reactions: Like 2


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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 9, 2019)

@Amol @Freechoice @Gledania

Reactions: Like 1


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## Louis-954 (Dec 9, 2019)

Yeah, most likely. It's pretty crazy when you think about it too. He was at their level without the use of weapons or Devil Fruit abilities.

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## GreenBull956 (Dec 9, 2019)

Yes i think .... he nearly killed Roger several times ( based on Japanese text ) , plus with God Valley battle he has portrayal advantage over Rayleigh ( who is the same age as him , and wasn't even mentioned or showed ) and Shiki ( who was kinda sidelined compared to Whitebeard Big Mom Kaido , tho maybe Shiki wasn't in his prime at that time )

Shiki is too irrelevant anyway to be put over Garp imo , let the guy shows up again in Manga first then it'll be more debatable if he was/is above Garp

Reactions: Like 2


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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 9, 2019)

i am 99% sure Prime Shiki is weaker than Kaido and Oldbeard


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## RossellaFiamingo (Dec 9, 2019)

No such level exists. He loses to BM and Kaido. Maybe even Shiki...

Reactions: Like 1


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## Corax (Dec 9, 2019)

It is obvious. He defeated the strongest and most famous pirate of his era. Term PK didn't exist at that time,but Rocks was PK of his age.

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## Raiden34 (Dec 9, 2019)

Well, Roger's crew member Buggy said ''only'' WB was able to fight equally with Roger.


*Spoiler*: __ 









Shiki said to the marines that they are scums and they were not strong enough to capture Roger,


*Spoiler*: __ 









Shiki later said that after Roger's death, now it's time for WB's age.


*Spoiler*: __ 









WB has been declared as WSM after Roger's death and Garp was still alive.


*Spoiler*: __ 









E.Oda used Kaido as strongest thing alive while the question asks about Akainu, instead of using Garp, E.Oda uses Kaido to define the strongest thing in One Piece.


*Spoiler*: __ 




*



			D: ''Odacchi!! In the sbs from volume 82 you told us how to escape from Akainu, bears, ghosts and the like. But when I try to do this before my angered mother I'm just beaten up... Is my mother stronger than Akainu?'' P.N. Star Fairy

Oda: ''You better watch out! you're being too brash! A mother is the strongest living being in the world, even stronger than Kaido!! Don't you dare do it again! But, you know, your mother loves you more than anyone else.''
--- SBS Volume 83
		
Click to expand...

*




Fleet Admiral Sengoku + Garp failed to capture or stop MF Blackbeard.


*Spoiler*: __ 









Etc. So Garp's portrayal is definitely not equal to Prime Roger / WB.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 9, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> Well, Roger's crew member Buggy said ''only'' WB was able to fight equally with Roger.
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...


god valley

Reactions: Like 2


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## RossellaFiamingo (Dec 9, 2019)

Shiba D. Inu said:


> god valley


Yet he needed Rogers help. Note how Sengoku called Xebec Rogers foe rather than Gaaaps foe. Garp is below multiple figures on an all time list.

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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 9, 2019)

RossellaFiamingo said:


> Yet he needed Rogers help.


yes, against _Rocks, WB, BM, Kaido_, Shiki, John etc.



how do we smite the GARP non-believers ?

Reactions: Like 3


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## RossellaFiamingo (Dec 9, 2019)

Shiba D. Inu said:


> yes, against _Rocks, WB, BM, Kaido_, Shiki, John etc.


Other Marines were there. Ray and Roger's crew were also there. And those characters weren't in their prime. Roger and co have at around 10 years on the likes of BM and Kaido.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 9, 2019)

RossellaFiamingo said:


> Other Marines


who ? VAs ?




RossellaFiamingo said:


> And those characters weren't in their prime. Roger and co have at around 10 years on the likes of BM and Kaido.


WB is same age as Garp and Roger (so is Shiki ?)
we dont even know *when* BMs prime is, she was already a monster at 5 (and isnt she 68 atm ? thats pretty close to the 70+ of Garp and WB)
Kaido I give you


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## RossellaFiamingo (Dec 9, 2019)

Shiba D. Inu said:


> how do we smite the GARP non-believers ?


I have prime Garp High diffing any of the current Admirals. He is for sure Yonko Level but he isn't beating a hand full of characters. At least on my tier list.

Roger~WB>=BM~Kaido>=Garp~Shanks

Every fight here requires Extreme Diff. Some Higher and Lower than others. For example, Garp likely loses 8/10 against Roger and Beard  While BM and Kaido lose 6-7 out of 10.


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## Raiden34 (Dec 9, 2019)

RossellaFiamingo said:


> Yet he needed Rogers help. Note how Sengoku called Xebec Rogers foe rather than Gaaaps foe. Garp is below multiple figures on an all time list.


The more important thing is we don't know how Xebec has been defeated. It could be a betrayal like Squardo's. WB also implied that when he refused Oden,


*Spoiler*: __ 









He implied that with crazy people like Kaido and Big mom his former crew had big issues. And the WG tried to cover Roger's success and they tried to show Garp as the only participant of that fight.

Which is why Garp doesn't like to talk about that;


*Spoiler*: __ 









Roger was never reported;


*Spoiler*: __ 









Which is why they called him Hero for that reason, if the world knew about Roger's involvement, they probably wouldn't call him that.

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## Corax (Dec 9, 2019)

RossellaFiamingo said:


> Other Marines were there. Ray and Roger's crew were also there. And those characters weren't in their prime. Roger and co have at around 10 years on the likes of BM and Kaido.


No marines of note were at his side. It was a secret operation. Though Roger and Ray together likely were strong to take on
WB,BM,Kaido,Shiki,John,Silver Axe,Ochoko. But this still leaves big bad cap Rocks vs Garp. And Garp won.

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## Ruse (Dec 9, 2019)

I think he was on their general level just a bit weaker


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## Raiden34 (Dec 9, 2019)

Corax said:


> But this still leaves big bad cap Rocks vs Garp. And Garp won.


Sengoku said that Xebec was Roger's most formidable rival, not Garp's.


*Spoiler*: __

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## Quipchaque (Dec 9, 2019)

Shiba D. Inu said:


> yes, against _Rocks, WB, BM, Kaido_, Shiki, John etc.
> 
> 
> 
> how do we smite the GARP non-believers ?



Dude Noone but you takes that God valley incident serious. According to your own logic since titles are absolute for you 

Kaido>Roger~Whitebeard>Garp>>Whitebeard

That makes no sense which is why noone will buy into that.

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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

Let's see:


Marine Rival of Roger
Had multiple encounters with the PK without losing but more importantly cornering him
Hero of the Marines
Destroyed Rocks Pirates (Rocks captain, WB, Kaido, Meme) together with Roger doing at least 50% of the work
Was entrusted by the PK to raise his son instead of Rayleigh or WB
Was known as the devil amongst pirates
Crushed mountains as training
Passed down his monstrous genes to Luffy
Anyone who denies he has CoC is in for a bad awakening 
Came so far with only Haki and physical stats

If that doesn't translates to being PK tier then sure as hell no one else deserves to be anywhere close to it.

Reactions: Like 7


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## Gianfi (Dec 9, 2019)

He was probably around Aokiji/Akainu level. WB and Xebec have been implied to be Roger’s most formidable foes, not Garp or Sengoku

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## Freechoice (Dec 9, 2019)

Let's all just agree that anyone that votes no is a big goofball and should be ignored from now on

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## Geralt-Singh (Dec 9, 2019)

Ofc, he's a member of the "God tier" quartet : Roger / Rocks / Prime WB / Prime Garp

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## Amol (Dec 9, 2019)

Yes he was. 
Anybody who is saying no is reading different manga and should be ignored. 
He has so many parallels with both Roger and Luffy. He is basically Marine! Luffy. 
Roger himself thought Garp raising Ace is exactly same as Roger raising him. I am gonna take Main Man's words over some clown's. I mean Buggy also never mentioned Rocks and yet we know he was Roger's greatest rival. So let's not pay too much attention to Buggy. He is unreliable narrator. 
Frankly Marine having at least one guy who is that strong should be expected when pirates has two.

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## Quipchaque (Dec 9, 2019)

Shiba D. Inu said:


>



So you are laughing at your own logic being used against you. Well that is good to know.

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## Daisuke Jigen (Dec 9, 2019)

RossellaFiamingo said:


> No such level exists. He loses to BM and Kaido. Maybe even Shiki...


 
OT: of course he was.

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## Raiden34 (Dec 9, 2019)

Buggy didn't give the title to WB. People did.

WB > Garp, there is no doubt about that. Sengoku, Shiki, basically every legends accepted that. Even Garp called WB as ''king of the seas''


*Spoiler*: __ 









If Garp was very close to WB, no one would say WB was the strongest man. Plain and simple.

WB and Roger > Garp.

As for Xebec fight,

1- They called Garp as hero, because World Government covered up Roger and his crew.
2- Only Xebec was defeated, but not WB, Kaido and Big mom, they continued and they become Yonko. And they said WB & Roger > Garp.
3- Xebec possibly defeated by Roger, not Garp, because Sengoku said Xebec was Roger's most formidable rival, not Garp's.
4- Garp probably held back the rest of Xebec's crew with the help of Silvers Rayleigh and Scopper Gaban, that was possible because Kaido and Big mom were no where near close to Yonko level at that time as Sengoku said. He said Kaido and Big mom are now much stronger than they were 38 years ago.

In the end, Garp's ''hero'' title is based on world government's cover, and it's because no one knew anything about Roger's involvement in that incident.

