# Terminator: Dark Fate (November 1, 2019)



## TetraVaal (Sep 21, 2017)

I'm sure you've all heard the news.

James Cameron is directly involved. Both as a producer, and for story development. Josh Friedman, David Goyer, Charles Eglee, and Justin Rhodes, are all part of a creative team to help develop and flesh out the story to possibly run as a new trilogy.

The film is being directed by Tim Miller, known for directing 'Deadpool'--as well as being the founder of Blur Studios.

The film will retcon everything after Cameron's T2, ala, similar to what Neill Blomkamp was going to do with his Alien film, and following directly after Cameron's 'Aliens.'

Arnold Schwarzenegger and Linda Hamilton will both be returning. No word yet if Arnold will actually play a Terminator this time around, but Linda will be returning in the role of Sarah Connor.

The film is currently beginning to line up castings for new, younger characters, that will drive the new film and potential trilogy. So, don't count on Emilia Clarke or Jai Courtney returning (thank God).

I know the general consensus on this will be, why not just let it die? And, following the results of T3, Salvation, and 'Genysis'--I would be inclined to agree.

HOWEVER, with James Cameron being directly involved, and Terminator always being his baby, as well as the fact that Tim Miller is a very capable filmmaker, who for whatever reason, was overlooked for the success of 'Deadpool', at least instills hope that this could actually right the ship, and give fans a sense of closure following the greatness of T2.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 21, 2017)

Source?


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## White Wolf (Sep 21, 2017)

mr_shadow said:


> Source?


2
2
2
2
and so on... 



---

Personally don't really care haven't even watched Genisys yet  but might check it out some day.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 21, 2017)



Reactions: Funny 1


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## GRIMMM (Sep 21, 2017)

This could potentially save the franchise. It's been badly beaten and abused by Hollywood in more recent times.

Hopeful but not enough to keep me from having a lot of doubt.

Linda Hamilton though.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Sep 21, 2017)

Isn't Linda over 60 now? That aside, not even being paid can hide Camerons disappointment over the past deluge of horrid sequels his franchise received in the past decade-and-a-half. Esp if they're essentially ignoring Genisys' attempt to reboot the franchise hard


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## Mider T (Sep 21, 2017)

I was looking for this thread yesterday to post about Linda, didn't realize it hadn't been made yet.


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 21, 2017)

Linda coming back sounds like a dumb idea imo. How does Elderly Sarah Conner make sense?


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## MartialHorror (Sep 21, 2017)

~Gesy~ said:


> Linda coming back sounds like a dumb idea imo. How does Elderly Sarah Conner make sense?



Because Terminator 3 and up are being retconned, although I suspect that she won't have a major role. 

I have hope that Cameron and Miller can save the franchise, but it should be noted that Cameron sucked the dicks of Terminator 3, Salvation and Genysis, only turning on them once the fans did. I'm not sure if he genuinely liked them or if he had just sold out and lied. Also, Cameron as producer isn't a guarantee of success. Does anyone remember "Sanctum"?


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## dr_shadow (Sep 21, 2017)

God said:


> Isn't Linda over 60 now? That aside, not even being paid can hide Camerons disappointment over the past deluge of horrid sequels his franchise received in the past decade-and-a-half. Esp if they're essentially ignoring Genisys' attempt to reboot the franchise hard





~Gesy~ said:


> Linda coming back sounds like a dumb idea imo. How does Elderly Sarah Conner make sense?



It said in one of the links that Cameron said that if there are "few" female action heroes, there are "NO" female action heroes older than ~40. So he thinks bringing Hamilton back is kind of a progressive move against age discrimination.

She turns 61 next week.

If the movie is set in present day, which it'd have to be to account for Hamilton's age, John Connor would have to be about 32 since he's likely born in 1985; within 9 months of the first movie.

While fans would probably like to see Edward Furlong (40) reprise the role from T2, he was in trouble with the law for drug abuse and domestic violence as recently as 2013, so unless he's really cleaned up his act they'll probably recast the role like they did for T3 (for the same reasons).


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## MartialHorror (Sep 21, 2017)

They should cast Steven Seagal as John Connor.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Mider T (Sep 21, 2017)

mr_shadow said:


> It said in one of the links that Cameron said that if there are "few" female action heroes, there are "NO" female action heroes older than ~40. So he thinks bringing Hamilton back is kind of a progressive move against age discrimination.
> 
> She turns 61 next week.
> 
> ...


HOLD THE PHONE

Linda Hamilton is a Libra?


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 21, 2017)

mr_shadow said:


> It said in one of the links that Cameron said that if there are "few" female action heroes, there are "NO" female action heroes older than ~40. So he thinks bringing Hamilton back is kind of a progressive move against age discrimination.
> 
> She turns 61 next week.
> 
> ...


So he's shamelessly pushing an agenda?

I dunno..I always liked the fact that Sarah played a role in mentoring her son for the coming apocalypse, and bowing out leaving everything to him once the time came. That might be the key component of her character and they're ruining it to prove a point.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 21, 2017)

MartialHorror said:


> They should cast Steven Seagal as John Connor.



Lol, preferably they cast a guy who is in his early 30's and -you know- kind of looks like Linda Hamilton and Michael Biehn. If they care enough about realism.

Quick Wiki says Biehn actually has two real-life twin sons born in 1984! Meaning... I guess his wife was pregnant when he shot the sex scene with Hamilton? The wonders of actor life...

Hamilton also has a son born in 1989.

Not sure if any of them have any acting ability though.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 21, 2017)

~Gesy~ said:


> So he's shamelessly pushing an agenda?
> 
> I dunno..I always liked the fact that Sarah played a role in mentoring her son for the coming apocalypse, and bowing out leaving everything to him once the time came. That might be the key component of her character and they're ruining it to prove a point.



No, they're bringing Hamilton back because the last three Terminator films have been disappointments/disasters, and they think reuniting more of the original cast will get more nerds to go see the next one. So they get more $$$.

But Cameron doesn't want to say that, because it sounds too cynical and manipulative. So instead we get "cougar empowerment!"

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Sep 21, 2017)

T3 was more uninspired/a rehash than truly terrible, 4 and 5 were terminal AIDS though.


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 21, 2017)

mr_shadow said:


> No, they're bringing Hamilton back because the last three Terminator films have been disappointments/disasters, and they think reuniting more of the original cast will get more nerds to go see the next one. So they get more $$$.
> 
> But Cameron doesn't want to say that, because it sounds too cynical and manipulative. So instead we get "cougar empowerment!"


I don't think so..

Cameron has been told for years that he is the only one who can save the franchise. Fans begged him to direct another.  His name alone would have sufficed. Raiding nursing homes for washed up acts wasn't  necessary imo .


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## dr_shadow (Sep 21, 2017)

God said:


> T3 was more uninspired/a rehash than truly terrible, 4 and 5 were terminal AIDS though.



I liked Salvation to be honest. I thought it was a fresh take on the Terminator universe, since you can only do so many "run from the killer cyborg in present day" stories before it gets stale.

Better to do it Aliens style and make a film of arguably a different genre but set in the same universe.


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## Mider T (Sep 21, 2017)

God said:


> T3 was more uninspired/a rehash than truly terrible, 4 and 5 were terminal AIDS though.


Other way around.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 21, 2017)

~Gesy~ said:


> Raiding nursing homes for washed up acts wasn't  necessary imo .



Would you disqualify Schwarzenegger on account of his age (70) as well?


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## MartialHorror (Sep 21, 2017)

I just hope this isn't one big nostalgia circle jerk.


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 21, 2017)

mr_shadow said:


> Would you disqualify Schwarzenegger on account of his age (70) as well?


Yeah.  Schwarzenegger was ridiculed a ton for his age in the last film.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Sep 21, 2017)

mr_shadow said:


> I liked Salvation to be honest. I thought it was a fresh take on the Terminator universe, since you can only do so many "run from the killer cyborg in present day" stories before it gets stale.
> 
> Better to do it Aliens style and make a film of arguably a different genre but set in the same universe.



I mean all of the films definitely have PIS (one egregious offense being T-1000 not killing Sarah on sight in that factory despite being able to shapeshift), but the 4th one was even worse in that regard because of Skynet's incompetence in giving Marcus nearly uninhibited free will instead of just taking him over to kill John immediately. It was still a lot better than Genisys though.


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## Imagine (Sep 21, 2017)

I'd like them to just stop. 3,4, and 5 have pissed on the franchise enough. This reboot will probably be just filled with callbacks to the original and more terrible CGI.

Just let it die.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Sep 21, 2017)

I wanted a sequel to Genysis tho

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1 | Lewd 1


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## MartialHorror (Sep 21, 2017)

Genysis is the only one I can say I really disliked. To me, it was a nostalgia circle jerk that didn't seem to understand why the first 2 films worked so well, a combination that infuriates me. I don't give a shit if the characters are wearing the exact same shoes as they did in the first film, especially if you're going to get these characters all wrong. 

"Salvation" was just mediocre to me, while I remember thinking "Terminator 3" was decent, but underwhelming. I haven't seen that one since it came out though, so I might change my mind if I revisit them.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Sep 21, 2017)

I honestly didn't even watch Genisys except for the  first 10 minutes and CinemaSins' review


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## butcher50 (Sep 21, 2017)

One thing i like about T4:*Salvation* is the seriousness of tone, sure it was brought down to the PG13 rating and has plenty of other flaws but at least the dumb jokes/dark comedy of *Rise of the Machines* (until the last 15 minutes) and _*Genisys*_ are absent in Salvation.

hopefully Cameron will make it R rated and without the dumb jokes.



God said:


> I honestly didn't even watch Genisys except for the  first 10 minutes and CinemaSins' review



IMO the first 20/30 minutes of Genisys are pretty watchable however once the make-shift/hobo parts time travel machine is introduced into the plot, the movie goes downhill from there and never recovers, Arnold apparently just can't resist doing something comical all the time without Cameron to reign him in.

also thanks to the PG13 rating, the two main "human" hero characters are basically invincible, as tough as machines themselves, Sarah and Kyle go through stuff that should have either permanently crippled them or killed them towards the end of the movie.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Suigetsu (Sep 21, 2017)

Does anyone even want to see this?


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## dr_shadow (Sep 21, 2017)

~Gesy~ said:


> Yeah.  Schwarzenegger was ridiculed a ton for his age in the last film.



I didn't mind it at all, since it was made into a plot point.

Reactions: Like 1


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## dr_shadow (Sep 21, 2017)

Wondering if it'll be another soft reboot?

A way to do it is to send somebody back to the late 90's to cure Sarah's leukemia. We'll assume that by 2029 humanity will have either figured out the cure for cancer by ourselves, or Skynet did it as a random science project (unintended consequence of experimenting with biological weapons?) and the resistance then stole the info from a databank.

If Sarah is cured she'll be able to guide John better and he doesn't end up the bum he is in T3, which means T4 and T5 don't happen exactly the way they did before either.


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## Tom Servo (Sep 21, 2017)

Fucking David Goyer again?? fuck this movie and anything he's attached with
*Berserk Creator Reveals He Based Band of the Hawk on High School Friendship*


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## butcher50 (Sep 21, 2017)

David Goyer ? what ? 

keep that hack away from my terminator verse !


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## MartialHorror (Sep 21, 2017)

Hey, David Goyer did a masterpiece that has withstood the ultimate test of time: "Kickboxer 2". Pay the man his respect!

In all seriousness, I think Goyer is a solid writer, but I do feel kinda burned out on his name. Just as Miller is a daring yet inspired choice, they probably should find a writer who fits the same mold. Goyer almost feels too...established. He's not old, but he feels like he's been around for awhile and I think "Terminator" needs some new blood. New sexual blood. 



mr_shadow said:


> I didn't mind it at all, since it was made into a plot point.



Even though I hated Genysis, I actually agree with you here. It wasn't fleshed out enough, but it was a clever way of treating his age and it made me wish that the movie was more about Arny and not Connor and Reese, who are so f@cking annoying.


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## Swarmy (Sep 22, 2017)

Ah well can't sink lower than this anyway


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## Yahiko (Sep 23, 2017)

MartialHorror said:


> Because Terminator 3 and up are being retconned, although I suspect that she won't have a major role.
> 
> I have hope that Cameron and Miller can save the franchise, but it should be noted that Cameron sucked the dicks of Terminator 3, Salvation and Genysis, only turning on them once the fans did. I'm not sure if he genuinely liked them or if he had just sold out and lied. Also, Cameron as producer isn't a guarantee of success. Does anyone remember "Sanctum"?


So this movie is a sequel to T2 while ignoring the events of T3 and salvation?


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## White Wolf (Sep 23, 2017)

Yahiko said:


> So this movie is a sequel to T2 while ignoring the events of T3 and salvation?


Yup

Reactions: Informative 2


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## dr_shadow (Sep 23, 2017)

Yahiko said:


> So this movie is a sequel to T2 while ignoring the events of T3 and salvation?



And Genysis. And The Sarah Connor Chronicles (RIP  ).

Probably there will be an in-universe explanation where somebody travels back in time to between T2 and T3 and changes history, so that neither T3, Salvation, nor the future parts of Genysis happen the way we saw them.


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## MartialHorror (Sep 23, 2017)

Yahiko said:


> So this movie is a sequel to T2 while ignoring the events of T3 and salvation?



They've only confirmed "Terminator Genysis" being removed from the timeline. My assumption is that the others won't be acknowledged, but won't necessarily be contradicted either, so you can still fit them in the continuity if you want to do so, but can also pretend they never happened. Then again, if Arny is in the movie, it's possible he'll play the creator of T-800 and that might overwrite "Terminator 3". I hope he isn't just there to be a new T-800 (using CGI). I love Arny and his T-800 role, but I think it would be better for the franchise to move on.

"Terminator" is stuck in the past right now and "Terminator: Genysis" is the embodiment of that.


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## dr_shadow (Sep 23, 2017)

Given how Arnold is 70, we'll have to confront the fact that some day he might "self-terminate".

In real life he probably can't operate 120 years on his current fuel cell. 

At that point they'll probably stop making Terminator movies.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## Suigetsu (Sep 27, 2017)

Well well, Gaddot faggs BTFO



> "They had Raquel Welch doing stuff like that in the '60s," the 'Avatar' director says of the Gal Gadot hit.



Also they discuss some interesting things about 3 possible movies. However I am not very happy with the writters that they mentioned for the project tought.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Sep 27, 2017)




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## Jake CENA (Sep 28, 2017)

this shit should be played by J.Lawrence


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## TetraVaal (Sep 30, 2017)

Naw.


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## Suigetsu (Oct 1, 2017)

MartialHorror said:


> They've only confirmed "Terminator Genysis" being removed from the timeline.


I am pretty sure james said that nothing after 2 counts. That's why this is a direct sequel.


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## butcher50 (Oct 2, 2017)

I really really really hope that they learned their lessons after Rise of the Machines, Salvation and Genisys

Terminator needs total revamp, a completely serious back to basics approach in tone and scale (the first 1984 style, smaller budget)

no more kid friendly PG-13 watering downs
no more stupid jokes, unnecessary comedy and sassy attitudes,
no more horribly mismatched casting choices (example: a bully-faced, beefcake Jai Courtney as Kyle Reese ? ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME ?)
no more over-the-top super-powerful bad guys
no more steel statue (supposedly flesh and blood human?) good guys
no more excessive, cartoony CGI saturation
no more cheap shock shlock plot twists (example: let's shit on John Connor and turn him into a villain !)


(as for the Sarah Connor Chronicles TV series, IMO it was a hit and miss, sure there are moments and episodes that are quite impressive/okay for a TV format terminator show, in fact i think it was the only tolerable post-T2 "sequel" so far, but there was a lot of just awful to balance it out)

EDIT: and yes keep Arnold out of this one, it was already a mistake bringing him back in T3, it was an absolute disaster including him in T5Genisys.


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## Ennoea (Oct 2, 2017)

Sorry but Arnie is an old ass bag. If they want to take this franchise forwars it's time to put him to rest.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Apr 13, 2018)

> *Mackenzie Davis to Star in ‘Terminator’ Reboot (EXCLUSIVE)
> *
> Mackenzie Davis is in negotiations to join the cast of the new “Terminator” movie.
> 
> ...


@davidhogg111



> *'Terminator' Reboot Lands 'Scream Queens' Star Diego Boneta (Exclusive)*
> 
> Tim Miller is directing the latest human vs. machine story, with James Cameron producing with Skydance.
> 
> ...






> *Gabriel Luna Is New Terminator; Natalia Reyes & Diego Boneta Also Set To Star In Tim Miller-James Cameron Skydance Reboot*
> 
> *EXCLUSIVE*: The search for a new Terminator to take over the first sanctioned Jim Cameron reboot since the original, is over. Director Tim Miller and producer Cameron have tapped Gabriel Luna for the role. Luna is best known for starring as Robbie Reyes/Ghost Rider on the ABC action superhero series _Marvel’s Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D_, as well as the El Rey Network drama series _Matador_.  On the film side, he starred in the films _Freeheld_ and _Transpecos_.
> 
> ...


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## MartialHorror (Apr 13, 2018)

Arnold's performance in Genysis was one of the only things I liked though.

Admittedly, I don't know what they could do with him at this point though. The 'older model' gimmick has been used and they'd already revealed the person who designed the terminator, but we'll see what they do. James Cameron's involvement gives me some hope, even though he has praised the last three sequels...before turning on them once the fanbase rejected them...Hopefully this isn't just a check for him.


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Apr 14, 2018)

I remember watching Genysis and thinking John Connor looked a lot like that one dude from the Wire. You know, the one who shot an undercover black officer and was fired because it was thought that the shooting was racially motivated, but then he was allowed to became a teacher in an inner-city middle school. 

And I admit, after seeing Dany say Dracarys a few time, I can totally buy Emilia Clarke being Sarah Connor. But that middle school teacher looking dude being THE leader of the Resistance? Nope. 

So yeah, considering how integral to the plot he was there, that did not work at all. Bale would have been perfect to bring back there actually. Not that he would have saved the movie or anything, but it woulda been neat. 

I don't really have any hope for this current project. But then again, I never had any hope for Jumanji either, and that was great. But then again then again, that had the Rock. If he ever stars in one of these, I'd be down. Hell, cast him as John Connor. I'd love to see him punch the shit out of some exoskeleton terminators.


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## ~Gesy~ (Apr 14, 2018)

Bringing Sarah Connor back from the dead is wack as fuck.


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## Aeternus (Apr 15, 2018)

Maybe a complete reboot after all these movies would have been better if you ask me, but I am curious to see what they are doing now.


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## Comic Book Guy (May 9, 2018)

Years later, the TV show _Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles _still remains as the best post-T2 story, continuing and expanding upon Cameron's themes in T2, and also introducing new ones to the _Terminator _series.

To both its own strengths and its own detriment, _Genisys _borrowed a few things that TSCC introduced.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Mider T (May 9, 2018)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Years later, the TV show _Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles _still remains as the best post-T2 story, continuing and expanding upon Cameron's themes in T2, and also introducing new ones to the _Terminator _series.
> 
> To both its own strengths and its own detriment, _Genisys _borrowed a few things that TSCC introduced.


Like what?  I only saw the first 2 episodes of TSCC.


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## Comic Book Guy (May 9, 2018)

Mider T said:


> Like what?  I only saw the first 2 episodes of TSCC.



It got better. One of the few shows that changed and got better due to the then-writer's strike. Though, that's not to say that the show wasn't without its weaknesses.

But yeah. TSCC expanded upon Terminator themes and introduced new themes along the way (though, I would not be surprised if the John Connor Chronicles novel series laid the groundwork). _Genisys _borrowed more than a few things from TSCC.


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## Mider T (May 9, 2018)

I mean what did it borrow?


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## Comic Book Guy (May 10, 2018)

Mider T said:


> I mean what did it borrow?



2 of the major things borrowed, or rather I suppose, adapted are:

- From the 'present', time-traveling just a few years into the near-future in order to strike at a critical stage of early Skynet. Kyle and Sarah do the same.

- Conceptualizing the whole human-machine war as a multi-temporal war, not only in different periods of time but also different existing alternate timelines brought about by the intervening actions. _Genisys _itself is one such timeline. And the Matt Smith Skynet was, as intended by writers, 
*Spoiler*: __ 



to be a Skynet from an alternate timeline who has traveled across various multiple timelines in order to avoid defeat and triumph instead. In the _Genisys_, it took the opportunity to eliminate and use John Connor himself, an effort to make a substantial difference throughout the following war.




Others, are nods, but those 2 are the major ones.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Jun 20, 2018)

destroying jugs of water


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## Kansas City Kipchaks Point Guard (Jun 20, 2018)

I am even fine with abandoning time travel.


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## Aeternus (Jun 20, 2018)

The Kamal Haasan Crazy Hour said:


> I am even fine with abandoning time travel.


I liked that idea in Salvation (whether the movie was good or not is a different matter). You can only do the time traveling thing so many times.


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## Unicornsilovethem (Jun 20, 2018)

MartialHorror said:


> They should cast Steven Seagal as John Connor.


Yeah, and also if they could make John Connor an evil robot, and spoil the surprise in the trailer, that'd be great.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 1, 2018)




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## Suigetsu (Aug 1, 2018)

Sarah looks pretty badass desu.


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## Aeternus (Aug 1, 2018)

Yeah, she looks surprisingly good.


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## Banhammer (Aug 1, 2018)

....which one of them is Sarah Connor?


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## RAGING BONER (Aug 1, 2018)

wtf is that?!


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## Comic Book Guy (Aug 1, 2018)

Is the middle character a Terminator?


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## Kansas City Kipchaks Point Guard (Aug 2, 2018)

Just make it animated with new characters.


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## Amol (Aug 2, 2018)

Maybe there are going to be multiple Sara in this movie. 
From different timelines. 
This franchise could pay more attention to alternate universes instead of time travel. time travel gets old fast. In other way franchise would be able to live long.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 2, 2018)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Is the middle character a Terminator?


 
No she is playing a character called Grace and she is a soldier-assassin. The girl next to her is playing someone called Dani Ramos.

Gabriel Luna is Terminator this time.


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## Snakety69 (Aug 2, 2018)

So is John Connor gonna be in  this one?


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## RAGING BONER (Aug 2, 2018)

If ever there was a franchise that needs to be retired, it's this one.

Hasn't had a good movie since T2.


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## Mider T (Aug 2, 2018)

Wow Linda Hamilton got old.



MartialHorror said:


> They should cast Steven Seagal as John Connor.


A fat John Connor wouldn't make sense in their world.


Amol said:


> Maybe there are going to be multiple Sara in this movie.
> From different timelines.
> This franchise could pay more attention to alternate universes instead of time travel. time travel gets old fast. In other way franchise would be able to live long.


Sarah*


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## ~Gesy~ (Aug 2, 2018)

I can't tell if the person in the middle is male or female bruh!


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## Comic Book Guy (Aug 2, 2018)

Amol said:


> Maybe there are going to be multiple Sara in this movie.
> From different timelines.
> This franchise could pay more attention to alternate universes instead of time travel. time travel gets old fast. In other way franchise would be able to live long.



_Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles_ did it pretty well.



