# Tsunade vs A (Fourth Raikage)



## Android (Aug 22, 2017)

No knowledge for both kages except reputation.
KCM Naruto vs A is the location.
No holds barred.
Both have war saga feats, stamina .. etc
How does it go ?


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## Veracity (Aug 22, 2017)

Going with Tsunade. Ay typically doesn't use his max speed at match start and with his lack of knowledge I think his first move will be V1. At that level of speed he proves faster than Tsunade but not fast enough to catch her without a reaction. I could easily see her grabbing his arm after taking the first blow and countering which would leave Ay at the _very least_ on the brink of death. Tsunade is Ay's physical superior in terms of strength, with insane resilience, and a 5 in taijustu skill so I can see her pulling this off. She wouldn't even need Katsuyu or Byakago assuming Ay doesn't go all out.

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 2


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## Itachі (Aug 22, 2017)

Tsunade wins this in my opinion. Without full knowledge Ei is not going to put down Tsunade with his first attack. I think she's just going to end up countering him and leaving him either dead or seriously wounded.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## Rocky (Aug 22, 2017)

Veracity said:


> I could easily see her grabbing his arm after taking the first blow and countering which would leave Ay at the _very least_ on the brink of death.


If she were to attempt that, he'd just take his free hand and punch her in the face while she was winding up. Besides, I don't know what makes you think she wouldn't go flying if she got hit by Raikage. She can barely react to him, if she can at all. It'd be no different than Madara kicking Sage Naruto. 

Btw, Tsunade wouldn't open with Susanoo-busting strength for the same reason Ay wouldn't open with Sasuke-blitzing speed.

Reactions: Like 1 | Disagree 1


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## Veracity (Aug 22, 2017)

Rocky said:


> If she were to attempt that, he'd just take his free hand and punch her in the face while she was winding up. Besides, I don't know what makes you think she wouldn't go flying if she got hit by Raikage. She can barely react to him, if she can at all. It'd be no different than Madara kicking Sage Naruto.
> 
> Btw, Tsunade wouldn't open with Susanoo-busting strength for the same reason Ay wouldn't open with Sasuke-blitzing speed.



Which wouldn't matter at all because once Tsuande has Raikage in a hold the match is basically over. I see her landing her next blow before Ay lands his; his movement speed is vastly superior but his striking speed isn't really.

Because her physical strength is massively superior to his and if she reacts anything like , then she'll be able to counter attack.

If Tsunade knows that she can't hit Ay( his title as fastest shinobi) then she'll probably got for a one shot before Ay goes for max speed.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Android (Aug 22, 2017)

Who wants to see @Turrin debating Tsunade vs A with @Rocky ?

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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## Rocky (Aug 22, 2017)

Veracity said:


> Which wouldn't matter at all because once Tsuande has Raikage in a hold the match is basically over


No, because punching her in the face would make her let go, mostly because she'd go flying.



Veracity said:


> I see her landing her next blow before Ay lands his; his movement speed is vastly superior but his striking speed isn't really.


There's no difference lol. I mean, Ay's fastest attack is a _punch._



Veracity said:


> Because her physical strength is massively superior to his


We don't really know that. We know she _hits_ much harder, but she has access to Ōkashō, which is a technique that allows Sakura to hit harder than both Ay and Tsunade without _any_ natural super strength. 



Veracity said:


> if she reacts anything like , then she'll be able to counter attack.


Actually, she'll go flying like Naruto did because there are no walls here for Raikage to carry her into. 



Veracity said:


> If Tsunade knows that she can't hit Ay( his title as fastest shinobi) then she'll probably got for a one shot before Ay goes for max speed.


She won't know that she needs her maximum strength or close to it to "one-shot". Not even Mabui knew of Ay's superhuman durability, and Tsunade won't have any knowledge on the defensive properties of his lightning armor.


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## Rocky (Aug 22, 2017)

Oh btw Jūgo did counterattack. He fired lasers into Raikage's face at point-blank range while Raikage's arm was stuck inside of his chest. Ay still loldodged, and I'm sure we all remember what happened to Jūgo.


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## Veracity (Aug 22, 2017)

Rocky said:


> No, because punching her in the face would make her let go, mostly because she'd go flying.
> 
> 
> There's no difference lol. I mean, Ay's fastest attack is a _punch._
> ...



I don't think so lol. I think Tsunade would hold on better than most because she can fight at all 100% while taking damage unlike pretty much everyone. 

He's moving around his opponent at high speeds and attacking from their blind spot or he throws his punch _while_ he moves; which means the first punch is incredibly fast but he isn't a rapid style puncher like Gai.

She uses chakra enhanced strength while in Base, and unless you believe she's taking more than an entire days worth of chakra per punch, then punches without Byakago should also be Sussano-busting.

There are boulders in the surrounding background and I'd assume the momentum would come to a stop and leave them both frozen in the middle of the battlefield with Tsunade taking damage in order to grab Raikage's arm.

Tsuande completely obliterated Madara with a punch despite not needing even close to that much power lol, so I don't see her going that easy on Ay based on his appearance and the fact that his body is shielded by lightning and the fact that she has been hyped to kill people in one shot.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Veracity (Aug 22, 2017)

Rocky said:


> Oh btw Jūgo did counterattack. He fired lasers into Raikage's face at point-blank range while Raikage's arm was stuck inside of his chest. Ay still loldodged, and I'm sure we all remember what happened to Jūgo.


That's because there was nothing stopping Ay from moving other than the skin around his arm. Do you think that holds him in place better than someone that can toss building sized swords in the air while rusty and at the bad end of Part one inflation?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Rocky (Aug 22, 2017)

Veracity said:


> I think Tsunade would hold on better than most because she can fight at all 100% while taking damage unlike pretty much everyone.


Her pain tolerance doesn't stop her from being sent flying, and you act as if Tsunade doesn't even flinch when taking damage. Even if she didn't go flying, for whatever reason, she'd be stunned long enough for Raikage to just back up or punch her again.



Veracity said:


> He's moving around his opponent at high speeds and attacking from their blind spot or he throws his punch _while_ he moves; which means the first punch is incredibly fast but he isn't a rapid style puncher like Gai.


He could punch in quick succession if he wanted to, just like any other human being with arms could. He couldn't punch as rapidly as Gai does during Asa Kujaku, but that's limited to Asa Kujaku. Outside of that, Gai basically does the exact same shit as Raikage. Hirudora is one fast punch, "moving around his opponent at high speeds and attacking from their blind spot" is a perfect description of what Gai did to Madara with Sekizō, and Yagai is just a really awesome kick.