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## Intus Legere (Dec 9, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> Sengoku said that Xebec was Roger's most formidable rival, not Garp's.
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __



How would Garp be a rival to Rogers? A rival is a person who competes "for the same thing or in the same area", and Garp isn't a pirate, so of course he isn't a proper rival.

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## Ruse (Dec 9, 2019)

Grinningfox said:


> Lots of Garp dicksucking going on



you’re goddamn right


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## Raiden34 (Dec 9, 2019)

Intus Legere said:


> How would Garp be a rival to Rogers? A rival is a person who competes "for the same thing or in the same area", and Garp isn't a pirate, so of course he isn't a proper rival.


True. The point is Roger definitely fought against Xebec, otherwise saying that he was his most formidable opponent wouldn't make sense.
Garp's goal was saving the Celestial and their slaves. While Roger's goal was defeating his most formidable opponent.


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## Fel1x (Dec 9, 2019)

Prime Garp is already strongest Marine ever. but now you want him to be equal to Pirate King. "you can't always get what you want"

P Garp would lose 1 on 1 fight to the death against Roger or WB. But he is strong enough to break all their plans if it is necessary

that means P Garp would give them highest end of extreme diff but would lose. and both Roger and WB would be in near death state after their win

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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 9, 2019)

Fel1x said:


> Prime Garp is already strongest Marine ever. but now you want him to be equal to Pirate King. "you can't always get what you want"
> 
> P Garp would lose 1 on 1 fight to the death against Roger or WB. But he is strong enough to break all their plans if it is necessary
> 
> that means P Garp would give them highest end of extreme diff but would lose. and both Roger and WB would be in near death state after their win


even that means he is PK-tier

but after god valley he is likely Rogers equal tbh


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## Kinjin (Dec 9, 2019)

Oh god, this thread reminds me of @Gledania's hot take.


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## CaptainCommander (Dec 9, 2019)

Roger extreme diffs Garp, Garp smites Whitebeard, and Buggy's loyal minions continue to believe the gospel coming out of his mouth.


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## Lyren (Dec 9, 2019)

Why is this even being debated ? 
It is said that he cornered Roger many times and the latter himself admitted equality to garp by saying they nearly killed each others in their encounters, this is enough proof for Garp to be as strong as Roger and Newgate

And who wouldnt need help when he is up against Kaido Bm Rocks WB and who knows how many other powerful figures ? Even solo roger would lose to them

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## oiety (Dec 9, 2019)

Rocks~Roger~Garp~Whitebeard>everyone else assuming primes


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

not their exact equal but he was on that general level.


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## Proseph (Dec 9, 2019)

He was in the same tier ("PK-tier") but not exactly as strong. Prime Whitebeard should've at least been very slightly stronger what with being the world's strongest and all. Roger could've been equal to either Prime Garp or Prime Whitebeard. Perhaps slightly stronger than Prime Whitebeard even although I seriously doubt that would ever be confirmed.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

Of the things Garp achieved?

He was legit PK tier together with Roger and WB, the only other people that will reach that level are Luffy and possibly BB/Akainu/IM.

Where is the actual evidence that Garp was below Roger and Primebeard?


*Edit:* _I added a poll on top of the discussion feel free to vote. _

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## Djomla (Dec 9, 2019)

Because people like Emperors more than Admirals.

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## Lawliet (Dec 9, 2019)

Yeah Garp was there with Roger and WB. Many people can achieve that level per generation. 

The old generation had Roger, Garp WB, rayleigh and I think big mom

This generation has Kaidou, Shanks, Akainu Mihawk, and Oden if he didn't die.

Next generation is going to have Luffy, Teach, Kid, Zoro, law if he doesn't die and Sanji.

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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

Edward Teach said:


> Yeah Garp was there with Roger and WB. Many people can achieve that level per generation.
> 
> The old generation had Roger, Garp WB, *rayleigh and I think big mom
> 
> ...



Thos guys are PK level? Based on what?


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## Lawliet (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Thos guys are PK level? Based on what?


I don't see PK level as this entity above everyone. In 1 vs 1 one, Roger might and will probably win, but any of those will give him a run for his money I think. So they're more or less on his level. 

What made him PK are different things, among them is his strength of course. 

I think Luffy will succeed where people like Roger and Oden failed to do something about the world is.. Luffy will have the mightiest army in comparison to Roger and Oden. That includes his allies and his own crew. Prime Zoro and Sanji would easily be the yonkou of the future if that system were to exist and they wished it.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

Edward Teach said:


> I don't see PK level as this entity above everyone. In 1 vs 1 one, Roger might and will probably win, but any of those will give him a run for his money I think. So they're more or less on his level.
> 
> What made him PK are different things, among them is his strength of course.
> 
> I think Luffy will succeed where people like Roger and Oden failed to do something about the world is.. Luffy will have the mightiest army in comparison to Roger and Oden. That includes his allies and his own crew. Prime Zoro and Sanji would easily be the yonkou of the future if that system were to exist and they wished it.



There is not much supporting your view. The Yonkou admit they want to become PK but can't reach that goal. View WB as someone superior to them despite him not being interested in the One Piece. They have huge armies and allies and still struggle not even able to take over other territories.

Not to mention that narration puts the PK above the yonkou multiple times, be it by storytelling, character statements or other hype sources.

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## bil02 (Dec 9, 2019)

Didn't garp still need to train 2 years After god Valley to smash chinjao's head ?
So either chinjao was that strong in his prime (and should be given credit for that) or garp was not that strong during god Valley incident and just took credit for Roger pirates accomplishments in that incident .
My answer is prime garp is not different from current yonkou powerwise so should be able to give extreme diff to wb and roger since i don't beleive in pk level tier.

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## Red Admiral (Dec 9, 2019)

so it's a tricky one cause PK level meaningless to me ,for me all 4 Yonko are capable of giving Roger or Primebeard a death fight

so assuming by PK level you means highest class of known power , then no, so far only 2 people have been there and 2 people alone , no room for 3rd or 4th


sure .... Roger , Primebeard , Garp and Rox are arguably the strongest known people yet even above the Yonko!


but ... Garp and Sengoku both call Whitebeard the strongest man ... so in their mind , the gap is not close to zero


now where Rox stand? not sure



any way ....

Garp is 4th strongest know person
Garp is capable of giving a death fight to Kings
Garp is not equal to Roger and Prime Beard



bil02 said:


> Didn't garp still need to train 2 years After god Valley to smash chinjao's head ?
> So either chinjao was that strong in his prime (and should be given credit for that) or garp was not that strong during god Valley incident and just took credit for Roger pirates accomplishments in that incident .
> My answer is prime garp is not different from current yonkou powerwise so should be able to give extreme diff to wb and roger since i don't beleive in pk level tier.



what Garp needed was a warm up


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## Lawliet (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> There is not much supporting your view. The Yonkou admit they want to become PK but can't reach that goal. View WB as someone superior to them despite him not being interested in the One Piece. They have huge armies and allies and still struggle not even able to take over other territories.
> 
> Not to mention that narration puts the PK above the yonkou multiple times, be it by storytelling, character statements or other hype sources.


Like I said, Roger would probably win in any fight (except maybe kaidou cause that's just how it is for me right now)..

They don't wanna be PK to be individually the strongest. Non of them would back down if they faced Roger. They're all just like that and they can prove it with their strength. 

Roger got more than individual strength.


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## Steven (Dec 9, 2019)

Roger would High-diff any Yonkou

Neither Kaido,neither BM nor Shanks was able to surpass WB and Old WB<Primebeard<~Roger.PK is Endgamestuff and not some Pre-final arc thing


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

buggy said whitebeard was the only person who tied roger in a fight and never mentioned garp.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

Edward Teach said:


> Like I said, Roger would probably win in any fight (except maybe kaidou cause that's just how it is for me right now)..
> 
> They don't wanna be PK to be individually the strongest. Non of them would back down if they faced Roger. They're all just like that and they can prove it with their strength.
> 
> Roger got more than individual strength.



Roger is the ultimate pirate, the man with the most freedom. You know who else is a pirate? Kaido. Roger would beat Kaido 10/10 times.



MO said:


> buggy said whitebeard was the only person who tied roger in a fight and never mentioned garp.


 
Good thing there are more reliable characters like the PK himself who acknowledges Garp and shits on Buggy.


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Good thing there are more reliable characters like the PK himself who acknowledges Garp and shits on Buggy.


I mean buggy was there on the ship so he saw roger get "cornered" and still said whitebeard was the only person to ever tie roger.

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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

MO said:


> I mean buggy was there on the ship so he saw roger get "cornered" and still said whitebeard was the only person to ever tie roger.



And i mean Roger who fought his own fights against both WB and Garp prefers Garp to take care of his son and hypes him as his rival.


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> And i mean Roger who fought his own fights against both WB and Garp prefers Garp to take care of his son and hypes him as his rival.


garp was his rival he just wasn't as close to roger as whitebeard was.

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## Lyren (Dec 9, 2019)

Maybe they just dislike Garp to the point they cant be objective when scaling him


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

MO said:


> garp was his rival he just wasn't as close to roger as whitebeard was.



And this is based on what?


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## Shrike (Dec 9, 2019)

Yeah I was always surprised by this. Garp was legit close to Roger's level. No bending of reading comprehension will change that. I don't know why the community as a whole kept mostly denying this for years and years. Hopefully they got to realize this after the God Valley stuff was revealed.

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## Flame (Dec 9, 2019)

Imagine taking the words of Buggy over Roger. Also not to mention Buggy stated that before we knew who Garp even was.