Sennin of Hardwork said:


> No she is playing a character called Grace and she is a soldier-assassin. The girl next to her is playing someone called Dani Ramos.
> 
> Gabriel Luna is Terminator this time.



Ah.



RAGING BONER said:


> If ever there was a franchise that needs to be retired, it's this one.
> 
> Hasn't had a good movie since T2.



I wish TSCC was able to finish. To this day, I wonder what was the rest of Josh Friedman's TSCC stories. Fucking FOX.


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## Skaddix (Aug 4, 2018)

Sennin of Hardwork said:


> No she is playing a character called Grace and she is a soldier-assassin. The girl next to her is playing someone called Dani Ramos.
> 
> Gabriel Luna is Terminator this time.



That is a girl in the middle?


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## James Bond (Aug 4, 2018)

Skaddix said:


> That is a girl in the middle?



I think it's Hayden Christensen


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## Skaddix (Aug 4, 2018)

James Bond said:


> I think it's Hayden Christensen



Eh even Hayden wasn't that ambiguous in the PT.


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## Kansas City Kipchaks Point Guard (Aug 4, 2018)

Skaddix said:


> Eh even Hayden wasn't that ambiguous in the PT.


Thanks to animated Anakin who had actual balls.


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## James Bond (Aug 4, 2018)

Skaddix said:


> Eh even Hayden wasn't that ambiguous in the PT.



If you're not with me, then you are my enemy


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## Skaddix (Aug 4, 2018)

James Bond said:


> If you're not with me, then you are my enemy



I am sorry Bond I never had trouble telling if Hayden was a guy or a girl.


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## James Bond (Aug 4, 2018)

Skaddix said:


> I am sorry Bond I never had trouble telling if Hayden was a guy or a girl.



That's not what we were discussing though, we were trying to determine the sex of the person in the middle of the poster which is when I made the very obvious joke that it looked like Hayden Christensen.


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## Skaddix (Aug 4, 2018)

James Bond said:


> That's not what we were discussing though, we were trying to determine the sex of the person in the middle of the poster which is when I made the very obvious joke that it looked like Hayden Christensen.



I am tired and drunk lol.


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## James Bond (Aug 4, 2018)

Skaddix said:


> I am tired and drunk lol.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 9, 2018)



Reactions: Like 1


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Mar 21, 2019)




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## Comic Book Guy (Mar 21, 2019)

_Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles_ is easily the best post-T2 Terminator story for me that the other post-T2 film sequels fall short in comparison.

No idea how _Dark Fate_ will be. No trailer yet, to my knowledge.


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## Huey Freeman (Mar 21, 2019)

What I dislike about this franchise, they purposely skip around this having any form of a solid conclusion just to milk sequels.

So I treat this as a transformer or F&F movie rather than a must see sequel like say Matrix to see the where the story goes.

Reactions: Like 1


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## dr_shadow (Mar 21, 2019)

Huey Freeman said:


> What I dislike about this franchise, they purposely skip around this having any form of a solid conclusion just to milk sequels.
> 
> So I treat this as a transformer or F&F movie rather than a must see sequel like say Matrix to see the where the story goes.



They're gonna keep making them for as long as Arnold (71) is still alive.

After that I think they_ probably_ won't recast the titular character, since he's so intimately associated with it.


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## MartialHorror (Mar 21, 2019)

This project has my curiosity.

I HATED "Genysis", so I treat this franchise like an abused puppy treats its master, but at least it looks like they're taking some decent risks. Cameron is back and Miller is an interesting choice as a director.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Apr 4, 2019)




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## Mider T (Apr 4, 2019)

Is that Linda Hamilton?


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## Rivayir (Apr 4, 2019)

Please make it stop.

I like the idea and story possibilities of Terminator, but the execution has not been good with the last few movies. Much like Alien, I think Terminator is better suited as a long-running TV series. I watched the Sarah Connor Chronicles and it was actually decent, because they had time to lay out ideas, develop characters and plant seeds that the robots could be influenced and changed by humans.


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## Jake CENA (Apr 4, 2019)

what the hell is this?


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## Comic Book Guy (Apr 5, 2019)

Arny?

Oldest Terminator confirmed.



Lastier said:


> Please make it stop.
> 
> I like the idea and story possibilities of Terminator, but the execution has not been good with the last few movies. Much like Alien, I think Terminator is better suited as a long-running TV series. I watched the Sarah Connor Chronicles and it was actually decent, because they had time to lay out ideas, develop characters and plant seeds that the robots could be influenced and changed by humans.



This.

Plus, TSCC shows that the _Terminator_ series can go on fine without needing to rely on Arnold or any Arnold nostalgia.


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## blakstealth (Apr 7, 2019)

I hear that the reactions from the test footage were very positive. Also interesting how this movie will follow T2 and act like T3 and beyond never exited.


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## Deathbringerpt (Apr 10, 2019)

The more they use an aging old man as the perfect killing machine, the less I can take these Terminator movies seriously.

I love Arnold but he's made of fat rolls and saggy skin, not metal. Move the fuck on.


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## blakstealth (Apr 10, 2019)

Deathbringerpt said:


> The more they use an aging old man as the perfect killing machine, the less I can take these Terminator movies seriously.
> 
> I love Arnold but he's made of fat rolls and saggy skin, nto metal. Move the fuck on.


it's not fat. it's metal plating


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## Unicornsilovethem (Apr 11, 2019)

Mider T said:


> Wow Linda Hamilton got old.



That happens to people who were hot in 1984.


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## Mider T (Apr 11, 2019)

Unicornsilovethem said:


> That happens to people who were hot in 1984.


There are stars who were hot in 1984 that are still smoking.


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## Unicornsilovethem (Apr 11, 2019)

Mider T said:


> There are stars who were hot in 1984 that are still smoking.


1. Not really.

2. Even so, they are still old.


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## Mider T (Apr 11, 2019)

Old broads can still be hot.  Look at Farah Fawcett before she died.  Or Raquel Welch.


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## ~Gesy~ (Apr 11, 2019)

Or Betty White


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## Shiba D. Inu (Apr 11, 2019)

Mider T said:


> There are stars who were hot in 1984 that are still smoking.


link me some pics banana-man


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## Suigetsu (Apr 17, 2019)

Shiba D. Inu said:


> link me some pics banana-man


Didnt know you where into “bananas” 
Hat does explain your avatar however.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (May 12, 2019)




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## ~Gesy~ (May 12, 2019)

I laughed at first, but yet again I feel myself getting sucked into being interested in this franchise.


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## Comic Book Guy (May 12, 2019)

As long as they don't do produce a dumb spoilerific trailer that _Genisys _was.


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## Deathbringerpt (May 14, 2019)

Tim Miller is on this? Huh. Still not into fat, old terminator but he could probably get something out of this.


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## dr_shadow (May 14, 2019)

Can't get over how many spare Terminators and time machines Skynet apparently has.

In the first movie Kyle made it sound like there was only one time machine, and that the resistance blew it up after he went in, and then destroyed Skynet itself shortly after.

But now between the five movies and two seasons of The Sarah Connor Chronicles, we must have seen at least... ten or so Terminators?

And they all seem to be coming back with ever-better upgrades and ever-more ingenious plans to kill John, suggesting that Skynet is learning from its previous failures. That doesn't seem like a last-ditch crazy plan. 

Either Skynet sent back a whole army of Terminators all at once, or it managed to outsmart the Resistance and buy itself time for research & development.


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## Amol (May 14, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> Can't get over how many spare Terminators and time machines Skynet apparently has.
> 
> In the first movie Kyle made it sound like there was only one time machine, and that the resistance blew it up after he went in, and then destroyed Skynet itself shortly after.
> 
> ...


Or movies were making money so producers didn't much care for consistency. 
Back in Time is one of the key part of Terminator series. They got to have it. It is like Jurassic movies.  Literally just about every movie Dinosaurs gets loose and yet people still watch them. 
Suspension of disbelief and all.


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## Comic Book Guy (May 14, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> Can't get over how many spare Terminators and time machines Skynet apparently has.
> 
> In the first movie Kyle made it sound like there was only one time machine, and that the resistance blew it up after he went in, and then destroyed Skynet itself shortly after.
> 
> ...



Well, TSCC expanded upon the temporal war to spanning multiple shifting timelines. And, it was explained behind-the-scenes, and planned for _Genisys_ follow-ups, that the Matt Smith T-5000 Skynet in Genisys was actually from a different timeline altogether and traveling multiple timelines to figure out how to thwart Connor and humanity from winning.


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## dr_shadow (May 14, 2019)

Of course every time Skynet makes a temporal incursion the future might change slightly, but clearly in all futures we've seen so far Skynet is still under imminent threat of destruction from the Resistance. Or it wouldn't be trying to change the past.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (May 21, 2019)




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## Sennin of Hardwork (May 22, 2019)




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## Comic Book Guy (May 23, 2019)




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## Comic Book Guy (May 23, 2019)

It looks okay.

Though, it is a teaser.


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## ~Gesy~ (May 23, 2019)

Looks like a movie I already seen once or twice.


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## Huey Freeman (May 23, 2019)

Naw should have tried to end this franchise a long time ago


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## Sennin of Hardwork (May 23, 2019)

Besides the so-so VFX/CGI where Gabriel Luna's evil Terminator clones itself and jumps from the truck to attack them it looked fine.


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## MartialHorror (May 23, 2019)

I will admit that the trailer intrigued me because of its tone... It seemed like it was aiming to be somewhat low key and chilling compared to the more bombastic trailers of the last few movies. 

But did anything jump out as exceptional or interesting? Not yet, although I'm hopeful.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (May 23, 2019)




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## Shiba D. Inu (May 23, 2019)




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## ~Gesy~ (May 23, 2019)

Admit it, If James Cameron's name wasn't all over this y'all would've went nuts over this. FOH!


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 23, 2019)

tbh I'm probably one of the half-dozen people that wanted a sequel to Genisys just to see what happens next in the plot - with Skynet and Matt Smiths alternate time travelling T-5000 Skynet

Skynet always interested me more than maybe even the terminators themselves



also more brunette Emilia

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sennin of Hardwork (May 23, 2019)




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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (May 24, 2019)

So is this like Terminator 3 Redo? Can we get Edward Furlong back too?


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## MartialHorror (May 24, 2019)

EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! said:


> So is this like Terminator 3 Redo? Can we get Edward Furlong back too?



That might be a tough one, as Furlong became somewhat infamous for his troubled personal life. He's gotten in trouble for drugs, alcoholism and domestic abuse, even serving some time if I recall.


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## ~Gesy~ (May 24, 2019)

Yikes..that dude looks fucking horrible!


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## Glued (May 24, 2019)

Don't give Paramount a single dollar. I see them for what they are. Beyond hope or redemption.


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## Comic Book Guy (May 24, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Admit it, If James Cameron's name wasn't all over this y'all would've went nuts over this. FOH!



Actually, Josh Friedman's name -- the showrunner for TSCC -- attached to _Dark Fate_ got my interest.

So far, I still consider TSCC not only the best of the post-T2 stories but, more importantly, a worthy sequel.


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## Saishin (May 24, 2019)

I'll give it the benefit of the doubt and Genisys was a good movie folks


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## Mider T (May 24, 2019)

Good teaser but the title "Dark Fate" is cheesy to me.  Sounds like a "meh" thriller from the 1990s.


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## Comic Book Guy (May 24, 2019)

Saishin said:


> I'll give it the benefit of the doubt and *Genisys was a good movie folks*




I partially enjoyed the plot, but I'd be hardpressed to call the movie itself good -- Jai Courtney did a bloody poor job as Kyle Reese to the point of coming off as a complete miscasting. Same goes for their John Connor.


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## Deathbringerpt (May 25, 2019)

It's just Terminator 2 with gendered swapped characters and another "Terminator who think it's human".

It looks more competent than every other movie beyond 2 but it's just so by the numbers.


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## Rukia (May 25, 2019)

Shiba D. Inu said:


> tbh I'm probably one of the half-dozen people that wanted a sequel to Genisys just to see what happens next in the plot - with Skynet and Matt Smiths alternate time travelling T-5000 Skynet
> 
> Skynet always interested me more than maybe even the terminators themselves
> 
> ...


It was a bad movie.  But I also wanted a sequel to Genisys.


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## dr_shadow (May 26, 2019)

Not sure why Skynet keeps doing these endoskeleton terminators. Seems like a step back from the T-1000.

Reactions: Like 2


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (May 26, 2019)

MartialHorror said:


> That might be a tough one, as Furlong became somewhat infamous for his troubled personal life. He's gotten in trouble for drugs, alcoholism and domestic abuse, even serving some time if I recall.



Sounds kinda close to John Connor in Terminator 3



Rukia said:


> It was a bad movie. But I also wanted a sequel to Genisys.



I want a sequel to Genisys too. Not because it was good or anything, but just cause I want more Emilia on the big screen.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 26, 2019)

I also liked Guardian getting T-1000 liquid metal in Genisys


would be pretty cool to see what Ahnold could do with that kind of body


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## Amol (May 26, 2019)

I liked the trailer. 
I especially loved the music. Whoever did the score is fantastic guy/gal.
Tone of the movie does seem quite dark which in era of MCU humor feels refreshing. Of course just being dark is not enough as proven by DCEU. I do have enough trust in JC to not let this movie be complete trash and as far as trailer goes it doesn't feel like complete trash. 
So I am actually hopeful.


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## ~Gesy~ (May 26, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> Not sure why Skynet keeps doing these endoskeleton terminators. Seems like a step back from the T-1000.


Liquid metal are capable of glitching, Staggers from high impact weaponry , and can be easily dispatched from a simple flamethrower.


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## dr_shadow (May 26, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Liquid metal are capable of glitching, Staggers from high impact weaponry , and can be easily dispatched from a simple flamethrower.



* Did we ever see the T-1000 glitch?

* The T-1000 can regenerate from any impact, while a solid terminator will be permanently maimed if hit hard enough.

* Lolno. It walked out unscathed from a burning truck wreck. Destroying it requires enough penetrating heat to dissolve the bonds between the nanites or whatever it's made of. You wouldn't get that from a simple flamethrower, which would only gently warm the surface but not the core.


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## ~Gesy~ (May 26, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> * Did we ever see the T-1000 glitch?


Yeah. In the third act after it was frozen. 


mr_shadow said:


> * The T-1000 can regenerate from any impact, while a solid terminator will be permanently maimed if hit hard enough.


Wouldn't say *any* since a grenade launcher damaged it quite a bit. That move Sarah did in the trailer would have dispatched it for quite a while. Shotgun rounds does more damage to a t-1000 than a t-800.

And any case This terminator model appears to be able to regenerate despite being solid based...


mr_shadow said:


> Lolno. It walked out unscathed from a burning truck wreck. Destroying it requires enough penetrating heat to dissolve the bonds between the nanites or whatever it's made of. You wouldn't get that from a simple flamethrower, which would only gently warm the surface but not the core.


"Simple" is probably an exaggeration but I believe  a high end flamethrower that fires at really high temperatures would do the trick.


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 26, 2019)

> I do have enough trust in JC to not let this movie be complete trash


JC isnt the old JC any more 

> Avatars
> he stanned pretty hard for Genisys too from what I remember and we know how that turned out


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## Glued (May 27, 2019)

This film is offensive to The God Emperor of Mankind. Send the Ultramarines.

EXTERMINATUS!!!


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## Blocky (May 27, 2019)

Funny how Fox has a hand in this which means Disney has a hand on this too.

You cannot escape the mouse.


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## Suigetsu (May 27, 2019)

The trailer was incredibly cringey, the director is honestly not a very good director for live action films.


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## Rivayir (May 30, 2019)

The CGI in the trailer wasn't very impressive. I see this more and more in high budget TV Series and movies and it's a concerning trend.

The terminator also took an awful long time to make a clone of himself, so if the characters don't act stupid on purpose to move the plot forward, which I know they will, a weak point of this model has already been discovered.


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## Deathbringerpt (May 30, 2019)

Fuck this wishy washy time travel bullshit. When are we getting a movie during post-apocalyptic global war with the Terminators? I'm talking about the REAL war where the world is covered in human bones under perpetual night. Not that Christian Bale bullshit.


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## Deer Lord (May 30, 2019)

What's with the uber generic direct-to-video esq title


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## MartialHorror (May 30, 2019)

Deathbringerpt said:


> Fuck this wishy washy time travel bullshit. When are we getting a movie during post-apocalyptic global war with the Terminators? I'm talking about the REAL war where the world is covered in human bones under perpetual night. Not that Christian Bale bullshit.



I think the problem with this, is that it would cost too much to make (especially for a Rated R film).

If it ever could've happened, it would've been in place of "Terminator 3", where the idea of such a film being a huge box office success was still feasible. 

I do agree with you though. It's something I think we've all wanted since "Terminator 2", lol.


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## dr_shadow (May 30, 2019)

Deathbringerpt said:


> Fuck this wishy washy time travel bullshit. When are we getting a movie during post-apocalyptic global war with the Terminators? I'm talking about the REAL war where the world is covered in human bones under perpetual night. Not that Christian Bale bullshit.





MartialHorror said:


> I think the problem with this, is that it would cost too much to make (especially for a Rated R film).
> 
> If it ever could've happened, it would've been in place of "Terminator 3", where the idea of such a film being a huge box office success was still feasible.
> 
> I do agree with you though. It's something I think we've all wanted since "Terminator 2", lol.



TBH I don't think there are enough humans in the world for it to be literally "covered in bones". Scenes like that would only happen in places with very dense human populations, i.e. former cities.

It also isn't literally always night. Kyle says in the first movie that "you stay low by day. At night you can move around." It's not like The Matrix where the world is in a .

I actually liked Terminator: Salvation myself.


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## MartialHorror (May 30, 2019)

I found Salvation to be just mediocre. 

Although at least it didn't make me angry like Genysis...

Then again, at least Genysis seemed to have ambitions outside of just being serviceable.


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## Deathbringerpt (May 31, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> TBH I don't think there are enough humans in the world for it to be literally "covered in bones". Scenes like that would only happen in places with very dense human populations, i.e. former cities.
> 
> It also isn't literally always night. Kyle says in the first movie that "you stay low by day. At night you can move around." It's not like The Matrix where the world is in a .



Do you always take shit so literally so you can be obnoxiously pedantic? Saying that you missed the point would be an understatement. When the first 2 movies showed the actual war, it was stylized in that way so it could be a huge impression.

Something that that garbage Salvation movie couldn't pull, it's forgettable in every possible way. While I'm at it, I don't understand why they're bringing that stupid "Terminator who think its human" thing of that movie.


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## dr_shadow (May 31, 2019)

Deathbringerpt said:


> Do you always take shit so literally so you can be obnoxiously pedantic? Saying that you missed the point would be an understatement. When the first 2 movies showed the actual war, it was stylized in that way so it could be a huge impression.
> 
> Something that that garbage Salvation movie couldn't pull, it's forgettable in every possible way. While I'm at it, I don't understand why they're bringing that stupid "Terminator who think its human" thing of that movie.



Wow, struck a nerve apparently.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~Gesy~ (May 31, 2019)

Don't really remember Genisys but this scene was awesome!

Reactions: Like 1


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## Shiba D. Inu (May 31, 2019)

honestly Genisys wasnt any worse than T3


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## reiatsuflow (Jun 5, 2019)

Producer james cameron needs to sit down.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Jul 16, 2019)




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## MartialHorror (Jul 16, 2019)

Shiba D. Inu said:


> honestly Genisys wasnt any worse than T3



yesitwas


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## Banhammer (Jul 16, 2019)

Wait, Linda is back for this

OK, maybe I'll waitch it


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Jul 17, 2019)




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## Comic Book Guy (Jul 17, 2019)

Return the franchise to glory.

I'll remember that tagline after DF comes out.


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## Aeternus (Jul 17, 2019)

They should be careful when making statements like this lol


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Jul 17, 2019)




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## Comic Book Guy (Jul 18, 2019)

Well, damn. I didn't expect this piece of news.


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## ~Gesy~ (Jul 18, 2019)

Would've rather they recast tbh

Maybe it's just a cameo


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Jul 18, 2019)

It will be Rated-R as well.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Jul 18, 2019)




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## reiatsuflow (Jul 18, 2019)

MartialHorror said:


> yesitwas



Yeah T3 wasn't...it's wasn't great but it was still, like, a movie. It even had a solid ending, from what I remember. 

The only thing going for gensys was brunette emilia clarke talking with an american accent.


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## MartialHorror (Jul 18, 2019)

Genysis sort of embodies everything I hate about franchise revivals -- overly relying on nostalgia in the worst possible way. I remember the filmmakers boasting about how they got the shoes the characters wore from the original movie correct... yet they couldn't get the characterizations correct? 

Terminator 3... er... I'm not going to lie, I remember very little of T3. But I remember thinking it was OK at the time. I really think people only "remember" it as a bad movie because it was following two exceptional movies, which is why people sometimes consider "Alien 3" bad. Then again, "Alien 3" has developed a following, whereas no one talks about "Terminator 3" anymore. I'm sure if I saw it again, I'd consider it mediocre.


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## Kansas City Kipchaks Point Guard (Jul 21, 2019)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Return the franchise to glory.
> 
> I'll remember that tagline after DF comes out.


I just want a really good animated series that does not look cheap at this point.


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## dr_shadow (Jul 21, 2019)

Would be nice if the final Terminator film is released in 2029, since that's the year Kyle and the Terminator travelled back from in the first film.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 22, 2019)

> While there are few franchises as beloved as Terminator, not every instalment has been well received by fans. Even Tim Miller, who has directed the forthcoming Terminator: Dark Fate, has problems with the last few sequels.
> 
> *"The last movie was not good. Wait, I shouldn’t say that,"* he tells our sister publication Total Film magazine. If Miller has a hard time staying diplomatic about the franchise, it's only because he adores the movies so much. *“There have been some… misfires,”* he laughs, *“You don’t want it to go out that way as a fan. I wanted the franchise to have some kind of noble future again. I wanted to help with that because I love The Terminator so, so much.” *
> 
> ...


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## Amol (Aug 22, 2019)

You shouldn't shit on other movies until your own does well. 
That is a risky gamble which may or may not make you look like a fool.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 29, 2019)




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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 30, 2019)




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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 30, 2019)




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## BlueDemon (Aug 30, 2019)

Ok, well, was not really a fan of the third one and I didn't see Genisys either. Guess it's good for the continuity, although I don't see why they had to scratch the third one too.

And dang, I'm not even one of those guys, but where's John Connor? Why has he been replaced with a girl? And if we already have a female cyborg and Sarah Connor, why even bring back Arnold? Meh.


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## MartialHorror (Aug 30, 2019)

I have mixed feelings on the new trailer. On one hand, it shows some cool, maybe even unique stuff. I did like a handful of those money shots.

On the other, I'm still baffled by how the trailer keeps... literally... cutting off the villain at the knees. It cheapens the stakes, in my opinion, even though I'm sure the movie will make him more of a monster.

And f@ck me, I'm so sick of these movies redoing the "I'll be back" line. It's not even that good of a line. It was Arnold's unsettling delivery that made it work. To me, this is nostalgia at its most suicidal, as it's like these movies want us to remember the better days. Yeah, "Terminator" was f@cking awesome... so why aren't I watching that instead?