Veracity said:


> She uses chakra enhanced strength while in Base, and unless you believe she's taking more than an entire days worth of chakra per punch, then punches without Byakago should also be Sussano-busting.


I don't even know what you're trying to say here. Ōkashō has nothing to do with the release of the Yin Seal. Sakura wasn't using Byakugō when she started hitting harder than Tsunade. Tsunade could crack Susanoo without her regeneration active, but I'm not sure what that has to do with anything I've been saying.



Veracity said:


> There are boulders in the surrounding background and I'd assume the momentum would come to a stop and leave them both frozen in the middle of the battlefield with Tsunade taking damage in order to grab Raikage's arm.


..or she'd go flying like Naruto did in that _exact_ same location like five times. 



Veracity said:


> I don't see her going that easy on Ay based on his appearance and the fact that his body is shielded by lightning and the fact that she has been hyped to kill people in one shot.


She's not going easy. She's using force she believes will be enough and the only reason it won't be is Ay's abnormal durability & armor. This is kinda irrelevant though because by the time she got her hands on Raikage (which is probably never btw) she'd likely be using her max strength anyway.

Reactions: Like 1


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## oiety (Aug 22, 2017)

Tsunade is stronger than A, but I believe he wins this matchup.

-Both entered the Heavenly Transmission
-A received no damage, Tsunade had some scratches, so A's durability should be above Tsunade's
-Beforehand, A easily cut his own arm off while in RnY

Therefore, given his superior speed, even if his strength is lower I can see him going for a decapitation/dismemberment victory before she can sufficiently pummel him.


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## t0xeus (Aug 22, 2017)

Ay goes V1 and attacks, Tsunade tries to block but since her durability isn't anything special, Ay's Raiton-powered arm goes through Tsunade's body easily.

He wins this in his first attack imo.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Disagree 1


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## LostSelf (Aug 22, 2017)

Ei is too fast for Tsunade. Even in V1. And his attacks are easily bypassing her considering his attacks are cutting.

With reputation knowledge, the Raikage knows she's both: Pretty strong and is capable of healing herself.

So expect him to go for the cutting. With superior reflexes, nothing stops Ei from cutting her limbs and dismantling her. She can't compete with the Raikage in close combat.

He's a bad matchup as he bypasses her regen. Or at least, can exhaust it pretty fast.

Reactions: Neutral 1


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## FlamingRain (Aug 22, 2017)

Tsunade will be able to pressure Ay with her strength because she's Tsunade, and Raikage will be able to pressure Tsunade with his speed because he's Raikage.

If Katsuyu comes out Tsunade gains a much greater advantage over Ay, though, and her resilience probably gives her the time she needs to resort to it.

Tsunade more often than not, due to having a wider margin for error.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Bonly (Aug 22, 2017)

Byakugo pretty much allows her to take whatever damage he can dish out while I doubt A could take to many of Tsunade's hits. Tsunade shouldn't have to many problems with A's speed until he goes V2 upon which she'd prolly get ragdolled for a bit unless she has Katsuyu out.

 A's problem is that he can't put her down for good without cutting off her head which Tsunade could defend from for a while and to add to it I doubt he could keep spamming V2 for a good while which means he'd be fighting in V1 upon which Tsunade has good chance to land some pretty hard hits to tip the scales in her favor.

I'd favor Tsunade thanks to her ability to take more hits with Byakugo while A's main shot at winning involves V2 which I doubt he could spam for to long

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Ryuzaki (Aug 22, 2017)

It really comes down to a fight of attrition and how much chakra is stored in her seal. Raikage isn't going to be taken down by her because she is too slow but at the same time Raikage can't kill her. Tsunade can win if she gets him to use up all his stamina, but he was one of the few that wasn't gassed.


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## hbcaptain (Aug 22, 2017)

Featwise, Raikage can easily beat her with a punch to the head but if the fight actually happened in the manga, then I think Tsunade would win giving the difference of portrayal between the two.


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## Isaiah13000 (Aug 22, 2017)

Tsunade is portrayed as stronger than A, so that already makes me lean towards her more. Although match-ups do exist in this series, so that can always affect the outcome. However, with them both being presumably IC and only having knowledge based on each other's reputation all I see happening is A going V1 and punching a hole through Tsunade, only for her to play dead, grab his arm, and then end him with a punch. Suigetsu and Jugo could both react to V1 A, so I don't buy the notion that she can't react to V1 A at all. Even if he does pull away and dodge, he really can't actually kill her and put her down so I see them both going back and forth for a little bit until she gets annoyed and summons Katsuyu in which case I see them defeating A together even if he does go V2. Especially since she can always punch the ground to keep him at bay since he can't blitz her if he has no ground to run on.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Anbu Knights (Aug 22, 2017)

Ay wins easily.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Hi no Ishi (Aug 22, 2017)

Physically they were shown to be equal but different so I think this fight is 50/50.

Tsunade stands the greater chance of surviving and counter attacking, while A stands the best chance of getting the first blow in.


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## Android (Aug 22, 2017)

LostSelf said:


> Ei is too fast for Tsunade. Even in V1. And his attacks are easily bypassing her considering his attacks are cutting.
> 
> With reputation knowledge, the Raikage knows she's both: Pretty strong and is capable of healing herself.
> 
> ...


TBH with you, when I saw that you made a post in this thread I was like "let's go and see what kind of sarcastic reply Lost will come up with since this is a Tsunade thread".
Guess I owe you an apology.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 3 | Friendly 1


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## LostSelf (Aug 22, 2017)

Cosmos said:


> TBH with you, when I saw that you made a post in this thread I was like "let's go and see what kind of sarcastic reply Lost will come up with since this is a Tsunade thread".
> Guess I owe you an apology.



Not all the time i would troll. Sometimes i am being serious and joking at the same time. But:

Tsunade wins. Speed is so overrated here. She's a Sannin, and was portrayed above him. Don't ask me when she was, just believe me. So, considering she's above him, she should do 700 push ups before the Raikage crosses 15 meters and she would punch him, too. Let's stop the speed wank, guys.

I mean, she tagged Madara, why wouldn't she tag the Raikage? A Sannin would never be speedblitzed,

There, you owe me nothing now .