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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> And this is based on what?


on buggy only mentioning whitebeard as the only one to tie against roger.

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## Red Admiral (Dec 9, 2019)

not sure if Yonko are more liked ... 

if there be jealousy it's about the fact over all fandom consider Yonko > admiral


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

MO said:


> on buggy only mentioning whitebeard as the only one to tie against roger.



So you have nothing.



> _5
> Flashback!Roger: Garp!! I'm going to be having a kid...! // But I'm afraid by the time my kid arrives in the world, I'll already be gone...
> Flashback!Garp: And why do you feel the need to tell this to a Marine like me, Roger?!! / Any woman with connections to you will be put straight to death, you should know that!!
> Flashback!Roger: That's why I'm telling this to you. / The Government are sure to trace all of my activities in this last year... // They'll find her, and they'll kill her!! / ...But a child who is yet to be born bears no sin, Garp!! // The two of us have nearly killed each other so many times... we're like old pals now, aren't we?!! / I trust you as much as I'd trust my own crewmates!! // Protect my child!!
> ...



*God Valley incident reinforces Garp's powerlevel being basically equal to that of Roger.* The text above confirms Garp to actively chasing after Roger till the end.

Garp was his equal the same way Primebeard was. The trio with the most hype and best portrayal of the series.


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> So you have nothing.


I-

how is it nothing? Buggy is a witness. he was on the ship. he saw roger fight both most likely and concluded whitebeard was the only man who could tie against roger. its that simple.

even if you take away buggy statement. Whitebeard was considered the strongest man. that means  whitebeard was>garp. And roger and Whitebeard were equal. So roger and whitebeard>garp.

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## Fel1x (Dec 9, 2019)

no evidence Garp was 100% as strong as them

but we can say that he was definetely a decent opponent for them


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

MO said:


> I-
> 
> how is it nothing? Buggy is a witness. he was on the ship. he saw roger fight both most likely and concluded whitebeard was the only man who could tie against roger. its that simple.





MO said:


> even if you take away buggy statement. Whitebeard was considered the strongest man. that means  whitebeard was>garp. And roger and Whitebeard were equal. So roger and whitebeard>garp.



Roger is the man who fought both and can give the best estimation of the strenght. We don't really need the fairytails of a liar as witness to conclude something. 

Not to mention that WB stopped in his tracks at MF when Garp jumped the stage, needing to encourage his men to continue in front of the mighty marine.



Fel1x said:


> no evidence Garp was 100% as strong as them
> 
> but we can say that he was definetely a decent opponent for them



Can you read? Did i just invented the mangas storytelling?


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Roger is the man who fought both and can give the best estimation of the strenght. *We don't really need the fairytails of a liar as witness to conclude something*.


how is it fairy tails when he was there..?




TheWiggian said:


> Not to mention that WB stopped in his tracks at MF when Garp jumped the stage, needing to encourage his men to continue in front of the mighty marine.


okay and? whitebeard was > garp. This doesn't change anything.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

MO said:


> how is it fairy tails when he was there..?



Do we see him being there?



MO said:


> okay and? whitebeard was > garp. This doesn't change anything.



Just like Buggy hyping _WB_ as _the man who fought Roger to a standstill_, *Roger himself hypes Garp as the man who almost killed him numerous times* and entrusts him with his son despite Garp being a marine and his bigger enemy than another pirate since WB didn't even want the title and One Piece.


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Do we see him being there?


he was a crewmember. he was on the ship. there is no reason to assume he wasn't there.



TheWiggian said:


> Just like Buggy hyping _WB_ as _the man who fought Roger to a standstill_, *Roger himself hypes Garp as the man who almost killed him numerous times* and entrusts him with his son despite Garp being a marine and his bigger enemy than another pirate since WB didn't even want the title and One Piece.


yeah and thats good but still whitebeard was considered the strongest men. That puts him above garp. roger being equal to whitebeard put both of them above him.


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

@T.D.A do you have the viz or most correct translation of garp and rogers conversation?

Reactions: Like 1


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## T.D.A (Dec 9, 2019)

Prime Garp Yonko level. He's Luffy's grandfather after all.


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

T.D.A said:


> Prime Garp Yonko level. He's Luffy's grandfather after all.





MO said:


> @T.D.A do you have the viz or most correct translation of garp and rogers conversation?


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

MO said:


> he was a crewmember. he was on the ship. there is no reason to assume he wasn't there.



They fought on Roger's ship?



MO said:


> yeah and thats good but still whitebeard was considered the strongest men. That puts him above garp. roger being equal to whitebeard put both of them above him.



How can Whitebeard be the WSM if he has someone who is just as strong as him?
Last time i checked almost killing someone is better than just having a draw. To be precise Roger and Garp nearly killing each other translates into them being equal aswell so that is one more man that breaches Whitebeards WSM title.

Roger and Garp crushing Rocks also speaks heavily of both being above WB with the assumption that he was the one who catched up to them and managed to be considered equal to either.



MO said:


> @T.D.A do you have the viz or most correct translation of garp and rogers conversation?



Whats the matter cnet not accurate enough for you? Or are you scared that Garp is equal to them?


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## T.D.A (Dec 9, 2019)

@MO

It's along the lines of

*We've fought to the death tons of times!!
I trust you like I trust a friend!!
*
Note I didn't use the Viz translation as Stephen Paul (current Viz translator) wasn't translating for Viz back then so the translations I would say are less reliable than they are now which are done by Stephen who's reliable.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Great Potato (Dec 9, 2019)

Buggy and Roger's statements don't necessarily contradict each other, you can be a bit weaker than someone and there still be scenarios where you can push them to near death.

Reactions: Like 1


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> They fought on Roger's ship?


they could have fought anywhere. buggy was travelling with the crew.



TheWiggian said:


> How can Whitebeard be the WSM if he has someone who is just as strong as him?


he doesn't. Period.  doesn't matter if roger and garp almost killed each other. Whitebeard being the strongest is a fact.



T.D.A said:


> @MO
> 
> It's along the lines of
> 
> ...


thanks.

Reactions: Like 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

Great Potato said:


> Buggy and Roger's statements don't necessarily contradict each other, you can be a bit weaker than someone and there still be scenarios where you can push them to near death.



That's a good point though given the numerous amounts of times Garp did it compared to WB's single standstill i'd lean on Garp.



MO said:


> they could have fought anywhere. buggy was travelling with the crew.
> 
> 
> he doesn't. Period.  doesn't matter if roger and garp almost killed each other. Whitebeard being the strongest is a fact.



He does. We know WB was known as the WSM before his fight with Roger and the best he was able to achieve is a draw where on the other hand Garp pushed Roger to near death experience a couple of times.



MO said:


> thanks.



Imagine debating in a serious thread without even knowing a reliable source to build your arguments on

Reactions: Like 1


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

bil02 said:


> Didn't garp still need to train 2 years After god Valley to smash chinjao's head ?
> So either chinjao was that strong in his prime (and should be given credit for that) or garp was not that strong during god Valley incident and just took credit for Roger pirates accomplishments in that incident .
> My answer is prime garp is not different from current yonkou powerwise so should be able to give extreme diff to wb and roger since i don't beleive in pk level tier.



Chinjao's head was extraordinary. Doesn't mean Garp couldn't defeat him, he wanted to utterly crush Chinjao's whole pride and he did so with a single punch.


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## oiety (Dec 9, 2019)

I don't think there is any. Probably people still coming to terms with the fact that people like BM, Kaido, Shanks, Current Akainu, Fujitora, Aokiji etc would all get wiped out by these dudes(these dudes being Prime Garp, Prime WB, Prime Roger).

Until further notice imo they win 10/10 times against anyone not in that group. Rocks is in there too, and Imu could be, and I won't even headcanon who will be there by EoS (except Luffy ofc), but for now, yeah, those three dudes are the top of the power charts. Like they're not low-diffing top tiers or anything, but they win solidly.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Gianfi (Dec 9, 2019)

Garp was the next best thing of his era after Roger, WB and Xebec there is no denying to that


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## T.D.A (Dec 9, 2019)

oiety said:


> I don't think there is any. Probably people still coming to terms with the fact that people like BM, Kaido, Shanks, Current Akainu, Fujitora, Aokiji etc would all get wiped out by these dudes(these dudes being Prime Garp, Prime WB, Prime Roger).
> 
> Until further notice imo they win 10/10 times against anyone not in that group. Rocks is in there too, and Imu could be, and I won't even headcanon who will be there by EoS (except Luffy ofc), but for now, yeah, those three dudes are the top of the power charts. Like they're not low-diffing top tiers or anything, but they win solidly.



Kaido belongs in the list


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## Bonney (Dec 9, 2019)

Fel1x said:


> Prime Garp is already strongest Marine ever. but now you want him to be equal to Pirate King. "you can't always get what you want"
> 
> P Garp would lose 1 on 1 fight to the death against Roger or WB. But he is strong enough to break all their plans if it is necessary
> 
> that means P Garp would give them highest end of extreme diff but would lose. and both Roger and WB would be in near death state after their win



If it takes the most extreme of extreme difficulty to win and you're left near death then were the 2 fighters not on the same relative level?


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## Fel1x (Dec 9, 2019)

Serenity said:


> If it takes the most extreme of extreme difficulty to win and you're left near death then were the 2 fighters not on the same relative level?


if being at the same level =/= being 100% equal in strength, ok Garp is at that level


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## MO (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Imagine debating in a serious thread without even knowing a reliable source to build your arguments on


@T.D.A is my reliable source.