So yeah, still cautiously optimistic, only because of the people involved.


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## Rivayir (Aug 30, 2019)

The new trailer looks better than the first one, but it still gives me too much vibes of the most recent Terminator movies in order to be hyped. The CGI still doesn't look compelling for a movie released in 2019.

It should not be that hard to make a compelling action / sci-fi movie like Terminator, but we always somehow end up with a run of the mill movie that's underwhelming with too much cooks in the kitchen.


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## ~Gesy~ (Aug 30, 2019)

This doesn't have the vibe of the first two at all..

I agree that this feels more like the newer T films (T3 mixed with Salvation) but we'll see.


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## Unicornsilovethem (Aug 30, 2019)

So this is really the fourth direct sequel to T2. Out of six movies in the entire franchise, four of them all contradict each other. Maybe it's time to give it a rest.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Aug 30, 2019)

i felt nothing


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Aug 31, 2019)




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## Deathbringerpt (Aug 31, 2019)

This is legitimately the first trailer where I thought that Arnold is the most forced element in it. He has no fucking reason being here and the cast seems bloated already.And those first 10 seconds were already cringe central.

It just feels toothless. No energy at all except from Sarah. And kicking your villains ass for the entire fucking thing doesn't exactly inspires any sort of threat.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Sep 10, 2019)




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## MartialHorror (Sep 10, 2019)

It's speculated that this will open to 30-35 million opening weekend.

Honestly, I think it comes down to whether or not the movie is good. Some franchises can withstand poor to middling critical receptions, but this needs to be good to have a shot at box office success.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Sep 10, 2019)




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## MShadows (Sep 10, 2019)

If this bombs will they label it non-canon as well and brush it off as “just a movie done for fun”?


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## Comic Book Guy (Sep 10, 2019)

Genisys tried the multi-timeline war route that TSCC had set up.

DF could use that excuse.

So far, I haven't been impressed enough that DF will turn out as good as TSCC. Though, DF hasn't shown much so far.


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## MartialHorror (Sep 10, 2019)

MShadows said:


> If this bombs will they label it non-canon as well and brush it off as “just a movie done for fun”?



Wait, have they used that excuse before?


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## MShadows (Sep 11, 2019)

MartialHorror said:


> Wait, have they used that excuse before?


No, but I wouldn't put it past them to make a similar excuse, just like how they dismissed Terminator 3 now


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## The Great One (Sep 11, 2019)

What is that thing?

Girl, guy, transgender? I couldn't tell.


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## Mider T (Sep 11, 2019)

Batzzaro29 said:


> What is that thing?
> 
> Girl, guy, transgender? I couldn't tell.


Did you miss the tits and the high pitched voice?


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## Deathbringerpt (Sep 11, 2019)

Sennin of Hardwork said:


>



Why can't actresses bulk just a tiny little fucking bit for action movies these days? Linda Hammilton went from a skinny 80s waitress to a gun mercenary with a decent amount of muscle by the time Terminator 2 came.


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## reiatsuflow (Sep 11, 2019)

Why do terminator movies always look so bad. Just get nic cage in there and go direct to streaming. Imagine a nic cage terminator. He's never played a robot before, he'd have a blast.


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## Mider T (Sep 11, 2019)

Deathbringerpt said:


> Linda Hammilton


Why the extra "m"?


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## Deathbringerpt (Sep 11, 2019)

Mider T said:


> Why the extra "m"?



Why the bananas?


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 11, 2019)

Deathbringerpt said:


> Why can't actresses bulk just a tiny little fucking bit for action movies these days? Linda Hammilton went from a skinny 80s waitress to a gun mercenary with a decent amount of muscle by the time Terminator 2 came.


You try bulking up in your 60s


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## reiatsuflow (Sep 11, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> You try bulking up in your 60s



I think he means the androgynous chick who's fighting the terminators.


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## ~Gesy~ (Sep 11, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> I think he means the androgynous chick who's fighting the terminators.


Ooooooh..then yeah she should've lol. Bulking up is how Arnold got the role in the first place.


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## MartialHorror (Sep 11, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Ooooooh..then yeah she should've lol. Bulking up is how Arnold got the role in the first place.



Yeah, but to be fair, Robert Patrick wasn't a beefcake when he was in T2... and no one complained about the female terminator in "Terminator 3", even if they complained about the movie. The sequels -- all of them -- have made a point that cybernet is getting craftier about blending in. 

Now obviously it's unclear what kind of role she'll play. She says she's an enhanced human, but I suspect that they'll pull a Blade Runner and have characters (perhaps even her) cast doubt on her humanity.


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## MShadows (Sep 11, 2019)

What role is Arnold's Terminator supposed to have again? 

except for the necessity of being present in the movie since the whole franchise is built around him and everyone loves seeing some Arnold action


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Sep 16, 2019)




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## Sennin of Hardwork (Oct 2, 2019)




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## Suigetsu (Oct 2, 2019)

The problem with these “new” terminators coming from the future is that they do not look like machines.

Compare them with Arnold and Robert Patrick, when you looked at their piercing stare and face silhuette, you knew they where cold and ruthless. But these new random folks that look like wannabe fodder schmucks.


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## Mider T (Oct 2, 2019)

They messed up "Come with me if you want to live" -_-


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## Suigetsu (Oct 3, 2019)

All movies after T2 are quite cringe.


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## Comic Book Guy (Oct 3, 2019)

For me, _Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles_ is still the best post-T2 sequel out of the lot, and has yet to be topped.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Oct 3, 2019)

Not a movie


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## reiatsuflow (Oct 4, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Not a movie



Probably why it worked.

I'm still in for a kid terminator. I have no idea why this stuck with me so much, but does anyone remember that clooney tomorrowland movie? There's this little girl robot in that movie and there's one scene where she runs after a car, and I thought it was done so well and looked so bizarre and real that it stuck in my mind and got me thinking it might be cool and scary and weird to have a kid terminator, if they could find a good actor for the part. I'm sure you could cook up a reason for building a terminator to resemble a kid. Cast that eleven girl or something. Could be cool.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Oct 4, 2019)




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## MShadows (Oct 5, 2019)

That's nice and all, but where the hell is John Connor?


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## Comic Book Guy (Oct 5, 2019)

MShadows said:


> That's nice and all, but where the hell is John Connor?



You're not going to like how he's going to be in DF.


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## MShadows (Oct 5, 2019)

Comic Book Guy said:


> You're not going to like how he's going to be in DF.


How's he going to be like?


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## Rukia (Oct 5, 2019)

Good point.  I liked the Sarah Connor Chronicles a lot!


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## reiatsuflow (Oct 6, 2019)

MShadows said:


> How's he going to be like?



Dead, is what I think comic means.

Like he shows up just to get popped.


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## ~Gesy~ (Oct 6, 2019)

So he's no longer leader of the resistance?

Hmm..don't think I like that.


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## MShadows (Oct 8, 2019)

Apparently the T-800 that Arnold plays this time around is called Carl.


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## MartialHorror (Oct 8, 2019)

MShadows said:


> That's nice and all, but where the hell is John Connor?



He's supposed to have a cameo of some sort. 

Edward Furlong has too much of a controversial history to be trusted with a sizable role in this production, as he has a history of drug abuse, (alleged) domestic abuse, etc. In this day and age, his presence would put a long of the wrong kind of heat on this movie. 

Recasting him would seem odd, as they're attempting to go for the "true sequel" vibe. It's possible his presence will lead to a backlash anyway, but there isn't much they can do. If he's revealed to have died off-screen, it will piss off fans. If he's revealed to be somewhere else, it wouldn't be satisfying as he's been the focal point of this franchise. But at the same time, it might be unsatisfying anyway. 

The newest trailer hasn't stoked me at all, but it hasn't made the movie seem worse either. I'm still struggling to drum up interest... I hope it's good and a good reception will probably be the only way I'll see it in theaters. "Genysis" really killed by love for this franchise.


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## reiatsuflow (Oct 8, 2019)

Nobody cares about the terminator mythology.

After this movie fails, the eventual next attempt, whether television or cinema, needs to drop the JC bullshit. Just let it go. You can't do it better than the t1 / t2 switcharoo anyway.

Terminators, time travel, go.


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## Comic Book Guy (Oct 8, 2019)

Carl comes off as too humanized to me. Then again, that seems to be the direction of DF -- T-800, arguably in its most human incarnation yet. Female protector, a human-converted cyborg. Luna's REV-9, no comment, since I see so little of him.

However _Genisys _was quality-wise, at least Pops still retained his uncanny character as befitting of a cyborg. Part of the _Terminator _draw is that contrast. Of course, _Genisys _made the astounding decision to have its T-3000 as a talky.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Oct 13, 2019)




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## Swarmy (Oct 16, 2019)

I feel bad for being excited for this movie despite realizing exactly how bad it'll be... Says a lot about the strength of nostalgia mixed with denial


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Oct 16, 2019)




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## MShadows (Oct 17, 2019)

Just read the leaks...


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## Swarmy (Oct 17, 2019)

MShadows said:


> Just read the leaks...


That bad?


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## MShadows (Oct 17, 2019)

Swarmy said:


> That bad?


If they are true, then


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## Swarmy (Oct 17, 2019)

MShadows said:


> If they are true, then


Honestly for a big Hollywood movie that's worse than bad... At least bad movies get some cult following...


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## ~Gesy~ (Oct 17, 2019)

This already have a cult following


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Oct 17, 2019)




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## DemonDragonJ (Oct 17, 2019)

I definitely shall not be seeing this film, since it is clearly nothing more than a blatant cash grab; the second film had such a great conclusion that I feel that any attempt to follow it will almost certainly not live up the first two, as was clearly seen with _Terminator 3, Terminator: Salvation,_ and _Terminator: Genisys._ Also, Linda Hamilton did not return for any films after the second because she felt that the second was a perfect conclusion to the story, so her returning for this film is a contradiction, unless she needs the money from it.

            Also, where is John? I know that Linda Hamilton is a famous actress, and that her character of Sarah Connor was the main focus of the first two films, but Sarah’s son, John, is the savior of humanity, which has been a central aspect and canonical fact of the franchise since the very first movie, so his absence from this film is extremely glaring.


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## MShadows (Oct 18, 2019)

Oh, Johnny boy...


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## Comic Book Guy (Oct 20, 2019)

DemonDragonJ said:


> I definitely shall not be seeing this film, since it is clearly nothing more than a blatant cash grab; the second film had such a great conclusion that I feel that any attempt to follow it will almost certainly not live up the first two, as was clearly seen with _Terminator 3, Terminator: Salvation,_ and _Terminator: Genisys._ Also, Linda Hamilton did not return for any films after the second because she felt that the second was a perfect conclusion to the story, so her returning for this film is a contradiction, unless she needs the money from it.
> 
> Also, where is John? I know that Linda Hamilton is a famous actress, and that her character of Sarah Connor was the main focus of the first two films, but Sarah’s son, John, is the savior of humanity, which has been a central aspect and canonical fact of the franchise since the very first movie, so his absence from this film is extremely glaring.



I recommend _Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles_ TV show. The only worthy post-T2 sequel story out of the lot, continuing on & expanding upon with what James Cameron has done, while adding brand new themes, characters, and directions that overall deepen the whole Terminator lore & mythology of the war and its stakes. TSCC shown that _Terminator _without Arnold and without movie action spectacles is still rich and compelling and even as terrifying that the first _Terminator _film first demonstrated.


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## Suigetsu (Oct 20, 2019)

The actor for the new terminator looks super forgettable and has no silhuette, let alone doesnt even look like a cold machine, unlike the previous actors. These lads failed and Tim Miller its ridding on the "I directed deadpool which tbh despite me being a fan I have to admit its not a very good movie" hence why I cant give a different look to this film other than cringe.
And let that alone, these folks are pushing the marketing super hard, putting their characters in videogames etc.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Oct 21, 2019)

First reactions from a surprise screening that took place last night.


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## Deathbringerpt (Oct 21, 2019)

"Classic terminator lines made fresh" has got to be the most hollow fucking sentence I've ever read in my life.


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## MartialHorror (Oct 21, 2019)

I hope it's good, but redoing "classic lines" has become a HUGE pet peeve of mine. "I'll be back" is not a great line, it's actually a very basic one. But Arnold made it iconic with his delivery. He has a talent for it. Every time I hear it again from someone's mouth, I roll my eyes.


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## MShadows (Oct 22, 2019)

Sennin of Hardwork said:


> First reactions from a surprise screening that took place last night.


All these “professional” critic reviews are worthless.

The fan reviews are what truly counts.


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## MartialHorror (Oct 22, 2019)

MShadows said:


> All these “professional” critic reviews are worthless.
> 
> The fan reviews are what truly counts.



Yeah, but at the same time, fans can get swept up in the moment. I remember when "Batman Vs Superman" was screened and fans took to twitter to sing its praises.


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## Kisaitaparadise (Oct 22, 2019)

YESSSSSSSSSSS FINALLY THE OG SARAH CONNER SKSKSK


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## MShadows (Oct 23, 2019)




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## Unicornsilovethem (Oct 23, 2019)

Sennin of Hardwork said:


> First reactions from a surprise screening that took place last night.


"setting it up from big things to come", yeah, heard that one before. What is it now, like, three times before?


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## Pilaf (Oct 23, 2019)

I don't watch movies to be "set up for big things to come." Your movie is the product, dipshit studio. It should BE the big thing.


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## MartialHorror (Oct 23, 2019)

The reviews seem to be OK so far. It actually went from a 55% to a 67%, so at least it's going up at the moment. Going upwards doesn't happen often, but that can change fast as the release date creeps up.


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## DemonDragonJ (Oct 24, 2019)

Why do the filmmakers continually return Arnold Schwarzenegger to the franchise? I understand that he is essentially the face of the franchise, but he is old, now, and his character is supposed to be ageless. Also, if his character in this film is yet another T-800, that raises the question of why Skynet continues to use that form as a human disguise for that model.



Comic Book Guy said:


> I recommend _Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles_ TV show. The only worthy post-T2 sequel story out of the lot, continuing on & expanding upon with what James Cameron has done, while adding brand new themes, characters, and directions that overall deepen the whole Terminator lore & mythology of the war and its stakes. TSCC shown that Terminator without Arnold and without movie action spectacles is still rich and compelling and even as terrifying that the first _Terminator _film first demonstrated.



I watched that series, and I did enjoy it, but it still was an unnecessary addition, as nothing can follow _Terminator 2,_ in my mind, although I shall say that it was unfortunate that the series ended after only two seasons, with an unsatisfying conclusion.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Oct 24, 2019)




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## Kuromaku (Oct 25, 2019)

You know, based on the camrip webms I've seen thus far, it looks like they decided to 'modernize' the action scenes with over the top high speed movement and choreography. Honestly, that's weird given that the series worked best when it was basically a slasher sci-fi horror story about humans having to be resourceful when dealing with time traveling killbots that were seemingly immune to conventional weaponry. Also, it's hilarious that Cameron produced this given 
*Spoiler*: __ 



how critical he was of _Alien 3_ killing off Ripley's supporting cast, yet here's John dying off early so that we can give the originals a soft reboot while making everything the good guys have done feel utterly pointless _Star Wars_-style.


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## MShadows (Oct 25, 2019)

Kuromaku said:


> You know, based on the camrip webms I've seen thus far, it looks like they decided to 'modernize' the action scenes with over the top high speed movement and choreography. Honestly, that's weird given that the series worked best when it was basically a slasher sci-fi horror story about humans having to be resourceful when dealing with time traveling killbots that were seemingly immune to conventional weaponry. Also, it's hilarious that Cameron produced this given
> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> ...



*Spoiler*: __ 




Remember this guy?  

Remember? 

REMEMBER?!


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Oct 25, 2019)

> And Hamilton wasn't keen on Sarah's depiction in the pivotal opening scene.
> 
> "Blessings to all, but I just was so upset that I didn't really have anything to do with it," Hamilton says. "Sarah was not putting up the fight that was written in the scene and I'm like no, no, no, no. My body would be doing different things, more fierce. She's not gonna just let him knock her away, she would be biting him, she'd be grabbing his arm -- not that arm, grab the arm with the gun! It wasn't me and it really hurt."
> 
> "I cried my eyes out when I got home," remembers Hamilton when I caught up with her in London to talk about the film.



I've seen the webm. It's really dumb.

This movie's marketing seemed all about propping up female action heroes, but it took a giant dump on one of the quintessential female action heroes of modern cinema in its opening moments.


*Spoiler*: _The opening scene in question_


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## MartialHorror (Oct 25, 2019)

I saw another TV spot and I still find it baffling how they're marketing the villain. Someone says something like "He's the most lethal Terminator ever!" followed by shots of said Terminator getting its ass handed to it. Once again, I have to assume that within the context of the film, it gets in more offense and is a genuine threat.


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## Swarmy (Oct 25, 2019)

Saw it today!


*Spoiler*: __ 



As a lifelong Terminator fan I actually find it the best sequel to the original and Judgement Day! It didn't really destroy that much of the legacy of those 2 even if there were some really questionable moments and acting here and there but hey what do you expect from a modern Cameron movie (and yes I know he's technically not the director but his overall influence is noticable)?
Also I like how it ended the old/original era of the franchise! Arnie was awesome as a "human" terminator and Sarah was badass as always!
Overall a good soft reboot that might lead to something interesting. Unless they bring back Arnie in some way... Which after this ending would be a bigger slap to the face of fans than Genysis was...


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## DemonDragonJ (Oct 25, 2019)

Given the reviews of the film, thus far, I am very glad that I have chosen not to spend money on it and support this poorly-conceived attempt at milking a nostalgic franchise.


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## Comic Book Guy (Oct 28, 2019)

Suigetsu said:


> *The actor for the new terminator looks super forgettable and has no silhuette, let alone doesnt even look like a cold machine, unlike the previous actors. *These lads failed and Tim Miller its ridding on the "I directed deadpool which tbh despite me being a fan I have to admit its not a very good movie" hence why I cant give a different look to this film other than cringe.
> And let that alone, these folks are pushing the marketing super hard, putting their characters in videogames etc.



On the other hand, one can say that casting & Skynet succeeded in with the 'blend in' intention of a Terminator -- that it's blending in suppose to look ordinary, mundane, and not stand out whatsoever.

Of course, movie-wise, some viewers will like that, and some viewers will want more.



DemonDragonJ said:


> I watched that series, and I did enjoy it, but it still was an unnecessary addition, as nothing can follow _Terminator 2,_ in my mind, although I shall say that it was unfortunate that the series ended after only two seasons, with an unsatisfying conclusion.



Ah, yes, another show cancelled by Fox.

Showrunner did finally released his notes for Season 3, as well as his series pitch proposal, if interested to look up.


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## GRIMMM (Oct 28, 2019)

Kuromaku said:


> You know, based on the camrip webms I've seen thus far, it looks like they decided to 'modernize' the action scenes with over the top high speed movement and choreography. Honestly, that's weird given that the series worked best when it was basically a slasher sci-fi horror story about humans having to be resourceful when dealing with time traveling killbots that were seemingly immune to conventional weaponry. Also, it's hilarious that Cameron produced this given
> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> ...





MShadows said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...





EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! said:


> I've seen the webm. It's really dumb.
> 
> This movie's marketing seemed all about propping up female action heroes, but it took a giant dump on one of the quintessential female action heroes of modern cinema in its opening moments.
> 
> ...





Swarmy said:


> Saw it today!
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...


Apologies for the multi-quote here, but I want to avoid spoilers so haven't ready anything.

What would you guys give it out of 10?


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## MShadows (Oct 28, 2019)

GRIMMM said:


> Apologies for the multi-quote here, but I want to avoid spoilers so haven't ready anything.
> 
> What would you guys give it out of 10?


Haven't seen it yet. It comes out in Japan on November 8.


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## GRIMMM (Oct 28, 2019)

MShadows said:


> Haven't seen it yet. It comes out in Japan on November 8.


Ah, I thought you had seen it because of your spoiler post, my bad bruh.


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## MShadows (Oct 28, 2019)

GRIMMM said:


> Ah, I thought you had seen it because of your spoiler post, my bad bruh.


I just read the leaks, which have been confirmed btw.


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## Swarmy (Oct 28, 2019)

GRIMMM said:


> Apologies for the multi-quote here, but I want to avoid spoilers so haven't ready anything.
> 
> What would you guys give it out of 10?


Personally for me it's around 7/10

Reactions: Like 1


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## Unicornsilovethem (Oct 28, 2019)

EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! said:


> I've seen the webm. It's really dumb.
> 
> This movie's marketing seemed all about propping up female action heroes, but it took a giant dump on one of the quintessential female action heroes of modern cinema in its opening moments.
> 
> ...


One small step for a terminator, but one giant leap for technology. I was convinced that scene was old footage until I read the article.


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## reiatsuflow (Oct 28, 2019)

Unicornsilovethem said:


> One small step for a terminator, but one giant leap for technology. I was convinced that scene was old footage until I read the article.



Yeah, maybe it's the grainy video quality but both hamilton and furlong looked real convincing. Arnold looks fake though imo.


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## MShadows (Oct 30, 2019)

Major plot spoilers ahead, but I have to admit that this guy hits the nail on the head!


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## ~Gesy~ (Oct 30, 2019)

So I heard this is just like the others.

Can y'all shut up about wanting Cameron back now? He's as lost as everyone else!

Reactions: Like 1


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## Shiba D. Inu (Oct 30, 2019)

the only ok movie Cameron was attached to in the last ~15+ years is Alita and he didnt even direct that


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## reiatsuflow (Oct 30, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> So I heard this is just like the others.
> 
> Can y'all shut up about wanting Cameron back now? He's as lost as everyone else!



Cameron didn’t do anything though. He just put his name on it. Which he will do for anything. People want Cameron to direct, not consult, but he clearly has no new ideas either for terminator and won’t do it.

Someone should make a super cut of him explaining how every new terminator movie that comes out is the true sequel to t2


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## Suigetsu (Nov 1, 2019)

This movie is utter dogshit, someone provided me a means to watch it without paying for it.

Things of importance NO SPOILERS if you care about that shit so much.

Tim miller cant direct live action for shit. Framing its total shit and makes you cringe, edition its also cringe and crap. And the special effects are outright laughable. But above all the "new" terminator is super unremarkable" FFS in the originals of james cameron you had FUCKING ARNOLD and then Robert who its an excellent actor! then in T3 you get a hot babe "which I excuse" but in this one you get what? some random schmuck? and YASS SLAY GAL TEAM!

I got so pissed off at the beggining of the movie that I seriously considered to stop, I DID NOT watch it all. I was in the brink of throwing up about how cringe this shit is that stopped watching it altogether.

This joins alongside:
Jurassic Park III; Who shits on Alan Grant's character and the Tyrannosaurus Rex.
The last Kedi; who shits on all the work done by George lucas and its characters.
What other movie may I be missing now?


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## dr_shadow (Nov 1, 2019)

Saw it. 

I've seen this movie four times before. I actually like Salvation because it takes place in the Terminator universe but isn't a beat-for-beat remake of T2.