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 9


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## Mithos (Aug 22, 2017)

Tsunade would struggle against the Raikage's speed, but she should be able to react to many of his attacks in close quarters; indeed, Naruto easily managed to block A's punch when he was mid-air, and Suigetsu intercepted A's chop on Sasuke.

A Lariat may be overpowered, if she reacts in time. A's best chance is to land Lariats or elbow/tackles straight from a Shunshin, so Tsunade doesn't have time/has less time to react to him. Tsunade could heal damage she receives, however, with either Souzou Saisei or Byakugou, and she could proactively defend herself by smashing the ground and preventing A from having a short, direct path to her since Shunshin is linear. In fact, Katsuyu would be perfect for this: If Tsunade is standing on top of Katsuyu, A cannot blitz her with his Shunshin. Katsuyu could also spread out her clones throughout the battlefield and act as walls to impede A's path to Tsunade, making him either jump or Shunshin around them, giving Tsunade time to react to his attacks and the possibility of countering them.

Because Tsunade could afford to make some mistakes thanks to Souzou Saisei/Byakugou, while A cannot take even one blow from Tsunade, I would side with her. She can't match him in speed, but she doesn't have to to fight him.

Tsunade wins after a tough battle.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Veracity (Aug 22, 2017)

Rocky said:


> Her pain tolerance doesn't stop her from being sent flying, and you act as if Tsunade doesn't even flinch when taking damage. Even if she didn't go flying, for whatever reason, she'd be stunned long enough for Raikage to just back up or punch her again.
> 
> 
> He could punch in quick succession if he wanted to, just like any other human being with arms could. He couldn't punch as rapidly as Gai does during Asa Kujaku, but that's limited to Asa Kujaku. Outside of that, Gai basically does the exact same shit as Raikage. Hirudora is one fast punch, "moving around his opponent at high speeds and attacking from their blind spot" is a perfect description of what Gai did to Madara with Sekizō, and Yagai is just a really awesome kick.
> ...



You're ignoring my intial point completely which is that Tsunade won't be blitzed here at all. If she can put up a guard then her taijustu skill is great enough to grab Ay's arm _as his fist connects. _Jugo was able to put up a guard before Ay's fist connected and his resilience, taijustu skill and physical strength all pale in comparison to Tsunade. Instead of simply putting up a guard, she would be able to grab Ay's entire arm though they would both flying unless Tsunade chose to use chakra to the feet method.

She really doesn't flinch when taking damage unless her chakra is low or Byakago is being abused. Ay's V1 blow shouldn't be enough to stun Tsunade, I mean Sakura could still finish her punched after being impaled by TSB, and she isn't even half of what Tsunade is. If this was anyone else, I think you would have had a point.

That's not even what I'm trying to say lol. I know Ay can punch more than one time like anyone can do but that isn't linked to his speed hype and feats. He may be able to cover a much larger distance than Tsunade can in the same time frame but that doesn't mean he can punch that much faster than Tsunade. He may be faster but I don't see him getting off multiple strikes while Tsuande becomes a punching bag. That would be sad for someone of her status having immense physical strength, skill and resilience.

When I said Byakago I meant the release of the Yin Seal and the chakra it gives its user. 

I don't see her going flying like Naruto at all lol. I see her having a more Jugo approach, seeing how she has more time to react in comparison to what Naruto did.

I don't see Raikage's durability to be that high tbh. So even if she doesn't outright kill him in the first strike, I see multiple organs being ruptured and Ay's performance dropping substantially leading to his defeat.


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## wooly Eullerex (Aug 22, 2017)

Ei wins because he is geared toward super-efficient taijutsu while Tsunade is not


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## Rocky (Aug 22, 2017)

Can I remind like most of the forum that Raikage isn't a jinchūriki and therefore doesn't have access to Version 1 or Version 2? His speed & power at any given time varies just like every other character in the manga. The only difference is that we're given a visual indicator (spiked hair) of when he's trying his hardest. I know people like to say "oh it's just slang" - which is fine in the case of v2, which represents a static level of speed - but "v1" could be anywhere from 99% as fast as his top speed to 1% as fast. It's a useless term.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Skaddix (Aug 22, 2017)

Veracity said:


> You're ignoring my intial point completely which is that Tsunade won't be blitzed here at all. If she can put up a guard then her taijustu skill is great enough to grab Ay's arm _as his fist connects. _Jugo was able to put up a guard before Ay's fist connected and his resilience, taijustu skill and physical strength all pale in comparison to Tsunade. Instead of simply putting up a guard, she would be able to grab Ay's entire arm though they would both flying unless Tsunade chose to use chakra to the feet method.
> 
> She really doesn't flinch when taking damage unless her chakra is low or Byakago is being abused. Ay's V1 blow shouldn't be enough to stun Tsunade, I mean Sakura could still finish her punched after being impaled by TSB, and she isn't even half of what Tsunade is. If this was anyone else, I think you would have had a point.
> 
> ...



Yeah not really guard up works for Jugo because Jugo actually has enhanced durability as shown by him deflecting swords. Tsunade doesnt so Raikage goes straight through her. The difference is Tsunade is all blunt force...Raikage punches pierce and cut through targets. 
Also Jugo got rammed into a wall hence why he stood up.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Veracity (Aug 22, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> Yeah not really guard up works for Jugo because Jugo actually has enhanced durability as shown by him deflecting swords. Tsunade doesnt so Raikage goes straight through her. The difference is Tsunade is all blunt force...Raikage punches pierce and cut through targets.
> Also Jugo got rammed into a wall hence why he stood up.



Extra durability doesn't really matter because her goal is to stop Raikage in his tracks or hold on to him, not alleviate the damage. Tsunade is also fairly durable having taken mini Yasaka without it breaking her skin.

Either Tsunade would get rammed into a rock or she would use her extra strong legs to stop the momentum after its slowed down a bit and after her and the Raikage have traveled dozens of meters.


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## Skaddix (Aug 23, 2017)

Durability matters because Raikage in motion is going to cut through Tsunade like butter. Jugo got pierced through his stomach even with greatly enhanced durability ergo Raikage would go right through.

And honestly there is no reason for him not to go full power and just decapitate her even with just reputation knowledge. Knowing Tsunade can regen and has super strength isnt hidden knowledge whereas Jugo is some no name.


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## Gohara (Aug 23, 2017)

A wins with around high difficulty at most in my opinion since he seems to be at least around as powerful as The Kage Summit Arc Sasuke who should be > Tsunade considering that Orochimaru already referred to the beginning of Naruto Shippuden Sasuke as more troublesome than himself.