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## oiety (Dec 9, 2019)

T.D.A said:


> Kaido belongs in the list



Maybe for you. I'm not putting him there until we get something more definitive. 1 shotting someone around 1st mate level is great and all, but no memory no df no named attacks BM beat the brakes off of Queen, so I'm wary.


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## T.D.A (Dec 9, 2019)

oiety said:


> Maybe for you. I'm not putting him there until we get something more definitive. 1 shotting someone around 1st mate level is great and all, but no memory no df no named attacks BM beat the brakes off of Queen, so I'm wary.



People gloss over the fact that Kaido couldn't be killed even when captured or when he jumped from frickin' Sky Island. That's some op immortal shit.


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## oiety (Dec 9, 2019)

T.D.A said:


> People gloss over the fact that Kaido couldn't be killed even when captured or when he jumped from frickin' Sky Island. That's some op immortal shit.



It was a great fucking entrance and a great feat, I'm not disputing that. But I would need someone knowledgeable saying "Yes, Kaido is the closest to being Pirate King" or something like that. Maybe Garp or Sengoku talking about him and Garp slips in a "Yeah, I'm not sure if I could have brought him down, if he was this strong back then." Until then, though? He's _just _the current top.


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## Yuji (Dec 9, 2019)

Seems strange that Garp was supposed to be comparable to Roger and yet he admitted the navy couldn't take on 2 legends at the same time (referring to old/retired Rayleigh) and stated if Rocks (referring to big mom and kaido) were to make a comeback it would be an incident far beyond their imaginations to do anything about.

2 possibilities:

1. Garp's strength has declined so much in his old age, his strength is irrelevant compared to a Yonko now which is why he makes these statements
2. He was never as strong as them to begin with

Or a 3rd possibility could be Oda is lying to the reader, and the big brain Garp fans have worked it all out.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Canute87 (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Of the things Garp achieved?
> 
> He was legit PK tier together with Roger and WB, the only other people that will reach that level are Luffy and possibly BB/Akainu/IM.
> 
> ...



It's because of WB's WSM titlle.  perception is a hell of a thing.



Yuji said:


> Seems strange that Garp was supposed to be comparable to Roger and yet he admitted the navy couldn't take on 2 legends at the same time (referring to old/retired Rayleigh) and stated if Rocks (referring to big mom and kaido) were to make a comeback it would be an incident far beyond their imaginations to do anything about.
> 
> 2 possibilities:
> 
> ...



Did he admit that the navy couldn't take on two legends at the same time or it would be stupid to do so?


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## Yuji (Dec 9, 2019)

Canute87 said:


> Did he admit that the navy couldn't take on two legends at the same time or it would be stupid to do so?



Both amount to the same thing, since it was preceeded by Garp saying they could lose a lot of men the implication is they can't. And again, this is old/retired Rayleigh. Imagine what he'd say about 2 active legends.

Well we don't have to imagine because this has happened! Garp said ''an incident far beyond our imagination to do anything about''.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Canute87 (Dec 9, 2019)

Yuji said:


> Both amount to the same thing, since it was preceeded by Garp saying they could lose a lot of men the implication is they can't. And again, this is old/retired Rayleigh. Imagine what he'd say about 2 active legends.
> 
> Well we don't have to imagine because this has happened! Garp said ''an incident far beyond our imagination to do anything about''.



They would have have lost more soliders yes 

But given how hard the WB pirates were fucked by the marines i think Garp was overthinking things.


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## Fujitora (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> There is not much supporting your view. The Yonkou admit they want to become PK but can't reach that goal. View WB as someone superior to them despite him not being interested in the One Piece. They have huge armies and allies and still struggle not even able to take over other territories.
> 
> Not to mention that narration puts the PK above the yonkou multiple times, be it by storytelling, character statements or other hype sources.


Pk lvl character will always win against other top tiers butntll still be an extreme diff fight imo. They aren’t on another level entirely.



Acno said:


> Roger would High-diff any Yonkou
> 
> Neither Kaido,neither BM nor Shanks was able to surpass WB and Old WB<Primebeard<~Roger.PK is Endgamestuff and not some Pre-final arc thing


White beard is equal to Roger, stop putting him below him.



TheWiggian said:


> And i mean Roger who fought his own fights against both WB and Garp prefers Garp to take care of his son and hypes him as his rival.


Roger was in jail bruh. Don’t think he was able to communicate with whitebeard from you know, jail.


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## Neo Arcadia (Dec 9, 2019)

Yuji said:


> Seems strange that Garp was supposed to be comparable to Roger and yet he admitted the navy couldn't take on 2 legends at the same time (referring to old/retired Rayleigh) and stated if Rocks (referring to big mom and kaido) were to make a comeback it would be an incident far beyond their imaginations to do anything about.
> 
> 2 possibilities:
> 
> ...


4. Garp overestimates the legends and underestimates the Marines. Kizaru alone was a match for Rayleigh, and implied to have the edge.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 9, 2019)

OniKaido said:


> Roger was in jail bruh. Don’t think he was able to communicate with whitebeard from you know, jail.



What a crappy argument considering Roger let himself get captured on purpose.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sabco (Dec 9, 2019)

It's just Yonko wankers who say that because Garp deep fisted BM and tortured the prisoner Kaido long ago.

Prime Garp's mere name was a nightmare for every Yonko. reminding them about the daddy that steamrolled Rocks long ago.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Seraphoenix (Dec 9, 2019)

While you can argue about strength between them, I think it's pretty clear that Rocks, WB, Roger and Garp are the 4 strongest characters we know of in their prime versions.

Shanks would be there too if he had both arms


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## Lee-Sensei (Dec 9, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Roger is the ultimate pirate, the man with the most freedom. You know who else is a pirate? Kaido. Roger would beat Kaido 10/10 times.
> 
> Good thing there are more reliable characters like the PK himself who acknowledges Garp and shits on Buggy.


When did Roger shit on a buggy.


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## Kylo Ren (Dec 9, 2019)

Yuji said:


> Seems strange that Garp was supposed to be comparable to Roger and yet he admitted the navy couldn't take on 2 legends at the same time (referring to old/retired Rayleigh) and stated if Rocks (referring to big mom and kaido) were to make a comeback it would be an incident far beyond their imaginations to do anything about.


I think it's because he is retired now and possibly talking about a current fighter from the marines.


TheWiggian said:


> He does. We know WB was known as the WSM before his fight with Roger and the best he was able to achieve is a draw where on the other hand Garp pushed Roger to near death experience a couple of times.


isn't the Garp and Roger fight can also be considered a draw? When do you imagine what went down between WB and Roger you think they fought without trying to kill each other? when someone on that caliber fighting with the result of DRAW it automatically interprets to me that they have near-death exp battle.


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## Oberyn Nymeros (Dec 9, 2019)

He should be based on his role and status and hype, but I think its impossible when you consider that Garp couldnt surpass sick Whitebeard.

Reactions: Like 1


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## jesusus (Dec 9, 2019)

Garp was definitely near Roger lvl, unlike current Smoker and Luffy


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## RossellaFiamingo (Dec 10, 2019)

When wanking Akainu fails, Wank Gaap.


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## Corax (Dec 10, 2019)

Not sure why even count Buggy here. Roger himself gave direct confirmation that he and Garp are equals. This can't be even more clear. Character himself stated it on panel.


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## trance (Dec 10, 2019)

*looks at the second option in the poll*

Ayy brothers and/or sisters, the Church of the FIST welcomes you with open arms


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## GreenBull956 (Dec 10, 2019)

I put Roger as WB's exact equal . so if they fight , it'll be a draw 

Roger vs Garp = Roger Extreme Diff , Garp nearly killing Roger several times mean that Garp indeed had the attacks/power to kill him but just barely missed or whatever


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## Sabco (Dec 10, 2019)

Seraphoenix said:


> Shanks would be there too if he had both arms



the lord of the coast was too much for Shanks


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## RossellaFiamingo (Dec 10, 2019)

Sabco said:


> the lord of the coast was too much for Shanks


Lor D.Coast is the ultimate potential unlocker. Shanks would have been equal to Mihawk [Admiral Level] if The Coast Lord didn’t bless him by taking his arm. That moment allowed him to grow into Yonko Level


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## Sabco (Dec 10, 2019)

RossellaFiamingo said:


> Lor D.Coast is the ultimate potential unlocker. Shanks would have been equal to Mihawk [Admiral Level] if The Coast Lord didn’t bless him by taking his arm. That moment allowed him to grow into Yonko Level



At least mihawk can watch some shit on his phone and jerk on the same time


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## RossellaFiamingo (Dec 10, 2019)

Sabco said:


> At least mihawk can watch some shit on his phone and jerk on the same time


That’s all he does. Sits around touching himself on an island full of baboons. Only interested in the low hanging fruits


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## Sabco (Dec 10, 2019)

RossellaFiamingo said:


> That’s all he does. Sits around touching himself on an island full of baboons. Only interested in the low hanging fruits



That's because handicapped Shanks doesn't satisfy Mihawk's needs anymore and that Mihawk is still awaiting to fight someone stronger than Shanks ( manga fact )


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## bil02 (Dec 10, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Chinjao's head was extraordinary. Doesn't mean Garp couldn't defeat him, he wanted to utterly crush Chinjao's whole pride and he did so with a single punch.


We are saying the same thing,what i want is chinjao getting props for his extraordinary head which needed garp to train to be able of smashing it.Instead of considering chinjao trash and wanking garp for god valley incident which os pretty much contradictory since he needed to train for chinjao's head.