Reactions: Like 1


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## dr_shadow (Nov 1, 2019)




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## reiatsuflow (Nov 1, 2019)

I thought salvation was fine too. At least I think I thought that. I don't remember it much. It wasn't put together quite right, but at least it wasn't another inferior retread of T2

Reactions: Like 1


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## dr_shadow (Nov 1, 2019)

WTF, I looked at the Salvation plot synopsis, and apparently that movie takes place in 2018!

Guess I was so bogged down writing my PhD dissertation that I completely missed all the T-600's slaughtering people.

---

To be fair, some of the technology shown is stuff that either existed in 2018 (airborne drones), or which could have_ plausibly_ existed if the military thought it worth the trouble to put resources into (humanoid robots with rubber skin and miniguns).

The reason we don't have T-600's in real life is probably that it's not a very effective design. They're slow and lumbering, so they're not gonna be able to sneak up on ISIS fighters any better than a flying drone can.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 1, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> I thought salvation was fine too. At least I think I thought that. I don't remember it much. It wasn't put together quite right, but at least it wasn't another inferior retread of T2


I'll stand on the hill that they should have continued it. Apparently it's either that or reskinning the same plot over and over.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 1, 2019)

I suppose we also learned something about the mechanics of time travel.


*Spoiler*: __ 




The Terminator killing John doesn't make him vanish from existence, even though there is now no reason for future Skynet to send him back in time.

It also doesn't alter Sarah's recollection of John or (presumably) knowing Kyle, even though there is now no future John to send Kyle back.

In other words we're going with the Avengers: Endgame model where time travel just creates new timelines but doesn't change the current timeline.

That ought to mean that future Skynet will still experience defeat at the hands of future John. Changing history does nothing to save the life of "prime" Skynet - it only lets it die with the comfort than there is an "alternate" Skynet (Legion) who survived.

It puts some minor question marks on why Skynet would keep sending these now at least five Terminators back in time. I figured that if the new timeline overwrote the old timeline (as in Back to the Future), then John should have _immidiately _vanished from existence the moment the T-800 went through the time machine. The fact that he was still there banging on Skynet's door would have clued the AI in to that the Terminator must have failed and that it should send the T-1000, then the T-X, etc.

But if it's Endgame style time travel, Skynet should have no means of determining whether the Terminator was successful or not. So why the other 4+ Terminators? "Just to be safe", I guess?


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## dr_shadow (Nov 1, 2019)

But wait a minute! 


*Spoiler*: __ 




If Grace comes from the altered future that followed John's death (she has no idea who he is), how is she able to travel back in time to a version of 2019 that still has Sarah and the Terminator as we know them in it?

Shouldn't she arrive in a version of 2019 that never saw Kyle and the Terminator face off in 1984?


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## Vault (Nov 1, 2019)

The time travel in this makes no fucking sense what so ever. 

Unless this universe kinda works as the "universe prime" where all the future scenarios can be changed only through that one specific timeline


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## MShadows (Nov 1, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> But wait a minute!
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...



*Spoiler*: __ 



It’s a mess...

The movie is lackluster as well.


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## Vault (Nov 1, 2019)

*Spoiler*: __ 



 Think about it. Skynet was meant to exist but John survived and made sure skynet never rises but then Skynet also destroyed John which means they cancelled each other out. But then legion came through from that new timeline without John and Skynet never existing and had another resistant leader in the girl. They sent their own terminator but changing the future wont change anything in the past (obviously, since what Skynet inadvertently did was wipe their own future through the past) so what happens there is still in effect, case in point old t 800.

What legion really should have done was go back to kill Sarah Connor as a child  stops the girl being the future leader. But by doing that that gives rise to skynet which will mean legion never came to be? Are you guys still with me? Good


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## dr_shadow (Nov 1, 2019)

BTW I saw it opening night in mainland China, and we were like 20 people max in the theater.

As I've explained in various Star Wars threads, mainland Chinese weren't allowed to see movies from "Capitalist" countries until 1994.

Which means the vast majority of them never saw The Terminator (1984) or Terminator 2 (1991) in theaters, unless they belonged to the small elite that could hop the border to British Hong Kong or Portuguese Macau.

China's first encounter with the franchise would have been Terminator 3 (2003). Would you have become a fan based on that movie?... me neither.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 2, 2019)

Just bought my ticket an hour in advance. Almost the full room was available...which tend to indicate that this is gonna flop .


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## butcher50 (Nov 2, 2019)

If you are that hellbent on killing off the old-gen characters to "pass on the torch" to the new gen-characters then at the very least give them a dignified exit.

other then that one moment, i was mostly okay with the film (IMO overall much better made film then Salvation and Genisys, kinda reminded me of Rise of the Machines minus the cartoony humor)


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Nov 2, 2019)

I hope I can see this next week.



Neat audience score.


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## Vault (Nov 2, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Just bought my ticket an hour in advance. Almost the full room was available...which tend to indicate that this is gonna flop .


It isn't doing too hot at the BO


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 2, 2019)

Just got back from watching this..it honestly wasn't the dumpster fire that I expected.

It's lowkey just a soft remake of Terminator 2. Doesn't add anything to the franchise but doesn't taKe away either.

If T2 was a homework assignment.  You can say that this movie plagiarized it but switched a few nouns around to seem clever.



Vault said:


> It isn't doing too hot at the BO


Yeah..most of my row was clear throughout


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## Vault (Nov 2, 2019)

The franchise is tainted. Just shelve it and leave it alone. 

Only 1 and 2 exist


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 2, 2019)

Shockingly, Arnold had a small role here. His lines probably only filled one sheet of paper.

For an old man tho..he's still buff and intimidating .


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 2, 2019)

Am I the only one who just gets bummed out seeing og characters return looking old and barely recognizable? Linda hamilton, carrie fischer, mark hamill. Like hamill doesn't even _look_ like he did when he was in star wars, physically. I love hamill, but I don't get excited seeing someone return to a role they did over 30 years ago. There's an expiration date on reprisals.

Nobody even knows laurie strode. Halloween is about michael myers, not laurie strode. Yet that marketing angle worked and the movie was a huge success. I don't fucking get it.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 2, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> Am I the only one who just gets bummed out seeing og characters return looking old and barely recognizable? Linda hamilton, carrie fischer, mark hamill. Like hamill doesn't even _look_ like he did when he was in star wars, physically. I love hamill, but I don't get excited seeing someone return to a role they did over 30 years ago. There's an expiration date on reprisals.
> 
> Nobody even knows laurie strode. Halloween is about michael myers, not laurie strode. Yet that marketing angle worked and the movie was a huge success. I don't fucking get it.


Meh...usually these characters grow to be better more badass versions of themselves. And it kinda feels like you grew up with them in a way.

Luke in  TLJ--I like the concept of him being an experienced jedi that knows of the force for longer than 3 years time. It was just badly utilized.


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## MShadows (Nov 2, 2019)

It’s gonna flop because people caught onto the bullshit they’re trying to push forward.

This is just another movie that takes a huge dump on the OG hero and replaces them with “muh strong wahmen”.

And I’m not talking about Sarah Connor here.


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 2, 2019)

Women also don't give a shit about terminator because it's terminator_, _and you can't get GA women _just_ by putting women into a movie. Terminator always had strong women, but it's still a dude movie. Seems like a miscalculation.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 2, 2019)

Speaking of feminism
Spoiler warning:



*Spoiler*: __ 



 Sarah Conner assumes the bad robot is after the girl because her "womb is important"(her exact words) . Strongly indicating that the girl is supposed to birth an important male figure like she did.

In the last act the big secret is revealed..the girl has taken John Conners new role as the leader of the resistance and doesn't breed one.

And Sarah is like "WHAAAAAT?! THE LEADER IS A WOOMON?"


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## dr_shadow (Nov 2, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Speaking of feminism
> Spoiler warning:
> 
> 
> ...



That's the kind of lines I hope Hamilton only said because the director made her to.


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## butcher50 (Nov 2, 2019)

first they came for Han Solo, but i did not protest because i'm not a Han Solo/SW fan.

then they came for Luke Skywalker, still i did nothing about it because hey SW is not my thing (and i didn't want to believe their conspiracy theories either)

finally they came for my bro Johnny..............and there was no one left to protest this injustice, all my fault i know.


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 2, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> That's the kind of lines I hope Hamilton only said because the director made her to.



Yes, that's how movies work.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 2, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> Yes, that's how movies work.



Actors often come with valuable input themselves, because they see the entire production from only the viewpoint of their own character, and might therefore have insights into their thoughts and motivations that the director or writer didn't think about.

Sometimes, at least. Other times you get situations like where Patrick Stewart suggested that Picard should be part of a dune buggy chase at the opening to Star Trek: Nemesis.


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## MShadows (Nov 2, 2019)

butcher50 said:


> first they came for Han Solo, but i did not protest because i'm not a Han Solo/SW fan.
> 
> then they came for Luke Skywalker, still i did nothing about it because hey SW is not my thing (and i didn't want to believe their conspiracy theories either)
> 
> finally they came for my bro Johnny..............and there was no one left to protest this injustice, all my fault i know.


"B-B-But it's James Cameron, man! He's gonna do the Terminator franchise justice... Right, guys?? Guys...?"

Reactions: Like 2


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 2, 2019)

And of course the classic arnold / cameron spat in T1 where cameron wanted arnold to say "I will be back" and arnold wanted to say "I'll be back" and cameron is arguing that arnold's a machine and should speak robotically and not use contractions and arnold's just flexing muscles at him, and eventually arnold wins out and it becomes iconic.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 2, 2019)

Lastly, I'll say that for a rated R movie..this movie is for the most part pretty tame. They actually cut away from gruesome scenes most of time..why do that when this is rated R!?


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## MShadows (Nov 2, 2019)

Well, at least they were inspired with the movie's title. 

Truly a *dark fate* for the Terminator franchise.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 2, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> And of course the classic arnold / cameron spat in T1 where cameron wanted arnold to say "I will be back" and arnold wanted to say "I'll be back" and cameron is arguing that arnold's a machine and should speak robotically and not use contractions and arnold's just flexing muscles at him, and eventually arnold wins out and it becomes iconic.


Btw I'm reading the Cameron and Miller directed this together and some of the ideas in this film was his.

Sooo yeah


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## dr_shadow (Nov 2, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Lastly, I'll say that for a rated R movie..this movie is for the most part pretty tame. They actually cut away from gruesome scenes most of time..why do that when this is rated R!?



It was rated R?!


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## dr_shadow (Nov 2, 2019)

What the hell, Boxofficemojo is now owned by "IMDBPro - An Amazon Company".

Aside from the strange Russian doll corporate structure (didn't know IMDB was owned by Amazon), they've put some features behind a paywall, such as seeing where this movie ranks compared to the other Terminator instalments.

Ass.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 2, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> It was rated R?!


Yup..barely any blood and gore and everyone was fully dressed throughout ..

But R rated nonetheless


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## butcher50 (Nov 2, 2019)

For those who were confused with the opening scene, here is IN-LORE explanation on how i think that annoying opening scenario works as shown (IMO):

*Spoiler*: __ 




so two basic rules to keep in mind:

1# once you chrono-port someone/something (make them go time-travel), they are protected by that blue bubble from reality itself, including major history-altering actions like Cyberdyne/Skynet getting destroyed in T2JD, basically the time-travelling visitors will still arrive and land even if their point of origin was erased, they were preserved in the blue time/quantum bubble.

2 # time-travel wise: you can only defend yourself against threats you actually remember encountering or being told by your close friends/family that they encountered (aka sending Kyle Reese to guard mom from the T800 in 1984 and sending "Uncle Bob" to guard his kid self from the T1000 in 1995)

and sadly there was no way for Commander Connor to foresee something like this happening (especially from an obliterated future war-timeline), basically a considerable time before sending the original T800 to 1984 and T1000 to 1995, Skynet was still testing and fine-tuning it's teleportation platform (time machine), so it scattered a group of T800s (say around 8 or 10) into a time period between let’s say September 1997 and mid 2010s with the primary objective to rendezvous with the nearest Skynet-friendly base to confirm the teleportation/time-jumping capabilities of the time machine, plus gather some extra helpful intel along the journey, had the cycle of T1/2’s future war and course of history carried on “as intended”, Connor would have likely never encountered them and it wouldn’t be a stretch to say that most of them ended up stuck somewhere and/or got too damaged upon arrival into the post-nuclear apocalypse wastes and battlefields, add Skynet having more then enough time to completely delete the tracks/logs of those departures to prevent the resistance from finding their exact arrival times and locations (unlike with the 80s T800 and the 90s T1000 departures because as soon as those were done, Skynet’s consciousness was taken off-line).

now because Sarah Connor decided to go out of her way to radically alter the course of history in T2JD and succeeded, that future war timeline was obliterated yet those straggling, lost T800s are still in transit, they will be arriving on their intended dates and destinations still, so i imagine first of these stragglers "Carl" arriving only to wonder around a bit, get the AI equivalent of confusion at the still-present human civilization and lack of Skynet's dominance, let alone nuclear devastation and winter, discovering that their Master is completely gone the lost T800s will automatically switch to their one last Secondary Objective: Track down and Assassinate John Connor.

so this is how the opening scene plays out


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 2, 2019)

I heard we get a bare ass shot.

It better be natalia reyes


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 2, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> I heard we get a bare ass shot.
> 
> It better be natalia reyes


This reminds me...what happened to the loli that was in that one Transformers movie?

Asking for a friend


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 2, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> This reminds me...what happened to the loli that was in that one Transformers movie?



If you mean isabela moner, that's dora the explorer so you get a pass because

I mean


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 2, 2019)

Wow..she's all grown up. I wasn't before, But I think I may try watching that movie someday .


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## Suigetsu (Nov 2, 2019)

MShadows said:


> "B-B-But it's James Cameron, man! He's gonna do the Terminator franchise justice... Right, guys?? Guys...?"


He didnt directed but the man has changed, this I have to admit and there is evidence for it. When he allowed Alita to be made by R.Rodriguez I knew it. JC said he would allow no one else to do it and literally over his dead body. But in the end someone else made it AND he allowed someone to trash terminator 2... With STRONK WOMYN power...

Lets see how Avatar 2 turns out, in theory it should be save since it was written before the rise of the sjw. But Jim is now a herbivore so, who knows. This makes me legit sad you know.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 2, 2019)

What's freaky is that I have this memory from the 1990's of my grandfather asking me if I'd seen "Tärminatår 5", and then describing what I now know to be the climax of the first Terminator movie.

Aside from the humor of my grandpa having seen Terminator at all, and him mispronouncing the title like only a Swedish farmer born in the 1930's could, I've always been perplexed by where he got the erroneous "5" at the end of the title from. Maybe he had seen it on Channel 5? Or at 5 o'clock? Or it was the 5th part in the channel's marathon of classic sci-fi or action movies?

Whatever the reason, it made it seem like my grandpa is clairvoyant, as he apparently predicted Terminator: Genysis about 20 years before it came out. A movie that's partially a remake of the original, which was the movie he actually saw.


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 2, 2019)

Suigetsu said:


> He didnt directed but the man has changed, this I have to admit and there is evidence for it. When he allowed Alita to be made by R.Rodriguez I knew it. JC said he would allow no one else to do it and literally over his dead body. But in the end someone else made it AND he allowed someone to trash terminator 2... With STRONK WOMYN power...
> 
> Lets see how Avatar 2 turns out, in theory it should be save since it was written before the rise of the sjw. But Jim is now a herbivore so, who knows. This makes me legit sad you know.



Alita could have been so damn good.



But remember all this producer talk clash stuff is always hearsay. I doubt cameron co-directed this. There are plenty of great directors who are unremarkable producers. It's a different talent.


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## MShadows (Nov 2, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> Alita could have been so damn good.
> 
> 
> 
> But remember all this producer talk clash stuff is always hearsay. I doubt cameron co-directed this. There are plenty of great directors who are unremarkable producers. It's a different talent.


I actually enjoyed Alita, as someone who's never had any interaction with the series before. 

The fight choreography and the CGI were amazing. I do have some gripes with the plot, but like I said, I enjoyed it for what it was.


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## Suigetsu (Nov 2, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> Alita could have been so damn good.
> 
> 
> 
> But remember all this producer talk clash stuff is always hearsay. I doubt cameron co-directed this. There are plenty of great directors who are unremarkable producers. It's a different talent.


He didnt co-directed Alita nor Terminator. He just produced and put the money, problem is he gets people that directs low budget films and has no experience with high budget ones, let alone FREAKING Tim Miller.. who is a MEGA NOOB when it comes to make movies.

Back in 2010 I mailed some Deadpool comic volumes to james cameron, directors guild. Back then he used to say only spiderman was the cool comic book hero and that the rest sucked. Then you listen to him saying he is one of the people that helped get the project greenlit. Hmmm... I wonder if I got the comics that I sent to him.


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## Suigetsu (Nov 2, 2019)

MShadows said:


> I actually enjoyed Alita, as someone who's never had any interaction with the series before.
> 
> The fight choreography and the CGI were amazing. I do have some gripes with the plot, but like I said, I enjoyed it for what it was.


Alita's cgi effects for me where meh, same with the art direction which dismissed all the post apocalyptic punk that the manga was. Also the big eyes where too disturbing for me.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 3, 2019)

*Red Letter Media review*

They've got a point in that adult John Connor is played by a new actor every time we see him. 

Michael Edwards (non-speaking) in Terminator 2, Nick Stahl in Terminator 3, Christian Bale in Salvation, and Jason Clarke in Genysis.

But... I guess... time travel? Maybe in each timeline it's a different one of Kyle's sperms that impregnates Sarah, and John therefore ends up with slightly different features? Though come to think of it none of these actors look like they could be the child of Linda Hamilton and Michael Biehn.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Nov 3, 2019)




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## dr_shadow (Nov 3, 2019)

I'm surprised at how the Chinese gross ($28m) is almost the same as the American gross ($29m), given how the PRC has no nostalgia for the franchise.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Nov 3, 2019)




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## dr_shadow (Nov 3, 2019)

I'm kind of curious about the physics of the T-1000 and associated liquid-metal Terminators; how much does that thing weight, and how much force can it absorb before breaking apart?

Obviously the resistance of the surface is not "zero", since it is able to hold on to guns, drive cars, climb ladders etc. without its hands breaking. But in fights it seems like it takes relatively little trauma to split it into smaller parts.

E.g. if you hit a human over the head with a steel pipe, it will definitely injure the person, but probably not_ break_ the head outright unless extreme force is applied. Whereas if you do the same thing to a T-1000 the pipe will more likely than not pass clean through the head and split it into two halves.

In this movie:


*Spoiler*: __ 




The un-docked liquid Terminator is easily split apart using a weighted chain, where if you hit a human the same way the chain would more likely wrap itself around the body. I.e. a T-1000 is less durable/sturdy than a human, which seems weird.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 3, 2019)

Just got back from watching DF.

As an action movie, I enjoyed it.

As a _Terminator_ story -- aside from the opening creative decision that a lot of people (rightfully) lambast -- DF's story by itself, was, eh. Rehash of T1's plot -- time-traveling robot assassin(s) sent back to its target the the DF's female cyborg Kyle Reese.

It says a lot that, I prefer _Genisys_'s Pops T-800 as a Terminator-character over DF Carl T-800.



Suigetsu said:


> But above all *the "new" terminator is super unremarkable*" FFS in the originals of james cameron you had FUCKING ARNOLD and then Robert who its an excellent actor! then in T3 you get a hot babe "which I excuse" but in this one you get what? *some random schmuck*?



Some James Cameron trivia -- the bolded had been James Cameron's original intention for the Terminator antagonists, even during T1. He wanted to Terminator to be unremarkable, to be looking like an ordinary guy. Then James Cameron met Arnold, and he revised his plans for the T-800 in T1. The Rev-9 was JC's creative choice to return to that. Which, in my opinion, some people won't like because of that rationale, while others like myself like it because of that rationale. A divisive creative choice, for better or for worst.



mr_shadow said:


> I suppose we also learned something about the mechanics of time travel.
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...





Vault said:


> The time travel in this makes no fucking sense what so ever.
> 
> Unless this universe kinda works as the "universe prime" where all the future scenarios can be changed only through that one specific timeline



This is where DF -- and _Gensisys _-- take their cue from TSCC, which escalated the scale into a multi-temporal war.



Vault said:


> The franchise is tainted. Just shelve it and leave it alone.
> 
> Only 1 and 2 exist



After seeing DF, TSCC is still the best post-T2 sequel, IMO.



~Gesy~ said:


> Speaking of feminism
> Spoiler warning:
> 
> 
> ...



I didn't come to accept Dani as the future leader, in either timeline. In T2, you can see some of the qualities young John Connor had that would carry over to his future as the successful leader of the human resistance.

You know what would have been better instead of bland Dani? Choose Miles Dyson's kids instead, one or both, have someone be some programmer rather than a messiah/leader. John already got the messiah/leader role pinned. Why not explore a different significant target, and with that, different concerns and thus different character dynamics and war dynamics.



~Gesy~ said:


> Btw I'm reading the Cameron and Miller directed this together and some of the ideas in this film was his.
> 
> Sooo yeah



The divisive opening scene decision, was James Cameron's idea.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 3, 2019)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Why not explore a different significant target, and with that, different concerns and thus different character dynamics and war dynamics.


Ehhh....sounds risky. Let's just write the same story again to make a quick buck.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 3, 2019)

Also, it just hit me, how to comparably sum up the ending of _Dark Fate_ compared to_ Genisys_ in terms of _Terminator _series story:

Compared to _Dark Fate_, _Genisys_ at least ends with something that has some of worth investing in / watching next. Depending on what you think on Dani's character, whether she's worthwhile -- DF ends with little to nothing.

Wow.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 3, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Ehhh....sounds risky. Let's just write the same story again to make a quick buck.



The Dyson children would be more interesting to follow -- they have more already going for them, compared to the blank slate that Dani started off with, and still bland by the end of the film in terms of what she has going on for her towards the future.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 3, 2019)

It's noteworthy that Arnold (72) is almost a side character, with much less screen time than in Genysis. 

I think they're weaning the audience of him in preparation for the day when he can't jump out of an airplane anymore, even a greenscreen one.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 3, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> It's noteworthy that Arnold (72) is almost a side character, with much less screen time than in Genysis.
> 
> I think they're weaning the audience of him in preparation for the day when he can't jump out of an airplane anymore, even a greenscreen one.



Well, TSCC already demonstrated how a _Terminator _story without Arnold can be worthwhile. However, that was a TV series though -- Arnold's the movie draw.

Speaking of which, what post-governor movies have Arnold done that was good? I haven't seen any yet. I know _Maggie _caught my interest, but am yet to watch it.


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## Suigetsu (Nov 4, 2019)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Some James Cameron trivia -- the bolded had been James Cameron's original intention for the Terminator antagonists, even during T1. He wanted to Terminator to be unremarkable, to be looking like an ordinary guy. Then James Cameron met Arnold, and he revised his plans for the T-800 in T1. The Rev-9 was JC's creative choice to return to that. Which, in my opinion, some people won't like because of that rationale, while others like myself like it because of that rationale. A divisive creative choice, for better or for worst.