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## Veracity (Aug 23, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> Durability matters because Raikage in motion is going to cut through Tsunade like butter. Jugo got pierced through his stomach even with greatly enhanced durability ergo Raikage would go right through.
> 
> And honestly there is no reason for him not to go full power and just decapitate her even with just reputation knowledge. Knowing Tsunade can regen and has super strength isnt hidden knowledge whereas Jugo is some no name.



So Ay is going to punch Tsunade and continue to move through her body and come out the other side lol? That clearly isn't going to happen especially if Tsunade grabs his fist or guards in any type of way. She's doing much less work than he is having to cover a fair distance and throw his punch while Tsunade gets to stand in place and counter.

If Ay goes all out, then the outcome changes here. I'm arguing under the idea that Ay only uses V1 to begin with.


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## Skaddix (Aug 23, 2017)

No A is going to punch her face in or decapitate her.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## FlamingRain (Aug 23, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> Durability matters because Raikage in motion is going to cut through Tsunade like butter.



There will be no cutting unless Raikage starts chopping instead of punching like he normally does.



> And honestly there is no reason for him not to go full power and just decapitate her even with just reputation knowledge. Knowing Tsunade can regen and has super strength isnt hidden knowledge whereas Jugo is some no name.



It's widely known that Tsunade is the most advanced medic. That's it. Sozo Saisei isn't common knowledge and pre-Sozo Saisei it wasn't possible for any medical ninja to heal greviously injured organs. Ay can punch a medical specialist like he would any other person and get the same result.

Ay doesn't know Tsunade is the exception, and he probably doesn't know the degree of her super strength either. He may figure he's safe charging straight at her with his normal levels of speed because of his durability and lightning aura based on reputation. Painful surprise waiting there.

Oh and decapitation is a made up solution to Sozo Saisei.


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## Skaddix (Aug 23, 2017)

Raikage's punches have piercing ability is the point. As shown by his fist going into Jugo's stomach. And Jugo has far more enhanced durability then Tsunade.

She is Legendary Sannin. There is no reason for him not go all out on her. Also I am not saying its common knowledge but Ei is a Kage so he is not a guy with standard common knowledge. Plus he does know what MS is based on immediately boosting his abilities when Sasuke activated it so again common knowledge for your standard Ninja not the same as common knowledge for a Kage.

Well there is no proof she can survive it but even so considering she needed Orochimaru's help to put her body back together after getting cut in half. It should still incapacitate her.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Veracity (Aug 23, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> No A is going to punch her face in or decapitate her.


That's really doubtful as that didn't happen to Jugo at all. Even outside of his durability, he was at no harm of being decapitated. I can't imagine Tsunade of all people being decapitated by Ay's intial punch.


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## t0xeus (Aug 23, 2017)

Bonly said:


> Byakugo pretty much allows her to take whatever damage he can dish out while I doubt A could take to many of Tsunade's hits. Tsunade shouldn't have to many problems with A's speed until he goes V2 upon which she'd prolly get ragdolled for a bit unless she has Katsuyu out.
> 
> A's problem is that he can't put her down for good without cutting off her head which Tsunade could defend from for a while and to add to it I doubt he could keep spamming V2 for a good while which means he'd be fighting in V1 upon which Tsunade has good chance to land some pretty hard hits to tip the scales in her favor.
> 
> I'd favor Tsunade thanks to her ability to take more hits with Byakugo while A's main shot at winning involves V2 which I doubt he could spam for to long


Why do you think that Tsunade can block his attacks?

Raiton no Yoroi arm went through another Raiton no Yoroi body part (also arm) like butter. It showed us that Ay's durability in V2 is weaker than his offensive capabilities.

So unless Tsunade's durability is > V2 Ay's, which we know it isn't (the teleportation technique that Ay had no problem with, while Tsunade did), his attacks can't be countered by Tsunade without losing the body part she's blocking it with.


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## Bonly (Aug 23, 2017)

t0xeus said:


> Why do you think that Tsunade can block his attacks?
> 
> Raiton no Yoroi arm went through another Raiton no Yoroi body part (also arm) like butter. It showed us that Ay's durability in V2 is weaker than his offensive capabilities.
> 
> So unless Tsunade's durability is > V2 Ay's, which we know it isn't (the teleportation technique that Ay had no problem with, while Tsunade did), his attacks can't be countered by Tsunade without losing the body part she's blocking it with.





As you can see above A went back to base after Gaara stopped his and Sasuke's attack and only coated one of his hands in Raiton when he cut off his arm that had the Ama flames on them.


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## FlamingRain (Aug 23, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> Raikage's punches have piercing ability is the point. As shown by his fist going into Jugo's stomach. And Jugo has far more enhanced durability then Tsunade.



They didn't pierce Naruto, Bee or Madara. He put a hole in Jugo because he slammed him into a wall and was able to press against his skin.

Jugo has a durability enhancement but that doesn't necessarily mean he's more durable than Tsunade innately is. She survived a jump that normally rips people apart with minor injuries, and then tanked a Magatama hitting her so hard she busted open the rock she flew into without any discernible injury.



> She is Legendary Sannin. There is no reason for him not go all out on her.



There was no less of a reason not to use his full speed against Naruto and Sasuke, and he can go all out yet opt for a punch instead of decapitation.



> Also I am not saying its common knowledge but Ei is a Kage so he is not a guy with standard common knowledge. Plus he does know what MS is based on immediately boosting his abilities when Sasuke activated it so again common knowledge for your standard Ninja not the same as common knowledge for a Kage.



Now that I'm thinking about the Madara fight...why was Ay so surprised when Tsunade survived being impaled by Madara the first time it happened?



> Well there is no proof she can survive it but even so considering she needed Orochimaru's help to put her body back together after getting cut in half. It should still incapacitate her.



Her Jutsu works by stimulating all proteins that make up the body to accelerate cell generation. Going with that method there would be nothing special about a head, so getting around a Jutsu repeatedly said to be able to recreate any organs and limbs/tissues/parts shouldn't be as simple as aiming for her neck.

She needed Orochimaru's help because she was almost out of Chakra. Remember the Byakugo state wasn't even active.


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## LostSelf (Aug 23, 2017)

I don't think Ei would go for decapitation (or not right of the bat at the very least).

But if Tsunade's decapitated, regeneration or not, she's not winning this fight. She took several facial expressions from the Gokage to regenerate a stab wound. 