Reactions: Like 1


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## RossellaFiamingo (Dec 10, 2019)

Sabco said:


> That's because handicapped Shanks doesn't satisfy Mihawk's needs anymore and that Mihawk is still awaiting to fight someone stronger than Shanks ( manga fact )


Pre Yonko Shanks. I’m giving him respect by saying he’s Admiral Level. In between that and Yonko where he beats all Admirals but loses to all Yonko including Shanks. 

Vista is still waiting for that rematch.

Imagine a girl getting engaged with Mihawk. He would postpone the marriage or dates.


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## oiety (Dec 10, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Chinjao's head was extraordinary





bil02 said:


> chinjao getting props for his extraordinary head





bil02 said:


> he needed to train for chinjao's head


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## Flame (Dec 10, 2019)

GreenBull956 said:


> I put Roger as WB's exact equal . so if they fight , it'll be a draw
> 
> Roger vs Garp = Roger Extreme Diff , Garp nearly killing Roger several times mean that Garp indeed had the attacks/power to kill him but just barely missed or whatever


Roger didn't say "you nearly killed me" he said "*we nearly killed each other*" so by that logic the same could be said to Roger. If Garp barely missed, so did Roger, making them equals.

Reactions: Like 4


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## Kinjin (Dec 10, 2019)

Stay on topic please.

Garp being PK level isn't debatable to me. Always got the impression that the purpose of his talk with Roger was to portray them as equals. The Rocks incident should have sealed the deal for everyone that he's on that level.

Reactions: Like 4


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## Raiden34 (Dec 10, 2019)

How many of these Garp power threads? This thread has no quality and it has no argument other than using the wrong translation.

Only if you use the right translation you can see there is no such a thing.



_*Digital colored manga translation;*_



_*VIZ official translation;*_



No mention of killing each other.

And you don't need Buggy when WB has been declared as the strongest man after Roger's death, which means WB & Roger > Garp. Shiki also said Garp, or any other marine could never capture Roger.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Steven (Dec 10, 2019)

How is Garp~Roger,when only WB was able to fight him as equal.

And WB was the WSM ergo stronger than Garp

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kylo Ren (Dec 10, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> How many of these Garp power threads? This thread has no quality and it has no argument other than using the wrong translation.
> 
> Only if you use the right translation you can see there is no such a thing.
> 
> ...


Well, This is it, no more rivalry as of now.

But the god valley incident still hold credibility that Garp is yonko level that cannot be deny.

When Garp time to shine you will see that he is really equal to WB and Roger


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## RossellaFiamingo (Dec 10, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> How many of these Garp power threads? This thread has no quality and it has no argument other than using the wrong translation.
> 
> Only if you use the right translation you can see there is no such a thing.
> 
> ...


GG end the thread

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kirin Thunderclap (Dec 10, 2019)

Seraphoenix said:


> While you can argue about strength between them, I think it's pretty clear that Rocks, WB, Roger and Garp are the 4 strongest characters we know of in their prime versions.
> 
> *Shanks would be there too if he had both* arms



You can't help yourself, can you?


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## Sabco (Dec 10, 2019)

in his prime Garp would smack a Yonko around like a fly. he's up there with Roger.

Reactions: Like 4


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## Seraphoenix (Dec 10, 2019)

Kirin Thunderclap said:


> You can't help yourself, can you?


No, I can't. The truth can't be contained that easily.


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## MrPopo (Dec 10, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> How many of these Garp power threads? This thread has no quality and it has no argument other than using the wrong translation.
> 
> Only if you use the right translation you can see there is no such a thing.
> 
> ...


, @T.D.A  already mentioned in this thread that the viz translation  for that statement is unreliable


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## Flame (Dec 10, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> And you don't need Buggy when WB has been declared as the strongest man after Roger's death, which means WB & Roger > Garp. Shiki also said Garp, or any other marine could never capture Roger.


Vivre Card confirmed WB got his title well before Roger's death.


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## Raiden34 (Dec 10, 2019)

Flame said:


> Vivre Card confirmed WB got his title well before Roger's death.


Vivre card also said Shanks was already a Yonko at East Blue and when he dueled with Mihawk 12 years ago, so... It's not reliable.


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## Flame (Dec 10, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> Vivre card also said Shanks was already a Yonko at East Blue and when he dueled with Mihawk 12 years ago, so... It's not reliable.


Until we get a clarification from the manga itself, it's the best next thing. Canon until proven otherwise.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Raiden34 (Dec 10, 2019)

Flame said:


> Until we get a clarification from the manga itself, it's the best next thing. Canon until proven otherwise.


Roger was the ''pirate king'' in the manga, I don't care about vivre card. Basically Roger was stronger than every pirate which includes WB as well. I should've said Roger > WB > Garp, but I didn't want to exaggerate the difference.



Don King said:


> Well, This is it, no more rivalry as of now.
> 
> But the god valley incident still hold credibility that Garp is yonko level that cannot be deny.
> 
> When Garp time to shine you will see that he is really equal to WB and Roger


Well about god valley, no doubt Garp did his best, but the main fighter and crew should be Roger.
As to why;

- Xebec was Roger's most formidable rival
- Kaido and Big mom were much weaker than Yonko level according to Sengoku
- Roger's crew had people like Silvers Rayleigh and Scopper Gaban, which is why the main force was Roger pirates, not Garp's marines.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 10, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> How many of these Garp power threads? This thread has no quality and it has no argument other than using the wrong translation.
> 
> Only if you use the right translation you can see there is no such a thing.
> 
> ...



Your bro TDA alrdy confirmed it's an unrealiable translation. Even to this current day alot of people consider cnet translations more accurate than VIZ.


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## Seraphoenix (Dec 10, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Your bro TDA alrdy confirmed it's an unrealiable translation. Even to this current day alot of people consider cnet translations more accurate than VIZ.


You're at least right about Cnet being > Viz.


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## Raiden34 (Dec 10, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Your bro TDA alrdy confirmed it's an unrealiable translation. Even to this current day alot of people consider cnet translations more accurate than VIZ.


Which is why I used 2 translations; VIZ + Digital coloured. None of them mentioned about nearly killing each other.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 10, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> Which is why I used 2 translations; VIZ + Digital coloured. None of them mentioned about nearly killing each other.



Ok let's go your route:


*Spoiler*: __ 







*Link Removed*

Lol this is even worse 




VIZ translation calls WB the Strongest Pirate which excludes Garp since he is no pirate and it's also just a standstill. Fought Roger and lived, a feat Garp pulled of numerous times. Get rekt.



GG who did say end the thread??? The fun is just starting.


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## Raiden34 (Dec 10, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Ok let's go your route:
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...



That's your route, not mine. I don't need Buggy to prove anything.

VIZ, and every other translations states that WB is the strongest man which means he > Garp.


*Spoiler*: __ 








Since you wouldn't accept anyone, let's see what Garp himself said about WB.


*Spoiler*: __ 






''King of the Seas''

Not king of the pirates, or anything else. He declare WB as someone who is stronger than himself.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 10, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> That's your route, not mine. I don't need Buggy to prove anything.
> 
> VIZ, and every other translations states that WB is the strongest man which means he > Garp.
> 
> ...



This got nothing to do with our previous talk you failed to prove that VIZ translation is better and i shoved their quality back where it came from.

Consider looking into the VIZ translation we got:

Garp:

"We've *faced each other dozens of times in battle*".
"That makes us comrades".
"I trust you as much as one of my own crew".
"*We've been fighting each other for years*".
"I trust you as much as any of my shipmates".

WB:

"An almost legendary monster *who, alone, fought against the PK to a standstill*".
"Without a doubt, he's the _world's strongest pirate_ as of now".
"*The only man whos ever fought Gold Roger and lived.* His strenght is legendary".
"He's _the most powerful living pirate_".

Compare bolded from both fractions and stack it up against each other. You'll realize Garp's hype exceeds WB and as the cherry on top we compare the PK, the guy who fought both Garp and WB against Buggy, a gag character and liar, someone who exeggerates things multiple times in the manga.

Look at the italic and underlined parts and see for yourself that _*VIZ *doesn't even includes Garp in WB's hype, meaning there is not even any proof to say WB > Garp._

SO we go by VIZ which doesn't even have Garp included in WB's hype as the strongest because speech is about pirates only and we then compare how WB fought Roger once to a standstill and survived which is weird because Garp fought him multiple times but is nowhere mentioned. Tells you how accurate VIZ *"was"*, but keep in mind that @Erkan12 prefers this accuracy as a OP expert.


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## Raiden34 (Dec 10, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> This got nothing to do with our previous talk you failed to prove that VIZ translation is better and i shoved their quality back where it came from.
> 
> Consider looking into the VIZ translation we got:
> 
> ...


We've never talked about Buggy here, and you're still trying to compare Buggy's statement. As I already told you no one needs Buggy to prove anything. That's your doing only. Did people come to you by showing Buggy's statement against Roger's statement? Then you can argue this against the people who does this. I never said anything about Buggy's statement. Garp has no chance against WB in terms of official statements and every other character's statements such as Sengoku, Shiki etc.

It's ''strength'' btw, not ''strenght''.

As for VIZ not being reliable, even if it's then we've digital coloured manga translation which mentions nothing of Roger saying Garp nearly killed him. 