Arnold does portray the look of a machine, the new guy sucks and has no presence on the screen. If you liked this thing you should be embarrased. BTW how is the cassandra cain thingy going? are you still protesting?


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## butcher50 (Nov 4, 2019)

Another sorta bait and switch moment/missed opportunity:

*Spoiler*: __ 




when the military guy showed up in the warehouse to provide Sarah and gang with the EMP bombs, i was like...........Dyson Junior ?  is that you ? ...........turns out completely unrelated guy 




the tasteless opening aside, i enjoyed the movie overall as a standalone project but there were some here and there hiccup moments that made me do all sorts of eye-rolling expressions:


*Spoiler*: __ 




1: Sarah's little "NEED NO MAN !"-style talk during the nighttime train ride, when comparing her's and dani's experiences, later on the airplane sequence Grace also joys the male-hating fun with one similar line (what's wrong with it ? imagine in this day and age two male heroes that you are supposed to like and care about making similar comments like that towards women WITHOUT their views challenged/corrected hard in some way or another throughout the movie, even in the original 1984 when asked how women fare in the post-apocalyptic future war that Kyle Reese arrived from, Kyle answers "GREAT FIGHTERS !" so excuse me where exactly this sense of resentment and retaliation against John and Kyle the feminist filmmakers felt they needed to inject into the series ?).

2: somewhat related to number 1, the super-late, bloody-obvious reveal about Dani already being the charismatic leader/messiah-figure for the upcoming human resistance, yes i get it i get you don't need to whack me over the head with a sledgehammer for that to sink in (a moment probably filmed for audiences not familiar with the series)

3: the little, unnecessary semantics vocabulary games in the ICE-like camp where Grace wakes up, beats everybody up and interrogates the security lady on "WHERE ARE THE PRISONERS ?" (the lady's response being "not prisoners, detainees") felt like a throwaway anti-trump jab.

4: the VFX artists were getting exhausted in places towards the end of the movie, especially evident during the Airplane fight tossing around and the underwater scenes, the CGI looked really cartoony at times, maybe TDarkFate was initially envisioned as an Anime ?

5: similar to Genisys, the physical durability and stamina of the main normal human characters (sarah and dani ramos) was cranked up to the Fast & Furious movies-levels, especially towards the end of the movie, getting repeatedly thrown and smashed into hard, heavy objects and surfaces inside the crashing airplane, also shaking off two nearby grenade detonations to make an exit out of it, sinking deep underwater and swimming out of it at super-speeds as if they were mermaids all the while still retaining sufficient strength for a last stand against the Rev-9......really really stretching my SOD.

6: somewhat related to number 5, standard 9mm/0.45 pistols are basically useless underwater and it goes double when used against a raging metallic, regenerating beast like Rev-9, maybe if Sarah pulled a shortened Kalashnikov (aksu) then maybe...yeah i can buy that but nah...........the main villain should have gutted them right there, they were completely defenseless.

7: not counting T2JD, this is like 3.5 time the "Good" T800 character sacrifices themselves to save the heroes and defeat the main baddie (4 if you count the Marcus Hybrid in TSalvation 2009 doing something similar, NO COUNT THAT 5 if you add Grace to the club)........a little stale at this point ? it's like those tragic car-crash openings, too overused by now.


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## MShadows (Nov 4, 2019)

For those of you that have seen the movie, how much screen time & dialogue does Arnold have? And were you invested in Carl's character?


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 4, 2019)

Suigetsu said:


> Arnold does portray the look of a machine,



That's what James Cameron thought, and so made the change in T1.



Suigetsu said:


> the new guy sucks and has no presence on the screen. If you liked this thing you should be embarrased.



Respectfully, I disagree with you, to an extent. As a antagonistic Terminator, Gabriel Luna's portrayal befits better for infiltrator types better than Arnold's distinct body-build and accent, and demonstrated as much, if not more, of infiltration blending in and infiltrating engagement compared to Patrick's T-1000.



Suigetsu said:


> BTW how is the cassandra cain thingy going? are you still protesting?



Current continuity Cassandra Cain is Orphan. She's alright so far. Now, her in the upcoming _Birds of Prey_ movie -- tsch, might as well be a character bearing her name and ethnicity but that's it, nothing else about the character that makes her what she is.

As for Beechen and DiDiot, yes, to this day, I still hate them. Hence, why the sig hasn't changed. Never forget. Never ever forgiven.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 4, 2019)

With the opening scene creative decision being James Cameron's idea, I wonder if, who tried to stand up to JC, pointing out that that would be franchise suicide.

I can't fathom everyone -- director and writers -- believing and agreeing with James Cameron that it was a 'good' creative decision, never mind one to revitalize the franchise. Surely there had to be people who seriously tried to convince JC and supporters to not go through with it. All of them can't be that stupid.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 4, 2019)

I don't believe it was "franchise suicide"..if such a thing exist.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 4, 2019)

*Spoiler*: __ 



What's funny is eventhough John is supposedly the centerpiece of the franchise ..they never knew exactly what to do with him.

He was a bum in T3..and James again said had they kept him he would've just ended up being a nobody if there was no war to wage.

I thought Linda did a great job..but it would've been a better opportunity to have John play the mentor role to the new girl.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 4, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> I don't believe it was "franchise suicide"..if such a thing exist.



From all the audience clamor about the DF, the opening scene seems pretty much that. Especially in terms of looking back on the previous films.



~Gesy~ said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



One of the reasons why I enjoyed the show -- it had good ideas of what trials would happened next and be worthwhile to watch.


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## Suigetsu (Nov 4, 2019)

Comic Book Guy said:


> That's what James Cameron thought, and so made the change in T1.


 what change?




> Respectfully, I disagree with you, to an extent. As a antagonistic Terminator, Gabriel Luna's portrayal befits better for infiltrator types better than Arnold's distinct body-build and accent, and demonstrated as much, if not more, of infiltration blending in and infiltrating engagement compared to Patrick's T-1000.


Yeah you see there is this thing called presence on screen which Gabriel Luna doesnt have at all, He doesn't feel like a terminator, He doesnt look like a cold calculating clumsy machine. 
Infiltration? its a movie lad, people dont care about that and that has been proven fact, because if the actor isnt iconic people wont remember and wont care, folks like to see eye candy and eye protein. Plus wasnt Arnold and Patrick supposed to be infiltrators anyway? Hence having the whole average looking guy being pointless. IMO ofc.



> Current continuity Cassandra Cain is Orphan. She's alright so far. Now, her in the upcoming _Birds of Prey_ movie -- tsch, might as well be a character bearing her name and ethnicity but that's it, nothing else about the character that makes her what she is.


Sad to hear that but I suppose she is better than before? In the comic book side of things at least.



> As for Beechen and DiDiot, yes, to this day, I still hate them. Hence, why the sig hasn't changed. Never forget. Never ever forgiven.


Just dont let such a bad thing to mark you, for example I dislike with all my heart: buddy escalera, daniel way and alex Alonzo “they trashed Deadpool” but I would not wear anything to protest them now because they are filth and I don't like them. My life and space are too precious for that.

I did protest on a more effective way, to say the least :los


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## Suigetsu (Nov 4, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> I don't believe it was "franchise suicide"..if such a thing exist.


You are right, it was already dead. People only remember T1 & T2 and then a bunch of bad movies. T3 girl termi was the hottest!


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 4, 2019)

Suigetsu said:


> what change?



Arnold showed up, and James Cameron was impressed that Arnold's look would come across great as a machine.



Suigetsu said:


> Yeah you see there is this thing called presence on screen which Gabriel Luna doesnt have at all, *He doesn't feel like a terminator, He doesnt look like a cold calculating clumsy machine.
> Infiltration*? its a movie lad, people dont care about that and that has been proven fact, because if the actor isnt iconic people wont remember and wont care, folks like to see eye candy and eye protein. Plus wasnt Arnold and Patrick supposed to be infiltrators anyway? Hence having the whole average looking guy being pointless. IMO ofc.



And the bolded worked for the Terminator as an Infiltrator -- it's not supposed to stand out, unlike Arnold. Patrick's T-1000 is an Infiltrator, but Luna's Rev-9 demonstrated more variety in blending in with his adaptable personality -- of course, the Rev-9 had more opportunities to do so, compared to Patrick's T-1000.

Now, in term of antagonist charisma onscreen, I agree. Though, I'd point it back to the divisiveness of the creative decision -- works well for the Terminator Infiltrator concept idea, but at the detriment of the aforementioned memorable antagonist character presence & charisma.



Suigetsu said:


> Sad to hear that but I suppose she is better than before? In the comic book side of things at least.



Compared to before, yes. Because Barbara is Batgirl now. Cassandra Cain, and Stephanie Brown were shafted because of that.



Suigetsu said:


> Just dont let such a bad thing to mark you, for example I dislike with all my heart: buddy escalera, daniel way and alex Alonzo “they trashed Deadpool” but I would not wear anything to protest them now because they are filth and I don't like them. My life and space are too precious for that.
> 
> I did protest on a more effective way, to say the least :los



For me, it still has value. And thus, I'd never forget. For better and worst.



Suigetsu said:


> You are right, it was already dead. People only remember T1 & T2 and then a bunch of bad movies. T3 girl termi was the hottest!



TSCC was the only worthwhile post-T2 sequel. Unfortunately, it was under Fox. Too good to last.

Also, shout out to _T2: 3D Across Time_.

Now upcoming is that Terminator video game. Some FPS.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 4, 2019)

So there was some stream Q&A video of Tim Miller -- he apparently blames DF's lackluster opening box performance to _Joker_'s ongoing success having "sucked all the air out" for DF's opening.


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## Deathbringerpt (Nov 4, 2019)

It's a testament to Terminator 2's quality as an action movie with a very strict idea on time traveling that every single sequel that came after it, needs to outright shit on its themes and plot points so that it can justify its existence and still fail miserably at it.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 4, 2019)

Deathbringerpt said:


> It's a testament to Terminator 2's quality as an action movie *with a very strict idea on time traveling* that every single sequel that came after it, needs to outright shit on its themes and plot points so that it can justify its existence and still fail miserably at it.



Which time-traveling idea would that be?


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## Deathbringerpt (Nov 4, 2019)

Simple causality loop. No fuss, no muss.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 4, 2019)

Deathbringerpt said:


> Simple causality loop. No fuss, no muss.



Ah, the stable time-loop.

I've heard that James Cameron had quote-unquote 'always' intended _Terminator_s to be a changeable timeline. However, I am yet to even identify where JC has ever stated that. But discarding that comment -- T1 and T2 stands great on their own as a 2-part saga.


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## Suigetsu (Nov 4, 2019)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Arnold showed up, and James Cameron was impressed that Arnold's look would come across great as a machine.


OFC It was Jame's first real movie "piranah 2 doesnt count"



> And the bolded worked for the Terminator as an Infiltrator -- it's not supposed to stand out, unlike Arnold. Patrick's T-1000 is an Infiltrator, but Luna's Rev-9 demonstrated more variety in blending in with his adaptable personality -- of course, the Rev-9 had more opportunities to do so, compared to Patrick's T-1000.


Patrick didnt stood out and he looked like a cold killer machine, it gave him presence on the screen and became an iconic silhuette. What does the new one achieve? unremarkable looks, no screen presence.
And as I said before, the infiltration thing its redundant because Arnold's model was an infiltrator, same with patrick. Also you forget this is a movie and in james cameron's words "we gave boobs to the navi because this is a movie for humans"

And look how well the new decision resulted. An absolute flop.



> Compared to before, yes. Because Barbara is Batgirl now. Cassandra Cain, and Stephanie Brown were shafted because of that.


Did Damian managed to bag Stephanie Brown in the end like he always dreamed off? I mean he had the teenage kicks for her no?



> For me, it still has value. And thus, I'd never forget. For better and worst.


Dude dont live in the past, those people already got their reckoning, are you really going to be stuck on a bad memory? Let alone capeshit.



> TSCC was the only worthwhile post-T2 sequel. Unfortunately, it was under Fox. Too good to last.
> 
> Also, shout out to _T2: 3D Across Time_.
> 
> Now upcoming is that Terminator video game. Some FPS.



Ah yes T2:3d across time was absolute GOAT! I also liked the T2 arcade, it was freaking fun to play.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 4, 2019)

Suigetsu said:


> Patrick didnt stood out and he looked like a cold killer machine, it gave him presence on the screen and became an iconic silhuette. What does the new one achieve? unremarkable looks, no screen presence.
> And as I said before, the infiltration thing its redundant because Arnold's model was an infiltrator, same with patrick.



Arnold's Infiltrator isn't quite redundant -- he's of a bodybuilder. Already, he'll stand out from the populous at large. Luna is far more inconspicuous -- with perhaps the exception of the detainee setting.

Patrick definitely has the scary menace, which works for the screen. Luna's lack of scary menace, while falls short for the screen, suits the infiltrator more aptly.



Suigetsu said:


> Also you forget this is a movie and in james cameron's words "we gave boobs to the navi because this is a movie for humans"



I'm not forgetting that this is a movie and thus has to come across with impression. _Dark Fate_ is also a Terminator story. And that's part of the reason why I enjoyed Luna's Rev-9 portrayal.



Suigetsu said:


> And look how well the new decision resulted. An absolute flop.



DF being a flop, yep -- but, Luna's casting was not the only divisive creative choice, and currently isn't the one drawing the most of the outcry.



Suigetsu said:


> Did Damian managed to bag Stephanie Brown in the end like he always dreamed off? I mean he had the teenage kicks for her no?



Not that I know of.



Suigetsu said:


> Dude dont live in the past, those people already got their reckoning, are you really going to be stuck on a bad memory? Let alone capeshit.



It's how I value. And so, I'll never forget.



Suigetsu said:


> Ah yes T2:3d across time was absolute GOAT! I also liked the *T2 arcade, it was freaking fun to play*.



Damn thing needs to be available in the current game markets.


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## Suigetsu (Nov 4, 2019)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Arnold's Infiltrator isn't quite redundant -- he's of a bodybuilder. Already, he'll stand out from the populous at large.


And yet he performed better thane expected.


> Luna is far more inconspicuous -- with perhaps the exception of the detainee setting.


No one gives a fuck about Luna, this is not D&D, it's a movie and thus you need presence and the people to buy it and feel like its authentic. Obviously if you cross the line then its over the top or if you under perform "like captain marvel" which looks unbelivable then you mess up.
Besides his powers are ass pull over powered technology, its just retarded. A complete shift of ideas from the James cameron that did terminator and avatar. he has changed.. now he only cares about money now.



> Patrick definitely has the scary menace, which works for the screen. Luna's lack of scary menace, while falls short for the screen, suits the infiltrator more aptly.





> I'm not forgetting that this is a movie and thus has to come across with impression. _Dark Fate_ is also a Terminator story. And that's part of the reason why I enjoyed Luna's Rev-9 portrayal.


Terminator ended with T2. let the thing rest. I dislike how they always want to turn everything into a franchise these days, like a hollow shell. Forgetting that what matters is whats inside the container and not the shell.

[qupte]
DF being a flop, yep -- but, Luna's casting was not the only divisive creative choice, and currently isn't the one drawing the most of the outcry.
[/quote]
They deserve it for being grocks.







> It's how I value. And so, I'll never forget.


Well, dont say I didnt try.




> Damn thing needs to be available in the current game markets.


or emulators.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 4, 2019)

First time seeing this.


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## Suigetsu (Nov 4, 2019)



Reactions: Like 1


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 4, 2019)

Suigetsu said:


> And yet he performed better thane expected.



In terms of what? In terms of onscreen presence and charisma, yep. In terms of an Infiltrator, so far yes. Would he have succeeded and maintained infiltration in the situations Patrick or Luna were in? Personally, I have doubt, and that's not due to both of their mimetic polyalloy.



Suigetsu said:


> No one gives a fuck about Luna,



The praise I've read from others, I'm not the only one with my regard.



Suigetsu said:


> this is not D&D, it's a movie and thus you need presence and the people to buy it and feel like its authentic. Obviously if you cross the line then its over the top or if you under perform "like captain marvel" which looks unbelivable then you mess up.
> Besides his powers are ass pull over powered technology, its just retarded. A complete shift of ideas from the James cameron that did terminator and avatar. he has changed.. now he only cares about money now.



In terms criticism of a movie impression, yes, indeed. In terms of a _Terminator _story though, I stand by my regard and can argue for it, and I'm not the only one.

As for James Cameron -- all he cares about is working on _Avatar_, since actors and director Miller stated that James Cameron was never onset at any point, instead skyping a few times from wherever he worked on _Avatar_. DF's opening scene's creative choice is his idea.


Yes, I'm aware of that, and Patrick's acting. It's not in continuity though.



Suigetsu said:


> Terminator ended with T2. let the thing rest. I dislike how they always want to turn everything into a franchise these days, like a hollow shell. Forgetting that what matters is whats inside the container and not the shell.



Out of all the lot, I still lament over TSCC -- not only the best, but an actual worthwhile post-T2 story.



Suigetsu said:


> They deserve it for being grocks.



The opening scene is a hard wall to begin to scale, never mind win over.



Suigetsu said:


> Well, dont say I didnt try.
> 
> 
> 
> or emulators.



Would love to play that on a big-screen hd TV screen. That, and other arcade gems.


I wonder if his health is better than last I heard -- a pretty bad hip, iirc.



mr_shadow said:


> First time seeing this.



*Still damn good.*


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## dr_shadow (Nov 4, 2019)

Comic Book Guy said:


> *Still damn good.*



Lots of stuff doesn't make sense though. 

* Why can you suddenly bring your clothes, weapons, and bike (!) with you on time travel?
* Why is Future Arnold dressed like a 1990's biker?
* Why would he recruit Teenage John to go take out Skynet with him, instead of going in with Adult Future John?
* The T-1,000,000 doesn't seem to be very good security when it can be defeated by a single T-800 and a teenage human.

But I get that it's a_ ride_ and that the Rule of Cool trumps logic. 

Weird thing is that this is the nearest we have to a canon depiction of Skynet's death, since it's never been shown in any of the movies. Kyle just implied that it was immanent at the time of him going in the time machine.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 5, 2019)

*Global box office (not adjusted for inflation)*

1. Terminator 2: Judgement Day ($515m)
2. Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines ($433m)
3. Terminator: Genysis ($432m)
4. Terminator: Salvation ($365m)
5. Terminator: Dark Fate ($123m)
6. The Terminator ($78m)



---

As many will know, inflation means that it gets "easier" to make money the further forward in time you go, so if two equally-good movies are released years apart, the more recent of the two will generally have the larger nominal gross.

For that reason it was to be expected that Dark Fate would beat T1, and _astonishing_ that T2 is still number one after almost* 30 years* of inflation.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Nov 5, 2019)

MShadows said:


> For those of you that have seen the movie, how much screen time & dialogue does Arnold have? And were you invested in Carl's character?



He shows up for about half the film and 
*Spoiler*: __ 



plays his generic role of dying at the end to put the bad guy down




Pretty much what you'd expect of Arnold. 

AS for the movie itself, it's really rather weak. Kyle Reese 2.0, the drugged up chick, has little going for her beyond being saved by future Dani (aka female John Connor), and her already being human makes her sacrifice feel much less moving than T800's sacrifice in the second film. 
*Spoiler*: __ 



John's early death


 does a disservice to John's character when it could've just as easily been accomplished had he 
*Spoiler*: __ 



died midway into the movie serving as inspiration to Dani perhaps




The main character, Dani's characterization was also rather bland. She doesn't show capacity for leadership at all here compared to the 10-year old John who talked his mother out of smashing the T-800's CPU and had enough self-agency to take money out of an ATM to keep himself afloat, instead just spouting "We have to fight!" all the time.

It's not bad as an action flick, but not exactly thought-provoking either and doesn't have nearly as memorable characters as the first 3 films.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 5, 2019)

The action was great. And it was relatively paced fine .

Arnold moreso plays comic relief here and takes a backseat..not sure how others took this. But it worked for me .

I'd watch a sitcom involving a murderous robotic assassin from the future turned family man and decorator.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 5, 2019)

I didn't have a problem with the opening *CONTROVERSY* because I'm already used to the idea that this is the third or fourth possible timeline (depending on whether Salvation is set in the same one as T3 or not) and this character has already been played by multiple actors.

Kind of surprised that so many people seem genuinely upset about it. Maybe T2 was a bigger part of their childhoods than it was mine (I was 2 years old when it came out and obviously didn't see it directly) 

They can easily set the next movie in a fifth timeline where the controversy didn't happen. Time travel is after all central to the premise of the franchise.

It's not like with the Star Wars Snoke controversy where there isn't an easy in-universe way of undoing it. (They've got clones, though)


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## MShadows (Nov 5, 2019)

The studio has become Skynet as they go back in time (create a new reboot) every time a Terminator failed to complete its mission (the last one bombed)


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## MShadows (Nov 5, 2019)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> He shows up for about half the film and
> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> ...


Oh, well... at the very least I was sure the action itself would be good. 

I was expecting Arnold to be more active in this movie, but I guess not. 

Killing off John Connor like that and replacing with him a forced and lackluster character this late into the series is still dumb imo.


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## Vault (Nov 5, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> I didn't have a problem with the opening *CONTROVERSY* because I'm already used to the idea that this is the third or fourth possible timeline (depending on whether Salvation is set in the same one as T3 or not) and this character has already been played by multiple actors.
> 
> Kind of surprised that so many people seem genuinely upset about it. Maybe T2 was a bigger part of their childhoods than it was mine (I was 2 years old when it came out and obviously didn't see it directly)
> 
> ...



Because this is meant to be the real sequel to T2 not the others. That's why people are pissed


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## Vino (Nov 5, 2019)

how bad is it?


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## dr_shadow (Nov 5, 2019)

Vino said:


> how bad is it?



It's essentially the same plot as Terminator 1, 2, and 3. "Run from the Terminator and then fight them in an industrial building". 

If you like that structure you'll probably be entertained, but don't expect any story "progression" or major reveals. Everything is stuff we've seen before.


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## Vino (Nov 5, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> It's essentially the same plot as Terminator 1, 2, and 3.
> 
> If you like that structure you'll probably be entertained, but don't expect any story "progression" or major reveals. Everything is stuff we've seen before.


spoiler me pls


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## Deathbringerpt (Nov 5, 2019)

The most grating shit about this garbage movie is that you can tell Linda Hamilton is trying her best to perform but no acting could erase the fact they turned Sarah Connor into a blubbering fucking retard. 

It's bizarre to me how they thought that directly shitting on T2's message and plot points...and then redoing them all over again but worse in every way was a good idea. It's unbelievable how badly this series has been handled.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 5, 2019)

is this franchise dead ? will they try again in 10-20 years ?


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 5, 2019)

Shiba D. Inu said:


> is this franchise dead ? will they try again in 10-20 years ?


They'll try again. Iconic properties like this one will always get another shot.


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## MShadows (Nov 5, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> They'll try again. Iconic properties like this one will always get another shot.


The latest trend is taking a massive dump on original iconic characters and replacing them with bland ones for no reason.