A head won't come out Picollo style. Ei's not going to stand there amazed as it happens either.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Lord Tentei (Aug 23, 2017)

Are we forgetting the fact if he has V1 stage active her coming into contact with his lightning would freeze up her body because of the electrical current shutting down her muscle synapses? 

That alone would give the Raikage enough time to deliver a killing blow IMHO.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Lord Tentei (Aug 23, 2017)

I think people forget the lighting isn't just for speed to also protect his body during his taijutsu assault. It shocks me that everyone forgets what Raiton can do to your body.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## t0xeus (Aug 23, 2017)

Bonly said:


> As you can see above A went back to base after Gaara stopped his and Sasuke's attack and only coated one of his hands in Raiton when he cut off his arm that had the Ama flames on them.


I see.

Still Raikage's base durability should be around Tsunade's durability, base or not. 

And even if you disagree, he still cut through his arm like nothing, so even if Tsunade is a little bit durable - the result shouldn't differ. Or?


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## Beyonce (Aug 23, 2017)

Grandpa Uchiha said:


> Are we forgetting the fact if he has V1 stage active her coming into contact with his lightning would freeze up her body because of the electrical current shutting down her muscle synapses?
> 
> That alone would give the Raikage enough time to deliver a killing blow IMHO.



Tsunade's was able to move around and fight when she had 2 Susanoo swords lodged in her spine. She was conscious and was able to move when her spine got outright severed. Not to mention the fact that she has an affinity for lightning to boost. Tsunade shouldn't freeze up.


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## Bonly (Aug 23, 2017)

t0xeus said:


> I see.
> 
> Still Raikage's base durability should be around Tsunade's durability, base or not.
> 
> And even if you disagree, he still cut through his arm like nothing, so even if Tsunade is a little bit durable - the result shouldn't differ. Or?



I agree he was shown to be more durable when they both went through that Mabui's Jutsu. A can only cut her if he goes for chops and assuming you've read the manga you'll know he doesn't strictly chop 24/7 so she can still block against some of his attacks.


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## Lord Tentei (Aug 23, 2017)

Beyonce said:


> Tsunade's was able to move around and fight when she had 2 Susanoo swords lodged in her spine. She was conscious and was able to move when her spine got outright severed. Not to mention the fact that she has an affinity for lightning to boost. Tsunade shouldn't freeze up.



There is a big difference. Susanoo is a spectral being based on the Uchiha handler's life force which is where they draw their power to make the spectral being which is the second requirement outside the Mangekyo. It isn't the same as an actual element. Two different abilities. The Susanoo swords are real but they aren't freezing up her muscles. When electricity strikes your body, it creates burns on the outer layer of the flesh. The electric currents within the Raiton itself would cause the muscles to spasm creating a slight delay in her movements. 

If Tsunade struck V1 or even V2 Ai the moment freeze would be enough to allow Ai to cause a blow that would surely damage her severely not to mention the force his palm would have going into her body would create the muscle freeze. Take Kakashi's Raikiri for example as a perfect mention to what I mean for an example for what it does to people. Dropping people like a sack of potatoes. In actuality, she is at a disadvantage attempting Taijutsu.


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## Lord Tentei (Aug 23, 2017)

I never seen her use Lightning. Reality is with no knowledge of his abilities she wouldn't know he had Raiton. Just because you have Raiton doesn't nullify it's effects. Her entire body would also have to be fully encased in Raiton which she can't or doesn't do so the way AI does. So, that is a mute point on your end no offense.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Isaiah13000 (Aug 23, 2017)

Grandpa Uchiha said:


> Are we forgetting the fact if he has V1 stage active her coming into contact with his lightning would freeze up her body because of the electrical current shutting down her muscle synapses?
> 
> That alone would give the Raikage enough time to deliver a killing blow IMHO.


 When was this ever illustrated happening when A was attacking someone with LRCM active?

Reactions: Creative 1


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## Android (Aug 23, 2017)

Isaiah13000 said:


> When was this ever illustrated happening when A was attacking someone with LRCM active?


I sure didn't see it happen when A hit Suigetsu, Juugo, Sasuke, Naruto, Madara ...etc

Reactions: Like 2 | Optimistic 1


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## Ashi (Aug 23, 2017)

I think Ay edges it out

Superior speed, and has enough fire power to down Tsunade


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## JiraiyaFlash (Aug 23, 2017)

Base Rusty Tsunade tanked Kusanagi slashes thru her lungs and heart
Base heavily drained Tsunade tanked CST (which is her spot was the center of the AoE)
Sozo Saizei Tsunade healed thousands of people who are heavily damaged by Deva, Animal and Asura Paths
Byakugo Tsunade healed her spine. Tanked Yasaka Magatama.. ANd even after bisected still able to summon Medium Size Katsuyu and heal her comrades

So due to some optimistic people Raikage gonna cut Tsunade ? Who even able to chop V1 rib cage susano which far below from Tsunade in terms of durability & resillience ? 

Since Tsunade has raiton too her attacks can infiltrate his raiton armor.

Outlasting + Rashinsho + CES Punch to head -> its good enough for Ay. 

Tsunade with mid to high diff.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## t0xeus (Aug 23, 2017)

Bonly said:


> I agree he was shown to be more durable when they both went through that Mabui's Jutsu. A can only cut her if he goes for chops and assuming you've read the manga you'll know he doesn't strictly chop 24/7 so she can still block against some of his attacks.


Block first few maybe, but Ay isn't stupid and will realize quickly that he needs to chop. Or is there a reason why he would punch her for more than once or twice?

He can simply punch her, knock her back with it, and then follow up with Shunshin + Chop.


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## Bonly (Aug 23, 2017)

t0xeus said:


> Block first few maybe, but Ay isn't stupid and will realize quickly that he needs to chop. Or is there a reason why he would punch her for more than once or twice?
> 
> He can simply punch her, knock her back with it, and then follow up with Shunshin + Chop.



I never said he wouldn't go for a chop, did I? You asked why I think she could block his attacks.  I told you why she could block some of them as they all won't be chops. Nothing more, nothing less.

Reactions: Friendly 1


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## Lord Tentei (Aug 23, 2017)

Well, I am basing my findings on actual science. While that may not be the case in their universe, however, I do believe Ai could do more damage to her than expected.


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## Rocky (Aug 23, 2017)

FlamingRain said:


> It's widely known that Tsunade is the most advanced medic. That's it.