The translation is not clear either way. Then you keep insisting that VIZ + digital colored manga is not reliable. Let's say it's not, every other people includes Garp said WB > Garp. And Roger was the pirate king when WB was in his prime as a pirate. That means Roger > WB > Garp. But somehow you believe Roger & Garp > WB, while no one ever tried to deny WB's word's strongest title in the manga, and no one ever said Garp is the strongest. Or that Garp was equal to Roger. Sengoku said WB is the strongest, Shiki said Roger > every other marine includes Garp. Garp himself said WB is the king of the seas, then you come up with Buggy's statement as if we need Buggy to prove anything here. Forget about Buggy or VIZ translations. WB was stronger than Garp. That's the fact.


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## Steven (Dec 10, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Ok let's go your route:
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...


*Link Removed* 
WB´s symbol looks like a Hakenkreuz


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## TheWiggian (Dec 10, 2019)

Erkan12 said:


> We've never talked about Buggy here, and you're still trying to compare Buggy's statement. As I already told you no one needs Buggy to prove anything. That's your doing only. Did people come to you by showing Buggy's statement against Roger's statement? Then you can argue this against the people who does this. I never said anything about Buggy's statement. Garp has no chance against WB in terms of official statements and every other character's statements such as Sengoku, Shiki etc.
> 
> It's ''strength'' btw, not ''strenght''.
> 
> ...



Nope. You can't even follow the discussion properly. Roger himself hypes Garp more than WB is hyped by other character's. When the PK himself states that Garp is equal to him and prefers him as the one to take care of this child i won't simply ignore it. WB being the WSM is the key point here, if he got the title he should be the undisputeable no.1 but the best he got is a draw against Roger which Garp does aswell, multiple times by the way.  You can use either translation, be it cnet128, VIZ or some other they tend to give Garp better hype than WB when it comes to combat ability. Here's the VIZ reference, the cnet speaks even more for Garp:



> Garp:
> 
> "We've *faced each other dozens of times in battle*".
> "That makes us comrades".
> ...



If you can't dispute how WB is only equal to Roger and therefore Garp by default, then you shouldn't even respond.

*Roger = WB = Garp*


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## Red Admiral (Dec 10, 2019)

the only OFFICIAL equal to Roger is Whitebeard

Garp is just so damn close to that level

Reactions: Like 1


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## CaptainCommander (Dec 10, 2019)

MO said:


> buggy said . . . . .



Two words that make everything after them true . . .


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## Red Admiral (Dec 10, 2019)

CaptainCommander said:


> Two words that make everything after them true . . .



since when Buggy is a bad source of info?

is power and information related to each other

words of a crew member of Roger who grow up in heart of golden era is as legit as Oda himself about Roger ....

he is not telling a tail when he is talking about Roger ... he is telling what he saw with his own eyes and was a general belief among the crew of the king


words of a man who know the truth of the one piece , Raftel and maybe even World Government is lol??? lol!


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## Lee-Sensei (Dec 10, 2019)

He was probably Yonkou level along with Sengoku and Rayleigh IMO. He was close enough to matter in a fight with them, but still noticeably weaker IMO.


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## Raiden34 (Dec 10, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Nope. You can't even follow the discussion properly. Roger himself hypes Garp more than WB is hyped by other character's. When the PK himself states that Garp is equal to him and prefers him as the one to take care of this child i won't simply ignore it. WB being the WSM is the key point here, if he got the title he should be the undisputeable no.1 but the best he got is a draw against Roger which Garp does aswell, multiple times by the way.  You can use either translation, be it cnet128, VIZ or some other they tend to give Garp better hype than WB when it comes to combat ability. Here's the VIZ reference, the cnet speaks even more for Garp:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So you think cnet translation despite being not official is better, and you're determining their power levels based on completely ignoring the official VIZ translation and you're also ignoring the digital coloured manga translation which also says the same thing?

How exactly VIZ and digital color translations are giving a better hype you lost me here. This is what the translation is;

_*Digital colored manga translation;*_



_*''We've faced each other dozens of times in battle!''*_

_*VIZ official translation;*_



_*''We've been fighting each other for years!''*_

No mention of nearly killing each other.

Then you say official VIZ translation is wrong and unofficial cnet translation is better, how so? Who decides which one is better? No one.

And even if it says nearly killing each other, you don't know the circumstances in One Piece, such as ambush, surprise attacks, attacking your enemy when he is already wounded before the fight (such as Burgess tried to kill Luffy after Luffy exhausted), if Garp attacks Roger while Roger was wounded before the fight, he can nearly kill him despite being weaker than him. We know Garp likes to take help from other Admirals such as Sengoku. It could be another 2 v 1 fight against Roger, like it happened against Shiki and Blackbeard. This is why it's ambiguous statement, it's not a power level confirmation. Garp can nearly kill someone even though he is still weaker than that person. As it happened to Shiki, Garp nearly killed Shiki but how? He took help from Admiral Sengoku in a 2 v 1. No one knows the circumstances of Roger's fights against the marines, you can't decide by this statement.

The power level confirmation is when Shiki says that no marine could be equal to Roger, and they could never capture him.

Why would Shiki doubt about Garp's power, if Garp is indeed close to Roger? And why would Garp attacks someone like Shiki in 2 v 1 battle if he was as strong as Roger. He could handle Shiki comfortably if was equal to Roger.


*Spoiler*: __ 









_*''I know how strong he is!! Scums like you could never capture Roger!!''*_


And Sengoku could let Garp to deal with Shiki if Garp was as powerful as Roger and WB. Instead half of the marineford has been destroyed despite Garp taking help from Admiral Sengoku to defeat Shiki.


*Spoiler*: __ 








_*''Garp, Sengoku, Golden Lion. These three fought until marineford was half destroyed.''*_

If Garp couldn't stop Shiki from destroying the half of the marineford, despite Admiral Sengoku's help, it's hard to believe that Garp is actually on a different level than Shiki like Roger and WB were.

Also you say Roger = WB while Roger was the king of pirates, he was clearly stronger than even WB, even if it's only a little. No one could be equal to EoS Luffy.  EoS Luffy will be the strongest man and no one will be equal to him in the end. So it's Roger > WB.

In the end all you've is an unofficial translation / an ambiguous statement from Roger vs. official translations + countless people in the manga (Garp himself) and the official titles says that WB > Garp, this is the situation you're in.

It's also funny that when Garp himself says WB is the king of the seas. And Sengoku says WB is the strongest man despite being the best friends with Garp and despite being the marine Fleet Admiral.

Garp says no one can stop WB (includes himself) and he says WB is the king of the seas.

Garp himself ; WB > Garp.


*Spoiler*: __ 








_*Garp: ''Nobody can stop this anymore!! We've angered the king of the seas!''*_


Fleet Admiral Sengoku; WB > Garp


*Spoiler*: __ 








_*Sengoku: ''The strongest man in the world is attacking!!''*_

Then you believe an ambiguous statement from Roger (not a power level statement) should be a better hype than Shiki's, and even against Garp's own words and Sengoku's own words about WB.

Even after WB's death, the strongest man title didn't pass to Garp, instead people (and Oda says this in SBS) accepted Kaido as the strongest creature alive. When they ask about Akainu's power, Oda uses Kaido as the strongest being in this series. If Garp was equal to WB, then people would at least say Garp is the strongest right now after WB's death, not Kaido. But still no one considers Garp as the strongest. It's Kaido.

Reactions: Like 1


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## CaptainCommander (Dec 10, 2019)

@Red Admiral I have nothing for you. Clearly you are beyond reason. Now go fetch Buggy Sama's copy of Fake News Morgan's paper.


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## Kylo Ren (Dec 10, 2019)

World Strongest Man > anyone else including marines.  This is a legit argument that WB is stronger than Garp. 

Roger and Garp fighting numerous times can translate to anything from Roger > Garp to Roger = Garp but one thing is clear Garp higher achievement when it comes to Roger is cornering him means Roger always gets the best of Garp in the end.

Reactions: Like 2


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## xmysticgohanx (Dec 10, 2019)

Rocks
Roger = WB
Prime Garp

those are the 4 strongest characters in all of one piece’s history. In that order


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## Luke (Dec 10, 2019)

He was close.


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## Red Admiral (Dec 11, 2019)

CaptainCommander said:


> @Red Admiral I have nothing for you. Clearly you are beyond reason. Now go fetch Buggy Sama's copy of Fake News Morgan's paper.



next time try to explain why I'm wrong instead of saying cheap meaningless things like "you are beyond reason"


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## TheWiggian (Dec 11, 2019)

Weird how no one could defend WB being the WSM here.


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## trance (Dec 11, 2019)

xmysticgohanx said:


> Rocks
> Roger = WB
> Prime Garp
> 
> those are the 4 strongest characters in all of one piece’s history. In that order



too soon to be putting rocks at the top (might not even happen)

he's (roughly) equal to them until further notice

Reactions: Like 1


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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 11, 2019)

xmysticgohanx said:


> Rocks
> Roger = WB
> Prime Garp
> 
> those are the 4 strongest characters in all of one piece’s history. In that order


thats literally not possible cause not only Rocks lost to them, but he also had his bounty surpassed by WB and Roger


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## Turrin (Dec 11, 2019)

The way I see it is Roger and Rocks were equals and those 2 fought. So this means at best Garp fought WB; but he may not have as Raleigh could have been the one to fight WB too. But assuming Garp fought and beat WB; it seems implied that Rocks crew members got stronger after the defeat of the Rocks, so it’s very likely WB wasn’t as strong as Rocks or Roger back then; and may not have even had the Gura Fruit.