Especially if said iconic character is a man, he’ll get replaced with a “fierce and powerful” woman.

SW went full retard with this too, and look what happened.


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## GRIMMM (Nov 5, 2019)

Enjoyed it thoroughly. A good action flick to entertain you for a few hours. Not much else to say.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 5, 2019)

Shiba D. Inu said:


> is this franchise dead ? will they try again in 10-20 years ?



I think they'll keep making new ones for as long as Arnold (72) is still alive.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Nov 5, 2019)

The blame game has bgun


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 5, 2019)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> The blame game has bgun


Man..fuck James Cameron. Why don't he direct a movie on his own then?

He won't because he's afraid to tarnish his reputation..hence why he's wiping his hands now.


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## Karma (Nov 5, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Man..fuck James Cameron. Why don't he direct a movie on his own then?
> 
> He won't because he's afraid to tarnish his reputation..hence why he's wiping his hands now.


The studio always strong arms him into promoting these movies. Iirc hell get the rights back after the next movie they make.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 5, 2019)

Karma said:


> The studio always strong arms him into promoting these movies. Iirc hell get the rights back after the next movie they make.



He already got the rights back after Genysis, but he has no interest in directing a third Terminator movie because he thinks the story ended with T2.


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## Karma (Nov 5, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> he things the story ended with T2.


Hes right


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## dr_shadow (Nov 5, 2019)

Karma said:


> Hes right



On the one hand it's understandable that he doesn't want to make Terminator sequels for the rest of his life just as a cheap cash-grab.

But on the other hand... he's not doing much else either, is he? In the* 28 years* since Terminator 2, Cameron has directed *three movies* (True Lies, Titanic, Avatar).


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 5, 2019)

Why produce the movie and help write it if you believe the story is over?


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## dr_shadow (Nov 5, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Why produce the movie and help write it if you believe the story is over?



The Midnight's Edge coverage says that Cameron is good personal friends with especially Arnold Schwarzenegger, and presumably also Linda Hamilton, and therefore gives them his blessing if_ they_ want to make more Terminator sequels, but he's not interested in directing one himself.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 5, 2019)

Doesn't answer my question .

Also I think he's wrong. There's plenty of story left to tell.  Most of the story is open to interpretation.  The creatives behind these movies are simply incompetent.


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## Karma (Nov 5, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> There's plenty of story left to tell.


Skynet, the literal cause of everything bad, is destroyed at the end of T2.

The only way to make a sequel is to retcon things from the first 2 movies. The only movie that doesnt rely on retcons is Salvation, and that's because it's a prequel.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 5, 2019)

Karma said:


> Skynet, the literal cause of everything bad, is destroyed at the end of T2.
> 
> The only way to make a sequel is to retcon things from the first 2 movies. The only movie that doesnt rely on retcons is Salvation, and that's because it's a prequel.


We can have a movie more skynet focused.  One more John Conner focused. More about the war with machines, aftermath of the war with machines. Etc


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## Catalyst75 (Nov 5, 2019)

Karma said:


> Skynet, the literal cause of everything bad, is destroyed at the end of T2.
> 
> The only way to make a sequel is to retcon things from the first 2 movies. The only movie that doesnt rely on retcons is Salvation, and that's because it's a prequel.



Exactly. The whole story of Judgement Day was to stop Skynet before it could be created. Except T3 and Genisys went all in with the "Skynet is inevitable", and that only made a mess of things.

For me, the direction _Dark Fate_ goes with introducing Legion puts a new spin on the premise of the franchise. It isn't Skynet and _its future _that's inevitable, but the development of AI _for military use. _Even with Cyberdyne and all its research and development being destroyed, preventing the existence of the Skynet AI, that wouldn't stop the idea of military artificial intelligence being pursued by someone else.


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## MShadows (Nov 6, 2019)

It’s all about teh MUUHNEEEEY



If he believes the story ended with T2 and he were true to himself he would’ve refused taking part in this subpar product.

Lol, you believe the story ended with T2 but this mess is marketed as “teh trub sequel after all these years”


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## dr_shadow (Nov 6, 2019)

MShadows said:


> It’s all about teh MUUHNEEEEY
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It's true, but when Cameron can apparently afford to pay his bills despite only making one movie per decade, I don't think he wants for money.

If he wanted to, he could probably retire completely and just passively live off Avatar blu-ray sales.


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## MShadows (Nov 6, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> It's true, but when Cameron can apparently afford to pay his bills despite only making one movie per decade, I don't think he wants for money.
> 
> If he wanted to, he could probably retire completely and just passively live off Avatar blu-ray sales.


If he had the dignity he would’ve cock blocked this project or simply dismiss it from being the “truvv sequels”


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## dr_shadow (Nov 6, 2019)

They should honestly do Robocop vs Terminator, the movie. 

There's a comic book precedent, but I haven't read it.

Main roadblock is that the Robocop rights seem to be with Sony (as of the 2014 reboot) while Terminator is a Paramount-Disney ("Fox") collaboration.

---

The plot writes itself. "Robocop survives Judgement Day and joins Connor's resistance. In the third act he briefly gets hacked by Skynet, but in the end him and John team up to fight Arnold."


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## MShadows (Nov 6, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> They should honestly do Robocop vs Terminator, the movie.
> 
> There's a comic book precedent, but I haven't read it.
> 
> ...


Shit, that would’ve been epic


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## Deathbringerpt (Nov 6, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> Why produce the movie and help write it if you believe the story is over?



His writing credit was practically in name only. He was mostly an editor for the final cut and he said it was an experience because the Deadpool director had a plain wrong take about characters and worldbuilding.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 6, 2019)

Deathbringerpt said:


> His writing credit was practically in name only. He was mostly an editor for the final cut and he said it was an experience because the Deadpool director had a plain wrong take about characters and worldbuilding.


Nope . Killing John Conner was his idea among other things.

He was praising this movie before release and now moonwalking away due to backlash. That doesn't sit right with me.


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## Deathbringerpt (Nov 6, 2019)

He always praises the Terminator movies, he has a PR check. Who wouldn't.

But he's never going to direct or fully write a movie because he knows better that this thing is done. Blaming him for other people's insistence to continue to make "true sequels" ain't it, chief.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 6, 2019)

I'm blaming him because had this ended up in high praise he would've happily accepted some of the credit for making it.

He also helped and financed it and put his name out there and said this was the best Terminator in a long time (which is kinda true but that's not saying much.)


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 6, 2019)

I in fact think had this ended up being a good film James would've received more credit for it than Miller.


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## reiatsuflow (Nov 6, 2019)

Gotta remember that one of the big drivers for making T2 was this idea of the terminator being an assembly line machine, which means arnold could play a good terminator, a new terminator, and sarah connor having to reconcile that. That switch was a big part of the movie. 

Not to mention the nuclear war stuff still lingering. Which is outdated in 2019. 

And the whole reason behind the t1000 was james cameron experimenting with new tehcnology.

There was more susbtantive and filmic stuff that used to be behind these ideas once upon a time. Hell, one of the things that initially preocupied cameron about the series is that audiences would accept, visually, a half man half machine. That exoskeleton design. 

I think the sequels aer focusing on the wrong thing. The more paperthin parts of the franchise.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 6, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> Gotta remember that one of the big drivers for making T2 was this idea of the terminator being an assembly line machine, which means arnold could play a good terminator, a new terminator, and sarah connor having to reconcile that. That switch was a big part of the movie.
> 
> Not to mention the nuclear war stuff still lingering. Which is outdated in 2019.
> 
> ...


Skynet is a lot more dangerous now then in 1997, that's for sure. The way every aspect of our lives is being filmed when we step outside and how we're so dependent on technology to run our lives..


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## BlueDemon (Nov 6, 2019)

What's the non-spoilery verdict? For a big fan of the first two. Third was ok-ish.


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## MShadows (Nov 6, 2019)

BlueDemon said:


> What's the non-spoilery verdict? For a big fan of the first two. Third was ok-ish.


Action's good, story's recycled but worse.


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## BlueDemon (Nov 6, 2019)

So pretty much what you'd expect from the..uhm...6th installment? Though it's hopefully better than Genysis or however the fuck that's spelled, the rating on RT and Metacritic are at least better.


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## Unicornsilovethem (Nov 6, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> And of course the classic arnold / cameron spat in T1 where cameron wanted arnold to say "I will be back" and arnold wanted to say "I'll be back" and cameron is arguing that arnold's a machine and should speak robotically and not use contractions and arnold's just flexing muscles at him, and eventually arnold wins out and it becomes iconic.


It was the other way around though. Arnold wanted to say "I will be back".


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## Deathbringerpt (Nov 6, 2019)

reiatsuflow said:


> And of course the classic arnold / cameron spat in T1 where cameron wanted arnold to say "I will be back" and arnold wanted to say "I'll be back" and cameron is arguing that arnold's a machine and should speak robotically and not use contractions and arnold's just flexing muscles at him, and eventually arnold wins out and it becomes iconic.



You fucked it up. Arnold wanted to change the line to make it sound more like a robot and James told him to shut up and read the script. You keep focusing on the guy who had minor involvement in this shit movie. He’s not the problem why current Terminator is bad. He doesn’t really care.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 6, 2019)

BlueDemon said:


> So pretty much what you'd expect from the..uhm...6th installment? Though it's hopefully better than Genysis or however the fuck that's spelled, the rating on RT and Metacritic are at least better.



The consensus on the ranking of the Terminator films seems to be:

1. T2
2. T1
-. Sarah Connor Chronicles
3. Salvation 
4. Dark Fate
5. T3
6. Genysis


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Nov 6, 2019)

I'm hoping they can finally let this series rest now that a movie with James Cameron's improvement has failed to revitalize it, but knowing Terminator it'll probably be back sometime in the 2020's


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## dr_shadow (Nov 6, 2019)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> I'm hoping they can finally let this series rest now that a movie with James Cameron's improvement has failed to revitalize it, but knowing Terminator it'll probably be back sometime in the 2020's



The final movie should come out on 2029, since that's the year Kyle and the original Terminator travelled back from. 

Arnold would be 82 at the time.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 6, 2019)

Catalyst75 said:


> Exactly. The whole story of Judgement Day was to stop Skynet before it could be created. Except T3 and Genisys went all in with the "Skynet is inevitable", and that only made a mess of things.
> 
> For me, the direction _Dark Fate_ goes with introducing Legion puts *a new spin on the premise of the franchise*. It isn't Skynet and _its future _that's inevitable, but the development of AI _for military use. _Even with Cyberdyne and all its research and development being destroyed, preventing the existence of the Skynet AI, that wouldn't stop the idea of military artificial intelligence being pursued by someone else.



It's not a new spin at all.

Josh Friedman already had that as one of the premier ongoing themes in his _Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles_ TV show.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 6, 2019)

To re-state the obvious...


*Spoiler*: __ 





* John destroying Skynet does not prevent Legion.

* Skynet killing John does not prevent Dani.

That is, it's fate that there must be an evil AI, and there must be a human resistance leader to fight it. So presumably:

* Dani destroying Legion would not prevent a third AI.

* Legion killing Dani would not prevent a third resistance leader.

So in effect anything that happens in these movies is ultimately pointless. The main plot beats leading up to 2029/2042 can't be fundamentally changed. Time travel isn't a solution to either Skynet's or humanity's problems.

The only way forward is, well, "forward". Instead of trying to change the past, both sides should put their time machines aside and progress into 2030/2043, because that future isn't known yet, and therefore the only place where a meaningful resolution to the conflict can happen.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Nov 7, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> The final movie should come out on 2029, since that's the year Kyle and the original Terminator travelled back from.
> 
> Arnold would be 82 at the time.



That'd be fitting, but doubtful considering T3 was the only movie to have a decade+ gap since the previous movie's release. The other sequels ranged from a 4 to 7 year gap.


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## Glued (Nov 7, 2019)

yep, its done.

RIP Terminator Franchise.


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## MShadows (Nov 7, 2019)

Ben Grimm said:


> yep, its done.
> 
> RIP Terminator Franchise.


You mean you didn’t like the *TRUVV SEQUEL$$$*?


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## Glued (Nov 7, 2019)

MShadows said:


> You mean you didn’t like the *TRUVV SEQUEL$$$*?



Eh, you can't live up to T2.

T3 was cheesy and Salvation could have been better, but this. Genysis wasn't necessary.

But this thing, I can say the franchise is dead.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 7, 2019)




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## BlueDemon (Nov 7, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> The consensus on the ranking of the Terminator films seems to be:
> 
> 1. T2
> 2. T1
> ...


T4 better than T3? Ehh. Hardly rermember it tbh, watched it only once though, to be fair.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 7, 2019)

T4 is better than T3 for sure.

T1=T2 for me  . I enjoy both for different reasons


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Nov 7, 2019)

I preferred T3 to T4. Genisys is rock bottom from what I've seen tho.

Reactions: Like 1


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## BlueDemon (Nov 8, 2019)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> I preferred T3 to T4. Genisys is rock bottom from what I've seen tho.


Might also just be the teenager in me who thought a half-naked female Terminator was a good idea 

I really can't remember the Christian Bale one and why I thought it wasn't that good.


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## butcher50 (Nov 8, 2019)

In terms of VFX the movie really falls apart during:
*Spoiler*: __ 



the whole Airplane scene and the Underwater scene, especially whenever Arnold and the Villain are smacking into each other, the CGI work is really not up to the test to say it softly, adding on the normal human characters suddenly developing superhuman durability (Fast & Furious-style) for just those two scenes makes it even worse, in one moment when Sarah and Dani are swimming up, they looked like freakin MERMAIDS !




however the final fight is kind of okay at least.

*
My post-T2JD sequels rating list goes something like this:*

1: the first 20 minutes of TGenisys (the rest of the movie is an unwatchable mess)

2:  certain exceptional episodes and scenes of the TSarahConnorChronicles 2008-2009 TV show.

3: T3 Rise of the Machines (with all the stupid jokes removed)

4: Dark Fate (barring that one distasteful scene, in fact i would say T3 and Dark Fate pretty much interchangeable overall)

5: TSalvation (Salvation would have been a lot better film if the Director didn't torpedoed the entire third act, what's wrong with salvation's third act you say ? i can write essays on how ridiculous it is but that's for another thread, it's a complete mess)

Reactions: Like 1


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## Ebisu's Shades (Nov 8, 2019)

Not sure how to rank these.  Its like T1 and T2 and then the rest.
T1 - Follows the horror film formula.  Unstoppable killer robot from the future makes it interesting.  Liked Arnold as the bad guy.  Great special effects.
T2 - More of an action film.  Special effects, new Terminator, dialogue, well everything has been taken up a notch and turned on its head.  Arnold now the good guy.  Linda Hamilton now kicking arse as Sarah Connor.  Finally get to meet John Connor.
T3 - My So Called Life in the back of truck.  The new Terminator is not much different then the T-1000.  Well it can control other machines now and its a girl.  Feels like less production value then T2.  John Connor still grappling with a dark future.
T4 - Finally get to see the future.  The story centers around Marcus who it turns out is the latest Terminator a human Cyborg.  The few snippets of the future we see in T1 and T2 are much better done then this movie which doesn't really deliver.  Skynet much more scary when it is not personified.
T5 - Well Reese fighting the T-1000 was fun.  And T2 Sarah Connor fighting T1 T-800 was fun.  Like how time travel is used more in this one.  Liked Arnold being back.  Don't particularly like John Connor being some sort of terminator hybrid bad guy.  Again Skynet better when not personified.  Also, John Connor not destroying Skynet but some sort of infantry was just dumb.
T6 - Nice to have Linda Hamilton back to the franchise.  Arnold great as always and nice new spin on the T-800.   Despite a major change, movie is a bit been there done that.  New terminator not much different than T-1000.  Special effects are nothing mind blowing.
Sarah Connor Chronicles - Only caught a couple episodes.  Enjoyed it, really just missed it, and didn't get the time to watch.  Enjoy Lena Heady in everything.  I will have to check out this series at some point.
I would say I have enjoyed all these to some degree.
If James Cameron came back I am sure the movie quality would be much better and the special effects would be top notch.  Storywise, I am sure he would give people plenty to complain about.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Saishin (Nov 8, 2019)

So it's flopping,meh they should have continued the Genisys franchise,I ejoyed that movie 

Or if not that they should have continued with Salvation,the only film set in the future war,I'm fed up of these Terminators set in present day,we need a Terminator that tells a story in post-judgement day



~Gesy~ said:


> *We can have a movie more skynet focused.*  One more John Conner focused. More about the war with machines, aftermath of the war with machines. Etc


Somehow this is what we were having with Genisys with Skynet in human form beginning to be an active character then everything went to shit and they reebot again the saga


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## Id (Nov 8, 2019)

Saw Dark Fate at an IMAX theater. And Rewatched T3. 
T3 is still hot garbage and the worst in the franchise.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 8, 2019)

Id said:


> Saw Dark Fate at an IMAX theater. And Rewatched T3.
> T3 is still hot garbage and the worst in the franchise.



Worse than Genysis, with its bizarre recasting of Kyle Reese?


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## Id (Nov 9, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> Worse than Genysis, with its bizarre recasting of Kyle Reese?


I just rewatched T3 with my wife. I owe her dinner for wasting 1.43 hr of her time. 

I hate Genysis a little less. It had some goofy moments that entertained me. Everything you mentioned reminded me why I disliked it. Especially John Connor as the T-3000. 

but damn T3 is awful. The filming, plot, action scenes, characterization, music, acting, choices of humor...all of it was awful.


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## Saishin (Nov 9, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> Worse than Genysis, with its bizarre recasting of Kyle Reese?


Jai Courtney was great as John Connor 


Id said:


> I just rewatched T3 with my wife. I owe her dinner for wasting 1.43 hr of her time.
> 
> I hate Genysis a little less. It had some goofy moments that entertained me. Everything you mentioned reminded me why I disliked it. Especially John Connor as the T-3000.
> 
> but damn T3 is awful. The filming, plot, action scenes, characterization, music, acting, choices of humor...all of it was awful.


The only good thing of T3 was the ending scene


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 9, 2019)

i still want a Genisys sequel to see:
1) Liquid metal Pops
2) T-5000 Matt Smith


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## MShadows (Nov 9, 2019)

After watching the movie I still believe that shafting John is the biggest middle finger to the Terminator fans, but I did enjoy some aspects of the movie. 

The fight scenes themselves were pretty good, with some intense moments and good camera work. The CGI however, was noticeable and kind of wanky at times. 

Linda Hamilton was badass from the moment she was introduced to the very last second she appeared. Loved the battle hardened grumpy old lady thing she went for, but it's understandable considering where Sarah came from and what she went through. 

What I found interesting about the REV-9's portrayal is how "human" it is in its interactions and mannerism. That "My whole body is a weapon" joke was actually good and not something you would've expected from a man hunting machine like it lol 

As for Carl... I honestly liked Pops from Genysis, and Carl is basically a further improved version of that. The interaction between Sarah and him were gold and I feel like the way he evolved after killing John is interesting. I honestly wouldn't mind a mini-series series of how "Carl" became so humanized over the course of the years, if they could somehow convince Schwarzenegger to do it. 
Also, the T-800 is still a powerhouse even when faced with the likes of the REV-9. While the REV-9's biggest strength is its durability, the T-800's would be his raw power, which trumps the REV-9's. 
Carl's sacrifice, to me at least, was also done nicely. I almost shed a tear when he took the enemy to the grave with him and said "For John" one last time, getting resolution with Sarah for taking her son from her. 

Grace was also a badass fighter, but this left me wondering why the Resistance doesn't enhance more humans like her because their chances of survival would increase a lot more (lack of resources? very likely). I enjoyed Mackenzie Davis's character but I initially thought she too overly-obsessed with Dani, as in, more than her mission would've warranted her to be. Well, at least until they did that little reveal that she was saved and raised by future Dani, oh well... 

Dani herself is where most of my problems with this movie lie. I wasn't feeling her as a potential Resistance leader and the way they were trying to push the agenda of her being the new "John", only for later to drop a "We dun need no men to save us, ur the real hero gurl" line further reinforced the idea that they really took a dump on John Connor. 

John Connor has been introduced as *the *hero, the person who *will *lead the Resistance against Skynet and eventually save humanity. But then they had to retcon the story by writing Skynet out of existence via time travel shenanigans and introduce a new future with Renamed Skynet (Legion) that renders John's existence completely useless so Dani can steal his role. 

The damage has already been done tho, unless Mr. Cameron goes out of his way to make a hilarious statement about how this movie isn't actually a canon sequel but just another movie lol


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## butcher50 (Nov 9, 2019)

James Cameron's credibility on all fronts should be in the toilet at this point, there is no way Hollywood is gonna keep tolerating this for much longer, he has been endorsing genisys like it was next best thing and now he did the same for dark fate with even worse results.


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## Shiba D. Inu (Nov 9, 2019)

butcher50 said:


> James Cameron's credibility on all fronts should be in the toilet at this point, there is no way Hollywood is gonna keep tolerating this for much longer, he has been endorsing genisys like it was next best thing and now he did the same for dark fate with even worse results.


just need for Avatar 2 to bomb now

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 9, 2019)

"
The hero John Connor of Cameron’s imagining was irrelevant in this fresh storyline.

“Sarah changed the past, which changed the future. So that future where John was the leader of humanity no longer happens. He’s just this man who has missed his moment in history. What are you going to do? Is he going to be an accountant? Is he going to be working in a bank?

“Any of those is unsatisfying when his real destiny was to be this super soldier who leads humanity. So all those reasons led us to do what we did.”

Miller also said he and Cameron, who returns as executive producer and story consultant, decided to move on from John because his possible story had already been explored in
other _Terminator_ sequels."


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 9, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> To re-state the obvious...
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...



And already, TSCC had that as one of its premier plot and themes, deconstructed and reconstructed.

I've read from some recent interview of James Cameron that he wanted to explore the whole 'AI sentience in Terminator' for the next films. That's surprising -- _Terminator _can barely stand after Genisys, and he wants the series to sprint for a theme like that? And of course -- that theme is like a goddamn steak, but ya hand it off fast-food working director Tim Miller. (saying 'fast food' as an example.)

It's not that hard to learn from, and build upon, TSCC's example, ffs. Yet, here we have DF, likely the final nail in the series.

Unless that other _Terminator _creator got the rights back and decides to do something with it.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Deathbringerpt (Nov 9, 2019)

Films that are passion projects for James Cameron: Battle Angel Alita - James gets a proven action director who made amazing movies, making sure it gets proper care. 

Films that are blank checks for James Cameron: Terminator - The Deadpool guy who now thinks he's the best action director in the world brings him to be a "consultant" and pays him a giant check to say the movie's totally rad.

It's almost like having a vision and personal investment makes a difference.


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## butcher50 (Nov 9, 2019)

How ironic that this movie was supposed to make you completely forget all the previous post-T2JD sequels and spin-offs, as the one true 25 years later continuation but it accomplishes the opposite, it makes all those previous sequels and spin-offs actually look better by comparison.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 9, 2019)

I just think they played too safe. It wasn't a bad movie..just wasn't a very memorable one.