That's _probably_ not true lol. I mean, if people know enough about Jiraiya to call him the "Toad Sage," then it's pretty likely that word has gotten out about Tsunade's herculean strength. 



FlamingRain said:


> There was no less of a reason not to use his full speed against Naruto and Sasuke


For most of that confrontation with Naruto, Ay was only trying to stop him from getting by, and he used enough speed to accomplish that every time Naruto tried to do so. When Ay did finally go on the offensive, he went all in right away. As for Sasuke, I happen to think that was a case of arrogance (against the Sharingan) and the Raikage's pissy mood. He seems to respect the Sannin just a _bit_ more than he does Sasuke lol. Besides, as soon as the sauce revealed the Mangekyō - which Ay _did_ consider a threat, unlike the regular Sharingan - Raikage stopped playing around.


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## FlamingRain (Aug 23, 2017)

Rocky said:


> That's _probably_ not true lol. I mean, if people know enough about Jiraiya to call him the "Toad Sage," then it's pretty likely that word has gotten out about Tsunade's herculean strength.



I meant as far as what she could heal up.

Her strength is legendary so somebody's got to know about it. The question is whether they've learned about specific feats or whether they've simply heard that she's generically really strong. I mean Kabuto was surprised when she exploded the rampart at Tanzaku Castle.

Same with Ay's speed from Tsunade's perspective.



> For most of that confrontation with Naruto, Ay was only trying to stop him from getting by, and he used enough speed to accomplish that every time Naruto tried to do so. When Ay did finally go on the offensive, he went all in right away. As for Sasuke, I happen to think that was a case of arrogance (against the Sharingan) and the Raikage's pissy mood. He seems to respect the Sannin just a _bit_ more than he does Sasuke lol. Besides, as soon as the sauce revealed the Mangekyō - which Ay _did_ consider a threat, unlike the regular Sharingan - Raikage stopped playing around.



Does Ay consider Tsunade's eyes (and insight) better than a Nine Tails Jinchuriki and the Sharingan?


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## Skaddix (Aug 23, 2017)

Well the MS thing is more Ei have more then just common knowledge...the average ninja doesn't know what MS is. Ei does know because when he sees it he takes Sasuke far more serious. 

So yes I think Ei would know Tsunade has super strength and can regenerate damage.


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## Orochimaruwantsyourbody (Aug 23, 2017)

Durability is inconsistent. We see that Itachi and Kakashi can block Jinchuriki strikes without much damage if they brace themselves when logically they should be seriously damaged, one Path of Pein gets blinded by SM Jiraiya's kick only for his punch to be blocked a minute later, and those are just several of many examples. The fact that Tsunade's hands don't disintegrate when she throws her punches doesn't make much sense, but taking that into account it seems likely that she can block (or even grab) the Raikage's hits if she reacts to them.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Neutral 1


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## Rocky (Aug 23, 2017)

FlamingRain said:


> Her strength is legendary so somebody's got to know about it. The question is whether they've learned about specific feats or whether they've simply heard that she's generically really strong. I mean Kabuto was surprised when she exploded the rampart at Tanzaku Castle. Same with Ay's speed from Tsunade's perspective.


Yep, no arguments there.



FlamingRain said:


> Does Ay consider Tsunade's eyes (and insight) better than a Nine Tails Jinchuriki and the Sharingan?


I mean she does have dat tier 5 anticipation. 

All joking aside, he probably doesn't think that lol. Using his full power isn't just about blitzing people, though.  and (presumably) the durability of his armor, not to mention his ability to react to and evade stuff. It affects pretty much everything Raikage wants to do, unlike most fighters who mold and weaponize a specific amount of chakra for their ninjutsu regardless of their overall chakra levels at the time. He may decide against significantly nerfing himself due to the amount of respect her title garners alone. That said, I could also see both of them holding back to start things off, based simply off of how many times we saw characters jobbing for no logical reason in the manga.


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## Rocky (Aug 23, 2017)

Orochimaruwantsyourbody said:


> Durability is inconsistent. We see that Itachi and Kakashi can block Jinchuriki strikes without much damage if they brace themselves when logically they should be seriously damaged, one Path of Pein gets blinded by SM Jiraiya's kick only for his punch to be blocked a minute later, and those are just several of many examples. The fact that Tsunade's hands don't disintegrate when she throws her punches doesn't make much sense, but taking that into account it seems likely that she can block (or even grab) the Raikage's hits if she reacts to them.


Buuuut wouldn't this logic also apply in reverse..?


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## Orochimaruwantsyourbody (Aug 23, 2017)

Rocky said:


> Buuuut wouldn't this logic also apply in reverse..?


To a large degree, yes. Orochimaru with his strange body was able to survive a punch to the face so her hits aren't auto kills to ultra durable character who see it coming. Still, she hits harder, has more grappling strength, and if they exchange blows she can regenerate damage while he can't. She needs those advantages though because his speed will give him much easier times landing hits. If he sees a hit coming and can only block (rather than dodge) he would probably be somewhat hurt but still function, IMO.

I see this as an evenly matched fight where the Raikage has one path to victory which has a high probability, while Tsunade has five paths to victory that are unlikely individually but have a high probably when combined.

Raikage can win with an attack to the head/neck she fails to react to, while Tsunade can win with a surprise attack (moderately likely in a no knowledge situation), getting ahold of him and turning it into a match of strength (grappling) more than speed (don't know how likely), Katsuyu acid (unlikely), paralyzing him (unlikely) or repeatedly giving him indirect hits that wear him down (unlikely).

Reactions: Like 1


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## Fleet Admiral Akainu (Aug 23, 2017)

Tsunade gets babyshaked...

The manga confirms shes helpless against the Raikage...

He's even been hyped for bijuu level chakra, she can't outlast him...


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## Veracity (Aug 23, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> Well the MS thing is more Ei have more then just common knowledge...the average ninja doesn't know what MS is. Ei does know because when he sees it he takes Sasuke far more serious.
> 
> So yes I think Ei would know Tsunade has super strength and *can regenerate damage.*



Very doubtful.

Outside of Shizune, nobody had knowledge of Sozo Saizei until it was used at chapter 169, considering Jirayia and Orochimaru had no idea Tsunade possessed such ability. And I find it doubtful that any of them were running around spreading information about Tsunade's regeneration considering the circumstance.

Outside of Sakura and Shizune, nobody had knowledge on Byakago until Tsunade used it against Madara at chapter 577.

So with general knowledge, Ay wouldn't know about Tsunade's regeneration.