So at this point I don’t see enough to put Garp on that level and honestly without DF; I don’t see how he could be at the Top Tier level of Roger and Rocks


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## Beast (Dec 11, 2019)

How could he not be PK tier if there is a separate tier for them? 

This man took on Roger numerous times without Oda revealing any winner and beat the Strongest crew we’ve heard to date alongside Roger. 

WB was ALREADY WSM while Roger was alive, so i don’t even know how that could be used against Garp at the war, it is very clear WB once he had attained the WSM title for whatever deed he did (which I’m sure we might get to see in one of the upcoming chapters in the FB), had never lost to anyone including Roger and Garp, at best people could only draw with him aka Roger but there was never any hint at Garp or Roger ever losing to him but rather the opposite when they beat his crew long before he gained the WSM title and then catched up to Garp the Hero and Roger the great pirate/ Future PK.  Garp and Roger were ahead of WB and WB was the one to catch up not Garp.

Buggy words mean very little when we know he thought Roger couldn’t beat fucking Shiki, his words hold no weight when the likes of Sengoku says otherwise. 

Shiki words also barely hold any weight when we know his personality so well, he thought he was on the same level as Roger and could bring him under his wing, such an arrogant man could never be taken seriously, he watched the greatest pirate crew fall apart to just Garp and the Roger pirates but doubts the entire marines couldn’t possibly take Roger? He got beat by Sengoku and Garp with what we saw as barely a fight at all from a guy we could hold up multiple islands with his DF powers because he got wrecked rather easily, Sengoku was willing to go on his own already nevermind Garp always jumping into fights as we’ve seen again and again. 

Anyone who doubts Garp the hero, the fist,  carry of the will of D and the MCs Loving Grandfather isn’t pirate king tier is just delusional. 

I’m glad the OL has finally taken in the glory that is Garp the polls. Probably thanks to couple people not being here.

Reactions: Like 6


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## xmysticgohanx (Dec 11, 2019)

Rakuyo said:


> too soon to be putting rocks at the top (might not even happen)
> 
> he's (roughly) equal to them until further notice





Shiba D. Inu said:


> thats literally not possible cause not only Rocks lost to them, but he also had his bounty surpassed by WB and Roger


 Rocks was said to be Roger’s greatest/strongest foe


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## Shiba D. Inu (Dec 11, 2019)

xmysticgohanx said:


> Rocks was said to be Roger’s greatest/strongest foe


WB wasnt Rogers foe at all


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## CaptainCommander (Dec 11, 2019)

xmysticgohanx said:


> Rocks
> Roger = WB
> Prime Garp
> 
> those are the 4 strongest characters in all of one piece’s history. In that order



That makes no sense what so ever. Rocks and WB can't be stronger than Roger and Garp when the latter defeated the former + others.

More like Rocks/Garp/Roger>>>>>WB

don't bring up bullshit like WB got stronger. Dude was already late thirties and confirmed to be at or very close to his peak.

Reactions: Like 1


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## trance (Dec 11, 2019)

xmysticgohanx said:


> Rocks was said to be Roger’s greatest/strongest foe



viz had it as he was "perhaps" his greatest foe

granted, he may just turn out to be stronger but as of now, its too early

especially since roger, wb and garp have a decade+ (irl time) of established hype going for them

Reactions: Like 1


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## xmysticgohanx (Dec 11, 2019)

CaptainCommander said:


> That makes no sense what so ever. Rocks and WB can't be stronger than Roger and Garp when the latter defeated the former + others.
> 
> More like Rocks/Garp/Roger>>>>>WB
> 
> don't bring up bullshit like WB got stronger. Dude was already late thirties and confirmed to be at or very close to his peak.


 WB got stronger



Rakuyo said:


> viz had it as he was "perhaps" his greatest foe
> 
> granted, he may just turn out to be stronger but as of now, its too early
> 
> especially since roger, wb and garp have a decade+ (irl time) of established hype going for them


 ima have to ask @T.D.A then. But I’ll trust viz over anything for now


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## TheWiggian (Dec 12, 2019)

xmysticgohanx said:


> WB got stronger
> 
> ima have to ask @T.D.A then. But I’ll trust viz over anything for now



VIZ makes it even harder than other translations for WB. Scroll up, VIZ doesn't even consider Garp when it comes to WB's hype because they keep calling WB the strongest pirate that once suvived Roger in a single standstill while Garp as a Marine replicated that feat a couple of times.

The pages/panels are in this thread, scroll up.

Reactions: Like 1


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## xmysticgohanx (Dec 12, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> VIZ makes it even harder than other translations for WB. Scroll up, VIZ doesn't even consider Garp when it comes to WB's hype because they keep calling WB the strongest pirate that once suvived Roger in a single standstill while Garp as a Marine replicated that feat a couple of times.
> 
> The pages/panels are in this thread, scroll up.


 I’ll try but 8 pages sucks. Probably tomorrow


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## Beast (Dec 12, 2019)

The heresy won’t make it past next week Tuesday. 

The time has come

Reactions: Like 3


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## TheWiggian (Dec 12, 2019)

xmysticgohanx said:


> I’ll try but 8 pages sucks. Probably tomorrow






TheWiggian said:


> Ok let's go your route:
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...

Reactions: Like 1


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## xmysticgohanx (Dec 12, 2019)

Seraphoenix said:


> While you can argue about strength between them, I think it's pretty clear that Rocks, WB, Roger and Garp are the 4 strongest characters we know of in their prime versions.
> 
> Shanks would be there too if he had both arms


 where do you have mf garp?

@T.D.A what is you translation of buggy’s speech?


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## Seraphoenix (Dec 12, 2019)

xmysticgohanx said:


> where do you have mf garp?
> 
> @T.D.A what is you translation of buggy’s speech?


Well he said he lost strength in old age. However he did what no other admiral was capable of doing which was to repel Marco. If you look at all the admiral clashes with Marco he was either kicking them away or stalemating them. Garp was the only one who outright overpowered him and even took him out of his form. That to me is a clear difference in portrayal. 

Also unlike WB who was sick or Rayleigh who was out of practice, Garp was still active. If an out of form Rayleigh can stalemate Kizaru then I believe Garp would have an edge over any admiral despite losing strength.

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## T.D.A (Dec 12, 2019)

xmysticgohanx said:


> where do you have mf garp?
> 
> @T.D.A what is you translation of buggy’s speech?



What chapter?

Reactions: Like 1


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## Steven (Dec 12, 2019)

Seraphoenix said:


> Well he said he lost strength in old age. However he did what no other admiral was capable of doing which was to repel Marco. If you look at all the admiral clashes with Marco he was either kicking them away or stalemating them. Garp was the only one who outright overpowered him and even took him out of his form. That to me is a clear difference in portrayal.
> 
> Also unlike WB who was sick or Rayleigh who was out of practice, Garp was still active. If an out of form Rayleigh can stalemate Kizaru then I believe Garp would have an edge over any admiral despite losing strength.


Tbf,Ray was not out of form,he "just" had stamina problems

But he dont lost power or haki


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## Seraphoenix (Dec 12, 2019)

Acno said:


> Tbf,Ray was not out of form,he "just" had stamina problems
> 
> But he dont lost power or haki


I think he said he hadn't picked up a sword in 20 years so he was a bit rusty


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## Steven (Dec 12, 2019)

Seraphoenix said:


> I think he said he hadn't picked up a sword in 20 years so he was a bit rusty


Yeah,20 years?Can you post the panel?


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## T.D.A (Dec 12, 2019)

TheWiggian said:


> Ok let's go your route:
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...





xmysticgohanx said:


> where do you have mf garp?
> 
> @T.D.A what is you translation of buggy’s speech?



Stephen Paul's (Viz translator):

*A legendary "MONSTER" who was once the only man who could ever match the Pirate King Roger!!!
HE IS WITHOUT A DOUBT, THE MOST POWERFUL PIRATE IN THE WORLD!!!!
THE MAN CLOSEST TO THE "ONE PIECE"!!!!*

Reactions: Like 1


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## Canute87 (Dec 12, 2019)

Louis-954 said:


> Yeah, most likely. It's pretty crazy when you think about it too. He was at their level without the use of weapons or Devil Fruit abilities.



there's still the question of when wb got the gura.


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## TheWiggian (Dec 12, 2019)

Even the current VIZ translation calls WB the strongest pirate


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## stealthblack (Dec 12, 2019)

roger and wb 100, garp 96


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## xmysticgohanx (Dec 12, 2019)

Roger and WB: 100
Garp: 99

Reactions: Like 1


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## nmwn93 (Dec 28, 2019)

Im a big Garp fan. I see threads asking for top strongest ppl in 1 piece and i see ppl putting garp BELOW roger and wb. Everytime i see it i get a vein popping. Idk how much oda has to do or show to male ppl respect garp. Prime wb gets eternal praise but you rank him over garp? Ok. Lets look at what we know. For better or worse. Its confirmed GARP nd roger took down the rox crew. Two vs a ridiculous team that was the rocks crew. Nd MISS ME WITH rogers crew. Until further notice its garp n roger vs RDX, WB, BM, SHIKI, KAIDO, etc. If wb n roger are equal then in order to win either garp or roger has to be a lot more powerful than we're acknowledging. A) why would you rate Garp in his prime below. Prime wb? B) if hes below wb then why did it only take he n roger to best all those powerful pirates at once if garp is below wb??? Why do people believe garps "hype" is a government hoax??  1 of the feats ppl use for garp is him one hitting marco when he tried to make it to the scaffold. I think garp was holding back. Moreover i think he hit Marco to SAVE MARCO. Garp has Coo and if its anything like coby (whom garp trained in coo) then he likely foresaw sengoku going full kill you on Marco and jumped in instead. So in my own lil head cannon garp hit marco with kid gloves but whatever. Why's garp not as powerful as its says he is? Im curious on why some still sleep on the old monkey d.