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## MShadows (Nov 10, 2019)

Good interview. Pretty sad to hear Arnie say that he's done with Terminator tho...


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## butcher50 (Nov 10, 2019)

The only place where John Connor got any decent portrayal as a pseudo-military leader was in some of the comics and novels spinoffs (aka licensed fan fiction), one in particular that stuck with me was the _"Cybernetic Dawn/Nuclear Twilight"_ series made in 1996 by the now defunct Malibu company.


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## jesusus (Nov 10, 2019)

This movie


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## butcher50 (Nov 11, 2019)

In case people missed it........


*Spoiler*: __ 




Sarah's little "NEED NO MAN !"-style talk during the nighttime train ride, when comparing her's and dani's experiences, later on during the airplane sequence Grace also joins the male-hating fun with one similar line (what's wrong with it ? imagine in this day and age two male heroes that you are absolutely supposed to like and care about making similar comments like that towards women WITHOUT their views challenged/corrected hard in some way or another throughout the movie, a serious non-comedic movie at that, even in the original 1984 when asked how women fare in the post-apocalyptic future war that Kyle Reese arrived from, Kyle answers without hesitation "GREAT FIGHTERS !" so excuse me where exactly this sense of resentment and retaliation against John and Kyle was coming from that the feminist filmmakers felt they needed to inject into the series ? why did the filmmakers decided that they needed to bludgeon the audiences over the head with a sledgehammer to sell Dani's role ?).




IMO ever since the success of Mad Max: Fury Road, Hollywood wants to lazily copy/paste the basic formula without understanding the deeper intricacies of what really made it work in the first place.


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## MShadows (Nov 11, 2019)

butcher50 said:


> In case people missed it........
> 
> 
> *Spoiler*: __
> ...


If it were the opposite you wouldn’t be hearing the end of it on social media and the news.

All the dumb masses would attack the movie for being “sexist”, “mansplaining” and “vile utter shit that support teh patriarchy!!!1” 

Double standards at their best. We live in a fucked up age where it’s okay to talk shit and diminish men at any given opportunity.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 11, 2019)

MShadows said:


> If it were the opposite you wouldn’t be hearing the end of it on social media and the news.
> 
> All the dumb masses would attack the movie for being “sexist”, “mansplaining” and “vile utter shit that support teh patriarchy!!!1”
> 
> Double standards at their best. We live in a fucked up age where it’s okay to talk shit and diminish men at any given opportunity.


You're gaslighting right now


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## MShadows (Nov 12, 2019)

The Japanese title for it is "Terminator: *New *Fate"


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## dr_shadow (Nov 12, 2019)

MShadows said:


> The Japanese title for it is "Terminator: *New *Fate"



I suppose not all languages have a word for "dark" in the sense of "foreboding". They might only use it in the sense of the color, in which case a literal translation would be understood as "Black Fate", which would mostly confuse people.

Like how an English-speaker would be confused if you told them "your future looks white" when you meant to say "your future looks bright".


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## MShadows (Nov 12, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> I suppose not all languages have a word for "dark" in the sense of "foreboding". They might only use it in the sense of the color, in which case a literal translation would be understood as "Black Fate", which would mostly confuse people.
> 
> Like how an English-speaker would be confused if you told them "your future looks white" when you meant to say "your future looks bright".


The title uses Katakana, which is used for transcriptions of foreign words into Japanese. There's no Kanji in the title so they could've kept the "Dark" term without any problem. 

It says [ターミネーター：ニュー・フェイト] which would transcribe to "Tāminētā: Nyū feito". They could've very easily said "Dāku" (which is actually always used when transcribing the English word *Dark*) instead of "Nyū" and no confusion would've occurred. 

I guess they wanted to make it sound more "positive" and give it that "first in a new trilogy" feeling.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 12, 2019)

Any new word from destroyer Tim Miller?


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## butcher50 (Nov 12, 2019)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Any new word from destroyer Tim Miller?



Only that he_ "Doesn't give a darn !" _which is okay because it looks like over half of the potential audiences (one way or another) just didn't give a darn either.

pro-tip #1: no matter how hard you try to appease them, ultra-woke screamers on the net will not result in a reliable movie-going customer base, let alone in profitable numbers. (sure they might write a positive review about your content and leave a high rating/like, but money-makers they are ain't)

pro-tip #2: The Terminator doesn't need over-ballooned 200+ million dollar budgets to be successful, get a grip on the budgets so you can spend less and focus on the story more, so other then Arnold's and Linda's salaries (including that wholly unnecessary airplane sequence that didn't even look good) i don't see how what i saw could have cost nearly 200 million dollars.


*Spoiler*: __ 



the moment teen john got his rib cage blasted open i had the sudden urge to leave the theater, there is no way you can convince me that this wasn't Hollywood throwing a bag of dog poo at my lap and i know for a fact that i was not the only one, seriously why go out of their way to burn budget on such a poor taste scene and include it in the final theatrical cut of the movie ? couldn't they simply reference the event ? off-screen ?


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## Mider T (Nov 13, 2019)

Just saw the film, actually much better than I was led to believe. Still a silly title though.

Glad to see Linda and Arnie back, this was better than Genesys if for that alone.

I didn't buy "Carl" though.  His being able to establish a family, his transition into trying to be human, his attempts at humor, etc.  I would have preferred him being a hermit.

Poor John but did nobody on that beach noticed a guy walking with a sawed off shotgun to a bar?

Where does Sarah live if she's wanted in all 50 states?

Who were the Terminators she was fighting being sent to kill?


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## dr_shadow (Nov 13, 2019)

Mider T said:


> Where does Sarah live if she's wanted in all 50 states?



Mexico, apparently. 

In both Terminator 1 and Terminator 2, as far as I recall, the heroes try to get out of the United States, which makes sense. As countries generally don't share population registers and the like, it will be much more difficult for a Terminator to track them of they keep moving between jurisdictions.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Nov 14, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> Mexico, apparently.
> 
> In both Terminator 1 and Terminator 2, as far as I recall, the heroes try to get out of the United States, which makes sense. As countries generally don't share population registers and the like, it will be much more difficult for a Terminator to track them of they keep moving between jurisdictions.



Don't think they tried to get out of the US in either of those movies. IIRC, they actually try to blow up Cyberdyne as early as in the first movie (in deleted scenes, anyways) instead of running, but the Terminator kills Sarah's mom and uses her voice to trick Sarah into giving it their location and the end of the movie ensues. In T2 they did meet up with that dude Enrique (who seems Hispanic) but Sarah rushes off to try and kill Dyson before they head anywhere. It's actually in T3 that Arnold suggests going to Mexico to escape the primary blast zones of Judgment Day.


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## butcher50 (Nov 14, 2019)

Did even notice how the Future War scene looked really "cheap" or just lazily put together ? there was something so boxed-in about it that it looked like a SyFy TV production at best or maybe it just looked too much like Tom Cruise's Edge of Tomorrow ?


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## Mider T (Nov 14, 2019)

butcher50 said:


> Did even notice how the Future War scene looked really "cheap" or just lazily put together ? there was something so boxed-in about it that it looked like a SyFy TV production at best.


Looked better than anything in the previous movies, you're just spoiled by the times.


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## butcher50 (Nov 14, 2019)

Mider T said:


> Looked better than anything in the previous movies, you're just spoiled by the times.



Hey........i actually enjoy the opening scenes of Terminator Genisys (the only really good part of that movie)

so this "spoiled" argument doesn't work.

(i mean if you go by comparisons then you will be right, it's "better" then what Salvation's overall vision was and to a lesser extent T3ROTM)


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 14, 2019)

I wanna see a movie of John Conner mentoring his father Kyle


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## butcher50 (Nov 14, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> I wanna see a movie of John Conner mentoring his father Kyle



We kinda do get to see that in a rapid-montage of the Genisys opening.

i argued a hundred times before on other boards, Genisys would have been a million times better if the general plot was reworked in a way that mostly shelved the whole _"let's time-travel to normal present-day 2017 to fight evil John Connor"_ for the next sequel.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 14, 2019)

And 50 times better if khaleesi didn't play Sarah Conner


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## butcher50 (Nov 14, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> And 50 times better if khaleesi didn't play Sarah Conner



or if the Meathead-looking Jai Courtney didn't play Kyle Reese


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 16, 2019)

butcher50 said:


> Only that he_ "Doesn't give a darn !" _which is okay because it looks like over half of the potential audiences (one way or another) just didn't give a darn either.
> 
> pro-tip #1: no matter how hard you try to appease them, ultra-woke screamers on the net will not result in a reliable movie-going customer base, let alone in profitable numbers. (sure they might write a positive review about your content and leave a high rating/like, but money-makers they are ain't)
> 
> ...



And with that, Miller's effectively hammered in what's likely the final nail in the _Terminator _film series coffin.

Which is supremely ironic, since he said that he and others have watched the previous post-T2 films to see why it failed and didn't catch on. And now his directed DF can be added to that pile, as well being the one with the unenviable dishonour of being a film killer.


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## butcher50 (Nov 16, 2019)

Just speed read a certain mostly positive review from a rather thirsty Lesbian/LGBTQ-lens and it's becoming crystal clear to me that particular demographic was the Prime Target for this movie, which is okay but it looks like David Ellison and Tim Miller had ridiculous expectations of that demographic's money, numbers and interest in the Terminator series, they gambled on the wrong crowd and lost horribly, at the same time they were hoping that the older, pre-established fans of the franchise will just shut up, put up and go see their movie out of loyalty and curiosity (the Director even tried the fashionable shaming tactics like "Misogynists !" months before the movie was released), then their last ditch effort was for the Chinese to pick up the slack......failed again.

better luck next time.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 16, 2019)

butcher50 said:


> Just speed read a certain mostly positive review from a rather thirsty Lesbian/LGBTQ-lens and it's becoming crystal clear to me that particular demographic was the Prime Target for this movie, which is okay but it looks like David Ellison and Tim Miller have grossly overestimated their money, numbers and interest in the Terminator series, they gambled on the wrong crowd and lost horribly.
> 
> better luck next time.



I can understand wanting to appeal to a particular audience, or involve particular characters in the story for, whatever reason.

However, THAT OPENING SCENE -- that comes across in one of, if not the worst possible ways, to fans AND also non-fans as well, as to how far the creative decision will go, and the uncomfortable (unintentional?) message underlying that decision.

I wonder if anyone in the writer's room pointed this out to Miller and Cameron. I expect Friedman would have tried to argue against it, given what he had done in his TSCC show. But, Miller and Cameron have the final say. Their very out-of-touch say.

Reactions: Like 1


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## butcher50 (Nov 16, 2019)

Comic Book Guy said:


> I can understand wanting to appeal to a particular audience, or involve particular characters in the story for, whatever reason.
> 
> However, THAT OPENING SCENE -- that comes across in one of, if not the worst possible ways, to fans AND also non-fans as well, as to how far the creative decision will go, and the uncomfortable (unintentional?) message underlying that decision.
> 
> I wonder if anyone in the writer's room pointed this out to Miller and Cameron. I expect Friedman would have tried to argue against it, given what he had done in his TSCC show. But, Miller and Cameron have the final say. Their very out-of-touch say.



Friedman created IMO one of the best John Connors (played by Thomas Dekker) or the very least the closest that matches Edward Furlong's version.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 16, 2019)

butcher50 said:


> Friedman created IMO one of the best John Connors (played by Thomas Dekker)



Agreed.

It still boggles me that the post-T2 filmmakers can't quite learn to capitalize from all the good that TSCC done for the _Terminator _stories. Especially considering how much _Genisys _and _Dark Fate_ takes after some of their ideas.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 17, 2019)

*Box office update
*
1. Terminator 2 ($515)
2. Terminator 3 ($433)
3. Genysis ($432)
4. Salvation (365)
*5. Dark Fate ($204)*
6. Terminator ($78)



If this doesn't beat Genysis, a much worse movie, it's pathetic.


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## MShadows (Nov 17, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> *Box office update
> *
> 1. Terminator 2 ($515)
> 2. Terminator 3 ($433)
> ...


Doubt it does. It has too bad of a start and the fans are still pissed about what they did.


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## butcher50 (Nov 17, 2019)

So one particular detail during the Future War-dream seemed strange too me, my memory is already fuzzy after the theater experience:


*Spoiler*: __ 



Who was the wounded, comatose? person packed into a stretcher called "Commander"?, was that Daniela Ramos herself ? why risk her into the the battlefield in such a state ? lol wut ? were they evacuating ? because it looked more like they were storming a Legion facility to me, were they trying to do both at the same time ?





Another strangeness will have to do with the Plot's motivation itself, particularly on the part of the villains:

*Spoiler*: __ 



How hard is Legion being pushed by the Resistance to R&D (or recreate) a Skynet-like Time Machine and use it ? Grace says that Ramos will ultimately lead them to victory but nothing more then that, in the "original" Skynet-based conflict the war went on for almost 30 years before Skynet was forced into a condition of "Okay i burned too many resources and losing fast, let's restart the game", in this Legion incarnation the war is little over 20 years old and already the humans are pushing Legion into a corner ? (probably because there is a lot less active nukes then it was in the 1990s imo)




EDIT: something just hit me regarding a certain new main character

*Spoiler*: __ 



So where exactly Daniela gets all that lightning-fast training, contacts and resources to make her launching pad for the resistance within just year or two before Legion's post-apocalypse really starts ? you see Sarah and John Connor had something like 12+ years of prep-time (in the original, uninterrupted T1/2JD cycle at least) before Skynet pushed the big red button, judging by Grace's flashback of encountering Dani for the first time and the Ending scene, Legion's Apocalypse is just two years away at most.

is this just another example of a Mary Sue-style writing ?


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## Deathbringerpt (Nov 18, 2019)

butcher50 said:


> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> 
> the moment teen john got his rib cage blasted open i had the sudden urge to leave the theater, there is no way you can convince me that this wasn't Hollywood throwing a bag of dog poo at my lap and i know for a fact that i was not the only one, seriously why go out of their way to burn budget on such a poor taste scene and include it in the final theatrical cut of the movie ? couldn't they simply reference the event ? off-screen ?



Ironically enough Linda said she hated how that scene turned out. She said that if her character ever saw that shit unfold in front of her, she would've gone completely apeshit and the actress portraying her totally phoned it in.

Reactions: Like 1


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## butcher50 (Nov 19, 2019)

Since i'm not a sadist that likes beating a dead horse (most of the specifically pandered to demographic was not that interested in Terminator-verse to begin with, most of the older pre-established fanbase basically boycotted it, the Chinese probably don't care about it either...etc.)

let's try talking about the stuff that we liked in TDark Fate 2019, my list:

*Spoiler*: __ 




1: Mackenzie's Grace has to be the coolest, most interesting character in the movie (by it's own standards), she was probably the only character i really gave a damn about from beginning to end 

2: Linda's Sarah is badass, nostalgic and sympathetic as expected   (outside of some moments here and there, she kinda tests my patience sometimes )

3: Thank god Arnold decided to tone down his clowning act for this version of the T800/M101-skin "Carl", the turned protector/ally feels a lot more professional here (compared to the Rise of the Machines and Genisys disasters), the adopted family angle was charming too but a bit too poorly explained (they even brought back the old style Termo-Vision !).

4: for all the structural flaws of this Legion-based Future War snippet from Grace's perspective it still does recapture the original film's sense of pain, fear and death of fighting the human-hating A.I forces in the rotting corpse of civilization (TSalvation failed to do this because it had too much daylight and was sanitized to the bones for the PG13 rating), so a point for that.
5: Gabriel's Rev-9 is solid and sinister as it should be , it even does manipulations and exploits that the T1000 in T2JD didn't bother with (like sicking the cops on the heroes ! but he does get a little bit too chatty towards the end)
6: thank Cthulhu for the R-rating in general, FUCKING FINALLY ! 

7: The cartoony CGI mess with the airplanes and the underwater aside, the final fight is good, really loved the sense of team-work between Grace and Carl there 

8: the new added flash-freezing effect of the incoming wormhole/quantum bubble (that carries the time-travelers) was interesting to me, a kinda small visual hint that while very similar to Skynet, Legion has it's own differences with it's tech.

EDIT 9: okay so the overall soundtrack/score is much better then T3ROTMachines that's for sure (Genisys to some extent too)

overall i think Dark Fate is a much better crafted movie then Genisys was but that's not saying much because for all these positives i highlighted it has equal or greater amount of negatives.

can't think of anything else positive to say right now.







EDIT: a somewhat amusing thought (in-lore)
*Spoiler*: __ 



Assuming time is always trying to keeping things similar whenever it can (no matter how improbable, Kyle Reese is the most glaring anomaly of this in the Sarah Connor Chronicles, Salvation and Genisys), Dani Ramos very likely existed in the Skynet/John Connor-gen Judgment Day War, as a young prodigy that quickly rose through the ranks in the resistance (she would have been 28 when Skynet fell in that version of 2029), but since the global Judgment Day conflict was postponed for a whole generation and John gone, she was pushed by time's tidal waves for that role.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 19, 2019)

butcher50 said:


> Since i'm not a sadist that likes beating a dead horse (most of the specifically pandered to demographic was not that interested in Terminator-verse to begin with, most of the older pre-established fanbase basically boycotted it, the Chinese probably don't care about it either...etc.)
> 
> let's try talking about the stuff that we liked in TDark Fate 2019, my list:
> 
> ...



I'd chime my disagreement on this one, I'd say the other preceding character, though corny, was a better idea and, when executed, more 'believable' of his development.

The DF idea was a good idea -- but, it's not really earned, or developed, unlike the previous movie's take, or the TSCC show.

Reactions: Like 1


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## butcher50 (Nov 23, 2019)

Now Tim Miller comes out and says he wanted humans to lose in the Legion future war (because cameron's humans-will-win is not "dramatic" or something for him) my automated response is why Legion must bother with time-travel if it's winning ?

(IMO think of Legion/Skynet as an RTS player that starts losing too many resources and factories, getting invaded from all sides.......the time-travel tech assassination missions is basically the RTS player trying to hit restart on the game menu)

the only way this makes sense is if Grace traveled back to destroy/sabotage Legion before it's activated and Legion detecting the pirated use of it's Teleporter base, sends the Rev-9 to intercept that attempt, therefore Dani Ramos makes no sense at all.


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## MShadows (Nov 23, 2019)

butcher50 said:


> Now Tim Miller comes out and says he wanted humans to lose in the Legion future war (because cameron's humans-will-win is not "dramatic" or something for him) my automated response is why Legion must bother with time-travel if it's winning ?
> 
> the only way this makes sense is if Grace traveled back to destroy/sabotage Legion before it's activated and Legion detecting the pirated use of it's Teleporter base, sends the Rev-9 to intercept that attempt, therefore Dani Ramos makes no sense at all.


The story is shit. The more those guys talk, the more it gets confirmed.


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## dr_shadow (Nov 25, 2019)

Global box office is still over $100 million behind Genysis.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 25, 2019)

Playing the blame game.


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## butcher50 (Nov 26, 2019)

Another weird character error i noticed


*Spoiler*: __ 



during the night train ride, Sarah was probably just being cynical, exhausted and not thinking things through with her "WOMB" comments but the whole Dani Ramos IS the next "John Connor" reveal should have been obvious much much earlier, you see Grace introduces herself in the motel stop as someone who time-jumped from 2042ish (i don't remember exactly) that's only 22 years from the movie's present-day and logically the machine assassin is from the same time point, Dani's child (if she happens to have a kid), will be barely 20 at most when Legion is getting pushed into a corner to resort to the time-travel reset button.................just not enough time for them to grow into a super-genius leader that is a reputable pain in the A.I's metal butt to focus on specifically, so Dani already has to be the main suspect for the top inspiration/organizer for the successful human resistance, not the generation after her.

LSS: as i noted before that line of dialogue (and another one during the airplane scene) was likely written by someone who is so PC/Woke that they feel embarrassed by the older films


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## U mad bro (Nov 29, 2019)

This movie is hilarious. Illegal immigrant sarah Connor vs Border patrol agent terminator.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 29, 2019)

I recently thought of something.  How did T800 know the evil Terminator was coming if it came from a future different from his own?


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## dr_shadow (Nov 29, 2019)

~Gesy~ said:


> I recently thought of something.  How did T800 know the the evil Terminator was coming if it came from a future different from his own?



He said something about how time travel creates ripples in space-time far in advance, which a terminator like him can apparently detect.

(Strange that Skynet would think to include this feature, though, since it couldn't have been expecting its science project to turn into a full-blown temporal war)


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## U mad bro (Nov 29, 2019)

Well the t800 in actuality should be a higher level Ai than what skynet started off as.


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## Mider T (Dec 10, 2019)

mr_shadow said:


> He said something about how time travel creates ripples in space-time far in advance, which a terminator like him can apparently detect.
> 
> (Strange that Skynet would think to include this feature, though, since it couldn't have been expecting its science project to turn into a full-blown temporal war)


It's not up to them.  If somebody gets dropped somewhere in time think of it as if you drop a rubber ducky on a still pond, it creates a disturbance.


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Jan 19, 2020)




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## Amol (Jan 20, 2020)

First thing that came to my mind when I watched the movie is that they killed John and replaced him with new 19/20 year old girl as Messiah. 
Then I found out she is 32 years old !!!!!!!
Anyway as a standalone movie, this movie is good enough. I kinda enjoyed it that way though it is perfectly understandable why it might piss off Terminators fans. It is hardly a true sequel if it literally makes first two movies pointless. 
I think instead of Linda they should have made adult John as mentor to Dani. When Terminator attacks it should have been John who saves her. I would have cut off Grace from the this film and put her in sequel of this movie. 
Basically Legion sends Terminator to kill Dani,  John who has became a badass Lone Wolf intercepts it and then sacrifices himself at the end of movie to destroy it because he doesn't believe in fate and has faith in humanity to always fight back. His sacrifice motivates Dani and she ends up being the new leader of humanity against Legion. 
Though I am not sure how to include Arnold here. 
Movie gets 6.5/10 from me.

Reactions: Like 1


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## EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! (Jan 20, 2020)

This gives me a wonderful sense of closure about the whole saga after 2. I even got a small tear in my eye.


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## reiatsuflow (Jan 20, 2020)

This was a bad movie. It was like a sci-fi pilot for a terminator series and not even a good one. It makes the Emilia Clarke terminator look better by comparison.


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## Comic Book Guy (Jan 20, 2020)

_Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles_ is still the best post-T2 sequel. Amazing how, after all this time, it still holds true.

Though, a disclaimer, I have not read the _John Connor Chronicles_ novel series.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Mider T (Jan 21, 2020)

Comic Book Guy said:


> _Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles_ is still the best post-T2 sequel. Amazing how, after all this time, it still holds true.
> 
> Though, a disclaimer, I have not read the _John Connor Chronicles_ novel series.


You sure love talking that show up.


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## Comic Book Guy (Jan 27, 2020)

Mider T said:


> You sure love talking that show up.



Still holds true. But more so -- it's absolutely mind boggling how the post-T2 movies fail to be satisfying in exploring stuff post-T2, when there's already an example that they could learn from and do better.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ~Gesy~ (Jan 27, 2020)

Comic Book Guy said:


> Still holds true. But more so -- it's absolutely mind boggling how the post-T2 movies fail to be satisfying in exploring stuff post-T2, when there's already an example that they could learn from and do better.