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## Skaddix (Aug 23, 2017)

Really you are telling me they went into War and the Kages shared zilch about their abilities with each other before they fought against Madara? That seems highly unlikely to me.

Suppose the question does arise where do you set this in terms of the Manga.


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## Rocky (Aug 23, 2017)

Orochimaruwantsyourbody said:


> I see this as an evenly matched fight where the Raikage has one path to victory which has a high probability, while Tsunade has five paths to victory that are unlikely individually but have a high probability when combined.


I totally agree with this. I disagree with the specific paths you mentioned though. Most of this fight will be a stalemate with Ay unable to kill Tsunade and Tsunade unable to land a meaningful blow. Raikage's path to victory is clear: damage Tsunade until she no longer has the chakra to heal it off while relying on the heightened speed, reaction time, and durability that Raiton Chakra Mode provides to deal with her limited offensive options. On the other hand, Tsunade has no apparent way to pin & beat down the Raikage. She'll have to get creative and try some things out (which her regeneration gives her the time to do), and although none of those strategies are going to be as solid as Ay's is, she only needs one of them to work out. It's a hard fight to call.


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## Skaddix (Aug 23, 2017)

Its really not....after Tsunade heals from a body blow there is about zero reason for Ei not to go straight for decapitation. Unless the argument is Tsunade is going to surprise Raikage with her regen and get in a surprise attack. Jugo tried that with a massive AOE beam instead of a punch and failed utterly and what Raikage do to him? Oh go straight for the head shot that is right.


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## Veracity (Aug 23, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> Really you are telling me they went into War and the Kages shared zilch about their abilities with each other before they fought against Madara? That seems highly unlikely to me.
> 
> Suppose the question does arise where do you set this in terms of the Manga.



If we are giving them information they recieved from the war then both Ay and Tsunade have full knowledge, which isn't what I think the op was aiming for. And no I don't think Tsunade shared knowledge of Byakago because everyone seemed astounded when she healed the damage from Madara's Sussano sword.


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## Skaddix (Aug 23, 2017)

Well to that I say knowing how a jutsu works isnt really the same thing as seeing it an action. 

Still manga knowledge when comes up at chapter 4XX since Raikage doesn't show up in the story until then?


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## Veracity (Aug 23, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> Well to that I say knowing how a jutsu works isnt really the same thing as seeing it an action.
> 
> Still manga knowledge when comes up at chapter 4XX since Raikage doesn't show up in the story until then?



I mean if that's what you think, but all the Kage thought Tsunade was a goner when she got stabbed by Madara. And they all looked surprised af when Tsunade  her new justu. Looks pretty clear that they didn't know about it.

When Ay was introduced he didn't know about SS or Byakago.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## FlamingRain (Aug 24, 2017)

Rocky said:


> On the other hand, Tsunade has no apparent way to pin & beat down the Raikage.



What about Katsuyu: Moryojika...especially the slug floor version?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Rocky (Aug 24, 2017)

FlamingRain said:


> What about Katsuyu: Moryojika...especially the slug floor version?


I don't think slug soup is particularly difficult to maneuver in, especially for somebody as strong & fast as Ay. Afterall, it didn't seem to be an issue for the random ninja in the alliance. If you're thinking about shōsen, I'm not so sure that she could freely run chakra into his body through his armor. Tbh, I don't even remember how that whole overload thing works or if it would work on Raikage in the first place.

Besides, even if slug puddle into mega shōsen coma did end up putting Raikage to sleep, I'd still consider that more "creative longshot" than "solid gameplan" lol.


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## FlamingRain (Aug 24, 2017)

Rocky said:


> I don't think slug soup is particularly difficult to maneuver in, especially for somebody as strong & fast as Ay. Afterall, it didn't seem to be an issue for the random ninja in the alliance.



Katsuyu is selectively permeable so it makes sense that the alliance would be able to move through it, but she can have a good enough hold to hang on to everyone that got blown away by CST when she wants to.

What matters is that Ay makes contact with Katsuyu's body, though.



> If you're thinking about shōsen, I'm not so sure that she could freely run chakra into his body through his armor. Tbh, I don't even remember how that whole overload thing works or if it would work on Raikage in the first place.



It ran through the Nine Tails auras Naruto gave the alliance. Hinata's Jyuken transferred through Naruto's. I don't see why the Chakra used for Shosen wouldn't transfer through RCM.

It works by sending Chakra into the circulatory system to disrupt its normal functioning. The circulatory system is different than the Keirakukei, which one's own Chakra flows through.

It _should_ work.



> Besides, even if slug puddle into mega shōsen coma did end up putting Raikage to sleep, I'd still consider that more "creative longshot" than "solid gameplan" lol.



We've seen Tsunade try to use it to kill Orochimaru, and we've seen Tsunade use Katsuyu as a giant zone for the technique to be distributed throughout. It doesn't seem like too big a leap to use it to catch someone she's having issues hitting, does it? I mean Ay can't do anything to her without crossing Katsuyu.


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## Rocky (Aug 25, 2017)

FlamingRain said:


> It ran through the Nine Tails auras Naruto gave the alliance. Hinata's Jyuken transferred through Naruto's. I don't see why the Chakra used for Shosen wouldn't transfer through RCM.


True, but not all chakra modes share the same exact properties. RCM is implied to be an actual layer of armor that covers the body, ie.  "I'm surprised you were able to touch me through my armor" and "wind attacks are the only thing that can reach him [through his armor]." There's also smaller stuff like Cee (who can use shōsen) considering it a highly impressive feat to breach it, and Ay wrapping Ōnoki in it when they performed their combo against Madara. 

The v1 shrouds that shōsen bypassed do possess some defensive properties, so I'll admit that it's a possibility for it to work on RCM. But the bottom line is that in order for shōsen to get to Raikage's circulatory system, it needs to enter his body through his tenketsu, and those are presumably blocked off by his armor. Getting through Kyūbi Naruto's chakra tells us that either those specific shrouds don't cover the tenketsu or that shōsen can just ignore chakra-based defense techniques, but going with the latter results in some questions...like why that was never mentioned in the Databook, or why Tsunade never used it to get past Susanoo (the chakra can be extended from the hands).



FlamingRain said:


> It works by sending Chakra into the circulatory system to disrupt its normal functioning. The circulatory system is different than the Keirakukei, which one's own Chakra flows through.


Ah, okay. Well, it would send chakra into the keirakukei, which is attached to the circulatory system and every other system in the body lol.