Reactions: Like 2


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## TheWiggian (Dec 28, 2019)

Neko White said:


> Im a big Garp fan. I see threads asking for top strongest ppl in 1 piece and i see ppl putting garp BELOW roger and wb. Everytime i see it i get a vein popping. Idk how much oda has to do or show to male ppl respect garp. Prime wb gets eternal praise but you rank him over garp? Ok. Lets look at what we know. For better or worse. Its confirmed GARP nd roger took down the rox crew. Two vs a ridiculous team that was the rocks crew. Nd MISS ME WITH rogers crew. Until further notice its garp n roger vs RDX, WB, BM, SHIKI, KAIDO, etc. If wb n roger are equal then in order to win either garp or roger has to be a lot more powerful than we're acknowledging. A) why would you rate Garp in his prime below. Prime wb? B) if hes below wb then why did it only take he n roger to best all those powerful pirates at once if garp is below wb??? Why do people believe garps "hype" is a government hoax??  1 of the feats ppl use for garp is him one hitting marco when he tried to make it to the scaffold. I think garp was holding back. Moreover i think he hit Marco to SAVE MARCO. Garp has Coo and if its anything like coby (whom garp trained in coo) then he likely foresaw sengoku going full kill you on Marco and jumped in instead. So in my own lil head cannon garp hit marco with kid gloves but whatever. Why's garp not as powerful as its says he is? Im curious on why some still sleep on the old monkey d.



Garp is a marine therefore the Yonk forces are on a holy, eternal crusade to place him below the others.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Canute87 (Dec 28, 2019)

Yes he was.

However Garp/Roger  was clearly a  Tsundere relationship.

You don't team up to take down a menace and believe that they are ever going to truly fight to the death.

It's just not going to happen.


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## ImpalerDragon (Dec 28, 2019)

Why would garp be roger or whitebeard level? He only chase after roger and roger turn himself in.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Gledania (Dec 29, 2019)

1 ) The exact translation of buggy state he was the *only man* who could fight roger.
Viz translation says he was the only one. The french official version says "le seul homme" (the only man) and the anime also says he was the only man (as far as I checked)

I asked Sandman and SubtereanErroist , both japanese speakers in AP forums , and they even gave me the raw material :

白ひげは、あいつはな、かつて”海賊王”ロジャーと唯一互角に戦った伝説の怪物なんだ


He was the only man to match roger in ability/be evenly matched/be on par. *唯一互角*.

*Spoiler*: __ 









2 ) Sengoku who knew both garp and WB for decades (and fought the later)  still viewed WB to be the WSM to that day despite being sick and on medical support , Shiki viewed roger above garp and sengoku (and he already fought Roger and Garp in god valley). Hell , even Garp view him as the ruler of the Sea. All of those fought WB. This is objectively speaking a better hype than Garp.

The only argument you can point is that Roger and Garp fought multiples times and almost killed each others (as stated by roger himself)  , which contradict buggy's claim. Moreover , Rox was roger's most formidable rival.  So baggy claim lost it's value of WB being the only man who could fight on par with him.

*The problem with this argument is :

- *Roger did not state *where and when* he and garp fought each others (just that they did it multiple times)
- Baggy was still a baby when Rox fought Roger in god valley. (one year old)
- We know he was in the crew 30 years ago when he was 9 , and left it when he was 14/15 approximately (when roger disbanded the crew)
- During this time , and only this one , he followed roger and didn't* see him* fight on par against anyone , *bar WB himself,* which led him to believe he was his only rival. (otherwise he wouldn't state "the only man"). It would be extremely unlikely that Roger would leave the crew for nor reason , go to fight Garp , came up full of scars (almost death) and hide to everyone that he had a clash with garp (btw top tiers fighting each others resonate over the world , even Mihawk/Shanks fight did so ... so let alone the crew ignoring Garp and roger are fighting each others ...)

It could be that during this 5/6 years of his life , Roger (and WB) reached their peak (by unlocking a new ability or eating a DF)  , and became above Garp and sengoku , who despite being near them (enough to give them a good fight) ,where no longer able to beat them or fight them on equal stand for long. *reason why Sengoku call him the WSM. 

Other possibility *would be that WB kept growing stronger even after roger death , surpassing Garp , sengoku *and Roger.

Another problem is : 
*
The reason why Roger pointed out garp exchange with him (fighting to death)  was not to hype it's strength , *it was to point out how their countless fights built a strong trust *among them after years of fighting : they know each other for long ery well. If roger main point was to hype garp strenght , he wouldn't add in the same sentence "I trust you as much as I would trust *a member of my crew (*which are not equal to roger ...)
Just like WB/Roger or Mihawk/Shanks fights have built a friendship , roger/garp fights have created mutual trust.

Therefor , the only logical conclusion is : Roger = WB > Garp but the gap isn't huge.

Other potential rebuttals :
*Why did Roger give Ace to garp and not anyone else ? He trusted WB and Ray.
*
Beside trust ? Well , Garp is a high ranking marine and viewed as an *enemy *of Roger. He would ensure Ace safety without any suspicions from the WG.  Roger wanted his kid to *be safe* , nothing more nothing less.

Ray was chased by the marines , same for WB who had hundreds of ennemies , and some of his allies might even hate roger (like squardo).

Which one who you have chosen in similar case ?

Now to answer the question : Was he pirate king level ?? I don't know. What is exactly pirate king level ??? How much would the current top tiers would give difficulty to Prime roger ?

Btw , I'm pretty sure that if Garp had the gura gura , or another dope DF , *he *would have been the WSM.  (Yes , I believe Garp with a DF > Anyone , so stop jumping on conclusions and calling me a hater @MasterBeast  I like garp , but WB is > Garp)


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## TheWiggian (Dec 29, 2019)

Friendly reminder Prime Garp = Primebeard = Roger

Reactions: Like 1


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## Quikdraw7777 (Dec 30, 2019)

I like Garp, but I feel like Roger & Xebec were on some (read: *OTHER*) level shit.

I'm still under the notion that the Gura Gura gave Whitebeard what was required to get up there with Roger .


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## Bash24 (Jan 1, 2020)

No he was the next best thing after Roger and WB. So to put this into perspective if Garp was pirate his bounty would have been in the high 4B's like Kaido imo.


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## Charlotte D. Kurisu (Jan 2, 2020)

Roger = Primebeard = Xebec = Garp > YonkouBeard = Big Mom = Kaido = Shanks > Oldbeard = Current Blackbeard = Old Garp > MarinefordBeard = Pre-Skip Blackbeard

Reactions: Like 1


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## Gledania (Jan 4, 2020)

Charlotte D. Kurisu said:


> Roger = Primebeard = Xebec = Garp > YonkouBeard = Big Mom = Kaido = Shanks > Oldbeard = Current Blackbeard = Old Garp > MarinefordBeard = Pre-Skip Blackbeard



And guess what ? Zoro > All of them exept luffy.


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## convict (Jan 5, 2020)

Roger/WB: 99-100 (ie complete equals or Akainu vs Aokiji). Because they were almost friends they never really fought with 100% intensity and bloodlust to kill it looks like. If they did you HAVE to bet on Roger being the Akainu in this situation or it is like Dorry/Broggy.

Garp: 96 (ie can give high/extreme diff but the above 2 win 10/10).

For reference I have Kaido at 96, Shanks/Rayleigh at 93, and Sengoku at 90.


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## MrPopo (Jan 5, 2020)

Quikdraw7777 said:


> I like Garp, but I feel like Roger & Xebec were on some (read: *OTHER*) level shit.
> 
> I'm still under the notion that the Gura Gura gave Whitebeard what was required to get up there with Roger .


Garp beat Xebec


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## convict (Jan 5, 2020)

Xebec was Roger's greatest enemy. Garp was essential to their downfall but I suspect Roger beat Xebec.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Vivo Diez (Jan 5, 2020)

Yes. This point keeps getting reinforced more and more as we go along in the series.


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## TheWiggian (Jan 6, 2020)

We have 2020 and some users still haven't accepted Garp in all his PK strenght glory

Reactions: Like 3


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## Duke Ysmir01 (Jan 6, 2020)

Prime Garp would beat all nerds of the new generation from all sides of this war with a hand tied behind his back while pissing 

Prime Garp was not only PK tier, he was Marine King tier

Reactions: Like 3


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## J★J♥ (Jan 10, 2020)

I would say no before rocks reveal, but now equal or slightly stronger than Roger.


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## sanninme rikudo (Jan 10, 2020)

They guy cornered the PK numerous times and he’s not pirate king level?

Give me a break...


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## trance (Jan 11, 2020)

tier specialist post


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## Tornado (Jan 11, 2020)

Not buying it. Old Garp did not have any sickness but was still weaker than old WB which suggests he wasn't WB lvl in his prime.


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## Blanco (Jan 11, 2020)

near equals


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## CaptainCommander (Jan 11, 2020)

Is this still open? The question isn't whether or not Garp was on their level, its if WB was ever on their level without Roger being sick.


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## Beast (Jan 11, 2020)

Tornado said:


> Not buying it. Old Garp did not have any sickness but was still weaker than old WB which suggests he wasn't WB lvl in his prime.


Because WB was the WSM? 
WB was the WSM even before Roger died.


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