Can't compare imo. Movies have 2 and half hours to sell us.

That show had 12 weeks.


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## Comic Book Guy (Jan 27, 2020)

~Gesy~ said:


> Can't compare imo. Movies have 2 and half hours to sell us.
> 
> That show had 12 weeks.



Well, to clarify, I was thinking more about thematic material, potential story plots, and tone that TSCC had that the movies could learn and have a chance to one-up as a bigger budget movie. For example, _Genisys _took the multi-temporal war interference from TSCC, but of course added cheese (as well as miscastings).


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## The World (Feb 3, 2020)

Movie would have been 100 times better if the new "John" Jane Connor wasn't a fucking extra and had personality and charisma


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## OLK (Feb 4, 2020)

The action scenes were cool but the writing was shit


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## Sennin of Hardwork (Feb 16, 2020)

Very funny.


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## Comic Book Guy (Feb 24, 2020)

To be honest, I felt disappointed with that Honest Trailer -- I'd thought they'd be way more savage, but I found them rather tame with their roast.


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## OLK (Feb 24, 2020)

Comic Book Guy said:


> To be honest, I felt disappointed with that Honest Trailer -- I'd thought they'd be way more savage, but I found them rather tame with their roast.


There's not much to roast, they went over it. It's a rehash of T2 except now John Connor is a girl and the bodyguard is a woman. 
The action was solid but we just don't care about Terminator anymore if they keep rehashing the same story


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## Sherlōck (Mar 20, 2020)

So both the tv show & this movie is set after Terminator 2.

Which one is canon? If both is canon then which one should I watch first?


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## MShadows (Mar 20, 2020)

Sherlōck said:


> So both the tv show & this movie is set after Terminator 2.
> 
> Which one is canon? If both is canon then which one should I watch first?


This movie is trash, don’t waste your time with it.


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## OLK (Mar 20, 2020)

Sherlōck said:


> So both the tv show & this movie is set after Terminator 2.
> 
> Which one is canon? If both is canon then which one should I watch first?


Nothing pretty much. This is the third time they went with "this is the TRUE sequel to T2, no really!" to try and drum up sales
The show was pretty good tho


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## butcher50 (Mar 21, 2020)

Sherlōck said:


> So both the tv show & this movie is set after Terminator 2.
> 
> Which one is canon? If both is canon then which one should I watch first?



Nothing is "canon" after James Cameron's T2JD, the guy basically gave up after Titanic and never really cared about this series since, other then making promotions/hype for his friend Arnold.

but if you want the complete circle story exp: after watching T1/T2JD read the 1996's comics "Cybernetic Dawn" and "Nuclear Twilight" by Malibu.

(alternatively you can watch T3ROTM, Salvation and then read the "Final Battle" 2014 comic series by DarkHorse)

the reason i'm not mentioning the Sarah Connor Chronicles TV series is because it was cancelled and left unfinished (same thing with the Genisys disaster)


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## dr_shadow (Mar 21, 2020)

*Box office (not adjusted for inflation)
*
1. Terminator 2 ($520,884,847)
2. Genisys ($440,603,537)
3. Terminator 3 ($433,371,112)
4. Salvation ($371,353,001)
5. Dark Fate ($261,119,292)
6. The Terminator ($78,475,971)

Pathetic.

When you don't apply inflation adjustment, then if all six films were equally good, they should appear in reverse order of release. I.e. Dark Fate should rank #1 because movie tickets have gotten progressively more expensive since 1984.

But as it turns out it couldn't beat any previous installment save the oldest one!


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## Dimezanime88 (Apr 11, 2020)

If you like reactions/reviews for movies, here is my first attempt into that world! This one is for Terminator: Dark Fate. Like it, dislike it, comments, suggestions; I want them all! Thank you!


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## Suigetsu (Apr 11, 2020)

OLK said:


> Nothing pretty much. This is the third time they went with "this is the TRUE sequel to T2, no really!" to try and drum up sales
> The show was pretty good tho


The true canon sequel is and was the universal studio park ride! now THAT one was a fine ride!


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## Zhen Chan (Apr 11, 2020)

Suigetsu said:


> The true canon sequel is and was the universal studio park ride! now THAT one was a fine ride!


I liked that ride too. Now its men in black isnt it


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## Suigetsu (Apr 11, 2020)

Zhen Chan said:


> I liked that ride too. Now its men in black isnt it


Dont know, I think they turned it into shrek land or harry potter or something.


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## Raiken (Apr 12, 2020)

Recently watched this.

Good standalone film with great affects, and it was awesome seeing Linda Hamilton again.

As a sequel to T2... absolutely terrible. It is basically a clone of T2's plot with a feminist spin.
I didn't buy the whole Alternate Future / Legion thing either, at least with how they presented it... it wasn't fleshed out anywhere near enough. It just felt like, "yeah... that's how it is... no more questions".

And what they did to John Connor was disgraceful and shit on the legacy of T2.


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## Raiken (Apr 12, 2020)

butcher50 said:


> Nothing is "canon" after James Cameron's T2JD, the guy basically gave up after Titanic and never really cared about this series since, other then making promotions/hype for his friend Arnold.
> 
> but if you want the complete circle story exp: after watching T1/T2JD read the 1996's comics "Cybernetic Dawn" and "Nuclear Twilight" by Malibu.


Sounds good to me. Know anywhere online I could read those comics?


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## OLK (Apr 12, 2020)

Cryorex said:


> Sounds good to me. Know anywhere online I could read those comics?


google readcomicsonline


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## U mad bro (Apr 13, 2020)

This movie bullet points were Mexican border patrol terminator, illegal immigrant female John Connor, Lesbian Arnold lol


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Apr 13, 2020)

OLK said:


> Nothing pretty much. This is the third time they went with "this is the TRUE sequel to T2, no really!" to try and drum up sales
> The show was pretty good tho



The show was much better than most of the post-T2 sequels but the abrupt ending and 
*Spoiler*: __ 



boring parts after Cromartie's death


 ruined it

Reactions: Like 1


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## OLK (Apr 13, 2020)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> The show was much better than most of the post-T2 sequels but the abrupt ending and
> *Spoiler*: __
> 
> 
> ...


The boring parts were because of the writer's strike. Pretty much killed any chance of it getting renewed. Shame because the last couple of episodes were great and that cliffhanger worked as both a nice hook and a time loop for an ending


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Apr 13, 2020)

Yeah I'd definitely liked to have seen a third or fourth season of TSCC.


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## Comic Book Guy (Apr 14, 2020)

OLK said:


> The boring parts were because of the writer's strike. Pretty much killed any chance of it getting renewed. Shame because the last couple of episodes were great and that cliffhanger worked as both a nice hook and a time loop for an ending





Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> Yeah I'd definitely liked to have seen a third or fourth season of TSCC.



The showrunner released all his behind-the-scenes notes, including those for season 3 & the closing season 4, on his twitter.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Oct 29, 2020)

So did Dark Fate at least do well enough in terms of DVD/Bluray sales or streaming service views, that they might consider a sequel?

Cuz even when the first movie really isn't good, not leaving it finished after it advertised itself as HURR DURR CAMERON'S LEGITIMATE THIRD FILM leaves a sour taste. Mostly this is because I want Dani Ramos killed brutally as karma for what they did to John


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## Suigetsu (Oct 29, 2020)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> So did Dark Fate at least do well enough in terms of DVD/Bluray sales or streaming service views, that they might consider a sequel?
> 
> Cuz even when the first movie really isn't good, not leaving it finished after it advertised itself as HURR DURR CAMERON'S LEGITIMATE THIRD FILM leaves a sour taste. Mostly this is because I want Dani Ramos killed brutally as karma for what they did to John


No. It was an utter straight up BOMB.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Oct 29, 2020)

They should've just ended this franchise with T3 from 2003. Somehow everything after it is a progressively bigger flop.


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## Mider T (Oct 29, 2020)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> They should've just ended this franchise with T3 from 2003. Somehow everything after it is a progressively bigger flop.


Sarah Connor Chronicles was 2007 and great though.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Oct 29, 2020)

Mider T said:


> Sarah Connor Chronicles was 2007 and great though.



Writers' strike and early cancellation still fucked it over, man. The first season wasn't even 10 episodes and the second season ended on a cliffhanger that turned into a cliff fall because of early cancellation like I said.

And SCC was 2008, not 2007


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## Mider T (Oct 29, 2020)

@Comic Book Guy

Reactions: Agree 1


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## OLK (Oct 30, 2020)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> They should've just ended this franchise with T3 from 2003. Somehow everything after it is a progressively bigger flop.


Even T3 was just a lazy rehash of T2, though the ending was tight
All I wanted was a movie about Future John fucking up some Terminators, and somehow they even screwed that up


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Oct 30, 2020)

OLK said:


> Even T3 was just a lazy rehash of T2, though the ending was tight
> All I wanted was a movie about Future John fucking up some Terminators, and somehow they even screwed that up



Yeah. Not denying that T3 is a mediocre film, but the way it ended was on spot (defied the status quo with Hollywood movies for happy endings) and it was definitely better than Salvation or Genisys, even though Salvation finally had the chance to deviate from the time traveling robots formula and show us a real war between Skynet and Connor.


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## MShadows (Oct 30, 2020)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> Yeah. Not denying that T3 is a mediocre film, but the way it ended was on spot (defied the status quo with Hollywood movies for happy endings) and it was definitely better than Salvation or Genisys, even though Salvation finally had the chance to deviate from the time traveling robots formula and show us a real war between Skynet and Connor.


Don’t worry, they’ll dig it up again 5 years from now and reboot it.

John will be Joanne and just as a 12 year old girl she’ll be build like Abby and strong enough to rip apart T-800s with her bare hands, which were sent back in time in order to ensure robotic patriarchy.


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## OLK (Oct 30, 2020)

I hated how the new movie had Sarah bitter over just being the one to give birth to the hero, and them acting like it's a huge deal that the girl was the actual hero
Motherfuckers, T1, T2, T3, and TSCC all told the story of how important Sarah Connor was, because she's the one who made John a warrior. She was the biggest badass in John's life, and the new movie acts like she was just  a baby dispenser so they can do their hamfisted overcoming sexism moment

Damn I hate that movie

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Oct 30, 2020)

Yeah. I don't care what anybody says, the PC brigade definitely played a role in how a Hispanic woman overshadowed John Connor and took his role as savior of humanity. I wouldn't even mind that crap had it been handled tastefully, but it was overtly to deliver a big middle finger to Sarah Connor's role mirroring Mother Mary and not Jesus Christ himself. Despite the fact that Sarah was the main character of both the first two movies. Even was the narrator of the second movie, and still was mentioned in T3 and Salvation on top of again being central in Genisys (even though you couldn't pay me to watch that tripe).

Reactions: Like 2


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## Mider T (Oct 30, 2020)

Oh boy, this thread is going to become the TLJ thread all over again.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Oct 31, 2020)

It won't. Dark Fate was too unpopular.


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## MartialHorror (Oct 31, 2020)

Yeah even though I think more people enjoyed it than not, I don't think those who like it feel particularly passionate about it, while those who dislike it feel very passionate about it. 

I enjoyed the movie, but I can't deny that it was... incredibly misguided... Killing off John was a miscalculation, although admittedly I don't know where he could've fit in the story that was already too encumbered. I actually liked both Dani and Grace, but I actually think audiences would've had an easier time swallowing them if Sarah, the T-800 (and of course John) weren't involved, or at least appeared in a reduced capacity. Because of their presence, nostalgia kicks in and we want to see more of the original cast, putting the new characters at a disadvantage. It also doesn't help that the story feels like it's at war with itself.  

Is it about Dani and Grace?

Is it about Sarah getting over her grief and having to confront her son's killer, who has actually reformed?

I kept thinking that the movie would've either been better if it either focused entirely on them, without SC or T-800... or if it was about Sarah Conner mentoring Dani without Grace, MAYBE with the T-800.  

I remember thinking the T-800 was unnecessary to the story, but found his scenes to be the most entertaining. The script needed to sacrifice something. Every dynamic had potential and wasn't poorly handled, but the narrative couldn't handle all of them. 

The marketing campaign was also pretty weak. None of the trailers stood out as especially cool and I think they relied waaaay too much female empowerment as a selling point. I have nothing against it, but "Terminator" is supposed to be a suspense driven franchise and nothing says 'suspenseful' like the heroes beating the shit out of the villain in every shot -- because female empowerment. You can get away with that in a comic book film or even other kinds of franchises, but not "Terminator". The funny thing is... the movie itself doesn't have this problem. The female heroes are always on the defensive, clearly at a disadvantage in every confrontation, which is the first step to being suspenseful.

I'm all for diversity and politics in films, but I don't like it when the message and the story are at odds with each-other. When the evil Terminator was slashing through what was clearly supposed to be ICE, I was wondering... what am I supposed to feel about this? Am I supposed to feel satisfaction at seeing ICE get slaughtered? Because technically, they're standing in the way of humanity's destruction at the moment. I think the director thought it would be cool to have a racist organization get killed by a Hispanic person, but... that hispanic is actually a robot who snuck into our time and is trying to kill us... That sounds like right wing propaganda, even though it's catering to the left. 

Anyway, didn't mean to ramble. Like I said, I enjoyed the movie, but the flaws clearly have stayed with me more than the strengths, lol.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Oct 31, 2020)

Yeah, I didn't hate the film (hate is a strong word); I even kind of want to see a continuation to it because leaving things unfinished always leaves a sour taste (esp since this was marketed as a film with Cameron having stronger involvement). But it's certainly nowhere near as strong of a movie as T2 was; it clearly was strongly driven by the leftist female/Hispanic empowerment schtick when they couldve given more respect to John's character even if they had to kill him. The film had a ton of flaws, even if it wasn't a total waste of two hours at the cinema.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## MartialHorror (Oct 31, 2020)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> Yeah, I didn't hate the film (hate is a strong word); I even kind of want to see a continuation to it because leaving things unfinished always leaves a sour taste (esp since this was marketed as a film with Cameron having stronger involvement). But it's certainly nowhere near as strong of a movie as T2 was; it clearly was strongly driven by the leftist female/Hispanic empowerment schtick when they couldve given more respect to John's character even if they had to kill him. The film had a ton of flaws, even if it wasn't a total waste of two hours at the cinema.



I actually wasn't angry with the way they killed John. The way his death leads to T-800 reforming was even poignant. His "For John" line at the end got to me, although it also drew attention to the overcrowded storyline, as the whole Sarah struggling to come to terms with having to work with her son's killer subplot was underdeveloped.

With that said... I think a large part of why I didn't mind it was "Terminator Genysis" had already kind of ruined the character for me. That movie infuriated me. Even though I want to respect it for trying to be bold and experimenting with some new ideas (whereas the other sequels, even DF, played it mostly safe), I just hated it.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Oct 31, 2020)

Nothing in the world could ever motivate me to watch Genishit. Not even if a rich ass supermodel offered to marry me if I watched it with her. A mind that somehow finds that asstrash worth watching will poison the gene pool of humanity.


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## MartialHorror (Nov 1, 2020)

What the franchise needs to do is go back to its lower budgeted roots. All of the sequels are clearly modeled after T2, but that's the problem. Terminator 2 wasn't just an exceptional action thriller, it was cutting edge to the point of pushing boundaries of technology. It was designed to be the biggest movie ever.

They were never ever going to recapture that magic. Even with "Dark Fate" having good action scenes, I wouldn't say they were any better or different than what Marvel is doing. The only difference is a sanitized R rating. I'd argue that all trying to be like T2 guarantees right now is that you're competing with the MCU, which is too hot of a brand right now. Even if "Dark Fate" was more liked by the fans, I don't think it would've stopped the movie from flopping. 

So it would just make sense to draw more inspiration from the first movie at the moment. Focus on suspense and tension building, punctuated by some nail biting action scenes. I actually thought "Upgrade (2018)" tapped more into what Terminator should be right now than the last few sequels have. Plus, it would save them money and help them rebuild the franchise.


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## Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld (Nov 1, 2020)

After how much Dark Fate flopped, I don't think we'll ever see Arnold in a Terminator movie again.


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## The World (Nov 5, 2020)

This movie would have been better with a more charismatic T robot and a more charismatic John replacement. If you're going to kill off John and replace at least get a good actress/actor to do the job! The hispanic girl was fucking horrible.


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## ~Gesy~ (Nov 14, 2020)

Rewatched this last night. Liked the action but that's about it. Too much focus on "girl power!" And " I am more than just a baby maker!" . It derails you from the movie a little bit.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 16, 2020)

Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> So did Dark Fate at least do well enough in terms of DVD/Bluray sales or streaming service views, that they might consider a sequel?
> 
> Cuz even when the first movie really isn't good, not leaving it finished after it advertised itself as HURR DURR CAMERON'S LEGITIMATE THIRD FILM leaves a sour taste. Mostly this is because I want Dani Ramos killed brutally as karma for what they did to John


Nope. But James Cameron had previously said, somewhere, that with his clout, he could move the wheels along for a movie sequel to disappointments like TDF or Alien Covenant. But of course, he's atm now focusing on Avatar 2 and 3.


OLK said:


> I hated how the new movie had Sarah bitter over just being the one to give birth to the hero, and them acting like it's a huge deal that the girl was the actual hero
> Motherfuckers, T1, T2, T3, and TSCC all told the story of how important Sarah Connor was, because she's the one who made John a warrior. She was the biggest badass in John's life, and the new movie acts like she was just  a baby dispenser so they can do their hamfisted overcoming sexism moment
> 
> Damn I hate that movie


Some audience actually argue that TDF is still Sarah Connor's story, that the movie has Sarah realize she's still the central character because she's the one who trains Dani.

An opinion which I disagree with. Sarah isn't central enough -- movie is more like Dani's story.


Godly Giraffe - King of the Uverworld said:


> Yeah. I don't care what anybody says, the PC brigade definitely played a role in how a Hispanic woman overshadowed John Connor and took his role as savior of humanity. I wouldn't even mind that crap had it been handled tastefully, but it was overtly to deliver a big middle finger to Sarah Connor's role mirroring Mother Mary and not Jesus Christ himself. Despite the fact that Sarah was the main character of both the first two movies. Even was the narrator of the second movie, and still was mentioned in T3 and Salvation on top of again being central in Genisys (even though you couldn't pay me to watch that tripe).



To be fair, Mother Mary doesn't take initiative to change the future though. What was lost in DF is addressing the repercussions of Sarah's actions -- she changed the future, yet bitterly, it is still the same, her own son died arguably because of her actions, and Grace is amidst a war of a multi-temporal scale where time-travel is no guarantee to work.

All that world complexity. . . completely ignored in TDF.

Side note: Also, sorry @ Mider T  for the 0 reputation, if that happened. I didn't realize the rep system had been completely revamped.


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## U mad bro (Nov 16, 2020)

I was reading somewhere Genisys is a successful movie even though it did badly in the states. I can see it. Unlike this movie, it didn't aim to annihilate the lore of the movie. Which I learned is important. People sometimes follow franchises just to see the lore of the franchise.


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## Comic Book Guy (Nov 16, 2020)

U mad bro said:


> I was reading somewhere Genisys is a successful movie even though it did badly in the states. I can see it. Unlike this movie, it didn't aim to annihilate the lore of the movie. Which I learned is important.


_Genisys _boxed great outside of the US, particularly in China.

In terms of its ideas, I'd say is good -- a SkyNet takes initiative to change the timeline, and there's no ballsy move of a change than to robot-convert John Connor and send him into the past, which would potentially thwart the time loop of Sarah conceiving John who would go on to defeat SkyNet.

The casting and MCU-esque tone, however, was the wrong choice.


U mad bro said:


> People sometimes follow franchises just to see the lore of the franchise.


To this day, a good number of the audience wants a future war movie done justice, despite James Cameron saying that it's only meant to serve as the background of the tension between future and present free-will to defy the future, that Terminator stories are mainly about the present. _Salvation _didn't get it right in terms of the future war portrayal, and the TSCC TV series got it as close as any film media could get, whatwith its TV budget.


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## U mad bro (Nov 16, 2020)

Comic Book Guy said:


> _Genisys _boxed great outside of the US, particularly in China.
> 
> In terms of its ideas, I'd say is good -- a SkyNet takes initiative to change the timeline, and there's no ballsy move of a change than to robot-convert John Connor and send him into the past, which would potentially thwart the time loop of Sarah conceiving John who would go on to defeat SkyNet.
> 
> ...



Well you said it best. TSCC was the best portrayal and illustration of the lore. It had everything you want , story, great special effects, and great actors. But it did what a good fox show always does get cancelled for no good reason. Hollywood directors and staff be so pretentious they feel they shouldn’t look at other mediums for inspiration. Yet they had the perfect material in front of them. I would advocate a reboot for the show but everybody too old for that now lol


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## MartialHorror (Nov 16, 2020)

U mad bro said:


> I was reading somewhere Genisys is a successful movie even though it did badly in the states. I can see it. Unlike this movie, it didn't aim to annihilate the lore of the movie. Which I learned is important. People sometimes follow franchises just to see the lore of the franchise.



eeeeh, personally what they did with John Connor and Reese annoyed me much more than anything in DF. In fact, I was probably numb to his death in DF because of genysis, but lore doesn't interest me as much as character I guess. I actually think getting too involved in lore will only lead to dwindling box office returns, as it's harder to keep up with. 

But "Grenysis" did flop in theaters. Studios don't get as much of the international revenue as they do domestic and it was reported it would need to get $450 million to break even. It most certainly did profit from rentals, home media sales, etc. It wasn't the financial disaster that "Dark Fate" ultimately was.


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## MartialHorror (Nov 16, 2020)

Oh wow, I had totally forgot that people liked "Terminator 3" at one point. But I'm also surprised to learn that it underperformed as well, only breaking even in theaters.

While the Sarah Connor chronicles might've been good, I don't think following that would've lead to a better box office performance. Even if the films would've been better, I don't think it would've maintained "Terminator 2" levels of popularity. "Terminator 3" took too long to really capitalize on its success while subsequent sequels kept hitting the reboot button hoping it would draw in audiences, when it was really just making it hard to keep up with the continuity. 

Remember that "Dark Fate" was a flop in its opening weekend, even though people were somewhat positive (It has a decent score on Rotten Tomatoes). There just wasn't much of an interest for it.


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## Deathbringerpt (Nov 21, 2020)

U mad bro said:


> I was reading somewhere Genisys is a successful movie even though it did badly in the states. I can see it. Unlike this movie, it didn't aim to annihilate the lore of the movie. Which I learned is important. People sometimes follow franchises just to see the lore of the franchise.



What lore? There's nothing left to explore in this fucking world. The only viable way to advance the story would be just to focus on the Post Apocalyptic war with the machines. And they've already fucked that one up.

Every other movie has just been about some asshole in the future sending robots to the past. This setting has no range whatsoever. This whole movie is just Terminator 2 but worse, which is pretty much a valid description for almost every movie after Terminator 2.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Friendly 1


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