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## FlamingRain (Aug 25, 2017)

Rocky said:


> True, but not all chakra modes share the same exact properties. RCM is implied to be an actual layer of armor that covers the body, ie.  "I'm surprised you were able to touch me through my armor" and "wind attacks are the only thing that can reach him [through his armor]." There's also smaller stuff like Cee (who can use shōsen) considering it a highly impressive feat to breach it, and Ay wrapping Ōnoki in it when they performed their combo against Madara.



It could have been considered so impressive because Chidori is a technique that has to deal external injury first, as would most other Jutsu. Ohnoki probably wouldn't have had the reflexes necessary to time his Jutsu with Ay's lightened attack if he didn't have his own reflexes enhanced.



> The v1 shrouds that shōsen bypassed do possess some defensive properties, so I'll admit that it's a possibility for it to work on RCM. But the bottom line is that in order for shōsen to get to Raikage's circulatory system, it needs to enter his body through his tenketsu, and those are presumably blocked off by his armor. Getting through Kyūbi Naruto's chakra tells us that either those specific shrouds don't cover the tenketsu or that shōsen can just ignore chakra-based defense techniques, but going with the latter results in some questions...like why that was never mentioned in the Databook, or why Tsunade never used it to get past Susanoo (the chakra can be [LINKHL]191973[/LINKHL] from the hands).



Naruto's aura that blocks swords and stuff pours out of his Tenketsu, though, as that's how he accesses Kurama's Chakra. The V1 aura would be identical as it emerged from Naruto mixing his Chakra with the alliance's as opposed to simply wrapping around each ninja externally.

It'd have had to transfer through the Chakra coming out itself, and if it can do that it should be able to travel through the opening that Chakra is coming out of too, if it needs to. I'm not entirely sure that it does need to, as you can apparently slice muscles with Chakra without having to tear up the Keirakukei and Tenketsu. To even get to the Keirakukei requires traveling through the cells based on the illustrations we were given, so there's that too.

Extending Shosen takes a bit of time the Susano'o probably wouldn't have given Tsunade, and Preta may be able to absorb it as it can be used as a field around the user's body.


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## Nonarutowanking (Aug 25, 2017)

Itachі said:


> Tsunade wins this in my opinion. Without full knowledge Ei is not going to put down Tsunade with his first attack. I think she's just going to end up countering him and leaving him either dead or seriously wounded.


lol, he doesn't need to 1 hit her, once A stabs her via lightning tsunade would have to actiate her regeneration jutsu, which would obviously make A notice she cant die unless her head is remove or charkra runs out, tsunade is stronger the A but her durability is crap, she can be injured by a Normal kunai while the Raikage can tank Most B class Ninjutsu and even A class Chidori, of course taking a direct hit from tsunade is not smart but he wont die, tsunade is not Hidan she would die if her head is cut of or she gets cut up into several pieces, while A can dodge tsunade hits she cant dodge his, as his Lightning Piercing would pierce tsunade no matter how she guards.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Disagree 2


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## Speedyamell (Aug 26, 2017)

Veracity said:


> I mean Sakura could still finish her punched after being impaled by TSB, and she isn't even half of what Tsunade is.


I was totally going to agree with you..but you had to involve sakubae huh..sakura's byakugo was said/shown to be better than tsunade so..idgi.
OT:     what @Mithos said


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## Veracity (Aug 26, 2017)

Speedyamell said:


> I was totally going to agree with you..but you had to involve sakubae huh..sakura's byakugo was said/shown to be better than tsunade so..idgi.
> OT:     what @Mithos said


Resilience wise.


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## Speedyamell (Aug 26, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> Yeah not really guard up works for Jugo because Jugo actually has enhanced durability as shown by him deflecting swords. Tsunade doesnt so Raikage goes straight through her. The difference is Tsunade is all blunt force...Raikage punches pierce and cut through targets.
> Also Jugo got rammed into a wall hence why he stood up.


Both tsunade and sakura can actually increase their durability by using chakra controll to create chakra shields over their body or a part of their body,as seen when tsuna redirected madara's flames with her arms..it was used by sakura in her novel.


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## Speedyamell (Aug 26, 2017)

Veracity said:


> Resilience wise.


Well she fucking had a TSB rod inside her..even with byakugo we know her insides would have been getting pretty messed up so for her to still be able to execute her punch is resilience enough.


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## Android (Aug 26, 2017)

Speedyamell said:


> it was used by sakura* in her novel.*


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## Veracity (Aug 26, 2017)

Speedyamell said:


> Well she fucking had a TSB rod inside her..even with byakugo we know her insides would have been getting pretty messed up so for her to still be able to execute her punch is resilience enough.


She's resilient yeah but Tsunade's feats are more impressive imo. Like being functional after being torn into two pieces without much chakra or Byakago to fall back on. That's crazy.


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## Speedyamell (Aug 26, 2017)

Veracity said:


> She's resilient yeah but Tsunade's feats are more impressive imo. Like being functional after being torn into two pieces without much chakra or Byakago to fall back on. That's crazy.


It is crazy impressive tbh...but she had katsuyu tho..


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## Skaddix (Aug 26, 2017)

Speedyamell said:


> Both tsunade and sakura can actually increase their durability by using chakra controll to create chakra shields over their body or a part of their body,as seen when tsuna redirected madara's flames with her arms..it was used by sakura in her novel.



I am sorry when did Flames become piercing or slashing attacks? I dont remember Madara using Flames like the Sauce but maybe I missed it. As for the mythical novel...


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## Speedyamell (Aug 26, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> I am sorry when did Flames become piercing or slashing attacks? I dont remember Madara using Flames like the Sauce but maybe I missed it. As for the mythical novel...


It was used by sakura to withstand crushing blows..and since we're talking of the raikage..


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## Skaddix (Aug 27, 2017)

Crushing Crushing As In Blunt Force?


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## Speedyamell (Aug 27, 2017)

Skaddix said:


> Crushing Crushing As In Blunt Force?


Yeah to atleast reduce damage from raikage's crushing blows..not his cutting ones.


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## Skaddix (Aug 27, 2017)

Well fuck that I have said repeatedly that Ninjas have blunt force properties but my point was Raikage's punches have a additional penetrative properties considering Raikage had his fist stuck in Jugo's gut.


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## Speedyamell (Aug 27, 2017)

Sakura's punch also made a hole in some juubling although it couldn't get "stuck in" because of the exploding nature of it,but does that make sakura'a punch cutting??


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